# DBSTalk Exclusive First Look: HR24-500 DVR (and H24-100 Receiver)



## Stuart Sweet

In May 2004, the DIRECTV HR10-250 was the height of technology. DBSTalk was there.

In August 2006, the DIRECTV HR20-700 took TV watching to a new level. DBSTalk was there.

In November 2008, the top dog of DVRs was DIRECTV's HR23-700. DBSTalk was there. 

 Are you ready to take the next step? *DBSTalk is already there.* Read on...


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## Stuart Sweet

You've already met the H24-100. Now it's time to meet its bigger brother, the HR24-500 HD DVR.









_Photo Credit: Greg Alsobrook_


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## Stuart Sweet

Take a look... the 24 Series are the receivers you've been waiting for.
_HD Version available at Youtube (click here)_


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## Stuart Sweet

But that's not enough... you want to know more. You want a first look. *DBSTalk is there*.


24 Series First Look

_(To make comparisons easier, I've consolidated the content from the H24-100 first look into this document.)_

You must use Adobe Reader 9 to view this PDF. Other PDF readers, including earlier versions of Acrobat or Adobe Reader, may not work. 

Please note that some DBSTalk.com testers and staff members may have received free equipment from DIRECTV or its partners for the purpose of evaluation and testing.


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## Stuart Sweet

I'd like to take a minute to thank some folks for all their help. 

Chris Blount, Doug Brott, Tom Robertson, Michael D'Angelo, Greg Alsobrook and Donnie Byrd, my friends and colleagues, who run a great forum.

Jason Nipp, James Long, Kent Taylor, Ron Barry, Allen Noland, Rob Glasser and Stewart Vernon, who don't even have DIRECTV service and help out immensely on the DIRECTV side anyway. Great guys.

Greg Alsobrook and Canis Lupus who did a fabulous job on the video. 

All the CE testers and their counterparts at DIRECTV, who were tireless in getting this great product out there. 

...and...

Earl Bonovich because... well... if you have to ask why, then you haven't been here very long.


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## Doug Brott

And with that... commence discussion!


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## Sixto

*Comparison: HR24 vs HR23​*
|
|
*External​*
|
Case - Color/Material|Black Plastic on Top & Sides, Clear Plastic on Front
Case - Buttons|All buttons are touch sensitive, Different then HR23
Case - Front Lighting|Power Button illuminates when "on"
|Guide, Menu, Rec, Select (with 4 arrows), Res buttons illuminated with blue circles
|No trickplay animated "blue ring"
Case - 1080p|New separate LED indicator for 1080p
Case - Vents on Sides and Bottom|Same as HR23
Case - Dimensions|2 3/8" High x 15" Wide x 9 5/8" Deep (10" with connectors)
|3" High x 15 1/8" Wide x 12 1/4" Deep (12 5/8" with connectors) for HR23
Case - Weight|6lbs 10oz, HR21-200 is 8lbs 4oz
Input - Power 2-Prong Plug|Same as HR23 
Input - Satellite|Same as HR23
Input - No Over-The-Air (OTA) Input|Same as HR23
Input - Internal RF Remote Antenna|Same as HR23
Output - Composite|1 Composite (V/L/R), HR23 has 2 (V1/L1/R2 & V2/L2/R2)
Output - S-Video|Same as HR23
Output - Component|Same as HR23
Output - HDMI|For 1080p: 1080p24 only, Same as HR23
Output - Digital Audio Coax|Same as HR23
Output - Optical Audio|Same as HR23
Output - USB (Front)|Same as HR23
Output - USB (Back)|Same as HR23
Output - Ethernet|1 Ethernet Port (10/100), HR23 has 2
Output - Phone|Same as HR23
|
*Internal​*
|
CPU/Main Processor|? (? DMIPS - Awaiting Chipset Details), HR23 has BCM7401 (450 DMIPS)
|
Potential HR24 processor information - CX24500 (730+ DMIPS) - Not confirmed

Wideband Tuners|2 Non-Wideband Tuners, SWM or BBC's required for Ka Lo (D10/D11/D12)
|Same as HR20/21/22 - HR23 has 2 Wideband Tuners
500GB Hard Drive|Seagate ST3500312CS Pipeline Hard Drive, Same size as HR23
Performance|"Very fast", More responsive then HR23
Coax Networking|DirecTV MoCA Functionality built-in,
Entropic c.Link Technology
-
Press Release

Power|Energy Star Compliant, 24-25 watts
|HR21-200 with no DECA: 28 watts, with DECA: 33-34 watts
|
*Remote Control​*
|
Remote|RC65RX with UEI QuickSet -
Press Release

Remote Responsiveness|More responsive then HR23
Remote Features|Same as HR23 (along with the addition of QuickSet)
|
*Programming​*
|
Access Card|Same as HR23
|
*Firmware​*
|
Firmware Level|Similar to HR23 (same GUI functionality as HR23)


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## Doug Brott

Keep in mind that I do not know when these will be available .. I'm sure it will be very soon though .. So get ready!

They are not available as of today, so you can't call and ask for one just yet


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## say-what

good work as usual, if I might say so myself


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## matt

2 please! Very nice!


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## Hutchinshouse

Nice! The unit looks solid. I want one. 

Great job dudes!


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## j2fast

Great work by all those involved! All this new hardware and tech is killing me because I want to centralize all my a/v equipment. I can't decide whether to grab some of these babies when they hit or hold out for the eventual release on the HMC.


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## Alan Gordon

Doug Brott said:


> They are not available as of today, so you can't call and ask for one just yet


Not that that would do one any good even if they were... 

I've been looking forward to this First Look... and while I enjoyed reading it, I'd really like to see a video actually showing the speed of the unit.

Also... does the ring still rotate when RWing or FFing?

~Alan


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## dirtyblueshirt

I. Want.

That being said, I'm a tad disappointed about the loss of the second ethernet pass through... it was a nice touch and came in handy.


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## slapshot1959

Very nice!

Keep this up and we won't have any need/want/desire/use for a Directv Tivo.


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## Alebob911

Great First Look!


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## chevyguy559

Very nice write up guys! I bet its fun to be able to test this stuff!


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## JoeTheDragon

Is the power use higher or lower then older boxes?


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## Groundhog45

"Oh boy, this is great."

I'm really looking forward to these becoming available.


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## barryb




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## toofastgtp

I cant wait to get my hands on one. Even it is only in a training room


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## carl6

Awesome first look Stuart. Great job on the part of everyone involved!

Very impressive looking units. While still of the HR2x genre, they appear to be taking DirecTV to a new level.


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## smiddy

I like it, I like it a lot!


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## Mike Bertelson

Great work..as always. 

Lots of good info in there, and I like the speed comparison at the end.

Mike


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## cheesedjdj

very nice as always


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## garyhall

Once available, how can existing HR users get their hands on the 24? Thanks.


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## ffemtreed

Still disappointed with the lack of optical audio. Unfortunately that will probably keep me from trying one of these new units for awhile.

Otherwise it looks good. I am all for the increased speed. Depending on how much speed I just might figure out a way to go buy a new surround sound receiver that has HDMI in it.


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## hdtvfan0001

Nice work on the First Look.

Congrats to Stuart for his continued mastery of the design of these.

Congrats to the test team for doing the hard "behind the scene" work to both field test the units and collect information & numerous photos.

Congrats to DBSTalk for continuing to be the leading source of information on what is happening in the world of satellite and HD TV.


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## Cheesehead Dave

dirtyblueshirt said:


> I. Want.
> 
> That being said, I'm a tad disappointed about the loss of the second ethernet pass through... it was a nice touch and came in handy.


I would have missed it a couple of years ago. Now that I have three boxes under my TV that are ethernet-ready, I added a small Linksys switch to my setup so all three are wired up individually.


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## Cheesehead Dave

garyhall said:


> Once available, how can existing HR users get their hands on the 24? Thanks.


I also have this question. I've only been a Directv customer for a couple years now. What is their equipment upgrade policy? Are you stuck with what you've been issued until it croaks, or do you have the option to upgrade periodically?


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## LameLefty

Looks great, Stuart! Thanks for all your hard work. :goodjob:


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## dmurphy

Great job guys!! Looks like a really nice unit, and the speed will be most welcome!

Two interesting 'observations' if you will ...

#1 - it looks like the hard disk is enclosed in some sort of shroud. I'm assuming that's for cooling? A dedicated fan for the hard disk maybe?

#2 - Back to "only" 1 Ethernet jack... that's somewhat disappointing. I know it's DECA-enabled, but the 2nd Ethernet jack was a really awesome feature -- lets you do neat stuff like hook up a blu-ray player to the home LAN when there's only one Ethernet run to the TV area.

Great first look, and I'm loving the appearance of the new boxes! I thought the R16 was a great step forward in style and design.... this takes it about 10 steps further.

Great job!


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## say-what

dmurphy said:


> #2 - Back to "only" 1 Ethernet jack... that's somewhat disappointing. I know it's DECA-enabled, but the 2nd Ethernet jack was a really awesome feature -- lets you do neat stuff like hook up a blu-ray player to the home LAN when there's only one Ethernet run to the TV area.


An inexpensive ethernet switch works wonders and provides a lot more than 1 extra connection.


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## LameLefty

say-what said:


> An inexpensive ethernet switch works wonders and provides a lot more than 1 extra connection.


And doesn't take up any system resources, as does the second jack in current HR2x boxes. I think I spent about $15 for the switch I'm using in my living room for 2 HR2x boxes, the PS3 and the XBox 360.


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## dmurphy

LameLefty said:


> And doesn't take up any system resources, as does the second jack in current HR2x boxes. I think I spent about $15 for the switch I'm using in my living room for 2 HR2x boxes, the PS3 and the XBox 360.


Fair enough - simple 10/100 switches are dirt cheap. Heck, even gig switches are cheap now (I've got my eye on the HP ProCurve 1400-8G switch that's running about $70 now.... rather spend a few extra $$$ for the quality of the ProCurve switch.)

Adding a switch isn't a problem, but that requires more clutter and another wall wart. What I like about the 2nd jack solution is that it's pretty elegant, from a cabling perspective. Make a short patch cable (no less than about 2 feet though - gotta watch for reflections) and you're all set.

Not a big loss, but worked well for me


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## gonzlobo

You don't understand ethernet if you think 'reflections' are an issue with switches.


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## davemayo

My main HR20-100 is starting to freeze up or spontaneously reboot more and more often, which I assume means it is going to die soon. I use an eSATA drive. If I replace my HR20-100 with an HR24-500, I assume that none of my eSATA recordings will play on the new unit. Correct?


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## chachster

Might be time to upgrade the HR10-250 with a nice shiny HR24-500... I like the increased speed and storage of this model. Great work on the first look!


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## dmurphy

gonzlobo said:


> You don't understand ethernet if you think 'reflections' are an issue with switches.


You're right, in a switched environment, reflections aren't really relative (No collisions to detect.) HOWEVER, I would consider it a best practice to not cut any cable less than 2 feet in length. You never know where a patch cable is going to end up.

Keep in mind also that I was talking about the 2nd port on the HR-series receivers, which I believe are *not* fully switched. I don't know the internals of the HR, so I wouldn't trust it.

Besides all of that - cutting anything really short is a PITA


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## Blurayfan

ffemtreed said:


> Still disappointed with the lack of optical audio. Unfortunately that will probably keep me from trying one of these new units for awhile.
> 
> Otherwise it looks good. I am all for the increased speed. Depending on how much speed I just might figure out a way to go buy a new surround sound receiver that has HDMI in it.


The first look pictures show optical audio for the HR24 below the coax audio out to the right of the component video. However optical does seem to be missing from the H24.


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## webby_s

Alan Gordon said:


> Also... does the ring still rotate when RWing or FFing?
> 
> ~Alan


Quick answer, no.

Did you want it to?


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## dave29

Looks great Stuart!


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## webby_s

DVDKingdom said:


> The first look pictures show optical audio for the HR24 below the coax audio out to the right of the component video. However optical does seem to be missing from the H24.


You are correct!


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## johnp37

Excellent job as usual, gentlemen. Re: the claim at First Look: "Makes Superman look slow". Wow, that is really optimistic. Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned, the jury is still out on that till I get my hands on one and crank it up.


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## utbronco

Great Job Folks!! The Video is great, the First Look Document is terrific!!

Does anyone know if the 50 series recording limit has been increased to match the great 500 gig hard drive? I'm sick of using key work recording in order to get about 75 shows set up on my HR21. I know, I know, I should do more with my life than trying to watch 75 TV Shows. Any info would be great, it would mean either just buying one HR24 or two.


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## dave29

johnp37 said:


> Excellent job as usual, gentlemen. Re: the claim at First Look: "Makes Superman look slow". Wow, that is really optimistic. Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned, the jury is still out on that till I get my hands on one and crank it up.


The jury won't be out too long. This thing is so fast, it is ridiculous. The timed statistics don't even do it justice.


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## dave29

utbronco said:


> Great Job Folks!! The Video is great, the First Look Document is terrific!!
> 
> Does anyone know if the 50 series recording limit has been increased to match the great 500 gig hard drive? I'm sick of using key work recording in order to get about 75 shows set up on my HR21. I know, I know, I should do more with my life than trying to watch 75 TV Shows. Any info would be great, it would mean either just buying one HR24 or two.


No, it hasn't.


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## Go Beavs

Nice work for all involved, very professional! DIRECTV should use that 1st look as a sales brochure. It looks very, very nice.

Good Job. :allthumbs


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## mhayes70

Great job everyone!! I can't wait to get my hands on a HR24!


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## HDJulie

Great job, guys! When I first started with D* back in 2006, their HDDVR's were $299. Sometime after that they dropped to $199. Do we know yet whether the HR24 will be $199?


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## Mike Bertelson

johnp37 said:


> Excellent job as usual, gentlemen. Re: the claim at First Look: "Makes Superman look slow". Wow, that is really optimistic. Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned, the jury is still out on that till I get my hands on one and crank it up.


According to the last page, it scrolls through 20 pages in the Guide in 7.4 seconds, or .37s/page. A third of a second per page. Sounds pretty quick to me. 

Mik


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## gwar28

When you are a CE tester do you get a 24 now or have to send it back and wait for the release date?


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## wilbur_the_goose

Couple of questions:
1. Does the new remote do RF?
2. I have a 5LNB dish - will that work with the HR24?
3. Will it support my current ESATA drive I'm using on my HR20?
4. Will we be able to install it ourselves (I don't need a tech to install it, and it's MUCH easier for me to just order it, install it, and send my HR20 back)
5. Timeframe?

Thanks for the great info!!


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## RAD

ffemtreed said:


> Still disappointed with the lack of optical audio. Unfortunately that will probably keep me from trying one of these new units for awhile.


The HR24 DOES have an optical/TOSLINK audio output on it, it's the H24 that doesn't.


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## Scott Kocourek

Great job to everyone involved. Thanks for all of the hard work that you all put into these First Looks.

I am looking forward to hooking one of these up in my Living Room as soon as I can get my paws on one.


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## Mike Bertelson

ffemtreed said:


> Still disappointed with the lack of optical audio. Unfortunately that will probably keep me from trying one of these new units for awhile.
> 
> Otherwise it looks good. I am all for the increased speed. Depending on how much speed I just might figure out a way to go buy a new surround sound receiver that has HDMI in it.


The picture on page six show the HR24-500 has optical out. 

Mike


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## LameLefty

wilbur_the_goose said:


> Couple of questions:
> 1. Does the new remote do RF?
> 2. I have a 5LNB dish - will that work with the HR24?
> 3. Will it support my current ESATA drive I'm using on my HR20?
> 4. Will we be able to install it ourselves (I don't need a tech to install it, and it's MUCH easier for me to just order it, install it, and send my HR20 back)
> 5. Timeframe?
> 
> Thanks for the great info!!


1. Yes.
2. Yes. I still have an AT-9.
3. I don't know. Of course, assuming it works, all your recordings will be unplayable on the new box.
4. Unknown.
5. Unknown.


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## ffemtreed

RAD said:


> The HR24 DOES have an optical/TOSLINK audio output on it, it's the H24 that doesn't.


I looked at the pics and didn't see it the first time I glanced. If so I am very happy and can't wait to get one in my hands! Be fair, I just woke up this morning when I looked the PDF.


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## hoyty76

I had an idea when reading about the built in DECA and ethernet. Would it be possible to have the DECA work as a replacement for Wireless / Powerline networking and hook the Ethernet to another Internet enabled device like game console or blu-ray or evan a switch? Something like this:

Internet -> DECA -> HR24 -> Blu-Ray

This way people could essentially have wired ethernet connections all over their house without needing to run ethernet cables or using wireless?

Any ideas if this would be possible? What happens to ethernet port if DECA port is active, disabled or dual or pass through?


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## vahighland

Does the HR24-500 have a true 30 second skip feature?


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## johnid

Cheesehead Dave said:


> I also have this question. I've only been a Directv customer for a couple years now. What is their equipment upgrade policy? Are you stuck with what you've been issued until it croaks, or do you have the option to upgrade periodically?


its all leased equipment so there is no gurantee of make model unless you leased it at best buy/walmart


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## xtc

That sure is alot of marketing in that PDF file for something that's barely any different than what I have now. There are not any new features with the new DVR. Just a new design and faster menus (which should have been this speed to begin with). Am I missing something? What's the big deal?


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## Grentz

Great job guys!



vahighland said:


> Does the HR24-500 have a true 30 second skip feature?


All of the HR2x series do by doing a keyword search for "30SKIP". You can do a search for "30SLIP" to get back to the 30 second slip.


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## Nighthawk68

Nice job to everyone involved with this First Look!! Always so informative.

I am glad to see that the HR24 is wider than the H24, it would look kinda strange in an equipment rack to be so much smaller than the other pieces of equipment.

A couple quick questions... can the blue ring be turned off like on the other HR2x boxes?
and how about the other smaller blue rings as well as the DirecTv logo, are they always on? Or doesn't it distract during viewing?

Ed


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## RAD

xtc said:


> There are not any new features with the new DVR. Just a new design and faster menus (which should have been this speed to begin with). Am I missing something? What's the big deal?


It does have built in DECA adapters. IMHO DirecTV want's all their HR2X's to basically have the same look and feel. IIRC when DirecTV first stated they were taking over STB designs they wanted to have a common look to all of them to ease support issues. So as long as were in the HR2X family I would expect all of them to basically be the same.


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## anleva

For the channel changing time test how was it connected? I assume HR24 to TV via HDMI. Have you done any testing through an AVR, i.e. HR24 to AVR via HDMI and AVR to TV via HDMI. Has that improved? That is how my home theater is connected and where I see excessively slow channel changes. DVR direct to TV via HDMI is faster, but I prefer connecting through AVR.


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## dettxw

Beautiful work as usual.


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## THX

How about OTA capability?

How does one get OTA capability with this unit?


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## LameLefty

THX said:


> How about OTA capability?
> 
> How does one get OTA capability with this unit?


Same as with all the HR2x's since the HR21 - via the external AM21 module.


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## carl6

davemayo said:


> My main HR20-100 is starting to freeze up or spontaneously reboot more and more often, which I assume means it is going to die soon. I use an eSATA drive. If I replace my HR20-100 with an HR24-500, I assume that none of my eSATA recordings will play on the new unit. Correct?


That is correct. Recordings made on one DirecTV DVR (R or HR series) are security coded to that specific DVR. If you move the drive to a different DVR you can see the list of recordings, but you cannot play them.


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## carl6

hoyty76 said:


> I had an idea when reading about the built in DECA and ethernet. Would it be possible to have the DECA work as a replacement for Wireless / Powerline networking and hook the Ethernet to another Internet enabled device like game console or blu-ray or evan a switch? Something like this:
> 
> Internet -> DECA -> HR24 -> Blu-Ray
> 
> This way people could essentially have wired ethernet connections all over their house without needing to run ethernet cables or using wireless?
> 
> Any ideas if this would be possible? What happens to ethernet port if DECA port is active, disabled or dual or pass through?


I don't know, but I suspect that would not be possible. The goal of DECA is to provide an ethernet connection over coax that is (a) easy to install, (b) easy to support, and (c) dedicated to traffic between DirecTV receivers/DVRs for the most part (specifically for support of MRV). Further, as someone else noted (while discussing the lack of the second ethernet port), internal switching takes processor time. I would be very surprised if either the H24 or HR24 has the switching capability built in to make the ethernet jack available for an external device.


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## Doug Brott

wilbur_the_goose said:


> 5. Timeframe?


Very Soon


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## Doug Brott

hoyty76 said:


> Would it be possible to have the DECA work as a replacement for Wireless / Powerline networking and hook the Ethernet to another Internet enabled device like game console or blu-ray or evan a switch?
> ...
> What happens to ethernet port if DECA port is active, disabled or dual or pass through?


You cannot do this. If the Ethernet port is active, the built-in DECA is disabled.


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## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> That sure is alot of marketing in that PDF file for something that's barely any different than what I have now. There are not any new features with the new DVR. Just a new design and faster menus (which should have been this speed to begin with). Am I missing something? What's the big deal?


Huh? We're basically presenting you with some pictures and a few lines of text. I can't help it if Stuart does such an excellent job of making it look nice :grin:

Would you rather we not tell you about it at all?


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## TheRatPatrol

utbronco said:


> Does anyone know if the 50 series recording limit has been increased to match the great 500 gig hard drive?





dave29 said:


> No, it hasn't.


Why, what is their excuse for this? 

Still disappointed you can't use IR and RF at the same time. And still only a 500GB HDD. How about a 750GB or 1TB? 

Otherwise, great job guys. Can we get that video of just how fast it is? :grin:


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## Mike Bertelson

TheRatPatrol said:


> Why, what is their excuse for this?
> 
> Still disappointed you can't use IR and RF at the same time. And still only a 500GB HDD. How about a 750GB or 1TB?
> 
> Otherwise, great job guys. Can we get that video of just how fast it is? :grin:


I don't think any excuse is offered or will be given. 

However, it seems pretty much the same feature set so I'd assume that's why it's still limited to 50.

Mike


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## Doug Brott

anleva said:


> For the channel changing time test how was it connected? I assume HR24 to TV via HDMI. Have you done any testing through an AVR, i.e. HR24 to AVR via HDMI and AVR to TV via HDMI. Has that improved? That is how my home theater is connected and where I see excessively slow channel changes. DVR direct to TV via HDMI is faster, but I prefer connecting through AVR.


As with the earlier H24-100 First Look, I'd caution you about getting into specifics of channel changing speed. The thing you should know is that the unit (on the whole) is VERY fast. The speed literally hits you in the face.

Even the channel change speed is noticeable to the casual observer regardless of the actual numbers. The biggest change is in the menu speeds .. Folks will like this, I guarantee.


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## Doug Brott

TheRatPatrol said:


> Why, what is their excuse for this?
> 
> Still disappointed you can't use IR and RF at the same time. And still only a 500GB HDD. How about a 750GB or 1TB?
> 
> Otherwise, great job guys. Can we get that video of just how fast it is? :grin:


A "speed" video is in the works .. You'll be happy 

As for the 500GB HDD? That is still 100 hours of MPEG-4 video on a two-tuner unit. I gotta believe that this is adequate for most households. Certainly there are folks here that may want more, but I'd see us as the exception more than the rule. Heck, that's even plenty for me. All of my HR2x are stock and I've never added an eSATA or swapped out an internal drive for a bigger one.


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## LameLefty

TheRatPatrol said:


> Why, what is their excuse for this?
> 
> Still disappointed you can't use IR and RF at the same time. And still only a 500GB HDD. How about a 750GB or 1TB?
> 
> Otherwise, great job guys. Can we get that video of just how fast it is? :grin:


To my way of thinking, the "excuse" (to the extent it is an excuse or that one is needed) for both of these is MRV + eSATA if that's still not enough. Since MRV was enabled between DVRs, I have drastically pruned the number of series links per box and have very few duplicates anymore. As a result, I have a lot more EFFECTIVE space across my household. Between my five networked HR2x boxes (one of which has a 1TB eSATA), I have access to almost 3 TB of storage. That's a LOT of HD. :grin:


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## say-what

hoyty76 said:


> I had an idea when reading about the built in DECA and ethernet. Would it be possible to have the DECA work as a replacement for Wireless / Powerline networking and hook the Ethernet to another Internet enabled device like game console or blu-ray or evan a switch? Something like this:
> 
> Internet -> DECA -> HR24 -> Blu-Ray
> 
> This way people could essentially have wired ethernet connections all over their house without needing to run ethernet cables or using wireless?
> 
> Any ideas if this would be possible? What happens to ethernet port if DECA port is active, disabled or dual or pass through?


First, the ethernet port should be disabled when DECA is in use and DECA disabled when ethernet is in use on the H/HR24.


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## bobnielsen

hoyty76 said:


> I had an idea when reading about the built in DECA and ethernet. Would it be possible to have the DECA work as a replacement for Wireless / Powerline networking and hook the Ethernet to another Internet enabled device like game console or blu-ray or evan a switch? Something like this:
> 
> Internet -> DECA -> HR24 -> Blu-Ray
> 
> This way people could essentially have wired ethernet connections all over their house without needing to run ethernet cables or using wireless?
> 
> Any ideas if this would be possible? What happens to ethernet port if DECA port is active, disabled or dual or pass through?


You could do this by having another DECA adapter for the Blu-Ray (or any ethernet device). There might be a slight performance degradation caused by the additional network traffic inside the DECA cloud.


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## digitalfreak

Looks nice, but not worth another 2 year contract.


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## Getteau

LameLefty said:


> To my way of thinking, the "excuse" (to the extent it is an excuse or that one is needed) for both of these is MRV + eSATA if that's still not enough. Since MRV was enabled between DVRs, I have drastically pruned the number of series links per box and have very few duplicates anymore. As a result, I have a lot more EFFECTIVE space across my household. Between my five networked HR2x boxes (one of which has a 1TB eSATA), I have access to almost 3 TB of storage. That's a LOT of HD. :grin:


I'm in the same boat. Before MRV, just about everyone of my HR's was over 90% full and was rolling off programs right and left. Now, most of my DVR's run below 50% and I've been adding new programs right and left. If the HR's had remote scheduling with each other, I'd be in heaven.


----------



## xtc

Doug Brott said:


> Huh? We're basically presenting you with some pictures and a few lines of text. I can't help it if Stuart does such an excellent job of making it look nice :grin:
> 
> Would you rather we not tell you about it at all?


i think it looks nice but you can't make sh!t into Gold. No matter how pretty you make the PDF file look, the bottom line is that the New DVR is not much different than what I have right now. The design may be different, and the speed is something it should have been from day one. There are no new features, so I don't know what DirecTV is spending money on. I would rather have them take the money they spent on the new design and implement it into some cool new features. The box can be puke green for all i care, just give me something new! There are no new features, even the hard drive isn't bigger. I don't even know why they would release a new model if there are hardly any changes other than exterior. There are so many things that could be added like larger hard drives, multi-room viewing, plus all the features that TiVos have. Meanwhile this new model just looks prettier and is finally performing at the speed it should have from the beginning....Pass...

Hopefully, if the New DirecTivo's ever come out, it would actually have features that are really something to talk about, because there certainly isn't anything here with this DVR.


----------



## RAD

xtc said:


> i think it looks nice but you can't make sh!t into Gold. No matter how pretty you make the PDF file look, the bottom line is that the New DVR is not much different than what I have right now. The design may be different, and the speed is something it should have been from day one. There are no new features, so I don't know what DirecTV is spending money on. I would rather have them take the money they spent on the new design and implement it into some cool new features.


So, would you prefer that DirecTV not add any new features to the existing base of HD DVR's and make you purchase a new one every time they added something new? So you have a HR20 and DirecTV comes out with DirecTV on Demand, you need to purchase a HR21 since the HR20 doesn't get it. Now they come out with 1080p support, got to get a new HR22 if you want that feature, the HR20/21 won't get it. How about adding MediaShare, now you need to get a HR23 since the HR20/21/22 won't get it. Sorry, but I prefer the current way of doing things, making some small incremental changes such as a large harddrive or internal DECA vs. making you get an entirely new receiver just to get some new feature. If you want to keep having to buy new boxes to get a new feature you might be happier with Dish then DirecTV.


----------



## vahighland

Grentz said:


> All of the HR2x series do by doing a keyword search for "30SKIP". You can do a search for "30SLIP" to get back to the 30 second slip.


That's great news, I didn't know they added skip capability to their DVRs. I haven't been following DirecTV for a few years, but I remember that when they first launched, they only had the slip option.


----------



## joelkamp

So is this still limited to two tuners?


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> Meanwhile this new model just looks prettier and is finally performing at the speed it should have from the beginning....Pass...
> 
> Hopefully, if the New DirecTivo's ever come out, it would actually have features that are really something to talk about, because there certainly isn't anything here with this DVR.


I wouldn't be shocked if a lot of folks here pass simply because they don't want to recommit (nor spend money on a new receiver). I get that. The addition of DECA is big. It really simplifies the network installation and will be great for new installations. It will be helpful, but less necessary in existing/replacement installations.

Still, this is the first new DVR in over a year .. I definitely don't see the point in NOT talking about it. It's like anything new that comes out .. some folks drool over it while others go meh! You've chosen the latter for the HR24-500. Cool, save yourself some money and don't get one.


----------



## Doug Brott

joelkamp said:


> So is this still limited to two tuners?


The HR24 has 2 tuners and is similar in functionality to the previous HR2x models. It adds DECA and runs much faster. It's a nice receiver.


----------



## Doug Brott

vahighland said:


> That's great news, I didn't know they added skip capability to their DVRs. I haven't been following DirecTV for a few years, but I remember that when they first launched, they only had the slip option.


Yup .. Been around for a long time actually, but it's still slip by default .. You have to enable skip .. similar to what you'd have done on the TiVos.


----------



## anleva

Doug Brott said:


> As with the earlier H24-100 First Look, I'd caution you about getting into specifics of channel changing speed. The thing you should know is that the unit (on the whole) is VERY fast. The speed literally hits you in the face.
> 
> Even the channel change speed is noticeable to the casual observer regardless of the actual numbers. The biggest change is in the menu speeds .. Folks will like this, I guarantee.


Well that is all fine and good, but the extremely slow channel changing speed of today's DVRs via an HDMI connection through an AVR results in "Native On" being unusable to me. And I prefer Native On because of better picture quality in my setup. My hope is the speed improvement through an AVR HDMI chain will allow Native On to be usable again with the HR24.


----------



## dpiq

I wish DirecTV would concentrate on adopting the TiVo Series 4. They desperately need to get rid of the 50 series limit, expand the search features, and layout the guide similar to the TiVo format. (It would also be nice if my newest additions to the To Do list and Series list didn't disappear when DirecTV downloads a software update.) I appreciate DirecTV HD for the beautiful pictures and channel line-up (keep on working on bringing back VS.). But using the DirecTV receivers also makes me appreciate even the old Series 1 TiVo I still have running.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

There are no plans to adopt the TiVo Series 4 for DIRECTV.


----------



## BattleScott

How 'bout some love for the eggheads? What are the chips?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

They're hidden under heat sinks. Let me tell you, it was hard enough to get the photos I did include.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

BattleScott said:


> How 'bout some love for the eggheads? What are the chips?


I kinda think if we knew it would be in the First Look. Personally, I'm thinkin' the indications (posted here somewhere) are it's an NXP chip...it's a theory. :grin:

Mike


----------



## RAD

BattleScott said:


> How 'bout some love for the eggheads? What are the chips?





MicroBeta said:


> I kinda think if we knew it would be in the First Look. Personally, I'm thinkin' the indications (posted here somewhere) are it's an NXP chip...it's a theory. :grin:
> 
> Mike


There is this press release from NXP saying they would have their chips in the HR24, http://www.nxp.com/news/content/file_1671.html


----------



## Mike Bertelson

RAD said:


> There is this press release from NXP saying they would have their chips in the HR24, http://www.nxp.com/news/content/file_1671.html


Cool. Thanks. I'm bettin' that's the chip. I realize it's just a guess, but it makes sense to me. 

Mike


----------



## mikeny

davemayo said:


> My main HR20-100 is starting to freeze up or spontaneously reboot more and more often, which I assume means it is going to die soon. I use an eSATA drive. If I replace my HR20-100 with an HR24-500, I assume that none of my eSATA recordings will play on the new unit. Correct?





LameLefty said:


> 1. Yes.
> 2. Yes. I still have an AT-9.
> 3. I don't know. Of course, assuming it works, all your recordings will be unplayable on the new box.
> 4. Unknown.
> 5. Unknown.





carl6 said:


> That is correct. Recordings made on one DirecTV DVR (R or HR series) are security coded to that specific DVR. If you move the drive to a different DVR you can see the list of recordings, but you cannot play them.


Unless something changed (or it's different coming from an AM21) OTA recordings DO play on a transferred e-SATA drive.


----------



## LameLefty

Whatever chip is in there, it's damned fast.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

mikeny said:


> Unless something changed (or it's different coming from an AM21) OTA recordings DO play on a transferred e-SATA drive.


I've never heard that before. Have your done this?

Mike


----------



## Sixto

The following is expected:


Code:


NXP’s HD DVR chipset for DIRECTV HR24 DVRs incorporates:

    * CX24500 High Definition SoC with DVR support
    * CX24118A advanced modulation digital satellite tuners
    * CX24127 dual-DVB-S2 and QPSK set-top box demodulator
    * CX20548 modem Direct Access Arrangement (DAA)

http://www.digitaltvnews.net/content/?p=12614

But due to the heatsink, unable to confirm.

The HR23 has a BCM7401 (450 DMIPS). The CX24500 is assumed to be 730+ DMIPS.


----------



## allenn

I am using the ethernet pass through, Hr21-100. What is the work-around for the Hr24?

Will the AM21 work with the Hr24?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

The ethernet passthrough was never a supported feature. In fact, it was strongly discouraged. The workaround: an inexpensive switch. 

The AM21 will work.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Sixto said:


> The following is expected:
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> NXP’s HD DVR chipset for DIRECTV HR24 DVRs incorporates:
> 
> * CX24500 High Definition SoC with DVR support
> * CX24118A advanced modulation digital satellite tuners
> * CX24127 dual-DVB-S2 and QPSK set-top box demodulator
> * CX20548 modem Direct Access Arrangement (DAA)
> 
> http://www.digitaltvnews.net/content/?p=12614
> 
> But due to the heatsink, unable to confirm.
> 
> The HR23 has a BCM7401 (450 DMIPS). The CX24500 is assumed to be 730+ DMIPS.


Well, there you have it. External confirmation of the CX24500. Thanks. 

Mike


----------



## Mike Bertelson

allenn said:


> I am using the ethernet pass through, Hr21-100. What is the work-around for the Hr24?
> 
> Will the AM21 work with the Hr24?


The pass-through on the previous HR2x's use system resources to operate.

Also, as posted in the link by Sixto above, it has a different chip set then the previous HR2x's so it likely has a different network controller too.

Mike


----------



## joelkamp

Bummer that it is still only 2 tuners, does the hr24 allow you to access the tuner on connected h24 through the DECA network? There are times when I would like to record two shows and watch a third, would like not to have to buy 2 dvrs.


----------



## LameLefty

Just FYI, and apropos the NXP discussion . . .



> CX2450x
> 
> In February 2010, Trident acquired the set-top box and TV product lines from NXP's BU Home. The product(s) on this page are now a part of Trident Microsystems' product offering for the set-top box market.


http://www.tridentmicro.com/producttree/stb/satellite-stb/cx2450x/


----------



## Mike Bertelson

joelkamp said:


> Bummer that it is still only 2 tuners, does the hr24 allow you to access the tuner on connected h24 through the DECA network? There are times when I would like to record two shows and watch a third, would like not to have to buy 2 dvrs.


You can't access the tuners on another receiver via MRV now. I'm assuming it's not going to change with the 24 Series.

Mike


----------



## mikeny

MicroBeta said:


> I've never heard that before. Have your done this?
> 
> Mike


Yes. My original HR20-700 was replaced by a HR20-100. When I reconnected the e-SATA drive, the sat recordings didn't play but the ones recorded OTA played just fine to my surprise.

I had deleted most of recordings in anticipation of this swap. (I'm not sure why I did that.) There were only a few remaining recordings which had recorded the previous night. In hindsight, I deleted the others for no reason. :eek2:


----------



## Sixto

LameLefty said:


> Just FYI, and apropos the NXP discussion . . .
> 
> http://www.tridentmicro.com/producttree/stb/satellite-stb/cx2450x/


That's been the confusing part the past few weeks while trying to confirm.

Interesting developments.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Alan Gordon said:


> Also... does the ring still rotate when RWing or FFing?





webby_s said:


> Quick answer, no.
> 
> Did you want it to?


Yeah... of course! 



Doug Brott said:


> A "speed" video is in the works .. You'll be happy


Thanks in advance to the folks working on that! 



Stuart Sweet said:


> The ethernet passthrough was never a supported feature. In fact, it was strongly discouraged. The workaround: an inexpensive switch.


While I have a wireless bridge that I could use, I think a lot of people liked the idea that you could use the internet provided via DECA to provide the internet instead of running another cable.

~Alan


----------



## wilbur_the_goose

The only thing I don't like is the inability to just take my HR20's ESATA drive and plug it into an HR24. I have a lot of good shows on there I'd like to take with me to my new HR24.


----------



## xtc

RAD said:


> So, would you prefer that DirecTV not add any new features to the existing base of HD DVR's and make you purchase a new one every time they added something new? So you have a HR20 and DirecTV comes out with DirecTV on Demand, you need to purchase a HR21 since the HR20 doesn't get it. Now they come out with 1080p support, got to get a new HR22 if you want that feature, the HR20/21 won't get it. How about adding MediaShare, now you need to get a HR23 since the HR20/21/22 won't get it. Sorry, but I prefer the current way of doing things, making some small incremental changes such as a large harddrive or internal DECA vs. making you get an entirely new receiver just to get some new feature. If you want to keep having to buy new boxes to get a new feature you might be happier with Dish then DirecTV.


That goes without saying, my point is, i don't see why all these people are getting excited about a dvr that's almost identical in features as the past ones, just looks prettier. I'm just being real here. There's nothing to get excited about this DVR. And I don't get why DirecTV is spending money manufacturing new models that basically do everything the old ones do, just look prettier. They can put the money they used to make these to much better use.


----------



## barryb

I am excited.


----------



## Sparky Scott

Sign me up for one..


----------



## Doug Brott

wilbur_the_goose said:


> The only thing I don't like is the inability to just take my HR20's ESATA drive and plug it into an HR24. I have a lot of good shows on there I'd like to take with me to my new HR24.


maybe one of these days, but definitely not now.


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> That goes without saying, my point is, i don't see why all these people are getting excited about a dvr that's almost identical in features as the past ones, just looks prettier. I'm just being real here. There's nothing to get excited about this DVR. And I don't get why DirecTV is spending money manufacturing new models that basically do everything the old ones do, just look prettier. They can put the money they used to make these to much better use.


DECA .. plain and simple. It is a game changer. The side benefit .. lot's faster. Don't assume that DIRECTV is stopping @ the HR24. That would be a mistake.


----------



## mikeny

xtc said:


> That goes without saying, my point is, i don't see why all these people are getting excited about a dvr that's almost identical in features as the past ones, just looks prettier. I'm just being real here. There's nothing to get excited about this DVR. And I don't get why DirecTV is spending money manufacturing new models that basically do everything the old ones do, just look prettier. They can put the money they used to make these to much better use.


I agree but besides looking prettier, it's reported to be faster and eliminates BBCs and DECA adapters (if SWiM is in place). You could say the same thing about computers. Many will "do the same thing" as your predecessor but faster. Sure, it doesn't seem like a "must have" item (like the HR20s were in order to get the new HD channels in '06-'07) but it's a step forward in DirecTV technology.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

xtc said:


> That goes without saying, my point is, i don't see why all these people are getting excited about a dvr that's almost identical in features as the past ones, just looks prettier. I'm just being real here. There's nothing to get excited about this DVR. And I don't get why DirecTV is spending money manufacturing new models that basically do everything the old ones do, just look prettier. They can put the money they used to make these to much better use.


I have to disagree with you're here. This is not just a prettier version of the HR20.

It has a different chipset, is faster, has DECA for easier MRV configuration, and has a two-way remote so there's no more need to search through IR codes to program the remote to work with your TV...I'm just sayin', it's not your old HR. :grin:

Mike


----------



## xtc

Doug Brott said:


> I wouldn't be shocked if a lot of folks here pass simply because they don't want to recommit (nor spend money on a new receiver). I get that. The addition of DECA is big. It really simplifies the network installation and will be great for new installations. It will be helpful, but less necessary in existing/replacement installations.
> 
> Still, this is the first new DVR in over a year .. I definitely don't see the point in NOT talking about it. It's like anything new that comes out .. some folks drool over it while others go meh! You've chosen the latter for the HR24-500. Cool, save yourself some money and don't get one.


There have been barely any new DVR features since the original HR20. I am just shocked that all these years go by and the only thing DirecTV could come up with is making the box prettier. that's sad. This is what they are doing with their research and development money? I don't mind people drooling over something, but there is nothing here. They need to give us something to drool about, I am guessing that ain't ever happening until TiVo comes back into the DirecTV picture. They are all about revolutionary features, DirecTV hardware isn't. They usually just copy what TiVo did years earlier and do it much worse. Dual Live Tuners is Exhibit A.


----------



## xtc

barryb said:


> I am excited.


why is that?


----------



## Sixto

xtc said:


> why is that?


The HR24 is a joy to use.

Lightning quick.

Simple as that.


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> why is that?


Maybe because this a cool, fast and good-looking unit that is substantially nicer to use than the current lineup.

Sorry you don't agree, but I for one don't agree with one poster popping into a First Look thread and turning it into his personal debate/crusade about how lame the product is (in his opinion).


----------



## xtc

mikeny said:


> I agree but besides looking prettier, it's reported to be faster and eliminates BBCs and DECA adapters. You could say the same thing about computers. Many will "do the same thing" as your predecessor but faster. Sure, it doesn't seem like a "must have" item (like the HR20s were in order to get the new HD channels in '06-'07) but it's a step forward in DirecTV technology.


I don't think it being faster is a feature. If it is indeed faster, that means it is finally running Normally and the old dvrs were buggy and faulty. Cable TV boxes from 30 years ago work faster than DirecTV receivers. And why are a lack of adapters important? who even sees them, they are in the back. you can add ten more adapters to the DVR if you give me one great new feature.


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> I don't think it being faster is a feature. If it is indeed faster, that means it is finally running Normally and the old dvrs were buggy and faulty. Cable TV boxes from 30 years ago work faster than DirecTV receivers. And why are a lack of adapters important? who even sees them, they are in the back. you can add ten more adapters to the DVR if you give me one great new feature.


DECA is your "great new feature."

Single-tuner, non-recording analog cable TV isn't even a comparison. This is getting silly.


----------



## Sixto

xtc said:


> I don't think it being faster is a feature. If it is indeed faster, that means it is finally running Normally and the old dvrs were buggy and faulty. Cable TV boxes from 30 years ago work faster than DirecTV receivers. And why are a lack of adapters important? who even sees them, they are in the back. you can add ten more adapters to the DVR if you give me one great new feature.


Definitions or semantics is unimportant.

The HR24 is a joy to use.

The past doesn't matter, the future (near future) is bright.


----------



## Nicholsen

I think it's a fair point that if the new box is really great (because it's so much faster than the old ones) the old boxes must be not so great (because they are too slow). 

If you just wanted 45 "great job" posts, we could set up a bot. Personally, I think that would be pretty boring.


----------



## xtc

MicroBeta said:


> I have to disagree with you're here. This is not just a prettier version of the HR20.
> 
> It has a different chipset, is faster, has DECA for easier MRV configuration, and has a two-way remote so there's no more need to search through IR codes to program the remote to work with your TV...I'm just sayin', it's not your old HR. :grin:
> 
> Mike


The remote thing is funny. You set up your remote once, and then it's set, it's not like a feature that you will use regularly. Again, give me the old remote code thing that i would have to do one time and if you could give me a new feature that i could use regularly.


----------



## Beerstalker

xtc said:


> There have been barely any new DVR features since the original HR20. I am just shocked that all these years go by and the only thing DirecTV could come up with is making the box prettier. that's sad. This is what they are doing with their research and development money? I don't mind people drooling over something, but there is nothing here. They need to give us something to drool about, I am guessing that ain't ever happening until TiVo comes back into the DirecTV picture. They are all about revolutionary features, DirecTV hardware isn't. They usually just copy what TiVo did years earlier and do it much worse. Dual Live Tuners is Exhibit A.


Have you not read abotu DECA, SWM, and MRV? This new DVR makes those setups very, very easy for the installer and the customer. With the new HR24 and H24 the installer just has to do a regular SWM install and all of the receivers will automatically be setup for MRV. The customer can then call D* and turn MRV on and off over the phone, maybe even on the website. They won't have to send a tech out to install DECA adapters at every receiver, customers won't have to rewire their house with multiple RG6 and CAT5/6 wires, etc.

It also makes hooking everything up to the internet very easy as all they will need to do is hook up one DECA adaper to the RG6 wiring and into your networks router.

For exising customers who already have SWM setups, and their homes networked with cat 5/6 then yes these new receivers won't be a big upgrade for them except for the speed. I believe this generation of receivers is mainly meant to streamline the install process and lower costs.

One thing I really like here though is the fact that these boxes still have network ports on them. To me this is a good indication that D* is not going to make MRV/networking only work over DECA, otherwise they could have dropped the ports and saved some more money.


----------



## Scott Kocourek

It's like a new cell phone, computer or even a car for that matter. It's new, reportedly faster, a few new features included, new look.... What is there to complain about? If it is not something you are into why give more than a brief thought to it.

I for one am looking to get another HDDVR soon and am excited to see there is something faster, this means my daughter will get a HR22 and Mom and Dad will get a 24. 

Some of the people here were able to test these and report back to us before anyone else even gets to see them, that's pretty cool too. Remember it's all voluntary and there is no sense in putting down something they all took part in.


----------



## xtc

Sixto said:


> The HR24 is a joy to use.
> 
> Lightning quick.
> 
> Simple as that.


Don't you think the previous DVRs should have been this speed? They are so slow and buggy that it's ridiculous. They should have been this speed from the beginning.


----------



## RAD

mikeny said:


> I agree but besides looking prettier, it's reported to be faster and eliminates BBCs and DECA adapters.


It does not eliminate BBC's, if you aren't on a SWiM then you still need them.


----------



## Sixto

xtc said:


> Don't you think the previous DVRs should have been this speed? They are so slow and buggy that it's ridiculous. They should have been this speed from the beginning.


You're entitled to your opinion about the past.

The HR24 is a joy to use, and available soon.

And also easy setup for Coax Networking.


----------



## veryoldschool

Beerstalker said:


> One thing I really like here though is the fact that these boxes still have network ports on them. To me this is a good indication that D* is not going to make MRV/networking only work over DECA, otherwise they could have dropped the ports and saved some more money.


I'm not sure I'd read too much into this.
All receivers need to be backwards compatible, so this may be like the need for BBCs for non SWiM systems and only be there for On Demand and customers not wanting to go "full DECA" for MRV. :shrug:


----------



## Mike Bertelson

xtc said:


> The remote thing is funny. You set up your remote once, and then it's set, it's not like a feature that you will use regularly. Again, give me the old remote code thing that i would have to do one time and if you could give me a new feature that i could use regularly.


When it's first installed and you spend two minutes setting up the remote for the TV and A/V receiver, some people would think that's pretty neat.

IMHO, DirecTV will have consistant features throghout the HD DVR+ line. That means as new features are added, they'll all get it at some point. From that perspective I guess you'll will never see a new DVR that's completely different with all new bells and whistles...sorry. :shrug:

Mike


----------



## Sparky Scott

Does anybody know if picture quality or sound will be noticabilty different or better?


----------



## RAD

xtc said:


> Don't you think the previous DVRs should have been this speed? They are so slow and buggy that it's ridiculous. They should have been this speed from the beginning.


XTC, I agree with you on the speed issue, I wish the HR21/22/23's had the same chipsets in them as the HR20's since IMHO the HR20 is fast enough.

But I disagree with you comment in a prior post about no new features being added since the HR20's. Go back and look at all the features/functions that have been added, everything from MediaShare or boolean searches to Multiroom Viewing.


----------



## xtc

Beerstalker said:


> This new DVR makes those setups very, very easy for the installer


We're supposed to get excited that this DVR makes the installers job easier? LOL! Ok sign me up for one!


----------



## sigma1914

xtc, we get it...you don't care. That's fine...let people enjoy the new stuff.


----------



## mhayes70

xtc said:


> There have been barely any new DVR features since the original HR20. I am just shocked that all these years go by and the only thing DirecTV could come up with is making the box prettier.


There has been a lot of new features since the original HR20. Read up and you will see. Some have already pointed them out to you. Media Share, and MRV are some of the big ones.


----------



## Scott Kocourek

Multi room viewing is a great new feature on the HR series, I am very happy that I did not have to run out an buy new receivers to make a new feature work. I appreciate the fact that Directv makes these receivers better and more reliable all of the time. They have come a very long way.


----------



## xtc

scottandregan said:


> It's new, reportedly faster, a few new features included, new look


Yeah, lots of new features here 



scottandregan said:


> What is there to complain about?


It's not so much a complaint as it is a "That's it???" This is what they came up with for their new model? Since the HR20, There was the HR21, the HR22, The HR23 and Now the HR24. Since the HR20, we lost the Off Air channels capability. And added 250GBs to the internal Hard Drive. That has been the main Hardware difference maker in all these years. If that gets you excited, then you must have pretty low standards.



scottandregan said:


> Some of the people here were able to test these and report back to us before anyone else even gets to see them, that's pretty cool too. Remember it's all voluntary and there is no sense in putting down something they all took part in.


I am not putting down what they did, that's not even what the discussion is about, are you not following??? The discussion is about the DVR itself and the lack of new features, not the Pamphlets they made.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

scottandregan said:


> Multi room viewing is a great new feature on the HR series, I am very happy that I did not have to run out an buy new receivers to make a new feature work. I appreciate the fact that Directv makes these receivers better and more reliable all of the time. They have come a very long way.


Agreed.

As long as you have SWM in place, these become virtually "plug and play" installations.


----------



## Scott Kocourek

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> As long as you have SWM in place, these become virtually "plug and play" installations.


It's pretty cool that these will be out soon and I hope to get one in the next few months. Thanks again for the great first look and this will be my last post here for a while.


----------



## xtc

MicroBeta said:


> When it's first installed and you spend two minutes setting up the remote for the TV and A/V receiver, some people would think that's pretty neat.


OK, that's neat for 2 minutes, and you'll never even think about this again for the lifetime of the receiver.



MicroBeta said:


> I guess you'll will never see a new DVR that's completely different with all new bells and whistles...sorry. :shrug:


That's DirecTV's decision. They CAN make new DVR with all new bells and whistles, but instead, they have chosen not to. Instead they are concentrating on making the boxes look prettier. I guess this is their priority.


----------



## hbkbiggestfan

Very very cool! Can't wait to get one. Will the new HR24-500 w/DECA be compatible with our current HD DVRs that are hardwired for MRV?


----------



## Sixto

When I get a new PC, I enjoy it.

It faster, and better then the old one.

It's not very productive to spend my days complaining about the old one.

Performance is priority #1. The HR24 solved that.

Easy network connectivity was probably priority #2. The HR24 solved that.

Maybe hardware setup (TV/AV) was another priority. The HR24 solved that.

More then 2 tuners? Let's be honest, that's not going into the workhorse box.

Bigger harddrive? Again, 100 hours of HD is probably the target and fine for most. And e-SATA is an easy add-on.

This is an easy discussion.

They enhanced what needed to be enhanced in the hardware.

Simple as that.


----------



## conductor

Does anybody know what the USB is/will be for? Is this the first box HR series box to have it?


----------



## veryoldschool

conductor said:


> Does anybody know what the USB is/will be for? Is this the first box HR series box to have it?


They've all had them and this is how the AM21 connects.


----------



## barryb

xtc said:


> why is that?


I am happy as a gopher in soft dirt that DirecTV is coming forth with new hardware.

Obviously you don't share the same sentiment, and I am really okay with that. It really comes down to two choices: yes, get this, or no, don't.

"Wanting it all" comes with a huge pricetag, and thats not going to work in these trying times xtc. Making something _better_ and _affordable_ at the same time is where it's at.

I will be replacing several older models here at our happy home when these become available.

I have not been a Tivo fan for a considerable amount of years now, so that is not a good comparison for me.

Watching this development makes me very happy because we do watch some TV here, and faster channel changes and guide speeds is something to be excited about. Our house is wired ethernet, but we are are talking about 3 times faster network speeds possible with DECA, sign me up.

Stuart and crew: seriously great job on this first look.


----------



## xtc

Sixto said:


> When I get a new PC, I enjoy it.
> 
> It faster, and better then the old one.
> 
> It's not very productive to spend my days complaining about the old one.
> 
> Performance is priority #1. The HR24 solved that.
> 
> Easy network connectivity was probably priority #2. The HR24 solved that.
> 
> Maybe hardware setup (TV/AV) was another priority. The HR24 solved that.
> 
> More then 2 tuners? Let's be honest, that's not going into the workhorse box.
> 
> Bigger harddrive? Again, 100 hours of HD is probably the target and fine for most. And e-SATA is an easy add-on.
> 
> This is an easy discussion.
> 
> They enhanced what needed to be enhanced in the hardware.
> 
> Simple as that.


Couldn't disagree more.


----------



## Syzygy

xtc said:


> That sure is alot of marketing in that PDF file for something that's barely any different than what I have now. There are not any new features with the new DVR. Just a new design and faster menus (which should have been this speed to begin with). Am I missing something? What's the big deal?





Doug Brott said:


> Huh? We're basically presenting you with some pictures and *a few lines of text.* I can't help it if Stuart does such an excellent job of making it look nice :grin:
> 
> Would you rather we not tell you about it at all?


Those "few lines of text" include some grandiose praise that's a lot more like marketing hyperbole than I'd expect from the average DVR enthusiast.

From the *24 Series First Look* pdf:


> _Functionality is nearly identical to prior boxes with a couple of minor and one major differences... _ †
> 
> _Raw, unmitigated quickness is evident through every single moment using these boxes. The UI responds instantly to nearly any possible command - menus pop up, pages scroll as fast as you can press the button, even a unified Playlist of several terabytes' worth of programming scrolls through like lightning. Direct channel changes with the remote are quick and accurate, and channels change as fast as the HDMI handshake with the attached set will allow._
> 
> _Combine this new form factor and this level of performance with a sizable 500 gigabyte drive that gives an estimated recording capacity of 100 hours of MPEG4 HD material or 400 hours of SD, and you have a fantastic addition to the DIRECTV HD DVR line that will make users very, very happy. - *LameLefty*_
> 
> _*Final words from the test team*_
> _• ... a wonderful addition to the DIRECTV receiver lineup. - *Grentz*_
> _• You will not be disappointed with this receiver, I wasn't. - *dave29*_
> _• I don't think that anyone will be disappointed in this STB. - *jasonki32*_


† Re: _"Functionality is nearly identical to prior boxes"_ - The only differences are that networking is either via Ethernet as before or via RG6 cable using DECA, and the remote is programmable. Being sufficiently fast - at last - is not a new function or a feature.


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> Couldn't disagree more.


Yeah, as you've been saying over and over again. We really do get it. :lol:

I personally disagree with thread-jacking this discussion into your own personal crusade.


----------



## Doug Brott

Syzygy said:


> Those "few lines of text" include some grandiose praise that's a lot more like marketing hyperbole than I'd expect from the average DVR enthusiast.


:shrug: Are you saying you don't like the First Look?


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> That's DirecTV's decision. They CAN make new DVR with all new bells and whistles, but instead, they have chosen not to. Instead they are concentrating on making the boxes look prettier. I guess this is their priority.


Are you assuming this is the only thing DIRECTV has been working on? Again, that would be a mistake.


----------



## matt

I still want one!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

xtc said:


> OK, that's neat for 2 minutes, and you'll never even think about this again for the lifetime of the receiver.
> 
> That's DirecTV's decision. They CAN make new DVR with all new bells and whistles, but instead, they have chosen not to. Instead they are concentrating on making the boxes look prettier. I guess this is their priority.


I think you may have missed my point. As features are added they're added to all the HD DVR+ line. Unless you think there is some hardware that this DVR is lacking then features will be universal to all the current supported hardware and as such there may not be much a difference in functionallity.

This makes sense to me. I shouldn't have to upgrade my receiver every time DirecTV comes out with a new feature...I'm just sayin' :grin:

Mike


----------



## hoyty76

bobnielsen said:


> You could do this by having another DECA adapter for the Blu-Ray (or any ethernet device). There might be a slight performance degradation caused by the additional network traffic inside the DECA cloud.


I figured another DECA to ethernet could be used, I just thought it would be a nice feature for those who wanted to utilize the HX-24 as a bridge and not have another device. Sounds like it isn't possible though.


----------



## Nicholsen

Sixto said:


> Performance is priority #1. The HR24 solved that.


I hope that is true. I take the "first look" report with a grain of salt. It seems the "first look" testers may never have met a unit they didn't like. (Much like the great Juilian Hirsch, who used to review equipment in Stereo Review, but never actually gave a speaker a "negative" review).



Sixto said:


> More then 2 tuners? Let's be honest, that's not going into the workhorse box.


Why? That just seems to be arbitrary design decision. I am sure they said that about 1 tuner boxes back in the day



Sixto said:


> This is an easy discussion.
> 
> They enhanced what needed to be enhanced in the hardware.
> 
> Simple as that.


Given the vociferous way some people on this board have defended the painfully slow HR2x platform for the last two years, that is an interesting comment. Basically, it implies the other HR2x boxes had hardware that was inadequate. That has been my position for some time.


----------



## Syzygy

Doug Brott said:


> :shrug: Are you saying you don't like the First Look?


Since you asked, I would've preferred more details about the hardware and less selling.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Nicholsen said:


> I hope that is true. I take the "first look" report with a grain of salt. It seems the "first look" testers may never have met a unit they didn't like. (Much like the great Juilian Hirsch, who used to review equipment in Stereo Review, but never actually gave a speaker a "negative" review).
> 
> Why? That just seems to be arbitrary design decision. I am sure they said that about 1 tuner boxes back in the day
> 
> Given the vociferous way some people on this board have defended the painfully slow Hr2x platform for the last two years, that is an interesting comment. Basically, it implies the other HR2x boxes had hardware that was inadequate. That has been my position for some time.


I don't think it's arbitrary at all. Two tuners is pretty much the standard. If this were to be a whole home DVR server I would agree with you. It's simply an HD DVR. :grin:

Mike


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Syzygy said:


> Those "few lines of text" include some grandiose praise that's a lot more like marketing hyperbole than I'd expect from the average DVR enthusiast.


You have my word that these are simply honest testimonials from the test team. No one in the test team works for the DIRECTV marketing department, myself included.


----------



## Doug Brott

Nicholsen said:


> I hope that [the speed improvents are] true. I take the "first look" report with a grain of salt. It seems the "first look" testers may never have met a unit they didn't like. (Much like the great Juilian Hirsch, who used to review equipment in Stereo Review, but never actually gave a speaker a "negative" review).


Understandable that folks might be skeptical, but really .. it's the "hit's you in the face" kind of speed up. It's is very noticeable and not something that you have to think about. I expect everyone to say "this is fast" the first time the use it. The reaction will be universal, I think.


----------



## Nicholsen

Syzygy said:


> Those "few lines of text" include some grandiose praise that's a lot more like marketing hyperbole than I'd expect from the average DVR enthusiast.


The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


----------



## hoyty76

xtc said:


> Yeah, lots of new features here


I am at this point actually a former DTV customer but I still think the addition of speed and DECA is a nice step forward. Since you keep mentioning a lack of new features I am just curious what new features you want in a DirecTV receiver / DVR? I assume you must have some ideas?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Nicholsen said:


> I hope that is true. I take the "first look" report with a grain of salt. It seems the "first look" testers may never have met a unit they didn't like. (Much like the great Juilian Hirsch, who used to review equipment in Stereo Review, but never actually gave a speaker a "negative" review).


I take issue with that statement. I will admit that the first look documents have a positive slant to them, given that they were prepared by excited forum members. They are not and never were intended to be unbiased reviews.


----------



## Doug Brott

Syzygy said:


> Since you asked, I would've preferred more details about the hardware and less selling.


It's got a 500GB HD .. 100 hours of MPEG4-HD
It's got built in DECA for MRV, DOD and TV Apps
It's fast

There are also a few pictures in the First Look that I won't post here.

Based on press releases, it uses a new NXP processor. It's quite similar to the earlier receivers, but it's faster and includes DECA (oh yeah, I already said that).


----------



## Skyboss

Stuart Sweet said:


> You have my word that these are simply honest testimonials from the test team. No one in the test team works for the DIRECTV marketing department, myself included.


As long as its not like Windows Vista a year from now....


----------



## houskamp

like going from a 486 to a pentium..


----------



## RAD

Nicholsen said:


> The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


I've been part of a number of 'first look' testers and except for being able to keep the hardware I was testing after the evaluation period no other compensation was ever provided.


----------



## Sixto

There's nothing biased in any of my comments.

The box either performs or it doesn't. 

The HR24 does.

As a reference point, my HR21-200 does not.


----------



## Doug Brott

Nicholsen said:


> The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2361819#post2361819


> Please note that some DBSTalk.com testers and staff members may have received free equipment from DIRECTV or its partners for the purpose of evaluation and testing.


----------



## Grentz

Nicholsen said:


> I hope that is true. I take the "first look" report with a grain of salt. It seems the "first look" testers may never have met a unit they didn't like. (Much like the great Juilian Hirsch, who used to review equipment in Stereo Review, but never actually gave a speaker a "negative" review).


IMO, the first looks are not really full in depth comparative reviews (comparing to other companies DVRs, pros/cons, etc.) as much as they are evaluations of new products and the new features/services/upgrades they provide in a DirecTV user's environment.

The nice thing is that first looks come from real users and not marketing teams, and thus they focus on the all around package and what people will find interesting. They also give info from actual users, not just a marketing sheet. Those users are also active around here to answer anyone's questions on the new devices.


----------



## mikeny

RAD said:


> It does not eliminate BBC's, if you aren't on a SWiM then you still need them.


Good point. Post edited for clarification.


----------



## Nicholsen

Sixto said:


> There's nothing biased in any of my comments.
> 
> The box either performs or it doesn't.
> 
> The HR24 does.
> 
> As a reference point, my HR21-200 does not.


That's a direct and honest comment. Thank you. 

Maybe the HR24 really is the superbox many of us have hoped for.


----------



## Syzygy

Nicholsen said:


> The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


I for one accept the fact that the testers are not compensated - except that they get free hardware.

And I'm not sure D* would ever let *me *have one of these fast (albeit still crippled by lousy software) boxes unless I got it from a store.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Nicholsen said:


> The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


That simply isn't neccessary! 

Look, I understand some of the criticism... in fact, I agree with some of them.

I agree with Syzygy's statement that he would have liked more information about the hardware... a statement I typed out last night and then deleted before I posted...

I agree with many of XTC's statements as well.

However, there is simply NO NEED for the "First Look" testers to state any such thing. 

~Alan


----------



## LameLefty

Sixto said:


> There's nothing biased in any of my comments.
> 
> The box either performs or it doesn't.
> 
> The HR24 does.


+1

I would have preferred that the "Blue Ring of Death" was animated and brighter, but then again I am one of the few I know who do NOT dim the LEDs on existing boxes and frankly wish they all had the big, bright discrete lights like my venerable HR20-700. However, I didn't feel like such aesthetic comments belonged in a First Look, and as I noted, my daughter (in that ever-important teenaged girl demographic :lol: ) absolutely loves it. Go figure.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Nicholsen said:


> The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


Let me tell you something. Testers spend a lot of time and in some cases have spent their own money...not because we were asked to (in fact quite the opposite) but because we wanted to.

Testers do not owe you any explainations or justifications. Everything you need to know about the testesr has been printed in the opening posts and the First Look.

Mike


----------



## Nicholsen

Alan Gordon said:


> That simply isn't neccessary!
> 
> Look, I understand some of the criticism... in fact, I agree with some of them.
> 
> I agree with Syzygy's statement that he would have liked more information about the hardware... a statement I typed out last night and then deleted before I posted...
> 
> I agree with many of XTC's statements as well.
> 
> However, there is simply NO NEED for the "First Look" testers to state any such thing.
> 
> ~Alan


I don't mean to be over the top here, and certainly don't mean to imply that any money changed hands. How would I know?

I am a little sensitive to this issue because I asked a pretty innocuous question about free equipment being provided to testers previously, and it was deleted from this thread by one of the Mods as inappropriate. I wondered what there was to hide?


----------



## Blurayfan

RAD said:


> It does not eliminate BBC's, if you aren't on a SWiM then you still need them.





mikeny said:


> Good point. Post edited for clarification.


The HR24 shouldn't need BBCs given that they are already not required by an HR23 which uses wideband tuners. It would make sense the HR24 would be using wideband tuners as well.


----------



## Billzebub

I for one am excited not just about the HR24 but about DECA. I currently have an HR22, an R22 and an R15. I'm planning on upgrading the R15 to an HR box and I will eventually replace the R22 (I have the HD enabled but if it dies it will be replaced by an R16 and that just won't do on the 42 inch LCD. I can get an HR right now for $99 from D but I think I'll wait and pay the extra money at Best Buy or somewhere to make sure I get an HR24. With D12 getting closer and closer to going online this is an exciting time to be a Directv customer.


----------



## wilbur_the_goose

"I want to go to there!"

(HR24-ville)


----------



## Nicholsen

Syzygy said:


> I for one accept the fact that the testers are not compensated - except that they get free hardware.
> 
> And I'm not sure D* would ever let *me *have one of these fast (albeit still crippled by lousy software) boxes unless I got it from a store.


I suspect I am on the "do not allow to test" list as well. :lol:

I can live with that.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

DVDKingdom said:


> The HR24 shouldn't need BBCs given that they are already not required by an HR23 which uses wideband tuners. It would make sense the HR24 would be using wideband tuners as well.


The HR24 is really meant to work on an SWiM system which doesn't need BBCs or wideband tuners.

Mike


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> Yeah, as you've been saying over and over again. We really do get it. :lol:
> 
> I personally disagree with thread-jacking this discussion into your own personal crusade.


you're way off base, not to mention rude. Everything has been on topic.


----------



## LameLefty

DVDKingdom said:


> The HR24 shouldn't need BBCs given that they are already not required by an HR23 which uses wideband tuners. It would make sense the HR24 would be using wideband tuners as well.


Wideband tuners on the HR23 were a stop-gap until SWM-based installations became standard. The HR24 does NOT have wideband tuners. If you install without an SWM, you WILL need BBCs.


----------



## xtc

Doug Brott said:


> Are you assuming this is the only thing DIRECTV has been working on? Again, that would be a mistake.


Who knows what they are working on, I am just commenting on what they are releasing.


----------



## xtc

Nicholsen said:


> The "first look" testers seem really, really excited. Perhaps they would be willing to confirm that they were not compensated for the review and endorsements?


Good point, thats why i was like, why in the world are these people so excited about this, makes no sense.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Nicholsen said:


> I don't mean to be over the top here, and certainly don't mean to imply that any money changed hands. How would I know?


The testers were given receivers to test. That is stated IN THE FIRST LOOK.

I did not intend to be so rude to you, but as a CE'er, I felt it insulting that our fellow posters could be "bought off" to do a good review.



Nicholsen said:


> I am a little sensitive to this issue because I asked a pretty innocuous question about free equipment being provided to testers previously, and it was deleted from this thread by one of the Mods as inappropriate. I wondered what there was to hide?


Again, I think the innapropriateness stems from insinuating that some of our posters could (possibly) have been "bought off".

~Alan


----------



## dave29

Man, this is an awesome unit and I thought this thread would be full of excited people wanting an HR24, boy was I wrong. 

What's the deal with all the skepticism and bad attitudes? :shrug:


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> Good point, thats why i was like, why in the world are these people so excited about this, makes no sense.


We are excited because it's a brand new hardware platform that is substantially quicker and more enjoyable to use, easier to network, and has a nice modern exterior refresh.

Take off your CynicalColoredGlasses™ and read the First Look.


----------



## Skyboss

The question of the day...

Is this the new TiVo "ready" platform waiting for an optional software download or is there an even faster H25/HR25 right behind it....

You've got until September DirecTV.... Deliver.

One disapointment... only 2 tuners in the DVR... The capacity is enough for our needs, but we have more than two overlapping programs a couple of days a week.


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> Who knows what they are working on, I am just commenting on what they are releasing.


Your many posts in essence are saying "Is this all they are doing with their R&D dollars?" I said "no."


----------



## Jotas

So does that mean I can trade in my HR10-250 for a new HR24-500 since I'll no longer receiver any HD content beginning March 31st?


----------



## xtc

Nicholsen said:


> I suspect I am on the "do not allow to test" list as well. :lol:


Me too. Because I would actually give an honest review and either compliment them on useful new additions or criticize them for a lack there off (which is the pattern forming from them)


----------



## Doug Brott

Skyboss said:


> The question of the day...
> 
> Is this the new TiVo "ready" platform waiting for an optional software download or is there an even faster H25/HR25 right behind it....
> 
> You've got until September DirecTV.... Deliver.


It is unknown .. My personal guess is that either the HR21 or HR23 platforms will be used for that .. Feel free to continue discussion of the new DIRECTiVo in the TiVo Discussion Thread.


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> Me too. Because I would actually give an honest review and either compliment them on useful new additions or criticize them for a lack there off (which is the pattern forming from them)


Ah .. So you are assuming the folks that did test this unit are not being honest .. Interesting.


----------



## Doug Brott

Jotas said:


> So does that mean I can trade in my HR10-250 for a new HR24-500 since I'll no longer receiver any HD content beginning March 31st?


I don't know. Maybe.


----------



## houskamp

Nicholsen said:


> I don't mean to be over the top here, and certainly don't mean to imply that any money changed hands. How would I know?
> 
> I am a little sensitive to this issue because I asked a pretty innocuous question about free equipment being provided to testers previously, and it was deleted from this thread by one of the Mods as inappropriate. I wondered what there was to hide?


 The tests I have been in in the past cost me more cash than if I bought it from directv :lol:
between adding wire and switches to spending time out in 2' of snow..

As for speed I can say that my HR21 stayed in the second room due to it being slower than my HR20s.. The HR24 has since replaced my HR20 as my main box.. Yes it is much faster..


----------



## hancox

I just love it that the same people bashing the length / etc of the First Look are also saying "that's it?" at the box... Sigh.

Look, this isn't a game-changing box. Don't expect it to brew your coffee, but it's faster. Cool.

The real movement will happen if/when the code branches. That could get *interesting*


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> Me too. Because I would actually give an honest review and either compliment them on useful new additions or criticize them for a lack there off (which is the pattern forming from them)


Are you insinuating those of us quoted in the document are not honest? In other words, are you calling me a liar? If so, say it directly rather than insinuating it.

Furthermore, do yourself a favor and do a search on my posts in the last 3-1/2 years. If you can find anything I've posted that's a lie, feel free to point it out to me.


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> We are excited because it's a brand new hardware platform that is substantially quicker and more enjoyable to use, easier to network, and has a nice modern exterior refresh.
> 
> Take off your CynicalColoredGlasses™ and read the First Look.


So I guess by NOT improving speed for years and years and 4 models later they actually do something about it and this is supposed to make you jump up and down. The speed was atrocious and now it is NORMAL. I don't consider it a new feature or even an improvement, i think they have moved from faulty DVRs to standard. Instead of patting them on the back, you should be saying it about F'n time!


----------



## xtc

Doug Brott said:


> Your many posts in essence are saying "Is this all they are doing with their R&D dollars?" I said "no."


Yes. and you said no, but you haven't shown me anything to prove me wrong.


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> So I guess by NOT improving speed for years and years and 4 models later they actually do something about it and this is supposed to make you jump up and down. The speed was atrocious and now it is NORMAL. I don't consider it a new feature or even an improvement, i think they have moved from faulty DVRs to standard. Instead of patting them on the back, you should be saying it about F'n time!


I don't know what rock you're living under but speed has DEFINITELY improved since 2006. Do a search for posts by Steve for his speed tests - he has been quite rigorous in periodic measurements and posting his findings.

Of course, it's easier to sit back behind a pseudonym calling people liars, I suppose.


----------



## veryoldschool

LameLefty said:


> I don't know what rock you're living under but speed has DEFINITELY improved since 2006. Do a search for posts by Steve for his speed tests - he has been quite rigorous in periodic measurements and posting his findings.
> 
> Of course, it's easier to sit back behind a pseudonym calling people liars, I suppose.


Not having one, how could anybody have a clue as to how it works or doesn't, yet can bash the crap out of it.


----------



## Alan Gordon

dave29 said:


> Man, this is an awesome unit and I thought this thread would be full of excited people wanting an HR24, boy was I wrong.


I think it boils down to several things. One, some people were looking for a new platform... and two, bitterness.

As far as the new plaform goes... I can certainly understand. It's been four years since the HR20-700 came out. Since that time, there really hasn't been any changes to the HR2x platform. Sure, the HR21 took away speed and OTA, and the HR22 added a larger hard drive, but it's stayed relatively the same. I think some people were hoping for a new platform with an HD GUI, new features, less restrictions, bigger hard drive, etc., and all they got was, more or less, more speed.

As far as the bitterness goes, I can understand that. I really don't like my HR23-700, and I'd LOVE to be able to replace it with an HR24, but DirecTV doesn't offer an easy (or cheap) way to upgrade. If I want to upgrade to the HR24, I'd have to put out another $200 when I wasn't happy with how my last $200 spent on a receiver turned out. If DirecTV offered their technophile subscribers an easier/cheaper way to upgrade, I'd be a lot more excited about the HR24 than I am. 

~Alan


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> Yes. and you said no, but you haven't shown me anything to prove me wrong.


http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=171288

Open the PDF .. Check out page #7


----------



## mhayes70

I can tell you that I want one of these really bad.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Alan Gordon said:


> I think it boils down to several things. One, some people were looking for a new platform... and two, bitterness.
> 
> As far as the new plaform goes... I can certainly understand. It's been four years since the HR20-700 came out. Since that time, there really hasn't been any changes to the HR2x platform. Sure, the HR21 took away speed and OTA, and the HR22 added a larger hard drive, but it's stayed relatively the same. I think some people were hoping for a new platform with an HD GUI, new features, less restrictions, bigger hard drive, etc., and all they got was, more or less, more speed.
> 
> As far as the bitterness goes, I can understand that. I really don't like my HR23-700, and I'd LOVE to be able to replace it with an HR24, but DirecTV doesn't offer an easy (or cheap) way to upgrade. If I want to upgrade to the HR24, I'd have to put out another $200 when I wasn't happy with how my last $200 spent on a receiver turned out. If DirecTV offered their technophile subscribers an easier/cheaper way to upgrade, I'd be a lot more excited about the HR24 than I am.
> 
> ~Alan


It is a different platform. It has all new hardware and chipsets inside. It has hardware based functionality that doesn't exist in the previous HR2x's.

However, the featrue set is maintained across the whole HD DVR+ line so as far as that goes you're not likely to see anything different between DVRs.

Mike


----------



## xtc

Doug Brott said:


> Ah .. So you are assuming the folks that did test this unit are not being honest .. Interesting.


Not necessarily. They may have been honest as in they are not lying about their feelings, but they are just unrealistic and ridiculously overexcited about nothing which does not make them good critics. When i look at it, it sounds like a kid who just got a new game and is just jumping up and down. I looked at the whole thing and could barely find anything about any new features, and I'm thinking to myself, they spent all this time on making this pretty file, but where is the stuff that i'm looking for? what is this hoopla about? where are the details about this box that supposedly make this box so much better than the previous one(s)! That should be the main focus! But hey, They make pretty pdf files though! which makes me think that they are more concerned with the look of the thing than what it actually does. I appreciate the time they took to make the file, but i would have been more impressed if they concentrated on the details than the looks. I wouldn't even mind if it was just text, just comparing the old vs. New. But now that I think about it, because there are hardly any new features in this dvr, the file would barely be worth looking at if not for the time they put into the actual look and design of the pdf file.


----------



## Alan Gordon

MicroBeta said:


> It is a different platform. It has all new hardware and chipsets inside. It has hardware based functionality that doesn't exist in the previous HR2x's.


I guess I should have stated software platform. Though for the end user, the difference in speed is really the only difference in the hardware platform.



MicroBeta said:


> However, the featrue set is maintained across the whole HD DVR+ line so as far as that goes you're not likely to see anything different between DVRs.


Which I think is the issue. People see the HR2*4* designation, and every time they see that number change, they hope to see something new.

~Alan


----------



## Stuart Sweet

I'm glad to see our naysayer contingent is still going strong. 

The H24 and HR24 are great little boxes. Are they the answer to everyone's prayers? No. But they are an improvement of the 22 and 23 series, which I continue to be happy with despite that.


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> Are you insinuating those of us quoted in the document are not honest? In other words, are you calling me a liar? If so, say it directly rather than insinuating it.
> 
> Furthermore, do yourself a favor and do a search on my posts in the last 3-1/2 years. If you can find anything I've posted that's a lie, feel free to point it out to me.


huh? liar? dude, i don't even know you.


----------



## houskamp

xtc said:


> Not necessarily. They may have been honest as in they are not lying about their feelings, but they are just unrealistic and ridiculously overexcited about nothing which does not make them good critics. When i look at it, it sounds like a kid who just got a new game and is just jumping up and down. I looked at the whole thing and could barely find anything about any new features, and I'm thinking to myself, they spent all this time on making this pretty file, but where is the stuff that i'm looking for? what is this hoopla about? where are the details about this box that supposedly make this box so much better than the previous one(s)! That should be the main focus! But hey, They make pretty pdf files though! which makes me think that they are more concerned with the look of the thing than what it actually does. I appreciate the time they took to make the file, but i would have been more impressed if they concentrated on the details than the looks. I wouldn't even mind if it was just text, just comparing the old vs. New. But now that I think about it, because there are hardly any new features in this dvr, the file would barely be worth looking at if not for the time they put into the actual look and design of the pdf file.


 So what are you looking for? It's a DVR.. It's not gonna make coffee or clean your house..


----------



## veryoldschool

In the words of Charlie Brown: "Good Grief" 

If you don't like it, fine, but give the rest of us a break.


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> Me too. Because I would actually give an *honest* review and either compliment them on useful new additions or criticize them for a lack there off (which is the pattern forming from them)





xtc said:


> huh? liar? dude, i don't even know you.


What part of your own words do you not understand, "dude?" Your implication was quite clear it seems to me. Clearly insulting.


----------



## Nicholsen

Stuart Sweet said:


> I take issue with that statement. I will admit that the first look documents have a positive slant to them, given that they were prepared by excited forum members. *They are not and never were intended to be unbiased reviews.*


Emphasis added.

I think an "honest" review is, by definition, unbiased.

However, I don't think anyone accused or intended to accuse anyone of dishonesty.

Homerism, yes.


----------



## hancox

Nicholsen said:


> Emphasis added.
> 
> I think an "honest" review is, by definition, unbiased.
> 
> However, I don't think anyone accused or intended to accuse anyone of dishonesty.
> 
> Homerism, yes.


100% wrong.

People can't be honestly excited? Really?


----------



## Doug Brott

xtc said:


> But hey, They make pretty pdf files though! which makes me think that they are more concerned with the look of the thing than what it actually does. I appreciate the time they took to make the file, but i would have been more impressed if they concentrated on the details than the looks.


Our little community is made of of professional from all walks of life .. It's amazing what one can accomplish with a little teamwork. :grin:


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> I don't know what rock you're living under but speed has DEFINITELY improved since 2006. Do a search for posts by Steve for his speed tests - he has been quite rigorous in periodic measurements and posting his findings.
> 
> Of course, it's easier to sit back behind a pseudonym calling people liars, I suppose.


What? who called who a liar? you did?

I got my HR20 then a couple of years later i got the HR22 and the speeds are much worse!!!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Alan Gordon said:


> I guess I should have stated software platform. Though for the end user, the difference in speed is really the only difference in the hardware platform.
> 
> Which I think is the issue. People see the HR2*4* designation, and every time they see that number change, they hope to see something new.
> 
> ~Alan


IMHO, it doesn't make any sense for it to be different in functionality from the other HR2x's. Otherwise I would need to upgrade my DVR every time there was a new feature...not a very good business model. :shrug:

This DVR had a new look, new hardware inside. Maybe the naysayers are so blinded by their own cynicism that they can't see past the pretty lights on the front of the box and evaluate what they are reading objectively...I'm just sayin' :grin:

Mike


----------



## mhayes70

xtc said:


> Not necessarily. They may have been honest as in they are not lying about their feelings, but they are just unrealistic and ridiculously overexcited about nothing which does not make them good critics. When i look at it, it sounds like a kid who just got a new game and is just jumping up and down. I looked at the whole thing and could barely find anything about any new features, and I'm thinking to myself, they spent all this time on making this pretty file, but where is the stuff that i'm looking for? what is this hoopla about? where are the details about this box that supposedly make this box so much better than the previous one(s)! That should be the main focus! But hey, They make pretty pdf files though! which makes me think that they are more concerned with the look of the thing than what it actually does. I appreciate the time they took to make the file, but i would have been more impressed if they concentrated on the details than the looks. I wouldn't even mind if it was just text, just comparing the old vs. New. But now that I think about it, because there are hardly any new features in this dvr, the file would barely be worth looking at if not for the time they put into the actual look and design of the pdf file.


Everyone has there opinion and you keep stating you don't like it. That is your opinion. But, the majority of us like it and see the value in this DVR and would love to upgrade to this new DVR. So, since you don't like it then just don't upgrade to it and keep everything the way you got it now. I WILL be upgrading to this DVR when it comes out.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

xtc said:


> When i look at it, it sounds like a kid who just got a new game and is just jumping up and down. I looked at the whole thing and could barely find anything about any new features, and I'm thinking to myself, they spent all this time on making this pretty file, but where is the stuff that i'm looking for?


First of all, thank you for the compliment. I spent about 50 hours on design and layout of that document. Personally. Just me. In my spare time. For free. So thank you for noticing.

Second of all, the thing is, that you really _do_ get it and you don't realize it. This is not intended to be a review. Reviews will come from all of you as you get the hardware. This IS intended to be just what you say, an honest expression of excitement from a bunch of guys who want to tell you about what they've been playing with. *That's the point.*

Finally, I understand that the new features may not excite you, but to claim they're not there seems a bit odd:


This DVR will be right at home next to a TV, with no wireless adapter, no ethernet, no external DECA, just one wire and one power cord. That's a huge feature for a huge number of people. 
The remote programs itself. It actually works. Point the remote at the DVR, answer a question or two, and IT PROGRAMS ITSELF. 
Not to mention, it's fast, no kidding. I didn't even know how to put into words or pictures how fast it is.

It's not the forthcoming multi-tuner device shown at CES, but it's hands down the best-performing DVR DIRECTV's put out, with or without a bobble-headed animated character attached.

And you know what? I'm excited. I think it's cool. I want to share that with my friends. So glad you've all afforded me the opportunity.


----------



## xtc

Alan Gordon said:


> I think it boils down to several things. One, some people were looking for a new platform... and two, bitterness.
> 
> As far as the new plaform goes... I can certainly understand. It's been four years since the HR20-700 came out. Since that time, there really hasn't been any changes to the HR2x platform. Sure, the HR21 took away speed and OTA, and the HR22 added a larger hard drive, but it's stayed relatively the same. I think some people were hoping for a new platform with an HD GUI, new features, less restrictions, bigger hard drive, etc., and all they got was, more or less, more speed.


EXACTLY!!!! and the speed increase is what should have been standard in the original models.


----------



## funkyp56

Agreed


----------



## mhayes70

xtc said:


> What? who called who a liar? you did?
> 
> I got my HR20 then a couple of years later i got the HR22 and the speeds are much worse!!!


Then you would be much happier with the HR24.


----------



## Nicholsen

Alan Gordon said:


> I think it boils down to several things. One, some people were looking for a new platform... and two, bitterness.
> 
> As far as the new plaform goes... I can certainly understand. It's been four years since the HR20-700 came out. Since that time, there really hasn't been any changes to the HR2x platform. Sure, the HR21 took away speed and OTA, and the HR22 added a larger hard drive, but it's stayed relatively the same. I think some people were hoping for a new platform with an HD GUI, new features, less restrictions, bigger hard drive, etc., and all they got was, more or less, more speed.
> 
> As far as the bitterness goes, I can understand that. I really don't like my HR23-700, and I'd LOVE to be able to replace it with an HR24, but DirecTV doesn't offer an easy (or cheap) way to upgrade. If I want to upgrade to the HR24, I'd have to put out another $200 when I wasn't happy with how my last $200 spent on a receiver turned out. If DirecTV offered their technophile subscribers an easier/cheaper way to upgrade, I'd be a lot more excited about the HR24 than I am.
> 
> ~Alan


Bitterness is a fair assessment.

I now have a HR10-250 which has been rendered obsolete, and an HR21-100 which doesn't work properly.

I have suffered though 2 years of software patches, but the software is still buggy.

Now they would like me to buy a third box and commit to 2 more years.

I believe many of the people who are all excited about the new HR24 thought the HR21 was great as well (just a few months ago).

I will reserve judgment until I see a unit in operation.


----------



## xtc

houskamp said:


> So what are you looking for? It's a DVR.. It's not gonna make coffee or clean your house..


At minimum, i would like this DVR to do what Standalone TiVo's are now doing for cable customers. (not the ancient HR10-250's)

And I don't get the point of making new DVR models every year that don't add any major new features and have in fact taken away features such as off-air channels. Just keep producing what you have been and release a new model when you actually have something to show people. Don't release something new just for the hell of it. I can bet that if we actually get the new DirecTivos, that will be something to talk about, this? Not so much.


----------



## mhayes70

xtc said:


> At minimum, i would like this DVR to do what Standalone TiVo's are now doing for cable customers. (not the ancient HR10-250's)
> 
> And I don't get the point of making new DVR models every year that don't add any major new features and have in fact taken away features such as off-air channels. Just keep producing what you have been and release a new model when you actually have something to show people. Don't release something new just for the hell of it. I can bet that if we actually get the new DirecTivos, that will be something to talk about, this? Not so much.


Ah.... I get it. You really just want the Tivo back to Directv.


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> What part of your own words do you not understand, "dude?" Your implication was quite clear it seems to me. Clearly insulting.


Well you need to have some thicker skin. First of all i never called you a liar because i don't even know you. and if someone else did, get over it. you don't need to cry about it.


----------



## xtc

Nicholsen said:


> Emphasis added.
> 
> I think an "honest" review is, by definition, unbiased.
> 
> However, I don't think anyone accused or intended to accuse anyone of dishonesty.
> 
> Homerism, yes.


VERY well said!


----------



## LameLefty

xtc said:


> Well you need to have some thicker skin. First of all i never called you a liar because i don't even know you. and if someone else did, get over it. you don't need to cry about it.


No one is crying here. I stand by what I wrote in the First Look. If you don't like it, too bad for you. For the vast majority of users, my opinions are more likely to be shared than are your (uninformed) opinions. That works for me.


----------



## Sim-X

I can't wait till these are out - I got DirecTV in the fall - what is the best way to upgrade? I heard you can't request certain models from DTV so what is one to do?


----------



## Alan Gordon

MicroBeta said:


> IMHO, it doesn't make any sense for it to be different in functionality from the other HR2x's. Otherwise I would need to upgrade my DVR every time there was a new feature...not a very good business model. :shrug:


Actually... a very good business model... just not a very user-friendly model.

The problem with making sure functionality stays the same across your entire line means that you're somewhat handicapped in bringing about new features.



MicroBeta said:


> This DVR had a new look, new hardware inside. Maybe the naysayers are so blinded by their own cynicism that they can't see past the pretty lights on the front of the box and evaluate what they are reading objectively...I'm just sayin' :grin:


Just don't lump me into the naysayers. *I'd LOVE to have an HR24.* I'm just simply saying that I understand where some of the "naysayers" are coming from.

~Alan


----------



## mhayes70

Sim-X said:


> I can't wait till these are out - I got DirecTV in the fall - what is the best way to upgrade? I heard you can't request certain models from DTV so what is one to do?


Probably the best thing to do is when they come out. Get the HR24 at a local retailer. Usually Directv can't promise what model you get.


----------



## sigma1914

xct...you don't like the HR24, you don't like the First Look...WE GET IT! Why keep stirring the pot? Move along...


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Alan Gordon said:


> Actually... a very good business model... just not a very user-friendly model.


That's a poor business model. How long would you stay with DirecTV if every time a cool new feature comes out you had to upgrade your hardware and extend you commitment...the HR21 has DoD so I have to get rid of my HR20...oh wait, now the HR22 has media share I have to get rid of my HR21...oh look, the HR23 has MRV, goodbye HR22.

I don't know about you, but I would be gone in a heartbeat. 



Alan Gordon said:


> The problem with making sure functionality stays the same across your entire line means that you're somewhat handicapped in bringing about new features.
> 
> Just don't lump me into the naysayers. *I'd LOVE to have an HR24.* I'm just simply saying that I understand where some of the "naysayers" are coming from.
> 
> ~Alan


If I meant to call you a naysayer I would have said so. 

I don't see how maintaining functionality would handicap the ability to have features. What features would necessarily not be included by maintaining a fairly uniform feature set. :scratchin

Mike


----------



## Sim-X

mhayes70 said:


> Probably the best thing to do is when they come out. Get the HR24 at a local retailer. Usually Directv can't promise what model you get.


So then I will have to send the old boxes back to DTV? That really sucks considering I paid $400 for 3 boxes (I got one free) So now I have to pay another $200+ per new box and send back the old ones and they don't give me any credit?


----------



## Guest

Has it been confirmed if the HR-24 needs the BBC's? Also is the guide only faster on the HR-24 and H-24 model because it has faster processors than the older systems so the older systems will still be slow? Thanks.


----------



## mikeny

xtc said:


> . Don't release something new just for the hell of it.


This doesn't sound fair. No, it's not revolutionary but it sounds like an improvement over the other HR units.


----------



## say-what

CraigerCSM said:


> Has it been confirmed if the HR-24 needs the BBC's?


If you are not using an SWiM, you need the BBC's.



> Also is the guide only faster on the HR-24 and H-24 model because it has faster processors than the older systems so the older systems will still be slow? Thanks.


That would be a logical conclusion as the H24 and HR24 are running the same core software as the prior receivers. How much is software, how much is hardware, we can't say. We can only provide our observations on this point.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

CraigerCSM said:


> Has it been confirmed if the HR-24 needs the BBC's? Also is the guide only faster on the HR-24 and H-24 model because it has faster processors than the older systems so the older systems will still be slow? Thanks.


Yes, earlier in the thread it has been confirmed that, for a non-SWiM setup, BBCs are required. The 24 series is intended to work on SWiM setups and doesn't need wideband tuners.

I would be just guessing, but since the processor seems to be about 80% faster than the previous Broadcom chips then it's likely faster due to the processor. I would also think that the firmware is coded for the chips so it's probably a little cleaner. I'm not a programmer but that seems logical to me. :grin:

Mike


----------



## Stuart Sweet

CraigerCSM said:


> Has it been confirmed if the HR-24 needs the BBC's?


I can confirm this.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

One poster now has 24 negative posts to tell us he does not like the new HR24/H24 units. Understood.

Another has more than 6 negative posts prior to telling us that they are reserving judgment until they have one. Understood.

So perhaps we can move forward now to talk about pertinent things about these new units, at least to appease those of us who have an interest in them.

Questions:

1) When will they be generally available?
2) Is there any speculation on an upgrade strategy, in the context of moving all customers to SWM/DECA eventually?
3) Do these units have the potential for new capabilities that may go beyond those supported in previous generation units?

Thanks in advance for any information.


----------



## xtc

Stuart Sweet said:


> First of all, thank you for the compliment. I spent about 50 hours on design and layout of that document. Personally. Just me. In my spare time. For free. So thank you for noticing.


Yeah you obviously know what you are doing, and i think the actual "look" of the file is very good. And I think that's what impresses people here and why they have your back. But personally, I would care more for a detailed explanation of the new DVR and it's features and how it compares to the old ones. Like i said earlier, a plain text file would have been sufficient and could have actually accomplished a lot more and not taken you as long to make. but obviously you have skill in the design, now if you could get together with someone that could actually give a realistic review and point out its greatness AND it's flaws that would be even better.



Stuart Sweet said:


> Second of all, the thing is, that you really _do_ get it and you don't realize it. This is not intended to be a review. Reviews will come from all of you as you get the hardware. This IS intended to be just what you say, an honest expression of excitement from a bunch of guys who want to tell you about what they've been playing with. *That's the point.*


Thank you for explaining that. Because i was expecting to get a review of the thing, when it actually is more like one of those DirecTV pamphlets or whatever they are called that are in stores like Best Buy. Thats why some other people even thought that you guys were somehow compensated by DirecTV for this.



Stuart Sweet said:


> Finally, I understand that the new features may not excite you, but to claim they're not there seems a bit odd:
> 
> [*]This DVR will be right at home next to a TV, with no wireless adapter, no ethernet, no external DECA, just one wire and one power cord. That's a huge feature for a huge number of people.


Sorry i don't see anything great about it. I still get the same functioning DVR and the way i have it now, i don't have any noticeable wires hanging out. And it is networked perfectly. I'm no networking expert, so If i can do it, others can without these so-called new features.



Stuart Sweet said:


> [*]The remote programs itself. It actually works. Point the remote at the DVR, answer a question or two, and IT PROGRAMS ITSELF.


This does not impress me because this is just something you do when you open the box and you will never use or even think about this feature for the entire lifetime of the machine. It's a one-time thing that saves a couple minutes. Big deal. The time they took to make this feature could have been spent on something MUCH more useful that could be used regularly, not once.



Stuart Sweet said:


> [*]Not to mention, it's fast, no kidding. I didn't even know how to put into words or pictures how fast it is.


I'll take your word for it, but i think it's too little too late. These speeds should have been implented in the original HR20-23 DVRs. TiVo did it before them, heck even cable is faster. No reason why DirecTV had to be painfully slow all these years. It took them this long to correct it? That's how i would rather explain it. It's more of a CORRECTION to a faulty DVR operation in the past than it is a new feature. They just finally came to their senses. Just like the Dual Tuners, it took them how long to realize that feature should have been implemented years ago???


----------



## Billzebub

xtc said:


> So I guess by NOT improving speed for years and years and 4 models later they actually do something about it and this is supposed to make you jump up and down. The speed was atrocious and now it is NORMAL. I don't consider it a new feature or even an improvement, i think they have moved from faulty DVRs to standard. Instead of patting them on the back, you should be saying it about F'n time!


I know you will think I'm flaming you, but I'm not. This is an honest question. If you are so unhappy with Directv why do you stay with them? Surely FIOS or cable are avaliable in your area.

I don't mean to imply that you don't have the right to complain. It's just that the best way to get your point across is to punish the company in the wallet. If enough people feel like you the company will adapt or die.


----------



## Alan Gordon

MicroBeta said:


> That's a poor business model. How long would you stay with DirecTV if every time a cool new feature comes out you had to upgrade your hardware and extend you commitment...the HR21 has DoD so I have to get rid of my HR20...oh wait, now the HR22 has media share it have to get rid of my HR21...oh look, the HR23 has MRV, goodbye HR22.


My Playstation 3 has a ton more features than my PSOne.

I don't really care anything about the DoD or MediaShare, and DirecTV intends to charge for MRV, so not really an issue for me.

My second (RCA) DirecTV receiver had more features than my first (RCA). My third DirecTV receiver (Sony B65) had features my second didn't have, and my second had features the third didn't have. My fourth (Hughes HTL-HD) had features none of the previous had, but they had some my HTL-HD didn't have. My DirecTiVo's had features none of them had, but my HR20-700had features the DirecTiVo didn't have, and vice versa.

I'm sure you can think of many instances in which newer models have more features than earlier models.



MicroBeta said:


> If I meant to call you a naysayer I would have said so.


Just making sure. Sometimes playing devil's advocate can cause you to be lumped in as well.



MicroBeta said:


> I don't see how maintaining functionality would handicap the ability to have features. What features would necessarily not be included by maintaining a fairly uniform feature set. :scratchin


Well, an HD GUI comes to mind. I have something else in mind as well, but unfortunately, I can't comment on it here.

~Alan


----------



## Juppers

Where is a video showing this thing actually performing as it is being claimed? I can't believe I watched that worthless student film project that provided no useful information about the HR24. The channel change speed still looks slow in the comparison graph, and the guide paging numbers are hard to believe. I have never seen any on my units perform anywhere near the "average" speeds for the existing HRs claimed in that chart. I have to add 10-15 seconds to the numbers as a reality check, which still makes the new unit slow. 

Show us the PROOF!


----------



## Syzygy

xtc said:


> So I guess by NOT improving speed for years and years and 4 models later they actually do something about it and this is supposed to make you jump up and down. The speed was atrocious and now it is NORMAL. I don't consider it a new feature or even an improvement, i think *they have moved from faulty DVRs to standard*. Instead of patting them on the back, you should be saying it about F'n time!


Everyone else, it seems, is kicking and stomping *xtc* for being too negative. Here's a switch: In one respect, at least, the above post isn't negative enough for my taste. What I mean is, I'd change "they have moved from faulty DVRs to standard" to *"they have moved from slow and faulty DVRs to reasonably quick and still faulty."* The horde of bugs and design deficiencies remains. Most of you have seen at least one of my lists of issues; I'm weary of listing the same unchanging set of problems (as you may be weary of reading about them ).


mhayes70 said:


> I can tell you that I want one of these really bad.


Not me; I'm still waiting for the real thing from TiVo. (Even if will be on older hardware, which is what Doug Brott repeatedly theorizes, as if he wishes it to be the case.)


----------



## Guest

Could the new HR-24 be able to run a web browser on it?

I wonder why they decided not to have internal wide band tuners in the HR-24 and H-24?


----------



## inazsully

As much as I appreciate the increase in operating speed I feel a little less than wowed. After 4 years and the advent of meg 4 and HDMI 1.4 and all the hoopla about 3D I would have expected a more substantial offering for the new Flagship. I can only compare it to Dish Networks 722 HD DVR which has been out for a couple of years now. It has a 500GB hard drive and three tuners so you can record two on air channels and an off air channel at the same time. Don't get me wrong, I like the 24 but I had hoped for 1TB hard drive and the inclusion of the third tuner, like the original HR20 had. Other than the speed increase the 24 seems like a lateral move to me. Better than nothing but.....


----------



## houskamp

Syzygy said:


> Not me; I'm still waiting for the real thing from TiVo. (Even if will be on older hardware, which is what Doug Brott repeatedly theorizes, as if he wishes it to be the case.)


 At the rate they are going your in for a loooooong wait.. and likely to be disappionted when it shows up..


----------



## Stuart Sweet

All I can tell you is that this is not the only product DIRECTV has up its sleeve for the near term future. This is an important part of the strategy, though.

As for those who are more interested in the new TiVo product, I wish you the best and remind you that there is an established thread for that discussion. This is the thread for the HR24 and H24 receivers.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Juppers said:


> Where is a video showing this thing actually performing as it is being claimed? I can't believe I watched that worthless student film project that provided no useful information about the HR24. The channel change speed still looks slow in the comparison graph, and the guide paging numbers are hard to believe. I have never seen any on my units perform anywhere near the "average" speeds for the existing HRs claimed in that chart. I have to add 10-15 seconds to the numbers as a reality check, which still makes the new unit slow.
> 
> Show us the PROOF!


Holy Crap. Take it down a notch.

Why the heck does everyone think the testers are being less then honest?

They realize that everyone will eventually get or have access to these receivers and will know how fast it is. They're a pretty bright bunch and wouldn't be that sloppy.

When you see a video would you even believe it? I doubt it.

Mike


----------



## LameLefty

Juppers said:


> Where is a video showing this thing actually performing as it is being claimed? I can't believe I watched that worthless student film project that provided no useful information about the HR24. The channel change speed still looks slow in the comparison graph, and the guide paging numbers are hard to believe. I have never seen any on my units perform anywhere near the "average" speeds for the existing HRs claimed in that chart. I have to add 10-15 seconds to the numbers as a reality check, which still makes the new unit slow.
> 
> Show us the PROOF!


Way to go, insulting the people who spent an awful lot of their own time and resources to put together something fun that they wanted people to enjoy. 

And get off the high-horse calling us all liars. I've had about enough of it for one day, thanks. When you get one yourself, or see one in a store demo, I expect some apologies.


----------



## Juppers

MicroBeta said:


> Holy Crap. Take it down a notch.
> 
> Why the heck does everyone think the testers are being less then honest?
> 
> They realize that everyone will eventually get or have access to these receivers and will know how fast it is. They're a pretty bright bunch and wouldn't be that sloppy.
> 
> When you see a video would you even believe it? I doubt it.
> 
> Mike


It's all relative. What they consider acceptable, I consider horribly, painfully slow. If they claim it is fast, that may be barely acceptable to me. I'd like to know for sure. I'm still sticking around til I see what D12 is going to offer, but there isn't much keeping me a customer these days, and the poor performance of the current HR units is the main reason I'm not a big fan of DTV anymore.


----------



## sigma1914

This thread truly shows peoples true colors.

I forgot to say...Nice work, everyone.


----------



## BattleScott

I would like to suggest that any future "First Look" threads (perhaps even this one retroactively) be handled like the firmware issues threads where only questions about the first look document and questions to the testers about the device features and operations are allowed. If someone wants to open an assinine tester bashing thread, they can start a new one. It sucks to see a good, informative thread turn into 8 pages of garbage in half a day.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

I frakkin' quit.


----------



## Canis Lupus

As an H24 and HR24 tester, and the creator of the First Look video, I've got to honestly say reading this thread has been a big disappointment. 

DBSTalk is a community of users who, over time and a lot of hard work, has developed relationships with and between providers of products and services, and the end users of those products and services, including enthusiasts who've had opportunities to participate in trials of products (provided by the manufacturers) for the purposes of testing and reporting on findings through the "First Look" communications. 

Every single participant who touches any aspect of these relationships and the opportunities it affords, does so with a passion and enthusiasm that is not only not compensated, but also at times difficult - and even upsetting to family life (during at home testing for example when you're trying to get stuff to work properly). 

I tested the H24 and HR24 and they are faster than previous DVRs and H-series in virtually every way. But I'm also perfectly happy with my other equipment. This is TV watching and TV recording - not some critical pieces of equipment that might end life as we know it if it's not "fast" or "new" or "advanced" enough. 

Myself, Stuart and so many others here do this because we're enthusiasts and are dedicated to making the DirecTV experience better for everyone else. Moreover, we do this because we care about the DBSTalk community and the relationships we've forged here. 

It's too bad (as it is in too many threads here on DBSTalk), that some users would rather just take a big dump on other users' efforts.


----------



## webby_s

sigma1914 said:


> This thread truly shows peoples true colors.


Ya it got ugly WAYYYY to early, sad:flaiming


----------



## Juppers

LameLefty said:


> Way to go, insulting the people who spent an awful lot of their own time and resources to put together something fun that they wanted people to enjoy.
> 
> And get off the high-horse calling us all liars. I've had about enough of it for one day, thanks. When you get one yourself, or see one in a store demo, I expect some apologies.


See previous post. It's all relative. Your ideas of fast have never matched with my ideas of fast. Didn't call you a liar, just adjusted for that.

I was expecting to take a look at the HR24, you know after clicking on the big Take a look link. Other than some blurry, jittery, poorly lit shots of the unit, which I already knew what it looked like, there was no other first look information in the video. Perhaps they should consider more accurate descriptions for their video links.


----------



## sigma1914

Juppers said:


> See previous post. It's all relative. Your ideas of fast have never matched with my ideas of fast. Didn't call you a liar, just adjusted for that.
> 
> I was expecting to take a look at the HR24, you know after clicking on the big Take a look link. Other than some blurry, jittery, poorly lit shots of the unit, which I already knew what it looked like, *there was no other first look information in the video.* Perhaps they should consider more accurate descriptions for their video links.


The info was in the pdf, as if you even care, you crapped on everything else. Real adult like.


----------



## dave29

CraigerCSM said:


> Could the new HR-24 be able to run a web browser on it?
> 
> *I wonder why they decided not to have internal wide band tuners in the HR-24 and H-24?*


Because they are meant to be used on a SWiM system, to take full advantage of them.


----------



## dave29

BattleScott said:


> I would like to suggest that any future "First Look" threads (perhaps even this one retroactively) be handled like the firmware issues threads where only questions about the first look document and questions to the testers about the device features and operations are allowed. If someone wants to open an assinine tester bashing thread, they can start a new one. It sucks to see a good, informative thread turn into 8 pages of garbage in half a day.


I agree...
As long as I have been here, I have never seen a First Look thread end up like this. Unbelievable. :nono2:


----------



## mikeny

Juppers said:


> See previous post. It's all relative. Your ideas of fast have never matched with my ideas of fast. Didn't call you a liar, just adjusted for that.
> 
> I was expecting to take a look at the HR24, you know after clicking on the big Take a look link. Other than some blurry, jittery, poorly lit shots of the unit, which I already knew what it looked like, there was no other first look information in the video. Perhaps they should consider more accurate descriptions for their video links.


Did you mean that youtube video? It was obviously meant to be fun, (which I thought it was) not a walkthrough.


----------



## Juppers

sigma1914 said:


> The info was in the pdf, as if you even care, you crapped on everything else. Real adult like.


I do care actually. BTW - The video link was before the PDF link. Had it been the other way around, I wouldn't have watched the video at all because I prefer written material.


----------



## Doug Brott

Syzygy said:


> Not me; I'm still waiting for the real thing from TiVo. (Even if will be on older hardware, which is what Doug Brott repeatedly theorizes, as if he wishes it to be the case.)


 .. nah, it'd be nice if it were on the newer hardware. I just think based on development cycles that it probably isn't. It'd be great if I were wrong on this thought.


----------



## Scott Kocourek

It would be nice to see all of the posts that are done by the first look crew and the testers put right after the first look, then have someone "accidently" delete the rest of the crap and lock the thread. This way when someone comes to look at the First Look they don't need to see all of the unwarranted put-downs and insults.


----------



## Doug Brott

Juppers said:


> Where is a video showing this thing actually performing as it is being claimed?


There will be a video ..


----------



## Doug Brott

Juppers said:


> See previous post. It's all relative. Your ideas of fast have never matched with my ideas of fast. Didn't call you a liar, just adjusted for that.
> 
> I was expecting to take a look at the HR24, you know after clicking on the big Take a look link. Other than some blurry, jittery, poorly lit shots of the unit, which I already knew what it looked like, there was no other first look information in the video. Perhaps they should consider more accurate descriptions for their video links.


That video was a teaser piece .. exactly what you got out of it, yes?


----------



## DogLover

Juppers said:


> See previous post. It's all relative. Your ideas of fast have never matched with my ideas of fast. Didn't call you a liar, just adjusted for that.


Actually, if your units are 10-15 seconds slower than what the First Look has as average, why aren't your really excited with the times listed for the new box?? They would be another order of magnitude faster than your machine?

(For that matter, why aren't your spending more time either trying to 
a) determine why yours are so much slower than average or 
b) trying to get your unit replaced?)


----------



## Sixto

This whole thread is weird.

We have the most significant positive announcement in 3+ years and the reaction is to complain about the past 3+ years.

It seems that you'd want to take that discussion elsewhere, to the hundreds of other threads.

This thread is for the Hx24 receivers, which many have been waiting for and posting about for 3+ years.

Have also added the detailed comparison to the beginning of the thread, but also gun-shy that it will further prompt the posts about the lack of the coffee making ability of the HR24.

The box rocks. We're talking hardware.


----------



## TXD16

LameLefty said:


> I personally disagree with thread-jacking this discussion into your own personal crusade.


Yeah, you wouldn't want a genuine discussion to break out in the middle of a bona fide love-fest, now would you?


----------



## Guest

dave29 said:


> Because they are meant to be used on a SWiM system, to take full advantage of them.


Does the SWiM multiswitch have the wide band tuners built in it?

I think its unfair for people who don't have the SWiM to have to make them still use the BBC's on the HR-24 and H-24.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

I would sincerely appreciate a bit more politeness and a bit less backbiting, thank you.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

CraigerCSM said:


> Does the SWim multiswitch have the wide band tuners built in it?
> 
> I think its unfair for people who don't have the SWim to have to make them still use the BBC's on the HR-24 and H-24.


SWiM is now the default installation. This DVR does have support for legacy dishes through BBCs. Wideband tuners would have added unnecessary expense.


----------



## Sixto

zkc16 said:


> Yeah, you wouldn't want a genuine discussion to break out in the middle of a bona fide love-fest, now would you?


Let's go.

Let's talk hardware.


----------



## Juppers

DogLover said:


> Actually, if your units are 10-15 seconds slower than what the First Look has as average, why aren't your really excited with the times listed for the new box?? They would be another order of magnitude faster than your machine?
> 
> (For that matter, why aren't your spending more time either trying to
> a) determine why yours are so much slower than average or
> b) trying to get your unit replaced?)


My units run the same as every other unit I have seen. I have replaced one of them because of very poor RF performance and the replacement was just as slow, I had one replaced because it was slow, the replacement was just as slow. The ones at my parent's house are just as slow, the one's at my friend's house are just as slow, the one's at my other friend's house are just as slow. I've seen the guide paging speeds they are listing on my H21 unit, never on a HR2x unit of any kind.


----------



## houskamp

Stuart Sweet said:


> SWiM is now the default installation. This DVR does have support for legacy dishes through BBCs. Wideband tuners would have added unnecessary expense.


 And would have used the band needed for deca


----------



## Guest

Sixto said:


> This whole thread is weird.
> 
> We have the most significant positive announcement in 3+ years and the reaction is to complain about the past 3+ years.
> 
> It seems that you'd want to take that discussion elsewhere, to the hundreds of other threads.
> 
> This thread is for the Hx24 receivers, which many have been waiting for and posting about for 3+ years.
> 
> Have also added the detailed comparison to the beginning of the thread, but also gun-shy that it will further prompt the posts about the lack of the coffee making ability of the HR24.
> 
> The box rocks. We're talking hardware.


I think the boxes look cool because they are smaller and faster. I just don't like it if you are not on the SWiM system you still have to use the BBC's. I am worried about the BBC's failing on my HR-22.


----------



## veryoldschool

CraigerCSM said:


> Does the SWiM multiswitch have the wide band tuners built in it?
> 
> I think its unfair for people who don't have the SWiM to have to make them still use the BBC's on the HR-24 and H-24.





Stuart Sweet said:


> SWiM is now the default installation. This DVR does have support for legacy dishes through BBCs. Wideband tuners would have added unnecessary expense.


Since these have DECA built-in, they must use BBCs to convert the 250-750 MHz band [to 1650-2150 MHz], since the DECAs are using 550 MHz.
You can't have DECA and wideband tuners since they both are using the same frequencies/band.


----------



## Sixto

Juppers said:


> My units run the same as every other unit I have seen. I have replaced one of them because of very poor RF performance and the replacement was just as slow, I had one replaced because it was slow, the replacement was just as slow. The ones at my parent's house are just as slow, the one's at my friend's house are just as slow, the one's at my other friend's house are just as slow. I've seen the guide paging speeds they are listing on my H21 unit, never on a HR2x unit of any kind.


We got it. We understand slow.

Have HR24 and HR21-200 hooked to the same TV.

The HR24 blows the doors off the HR21-200.

The HR24 has also made be forget about any fascination with the future TiVo box.

Next.


----------



## Juppers

Sixto said:


> This whole thread is weird.
> 
> We have the most significant positive announcement in 3+ years and the reaction is to complain about the past 3+ years.
> 
> It seems that you'd want to take that discussion elsewhere, to the hundreds of other threads.
> 
> This thread is for the Hx24 receivers, which many have been waiting for and posting about for 3+ years.
> 
> Have also added the detailed comparison to the beginning of the thread, but also gun-shy that it will further prompt the posts about the lack of the coffee making ability of the HR24.
> 
> The box rocks. We're talking hardware.


I sincerely hope so. The only feature change I would hope they included would be getting rid of the 50 series limit. I know I hope it performs as advertised, just a little bitter about having to wait 3+ years.


----------



## veryoldschool

CraigerCSM said:


> I think the boxes look cool because they are smaller and faster. I just don't like it if you are not on the SWiM system you still have to use the BBC's. I am worried about the BBC's failing on my HR-22.


"but" since the BBCs are external, you can change bad ones without changing the receiver. Need any spares? I've got a dozen or so.


----------



## RAD

CraigerCSM said:


> I think the boxes look cool because they are smaller and faster. I just don't like it if you are not on the SWiM system you still have to use the BBC's. I am worried about the BBC's failing on my HR-22.


If you're that worried about it get install a SWiM and then you don't have to worry about it any more.


----------



## Guest

Stuart Sweet said:


> SWiM is now the default installation. This DVR does have support for legacy dishes through BBCs. Wideband tuners would have added unnecessary expense.


I know their isn't any pricing on it right now but the HR-23 has wide band tuners built in and cost's $200. So could one assume that the HR-24 will be $100 and the H-24 be $50? I would by them at those prices even having the BBC's attached to them. We don't have SWiM.


----------



## houskamp

Juppers said:


> I sincerely hope so. The only feature change I would hope they included would be getting rid of the 50 series limit. I know I hope it performs as advertised, just a little bitter about having to wait 3+ years.


 Well, as the chipset is brand new it would have been hard to build 3 years ago..


----------



## Sixto

Juppers said:


> I sincerely hope so. The only feature change I would hope they included would be getting rid of the 50 series limit. I know I hope it performs as advertised, just a little bitter about having to wait 3+ years.


That may happen. That's software.


----------



## Guest

RAD said:


> If you're that worried about it get install a SWiM and then you don't have to worry about it any more.


We have six boxes wouldn't that require a huge rewiring of the house? I asked a DTV installer about the SWiM and he said they have trouble in cold weather.


----------



## wilbur_the_goose

I'm REALLY psyched about the HR24. THANK YOU to the folks that brought us the info.

Here's a question for you - how did the rest of your family react? Were they happy campers?


----------



## DogLover

Juppers said:


> My units run the same as every other unit I have seen. I have replaced one of them because of very poor RF performance and the replacement was just as slow, I had one replaced because it was slow, the replacement was just as slow. The ones at my parent's house are just as slow, the one's at my friend's house are just as slow, the one's at my other friend's house are just as slow. I've seen the guide paging speeds they are listing on my H21 unit, never on a HR2x unit of any kind.


That makes sense. Different units and different installations. That would make one think that it's that slow for everyone. I still wonder why some people are experiencing faster guide paging and other slow guide paging. I consider my HR22 very slow, but sounds like what you've seen is much slower than mine.

There's probably too many veriables between how the machine is connected and how the machine is used to really come up with what might be causing the difference. Too bad, if the differences could be isolated, it might help DirecTV improve those machines.


----------



## webby_s

CraigerCSM said:


> I think the boxes look cool because they are smaller and faster. I just don't like it if you are not on the SWiM system you still have to use the BBC's. I am worried about the BBC's failing on my HR-22.


BBC's are about a dime a dozen, I have about 8 of them in my house somewhere ever since the switch over to SWM, want them? If one fails, use another, but I doubt it will and if it does, as stated before, I have plenty of them.


----------



## sigma1914

CraigerCSM said:


> I think the boxes look cool because they are smaller and faster. I just don't like it if you are not on the SWiM system you still have to use the BBC's. I am worried about the BBC's failing on my HR-22.


BBCs are cheap and easily replaced...why so worried?


----------



## Guest

webby_s said:


> BBC's are about a dime a dozen, I have about 8 of them in my house somewhere ever since the switch over to SWM, want them? If one fails, use another, but I doubt it will and if it does, as stated before, I have plenty of them.


The BBC's are still about $20 bucks right?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

In 3 1/2 years, I've never had a BBC fail, including the ones that shipped with the original HR20, that were improperly packaged.


----------



## houskamp

CraigerCSM said:


> The BBC's are still about $20 bucks right?


 free last I knew..


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Yes they are free, but no longer available through DIRECTV.com. Contact a CSR if you need one, or DBSTalk Club members can put a post in the Buy/Sell/Trade forum if they want to buy used ones from a member here.


----------



## Guest

Stuart Sweet said:


> In 3 1/2 years, I've never had a BBC fail, including the ones that shipped with the original HR20, that were improperly packaged.


Do the BBC's cause pixilation or 771 errors? I wonder if DTV could do a software update to make the guide and channel changing run faster on the HR-22?


----------



## Sixto

Personally, I'm anti-BBC. I don't want anything non-powered in the way. (personal opinion)

SWM has been the future for quite some time now, and also helps with signal strength.


----------



## Guest

Sixto said:


> Personally, I'm anti-BBC. Don't want anything in the way. (personal opinion)
> 
> SWM has been the future for quite some time now, and also helps with signal strength.


Same here I think the BBC's are in the way. Also needing a phone cord. I wish DTV would do away with the phone cord. They don't degree the picture quality do they since they are broken up between two connectors?


----------



## Billzebub

Billzebub said:


> I know you will think I'm flaming you, but I'm not. This is an honest question. If you are so unhappy with Directv why do you stay with them? Surely FIOS or cable are avaliable in your area.
> 
> I don't mean to imply that you don't have the right to complain. It's just that the best way to get your point across is to punish the company in the wallet. If enough people feel like you the company will adapt or die.


I'm sorry if this post gave the wrong impression. I'm very happy with the direction things are going in. Thanks, as always, for the work and time devoted to the first look.

For what it's worth, I received an email from DIRECTV today saying the HR24 will be avaliable in select markets in mid March and nationwide by May, 2010.


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> We have six boxes wouldn't that require a huge rewiring of the house? I asked a DTV installer about the SWiM and he said they have trouble in cold weather.


No. Only the very FIRST generation of SWiM LNBs from one manufacturer had an issue below 0ºF.


----------



## houskamp

and a SWM8 fits right where a old wb68 did


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> Do the BBC's cause pixilation or 771 errors? I wonder if DTV could do a software update to make the guide and channel changing run faster on the HR-22?





CraigerCSM said:


> Same here I think the BBC's are in the way. Also needing a phone cord. I wish DTV would do away with the phone cord. They don't degree the picture quality do they since they are broken up between two connectors?


No and No.


----------



## Billzebub

CraigerCSM said:


> The BBC's are still about $20 bucks right?


I called and DIRECTV sent them to me for free.


----------



## Guest

We are getting a new roof put on soon I wonder how much DTV would charge switching to a SWiM system to a six box setup? We have the protection plan.


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> The BBC's are still about $20 bucks right?


They have NEVER been $20. They have always been free.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

CraigerCSM said:


> Same here I think the BBC's are in the way. Also needing a phone cord. I wish DTV would do away with the phone cord. They don't degree the picture quality do they since they are broken up between two connectors?


If you are networked, either currently through ethernet or in the future through DECA (or HR24 which doesn't need an external DECA) then you don't need a phone cord.


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> We are getting a new roof put on soon I wonder how much DTV would charge switching to a SWiM system to a six box setup? We have the protection plan.


They won't switch you over to a SWiM just because.

These random questions are going waaaaaaaay off topic as well. I suggest you open a new thread for your questions.

:backtotop


----------



## Guest

Stuart Sweet said:


> If you are networked, either currently through ethernet or in the future through DECA (or HR24 which doesn't need an external DECA) then you don't need a phone cord.


Stuart with DTV adding DECA to the HR-24 do you think they will add a web browser to it since it will also have a faster processor?


----------



## Guest

RobertE said:


> They won't switch you over to a SWiM just because.
> 
> These random questions are going waaaaaaaay off topic as well. I suggest you open a new thread for your questions.
> 
> :backtotop


Sorry about that. I thought it was because of the HR-24 still needing the BBC's. So a SWiM is for new installs only? Are they totally doing all SWiM's now and not the old way anymore?


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> Stuart with DTV adding DECA to the HR-24 do you think they will add a web browser to it since it will also have a faster processor?


Unlikely.


----------



## sigma1914

CraigerCSM said:


> Stuart with DTV adding DECA to the HR-24 do you think they will add a web browser to it since it will also have a faster processor?


In the days on Netbooks, 3G & 4G Phones, wifi, etc...why do you want a useless browser on a HR2x? :nono:


----------



## Guest

sigma1914 said:


> In the days on Netbooks, 3G & 4G Phones, wifi, etc...why do you want a useless browser on a HR2x? :nono:


Because then I could have the web on my 55" HDTV. I think it would be neat also having a PIP feature with the web browser when you are on the web the channel you are on would go to PIP mode in a corner and you could move the PIP all around the screen. The only thing I would wonder about is if the web browser crashed while watching TV.


----------



## Nicholsen

Sixto said:


> This whole thread is weird.
> 
> We have the most significant positive announcement in 3+ years and the reaction is to complain about the past 3+ years.
> 
> It seems that you'd want to take that discussion elsewhere, to the hundreds of other threads.
> 
> This thread is for the Hx24 receivers, which many have been waiting for and posting about for 3+ years.
> 
> Have also added the detailed comparison to the beginning of the thread, but also gun-shy that it will further prompt the posts about the lack of the coffee making ability of the HR24.
> 
> The box rocks. We're talking hardware.


I want to thank the moderators for not closing the thread.

I think there is a fair amount of frustration among various posters who have been assured repeatedly by others "who are in the know but can't talk" that the "big fix" is just around the corner, whether it be a faster NR, a much faster HR or a new HD Tivo box.

When the review is nothing but breathless "it's even better than before," that may provoke a volley of fact checking in response.

I have not been able to book Superman to verify the most recent speed claim for the HR24, but I am looking into renting a speeding locomotive.


----------



## Guest

RobertE said:


> Unlikely.


What about RSS news feeds or interactive news channels like what the Moxi units have?


----------



## Doug Brott

CraigerCSM said:


> I think the boxes look cool because they are smaller and faster. I just don't like it if you are not on the SWiM system you still have to use the BBC's. I am worried about the BBC's failing on my HR-22.





RAD said:


> If you're that worried about it get install a SWiM and then you don't have to worry about it any more.


plus there would be an extra cable for more insurance since SWiM only needs one coax rather than the two needed with the WB68


----------



## veryoldschool

Nicholsen said:


> I have not been able to book Superman to verify the most recent speed claim for the HR24, but I am looking into renting a speeding locomotive.


Believe me the next round of complaints will be about key bouncing, since these are so fast that the users will be holding the remote too long.


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> What about RSS news feeds or interactive news channels like what the Moxi units have?


Check out some of the other threads here at DBSTalk.com

Like any of these in the DirecTv extras subforum found here: http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=137


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Nicholsen said:


> I want to thank the moderators for not closing the thread.
> 
> I think there is a fair amount of frustration among various posters who have been assured repeatedly by others "who are in the know but can't talk" that the "big fix" is just around the corner, whether it be a faster NR, a much faster HR or a new HD Tivo box.
> 
> When the review is nothing but breathless "it's even better than before," that may provoke a volley of fact checking in response.
> 
> I have not been able to book Superman to verify the most recent speed claim for the HR24, but I am looking into renting a speeding locomotive.


No one said there's a big fix coming. The testers have simply told us what's inside the box and how it currently operates....nothing more.

Mike


----------



## Doug Brott

CraigerCSM said:


> Sorry about that. I thought it was because of the HR-24 still needing the BBC's. So a SWiM is for new installs only? Are they totally doing all SWiM's now and not the old way anymore?


DIRECTV has pretty much moved to an all SWiM installation model .. there may be exceptions, but a couple of conference calls ago, this is the plan. It's less costly due to less wiring (potentially re-using existing cable TV wiring for new installs).


----------



## Nicholsen

MicroBeta said:


> No one said there's a big fix coming. The testers have simply told us what's inside the box and how it currently operates....nothing more.
> 
> Mike


I think "In the words of one tester,"

"_Makes Superman look slow!!_"

(on page 8, double exclamation points in original) is a bit more than that.


----------



## Guest

Doug Brott said:


> DIRECTV has pretty much moved to an all SWiM installation model .. there may be exceptions, but a couple of conference calls ago, this is the plan. It's less costly due to less wiring (potentially re-using existing cable TV wiring for new installs).


How would they use the existing coax just unhook the exiting incoming cable wire and hook the sattilite wire to the cable wall outlet?


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Nicholsen said:


> I think "In the words of one tester,"
> 
> "_Makes Superman look slow!!_"
> 
> (on page 8, double exclamation points in original) is a bit more than that.


You took that literally? I think most people would have just read that as a simile, or metaphor, I forget which.

Don't tell me your whole problem is with adjectives. Man, you're reading way too much into this. 

It's much faster than the previous HR2X's. It's really that simple and there's no reason to read more into it then that. No need to make a federal case out of it.

Mike


----------



## RobertE

CraigerCSM said:


> How would they use the existing coax just unhook the exiting incoming cable wire and hook the sattilite wire to the cable wall outlet?


They will send the signal over 20lb test monofilament fishing line. 

They have a CLUE as what needs to be done. Leave the hard stuff to them.


----------



## HDJulie

Stuart Sweet said:


> All I can tell you is that this is not the only product DIRECTV has up its sleeve for the near term future. This is an important part of the strategy, though.


I just spent $200 on an HR22 because we needed a receiver for the Man Cave & we decided to get another DVR so we would have more recording space. I've been very frustrated the last few months with the slowness of all of the receivers & especially since these last two NR's so I'm excited about the HR24 while also a little cheesed that I'll have to shell out at least $200 more to get it. But, the desire to no longer want to trash the receiver is greater than the need for the cash, so I'll get one. However, I don't want to spend this money if in another 6 months something *even better* WILL be coming. It wouldn't be an issue for me, if there were an upgrade path. We've spent $$ to get the receivers we have & we've commited to another 2 years of service -- at least let me trade in my old receiver for a discount on the new one. Thank you to the CE members who helped come up with the First Look -- I always appreciate your previews & insight into what's coming. But while I am looking forward to this new receiver, I can understand some of the negative comments because I too feel a tiny bit disappointed that I'm going to have to spend money to get a DVR that works at the speed that it should. I'd be all over the love train if only they'd give me a couple of bucks for the receiver I'll have to return when I get this one.


----------



## bobnielsen

CraigerCSM said:


> How would they use the existing coax just unhook the exiting incoming cable wire and hook the sattilite wire to the cable wall outlet?


They would also need to add or replace splitters plus install a power inserter.


----------



## Halo

Is Frame-Reverse still utterly broken? When you press Pause-Rewind it should jump back one single frame. Instead it jumps forward many frames. Totally unusable.
I had hoped that this was specific to the BCM hardware (large doubt, as an EE it's almost never the hardware) because it is hard to believe that competent engineers could allow such an obvious bug to persist given several years of development time.

Is Slo-Mo still a UI nightmare?

I'm happy to hear about the speed increase.


----------



## Sixto

We're now at 300+ posts today, and can't say I've seen one post yet where anyone has made a strong compelling argument for a hardware enhancement that's missing from the HR24.

My only expectation was that the hardware would have a beefed up processor. It seems to have an NXP chip with at least 730 DMIPS. Would have preferred the latest Broadcom, with 1000+ DMIPS, but since the box already flies then maybe this was a good cost conscious decision.

The Coax Networking is also a great enhancement. Every new install can now easily get network connected if they want.

The QuickSet enhancement also works well. You enter the model of TV or AV equipment and two seconds later you're done. Gone are the days of punching in all the codes.

That's it, gave me the performance I wanted and expected.

Would I have liked a 1TB drive. Sure, but I'd guess that a 1TB drive would have pushed the price up significantly. I'd guess that the HR24 will be the same $199. Just a guess. And 100 HD hours is probably fine for most households. And e-SATA can be added in minutes.

Would I have liked an extra tuner or 2. Sure, but no way their base DVR would have that added expense. That just doesn't make sense in this economy. Maybe for a future Pro model or the HMC.

That's it. The HR24 seemed to be exactly what I would have expected.


----------



## Surveyor40

Great first look, thank you everyone. Only increases my desire to have one


----------



## Doug Brott

Here's a simple video I just put together:





The production quality is bad, but it should give you a general idea of what we're talking about.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Thanks for putting that together Doug.


----------



## veryoldschool

^ keep your day job :lol:


----------



## Scott Kocourek

That's awesome.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

Great video Doug.


----------



## pwalker

Very excited that a new better DVR is right around the corner. I have a couple of noisy HR20's that need to be replaced. Thank you for all the great info, pictures, and videos!

I am disappointed that OTA is not a feature in the new receivers. Not really surprised this was left off however since it hasn't been offered for a while. Will we be able to add this to the HR24's with an extra module? I still like watching my locals through OTA and it comes in handy during bad weather when I can't receive a signal through the satellite.


----------



## Earl Bonovich

Doug Brott said:


> Here's a simple video I just put together:
> 
> The production quality is bad, but it should give you a general idea of what we're talking about.


I only have one comment...

You have a very strange selection of recordings...


----------



## hdtvfan0001

pwalker said:


> Very excited that a new better DVR is right around the corner. I have a couple of noisy HR20's that need to be replaced. Thank you for all the great info, pictures, and videos!
> 
> I am disappointed that OTA is not a feature in the new receivers. Not really surprised this was left off however since it hasn't been offered for a while. Will we be able to add this to the HR24's with an extra module? I still like watching my locals through OTA and it comes in handy during bad weather when I can't receive a signal through the satellite.


They will work in conjunction with the AM21....


----------



## Juppers

Doug Brott said:


> Here's a simple video I just put together:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The production quality is bad, but it should give you a general idea of what we're talking about.


Thanks for an actual look. Would love to see paging up and down and changing channels by inputing numbers. Also would love to see how it performs as it is recording a HD program or 2.


----------



## compnurd

it is great to see they finally got the speed right but it sucks we will all get ripped of our money again


----------



## LameLefty

Juppers said:


> Thanks for an actual look. Would love to see paging up and down and changing channels by inputing numbers. Also would love to see how it performs as it is recording a HD program or 2.


It makes no difference whether it's recording one program or two, serving up MRV or watching via MRV over the network. In fact, I've had mine recording two program, watching MRV from another box in the house, and serving up a program via MRV and I couldn't tell the slightest bit of difference in performance - it's still fast. It's faster than the H24. We're not kidding when we say people will be happy with these.


----------



## Scott B.

Doug,
How long have you been breaking it in? I noticed in your list that there was recordings from June.


----------



## cartrivision

Since the AM21 doesn't match the style and form factor of the HR24, will there be an AM24 to go with the HR24?


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter

Great job everyone whose contributed to the first look!! Sucks how this thread has taken a turn at times to the negative side.

Great to see a newer chip, internal DECA Adapter, Larger hard drive here! Thats about all you can ask for hardware wise.
Everything else I could possibly think of wanting in a box would be software related imo. Web browsing would be freaking sweet but I'd rather them focus on other stuff first thats been on the list for some time now.

This chip support PIP? I know its unlikely they add it to the software though it would be a huge plus in my book if they ended up getting around to it since now they have a faster chip to handle all the things the software is currently asking of it.
*Maybe a chip able to handle something higher than 1080p/24 like 1080p/60... not on top of list by any means but seems to be something you hear gripped about. All in all i see as long as the latest chip is used and a bigger HD then it comes to software and what they choose to do with it.
Once agian great job guys!!


----------



## hdtvfan0001

cartrivision said:


> Since the AM21 doesn't match the style and form factor of the HR24, will there be an AM24 to go with the HR24?


Nope. Only a very small % of users use OTA, and the x24 units fit just fine on top of the AM21.


----------



## Nicholsen

MicroBeta said:


> You took that literally? I think most people would have just read that as a simile, or metaphor, I forget which.
> 
> Don't tell me your whole problem is with adjectives. Man, you're reading way too much into this.
> 
> It's much faster than the previous HR2X's. It's really that simple and there's no reason to read more into it then that. No need to make a federal case out of it.
> 
> Mike


I am pretty sure no HR2x is really as fast as Superman. :lol:

No need to actually test. Although it would be fun. What I really want to know is can it stop a speeding bullet. I often consider (please wait...) taking mine out to the range and (please wait...) finding out. :hurah:

How about this for "final words" from one user who did not field test a "free" HR24:

One user said, "My HR21 is as slow as molasses on a cold day!! But the HR24 is probably fast enough to be considered more than adequate by most!! Some people (who may have gotten it got free) even say its really fast, like Superman fast!! You can now change channels six tenths of second faster than an HR24!! Just think of the time you will save!!"

Just $XXX plus a new two year commitment to find out for yourself. Plus you can pay an extra $6 a month for your old HR21 while you watch the 30-200 hours of content now stuck on its hard drive. What a deal!!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Nicholsen said:


> How about this for "final words" from one user who did not field test a "free" HR24


So you're saying that the tester are being dishonest because they have to in order to get free stuff. Well the heck with you. Your crap isn't worth responding to.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Doug Brott said:


> Here's a simple video I just put together:
> 
> The production quality is bad, but it should give you a general idea of what we're talking about.


*THREE COMMENTS​*
*1.* Doug's HR23-700 is faster than mine!
*2.* Compared to my HR23-700, the HR24-500 is Superman fast... or the Flash, or Quicksilver, Impulse, Max Mercury, or Daphne fast...
*3.* If Doug was on Survivor, I'd actually watch it!

More comments to come later...

~Alan


----------



## TXD16

Sixto said:


> We're now at 300+ posts today, and can't say I've seen one post yet where anyone has made a strong compelling argument for a hardware enhancement that's missing from the HR24.


Not sure whether it's entirely software, entirely hardware, or a combination of both, but the lack of full DLNA compliance constitutes is a major omission with the current HR2x products, especially for a company that touts itself as a Promoter Member of the DLNA Alliance.


----------



## LameLefty

Nicholsen said:


> I am pretty sure no HR2x is really as fast as Superman. :lol:
> 
> No need to actually test. Although it would be fun. What I really want to know is can it stop a speeding bullet. I often consider (please wait...) taking mine out to the range and (please wait...) finding out. :hurah:
> 
> How about this for "final words" from one user who did not field test a "free" HR24:
> 
> One user said, "My HR21 is as slow as molasses on a cold day!! But the HR24 is probably fast enough to be considered more than adequate by most!! Some people (who may have gotten it got free) even say its really fast, like Superman fast!! You can now change channels six tenths of second faster than an HR24!! Just think of the time you will save!!"
> 
> Just $XXX plus a new two year commitment to find out for yourself. Plus you can pay an extra $6 a month for your old HR21 while you watch the 30-200 hours of content now stuck on its hard drive. What a deal!!


Let me just say this: I've spent WAY more than than the cost of a receiver over the last couple years to test equipment. New cabling (several times), new connectors, new splitters, a second SWM8 (bought from eBay so I can run two of them at a time in parallel), a TV for an additional location, etc., not to mention the time, effort and aggravation.

Then we write up our impressions afterwards to get . . . this kind of reception. :nono2:


----------



## mikeny

Of course, if the HR24 did substantial things that the other DirecTV HD DVRs can't do then there would be a group clamoring that it's not fair that existing units can't do it and that they would be forced to upgrade to take advantage of the new stuff.


----------



## cartrivision

Scott B. said:


> Doug,
> How long have you been breaking it in? I noticed in your list that there was recordings from June.


If you look closely, you'll see it was an MRV playlist showing recordings from other DVRs.


----------



## bonscott87

Nicholsen said:


> Just $XXX plus a new two year commitment to find out for yourself. Plus you can pay an extra $6 a month for your old HR21 while you watch the 30-200 hours of content now stuck on its hard drive. What a deal!!


So wait a couple months and see what the general public thinks about it then. What a concept. :hurah:

In any case would I pay to upgrade a current HR20-23 to the HR24? No, why would I if what I have functions. But this next gen will greatly benefit any new users and as replacements for current. Things continue to get added to the receiver line.

HR20 - The original, has OTA tuners built in
HR21 - HR20 with no OTA tuners
HR22 - HR21 with larger hard drive
HR23 - HR22 with BBC's built in
And now we have the HR24 - HR23 with DECA built in and new chips making it faster

Not sure what people want. At no point in any of these newer receivers would I ever pay to upgrade a perfectly good unit I have now, even if older. If what I have now doesn't work then I would have called yesterday to just get it replaced. I'm sure within a year there will probably be an HR25 that will be another advancement of something unless there will be an entire receiver redesign.

The next "big thing" will be the home media server. Anything thinking there will be big changes in the regular receiver line any time soon is fooling themselves and not paying attention to what DirecTV is doing.


----------



## delete2end

good write up guys but once again Direct TV screws the customers by not giving them what they want... I guess these guys just dont act upon their own research.


----------



## Alan Gordon

I've repeatedly stated that I understand some of the frustration and disappointment on this thread...

... but some posts make me wonder... has Swanni gotten a DBSTalk.com account?!  :lol: 

~Alan


----------



## Sixto

delete2end said:


> good write up guys but once again Direct TV screws the customers by not giving them what they want... I guess these guys just dont act upon their own research.


and that significant compelling research-discovered missing hardware feature would be?


----------



## houskamp

Sixto said:


> and that significant compelling research-discovered missing hardware feature would be?


 Or he's just not in the majority..


----------



## sp44

I liked it better when I could sell an old box on some website and then upgrade to the newer model. I would upgrade my slow ass HR21 to one of these but not for $200. I wish slowness was a defect so I could get a replacement.


----------



## Nicholsen

MicroBeta said:


> So you're saying that the tester are being dishonest because they have to in order to get free stuff. Well the heck with you. Your crap isn't worth responding to.


I think you doth protest too much.


----------



## inkahauts

Nicholsen said:


> I think you doth protest too much.


I doth think you make to many illogical and inaccurate statements, especially when the fact we all know you have no first hand knowledge of the workings of the HX24's is taken into account.......


----------



## Nicholsen

Just checking inkahauts, did you get a "free" HR24 to test?


----------



## Nicholsen

inkahauts said:


> I doth think you make to many illogical and inaccurate statements, especially when the fact we all know you have no first hand knowledge of the workings of the HX24's is taken into account.......


Let me help you out:

*In American English, the phrase "the lady doth protest too much" definitely indicates that you think the subject's ardent denial of a proposition is meant to cover up its embarrassing truth.* For example, if you offered someone a beer and they said "No thanks. I absolutely hate beer. Never touch the stuff, ever. I can't even imagine ever wanting to drink a single drop of that filthy, mind-numbling liquid. It's poison to me. I absolutely do not want a beer," you might well think that they were trying hard to restrain themselves from taking it.

In Hamlet, queen Gertrude is watching a play in which a faithful widow refuses to marry too soon after her husband's death. Hamlet arranged this as a veiled accusation, because she married his paternal uncle just after his father died... so quickly that, as Hamlet quipped, the food at the wedding banquet could have been leftovers from when they had the funeral. Gertrude says that the widow is protesting her suitor's advances too much, evidently because she's ashamed that she failed to do so.

If we take Gertrude at face value, this comment means just the opposite of the current form. She says it not because she disbelieves the widow, but because the widow's sincere protests make Gertrude feel inferior. One way to reconcile things is to assume that Gertrude does not believe the widow, and thinks that the widow, like her, really does want to marry. Then her comment means what we mean by it today, that the subject is being hypocritical.

http://everything2.com/title/The+lady+doth+protest+too+much%2C+methinks


----------



## Doug Brott

Scott B. said:


> Doug,
> How long have you been breaking it in? I noticed in your list that there was recordings from June.


MRV ..


----------



## Doug Brott

Alan Gordon said:


> *3.* If Doug was on Survivor, I'd actually watch it!


I've tried, but apparently they don't want me .. :lol:


----------



## Alan Gordon

Doug Brott said:


> I've tried, but apparently they don't want me .. :lol:


Apparently they don't want my viewership then... 

... though bringing Colleen Haskell heart back might make me watch! 

*NOTE:* Doug's video actually brought up several questions I want to ask our testers (which hopefully will allow there to be SOME posts about the HR24's use, and not about disappointments), but with the site down, I didn't bother to get them together tonight. I'll try and ask them tomorrow (along with a funny story involving Doug's video). 

~Alan


----------



## xtc

mhayes70 said:


> Ah.... I get it. You really just want the Tivo back to Directv.


not necessarily. I just know that when TiVo comes out with something, it's usually something to write about. They are revolutionary in the DVR industry and have many more features than DirecTV DVRs do. A lot of people on this forum may not be fans of TiVos because their only experience with a TiVo was the old DirecTiVos and they aren't familiar of what the new standalone TiVos have been doing since those ancient days. Bottom line is that DirecTV has had the same machine and have recycled it over and over every year and call it their new model when in reality its the same box as before with very few relevant adjustments. And if because of TiVo's reputation, I am expecting a lot more bells and whistles if they come out with a new DVR for DirecTV. Not something like remote that saves you 2 minutes in programming it where you will never think about that ever again.


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> For the vast majority of users, my opinions are more likely to be shared than are your (uninformed) opinions. That works for me.


Glad you feel this way. Britney Spears sold more albums than Bob Dylan. You're Britney Spears.


----------



## xtc

Billzebub said:


> I know you will think I'm flaming you, but I'm not. This is an honest question. If you are so unhappy with Directv why do you stay with them? Surely FIOS or cable are avaliable in your area.
> 
> I don't mean to imply that you don't have the right to complain. It's just that the best way to get your point across is to punish the company in the wallet. If enough people feel like you the company will adapt or die.


This is completely irrelevant. When did i say i am unhappy with DirecTV? I just find it silly that grown-ups (I assume that most of you people are adults) are jumping up and down like little kids over a supposed new model that is pretty much the same as every model before it. The excitement is unjustified in my opinion and people are making this release to be way more than it should. There is nothing revolutionary about this release, the only thing this release gives you is a prettier box and speeds that have been corrected (finally) since the original DVR release many years ago. Sorry, that just doesn't excite me.


----------



## xtc

Juppers said:


> Where is a video showing this thing actually performing as it is being claimed? I can't believe I watched that worthless student film project that provided no useful information about the HR24.


:lol:


----------



## xtc

Syzygy said:


> Everyone else, it seems, is kicking and stomping *xtc* for being too negative. Here's a switch: In one respect, at least, the above post isn't negative enough for my taste. What I mean is, I'd change "they have moved from faulty DVRs to standard" to *"they have moved from slow and faulty DVRs to reasonably quick and still faulty."* The horde of bugs and design deficiencies remains. Most of you have seen at least one of my lists of issues; I'm weary of listing the same unchanging set of problems (as you may be weary of reading about them ).
> 
> Not me; I'm still waiting for the real thing from TiVo.


Excellent post.


----------



## xtc

inazsully said:


> As much as I appreciate the increase in operating speed I feel a little less than wowed. After 4 years and the advent of meg 4 and HDMI 1.4 and all the hoopla about 3D I would have expected a more substantial offering for the new Flagship. I can only compare it to Dish Networks 722 HD DVR which has been out for a couple of years now. It has a 500GB hard drive and three tuners so you can record two on air channels and an off air channel at the same time. Don't get me wrong, I like the 24 but I had hoped for 1TB hard drive and the inclusion of the third tuner, like the original HR20 had. Other than the speed increase the 24 seems like a lateral move to me. Better than nothing but.....


pretty much sums up how i feel too. Nothing to get excited about. DirecTV has been extremely lazy in their so-called "new" hardware releases as well as fixing the virtually unlimited software bugs they have. They barely fix .00001% of the problems people complain about. I mean it has to be a completely catastrophe for them to even look at an issue.


----------



## xtc

LameLefty said:


> When you get one yourself, or see one in a store demo, I expect some apologies.


:lol: yeeeahh....good luck with that! :lol:


----------



## ZPrime

It figures that just after I jump in and sign up for dtv this is announced. 
Guess we are waiting 2 years...


----------



## xtc

Canis Lupus said:


> As an H24 and HR24 tester, and the creator of the First Look video, I've got to honestly say reading this thread has been a big disappointment.
> 
> DBSTalk is a community of users who, over time and a lot of hard work, has developed relationships with and between providers of products and services, and the end users of those products and services, including enthusiasts who've had opportunities to participate in trials of products (provided by the manufacturers) for the purposes of testing and reporting on findings through the "First Look" communications.
> 
> Every single participant who touches any aspect of these relationships and the opportunities it affords, does so with a passion and enthusiasm that is not only not compensated, but also at times difficult - and even upsetting to family life (during at home testing for example when you're trying to get stuff to work properly).
> 
> I tested the H24 and HR24 and they are faster than previous DVRs and H-series in virtually every way. But I'm also perfectly happy with my other equipment. This is TV watching and TV recording - not some critical pieces of equipment that might end life as we know it if it's not "fast" or "new" or "advanced" enough.
> 
> Myself, Stuart and so many others here do this because we're enthusiasts and are dedicated to making the DirecTV experience better for everyone else. Moreover, we do this because we care about the DBSTalk community and the relationships we've forged here.
> 
> It's too bad (as it is in too many threads here on DBSTalk), that some users would rather just take a big dump on other users' efforts.


This is not only directed towards you, but also the others who have b!tched about this file not being universally loved : I can only speak for myself, but it seems like you are completely missing the point on people's opinion on this. The people seem to understand the work it took to make a nice looking document, but what is disappointing is the text involved within the document because it sounds like a child who got a new toy reviewed it. And it's not a well-written constructive review. The tone of the review sounds like the item being talked about is the single greatest invention since sliced bread, while in reality its pretty much the same old box DirecTV has been releasing since the original HR20 years back except they correct their atrocious speed. Had there been a constructive review instead of a child-like review along with the very nice layout, it would have been respected much more, I guarantee you. If the point of this little project of yours was not to be constructive and to be overly biased toward's DirecTV's side, then maybe you should have somehow pointed that out before you released this pdf file, and then people would understand what they were getting into, if you did point that out, the many people including myself missed it. I think since you have the machine at your disposal while no one else does, the most useful thing you could do is give a constructive review, not create a an advertisement or pamphlet. Let the DirecTV PR people handle that. I think if you teamed the designer of this PDF file with constructive reviewers instead whoever was jumping up and down while writing it, you would have yourself something close to a universally respected project. I appreciate the time that the you took to make it, and I hope you can appreciate some constructive criticism. I respect people who can take criticism a lot more than people like LameLefty and MicroBeta who obviously can't and cry like babies if they are not sucked up to after releasing this. I feel if you can't have thick skin or take criticism or the good with the bad, then you are in wrong field. When you release something to the public like this, you can't expect everyone to love it. If you can't see what people are trying to point out and continue to act like babies, you're just making yourself look bad, however if you try to understand other people's opinion and take something from it and try to improve next time, then maybe your next project will be vastly improved and you will be respected more...Or you can just keep releasing stuff just so you can have people suck up to you no matter what you release. It's up to you. But as far as I know, this isn't a DirecTV Fanboy site. This forum talks about the good and the bad side of DBS companies. If you're gonna take the good, then you should be able to take the bad and build off of everything for next time. That's what good companies and creative people in general do.


----------



## xtc

scottandregan said:


> It would be nice to see all of the posts that are done by the first look crew and the testers put right after the first look, then have someone "accidently" delete the rest of the crap and lock the thread. This way when someone comes to look at the First Look they don't need to see all of the unwarranted put-downs and insults.


 right, lets just have everybody suck to everyone and not have any kind of constructive criticism, cause that's what makes for good forum chat. If I wanted to have people just rave about everything DirecTV does, i would just go to DirecTV.com and watch and read their advertisements all day.


----------



## xtc

Sixto said:


> We have the most significant positive announcement in 3+ years


what??? i hope you are joking. what is so positive about it? I read it and immediately though : here we go again, same thing as every other release before it, as usual. Whoop ti doo!

Man it amazes me how some people have such low standards. I can only imagine what your reactions would be if they actually ever release something worth while. If we ever get the new DirecTiVo's i think some of you would have heart attacks from excitement.


----------



## xtc

zkc16 said:


> Yeah, you wouldn't want a genuine discussion to break out in the middle of a bona fide love-fest, now would you?


Awesome, just plain awesome. Thanks for telling it like it is, even though you will get flamed for it like i did. Takes balls. Good for you.:biggthump


----------



## xtc

mikeny said:


> Of course, if the HR24 did substantial things that the other DirecTV HD DVRs can't do then there would be a group clamoring that it's not fair that existing units can't do it and that they would be forced to upgrade to take advantage of the new stuff.


but you admit that it doesn't so it's a moot point


----------



## Game Fan

To the First Look Gang: GREAT JOB!!! My most sincere thanks for your efforts. Please, please, please don't let all the negativity get you down. Your supporters far outweigh your detractors.


----------



## tcusta00

Yes, gentlemen, very nice work on the First Look! I appreciate your efforts to produce something so informative and professional-looking on a volunteer basis.


----------



## David MacLeod

tcusta00 said:


> Yes, gentlemen, very nice work on the First Look! I appreciate your efforts to produce something so informative and professional-looking on a volunteer basis.


agreed. some people here should be ashamed of themselves.


----------



## Doug Brott

It's good to see that some appreciation ..


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter

xtc said:


> not necessarily. I just know that when TiVo comes out with something, it's usually something to write about. They are revolutionary in the DVR industry and have many more features than DirecTV DVRs do. A lot of people on this forum may not be fans of TiVos because their only experience with a TiVo was the old DirecTiVos and they aren't familiar of what the new standalone TiVos have been doing since those ancient days. Bottom line is that DirecTV has had the same machine and have recycled it over and over every year and call it their new model when in reality its the same box as before with very few relevant adjustments. And if because of TiVo's reputation, I am expecting a lot more bells and whistles if they come out with a new DVR for DirecTV. Not something like remote that saves you 2 minutes in programming it where you will never think about that ever again.


OK enough of this crap. We all get you dont think the new box is worth anything. Good to know your opinion. It isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread for sure but deff is a step in the right direction for DirecTV's future.
Minus them putting a 1TB harddrive in there and say something that could handle 20turners WTF would you expect them to include in this box???
It has a new recent chip, bigger hard drive, integrated DECA adapter. What else would you want? 
EVERYTHING else I can possibly think of that you would want included would be completely software related. Untill the box is out they wont start tweaking features on that one specifically if they choose to even go the route of trying to do the programing on that one different from the current line of HR's.

Once again good job on the first look guys! It isn't a review like some people treat it as such and they just need to understand the difference b/w a first look and review.


----------



## raott

David MacLeod said:


> agreed. some people here should be ashamed of themselves.


Why? For expecting a first look to be an objective critique rather than reading like a marketing piece?

I've posted on the same issue before when the year in "review" came out last year and got flamed for it. I'm not sure why it is so hard to understand that most people would rather see objective information, with plusses and minuses, rather than documents that read like one sided marketing pieces I'd find at a trade show booth.


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter

raott said:


> Why? For expecting a first look to be an objective critique rather than reading like a marketing piece?
> 
> I've posted on the same issue before when the year in "review" came out last year and got flamed for it. I'm not sure why it is so hard to understand that most people would rather see objective information, with plusses and minuses, rather than documents that read like one sided marketing pieces I'd find at a trade show booth.


ITS a FIRST LOOK not a full out Review. Know the difference. Its supposed to be very general overall so any kind of detail they decide to throw in there you should be happy with to begin with. It's not ment to critic the hardware through and through like a review is, but just give the general idea of whats coming.


----------



## tcusta00

Yes, gentlemen, very nice work on the First Look! I appreciate your efforts to produce something so informative and professional-looking on a *volunteer* basis.

:nono2:


----------



## raott

Sgt. Slaughter said:


> ITS a FIRST LOOK not a full out Review. Know the difference. Its supposed to be very general overall so any kind of detail they decide to throw in there you should be happy with to begin with. It's not ment to critic the hardware through and through like a review is, but just give the general idea of whats coming.


Just about every enthusiast site I've ever been to has similar "first looks" where they get their hands on a piece of upcoming hardware. On those "first looks" both the plusses and minuses are pointed out, whether it is a full blown review or not.

That doesn't happen here, so don't take offense when people see it as a one sided marketing piece for D*.


----------



## Syzygy

mikeny said:


> Of course, if the HR24 did substantial things that the other DirecTV HD DVRs can't do then there would be a group clamoring that it's not fair that existing units can't do it and that they would be forced to upgrade to take advantage of the new stuff.


It's not fair that I'm stuck with a slow "existing unit."


bonscott87 said:


> In any case would I pay to upgrade a current HR20-23 to the HR24? No, why would I if what I have functions.


What I have does not function well enough. But lack of speed is only half the problem.


sp44 said:


> I liked it better when I could sell an old box on some website and then upgrade to the newer model. I would upgrade my slow ass HR21 to one of these but not for $200. I wish slowness was a defect so I could get a replacement.


Slowness *is* a defect.


----------



## ffemtreed

I am grateful for these first look threads, In my case I would have passed at getting one of these because I assumed they didn't have the optical audio. I am glad threads like this made me realize I was wrong and now I am anticipating getting one of these for my main TV room. 

My two biggest complaints about the HR DVR's are the speed and the guide style. This new box solves problem #1


----------



## say-what

Doug Brott said:


> Here's a simple video I just put together:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The production quality is bad, but it should give you a general idea of what we're talking about.


Thanks Doug. While the HR24's GUI is faster, your HR23 performs much like mine, which is also within acceptable limits in my opinion. I really don't understand the preoccupation of some with wanting to scroll through the guide at lightning speed - If I want to jump more than a page to check listings, I enter the channel number to get where I want, I don't try to scroll and this is a habit I developed with TIVO. I can sort of understand with long playlists, but really, you still need to be able to read what you're scrolling through.

Anyway, thanks and I am looking forward to being able to add an HR24 to my system.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

Doug Brott said:


> Here's a simple video I just put together:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The production quality is bad, but it should give you a general idea of what we're talking about.


Holy speed Batman! :eek2:

Great video, could you give us an example of channel change speed as well from the HR24?


----------



## PackCat

_Sometimes, it is a little difficult to filter through the clutter of 'pat on the backs', enthusiasm, and complaints to get to the meat of the matter..._

So, (eventually) when I trade in my HR23-500 for a HR24-500...
The net effect is: the processor is a little faster, and I get an extra 1080P blue light instead of both the 1080I and 720P lit up at the same time? and I lose an Ethernet port and do not need the 2 HD-adaptor cables? And it only takes 10 seconds to change channels instead of 15-20?

Does that pretty much sum it up for the majority of users?
I think the majority of users would get more turned-on if they announced there was a purpose for the USB connections, or added built-in WiFi to the receivers. The idea is to become less bundled from wires, not add more wires throughout the home.
At least TIVO lets you add a wireless USB adaptor instead of having a 50 ft CAT-5 cable running through the middle of your kitchen and living room.


----------



## houskamp

TheRatPatrol said:


> Holy speed Batman! :eek2:
> 
> Great video, could you give us an example of channel change speed as well from the HR24?


 Channel change isn't as drastic.. I belive the switching and sync times (for mpg4) take most of the time and there's no real way to fix that..

my take on speed:
hr24

hr20

hr21


----------



## LameLefty

PackCat said:


> I think the majority of users would get more turned-on if they announced there was a purpose for the USB connections, or added built-in WiFi to the receivers. The idea is to become less bundled from wires, not add more wires throughout the home.
> At least TIVO lets you add a wireless USB adaptor instead of having a 50 ft CAT-5 cable running through the middle of your kitchen and living room.


DECA. You don't need anything but the power cord, a single run of coax, and an HDMI cable to your TV or AV receiver, if you wanna go minimalist.  With DECA, you don't need a separate ethernet cable at all.


----------



## mikeny

say-what said:


> I really don't understand the preoccupation of some with wanting to scroll through the guide at lightning speed - If I want to jump more than a page to check listings, I enter the channel number to get where I want, I don't try to scroll and this is a habit I developed with TIVO. I can sort of understand with long playlists, but really, you still need to be able to read what you're scrolling through.


I usually manually enter it also but there are times when you might want to browse through the guide until something catches your eye.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

PackCat said:


> or added built-in WiFi to the receivers. The idea is to become less bundled from wires, not add more wires throughout the home.
> At least TIVO lets you add a wireless USB adaptor instead of having a 50 ft CAT-5 cable running through the middle of your kitchen and living room.


This has built in DECA which means you can run internet and satellite signals over one coax cable, no need to run Cat 5 everywhere.

The only one thing I wish the new receiver had was PIP, but we've been down that road before, so I won't discuss that here again.


----------



## Sixto

xtc said:


> what??? i hope you are joking. what is so positive about it? I read it and immediately though : here we go again, same thing as every other release before it, as usual. Whoop ti doo!
> 
> Man it amazes me how some people have such low standards. I can only imagine what your reactions would be if they actually ever release something worth while. If we ever get the new DirecTiVo's i think some of you would have heart attacks from excitement.


I was not joking.

And I'll repeat what I said previously, with an update, it's now 400+ posts.



Sixto said:


> We're now at 300+ posts today, and can't say I've seen one post yet where anyone has made a strong compelling argument for a hardware enhancement that's missing from the HR24.
> 
> My only expectation was that the hardware would have a beefed up processor. It seems to have an NXP chip with at least 730 DMIPS. Would have preferred the latest Broadcom, with 1000+ DMIPS, but since the box already flies then maybe this was a good cost conscious decision.
> 
> The Coax Networking is also a great enhancement. Every new install can now easily get network connected if they want.
> 
> The QuickSet enhancement also works well. You enter the model of TV or AV equipment and two seconds later you're done. Gone are the days of punching in all the codes.
> 
> That's it, gave me the performance I wanted and expected.
> 
> Would I have liked a 1TB drive. Sure, but I'd guess that a 1TB drive would have pushed the price up significantly. I'd guess that the HR24 will be the same $199. Just a guess. And 100 HD hours is probably fine for most households. And e-SATA can be added in minutes.
> 
> Would I have liked an extra tuner or 2. Sure, but no way their base DVR would have that added expense. That just doesn't make sense in this economy. Maybe for a future Pro model or the HMC.
> 
> That's it. The HR24 seemed to be exactly what I would have expected.


----------



## Davenlr

Game Fan said:


> To the First Look Gang: GREAT JOB!!! My most sincere thanks for your efforts. Please, please, please don't let all the negativity get you down. Your supporters far outweigh your detractors.


What negativity? Two people that say the same thing over and over and over and over? That doesnt get me down. I dont watch Fox News either except for the clips on the Daily Show exposing how "Fair and Balanced" they are.
[SARCASM]
Besides, I cant talk bad about DirecTv. When I got my H24 to test, I had line of site issues with a tree. They bought me a new house in the country so I could continue testing. Love the view of the deer licking the Slimline at night. [/SARCASM]


----------



## lparsons21

Whew! This is a big thread, but I read all of it.

Thanks for the work on the first look at these new models. If I were still with D* and had a way to get one, I'd be thrilled to see one that actually responds properly to the remote and gives some speed of operation.

But I'd be really more irritated knowing that my HR21 was a POS and that it would cost me to fix what I considered a poor HDDVR.

This almost makes me consider coming back to D*, but I would have to have 2 HDDVRs w/one AM21 to get the functionality I get with one from E*. That functionality being 4 recordings at once.


----------



## Doug Brott

PackCat said:


> _Sometimes, it is a little difficult to filter through the clutter of 'pat on the backs', enthusiasm, and complaints to get to the meat of the matter..._
> 
> So, (eventually) when I trade in my HR23-500 for a HR24-500...
> The net effect is: the processor is a little faster, and I get an extra 1080P blue light instead of both the 1080I and 720P lit up at the same time? and I lose an Ethernet port and do not need the 2 HD-adaptor cables? And it only takes 10 seconds to change channels instead of 15-20?
> 
> Does that pretty much sum it up for the majority of users?
> I think the majority of users would get more turned-on if they announced there was a purpose for the USB connections, or added built-in WiFi to the receivers. The idea is to become less bundled from wires, not add more wires throughout the home.
> At least TIVO lets you add a wireless USB adaptor instead of having a 50 ft CAT-5 cable running through the middle of your kitchen and living room.


Don't forget the 500GB HDD .. This will give you ~100 hours of MPEG-4 HD which should satisfy most folks. Some of the folks that frequent DBSTalk may prefer more storage though. You can use the eSATA port to add a larger HDD.

As for Ethernet .. On the surface, there are two "wireless" options. The main option is technically wired (not wireless), but is combined with the satellite signal on the coax line entering your receiver. We refer to this as DECA (DIRECTV Ethernet over Coax Adapter), but there really is no adapter on the HR24. It's all managed inside the box. The technology is MoCA, but the frequencies that DIRECTV use are different than the MoCA spec which is what Cable TV uses. In order to differentiate the two technologies, we simply refer to it as DECA here.

An alternative, that may or may not work for MultiRoom Viewing is a wireless Ethernet bridge. This device will convert your Ethernet port on the back of your receiver into a wireless signal that can reach the rest of your house. It's not USB, but it works in much the same way as your USB mention would work.

Cheers.


----------



## Sixto

Correct, while a certain leading thread poster has yet to post any credible significant compelling missing hardware enhancement.

You want facts, read post#7.

You want net ...

HR24 vs HR23: Fast, Coax Networking, Easy Setup, Cooler Design / More Efficient Packaging.

All still with the ability to expand with e-SATA.

Perfect significant upgrade.


----------



## Davenlr

PackCat said:


> _Sometimes, it is a little difficult to filter through the clutter of 'pat on the backs', enthusiasm, and complaints to get to the meat of the matter..._
> 
> So, (eventually) when I trade in my HR23-500 for a HR24-500...
> 
> I think the majority of users would get more turned-on if they announced there was a purpose for the USB connections,
> 
> * AM21 OTA tuner *
> 
> or added built-in WiFi to the receivers. The idea is to become less bundled from wires, not add more wires throughout the home.
> 
> * One coax, no network wires needed. Thats less wires using my math *
> 
> At least TIVO lets you add a wireless USB adaptor instead of having a 50 ft CAT-5 cable running through the middle of your kitchen and living room.
> 
> * You can add a wireless adapter to ANY of the old or new H/HR boxes except the H20 now *


Hope that helps.


----------



## BattleScott

Doug Brott said:


> Don't forget the 500GB HDD .. This will give you ~100 hours of MPEG-4 HD which should satisfy most folks. Some of the folks that frequent DBSTalk may prefer more storage though. You can use the eSATA port to add a larger HDD.


Didn't the 500GB drive start in the HR22s?


----------



## Doug Brott

BattleScott said:


> Didn't the 500GB drive start in the HR22s?


Absolutely, but it's still there in the HR24. If you want to leave it out of the comparison, fine. But it's a salient point. Folks wanna know how much they can store.


----------



## BattleScott

Doug Brott said:


> Absolutely, but it's still there in the HR24. If you want to leave it out of the comparison, fine. But it's a salient point. Folks wanna know how much they can store.


True, definitely a good feature. It just seemed like it was stated as a benefit over the HR23 in that post and I thought it was added beginning with the HR22s.


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter

Sixto said:


> I was not joking.
> 
> And I'll repeat what I said previously, with an update, it's now 400+ posts.


I believe you, myself, and many others here are in complete agreement with this as well.

Using the latest chipset(or least one of the latest), new design, new HARDWARE feature(internal DECA), large harddrive; what else would you want? Yes excluding a gigantic harddrive(5TB) or something like 8turners(which is closer to the HMC30 coming out later).

EVERYTHING else i've herd mentioned is stuff related to software and hence a moot point as I can't see them running a completely different software on it this early on. Maybe they will, maybe with the faster chip they can try to squeeze some more out of the box but I wouldn't expect that to happen until its been out and run through all original bugs at least.


----------



## johnp37

As I mentioned earlier in this thread great job by all involved. Being volunteers in this project as in the past you are to be commended for your efforts. That said, I saw absolutely no point in that silly video takeoff on 24. This told me nothing about the box. Why not an actual video of the performance of the HR24? I sincerely hope all the hype is justified because I have seen it all before for the past three and a half years since the summer of '06. New model released, same old, same old. Now, that being said, I will reserve my judgement of this box till I have one,and see how it performs. Fair enough, right? If does not meet the expectations I have, given the critique of the First Look team, then and only then will I say what needs to be said in no uncertain terms.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

PackCat said:


> _Sometimes, it is a little difficult to filter through the clutter of 'pat on the backs', enthusiasm, and complaints to get to the meat of the matter..._
> 
> So, (eventually) when I trade in my HR23-500 for a HR24-500...
> The net effect is: the processor is a little faster, and I get an extra 1080P blue light instead of both the 1080I and 720P lit up at the same time? and I lose an Ethernet port and do not need the 2 HD-adaptor cables? And it only takes 10 seconds to change channels instead of 15-20?
> 
> <snip>


I guess we differ on what's a little faster processor. IMHO, ≈62% speed increase is pretty large...but maybe that's just me. :grin:

Mike


----------



## hdtvfan0001

MicroBeta said:


> I guess we differ on what's a little faster processor. IMHO, ≈62% speed increase is pretty large...but maybe that's just me. :grin:
> 
> Mike


Nope...its not just you...that is a major improvement...and that doesn't even reflect what can still be done on the firmware side.


----------



## anleva

TheRatPatrol said:


> Holy speed Batman! :eek2:
> 
> Great video, *could you give us an example of channel change speed as well from the HR24?*


I'd appreciate seeing a video of that as well. Put both DVRs into "Native On" with all resolutions checked and switch between different resolution channels (480i, 720p, 1080i) via HDMI. That is what frustrates me the most about todays DVRs, incredibly slow channel changing speed.


----------



## LameLefty

anleva said:


> That is what frustrates me the most about todays DVRs, incredibly slow channel changing speed.


A great deal of that is the HDMI handshake. There are limits to what Directv can do, since at least half the issue depends on the TV.


----------



## say-what

mikeny said:


> I usually manually enter it also but there are times when you might want to browse through the guide until something catches your eye.


I agree, but you still have to be able to read what you're browsing. As for channel changing, I'd like channels to tune a bit faster also, but I think there are certain limitations to that. I know SD to SD is much faster than HD to HD.


----------



## anleva

LameLefty said:


> A great deal of that is the HDMI handshake. There are limits to what Directv can do, since at least half the issue depends on the TV.


I understand that. But I have seen faster and more acceptable channel changing via HDMI from other providers. So I guess I'm hopeful DirecTV's engineers can improve it as well.

I just timed 15 channel changes with Native On on my HR23-700. Average speed was 8.1 seconds. I'm hopeful the HR24 drives down that number.


----------



## houskamp

say-what said:


> I agree, but you still have to be able to read what you're browsing. As for channel changing, I'd like channels to tune a bit faster also, but I think there are certain limitations to that. I know SD to SD is much faster than HD to HD.


 but you can haul butt when going past the PPV channels :lol:


----------



## veryoldschool

LameLefty said:


> A great deal of that is the HDMI handshake. There are limits to what Directv can do, since at least half the issue depends on the TV.


Did some playing this morning. Simple channel ^, wait for video/sound, repeat, wait for video/sound, repeat.
My times look much like the 3 digit times in the first look, through HDMI to my Sony. These times just about doubled with native on. Each change was also random resolution changes too.


----------



## mluntz

Not to get off topic, but while watching the video I noticed the menu in the upper left hand corner being used to change recievers. Is that part of MRV (I assume it is)?

I have to use my Harmony to change recievers.


----------



## bonscott87

FYI that turning Native off will most time double channel change speed or more. I had Native off and never had a channel change that took more then 2-3 seconds. Native on was in the 6-7 second range. So choose the setting you prefer based on your situation and hardware. Then again, this Native on/off thing has been hashed and rehashed many times over the past 3 years.


----------



## Sixto

mluntz said:


> Not to get off topic, but while watching the video I noticed the menu in the upper left hand corner being used to change recievers. Is that part of MRV (I assume it is)?
> 
> I have to use my Harmony to change recievers.


That was just the switching of HDMI ports / TV input. Looks same on my TV.


----------



## veryoldschool

mluntz said:


> Not to get off topic, but while watching the video I noticed the menu in the upper left hand corner being used to change recievers. Is that part of MRV (I assume it is)?
> 
> I have to use my Harmony to change recievers.


That was the TV's input menu, not anything from DirecTV.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

anleva said:


> I understand that. But I have seen faster and more acceptable channel changing via HDMI from other providers. So I guess I'm hopeful DirecTV's engineers can improve it as well.
> 
> I just timed 15 channel changes with Native On on my HR23-700. Average speed was 8.1 seconds. I'm hopeful the HR24 drives down that number.


I wonder if MPEG-2 vs MPEG-4 also makes a difference.

Mike


----------



## Doug Brott

veryoldschool said:


> That was the TV's input menu, not anything from DirecTV.


Yup .. That was the TV, not either receiver I was using. I was swapping inputs to show either HR23 or the HR24. No on screen labeling either, you'd have had to listen to me say when I was swapping. The video was ad-hoc shot in about 5 minutes with no prep and no plan


----------



## veryoldschool

Doug Brott said:


> Yup .. That was the TV, not either receiver I was using. I was swapping inputs to show either HR23 or the HR24. No on screen labeling either, you'd have had to listen to me say when I was swapping. The video was ad-hoc shot in about 5 minutes with no prep and no plan


At least you have a menu. My Sony is only multiple presses/cycling if the input button.


----------



## mluntz

Thanks guys. I use 1 TV input for everything.


----------



## Scott Kocourek

xtc said:


> right, lets just have everybody suck to everyone and not have any kind of constructive criticism, cause that's what makes for good forum chat. If I wanted to have people just rave about everything DirecTV does, i would just go to DirecTV.com and watch and read their advertisements all day.


My point was to get rid of all of the Put downs and insults directed to good people by you and others. Many of the insults are directed at folks that do not work for Directv and do this for fun. Maybe if you sat back and thought about what you put down for the world to see things would be different.

If you have a problem with a new product then maybe you should ignore it rather than insult the ones who are interested in it. If you have problems with certain features or speed issues, start your own thread or find one that others have started. Why use one like this.

If I am not mistaken the last few posts you made before the 24's came out was during the release of double play, I remember this because I was asked to remove some of the posts that I had replied to you. Some of your posts were also removed. I now realize that you will only show your "face" when you have the chance to put down others you will never meet. This is why I made the comment about removing posts, not to make this a love fest, just to get rid of......(this way I wont have to remove my post this time.)


----------



## BattleScott

veryoldschool said:


> Did some playing this morning. Simple channel ^, wait for video/sound, repeat, wait for video/sound, repeat.
> My times look much like the 3 digit times in the first look, through HDMI to my Sony. These times just about doubled with native on. Each change was also random resolution changes too.


It may have already been adressed in the previous pages, but what I find more annoying than the actual channel changing time on the current dvr is the extremely inconsistent response from the keypresses on the numeric entry. Many times the software will time out before the receiver recognizes the second or third number press. Hopefully this is eliminated with the new hardware? :hair:


----------



## TheRatPatrol

Doug, is scrolling any faster using the page down button vs using the arrow down button?


----------



## houskamp

TheRatPatrol said:


> Doug, is scrolling any faster using the page down button vs using the arrow down button?


 I can hold the button down on my MX800 and it will not miss a beat..


----------



## say-what

houskamp said:


> but you can haul butt when going past the PPV channels :lol:


I remove them from my custom guide, so I get by them really fast.


----------



## Doug Brott

TheRatPatrol said:


> Doug, is scrolling any faster using the page down button vs using the arrow down button?


my list isn't that long .. i've never been unhappy with the page-down scrolling. I think overall the improved navigation ability will play a MUCH bigger role in satisfaction than channel change time.


----------



## veryoldschool

BattleScott said:


> It may have already been adressed in the previous pages, but what I find more annoying than the actual channel changing time on the current dvr is the extremely inconsistent response from the keypresses on the numeric entry. Many times the software will time out before the receiver recognizes the second or third number press. Hopefully this is eliminated with the new hardware? :hair:


This I can't say, since even with my old boxes, it's never been a problem here.
I've that some have problems and then try mine to see if I can get them to do it too, but so far, I can't. :shrug:


----------



## Alan Gordon

OK.... I have work to do, so I don't really have time to tell the full story of watching Doug's video last night. Long story short, I watched the video via my TiVo Series 3 on a 50-inch SDTV last night. Family was visiting at the time, and I was getting laughed at for watching a video of some guy changing channels. One person even stated that the HR24-500 was too fast for them.

However, I do have those questions which I'll ask now:

*1.* As previously stated... Doug's HR23-700 was considerably faster than mine. A recent topic on the TiVo thread has been that previous units run faster with less Series Links, etc. Outside of the Summer months, I'm constantly running 50, and I need more. While I'm sure it still runs faster than previous units, I'm curious if it's even an issue with the newer chips. Have any of the testers tested the HR24-500 with 50 Series Links?

*2.* The lights on the front of the unit. Are those OLEDs or something else?

*3.* After hitting power... how long does it take until you have control of the remote?

*4.* After hitting PLAY on a recording in your Playlist, how long does it take until you have control of the remote?

*5.* Is it as fast when deleting a program from the Playlist as it is at everything else? In other words, using the RED button while in the Playlist?

There may have been more, but that's all I can remember right now.

~Alan


----------



## Sixto

All of my comments about speed have been relative to normal navigation: LIST, GUIDE, MENU, UP/DOWN, SELECT.

I'm exclusively native OFF, and rarely ever type in a channel #. All channels are either selected via the GUIDE or QuickTune, and I've never been concerned with change change speed.

With the HR24, you can bounce from screen-to-screen very easily with very little delay. Light years better then the HR21-200.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Alan Gordon said:


> *5.* Is it as fast when deleting a program from the Playlist as it is at everything else? In other words, using the RED button while in the Playlist?
> 
> ~Alan


I'm at the office right now so can't check the others, but it's a definitive Yes on this one.


----------



## inkahauts

Alan Gordon said:


> OK.... I have work to do, so I don't really have time to tell the full story of watching Doug's video last night. Long story short, I watched the video via my TiVo Series 3 on a 50-inch SDTV last night. Family was visiting at the time, and I was getting laughed at for watching a video of some guy changing channels. One person even stated that the HR24-500 was too fast for them.
> 
> However, I do have those questions which I'll ask now:
> 
> *1.* As previously stated... Doug's HR23-700 was considerably faster than mine. A recent topic on the TiVo thread has been that previous units run faster with less Series Links, etc. Outside of the Summer months, I'm constantly running 50, and I need more. While I'm sure it still runs faster than previous units, I'm curious if it's even an issue with the newer chips. Have any of the testers tested the HR24-500 with 50 Series Links?
> 
> *2.* The lights on the front of the unit. Are those OLEDs or something else?
> 
> *3.* After hitting power... how long does it take until you have control of the remote?
> 
> *4.* After hitting PLAY on a recording in your Playlist, how long does it take until you have control of the remote?
> 
> *5.* Is it as fast when deleting a program from the Playlist as it is at everything else? In other words, using the RED button while in the Playlist?
> 
> There may have been more, but that's all I can remember right now.
> 
> ~Alan


1.Haven;t done 50 SLs on it yet, but it doesn't seem to let anything slow it down so far...

2. Can;t tell, but you might be right on that.. They are sleek looking....

3. Almost as fast as you can hit the next button... and It doesn't ever miss button presses.

4. Depends.. For MRV, it can take a bit.. but I attribute that to MRV, not the HR24... Everything else.. very quick...

5. Who hits the red button? I always hit dash dash..  For local recordings, its faster at that too.. MRV, I think its a little faster there to, but frankly, that seems to change now and then based on developments in MRV, so I can't say its speed is relevant to the hr24...

I will say this, using an HR24 to access your hr21 for me is faster than using the hr21 itself to watch a local program...

The big thing that people need to understand about the speed, is that it gets faster and faster over the number of things you tell it to do.. If one key press is twice as fast, 2 or 4 times as fast, etc.... than previous models...


----------



## houskamp

one other thing, I haven't seen the remote stall from my Aquos yet with the hr24 (on top of my hr20 that does stall for 20sec when tv is 1st turned on)


----------



## Canis Lupus

Overall with the remote response, it's really tactile. Once it's in your hand and you're pressing buttons, that's the time when the speed increases are really noticeable. It does more justice to the speed increases than trying to show it visually.


----------



## Scott Kocourek

Is a menu reboot any faster than the older HR's?


----------



## Alan Gordon

Canis Lupus said:


> I'm at the office right now so can't check the others, but it's a definitive Yes on this one.


Good to know... my HR23-700 sometimes takes a while...

*inkahauts:* Thanks for the replies. While I'm still interested if there is even the SLIGHTEST speed decrease (yes, I have my reasons) in the unit with 50 Series Links, I thank you for answering my other questions well enough for me.

~Alan


----------



## Canis Lupus

scottandregan said:


> Is a menu reboot any faster than the older HR's?


Yes. They boot in about 4 minutes.


----------



## Sixto

Alan Gordon said:


> *1.* As previously stated... Doug's HR23-700 was considerably faster than mine. A recent topic on the TiVo thread has been that previous units run faster with less Series Links, etc. Outside of the Summer months, I'm constantly running 50, and I need more. While I'm sure it still runs faster than previous units, I'm curious if it's even an issue with the newer chips. Have any of the testers tested the HR24-500 with 50 Series Links?
> 
> *2.* The lights on the front of the unit. Are those OLEDs or something else?
> 
> *3.* After hitting power... how long does it take until you have control of the remote?
> 
> *4.* After hitting PLAY on a recording in your Playlist, how long does it take until you have control of the remote?
> 
> *5.* Is it as fast when deleting a program from the Playlist as it is at everything else? In other words, using the RED button while in the Playlist?
> 
> There may have been more, but that's all I can remember right now.
> 
> ~Alan


1. I have 16 series links. High is usually about 25.

2. The lights are touch sensitive, just like the touch sensitive buttons on a number of TV's.

3. From powered off to the channel banner is 2.5 seconds attached via HDMI. Then about another .5 seconds to the picture displays. This might be TV dependent, with component-attached being different.

4. Hitting play for a recording until picture displays is about 1.9-2.1 seconds.

5. Red button delete is quick. Just did with 90 minute program. Took 2.1 seconds.

Most of these tests took me longer to hit the stopwatch. 

The box is very responsive. No need to go over board with our comparison, but it's much more responsive then the previous generations with the same firmware.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Alan Gordon said:


> Good to know... my HR23-700 sometimes takes a while...
> 
> ~Alan


Yeah for me I'd say HR20-700 is 2nd fastest, followed by 21-700 and then R22-100(withHD).

Also I forgot to note that remote deletions through MRV are also much faster when the H24 is deleting a program served by the HR24, while MRV deletions of programs served from the 21-700 and R22-100 and deleted by the HR24 and H24 are only slightly faster.

So the server of the MRV program seems to play a role in the remote delete performance of the client in my experience.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

Doug Brott said:


> my list isn't that long .. i've never been unhappy with the page-down scrolling. I think overall the improved navigation ability will play a MUCH bigger role in satisfaction than channel change time.


I was talking more with the guide.


----------



## Sixto

Just did a reboot from the restart receiver screen.

From pressing the dash until picture was 3 minutes 57.82 seconds.


----------



## Canis Lupus

TheRatPatrol said:


> I was talking more with the guide.





TheRatPatrol said:


> Doug, is scrolling any faster using the page down button vs using the arrow down button?


Yes - guide or list scrolling using CH up or down is much faster. I use CH a lot. A note as well that it's faster with both local playlist and Unified playlist (in my case 2 other DVRs outside the DECA cloud, connected wirelessly).


----------



## Alan Gordon

Sixto said:


> 3. From powered off to the channel banner is 2.5 seconds attached via HDMI. Then about another .5 seconds to the picture displays. This might be TV dependent, with component-attached being different.


I have to wait a minute (OK, less than a minute, but seems like longer) AFTER my picture comes up on my HR23-700 before I can use the remote. My picture comes up fairly quick, and like you said, is more dependent on HDMI handshaking than anything else really. I was more interested in the remote issue.



Sixto said:


> The box is very responsive. No need to go over board with our comparison, but it's much more responsive then the previous generations with the same firmware.


I understand... and I certainly didn't intend on someone going above and beyond (with a stop-watch). My questions were simply to gauge whether or not certain functions (which are often extremely slow in my normal usage) have experienced equal speed upgrades as well as previously mentioned ones.

~Alan


----------



## Scott Kocourek

Thanks for the reboot times. When I got my first HR, I had spontaneous reboots and they took 9 minutes. (Doesn't happen anymore.) 4 +/- minutes is awesome.


----------



## Sixto

TheRatPatrol said:


> I was talking more with the guide.


There's speed testing and then there's practical use.

Doing a test right now ...

In the GUIDE, if you hit page down, and want to see the full screen that you've scrolled to, the screen just about refreshes as fast as you can hit page down.

GUIDE appears in 1.0-1.2 seconds. Just did it several times with a stopwatch.


----------



## Flyrx7

For the price of 1TB these days I'm really surprised it still has a 500GB drive. What are they, like $30-$40 difference, if that, for double the storage. With that said:

- Is it confirmed that the eSata II drives will plug and play? (say for instance, my Seagate 750GB currently hooked up to the HR20-100) I know I'll lose the content.

- Are eSata II external drives going to be supported officially, or is this still an unofficial enhancement?

- Are any testers willing to comment on Pixelation and audio drop-outs? Are they more or less prevalent?

- Any noticeble system lags due to DP being enabled? Pixelation, slow remote responses? etc.

Thanks,
Frank


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> I have to wait a minute (OK, less than a minute, but seems like longer) AFTER my picture comes up on my HR23-700 before I can use the remote. My picture comes up fairly quick, and like you said, is more dependent on HDMI handshaking than anything else really. I was more interested in the remote issue.
> 
> I understand... and I certainly didn't intend on someone going above and beyond (with a stop-watch). My questions were simply to gauge whether or not certain functions (which are often extremely slow in my normal usage) have experienced equal speed upgrades as well as previously mentioned ones.
> 
> ~Alan


I think I know what you're asking and yes there still is a bit of a lag from the first time the show/recording starts playing and when the remote functions [skip ahead] start to work. This may be only a few secs, but as with the other DVRs, it's still there. As I remember HD takes longer than SD for the remote to "kick in".


----------



## Sixto

Alan Gordon said:


> I understand... and I certainly didn't intend on someone going above and beyond (with a stop-watch). My questions were simply to gauge whether or not certain functions (which are often extremely slow in my normal usage) have experienced equal speed upgrades as well as previously mentioned ones.


Oh yeah, that last comment in my post wasn't specifically addressed to you. 

Was just commenting that it's faster then previous units, and we shouldn't go overboard that everything is instantaneous ... but it is much quicker then any previous generation, and very nice to use in daily operation.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Alan Gordon said:


> My questions were simply to gauge whether or not certain functions (which are often extremely slow in my normal usage) have experienced equal speed upgrades as well as previously mentioned ones.
> 
> ~Alan


Overall I would say there are speed increases in every facet of the HR24's use. I haven't found a spot where I was surprised not to see it working faster. Maybe others have found 1 or more though.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Sixto said:


> Oh yeah, that last comment in my post wasn't specifically addressed to you.
> 
> Was just commenting that it's faster then previous units, and we shouldn't go overboard that everything is instantaneous ... but it is much quicker then any previous generation, and very nice to use in daily operation.





veryoldschool said:


> I think I know what you're asking and yes there still is a bit of a lag from the first time the show/recording starts playing and when the remote functions [skip ahead] start to work. This may be only a few secs, but as with the other DVRs, it's still there. As I remember HD takes longer than SD for the remote to "kick in".


To pick up on what Sixto is saying though, it is still faster than previous (HR21-23) units, correct?

~Alan


----------



## Sixto

Flyrx7 said:


> For the price of 1TB these days I'm really surprised it still has a 500GB drive. What are they, like $30-$40 difference, if that, for double the storage. With that said:
> 
> - Is it confirmed that the eSata II drives will plug and play? (say for instance, my Seagate 750GB currently hooked up to the HR20-100) I know I'll lose the content.
> 
> - Are eSata II external drives going to be supported officially, or is this still an unofficial enhancement?
> 
> - Are any testers willing to comment on Pixelation and audio drop-outs? Are they more or less prevalent?
> 
> - Any noticeble system lags due to DP being enabled? Pixelation, slow remote responses? etc.
> 
> Thanks,
> Frank


It was probably a business decision to save $30-$40. 30-40 times millions of receivers is big dollars. Analysis has probably been done and $199 and 100 hours of HD is the design point.

Don't know about SATA II.

Have not experienced any pixelation or audio drop-outs. The dish is tuned, and the entire infrastructure has been designed with SWM and Quad shielded RG6. Have never had any issue on any receiver.

No system lags.


----------



## Canis Lupus

veryoldschool said:


> I think I know what you're asking and yes there still is a bit of a lag from the first time the show/recording starts playing and when the remote functions [skip ahead] start to work. This may be only a few secs, but as with the other DVRs, it's still there. As I remember HD takes longer than SD for the remote to "kick in".


I actually tried this the other day after someone (in the trial i think) brought up this point (maybe it was VOS himself? Can't recall). My experience when trying it though was an almost instant response for the remote to "kick in". Definitely not a few seconds, but IIRC someone did mention it was longer than my experience. Not sure also if this "kick in" time is affected by local vs. MRV (after the program starts because there is still a delay in start times over MRV), and H24 vs. HR24 etc.


----------



## Sixto

Alan Gordon said:


> To pick up on what Sixto is saying though, it is still faster than previous (HR21-23) units, correct?
> 
> ~Alan


Not sure I had understood the question.

From Play to the start of the recording is quick.

I usually then just watch so I never hit trickplay immediately.

I just tried. It's pretty dam quick.

I hit play, 1.8-2.1 seconds later I see the recording, I then hit FF and it immediately went to FF1. No delay what-so-ever.


----------



## Syzygy

inkahauts said:


> ... It doesn't ever miss button presses...


Then maybe the HR24 doesn't have some of the following issues (that my HR21 has):

• Entering letters with the numeric keypad ("triple-tapping") frequently generates mistakes (perhaps because a button press is acted on too late). For instance, pressing the '3' button twice sometimes generates 'DD' instead of 'E', no matter how quickly (or slowly) you do it.
• All remote button presses are ignored for the first few seconds after playback starts.
• Press-and-hold functions sometimes engage when you don't want them to.
• You can't pause a recording on the right frame unless you anticipate and press the Pause key early.
• Instant Replay takes so long to engage that frequently you go back less than 6 seconds.
• Missed recordings are still happening with Keyword Autorecords (even when the ARSL is long-established). [A long shot, I know.]

Please, anyone, tell us whether the Superman-fast HR24 has any of these problems. (For any of these problems that remains, I'd guess the developers still have work to do. *Triple-tap errors*, especially, likely arise from faulty timekeeping in the kernel, IMO.)



inkahauts said:


> The big thing that people need to understand about the speed, is that it gets faster and faster over the number of things you tell it to do.. If one key press is twice as fast, 2 or 4 times as fast, etc.... than previous models...


I'd like to understand that paragraph, but I'm drawing a blank on it. Could you clarify?


----------



## texasmoose

Is this the spec sheet on the chip within the H[R]24 box?

http://www.nxp.com/acrobat_download2/literature/9397/75016596.pdf

It says HDMI v1.3 interface included. Doesn't the 3D venture D* will soon be launching require the v1.4 specification?


----------



## Alan Gordon

Sixto said:


> Not sure I had understood the question.


It's complicated.

VOS quoted my reply to your reply regarding the speed in which you can use the remote AFTER you turn on the unit. On my HR23-700, it can seem like an eternity. VOS's reply seemed to indicate he was referring to AFTER one hit the play button on a recording... which seemed to be more in response to one of my other questions... which is also an issue of mine since I have a tendency to pad my recordings by two minutes (one before and one after)... and I either have to sit a minute and watch commercials or see the ending of a show I have yet to watch yet.

VOS stated there was still a lag... but did not specify as to whether or not that lag had improved. You stated that the unit was much faster than previous units, and so I asked VOS if the lag was shorter. Canis Lupus said that it was almost instantaneous, and that he experienced a shorter lag time than someone else (possibly VOS).

WHEW!!

~Alan


----------



## Alan Gordon

texasmoose said:


> Is this the spec sheet on the chip within the H[R]24 box?
> 
> http://www.nxp.com/acrobat_download2/literature/9397/75016596.pdf
> 
> It says HDMI v1.3 interface included. Doesn't the 3D venture D* will soon be launching require the v1.4 specification?


Not how DirecTV's doing it...

~Alan


----------



## kymikes

A strong "Thank you" to the First Look team. They provided a good "first" look at the new boxes. Unfortunately, most of this thread has turned into a "*****" fest. I guess this is just whether this elected to emerge. While I am not as excited as some about the new features, the actual 'first look' content allowed me to understand what the new boxes are 'all about'. Thanks again guys.


----------



## LameLefty

Syzygy said:


> Then maybe the HR24 doesn't have some of the following issues (that my HR21 has):
> 
> • Entering letters with the numeric keypad ("triple-tapping") frequently generates mistakes (perhaps because a button press is acted on too late). For instance, pressing the '3' button twice sometimes generates 'DD' instead of 'E', no matter how quickly (or slowly) you do it.
> • All remote button presses are ignored for the first few seconds after playback starts. [Belatedly I read that the HR24 doesn't do this.]
> • Press-and-hold functions sometimes engage when you don't want them to.
> • You can't pause a recording on the right frame unless you anticipate and press the Pause key early.
> • Missed recordings are still happening with Keyword Autorecords (even when the ARSL is long-established).
> • Instant Replay takes so long to engage that frequently you go back less than 6 seconds.
> 
> Please, anyone, tell us whether the Superman-fast HR24 has any of these problems. (For any of these problems that remains, I'd guess the developers still have work to do. *Triple-tap errors*, especially, likely arise from faulty timekeeping in the kernel, IMO.)
> 
> I'd like to understand that paragraph, but I'm drawing a blank on it. Could you clarify?


I've never used ARSL's so I have no idea. I would think that is a software issue, not a hardware issue. The other problems I've never seen on the Hx24's; in addition, I have had no trouble with either Pause or Instant Replay on any HR2x.


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> It's complicated.
> 
> VOS quoted my reply to your reply regarding the speed in which you can use the remote AFTER you turn on the unit. On my HR23-700, it can seem like an eternity. VOS's reply seemed to indicate he was referring to AFTER one hit the play button on a recording... which seemed to be more in response to one of my other questions... which is also an issue of mine since I have a tendency to pad my recordings by two minutes (one before and one after)... and I either have to sit a minute and watch commercials or see the ending of a show I have yet to watch yet.
> 
> VOS stated there was still a lag... but did not specify as to whether or not that lag had improved. You stated that the unit was much faster than previous units, and so I asked VOS if the lag was shorter. Canis Lupus said that it was almost instantaneous, and that he experienced a shorter lag time than someone else (possibly VOS).
> 
> WHEW!!
> 
> ~Alan


It probably is shorter, but at the same time, it is noticeable, so not instantaneous. I would say that it's less than my HR20 as it seemed to be more in the 5 sec timeframe.

Canis, no it wasn't me before. I just remembered this lag reading Alan's post(s). Maybe it's only 1 sec but feels like two :lol:


----------



## compnurd

While I do also apperciate the time put into the First look, people here are right. Almost any review site of new anything will list pro's and cons. The ones here are a severe love fest. To the point you wonder if D* helped write it or tossed in a few bucks. Hell if they gave me a free HR24(instead of the 200 they will charge me to get a DVR that performs at the same speed of every other companies and no new contract) I would write the same thing!


----------



## Captain Spaulding

I'm not as up to speed on satellite dish technology as many here, but here's my questions: 

I currently have a Slimline dish with 2 BBCs connected both of my current HD DVRs. Am I correct in assuming that I'll also use the BBCs on the new HR24-500 and that my dish is not set up for DECA use?

Thanks.


----------



## RAD

Captain Spaulding said:


> I'm not as up to speed on satellite dish technology as many here, but here's my questions:
> 
> I currently have a Slimline dish with 2 BBCs connected both of my current HD DVRs. Am I correct in assuming that I'll also use the BBCs on the new HR24-500 and that my dish is not set up for DECA use?
> 
> Thanks.


Yes, the new HR24 and H24 still require the BBC's if you don't have SWiM LNB or switch. Since you say you have two leads to your HD DVR's that means you don't have SWiM and you can't use DECA until you either get a SWiM LNB or SWiM8/16 switch.


----------



## Richierich

Okay, what's the Fastest Way for me to buy one of these Puppies???

Anyone doing a PreOrder for these HR24-500 DVRs???


----------



## Canis Lupus

Alan Gordon said:


> VOS quoted my reply to your reply regarding the speed in which you can use the remote AFTER you turn on the unit. On my HR23-700, it can seem like an eternity.
> ~Alan


As far as the "turn on DVR > remote is useable" time, I've never paid really close attention to this on any of my units (usually cuz I have a kid hanging off my leg :lol: ), but I'd say it's very likely faster, as a contributing factor in my assessment is that the unit just plain comes out of standby faster. This is definitely YMMV though I would think based upon analog vs. HDMI, TV Model/type etc.

I think what inkahauts has been getting at is the overall speed in every facet, which I tend to agree with, except possibly in the area VOS was describing above.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

richierich said:


> Okay, what's the Fastest Way for me to buy one of these Puppies???
> 
> Anyone doing a PreOrder for these HR24-500 DVRs???


I think it's gonna be a while before they're generally available. Initially they'll be for new SWiM installs. :shrug:

Mike


----------



## Richierich

Mike, I am not looking for General Availability but for whoever is going to be offering these units FIRST such as valueelectronics.com did with the HR10-250 DVRs.

I don't care what the Price is I just want one as soon as I can get my hands on it!!!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

richierich said:


> Mike, I am not looking for General Availability but for whoever is going to be offering these units FIRST such as valueelectronics.com did with the HR10-250 DVRs.
> 
> I don't care what the Price is I just want one as soon as I can get my hands on it!!!


I know what you were looking for. 

I'll bet the first production runs will be taken up by suppliers. I'll also bet that it's a while before they're generally available. IIRC, it was 6+ months before the HR23 was available for purchace.

Mike


----------



## Canis Lupus

compnurd said:


> While I do also apperciate the time put into the First look, people here are right. Almost any review site of new anything will list pro's and cons. The ones here are a severe love fest. To the point you wonder if D* helped write it or tossed in a few bucks. Hell if they gave me a free HR24(instead of the 200 they will charge me to get a DVR that performs at the same speed of every other companies and no new contract) I would write the same thing!


That's fair enough compnurd. As enthusiasts who get a unit to test and keep, it's not unreasonable for some to see it as a lovefest. I just think it's important to keep in mind that the First Looks are not reviews, only "announcements" from those who would likely be "enthusiastic" about the product.

It's also important to keep in mind the First Looks are written by the users themselves, then "group-edited" by the users, then reviewed and executed by the Mods (in this case Stuart who also designs them plays a big role).

All that said, if I were not a tester, but heard from these testers about this box, I'd pay the 199 and the 2 yr commitment to get 1 or more. This is, IMO, how much improved the Hx24s are. As I've stated before though, I'm perfectly happy with my 20-700 and 21-700 units as well.


----------



## veryoldschool

Canis Lupus said:


> As far as the "turn on DVR > remote is useable" time, I've never paid really close attention to this on any of my units (usually cuz I have a kid hanging off my leg :lol: ), but I'd say it's very likely faster, as a contributing factor in my assessment is that the unit just plain comes out of standby faster. This is definitely YMMV though I would think based upon analog vs. HDMI, TV Model/type etc.
> 
> I think what inkahauts has been getting at is the overall speed in every facet, which I tend to agree with, except possibly in the area VOS was describing above.


My comment wasn't about turning on the DVR, but more changing channels or bring up a recording. There is a slight delay before you can pause or start to use trickplay. 
IE: change channel and then pause it so you can go do something and come back to watch [aka a bathroom break].
My Sony TV is pretty much the limiting factor when powering up.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Canis Lupus said:


> This is definitely YMMV though I would think based upon analog vs. HDMI, TV Model/type etc.


While I understand how video/audio might be affected by HDMI, I don't think that remote usage would be affected by it.

For instance... a few minutes ago, I went to the GUIDE and set up a recording. After exiting either the GUIDE or the Playlist (which I also visited), I had to wait XX amount of seconds until I could use the remote again. It's faster than when I bring the unit up out of standby, but it's still tiresome to me.

~Alan


----------



## veryoldschool

Canis Lupus said:


> All that said, if I were not a tester, but heard from these testers about this box, I'd pay the 199 and the 2 yr commitment to get 1 or more. This is, IMO, how much improved the Hx24s are. As I've stated before though, I'm perfectly happy with my 20-700 and 21-700 units as well.


"I think" anyone that has the HR21/22/23 will find the HR24 a big improvement.
Those with the HR20, would still find this an improvement, though not as much as the others.
As slow as my HR21 is/was [it's retired now], compared to my HR20s, the HR20s now feel the dogs compared to the HR24. :lol:


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> For instance... but it's still tiresome to me.
> 
> ~Alan


I'd think my post above would give you some idea.


----------



## Alan Gordon

veryoldschool said:


> I'd think my post above would give you some idea.


Aside from the 50 Series Link question, all my questions were answered (by several) to my satisfaction... though _your_ initial reply concerned me for a bit.

~Alan


----------



## Canis Lupus

veryoldschool said:


> My comment wasn't about turning on the DVR, but more changing channels or bring up a recording. There is a slight delay before you can pause or start to use trickplay.
> IE: change channel and then pause it so you can go do something and come back to watch [aka a bathroom break].
> My Sony TV is pretty much the limiting factor when powering up.


Yes I'm following you. I was responding to what I thought was the question Alan was asking concerning the time from "DVR Turn-On" to "Remote is Active"


----------



## Canis Lupus

Alan Gordon said:


> While I understand how video/audio might be affected by HDMI, I don't think that remote usage would be affected by it.
> 
> For instance... a few minutes ago, I went to the GUIDE and set up a recording. After exiting either the GUIDE or the Playlist (which I also visited), I had to wait XX amount of seconds until I could use the remote again. It's faster than when I bring the unit up out of standby, but it's still tiresome to me.
> 
> ~Alan


OK I thought you'd asked earlier about "DVR ON>Now I can use my Remote" speed.

Your example here is not that, but I'm following you with this one. My answer would be Yes in this case as well. The time for the unit to "finish a task" (in one of your cases Record a program then exit the Guide), then move on to the next "task" (using the Remote again), is indeed faster. This is true with every "task completion> next thing" I've seen so far.


----------



## nick9742

Anyone know how much it might cost to upgrade to one of these models? I just got their latest model back in August but I really would like to have this one if it's not too much of an expensive upgrade..


----------



## RAD

nick9742 said:


> Anyone know how much it might cost to upgrade to one of these models? I just got their latest model back in August but I really would like to have this one if it's not too much of an expensive upgrade..


No pricing or availablity has been announced yet.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Canis Lupus said:


> OK I thought you'd asked earlier about "DVR ON>Now I can use my Remote" speed.


I did! Check out #3! 

I was simply (or at least trying to) state that I experience a lot of this sluggishness in multiple aspects of the HR23-700.

I use the DVR a LOT... not just watching recordings, but trimming the Playlist, checking the To Do List, etc. With my HR10-250, TiVo Series 3, and HR20-700, I can get things done pretty fast... but the HR23-700 is pretty darn slow... and between the general sluggishness of the DVR and the multiple issues with the remote, the HR23-700 can CONSIDERABLY slow me down.

Since the HR24-500 is not much of a change from the HR23-700 other than speed, the First Look had a lot to say about speed, but predominately about the speed of scrolling and similar functions. While I assumed it was sped up across the whole of the unit, I really wanted to find out if certain functions the HR23-700 takes too long on (for me) was indeed sped up as well.

~Alan


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> Since the HR24-500 is not much of a change from the HR23-700 other than speed, the First Look had a lot to say about speed, but predominately about the speed of scrolling and similar functions. While I assumed it was sped up across the whole of the unit, I really wanted to find out if certain functions the HR23-700 takes too long on (for me) was indeed sped up as well.
> 
> ~Alan


I hope you've gotten your answers. I don't have an HR23 to compare, but the HR21 has the same processor so I think mine is a good comparison, and everything about the 24 is faster with its better processor.


----------



## whatliesbeyond

I understand why some posters are unhappy with the new receivers. For new subscribers, they will be great. For people who, for whatever reason, obtain these receivers for free, they will be great. For Directv and its installers, they will be great. 

But for the millions of existing subscribers who do not wish to pay a monthly charge for MRV via DECA (especially since for most it would also entail the cost of getting and installing a SWiM), the new receivers have something we dearly want (reasonably responsive DVRs), but at a price that does not justify the cost. Much as I'd really love to have a fast receiver like the HR24, I can't justify the $200 cost for each one, the hassle of returning my existing HR21s, the loss of all my current recordings (even the ones on my external drives), and the new 2 year contract term, just so I can save the frustration I experience from using the underpowered (or poorly programmed) HR21s I have. If the HR24 had added something else that I would use, even something minor, I could have perhaps justified the cost, and thereby finally obtained a frustration-free DVR.

What could they have added? I for one would have loved a hardware based PIP. Now that we have on-demand dual line buffers, I can easily see how activation of a PIP option could be set to simultaneously activate the DLBs for a given period of time (say 3 hours). PIP is great for sports fans since often several games are on at the same time, and D* is supposed to be "the place" for people who love sports. I'm told PIP is available on the Dish receivers.

The new receivers could have also added built in wireless n capability. This isn't that expensive. If I can get a whole netbook with a good processor, wireless b/g/n, 250 GB harddrive, Windows XP or 7, HDMI and VGA out, etc., with 10" LED screen, all for under $250, I have to believe D* can add wireless n to these $650 receivers (this cost is implied by the $200 upfront price plus the $450 pro-rated charge under a two year term). Given how common wireless routers have become in American homes (and probably more so in homes that subscribe to satellite television), this addition would have been of benefit to a huge number of existing and new subscribers. 

Man, I can't believe I've lurked for 6 months and ended up making this my first post. Sorry . . ..


----------



## veryoldschool

whatliesbeyond said:


> I understand why some posters are unhappy with the new receivers. For new subscribers, they will be great. For people who, for whatever reason, obtain these receivers for free, they will be great. For Directv and its installers, they will be great.
> 
> But for the millions of existing subscribers who do not wish to pay a monthly charge for MRV via DECA (especially since for most it would also entail the cost of getting and installing a SWiM), the new receivers have something we dearly want (reasonably responsive DVRs), but at a price that does not justify the cost. Much as I'd really love to have a fast receiver like the HR24, I can't justify the $200 cost for each one, the hassle of returning my existing HR21s, the loss of all my current recordings (even the ones on my external drives), and the new 2 year contract term, just so I can save the frustration I experience from using the underpowered (or poorly programmed) HR21s I have. If the HR24 had added something else that I would use, even something minor, I could have perhaps justified the cost, and thereby finally obtained a frustration-free DVR.
> 
> What could they have added? I for one would have loved a hardware based PIP. Now that we have on-demand dual line buffers, I can easily see how activation of a PIP option could be set to simultaneously activate the DLBs for a given period of time (say 3 hours). PIP is great for sports fans since often several games are on at the same time, and D* is supposed to be "the place" for people who love sports. I'm told PIP is available on the Dish receivers.
> 
> The new receivers could have also added built in wireless n capability. This isn't that expensive. If I can get a whole netbook with a good processor, wireless b/g/n, 250 GB harddrive, Windows XP or 7, HDMI and VGA out, etc., with 10" LED screen, all for under $250, I have to believe D* can add wireless n to these $650 receivers (this cost is implied by the $200 upfront price plus the $450 pro-rated charge under a two year term). Given how common wireless routers have become in American homes (and probably more so in homes that subscribe to satellite television), this addition would have been of benefit to a huge number of existing and new subscribers.
> 
> Man, I can't believe I've lurked for 6 months and ended up making this my first post. Sorry . . ..


Having always been someone who once I got/bought something, it either had the price slashed in half, or replaced by something better, I really understand your point(s).
PIP might have been something they should have thought about, but isn't something I used when I had it.
I will say that wireless would not have worked out that well though. MRV and wireless hasn't turned out very well for some, while others haven't had a problem. Why add something that iffy?
DECA isn't and works for everyone.
BTW::welcome_s to the forums


----------



## Shades228

Wireless would be a waste of money when they are going with MOCA/DECA. Wireless would be a nightmare to attempt to support. People would want replacements due to wireless not connecting and so forth. 

I also wouldn't expect the majority of customers to want to get one just to have one if they already have an HR. Sure there are many on here that will but overall less than 1% would call in to get the latest and greatest thing out there. Besides most customers probably won't know they exist until they get one. Unless DirecTV goes against status quo with their ordering policy you wouldn't even be able to request one from them and get the same thing in return for a replacement.


----------



## Mike Greer

Wow – what a thread! I’m VERY interested in seeing an HR24 in action and I appreciate the ‘First Look’. I need to make a change – either to Dish Network or the HR24s. I’ve given up on the older HRs as you know!

The information and video posted is great information but I can also see why some people are hesitant to be excited. After years of dealing with the way-to-slow, incredibly frustrating HR22s only to be told by some of the excited people here that ‘mine isn’t slow’ and/or ‘the fix is coming soon’ it makes me wonder. Did they suddenly realize the speed of the HR20/21/22/23 receivers leave much to be desired? (To put it nicely) I guess the fix around the corner didn’t turn out to be another ‘NR’ but a new box running essentially the same software.

A few weeks ago I was done and getting ready for Dish Network but now I’m glad I waited a bit. I’ll just ignore the praises of the few that have suddenly decided speed matters and listen to the credible people that didn’t try to convince me that I was the problem and not my HR22s.

I am a bit surprised that DirecTV is sticking with essentially the same software. I had hoped to be able to record more than 2 streams with the new receivers like with my Dish 622 could nearly 4 years ago. I was also hoping to be able to use the IR and RF remotes simultaneously (again like my Dish 622) but my biggest complaint looks to have been fixed – SPEED! The other thing that would be great is if I could actually buy an HR24 for $200 - $300 like I can buy a Dish Network 722k for. I’d buy one or two today – site unseen – if I could!

Count me in as one of the ‘excited’ ones – I just hope they are available sooner rather than later! I wish DirecTV would have addressed the speed problems earlier but that doesn’t change the fact that they have finally done something about it. THANK YOU DIRECTV!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

whatliesbeyond said:


> I understand why some posters are unhappy with the new receivers. For new subscribers, they will be great. For people who, for whatever reason, obtain these receivers for free, they will be great. For Directv and its installers, they will be great.
> 
> But for the millions of existing subscribers who do not wish to pay a monthly charge for MRV via DECA (especially since for most it would also entail the cost of getting and installing a SWiM), the new receivers have something we dearly want (reasonably responsive DVRs), but at a price that does not justify the cost. Much as I'd really love to have a fast receiver like the HR24, I can't justify the $200 cost for each one, the hassle of returning my existing HR21s, the loss of all my current recordings (even the ones on my external drives), and the new 2 year contract term, just so I can save the frustration I experience from using the underpowered (or poorly programmed) HR21s I have. If the HR24 had added something else that I would use, even something minor, I could have perhaps justified the cost, and thereby finally obtained a frustration-free DVR.
> 
> What could they have added? I for one would have loved a hardware based PIP. Now that we have on-demand dual line buffers, I can easily see how activation of a PIP option could be set to simultaneously activate the DLBs for a given period of time (say 3 hours). PIP is great for sports fans since often several games are on at the same time, and D* is supposed to be "the place" for people who love sports. I'm told PIP is available on the Dish receivers.
> 
> The new receivers could have also added built in wireless n capability. This isn't that expensive. If I can get a whole netbook with a good processor, wireless b/g/n, 250 GB harddrive, Windows XP or 7, HDMI and VGA out, etc., with 10" LED screen, all for under $250, I have to believe D* can add wireless n to these $650 receivers (this cost is implied by the $200 upfront price plus the $450 pro-rated charge under a two year term). Given how common wireless routers have become in American homes (and probably more so in homes that subscribe to satellite television), this addition would have been of benefit to a huge number of existing and new subscribers.
> 
> Man, I can't believe I've lurked for 6 months and ended up making this my first post. Sorry . . ..


Welcome to DBSTalk and don't worry about your first post. :welcome_s

As it stands right now, you don't need DECA to take advantage of MRV. Nearly all the testing that's going on right now (at least here anyway) is on Ethernet networks.

As for wireless, they seem to have chosen DECA as their primary network for MRV. If a faster processor, DECA, and a two-way remote so there's no more need to search through IR codes to program the remote to work with your TV isn't enough then I guess the HR24 is not for you...and that's just fine. It won't fit for everyone. :grin:

Speaking only for me, the speed increase and DECA is enough for me to want one. 

Mike


----------



## johnp37

veryoldschool said:


> I hope you've gotten your answers. I don't have an HR23 to compare, but the HR21 has the same processor so I think mine is a good comparison, and everything about the 24 is faster with its better processor.


O.K. I need to be clear on something. Did this "better processor" not exist before? Or has it been in R&D for the past three and a half years and just recently released for production?


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## Mike Bertelson

johnp37 said:


> O.K. I need to be clear on something. Did this "better processor" not exist before? Or has it been in R&D for the past three and a half years and just recently released for production?


Not knowing a single thing about the contractual agreements between Broadcom and DirecTV, I would guess that it didn't matter what other processors were available. I would guess they had a contract for a certain period of time. :shrug:

Further, I don't know if it's a "better processor" but it certainly is a faster processor. 

Mike


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## Davenlr

Its the same as computers. There was no AMD Phenom processor when I bought my computer three years ago. They come out with newer and faster processors with more cores all the time. The processor in the HR24 wasnt available when the HR22 and HR23 was designed...Just like 3 yrs from now, they will probably have a faster processor for whatever incarnation they release than the HR24 has in it now.


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## veryoldschool

Davenlr said:


> they will probably have a faster processor for whatever incarnation they release than the HR24 has in it now.


If history holds true, this will only happen "right after" I get my next DVR.  :lol:


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## compnurd

I understand everyone keeps putting down Wireless due to the DECA but for those who will not have DECA, the wireless would have been perfect for ondemand and TV Apps. Forget MRV for a minute


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## compnurd

Davenlr said:


> Its the same as computers. There was no AMD Phenom processor when I bought my computer three years ago. They come out with newer and faster processors with more cores all the time. The processor in the HR24 wasnt available when the HR22 and HR23 was designed...Just like 3 yrs from now, they will probably have a faster processor for whatever incarnation they release than the HR24 has in it now.


True but my old Motorola HD DVR from 3-4 years ago was 3-4 times faster then the HR20 and 21 I have now. And the Passport interface was alot nicer


----------



## veryoldschool

compnurd said:


> I understand everyone keeps putting down Wireless due to the DECA but for those who will not have DECA, the wireless would have been perfect for ondemand and TV Apps


As it is today, but the push is for a MRV capable network, which wireless is too iffy for.
If you only need ondemand & TVApps, there still is the ethernet jack for a wireless adapter, so why make it standard, when most may not use it?


----------



## DogLover

compnurd said:


> I understand everyone keeps putting down Wireless due to the DECA but for those who will not have DECA, the wireless would have been perfect for ondemand and TV Apps. Forget MRV for a minute


For those applications, DiecTV already sells wireless adapters that work with all the HRs.


----------



## veryoldschool

compnurd said:


> True but my old Motorola HD DVR from 3-4 years ago was 3-4 times faster then the HR20 and 21 I have now. And the Passport interface was alot nicer


Never had one of those in my hand, "but" since it isn't an MPEG-4 DVR, it didn't have the same load on it either.


----------



## compnurd

veryoldschool said:


> As it is today, but the push is for a MRV capable network, which wireless is too iffy for.
> If you only need ondemand & TVApps, there still is the ethernet jack for a wireless adapter, so why make it standard, when most may not use it?


Because the 10 dollars it would have cost to put the chip in compared to the higher cost of external.


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## compnurd

veryoldschool said:


> Never had one of those in my hand, "but" since it isn't an MPEG-4 DVR, it didn't have the same load on it either.


that is a loaded but


----------



## veryoldschool

compnurd said:


> Because the 10 dollars it would have cost to put the chip in compared to the higher cost of external.


I see "your point" but bet the real numbers didn't work out to add $10/box for the number of users that would use it.
This would be just like the removal of the OTA tuners and then the AM21 for those that do want/need OTA.


----------



## Alan Gordon

whatliesbeyond said:


> If the HR24 had added something else that I would use, even something minor, I could have perhaps justified the cost, and thereby finally obtained a frustration-free DVR.


Welcome! Don't be sorry... your thoughts pretty much echoed mine as well. 



compnurd said:


> I understand everyone keeps putting down Wireless due to the DECA but for those who will not have DECA, the wireless would have been perfect for ondemand and TV Apps. Forget MRV for a minute


DirecTV would be wise to come up with an easy solution to connect the DECA cloud with people's wireless networks. 

~Alan


----------



## compnurd

veryoldschool said:


> I see "your point" but bet the real numbers didn't work out to add $10/box for the number of users that would use it.
> This would be just like the removal of the OTA tuners and then the AM21 for those that do want/need OTA.


Of couse. The business model supports charging customers another 50 dollars for OTA


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## RobertE

compnurd said:


> Because the 10 dollars it would have cost to put the chip in compared to the higher cost of external.


$10 of unused hardware times several hundread thousand units add of quick. Just like the removal of the OTA tuners, it's all about saving cost. Why increase the price of something that 99% of the userbase won't use as part of the core functionality?


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## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> DirecTV would be wise to come up with an easy solution to connect the DECA cloud with people's wireless networks.
> 
> ~Alan


They have it's a DECA [adapter] + wireless bridge.


----------



## compnurd

RobertE said:


> $10 of unused hardware times several hundread thousand units add of quick. Just like the removal of the OTA tuners, it's all about saving cost. Why increase the price of something that 99% of the userbase won't use as part of the core functionality?


99% is a pretty crazy amount to spit out there. My parents have a HR21 and would certainily use the wireless for ondemand if it was built it. Hell my blackberry has built in wifi and i actually think the cost would be MUCH lower


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## veryoldschool

compnurd said:


> 99% is a pretty crazy amount to spit out there. My parents have a HR21 and would certainily use the wireless for ondemand if it was built it. Hell my blackberry has built in wifi


hey I'm not trying to give you a hard time here.
When the HR20s came out they were $300 to lease.
DirecTV dropped the price to $200 with the later models by removing OTA and some other stuff.
Those that still need/want OTA pay $50, so even they come out ahead don't they?
Build a box to fix everyone's basic needs and have options for those that need more.
Seems like a fairly good plan.


----------



## Shades228

compnurd said:


> I understand everyone keeps putting down Wireless due to the DECA but for those who will not have DECA, the wireless would have been perfect for ondemand and TV Apps. Forget MRV for a minute


Not enough to justify the cost of having it in every single box out there. They sell the wireless adapter for those scenarios. They had to make a standard that all box's would have regardless of manufacturer. Adding in something that can be done elsewhere and not add to the total cost or support aspect is better. Would it be nice? Sure but at what total cost.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Alan Gordon said:


> DirecTV would be wise to come up with an easy solution to connect the DECA cloud with people's wireless networks.





veryoldschool said:


> They have it's a DECA [adapter] + wireless bridge.


You're correct!

I had apparently missed the First Look for the Cisco/Linksys WET610N. Nice looking unit! 

~Alan


----------



## RobertE

compnurd said:


> 99% is a pretty crazy amount to spit out there. My parents have a HR21 and would certainily use the wireless for ondemand if it was built it. Hell my blackberry has built in wifi and i actually think the cost would be MUCH lower


From my personal knowledge, 99% is on the conservative side as far as OTA useage goes.

Adding extra hardware that isn't needed for core functionality and/or isn't withing an enviroment (wifi) controlled by DirecTv is just a waste of time and money.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

Alan Gordon said:


> You're correct!
> 
> I had apparently missed the First Look for the Cisco/Linksys WET610N. Nice looking unit!
> 
> ~Alan


It certainly works well - very stable and solid signal.


----------



## spartanstew

Just read this whole thread.

Great job on the first look guys, the unit looks really good.

I was amazed at some of the reactions here, but I guess it takes all kinds.

I had the sound off when watching the speed clip that Doug put up and I must say that when it first started, I thought "wow, it is faster", and then realized he was using his HR23. And that the HR24 was even faster than that.

I've never thought my units were slow, but both of my HR21's and my HR20 are much slower than the HR23 that Doug has. 

I guess I just didn't know what I was missing.

I'm probably going to hang onto my old units for the foreseeable future, but will sure be jealous of those with HR24's.

Thanks again all who contributed.


----------



## Canis Lupus

For my part of the wireless discussion, I have the H24 and HR24 via DECA cloud, mixed in with 2 HDDVRs via wireless (each via Linksys WGA600N), all connected through an Apple Airport Extreme N. 

With one wireless DVR downstairs, and one upstairs, and the Airport in the middle, I get very good MRV performance - even with HD programs.


----------



## Captain Spaulding

I sent an email message to DirecTV asking about the availability of the new DVRs. At first, the guy thought I was talking about the new TiVo. I then sent him a link to the "First Look" document. Here is the reply I received:

I understand that you are interested in upgrading your existing DIRECTV receivers to the new HD -DVR (HR24). While I'm unable to open the link you provided, I just wanted to let you know that this exciting new receiver will be offered starting mid-March 2010 for select markets and May 2010 nationwide.


----------



## tkrandall

Man, I've been away for a couple of days and I'm post #516. 

First - let me add my thanks for the First Look team. I understand what the first looks are intended for and I think you do a great job in offering up the time and effort it takes. It is appreciated.

I am also happy to see this improved box coming. I have gladly kept my trusty HR20-700 w/OTA tuner (acquired July 2007, and it was a refurb) knowing full well the HR21/22/23 line really does not offer anything I don't presently have with the HR20. But these new developments have me considering newer boxes, a SWM LNB, and MRV via DECA (if priced right).

I do have a comment/question that perhaps no one here can address. But it does seem to me, that the HR24 is enough of a incremental step (speed, built-in DECA, intended for SWM setups, etc) that we are getting to the point where it really is not "appropriate" for DirecTV to group all the HD DVRs as functionally the same. At some point I think they need to begin to differentiate DVR functionality/generational levels in terms of their lease model and what type of box you might get on a swap-out. It seems a bit of a stretch to me for someone to go out and acquire an HR24-500 (for lease) and then should it need to be swapped out, they could end up with a slower HR21 or HR22 or what have you. I do hope DirecTV will make that differentiation/distinction in their product line beginning with this model.


----------



## hombresoto

What kind of upgrade deal do you think I would get with 11 HR2X DVRs? lol... i'm screwed, and have never been happy with the speed of any of my DVRs, compared to comcast motorolas instantaneous response from day one. Yeah, I don't like anything else about them, but it's like a quarter mile race between a cavalier and a z06 corvette as far as speed goes. The HR series DVRs have been disappointingly slow from day one, yeah, some are better than others, but in my point of view, they are all unacceptable.. especially with a premium service like DirecTV (not a bargain basement experience that Dish Network provides)


----------



## Nicholsen

raott said:


> Why? For expecting a first look to be an objective critique rather than reading like a marketing piece?
> 
> I've posted on the same issue before when the year in "review" came out last year and got flamed for it. I'm not sure why it is so hard to understand that most people would rather see objective information, with plusses and minuses, rather than documents that read like one sided marketing pieces I'd find at a trade show booth.





johnp37 said:


> O.K. I need to be clear on something. Did this "better processor" not exist before? Or has it been in R&D for the past three and a half years and just recently released for production?


+1

I doubt you will get a direct response to either of those questions.

Posters on this board who have continued to insist that the HR21, HR22 and HR23 work perfectly, and are more than fast enough, while using free HR24's without disclosure, should be seriously embarrassed. :nono2:

Pick a position. Either the old receivers are too slow, or the new receiver is no big deal. You can have one position or the other, but not both.


----------



## PackCat

TheRatPatrol said:


> This has built in DECA which means you can run internet and satellite signals over one coax cable, no need to run Cat 5 everywhere.


Whoopdie Do! I think you are missing the trees for the forest.
NOBODY wants any more stinking cables.

OK, so instead of a 50 foot ethernet cable running through the middle of my kitchen and living room, you are suggesting I can have a 50 foot coax cable running through my living room and kitchen floor instead? How stupid.

I live in a Condo, it's not like I can sling cables out my window and bury it underground or run cables through a basement. I have 2 tuner-cables that run from the dish to the receiver. That is it! Everything else in my house except for my Refrigerator and Satellite receiver have WiFi or remote built-in. Even my VoIP phone line will transfer phone calls through bluetooth from my cellphone.

If DECA can carry internet and tv signal over one coax, how am I suppose to split this signal at my PC/router since my router does not have a coax input ? Do I have to purchase another signal separation device or receiver?

My interest was to get IP and receiver signals to the room across my unit that doesn't require me to drill holes in the ceiling or create a railroad of jump ropes on my floor to install MORE CABLE.
I apologize that I don't live in a trailer or in my mom`s garage/basement and can do as I please. I wish the testers with Reality Deficit Disorder would please keep this mind when they are trying to hype something that does nothing to improve on the current situation of normal real-world users.


----------



## PackCat

Doug Brott said:


> Don't forget the 500GB HDD .. This will give you ~100 hours of MPEG-4 HD which should satisfy most folks. Some of the folks that frequent DBSTalk may prefer more storage though. You can use the eSATA port to add a larger HDD.
> 
> As for Ethernet .. On the surface, there are two "wireless" options. The main option is technically wired (not wireless), but is combined with the satellite signal on the coax line entering your receiver. We refer to this as DECA (DIRECTV Ethernet over Coax Adapter), but there really is no adapter on the HR24. It's all managed inside the box. The technology is MoCA, but the frequencies that DIRECTV use are different than the MoCA spec which is what Cable TV uses. In order to differentiate the two technologies, we simply refer to it as DECA here.
> 
> An alternative, that may or may not work for MultiRoom Viewing is a wireless Ethernet bridge. This device will convert your Ethernet port on the back of your receiver into a wireless signal that can reach the rest of your house. It's not USB, but it works in much the same way as your USB mention would work.
> Cheers.


For the most part, your's has been the most informative post I have seen, just the facts without the hype.
Unfortunately, adding more cables is just not an option for me and it's the reason I have been asking for wireless capability for the last 5 years. It does no good to replace an ethernet cable with a coax, as I will still have a jump rope running through the middle of my house. Funny how the cost of wireless routers are give-aways now, but wireless ethernet bridges are still around $200 for a decent one, and they never work as advertised. Wireless USB adaptors are only $20.

Since the on-demand and special functions require an IP connection, I am stuck with with a jump rope in the middle of the floor or no service. This also allows my cellphone and laptop to see the recorded titles in the DVR list but not view them, but I can view pc and cellphone photos on the DVR as a slideshow.

BTW, my HR23 already has 500GB.

I just wish the receiver had both Sata and e-Sata terminals.
Hopefully someday DirecTV will get a clue and build wireless networking into the device, as this would be cheaper for everyone. I'm sure there is a marketing reason why they would rather push more boxes. This is why I think TIVO has an edge.

Thanks!


----------



## PackCat

scottandregan said:


> My point was to get rid of all of the Put downs and insults directed to good people by you and others. Many of the insults are directed at folks that do not work for Directv and do this for fun. Maybe if you sat back and thought about what you put down for the world to see things would be different.


It could be worse... you could be testing Toyotas! :lol:


----------



## PackCat

What would be cool is if they built a receiver that lets you skip the 15 minute satellite setup when you have a brown-out and simply want to turn the receiver back on, and not miss half a TV show. Even my TIVO unit lets you watch a recorded movie while it goes through the start-up process.


----------



## BattleScott

PackCat said:


> For the most part, your's has been the most informative post I have seen, just the facts without the hype.
> Unfortunately, adding more cables is just not an option for me and it's the reason I have been asking for wireless capability for the last 5 years. It does no good to replace an ethernet cable with a coax, as I will still have a jump rope running through the middle of my house. Funny how the cost of wireless routers are give-aways now, but wireless ethernet bridges are still around $200 for a decent one, and they never work as advertised. Wireless USB adaptors are only $20.
> 
> Since the on-demand and special functions require an IP connection, I am stuck with with a jump rope in the middle of the floor or no service. This also allows my cellphone and laptop to see the recorded titles in the DVR list but not view them, but I can view pc and cellphone photos on the DVR as a slideshow.
> 
> BTW, my HR23 already has 500GB.
> 
> I just wish the receiver had both Sata and e-Sata terminals.
> Hopefully someday DirecTV will get a clue and build wireless networking into the device, as this would be cheaper for everyone. I'm sure there is a marketing reason why they would rather push more boxes. This is why I think TIVO has an edge.
> 
> Thanks!


I'm not sure you understand what the DECA device is. You already have a Coax cable connected to your DVR (probably 2 of them unless you are on SWM already). The DECA adapters with a SWM multiswitch will allow you to use the existing coax feed to provide broadband connectivity as well. There is no need for any additional cabling to be installed.


----------



## johnp37

Nicholsen said:


> +1
> 
> I doubt you will get a direct response to either of those questions.
> 
> Posters on this board who have continued to insist that the HR21, HR22 and HR23 work perfectly, and are more than fast enough, while using free HR24's without disclosure, should be seriously embarrassed. :nono2:
> 
> Pick a position. Either the old receivers are too slow, or the new receiver is no big deal. You can have one position or the other, but not both.


An objective critique listing pros AND cons on the FIRST LOOK presentations? D* would not be happy. To paraphrase the Soup Nazi on Seinfeld: No(more) boxes for you for your First Look!


----------



## houskamp

PackCat said:


> For the most part, your's has been the most informative post I have seen, just the facts without the hype.
> Unfortunately, adding more cables is just not an option for me and it's the reason I have been asking for wireless capability for the last 5 years. It does no good to replace an ethernet cable with a coax, as I will still have a jump rope running through the middle of my house. Funny how the cost of wireless routers are give-aways now, but wireless ethernet bridges are still around $200 for a decent one, and they never work as advertised. Wireless USB adaptors are only $20.
> 
> Since the on-demand and special functions require an IP connection, I am stuck with with a jump rope in the middle of the floor or no service. This also allows my cellphone and laptop to see the recorded titles in the DVR list but not view them, but I can view pc and cellphone photos on the DVR as a slideshow.
> 
> BTW, my HR23 already has 500GB.
> 
> I just wish the receiver had both Sata and e-Sata terminals.
> Hopefully someday DirecTV will get a clue and build wireless networking into the device, as this would be cheaper for everyone. I'm sure there is a marketing reason why they would rather push more boxes. This is why I think TIVO has an edge.
> 
> Thanks!


 The H24 and HR24 only need ONE RG6 cable run to them.. they do EVERYTHING thru that ONE cable.. You add one deca adapter ANYWHERE on your SWM system to connect to the internet.. This ONE adapter can be at the switch, at a reciever, where ever it is convient to connect to your network equipment..


----------



## Sixto

Nicholsen said:


> +1
> 
> I doubt you will get a direct response to either of those questions.
> 
> Posters on this board who have continued to insist that the HR21, HR22 and HR23 work perfectly, and are more than fast enough, while using free HR24's without disclosure, should be seriously embarrassed. :nono2:
> 
> Pick a position. Either the old receivers are too slow, or the new receiver is no big deal. You can have one position or the other, but not both.


Been several direct responses.

I can only comment on the HR21-200 (and have). It's slow.

The HR24 is a joy. It's fast.

Simple as that. This is not a very difficult evaluation.


----------



## Sixto

PackCat said:


> Whoopdie Do! I think you are missing the trees for the forest.
> NOBODY wants any more stinking cables.
> 
> OK, so instead of a 50 foot ethernet cable running through the middle of my kitchen and living room, you are suggesting I can have a 50 foot coax cable running through my living room and kitchen floor instead? How stupid.
> 
> I live in a Condo, it's not like I can sling cables out my window and bury it underground or run cables through a basement. I have 2 tuner-cables that run from the dish to the receiver. That is it! Everything else in my house except for my Refrigerator and Satellite receiver have WiFi or remote built-in. Even my VoIP phone line will transfer phone calls through bluetooth from my cellphone.
> 
> If DECA can carry internet and tv signal over one coax, how am I suppose to split this signal at my PC/router since my router does not have a coax input ? Do I have to purchase another signal separation device or receiver?
> 
> My interest was to get IP and receiver signals to the room across my unit that doesn't require me to drill holes in the ceiling or create a railroad of jump ropes on my floor to install MORE CABLE.
> I apologize that I don't live in a trailer or in my mom`s garage/basement and can do as I please. I wish the testers with Reality Deficit Disorder would please keep this mind when they are trying to hype something that does nothing to improve on the current situation of normal real-world users.


It's very simple.

Every receiver already has a Coax cable. There are zero additional cables required for any receiver. Actually, if you have two cables today, tomorrow you would need only one cable, so less receiver cables.

The only one additional connection required is to bridge the Coax infrastructure to the Ethernet infrastructure somewhere/anywhere.

Either find a one location where Coax is close to Ethernet, or run Coax to an Ethernet location, or run Ethernet to a Coax location. If none of these options are possible, then use one of the announced and supported wireless options.

They are not going to put wireless in every box. Why would they, when Networking over Coax is easy and wireless is not optimal for MRV, and there are already supported wireless options for non-MRV.


----------



## Sixto

PackCat said:


> For the most part, your's has been the most informative post I have seen, just the facts without the hype.
> Unfortunately, adding more cables is just not an option for me and it's the reason I have been asking for wireless capability for the last 5 years ...


The HR24 vs HR23 comparison is at the beginning of the thread.

As mentioned in the previous post, there have been wireless options announced (for non-MRV).


----------



## Doug Brott

Nicholsen said:


> Posters on this board who have continued to insist that the HR21, HR22 and HR23 work perfectly, and are more than fast enough, while using free HR24's without disclosure, should be seriously embarrassed. :nono2:


I suspect you are generalizing here .. Not everyone (in the class of people you are talking about) is doing what you suggest.



> Pick a position. Either the old receivers are too slow, or the new receiver is no big deal. You can have one position or the other, but not both.


My position .. and you saw my video .. The HR23-700 is not slow, but the HR24-500 is clearly faster. That being said, others claim that their HR23-700 isn't nearly as fast as what they were seeing from mine .. So, YMMV.


----------



## Doug Brott

PackCat said:


> For the most part, your's has been the most informative post I have seen, just the facts without the hype.
> Unfortunately, adding more cables is just not an option for me and it's the reason I have been asking for wireless capability for the last 5 years. It does no good to replace an ethernet cable with a coax, as I will still have a jump rope running through the middle of my house. Funny how the cost of wireless routers are give-aways now, but wireless ethernet bridges are still around $200 for a decent one, and they never work as advertised. Wireless USB adaptors are only $20.


You are not adding any coax. If you have a satellite receiver that works, it already has a coax line coming into it, yes? It has to. That same line is where the network signals will pass.

Perhaps you are in an apartment and only have the one feed. If you only have the one STB, then MRV would not be useful to you anyway. You need at least one HD DVR, one HD receiver and a fast enough network to utilize MRV.

If all you are talking about is connecting one receiver to the Internet for DIRECTV On Demand, then yes, you want to get a wireless adapter in your situation. DECA would be of zero use to you.

If, on the other hand, you have multiple STBs capable of MRV and your only desire is MRV (no Internet connectivity) , then you can simply add DECAs on the back of your exiting receivers or add an Hx24 and all receivers can talk using the SAT line coming into your receiver - assuming you are on SWiM.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

PackCat said:


> Whoopdie Do! I think you are missing the trees for the forest.
> NOBODY wants any more stinking cables.
> 
> OK, so instead of a 50 foot ethernet cable running through the middle of my kitchen and living room, you are suggesting I can have a 50 foot coax cable running through my living room and kitchen floor instead? How stupid.
> 
> I live in a Condo, it's not like I can sling cables out my window and bury it underground or run cables through a basement. I have 2 tuner-cables that run from the dish to the receiver. That is it! Everything else in my house except for my Refrigerator and Satellite receiver have WiFi or remote built-in. Even my VoIP phone line will transfer phone calls through bluetooth from my cellphone.
> 
> If DECA can carry internet and tv signal over one coax, how am I suppose to split this signal at my PC/router since my router does not have a coax input ? Do I have to purchase another signal separation device or receiver?
> 
> My interest was to get IP and receiver signals to the room across my unit that doesn't require me to drill holes in the ceiling or create a railroad of jump ropes on my floor to install MORE CABLE.
> I apologize that I don't live in a trailer or in my mom`s garage/basement and can do as I please. I wish the testers with Reality Deficit Disorder would please keep this mind when they are trying to hype something that does nothing to improve on the current situation of normal real-world users.


I think you're missing how it works.

If you have an HD receiver it has to have a coax cable already going to it. That cable is used for DECA as well as supplying the satellite signal to your receiver.

AAMOF, with SWiM you only need a single coax cable to an HD DVR and that will supply two tuners and DECA for MRV. If you need to connect to your ethernet you can put a DECA at any convenient place in you run of coax. You won't have to run 50' of cable if you don't want to. 

So you see, you only need a single cable going to your HD DVR for both tuners and DECA.

Mike


----------



## bobnielsen

PackCat said:


> What would be cool is if they built a receiver that lets you skip the 15 minute satellite setup when you have a brown-out and simply want to turn the receiver back on, and not miss half a TV show. Even my TIVO unit lets you watch a recorded movie while it goes through the start-up process.


I had the same complaint until I added a UPS to each of my DVRs.


----------



## bobnielsen

PackCat said:


> Funny how the cost of wireless routers are give-aways now, but wireless ethernet bridges are still around $200 for a decent one, and they never work as advertised.


Directv sells WET610N bridges for $80 and they work quite well. You could take a router and use DD-WRT firmware to put it into bridge mode (plus you get multiple ports to use with other devices).


----------



## Stuart Sweet

I continue to state, both publicly and privately, that the HR24 is very very fast BUT that I find the HR23 is sufficiently fast. I don't see any conflict between these statements.


----------



## The Scotsman

Hi Stuart
I've just read this entire thread, searching for any mention of HDMI 1.3 or higher. I see that *texasmoose* did broach the subject on page 19. The reason for my interest is that I believe HDMI 1.3 would make it possible for the HR24 to deal with enhanced sound formats like Dolby Digital Plus. Not only would that sound better (perhaps) than the original DD5.1 at 384 or 448 kbps, but 7.1 audio would be possible too.

Is there any chance the new H24/HR24 will be capable of this new sound format?

Archie


----------



## Nicholsen

Sixto said:


> Been several direct responses.
> 
> I can only comment on the HR21-200 (and have). It's slow.
> 
> The HR24 is a joy. It's fast.
> 
> Simple as that. This is not a very difficult evaluation.


You are one of the very few "positive" poster in this thread who has been willing to acknowledge that simple (but unpleasant) truth. (This is actually the second time.)

That gives you a boat load of of credibility in my book.


----------



## Sixto

Been trying to find a little more info on the processor.

From Trident Micro earnings call:"Last month, it was announced that our SoC had been qualified by DirecTV for its next generation high definition DVR satellite receivers. This was our first high definition win with DirecTV. It is projected to represent significant revenue for Trident in 2010 and positions us well with this operator for their continuing high definition and high definition DVR programs going forward."

http://seekingalpha.com/article/187...ing-12-31-09-earnings-call-transcript?page=-1​This is somewhat old news, but interesting none-the-less.


----------



## Canis Lupus

I've commented in this thread and continue to hold the same position I've always held. My wife and I escaped from the kids this weekend, but I have my tripod and camera in hand and will try to record some speed tests tonight, taking some questions/concerns from this thread and using some of those as the tests. 

That said, here's my take:
I have 2 x 20-700s that are plenty responsive and fast for my liking. 

My 10 yr old has a 21-700 that I find to be a bit slower than the 20-700s.

My younger kids have an R22-100 which I find to be by far the slowest of them all. This is why they have it. I press play on a folder of Yo Gabba Gabba and I'm done with it. 

The H24 and HR24 are about 4x faster than the R22-100, about 2.5x faster than the 21-700, and 2x faster than the 20-700s. YMMV.


----------



## Nicholsen

Doug Brott said:


> I suspect you are generalizing here .. Not everyone (in the class of people you are talking about) is doing what you suggest.
> 
> My position .. and you saw my video .. The HR23-700 is not slow, but the HR24-500 is clearly faster. That being said, others claim that their HR23-700 isn't nearly as fast as what they were seeing from mine .. So, YMMV.


Your position is that it is the "others" who "claim" their units are slow? This sounds a bit like Lost, where DVRs mysteriously change speed as you move them from house to house on the island.

You can't just acknowledge that the HR21, 22 and 23 units are really pretty slow, and many people find their speed unsatisfactory. If they are fast enough, why go to a faster (and more expensive) chip set in the HR24? What would be the point? Fast enough is fast enough. Right?

I am suggesting that people who have been enjoying the use of a free and blazing fast HR24 have a bit of nerve to insist that those of us who "claim" their HR21s, HR22s and HR23s are too slow are wrong. I think if I had a free HR24 to play with, and use as my primary receiver, I would feel a lot better about using my painfully slow HR21 as a server.

In fact, it has been suggested that might be a really hot set up.


----------



## allenn

Stuart Sweet said:


> The ethernet passthrough was never a supported feature. In fact, it was strongly discouraged. The workaround: an inexpensive switch......


Thanks for the reply.

Would a ethernet hub work?

I currently have a Linksys game adapter connected to an Hr21-100 which in turn is connected to a PS3 via the HR pass-through. This works great now. I'm justing planning 
ahead.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Stuart Sweet said:


> I continue to state, both publicly and privately, that the HR24 is very very fast BUT that I find the HR23 is sufficiently fast. I don't see any conflict between these statements.


There is no conflict in your statement above. HOWEVER...

...I'm one of those people who stated that Doug's video of _HIS_ HR23-700 was speedier than mine. Granted, mine isn't always a bottle of Heinz ketchup (think 80's commercial) as it's often dependent on several factors, BUT a lot of the time, I do not consider mine to be sufficiently fast.

Prior to moving from the HR10-250 to the HR20-700, I was told that the HR2x units were FAST compared to the HR10-250, and while that statement can be left up for debate, I have no complaints about the speed of EITHER unit... as I can often do everything I need to do without wishing it would hurry up. I can't say that about the HR23-700.

Now, in all fairness, I am a power user. I ALWAYS (Summer excluded) have my Series Links maxed out at 50.... and it's possible that if I cut them down, I'd have a faster machine, but 50 is too small a number for me as it is, and cutting it down more is out of the question.

I may complain some about the lack of certain features on the HR2x units, as well as certain features (50 Series Link limit, etc.), but *I LIKE MY HR20-700.* It's a good unit. I do not feel that way about the HR23-700... as much I dislike saying that (23 is my favorite number).

~Alan


----------



## Sixto

The Scotsman said:


> Hi Stuart
> I've just read this entire thread, searching for any mention of HDMI 1.3 or higher. I see that *texasmoose* did broach the subject on page 19. The reason for my interest is that I believe HDMI 1.3 would make it possible for the HR24 to deal with enhanced sound formats like Dolby Digital Plus. Not only would that sound better (perhaps) than the original DD5.1 at 384 or 448 kbps, but 7.1 audio would be possible too.
> 
> Is there any chance the new H24/HR24 will be capable of this new sound format?
> 
> Archie


The suspected chipset is: http://www.tridentmicro.com/producttree/stb/satellite-stb/cx2450x/

Says HDMI 1.3.


----------



## jasonki32

I can concur that the HR24 is a joy to use. I have 2 HR21s and an HR22. The HR22 is slightly faster than the HR21s but the HR24 is definitely a move in the right direction. Scrolling, channel changes, moving through the menus are significantly faster than any other of my receivers.

The comments that were made in the first look were made after a significant amount of time of testing. So the initial "wow factor" was gone.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Nicholsen said:


> Your position is that it is the "others" who "claim" their units are slow? This sounds like a bit like Lost, where DVRs mysteriously change speed as you move them from house to house on the island.
> 
> You can't just acknowledge that the HR21, 22 and 23 units are really pretty slow, and many people find their speed unsatisfactory. If they are fast enough, why go to a faster (and more expensive) chip set in the HR24? What would be the point? Fast enough is fast enough. Right?
> 
> I am suggesting that people who have been enjoying the use of a free and blazing fast HR24 have a bit of nerve to insist that those of us who "claim" their HR21s, HR22s and HR23s are too slow are wrong. I think if I had a free HR24 to play with, and use as my primary receiver, I would feel a lot better about using my painfully slow HR21 as a server.
> 
> In fact, it has been suggested that might be a really hot set up.


You need to do a search. You will find that many of the people you're talking about have complained about their receivers being slow. In my case I've said over and over that my HR21-100 is pretty slow (sometimes painfully so). However, my HR23 is faster.

Please check your facts before you discount what we're saying. Of course I haven't made any claims on speed of the HR24 and have only related what the testers have posted but I know those guys and I trust them...not only that, but the video Doug posted is the last bit of proof anyone could need. 

Unless you have some info that the tester are being less then dishonest, you really should quit making accusations...and just because you haven't made any direct accusations everyone knows what you mean. You're assuming that because they may have gotten something for "free" you can't trust them.

All anyone can say is wait until you or someone _you_ trust gets one. Until you get something concrete, you really should let it go.

Besides, I don't recall anyone saying you are wrong about the speed of your receivers. I've seen plenty of people, including myself, relating how fast their receivers are...unless you can post a link to the person telling you're wrong about your receiver. 

Mike


----------



## David MacLeod

you're wasting your breath Mike, he seems to be looking for a way to twist stuff and fight over it.
my hr21's are slower than my hr20's were, but nowhere near as bad as a lot of people report. I guess I should drive a screwdriver down through them to make them wok as badly as others do.

I generally run approx 35 SL's on each (3) of them, really do wonder if SL level affects performance.



MicroBeta said:


> You need to do a search. You will find that many of the people you're talking about have complained about their receivers being slow. In my case I've said over and over that my HR21-100 is pretty slow (sometimes painfully so). However, my HR23 is faster.
> 
> Please check your facts before you discount what we're saying. Of course I haven't made any claims on speed of the HR24 and have only related what the testers have posted but I know those guys and I trust them...not only that, but the video Doug posted is the last bit of proof anyone could need.
> 
> Unless you have some info that the tester are being less then dishonest, you really should quit making accusations...and just because you haven't made any direct accusations everyone knows what you mean. You're assuming that because they may have gotten something for "free" you can't trust them.
> 
> All anyone can say is wait until you or someone _you_ trust gets one. Until you get something concrete, you really should let it go.
> 
> Besides, I don't recall anyone saying you are wrong about the speed of your receivers. I've seen plenty of people, including myself, relating how fast their receivers are...unless you can post a link to the person telling you're wrong about your receiver.
> 
> Mike


----------



## Canis Lupus

Nicholsen said:


> This sounds a bit like Lost, where DVRs mysteriously change speed as you move them from house to house on the island.


I would submit that this, in fact, is true - and an island in Lost is not even required for DVRs to change speed.

There's no mystery here. Show me 2 houses on your island with _exactly_ the same setup and let's move a DVR between those 2. Then I'll call it a mystery if the speed changes.


----------



## carl6

Alan Gordon said:


> Now, in all fairness, I am a power user. I ALWAYS (Summer excluded) have my Series Links maxed out at 50....


I think at one time I managed to get up to a high of 15 series links. I can't even comprehend 50.

Right now I have four DVRs active on my account. They have 8, 6, 8 and 9 series links at the moment (many are duplicates).

I'm not knocking you for having as many as you do, however I would suggest that both of us are not representative of a typical user. I'm low and you are way high.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

carl6 said:


> I think at one time I managed to get up to a high of 15 series links. I can't even comprehend 50.
> 
> Right now I have four DVRs active on my account. They have 8, 6, 8 and 9 series links at the moment (many are duplicates).
> 
> I'm not knocking you for having as many as you do, however I would suggest that both of us are not representative of a typical user. I'm low and you are way high.


I've been close. Right now I have about 40 on on of my DVRs. I can't say as it's any slower because of it though. At least not noticable to me.

Mike


----------



## Davenlr

Nicholsen said:


> I am suggesting that people who have been enjoying the use of a free and blazing fast HR24 have a bit of nerve to insist that those of us who "claim" their HR21s, HR22s and HR23s are too slow are wrong.


Exactly what does the fact that they have a "free" HR24 have to do with anything? I have a "free" HR22-100. Its slow, it misses direct entry channel changes, and makes me wait to see if my press of the guide button worked. My HR20-700 does not have any of those problems. Were I to have a HR24, whether free, or leased, I would be stupid not to use it as my primary box, if it was the fastest one I had.


----------



## Alan Gordon

carl6 said:


> I'm not knocking you for having as many as you do, however I would suggest that both of us are not representative of a typical user. I'm low and you are way high.


ABSOLUTELY!!

However, it's like I recently stated (multiple times) on the TiVo thread:



Alan Gordon said:


> Some of us have more than 50 series we'd like to record. Another thing to add too is that I watch several cable series that run for several episodes, and then go on hiatus... and so on... so being able to keep those Series Links even when the show isn't on, means I don't have to worry about when it comes back. For instance, two programs I watch on the HR10-250 ("White Collar" and "Psych") just ended their season. On my HR10-250, I can keep the Season Passes and when the new episodes start, it will show up.
> 
> Another thing too is that some channels like SciFi tend to air some older shows from time to time in mini-marathons. Shows I enjoy watching from time to time. I currently have several of these shows as Season Passes on my HR10-250. I don't have room to do this on my HR2x DVRs.





Alan Gordon said:


> Not everybody has 6 DVRs. Some people have multiple DVRs, but not want certain DVRs to record certain programs. Some people want their main DVR to do the majority of the work.





Alan Gordon said:


> Absolutely. One thing to keep in mind is that with there being a charge, not everybody will have MRV... and with the advent of MRV, the 50-Series Link limit becomes even more of an issue as some people might not see a need for more than one HD-DVR.


Hopefully, with the new chipset, DirecTV can manage to find a way to not only find a way to allow "power users" who max out the Series Link limit to not experience the drop in speed, but also to find a way to do away with the limit without sacrificing much of the speed.

~Alan


----------



## Syzygy

carl6 said:


> I think at one time I managed to get up to a high of 15 series links. I can't even comprehend 50.
> 
> Right now I have four DVRs active on my account. They have 8, 6, 8 and 9 series links at the moment (many are duplicates).
> 
> I'm not knocking you for having [close to 50], however I would suggest that both of us are not representative of a typical user. I'm low and you are way high.


I've said this elsewhere: If it weren't for ARSLs (which I hate having to use), I'd have around 70 SLs on my *only* HR21; as it is, I have 33.

And my HR21 is about half as fast as Doug's HR23.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Syzygy said:


> I've said this elsewhere: If it weren't for ARSLs, I'd have around 70 SLs on my *only* HR21; as it is, I have 33.
> 
> And my HR21 is about half as fast as Doug's HR23.


My HR21 is much slower than my HR23, which is slower than my HR20 but I can't say that the number of SLs have anything to do with it. There are others who have noticed a correlation but I'm not willing to remove any SLs to test it out. 

The video clearly shows that the big bump in processor speed makes it faster than even my HR20. I bleepin' like the HR24. 

Mike


----------



## Alan Gordon

Syzygy said:


> I've said this elsewhere: If it weren't for ARSLs (which I hate having to use), I'd have around 70 SLs on my *only* HR21; as it is, I have 33.


I don't use Autorecords, but without the limit, I'd probably have somewhere around 70-75 myself.

Another thing for some people to take into account is that Autorecords count as Series Links as well...

~Alan


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Alan Gordon said:


> I don't use Autorecords, but without the limit, I'd probably have somewhere around 70-75 myself.
> 
> Another thing for some people to take into account is that Autorecords count as Series Links as well...
> 
> ~Alan


I don't understand. Are you saying that Autorecords + SLs can't exceed 50?

Mike


----------



## Alan Gordon

MicroBeta said:


> I don't understand. Are you saying that Autorecords + SLs can't exceed 50?


*Correct!* 

~Alan


----------



## whatliesbeyond

bobnielsen said:


> Directv sells WET610N bridges for $80 and they work quite well. You could take a router and use DD-WRT firmware to put it into bridge mode (plus you get multiple ports to use with other devices).


Yes, ways exist to connect a D* receiver wirelessly. But they are inelegant in comparison to having wireless n already built in. They require users to purchase another electronic device which is somewhat costly ($80 plus I assume shipping), and they require one more power adapter plugged into your power strip. In contrast, I'll bet D* could get wireless n chips in bulk for less than 5 dollars each, thereby making them available to all of their customers with these new receivers. D* wouldn't even have to spend much time working on the software to enable the wireless chip, since the receivers already have software to detect and configure an external WET610N. And to avoid any problems, make enabling the connection an option the subscriber has to specifically choose to enable (like MRV is now).

Really, for a high-end electronic device not to have this capability built in these days is almost strange. Even refrigerators and toasters have it (well, not toasters, yet). Even if DECA is a preferred route for MRV (and I have no problem with this approach), it still makes sense to give Non-MRV people an easy way to access their home network and internet connection, so they can download on demand content, take advantage of those nice Directv apps, enjoy the music and pictures on their home computers in their livingrooms, and finally do away with the need for a landline phone hookup. For a very nominal amount, D* could have made life easier and more pleasant for a lot of their subscribers, and made themselves look good as well in terms of being perceived as high-end.

I think their desire to manufacture these receivers as inexpensively as possible is short-sighted (and that goes also for using a lower-end chip that's been around since 2007, and is rated at only 730 MIPS or so). To me, it seems they are being penny-wise and pound foolish, and hurting their aim of being the centerpiece of the home entertainment experience. Put in a fast chip like the Broadcom one you mentioned, and you have room to add features in the future without slowing down existing functions. Put in wireless n, and maybe bluetooth too, so people can connect their cell phones and other devices seemlessly, and then maybe even add software to the NR that lets people use Netflix or Pandora without having to hook up a computer to their TVs. Make people want to say, those D* guys are pretty sharp and cutting edge. Surely the cost, even multiplied by millions of receivers, isn't that much in the big scheme of things. Probably even less than they pay to those Hollywood stars . . . .


----------



## DogLover

Nicholsen said:


> Pick a position. Either the old receivers are too slow, or the new receiver is no big deal. You can have one position or the other, but not both.





Nicholsen said:
 

> You can't just acknowledge that the HR21, 22 and 23 units are really pretty slow, and many people find their speed unsatisfactory. If they are fast enough, why go to a faster (and more expensive) chip set in the HR24? What would be the point? Fast enough is fast enough. Right?


While I have an HR22 that is annoying slow at times, I just don't understand your logic here.

My Honda CRV is fast enough. A nice little sports car would be much faster. I'm satisfied with my Honda, but that doesn't mean that I might dream of a sports car. Fast enough is never fast enough!

You could argue that the sports car is faster and more expensive than necessary. (Not to mention the insurance hikes, speeding tickets, and eventual revokation of my license that would inevitably result from such a purchase.)

However, the chip in the HR21/2/3 is several years old. There's no evidence that the new chip is more expensive. In fact chips usually get faster and cheaper over time. Not to mention that unlike sports cars, there is no penalty for processors running faster. In fact, the faster they run, the more features you can add and still have usable speed. As long as it is within budget, faster is always better with processors.

I just don't share your opinion. The HR21/2/3 could be fast enough, and the HR24's speed increase would still be a great thing.

I have a bigger queston:

We've seen a video of an HR23 with good speed. My HR22's speed ranges from okay to annoyingly slow. Others have reported that their DVR ranges from annoyingly slow to unusably slow. *Why is there such a big difference? Are all of the HR21/2/3s capable of good speed and something (SLs, installation, eSATA use, day they were manufactured, direction their facing?) is keeping them from being that fast?*


----------



## Mike Bertelson

whatliesbeyond said:


> Yes, ways exist to connect a D* receiver wirelessly. But they are inelegant in comparison to having wireless n already built in. They require users to purchase another electronic device which is somewhat costly ($80 plus I assume shipping), and they require one more power adapter plugged into your power strip. In contrast, I'll bet D* could get wireless n chips in bulk for less than 5 dollars each, thereby making them available to all of their customers with these new receivers. D* wouldn't even have to spend much time working on the software to enable the wireless chip, since the receivers already have software to detect and configure an external WET610N. And to avoid any problems, make enabling the connection an option the subscriber has to specifically choose to enable (like MRV is now).
> 
> Really, for a high-end electronic device not to have this capability built in these days is almost strange. Even refrigerators and toasters have it (well, not toasters, yet). Even if DECA is a preferred route for MRV (and I have no problem with this approach), it still makes sense to give Non-MRV people an easy way to access their home network and internet connection, so they can download on demand content, take advantage of those nice Directv apps, enjoy the music and pictures on their home computers in their livingrooms, and finally do away with the need for a landline phone hookup. For a very nominal amount, D* could have made life easier and more pleasant for a lot of their subscribers, and made themselves look good as well in terms of being perceived as high-end.
> 
> I think their desire to manufacture these receivers as inexpensively as possible is short-sighted (and that goes also for using a lower-end chip that's been around since 2007, and is rated at only 730 MIPS or so). To me, it seems they are being penny-wise and pound foolish, and hurting their aim of being the centerpiece of the home entertainment experience. Put in a fast chip like the Broadcom one you mentioned, and you have room to add features in the future without slowing down existing functions. Put in wireless n, and maybe bluetooth too, so people can connect their cell phones and other devices seemlessly, and then maybe even add software to the NR that lets people use Netflix or Pandora without having to hook up a computer to their TVs. Make people want to say, those D* guys are pretty sharp and cutting edge. Surely the cost, even multiplied by millions of receivers, isn't that much in the big scheme of things. Probably even less than they pay to those Hollywood stars . . . .


I think the reason they haven't gone wireless is because it's not the best solution for MRV. They've chosen DECA (DirecTVs version of MoCA) and have built that into the HR24/H24.

I have several new components in my living room (w/in the last year) and none of them have wireless ethernet. I just searched through BBs site an didn't find any A/V equipment that has wireless ethernet so I don't understand your comment that most mainstream electronics have it built in. :scratchin Not that the HR24 is high end electronics. It's going to be the primary new install HD DVR. The HR21Pro was supposed to the high end piece of gear.

Mike


----------



## Alan Gordon

DogLover said:


> I have a bigger queston:
> 
> We've seen a video of an HR23 with good speed. My HR22's speed ranges from okay to annoyingly slow. Others have reported that their DVR ranges from annoyingly slow to unusably slow. *Why is there such a big difference? Are all of the HR21/2/3s capable of good speed and something (SLs, installation, eSATA use, day they were manufactured, direction their facing?) is keeping them from being that fast?*


I don't really notice that big of a difference when using eSATA compared to the internal. I do know there is a difference depending on one's SL usage.

I also know that firmware can make a big difference as well.

~Alan


----------



## spartanstew

Nicholsen said:


> If they are fast enough, why go to a faster (and more expensive) chip set in the HR24? What would be the point? Fast enough is fast enough. Right?


Seriously? Did you think that through before typing it at all?

I've always thought my units were fast enough.

But the video posted shows that Doug's HR23 and the new HR24 are both faster than any of my units.

So, while fast enough was fine, I'd certainly enjoy one of the faster units (and am glad the made to point to make it faster).

You really don't see the point in improving something that many people thought was fine?


----------



## Aztec Pilot

Great First Look! Been waiting for the next generation, to upgrade some older boxes . I will take 2! Nice job guys!


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> I don't really notice that big of a difference when using eSATA compared to the internal. I do know there is a difference depending on one's SL usage.
> 
> I also know that firmware can make a big difference as well.
> 
> ~Alan


All mine are in the mid 40s and I haven't seen any significant speed change.
"I could see" the more SLs you have and right after a guide update, that the number of SLs might cause a slow down as they get sorted, but none of my DVRs have ever become unbearably slow.
I also don't why some users do have such slow DVRs. Enough post about this problem so it must be happening, but without doing some swap & test, it must be so hard to find the cause, since while the HR21/22/22 are slower than the HR20, those that post say that their HR20(s) are also slow.
Many complain about not being able to numerically enter channels, yet mine have never had the problem.
I have no idea as to why some do & others don't. :shrug:


----------



## DogLover

Alan Gordon said:


> I don't really notice that big of a difference when using eSATA compared to the internal. I do know there is a difference depending on one's SL usage.
> 
> I also know that firmware can make a big difference as well.
> 
> ~Alan


Except that from the reports on this board, DVRs with the same firmware experience different speeds. So, while the firmware may be able to speed up (or slow down) how the DVRs run, it's the differences between machines that are really puzzling.

I do vaguely recall hearing that one reason the 50 SL limit was originally put into place on the HR20's was that allowing more slowed the system down. (I don't know if that was true, or just a rumor.)

I have had 49/50 on my HR20, and still founds its speed acceptable. I've never had more than 25 on my HR22, and it always slower than the HR20, and at times slows down enough to be annoying. (Makes me want to add some more just to see if it slows down noticeably. May try that this week.)

If I see a big difference, I'll start a new thread. I don't want to take this one too far off of discussing the new HR24.


----------



## Alan Gordon

veryoldschool said:


> All mine are in the mid 40s and I haven't seen any significant speed change.


I think somewhere in the 30s are the sweet spot... as far as speeding up goes.



veryoldschool said:


> "I could see" the more SLs you have and right after a guide update, that the number of SLs might cause a slow down as they get sorted, but none of my DVRs have ever become unbearably slow.


Obviously, you see an even bigger slowdown should the guide cache be flushed (for whatever reason)... but otherwise, I don't know.



veryoldschool said:


> I also don't why some users do have such slow DVRs. Enough post about this problem so it must be happening, but without doing some swap & test, it must be so hard to find the cause, since while the HR21/22/22 are slower than the HR20, those that post say that their HR20(s) are also slow.


My HR20-700 is consistent with the speeds of my HR10-250 and TiVo Series 3... aside from a few functions. It could be faster, but it's plenty sufficient for me.



veryoldschool said:


> Many complain about not being able to numerically enter channels, yet mine have never had the problem.


A frequent problem of mine. Luckily, I rarely watch live TV, and I have QuickTune with several channels saved (like The Weather Channel). I have MANY remote issues.

~Alan


----------



## houskamp

Alan Gordon said:


> A frequent problem of mine. Luckily, I rarely watch live TV, and I have QuickTune with several channels saved (like The Weather Channel).* I have MANY remote issues*.
> 
> ~Alan


 Have you ever tried moving the receiver? There have been several cases of remote interference from TVs (esp Aquos ones)..

By the way the new 24s seem much less susceptible to this problem as well..


----------



## Doug Brott

houskamp said:


> Have you ever tried moving the receiver? There have been several cases of remote interference from TVs (esp Aquos ones)..
> 
> By the way the new 24s seem much less susceptible to this problem as well..


Yup and with the TV set in my video, I've had the exact "WTH doesn't the remote work" problem. Once I figured out it was the IR from the actual LCD panel .. I made some adjustments and NEVER have that problem now.


----------



## Alan Gordon

houskamp said:


> Have you ever tried moving the receiver? There have been several cases of remote interference from TVs (esp Aquos ones)..
> 
> By the way the new 24s seem much less susceptible to this problem as well..


If you're referring to different spots in the room, yes, I have... not for this reason, but just by re-organizing some stuff last year.

I've also tried multiple remotes, multiple receivers (HR23-700, HR20-700, HR20-100), multiple TVs, swapping the remotes with the different receivers, switching between IR/RF, and more.

The only thing I have found that does the job is firmware... and the same firmware on two different receivers does not equate the same results. My HR20-700 button presses have been working pretty good right now, but not my HR23-700 which is terrible... and they both use the same firmware.

*BTW, the issue is not a CE issue as I've had the same problems on the last several NRs as well... hence why I'm talking freely about it outside the CE section.*

~Alan


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Alan Gordon said:


> If you're referring to different spots in the room, yes, I have... not for this reason, but just by re-organizing some stuff last year.
> 
> I've also tried multiple remotes, multiple receivers (HR23-700, HR20-700, HR20-100), multiple TVs, swapping the remotes with the different receivers, switching between IR/RF, and more.
> 
> The only thing I have found that does the job is firmware... and the same firmware on two different receivers does not equate the same results. My HR20-700 button presses have been working pretty good right now, but not my HR23-700 which is terrible... and they both use the same firmware.
> 
> *BTW, the issue is not a CE issue as I've had the same problem on the last several NRs as well... hence why I'm talking freely about it outside the CE section.*
> 
> ~Alan


What he is saying is that there are certain TV's that cause IR interference with with the receivers and was wondering if that's what your problem was. IIRC, they were the Sharp Aquos. I seem to remember some other TVs too but I can't recall at the moment. If that is a potential problem then moving them around the room may not help.

Mike

Mike


----------



## Alan Gordon

MicroBeta said:


> What he is saying is that there are certain TV's that cause IR interference with with the receivers and was wondering if that's what your problem was. IIRC, they were the Sharp Aquos. I seem to remember some other TVs too but I can't recall at the moment. If that is a potential problem then moving them around the room may not help.


I understood! 

My TV is a Sony KDL-46W4100. While my HR23-700 has only been connected to this TV, I used to have the HR20-700 in this same room... which was connected to at least two other TVs... and it exhibited the same problem.

I have also experienced the problem with my HR20-700 in a different room with a completely different TV (yet, I don't have the problem right now).

~Alan


----------



## Canis Lupus

DogLover said:


> Why is there such a big difference? Are all of the HR21/2/3s capable of good speed and something (SLs, installation, eSATA use, day they were manufactured, direction their facing?) is keeping them from being that fast?


Exactly my point. Different people report different results using way too many variables for there to be a hard-lined irrefutable answer.

I'll try my best to record this data on video at the exact same location within my setup, using at least 3 different DVR models, and see what I can come up with. Even _then_, though, it will only be from using _my_ setup, _and_ my setup using the receivers in their current states, so the results could _still_ come into question from either camp. But at least it'll be a starting point for a reasonable conversation. So I'll do my best to record this.


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> I understood!
> 
> My TV is a Sony KDL-46W4100. While my HR23-700 has only been connected to this TV, I used to have the HR20-700 in this same room... which was connected to at least two other TVs... and it exhibited the same problem.
> 
> I have also experienced the problem with my HR20-700 in a different room with a completely different TV (yet, I don't have the problem right now).
> 
> ~Alan


My Sony XBR is horrible for IR interference, not just with DirecTV receivers, so I use RF on everything I can.


----------



## Alan Gordon

veryoldschool said:


> My Sony XBR is horrible for IR interference, not just with DirecTV receivers, so I use RF on everything I can.


I have only experienced this issue with HR2x DVRs. No other IR issues with other devices I've had. The DirecTV remote works fine with volume on my AVR.

I also use RF (which SUCKS) on both units... particularly the HR23-700 which has some sort of IR issue.

*It was not mentioned in the First Look. Has the RF feature improved on the HR24-500?!*

~Alan


----------



## Nicholsen

spartanstew said:


> Seriously? Did you think that through before typing it at all?
> 
> I've always thought my units were fast enough.
> 
> But the video posted shows that Doug's HR23 and the new HR24 are both faster than any of my units.
> 
> So, while fast enough was fine, I'd certainly enjoy one of the faster units (and am glad the made to point to make it faster).
> 
> You really don't see the point in improving something that many people thought was fine?


If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

You could take the cost of the faster chip and add on-board wireless, as suggested/requested by another poster.

IMHO, If you would enjoy a faster unit, that implies you really aren't all that satisfied with the speed of your current unit. I understand you may not see it that way.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Nicholsen said:


> If it ain't broke, don't fix it.


What? I could have sworn you've posted in this thread multiple times that it was broke????

Sorry but you're Losing me.

EDIT: Nevermind I see now. You've posted multiple times that _others_ have posted it's broke. Remind us again of what equipment you have and what your issues are please, and we'll see if we might be able to help.


----------



## Doug Brott

Nicholsen said:


> If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
> 
> You could take the cost of the faster chip and add on-board wireless, as suggested/requested by another poster.
> 
> IMHO, If you would enjoy a faster unit, that implies you really aren't all that satisfied with the speed of your current unit. I understand you may not see it that way.


Hmmm .. Don't you think it's too slow? Wouldn't you want a faster processor? Guess what, it's out now. The choice has been made DIRECTV has moved on.

Why must we proclaim dissatisfaction in previous technologies now that a new technology is out. Now that something new is out .. Yup, that's what I want because it is faster. But before the HR24 was available .. I wasn't dissatisfied. I really don't get what you want. The only thing I can guess is that you want me and perhaps others (not _Lost_ 'others') to say that the HR20/HR21/HR22/HR23 are bad DVRs .. Nope, I've been happy with them .. The HR24 is an improvement and yeah, I'll take the improvement. But I don't think I share the level of dissatisfaction with the earlier models that you do.


----------



## Nicholsen

Canis Lupus said:


> What? I could have sworn you've posted in this thread multiple times that it was broke????
> 
> Sorry but you're Losing me.
> 
> EDIT: Nevermind I see now. You've posted multiple times that _others_ have posted it's broke. Remind us again of what equipment you have and what your issues are please, and we'll see if we might be able to help.


Sorry for the confusion.

I think its too slow, and therefore broken.

I was just taking the boosters' prior claims about the HR21-22-23 to their logical conclusion.

After having many people on the board insist for two years that the HR21-22-23 are plenty fast enough, it's hard to listen to them now gush about how improved the HR24 is.


----------



## Nicholsen

Doug Brott said:


> Hmmm .. Don't you think it's too slow? Wouldn't you want a faster processor? Guess what, it's out now. The choice has been made DIRECTV has moved on.
> 
> Why must we proclaim dissatisfaction in previous technologies now that a new technology is out. Now that something new is out .. Yup, that's what I want because it is faster. But before the HR24 was available .. I wasn't dissatisfied. I really don't get what you want. The only thing I can guess is that you want me and perhaps others (not _Lost_ 'others') to say that the HR20/HR21/HR22/HR23 are bad DVRs .. Nope, I've been happy with them .. The HR24 is an improvement and yeah, I'll take the improvement. But I don't think I share the level of dissatisfaction with the earlier models that you do.


The HR21-22-23 owners have suffered enough already.

I suggest D* give owners of the HR21-22-23 a significant credit ($100) toward the cost of an upgrade to the HR24 (without requiring a 2 yr. contract extension), and put them at the top of the list for HR24's as they become available.

That would seem fair. No one has to loose face by actually admitting the old receivers were too slow.


----------



## HooliganChuck

I'm a little surprised at the return of the non-wideband tuners that require b-band converters. Otherwise, I'm impressed


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter

Nicholsen said:


> The HR21-22-23 owners have suffered enough already.
> 
> I suggest D* give owners of the HR21-22-23 a significant credit ($100) toward the cost of an upgrade to the HR24 (without requiring a 2 yr. contract extension), and put them at the top of the list for HR24's as they become available.
> 
> That would seem fair. No one has to loose face by actually admitting the old receivers were too slow.


dont hold your breath on getting credit and no extension. I think they might do credit or discounts for the upgrades as you can usually always get a rep to give you some sort of discount on purchasing a new box. The 2yr extension is something I doubt they ever do away with. It'd be nice if they did but i doubt it as that guarentee's them revenue there.

If you've never used a TWC box then you dont know problems. When they switched to the new system("Navigator") from the old("Passport") it was god awfull and had a boat load of problems. From what I hear it still does and my neighbors box is about the speed of my HR23 maybe slower but deff NOT faster.

Again when speaking of overall speed YMMV depending on what your doing and your setup.


----------



## Canis Lupus

HooliganChuck said:


> I'm a little surprised at the return of the non-wideband tuners that require b-band converters. Otherwise, I'm impressed


This is only for non-SWM systems. The SWMs take care of this so no BBCs are required in SWM setups.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Nicholsen said:


> Sorry for the confusion.
> 
> I think its too slow, and therefore broken.
> 
> I was just taking the boosters' prior claims about the HR21-22-23 to their logical conclusion.
> 
> After having many people on the board insist for two years that the HR21-22-23 are plenty fast enough, it's hard to listen to them now gush about how improved the HR24 is.


OK but what receivers do you have and what are you issues with them? Maybe we can help? :shrug:


----------



## RAD

Canis Lupus said:


> This is only for non-SWM systems. The SWMs take care of this so no BBCs are required in SWM setups.


I think saying 'intented' for SWiM systems is better phrasing, since there's no reason with the addition of BBC's that the H24/HR24 won't work on a non-SWiM system.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Nicholsen said:


> I think its too slow, and therefore broken.


To say I've been unhappy with the speed of the HR23-700 is an understatement, but I disagree with your statement that it is broken.



Nicholsen said:


> I suggest D* give owners of the HR21-22-23 a significant credit ($100) toward the cost of an upgrade to the HR24 (without requiring a 2 yr. contract extension), and put them at the top of the list for HR24's as they become available.


I do think that DirecTV needs to work out a system in which you can specify a particular model, and I do think they need to work out a "modest" upgrade fee for those technophiles among us who like to play with new toys... but not because I consider my HR23-700 to be broken.

~Alan


----------



## RELLENBOGEN

One of the customer service reps had said that the HR24 has a built in off air tuner like the old HR20's, Is this true, or as is usually the case, dtv is clueless?


----------



## spartanstew

RELLENBOGEN said:


> One of the customer service reps had said that the HR24 has a built in off air tuner like the old HR20's, Is this true


No.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

RELLENBOGEN said:


> One of the customer service reps had said that the HR24 has a built in off air tuner like the old HR20's, Is this true, or as is usually the case, dtv is clueless?


Clueless. You'll have to get the AM21 for OTA tuning.


----------



## jasonki32

RELLENBOGEN said:


> One of the customer service reps had said that the HR24 has a built in off air tuner like the old HR20's, Is this true, or as is usually the case, dtv is clueless?


Sorry the H24/HR24 do not have a built in OTA tuner. You would need an AM21 to receive OTA.


----------



## carl6

Nicholsen said:


> The HR21-22-23 owners have suffered enough already.
> 
> I suggest D* give owners of the HR21-22-23 a significant credit ($100) toward the cost of an upgrade to the HR24 (without requiring a 2 yr. contract extension), and put them at the top of the list for HR24's as they become available.
> 
> That would seem fair. No one has to loose face by actually admitting the old receivers were too slow.


I am the HAPPY owner/leasor of an HR20, HR21, and two HR22's. They are fast enough for me. If I get another DVR that is faster, that will be great. But that doesn't mean that what I have is not fast enough.


----------



## tkrandall

Alan Gordon said:


> I do think that DirecTV needs to work out a system in which you can specify a particular model, and I do think they need to work out a "modest" upgrade fee for those technophiles among us who like to play with new toys... but not because I consider my HR23-700 to be broken.
> 
> ~Alan


Agreed!

Yesterday I posed a question as to if the HR24, as compared to the HR20, HR21, etc, was enough of an upgrade to the HD DVR lineup that it was time for DirecTV to begin to differentiate models so that if a customer has an HR24, he/she would not be subject to getting a refurb HR20 or HR21 on a swap-out. I do not think they should continue to group them as "all the same" in this regard. Any idea if DTV will consider this with this model?


----------



## veryoldschool

Alan Gordon said:


> I have only experienced this issue with HR2x DVRs. No other IR issues with other devices I've had. The DirecTV remote works fine with volume on my AVR.
> 
> I also use RF (which SUCKS) on both units... particularly the HR23-700 which has some sort of IR issue.
> 
> *It was not mentioned in the First Look. Has the RF feature improved on the HR24-500?!*
> 
> ~Alan


Hard to know what your problem is with the RF "sucks". It doesn't here so it is hard to say it has improved with the new model. I have a H21 that is a bit weak compared to my DVRs, but I'm fairly sure it's simply a defect in the unit, and not the product line.


----------



## Canis Lupus

RAD said:


> I think saying 'intented' for SWiM systems is better phrasing, since there's no reason with the addition of BBC's that the H24/HR24 won't work on a non-SWiM system.


Yes good point RAD.


----------



## Canis Lupus

Alan Gordon said:


> I do think that DirecTV needs to work out a system in which you can specify a particular model, and I do think they need to work out a "modest" upgrade fee for those technophiles among us who like to play with new toys... but not because I consider my HR23-700 to be broken.
> 
> ~Alan


IMO I think all would be smoother in the DirecTV world if there weren't so many different models, but for whatever reasons, a number of different manufacturers are in the system - each I would guess with their own pros and cons.


----------



## RAD

Alan Gordon said:


> I do think that DirecTV needs to work out a system in which you can specify a particular model, and I do think they need to work out a "modest" upgrade fee for those technophiles among us who like to play with new toys... but not because I consider my HR23-700 to be broken.
> 
> ~Alan





Canis Lupus said:


> IMO I think all would be smoother in the DirecTV world if there weren't so many different models, but for whatever reasons, a number of different manufacturers are in the system - each I would guess with their own pros and cons.


This is something that needed to be taken care of since DirecTV removed the ATSC tuners in the 21 and higher series of STB's. People with HR20's were upset when a replace box came as a HR21 or greater and they lost the OTA tuners. The same will hold now with the 24's and their built in DECA support. Someone orders a new HD DVR on the DirecTV web site will they automatically ship a 24 model or just add an external DECA if the account is flagged as having DECA?


----------



## Doug Brott

tkrandall said:


> Agreed!
> 
> Yesterday I posed a question as to if the HR24, as compared to the HR20, HR21, etc, was enough of an upgrade to the HD DVR lineup that it was time for DirecTV to begin to differentiate models so that if a customer has an HR24, he/she would not be subject to getting a refurb HR20 or HR21 on a swap-out. I do not think they should continue to group them as "all the same" in this regard. Any idea if DTV will consider this with this model?


With MRV being optimal with DECA .. It's very possible that, if you have MRV enabled on your account, that an HR24 or H24 will be priority for you on any returns. I do not know this to be true, but it certainly would not come as a shock to me if it were true because it kinda makes sense.

I also suspect that the HR21/22/23 lines are shut down or soon to shut down in lieu of HR24/H24 since it really is the new wave of receivers.


----------



## Alan Gordon

tkrandall said:


> Agreed!
> 
> Yesterday I posed a question as to if the HR24, as compared to the HR20, HR21, etc, was enough of an upgrade to the HD DVR lineup that it was time for DirecTV to begin to differentiate models so that if a customer has an HR24, he/she would not be subject to getting a refurb HR20 or HR21 on a swap-out. I do not think they should continue to group them as "all the same" in this regard. Any idea if DTV will consider this with this model?


Yeah...a few years ago I noticed a small issue with my HR20-700. I was going to call DirecTV to try and get them to replace it, but the HR21 had been out for a while and I was afraid that they might try and replace my unit with an OTA tuner for one without and I'd be forced to buy an AM21. I decided to live with the issue.



veryoldschool said:


> Hard to know what your problem is with the RF "sucks". It doesn't here so it is hard to say it has improved with the new model. I have a H21 that is a bit weak compared to my DVRs, but I'm fairly sure it's simply a defect in the unit, and not the product line.


Years ago, my Uncle and Aunt owned a BUD. He had a line ran out to a small TV sitting by the pool in order to watch the Braves games by the pool. That RF remote would work by the pool. It was that good! When I was moving to the HR20 from the HR10-250, that was one of the features I was looking forward to the most. Whether it was my briefly used HR20-100, or my HR20-700 and HR23-700, if I go into the next room and shut the door, RF doesn't work. 

~Alan


----------



## bonscott87

Nicholsen said:


> After having many people on the board insist for two years that the HR21-22-23 are plenty fast enough, it's hard to listen to them now gush about how improved the HR24 is.


Ummmm, why can't it be both? You don't think someone could have been satisfied enough with the speed of the 21/22/23 but still appreciate the faster 24? Not sure why you can't understand that. Seems like you think that to say the 24 is faster means saying the 21/22/23 are dog slow. These are not the same thing.

My 3 year old PC is plenty fast enough for me still, even playing the latest games. But that doesn't mean I wouldn't appreciate a brand new top of the line Core i7 with an ATI HD58xx graphics card.

Same thing. 

Just FYI that I no longer have DirecTV so it doesn't matter to me either way. I had an HR20-700 which I never had a speed complaint about. I also had an HR21-200 which was slower, enough to notice vs. the HR20 but it was still plenty fast enough for me and my family. The HR24 is obviously probably faster then both. Does that mean the HR21 is all of a sudden a crappy slow machine? No. Just means that it's slower then what else is available.

Your problem seems to be with posters saying how great that the HR24 is faster then previous models. That doesn't mean that automatically makes previous models slow dogs not worth using. Just means it's faster. And of course it's from the personal experience of the posters. Some do indeed have really slow machines, others don't.

Hope that makes sense to you.


----------



## spartanstew

bonscott87 said:


> Hope that makes sense to you.


It won't.


----------



## Nicholsen

Canis Lupus said:


> OK but what receivers do you have and what are you issues with them? Maybe we can help? :shrug:


You are very generous to offer, but I think there is nothing to fix. The HR21 is just too slow.

I have an HR21-100, professional install, relatively new 5LNB dish, cable, multiswitch, etc. It's not networked and "native" is off. It is still too slow.

I feed a HR10-250 off the same dish and it works great.

I get the same issues as many of the "others" (the tribe from the negative side of the island). Key bounce, slow guide, irritating (please wait...) messages when setting recordings.

The skip forward function is sluggish and the slo-mo is effectively useless.


----------



## Nicholsen

Alan Gordon said:


> To say I've been unhappy with the speed of the HR23-700 is an understatement, but I disagree with your statement that it is broken.
> 
> ~Alan


I will spot you that one.

I do think it is so slow that it is essentially defective, i.e., unsuitable for the purpose for which it was designed.


----------



## whatliesbeyond

MicroBeta said:


> I have several new components in my living room (w/in the last year) and none of them have wireless ethernet. I just searched through BBs site an didn't find any A/V equipment that has wireless ethernet so I don't understand your comment that most mainstream electronics have it built in. :scratchin Not that the HR24 is high end electronics. It's going to be the primary new install HD DVR. The HR21Pro was supposed to the high end piece of gear.
> 
> Mike


Not sure about BB, but in a quick Amazon check I found a goodly number of electronic products with built in wifi, including game players (the PS3, Wii, PSP, Nintendo DSi and SDi XL), media players (ASUS O!Play with wireless N, Iomega ScreenPlay Director), TVs (at least Vizio now, and many more from other manufacturers too in the 2010 models already appearing in stores), Blu-Ray players (Sony, LG and Panasonic), internet radios and other steaming music devices (Logitech Squeezebox and a nice model by VTech), and even some audio receivers (for Pandora, Rhapsody and other internet music providers). Moreover, a lot of other devices (like my 2008 Samsung TV) allow for the use of a simple thumb-sized USB plug to enable wireless (no CAT5, extra power cord and power adapter needed with these). And of course, there are all those netbooks, notebooks, e-readers (like Kindle), and Apple ipods, ipads and iphones. When it comes to the internet and home users, wireless is very much the present and the future.

By the way, I use my notebook's wireless n to stream HD recordings off my Directv receivers via Directv2PC. Works perfectly, with no loss in picture quality or any other problems. It works at least as well as a 10/100 ethernet connection, and maybe even faster since it can go to 135.

I didn't mean to waste everyone's time with this. I've probably said too much, especially since I really did enjoy the First Look. Back to lurking . . .


----------



## PackCat

BattleScott said:


> I'm not sure you understand what the DECA device is. You already have a Coax cable connected to your DVR (probably 2 of them unless you are on SWM already). The DECA adapters with a SWM multiswitch will allow you to use the existing coax feed to provide broadband connectivity as well. There is no need for any additional cabling to be installed.


I also said I have a bedroom on the other side of my home with no access via cables, or the installer would have hooked me up in the first place. He said it was impossible without an ugly cable running through all the exposed nooks and crannies. I counted about 30 twists and turns around kitchen, bathrooms, and closets.

Does this DECA convertor come with the HR24 or is it another ridiculous extortion fee and contract extension? Are they going to charge a rental fee? It is kind of stupid to talk about a device that does not exist or is not available yet. That is the same crap they told me about wireless USB ports 4 years ago when they lured me into service. If they had simply added the $.50 part to control wireless operation, this would have been a moot point long ago.


----------



## PackCat

> Wireless would be a waste of money when they are going with MOCA/DECA. Wireless would be a nightmare to attempt to support. People would want replacements due to wireless not connecting and so forth


Forgive me for being slightly off-topic...
I think a bigger question is, has anyone ever built or seen a true "Ethernet" Wireless Adaptor and is this even possible. I have a feeling something in the technology does not allow this the same way you can with USB, or there would be a bunch of them on the market, and you would not have to purchase a $200 wireless ethernet bridge to do the job. I was really surprised when Wireless first came out, why they did not immediately have wireless ethernet adaptors that could plug-in to the already zillions of ethernet ports available on devices. (like printers) Technically you already have the guts (mac address, etc) on every ethernet port device and simply need the wireless transmitter/receiver amp.

Anyone have a straight-up non-marketing answer for this? For < $50 this would be a hot sell. especially for older devices or lack of USB ports.


----------



## spicyTuna

PackCat said:


> Forgive me for being slightly off-topic...
> I think a bigger question is, has anyone ever built or seen a true "Ethernet" Wireless Adaptor and is this even possible. I have a feeling something in the technology does not allow this the same way you can with USB, or there would be a bunch of them on the market, and you would not have to purchase a $200 wireless ethernet bridge to do the job. I was really surprised when Wireless first came out, why they did not immediately have wireless ethernet adaptors that could plug-in to the already zillions of ethernet ports available on devices. (like printers) Technically you already have the guts (mac address, etc) on every ethernet port device and simply need the wireless transmitter/receiver amp.
> 
> Anyone have a straight-up non-marketing answer for this? For < $50 this would be a hot sell. especially for older devices or lack of USB ports.


I don't really know why. But for about $50 if you're the hacker/tweaker type, you can buy a Linksys WRT54G or WRT54G2 and download DD-WRT on to it and convert it to a wireless bridge.

Since I haven't posted enough, it won't let me post the url. In google, type dd-wrt repeater bridge. It should be the first link. I'm guessing that is what you're talking about.


----------



## PHL

PackCat said:


> Forgive me for being slightly off-topic...
> I think a bigger question is, has anyone ever built or seen a true "Ethernet" Wireless Adaptor and is this even possible. I have a feeling something in the technology does not allow this the same way you can with USB, or there would be a bunch of them on the market, and you would not have to purchase a $200 wireless ethernet bridge to do the job. I was really surprised when Wireless first came out, why they did not immediately have wireless ethernet adaptors that could plug-in to the already zillions of ethernet ports available on devices. (like printers) Technically you already have the guts (mac address, etc) on every ethernet port device and simply need the wireless transmitter/receiver amp.
> 
> Anyone have a straight-up non-marketing answer for this? For < $50 this would be a hot sell. especially for older devices or lack of USB ports.


Probably because wireless is an entirely different specification than ethernet. The spec for traditional ethernet over CAT-5 (IEEE 802.3, I believe) is almost purely electrical in nature. It says nothing about radio frequencies and modulation and security, etc. It also means that there is probably no way to send "control" instructions through an ethernet port, which is purely a transport mechanism. It's only purpose is to transmit IP packets and nothing else. In other words, you can't really write a device driver that uses the ethernet port to control an external adapter, since that's not what the port was designed for. Or, if you could, the driver would be OS-dependent, and each manufacturer's adapter would require a different driver. It wouldn't be any better than the USB wireless adapters.

So, if what you want is driverless, plug-and-play solution, you wind up needing a lot of intelligence in the "adapter" plus a whole new specification for wireless. Basically, that's exactly what a bridge is.


----------



## PackCat

spicyTuna said:


> I don't really know why. But for about $50 if you're the hacker/tweaker type, you can buy a Linksys WRT54G or WRT54G2 and download DD-WRT on to it and convert it to a wireless bridge.


I probably have some of those laying around somewhere.... but Amazon has them listed for under $25.00 used. I am guessing that you are saying that they only have to be connected to electricity and no wires except or the one to the receiver?


----------



## PHL

spicyTuna said:


> I don't really know why. But for about $50 if you're the hacker/tweaker type, you can buy a Linksys WRT54G or WRT54G2 and download DD-WRT on to it and convert it to a wireless bridge.
> 
> Since I haven't posted enough, it won't let me post the url. In google, type dd-wrt repeater bridge. It should be the first link. I'm guessing that is what you're talking about.


I think for the average user dd-wrt is just not worth the hassle. I'm not afraid of technology, but I just didn't want to deal with it just to save $50 for a functioning bridge. If you don't need the advanced router features, then a simple wireless gaming adapter like the WGA-600 that D* used to sell or the WET-600N that they currently sell is the best bet. Both are less than $100. They could probably be made and sold for much cheaper, but I don't think the demand is there. Another option is the Dlink DAP1522 for about $100. You certainly don't need to spend $200 to get the job done.


----------



## Alan Gordon

PHL said:


> I think for the average user dd-wrt is just not worth the hassle. I'm not afraid of technology, but I just didn't want to deal with it just to save $50 for a functioning bridge. If you don't need the advanced router features, then a simple wireless gaming adapter like the WGA-600 that D* used to sell or the WET-600N that they currently sell is the best bet. Both are less than $100. They could probably be made and sold for much cheaper, but I don't think the demand is there. Another option is the Dlink DAP1522 for about $100. You certainly don't need to spend $200 to get the job done.


I second PHL's comments above.

Unless you either already own a Linksys router that can be modded, or need the additional ethernet ports that a modded router would offer you (for Blu-ray player or whatever), I'd recommend going the route PHL recommended.

~Alan<~~~~~~Who uses a dd-wrt router as a bridge...


----------



## PHL

Alan Gordon said:


> I second PHL's comments above.
> 
> Unless you either already own a Linksys router that can be modded, or need the additional ethernet ports that a modded router would offer you (for Blu-ray player or whatever), I'd recommend going the route PHL recommended.
> 
> ~Alan<~~~~~~Who uses a dd-wrt router as a bridge...


Thanks Alan. I believe that even if you need additional ports, a gaming adapter can be combined with an inexpensive switch (I think). I've seen 5-port switches at Office Depot for $14.99. It wouldn't surprise me to see switches for less than $10 after a rebate.


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter

Is there even a chip out there that supports HDMI 1.4 currently? 
j/w b/c if they ever planned on doing 1080p3D I would think they would of tried to get 1.4 in the new box's.
I know DirecTV's 3d channel will not be full blown 1080p3D as they are using the RealD method for delivery so would they even need the 1.4 spec to deliver FullHD3D?
Or would 1080p3D just take up an ungodly amount of bandwidth and they probably will never venture to it anyway?

Lastly, are we going to stick with the 1080p/24 and not ever see the other frame rates? I doubt I'd notice the difference as but just figured I'd ask. I wanna say the reason for the 24 was bandwidth also so I think I might of answered both questions here in my post. lol


----------



## BattleScott

PackCat said:


> I also said I have a bedroom on the other side of my home with no access via cables, or the installer would have hooked me up in the first place. He said it was impossible without an ugly cable running through all the exposed nooks and crannies. I counted about 30 twists and turns around kitchen, bathrooms, and closets.


Sorry, didn't see that part. No way to run that on the outside of the house?



PackCat said:


> Does this DECA convertor come with the HR24 or is it another ridiculous extortion fee and contract extension? Are they going to charge a rental fee? It is kind of stupid to talk about a device that does not exist or is not available yet. That is the same crap they told me about wireless USB ports 4 years ago when they lured me into service. If they had simply added the $.50 part to control wireless operation, this would have been a moot point long ago.


The H/HR24s do have the DECA integrated in the receiver so you would only need 1 external adapter to bridge to the network. Early reports are $25.00, no idea about commitment on that device (expect no though), but I'm sure there will be one to lay hands on an HR24.


----------



## bonscott87

Nicholsen said:


> I have an HR21-100, professional install, relatively new 5LNB dish, cable, multiswitch, etc. It's not networked and "native" is off. It is still too slow.
> 
> I feed a HR10-250 off the same dish and it works great.
> 
> I get the same issues as many of the "others" (the tribe from the negative side of the island). Key bounce, slow guide, irritating (please wait...) messages when setting recordings.
> 
> The skip forward function is sluggish and the slo-mo is effectively useless.


Honestly if I had it that bad I would have called to get it replaced long ago. The key bounce, slow guide, please wait messages are NOT normal at all.

Slo-mo is bad no matter what receiver you have, it's the "press and hold" that messes that up so don't expect miracles here. But your other problems seem to be a bad receiver, especially with the slow guide and please wait stuff. At least if it were me I'd get it replaced. I'm one that would never stand for something like that and suffer thru, I'd replace it.

Good luck.


----------



## Mike Greer

bonscott87 said:


> Honestly if I had it that bad I would have called to get it replaced long ago. The key bounce, slow guide, please wait messages are NOT normal at all.


I only wish this was truth. I've been dealing with it, as have many others, for years now. Sometimes it better than others but all three of my HR22 are ALWAYS slow.

Bring on the HR24s!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Mike Greer said:


> I only wish this was truth. I've been dealing with it, as have many others, for years now. Sometimes it better than others but all three of my HR22 are ALWAYS slow.
> 
> Bring on the HR24s!


Scott's right. I can't remember the last time I had key bounce and please wait messages. Those are both very abnormal and if anyone is having those issues they should look into getting some help.

Seriously, that is not normal.

Mike


----------



## veryoldschool

MicroBeta said:


> Scott's right. I can't remember the last time I had key bounce and please wait messages. Those are both very abnormal and if anyone is having those issues they should look into getting some help.
> 
> Seriously, that is not normal.
> 
> Mike


What we don't know is if there is anything in the environment that is what is really causing this.
It would seem to be the source when someone has replaced several receivers and they all have the same problem.
As weird as this may sound, I read a post where someone found the AVR was causing their problem. They unplugged it and everything worked fine/well.
I never would have guess this.

then there were the posts about light dimmers causing problems.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

*At this point, I think we've all had a good run at both ranting and raving. I'd like to ask that this thread stay on topic, that topic being discussion of the new 24 Series receivers.

If you're not satisfied with your current receiver, or if you have other general DIRECTV discussion, I welcome you to open another thread for that. Thank you. *


----------



## johnp37

Stuart I think you are absolutely right on. I have concluded that those of us who ranted, complained or otherwise posted negative things about our HR receivers are obviously all suffering from some mass hysteria which has no basis in fact. Paranormal activity perhaps?


----------



## LameLefty

johnp37 said:


> Stuart I think you are absolutely right on. I have concluded that those of us who ranted, complained or otherwise posted negative things about our HR receivers are obviously all suffering from some mass hysteria which has no basis in fact. Paranormal activity perhaps?


That's not at ALL what Stuart said. Please go back and re-read. He said THIS THREAD is not the place for it. :nono:


----------



## Doug Brott

johnp37 said:


> Stuart I think you are absolutely right on. I have concluded that those of us who ranted, complained or otherwise posted negative things about our HR receivers are obviously all suffering from some mass hysteria which has no basis in fact. Paranormal activity perhaps?


Well, since the point Stuart was making was that we get back to discussion on the *HR24* .. that would, yes, mean that we should move away from discussing the older receivers.

The point is, if you want to rant about your HR20, HR21, HR22 or HR23 .. let's do that in another thread. That's all.

This is the last word on the subject. If it doesn't involve the HR24, it needs to be in another thread. Thanks for your understanding folks.


----------



## richardeholder

I've searched, but could not find if the ethernet port is still a 10/100 or if the HR24 now supports 10/100/1000 gigabit speeds?


----------



## veryoldschool

richardeholder said:


> I've searched, but could not find if the ethernet port is still a 10/100 or if the HR24 now supports 10/100/1000 gigabit speeds?


100 Mb/s


----------



## Sixto

richardeholder said:


> I've searched, but could not find if the ethernet port is still a 10/100 or if the HR24 now supports 10/100/1000 gigabit speeds?


10/100. (have added to comparison table)


----------



## richardeholder

Sixto said:


> 10/100. (have added to comparison table)


Unfortunate...


----------



## veryoldschool

richardeholder said:


> Unfortunate...


I'm not sure why 
it is fast enough to do what it needs to.


----------



## BattleScott

richardeholder said:


> Unfortunate...


On cosnumer network gear the gigabit equipment is coming to reasonable price point. But in dealing with the single chip solutions used in these set-top boxes, gigabit functionality would probably increase the production costs by a sizable margin. Even the newest IP TV based solutions are still integrating 100MB technology.


----------



## RAD

richardeholder said:


> Unfortunate...





veryoldschool said:


> I'm not sure why
> it is fast enough to do what it needs to.


Agreed, don't know what folks are hung up on the box not having gig when it didn't need the bandwidth.


----------



## Syzygy

Nicholsen said:


> The HR21-22-23 owners have suffered enough already.
> 
> I suggest D* give owners of the HR21-22-23 a significant credit ($100) toward the cost of an upgrade to the HR24 (without requiring a 2 yr. contract extension), and put them at the top of the list for HR24's as they become available.
> 
> That would seem fair. No one has to lose face by actually admitting the old receivers were too slow.


I second that, except that I'd have no problem with a 2-year extension.


----------



## Syzygy

Nicholsen said:


> ... After having many people on the board insist for two years that the HR21-22-23 are plenty fast enough, it's hard to listen to them now gush about how improved the HR24 is.





bonscott87 said:


> Ummmm, why can't it be both? You don't think someone could have been satisfied enough with the speed of the 21/22/23 but still appreciate the faster 24? Not sure why you can't understand that. Seems like you think that to say the 24 is faster means saying the 21/22/23 are dog slow. These are not the same thing.
> :
> :
> Just FYI that I no longer have DirecTV so it doesn't matter to me either way. I had an HR20-700 which I never had a speed complaint about. I also had an HR21-200 which was slower, enough to notice vs. the HR20 but it was still plenty fast enough for me and my family. The HR24 is obviously probably faster then both. Does that mean the HR21 is all of a sudden a crappy slow machine? No. Just means that it's slower then what else is available.
> 
> Your problem seems to be with posters saying how great that the HR24 is faster then previous models. That doesn't mean that automatically makes previous models slow dogs not worth using. Just means it's faster. And of course it's from the personal experience of the posters. Some do indeed have really slow machines, others don't.
> 
> Hope that makes sense to you.


Makes perfect sense to me. It seems that you accepted the slowness of your HR21, or at least felt it wasn't something to complain about. Perhaps you never had to wait a second or two for a result that should've been instantaneous. Perhaps you had no dropped keypresses.

OTOH, a lot of people here (like me) said their 21, 22 or 23 boxes *are* dog slow. Meanwhile, a few who love DirecTV unconditionally were insisting over and over, _ad nauseam_, that those slow boxes were definitely *not* slow. *That's* the issue.


----------



## sigma1914

To reemphasize...



Stuart Sweet said:


> *At this point, I think we've all had a good run at both ranting and raving. I'd like to ask that this thread stay on topic, that topic being discussion of the new 24 Series receivers.
> 
> If you're not satisfied with your current receiver, or if you have other general DIRECTV discussion, I welcome you to open another thread for that. Thank you. *


----------



## delete2end

Sixto said:


> and that significant compelling research-discovered missing hardware feature would be?


read the survey taken several months ago by 1000 or more DBStalk users that D* was suppose to be looking at to help determine which new features should come out first. how quickly people forget.


----------



## sigma1914

delete2end said:


> read the survey taken several months ago by 1000 or more DBStalk users that D* was suppose to be looking at to help determine which new features should come out first. how quickly people forget.


You could find it for us if you're referencing it.


----------



## dave29

delete2end said:


> read the survey taken several months ago by 1000 or more DBStalk users that D* was suppose to be looking at to help determine which new features should come out first. how quickly people forget.


Are you talking about the wishlist? Most of that is Software, not Hardware.


----------



## delete2end

houskamp said:


> Or he's just not in the majority..


read the survey taken by over 1000 dbstalk users from several months ago as it more than proves my point....


----------



## Syzygy

veryoldschool said:


> ... I also don't why some users do have such slow DVRs. Enough post about this problem so it must be happening, but without doing some swap & test, it must be so hard to find the cause, since while the HR21/22/22 are slower than the HR20, those that post say that their HR20(s) are also slow.
> Many complain about not being able to numerically enter channels, yet mine have never had the problem.
> I have no idea as to why some do & others don't. :shrug:


Possible explanations for differing reports on sluggishness:
• Some people are more tolerant in general.
• Some people have slow reflexes. 
• Some hardware (especially B-Band Converters) may be faulty. 
• Some installations experience dropouts due to loose connections or dish misalignment. (Even if you're not watching the interrupted show, recovery from dropouts steals cycles from other tasks. My system slowed to a crawl, and then stopped, when dish misalignment caused certain channels to drop out constantly.)


----------



## delete2end

dave29 said:


> Are you talking about the wishlist? Most of that is Software, not Hardware.


yeppers... i know... D* gives us new below par hardware (500GB hard drive...come on... get real D*) while not adding anything from the wish list.... without software hardware is useless...


----------



## sigma1914

delete2end said:


> yeppers... i know... D* gives us the crappy outdated hardware (500GB hard drive...come on get real D*) to go along with no new software features from the wish list.


1.) Add an eSATA.
2.) New software features can be added.


----------



## Alan Gordon

PHL said:


> Thanks Alan. I believe that even if you need additional ports, a gaming adapter can be combined with an inexpensive switch (I think). I've seen 5-port switches at Office Depot for $14.99. It wouldn't surprise me to see switches for less than $10 after a rebate.


If the only thing someone wants to wirelessly hook up is a DirecTV receiver or a DECA cloud, I'd recommend the WET-600N... and then they can always go the way you list above should the future need arise.

IF HOWEVER... they need more ports, it's really dependent on their personal preference. If they have an old Linksys router capable, and have a "fair" level of experience in the networking area, then they could save a few bucks. If they intend on buying a brand new router, then it brings up potential "bricking" issues... as I've flashed three different Linksys routers with dd-wrt, and I thought I bricked one, but it turned out okay. While you can find step-by-step instructions as to how to set up the dd-wrt router as a wireless bridge (including here on this site), some users may find the WET-600N to be easier to setup as well.

*NOTE:* *To our ever vigilant mods, given the HR24's networking capabilities, I felt that this was somewhat on topic. If you disagree, feel free to delete.* 

*NOTE #2:* Given the "crackdown" on HR23-700 complaints, my posting on this thread will most likely be cut in half... or more! I'll still continue my rants and raves about it on the TiVo thread though! 

~Alan


----------



## Alan Gordon

BTW...

To those with HR24-500s, is Interactive any faster?

~Alan


----------



## Stuart Sweet

I'll let the post stand, but please folks let's get back to the HR24 talk. OK?


----------



## Sixto

It's almost comical all the FUD being introduced to discount the HR24.

It seems fairly obvious that analysis has led to 100 hours of HD being the design point to cover a vast majority of the need, within a defined price point of probably $199 (the new TiVo 1TB box is $499). All else will do e-SATA.


----------



## Marlbs

LameLefty said:


> Same as with all the HR2x's since the HR21 - via the external AM21 module.


Is this already confirmed as working and tested with the HR24?

How does the AM21 box look with the HR24?


----------



## Kansas Zephyr

Marlbs said:


> Is this already confirmed as working and tested with the HR24?
> 
> How does the AM21 box look with the HR24?


Any plans for an "AM24" to match the new STB's look?


----------



## RAD

Marlbs said:


> Is this already confirmed as working and tested with the HR24?
> 
> How does the AM21 box look with the HR24?


Yes, the AM21 has been tested with the HR24.

The AM21 footprint is larger then the HR24 but remember you don't need to stack the two together, the power and USB cables are long enough you can hide the AM21 somewhere out of sight.


----------



## say-what

Marlbs said:


> Is this already confirmed as working and tested with the HR24?
> 
> How does the AM21 box look with the HR24?


The AM21 most definitely works with the H/HR24 - it was tested.

How does it look? Like any AM21 would with an H/HR24. The dimensions of the AM21 and HR24 are not that different, just the rounded corners of the HR24. You can place the AM21 below the HR24.



Kansas Zephyr said:


> Any plans for an "AM24" to match the new STB's look?


Not that we're aware of.


----------



## Alan Gordon

say-what said:


> Not that we're aware of.


Hopefully, in a few years there will be an upgrade with a better tuner in it as I can't pick up my local PBS station with the AM21, but I can with multiple other ATSC tuners.

~Alan


----------



## Arative

If I call D* up and ask for a new DVR, any way to guarantee that I'll get HR24-700 or is it all a shot in the dark as to which one they'll send?


----------



## dave29

Arative said:


> If I call D* up and ask for a new DVR, any way to guarantee that I'll get HR24-700 or is it all a shot in the dark as to which one they'll send?


No guarantee, especially since they haven't officially been released yet.


----------



## RAD

Arative said:


> If I call D* up and ask for a new DVR, any way to guarantee that I'll get HR24-700 or is it all a shot in the dark as to which one they'll send?


I can promise you it won't be a HR24, they're not released yet for installations. Even if they were, unless something changes it's whatever DVR is in the stack will be what you get, could be a HR20 up to a HR23 or anything in between.


----------



## David MacLeod

I was curious about the AM21 also, glad to see its been asked and answered.


----------



## spartanstew

Arative said:


> If I call D* up and ask for a new DVR, any way to guarantee that I'll get HR24-700 or is it all a shot in the dark as to which one they'll send?


Does the HR24-700 even exist?


----------



## tkrandall

Alan Gordon said:


> Hopefully, in a few years there will be an upgrade with a better tuner in it.
> 
> ~Alan


It has consistently been reported that the AM21 has a later generation tuner that better deals with weak signal and multipath, compared to the HR20. An HR24 + AM21 combo should offer a better solution than a HR20 solution in that regard. If the AM21 would work with the HR20-700 I have (trumping the HR20's OTA tuner) I would have an AM21 now.


----------



## Arative

RAD said:


> I can promise you it won't be a HR24, they're not released yet for installations. Even if they were, unless something changes it's whatever DVR is in the stack will be what you get, could be a HR20 up to a HR23 or anything in between.


I guess I should have specified. When it is released.


----------



## say-what

Arative said:


> I guess I should have specified. When it is released.


We don't know - only way that happens is if they change their ordering/distribution system to allow for DVR specification.

Short of ordering from a third party, based on things as they exist now, there is no way to specify a particular model DVR.


----------



## Doug Brott

Marlbs said:


> Is this already confirmed as working and tested with the HR24?
> 
> How does the AM21 box look with the HR24?


Yes, the AM21 works with the HR24 .. There will not be a sleek looking AM24, there just isn't enough demand for OTA from what I can tell.

Page 6 of the First Look has a fairly good shot of the HR24 & AM21 together.


----------



## GP245

Just got off the phone with Customer Service.

Once again, the word on the HR24 (did not ask about the H24 - would imagine the timing would be the same) distribution in "selected markets" - Mid-March and national availability is scheduled for May.

When I mentioned that today is Mid-March and asked which are the "selected markets" -there is no further information.

Just wanted to share this.


----------



## veryoldschool

GP245 said:


> Just got off the phone with Customer Service.
> 
> Once again, the word on the HR24 (did not ask about the H24 - would imagine the timing would be the same) distribution in "selected markets" - Mid-March and national availability is scheduled for May.
> 
> When I mentioned that today is Mid-March and asked which are the "selected markets" -there is no further information.
> 
> Just wanted to share this.


Four Test Markets in:


Columbia, MO,
Fresno, CA,
Denver, Co, and
Portland
 will have all new customer installs set up with MRV. Of course HD equipment only. HDDVR required. Rolls out 3-17-10


----------



## GP245

veryoldschool said:


> Four Test Markets in:
> 
> 
> Columbia, MO,
> Fresno, CA,
> Denver, Co, and
> Portland
> will have all new customer installs set up with MRV. Of course HD equipment only. HDDVR required. Rolls out 3-17-10


Thanks!


----------



## carl6

veryoldschool said:


> Four Test Markets in:
> 
> 
> Portland


Maine or Oregon?


----------



## dirtyblueshirt

carl6 said:


> Maine or Oregon?


North Dakota. :lol:


----------



## Kansas Zephyr

Doug Brott said:


> Yes, the AM21 works with the HR24 .. There will not be a sleek looking AM24, *there just isn't enough demand for OTA from what I can tell*.


...and D*'s decision to drop the digital LP/TX info from the OTA database will help keep that demand down, too.


----------



## veryoldschool

carl6 said:


> Maine or Oregon?


The copy & paste didn't show, but would guess Oregon.


----------



## delete2end

sigma1914 said:


> 1.) Add an eSATA.
> 2.) New software features can be added.


Very clever. At least you got me to smile. The H24 anything series needs to add more in the way of software features. There is just so much more D* could do in the way of adding new features but D* continuously fails to provide top ranked survey requested features. If they are going to release H24 anything with only hardware upgrades and no new software features at least they could have used a 1TB drive instead of a 500GB on the DVR. I mean Dang! Who are the Stake Holders involved let alone the Engineers on this project? Why have they not submitted a change order to the PMP on this project?

Finally, if anyone thinks I am ranting or not on topic please consider those who provide input/discussion upon the lack of features most likely are providing feedback that is pertinent to the success of the H24 series of products? Just because a posting is not "positive" does not mean that it is off topic. Has DBStalk made positive & negative per subject matter threads for which I am unaware?

Humbled and chill pill taken but maybe some of you need to do the same. Twice the North Texas football team beating my Texas Tech Red Raiders humbled me.


----------



## sigma1914

delete2end said:


> Very clever. At least you got me to smile. The H24 anything series needs to add more in the way of software features. There is just so much more D* could do in the way of adding new features but D* continuously fails to provide top ranked survey requested features. If they are going to release H24 anything with only hardware upgrades and no new software features at least they could have used a 1TB drive instead of a 500GB on the DVR. I mean Dang! Who are the Stake Holders involved let alone the Engineers on this project? Why have they not submitted a change order to the PMP on this project?
> 
> Finally, if anyone thinks I am ranting or not on topic please consider those who provide input/discussion upon the lack of features most likely are providing feedback that is pertinent to the success of the H24 series of products? Just because a posting is not "positive" does not mean that it is off topic. Has DBStalk made positive & negative per subject matter threads for which I am unaware?
> 
> Humbled and chill pill taken but maybe some of you need to do the same. Twice the North Texas football team beating my Texas Tech Red Raiders humbled me.


100 Hours of HD is more than enough, IMO, for the average user. Yes, 1TB would be nice, but average users aren't stuffing 200 hours on a DVR.

As for software changes...take a look at the HRx history, and you'll see the software has added *A LOT*. Now, with better speed and hardware, maybe even more software tweaks can be added.

I wish we could see the original wishlist compared to what's been added. DLB and MRV are 2, I bet.


----------



## LameLefty

sigma1914 said:


> I wish we could see the original wishlist compared to what's been added. DLB and MRV are 2, I bet.


Well, when I got my first HR20-700 in 2006, OTA was highest on the list. Well, that and being able to go more than 3 - 4 days without a spontaneous reboot or black screen (e.g., "blank") recordings. :grin:

So yes, the platform has come a LONG way. The Hx24 line seems to indicate it will go further still.


----------



## Doug Brott

There's certainly some folks who think development doesn't go fast enough and others who wish the development would just stop .. Perhaps we really are in the middle.


----------



## PackCat

BattleScott said:


> Sorry, didn't see that part. No way to run that on the outside of the house?


Sorry, No... I live in a Condo.
They gave me a violation after burying the cables with $100 worth of mulch and running them in through the living room window.
I had to move the cables and run it through the dining room sliding glass door with the thin connectors and hide the coax behind furniture.

Currently, I have to run a 50 ft ethernet cable through the middle of my house on the floor from the spare bedroom (where my router is) to connect the internet features to the receiver.


----------



## tkrandall

Kansas Zephyr said:


> ...and D*'s decision to drop the digital LP/TX info from the OTA database will help keep that demand down, too.


Can you please translate that in layman's :sure: terms?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

I believe he's talking about some low powered OTA channels not being in DIRECTV's database. Which, by the way, is off topic, but I'll allow it since it responds to a moderator's post. 

I have already deleted off-topic posts in this thread and will continue to do so. I don't want to stifle genuine conversation about the 24 series, but am no longer interested in off-topic posts.

Thank you.


----------



## PkDog

I am assuming that the HR24 is running the latest and same software that the other HR2x boxes are running. If so, then the speed increases are strictly due to hardware. The real question is will the HR24's software be allowed to diverge.

I think the HR24 h/w with new software could support an HD UI that many people want and I doubt that could be supported on the other HR2x boxes.

Didn't Dish do something similar: come out with a new HD dvr that has sufficiently more powerful h/w. How are they handling this software-wise?

My only complaint is the removal of the pass-through ethernet connector. Directv has sold many solutions to getting ethernet at the stb. Many of the people using those solutions also have another close device (e.g. blu-ray player) that needs an ethernet connection. The pass-through connector was perfect for that and it has now been taken away (read: "not-backward compatible").


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Your complaint is a valid one, but please note that using the second connector as a passthrough was never supported. In fact, we've said here, and DIRECTV has said as well, that you should *NOT* use the second connector as a passthrough.

I'm not sure it's reasonable to complain that the manufacturer is removing the use of something they told you not to use. In the meantime a small ethernet switch does very well.


----------



## tkrandall

PkDog said:


> I am assuming that the HR24 is running the latest and same software that the other HR2x boxes are running. If so, then the speed increases are strictly due to hardware. The real question is will the HR24's software be allowed to diverge.
> 
> I think the HR24 h/w with new software could support an HD UI that many people want and I doubt that could be supported on the other HR2x boxes.
> 
> Didn't Dish do something similar: come out with a new HD dvr that has sufficiently more powerful h/w. How are they handling this software-wise?
> 
> My only complaint is the removal of the pass-through ethernet connector. Directv has sold many solutions to getting ethernet at the stb. Many of the people using those solutions also have another close device (e.g. blu-ray player) that needs an ethernet connection. The pass-through connector was perfect for that and it has now been taken away (read: "not-backward compatible").


I also would like the HR24 to diverge in the sense I would like DirecTV to consider it's latest H24/HR24 offerings as a seperate category of DVR/receiver in terms of unit selections and/or defective unit swapout. It's been 3 years or more wince the HR20 came out, right?


----------



## ITSec_Guy

mhayes70 said:


> Probably the best thing to do is when they come out. Get the HR24 at a local retailer. Usually Directv can't promise what model you get.


Considering Best Buy is still selling the HR-22 online, I'm willing to bet that we'll be waiting a while...

Just let me know who I have to sleep with in customer service!


----------



## Ken_F

PkDog said:


> Didn't Dish do something similar: come out with a new HD dvr that has sufficiently more powerful h/w. How are they handling this software-wise?


Dish Network released the ViP722K based on the the newer BCM7400 SoC last year. It currently uses the same UI as their older boxes.

Dish Network's ViP922 -- expected in May -- uses the same BCM7400 SoC to support a completely new HD UI with 3D elements. This is made possible by the 3D GPU in that chip. This new UI is incompatible with their older ViP622 and ViP722 DVRs, but is compatible with the ViP722k.

If the HR24 is based on the CX24500 as reported, then it doesn't have a GPU or OpenGL / Flash support. That suggests DirecTV *may* have opted for a less ambitious approach to their next UI. It is *possible* they are looking at a "watered down" 16:9 UI that can run on all existing HR2x platforms. Sky+ in the UK opted to do that for their older BCM7038+BCM74011 boxes:

Youtube: Sky+ 16:9 EPG for older DVR hardware similar to HR20

The video above shows a 16:9 UI, although it is rendered in lower resolution and then upconverted to HD resolution.


----------



## PHL

delete2end said:


> If they are going to release H24 anything with only hardware upgrades and no new software features at least they could have used a 1TB drive instead of a 500GB on the DVR. I mean Dang! Who are the Stake Holders involved let alone the Engineers on this project? Why have they not submitted a change order to the PMP on this project?


I too would like a larger drive, but I think 500GB is reasonable, and I think there are good technical reasons to use this as a standard drive (lowest cost, proven designs, single-platter drives for lowest heat dissipation, etc). I would guess that less than 10-15% of customers really think 500GB is inadequate. Plus, when MRV becomes common, you could leverage the storage of multiple DVR's. There's also the HMC variant that's being rumored for the end of this year.

I have not read this entire thread, so I don't know if it's already been discussed, but perhaps the esata port could now be used to EXPAND the capacity rather than simply replace the internal HDD. I believe the constraint on the current HR2x units was that there was only one sata controller, so it could only handle one drive at a time. If the speculation about the new SOC is correct, then it should be able to accommodate two HDD's simultaneously, with the capacities being added together.

A 500 GB esata drive is a reasonably inexpensive addon to get 1TB of total recording capacity. The added plus is that you wouldn't lose all your current recordings and season passes.


----------



## evan_s

ITSec_Guy said:


> Considering Best Buy is still selling the HR-22 online, I'm willing to bet that we'll be waiting a while...
> 
> Just let me know who I have to sleep with in customer service!


DirecTV seems to have backed off on the Hr23 and from the reports is primarily manufacturing the HR-22 so it makes sense that is what Best Buy would have. Since the only real benefit of the HR-23 is the wide band tuners which don't require a BBC on legacy systems the added cost of the wide band tuners doesn't make much sense when they are moving to swm being standard which doesn't need BBCs on any HR2x box. I expect that we will see HR24's in my larger quantities than we ever saw or will see for the hr23's.

The HR23's were a more expensive box that was the solution to a problem that got solved another way.


----------



## bananfish

say-what said:


> We don't know - only way that happens [i.e., a customer being able to specifically request an HR24 rather than any other HDDVR] is if they change their ordering/distribution system to allow for DVR specification.
> 
> Short of ordering from a third party, based on things as they exist now, there is no way to specify a particular model DVR.


If they don't allow that, DishTV or Comcast will have a new customer by June ---> me. That's about $1200 worth of business a year. And I'm sure I'm not the only one.

I've put up with a DVR that requires seconds to bring up a menu or a guide or scroll down a screen of options or do *anything* long enough. I will not put up with it one day longer if there is an alternative option available which the company refuses to provide me.

And frankly, I expect them to provide the HR24 to me for free - they can of course have their Edsel back.

[Edit: Having looked back now a few pages, I fear this post may be deleted. The real message of my post is not to complain about my current receiver, but to state the necessity for D* to do what it must, such as change its ordering/distribution system, to get an HR24 into the hands of customers who have been less than fully satisfied with prior models as soon as possible.]


----------



## dpiq

bananfish said:


> If they don't allow that, DishTV or Comcast will have a new customer by June ---> me. That's about $1200 worth of business a year. And I'm sure I'm not the only one.
> 
> I've put up with a DVR that requires seconds to bring up a menu or a guide or scroll down a screen of options or do *anything* long enough. I will not put up with it one day longer if there is an alternative option available which the company refuses to provide me.
> . . .


Be on friendly terms with your installer and let them know what would make you happy. Sometimes they have to go back to the shop to get a receiver that was meant for another customer in order to solve a 'problem' they are having with your installation. For example, instead of demanding a particular model, if it can be shown that they one they are installing is slow, and therefore might be defective, they will have an excuse for an exchange.


----------



## Richierich

Well, BananaFish let us know which Provider you choose, Dish Or Comcrap because you ain't gonna change Directv's Policies and you ain't gonna get an HR24 to replace you DVR so keep in touch after you leave!!!


----------



## johnp37

dpiq said:


> Be on friendly terms with your installer and let them know what would make you happy. Sometimes they have to go back to the shop to get a receiver that was meant for another customer in order to solve a 'problem' they are having with your installation. For example, instead of demanding a particular model, if it can be shown that they one they are installing is slow, and therefore might be defective, they will have an excuse for an exchange.


The installers I have had except for one over the years could care less what makes me happy. And how can I possibly "show" that a receiver is slow. Aren't they all?


----------



## veryoldschool

johnp37 said:


> The installers I have had except for one over the years could care less what makes me happy. And how can I possibly "show" that a receiver is slow. Aren't they all?


You $how him/her $ome intere$t


----------



## LameLefty

johnp37 said:


> The installers I have had except for one over the years could care less what makes me happy. And how can I possibly "show" that a receiver is slow. Aren't they all?


Nope. My HR20-700 is nice and quick, as is my R22-200. My HR21-700 and HR22-100 could use a good kick in the can lots of times, however.

But getting :backtotop so Stuart doesn't get too angry . . .

My HR24-500 smokes 'em all.


----------



## bananfish

richierich said:


> Well, BananaFish let us know which Provider you choose, Dish Or Comcrap because you ain't gonna change Directv's Policies and you ain't gonna get an HR24 to replace you DVR so keep in touch after you leave!!!


Well, keeping this discussion civilly focused on the HR24, I have a hunch that at least some existing customers actually will be able to score an HR24 from DirecTV - if that takes a policy change, well, I expect there will be a policy change.

They didn't design speed into the HR24 with the idea of teasing and annoying existing long-term customers - they know some existing customers are craving that speed. I'll be surprised if they don't find some way to accommodate profitable long-term customers that haven't upgraded in a while who request an HR-24 and are willing to commit for another 2 years.

I'm sure they won't be volunteering to give them away, but customers with lots of "hearts" tend to get accommodated, and I think I've got quite a few.


----------



## DirectMan

If you have a new installation requesting MRV when it is an orderable service option wouldn't it be likely that D* would specify HR24/H24 receivers, just like when D* prioritized SWM for 5 or > tuner installs a while back?


----------



## Doug Brott

DirectMan said:


> If you have a new installation requesting MRV when it is an orderable service option wouldn't it be likely that D* would specify HR24/H24 receivers, just like when D* prioritized SWM for 5 or > tuner installs a while back?


I'd say that this is a real possibility, yes.


----------



## David Ortiz

veryoldschool said:


> Four Test Markets in:
> 
> 
> Columbia, MO,
> Fresno, CA,
> Denver, Co, and
> Portland
> will have all new customer installs set up with MRV. Of course HD equipment only. HDDVR required. Rolls out 3-17-10


Wow. I am in Fresno and when I moved a little over a year ago, the installer didn't want to use SWiM and it was only at my insistence that they used my own SWiMLine dish instead of the AU-9 that they brought with them. The excuse was that SWiM didn't really work all that well and they had numerous problems with them. I think it was an excuse to save money on the dish.

The local supervisor was extremely upset when my 4 receiver install turned into a three room installation, with two of them on a common wall. I hope new customers in Fresno aren't seeing the same issues.


----------



## Duke3K

DirecTV is taking orders on the new units.

I just ordered my MRV HD upgrade from Directv Customer Service. I'm getting (1) HR24 (1) H24 and the MRV setup. It's going to be installed tommorow. As you guys have said if you specify that you want MRV - they will guarantee that it will be the HR24/H24 units but you have to do MRV meaining you are upgrading at least two of your recievers.

I live in Denver - so I guess I'm one of the lucky ones for a change.


----------



## LameLefty

Duke3K said:


> DirecTV is taking orders on the new units.
> 
> I just ordered my MRV HD upgrade from Directv Customer Service. I'm getting (1) HR24 (1) H24 and the MRV setup. It's going to be installed tommorow. As you guys have said if you specify that you want MRV - they will guarantee that it will be the HR24/H24 units but you have to do MRV meaining you are upgrading at least two of your recievers.
> 
> I live in Denver - so I guess I'm one of the lucky ones for a change.


That's only because you are in one of the test markets. FOR NOW, most people will probably not be able to get any such specificity in equipment.


----------



## SunDevil2012

DirecTV is starting to look better and better every day.


----------



## Doug Brott

Duke3K said:


> DirecTV is taking orders on the new units.
> 
> I just ordered my MRV HD upgrade from Directv Customer Service. I'm getting (1) HR24 (1) H24 and the MRV setup. It's going to be installed tommorow. As you guys have said if you specify that you want MRV - they will guarantee that it will be the HR24/H24 units but you have to do MRV meaining you are upgrading at least two of your recievers.
> 
> I live in Denver - so I guess I'm one of the lucky ones for a change.


Thread split off to here: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=174322


----------



## damondlt

So when can I get an HR24 and H24. 
I want to do a MRV upgrade.
I have a D12, and R16 currently., I want to go HD in 2 rooms, while keeping the SD DVR in 1 room. 
So the HR24 can share the recordings with the H24?


----------



## Doug Brott

HR24s & H24s are available in select markets starting today .. Nationwide perhaps in 6-8 weeks according to what some folks are hearing when they call DIRECTV.


----------



## BudShark

damondlt said:


> So when can I get an HR24 and H24.
> I want to do a MRV upgrade.
> I have a D12, and R16 currently., I want to go HD in 2 rooms, while keeping the SD DVR in 1 room.
> So the HR24 can share the recordings with the H24?


See the big announcement on the front page. The HR24/H24 MRV is now a released and supported option in 4 markets. So it should be coming to you in a short period of time.
The HR24 can share recording with the H24 and any H21-H23 with an external DECA adapter.

In your case since you don't have an H21-H23 currently, once the program is available to you the best option would be to upgrade to HR24 and H24 with the R16 left in place.


----------



## damondlt

BudShark said:


> In your case since you don't have an H21-H23 currently, once the program is available to you the best option would be to upgrade to HR24 and H24 with the R16 left in place.


 This is exactly the route I want to take.
Do you Know if the offeres would still be the same. They said Currently my accout May 10 would be eligable for a HD DVR for $99 and a H- for $99.
They said though call back when it gets closer, Since a Free upgrade might become available to me.


----------



## utbronco

I have really been looking forward to the general release of MRV and now of the new HR24 DVR. I'm in SLC, Ut. so I'll be waiting a couple more months. I'm wanting to put two of the HR24s in my home replacing one HR21 DVR because of the 50 series recording limit. They would be located in different rooms. I had hoped that I could put some of my series requests on one unit with the rest on another unit without having to use the keyword searches. I do have an older SD unit next to my HR21 which I understand could be a problem if a DTV Technician decided to make a stink about it. 

I'm not sure if DTV is going to sell me two of the HR24s and MRV. Anyone have any idea??

Thanks
Dave


----------



## Mike Bertelson

utbronco said:


> I have really been looking forward to the general release of MRV and now of the new HR24 DVR. I'm in SLC, Ut. so I'll be waiting a couple more months. I'm wanting to put two of the HR24s in my home replacing one HR21 DVR because of the 50 series recording limit. They would be located in different rooms. I had hoped that I could put some of my series requests on one unit with the rest on another unit without having to use the keyword searches. I do have an older SD unit next to my HR21 which I understand could be a problem if a DTV Technician decided to make a stink about it.
> 
> I'm not sure if DTV is going to sell me two of the HR24s and MRV. Anyone have any idea??
> 
> Thanks
> Dave


That very thing is being discussed here.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=174322

Of course this only applies to the test markets.

Mike


----------



## newlions

How is the responsiveness of the remote on an H24 w/ DECA going to the HR24 (as the MRV server) for things like menu navigation or 30 sec slip? 

I have read about and experienced lag times between legacy DVRs using MRV over Ethernet. Is the lag noticeable? Is there any speed/lag difference in IR vs RF for those who have tested this combination. Thanks!

My setup:
HR22, HR20, and R15 

What I am thinking of going to:
HR24, HR24, and H24


----------



## veryoldschool

newlions said:


> How is the responsiveness of the remote on an H24 w/ DECA going to the HR24 (as the MRV server) for things like menu navigation or 30 sec slip?
> 
> I have read about and experienced lag times between legacy DVRs using MRV over Ethernet. Is the lag noticeable? Is there any speed/lag difference in IR vs RF for those who have tested this combination. Thanks!
> 
> My setup:
> HR22, HR20, and R15
> 
> What I am thinking of going to:
> HR24, HR24, and H24


I'd guess the answer is the HR24 has more power, so the MRV/server responds faster than my HR20 does.


----------



## b00st3d

dang, wished I hadn't just bought my HR23!


----------



## johnp37

Don't feel bad, I bought a couple of 23s a few months ago from Amazon. Still in their boxes, not yet activated. Anybody interested? PM me, I'm sure we can make a deal.


----------



## Slipkid87

So let's say you already have an HR-21. How does one go about upgrading to the latest and greatest? $hell out $199 a pop again? Ouch!


----------



## houskamp

Slipkid87 said:


> So let's say you already have an HR-21. How does one go about upgrading to the latest and greatest? $hell out $199 a pop again? Ouch!


 right now even that won't get you one..


----------



## Boxerbluedog

Has the general public already got there hands on this box. Does anyone have any idea whether this will be comparable to the Directivo DVR. Whats the difference in the HR24 100 & the Hr24 500. I assume hardrive space. Please correct me if Im wrong

Thanks
Eagerly Waiting DirecTivo HR10-250 Customer


----------



## veryoldschool

Boxerbluedog said:


> Has the general public already got there hands on this box. Does anyone have any idea whether this will be comparable to the Directivo DVR. Whats the difference in the HR24 100 & the Hr24 500. I assume hardrive space. Please correct me if Im wrong
> 
> Thanks
> Eagerly Waiting DirecTivo HR10-250 Customer


The -100/-500 is the manufacture's designation. I'd guess the features would be the same.
The HR24 has been found at a store in Fresno Ca., but so far that's the only one posted.


----------



## Beerstalker

They are available to installers in 4 markets right now, and it sounds like they might even be making their way into stores in those markets. They are not available in your market yet though.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

veryoldschool said:


> The -100/-500 is the manufacture's designation. I'd guess the features would be the same.
> The HR24 has been found at a store in Fresno Ca., but so far that's the only one posted.


There is no HR24-100, or if there is one, it only exists within DIRECTV. The new receiver is the *H24*-100 which is not a DVR.


----------



## veryoldschool

Stuart Sweet said:


> There is no HR24-100, or if there is one, it only exists within DIRECTV.


Which is why "I'd have to guess".


----------



## voltagexx

I apologize if this has been asked/answered already. I don't understand most of the technical terms and things going on here, but based on something I was reading at another site, is it true that this new receiver will let us record more than two programs at once, or record two and watch another? This is something I always wanted so it would be a major selling point for sure. (as would a discount for existing customers...)


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Just like other DVRs, you can record two live, record one and watch another live, or record two while watching a third already recorded. You cannot record two live programs and watch a third live program.


----------



## voltagexx

Darn. Well in that case count me out I guess. That's about the only feature that could sway me. I saw "this DVR has somewhere between three and eight tuners," on a site about this, so I was hoping that's what it meant. Guess I'll have to go back to trying to figure out what to do about the MLB Extra Innings package with the equipment I have.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

voltagexx said:


> Darn. Well in that case count me out I guess. That's about the only feature that could sway me. I saw "this DVR has somewhere between three and eight tuners," on a site about this, so I was hoping that's what it meant. Guess I'll have to go back to trying to figure out what to do about the MLB Extra Innings package with the equipment I have.


That was the HMC30 Home Media Center that you likely read about at this year's CES - slated for late 2010 or early 2011.

From reading the contents in the First Look - there seem to be many reasons to look kindly towards the HR24-500.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

voltagexx said:


> Darn. Well in that case count me out I guess. That's about the only feature that could sway me. I saw "this DVR has somewhere between three and eight tuners," on a site about this, so I was hoping that's what it meant. Guess I'll have to go back to trying to figure out what to do about the MLB Extra Innings package with the equipment I have.


Another site mistook a prototype DVR shown at CES for the HR24. That prototype, discussed here, is actually a completely different thing that isn't available to the public.


----------



## voltagexx

Looking through it, I can't find anything that would be helpful for me. Better speed would be nice, but it's certainly not a big enough deal to make it worth 200 bucks or whatever it will cost. I'm just in a regular ol' one-bedroom apartment with one tv so any sort of multi-room feature isn't beneficial at this point. The three tuners would've been tremendous. Either that or having the major networks available on demand. Ah well, I shall wait until such a feature is available I guess! Thanks for the help anyways.


----------



## Beerstalker

Stuart Sweet said:


> Another site mistook a prototype DVR shown at CES for the HR24. That prototype, discussed here, is actually a completely different thing that isn't available to the public.


After that one site called it an HR24 about 10 other sites that I saw repeated the same error. I'm not sure which site was first, but I definitely read it on quite a few (and I tried to leave comments telling them of their error at most).


----------



## bobnielsen

Beerstalker said:


> After that one site called it an HR24 about 10 other sites that I saw repeated the same error. I'm not sure which site was first, but I definitely read it on quite a few (and I tried to leave comments telling them of their error at most).


The Swanni factor :lol:


----------



## Doug Brott

Engadget kept calling it an HR24 .. I have sent corrections on more than one occasion, but to no avail apparently. Now, I believe the error originated because some folks in the Entropic booth (perhaps not DIRECTV employees) were actually calling it an HR24. The device @ CES was NOT an HR24. It was a prototype for the HMC30 (as folks above have noted).

This thread, however, is a discussion about the HR24-500 digital video recorder and the H24-100 standalone receiver.


----------



## PHL

voltagexx said:


> Looking through it, I can't find anything that would be helpful for me. Better speed would be nice, but it's certainly not a big enough deal to make it worth 200 bucks or whatever it will cost. I'm just in a regular ol' one-bedroom apartment with one tv so any sort of multi-room feature isn't beneficial at this point. The three tuners would've been tremendous. Either that or having the major networks available on demand. Ah well, I shall wait until such a feature is available I guess! Thanks for the help anyways.


Well, if you're a true TV junkie, you could just get a second DVR and hook both of them up to your one TV. Then, you would be able to record 4 shows simultaneously and still access everything from one Now Playing list. Granted, it will cost you, but no other DVR on the market can record more than 2 HD streams simultaneously, as far as I know.

Or put the second DVR in your bedroom (yeah, you'll need a second TV), and you can watch anything, anywhere.


----------



## Davenlr

PHL said:


> Or put the second DVR in your bedroom (yeah, you'll need a second TV), and you can watch anything, anywhere.


I have a second DVR in the bedroom, no TV. It just records series links. I watch them on the one in the living room 
Actually, I do have a portable 7" tv plugged into the video jack, so I can see the menu in case I have to add or delete a link.


----------



## lparsons21

PHL said:


> Well, if you're a true TV junkie, you could just get a second DVR and hook both of them up to your one TV. Then, you would be able to record 4 shows simultaneously and still access everything from one Now Playing list. Granted, it will cost you, but no other DVR on the market can record more than 2 HD streams simultaneously, as far as I know.


I think only Dish's Vip HDDVRs can do more than 2 HD streams at once, and then only OTA HD beyond the 2.


----------



## PHL

lparsons21 said:


> I think only Dish's Vip HDDVRs can do more than 2 HD streams at once, and then only OTA HD beyond the 2.


Also, AT&T advertises that you can record "up to" 4 shows at once on their DVR, but I'm pretty certain that you can only do 2 HD streams. If I recall, that was a fundamental problem with AT&T's FTTN IPTV strategy. It could only provide 2 simultaneous HD streams to each home.

In this regard, the HMC30 will be truly unique when it finally hits the market. I'm crossing my fingers since I remember lusting after the much-rumored D* HMC (announced at CES 2005) and the Verizon "6-Tuner DVR", both of which turned out to be vaporware.


----------



## PHL

Just curious,

Has anyone tried hooking up an eSATA drive to an HR24 yet? Does it function exactly the same way as with an HR20/21/22/23?

I was hoping that the HR24 would allow for using two HDD's simultaneously.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

PHL said:


> Just curious,
> 
> Has anyone tried hooking up an eSATA drive to an HR24 yet? Does it function exactly the same way as with an HR20/21/22/23?
> 
> I was hoping that the HR24 would allow for using two HDD's simultaneously.


It is like all the other HR's. Only one drive is active, either the internal or the external but not both.

Mike


----------



## voltagexx

PHL said:


> Well, if you're a true TV junkie, you could just get a second DVR and hook both of them up to your one TV. Then, you would be able to record 4 shows simultaneously and still access everything from one Now Playing list. Granted, it will cost you, but no other DVR on the market can record more than 2 HD streams simultaneously, as far as I know.
> 
> Or put the second DVR in your bedroom (yeah, you'll need a second TV), and you can watch anything, anywhere.


Hmm, I'm curious about what you're saying here. When you say that I could get another DVR and everything would still be on one now playing list, do you mean with this upcoming HR24, or right now would I be able to get a second DVR and still have that somehow work? I'm trying to figure out how that would function. I don't think I'd want to fork out that kind of money, but the idea intrigues me so I'd like to hear more about it. Basically I want to get the MLB Extra Innings package, and most games are at 7 PM. Unfortunately, most primetime network shows are somewhere between 8-11, so there's frequently two things recording as-is, meaning I'd have to cancel either the games or the other programs.


----------



## BattleScott

voltagexx said:


> Hmm, I'm curious about what you're saying here. When you say that I could get another DVR and everything would still be on one now playing list, do you mean with this upcoming HR24, or right now would I be able to get a second DVR and still have that somehow work? I'm trying to figure out how that would function. I don't think I'd want to fork out that kind of money, but the idea intrigues me so I'd like to hear more about it. Basically I want to get the MLB Extra Innings package, and most games are at 7 PM. Unfortunately, most primetime network shows are somewhere between 8-11, so there's frequently two things recording as-is, meaning I'd have to cancel either the games or the other programs.


Using the MRV option, which in your case would require nothing more than a short network cable and a 2nd DVR, you can have two or more DVRs providing the multiple tuners you need. The recorded material on the connected DVRs is displayed in a composite Playlist.


----------



## voltagexx

Wow, very interesting. Thanks for the information. That sounds like a great idea, although having to already spend 200 for the baseball package as-is, I don't know about another 200 for the HD DVR, plus the extra 5 each month for the extra receiver. I'll have to think about that one I guess.


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## Doug Brott

Please report HR24/H24 issues here:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=174716


----------



## PHL

voltagexx said:


> Wow, very interesting. Thanks for the information. That sounds like a great idea, although having to already spend 200 for the baseball package as-is, I don't know about another 200 for the HD DVR, plus the extra 5 each month for the extra receiver. I'll have to think about that one I guess.


If you're only concerned about baseball, I believe you can suspend the 2nd DVR during the off-season. That would save about $30 per year. I'm not sure if you'll be able to access any of the recordings during the suspension though. I'm sure it's been discussed elsewhere, I just don't know the answer.

Don't forget about the *NEW* 2-year commitment when you activate a new DVR.


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## ecilopaveht

I need a place to purchase this. Directv will not promise me one but they aggread to credit my account $199.00 if I can find one retail, I think they know they are not avalible.

If you know of a store anywere on this planet that has these please let me know.


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## Stuart Sweet

I'm sorry, you're several months too early for these to be in stores.


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## veryoldschool

ecilopaveht said:


> I need a place to purchase this. Directv will not promise me one but they aggread to credit my account $199.00 if I can find one retail, I think they know they are not avalible.
> 
> If you know of a store anywere on this planet that has these please let me know.





Stuart Sweet said:


> I'm sorry, you're several months too early for these to be in stores.


With Portland being one of the test markets, I'd start calling around there and then plan to make a drive if I found one that did.
Fresno is another test market and there is one store that has them.


----------



## David Ortiz

ecilopaveht said:


> I need a place to purchase this. Directv will not promise me one but they aggread to credit my account $199.00 if I can find one retail, I think they know they are not avalible.
> 
> If you know of a store anywere on this planet that has these please let me know.


I found an HR24 in Fresno after trying to get one through DIRECTV. I was told that getting one locally would be the only way to guarantee the model I received. One rep even mentioned Best Buy, but my success came after a rep gave me a list of local stores to check. One was Walmart, but the other three were satellite specialty shops. One of them had some in stock.

As was already mentioned, there are probably similar situations in Portland. Let your fingers do the walking...


----------



## TheRatPatrol

David Ortiz said:


> I found an HR24 in Fresno after trying to get one through DIRECTV. I was told that getting one locally would be the only way to guarantee the model I received. One rep even mentioned Best Buy, but my success came after a rep gave me a list of local stores to check. One was Walmart, but the other three were satellite specialty shops. One of them had some in stock.
> 
> As was already mentioned, there are probably similar situations in Portland. Let your fingers do the walking...


Please let us know what you think of it.


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## Davenlr

Who would you call at DirecTv to BUY one. I dont want to lease it. I want to BUY it. No one at the CSR level seems to have a clue how to buy a box.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Davenlr said:


> Who would you call at DirecTv to BUY one. I dont want to lease it. I want to BUY it. No one at the CSR level seems to have a clue how to buy a box.


Owned, leased, or whatever, I'd guess it all works the way it works now.

IOW, it's gonna be really difficult to own a leased receiver. :grin:

Mike


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## Richierich

I just bought one and it will be at my Home on Wednesday where I will put a 2 TB WD20EADS Drive in it replacing the Stock Internal Drive. 

You can find them but just not at Best Buy where those units will be Leased Units and not Owned. 

More likely at Ebay.com from someone who works at Directv.


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## veryoldschool

Davenlr said:


> Who would you call at DirecTv to BUY one. I dont want to lease it. I want to BUY it. No one at the CSR level seems to have a clue how to buy a box.


Try getting transferred to and asking the access card department.


----------



## ecilopaveht

David Ortiz said:


> I found an HR24 in Fresno after trying to get one through DIRECTV. I was told that getting one locally would be the only way to guarantee the model I received. One rep even mentioned Best Buy, but my success came after a rep gave me a list of local stores to check. One was Walmart, but the other three were satellite specialty shops. One of them had some in stock.
> 
> As was already mentioned, there are probably similar situations in Portland. Let your fingers do the walking...


What store in fresno, I am desperate!

Anyone have one they want to sell?:lol:


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## ecilopaveht

richierich said:


> I just bought one and it will be at my Home on Wednesday where I will put a 2 TB WD20EADS Drive in it replacing the Stock Internal Drive.
> 
> You can find them but just not at Best Buy where those units will be Leased Units and not Owned.
> 
> More likely at Ebay.com from someone who works at Directv.


Where did you get yours?


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## David Ortiz

ecilopaveht said:


> What store in fresno, I am desperate!
> 
> Anyone have one they want to sell?:lol:


Central Valley Entertainment Systems

I think they are closed on the weekend.


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## ecilopaveht

David Ortiz said:


> Central Valley Entertainment Systems
> 
> I think they are closed on the weekend.


Thank you!!, Their phone will be rining Monday Morning!


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## Hutchinshouse

This one is for sale (not lease).

http://denver.craigslist.org/ele/1660737416.html


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## Mike Bertelson

Kind of amazing, and a little suspicious, that there are so many “owned” HR24’s for sale already. :scratchin

Everyone should be careful. I’m just sayin’ :grin:

Mike


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## say-what

Hutchinshouse said:


> This one is for sale (not lease).
> 
> http://denver.craigslist.org/ele/1660737416.html


Can't even take a picture of his own receiver - the picture used isn't even an HR24, it's the DBSTalk.com picture (note the watermark on the pic top right, he cropped the other) of the "prototype" HMC30 the Entropic Booth at CES. Seems more than suspicious to me.


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## Richierich

Hutchinshouse said:


> This one is for sale (not lease).
> 
> http://denver.craigslist.org/ele/1660737416.html


Hutch, that is the one I just bought which will be at my doorstep on Wednesday.

It is Owned as the guy who sold it to me is a Directv Employee. They are allowed to purchase so many units within a specified timeframe and can sell them later if they so desire.

He didn't have a Digital Camera handy so he used those pictures to give an idea what the DVR looks like. A very nice individual who got it to UPS right away for me. He just needs money right away and can get another HR24-500 down the road if he desires to do so.


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## TheRatPatrol

richierich said:


> Hutch, that is the one I just bought which will be at my doorstep on Wednesday.
> 
> It is Owned as the guy who sold it to me is a Directv Employee. They are allowed to purchase so many units within a specified timeframe and can sell them later if they so desire.


You going to put a 2TB hard drive in it when you get it?


----------



## Richierich

TheRatPatrol said:


> You going to put a 2TB hard drive in it when you get it?


Yes, I always run my DVRs with 2 TB WD20EADS Drives in them as you can Never get enough Recording Capacity!!! :lol:

I ordered the WD20EADS yesterday for $149.99 plus Free Shipping from Newegg.com.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

richierich said:


> Yes, I always run my DVRs with 2 TB WD20EADS Drives in them as you can Never get enough Recording Capacity!!! :lol:
> 
> I ordered the WD20EADS yesterday for $149.99 plus Free Shipping from Newegg.com.


This one? Any issues with it?


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## Richierich

Yes, I have DVRs with 4 WD10EADS in them and 2 with 2 TB WD20EADS in them and I have not had a single problem with any of them.

However, I have heard that some people are experiencing problems with the WD20EARS so avoid that Drive for now.


----------



## bratboy

How hard is it to replace the drive? I Use the WD Green drives in my computer and am always seeing 1T+ drives on sale pretty cheap. I'm assuming going from 500 gig to 1T would basically dbl storage space, correct?


----------



## Mike Bertelson

bratboy said:


> How hard is it to replace the drive? I Use the WD Green drives in my computer and am always seeing 1T+ drives on sale pretty cheap. I'm assuming going from 500 gig to 1T would basically dbl storage space, correct?


I've heard that it's more difficult than the previous model HR's. Supposedly the case doesn't come apart the same way. Since Rich's is owned he'll let us know how it works.

Mike


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## Richierich

Actually it would more than double the amount of recording capacity.

Here is how it is calculated.

500 Gig minus 100 Gig for Housekeeping equals 400 Gig of Storage.
1000 Gig minus 100 Gig for Housekeeping equals 900 Gig of Storage.

I would recommend at least a 1.5 TB Drive myself as you would then have 1500 Gig minus 100 Gig equals 1400 Gig of Storage Space which would be 3 1/2 times more Storage than that of a 500 Gig Drive.


----------



## Richierich

MicroBeta said:


> I've heard that it's more difficult than the previous model HR's. Supposedly the case doesn't come apart the same way. Since Rich's is owned he'll let us know how it works.
> Mike


It definitely is harder to do if you don't know what you are doing so I am going to have a Friend help me who has done it with his HR24. It should only take about less than 30 minutes to do when you know what you are doing.

If you don't you could screw stuff up alot more easily than doing it on the other HR2X Models.


----------



## sigma1914

richierich said:


> ...
> I would recommend at least a 1.5 TB Drive myself as you would then have 1500 Gig minus 100 Gig equals 1400 Gig of Storage Space which would be 3 1/2 times more Storage than that of a 500 Gig Drive.


That's what...350 hours of space? Geez, that's A LOT of TV. :eek2:


----------



## Doug Brott

sigma1914 said:


> That's what...350 hours of space? Geez, that's A LOT of TV. :eek2:


Wait until he tells you how many other DVRs he has  :lol:


----------



## sigma1914

Doug Brott said:


> Wait until he tells you how many other DVRs he has  :lol:


Yea, I thought Rich had a Tom like DVR collection. :lol:


----------



## Richierich

I've got 6 DVRs and this will be Seven DVRs with 10,000 Gigabytes of Recording Capacity so when I Truly Want To Watch TV I Can Watch What I Want Where I Want & When I Want To Watch It!!! :lol:

With 14 Tuners and 350 Series Links Limit I can do some serious TV watching.

However, some DVRs Back Up the others in case I have a Hard Drive Failure.


----------



## MyDogHasFleas

PHL said:


> Also, AT&T advertises that you can record "up to" 4 shows at once on their DVR, but I'm pretty certain that you can only do 2 HD streams. If I recall, that was a fundamental problem with AT&T's FTTN IPTV strategy. It could only provide 2 simultaneous HD streams to each home.


Actually there is no such "fundamental" problem. AT&T is currently testing 3HD/1SD recording and will roll it out later this year. Customers today who have the new 32/5 profile (32 megabits down/5 megabits up) can record 2HD streams and view one, but can't record 3HD streams yet, until the 3HD/1SD feature goes into production.

Just so you know.... the competition isn't sitting still. Also they've had multi room DVR for some time now (I think it went into production last fall? I could be mistaken). They call it "Whole Home DVR".


----------



## veryoldschool

MyDogHasFleas said:


> Actually there is no such "fundamental" problem. AT&T is currently testing 3HD/1SD recording and will roll it out later this year. Customers today who have the new 32/5 profile (32 megabits down/5 megabits up) can record 2HD streams and view one, but can't record 3HD streams yet, until the 3HD/1SD feature goes into production.
> 
> Just so you know.... the competition isn't sitting still. Also they've had multi room DVR for some time now (I think it went into production last fall? I could be mistaken). They call it "Whole Home DVR".


Now this is only "my opinion" but 32 megabits down for 3 HD + 1 SD even with MPEG-4, is kind of lite and would be a "fundamental" limitation on PQ, and I've heard this also drops as internet use increases.


----------



## inkahauts

richierich said:


> Yes, I always run my DVRs with 2 TB WD20EADS Drives in them as you can Never get enough Recording Capacity!!! :lol:
> 
> I ordered the WD20EADS yesterday for $149.99 plus Free Shipping from Newegg.com.


You may want to run it as an external, and get a mx-1 to go with it... These units, from the pics I have seen internally, and what I have been told, are much more difficult to get to the drive...

BUt if you do get it apart, please, take pics and post them would ya? i'd love to see exactly how hard it is...


----------



## Richierich

I know someone who can do it in under 30 minutes. 

Yes, it is trickier than the other HR2X DVRs but with a little Intelligence, Experience and Patience it can be done quite easily from what I have been told if you know how and a Friend of mine knows how!!!

I'll keep you posted.


----------



## bratboy

richierich said:


> I've got 6 DVRs and this will be Seven DVRs with 10,000 Gigabytes of Recording Capacity so when I Truly Want To Watch TV I Can Watch What I Want Where I Want & When I Want To Watch It!!! :lol:
> 
> With 14 Tuners and 350 Series Links Limit I can do some serious TV watching.
> 
> However, some DVRs Back Up the others in case I have a Hard Drive Failure.


One problem I ran into with another box I had tho was trying to watch shows if no signal. If the pwr went out for a sec and then the DTV box rebooted if it couldn't get a signal I couldn't access any of my recordings. How do you get around that need for a signal issue?


----------



## bobnielsen

bratboy said:


> One problem I ran into with another box I had tho was trying to watch shows if no signal. If the pwr went out for a sec and then the DTV box rebooted if it couldn't get a signal I couldn't access any of my recordings. How do you get around that need for a signal issue?


I also found that the AM21 won't provide OTA in that situation either. But the answer is simple--UPS. I have a 650 kVA unit on my HR24 and a 550 kVA on my HR21 (with larger ones on my computers). The power drops quite often here and I learned that lesson several years ago.


----------



## Richierich

bratboy said:


> One problem I ran into with another box I had tho was trying to watch shows if no signal. If the pwr went out for a sec and then the DTV box rebooted if it couldn't get a signal I couldn't access any of my recordings. How do you get around that need for a signal issue?


I have APC Battery Backup UPS/Line Conditioner/Automatic Voltage Regulation/Surge Protection on my Home Entertainment Systems so I never have these Momentary Glitches as it switches over to Battery Backup if it Detects a loss of Power for 7 to 9 Milliseconds. It also outputs Pure Sine Wave Power.

The Worse Problem for Hard Drives is to have an Ungraceful Sudden Shutdown due to Power Outage or Power Spikes and Surges. Therefore I do not have these monentary outages and my drives last longer and I don't lose viewing time while I am waiting for the DVR to Power Back Up!!!


----------



## bratboy

bobnielsen said:


> I also found that the AM21 won't provide OTA in that situation either. But the answer is simple--UPS. I have a 650 kVA unit on my HR24 and a 550 kVA on my HR21 (with larger ones on my computers). The power drops quite often here and I learned that lesson several years ago.


I'd been thinking about getting one mainly just for my HR22/AM21 and with spring arriving power hiccups are more common but wasn't sure how big a ups I would need/want.


----------



## RACJ2

Does anyone know where the thread about the new HR24's went?


----------



## MyDogHasFleas

veryoldschool said:


> Now this is only "my opinion" but 32 megabits down for 3 HD + 1 SD even with MPEG-4, is kind of lite and would be a "fundamental" limitation on PQ, and I've heard this also drops as internet use increases.


I am not an AT&T fanboy, FYI, but I know what they are doing. First their compression has never been MPEG-2. I believe it was a flavor of MPEG-4 but is now proprietary and optimized to U-verse's specific bitrate budget.

When you do all the math it looks like they are getting by with 20-25% less bitrate than DirecTV does, per HD stream. Their compression technology makes up for this, a bit.

Bottom line is that most customers don't care that much about incremental HD PQ, which is hard for most people here to fathom. So U-verse is actually quite successful and is growing pretty fast.

As far as I can tell AT&T is trying hard to increase bandwidths through improved xDSL protocols and deploying more VRAD boxes. For right now they do have significant limitations on the ability to deliver to the home.

By the way the video streams always take priority in the system, so the Internet speeds will suffer, not the other way around.


----------



## MyDogHasFleas

To get it back on topic: I'm currently a Time Warner Cable TV customer (I have U-verse for Internet and phone). 

This new MRV and H24/HR24 technology has me wanting to switch. 

I would put 2x HR24 in my living room, one H24 in the bedroom, use the PC option to stream to my office, and put free SD receivers in the 3 guest bedrooms. I'd pay less than I pay with cable now, even without boxes in the guest rooms. 

I have two RG6 cables and two Cat5e cables into the living room so I can connect the two HR24s natively. However the bedroom only has one coax cable. Am I going to be able to use the bedroom H24 to access the HR24s? If so how?

Any setup or configuration comments (or any other advice) on my plan?


----------



## Doug Brott

MyDogHasFleas said:


> I have two RG6 cables and two Cat5e cables into the living room so I can connect the two HR24s natively. However the bedroom only has one coax cable. Am I going to be able to use the bedroom H24 to access the HR24s? If so how?
> 
> Any setup or configuration comments (or any other advice) on my plan?


If you were to get a new install with MRV in mind, you would possibly get all 24s and all networking would be through the coax - no Ethernet required.

The key point is that MRV is not available nationwide yet. This should happen in mid May so if MRV is in your plans, you should wait just a little bit longer.


----------



## ndole

MyDogHasFleas said:


> To get it back on topic: I'm currently a Time Warner Cable TV customer (I have U-verse for Internet and phone).
> 
> This new MRV and H24/HR24 technology has me wanting to switch.
> 
> I would put 2x HR24 in my living room, one H24 in the bedroom, use the PC option to stream to my office, and put *free SD receivers* in the 3 guest bedrooms. I'd pay less than I pay with cable now, even without boxes in the guest rooms.
> 
> I have two RG6 cables and two Cat5e cables into the living room so I can connect the two HR24s natively. However the bedroom only has one coax cable. Am I going to be able to use the bedroom H24 to access the HR24s? If so how?
> 
> Any setup or configuration comments (or any other advice) on my plan?


Free?


----------



## MyDogHasFleas

ndole_mbnd said:


> Free?


yeah, when I priced out a configuration yesterday (of course not MRV) it gave me 1 HD DVR free, 1 HD DVR for $99 ($100 off), 1 HD receiver for $99 (I think), and 3 free SD receivers.

of course "free" means no initial charge.


----------



## Davenlr

bratboy said:


> I'd been thinking about getting one mainly just for my HR22/AM21 and with spring arriving power hiccups are more common but wasn't sure how big a ups I would need/want.


HR22/AM21/SWM uses about 80 watts on my system. Add whatever the TV uses. Then double it, and you should be ok for minor outages. I have a 1500VA, and it reports (havent tested) it will run for 9 minutes with a 550W load which includes my Sharp 46", two DVRs w/eSATAs, HTPC, Sage Media Extender, HDMI switch, and Denon 100Wx5.1 Amp.


----------



## ecilopaveht

David Ortiz said:


> Central Valley Entertainment Systems
> 
> I think they are closed on the weekend.


THEY WON"T SELL ME ONE!!!!


----------



## Doug Brott

ecilopaveht said:


> THEY WON"T SELL ME ONE!!!!


This is not entirely shocking .. Soon.


----------



## zodiac

It would be nice if D offered us all a unit as an upgrade at a fair price, so we could use, test and report as we have in the past. It would be the easiest and less stressful for all of us. I have already tried to order a "New" unit at $250 for a third bedroom for guests and was sent a remanufactured unit which I refused (never had good luck with a used unit) and sent back after 5 0r 6 calls to get a return label (a complete waste of mine and D's time.)

My plan is to cancel service May 1st as I'm past all my obligations on time and just reorder new equipment once the new units start to ship out to new customers unless I can get a new unit someway else.


----------



## Smuuth

Great job on the First Look, guys! 

I was a bit pessimistic about the speed difference, especially compared to the HR20, but I will verify to anyone who asks that it is noticeably faster to the naked eye and this is from someone who paid DirecTV for an upgrade to add this box simultaneously with installing SWiM/MRV/DECA.

I also love the aesthetics and having only one coax and one power cable really cleans up the back of my equipment shelf. 

I have an HR20-100 that is slowly dying, so I am hoping that I will be able to specify an HR24 to replace it when the time comes since I have MRV now.


----------



## psyke0

Does anyone know if Media Share (using ViiV) dies with the release of the Hx24? It has to be the tedious and feature lacking protocol today. I would expect RVU (RUI) to be its replacement but that's just hoping.


----------



## say-what

psyke0 said:


> Does anyone know if Media Share (using ViiV) dies with the release of the Hx24? It has to be the tedious and feature lacking protocol today. I would expect RVU (RUI) to be its replacement but that's just hoping.


The same features you have on the current receivers exist on the HR24, including Media Share.


----------



## audioswami

Think it is time to get rid of the HR20 and HR21. I smell Upgrade.

R22 w/HD
HR-20
HR-21
HR-22 x 2
HR-23 x 2
SWiM8 x 2 w/expander
Aim 21


----------



## webby_s

psyke0 said:


> Does anyone know if Media Share (using ViiV) dies with the release of the Hx24? It has to be the tedious and feature lacking protocol today. I would expect RVU (RUI) to be its replacement but that's just hoping.





say-what said:


> The same features you have on the current receivers exist on the HR24, including Media Share.


Yep, Media Share works flewlessly on my HR24 and loving it. In all honesty, it's on par with my other HR21's and H21 but as stated before, 24's blow the 21's out of the water in regards to speed.


----------



## DaveC

say-what said:


> The same features you have on the current receivers exist on the HR24, including Media Share.


Has anyone tested control through the serial (USB) port on the H*24's? It's a feature on current receivers. I would expect it to be on there, but would be nice to confirm it.


----------



## Syzygy

webby_s said:


> Yep, Media Share works *flewlessly* on my HR24...


Izzat a cross between _flawlessly_ and _cluelessly_? Sorry, couldn't resist.


----------



## RAD

jjwolf said:


> so let me get this straight regarding the ethernet output port on the HR24:
> 
> I can put on HR24 in my upstair bedroom. It will get ethernet over the coax from my router downstairs. I can chain my PS3 that is upstairs next to my HR24 so that it too will receive a wired network connection.
> 
> If so, can I also run a network cable from the HR24 to a linksys 5 port switch to create more wired ethernet ports upstairs?
> 
> will the devices chained off of so many others in this scenario suffer a slower network connection?


No you can't, when you connect the HR24's ethernet port to your network it disables the internal DECA adapter so you don't have a network path over the coax from your HR24.


----------



## say-what

jjwolf said:


> so let me get this straight regarding the ethernet output port on the HR24:
> 
> I can put on HR24 in my upstair bedroom. It will get ethernet over the coax from my router downstairs. I can chain my PS3 that is upstairs next to my HR24 so that it too will receive a wired network connection.
> 
> If so, can I also run a network cable from the HR24 to a linksys 5 port switch to create more wired ethernet ports upstairs?
> 
> will the devices chained off of so many others in this scenario suffer a slower network connection?


Ethernet is disabled when using DECA.


----------



## jjwolf

too bad. I really wish they would have kept that pass thru ethernet port
that my HR23 has


----------



## T.are.U.InstallR

The hr-24 ethernet ONLY works for pass thru internet. Experienced first hand in training. The internet is supplied to the hr-24 ONLY thru deca. A switch may be used post hr-24 to expand ethernet ports. One of the MAIN selling points for deca is the ability to add internet functionality to a room without! Receiver is sooooo much quicker at everything I tried.


----------



## David MacLeod

T.are.U.InstallR said:


> The hr-24 ethernet ONLY works for pass thru internet. Experienced first hand in training. The internet is supplied to the hr-24 ONLY thru deca. A switch may be used post hr-24 to expand ethernet ports. One of the MAIN selling points for deca is the ability to add internet functionality to a room without! Receiver is sooooo much quicker at everything I tried.


internet can get to hr24 without deca. ethernet port works like normal.
hook cat5 to it from router/switch like normal.

if this is what directv training involves we have problems.....


----------



## BudShark

David MacLeod said:


> internet can get to hr24 without deca. ethernet port works like normal.
> hook cat5 to it from router/switch like normal.


+1000 what MacLeod said.

I have an HR24. It works DECA, it works Ethernet. It can NOT use both at one time. So its purely your setup/preference as to which to use.


----------



## barryb

T.are.U.InstallR said:


> The hr-24 ethernet ONLY works for pass thru internet. Experienced first hand in training. The internet is supplied to the hr-24 ONLY thru deca. A switch may be used post hr-24 to expand ethernet ports. One of the MAIN selling points for deca is the ability to add internet functionality to a room without! Receiver is sooooo much quicker at everything I tried.


:welcome_s to DBSTalk

What you are saying is that when DECA is connected to the HR24, the ethernet jack can pass the internet connection to other devices.


----------



## LameLefty

barryb said:


> :welcome_s to DBSTalk
> 
> What you are saying is that when DECA is connected to the HR24, the ethernet jack can pass the internet connection to others devices.


Since when?


----------



## barryb

LameLefty said:


> Since when?


I am as confused as you Mr. Lefty.


----------



## veryoldschool

T.are.U.InstallR said:


> The hr-24 ethernet ONLY works for pass thru internet. Experienced first hand in training. The internet is supplied to the hr-24 ONLY thru deca. A switch may be used post hr-24 to expand ethernet ports. One of the MAIN selling points for deca is the ability to add internet functionality to a room without! Receiver is sooooo much quicker at everything I tried.


You might want to re-look at this, since if you're using ethernet, the internal DECA is disabled.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Also I can tell you firsthand that the ethernet port on the HR24 works just like the ethernet port on other receivers. I use it that way myself. I've been told you can't bridge DECA to ethernet but I have no firsthand knowledge.


----------



## Doug Brott

As everyone has already said, The built in DECA is disabled if an Ethernet Connection is detected. In that situation, the Ethernet is used.


----------



## DonDeAgo

Does anyone know if the HR21 UHF remotes will work on the new HR 24?


----------



## veryoldschool

DonDeAgo said:


> Does anyone know if the HR21 UHF remotes will work on the new HR 24?


I was using an old RC 32RF, so "RF is RF" for these.


----------



## bobnielsen

They will work fine but you won't get the two-way setup features, of course (the HR24 will use the old-style setup if you have a remote other than the RC65X or RC65RX).


----------



## Mr. Big

DaveC said:


> Has anyone tested control through the serial (USB) port on the H*24's? It's a feature on current receivers. I would expect it to be on there, but would be nice to confirm it.


I'm wondering the same thing. I just set up my remote system to work on RS-232 and the only thing that sucks is that my HR-20 lags when I set up my macros.

Also, does anyone know if all of the video outputs are active at the same time? I have HDMI going to my plasma in the living room and component going to the secondary set in the den.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

All of the video outputs are most certainly active at the same time.


----------



## Mr. Big

Stuart Sweet said:


> All of the video outputs are most certainly active at the same time.


Thanks Stuart. Any word on RS-232 via the USB jack?


----------



## Skram0

Does anyone know how DirecTV's 3D channels will work? Which receivers will be capable of outputting 3D?

Will the HR24 even though it's only HDMI v1.3? If so, then for that matter I'd suppose a lot of the previous models would be able to also, maybe not if they're not capable of 1080p? I'm guessing the quality will be a lot lower due to the limitations of HDMI v1.3.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Skram0 said:


> Does anyone know how DirecTV's 3D channels will work? Which receivers will be capable of outputting 3D?
> 
> Will the HR24 even though it's only HDMI v1.3? If so, then for that matter I'd suppose a lot of the previous models would be able to also, maybe not if they're not capable of 1080p? I'm guessing the quality will be a lot lower due to the limitations of HDMI v1.3.


Welcome to DBSTalk. :welcome_s

Yes, 3D will work on all the current HD receivers. I'm not the best one to explain how this works but here I go. 

As for HDMI, v1.4 is not required to have 3D. It will work just fine on v1.3. Here is a decent explaination of 3d and versions 1.3 & 1.4.

Do we Need HDMI 1.3 or HDMI 1.4 for Stereoscopic 3D Support

Version 1.4 defines the standards for 3D over HDMI but since the cable/connector is the same (except for cables supporting the Ethernet and Audio Return Channel, and the new micro connector which don't apply to 3d), all the devices need not to be 1.4 compliant to have 3D. There should be not loss in quality because v1.3 isn't a limitation but rather it's undefined as in how to accomplish 3D (which, IMHO, leaves the door open for proprietary "matched" equipment...buy our blu-ray player because it will work best with our tv ). This leaves it up to the manufacturers to decide how to implement 3D over v1.3, and let's face it, in the beginning most sources will be v1.3 because, like DirecTV, that's what is already out there. :grin:

Mike


----------



## the3dolla

So, I've had DTV for like 28 months now. I called a few months ago and got 10/mo off for a year, yea pretty much the lower of the deals.

I'm going to combine my bill with AT&T and then see if I can haggle on the price more. I guess I don't sound convincing because I don't want comcast or u-verse because I just see to many bandwidth/bitrate issues.

Anyways, I have a HR21 as well and it's horribly slow, press a button, wait, press a button, oops it didn't work, press it again, wait; you know the drill. Sometimes it's "fast" most of the time it isn't.

I live in Southwest Michigan, I'd imagine that isn't a test market; are the hr24's live yet?

What are the chances I could get one for free!? I paid $200 for the HR21 and then months later of course they were offering it free.

Thanks, Nick


----------



## webby_s

the3dolla said:


> I live in Southwest Michigan, I'd imagine that isn't a test market; are the hr24's live yet?


Correct, I don't believe you are in the "test" market. But there are HR24's out in those test markets and so you could say they have gone "live" already since they are out in the wild. There's also "rumors" on the boards that the MRV/DECA will go nationwide May, 11 or May 13th depending on who you ask. (looks like May 13th from Doug) So for new or some upgrades you may see more HR24s out there.


> What are the chances I could get one for free!? I paid $200 for the HR21 and then months later of course they were offering it free.
> 
> Thanks, Nick


Free?! No, I don't see how you could get it free. Maybe $100 but more likely $200. But sorry, not free


----------



## abruns

I had a service call today for playback issues on my hr20 and a loud hard drive. They replaced it with a HR24-500. Tech said it was the first one he has seen. His supervisor came my and he told me that MRV/DECA would be avaliable next week.


----------



## vegasnv

abruns said:


> I had a service call today for playback issues on my hr20 and a loud hard drive. They replaced it with a HR24-500. Tech said it was the first one he has seen. His supervisor came my and he told me that MRV/DECA would be avaliable next week.


How does the HR24 compare to the HR20?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

It's quite a bit faster and has a larger hard drive.


----------



## Sixto

vegasnv said:


> How does the HR24 compare to the HR20?


See post#7 (for HR23 compare).


----------



## dminches

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's quite a bit faster and has a larger hard drive.


The "faster" part is very important. The hard drive part isn't (at least for me) since I would guess many people replace theirs or use a large external. The ability to do that is one of the best features of the DTV DVRs.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

With the HR24 you can still use an external but replacing the internal is quite a bit more difficult and I simply don't recommend it.


----------



## dminches

Stuart Sweet said:


> With the HR24 you can still use an external but replacing the internal is quite a bit more difficult and I simply don't recommend it.


I agree. Hanging an external is too easy not to do although I have read the reasons why people replace internals (noise, heat, etc.).


----------



## Stuart Sweet

For the record the HR24's internal drive is almost silent and it runs cooler than any other DVR I've had.


----------



## aleicgrant

I would love to have this new dvr but correct me if I am wrong if I swap out my internal 2tb from my H21 I would lose everything correct? I have 3 dvr's all with 2tb drives.............. Lots of movies being shared.........


----------



## hdtvfan0001

aleicgrant said:


> I would love to have this new dvr but correct me if I am wrong if I swap out my internal 2tb from my H21 I would lose everything correct? I have 3 dvr's all with 2tb drives.............. Lots of movies being shared.........


Correct - internal hard drives are device specific - you can't move the content to a different HD DVR.


----------



## roller11

I live in Denver, a roll out market. I was thinking about switching over to D* from E*. Does D* offer all of the Colorado Rockies baseball games in HD? I know D* 'supposedly' does, but I need this verified by a someone who has actually observed the rockies in HD on Directv.


----------



## dwcolvin

roller11 said:


> I live in Denver, a roll out market. I was thinking about switching over to D* from E*. Does D* offer all of the Colorado Rockies baseball games in HD? I know D* 'supposedly' does, but I need this verified by a someone who has actually observed the rockies in HD on Directv.


This thread and this Sub-Forum are probably not the best place to ask...


----------



## sigma1914

roller11 said:


> I live in Denver, a roll out market. I was thinking about switching over to D* from E*. Does D* offer all of the Colorado Rockies baseball games in HD? I know D* 'supposedly' does, but I need this verified by a someone who has actually observed the rockies in HD on Directv.


FS Rocky Mountain is 24-7 HD...If the games produced in HD, then you'll get it in HD.


----------



## anleva

roller11 said:


> I live in Denver, a roll out market. I was thinking about switching over to D* from E*. Does D* offer all of the Colorado Rockies baseball games in HD? I know D* 'supposedly' does, but I need this verified by a someone who has actually observed the rockies in HD on Directv.


Yes. I live in Colorado and watch the Rockies games in HD on DirecTV on Fox Sports Rocky Mountain.


----------



## SlimyPizza

slapshot1959 said:


> Very nice!
> 
> Keep this up and we won't have any need/want/desire/use for a Directv Tivo.


I will. What's the latest on when the TiVo units are coming out anyway? I haven't heard anything in awhile.


----------



## sigma1914

SlimyPizza said:


> I will. What's the latest on when the TiVo units are coming out anyway? I haven't heard anything in awhile.


Maybe late 2010 or early 2011...in Tivo-onics, that means between 2011 and never.


----------



## RunnerFL

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Correct - internal hard drives are device specific - you can't move the content to a different HD DVR.


So are external drives.


----------



## webby_s

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's quite a bit faster and has a larger hard drive.


And Mr. Sweet, you have a gift of understatement!

It is Superman Fast! Remember!!


----------



## Mike Bertelson

SlimyPizza said:


> I will. What's the latest on when the TiVo units are coming out anyway? I haven't heard anything in awhile.


You'll find all the DirecTiVo info you could ever want right here

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=174544

Mike


----------



## roller11

anleva said:


> Yes. I live in Colorado and watch the Rockies games in HD on DirecTV on Fox Sports Rocky Mountain.


Thanks for the response. Dishnetwork offers *some* of the Rockies games in HD. Just to be clear, as far as you know, Directv offers ALL games in HD, is this correct?


----------



## sigma1914

roller11 said:


> Thanks for the response. Dishnetwork offers *some* of the Rockies games in HD. Just to be clear, as far as you know, Directv offers ALL games in HD, is this correct?


Yes, as I sai before...FS Rocky Mountain is 24-7 HD...If the games produced in HD, then you'll get it in HD.


----------



## SPACEMAKER

I just called and asked if the HR24/H24/DECA was available in my area. The CSR I spoke with simply did not know and the person he spoke with while I was on hold apparently had no idea as well.

I guess I will call next week and see if there is any new info.


----------



## lcsenn

I am sure this has been discussed, but I cannot find the answer. Apprecite any assistance.


----------



## veryoldschool

lcsenn said:


> I am sure this has been discussed, but I cannot find the answer. Apprecite any assistance.


It is an RF remote.


----------



## lcsenn

Is there any remote that is uhf that will work with the HR24?


----------



## veryoldschool

lcsenn said:


> Is there any remote that is uhf that will work with the HR24?


What exactly do you mean by "UHF"?
The RC65RX is what I'm using with my HR24 right now, in RF mode.


----------



## lcsenn

My bad, old term. Rf is what I had reference to. I want to place the HR24 in a utility room with other equipment and use remote in other rooms.

Thanks for your help!


----------



## Paul E Fox II

Got to play with one today as my Father-in-Law upgraded to HD and they brought the HR24-500 and the H24-100.

I can say that the HR24 is FAST, FAST, FAST! Looks pretty cool too.

His dish only appears to have one LNB so I'm guessing it's the new one and he does have two functional tuners.

Very jealous now!


----------



## TheRatPatrol

veryoldschool said:


> What exactly do you mean by "UHF"?


UHF remotes were used back during the C-band days. Now its called RF. Not sure when or why they changed the name.


----------



## veryoldschool

TheRatPatrol said:


> UHF remotes were used back during the C-band days. Now its called RF. Not sure when or why they changed the name.


"Most likely" because the H/HR2x calls it "RF" [in setting it up] and UHF is RF :lol:


----------



## anleva

roller11 said:


> Thanks for the response. Dishnetwork offers *some* of the Rockies games in HD. Just to be clear, as far as you know, Directv offers ALL games in HD, is this correct?


Yes Roller. All the games in HD.


----------



## webby_s

Paul E Fox II said:


> Got to play with one today as my Father-in-Law upgraded to HD and they brought the HR24-500 and the H24-100.
> 
> I can say that the HR24 is FAST, FAST, FAST! Looks pretty cool too.
> 
> His dish only appears to have one LNB so I'm guessing it's the new one and he does have two functional tuners.
> 
> Very jealous now!


Ya he most likely has the "newer" SWMline 3LNB ODU (Singlewire Multiswitch LNB outdoor unit) It has a "single" LNB but that actually sees the three sats (with a 4th coming soon, D12) the 99 101 103 satellites.

They are SUPER FAST arn't they!!!


----------



## the3dolla

webby_s said:


> Correct, I don't believe you are in the "test" market. But there are HR24's out in those test markets and so you could say they have gone "live" already since they are out in the wild. There's also "rumors" on the boards that the MRV/DECA will go nationwide May, 11 or May 13th depending on who you ask. (looks like May 13th from Doug) So for new or some upgrades you may see more HR24s out there.
> 
> Free?! No, I don't see how you could get it free. Maybe $100 but more likely $200. But sorry, not free


Well, I just say that because I seemingly always see people say. "They said 20/mo off for a year, free HD-DVR, etc.." When I got my HR-21, new service; I paid 200. Right now I pay $70/mo for service; one hddvr. My friend got service a few months after me and I think he got it free. Seems as if the HR24 is more probable now. I may be calling on Sunday/Monday to cancel my premiums (The Pacific is over, which btw was pretty "eh" compared to the action in band of brothers) Then see my options, atm I'm prepared to cancel and use OTA/Internet to watch TV.

My friend cancelled recently and he said, you can't change my mind. They set it up to cancel, but then they called up and said "We'll give you free service for two months; then you can decide what you want to do"

Nick


----------



## pdxguy

I need to record our local CW over the air because the satellite feed breaks up all the time. Does the AM21 work with the HR24?


----------



## RAD

pdxguy said:


> I need to record our local CW over the air because the satellite feed breaks up all the time. Does the AM21 work with the HR24?


Yep, works just fine with mine.


----------



## pdxguy

Thanks, RAD.


----------



## bobnielsen

pdxguy said:


> I need to record our local CW over the air because the satellite feed breaks up all the time. Does the AM21 work with the HR24?


Yes, just as it does with the other HD receivers without built-in OTA.


----------



## Syzygy

pdxguy said:


> I need to record our local CW over the air because the satellite feed breaks up all the time...


I have the reverse situtation: My over the air CW (ch 23 here) breaks up all the time because I'm in a valley, but the satellite feed is better. Still, the spot-beamed CW has lots of audio dropouts.

I wonder how many viewers are experiencing poor spot-beamed CW reception? [Sorry, I just realized how far OT this is.]


----------



## kjgarrison

Title says it all.

FWIW, I have SWM8 that I bought and installed, and two HD DVRs, one owned and one leased. (HR20 and 21(?). I own the HR20.

I am not in a "rollout" area. (Northern Wisconsin)


----------



## RAD

kjgarrison said:


> Title says it all.
> 
> FWIW, I have SWM8 that I bought and installed, and two HD DVRs, one owned and one leased. (HR20 and 21(?). I own the HR20.
> 
> I am not in a "rollout" area. (Northern Wisconsin)


See thread http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=176749 for info. BTW MRV/Whole Home DVR service is now nationwide, pilot ended Thursday.


----------



## MONSTERMAN

Trying to upgrade my R15-500 and D11-800 to the HR24-500 and H24-100 with MRV and SWM.

Directv customer service offered a $100 discount, so the total was $340 for everything plus shipping and tax, with me installing everything as well.

I have never gotten *anything* from Directv for free, seems now new customers get the best deals and loyal customers get the shaft :nono2:.

Is $340.00 a fair price for a loyal Directv customer of 16 years, never a late payment?


----------



## jjwolf

just curious how is that 340 broken down for hardware and
for the SWM?

What equipment are they sending you for the SWM? If its the LNB, they are
expecting you to install it?

I have the SWM and receivers but just need the DECA


----------



## Steve

MONSTERMAN said:


> Trying to upgrade my R15-500 and D11-800 to the HR24-500 and H24-100 with MRV and SWM.
> 
> Directv customer service offered a $100 discount, so the total was $340 for everything plus shipping and tax, with me installing everything as well.
> 
> I have never gotten *anything* from Directv for free, seems now new customers get the best deals and loyal customers get the shaft :nono2:.
> 
> Is $340.00 a fair price for a loyal Directv customer of 16 years, never a late payment?


Unless you don't want an installer in your home, DirecTV should at least throw in installation for you (a $50 value).

BTW, if you don't already have one, I'd ask to have a 3-LNB SWM dish installed and peaked as well. For your set-up, that's probably a cleaner way to go than adding a stand-alone SWiM to your existing dish. Just my .02, others may disagree.


----------



## MurrayW

Mr. Big said:


> Thanks Stuart. Any word on RS-232 via the USB jack?


I got a HR24-500 this weekend as part of a DECA install. I connected an IOGear USB 2.0 to Serial/PDA Converter Cable GUC232A to the back USB port and connected it to a null modem cable and everything worked fine just like my 3 HR20-700's and HR21-100.


----------



## Mr. Big

MurrayW said:


> I got a HR24-500 this weekend as part of a DECA install. I connected an IOGear USB 2.0 to Serial/PDA Converter Cable GUC232A to the back USB port and connected it to a null modem cable and everything worked fine just like my 3 HR20-700's and HR21-100.


Thanks, that's what I was hoping for. The HR24 should be in my hands mid-week.


----------



## cavinny

Did you request a HR-24 or was it random?


----------



## Mr. Big

cavinny said:


> Did you request a HR-24 or was it random?


I ordered it from Solid Signal.


----------



## Gottria

So what if your installer shows up and doesn't have the HR24 and you refuse it? Do you get charged? Do they come back when they have a HR-24? Do you call DTV and tell them you want a HR24 or you not having one installed?


----------



## Richierich

You need to find out from Directv who your installer is so you can call them and request an HR24. 

I did that and finally got what I wanted because I found out that the Directv CSR did not write up the order right.


----------



## ps2baseball

veryoldschool said:


> It is an RF remote.


Does this mean I can hide the box? That is huge for me.


----------



## ps2baseball

Does this have a 30 second skip and reverse?

Thinking about switching from Dish. Also, does this have the mini guide, meaning I can stay on a channel and hit the up key to surf channels?


----------



## Davenlr

ps2baseball said:


> Does this have a 30 second skip and reverse?
> 
> Thinking about switching from Dish. Also, does this have the mini guide, meaning I can stay on a channel and hit the up key to surf channels?


Yes, 30 second skip and reverse. Mini Guide on DirecTv uses the "Blue" key on the remote to do that, but yes.


----------



## Richierich

ps2baseball said:


> Does this mean I can hide the box? That is huge for me.


Yes as long as RF can penetrate whatever you hide the DVR in.


----------



## jwehman

First post, new DTV customer ("Hi!")

I have the HR-24 (and coming from 7 years with TiVo, I'm very happy with the functionality...almost (completely?) on par with TiVo's usability)

My question is regarding Internet connectivity. I currently have MRV working with another H-24 downstairs (and watching Avatar 1080p from the H-24 while it was actually recording to the HR-24 was quite an accomplishment...kudos!).

However, the ethernet port on the HR-24 does not appear to be working (the LED's do not light up, and the DVR does not see the connection). From reading here, that appears to be the case with the internal DECA functionality turned on.

But...what do I do if I also want internet connectivity? Do I have to go to some menu and enable/disable DECA to get the internet connection working? I'm mainly only concerned with VOD...but it does appear that Directv2pc might serve some purpose as well.

Thanks in advance!

Rgds,

John Wehman


----------



## RAD

jwehman said:


> First post, new DTV customer ("Hi!")
> 
> I have the HR-24 (and coming from 7 years with TiVo, I'm very happy with the functionality...almost (completely?) on par with TiVo's usability)
> 
> My question is regarding Internet connectivity. I currently have MRV working with another H-24 downstairs (and watching Avatar 1080p from the H-24 while it was actually recording to the HR-24 was quite an accomplishment...kudos!).
> 
> However, the ethernet port on the HR-24 does not appear to be working (the LED's do not light up, and the DVR does not see the connection). From reading here, that appears to be the case with the internal DECA functionality turned on.
> 
> But...what do I do if I also want internet connectivity? Do I have to go to some menu and enable/disable DECA to get the internet connection working? I'm mainly only concerned with VOD...but it does appear that Directv2pc might serve some purpose as well.
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> Rgds,
> 
> John Wehman


When you boot the HR24/H24 up without an ethernet cable connected to it the internal DECA adapter is enabled and the ethernet port is disable and if there's an ethernet cable connected the internal DECA adapter is disabled. There is no way to have both active at the same time. What you need to do is contact DirecTV and tell them you also need internet connectivity (ICK feature) which adds a seperate DECA adapter where you have your router to connect the DECA network to your ethernet network. This is a question the CSR should have asked you when you ordered so it would be on the work order (or it was and the installer didn't install it).


----------



## psuscott0483

how does this work? can i get a h24-500 and my other hd receivers will suddenly be able to see whats recorded on it? or do i have to run coax or cat6 to interconnect all of them?


----------



## Mike Bertelson

psuscott0483 said:


> how does this work? can i get a h24-500 and my other hd receivers will suddenly be able to see whats recorded on it? or do i have to run coax or cat6 to interconnect all of them?


They would have to networked somehow. Either via DECA (coax) for Ethernet (Cat5/6).

Then you'd have to have MRV/Whole Home DVR activated for $3/mo.

Mike


----------



## ps2baseball

So, if my wife goes in the other room and grabs something off of the living room DVR, does she hijack the TV like Slingbox? Or does she just take a tuner.

And do I understand this correctly, this puppy has 3 tuners?

Any PIP?


----------



## Mike Bertelson

ps2baseball said:


> So, if my wife goes in the other room and grabs something off of the living room DVR, does she hijack the TV like Slingbox? Or does she just take a tuner.
> 
> And do I understand this correctly, this puppy has 3 tuners?
> 
> Any PIP?


With MRV, she doesn't have access to the tuners on the server DVR.

She would be streaming a recording.

You would still have access to both tuners and the Playlist. You probably wouldn't know she was watching something off that DVR.

However, the DVR can only stream to one client, so someone in another room can't watch anything from the living room DVR.

Mike


----------



## RAD

ps2baseball said:


> So, if my wife goes in the other room and grabs something off of the living room DVR, does she hijack the TV like Slingbox? Or does she just take a tuner.


No, the MRV function only allows a client receiver (either another HD DVR or HD reeiver) to view a recording on the server. Your wife in the other room would need another HD receiver or HD DVR to act as the client. Watching something from a HD DVR has no impact on the functions on that HD DVR, you'll not even know that someone is watching something recorded.



 ps2baseball said:


> And do I understand this correctly, this puppy has 3 tuners?
> 
> Any PIP?


The DirecTV HD DVR's have two DBS tuners in it and you can add a AM21 module that adds two ATSC/OTA tuners. However, only two tuners can be active at one time. And no, there is no PIP support.


----------



## roller11

Davenlr said:


> Yes, 30 second skip and reverse. Mini Guide on DirecTv uses the "Blue" key on the remote to do that, but yes.


I understand that there is no skip. You can do a one click 30 second fast forward, but it doesn't instantly skip forward by 30 seconds. Was I misinformed, or does the HR24 do an instantaneous 30 forward skip? Also, how many seconds does the 'skip' reverse go back?


----------



## ps2baseball

Great info guys. This sounds like it is for us. Going to have an HD box in the bedroom, just don't want her messing with my TV when she goes to bed!

How is the swap tuner feature? I love my Dish 722 for this reason, I use it for lighting fast channel changing.

This sounds great. So I can watch a recorded show, and at the same time record two more, while she streams a previously recorded? Sick.


----------



## sigma1914

roller11 said:


> I understand that there is no skip. You can do a one click 30 second fast forward, but it doesn't instantly skip forward by 30 seconds. Was I misinformed, or does the HR24 do an instantaneous 30 forward skip? Also, how many seconds does the 'skip' reverse go back?


You can 30 skip and here's how:
Search/keyword/all/30skip
which will return no entries, so select "done".


----------



## ps2baseball

sigma1914 said:


> You can 30 skip and here's how:
> Search/keyword/all/30skip
> which will return no entries, so select "done".


Where?


----------



## bobnielsen

Menu -> Smart Search


----------



## ronkuba

ps2baseball said:


> Where?


Menu, smart search, type 30skip,


----------



## ps2baseball

So there isn't a button for it? You have to dig thru the menu? Or is that to set it up.


----------



## barryb

ps2baseball said:


> So there isn't a button for it? You have to dig thru the menu? Or is that to set it up.


No button. Just do what was mentioned above. You will settle into how you like to FF.


----------



## RunnerFL

ps2baseball said:


> So there isn't a button for it? You have to dig thru the menu? Or is that to set it up.


Once you do the keyword search it enables 30 second skip. Once enabled the same button that you were using for 30 second slip, where you see it move forward 30 seconds, becomes a 30 second skip button.


----------



## Steve Robertson

Any improvement on PQ with this box?


----------



## Stuart Sweet

The picture quality is equivalent.


----------



## RunnerFL

Steve Robertson said:


> Any improvement on PQ with this box?


Minor if at all. I'm thinking it's brighter and crisper but that may just be my mind thinking that because it's new.


----------



## Steve Robertson

RunnerFL said:


> Minor if at all. I'm thinking it's brighter and crisper but that may just be my mind thinking that because it's new.


My mind does the same thing and not surprised there isn't much difference


----------



## camo

Question about the HR24. Does it require the swm power supply. I noticed it had two cable inputs the one on left says swm 2 and the one on right says satellite 2.
Got no directions with receiver.


----------



## sigma1914

camo said:


> Question about the HR24. Does it require the swm power supply. I noticed it had two cable inputs the one on left says swm 2 and the one on right says satellite 2.
> Got no directions with receiver.


Are you on a SWM setup? The HR24 hooks up like any other HR20 21 or 22.


----------



## camo

Yes, I have SWM and a pl-21 power supply, that powers up the SWM signal. I used the power supply off my HR20 and everything is working. I was hoping the HR24 would not need it because it has the dual coax inputs. One of the inputs says SWM2, that's where I connected. I really was thinking there would be a base instruction manual with the receiver but just a generic user manual came with it. Thanks for the help.


----------



## RAD

camo said:


> Yes, I have SWM and a pl-21 power supply, that powers up the SWM signal. I used the power supply off my HR20 and everything is working. I was hoping the HR24 would not need it because it has the dual coax inputs. One of the inputs says SWM2, that's where I connected. I really was thinking there would be a base instruction manual with the receiver but just a generic user manual came with it. Thanks for the help.


Sorry but I don't understand what you're asking. The power
supply for you SWiM is for powering that and nothing else. When you have SWiM you only need one cable from the SWiM and that connects to the #1 port on the HR DVR's, nothing connected to port #2. On the HR24 just connected one coax from your SWiM splitter to port #1.


----------



## camo

It Looks like this. http://www.prosatellitesupply.com/images/PI21_power-supply_LNB-1.jpg This was installed on my HR20 original installation and I also have a slimline dish. I have the power supply hooked up with the HR24 and works.
I connected the HR-20 up without SWM power supply and everything still works.

FYI the HR24 is really fast compared to the HR20.


----------



## mobandit

camo said:


> Question about the HR24. Does it require the swm power supply. I noticed it had two cable inputs the one on left says swm 2 and the one on right says satellite 2.
> Got no directions with receiver.


A SWM system is what requires a power supply, not a receiver...AFAIK, the HR24 is just another receiver...


----------



## camo

Mine was hooked up with a multiple splitter outside and extra power inserter inside (pick posted above), plugs directly into the receiver.


----------



## veryoldschool

camo said:


> Mine was hooked up with a multiple splitter outside and extra power inserter inside (pick posted above), plugs directly into the receiver.


The SWiM needs a PI and it sounds like yours was mounted/connected near your receiver and then the receiver was connected to the PI output to feed the SAT signal to the receiver.
The receivers need no PI to work.


----------



## camo

Appreciate the help. So I'm thinking that's the only PI I would need on the system. The splitter outside has 6 or 8 outlets.


----------



## veryoldschool

camo said:


> Appreciate the help. So I'm thinking that's the only PI I would need on the system. The splitter outside has 6 or 8 outlets.


I came in late, so don't know if you're also asking about DECAs too, but they need one PI for the DECA to router bridge.


----------



## Skram0

So, has anyone verified if you can specify an HR24 if you upgrade your service to HD DVR? I currently have a series 1 dtivo, and I'm thinking now is the time to upgrade with the speed that the HR24 has to offer. Exactly what I'm looking for in a DVR. Smoke circles around my old series 1. :hurah:


----------



## RobertE

Skram0 said:


> So, has anyone verified if you can specify an HR24 if you upgrade your service to HD DVR? I currently have a series 1 dtivo, and I'm thinking now is the time to upgrade with the speed that the HR24 has to offer. Exactly what I'm looking for in a DVR. Smoke circles around my old series 1. :hurah:


No you can nost specify a specific model. Any CSR that tells you otherwise is misinformed. It will be whatever the tech has available to him at the time.


----------



## ps2baseball

I called them and was about to order. The CSR not only told me the 24 "was Tivo" but said the Dish would be losing DVR service soon due to a court ruling! Classic!


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Are you sure you didn't call 1-800-Dishnetwork? :lol:


----------



## Mr. Big

Nitehawk^ said:


> A couple quick questions... can the blue ring be turned off like on the other HR2x boxes?
> and how about the other smaller blue rings as well as the DirecTv logo, are they always on? Or doesn't it distract during viewing?


Has this ever been answered? The blue lights are really distracting to me seeing that my unit sits right below my TV screen.


----------



## veryoldschool

Mr. Big said:


> Has this ever been answered? The blue lights are really distracting to me seeing that my unit sits right below my TV screen.


Yes the same way, but since it isn't anywhere near as bright, I don't because the power/DirecTV logo light is much brighter.


----------



## Baconbeard

So if I want to upgrade and enjoy multi-room viewing with Deca, what do I need to do? I currently have the beta version set up wirelessly, but it does not work that well.

I currently have 2 HR20-700's and the 5 LNB Dish. Since the HR24 has built in Deca, do I simply just swap out the receivers, and that's all there is to it? Or is there any other equipment I need?


----------



## veryoldschool

Baconbeard said:


> So if I want to upgrade and enjoy multi-room viewing with Deca, what do I need to do? I currently have the beta version set up wirelessly, but it does not work that well.
> 
> I currently have 2 HR20-700's and the 5 LNB Dish. Since the HR24 has built in Deca, do I simply just swap out the receivers, and that's all there is to it? Or is there any other equipment I need?


The upgrade package may be the best/cheapest option.
You need a SWiM system.
You can add DECAs to each of your receivers and another one to connect to your home network.


----------



## RAD

Baconbeard said:


> So if I want to upgrade and enjoy multi-room viewing with Deca, what do I need to do? I currently have the beta version set up wirelessly, but it does not work that well.
> 
> I currently have 2 HR20-700's and the 5 LNB Dish. Since the HR24 has built in Deca, do I simply just swap out the receivers, and that's all there is to it? Or is there any other equipment I need?


Your 5LNB dish needs to be changed out to a SWiM LNB and your HR20-700's would get a DECA adapter for each. There is no need to swap out your HR20's just to get DECA. If you also want internet connectivity then you'll need a DECA adapter to interconnect to your ethernet network.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Baconbeard said:


> So if I want to upgrade and enjoy multi-room viewing with Deca, what do I need to do? I currently have the beta version set up wirelessly, but it does not work that well.
> 
> I currently have 2 HR20-700's and the 5 LNB Dish. Since the HR24 has built in Deca, do I simply just swap out the receivers, and that's all there is to it? Or is there any other equipment I need?


DECA requires SWiM to work for MRV, so you would an SWiM module (SWM8, SWM-LNB, etc).

Next you would need DECA adapters for the HR20s, and a Band Stop Filter. Then you'd have a DECA/MRV network. To access the internet you'd need to add an DECA to Broadband adapter.

What's wrong with our existing MRV. I have MRV over Ethernet and it works great. Wireless?

Mike


----------



## RAD

MicroBeta said:


> Next you would need DECA adapters for the HR20s, and a Band Stop Filter.


Band Stop Filters would be necessary only if the SWiMLNB or SWiM8/16 didn't have a green label on them (which I would hope they all would by now for a new install).


----------



## Baconbeard

Thanks for all the quick responses guys. Do I simply just call Directv and tell them I want to upgrade to the Whole-Home DVR service, and they will come out and install the new dish, deca, adapters, etc.?

According to my account online, I am "not eligible for this product."


----------



## RAD

Baconbeard said:


> Thanks for all the quick responses guys. Do I simply just call Directv and tell them I want to upgrade to the Whole-Home DVR service, and they will come out and install the new dish, deca, adapters, etc.?
> 
> According to my account online, I am "not eligible for this product."


Yep, that's how it's supposed to work. They'll want to charge a credit card the $99 for hardware and $49 for install (unless you can talk them into a deal) at the time of the order.


----------



## Baconbeard

MicroBeta said:


> DECA requires SWiM to work for MRV, so you would an SWiM module (SWM8, SWM-LNB, etc).
> 
> Next you would need DECA adapters for the HR20s, and a Band Stop Filter. Then you'd have a DECA/MRV network. To access the internet you'd need to add an DECA to Broadband adapter.
> 
> What's wrong with our existing MRV. I have MRV over Ethernet and it works great. Wireless?
> 
> Mike


Yeah, I have it set up wireless right now, so it doesn't work very well. It is about a 50/50 shot to even get something to play in the other room, and if I do get it to play, I can't use any trick play, or it just shuts down.

Doing a wired connection would be very difficult with my setup, so I think Deca is the way to go for me.


----------



## Syzygy

Nitehawk^ said:


> ... can the blue ring be turned off like on the other HR2x boxes? and how about the other smaller blue rings as well as the DirecTv logo, are they always on? Or doesn't it distract during viewing?





Mr. Big said:


> Has this ever been answered? The blue lights are really distracting to me seeing that my unit sits right below my TV screen.





veryoldschool said:


> Yes, the same way, but since it isn't anywhere near as bright, I don't because *the power/DirecTV logo light is much brighter.*


So. Yet another design mistake.

And I suppose the remote still makes you hold down a key 3 seconds before it repeats?


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Syzygy said:


> So. Yet another design mistake.
> 
> And I suppose the remote still makes you hold down a key 3 seconds before it repeats?


I'm sorry, what's the design mistake? 

Mike


----------



## Syzygy

MicroBeta said:


> I'm sorry, what's the design mistake?


Leaving in place a method for reducing the brightness of the blue ring (which evidently isn't as bright as before) while making the blue power button/logo much brighter (and evidently not providing a way to dim it).


----------



## veryoldschool

Syzygy said:


> Leaving in place a method for reducing the brightness of the blue ring (which evidently isn't as bright as before) while making the blue power button/logo much brighter (and evidently not providing a way to dim it).


It's only brighter because it's bigger.
Yes it would have been nice to dim it too, but since you can turn off the ring, it would have needed more so the power light isn't.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Syzygy said:


> Leaving in place a method for reducing the brightness of the blue ring (which evidently isn't as bright as before) while making the blue power button/logo much brighter (and evidently not providing a way to dim it).


Wow, I don't think I would have ever called that a mistake. :scratchin

Not to mention that all the A/V equipment in my cabinet have plenty of lights and displays so one more doesn't matter. :shrug:

Mike


----------



## sigma1914

Is Caller ID working for you guys?


----------



## Richierich

Working Like A Chanp!!!

If yours does not work unplug your DVR for 30 minutes and then plug it back in and see if that helps!!!

I have had to do this a couple of times and it works.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

sigma1914 said:


> Is Caller ID working for you guys?


I don't have phone lines on my receivers but IIRC, it works....as well as the receivers anyway. 

Mike


----------



## Skram0

So when I call for an HD DVR upgrade, what kind of things should I make sure they're installing? Like the latest technology in HD dishes and stuff.

I currently have one dish with a regular LNB and a cable with 2 conductors going inside. I don't need to use both cables, I guess it'd be neat if only one could be used. I'm only planing to use just the one HD DVR.


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Skram0 said:


> So when I call for an HD DVR upgrade, what kind of things should I make sure they're installing? Like the latest technology in HD dishes and stuff.
> 
> I currently have one dish with a regular LNB and a cable with 2 conductors going inside. I don't need to use both cables, I guess it'd be neat if only one could be used. I'm only planing to use just the one HD DVR.


Welcome to DBSTalk. :welcome_s

Just ask for an HD-DVR upgrade. From the sounds of it they'll probably replace your dish. These days that's probably going to include an SWiM LNB so you'll only have one line coming in. The CSR should be able to tell you what you need based on your account info.

After you're done with DirecTV, try getting in touch with the installer. They may be able to tell you what actual model numbers you'll be getting. The CSR can not do that. Nor can the DirecTV CSR promise you a particular receiver model.

Mike


----------



## cconklin1

MicroBeta said:


> Wow, I don't think I would have ever called that a mistake. :scratchin
> 
> Not to mention that all the A/V equipment in my cabinet have plenty of lights and displays so one more doesn't matter. :shrug:
> 
> Mike


The blue ring is a contrast killing machine in some dedicated home theaters that use dedicated projectors and screens. It may not have been a "design flaw" but it certainly sucks for the people with projection systems that want an optimum experience in our home theaters....
Chris


----------



## RAD

cconklin1 said:


> The blue ring is a contrast killing machine in some dedicated home theaters that use dedicated projectors and screens. It may not have been a "design flaw" but it certainly sucks for the people with projection systems that want an optimum experience in our home theaters....
> Chris


So turn it off if it bothers you, there is that option.


----------



## LameLefty

RAD said:


> So turn it off if it bothers you, there is that option.


Or even put it inside a cabinet and use RF on the remote.

Jeez, seriously . . . some of these "flaws" sound like the petulant nonsense I hear from my teenagers when they're being difficult. :lol:


----------



## Mike Bertelson

cconklin1 said:


> The blue ring is a contrast killing machine in some dedicated home theaters that use dedicated projectors and screens. It may not have been a "design flaw" but it certainly sucks for the people with projection systems that want an optimum experience in our home theaters....
> Chris


And what do those people do with all the A/V equipment? All of mine have lights of some sort when they're on. :shrug:

Mike


----------



## hdtvfan0001

cconklin1 said:


> The blue ring is a contrast killing machine in some dedicated home theaters that use dedicated projectors and screens. It may not have been a "design flaw" but it certainly sucks for the people with projection systems that want an optimum experience in our home theaters....
> Chris


Not here. I can close the door on my equipment rack and get 0 lighting. As others have mentioned, other devices also commonly emit light.

Based on my design in a dedicated Home Theater with 0 ambient light...its a non-issue here...even with the equipment rack door open completely.


----------



## Skram0

MicroBeta said:


> Welcome to DBSTalk. :welcome_s
> 
> Just ask for an HD-DVR upgrade. From the sounds of it they'll probably replace your dish. These days that's probably going to include an SWiM LNB so you'll only have one line coming in. The CSR should be able to tell you what you need based on your account info.
> 
> After you're done with DirecTV, try getting in touch with the installer. They may be able to tell you what actual model numbers you'll be getting. The CSR can not do that. Nor can the DirecTV CSR promise you a particular receiver model.
> 
> Mike


Do you think I'd be able to request the same installer who did my move install 6 months ago? That guy, even though I think he was new, did a great job. At that time some lady came by a few hours later when he was done to check his work and to take pictures of the wiring and signal levels. I wouldn't mind the same guy to install my HD setup too.


----------



## Skram0

Overstock has the HR24 for 21$ cheaper than DirecTV. There's no mention of any service agreement. If purchased through here or other stores, would this be considered a non-leased receiver?

What's the difference with leasing from DirecTV for 200$ or purchasing from another site for 179$?


----------



## matt

Skram0 said:


> Overstock has the HR24 for 21$ cheaper than DirecTV. There's no mention of any service agreement. If purchased through here or other stores, would this be considered a non-leased receiver?
> 
> What's the difference with leasing from DirecTV for 200$ or purchasing from another site for 179$?


Other store's units (like overstock or solid signal) are leased units as well. The non-leased are only available through a handful of sources, and definitely not for $179. The difference in leasing from D* is that you get whatever they feel like sending you, possibly at a lower price or even free. The O and SS routes guarantee you get that specific model, but you will receive no discount like D* might offer for long term customers.


----------



## RAD

While most folks here know that the chances of getting a purchased receiver is almost nill I do agree that there is no mention of it on the HR24's web pages at Overstock so someone might think it is purchased. I wonder if when someone actually gets one if on the invoice/shipping documentation there's the lease agreement mentioned?


----------



## tonyd79

Skram0 said:


> Overstock has the HR24 for 21$ cheaper than DirecTV. There's no mention of any service agreement. If purchased through here or other stores, would this be considered a non-leased receiver?
> 
> What's the difference with leasing from DirecTV for 200$ or purchasing from another site for 179$?


Better question for me is "Huh?"

Why does DirecTV charge more for a discounted unit than a third party? These are DirecTV units, not anyone elses.


----------



## veryoldschool

I've got to wonder how this has anything to do with "the first look"?
There are already two threads about Overstock.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=177594

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=177773

Pick one and post there please.


----------



## MadManNBama

The DTV website after I log in offers me a new HR24 for only $99 with $199 above it with a red line through it. Anyone else see this offer? 

I'd like to get a newer second DVR then MRV it for $3, but want to know if this is a limited offer, or just part of a great deal I and other long term customers get.


----------



## DogLover

MadManNBama said:


> The DTV website after I log in offers me a new HR24 for only $99 with $199 above it with a red line through it. Anyone else see this offer?
> 
> I'd like to get a newer second DVR then MRV it for $3, but want to know if this is a limited offer, or just part of a great deal I and other long term customers get.


Does it say HR24? or just HD DVR? This would be new information if they are saying that you will definitely get a new HR24.


----------



## say-what

MadManNBama said:


> The DTV website after I log in offers me a new HR24 for only $99 with $199 above it with a red line through it. Anyone else see this offer?
> 
> I'd like to get a newer second DVR then MRV it for $3, but want to know if this is a limited offer, or just part of a great deal I and other long term customers get.


It's most likely offering you an HD-DVR - could be an HR20, 21, 22, 23 or less likely, 24. DirecTV cannot guarantee what DVR will ship.


----------



## Skram0

I like how on the DirecTV website in _Account Overview->My Equipment_, under _Add A New Receiver_, states "_Get the latest HD and DVR technology in one easy-to-use unit:_". After adding to your cart, when you click on the link it goes to the page that shows a picture of the HR24. So I'd be pissed if what I purchased _(or leased)_ was not "_the latest HD and DVR technology_" and not the HR24. Has anyone received anything other than an HR24 after ordering now?


----------



## Mike Bertelson

Skram0 said:


> I like how on the DirecTV website in _Account Overview->My Equipment_, under _Add A New Receiver_, states "_Get the latest HD and DVR technology in one easy-to-use unit:_". After adding to your cart, when you click on the link it goes to the page that shows a picture of the HR24. So I'd be pissed if what I purchased _(or leased)_ was not "_the latest HD and DVR technology_" and not the HR24. Has anyone received anything other than an HR24 after ordering now?


In the "Additional Details" at the bottom it does say the DVR will be "model HR20 or higher", and not that it will be an HR24. However, it is very small at the bottom of the page and makes you open a popup window for that info.

Mike


----------



## Syzygy

In the artificial reality D* would like to create, *all *the HR2x DVRs represent "the latest DVR technology." And there are no bugs or oversights in the firmware, either, nor have there ever been; hence the absence of any news about the fixing of said bugs and oversights.

How silly of you to think otherwise!


----------



## MadManNBama

Syzygy said:


> In the artificial reality D* would like to create, *all *the HR2x DVRs represent "the latest DVR technology." And there are no bugs or oversights in the firmware, either, nor have there ever been; hence the absence of any news about the fixing of said bugs and oversights.
> 
> How silly of you to think otherwise!


Yes true, but I just read on EngadgetHD that the DTV 3D networks will only be upgradable on the H21 and HR21 or higher. I own an HR20-700, so if I were to take the bait and get that new HDDVR for $99, I'd expect what I saw in the picture, or I'd just cancel my order once the tech showed up with an older model.

Yes, 3D will work on a HR23, but that isn't what I saw in the pretty picture on the website with the offer. I am almost tempted to order one this weekend just to test and report back to you guys, but I really need to wait a few weeks because I have a vacation coming up and need to save my cash.

No I don't own a 3D HDTV yet, but I will get one this year, so a new DVR needs to be a newer model on general principle IMHO.


----------



## judson_west

MadManNBama said:


> Yes true, but I just read on EngadgetHD that the DTV 3D networks will only be upgradable on the H21 and HR21 or higher. I own an HR20-700, so if I were to take the bait and get that new HDDVR for $99, I'd expect what I saw in the picture, or I'd just cancel my order once the tech showed up with an older model.
> 
> Yes, 3D will work on a HR23, but that isn't what I saw in the pretty picture on the website with the offer. I am almost tempted to order one this weekend just to test and report back to you guys, but I really need to wait a few weeks because I have a vacation coming up and need to save my cash.
> 
> No I don't own a 3D HDTV yet, but I will get one this year, so a new DVR needs to be a newer model on general principle IMHO.


Since the HR20-HR23's are essentially the same hardware (except the hard drive) then it must have been an arbitrary decision to exclude the HR20 from 3D support.


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## RAD

judson_west said:


> Since the HR20-HR23's are essentially the same hardware (except the hard drive) then it must have been an arbitrary decision to exclude the HR20 from 3D support.


The HR20's have a different processor in them then the HR21/22/23's which might be the reason the HR20's can't do 3D.


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## veryoldschool

judson_west said:


> Since the HR20-HR23's are essentially the same hardware (except the hard drive) then it must have been an *arbitrary* decision to exclude the HR20 from 3D support.


Kind of hard to be arbitrary, when the chips don't support it.


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## Mike Bertelson

judson_west said:


> Since the HR20-HR23's are essentially the same hardware (except the hard drive) then it must have been an arbitrary decision to exclude the HR20 from 3D support.


The HR20 has a different Broadcom chipset from the HR21-23.

Mike


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## MadManNBama

So RAD, veryoldschool, and MicroBeta, all of you guys are veteran experts so I am going to ask for your advice.

Do you guys think I stand a legit chance of actually getting an HR24 for the $99 add on offer? If the Tech shows up with an older piece of junk, will there be any issue in the future if I turn him down at the door?

If you even have a past reference of someone trying this and then turning an older unit down and getting burned some way, let me know and be blunt about it. I come to DBSTalk forums because 99% of the time, I get great help and advice, so I trust your opinions and guidance.

I do have the service plan, so it doesn't cost me anything.


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## HDJulie

MadManNBama said:


> So RAD, veryoldschool, and MicroBeta, all of you guys are veteran experts so I am going to ask for your advice.
> 
> Do you guys think I stand a legit chance of actually getting an HR24 for the $99 add on offer? If the Tech shows up with an older piece of junk, will there be any issue in the future if I turn him down at the door?
> 
> If you even have a past reference of someone trying this and then turning an older unit down and getting burned some way, let me know and be blunt about it. I come to DBSTalk forums because 99% of the time, I get great help and advice, so I trust your opinions and guidance.
> 
> I do have the service plan, so it doesn't cost me anything.


I think it costs the serviceman something -- he doesn't get paid for his time & might get dinged for not being able to fulfill the order _through no fault of his own_. That's the only reason I haven't tried the same thing . By the way, when I ordered a DVR online for the $99 deal, they sent me an HR21 :-(. I had already discussed with the CSR that I would refuse the box (I ordered it with no install) if it wasn't an HR24 & that was ok. I then ordered an HR24 from Solid Signal.


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## veryoldschool

MadManNBama said:


> Do you guys think I stand a legit chance of actually getting an HR24 for the $99 add on offer? If the Tech shows up with an older piece of junk, will there be any issue in the future if I turn him down at the door?


"Chance", yes, but "guarantee", no.
I don't have any advice to offer as to how or what, sorry.
Going the retail route [solidsignal] is the only "known way", that works.


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## RAD

MadManNBama said:


> So RAD, veryoldschool, and MicroBeta, all of you guys are veteran experts so I am going to ask for your advice.
> 
> Do you guys think I stand a legit chance of actually getting an HR24 for the $99 add on offer? If the Tech shows up with an older piece of junk, will there be any issue in the future if I turn him down at the door?
> 
> If you even have a past reference of someone trying this and then turning an older unit down and getting burned some way, let me know and be blunt about it. I come to DBSTalk forums because 99% of the time, I get great help and advice, so I trust your opinions and guidance.
> 
> I do have the service plan, so it doesn't cost me anything.


Frankly I don't know what your chances are. All I can say is ask the tech nicely if he can get a HR24 and it you really don't want anything else then say never mind. What would happen in the future, who knows, but if DirecTV wants to retain you as a customer I don't think anything will happen.


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## Stuart Sweet

Guys,

This wasn't really intended to be a general purpose HR24 Q&A thread. I think that as a first look thread, it's served its purpose. I ask that you start a new thread for specific questions; I am closing this one.


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