# C-Band at the End?



## Nick

FWIW, I saw this in today's SkyReport


> *C-Band at the End?
> *
> Looks like the consumer C-Band business will be dead and gone by the end of this year. After hearing from several retailers about rumors that Motorola would cease its authorization stream, we started making inquires. No response from Motorola but Mike Monfort of National Programming Service (NPS) confirms that the demise is likely.
> 
> "We had a conference call in late December when Motorola talked about discontinuing the authorization stream on April 15th," Monfort says. After some protests and concerted lobbying, the giant manufacturer boosted prices by 20%, agreed to continue service until the end of the year and said they will then decide the future.
> 
> Motorola will almost certainly discontinue the service, Monfort says, so his National Programming Service (NPS) has ceased selling annual subscriptions. That's bad news for many retailers and C-Band's current 22,606 subscribers. "The people who are left love their C-Band," Monfort says. But Motorola apparently finds the business inconvenient ... and so an era is coming to an end.


*SkyReport*


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## BattleZone

With only 22,606 customers nationwide, I can see how it isn't profitable to keep going.

My first sat job was installing C-band dishes in 1987...


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## Greg Bimson

There may be more to the story. Other places have stated that NPS may simply be looking to get out of the C-Band business, as their competitors have stated there isn't an issue with staying in the C-Band business.


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## jeffgbailey

the truth is nps is in bed with Charlie and now he wants a ring



> There seems to be some misinformation going on that Motorola will be ending c band support as of the end of the year. This is not true. NPS is getting out of selling c band subscriptions and lieing to convert people over to Dish Network.
> 
> I called NPS twice today and they told me these lie's and wanted me to convert. I called SRL and they told me this is not true. I then called Skyvision and had a nice conversation with Mike Kohl about this. Mike's exact words were "hogwash" NPS has made a deal with the devil and is trying to sell there remaining customers to Charlie.
> 
> Mike also said that he will be talking about this whole issue on Friday night on Access America. He went into other details but I'll let him tell everything this Friday.
> 
> The bottom line is if your not with SRL or Skyvision renew your subscriptions with them as soon as your subs with NPS run out. I will be doing this.
> 
> Do not bite on NPS's offers to transition you to dish network. They are pulling a Superstar, Netlink, Turnervision.





> Mike Mountford is blowing smoke in his letter. Motorola is not ending support for c band at year end. I spoke with Mike Kohl yesterday at Skyvision, Both Skyvision and SRL have been in contact with Motorola and this is false information NPS is selling.
> 
> NPS got a 20% increase in there fee's they pay to Motorola in January (For ACC tier bit access I would guess) NPS is also in a no contract situation with A&E networks so those channels are on the line.
> 
> *The deal with the devil (as Mike Kohl call's it) has been sealed with Charlie Ergen of Dish Network. NPS gets a Bounty from Charlie for every C band subscriber he turns over to them. NPS is getting out of the c band business at year end and closing it's doors.*
> 
> Motorola is not happy with the lies NPS is spreading for there own benefit. Nps may be facing legal action for this.
> 
> If I would have to sum it up, NPS contact from Mr Mountford you got adding what I know. NPS contract ran out Jan 1st for tier bit access. They had till April 15 to pay the increases and renew. They refused to pay the 20% increase and got Motorola to extend it till Dec 31st for a smaller fee. Probably the 7% increase they raised programming in February. They figured the only way to win is to sell there customer base to Charlie Ergen getting a finders fee for each fool who converts.
> 
> Skyvision and SRL are under different contracts with Motorola , HITS (Comcast) and the programmers. They are not effected by anything NPS does with Motorola.
> 
> The bad part about this is there hard sell to Dishnet and lies they offer as far as the skys are going dark are not good business decisions for c band consumers.


more info is here


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## loudo

May my 12 foot Paraclipse rest in peace. Used it from 1978 until 2003.


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## Nick

R.I.P. you Princes of the Sky, but keep looking up, for one day you may receive a signal from the stars.


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## Chris Blount

loudo said:


> May my 12 foot Paraclipse rest in peace. Used it from 1978 until 2003.


Used mine from 1993 to 2000. Installed it myself. The best years I ever had scanning the sky. RIP


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## Lincoln6Echo

Chris Blount said:


> Used mine from 1993 to 2000. Installed it myself. The best years I ever had scanning the sky. RIP


You take pictures like my mom....subject off centered and cropped at the edges. She'll take pictures of landmark buildings and she'll cut the top off of the roof or steeple or whatever, but she'll get plenty of ground below the base of the building. Or vice versa. Cut the bottom off, but get plenty of empty sky.


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## dengland

loudo said:


> May my 12 foot Paraclipse rest in peace. Used it from 1978 until 2003.


My 12 foot lived until the 2004 hurricanes: Charley, Frances and Jeanne. It then turned into braces for my garage door. (Before the storms.)


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## Chris Blount

Lincoln6Echo said:


> You take pictures like my mom....subject off centered and cropped at the edges. She'll take pictures of landmark buildings and she'll cut the top off of the roof or steeple or whatever, but she'll get plenty of ground below the base of the building. Or vice versa. Cut the bottom off, but get plenty of empty sky.


Lighten up. The picture was taken for a computer wallpaper. Having the sky and trees was intentional.


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## SayWhat?

loudo said:


> May my 12 foot Paraclipse rest in peace. Used it from 1978 until 2003.


Looks like a head banger while cutting the grass.


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## loudo

SayWhat? said:


> Looks like a head banger while cutting the grass.


It wasn't to bad, the picture was taken in the grass mowing position. This is also an older photo, before I converted it to a Horizon to Horizon mount and tripod mount for the LNB.

My favorite things watched on it were the sports back hauls and Canadian Networks.


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## Richard King

My old 10' Unimesh Perf Minnesota dish. I used it for both C and KU band from about 1989 to 1996, when I moved to Florida. The last time I drove by the house, last September it was still there. It's a bit up in the air which made for interesting times clearing snow off the dish.  This was my first installation when I got into the satelllite business.


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## Richard King

Some interesting installs that I did over the years: http://www.pbase.com/rking401/satellite_installs&page=all


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## TheRatPatrol

So is there anything left on C-Band that isn't encrypted? Can you still order channels?

I always thought CB was better, you were getting the uncompressed signals directly from the network, you could get almost every channel available, and you didn't have to worry about whether or not your provider was going to carry the channel, no "middle man".

With all of these carriage disagreements lately, it would be kind of nice if we could go back to those days.


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## Sparky Scott

does that have anything to do with th ku band on the big sats. the ones that are combined with the c band?


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## gomezma1

They are giving these dishes away down here in San Antone. Are they still usefull for C band FTA?


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## Jtaylor1

We'll, there's always Ku-Band.

Will this affect digital networks (ie. Retro Television Network and This TV) and the broadcast stations that carry them?


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## Davenlr

gomezma1 said:


> They are giving these dishes away down here in San Antone. Are they still usefull for C band FTA?


Heck yeah... All 6 major networks, PBS HD, Nasa, lots of Sports feeds, News channels... there is a lot to watch. Most of it in HD if you have the right receiver. When something important happens, like the earthquake in Haiti, it was on FTA live before anywhere. If you can swing the price of a receiver, grab one of those free dishes. I have a 6'er and a 10'er.


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## james hyde

wow!that is a very bis satllite dish the dish at my house is smaller then that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## bruin95

gomezma1 said:


> They are giving these dishes away down here in San Antone. Are they still usefull for C band FTA?


You could very well watch all CBS NFL games in the clear via C-band. Lots of other sports wild feeds. That alone makes having a C-band dish worth it.


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## Sparky Scott

I've always used my 9' spun aluminuim dish for news feeds 3:00-5:30 p.m. nbc patches there feeds on there in regions eastern, central,so on


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## Nick

Not to:beatdeadhorse: but there is a follow-up editorial by _Evie Haskell_ in today's SkyReport.


> *SkyBOX: A C-Band Saga*
> 
> by Evie Haskell -- 2/8/2010
> 
> Here's a story about a once-great business, the inexorable march of technology and the arrogance ... to say nothing of the destructive power ... of monopolies.
> 
> The first hints of serious disease trickled into my mailbox early last week. We hear, they said, that the C-Band business is going out of business .... We hear that *Motorola* will kill it by ceasing to support of C-Band authorizations.
> 
> Now Motorola is, of course, the ONLY support for C-Band authorizations. It wound up with that monopoly via its take over of *General Instruments*, the former "VideoCypher" C-Band monopoly, in 1999. It has profited handsomely from the C-Band business which, at its pre-Motorola peak, numbered nearly 2.4 million subscribers.
> 
> But, as in many things Motorola, the company has given this business only token support, being content to milk the revenue stream from far flung subscribers as the newer little dish services soaked up subscribers in more urban/suburban settings. Today the big dish has fewer than 23,000 subscribers ... but the revenues still come in. Would Motorola cut that off?
> 
> I called Motorola PR honcho Jennifer Erickson. I left a message. I wrote an email. I got no response so I called a few more times and ... bingo! ... Ms. Erickson answered her phone. I made my query and she said, in essence, "What's C-Band?" She said she would check the rumors out. She said she would call me back.
> 
> That call never came. So I tried Mike Mountford at *NPS*. And he gave me the scoop: Yes, Motorola is likely to discontinue its support of C-Band authorizations at the end of this year. There's a glimmer of hope, but Mountford's NPS has stopped selling annual subscriptions.
> 
> So I wrote a story on that (along the way completely mangling the spelling of Mr. Mountford's last name ... urgh! my apologies.) And I got a lot of response to that story. And guess what? Some of that response came from programmers who had been planning new C-Band feeds. Some of it came from folks who service C-Band equipment. One message admonished me to tell "both sides of the story." (And if the author of that email would tell me what this story is missing, I most certainly will.) But none of it ... nothing ... nada ... came from Motorola.
> 
> So we're talking about people's lives, and business plans, and 22,606 households who just love those big dishes. But we're also talking about Motorola which is, apparently, too big to be bothered.


Source: *SkyReport*


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## matt

I want one. C-Band always seemed cool to me, I hope it stays around to when I move next year and it is worth the time/effort to install it.


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## Jtaylor1

But that would mean that cable will be gone as well if C-band is going out of business. Cable Networks will just go to the Web.

To me, Television is on it's last leg since people use the internet to watch shows.


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## SayWhat?

Jtaylor1 said:


> To me, Television is on it's last leg since people use the internet to watch shows.


Some do, but that will likely never be possible in most of the country. The infrastructure just isn't there.


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## loudo

Jtaylor1 said:


> But that would mean that cable will be gone as well if C-band is going out of business. Cable Networks will just go to the Web.
> 
> To me, Television is on it's last leg since people use the internet to watch shows.


C-Band home delivery is going out of business. There will still be a lot of use of C & KU band for network delivery and back hauls of programing.

I don't think you will see the majority of people watching TV via the Internet for a while, if ever. Eventually we might see home delivery of full cable or satellite packages, via the Internet and sent to a TV, but, at this time I would say television is a far cry from being on it's last leg. If I have a choice of watching the Super Bowl on my 20" computer monitor, or my 65" HDTV, the computer gets shut off.


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## matt

I dislike watching TV on the computer, or even movies for that matter. I just have a laptop here. The internet is too slow, the screen is too small, and the case gets too hot. Plus, why fill up my little hard drive with recordings?


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## bruin95

loudo said:


> C-Band home delivery is going out of business. There will still be a lot of use of C & KU band for network delivery and back hauls of programing.


Exactly. Some people are panicking for no reason.



> I don't think you will see the majority of people watching TV via the Internet for a while, if ever. Eventually we might see home delivery of full cable or satellite packages, via the Internet and sent to a TV, but, at this time I would say television is a far cry from being on it's last leg. If I have a choice of watching the Super Bowl on my 20" computer monitor, or my 65" HDTV, the computer gets shut off.


There are plenty of people, including myself, who are watching streaming "internet TV" on their big screens right now. There are plenty of plug and play devices that let you do this easily.


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## CJTE

SayWhat? said:


> Some do, but that will likely never be possible in most of the country. The infrastructure just isn't there.


Ehh... I wouldn't say its not there, so much as it's not available/connected just yet.
http://www.voip-news.com/feature/google-dark-fiber-050707/
http://news.cnet.com/Google wants dark fiber/2100-1034_3-5537392.html


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## loudo

bruin95 said:


> Exactly. Some people are panicking for no reason.
> 
> There are plenty of people, including myself, who are watching streaming "internet TV" on their big screens right now. There are plenty of plug and play devices that let you do this easily.


The issue will be educating people that it is there, and how to use it. Very few people with the HRx DirecTV series receivers even know you can use it to watch Internet TV. I have showed several friends it and they were really surprised it could be done. Currently, a lot of us techy people know about it but the average DVR customer doesn't have a clue or could care less about it. They just want to use the receiver for watching satellite programing.


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## bidger

loudo said:


> If I have a choice of watching the Super Bowl on my 20" computer monitor, or my 65" HDTV, the computer gets shut off.





bruin95 said:


> There are plenty of people, including myself, who are watching streaming "internet TV" on their big screens right now. There are plenty of plug and play devices that let you do this easily.


Yup, I use my Vista Ult. MCE PC connected to the 46" SONY for ATSC HD shows and come Friday I'm having Roadrunner installed so that should help with the lag I experience while trying to view hi res web casts.

The folks who say they don't want to watch video over their PC on a 20" monitor aren't taking into account that bigger HD sets have a myriad of options for connecting a PC.

Sorry for the sidetrack since this thread is about C-Band.


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## jodavis

Jtaylor1 said:


> But that would mean that cable will be gone as well if C-band is going out of business. Cable Networks will just go to the Web.
> 
> To me, Television is on it's last leg since people use the internet to watch shows.


Broadcast Video (TV) will not be going anywhere for a while. There is no more efficient way to get a video stream to hundreds of millions of people. 106 million people watched the Super Bowl yesterday. at 20Mbps that would requre 2.12 * 10^6 Gbps to stream. This amount of throughput would be hugely expensive. According to Ben Drawbaugh of Engadget the current breakeven point is about a million viewers at that point classic broadcast tecnologies become cheaper than internet streaming.


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## TXD16

I miss my long-gone 10.5' C-band BUD and Shaun Kenny.


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## loudo

zkc16 said:


> I miss my long-gone 10.5' C-band BUD and Shaun Kenny.


Well then this will bring back some memories:


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## xtc

so C-band is just the name for the programming you get with the giant satellite dishes before DBS came along? what programming can you get with those vs. what you can with DirecTV, Dish Network, FiOS and Cable? Why would someone want to use that instead? is it just the crappy free over the air stuff in non-English countries?


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## loudo

xtc said:


> so C-band is just the name for the programming you get with the giant satellite dishes before DBS came along? what programming can you get with those vs. what you can with DirecTV, Dish Network, FiOS and Cable?


C-Band is actually the name given to the frequency band of the receivers that are used to pick up the signals. There were several different companies that sold programing for the C-Band receivers, with packages similar to what DirecTV and DISH offer today. I think there is only one company left today and that is the one mentioned here, NPS. If you go to programming on their web site, you will see what you can get for programing. They currently offers a lot less than they did years ago. Here is their web site: http://www.callnps.com/



xtc said:


> Why would someone want to use that instead? is it just the crappy free over the air stuff in non-English countries?


Actually C-Band was around before either DirecTV or DISH, so many people who lived in rural areas as well as a few city dwellers bought C-Band equipment. In the early days nothing was scrambled and all you needed was a receiver. As they became more popular the scrambled and you needed a Motorola 4DTV receiver and subscription to receive the programing offered by DirecTV and DISH. There was still a lot of things that were unscrambled, News Feeds, sports backhauls (Feeds from the event back to the studios), International programing and Network (ABC, CBS, etc, sent to the local stations for rebroadcast) feeds. Eventually most of those became scrambled. Then the KU band started being used to send video and many of us retrofitted our dishes to receive their signals. I used to watch a lot of news feeds being sent from scenes to the networks. I specifically remember watching things like the live feeds from the Oakland California fire storms. Before the Sunday Ticket package we used to be able to watch the back haul of any football game, which used to be unscrambled.

I had my C-Band system from 1978 till 2003, when I sold the system.


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## xtc

loudo said:


> C-Band is actually the name given to the frequency band of the receivers that are used to pick up the signals. There were several different companies that sold programing for the C-Band receivers, with packages similar to what DirecTV and DISH offer today. I think there is only one company left today and that is the one mentioned here, NPS. If you go to programming on their web site, you will see what you can get for programing. They currently offers a lot less than they did years ago. Here is their web site: http://www.callnps.com/
> 
> Actually C-Band was around before either DirecTV or DISH, so many people who lived in rural areas as well as a few city dwellers bought C-Band equipment. In the early days nothing was scrambled and all you needed was a receiver. As they became more popular the scrambled and you needed a Motorola 4DTV receiver and subscription to receive the programing offered by DirecTV and DISH. There was still a lot of things that were unscrambled, News Feeds, sports backhauls (Feeds from the event back to the studios), International programing and Network (ABC, CBS, etc, sent to the local stations for rebroadcast) feeds. Eventually most of those became scrambled. Then the KU band started being used to send video and many of us retrofitted our dishes to receive their signals. I used to watch a lot of news feeds being sent from scenes to the networks. I specifically remember watching things like the live feeds from the Oakland California fire storms. Before the Sunday Ticket package we used to be able to watch the back haul of any football game, which used to be unscrambled.
> 
> I had my C-Band system from 1978 till 2003, when I sold the system.


Thanks for the info, so i checked out the programming and almost all of those channels listed are now available on DBS/cable/FiOs. So is there any benefit today to owning those big dishes, or have they become completely obsolete? And back in the day, you're saying one of the major benefits to owning the big Dishes was the ability to get channels that you would normally pay for with other services, but after they became scrambled, that benefit died. So other than that, what was the benefit of owning them? We always used to see sports bars have the dishes, but i guess now with all the NBA League Pass, Sunday Ticket, etc. packages available, that's obsolete as well.


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## loudo

xtc said:


> Thanks for the info, so i checked out the programming and almost all of those channels listed are now available on DBS/cable/FiOs. So is there any benefit today to owning those big dishes, or have they become completely obsolete? And back in the day, you're saying one of the major benefits to owning the big Dishes was the ability to get channels that you would normally pay for with other services, but after they became scrambled, that benefit died. So other than that, what was the benefit of owning them? We always used to see sports bars have the dishes, but i guess now with all the NBA League Pass, Sunday Ticket, etc. packages available, that's obsolete as well.


I would say that after NPS stops selling programing, the basic purpose for owning one would be for the hobbyist who like to surf the sky. I know when I had my system, and living in South Florida, we could watch TV from South and Central America. This was possible as we are on the out skirts of the foot prints of some of the South American satellites. We also received most of the CBC & CTV network feeds, from Canada. I think they are now scrambled though. One I retrofitted the dish for KU, I picked up a lot more stations.

Sunday ticket used to be on C-Band and at the beginning it was about $100 a year. Since DirecTV has taken it over, that has increase a bit.

I miss my system as it was fun just surfing around to see what you could find. I probably still would have my system, had I of not sold my house and moved.


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## lee635

That's not exactly true. With multicasting capabilities, the stream would go out on the backbone only once, then as it trunks down the line it would get replicated until it goes to individual receviers of the stream.



jodavis said:


> Broadcast Video (TV) will not be going anywhere for a while. There is no more efficient way to get a video stream to hundreds of millions of people. 106 million people watched the Super Bowl yesterday. at 20Mbps that would requre 2.12 * 10^6 Gbps to stream. This amount of throughput would be hugely expensive. According to Ben Drawbaugh of Engadget the current breakeven point is about a million viewers at that point classic broadcast tecnologies become cheaper than internet streaming.


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## jeffgbailey

loudo said:


> C-Band is actually the name given to the frequency band of the receivers that are used to pick up the signals. There were several different companies that sold programing for the C-Band receivers, with packages similar to what DirecTV and DISH offer today. I think there is only one company left today and that is the one mentioned here, NPS. If you go to programming on their web site, you will see what you can get for programing. They currently offers a lot less than they did years ago. Here is their web site: http://www.callnps.com/


there are more than ripoff NPS (nice piece of s**t)

www.programming-center.net
www.skyvision.com

NPS is getting out of the business because they are sleeping with Charlie



> Actually C-Band was around before either DirecTV or DISH, so many people who lived in rural areas as well as a few city dwellers bought C-Band equipment. In the early days nothing was scrambled and all you needed was a receiver. As they became more popular the scrambled and you needed a Motorola 4DTV receiver and subscription to receive the programing offered by DirecTV and DISH. There was still a lot of things that were unscrambled, News Feeds, sports backhauls (Feeds from the event back to the studios), International programing and Network (ABC, CBS, etc, sent to the local stations for rebroadcast) feeds. Eventually most of those became scrambled. Then the KU band started being used to send video and many of us retrofitted our dishes to receive their signals. I used to watch a lot of news feeds being sent from scenes to the networks. I specifically remember watching things like the live feeds from the Oakland California fire storms. Before the Sunday Ticket package we used to be able to watch the back haul of any football game, which used to be unscrambled.


still PLENTY of free channels up on C-Band. 
Loving all the sports feeds on it


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## TheRatPatrol

Can you get HD channels on C-Band?


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## loudo

TheRatPatrol said:


> Can you get HD channels on C-Band?


Like I said I have not had C-Band since 2003, but I do remember getting a few HD channels (PBS Feeds specifically and I think a few premium movie channels like HBO) with my 4DTV receiver, but it required an additional equipment. I can't recall if it was a different decoder module or an additional piece of electronics I had to plug into the 4DTV receiver.


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## the300

Man, you guys are really bringing back some memories !
I grew up on an old C-band dish, My dad still has the big monster in the backyard.
When we first got it we thought it was the greatest thing since indoor plumbing.You could get anything on the air free after purchasing the equipment. Like someone mentioned, most of the good channels became scrambled and you needed an embedded decoder chip to get the scrambled channels or you could subscribe.
I remember watching many games without sound as it was an alternate feed.
xxx channels were all easily found as well.


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## FTA Michael

Y'know, this thread actually shouldn't be here. C-band pay-TV programming is just one (little-used) form of DBS, and it's not FTA. 

But to get this thread back into compliance, here's my FTA-based tangent. This is actually good for FTA viewers with C-band dishes for two reasons. More inactive dishes mean more used C-band dishes and equipment for sale. And as the universe of C-band viewers shrinks, broadcasters are more likely to send C-band feeds without encryption.


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## loudo

FTA Michael said:


> Y'know, this thread actually shouldn't be here. C-band pay-TV programming is just one (little-used) form of DBS, and it's not FTA.
> 
> But to get this thread back into compliance, here's my FTA-based tangent. This is actually good for FTA viewers with C-band dishes for two reasons. More inactive dishes mean more used C-band dishes and equipment for sale. And as the universe of C-band viewers shrinks, broadcasters are more likely to send C-band feeds without encryption.


Taking C-Band viewers back to the old days. :grin:


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## ejjames

My best friend in 1st grade had a C-Band dish. It had an actual tuner like a old receiver where the knob would slide the dial up and down the frequencies . HBO east and west was something I had to grasp.


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## cousinofjah

lee635 said:


> That's not exactly true. With multicasting capabilities, the stream would go out on the backbone only once, then as it trunks down the line it would get replicated until it goes to individual receviers of the stream.


that's kind of how FIOS works, right? or U-Verse?


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## dodge boy

Nick said:


> FWIW, I saw this in today's SkyReport*SkyReport*


I used to have C-band and loved it, 10' dish blew over in a winter storm. Wonder if they will just leave receivers authorized and not shut them off?


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## Chris Blount

FTA Michael said:


> Y'know, this thread actually shouldn't be here. C-band pay-TV programming is just one (little-used) form of DBS, and it's not FTA.


Take a look at the forum description.


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## Nick

FTA Michael said:


> Y'know, this thread actually shouldn't be here. C-band pay-TV programming is just one (little-used) form of DBS, and it's not FTA...


For the sake of clarity, here is the description of the FTA / Non-DBS Satellite Area Forum: _"Satellite Television is not just DBS Mini Dishes! Here you can discuss other satellite technologies such as C-Band, KU-Band and their related receivers, such as 4DTV along with FTA (Free To Air) MPEG Receivers."_

Michael, before I posted I considered the forum in which to put this topic. I am by no means an expert in C-band, but I've been a fan of and have followed the technology almost since its inception. I appreciate your contributions in this forum and I always read your posts with interest.


> ...But to get this thread back into compliance, here's my FTA-based tangent. This is actually good for FTA viewers with C-band dishes for two reasons. More inactive dishes mean more used C-band dishes and equipment for sale. And as the universe of C-band viewers shrinks, broadcasters are more likely to send C-band feeds without encryption.


Let's hope that is the case. Although I've never had C-band, I always wanted to get a BUD, and secretly envied those who had one. But I am old, and even though I now have enough land for a VLA*, it's probably a little late for me to go down that path.

*Very Large Array


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## FTA Michael

C'mon guys, I was only playing, hence the stuck-out tongue. When a thread is seriously in the wrong place, you don't add another post to it, you click the triangle to report it to the admins. They know how to move stuff real quick!


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## james hyde

i do not like the way the c-band dish looks!!!!!!!


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## james hyde

what is the c-band servise called??????????


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## Nick

james hyde said:


> i do not like the way the c-band dish looks!!!!!!!


Don't look at it.


> what is the c-band servise called??????????


What, are you twelve? Learn to spell, use caps to start your sentences and stop pounding the *!* and *?* keys.


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## SayWhat?

I've got plenty of room for a BUD, lots of wide open spaces if I can keep the deer from running into the thing and the wasps from nesting in it. My issue with them is that I'm a button pusher and channel scanner. I've got a terribly short attention span and I'm constantly changing channels. I always understood you couldn't really do that with BUDs since they had to reposition themselves between satellites for certain channel changes.


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## loudo

SayWhat? said:


> I've got plenty of room for a BUD, lots of wide open spaces if I can keep the deer from running into the thing and the wasps from nesting in it. My issue with them is that I'm a button pusher and channel scanner. I've got a terribly short attention span and I'm constantly changing channels. I always understood you couldn't really do that with BUDs since they had to reposition themselves between satellites for certain channel changes.


That is the main difference between DirecTV or DISH and C-Band, besides the size of the dish. The channels are scattered from east to west, in the Clark Belt. I retrofitted my unit with a horizon to horizon mount, rather than an actuator arm, I was a big news surfer with my unit. I kept wearing out the actuator arms.


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## cousinofjah

loudo said:


> That is the main difference between DirecTV or DISH and C-Band, besides the size of the dish. The channels are scattered from east to west, in the Clark Belt. I retrofitted my unit with a horizon to horizon mount, rather than an actuator arm, I was a big news surfer with my unit. I kept wearing out the actuator arms.


is there such a thing as a multi-LNB c-band dish that can point at several different satellites without having to move?


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## TheRatPatrol

loudo said:


> That is the main difference between DirecTV or DISH and C-Band, besides the size of the dish. The channels are scattered from east to west, in the Clark Belt. I retrofitted my unit with a horizon to horizon mount, rather than an actuator arm, I was a big news surfer with my unit. I kept wearing out the actuator arms.


How does that work? How many satellites do you see at once? Can you take some pictures? :grin:


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## loudo

cousinofjah said:


> is there such a thing as a multi-LNB c-band dish that can point at several different satellites without having to move?


There are some dishes that can look at several satellites at once, but they are stationary and you could never veiw *all* of the satellites, as it is stationary. You can see one here: http://www.global-cm.net/multifeedsys.html

You could never get one C-Band dish look at all satellites at the same time, as they are located in the Clark Belt which runs around the world about 22,000 miles above the earth. So you have satellites as far west as you can see, all the way overhead and as far east as you can see. That is why most C-Band systems need either an actuator arm or horizon to horizon mount to move the dish and be able to view all satellites, but using them you can only look at one satellite at a time. This done with the use of an actuator arm that will rotate the satellite dish about 120 degrees or a horizon to horizon mount that will rotate the dish 180 degrees, allowing you to see more satellites.

They do make a C/KU Band corotor that can look at a C-Band and a KU Band satellite located at the same location without moving the dish, but both satellites have to be at the same location, An example of that is in the 125 degree slot a C/KU LNB could see Gallaxy 14 (C) and AMC 21 (KU) without moving the dish. Here is the one I had on my system: http://www.mjsales.net/items.asp?FamilyID=137&this_Cat1ID=263&Cat2ID=7

I am not sure if they still make them, but at one time they made a C/KU DirecTV LNB setup that you could use your C/KU Dish to receive DirecTV also. Of course you needed DirecTV receivers and a subscription.


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## loudo

TheRatPatrol said:


> How does that work? How many satellites do you see at once? Can you take some pictures? :grin:


See my above post.

As I sold the dish in 2003, I don't have any photos of the H to H mount, only the actuator arm mount before I retrofitted my dish, it is shown in my previous post http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2354266&postcount=5


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## cousinofjah

loudo said:


> There are some dishes that can look at several satellites at once, but they are stationary and you could never veiw *all* of the satellites, as it is stationary. You can see one here: http://www.global-cm.net/multifeedsys.html


thanks for the info - an interesting bit from this link:



> PLEASE BE AWARE that the pictured 9-satellite reception system using a 90 cm Paraclipse round offset antenna was part of a test to demonstrate how far away from center that MPEG-2 signals could be received. We were successful in going 30 degrees left and right of center, but realize that this was under optimum conditions during clear weather, critically aligned with a spectrum analyzer, and does not provide any margin for outages during rain or other bad weather. DO NOT assume or attempt to set up a permanent system with these conditions, or you will be severely disappointed.


so much for that idea. Though I'd gotten the impression that there were only a few sats that provided unencrypted content i.e. Golbecast but I suppose each satellite has some encrypted and some unencrypted?


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## P Smith

loudo said:


> ...
> They do make a C/KU Band corotor that can look at a C-Band and a KU Band satellite located at the same location without moving the dish, but both satellites have to be at the same location, An example of that is in the 125 degree slot a C/KU LNB could see Gallaxy 14 (C) and AMC 21 (KU) without moving the dish. Here is the one I had on my system: http://www.mjsales.net/items.asp?FamilyID=137&this_Cat1ID=263&Cat2ID=7
> 
> I am not sure if they still make them, but at one time they made a C/KU DirecTV LNB setup that you could use your C/KU Dish to receive DirecTV also. Of course you needed DirecTV receivers and a subscription.


There is DMX741 for start.


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## matt

Nick said:


> Don't look at it.What, are you twelve? Learn to spell, use caps to start your sentences and stop pounding the *!* and *?* keys.


!rolling


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## bidger

Ah, so that's what a satellite press conference looks like.


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## FogCutter

End of an era. 
So how long will it take IP to bury DBS?


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## ejjames

Are there any other cool you tube videos like that guy selling VCII equipment?


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## Nick

According to a brief note in SkyReport today, NPS says that 10 nets, including the Cartoon Network, Spike TV, TNT and CMT will cease transmitting via C-Band on April 6. One channel (Blue Highways TV) will cease transmitting on May 1.

Sad to say, but it looks like C-band is circling the drain.


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## TheRatPatrol

Nick said:


> According to a brief note in SkyReport today, NPS says that 10 nets, including the Cartoon Network, Spike TV, TNT and CMT will cease transmitting via C-Band on April 6. One channel (Blue Highways TV) will cease transmitting on May 1.
> 
> Sad to say, but it looks like C-band is circling the drain.


So how will they be broadcasting then?


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## FogCutter

So C-band is going, OTA is being threatened. Wire line telephones are dropping like flies.
We live in interesting times.


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## loudo

FogCutter said:


> So C-band is going, OTA is being threatened. Wire line telephones are dropping like flies.
> We live in interesting times.


Changing times and technology. Just like newspapers subscriptions and constantly getting smaller, mail not going to be delivered on Saturday or analog TVs becoming extinct. As newer technology come into play, the old goes out.


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## jeffgbailey

Nick said:


> According to a brief note in SkyReport today, NPS says that 10 nets, including the Cartoon Network, Spike TV, TNT and CMT will cease transmitting via C-Band on April 6. One channel (Blue Highways TV) will cease transmitting on May 1.
> 
> Sad to say, but it looks like C-band is circling the drain.


no it isn't

Those stations were gathered, compressed like hell and resold by NPS...the people who are getting out of C-Band because Charlie is in bed with them and he wants a ring now.

These stations could be picked up by other providers (Skyvision and SRL)


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## jeffgbailey

FogCutter said:


> So C-band is going,


no it isn't

Now the heck do you think Dish, Direct and cable companies get most of the national channels?

yep...C-Band


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## bruin95

Nick said:


> Sad to say, but it looks like C-band is circling the drain.


There is PLENTY of free stuff to watch on C-band, not to mention all the wild feeds of professional and college sports and news feeds. C-band isn't going anywhere.


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## Nick

*SkyReport*
Apr 9, 2010


> Another round of programming is going dark for C-Band systems, according to a note sent to dealers from National Programming Service. Effective June 20, all Showtime channels (including 16 flavors of Showtime, four Movie Channel versions and Flix East and West) will turn off. May 1 will see Blue Highways TV leave the big dish and earlier this week WGCL (CBS), WSB (ABC), WXIA (NBC), WPIX, Cartoon Network, Spike TV, VH-1, TRUTV, TNT and CMT left the service.
> 
> NPS repeats its opinion that Motorola will cut the cord completely on C-Band subscribers by the end of this year.


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## jeffgbailey

NPS is still blowing smoke huh?

Interesting as 2 other C-Band providers have said that Motorola will still be going strong on C-Band....its just NPS (aka Charlie's mistress) who keeps saying the sky is falling


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## sunfire9us

Jtaylor1 said:


> But that would mean that cable will be gone as well if C-band is going out of business. Cable Networks will just go to the Web.
> 
> To me, Television is on it's last leg since people use the internet to watch shows.


That is not true. If you want to know what happened, here is the deal. Unlike when everything was analog and used the Videocipher as the standard for encryption, this didn't work out the same way when the channels changed from analog to digital. Most of the channels used Scientific Atlanta's PowerVu digital/encryption system instead of Motorola's DigiCipher system. As a result as the channels were changing over to digital these channels were no longer avail to the c band market. NPS did get some of the channels back and they were in digicipher format but they were very piss poor in quality etc.People got tired of losing their fav channels and dumped c band for either cable,DTV, DishNet or Uverse/Fios.So actually all the channels are still up on the satellites like before ( where the different carriers can recieve them such as cable ) BUT they use a digital format that is NOT avail to the general public. There is NO consumer version of the PowerVu system. When it comes to FTA all you're going to see prolly is a bunch of foreign crap and yeah a few wild feed but not regular channels as I understand it.


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## Nick

JTaylor1 said:


> When it comes to FTA all you're going to see prolly is a bunch of foreign crap and yeah a few wild feed but not regular channels as I understand it.


You had me until you said _"prolly"_.


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## Nick

Under the heading 'Don't Let the Facts Get in the Way of a Good Story', in today's SkyReport comes a letter of rebuttal from Tim Mancoske, Programming Center Manager of Satellite Receivers, LTD/Cash Depot.



> I have a few comments in regards to "More C-Band Going Dark."
> 
> NPS has chose (sic) to discontinue WGCL (CBS); WSB (ABC), WXIA (NBC), WPIX, Cartoon Network, Spike TV, VH-1, TruTV, TNT and CMT services that they uplink on Satellite G3. This had nothing to do with Motorola or anybody else. Satellite Receivers LTD and Skyvision do provide an alternative version of the East Cost Networks in which NPS has just discontinued. Customers are calling us in large numbers subscribing to these networks. We plan to be the last man standing in the C-Band industry.
> 
> Showtime has announced that they are terminating their feeds on satellite C3/G0 as of June 30th however; SRL and Skyvision offer the HITS version of Showtime on satellite W5 and understand they will still be available past June 30th.
> 
> Thank you for using the word "opinion" in regards to NPS and their tale that Motorola is cutting the cord at the end of the year. There are too many factors for anyone to know the outcome of the big dish. I've worked for Satellite Receivers for 11 years and people have been spinning this yarn since I've started.
> 
> I've been reading this publication since NPS started their down on C-Band campaign ad so far I've only read their side of the story.
> 
> If you have any questions please feel free to contact me.
> 
> Tim Mancoske
> Programming Center Manager
> Satellite Receivers, LTD/Cash Depot


Source: www.MediaBiz.com


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## sadoun

For possible alternative, see http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=176645


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## Jtaylor1

Update from NPS:

Travel Channel is now broadcasting on C3-599 and C4-602 until 5-17-10 when it's C4-602 shuts off.


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## ACR_Ted

loudo said:


> The issue will be educating people that it is there, and how to use it. Very few people with the HRx DirecTV series receivers even know you can use it to watch Internet TV. I have showed several friends it and they were really surprised it could be done. Currently, a lot of us techy people know about it but the average DVR customer doesn't have a clue or could care less about it. They just want to use the receiver for watching satellite programing.


This sounds interesting to me....could you please tell me how it is done? A search via google turned up nothing.

Thanks!

Ted


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## Davenlr

ACR_Ted said:


> This sounds interesting to me....could you please tell me how it is done? A search via google turned up nothing.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Ted


Network it to your home network with internet connection, then run a program called PLAYON (or others) on one of your computers on the same network, which will act as an internet video server, and allow you to watch programs from several networks, hulu, etc with your HRxx DVR. Adding a second program, Tversity, will allow you to play any media (music, videos, pics) from your home network with the HRxx as well.


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## loudo

ACR_Ted said:


> This sounds interesting to me....could you please tell me how it is done? A search via google turned up nothing.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Ted


As Davenir explained the basics of setup, you can also check out the following threads for more information on Media Share:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=75287&highlight=media+share

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=177176&highlight=media+share (Mac Users)

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=128910&highlight=media+share

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=176804&highlight=media+share

These are just a few of the threads that talk about Media Share. If you can't find what you want do a search for "Media Share", and you will see many more.


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## ACR_Ted

Davenlr said:


> Network it to your home network with internet connection, then run a program called PLAYON (or others) on one of your computers on the same network, which will act as an internet video server, and allow you to watch programs from several networks, hulu, etc with your HRxx DVR. Adding a second program, Tversity, will allow you to play any media (music, videos, pics) from your home network with the HRxx as well.


Thanks everyone for the links and advice!

Ted


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## rid0617

gomezma1 said:


> They are giving these dishes away down here in San Antone. Are they still usefull for C band FTA?


Man I wish they would down here. I'm trying to find one that don't cost an arm and a leg in South Carolina for FTA. Got bored with my little FTA dish


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## Jtaylor1

Bad news. An offical notification from Motorola (in PDF) has been released.


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## matt

They quit selling subscriptions because they said Motorola would quit providing support but it turns out Motorola is going to stop providing support because companies stopped selling subscriptions.

While I can obviously see the writing on the wall that c-band is dying for end users, I put some of the blood on NPS's hands. To me they were telling everyone to find something else, not taking new customers, and making existing customers leave. Of course the customer base is going to decline when the people that are supposed to be pushing a service push it away from the customers.


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## AntAltMike

NPS was supporting a service that was not financially viable. I haven't dealt with them in nearly a decade, but I imagine that the cost of supporting customers became simply disproportionate to the revenue they generate when they are getting deluged with complaints about discontinued channels, and interrogated regarding prospective channel discontinuances and dragged into arguments over what the customer's obligations are to NPS and whether they are entitled to refunds or credits. Even if the customer is wrong every time, the cost of arguing with them can exceed the profit from their subscription.


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## Nick

*Motorola, inheritor of the BUD C-Band business, is
shutting it off as of Midnight, December 31, 2010*


> *SkyReport*
> 
> C-Band Sunset
> by Evie Haskell [email protected]
> 
> RIP BUD.
> 
> There really isn't a whole lot more to say. But it's a great story. So ....
> 
> The Big Ugly Dish got it's start when a Stanford University professor - and all round great guy, the late Taylor Howard - put a giant parabolic dish in his backyard and discovered he could bring in satellite-delivered TV signals. Not too long after that, he found that he could get one of the nation's first premium pay TV services ... HBO. He wrote a letter. Did they mind? They never replied.
> 
> Thus started a Wild West tumble of BUDs sprouting like sunflowers across Kansas ... outrage from an (eventually) enlightened HBO ... encryption ... piracy ... corporate skullduggery ... and then ... >>>


More @ *MediaBiz.com*


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## isiis

(pictures removed by moderator)

These are both from a 12 foot dish, Worth anything?


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## P Smith

Would you please reduce a size of your pictures ?!
DSL line is chocking


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## Nick

4 mb _is_ a bit mutch.


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## matt

At least he trimmed his toenails...


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## Stuart Sweet

Please repost smaller versions of the pictures, thanks.


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## RalphAlfalfa

Nuts! I finally found a good source for information only to learn C band is dead. I'm 63, fixed income, don't go up on the roof. It seems my only choice is Dish Network (which I'm predisposed to dislike after having NPS strong-arm me) as DirectTV has less subscribers and costs more. I sure have missed my favorite ladies on TNT - Closer, Grace. Any advice for me?


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## loudo

RalphAlfalfa said:


> Nuts! I finally found a good source for information only to learn C band is dead. I'm 63, fixed income, don't go up on the roof. It seems my only choice is Dish Network (which I'm predisposed to dislike after having NPS strong-arm me) as DirectTV has less subscribers and costs more. I sure have missed my favorite ladies on TNT - Closer, Grace. Any advice for me?


DirecTV has more subscribers than DISH, if that is what you were referring to.

Both companies play with their prices, but when you add up programing and equipment costs they come out pretty closer to each other. Some have lower prices for a year or other deals for new customers, but after that period is over there is very little difference. One includes locals in their package and the other requires a separate charge for them. The best thing to do is select the channels you are interested and choose a service from there.


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## Danilo-11

gomezma1 said:


> They are giving these dishes away down here in San Antone. Are they still usefull for C band FTA?


Where are they giving them away?
I need one (maybe, still gotta check with HOA)
send me an email to [email protected]
I want to be able to get NSS-806


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## Jtaylor1

I found some good news from a SRL Rep who posted on Satelliteguys.

Update: NPS will be shutting down subscriptions on December 26. No more subscriptions to C-Band after December 8th. Credits will be calculated for customers who paid on the past date and refunds will be made in the future.


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