# PVR 508 - one year later



## AlexF (Jan 9, 2003)

Hey guys, 

I’m new here and will be receiving my Dish Network setup this Saturday. I got a 508 receiver, 500 dish, and free installation for $175. That seems like a good deal to me. That was also with the Top 50 channel selection. 

I was wandering if, hypothetically, after my year contract is up, and I decide I don’t like Dish Network, will I be able to use the PVR508 as a recorder to record alternate sources such as cable, DVD, antenna TV, etc.? I’m sure I will stay with Dish Network (Time Warner gets enough money for Internet already). I was just curious. Thanks in advance.


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## gcutler (Mar 23, 2002)

No Dish Network = No signal to the 508 = Boat Anchor. 

Althoough you could probablty sell it for clost to what it cost you. 

Thats what a TiVo or Replay would be for if you wanted to keep the system but jump providers.


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## RJS1111111 (Mar 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by gcutler _
> *No Dish Network = No signal to the 508 = Boat Anchor.
> 
> Althoough you could probablty sell it for clost to what it cost you.
> ...


Well, yes, a 508 without DISH would be more or less a waste,
but then there are still a few FTA channels, Sky Angel for
$9/month or $99/year, possibly a future compatible provider,
and the FTA news shows from ExpressVu.

Theoretically, you could maybe buy or build an assembly of
components that would convert various video formats to one
or more DISH-compatible MPEG bitstreams, multiplex those if
necessary, up-convert to one or more L-band transponder
frequencies, and feed the signal to the SAT IN F connector
on your 508. Estimated total cost: well, thousands at least.
But, think of it as investment protection. Or, just think of it
as an expensive hobby.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

If that rainbow provider would have receivers that are compatible then it would still not be usable because they would not activate another type of receiver than their own.


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## RJS1111111 (Mar 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Jacob S _
> *If that rainbow provider would have receivers that are compatible then it would still not be usable because they would not activate another type of receiver than their own. *


Your guess could turn out to be correct, but I hope not.

ExpressVu in Canada and DISH in the US agreed not to
activate each other's cross-border receiver serial numbers,
in order to comply with their licenses, which forbid offering
subscriptions to addresses outside their respective countries.

R/L DBS and DISH USA are seeking subscribers in the same
country/market. If R/L DBS is smart, they will gladly activate
any and all DISH USA receivers for their own service,
assuming there is no legal prohibition against it.

Otherwise, they will be unable to take advantage of the wide
availability of DISH USA receivers.

Hopefully it will also be on a compatible basis; that is, you
should be able to subscribe to either service or both,
from separate authorization streams that don't disrupt
each other's subscriptions. This is the model that I expect
Sky Angel also wants to adopt; i.e. eventually provide their
own authorization stream from their own transponders on
their own satellite(s), even though their first will most likely
share a slot with Echostar III at 61.5 WL. Perhaps R/L DBS
and Sky Angel might even strike a deal to share the same
new satellite there, although I doubt it.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

Would there be some law against them forbidding another provider to not activate the hardware or would they have the right because they manufacture it for their own service? What would the difference be with Dish that makes their own and DirecTv's receivers in which some others make their receivers.


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## RJS1111111 (Mar 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by Jacob S _
> *Would there be some law against them forbidding another provider to not activate the hardware or would they have the right because they manufacture it for their own service? What would the difference be with Dish that makes their own and DirecTv's receivers in which some others make their receivers. *


Those are good questions; I don't know the answers.
I think it depends on whether the two or three providers
at 61.5 have "friendly" business relations or not.

Of course the FCC might get involved if they go out of
their ways to make their receivers incompatible and
non-interoperable.

DISH receivers currently interoperate with FTA DVB broadcasts
with specific FEC. This makes them less adaptable than full
FTA receivers. They also use Nagravision for conditional access,
which is one of several widely-accepted industry standards.

So right now it is fairly easy for other providers to restrict
themselves to DISH-compatible broadcasts, and get their
channels (conditionally) listed in the EPG.

DISH could make this much more difficult or impossible by
making changes to the receiver software. But I don't know
whether that would be such a good idea.

DirecTV, OTOH, has some of its own proprietary extensions
to DVB. Still, it would be fairly easy for another provider to
broadcast in DirecTV-compatible mode.


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## Bob Haller (Mar 24, 2002)

Sat radio was REQUIRED to be compatible by the FCC, although its not effective till the second generation units.


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