# ANOTHER rate increase!!



## ThomasM

Yup, just when everyone is getting over the big increase in March, another one is coming July 29th. Oh, wait, it ISN'T a rate increase-it's a new "Music Licensing Fee" of $0.97 per radio per month!! (Pretty clever eh?)

Luckily, folks that went for long-term renewals prior to the March increase to continue getting XM Online for free and avoid THAT increase won't have to pay the NEW increase until their present subscription term expires.

With the new "fee" an extra (family plan) radio will be $9.99 per month! For folks who just listen to the music channels at home, it's HALF that price just to add an extra receiver to their DirecTV account and listen to XM that way (and they get TV too!)


----------



## Dolly

Gee when is Sirius XM going to stop shooting its' self in the foot  It seems like when people are trying to get over being upset over one thing Sirius XM just adds yet another thing for them to be upset over--not a way to run a company :nono:


----------



## Richard King

I could have missed something, but my research indicates that they negotiated their "Music Licensing Fees" a while back (well before the merger) and still have a number of years left on the contract. This IS a price increase no matter what they call it. If they can prove that they recently were forced to pay an increase in their existing fees I would like to see it.

I'm glad I dropped them when I did (spoken as a shareholder).

Slacker.com, the alternative to XM/Sirius music.


----------



## MCWHAMMER

How do you find out about this stuff? They didn't inform me of a rate change... you'd think they'd drop me a line or something (I'm on a quarterly payment plan).


----------



## Ken S

Obviously they have to figure out a way to make money...and I'm sure some genius in marketing said we'll call it a "Fee".

To me Sirius has been a disappointment...should Howard retire I wouldn't keep it...they've really failed thus far at developing new talent.


----------



## MCWHAMMER

Ken S said:


> To me Sirius has been a disappointment...should Howard retire I wouldn't keep it...they've really failed thus far at developing new talent.


I can't believe there are people out there that only subscribe to hear Howard Stern... you really don't like music at all? It would be a crappy world without some form of music... Sirius has 50+ channels of it... try changing your dial one day, I guarantee you'll find something interesting that doesn't have Baba Booey in it.


----------



## ThomasM

MCWHAMMER said:


> How do you find out about this stuff? They didn't inform me of a rate change... you'd think they'd drop me a line or something (I'm on a quarterly payment plan).


When I want to know anything about DirecTV, I come right here to DBSTALK.COM but when I want to know anything about Sirius/XM long before it happens I go to www.orbitcast.com ! Try it, you'll like it.


----------



## Ken S

MCWHAMMER said:


> I can't believe there are people out there that only subscribe to hear Howard Stern... you really don't like music at all? It would be a crappy world without some form of music... Sirius has 50+ channels of it... try changing your dial one day, I guarantee you'll find something interesting that doesn't have Baba Booey in it.


Did I say I don't like music? I can get the music I want to listen to from hundreds of different sources including FM, Internet Radio, CDs, Albums, MP3s, etc. I can even listen to their music through my DirecTV receivers if necessary (although we never do that).

There is nothing special about the Sirius music channels. Several even have annoying DJs...the others are fine...but nowhere near worth paying $20/month for (2 radios).

So, what is unique about Sirius? Howard, Maddog, Some Sports...what else?

I'm glad you enjoy the music channels. I'm not suggesting they take them away, but should the unique programming I enjoy on Sirius disappear I will discontinue my subscription.


----------



## Marvin

The biggest question I have is wheter or not Directv will be forced to pass that fee on as well. If they do, I honestly hope that they just drop the XM channels because I'd be paying the dumb fee 3 times then (2 radios and Directv).


----------



## Richard King

> what else?


The one channel that I miss is "Underground Garage". Try it, you might like it.


----------



## ziggy29

Yeah, those mergers are really good for consumers. Right.


----------



## Ken S

Without the merger we'd still only have one satellite radio company as one of them would be bankrupt by now for sure. The question is what price does satellite radio have to charge in order to survive?


----------



## BubblePuppy

Marvin said:


> The biggest question I have is wheter or not Directv will be forced to pass that fee on as well. If they do, I honestly hope that they just drop the XM channels because I'd be paying the dumb fee 3 times then (2 radios and Directv).


Since I don't have either "radio" channels in my favorites, I would hope one would be able to opt out and not have to pay for an increase, just like the movie channels. Make XM and Sirius an optional package.


----------



## JJJBBB

Howard 100 and 101 are the only channels that are worth every increase. I could live without the others.


----------



## djlong

You would still have two companies without the merger. In the event that one filed for bankruptcy, the SERVICE would continue while the shareholders and bondholders get cleaned out. The assets (subscribers, satellites, uplink centers, contracts) would have been sold to the highest bidder.


----------



## Ken S

djlong said:


> You would still have two companies without the merger. In the event that one filed for bankruptcy, the SERVICE would continue while the shareholders and bondholders get cleaned out. The assets (subscribers, satellites, uplink centers, contracts) would have been sold to the highest bidder.


There's no guarantee of the service continuing in the event of a bankruptcy..especially if it was Chapter 7. The assets could have been broken up and sold to a number of different companies. Those companies would be free to do what they wished with the assets. It's also pretty likely that the surviving company would have picked up some of those assets.

There have been a number of consumer satellite services in the recent past that have just disappeared. Voom, Primestar, Alphastar are some examples. Some got melded into other services, others just disappeared.


----------



## djlong

None of them had over 10 million paying customers.


----------



## ehilbert1

Ken S said:


> Did I say I don't like music? I can get the music I want to listen to from hundreds of different sources including FM, Internet Radio, CDs, Albums, MP3s, etc. I can even listen to their music through my DirecTV receivers if necessary (although we never do that).
> 
> There is nothing special about the Sirius music channels. Several even have annoying DJs...the others are fine...but nowhere near worth paying $20/month for (2 radios).
> 
> So, what is unique about Sirius? Howard, Maddog, Some Sports...what else?
> 
> I'm glad you enjoy the music channels. I'm not suggesting they take them away, but should the unique programming I enjoy on Sirius disappear I will discontinue my subscription.


I agree with you man. I dig the music channels and all,but there are way to many free options avalible. Slacker,Pandora, AOL radio just to name a few. I went from XM to Sirius because of Howard and if he's not there anymore I really see no reason to keep a 2nd radio. My first radio I lifetimed back in 05. I'm glad I did that because no bill and no rate increases ever.

It's also funny how people that hate Howard always say...."I can't believe you pay for that." You know to each their own. If you don't like him thats cool. Why make a big deal and post about it? I have no idea why people like counrty music. It's not for me,but I won't post anything bad about it or ask why people like it? I guess having a huge post count doen't matter to me.


----------



## mishababy

glad I got rid of them, the service sucked and I couldnt afford a price increase every time I turned on my radio. lol. I can still listen on my directv though so HAHA to them (oh wait Im still prob payin them too just thru directv.)


----------



## djlong

I think this means my least-used radio will be deactivated. I'll be down to 3 where I used to run 5. Just my car, my SkyFi2 and my girlfriend's Inno.


----------



## ThomasM

ziggy29 said:


> Yeah, those mergers are really good for consumers. Right.


I voted my XM proxy statement AGAINST the merger while everyone on the blogs was touting the merger. Now they are all lamenting what happened to the programming and the rates. (Didn't that "ala carte" channel proposal sound great? Didn't that "keep the same rates for three years" sound good? HAH! Too bad both services have the same channels now and have found innovative ways to gouge the customers!)

All I can say is *thank God the government blocked the proposed DirecTV-Echostar (DISH network) merger several years ago!!!!*


----------



## djlong

I was against the merger because the receivers were not interoperable - so you would always have two separate encoding schemes, XM's and Sirius'. If this were not true, then we could have one 300-channel service instead of two almost identical 150 channel services.


----------



## Paul Secic

ThomasM said:


> Yup, just when everyone is getting over the big increase in March, another one is coming July 29th. Oh, wait, it ISN'T a rate increase-it's a new "Music Licensing Fee" of $0.97 per radio per month!! (Pretty clever eh?)
> 
> Luckily, folks that went for long-term renewals prior to the March increase to continue getting XM Online for free and avoid THAT increase won't have to pay the NEW increase until their present subscription term expires.
> 
> With the new "fee" an extra (family plan) radio will be $9.99 per month! For folks who just listen to the music channels at home, it's HALF that price just to add an extra receiver to their DirecTV account and listen to XM that way (and they get TV too!)


I just bought an HD Radio. Who needs XM


----------



## Grentz

FYI, it was not their choice...the RIAA/MPAA and Congress forced the fees upon them....

They are still in compliance with their no rate increase promise as this is not a rate increase as much as it is a fee/tax placed upon them by a 3rd party.


----------



## Uncle Freddy

The FCC authorized them to pass through cost increases. Their costs have increased by half a percent. For a family plan radio that works out to about $.05. Seems to me they are pocketing $.92 for this "pass through."


----------



## djlong

HD Radio still has the commercials, playlists as shallow as a puddle and limited range.

What this cost increase does for me is prompt me into deactivating my least-used radio.


----------



## Richard King

Grentz said:


> FYI, it was not their choice...the RIAA/MPAA and Congress forced the fees upon them....
> 
> They are still in compliance with their no rate increase promise as this is not a rate increase as much as it is a fee/tax placed upon them by a 3rd party.


I tried to find a link stating the changes that they had to pay and was unable to do so. Do you have a link? The only thing that I found was contract terms that were not due to change for a few years.


----------



## Grentz

http://beatcrave.com/2009-05-13/us-congress-votes-radio-performance-royalty-fees/
http://www.xmradio.com/about/musicroyalty.xmc

HD Radio is not really an alternative to Satellite radio at all....HD Radio is just a higher quality version of standard FM stations and in some cases adds a few extra subchannels...all still have commercials/small playlists like normal FM though.


----------



## Grentz

Uncle Freddy said:


> The FCC authorized them to pass through cost increases. Their costs have increased by half a percent. For a family plan radio that works out to about $.05. Seems to me they are pocketing $.92 for this "pass through."


I honestly doubt it, and the fees are way more complicated than just "O, it raised half a percent, pass that through". Music royalty fees are extremely intricate and complex, especially for big broadcast companies.


----------



## Uncle Freddy

Grentz said:


> I honestly doubt it, and the fees are way more complicated than just "O, it raised half a percent, pass that through". Music royalty fees are extremely intricate and complex, especially for big broadcast companies.


The past two years, they were paying 6% of gross revenues as their royalty rate. This year it went up to 6.5%, next year 7%, 7.5% in 2011, and 8% in 2012 when the rates expire (though I'm sure they will maintain at least that rate moving forward).

It's really not all that complicated.

http://www.businessdose.com/economy/copyright_royalty_board_sets_rat/


----------



## Richard King

Grentz said:


> http://beatcrave.com/2009-05-13/us-congress-votes-radio-performance-royalty-fees/
> http://www.xmradio.com/about/musicroyalty.xmc
> 
> HD Radio is not really an alternative to Satellite radio at all....HD Radio is just a higher quality version of standard FM stations and in some cases adds a few extra subchannels...all still have commercials/small playlists like normal FM though.


Thanks for the links. I wish the first one had a date attached to it. It states that the fees got through committee, but sent it to the house for a full vote. I assume that it passed the full house vote.


----------



## xmguy

ThomasM said:


> Yup, just when everyone is getting over the big increase in March, another one is coming July 29th. Oh, wait, it ISN'T a rate increase-it's a new "Music Licensing Fee" of $0.97 per radio per month!! (Pretty clever eh?)
> 
> Luckily, folks that went for long-term renewals prior to the March increase to continue getting XM Online for free and avoid THAT increase won't have to pay the NEW increase until their present subscription term expires.
> 
> With the new "fee" an extra (family plan) radio will be $9.99 per month! For folks who just listen to the music channels at home, it's HALF that price just to add an extra receiver to their DirecTV account and listen to XM that way (and they get TV too!)


This is the reason I'll be dropping my Online access. To off set the increase of the radios. I as well as many others are on a tight monthly budget and can't afford another high charge. XM COULD charge the required 6% but NO they are charging the HIGH 15%..


----------



## ehilbert1

djlong said:


> HD Radio still has the commercials, playlists as shallow as a puddle and limited range.
> 
> What this cost increase does for me is prompt me into deactivating my least-used radio.


HD radio is the biggest joke out there. Like you said commercials and crap radio. Plus you sure as hell can't listen to you favorite stations from coast to coast. Truckers love their satellite radio for that very reason and there are a lot of truckers that have SiriusXM.


----------



## Grentz

Richard King said:


> Thanks for the links. I wish the first one had a date attached to it. It states that the fees got through committee, but sent it to the house for a full vote. I assume that it passed the full house vote.


Looks like from the URL that it is 5/13/09.


----------



## Richard King

Grentz said:


> Looks like from the URL that it is 5/13/09.


Ah... which makes me wonder if they are being pre-emptive with the increase. I assume it did pass committee and the full house.


----------



## reddice

I am finding that internet radio is blowing away the crappy Sirius XM. I paid for the year but when my year is up in October I will most likely be canceling. BYW I don't listen to Slacker, Pandora etc. I have other internet radio streams I pay for and some free ones I listen to.


----------



## bejohn2

Just got my notice from Sirius today and the price for the "U.S. Music Royalty Fee" is $1.98 per month for primary subscriptions and $.97 per month for multi receiver subscriptions.


----------



## Hoxxx

Dolly said:


> Gee when is Sirius XM going to stop shooting its' self in the foot  It seems like when people are trying to get over being upset over one thing Sirius XM just adds yet another thing for them to be upset over--not a way to run a company :nono:


I agree. At one time I was paying for 5 radios I am now down to two and that could change to zero. there is more and more choices to listen to stuff at home or in the car.


----------



## Ken S

Here's info on the increase...
http://www.orbitcast.com/archives/p...-to-pass-music-royalty-fees-to-consumers.html


----------



## Lord Vader

And here's the text of the Email I received yesterday in case anyone's too lazy to click Ken's link:



> Thank you for being an XM subscriber. We are dedicated to providing our subscribers with the best programming and listener experience available on radio today. As part of this commitment, we have an important update regarding your XM subscription.
> 
> Music royalty rights were established by the U.S. Congress as part of the Copyright Act. This Act requires payment of copyright music royalties to recording artists, musicians and recording companies who hold copyrights in sound recordings.
> 
> These royalties have recently increased dramatically, principally as a result of a decision made by the Copyright Royalty Board, which is designated by the Library of Congress to set royalty rates for sound recordings. Beginning on July 29, 2009, a "U.S. Music Royalty Fee" of $1.98/month* for primary subscriptions and $.97/month* for multi-receiver subscriptions will be effective upon your next renewal. This fee will be used directly to offset increased payments from XM to the recording industry.
> 
> Unfortunately, we cannot control the Copyright Royalty Board's rate increase, but we can offer you ways to save on your subscription. The longer your subscription, the more you save!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Call 866-377-7287*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for being a loyal XM listener and we hope you continue to enjoy the unparalleled listening experience XM provides.
> 
> *Joe Zarella*
> Chief Service Officer
> SIRIUS XM Radio
> 
> P.S. Questions about the U.S. Music Royalty Fee? Please visit xmradio.com/usmusicroyalty for additional information.


----------



## reddice

I got two words to say and I bet you all agree with me.
"Fees suck"
I always hate them. Free is free but fee you got to pay more just because they can.


----------



## Terry K

I've already found a solution to get Pandora & iheartradio (yes its Clear Channel) streaming in my Jeep. Blackberry + audio cable + car radio. I refuse to pay XM another dime.


----------



## since 2/96

just talked to Sirius' 'cancellation dept.' and told the rep to talk me out of canceling since I didn't feel $17+ per month was worth it anymore...

He gave me the next 5 months for $20 + free internet access, so I'll revisit the costs in January


----------



## ffdoug

I called last week to cancel one of my radios on the family plan. I was transferred to XM cancellations dept, where the lady offered 74.99/year. I said can I get that on my 4 radios under my account now, which she said yes. I haven't received my new invoice yet but we will see.


----------

