# Component Output Problems



## newsdoc (Jun 7, 2004)

The good news is my new 921 seems to have none of the problems reported by others on this forum. The bad news is the component output isn't working properly -- specifically, the blue differential (Pb) seems to be dead.

Once the luminance cable is connected (Y), I get the black & white portion of the picture. When I plug in the red differential (Pr), much of the chrominance comes in, but the colors are off. Then I then plug in the blue differential (Pb), nothing changes. Likewise, if I disconnect the red from Pr but leave the Pb plugged in (along with the Y), I revert back to black & white -- there is no color information present at all.

This occurs with two separate monitors, so the display device is obviously not the problem. It also happens when I swap out the RCA cables, so that rules out any wiring problems. That leaves the receiver.

I bought my receiver a few days ago and immediately upgraded the software to L211, so what do you think: do I simply have a bad box on my hands?


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## firebird2k (Jan 8, 2005)

I don't have a signal checker.. but I just had my 811 replaced by the 921.. The 811 output 720p perfectly with no problems.. However with the 921...

I can't output 720P on component output.. if I plugin the DVI.. it works fine.. but the signal comes in and out at 720p... if I reset the display to 480p.. component outputs fine.. The installer that showed up called dish and asked them to send me a replacement.. so we'll see if the replacement unit has the same problem.. I'm tempted in returning it for a refund and wait for the 942 or another new model that will support the future mpeg4 HD hardware that they may be releasing later this year....


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

A major flaw with the 921 is that it only outputs HD by its DVI or Component outputs. You dont have a bad reciever! It really bites hard! I have too toggle between tv inputs. (RCA for SD) and DVI for hd. known flaw


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## firebird2k (Jan 8, 2005)

You've got to be kidding me.. They won't output HD signal via component cable? the 811 output 720P over component fine and the higher end 921 won't output 720p over component cable! That's absolutely absurd and stupid of them to do that...


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

firebird2k said:


> You've got to be kidding me.. They won't output HD signal via component cable? the 811 output 720P over component fine and the higher end 921 won't output 720p over component cable! That's absolutely absurd and stupid of them to do that...


Sorry think I was being confusing!. THe composite and DVI output on the 921 will only output HD signals. So for an example. I also have VOOM. With Vooms reciever. I only have to have my DVI hooked to my tv. The Voom will output native (what the signal is 480-780-1081) to my Tv and my Wega tv upconverts the signal or plays true HD if that is what signal is.

With the 921 I have to hook up the RCA video output jacks to TV (actually thru my Onkyo THX Reciever) and either my DVI or Component cables to tv, (another major flaw is you can only pick one from DVI or Component cables) and when I watch HD shows, I have to put Wega tv into DVI or COmponent Mode and push HD/SD 921 button to put 921 into HD mode. Then if I switch to a standard SD channel (screen go's Blank) until I toggle HD/SD to SD mode for 921 Reciever and put my tv into RCA jack video mode. 
The only lucky thing is I was able to program Tv remote codes into 921 remote. so toggle is a not quite as much as a pain.

In comparison. with Voom all I have to do is change channels on remote and never loose picture without having to touch a button!

What I dont understand is the remote on the 921 has the HD/SD button. My guess is that this should probably downconvert HD to sd so you would not have to toggle as much. Waste of a function button!


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## zer0cool (Nov 24, 2004)

I'm kinda confused by iceshark's post. I have my 921 hooked up via DVI and I can watch both HD channels and SD channels through that input with the 921 in HD mode. I've also got the 921 running to an Sd television in my bedroom, so when I go in there, I use the HD/SD button to switch to SD so I get a picture on the bedroom TV. (of course, this kills the picture on my HD set through DVI, but if I want I can change my HDTV input to s-video and get an SD picture on both sets at the same time). The 921 will do HD via component cables, but not while DVI is connected. (it won't output to both at the same time).


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

zer0cool said:


> I'm kinda confused by iceshark's post. I have my 921 hooked up via DVI and I can watch both HD channels and SD channels through that input with the 921 in HD mode. I've also got the 921 running to an Sd television in my bedroom, so when I go in there, I use the HD/SD button to switch to SD so I get a picture on the bedroom TV. (of course, this kills the picture on my HD set through DVI, but if I want I can change my HDTV input to s-video and get an SD picture on both sets at the same time). The 921 will do HD via component cables, but not while DVI is connected. (it won't output to both at the same time).


ITs true that the DVI and component will not do 480i. Put they will do 480p and most HD sets accept that as well. And as you noted you can let 921 upconvert SD pictures to either 720p or 1080I. In fact you have to go out of your way to not have it upconvert them to whatever HD setting you have.


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

My sony Wega xbr does upconvert to 1080I, It will not work with 921 becuase 921 does not output 480 to its DVI or Component hookups. They only way that this could be working for anyone is that they must be constantly putting 921 in SAFE MODE> that is the only way you could possibly get an SD signal out of your DVI OR COmponent outputs. ????


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## 4HiMarks (Jan 21, 2004)

Now I'm confused. I leave my 921 on HD/720p all the time. If I tune to an SD channel, it upconverts it to 720p and outputs it through the DVI cable. No switching of inputs, button pushing, or anything else. It should do the same via component. 

-Chris


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

4HiMarks said:


> Now I'm confused. I leave my 921 on HD/720p all the time. If I tune to an SD channel, it upconverts it to 720p and outputs it through the DVI cable. No switching of inputs, button pushing, or anything else. It should do the same via component.
> 
> -Chris


From everything I have experianced or read on this and satelliteguys.com forum. What you are saying should be impossible. The 921 when not in safe 420p mode, Only sends out HD signals thru DVI or COmponent. THis is why lots of users are pissed off.
My Voom box does what you are saying.


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

Sorry I now am confusing myself. Yes if you are in HD mode and using DVI or COmponent output, You will still have a picture when you change to a SD channel. However the picture will be Cropped or stretched and look TERRIBLE> You have to switch back to SD mode and RCA outputs to get normal FULL screen SD pictures. 
With my VOOM box I can send native signal out so It will give me HD in Letterbox (standard) and when I switch to SD programming it is FULL Screen normal. All without pushing a button. The 921 does not do this. it has a SD/HD button but it will not work on both. Waste of a function button.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

iceshark said:


> Sorry I now am confusing myself. Yes if you are in HD mode and using DVI or COmponent output, You will still have a picture when you change to a SD channel. However the picture will be Cropped or stretched and look TERRIBLE> You have to switch back to SD mode and RCA outputs to get normal FULL screen SD pictures.
> With my VOOM box I can send native signal out so It will give me HD in Letterbox (standard) and when I switch to SD programming it is FULL Screen normal. All without pushing a button. The 921 does not do this. it has a SD/HD button but it will not work on both. Waste of a function button.


I don't know enough about the Sony WEGA. The 921 supports 16x9 and two forms of 4x3. Assuming that one of these modes works with your TV, then the picture should not be cropped or streched. Check what HD settings you have and what aspect setting (* key) you show. In Normal aspect and with correct HD setting for your TV, it should show as a normal 4x3 picture.

And although not automatic you can set the 921 to output a 480P mode, if that works better for SD material on your set.


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

tnsprin said:


> I don't know enough about the Sony WEGA. The 921 supports 16x9 and two forms of 4x3. Assuming that one of these modes works with your TV, then the picture should not be cropped or streched. Check what HD settings you have and what aspect setting (* key) you show. In Normal aspect and with correct HD setting for your TV, it should show as a normal 4x3 picture.
> 
> And although not automatic you can set the 921 to output a 480P mode, if that works better for SD material on your set.


Partially correct. However. They 921 will output in 3 modes to your tv. 4by3, 4by3, 16by9 BUT! if you let it output from its DVI or Component it will only output what you choose, And that is going to be HD (780 or 1080) The SD will be strecthed, squeezed or cropped no matter 4by 3 or 16by 9 on a standard 4by 3tv. It will only fill screen (normal mode) by RCA outputs of 921.
It you have a 16by9 screen it is not a problem, THis is a problem for us with non letterbox size screens.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

iceshark: Maybe you need to familiarize yourself with the Menu-6-9 screen?

480i (SD) will come out of the composite/RF/S-video outputs.

480p/720p/1080p (ED/HD) will only come out of the DVI/component outputs, and you can choose which one you want.

That is how it MUST be. Composite/RF/S-video is NOT spec'd for any ED/HD formats.

As for aspect ratio selection, that affects all outputs.


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

SimpleSimon said:


> iceshark: Maybe you need to familiarize yourself with the Menu-6-9 screen?
> 
> 480i (SD) will come out of the composite/RF/S-video outputs.
> 
> ...


I am new but already very familiar with this menu. However If you are outputing by any other method then the RCA jacks, No matter what aspect ratio you choose. You will not have standard full screen SD no matter what is choosen. Not with a standard 4x3 Tv monitor like the Wega xbr. The ONLY way for a full screen normal SD on this tv is by choosing 480I and 4x3 and choosing the RCA inputs of your WEGA tv.


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

To put it more simply. If I turn my 921 on and put in HD mode. Put my Wega in Component in mode (OR DVI) and put on DiscoveryHD (or any HD channel) I will have 1080I letterbox picture on my Wega. If I simply choose for example channel 103 Tvland (SD Channel) without pushing HD/SD button or toggleing anything. I will have a letterbox fisheye looking Tvland on my tv. If I use menu 6-9 and change just aspect ratio. I will get either fisheye letterbox or blackbars on side or black box around picture. NO CHOICES at this point will give me full screen normal. NOW if I push HD/SD button to SD "AND" Toggle my WEGA to RCA jack (composite) input I will have normal full screen TVLAND on my tv.
THIS IS A ROYAL PAIN IN REAR for some people. 

With Voom I set my VOom box to Native 480-108I and it will shoot native TO my vega. So if I was to be watching HD channel and change to SD on Voom it would be normal HD letterbox then Normal full screen SD without touching a thing.
THat is customer satsifaction in my book.
Too Bad Voom box locks up twice a day LOL


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

Simple Simon, You definatly know more then about anyone. Could I have a bad box? Does yours work better?
HELP


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## firebird2k (Jan 8, 2005)

umm... no one mentioned hitting the format button on the remote while you set the 921 to display 720p or 1080i via dvi or component? its the one next to the 0 key.. I think its the * key.. It lets you switch to zoom, normal, etc.. for each press.. no need to go into the menu to the change the display format....


As to the original question.. component output is not working for someone hence my opinion would be to try setting it to 480p and see if it outputs ok.. That is the problem with my 921... it outputs 480p over component fine.. once i switch to 720p it flakes out and doesn't output properly.. I had an 811 before this and that unit output 720p perfectly.. hence I asked dish to replace the receiver due to bad component output.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

iceshark said:


> Partially correct. However. They 921 will output in 3 modes to your tv. 4by3, 4by3, 16by9 BUT! if you let it output from its DVI or Component it will only output what you choose, And that is going to be HD (780 or 1080) The SD will be strecthed, squeezed or cropped no matter 4by 3 or 16by 9 on a standard 4by 3tv. It will only fill screen (normal mode) by RCA outputs of 921.
> It you have a 16by9 screen it is not a problem, THis is a problem for us with non letterbox size screens.


Not true on all TV's. Each mode behaves differently and correctly as defined on at least some 4x3 tvs. Essentially 4x3 (1) is for TVS then only drop some line in order to show a 16x9 picture and 4x3 (2) if for those tvs that change the scan but keep all lines(i.e still show 1080i lines but with black bars above and below).

On almost all 4x3 tvs that accept 480p you also can show SD correctly even if 1080i/780p doesn't behave. This unfortunately requires you to switch the output mode back and forth from 480p to 780P/1080i when watching sd or hd programs.


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## jadebox (Dec 14, 2004)

zer0cool said:


> I have my 921 hooked up via DVI and I can watch both HD channels and SD channels through that input with the 921 in HD mode. I've also got the 921 running to an Sd television in my bedroom, so when I go in there, I use the HD/SD button to switch to SD so I get a picture on the bedroom TV. (of course, this kills the picture on my HD set through DVI ...


If you hold down the HD/SD button on the front of the 921 for a few seconds, both the HD output and the SD output will be enabled at the same time.

-- Roger


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

firebird2k said:


> umm... no one mentioned hitting the format button on the remote while you set the 921 to display 720p or 1080i via dvi or component? its the one next to the 0 key.. I think its the * key.. It lets you switch to zoom, normal, etc.. for each press.. no need to go into the menu to the change the display format....
> 
> Tried the format button. Does not have choice of normal or full screen. It was of no help.
> Thanks for your help though....


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## devecho (Mar 10, 2004)

Iceshark, you should probably be using the 4x3 #1 setting. Have you tried using that? According to the 921 manual, this is what you should pick for your non-widescreen Sony Wega TV. 

And is there a reason that the asterisk/format key won't work for you to prevent people from either looking squashed or stretched depending upon the program material? Or are you having a problem with the concept of letterboxed 16x9 material on your 4x3 TV? Or is that you don't like the job of upconverting SD (480i) programming that the 921 does?


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

devecho said:


> Iceshark, you should probably be using the 4x3 #1 setting. Have you tried using that? According to the 921 manual, this is what you should pick for your non-widescreen Sony Wega TV.
> 
> And is there a reason that the asterisk/format key won't work for you to prevent people from either looking squashed or stretched depending upon the program material? Or are you having a problem with the concept of letterboxed 16x9 material on your 4x3 TV? Or is that you don't like the job of upconverting SD (480i) programming that the 921 does?


I dont mind the upconverting the Wega does. The picture in 4x3 #1 is a small box with bars sides, top and botton. (essentially smaller screen) Comcast HD box did the same. My wife and kids hate it! 
THe plus I have with my Motorola Voom box is that it has Native output so if I watch HD its letterbox (as it should be) when you change to 480I sd channel it go's normal full screen. So I dont have to toggle anything.
The Asterisk key would be great but none of the formats is normal full screen.
Oh well., Just have too live with toggling back and forth the Wega's video inputs and the 921's HD/SD button,
Small price to pay for an othrewise rockin box.


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## firebird2k (Jan 8, 2005)

iceshark said:


> firebird2k said:
> 
> 
> > umm... no one mentioned hitting the format button on the remote while you set the 921 to display 720p or 1080i via dvi or component? its the one next to the 0 key.. I think its the * key.. It lets you switch to zoom, normal, etc.. for each press.. no need to go into the menu to the change the display format....
> ...


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## boylehome (Jul 16, 2004)

Yesterday morning I checked both 921's and saw that they had auto-rebooted. I discovered that the model with the HEED version, had a frozen aspect FORMAT button. All SD channels were in the STRETCH mode but the dispaly banner showed NORMAL. Checking HD satellite and HD OTA channels showed the correct size but still the format selection feature was frozen. Changing video setting and the other tricks didn't work. I had to reboot by power cord unplug.

This morning other 921 with the HECD did the exact same thing. Corrected it by doing the power cord reboot.

Both receivers display setups are for 720p Output Mode and 16x9 TV Type.

The HEED is connected via component. The HECD is connected via DVI.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

I've had a "sticky" format lately myself. When using 1080i output and leaving a recorded HD program for a SD one, the format is "stretch" instead of "normal". :no

Anyway, iceshark, I don't think I can help much more - I've got a 60" 16:9, so I don't see any of these issues. It doesn't sound like a hardware issue, tho, so all I can offer is to try playing around with all 3 settings until you can isolate what the TV is doing - and remember the TV settings can be affecting this, too.


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