# HR44 Genie won't stay connected to home network



## Lord Vader

This problem has been ongoing for a couple weeks now and is *constantly *happening. Simply put, my HR44 just won't stay connected to the home network. My Whole Home service is hard-wired via ethernet cabling. I'll be watching on the Genie a program recorded on another DVR (they're all connected), then after a minute or two, the playback stops with the message telling me the Genie has become disconnected from my home network. Similarly, I'll be watching on my bedroom TV, or another DVR, a program recorded on the Genie, and after a minute or two, the playback stops with the same disconnected message.

In order to "fix" this, I have to go to the Genie and either reset it, or enter the network settings and go through the setup to force connect it, so to speak. I do this through the Advance Setup option, and it tells me it's "now connected to the Internet." However, if I try restore network services, it tells me, "unable to restore network services (202)."

This is the only DVR with which this is occurring, BTW. All my other DVRs, from the HR20s to HR24s, have no problem when watching among them recordings via Whole Home service.

I don't know what else to do, other than check all connections, which appear to be physically OK.


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## peds48

Are all of your receivers connected via ethernet? Or are you mixing and matching Coax and ethernet?


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## Lord Vader

All of them are connected via ethernet cable.


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## peds48

It would seem to me that you may have a network loop on the DirecTV® receivers. I would disconnect the ethernet cables form the the HR2x DVRs and leave only the Genie connected via ethernet or at the very least connect a BSF on the HR44


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## Lord Vader

Unfortunately, that would remove all those DVRs from the Whole Home service then. Because of my rather unique set-up, I can't use DECA.


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## peds48

Then use a BSF on the HR44


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## Lord Vader

Would that even work? BTW, can you refresh my memory as to what exactly a BSF does?


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## acostapimps

Just leave the HR44 ethernet connected and disconnect the rest of the receivers, since the HR44 act as a bridge to the rest of the receivers, So basically the HR2x or H2x if any shouldn't be necessary to be on cat5, Since the HR44 is providing internet to the rest of the boxes through coax from SWM.


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## Lord Vader

Huh? If I disconnect the other receivers' ethernet cables, then I cannot watch any of their recordings! 

Remember, my setup is not DECA. There is no connectivity among the receivers without ethernet cables.


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:



> Huh? If I disconnect the other receivers' ethernet cables, then I cannot watch any of their recordings!
> 
> Remember, my setup is not DECA. There is no connectivity among the receivers without ethernet cables.


Maybe you need to refresh our memory of your system. You have to have SWiM to have a 44, so I don't understand why you can't use DECA unless you have two separate systems - which a CCK or second Ethernet connection would resolve.


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## Lord Vader

I have a rather unusual hybrid system due to the fact that the MDU company has my building is on a master dish that has a limit of how many tuners can run off it. When I moved and brought my DVRs with me, this created a problem. So, the only way to retain all of those DVRs and use the Whole Home service was to connect the bedroom ones (total of 2 of them--4 tuners) to each bedroom's wall coax jack, which runs off the building's MDU master dish, then have the DVRs in the living room and adjacent office (total of 5 of those, one of which is the HR44 Genie--13 tuners) run off my own installed dish that is located on the balcony. The balcony dish has a regular 5-lnb assembly from which 4 coax run into a powered SWM16.

Because of this configuration, DECA won't work. The two systems wouldn't be able to "see" each receiver. BTW, if there was a way to run all the receivers off my balcony dish, I would. (Because of the location of the rooms and DVRs, this really wouldn't be physically possible.) This would allow me to use DECA. However, with a total of 17 tuners, that wouldn't work. FWIW, I'm looking to probably deactivate two of the older DVRs in the living room set-up, which would mean 9 tuners there or 13 total in the entire abode.

Lastly, I should mention that my Genie was working flawlessly for months when it came to connectivity. It was just within the last couple of weeks where it kept becoming disconnected from the network, so I don't know why the sudden change.


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## lugnutathome

Genies are unique in that their DECA ability is enabled full time regardless of the LAN connection. Their LAN port acts as a Cinema Connection Kit. There must be a band stop filter on the Genie in your installation between it and it's splitter so as to prevent its DECA side from trafficking in or out. This we'll could be your issue here.

Also the 44 models have wireless capabilities (I do not recall how to monitor, enable, disable that unfortunately).

I run a 44 on my switched Ethernet using a BSF and have never had issues.

Don "don't know if. I helped here but. . . " Bolton


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## Lord Vader

I'll try the BSF route. That can't hurt. (As far as wireless goes, the wireless capability I have in my place totally sucks, to put it mildly. Thank you, Uverse Internet.)


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Would that even work? BTW, can you refresh my memory as to what exactly a BSF does?


It blocks the DECA frequencies


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## Lord Vader

I've got a couple of those lying around, so I'll give it a try. IIRC, I just basically connect it to the Genie and the coax runs from the BSF, right?


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> I've got a couple of those lying around, so I'll give it a try. IIRC, I just basically connect it to the Genie and the coax runs from the BSF, right?


Correct


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## Lord Vader

I'll give that a shot, let it run for a while, and let you know if that did the trick.


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## acostapimps

What peds been saying all along, hope that resolves your issue, post any updates when you can.


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## Lord Vader

Will do.


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## lugnutathome

Just to clarify, I was not recommending wireless, Rather suggesting a confirmation that it somehow was now not engaged and in fact the cause of your issues. I just don't remember the steps to do so.

Don "hopefully the BSF fixes it " Bolton



Lord Vader said:


> I'll try the BSF route. That can't hurt. (As far as wireless goes, the wireless capability I have in my place totally sucks, to put it mildly. Thank you, Uverse Internet.)


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## nj829

I had the same issue, plus the clients would freeze up. Placed a service call and the guy came took one look and said the Genie is going bad, wasn't even 4 months old and was an HR44 as well. 

The new one has been online for almost a week with no issues while the other one would drop off within 30 minutes of resetting it.


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## Lord Vader

Well, so far my Genie has stayed connected much more consistently.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Well, so far my Genie has stayed connected much more consistently.


With the BSF inline?


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## Lord Vader

Yes, with the BSF connected.


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## peds48

Awesome. Lets hope it stays that way


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## Lord Vader

I agree.


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> Awesome. Lets hope it stays that way


Well, that didn't last very long. The problem recurred today. The Genie keeps dropping off the network. I admit, I'm stumped now.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Well, that didn't last very long. The problem recurred today. The Genie keeps dropping off the network. I admit, I'm stumped now.


The only thing I can think of is to disconnect the system from your network. This will point out if your router is the culprit


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## dennisj00

peds48 said:


> The only thing I can think of is to disconnect the system from your network. This will point out if your router is the culprit


If you disconnect the Ethernet bridge, I'd reboot or reset network to defaults on each box unless you have static addresses. Otherwise, they'll randomly reset as the DHCP leases expire and create lots of drop offs!


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## Lord Vader

But why did this Genie work flawlessly for almost a year, then suddenly, about a month ago, start doing this? 
The unit is at the point now that it's useless unless one watches recordings locally; that is, those recorded on it and no others. Often times, when I try to watch from another IRD recordings on the Genie, the message of "playback failed, no audio/video packets detected" appears.


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## peds48

did you tried the test on post #28?


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## Lord Vader

Assuming I did it correctly, yes. However, what was I supposed to be looking for? When I disconnect my Genie, all other IRDs still work fine and can see each other on the Whole Home network.


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## peds48

Never mind I just remember this



> Unfortunately, that would remove all those DVRs from the Whole Home service then. Because of my rather unique set-up, I can't use DECA.


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## Lord Vader

In order to use DECA, I'd have to take the two bedroom receivers that are currently connected to the building's master dish and rewire them to run off the balcony dish that currently feeds the 5 DVRs in the living room. That's the only way to get all the IRDs on the same system, so to speak, so that DECA would work among all of them and not some of them.


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> In order to use DECA, I'd have to take the two bedroom receivers that are currently connected to the building's master dish and rewire them to run off the balcony dish that currently feeds the 5 DVRs in the living room. That's the only way to get all the IRDs on the same system, so to speak, so that DECA would work among all of them and not some of them.


You might want to look at VOS's diagram in the connected home stickies that bridges two swim-16s to the same DECA cloud. I use it on dual 16's and it should work for you if you can get to the swim outputs.

http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/196584-when-one-swim-isnt-enough/page-1#entry2968592


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## Lord Vader

Interestingly, I found out late last week that the MDU company who handled our DirecTV service did not have its contract renewed. DirecTV customers in our complex are now serviced directly by DirecTV installers. I contacted DirecTV after learning this, and they confirmed it. They are coming out tomorrow (Wednesday the 3rd) to take the two bedroom receivers off the building's master dish and rewire them to my balcony dish, which would then result in having all receivers on the same system. I've got a question about this, but in the meantime, when I spoke to the DirecTV CSR, I suggested that they note the account to ensure the service technician has a SWM16 and a couple of splitters he can install (per the above referenced link to VOS's configuration).

Now, my question is this--assuming the technician properly rewires everything, would having all receivers, including the troublesome HR44 Genie, on DECA be a "fix" to the constant dropping off the network? In other words, does Whole Home via DECA provide for any more reliability than traditional ethernet connections, or would the Genie most likely still be dropping off?


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> Interestingly, I found out late last week that the MDU company who handled our DirecTV service did not have its contract renewed. DirecTV customers in our complex are now serviced directly by DirecTV installers. I contacted DirecTV after learning this, and they confirmed it. They are coming out tomorrow (Wednesday the 3rd) to take the two bedroom receivers off the building's master dish and rewire them to my balcony dish, which would then result in having all receivers on the same system. I've got a question about this, but in the meantime, when I spoke to the DirecTV CSR, I suggested that they note the account to ensure the service technician has a SWM16 and a couple of splitters he can install (per the above referenced link to VOS's configuration).
> 
> Now, my question is this--assuming the technician properly rewires everything, would having all receivers, including the troublesome HR44 Genie, on DECA be a "fix" to the constant dropping off the network? In other words, does Whole Home via DECA provide for any more reliability than traditional ethernet connections, or would the Genie most likely still be dropping off?


LV, the installer won't add the diplexers on the diagram I linked above. There is already internal coupling in the SWiM16 for DECA but VOS's system improves it and is more specifically for linking multiple 16s.

As to your last question, having your dvrs on one swim-16 is certainly better than a mixed system and should work for you.


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## Lord Vader

I already have a SWM16, which is why I alluded to the splitters shown on the above schematic, because a second SWM16 would be added to the mix.


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> I already have a SWM16, which is why I alluded to the splitters shown on the above schematic, because a second SWM16 would be added to the mix.


Then I would order the diplexers and a 4-way green SWim splitter from SolidSignal and some 18" RG6 jumpers from Monoprice unless you can try the boxes that were dropping off the net on the same 16.

But you definitely need this to bridge the two 16s. Works great for me.


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## Lord Vader

Is that the same stuff shown in VOS's schematic? If not, can you reference the model numbers of the items needed? 

After looking at that schematic, I figured all I'd have to do is have the units connected as illustrated in that diagram. However, if there's more to it than that, I'm all ears.


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> Is that the same stuff shown in VOS's schematic? If not, can you reference the model numbers of the items needed?
> 
> After looking at that schematic, I figured all I'd have to do is have the units connected as illustrated in that diagram. However, if there's more to it than that, I'm all ears.


The only gotcha I found was being sure of the labeling on the splitter for the TV (deca) side and Swim side. . .I'll post a picture tomorrow of the splitter and connections.


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## Lord Vader

OK, thanks.


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## peds48

dennisj00 said:


> LV, the installer won't add the diplexers on the diagram I linked above.


That is correct, the most DirecTV® will do is install two BroadBand DECA to bridge the two SWM16s


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## Lord Vader

Well, the DirecTV technician stopped by yesterday late afternoon, took a look, and told me that he would need to connect a second SWM16, which he had in the truck, but as he also explained, "You have to cascade the two SWMs, and for that I'm going to need some splitters, which I don't have on me." We scheduled a follow-up date for him to return.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Well, the DirecTV technician stopped by yesterday late afternoon, took a look, and told me that he would need to connect a second SWM16, which he had in the truck, but as he also explained, "You have to cascade the two SWMs, and for that I'm going to need some splitters, which I don't have on me." We scheduled a follow-up date for him to return.


Ugghh, he could of use a 6x8 to parallel the two SWMs


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## Lord Vader

I got the feeling that he didn't realize that.


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## peds48

Those splitters are so unreliable, that my office stopped using them awhile ago. We still get new techs asking for them since that is all the “book” shows


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## Lord Vader

So peds, what, then, are the correct things to use? I admit that with all this back-and-forth stuff here, even I'm now confused.


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## peds48

I will confuse you even more then... :rotfl:

DirecTV says splitters are supposed to be used, my guess is that this has to do with price than anything else. over the years we kept getting multiple failures of these splitters, so we stopped using them. We used for a little while SWM expanders, pretty much 6 splitters in one housing, but apparently they got discontinued. Since then we now used 6x8 to parallel two SWMs. This solution may be more expensive than using splitters but is worth it as the call backs have completely stop when we were suing those splitters.


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## Lord Vader

Can you indulge me by posting a link to that item to which you're referring? Thanks


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## peds48

Here is a link

http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=WB68&ss=278621


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## Lord Vader

Thanks! BTW, how many would be needed again for a two SWM16 setup with a total of 20 tuners? (Yes, 20 tuners!)


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## acostapimps

I thought Zinwell switches were for older legacy non SWM systems, but it's not appropiate to use with Whole Home Service.


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## acostapimps

Lord Vader said:


> Thanks! BTW, how many would be needed again for a two SWM16 setup with a total of 20 tuners? (Yes, 20 tuners!)


Since the 6x8 is for 8 tuners then I would guess 3 or 2 and a 4-way splitter.


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## dennisj00

I'm using Solid Signal NAS STD-9501M Satellite / Off Air Diplexer Power Passing (STD-9501) splitters to parallel two Swim-16 per VOS's 'when one 16 isn't enough'. Haven't had any problems. Just keep the order of the 4 coax inputs the same from the splitters to both 16s.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Thanks! BTW, how many would be needed again for a two SWM16 setup with a total of 20 tuners? (Yes, 20 tuners!)


You would need one switch. Since it has 8 outputs, 4 to each SWM16


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## peds48

acostapimps said:


> I thought Zinwell switches were for older legacy non SWM systems, but it's not appropiate to use with Whole Home Service.


This switch is only used to feed the SWM16s. Keep in mind that before the SWM16s, the install is "legacy"


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## peds48

dennisj00 said:


> I'm using Solid Signal NAS STD-9501M Satellite / Off Air Diplexer Power Passing (STD-9501) splitters to parallel two Swim-16 per VOS's 'when one 16 isn't enough'. Haven't had any problems. Just keep the order of the 4 coax inputs the same from the splitters to both 16s.


Perhaps those splitters are good quality. The ones my office was using was the splitter version of this diplexer http://bit.ly/1qs11PC

and this were the worse to use http://bit.ly/1qs1elO


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## acostapimps

peds48 said:


> This switch is only used to feed the SWM16s. Keep in mind that before the SWM16s, the install is "legacy"


So in other words it's used like a splitter.


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## peds48

acostapimps said:


> So in other words it's used like a splitter.


While I don't like the word "splitter" in this context, that would be a way to describe it.


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## Lord Vader

peds, an update you might or might not find amusing...

DirecTV was out today, and this technician--different from last week's--declined to do the work, saying that, "We're not approved to configure the installation that way. I don't care what you're 'contact' says, you can't have a 6x8 and a Genie working on the same setup." (I had politely explained how an "expert" recommended the 6x8 and two SWM16s. Hell, I even told this guy about the forum and the VOS schematic if it came to that. He dismissed that info.)

Long story short, I'm left with either doing this ALL by myself, which will be time-consuming and a PITA, or their recommended "fix"--installing a second Slimline-5 dish and SWM16 on my balcony and connecting some of the receivers to that. I know this sounds bizarre, and I'm not too happy with that, but I'm tired of all the back-and-forth.

Here's my big question--if I end up having two dishes, won't that mean DECA won't see the receivers connected to the *other *dish? Oy vay! :bang


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Here's my big question--if I end up having two dishes, won't that mean DECA won't see the receivers connected to the *other *dish? Oy vay! :bang


You can bridge the two dishes the same way you can bridge two SWM16s. You can use VOS diplexer method, or you can use the "DirecTV way" which is using 2 BroadBand DECA at your router.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> peds, an update you might or might not find amusing...
> 
> DirecTV was out today, and this technician--different from last week's--declined to do the work, saying that, "We're not approved to configure the installation that way. I don't care what you're 'contact' says, you can't have a 6x8 and a Genie working on the same setup." (I had politely explained how an "expert" recommended the 6x8 and two SWM16s. Hell, I even told this guy about the forum and the VOS schematic if it came to that. He dismissed that info.)
> 
> Long story short, I'm left with either doing this ALL by myself, which will be time-consuming and a PITA, or their recommended "fix"--installing a second Slimline-5 dish and SWM16 on my balcony and connecting some of the receivers to that. I know this sounds bizarre, and I'm not too happy with that, but I'm tired of all the back-and-forth.


You qualify to call the OOP. This is unacceptable. Is not your fault that they have poor trained technicians. Demand a resolution, ASAP


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> You can bridge the two dishes the same way you can bridge two SWM16s. You can use VOS diplexer method, or you can use the "DirecTV way" which is using 2 BroadBand DECA at your router.


Admittedly not a network guru, is there a schematic or something similar I can follow in order to bridge the 2 DECA connectors? Also, while I'm on this subject, I'll need a DECA adapter on each DVR (except for the HR24 and HR44, of course), right?

Oh, and since I'm on the subject of the Genie, the DirecTV installer took a look at it and said, "There's the cause of your Genie constantly dropping off your network-the band stop filter. You're not supposed to connect those to HD DVRs. You need to remove that."


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## peds48

HR20, 21, 22, 23

H21, H23

those receivers need an external DECA attached in order for them to join the SWM coax network 

HR24, H24, HR34, HR44 and DirecTV® RVU clients do not need an external DECA as those receivers have them built in.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Oh, and since I'm on the subject of the Genie, the DirecTV installer took a look at it and said, "There's the cause of your Genie constantly dropping off your network-the band stop filter. You're not supposed to connect those to HD DVRs. You need to remove that."


You had a special configuration before, and it appears that the tech you got didn't know his right hand from his left. With new configuration, BSF will have to be removed, to be replace by external DECAs


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Admittedly not a network guru, is there a schematic or something similar I can follow in order to bridge the 2 DECA connectors?


Too late to make an schematic. But basically you connect two BroadBand DECAs to your router., each will connect to each dish. Nothing complicated.


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## Lord Vader

I have several DECAs in a box. Not having had a DECA setup yet, the DECA broadbands aren't the same ones as get connected to the DVRs, right?


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> I have several DECAs in a box. Not having had a DECA setup yet, the DECA broadbands aren't the same ones as get connected to the DVRs, right?


Yes, same ones, only difference is that the BroadBand DECAs have a power supply since there is no receiver to power them


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## Lord Vader

OK. I'll look to see if I have any of those power supplies, because I don't know if I do. 

BTW, how do they get connected to the router? Just curious. 

Lastly, thanks for answering what many might often think are basic questions. I actually enjoy learning stuff like this.


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## Lord Vader

BTW, check your PMs.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> BTW, how do they get connected to the router? Just curious.


From the dish splitter run coax to router to connect BroadBand DECA there. Connect BroadBand DECA to router using included 1 foot ethernet jumper


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## Lord Vader

Check your PM.


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## Lord Vader

Well, after everything got connected, including the DECA equipment, I can say that DECA really SUCKS! I never had issues with video playback when I was connected via ethernet cables, but with DECA, recordings are unwatchable. The playback stutters and freezes CONSTANTLY. What makes this more frustrating is that on Sunday, I finally dumped UVerse Internet and had Comcast Internet installed. I'm on the package that provides 100MB down and 20MB up (and I've confirmed those speeds as accurate). 

What a useless piece of crap DECA has so far proved to be!


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> Well, after everything got connected, including the DECA equipment, I can say that DECA really SUCKS! I never had issues with video playback when I was connected via ethernet cables, but with DECA, recordings are unwatchable. The playback stutters and freezes CONSTANTLY. What makes this more frustrating is that on Sunday, I finally dumped UVerse Internet and had Comcast Internet installed. I'm on the package that provides 100MB down and 20MB up (and I've confirmed those speeds as accurate).
> 
> What a useless piece of crap DECA has so far proved to be!


Something's not right. Are all the lights on your DECA modules green? On a Genie or 24, Press Right Arrow / Menu - Coax Networking and post the numbers here.


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## Lord Vader

Yes, the lights on all of my DECA modules are green. As far as right arrow/menu, if you can wait until I get home this evening, I'll post what the numbers say. 

Just out of curiosity, what does or is that supposed to indicate? 

For the record, I've got numerous receivers on this account, from HR44 to HR24 (2) to HR22s and HR20-700s (2). With help from peds here, I've tried to make sure the connections are correct.


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## dennisj00

The coax network numbers will show any suspect nodes.

I've got 6 boxes (was 7) on two Swim-16 with VOS's diplexer system tied together in a 4-way and never (other than a failing hard drive last month) have any MRV problems. It's a better system because it keeps the MRV traffic off of the router.

With your change to Comcast, did you reboot everything?


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## Lord Vader

By rebooting everything, if you mean the receivers, yes. 

BTW, because of my very weird and unique setup--DirecTV had to install a second dish(!!!) to get everything working (that's a long story that even peds here told me shouldn't have happened, but hey! I couldn't get the installers to budge)--I have to use 2 DECA broadbands w/ power adapters and bridge the two dishes through my router.


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## dennisj00

I think this was posted earlier but I'm using this . . . http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/196584-when-one-swim-isnt-enough/#entry2968592

and I'm not using the broadband from the 4 way splitter but ehternet to HR34 as the internet connection.

Using two broadbands connected to your router complicates the situation by routing MRV traffic through your router.

And Post #6 in that thread shows the NAS splitters from one dish.

But Directv won't install either.


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## Lord Vader

Well, the problem I'm running into is that there are two dishes. Believe it or not, I tried explaining to the 3 installers who showed up that I wanted, based on peds' recommendation, a 6x8 switch to feed two SWM16s, from which I'd run the equipment as shown in that linked VOS thread. The installers were adamant: "We can't do that. We have to install a second dish." So they did. What really irked me was the comment by one of them when they were finished: "You know, if you had a 6x8, we could have used that with these two SWM16s."

WTF?!? I just told them that! Now I'm stuck with two dishes, which I've tried to bridge. However, it looks like because they're being bridged through the Motorola modem/router, the result is video freezing, etc. I guess I'm left with the question of, "Is it possible to eliminate all DECA devices and connect all receivers via ethernet cable like I did before (two receivers had run off the building's master dish; the other receivers off my balcony dish), thereby avoiding this Internet latency?"

Could I end up uninstalling one dish myself and rewiring everything myself? I suppose so. However, I honestly don't have the time. I'm home for a mere couple hours a day, if that, and spend most of my waking hours planning/teaching 6 different classes of high school Social Studies students.

Edited to add...

As I mentioned above, I used to have one dish on the balcony that fed 5 receivers. That still exists. The two bedroom receivers were fed by the MDU master building dish. Because the MDU company lost the complex video contract in mid-June, DirecTV now handled us residents directly and individually. Comcast took over the complex's video services as a complex-wide provider, but more importantly now was available for Internet service. However, they needed the home run lines. Consequently, DirecTV had to come out last Saturday and rewire those two bedroom receivers from the building master dish to what I asked to be my balcony dish. They didn't. As mentioned above, they installed a 2nd dish. When they did, and before I connected the DECAs, all of my receivers were doing fine (they all saw each other), except for one HR24. Ethernet connected everything.

I'm wondering if this video freezing issue would disappear if I actually *disconnected* DECA from my router. After all, when ethernet connected them, they all saw each other.

My sole goal is just to eliminate this latency problem.


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## dennisj00

If you disconnect the two broadband adapters, you'll have two DECA clouds that won't see each other. But MRV from two on the same cloud should be fine.

Might be a good test. . . if that works, I'd install the diplexers like in the post above.


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## Lord Vader

What if I was to just disconnect ALL DECA devices and reconnect every receiver with ethernet cables? Wouldn't that accomplish MRV?


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## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> If you disconnect the two broadband adapters, you'll have two DECA clouds that won't see each other. But MRV from two on the same cloud should be fine.
> 
> Might be a good test. . . if that works, I'd install the diplexers like in the post above.


I think I'm a bit confused. To which diplexers are you referring? Are you alluding to VOS's schematic that shows two SWM16s? If so, then I'd have a lot of rewiring to do. My two SWM16s, BTW, are located outside my apt. on the balcony, which isn't a big deal access-wise--it's in the corner--I'd just have to find a place to connect all the other peripherals.


----------



## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> Something's not right. Are all the lights on your DECA modules green? On a Genie or 24, Press Right Arrow / Menu - Coax Networking and post the numbers here.


I tried that on both the 44 and 24 and was unable to do what you suggested. Are you sure you got the steps correct?


----------



## coolman302003

Lord Vader said:


> I tried that on both the 44 and 24 and was unable to do what you suggested. Are you sure you got the steps correct?


You have to use the front panel buttons not via the remote. Sometimes it takes a couple tries with the touch sensitive ones. When you get it you will see Coax Test, Phone test, Phy Mesh etc. options appear on screen


----------



## coolman302003

And he was incorrect it's actually Guide and the Right Arrow> then you press select on Coax Network. and you get several options and items that they may want you to check/post #s


----------



## Lord Vader

coolman302003 said:


> You have to use the front panel buttons not via the remote. Sometimes it takes a couple tries with the touch sensitive ones. When you get it you will see Coax Test, Phone test, Phy Mesh etc. options appear on screen






coolman302003 said:


> And he was incorrect it's actually Guide and the Right Arrow> then you press select on Coax Network. and you get several options and items that they may want you to check/post #s


OK, I'm waiting on the HR24 and HR44 in the living room. I did press Guide + right arrow, chose coax network, and they've been showing, "Please wait" for about 5 minutes so far. I'll report back shortly what they indicate.


----------



## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> If you disconnect the two broadband adapters, you'll have two DECA clouds that won't see each other. But MRV from two on the same cloud should be fine.
> 
> Might be a good test. . . if that works, I'd install the diplexers like in the post above.


Well, if I disconnect all DECA devices and reconnect ethernet to all receivers, then MRV should be back. However, I might then suffer from an earlier problem of the Genie or one of the HR24s constantly dropping off the network. If I do reconnect ethernet, I wouldn't have to do so on my HR44 and two HR24s, right?

This is what I get for having 3 hours of sleep last night.


----------



## coolman302003

Lord Vader said:


> they've been showing, "Please wait" for about 5 minutes so far.


I've never experienced that, usually comes right up maybe 20-30 seconds at most. Something doesn't seem exactly right...


----------



## Lord Vader

I was able to get the info from the HR44, but not my two HR24s. I even rebooted both of the 24s. Every time I try the Guide + right arrow then select coax network, it says, "Please Wait" and won't stop. Moreover, the TV screen comes back with the "Please Wait" superimposed over it. I am forced to do a reboot to get rid of that.

Here's the 44's info:



> Node ID Physical levels
> 
> 0 NODE-08EB741C87AE N/A
> 1 NODE-E0B7B153CE4B -15
> 2 NODE-FC94E306D705 -24
> Dropped Session Count is 0


Here's another receiver's info:



> Node ID Physical levels
> 
> 0 NODE-D82522AD2F99 N/A
> 1 NODE-000378414284 -12
> Dropped Session Count is 0


----------



## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> I think this was posted earlier but I'm using this . . . http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/196584-when-one-swim-isnt-enough/#entry2968592
> 
> and I'm not using the broadband from the 4 way splitter but ehternet to HR34 as the internet connection.
> 
> Using two broadbands connected to your router complicates the situation by routing MRV traffic through your router.
> 
> And Post #6 in that thread shows the NAS splitters from one dish.
> 
> But Directv won't install either.


In the FWIW category, I don't know if this is significant, but behind my home theater system I have this multi-port ethernet switch.

That leads to a secondary router in the master bedroom via a 100' ethernet Cat 5e cable. Connected to this switch are all my home theater devices (except for those receivers that were disconnected and replaced with DECA connections). The Motorola modem/router that's used for Comcast is also behind my home theater system. The Trendnet multi-switch referenced in the preceding paragraph has a direct Cat 5e connection to the rear of my Motorola modem/router. The two aforementioned DECA broadband devices are connected to ports #2 and #3, respectively, on my Motorola modem/router.

I mention this because in that linked VOS thread, I remember reading that someone asked if removing the DECA from the router (which are now modem/router combos) and connecting them to a switch is better than directly to the modem/router. Don't know if any of this is relevant.

Lastly, I appreciate the back-and-forth help. It's interesting learning, even if I haven't been successful yet.


----------



## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> OK, I'm waiting on the HR24 and HR44 in the living room. I did press Guide + right arrow, chose coax network, and they've been showing, "Please wait" for about 5 minutes so far. I'll report back shortly what they indicate.


We need to get VOS involved here. . . you've got something severely wrong if it's taking that long to respond and then it only shows two nodes.


----------



## Lord Vader

The HR44 is responding very quickly. One HR24 took a while, and the other HR24 never did respond. I'll never forgive those dang installers for not connecting it the way I wanted them to (per VOS's linked schematic in that other thread)!


----------



## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> The HR44 is responding very quickly. One HR24 took a while, and the other HR24 never did respond. I'll never forgive those dang installers for not connecting it the way I wanted them to (per VOS's linked schematic in that other thread)!


The Directv installers would never connect it that way. . . they don't know that way even if you show it to them.


----------



## Lord Vader

Except that I TOLD them how to do it by using a 6x8 to branch off to 2 SWM16s. Peds here was the one who guided me on that. Honestly, if I had the time and could guarantee it wouldn't take more than an hour or two, I'd rewire the whole shebang, ditch the old dish, and use their newly-installed one with my 6x8 and the two SWM16s and 4 splitters.

Any "off the book" DirecTV installers in the Houston area available?


----------



## peds48

I think the issue here is that we are not sure how your system is wired. Even now and then we keep finding new information. I would say lets start clean by posting EXACTLY how your set up is wired. Perhaps an schematic would help


----------



## David Ortiz

Lord Vader said:


> Except that I TOLD them how to do it by using a 6x8 to branch off to 2 SWM16s. Peds here was the one who guided me on that. Honestly, if I had the time and could guarantee it wouldn't take more than an hour or two, I'd rewire the whole shebang, ditch the old dish, and use their newly-installed one with my 6x8 and the two SWM16s and 4 splitters.
> 
> Any "off the book" DirecTV installers in the Houston area available?


O dark one, you mention the possibility of deactivating some older receivers. Would you be opposed to setting some of your HD DVRs to single tuner mode? If you could get the tuner count to 16 that might simplify things considerably.


----------



## veryoldschool

peds48 said:


> I think the issue here is that we are not sure how your system is wired. Even now and then we keep finding new information. I would say lets start clean by posting EXACTLY how your set up is wired. Perhaps an schematic would help


For me to add anything meaningful, I'd need "to see" [aka drawing] what is going on "right now".

When a receiver is "stuck" reporting it's a good sign something is run a muck.


----------



## peds48

veryoldschool said:


> For me to add anything meaningful, I'd need "to see" [aka drawing] what is going on "right now".
> 
> When a receiver is "stuck" reporting it's a good sign something is run a muck.


Exactly, anything else is like shooting in the dark :righton:


----------



## Lord Vader

OK, give me some time to figure out exactly what's connected where. Note: I can't take pics, because the wires behind the home theater system look like one massive spaghetti bowl. I should, however, be able to explain what's connected where.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> OK, give me some time to figure out exactly what's connected where. Note: I can't take pics, because the wires behind the home theater system look like one massive spaghetti bowl. I should, however, be able to explain what's connected where.


Pictures aren't as good as a layout drawing with the coax lengths noted.
I model systems so the more data you can draw the better my modeling is.


----------



## Lord Vader

OK. I know that no coax lengths are greater than 25 feet, with most being much shorter.


----------



## veryoldschool

Good, now what are the splitters & what's connected to what?


----------



## veryoldschool




----------



## Lord Vader

I'm working as fast as I can. Trying to multi-task: make quizzes for tomorrow's classes; enter grades in by midnight for tomorrow's progress reports, pick up brother from airport in 90 minutes; and get diagram for VOS and the gurus here.

Guess which I'm trying to put ahead of everything (everyone) else?


----------



## veryoldschool

The airport in 90 mins? :lol:


----------



## Lord Vader

My brother may have to wait a bit.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> My brother may have to wait a bit.


I had a 300+ mile road trip today, so I'm a bit tuckered out.
Post what you can and I'll look at it first thing in the morning.


----------



## Lord Vader

OK, I'm done analyzing everything. Question--do you need the layout of the Internet connections?

BTW, in reviewing everything, I noticed something that might be irrelevant, but it might not--the old dish that is connected to SWM16-OLD has its 4 cables running to SWM16-OLD, and the SWM16-OLD has its two lines that run, but one of them leads to nothing; that is, it's not connected to anything. It's just lying unconnected to a termination point.

Anyway, I'll be creating my diagrams shortly and will upload then. Have to leave at 9:50 p.m. CDT for IAH, so I might not get it done till I return.


----------



## Lord Vader

I'm trying to upload the file, but for some reason it keeps telling me, "Upload skipped (Error500)."

It's in my Dropbox folder.









Edited to add: the two HR20-700s are connected vie ethernet cables solely because I don't yet have 2-way splitters to allow me to connect both the coax and a DECA adapter.


----------



## peds48

For starters, remove the BSF from both splitters and use them at the HR20-700s. Changing the 8 ways to 4 ways, will make “look” better & terminate the unwed SWM16 second output


----------



## Lord Vader

What's the best way to terminate the unconnected SWM16 cable?


----------



## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> For starters, remove the BSF from both splitters and use them at the HR20-700s. Changing the 8 ways to 4 ways, will make "look" better & terminate the unwed SWM16 second output


I won't be able to use a 4-way on the old dish connection, because IO need 5 ports: 1 for the power inserter, 1 for the DECA broadband, and 3 for the receivers (two HR20-700s and one HR22). The 4-way splitter has 1 port for the P.I. and 3 for the receivers, leaving me one short.

While I'm on this subject, a problem with the master bedroom HR24 has developed. If I use DECA connections as indicated in the above schematic, then the master BR HR24 says it's not connected to the Internet; it doesn't see any other DVR except for the Genie. All other DVRs don't show as being connected. If I reconnect the master BR's ethernet cable, then it does, in fact, see all of them and lists them as networked. However, doesn't connecting the ethernet cable on a DECA-default receiver, when going the DECA route, disable Whole Home capability?


----------



## Lord Vader

OK, I changed around the BSF. Well, so far no freezing or stuttering or anything like that. I'll keep monitoring it.


----------



## veryoldschool

The tops was from your dropbox and the bottom looks to me like a better way.
It could be cleaned up more, but the basics are there.

DECA Phy levels are expected to be -15 to -35 [within range]


----------



## TheRatPatrol

Lord Vader said:


> The HR44 is responding very quickly. One HR24 took a while, and the other HR24 never did respond. I'll never forgive those dang installers for not connecting it the way I wanted them to (per VOS's linked schematic in that other thread)!





Lord Vader said:


> Except that I TOLD them how to do it by using a 6x8 to branch off to 2 SWM16s. Peds here was the one who guided me on that. Honestly, if I had the time and could guarantee it wouldn't take more than an hour or two, I'd rewire the whole shebang, ditch the old dish, and use their newly-installed one with my 6x8 and the two SWM16s and 4 splitters.
> 
> Any "off the book" DirecTV installers in the Houston area available?


I don't mean to be rude here, just curious, but why didn't you just install it the way you wanted it yourself?


----------



## Lord Vader

You're not being rude; don't worry. Dummy me has been asking myself that very question. LOL

I think one reason has been because of lack of time. With so many preps at school, and all the work that comes with the position I hold, I am so overwhelmed with all that work and have so little time--literally. Moreover, I am so exhausted when I get home, often a long, traffic-caused commute, that I lack the energy and often take a nap.

I miss being in my early 20s (or 30s, or...).


----------



## Lord Vader

For the record, I just wanted to publicly thank every person posting in this thread! Special props to peds, VOS, dennis, and anyone else who has chimed in with the technical knowledge. I'll never be as adept in this as those guys (and others here) are--we all have our strengths and weaknesses, of course--but it has been a learning experience, even if/when I might have connected something wrong, or if DirecTV might have connected something stupidly, etc.

This all proves the old adage, "You're never too old to learn."


----------



## Lord Vader

veryoldschool said:


> LVsetup.png
> 
> The tops was from your dropbox and the bottom looks to me like a better way.
> It could be cleaned up more, but the basics are there.
> 
> DECA Phy levels are expected to be -15 to -35 [within range]


Thanks! As soon as I get some 2-way splitters in, which I ordered a few days ago anyway, I'll give this a shot.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Thanks! As soon as I get some 2-way splitters in, which I ordered a few days ago anyway, I'll give this a shot.


That setup was "just" a tweaking of what you currently have.
More/different splitters could improve things, but the rerouting of what's connected where shouldn't change.
You've got enough hardware to use 1½ SWiM-16s, and the HR20s with ethernet should be on the ½ SWiM-16.
Everything else fits on the other SWiM-16 and is all DECA networked.


----------



## Lord Vader

Feel free to chime in regarding more/different splitters. When I ordered the 2-way ones, I also ordered some 4-ways (one port on each is a power pass-through, however).


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Feel free to chime in regarding more/different splitters. When I ordered the 2-way ones, I also ordered some 4-ways (one port on each is a power pass-through, however).


Looking at things, it looks like a 4-way and two 2-ways are all you need with "my layout" and you can connect the PI/coax to the DC port on each SWiM.
If you have problems with the PI connection then two 4-ways & a 2-way


----------



## Lord Vader

I know on that one SWM16 with the unconnected coax, I can connect the PI that's presently connected to that SWM16's 8-way splitter, if that's permissible. The other PI would be a little more cumbersome, because in order to connect it to its SWM16's DC port, I'd have to run another lengthy coax (approx. 20 feet) along the same wall baseboard that already has 3 coaxes and one ethernet cable. If I connect the first SWM16's DC port, the one with the current unterminated coax, is it permissible for the second SWM16 to retain its current PI connection?


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> I know on that one SWM16 with the unconnected coax, I can connect the PI that's presently connected to that SWM16's 8-way splitter, if that's permissible. The other PI would be a little more cumbersome, because in order to connect it to its SWM16's DC port, I'd have to run another lengthy coax (approx. 20 feet) along the same wall baseboard that already has 3 coaxes and one ethernet cable. If I connect the first SWM16's DC port, the one with the current unterminated coax, is it permissible for the second SWM16 to retain its current PI connection?


Life is a series of compromises. :lol:
Sounds like you'll be using two 4-ways.


----------



## Lord Vader

Which is really no big deal. 

I infer from your reply, BTW, that having only 1 of 2 PI's connected to two SWM16's DC ports is not a good idea, and that it's best to have one connected to each or none at all (like my situation where they're connected through the splitters).


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Which is really no big deal.
> 
> I infer from your reply, BTW, that having only 1 of 2 PI's connected to two SWM16's DC ports is not a good idea, and that it's best to have one connected to each or none at all (like my situation where they're connected through the splitters).


Nope.
The SWiM has two options for powering. "pick one" [which can be different for each].


----------



## Lord Vader

OK. Well, I might as well use that SWM16 unconnected coax for SOMEthing. I'll just reconnect the end on the SWM16 to the DC port and use a terminator cap on the unused SWM16 tuner port.


----------



## Lord Vader

Hey there,

Can someone remind me...

One of my receivers is very old. It's one of the HR20-700s I have. (I got this when the HR20-700s first came out; that's how old it is.) This one has numerous recordings on it that I'd like to watch. The unit itself is suffering from frequent signal loss error issues like ext. 771, 721, etc. It does this even if I connect it directly to the SWM16 with no other tuners on it. I'm not really that interested in trying to fix that issue anymore, because I really only use it for watching the many recordings that are still sitting on it.

If someone can remind me, if I call DirecTV to deactivate this specific receiver, will ALL DVR functions on this particular unit be terminated, or will I still be able to at least _ watch_ the recordings that reside on that unit's eSata drive? (It's connected to an external 1TB drive.) Moreover, what about MRV? Currently, I can watch this receiver's recordings on any and all of my other receivers. If I deactivate it, will I be able to do that via DECA, ethernet, or not at all?


----------



## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> If someone can remind me, if I call DirecTV to deactivate this specific receiver, will ALL DVR functions on this particular unit be terminated, or will I still be able to at least _ watch_ the recordings that reside on that unit's eSata drive? (It's connected to an external 1TB drive.) Moreover, what about MRV? Currently, I can watch this receiver's recordings on any and all of my other receivers. If I deactivate it, will I be able to do that via DECA, ethernet, or not at all?


As long as you disconnect the coax BEFORE deactivation, you have "some" time before the HR20 "self destructs"


----------



## Lord Vader

I'm interested only in being able to watch its recordings after deactivation, so I don't care if anything else on it becomes impermissible. 

So, your answer brings me to these questions, then:

1. Can I watch recordings on it from other receivers? 

2. If I can, would it be via ethernet connection only (since DECA would require the coax be connected)? 

3. How long after the coax is disconnected until the unit gets temperamental and doesn't let me do anything anymore?


----------



## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> 1. Can I watch recordings on it from other receivers?
> 
> 2. If I can, would it be via ethernet connection only (since DECA would require the coax be connected)?
> 
> 3. How long after the coax is disconnected until the unit gets temperamental and doesn't let me do anything anymore?


1. YES
2. YES
3. Only DirecTV® knows and they are not telling...


----------



## Lord Vader

1. OK 
2. OK 
3. Bastards!


----------



## Lord Vader

Here's a weird problem that I thought would go away with the rewiring and all...

On my master bedroom HR24, I keep getting ext. 771 signal loss whenever I tune to channel 362, The Weather Channel (along with a couple other channels in the 300s). It doesn't matter which of the 2 tuners on which I watch that channel, either, for whenever I tune to that channel, the screen is black with the ext. 771 loss of satellite signal error. I've rebooted it, but that hasn't helped.

This problem was present before the rewiring but only popped up a few days ago (it didn't occur for several days after the techs last week were here); it was present after (per my original schematic as posted earlier); it's still present after VOS's suggested wiring. I don't know if it means anything, but when DirecTV was here last week, they linked the master bedroom with the 2nd bedroom in a rather unusual manner. There's a coax from the new dish's SWM16 to the master bedroom as indicated in the aforementioned schematic. This coax runs into the master bedroom into a 2-way splitter. One out goes to the HR24 itself. The other coax goes to the wall jack. Behind the master bedroom closet wall is the junction box/panel where the DirecTV lines (and the old home run that is now Comcast's) are located. The techs took the master bedroom line and the 2nd bedroom line and connected them to, as they said, "allow the 2nd bedroom to be fed from the new dish's coax off the SWM16." The alternative was to run a line from the 2nd bedroom through walls and around floors to the dish, which is located on the other side of the apartment. Note: The 2nd bedroom's receiver does not have any ext. 771 signal loss issues; channel 362 TWC comes in just fine on that one.

Like I said, after they did this, there were no problems. It was working fine through reboots, etc. This problem occurred Friday and has been recurring since then, and like I said, it's on only this receiver and on channel 362, along with a couple other channels in the 300s.


----------



## Lord Vader

Hey, guys,

I took another look at the line from the new dish to the aforementioned HR24 that is giving me ext. 771 issues. Isn't there supposed to be a power inserter along the pathway somewhere? I have PIs for the other runs that lead to the living room and the two 8-way splitters; however, I don't see one on this HR24 line at all. Could that be the cause of the 771 error? I understand that generally, only one PI is needed per SWM16, but isn't that the case if the PI runs off the SWM's power port? I thought that if one has two separate lines from the SWM16, and each line runs into its own splitter (8-way, 4-way, etc.), then each of those lines' splitters would need a PI in order to sufficiently pass along the signals for all channels. Of course, I could simply be misunderstanding this whole thing.


----------



## veryoldschool

A SWiM-16 uses ONLY ONE PI. It doesn't matter if you use the DC port or SWM1.


----------



## Lord Vader

That's what I thought, but I was just wondering if the PI's placement along the other coax's pathway to that 8-way splitter meant that this HR24 was being left out. The fact that the other receiver that is connected to the wall jack and the same SWM16 isn't having the same signal issues would preclude the lack of a PI as being the problem.

I'm scratching my head on this one. It's beginning to sound like it might be a problem with the receiver itself, which would suck, because of all the receivers I have, this one is owned and not leased and well beyond its warranty period.


----------



## peds48

Mr Vader, why is it that every time you post a new issue a new piece of hardware emerges. I have been trying to put this together on my head but I am always missing one piece. 


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## Lord Vader

To which new hardware are you referring? I made an error in my original post #133 but corrected it. Did I forget something along the way? If so, it wasn't intentional. The schematic in post #110 shows the setup before VOS's suggestion in post #115.


----------



## Lord Vader

In the for what it's worth dept, when I tune to the satellite test channels (the 9500s), most of them appear to be normal, giving me the proper message. However, the following test channels show "771-Signal loss on Satellite In-2."

Channel 9508 test channel 103 A Odd
Channel 9510 test channel 103 B Odd
Channel 9513 test channel 119 Odd

Again, I don't know if any of that is even relevant. I thought I'd post it for what it's worth.


----------



## veryoldschool

Those suggest there is a problem with the 13 volt 22kHz coax.
Since you have two SWiMs, check if the other is giving the same error.


----------



## Lord Vader

This particular receiver is connected to a 2-way splitter, with the other output from that splitter going to the other bedroom's HR24, which is NOT experiencing this problem at all. This leads me to believe, if your assessment is correct, that the problem would be with the cable from the splitter and not the SWM16. 

Does that sound logical?


----------



## Lord Vader

When I get home shortly, I'll replace the cable(s) and see if that helps. Other than this particular issue, VOS, everything else appears to be working just fine, DECA included.


----------



## Lord Vader

Update: switched out cables, problem still exists, except that this time, it says ext. 771 signal loss on Satellite In-1 and not In-2. Don't know why there'd be a change in that.


----------



## veryoldschool

The change from SAT 1 to SAT 2 may simply be the tuner being used for the channel tunning.
Tie a tuner up with a recording and it may switch between 1 & 2
"Things to check":
Swap HR24s and see if the problem stays with the cable/location, or DVR.
With everything connected, run the coax/DECA test and post the results.


----------



## Lord Vader

OK, I'll swap the HR24s in a bit, when the one isn't recording anything. They both have recordings in Series Manager set up. 

As far as the coax test, I can't do it on this one. This is the only HR24 on which I cannot get the test to run. When I press the corresponding things on the front panel, the coax test menu comes up, but then it gets stuck at "Please Wait." After about 5 minutes, the background disappears and the broadcast picture returns. However, the "please wait" remains, being superimposed over the picture. I'm forced to reboot the unit to clear that, which is what I just did.


----------



## Lord Vader

I'm going to have to swap receivers to continue my trouble shooting, because I'm getting tired of constantly rebooting this thing everytime I try to do a coax test. Beats me why this one just won't let me do it.


----------



## veryoldschool

Since they're networked via DECA, you can run the test on any receiver that has it.
"What you need to do" is trace/track the MAC addresses down to which receiver is which.

It also wouldn't hurt to run this test from more than one receiver.


----------



## Lord Vader

If I'm not mistaken, I can find this receiver's MAC address in the network setup section, right? I can get there and run tests; it's just the coax test that won't work on this box. 

I'll run the test on a couple receivers and report back shortly.


----------



## veryoldschool

zzzz
!rolling


----------



## Lord Vader

OK, here's the info...

*Node ID * *Phys levels*

0 NODE-08EB741C87AF N/A
1 NODE-E0B7B153CE4B  -14
2 NODE-FC94E306D705 -14
3 NODE-D82522AD2F99 -26
4* NODE-000378414284 -21

0 NODE-08EB741C87AF -25
1 NODE-E0B7B153CE4B -25
2 -25
3 NODE-D82522AD2F99 N/A
4* NODE-000378414284 -12

* Denotes problematic HR24 in question

The above are the only two receivers on which I could run the test. Hope this helps.


----------



## veryoldschool

Given the expected levels were to be 15-35, and you're getting 12/14 to 26... nope no help :lol:
The "hope" was to see more loss on a leg that would correlate with a SWiM loss problem, but.....


----------



## Lord Vader

So what are you saying? 

I've swapped receivers and am now waiting for the HR24 from the other room to finish booting. I'll then check and see if this one has the same problem.


----------



## Lord Vader

Update... 

Swapped HR24 exhibits same problem, ext. 771 signal loss. Obviously, the problem therefore is somewhere in the connection. The HR44 Genie shares the same SWM16 connection, and that receiver is not experiencing any problems whatsoever. So, I guess the question is where to look next. Hmmm...


----------



## veryoldschool

So it's the location, and not the DVR?
If so try new connectors on the coax.


----------



## Lord Vader

I've tried 3 different coax cables already, all to no avail. Everything is temporarily on hold, however, because I lost power 10 minutes ago. Weird. Blue sky, no construction around. No power now.


----------



## Lord Vader

Power is back. So, where were we?


----------



## Lord Vader

I'll have to work on it later. Bears game is on, and I'm recording at least a half-dozen shows on multiple receivers this evening. When I get some more time later, I was thinking of swapping out the 2-way splitter. Maybe that's the issue. It won't hurt to try. I've got 2 on order, expected to arrive tomorrow, actually.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> I was thinking of swapping out the 2-way splitter. Maybe that's the issue. It won't hurt to try. I've got 2 on order, expected to arrive tomorrow, actually.


It's "unlikely", but you're right, it won't hurt.


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## Lord Vader

Well, if it's not that, I don't know what else it could be. I can't see how it's the cable from the SWM16, because that cable feeds, through the 2-way, both the HR24 in question and the Genie, the latter of which, again, is not experiencing the problems the HR24 is experiencing.


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## Lord Vader

Well, this one's a stumper! When I got home, I tried everything else I can think of: replaced each of the coax cables from the splitter; even switched the two cables going into outputs 1 and 2, moving 1 to 2 and 2 to 1 (just for the hell of it); I swapped this 2-way splitter with another one (new); I exchanged the gray power inserter with another new one of which I had an extra; I used another receiver, an HR22 (same problem); I even disconnected the AM21 OTA tuner. Regardless of what I did, the ext. 771 signal loss remained. Again, on the Genie that also comes from this same splitter, no such problem exists. I'm baffled as to what could be causing this. As of now, DirecTV is scheduled to come out late tomorrow afternoon, but I'm trying to avoid that, because I have to ditch out of work a little early to be home in time for them.


----------



## Lord Vader

Should I switch out the dish?


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## veryoldschool

You should have a service call and have the tech use the AIM [meter] to measure what's going on.


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## Lord Vader

They're scheduled to come out late today. I'll mention the AIM meter to him.

I admit that I really *AM* curious as to what is causing this, especially now that I know it's not the receiver and I've swapped out all the links in the chain, so to speak.


----------



## veryoldschool

Without the AIM, he'll be pissing in the wind.
The AIM will show what's going on.


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## peds48

veryoldschool said:


> Without the AIM, he'll be pissing in the wind.
> The AIM will show what's going on.


as long as he know how to use it.... :lol:

Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## Lord Vader

veryoldschool said:


> Without the AIM, he'll be pissing in the wind.
> The AIM will show what's going on.





peds48 said:


> as long as he know how to use it.... :lol:
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


I'll be sure he does know how to use it.


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## Lord Vader

*Oh my frickin' God!!!*

*Words cannot adequately describe what has been happening in the last 2+ hours with DirecTV!!! I'm so furious I feel like Michael Douglas in Falling Down! :flaiming *

Edited to add...

Here's a "shortened"--literally--summary:


Tech shows up at 5:00 p.m.
Tech says his supervisor said the service call was canceled because "an MDU company handles the account."
I explained to him that that is NOT true. Access 3 Media lost the complex entirely effective 6-13-14.
I further explained that I found this out by accident about a month ago from my apt. complex manager.
About 3 weeks ago I called DirecTV to schedule a service call for the rewiring, which led to the second dish and SWM16.
If I WAS an MDU account, DirecTV wouldn't even be ABLE to work with my account for such calls; they scheduled the call, and on 9-13-14 the 3 techs came out, spend over 2 hours, and finished their job.
About 4 or 5 days later, last week, the aforementioned 771 issue pops up on my HR24
After much troubleshooting, including with the help of folks here, I had no success
I called DirecTV on 9-21-14 to set up a service call that ended up being for late this afternoon
Dispatch calls me today to confirm appointment for "between 4:00 and 8:00 p.m." I confirmed.
Some guy named Claudio from "Multiband," the company dispatched to do the call, shows up at 5:00 p.m. (SEE BULLET POINTS 1-4 AGAIN)
Claudio tells me, "My tech supervisor said the service call came up canceled in the screen because we're not supposed to touch your account; it's an MDU. However, I'm going to go back to my truck and get some tools and fix it for you anyway." (I'm thinking, "Cool!")
He leaves, about 10 minutes go by, then some lady from dispatch calls from a KY # (859-654-0779) and tells me that the tech supervisor has informed her that they can't service the account and that the tech was ordered to leave.
I get into an argument with her and told her that what she was saying wasn't true; that DirecTV directly was handling the account, especially because I had placed a service call with DirecTV directly for the 9-13-14 tech visit.
She tells me, "We're a company called Multiband and are DirecTV directly. You will have to call the installers who came out on the 13th."
I tell her, "I'm looking at that pink work order receipt, and it has the Multiband logo and name on it! That's your company!!!"
She sounds clueless and tells me (her accent was horrible, BTW) that it's a different installer and I need to call DirecTV and get it straightened out.
I call them today at 5:47 CDT and am surprised by an immediate message telling me I had a past due amount of $44.90. I confirmed that I made a payment of $66.40 over a week ago, which paid in full my then balance.
My current statement dated today is not yet viewable, but that amount + the past due showed a total higher than expected. Because I couldn't and can't yet see the statement and specific charges (recent activity showed very limited information, and NOTHING happening today--yet; see next point), I was unable to figure anything out. Consequently, I just paid this $44.90 past due so I could get to the service people to get someone out here.
While I was processing the online payment, a gentleman named Scott from the Protection Plan dept. came on the phone off the hold. While I was talking to him, I logged out then back in, saw my activity, and noticed a phone order charge of $5 + $.31 tax was on my bill! I was told that a "Michelle Perry" phoned in an order for _Brick Mansions_ at 7:02 p.m.
I told them I don't even know anyone named Michelle (Perry or otherwise), and that this allegedly occurred _*while I was on the phone with them*_ (DirecTV).
Scott credited that off my bill, and he admitted he never saw that before and couldn't explain why the time was off (my call to them began at 5:47 p.m. CDT and lasted exactly 47 minutes, so where did this 7:02 p.m. time come from?). Regardless, I put a password on my account.
Scott elevated my request for a service call--because I can't yet get someone here--to send their service dispatch a direct communiqué informing them to contact me directly to set up a call.

In sum, I am now in limbo, with a partially inoperable HR24 and no one who is able to presently service my account. Even my complex manager is baffled as to why Multiband is saying what they did.

Unbelievable.


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## peds48

Wow!!!!! 


But as a tech, I can give a bit of “advice” 4PM to 8PM appointments are not recommended on my books. An AM appointment is the BEST way to go. I can name a thousands for this.


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## Lord Vader

I understand, but with my work schedule, I'm limited to when I can be home without having to take off work. However, the time of the appointment shouldn't be relevant at all here. After all, they came on the 13th, and at an even later time then—5:30 or so. 

As of this very moment, no service calls are scheduled, because no one at DirecTV even knows what's going on.


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## Lord Vader

Peds, I was just wondering, technically speaking, what does an AIM meter do? What does it measure? Is it the same thing as a typical signal meter?


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## TheRatPatrol

AIM Meter > http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=aim&d=aim-advanced-installation-signal-meter-for-directv-satellite-dishes-(aim)

Not to be rude here, but you've been troubleshooting this for almost a month now. I still think you should have hooked up everything yourself the way you wanted it to be, the way that was suggested on here, it might have saved you a lot of headaches.


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## Lord Vader

Rat,

I think I'm going to end up going that route with this fix, although I don't know exactly how I'm going to do it. 

When I say I don't have much time, that's literally true. I teach at a charter high school that has this obsession with holding meetings during our planning times 3 days a week. Then we're required to attend monthly meetings on Saturdays. I teach 6 different classes, resulting in 6 "preps," as they call it. That means 6 different lesson plans every week. It takes at least of 3 hours per class to create the weekly lesson plans. On top of that, I have mounds of papers to grade. In addition, I have to create every 3 weeks 6 "benchmark" quizzes, on top of all the traditional assessments. I get home around 5:00 p.m., usually, and with schoolwork am often busy straight through midnight or later, and my alarm rings every morning at 5:00 a.m. to begin my work day. My next day off isn't until the day before Thanksgiving. Add to that some days when I have college baseball games to umpire (even in the fall), and my time is so damn limited. Believe me, if I have the time to do all this stuff on my own, I would. 

Now to the latest in this service saga...

I received a phone call this morning at 7:15 a.m. from Amber, the dispatcher at Multiband, the DirecTV installer/service shop. I am guessing that she called me as a result of DirecTV, as I mentioned above in post # 167, contacting them directly. I was feeling hopeful because of this. She proceeds to go into the same seemingly scripted story she told me yesterday: "Mr. NNNNN, I spoke to the tech supervisor, and again, he said we cannot touch the account. You are going to have to call DirecTV and have them dispatch a technician to your residence." Understandably angry again, I told her that I DID speak with DirecTV, and that they were supposed to contact someone in my area to do just that, and that they must have done so since she and I last spoke yesterday around 5:30 p.m. CDT. She then says she'll speak to the tech supervisor (again).

I'm getting nowhere with these idiots! This is unfrickinbelievable.

Edited to add: open house today after school, Rat. I just measured the pile of papers I have to grade and input into our grading system. I kid you not, it's exactly 7.75" high. I miss my days as a sales manager--a LOT less work than being a teacher! 

OK, lunch is over. Later...


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## Lord Vader

Does anyone have an Email address for someone in DirecTV corporate? Ellen Filipiak's Email no longer is valid.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Does anyone have an Email address for someone in DirecTV corporate? Ellen Filipiak's Email no longer is valid.


There is no direct email anymore, but this is the form for OOP

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIFnorail.jsp?assetId=P4960016


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Peds, I was just wondering, technically speaking, what does an AIM meter do? What does it measure? Is it the same thing as a typical signal meter?


No, the AIM goes further than a typical signal meter. The AIM has a "guided mode" this mode is pretty much a trouble shooting for idiots. It literally tells the tech where to look for the failure point

It just occurred to me one more thing you can try that will take 15 minutes at the most, swap the SWM16s and see if the issue follows the switch. If you already did this, disregard


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> There is no direct email anymore, but this is the form for OOP
> 
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIFnorail.jsp?assetId=P4960016


What about [email protected]? I sent an Email to that a few hours ago just for the heck of it, but unlike one to Ellen, it didn't get bounced back.



peds48 said:


> No, the AIM goes further than a typical signal meter. The AIM has a "guided mode" this mode is pretty much a trouble shooting for idiots. It literally tells the tech where to look for the failure point
> 
> It just occurred to me one more thing you can try that will take 15 minutes at the most, swap the SWM16s and see if the issue follows the switch. If you already did this, disregard


I can give that a shot, but I was wondering...looking at my schematic a couple pages back, what if I was to take that unterminated coax from that one SWM16 and use it for only the HR44 or the problematic HR24? Might that help? I ask because I think that MIGHT be easier connection-wise.


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## Lord Vader

BTW, the guy who showed up yesterday did say one thing before he left (when he said he was going to get his tools to fix the problem). He said, "I know what the problem is just from looking at your setup. You're using a 2-way splitter. You have to use either a 4-way splitter or 8-way splitter with SWMs, especially since you have to have a power pass-through connected to those. You can't do that with a 2-way splitter." 

As far as I knew, he was full of it, correct?


----------



## David Ortiz

> BTW, the guy who showed up yesterday did say one thing before he left (when he said he was going to get his tools to fix the problem). He said, "I know what the problem is just from looking at your setup. You're using a 2-way splitter. You have to use either a 4-way splitter or 8-way splitter with SWMs, especially since you have to have a power pass-through connected to those. You can't do that with a 2-way splitter."
> 
> As far as I knew, he was full of it, correct?


I'm using four 2-way splitters in my SWM setup, and that is with the power inserter connected to one of them. When I had my HR34 installed, the installer wanted to replace my 4-way splitter with an 8-way splitter which he was convinced was necessary because the unit had 5 tuners.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> As far as I knew, he was full of it, correct?


Glad he did not touch your set up, because he doesn't know what he is talking about.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> I can give that a shot, but I was wondering...looking at my schematic a couple pages back, what if I was to take that unterminated coax from that one SWM16 and use it for only the HR44 or the problematic HR24? Might that help? I ask because I think that MIGHT be easier connection-wise.


That is definitely an option to try


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> Glad he did not touch your set up, because he doesn't know what he is talking about.


I figured as much.


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## Lord Vader

BTW, I just got a call from Amber of Multiband, the DirecTV company. She said they received a call from DirecTV corporate ordering them to come out to my place, which they will do later tomorrow.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> BTW, I just got a call from Amber of Multiband, the DirecTV company. She said they received a call from DirecTV corporate ordering them to come out to my place, which they will do later tomorrow.


that must have been an awkward call.

Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## Lord Vader

Indeed. 

If I get the time tonight, I'm going to try one of the aforementioned ideas: yours and mine, and see if either works.


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## peds48

Why is it that every one of your issues takes 10 pages plus….. !rolling

Funny thing was that I started posting on this forums regularly AFTER your fiasco with your building and your dish. I took me a few days to read the ENTIRE post about that...


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## Lord Vader

And that was an awesome thread, wasn't it? 

I guess you can say I brought you here, my young apprentice.

___________________________________________________

A bad SWM16?

I just finished switching some cables around (don't know why I didn't try this before). If you look at my schematic from a few pages back, the link of which I repost below, you'll notice that the old SWM16's left port (from our point of view) has a coax that leads to nowhere; it's unconnected to any equipment. I disconnected the end that is attached to this SWM16. I then took the left port coax from the new SWM16 and connected it to the open left port of the old SWM16, and voila! Everything works. I even checked out the Genie that along with the HR24 is now connected to the old SWM16's left port, and the Genie is working fine.

As a result of doing this cable switch, the left port on the new SWM16 is now unused and remains open (the right one feeds other equipment). This leads me to two questions:


Could the new SWM16 have been defective? If not, I don't know what the issue could have been.
Should I call DirecTV and cancel tomorrow's service call, or should I keep it and tell them to simply replace the new SWM16, explaining why?
Schematic


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## peds48

Most likely bad SWM16. I would still keep the service call and have them replace the switch 


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## Lord Vader

Have you experienced many bad SWM16s during your runs? Just curious.


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## peds48

Well, not sure what “many” constitutes. Things to keep in mind, SWM16 are not as “popular” as SWM LNBs. The biggest reason (in my case) for SWM16 failures is water ingression.


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## dennisj00

peds48 said:


> Well, not sure what "many" constitutes. Things to keep in mind, SWM16 are not as "popular" as SWM LNBs. The biggest reason (in my case) for SWM16 failures is water ingression.


There's probably a small percentage of customers with a SWiM16. . . many less with 2. Any piece of electronic equipment can fail and the 16 is basically 2 SWiM8 in the same enclosure, so one could easily fail.

We had a power outage last night to the point that I killed all of the UPSes and sat quietly in the dark while repeated attempts to restore power failed (very bad on the equipment).

So far, the only failure I've found is a digital clock / outdoor thermometer that won't come on.


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> Well, not sure what "many" constitutes. Things to keep in mind, SWM16 are not as "popular" as SWM LNBs. The biggest reason (in my case) for SWM16 failures is water ingression.


The funny thing is that the old SWM16 is more exposed to the weather due to its location on the balcony. The new SWM16, however, was installed in such a manner that it won't get wet like the older one has and can. I did notice, BTW, that the old one did not have those rubber collars (or sleeves or whatever they're called) on the F connectors. I had a couple extra lying around and put them on today.


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## peds48

I did not mean to say that your failure was due to weather. But the SWM16,as any other piece of electronic equipment can fail at any time as well 


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Should I call DirecTV and cancel tomorrow's service call, or should I keep it and tell them to simply replace the new SWM16, explaining why?.


Keep the service call.
Let them "ring out" your system.
Any piece of electronics can fail.


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> I did not mean to say that your failure was due to weather. But the SWM16,as any other piece of electronic equipment can fail at any time as well
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


I understood what you meant, and I didn't infer that you claimed weather was the culprit, so you're good. ☺


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## Lord Vader

veryoldschool said:


> Keep the service call.
> Let them "ring out" your system.
> Any piece of electronics can fail.


Yeah, that makes sense.


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## Lord Vader

Waiting on the tech to arrive; I'll keep you posted. In the meantime, I received a call from Jennifer from the office of the president, who reviewed the Email I sent to two individuals in the corporate office (I dug up their contact info on my PC, as I had stored it a while ago). She also reviewed the account history recently and said that the office of the president again (today) called Multiband, the DirecTV company scheduled to come out today, emphasizing they prioritize this call. In addition, she stated they were going to credit my account the $19.95 equipment order charge that somehow popped up on my account on 9-4-14, and she would also issue a $50 credit for this past Wednesday's botched service call. So far, I'm pleased with what DirecTV's corporate folks have done.


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Waiting on the tech to arrive;


Me too&#8230;.


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## veryoldschool

ZzZzZz :lol:


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## Lord Vader

veryoldschool said:


> ZzZzZz :lol:


That's the problem with senior citizens. They fall asleep so damn early.


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> Me too&#8230;.


He left a few minutes ago. He used an AIM meter and said that that new SWM16 is in perfect condition. So, then, why the ext. 771 signal loss issue? Well, he looks at the whole configuration, particularly the connections at the 8-way splitters, and tells me that there are too many tuners on the other port of the new SWM16. He proceeds to explain that because a DECA broadband was connected to the 8-way, it exceeded the number allowed.

Where does DirecTV GET these people? DECA uses tuner availability? Ugh.

I just left things switched like I explained in my posts yesterday, and everything is working fine.

Oy vay!

___________________

BTW, on an unrelated note, he did a signal test on both dishes and said that the LNB assembly on the old dish is "not good." "Your LNB assembly is bad."

I replaced the 5-LNB myself less than 9 months ago. If it's less than optimal, I'm going to claim warranty issue on it.


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## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> He left a few minutes ago.
> 
> Where does DirecTV GET these people?


mcdonalds


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## Lord Vader

So maybe that's why those part-time workers are marching & demanding $15/hour.


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## Lord Vader

You know, now that the 2 SWM16s are right next to each other on the balcony, I'm wondering if I should just get out the 6x8 multiswitch I still have sitting in a box and connect the two SWM16s to it, thereby running everything off the one dish (the new one they installed), allowing me to take down the old dish. 

How easy would this be? I don't need a bunch of new splitters now, do I?


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## peds48

Plug n play. No splitters are needed if you use the 6x8


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## Lord Vader

That sounds cool. If I'm not mistaken—correct me if I'm wrong—I just take the new dish's 4 cables, plug them into the one end of the multiswitch, then run 4 coax cables from one of the 6x8's sides into one SWM16, and 4 coax cables from the other 6x8's side into the other SWM16, correct?


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## sigma1914

If everything is working now, why mess with it?


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## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> That sounds cool. If I'm not mistaken-correct me if I'm wrong-I just take the new dish's 4 cables, plug them into the one end of the multiswitch, then run 4 coax cables from one of the 6x8's sides into one SWM16, and 4 coax cables from the other 6x8's side into the other SWM16, correct?


correct. Just make sure not to use the flex ports on the 6x8.

Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## Lord Vader

Oh, I know enough to know that one isn't supposed to use them. Of course, it helps that I don't even know what those are for! 

Guess I need a bunch {8} of very short RG6s now.


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## Lord Vader

sigma1914 said:


> If everything is working now, why mess with it?


That's a valid question, to which the answer would be-solely to get rid of the additional dish, in this case the older one {which, if you recall, yesterday's tech said had a bad LNB}.

Even if that dish was in perfect order, why keep 2 right next to each other (possibly risking the wrath of the property management company) when 1 will suffice? BTW, it's the same management company as the one who owns the complex in suburban Chicago where I lived and fought that epic, valiant battle over a balcony dish.


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## peds48

sigma1914 said:


> If everything is working now, why mess with it?


why not? Is not like doing this will break something

Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## Lord Vader

And it IS kind of fun to learn all this stuff. 

Oh, BTW, you should have heard something else the tech said. I had an HR24 from my Chicago account that I had not yet transferred to my Houston account (the receiver is still active, but with the Chicago locals, of course—useless for me in Houston, obviously), and I simply wanted to make sure it was working fine down here. Of course, when I connected it, it got the same ext. 771 signal loss error. The tech told me it was "because you're in the Houston area, and you're programming is different." I tried to explain to him that what he's referring to is the spot beam locals, but he insisted that because the receiver was still on the Chicago subscription, its programming, "including the national programming like channel 362 is different. That's why you're experiencing 771. Your receiver needs to be on this account in this area."


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## peds48

And of course you know he was mistaken. You should be able to all programing sans your local channels


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## Lord Vader

Oh, I know, believe me. I actually kept telling him, politely but firmly, that that wasn't the case. His reply was something like, "Trust me. I know. This is definitely the cause of the 771." I then asked him if that was the case, then DirecTV would need dozens of more satellites, spot beam or otherwise, because that would require the national or CONUS channels be specific to each area, based on his logic. 

I'm certainly not as technologically literate as some here, present company included, but lately I've been scratching my head over how unknowledgeable many of these DirecTV techs are. I often seem to know more than these guys do.


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## dennisj00

peds48 said:


> why not? Is not like doing this will break something
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


Famous last words. . .


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## peds48

dennisj00 said:


> Famous last words. . .


depends on the context....

Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


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## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> Famous last words. . .


Indeed. After all, it IS me we're talking about.


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## veryoldschool

dennisj00 said:


> Famous last words. . .


Or "All you need to do is....." :rolling:


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## Lord Vader

I personally like the following two:

* "Everybody knows how to..." 
* "It's as easy as..."


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## Laxguy

"You can't miss it. Third turn on the left after the cow shed."


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## Lord Vader

peds48 said:


> Plug n play. No splitters are needed if you use the 6x8
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


I should have it done probably in a couple days. I wanted to wait until I purchased some very short RG6 cables. Due to the proximity of the SWM16s to the 6x8, I didn't want to have cables lying all over the place, so I decided to use the 1.5' ones. No one around here sells them that short, so I ordered some from Monoprice. I had to get some other things from Monoprice, so I just consolidated everything into one order and am waiting on its arrival.


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## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> I should have it done probably in a couple days. I wanted to wait until I purchased some very short RG6 cables. Due to the proximity of the SWM16s to the 6x8, I didn't want to have cables lying all over the place, so I decided to use the 1.5' ones. No one around here sells them that short, so I ordered some from Monoprice. I had to get some other things from Monoprice, so I just consolidated everything into one order and am waiting on its arrival.


I probably didn't know it at the time, but I had a left-over WB68. But I ordered the splitters and overall think it's probably cleaner. I also ordered a bunch of 18" RG-6 jumpers from Monoprice for both the input and output diplexer arrangement.

The only gotcha is I was able to remove the rubber boots (inside basement) and it made the connections to Swim and splitters easier.


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## Lord Vader

I like those rubber boots, but damn! Sometimes they can be a real pain in the ass to deal with. 

I finally had the time this weekend to install the 6x8 multiswitch and feed it to the 2 SWM16s. I used the newly-installed dish, which allowed me to take down the original dish. Now I'm back to one dish, one 6x8, and the 2 SWM16s—basically what I wanted from the very beginning! All this runaround was really useless if you ask me. In reality, I'm the one who rewired everything in the end (thanks to the help provided here). With the exception of the new dish, which the first group of technicians installed on 9-13, I ended up doing almost all the work. 

Go figure.


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## dennisj00

You learned a lot and that's worth a lot. I guess it's too late but you could use the other dish to set up and tweak for good signals. 

I enjoyed putting in a pole mounted and going through the setup and tweaks.


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## peds48

I hate to do this but….. I told you so…. :rotfl:


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## Lord Vader

I want the last three weeks of my DirecTV life back.


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## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> You learned a lot and that's worth a lot. I guess it's too late but you could use the other dish to set up and tweak for good signals.
> 
> I enjoyed putting in a pole mounted and going through the setup and tweaks.


One is never too old to learn, as they say.

As far as the old dish, I just took it down and will store it in the garage. The new dish is nice. It has a lower profile, slightly sleeker design. I recall the DirecTV installer saying that this new dish "is going to be the only dish DirecTV will install."


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## peds48

at least he got something right!


----------



## Lord Vader

For once. 

I had three sets of installers come out. The first was a trio of installers. They did the most work; however, they're the ones who installed a second dish. The second tech was a guy who said he was going back to his truck to get tools to "help me out anyway," but never came back; he instead left. The third one was the one who tried telling me that I couldn't use a receiver still subscribed to my Chicago account because it wouldn't get the Houston programming, which included channel 362, a CONUS channel (never mind that I said I was intending to simply test that receiver and hadn't yet called DirecTV to switch it over). 

I can't WAIT until I have to call for the next DirecTV technician.


----------



## Lord Vader

Ah, dang it! Just when you thought it was safe to go back into the water... 

My stupid Genie, whose Whole Home DVR service was working perfectly since September 13th, has now gone kaput again. The last day or two has seen attempts to watch its recordings result in the "no playback/video packets," etc. error message. Ugh.


----------



## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> Ah, dang it! Just when you thought it was safe to go back into the water...
> 
> My stupid Genie, whose Whole Home DVR service was working perfectly since September 13th, has now gone kaput again. The last day or two has seen attempts to watch its recordings result in the "no playback/video packets," etc. error message. Ugh.


Locally? Or through MRV?


----------



## Lord Vader

Through MRV


----------



## peds48

Across switches? Or in the same SWM16


----------



## Lord Vader

Across switches. Remember, that was pretty much the same situation with the two dishes.


----------



## peds48

Sat signal is not involved in MRV playback. So as long as you have a good recoding, how the sat signal gets there is a moot point. 

Is it working now? 

One thing we never checked was the coax and mesh signals after everything was “said and done” Perhaps this is a good time to check those numbers….


----------



## Lord Vader

I can do that. To answer your question, though—it works after I reboot the Genie, but for how long is anyone's guess.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> I can do that. To answer your question, though-it works after I reboot the Genie, but for how long is anyone's guess.


When/if this happens again would be the best time to check the mesh rates.



> Across switches. Remember, that was pretty much the same situation with the two dishes


If you're referring to DECA to ethernet through your router, try Genie to DVR with "just DECA".


----------



## peds48

veryoldschool said:


> If you're referring to DECA to ethernet through your router, try Genie to DVR with "just DECA".


But without a router between both switches, "cloud A" wont be able to see "cloud B" unless he uses one of your suggested NAS combiners.


----------



## Lord Vader

veryoldschool said:


> When/if this happens again would be the best time to check the mesh rates.
> 
> If you're referring to DECA to ethernet through your router, try Genie to DVR with "just DECA".


OK. When that recurs, I'll jot down that info. BTW, does it matter on which receiver I do the coax test? I ask because some of the receivers on which I have tried that never give me the information. Instead, the "please wait" message runs endlessly, and I'm forced to reboot the IRD to clear that nag.



peds48 said:


> But without a router between both switches, "cloud A" wont be able to see "cloud B" unless he uses one of your suggested NAS combiners.


Can you remind me where that info/link is to VOS's NAS combiners? I think I used the wrong search term or something.


----------



## dennisj00

In your very own thread . . . http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/213395-hr44-genie-wont-stay-connected-to-home-network/page-2#entry3283362


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> OK. When that recurs, I'll jot down that info. BTW, does it matter on which receiver I do the coax test? I ask because some of the receivers on which I have tried that never give me the information. Instead, the "please wait" message runs endlessly, and I'm forced to reboot the IRD to clear that nag.
> 
> Can you remind me where that info/link is to VOS's NAS combiners? I think I used the wrong search term or something.


Any receiver with an internal DECA can run the test(s).
I think you may have missed a point or question:
When or if this happens again, is it between the Genie and an ethernet receiver or between the Genie and a DECA receiver?

It's a sticky in this forum: http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/196584-when-one-swim-isnt-enough/


----------



## veryoldschool

peds48 said:


> But without a router between both switches, "cloud A" wont be able to see "cloud B" unless he uses one of your suggested NAS combiners.


If the setup is the way I suggested: SWiM #1 is all DECA & SWiM #2 is all ethernet, as these were the HR20s without DECA.


----------



## Lord Vader

dennisj00 said:


> In your very own thread . . . http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/213395-hr44-genie-wont-stay-connected-to-home-network/page-2#entry3283362





veryoldschool said:


> Any receiver with an internal DECA can run the test(s).
> I think you may have missed a point or question:
> When or if this happens again, is it between the Genie and an ethernet receiver or between the Genie and a DECA receiver?
> 
> It's a sticky in this forum: http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/196584-when-one-swim-isnt-enough/


Duh! I was aware of that but just got confused by peds' terminology above. Guess that's what happens on only 3 hours of sleep!


----------



## Lord Vader

veryoldschool said:


> If the setup is the way I suggested: SWiM #1 is all DECA & SWiM #2 is all ethernet, as these were the HR20s without DECA.


I took the HR2Xs (HR20-700s and HR22s) and used DECA adapters per peds' prior recommendations with the BSF on the 20-700s. Everything is DECA and no more ethernet.

I'm going to monitor that particular Genie that gives the "no playback/video packets" error and see if it keeps occurring. It did not happen immediately after I removed the old dish and installed the WB68. Instead, it popped up a couple days ago.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> I took the HR2Xs (HR20-700s and HR22s) and used DECA adapters per peds' prior *recommendations with the BSF on the 20-700s*. Everything is DECA and no more ethernet.
> 
> I'm going to monitor that particular Genie that gives the "no playback/video packets" error and see if it keeps occurring. It did not happen immediately after I removed the old dish and installed the WB68. Instead, it popped up a couple days ago.


It was only the 20-100s that use the BSF.
With the short distances, combining the DECA clouds is feasible, but let's get a handle on the phy levels & mesh first.


----------



## Lord Vader

I'll check that out when I get home later today and report back here. 

With respect to the HR20-700s, should I remove the BSFs? Both IRDs and their Whole Home MRV service appear to be working fine with them; hence my asking.


----------



## veryoldschool

With the HR20-100 they couldn't get the SAT #1 to power the DECA so it had to be connected to SAT #2.
The BSF was added later as the installers it seems couldn't follow directions.


----------



## Lord Vader

I wonder if that's why the coax to my two HR20-700s (which aren't the HR20-100s, obviously) is connected to Sat #2, whereas on all other receivers, it's connected to Sat #1.


----------



## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> I took the HR2Xs (HR20-700s and HR22s) and used DECA adapters per peds' prior recommendations with the BSF on the 20-700s. Everything is DECA and no more ethernet.


The BSF was recommended way back when you were mixing ethernet and DECA at the same time.


----------



## Lord Vader

Could that in any way be contributing to the Genie dropping off as much as it does? Just wondering.


----------



## Lord Vader

Well, the Genie is doing it again--won't play MRV recordings. Moreover, I'm getting occasional ext. 771 error nags on that one.

I just did the coax test and here's the info...

Nodes Physical levels

0 N/A
1 -26
2 -23
3 -12
4 -27


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Well, the Genie is doing it again--won't play MRV recordings. Moreover, I'm getting occasional ext. 771 error nags on that one.
> 
> I just did the coax test and here's the info...
> 
> Nodes Physical levels
> 
> 0 N/A
> 1 -26
> 2 -23
> 3 -12
> 4 -27


You'll need to refresh what you have connected and how it is networked.
You're showing five DECA nodes. A CCK & four DVRs?


----------



## Lord Vader

No, no CCK, just all DVRs (total of 7) now all connected via DECA, one dish, one WB68 that feeds 2 SWM16s.


----------



## peds48

Lord Vader said:


> No,* no CCK*, just all DVRs (total of 7) now all connected via DECA, one dish, one WB68 that feeds 2 SWM16s.


Yes, you have two CCKS, at your router. The BroadBand DECAs. So that should be 9 nodes and you are only showing 4


----------



## Lord Vader

My bad. By "CCK" I thought you were referring to something else. 

So the next question is why are only 4 nodes showing when 9 should be?


----------



## peds48

Legacy receivers won't show but their DECAs if any should


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## Lord Vader

Each legacy receiver is connected via DECA. No more ethernet connections. Does that mean their nodes SHOULD show?


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Each legacy receiver is connected via DECA. No more ethernet connections. Does that mean their nodes SHOULD show?


If you're back to bridging the two SWiMs with ethernet, the DECA nodes are limited to only those on each "side" of the ethernet bridging.

To ask it another way:
How is SWiM #1 and SWiM #2 connected?
A CCK on each running to your router?


----------



## Lord Vader

Yes. There are no more ethernet connections. It's all DECA now.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Yes. There are no more ethernet connections. It's all DECA now.


You haven't explained how SWiM #1 connects to SWiM #2.


----------



## Lord Vader

Each is connected to a DECA broadband adapter that in turn is connected directly to my comcast modem/router.


----------



## peds48

veryoldschool said:


> If you're back to bridging the two SWiMs with ethernet, the DECA nodes are limited to only those on each "side" of the ethernet bridging.


Was not aware of that. Learn something new very day...


----------



## Lord Vader

But since I'm all DECA and not ethernet...

My recordings are able to be seen by the problematic Genie, and the Genie can see all other networked DVRs. It's just when I go to play from another receiver a recording on the Genie, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, the latter giving me the no video packets nag or the "we're having trouble accessing this recording" nag.


----------



## inkahauts

Yes but you have two separate deca clouds now is what VOS is getting at. Not sure but might be a router issue. Maybe connect the bbdeca that go
To your router strait to each other for the moment and see if that clears up your issues. That would narrow it down to something outside the system.

Could be your router is messing with IP address and you may need to reserve iPs for your DVRs in your router. That'd be a bit odd but it's possible.


----------



## inkahauts

Oh and you aren't "all deca" since signal has to go through Ethernet and your router to get from one side to the other.


----------



## peds48

inkahauts said:


> Oh and you aren't "all deca" since signal has to go through Ethernet and your router to get from one side to the other.


And this is the only DirecTV® approved way.


----------



## Lord Vader

At least I'm "approved" then. :-D


----------



## inkahauts

I was unaware DIRECTV has any approved ways for two swim16s in a system.


----------



## peds48

inkahauts said:


> I was unaware DIRECTV has any approved ways for two swim16s in a system.


While VOS provides a more 'cleaner" method, I have been using the DIRECTV® way for a little longer than a year with no issues what so ever.


----------



## veryoldschool

peds48 said:


> While VOS provides a more 'cleaner" method, I have been using the DIRECTV® way for a little longer than a year with no issues what so ever.


The installation side of the house hasn't approved it, but the engineering side loved it. !rolling


----------



## peds48

veryoldschool said:


> The installation side of the house hasn't approved it, but the engineering side loved it. !rolling


Then I wonder why this has not seen the field then&#8230;. Is not like is rocket science&#8230; Or is it???? :rotfl:


----------



## veryoldschool

peds48 said:


> Then I wonder why this has not seen the field then&#8230;. Is not like is rocket science&#8230; Or is it???? :rotfl:


It reduces the DECA range by 5 dB, so long coax runs can be a problem.


----------



## Lord Vader

That brings up an interesting point. My SWM16s and WB68 are about 25-30 feet away from the receivers.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> That brings up an interesting point. My SWM16s and WB68 are about 25-30 feet away from the receivers.


"long coax runs" are 100'+


----------



## peds48

veryoldschool said:


> It reduces the DECA range by 5 dB, so long coax runs can be a problem.


so in that case router bridging would be better?

Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## veryoldschool

peds48 said:


> so in that case router bridging would be better?


If DECA is close to its limit, then ethernet would be a better option.
the loss calculators came about because of this idea of combining DECA.
Since the loss is more critical, and with dual SWiM-16s, the loss paths are more than I could keep in my head, the calculator became a must to keep track of every path.


----------



## acostapimps

....and the setup stories continues I wonder what the next segment of issues would be !rolling
:icon_band


----------



## Lord Vader

That's a good question. 

In the for what it's worth dept, the Genie is working fine right now. Sometimes it's just fine; sometimes it won't stay on the network. Weird.


----------



## acostapimps

It's only network/MRV issues that's happening right? No signal problems or anything hardware related?


----------



## acostapimps

I hope those DECA's currently connected are on older receivers and not on HR24 or Genie or any other newer-ish equipment
as those have built in DECA's.


----------



## Lord Vader

acostapimps said:


> It's only network/MRV issues that's happening right? No signal problems or anything hardware related?


None that I can see.



acostapimps said:


> I hope those DECA's currently connected are on older receivers and not on HR24 or Genie or any other newer-ish equipment
> as those have built in DECA's.


Correct. They're connected only to the HR20-700s and HR22s and not the HR24s or HR44. The two broadband adapters are connected to the respective individual coaxes from each SWM16, then these adapters are connected to my modem/router.


----------



## acostapimps

Did you rebooted your modem/router to see if that clears up the MRV issues? and receivers also and start the network setup again or restore to defaults if there's any IP address issues on any of your DVR's, make sure it matches your DNS and IP address, Subnet also (it shouldn't have changed) from your router,


----------



## Lord Vader

I can't do the restore network services on my receivers, because when I do, I always get the "unable to restore network services" error.


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> I can't do the restore network services on my receivers, because when I do, I always get the "unable to restore network services" error.


Let's not go down the wrong rabbit hole.
You don't care about "network services". TVapps is the only thing that uses part of that code.
Some routers just don't play nice with network services and other do.

"Restoring Network Defaults" is much more important as it can flush out glitches in your networking, which may be causing the issues you're having.


----------



## Lord Vader

When looking at your schematic, I remembered that I have a WB68, which isn't in your layout obviously. How would the connections go with that in the mix? I noticed this when trying to figure out where the 4 coaxes from the dish would go in your setup.


----------



## dennisj00

Lord Vader said:


> When looking at your schematic, I remembered that I have a WB68, which isn't in your layout obviously. How would the connections go with that in the mix? I noticed this when trying to figure out where the 4 coaxes from the dish would go in your setup.


Remember, the input side of your SWiM-16s have nothing to do with your network / MRV connectivity.


----------



## Lord Vader

That much I remember


----------



## veryoldschool

dennisj00 said:


> Remember, the input side of your SWiM-16s have nothing to do with your network / MRV connectivity.





Lord Vader said:


> That much I remember


Which is why I didn't care.


----------



## Lord Vader

No need to get snippy, because I wasn't trying to be. ☺

It's all good. Thanks


----------



## veryoldschool

didn't think I was, though being tired caused me to be brief, which might have come across that way.


----------



## Lord Vader

I understand. You've been nothing but helpful and informative, and for that I am grateful. (Never mind that I'm stuffed up on Nyquil and other meds right now.)


----------



## pogo

just a quick note to thank LV and all who contributed to this thread. I had been searching for any info on boxes intermittently dropping off the network. When D* forced me to pay for MRV because I had an HR34 I conceded that since I had to pay I might as well use it. I looked at some setup help and saw that both HR21 and HR22 would need a DECA so I dutifully called CS and ordered them up. I disconnected from the router and installed the DECAs. Not until I saw this thread did the little light go on that you only need the DECA _IF_ you need to use coax networking.
(Which I don't -- all dvrs are installed in one rack with an eight port ethernet switch.)
I don't know if the DECAs had anything to do with my problem, but it's certainly a good thing to take them out of the equation if they're not needed. I do know that the numbers I saw in the coax network diagnostics weren't all that great.

Thanks for waking me up.


----------



## fleckrj

LV, I just spent about 90 minutes reading this entire thread (very informative, by the way), and I have one question. When do you have time to watch the programs you record?


----------



## Lord Vader

fleckrj, *THAT* is a very good question. Short answer--I don't! Seriously. I'm SO backed up with recordings it's not even funny. What little time I get I tend to spend watching a sporting event: Blackhawks game, Steelers game, Bears game, White Sox game, MLB playoffs, NCAA Tournament, and similar stuff. I teach at a year round high school in Houston. My alarm rings at 5:00 a.m. every weekday. On Tuesdays and Thursdays we have after school meetings until 4:00 p.m. My "planning" period is from 2:05 to 2:50 weekdays, but it is replaced by incessant meetings on the aforementioned Tuesdays and Thursdays (not to mention the second Saturday of the month from 7:30 a.m. to 9:30 a.m.).

I don't get home oftentimes until 5:30 p.m. or later. I'm usually grading papers or doing lesson planning on evenings, which I also do all Sunday evening. In-between all of this, I'm a college baseball umpire. I'm usually in bed around 1:00 a.m. (that's not a typo). Unfortunately, I'm not in my 20s (or even 30s) anymore.

That probably explains why I got sick this past weekend and spent all day Monday in bed.


----------



## peds48

pogo said:


> I do know that the numbers I saw in the coax network diagnostics weren't all that great.


What numbers (values) were you seeing? Were the DECAs attached when you took those numbers?


----------



## pogo

peds48 said:


> What numbers (values) were you seeing? Were the DECAs attached when you took those numbers?


Yes, with the DECA in the loop. AFAIK the Coax Network Test menu won't display if you're not using DECA. PHY Levels looked really good (to be expected since the boxes were all in one place. I saw PHY RATE MESH numbers of 200. By the troubleshooting guide at Solid Signal that would be quite low, although everything seemed to be working at the time. I Disconnected the HR 21 to try to isolate for certain which box had the worst numbers. When I ran the test again with only the HR34 and the HR22 connectecd I got numbers of 150 to 180. I decided that it was all interesting, but since I don't need the DECA anyway just get rid of it.


----------



## veryoldschool

pogo said:


> Yes, with the DECA in the loop. AFAIK the Coax Network Test menu won't display if you're not using DECA. PHY Levels looked really good (to be expected since the boxes were all in one place. I saw PHY RATE MESH numbers of 200. By the troubleshooting guide at Solid Signal that would be quite low, although everything seemed to be working at the time. I Disconnected the HR 21 to try to isolate for certain which box had the worst numbers. When I ran the test again with only the HR34 and the HR22 connectecd I got numbers of 150 to 180. I decided that it was all interesting, but since I don't need the DECA anyway just get rid of it.


Since RF is my thing, and DECA is...
The 550 MHz range either has some excess noise "or" the DECA signal has a double path so the secondary signal is being seen as noise to the primary.
Sometimes changing a coax with one a couple of inches longer or shorts will improve this and sometimes using a BSF to block the signal from going places it doesn't need to will improve this.
With everything at the same location, the BSF on the input of the splitter would be my choice.


----------



## dennisj00

veryoldschool said:


> Since RF is my thing, and DECA is...
> The 550 MHz range either has some excess noise "or" the DECA signal has a double path so the secondary signal is being seen as noise to the primary.
> Sometimes changing a coax with one a couple of inches longer or shorts will improve this and sometimes using a BSF to block the signal from going places it doesn't need to will improve this.
> With everything at the same location, the BSF on the input of the splitter would be my choice.


Also, wouldn't the short cable runs be a potential detriment with too strong signals and reflections?


----------



## pogo

dennisj00 said:


> Also, wouldn't the short cable runs be a potential detriment with too strong signals and reflections


The readings were in the -25 range so not really excessive -- OTOH the HR21 and HR22 were both on one two way splitter. When I removed the HR21 I simply unscrewed at the back of the DVR so the DECA was still hanging on the splitter but unterminated. That could well account for 150-180 reading at that time. Since I didn't intend to use the DECAs anymore I really didn't pursue troubleshoooting of the cause.


----------



## veryoldschool

dennisj00 said:


> Also, wouldn't the short cable runs be a potential detriment with too strong signals and reflections?


Not in this case. It has to do with levels and phase.
If the secondary is of high enough amplitude, it's the phase in relationship to the primary that is the problem.
A change of just a couple of inches in coax "can" phase match the secondary to the primary, which allows the primary to have a good SNR and therefore a good phy mesh.
IIRC I started with a mesh of 250+ and degraded it to below 200 with a 2 or 4 inch longer coax.
Attenuation is a simpler method, but phasing also works.


----------



## veryoldschool

pogo said:


> The readings were in the -25 range so not really excessive -- OTOH the HR21 and HR22 were both on one two way splitter.


A -25 suggests the 2-way splitter wasn't a DECA [green label] splitter.
A silver splitter has around 20 dB isolation, where the DECA 2-way has 7-10 dB.


----------



## Lord Vader

So what do my levels above suggest? Just curious. (All of my splitters are the green ones.)


----------



## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> So what do my levels above suggest? Just curious. (All of my splitters are the green ones.)


Your levels "showed me" you don't have excessive loss between nodes.
If your mesh numbers aren't above 220, "then" I'd play with coax lengths.

These are some very old drawings I have trying to show what a few inches can do to the primary and secondary signals:






way out of phase






a few inches longer coax






"The sweet spot"


----------



## pogo

veryoldschool said:


> A -25 suggests the 2-way splitter wasn't a DECA [green label] splitter.
> A silver splitter has around 20 dB isolation, where the DECA 2-way has 7-10 dB.


Also suggests that I don't really care. I'm not totally sure you've read my posts. I'm no longer using DECA and never would have if I had not suffered from HUMA.


----------



## pogo

veryoldschool said:


> A -25 suggests the 2-way splitter wasn't a DECA [green label] splitter.
> A silver splitter has around 20 dB isolation, where the DECA 2-way has 7-10 dB.


It also suggests that you haven't read my posts. I no longer care about DECA. I don't use it anymore. if folks want to believe that you can only use RG6 cable and "green" splitters that's fine with me.


----------



## veryoldschool

pogo said:


> Also suggests that I don't really care. I'm not totally sure you've read my posts. I'm no longer using DECA and never would have if I had not suffered from HUMA.





pogo said:


> It also suggests that you haven't read my posts. I no longer care about DECA. I don't use it anymore. if folks want to believe that you can only use RG6 cable and "green" splitters that's fine with me.


You've sort of jumped into this thread so most of my posts are for others reading the thread.
"I realize" you don't give a ....
yet I can point out to others how you screwed up so they don't.


----------



## Lord Vader

Indeed. I've enjoyed learning from VOS, in this thread and others. ☺


----------



## pogo

veryoldschool said:


> You've sort of jumped into this thread so most of my posts are for others reading the thread.
> "I realize" you don't give a ....
> yet I can point out to others how you screwed up so they don't.


I'm sorry that I offended especially siince I "jumped into this thread" to thank someone for pointing out to me that I had screwed up. Difference between you and I is you think I screwed up in the way I connected my DECAs and I think I screwed up by using them in the first place. Your advice is very good I'm sure for those who have to use them, but I made it clear that I don't. I guess I got irritated by people quouting me and not repsonding to me. I will not offend again but I will continue to believe that green splitters and RG6 aren't a big deal. I do give a --- I just didnt' understand why I was being quoted when I made it clear where I am. I do apologize. I didn't mean to offend.


----------



## Lord Vader

Hey, folks, let's get past this and move on. I don't want this thread to be closed due to flaring tempers.

On another note, pogo, it is my understanding that the green label splitters are the ones to use because they've been proven to work with Whole Home Service and that other types of splitters may not work or do not work. I DO know that way back when, I had a splitter from Radio Shack. I was having signal loss issues, etc. When someone here (a different thread) suggested I use the green label DirecTV-approved ones, I picked up one from Amazon. I swapped the Radio Shack one for the green label, and voila! Instant fix.


----------



## veryoldschool

pogo said:


> I'm sorry that I offended especially siince I "jumped into this thread" to thank someone for pointing out to me that I had screwed up. Difference between you and I is you think I screwed up in the way I connected my DECAs and I think I screwed up by using them in the first place. Your advice is very good I'm sure for those who have to use them, but I made it clear that I don't. I guess I got irritated by people quouting me and not repsonding to me. I will not offend again but I will continue to believe that green splitters and RG6 aren't a big deal. I do give a --- I just didnt' understand why I was being quoted when I made it clear where I am. I do apologize. I didn't mean to offend.


I wasn't offended.
Some just like ethernet.
You had posted some poor results, and another poster or two were questioning them.
You gave enough info that I could get an idea of why, because I too was once using components with similar results.



Lord Vader said:


> Hey, folks, let's get past this and move on. I don't want this thread to be closed due to flaring tempers.
> 
> On another note, pogo, it is my understanding that the green label splitters are the ones to use because they've been proven to work with Whole Home Service and that other types of splitters may not work or do not work. I DO know that way back when, I had a splitter from Radio Shack. I was having signal loss issues, etc. When someone here (a different thread) suggested I use the green label DirecTV-approved ones, I picked up one from Amazon. I swapped the Radio Shack one for the green label, and voila! Instant fix.


If pogo isn't upset [at me] I don't see this thread getting closed.

Why there are green labeled splitters is because they're a modified splitter with an added circuit for DECA.
The modification reduces the DECA loss between output ports AND increases the loss [for DECA] between the outputs and the input port.
What this does is increase the primary signal AND decrease the secondary, so in most cases "phase matching" isn't needed.


----------



## Lord Vader

Whatever that means. LOL


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## veryoldschool

Lord Vader said:


> Whatever that means. LOL


If I had an hour with a white board, I could explain it. :lol:

I'd start with








Then








and


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## Lord Vader

OK, that explains it!

Too much math, algebra, etc. involved.


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## TheRatPatrol

Lord Vader said:


> OK, that explains it!
> 
> Too much math, algebra, etc. involved.


Well its just like when the flux capacitor and dilithium crystals engage.


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## Lord Vader

Oh, *THAT*! Well, why didn't you *SAY* that?!? Now I understand it! :scratch:


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## pogo

veryoldschool said:


> If pogo isn't upset [at me] I don't see this thread getting closed.


No, not upset. Just a cranky old coot who had a generally bad day yesterday. WRT preffering ethernet -- It's that I always prefer the simplest solution. I just can't believe that I already had it and didn't realize it. Peace, and keep up the work. WRT green splitters it had never before been explained to me that they were specific to DECA. I just used the ones I've had in the system forever since the've always worked for me. Peace.


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## acostapimps

fleckrj said:


> LV, I just spent about 90 minutes reading this entire thread (very informative, by the way)


Wow that's 15 pages of reading, you sure love reading  
But to tell you the truth I've fully read about at least 6 or 7 pages just waiting for the Update Resolved post !rolling


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