# 921 Upgrade Price for Existing Customers



## erikbenz (Dec 11, 2003)

So I talked to my local dealer yesterday and was told on Feb. 1st the 921 would have an upgrade price for existing customers. According to him he heard this on the dealer chat and it is not yet been released to the public.

Erik


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## jerryyyyy (Jul 19, 2002)

Upgrade from what? If it is a 721 sounds like that will be out of the frying pan into the fire.


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## erikbenz (Dec 11, 2003)

Jerry,

It does not matter from what you are upgrading it only matters that you are a dish customer. The point is the 999 price is over as of Feb. 1st.

Erik


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## jerryyyyy (Jul 19, 2002)

So that means that the price is going up at that point?


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## AkShark (Jul 12, 2002)

jerryyyyy,


Your such a buzz kill! LOL


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

erikbenz said:


> So I talked to my local dealer yesterday and was told on Feb. 1st the 921 would have an upgrade price for existing customers. According to him he heard this on the dealer chat and it is not yet been released to the public.
> 
> Erik


Unfortunately, there was no such existing customer 921 upgrade mentioned on the retailer chat. I have watched the chat several times now to soak in all the new info.

The only 921 "upgrade" mentioned was the $600 new customer upgrade on Free Dish. I truly don't see the rationale in a price decrease in a product whose supply is not keeping up with demand.

Justin
www.checkyes.tv


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## erikbenz (Dec 11, 2003)

Well take your pick either my dealer is a lier or something is going on that he is privy to and we are not. I am not sure which it is but am very frustrated at the lack of reliable info. He said it was in response to existing customer complaints about new customer offers etc.
Erik


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

erikbenz said:


> Well take your pick either my dealer is a lier or something is going on that he is privy to and we are not. I am not sure which it is but am very frustrated at the lack of reliable info. He said it was in response to existing customer complaints about new customer offers etc.
> Erik


I doubt he is purposely fibbing. Who knows, maybe he gets a different chat than standard Echo retailers. There is so much info flying around on the chat (sometimes not even accurate), it would be easy to misunderstand something that was said. You might ask him to re-watch the chat and save the portion where the upgrade was mentioned where you could listen to it. Nothing about this was mentioned in the fax blast that followed the chat either.

It would be nice to see an existing customer upgrade for the 921, but it could also pose a problem. All equipment upgrade promo's require that you go through your original retailer or directly through DISH. Since DISH isn't selling the 921's, you would have to bank on your retailer carrying them. Since DISH only wants to pay the retailer about $25 on equipment upgrade offers (incl. install/swap out), it wouldn't be worth it for most.


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## erikbenz (Dec 11, 2003)

"I truly don't see the rational in a price decrease in a product whose supply is not keeping up with demand."
Mainstreet if this were the case then why is the 811 only 149 bucks to existing subs?

Erik


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

erikbenz said:


> "I truly don't see the rational in a price decrease in a product whose supply is not keeping up with demand."
> Mainstreet if this were the case then why is the 811 only 149 bucks to existing subs?
> 
> Erik


Who knows??? I would assume that the special $149 promo (only available through DISH directly) was cooked up before there was a large shortage of them. The lower price has driven, and in part, directly caused the shortage we have today with the 811. For the record, the published upgrade promo for the 811 is $199, and is available from the original retailer of record. The low price point on the 811 is also because DISH wants to be the HD leader. The way they see doing this is by giving them away to new subs. I guess they weren't expecting the demand. 

I still stand by my prediction that there will be no price reduction in the 921 until the demand subsides.


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## srrobinson2 (Sep 16, 2003)

This is pretty funny--as far as I am concerned, they might as well tell us they are free--since they have no intention of shipping product any time soon--what does it matter?


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## BigMike (Dec 4, 2003)

Mainstreet said:


> Unfortunately, there was no such existing customer 921 upgrade mentioned on the retailer chat. I have watched the chat several times now to soak in all the new info.
> 
> The only 921 "upgrade" mentioned was the $600 new customer upgrade on Free Dish. I truly don't see the rationale in a price decrease in a product whose supply is not keeping up with demand.
> 
> ...


Is it possible that this could be an upgrade from an 811 to a 921? The difference in MSRP on those 2 models is $600. That wouldn't be a price decrease.


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## Cyclone (Jul 1, 2002)

That is 100% of what I think. Its mearly going from a 811 to a 921 (a difference of exactly $600). This applied to the HDTV box sets.


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

The press release from Dish at CES on the 8th says that the HDTV-in-a-box w/ 811 package is available to new or existing customers for $999. It then says that new or existing customers can upgrade that package to the 921 for an additional $600. So, $1599 total for the HDTV and a 921. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find anyone that knows enough about it to order it. I did find ONE retailer (after calling about a dozen) that could do the HDTV w/ 921 offer -- but only for NEW subscribers. He said he had no info yet about doing it for existing subscribers.

I've spoken with several people at Dish -- ranging to CSRs to Advance Support to a "Customer Resolution Specialist." They all said that had no idea since 921s were available through retailers only -- they said to "ask your local retailer." After explaining that I had -- over a dozen of them actually -- they said they just didn't know anything about it. None of them had even heard of the January 8th press release that mentioned it.

I've even emailed the two contacts listed ON the press release -- no response from either.

Very disappointing. Don't announce things if you don't have the info available. Bah.

- John...


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

jgoggan said:


> The press release from Dish at CES on the 8th says that the HDTV-in-a-box w/ 811 package is available to new or existing customers for $999. It then says that new or existing customers can upgrade that package to the 921 for an additional $600. So, $1599 total for the HDTV and a 921. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find anyone that knows enough about it to order it. I did find ONE retailer (after calling about a dozen) that could do the HDTV w/ 921 offer -- but only for NEW subscribers. He said he had no info yet about doing it for existing subscribers.
> 
> I've spoken with several people at Dish -- ranging to CSRs to Advance Support to a "Customer Resolution Specialist." They all said that had no idea since 921s were available through retailers only -- they said to "ask your local retailer." After explaining that I had -- over a dozen of them actually -- they said they just didn't know anything about it. None of them had even heard of the January 8th press release that mentioned it.
> 
> ...


It has been confirmed that the information in that article was incorrect. The price was for NEW customers only. Someone just got their wires crossed, unfortunately. There is no such upgrade promo including the HDTV &/or 921. Dealer cost is well over the $1599 price, and DISH isn't pitching in on existing customers, for now. The dealer cost of the HDTV TV itself IS $999.


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

Mainstreet said:


> It has been confirmed that the information in the information in that article was incorrect.


1. It wasn't an "article" -- it was an official press release from Dish.

2. Confirm WHERE exactly? I can barely find a Dish employee that knows about the press release -- much less one informed enough to call it officially confirmed as incorrect!

Sorry, but without more details than that -- some OFFICIAL writing or correction or SOMETHING somewhere, then I'm still going by the press release...

- John...


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## 928gt (Dec 17, 2003)

> It wasn't an "article" -- it was an official press release from Dish.


Yes it was a Press release, BUT it is being misread !!

Read again carefully :

http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=dish&script=410&layout=-6&item_id=482819

Quote from the Press release :



> The DISH Player-DVR 921 is available now for a $600 upgrade when customers purchase the DISH Network HDTV System.


The key is "WHEN" you purchase the HDTV System (for $999) .

Bottom line , $600 + $999 = $1599


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

928gt said:


> Yes it was a Press release, BUT it is being misread !!
> 
> Read again carefully :


Um, I've read it carefully. I see:

"Offered to new *and existing residential * customers through a special promotion through Jan. 31, 2004, the DISH Network HD System includes a DISH 811 HD satellite TV receiver/decoder and the customer's choice of a 34-inch CRT or a 40-inch rear-projection wide-screen HD monitor, all for only $999." ...and then... "The DISH Player-DVR 921 is available now for a $600 upgrade when customers purchase the DISH Network HDTV System."

So -- it certainly looks like existing customers can buy the HDTV-in-a-box for $999 and then upgrade to the 921 for an additional $600.



> The key is "WHEN" you purchase the HDTV System (for $999) .
> 
> Bottom line , $600 + $999 = $1599


Um, right -- that is what I said. I think you are arguing against someone else -- but quoting me.

I clearly stated above that you couldn't get JUST the 921 for $600. I stand by that -- and you seem to agree.

What I was replying to was someone just stating that the press release itself was incorrect and that even the $1599 HDTV w/ 921 was not available to existing subscribers. THAT is what I was talking about in my reply.

I never said that the 921 was available WITHOUT the HDTV for any discounted price. Someone else suggested it -- and I suggested, like you, that they are incorrect.

Before you tell me to carefully read a Press Release again -- you might want to carefully read this thread. 

- John...


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

jgoggan said:


> 1. It wasn't an "article" -- it was an official press release from Dish.
> 
> 2. Confirm WHERE exactly? I can barely find a Dish employee that knows about the press release -- much less one informed enough to call it officially confirmed as incorrect!
> 
> ...


First off - I am not arguing with you on this point as you suggested 928was. I am just trying to let you know the correct information.

I am assuming that you are referring to this press release: http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=dish&script=410&layout=-6&item_id=482819

There is NO mention of existing customers upgrading to a 921 for $600. That paragraph was referring to new customer promos only. It was not totally clear on that fact though. It mentioned the HDTV package price was available to new and existing customers. I can't find where that is accurate, though.

The press release says that the promo is available through 1/31/04. Today is 1/19/04. If they are going to notify us of any existing customer upgrade promo for either the HDTV package or the 921 receiver, they better get on the ball. Time is running out! The only upgrade currently available to retailers for HDTV equip is the 811 upgrade for the retailer's original customers for $199.

The paragraph you are referring to is probably this one:


> DISH Network has further strengthened its HD product line with the introduction of the first-of-its-kind high definition digital video recorder (DVR). The DISH Player-DVR 921 is available now for a $600 upgrade when customers purchase the DISH Network HDTV System. The DISH Player-DVR 921 features a 250-gigabyte hard drive capable of recording up to 25 hours of high definition video or up to 180 hours of standard definition content, or a combination of both.


Again, note that there is no mention of existing customers. I can see how it could be construed to mean ANY (existing or new) customer could buy the TV and get the $600 price on the 921. That is NOT the case.

Current retailer promos:


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

Mainstreet said:


> First off - I am not arguing with you on this point as you suggested 928was.


Actually, he was arguing about something else -- whether or not the 921 was available by itself for $600 -- which is an entirely different issue and one I've already agreed with him on (that it isn't available).



> I am just trying to let you know the correct information.


I appreciate that -- but when someone suddenly announces that it has been "confirmed" as inaccurate -- but provides no references to any official confirmation to go with it -- then that doesn't usually go over well.



> I am assuming that you are referring to this press release:


Correct.


> There is NO mention of existing customers upgrading to a 921 for $600.


Sure it does. It says that the HDTV in a box deal is available to new or subscribed for $999. Then it goes on to say that customers who purchase the HDTV in a box deal can upgrade to the 921 for $600 more.

So, they indicate that subscribed people CAN get the HDTV in a box deal for $999 -- then later says that "customers" can upgrade that deal to the 921 for $600 more. It stands to reason that they didn't mean JUST new customers could upgrade to the 921 for $600 more since it certainly was not at all stated that way.

It does NOT say that new and subscribed can get the HDTV in a box for $999 and then NEW can upgrade to the 921 for $600 more.



> The press release says that the promo is available through 1/31/04. Today is 1/19/04. If they are going to notify us of any existing customer upgrade promo for either the HDTV package or the 921 receiver, they better get on the ball. Time is running out!


Um, I fully realize that -- which is why I have been trying so hard to find someone that knows anything about it.

Again, I've contacted over a dozen retailers and only ONE even knew about the HDTV in a box deal for NEW customers. Therefore, arguing that it isn't there for current subscribers because there isn't much time left and they haven't gotten the word out really doesn't work -- since it obviously IS available for NEW customers -- and they haven't gotten the word out on that either obviously.



> The only upgrade currently available to retailers for HDTV equip is the 811 upgrade for the retailer's original customers for $199.


That may be the case -- but that isn't what the press release states.



> Again, note that there is no mention of existing customers. I can see how it could be construed to mean ANY (existing or new) customer could buy the TV and get the $600 price on the 921. That is NOT the case.


Well, YOU seem to be saying that existing subscribers can't even get the HDTV in a box w/ 811 for $999 deal! But the press release CLEARLY states that that one is. So, arguing with me about whether or not the upgrade on the HDTV w/ 811 deal also applies to new subscribers based on the wording of the press release doesn't make much sense -- since you don't even seem to think the HDTV/811 deal even applies even though the press release DOES say that. Correct?



> Current retailer promos:


Ok -- so -- I don't see the HDTV-in-a-box w/ 811 deal in there. Even though it seems clear in that Press Release that it IS available to existing subscribers. So -- that is why I am asking what you are trying to argue...

Are you trying to argue that the Press Release is completely wrong and NONE of that applies to new subscribers even though it is clear that at least the HDTV w/ 811 deal does by the wording given? (In which case, please provide a link to where Echostar clarifies the error in that press release.)

Or are you trying to argue that the Press Release is correct -- and just that they don't mean the existings can do the 921 upgrade (as you said above)? In which case, why isn't the HDTV w/ 811 deal listed in your graphic?

Now, don't get me wrong -- the deal certainly might NOT be available. I'm just arguing, right now, that the press release says that it is -- and they MEANT it to say that it is -- even with the 921 upgrade for an extra $600. Dish might not honor that -- but they certainly meant to say it in that wording.

In other words, I won't be surprised at all if that deal is not available to me ever -- but they did announce it.

- John...


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

jgoggan said:


> I appreciate that -- but when someone suddenly announces that it has been "confirmed" as inaccurate -- but provides no references to any official confirmation to go with it -- then that doesn't usually go over well.


The "confirmation" was from the people at the CES booth shortly after the press release was issued. I'm sorry, I didn't get names. I am currently waiting on e-mails from two credible sources in the company. I'll post the replies.


> Sure it does. It says that the HDTV in a box deal is available to new or subscribed for $999.


 That is the part that is incorrect as far as I know. I am awaiting "official" confirmation.


> Then it goes on to say that customers who purchase the HDTV in a box deal can upgrade to the 921 for $600 more.


The word NEW should have been inserted before the word customer. I believe that was the intended meaning.



> So, they indicate that subscribed people CAN get the HDTV in a box deal for $999 -- then later says that "customers" can upgrade that deal to the 921 for $600 more. It stands to reason that they didn't mean JUST new customers could upgrade to the 921 for $600 more since it certainly was not at all stated that way.


I think that is exactly what they meant. Again, I think the "existing" referrence in the HD paragraph was incorrect. - We'll see.



> It does NOT say that new and subscribed can get the HDTV in a box for $999 and then NEW can upgrade to the 921 for $600 more.
> 
> Um, I fully realize that -- which is why I have been trying so hard to find someone that knows anything about it.





> Again, I've contacted over a dozen retailers and only ONE even knew about the HDTV in a box deal for NEW customers. Therefore, arguing that it isn't there for current subscribers because there isn't much time left and they haven't gotten the word out really doesn't work -- since it obviously IS available for NEW customers -- and they haven't gotten the word out on that either obviously.


I can't speak for those other retailers. They may not have an interest in anything but the core standard equipment and "FREE" promos. However; if it was made available and posted to the retailer website as the new customer promo is, *I* would know about it. It's not there.



> Well, YOU seem to be saying that existing subscribers can't even get the HDTV in a box w/ 811 for $999 deal! But the press release CLEARLY states that that one is. So, arguing with me about whether or not the upgrade on the HDTV w/ 811 deal also applies to new subscribers based on the wording of the press release doesn't make much sense -- since you don't even seem to think the HDTV/811 deal even applies even though the press release DOES say that. Correct?


 No, I'm stating that it isn't available base on the fact that I as a retailer can NOT offer it to existing customers. They may be offering the existing customer $999 HDTV deal directly through the 800#, but retailers can't participate. I believe the "and existing" wording in the press release is incorrect.



> Ok -- so -- I don't see the HDTV-in-a-box w/ 811 deal in there. Even though it seems clear in that Press Release that it IS available to existing subscribers. So -- that is why I am asking what you are trying to argue...
> 
> Are you trying to argue that the Press Release is completely wrong and NONE of that applies to new subscribers even though it is clear that at least the HDTV w/ 811 deal does by the wording given? (In which case, please provide a link to where Echostar clarifies the error in that press release.)


 Yes, I'm saying that it doesn't apply to -existing- customers even though it is clear that they worded it that way. Again, someone's wires were crossed. There is no link to click to. It was verbal. Again, I am waiting for a response via e-mail, which I will post.



> Or are you trying to argue that the Press Release is correct -- and just that they don't mean the existings can do the 921 upgrade (as you said above)? In which case, why isn't the HDTV w/ 811 deal listed in your graphic?


 It's incorrect. Neither upgrade is available through retailers.

I will post again once I receive the e-mail(s).

Justin


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

Mainstreet said:


> The "confirmation" was from the people at the CES booth shortly after the press release was issued.


Seems odd that they would release a press release with invalid information and then immediately state that it was incorrect -- without ever correcting the release or, if that is impossible, immediately releasing a correction. But, I agree it could happen.



> I am currently waiting on e-mails from two credible sources in the company. I'll post the replies.


Same here -- and have been waiting for over a week now. I'll do the same -- if anyone ever replies to my emails or voicemails.



> That is the part that is incorrect as far as I know. I am awaiting "official" confirmation.


...


> The word NEW should have been inserted before the word customer. I believe that was the intended meaning.


Actually, if the first part above is incorrect as you suggested -- then they wouldn't have needed "new" inserted -- since the entire deal would be for "new" subscribers only...



> No, I'm stating that it isn't available base on the fact that I as a retailer can NOT offer it to existing customers. They may be offering the existing customer $999 HDTV deal directly through the 800#, but retailers can't participate. I believe the "and existing" wording in the press release is incorrect.


Indeed -- certainly could be the case -- but isn't what they announced. They really fouled up that Press Release then...



> I will post again once I receive the e-mail(s).


Agreed -- will do also.

I'm currently planning to start complaining to CEO some more -- they announced it as available -- I'll argue that I should get it even if it was a mistake. It's certainly worked in the past when Charlie mispoke...  I've got two 811s to prove that. 

- John...


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## jerryyyyy (Jul 19, 2002)

Boy, am I glad this has been all cleared up.


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

The only way to clear it up would be if Dish actually took some action. Fairly unlikely -- based on past experience. It's sad to have a press release that is either completely wrong or completely unsupported by any documentation to the retailers.

- John...


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## laker (Dec 19, 2003)

I also had problems with CSRs on this press release. Some were not able to find the 'press release' section on their screens. I was finally transferred to the 'executive office' where they were able to locate it. The press release was pasted into my account and I was told that the offer would be honored - most likely the expiration date will be extended. I was told the offer was valid for existing customers who were 'upgrading' to a 921 - ie - $1599 (delivery, installation, the whole deal). I still get conflicting info from various CSRs on details. The last one I spoke to said new switches ( I currently have two SW21s) will be included in the price. The bottom line is I've become cynical of every statement from Echostar - press release, Charlie Chat, Technical Chat etc. They've been flip-flopping on everything.


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

Interesting. I've noticed that getting them to past the info into your account does seem to work. I had the same thing done with an 811 that I wanted to remove from my account -- and there was, at first, some confusion about whether or not it was under a contract. Once determined that it was not, according to the "higher ups", they pasted that as a note in my account.

So -- maye now I should try some more phone calls and see if I can get a similar note pasted for the HDTV w/ 921 for $1599 deal...

- John...


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

laker said:


> I also had problems with CSRs on this press release. Some were not able to find the 'press release' section on their screens. I was finally transferred to the 'executive office' where they were able to locate it. The press release was pasted into my account and I was told that the offer would be honored - most likely the expiration date will be extended. I was told the offer was valid for existing customers who were 'upgrading' to a 921 - ie - $1599 (delivery, installation, the whole deal). I still get conflicting info from various CSRs on details. The last one I spoke to said new switches ( I currently have two SW21s) will be included in the price. The bottom line is I've become cynical of every statement from Echostar - press release, Charlie Chat, Technical Chat etc. They've been flip-flopping on everything.


I wonder how they are going to do that since they are not selling the 921's directly. Maybe they are going to start?


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

Well -- I finally have an update! I made a LOT of calls to various people at Dish today -- and finally got to actually talk to a few people that could check on things -- and even got a good email response today.

I spoke with Marc Lumpkin and Steve Caulk today -- note that they are the two people listed as the contacts for that Press Release. I first spoke with Steve and asked about an existing customer getting the HDTV w/ 921 for $1599 as the press release appeared to indicate. He said that he thought that was correct, but deferred to Marc to be sure.

Later that day, I finally got a hold of Marc. He told me, at first, that he thought the $600 921 upgrade might be intended for new customers only. He said that, for existing subscribers, the price was $1999 for the HDTV w/ 921. I asked if existings could do the HDTV w/ 811 for $999 -- and he said that they could. I then asked how $1999 could be a "deal" for the HDTV w/ 921 -- since anyone could just do the $999 HDTV w/ 811 deal and then BUY the 921 for $999 more. In other words, their $1999 deal made no sense -- since a better deal, for a dollar cheaper, would be to take the $999 HDTV w/ 811 and then buy a 921 -- you'd get the 811 for free. He agreed that would be a better way to do it -- but still stuck to the $1999 statement.

After some more discussion -- and pointing out that the press release certainly does seem to imply that $600 upgrade was for anyone buying the $999 package -- not just the new subscribers, he said that he would check into it some more. He said that he thought that there might be plans in February for some deal of the HDTV w/ the 921 for subscribers besides the $1999 price. Possibly even the $1599 that the new customers can get -- but he wasn't positive. He said he would email or call me when he had more information.

Well, he kept to his word! A few hours later he emailed me and stated that DISH Network retailers "are expected to be able to process" the HDTV-in-a-box deal WITH the 921 for *existing customers for $1,599* starting in 1-2 weeks from now! He said that there would be some commitment required, but did not detail it. I would assume it is the year of HDPak and at least AT-60, of course.

He then thanked me for my patience and that was it!

So -- it looks like a little persistence has paid off! According to what they are telling me, I should be able to buy the HDTV w/ 921 for $1599 very soon! We'll see how it goes!

*Mainstreet* -- can you watch and let us know as soon as something pops up for retailers to be able to have customers order that? Thanks much!

- John...

P.S. On a side note, Marc confirmed what we have been saying all along to those that asked early on in this thread: The 921 absolutely will NOT be available by itself for $600 to anyone. The $600 is the price to change the 811 in the HDTV package to a 921 -- and that is the only option.


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

I will ABSOLUTELY keep my eyes peeled on this one. I will keep you posted. One thing is almost absolute - the current upgrade promos are only good for retailers' originally installed customers. We will see if this one is the same. I don't know what will happen for those who originally purchased from DISH since they - as far as I know - aren't selling the 921's direct. Otherwise, you will just have to hope that your original retailer participates.

(that all has to do with commissions and chargebacks)

Like I said, I will update everyone when more info is available.

Justin


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## JohnMI (Apr 2, 2002)

Indeed -- the "original retailer" thing is a problem for me -- because I ordered over the Net and did a self-install originally. Shipping on the HDTV would not be pretty if he wasn't able to ship it directly to me... Hmmm...

In any case, thanks for watching for us.

- John...


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## Mainstreet (Jun 29, 2002)

This is the only reply I have received:



> From: "Retail Services"
> To: "'[email protected]'" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: Upgrade for existing customers
> Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 12:08:08 -0700
> ...


Hmmm. They didn't even sign off with their name. We'll see if anything changes on Tuesday's Retailer Chat.

I'll keep you posted.


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