# Is the R-15 worth suggesting?



## jbstix (Dec 29, 2005)

I have 2 HR20's currently and an older DTivo box.
A friend was asking about me about D* and wants to upgrade and drop his cable service and do a "Triple Play" package through Bellsouth.

I've read here and there about major issues with the R15's (and had some issues with my HR20's) but know there has been a recent software update.

So here's the big question: Is the R15 stable enough to recommend it to a new D* sub and someone new to the DVR world???
I told him that having a DVR is awesome, but I had some reservations about the R15...

So give me the scoop R15 owners... 

Thanks for the input and advice!!!


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## ApK (Mar 6, 2006)

Wer'e talking SD only, right? No HD aspirations?
Is he already a Tivo user?
I haven't plugged my R15 back in to try this latest update, but the $180 I spent on a used 160 hr DTivo has brought me oh so much joy these past few months.

Based on where the R15 was when I pulled the plug, I'd say if it's his first DVR and he's a fairly undemanding user, then a free R15 is better than no DVR at all.

If he's already a Tivo fan, take the R15 if it's free, but get a DTivo to actually use.


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## Larry Daughtrey (Feb 14, 2006)

Not until they fix it. They fix one problem only to create a new one. I've had two R-15's since they were introduced and had my hopes they would straighten it out only to hear they are working on it. Next software release, Have patience its a new product, etc etc.. This thing is as buggy as ever. I mean come on DTV, You can't even get the screensaver fixed let alone the damn pause only works half the time, etc..
I mean Geez!


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## jbstix (Dec 29, 2005)

Yes, SD only...

No previous DVR experience at all. Only Tivo experience he's had is when he's been over at my house - and that was with my HR10-250! LOL.

He would def. be a heavy DVR user once it was installed. Between he and other family members, they would be recording a good bit of material.

Now I'm really on the fence here, I don't want to recommend a buggy box to a brand new user... 
Is it safe to say that the HR20 is already more stable than the R15???

My mom had an R15 back around the first of the year, and the few times I messed with it, I do remember it Sucked! But I was hoping that the latest update fixed a lot of issues...

I need some more input before I tell him to pul the trigger...

thanks


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## akstone (Dec 27, 2006)

I've had the R-15 for six weeks and I hate it.

I just expect the basic from my DVR. Record shows that I can watch a day or two later. 

The R-15 doesn't record at least a quarter of the shows I've asked it to record. And another 10% record, but a few minutes into playback will stop playing and ask me if I want to delete it. 

I've done red-button resets almost daily to keep it working half-way reliably (which wipes out my guide data which takes 48 hours to repopulate). And I've done periodic total resets as directed by Directv tech support which wipes out any shows that I did manage to record.

I got the R-15 temporarily until I could get the HR-20. But reading the HR-20 forums, it sounds as buggy as my R-15. I'm not sure what to do now...


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## jbstix (Dec 29, 2005)

Another quick question:

Which box is now the one that is mainly used???
R15-100 
R15-300 
R15-500

I would assume the R15-500 is the newest and has the least amount of issues - possibly b/c of newer/better hardware? Or just a different manufacturer or assembly plant?

Thanks guys


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## akstone (Dec 27, 2006)

I got a supposedly brand new R15-100 installed six weeks ago.


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## spanishannouncetable (Apr 23, 2002)

jbstix said:


> ...So here's the big question: Is the R15 stable enough to recommend it to a new D* sub and someone new to the DVR world???


Nope


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## qwerty (Feb 19, 2006)

jbstix said:


> I would assume the R15-500 is the newest and has the least amount of issues - possibly b/c of newer/better hardware? Or just a different manufacturer or assembly plant?
> 
> Thanks guys


Incorrect. They were released 500, 300 then 100. Yes, different manufacturers. They're supose to be functionally identical.


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## TigersFanJJ (Feb 17, 2006)

I've had my R15-500 for over a year now and I'd recommend it to a friend. Is it a perfect dvr? No, but it has been more stable than my R10.


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## Upstream (Jul 4, 2006)

akstone said:


> I've had the R-15 for six weeks and I hate it.
> 
> The R-15 doesn't record at least a quarter of the shows I've asked it to record. And another 10% record, but a few minutes into playback will stop playing and ask me if I want to delete it.


If your box is missing 25% of its scheduled records and asking you to keep or delete minutes into playing on another 10%, you have a defective box. Sound's like some sort of hard disk error.

At six weeks old, you are under warranty. Call DTV now and get a replacement.


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## akstone (Dec 27, 2006)

Tech support did say they would send me a new R15. But I said wait since I was on the priority waiting list for an HR20 which I was expecting "real soon". 

But that's a whole different series of headaches not appropriate for this thread.

After eight years with Dish, I switched to Directv because I was dissatisfied with Dish. I am more dissatisfied withDirectv. But now I'm stuck with a two year commitment. 

I would think if Directv had a good product, they wouldn't need to push their two year commitment on people. Dish default is no commitment or a rebate if you agree to an 18 month commitment. That says something about the quality of the respective products.


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## ApK (Mar 6, 2006)

Apparently not, if you were dissatisfied enough with Dish to leave.

The R15 is a flop, and that is sad, but with a DTivo, I am very happy with DTV so far. For the few problems I have had they have addressed them to my complete satisfaction (they apologize sincerely and throw money at me).

Would I prefer no commitment? Sure. From my cell phone company, too.
But it says nothing about the quality of the product as far as I can see.
I've renewed the two-year commitment on my cell phone 10 times because the service is good, and if DTV keeps up, and requires it to get me a better deal. I'll renew with them, too.


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## Upstream (Jul 4, 2006)

akstone said:


> Tech support did say they would send me a new R15. But I said wait since I was on the priority waiting list for an HR20 which I was expecting "real soon".


You have a defective receiver. You can get a working receiver within a week for free. All you have to do is make a phone call, connect a few cables, and send the defective receiver back at no cost to you.

Unless you are going to get an HR20 in the next few weeks, why wouldn't you exchange the defective receiver for a working one? If you wait another 6 weeks, your warranty will have expired and you won't be able to exchange the defective receiver for free.

Also, if you know you have a defective receiver (and you must know since DTV offered to replace it, but you said no), you are being disingenuous complaining about the problems as if they are general problems with the R15.


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## akstone (Dec 27, 2006)

I would agree with you if these R-15 forums weren't full of posts with identical complaints. 

I would have replaced my R-15 in an instant if I hadn't read several posts from people with the same issues even after replacing their R-15 several times.

I would have replaced my R-15 instantly if tech support would have told me these problems were proof of a bad unit. Instead they initially told me most people with these problems have them fixed by pushing the red reset button. So I push the red reset button which does stabilize my box for a few days at a time. 

A later tech support call said a total reset would almost certainly fix these problems for good. This did fix the problems for a couple weeks before I started losing recordings again. 

Another tech support call told me I could try replacing the unit. I asked if I would get a new box. I was told No, I would get a used refurbished unit. This made me think of posts I've read from people that got replacement boxes more flaky than the one they sent in. 

Tech support then told me a new software update coming soon might fix the problems I'm seeing. I just got a software update a few days ago. I followed the update with another total reset to get my box in a good state. I am now waiting to see if these problems reappear. If the problems reappear, I'll try a new box.

Since I was told new software will hopefully fix the problem, this tells me getting a replacement box is only a feel good step that would replace my six week old box with a much older refurbished box. That is why I haven't replaced my R-15 yet.

Six weeks of try this - now try this - now try that - gives me every right to complain about the R-15.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Okay, my take.

The R15 has made alot of progress over the year. But IMO it's still not a reliable unit. Mine, right now is working pretty well but still has annoying problems. My R15 is in a place that is not critical (a place I really only need a receiver) and I have DTivo units handling my "real" recordings.

The only DTV DVR I can recommend at this time would be a Tivo unit on the used market.


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## jbstix (Dec 29, 2005)

Thanks for the info guys... 

My friend hasn't made a decision yet, but he has until tomorrow until the current "deal" ends. 

I haven't told him I posted here asking R15 owners what they thought, I'm just trying to gather enough info before I give him my final advice.

Thanks again


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## cawall (Sep 30, 2006)

I'm with TigerfanJJ. I have had my R15 about 3 months after going through 3 
R10's. Yes it has some quirks and some things I just hate like the worthless history and picking up some reruns on first run requests, but it has some features I love like the guide in picture and the 90 minute cache. My unit has been reliable. I reboot once a week which appears to help the stability.


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

cawall said:


> My unit has been reliable. I reboot once a week which appears to help the stability.


Something wrong with these two statements.

I've converted four people from cable to DirecTV just for the DTiVo. I never really evangelized it--I just let them see it when they were in my house, and that was enough. I've actively warned all of them against the R15, though.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

cawall said:


> I'm with TigerfanJJ.My unit has been reliable. I reboot once a week which appears to help the stability.


I guess it's all in your expectations. I have DTivos that haven't been reboot in 70-90 days. Yes, I reboot my R15 every week also as it doesn't work properly if you don't. That's why I cannot recommend the R15. If you accept a weekly reboot and loss of guide data for 24 hours, then it works for you. Prior to the R15, on DTivo DVRs and on UTVs or Replays....gosh, I guess any DTV DVR before the R15....that wasn't needed.


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

Wolffpack said:


> I guess it's all in your expectations. I have DTivos that haven't been reboot in 70-90 days. Yes, I reboot my R15 every week also as it doesn't work properly if you don't. That's why I cannot recommend the R15. If you accept a weekly reboot and loss of guide data for 24 hours, then it works for you. Prior to the R15, on DTivo DVRs and on UTVs or Replays....gosh, I guess any DTV DVR before the R15....that wasn't needed.


No you didn't need to reboot the RePlay every week it did it every couple of days on it's own :lol: and I don't think it was part of the software plan for it to do it.

On the flip side my R15 goes many weeks without ever being rebooted and I have very little problems. I think it's been rebooted more times the last 2-3 weeks due to me trying to get the new version then it has in the past 6 months.


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## samo (Nov 9, 2002)

Do not recommend DirecTiVo to your friend NOW. There is a horrible bug, presumably in guide interface that makes my R10s to miss more than half of the recordings with ""Someone modified the season pass" message http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=332166
Untill this problem is resolved (and there is no estimate if and when this problem will be resolved), do not recommend DirecTiVo to your friend - he will hate you for that.
On other hand, this problem is not affecting R-15s. It looks like DirecTV fixed series links problems with R-15s by modifying something in a data feed that screwed up DirecTiVos.


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## AnonomissX (Jun 29, 2006)

akstone said:


> I would agree with you if these R-15 forums weren't full of posts with identical complaints.
> 
> I would have replaced my R-15 in an instant if I hadn't read several posts from people with the same issues even after replacing their R-15 several times.
> 
> ...


Actually, I believe when the unit is a new box UNDER THE 90 DAY WARRANTY, you are supposed to get a new one. HOWEVER: I myself prefer refurbs, because they have had extra TLC and more rigorous testing. Also, if you do accept a replacement, it restarts the 90 day warranty anyways, and does not extend the commitment time period.


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## jbstix (Dec 29, 2005)

Man - this is a tough one...

I've been browsing through the R15 threads - reading here and there.

It almost seems as if the R15 (even being out a lot longer) than the HR20 still has more issues than the HR20??? 
But, at the same time, my friend has limited choices - and will probably have to just pick the lesser of 2 evils  
I did tell him that overall D* (even with software issues) really is the best option on the market IMO. I've had very, very few issues with my DSR6000 (over 5 years old) and few issues with my HR10-250. But, he def. wants to go the route of new equipment, so buying an older DTivo unit is not an option.

Bottom line I guess is, I'll just restate my "disclaimer" statement that there are known issues with the R15 so commit at your own risk - but still try to be hopeful.

Is there any solid evidence that D* will ditch the R15 in early '08 like someone here has mentioned??? 

thanks for the input and advice


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

I think the R-15 will be replaced long before 2008. If something else doesnt come to replace it or at least be in the works in a few months, I will be very surprised.

Another thought is the HR20 is the future of DirecTV and ALL future DVR's will eventually be the HR20.


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## ApK (Mar 6, 2006)

samo said:


> Do not recommend DirecTiVo to your friend NOW. There is a horrible bug, presumably in guide interface that makes my R10s to miss more than half of the recordings with ""Someone modified the season pass" message http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=332166
> Untill this problem is resolved (and there is no estimate if and when this problem will be resolved), do not recommend DirecTiVo to your friend - he will hate you for that.
> On other hand, this problem is not affecting R-15s. It looks like DirecTV fixed series links problems with R-15s by modifying something in a data feed that screwed up DirecTiVos.


No bug.

One batch of bad guide data, apparently. All fixed now.

My DTivo (RCA DVR40) is working perfectly.
Recommend it whole heartedly.

ApK


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## qwerty (Feb 19, 2006)

AnonomissX said:


> HOWEVER: I myself prefer refurbs, because they have had extra TLC and more rigorous testing.


Man, I wish I could find that post from the guy that received his refurb loose in the box with no packing material. I believe it still had the previous owners caller ID info on it too!


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

Bobman said:


> I think the R-15 will be replaced long before 2008. If something else doesnt come to replace it or at least be in the works in a few months, I will be very surprised.
> 
> Another thought is the HR20 is the future of DirecTV and ALL future DVR's will eventually be the HR20.


Yeah, I also think this is what will happen. Not for up to a year or so, but eventually. At some point, it will be more cost effective to swap out R15's with HR20's than it will be to continue a software development process for the R15 that obviously isn't working, perhaps because of the NDS foundation it is built on.

Carl


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## spanishannouncetable (Apr 23, 2002)

ApK said:


> No bug.
> 
> One batch of bad guide data, apparently. All fixed now.
> 
> ...


Not so fast. This problem has been popping up for several weeks, so "One batch of bad guide data" is not the problem.

My DSR6000 is really f'ed up. The guide shows everything it's supposed to, but a "search by title" shows a total of 3 programs in the database for the next 12 days.

*Hundreds of channels, thousands of hours of available programming, 40 SP's in effect, and the to-do list only shows manual recordings for the next 2 weeks.*

It looks like Directv is deliberately trying to piss off DTiVo owners so we'll swap them for the POS R-15


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## mikewolf13 (Jan 31, 2006)

jbstix said:


> Is there any solid evidence that D* will ditch the R15 in early '08 like someone here has mentioned???
> 
> thanks for the input and advice


No. there is no solid evidence.

It is the belief of many for various reasons. I for one would reccomend a Dtivo, but if your friend HAD to get a DVR+ DVR get the HR20 even if he will never use it for HD.

There is more focus on fixes...but in way is it as relaible as a Dtivo.


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## ApK (Mar 6, 2006)

spanishannouncetable said:


> *Hundreds of channels, thousands of hours of available programming, 40 SP's in effect, and the to-do list only shows manual recordings for the next 2 weeks.*


Ours is fine. All SPs and wishlists working correctly.

Any one else still having a problem?


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

ApK said:


> Ours is fine. All SPs and wishlists working correctly.
> 
> Any one else still having a problem?


As far as I know I never had this problem (I was out of town and most of my shows are repeat or hiatus right now).


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

ApK said:


> Ours is fine. All SPs and wishlists working correctly.
> 
> Any one else still having a problem?


My 4 HDVR2/SD-DVR40s right now all show To Do lists out through 1/9 or 1/10 and I haven't missed any SLs. All running 6.2.


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## jbstix (Dec 29, 2005)

Well, the trigger has been pulled ! 
He placed his order today for D* service. He's only getting one R15 for now, and several standard STB's(nonDVR). He got a good deal, pretty much free w/ a bill credit. He's actually very excited b/c of how much more content he's getting for less money compared to the cable provider he's leaving. I remained encouraging about D* programming and equipment, so we'll see if he's still my friend after using the R15 for a few weeks  
The real test will be when 24 starts back in a few weeks - it's really the only Primetime show he watches, so needless to say it's very important that it record and playback correctly *fingers crossed*

Thanks for all the input guys - I appreciate it.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

I think most of us out here will agree that DTV programming is pretty good (other than that stupid HD thing) but it's this crappy DVR equipment that's really torking folks off. Prior to the DVR+ line I had absolutely no complains about DTV. I joined this board in July of 2003 and up until a year ago (just before I got my R15) I probably had 10 posts here. Cripe, prior to the R15 release these DTV forums hardly had any posts. Now I'm betting close to 4,000 posts and how many members have joined since then? 

Can any of the moderators look up the increase in membership and posts prior to Nov 2005 compared to after Nov 2005?


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## akstone (Dec 27, 2006)

Good luck to your friend and his R15.

I now have an appointment to replace my R15 with an HR20. 

Soon I'll have no more problems with DVR stability and reliability.

Although reading the HR20 forums, that hope might be a little optimistic.


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