# Instructions for Adding the 61.5 - REVISED 05/04



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

E* Switch configuration help:

Please, read this and *LOOK* for your switch information, and then read over the suggestions provided. This is pretty everything that you need to know.

Right now, the VOOM Channels are ONLY available on the 61.5. However, there are rumors(which make sense) that E* will add Voom to the 148. This has NOT been confirmed, but it may be worth waiting to see what is announced instead of wasting money for this IF you already have the 148. Those on the West Coast may have problems getting the 61.5 and Alaska and Hawaii are SOL(Sorry Guys).

Also note that right now, you cannot see Rainbow 1's transponders on the E* receiver. They are using Trans 1, 3, 5, 7. These will NOT show up on your signal strength screen until E* releases a software update(although it DOES show on the 921 according to Mark Lamutt). The receiver will be able to use them, however.

The first thing you need to do is find out what equipment you have. This can be easy, but it can also require a little work on your part depending on what you already have. The first part of this is for LEGACY systems. The second will be for Dish Pro(DP). Please keep in mind that you CANNOT mix legacy and DP DBS LNBs and switches. It is either one or the other.

PLEASE EVERYONE NOTE THAT a switch that starts with *SW* is a LEGACY switch and that a switch that starts with *DP* is a DISH PRO switch. It is VERY important that you keep this in mind when you post because you will create confusion for those who are newbies....

Almost ALL E* installs are connected to the 110 and 119 with a Dish500. Yours may use 2 dishes to do this. Generally, if you have a Dish500 and another dish, it is for the 61.5 or the 148. Superdishes will be discussed in the Dishpro section.

IF you need the 61.5(or the 148), you will need an 18Inch Dish. A D500 CAN be used, but it is recommended that you DO NOT use a Twin LNB unless you don't have access to another LNB. Due to popular demand, a new section about using this equipment has been added below.

A D* or V* dish CAN be used with ANY legacy setup. All the D* and V* LNBs are INTERCHANGABLE (EXCEPT the special SAT C D* LNB). A Dish PRO install will need either an E* dish or a D* dish that had the D-shaped arm. A rectangular arm dish CANNOT be used with a DP LNB without modifications(and it's not worth doing. You CAN add the E* I-bracket, but it will make the arm too long and mess with the signal. However, a measurement is being worked on for thos who are adventurous. WIll post when available.).

ANY E* Sub that has Local Channels available on the 61.5 Can get a free install done. However, YOU MUST ASK for the LOCALS ADDITIONAL DISH, and NOT an HD Upgrade for it to be free. Also, when having it installed for locals, E* is REQUIRED by the FCC to hook ALL activated receivers to the 61.5(or 148 if that is used in your area).

Keep in mind that ONLY an HD receiver can SEE HD channels. Therefore, unless you plan to add an HD receiver soon, you may only have to hook the 61.5 up to 1 receiver and not all of your receivers.

IF you are UNSURE, PLEASE call a professional. A local Retailer or E* will be more than willing to help you for a reasonable price if necessary.

IF you have a VOOM dish already pointed at the 61.5 and are using legacy E* equipment, you do NOT have to repoint it. If you are using DP equipment, you will need a new D-Arm Dish.

#1 - Find out what you have. The following is a list of available legacy E* switches and what they are:

500 Twin - Picks up the 110 & 119 and can feed 2 receivers MAX, 
500 Quad - Picks up the 110 & 119 and can feed 4 receivers. 
SW21 - Used to combine LNBs and/or one LNB and one Switch. Very useful. 
SW42 - Basically 2 SW21s in 1 box. Uses the same switching as the 500 Twin.
SW44 - Used for 2 sat locations. Requires a Power Inserter. Requires 2 lines from each LNB. Feeds up to 4 receivers. 
SW64 - Used for 3 sat locations. Requires a Power Inserter. Requires 2 lines from each LNB. Feeds up to 4 receivers. 
SWAJ - Similar to the SW21, but required power from the Accessory Jack used on some receivers. Basically had to be put at the receiver and had to have 1 wire from each dish ran to it. Unsupported and unusable. 
Single LNB - DBS LNB that only has 1 output. Can ONLY be connected to 1 receiver. 
Dual LNB - DBS LNB that had 2 outputs. Can be connected to 2 receivers or to a switch to go to 4 or more receivers. 
D* 2x4 or 3x4 MultiSwitch - Simple multiswicth that allows a Dual LNB to be connected to up to 4 receivers. Also available in a 2x8 and 3x8 for up to 8 receivers. CAN be used with E*, but the setups get horribly complicated and is NOT recommended for anyone other than an Expert.

SW21 - 3Sat - This is seen when you have either a 500 Twin or Quad OR an SW44 connected to a 3rd location with an SW21. 
SW21 - 4Sat - This is seen when you have an SW64 connected to a 4th location with an SW21. This is also how a legacy receiver will "see" a DP+44 Switch.

IF you have a 500 Twin or Quad- You will need an 18" dish and a Single or Dual LNB to get the 61.5 as well as an SW21(or 2 for 2 receivers). Connect the line from the 500 Twin to the SW21 and connect the other LNB to the SW21. DO A CHECK SWITCH.

If you have an SW44 - You can connect the SW44 and the another LNB with an SW21. DO NOT USE PORT 1 due to the power inserter. It will DESTROY the SW21! OR you can replace the SW44 with an SW64 and add the new dish and DUAL LNB to the SW64. DO A CHECK SWITCH.

If you have an SW64 and do not get the 61.5 - You can connect the SW64 and the another LNB with an SW21. DO NOT USE PORT 1 due to the power inserter. It will DESTROY the SW21! DO A CHECK SWITCH.

PLEASE NOTE: You CANNOT cascade 2 SW21s. You MUST have another switch cascaded to the SW21. Microyal, www.microyal.com offers E* compatible switches. They offer the SW21X, which is basically 1/2 of an SW42, and CAN be cascaded with an SW21. You CANNOT casecade an SW21X with a 500Twin or Quad.

PLEASE NOTE: Cascading Multiple SW64 switches together is beyond the scope of this and should ONLY be done by a professional to protect the equipment.

Dish Pro:

ALL DP LNBs or Switches have a DP logo or a DPPlus Logo on them, and it is usually very visible.

DP Single or Dual - DP LNB for 1 sat location. 
DP Twin - Picks up the 110 & 119 - Can feed 2 receivers directly OR be connected to another switch. When connected to a DP34 or DP+44, you need BOTH lines connected to these switches.
DP Quad - Picks up the 110 & 119 - Can feed 2 receivers directly OR be connected to another switch. When connected to a DP34 or DP+44, you need at LEAST 2 lines connected to these switches. The other 2 can be connected directly to a receiver, but you won't get the extra sat locations from the DP34 or DP+44.
DP21 - Similar to the SW21. Connects 1 single or dual DP LNB to another LNB or switch. CANNOT connect 2 DP switches together. 
DP34 - Allows up to 3 Sats to be connected to up to 4 receivers. Can be connected to 2 more DP34s for up to 12 receivers/tuners. REQUIRES 1 Wire from each location.
DP+Twin - Picks up the 110 & 119, Can feed up to 4 tuners. Has a port to add a 3rd location built into it. CAN be used with a DP+ Seperator and a Dual Tuner receiver. Can be connected to a DP34 or a DP+44, but will ONLY transmit the 110 & 119 when connected this way.
DP+44 - Allows up to 4 Sats to be connected to 4 receivers or up to 8 tuners with the DP+ Seperators. Requires POWER INSERTION. 
DP+ Seperator - Allows a DP+ Dual Tuner receiver(322/522/625/721/921/942) to connect to a DP+44 or DP+ Twin(excluding the 721 right now) with only 1 wire. 
SuperDish 105 or 121 - Used with the FSS sats at those locations. The SuperDish comes with a DP34. It can be connected to a DP+44 as well. SuperDishes DO NOT pick up the 61.5. You NEED a second dish.

You CANNOT run a DP21 into a DP34, DP+44, or DP+Twin. It DOES Not work that way. It only works BETWEEN These switches and the receiver(unsure about the DP+Twin, but don't see why it won't work). Also, using a DP21 with a DP+ switch removes the ability to use the DP+ Seperator, so PLEASE keep this in mind.

You CANNOT use a DP21 with a DP+44 and the DP+ Seperator. When you use the DP21s, you MUST have 1 line to each tuner. The DP21 is NOT DP+. It only band stacks. It does NOT band translate/share.

If you have a DP Twin or Quad- You will need an 18" dish and a Single or Dual DP LNB to get the 61.5 as well as an DP21(or 2 for 2 receivers). Connect the line from the DP Twin or Quad to the DP21 and connect the other DP LNB to the DP21. DO A CHECK SWITCH.

If you have a DP34 - You can connect the DP34 and the another DP LNB with a DP21. OR you can replace the DP34 with a DP+44 and add the new dish and DP LNB to the DP+44. DO A CHECK SWITCH.

If you have an DP+44 and do not get the 61.5 - You can connect the DP+44 and the other DP LNB with an DP21. DO NOT USE PORT 1 due to the power inserter. It will DESTROY the DP21! DO A CHECK SWITCH.

Please keep in mind that legacy switches like the SW44 and SW64 HAVE to have 2 lines from each LNB/Location to work properly, whereas an SW21 only needs 1.

Also keep in mind that a DP switch, like the DP21, DP+Twin, DP34, or DP+44 REQUIRE 1 wire from each LNB/Location.

When cascading 1 DP34 into another DP34, if you want the same sats on all Tuners, you MUST connect each output from the first DP34 into each input on the 2nd DP34(they do NOT have to be in the same order). Same goes for the DP+44. You can also cascade a DP+44 into a DP34, but you will lose 1 sat in this config. Also keep in mind that when cascading DP34s that at least 1 receiver on the first switch MUST be plugged in to power the switch. With the DP+44s, you MUST have the power inserters plugged in for each switch for them to see the signals.

Revision:

Using a DPTwin on a D500 to get the 61.5:

1. Set the skew of the D500 at 90 degress so that the arm is not tilted.
2. Connect the Twin DIRECTLY to a receiver.
3. Cover the 110 side of the LNB with a peice of tin foil or thick cloth.
4. Set the elavation. Tune the dish.
5. Once you have the signal locked, connect the dish to your equipment. Remove the cover.
6. Run the check switch. It SHOULD show 4 locations with 1 as an X for signal and NC for sat(assuming you are connecting to a DP34. A DP21 should only "see" the 119 side to begin with).

When using the DPTwin with a DP21, you may have problems when using a DPTwin on the 110/119 since the DP21 only "sees" 1 switch. You may have to re-run the switch check a few times. The DP34 should not have any problems.

I would NOT try using a 500 Twin since the SW21 may not see the second 500Twin. If need be I will try it in the next few days and see what happens.

Good Luck!

This post is mirrored at SatelliteGuys.US as well as the EchoStar Knowledge base at http://ekb.dbstalk.com/Adding 61-5 dish.htm


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Thanks for this, Larry!


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## TNGTony (Mar 23, 2002)

Larry, can I copy this post to the EKB?

See ya
Tony


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Good job Larry!


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## JohnGfun (Jan 16, 2004)

Thanks Larry! I do have one question....Do I add the DP21 Before Or After The DP34?


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## JohnGfun (Jan 16, 2004)

One more question. Is it possible to use a Dish 500 LNB Because thats what I've got laying around.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

John - after the DP34, and if you're talking about a Twin, you can give it a shot, but it's a hit or miss type deal, especially if it's DP.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

TNGTony said:


> Larry, can I copy this post to the EKB?
> 
> See ya
> Tony


Yup.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

JohnGfun said:


> Thanks Larry! I do have one question....Do I add the DP21 Before Or After The DP34?


You MUST add the DP34 into the DP21. It will NOT work the other way.


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## JohnGfun (Jan 16, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> You MUST add the DP34 into the DP21. It will NOT work the other way.


So the 61.5 will only run to one receiver that way?


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## JohnGfun (Jan 16, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> John - after the DP34, and if you're talking about a Twin, you can give it a shot, but it's a hit or miss type deal, especially if it's DP.


Its a quad?


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

JohnGfun said:


> One more question. Is it possible to use a Dish 500 LNB Because thats what I've got laying around.


You can. It's just a pain to point. Best to hook the 500 directly to the receiver, point and acquire 61.5 then attach it to your switch and do a check switch.

Make sure also that you are using either completely legacy dishes/switches or DishPRO dishes/switches.

I do have a 500 pointed at 61.5 and it gives me no grief.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

JohnGfun said:


> So the 61.5 will only run to one receiver that way?


Correct. You can SPLIT a DP Single/Dual LNB, and use multiple DP21s to connect to more than 1 receiver in this fashion. However, it would make more sense to get a DP+44 in this case. Basically, if all you need from the 61.5 is the V* channels, and you ONLY have 1 HD receiver, then that is all that you need.


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## chastulsa (Dec 5, 2003)

I have 3 questions. 


1. How far can the dishes be from each other? (other side of house?)

2. I have my dish 500 on the West side of my house pointing south. My niehbor has a big tree on the east side of me which blocks nearly al the east (unless I go on a 30ft pole) But on the east side of my house I have about a 15ft square window. How big of a window do I need if its the right eval? I cant move my Dish 500 becuase On the east side of the house the same tree blocks south. 

3. I live in Tulsa and can get the MUST CARRY dish for free. I dont have exposure to 148 bc other neihbors tree. How much should I buy the guy to try to repoint that dish to 61.5?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

chastulsa said:


> I have 3 questions.


3 answers:



chastulsa said:


> 1. How far can the dishes be from each other? (other side of house?)


Maximum cable legnth from the receivers to the dish is 125ft for legacy and 200ft for DP. You CAN go farther, but at your own risk.



chastulsa said:


> 2. I have my dish 500 on the West side of my house pointing south. My niehbor has a big tree on the east side of me which blocks nearly al the east (unless I go on a 30ft pole) But on the east side of my house I have about a 15ft square window. How big of a window do I need if its the right eval? I cant move my Dish 500 becuase On the east side of the house the same tree blocks south.


That MAY work. Unfortunately, the only way to find out is to try.



chastulsa said:


> 3. I live in Tulsa and can get the MUST CARRY dish for free. I dont have exposure to 148 bc other neihbors tree. How much should I buy the guy to try to repoint that dish to 61.5?


You can schedule the must carry install. And you MAY be able to at least get the installers opinion. However, keep in mind that E* will probably mirror the V* channels on the 148 soon, and you may be wasting your time and money. Is it really THAT important that you get these channels immediately, or would it make more sense to wait and see what happens.


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## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

Hey great post and info Larry,

I just added the 10 Voom channels with no problems. Here is my question. I have 2 921's that are being fed from a legacy quad. I currently have both of the inputs from my 61.5 lnb feeding one of the 921's in the den. What switch would I need to get to add 61.5 to the other 921? I need 2 more 61.5 feeds in another words for the other 921. 

Looks like I need an SW64 but would this work before I spend the extra $$$$?


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## ww2154 (Aug 4, 2004)

I have a superdish with a 34dp switch. I subscribe to dish network 120 plus hd packand have the 811 receiver. I also have a direct tv dish with a lnb model dlnb2 right next to my dish network superdish that I used back when I had direct tv 2 years ago. Can I use the direct tv dish to pick up the voom channels on dish network and if I can how do I do that. I know I have to pay dish 5 more dollars a month for these channels .


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

I've got my locals on 148, which I don't watch, but I do need the guide data. I'm guessing the data comes from 148 too.

Anyway, it appears I need 61.5, 110, 119, and 148.

I read that link about cascading sw21s with the sw21x here:
http://www.microyal.com/dishnet-tech-main.jpg

However, in the end, it only shows up as linking three satellites together.
Can I use the a sw21 cascaded with a sw21x to link a Dish500 twin, and two Dish 300 twins to get 61.5, 110, 119, and 148? Or do I have to go the sw44 with a sw21?

I'm only running two lines down for a 921. No other receivers.


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## yaesumofo (Apr 22, 2005)

Ok so here is the deal.
I now have a 921 and a 811.
On the roof here is a dish 500 antenna pointed at 110 and 119.
A second dish pointed at 148.
These are feeding a SW64.
So I tried to re-aim tthe 148 dish. No good the dish 500 is in the way of a good point at 61.5. 
So option one seem to be to have a dish guy come out and move the 148 dish and re-aim it for 61.5. cost $129. I loose 148.
Or have the guy add a dish for 61.5 and a dishpro+ 44. Cost $300+.
Is this really worth all the trouble?
Should I just be patient and wait for the HD content to appear on 148?
Can any of you think of an easy way to do all of this?
Anybody got a cheap dishpro+44 they don't need?
Yaesumofo


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

ibglowin said:


> I just added the 10 Voom channels with no problems. Here is my question. I have 2 921's that are being fed from a legacy quad. I currently have both of the inputs from my 61.5 lnb feeding one of the 921's in the den. What switch would I need to get to add 61.5 to the other 921? I need 2 more 61.5 feeds in another words for the other 921.
> 
> Looks like I need an SW64 but would this work before I spend the extra $$$$?


You can do that. OR, you can run the 61.5 LNB into a D* style 4way multiswitch and use 2 more SW21s. OR upgrade to DP and get a DP34.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

ww2154 said:


> I have a superdish with a 34dp switch. I subscribe to dish network 120 plus hd packand have the 811 receiver. I also have a direct tv dish with a lnb model dlnb2 right next to my dish network superdish that I used back when I had direct tv 2 years ago. Can I use the direct tv dish to pick up the voom channels on dish network and if I can how do I do that. I know I have to pay dish 5 more dollars a month for these channels .


That will ONLY work if the D* dish is a D-Arm dish and you will have to replace the LNB for it to work.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

jsanders said:


> I've got my locals on 148, which I don't watch, but I do need the guide data. I'm guessing the data comes from 148 too. Anyway, it appears I need 61.5, 110, 119, and 148. However, in the end, it only shows up as linking three satellites together.
> Can I use the a sw21 cascaded with a sw21x to link a Dish500 twin, and two Dish 300 twins to get 61.5, 110, 119, and 148? Or do I have to go the sw44 with a sw21?


Unfortunately, you cannot cascade more than 2 switches with legacy. Also, the problem is that the SW21X is the SAME as the 500Twin, and you cannot cascade the same switch. You will need to get an SW64 to do the SW21-4Sat setup. AFAIK, you cannot casecade a 500Twin and an SW44 together with an SW21. However, you may be able to get the V* channels on the 148, so it may be worth waiting.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

yaesumofo said:


> Should I just be patient and wait for the HD content to appear on 148?
> Can any of you think of an easy way to do all of this?
> Anybody got a cheap dishpro+44 they don't need?


That would be the best idea. At the very least wait and see what they say. Otherwise, you may end up spending more money for no good reason other than impatience.


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## yaesumofo (Apr 22, 2005)

larrystotler said:


> That would be the best idea. At the very least wait and see what they say. Otherwise, you may end up spending more money for no good reason other than impatience.


Are we talking about weeks or months here?
I wonder.
Yaesumofo


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## chastulsa (Dec 5, 2003)

larrystotler said:


> You can schedule the must carry install. And you MAY be able to at least get the installers opinion. However, keep in mind that E* will probably mirror the V* channels on the 148 soon, and you may be wasting your time and money. Is it really THAT important that you get these channels immediately, or would it make more sense to wait and see what happens.


Well if they mirror because there is now I will be able to get 148 wich is WEST right?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

chastulsa said:


> Well if they mirror because there is now I will be able to get 148 wich is WEST right?


The 148 comes in from the right of the D500 when looking at where the D500 is pointed. Right now we have not gotten any definate info.


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## dishbacker (Jun 15, 2004)

I believe the answer to this is no, but is it possible to cascade a DP+ Twin (110/119/148) with a DP21 to add in 61.5? I'm using a separator on the other end for my 921. I'm guessing it would work if I wasn't using the separator on the other side.

Or, what about using the DP21 prior to the 'Satellite In' connection on the DP+ Twin?

Just curious.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

dishbacker said:


> I believe the answer to this is no, but is it possible to cascade a DP+ Twin (110/119/148) with a DP21 to add in 61.5? I'm using a separator on the other end for my 921. I'm guessing it would work if I wasn't using the separator on the other side.
> 
> Or, what about using the DP21 prior to the 'Satellite In' connection on the DP+ Twin?


You cannot run a DP21 output into another switch. It MAY work with a DP21 connected to the DP+Twin. I haven't tried it yet.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

jsanders said:


> I've got my locals on 148, which I don't watch, but I do need the guide data. I'm guessing the data comes from 148 too.
> 
> Anyway, it appears I need 61.5, 110, 119, and 148. ...


Well, you might not need 148 to get the guide data. It's worth a shot anyway - try just swapping in 61.5 for 148.


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## chastulsa (Dec 5, 2003)

larrystotler said:


> The 148 comes in from the right of the D500 when looking at where the D500 is pointed. Right now we have not gotten any definate info.


are you sure its the southern area, they came out twice and said its staright west? Is there any photos of how to two dish's look side by side?

-C h a s


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

dishbacker said:


> I believe the answer to this is no, but is it possible to cascade a DP+ Twin (110/119/148) with a DP21 to add in 61.5? I'm using a separator on the other end for my 921. I'm guessing it would work if I wasn't using the separator on the other side.
> 
> Or, what about using the DP21 prior to the 'Satellite In' connection on the DP+ Twin?
> 
> Just curious.


No, sorry - it doesn't work, I've tried it.

You can't feed a DPP-Twin into a DP21. Well, you can, but it won't see the single LNB. 

Here's my testing:

```
-----------
Swapped in the DPP-Twin
Switch Check: 1=3/3 2=3/3
Switch Matrix:
Tuner	----1----		----2----
Port:	1	2		1	2
Sat:	119	110		119	110
Trans:	OK	OK		OK	OK
Device:	twin	twin		twin	twin
Status:	Reception Verified.	Reception Verified.	
Switch:	DPP-Twin		DPP-Twin

-----------
Added a pair of DP21s - nothing on input #2
Switch Check: 1=3/3 2=3/3
NO CHANGE to Switch Matrix!

-----------
Added 148 on DP21 input #2 - Tuner 1 = DC pass
Switch Check: 1=3/3 2=3/3
NO CHANGE to Switch Matrix!

-----------
Put DPP-Twin back onto DP21 input #2
Switch Check: 1=3/2 2=3/2
Nothing recognized from DP21 input #2
```


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## dishbacker (Jun 15, 2004)

SimpleSimon said:


> No, sorry - it doesn't work, I've tried it.
> 
> You can't feed a DPP-Twin into a DP21. Well, you can, but it won't see the single LNB.


I figured. Oh well. One other question, if I did go the DP+ 44 route, and have both 61.5 and 148, would that allow me to get both CBS-HD channels (East and West)? I currently get CBS-HD West off of 148 today.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Guide data does NOT come from 148 - the extended guide data is all from 110.

Simon - have you tried running the DPP Twin outputs into a DP34 or a DPP44 and then adding another satellite at the DP34 or the DPP44?


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## Shani (Sep 23, 2004)

OK, I'm a little confused  (nothing new about that!) and need some help: I have a DP Twin LNB with 2 runs to an inside DP34, then out of the DP34 to a 942 and a 501.

How can I connect a 2nd dish (for either 61.5 or 148) without having to do another cable run into the house? 
(I thought of getting a DPP Twin, but then read that it can't be connected to a DP34...)


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Guide data does NOT come from 148 - the extended guide data is all from 110.


Mark, I think he was refering to his locals guide info. Don't you have to have a sat at that location to get the locals guide data?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Shani said:


> I have a DP Twin LNB with 2 runs to an inside DP34, then out of the DP34 to a 942 and a 501. How can I connect a 2nd dish (for either 61.5 or 148) without having to do another cable run into the house? (I thought of getting a DPP Twin, but then read that it can't be connected to a DP34...)


Actually, you would not need the DP34 with the DP+Twin, since it can feed both tuners of the 942 in conjunction with the DP+ Sperator. Also, the DP+Twin WILL work with the DP34, however, it will only transmit the 110 and 119, and not the 3rd location. That port won't work anymore. Otherwise, you will HAVE to run a new line to the DP34.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

larrystotler said:


> Mark, I think he was refering to his locals guide info. Don't you have to have a sat at that location to get the locals guide data?


I believe that _all_ of the guide data comes from 110, not from where your locals are coming from.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Hey Guys, I have been editing the original post to fill in and blanks. Please check it out again if you have a questions. I may have the answers there now.


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## IamtheEggman (Sep 21, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> I believe that _all_ of the guide data comes from 110, not from where your locals are coming from.


Wonder why I'm not seeing the new channels on my 921 then?


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

Well I am a totally confused ex-voomer, now coming back to DISH for a smaller VOOM fix :lol: :

What I have:
- DISH 500 quad legacy LNB dish (pointed at 100/119)
- VOOM dual LNB dish (pointed at 61.5)
- DISH 4000 receiver to go on the SD television
- One SW21 switch

What I want to do:
- Get an 811 for the HD television
- 811 must receive 110/119/61.5
- 4000 must receive 110/119 (61.5 too if that's doable without lots of extra $$$)

So what's my easiest and or most cost-effective solution? Mucho thanks in advance !!!

Rob.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

IamtheEggman said:


> Wonder why I'm not seeing the new channels on my 921 then?


Because you MUST have a dish pointing at 61.5 to see the channels in your guide. The data is there, but it's hidden from you unless you have a dish in place. That's the way it's always been with Dish.


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> I believe that _all_ of the guide data comes from 110, not from where your locals are coming from.


Okay, you and Simon generally know more about this stuff than I do, which is a good thing! 

Have you replaced your 148 satellite after the "operation" on Friday?? For those locals that you have on 148, have you tried going out 9 days in the guide to see if they are being replenished? I guess that would be the ultimate insurance policy. :contract: :lol:


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Rob - did you read the first post in this thread?

Because you're legacy, your install is very easy. 2 SW21 switches connected to oututs of Quad and Dual at 61.5, outputs running to 811 and 4000. Piece of cake!


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> Unfortunately, you cannot cascade more than 2 switches with legacy. Also, the problem is that the SW21X is the SAME as the 500Twin, and you cannot cascade the same switch. You will need to get an SW64 to do the SW21-4Sat setup. AFAIK, you cannot casecade a 500Twin and an SW44 together with an SW21. However, you may be able to get the V* channels on the 148, so it may be worth waiting.


Thanks for the insight Larry! I get it, legacy doesn't allow the same kind of switch twice. So, I need the SW64 and a new dish. I'm guessing by your comments about destroying the SW21 means that you cascade it through the output of the SW64, and not the output of the SW21 going as an input to the SW64.

The way it looks now, it might be cheaper to let dish install it for me for $100, if I can stand to wait for them to come out and do it.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

jsanders said:


> Okay, you and Simon generally know more about this stuff than I do, which is a good thing!
> 
> Have you replaced your 148 satellite after the "operation" on Friday?? For those locals that you have on 148, have you tried going out 9 days in the guide to see if they are being replenished? I guess that would be the ultimate insurance policy. :contract: :lol:


My new dish for 148 should get here tomorrow, so not yet. Currently, I'm not showing my other local channels in any of my guides because that data is hidden. If there's no dish installed to looks at the channels, you don't get to see the guide data.


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Rob - did you read the first post in this thread?
> 
> Because you're legacy, your install is very easy. 2 SW21 switches connected to oututs of Quad and Dual at 61.5, outputs running to 811 and 4000. Piece of cake!


Naw I just ignored all that EXCELLENT information (btw a big thanks to Larry)  . Where I got confused is the DISH install diagrams only show this config as supported on the x7xx series of receivers, not the x0xxx (http://www.dishnetwork.com/content/products/installation/install_diagrams/index.shtml). Thanks for letting me know it will work!

Rob.


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## UT_Texan (Dec 9, 2004)

sorry to seem like a pest but I would like to know what I might need if I decide to try and get the voom hd.

I currently have a D500 with 2 DP dual LNB running into a DP34 that runs into another DP34 hooked up powering what is in my sig.

I have an older D500 dish with legacy twin lnb. I know the lnb won't work. So I guess what the real question is how to hook it up. I know I would need to get a DP LNB but does it matter which one Dual/quad? depending on which one I get do I just need to run one cable into my first dp34 then another cable from the first dp34 to the second?
After looking on the web awhile I was able to find an LNB that matches the two I have on my d500.
I did read Larry's post but am still somewhat confused


thanks!


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> My new dish for 148 should get here tomorrow, so not yet. Currently, I'm not showing my other local channels in any of my guides because that data is hidden. If there's no dish installed to looks at the channels, you don't get to see the guide data.


Oh. So that applies to your OTA channels as well? No guide data for some of them now?


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Rob - did you read the first post in this thread?
> 
> Because you're legacy, your install is very easy. 2 SW21 switches connected to oututs of Quad and Dual at 61.5, outputs running to 811 and 4000. Piece of cake!


Okay I said I was confused :icon_stup . I have a DISH 500 with two seperate twin legacy LNB's (is that the same as a twin or quad DISH500?). Do I take one SW21 with 110/61.5 and output to one reciever, and the other SW21 with 119/61.5 to the other receiver? This is what Larry's instructions say and what DISH diagrams have, but I don't know how this will give all three sats on both recievers.

Thanks again, Rob.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Hmm...looking now. My 942 does have guide data for the PBS station that I lost when I disconnected 148. So does my 921. That's interesting. So, guide data for the digital channels that is mapped over from the local channel package is not dependent on being able to receive that local channel if a dish isn't installed.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

rvsixer said:


> Okay I said I was confused :icon_stup . I have a DISH 500 with two seperate twin legacy LNB's (is that the same as a twin or quad DISH500?). Do I take one SW21 with 110/61.5 and output to one reciever, and the other SW21 with 119/61.5 to the other receiver? This is what Larry's instructions say and what DISH diagrams have, but I don't know how this will give all three sats on both recievers.
> 
> Thanks again, Rob.


OK, your life just got more difficult. You don't have 2 legacy twins, you have 2 legacy dual LNBs (if they are separate pieces that don't have the black DP logo on them). Definitely not the same. The SW21s will no longer work for you. You'll need to add an SW64 switch, connect to it the 4 cables from your Dish500, 2 cables from your Voom dish, and then connect the 2 receivers to the output ports.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Hmm...looking now. My 942 does have guide data for the PBS station that I lost when I disconnected 148. So does my 921. That's interesting. So, guide data for the digital channels that is mapped over from the local channel package is not dependent on being able to receive that local channel if a dish isn't installed.


Side slot 'extra' locals are different. Try tuning them. You will see a slate (channel 9950) that tells you you need a 2nd dish.

All the side slot 'extra' locals are set up this way so they show up in the guide of D500 only customers and (the NAB hopes) get requested. 

Full markets on a satellite you don't get don't show up (just like other channels on those slots).

JL


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## IamtheEggman (Sep 21, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Because you MUST have a dish pointing at 61.5 to see the channels in your guide. The data is there, but it's hidden from you unless you have a dish in place. That's the way it's always been with Dish.


Cool
Thanks Mark, the question I now have is do I want a 4th dish(Dish 500, 10ft C band 4DTV, dedicated KU and now one at 61.5 )  just so I can get those channels. I have the SW21s, I have the dual legacy LNB all I need is a dish. SHould be a easy to get as it will clear the trees around my house with that elevation angle.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Well, obviously the answer to that question is YES OF COURSE!, Eggman!  You can never have too many dishes!


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## gunawo (Aug 17, 2004)

Can two (2) DP34 Switches be cascaded to a SuperDish and a DishPro
LNB on a separate dish pointing at 61.5 or do I have to get a SW44?

Jim


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Hmm...looking now. My 942 does have guide data for the PBS station that I lost when I disconnected 148. So does my 921. That's interesting. So, guide data for the digital channels that is mapped over from the local channel package is not dependent on being able to receive that local channel if a dish isn't installed.


That is great news! I'm guessing that the local OTA guide data for those channels still goes out the entire 9 days?


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Jim - you need to get a DPP44, NOT an SW44. They are very different beasts.

jsanders - yup.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> My new dish for 148 should get here tomorrow, so not yet. Currently, I'm not showing my other local channels in any of my guides because that data is hidden. If there's no dish installed to looks at the channels, you don't get to see the guide data.


That's what I was asking about earlier. If he is getting his guide data for his OTA, and removes the 148, he will loose the guide data, yes?


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> That's what I was asking about earlier. If he is getting his guide data for his OTA, and removes the 148, he will loose the guide data, yes?


 Well, that's the big question isn't it? 

My contention is that if you have an actve subscription for the locals, the guide data will continue to be available. I sure want to know if I'm right or not.

If I AM right, it might help a lot of 921 and maybe 942 customers with their OTA guide.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

rvsixer said:


> Okay I said I was confused :icon_stup . I have a DISH 500 with two seperate twin legacy LNB's (is that the same as a twin or quad DISH500?). Do I take one SW21 with 110/61.5 and output to one reciever, and the other SW21 with 119/61.5 to the other receiver? This is what Larry's instructions say and what DISH diagrams have, but I don't know how this will give all three sats on both recievers.
> 
> Thanks again, Rob.


You can also replace the 2 duals on the D500 and get a 500Twin(kinda rare) and 2 SW21s to tie the 61.5 in OR you can get a Microyal SW21X and cascade the SW21 into the SW21X on the HD receiver.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

UT_Texan said:


> I currently have a D500 with 2 DP dual LNB running into a DP34 that runs into another DP34 hooked up powering what is in my sig.
> I have an older D500 dish with legacy twin lnb. I know the lnb won't work. So I guess what the real question is how to hook it up. I know I would need to get a DP LNB but does it matter which one Dual/quad? depending on which one I get do I just need to run one cable into my first dp34 then another cable from the first dp34 to the second?
> After looking on the web awhile I was able to find an LNB that matches the two I have on my d500.


You didn't specify if the dish with the DP Dual is the 148? Anyway, when you cascade a DP34 OR a DP+44, IF you want the same signals on all receivers, then you cascade each output into each input. If you only need the 61.5 on 1 HD tuner, then a DP Dual and 1 DP21 would be fine. I will edit to clarify cascading the switches.


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## UT_Texan (Dec 9, 2004)

Larry,
It is the 110/119. That is the only ones I am currently pointing to. The older d500 isn't hooked up. It is what I add from way way back. I fear I am not using the right terminology.
I will take picture and add it tomorrow when there is light again


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

In other words, you have a DP TWIN hooked up to the DP34. If this is so, you will need the 61.5 installed with a DP single or Dual and ran into the DP34.


TNGTony - I have revised my original post several times. I don't know if you added it yet, but it may get more revisions over the next few days.....Thanx


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

SimpleSimon said:


> My contention is that if you have an actve subscription for the locals, the guide data will continue to be available. I sure want to know if I'm right or not.




```
FOR ALL LOCALS:
IF [[you have an active subscription to the channel]
    AND [[can receive the satellite the channel is on]
      OR [the channel is an extra locals on the wings]]]
   THEN {you get the EPG DATA} 

FOR ALL OTHER CHANNELS:
IF [[you have an active subscription to the channel]
    AND [can receive the satellite the channel is on]]
   THEN {you get the EPG DATA}
```
JL


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Larry and Simon - that's exactly the situation that I'm currently in. I have removed my 148 dish. My KBDI PBS station is on 148. My digital OTA KBDI station continues to be completely populated with guide data for the next 9 days. Ergo, OTA guide data for wing locals is not contingent on having a wing dish installed.


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## DRJDAN (Apr 28, 2002)

I am in Dallas. My understanding is that I need 148 for the must carry locals which I understand I can have installed at no cost. I don't really want the must carry locals.

If I do this, would I have to remount or reaim to change the 148 dish to the 61.5 location?


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## Mike123abc (Jul 19, 2002)

DRJDAN said:


> I am in Dallas. My understanding is that I need 148 for the must carry locals which I understand I can have installed at no cost. I don't really want the must carry locals.
> 
> If I do this, would I have to remount or reaim to change the 148 dish to the 61.5 location?


If you have a clear view of 61.5 from where your 148 dish is installed, you would just have to rotate the 148 dish around and adjust the elevation to get 61.5 instead.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Larry and Simon - that's exactly the situation that I'm currently in. I have removed my 148 dish. My KBDI PBS station is on 148. My digital OTA KBDI station continues to be completely populated with guide data for the next 9 days. Ergo, OTA guide data for wing locals is not contingent on having a wing dish installed.


 Yes - for the moment at least.

The acid tests include whether it's still there in the morning, and whether it's there after soft/hard reboots.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Mark Lamutt said:


> My digital OTA KBDI station continues to be completely populated with guide data for the next 9 days. Ergo, OTA guide data for wing locals is not contingent on having a wing dish installed.


I can't believe I missed that it was an OTA digital station (ATSC tuner) and not a E* retransmitted OTA! That changes the IF THEN I posted (which remains accurate for E* transmitted locals).

All the OTA and satellite channel information is in all of the program guides on E*. Every satellite position carries the 44 hour guide - so even if you had just a Dish300 pointed at one of the DBS slots or just the FSS feed of the SuperDish hooked up to a receiver as the only signal you would get a 44 hour guide.

The 9 day guide is uplinked ONLY to 110 ... so in order to go 9 days out you need 110 as one of your feeds. Without 110 you will only get the 44 hour data.

BTW: EVERY transponder in the system has a 'present/next' guide for EVERY channel in the system. This mini-guide only lists two programs and the info screen for each channel and is used for instant updates (last minute program changes) and the browse function. It is on every transponder so the receiver doesn't have to lose the channel you are watching to update the table.

Hidden in the guide:
Channels on satellites you don't receive (except subscribed side slot locals)
Channels marked hidden that you don't subscribe to
Channels marked HD on non-HD receivers
OTA channels that your receiver hasn't found

Short answer: If it is OTA and you receive the signal you will get the EPG.

JL


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## gunawo (Aug 17, 2004)

OK Let me ask this: I have a superdish with 110,119,121. I also have a dish 300 with a DP LNB that I can point at 61.5. Can I Put two of the LNBs on a DP21 and the other two on another DP21,
and then the two outputs from the dp21's into the house to a DP34 Switch to end up with 4 outputs to receivers with all 4 satellites on them??? I'm trying to avoid buying
a DPP44.
Jim


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

NO - You CANNOT cascade a DP21 INTO another switch. You will have to add it to the output of the DP34. Do you need 4 tuners worth of 61.5? If so, then a DP+44 may be needed. OR, you could wait and see what they say about putting the V* channels onto the 148.


ATTENTION - I have made SEVERAL revisions to the original post. Please check it out if you haven't read it lately. Both here and Satellite Guy's thread have the IDENTICAL post. Thanx.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

SimpleSimon said:


> Yes - for the moment at least.
> 
> The acid tests include whether it's still there in the morning, and whether it's there after soft/hard reboots.


Yes, it's still there after the nightly reboot and guide download.


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## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

Your lucky, not too many locals have anything on the side wings anymore.

This is how I got my 61.5 Dish for free a few years ago. Just call up Dish and ask for the locals on 148. When the installer comes just tell him you really want it pointed at 61.5, not 148. He gets paid by Dish all the same so he won't care as long as you sign the order and he gets his $$ and you get your 2nd Dish.



DRJDAN said:


> I am in Dallas. My understanding is that I need 148 for the must carry locals which I understand I can have installed at no cost. I don't really want the must carry locals.
> 
> If I do this, would I have to remount or reaim to change the 148 dish to the 61.5 location?


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

To verify that I understand this correctly:
I am in Toledo, OH. I have a SuperDish and it locks onto satellites 110, 119 and 121. I also have an 811 and subscribe to the HD Pak (such as it is). The only way I'm going to get the new, former VOOM HD channels right now is to have a second dish installed and pointed at the 61.5 bird whatever direction that might be. I don't think that it helps me even if Dish "mirrors" the channels onto 148 since my Dish is not locked onto that satellite either. I also have a DP34 switch currently feeding three receivers - one of which is a dual tuner so I will assume that it counts as two receivers. So, once again, I assume I would also need a new or additional switch? 
Or, I could just wait until Dish moves these "new" channels over to one of the satellites I already receive programming from - say around 2010?
Do I have it about right?


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

larrystotler said:


> You can also replace the 2 duals on the D500 and get a 500Twin(kinda rare) and 2 SW21s to tie the 61.5 in OR you can get a Microyal SW21X and cascade the SW21 into the SW21X on the HD receiver.


Thanks to all who responded for your help. Okay one set of 110/119 outputs to a SW21 into the 4000 receiver. One set of 110/119/61.5 outputs to SW21X/SW21 to the 811 receiver. Good to go, yes? The SW64 route looks expensive, might be cheaper to go with a new SD reciever and convert to DP LNB's.

Rob.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

rvsixer said:


> Thanks to all who responded for your help. Okay one set of 110/119 outputs to a SW21 into the 4000 receiver. One set of 110/119/61.5 outputs to SW21X/SW21 to the 811 receiver. Good to go, yes? The SW64 route looks expensive, might be cheaper to go with a new SD reciever and convert to DP LNB's.
> 
> Rob.


No. You need to either replace the 2 duals on the D500 with a 500Twin OR you need to run them into the SW21 like you have now, and then into the sw21X for the 61.5. You cannot do it the way you are suggesting. And you cannot use the SW21X with the 500Twin. You don't need the 61.5 on the 4000, so if you have the D500 on the SW21s, just order the SW21X and connect the 61.5 to the line going to the 811. Or have E* do the install for the $99. That would be as cheap as the SW64 and the aggrevation.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

JerryR said:


> The only way I'm going to get the new, former VOOM HD channels right now is to have a second dish installed and pointed at the 61.5 bird whatever direction that might be.


In your case, the 61.5 would probably be best. You didn't specify how many HD receivers you have. If you only have 1, then you only need 1 DP21 to do this. If you have more than 1, then an upgrade to the DP+44 would be the best bet, especially since it will allow you to use the dual tuner one 1 wire with the DP+ Seperator.


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> In your case, the 61.5 would probably be best. You didn't specify how many HD receivers you have. If you only have 1, then you only need 1 DP21 to do this. If you have more than 1, then an upgrade to the DP+44 would be the best bet, especially since it will allow you to use the dual tuner one 1 wire with the DP+ Seperator.


Thanks for the response Larry. I have only one 811 HD receiver. My SuperDish points to the southwest - is the 61.5 bird out in that direction? Sounds like what you are telling me is that I don't necessarily need another dish but just a switch. Is that correct? Thanks again.
Update: I guess I just got my question answered. I just spoke with my local installer who, BTW, was unaware of the additional HD channels being offered - no surprise. She told me I would need another dish pointed at the 61.5 bird and another "very expensive" switch in her words. Since I'm not wild about creating a dish farm or spending yet even more $$, I believe I'll wait for Dish to get around to offering them to all subs - if they ever do.


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

larrystotler said:
 

> Or have E* do the install for the $99. That would be as cheap as the SW64 and the aggrevation.


Okay finally gotcha' on the SW21x placement (wasn't aware you could cascade after the SW21, that's not shown on the microroyal wiring diagram). I prefer to avoid "professional" installs at all costs. VOOM forced Installs Inc. on me and boy what a mess that was (two 1/8" lags to mount dish, not a ground block or ground wire anywhere, left all the empty boxes/packaging strewn about outside and inside). Way more aggravating than self-installing.

Rob.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

JerryR said:


> I just spoke with my local installer who, BTW, was unaware of the additional HD channels being offered - no surprise. She told me I would need another dish pointed at the 61.5 bird and another "very expensive" switch


She's wrong on the "expensive switch". She's refering to the DP+44, which you really don't need unless you plan to add another HD receiver anytime soon. While you will need an 18" dish pointing SSE, you only need to obtain the Dish, a DP Dual LNB, and a DP21. You tie the DP34 into the DP21, the DP Dual into the DP21, and run it to the receiver. Cost about $100 total. Call the 800-WOW-HDTV # and check it out. They are doing 61.5 installs for $99 from E*.


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> She's wrong on the "expensive switch". She's refering to the DP+44, which you really don't need unless you plan to add another HD receiver anytime soon. While you will need an 18" dish pointing SSE, you only need to obtain the Dish, a DP Dual LNB, and a DP21. You tie the DP34 into the DP21, the DP Dual into the DP21, and run it to the receiver. Cost about $100 total. Call the 800-WOW-HDTV # and check it out. They are doing 61.5 installs for $99 from E*.


Thanks yet again Larry. As usual, the folks here know more than the people who sell/install this stuff! One last question if I may, do you know where the 148 bird is located? Rampant speculation here has been that E* will likely mirror the new HD channels on to 148 from 61.5. I'm wondering if my SuperDish is able to pull in 148. As you can tell, I'd really like to avoid another dish -which, I'm not sure would work in my case anyway due to LOS issues.


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## RandallA (Feb 4, 2005)

The 148 bird is located at 148. You still need a separate dish to get 148. SuperDish will only get 3 birds (110, 119,121) or (105, 110, 119).

Hope that helps.


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## mm1 (Aug 20, 2004)

I read the Mad Scientist but am still having problems getting the 5th sat on my 522. I have a 105 SD for locals and the 120 package. I have a 121 SD that I put up just for a few internationals on 121. I have a DPP 44 switch and want to add a 61.5 (DP) for the Pentagon channel. When I try and cascade the DP21 switch and add the 61.5 my 522 receiver won't pass the Check Switch test. Both tuners don't match up and it won't let me continue. If I swap the 61.5 input un the DP21 to dish 1, the same thing happens. This works on my 510 receiver so I can't figure it out. I am using a DP seperator on my 522. Does anyone know how I can make this work on my 522?


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

RandallA said:


> The 148 bird is located at 148. You still need a separate dish to get 148. SuperDish will only get 3 birds (110, 119,121) or (105, 110, 119).
> 
> Hope that helps.


Thanks Randall. I obviously don't have a good understanding of how the satellites are named. I keep thinking in terms of a 360 degree circle and where they are located on that circle. Obviously, that thinking is incorrect.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

JerryR said:


> Thanks Randall. I obviously don't have a good understanding of how the satellites are named. I keep thinking in terms of a 360 degree circle and where they are located on that circle. Obviously, that thinking is incorrect.


It isn't too far off. The circle is over the equator around the entire globe where satellites rest in geosync orbit. The orbital locations are numbered starting at zero to the east all the way around the world. To make it easier on us Western hemisphere people, we use numbers starting at zero counting up to the west.
Echostar 148 West is the cluster of satellites operated by Echostar at 148 degrees west of the zero line.
Echostar 61.5 West is the satellite (soon to be cluster) operated by Echostar at 61.5 degrees west of the line.

(The satellites themselves also have names which don't change based on the location. Currently Echostar1 and Echostar2 are at 148 and Echostar3 is at 61.5 . Rainbow1 is also in the cluster at 61.5 but is not yet owned by Echostar. It is possible Echostar4 will also end up at 61.5 .)

The point dish screen will tell you what compass degree (pre-adjusted for magnetic declination) you need to look at to point your dish at a particular orbital slot. Heavy math output into a table. It will also tell you the elevaton (degrees above the horizon with zero being horizon and 90 being straight up) that you need to tilt the dish - and if it is a multisat dish the skew needed to hit multiple satellite locations.

Some of E*'s dishes will pick up multiple close locations such as the Dish500 which can receive 119 and 110, the SuperDish105 which can receive 119, 110 and 105 and the SuperDish121 which can receive 119, 110 and 121 (all when properly aimed).

JL


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## RandallA (Feb 4, 2005)

One easy way to understand it:

Azimuth 0 to 360 degrees. 

N 0 or 360., E 90., S 180., W 270.


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

justalurker said:


> The point dish screen will tell you what compass degree (pre-adjusted for magnetic declination) you need to look at to point your dish at a particular orbital slot. Heavy math output into a table. It will also tell you the elevaton (degrees above the horizon with zero being horizon and 90 being straight up) that you need to tilt the dish - and if it is a multisat dish the skew needed to hit multiple satellite locations.JL


Wow! Thanks for the great, detailed info. That does make it more understandable. Points on the compass is exactly how I've always envisioned the location of the satellites. I did go into the point dish screen and, while 61.5, 105 and 148 are all listed, I will not give me any info when I highlight and select one of them - other than to tell me "wrong satellite, not locked." I'll likely wait a bit until this all shakes out to see if Dish has plans to make the new HD channels available to all subs (why wouldn't they want to??) before I take the drastic step of creating a dish farm. Thanks again for the info. I appreciate it.


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

RandallA said:


> One easy way to understand it:
> 
> Azimuth 0 to 360 degrees.
> 
> N 0 or 360., E 90., S 180., W 270.


That's exactly how I've always thought of it - which is why it confuses me. Take the 61.5 location for example: if I think of (magnetic) North as 0, then 61.5 is just a bit beyond NE where I live. And, I don't think that's where I would point a dish to pick up the 61.5 sats. Sorry if I'm being thick about this.


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## RandallA (Feb 4, 2005)

JerryR,

Go to Menu, 6, 1,1 and press "Peak Angles". Enter you zipcode and select SuperDish and you should get the Azimuth angle, Elevation angle and Skew.


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

RandallA said:


> JerryR,
> 
> Go to Menu, 6, 1,1 and press "Peak Angles". Enter you zipcode and select SuperDish and you should get the Azimuth angle, Elevation angle and Skew.


Oh. Right church, wrong pew. Thanks again Randall. I'll check that out tonight. I appreciate everyone's patience while I try to wrap my brain around this.


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

larrystotler said:


> Okay one set of 110/119 outputs to a SW21 into the 4000 receiver. One set of 110/119/61.5 outputs to SW21X/SW21 to the 811 receiver. Good to go, yes?....You cannot do it the way you are suggesting. You don't need the 61.5 on the 4000, so if you have the D500 on the SW21s, just order the SW21X and connect the 61.5 to the line going to the 811.


Okay finally found a diagram similar to the way I wanted to do it (but adding a 61.5 LNB & SW21x after one of the SW21's to feed the 811). To me it sound the same as what you are describing?

http://www.dishnetwork.com/downloads/pdf/technology/installation/install-1.pdf


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

mm1 said:


> I am using a DP seperator on my 522. Does anyone know how I can make this work on my 522?


That's your problem. You cannot use the DP21 with the DP+ Seperator. To use the DP21, you will need 2, 1 for each tuner and 2 full lines from the receiver to the switches.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

rvsixer said:


> Okay finally found a diagram similar to the way I wanted to do it (but adding a 61.5 LNB & SW21x after one of the SW21's to feed the 811). To me it sound the same as what you are describing?


Kinda. You need to connect 1 line from each LNB on the D500, from the 110 and the 119, into the SW21. Then, take the line from the 61.5's LNB and the line from the SW21 and run them into the SW21X. Then do a check switch.


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## rvsixer (May 1, 2005)

> (adding a 61.5 LNB & SW21x after one of the SW21's)...take the line from the 61.5's LNB and the line from the SW21 and run them into the SW21X.


E-mail communication lacks at times, sorry for any misinterpretation. I take these to mean one in the same and will proceed.

Thanks, Rob.


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## mm1 (Aug 20, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> That's your problem. You cannot use the DP21 with the DP+ Seperator. To use the DP21, you will need 2, 1 for each tuner and 2 full lines from the receiver to the switches.


That's what I thought. Thanks Larry


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## GravelChan (Jan 30, 2005)

JerryR said:


> That's exactly how I've always thought of it - which is why it confuses me. Take the 61.5 location for example: if I think of (magnetic) North as 0, then 61.5 is just a bit beyond NE where I live. And, I don't think that's where I would point a dish to pick up the 61.5 sats. Sorry if I'm being thick about this.


Jerry, you're looking at your compass from the wrong end. 0 degrees is a line
from the north pole to the south pole running through Greenwitch, England.
All these satellites we are talking about are over the equator. So, a satellite 
at 0 degrees is straight south of Greenwitch. A satellite at 100 W(est) is 
over the equator straight south of the center part of the U.S. and will be at 
180 degrees on your compass. The 100 degree west longitude line runs right through the center of N.D., S.D...., TX. The sat at 61.5 is in between 0 and 100 so is southeast for those of us in the U.S. and the 148 sat is SW.

Chan


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

GravelChan said:


> Jerry, you're looking at your compass from the wrong end. 0 degrees is a line
> from the north pole to the south pole running through Greenwitch, England.
> All these satellites we are talking about are over the equator. So, a satellite
> at 0 degrees is straight south of Greenwitch. A satellite at 100 W(est) is
> ...


That clarifies it even more. I appreciate it that you took the time to explain it. Guess I better get my globe out and do some studying. Thanks again Chan.


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## alan s (Dec 6, 2004)

Strange problem. I have a Legacy 500 and a dish at 148 going into a SW64 feeding a 921 and 2 501's. I have added another dish aiming at 61.5 and have attempted to cascade that and outputs 3 and 4 of the SW64 through a pair of SW21's for the 921.
Only 1 of the 2 tuners of the 921 detects the 61.5 satellite during the switch check. I have changed out wires and substituted different SW21's with the same result....the same tuner continues to see 61.5 and the other will not.
Interestingly, if I reverse the wires at the receiver input, the opposite tuner detects the sat.
If I replace the 148 lines with the 61.5 lines to the SW64 the check switch correctly picks up the 61.5 sat.
So far, I know the LNB's are OK, the SW21's and SW64 are OK and the cables are OK......Any suggestions??


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

HAS to be a bad fitting or cable between that SW21 and the 61.5, or a bad SW21. Try changing out those lines and see what happens.


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## trido (Nov 7, 2004)

I have a super dish 105 (105,110,119) with a DP 34 switch.
2-811 and 2 311 receivers.
I have one of my suppliers that can get me DISH 500 and I assume that has a DP LNB.

Dish 500 work for 61.5 and then swap out my DP 34 for a DP44 switch?

SO far seems easy if I have this right so far.

Now when I change out the switches I assume all are marked and not sure if each SAT must connect to a certain connector on DP44?

Also I have seen mention a power inserter I think for switch? What is that exactly and what does it look like and where does it go assuming this setup requires it.

If need is the power inserter included with DP 44?

Thanks

Trido


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

The power inserter supplies power to the switch. The DP+44 will come with one if you buy it.

Other than the fact that it doesn't matter how you hook the lines to the DP+44, you are on the right track.


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## trido (Nov 7, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> The power inserter supplies power to the switch. The DP+44 will come with one if you buy it.
> 
> Other than the fact that it doesn't matter how you hook the lines to the DP+44, you are on the right track.


thanks where does the power inserter hook at meaning does the switch need another run of rg 6 into the house does insertion plug in near receiver and just use that coax from one receiver to switch

Sorry so dumb I just dont see where and how the power insertion mounts I sure hope I dont need another run of rg 6 just for the power insertion?

maybe someplace there is a diagram

thanks

Trido


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## Moridin (Mar 22, 2005)

Currently I have a very boring setup: single dish, 500 Twin legacy LNB, with both feeds connected directly to a 942. (Okay, I'll admit the 942 is _far_ from boring  )

I haven't subscribed to my locals, which would be on 105. If I were to subscribe to my locals, I _think_ that means I would get a SuperDish 105 for free (presumably with some sort of programming commitment). I was thinking I could then have my existing dish reoriented towards 61.5. Three questions:

1) Does the 942 play nicely with superdishes?
2) Why the recommendation to not use Twin LNBs unless no others are accessible?
3) What sort of a switch would I need if I were trying to tie together a superdish with a legacy Twin pointed to 61.5 (assuming that use of a Twin wouldn't cause any problems)?


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## topom (Jan 4, 2004)

IF you need the 61.5(or the 148), you will need an 18Inch Dish. A D500 CAN be used, but it is recommended that you DO NOT use a Twin LNB unless you don't have access to another LNB.

I have a dish 500 currently picking up 110/119 and a DP34 switch. I am going to add another dish for 61.5. In my area, it seems that all of the dealers/installers are saying that the single DP lnbs are no longer available, and the same goes for the 18" dish. I know I can get them online, but is there any reason for the statement above?

The local installers say that the only way they know how to do this with current equipment is a D500 and a dual lnb. Is this more difficult to install?

Thanks for your help! (oh 1 more question - can I use a DP dual lnb with an 18" dish?)


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## alan s (Dec 6, 2004)

Larrystotler, I continue to have the problem.
I have changed the wires and sw21's and am still only seeing 4 sats on input 2 and 3 sats on input 1 of the 921 .
Interestingly, if I reverse the leads coming out of the SW64 at outputs 3&4 the 921 continues to only show 4 sats on input2 (and 3 on input 1) but if I reverse the wires at the back of the 921 the input 1 shows 4 sats and input 2 shows 3.
Thought it might be a 921 problem so I called Dish and of course they felt it was an unauthorized type of installation that I was trying.
Any ideas other than changing everything over to DP?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Moridin said:


> 1) Does the 942 play nicely with superdishes?


Yes



Moridin said:


> 2) Why the recommendation to not use Twin LNBs unless no others are accessible?


They can make installation of a single sat tricky. It's merely much easier to not have to fool with the extra steps involved.



Moridin said:


> 3) What sort of a switch would I need if I were trying to tie together a superdish with a legacy Twin pointed to 61.5 (assuming that use of a Twin wouldn't cause any problems)?


Since the StuipiDish is DP is and the Twin is Legacy, then NO. You CAN reuse the dish, but you will need a DP Dual LNB to make it work. Ask the installer about helping you set it up for the 61.5 when he shows up for the SD install. He may not charge you too much.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

topom said:


> I have a dish 500 currently picking up 110/119 and a DP34 switch. I am going to add another dish for 61.5. In my area, it seems that all of the dealers/installers are saying that the single DP lnbs are no longer available, and the same goes for the 18" dish. I know I can get them online, but is there any reason for the statement above?


The single sat DP Single is no longer being manufactured. The single sat DP Dual is very easy to come by. The 18" dish isn't used by the E* techs because E* no longer makes an 18" dish with their logo on it. They just ues the 20" D500 and put the DP Dual on one side and don't skew it.



topom said:


> (oh 1 more question - can I use a DP dual lnb with an 18" dish?)


So long as the dish has the D-shaped arm, any 18 inch dish will do. A dish with the rectangular arm will not work.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

alan s said:


> I have changed the wires and sw21's and am still only seeing 4 sats on input 2 and 3 sats on input 1 of the 921 .
> Interestingly, if I reverse the leads coming out of the SW64 at outputs 3&4 the 921 continues to only show 4 sats on input2 (and 3 on input 1) but if I reverse the wires at the back of the 921 the input 1 shows 4 sats and input 2 shows 3.


Have you tried the other ports on the SW64? Other than that, I am at a loss. I would try running the 61.5 into the SW64, and move the other sat onto the SW21 to see what happens. What sats are you using and why?


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## M492A (Nov 18, 2004)

I bought a DP single-output LNB yesterday, mounted it to my old 500 dish, and hooked it up to a 301 to try and find 61.5. This should work, right? 

My setup is a SuperDish connected via three cables to a DP-34. From there, I have two cables running to a 942 and one to the 301. From what I can gather from this thread, I'll need a DP+44 to feed everything to the two sat inputs on the 942. Is that correct?


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## M492A (Nov 18, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> So long as the dish has the D-shaped arm, any 18 inch dish will do. A dish with the rectangular arm will not work.


Is this true even if it has the yoke at the end of the arm to adapt it to a DP single LNB?


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## alan s (Dec 6, 2004)

I have replaced the 148 lines to the sw64 (inputs 5&6) with the 61.5's and it works fine but unable to add the 148 using the sw21's....same symptoms as before.
I use the Dish 500, and the 148 for Dallas locals. Added the 61.5 to get the Voom HD. All function OK separately and through the sw64 but unable to cascade through the sw21's. I 6 different sw21's and I have tried them all. Could it be a problem with the sw64 or the 921???


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## David K (Nov 27, 2004)

OK, their out side installing my 61.5 dish now, about the warning of the channels moving to the 148, I asked the tech if he would put the dish in a position that it could be re-aimed to the 148 if this happens, he said that I could not get the 148 from here. So I called csr and asked what would happen to those of us who can't get the 148 if the channels are moved. Granted csr's are a waist of time, but this guy made a very good point, he said that the 148 is primarily a west coast sat and that they would not drop all their east coast costumers JUST to offer west coast only, he said if they move the channels they would have to find a way to move them to offer to both. He said not to sweat it, if they move, they would move to a sat I could re-aim to and get. What is you're guys take on this? BS?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

M492A said:


> Is this true even if it has the yoke at the end of the arm to adapt it to a DP single LNB?


The D500 is a 20" dish, and is DESIGNED to be used with DP equipment......


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

alan s said:


> I use the Dish 500, and the 148 for Dallas locals. Added the 61.5 to get the Voom HD. All function OK separately and through the sw64 but unable to cascade through the sw21's. I 6 different sw21's and I have tried them all. Could it be a problem with the sw64 or the 921???


So, you do need the 148 more than the 61.5. The only other thing I can recommend is to try replacing your wiring 1 at a time and see if it works. It COULD be the 921, but I don't think so. And the legacy switches don't have to be reset like the DPs......weird.


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## M492A (Nov 18, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> The D500 is a 20" dish, and is DESIGNED to be used with DP equipment......


Thank you Larry, but I'm dense in this area and am unsure of your point.

The dish is a Dish 500 with a rectangular arm, and it is a single output DishPro LNB attached to the arm via a Y yoke.

Are you saying this configuration should work or will not work?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

David K said:


> OK, their out side installing my 61.5 dish now, about the warning of the channels moving to the 148


It was NEVER said that they were going to MOVE the channels. It was postulated that they would MIRROR them. If they DID MOVE them, it would be to the 110 more than likely.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

M492A said:


> Are you saying this configuration should work or will not work?


It WILL work.........


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## M492A (Nov 18, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> It WILL work.........


I was hoping you'd say that.  Thanks again!


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## David K (Nov 27, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> It was NEVER said that they were going to MOVE the channels. It was postulated that they would MIRROR them. If they DID MOVE them, it would be to the 110 more than likely.


Thanks, I guess I miss read the original post that installing a dish for the 65.1 could be a waist of time and money. I see now that he was refering to those who have a dish aimed at the 148.


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## topom (Jan 4, 2004)

So long as the dish has the D-shaped arm, any 18 inch dish will do. A dish with the rectangular arm will not work.[/QUOTE]

Thanks Larry!


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## socceteer (Apr 22, 2005)

Larry ...Thanks for the detail information.

I do have a simple question

Do you happen to know which direction and how angle does the dish have to point from the west cost...? for the 61.5


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## dcad (Sep 12, 2002)

Anyone know why my 921 won't hold the SW21 4-sat config through a reboot? I've got 119, 110, and 105(KU) working fine through a SW64, and have added 61.5 using sw21's. It works great until I have to reboot, then, if rebooted while the sw21 is tuned to the 61.5 sattelite, it loses all the sats. If it reboots while tuned to the sw64 side of the sw21, it will come back up with only seeing the 3 sats connected to the sw64. It works perfect after a switch test but with the need to reboot at least once a day due to lockups and other bugs, this is not ideal. Especially if they are still forcing a reboot overnight, as this morning it was locked up on black screen.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

For Morgan Hill zip code 95037 the Azimuth is 93 and the elevation is 15. 

..Doyle


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

Larry, How about a couple quick comments about the extra steps using a DP Twin? I assumed it was just a matter of adjusting the azimuth but am gathering that there is more to it than that based on your comments. There aren't alot of DP Duals on ebay. Just mostly Twins.

..Doyle


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## SummitAdvantageRetailer (Feb 20, 2005)

Hi guys. Will the following work?

SuperDISH 105/110/119 or SuperDISH 110/119/121 plus Dish 300/500 with DP Dual LNBF for 61.5 mated together with a DP34 and a DP21.

So, the DP34 switch that takes the 105/110/119 or 110/119/121 from the SuperDISH can be mated with a 61.5 signal by a DP21 switch after the DP34, right? In other words, Port 1 of the DP34's output can be combined with the DP21 switch for the 61.5 to allow 4 satellite tuning without the need for DPP44 switch, right?

We've always thought that 4 satellite signals need a 4xX switch but if this DP34 and DP21 combo can work, that'd be great for our E* customers that want to add V*.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

Summitxxx, That is the way Larry explained it. The output of port 1 on the DP34 goes to one of the inputs on the DP 21 while the other DP21 input is fed with one of the outputs from the DP Dual that is on the 61.5 dish. If a 2nd HD connection is needed you would repeat with another DP21 on the 2nd DP34 port. Output of the DP21 obviously goes to the HD receiver and the other DP34 ports feed the non HD receivers. 

..Doyle


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

DoyleS said:


> Larry, How about a couple quick comments about the extra steps using a DP Twin? I assumed it was just a matter of adjusting the azimuth but am gathering that there is more to it than that based on your comments. There aren't alot of DP Duals on ebay. Just mostly Twins.


I'll start working on a FAQ for that. Give me a day or so.....


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## SummitAdvantageRetailer (Feb 20, 2005)

DoyleS said:


> Summitxxx, That is the way Larry explained it. The output of port 1 on the DP34 goes to one of the inputs on the DP 21 while the other DP21 input is fed with one of the outputs from the DP Dual that is on the 61.5 dish. If a 2nd HD connection is needed you would repeat with another DP21 on the 2nd DP34 port. Output of the DP21 obviously goes to the HD receiver and the other DP34 ports feed the non HD receivers.
> 
> ..Doyle


Thanks for the clarification. If we want all 4 ports on the DP34 to combine with another satellite (like the 61.5), then we need 4 DP21 switches? Of course, I see now why we haven't done this method as the cost of 1 DP34 switch + 4 DP21 switches ~= 1 DPP44 switch. But this is a good compromise to get one or two of the receivers to see 4 signals. Thanks! Do correct me if my conclusions are wrong here.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Please note that if you do a locals dish install, that you HAVE to hook ALL receivers to the 61.5 or you will get a chargeback on a QC.


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## gunawo (Aug 17, 2004)

Is it true that I must use a DPP Separator with a DPP44 in order to make it work on a 921 Receiver???

Jim


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## M492A (Nov 18, 2004)

SLIMJIM said:


> Is it true that I must use a DPP Separator with a DPP44 in order to make it work on a 921 Receiver???
> 
> Jim


The separator allows you to run just one cable from the switch to the 921 and split it there, as opposed to running two cables. The separator requires use of DishPro Plus equipment, such as the DPP44. It won't work with a DP34, for example.

If a picture is worth a thousand words, check this one out: http://www.satelliteone.com/dish/support/dpplus/DISH_Pro_Plus_44_Switch_A.pdf


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## David_Levin (Apr 22, 2002)

SLIMJIM said:


> Is it true that I must use a DPP Separator with a DPP44 in order to make it work on a 921 Receiver???
> 
> Jim


Yes, that does seem to be the case (with the current software). Doesn't seem to like two cable runs from two DPP44 ports.


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## Sailor (Feb 18, 2004)

Wow, just had the Dish Installer out so he could put another dish up to get 61.5 for the $99 special. What an ordeal.

Background: The original install was for two refurbed 301's and a 921 through a DP34, with the dish bolted to my brick chimney. This was not done through Dish directly, but through a retailer. The actual install did a beatufil job of wiring and everything is in one place in my attic with easy access.

So, to get the Voom channels, I called Dish direct who sent out their install team of two guys. I wanted the second dish done the same way as the original install and the guys that showed up said they couldn't bolt the dish to the chimney, that they could only do it to the roof or fascia boards. I told em to go home, called Dish and they credited the $99 to my account and made sure the Voom programming charge was removed.

My question at this point: If I go to my original retailer, and have the original installer do all the work (mounting to the chimney), and pay dish the $99, will they pay the retailer for the full install?


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

David_Levin said:


> Yes, that does seem to be the case (with the current software). Doesn't seem to like two cable runs from two DPP44 ports.


David - where did you get this idea? That's the way I have mine setup at the moment.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Sailor said:


> My question at this point: If I go to my original retailer, and have the original installer do all the work (mounting to the chimney), and pay dish the $99, will they pay the retailer for the full install?


I believe the $99 deal is only through Dish, so if you choose to have your installer come out and do it, you'll end up paying him whatever he charges for the work. Almost certainly much more expensive than $99, though.


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## socceteer (Apr 22, 2005)

DoyleS said:


> For Morgan Hill zip code 95037 the Azimuth is 93 and the elevation is 15.
> 
> ..Doyle


Thank you


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## mkpolley (Dec 8, 2003)

new 61.5 dish installed today,i ordered it may1st,so pretty quick turnaround.
installer got here about 9am,mounting of dish was fine,good signal,but he got his wires,or cables crossed at least 3 times,switched out about 3 switches,finally got it right about 11:30am.
i called dish talked to csr,added the voom channels right away,but could not access them,even though there were white in my guide,switched me to technical support,i was on hold,decided to do a soft re-boot while i waited,all the voom channels work fine now,and look great after the re-boot.
i also asked the csr about if i qualify for cbshd,he said hold on,waited about 5 minutes,told me yes, cbshd out of newyork(no charge).
so all and all went ok,install and dish completely free,one of my locals is on 61.5,i had to add local channels for free dish and install,i will cancel the locals next month.
anyone know,if i cancel my locals,do they cancel cbshd also? thanks


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Yes, if you cancel your locals, you will lose CBS-HD as well.


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

mkpolley said:


> i also asked the csr about if i qualify for cbshd,he said hold on,waited about 5 minutes,told me yes, cbshd out of newyork(no charge).


I wonder why you have no charge. They charge me $1.50/mo for that channel. It is CBS-HD west (L.A.), and I subscribe to San Francsco locals. Anyone know why I get charged and mkpolley doesn't?


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

I don't get charged for mine either, and never have. I think it's a waivers issue.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Sailor said:


> twith the dish bolted to my brick chimney. This was not done through Dish directly, but through a retailer.
> I wanted the second dish done the same way as the original install and the guys that showed up said they couldn't bolt the dish to the chimney, that they could only do it to the roof or fascia boards. I


That's because you are NOT supposed to drill into a chimney, PERIOD! That can cause an air gap that can crack the chimney and it could actually explode. The ONLY acceptable chimney mount is a metal strap mount that goes around it. As for using the attic, it's probably not grounded either.....beautiful job? Maybe. Right? Nope.

Mark - Had an E* supe tell me that V* channels were NOT available to subs who were not previously V* customers this morning. She ened up adding them, but was a pain for me to have to deal with.....Can you provide a link or # to call that will make this easier? I called the 1-800-WOW-HDTV for this one.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

JSanders, 
I have SFO locals + AT180 + HDpack. I called a number of months ago and they added CBSHD at no charge. I would think a phonecall would fix the problem but then again, a CSR will answer the phone and that may be a problem. 

..Doyle


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## keng52 (Oct 18, 2003)

larrystotler said:


> Please note that if you do a locals dish install, that you HAVE to hook ALL receivers to the 61.5 or you will get a chargeback on a QC.


 I have a 61.5 install scheduled for Mon. for locals (really Voom HD, but I get the "if you can't get this channel you qualify for additional dish" on WTBS even though I get It over the air in HD and with the superstation package) Will I have to pay for a new multiswitch? I currently have dish 5oo and a SW42.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

larrystotler said:


> Mark - Had an E* supe tell me that V* channels were NOT available to subs who were not previously V* customers this morning. She ened up adding them, but was a pain for me to have to deal with.....Can you provide a link or # to call that will make this easier? I called the 1-800-WOW-HDTV for this one.


I wish I could, Larry, but I don't have any dealings with the CSR side, except for the advanced tech support team that deals with 921 and 942 issues.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

keng52 said:


> I have a 61.5 install scheduled for Mon. for locals (really Voom HD, but I get the "if you can't get this channel you qualify for additional dish" on WTBS even though I get It over the air in HD and with the superstation package) Will I have to pay for a new multiswitch? I currently have dish 5oo and a SW42.


E* is REQUIRED by the FCC to provide ALL equipment neccessary to get the locals on the wing. They will probably replace the SW42 with an SW64 or possibly a 500Twin and SW21s.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Added instructions for using a DPTwin on a D500 to get the 61.5. Let me know if I missed anything.....kinda worn out right now......I do actually have a job....


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

Thanks Larry, All is clear now. I hadn't realized when you were talking about foil that you were covering the front of the antenna so as not to get false readings until reading these latest instructions. I was trying to figure out why it was necessary to put foil over the F connector on the second position. Doh!!!

I think I'll now snag one of the less expensive Twins on eBay. The few Duals are really getting bid up, compared to the prices a week or more ago. 

..Doyle


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## styxfix (Aug 7, 2002)

alan s said:


> I have replaced the 148 lines to the sw64 (inputs 5&6) with the 61.5's and it works fine but unable to add the 148 using the sw21's....same symptoms as before.
> I use the Dish 500, and the 148 for Dallas locals. Added the 61.5 to get the Voom HD. All function OK separately and through the sw64 but unable to cascade through the sw21's. I 6 different sw21's and I have tried them all. Could it be a problem with the sw64 or the 921???


A couple of other things to check over Alan as I also have the same setup:

- Make sure that your have SUPERDISH has your type of sat dish. I know you don't have a superdish, but in order to increase the number of check switch tests you need to make sure that is your type of Dish and NOT DISH 500. Doing the DISH 500 could damage your SW64 Switch if you have cascaded with SW21 switches.

- Also make sure that both of your SW21 switches are conneted to the SW64 switch using the DISH 2 input on the SW21 and that your 2nd wing sat dish are connected to the DISH 1 input on the SW21 switch.

Even with a sucessful switch test SW 4-SAT, I feel the 921 is very unstable with this setup. My 921 often freezes up when trying to watch PVR events and I think my problems may be switch related since I have had my 921 replaced and I still have many of the same issues.


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## HotRod19579 (Jul 31, 2004)

I have a spare 500 up on the roof that has a legacy LNB. I am not exactly sure what it is (Dual or twin) but one of the LNBs is labeled 110 and the other is labeled 119. They were cabled into a SW21 which used to run to a single receiver. 

I wanted to see if I could get 61.5 so I hooked a receiver up to the SW21 and had the wife watch the point dish screen while I moved the dish. I failed to find 61.5.

After reading Larry's post it sounds like I need to make some changes in my attempts. Do I need to put foil over one of the LNBs and remove the SW21? Or would I be better off to use an old legacy dual lnb that I used to use for my dish300?

When on the point dish screen, what transponder should I use in my attempts to find 61.5? Is it worth making another attempt or should I call dish and pay the $100?

Can you also tell me what transponders I should use for the other satellites, 110, 119 and 148?


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## HotRod19579 (Jul 31, 2004)

It worked! I changed the LNBF to my legacy Dish300 dual, installed on the Dish500 and found 61.5, signal strength 125. Off to the store to purchase new DP LNBF.

Short distance away from getting the Voom channels


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

110 - Trans 11
119 - Trans 11
61.5 - Trans 31
148 - Any


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## Agent X (May 9, 2005)

Howdy! New to the forum here, but just wanted to post that I am officially Voomin!

Two Dish 500's
Twin on one (110/119)
One single Dual LNB on the second (61.5) in the 119 bracket

Took awhile to find a good spot for the 61.5 dish, because of Trees. But now have a signal of 108

Plugged both dishes into a SW21 and I am good to go! 3min MAX on the phone with the Dish CSR.

(My second reciever (301) is using the Dish LNB's on my Starband dish, so I didnt have to fiddle with making two recievers work off the two dish setup.)

Couldnt have done it without all the great info here!


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## cschang (Apr 18, 2005)

I have an installer coming out on Saturday with a new dish to try and get 61.5.......I don't think it looks good for me, but it was worth a shot. If it doesn't work, the $99 gets credited to my account, so nothing lost.


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## cschang (Apr 18, 2005)

FWIW....

During last night's tech forum, I called in to ask about the Voom channels being mirrored on another satellite. The tech that I got said that he knows of no plans to do so, but he was sure they would in the future.


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## JerryR (Jun 17, 2004)

cschang said:


> FWIW....
> 
> During last night's tech forum, I called in to ask about the Voom channels being mirrored on another satellite. The tech that I got said that he knows of no plans to do so, but he was sure they would in the future.


That's the same response I got from a lady in the executive offices at Echostar. However, in something I saw here last week, Charlie lead us to believe that something would likely happen this summer. If I understood it correctly, he was advising installers not to rush out and sell everyone a dish to receive 61.5 because "it will all change soon." Personally, I hope that means 110, 119 or 121 too!


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## spruce (May 10, 2005)

Do I have this right? I have 2 DP500's with twin LNB's. One is in a box and has never been set up. If I install the 2nd DP500 and aim at 61.5 I'll need a DP 34 or 21(which one)...right? Also, I'm only going to continue with HD service so 1 dish at 110/119, another at 61.5 with the DP 34 or 21 and I should get all the HD channels. I'll only be using 1 811. With the service downgrade I can't use the 508. Thanks.


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## IamtheEggman (Sep 21, 2004)

Got a dish to get 61.5, i was installing it today to check and see if I could see it through/over my trees. Found a spot, hooked it up to my 508 just to aim dish and see signal strength. Couldn't find sat until I finally switched transponder to 25, where I got a signal of 125. The only transponder I get signal on are odd numbers, is that normal?? Will that change when I hook it up to my 921?


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## BoisePaul (Apr 26, 2005)

Just wanted to drop in, say hello, and thanks. Installed the 2nd dish and now have 61.5/105/110/119 working on my 811 using a DP34 and DP21. Sure beats shelling out the cash for a DPP44 when you've only got 1 receiver. I will say that it looks like the elevation from "Peak Angles" is off by about 3 degrees when using a D500 dish (LNBF in the 119 position) instead of a D300. I'm sure the azimuth is off by a bit as well, but I didn't bother to see just how much. Took about 30 seconds for the CSR to activate the VOOM channels.


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## DRJDAN (Apr 28, 2002)

What is 105? Does that come along when you add a 61.5 dish? What additional programs are on 105?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

DRJDAN said:


> What is 105? Does that come along when you add a 61.5 dish? What additional programs are on 105?


Look up superdish


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## TNGTony (Mar 23, 2002)

DRJDAN said:


> What is 105? Does that come along when you add a 61.5 dish? What additional programs are on 105?


105 is another satellite location. It's short hand for referring to AMC2 which is 22,300 miles above the equator at 105 degrees west longitude. The same thing goes for all the other magic numbers on Dish: 61.5, 105, 110, 119, 121, 148 and 157.

At 105 you have nothing but local channels from many parts of the country.

What is on each satellite, take a look at the Dish Channel Chart.

See ya
Tony


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## JohnH (Apr 22, 2002)

IamtheEggman said:


> Got a dish to get 61.5, i was installing it today to check and see if I could see it through/over my trees. Found a spot, hooked it up to my 508 just to aim dish and see signal strength. Couldn't find sat until I finally switched transponder to 25, where I got a signal of 125. The only transponder I get signal on are odd numbers, is that normal?? Will that change when I hook it up to my 921?


Sounds like you have a Legacy LNBF in a DISH Pro setup.


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## IamtheEggman (Sep 21, 2004)

JohnH said:


> Sounds like you have a Legacy LNBF in a DISH Pro setup.


 I'm using a Quad Legacy for 110/119 and it works for both my recievers(508,921). I'm using a single(2 f connectors, does that make it a twin?) LNBF that came with my original setup back in 98?? So I believe its a LEgacy. I hooked my 5000 to my 61.5 dish and set it to point dish and got some odd and even transponders but still didn't find 1-4. I think I need to spend some time aiming dish but haven't had that time yet. The kid has 5 little league games this week due to last weekends rain  .


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## JohnH (Apr 22, 2002)

Probably a Dual. Should work okay.

Your 5000 will not see those as they are 8PSK Modulated. Your 921 is the only one which will see 1, 3, 5 and 7 at 61.5.


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## IamtheEggman (Sep 21, 2004)

JohnH said:


> Probably a Dual. Should work okay.
> 
> Your 5000 will not see those as they are 8PSK Modulated. Your 921 is the only one which will see 1, 3, 5 and 7 at 61.5.


Thanks  Hopefully will get a chance to hookup this weekend


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## KKlare (Sep 24, 2004)

BoisePaul said:


> I will say that it looks like the elevation from "Peak Angles" is off by about 3 degrees when using a D500 dish (LNBF in the 119 position) instead of a D300. I'm sure the azimuth is off by a bit as well, but I didn't bother to see just how much. Took about 30 seconds for the CSR to activate the VOOM channels.


My experience was closer to 5 or 6 degrees higher indicated. Again a D500. I plumbed the little stub but cannot check it now without losing the tuning to near full scale. Why is it so much better than my previously optimized 110/119?
I tried 1-800-333-DISH but after saying 2 minutes, it left me with dead air, twice. I next tried 1-800-WOW-HDTV gave me the same place with 2 less presses and a person.
-Ken


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## IamtheEggman (Sep 21, 2004)

I be Voomin'  Never could have done it without you guys  Thanks


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## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

Picked up a gently used SW64 on Ebay this week for $35. I have a legacy quad LNB along with a dual LNB that provides 61.5. I needed two more 61.5 signals for my other 921 in the master bedroom and the SW64 seemed to be the easiest/cheapest route. Installation was quick and easy in my attic. The hardest problem was finding out which feed coming off the legacy quad went where on the SW64 since the wires go out of the attic to the Dish 500. Did the math and there were 5 possible combination of the 4 cables being hooked up. Got it on the 5th try of course! 

This is SwEeT!


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

IF you actually have a legacy Quad, then it shouldn't matter how it is connected to the SW64, so long as you use 2 wires to each input. Personally, I would get 2 more duals and remove the quad and sell it.


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## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

I didn't think it should/would matter (I thought both 119/110 were combined and output together on a single line) but it somehow did/does. I called dish before buying the SW64 to make sure it would work and was told yes it will work but you have to put the 119 signals on the 1A/B SAT inputs, the 110 signals on 2A/B SAT inputs and then the 61.5 signals on the 3A/B inputs of the SW64. Like I said, I had to try all 5 combinations and run a check switch test each time. On each test 61.5 was OK but either 110 or both 110/119 would not show up OK except with the one (last) combination. I do have a legacy quad, (says it right on the LNB) that was purchased new from Dishdepot several years ago.



larrystotler said:


> IF you actually have a legacy Quad, then it shouldn't matter how it is connected to the SW64, so long as you use 2 wires to each input. Personally, I would get 2 more duals and remove the quad and sell it.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

ibglowin said:


> I didn't think it should/would matter (I thought both 119/110 were combined and output together on a single line) but it somehow did/does. I called dish before buying the SW64 to make sure it would work and was told yes it will work but you have to put the 119 signals on the 1A/B SAT inputs, the 110 signals on 2A/B SAT inputs and then the 61.5 signals on the 3A/B inputs of the SW64. Like I said, I had to try all 5 combinations and run a check switch test each time. On each test 61.5 was OK but either 110 or both 110/119 would show not show up OK except with the one (last) combination. I do have a legacy quad, (says it right on the LNB) that was purchased new from Dishdepot several years ago.


The SW64 is supposed to line-locked the legacy quad and it still shouldn't matter. But I would go ahead and look for 2 duals are sell the quad IMHO.....at least it works. Later


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## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

What reason would you sell the quad for?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

ibglowin said:


> What reason would you sell the quad for?


To pay for the SW64. It's kinda redundent to have the Quad running into the SW64, since you are no longer using the features on the Quad. You can probably get out of it what you paid for the SW64 if not more.


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## cschang (Apr 18, 2005)

cschang said:


> I have an installer coming out on Saturday with a new dish to try and get 61.5.......I don't think it looks good for me, but it was worth a shot. If it doesn't work, the $99 gets credited to my account, so nothing lost.


Oh well...installer came out this morning. No clean shot at 61.5. I hope the Voom HD channels get mirrored somewhere in the near future.


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## khearrean (Mar 24, 2004)

I just discovered something that I thought was interesting...Yesterday I had the 2nd dish for Voom added and then activated. Although everything looks great, I found something to be strange. Before the Voom activation, I could not get the Dish HD demo channel (94XX). But since the 2nd dish (61.5) was added yesterday, I now get it. Does this make any sense?

Ken


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## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

Well since the Dish HD Demo channel is only on 61.5.......

Makes perfect sense!



khearrean said:


> I just discovered something that I thought was interesting...Yesterday I had the 2nd dish for Voom added and then activated. Although everything looks great, I found something to be strange. Before the Voom activation, I could not get the Dish HD demo channel (94XX). But since the 2nd dish (61.5) was added yesterday, I now get it. Does this make any sense?
> 
> Ken


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Yeah...as the demo channel is from the 61.5 satellite...


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## DRJDAN (Apr 28, 2002)

khearrean,

I had the same situation. I think it is because 9443 (the Dish HD demo channel) is on 61.5.


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## Hypno toad (Jan 19, 2005)

well here goes my scenario- I have an 811 and 501 feed by dish 500 (twin duel?  ) it has two lnb's with two outputs each they (all four) go to sw21's and the two outputs go to my 811 & 501 what type of lnb is this called? legecy twin? also what will I need to get to get 61.5 added.
Thanks (long time lurker :nono2: )


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## boylehome (Jul 16, 2004)

Hypno toad said:


> well here goes my scenario- I have an 811 and 501 feed by dish 500 (twin duel?  ) it has two lnb's with two outputs each they (all four) go to sw21's and the two outputs go to my 811 & 501 what type of lnb is this called? legecy twin? also what will I need to get to get 61.5 added.
> Thanks (long time lurker :nono2: )


It has dual not duel  . Twins have two outputs and one input. If you see, "DP" icons on the LNB's then they are DishPro. Since you have sw21's you got legacy.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

boylehome said:


> It has dual not duel  . Twins have two outputs and one input. If you see, "DP" icons on the LNB's then they are DishPro. Since you have sw21's you got legacy.


DP+ Twins have 2 outputs and 1 input. DP and 500Twins only have 2 outputs.

You have 2 legacy duals feeing into 2 SW21s. If you want to get the 61.5, you will need to get a 500Twin and another dish for the 61.5 and use one of the duals on the 61.5 and run the 500Twin and the 61.5 into the sw21s.


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## Hypno toad (Jan 19, 2005)

larrystotler said:


> DP+ Twins have 2 outputs and 1 input. DP and 500Twins only have 2 outputs.
> 
> You have 2 legacy duals feeing into 2 SW21s. If you want to get the 61.5, you will need to get a 500Twin and another dish for the 61.5 and use one of the duals on the 61.5 and run the 500Twin and the 61.5 into the sw21s.


Thanks Larry - I'm off to ebay


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## alan s (Dec 6, 2004)

I have all legacy equipment with a dish 500 and 61.5 feeding into an SW64 and 2 of the outputs going to a pair of SW21's where I bring in a 148 dish. My 921 receiver sees all 4 sat's and works fine until I shut it off for the night. When I turn it on in the morning and try to tune to a 148 station it is unable to locate the sat. It does this on both tuners. If I rerun "check switch" everything returns to normal until I power off again. I assume that it has something to do with the nightly automatic reboot. I have replaced the sw21's with no change.
Any suggestions (other than not letting it reboot)?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Unfortunately, this seems to be a problem with the 721 & the 921 when using a legacy 4 sat setup. Make sure that you have the superdish option selected in the signal strength screen. Other than changing out to DP+, there's probably not a lot you can do.


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## wysocki (Mar 11, 2003)

I've read all 184 posts of this thread and, in my bleary eyed state, I may have missed the answer to this, so forgive me. Anyway, I have a Dish 942 w/separator getting signal from one of the outputs of a DP+ Twin. I get 110/119 just fine. 

I used to have Voom on another dish at 61.5 so I replaced it with a D500 with a DP Dual. This Dual runs to the line-in of the Twin. I did a check switch and port 1&2 show the Twin but port 3 shows N.C. Do I need some other part in this circuit?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

wysocki said:


> I've read all 184 posts of this thread and, in my bleary eyed state, I may have missed the answer to this, so forgive me. Do I need some other part in this circuit?


Sounds like you don't have any signal on the 61.5. Try connecting it directly to see if you have a signal on the 61.5.


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## wysocki (Mar 11, 2003)

I took the Dual off of the D500 and connected it directly to the separator. A check switch showed N.C. on port 1. Does this mean the Dual is dead?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

wysocki said:


> I took the Dual off of the D500 and connected it directly to the separator. A check switch showed N.C. on port 1. Does this mean the Dual is dead?


Did it say it had a DP Dual connected? If it did, then your dish is out of alignment. If it showed no switch, then it is either bad or a legacy.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

Ok, finally got around to getting the 61.5 dish up and aligned. It has a DPTwin on it and I covered the 119 with foil. The dish aligned fine and I am getting signals ranging from 80 to 105 here in Northern Californial. So, I then connected the output of Set 1 from my DP34 to the first input of a DP21. I took the output of the 61.5 Twin and put it into input 2 of the DP21. Output of the DP21 goes to the input of my 6000. When I do a check switch it comes back with a warning indicating it can only see the 110 and the 61.5 sats. Without the DP21 it sees the DP34 along with 110,119 and 148. I have rerun the check switch test 5 times but it still does not see 119 or 148. The 6000 is also calling the DP21 an SW21 and there is no mention of a DP34. The DP21 is definitely a DP21 (3 times the size and potted of the old SW21). Any suggestions? And here I figured I would have this nailed. 

One other thought. Do I need to have SuperDish selected? In the peak angles screen I have Dish 500 selected. I did try SuperDish once with no change as I saw an earlier post indicating you should use SuperDish but that was with SW21 and SW64 not DP switches. 

...Doyle


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

OK, I finally got it. Might need to add a little more instruction to the first post. When using a 3 sat DP34 (110,119,148) with a DP21(61.5) you need to do a switch check as a SuperDish with 4 Sat checked. The first time it missed the odd section on the 119 but when I tried it again, it got them all. So, now I can call the CSR and get the Voom channels added. Thanks again Larry for all the notes. 

..Doyle


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

DoyleS - you're better off using the 119 (default) "eye" when using the Twin as a Single/Dual.

Keep this in mind if you have any problems down the road.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

And that may have also contributed to his problem. Of course, since he didn't say which receiver he was using....

As for the 6000, it will see all DP setups as an equivalent legacy switch. DP34 =SW64 - DP34/DP21=SW21-4Sat


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

OK, let me ask a question regarding the default eye. Although I am able to receive all of the stations, I do see one strange thing. If I use the guide, I can select any channel and it works fine. If I use the up and down arrow to change channels, now and then when it hits a 110 channel it says it is not there and goes to acquiring satellite. If I go to the guide I can always access the station. Could this be related to the default eye being 119? When the message comes up I am assuming it is referring to the real 110 sat. I think I need to look at a channel/ transponder/Sat reference list to see which stations and which sat is having this problem. The message always refers to the 110 position and gives the transponder number but I didn't note or check to see if it was really 110 or if it is referring to the twin on 61.5. I am confusing myself in writing this. Should I cover the 110 and realign for the 119 eye? 

..Doyle


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Using the DP Twin on the 61.5 should have nothing to do with the 110 going out. If you are unsure if the current channel is on the 110, when it throws that message up, just hit Menu/6/1/1. That will show you which trans the receiver is trying to lock onto. When using a DP Twin on the 61.5, you should use the 119 LNB because the device defaults to the 119 side. However, it really shouldn't matter. If in doubt, re-align the 61.5 and see if it persists. All this is kinda uncharted waters. E* never intended the DP Twin to only be used for 1 sat location.


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## logray (Apr 8, 2005)

larrystotler said:


> A rectangular arm dish CANNOT be used with a DP LNB without modifications(and it's not worth doing. You CAN add the E* I-bracket, but it will make the arm too long and mess with the signal. However, a measurement is being worked on for thos who are adventurous. WIll post when available.).


Any news on that measurement?


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## logray (Apr 8, 2005)

Anyone have an update if dish will mirror voom channels on 61.5 to 148?


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

logray said:


> Any news on that measurement?


 I think those that have done it as I've suggested a couple of times and just eyeballed it by laying the DP LNB up against the D* or V* one. Don't forget the overlap for the "I" beam. IIRC, it's in the vicinity of 5 inches.

Oh - and don't hold your breath on seeing V* on 148.


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## logray (Apr 8, 2005)

SimpleSimon said:


> I think those that have done it as I've suggested a couple of times and just eyeballed it by laying the DP LNB up against the D* or V* one. Don't forget the overlap for the "I" beam. IIRC, it's in the vicinity of 5 inches.
> 
> Oh - and don't hold your breath on seeing V* on 148.


Thanks. I figured it out. I actually ended up using my 20" dish 500 with the i beam off a DP twin and an old legacy dual lnb I had laying around (with a little metal drilled out on the mounting holes so it would fit in the 119 slot). lol . It works perfectly.

But a big bummer that line of sight (14 degrees elev) to 61.5 is directly through a giant hill. I get 0 signal from that bird. 148 however - I could peak it with earplugs and a blindfold up here in Northern California... Too bad there's not much of interest on the 148 bird except for maybe CBS west HD (already have it on OTA) and the pentagon channel (the excitement lasted all of two minutes though). Everything else is international or junk! (


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## satman20003d (Jun 30, 2005)

I currently have a dp34 looking at 119, 110, and 61.5 feeding the following receivers:

811
510
301

I want to replace the 811 with the 921 and move the 811 to replace the 510 and leave the 301 alone. I would return the 510(leased) to Dish.

E* said that I could use a separator on the output of the dp34 and another separator on the inside feeding the receiver instead of running an additional cable. Has anyone tried this setup? My 921 will be here on Friday and I was hoping that I could get by with one cable from the dp34.

Also posted in DVR forum.


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## Jordan420 (Nov 11, 2003)

satman20003d said:


> E* said that I could use a separator on the output of the dp34 and another separator on the inside feeding the receiver instead QUOTE]
> 
> That is incorrect, would need a DPP 44 switch to do this


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## bryan92 (Oct 30, 2003)

Deleted
Thanks Doyle, someone pm'ed my with the answer. You must have been typing as I was deleting. 

The answer was for a superdish, sw34, dish 300 and 921 setup.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

You will need 2 DP21s. One for each tuner on your 921. Both are connected on the after the SP34 with feeds from the DP34 and the 61.5 LNBF. You will need to put a DishPro Dual or DishPro Twin on that 300 dish. 

I also had an old Legacy dish laying around. I picked up 2 DP21s on ebay for about $7 each and a DishPro Twin for $15. 
The other alternative is to get the Dish guy to do it when he comes out. He may be willing to take your 34 and give you a 44. Tips always help. Worst case you are looking at $199 for Dish to come out and do it. Too bad they don't have the $99 deal anymore. I think they may have realized it was costing them a lot of DP44 switches.

..Doyle


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## WhiteForMe (May 30, 2005)

Today I finally got the bug, took larrystotler's advice. Swapped out the DPtwin for the single DP lnbf for 61.5. Not that there was any problems with the twin, just didnt seem right having it up and only using half of it. At least now the dish is pointing in the direction that the compass/point dish screen said


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## H2OSkier (Jan 20, 2004)

Well I thought the changes I had to make were going to be pretty easy, but nothing is ever that easy  My original setup was a Dish 500 with a twin lnb 119/110 and a Dish 300 with a dual 61.5. Two sw21's tied the two together to run a 6000/4900, which worked for years. When I got my 921 I swapped out the twin for two duals. I lost 61.5 but all was well. Now that I want 61.5 I tried swapping out the two sw21's for a sw64. After running a check switch MANY times the 921 never sees the switch. I've doubled checked everything. Using a volt meter to make sure power was getting to the switch on the right port. I've tried a new Microyal sw64 and two used Dish sw64 and always the same thing. I'm out of ideas and sure hope someone will tell me that I just need to do something simple.

Thanks for any help,

Ken


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## jcrandall (Jun 18, 2004)

Wow, I spent two months pondering the whole self-setup thing and finally jumped in. Here is my setup with one question:

I have all DishPro Equipment. A Superdish feeding a DP34. A Dish 500 w/Quad LNB feeding into 3 DP21s, with the DP34 feeding the second input on the DP21.

Everything works great, and I now have the VOOM channels. Just one thing...I can only get 61.5 on TWO of my three receivers. I tried changing cables, etc. It appears the LNB only feeds two of the outputs when it only picks up one satellite.

Is this correct? If so, can I use a 5-2150mhz (sat grade) splitter to feed the third DP21 with the 61.5 signal?

Thanks for any help, and thanks a TON for setting up this thread.


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

Yes, you can use a sat grade splitter to send the same satellite signal to 2 switches. (As always, splitters can _not_ be used downstream from any switch.)


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## jcrandall (Jun 18, 2004)

Thanks for the switch info. So I am right that the quad will only service two lines if only hooked up to one satellite signal?


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

masterdeals said:


> Thanks for the switch info. So I am right that the quad will only service two lines if only hooked up to one satellite signal?


You will probably have problems using a splitter with a DP Quad, even when only using it for 1 location. The best bet would be to get a DP+44 and/or DPDual to get the 61.5. There's no reason I no of why the DPQuad wouldn't feed the 3 tuners other than the fact that I continuously stated that a DPTwin or Quad was NEVER designed to be used like that and you will porbably have problems. Also keep in mind that a Dual Tuner receiver does not LIKE it if you use a splitter with a DP Dual.....It only sees it on 1 tuner in that case.


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## jcrandall (Jun 18, 2004)

So after two days of changing configs and cables, etc, I have everything working with VOOM up and running. For future readers, the following does work:

Superdish connected through DP34, feeding into 3 DP21s. The second sat on the DP21s are connected to the Dish 500 aimed at 61.5. I am using a QUAD (but with one sat only number 2&4 work) (Maybe 1&3 depending on which LNB is actually seeing the sat, I am not sure).

I feed one of the connections from the quad into a 2150mhz splitter (digital grade) and connect two of the DP21s that way. The third is connected directly to the lnb.

Everything is working fine with this setup.

As a side note, when I first setup everything I could tune some channels on 61.5, like the HD Demo channel, but none of the voom channels. They just appeared black. As someone noted previously, the voom channels are on a seperate satellite, an I was just barely catching one and missing the other. If you receive 61.5 channels but not the Voom channels (and have subscribed), try turning the dish VERY slightly.

Good luck, and thanks for the forum.


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## H2OSkier (Jan 20, 2004)

After another round of testing I still don't have a working config that will get me 119/110/61.5. The ONLY config that my 921 will work with is a Dish 500 with 2 duals and 2 sw21. All the signal strengths were mid 90s or higher. I tried my original config which is a Dish 500 with a twin, Dish 300 with a dual and 2 sw21. After a check switch, the 921 would have one port correct but the second port would have 61.5 but no 119/110. I tried 3 different sw64s and the 921 wouldn't see any of them, no switch found. Is there any other testing I can do to trace down my problem ? I went though all the cabling and got rid of crimped ends and used good compression ends. Any hints of what to check next would be appreciated.

Ken


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

H2OSkier said:


> After another round of testing I still don't have a working config that will get me 119/110/61.5. The ONLY config that my 921 will work with is a Dish 500 with 2 duals and 2 sw21. All the signal strengths were mid 90s or higher. I tried my original config which is a Dish 500 with a twin, Dish 300 with a dual and 2 sw21. After a check switch, the 921 would have one port correct but the second port would have 61.5 but no 119/110. I tried 3 different sw64s and the 921 wouldn't see any of them, no switch found. Is there any other testing I can do to trace down my problem ? I went though all the cabling and got rid of crimped ends and used good compression ends. Any hints of what to check next would be appreciated.
> 
> Ken


Sounds like you are having problems. Do you have access to another receiver to test the configs with? It may be a problem with the 921. Also, did you check to verify that the Twin is working properly? Try hooking it directly to the 921 without the SW21s to make sure it works properly.


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## H2OSkier (Jan 20, 2004)

If I pick up a couple barrel connectors I can test the twin alone. I have a 6000 but it's not currently active, but I'm thinking I should be able to at least run a check switch.

Thanks for the additional ideas, I've been looking at this too long.

Ken


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Couple of comments.

To H2OSkier: Have you tried a full switch matrix reset?
Disconnect ALL sat feeds
Run check switch
power cord reboot
run check switch AGAIN
reconnect feeds
run check switch (hopefully) for last time

Regarding using the Quad: Larry's right - it's NOT designed for that. Ports 1 & 3 will be locked to one eye, Ports 2 & 4 to the other. A DP Splitter should work fine - when used to drive a switch.


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## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

Which transponder should I use to aim at 61.5 with a 301? Thanks.


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## JohnH (Apr 22, 2002)

peano said:


> Which transponder should I use to aim at 61.5 with a 301? Thanks.


32


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## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

32 didn't work. I checked Lyngsat and it says 32 is for Skyangel.

I tried TP 8 and it worked great.


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## JohnH (Apr 22, 2002)

If 32 does not work, you are likely not getting 61.5 or something is malfunctioning.


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## Smegal (Nov 15, 2004)

I currently have DPP44 connected with SuperDish121 and 148 side dish for locals on West Coast. Running two 721s with separators and a 508. I want to upgrade the 508 to 921. With this configuration, how could I add another side dish for 61.5 to get Voom? I know this would give me five dishes but do not want to loose any of the programming I currently have to add Voom.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Smegal said:


> I currently have DPP44 connected with SuperDish121 and 148 side dish for locals on West Coast. Running two 721s with separators and a 508. I want to upgrade the 508 to 921. With this configuration, how could I add another side dish for 61.5 to get Voom? I know this would give me five dishes but do not want to loose any of the programming I currently have to add Voom.


You can do this, however, you will not be able to use the seperators on the 921. You will need a D300 with a DPDual and 2 DP21s. Run the DP+44 lines 3&4 into the DP21s with the DPDuals into port 2. Your check switch will then show a 5 sat config. Keep in mind that this may not be the most stable setup and you may have to recheck it some times. Put the 2 721s on Ports 1&2(You CANNOT use port 1 with the DP21s.). Good luck.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

Stable seems to be the operative word. I have a DP34 with 110,119,148 connected and to add Voom I put on the DP21 as described above. The 6000 does a Superdish check for 4 sats and after several tries it finds everything. Sometimes when I go to change the channel on the Voom stations, it comes back with an error message indicating that there is no signal. Alternating between the select button and Guide sometimes brings it back but I have had to go all the way back to Check Switch and usually it doesn't find the 61.5 sat. After a number of tries it shows back up. Not sure whether this is just related to the setup with the DP21 , the 6000 or the fact that I am using a DPTwin on the 61.5 dish (default 119 position). Any thoughts Larry? Would a DP44 tend to be more stable or could the Twin be causing a problem?

..Doyle


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## Smegal (Nov 15, 2004)

Thank you for the info. I will see how stable.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

DoyleS said:


> Any thoughts Larry? Would a DP44 tend to be more stable or could the Twin be causing a problem?


The biggest problem when it comes to the 6000 could be that you are using the DP Adapter with the DP34/DP21. It should come up in the check switch screen as an SW21-4sat. It's probably a software issue. The DP+44 may help, but I would ask around and see if anyone else is having the same problem. Maybe start a new thread. What sat is the 3rd one you are using on the DP34? If it is the 148, that may also be a problem, since they had some issues with using both sats. Also, have you tried rebooting the switches? Unhook all the receivers from the switch and let it power off for a few minutes. Start with the 6000 after rebooting it and then run the check switch. The more complicated that they have made this stuff, the more problems they have had. Good Luck.


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## jla376 (Oct 14, 2004)

I am having a hard time finding a signal from 61.5. Here's what equipment I have installed:

18" dish w/d-arm(installed and plumed)
dp lnb(removed from a superdish)
dp21 between dp34 and receiver

Check switch shows: comm
x
dual

Does it matter which connection i use on the lnb?

It has been quite awhile since I used an 18" dish, does the elevation mark align with the left or right side of the washer?

Any help appreciated.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

When trying to align your dish, always run it directly into a receiver. Also, when trying to troubleshoot after verifying signal, always try checking stuff 1 thing at a time, and also try rebooting your switches by removing all power and starting with 1 receiver at a time by doing checkswitches.


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## kb7oeb (Jun 16, 2004)

I have a couple old 18" directv dishes, can I use the I bracket to fit a dishpro lnb onto a rectangle armed rca directv dish?


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

No - not without cutting the arm to the proper length so that the "eye" remains at the focal point.

It's probably easier to just cut open the end of the D* arm into something you can mangle into holding the E* LNB.


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