# 721 vs. 510/08/01



## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

For those of you that have used both the 721 and 5xx (not incl. 522), I would like to know which you prefer. Please feel free to post the reasons behind your vote, as well. Thanks.
(I'm considering returning my 510, and getting a 721.)


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## Jason (Aug 8, 2002)

garypen said:


> For those of you that have used both the 721 and 5xx (not incl. 522), I would like to know which you prefer. Please feel free to post the reasons behind your vote, as well. Thanks.
> (I'm considering returning my 510, and getting a 721.)


Gary,

I have a 721 and a 501. I just retired the 501 and added a 921. Dual tuner is definitely the way to go! A single tuner is a major inconvenience because you can never watch another channel while you are recording something. Another benefit of you going with the 721 over the 510 is that there is no DVR fees. The 721 started off, like most Dish receivers, being very unstable and infested with bugs. It is a pretty solid unit now after 2 years of updates. If you can return your 510, I say go for it and get the special upgrade pricing on the 721 before they are gone!


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Gary, I thought you were just waiting out your E* commitment and then going to switch to D*. Have you changed your mind?


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

RAD said:


> Gary, I thought you were just waiting out your E* commitment and then going to switch to D*. Have you changed your mind?


That's what I thought too based on your E* comments....you don't seem like a very satisfied E* customer. You don't seem as disatisfied as Bob Haller, but disatisfied nonetheless.....


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

While I'm with Dish, I might as well enjoy it to its fullest, no? I can always sell the gear if and when I bail. 

If they get their sh*t together by that time, I would stay. Odds are, they won't, of course. But, if they do, I'd gladly stay. I have no particular brand loyalty. Whichever company provides the best value for me will get my biz. (That will include Voom and Cable.) They're all just utility companies, after all.


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## retiredTech (Oct 27, 2003)

I paid full price for my 721, now that they are available for half price, this is a no brainer for me, the 510 is ok(my sister-inlaw has one) but dual tuners and no dvr fee make the 721 a real joy. I would recommend a 721 to anyone. Mine works well everyday. The only thing I know of personally is that the 721 will not work with a 3sat cascaded twin/sw21 config. I now have mine on a sw64 for 3 sats.


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## cclement (Mar 22, 2004)

The 721 is a great stable receiver. I would highly recommend it to any one, especially at the cheap price they are giving them out now!!


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## TomCat (Aug 31, 2002)

I love both my 721 and my 508 (and even my 501), but there are differences. The 721 search (now somewhat crippled) and setting of recordings is a breeze on a connected keyboard and I like the guide with pip. On the other hand, slo-mo / FA really blows on the 721, and the time bar covers credits (too big). global padding can't be turned off, either. I'm not sure why, but I seem to record all 60 minute dramas on the 721 and all sitcoms and throw-away programs on the 508 (have gotten away from movies and sports lately, with my D-backs threatening to usurp the cellar from Montreal). I pretty much only use the 501 as a receiver for my DVDR and second-level monitoring (the HD is a little iffy...guess I should RMA it since I'm paying for the service plan, but I need to offload some stuff).

721 vs. 50x is a tossup. 721 vs. 510 is a no-brainer.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

TomCat said:


> (have gotten away from movies and sports lately, with my D-backs threatening to usurp the cellar from Montreal).


But...They live in two different cellars. One's in the East, and one's in the West.

721 vs. 510 is a no-brainer? _Pretend_ for a minute that I don't have a brain. (OK, so you don't have to pretend that hard.) Which would you choose? You don't actually say.


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## Randy_B (Apr 23, 2002)

Dual tuner is the giant difference. Especially in trying to satisfy the recording wants of a family. We have a 501, 510 and 721 (the 721 is in the family room, the 510 records only my shows, and I filled the HD on the 501 during a free movie weekend and deactivated it). All three are and have been extremely stable for a long time now (I really know unstable after having had a 7100 and 7200 for several years!). The larger guide on the 721 is also a big +. It is much closer to the look of the DP. The guide screen on the 5xx series is WAY to small. The fact that the 5xx event screen is sticky is nice (set it for name sort and it STAYS that way until you change it). I agree with retired tech. with the 721 promo it is great deal.

TomCat, are you talking about the progress bar that appears when you pause? If so, then after you hit pause and it appears, do a step ahead or back (jump fwd or back buttons) and the bar will disappear.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

Where do you see the 721 upgrade offer on the Dishnetwork website? What are the details? 

..Doyle

EDIT: I found the thread with the details. Thanks....


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## rcwilcox (Jan 20, 2003)

Got my 721 a couple of years ago at what was then a good price $399. Had a bad tuner but since then I prefer it over my 508. My 508 is good but like the dual tuners very much. Seems like I don't record all that much but inevitable conflicts fixed by the dual tuners especially on Sunday night. I wish I could get another 721 for $249 but I have hit Dish up for the 508 for $99 so doubt they wouuld deal again.


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## luckycat (Mar 12, 2003)

rcwilcox said:


> Got my 721 a couple of years ago at what was then a good price $399. Had a bad tuner but since then I prefer it over my 508. My 508 is good but like the dual tuners very much. Seems like I don't record all that much but inevitable conflicts fixed by the dual tuners especially on Sunday night. I wish I could get another 721 for $249 but I have hit Dish up for the 508 for $99 so doubt they wouuld deal again.


Don't assume that - I got the 508 for $99 several months ago when that promo was running, and then just recently got the 721 for $249. Email them and check it out.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Hey Guys (and Gals?) - Thanks for all the great information on the 721 compared to the 510/08/01. Please keep 'em coming! They're very helpful.


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## rcwilcox (Jan 20, 2003)

luckycat said:


> Don't assume that - I got the 508 for $99 several months ago when that promo was running, and then just recently got the 721 for $249. Email them and check it out.


Well I took luckycat's advice emailed ceo got a call the next day long story short am getting a 721 for $249 plus a DP quad and a DP34 all shipped to me am doing own install.


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## luckycat (Mar 12, 2003)

rcwilcox said:


> Well I took luckycat's advice emailed ceo got a call the next day long story short am getting a 721 for $249 plus a DP quad and a DP34 all shipped to me am doing own install.


Good deal! I have really been enjoying my 721..love the program guide, having two tuners has been terrific. I just wish I could get the 921, warts and all, for $249, or $500... maybe the 942 or whatever will hit that price point?


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## AppliedAggression (Aug 16, 2003)

I just received my 721, and have had a 508 for almost 2 years. the 721 definitely has more features and makes some things just easier to edit, but i have to say that the 5xx series is a lot more stable. I also think the 721 is harder to use and there are a few things i don't like about it. when it comes down to it though, the extra features of the 721 and dual tuners, make it a giant leap above the 5xx.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Can you be more specific about the stability issue, and which features are easier and/or harder on the 721? Thanks, AA.


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## AppliedAggression (Aug 16, 2003)

for stability i haven't experienced anything major but from the moment i plugged it in, it wouldn't let me change channels, it was stuck on channel 77, which doesn't exist. Once the new software loaded, the receiver then tuned everything just fine. I've had times where the remote stops responding and I have to reboot, last night it missed a recording. Like i said, nothing I consider major but a few annoyances. I'm sure the 5xx series has them as well but I have rarely experienced them, and I've had my 721 for 2 days.

As far as easier to use, I mean things like when you go set a timer, you have a box right then in there that lets you pad the recording. On the 5xx Dvrs, you have to first set the timer, then go into the timers menu and manually edit it. Another convienent feature of the 721 is being able to change channels while in the guide without actually getting out of the guide. It works great. Being able to tell the receiver to turn off when it's done with a recording I also like quite a bit. There's many more features like this that simply aren't on the 5xx series.

One important feature I like a lot and almost forgot is that with the 721, when you hover over a program in the guide, it automaticly shows the info of that program on the top left corner. It saves a lot a time when compared to hitting info over and over again on a 508.

These are more few and far between but the 5xx does have some features the 721 does not, or that are just plain better. The timers menu is a perfect example, it is a lot more clearly laid out than the 721's, so is the PVR screen.

There really are many, many small differences between the two, but I would basicly base your decision on whether you need 1 tuner or 2.

Here's a bunch of screens I took of the 501/508/510. It should really help you out if you haven't seen one yet.

http://dvr.dbstalk.com/508/

Maybe I'll find the time to do the same for the 721. Would be great to compare them with screens, side by side.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Excellent review. It sounds like the 721 has quite a few superior features to the 510. OTOH, the fact that you've already had to reboot a few times to get the remote to respond, and already lost a recording, doesn't fill me with confidence. I was hoping that they finally got the SW right, now that they're discontinuing it. (Their SOP.)

Thanks for the 510 screen shots, but I already have a 510, so I'm familiar with the menus and such.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

As of 5pm tonight, I have replaced a 508 with a 721. I have not had a lot of time on the 721, but it did take a while to come up the first time and I had some remote issues. It felt like I was kickign starting it.  I think the problem was mainly I was not patient enough to let the box initialize itself. 

THe Font size is a lot smaller than the 508 so if you have bad eyes, keep your 508. I do like the overall look better and the PIP and 2nd tuner is going to help a lot for me.. Give me a few days and I will have a better opinion. Going to have to see if I can find those checkboxes..  

The info on the Guide is a welcome addition too. Buttons are much smaller. 

Overall I am glad I ran the 2nd cable. I would not put a lot of weight to Applieds issues. I had similar problems, but it was out of the box experience and it was with older software 1.19 that I had mine. Be intersting what Applieds thoughts are one week later after the box has settled in.


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## TomCat (Aug 31, 2002)

garypen said:


> But...They live in two different cellars. One's in the East, and one's in the West.
> 
> 721 vs. 510 is a no-brainer? _Pretend_ for a minute that I don't have a brain. (OK, so you don't have to pretend that hard.) Which would you choose? You don't actually say.


But they are battling down to the wire for worst won-lost record in the Natl. League. It's a little less embarrasing to be a D-backs fan while Montreal is sucking so badly than if they weren't.

The deal breaker is the VOD fee. If I had no PVR and was going to get one, I would choose the 721 over the 510 for that reason. The 721 is a Lexus while the 510 is a Camry (as is the 501/8) but if you figure another 180 bucks in VOD over the life of the unit for a 510, that Camry actually ends up costing more than the Lexus.

Apply that to the 508 vs. 721, and you have a harder choice, because in either case you get what you pay for. The extra features on the 721 validate its extra cost. VOD can't be justified no matter what the argument is.

As for stability, the 50x platform has been pretty rock-solid now for some time. I bought a 501 on day one, so I have lived through all of the fires of hell regarding its evolution, which was nothing but ugly. But now, it is a rock. The 721 had a few growing pains, too, but it is pretty solid as well. Still not as mature or solid as the 50x, but definitely getting there. Unfortunately, neither enjoys the nearly instant reliability that Replay or Tivo enjoyed, but I still much prefer DISH PVR's to anything out there, warts and all. There was a time when I couldn't say that, but things change.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Sounds like a decent piece of gear. I guess you, and the other kind folks, have talked me into it. Now, I wonder if I can get a DPP44 with it, so I don't have to run another feed through the wall?


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Well here is a bit more that I have found on the 721 vs. 508. The 721 on my TV is actually get clipped. I think this is because I have a older TV set and the 721 uses more of the screen than the 508. This is a minor inconvience. The Dual tuner feature is well integrated with the exception that I could not find a way to switch back and forth without going to PIP. Would be nice if there was a button to toggle between the tuners. 

General Font size is smaller so if this is a concern don't jump. Having a dual Tuner PVR in the bedroom is great. No more conflict watching survivor and apprentice for next season if they conflict. Like TomCat said... No Brainer. (How.. with my upstar 508 ever once in a while it decides to stop recording the events I have set up so my rock has a whole in it.... Reboot fixes this issue.)

As for reliability, I know that Tivo/Reply have a better reputation on this department but I am not sure how accurate that statement is when comparing a 721 vs. Reply/Tivo. To bad there is not a reliability lab testing all this equipment to quantify this view. From the user reports I have read with the exception of a few 721 users and one in particular, the 721 is stable in general. 

The reason I said "In General" is that I am sure some would disagree. There is an opinion that DirecTV boxes are more stable than Dish. I was talking to the neighbor across the street that has 6 DirecTV receivers and he was telling me some horry stories about how all his receivers expect the family room crash. He is one phone call from trashing DirectTV and going with another provider (No I did not push him to Dish). If I was just using him as a baramoter, I would think DirecTV sucks which is not the case at all. Always good to get a deverse set of opinions when changing.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

WeeJavaDude said:


> No more conflict watching survivor and apprentice for next season if they conflict.


I actually found a solution for that with my 510: If anyone in my household tunes to either the Apprentice or Survivor, I smack them in the head with it. It works pretty well.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Yes but your solution costs you an extra 10 bucks if you don't have AEP.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

It's worth it.


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## Slaylock (Jun 2, 2004)

I appreciate everyone who has posted their impressions to this thread. I currently have a Dishplayer 7100, and I'm very tempted to upgrade to a 721. 

I enjoyed looking at the screenshots of the 508 interface that were posted earlier in this thread, and I was wondering if anyone knows where I might find similar screenshots for the 721.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

I did a quick look last night on my 721 in regards to the Lock features here is what I could find. 

They do provide a Hide Adult feature. I did not see anyway of hiding locked channels. There was the ability to lock on Rating and on some key words but no ability to hide all lock channels. 

Another annoyance was when you set up your favorites it does not show what channels you are not subscribed to. This makes it rather confusing and a little more complicated. Not a huge deal, but something I do no perfer. 

I could not find a way to swap tuner without going through PIP. There is a swap button on the remote and I expected pushing it would changed the tuner inputs. I was suprised it did not.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Also Gary.. There is Video inputs in the front of the 721 that map to channel 0 like the 811. I have not tried these yet but it does help. I plan on using them watch some movies I have still in my existing 508.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Slaylock said:


> I appreciate everyone who has posted their impressions to this thread. I currently have a Dishplayer 7100, and I'm very tempted to upgrade to a 721.
> 
> I enjoyed looking at the screenshots of the 508 interface that were posted earlier in this thread, and I was wondering if anyone knows where I might find similar screenshots for the 721.


Try

http://www.angelfire.com/tv2/fel/721/index.html


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

WeeJavaDude said:


> Also Gary.. There is Video inputs in the front of the 721 that map to channel 0 like the 811. I have not tried these yet but it does help. I plan on using them watch some movies I have still in my existing 508.


Can you record from this front panel input? I'd like to move some stuff from my 510 onto the new 721, if possible.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

garypen said:


> Can you record from this front panel input? I'd like to move some stuff from my 510 onto the new 721, if possible.


I would expect you to be able to.. I can give it a try since I am set up to be able to tonight and get back to you tomorrow unless someone else has already tried this out.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Excellent. Thanks. Mrs. Gary would be quite upset if I lost her American Idol and Ryan Seacrest eps. (OTOH, I wouldn't mind getting the hdd space back. Don't tell her, OK?)


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

You can only watch on the video input on the front of the 721. You can not record and after doing this experiment it became obvious why not. The 721 does not have an MPEG-2 encoder. It can only decode and that is why you cannot record from the front input. A technical reason for once.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

That makes sense! Thanks.


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