# No 1080p from DISH, if . . . .



## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

. . . you have a real HDTV. From what DISH says. 

After spending three days downloading A&E’s “The Beast” in 1080p, even though I have a 7MBps connection, when I went to watch it on my new 50” DLP it showed that it was 1080i. My display and the DISH box shows that the HDMI connection is 1080i and not p. When I went to "order" it I did not get the FPS test page. So I called DISH, got American TS and asked what this was all about? After all the proverbial trouble shooting and info gathering, it was determined that my set had a considerably higher Frame Rate (FPS) than they support, but my set should support. WHICH they equate to the Hz of your display and say that 24fps (24Hz) is the industry standard. I discussed with DISH, that with their math the actual industry standard of 60fps = 60Hz (30 Fields x2 = 60 Frames/Hz per second at least it was when I taught TV) and now there are 120HZ and I have seen 240Hz displays advertised, and that they are transmitting at, which by their standards this tells me 24fps = 24Hz, a very low and substandard frame rate. Of which DISH can not support any higher. They acknowledged this and I added that means many people will be severely upset that they will not be able to get 1080p from DISH and that they (DISH) will have to step up. Their reply was that they were sorry for my frustration.

If anyone has any further or deeper knowledge on this, I would love to hear it. But if the above is true, then that will explain why so many people can’t get 1080p on their displays, why the FPS tests are failing, and the better display you have the farther you are from 1080p with DISH. Although, 1080i on my DLP is gorgeous – especially with HDNET. And mine is a new, but lamp powered unit and not the newer LED or Laser (my next purchase).

Also the playback of the tri-day download was severely choppy in audio and picture, which was said to be a result of the L6.16 software and possibly a bad hard drive, or so I was told it was and why I have new 722 on its way. I’m looking to and have made arrangements to upgrade my 625 to a 922, and have been assured that it is only a 722 problem and not with the forthcoming 922. But nothing was said about the 622.

Oh and what’s with the OSG?!! But that will need to be another post.

. . . fb


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

My guess is the TS does not know what they are talking about. The 622 has the same problem and I doubt your replacement 722 will solve the problem.


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## olds403 (Nov 20, 2007)

I believe the 1080p content will only display at 1080p/24. Your tv must be able to display 1080p/24 material in order to view it in that format. That generally means that the refresh rate on the tv must be a multiple of 24, such as 72hz or 120hz. If your tv doesn't support 1080p24 it will default to 1080i/60. 

Can you view blu-rays at 1080p24? This would be a good indicator of whether or not you can view 1080p24 content at all. Not all HDTV's can display this frame rate.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

HobbyTalk said:


> My guess is the TS does not know what they are talking about. The 622 has the same problem and I doubt your replacement 722 will solve the problem.


When I received the confirmation that a new unit was being shipped, I told them that I would be trying it before I shipped the old one back. I have a ton of programming on it and when asked they said they had no way to archive it. I am so over losing programming when having to exchange receivers. I plan to get an external drive and start loading that up first, just in case.

Both TS's that I spoke with were from the Executive Office. But I am not saying that they know all.

So . . . .


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

olds403 said:


> I believe the 1080p content will only display at 1080p/24. Your tv must be able to display 1080p/24 material in order to view it in that format. That generally means that the refresh rate on the tv must be a multiple of 24, such as 72hz or 120hz. If your tv doesn't support 1080p24 it will default to 1080i/60.
> 
> Can you view blu-rays at 1080p24? This would be a good indicator of whether or not you can view 1080p24 content at all. Not all HDTV's can display this frame rate.


That makes perfect sense. But I have never heard of 1080p24, nor have seen it advertised nor printed on packaging, until I read about it in a "Dark Knight" thread, that I came back to for clarification but there was none and that is why I posted this. The FPS is not as DISH implied, but as you say a multiple of, in looking at the Hz I saw the regular natural progression of 60, 120, 240. But then the 120 & 240 are multiples of 24.

I have several Blu-ray discs but am waiting for a specific player to work out some bugs and then I'll snag it. So at the moment I have no Blu-ray source. But I'll tell ya, this DLP's picture, even at 1080i (OTA beats the box) can bring a tear to your eye. And Direct OTA being better than the box which I was told by an Exec TR is a software issue with the 722 that they are aware of and are working on.

Now I am very curious. But I wonder why the Tech Rep that I just spoke with couldn't tell me this? I would have understood immediately and it would have shortened our exchange dynamically. Instead I was told that I am out of their range.

You might want to go over to the "Dark Knight" thread and see if this might not fit there. Where they were talking of about the compatibility test that I did not get. Which led me to believe that I was compatible.

Anyway . . .

Thanks . . .
. . . fb


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## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

Same with DirecTV, your panel must be able to do 24 (even if all it does is convert it to 60). 1080p24 is the "standard" for this. Same with Blue Ray. I just got a new 1080p Plasma and made sure it accepted 1080p24 input before I bought. If it didn't do 24 then it wasn't even on the list.


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

What model DLP do you have? Someone will be able to look it up and see if it supports 24fps. There is a list on the AVS forums somewhere but I don't have the link.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Search for "1080p" and read IIP's posts - he explained it for you many times already.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=144894

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=149231


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## Borgie (Dec 30, 2006)

I have a sammy DLP HLT-5087S. When watching the 1080P version of the beast it also displays as 1080i.

I know the TV will accept 24p output because my Sony BDP-S300 has a setup for 24P output.

With it off my display shows as [email protected]
With in on my display shows as [email protected]

I noticed on the 622 menu HDTV setup thewre is no choice for 1080P. Or is that just for over the air or cable?

This is the first 1080p download for me and there was no "test". I'm not going to pay for any others at this point as its cheaper with netflix.


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## JS_racer (Aug 25, 2007)

if its any help, i have a samsung 67a750 dlp connected with hdmi to my 622. my set passes the 501ppv 1080p 24 test. so i dl the beast 1080p, not knowing a thing about the show, just looking for a 1080p anything. the beast starts playing in 1080i, not 24p. well the d/l was quick but wtf, thought it was 1080p. how can i pass the 501 1080p test and d/l a 1080p in 1080i ?? something is borked here, don't think its my end.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

Dish definitely has issues with their 1080/24p HDMI detection/handshake, and they are working on the problem. Many TVs that are known to support 1080/24p are not currently being detected properly. DirecTV had very similar problems with their 1080/24p HDMI issues, and have resolved them, so I suspect it won't be too long before Dish's issues are fixed as well.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

HobbyTalk said:


> What model DLP do you have? Someone will be able to look it up and see if it supports 24fps. There is a list on the AVS forums somewhere but I don't have the link.


I have the Samsung HL50A650 of which Samsung just replied to my inquiry on this with a spec sheet that I have at least 10 copies scattered on my hard drives and completely forgot about since I purchased. It shows that my DLP is, and this is the good part:
 

Samsung *Cinema Smooth™ 120Hz light engine*:
Full HD 1920 x 1080p performance featuring digital format converter for all inputs
Single-panel DLP® design-crystal-clear picture without any possibility of convergence errors
Smooth, high detail, film-like images for an inviting picture experience

3 HDMI inputs:
480p/720p/1080i/1080p *(60Hz/30Hz/24Hz)* input support
HDMI with universal CEC system control
Simplay certified for cross component compatibility

2-component video inputs(480i/480p/720p/1080i/1080p)
 I remember reading all this many times and just thought all the bases were covered, but did not factor the individual specs. That's why I went this route. Plus at the time this was not as important as it is now. Although I was assured that I would be covered. So if what is said above is true, my current 722, which is dying as I type, hopefully is more defective than I thought and it's just not reading the set as it should. It's good that I have another on the way. I will dig further and may have to call my Exec TSR and discuss this with him. If the boxes are reading HDMI connections wrong, which would not surprise me, I will not be the only one with issues, as I have been reading. That would explain why I did not get the Res Check window? But not why my set shows me hooked up at 1080i and not p.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

P Smith said:


> Search for "1080p" and read IIP's posts - he explained it for you many times already.


Excuse me.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

IIP said:


> Dish definitely has issues with their 1080/24p HDMI detection/handshake, and they are working on the problem. Many TVs that are known to support 1080/24p are not currently being detected properly. DirecTV had very similar problems with their 1080/24p HDMI issues, and have resolved them, so I suspect it won't be too long before Dish's issues are fixed as well.


That's what I was hoping was the problem and hopefully it will get fixed soon. Unfortunately, I'm one that can see this stuff. I see the Rainbowing on the DLP at times when I glance across the screen quickly. Who says good eye sight is a virtue?

Thanks for the confirmation.

. . . fb


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

FarmerBob said:


> Excuse me.


Well, then post#9 should help you also.

Let me add more - try to find threads about "EDID" and do your contribution for fix the problem.


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

FarmerBob said:


> That's what I was hoping was the problem and hopefully it will get fixed soon. Unfortunately, I'm one that can see this stuff. I see the Rainbowing on the DLP at times when I glance across the screen quickly. Who says good eye sight is a virtue?


I believe that is a common effect on DLP sets and not an effect of the input fps speed.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

HobbyTalk said:


> I believe that is a common effect on DLP sets and not an effect of the input fps speed.


It has to do with the color engines. Basically the lamp and DLP chip create a B&W picture and the color engine adds RGB, individually, to whole frames. But the newer higher/multiple Hz (mine), "Jutter" less, LED and Laser versions don't do it at all. And only about 20% or so of the population can see this. But they are also more susceptible to the "jutter" that is the result of frame rate and pulldown. That's what I was implying. It's all personal "perception". I saw it more when I first got my DLP, then as time went on either I don't realize it as much anymore or just filter it out. So the frame rate jutter is something that I see more than others around me. And more lately along with an overall deterioration of picture through the 722. And through this site I have read why the 722 is misreading the DLP. So anything could happen. But it's official, the bottom is falling out of my box. Tonight I had to "hard" reset it twice and it still seems possessed.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

. . . yesterday. Now I have to jam and watch all the fair that I have on the old one and swap them out. I'll probably install the new one and leave the old one connected to the system watch my stuff until I have to get it out the door and monitor the new one. I did warn them that I was going to meter the situation before sending anything back. It may be the new one depending on if it works . . . or not.

So . . . we'll see.

. . . fb


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

. . . the new box has more bugs than the old one. I have written the person that I was dealing with via eMail asking which box to send back, but the last reply that I received did not apply to anything that I asked nor wrote about. I re-replied and am waiting on a reply to that. I have the old box ready to ship, late, but called and talked this over with a very pleasant and knowledgeable TSR who said just sent it back anytime. I told him I would wait until Monday to hear back from the original TSR.

But this new box crashes and resets itself at least once a day and it's usually while recording something. And I have noticed that since it has started doing that the overall picture has become quite grainy. And that is above and beyond the known picture quality software bug that is in the works. In one of my last eMails to the TSR he/she assured me that the problems in the 722 were not present in the 922, so in the last eMail exchange I asked how I could get one. I'm done with playing around with buggy gear. No response . . . yet.

So . . . we'll see.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

FarmerBob said:


> In one of my last eMails to the TSR he/she assured me that the problems in the 722 were not present in the 922, so in the last eMail exchange I asked how I could get one.


Considering the 922 is at least 6 months from being released, the CSR was blowing smoke. There's no way for the CSR to know what the 922 will be like.

In general, the 722s are pretty stable, but like any complicated machine, there are going to be some bad ones out there. It happens. And there are bound to be software problems, as Dish continues to develop the software that runs their DVRs to add features and keep up with changes, and those software issues will be addressed in time. The 722 is currently Dish's showpiece receiver, so there is a lot of motivation to keep it working well.

I would return the replacement receiver and ask for a second replacement.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

IIP said:


> Considering the 922 is at least 6 months from being released, the CSR was blowing smoke. There's no way for the CSR to know what the 922 will be like.
> 
> In general, the 722s are pretty stable, but like any complicated machine, there are going to be some bad ones out there. It happens. And there are bound to be software problems, as Dish continues to develop the software that runs their DVRs to add features and keep up with changes, and those software issues will be addressed in time. The 722 is currently Dish's showpiece receiver, so there is a lot of motivation to keep it working well.
> 
> I would return the replacement receiver and ask for a second replacement.


This is what I just got back from the eMail Tech, what a waste and I wanted a paper trail, but . . ._Thank you for your email. The issues you described in your previous email are currently software issue on the 772 receiver. Our engineering is currently working on software that will be sent your receiver via satellite signal._​So . . . since I was not authorized to send back the new unit, the old one is going back and I will now call the Exec Level instead of the eMail route. Oh and the new one has SWV: L617.


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## EdN (May 5, 2007)

HobbyTalk said:


> What model DLP do you have? Someone will be able to look it up and see if it supports 24fps. There is a list on the AVS forums somewhere but I don't have the link.


I have a Samsung HL-T6189S. Does anyone know if it supports 24fps?


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## waynebtx (Dec 24, 2006)

Borgie said:


> I have a sammy DLP HLT-5087S. When watching the 1080P version of the beast it also displays as 1080i.
> 
> I know the TV will accept 24p output because my Sony BDP-S300 has a setup for 24P output.
> 
> ...


As already said Directv has the same only 1080p/24 supported My sammy HL-S6187 will only do 1080p/60


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

EdN said:


> I have a Samsung HL-T6189S. Does anyone know if it supports 24fps?


Well from what I can find:

7 A/V inputs, including:
- 2 composite video
- 2 S-video
- 2 component video (accepts signals up to 1080p)
- 3 HDMI v1.3 (accepts signals up to 1080p - 60Hz, *24Hz*)

You have the 61" version of the 50"er I was looking for but it just disappeared. Evryone had in their computers as an item as stock, but no inventory nor any due dates. So I went for the lamp version mostly because I got a "really" great price, the size was perfect and a 4 year warranty for the parts that are not as easy to replace as the lamp.

From what I have seen in regard to DLP's, Frame Rate is not an issue for the format. Especially the LED models like yours or the Lasers. With its, insert jeaousy here, depending on where you look, 11k-22k hours life on the LEDs. The light engines support anything. Mine is 24/30/60.


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## daveray (Feb 12, 2004)

EdN said:


> I have a Samsung HL-T6189S. Does anyone know if it supports 24fps?


http://forums.highdefdigest.com/hom...24-signal-multiplies-original-frame-rate.html


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## poyzin (Jan 19, 2009)

Just my experience: I am able to watch a pay VOD movie in 1080p on my brand new Panasonic plasma but I cannot get The Beast to play in 1080p. All I get is 1080i. The Beast never goes through the compatability test like the pay movie does. And yes, the Panny can play at 24 fps. This is on a VIP 612.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

poyzin said:


> Just my experience: I am able to watch a pay VOD movie in 1080p on my brand new Panasonic plasma but I cannot get The Beast to play in 1080p. All I get is 1080i. The Beast never goes through the compatability test like the pay movie does. And yes, the Panny can play at 24 fps. This is on a VIP 612.


I just got a replacement 722 and after getting it all set up in the early morning I thought I would try the "Beast" thing again. This time I got the verification screens (2) and in the download area the title was prefixed with 1080p. Whereas, the last time there was no prefix. AND this time it only took hours other than 3 days like last time to download.

Once it had landed, it said it was 1080p, but my 1080p TV still showed that the HDMI connection with the 722 was 1080i. So I don't think that the 722 can convert or is broken in that feature. In the Analysis area under HDMI Test it says that the connecton is 1080i and in the area where it lists the capabilities of my set it 720p, 1080i, 480p, 480i. It also says that my set was made in Mid November 2007. The label (must be accurate by law) on the back and the manufacturer warranty paperwork says August 2008. That's quite a difference. And I know that stock flows a lot quicker than this implies.

I would not be surprised, since HDMI color is really bad due to software glitches as per a DISH.

I really doubt that there is 1080p capability in the 722. But after a back door unannounced update it may make this a reality. But until then . . .


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

_"I really doubt that there is 1080p capability in the 722."_
You should take second thought - it is *works *from day one of first spooling 1080p DOD [ch 501] movie [IAL] on thousands 622/722 DVRs.
The free 1080p DishONLINE movies are different story.


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## DustoMan (Jul 16, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> Test it says that the connection is 1080i and in the area where it lists the capabilities of my set it 720p, 1080i, 480p, 480i. It also says that my set was made in Mid November 2007. The label (must be accurate by law) on the back and the manufacturer warranty paperwork says August 2008. That's quite a difference. And I know that stock flows a lot quicker than this implies.


Do you think that the test is reading when the firmware on the HDMI chipset was baked? Couldn't it be possible that a set manufactured in Aug 2008 could be using chipset firmware from November 2007 if whoever made the set was satisfied with it and didn't want to make any changes?


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## DustoMan (Jul 16, 2005)

poyzin said:


> Just my experience: I am able to watch a pay VOD movie in 1080p on my brand new Panasonic plasma but I cannot get The Beast to play in 1080p. All I get is 1080i. The Beast never goes through the compatability test like the pay movie does. And yes, the Panny can play at 24 fps. This is on a VIP 612.


What model Panasonic? Cause my Panasonic TH-42PZ85U can ACCEPT 24fps, but is can't DISPLAY 24fps. Only the two higher models, the 800U and 850U can playback 24fps.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

DustoMan said:


> Do you think that the test is reading when the firmware on the HDMI chipset was baked? Couldn't it be possible that a set manufactured in Aug 2008 could be using chipset firmware from November 2007 if whoever made the set was satisfied with it and didn't want to make any changes?


That makes sense, that it's reading the chipset and reporting that the set has that manufacture date. But then that would lock the set into the features of that date. This is suppose to be, as per Samsung direct, a 1080p 24/30/60 monitor. I would hope that if there were other factors that complete the operation of the set that they would be seen also. This means that it would not let me have 1080p access. Although it does acknowledge that it has 1080i capability. And I have never seen a set that if it has 1080i does not have 1080p.


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> And I have never seen a set that if it has 1080i does not have 1080p.


Surely you meant that the other way, right? There are millions of 1080i sets out there (and a bunch more that are 720P or 768P but will accept 1080i max) that were sold before 1080P capable became "the standard". And then there are the 1080P displays that will not accept any form of 1080P input.

As for the HDMI information passed to the reciever from the TV, it's been widely speculated (possibly even proven) that this has absolutely nothing to do with it being successful in passing E*'s 1080P test. There are certainly plenty of sets that pass the 1080P test but only report 1080i as the max resolution via the HDMI information you are referring to.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

P Smith said:


> _"I really doubt that there is 1080p capability in the 722."_
> _You should take second thought - it is *works *from day one of first spooling 1080p DOD [ch 501] movie [IAL] on thousands 622/722 DVRs._
> The free 1080p DishONLINE movies are different story.


Sorry, but I don't quite understand what you are trying to say.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

bobukcat said:


> Surely you meant that the other way, right? There are millions of 1080i sets out there (and a bunch more that are 720P or 768P but will accept 1080i max) that were sold before 1080P capable became "the standard". And then there are the 1080P displays that will not accept any form of 1080P input.
> 
> As for the HDMI information passed to the reciever from the TV, it's been widely speculated (possibly even proven) that this has absolutely nothing to do with it being successful in passing E*'s 1080P test. There are certainly plenty of sets that pass the 1080P test but only report 1080i as the max resolution via the HDMI information you are referring to.


I'm not surprised that the DISH box is not reading or interacting with sets properly. And nope, I meant what I said. We have been researching TV's for over two years with Frame Rate and Resolution as key factors. All the TV's that I have seen that are 1080i capable, also do 1080p. When looking at 1080 devices. Now I have seen lower res sets that emulate 1080, that is probably what you are talking about, but I am not. I have found DLP's, mostly the DLP engine, are more feature rich and universal in full spectrum operation, and do not fall into feature restricted categories that LCD's and Plamsa's do. Mine does it all and is amazing.


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> Sorry, but I don't quite understand what you are trying to say.


He's saying that your assertion that the 722 doesn't really have the capability to do 1080P is false and that it has worked with some (not all) sets from the first day that 1080PVOD became available (I Am Legend was the movie IIRC). How well it works with the 1080P Dish On Line offerings appears to be different.


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> I have found DLP's, mostly the DLP engine, are more feature rich and universal in full spectrum operation, and do not fall into feature restricted categories that LCD's and Plamsa's do. Mine does it all and is amazing.


You do know that your DLP chip is not 1080P native and uses wobbulation to achieve 1080, right?

As for not seeing 1080i sets that don't do 1080P it would not have been hard to find such a creature as little as two years ago.


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

FarmerBob said:


> I'm not surprised that the DISH box is not reading or interacting with sets properly. And nope, I meant what I said. We have been researching TV's for over two years with Frame Rate and Resolution as key factors. All the TV's that I have seen that are 1080i capable, also do 1080p. When looking at 1080 devices. Now I have seen lower res sets that emulate 1080, that is probably what you are talking about, but I am not. I have found DLP's, mostly the DLP engine, are more feature rich and universal in full spectrum operation, and do not fall into feature restricted categories that LCD's and Plamsa's do. Mine does it all and is amazing.


Must not have looked very hard. A number of Panasonic sets can accept 1080i but not 1080p..... I own one.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

bobukcat said:


> You do know that your DLP chip is not 1080P native and uses wobbulation to achieve 1080, right?
> 
> As for not seeing 1080i sets that don't do 1080P it would not have been hard to find such a creature as little as two years ago.


As per Texas Instruments, the maker of the DLP chip, it is Full Spectrum 1080p capable. What chip are you talking about?

Also as per Samsung: _All the DLP TVs in the 2008 HLxxA series (mine HL50a650) have resolutions of 1920 by 1080 (1080p). If the resolution of the incoming signal is not 1080p (that is, it is 1080i, 720i, 480p, or 480i), these DLP TVs will convert the resolution to 1080p._

And the specs for my set that I post earlier that you didn't see:


Samsung *Cinema Smooth™ 120Hz light engine*:
Full HD 1920 x 1080p performance featuring digital format converter for all inputs
Single-panel DLP® design-crystal-clear picture without any possibility of convergence errors
Smooth, high detail, film-like images for an inviting picture experience

3 HDMI inputs:
480p/720p/1080i/1080p *(60Hz/30Hz/24Hz)* input support
HDMI with universal CEC system control
Simplay certified for cross component compatibility

2-component video inputs(480i/480p/720p/1080i/1080p)


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

HobbyTalk said:


> Must not have looked very hard. A number of Panasonic sets can accept 1080i but not 1080p..... I own one.


Was looking very hard. Just wasn't looking at Panasonic. Nor Plasma.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

bobukcat said:


> He's saying that your assertion that the 722 doesn't really have the capability to do 1080P is false and that it has worked with some (not all) sets from the first day that 1080PVOD became available (I Am Legend was the movie IIRC). How well it works with the 1080P Dish On Line offerings appears to be different.


In that light, why would it work for one side of the box and not the other especially since the big deal that was made about it?

*UPDATE:*

I just spoke with DISH and there is no difference between the DISHOnline area and VOD, other than with DOL you have to wait for the download and VOD is ready to view instantly. If it is labeled 1080p it is 1080p.

As far as the question of a "software" problems with the 722 accurately reading the res of a TV, as I was told a couple of week ago, it was said not to be know, but rose enough curiosity at the American call center for the Supervisor to submit a ticket and escalate it. So maybe soon we'll know.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

One thing to be clear. 1080p support on the 722 only happens when you watch a 1080p show. there is no 1080p setting in the output settings. The process as I understand it tests your set and if it passes it will do 1080p if it fails it drops down to 1080i. 

There have been some reports of it not working with certain TV sets, but the feature is there and it does work (Bugs not withstanding).


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## DustoMan (Jul 16, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> In that light, why would it work for one side of the box and not the other especially since the big deal that was made about it?


It could be something with how the video files are encoded. Perhaps they have to be wrapped in one way when transmitted over the satellite link to the receiver overnight as opposed to be downloaded over the internet. Without knowing intimate details as to how the videos are served up, there's no way to know for sure.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

FarmerBob said:


> Sorry, but I don't quite understand what you are trying to say.


Sorry, but asserting just false statements doesn't work either. 
'622/722 doesn't support 1080p' or 'HDTV do 1080p but not 1080i'.

There is a ton of posts about 1080p/24, Dish or DTV 1080p movies - one IIP posted a lot. Just read and absorb.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

Ron Barry said:


> One thing to be clear. 1080p support on the 722 only happens when you watch a 1080p show. there is no 1080p setting in the output settings. The process as I understand it tests your set and if it passes it will do 1080p if it fails it drops down to 1080i.
> 
> There have been some reports of it not working with certain TV sets, but the feature is there and it does work (Bugs not withstanding).


Then since on this new 722 where I got the secondary ResCheck screen and the downloaded program had 1080p all over the listing, it MUST mean that I am 1080p. But there is nothing between the two devices during playback that blatantly says so.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

P Smith said:


> Sorry, but asserting just false statements doesn't work either.
> '622/722 doesn't support 1080p' or 'HDTV do 1080p but not 1080i'.
> 
> There is a ton of posts about 1080p/24, Dish or DTV 1080p movies - one IIP posted a lot. Just read and absorb.


Sorry. Again I don't read crypt. And those statements are my opinion as are yours. And nothing of either are false. Unless you can prove it. And I have yet to see anything beyond speculation and inferences that out and out confirms or denies the my issue. That's the reason for this discussion the hope of firm information to confirm or dispel my "false" statement.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

FarmerBob said:


> Then since on this new 722 where I got the secondary ResCheck screen and the downloaded program had 1080p all over the listing, it MUST mean that I am 1080p. But there is nothing between the two devices during playback that blatantly says so.


I only have 1080i so I don't know exactly what to expect. I do know from reading here that when you play the video it checks and if you have 1080p display it outputs the video in 1080p. If you don't or it fails the check it tells you and provides you with a choice to watch it at 1080i. That is how it works.. So if you play it and it passes the check and plays I would assume you are watching it at 1080p.

Can anyone with a 1080p display that has watched the 1080p movies confirm this process since I am going off the top of my head.

Have to check the res check screen but my guess it is indicating 1080i because that is one of the outputs of the 722. You can't have 1080p output as your default it just happens as part of the 1080p movies.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ron, we got a lot of confirmations right after IAL start spooling, it been posted here. Some ppl posted EDID info from their TVs what correctly display 1080p from 622/722 ! [You should knew that]


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> Sorry. Again I don't read crypt. And those statements are my opinion as are yours. And nothing of either are false. Unless you can prove it. And I have yet to see anything beyond speculation and inferences that out and out confirms or denies the my issue. That's the reason for this discussion the hope of firm information to confirm or dispel my "false" statement.


It took me 2 minutes or less to find this post of someone who has succesfully watched 1080P from both the VOD and DOL, I don't know what kind of "proof" that your statement (that the 722 cannot really do 1080P) is false you want unless you're saying you just don't believe other people. I know if I continue searching I will find more as I remember reading them. From what I gathered it seems more people have success watching 1080P from VOD than the DOL.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=1973272#post1973272


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

FarmerBob said:


> As per Texas Instruments, the maker of the DLP chip, it is Full Spectrum 1080p capable. What chip are you talking about?
> 
> Also as per Samsung: _All the DLP TVs in the 2008 HLxxA series (mine HL50a650) have resolutions of 1920 by 1080 (1080p). If the resolution of the incoming signal is not 1080p (that is, it is 1080i, 720i, 480p, or 480i), these DLP TVs will convert the resolution to 1080p._
> 
> ...


The chip does not have enough mirrors on it to display the 2M+ pixels (it has 960 mirrors IIRC) so it uses a technology called Wobbulation to display the full resolution buy doing it in pieces (albeit very, very fast). In other words half of the each pixel is drawn, the mirror shifts very slightly and then the other half is drawn. That's a simplification of it of course, but that is essentially what's going on.


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## Michael P (Oct 27, 2004)

FarmerBob said:


> When I received the confirmation that a new unit was being shipped, I told them that I would be trying it before I shipped the old one back. I have a ton of programming on it and when asked they said they had no way to archive it. I am so over losing programming when having to exchange receivers. I plan to get an external drive and start loading that up first, just in case.
> 
> Both TS's that I spoke with were from the Executive Office. But I am not saying that they know all.
> 
> So . . . .


No way to archive???? All you need is an EHD and $39.95 one-time fee to E* and you can archive. All you need is a 1 TB single platter EHD.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Michael P said:


> No way to archive???? All you need is an EHD and $39.95 one-time fee to E* and you can archive. All you need is a 1 TB single platter EHD.


You'll need to provide a proof of your statements !


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## ZBoomer (Feb 21, 2008)

bobukcat said:


> The chip does not have enough mirrors on it to display the 2M+ pixels (it has 960 mirrors IIRC) so it uses a technology called Wobbulation to display the full resolution buy doing it in pieces (albeit very, very fast). In other words half of the each pixel is drawn, the mirror shifts very slightly and then the other half is drawn. That's a simplification of it of course, but that is essentially what's going on.


This is true (wobulation) but regardless of the way it does it, there are 1920x1080 addressable pixels on the screen. Yes, it uses the same mirror to display more than one pixel by doing it twice as fast, but who cares; the net effect is you still have 1920x1080 pixels that are independant. Many folks think it actually produces a better picture because there is less screen-door effect with wobulation and a smoother more natural look.

A CRT does not illuminute all "pixels" at the same time either, but instead draws a raster down the screen one line after the other, and no one seems to think CRT's are bad.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

P Smith said:


> Ron, we got a lot of confirmations right after IAL start spooling, it been posted here. Some ppl posted EDID info from their TVs what correctly display 1080p from 622/722 ! [You should knew that]


Well I know that people were successful in watching 1080p content. What I could not confirm was the process and thus the reason for my post. I personally had not done it on a 1080p set but what I posted was what I recall people describing it as. So yes I do know people have been successful. Sorry if I did not give that impression.


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

ZBoomer said:


> This is true (wobulation) but regardless of the way it does it, there are 1920x1080 addressable pixels on the screen. Yes, it uses the same mirror to display more than one pixel by doing it twice as fast, but who cares; the net effect is you still have 1920x1080 pixels that are independant. Many folks think it actually produces a better picture because there is less screen-door effect with wobulation and a smoother more natural look.
> 
> A CRT does not illuminute all "pixels" at the same time either, but instead draws a raster down the screen one line after the other, and no one seems to think CRT's are bad.


I never said, nor meant to imply that Wobbulation was somehow a "bad" thing and in fact I've often gone on record in support of DLPs (although never another Mits after the WDxx725 POS that so many people are stuck with) particularly in the bang-for-the-buck department. I don't think it compares favorably with a good-quality plasma or LCD from a motion resolution standpoint nor off-axis viewing (particularly compared to plasma).

As far as the actual technology goes is still blows my mind to think of all those tiny little mirrors shifting back and forth at such speed and in perfect timing. :eek2:


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## ZBoomer (Feb 21, 2008)

bobukcat said:


> I never said, nor meant to imply that Wobbulation was somehow a "bad" thing


My bad, I'm just used to defending a dude I knew who was an SxRD freak, and used to bash DLP any chance he got. He always threw out the wobulation argument as if it meant it wasn't really a 1080p display, blah, blah.

I don't even own a DLP set, but just had to make sure I kept him in line, lol. I did own a DLP front projector for a while and thought it looked awesome though, I like the PQ of DLP in many ways. Motion handling expecially, for sports you just can't beat the response time.

You're right, it's amazing DLP works at all, much less so well; it's the mirrors!


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

Well obviously it doesn't work with my new DLP. I selected "The Beast" in 1080p, it went through the tests and in my DVR it says that there is a 1080p version to watch. When I watch it my monitor says that the 722 is connected at 1080i. So it may run through a test and DL the appropriate version, but when playing it back, at least mine, isn't connecting at 1080p.

I posed the question to my Exec Level TSR at DISH and, funny enough, he did not know and is having to check. I'll be curious to see what they have to say.

Also as per Texas Instruments (cut/copied directly from the TI DLP site):*True 1080p technology*

DLP® 1080p technology *delivers over 2 million pixels on-screen with full 1920 x 1080 resolution*, the highest available. With a DLP® 1080p HDTV you can experience the best that HDTV has to offer today, and be ready to enjoy all the 1080 sports, gaming and entertainment content that's on the horizon. *HDTVs with DLP® 1080p technology are available right now.*

With outstanding picture quality, unparalleled pixel response time that's ideal for sports and gaming, a reliable, long-lasting picture and true 1080p technology, it's easy to see how *DLP® technology delivers the ultimate HDTV and projector (movie theatres) experience.*
​*Links:*
*What is DLP: *http://www.dlp.com/tech/what.aspx
*Why DLP:* http://www.dlp.com/tech/why.aspx


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

But it does not say if that model of TV that contains DLP will accept a 24fps signal. If it will not accept a 24fps signal, then it is not the "ultimate HDTV and projector experience".


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## ZBoomer (Feb 21, 2008)

I am not sure anyone has been able to watch the Beast on dishonline in 1080p, regardless if their TV accepts 1080p/24 or not. My TV most definitely DOES, and my 722 won't even attempt to send it. It works with 1080p VOD, but not Dishonline.

It shows it in 1080i; it looks good mind you, but doesn't even attempt to do 1080p on it.


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## Jeff_DML (Feb 12, 2008)

ZBoomer said:


> I am not sure anyone has been able to watch the Beast on dishonline in 1080p, regardless if their TV accepts 1080p/24 or not. My TV most definitely DOES, and my 722 won't even attempt to send it. It works with 1080p VOD, but not Dishonline.
> 
> It shows it in 1080i; it looks good mind you, but doesn't even attempt to do 1080p on it.


seen picture evidence of people watching the beast in 1080p24, same tv as mine too, pioneer pdp-5020. My is always 1080i:nono2:


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## TvilleBee (Feb 11, 2007)

to bob: Have downloaded & read the owners maunal for your set directly from Samsung's site... the only mention of 1080p for your set is in the PC connection section & blatently states the only refresh rate is 60Hz. I'm begining to think your Sammy is an entry level unit (based on reading the literature) & you're expecting EVERY single DLP set to be the same... don't think you can blame dish for this one. My suggestion is to find a friend that has a Blu-Ray or PS3 that you can hook up to make sure you've got what you expect to have....


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## DustoMan (Jul 16, 2005)

TvilleBee said:


> to bob: Have downloaded & read the owners maunal for your set directly from Samsung's site... the only mention of 1080p for your set is in the PC connection section & blatently states the only refresh rate is 60Hz. I'm begining to think your Sammy is an entry level unit (based on reading the literature) & you're expecting EVERY single DLP set to be the same... don't think you can blame dish for this one. My suggestion is to find a friend that has a Blu-Ray or PS3 that you can hook up to make sure you've got what you expect to have....


FWIW, I looked at your manual too and there's no mention of 24fps at all. There's something called a "film mode" in your video options but it's for every other resolution but 1080p.


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## DustoMan (Jul 16, 2005)

Jeff_DML said:


> seen picture evidence of people watching the beast in 1080p24, same tv as mine too, pioneer pdp-5020. My is always 1080i:nono2:


I would take a look at their picture options to see if there are any features you need to enable or disable to produce a 1080p24 picture.


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## JS_racer (Aug 25, 2007)

i have a samsung 67a750 led lit dlp. mine will pass the test from 501 with 1080p but the beast does no test and offers the I version. i can hit info on the tv remote and it will say 1080p 24 when testing on 501ppv or from my ps3 BR discs.

I know my set will take the 1080p 24 signal but the beast on line wont let me get it. 

hope this helps.


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## poyzin (Jan 19, 2009)

DustoMan said:


> What model Panasonic? Cause my Panasonic TH-42PZ85U can ACCEPT 24fps, but is can't DISPLAY 24fps. Only the two higher models, the 800U and 850U can playback 24fps.


I have a Panasonic Viera TH-50PZ800U. No problem with 1080p at 24fps from pay channel 501. It did the test steps and passed. Watched Dark Knight in 1080p. Absolutely cannot get The Beast to play at 1080p.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

HobbyTalk said:


> But it does not say if that model of TV that contains DLP will accept a 24fps signal. If it will not accept a 24fps signal, then it is not the "ultimate HDTV and projector experience".


As per the specs I posted above for the second time that you missed:


Samsung *Cinema Smooth™ 120Hz Light Engine*:
Full HD 1920 x 1080p performance featuring digital format converter for all inputs
Single-panel DLP® design-crystal-clear picture without any possibility of convergence errors
Smooth, high detail, film-like images for an inviting picture experience

3 HDMI inputs:
480p/720p/1080i/*1080p* *(60Hz/30Hz/24Hz)* *input support*
HDMI with universal CEC system control
Simplay certified for cross component compatibility

2-component video inputs(480i/480p/720p/1080i/1080p)
That's the beauty of the DLP chip now and the future ones where there is no question because they are not bound by the FPS limitation of LCD and Plasma. They just do what they are told. And at least my model line of monitors was made just for high end output which as the operational specs say, covers all the bases naturally without resampling.

Also, I think I read in a review on the Beast that it was "taped" as a made for TV presentation and thus 60fps. And not getting it in 1080p through the DISH box would not surprise me what with all the problems they are having with software. As soon as something I would want to pay to see comes up on VOD/PPV I will get it and see if my box outputs a 1080p signal.

I have tried several 1080p BD players and my monitor shows a 1080p connection, and when the unit have, as some of the newer ones do, a setting to restrict output to 24fps, my set was beautiful. But the question or "statement" is on regard to the DISH 722 and not BD players that have played nicely with my set.

Take Care Y'all . . .
. . . fb


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

TvilleBee said:


> to bob: Have downloaded & read the owners maunal for your set directly from Samsung's site... the only mention of 1080p for your set is in the PC connection section & blatently states the only refresh rate is 60Hz. I'm begining to think your Sammy is an entry level unit (based on reading the literature) & you're expecting EVERY single DLP set to be the same... don't think you can blame dish for this one. My suggestion is to find a friend that has a Blu-Ray or PS3 that you can hook up to make sure you've got what you expect to have....


Samsung's literature is not the best in the world, it loses a lot in translation (see my multiple postings of the actual tech specs) and is lacking greatly or they just choose not to include certain information that does not pertain to the situation other than qualifying it (as if a common practice in Asian translations). I checked with Texas Instruments and was told most definitely the generation chip in my monitor and future generations due to their design and operation are not subject to what one needs to worry about in 24fps/Hz nor any FPS issues. The DLP chip functions differently than the way LCDs do. So much so that is what they use in the new Theatre Projection units. So think about a picture being made that large and all the subtleties that will have to be dealt with to make it viable along with the latest innovation in IMAX 8k to 2k conversion. There's a real taste test for ya all.

As far as Samsung and their product lines there are no "entry" level designations. They are:
The A650 Series has the lamp = 50(size of screen)A650
The A750 Series has an LED light source
and the new 88 Series which is listed and not really discussed.​Mine is only the smallest, not entry level, because I can only fit a 50" where is placed. I have a 70" Mistubishi LaserVue (Post Retool) on order and a 73" Samsung LED on its way.

And another really nice aspect of DLP is that they openly state that due to the technology they are able to make larger screens inexpensively. And that is why DLPs are 50" (now 56" their smallest) and up. Which I think would make most think "entry level" only because I'm not paying a ton of money. And with the LED light sources that are estimated at a 11-13 year life expectancy, I'm sold. Or have been sold and have been since the announcement of the DLP long before it was commercially available for all the reasons stated in this forum.


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## Jason Whiddon (Aug 17, 2006)

Dish has admitted the problem is on their end. The 722 chip, as well as the Directv chips can do 1080p/24 only, which is why so many with Directv where mad when the 1080p came down (they had tv's that did not support 1080p/24 and could not watch).

I tried a couple of the beasts and they dont work for me in 1080p either, all I get is 1080i. Its not the tv(mine does 1080p/24), its a issue dish is working on.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

elwaylite said:


> Dish has admitted the problem is on their end. The 722 chip, as well as the Directv chips can do 1080p/24 only, which is why so many with Directv where mad when the 1080p came down (they had tv's that did not support 1080p/24 and could not watch).


Actually, THAT problem is not "on Dish's end", but on the customer's end. The customers simply bought TVs that didn't have an important feature (granted, manufacturers chose not to add 24p support until 2006 at the earliest). That's not Dish's fault. Dish (and DirecTV, and Blu-Ray, and HD-DVD, etc.) are using the industry standard encoding method, 1080/24p, for their HD movies, as they should.



> I tried a couple of the beasts and they dont work for me in 1080p either, all I get is 1080i. Its not the tv(mine does 1080p/24), its a issue dish is working on.


This part IS Dish's issue. Many people who can watch Dish's 1080/24p pre-loaded movies are unable to view The Beast in 1080/24p. Either the problem is the encoding by the network (DirecTV had a similar problem with poorly-encoded content from Showtime), or it's a bug in the Dish receiver software. Either way, the best thing to do is report the problem to Dish so they can start working on a solution.


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## Jason Whiddon (Aug 17, 2006)

IIP said:


> Actually, THAT problem is not "on Dish's end", but on the customer's end. The customers simply bought TVs that didn't have an important feature (granted, manufacturers chose not to add 24p support until 2006 at the earliest). That's not Dish's fault. Dish (and DirecTV, and Blu-Ray, and HD-DVD, etc.) are using the industry standard encoding method, 1080/24p, for their HD movies, as they should.


Thats what I was saying. The issue with The Beast showing as 1080i when it should be 1080p is on their end, and theyve admitted as such.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

elwaylite said:


> Dish has admitted the problem is on their end. The 722 chip, as well as the Directv chips can do 1080p/24 only, which is why so many with Directv where mad when the 1080p came down (they had tv's that did not support 1080p/24 and could not watch). I tried a couple of the beasts and they dont work for me in 1080p either, all I get is 1080i. Its not the tv(mine does 1080p/24), its a issue dish is working on.


I was told by an Exec Level TSR that it was a software issue that they are working on. But since they were trying to get the 922 out the door that was taking priority. Plus the fix will be coming from software for the 922. Was also told that if my box DLs the 1080p version that my set passed the 1080p testing and that has nothing to do with 24fps. And since the Beast was Taped not Filmed is presented in the 1080p (vertical pixels, progressive scanning) format we have no idea if it is 24, 30 or 60. WHICH since it was taped is probably 1080p60. Anyway, this thread has gone off on a tangent. I was talking about that my box does not connect to my TV at 1080p but 1080i. Which is also denoted in the HDMI Analysis area. And that it can not present The Beast at 1080p as advertised. We have reports of it being a hardware issue and I was told it was a software issue. Who knows it could be a "we'll sucker them in with a prelude box and then they'll want the big new toy _OF WHICH_ I was told that you can not upgrade within 24 months of getting your 722. They won't let me upgrade my other 625 to a 722k since I upgrade a 625 to this 722 last November. The rep "whispered" that I would be better off buying one on eBay. But that is a totally different thing.

So the frame rate another issue is a totally separate thing as per these most inclusive Wikipedia listings: 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080p24
or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_Ready_1080p
and this very interesting article: _
1080p and the Acuity of Human Vision:_
http://www.audioholics.com/education/display-formats-technology/1080p-and-the-acuity-of-human-vision

I have an inquiry into A&E to see how The Beast was produced just to see. I'm very curious. But "if" it is 1080p60, it's still not coming over as 1080p. I've heard that there is another problem of the boxes not being able to accurately read the HDMI connection to the set. This could be the root of the whole problem.

Until then . . .


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

FarmerBob said:


> I was told that you can not upgrade within 24 months of getting your 722.


Dish's upgrade program limits you to one upgrade per 12 month period, so you could upgrade after a year.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

1080p60 will never happen regardless what you'd heard - just read BCM7038(7400 in 722k) chip spec.


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## poyzin (Jan 19, 2009)

More data regarding 1080p VOD. I have identical Panasonic plasmas capable of 24 FPS 1080p.

One is connected to a 612 which is connected via a wireless bridge. I can choose The Beast in HD in VOD but it never plays at 1080p even though the pay movies on 501 will play at 1080p.

The second TV is connected to a 622 and is hardwired to my router. The Beast listing in the VOD menu specifically says "1080p" in the title. So the difference has to be either the 622 vs the 612 or the wired ethernet vs the wireless bridge.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

"_or the wired ethernet vs the wireless bridge_" doesn't count here at all.


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## poyzin (Jan 19, 2009)

P Smith said:


> "_or the wired ethernet vs the wireless bridge_" doesn't count here at all.


Then are you saying that the inability to view The Beast in 1080p is strictly due to the 612 receiver vs the 622?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Correct.

Mentioned suggestion of different transport level what doesn't change parameters of stream.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

Some changes in the L618 code, but ..., see my post in the l618 thread http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2036106&postcount=53


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## Jeff_DML (Feb 12, 2008)

tnsprin said:


> Some changes in the L618 code, but ..., see my post in the l618 thread http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2036106&postcount=53


sweet, was hoping they would fix something in the new firmware, started downloading the latest episode of the beast last night


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I would rush to watch while it lasts ! In new FW the bug could reappear.


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## Jeff_DML (Feb 12, 2008)

tnsprin said:


> Some changes in the L618 code, but ..., see my post in the l618 thread http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2036106&postcount=53


latest the beast is now 1080p for me on my pioneer 5020 via my Onkyo 606 AVR


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## scandalous (Jan 14, 2008)

Jeff_DML said:


> latest the beast is now 1080p for me on my pioneer 5020 via my Onkyo 606 AVR


Same here both of The Beast episodes are coming in at 1080/24p.
I have a Sony Bravia KDL-42V4100

Although I could get 1080p from the VOD like all of you The Beast was never at 1080p and was always in 1080i. Now it is and the PQ looks great IMO!


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

I downloaded ep 107, got the 1080p confirmation window and it was labeled 1080p in My Downloads window but showed at 1080i. . .

Downloaded ep 108, same-same it was labeled 1080p, showed at 1080i AND was the same episode as 107. I mean it was ep 107 not 108, but labeled 108. Is the really bad and wrong EPG info creeping into this now?

I love when a series premier is labeled as ep 7 and the next weeks ep is labeled #15 and its origin date is sometime last year. When are they going to start using TVGuide as logoed on the page and not Zap2It?

This is NUTZ!


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## grog (Jul 3, 2007)

My set is reporting 1080p with .ep 108 here.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

grog said:


> My set is reporting 1080p with .ep 108 here.


Is your episode 108 and same as episode 107 as I have? I have two episodes that are the same but numbered and named differently.


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## scandalous (Jan 14, 2008)

FarmerBob said:


> Downloaded ep 108, same-same it was labeled 1080p, showed at 1080i AND was the same episode as 107. I mean it was ep 107 not 108, but labeled 108. Is the really bad and wrong EPG info creeping into this now?


I downloaded 108 earlier and just now (12:35am MST) tried to download 107 but it's gone now. Only 108 is left. Maybe they (Dish) realized it was screwed up and removed it.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

. . . in Analysis it still says under VideoFmt = 1080i. BUT now under Monitor Data > Supported formats: 720p 480i 1080i 1080p60 480p 1080p24 1080p30. In HDTV Setup it still only has 1080i for TV type. But I'll tell ya, i or p the picture on this DLP is gorgeous no matter what - including SD.

I went to the 108 episode of the Beast and it still connects at 1080i. And since erasing is not allowed, I can't redownload it. I'll have to wait until 109 or 108 times out and see if the DL process is the same and what I get to watch. I'll also check to see if there is anything on VOD or PPV in 1080p worth renting (that I don't already own) and test that.

"There is progress!!" Oh, 21.0 Remote Sync still crashes the 722.

*UPDATE:*
While I was looking for a 1080p VOD/PPV program, I looked in the DISHOnLine area and saw that The Beast ep 109 is available as HD, but not 1080p . . . yet.

*MORE UPDATES:*
I was able to erase the 108 (1080p) ep of The Beast that I had and have started re-downloading the 1080p labeled version, as I type. This time I only got one pop up that confirmed that I was DLing the 1080p version and did not get a secondary pop up mentioning something about resolution while telling me that I was getting the 1080p version. We'll see.

*FINAL UPDATE:*
Saw that the DL was done and fired up The Beast @ 1080p and the info panel on my DLP now says: *[email protected]* and the HDMI Test says: VideoFmt = 1250i_50Hz. I searched the forum and read about that.

So now it's official, I knew that my set was capable the whole time and it was an issue on the DISH end after all (as they told me it was). Sorry nay sayers. Oh and I love the Low Fat Cookie commercial in the middle of the show. Oh well.

_All fixed. Signing off. Take Care, Have Fun, and don't take yourself too seriously._
. . . fb


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

I think we need a survey of what sets now work and what ones, that really support 1080P24, don't. Several of us with Sony's (mine is a KDS55A3000) now report that it detects that the set supports 1080P24, but shows mostly black screen with occassional short glimpses of the show. Probably true of other brands. And of course we need to know what 1080p24 sets are still not detected as such.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

And I proposed a while ago to post your TV's EDID to help ENGINEERS fix the problem, not blah/blah what give a 'food' to marketing/sales ppl.


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## FarmerBob (Nov 28, 2002)

TvilleBee said:


> to bob: Have downloaded & read the owners maunal for your set directly from Samsung's site... the only mention of 1080p for your set is in the PC connection section & blatently states the only refresh rate is 60Hz. I'm begining to think your Sammy is an entry level unit (based on reading the literature) & you're expecting EVERY single DLP set to be the same... don't think you can blame dish for this one. My suggestion is to find a friend that has a Blu-Ray or PS3 that you can hook up to make sure you've got what you expect to have....


There is no such thing, in contemporary Samsung DLPs, as an entry level model. They're rated either Lamp or LED and by screen size and as of the L618 sw update mine reads in the Analysis area: _Monitor Data > Supported formats: 720p 480i 1080i 1080p60 480p 1080p24 1080p30_. So there was a SW issue.

P.S.
Not sure what manual you got, the one I have had the whole breakout of features that I posted. Please see my links to what DLP is all about. Also as I have posted DISH has admitted that there are/were software issues. I'm only blaming DISH for not providing what I was told they could when they sold me the TurboHD package.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

The issue is that many Tv sets even though they can handle 1080P24 don't correctly advertise their supported formats via the HDMI. DISH and DIRECTV call these Movies 1080P because they are progressive vs. interlaced but current chip sets in cable and DBS doen't support 1080P60 only 1080i,720P and 1080P24 (and other lower res formats).
ANyone know how big the files are or the bit rate used to encode ? That is one way to compare their content with the blu ray equivalent.


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## Jeff_DML (Feb 12, 2008)

dvrblogger said:


> The issue is that many Tv sets even though they can handle 1080P24 don't correctly advertise their supported formats via the HDMI. DISH and DIRECTV call these Movies 1080P because they are progressive vs. interlaced but current chip sets in cable and DBS doen't support 1080P60 only 1080i,720P and 1080P24 (and other lower res formats).
> ANyone know how big the files are or the bit rate used to encode ? That is one way to compare their content with the blu ray equivalent.


someone on this forum has said it averaged 15 Mbps for the 1080p24 VOD movies. So not bluray, seen up to 40Mbps on some blurays, but not bad rates for AVC/h.264 encoding.


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## Bobby H (Mar 23, 2008)

Video bit rates is a separate factor from video format, be it 720p/60, 1080i/60 or 1080p/24.

I've seen movies on Blu-ray with video rates peaking well over 40Mb/s. _Cloverfield_ is one example that comes to mind where I saw very high bit rates. OTOH, you can download movies trailers in 1080p using the same AVC codec from Apple and those bit rates sometimes don't get above 10Mb/s.

I haven't bothered with the Dish Network 1080p VOD stuff largely because of these compatibility problems, along with the high price ($6.99 for a 24 rental doesn't compare well to what I pay for Blu-ray rentals from local stores). I have a 52" Sony Bravia XBR4 and don't know whether the latest firmware from Dish has added proper 1080p support for this television.


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