# Anyone receive an AM21 from ValueElectronics?



## Tiger62 (Mar 18, 2008)

I was told, on the phone, that they would be shipping yesterday, May 6 but I haven't received a confirmation email. Anyone heard from them?


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Tiger62 said:


> I was told, on the phone, that they would be shipping yesterday, May 6 but I haven't received a confirmation email. Anyone heard from them?


I called early last evening with the intention of canceling my pre order as the price from DirecTV is better (free or $50 depending on what you can work out). The woman I spoke with was distant / not overly friendly and claimed mine had been shipped already and that I should have received a confirmation email (which I hadn't). She was speaking with me as though she was distracted with something else (long pauses between words, etc.). She eventually gave me a UPS tracking number, which I checked after I got off the phone and the status was "billing information received". I kind of got the feeling that she quickly generated a tracking number while talking with me to make it difficult for me to cancel the order. I checked the tracking number again today and my AM21's won't be arriving until 5/13 - they're coming from TX and I'm in MA.

I had been considering purchasing a new HDTV from them later this year, but my 2 experiences with them so far really haven't been up to the level I expected after reading all the positive comments about them here and on AVS forums. I bought a HR21p and new slimline dish from them several weeks ago over the phone and got the impression I was inconveniencing them at the time - this wasn't a huge purchase, but also not an annoying $5 purchase either.

When the discussion of a HR21p recall came up on this forum, I felt like I've gotten the runaround from them on the recall status of my unit and still have an unanswered email from Robert on that topic. Robert had said that all of his customers would have their units swapped and we'd all get confirmation by 4/14 - I'm still waiting for my confirmation.


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## diggerg56 (Sep 26, 2007)

Usually if you check the link for Detailed Tracking Info it will tell you the exact time the billing infromation was received. Might be interesting to see if the time corresponded to your phone call.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

diggerg56 said:


> Usually if you check the link for Detailed Tracking Info it will tell you the exact time the billing infromation was received. Might be interesting to see if the time corresponded to your phone call.


Good point - I just checked and the billing information was received at 5:22 PM yesterday. It isn't clear if that time is my local time (ET) or local Texas time, but from what I can figure out it's coming from near Dallas, TX so they would only be 1 hour behind which means that at worst the billing information would have been received at 6:22 PM my local time, about an hour before I called. So it looks like the package was sent out prior to my call. I still would have prefered friendlier service though.


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## longrider (Apr 21, 2007)

Just a note, while my experience with Value Electronics is somewhat dated, I was very satisfied with the service I got. I would recommend them.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

longrider said:


> Just a note, while my experience with Value Electronics is somewhat dated, I was very satisfied with the service I got. I would recommend them.


My experience certainly hasn't been flat-out negative, but it just hasn't been good enough for me to make a 6+ hour round trip in the car to give them a Pioneer Elite plasma sale before exploring other options, though I would consider buying from them again for a mail order purchase as long as their price is competitive (not necessarily the cheapest). Most of my negative reaction is from the seemingly unfriendly interactions with one person on the phone (I'm pretty sure I talked to the same person when I ordered the HR21p and the other night), which may not be representative of how they are in person.


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## Tiger62 (Mar 18, 2008)

greynolds said:


> Most of my negative reaction is from the seemingly unfriendly interactions with one person on the phone (I'm pretty sure I talked to the same person when I ordered the HR21p and the other night), which may not be representative of how they are in person.


I'm pretty sure that I talked to the same woman when I called about expected ship date and you're right, she did seem distracted. Didn't leave me with a good feeling, at all. Maybe Robert can "speak with her".


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## MIAMI1683 (Jul 11, 2007)

greynolds said:


> I called early last evening with the intention of canceling my pre order as the price from DirecTV is better (free or $50 depending on what you can work out). The woman I spoke with was distant / not overly friendly and claimed mine had been shipped already and that I should have received a confirmation email (which I hadn't). She was speaking with me as though she was distracted with something else (long pauses between words, etc.). She eventually gave me a UPS tracking number, which I checked after I got off the phone and the status was "billing information received". I kind of got the feeling that she quickly generated a tracking number while talking with me to make it difficult for me to cancel the order. I checked the tracking number again today and my AM21's won't be arriving until 5/13 - they're coming from TX and I'm in MA.
> 
> I had been considering purchasing a new HDTV from them later this year, but my 2 experiences with them so far really haven't been up to the level I expected after reading all the positive comments about them here and on AVS forums. I bought a HR21p and new slimline dish from them several weeks ago over the phone and got the impression I was inconveniencing them at the time - this wasn't a huge purchase, but also not an annoying $5 purchase either.
> 
> When the discussion of a HR21p recall came up on this forum, I felt like I've gotten the runaround from them on the recall status of my unit and still have an unanswered email from Robert on that topic. Robert had said that all of his customers would have their units swapped and we'd all get confirmation by 4/14 - I'm still waiting for my confirmation.


 Somewhere around here is a thread where I was against the pre-orders from this retailer. $99 but " well drop the price if its lower" I didn't like it then and never would have orderd it. Make them match the price for $50 not $99 or cancell and return it. or refuse it and call you cc company and get your money back. Don't be taken advantage of because it already shipped.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

MIAMI1683 said:


> Somewhere around here is a thread where I was against the pre-orders from this retailer. $99 but " well drop the price if its lower" I didn't like it then and never would have orderd it. Make them match the price for $50 not $99 or cancell and return it. or refuse it and call you cc company and get your money back. Don't be taken advantage of because it already shipped.


The price they charged me was $59, not $99 - not enough to bother returning them (unless I can actually get 2 of them for free from DirecTV). There's certainly no reason at all to get the credit card company involved.


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## Spanky_Partain (Dec 7, 2006)

I ordered mine from ValueElectronics.

Here is my view on the scenario.
I found a place that was offering something I wansted and posted a risk as to when it was going to be shipped. They put a price on the item and I entered into a contract with this company. I have a moral obligation to accept the risk and stick to the order. I will wait until the system arrives and then I will post that I have received the item.

For those who have ordered from them and then canceled, shame on you for that. What if Directv decided to charge $69.99?

O'Well. I will get off my soap box now.


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## Tiger62 (Mar 18, 2008)

MIAMI1683 said:


> Somewhere around here is a thread where I was against the pre-orders from this retailer. $99 but " well drop the price if its lower" I didn't like it then and never would have orderd it. Make them match the price for $50 not $99 or cancell and return it. or refuse it and call you cc company and get your money back. Don't be taken advantage of because it already shipped.


I'm pretty sure the thread to which you're referring pertained to the price at SolidSignal, NOT VE.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Spanky_Partain said:


> I ordered mine from ValueElectronics.
> 
> Here is my view on the scenario.
> I found a place that was offering something I wansted and posted a risk as to when it was going to be shipped. They put a price on the item and I entered into a contract with this company. I have a moral obligation to accept the risk and stick to the order. I will wait until the system arrives and then I will post that I have received the item.
> ...


If you're in Texas, you should probably have yours by the end of this week assuming they're all shipping from Texas and all shipped a few days ago.

As to moral obligations, it goes both ways. Robert promised me something in regards to the recall on the HR21p's and has yet to give me a straight answer on what's going on. This is on a $600 item, not a $59 item.

On a pre-order item that should sell reasonably well on an ongoing basis, I don't feel that cancelling breaks any moral code. At best it moves someone up a waiting list and at worst it leaves VE with some inventory to move that they had already ordered anyway - the site mentions something about the first 200 orders so it seems safe to assume that they purchased / allocated 200 of these before they had any orders so it's not like anyone is leaving them holding the bag on a special order. Once an item has shipped, I do feel it would be morally wrong to, for example, refuse delivery and expect VE to eat the shipping cost.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

While my VE order lost me about $6 on the deal over D*, the bigger negative is the shipping time: D* uses 2-day Fedex and VE uses slo-boat UPS land which can take forever.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Okay folks...never, EVER deal with "Value" Electronics. They are completely full of shyte. I was informed via email that my unit would definitely ship on Tuesday. But I never received an email confirmation. TODAY I got the same a-hole nasty woman that everybody else is getting. She says my unit "may" be going out TOMORROW instead. Now understand, I ordered from them within hours of VE first offering them for sale weeks ago. She says "some" went out Tuesday but she doesn't know if mine did or not. 

She asked for an order number. I informed her again I NEVER GOT AN EMAIL CONFIRMING THE ORDER so how could I give her the order number??? She says "I'll have to call you back."

So now I have no idea when or if my unit is shipping, have no idea by what method it will be shipped, have no idea when or if this nasty and uninformed jerk is ever going to call me back.

NEVER DEAL WITH THESE LYING SCUMBAGS AGAIN. Value Electronics insult and scam their customers. I would rather deal with D*, as bad as they are, than with these creeps. I'm cancelling my order immediately. I recommend that move to anybody else suckered into dealing with them as well.


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## jacmyoung (Sep 9, 2006)

Maruuk said:


> While my VE order lost me about $6 on the deal over D*, the bigger negative is the shipping time: D* uses 2-day Fedex and VE uses slo-boat UPS land which can take forever.


Big companies like DirecTV and Amazon get bulk deals so they can ship two-day and it will cost them the same as ground service for other smaller shippers.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

I got a guy at VE the second time and had to fight with him for 10 minutes just to cancel my order. VE is sooooooooooooooooooo screwed up it ain't funny. I got the classic, "We use a third party distributor and we don't know when it's actually shipping and blah blah blah..."

One more dysfunctional electronics outlet bites the dust.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Maruuk said:


> While my VE order lost me about $6 on the deal over D*, the bigger negative is the shipping time: D* uses 2-day Fedex and VE uses slo-boat UPS land which can take forever.


Though I'm not happy about the slow shipping, it isn't reasonable, IMHO, to expect free shipping to be fast... Also, as jacmyoung mentioned, the big companies have an advantage because they get great deals on shipping that the little guys don't get.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Right. D* is shipping me a free one. And they have 2-day service.


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## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

Honestly this is no different then the people that pre-order a DVD or game on Amazon. They'll get it shipped to them days after they could have just bought it at Walmart or Best Buy on day of release. 

I'll never understand people that pre-order anything. Just makes no sense unless there is a shortage of whatever it is so you want to make sure you get it.


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## Spanky_Partain (Dec 7, 2006)

Maruuk said:


> Okay folks...never, EVER deal with "Value" Electronics. They are completely full of shyte. I was informed via email that my unit would definitely ship on Tuesday. But I never received an email confirmation. TODAY I got the same a-hole nasty woman that everybody else is getting. She says my unit "may" be going out TOMORROW instead. Now understand, I ordered from them within hours of VE first offering them for sale weeks ago. She says "some" went out Tuesday but she doesn't know if mine did or not.
> 
> She asked for an order number. I informed her again I NEVER GOT AN EMAIL CONFIRMING THE ORDER so how could I give her the order number??? She says "I'll have to call you back."
> 
> ...


I received order confirmation email from them when I ordered mine. Today my card was charged so I expect it is on the way. Here is a copy of the email I got.

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 1:29 PM
To: Mark Partain
Subject: ValueElectronics.com Inc. Order Confirmation

Time of Order: 3/25/2008 2:29:21 PM
Order Type: Email
Order ID: XXXXX
1---------------------------------
Product Code :AM21
Product Name : DIRECTV OTA dual tuner
Attributes :
Quantity :1
Unit Price :$59.99
Total Price :$59.99
***********************************
Sub Total :$59.99
Ship Method :UPS-Ground
Shipping :$0.00
Tax State :
Tax :$0.00
Order Total :59.99
***********************************
Bill To Name :Mark Partain
Bill To Company Name :
Bill To E-mail :
Bill To Address1 :
Bill To Address2 :
Bill To City :
Bill To State :TX
Bill To Zip Code :
Bill To Phone :
Bill To Fax :
Ship To Name :Mark Partain
Ship To Company Name :
Ship To Address1 :
Ship To Address2 :
Ship To City :
Ship To State :
Ship To Zip Code :
Ship To Phone :
Ship To Email :
-----------------------------------
Comments : 
-----------------------------------
If you have any questions please contact us at :
ValueElectronics.com Inc.
108 Garth Rd

Scarsdale, NY 10583
Phone : 914-723-3344
Fax : 914-472-6364


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## sbl (Jul 21, 2007)

I feel sorry for Robert and VE - DirecTV violated one of the cardinal rules of manufacturers - never, ever undercut your channel on pricing. It just causes ill will all around.

Robert and VE have been outstanding supporters of the DirecTV (and TiVo) community for many years. Personally, I've had very little dealing with them other than a couple of simple DirecTV receivers some years ago, but I've met Robert at TiVo conventions and believe he wants to do right by the community.

It makes me sad to hear of the ordering issues people are having, not to mention that DirecTV pulled the rug out from under him with pricing.

BTW, my understanding is that DirecTV equipment all ships directly from central distributors and that resellers such as VE don't actually carry stock.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

The only reason I didn't cancel with VE was that on Monday Robert assured me that they would ship my unit on Tuesday. When all that fell apart, they failed to inform me of the change and left me hanging out to dry, no indication of when it WOULD ship. In other words, trying to keep me from canceling by stringing me out with no info. That's not acceptable biz practice.

I fully agree about getting undercut price-wise by D*. Much as I welcome the price break, you're cutting your dist network off at the knees.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

sbl said:


> I feel sorry for Robert and VE - DirecTV violated one of the cardinal rules of manufacturers - never, ever undercut your channel on pricing. It just causes ill will all around.
> 
> Robert and VE have been outstanding supporters of the DirecTV (and TiVo) community for many years. Personally, I've had very little dealing with them other than a couple of simple DirecTV receivers some years ago, but I've met Robert at TiVo conventions and believe he wants to do right by the community.
> 
> It makes me sad to hear of the ordering issues people are having, not to mention that DirecTV pulled the rug out from under him with pricing.


Well there are 2 issues here:

1) DirecTV undercutting their dealers. Yeah, this stinks.

2) How VE is treating some of us. There's no good excuse for not answering my questions regarding the recall status on my HR21p. There's (usually) no good excuse for being grumpy on the phone with a customer.

I agree that Robert / VE have been great supporters of AVS, TivoCommunity, and this forum for quite a long time now and I'm quite honestly surprised at the level of service I've received so far. I'm just glad that I started out with a few small purchases before making a large purchase. I don't think they have any intention of screwing customers out of their hard earned cash, but I'd certainly rather deal with someone for a large purchase (such as a Pioneer Elite plasma display) that I'm more comfortable with. I'm comfortable enough with VE that I'd probably purchase from them again, but I don't see myself driving there (6+ hour round trip) to purchase something where mail order sales aren't allowed.

I was considering the long drive because there aren't many dealers in my area who are as willing to budge on price as the various forum sponsors such as VE. I live in the Boston, MA area and most of the dealers around here are Tweeter and the Best Buy Magnolia stores. The few other options include a store that I'm not very fond of - they made some promises that they couldn't deliver on a while back and I'll most likely pay full MSRP before buying from them again (and they were never overly generous on discounts anyway despite me giving them a LOT of business prior to the problem I had with them).


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## johnp37 (Sep 14, 2006)

Has anyone who ordered from VE received their AM21 yet?


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

Well… I guess I’m going to have to throw in with those recommending against doing any future business with Value Electronics. When the AM21 first became available on DirecTV’s web-site on 4/30. I decided to cancel my pre-order with VE on that day. And of course spoke with the same grumpy woman who dryly instructed me to just send them an e-mail, to which I more than anxiously did after listening to her mean-spiritedness.

But as fate would have it, I checked my bank account this morning and sure enough, there is VE’s debit of my account two days ago on 5/7 for $59.99. And I never received any e-mails confirming either the charge or shipment. Now it is probably in UPS transit so I'm therefroe going to have to refuse it at the door.

Sign... oh well …Its back to dealing with the grumpy woman or possibly another mad one there to try and straighten this mess out.

Though after this, and with all due respect for Robert, I definitely will not be doing any business with VE again. :nono2:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

johnp37 said:


> Has anyone who ordered from VE received their AM21 yet?


Received an email from Robert (after emailing him re: status) on 5/6.."We're shipping today...thanks for your patience"

No shipping confirmation since. Re-emailed today for status.


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## johnp37 (Sep 14, 2006)

I received the exact same e-mail message on 5/6. This is really starting to worry me now. Hello, Robert, are you listening?


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## slharder (Feb 23, 2008)

I placed a 'friendly' phone call to Value today (Friday) morning. Think I talked with Robert. He told me that all outstanding orders had been shipped as of today. All went out on UPS ( I would assume ground).

Sounded like they had received a 'trickle' of boxes over the last couple of days and had just been shipping each out as soon as they got it in.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

slharder said:


> I placed a 'friendly' phone call to Value today (Friday) morning. Think I talked with Robert. He told me that all outstanding orders had been shipped as of today. All went out on UPS ( I would assume ground).
> 
> Sounded like they had received a 'trickle' of boxes over the last couple of days and had just been shipping each out as soon as they got it in.


I doubt that they actually received anything - mine are being shipped from Texas. VE is in NY and I'm in MA so if VE was receiving units at their location, I doubt mine would have been shipped from Texas.


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## glennb (Sep 21, 2006)

I think you all need to chill out a bit.
I can't believe how worked up people get saying stuff like - Value Electronics people are a bunch of lying scumbags, referring to a certain phone rep. at VE as an A-hole.


When a company gets a huge amount of orders for a certain item it takes time to get all the orders processed, shipped, and end up on your doorstep.


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## Montezuma58 (May 24, 2004)

glennb said:


> I think you all need to chill out a bit.
> I can't believe how worked up people get saying stuff like - Value Electronics people are a bunch of lying scumbags, referring to a certain phone rep. at VE as an A-hole.
> 
> 
> When a company gets a huge amount of orders for a certain item it takes time to get all the orders processed, shipped, and end up on your doorstep.


+1 VE said they would ship the first week of May. They shipped the first week of May. Nothing to really complain about. I could of canceled my VE order and went through DirecTV but that seemed like a big hassle just to save $5 and maybe a couple of days.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Montezuma58 said:


> +1 VE said they would ship the first week of May. They shipped the first week of May. Nothing to really complain about.


Did they ship? or did they tell you they shipped (like me)? I have yet to read about anyone getting a tracking number...I sure haven't.


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## johnp37 (Sep 14, 2006)

glennb said:


> I think you all need to chill out a bit.
> I can't believe how worked up people get saying stuff like - Value Electronics people are a bunch of lying scumbags, referring to a certain phone rep. at VE as an A-hole.
> 
> 
> When a company gets a huge amount of orders for a certain item it takes time to get all the orders processed, shipped, and end up on your doorstep.


While I am among those who are rightfully frustrated and annoyed by getting an attitude from a "grumpy" rep at VE I myself made no disparaging remarks concerning this individual. BUT, I do think the person answering the phone reflects upon the business and SHOULD maintain a professional and helpful demeanor. If that person is unable or unwilling to maintain that demeanor she or he is in the wrong line of work.
Am I wrong in this assumption?


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Montezuma58 said:


> +1 VE said they would ship the first week of May. They shipped the first week of May. Nothing to really complain about. I could of canceled my VE order and went through DirecTV but that seemed like a big hassle just to save $5 and maybe a couple of days.


I ordered a pair of AM21's. The price difference is $9.99, so that's about $20 in my case. For those who have been able to get AM21's for free from DirecTV it's more like $59.99 which is more than just a few bucks.



peters4n6 said:


> Did they ship? or did they tell you they shipped (like me)? I have yet to read about anyone getting a tracking number...I sure haven't.


I thought that posts 2 and 4 in the thread make it pretty clear that I got a tracking number from them.



johnp37 said:


> While I am among those who are rightfully frustrated and annoyed by getting an attitude from a "grumpy" rep at VE I myself made no disparaging remarks concerning this individual. BUT, I do think the person answering the phone reflects upon the business and SHOULD maintain a professional and helpful demeanor. If that person is unable or unwilling to maintain that demeanor she or he is in the wrong line of work.
> Am I wrong in this assuption?


Same here.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

greynolds said:


> I thought that posts 2 and 4 in the thread make it pretty clear that I got a tracking number from them.


What was clear was that you had to ask for a tracking number and got one; it was not sent to you. Did you receive your product yet?

I guess my point was that I haven't heard of anyone who had gotten an emailed tracking number upon shipment. My bad.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> What was clear was that you had to ask for a tracking number and got one; it was not sent to you. Did you receive your product yet?


No - according to UPS tracking they should arrive this coming Tuesday.


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## AtlPaul (Mar 29, 2008)

I'll keep this simple.


I pre-ordered.
I expected the price to be about on-par with Directv. As far as I'm concerned it is. $5 difference is nothing. I did not call to cancel because it wasn't worth my time or theirs.
I expected it to be shipped the first week of May. It was. Today I received my shipment information and tracking number.
I contracted with them to provide the unit at the stated time. They did that.
I wasn't going to call them, with ants-in-my-pants, the first day of the first week of May about my order because that would waste my time and theirs and if alot of people do that it will just hold up processing.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

AtlPaul said:


> I'll keep this simple.
> 
> 
> I pre-ordered.
> ...


I love this holier than thou attitude... I wouldn't have called to cancel for a difference in price of $50 versus $59.99. I called because it's possible to get them for FREE from DirecTV. A difference of $50 or so is definitely worth a quick phone call in my book, especially when I'm getting 2 of these. I didn't expect them to be grumpy when they answered the phone (even before they knew why I was calling). Once I knew the order had shipped, I normally wouldn't have inquired about their return policy, but I wasn't happy with how I was being treated on the phone so I did and I'm still debating what to do once they arrive.

Meanwhile, I'm still waiting for a response from Robert regarding the recall status of my HR21p - much more than a $50 purchase (just under $600). I have a few unanswered emails about this. I'd call, but I'd quite frankly rather not speak with the same grumpy woman again.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

peters4n6 said:


> Received an email from Robert (after emailing him re: status) on 5/6.."We're shipping today...thanks for your patience"
> 
> No shipping confirmation since. Re-emailed today for status.


Got UPS tracking# via email today ~ 6 PM EST. That's a relief...then again VE jumped the gun by telling me they were shipping "today"....on May 6. If I hadn't gotten great service from them before, I'd have been more annoyed. Hopefully this is a one-time thing for them.


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## AtlPaul (Mar 29, 2008)

greynolds said:


> I love this holier than thou attitude... I wouldn't have called to cancel for a difference in price of $50 versus $59.99. I called because it's possible to get them for FREE from DirecTV. A difference of $50 or so is definitely worth a quick phone call in my book, especially when I'm getting 2 of these. I didn't expect them to be grumpy when they answered the phone (even before they knew why I was calling). Once I knew the order had shipped, I normally wouldn't have inquired about their return policy, but I wasn't happy with how I was being treated on the phone so I did and I'm still debating what to do once they arrive.
> 
> Meanwhile, I'm still waiting for a response from Robert regarding the recall status of my HR21p - much more than a $50 purchase (just under $600). I have a few unanswered emails about this. I'd call, but I'd quite frankly rather not speak with the same grumpy woman again.


I don't blame you if you feel that they mishandled your order and treated you poorly on the phone. I would be mad too.

I'm sorry you got the impression that I have a holier than thou attitude as perhaps that is related in particular to the "ants-in-the-pants" statement I made. I made that because sometimes I do get ants in the pants. I also understand that $50 is worth it considering the situation.

I was only expressing exactly what occurred and how it related to my expectations.


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## jhs33 (Dec 24, 2006)

I received an e-mail from Value Electronics today with a UPS tracking number. It shows it was shipped from Texas and should be delivered on Tuesday the 13th.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

jhs33 said:


> I received an e-mail from Value Electronics today with a UPS tracking number. It shows it was shipped from Texas and should be delivered on Tuesday the 13th.


I wonder if they're staggering the shipments depending on where each of us lives so they'll all arrive on Tuesday the 13th (at least it isn't a Friday...).


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

AtlPaul said:


> I don't blame you if you feel that they mishandled your order and treated you poorly on the phone. I would be mad too.
> 
> I'm sorry you got the impression that I have a holier than thou attitude as perhaps that is related in particular to the "ants-in-the-pants" statement I made. I made that because sometimes I do get ants in the pants. I also understand that $50 is worth it considering the situation.
> 
> I was only expressing exactly what occurred and how it related to my expectations.


No worries - I guess I'm just grumpy now after dealing with VE. It must be contagious.


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## slharder (Feb 23, 2008)

And I've received email with UPS tracking - mine was shipped from E Syracuse NY.


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## Tiger62 (Mar 18, 2008)

I just emailed VE and received a prompt reply...

"Tracking #'s will be sent tomorrow. All AM21 orders shipped today.

Thanks for your patience"


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Well, I just got off the phone with DirecTV. I'm getting another HR21p shortly (a DBSTalk member arranged a group buy that I decided to take part in), so I figured I'd take a shot at getting a free AM21 for one of the new DVR's that are already on my account. It took a while on the phone, but they're sending me 2 AM21's for free - no shipping, no sales tax, just completely free.

The first level of customer support was nice, but told me that I need to go to a store like Radio Shack to get an antenna :lol:. I nicely explained to him that I don't need an antenna, but rather a tuner to use with the antenna I already have (and was using with my HR10-250's) and made it clear that the item is called "AM21". I don't think he ever figured out what I need, but transfered me to the next level which is probably where I needed to be anyway.

At the next level, I spoke with a really nice woman. She wanted to know if I've got the new 5 LNB dish and it took a few rounds to get the point across that I have a new 5 LNB dish and an antenna and can get ~some~ of my local channels in HD from the dish, but there are a few that I get on the HR10-250 that they don't yet have in HD on the dish. Once she understood, she simply offered the AM21's for free for both of my new receivers that are on my account with no hassle at all. She said I should have them in about 3 business days.

Though somewhat better training of their CSR's would have saved some time on the phone (and obviously resulted in even better customer service), this was perfectly acceptable customer service. Everyone was friendly and wanted to help.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

VE handled the AM21 situation very badly. They deserve to be criticized. They misrepresented shipping dates, failed to contact customers, could not provide actual shipping dates, charged without notice, etc. Now that they've caught up, that doesn't excuse the chaos they caused customers earlier in the week.

I would not deal with them again.


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## Tiger62 (Mar 18, 2008)

I received an email with a tracking number at 11:15 CDT, this morning and UPS tracking indicates that it's "in transit" (from Orlando, FL) for delivery on Tuesday, May 13. I can live with that.


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## AreBee (Jan 17, 2005)

I ordered a HR10-250 from VE back in 2005 and the buying experince was flawless. Good price, timely response with confirmation and tracking info.

Based on that experience I preordered the AM21 on March 26 and had no intention of cancelling when D* started shipping earlier than VE at $10 cheaper. 

Inquired on my order status on May 6 after seeing DBSTalk members receiving info that all were shipping. I received a prompt response that same day stating ALL AM21 orders were shipping today (May 6). I responded thankfully and apologized for all the crap he must have been enduring with the cancelled orders.

On May 8, I emailed asking for a tracking # so I would be able to send a family member to my house to grab the package and keep it out of the torrential rain we had forecast for Thursday and Friday.

As of Sunday May 11, I still have not received a response. I don't know if it shipped, I don't know when it will arrive. I don't have ants in my pants and if it gets here tomorrow or Friday it won't make much of a difference to me, I just want the courtesy of a response.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

It's worth saying that Robert from Value is a member here, so rules against insulting other members are in force. Please be friendly and civil, thanks.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

We had a situation where there was tremendous anticipation and frustration waiting for the AM21, and folks were understandably very intense about making sure they got the unit shipped on the agreed date. They've been missing important shows because of the HR21 bait-and-switch for months and months, and they didn't want to miss any more.

VE got overwhelmed with orders, has an arm's length relationship with their distributor, and had a woman answering the phone who was impolite and frankly had no answers about when the units were shipping, after customers were assured of a date certain.

That's the whole of it. I'd say us customers had every right to be upset. VE knew the AM21 was the Cabbage Patch Dolls of consumer electronics, and should have anticipated the crush and gone out of their way to handle the situation knowing their customers were desperate for the units. They didn't, and the rest is history.

This isn't personal, this is simply about consumer rights and being treated responsibly as a customer by a company you've placed an order with. This was handled very badly by VE. Perhaps in the future they should avoid high-demand, late-arriving hardware with a big pent-up customer base. They don't appear to have the resources to handle a situation like that.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

Maruuk said:


> VE knew the AM21 was the Cabbage Patch Dolls of consumer electronics, and should have anticipated the crush and gone out of their way to handle the situation knowing their customers were desperate for the units.


Exaggerate much?

As a consumer electronics retailer who went out of his way for 30 years to take care of his customers, you're a tough one, Maruuk.

I said it recently in another thread on a different matter, but it bears repeating here: I love it when people, viewing a situation through a microscope, think they are seeing the entire world. "The Cabbage Patch doll of consumer electronics'? Hardly, even in our little corner of the universe. Sales in AM21s wouldn't even account for 0.001% of consumer electronics sales last week. It's too late and I'm tired, or otherwise I'd add another zero or two into that percentage. "Desperate for their units"? No. People in Myanmar are desperate for clean water and food. Tornado victims in Oklahoma and Missouri are desperate for shelter and news on their loved ones. You wanted a TV tuner and, from postings in this thread, it would have taken 10-14 days longer to get it through VE. Desperate? No. Inconvenienced? Yes.

As a retailer, I hated competing against a manufacturer who sold direct. I always lost in that situation. The company holds all the cards. I could never even draw for a pair of deuces. Let's say the situation had been reversed and DirecTV couldn't ship until around now. Suddenly VE saying that they could last week, even without giving you a specific ship confirmation or even by responding with complete silence, would be the hero instead of a goat. It's only because DirecTV took your purchase does VE look so terrible to you. From reading the threads, DirecTV also responded with silence when people wanted shipping confirmations. If the situation had been reversed, and people on this board were posting that VE was filling orders when DirecTV couldn't, you wouldn't be publicly castigating them, even with their inability to give you shipping information. But then, as I said, when competing against the manufacturer, the retailer always loses.

I'm not saying VE handled the situation well. But on a piece that they had zero control of availability, and seemingly little control over its fulfillment and distribution, your hot poker approach is tiresome. Add into the mix the fact that VE was probably making a grand total of $10 on each piece and you wanted them to spend at least that much in servicing you. Once again, I realize a sale is a two way street. You are welcome to take your business elsewhere, Maruuk. If I was Robert at VE, with that knowledge, I'd be doing my happy dance.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Obviously I was referring not to a national craze, but to exactly what Robert himself referred to, a huge pent-up demand inside the D* DVR industry, and I quote: "We received a huge number of orders for this unit, we got overwhelmed, and we're trying to catch up with getting the orders fulfilled. But the distributor, in your case in California, can't confirm shipping dates at this time."

If you want to spin that in some crazy way, be my guest. But those are the facts.

Of course, your radical and biased spin on the matter conveniently leaves out the key factor: customers who were considering whether to cancel their orders since D* was obviously selling them cheaper were given LIES in order to keep their business. And then when the customers demanded to know where their unit was, VE stonewalled them for days.

But of course, that part doesn't help sell your spin. What next, VE couldn't ship because of the sniper fire?

Nobody is disputing the crunch, or the flood of orders. What we're disputing is the right of a company to jerk us around without accurate and timely information if there IS a problem. Instead, we got stonewalled, then told they didn't know for sure when shipping was going to happen. All of which they could have told us on Monday or at the latest Tuesday so we could make an informed choice. Instead, one guy even had his account charged with no permission or confirmation of shipping. These folks were out of control, plain and simple. 

If you choose to defend a nasty foulup by a company that cost exhausted AM21 customers who had been forced to wait (unfairly) for months and months to get OTA HD for yet another week based solely on a company stringing them along, then it's clear where your sympathies lie. Not with the consumer.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

Whoa, dude!

Maruuk, that was great. Thank you. I haven't received such an over the top reply to one of my posts on any board in years.

I'm going to pour myself a scotch and re-read it again, slowly, just for sh*ts and giggles.

I don't have any further response. It's trite, but _I wouldn't know where to start_.


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## Incog-Neato (Apr 21, 2006)

LOL I guess you weren't around when the HR10-250's were first released for $999 a few years back. Not sure if the old thread is still available on TC but it was interesting. Must still be the same woman working there now who was there back then. :eek2:


Maruuk said:


> This was handled very badly by VE. Perhaps in the future they should avoid high-demand, late-arriving hardware with a big pent-up customer base. They don't appear to have the resources to handle a situation like that.


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## glennb (Sep 21, 2006)

Comparing the AM21 to cabbage patch dolls is a great one.

Let's see.. How many people have DIRECTV ? How many of them know what a DVR is ? How many of them have an HDTV and want an HD DVR ? How many of them got an HR21 and don't get their local channels via satellite ? How many of them actually have a clue what an AM21 is ?


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Wow - cabbage patch dolls?? Not even close to the demand - I'm pretty sure we don't have people attacking each other at the checkout lines over AM21's even though it would be a really funny, yet sad, sight.

I have no super urgent need to have the AM21 immediately. I still have an HR10-250 that can get the OTA channels and have a computer with a bunch of OTA HD tuner cards running BeyondTV that handles most of this duty anyway.

I simply called VE to cancel my order and was unhappy with how grumpy the woman was. I'm also unhappy with VE for the lack of response to my inquiries about the recall on the HR21 Pro I bought from them.

Maruuk - you're blowing this completely out of proportion.


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## jimb726 (Jan 9, 2007)

greynolds said:


> Wow - cabbage patch dolls?? Not even close to the demand - I'm pretty sure we don't have people attacking each other at the checkout lines over AM21's even though it would be a really funny, yet sad, sight.
> 
> I have no super urgent need to have the AM21 immediately. I still have an HR10-250 that can get the OTA channels and have a computer with a bunch of OTA HD tuner cards running BeyondTV that handles most of this duty anyway.
> 
> ...


Given some of the responses on this thread, dont you think they would be fighting in the aisles if this item were available in retail locations?


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

jimb726 said:


> Given some of the responses on this thread, dont you think they would be fighting in the aisles if this item were available in retail locations?


That's why I threw in that comment .


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## jimb726 (Jan 9, 2007)

greynolds said:


> That's why I threw in that comment .


For anyone from Northern Ohio or saw the news this past week for Cleveland, we had a similiar situation with our Papa John's franchises selling pizza's for .23 cents because a franchisee in DC had printed Tshirts with the words Crybaby on it in reference to LeBron James. We had stores that had people waiting in line for 5 and 6 hours to save 8 dollars on a pizza. Included in that were arrests and fights, if that isnt a Cabbage Patch Doll moment, I dont know what is.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

My feeling is, this all shall pass. There is a demand for AM21s among us, and the funny thing is, I suspect that once this huge surge is satisfied, there will be ample AM21s after that. I don't want to turn this into an OTA-vs-SAT discussion, but I do want to say that when DIRECTV11 lights up there will be more HD local markets and even though some will still want subchannels most will be satisfied with the sat-delivered selection. 

It's like ATSC/NTSC converters. They will sell all they are going to sell very quickly and very few after that.


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## glennb (Sep 21, 2006)

When DIRECTV turns on more local HD channels I wonder if people that bought the AM21 will be back here saying - DIRECTV is now providing my HD locals and they refuse to buy back my AM21 !!


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## jimb726 (Jan 9, 2007)

glennb said:


> When DIRECTV turns on more local HD channels I wonder if people that bought the AM21 will be back here saying - DIRECTV is now providing my HD locals and they refuse to buy back my AM21 !!


Given that a lot of freebies were given out, I hope that isnt the case.


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## Scarpad (May 22, 2006)

I ordered one from VE, knew the vague ship date, but I've been so busy here of late with the nice weather I did'nt even know DTV shipped, therefore I did'nt worry about anything, just got the email that it shipped and will be here on the 12th. Maybe if I ordered from DTV would've gotton it on the eighth, who cares why do you guys freak at a few days later? I'm sure you all have something else to watch in the meantime.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

AreBee said:


> I ordered a HR10-250 from VE back in 2005 and the buying experince was flawless. Good price, timely response with confirmation and tracking info.
> 
> Based on that experience I preordered the AM21 on March 26 and had no intention of cancelling when D* started shipping earlier than VE at $10 cheaper.
> 
> ...


Same exact boat as you, AreBee. Bought a HR10-250 a couple years back from VE and had exquisite service. Robert is painfully polite and nice and when I saw they were offering AM21 units as pre-orders with free shipping I thought is was the deal of the century (I ordered three). Sadly, at least as far as hard core DBSTalkers are concerned, I will be the last on the block to get them. They shipped from Syracuse to get to me in Tucson by Friday. Again, I too received the "we're shipping today" on May 6. If it were me, upgrading the shipping to 2-day would have made the whole problem go away. I think what is ticking most people off is being strung along. If told the truth about the actual ship date I wouldn't care.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Scar-You're not reading the threads above. I'll tell you exactly why in my case this was not a toaster or some generic appliance coming in the mail. I wasted untold hours trying to get an HR20 to work so I could get HD network television. They sent me 4 dysfunctional refurbished units. Each unit required installation, thorough checking for problems, endless time trying to deal with the problems, then tech support visits in which the guy was coming "sometime between 8 and 3". Repeated 4 times, plus the time to find an HR21 that worked, some didn't.

Then all the rumors and change of shipping dates on the AM21. All the time I'm missing many amazing programs critical to me because my schedule prevents realtime viewing. The VE snafu cost me an extra week's worth of shows I'm losing forever. Maybe you don't, but I care.

It's fine that some folks could care less. But why do you bother to sneer at folks who happen to care a lot? This entire forum is packed with folks who CARE A LOT about their new hardware and when they get it.

There are folks who don't care if they're missing shows due to hardware snafus or shipping screwups, and folks that do. We can all get along. Note, we don't use the word "freak" in reference to you. Please reciprocate.


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## Scarpad (May 22, 2006)

I just received mine and I can't say they did a great job in shipping, it came in the Direct TV box, with no outside container, it was somewhat flopping around in the box and the flap that opens the box was not sealed, it looks like all the parts was there, but it could've easily flopped open and dumped out, looks like they were so rushed to get them out that they shipped them what ever way they were. There was a Direct TV sticker but it was adhered to the box not to the flap sealing it down. A Big thumbs down to VE for the way this thing was handled.


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## Scarpad (May 22, 2006)

Maruuk said:


> Scar-You're not reading the threads above. I'll tell you exactly why in my case this was not a toaster or some generic appliance coming in the mail. I wasted untold hours trying to get an HR20 to work so I could get HD network television. They sent me 4 dysfunctional refurbished units. Each unit required installation, thorough checking for problems, endless time trying to deal with the problems, then tech support visits in which the guy was coming "sometime between 8 and 3". Repeated 4 times, plus the time to find an HR21 that worked, some didn't.
> 
> Then all the rumors and change of shipping dates on the AM21. All the time I'm missing many amazing programs critical to me because my schedule prevents realtime viewing. The VE snafu cost me an extra week's worth of shows I'm losing forever. Maybe you don't, but I care.
> 
> ...


No, what you went thru was understandable your frustration. I have to go home and hope my shoddily shipped AM21 from VE will work, I'm not exactly happy with them either.


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## glennb (Sep 21, 2006)

Maruuk said:


> The VE snafu cost me an extra week's worth of shows I'm losing forever.


They put a lot of these on the network websites, and there's always reruns so you are not really losing the shows forever.


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## Thaedron (Jun 29, 2007)

Maruuk said:


> The VE snafu cost me an extra week's worth of shows I'm losing forever. Maybe you don't, but I care.


Forgive me, I'm not familiar with CA geography, but I looked up your zipcode via the USPS. 95076 is the zip they list for Royal Oaks, CA. There are 3 options for 95076 on DirecTV, two of which have HD locals and SD locals, the last which has only SD locals. Presumably you fall into the SD locals only area.

This has been an interesting thread, and I don't mean to suggest that watching some things in HD is a much better experience than in SD. However, it would seem that if you have a functional HD DVR today that you're not really missing anything, only not able to watch the shows that you want in their full HD glory. Am I missing something?

I'm not going to suggest that VE exhibited stellar customer service in this case, but there seems to be a tremendous amount of angst over a slight delay in the ability to watch the HD version of a show designed to entertain. Granted, in your case the slight delay is tacked onto a long series of events that have prevented you from viewing HD content.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

Scarpad said:


> I just received mine and I can't say they did a great job in shipping, it came in the Direct TV box, with no outside container, it was somewhat flopping around in the box and the flap that opens the box was not sealed, it looks like all the parts was there, but it could've easily flopped open and dumped out, looks like they were so rushed to get them out that they shipped them what ever way they were. There was a Direct TV sticker but it was adhered to the box not to the flap sealing it down. A Big thumbs down to VE for the way this thing was handled.


haha, got mine from directv and it showed up the exact same way. even the directv sticker not adheared and the flap was open:lol:


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

The 2 I ordered from VE arrived about 30 minutes ago. They were inside a slightly larger box with brown paper filling up the extra space. Not exactly a stellar packing job, but typical of what a lot of places do these days. I just finished installing one of them on my first HR21 Pro and it's working fine so far.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

greynolds said:


> The 2 I ordered from VE arrived about 30 minutes ago. They were inside a slightly larger box with brown paper filling up the extra space. Not exactly a stellar packing job, but typical of what a lot of places do these days. I just finished installing one of them on my first HR21 Pro and it's working fine so far.


i bet you cant wait to get that 2nd hr21 pro now


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## AreBee (Jan 17, 2005)

peters4n6 said:


> Same exact boat as you, AreBee. Bought a HR10-250 a couple years back from VE and had exquisite service. Robert is painfully polite and nice and when I saw they were offering AM21 units as pre-orders with free shipping I thought is was the deal of the century (I ordered three). Sadly, at least as far as hard core DBSTalkers are concerned, I will be the last on the block to get them. They shipped from Syracuse to get to me in Tucson by Friday. Again, I too received the "we're shipping today" on May 6. If it were me, upgrading the shipping to 2-day would have made the whole problem go away. I think what is ticking most people off is being strung along. If told the truth about the actual ship date I wouldn't care.


That was a great deal. 5 yr warranty too!

I just found that my card was charged on 5/7 and I still do not have any shipping information. I'm dumbfounded by the whole situation.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

dave29 said:


> i bet you cant wait to get that 2nd hr21 pro now


Is it here yet???


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## glennb (Sep 21, 2006)

jimb726 said:


> Given that a lot of freebies were given out, I hope that isnt the case.


Given the way some people go ballistic here when something doesn't arrive exactly when it's supposed to I'm sure this will be the case.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

No, people go ballistic when companies lie to them about previously agreed upon arrangements, then stonewall them for days with no information about when the product is shipping. 

Nice try at pro-corporate spin, but it ignores the facts of the matter. Let's stick to the facts, not personal attacks against abused customers.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

My 2 free AM21's from DirecTV arrived a short time ago. They were shipped separately rather than putting both into a larger box. These had open flaps on the boxes just like people reported with the VE shipments. As others have suggested, I suspect these are all shipping from pretty much the same warehouse, so the suspect packing jobs probably aren't the fault of VE. Given that I paid nothing for the 2 from DirecTV, I certainly have no complaints - they were ordered this past Friday evening and arrived today.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

As discussed extensively above and elsewhere, the issues concerned only how they handled the launch crisis early last week. In a word, badly.


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## jimb726 (Jan 9, 2007)

Maruuk said:


> As discussed extensively above and elsewhere, the issues concerned only how they handled the launch crisis early last week. In a word, badly.


I dont know about that. It sounds like you had issues with VE, the girl answering the phone at VE, directv, directv's csr people, directv refurbishment department and anyone else who touched an HR2X that happend to get to your house.


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

You would think they would learn. Anyone remember the VE/HR10 launch fiasco?


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Well, it's done and I'm sure Robert has heard these legitimate issues and taken them into consideration. I'm sure under normal non-crunch circumstances things go much better at VE. But like any business that relies on phone communications: make sure no matter what the situation is that whoever deals with customers on the phone is polite, informed and helpful.


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## jhs33 (Dec 24, 2006)

I received my AM21 today from Value Electronics as promised.


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## slharder (Feb 23, 2008)

And I received my AM21 today from VE - one day earlier than promised.


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## johnp37 (Sep 14, 2006)

My AM21 arrived today in perfect condition, exterior packaging undamaged. Thank you Robert, now please have a sit down with your crabby phone person. This does reflect on your business.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

glennb said:


> Given the way some people go ballistic here when something doesn't arrive exactly when it's supposed to I'm sure this will be the case.





Maruuk said:


> No, people go ballistic when companies lie to them about previously agreed upon arrangements, then stonewall them for days with no information about when the product is shipping.


No, _some_ people at least try to go through their lives without going ballistic. In both jimb726's and glennb's posts, there is humor and an implicit dismissal of those who take things too seriously. _Some_ folks, like me, let life's travails roll off of them. _Some_ folks find afronts at every turn. I will admit to being too indifferent, too complacent, when it comes to life hitting me in the stomach. Can I at least get you to admit that sometimes you can be a bit intense?



> Nice try at pro-corporate spin, but it ignores the facts of the matter. Let's stick to the facts, not personal attacks against abused customers.


Jeez, Maruuk, this is not CNN or Fox News. _"corporate spin"?_ Come on. Commenting on how different people are different is chatty gossip, not a political comment.

Relax, Maruuk. Have a drink. It's just a $50 tuner. No bodily injuries were caused by your purchase. The problems here are poor business practices, not love, death or even the failure of _Speed Racer_ at the box office.

Don't get me wrong, Maruuk. Go ahead and complain. Louder, please. That's one of the functions of this board. But a bit less florid writing and some sort of perspective would help the rest of us realize you're just a normal guy, not Keith Olbermann or Bill O'Reilly. I believe that Rush Limbaugh is a DirecTV subscriber. From your writing, at one point I wondered if you were him. On a fanboy board, which, if you cut out all the crap, this board ultimately is, the over the top complaining makes you look the odd man out.

Can I buy you a cup of coffee, Maruuk? You're obviously a very smart guy. I'd love to spend 20 minutes to get to know you.


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## AreBee (Jan 17, 2005)

My AM21 showed up today although I never received any shipping notification or tracking information. Invoice says it shipped on the 9th. No sleep lost on my part, I just would have liked a little communication.


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## sherlock1 (Feb 6, 2006)

johnp37 said:


> Has anyone who ordered from VE received their AM21 yet?


Yes, I got my AM21 from ValueElectronics (5-14) and it works perfectly. Actually sooner than I expected to get it.

sherlock


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## ssmith10pn (Jul 6, 2005)

I was notified by Solid Signal today that my 21 shipped today.
I ordered about 2 months ago.


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## Spanky_Partain (Dec 7, 2006)

I got mine from Value Electronics today. I would recommend/use them again. The box was in good shape and I got what I paid for.

Thanks VE.


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## Bevostein (Feb 2, 2008)

Carl Spock said:


> Can I buy you a cup of coffee, Maruuk?


Please don't buy him coffee. A drink maybe but coffee, no.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

A righteously irate customer defines the business, not the customer. And I'm sure Robert is a very nice man.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Just got my AM21 from VE. After I cancelled the order directly with Robert on Monday. I put it right back on the UPS truck. Hope they didn't charge me. Sigh.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Well they did charge me, but then uncharged me. And today the "woman" was very nice. Not stressed by the crunch of the order pile on. So I guess I'm finally past the VE hassle. And the D* hassle, since they blew the first order but delivered the second time.

I'm thinking longingly back to the day when you could just order something and it would show up when they told you it would. That's going the way of your father's Oldsmobile.


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## greynolds (Aug 19, 2006)

Maruuk said:


> Well they did charge me, but then uncharged me. And today the "woman" was very nice. Not stressed by the crunch of the order pile on. So I guess I'm finally past the VE hassle. And the D* hassle, since they blew the first order but delivered the second time.
> 
> I'm thinking longingly back to the day when you could just order something and it would show up when they told you it would. That's going the way of your father's Oldsmobile.


Well, in my opinion, the AM21's I ordered from VE shipped and showed up when they were promised to. My only problem with them was how unfriendly the woman was on the phone and the lack of response on the HR21 Pro recall situation for the one I purchased from them.


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## mberg300 (May 2, 2008)

I pre-ordered from VE so I could stop worrying about when it would be released, etc. I received my AM-21 yesterday. Concerning VE: I got what I wanted, when they said I would get it. This was a great transaction, will definitely do business with them again. The entertainment provided by all the AM-21 threads was excellent......!!


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

The lady is on her good meds today. Call her up, she's even telling jokes!


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## alanrob (Jul 4, 2007)

VE was excellent in my dealings with them.

Placed the order several months ago and they didn't charge my CC until the unit shipped. Other retailers I've dealt with charge you immediately.

When I emailed requesting a tracking number, they responded within an hour. 

Unit showed up on its scheduled delivery day, and the box was in perfect condition. (Thanks, UPS.)

Fired the unit up and it worked perfectly.

All in all, a pleasant shopping experience. I would have saved $6 by shopping directly with DirecTV, but I found VE much better/easier to deal with.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

So I order from VE months ago, they screw up things and don't ship when they promised. I cancel. They ship anyways and charge me. I send it back. Then they just shipped me another one and charged me again. This is has got to be the most %^&^%$#@ company on the planet, besides D* that is.


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## jimb726 (Jan 9, 2007)

Maruuk said:


> So I order from VE months ago, they screw up things and don't ship when they promised. I cancel. They ship anyways and charge me. I send it back. Then they just shipped me another one and charged me again. This is has got to be the most %^&^%$#@ company on the planet, besides D* that is.


With all of the issues and problems you have with DirecTv why do you still use them. In looking at your posts you have had nothing but bad experiences with them and their CSR's and equipment. I think it might be time to look at another carrier before you have a stroke.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

You guys in the city have no clue. When you live in the country--YOU HAVE NO OPTIONS.

Besides, what in blazes does VE's incompetence and poor customer relations have to do with D*???


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## jimb726 (Jan 9, 2007)

Maruuk said:


> You guys in the city have no clue. When you live in the country--YOU HAVE NO OPTIONS.
> 
> Besides, what in blazes does VE's incompetence and poor customer relations have to do with D*???


It all has to do with D* according to you. In your earlier posts you had stated that you were entitled to and demanded that you be given an AM21 due to an extended period of time that you were having problems with an HR20. I am simply stating that if you are having all of the problems and issues, whether it is D* or VE, I am not sure it is worth it. And for what it is worth I do live in the country, and I have very few alternatives for television, however both DirecTv and Dish are available and if one had me so worked up I would certainly have to try the other.


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## Maruuk (Dec 5, 2007)

Dish is not an alternative to anything. Does that make D* any better? Certainly not.

What we have is like Microsoft: a near monopoly that allows D* to get away with murder.

And the subject is VE. And folks reporting on what their experience has been with this company. I have done that. Sorry you have a problem with the facts of the matter.


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