# 50x/P168: So what improvements do you like?



## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

It's a fairly safe assumption that everyone received the P168 update now for the 501/508. Too often, on the web boards, people are very vocal when something isn't working properly. I figured it would be a great opportunity to express our appreciation to the 50x team for improving the receiver, and making it something that one can recommend to a Dish subscriber. It may lack some of the nicities of a Tivo, but it's certainly more powerful than a VCR. Hmmmm.... "Schedule your programs around your life, not the other way around."

So, I figured I would start up a thread as to the improvements we've seen and liked. Here is my list, along with the order of how good the improvement was. Your rankings will very, and it's entirely possible that some additions or changes that some of you use aren't even listed here.

1. View Guide While Recording or Playback - Believe it or not folks, during a slow period of a movie, you couldn't visit the program guide to set up timers. 
2. Nine Day Guide - While many people would place it at the top of the list, I place it second. Introducted in November, 2001, being able to set up events one week ahead of time is great.
3. Number of timers - Initial shipments of the 501 unit limited it to 10 timers, but it was quickly increased to 50.
4. Search function (Part 1) - A few revisions ago saw the introduction of the "Search Feature", which allowed you to search by key phrases. Even through there was some minor irritations with the introduction (Punching in YuGiOh would initially produce no matches for Yu-Gi-Oh), this was fixed in a later released... and improved. 
5. Timer screen - Many users were begging for improvements on the Timer screen. Dish delivered in a big way on P168 by introducing a sort function by date or title, putting the title on the screen, and making the screen very usable. 
6. Search Function (Part 2) - Yes, a second entry for search simply because of the improvements. If you press search, it will fill in the show title for the show you are watching OR the entry currently highlighted in the guide. You can also search by title only or search through descriptions. Very handy.
7. Local channel mapping - Although this upgrade applied to all OpenTV receivers, not just the 50x, mapping the local channels to their OTA positions certainly made it easier to remember that channel 3 is 003 instead of 8632. 
8. Edit recording - One recent upgrade allowed you to select the timer from the guide and edit or delete it. Coolness.
9. The PVR screen - One upgrade allowed you to sort the timers by either date of recording or by name of recording. A manage recordings function from the PVR menu allowed you to easily select a series of recording to protect, unprotect, or erase. Also included was a confirmation that you wanted to erase the recording.
10. Time remaining - Earlier revisions of the software didn't allow you to see how much time was remaining on the recording. This was fixed a year ago, and can be accessed by pressing Cancel.
11. View fron end - Added in the last revision, you can rewind from the end of a recording instead of trying to FF to a particular point again. Nice.
12. Improved record function - I haven't used it much, so it's ranked low. But, by pressing the record button, it brings up a record menu asking if you want to record until stopped, record until end of event, and such.
13. Slow-mo/Freeze Frame - Most VCRs have it, and it's nice that the 50x now has it too. Again, haven't used it much, so it's low on the list. 
14. "Live warning screen" - If you were not watching the program as it happens, but rather behind in the buffer, it gave you a warning that the function could only be carried out in live mode.

BONUS: With every major upgrade, Dish Network sent down a "New Features" video showing the new features of the 50x. It would be great if, from the customer service application in the Dish Home menu, that the user can "order" on-line videos showing various features of the PVR. Not everyone reads the manual, and, for some functions, the manual is outdated.

Now, for some feature requests that probably doesn't violate anyone's patents:

* *Mr. Blinky must die* - It is most irritating when I'm watching something off the PVR (or transferring a program to tape), and the flashing clock comes up reminding me that another PVR event is about to record. We have named it Mr. Blinky (probably a Simpsons reference), and it's as irritating as the Microsoft Office paperclip. I can certainly understand if it is a VCR recording, Auto-Tune, or Reminder, but not PVR. 
* Get the red out of Timers and Themes - The biggest problem with themes and search is that it turns up results on channels which I am not subscribed to AND have no intention of subscribing to. This is especially irritating when you have the second dish installed and do a search for the show title "24". Just let me see what's available for the channels I'm subscribed to. Thank you.
* Three minutes after - Already available on the 721, you should be able to select the box to record three minutes beyond the established record time.
* Timer screen - As I said before, Timers were very much improved. One improvement would be to highlight the timer and press the "Info" button to get the exact times, channel, and description. This may be harder than it sounds since, thanks to networks running programs back-to-back, I have to program my Thursday night CBS timer from 6:59-9:00 PM to catch both Survivor and CSI. *6/11-This has been added in P196*
* Stop warning - Because of the close proximaty of the stop button to the pause button, it is too easy to stop a recording in progress. A verification screen is needed. *6/11 - This has been added to P196*
* One-time override warning - If I set up a timer to record a movie or special that overrides several of my repeating timers, a warning box should come up saying: "This one-time event will override repeating timers." The options will possibly be "Search for alternative airing", "Override", "Cancel Timer".
* Alphabetical sorting - It would be neat to sort the guide listings by channel name instead of channel number. 
* View - In live mode, it would be great if I highlighted the channel ANYWHERE in the guide and press the view button. This would bring up the channel in the preview window. Pressing view again will bring it full screen. 
* Lock/unlock recording - I just thought of this just now. Although parental locks and ratings locks already exist, and there is a protect feature, they could also put in a lock/unlock recording feature. "Locking" a program means that you have to enter a code to view the program/erase the program/etc, while "Unlocking" the program will allow you to view the program without entering any futher codes. This would be great for parents who put on restrictions for certain programs or movies, and want to preview the program before allowing the kids to see it. Likewise, kid on restriction? You can record their favorite program, but it will be locked until they behave. 
* Hard drive upgrade - As I have said before, and I'll say it again. No matter how big a hard drive you put in, it is never big enough. According to www.newegg.com (OEM, Drive Only):
* 40 GB (used on the 501) - $75-$93
* 80 GB (used on the 508) - $97-$116
* 120 GB - $138-$147 (There was also a Maxtor with a 8MB buffer for $194)
* 160 GB - $215
Probably because of Dishplayer problems, Dish has married the hard drive to the receiver, making hard drive upgrades almost impossible.


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

A big improvement that made many of the others possible or practical was storing the EPG on the hard drive.

My new feature wish list is short. It's part of your list but I think it bears repeating. We need to be able to override a recurring timer without having to delete it.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Z'Loth, that was an excellent post!

My 2 BIGGEST improvement items are on your list - Give us an option to turn off the blinking timer clock, and give us the option to override a recurring timer with a one time timer.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

You can turn the timer clock blinky off with the 721 now.


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## TimL (Apr 24, 2002)

I love the slow-motion/frame-by-frame feature..I tape the B&W Overnight shows on Game Show Network.(What's My Line, To Tell The Truth. I've Got A Secret)
Occasionally they will come out of a current commercial and mistakenly show the last frame of a commercial that was originally aired in the 50's or 60's, And I can now rewind and slo-mo/freeze frame and see what the commercial was. I wish they could show these intact original commercials and all but that's for another forum..I also like the new recording options.

Tim Lones


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## tampa8 (Mar 30, 2002)

As a modifacation to one of the complaints - red during search, I would like the option to see red channels or not. If I am looking for say a movie and it is on a movie channel I don't get, and this happens frequently, perhaps I would consider getting that movie channel instead or in addition to what I have. Or say I get the AT100 and am looking for a couple of different programs or type of programs and find they only pop up on AT100 channels. I would like to know that. I certainly agree it can be annoying at times though!


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

One of the sub-menus of the 50x has an option to sort the guide in channel ascending or descending. Maybe a few more options could be added to that screen as well to give the user the option of whether or not to display the "red" channels. 

I can understand the sales logic behind showing the unsubscribed channels in order to show you what you are missing by not subscribing. Some of us just don't care, or already have that movie in their DVD collection.


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

> View - In live mode, it would be great if I highlighted the channel ANYWHERE in the guide and press the view button. This would bring up the channel in the preview window. Pressing view again will bring it full screen.


That would be what I would like to see most, in addition to the option of removing the blinking clock. If I could change channels in the PIP EPG I would go back to using it that way instead of full screen. I would also like to see unsubscribed channels removed from the themes and search, not because of movie channels, but now that I'm looking at 61.5 the amount of red has tripled due to the additional 40something internationals.


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

Apparently, now, Dish has some functionality in which channels are not even displayed on the "All Channel" list unless you are subscribed to them. For example, if you are not subscribed to the Distant Nets or PBS (XD Schedule), they simply do not show up in the guide at all.


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## bolco (Jun 11, 2002)

I am **VERY** pleased with the development of the 50x to date. However, I would REALLY like to see a "Skip this Instance" feature added so that when I record a Penguins Hockey game, I don't have to go back in and re-setup my timer for Fear Factor. I would also like to have them look into the CallerID feature. It still is NOT compatible with my "Identa-Ring" feature, where when friends who have my "special" phone number call me, i get a ring-ring...instead of one long ringgggg. I HOPE that it's a software issue and not a hardware issue. The identa-ring works perfectly on my 5000. But, again, I'm happy!


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2003)

Some Features I'd love to see that were not mentioned above are:
1) The ability to limit searches to only channels in a specific favorite list.
2) The ability to limit Searches to only shows within a specific theme.
3) The ability to "turn off" Red (unsubscribed) channels and Green PPV Channels in Guide and searches
4) The ability to Edit PVR Recordings by trimming unwanted portions from the beginning and end. While Watching a recording pressing PVR could give the options of Delete to here and Delete to End. This would allow us to recover recording time from events that end earlier than scheduled. It would also allow me to save only a portion of a show without having to keep the whole show.
5) The ability to rename a PVR recording...would help for all of those times where the names are not accurate.

Finally I'd like them to either 
1) "unlock" the software so users can add larger Hard disks could be added to the receiver. If it is a "support" issue, they could release a list of "supported" drives.
OR
2) Release a 50X model with a much larger Hard Disk. I'd definately be willing to pay an extra $200 for a model with a 200 GB HDD.

The way I see it Dish network should allow us to have more recording time. If they don't want to release receivers with bigger HDD's, then they should give us the option of adding one.

Even the upcoming 2 tuner 522 is only supposed to have only a 80GB Hard Disk. I was dissapointed to see this years line-up announced without any models containing a larger HDD. I believe people would


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## J.W. (Nov 8, 2002)

I second the trimming and renaming!!!!! That would be great!


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## CompuDude (Jan 27, 2003)

Four HUGE things have driven me nuts about the 501. I compare it to the old original DishPlayer unit that I now use as my bedroom PVR, and the newer the living room 501 unit has four GLARING deficiencies.

1) Let me see my show while I go into the PVR listings! There's a TON of wasted screen space there. If I want to glace at my list of recordings, I currently have to interrupt the show I'm watching, siunce both video and audio go bye-bye the second I hit that button. Ditto for setting timers. My old DishPlayer kept the current show running in a little window, and didn't kill the audio. MUCH better.

2) More lines on the program guide! Again, my old DishPlayer lists 6 lines of shows per screen, vs. 4 on the 501. Even adding one more line, to show 5 lines, would be a huge improvement. Again, there's plenty of screen space to play with here, simply by tightening up the spacing between text and row margins.

3) Listing the program description in the extra space next to the PIP view of hte current show. Again, the DishPlayer does this. The 501 does not. It has the info available, but you have to take the extra step of hitting Info. Why? Do we really need that much screen space devoted to Dish splashing their logo on our sets? Who are they selling to?!? Current customers?

4) Last but not least: The program descriptions. Huh? What happened? Not only are they shorter than they are the DishPlayer, they are frequently chopped short in mid-sentence! Yet the same show on the DishPlayer in the other room displays much more info. Well, perhaps not MUCH more, but when the amounts are this small to begin with, every little bit helps.

-KMan


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## hikerak (Jan 8, 2003)

<<<3) Listing the program description in the extra space next to the PIP view of hte current show. Again, the DishPlayer does this. The 501 does not. It has the info available, but you have to take the extra step of hitting Info. Why? Do we really need that much screen space devoted to Dish splashing their logo on our sets? Who are they selling to?!? Current customers?>>>

I couldn't agree more. I miss seeing the program info next to the PIP in the guide. It makes things much easier when browsing the guide.

The DP had great features, they didn't always work but the features were nice...

Matt


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## Chris Blount (Jun 22, 2001)

Hi Copudude and welcome to DBSTalk.Com! :hi:

All of the features you mention are already on the 721. Hopefully the 501 will get them at some point in time.


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## CompuDude (Jan 27, 2003)

Well, that's somewhat good to know, about the 721, at lesat. I had head that it had 5 lines of preview at one point... not as good as 6 (unless they've changed that now?) but better than 4. I'd sure love it if they migrated that feature over to the 501/8, too, along with the others.

On the bright side, if the 721 has those features, I guess it's a good bet the 921 will have them come July... making it that much more of a must-have for me! Mmmm... HD on my 65" Mitsu will be sweeeeeet...


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2003)

Good job 50X development team. Keep up the good work.


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2003)

I have a stand alone Tivo and a 2 week old 508. Like others have mentioned, one time override is on the top of my list! My next biggest irritation is that my 508 doesn't resume playing a PVR event where I left off if I switch to another show. Is this just operator error?

Let's say I do the following:

- start watching PVR event #1 with the wife
- phone rings and wife talks on the phone for a bit
- pause PVR event #1
- start watching PVR event #2 (something that the wife won't miss)
- wife comes back
- pause PVR event #2
- start watching PVR event #1 again

At this point, PVR event #1 starts from the very beginning and I have to FF to where I left off. Is there a way that I can just resume play from where I left off? This was a -major- pain while watching the Super Bowl. FF at 300x though 3 hours of football is -not- a good thing. Tivo does this without a hitch.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

Maybe it should have memory just like a vcr does to where it goes back to a certain number if they cannot get it to start from where it left off. I thought for sure they had that functionality in them to start from where you left off.


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

You need to press STOP, not PAUSE to switch recordings. When you get switch back, you should see an two options on the PVR recording screen: "Resume" and "Start Over".


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

After you highlight event #1, press Select instead of Play to get the Resume option.

Getting back to overriding a timer, I realized Dish receivers with timers already have the ability to suppress a timer without deleting it. It's an option on the Mr. Blinky menu, accessible only by manual selection within 5 min of the event. Part of the code is already there but the conflict resolution routine isn't taking advantage of it.


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

Just bringing back an old thread.... wonder when we'll see the next update to the 50x box and what improvements the programmers will make.


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## DarrellP (Apr 24, 2002)

Although I like the features that Dish has put into the 50x PVR's, I will fall short of praising them for something that should have been in the box from the day it shipped. Shipping a barebones box and using us for Beta testers is a poor business model.

For improvements, I agree with Mr. Blinky go bye, bye or at least have an option to override it.

Definitely need a timer override.

A warning for hitting Cancel while recording a show is a must .

Another must have: INFO for Timers. A channel number would also be helpful.

#1 fix on my list: More stablilty, my machine still requires a weekly reset and even at that, it still barfs if I do a lot of EPG browsing and timer setting with PIP active.


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## bearklaw (Jan 3, 2003)

I want to be able to hit the Info button while watching a recorded show and see information about that show (like how much time is left) instead of being bounced, with no warning, to live mode.

-BearKlaw


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## tampa8 (Mar 30, 2002)

> _Originally posted by bearklaw _
> *I want to be able to hit the Info button while watching a recorded show and see information about that show (like how much time is left) instead of being bounced, with no warning, to live mode.
> 
> -BearKlaw *


Mine allows me to view info about the recorded program I am watching, yours does not?


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## rtt2 (Jan 27, 2003)

I wish there was a way to quckly view the program guide in full mode and quickly switch to the mode with 1/4 screen mode. I hate having to go all the way to the system setup to change this every tiime I want to view the tv listings when I am changing channels.


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

> _Originally posted by bearklaw _
> *I want to be able to hit the Info button while watching a recorded show and see information about that show (like how much time is left) instead of being bounced, with no warning, to live mode.*


Try hitting the cancel button.


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## psycaz (Oct 4, 2002)

I've got a 508, definitely get rid of blinky, and i'd love to see the search screen remember your last choice of search event titles only or search all event info. I have yet to ue the info one, but it defaults to it. Very irritating.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

721 got rid of blinky so I would think that they could do the same on the 501/508, but since there is a different program that powers the 721 it may not be possible to do on the 501/508 as a result.


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## bearklaw (Jan 3, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Z'Loth _
> *
> 
> Try hitting the cancel button. *


Dang, that does it! Thanks.

Now, what the heck was the 50x team thinking of when they came up with that one? Hitting "Cancel" when you aren't doing anything isn't exactly obvious, is it? I still think the View button should do this when watching a recorded show.

-BearKlaw


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

Bringing back an old post....

It would nice if they use the search engine to display the schedule of one or several channels in a list format.


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## dmodemd (Jul 5, 2002)

I'm surprised I haven't heard this one:

SEQUENTIAL PLAY - Select multiple recorded programs and play them sequentially - for dumping to tape.


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## toddjb (May 7, 2002)

> _Originally posted by rtt2 _
> *I wish there was a way to quckly view the program guide in full mode and quickly switch to the mode with 1/4 screen mode. I hate having to go all the way to the system setup to change this every tiime I want to view the tv listings when I am changing channels. *


Wow, I agree with you on this one.

I HATE that. I always have it set to 1/4 screen mode, but when I'm not watching anything I'd love to go full screen with the touch of a button. No reason that has to be buried in menus.

-todd


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