# So who is getting HD-DVD this spring?



## Chris Blount (Jun 22, 2001)

Toshiba is supposed to release the first HD-DVD player this spring. Anyone getting one? I purchased the first Toshiba DVD player back in April of 1997 and plan to be on the bleeding edge this time around. I'm actually looking forward to owning one especially at only $499 retail.

Blu-Ray has promise but quite frankly, I think it has too many technical problems and will be too expensive for the average consumer.


----------



## ibglowin (Sep 10, 2002)

I'm going to sit on the fence on this one and see who wins. I must be getting older (and hopefully somewhat wiser!)

I really want an HD Camcorder but without a DVD to burn the project back to in HD its pointless at this time.

I want to see the PQ difference between the two competing formats as well as the standard DVD all side by side to see if the technology is light years ahead or only slightly ahead of what we have today.

Should be interesting to see how it all falls out!


----------



## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

ibglowin said:


> I'm going to sit on the fence on this one and see who wins. I must be getting older (and hopefully somewhat wiser!)
> 
> I really want an HD Camcorder but without a DVD to burn the project back to in HD its pointless at this time.
> 
> ...


I copy them via 1394 to a DVD recorder (480i downconvert) and play them back on an upconverting DVD player. I save the original on mini dv. The longer the wait, for recordable disc in high definition, the more attractice HDVHS looks.


----------



## jrjcd (Apr 23, 2002)

yeah, as a bloodied vetern of the VHS/Beta wars, I think I'll wait till the dust settles and see which one survives and flourishes...you know, this is not the sort of thing that benefits the consumer at all(and yes, i AM a firm believer in competition in the marketplace)...until then, i'll be happy with my widescreen dvds and let the fanatical videophiles duke it out over this...i just hope that whoever succeeds, they don't waste time making AFFORDABLE units($i'm sorry-these days anything that facilitates a TV signal has got to be under $130 to garner my interest)for the great unwashed and keep the prices in dvd norms(a regular dvd that sells over 19.95 doesn't find it's way to my house, road show exclusives such as the LOTR movies an example of exception)...


----------



## JM Anthony (Nov 16, 2003)

Chris - I admire your spirit of adventure. I'm also sitting on the fence. The price of the h/w isn't that big a consideration for me. I want to be able to assess both formats side by side and see what's happening with s/w before I plunk down any moolah.

John


----------



## Jim Parker (Aug 12, 2003)

I'm going to wait a bit and see what the market is doing. Maybe a Christmas present for myself. 

The DVD player that I have now holds 5 DVDs, and I find that kind of handy, so it also depends on what options are available.

It also depends on how much HD is available on Dish a year from now. If there is plenty to watch on Dish, I may wait a while longer for prices to come down more.


----------



## Capmeister (Sep 16, 2003)

I'm going to wait mainly to see what titles will be released in what formats. And I'm concerned about closed captioning versus subtitles (they're not the same).


----------



## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

Capmeister said:


> I'm going to wait mainly to see what titles will be released in what formats. And I'm concerned about closed captioning versus subtitles (they're not the same).


While close captioning has been available for some time on VHS, I wasn't aware that it was available on DVD. What is the drawback on subtitle vs close captioned?


----------



## jrjcd (Apr 23, 2002)

accuracy comes to mind...


----------



## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

jrjcd said:


> accuracy comes to mind...


Live close captioning has a problem with accuracy, but I wasn't aware of that being an issue with subtitles. How can they do multiple language, if it is an issue? I sometimes watch movies with subtitles and haven't seen a problem.


----------



## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

ibglowin said:


> I'm going to sit on the fence on this one and see who wins. I must be getting older (and hopefully somewhat wiser!)
> 
> I really want an HD Camcorder but without a DVD to burn the project back to in HD its pointless at this time.
> 
> ...


I've seen the Blue Ray and the DVD-HD and both are stunning on a 1080p, somewhat less difference on a 720P display. Consequently, I will wait for HD flavor of DVD either one until I first move to the 1080p Front projection system for my Home Theater. That could be at least 3 years from now. Maybe by then media will be plentiful in the rental houses but I'm not holding my breath. My professional use is on a different timetable.

Regarding your concern for distribution of HDV camcorder here's the scoop-

You can certainly buy a relatively low cost HDV palm corder from Sony today. It will play back your camera original tapes with the on board dongle cable to component 1080i out. It looks fantastic, just like HDNet live coverage. Next you may want to edit. Now it gets a bit more involved from the pure technical side of things. HDV is not miniDV. You will need a very fast computer Pentium 3.3Ghz or better with at least 2 Ghz ram and fast raid hard drives. Professional edit software like Sony Vegas 6.0 with built in codecs for HDV real time editing or a third party codec like Cineform to built proxies for editing in less robust packages. There are some technical "gotchas" with HDV that HDCAM and true HDTV editing doesn't have. Something had to give and that was error correction. With HDV you will find some transitions will be loaded with artifacts while straight footage with cuts only are fine. Just know this will happen and it's the fault of HDV format. JVC is a bit better but then they use more compression and lower resolution and native frame rate so it has other issues like panning and zoom judder artifacts forcing you to shoot film style rather than video style or the footage looks awful! Simply put, you can't win when it comes to editing. HDV is just this way while expensive HDCAM, and even lower cost DVCPRO HD does not.

So now you bought the expensive computer, the professional software and you edited your movie and allowed the computer to render it for the next 20 hours. How do you watch it? Practical Choices- What I do here:

I lay the HDV edit master off to a Sony HDV master tape using the Camcorder. Then I take the camcorder to my HT room and connect a 1394 cable between the HVR Z1U output and my JVC DVHS VCR and pair the connection. Then I start the Camcorder playing back and when the color bars leader finish on my master I start the DVHS VCR to record the dub, manually. When done I stop recorder and now I have a DVHS HDTV dub for my home theater room. Considering that most people today have no means to play back HDV or HDTV media like DVHS (the only consumer HDTV media player today) I take the master HDTV timeline in my editor and with Sony Vegas, render out this to DVD downconvert to DVD resolution. This can be ported to Sony DVD Architecture, (can be purchased as a bundle with Vegas) Build some nice menus and burn a master DVD-R. Then if anyone wants a copy, I have that to distribute.

I have now done two projects this way and in one case I advised a HT enthusiast on getting a JVC DVHS VCR cheap and they have a no generation loss copy made with 1394 dubbing.

I suspect that my first DVD in HD deck will be a computer player-recorder to burn HDV DVD's for distribution of my works before I buy a set top box for the home theater. Most likely, It will be the Sony Blue Ray because I suspect Sony will have first support built into their software and I'm fixed to Sony for my professional works. 
I feel that I will have to wait until the DVD rental houses begin stocking movies on HD DVD or Blue Ray before thinking about 1080P projector and HD DVD for the HT.


----------



## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

DonLandis said:


> I've seen the Blue Ray and the DVD-HD and both are stunning on a 1080p, somewhat less difference on a 720P display. Consequently, I will wait for HD flavor of DVD either one until I first move to the 1080p Front projection system for my Home Theater. That could be at least 3 years from now. Maybe by then media will be plentiful in the rental houses but I'm not holding my breath. My professional use is on a different timetable.
> 
> Regarding your concern for distribution of HDV camcorder here's the scoop-
> 
> ...


Don, I've attempted a straight dub from Sony HDV to JVC HMDH40000 and keep getting serious frame lockups. Wasn't a necessary dub and thought of a compatability issue (this was 6 months ago). If you've done it, I must have a recorder issue. I'v tried 2 cables and 2 different record decks. No luck. Any suggestion? thanks


----------



## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

The only issue I found was that the JVC has to be ready and on but not recording, then you connect the HDV camcorder to it and wait for the pairing to show up. When that showed up you have to turn on the HDV first because there is nothing to sync to unless the HDV tape is rolling. That means you should have some leader on your HDV master before the program starts to allow the slow connect process to happen. I used 30 seconds of color bars followed by about a minute of black then a countdown and black again for about 10 seconds. That gave the DVHS tape about 10 seconds of leader before the program started. Then just hit record. It's pretty crude dub since you can't really control much but it works for me.

I'd say if you see the pairing, the your cabling is fine, then you just need to get the JVC to see audio and video from the tape. Remember, it won't until the HDV tape is rolling. One more tip, don't try to complicate things with the SVHS tape. I only had success with this using real DVHS tape stock.

Also, everyone who has the JVC DVHS 40K VCR knows the problems this deck had with image breakups due to any number of reasons from bad tape to clogged heads. DVHS from JVC was never a robust VCR but did have some nice features. I also have a Mitsubishi which records more reliably than the JVC. It just requires another 1394 input display to play the tapes back as it doesn't have an analog output.


----------



## AllieVi (Apr 10, 2002)

ibglowin said:


> ... I really want an HD Camcorder but without a DVD to burn the project back to in HD its pointless at this time. ...


I disagree.

While I have no interest in an HD set or player at this time, I *would* consider getting an HD camcorder for once-in-a-lifetime personal events (weddings, birthdays, first steps, etc.). When I finally do get around to being able to view it, at least the material will have been captured in HD.


----------



## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

Thanks Don, I'll try again


----------



## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

I might get a Blu-ray this summer. They are getting pretty cheap.


----------



## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

Wow... .a four year old thread.  Closing.


----------

