# VIP722 replacement for audio problems



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

My system consists of: Sony tv - kdl-40v5100, Sony blu ray player, VIP722, and Onkyo Ht-s5200 home theater. HDMI from the vip722 to the tv with optical cable to onkyo for audio, HDMI from the blu ray to tv with optical for the audio. 
My problem: audio drops. If I run the audio through the tv direct from the vip722 the audio would have glitches, through the Onkyo the audio would actually drop for a second then come back. This audio problem was not network specific. This was not a problem with my tv. This was not a problem with my Onkyo. The problem is / was with my VIP722. I had to get three different VIP722 to get a good one. Now my audio seems fine so far. If that changes I will let you know. Wanted to let you all know that dish will send out these reconditioned VIP722's and it may take a while to get a good one so be persistant with dish. I had two older VIP722's, the ones with OTA antenna connection, this newer VIP722 does not have the OTA antenna connection. Is that the VIP722K then? Anyway, if you have the same problem, don't give up. Keep on dish network to get you a good receiver/dvr! It took me 2 months of hell to get my problem resolved..


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Here is my update for my original post.....
OK, after having my third receiver for a few days now, I am getting audio drops still, but here is the deal. The audio drops occur with the following settings on my Dobly Digital setting through the Dish Network menu. I have the DD setting to Dolby Digital/PCM and line mode. This setting I have audio drops that occur very seldom but there nonetheless. This is my preferred setting, as I like Dolby Digital over PCM. I do not experience any audio drops when it is set on PCM only and line mode. To me it seems like the dish box needs a software update to process the Dobly Digital the way it is supposed to. Taking into consideration my connection set up mentioned in my original post. Does anyone have any suggestions? Is it my receiver with the problems? I think it is.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

let me see if I understand this.

You have audio going 722->TV->to Receiver. Not sure what TV you have but a lot of TVs don't do DD pass through. 

What I would do for an experiment is to go directly to your receiver and see if the Audio issue goes away. I suspect it will if I am reading this correctly. If I am not and you are going directly Onkyo perhaps someone with your model will pipe in. 

There are a lot of people doing DD with the 722 through both HDMI and optical with very good success. 

If your set up is as above, i suspect someone along they way is messed up and I would look to all components to see if there are any software updates you might try to remedy the situation.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

One other point. If you are doing a passthrough, you might want to check out AVSForums for your TV model. I did a quick google around this and there seems to be some discussion around this topic. I don't have time to read them, but figure it might provide some clues.


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Let me clarify my step up.
Hdmi from the vip722 to the tv, the optical is from the vip722 directly to the onkyo. Hdmi from the blu ray to the tv. optical directly from the blu ray to the onkyo. Any input is appreciated....Thanks....


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Thanks for the clarification.. Wanted to make sure. If there is no OTA then it would be a 722K. So to summarize.

1) You have had two 722s and one 722K
2) All three have shown the same issue. 

Here are my comments.

I totally agree that it can't be the TV since it is optical from the 722 to the receiver. This leaves the following possibilities.

1) Bad Optical cable. (Swap out should verify this is not the case)
2) Incompatibility between Dish and the Onkyo. 
3) Bug in the Onkyo
4) Bug in the Dish receiver.

I know you are leaning towards #4 based on your post above, but just as there are a ton of people using Onkyo with DD there are a ton of Dish subs using Optical 722 with DD. I fall into that category and I my experience has been pretty flawless over the last 2+ years I have had my 722. I personally suspect something possibly external is at work.

If you have not tried the cable, give it a try as it is something that has not changed. Also, I am sure you verified that your Onkyo firmware is up to date if it is upgradable. 

You did mention the 722K took awhile for the issue to surface which would tend to point away from software. How about heat? What is your environment like? Enclosed cabinet? Clean power? Did your 722s immediately show the issue or did it take time to develop? 

Since you indicate not content related, Do you have this issue happening on both local channel content and national channels?

Also, Anyone out there have this receiver with a 722/622/722K if so, same experience?


----------



## JR_Baas (May 5, 2005)

A friend of mine has an Onkyo receiver with AT&T Uverse that is experiencing the same problems. As a test, can you run the video on component, removing the HDMI cable? That seemed to clear up his audio problems.


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Thanks Ron and J.R. for your suggestions.

Ron - I tried two brand new optical cables with no change. Tried new hdmi cables.

This problem is not network specific, I have seen it happen on all sorts of channels, locals, hbo, starz, etc...

This only happens when I set the dish box to run DD/PCM as I prefer DD. Setting it on PCM only seems to eleviate the problem. But I do not like the PCM setting and prefer DD.

J.R. - That is interesting that removing the hdmi cable from the SAT REC to the TV and use component video would clear up the audio problem since the audio is being pushed thru an optical cable. But I do believe you in saying it cleared up the problem. I wonder if his problem is with Dolby and I wonder if his AT&T Uverse has a similiar dd/pcm setting. But it's sounding more like it could be the hdmi cable(between vip722 and tv) interfering with the audio that runs through the optical cable?? Is that what you are saying J.R.? But regardless, I am willing to try using component video cables from vip722 to tv and keep the optical as is from the vip722 to onkyo. If that solves the audio problem, then hdmi compatibility would be the problem, right? So is it the TV's fault or the SAT REC's fault, because if it's my Sony I can get a new one as it is under a 5 year warranty, this tv is only a few months old. Why would hdmi affect audio on the optical? Stranger things have happened I guess...But another point is that I have audio glitches through the hdmi cable to the tv, but to the onkyo thru the optical the audio actually drops for a second then comes back? HDMI the problem for both??

My onkyo is new and I called about the firmware and it is up to date, so they say....

The probem has always been intermittant on all three vip722 boxes. 

What do you guys think.....Ron, JR?


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

just for completeness. The DD/PCM setting means that you get DD when available and PCM when not. Using just PCM would definitely be a step down so I would suggest keeping trying to figure it out.

One thing you might try is to disable the sound on the HDMI If that is possible from the TV. Not sure if it is, but something worth taking a look at. Hmmm.. 

Given you had swapped optical twice, I think that rules out cable. 

On the HDMI causing the problem. Like I said earlier DD does not go well into some TVs and I have had issues with my LCDs when having it set to DD so perhaps that might be causing the issues as JR indicated. See if your TV allows you to turn off the sound through HDMI. 

Also, you did not give any indication that heat might be at play. Is the receiver out in an open cabinet?


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Ron- 

My vip722 is in an open back cabinet with plenty of air, also the front glass closure is not air tight by any means....

I did not see anything on the tv to turn off the sound through HDMI.

I did find Bravia sync control for hdmi setting that was set to on, I just turned that off. That setting is to control other sony equipment connected via hdmi, so I do not need that on, not sure if that would affect the audio, but so far today I have not heard any audio drops through the onkyo. But have only had the tv on a few mintues.. 

Thanks for all of your input. If I get it totally figured out or have new info, I will update my post again.. 

Thank you....

brad


----------



## JR_Baas (May 5, 2005)

nikeboiz said:


> J.R. - That is interesting that removing the hdmi cable from the SAT REC to the TV and use component video would clear up the audio problem since the audio is being pushed thru an optical cable. But I do believe you in saying it cleared up the problem. I wonder if his problem is with Dolby and I wonder if his AT&T Uverse has a similiar dd/pcm setting. But it's sounding more like it could be the hdmi cable(between vip722 and tv) interfering with the audio that runs through the optical cable?? Is that what you are saying J.R.? But regardless, I am willing to try using component video cables from vip722 to tv and keep the optical as is from the vip722 to onkyo. If that solves the audio problem, then hdmi compatibility would be the problem, right? So is it the TV's fault or the SAT REC's fault, because if it's my Sony I can get a new one as it is under a 5 year warranty, this tv is only a few months old. Why would hdmi affect audio on the optical? Stranger things have happened I guess...But another point is that I have audio glitches through the hdmi cable to the tv, but to the onkyo thru the optical the audio actually drops for a second then comes back? HDMI the problem for both??


My friend has a TV that only allows PCM input, not DD. I think what was happening is that the TV was complaining about the DD back to the AT&T box. You would periodically see a message on the TV that said audio format not compatible.


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

still having audio problems. i believe it is the tv after all. working to get it swapped out using my expensive extended warranty!! will keep you posted....


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

I am having my Sony tv swapped out today for a brand new LN40B650 Samsung. I found info on Sony's own web site that states audio problems on the model kdl40v5100 as well as other models. The swap is covered under my warranty at no cost to me. Plus my five year warranty transfers to the Samsung.(purchased the 5 yr) I found a few online posts of people who have had audio problems and getting rid of the Sony TV corrected the problem. So I am hoping that with the swap, my audio drops will go away. The drops do not happen as much as they used to, but there nonetheless. So, this morning I also had electricians run a new dedicated circuit (20 amp line) to my entertainment center with 6 plug ins. So everything will have it's own power socket!! So to date I have had three vip722's, new hdmi/optical cables, new coax from the satelllite to inside the house, This morning new 20 amp dedicated circuit with 6 plugs ins, different set up configs and settings and still have audio drops. Now, after lunch, my new Samsung will arrive to replace the Sony, if audio clears up then it was my Sony tv, if it does not clear up then my next thing to do is replace my Home theater system(Onkyo), if that does not work, then back to Dish Network. I am hoping after my new tv gets in place all will be fine. I will let you know.....
Here is the link that Sony.com admits to problems with audio that a software update will fix, so they say....http://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/news-item.pl?news_id=336&mdl=KDL40V5100

I will update when I know what's up!


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

got my tv swapped out from the sony to the samsung. still getting the dang audio drops through the home theater system!! What the?? i am getting tired of this. ok, now I have it narrowed to dish network or the onkyo. 
On the new tv, I tried switching from a hdmi cable to component cable from the dish receiver to the tv for video signal only and left the optical cable in place from the dish receiver to the onkyo. still getting audio drops.
Through the tv the audio does not actually drop but has a glitch sound rather and is an actual drop through the home theater system(onkyo) 
I am sooooo P.O.ed...

Dish network or onkyo is the problem. any guess which one?


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

anyone? help! is there a solution to my problem that you know of? 

in the meantime....
I will be talking with dish network tomorrow about a report that is going to go to the engineers to see if it is a software issue with the vip722k. not sure how that will go over.


----------



## Grandude (Oct 21, 2004)

nikeboiz said:


> got my tv swapped out from the sony to the samsung. still getting the dang audio drops through the home theater system!! What the?? i am getting tired of this. ok, now I have it narrowed to dish network or the onkyo.
> On the new tv, I tried switching from a hdmi cable to component cable from the dish receiver to the tv for video signal only and left the optical cable in place from the dish receiver to the onkyo. still getting audio drops.
> Through the tv the audio does not actually drop but has a glitch sound rather and is an actual drop through the home theater system(onkyo)
> I am sooooo P.O.ed...
> ...


My guess is that the Onkyo takes a few seconds longer to decide how it is going to process the sound coming from the Dish receiver when the 'glitch' occurs. I also have an Onkyo (TX-SR705) and have similar audio drops which is annoying but not a deal killer for me yet.

I replaced a JVC RX-8030VBK for a slightly worse problem.  Every now and then it would turn down the volume to 0 on it's own. Never found out why so replaced it with the Onkyo. Still wondering if I should have got a Kenwood instead.

I guess if I were you I would try to get a loan with offer to buy of a different receiver from a friendly retailer in your area to see if that would solve your problem. In my case, I put off doing things like that as my interconnections to all the 'stuff' I have is very confusing. (Luckily my Harmony remote remembers what's what.)

Oh, btw, you should see the indicator panel on your Onkyo changing when this happens if my guess is correct.............


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Dish is coming back out for signal issues

722k box signals
110 is signal 75
119 is signal 78
129 is signal 50

my second box is a non high def reg set top box
119 is a signal 13
129 is a no locked signal
110 is a signal 74

Other than replacing some cable on the outside of the house, no diagnostics at all!!
Has this been my problem all along? The techs they send out do no diagnostics at all. What the hell are they paid for? They just say oh, you get a picture so it's all good!! WTF!!
What do you guys think of these reading? Any advice?


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

nikeboiz said:


> Dish is coming back out for signal issues
> 
> 722k box signals
> 110 is signal 75
> ...


I'm not sure what good it would be to have an HD sat like 129 on a "regular" SD box. But what box is it by number?


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

my main tv is high definition with a HD box VIP722k, 
my second tv is not high definition with a dish311 box.
What does that have to do with signal, nothing!?
i guess you are missing the whole point of me posting my signals.
if there are bad readings, then isn't that a problem?

any input on signal would be appreciated....
Thanks....


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

Your 722k signals are fine. Your 311's 110 is fine, 119 is low though there are transponders that are low, so make sure you're comparing apples to apples. And much to my surprise it appears you do need 129. So you need it.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

If you are not seeing any video issues I would doubt it is a signal problem as you should see those go hand in hand. How often are you getting the sound issues? Does it appear to be when you are moving from content to commercial or does it happen both during a show and when transitioning to commercials. 

Do you have OTA? Is is happening via OTA? 

I still think it is a configuration setting, but since my experience lies with a 722 not sure about compatibility issues with the 722K. I would suggest pulling out your Onkyo manual and if there is anything "Auto" sensing turn it to just deal with PCM and Dolby.

Receivers these days have a lot of knobs and a lot of bells and whistles and sometimes these can cause more pain then help. If nothing helps there there really is not a lot you can do. As far as the 722K goes we are talking minimal settings and I believe you have toggled those with no improvement.

One other thing to check ("Not sure if this is on the 722K"), is there a setting for line leveling. If there is and you have it on try turning it off and see if that improves things.


----------



## olguy (Jan 9, 2006)

I just noticed some audio drops tonight on one of our 622s. First I recall in 3 years. One program was HBO, the other Showtime, both recorded this week. 622>Monoprice HDMI switch>Onkyo 605>new Mitsubishi 82737 all via HDMI. With HDMI out audio off on the Onkyo. We've watched 5 or 6 DVDs in the 3 days we've had the Mits with no audio problem. Very same cables in the very same place as with the Toshiba.


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Thanks for all of your input.
I am shocked that only one person says that some of my signal readings are low? What is a low signal, I heard 50 or below is low.
I have a reading of 13 and only one of you think that is low? I don't get it.
I have a service call set up for next Friday. I want my signals to go up, especially the 13 and 50 and see where that takes me. 
My dish is not in the best place, it is on a short pole on the north side of the house pointing southwest over my house, not sure if it is a clear shot to the satellites. I think the dish would be better in the back of the house with a clear shot to the sky and not trying to go over the house! But we shall see on Friday.....I will report what happens.....

Thank you all for your input!
Brad


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Dish network install tech here today. Not a sub-contractor this time, but an actual Dish installer Tech. He found several problems. He found RG59 coax, replaced that. Wrong ground block, replaced. Wrong wall jack barrels, replaced. Checked and peaked dish. Placement of dish is determined OK. Said the audio and signal problems should be nonexistent now. We shall see how it goes!! So happy he found problems and fixed. My problems were annoying. Will update my thread later if needed! Hopefully I am good now. It has been a long and learning process. Later! 

brad

Note: Thanks for all input!


----------



## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

While it's good that the tech changed those things, I assure you it will do NOTHING for your audio-specific problems.


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

OK battlezone

That is some intelligent advice you got there.....

Thanks, I appreciate it......??????????


----------



## TulsaOK (Feb 24, 2004)

Let us know if that fixed your audio issues.


----------



## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

nikeboiz said:


> OK battlezone
> 
> That is some intelligent advice you got there.....
> 
> Thanks, I appreciate it......??????????


Sorry, I should have clarified:

The video and audio are part of the same data stream. It isn't possible for the video data to be good and the audio to be bad due to a problem with the coax cable or any other "dish to receiver" connection issue. So, while fixing those other issues are certainly a good idea, and could prevent an overall outage in the future, they aren't a solution to the specific problem you're having.


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

battlezone

So, the audio drops are...in your opinion, related to each specific network? Is that what you are saying, or is it the way the satellite transfers the signal?
Or why would these audio drops happen? In your opinion......


Thank you....

brad


----------



## nikeboiz (Apr 2, 2010)

Is anyone else having audio drops with a 722k or 722/high def set up?
Please join in!! 

Thanks....


brad


----------

