# CBS All Access to become Paramount+ in 2021



## phrelin

That plus sign sure has gained a corporate following. First we have Apple+ and Disney+. Now ViacomCBS Confirms Paramount+ As New Streaming Name For CBS All Access.


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## Rich

phrelin said:


> That plus sign sure has gained a corporate following. First we have Apple+ and Disney+. Now ViacomCBS Confirms Paramount+ As New Streaming Name For CBS All Access.


Perhaps it will work better than it does now.

Rich


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## b4pjoe

Adding to that post:

ViacomCBS Announces Paramount+ Rebranding: Live sports, news, and entertainment coming in 2021
Paramount+ will be the home of a critical mass of sports, including UEFA, NFL, Golf, SEC and more


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## b4pjoe

Rich said:


> Perhaps it will work better than it does now.
> 
> Rich


What do you find lacking on it?


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## Rich

b4pjoe said:


> What do you find lacking on it?


Lots of little things. Mostly navigation. Had no issues with the picture or content.

Rich


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## B. Shoe

As long as they get something that I can stream ALL episodes of Yellowstone on, I'm game.  I think someone foresaw this coming down the road in some earlier threads regarding CBSAA? It's hazy to me, but that sounds familiar.


> You're here for sports. So is Paramount+. Along with the remarkable streaming library of originals and classics from our brands, Paramount+ will carry the heavy-hitting sports broadcasts that you have come to expect from the CBS Sports brand.
> 
> That includes our deals with UEFA for exclusive streaming Champions and Europa League broadcasts in the U.S. Game broadcasts of NFL on CBS, Golf on CBS, SEC on CBS, NWSL on CBS and more also will be key parts of Paramount+. And of course there is CBS Sports HQ, our 24/7 streaming sports news network that has you covered with deep analysis and expert picks.


This is good news for some football (American and European) fans, alike!


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## Rich

B. Shoe said:


> As long as they get something that I can stream ALL episodes of Yellowstone on, I'm game.  I think someone foresaw this coming down the road in some earlier threads regarding CBSAA? It's hazy to me, but that sounds familiar.
> 
> This is good news for some football (American and European) fans, alike!


IIRC, Peacock has Yellowstone. Good series. Costner.

Rich


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## Stewart Vernon

I read elsewhere today that unfortunately, not so long ago a bunch of Paramount content was sold to NBC/Universal and is now on their Peacock channel... so, this Paramount+ on some level is kind of going to be Paramount- as a result of not having the foresight to keep some of that content for themselves.


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## techguy88

phrelin said:


> That plus sign sure has gained a corporate following. First we have Apple+ and Disney+. Now ViacomCBS Confirms Paramount+ As New Streaming Name For CBS All Access.


Don't forget about ESPN+ and TiVo+. I wouldn't be surprised if AT&T comes out with HBO Max+ ROFL



B. Shoe said:


> As long as they get something that I can stream ALL episodes of Yellowstone on, I'm game.  I think someone foresaw this coming down the road in some earlier threads regarding CBSAA? It's hazy to me, but that sounds familiar.


ViacomCBS signed the rights to some of their shows away on exclusive deals to other upstart streamers that are absent on Roku & Amazon at the present moment. 

*Peacock* - Yellowstone (currently has Seasons 1-2 requires Peacock Premium, Season 3 is in the Paramount Network TVE app) 
*HBO Max *- South Park (new episodes are added to HBO Max 24 hours after their premiere on Comedy Central), Awkafinia is Nora from Queens
HBO Max also purchased two existing comedies from Comedy Central. Their new seasons will be Max Originals: The Other Two, South Side (their first seasons will be on HBO Max in 2021.) 




Stewart Vernon said:


> I read elsewhere today that unfortunately, not so long ago a bunch of Paramount content was sold to NBC/Universal and is now on their Peacock channel... so, this Paramount+ on some level is kind of going to be Paramount- as a result of not having the foresight to keep some of that content for themselves.


The big deal ViacomCBS - Peacock signed was for non-exclusive content allowing them to resell it to other services and add it to their own services. The movie package will have limited availability windows (i.e. a Paramount movie exclusive to Peacock for 1-3 months then rotate out when another takes its place.)



b4pjoe said:


> What do you find lacking on it?





Rich said:


> Lots of little things. Mostly navigation. Had no issues with the picture or content.
> 
> Rich


During _Big Brother_'s first endurance Head of Household competition on September 10 the CBS website, CBS All Access on Apple and Android devices (TV, iPad & mobile) all crashed after the live eviction episode ended and CBS had advertised that week it would be available to watch unedited as it happened on _Big Brother_'s Live Feeds as soon as the East coast live episode ended. So... I don't know if the service is currently suited to be airing higher profile events 

Also.... I don't get the whole point of renaming it Paramount+ in all honestly. The CBS brand is more recognized. This is the most AT&T move by a non-AT&T company I've seen yet.


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## b4pjoe

They do that a lot on Big Brother. Advertise it all week and then don't put it on as promised. I suspect they just withhold it to make the live shows get better ratings.


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## SamC

Sports? Of those listed:

NFL - The current contracts mean that the only NFL live content CBS could stream is what is already streamed by the NFL and Yahoo apps. The games already shown on over-the-air TV in your area.

SEC - CBS has the rights to ONE SEC game per week. The 3:30 ET "Best Game From The Best Conference" which is shown live OTA for free. The rest of the SEC games are Disney property and on an ESPN channel, and replayed on ESPN+. And the CBS-SEC contract expires after the 24 season, with the game moving to ABC.

Golf - Note that it did not say "PGA golf". Because the streaming rights to the live events during times when the event is not on a network belong to AT&T. So they probably mean the PGA Championship, and perhaps The Masters, although Augusta National has turned CBS down for extended coverage for decades.

NWSL - Did not know this existed until 5 minutes ago.

UEFA - Yeah. Yet more eurosoccer. 

CBS Sports HQ - Currently free on the regular CBS app. This is what SportsCenter used to be before it became all NBA and politics. Its not bad.

--

Why did CBSAA fail? 

Because Star Trek failed. The iterations of the franchise produced for CBSAA are simply not any good. Beyond is a combination of feminist angst and poorly dreamed up characters, while Picard is a collection of cameos from a series that ended in 1994, plus other characters from other long ended series with no previously know relationship to the central character, held together only by a mildly disguised preachfest which is already out of date.


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## James Long

Branding. Perhaps they find that people are not seeing "CBS All Access" as being much more than CBS and want to lean on the "bigger" (even if unfamiliar to some) name of Paramount. Paramount isn't a lousy name ... they have been making movies for longer than most people alive have been alive - plus TV shows and other content. The "plus" seems to be a current trend and would cover any non-Paramount content (as in "Paramount content, plus other content"). Any Paramount content they can't show because they assigned rights over to another distributor would cut in to that library.

We are still in the early months of "Peacock". I'm not sure if the "off brand" branding of going with "the peacock network" instead of NBC is working or not. It is too early to tell. But it does convey that the content is more than what one has seen on NBC. And that is a good thing.


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## inkahauts

techguy88 said:


> Don't forget about ESPN+ and TiVo+. I wouldn't be surprised if AT&T comes out with HBO Max+ ROFL
> 
> ViacomCBS signed the rights to some of their shows away on exclusive deals to other upstart streamers that are absent on Roku & Amazon at the present moment.
> 
> *Peacock* - Yellowstone (currently has Seasons 1-2 requires Peacock Premium, Season 3 is in the Paramount Network TVE app)
> *HBO Max *- South Park (new episodes are added to HBO Max 24 hours after their premiere on Comedy Central), Awkafinia is Nora from Queens
> HBO Max also purchased two existing comedies from Comedy Central. Their new seasons will be Max Originals: The Other Two, South Side (their first seasons will be on HBO Max in 2021.)
> 
> 
> The big deal ViacomCBS - Peacock signed was for non-exclusive content allowing them to resell it to other services and add it to their own services. The movie package will have limited availability windows (i.e. a Paramount movie exclusive to Peacock for 1-3 months then rotate out when another takes its place.)
> 
> During _Big Brother_'s first endurance Head of Household competition on September 10 the CBS website, CBS All Access on Apple and Android devices (TV, iPad & mobile) all crashed after the live eviction episode ended and CBS had advertised that week it would be available to watch unedited as it happened on _Big Brother_'s Live Feeds as soon as the East coast live episode ended. So... I don't know if the service is currently suited to be airing higher profile events
> 
> Also.... I don't get the whole point of renaming it Paramount+ in all honestly. The CBS brand is more recognized. This is the most AT&T move by a non-AT&T company I've seen yet.


Paramount is much much larger than CBS. CBS is a tv station, paramount is a studio that produces tv and movies. I'm sure that's why they went that way, to make it seem larger, because, well, it is larger and more encompassing now they they have merged back into one company. Now that's how the studio sees it, I wonder if you surveyed all the people in the country if they'd see it that way. Paramount as being a larger company with more "stuff". Especially if you told someone they also own CBS. I'm guessing yes.


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## inkahauts

SamC said:


> Sports? Of those listed:
> 
> NFL - The current contracts mean that the only NFL live content CBS could stream is what is already streamed by the NFL and Yahoo apps. The games already shown on over-the-air TV in your area.
> 
> SEC - CBS has the rights to ONE SEC game per week. The 3:30 ET "Best Game From The Best Conference" which is shown live OTA for free. The rest of the SEC games are Disney property and on an ESPN channel, and replayed on ESPN+. And the CBS-SEC contract expires after the 24 season, with the game moving to ABC.
> 
> Golf - Note that it did not say "PGA golf". Because the streaming rights to the live events during times when the event is not on a network belong to AT&T. So they probably mean the PGA Championship, and perhaps The Masters, although Augusta National has turned CBS down for extended coverage for decades.
> 
> NWSL - Did not know this existed until 5 minutes ago.
> 
> UEFA - Yeah. Yet more eurosoccer.
> 
> CBS Sports HQ - Currently free on the regular CBS app. This is what SportsCenter used to be before it became all NBA and politics. Its not bad.
> 
> --
> 
> Why did CBSAA fail?
> 
> Because Star Trek failed. The iterations of the franchise produced for CBSAA are simply not any good. Beyond is a combination of feminist angst and poorly dreamed up characters, while Picard is a collection of cameos from a series that ended in 1994, plus other characters from other long ended series with no previously know relationship to the central character, held together only by a mildly disguised preachfest which is already out of date.


Cbsaa didn't fail. CBS merged with paramount, again, and they want to somehow denote they are going to massively expand the viewing catalogue.


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## billsharpe

Rich said:


> Lots of little things. Mostly navigation. Had no issues with the picture or content.
> 
> Rich


I find it easy enough to navigate. CBS AllAccess site keeps track of programs that I watch regularly, like Mom and the old Perry Mason shows, and I can easily find others. It's nice to watch Sunday Morning in one hour without commercials. The Perry Mason shows run about 54 minutes (out of 60), which gives you some idea of how commercials have since intruded. Mom takes about 20 minutes (out of 30).


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## Stewart Vernon

I would also add that IF CBS All Access was hinging upon the success of Star Trek... even if Star Trek was awesome... the numbers they got in the beginning before people had watched much of their first new show, was not the kind of numbers they would need to sustain a streaming service longterm. Even a successful 100% great Star Trek would not by itself bring in enough people. They need a lot more people, and to get that they'd need a lot more compelling content.


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## makaiguy

Stewart Vernon said:


> They need a lot more people, and to get that they'd need a lot more compelling content.


A presence on Roku and Amazon Fire (reportedly a combined 70% of streaming devices) wouldn't hurt, either.


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## b4pjoe

CBSAA is on Amazon. Either the app if you are already subscribed or you can buy the channel directly from Amazon.


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## makaiguy

b4pjoe said:


> CBSAA is on Amazon. Either the app if you are already subscribed or you can buy the channel directly from Amazon.


My bad. I was confusing CBS All Access with NBC Peacock which, along with HBO Max, hasn't showed up on Roku or Fire systems since carriage agreements haven't been reached yet.


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## NashGuy

James Long said:


> Branding. Perhaps they find that people are not seeing "CBS All Access" as being much more than CBS and want to lean on the "bigger" (even if unfamiliar to some) name of Paramount.


Yes. And also because Paramount+ will be an international service. CBS is very much a US brand while Paramount is (at least somewhat) famous worldwide as a legendary Hollywood studio.

Interestingly, outside the US, Paramount+ will include Showtime content, at least some of it. Here in the US, though, Showtime will remain a separate service. It will be interesting to see how they divide content between the two. I'm specifically wondering if Paramount Pictures' first-run TV/streaming window will be on Showtime (which is where recent theatrical films have normally gone) or if they'll go to Paramount+, or get somehow split between the two. Most logical thing, IMO, would be to put them on Showtime and preserve it as an adult-focused premium home for original content and theatrical films.

Meanwhile, Paramount+ would essentially be their broad catch-all service with something for all ages and tastes -- entertainment, sports, news, kids -- essentially being their streaming successor to broadcast + basic cable. Hence their tagline: "Live Sports. Breaking News. A Mountain of Entertainment."


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## NashGuy

Stewart Vernon said:


> I read elsewhere today that unfortunately, not so long ago a bunch of Paramount content was sold to NBC/Universal and is now on their Peacock channel... so, this Paramount+ on some level is kind of going to be Paramount- as a result of not having the foresight to keep some of that content for themselves.


Yeah, ViacomCBS is IMO spreading their content pretty thin between their own subscription services, their many linear channels, Pluto TV, plus licensing deals with competing services, like the deal to put past seasons of Yellowstone on Peacock. That said, one of the ViacomCBS honchos said recently that their plan is to pull back a lot of that stuff to their own service (Paramount+) in a couple years or so. I guess the thought is that they can grow the audience for some of those shows right now by distributing them more widely, plus make some additional licensing money. But it will be a bit odd that the one true hit that the Paramount Network has produced, Yellowstone, will apparently be absent from Paramount+ when that service debuts next year.


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## phrelin

Just to add further confusion, according to THR the Paramount cable channel is to be rebranded as the Paramount Movie Network in 2021 dropping most of its ongoing series (other than flagship Yellowstone) in favor of original movies and a handful of short-run scripted shows per year. I have no idea whether those original movies etc. will appear on Paramount+.


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## makaiguy

phrelin said:


> Just to add further confusion, according to THR the Paramount cable channel is to be rebranded as the Paramount Movie Network in 2021 dropping most of its ongoing series (other than flagship Yellowstone) in favor of original movies and a handful of short-run scripted shows per year. I have no idea whether those original movies etc. will appear on Paramount+.


OMG. It sounds like the folks at Paramount have done a Vulcan Mind Meld with the ATT geniuses that have named THEIR products.


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## techguy88

makaiguy said:


> OMG. It sounds like the folks at Paramount have done a Vulcan Mind Meld with the ATT geniuses that have named THEIR products.


I can't remember where I saw this exactly but it was a comment someone posted shortly after the news broke of the new name. Someone said "this is the most AT&T move by a non-AT&T company I've ever seen." I agreed with that and even more so now lol.


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## Rich

phrelin said:


> Just to add further confusion, according to THR the Paramount cable channel is to be rebranded as the Paramount Movie Network in 2021 dropping most of its ongoing series (other than flagship Yellowstone) in favor of original movies and a handful of short-run scripted shows per year. I have no idea whether those original movies etc. will appear on Paramount+.


IIRC, I watched _Yellowstone _on the Paramount app the first time. The picture quality on that app was so bad I gave up on _Yellowstone _quickly. Then I got the Peacock app and tried _Yellowstone _again and enjoyed it thoroughly. Much better PQ on that app. I'd say the Paramount app needs some work.

Rich


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## TheRatPatrol

NashGuy said:


> like the deal to put past seasons of Yellowstone on Peacock........But it will be a bit odd that the one true hit that the Paramount Network has produced, Yellowstone, will apparently be absent from Paramount+ when that service debuts next year.


That is a bit odd, why would they do that?


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## NashGuy

TheRatPatrol said:


> That is a bit odd, why would they do that?


Based on what I've read, I think the idea to license those back seasons of Yellowstone to Peacock is to (A) score that additional licensing revenue and (B) expose the show to a wider audience and build lasting popularity for it. I guess they think that a lot of folks will use Peacock due to it being free/cheap and heavily promoted by Comcast.

It sounds like the current plan is for ViacomCBS to generally keep new seasons of their cable TV shows exclusive to the linear channels, though, and not share them with Paramount+ (as they do with CBS shows). So if you want to see the latest eps of Yellowstone, those will likely remain exclusive to Paramount Movie Network. But I don't know if the current deal to license back seasons of Yellowstone to Peacock is an exclusive. Those seasons may well show up on both Peacock and Paramount+ (same way that The Affair and Ray Donovan are on both Peacock and Showtime).


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## inkahauts

Personally I think they may be taking the approach used all through history of selling syndication rerun rights to multiple outlets to broaden shows reach as others have mentioned. Do people realize how many channels friends is on for example?


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## Rich

inkahauts said:


> Personally I think they may be taking the approach used all through history of selling syndication rerun rights to multiple outlets to broaden shows reach as others have mentioned. Do people realize how many channels friends is on for example?


How many?

Rich


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## billsharpe

I'm sure I am in the minority but I haver never watched Friends and seldom watched I Love Lucy.

I did like Cheers, Mash, and Hogan's Heroes to name three. And I'm busy watching the old Perry Mason 50's shows on CBS All Access.


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## Rich

billsharpe said:


> I'm sure I am in the minority but I haver never watched Friends and seldom watched I Love Lucy.
> 
> I did like Cheers, Mash, and Hogan's Heroes to name three. And I'm busy watching the old Perry Mason 50's shows on CBS All Access.


I never liked _I Love Lucy_. I thought the character (Lucy) was obnoxious. I did like the Mertz's tho. My mother and father were raving about the new show and I was allowed to stay up to watch an episode. They laughed thru the show and I sat there wondering what was so funny. Just me, I never got the Three Stooges movies either.

Rich


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## SamC

The idea of the rerun is that as means of delivery increase is that the idea of an "exclusive" to any streaming service or linear channel is an illusion. ALL shows will eventually end up shown 1000s of times on a plethora of outlets. Finally, with the last few cents of value being squeezed out of it on minor netlet channels in the middle of the night selling ads for a "dollar a holler". 

If you pay for "exclusive" content, you might as well write "sucker" on your forehead.


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## James Long

Most exclusives are timed ... the old progression for a theatrical film was: Big Theaters, Little Theaters, Cheap Theaters - Somewhere along that line the film would be released to premium movie channels (HBO or Showtime or both) before being released through other cable channels. As technology changed DVD and VHS releases were introduced. Historically after the premium movie channels but now I see more DVD releases pre-premium channel. Technology has also brought us PPV channels (modern version of the VHS being available for rental months before being available for sale).

It is all crafted to make the most money possible. People who are willing to pay $$$ per person to sit in a theater see something before people willing to pay a few cents for a cable channel or nothing at all to watch on a diginet. People who choose not to wait for a cheaper price get to see the content sooner.


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## inkahauts

Rich said:


> How many?
> 
> Rich


I know at least four at once, maybe even five for a while, and while it was on Netflix as well.... seemed like ten channels to be honest....


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## Rich

inkahauts said:


> I know at least four at once, maybe even five for a while, and while it was on Netflix as well.... seemed like ten channels to be honest....


I looked thru the Guide and found a couple of channels that carried it. I didn't do a search for _Friends_, just wandered thru the Guide. I'd rather watch that series on HBO Max. Don't care about the cost. PQ is gonna be better, that I care about.

I had that series on DVD, never watched it. I did watch it when it first came out but missed a whole lot of episodes. That apartment they live in always bothered me. An apartment like that would cost a fortune unless it was rent-controlled, in NYC. You gotta make a small fortune to live in the City.

Rich


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## James Long

Rich said:


> That apartment they live in always bothered me. An apartment like that would cost a fortune unless it was rent-controlled, in NYC. You gotta make a small fortune to live in the City.


They addressed that complaint on the final show.


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## inkahauts

Rich said:


> I looked thru the Guide and found a couple of channels that carried it. I didn't do a search for _Friends_, just wandered thru the Guide. I'd rather watch that series on HBO Max. Don't care about the cost. PQ is gonna be better, that I care about.
> 
> I had that series on DVD, never watched it. I did watch it when it first came out but missed a whole lot of episodes. That apartment they live in always bothered me. An apartment like that would cost a fortune unless it was rent-controlled, in NYC. You gotta make a small fortune to live in the City.
> 
> Rich


They where under rent control and using it via Monica's aunt or something like that. The building manager even knew and there was an episode where Joey had to teach the building manager how to dance to keep him from telling the owner they where illegally using her relatives ancient lease. Because Joey got them in trouble...

Friends is on 3 channels now it seems... local (KTLA for me) TBS and Nickelodeon's.

HBO Max is the good way to watch. Although the collector box dvd edition had more scenes in it including some unaired. Anything on tv with commercials is missing scenes that even originally aired to shrink the time and add more commercials. Same with most older reruns I believe.


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## Rich

inkahauts said:


> They where under rent control and using it via Monica's aunt or something like that. The building manager even knew and there was an episode where Joey had to teach the building manager how to dance to keep him from telling the owner they where illegally using her relatives ancient lease. Because Joey got them in trouble...
> 
> Friends is on 3 channels now it seems... local (KTLA for me) TBS and Nickelodeon's.
> 
> HBO Max is the good way to watch. Although the collector box dvd edition had more scenes in it including some unaired. Anything on tv with commercials is missing scenes that even originally aired to shrink the time and add more commercials. Same with most older reruns I believe.


I have the DVD collection somewhere. DVDs look like hell on my 4K sets. I'll stick with HBO for that series. I'm not even sure we have a BD player that works in the house.

Rich


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## Rich

inkahauts said:


> They where under *rent control* and using it via Monica's aunt or something like that. The building manager even knew and there was an episode where Joey had to teach the building manager how to dance to keep him from telling the owner they where illegally using her relatives ancient lease. Because Joey got them in trouble...
> 
> Friends is on 3 channels now it seems... local (KTLA for me) TBS and Nickelodeon's.
> 
> HBO Max is the good way to watch. Although the collector box dvd edition had more scenes in it including some unaired. Anything on tv with commercials is missing scenes that even originally aired to shrink the time and add more commercials. Same with most older reruns I believe.


Figured that was the only way normal mortals could rent such an apartment in Manhatten. Over the years, I've been in a lot of apartments in the City and they were all cramped. The one thing I saw in every one of them was a fireplace. I also saw a lot of Murphy beds. I have never been in a relatively new apartment.

Rich


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## espaeth

Apparently push notifications are going out to people who subscribed to the Smithsonian Channel Plus service, now all of that content is being moved to CBS All Access (and presumably Paramount+ in the future).

I just checked and all the stuff I would normally watch on Smithsonian is now available to watch commercial free via my Showtime/CBS:AA subscription through Apple TV Channels.


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## techguy88

espaeth said:


> Apparently push notifications are going out to people who subscribed to the Smithsonian Channel Plus service, now all of that content is being moved to CBS All Access (and presumably Paramount+ in the future).
> 
> I just checked and all the stuff I would normally watch on Smithsonian is now available to watch commercial free via my Showtime/CBS:AA subscription through Apple TV Channels.


Their website redirects people to CBS All Access now. I was wondering what ViacomCBS would do with all the different services they provide with their upcoming Paramount+.

Here is a full list of both ViacomCBS & WarnerMedia's streaming services (excluding TV Everywhere apps unless impacted.) AT&T didn't have as many streaming services as most of the media paints them out to have.


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## NashGuy

Probably most or all the rest of VCBS's niche services like BET+, MTV Hits, Comedy Central Now, etc. will get shut down too over the next year, with their content pulled into Paramount+. VCBS really needs to bulk up P+'s content library to make it a decent competitor to Hulu (which I see as its most direct competitor).

As for Warner, I can see Crunchyroll remaining separate as anime is a pretty specific entertainment genre and the service is already global. Boomerang, I dunno. Could see that folding and the content sucked into HBO Max. That would help make the service even more kid-friendly in an effort to compete with Netflix.

I predicted over and over that Cinemax would get shut down this year after the launch of HBO Max but it's still shuffling along for now. Looks like the current second season of Warrior will be the service's last hurrah for original content. After that, the two seasons of the series will reportedly move to HBO Max (although no word on whether there will be any future seasons of Warrior there). As for Cinemax's future, who knows. Its subscribers numbers are way down after both Charter and Comcast dropped it from all their bundles last year and made it purely a la carte (and DISH completely dropped it the year before that). Hard to see why anyone would choose to pay $10/mo for Cinemax after they cease to air any more original content (given that Cinemax's movie library is shared with HBO). So maybe Warner kills it next year. Or maybe Cinemax pivots to being something like Starz Encore, focused on older movies that have finished their initial pay window on HBO Max. In which case, Warner would ask for lower carriage rates and try to get it included as part of the same upper-tier or add-on packages where TCM typically resides.


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## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> Probably most or all the rest of VCBS's niche services like BET+, MTV Hits, Comedy Central Now, etc. will get shut down too over the next year, with their content pulled into Paramount+. VCBS really needs to bulk up P+'s content library to make it a decent competitor to Hulu (which I see as its most direct competitor).
> 
> As for Warner, I can see Crunchyroll remaining separate as anime is a pretty specific entertainment genre and the service is already global. Boomerang, I dunno. Could see that folding and the content sucked into HBO Max. That would help make the service even more kid-friendly in an effort to compete with Netflix.
> 
> I predicted over and over that Cinemax would get shut down this year after the launch of HBO Max but it's still shuffling along for now. Looks like the current second season of Warrior will be the service's last hurrah for original content. After that, the two seasons of the series will reportedly move to HBO Max (although no word on whether there will be any future seasons of Warrior there). As for Cinemax's future, who knows. Its subscribers numbers are way down after both Charter and Comcast dropped it from all their bundles last year and made it purely a la carte (and DISH completely dropped it the year before that). Hard to see why anyone would choose to pay $10/mo for Cinemax after they cease to air any more original content (given that Cinemax's movie library is shared with HBO). So maybe Warner kills it next year. Or maybe Cinemax pivots to being something like Starz Encore, focused on older movies that have finished their initial pay window on HBO Max. In which case, Warner would ask for lower carriage rates and try to get it included as part of the same upper-tier or add-on packages where TCM typically resides.


BET+ is really being made redundant with the new Sho X BET channel. Sho x BET is supposed to be a premium version of BET with its own content. ViacomCBS could move all the content that airs on regular BET that is on BET+ to Paramount+ and all its exclusives to Showtime. Some content from Comedy Central Now, BET+, MTV Hits, Noggin and Nick Hits are on CBS AA right now.

I do think closing Cinemax and folding it within HBO Max would be a better option. Right now their strategy to continue cycling movies from HBO to Cinemax and back to HBO is silly. Like the movie "Us" was on HBO via HBO Max at launch then left for Cinemax and is now back on HBO via HBO Max.


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## Jhon69

espaeth said:


> Apparently push notifications are going out to people who subscribed to the Smithsonian Channel Plus service, now all of that content is being moved to CBS All Access (and presumably Paramount+ in the future).
> 
> I just checked and all the stuff I would normally watch on Smithsonian is now available to watch commercial free via my Showtime/CBS:AA subscription through Apple TV Channels.


Yes I got my notification,take a good service Smithsonian Plus (no commercials) for $4.99 a month absorb it a bunch of other stuff and double the price?
OK where is it? OK found it.....click.....Cancel the subscription.


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> I do think closing Cinemax and folding it within HBO Max would be a better option. Right now their strategy to continue cycling movies from HBO to Cinemax and back to HBO is silly. Like the movie "Us" was on HBO via HBO Max at launch then left for Cinemax and is now back on HBO via HBO Max.


Yeah. Annoying for HBO Max subscribers to see recent movies leave the service so that they can shift over to Cinemax for a couple months, only to later return to HBO Max. If they're going to keep Cinemax around, IMO, all the movies on it at any given time should also be part of the bigger HBO Max catalog. As for the catalog of past Cinemax originals, maybe they'll just air as repeats on some of the Cinemax linear channels, and exist in its on-demand library/Cinemax Go, and then slowly disappear over time as they get licensed out to other platforms.


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## inkahauts

If I where them I’d kill off Cinemax as it is today... all Cinemax content would be on hbo Max as suggested and make the cineMax channels that air stuff from Cinemax and the HBO Max stuff frthat isn’t on HBO channels. But that’s just me. 

Actually they could make Cinemax into two focused sets of channels. One called Cinemax that had a couple channels and carried movies (theme it as they do now) and one called telemax or something and have it just air tv shows without commercials. One channel for sitcoms one for dramas.


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## NashGuy

inkahauts said:


> If I where them I'd kill off Cinemax as it is today... all Cinemax content would be on hbo Max as suggested and make the cineMax channels that air stuff from Cinemax and the HBO Max stuff frthat isn't on HBO channels. But that's just me.
> 
> Actually they could make Cinemax into two focused sets of channels. One called Cinemax that had a couple channels and carried movies (theme it as they do now) and one called telemax or something and have it just air tv shows without commercials. One channel for sitcoms one for dramas.


I had imagined all but the original Cinemax channel getting killed off, with it being rebranded to "HBO Cinema" and included as part of the HBO multiplex of linear channels, the only one devoted to 24/7 theatrical films. I also expected (and sorta still do) that HBO will whittle down the number of linear channels they offer as more and more viewing shifts over to the HBO Max app. IMO, HBO, HBO Family and HBO Latino are the most differentiated, so I would expect them to survive the longest. HBO 2, HBO Comedy, HBO Signature, etc., eh, not so much.

I dunno, maybe the bean counters at AT&T are thinking, "Hey, what if we don't actually spend any additional money on Cinemax and see what happens? No more original content, no advertising, very little expenditure for actual operations of the linear channels and website. (And we've already killed the MaxGo mobile app.)"

At that point, whatever revenue Cinemax brings in would be nearly pure profit. At its peak, I think Cinemax had somewhere in the range of 16 to 18 million subscribers. Per the WSJ, that fell to 7.9 million by 2019. I'd guess it's even lower now. But hey, even if only 3 or 4 million folks shell out $10-12 per month for a service that essentially costs AT&T nothing to run, they may decide to keep it around. (Of course, AT&T doesn't get the full subscription price. I think their MVPD distribution partners get to keep at least half that amount.)


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## inkahauts

Cinemax seems to show movies right after they leave HBO.... almost like a second run theater. 

Actually I have wondered the opposite about their linear channels. What if all the HBO channels begin showing some HBO Max type content making the Ten HBO channels more valuable overall. Time will tell I suppose.


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## techguy88

inkahauts said:


> Cinemax seems to show movies right after they leave HBO.... almost like a second run theater.


That is by design, Cinemax was launched as a more affordable premium TV service that could be sold to anyone including HBO subscribers. It is meant to compliment HBO's offerings. Films that HBO holds the Pay 1 window rights through their studio output deals will premiere on HBO then rotate over to Cinemax and back to HBO. Sometimes (especially pre-COVID) the reverse would happen where Cinemax got a movie first then rotate over to HBO and back to Cinemax. If HBO's slate of new theatrical premieres is full then Cinemax was used as the overflow.

COVID-19 has impacted this model in that all films from Warner Bros., Universal & 20th Century Studios are premiering on HBO first as a rationing attempt (not due to the launch of HBO Max.)

Right now HBO has exhausted all their Warner Bros. and Summit Entertainment movies. HBO is premiering the remaining Universal & 20th Century Studios films from 2019 and early 2020 but those are about to run out as well.



inkahauts said:


> Actually I have wondered the opposite about their linear channels. What if all the HBO channels begin showing some HBO Max type content making the Ten HBO channels more valuable overall. Time will tell I suppose.


Most likely a clause in the agreements with MVPDs and vMVPDs that if a program touches the linear HBO channels it must be made available to HBO On Demand thus negate any exclusivity the HBO Max app has.


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## NashGuy

inkahauts said:


> Actually I have wondered the opposite about their linear channels. What if all the HBO channels begin showing some HBO Max type content making the Ten HBO channels more valuable overall. Time will tell I suppose.


I think Warner's long-term goal is to have all HBO viewing done inside their own app, where they control the UI and glean all the valuable user data (i.e. the same situation Netflix, Hulu, Prime Video, Disney+, and Apple TV+ all have). So I don't see HBO making all that additional "Max" content from the HBO Max app become available via linear channels. (And keep in mind the larger long-term paradigm shift happening, which is from linear cable channels to on-demand OTT streaming, not the other way around.)

Part of the standoff that Warner has with Roku and Amazon is that those two distributors are insisting that *all* of the content in HBO Max be made available for them to distribute inside their own apps (The Roku Channel and Prime Video) whereas Warner says, no, we'll only continue allowing you to subsume the core HBO content in your own app/UI. (And it's the same situation with cable operators like Comcast with their X1 platform.) But all the additional Max content -- which BTW tends to target a younger, more streaming-friendly demographic than the core HBO content -- must remain exclusive to the HBO Max app, Warner says.

If I was Warner, the next step in my playbook in maybe 2022 would be to whittle down the HBO linear channels to those three main differentiated nets: HBO, HBO Family, and HBO Latino. By that time, all the major pay TV operators should be offering a box that features the HBO Max app, which would be touted as the centerpiece of your $15/mo subscription. (The X1/Contour boxes offered by Comcast and Cox should land the app any time now -- they said it was coming back in May. Meanwhile, other MVPDs like Charter may end up going with Google TV/Android TV for their STB platform in the next year or two.)

Next step after that, when renewing carriage contracts with MVPDs for HBO Max, would be to make the linear HBO nets non-recordable to cloud DVR platforms (although still recordable on any systems still using QAM-based channels and DVRs with hard drives) and also to eliminate "HBO OnDemand" with that MVPD-operated platform being completely replaced by the HBO Max app. The linear HBO channels could be viewed live (and paused and rewound) within an operator's native UI (e.g. from the X1 grid guide) but attempting to record a program would simply add a bookmark for that title to your DVR library. Clicking to "play" that bookmark would just open the HBO Max app and play it there.


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## inkahauts

Your plan would make their content harder and harder to get and therefore lose customers. So that probably is their plan. 

They would be stupid to remove HBO channels and shrink that down because anyone without good internet access would dump them. 

Unless they have the data that shows no one that has HBO has data limits and all have internet access of true high speed decreasing their channel count should be a non starter. If that ever changes then you could revisit it.


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## NashGuy

inkahauts said:


> Your plan would make their content harder and harder to get and therefore lose customers. So that probably is their plan.
> 
> They would be stupid to remove HBO channels and shrink that down because anyone without good internet access would dump them.
> 
> Unless they have the data that shows no one that has HBO has data limits and all have internet access of true high speed decreasing their channel count should be a non starter. If that ever changes then you could revisit it.


And yet none of those things seems to hurt Netflix, Disney+, Hulu, YouTube, etc. Cable TV is the past. Streaming is the future.


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## inkahauts

No one has ever really contracted how to get their programing as was being suggested.

Netflix can’t even be involved in the conversation, it was never a channel you could get, much less a package of channels.

Don’t confuse license deals running out as taking your content off a delivery mechanism and just shrinking its access.


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## NashGuy

inkahauts said:


> Netflix can't even be involved in the conversation


Heh. Netflix is involved in *every* conversation that happens in Hollywood about the future of "TV" (i.e. video entertainment).


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## techguy88

Looks like ViacomCBS could shut down some of the smaller streaming services prior to the Paramount+ rebrand.

In a way would make sense to shut down something like Comedy Central Now since about half of its content is currently on CBS All Access & HBO Max. (I kinda find it funny that CBS All Access & HBO Max are essentially sharing the Comedy Central content especially since Time Warner used to own 50% of Comedy Central before selling the share to Viacom years ago.)

Personally I can also see Nick Hits & MTV Hits being shut down completely. I could see BET+ be folded into Showtime and its premium/original content used for ShoXBET meanwhile the content from regular BET going to Paramount+. Noggin is a bit iffy, they could keep that running to give parents a dedicated app for the children's content.



NashGuy said:


> Heh. Netflix is involved in *every* conversation that happens in Hollywood about the future of "TV" (i.e. video entertainment).


Netflix is a member of the Motion Pictures Association alongside Disney, Warner Bros., Sony, Universal & Paramount as well.


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## NashGuy

The ability to bundle CBS AA (ad-free) plus Showtime plus Apple TV+ inside the Apple TV app is no longer available. At $15/mo combined, it was a great deal while it lasted. It's not for sure yet but this move suggests that Paramount+ may not be available as an Apple TV Channel at all, the way that CBS AA has been for some time now. I thought that might happen.

CBS and Showtime bundle no longer available through Apple TV app, ahead of Paramount+ launch - 9to5Mac

When HBO morphed into HBO Max, it also disappeared from the Apple TV Channels platform and, once distribution deals were finally struck with Amazon and Roku, it led to HBO's removal from those operators' similar aggregated platforms (Prime Video Channels and The Roku Channel).

The big media players all (understandably, IMO) want their flagship/primary streaming service to be distributed exclusively via their own app, not as an add-on inside competitors' apps/UIs. The "channels" distribution platforms will soon likely consist only of premium services Showtime, Starz and Epix, along with various niche streaming services like AMC+, Shudder, Acorn TV, PBS Living, etc.


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## Mark Holtz

The TV platforms (Roku, Amazon) make their money from the channel carriage, whether it be through a cut of the subscription fees or such. When I moved to Texas, one of the decisions I made was that all of our TVs were on the Roku platform to make things "easier" for my mother. It didn't work out that well, as all my mother cares about is her bleeping Hallmark channel, even though I have the Amazon Prime, Plex, Criterion, Hulu (basic), and HBO Max.


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## techguy88

Mark Holtz said:


> The TV platforms (Roku, Amazon) make their money from the channel carriage, whether it be through a cut of the subscription fees or such. When I moved to Texas, one of the decisions I made was that all of our TVs were on the Roku platform to make things "easier" for my mother. It didn't work out that well, as all my mother cares about is her bleeping Hallmark channel, even though I have the Amazon Prime, Plex, Criterion, Hulu (basic), and HBO Max.


You could get FrndlyTV to fill the Hallmark void if that is all your mom wants. It has linear streams of all 3 Hallmark channels plus things like Game Show Network, Up TV, Insp, etc. The HD plan with 2 streams is $7.99/mo


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## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> The ability to bundle CBS AA (ad-free) plus Showtime plus Apple TV+ inside the Apple TV app is no longer available. At $15/mo combined, it was a great deal while it lasted. It's not for sure yet but this move suggests that Paramount+ may not be available as an Apple TV Channel at all, the way that CBS AA has been for some time now. I thought that might happen.
> 
> CBS and Showtime bundle no longer available through Apple TV app, ahead of Paramount+ launch - 9to5Mac
> 
> When HBO morphed into HBO Max, it also disappeared from the Apple TV Channels platform and, once distribution deals were finally struck with Amazon and Roku, it led to HBO's removal from those operators' similar aggregated platforms (Prime Video Channels and The Roku Channel).
> 
> The big media players all (understandably, IMO) want their flagship/primary streaming service to be distributed exclusively via their own app, not as an add-on inside competitors' apps/UIs. The "channels" distribution platforms will soon likely consist only of premium services Showtime, Starz and Epix, along with various niche streaming services like AMC+, Shudder, Acorn TV, PBS Living, etc.


ViacomCBS could have been testing out a new pricing model with the bundle. Also it does seem Paramount+ is heading in the direction of Disney+ & HBO Max by being app exclusives. I would expect existing Apple TV-CBS All Access subscribers to be grandfathered just as how Apple TV-HBO subscribers was grandfathered. Apple TV-CBS All Access subs can link their Apple ID to the current CBS All Access app so they can use the standalone app on any supported device. I figure Paramount+ will allow for this type of authentication as well for grandfathered subs.

It is worth noting that this article pointed out that ViacomCBS has been silent on Amazon & Roku for Paramount+ which is what happened to Disney+, HBO Max and Peacock leading up to their respective launches. Only Disney+ was able to secure carriage on both platforms by launch, it took HBO Max around 7 months after launch to get Amazon and 8 for Roku. Peacock got Roku around 6 months after launch but still no Amazon.

I figure Showtime's value on the different Channels services (and even MVPDs) will soon diminish if ViacomCBS offers an aggressive bundle of Paramount+ & Showtime on their own. This would be in contrast to HBO Max and Cinemax where Cinemax is still acting as a standalone service with no ties to its streaming sibling.


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> ViacomCBS could have been testing out a new pricing model with the bundle. Also it does seem Paramount+ is heading in the direction of Disney+ & HBO Max by being app exclusives. I would expect existing Apple TV-CBS All Access subscribers to be grandfathered just as how Apple TV-HBO subscribers was grandfathered. Apple TV-CBS All Access subs can link their Apple ID to the current CBS All Access app so they can use the standalone app on any supported device. I figure Paramount+ will allow for this type of authentication as well for grandfathered subs.


You say that Apple TV Channels grandfathered in their HBO subs -- but didn't they just convert them to HBO Max subs with Apple billing? Or does the Apple TV app still house HBO content for those (relatively few) folks who subbed to HBO via Apple TV Channels as of last May? That would be weird if so.



techguy88 said:


> It is worth noting that this article pointed out that ViacomCBS has been silent on Amazon & Roku for Paramount+ which is what happened to Disney+, HBO Max and Peacock leading up to their respective launches. Only Disney+ was able to secure carriage on both platforms by launch, it took HBO Max around 7 months after launch to get Amazon and 8 for Roku. Peacock got Roku around 6 months after launch but still no Amazon.


Ah, I wondered if P+ might have difficulty striking deals with Amazon and Roku. That seems to be par for the course with just about every new app now. (Well, I guess discovery+ had them both out of the gate.)



techguy88 said:


> I figure Showtime's value on the different Channels services (and even MVPDs) will soon diminish if ViacomCBS offers an aggressive bundle of Paramount+ & Showtime on their own. This would be in contrast to HBO Max and Cinemax where Cinemax is still acting as a standalone service with no ties to its streaming sibling.


I think of the combo of P+ and Showtime as being similar to just HBO Max, which itself combines the premium HBO library with the broader sort of stuff that P+ will carry: a different set of originals, kids' programming, past seasons of broadcast and basic cable series, older movies, etc. Warner made the strategic decision not to offer those two things separately but rather group it all together in a single service to compete against Netflix, which has a similar all-in-one strategy. ViacomCBS is choosing to keep them separate, which allows for lower prices on each.

But we might see them offer a bundle of ad-free P+ and Showtime -- at least if purchased and billed directly from VCBS -- for $15/mo, the same as completely ad-free HBO Max charges. That would have to be more profitable for ViacomCBS than the current bundle deal they have in place with Apple. And for the ~28 million Showtime subscribers (the great majority of whom have cable TV), it might well temp them to add P+ for just an extra $3-4 beyond the $11-12 they pay for Showtime alone. I tend to think that P+ won't be as interesting to cable TV subscribers as it will for cord-cutters given that cable TV subs already get their live local CBS station plus access to so many of those Viacom shows that P+ touts. But if they could get all that content ad-free for just a few bucks more than they pay for Showtime, it might be an easy sell, especially if you're already paying $100 or more a month on subscription TV services anyhow.

As for P+ by itself, they should price it at $4.99 with ads or $9.99 ad-free, the same as Peacock Premium (and $1 less than Hulu with ads). The streaming market is crowded now and they need to ramp up subscribers well beyond the ~9 million that CBS AA has now.


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## espaeth

I hope Paramount+ does better than the poor quality an app glitchiness of CBS:AA. I've enjoyed subscribing through AppleTV channels not just because of the price, but the video/audio quality was noticeably better on much of the content.


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## b4pjoe

NashGuy said:


> As for P+ by itself, they should price it at $4.99 with ads or $9.99 ad-free, the same as Peacock Premium (and $1 less than Hulu with ads). The streaming market is crowded now and they need to ramp up subscribers well beyond the ~9 million that CBS AA has now.


When Paramount Plus launches on March 4, you can expect to pay $5.99 per month for limited commercials or $9.99 per month for the more premium option with no commercials while you stream your favorite shows and movies. There is also an annual option that saves you around 15 percent and costs $59.99 annually for the limited commercial option or $99.99 if you don't want to be bothered with any ad breaks.

Paramount Plus Release Date, Price And 4 Other Things We Know About The Streaming Service


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## NashGuy

b4pjoe said:


> When Paramount Plus launches on March 4, you can expect to pay $5.99 per month for limited commercials or $9.99 per month for the more premium option with no commercials while you stream your favorite shows and movies. There is also an annual option that saves you around 15 percent and costs $59.99 annually for the limited commercial option or $99.99 if you don't want to be bothered with any ad breaks.
> 
> Paramount Plus Release Date, Price And 4 Other Things We Know About The Streaming Service


I think the writer of the article you cited was making an assumption. "You can expect to pay..." It's very possible that ViacomCBS keeps the current CBA AA pricing in place for Paramount+ but we don't know if they will because they have yet to officially announce pricing. See this article of three days ago. Key quotes:

_While the full streaming strategy for Paramount Plus will be revealed on February 24, 2021, including its price, we still know a fair amount about what's to come in terms of exclusive shows and its international rollout._

_Paramount Plus price: not yet revealed
The Paramount Plus has not been revealed yet. CBS All Access as it stands costs $9.99 per month without ads, or $5.99 per month with ads. We'd expect to learn the price of the service on February 24, when that streaming strategy is made clear._​


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## b4pjoe

True but I sure don't expect the price to go lower than what CBS AA is at currently (with ads).


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## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> You say that Apple TV Channels grandfathered in their HBO subs -- but didn't they just convert them to HBO Max subs with Apple billing? Or does the Apple TV app still house HBO content for those (relatively few) folks who subbed to HBO via Apple TV Channels as of last May? That would be weird if so.


Only those who subscribed to HBO via The Roku Channel are being forced to cancel that subscription and sign up via the HBO Max app (either directly or through Roku's in-app purchase system.)

Existing Apple TV Channels-HBO subscribers are grandfathered and keep access to HBO only content with HBO east & west linear feeds via Apple TV Channels and login to HBO Max with their Apple ID to access HBO Max. Apple no longer offers HBO on Apple TV Channels for new customers and once existing customers cancel it they can't go back. Apple customers wanting HBO Max now subscribe in-app and log into the app with the username & password they set up at sign-in or via their Apple ID.

Amazon will keep selling Prime Video Channels-HBO subscriptions until their one year extension ends. Then Amazon will stop selling HBO via Prime Video Channels however current Prime Video Channels-HBO subscribers can log into the HBO Max app with their Amazon credentials.



NashGuy said:


> Ah, I wondered if P+ might have difficulty striking deals with Amazon and Roku. That seems to be par for the course with just about every new app now. (Well, I guess discovery+ had them both out of the gate.)


Unlike Disney+, HBO Max & Peacock which has resisted all forms of being part of the Channels eco-system, discovery+ will be added to Prime Video Channels later this year. I wouldn't be surprised if Discovery just caved in on Roku's ad-sharing revenue terms which was a sticking point for HBO Max & Peacock.



NashGuy said:


> I think of the combo of P+ and Showtime as being similar to just HBO Max, which itself combines the premium HBO library with the broader sort of stuff that P+ will carry: a different set of originals, kids' programming, past seasons of broadcast and basic cable series, older movies, etc. Warner made the strategic decision not to offer those two things separately but rather group it all together in a single service to compete against Netflix, which has a similar all-in-one strategy. ViacomCBS is choosing to keep them separate, which allows for lower prices on each.


As WarnerMedia has shown it's not that easy to do. Trying to launch a comprehensive streaming service tied to a traditional premium brand has its caveats. This is why HBO Max is priced at $14.99/mo because they can't go lower. It was the same caveat HBO Now had. They still haven't launched their ad-supported version and according to reports could mean select HBO content won't have ads (due to MVPD agreements) or some HBO content could be excluded. It is also rumored that the AVOD version would be around $8.99/mo which is on the high-end scale of AVOD streaming services when compared to Hulu, CBS All Access, Peacock Premium, etc.



NashGuy said:


> But we might see them offer a bundle of ad-free P+ and Showtime -- at least if purchased and billed directly from VCBS -- for $15/mo, the same as completely ad-free HBO Max charges. That would have to be more profitable for ViacomCBS than the current bundle deal they have in place with Apple. And for the ~28 million Showtime subscribers (the great majority of whom have cable TV), it might well temp them to add P+ for just an extra $3-4 beyond the $11-12 they pay for Showtime alone. I tend to think that P+ won't be as interesting to cable TV subscribers as it will for cord-cutters given that cable TV subs already get their live local CBS station plus access to so many of those Viacom shows that P+ touts. But if they could get all that content ad-free for just a few bucks more than they pay for Showtime, it might be an easy sell, especially if you're already paying $100 or more a month on subscription TV services anyhow.
> 
> As for P+ by itself, they should price it at $4.99 with ads or $9.99 ad-free, the same as Peacock Premium (and $1 less than Hulu with ads). The streaming market is crowded now and they need to ramp up subscribers well beyond the ~9 million that CBS AA has now.


Given ViacomCBS was able to grow CBS AA and Showtime (streaming) at a quicker rate post-merger I feel they will keep the CBS AA pricing for Paramount+ which is $5.99 for limited commercials (in line with Hulu) and $9.99/mo for the Commercial Free plan (in line with Peacock Premium Ad-Free). We will find out for sure on February 24. I also feel this will be the case given they are offering 50% off a 12-month subscription of CBS All Access through March 3. (Use code: PARAMOUNTPLUS at checkout.) Which makes a year of Paramount+ $30 w/ads or $50 no ads. (Annual subscriptions for CBS AA are normally $60 w/ads and $100 no ads.)

I also feel they may keep their direct to consumer bundling options the same since it is only a $1.99/mo savings:

CBS All Access (Limited Commercials) + Showtime bundle $14.99/mo
CBS All Access (Commercial Free) + Showtime bundle $18.99/mo
This way they won't draw the ire of MVPDs like Comcast. Comcast was very vocal about Starz launching its streaming app in 2016 and pricing the service at $8.99/mo which was far lower than what MVPDs charge for Starz (and some StarzEncore).

The 2019 Comcast-Starz dispute ended with Comcast removing most Starz/StarzEncore channels, reducing the add-on price to $8.99/mo and Lionsgate, Starz owner, licensing content to Peacock.

While ViacomCBS is the Oprah of licensing content in the streaming age they don't want to put themselves into a position where Comcast & AT&T are wanting ViacomCBS to license them content for their own streaming services as part of a carriage agreement of their OTA, basic linear & premium linear services. ViacomCBS rather would keep its channel negotiations and its content licensing separate to maximize the dollar value it receives.


----------



## Getteau

Has anyone subscribed to CBS All Access with the Paramountplus discount? I wasn't that interested in CBS All Access, but we have been watching stuff off the Paramount app lately and the commercials are killing me. For $50, I thought about subscribing to CBS All Access so next month we could start watching the Paramount stuff commercial free. However, when I walked through the website, the price was still $9.99 a month and it didn't seem like it was going to apply a discount.


----------



## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Only those who subscribed to HBO via The Roku Channel are being forced to cancel that subscription and sign up via the HBO Max app (either directly or through Roku's in-app purchase system.)
> 
> Existing Apple TV Channels-HBO subscribers are grandfathered and keep access to HBO only content with HBO east & west linear feeds via Apple TV Channels and login to HBO Max with their Apple ID to access HBO Max. Apple no longer offers HBO on Apple TV Channels for new customers and once existing customers cancel it they can't go back. Apple customers wanting HBO Max now subscribe in-app and log into the app with the username & password they set up at sign-in or via their Apple ID.
> 
> Amazon will keep selling Prime Video Channels-HBO subscriptions until their one year extension ends. Then Amazon will stop selling HBO via Prime Video Channels however current Prime Video Channels-HBO subscribers can log into the HBO Max app with their Amazon credentials.


Yes, was aware of all that except the part I wasn't sure about was whether HBO-via-Apple TV Channels subs were still able to get HBO content inside the Apple TV app as before. Odd that that feature was grandfathered in. I wonder how long it will last (or frankly why Apple even sees it in their interest to continue).



techguy88 said:


> Unlike Disney+, HBO Max & Peacock which has resisted all forms of being part of the Channels eco-system, discovery+ will be added to Prime Video Channels later this year. I wouldn't be surprised if Discovery just caved in on Roku's ad-sharing revenue terms which was a sticking point for HBO Max & Peacock.


Oh, I don't think I had read about discovery+ getting added to Prime Video Channels. Yeah, I'd say Discovery caved on that, and likely caved on ad-revenue with Roku too, in order to get on both platforms at launch. Discovery is far smaller than Warner/AT&T and NBCU/Comcast and can't stand up to Amazon and Roku the same way.



techguy88 said:


> As WarnerMedia has shown it's not that easy to do.


Obviously. Some have wondered why ViacomCBS didn't just go the route of morphing Showtime into "Showtime Max" (or absorbing Showtime into Paramount+, same end result) to create a single service with all of their OTT subscription content. HBO Max looks likely to pull it off over time but Showtime and the rest of Viacom/Paramount probably doesn't have the strength/brand loyalty/pricing power to make that happen.



techguy88 said:


> Given ViacomCBS was able to grow CBS AA and Showtime (streaming) at a quicker rate post-merger I feel they will keep the CBS AA pricing for Paramount+ which is $5.99 for limited commercials (in line with Hulu) and $9.99/mo for the Commercial Free plan (in line with Peacock Premium Ad-Free). We will find out for sure on February 24. I also feel this will be the case given they are offering 50% off a 12-month subscription of CBS All Access through March 3. (Use code: PARAMOUNTPLUS at checkout.) Which makes a year of Paramount+ $30 w/ads or $50 no ads. (Annual subscriptions for CBS AA are normally $60 w/ads and $100 no ads.)
> 
> I also feel they may keep their direct to consumer bundling options the same since it is only a $1.99/mo savings:
> 
> CBS All Access (Limited Commercials) + Showtime bundle $14.99/mo
> CBS All Access (Commercial Free) + Showtime bundle $18.99/mo
> This way they won't draw the ire of MVPDs like Comcast. Comcast was very vocal about Starz launching its streaming app in 2016 and pricing the service at $8.99/mo which was far lower than what MVPDs charge for Starz (and some StarzEncore).


I don't really see any connection between the Comcast/Starz pricing dispute and direct-to-consumer bundle pricing for Showtime/Paramount+. (If we were talking about disparities in standalone pricing for either service direct-to-consumer vs. via Comcast, then maybe. Although it's worth noting that Showtime OTT costs $11/mo while Comcast still charges $12/mo for it.)

Part of Starz's problem was that they're a small lone player and Comcast is a very big distributor. ViacomCBS is a pretty big player with the most-watched broadcast net, some of its key local affiliates, several popular basic cable channels, plus a popular premium a la carte service (which isn't sold as part of any Comcast channel bundles).

It's certainly possible, even likely, that Paramount+ will retain the same standalone and Showtime bundle pricing that CBS AA already has. It's simply my opinion that they need to be a bit more aggressive in their pricing if they want to succeed long-term. And the short-term experiment that they entered into with Apple for deeply discounted bundle pricing suggests that ViacomCBS may be open to lowering their prices. They may even work deals with major cable operators like Comcast and Charter to support discount bundling of Paramount+ with Showtime. (So far, the bundling discount for CBS AA and Showtime has only been for direct-to-consumer sales/billing by ViacomCBS.)

Many industry observers believe that the ultimate winners and losers of the streaming wars will be decided in the next 2-3 years. There's a lot of competition now and the rush is on for all these services to build up their subscriber bases and survive. Paramount+ looks, to me, like one of the weakest players.


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## Getteau

Getteau said:


> Has anyone subscribed to CBS All Access with the Paramountplus discount? I wasn't that interested in CBS All Access, but we have been watching stuff off the Paramount app lately and the commercials are killing me. For $50, I thought about subscribing to CBS All Access so next month we could start watching the Paramount stuff commercial free. However, when I walked through the website, the price was still $9.99 a month and it didn't seem like it was going to apply a discount.


Never mind, it looks like they auto-fill the paramountplus coupon code on the form, but don't apply it automatically. You have to hit the apply coupon button to get it to recognize the 50% off. I guess I was expecting the coupon code to be auto-applied when I started on the paramount site with an add that said click here to get this special.


----------



## billsharpe

CBS All Access (ad-free) streams fine on my Roku TV set. I trust it will continue when Paramount is added. I have been watching, among other items, old Perry Mason shows. The first season shows run 54 minutes when the commercials are taken out. New shows like "All Rise" run about 45 minutes without commercials.


----------



## NashGuy

billsharpe said:


> CBS All Access (ad-free) streams fine on my Roku TV set. I trust it will continue when Paramount is added. I have been watching, among other items, old Perry Mason shows. The first season shows run 54 minutes when the commercials are taken out. New shows like "All Rise" run about 45 minutes without commercials.


I recently learned that a lot of the classic series on CBS AA don't include ads even if you're on the lower-cost plan that includes ads. Not sure why. Just an FYI for anyone who plans to mainly watch old series (and/or your live local CBS station, which will always contain ads regardless of your plan), you may as well save the extra money and get the cheaper version.


----------



## techguy88

Getteau said:


> Has anyone subscribed to CBS All Access with the Paramountplus discount? I wasn't that interested in CBS All Access, but we have been watching stuff off the Paramount app lately and the commercials are killing me. For $50, I thought about subscribing to CBS All Access so next month we could start watching the Paramount stuff commercial free. However, when I walked through the website, the price was still $9.99 a month and it didn't seem like it was going to apply a discount.





Getteau said:


> Never mind, it looks like they auto-fill the paramountplus coupon code on the form, but don't apply it automatically. You have to hit the apply coupon button to get it to recognize the 50% off. I guess I was expecting the coupon code to be auto-applied when I started on the paramount site with an add that said click here to get this special.


I didn't have issues when I signed up yesterday for a year of the limited commercials plan. I did have to manually enter the coupon code and press the apply button.



NashGuy said:


> I recently learned that a lot of the classic series on CBS AA don't include ads even if you're on the lower-cost plan that includes ads. Not sure why. Just an FYI for anyone who plans to mainly watch old series (and/or your live local CBS station, which will always contain ads regardless of your plan), you may as well save the extra money and get the cheaper version.


I mainly get CBS All Access for the _Big Brother_ live feeds. Since three months of the limited commercials plan is $17.97 for 3 months (at $5.99/mo) the current deal was very good IMO plus during the live feeds there is no commercials lol.


----------



## techguy88

*Paramount+ information - *New info announced on 2/24/21

*Cost (Additional info on new tiers)*

*Base* - Ad-supported - $4.99/mo [Launches in June]
Includes access to live sports including NFL, CBS News on demand & CBSN, Paramount+ Originals, thousands of movies, 30,000 TV episodes & CBS shows on demand
*Note:* This tier will not include access to a live CBS station. 
If you are currently subscribed to *CBS All Access's Limited Commercials* tier (at $5.99/mo or $59.99/yr) you will be *grandfathered* into that plan as long as you remain a Paramount+ subscriber. The price and features of that plan will not change (i.e. you keep access to your live CBS station.) This tier will remain available for new subscribers until the newer & cheaper Base tier launches in June. 


*Premium* - Ad-free - $9.99/mo (formally CBS All Access' No Commercials tier)
Includes everything in the base tier ad-free plus more live CBS sports, CBS network news & live local CBS station. Will also include 4K HDR, Dolby Vision and mobile downloads.

ViacomCBS will continue to sell Showtime and BET+ as individual services. Bundles will be made available but no specifics about those bundles was discussed. Internationally Showtime's content will be part of Paramount+. PlutoTV will remain as is and continue to be ViacomCBS' free ad-supported service.

*Movies*
ViacomCBS and Epix have expanded their partnership which currently sees Epix as the Pay-1 home of Paramount's theatrical films. Under a new, expanded agreement between the two parties will see most (not all) of Paramount Pictures' output receive a 90 day exclusivity window on Epix. After that window those films will be available on both Paramount+ and Epix. There will also be a lot of Paramount's theatrical films that will have their streaming premiere on Paramount+ first following their theatrical runs before Paramount+ and Epix shares the Pay-1 window. This deal also sees Paramount+ sub-licensing some of MGM's films for the streamer as well. This will allow Paramount+ to stream MGM's anticipated but long delayed Bond flick _No Time to Die_ and other films. The new deal lasts until 2023.

Paramount will shorten the exclusive theatrical window for their films down to 30 days for most tiles and 45 days for tentpole/blockbuster releases. The new Paramount-Epix deal allows ViacomCBS the flexibility to send two of its upcoming tentpoles _Mission: Impossible 7_ and _A Quiet Place Part II_ to Paramount+ 45 days after their theatrical release.

This makes Paramount the 4th major studio to alternate their theatrical distribution model. Disney is deciding the release method for their films on a case by case basis, Warner Bros. has their hybrid theatrical/streaming model for all of 2021 and Universal shortened their theatrical window down to 17 days for most films (tentpoles will stay theatrical exclusives for at least 30 days.)

*Originals*
Here is a list of all the originals coming to Paramount+. Notable ones will be _Younger_'s final season will be exclusively on Paramount+ and VH1's _RuPaul's Drag Race: All-Stars_ will move to Paramount+ exclusively starting with its sixth season. Nickelodeon will provide Paramount+ with a lot of children's programming. The television adaptation of the popular video game series Halo which was in development at Showtime will move to Paramount+.

Here is a nice guide recapping all of Paramount+ from The Streamable.

ViacomCBS is targeting to have 65-75 million streaming subscribers across all of its streaming services by 2024 with most of them on Paramount+. PlutoTV had 43 million monthly users in 2020 and the company is expecting that to grow to 100-120 million by 2024.


----------



## I WANT MORE

What happens with this?








CBS All Access and Showtime
CBS All Access and Showtime (Monthly)
Renews Mar 25, 2021


----------



## NYDutch

Did you miss this part?

"ViacomCBS will continue to sell Showtime and BET+ as individual services. Bundles will be made available but no specifics about those bundles was discussed. Internationally Showtime's content will be part of Paramount+."


----------



## phrelin

I've been watching all this ViacomCBS hoopla with interest only because we've had CBS All Access no-ads since late 2016. I read the listings in yesterday's Deadline Hollywood article Paramount+ Programming: The TV Shows & Films That Will Stream On ViacomCBS Service. While many of the new-and-reprised shows sound potentially watchable the truth is I have a hard time organizing a schedule now and it looks like it's only going to get worse.

Unscrambling the offerings coming from what are other Viacom channels -Comedy Central, Logo, Paramount Network, Pop TV, Smithsonian Channel, TV Land, VH1, the Nickelodeon Networks, the BET Networks, the Showtime Networks, the MTV channels and the CMT channels - will be interesting. I must admit I was startled and pleased to see that they are offering the last season of TV Land's "Younger" which we've watched from the beginning. All we have to do is live long enough to see it.

All the information notwithstanding, I have no idea what's going to happen to the Apple TV bundle I subscribed to last August (see Apple TV+ Bundle: Get CBS All Access & Showtime for $9.99/mo with an Apple TV+ subscription). Peacock is still not available as a native app on my Amazon Cube and while I've set up the Google App workaround it's weird.

Beyond worrying about the future of the Apple TV+ Bundle, I don't see any real difference for us other than getting acquainted with a new interface and putting up with any interface release failures.

EDIT: Per Paramount+ ends CBS All Access, Showtime bundle on Apple TV+ "According to _9 to 5 Mac_, that deal is no longer available through Apple TV, though existing subscribers still have access."


----------



## TheRatPatrol

I just hope they keep the classics around for a while. I’ve been watching the original Mission Impossible, Hawaii 5-0 and Columbo. Gosh I sound old.


----------



## techguy88

I WANT MORE said:


> What happens with this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CBS All Access and Showtime
> CBS All Access and Showtime (Monthly)
> Renews Mar 25, 2021


That bundle is no longer available to new subscribers. Existing customers are grandfathered as long as they maintain the bundle subscription & Apple TV+.


----------



## techguy88

NYDutch said:


> Did you miss this part?
> 
> "ViacomCBS will continue to sell Showtime and BET+ as individual services. Bundles will be made available but no specifics about those bundles was discussed. Internationally Showtime's content will be part of Paramount+."


That bit is for future bundles once Paramount+ is going.

Due to them discontinuing the "Limited Commercials" tier and replacing it with the "Base" tier in June, Paramount+ probably will introduce a new set of bundles.


----------



## NYDutch

techguy88 said:


> That bit is for future bundles once Paramount+ is going.
> 
> Due to them discontinuing the "Limited Commercials" tier and replacing it with the "Base" tier in June, Paramount+ probably will introduce a new set of bundles.


The question was what happens to the CBSAA/Showtime bundle after the transition. The quote clearly shows that they haven't said yet what the new bundles will be. Basically, the quote answers the question with "We don't know yet."


----------



## NashGuy

NashGuy said:


> As for P+ by itself, they should price it at $4.99 with ads or $9.99 ad-free, the same as Peacock Premium (and $1 less than Hulu with ads). The streaming market is crowded now and they need to ramp up subscribers well beyond the ~9 million that CBS AA has now.


Glad to see that ViacomCBS took my advice on pricing for Paramount+. ;-)


----------



## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> Glad to see that ViacomCBS took my advice on pricing for Paramount+. ;-)


In doing so the new $4.99 tier won't have your local CBS station. If you want your local CBS station and are willing to pay $5.99/mo better get that CBS AA Limited Commercial Plan before June.


----------



## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> In doing so the new $4.99 tier won't have your local CBS station.


Yes, I saw that. Interesting move. Somehow they're able to stream live sports from CBS in the base tier even though it doesn't carry live local affiliates. Wonder what the underlying financials look like. Are they giving those affiliates anything at all for the subs who will come in through the (likely more popular) base tier? If the affiliates get nothing out of that $4.99, I'd think they'd be up in arms about it since their most valuable content -- live sports such as the NFL -- is being lifted out of their broadcasts and still included in the base tier. Meanwhile, the stuff that many of those affiliates give away for free via their own apps or apps such as NewsOn -- their local newscasts -- apparently isn't included at all in the base tier. Which is a missed opportunity for affiliates to gain ad revenue.

I also noticed that the premium tier, in addition to adding live local CBS affiliates, will also have additional live CBS sports that aren't included in the base tier. I wonder if this means that some of the live sports on CBS stations won't be in the base tier or if it means that the premium tier might include some or all of the live sports from the CBS Sports Network cable channel.


----------



## sigma1914

To those of us with CBS All Access without ads, do we need to re-sign up for this or will it be automatic?


----------



## b4pjoe

Automatic. Just log in with your existing email address and password at Paramount+ - Stream live TV, movies, originals, sports, news, and more or in the new Paramount + app according to the Learn More video they released.

Learn More


----------



## evotz

techguy88 said:


> In doing so the new $4.99 tier won't have your local CBS station. If you want your local CBS station and are willing to pay $5.99/mo better get that CBS AA Limited Commercial Plan before June.


The removal of the local CBS affiliate kind of sucks with all of this.

What's the best course of action to take to keep the local CBS affiliate? I'm currently on the $5.99/mo plan with $50+ in gift cards loaded on my account.

What happens after June?

What happens after my gift card balance runs out?

When I heard that they were going to rebrand as Paramount+ I just thought it would be a name change. But losing the local CBS affiliate is going to hurt because I can't quite get it all the time over antenna.


----------



## techguy88

evotz said:


> The removal of the local CBS affiliate kind of sucks with all of this.
> 
> What's the best course of action to take to keep the local CBS affiliate? I'm currently on the $5.99/mo plan with $50+ in gift cards loaded on my account.
> 
> What happens after June?
> 
> What happens after my gift card balance runs out?
> 
> When I heard that they were going to rebrand as Paramount+ I just thought it would be a name change. But losing the local CBS affiliate is going to hurt because I can't quite get it all the time over antenna.


You will be fine. As long as you remain an active subscriber you will keep the $5.99/mo plan and your gift cards are still valid.  You can still purchase CBS All Access gift cards that are available as they will be carried over to Paramount+. ViacomCBS didn't say anything else about gift cards. If you want to save money you could switch to the annual Limited Commercials plan @ $59.99/year.

The rebrand to Paramount+ will occur on March 4. Existing CBS All Access subscribers will become Paramount+ subscribers on that date. Anyone on the current "Limited Commercials" plan will be grandfathered into that plan and will keep it as long as they remain an active subscriber.

ViacomCBS has assured people & investors that those who keep the Limited Commercials plan will not lose any benefits they enjoy today which includes the live local CBS affiliate.


----------



## b4pjoe

evotz said:


> The removal of the local CBS affiliate kind of sucks with all of this.
> 
> What's the best course of action to take to keep the local CBS affiliate? I'm currently on the $5.99/mo plan with $50+ in gift cards loaded on my account.
> 
> What happens after June?
> 
> What happens after my gift card balance runs out?
> 
> When I heard that they were going to rebrand as Paramount+ I just thought it would be a name change. But losing the local CBS affiliate is going to hurt because I can't quite get it all the time over antenna.


From techguy88's previous post about if you are currently subscribed to the $5.99 tier.:

*Cost (Additional info on new tiers)*

*Base* - Ad-supported - $4.99/mo [Launches in June]
Includes access to live sports including NFL, CBS News on demand & CBSN, Paramount+ Originals, thousands of movies, 30,000 TV episodes & CBS shows on demand
*Note:* This tier will not include access to a live CBS station.
If you are currently subscribed to *CBS All Access's Limited Commercials* tier (at $5.99/mo or $59.99/yr) you will be *grandfathered* into that plan as long as you remain a Paramount+ subscriber. The price and features of that plan will not change (i.e. you keep access to your live CBS station.) This tier will remain available for new subscribers until the newer & cheaper Base tier launches in June.


*Premium* - Ad-free - $9.99/mo (formally CBS All Access' No Commercials tier)
Includes everything in the base tier ad-free plus more live CBS sports, CBS network news & live local CBS station. Will also include 4K HDR, Dolby Vision and mobile downloads.


----------



## techguy88

Paramount+ has arrived! - Paramount+ FAQ

At launch Paramount+ will keep the same tiers as CBS All Access:

*Limited Commercials *- $5.99/month or $59.99/year
*Commercial Free* - $9.99/month or $99.99/year
The Commercial Free tier includes everything in the Limited Commercials tier without ads plus mobile downloads, 4K HDR support.

*Note:* The Limited Commercials plan will be discontinued later this year and a new $4.99/month plan that does not include access to a live CBS station will be introduced. *This will not affect current subscribers* unless you *cancel and resubscribe* *after this plan is introduced*. At that time you will only be able to chose between the new $4.99/month plan or the existing Commercial Free plan. The exact date for when the $4.99/month plan is available will be announced at a later date.

Paramount+ will keep the Showtime bundles CBS All Access had for now. This may change once the new, cheaper Base tier launches later this year. Existing subscribers of these bundles will not notice a change.

*Limited Commercials + Showtime* - $14.99/month
*Commercial Free + Showtime* - $18.99/month
*Note:* If you have the $9.99/month CBS All Access + Showtime Apple TV Channels bundle with Apple TV+ you will keep the the bundle at the same price as long as you stay subscribed to the bundle *and* Apple TV+. If you cancel either one you will lose the special $9.99/month price for the bundle. 

While browsing the Paramount+ Help Center here are some tidbits I found that are not mentioned much elsewhere that would be of interest to new subscribers.

Will a Limited Commercials subscriber see commercials when they stream movies?
No, subscribers will not see commercials when streaming movies even on the Limited Commercials plan.

Does Paramount+ support streaming in 4K, HDR10 and/or Dolby Vision?



> Yes! Commercial Free users can currently enjoy 4K, Dolby Vision or HDR10 premium video formats on supported devices (shown below) that are connected to a 4K/DV/HDR10 capable TV.
> 
> Select Roku models
> Amazon Fire TV (4K Stick, Cube)
> Android TV
> Apple TV 4K HDR (5th Gen)
> Content that is 4K, Dolby Vision and/or HDR10 enabled will be marked with badges on the show page. Note: Some movies will have premium formats, and this information will be included in the description box, so be sure to check it!


----------



## phrelin

So basically nothing is new this morning except some added content. Is that right?


----------



## NYDutch

phrelin said:


> So basically nothing is new this morning except some added content. Is that right?


If you're already a subscriber, that's correct. When I opened the CBS-AA app on my Firestick this morning there was a notice about the name change, but no update yet. I expect that will roll out soon.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

techguy88 said:


> *Commercial Free* - $9.99/month or $9.99/year


What's the yearly price?


----------



## b4pjoe

$99.99 same as it was for CBS All Access.


----------



## phrelin

techguy88 said:


> *Note:* If you have the $9.99/month CBS All Access + Showtime Apple TV Channels bundle with Apple TV+ you will keep the the bundle at the same price as long as you stay subscribed to the bundle *and* Apple TV+. If you cancel either one you will lose the special $9.99/month price for the bundle.


Well, I have one problem. I can't sign in to my Apple TV bundle CBSAA/Paramount+ channel on my Microsoft computer through any browser. I get an Invalid email and/or password message. Since I don't watch TV on the computer I'm not going to complain to Paramount+ for now, but sometimes I use the website to get information.


----------



## billsharpe

I cancelled my monthly CBS AllAccess plan on my RokuTV, then signed up for the annual plan with Paramount+ knocking 50% off the $100 no-commercial annual price. The transfer was almost seamless, although I ran into some small hiccups getting the service on the RokuTV, my iPad and my computer. 

I was hoping to see some older Paramount pictures available such as The Hope/Crosby Road series, but they are not showing up when I search for them.


----------



## billsharpe

phrelin said:


> Well, I have one problem. I can't sign in to my Apple TV bundle CBSAA/Paramount+ channel on my Microsoft computer through any browser. I get an Invalid email and/or password message. Since I don't watch TV on the computer I'm not going to complain to Paramount+ for now, but sometimes I use the website to get information.


If you are having login problems call 888-274-5343. I was on hold for about 20 minutes but the rep got me straightened out quickly and I was finally able to sign in.


----------



## evotz

Yea... don't have 20 minutes to wait on hold on the phone.

Maybe some kind soul from this forum will tell them to fix their crap when they get a hold of an operator.


----------



## evotz

Looks like they botched the whole switch-over. They didn't get everyone transferred over from CBS All Access to Paramount+. I mean, they've only had what 6 months to get all of this sorted out? And they couldn't accomplish this simple task?


----------



## evotz

Apparently you have to update the CBS All Access app (at least on Roku) to the Paramount+ then you're automatically logged in when you open the app.


----------



## espaeth

phrelin said:


> Well, I have one problem. I can't sign in to my Apple TV bundle CBSAA/Paramount+ channel on my Microsoft computer through any browser.


Are you going here to link a Paramount Plus / CBS account to your apple account?

Verify your Apple TV Paramount Plus channel subscription


----------



## b4pjoe

I had that happen trying to login to paramountplus.com website this morning. Tried about 15 minutes later and it worked.


----------



## BrucePadgett

Oy vey. P+ wouldn’t accept my password, nor allow me to update. Tried to do this both on the app and website. So far I’ve been on hold with customer service for 90 friggin’ minutes. At least the app logo updated by itself. What a JOKE.


----------



## harsh

Mark Holtz said:


> The TV platforms (Roku, Amazon) make their money from the channel carriage, whether it be through a cut of the subscription fees or such.


Amazon and Roku make their money through ad insertion/replacement. That's reportedly why it took/is taking so long to iron out their deals with new content providers.


----------



## phrelin

espaeth said:


> Are you going here to link a Paramount Plus / CBS account to your apple account?
> 
> Verify your Apple TV Paramount Plus channel subscription





b4pjoe said:


> I had that happen trying to login to paramountplus.com website this morning. Tried about 15 minutes later and it worked.





BrucePadgett said:


> Oy vey. P+ wouldn't accept my password, nor allow me to update. Tried to do this both on the app and website. So far I've been on hold with customer service for 90 friggin' minutes. At least the app logo updated by itself. What a JOKE.


Well, neither of the two suggestions above worked. At this point I'm not interested in in getting on hold with customer service since I don't watch on my computer. Maybe in the future.


----------



## b4pjoe

I don't watch on my computer either but to activate my LG TV I had to login to paramountplus.com to enter the activation code.


----------



## billsharpe

b4pjoe said:


> I don't watch on my computer either but to activate my LG TV I had to login to paramountplus.com to enter the activation code.


Yes, that's essentially what the rep told me when I called to complain about not being able to log in. And I put the phone on speaker while on hold when I called so that I could do other work on my computer in the meantime.


----------



## techguy88

harsh said:


> Amazon and Roku make their money through ad insertion/replacement. That's reportedly why it took/is taking so long to iron out their deals with new content providers.


All the streaming platforms (Apple TV, Amazon, Android/Google TV and Roku) take a cut of the subscription fees when the user subscribes via in-app purchases. Apple & Google are easier to work with since with video streaming services they will take 15% instead of their usual 30%. Apple also allows apps to block in-app sign-ups and purchases which is how Prime Video & Spotify get around Apple taking a cut of their subscription fees.

Amazon & Roku are pretty die-hard about getting 30% cut on their platforms for streaming services in addition to a significant amount of the ad-inventory (if the service as an AVOD tier.) This is what usually leads to disputes.


----------



## techguy88

phrelin said:


> So basically nothing is new this morning except some added content. Is that right?





NYDutch said:


> If you're already a subscriber, that's correct. When I opened the CBS-AA app on my Firestick this morning there was a notice about the name change, but no update yet. I expect that will roll out soon.


The expanded movie catalog (as a result of their Epix deal) will hit in June. Right now it just has the same movie library CBS AA had with the exception of the new Spongebob movie. On the TV side of things they added a few new shows plus some new originals. Paramount moved the theatrical premiere of _A Quiet Place: Part II_ to May 28, 2021 so that film should hit Paramount+ 45 days later on July 12, 2021 as long as that theatrical release date sticks.



TheRatPatrol said:


> What's the yearly price?


I fixed it hehe sometimes my wireless keyboard doesn't register when I press a key and I didn't notice it.


----------



## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Amazon & Roku are pretty die-hard about getting 30% cut on their platforms for streaming services in addition to a significant amount of the ad-inventory (if the service as an AVOD tier.) This is what usually leads to disputes.


Amazon and Roku are also more insistent on wanting services to be available as add-ons inside their own Prime Video and Roku Channel apps as opposed to being exclusively distributed through a service's own app, direct from the provider. That was a huge point of contention with the HBO Max standoff and I think it may have been an issue with Peacock too.

Interestingly, Paramount+ is available via Prime Video Channels as Apple TV Channels, same as CBS AA before it, but it's not available as an add-on in The Roku Channel. And yet Roku added the Paramount+ app on launch day. That surprises me a bit.


----------



## Andrew Sullivan

For some reason my go to category has been eliminated. "Latest Episodes". Seems like a no brainer to include this category for those that don't want to search for a specific show and see if the latest episode is not a re run. One week they're new and the next week they are re runs.


----------



## phrelin

Andrew Sullivan said:


> For some reason my go to category has been eliminated. "Latest Episodes". Seems like a no brainer to include this category for those that don't want to search for a specific show and see if the latest episode is not a re run. One week they're new and the next week they are re runs.


If you mean something like the CBS "Keep Watching" list on my Amazon Cube, on one day last week I couldn't get signed in to Paramount+ on the Amazon Cube. On Friday I watched some CBS shows on my Apple box.

On Saturday morning I was able to sign in to Paramount+ on the Amazon Cube by authorizing it via my computer, but it did not have a "Keep Watching" list and seemed to have lost my entire history.

Then I watched "CBS Sunday Morning" on the Amazon Cube a lo-and-behold the list reappeared but only showing "CBS Sunday Morning."

So I assume this week on my Amazon Cube I'll have to find each show's listing and watch the next episode in order to get them back into the "Keep Watching" list. It is frustrating particularly since I don't see any real difference between the CBSAA app and the Paramount+ app.


----------



## Andrew Sullivan

No, "Latest Episodes" listed in order what was on last night then the previous night and so on. For instance the only new showing last night on CBS was "Bob Loves Abishola". Every other show was a rerun. Using "Keep Watching" I had to scroll through the entire list of shows including those not on last night before I came across Bob Love Abishola which was the only show listing a March 8 date. "Latest Episodes listed all shows new on March 8 in order.


----------



## Andrew Sullivan

A perfect example is the lineup on CBS from 3/10. If you scroll through Keep Watching it lists SWAT latest episode as 3/10 but unlisted is Seal Team which was also a new episode on 3/10. Whereas when they had a Latest Episode Catagory both would have been listed. It makes no sense that they have eliminated the Latest Episode catagory.


----------



## billsharpe

I have been watching B-Positive on CBS AllAccess. Last Friday I got an email from Paramount+ telling me a new episode was available. That's the first email I have ever received about available programs.


----------



## phrelin

Andrew Sullivan said:


> No, "Latest Episodes" listed in order what was on last night then the previous night and so on. For instance the only new showing last night on CBS was "Bob Loves Abishola". Every other show was a rerun. Using "Keep Watching" I had to scroll through the entire list of shows including those not on last night before I came across Bob Love Abishola which was the only show listing a March 8 date. "Latest Episodes listed all shows new on March 8 in order.


Ah, got it. "Latest Episodes" listing was effectively useless for me, particularly this year as I decided not to watch shows immediately on release as in most cases the pandemic caused disrupted shooting schedules. All I need is the next unwatched episode.


----------



## NashGuy

Wonder what the bundle deal for Showtime and Paramount+ will be? To really be competitive with the market, IMO they should include the upcoming basic $4.99 tier of P+ for free when you subscribe to Showtime at its regular $11/mo price, and let you upgrade to the ad-free premium tier of P+ for an extra $5 ($16/mo total). I doubt that they'll be that generous/aggressive with their pricing but they probably need to if they want to grow both services.


----------



## makaiguy

I signed up for the Paramount+ pre-release half price for a year deal. Intended to get the commercial-free tier, but must have clicked the wrong button and instead ended up with the "limited ad" version. Can upgrade to the ad-free version but will lose the half price deal. Aw nuts! The ads aren't near as bad as the broadcast versions, usually only a max of 90 seconds, but not what I intended. And of course, these are unskippable, unlike ads on my DVRed broadcast recordings. Guess I'll be putting up with ads for a while.


----------



## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> Wonder what the bundle deal for Showtime and Paramount+ will be? To really be competitive with the market, IMO they should include the upcoming basic $4.99 tier of P+ for free when you subscribe to Showtime at its regular $11/mo price, and let you upgrade to the ad-free premium tier of P+ for an extra $5 ($16/mo total). I doubt that they'll be that generous/aggressive with their pricing but they probably need to if they want to grow both services.


So far the pricing is the same as with CBS All Access. You can add Showtime to an existing Paramount+ account but it has to be on the monthly plan (can't add Showtime through Paramount+ on a yearly plan.) Or if you are a direct Showtime subscriber you can add Paramount+ to Showtime. This may change slightly when the $4.99 tier launches later this year, but for now here are the bundles available:

*Paramount+ Limited Commercials (LC) & Showtime* - $14.99/month - Showtime content no commercials, Paramount+ content limited ads except for movies are commercial free.
*Paramount+ Commercial Free (CF) & Showtime* - $18.99/month - All content commercial free except linear feeds in Paramount+ and select programs. 
I wouldn't be surprised if the $14.99 bundle drops to $13.99 when they introduce the cheaper P+ AVOD tier without a CBS local station.

Other than that I'm not expecting much change here unless ViacomCBS feels the need to compete with HBO Max's planned AVOD tier. It is possible, but extremely unlikely, ViacomCBS will drop the P+ LC & Showtime bundle to match HBO Max's AVOD tier while dropping the P+ CF & Showtime bundle to $14.99/month to compete with HBO Max Commercial Free.


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Other than that I'm not expecting much change here unless ViacomCBS feels the need to compete with HBO Max's planned AVOD tier. It is possible, but extremely unlikely, ViacomCBS will drop the P+ LC & Showtime bundle to match HBO Max's AVOD tier while dropping the P+ CF & Showtime bundle to $14.99/month to compete with HBO Max Commercial Free.


Whether they "feel the need" or not, they clearly are competing with HBO Max (as well as Netflix, Hulu, Disney+, etc.). But it doesn't look to me like ViacomCBS is really serious about being one of the few survivors left standings when the dust clears in the streaming wars. Which calls to mind this analysis I recently read:

What if Paramount+ Is Just an Asset in a Future ViacomCBS Sale?

The story ends with:

_...as currently constructed, it's difficult to see Paramount+ thriving. But perhaps that isn't ViacomCBS' primary goal long-term.

"My hypothesis is that they're just trying to position themselves to be sold," Offenberg said. "If you're serious about becoming an SVOD force, then allowing Showtime, BET+ and Noggin to continue as separate services doesn't make a lot of sense. What they're doing feels to me like an attempt to keep legally separate entities and make the transaction to negotiation, process, and close much easier for a future sale."_​


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## phrelin

Sure, ViacomCBS might choose to sell all or pieces of the company at some point. But keep in mind its history and viewership.

On February 17 the LA Times article CBS dominates primetime ratings with 'NCIS,' '60 Minutes' and 'The Equalizer' reported:

CBS had each of last week's five most popular primetime programs, topped by "NCIS," to finish first in the network race for the fourth consecutive week and sixth time in the 21-week-old 2020-21 television season.

"NCIS" averaged 9.75 million viewers to be the highest-rated program for the second time in three weeks, according to live-plus-same-day figures released Wednesday by Nielsen. "NCIS" is the only entertainment program to finish first in the weekly ratings this season.

"60 Minutes" was the only other primetime program between Feb. 8 and Sunday to average more than 9 million viewers, averaging 9.438 million viewers. The time-slot premiere of "The Equalizer" that followed was third for the week, averaging 8.212 million viewers. "FBI," which followed "NCIS," was fourth for the week, averaging 7.729 million viewers. "Young Sheldon" was fifth, averaging 7.599 million viewers, most among comedies.​
It represents a focus in that CBS All Access (CBSAA) seemed almost like a "we've got to do this" move when CBS All Access was launched on October 28, 2014.

Historically in streaming, we tend to focus on Netflix. But Hulu - a joint venture between Fox's News Corporation, NBC Universal, Providence Equity Partners, and later ABC owner The Walt Disney Company - launched for public access in the United States on March 12, 2008, and by early in 2010, Hulu chief executive Jason Kilar said the service had made a profit in two quarters and that the company could top $100 million in revenue by summer 2010, more than its income for all of 2009.

Ironically in January 2006 the CBS Corporation and Viacom split just two years before Hulu first aired. They re-merged December 4, 2019, giving CBSAA access to extensivev cable programming. CBSAA was the last broadcast network entry in the streaming business and Paramount+ is the last expanded streaming service, incorporating cable channel programming.

But CBS still has an extremely strong presence in broadcast TV. Yes, at the end of 2010, 105 million U.S. households watched television through a traditional cable or satellite TV subscription while in 2020 only 84 million households still use traditional cable or satellite TV and in 2019 one in three (29%) TV content viewers 18+ report owning an antenna and one in four (24%) actively uses an antenna to watch TV on at least one TV in their home. But those are still significant numbers and CBS still has significant sports and related programming on top of having the most watched nighttime shows. And CBSAA launched offering live local CBS channels which continues in Paramount+.

Can Paramount+ compete? CBSAA was rebranded as Paramount+ on March 4, 2021, just 12 days ago. They offer programming from the following channel groups: BET, Comedy Central, MTV, Nickelodeon, and Smithsonian Channel. Will they find a way to offer Showtime in a package? Who knows? Right now we're seeing pricing experiments across the streaming media sector. It's very early in the game.

The real unknown is the role of advertising and the viewing habits of the population as it ages. And these things will be changing.


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## dod1450

I was paying cbs all access commercial free. Now that cbs all access is part of paramount. Why am I seeing commercials?


Sent from my LM-G850 using Tapatalk


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## James Long

Paramount+ Help Center

Commercial Free plan 
Stream all the same amazing programming that comes with the Limited Commercials plan-commercial free*! Plus, download shows and movies to watch offline.

$9.99/month with a 1 week free trial
$99.99/year with a 1 week free trial (save over 15% off the monthly price!)

**Except live TV and few shows*


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## inkahauts

I think paramount is very serious about being on its own. When you look at something like Disney, there is a reason that Disney plus and FX are totally separate. Disney doesn’t want kids stuff and adult only stuff folded together. So they Sell it separate. Paramount is doing the same thing. The outlier is BET but then I could make the argument it’s demographics are different enough it to should be separated out as well. It won’t surprise me if at some point down the road they have Hulu esque package that allows people to purchase bet, nick, and paramount all in one package. 

It’s also possible they don’t have all the streaming rights for enough of the programs on bet bd nick to fold them into paramount at the moment. Someone should have to really look into that to find out. 

I can see paramount looking to buy additional programing and even a small studio To add to their portfolio, not sell themselves off to someone else.


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## makaiguy

dod1450 said:


> I was paying cbs all access commercial free. Now that cbs all access is part of paramount. Why am I seeing commercials?
> 
> Sent from my LM-G850 using Tapatalk


Problem at Viacom. Complaints all over on Roku support snd elsewhere.


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## dod1450

I just cancel Paramount. Here is what I was paying. 
"Paramount+ (Commercial Free) $9.99/month" Which I was not getting "commercial-free."


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## dod1450

This is from Paramount website. I think this is a joke. "*Why am I seeing commercials with Commercial Free?*
While you can stream the majority of Paramount+ shows ad-free, select shows do have promotional interruptions (a brief break in programming to let you know about other Paramount+ shows), and live TV will include commercials."

So I have now unsubscribed from Paramount.


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## B. Shoe

dod1450 said:


> While you can stream the majority of Paramount+ shows ad-free, select shows do have promotional interruptions (a brief break in programming to let you know about other Paramount+ shows), and live TV will include commercials."


How often are you seeing the "promotional interruptions" during a 30-minute or 60-minute program? And how long are those breaks lasting?


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## dod1450

B. Shoe said:


> How often are you seeing the "promotional interruptions" during a 30-minute or 60-minute program? And how long are those breaks lasting?


 At the beginning from 5 minutes to about 6o seconds then 8 minutes later you will see a 120 seconds promotion.


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## NashGuy

inkahauts said:


> I can see paramount looking to buy additional programing and even a small studio To add to their portfolio, not sell themselves off to someone else.


Even after CBS and Viacom (Paramount) re-merged a year or so ago, they're still pretty small ($25 B market cap) compared to media titans like Disney ($330 B), AT&T/WarnerMedia ($213 B), Comcast/NBCUniversal ($247 B), and Netflix ($243 B). I'm not alone in thinking that ViacomCBS will end up in one or more mergers or acquisitions in the next few years in order to scale up. One analyst I read recently suggested that they may be separately structuring their services (Paramount+, Showtime, BET+) to make it easier for a future sale and break-up. Who knows.

Shortly before CBS got into heavy merger talks with Viacom, they made an unsolicited bid to buy Starz from Lionsgate but the offer was rejected and things apparently went no further on that front.

There are only so many small-to-mid-sized chess pieces left on the media board aside from ViacomCBS: Sony Pictures and TV, Fox (which is now just the Fox broadcast networks plus their sports and news cable channels), Discovery, Lionsgate (studio + Starz), MGM (studio + Epix), AMC, and the privately-held Crown Media (Hallmark cable networks and streaming).

Here's who owns everything in the media today

I keep saying that it would make sense for ViacomCBS to acquire Lionsgate and MGM. They could consolidate their film and TV studios and their content libraries while folding Starz and Epix into Showtime to make it bigger and more compelling. It would be the last remaining pure "premium" service, always ad-free, with content focused on more sophisticated adult tastes. Meanwhile, Paramount+ would continue to serve as their more mainstream, something-for-everyone (including kids) streaming service -- effectively the streaming era successor to broadcast and basic cable.


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## billsharpe

I have been watching CBS Sunday Morning, CBS Evening News, All Rise, and B Positive without any commercials on Paramount+. The Sunday show runs about 62 minutes instead of 90 and I watched it two days ago. I signed up for the discount price of $50 for 12 months early in March. I consider it a real bargain.


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## b4pjoe

I've watched FBI, FBI Most Wanted, Bull, Blue Bloods, Seal Team, SWAT, Magnum PI, Mom, Young Sheldon, B Positive, The United States of Al, The Neighborhood, The Unicorn, and Bob and Abishola recently with no commercials.


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## phrelin

I was beginning to think I was crazy until the last two posts. We watch 9 Paramount+ shows a week and are not seeing any commercials, because we pay for no commercials. I do use Apple and Amazon boxes. I suppose that could be why.


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## b4pjoe

I've noticed this weeks Tuesday episodes of FBI and FBI Most Wanted are not on Paramount+ yet. The Monday and Thursday comedies are all on there as is SWAT and Seal Team from Wednesday. Anyone know why those latest episodes of FBI and FBI Most Wanted are not on there? I wonder if they are going to do those the way Peacock does with The Blacklist and wait a week before putting the new episodes up? If so that is an excellent way of losing subscribers.


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## lparsons21

b4pjoe said:


> I've noticed this weeks Tuesday episodes of FBI and FBI Most Wanted are not on Paramount+ yet. The Monday and Thursday comedies are all on there as is SWAT and Seal Team from Wednesday. Anyone know why those latest episodes of FBI and FBI Most Wanted are not on there? I wonder if they are going to do those the way Peacock does with The Blacklist and wait a week before putting the new episodes up? If so that is an excellent way of losing subscribers.


I think they were reruns.


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## b4pjoe

To answer my own question....the guide showed them both as new a new episodes for the date of 4/27/21 which is next Tuesday and the DVR recorded them. What recorded was a re-run of FBI and the FBI Most Wanted was a CBS special about the Chauvin trial in Minnesota.


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## b4pjoe

lparsons21 said:


> I think they were reruns.


Yeah one was and the other was something different as I posted above at the same time you were posting.


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## Andrew Sullivan

NCIS last week was a repeat on Paramount but on Cyberflix it was new. As of this moment it still shows the last episode available on Paaramount as on 4-6, episode 11, Gut Punch. We already watched episode12, Sangre, on 4-20.


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## James Long

NCIS was a repeat on my local CBS ... despite the EPG information. The local CBS aired episode 8 (Jack Slone's last episode).


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## MysteryMan

James Long said:


> NCIS was a repeat on my local CBS ... despite the EPG information. The local CBS aired episode 8 (Jack Slone's last episode).


Same here.


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## SamC

It wasn't a local station thing. CBS aired a rerun because it did not want to get pre-empted in one time zone and maybe not another in case the Minnesota deal went south. NCIS ratings are very important to CBS.

The episode scheduled for last week "Sangre" will be shown this week, and everything is just pushed back a week for the rest of the year.


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## Andrew Sullivan

This networks information page is just so uninformative. I g to the Drama section and it shows Blue Bloods, NCIS, Bull, SealmTeam. That's all fine. But it also does not show Clarice, The Equalizer, MacGyver, Magnum PI, NCIS LA, NCIS NO. All high ranking dramas on CBS right now, but they do list the following shows no only no longer on some some have been off the air for over 20 years. , The Goodwife, The Guardian, Criminal Minds, CSI Miami, Star Trek Voyager, Star Trek Deep Space Nine, Star Trek Enterprise. All good shows but that kind of list is meaningless when your checking to see if any current episodes of 2021 shows have aired.


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## b4pjoe

Andrew Sullivan said:


> This networks information page is just so uninformative. I g to the Drama section and it shows Blue Bloods, NCIS, Bull, SealmTeam. That's all fine. *But it also does not show Clarice, The Equalizer, MacGyver, Magnum PI, NCIS LA, NCIS NO.* All high ranking dramas on CBS right now, but they do list the following shows no only no longer on some some have been off the air for over 20 years. , The Goodwife, The Guardian, Criminal Minds, CSI Miami, Star Trek Voyager, Star Trek Deep Space Nine, Star Trek Enterprise. All good shows but that kind of list is meaningless when your checking to see if any current episodes of 2021 shows have aired.


You mean on the Paramount+ app right? Those bolded shows are in the list of dramas on my app on the ATV.


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## Andrew Sullivan

b4pjoe said:


> You mean on the Paramount+ app right? Those bolded shows are in the list of dramas on my app on the ATV.


There in the main Drama catagory on the left side of the screen which you have to select from which begins with Search at the top. There is also a section list that appears when you originally log on. I'm looking at it right now. The first catagory is DRAMA, under that is Comedies, under that is Keep Watching. Neither Drama or Comedies for instance include all of the current shows in that catagory but do include many shows that havent been on for many years (Hot in Cleveland, Love Boat, I Love Lucy etc). So now I have to go over to the left side of the page, scroll down to SHOWS, then over to Drama or Comedies and search for what I want. Why not allow for a Custom page set up for Shows you Watch or Favorites or My List, similar to Netflix and Prime? So simple.


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## Getteau

I agree. The lack of a “my list” or favorites area is completely baffling from a UI perspective. Every other service I use has one and it makes this app a pain to use and makes it harder than it needs to be to continue watching a series.


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## b4pjoe

Andrew Sullivan said:


> There in the main Drama catagory on the left side of the screen which you have to select from which begins with Search at the top. There is also a section list that appears when you originally log on. I'm looking at it right now. The first catagory is DRAMA, under that is Comedies, under that is Keep Watching. Neither Drama or Comedies for instance include all of the current shows in that catagory but do include many shows that havent been on for many years (Hot in Cleveland, Love Boat, I Love Lucy etc). So now I have to go over to the left side of the page, scroll down to SHOWS, then over to Drama or Comedies and search for what I want. Why not allow for a Custom page set up for Shows you Watch or Favorites or My List, similar to Netflix and Prime? So simple.


The list on the left of my Paramount+ app on the ATV shows Search, Home, Shows, Movies, Live TV, News, and Brands. There is no Drama in that list for me. To get to Drama I have to click Shows whcih opens a new flyout menu with the different categories of which Drama is one of them. The only other place I see Drama is by going to Home and then over to the right you can scroll down through categories Comedy, Drama etc....and the sideways for various shows for those categories. And there does seem to be missing a few current shows not in that list. I agree it would be nice if you could create your own list. They just got profiles recently so my guess is that might be added at some point.


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## Andrew Sullivan

b4pjoe said:


> The list on the left of my Paramount+ app on the ATV shows Search, Home, Shows, Movies, Live TV, News, and Brands. There is no Drama in that list for me. To get to Drama I have to click Shows whcih opens a new flyout menu with the different categories of which Drama is one of them. The only other place I see Drama is by going to Home and then over to the right you can scroll down through categories Comedy, Drama etc....and the sideways for various shows for those categories. And there does seem to be missing a few current shows not in that list. I agree it would be nice if you could create your own list. They just got profiles recently so my guess is that might be added at some point.


Not something that should be offered SOMETIME. The competition was there first and it should be obvious with just a little savvy that a Favorites list is kinda important. It's a big enough deal to keep me from reupping.


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## b4pjoe

Paramount+ Help Center

Does Paramount+ have a watchlist?

Not yet, but we're working on a watchlist feature for the near future. Stay tuned!


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## Andrew Sullivan

b4pjoe said:


> Paramount+ Help Center
> 
> Does Paramount+ have a watchlist?
> 
> Not yet, but we're working on a watchlist feature for the near future. Stay tuned!


Interesting. What exactly is your idea of Near Future?


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## b4pjoe

Well I'm not the one that answered the FAQ question but my idea of the near future would 3 - 6 months. Could be sooner. Could be later. But at least they say they are working on it. Of course they could be lying about it too.


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## Andrew Sullivan

b4pjoe said:


> Well I'm not the one that answered the FAQ question but my idea of the near future would 3 - 6 months. Could be sooner. Could be later. But at least they say they are working on it. Of course they could be lying about it too.


I'm leaning towards the maybe never camp. I can think of at least 8 streaming services that include a "Favorites" catagory. Most of which are not close to clout factor of CBS All Access/Paramount+. I can't say they are lying because I've seen no official statement from them alluding to a upcoming "Favorites" catagory.


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## b4pjoe

I posted the link above to where they did in fact allude to it. Here it is again.

Paramount+ Help Center


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## harsh

It may be that if you subscribe through an aggregator such as Amazon Prime, AppleTV+ or the Roku Channel that you'll have access to their recents/favorites listing for Paramount+.

I recall that when I subscribed to CBSAA through Prime, the shows I was watching showed up in my recents/watch next list.


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## b4pjoe

Yes it still does that on the Apple TV but he wants the Paramount + apps to have watch lists in the app. I don't know what box he is using. And on the Apple TV you don't have to subscribe through Apple for the shows to show up in the watch next list.


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## Andrew Sullivan

b4pjoe said:


> Yes it still does that on the Apple TV but he wants the Paramount + apps to have watch lists in the app. I don't know what box he is using. And on the Apple TV you don't have to subscribe through Apple for the shows to show up in the watch next list.


I have it directly through the TV (Samsung QLED). I also have it through my Invidia Shield and also through a Firestick. Also, as I'm sitting here watching FBI, I notice that before each show that I watch it is preceded by a Paramount commercial. Since I am paying extra to watch content commercial free I'm wondering how they can get away with this.


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## NashGuy

Andrew Sullivan said:


> I have it directly through the TV (Samsung QLED). I also have it through my Invidia Shield and also through a Firestick. Also, as I'm sitting here watching FBI, I notice that before each show that I watch it is preceded by a Paramount commercial. Since I am paying extra to watch content commercial free I'm wondering how they can get away with this.


Pre-roll previews for the service's own content has always been normal behavior from ad-free premium services like HBO, Showtime and Epix. Although they always allow you to FF/skip through the preview if you like. Sounds like Paramount+'s ad-free premium tier is doing the same thing.


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## Andrew Sullivan

NashGuy said:


> Pre-roll previews for the service's own content has always been normal behavior from ad-free premium services like HBO, Showtime and Epix. Although they always allow you to FF/skip through the preview if you like. Sounds like Paramount+'s ad-free premium tier is doing the same thing.


HBO, SHOWTIME and EPIX do not offer a commercial free premium package. I am paying a up graded premium price to not watch commercials. This is the package they offered and still offer. A commercial is a commercial. I don't care if it's a Paramount commercial. As far as I'm concerned I have honored the contract and they have broked it.


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## NashGuy

Andrew Sullivan said:


> HBO, SHOWTIME and EPIX do not offer a commercial free premium package.


HBO, Showtime and Epix are all commercial-free premium packages. Commercial-free has always been the only way to subscribe to those services and they've always been marketed that way. They've never carried spots for third-party products like soup, diapers, or cars. The previews that those services air for their own upcoming content, in between shows and movies on their linear channels, have never been considered "ads," even if you think of them that way. Once those services launched companion streaming apps, they often chose to stream a single preview ahead of the selected feature but you've always been able to FF through it if it was something you didn't want to watch. I actual like seeing them because they give me an idea of other things I might want to see on a service I'm already paying for. But then I always liked seeing the previews before movies at the theater too. (Although I disliked it when theaters began running ads for other stuff before movies.)

At any rate, if you don't like seeing the pre-show previews on Paramount+, try fast forwarding through them. Or cancel the service. But my point is that that practice is considered normal, even for an ad-free service. I don't expect them to stop doing it.


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## b4pjoe

Andrew Sullivan said:


> I have it directly through the TV (Samsung QLED). I also have it through my Invidia Shield and also through a Firestick. Also, as I'm sitting here watching FBI, I notice that before each show that I watch it is preceded by a Paramount commercial. Since I am paying extra to watch content commercial free I'm wondering how they can get away with this.


I have the commercial free version too. I just watched last weeks FBI, FBI: Most Wanted, and Magnum PI and never saw any Paramount commercial nor did I see any for the half hour CBS comedies from last week. Weird.


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## billsharpe

One reason I don't go to movie theaters anymore is the commercials and seemingly endless previews they show before the main feature. I can accept a 30-second preview of a Paramount+ program, although I haven't noticed any yet.


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## Andrew Sullivan

billsharpe said:


> One reason I don't go to movie theaters anymore is the commercials and seemingly endless previews they show before the main feature. I can accept a 30-second preview of a Paramount+ program, although I haven't noticed any yet.


I just started Clarice and was immediately shown a commercial for "The Stand".


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## b4pjoe

Are you sure you have the ad free subscription and you are logged in with that subscription? I know that is a silly question but I never see those ads with my ad free subscription on there. Maybe I'm just lucky.


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## Andrew Sullivan

b4pjoe said:


> Are you sure you have the ad free subscription and you are logged in with that subscription? I know that is a silly question but I never see those ads with my ad free subscription on there. Maybe I'm just lucky.


Yes. There are no commercials during the shows. This commercial thing was a mere minor ad on to my major complaint fueling this thread. No Favorites List.


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## phrelin

I've had an commercial-free subscription to CBS-All-Access-now-Paramount+ since 2017 and have never noticed promo's. But that doesn't mean with the advent of Paramount+ we won't be getting any as they are now define themselves as a competitor with HBO Max, etc. rather than Hulu ad-free. With the advent of streamers like Disney+ and Peacock, my guess is the definition of commercials/advertising no longer includes promos.


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## b4pjoe

Andrew Sullivan said:


> Yes. There are no commercials during the shows. This commercial thing was a mere minor ad on to my major complaint fueling this thread. No Favorites List.


When you see these promos is there a skip button like there is on HBO MAX? I do see the promos there but the skip button makes them disappear if it is something I don't want to see.


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## billsharpe

Last night I got a 15-second promo for a Paramount+ show before watching B-Positive. It was short enough that I didn't even try to fast-forward through it. I also watched All-Rise with no promo at the start. B-Positive is only 21 minutes without commercials. CBS Sunday Morning is only 62 minutes. I watch that show weekly and haven't seen a promo yet before it starts.


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## Andrew Sullivan

billsharpe said:


> Last night I got a 15-second promo for a Paramount+ show before watching B-Positive. It was short enough that I didn't even try to fast-forward through it. I also watched All-Rise with no promo at the start. B-Positive is only 21 minutes without commercials. CBS Sunday Morning is only 62 minutes. I watch that show weekly and haven't seen a promo yet before it starts.


We just watched Young Sheldon which was preceded by a Picard commercial. Now watching SWAT which was preceded by a Coyote commercial. No biggie but it is what it is.


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## NashGuy

Andrew Sullivan said:


> We just watched Young Sheldon which was preceded by a Picard commercial. Now watching SWAT which was preceded by a Coyote commercial. No biggie but it is what it is.


Just curious: does it allow you to FF through the preview? Hopefully so. Not cool if they force it on you.


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## Andrew Sullivan

NashGuy said:


> Just curious: does it allow you to FF through the preview? Hopefully so. Not cool if they force it on you.


No, it does not allow for FF. I've tried several times. Like I said, it's not a big deal but more of a principle thing. I know it's not a bunch of back to back big time commercials but they didnt offer a "only our commercial" package.


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## billsharpe

HBO in particular has always been full on promos before or after shows. I'm OK with short promos as long as they don't interrupt the show.


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## b4pjoe

Andrew Sullivan said:


> No, it does not allow for FF. I've tried several times. Like I said, it's not a big deal but more of a principle thing. I know it's not a bunch of back to back big time commercials but they didnt offer a "only our commercial" package.


My account was a CBS AA commercial free account that was migrated over to Paramount+. Was yours like that too or is your account a new Paramount+ account? I ask because I've seen never seen the ads you are seeing before shows. I watched The Neighborhood, Bob and Abishola, FBI, FBI Most Wanted, S.W.A.T. and Seal Team from last week last night and never saw any kind of ad of any kind. Not sure if two accounts that differ like that would see differences in the promos shown but it is all I can think of.


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## NashGuy

billsharpe said:


> HBO in particular has always been full on promos before or after shows. I'm OK with short promos as long as they don't interrupt the show.


The HBO Max, Showtime and Epix Now apps all do this but they also all let you FF through the single promo spot that streams before the feature. (The Starz app may do it too, can't remember as I haven't had it in forever.) I don't mind it, as long as it's not a promo I've already seen umpteen times, in which case I'll FF/skip it.


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## Andrew Sullivan

NashGuy said:


> The HBO Max, Showtime and Epix Now apps all do this but they also all let you FF through the single promo spot that streams before the feature. (The Starz app may do it too, can't remember as I haven't had it in forever.) I don't mind it, as long as it's not a promo I've already seen umpteen times, in which case I'll FF/skip it.


The HBO App, the Showtime and the Epix apps also do NOT offer a higher priced commercial free option. Like I said, its not a big deal, just a principle thing. As far as I know my CBSAA account simply transferred over since it just showed up one day.


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## Getteau

A few weeks ago, I would get the please wait ... message and then it would show the paramount logo and move on. Now, I'm getting previews for other shows before every episode of Star Trek (the only thing I'm currently watching on Paramount+). If it happens once when I'm streaming 4 or 5 shows in a row, it's OK. When I get a 20-30 second, non FF'able commercial/preview before the start of every show, it's down right annoying. Especially when the 20+ second ad is then followed up by the Paramount logo ad that follows it.
It's like the stupid ad's in the DTV guide. When there were 3 or 4 of them total, it was OK. Now I have screens in my guide where 4 or 5 of the guide slots are covered in DTV ad's and you can't see the actual guide listings because they are burred in ad's.


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## NashGuy

Andrew Sullivan said:


> The HBO App, the Showtime and the Epix apps also do NOT offer a higher priced commercial free option. Like I said, its not a big deal, just a principle thing. As far as I know my CBSAA account simply transferred over since it just showed up one day.


Those services only offer a commercial-free version without an option to pay less for a version that includes ads. Although HBO Max will, in fact, begin selling a cheaper (rumored to be $10/mo) version in June that includes ads in the non-HBO content.


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## phrelin

Just to confirm, tonight Paramount+ "touted their excellent shows tonight" before two we wanted to watch. Oh well....


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