# Observations of 942 after one week



## SaranWrap (Apr 1, 2005)

After using the DVR 942 for a week now here is a report and initial observations.

The 942 can be summed up as impressive and disappointing both at the same time. I have no doubt that some of the issues I have experienced are user error, or can be quickly resolved in upcoming software releases.

*Nightly Video Loss*

My biggest issue I have experienced so far is that every night after the nightly download the unit will lose video. The audio, menus, etc. are intact, but there is no video until I run a check switch and then wait for it to get guide download. This is obviously annoying and is probably due to the 2 X SW21 legacy switch setup I have. My assumption is that the 942 supports legacy switches.

*Lack of Screen Formmating*

The 942 is hooked up to a DishNetwork 34" HDTV via the DVI input. I have not been able to at this point find in the menu how to shift the screen up and down to correctly center the picture on the TV. With it un-centered in the "super" guide mode the bottom boundary cuts off half of the lowest channel listings. I'm afraid that the problem might be more difficult than just shifting the image up, because at the top the "preview" video is already touching the top boundary of the image. It seems to me that the 942 was designed for flat panel TV's that don't have any overscanning.

*DISHPASS*

I can't tell you how excited I was to finally have NBR after years of setting and moving timers. I find this feature overwhelming and confusing in many aspects. The problem I found was in all the different ways there in setting up a recording. It seems to me that you can do a manual timer, a timer off of a search, one from the guide and of course through DISHPASS. The confusion comes from the fact that it seemed that it always searched the guide and record multiple instances whether you wanted them to record or not. This is very difficult to explain with out long examples, but my issue is that it just to confusing with tuner 1, 2, X's no X's.

*Lack of Multicast Recordings* (-2, -3, etc.)

Another serious issue that left the elaborate record features of the 942 useless is the missing guide info for the multicasted channels. I will share a brief example of this from Utah's DTV channels. KSL broadcasts a SD DTV channel on 5-1 and a HD DTV channel on 5-2. The guide uses the guide info from the local satellite channels and displays it on 5-1. However 5-2 (-3, etc) only shows "digital service". Salt Lake may be unique to have the HD channel on the -2 channel, but this leaves me unable to record KSL in HD without setting up a manual recording. How is this for progress. I noticed that the 921 recently made the same move.  The solution to this is not an easy one, but there needs to be an option to select to use the local PSID info or port what channel gets the local guide info. Better yet, Dish can get the local guide data like services like titantv.com can.

*Overheating*

Shortly after installing th 942 I got a mesage on the screen saying that the 942 was running to hot and needed to be better ventilated. The 942 is in the same spot my 921 lived, on top of my A/V receiver. I propped the 942 up on halved easter eggs that were around and the message went away after 10 min. or so.

I haven't seen any of these issues else where so I thought I would bring them up so DISH can get them resolved.


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## jtallon (Nov 7, 2004)

This is very intersting. So the timer setting is confusing, like it is on the 522 and 921 ? That's one thing I always liked about Tivo - you pick a show, and click record, and it asks if you want the season, or just this show. That's it - no picking which tuner to record on, whether you want a manual timer, etc.

I expected the subchannel problem for the guide given that the 921 has the same problem, but I'm still baffled why EITHER one has that problem. Before I had Dish, I was using literally the cheapest HDTV tuner I could find - a 'US Digital' box purchased at WalMart for $175. And it could pick up the sub-channel guide just fine OTA. So I'm not clean on why the state of the art stuff from Dish can't do this...

Anyway, how has the name based recording done - any chance to see yet whether it has noticed schedule changes, like when Survivor moves from Thursday to Wednesday night ?


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## SaranWrap (Apr 1, 2005)

The name base recording does seem to be working. A show that wasn't on this week shows that it will record next week. But others I have set seem to record pick up every single show. An example of this is the Simpson's. Our local broadcaster ("-2" incidentally) has Simpson's on Sundays and then also everyday a few times a day. So if you set a DISHPASS you record the one you want plus all the other ones unless you manually go through and "X" them out. You 522 users, what is the solution for this?


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

SaranWrap - change your Simpsons timer to a "New" epsiodes timer, rather than a DishPass. That will keep the recording to only Sunday nights. 

More guide data is coming. It's currently much better than the 921 (although that doesn't help you out much right now, I know...). 

The overheating issue - that's why I said that the 942 needs to be installed in a well ventilated area. Directly on top of your stereo receiver is not a well ventilated area. You'd get a lot of heat buildup from the receiver. 

I find the nightly video loss very troubling, and that's not something that I've seen at all. In the morning, turn just your television on. Do you see the Dish logo floating around the screen? 

The overscan issue is one that we complained about early on. On my set, I also have part of the bottom line of guide data cut off. The Dish televisions are horrendous for their overscan, and really need to be adjusted to make it better.


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## SaranWrap (Apr 1, 2005)

Mark Lamutt said:


> SaranWrap - change your Simpsons timer to a "New" epsiodes timer, rather than a DishPass. That will keep the recording to only Sunday nights.
> 
> More guide data is coming. It's currently much better than the 921 (although that doesn't help you out much right now, I know...).
> 
> ...


I didn't explain it very well but you illustrated my confusion. What or why is there a difference between the "New" episodes timer and DishPass? I thought it was DishPass that was the NBR function. Is the "new episode timer" apart of dishpass? My questions would probably be answered if I read through Mark's review or looked at my manual.

Any timeline on the -2 channel guide data fix? They know that it is a problem I assume in some markets?

I will check out the video loss in the morning and let you know. I might also get a new DP LNBF and see if that fixes it too.

Thanks Mark it is great to have you answer my post after all my lurking unregistered.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

SaranWrap said:


> *Overheating*
> Shortly after installing th 942 I got a mesage on the screen saying that the 942 was running to hot and needed to be better ventilated. The 942 is in the same spot my 921 lived, on top of my A/V receiver. I propped the 942 up on halved easter eggs that were around and the message went away after 10 min. or so.
> [/FONT]


So there is no distance from your between your AV and 942? I would look at your A/V receiver manual and check to make sure it does not require space between it and the next component. In the case of mine, it suggests something like 12 inches... A/V reciever can be huge heat producers. I would be very careful on putting anything on top of one. Put your hand on top and see if it feels hot. If it does I would consider a re-arrangement if possible.


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## SaranWrap (Apr 1, 2005)

Yesterday morning I confirmed that after the nightly download that the dishlogo was floating around. And again after turning on the unit there was no video as described above.

Also yesterday I swapped out the SW21 switches and installed a new DP Twin. This morning there was no video loss.

*MYTH: Confirmed*


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## kspeters (Aug 12, 2003)

Mark Lamutt said:


> SaranWrap - change your Simpsons timer to a "New" epsiodes timer, rather than a DishPass. That will keep the recording to only Sunday nights.
> 
> More guide data is coming. It's currently much better than the 921 (although that doesn't help you out much right now, I know...).
> 
> ...


Mark. how does one correct the overscan on the dishnet tv's?


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Sarawrap - yes, if you read my review or the manual, you'd know the difference between DishPass rules and "New" epsiode timers. I talked about it at great length...  To sum up - New timers will record new (episodes from this calendar year) episodes from the selected channel. DishPass rules create timers for the show that you specify across all channels (unless you specifically tell it to search only one channel). Both use name-based recording.

kspeters - you'd have to go into the service menu for that to adjust the lower level geometry settings. But, specifically, I have no idea.


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## krusir (Aug 15, 2005)

How did the system judge it is "New" show? Did the guide data have special mark for it? Or the DVR keep entire calendar year's "info plus description" in hashed format to figure it out?


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## zmark (Apr 18, 2005)

For many new shows, the description has the word "New" at the end. So, I guess the guide data has a field for it (or it jsut looks for the word "New" at the end of the program description).


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## waltinvt (Feb 9, 2004)

kspeters said:


> Mark. how does one correct the overscan on the dishnet tv's?


I can't remember the 2 keys right at the moment but I know it's been posted either here or at one of the other discussion groups. Do a search under RCA TVs since that's what the Dish monitor is.

Anyway, turn the TV off, then press & hold whatever the 2 keys are (maybe "Vol Up" & "Chan Dn") and in about 5 seconds or so the tv will come back on in what's called "service mode", where you can do all kinds of damage to your set if you're not careful. Within the service is a sub menue called "geometry" where you can adjust the screen parameters.

Another thing to consider is that different channels (especially some of the Voom ones) display differently, so you kind of have to find a happy medium with your adjustments.

It also makes a difference which output / inputs you're using on the tv & 942 for HD & SD and what combination of screen formats you use with each. It can be very confusing for SD but if you're like most people and watch some of each, you're going to want to run 2 hookups from your 942 to the TV - one for HD & one for SD.

This works well for me:
For viewing HD:
Use HDMI out of 942 to DVI in on TV
Set TV to use "DVI" input
Format button on Dish remote to "normal". TV won't allow "zoom / stretch" changes from DVI output anyway but you can use the tv's menu to adjust many other settings for this input.

For SD viewing:
Use composite out of 942 to either rear or side composite inputs on tv.
Set TV to appropiate input.
Format button on Dish remote to "stretch" setting.
Zoom setting on tv to "Cinerama".

The 2 inputs on the tv will retain whatever settings you use so all you really have to do is switch tv inputs for HD vs SD viewing.

Hope some of this was helpful


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## kspeters (Aug 12, 2003)

Thanks for that info, I'll give it a try.


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## Bichon (Jun 5, 2003)

One little hint, for anytime you make adjustments on a TV service menu: Keep and pen and paper handy and write down EVERYTHING you do, so that if you aren't happy with the results, you can put them back. I'm not certain if this applies to the RCA, but on many TVs, adjusting picture geometry via the service menu can throw off settings for linearity and convergence. Better safe than sorry.


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## mrschwarz (May 8, 2004)

krusir said:


> How did the system judge it is "New" show? Did the guide data have special mark for it? Or the DVR keep entire calendar year's "info plus description" in hashed format to figure it out?


Dish network's idea of new is an episode that was originally shown in the current calendar year. 'New' is really not an accurate description. More accurately it is 'First shown in the current calendar year'.

If it's a rerun that was originally shown this year, it is still new. If it's a rerun that was originally shown last year, it's not. If it's a rerun that was shown last season in the beginning (like in 2004), it's not new. If it was shown at the end of last season (like in 2005), it is new.


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## Foxbat (Aug 1, 2003)

I had my Battlestar Galactica timer set up to record "New" and it didn't want to record Friday night's episode (either one). However, the Monday night re-broadcast was showing up, but not scheduled since the "event existed in the DVR" Huh? All I could figure was Firday's episode was the 2nd part of a two-parter and I still had Part I in the DVR. I had to edit the timer to include "all edisodes" it it recorded fine.

By the way, this thread needs an edit to its title. It's been quite a few months since the first observations were made, and a lot don't apply any longer...


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

I ran into that Battlestar Galactica glitch on Friday also. Luckily, I checked my scheduled events beforehand. I manually selected record from the guide to reschedule and then checked scheduled events and it still was not there. I paged up to to find it listed as being skipped as a duplicate episode. The info for the episode was not the same as part 1 so I cannot understand why the 942 felt this was a repeat. Also, in the guide, it did not have the red X showing a skipped program.


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## bnewt (Oct 2, 2003)

waltinvt said:


> I can't remember the 2 keys right at the moment but I know it's been posted either here or at one of the other discussion groups. Do a search under RCA TVs since that's what the Dish monitor is.
> 
> Anyway, turn the TV off, then press & hold whatever the 2 keys are (maybe "Vol Up" & "Chan Dn") and in about 5 seconds or so the tv will come back on in what's called "service mode", where you can do all kinds of damage to your set if you're not careful. Within the service is a sub menue called "geometry" where you can adjust the screen parameters.
> 
> ...


When you switch to sd viewing...........what type of picture quality do you receive? I want to upgrade to the 942 & hd when I settle on a hd set, but am scared as to the picture quality of the sd channels on the hd set. I still like to watch AMC, TMC (turner classics) USA, and the other non hd channels. I don't really know anyone personally that has hd, so I can't really look at the quality first hand.


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## waltinvt (Feb 9, 2004)

bnewt said:


> When you switch to sd viewing...........what type of picture quality do you receive? I want to upgrade to the 942 & hd when I settle on a hd set, but am scared as to the picture quality of the sd channels on the hd set. I still like to watch AMC, TMC (turner classics) USA, and the other non hd channels. I don't really know anyone personally that has hd, so I can't really look at the quality first hand.


Bnewt,
My SD viewing with the 942 is great as long as I use the composite connection - every bit as good as it was on my 508 through S-Vid.

SD through the DVI connection is garbage though. Besides not being able to use the TV's screen format choices, the PQ is way too soft and fuzzyish (I just invented that word). Even the RF connection shows better SD than DVI but definitly not as good as composite.

Of course all this is based on my tv which is the Dish 34" widescreen. You'll hear a lot of negative talk about it because it's an RCA but I've had mine over a year and a half and it's been great. It's a CRT, so it's real heavy but for the most part, CRT HDTVs generally give a better SD picture.


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## Jon Spackman (Feb 7, 2005)

Waltintv-

Has you RCA tv been calibrated?
There are often two sets of adjusts in a tv. One for SD (up to 480i) and another for Ed and HD (480p, 720p, 1080i). One of the reasons your tv doesnt look good with the dvi input with SD may be that it is not calibrated very well (assuming you have not calibrated it).

Jon


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## bnewt (Oct 2, 2003)

I understand what you are saying about crts's & RCA. I have a 36" that is 15 years old & gives a great picture. I was wondering about the larger screens, since that is what U will move into with hd.


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## Bichon (Jun 5, 2003)

bnewt said:


> I understand what you are saying about crts's & RCA. I have a 36" that is 15 years old & gives a great picture. I was wondering about the larger screens, since that is what U will move into with hd.


That old TV looks great because you've been looking at it (and others like it) every day for most of your life, and have grown accustomed to its faults. If all you'd ever watched in your lifetime were modern HDTVs, you'd probably find the screen curvature and wide scan line pitch of your old one objectionable, resulting in a viewing experience akin to watching a TV picture projected on the side of a white corduroy balloon. 

I'll agree that those old TVs are sharper when displaying standard definition video -- especially overcompressed standard def video. The line doublers and scan converters in digital TVs (that eliminate that corduroy effect I mentioned above) can really have a tough time with anything less than a pristine source.


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## ALICE_34 (Sep 11, 2005)

*SOMEONE REPLY ON MONDAY///////PLEASE
I have had the 942 for a couple days, I am wondering should I keep it. I called the Dish network people and they say that it will pick up MPEG 4 stuff in the future via it's nightly downloads. I plan to call and check again. Is this true? Also, I have a Samsung 42" widescreen, model # HP4-4262. It is a Plasma/HDTV inside and now we have it hooked up via composite and DVI thanks to othis website. Even hooked up this way, with a sihnal over 100 (we are on a high hill) The picture stinks for SD and I have it on 420p. Is this correct. The blacks look pixeled??? Also I wonder if the stretching hurts the picture quality.*


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

ALICE_34 said:


> *SOMEONE REPLY ON MONDAY///////PLEASE
> I have had the 942 for a couple days, I am wondering should I keep it. I called the Dish network people and they say that it will pick up MPEG 4 stuff in the future via it's nightly downloads. I plan to call and check again. Is this true? Also, I have a Samsung 42" widescreen, model # HP4-4262. It is a Plasma/HDTV inside and now we have it hooked up via composite and DVI thanks to othis website. Even hooked up this way, with a sihnal over 100 (we are on a high hill) The picture stinks for SD and I have it on 420p. Is this correct. The blacks look pixeled??? Also I wonder if the stretching hurts the picture quality.*


*

Try switching your 942 to 720p. The 942 may due a better job upconverting SD than your Samsung. Also, if you have the 942 set for 420p, you are needlessly reducing your HD resolution.*


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## ALICE_34 (Sep 11, 2005)

Thanks, I'll try 720 ...but i heard SD had to be 480p
Is it the receiver or my plasma, because HBO and alot of channels are pixelated and blacks bad....I guess it is the receiver, because dvd's are decent, my resolution on tv is 768 vertical X 1080 but my kenwood progressive dvd player is lower resolution.

ANYONE.....Should i keep the 942 RECEIVER? (I had to lease it from dish net for 250 dollars).
today is the last day i can return it for the 921. I am worried about the new 
mpeg-4 signal and new receiver soon to come out?

i have samsung plasma 
942 receiver
and some sort of dish # unknown...

............................I hope that dvr recorded today


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## Bichon (Jun 5, 2003)

The Dish CSR mislead you, the 942 is not upgradable to MPEG4.

Dish hasn't said anything about what kind of upgrade offers they'll have for 942 owners when the new equipment comes out.


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## bnewt (Oct 2, 2003)

Bichon said:


> That old TV looks great because you've been looking at it (and others like it) every day for most of your life, and have grown accustomed to its faults. If all you'd ever watched in your lifetime were modern HDTVs, you'd probably find the screen curvature and wide scan line pitch of your old one objectionable, resulting in a viewing experience akin to watching a TV picture projected on the side of a white corduroy balloon.
> 
> I'll agree that those old TVs are sharper when displaying standard definition video -- especially overcompressed standard def video. The line doublers and scan converters in digital TVs (that eliminate that corduroy effect I mentioned above) can really have a tough time with anything less than a pristine source.


I agree with you, but is there a "best of both worlds" option. I would like to enjoy the hd picture & sound, but also want to enjoy reruns of older shows and movies that aren't hd yet.


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## kspeters (Aug 12, 2003)

ALICE_34 said:


> Thanks, I'll try 720 ...but i heard SD had to be 480p
> Is it the receiver or my plasma, because HBO and alot of channels are pixelated and blacks bad....I guess it is the receiver, because dvd's are decent, my resolution on tv is 768 vertical X 1080 but my kenwood progressive dvd player is lower resolution.
> 
> ANYONE.....Should i keep the 942 RECEIVER? (I had to lease it from dish net for 250 dollars).
> ...


If your choice is either a 921 or 942 keep the 942. I had both and the 942 is a much better unit in my opinion.


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## rbrittigan (Sep 7, 2005)

SaranWrap said:


> *Nightly Video Loss*
> 
> My biggest issue I have experienced so far is that every night after the nightly download the unit will lose video. The audio, menus, etc. are intact, but there is no video until I run a check switch and then wait for it to get guide download. This is obviously annoying and is probably due to the 2 X SW21 legacy switch setup I have. My assumption is that the 942 supports legacy switches.
> 
> ...


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Alice_34 - the pixellated blacks are a function of the Dish Network compression of the channel, not a function of the 942. You will see this with any Dish receiver. That's the downside of having a nice large display device - the SD channels just don't look great.


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## vivarey (Aug 21, 2005)

SaranWrap said:


> *Lack of Screen Formmating*
> 
> The 942 is hooked up to a DishNetwork 34" HDTV via the DVI input. I have not been able to at this point find in the menu how to shift the screen up and down to correctly center the picture on the TV. With it un-centered in the "super" guide mode the bottom boundary cuts off half of the lowest channel listings. I'm afraid that the problem might be more difficult than just shifting the image up, because at the top the "preview" video is already touching the top boundary of the image. It seems to me that the 942 was designed for flat panel TV's that don't have any overscanning.


I don't believe this has anything to do with flat panel TVs as I have a 37" Sceptre 1080p LCD and I'm losing a couple of inches or so at the bottom as well. This is most noticeable on the guide, but also on certain programming (e.g. on 4:3 letterboxed movies the black bars are shorter on the bottom, text is cut off when presented on the very bottom of the screen, etc). I can take pics if necessary for clarification.


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## lnyoung (Oct 4, 2005)

Let me reiterate how to do the service settings on this monitor. Please note, it is essential you write down the original settings before making changes. Changes made in these menus can make the set unwatchable!!!!

First set up the TV to watch a 1080I program on the 942 that is solid and will not be switching between SD and HD. Then change the mode to guide view.

Turn the monitor off using the power button on the front of the monitor. Then on the front of the monitor push the following buttons in this order (the order is important):

Vol <
Ch down (triangle pointing down)
Power (Sometimes I have had to push the power buttin twice)

The power green light comes on and the monitor then should turn on and should be in the service mode.

Uses the channel buttons to select the Geometry area. Once in the geometry area, adjust the following:

H-position. Moves the picture to the left and right, without changing the size.
H-amplitude. Changes the width of the picture
V-position. Moves the picture up and down, without changing the size.
V-amplitude. Changes the overall height of the picture.

In general you should not need to change any other settings to fix the overscan with the 942.

One final step. You must store these values, or they will only remain in effect until the set is powered off. Push the Ch down button in the geometry area until it appears to go off the bottom of the screen. You will then see the Store option. Select it (MENUOK button) and a checkmark will appear).

Turn the set off. Then turn the set on normally. Your new settings should be in place and the 942 will work excellently with the HD 3400.

You will probably need to do several iterations of this process to get everything perfect, especially with the extented guide information.


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## kspeters (Aug 12, 2003)

Thanks for this info. What exactly do you mean when you say "*Then change the mode to guide view.*"


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## lnyoung (Oct 4, 2005)

On your remote control press the blue 'Guide' button. This brings up the guide display showing what is on each of the channels. This allows you see how much over-scan is occuring and set up the set to show the amount of infotrmation you want to see.

Typically, you want to see all of the guide information, especially the extended guide information available with the 942.


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

lnyoung said:


> ...
> V-position. Moves the picture to the left and right, without changing the size.
> V-amplitude. Changes the width of the picture
> H-position. Moves the picture up and down, without changing the size.
> ...


I am not arguing. In fact I have no knowledge in this area.

Is it possible that you have horizontal and verticle reversed in the above? *V* smacks of relating to *verticle* and *H* smacks of relating to *horizontal*

I only ask so that if you mis-typed that the OP won't do damage.


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## lnyoung (Oct 4, 2005)

SaltiDawg said:


> I am not arguing. In fact I have no knowledge in this area.
> 
> Is it possible that you have horizontal and verticle reversed in the above? *V* smacks of relating to *verticle* and *H* smacks of relating to *horizontal*
> 
> I only ask so that if you mis-typed that the OP won't do damage.


Thanks. You are correct. I have edited my post to correct.


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