# Buzz, Hum With Directv?



## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Hi guys. I hope I has posted this in the right section. I have a buzz or hum through my speaker, and the noise goes away when I unplug the HDMI from my Directv box. I went outside to check the ground and the ground on the coaxial cable is grounded to the Directv grounding block, and then there is a ground coming off the block that is connected to a clamp on my meter. Is this a sufficient ground? Could this be causing my issue?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I would search for ground loop between DTV box and TV/AVR - check all outlets if there good ground (Home depot have cheap tester for that)


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Everything is plugged into one outlet so ground should be good there correct?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

umm, practically not
- not all power cable have third (ground) wire or it could be broken
- not all outlets have the ground or lost ground by bad screw
- faulty power strip could be too


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Well the outlet that everything is plugged was changed not too long ago and replaced with a a ps audio outlet, so the outlet connection should be okay. My power strip is recently new as well. So re-routing the ground for Directv to my main home ground won't help the issue?? BTW thanks for the replies!


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I would get the cheap ground tester and would check all outlets what you use for devices; I don't think dish/LNBF grounding will affect the humming; I would concentrate on DVR/client and TV/AVR.
BTW, you didn't provide details of the equipment and interconnection in-between.
Also, does all your boxes have three prong power cables ?


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

My equipment consists of a 65'' tv, denon receiver, 2 monoblock amps, Directv box, fire tv, xbox one x, and a gigabit ethernet switch. The only three prong devices are the two monoblock amps. Everything is plugged into a surge protector that goes to one outlet. Interconnects are from Blue Jeans Cable along with their speaker cable as well. Also, I just connected the speakers up to the denon receiver instead of the amps and the noise goes away. What does that mean??


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

That's a ton of stuff, you need to disconnect things down to a minimum to isolate the problem. If you have just TV and Directv receiver, both plugged into the wall and with just an HDMI cable between them and audio through the TV speakers, do you have hum? If not, it isn't the Directv receiver and you need to add components back in one at a time to see what is causing it.

It is quite possible it your TV that is responsible, a lot of newer TVs have ground plane issues. Assuming you have a second TV, you might try swapping it with that 65" one with everything set up as it is currently to rule out the TV as the cause.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

I connected the directv box straight to the tv and didn't hear the noise. Once I cut my amps back on the speakers have a hiss through them. Whenever everything was connected like usual the sound was a hiss and a buzz if that makes sense. So connecting from directv straight to the tv basically eliminated the buzz I was hearing.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

So the buzz goes away when i connect the directv box straight into the tv, and it goes away when I unplug the HDMI from the back of receiver. So it sounds like the problem could be in the receiver?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I would try recombination of two prong plugs … turn to 180 degree one at a time


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Thanks for the Reply P. Smith I will try that. So I just disconnected everything from the system and started connecting everything one at a time. I started with just the amps and the receiver with the interconnects connected from the amps to the receiver. With this a got a hiss from the speakers (which I have always had). The hiss remained constant after plugging other things in. Once I plugged in the HDMI into the back of the receiver that connected my Directv box the buzz reappeared


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Thanks for the Reply P. Smith I will try that. So I just disconnected everything from the system and started connecting everything one at a time. I started with just the amps and the receiver with the interconnects connected from the amps to the receiver. With this a got a hiss from the speakers (which I have always had). The hiss remained constant after plugging other things in. Once I plugged in the HDMI into the back of the receiver that connected my Directv box the buzz reappeared


Do you have another HR you can put in place of that box? If you do and you can swap them...is the buzz gone?  If it is you have a problem with that box. If it remains you have another issue. Try the simpler approach.

Rich


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

OK so after googling "PS audio receptacle" I'm pretty sure that's your problem. It claims to be a "custom-built, hospital-grade, _isolated-ground_, 15-to-20 amp receptacle". An "isolated ground" is exactly what you do NOT want here, that's what's causing your problem. The reason why you only hear the buzz when the amps are hooked up is because the amps are the one part of your system with a ground plug, but your outlet is not allowing the ground pin on the amp's plug to function as intended, and drain the potential difference between your electrical ground and satellite ground (which the receiver bridges onto the HDMI shield)

I'm willing to bet if you moved everything to a different outlet you didn't replace with that gimmicky audiophile piece of crap, the buzz will disappear. If so, replacing that outlet with a standard receptacle that has a proper ground would be the permanent fix that allows everything to function as intended.

Not certain how PS audio implements that isolated ground, and of course as usual with audiophile snake oil equipment there is no documentation because that would "reveal their secrets". Most likely the only thing that makes it different from a standard receptacle is a small resistor in line with the ground, which would isolate the ground from low power levels typical in a ground loop, while still (hopefully!!!) functioning as a safety ground. Plus of course an LED because everything that sells for way more than it is worth needs an unnecessary LED hooked to nothing to justify the price!


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Thanks guys I will try your recommendations and get back to you!


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

So I tried a different Directv box and plugged everything into a different outlet in the room but there was no change :/


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So I tried a different Directv box and plugged everything into a different outlet in the room but there was no change :/


That leads you back to *Slice's *post #14 of this thread. I'd take out that receptacle and put in a normal one.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> That leads you back to *Slice's *post #14 of this thread. I'd take out that receptacle and put in a normal one.
> 
> Rich


Well I tried a different receptacle in the room, but the buzz was still present


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Well I tried a different receptacle in the room, but the buzz was still present


Nutz, that was gonna be my next suggestion. When did this start?

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Hi guys. I hope I has posted this in the right section. I have a buzz or hum through my speaker, and the noise goes away when I unplug the HDMI from my Directv box. I went outside to check the ground and the ground on the coaxial cable is grounded to the Directv grounding block, and *then there is a ground coming off the block that is connected to a clamp on my meter.* Is this a sufficient ground? Could this be causing my issue?


My D* system has never been grounded. Did you try taking that ground off the clamp? have you tried your system without it being grounded?

Before anyone jumps me on not having my system grounded I have had two township Electrical Inspectors look at my D* system and they had no issue with it not being grounded. I did try to get it grounded but none of the installers knew how to do that properly.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Nutz, that was gonna be my next suggestion. When did this start?
> 
> Rich


You know I honestly don't know. Some days are worse than others, and I finally got the time to try to troubleshoot it. We have the same issue downstairs as well but the noise is much worse and it is more of a high pitch noise? It's crazy and driving me insane lol


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Well I tried a different receptacle in the room, but the buzz was still present


But, do you know if the two receptacles are on the same circuit? You want to try a circuit the PS receptacle is not on.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> But, do you know if the two receptacles are on the same circuit? You want to try a circuit the PS receptacle is not on.
> 
> Rich


I would have to run an extension cord. Is that okay?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> You know I honestly don't know. Some days are worse than others, and I finally got the time to try to troubleshoot it. We have the same issue downstairs as well but the noise is much worse and it is more of a high pitch noise? It's crazy and driving me insane lol


Doesn't sound like a 60 cycle hum? I can't think of a way to describe that but it's not a high pitched sound, kinda like a low hummmmmmmmmm. Do you know what an oscillator squeal sounds like? My first color TV set had that squeal. Happy day when I got rid of that thing.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I would have to run an extension cord. Is that okay?


Sure.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Doesn't sound like a 60 cycle hum? I can't think of a way to describe that but it's not a high pitched sound, kinda like a low hummmmmmmmmm. Do you know what an oscillator squeal sounds like? My first color TV set had that squeal. Happy day when I got rid of that thing.
> 
> Rich


I wouldn't describe it as a hum. And i'm sorry but I don't know what that sounds like lol. It's just this crazy high pitch awful noise that goes away when you unplug the hdmi from the directv box just like upstairs. But like I said the downstairs is much worse than mine. It's really crazy!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I wouldn't describe it as a hum. And i'm sorry but I don't know what that sounds like lol. It's just this crazy high pitch awful noise that goes away when you unplug the hdmi from the directv box just like upstairs. *But like I said the downstairs is much worse than mine*. It's really crazy!


Same circuit by any chance?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Same circuit by any chance?
> 
> Rich


Different circuit for sure


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Different circuit for sure


I don't think you are hearing the kind of squeal I mentioned. I'd expect that to be in one place, caused by a component of a single device.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

P Smith said:


> I would get the cheap ground tester and would check all outlets what you use for devices; I don't think dish/LNBF grounding will affect the humming; I would concentrate on DVR/client and TV/AVR.
> BTW, you didn't provide details of the equipment and interconnection in-between.
> Also, does all your boxes have three prong power cables ?


What is a "cheap" ground tester? Have you ever seen a three prong plug on an HR?


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> I don't think you are hearing the kind of squeal I mentioned. I'd expect that to be in one place, caused by a component of a single device.
> 
> Rich


I'll try disconnecting the grounds outside once it stops raining and see what happens. Thank you for all of your suggestions btw!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I'll try disconnecting the grounds outside once it stops raining and see what happens. Thank you for all of your suggestions btw!


I should be thanking you for making a boring day interesting. All you should do with the grounding wires is disconnect the lead from the D* grounding block to the ground clamp. Just isolate the D* system, nothing else. You describe a squeal well, I don't think a bad ground would give you that but I'd still take that lead off.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> I should be thanking you for making a boring day interesting. All you should do with the grounding wires is disconnect the lead from the D* grounding block to the ground clamp. Just isolate the D* system, nothing else. You describe a squeal well, I don't think a bad ground would give you that but I'd still take that lead off.
> 
> Rich


Okay so when I disconnected the ground from the clamp the noise upstairs got much worse. Actually it changed to a high pitch noise like the downstairs. The downstairs noise stayed the same during this process. Here is where it gets strange. While the ground was still disconnected, I unplugged my coax from my box upstairs and the high pitched noise downstairs went away. What the heck does that mean? lol


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Okay so when I disconnected the ground from the clamp the noise upstairs got much worse. Actually it changed to a high pitch noise like the downstairs. The downstairs noise stayed the same during this process. Here is where it gets strange. While the ground was still disconnected, I unplugged my coax from my box upstairs and the high pitched noise downstairs went away. What the heck does that mean? lol


Where exactly is that noise coming from on each floor?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Where exactly is that noise coming from on each floor?
> 
> Rich


Through the front two speakers


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Through the front two speakers


Speakers on AVRs on each floor?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Speakers on AVRs on each floor?
> 
> Rich


So connecting the upstairs to a different circuit fixed the issue. I haven't tried the downstairs yet


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So connecting the upstairs to a different circuit fixed the issue. I haven't tried the downstairs yet


Try to put the downstairs equipment on the same circuit that fixed the problem upstairs.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Try to put the downstairs equipment on the same circuit that fixed the problem upstairs.
> 
> Rich


Testing it now


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Try to put the downstairs equipment on the same circuit that fixed the problem upstairs.
> 
> Rich


That seemed to have fixed the issue. Or at least it dialed it down by about 85 to 90 percent. So I just need to replace the receptacles?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Are you an electrician? Tread lightly if you are not.

It is possible that there is a problem with the wiring to the receptacle that could be repaired. It is also possible to kill yourself if you don't know what you are doing with electricity. Stay safe.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> That seemed to have fixed the issue. Or at least it dialed it down by about 85 to 90 percent. So I just need to replace the receptacles?


You have more than one of those receptacles?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

James Long said:


> Are you an electrician? Tread lightly if you are not.
> 
> It is possible that there is a problem with the wiring to the receptacle that could be repaired. It is also possible to kill yourself if you don't know what you are doing with electricity. Stay safe.


Not an electrician lol i have changed receptacles before, but anything too tricky I don't mess with. Thanks for the input and concern!


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> You have more than one of those receptacles?
> 
> Rich


No I only have a one PS Audio receptacle upstairs so why does this fix the issue downstairs? Everything downstairs is just your standard receptacles. They are probably old, but other than that nothing special


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Not an electrician lol i have changed receptacles before, but anything too tricky I don't mess with. Thanks for the input and concern!


Just make sure you shut the circuit breaker in the panel off.

Rich


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> While the ground was still disconnected, I unplugged my coax from my box upstairs and the high pitched noise downstairs went away. What the heck does that mean? lol


So you should put a ground loop isolator on that coax if it is not carrying DC power. They cost under $10.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Just make sure you shut the circuit breaker in the panel off.
> 
> Rich


So i just realized that the extension cord i was using has the ground prong broken off so I am essentially lifting the ground which is why the noise goes away right? I swapped the cord for a three prong cord and the noise is back


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

James Long said:


> Are you an electrician? Tread lightly if you are not.
> 
> It is possible that there is a problem with the wiring to the receptacle that could be repaired. It is also possible to kill yourself if you don't know what you are doing with electricity. Stay safe.


I once encountered a life threatening wiring defect at a condo that I'm told was the old British Embassy. It was a four story building with one condo on each floor and a staffed English style elevator like they have in James Bond movies. Sometimes, the elevator operator goes days without doing anything, but anyway...

I was working on a 10 foot C-band dish on the roof and felt a heavy "thud" each time I touched the mast. Never had a sensation like that before. I saw the mast was not grounded and came back to ground it the next day.

I attached an 8 gauge bare aluminum wire to the mast and hung it down the side of the building, in front of a window that was security protected by a metal grate, and then I crawled in the 4th floor crawl space and hooked and retrieved the wire, and as I pulled it through the grate, I saw a big spark. I then connected it to a convenient copper water pipe. Back in those days, that still met code

When I went downstairs, the home owner asked what happened. He said that I had tripped a circuit breaker, which took out some lights, and that he was unable to trip it back on.

I unplugged the receiver and he flipped the breaker back on, but as soon as I plugged it back in the breaker tripped again.

I had him flip it on with the receiver unplugged, and then I checked the outlet wiring potential with respect to the nearby cast iron radiator and found that even though the black and white wires on the outlet were connected where they were supposed to be, the white wire was hot and the black wire was at ground potential.

This old Echostar receiver had a three prong plug to ground the chassis, but while the electronics were transformer isolated from the AC cord ground, the coax shield was not and that completed the (otherwise fatal) circuit from hot to ground.

I'll tell you, if I had used an insulated ground wire instead of a bare one, I most likely would not have tripped the breaker when pulling it through the grate and when I drew the stripped end of that wire with one hand to the to the ground connection with the other... well... I probably wouldn't be writing this post.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Why does lifting the ground eliminate the noise?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Why does lifting the ground eliminate the noise?


Question for all posters:
Would something like this , Surge with EMI/RFI filtration help in this situation ?
https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_...x=surge+emi,electronics,178&crid=3KKDUL30YG8X


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So i just realized that the extension cord i was using has the ground prong broken off so I am essentially lifting the ground which is why the noise goes away right? I swapped the cord for a three prong cord and the noise is back


I just read the thread again. Each time I read thru it I keep thinking it's a problem with the AVR setup. You prove in a post that it's not the TV or the Directv box. But why do you hear the noise in two locations? What is common to those two locations? What kind of sound system to you have in the room that doesn't have the Denon in it?

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

jimmie57 said:


> Question for all posters:
> Would something like this , Surge with EMI/RFI filtration help in this situation ?
> https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_1_9?url=search-alias=electronics&field-keywords=surge+protector+emi/rfi&sprefix=surge+emi,electronics,178&crid=3KKDUL30YG8X


No idea. This is confusing.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Downstairs in the living room we have a 7.1 system. The 2 fronts are plugged into a 2 channel external amp, and the other 5 channels are plugged into a marantz receiver. There is also a 75" tv and an xbox. The main Directv box is in the living room as well. 

Upstairs in a 5.1 system. The two fronts are plugged into 2 monoblock amps. The other 3 channels is plugged into a Denon receiver. There is also a tv, DirecTV box, Xbox, fire TV, and a gigabit Ethernet switch


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Why does lifting the ground eliminate the noise?


Because if the wiring is grounded at two points and if they are not at exactly the same potential, then the interconnection forms a "loop antenna" and the received signal can develop an EMF of its own. In commercial audio, that is why we develop "star" grounding and why we are forever lifting grounds.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> Because if the wiring is grounded at two points and if they are not at exactly the same potential, then the interconnection forms a "loop antenna" and the received signal can develop an EMF of its own. In commercial audio, that is why we develop "star" grounding and why we are forever lifting grounds.


So this means that my equipment is not all grounded to the same ground point correct?


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So this means that my equipment is not all grounded to the same ground point correct?


Yep.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> Yep.


Hmmm. All my equipment is plugged into one outlet which should be earth grounded. The only thing I don't think is earth grounded is my DirecTV


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

https://www.amazon.com/Isolation-Tr...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=N6AKQRV9YBZNZG97YEB4


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Hmmm. All my equipment is plugged into one outlet which should be earth grounded. The only thing I don't think is earth grounded is my DirecTV


Your coax is also grounded.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> Your coax is also grounded.


If I am correct it is grounded to a clamp on my meter


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> If I am correct it is grounded to a clamp on my meter


First thing I think you should do is replace that receptacle. Do that and we'll see what happens.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> First thing I think you should do is replace that receptacle. Do that and we'll see what happens.
> 
> Rich


I will do that tomorrow. That's again for the help. I hope I'm not driving you insane with this problem like I have driven myself lol


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

There is a reason that those of us who used to participate regularly here no longer do so. 

If you disconnect the ground at the meter and the noise goes away, then you have a ground loop, which you can also break with the isolator. You could also use a 3-wire extension cord to enable you plug the outlet strip into other sockets.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> There is a reason that those of us who used to participate regularly here no longer do so.
> 
> If you disconnect the ground at the meter and the noise goes away, then you have a ground loop, which you can also break with the isolator. You could also use a 3-wire extension cord to enable you plug the outlet strip into other sockets.


Unfortunately, disconnecting the ground from the meter does not eliminate the noise. The thing baffling me is I know i have a noise problem in two different locations of the house, but why is the downstairs living room much worse AND a different sound too?


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

No, I meant that you should disconnect the antenna ground at the meter or anywhere else. When you disconnect the ground from the meter to earth, (God forbid!), the meter box is still grounded by virtue of the fact that the case is part of the ground electrode system and still gets grounded via the bonding of the copper water piping or other paths.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> No, I meant that you should disconnect the antenna ground at the meter or anywhere else. When you disconnect the ground from the meter to earth, (God forbid!), the meter box is still grounded by virtue of the fact that the case is part of the ground electrode system and still gets grounded via the bonding of the copper water piping or other paths.


You kind of lost me lol I'm sorry


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> No, I meant that you should disconnect the antenna ground at the meter or anywhere else. When you disconnect the ground from the meter to earth, (God forbid!), the meter box is still grounded by virtue of the fact that the case is part of the ground electrode system and still gets grounded via the bonding of the copper water piping or other paths.


Sorry that it is dark, but i attached a couple of photos showing the meter and the Directv grounding block


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> You kind of lost me lol I'm sorry


I understand what he's saying. Replace the receptacle and if that doesn't fix the problem try what he's suggesting.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> I understand what he's saying. Replace the receptacle and if that doesn't fix the problem try what he's suggesting.
> 
> Rich


What exactly is he suggesting?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> What exactly is he suggesting?


He'd have to clarify his suggestion. I just reread what he wrote and I'm not sure what he meant. Did you put a normal receptacle in place of the other one?

Rich


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Evan Spurlock said:


> What exactly is he suggesting?


Find the part of your electrical ground wiring responsible for hum/hiss/etc noise.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> What exactly is he suggesting?


I just saw a post that you made that stated the coax is grounded. Where is that grounded? Can you lift that off and see what happens?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> I just saw a post that you made that stated the coax is grounded. Where is that grounded? Can you lift that off and see what happens?
> 
> Rich


The wire connected to the coax that goes into the satellite is connected to the satellite and runs to a grounding block on the side of the house. Then from the grounding block it runs to the clamp on the top of the meter. Make sense?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> The wire connected to the coax that goes into the satellite is connected to the satellite and runs to a grounding block on the side of the house. Then from the grounding block it runs to the clamp on the top of the meter. Make sense?


Yes, isn't that what you disconnected before?

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> What exactly is he suggesting?


Read this: WTF are Ground Loops?

This is what he was talking about, I think.

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Yes, isn't that what you disconnected before?
> 
> Rich


Yes it is and there was no change. So does that need to be grounded to the main house ground? Would that help?


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> He'd have to clarify his suggestion. I just reread what he wrote and I'm not sure what he meant. Did you put a normal receptacle in place of the other one?
> 
> Rich


I won't be able to change the receptacle until 6 ot 7 CST, but i will definitely let you know when I do


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So connecting the upstairs to a different circuit fixed the issue. I haven't tried the downstairs yet


Did you use the same extension cord with the missing ground prong for this?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Did you use the same extension cord with the missing ground prong for this?
> 
> Rich


Yes I did


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Yes it is and there was no change. So does that need to be grounded to the main house ground? Would that help?


Didn't you say the sound changed in one of the rooms when you did that?

Rich


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I won't be able to change the receptacle until 6 ot 7 CST, but i will definitely let you know when I do


Have you looked around your house to see if there is a second ground rod in the ground and anything connected to it. I remember way back when I installed a CB radio antenna and we drove a second ground rod into the ground but nothing was connected to it except the CB antenna. The antenna has been down for years now.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Didn't you say the sound changed in one of the rooms when you did that?
> 
> Rich


I can't remember what I said at this point lol I can disconnect it again here in a minute and tell you for sure


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Yes I did


Is there any way you can hook up that equipment to an extension cord that has a ground prong?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> Is there any way you can hook up that equipment to an extension cord that has a ground prong?
> 
> Rich


I did that and the noise was still there


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

jimmie57 said:


> Have you looked around your house to see if there is a second ground rod in the ground and anything connected to it. I remember way back when I installed a CB radio antenna and we drove a second ground rod into the ground but nothing was connected to it except the CB antenna. The antenna has been down for years now.


What do you think? I don't see any mention of when this started but if he's getting the same problem on two AVR systems what else can it be but a grounding problem? What other commonality is there? Other than the power source. In one post the TS says he took the coax off the "box" and the problem disappeared. I think *AntAltMike* makes a good argument. Thing is, we don't know when this started. Did this noise occur before or after the PS receptacle was installed? We don't know.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I did that and the noise was still there


How long ago was that PS receptacle installed?

Rich


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> What do you think? I don't see any mention of when this started but if he's getting the same problem on two AVR systems what else can it be but a grounding problem? What other commonality is there? Other than the power source. In one post the TS says he took the coax off the "box" and the problem disappeared. I think *AntAltMike* makes a good argument. Thing is, we don't know when this started. Did this noise occur before or after the PS receptacle was installed? We don't know.
> 
> Rich


I dont think there is a second ground rod. This is my father's house and it was built in the mid 80's. But let's forget about the ps receptacle for a second. The downstairs is still making an awful noise and it has your standard receptacles on the circuit. Never had an aftermarket receptacle ever. So this makes me think it's ground related as well?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I dont think there is a second ground rod. This is my father's house and it was built in the mid 80's. But let's forget about the ps receptacle for a second. The downstairs is still making an awful noise and it has your standard receptacles on the circuit. Never had an aftermarket receptacle ever. So this makes me think it's ground related as well?


Do you have a meter that can check the voltage ? I had a problem once ( did not cause a high pitched noise ) that my electric voltage was up to 140. I got the power company out and they said I had lost the Neutral Leg ?. They cut off the main connections coming into the house and found out it was still 135. They checked my neighbor and found out theirs was the same. One of the guys left and called back when he got to where he was going. The 2 of them kept talking and the voltage went down every few minutes until it got to 120.
I feel like this had caused 2 AVRs and a Subwoofer and 1 TV to burn out way too early, especially since I have not had any of those problems since.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> Do you have a meter that can check the voltage ? I had a problem once ( did not cause a high pitched noise ) that my electric voltage was up to 140. I got the power company out and they said I had lost the Neutral Leg ?. They cut off the main connections coming into the house and found out it was still 135. They checked my neighbor and found out theirs was the same. One of the guys left and called back when he got to where he was going. The 2 of them kept talking and the voltage went down every few minutes until it got to 120.
> I feel like this had caused 2 AVRs and a Subwoofer and 1 TV to burn out way too early, especially since I have not had any of those problems since.


Voltage is good. About 118-119


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> How long ago was that PS receptacle installed?
> 
> Rich


Last year maybe?


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

The user (un)friendly image insertion tool doesn't work on half the images I try to post.

Here is the image from someone else's post. It is a lousy diagram because it does not show how EMF can be developed across the loop because it does not show resistance on the ground interconnection between the two outlets.

















These two images are damn good, but I'm not sure if they'll post or not. I see that the second, matching drawing is now at the bottom of this post.

http://www.channld.com/goodloop.gif







www.channld.com/badloop.gif

You can put them on audio lines, too. Here is a picture of one that can be put on your audio RCA cables, but in my limited experience with them, the ones I tried didn't have as good of a frequency response as I had hoped.










Here is what the ground loop isolator that I advised you to try does. It simply has capacitors on both conductors.










Alternatively, we sometimes could use a pair of 300 ohm flat lead to 75 ohm coax "matching baluns" back to back, if they were the transformer type and eif their inputs and outputs were electrically isolated, but you are much better off with the new capacitor-type ones if coax ground interruption is what you need.

Here is another shot at me posting the image of the 5-2,400 MHz filter for the DirecTV receiver coax.










That ground interruptor can work on a coax that is not carrying DC power. It can't be used with old DirecTV receivers that sourced and switched their LNBs by impressing 13VDC and 18V on the LNB downlead, but it can be used with all modern DirecTV receivers. That kind of product probably does not exist for HDMI cable, which has at least five ground conductors in it.

*You need to go to the DirecTV receiver and unscrew the coax and see if that makes the sound go away. If it does, then inserting the ground loop isolator on the receiver coax will break the ground loop just as surely as disconnecting the coax does.*

This one should be just below the second picture, but I can't move it.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> The user (un)friendly image insertion tool doesn't work on half the images I try to post.
> 
> Here is the image from someone else's post. It is a lousy diagram because it does not show how EMF can be developed across the loop because it does not show resistance on the ground interconnection between the two outlets.
> 
> ...


Unplugging the coax makes the noise go away for sure


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Btw Rich, unplugging the ground from the meter makes the noise upstairs worse. Changes it to a high pitch noise like the downstairs


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Unplugging the coax makes the noise go away for sure


Then the problem is solved. For $16.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> Then the problem is solved. For $16.


So is this like a band aid fix or the only solution? I want to try to fix the disease and not just the symptoms if that makes any sense


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Rich said:


> He'd have to clarify his suggestion. I just reread what he wrote and I'm not sure what he meant. Did you put a normal receptacle in place of the other one?
> 
> Rich


I replaced the receptacle upstairs, but no change


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So is this like a band aid fix or the only solution? I want to try to fix the disease and not just the symptoms if that makes any sense


It is the professional way to fix it. I have serviced several thousand television systems that included audio speakers. I have done commercial work for broadcast television stations, for franchised cable companies and for radio stations, and I even did field installations for the Washington, DC facilities of ESPN and CNN. A ground isolator or interrupter is the way to go, when it works for you, believe me.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> It is the professional way to fix it. I have serviced several thousand television systems that included audio speakers. I have done commercial work for broadcast television stations, for franchised cable companies and for radio stations, and I even did field installations for the Washington, DC facilities of ESPN and CNN. A ground isolator or interrupter is the way to go, when it works for you, believe me.


That's all I needed to hear. I appreciate it!! I will let everyone know when it comes in


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> That's all I needed to hear. I appreciate it!! I will let everyone know when it comes in


And if it doesn't work, I'll just change screen names.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> And if it doesn't work, I'll just change screen names.


Hahaha if it does work I'm gonna wire transfer money to everyone who helped


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Isolation transformer will be here Saturday. Quick question. What would happen or would it make a difference if I extended the wire that is connected to my meter and ran it to the ground wire on a receptacle in the house thus ensuring it is grounded to the house main. Just to try out of curiosity?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

big spark and tripping RCCB/RCD [residual-current circuit breaker]


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

P Smith said:


> big spark and tripping RCB [residual circuit breaker]


Really?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

see these diagrams - ground loop is creating different voltage on both sides of the loop,
so when you will connect those points by thick wire, it will produce the spark;

new RCCB (in Europe it's mandatory breakers) will sense a current/voltage delta on the ground and neutral wires, while hot wire does cut off by normal switch (from my practice - involuntary connecting neutral wire and ground wire in receptacle or a lamp's socket tripping the RCCB)
British code force having a switch in each receptacle, BTW


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Isolation transformer will be here Saturday. Quick question. What would happen or would it make a difference if I extended the wire that is connected to my meter and ran it to the ground wire on a receptacle in the house thus ensuring it is grounded to the house main. Just to try out of curiosity?


Being grounded isn't the root of your problem. As you have demonstrated with your damaged cord (missing the ground pin), lifting the ground helped with your problem (you broke the loop).

The issue that causes ground loops is MULTIPLE paths to ground. Adding yet another path to ground is more likely to create more problems than solve the problems you have.

Your isolation transformer breaks a loop. There may be additional loops in your system. Finding and eliminating them all is the only way to eliminate every hum.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

P Smith said:


> see these diagrams - ground loop is creating different voltage on both sides of the loop,
> so when you will connect those points by thick wire, it will produce the spark;
> 
> new RCCB (in Europe it's mandatory breakers) will sense a current/voltage delta on the ground and neutral wires, while hot wire does cut off by normal switch (from my practice - involuntary connecting neutral wire and ground wire in receptacle or a lamp's socket tripping the RCCB)
> British code force having a switch in each receptacle, BTW


Hmm thanks that's interesting. I figured since they are both ground wires connecting them would not cause a spark or trip the breaker


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

James Long said:


> Being grounded isn't the root of your problem. As you have demonstrated with your damaged cord (missing the ground pin), lifting the ground helped with your problem (you broke the loop).
> 
> The issue that causes ground loops is MULTIPLE paths to ground. Adding yet another path to ground is more likely to create more problems than solve the problems you have.
> 
> Your isolation transformer breaks a loop. There may be additional loops in your system. Finding and eliminating them all is the only way to eliminate every hum.


Gotcha looking forward to getting this fixed


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Isolation transformer will be here Saturday.


If you ordered the isolator I recommended, then it surely is not a transformer. It uses capacitors as DC blocks. Notice that it is substantially physically larger than the previous models because the higher value capacitors, which drop the minimum pass frequency from 10 MHz to 5 MHz, are physically larger.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

I have seen ground problems where I have lifted the ground and put a volt meter where the ground wire was and seen a trace amount of voltage. That is a good demonstration that there was another ground path and the path I disconnected was not an equal ground. One path to ground normally solves these problems.


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Hmm thanks that's interesting. I figured since they are both ground wires connecting them would not cause a spark or trip the breaker


I don't think that there will be a spark. The difference in potential will be too low.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

AntAltMike said:


> If you ordered the isolator I recommended, then it surely is not a transformer. It uses capacitors as DC blocks. Notice that it is substantially physically larger than the previous models because the higher value capacitors, which drop the minimum pass frequency from 10 MHz to 5 MHz, are physically larger.


I did order the one you recommended. The Amazon listing says isolation transformer so that's why i called it that


AntAltMike said:


> If you ordered the isolator I recommended, then it surely is not a transformer. It uses capacitors as DC blocks. Notice that it is substantially physically larger than the previous models because the higher value capacitors, which drop the minimum pass frequency from 10 MHz to 5 MHz, are physically larger.


I did order the one you recommended. The Amazon listing says isolation transformer so that is why I called it that. 
This one correct? https://www.amazon.com/Isolation-Tr...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=N6AKQRV9YBZNZG97YEB4


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

So let's pretend for a second that I don't have Directv, but I wanted to get it installed next week. How do you avoid getting a ground loop?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So let's pretend for a second that I don't have Directv, but I wanted to get it installed next week. How do you avoid getting a ground loop?


As Mike mentioned - be sure all your ground wires coming to one point - ground rod at your house's electrical entrance.
Or (hypothetically speaking) connect ALL power plugs/grounding of your DTV/AVR/TV devices to ONE receptacle. Include PI feeding DC to LNB.


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

But even with one point grounding, you can still develop enough "loop impedance" to enable your unintended loop antenna to develop a hum just because the resistance of the ground paths is not exactly equal. One point grounding is the starting point to a hum free audio, but not always the entire solution. If you have a hum in a system with one point grounding, you then look for "lateral" ground path interconnections and interrupt them, which is what this ground isolator or ground interruptor component will be doing.

Capacitive ground loop interruptors are often mistakenly called transformers. When you receive yours, you will be able to tell if it is a transformer by placing an ohmmeter across the IF connector terminals on each end.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Mike, he is not going to prepare to PhD deep theoretical research  - OP need practical solution, while theoretically I'm agree with you. 
Just that low difference in a length of ground wires shouldn't create practically sensible level of hum... IMO


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

Almost everyone is grounded at a single point - the ground rod for their house - but that doesn't prevent ground loops. As AntAltMike says if you end up with different ground references that's the most common cause. That can happen due to varying impedance, improper installation, or devices that attempt to defeat/isolate the ground like that PS2 Audio receptacle.

If different length of wiring could cause it, almost everyone would have ground loops because the distance from any given outlet back to your electrical panel (where all the grounds are connected to a bus bar which is then connected to the house ground) will vary. As will the distance to the ground block from any given coaxial cable.

If replacing that PS2 Audio receptacle didn't do the trick, there may be a bad/loose ground somewhere. I'd take an outlet tester and test every outlet in the house. If just one has a poor ground, it could affect the rest if something is plugged into it. Unfortunately there's no way to check light fixtures in this way. Anecdotally, I've read that a bad GFCI receptacle can cause problems, so that's another thing to check. Theoretically I suppose you could check for a difference in the ground off each breaker to identify any potential problem circuits, but you'd have to pull the panel cover and poking around in there is probably not the best idea...

Another thing to consider is that it is quite possible to have audio ground loops that have nothing to do with the electrical system per se. If you have audio devices that don't have a ground pin they have no ground reference other than what they obtain from the incoming audio. Other devices have a ground pin, but some will use that as an audio ground reference and some will maintain a separate audio ground reference (that's typically what higher end gear using balanced audio should do, though a lot of them get it wrong) That's why people end up doing stuff like using ground lift plugs on gear that's supposed to be grounded, because they get a problem they can't solve so they take the "brute force" fix.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Isolation transformer will be here Saturday. Quick question. What would happen or would it make a difference if I extended the wire that is connected to my meter and ran it to the ground wire on a receptacle in the house thus ensuring it is grounded to the house main. Just to try out of curiosity?


Wait for the isolator. Don't try fixing this yourself. If this works and I hope it does, you should get someone out to find out exactly what caused this.

About the concern for multiple ground rods on a home, I do see the need for those rods to be "bonded". In a chemical factory environment all the ground rods are bonded to each other (well, we tried to do that) so things like we see in this thread can't happen. The problem we see in this thread might not be life threatening but bonding ground rods is still the right thing to do. Improper grounding in a chemical factory could be catastrophic.

Rich


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

slice1900 said:


> If different length of wiring could cause it, almost everyone would have ground loops because the distance from any given outlet back to your electrical panel (where all the grounds are connected to a bus bar which is then connected to the house ground) will vary. As will the distance to the ground block from any given coaxial cable.


It is important to remember that a ground loop is a LOOP. Wire distance from two pieces of equipment back to the ground becomes an issue when you connect the "ground" of each of those pieces of equipment together (perhaps with an AV cable that has a ground or coax). Equipment in the same room connected to the same outlet brings the single point those devices share closer to the equipment. Equipment in multiple rooms leads to problems. Not because of the ground wire difference between the two locations but because of the larger loop created when those devices are connected together using an AV cable or coax.

I agree with Mike that everything connected to the same outlet is not the end of the story nor a guarantee that there will be no loops or hum. But it is a good start. One step at a time break all loops until the remaining hum is not noticeable or eliminated.

I was fortunate that when I was fighting hum professionally it was in a facility with balanced audio. It was very easy to create a ground loop between systems in different rooms. The first thing I learned was not to create loops. And then the work continued to eliminate any loops created by others.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Thank you everyone for all of the valuable information. Like I said the hopeful fix will be here Saturday. If that fixes it I don't think I'll poke around anymore although the it does bug me there there is a problem somewhere. There is a pipe running into the bottom of my meter and into the ground. Is that my ground rod? Feels more like plastic than copper though but I figured that was it


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Thank you everyone for all of the valuable information. Like I said the hopeful fix will be here Saturday. If that fixes it I don't think I'll poke around anymore although the it does bug me there there is a problem somewhere. There is a pipe running into the bottom of my meter and into the ground. Is that my ground rod? Feels more like plastic than copper though but I figured that was it


Check it with a magnet. Of course if it is a copper pipe it will not be magnetic either.

I had an installer hook my ground to the spigot on the side of the house once. He evidently did not pay attention or did not know that you can not do that when all the piping in the house is plastic.

My ground rod is a half inch or five eights inch copper rod 8 feet long, driven into the ground for all but 2 inches of it. The grass hides it most of the time.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> Check it with a magnet. Of course if it is a copper pipe it will not be magnetic either.
> 
> I had an installer hook my ground to the spigot on the side of the house once. He evidently did not pay attention or did not know that you can not do that when all the piping in the house is plastic.
> 
> My ground rod is a half inch or five eights inch copper rod 8 feet long, driven into the ground for all but 2 inches of it. The grass hides it most of the time.


Definitely not magnetic. That has to be it though right?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Definitely not magnetic. That has to be it though right?


If it is copper you could scrape it with a knife or file, etc. to expose the copper color since it is possibly painted over.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> If it is copper you could scrape it with a knife or file, etc. to expose the copper color since it is possibly painted over.


I might try that. Perhaps also a ground rod wasn't installed when this house was built?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Sorry that it is dark, but i attached a couple of photos showing the meter and the Directv grounding block


I saved the pic you posted so I could zoom in on it and that looks like galvanized conduit pipe close to the ground. It should be magnetic.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> I saved the pic you posted so I could zoom in on it and that looks like galvanized conduit pipe close to the ground. It should be magnetic.


I put a magnet to it but it wasn't magnetic. The bottom part is the old color of our house. We had it repainted green which is why the top is green lol


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## AntAltMike (Nov 21, 2004)

Believe me, the meter is grounded by a big, big sucker ground wire that is probably zero gauge or bigger. It may well be in that plastic conduit.

FYI, prior to the 2002 revision of the code, you could clamp to a cold water pipe anywhere. Now, in an individual residence, you can only connect to it within 5 feet of where it enters the building, but in a multiple dwelling unit you can connect to it anywhere where it is electrically continuous provided it is substantially exposed over its length and is professionally maintained. In my house, I'd connect to any cold water pipe that I knew to be electrically continuous, because I don't fear the mattress tag police moonlighting as NEC Code enforcement and arresting me.

Now, will someone PUH-LEEZE lock this thread before any more bright ideas get posted that detract from the useful information already contained herein?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

The thread will remain open so Evan can respond and the discussion can continue.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

I'm not going to try anything fancy guys I'll just let you know if the isolator works. Thanks again everyone


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I'm not going to try anything fancy guys I'll just let you know if the isolator works. Thanks again everyone


I feel confident that the part you bought will fix your problem. Some of these guys really know their stuff. When it comes to electricity I can only tell what I have seen in the past at mine or my second son's house.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> I feel confident that the part you bought will fix your problem. Some of these guys really know their stuff. When it comes to electricity I can only tell what I have seen in the past at mine or my second son's house.


I am confident as well Jimmie! I'm glad I opened this thread. I enjoy learning new information regarding audio and video


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Evan Spurlock said:


> I am confident as well Jimmie!


So far, I see it as 50-50 chances


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

P Smith said:


> So far, I see it as 50-50 chances


Hahahaha yeah give or take a little


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Hey guys. So the isolator worked. We have a splitter downstairs with one input and 2 outputs. One output goes to the swim and the other goes to the box. The only way I could get the high pitch sound to disappear was to connect the isolator in-between the splitter and the swim and not in the back of the box like thought it would go. This is correct? Is the swim adapter possibly bad?


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Also, while the high pitch noise is gone, there is still a buzz. When I tried connecting it to the back of the box the buzz the reduce, but I don't have picture. It says there is no connection.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Also, while the high pitch noise is gone, there is still a buzz. When I tried connecting it to the back of the box the buzz the reduce, but I don't have picture. It says there is no connection.


*the buzz is reduced


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Also, while the high pitch noise is gone, there is still a buzz. When I tried connecting it to the back of the box the buzz the reduce, but I don't have picture. It says there is no connection.


No connection or No signal is usually a TV message. You might have to change the Input in the TV using the TV menu settings.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> No connection or No signal is usually a TV message. You might have to change the Input in the TV using the TV menu settings.


This message is pretty much saying there is no DirecTV connected. I tried it upstairs on my box and it worked fine. Got rid of my noise and I have picture


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> This message is pretty much saying there is no DirecTV connected. I tried it upstairs on my box and it worked fine. Got rid of my noise and I have picture


Sorry about that. I have never seen that message. Your TV must be remembering what that HDMI is connected to.
I am sure you did this already, but, did you check the orientation of the filter to make sure it was not in backwards ?


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> Sorry about that. I have never seen that message. Your TV must be remembering what that HDMI is connected to.
> I am sure you did this already, but, did you check the orientation of the filter to make sure it was not in backwards ?


Yes I did. I even completely got rid of the swim and the splitter and went straight into the box and still no picture?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Yes I did. I even completely got rid of the swim and the splitter and went straight into the box and still no picture?


I looked but did not find the model number of the DirecTV Box ? What model receiver is this and what is the one that works ?


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> I looked but did not find the model number of the DirecTV Box ? What model receiver is this and what is the one that works ?


It's an HR54 and the one that works is a 4k genie.


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> It's an HR54 and the one that works is a 4k genie.


Thanks.
I am wondering if the fact that the 54 is sending power out to the LNB if that is causing it to not work. Since it is sending power out the filter might need to be turned around ?
Just a guess, but it might ruin the filter.

AltAntMike or someone else will have to help with this.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> Thanks.
> I am wondering if the fact that the 54 is sending power out to the LNB if that is causing it to not work. Since it is sending power out the filter might need to be turned around ?
> Just a guess, but it might ruin the filter.
> 
> AltAntMike or someone else will have to help with this.


Right now it's connected in between the splitter and the swim adapter and I have picture and no high pitch noise, but like I said there is still a buzz. I'm confused as to why it has to be connected there to get rid of the high pitch sound


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> Right now it's connected in between the splitter and the swim adapter and I have picture and no high pitch noise, but like I said there is still a buzz. I'm confused as to why it has to be connected there to get rid of the high pitch sound


What does the Swim adapter look like ? Are you calling the Power Inserter the swim adapter ? Can you see the name / model number of the swim adapter ?
The 54 has the power inserter built into it so the additional external one is not needed.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> What does the Swim adapter look like ? Are you calling the Power Inserter the swim adapter ? Can you see the name / model number of the swim adapter ?
> The 54 has the power inserter built into it so the additional external one is not needed.


It says connect home adapter but also has swim on it. It's what allows us to have internet to watch on demand on all the tv's.


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> It says connect home adapter but also has swim on it. It's what allows us to have internet to watch on demand on all the tv's.


OK, I am pretty sure that is what is commonly called the DECA unit, Ethernet over coax. It does what you said.


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> OK, I am pretty sure that is what is commonly called the DECA unit, Ethernet over coax. It does what you said.


So it's not needed?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Evan Spurlock said:


> So it's not needed?


It has that built in but some installers put them in like yours is.
I can not tell you to take it out or the steps to set it up if you did take it out.
Link to specs of your 54.
DIRECTV Genie RVU Server for Whole Home HD-DVR Receiver (HR54) from Solid Signal


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## Evan Spurlock (Oct 16, 2018)

jimmie57 said:


> It has that built in but some installers put them in like yours is.
> I can not tell you to take it out or the steps to set it up if you did take it out.
> Link to specs of your 54.
> DIRECTV Genie RVU Server for Whole Home HD-DVR Receiver (HR54) from Solid Signal


I took it out and connected Ethernet straight into the back of the 54 and it's working. Now I just gotta figured out how to get the isolator working cause I still have a buzz


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