# HP Experience



## Dad61 (Sep 26, 2008)

Last Saturday I was working on a project for the Veterans Administration. It was a looped video project about MRSA to play for visitors and was due Monday. I lost this Gov contract because of what transpired. I had been working on it for a week. At the same time I tried to capture a video from my HDD cam and the puter crashed. BIOHD-8 Error. The PC is still under waranty, so I called HP support and they shipped me a new HD and Recovery Discs. They said they shipped it overnight. It arrived on Tues. I had already spoken with the dept head at the VA and he didn't really need the vid until Wed, so he gave me some leeway. I installed the new HD and started recovery
and then realized they sent me Vista Home Premium 32bit. I need 64bit as most of my software runs on that. I called support and they said I ad to pay for shipping. I was not happy about that but paid the extra for over night priority. It arrived the very next day. When I opened the package, I found that they sent me the WRONG discs again. They sent me Vista Ultimate 64bit. As any one who's messed with OEM computers can attest to, you can not use them RD because of "tattooing" of the MOBO by the
manufacturer. On the freaking phone again!! Go through the voice menu repeating yourself a gazzillion times and then repeating yourself and asking for them to repeat due to accents. I recorded the conversation because I KNEW "Mr. Orange and Mr. Red" his supervisor where lying to me. They flat out LIED to me about shipping it over night at THEIR expense. When I checked the email NO TRACKING number and not even shipped yet.:nono2: Now I am furious. So I use google finance to find the phone number of Mark Hurd the CEO. I called and very calmly explained my plight to
Rose, the CEO's assistant. She connected me to the Sr. case manager. I played the recording for her and emailed her a copy of the email proving the lie. She reimbursed the money I spent AND shipped me the correct RD's over night. They just arrived and are correct. FINALLY!! Now for the 8 hr re-install. ------>


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

HP is an awful company.
They build crap and they support it like crap.

I would have abandoned their efforts after the first mistake and installed a bootleg copy to get the project done.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

delta - who would you recommend? Dell is now crap too. G2K is now crap too.

Honestly, who's left that's good?


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

deltafowler said:


> HP is an awful company.
> They build crap and they support it like crap.
> 
> I would have abandoned their efforts after the first mistake and installed a bootleg copy to get the project done.


How can they build crap, when they really don't build computers, desktops at least, they just assemble them. It's not like HP made my video card, that was NVidia, HP didn't make the hard drive that was Maxtor. I can go out and get a Dell with the same components as my HP or close to it, or I can go out and build my own, and the only difference would be the logo on the tower.

I've only need to contact HP support a hand full of times over the past 8 years, once when I had issues with my Compaq Wireless keyboard, which they replaced, once when my monitor had a cluster of dead pixels, which they replaced and once when I forgot and left my iPaq PDA in my car for a week in the winter and it froze up, literally, and that was fixed free of charge. The phone support is generally awful, but after that it's not bad.

HP is the only brand I'd ever use for computing, my 5 year old post merger Compaq Presario is going just as strong as it was the day I got it, my new HP Pavilion that I got six months ago has been trouble free, my 2 iPaq PDAs have been great, and my Wireless G HP Deskjet has been flawless with Vista, had a few minor problems when I was running XP. If I didn't get a new vehicle in the summer, I'd be ordering one of those higher end HDX laptops right now. The only thing I'd never get from HP is a digital camera, I like Sony for them.


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> delta - who would you recommend? Dell is now crap too. G2K is now crap too.
> 
> Honestly, who's left that's good?


Dell is far from crap, especially if you stick with the new Vostro line.
No pre-loaded crapware and rock-solid hardware at a very attractive price.
Heck, you don't even have to get an OS pre-loaded if you don't want it.

Every time I work on a HP or Compaq desktop, but especially laptop, I'm that much more thankful for Dell.

Yes, many components are the same, but how they're put together and supported can make a world of difference.
It's like a building a house.
Regardless of who builds it, the lumber, nails, brick, and mortar can all come from Home Depot or Lowes. But if you think all builders will put them together the same way, then all I can say is go for it.

Dell has made it impractical to build one's own PC's anymore.
I mean, if you want to build your own, then by all means knock yourself out. But you won't build it any better than they do, and it certainly will cost more.

Steve, I admire your brand loyalty, but I can tell you from experience and having dealt with a multitude of users and brands, that you are the exception rather than the rule when it comes to HP/Compaq.


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

Support I could careless about, I'm my own support, and if I don't know what to do, I'm resourceful enough to find out. Unless it's a hardware problem under warranty tech support means nothing. Dell is nothing special, the only thing they ever did right was marketing, which shows.

So what exactly is so bad about HP, other than support? And let me tell you this no Dell monitor can touch the sharpness and richness of HPs new crop of displays. Just looking at them there is no comparison. Even PC World, who is the most pro Dell publication on the planet, so much so it makes me want to puke, who worships the grass Mikie walks on rated the 24" version of my display #1 a few times. Not that their bogus payola awards mean much to me, all that happened was HP finally outbid Dell on some paid off award. 

Maybe all the problems with HPs and Compaq are the cheap ones. From 1995 to present I've owned four computers, the least expensive one was my second Compaq at $2500. My Aunt has a cheap HP from WalMart, in less than a year the PSU died, my neighbor had the same problem with her ~$600 Dell. I have a degree in IT, never had a job in the industry, work in a place where most people didn't even finish high school and get called up on 'fix' broken computers all the time. Name brand makes no difference, 99.9% of all problems I encounter have nothing to do with the name on the box, its stupid users, or their kids installing crap. My Aunts neighbor has an EMachines that runs better than a lot Dells I know of, of course it could be because I advised her to get a machine with Pentium 4 processor, not a Celeron and get a gig of RAM not 256MB.

If Sony offered custom built to order machines, I would have went with a Viao.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

I used to be a Dell fanboy. But they blew it when they offshored all their support to untrained staff.


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## Dad61 (Sep 26, 2008)

Steve Mehs said:


> Support I could careless about, I'm my own support, and if I don't know what to do, I'm resourceful enough to find out. Unless it's a hardware problem under warranty tech support means nothing. Dell is nothing special, the only thing they ever did right was marketing, which shows.
> 
> So what exactly is so bad about HP, other than support? And let me tell you this no Dell monitor can touch the sharpness and richness of HPs new crop of displays. Just looking at them there is no comparison. Even PC World, who is the most pro Dell publication on the planet, so much so it makes me want to puke, who worships the grass Mikie walks on rated the 24" version of my display #1 a few times. Not that their bogus payola awards mean much to me, all that happened was HP finally outbid Dell on some paid off award.
> 
> ...


This is my 8th HP computer, not 1 under $2K, maybe the first 1 or 2, due to inflation factor. I have built several my self, the first one being a commodore64 in 1984, been on the net since. Started buying because of cost associated mostly with software. HP's customer support has gone down the tubes since Mark Hurd took over as CEO. I too do my own support, this was 6 months old and under warranty and was a hardware issue. I believe the crash was caused by the HP/nVidia graphics card issue, I can not say for sure. But the problem is so bad that I read that 30% of HP crash's are caused by this and that it has also caused a lawsuit. So, I say your wrong about them being "all the same", they are not. OEM hardware is not always the same as retail, it may look the same, sometimes even has the same pt number, but it is not. If you don't believe me, try putting a retail MB in an HP computer, the exact same MB, only buy it from some where other than HP and see how far you get. You'll be tossing that MB or the puter. There also is a HUGE difference between OEM software and retail. Software developers, like Cyberlink, have different products for HP and Dell, than it's retail versions. Even OEM drivers are not the same and some hardware won't work properly with non OEM drivers. And the fact that the MB is tatoo'd creates problems with boot leg OS due to bid(build ID) and things like that. I'm also educated, a graduate from the school of hard knocks. Trust me brother, I didn't just fall off the turnip truck, it was a horse drawn turnip wagon.


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

I only use Dell support for warranty issues.
I use chat, not voice. Those Indians have a hard time understanding my Southern drawl.

If you do your own troubleshooting in advance and let them know up front that you are knowledgeable, they'll usually have a part on its way to you in just a few minutes.

I can have a Dell laptop apart and ready to change the motherboard in about ten minutes.
HP and Compaq are a nightmare to take apart, and their hinges are crap.

I've replaced more power supplies on HP and Compaqs than all other brands combined.

HP/Compaqs come pre-loaded with an astounding array of crapware.

I can go to Dell's website and download XP drivers for any model, even those that shipped with Vista installed from the factory.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

Your hard drive failed, you had no local backup, and you're doing computer work for pay? Those things seem pretty incompatible to me.

Why didn't you make recovery discs as soon as you got the computer? The instructions tell you to do so.

I agree that HP made a mistake shipping the wrong version of the OS, but honestly, any fault for you losing your contract was yours. Hard drives die; that's nothing new. With proper backups, you can restore your computer in a couple of hours, tops, and be back up and running.

Also, you can run a retail version of a Microsoft OS on any of those machines with no problem. Sure, you might not be able to run some of the supplied add-on software (Cyberlink), but you could have the computer up and running, and install apps on it.

I understand you're being frustrated, but the only thing HP did wrong is not ship you the correct version of the OS (twice, apparently). Everything else was on you.


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

Had another classic experience with HP support today.
A customer bought a new Touchsmart PC over the holidays -$2,000.
It was giving them problems with crashes and lock-ups right off the bat.
Then it got to the point that it wouldn't boot.

They called me and asked me to take a look at it.
Memory diagnostics failed on the first module, so I popped the cover off and reseated both modules. 
Still failed.
Removed one module and tried again.
Still failed.
Removed the other one and reinstalled the first one - success.
I swapped slots to make sure it was the module. Still worked fine.

Having diagnosed the problem, I initiated a chat with HP support.
I explained the steps taken and the results, indicating that a replacement module was needed.
"You will need to send the computer to an authorized HP service center. The memory modules in the Touchsmart computers are not user serviceable."

Now this is despite the fact that there is even an idiots' guide with pictures and all right there in the manual, showing how to replace memory modules!

I appealed for an override from a supervisor, but got the same answer.
Thanked them for nothing and terminated the chat.

Crucial.com - $28
I'll have it by Wednesday.
Oh yeah, the brand new HP keyboard had a problem with the W key being hard to press as well.
We'll deal with that one without the aid of HP (non) Support as well.


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

By contrast, I just finished with a chat for Dell warranty on a failed HDD.
I gave them my information and explained that I was a technician helping the original customer with the PC.
I outlined the diagnostic steps I had taken and told them that I needed a replacement drive sent to me.
They read through and never questioned my diagnosis and they are sending me a new drive.
The entire process took about 14 minutes.
A sheer pleasure to deal with them!


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

deltaflower - good info - thanks for sharing!


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

Dell truly is easy to deal with, once you get the hang of what they want to know.
I type all of the information into Notepad before connecting with them.
When they come online, I copy & paste everything they need.

She took about ten minutes to read through and repsonded that they would be sending me the drive.

I can't deal with them on the phone, because I can't understand them and they can't understand me, but they are great via chat.


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## sideswipe (Dec 4, 2008)

to both op & anyone else:

buying oem (hp, dell, gateway, etc...) is good for the masses but honestly if you have the know-how & time (few hours), why not just build & do full install yourself? don't get me wrong my pc currently started life 5yrs ago as an hp from walmart, b4 that another hp, i like HP personally but as far as support goes will never rely on them, 1st pc (1999) came with restore disks last HP advised on boot & for like 1st week to burn restore 5disc set (also my aunt's HP after crashed she didnt burn disk but was able to buy for $12 from HP),

Now I personally prefer Hp for accessories have HP keyboard (its solid black  ), currently, just replaced HP camera (kids destoried bought Kodiak due to price), HP printers, no issues. Currently using only the Media Card reader & Moniter from last HP

back to support, had Moniter issues after about 8? months contacted HP in wee hours in morn. tech chat setup rma over internet, they then had to call me to get cc# for security (understand why no dispute from me on this), got rma dead pikels that spread 10x worse than 1st 1, again rma gave cc# wee hours of morn got 2nd monitor now 4+yrs later & still kicking fine. only time had to deal with HP support (didnt agree w/3am phone calls to my house from them but like I said understand why)

FYI after 3.5yrs motherboard crapped out on that pc was socket A xp3000+ amd (last series of this line) had to find new 1 on ebay, about 1year later wife removed power cord "slightly" while pc on caused surge fried power supply, mobo & ram

rebuild new case $30
power supply 350w $20 
motherboard $80
x2 5000+ processor $50
2gb ddr2 800 $22
9500gt vid card $70
this is oct pricing & what rebuilt to 

factor in new hard drive this is under $350 find me an oem @ better specs for this price New not reman or in "outlet" only windows xp pro retail copy bought yrs ago incase something like this happened so no "crapware" either so price vs speed you can't buy new OEM for what can build & yes if your on this forum im pretty sure you can build one from scratch just make sure your grounded


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

As long as Dell is doing stuff like this, I'll never build another PC.

Intel® Pentium® Dual-Core Processor 
Genuine Windows Vista® Business Bonus - 
Windows® XP Professional downgrade preinstalled 
2GB Memory*, 160GB* Hard Drive & DVD Burner 
Dell 20" Widescreen Flat Panel Monitor 
1-Year Next Business Day On-Site Service after 
Remote Diagnosis* 
$429

Offer expires 01/14/09


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## sideswipe (Dec 4, 2008)

delta not bad but still oem, if something fails outside warranty (motherboard or hard drive for example) chances are slim that even if had bootleg copy of windows disk using the key that came with pc would not (especially if motherboard) work, dont get me wrong looks like good deal but yes those parts are low end for that price if you have to factor in os & your budget is that small go for 1 of those, only thing im saying is don't rely on OEM for support (even though we should be able to), can't just blame only HP, you yourself won't call dell but will only chat. Best bet regardless if using OEM or building one, always backup, i use 1 Harddrive for OS/games/apps, 2nd harddrive is where all save data is at. If small & somewhat important will email to myself. If larger will place on backup harddrive.

no I don't work on PC's for a living straight hobby of mine for 10yrs. I do game alas nothing that requires heavy duty spec's right now. but for your dollar if you had to rely on a PC for living (or gaming without crashing) best to do yourself. You know what you have in it, no stray remote invitations (ie remote tech support) you set the PC up you know what & how can do. The great thing is that anyone can build a PC, its as simple as you want it to be & the savings is there. If someone just took a month, review websites, used forums for ? they may have you can build just a non-cluttered work area thats static free can build a great PC for low to high end & the higher the dollar PC you want the more you save. 

the spec's I posted was start since funds get strapped @ end of year (enjoy the kids 2 much to overspend @ that time) but now that holidays over, this pc getting heatsink/fan, faster video card, bigger power supply, more ram, finally going to vista, finally saying goodbye to this 17" monitor. Im going to have total about $800pc that competes w/$1200+ PC's on performance, + every part i get has a minimum 1yr warranty, ram is lifetime, hard drives about 5yrs, 3yrs processor, so my warranties exceed OEM warranties & dont pay extra for them.


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## deltafowler (Aug 28, 2007)

sideswipe said:


> delta not bad but still oem, if something fails outside warranty (motherboard or hard drive for example) chances are slim that even if had bootleg copy of windows disk using the key that came with pc would not (especially if motherboard) work,


I have replaced more than a few Dell motherboards and hard drives, and this has never been an issue. It's simply a matter of knowing your product and arming yourself with the proper wares.
The hard drive I ordered yesterday will not likely come pre-loaded with anything, but I'll have a legal and legitimate copy of Dell XP on it before it goes back to the customer.

And here is another area where Dell beats the pants off of HP.
Drivers.
Enter the Service tag or look it up by model number, and you have immediate access to XP and Vista drivers. Even if the PC shipped with Vista, I can still upgrade it to XP with no problems at all.

Try finding XP drivers for a HP that shipped with Vista.
And don't even get me started on their model numbers. I swear, I think they issue a different model number for every two serial numbers.


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