# one of two Hoppers won't update



## TxDave (Mar 29, 2006)

I had 2 Hoppers and 3 Joeys installed Friday. The one Hopper has updated guide and software updates each night but the second one says its going to update but it just restarts. So on it I cannot search ( all shows no info) and things like the show logos don't show up on it. I've done the normal things, 
1. Front panel restart
2. unplugged for five minutes
3. pulled smart card out
Software on both Hoppers is S204 NACB
All caused a restart but not any updates. I checked the countrers and only shows updates done while the installer was here.
Does anyone else know another way to force an update or do I need a tech visit.
Also my other Hopper is doing its nightly update at 1:00 instead of 3:00 can this be changed. under updates in menu I only have inactivity standby options.
Thanks for help with this


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## TxDave (Mar 29, 2006)

follow up. there are no diplexers on my lines as in simular post. Anyone have other ideas ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

The nightly update time cannot be changed ... and for some reason mine went from 3am to 1am with S204, asking every hour until I give in.

Check your signals ... make sure all three tuners are showing the same signal level for the same transponder. There may be an issue with the cable between the Hopper and the node. There may also be a problem with the node or with the LNBF that is feeding it.

Unless there is something obvious you can fix calling the tech is a good thing.


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## TxDave (Mar 29, 2006)

Thanks for the info. James,
I'll check all the signal readings tonight and compare them,then check for any obvious problems with the wiring in the daylight. They left the second cable in place that was feeding my 722k. I may try connecting it place of the current wire. If none of this works I guess its time for Dish to come back out.


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## TxDave (Mar 29, 2006)

After four days, last night my second Hopper finally downloaded all the guide info and features that the other Hopper had. I'm still not sure why it took four nights. Now hopefully they will fix it so it goes to the 3am download time as the manuel says , instead of at 1am. Or better yet let us choose a time like on my old 722ks. Anyway thats not a major deal for awhile.
Now that my second Hopper has downloaded I am very happy with the new system. It has been a job learning the different ways of doing things from the 722k. Once you find everything though its pretty easy to operate.


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## Ray [email protected] Network (Dec 28, 2010)

If the Hopper is not in standby or if any timers are set to trigger during the upload, it will not permit the receiver to update. These are normally 2 things that prevent the update. Thanks.



TxDave said:


> After four days, last night my second Hopper finally downloaded all the guide info and features that the other Hopper had. I'm still not sure why it took four nights. Now hopefully they will fix it so it goes to the 3am download time as the manuel says , instead of at 1am. Or better yet let us choose a time like on my old 722ks. Anyway thats not a major deal for awhile.
> Now that my second Hopper has downloaded I am very happy with the new system. It has been a job learning the different ways of doing things from the 722k. Once you find everything though its pretty easy to operate.


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## TxDave (Mar 29, 2006)

RayC , Do you know why the nightly updates are going at 1:00am instead of 3:00 is it a bug or have they changed it since the online manuel. 
Thanks


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## mbolack (Apr 6, 2012)

RayC, maybe you can help me. I haven't been on here long enough yet to be able to do a PM, or I would have done that. But maybe this will help someone else, anyway.
My program guide isn't updating. I am getting really nervous.
I have chatted with some of your people, and talked by land line to one this morning, but nothing they tell me has worked. All really nice people, but just no solutions. Is there no way for you guys to force a program guide download? 
I am now down to just 3 days on my guide, and my timers are going to stop functioning, besides severely limiting me in actual viewing. My hopper software has just updated this morning to 207. I know because when I talked to your tech, she had me check and it was 204 then.
My network connection is fine, and everything else shows good, too, in all the tests they had me run. I even left the hopper unplugged for an hour this morning, at her suggestion, and that didn't make it update the guide, either, when it came back up.
I'm hoping you have a suggestion.
thanks so much!


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Try RBR (Red Button Reboot) method - perhaps forcing do cold reboot (unplug power for 1 minute) could help too.


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## mbolack (Apr 6, 2012)

thanks, but have done both of those multiple times. still only have 3 days of program guide. It must have not updated in days and days. I don't have any timers that run at 1am, so that can't be it, either.


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## Ray [email protected] Network (Dec 28, 2010)

It is set as the default for any nightly updates. All other receivers have the option to change the time the updates occur but this option is not available with the Hopper/Joey since the update can occur at any time during the day when the receivers are idle. Thanks.



TxDave said:


> RayC , Do you know why the nightly updates are going at 1:00am instead of 3:00 is it a bug or have they changed it since the online manuel.
> Thanks


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## Ray [email protected] Network (Dec 28, 2010)

Did any of the agents that you spoke with have you place the Hopper in standby mode, by pressing the power button on the receiver, to turn the receiver off and then have you unplug the receiver from the electrical outlet for 10 seconds to have the receiver reboot? Once the receiver is plugged back into the electrical outlet, it will reboot and acquire satellite signal. Normally after acquiring satellite signal, the Guide is updated. With the other receivers, after running a check switch, it will acquire satellite signal and then download the Guide. Please let me know so I can assist you further. Thanks.



mbolack said:


> RayC, maybe you can help me. I haven't been on here long enough yet to be able to do a PM, or I would have done that. But maybe this will help someone else, anyway.
> My program guide isn't updating. I am getting really nervous.
> I have chatted with some of your people, and talked by land line to one this morning, but nothing they tell me has worked. All really nice people, but just no solutions. Is there no way for you guys to force a program guide download?
> I am now down to just 3 days on my guide, and my timers are going to stop functioning, besides severely limiting me in actual viewing. My hopper software has just updated this morning to 207. I know because when I talked to your tech, she had me check and it was 204 then.
> ...


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## mbolack (Apr 6, 2012)

I just did all of that again... the first time since the newest software version downloaded a couple of hours ago, and the guide finally updated. I had done it a half dozen times with the old software, so maybe it is the 2.07 that fixed this.
thanks!

on another topic, where could we suggest a feature?
I record a couple of tv series, but they are already in reruns, so I have to have it record both new and reruns. But I get a lot of dupes. It would be great if, in the record series section, we had a choice so we could record one of each episode. They all have numbers, after all.
:>))


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## patmurphey (Dec 21, 2006)

mbolack said:


> ...on another topic, where could we suggest a feature?
> I record a couple of tv series, but they are already in reruns, so I have to have it record both new and reruns. But I get a lot of dupes. It would be great if, in the record series section, we had a choice so we could record one of each episode. They all have numbers, after all.
> :>))


What series? All of the "new and reruns" that I am recording show skip on duplicates. Are you recording from the guide or seek and record? I'm using the guide, seek may work differently. There are also some old series where the guide data doesn't properly identify episodes - not Dish's fault for bad guide data.


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## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

Ray [email protected] Network said:


> If the Hopper is not in standby or if any timers are set to trigger during the upload, it will not permit the receiver to update. These are normally 2 things that prevent the update. Thanks.


I read in the Hopper User Guide page 91, Scheduling receiver updates; by default the updates are at 3am. 
(Note) that "this feature does not interfere with any scheduled event timers."
Seemingly because of the multiple tuners, timer events are no longer a issue, and there is no apparent way to change the nightly update time anyway, like you could with previous receivers.
This was of interest to me because I record in the wee hours sometimes.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Ray [email protected] Network said:


> It is set as the default for any nightly updates. All other receivers have the option to change the time the updates occur but this option is not available with the Hopper/Joey since the update can occur at any time during the day when the receivers are idle. Thanks.


We're complaining about the nightly shut down that interrupts TV viewing ... not anything that would occur during the daytime. Many here would much rather the update occur at a different time than 3am or 1am. A time of their own choosing.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

Throwing a thought out there... The Hopper has the PTA feature that, when enabled, uses that 3rd tuner to record a transponder for the big four networks.

I wonder, for receivers with PTA enabled if Dish couldn't also hijack that 3rd tuner at any time during the day and do some other things like downloading VOD and stuff that usually only happens when in standby.

At least maybe this could be an option for users to enable/disable... I grant that the receiver itself often needs a nightly reboot to clear its memory and other housekeeping... but Dish could also use that 3rd tuner to send VOD even when the receiver isn't in standby during the day IF the customer checked a box and allowed it.

Back to topic, though... I am surprised to see that they removed the ability to reschedule that nightly update. On my ViP receivers I changed them to 7am because I find I DVR stuff during the night that I'd rather not be in conflict with that update... and 7am works as a better time than 3am for me.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Stewart Vernon said:


> Back to topic, though... I am surprised to see that they removed the ability to reschedule that nightly update. On my ViP receivers I changed them to 7am because I find I DVR stuff during the night that I'd rather not be in conflict with that update... and 7am works as a better time than 3am for me.


On my 622 a scheduled recording would push the nightly update back, but there would still be one. A skipped update (if one happened to be watching and stopped it) would not be made up.

On the Hopper a skipped update is retried at the beginning of the next hour. This is an improvement (there were times I stopped the update on my 622 and it could have been completed a half hour later). But not being able to set the "first attempt" time is not an improvement.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

James Long said:


> On my 622 a scheduled recording would push the nightly update back, but there would still be one. A skipped update (if one happened to be watching and stopped it) would not be made up.
> 
> On the Hopper a skipped update is retried at the beginning of the next hour. This is an improvement (there were times I stopped the update on my 622 and it could have been completed a half hour later). But not being able to set the "first attempt" time is not an improvement.


Interesting... It has been a while since I intentionally skipped one... and longer than that since I had it scheduled to conflict... although, now that I think about it I think I recorded something from 6-7:30am this week on my 922.. I wonder if it made the update after the end of that timer.

So... sounds like 2 steps forward, 1 step back with the Hopper.


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## gbeenie (May 3, 2012)

James Long said:


> The nightly update time cannot be changed ... and for some reason mine went from 3am to 1am with S204, asking every hour until I give in.


>sigh< Are there any plans in the pipeline to change this? We work nights, and are ALWAYS up at 1AM, and this is driving us nuts. It's literally the only thing I don't like about the Hopper.


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## patmurphey (Dec 21, 2006)

356B said:


> I read in the Hopper User Guide page 91, Scheduling receiver updates; by default the updates are at 3am.
> (Note) that "this feature does not interfere with any scheduled event timers."
> Seemingly because of the multiple tuners, timer events are no longer a issue, and there is no apparent way to change the nightly update time anyway, like you could with previous receivers.
> This was of interest to me because I record in the wee hours sometimes.


Where did you find an official users guide? The only one I've seen is posted on Satelliteguys and Scott clearly said it is unofficial and contains many errors.


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## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

patmurphey said:


> Where did you find an official users guide? The only one I've seen is posted on Satelliteguys and Scott clearly said it is unofficial and contains many errors.


http://www.satelliteguys.us/hopper-zone/280291-hopper-manual.html

Check the date...it was not discredited until nearly a month later. Interestingly it speaks more to a 922 then a Hopper. It is ridiculous in some ways compared to reality....hence your criticism. Never the less my installers found it helpful since they had nothing to go by with the exception of the literature featured with the units, which by the way was limited...their words, not mine.
Sorry for any confusion....:grin: time does march on....
Happy Memorial Day!!pride


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

patmurphey said:


> Where did you find an official users guide?


http://www.mydish.com/support/manuals


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## dunkonu23 (Sep 11, 2006)

I'm starting to really dislike the 1am update thing. I know the work arounds, but my wife's patience is wearing thin. What's the big deal about not letting users choose the update time? 

Scott


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

dunkonu23 said:


> I'm starting to really dislike the 1am update thing. I know the work arounds, but my wife's patience is wearing thin. What's the big deal about not letting users choose the update time?
> 
> Scott


Bugs. Only full reboot can do cleaning them.


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## dunkonu23 (Sep 11, 2006)

P Smith said:


> Bugs. Only full reboot can do cleaning them.


Yeah, I know. Just why must it happen when they have it scheduled? For a machine to have so many great features then to blow it by not allowing folks to schedule their update time is not only short sighted, it's stupid.

Scott


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Perhaps 99.999% of users sleep around that time ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

P Smith said:


> Perhaps 99.999% of users sleep around that time ?


Probably not. The major networks have programming that runs past 1am for their late night programming. 3am when programming is no more than mostly infomercials is closer to the "99.999%". It certainly has less viewers than 1am when new programming is still airing.


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## dunkonu23 (Sep 11, 2006)

P Smith said:


> Perhaps 99.999% of users sleep around that time ?


Ever work from 3pm to 11pm? How about you just want to watch late night TV, be a bit behind, step out for a moment, then come back only to lose your spot because the Hopper has rebooted.. what you lost was the last five minutes of F1 qualifying. When the receiver has restored you've missed seeing your team get the pole.

This is not about a pissing match, it's about a user-friendly feature that can be set in advance so a user doesn't miss whatever they're watching. It can't be that difficult to do. Maybe when the software is more stable, we'll see it but until then, Dish is charging full price for what is essentially a system "in progress". I knew that when I got in, but it's getting hard to explain to my wife, now.

Scott


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I'm indifferent to the time, just try to propose their possible reason. 
As to my point of the whole idea:initially it was a runt about sloppy coding what lead to memory leakage and locking resources, starting from first Linux model - 721; at least they made reboot time adjustable - any time of day and night. 
Strange, in the last model - XiP813's FW it's locked to 1am. Perhaps something new [buggy] feature like PTA required it ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

P Smith said:


> at least they made reboot time adjustable - any time of day and night.


And that is the problem ... I set my 622 for 4:05am because I occasionally was up until after 3am. Losing that feature is not cool.



> Strange, in the last model - XiP813's FW it's locked to 1am. Perhaps something new [buggy] feature like PTA required it ?


Unlikely. The reboot CAN be skipped without exposing any bugs (it will try again each hour, unlike the 622 series). If one has an active recording at 1am the reboot will wait. And PTA still gets it's instructions even if the reboot is skipped.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

The 1am time is look suspiciously close to PTA ending ... 
Perhaps some house choir with PTA recordings require reboot ? Moving records from PTA to user space ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Do I need to say it again?
Skipping the 1am and 2am updates does not affect PTA nor AutoHOP.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Because it will happen next hour ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

AutoHOP markings show up around 1am. I've watched programs from the evening before WITH AutoHOP enabled and without the reboot. The reboot is not needed to make AutoHOP work ... and PTA worked when the reboot time was still at a default 3am.

I've also stayed up all night and skipped the reboot each hour until it stopped asking. The nightly reboot isn't a bad idea ... but it does NOT need to be at 1am. Giving the user the option of picking the time would work.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Should be something reasonable, if it *disabled* using 922 code base.


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