# Best Buy runs out of stock so cancels online orders for Christmas!



## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

"Due to overwhelming demand of hot product offerings on BestBuy.com during the November and December time period, we have encountered a situation that has affected redemption of some of our customers’ online orders. We are very sorry for the inconvenience this has caused, and we have notified the affected customers,"

Just what you need 2 days before Christmas - that nice gift you bought a while ago and was waiting for it to be shipped is now cancelled!

This isnt them not allowing people to order, this is them cancelling orders they have taken in the past few weeks!

Lots of unhappy people on their forums and facebook at the moment


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

While not that bad, I ordered a TV from Wal-Mart and was promised delivery on or before 12/24. According to FedEd it will not be here until the 27th. Wal-Mart couldn't care any less.

Had this been a Christmas gift for someone other than me, I would be seriously pissed. As it is, I am just really annoyed.


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

hilmar2k said:


> While not that bad, I ordered a TV from Wal-Mart and was promised delivery on or before 12/24. According to FedEd it will not be here until the 27th. Wal-Mart couldn't care any less.
> 
> Had this been a Christmas gift for someone other than me, I would be seriously pissed. As it is, I am just really annoyed.


Have you started tracking it? The reason I say that is that I had my HR34 come from NY by Fedex Ground. When I started tracking it, they said it would be here on 12/21. But when I looked on 12/19 it was on the local truck for delivery.

They are throwing out all the stops to get things here and weather isnt holding things up. A friend of mine owns a franchised large rental truck business and 80% of his trucks have been out all month to UPS and FEDEX


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

F1 Fan said:


> Have you started tracking it? The reason I say that is that I had my HR34 come from NY by Fedex Ground. When I started tracking it, they said it would be here on 12/21. But when I looked on 12/19 it was on the local truck for delivery.
> 
> They are throwing out all the stops to get things here and weather isnt holding things up. A friend of mine owns a franchised large rental truck business and 80% of his trucks have been out all month to UPS and FEDEX


Yeah, it's apparently still on the way here from Memphis (departed Memphis yesterday at 8:15 AM). I suppose it could arrive this afternoon or tonight and they could deliver it tomorrow. I doubt FedEx is delivering ground shipments on Saturday, though. We'll see.....


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

hilmar2k said:


> Yeah, it's apparently still on the way here from Memphis. I suppose it could arrive this afternoon or tonight and they could deliver it tomorrow. I doubt FedEx is delivering ground shipments on Saturday, though. We'll see.....


Maybe they will for this one day.

Also a friend of mine got up at 3am the other day (with shotgun) as he lives in a rural area and heard a noise outside - turns out Fedex was delivering to him at that time of morning


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

I'm amazed at some of the hassles and surprises with online ordering...

For a gift I ordered a gazebo from Home Depot early last week and it took a full day to get email acknowledging the order, then it took a week to get email that it shipped, another 2 days for the 'label' to show up on the UPS web site, and it was delivered 2 days later - all without the UPS website ever showing any "prorgress".

I had a similar situation with Costco "white glove" shipment just after Thanksgiving: got email right away, but could never find any shipping info. Finally a week went by and I got a phone call, but I was in the dark the entire time up until then.

Amazon seems to get it right, but they've had years of experience building regional shipping centers and working with UPS.

I love Best Buy but this is not good news for them or their customers...


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## Greg Alsobrook (Apr 2, 2007)

According to this Gizmodo article, it's a bit more than just cancelling orders. They're continuing to sell the items at full price, but the ones purchased at sale prices are magically backordered. They were also marking items as shipped (and assuring customers they had), only to come back and say the orders had been cancelled later... leaving customers with hardly any time to source a replacement. I hope they fix this. I really like Best Buy, and this is a huge black mark.


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

Greg Alsobrook said:


> According to this Gizmodo article, it's a bit more than just cancelling orders. They're continuing to sell the items at full price, but the ones purchased at sale prices are magically backordered. They were also marking items as shipped (and assuring customers they had), only to come back and say the orders had been cancelled later... leaving customers with hardly any time to source a replacement.


Yeah I read that article after I did more searching.... There will be some legal cases here. You cannot charge a card for an item (just hold the amount) until you ship it. Most systems, when you mark the item as shipped will automatically put through the charge capture then. So marking those items as shipped and charging for them is Fraud - and against Visa and Mastercard TOS. And they will come down hard on them - especially when it rings into the $$millions


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Ironically, another website I frequent has literally hundreds of posts from folks who just received Best Buy online orders for some hot Android tablets.

In most cases, these were ordered around Thanksgiving on pre-order, and only now shipped. The delay was reported from other retailers carrying the same items to be a result of manufacturers being behind in their production from the Thailand floods that happened a short while ago.

Apparently, the short supplies included tablets, laptops, and other electronics...and it impacted Amazon and other retailers beyond just Best Buy.


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

Greg Alsobrook said:


> According to this Gizmodo article, it's a bit more than just cancelling orders. They're continuing to sell the items at full price, but the ones purchased at sale prices are magically backordered. They were also marking items as shipped (and assuring customers they had), only to come back and say the orders had been cancelled later... leaving customers with hardly any time to source a replacement. I hope they fix this. I really like Best Buy, and this is a huge black mark.


If Best Buy is selling the items in store and online for the full price, out of fairness to the customer Best Buy should be converting all of those "sale" orders to "in store pickups" for the sale price, allowing the customer to walk in and get it today.

To not honor Black Friday orders when the product is still being sold is ridiculous...


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

F1 Fan said:


> Maybe they will for this one day.
> 
> Also a friend of mine got up at 3am the other day (with shotgun) as he lives in a rural area and heard a noise outside - turns out Fedex was delivering to him at that time of morning


Just called FedEx. They said if it shows up at the distrobution center it will be delivered. They said they are delivering anything that might be a gift, regardess of when it would normally be delivered based on the service level it was shipped using. They are normally closed tomorrow, but are remaining open to get as many packages delivered as possible.

A possible side effect of the FedEx guy chucking the monitor over the fence? 

EDIT: My TV is on the truck for delivery. So FedEx bailed out Wal-Mart. Awesome job of FedEx getting it here 3 days ahead of schedule in order to beat Christmas.


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## Greg Alsobrook (Apr 2, 2007)

hilmar2k said:


> Just called FedEx. They said if it shows up at the distrobution center it will be delivered. They said they are delivering anything that might be a gift, regardess of when it would normally be delivered based on the service level it was shipped using. They are normally closed tomorrow, but are remaining open to get as many packages delivered as possible.
> 
> A possible side effect of the FedEx guy chucking the monitor over the fence?


FedEx missed two packages that were coming to me and my wife last Friday... and brought them on Saturday morning. And that was before the box incident. :sure:


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## jadebox (Dec 14, 2004)

F1 Fan said:


> You cannot charge a card for an item (just hold the amount) until you ship it.


That's not true. And, none of the articles I read said that best Buy had charged anyone for the orders that are being canceled. And it certainly wasn't intentional. So, while it certainly will hurt Best Buy's reputation, it wasn't fraud.

-- Roger


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

jadebox said:


> That's not true. And, none of the articles I read said that best Buy had charged anyone for the orders that are being canceled. And it certainly wasn't intentional. So, while it certainly will hurt Best Buy's reputation, it wasn't fraud.
> 
> -- Roger


It is in Visa and Mastercards terms of service for merchants. Which is why they have a single step process and a 2 step process in their systems.

Trust me on this as we write many Shopping Carts for many websites using lots of gateways and spend lots of time in PCI compliance audits etc.

If a merchant sells goods and accepts credit cards they request a "hold" on those funds. In normal practice those funds are no longer available on the card and are help for up to 30 days.

As soon as the merchant ships the items they can then "charge" the amount using the auth code they recieved.

If you try and charge the same time, I have often seen Visa/Mastercard/Discover call the customer and ask them if they have had the items shipped or received them. And have seen the funds held back by Visa etc.

Also the forums and facebook pages show people saying they were charged for the items and told they were shipped.

So if those people were telling the truth (and I suspect they were as most carts will automatically charge once shipped) then yes it is fraud. I dont know what would be done legally. But I have seen repeat offenders have their merchant services removed by Visa. And once you have it removed, good luck on ever getting it re-instated again.


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

No BB for me. I've been in their pits twice in 15+ years. Never again.

First time was many years ago when they opened a store in a new mall in my area. Lots of attitude from their people, very unpleasant experience.

Second time was a few years ago. I had moved a few states away and they opened a new store here. I figured it had been a few years, maybe they learned a thing or two. Just barely got in the door and the vultures descended. Every time I picked up a box to read the specs, a vulture was hanging over my shoulder disrupting my concentration.

I walked out.

----

I have had FedEx deliver on Saturday recently. I think they start residential Saturday ground deliveries after Turkey Day.


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## jadebox (Dec 14, 2004)

F1 Fan said:


> It is in Visa and Mastercards terms of service for merchants.


While some processors might include it, _none_ of the merchant accounts I've used over the years have had that in their Terms of Service.

-- Roger


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

jadebox said:


> While some processors might include it, _none_ of the merchant accounts I've used over the years have had that in their Terms of Service.
> 
> -- Roger


You may be correct. All I know is we write software for shopping carts that accept Visa, Mastercard, Amex, Discover and Diners Club. All of these companies state in their operating conditions that you must deliver goods at time of charge. For a brick and mortar store that is easy. But for eCommerce there are steps we have to take (plus PCI compliance).

As for not being fraud - I would disagree. Although going against TOS is not fraud. Charging for an item you said had been shipped and consequently not shipped, cancelling the order but selling the items at a higher price and then holding onto the original amount and going through the normal merchant refund process (as has been alleged by many BB customers) is most certainly fraud. The part where it becomes fraud is when they charge and tell people it has shipped, people ask for more details and confirmation and again being told is has shipped and will be delivered on xx day. Then find out it was never shipped. The other part is where you offer an item for $xx on sale. charge a card, and say it is on its way. Then cancel the order and offer the same item at a higher price. Again alleged by many people today.


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

jadebox said:


> That's not true. And, none of the articles I read said that best Buy had charged anyone for the orders that are being canceled. *And it certainly wasn't intentional.* So, while it certainly will hurt Best Buy's reputation, it wasn't fraud.
> 
> -- Roger


Again I would disagree. There are a large number of people who are saying they bought items on Black Friday in the sale. They have today had the order cancelled. But you can buy that same item at full price online at Best Buy and in their stores.

And Best Buy put out a statement and sent an email saying these items have had to be cancelled.

How is that not intentional? Or are you saying the charging and then cancelling was not intentional? I cant see how that could happen by accident either.

Best Buy messed up. They are trying to squeeze more sales than they have items for. I very much doubt that if you ordered the sales items at full price, that you would get them either.

But like Netflix, GoDaddy and some others recently - they all sent their CEO's on some new PR course. Instead of apologizing and making it right, they make it 10 times worse.

All Best Buy need to do now is call in Reed Hastings to write them a quick blog and that would be the icing on the cake!


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## photostudent (Nov 8, 2007)

A few years ago I never saw a charge until item was shipped. Now it always comes out of my account as soon as I make purchase. Not sure if it is a charge or hold. Re. BB; I picked up some small items there last Tuesday morning. There were 2 of 8 registers open with about 25 people in line. I knew they would be spending a lot of time trying to sell those buyers extended warranties and sign them up for Rewards Cards or Credit accounts. So I put down what I had and left. You wonder why people shop online?


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

photostudent said:


> A few years ago I never saw a charge until item was shipped. Now it always comes out of my account as soon as I make purchase. Not sure if it is a charge or hold. Re. BB; I picked up some small items there last Tuesday morning. There were 2 of 8 registers open with about 25 people in line. I knew they would be spending a lot of time trying to sell those buyers extended warranties and sign them up for Rewards Cards or Credit accounts. So I put down what I had and left. You wonder why people shop online?


if it is online or telephone order then initially it is a hold. Your available balance will be reduced by the amount but not showing as a charge yet.

If you see it on an online statement it should show as Pending.

Only when they ship the item do they charge it.

This is also part of the security and risk management strategy. When we authorize an amount we get a code. When we then charge for that amount later we dont put in the card information again, we send the transaction code for the original auth. This means it goes to the same card and also gave the cardholder time to have been notified of the transaction and can call about possible fraud.

Card Not Present transactions, especially over ecommerce have a whole load of things that have to be complied with.

If you ever host a website site that accepts credit cards you must ensure that you are PCI compliant (a set of 12 requirements). You and your hoster are liable otherwise. Though most carts are already PCI compliant if they use the standard processors. For example we do a lot with Quickbooks Merchant Services. They hold the information and they are PCI compliant. So it takes the onus of the website unless that website wants to store information locally - which it should not need to with the QBMS system and others.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> Just called FedEx. They said if it shows up at the distrobution center it will be delivered. They said they are delivering anything that might be a gift, regardess of when it would normally be delivered based on the service level it was shipped using. They are normally closed tomorrow, but are remaining open to get as many packages delivered as possible.
> 
> A possible side effect of the FedEx guy chucking the monitor over the fence?


I saw that clip, they mentioned that the monitor was broken, Wow, what a surprise, Not.

I just got a FedEx ground delivery here and the box was kind of beat up. I didn't worry about since it was just a driveless Rackmount server and it wasn't that beat. Then UPS delivered the drives and extra memory.

The USPS delivered a book in a box that both ends broke out. Fortunately the book was still inside and in good condition.


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## jadebox (Dec 14, 2004)

> ... (plus PCI compliance) ....


You'll probably hate to hear this, but we've switched to using PayPal for our sites to avoid all of that. It's easier to let them worry about it. PayPal, BTW, is an example of a processor that allows you to charge a card before shipping. But, of course, they track your sales and shipping unlike a bank or other processor would.



> As for not being fraud - I would disagree.


Fraud, to be fraud, has to be intentional. I don't think that's the case here.

They may have handled the entire situation badly, but Best Buy didn't set out to purposefully defraud their customers.

If they had planned this, you'd think that they would have done a better job of it. On the other hand, ..... 

I had my own run-in with Best Buy, btw. I purchased a "Black Friday" special online and selected "in-store pickup." Of course, when I went to pick it up, they didn't have it.

-- Roger


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

photostudent said:


> A few years ago I never saw a charge until item was shipped. Now it always comes out of my account as soon as I make purchase. Not sure if it is a charge or hold. Re. BB; I picked up some small items there last Tuesday morning. There were 2 of 8 registers open with about 25 people in line. I knew they would be spending a lot of time trying to sell those buyers extended warranties and sign them up for Rewards Cards or Credit accounts. So I put down what I had and left. You wonder why people shop online?


The One time I went into a Borders Book store they had one register open a a huge line, I put everything back and left and never returned. Now of course there are no Borders bookstores. 
I always had s suspicion it was the manager trying to keep labor costs down and assuming that sales would not suffer. Wrong BTW.



SayWhat? said:


> No BB for me. I've been in their pits twice in 15+ years. Never again.
> 
> First time was many years ago when they opened a store in a new mall in my area. Lots of attitude from their people, very unpleasant experience.
> 
> ...


And at the other extreme there are people that go into a store and no one bothers them so they get ticked off and leave and won't go back because no one came over to them.

Retail is lose lose situation, No matter what you do someone will be unhappy.

I've had customers leave in a huff because I put up the back in 5 minute sign to do something in the backroom that took 1 minute. I could see them try the door and leave.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

If they just canceled back orders they knew they old not fill, then I do not see a problem. Also not converting online orders to store pickup is fine because it is two different fulfillment systems...

But the allegations that they might be selling at full price and filling new orders, while canceling old orders from sales... That sounds like bad mojo.


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

When you see stories like this, you cannot help but wonder if the store is in serious trouble. The only order I had this holiday season was for "buy two games, get one free", or, in my case, three WoW cards for the price of two. This was a in-store pickup, so no problem.

I came close to ordering a nice 32" television for $300 through Best Buy. This was going to be my Christmas present. However, my mom elected to hold off due to some higher priority items. We agreed to hold off until January, and NO sneaking of a television. Now, I wonder if we would have been stuck in limbo had we proceeded.

But, Best Buy stock price hasn't been hit... yet. But an ordering experience would drive people away. I ended up going all my Black Friday ordering through Amazon.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

All of the above is one reason I try very hard to avoid most retail stores between Black Friday and after New Years.


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## zx10guy (Nov 16, 2008)

Best Buy to me is meh....

I hope this incident reigns in the craziness that is Black Friday and the Christmas shopping season. All the cut rate pricing with barely enough stock for a reasonable amount of customers to get it is getting ridiculous.

I'm glad there is a Microcenter nearby me. Their sale prices sometimes aren't the rock bottom cheapest but you at least know you'll get it at at a fair and reasonable price. The only gripe I had with Microcenter was the inability to prepay for an instore only pickup item. Bought my mom a laptop but couldn't do the 18 minute pickup option. So I had to stand in line for a while. But on the other hand, I did an online order for in store pickup of an iPad2 32 GB WiFi for $549 as a Christmas gift for the GF. They had it in stock and the whole process was extremely easy and pleasant. From order to an email telling me I can pick it up was only about 20 minutes. I drove to the store. Got into a special line for the 18 minute pickup orders and was out of there in under 18 minutes. The bonus? Not only was Microcenter's price cheaper than Best Buy's (or any other reputable retailer that had them in stock), I got a $50 off coupon in an email that I used on the iPad2. They honored the coupon without hassles when I paid in the store. So I got the iPad2 32GB for $499. The store manager even came over while I was checking out to shake my hand and thanking me for my purchase.

The other places I purchase from with good prices, fast shipping, and good customer service are: of course Amazon, NewEgg, Provantage, One Call, and B&H Photo to name a few.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

SayWhat? said:


> No BB for me. I've been in their pits twice in 15+ years. Never again.


I never let my personal feelings get in the way of saving MY money. If BB has the best price on something I want, I buy it from them. If someone else has the best price, I buy it there. I don't care if they tell me to F*** Off.


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## puckwithahalo (Sep 3, 2007)

Stewart Vernon said:


> But the allegations that they might be selling at full price and filling new orders, while canceling old orders from sales... That sounds like bad mojo.


I agree, if you can't fill old orders, how are you planning to fill new ones or able to sell in-store. Bad vibes for sure.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

spartanstew said:


> I never let my personal feelings get in the way of saving MY money. If BB has the best price on something I want, I buy it from them. If someone else has the best price, I buy it there. I don't care if they tell me to F*** Off.


Ditto.

Amazon cancelled and/or delayed tons of pre-orders too for the holiday week, yet they didn't get the bad press.

Still...a deal is a deal is a deal as you correctly point out....regardless of where one ends up getting it.


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