# Dish Customer Service regarding Hopper installation fees



## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Sorry if this is a redundant thread, I have lost the references to other similar threads each time I've tried to post. 

I found this forum after being quoted a $300 installation fee for Hopper. I was wondering if anyone else was feeling a bit unhappy about being an existing customer and being charged for services provided for free for new accounts.

What I discovered is that the fee structure for existing customers is completely arbitrary, so I called back to speak to another agent, only to be told that I should be happy that Dish gave me free equipment when I signed up, and that I have had two late payments anyway, so what would I expect. I was very insulted by this agent and his manner of speaking to me, so I hung up.

A minute later I received a call from a Sergio Portillo who told me that he was wanting to get my feedback on the previous conversation, which from me is basically that I am unhappy with Dish's arbitrary fees for Hopper installation and that it doesn't make an unhappy customer happy to be told off. Sergio replied by telling me off further, even to the extent of telling me that he could drop the fee for me, but that he wouldn't, because he's a good business man and he has to make a profit.

Naturally, I mentioned to Sergio that his response was hardly making me feel any better, and that I wholeheartedly dispute his notion of himself as a business man or business owner acting in an appropriate manner. Sergio then hung up on me. 

When I called back, I asked the new agent Lila to kindly connect me to a supervisor, since at this point my issue has escalated from being an unhappy customer due to arbitrary fee structures to being an angry customer over arrogant and abusive customer service agents. I asked Lila to not make me repeat the entire situation, but to forward me to a supervisor, but she continued to query me, after which she said "don't worry about it" and claimed to be transferring me to a supervisor. I mentioned to Lila that "don't worry about it" isn't the best thing to say to an unhappy and angry customer. Then I waited and waited and waited for a supervisor, but never connected to one within a vaguely reasonable amount of time. 

Considering that Sergio was on the line in one minute after my original unhappy call, I feel a bit suspicious, and of course, additionally unhappy and angry about the wait time.

So now I am here venting in hopes that Dish catches the drift, that it's not a great idea to alienate existing customers in the quest for new customers, and that it makes no sense to give something away to some when you can admittedly give it away to others, but simply don't choose to in certain instances.

At this point, is it worth it to me to cancel Dish and pay an early termination fee? I'm seriously considering it. There are some things that you can't put a price on, and one's self-respect is one of those. I'm quite sure that I'm not alone in that sentiment.


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## garys (Nov 4, 2005)

Anyone except someone who works for Dish can only make speculation as to who is charged and why. Best if you try to PM a DIRT member here. They are Dish employees and can check your account as well as set up upgrade for you. You may not be allow to PM with only one post thus far, but a DIRT member will contact you when they see your post.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

That is ongoing complain about unfair (in upgrade prices) for existing customers vs new.
Unfortunately, all the 1000s posts went nowhere and the company is not changed the policies.

You are 'on hook' for 2 years contract.
Your options are same as for anyone in same position and didn't changes for long time.


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## [email protected] Network (Jul 21, 2011)

I can understand the frustration you have with the experience that you received. I have sent you a PM.


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## SJ HART (Feb 12, 2003)

"[email protected] Network" said:


> I can understand the frustration you have with the experience that you received. I have sent you a PM.


Being a DISH customer since 1997, I was also taken back that I had to pay for the upgrade vs. NEW customers. SJ


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## smbsocal (Dec 16, 2008)

Yes it is annoying that the special deals are for new customers only. Then again every other company has the exact same policy; cable, satellite, wireless providers, etc.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Except of course, the wireless providers don't have that same arrangement. Cable/Sat do though.


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## RasputinAXP (Jan 23, 2008)

The price you pay is also based on your credit score and your 'prompt payment history'.

In my case, I paid $99.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

RasputinAXP said:


> The price you pay is also based on your credit score and your 'prompt payment history'.
> 
> In my case, I paid $99.


Actually, it's completely arbitrary. As Mr. Portillo told me, he has the discretion to charge or not, and determine what the charges will be. He told me that he could give me the install for free, but that he wasn't going to, because he is a good business man.

Totally ridiculous policies, and really not such a smart thing to tell a customer.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

And...the reason I had two late payments is that I was set up for autopay, and didn't realize right away that Dish for some reason had stopped automatically billing me. As soon as I realized, I went back in and reset the option.

More ridiculousness.


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## RasputinAXP (Jan 23, 2008)

In Dish's case, it's not arbitrary. It's definitely your payment history and credit. 

I'm edging toward thinking that this guy is a reseller, not with Dish Network corporate. They don't generally behave in that manner. Resellers do, though.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

RasputinAXP said:


> In Dish's case, it's not arbitrary. It's definitely your payment history and credit.
> 
> I'm edging toward thinking that this guy is a reseller, not with Dish Network corporate. They don't generally behave in that manner. Resellers do, though.


How would I reach a reseller by calling the Dish customer service number from their website?

There's nothing wrong with my credit.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

I just called the number that was on my caller ID from Sergio Portilla, and was assured I had reached Dish corporate, and could not reach any resellers at that number.


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## RasputinAXP (Jan 23, 2008)

"ScarlettRuby" said:


> I just called the number that was on my caller ID from Sergio Portilla, and was assured I had reached Dish corporate, and could not reach any resellers at that number.


Have you messaged Ray yet?


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## [email protected] Network (Jul 21, 2011)

ScarlettRuby has contacted me and I am assisting them through private messages.


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## hahler2 (Sep 19, 2006)

I won't speak to Dish's upgrade policy but to be talked down to like that by a customer service rep is inexcusable. Regardless of the circumstances. I can understand why the OP was so upset and I don't blame him for considering terminating services. I know I probably would in his shoes.


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## col3rsc (Jun 23, 2012)

I called Dish today about upgrading and at first I was told $99 and 2 minutes later the price was $200. I only have 2 TVs and to give me one price and then change it to another is not good business. I've never been late, I use automatic billing.


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

For those who wish to purchase and have no 24 month commitment you can purchase your equipment here:

http://www.dishdepot.com/

This so far has been the cheapest price I have found.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

I don't know why Rasputin is claiming that the pricing isn't arbitrary. I'm reading posts in other forums by customers who are having the same problem I am. They get quoted one price initially, then it changes, even two or three times. 

What is Dish thinking?

I hope Raymond listens to the tapes of my conversations. Assuming Raymond has any influence or power and the concern to address these problems. 

It would be interesting for me to know why Mr. Portillo called me back after I'd hung up. He clearly had nothing new to add other than further insults and ridiculousness. Maybe he was on the mood for a pile-on.

One of the agents I spoke to told me that the cost to purchase the equipment was something like $1200, btw. I see from my research that that figure is a complete lie also.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Dealing with DISH directly (with Ray in this case) is the best option.

It is mind boggling why some customers seem to have a ton of problems while others do not. The fee structure may seem arbitrary to you, and to the "others" you refer to, but there is method behind the madness and not everyone is willing to admit that they are not quite the good customer that they claim to be on Internet forums.

You mentioned you had a couple of late payments ... and I'm not going to get into an argument over the rest of your financial history. Ray can do that via DISH's records and see why the red flags were raised.

As far as the $1200 price ... manufacture list price is that high. You could get a better deal through a reseller such as Solid Signal (except you would have to buy the nodes, and dish upgrade needed and do the install yourself). While $300 is more than the $99 people with a good payment history, good credit and no other issues are paying it is certainly less than the full retail price of the equipment and the cost of installation.


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## Jhon69 (Mar 28, 2006)

ScarlettRuby said:


> I don't know why Rasputin is claiming that the pricing isn't arbitrary. I'm reading posts in other forums by customers who are having the same problem I am. They get quoted one price initially, then it changes, even two or three times.
> 
> What is Dish thinking?
> 
> ...


What would interesting to see is where would that $1200.go(in somebody's back pocket?) that's almost 3 times what DishDepot sells their single Hopper with 1 Joey system for,but I don't know what kind of system you want,or talking about.

You could call and see what DISH would do if you bought your system,it used to be if you bought your system and had the DISH Service Plan on your DISH account DISH would install it for $15.
Good Luck!.

P.S. If that too expensive check into getting a VIP922 with the MT2,Dual Over The Air Tuners Module(if you have an outside antenna),or if that's too much get the VIP722k/wMT2 and 211ks in your other rooms.

That's what I use,the VIP922/wMT2 & 3-211ks.


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## coldsteel (Mar 29, 2007)

ScarlettRuby said:


> One of the agents I spoke to told me that the cost to purchase the equipment was something like $1200, btw. I see from my research that that figure is a complete lie also.


That's the price point in the Dish billing system for a 2-Hopper system. Sounds like you are looking at online retailers/wholesalers that are, for some reason, killing their profit margin by offering the equipment cheaper than MSRP. YMMV with quality/support however.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

coldsteel said:


> That's the price point in the Dish billing system for a 2-Hopper system. Sounds like you are looking at online retailers/wholesalers that are, for some reason, killing their profit margin by offering the equipment cheaper than MSRP. YMMV with quality/support however.


Actually that makes sense .. ScarlettRuby has not detailed the system that she wants. A two hopper deal even with the best credit and payment history can easily be $300 ($99 upgrade plus $199 for second hopper).


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

> that it's not a great idea to alienate existing customers in the quest for new customers, and that it makes no sense to give something away to some when you can admittedly give it away to others, but simply don't choose to in certain instances.


It makes perfect sense.
Theres a thing called cost of acquisition or subscriber acquisition cost, or SAC or how ever you choose to call it but it exists. For Dish pre-hopper era it was in the 700-800$ range per customer. This is the investment Dish makes in a customer to get them, despite the customer paying an average of 70$ a month due to the way accounting handles money it takes most customers around 4 years to pay off the SAC, assuming they havent gotten any other upgrades, credits or freebies in those 4 years.

So when it comes to new things like receivers and equipment Dish takes there investment in you as a customer and your history with them into account.

Lets pretend you loaned a friend 700$ and you guys made a deal to pay it off over the course of 4 years. The friend was late here and there. At the end of year 2 he comes back to you and asks for 300$. Given the amount you already loaned him and the billing history with him would you readily loan him some more money?

Silly amounts of money/years aside thats exactly what Dish looks at when considering giving customers free or reduced upgrades (atleast in the sense of a DIU upgrade for pre-hopper era Receivers).

Its not arbitrary, its not random its math. This is why some customers get some things cheaper/free and why some others have to pay full price, toss in credit score into the mix and it just becomes even more confusing to those not in the know.



> Actually, it's completely arbitrary. As Mr. Portillo told me, he has the discretion to charge or not, and determine what the charges will be. He told me that he could give me the install for free, but that he wasn't going to, because he is a good business man.


He more then most likely just chose the wrong wording. Its not that he had the discretion to not charge you. He probably just the ability to credit back the charge 



> And...the reason I had two late payments is that I was set up for autopay, and didn't realize right away that Dish for some reason had stopped automatically billing me. As soon as I realized, I went back in and reset the option.
> 
> More ridiculousness.


Doesnt matter why it was late. All that matters is that it WAS late. Theres not somebody in some back office looking for late/overdue accounts and flagging them to not get a cheaper upgrade. Its all run through filters and queries by the system and is flagged automatically. All the system sees is 0's and 1's unfortunately.
Though to be fair the discretion to look the other way is still there for any supervisor level agent or above.

Honestly. I wouldnt trust serge  
He was either a national Quality Assurance agent who happened to be listening to that agents call and realized it was a train wreck, thus the call back.

Orrrr he was the agents supervisor who happened to be instant messaging with the agent while you had the first conversation and probably tried to do a call back to save the agent from getting a 1 in the customer survey, and ultimately failed lol.

My moneys on the latter.

And lastly, I wouldnt bash the Lila agent myself.
Finding a supervisor isnt that simple its not like theres a 1:1 supervisor to agent ratio at the call centers. I recall having to get up from my desk and look all over the call floor for help when I was first starting out in the call center game a few years back. Sometimes there just isnt anyone around, though Lila should have gotten back in touch with you and given you a heads up. Thats just common courtesy.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

James Long said:


> Dealing with DISH directly (with Ray in this case) is the best option.
> 
> It is mind boggling why some customers seem to have a ton of problems while others do not.


Correct, and that's the issue being addressed here. The unequal and arbitrary treatment of customers.



> The fee structure may seem arbitrary to you, and to the "others" you refer to, but there is method behind the madness and not everyone is willing to admit that they are not quite the good customer that they claim to be on Internet forums.


James Long, the notion that I should agree that I'm not such a great customer rather than expect to be treated the same as other customers who may or may not be just as flawed and defective as I am, is ludicrous.

Do you work for Dish? If so, it's this kind of short-sighted, insulting and hostile attitude that is being addressed here.

Your post is as ridiculous as Dish's customer service practices, which is arbitrary by their own admission. Although, if you have some evidence that it's not, it would be very nice to have that clarity in the form of a statement from Dish.



> You mentioned you had a couple of late payments ... and I'm not going to get into an argument over the rest of your financial history. Ray can do that via DISH's records and see why the red flags were raised.


If "red flags were raised, by didn't anyone at Dish mention that? If my credit is an issue, why didn't anyone state that? More to the point, why are you making excuses for Dish at the expense of a customer whose credit worthiness you are willing to impune without evidence?



> As far as the $1200 price ... manufacture list price is that high. You could get a better deal through a reseller such as Solid Signal (except you would have to buy the nodes, and dish upgrade needed and do the install yourself). While $300 is more than the $99 people with a good payment history, good credit and no other issues are paying it is certainly less than the full retail price of the equipment and the cost of installation.


You seem to be making a case to support your own theories about the arbitrary nature of the costs associated with Hopper installation, rather than dealing in fact. What dog do you have in this hunt, I'm wondering? Maybe just the idea that some people are better people and therefore more deserving because they've never had a late payment? Something like that?

Another theory that has as much substantiation as you have provided is that the Dish customer service agents are encouraged to charge as much as possible for the Hopper. That would explain why one of them told me that he was a business owner wanting to make a profit, rather than telling me that I didn't pass muster for a free or less expensive installation on the basis of my late payments or credit record, as you claim.

If you have evidence or proof of Dish's policy in this regard, why not share it?


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

James Long said:


> Actually that makes sense .. ScarlettRuby has not detailed the system that she wants. A two hopper deal even with the best credit and payment history can easily be $300 ($99 upgrade plus $199 for second hopper).


I thought the "fact" that I am an unworthy negligent delinquent and/or have bad credit is the reason for the excessive charges.

Now it's because I ordered more equipment and didn't say so?

Again, why the attitude? I'm trying to get an issue resolved here, and you seem to be determined to prove that I was not treated in an arbitrary or insulting manner by Dish. How come?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

I don't work for DISH, I've just been here for nine years and have read a lot of stories from people who seem to drop in and complain about issues that most subscribers just don't have.

Would you mind answering the question of what equipment you were looking for? One hopper? Two hoppers? It would make it easier to figure out if the offer you received was fair if we knew what you wanted.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

Were not trying to hunt anyone down or what have you we are just using known facts about the system.
Its not random at all. Dish doesnt just sit there and play any many miny moe with prices and customers.

New customers get it free because its the most logical choice. Dish hasnt made an investment in these customers yet so its logical for them to invest the best in them right off the bat, rather then investing in giving them a 722k receiver then investing in them again 2 years down the road and giving them something free *again*.

From that point out as a customer what you can get largely depends on 2 things.
Your credit score (when you first signed up with Dish).
And your billing history. 

Your credit score determines the type of account you get stuck with, which determines eligibility for freebies right off the bat (i.e .you can possibly get stuck with a flex account that gets 0 freebies due to bad credit).

And your billing history with Dish determines how willing Dish may be inclined to re-up on there investment in keeping you as a customer beyond there SAC in you. 

Its because of these 2 things primarily (there is much more to take into account by the way, were just scratching the surface), that we see so many different scenarios play out between customers. Some get nothing free at all, the flex guys pay MSRP for pretty much everything. 
Some customers get it reduced, some dont. Thats just the way it is and it entirely depends on the customer and not some fathomed CSR roulette or luck of the draw.

Proof for all this :
Most of us cant, most members here are just long time customers and some of us (like myself) are former employees of both Dtv and Dish. And undoubtedly wouldnt be employeed very long if we did go providing proof anyway (screen caps, videos of training on Subscriber Acquisition Costs. , ect.) 



TL;DR. 
Its not arbritrary, the prices arent just made up, each customer potentially sees a different price Dependant on there status with Dish.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Inkosaurus said:


> Its because of these 2 things primarily (there is much more to take into account by the way, were just scratching the surface)..........
> 
> .......Its not arbritrary.


Do you know the meaning of the word "arbitrary"?

Did you read the part where Sergio Portillo told me that he had the option to charge me or not?

When I signed up, I didn't pay any special or additional fees. In fact, as I recall a very small amount (like a dollar) due was removed that remained from a previous account. If I am such a bad risk, why would Dish do that for me? Again, the word "arbitrary" comes to mind.

All over the internet people are having the same complaint. One minute it's one price for the Hopper another the next. I suppose I could copy and paste those comments in here, but clearly there is an agenda to just deny that Dish is ARBITRARY in the way they address customer service, so I won't bother.

To James, I asked for one Hopper and one Joey, the basic package. I have two TVs, that's all. But you still haven't explained how that is relevant, considering that you have stated as a fact that the $300 charge is due to me being an unworthy customer because of two late payments, which were actually two failures on Dish's part to successfully auto bill my account as it was set up to do.

And none of these replies address the biggest issue, that being the rude, insulting, and useless customer service reps.

Since some of you seem to know everything, could you explain to me why that Sergio Portillo person called me back within a minute of me hanging up on the original obnoxious rep? Or why he could call me back in one minute, but when I called and requested to speak to a supervisor after Sergio hung up on me, I was left holding for in excess of 10 minutes?

For me the major issue here is what Dish is thinking by their treatment of existing customers. Right now people are dumping cable and satellite in favor of services like Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc. Soon enough, there will be no real reason for anyone to use Dish other than possibly convenience, so what is the point in antagonizing existing customers? It makes no sense to me, and possibly that's because it isn't a logical thing to do. Maybe someone should tell them that, instead of making up excuses and adding to the insults.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

James Long said:


> I don't work for DISH, I've just been here for nine years and have read a lot of stories from people who seem to drop in and complain about issues that most subscribers just don't have.


Right, that's the meaning of "arbitrary". It certainly doesn't prove or even indicate that it's about people being unworthy dogs due to bad credit, as you claim. You seem to be attached to that belief, but I'm wondering why.



> Would you mind answering the question of what equipment you were looking for? One hopper? Two hoppers? It would make it easier to figure out if the offer you received was fair if we knew what you wanted.


In case you missed it in my previous post, it was for the basic Hopper installation of one Hopper and one Joey as offered to new customers at no charge. But why would that be relevant if, as you insist, the charges are due to me being a lowlife credit risk?


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Inkosaurus said:


> Were not trying to hunt anyone down or what have you we are just using known facts about the system.
> Its not random at all. Dish doesnt just sit there and play any many miny moe with prices and customers.


The evidence does not support your assertion, sorry. It may not be Dish's official policy, but it is most definitely the practice of customer service reps. And again, why didn't anyone mention to me that I had to pay this fee because of my credit or 2 late payments?



> New customers get it free because its the most logical choice. Dish hasnt made an investment in these customers yet so its logical for them to invest the best in them right off the bat, rather then investing in giving them a 722k receiver then investing in them again 2 years down the road and giving them something free *again*.


So now Dish is a charity that gives things away to deserving customers? No wonder their customer service is so bad. I wonder how charitable Dish will be to its employees once they've alienated their PAYING customer base.

I am beginning to understand the problem here, the mentality that Dish is doing people a big huge favor, the hugeness of which is dependent on the worthiness of the customer to benefit from the generous largesse of the charitable Dish Network, so we should all be grateful and not complain, particularly those of us who are really unworthy, but still permitted to share in the bounty nevertheless.

Maybe a few years ago, but no longer. Dish better wise up. Consumers really aren't that dumb or that desperate.

As to those of you who share these notions, let me give you a clue. Did you ever hear of the Dot Bomb? Arrogance isn't the way to run a business. You need happy, satisfied customers whose issues are addressed and who are treated with respect, because that is where the money to make the payroll comes from.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

Luckily for you I have already answered some of the questions your asking in my first post in this thread 



you said:


> Since some of you seem to know everything, could you explain to me why that Sergio Portillo person called me back within a minute of me hanging up on the original obnoxious rep? Or why he could call me back in one minute,





me said:


> Honestly. I wouldnt trust serge
> He was either a national Quality Assurance agent who happened to be listening to that agents call and realized it was a train wreck, thus the call back.
> 
> Orrrr he was the agents supervisor who happened to be instant messaging with the agent while you had the first conversation and probably tried to do a call back to save the agent from getting a 1 in the customer survey, and ultimately failed lol.
> ...


My moneys still on the latter by the way.



> Or why he could call me back in one minute, but when I called and requested to speak to a supervisor after Sergio hung up on me, I was left holding for in excess of 10 minutes?





> And lastly, I wouldnt bash the Lila agent myself.
> Finding a supervisor isnt that simple its not like theres a 1:1 supervisor to agent ratio at the call centers. I recall having to get up from my desk and look all over the call floor for help when I was first starting out in the call center game a few years back. Sometimes there just isnt anyone around, though Lila should have gotten back in touch with you and given you a heads up. Thats just common courtesy.





you said:


> Did you read the part where Sergio Portillo told me that he had the option to charge me or not?





me said:


> He more then most likely just chose the wrong wording. Its not that he had the discretion to not charge you. He probably just the ability to credit back the charge


Honestly, for someone who is claiming CSR's are liars/useless/ect. You sure do bank on what Serge said to be true alot. Just sayin 



> When I signed up, I didn't pay any special or additional fees. In fact, as I recall a very small amount (like a dollar) due was removed that remained from a previous account. If I am such a bad risk, why would Dish do that for me? Again, the word "arbitrary" comes to mind.


Because theres such things as gray areas? Thus different amounts for different customers.



> To James, I asked for one Hopper and one Joey, the basic package. I have two TVs, that's all. But you still haven't explained how that is relevant


He brought it up because there is a set up that can be ordered that easily costs 300$ taking into account the reduced prices.



> All over the internet people are having the same complaint. One minute it's one price for the Hopper another the next. I suppose I could copy and paste those comments in here, but clearly there is an agenda to just deny that Dish is ARBITRARY in the way they address customer service, so I won't bother.


All that explains is that a CSR lied and didnt mention the actual price of the equipment, not that Dish just up and changed prices on a whim.
And even then most of those cases are just examples of customers not listening when the agent goes over the 4 minutes worth of text and disclosures they have to read off regarding pricing 

So at best its a case of a bad apple at a call center (shock,horror) or a case of a customer not listening to all of the details.



> And none of these replies address the biggest issue, that being the rude, insulting, and useless customer service reps.


Once again bad apples. Every company regardless of industry has them, its nothing new.



> For me the major issue here is what Dish is thinking by their treatment of existing customers. Right now people are dumping cable and satellite in favor of services like Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc. Soon enough, there will be no real reason for anyone to use Dish other than possibly convenience, so what is the point in antagonizing existing customers? It makes no sense to me, and possibly that's because it isn't a logical thing to do.


lol off topic buttttttt.. Netflix, amazon prime, hulu+ , ect. Will not be cut the cord options for ever, they all use content that was created elsewhere and the more that people flock to them in exchange for dropping Dtv/Dish, the higher there price will increase due to having to create new content  Like a true Democracy its not something that can last for ever 


> Maybe someone should tell them that, instead of making up excuses and adding to the insults.


The difference is you are emotionally invested in this and we are not. We can see it from all angles because at the end of the day were not out 300$. 
If I were in your shoes I would be looking for help, I may not be disputing it left and right but I would be looking for it as well none the less.
Not every answer is one likes to hear.

But yeah definitely not arbitrary or random on the actual pricing of the hopper system.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Inkosaurus said:


> Luckily for you I have already answered some of the questions your asking in my first post in this thread


Sorry I missed them and lost the opportunity to experience your immaturity and rudeness even earlier.



> Honestly, for someone who is claiming CSR's are liars/useless/ect. You sure do bank on what Serge said to be true alot. Just sayin


There's nothing honest about that statement, I never ever used those words, you made them up. What is your game here? You are every bit as obnoxious and arrogant as the customer service reps I am here discussing.



> But yeah definitely not arbitrary or random on the actual pricing of the hopper system.


Which of us is emotionally invested here, since we are now psychoanalyzing and assigning motives?

I truly hope you mature enough to become a half way responsible human being. Your attitude and behavior is destroying this nation and many businesses. If you worked for me I would fire you in a hot new york minute. Just sayin'.

Even though that phrase is old, used up, trite, and childish, just so you know.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

> The evidence does not support your assertion, sorry. It may not be Dish's official policy, but it is most definitely the practice of customer service reps. And again, why didn't anyone mention to me that I had to pay this fee because of my credit or 2 late payments?


Obviously I cant comment on the behalf of the CSR who screwed you over initially buuuut.
From experience working with the same program they used to set up your upgrade I can honestly tell you that when something happens like : a customer not qualifying for the upgrade or a customer not qualifying for it for free, ect. The system does not state the reason. Merely it just states that it isnt going to happen.

Its up to the agent at that point to look at your account and figure it out based on training.
Of course I had to leave Dish back in January so my information could be outdated and it could be possible that the program now states reasons. Though I highly doubt it.



> So now Dish is a charity that gives things away to deserving customers? No wonder their customer service is so bad. I wonder how charitable Dish will be to its employees once they've alienated their PAYING customer base.


Alienated implies that the paying existing customers dont get anything for free. Which is false. 
They dont have to pay full MSRP for receivers in most cases (Dependant on credit/the type of account you get due to your credit score  ). Free Dish movers (again depends on account type). We got Starz free for a year,. We get Free Dish n it ups, Club Dish.
Recently most customers got to take advantage of HBO for half off for 6 months, HD free for life. And quite a bit more.

Really the only thing Existing customers miss out on is that they cant re-up on there first year promotions (the 20$+ off each month , ect). And a free hopper, and even then these both can be negotiated if you have been a great customer.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

I think what I'm learning here is that Dish customer service is run by a gamer/skateboarder/adolescent male petty tyrant mentality. In other words, the absolute worst possible demographic to be interacting from a place of rationality, respect or professionalism.

Which explains everything.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Inkosaurus said:


> Alienated implies that the paying existing customers dont get anything for free. Which is false.


I think you are as confused about the meaning of the word "free" as you are the word "arbitrary".

Your notions of business are reflective of someone who has never been responsible to run a business. No one gives anything away for free and remains in business for very long. Evidently Dish is able to successfully indoctrinate it's naive customer service reps to believe such nonsense, so ultimately the responsibility for the terrible anti-customer attitudes and behaviors is on management.

Young boys or immature people of any description should not be given to believe they are doing people who pay their salaries a huge big favor for providing paid contracted services.

You have truly cleared up a lot of my confusion over what is going on at Dish. The next time I need to speak to anyone there I will most definitely be seeking someone who shows some signs of maturity and basic common sense. I am an optimist, so I believe they must have someone there who meets the requirements for basic customer service, but I could be wrong.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

> There's nothing honest about that statement, *I never ever used those words, you made them up.*


Really?


you said:


> One of the agents I spoke to told me that the cost to purchase the equipment was something like $1200, btw. I see from my research that that figure is a complete *lie* also.





you said:


> And none of these replies address the biggest issue, that being the rude, insulting, and *useless* customer service reps


I also offer screen caps on request if you like 
Though Im sure you will take the bit about me being an avid photoshop user/Digital Artist in my profile and twist it to claim I doctored those images lol.



> Which of us is emotionally invested here, since we are now psychoanalyzing and assigning motives?


Im just pointing out that If I were out 300$ because some punk lied to me I would definitely be emotionally invested in getting to the bottom of it. 
I.e. I was attempting to build a bridge and be civil with you.



> Sorry I missed them and lost the opportunity to experience your immaturity and rudeness even earlier.


Oh gosh wheres my darn kettle and pot image macro when I need it.
I'd bother to address your other insults but considering your insults will be deleted Ill have to choose to take the lazy route and just ignore them 

Now if you excuse me Im going to go skateboard down to my local call center where in I shall fall asleep at my desk and when I awaken I will make sure to inform the unlucky customer that I am the reason this nation shall fall.

edit:



> Your notions of business are reflective of someone who has never been responsible to run a business. No one gives anything away for free and remains in business for very long. Evidently Dish is able to successfully indoctrinate it's naive customer service reps to believe such nonsense, so ultimately the responsibility for the terrible anti-customer attitudes and behaviors is on management.


The notion of "free" has been covered in my first post pointing out the fact that Dish (and DTV) have a SAC that they take into account and they knowingly make that up in the next 4 or so years. The SAC of course is increased if the customer gets anything else after the initial set of freebies. 
You'd do well to read up on some of these things since they are indeed present when it comes to Satellite tv.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Inkosaurus said:


> I was attempting to build a bridge and be civil with you.


I'm sure you believe that, and that's the problem. You couldn't be more rude, snarky or disrespectful if you tried. What do you get out of it?

Do you know that there is a difference between identifying a lie and calling someone a liar?

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see my posts go poof, and your ignorance remain here for celebration. What a huge success for you, huh?

As I said, you've taught me a lot about what is going on at these call centers of late. Information is power. That's something rude, immature little bullies don't know a thing about.

One of my favorite observations in life is how powerless people respond when they suddenly have even the tiniest smidgen of power over another person. I call it Crossing Guard syndrome. You know, those otherwise unemployable nerds and geeks who suddenly get to put on a uniform and lord their power over all the little school kids?

I suppose you take great delight in your little moments of importance, but as a caring adult, let me inform you that all you're doing is holding yourself down with such behavior. The real high in life is in actually accomplishing something to be proud of, and then enjoying the well-deserved respect you earned the old fashioned way. Your petty self-importance as a call center lackey is immensely misplaced.

But again, thank you for the peek inside your mind, it's quite useful to me as I'm sure it would be to others who are seeking some kind of understanding about the horrible experiences we have with call centers, but as you say, one of your important and powerful buddies is likely to send it poofing into the ethers, along with any other information that doesn't support or promote your bad attitude and terrible notions of customer service.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

Yeah keep adjusting that tin foil hat buddy.
I implied your insults would likely be deleted, not the information you provided would be deleted.
Thus why I chose (note the choice of past tense) to not stoop to your level and reply to them in earnest. There Isnt much point considering both of our posts that are off topic would be deleted, with both of us being infracted as well. Ofcourse that doesnt matter to you since you will likely disappear after today, but I will have to deal with that +1 to my warn level 

But lol. If were going to make assumptions about each other based up on these few posts then honestly If you were my boss you would likely be fired by an HR representative due to immature conduct, ect. Then I would go on to let you know that at my time at Dish I got so many 5's in customer survey (5 being the best by the way) that I easily reached my pay for performance goals every month and at one point Due to my high consistent scores I was even chosen to help teach a CSAT blitz class with 2 other trainers 

So not only Dish liked me (and im sure you will use this as a way to insult Dish), But its customers loved me :3

But thats all assuming I would take the time to reply to your posts... Oh wait =/


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Jhon69 said:


> What would interesting to see is where would that $1200.go(in somebody's back pocket?) that's almost 3 times what DishDepot sells their single Hopper with 1 Joey system for,but I don't know what kind of system you want,or talking about.


I honestly think the agent was just toying with me for sport. What hasn't become apparent here, evidently, is that I am a 62 year old grandmother. I believe now, particularly based on the interactions here with other customer service reps that I'm a joke and fair game to these surfboarder/gamer types. Perhaps my command of the English language and level of self-respect is an affront to them.



> Good Luck!.


Thanks!



> P.S. If that too expensive check into getting a VIP922 with the MT2,Dual Over The Air Tuners Module(if you have an outside antenna),or if that's too much get the VIP722k/wMT2 and 211ks in your other rooms.
> 
> That's what I use,the VIP922/wMT2 & 3-211ks.


Honestly, it's not even about the money. I was fully prepared to pay the fee, but it's my practice to do a little research before committing to anything, so when I discovered this inconsistency in pricing, I challenged it.

This isn't about money for me, it's the principle of how Dish treats its customers. But, I am catching the drift as to why that is, so this has been a valuable exercise for me.

Thank you very much for your kind suggestions, I will certainly consider them. I'm not really the type to install my own equipment, that's the problem. I was hoping for a friendly and stress-free encounter with a helpful Dish staff who would get the job done.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

ScarlettRuby said:


> Do you know the meaning of the word "arbitrary"?


Sure ... but at this point, do you know the meaning of the word "arbitrary"? You and others not understanding DISH's pricing does not make it arbitrary.

DISH has published their prices for new customers with good credit and payment history ... and placed a disclaimer for those prices on their advertisements.



> All over the internet people are having the same complaint. One minute it's one price for the Hopper another the next.


I'm not concerned with "all over the internet". It is easy for people to complain loud and wide without accountability. Here we try to understand the issues customers report ... not just slander the company and employees (and anyone who disagrees with the report).



> To James, I asked for one Hopper and one Joey, the basic package. I have two TVs, that's all. But you still haven't explained how that is relevant,


It is relevant because it helps determine what a "normal" customer would pay for the equipment. A normal customer wishing to upgrade to two hoppers would pay $300. Since you had failed to reveal what your desired upgrade was it was POSSIBLE that you were asking for more than one hopper and the price you were being quoted was normal.



> ... considering that you have stated as a fact that the $300 charge is due to me being an unworthy customer because of two late payments, which were actually two failures on Dish's part to successfully auto bill my account as it was set up to do.


People with poor payment history have seen higher charges. No judgement by me or others here, just the reported facts. There may be something else in your account history that you have not revealed that is affecting that price.



> And none of these replies address the biggest issue, that being the rude, insulting, and useless customer service reps.


Everyone has a bad day ... and sometimes being faced with a rude, insulting customer it is hard to smile through the phone and apologize for the customer's problems.



> Or why he could call me back in one minute, but when I called and requested to speak to a supervisor after Sergio hung up on me, I was left holding for in excess of 10 minutes?


People are available when they are available. Perhaps the supervisor you were on hold for was busy helping another customer? Would you accept that you are not the only customer who called DISH network on that day?



> Soon enough, there will be no real reason for anyone to use Dish other than possibly convenience, so what is the point in antagonizing existing customers? It makes no sense to me, and possibly that's because it isn't a logical thing to do. Maybe someone should tell them that, instead of making up excuses and adding to the insults.


They understand ... and they really don't have to explain it to you in a way you understand.

Probably the truest words you have written in this thread is "It makes no sense to me". If you're unwilling to listen to explanations it never will.

Hopefully Ray will solve this to your satisfaction. I wish him luck.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

ScarlettRuby said:


> What hasn't become apparent here, evidently, is that I am a 62 year old grandmother.


We only know what you reveal ... and while we found out about your two missed payments early on, it has taken a while to find out exactly what system you were looking for (one Hopper and one Joey were not specified until recently) and your age (which may explain your attitude and insults directed toward young people).

Which reminds me ... we've allowed some leeway in this thread to allow you to vent - but it is time to reign it in and get away from insults and name calling.

Yes, you're frustrated ... but lets keep the rest of this thread civil.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

James Long said:


> Sure ... but at this point, do you know the meaning of the word "arbitrary"? You and others not understanding DISH's pricing does not make it arbitrary.


I understand completely, it's arbitrary. Why you are denying that is beyond me.



> DISH has published their prices for new customers with good credit and payment history ... and placed a disclaimer for those prices on their advertisements.


So what? All the rep had to do was tell me that I was being charged a higher fee than other customers and let me decide if that was ok with me or not. Instead he just quoted me that price and I had to do my own research to discover the ARBITRARY treatment. The issue escalated when I called to find out why I was quoted that fee, only to be told that it was discretionary, and that the agent was exercising his discretion because of his great business sense.

You are demonstrating my issue here, which is that when customer service reps are challenged to actually converse, explain things, and act like customer service reps, they get defensive and combative instead.



> I'm not concerned with "all over the internet". It is easy for people to complain loud and wide without accountability. Here we try to understand the issues customers report ... not just slander the company and employees (and anyone who disagrees with the report).


No one is being slandered here, although your continued insults and implications regarding your imaginings about my credit might be construed as such just as easily as you construe my comments to be slanderous. And again, this is the issue, the attitude you demonstrate is unbelievable. Why are you so defensive? And why try to diminish the comments and feedback of others, rather than address it as a real and accurate issue? If paying customers have an issue, it's an issue for the company you are trying to defend. But you are not defending it at all, really, you're just demonstrating the problem. You aren't serving the customer, and you aren't serving Dish. You are serving yourself, and that's not what you are paid to do, I'm quite sure.



> It is relevant because it helps determine what a "normal" customer would pay for the equipment. A normal customer wishing to upgrade to two hoppers would pay $300. Since you had failed to reveal what your desired upgrade was it was POSSIBLE that you were asking for more than one hopper and the price you were being quoted was normal.


And again, you make assumptions, put the blame on me, refer to customers as "normal", which implies that some are "abnormal", etc. Who trained you in customer service? Do you get it that this kind of interaction is not appropriate, helpful, or good business?



> People with poor payment history have seen higher charges. No judgement by me or others here, just the reported facts. There may be something else in your account history that you have not revealed that is affecting that price.


You have implied time and again that I am a defective customer who deserves to be punished for my failure to achieve some ARBITRARY status of perfection. Not good customer service, not even good sense. You are being combative and have been all along. Do you get that? Do you know why? Do you believe there are alternative and far more productive ways to interact with others?



> Everyone has a bad day ... and sometimes being faced with a rude, insulting customer it is hard to smile through the phone and apologize for the customer's problems.


Bad customer service is the problem. Your attitude is reflecting the problem. No one owes it to you to make you feel happy. You are being paid, although not very well, to make PAYING customers happy. What is it about that equation that is confusing to you? If you can't handle angry, upset or even rude customers, you aren't qualified to do the job. If you imagine things about people and seek to punish them for your imaginings, you are doubly not qualified for the job. When you justify those behaviors, you are as unqualified as it gets.



> People are available when they are available. Perhaps the supervisor you were on hold for was busy helping another customer? Would you accept that you are not the only customer who called DISH network on that day?


.

Sure, but the question arose as to why one supervisor managed to call back in less than a minute, yet suddenly no supervisors were available. There is a way to handle long hold times, and that was not employed. Is it Dish's policy to leave customers on hold for extended periods with no notion of how long one is expected to wait? Again, where do you get your notions about customer service? So far all you've shown us is that you think it's about the customer service rep and not the customer.



> They understand ... and they really don't have to explain it to you in a way you understand.


Clearly not. Clearly in your mind the customer service rep doesn't have to do anything they don't feel like doing. I'm getting it loud and clear, and I will definitely be sharing your comments with Dish management, you can be assured of that. At this point, I'm extremely curious to know exactly how Dish reps are trained and what standards you are expected to maintain when addressing paying customers.



> Probably the truest words you have written in this thread is "It makes no sense to me". If you're unwilling to listen to explanations it never will.


As I've stated numerous times, I understand what you are saying completely. Do you understand that your attitudes are not reflective of good customer service by any stretch of the imagination? Do you understand that customer service isn't about customers being insulted, misled, or toyed with? What I don't understand is where you come up with your ideas about customer service, or your own rights and demands vs those of the customers who you are supposed to be serving.



> Hopefully Ray will solve this to your satisfaction. I wish him luck.


No one needs luck to do an effective job. They need the required skills.

But my issue is effectively resolved here. I now understand exactly what happened and why it happened. When I'm finished taking my real and valid complaints to their ultimate conclusion, I will decide whether or not to continue as a Dish customer. Because I can afford to, I will have no problem paying an early termination fee, if that is my decision.

I wish you good luck in advancing beyond a low-paying entry level position that clearly is beyond your comfort level to perform appropriately. In this economy, you either catch the drift and develop useful marketable skills, or you can join the dirty street complainers, demand free stuff and break some windows when you don't get it.

As a productive, contributing and responsible member of society and the business community, I have a pretty good idea of where your attitude is taking you. Do you have a clue?


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

James Long said:


> Which reminds me ... we've allowed some leeway in this thread to allow you to vent - but it is time to reign it in and get away from insults and name calling.


What insults and name calling? Please be specific.



> Yes, you're frustrated ... but lets keep the rest of this thread civil.


Listen James, if you want people to behave in a certain matter, the idea is for you to do the same. I am here because I was not treated with civility by Dish employees. And you are here defending them for some puzzling reason.

I have no clue of your age, just your behavior. And you are correct that it is reflective of the arrogance and inexperience of youth, but you could be my age for all I know. Some people never learn how to behave appropriately. Why you think anyone needs to suffer that behavior in silence though, is beyond me.

How many of your customers do you think are my age or older, by the way? Do you notice your attitude about older people? Do you think it has anything to do with the issues I'm raising here?

FYI, I work happily and productively with young people in business all the time. In fact, not a few who I've worked with have achieved immense success and wealth. None of them shared your attitudes or exhibited your behaviors, however. Your projections are baseless once again.

My comments have been civil. If posters are not welcomed to challenge the status quo here, you should mention that during the registration process. Again, you afford yourself rights and privileges that you do not extend to others. Others who pay your salary, I might add. How smart do you think that is, James?

I see that you claim to be "Working to make it better." Make what better and for whom? How do you see yourself making anything better? I'm curious.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

I am going to pass on a point for point rebuttal of your posts ... but I invite you to count the number of insults you have posted in this thread and the number of names you have called people. It is not a good number.



ScarlettRuby said:


> When I'm finished taking my real and valid complaints to their ultimate conclusion, I will decide whether or not to continue as a Dish customer. Because I can afford to, I will have no problem paying an early termination fee, if that is my decision.


ETFs apply to people who remain under contract ... which implies that you have received equipment or a discount within the past two years. This is another factor that has been reported by people not getting the $99 price.

When you first called DISH they looked at your account and made a determination based on account history and other factors. Any customer with the same factors would have been offered that price. They offered you a price ... you did not like that price. Perhaps out of "good will" the company would reduce that price ... "good will" can certainly be a factor.

If DISH were to somehow reduce your charge to $99 would you come back to this thread and thank them or would you continue complaining about the poor customer service?



 ScarlettRuby said:


> How many of your customers do you think are my age or older, by the way?


I have already stated that I do not work for DISH. I cannot make the statement any clearer.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

James Long said:


> I am going to pass on a point for point rebuttal of your posts ... but I invite you to count the number of insults you have posted in this thread and the number of names you have called people. It is not a good number.


I haven't called anyone names, that's why you can't produce any. Nor can you produce any insults, particularly if we are operating under the rules you and your fellow regulars here have set for yourselves. If you dispute anything I've said about you that is based on what is actually occurring here, you are free to do so. Claiming that I called you names and insulted you without citation is just more childishness. It's also not reflective of the kind of qualities required in an appropriate and effective customer service rep. I believe you are looking for an excuse to delete these posts, to be honest.



> ETFs apply to people who remain under contract ... which implies that you have received equipment or a discount within the past two years. This is another factor that has been reported by people not getting the $99 price.[/quote}
> 
> And again, you assume things. Have you ever heard of anyone renewing a contract for any reason? Why do you assume things?
> 
> ...


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Companies use very complex algorithms to place values on customers. There are policies that will dictate how and what to offer said customers. Clearly DISH has determined that at this time you are not valuable enough to offer something that someone else, with a higher value, received. These values can change as often as the companies feel like having them update. 

You're use of arbitrary is implying that they're asserting authority over you unfairly in your eyes. Companies will never post what makes people more valuable or not because it would give their competition insights into marketing and retention strategies.

Any company that provides discounts will have the same complaints as you're posting and it's for a very simple reason. We all think we're more valuable than we sometimes are to companies. 

The bottom line is that if you don't think that it's fair to you then make a choice to accept it, decline their offer while staying a customer or decline their offer and go elsewhere.

There are very smart people who run these companies and they make decisions daily that they know some people will not like but in the end it will be more beneficial to the company in the long run.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

> I have already stated that I do not work for DISH. I cannot make the statement any clearer.


Since you are speaking for Dish and defending their practices, I am speaking to you as though you are an employee for the sake of getting my point across.

Perhaps I am in the wrong place. Is this a corporate website that is here to promote Dish and DirectTV? I thought it was for consumers.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

ScarlettRuby said:


> I haven't called anyone names, ... Claiming that I called you names and insulted you without citation is just more childishness.


I don't even have to leave the post to find an insult/namecalling incident. 



> > ETFs apply to people who remain under contract ... which implies that you have received equipment or a discount within the past two years. This is another factor that has been reported by people not getting the $99 price.
> 
> 
> And again, you assume things. Have you ever heard of anyone renewing a contract for any reason?


OK ... provide the REASON why you would pay an ETF. If it is for receiving equipment or a discount my statement, based on years of reading the comments of DISH customers is true. Are you claiming to have extended your contract without any new equipment or discount?



> As I have stated repeatedly, the price is not the issue and it never was.


Then why did you not agree to the $300 price initially offered?



> I assure you that I will never feel any urge to thank Dish network for anything.


Then there is no win for DISH. They might as well stick with the $300 price that a person in your position (still under contract, two late payments, etc) pays for an upgrade.



ScarlettRuby said:


> Perhaps I am in the wrong place. Is this a corporate website that is here to promote Dish and DirectTV? I thought it was for consumers.


It is for consumers ... and I have been a DISH customer for just over nine years. Most of the people replying to you are DISH customers. We just see DISH in a bigger picture than your incident.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

> I haven't called anyone names, that's why you can't produce any. Nor can you produce any insults, particularly if we are operating under the rules you and your fellow regulars here have set for yourselves. If you dispute anything I've said about you that is based on what is actually occurring here, you are free to do so. Claiming that I called you names and insulted you without citation is just more childishness. It's also not reflective of the kind of qualities required in an appropriate and effective customer service rep. I believe you are looking for an excuse to delete these posts, to be honest.


You threw an insult in this very bit where you dispute the accusation of throwing insults earlier. Hilarious.
If its not clicking, calling people childish, immature and insulting grammar among other things is not an attitude that is praised on this forum nor many others.



> And again, you assume things. Have you ever heard of anyone renewing a contract for any reason? Why do you assume things?


With Dish you cant just renew the contract without doing anything else. For example you cant call in and say "Hey I want 2 more years on my contract please". It doesnt work that way.
In order to get a new contract you have to do a DIU (dish'n'it up, or similar upgrade plan).
At the end of contracts Dish offers the option to let you pay on a month to month basis without ever seeing another contract. 
His assumption is based on this fact.



> So you keep insisting, but on what basis, because you said so? I'm sorry, but your assertions are meaningless to me, given the complete falsehoods you have already stated here that I know for a fact to be incorrect, coupled with ample testimony from others. Your lack of interest in facts doesn't change the facts.


James is actually in the right here.



> If I continued to be treated to attitudes like yours, I would continue to complain. I assure you that I will never feel any urge to thank Dish network for anything. Why should I thank a company for providing the services I pay for? Especially a company whose customer service standards are evidently non-existent?


If I remember correctly Dish beat out Dtv and several other companies in the customer support and service portions of ACI(sp? Honestly forget there name xD) this year.
To be fair this isnt a bragging point for any company though since nearly every one of them got C score averages if i remember correctly and Dish only beat the rest by several points.

The fact still remains though that ALL companies not just Dish have bad apples.
Its silly to assume every encounter with any customer service entity will always yield positive or negative results. In this regard it truly is luck of the draw and if you call in asking for a supervisor immediately you wont get the best results. Its like the restaurant business, you dont screw with the people who handle your food. In this case you dont screw with the people with access to your phone number, address, name, and how much your bill costs. Because eventually you will run into that guy who is about to be fired anyway and doesnt care anymore.

Neither James nor myself are Dish employees (though I once was) and we are merely sharing our insight on the matter. We have no stake in the interest of the company and just post on these boards as a hobby.



> Since you are speaking for Dish and defending their practices


lol there practices.

Dish's training course for CSR is 5 weeks, it covers billing, tech and even to a lesser extent how to install the services. Agents are taking calls usually on there second day in training with the help of OJT navigating the programs for them

After that once there on the floor Dish employs the use of QA agents who monitor and listen to recorded calls and grade the calls accordingly. Each agent gets 4 randomly recorded calls per shift. If you fail enough calls you're fired (and its not many fails before you go kapoot by the way). You can also be fired if your doing average or not well.

On top of that you also have to deal with CSAT, or the customer survey at the end of the call. This not only determines your employement but potentially your pay as it acts as modifier for pay for performance payouts (When I first started there I was making 16$ an hour with P4P despite Texas minimum wage being 7$ and change).
If you get enough bad scores in CSAT you're fired.

Then theres AHT, or average handle time. AHT should be about 5-6 minutes per day to be an average agent. You should be trying to make about 50-70 calls a day. If you aren't averaging out well you're fired.

Then theres Repeat call. If a customer calls in a second time within 24 hours (it could be 48 but I cant recall) regardless of reason. Repeat stat goes way up.
Enough to stop a agent from getting P4P, thus docking pay. If you dont get P4P enough times in a given period of time you can be fired.

Theres alot more to consider, but Dish does a really good job of weeding out the bad apples. Theres a reason Call Centers have a high turn over rate.
Bad apples do make it through and people have bad days it happens, but like I said to assume several thousand people making an honest days pay are terrible at there job based on a few guys on the phone and a few more online who dont agree with you (and dont work for Dish) is silly.



> Sure, but the question arose as to why one supervisor managed to call back in less than a minute, yet suddenly no supervisors were available. There is a way to handle long hold times, and that was not employed. Is it Dish's policy to leave customers on hold for extended periods with no notion of how long one is expected to wait? Again, where do you get your notions about customer service? So far all you've shown us is that you think it's about the customer service rep and not the customer.


Whose to say you were even talking to the same 2 call centers? Dish has something like 15 different centers in the US alone, each with anywhere from 500 to 800 agents each.
Just because one center has a Supervisor readily available to do call backs doesnt mean the all 14 others do too.

And like I said its really likely sergio was the original agents supervisor. I know My supervisor would always do call backs when she could even if the call was positive or negative.


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## ScarlettRuby (Jun 20, 2012)

Thank you all for the exercise in demonstrating the beliefs and attitudes that result in the offensive, alienating and unproductive behaviors of certain call center employees.

I have no doubt that you believe yourselves to be extremely competent and accurate about the role of a customer service representative, but as someone who has created such programs, managed them and trained personnel, having earned my credentials at an internationally renowned business school, I can assure you that you are so far off base it's scary. Sometimes accurate self-evaluation is a challenge. 

I believe that this site is a place for those of a certain mentality and pay scale to hang out and enable each other's false notions about themselves, and possibly to receive validation for your terrible attitudes and actions. I'm sure you enjoy it. I know that I have certainly benefited from the sneak peek into your minds.

FYI, my favorite response was from the person who informed me of the geniuses who create the algorithms by which Dish determines the value of their customers. That is one for the books. It's almost worthy of a book, in fact. I wonder if those algorithms factor in abusive and incompetent customer service, and how that might effect the overall prospect for customer retention, particularly of those customers deemed to be unworthy or undesirable. 

As to the moderators, who evidently can't or won't make the determination between an objective adjective and name calling, enjoy your little reign of tyranny here, since clearly, you have no power anywhere else, so might as well enjoy your little Crossing Guard moment. It's not as nourishing as a romp through the dictionary, but hey, we take it where we can get it, don't we? 

Raymond has responded appropriately to my concerns regarding the Hopper, and I will be further addressing the information I've gathered here to the appropriate channels at Dish Network. I will also bear them in mind in future interactions with customer service reps. This thread is a gold mine of examples of "what not to say" when providing customer service.

As I said, thanks for the enlightenment and the entertainment. You dudes are so totally awesome, legends in your own minds, in fact. 

As one of my street livin', skateboardin', pandhandlin' acquaintances used to say "See ya, wouldn't want to be ya".


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## RasputinAXP (Jan 23, 2008)

ScarlettRuby said:


> FYI, my favorite response was from the person who informed me of the geniuses who create the algorithms by which Dish determines the value of their customers. That is one for the books. It's almost worthy of a book, in fact. I wonder if those algorithms factor in abusive and incompetent customer service, and how that might effect the overall prospect for customer retention, particularly of those customers deemed to be unworthy or undesirable.


You're welcome.

As my something-something skate park something trying to sound cool folks say "Don't let the door hitcha where the good Lord splitcha."


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

It's time to lock the thread.


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## Inkosaurus (Jul 29, 2011)

Yeah lock it up. My blogs readers already had enough fun making fun of the OP I dont think they can handle a round two "of stupid things people say on the web"


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## RasputinAXP (Jan 23, 2008)

You've got a blog?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Well, since ms Ruby has decided to stop reading the thread and continue the insults I suppose that there is no point in continuing.

If she spent more time reading she would meet people older than her who frequent this site. And she would realize that nearly everyone here is just a customer, not a CSR. But she has her opinions of us ... and apparently there are no words that can change those opinions. So ... we're done.

Thanks to all who have attempted to explain what we know about DISH.

PS: If Ms Ruby or Ray would like to add any comment please send me a PM. Thanks!


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