# DISH Network and Fox Networks Reach Comprehensive Programming Agreement



## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

*DISH Network and Fox Networks Reach Comprehensive Programming Agreement
Viewers Ensured Continued Fox Broadcasting and Fox Television Stations Programming in Major Cities

FX, National Geographic Channel, and Fox's 19 Regional Sports Networks Immediately Restored to DISH Network Lineup
*
LOS ANGELES and ENGLEWOOD, Colo., Oct 29, 2010 /PRNewswire via COMTEX News Network/ -- DISH Network L.L.C., a subsidiary of DISH Network Corporation (Nasdaq: DISH) and Fox Networks, an operating unit of News Corporation (Nasdaq: NWS), today announced a wide-ranging distribution agreement to provide the third-largest video distributor in the United States with continued access to programming from Fox Broadcasting and Fox local television stations in major cities. The agreement also included carriage of FX, National Geographic Channel, and Fox's 19 regional sports networks, which were restored for DISH Network viewers Friday.

"After prolonged negotiations to reach a fair deal, we're pleased to enter into a long term agreement with Fox and to assure our customers that they can continue to enjoy these channels," said Dave Shull, Senior Vice President of Programming for DISH Network. "We thank our customers, our retail and channel partners, and our employees for their support through these negotiations, which we believe resulted in a fair deal that reinforces DISH Network's position as the best value in television."

"I want to thank our partners at DISH Network who worked tirelessly to help us reach a successful conclusion," said Mike Hopkins, President, Fox Networks Affiliate Sales and Marketing. "This agreement provides a strategic partnership between Fox and DISH to bring the best programming to DISH subscribers."

The agreement ensures that DISH Network viewers will continue to have access to Fox's live national and regional coverage of major sporting events including Major League Baseball's World Series, the NFL on FOX, the NBA, the NHL, college football and basketball, as well as popular entertainment programming on FOX, such as Glee, House, and The Simpsons; Sons of Anarchy and It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia on FX; and the Border Wars and the upcoming Great Migrations on National Geographic Channel.

DISH Network will continue to provide programming from the local Fox and MyNet television stations in the following markets: Atlanta, Austin, Baltimore (MyNet 24 only), Boston, Chicago, Cleveland/Akron, Dallas, Denver, Detroit, Gainesville (FL), Greensboro/Winston-Salem, Houston, Kansas City, Los Angeles, Memphis, Minneapolis, Milwaukee, New York, Orlando, Philadelphia, Phoenix, St. Louis, Salt Lake City, Tampa, and Washington D.C.

Financial terms of the agreement were not disclosed.

http://dish.client.shareholder.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=525025


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

Not exactly immediately, but whatever.

So, who blinked and what's it gonna cost US?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

SayWhat? said:


> Not exactly immediately, but whatever.


Gotta wake up someone in the uplink center. Charlie's still talking on the FSN feeds. 

BTW: Fox has changed their http://getwhatipaidfor.com/ site to announce the "good news".


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

I'm pleased to see this and glad I didn't ever seriously consider switching providers because of it. Much of that was timing though, if this would have happened during the regular MLB season where I would have missed the Reds' pennant chase I may have been less patient. The same is true if it went on too much longer to where I started missing UK basketball games but as it was this didn't really have any negative impact on me at all. 

It is too bad they can't get these deals done before they hit cutoff dates and people lose programming they are used to getting as part of their package but I'm glad it ended relatively quickly.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

James Long said:


> Gotta wake up someone in the uplink center. Charlie's still talking on the FSN feeds.


136 FX and 186 NatGeo content is back ... still need to rename the channels, restore the EPG and get Charlie off FoxSports.


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## cj9788 (May 14, 2003)

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=lf#!/FX

They just posted this on face book.


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## Araxen (Dec 18, 2005)

You have to wonder who blinked first. Sadly we might not ever know.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

Congratulations! (I'll add them back to the count as well)


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Araxen said:


> You have to wonder who blinked first. Sadly we might not ever know.


As expected. There were no public demands that will make a blink obvious (such as Fuse returning to satisfy MSG). We won't know how much DISH is paying ... and DISH already announced the intent to do 24/7 HD of sports channels next year so those shouldn't be tied to the dispute (unless they launch for FSN next week).

BTW: FSN Midwest is airing the correct content with the "important message" EPG.


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## grog (Jul 3, 2007)

That is good news for Dish. Glad to hear it! 

Since this is a multi-year deal Dish should not have to deal with FOX again for sometime. The deal may also ease the talks for other carriers when the carriage comes due.

This was also just posted.

http://www.app.com/article/20101029...ith-Dish-Network-no-Cablevision-pact-in-sight



> Dave Shull, senior vice president of programming for the Dish Network, said the deal was fair.


So whatever the price point at least Dish feels the deal was fair and that is good news for Dish subs.



> Meanwhile, Cablevision customers remain without their local Fox channels.


Side note: I am still glad I changed carriers but more than FOX was involved in our decision to change.


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## altidude (Jan 13, 2010)

FSW is back! Go Lakers!


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

bobukcat said:


> I'm pleased to see this


You may not say that in February when you see the new rates.



James Long said:


> 136 FX and 186 NatGeo content is back ... still need to rename the channels, restore the EPG


Yeah, it must be just the EPG.

Not sure I'll watch them again though.


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## chum76 (Jun 4, 2010)

I just heard at the top of the hour on our local radio station Dish Network finally agreed to FOX's proposal. All this waiting and losing customers for nothing....now hopefully cablevision will belly up and do the right thing as well.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

http://www.jointhefightagainstfox.com/ has been updated ... also calling the deal fair.


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

chum76 said:


> Dish Network finally agreed to FOX's proposal. All this waiting and losing customers for nothing....now hopefully cablevision will belly up and do the right thing as well.


You're still not getting the picture are you?


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## chum76 (Jun 4, 2010)

SayWhat? said:


> You're still not getting the picture are you?


Sure, losing the local FOX stations would have been a disaster. Now FOX gets more money, and customers get their channels back. Everyones happy at last.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

EPG and channel names have returned to normal ... (you will see buffered EPG for events that are not now or next until your receiver downloads a new guide).


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

This ought to make Milfan happy - as well as some others


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## Araxen (Dec 18, 2005)

chum76 said:


> Sure, losing the local FOX stations would have been a disaster. Now FOX gets more money, and customers get their channels back. Everyones happy at last.


And you'll pay more money in the next yearly rate hike.


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## bobukcat (Dec 20, 2005)

SayWhat? said:


> You may not say that in February when you see the new rates.


I hate to sound cavalier about it but I want what I want and expect to pay for it (within reason). I'm sure I could get what I have from Dish cheaper elsewhere but without the same DVR quality/functionality and maybe a few channels but I don't really care. I could have saved lots of money over the year switching back and forth between E* and D* for the new customer offers but again, it just wasn't worth the hassle to me. I don't believe for a second that E* bent over and took Fox's demands without some concessions being made (on both sides) and I would have expected my bill to go up in February like it does (almost) every year even without this dispute.

I expect a reasonable compromise was made and the Cablevision dispute and FCC attention the two simultaneous disputes garnered probably put even more heat on Fox to lower their expectations. Of course none of us will ever know the full details but I'm glad it's over and that E* pushed the issue but apparently not too far.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

James Long said:


> http://www.jointhefightagainstfox.com/ has been updated ... also calling the deal fair.


What do you expect it to say? "We really got shafted on this deal. Oh well." Or..."Boy oh boy we screwed them over!"


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## kcolg30 (May 11, 2010)




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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

Fair deal or not having is better than wanting.


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## MilFan (Sep 13, 2010)

Very awesome. For as much as I've bashed Dish, I will commend them for getting this resolved pretty quickly into the NBA season. So what channel is the Bucks game on tonight for Milwaukee/Madison people? I didn't see it on the Game Finder.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

MilFan said:


> Very awesome. For as much as I've bashed Dish, I will commend them for getting this resolved pretty quickly into the NBA season. So what channel is the Bucks game on tonight for Milwaukee/Madison people? I didn't see it on the Game Finder.


Try 441 HD for Bucks at Timberwolves (450 SD).


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## grog (Jul 3, 2007)

If Dish thought it was not a fair deal I would have expected them to just say they made a deal.. nothing else.

Saying it was fair means the they got the deal they wanted; maybe with some concessions, but still a 'fair deal'.



sigma1914 said:


> What do you expect it to say? "We really got shafted on this deal. Oh well." Or..."Boy oh boy we screwed them over!"


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## kcolg30 (May 11, 2010)

I get to see my HEAT loose lost lose again...

But at least me EPG wont have the BS "Important update" in the guide


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## coolman302003 (Jun 2, 2008)

Oh thank goodness, I have been bothered with my neighbor coming over every Friday to watch Sons of Anarchy since he has E*


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

SayWhat? said:


> Not exactly immediately, but whatever.
> 
> So, who blinked and what's it gonna cost US?


If you see AT120 include the Fox RSN and AT120 + disappears then Dish blinked,if not Fox blinked.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

Jhon69 said:


> If you see AT120 include the Fox RSN and AT120 + disappears then Dish blinked,if not Fox blinked.


I was having my wife check if FX / Nat Geo made it into AT120, but it doesn't appear so.


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## ehren (Aug 3, 2003)

Yep got the EPG updated for all the games now, cool. Now Dish can add 24/7 RSN's in HD, LOL


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## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

I forced a guide update to get the FX guide. This allows me to record the most recent episode of "Sons of Anarchy." But I'm still missing three episodes.


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## CoolGui (Feb 9, 2006)

This is good news, I only missed on regular season game... But I'm still weighing my options as I would like to get HD in my bedroom and potentially get the full time FSHouston feed (but I'd probably have to go to cable for that).


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## HuggieBear (Nov 17, 2006)

*Bout damn time I have missed my NATGEO.*


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## Jupiter (Aug 19, 2002)

While I am glad to have FSNorth back here in Minnesota... The Dish HD situation with FSNorth is still complete crap! Just like what happened with the Twins earlier this year, they are not showing all of the games in HD when FSNorth is broadcasting HD.

According to FSNorth, the T-Wolves pregame and game is in HD tonight along with the Gopher hockey game later on also being in HD. The Wolves pregame is on right now, but the FSNorth HD channel is showing the "Check back often to see if your favorite team is playing in HD"


COME ON DISH!!!!

You supposedly offer the most HD content, yet I am not getting my games that are being broadcasted in HD on Dish! This is complete BS!!!


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

So now I'm wondering...

For the posters that were predicting the bankruptcy of Dish immediately over this...

does it now mean that Dish will be the #1 broadcast company immediately as well?

Hyperbole works both ways, right?


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## Gloria_Chavez (Aug 11, 2008)

chum76 said:


> I just heard at the top of the hour on our local radio station Dish Network finally agreed to FOX's proposal. All this waiting and losing customers for nothing....now hopefully cablevision will belly up and do the right thing as well.


Chum, can you please cite a source that stipulates that Dish acquiesced to Fox's demands? If you heard it on the radio, I'm certain the AP or Reuters picked it up.

Please cite.


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## tsmacro (Apr 28, 2005)

So as far as we all know all channels involved have returned to the same packages as they were in before the dispute then? I guess this also means that i'm going to have to pay for the Platinum package to watch HDNet Movies now. Oh well at least I won't have to listen to my wife complain about missing her Pacers games.


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## dtrail2000 (Oct 30, 2010)

did anyone check the programing for FX now that its on. I still dont see SOA or Always sunny in PA. its all movies. so i called dish net and they told me they have no control over what is on the channel.....well direct tv is playing SOA at 10pm.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

dtrail2000 said:


> did anyone check the programing for FX now that its on. I still dont see SOA or Always sunny in PA. its all movies. so i called dish net and they told me they have no control over what is on the channel.....well direct tv is playing SOA at 10pm.


do a check switch and download a new EPG and you will see it.


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

scooper said:


> I was having my wife check if FX / Nat Geo made it into AT120, but it doesn't appear so.


We may have to wait until Feb. 1st,2011?.


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## david91722 (Oct 10, 2010)

Stewart Vernon said:


> So now I'm wondering...
> 
> For the posters that were predicting the bankruptcy of Dish immediately over this...
> 
> ...


Yeah! Gotta laugh at all the people who wrote: "Dish Network R.I.P. 1996-2010".

Long live E*! :goodjob:

I feel bad, though, for all the longtime E* subs who jumped ship (some of them reluctantly) to D* and now have a contract with them. Let this be a lesson to you. Patience is a virtue.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

david91722 said:


> I feel bad, though, for all the longtime E* subs who jumped ship (some of them reluctantly) to D* and now have a contract with them. Let this be a lesson to you. Patience is a virtue.


Why would you feel bad for them? With the exception of a few issues with both providers. Everyone should be fairly happy. (subscribers to various sports packages relying on RSN's being an exception on one side)


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## david91722 (Oct 10, 2010)

Hoosier205 said:


> Why would you feel bad for them? With the exception of a few issues with both providers. Everyone should be fairly happy. (subscribers to various sports packages relying on RSN's being an exception on one side)


They had to go through everything involved in the hassle of switching. I concede for some it may not have been much of an inconvenience, but I mostly feel bad for the people who liked E*, and for one reason or another may not like their experience with D*. Now they are tied down by a contract with a hefty ETF.


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

david91722 said:


> They had to go through everything involved in the hassle of switching. I concede for some it may have been much of an inconvenience, but I mostly feel bad for the people who liked E*, and for one reason or another may not like their experience with D*. Now they are tied down by a contract with a hefty ETF.


It's what you would call a learning experience.I have done it myself,I came back to Dish Network it's just a better fit for me.For someone else it may not be,we shall see.


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## david91722 (Oct 10, 2010)

Jhon69 said:


> It's what you would call a learning experience.I have done it myself,I came back to Dish Network it's just a better fit for me.For someone else it may not be,we shall see.


Some people have to learn. Others already have the knowledge.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

david91722 said:


> Yeah! Gotta laugh at all the people who wrote: "Dish Network R.I.P. 1996-2010".


DISH will not die or live over one issue. There have been too many "this will kill DISH" issues over the year that they survived.



> I feel bad, though, for all the longtime E* subs who jumped ship (some of them reluctantly) to D* and now have a contract with them. Let this be a lesson to you. Patience is a virtue.


Fortunately the deals were pretty good. And if they have any problems figuring out their new system we have a forum full of people (overflowing) who are willing to help.

And perhaps some installers will get a break as the last of the panic installs get canceled.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

david91722 said:


> They had to go through everything involved in the hassle of switching. I concede for some it may not have been much of an inconvenience, but I mostly feel bad for the people who liked E*, and for one reason or another may not like their experience with D*. Now they are tied down by a contract with a hefty ETF.


Most of us veterans were counseling patience, that FOX and Dish will get this worked out eventually - as they did. For some - they simply HAD to have their sports nets NOW and they made their decision on what they felt was their best choice at the time.


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

Glad to see it got settled. Hope it was a good deal for everyone.


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## calgary2800 (Aug 27, 2006)

Got a email from Dish just now, they want me back and offer to take 15 bucks off my programming for 12 months. No, thanks. I am watching the NY Rangers MSG game on CI and the HD is stunning. BYE BYE


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## chum76 (Jun 4, 2010)

Gloria_Chavez said:


> Chum, can you please cite a source that stipulates that Dish acquiesced to Fox's demands? If you heard it on the radio, I'm certain the AP or Reuters picked it up.
> 
> Please cite.


http://www.latimes.com/business/fi-ct-dish-20101030,0,824095.story?track=rss

*"Fox is definitely the winner here; they are going to be paid quite a bit of money," said Derek Baine, cable television analyst with SNL Kagan. "I didn't understand Dish's PR strategy. If you are a consumer, you just want your channels and you don't care about the back-room negotiations between the programmers and the distributors."*

A pretty good unbiased article. I am sure more will leak in the future.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

I have no doubt that Fox came out better in this dispute, to what degree I do not know. Dish was in a bad spot from the very beginning...as any service provider would be. Fox always had the stronger hand.


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## paja (Oct 23, 2006)

Stewart Vernon said:


> So now I'm wondering...
> 
> For the posters that were predicting the bankruptcy of Dish immediately over this...
> 
> ...


Never will be #1 as long as they can't provide the channel of our National pastime(MLB Net) or YES for New York fans


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

chum76 said:


> http://www.latimes.com/business/fi-ct-dish-20101030,0,824095.story?track=rss
> 
> *"Fox is definitely the winner here; they are going to be paid quite a bit of money," said Derek Baine, cable television analyst with SNL Kagan. "I didn't understand Dish's PR strategy. If you are a consumer, you just want your channels and you don't care about the back-room negotiations between the programmers and the distributors."*
> 
> A pretty good unbiased article. I am sure more will leak in the future.


Wasn't he one of the trolls (not you, but the quoted article) that was blasting DISH over this from the beginning? Seems like "unbiased" might be a stretch.

DISH wins by being able to sell the programming at a markup. That is the way the business works. It is stupid to consider Fox a winner just because DISH pays them. This isn't Judge Judy with the winner getting the cash. This is what is supposed to be a cooperation between programmer and carrier.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

James Long said:


> DISH wins by being able to sell the programming at a markup.


Good point James.


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## calgary2800 (Aug 27, 2006)

When does Dish rates the package rates?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

calgary2800 said:


> When does Dish rates the package rates?


Normally in February with DirecTV following in March (effective month) but DISH made other adjustments in February and the rate bump in June this year so they may be off cycle next year.


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## tsmacro (Apr 28, 2005)

chum76 said:


> http://www.latimes.com/business/fi-ct-dish-20101030,0,824095.story?track=rss
> 
> *"Fox is definitely the winner here; they are going to be paid quite a bit of money," said Derek Baine, cable television analyst with SNL Kagan. "I didn't understand Dish's PR strategy. If you are a consumer, you just want your channels and you don't care about the back-room negotiations between the programmers and the distributors."*
> 
> A pretty good unbiased article. I am sure more will leak in the future.


I wouldn't be so sure about this after all wasn't one of the sticking points supposedly that Fox wanted their channels in the AT120? If all the sudden FX and the Fox Sports Channels were in the AT120 i'd be more convinced that FOX was a "winner".


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

tsmacro said:


> I wouldn't be so sure about this after all wasn't one of the sticking points supposedly that Fox wanted their channels in the AT120? If all the sudden FX and the Fox Sports Channels were in the AT120 i'd be more convinced that FOX was a "winner".


As that LA Times article states:While Fox fell short in its bid to get wider distribution on Dish for its sports channels, it succeeded in wrangling higher payments for all its channels.​
How much higher is a question. I can't imagine a renewal contract without some increase (a couple of percent) unless the channels lost value.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

I agree - there will be some rate increase (and maybe a schedule for the next couple years), but If FOX isn't getting the wider distribution it wanted -


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

chum76 said:


> *If you are a consumer, you just want your channels and you don't care about the back-room negotiations between the programmers and the distributors."*


That is completely false. If the rates change significantly as a result of this, I'm out.

Of course it won't affect me until next September at my next annual renewal.


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## GrumpyBear (Feb 1, 2006)

scooper said:


> I agree - there will be some rate increase (and maybe a schedule for the next couple years), but If FOX isn't getting the wider distribution it wanted -


Will be interesting to see what kind of Rate increase we see in Feb, as well if FX, NetGeo, or if the RSN's fall into AT120 or not. RSN's, FS, and NetGeo stay in the Tiers they are in, Fox didn't win out here at all. 
This happened a couple of days earlier than expected, as the 1st is still a few days away, the other thread was getting pretty doom and gloom from all the Trolls in it, and shouting down those that new this would get worked out once the contract for Fox locals came up, as FX, NetGeo and the RSN's just weren't a huge number of viewers, and there was really very little out cry about those channels.


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## Art7220 (Feb 4, 2004)

You'll care about the back-room deal to see how much your rates will go up, and they will.

From the LA Times: "In its public campaign, Dish tried to paint Fox as a greedy "Global media cartel" out to gouge consumers".

I wonder if Dish has backed down from that statement? I wonder if there's a clause in the deal that states the parties can't badmouth each other anymore?

The loser in this is of course, the customer. How much they will lose depends on the next rate increase.


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## Gloria_Chavez (Aug 11, 2008)

Perhaps Fox feared govt intervention more than it has telegraphed. 3M subs not having Fox Broadcast is not in the same ballpark as 14M.

(focus on last sentence below)

------------------------
Sports Broadcasts Return as Fox and Dish End Dispute

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/30/business/media/30fox.html?ref=business

Separately, Mr. Genachowski wrote in a letter to Senator John Kerry, Democrat of Massachusetts, who recently proposed updated legislation, that "it is time for Congress to revisit the current retransmission law."

Cablevision has been arguing that the regulatory system for retransmission negotiations is broken and that government intervention is needed. Now Fox can point to the Dish negotiations as evidence that the government need not be involved - and that is exactly what it did on Friday afternoon. 
------------------------------------


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## Gloria_Chavez (Aug 11, 2008)

Art7220, the loser will be the PayTV co's if prices go up significantly above inflation.

Yesterday, Comcast reported a larger than expected subscriber loss in 3Q10.

The music industry once thought that it could continue increasing CD price points, until it couldn't. Today, music industry revenues are down 55% from where they were in 2001.


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## dclaryjr (Mar 11, 2007)

Although I recently switched for reasons completely unrelated to this, I'm happy for my former fellow Dish customers.


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## stevetanneyhill (Mar 20, 2007)

I wonder if the new agreement will now allow SportSouth to be placed in the Multi sport package? (before, it was the only RSN not available in that package to subscribers outside of the Southeast).


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## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

My dog Kate got to watch Caesar this evening.......she's very happy......


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## Willh (Jan 1, 2009)

i got a good question to ask

now that the dispute is over, when do u think Dish will shut the RSNs and the other channels in the multi-sports that weren't affected in the dispute to those without the multi-sports package.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Willh said:


> i got a good question to ask
> 
> now that the dispute is over, when do u think Dish will shut the RSNs and the other channels in the multi-sports that weren't affected in the dispute to those without the multi-sports package.


Yes. I'm surprised that they have not pulled them already. Perhaps they are waiting until Sunday Night to give people a full month.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

James Long said:


> As that LA Times article states:While Fox fell short in its bid to get wider distribution on Dish for its sports channels, it succeeded in wrangling higher payments for all its channels.​How much higher is a question. I can't imagine a renewal contract without some increase (a couple of percent) unless the channels lost value.


I agree. Whenever a contract comes up for renewal each side has a chance to ask for more (FOX) or less (Dish) or keep the status quo.

In a dispute like this, it is not likely that Dish managed to negotiate a lower payment... and it doesn't appear yet that FOX manage to "win" getting placed in a lower tier package.

So what's left is "status quo" or "more money for FOX"... Status quo is possible, but once it gets to the channels-pulled stage, it would be hard for FOX to go back to shareholders and say "we won.. we pulled our channels and Dish agreed to pay us what they already were paying"...

So the most likely resolution is that FOX will be getting more money than they were before.

I don't see that as an unreasonable solution if the money is appropriately more but not extravagantly more.... though it is highly unlikely that info will leak to allow any of us to make an informed decision of just how much more they are getting.

But in the grander scheme... we got back the channels we lost AND didn't lose the OTAs at all.

Now onto other disputes and crises...


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Stewart Vernon said:


> In a dispute like this, it is not likely that Dish managed to negotiate a lower payment...


I don't expect DISH to ever walk in to a channel negotiation expecting to pay less for a channel than they already are. Their starting position would be status quo. Zero increase. With the expectation that something slightly higher would be a compromise.

The only time I'd expect DISH to walk in expecting to cut the current price would be if the channel isn't as good as it needs to be. Channels where carriage is important to the channel (such as The Weather Channel who could not afford to lose 14 million subscribers). They need to keep the image going that they are a core channel that everyone must have and not an option.

DISH's success at negotiating a lower payment is negotiating a lower payment than the channel wants to be paid. Cutting the 50% increases down to 5% would be a huge win (although channels starting sky high so "settling" is what they really wanted could be part of the game).

My question is how does Time Warner feel about this deal. With "most favored nation" in their contract DISH's negotiations may have lowered TWs price as well. Unless they found some way to create a special deal with DISH that didn't change Time Warner's deal.

If the DISH deal affects the Time Warner deal it also may help Cablevision.


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## CoolGui (Feb 9, 2006)

James Long said:


> My question is how does Time Warner feel about this deal. With "most favored nation" in their contract DISH's negotiations may have lowered TWs price as well. Unless they found some way to create a special deal with DISH that didn't change Time Warner's deal.
> 
> If the DISH deal affects the Time Warner deal it also may help Cablevision.


That's probably why it isn't disclosed. But honestly I don't think Dish got the best deal from Fox, just one they could live with and still keep it out of their AT120.

I do wonder what this will mean in 2012 for me though when the Houston teams with FSHouston switch over to a Comcast station. Probably the same as I get now, just the games, nothing else.


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## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

I guess I'll add my opinion here. It's free and worth every penny.

First, based on historical pricing of locals, Dish seems to just spread the cost of all locals in all DMA's as a single cost center. So now the cost for one (or two) stations in 27 out of 210 DMA's jumps this year. Not a big deal. Just gradually increase the price of all packages over the next 10 years as each DMA and each of the network affiliated locals jumps a similar amount. All other cable, satellite, and telcom companies will have to deal with this cost also.

We viewers will see the costs leap likely over a decade. The cable, satellite, and telcom companies and lawful sources for internet TV as a whole won't suffer as we viewers hop from one to the other, frustrated at inevitable substantial price increases across all platforms. At the end of 10 years, the impact will be felt by the viewers.

Next, Fox bragged to the FCC about the value to viewers of its programming. I'm posting this season's ratings over in the TV Talk Forum.

As I look at the ratings, particularly this week, I can't help wonder. Fox says it's broadcast network is worth all that money because of its programming and sports. Using their standards, I assume CBS must be worth $25 a month per cable and satellite subscriber because of the actual number of viewers who watch CBS. And except for "American Idol" that is likely to be true in the Winter season.

Remember, in this case the money isn't about the demos and advertising but about how many viewers want CBS on their TV sets every night and who therefore would definitely miss that network. The fact is that "The Big Bang Theory", "CSI" and "The Mentalist" were on significantly more TV sets than the World Series last night. And compared to even "The Mentalist" at 10 pm on Thursday, Fox has no regular show this season that even comes close to having the number of TV sets tuned in, not even "House."

Finally, I have a hunch that the important information in the joint news release was contained in the enigmatic terms "a long term agreement" and "a wide-ranging distribution agreement." Dish may have agreed to pay the full amount Time Warner is paying for the O&O broadcast stations realizing that it is only one or two of the locals in only 27 of the 210 DMA's. My speculation is that Dish probably will not have to renegotiate for a significant length of time, perhaps 7 or more years. And Dish probably got a really good deal on at least some of the Fox cable and/or regional sports channels, perhaps some that we don't even know were brought up. Charlie's no fool.

The pressure dynamics in the negotiations in favor of Dish included

the Cablevision situation bad PR,
the involvement of the FCC and Congress and,
one other last minute factor - Fox has reruns scheduled next week except for games 5-7 of a low ratings World Series; there may or may not be games 5, 6 and/or 7 and if not, few viewers would a sense of loss (Go Giants!).
Fox needed to give. Dish had room to give if Fox did.

I don't like it because I think the die is now cast that affiliated broadcast channels in 10 years will no longer be available except at a significant cost to the viewer. And that will apply to OTA. It is not a rational way to reorganize the home media business that includes federally created near-monopolies.


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## Wilf (Oct 15, 2008)

chum76 said:


> Sure, losing the local FOX stations would have been a disaster. Now FOX gets more money, and customers get their channels back. Everyones happy at last.


I'll let you know about that next February.


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## BillJ (May 5, 2005)

Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.

One consequence of the shutdown which FOX may not appreciate. My very first act when I learned FX was back was to delete my timer for "Sons of Anarchy". I've missed too many episodes and I've realized I can get along just fine without it. So instead of losing a viewer for a month, they've lost one permanently. Wonder how many other viewers feel the same way?


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## CoolGui (Feb 9, 2006)

"phrelin" said:


> ...Fox says it's broadcast network is worth all that money because of its programming and sports...


I honestly don't know if we will ever know the details, but the broadcast channels might have only been a small increase. I assumed they were just using all the other channels as bargaining chips to get more money out of their RSNs. The cablevision dispute makes me think they are raising the rate, I just don't know how much.

You know people were saying that fcc or govt really couldn't do anything to fix this... Couldn't they just get rid of the pay to carry option and make them all "must carry"?


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

CoolGui said:


> I honestly don't know if we will ever know the details, but the broadcast channels might have only been a small increase. I assumed they were just using all the other channels as bargaining chips to get more money out of their RSNs. The cablevision dispute makes me think they are raising the rate, I just don't know how much.
> 
> You know people were saying that fcc or govt really couldn't do anything to fix this... Couldn't they just get rid of the pay to carry option and make them all "must carry"?


The FCC can't - but Congress can - no wait - this is the same Congress that is bought and paid for by the NAB.... Let's revise that to "Congress could, but is unlikely to revisit the issue".


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## dakeeney (Aug 30, 2004)

BillJ said:


> Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.
> 
> One consequence of the shutdown which FOX may not appreciate. My very first act when I learned FX was back was to delete my timer for "Sons of Anarchy". I've missed too many episodes and I've realized I can get along just fine without it. So instead of losing a viewer for a month, they've lost one permanently. Wonder how many other viewers feel the same way?


The only show I was watching was Terriers. I too got along fine without it.


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## Slamminc11 (Jan 28, 2005)

Wilf said:


> I'll let you know about that next February.


Price increases happen every year which everyone knows and has experienced but seem to always forget around Christmas and then become completely unglued in January when the numbers leak out. 
It will happen again this year, mark my words. Amazingly, a lot of people are now going to blame the Fox thing for the price increase like one has never happened before.


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## Paul Secic (Dec 16, 2003)

Araxen said:


> You have to wonder who blinked first. Sadly we might not ever know.


I bet FOX blinked first because they had more to loose.


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## kalone (May 6, 2010)

Glad this was settled. Myself, I never watch any programs from Fox networks.


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## kenglish (Oct 2, 2004)

I just wish the Government would nationalize the entire radio and TV industry, and make us all Civil $ervice Employee$. Then, it wouldn't make any difference whether the stations and networks get any income at all...outside of tax dollars, of course. 

And, those who work in TV and Radio would get pay raises.


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## epokopac (Aug 8, 2007)

James Long said:


> Yes. I'm surprised that they have not pulled them already. Perhaps they are waiting until Sunday Night to give people a full month.


I believe E* is keeping them "active" until the MSG issue is resolved. At least that's the impression I got from www.greedymsg.com and the video running on the MSG channel.


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## jacmyoung (Sep 9, 2006)

BillJ said:


> Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.


If FOX did not succeed in having the channels included in a lower tier, then that alone may be considered "a fair deal" because the higher tiers presumably have higher profit margins to absorb the fee increase.

Now if DISH's goal is to sell the lower tier package as a volume leader, that they rely much less on selling the higher tiers, then you can even say DISH had won.


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## olguy (Jan 9, 2006)

BillJ said:


> Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.
> 
> One consequence of the shutdown which FOX may not appreciate. My very first act when I learned FX was back was to delete my timer for "Sons of Anarchy". I've missed too many episodes and I've realized I can get along just fine without it. So instead of losing a viewer for a month, they've lost one permanently. Wonder how many other viewers feel the same way?


I'll wait for the 3rd season DVD and check it out at the library. That's how I watched the first 2 seasons and when I started watching the recorded programs this season on my 922 I almost wore out my thumb on the 30 second skip to get through the commercials.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

paja said:


> Never will be #1 as long as they can't provide the channel of our National pastime(MLB Net) or YES for New York fans


Dishnetwork provides more of what I want, And what I want is what is important to me. If you look at the channel comparisons between DirecTV & Dishnetwork Dish is ahead on non sports national HD and DirecTV is ahead on Sports HD.

More non-sports channels.

For me they could take off two sports channels and give me one non sports channel for each pair of sports channels and I would consider myself a winner.

I await the day that the large cities wake up and stop giving major sports teams the key to the financial city.

It's wrong that non sports fans are subsidizing sports to keep prices lower for fans.

When the YES channel became a reality, I realized I did not miss the games at all. No withdrawal symptoms at all.

Of course I never had a Yankees shrine in the house like some do.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Now that the Dish vs Fox dispute is settled all the Dish is doomed posters can transfer all that negative energies to DirecTV and the G4 channel.


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

jacmyoung said:


> If FOX did not succeed in having the channels included in a lower tier, then that alone may be considered "a fair deal" because the higher tiers presumably have higher profit margins to absorb the fee increase.
> 
> Now if DISH's goal is to sell the lower tier package as a volume leader, that they rely much less on selling the higher tiers, then you can even say DISH had won.


That is Dish Network goal's and why they would not budge.The lowest package price in America is what draws customers.It's also nice to know during hard times a subscriber can go down that low and maintain service, if a subscriber owns their equipment they can even go to a lower price.


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## Greg Bimson (May 5, 2003)

Until we start seeing the packaging of some of these channels, we won't know for sure what happened. There could also be a grace-period before any of the new packaging applies.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Greg Bimson said:


> Until we start seeing the packaging of some of these channels, we won't know for sure what happened. There could also be a grace-period before any of the new packaging applies.


So any change within a few months would be considered a 'victory' for Fox? Even changes DISH announced months ago?

The LA Times "insider" comments clearly said Fox did not win on their request for better placement of the sports channels, so they should stay at AT120+ with other provider's regional sports channels.

If we see more HD feeds or 24/7 HD channels it could be just part of the plan already announced months ago.

Both Fox and DISH seem to be happy with the deal. Isn't that enough? Does there have to be a winner, other than subscribers who got their content back?


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## Lincoln6Echo (Jul 11, 2007)

James Long said:


> Gotta wake up someone in the uplink center. Charlie's still talking on the FSN feeds.
> 
> BTW: Fox has changed their http://getwhatipaidfor.com/ site to announce the "good news".


You just gotta love Fox's advertising campaign for this dispute..."DISH was too stubborn to pay our new jacked up rates...so here...switch to DirectTV while you wait..."

Yeah, like I was gonna call up Direct, get all new equipment, not to mention a new contract, so I could watch a few channels that I don't regularly watch, only to have a settlement less than a month later.


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## tsmacro (Apr 28, 2005)

James Long said:


> So any change within a few months would be considered a 'victory' for Fox? Even changes DISH announced months ago?
> 
> The LA Times "insider" comments clearly said Fox did not win on their request for better placement of the sports channels, so they should stay at AT120+ with other provider's regional sports channels.
> 
> ...


I like the idea of the idea of the sports channels being 120+ or higher that way people who don't want to pay for them don't have to. As for the other channels based on popularity and the tiers that FX is in with other providers it would make sense to have it in the 120 and Nat Geo in the 200 especially since Nat Geo has that secondary channel, Wild or whatever it is, keep that one in the 250. That's my 2cents on what would make sense to me.


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## joshjr (Aug 2, 2008)

Congrats to all E* customers. I am happy it wokred out. It would eventually of been D*'s turn. I hope it does not mean a price increase though. Again glad it worked out and hope everyone is happy with the results.


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## Greg Bimson (May 5, 2003)

James Long said:


> So any change within a few months would be considered a 'victory' for Fox? Even changes DISH announced months ago?


I'm not saying anyone is victorious. I'm simply saying that until we see any channels placed in a different tier, we don't know what happened. Keep in mind that any changes that may have been announced months ago would also have to conform to this new carriage contract.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Greg Bimson said:


> I'm not saying anyone is victorious. I'm simply saying that until we see any channels placed in a different tier, we don't know what happened.


You're saying that until we see change we won't know that the tier placements have _not_ changed? So we should just assume that a future change has been agreed to despite the comment in the LA Times.

What I was referring to in the rest of my comment was the concept of any change would be construed as a victory for Fox. When DISH adds 24/7 HD RSNs next year I'm sure someone will say "see, Fox won, they got their channels 24/7" despite it being a goal already announced by DISH. Yes, DISH and Fox (and the other RSNs) will need to have an agreement that allows 24/7 carriage - but the goal was already expressed. When it happens it will be just another example of programmers working with carriers to get a feed carried. Not a "victory".


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## Darcaine (Aug 31, 2009)

BillJ said:


> Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.
> 
> One consequence of the shutdown which FOX may not appreciate. My very first act when I learned FX was back was to delete my timer for "Sons of Anarchy". I've missed too many episodes and I've realized I can get along just fine without it. So instead of losing a viewer for a month, they've lost one permanently. Wonder how many other viewers feel the same way?


I don't know, but with all this hoopla over the Sons of Anarchy I decided to check the show out, and now I'm hooked. So I suppose we cancel each other out. :lol:


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## david_jr (Dec 10, 2006)

scooper said:


> The FCC can't - but Congress can - no wait - this is the same Congress that is bought and paid for by the NAB.... Let's revise that to "Congress could, but is unlikely to revisit the issue".


The NAB is only one of their many sponsors.

Glad the channels are back for everyone that missed them, but I didn't really watch any of them. Watch Fox network, but get that OTA if there is a problem anyway.


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## Ohioankev (Jan 19, 2006)

BillJ said:


> Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.
> 
> One consequence of the shutdown which FOX may not appreciate. My very first act when I learned FX was back was to delete my timer for "Sons of Anarchy". I've missed too many episodes and I've realized I can get along just fine without it. So instead of losing a viewer for a month, they've lost one permanently. Wonder how many other viewers feel the same way?


I still caught sons of anarchy at moms but I quit watching Terriers and probably won't start again. I'm not saying it's bad but it's a new show and I only got to watch four episodes before they pulled FX.

Anyways Dish could make it right for customers, If the FOX deal increases our rates by $5 then they could cut these ridiculous dual view dvr fees from $17 to $12/month.

I Guarantee that they won't and we will have to pay the increase come Feb. 2011, and then again in June 2011.


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## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

Hey all you dishTV deserters......:ringo: who... oh by the way, payed the (get me out of here money) :barf:........how's that working out for ya......? :icon_da:

:icon_band


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## Deke Rivers (Jan 8, 2007)

BillJ said:


> Yes, they are back and I'm glad but hoping DISH didn't cave in and pay the extortion rates FOX was demanding. Knowing Charlie, they didn't.
> 
> One consequence of the shutdown which FOX may not appreciate. My very first act when I learned FX was back was to delete my timer for "Sons of Anarchy". I've missed too many episodes and I've realized I can get along just fine without it. So instead of losing a viewer for a month, they've lost one permanently. Wonder how many other viewers feel the same way?


same here..other than that show I wouldnt even have known the channels were gone until Justified starts back up


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## dakeeney (Aug 30, 2004)

:goodjob:


356B said:


> Hey all you dishTV deserters......:ringo: who... oh by the way, payed the (get me out of here money) :barf:........how's that working out for ya......? :icon_da:
> 
> :icon_band


I'm glad I didn't jump ship.


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## Greg Bimson (May 5, 2003)

James Long said:


> You're saying that until we see change we won't know that the tier placements have *not* changed? So we should just assume that a future change has been agreed to despite the comment in the LA Times.


The LA Times article only mentions that there wasn't wider distribution of the RSN's. There was no mention of FX or NatGeo.

I'm expecting that FX would most likely be put in AT120. But who knows?


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

Greg Bimson said:


> The LA Times article only mentions that there wasn't wider distribution of the RSN's. There was no mention of FX or NatGeo.
> 
> I'm expecting that FX would most likely be put in AT120. But who knows?


FX might but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Who can you believe if you can't believe the LA Times?.


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## grog (Jul 3, 2007)

I think a lot depends on why someone left. For many including myself the FOX issue was just an added reason to make a change that we had already thought about doing.

I do have a friend who was ready to switch but only due to the lack of FOX stations. I have a feeling he will say with Dish now that the issue is resolved and if so I have a couple of extra RF remotes I purchased that he may find useful.

I did not pay to get out of my contract since I was no in one.

I did however leave Dish during the FOX rounds.

To answer your question.

The change is going much better than expected.

We had several issues that were long standing and add the FOX issue was the reason we left.

Random reboot of both our VIP622's. They were replaced a couple of times. Still random reboots. In the end it just seemed to be a glitch as others reported the same issues. Loss of SAT signal that pressing guide and back cleared up. Disabled all OTA channels since lose of signal on OTA could cause the same issue. While I had two external hard drives on both VIP622's it was hard to deal with what was recorded where. Both bedrooms had SD feeds but HD sets.

So something needed to change but I had no strong reason to fix the issues. My wife would get upset when she lost signal during a game. But with those problems we lived with it.

For MLB we signed up for access via the network as Dish stopped MLB. This involved setting up a media center and training the wife to use it to access MLB and all her games.

There were stations that were dropped by Dish and we did not like to see them go but we stayed with Dish anyway.

Thing is; when FOX was dropped we were having a large number of reboots with both VIP622's. We knew we had to change something and Dish gave us the reason to look elsewhere.

We are glad Dish gave us the incentive to look around.

No random reboots. We have the sports channels we want. All the rooms are in HD now. We have two HD-DVR's but now we can play the content of all our recorded shows anywhere in the home.

A large number of channels also include VOD content that is all free.

Been watching a few 1080P free movies from the VOD channels.

So yes we are happy we left. Seems it was a good move for us. 



356B said:


> Hey all you dishTV deserters......:ringo: who... oh by the way, payed the (get me out of here money) :barf:........how's that working out for ya......? :icon_da:
> 
> :icon_band


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## ENDContra (Dec 8, 2006)

Any word on if these negotiations included additions of any channels or full time RSNs? Really glad this has been taken care of before basketball season.


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## Paul Secic (Dec 16, 2003)

Lincoln6Echo said:


> You just gotta love Fox's advertising campaign for this dispute..."DISH was too stubborn to pay our new jacked up rates...so here...switch to DirectTV while you wait..."
> 
> Yeah, like I was gonna call up Direct, get all new equipment, not to mention a new contract, so I could watch a few channels that I don't regularly watch, only to have a settlement less than a month later.


+1 I


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## Santi360HD (Oct 6, 2008)

dakeeney said:


> :goodjob:
> 
> I'm glad I didn't jump ship.


Lets see....No Yes Network...ever
MSG Pulled
I live on NYC and this would pose a problem

no MLB Channel, nor the MLB PPV packages
Some of the ESPN channels relegated to SD that were once in HD
No NFL Sunday Ticket package..

While the FOX issue was resolved ...but it lurked like a fart that took while to get wind of the whiff..heh heh thats about as close of an example I could give about what could of happened on 11/1 to Fox on E*

Im glad I have D* with its no promise or future of anymore HD's ...They've fulfilled my sports fix...I give thanks back in 2005 when I left Time Warner for satellite and went to D*...and never dealt with E*...in fact the YES channel absent was a reason I never got DISH-N...All I've had issue with on D* was the VS channel dispute and the dwindle down additions of more HD after the wave from this past summer..

I am also fortunate that my satellite dish is on a rooftop...not bolted outside a window...so 6 floors up facing the Hudson...I am the 1st one to say rain SELDOMLY knocks my signal out.

good luck going fwd fellow E* subscribers...


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## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

Santi360HD said:


> Lets see....No Yes Network...ever
> MSG Pulled
> I live on NYC and this would pose a problem
> 
> ...


Lots of words to "Justify" the position on the Direct side.......like I said....
Originally Posted by 356B 
Hey all you dishTV deserters......:new_smili who... oh by the way, payed the (get me out of here money) reach:........how's that working out for ya......?:icon_da:

:icon_band


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## GrumpyBear (Feb 1, 2006)

Santi360HD said:


> good luck going fwd fellow E* subscribers...


If you need your Baseball, and feel like spending $400-$500+ a year, on NFL and MLB, Direct is your only choice. Personally, I have better things to spend $400-$500+ a year on, than just 2 sports packages.

I prefer Dish with its More HD channels in its National Packages and in the Platinum package, vs having to spend $100's more a year on extra's add-on packages, to get HD channels.

Dish has done a great job of making the Platinum package worth while, and as a addon to the AT200 and AT250 just have more watchable HD channels. Throw in, the Multisports package with NFL Redzone included, adding in Netflix, saving lots of money, and getting more, channels in general and more HD channels overall. Had friends over today, who thought FoxMo was a HD channel, had to explain it was just SD, they were sure Dish had FoxMo in HD, as it looked so much better, than what they were used to seeing on thier Direct SD version, granted all the SD versions look better on Dish than Direct, and still lots of SD channels out there, with shows we all watch here. I have been streaming any NFL football game to my TV for 2 years now, and it only costs me a $1 a game, sure beats $300 this year, and over $400 in Years past, to watch NFL games in HD.

Granted my ViP722k's and my old trusty Vip622 have really kept me loyal, over the years. Being able to record 4 HD channels at the sametime, really cuts down on how many recievers I need. Single push of the remote, by default I see only channels I get, no adds in the guides, never had to time any of my DVR's by the second hand of my watch, waiting for them to do something. DVR's that understand that NOT everything has to be a recording, and have Autotune as a super useful feature. PiP, what in the world is the use of having the option to watch several games at the sametime without PiP? DLB that works automatically, don't have to push any extra buttons to turn it on, nor do I have to worry about turning DLB on everyday, DLB just works. DVR's that understand that family life is a busy life and when a show is buffered, its supposed to stay buffered, no accidental channel changes and wiping out the buffer accidently. Have over 8 TB's of storarge for my DVR's, makes for everybody having thier own personal 2TB DVR. Nothing better than having a remote that is actually clearly labled, for all the different features and having a single button that does what its supposed to do, vs having to press this button plus that button or to have to press one button twice to get a feature to work.

Glad you like Direct. I am very happy Dish, saving hundreds a year, and getting more, with better equipment, with more features.


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## Santi360HD (Oct 6, 2008)

If that floats your boat I'm happy that your enjoying the fruit said service offers. I do not have the Baseball PPV or Sunday Ticket to my service (When I joined in 2005 originally I took Sunday Ticket subscription) and yes there are quite a few more HD's that DISH has but not alot that roll me at night wondering if the summer channel add-ons (from the rocket launch earlier) was all for naught.. Anyone's SD beats Directv's butchering of it...as for DVR's dont get me started I HAVE NEVER HAD ONE with Directv...I had such a bad taste from the years I had Time Warner's DVR that I simply have the HD NON DVR box...and have no plans to get any DVR anytime soon...nor do I care what they can now do...ive seen posts here about both provider's DVR's either having phantom recordings or problems with the HDD gee it sure sounds alot like what i went thru in my end of days with Time Warner Cable, never going thru that again...awesome that my NON DVR HD box has had ZERO issues since i got it in 2005.

In addition boasting about beating the system by (VERY LIKELY) illegally getting NFL games for a buck (KEY WORD BEING if they're Illegal)...Well chip chip cherrrio to you for that piece of insight...I mean we've all done stuff however, that was something you could of kept under your hat...Would i try to find it on my own? probably not dont want my IP associated with all that stuff...I know people with cablevision and comcast that had to pay for the music they've downloaded when they've gotten letters from their providers...if theres ways around that now too...I dont care to know..and as for my IP yes I still have Time Warner's internet..i have a stripped down cable price of about $64 bucks to just SOLELY have the Cable Modem...and on the other TV's in my house cable line directly to the back of the TV...There are a few HD channels I can get as an alternate should any weather knock my dish out...

each provider has its plusses & minuses...Dish was not my cup of Tea...D* has my sports fix and E* does not...and Im in a (Kid listening to his mom when he/she says *ALRIGHT ALREADY*) kind of attitude when i say im satisfied..Could D* give more HD choices..absoletly and so can E* you guys arent pristene by a long shot with your lineup either..

Game on to all E* people....best of luck the rest of the way...


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## mnassour (Apr 23, 2002)

Excellent AP article this morning on the background on all this from TV Newscheck:
Good info in the article on why Dish caved...

http://www.tvnewscheck.com/article/2010/10/31/46648/broadcasters-keep-upper-hand-in-disputes



> retrans wars
> Broadcasters Keep Upper Hand In Disputes
> By Ryan Nakashima
> Associated Press, October 31, 2010 9:27 PM EDT
> ...


Full article from link.....


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## KalebD (May 8, 2007)

next, Disney HD cannels. Who's with me? :hurah:


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

KalebD said:


> next, Disney HD cannels. Who's with me? :hurah:


I figured MSG was next.


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## R DAVIS (Sep 30, 2008)

James Long said:


> When DISH adds 24/7 HD RSNs next year I'm sure someone will say "see, Fox won, they got their channels 24/7" despite it being a goal already announced by DISH. Yes, DISH and Fox (and the other RSNs) will need to have an agreement that allows 24/7 carriage - but the goal was already expressed. When it happens it will be just another example of programmers working with carriers to get a feed carried. Not a "victory".


Any idea if or when, Dish will actually start carrying all the Fox Sports Network programming in HD ? Is any actual date being discussed ?

I subscribe to Center Ice, and about half of the Dallas Stars games are not carried in HD, even though they ARE being broadcast in HD, and many cable companies and Direct TV are carrying them. The same is true of the Rangers and Astros games on Fox Sports SW and Fox Sports Houston. These games look just terrible in SD on my 42 inch DLP screen.

Also, when if ever will Dish quit broadcasting in SD ? It would no doubt require new receivers for those who have only SD receivers, but I would think Dish would make a special deal, or maybe even a converter box available ? It just seems to me to be a real waste of bandwidth and or transponders to continue the SD transmissions in the long term.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

My guess is that there are more SD subscribers than HD subscribers. If they planned to drop SD anytime soon every receiver installed would be mpeg4 capable.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

R DAVIS said:


> Any idea if or when, Dish will actually start carrying all the Fox Sports Network programming in HD ? Is any actual date being discussed ?


No hard date or even quarter was announced. It could be any time within the next few months (or not).



> I subscribe to Center Ice, and about half of the Dallas Stars games are not carried in HD, even though they ARE being broadcast in HD, and many cable companies and Direct TV are carrying them.


The rumor is that DISH only contracted to carry a certain number of games from each carrier ... not all games that each carrier had. DISH has only set aside roo for 12 HD games at a time. I have not seen all feeds in use in a while.

One thing for sure. It can only get better.



> Also, when if ever will Dish quit broadcasting in SD ? It would no doubt require new receivers for those who have only SD receivers, but I would think Dish would make a special deal, or maybe even a converter box available ? It just seems to me to be a real waste of bandwidth and or transponders to continue the SD transmissions in the long term.


The "converter box" would be replacing several million SD receivers with HD receivers. The first step would be to stop placing SD receivers. DISH still has not taken that first step (although many markets are "Eastern Arc" and all HD equipment has been provided regardless of subscription to HD).

It will cost DISH billions of dollars to change out all the receivers. They are not in a position to do that in one fell swoop. I would like to see them start by no longer placing SD equipment. (Step 2 would be to no longer activate SD equipment not placed by DISH.)


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

KalebD said:


> next, Disney HD cannels. Who's with me? :hurah:


Not me. If anything has been shown, it is that Disney's channels in HD aren't important to very many. The howling was relatively quiet and short lived.

I think people finally realized that the kids don't care if the 'mouse' is in HD as long as it is on at all.

Frankly I'll be surprised if Disney gets anything for their HD when the SD contract comes up.


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## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

lparsons21 said:


> Not me. If anything has been shown, it is that Disney's channels in HD aren't important to very many. The howling was relatively quiet and short lived.
> 
> I think people finally realized that the kids don't care if the 'mouse' is in HD as long as it is on at all.
> 
> Frankly I'll be surprised if Disney gets anything for their HD when the SD contract comes up.


I agree, little kids are the watchers, :balloons: The Disney Channel could be considered a quasi baby sitter in some homes.....:new_popco HD in most cases is not the issue.... the number of responses seem to bare that out........who cares.......!pepsi!

:icon_band


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## GrumpyBear (Feb 1, 2006)

356B said:


> I agree, little kids are the watchers, :balloons: The Disney Channel could be considered a quasi baby sitter in some homes.....:new_popco HD in most cases is not the issue.... the number of responses seem to bare that out........who cares.......!pepsi!
> 
> :icon_band


Except for the HD only people, haven't seen many people asking for or complaining about those Disney and ABC Family channels.

HD only people, its kind of understandable, that they would want them back, as they don't get them period. For me, no kids in that age group, thier late evening shows, look as good in SD as they did in HD, as Disney and ABC Family were HORRIBLE waste of bandwidth for HD.

I would prefer to see all the FOX Sports go 24/7 HD before those channels. AS the Fox Sports channels have actually HD worth watching, and you have to pay for the Multisports package seperatly, vs having it forced upon everybody.


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## jerbear4 (Dec 19, 2005)

This post is for the nay sayers to my post about the Fox VS Dish dispute that stated this would be the downfall of dish. Well, I see dish is still here. Plus someone stated that my post was not fair because I was comparing apples to oranges because I compared VS with RS networks. Well the sad thing is that most of the Regional Channels are blacked out and I don't watch any of these but Fox Sports Pittsburgh and could care less about the rest of the channels as I think most others care less about them as well. I actually think now that people subscribe to the Multi Sports channel package for the Redzone Channel. I know I do and will drop those RS nets in a hot minute as soon as football season is over this year. I do know that some people were not happy when directv pulled The VS Channel due to the hockey fan base it served and does not black out most of the games that I know. So apples and oranges I think not for VS is a very good channel if you like hockey. As I said these disputes mostly get settled for there is too much at risk for both parties.


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## Curtis0620 (Apr 22, 2002)

http://www.mediabiz.com/news/skyreport/?edit_id=15076


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

I find this one of more interest no more G4 on DirecTV?

http://www.mediabiz.com/news/skyreport/?edit_id=15075

Another channel that Dish Network will have.


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## WingNut (Sep 18, 2006)

356B said:


> Hey all you dishTV deserters......:ringo: who... oh by the way, payed the (get me out of here money) :barf:........how's that working out for ya......? :icon_da:
> 
> :icon_band


I didn't pay to leave Dish. Am I still happy I left? yes. Why? Because I don't like being a pawn during these negotiations while I continue to pay for what I'm not getting.

Will I ever come back? Not sure. Depends on what the future holds. But right now I'm happy with D* because of their sports offerings.

Why should one become so attached to their service provider? Seriously...you PAY them every month. Do you also rent friends?


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## WingNut (Sep 18, 2006)

Jhon69 said:


> I find this one of more interest no more G4 on DirecTV?
> 
> http://www.mediabiz.com/news/skyreport/?edit_id=15075
> 
> Another channel that Dish Network will have.


The channel is geared toward teenagers and people that can't leave college in their past. I think I can live w/o it. :lol:


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

G4 is turning into the COPS! channel which is better than gaming but nowhere near what TechTV was.


Don't give a flyin' fig about DizzyHD, FamHD or any other HD for that matter. Just keep my rates down.


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## Curtis0620 (Apr 22, 2002)

Jhon69 said:


> I find this one of more interest no more G4 on DirecTV?
> 
> http://www.mediabiz.com/news/skyreport/?edit_id=15075
> 
> Another channel that Dish Network will have.


Sorry, I don't see where your linked article says anything about the DISH-FOX dispute.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Curtis0620 said:


> http://www.mediabiz.com/news/skyreport/?edit_id=15076


Lumping it in with the Cablevision vs Fox dispute tips the scale. Cablevision has made no secret of their displeasure over the new deal. I suspect they took the full price that Time Warner agreed to and got a "most favored nation" clause so that the next negotiators (for some other provider) can work to get them a better rate. (The same clause they were complaining about TW having.)

DISH vs Fox is being noted as a fair deal. Not in the same ballpark as Cablevision's comments. The LA Times report clearly stated that Fox didn't get everything they asked for. That's called compromise.


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## Michael P (Oct 27, 2004)

Ever since my local FOX RSN (FSN Ohio on 425 - SD) came back on line after the dispute there has been terrible lip sync issues. It's so far out of sync that you hear the voice when the lips are closed and get no voice when the mouths are open. 

I do not get the same problem on the other RSN's, including the 9660's which were still on as of last night.


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## Paul Secic (Dec 16, 2003)

SayWhat? said:


> G4 is turning into the COPS! channel which is better than gaming but nowhere near what TechTV was.
> 
> Don't give a flyin' fig about DizzyHD, FamHD or any other HD for that matter. Just keep my rates down.


TechTV was educational & interesting. G4 is the opposite!


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

Paul Secic said:


> TechTV was educational & interesting. G4 is the opposite!


One person's trash can be another person's treasure.


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

Well, ya' had to know it was coming. Hopefully it will be dismissed outright.



> ATLANTA - Dish Network charged full rates for October though it didn't deliver Fox Sports program that month, customers say in a federal class action.


http://www.courthousenews.com/2010/11/05/DishNet.pdf

We've had that discussion here. You're not guaranteed any certain channels and Dish actually provided more upgraded services during the outage, so if anything, users got more value, not less.

Did we ever determine how much of the monthly bill was for Fox prior to the outage? How much of a rate 'decrease' would have been realistic anyways? $1? $2? Why would a law firm take on a case like this over such small amounts? Doesn't it sound frivolous? Don't law firms research this kind of thing?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

SayWhat? said:


> Did we ever determine how much of the monthly bill was for Fox prior to the outage? How much of a rate 'decrease' would have been realistic anyways? $1? $2? Why would a law firm take on a case like this over such small amounts? Doesn't it sound frivolous? Don't law firms research this kind of thing?


The difference between AT120 and AT120 Plus is $5. AT120 does not include the FoxSports channels (or other RSNs). AT120 Plus does.

However ... the price of Multi-Sport is $7 per month. Every subscriber who lost a FoxSports channel was given access to Multi-Sport. The FX and NatGeo feeds were also replaced. There were customers who already subscribed to the replacement channels but DISH did make an effort to compensate their customers.

Why do law firms take these cases? Because they sue for damages beyond the actual loss and ask for punitive damages _and_ legal fees. Win a class action lawsuit for $10 million where $5 million goes to the lawfirm and the rest is shared amongst the class at 50c per member. If the firm believes there is a chance THEY will get paid, even in a settlement, they will make the money grab. It isn't about the client(s). It is about the ability to make millions by filing a complaint.


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

> However ... the price of Multi-Sport is $7 per month. Every subscriber who lost a FoxSports channel was given access to Multi-Sport. The FX and NatGeo feeds were also replaced. There were customers who already subscribed to the replacement channels but DISH did make an effort to compensate their customers.


Which is my point. Shouldn't the case be thrown out since Dish did compensate their customers? Shouldn't the law firm have known that before filing the case?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

SayWhat? said:


> Which is my point. Shouldn't the case be thrown out since Dish did compensate their customers? Shouldn't the law firm have known that before filing the case?


Perhaps it will, perhaps it won't. At this point I'd expect it to be thrown out as most members of "the class" don't care and the programming was restored. Other than the subscribers to "AT120+" no one contracts for FS South or any other specific sports channel. The contract for delivery of a package of channels. (AT120+ is special as the only difference between it and AT120 is the local RSN.)

The law firm will spend a minimal amount of time on it and hope for a return. Win some, lose some and occasionally get paid to go away. DISH also has decent lawyers so perhaps the firm should have passed on this case. But it only costs them a few hours and a filing fee to try.


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