# ASK DBSTALK: Aspect Ratio Selection



## markcollins (Jan 27, 2004)

Just Bought A 921 Receiver and am wondering if there is a way to change the aspect ratio output without having to go back to the menu "display setup".Also does anyone know if you can seperately set aspect ratios for sd and HD outputs.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Set display in the setup for your type of monitor. Then use the * key on your remote and move it to "NORMAL" This will get you a consistent automatic AR for both SD and HD channels. Some people have had problems with stretch mode but I have figgured out how to trigger the proper stretch here and then is only reverts to improper if I tamper with the * key again. Leave it alone and have proper stretch. I kept my proper stretch consistent for 2 days but since I prefer "Normal" this is where I have it now.


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## BobMurdoch (Apr 24, 2002)

When I want to stretch a 4:3 image to 16:9 on my 16:9 TV I switch the Display setup to 4:3 #2 and then hit stretch. i don't know why it works as well as it does, but it fills the screen without distorting the picture too heavily and without chopping off huge parts of the screen like the zoom does.


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## tm22721 (Nov 8, 2002)

IMHO HDTV acceptance by the average consumer will continue to be crippled until somebody designs a receiver that automatically sets aspect ratio and resolution based upon information from the TV display and the program provider.

Why doesn't a standard exist to allow this to be automated by the receiver ?


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## Jim Kosinsky (Jul 20, 2003)

Don,

How do you enable the proper stretch mode that you mention above? Or did you mean you leave the setting on 'Normal' for all material?

JimK


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## David_Levin (Apr 22, 2002)

tm22721 said:


> IMHO HDTV acceptance by the average consumer will continue to be crippled until somebody designs a receiver that automatically sets aspect ratio and resolution based upon information from the TV display and the program provider.


Personal preference? In my mind the proper aspect ration would NEVER stretch a 4:3 to 6:9. But, plenty of people seem to want the feature.

When a 16:9 TV is displaying a Letterboxed SD source it has no was to know the top/bottom bars aren't useful information (sometimes subtitles are placed down there). The users is going to have to intervene.

Resolution is simpler but also has it quirks. Your TV could have a better scaler then your Sat receivers. You might with to set things up so the Sat outputs what it gets over the DVI without any scaling (which I believe is not an option). Again, I prefer not to have the hardware make these decisions for me. I suppose an auto mode would be nice for the less techno-savy.

Don,
I want NOTHING stretched or distorted. So, can I set the TV type to widescreen and leave the aspect ration on normal (I expect pillars on 4:3 material)?

Thanks


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## Slordak (Dec 17, 2003)

If you go into the setup menu and pick "16:9" and then pick an HD resolution, such as "1080i", you should be good to go. Make sure the 921 is in "HD Mode", where the blue LED is lit, and then tune to an SD channel. Use the "*" key to change the aspect ratio to "NORMAL". Now tune to an HD channel and again use the "*" key to change the aspect ratio to "NORMAL". You should now be watching all 16:9 content (e.g. Discovery HD) full screen, and all 4:3 channels in OAR.

This does actually work correctly today, even without further fixes from Dish Network. Proper stretching and zooming and all are not yet working fully, so these require some elaborate tricks in some cases, but what is documented here should work fine. I do think it would be neat if letterboxed content shown on a 4:3 channel being watched on a 16:9 TV had some sort of auto-edge detection which did an automatic zoom, but that's probably asking for too much.

With regards to the other comment, yes, I too would like to see 720p content come out as 720p and 1080i content come out as 1080i, since my television has a much better scaler, but that's a whole separate issue, unfortunately.


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## markcollins (Jan 27, 2004)

Slordak said:


> If you go into the setup menu and pick "16:9" and then pick an HD resolution, such as "1080i", you should be good to go. Make sure the 921 is in "HD Mode", where the blue LED is lit, and then tune to an SD channel. Use the "*" key to change the aspect ratio to "NORMAL". Now tune to an HD channel and again use the "*" key to change the aspect ratio to "NORMAL". You should now be watching all 16:9 content (e.g. Discovery HD) full screen, and all 4:3 channels in OAR.
> 
> This does actually work correctly today, even without further fixes from Dish Network. Proper stretching and zooming and all are not yet working fully, so these require some elaborate tricks in some cases, but what is documented here should work fine. I do think it would be neat if letterboxed content shown on a 4:3 channel being watched on a 16:9 TV had some sort of auto-edge detection which did an automatic zoom, but that's probably asking for too much.
> 
> With regards to the other comment, yes, I too would like to see 720p content come out as 720p and 1080i content come out as 1080i, since my television has a much better scaler, but that's a whole separate issue, unfortunately.


OAR???--please enlighten


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

OAR = original aspect ratio


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## tm22721 (Nov 8, 2002)

The problem is that many of us use one display to watch HD and another for SD. 

It is totally unacceptable that the 6000 handled this correctly for the past three years while the 921 (which costs twice as much) does not.


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## Slordak (Dec 17, 2003)

You're advocating separate displays for SD and HD? Do you have the two of them side by side or in separate rooms?

I don't think this is exactly the "standard" use case; I would think that the expected use case (once the various bugs are worked out) is that one would put the receiver in whichever mode one uses (HD for most of us), and leave it in that mode more or less indefinitely. If the receiver correctly manages its aspect ratios and can output multiple resolutions without excessive menu contortions, then this should provide the correct signal in all cases.


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## jsa_usenet (Oct 7, 2003)

I've been using the 921 pretty hard since I installed it a couple days ago. I have it set to 1080i, 16:9 and normal. It autoselects to fill the widescreen when the input is appropriate (720p or 1080i 16:9 image) and gives me black bars when it's 4:3.

If I was running this on a plasma, I'd set it to 4:3#2... I'm not happy with changing the image, but I'd do it to protect the plasma. I like the 921 stretch mode better than the Sony "wide zoom," though both are ok in general... I'd move to the component inputs to allow the Sony to work if I was a wide zoom fan.

(now all of this aspect ratio stuff is really moot if I can't get the thing to tune properly to off-air channels)



Slordak said:


> You're advocating separate displays for SD and HD? Do you have the two of them side by side or in separate rooms?
> 
> I don't think this is exactly the "standard" use case; I would think that the expected use case (once the various bugs are worked out) is that one would put the receiver in whichever mode one uses (HD for most of us), and leave it in that mode more or less indefinitely. If the receiver correctly manages its aspect ratios and can output multiple resolutions without excessive menu contortions, then this should provide the correct signal in all cases.


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## pculley (Dec 23, 2003)

Slordak said:


> You're advocating separate displays for SD and HD? Do you have the two of them side by side or in separate rooms?
> 
> I don't think this is exactly the "standard" use case;


I use mine exactly this way; most watching is done on the main set in HD/16:9 mode, however, when I go to the kitchen for a snack, I switch to SD/4:3 so I can watch on the kitchen set.

I would also love to have all output resolutions available on DVI/Component, since my set has a significantly better de-interlacer and scaler than the 921. Since the S-vid outputs are analog, (and poorly adjusted at the factory) I lose a bit of color rendition and contrast when viewing through that output, even though the picture has fewer artifacts and looks a bit sharper due to the better scaler.

And no, 480p mode does not cut it for me; I suspect that the de-interlacer in the 921 is actually the weak link.


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## tm22721 (Nov 8, 2002)

Slordak said:


> You're advocating separate displays for SD and HD? Do you have the two of them side by side or in separate rooms?
> 
> I don't think this is exactly the "standard" use case; I would think that the expected use case (once the various bugs are worked out) is that one would put the receiver in whichever mode one uses (HD for most of us), and leave it in that mode more or less indefinitely. If the receiver correctly manages its aspect ratios and can output multiple resolutions without excessive menu contortions, then this should provide the correct signal in all cases.


Most channels (98%) are still SD and they are overcompressed on satellite so I use a separate 19" TV to watch these. The 19" TV is in the same room as a 106" 16:9 front projector screen used for HD and DVD. I have an external scalar (set to 1080i) for DVD playback.

I don't want to waste the front projector on SD channels. I will get rid of the SD TV only when/if most programming has changed over to HD.


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## Slordak (Dec 17, 2003)

I think we're in universal agreement that the de-interlacer in the 921 is not up to par with "videophile" grade equipment. Enthusiasts who pay $1000 for an HD satellite receiver should not be forced to deal with a de-interlacer which is far below that found in a nice $300 - $375 DVD player (e.g. Denon 1600 with Faroudja DCDi). Using some "bob and weave" chipset from a $60 DVD player cannot and will not produce high-end A/V equipment.

Since the 921 is (according to reports) physically incapable of sending an unmolested 480i signal out of its HD outputs, the receiver may simply be a lemon for actual high end, instead relegating its HD output to be measured in terms of "somewhat better than SD".


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## tm22721 (Nov 8, 2002)

Somebody mentioned a while ago to connect the SD TV to the 921 DVI (VGA) output through a PC-to-TV (VGA to NTSC) converter. The only problem is that you are upconverting from 480i to 480p (in the 921) then downconverting (through the external converter) back to 480i. Not an optimum solution but at least it gets rid of having to use Display Mode every time you switch between SD and HD modes.


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