# Now that Blu-Ray won? Should we jump on it, or forget it?



## Earl Bonovich

I was an HD-DVD guy... still am... And looking forward to picking up some more titles as the "fire-sale" kicks into full drive.

However... I am not running out to buy a blu-ray player (or PS3).

At CES, I was very impressed on the possibilities with XStreamHD.
And of course DirecTV that I am already have cranking in the house.

I've have seen the VuDu stuff... and of course there is AppleTV/XBOX360 (which I already own)... for IPTV type options.

This article:
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/daves-download/2008/2/20/7-reasons-to-forget-blu-ray.html

Gives 7 Reasons on why to forget about Blu-Ray...

After reading it... I do agree with most of it.
I don't watch my library of DVD's the way we used to.... The movies get watched once, and then sit on the shelf for a while... until someone wants to borrow them... or I am bored.

The idea of getting them via the Internet or SAT.... to me, makes a ton of sense... especially for hot releases.... I would rather spend a lot less on single watches, then dropping $30 on a "High-Def" disk. (Hence why I only have about 7 HD-DVD's in the year plus I have owned the player).

Standard Def DVD's... the cost savings just isn't there... so I will still buy some long term "must haves" on Standard DVD (just got Ratatooie sp?) for $10


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## space86

Regular DVD Upconverted is just fine with me 
wait until the Blu Ray Players prices go down.


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## Nick

...way down!


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## shocky

BlockBuster Online movie rentals for me. I'm grandfathered in for $14 a month for 2 DVDs out at a time with unlimited rentals & unlimited in-store exchange. (I switched from NetFlix to BlockBuster during the BlockBuster online beta before it was public) Within 48 hours of exchanging a movie at my local BlockBuster I already have a new one.

I realize this now costs $30+ for new customers but there are a TON of grandfathered customers and it's a great source for HD DVD & Blu-Ray titles (online has both stores have Blu-Ray only mostly).


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## ebaltz

Nick said:


> ...way down!


Maybe they should be just given away. Its a high tech piece of equipment. Should your HDTV and your receiver also be around $100? If you can't afford one, then you can't afford HD Sat TV or and HDTV.


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## Sirshagg

I'm definitely waiting. Mostly for prices to come down, way down as well as for discs to show up on the previewed shelf at Hollywood Video (which is where I get all my DVD's now).

In the meantime I might just pick up and upconverting DVD player and HD PPV from DirecTv is also a possibility. 

I happen to agree with alot of things in that artice. The war killed HD-DVD but it may have killed BR too, time will tell.


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## machavez00

Too late! I used my "ataboys" from work (Target gift cards) and my winnings from a SB pool to buy a PS3 (it came with a $40 free Target GC) There are movies I like to watch a lot. I am waiting for the Godfather trilogy. I have it on SD, but the transfers are horrible. Big Trouble in Little China, Enter the Dragon, on and on.


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## HfreaknD

Earl Bonovich said:


> I was an HD-DVD guy... still am... And looking forward to picking up some more titles as the "fire-sale" kicks into full drive.
> 
> However... I am not running out to buy a blu-ray player (or PS3).
> 
> At CES, I was very impressed on the possibilities with XStreamHD.
> And of course DirecTV that I am already have cranking in the house.
> 
> I've have seen the VuDu stuff... and of course there is AppleTV/XBOX360 (which I already own)... for IPTV type options.
> 
> This article:
> http://www.usnews.com/blogs/daves-download/2008/2/20/7-reasons-to-forget-blu-ray.html
> 
> Gives 7 Reasons on why to forget about Blu-Ray...
> 
> After reading it... I do agree with most of it.
> I don't watch my library of DVD's the way we used to.... The movies get watched once, and then sit on the shelf for a while... until someone wants to borrow them... or I am bored.
> 
> The idea of getting them via the Internet or SAT.... to me, makes a ton of sense... especially for hot releases.... I would rather spend a lot less on single watches, then dropping $30 on a "High-Def" disk. (Hence why I only have about 7 HD-DVD's in the year plus I have owned the player).
> 
> Standard Def DVD's... the cost savings just isn't there... so I will still buy some long term "must haves" on Standard DVD (just got Ratatooie sp?) for $10


I just bought my son a PS3. PQ is great. I don't watch movies more than once either, I just rent them (usually $4.99).

Watching something on a local player usually always renders better PQ than something cabled in (from cable or sat). I have read other threads in this forum that say that D*od and other downloaded programs (via internet) are compressed and seem to provide lower PQ. That may be a reason to get one.


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## phat78boy

Even with having multiple HD-DVD and Blu-Ray players throughout the house, I still watch DirecTV HD PPV more then the others combined. With the HR20 making it so easy to watch a PPV on your time and in HD, its very hard not to use it often. The picture and sound is very good and and Blu-Ray and HD-DVD are not enough of an upgrade for me to give up the convenience

Like many others, once I watch a movie I rarely come back to it within that year. Its very convenient for me to watch the movie in HD PPV when released and then catch it several months later, if I want, on one of te HD movie channels. If DOD starts offering a lot of HD choices, media will be one of my last choices for viewing movies.

I'm also keeping a close eye on XStreamHD. If the releases are in sync with DVD releases, it would be a great product.


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## Nick

ebaltz said:


> Maybe they should be just given away. Its a high tech piece of equipment. Should your HDTV and your receiver also be around $100? If you can't afford one, then you can't afford HD Sat TV or and HDTV.


Don't worry, I can afford it, but I'm a bargain-hunter and I don't like being overcharged for stuff.


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## Stewart Vernon

Just because you can do (buy) something, doesn't mean you should... there's lots of stuff I can pay for, but don't because the entertainment value isn't there to justify the purchase.

A movie like the Simpsons looked quite nice to me in SD on my HDTV... and while I know the HD (Blu ray) version would look sharper, brighter colors probably too... the purchase price is about double what I paid so it would be hard to justify that.

Some movies I don't mind the double dip to re-buy... others I don't even mind paying a little more for HD... but I don't feel as impressed by a comedy in HD as I do about something like Star Wars (if you could buy it) in HD. Everybody Loves Raymond looked nice in HD on CBS the last few seasons... but I happily bought the widescreen DVD season sets and can 100% say that the show is just as funny in SD as it was in HD. No reason to jump on a Blu ray season set if such a thing should come to pass.

This is where the price comes in... I wouldn't even have an HD player if not for the black friday sales where I basically got 10 movies and a player for about $200. If I could have done that with Blu ray, I might have one of those too. But I couldn't, and so I don't.

For all the appreciation I have for HD programming... I can honestly say that I enjoy the content of a program first... and while the price differential is high, I can sit on the sidelines and wait.

It'd be nice if Blu ray catches on, and prices come down in a year or two... then I'll re-visit. But if not, I'm ok with that too.. and don't feel like I'm missing out. Also, with some potential "steals" coming from HD DVD firesales, I'll be happy there too!


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## ebaltz

Nick said:


> Don't worry, I can afford it, but I'm a bargain-hunter and I don't like being overcharged for stuff.


And who determines what "being overcharged" is? You? The market decides. Apparently 10 million people or more felt the value of the PS3 was worth the price. I for 1 would pay twice what I did for mine and still be happy.


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## Earl Bonovich

ebaltz said:


> And who determines what "being overcharged" is? You? The market decides. Apparently 10 million people or more felt the value of the PS3 was worth the price. I for 1 would pay twice what I did for mine and still be happy.


This thread is about your personal opinions/feelings on it.

Everyone has their price point....

I can not spend $30 on TNMT in HD... but I did spend $30 on Transformers..
Each person has their own value point. Nothing wrong with that, and basically what this is all about.

If the technology in all these examples where Sub-$10... they would all have a place/home... but they are not... they do cost, and for some... cost too much.


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## Stuart Sweet

I would table all Blu-Ray discussion until the specs are mature, for example, what BD profile 2.0 promises to be. For myself, I will be looking for the $199 player with that does everything in the current spec.


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## deweybroncos

I joined Netflix because I can rent Blu-ray and regular movies cheaper than pay per view, and its fast and easy. Also, since the kids are bigger, we no longer buy movies to watch over and over and *over*!


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## Ken984

I bought HD-DVD also, just before Christmas(what great timing!). I have about 10 HD-DVD's (still waiting on the 5 free from Toshiba). I am not buying more unless its something really special, BG season 1 for less than $50 would move me.

I am waiting on BluRay, a player for less than $300 would be nice and the movies should not cost $35.


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## machavez00

buy them at Fry's 90% of HD and BD are $19.99, with many at $14.99. I buy a lot of my movies at Blockbuster or Hollywood from their rental clear outs


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## Sirshagg

Earl Bonovich said:


> I can not spend $30 on TNMT in HD


You'd have to pay me well more than $30 to watch that, HD or otherwise. :lol:


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## Earl Bonovich

Sirshagg said:


> You'd have to pay me well more than $30 to watch that, HD or otherwise. :lol:


Even though off topic... it wasn't that bad of a movie, for $14 ($7 and $7 mid-day movie trip with the son)

:backtotop


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## farjo08

I agree with you Earl. Most movies I watch once and that's about it. A few classics, etc. I will watch more than once, over the years, but that's about it.

I got the 360 HD add-on about a year ago and sold it (for $150 w/o KK so basically broke even) back in October when I picked up an A3 for $199 with 10 free movies (2 in box, BB had 3 free instantly + 5 from the rebate which I finally got like 3 months later). So the free movies pretty much washed out the price of the player.

I did not have an upconverting player, so for that, the HD-DVDs I have and HDMI I don't regret the decision to adopt HD-DVD.

Like you I will keep an eye out for deals (firesales) on HD-DVDs and plan to add to the collection but I am not planning on Blu-Ray anytime soon.

I have to admit I don't know much about Blu-Ray per se, but keep hearing and reading things about 1.1/2.0 profiles (with some players not upgradeable?), lack of ethernet ports or TruHD, possibility of not handling future codecs through HDMI (PS3?), etc. So while they might have won the war, it still looks like they have their own squirmishes going on inside their camp and does not seem like a good time to adopt until the figure all those things out. And of course, the players are still expensive, with the PS3 seeming to be the most reasonable choice as of now, at least compared to the $399 players, so a price drop and/or free movies would also be something I would hold out for.

At some point I expect to go Blue, but don't see it in the near future, that's for sure.


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## ehilbert1

Earl Bonovich said:


> This thread is about your personal opinions/feelings on it.
> 
> Everyone has their price point....
> 
> I can not spend $30 on TNMT in HD... but I did spend $30 on Transformers..
> Each person has their own value point. Nothing wrong with that, and basically what this is all about.
> 
> If the technology in all these examples where Sub-$10... they would all have a place/home... but they are not... they do cost, and for some... cost too much.


I can't balme anyone for not wanting to pay $30 for an HDDVD or Blu-ray disk. I have a Columbia House account and they have buy 1 get 1 free with free shipping deals all the time. I just ordered I am Legend Blu-ray(preorder) and 30 Days of Night Blu-ray for $26.98 shipped free. I'm not asking anyone to join Columbia House and I understand why people hate it,but it kicks ass for me. I have a PS3 for games first,but man I love it as a Blu-ray player. Anyway I just wanted to point out that there are some really good deals out there for Blu-ray disks.


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## old7

I bought a $99 HD-A2 and have picked up a dozen HD-DVD movies. I will likely pickup a few fire-sale HD-DVDs.

I will buy a BD player when the price for a decent player is 150ish.

Now that there is no competition it may take a while. I'm in no hurry.


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## Carl Spock

Stuart Sweet said:


> I would table all Blu-Ray discussion until the specs are mature, for example, what BD profile 2.0 promises to be. For myself, I will be looking for the $199 player with that does everything in the current spec.


My position, exactly.


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## Tom Robertson

If 2.0 (BD-Live) players were out right now, I'd probably get one immediately then add more as existing players in the house died or prices fall.

I'm toying with the PS3 concept tho that would not normally be a direction I'd go. It just is an interesting economic price point.

I am already looking into media, my laptop can play BD; might just sit with that until BD-Live players are out.

Cheers,
Tom


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## HIPAR

Waiting for the same kind of offer I got with my HD-A3 ... $200 and a bunch of included movies. I'll even take an 'unfinished' player for that price.

I don't buy into that malarkey that it cannot happen because Sony has no competition. It's HD-DVD down with plain old DVD for the next campaign and that one will not be won through back room deals.

The consumer hasn't lost anything unless he foolishly relinquishes control over his own wallet. 

--- CHAS


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## Drew2k

Uh-oh! Did someone tell Stuart there's a HD-DVD / Blu-ray discussion outside of the official stickies?!  

:lol:

My plan is to wait for a BD 2.0 player and then to wait for prices to drop ... a lot. So probably 2009 for me, or Christmas 2008 if there are REALLY good deals.


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## Stewart Vernon

ebaltz said:


> And who determines what "being overcharged" is? You?


Yes, actually, that is 100% correct. The consumer decides if something is worth what the asking price is. IF the consumer, the individual consumer, decides it is then a purchase is made. IF not, then no purchase.

You, me, and everyone else each makes an individual decision on whether or not something is worth the price of admission... AND the kicker here is, we are all correct! You are correct, and so am I... even if our opinions differ.



ebaltz said:


> The market decides. Apparently 10 million people or more felt the value of the PS3 was worth the price. I for 1 would pay twice what I did for mine and still be happy.


IF I wanted to play video games, then I would agree with you that the PS3 is priced well as a gaming machine + Blu ray movie machine. BUT for the consumer like me who only wants it to play movies, the argument becomes... why does it cost $400? I only want to play movies, so I don't want to pay for the video game part... Same discussion in the Dish/DirecTV forums when customers ask why they are paying for channels they don't want to watch. Difference here is that we usually have a choice in technology.

I own a PS2 and a DVD player. I never (maybe once or twice) play movies in the PS2. Actually I don't play games on it either anymore... but I used to... and I still wanted a separate DVD player back in the day. I didn't even mind back then paying for the PS2 and also buying a DVD player separate.

But now... I have DVD, HD DVD, and my old PS2. I really don't want to pay for a PS3 that I'll absolutely never 100% guaranteed use for video gaming... so the price has to come down for me to be interested even if it is the best bang for the buck.

For that matter... I can't think of too many products that I would say I would pay twice what I did... especially not when the price in question is around $300-$400!


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## Zepes

kept it in my pants through this whole thing....(money)
It's a PS3 for me now....woohoo


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## bidger

I bought into DVD when the players dropped below $200 *AND* the media was priced competitively to the reigning format, pre-recorded VHS. I don't see either of those things happening with Blu-ray.

When I went DVR, it affected how I used DVDs. The content on my DVR is dynamic for the most part, some things I've kept, but a lot of new stuff is added daily. Optical media is static, the movie on that disc will always be that movie. I use my DVRs daily, I won't watch that film daily, no matter how stunning it may be. So, yeah, I'm in no hurry to go Blu-ray.


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## hdtvfan0001

Drew2k said:


> My plan is to wait for a BD 2.0 player and then to wait for prices to drop ... a lot. So probably 2009 for me, or Christmas 2008 if there are REALLY good deals.


That would make you one of the smart people - but then you already are one. 

With v1.1 deploying in some units over the next 3-6 months, followed by v2.0, there is absolutely no reason to rush.

In addition, since the BD disks themselves will start to contain extras and downloadable feature Javacode only supported in v 2.0 (with Ethernet), again....no reason to hurry.

The other issue is that the jury is out on Blu Ray's survival as well. Remember, both HD DVD and BD *together* only accounted for less than 3% of all movie disk sales....if market share on Blu Ray doesn't get up into the 15% or higher range....it's future may be in doubt as well.

Patience is prudent.


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## DCSholtis

I'm already neutral I have both an A3 and a "beginner" Sony BDP S-300 that I'll replace ASAP possibly with a combo player. I'm like Earl still buying HD DVDs, scanning various boards and sites for kick ass deals and finding ALOT for the most part. Still involved heavily into the import market as well. And yes I can't wait till the Godfather Trilogy comes to HD DVD... Pre order is up for it at Amazon UK....


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## Earl Bonovich

Drew2k said:


> Uh-oh! Did someone tell Stuart there's a HD-DVD / Blu-ray discussion outside of the official stickies?!


I know it was partially meant in jest....

This isn't really an HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray discussion... as that is done, and over. The primary backers of HD-DVD pulled out... the optical "HD" format war is over...

However, this is was hopefully to be a discussion on "HD" entertainment options... not necessary optical/physical options, but other soft-stream options that are out there now... and will be out there in the near future.


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## smiddy

Perhaps I will put my foot in my mouth, but think we're media whores. I realize that is a real simplification of what we are, since it doesn't explain what I truely mean. So what do I mean? HD DVD or Blu Ray for later on. We are collectors which don't efficiently use our earned prizes (DVDs etcetera). Do we really need any of these things? I realize the philosophical questions it poses, but take a serious look at what it takes to thrive, so you need any of this to thrive?

The fact is, we buy due to a hyperactive rhetoric that captures our attention and since we think it makes us better we subscribe to it. We're lemmings!

I'm not *****ing, but simply realizing we're over the threshold of what we need to thrive, it is fleeting, like Disco.

We need to be entertained, this is certain, its engrained, but we don't need movies and certainly not HD.

I think we're going to use HD but perhaps not own all of what is available but simply rent it as we go...any wagers?

[BTW, I need to read the rest of this thread, then perhaps I may edit depending]


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## smiddy

deweybroncos said:


> I joined Netflix because I can rent Blu-ray and regular movies cheaper than pay per view, and its fast and easy. Also, since the kids are bigger, we no longer buy movies to watch over and over and *over*!


Now there's a perspective I can understand, I have two young'n's whom consume the most of our entertainmant budget in archival media. You captured a segment of the audience with what you just wrote.


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## Drew2k

Earl Bonovich said:


> I know it was partially meant in jest....


My tongue was firmly in cheek the entire time I was typing the opening, so that part was all jest. 

I'll be one of those people who will really be watching the alternatives (Unbox, Vudo, etc) to Blu Ray see how they fare over the next year, but I also think I like to actually OWN the media in a physical form, versus owning rights to access a digital stream that could be corrupted or that is limited to a specific device. I like the portability of physical media - the ability to take it to a friend's house for movie night, etc.

Like I said earlier, I'm looking for a lower priced BD 2.0 player later this year or even next year, but if something better comes along, I'm ready to consider it...


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## smiddy

hdtvfan0001 said:


> That would make you one of the smart people - but then you already are one.
> 
> With v1.1 deploying in some units over the next 3-6 months, followed by v2.0, there is absolutely no reason to rush.
> 
> In addition, since the BD disks themselves will start to contain extras and downloadable feature Javacode only supported in v 2.0 (with Ethernet), again....no reason to hurry.
> 
> The other issue is that the jury is out on Blu Ray's survival as well. Remember, both HD DVD and BD *together* only accounted for less than 3% of all movie disk sales....if market share on Blu Ray doesn't get up into the 15% or higher range....it's future may be in doubt as well.
> 
> Patience is prudent.


I don't understand the differences in version numbers (yet) so I need to be schooled int hat regard for sure.

Markey share, there is an area of understanding that I don't know about either and have thoughts on. I suspect that we're moving forward, thus since the general public sill see a clear winner (regardless of importance or pocket book) that BD is it. The numbers will only increase as time moves right. I invision that eventually everyting will be in HD (if you want people to watch it, their choice over time). Thus there is gaining traction towards one thing BD (until the next best thing comes about; BTW people will continue to want to archive their bounty [call it what you will]).


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## Tom Robertson

smiddy said:


> Perhaps I will put my foot in my mouth, but think we're media whores. I realize that is a real simplification of what we are, since it doesn't explain what I truely mean. So what do I mean? HD DVD or Blu Ray for later on. We are collectors which don't efficiently use our earned prizes (DVDs etcetera). Do we really need any of these things? I realize the philosophical questions it poses, but take a serious look at what it takes to thrive, so you need any of this to thrive?
> 
> The fact is, we buy due to a hyperactive rhetoric that captures our attention and since we think it makes us better we subscribe to it. We're lemmings!
> 
> I'm not *****ing, but simply realizing we're over the threshold of what we need to thrive, it is fleeting, like Disco.
> 
> We need to be entertained, this is certain, its engrained, but we don't need movies and certainly not HD.
> 
> I think we're going to use HD but perhaps not own all of what is available but simply rent it as we go...any wagers?
> 
> [BTW, I need to read the rest of this thread, then perhaps I may edit depending]


Smiddy, you forgot to take your medicine again, didn't you... 

Some of the movies I buy are favorite escapes to places, some are warm treasures enjoyed, some are little kids movies--for the little kid in me (and the grand-tibbers enjoy them too!), others are just plain fun.

So you feel about your media expenditures as you wish, I'm in it for the good times. 

Cheers,
Tom


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## Pink Fairy

Honestly, if we had not bought a PS3 for gaming reasons, I doubt we would have bought either type of player.

I love my PS3 and love the Blu Rays we have purchased - but I would not have cared if I had not bought it.


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## wakajawaka

I'm quite content with the HD options I have today. I have Directv with all the movie channels plus on demand. I have plenty of movies on my DVR ready to be watched. I was home sick the other day and watched a bunch of movies all in HD. That's not to say I would never buy into some other HD format (Blu-ray etc), it's just that my price point for entering another market is low, real low. So I'll wait to see what pans out while I'm enjoying plenty of HD content right now.


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## Chris Blount

Just to rehash, this is NOT a HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray thread. Thank you. 

I agree Earl. There a lot of other ways to get HD content. I am looking at the Blu-Ray releases and seriously considering not to buy any more Blu-Ray discs. They are expensive. It think if it wasn't for my Amazon Prime membership, I would have stopped a long time ago. Right now I'm getting free shipping and 10% off their already discounted price. Takes a $39 retail disc down to $25. Barely passable for my budget but if they go higher, forget it.

Right now DirecTV is doing a wonderful job supplying HD content. Apple TV is a great alternative for HD content from iTunes. There are others but it's obvious that Blu-Ray will have a tough time competing. It's going to be an interesting year.


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## paulman182

ebaltz said:


> And who determines what "being overcharged" is? You? The market decides. Apparently 10 million people or more felt the value of the PS3 was worth the price. I for 1 would pay twice what I did for mine and still be happy.


If 10 million people in the US bought it, evidently 293 million agree that it's not worth it to them...

Since I have all DirecTV's movie channels, I haven't purchased a DVD in a couple of years, especially since we have all the glorious HD. I know the advantages of DVD (extra stuff) and BD (extra stuff and improved image quality) but I have more than I can watch coming off the sat already.


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## cb7214

Stuart Sweet said:


> I would table all Blu-Ray discussion until the specs are mature, for example, what BD profile 2.0 promises to be. For myself, I will be looking for the $199 player with that does everything in the current spec.


well that is the big advantage with the PS3's, it doesn't matter what updates happen they have the advantage of the WIFI access built in so when the updates come they can update right away and won't have to worry about them being not compatiable


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## Stuart Sweet

Rather than discuss the merits of the PS3 over other players, I'll keep this thread on topic, and say that since I heard that Warner abandoned HD-DVD, I've ordered more HD-PPVs than I did in all of 2007, and purchased no new HD-DVDs. I think that's the point that Earl's trying to make, did the format war cause a paradigm shift? 

Back when, everyone thought DVD recorders would replace VCRs. But there were compatibility problems between recorders, two different recording technologies, prices were too high, the major players (in this case Apple and Microsoft) each backed different technologies. Sound familiar? 

What happened? People chose option "c" -- TiVo. DVD Recorders are a niche item now even though all the problems have been resolved. I'm beginning to wonder if Blu-Ray will suffer a similar fate, and from the sound of it, so is Earl.


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## bobukcat

Stuart Sweet said:


> Rather than discuss the merits of the PS3 over other players, I'll keep this thread on topic, and say that since I heard that Warner abandoned HD-DVD, I've ordered more HD-PPVs than I did in all of 2007, and purchased no new HD-DVDs. I think that's the point that Earl's trying to make, did the format war cause a paradigm shift?
> 
> Back when, everyone thought DVD recorders would replace VCRs. But there were compatibility problems between recorders, two different recording technologies, prices were too high, the major players (in this case Apple and Microsoft) each backed different technologies. Sound familiar?
> 
> What happened? People chose option "c" -- TiVo. DVD Recorders are a niche item now even though all the problems have been resolved. I'm beginning to wonder if Blu-Ray will suffer a similar fate, and from the sound of it, so is Earl.


These are good points but I find it interesting that in Japan DVD recorders and now BD Recorders sell much better than just the players and it appears to be the preferred format (media over hard drive).

FWIW, I really wanted to get into the HDM game and the PS3 was the best choice for me as it offers the best chance of being upgradable, has an Ethernet port, etc. and offers a lot of functionality outside of playing BD. I almost decided to just sit it out but I'm glad I didn't because I can watch a lot (and hopefully a lot more soon) of the new releases in HD via Netflix. So if you ask me, the answer to the OP is what are you willing to spend on a player today in order to enjoy the same?

As for prices of movies, I have about 25 BD movies now (including the five free ones) and haven't paid over $20 for any of them - including all five HP movies. Deals can be had just like for DVDs and HDDVDs.


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## chris0

DCSholtis said:


> And yes I can't wait till the Godfather Trilogy comes to HD DVD... Pre order is up for it at Amazon UK....


I'd be willing to bet cold hard cash that that doesn't see the light of day as a domestic release here in the US.


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## Alan Gordon

My advice is to jump on it... but unless you want a PS3, wait until the 2.0 players...

I was a Blu-ray supporter for years until they bungled things up in the beginning, and was told HD DVD was the better choice. I got it, was impressed, but when it appeared that HD DVD was never going to win the war, I started buying Blu-ray discs on sale, and then in May of last year, bought a PS3. Could not be happier with my choice. Months after getting my PS3, I had no interest in HD DVD anymore, so I sold my player and movies on EBay. 

I have ABSOLUTELY no interest in VOD, VUDU, XStreamHD or anything like that... I want a physical copy or it's a film that I care nothing about, and will gladly catch on SD DVD or a DirecTV freeview.

As far as the high price of discs, JR.com just had a sale on Blu-ray movies with a ton of titles for $11.99, Amazon.com recently had a B2G1 sale, and Amazon's got some discounted Blu-ray's on sale now.

No offense Earl, but I purchased "Ratatouille" on Blu-ray for less than $20, and while I haven't seen the SD DVD, the picture quality on the Blu-ray is so unbelievable that spending $10 for the SD DVD seems like a rip-off! While I don't have the equipment yet to hear the PCM soundtrack, I've heard it's a MAJOR improvement over the regular DD5.1 soundtrack...

~Alan


----------



## Pinion413

We have 2 Oppo upconverting players here. I find that they do a superb job at what they do. Most of out SD DVD's look just about as good as the HD feeds we get from DirecTV.

I'm not convinced enough to go out and put down the cash on Blu-ray just yet. Upscaled DVD looks quite good to my eye, even scaled to 1080p on our 40".

We have enough DVD's. I'm not sure if I want to get into another disc-based medium for movies. We have enough stuff taking up space here. Plus, if I have to have a movie, I can justify paying $15 or less for the DVD versus $25-$35 for the B-r version of it.

As much as I used to be (still sorta am) one of those who insisted on having to have a physical copy in my collection, I'm starting to feel that way less and less. What I'd really like is something like XStreamHD or a service along those lines. Obviously we need more internet bandwidth available before this stuff can really happen, so we're a little ways off. My thing with a service like that though is I would rather pay a monthly fee to have access to anything/everything versus a pay per play deal (hence why I don't do the XBOX Live Marketplace movie downloads at all, but do enjoy the Netflix streaming service I get, even if it is only SD and the selection isn't the greatest yet....).


----------



## Chris Blount

Pinion413 said:


> As much as I used to be (still sorta am) one of those who insisted on having to have a physical copy in my collection, I'm starting to feel that way less and less. What I'd really like is something like XStreamHD or a service along those lines. Obviously we need more internet bandwidth available before this stuff can really happen, so we're a little ways off. My thing with a service like that though is I would rather pay a monthly fee to have access to anything/everything versus a pay per play deal (hence why I don't do the XBOX Live Marketplace movie downloads at all, but do enjoy the Netflix streaming service I get, even if it is only SD and the selection isn't the greatest yet....).


Good points. Blu-Ray and HD-DVD will be my third "collection". At one point I had over 200 laserdiscs. Sold them all off to get their DVD counterparts. Now I'm doing the same with Blu-Ray and HD-DVD. Don't know if I want to do this for a third time (replacing my entire collection with a new format).

There are so many more options now to get HD. Like I said before, DirecTV alone is a great source of HD especially if you subscribe to all of the movie channels.

With the death of HD-DVD and the current state and prices of Blu-Ray, I really have to do some serious thinking whether or not I want to support yet another disc based format.


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Chris Blount said:


> Don't know if I want to do this for a third time (replacing my entire collection with a new format).


Exactly the reason I put off getting the White Album on CD for the longest time... Vinyl then 8-Track then cassette... I wanted to make sure CDs would be around a while.


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## machavez00

That's why I went with the PS3. There are games I do like to play that are now out, Unreal Tournament for One. I will be replacing very few movies that I have on DVD. The Godfather Triolgy will be one, if it is a new print transfer. I was disappointed with DVD transfer. It looks like a 20 year old prints was used, and the audio sounds like an echo chamber was used. Any new movies I buy will be BD.


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## jwebb1970

Well, I am/was on the HD DVD side. The $99 HDA2 sale last November (+ 7 free movies - 5 via rebate, 2 off BestBuy shelves) was too hard to pass up, esp since I was in the market for a new DVD player at the time. My daughter's old cheapie died & I was in the $75-$100 range as far as a replacement (was using a Sony upconverter in the living room). $99 for HD + free discs? Daughter now uses the Sony, HDA2 in the living room.

Had the big sale been on a BD player instead? I'd likely have bought that. Was willing to ride the fence on the HDM battle until a victor was announced.

After going "red", I have amassed a small collection of HD discs (around 30). Although I was sad to see what hapened to the format, I wasn't nearly as upset as many "fans" found on the Internet were.

Look, the player still works (and the Toshibas all appear to be solidly built - so this should continue for years) & the HD discs still play. SD DVDs look even better than they did on the Sony upconverter. I don't feel like I've wasted $$ on a dead format.

As retailers blow out thier stock, I will add a few more HD DVDs to the collection. Am also considering a backup player, as those prices are going south fast, as well.

As far as going Blu....I also am going to wait. Wait for prices to go down, for specs to be finalized (what is this I have seen elsewhere online that there may be a BD 2.5 in the future? Finish it already!!!) and for the format to show it has some "legs".

The jump from upscaled DVD to HDDVD/BD is not that great, IMO. Yes, I have seen differences in HD DVD/BD VS SD DVD. In some cases, its a marked difference - example: the 1st MATRIX on HD DVD is much cleaner, more crisp and eye-popping compared to the '99 snapcase WB DVD. In other cases, the jump is marginal at best - example: 2nd/3rd MATRIX films. I have the Trilogy HD set & owned the SD DVDs before that. 1st film is a big improvement in HD, 2 & 3---honestly have compared HD & SD DVD versions - not much difference. Slightly "punchier" audio & slightly sharper. But from normal viewing distance the "improvement" is pretty negligible.

If you have a well-mastered DVD in your player, it's gonna look REALLY nice on a good upconverter (or if your HDTV does that job well).

For most folks (as in the consumers who DON"T hang out on Internet tech forums) the gains in HD discs is just not enough to justify the costs. The gains are not nearly those that we saw when going from VHS to DVD. IN that switch, we got much improved PQ/AQ, random access, easier storage/portability, relatively indestructable physical form.....HD/BD doesn't have this advantage. It's still a movie on a shiny disc. Slightly better fidelity, maybe more bonus stuff (that may get used/watched once in most cases)...but really the same type of thing, but at ofter twice the price.

"Do I buy this DVD for $15, which will look/sound really nice or do I go w/ this "HD" disc of the same stuff, a little nicer looking, but essentially the same thing, for $30?" Yes, a true videophile would go with the latter. Last time I checked, hardcore videophiles do not make up anywhere near the majority of mass market consumers.

The real battle for either format was never it's rival in HDM, but w/ DVD itself. I have always felt that either HD media had a future of being this generations laserdisc - moderately popular, but still just a niche market.

As to the comments earlier about those waiting for prices to drop on a product that is meant to be enjoyed on a pricey display & sound system - I see this making absolute sense. Yes, you may have spent $1000's on your HDTV and/or HT system. So why are $300+ BD players "too much"? Simple - with said HDTV/HT system + a great upconverting DVD player (that will likely be sub $200), you get almost as good for less $$ and know that your existing DVDs and all future ones will work just fine - no profile issues, FW updates, etc.

Of course, us HD DVD "losers" sort of have our cake & get to eat it, too. Cheap players-in some cases, esp now- that are great upscalers + do "real" HD on the now finite number of discs issued.

So, even if HD DVD "lost", I still feel I have won.

And if there's a movie that comes to BluRay that I'd REALLY like to see in HD (but not necessarily _own_)? Guess what - DirecTv generally has 'em on PPV around the same time. Got to see Blu exclusves 3:10 TO YUMA & the "unrated" (left the f-words in) LIVE FREE OR DIE HARD in high-def via D* PPV.

The "unrated" ..DIE HARD isn't even on BluRay, just DVD. So score one for DirecTv PPV!


----------



## NO1B4ME

Earl Bonovich said:


> This thread is about your personal opinions/feelings on it.
> 
> Everyone has their price point....
> 
> I can not spend $30 on TNMT in HD... but I did spend $30 on Transformers..
> Each person has their own value point. Nothing wrong with that, and basically what this is all about.
> 
> If the technology in all these examples where Sub-$10... they would all have a place/home... but they are not... they do cost, and for some... cost too much.


This is definitely true. I jumped on the HD-DVD Bandwagon and bought like 100 movies. Heck I have 2 HD players and 1 blu Ray. I own like 20 Blurays but iwll not be buying too mnay like i did with HD.


----------



## Button Pusher

Earl Bonovich said:


> I was an HD-DVD guy... still am... And looking forward to picking up some more titles as the "fire-sale" kicks into full drive.
> 
> However... I am not running out to buy a blu-ray player (or PS3).
> 
> At CES, I was very impressed on the possibilities with XStreamHD.
> And of course DirecTV that I am already have cranking in the house.
> 
> I've have seen the VuDu stuff... and of course there is AppleTV/XBOX360 (which I already own)... for IPTV type options.
> 
> This article:
> http://www.usnews.com/blogs/daves-download/2008/2/20/7-reasons-to-forget-blu-ray.html
> 
> Gives 7 Reasons on why to forget about Blu-Ray...
> 
> After reading it... I do agree with most of it.
> I don't watch my library of DVD's the way we used to.... The movies get watched once, and then sit on the shelf for a while... until someone wants to borrow them... or I am bored.
> 
> The idea of getting them via the Internet or SAT.... to me, makes a ton of sense... especially for hot releases.... I would rather spend a lot less on single watches, then dropping $30 on a "High-Def" disk. (Hence why I only have about 7 HD-DVD's in the year plus I have owned the player).
> 
> Standard Def DVD's... the cost savings just isn't there... so I will still buy some long term "must haves" on Standard DVD (just got Ratatooie sp?) for $10


I was HD-DVD too but was planning on going format neutral with the Sharp Blu player since I have an Aquos TV. But from what I have read about the Sharp player it has some downfalls so I will wait. I just bought my Toshiba A35 in October.Doh! I should have waited out the war a little longer. Like you Earl I only have about ten HD-DVD's and five of those were the free ones. Which player do you have Earl?


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## flexoffset

I was always in the Blu-Ray camp and have been keeping track of this saga over the years. Ironically, the only reason I have a Blu-Ray player now is because my wife bought me a PS3 for Christmas. I'm still waiting on my 5 free BD's to arrive.

If I had my preference it would be: 
Download uncompressed 1080p HD content with 7.1 surround.
Store the content on the media server hard drives indefinitely.
Watch when I want to watch on any compatible device via gigabit LAN.
Watch whenever I want to watch with no restrictions on viewing time.

I prefer physical media - records, 8-tracks, cassette, cd, dvd - something I can touch. I accept the fact that multimedia is moving online. I will be thrilled if they can keep the quality of downloaded media comparable to what the best physical media has to offer. We will be at the mercy of our Internet Service Providers for all of it. THAT is what I'm most worried about.


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## bidger

flexoffset said:


> I prefer physical media - records, 8-tracks, cassette, cd, dvd - something I can touch.


I felt that way...until I started putting content on additional internal and external drives on my MCE 2005 PC. I have a 24 bit sound card with an optical connection to my A/V receiver. Ripped all my CD @ lossless setting. It's like having a digital jukebox, not one of those 400 CD/DVD monstrosities, instant access and I have well over 700 CDs at my disposal. I have them backed up and original discs are off in a side room locked up.

Bottom line, don't knock what you haven't tried. Back to the topic.


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## Earl Bonovich

Button Pusher said:


> Which player do you have Earl?


MSFT Add-On for the XBOX360... cost me $25 after reward certificats, and a $50 gift card.


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## Button Pusher

Earl Bonovich said:


> MSFT Add-On for the XBOX360... cost me $25 after reward certificats, and a $50 gift card.


That was a good deal! You can call me the unfortunate one. I bought my A35 when BB started carrying them and they were not even out on the shelf.You had to ask the salesperson if they had any in the back (this info came from AVS). I thought I was doing pretty good to find one.


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## cb7214

I was just reading Swanni's latest 2 cents on the HD DVD's I think he might be on something

Commentary
Sony & Toshiba Should Aid HD DVD Owners 
HD DVD's exit will leave a bad taste in the mouths of millions.
By Swanni

Washington, D.C. (February 28, 2008) -- Toshiba has a moral responsibility to provide either a discount or refund for the nearly one million people who now own HD DVD players (standalone and XBox players.)

Toshiba, the leading company behind the HD DVD format, announced last week that it would exit the high-def disc business by the end of March, ceding victory to rival Blu-ray.

link to full article
http://www.tvpredictions.com/toshibasony022808.htm


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## flexoffset

bidger said:


> ...I have a 24 bit sound card with an optical connection to my A/V receiver. Ripped all my CD @ lossless setting. It's like having a digital jukebox, not one of those 400 CD/DVD monstrosities, instant access and I have well over 700 CDs at my disposal. I have them backed up and original discs are off in a side room locked up.
> 
> Bottom line, don't knock what you haven't tried. Back to the topic.


???

Bottom line, we're talking about the future of acquiring HD content - not CDs. There's a big difference.
When did I _knock_ archiving CD's to central storage? I do that, too. I've been doing it for years and years.


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## bidger

Forgive me for reversing the order of your post.


flexoffset said:


> When did I _knock_ archiving CD's to central storage? I do that, too. I've been doing it for years and years.


Sorry, I figured your comment on 'physical media" meant you were against digital storage.


flexoffset said:


> Bottom line, we're talking about the future of acquiring HD content - not CDs. There's a big difference.


I don't see it. I have video files and find it easier to access content on a hard drive than on an optical disk. To me, HD content only means bigger files.


----------



## keith_benedict

Earl Bonovich said:


> I was an HD-DVD guy... still am... And looking forward to picking up some more titles as the "fire-sale" kicks into full drive.
> 
> However... I am not running out to buy a blu-ray player (or PS3).
> 
> At CES, I was very impressed on the possibilities with XStreamHD.
> And of course DirecTV that I am already have cranking in the house.
> 
> I've have seen the VuDu stuff... and of course there is AppleTV/XBOX360 (which I already own)... for IPTV type options.
> 
> This article:
> http://www.usnews.com/blogs/daves-download/2008/2/20/7-reasons-to-forget-blu-ray.html
> 
> Gives 7 Reasons on why to forget about Blu-Ray...
> 
> After reading it... I do agree with most of it.
> I don't watch my library of DVD's the way we used to.... The movies get watched once, and then sit on the shelf for a while... until someone wants to borrow them... or I am bored.
> 
> The idea of getting them via the Internet or SAT.... to me, makes a ton of sense... especially for hot releases.... I would rather spend a lot less on single watches, then dropping $30 on a "High-Def" disk. (Hence why I only have about 7 HD-DVD's in the year plus I have owned the player).
> 
> Standard Def DVD's... the cost savings just isn't there... so I will still buy some long term "must haves" on Standard DVD (just got Ratatooie sp?) for $10


I'm an HD-DVD guy, too. My parents bought an A30 for my family for Christmas.

However, I have yet to see a broadcast from any of Directv's HD channels that rivals HD-DVD and in most cases upconverted SD-DVD. The biggest issue for me is the sound. Even SD-DVD soundtracks have more detail and dynamic range than the best HD broadcasts from Directv. Now compare them to the newer audio codecs that come with HD-DVD or Blu-ray and the comparison gets even worse.

Does that mean I'm going to run out and buy a Blu-ray player? Absolutely not. Until prices for the players come down to HD-DVD player prices, I'll be perfectly fine with my upconverted SD-DVDs.


----------



## Snoofie

I had the XBOX 360 HD-DVD add-on and only bought it because of the price ($150 + free Heroes and 3 other HD-DVD's instantly and 5 mail-in) and I enjoyed it. I decided to sell it when it looked like HD-DVD was going to fold because I would only use it for HD-DVD's and not as an upconverting player. Just couldn't see holding on to it. Sold everything for $300 and actually made money so I'm happy with my results. I do want to get a Blu Ray player, but until they drop below $200 I won't buy one. I was tempted to get a PS3, but I just don't want two game consoles right now. So, I will keep watching DVD on my existing upconverting player until Blu Ray drops. From what I have seen from Sony though, they have no intention of dropping prices so it might be a long wait.


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## Earl Bonovich

On a slide note...

The HD-DVD add-on to the XBOX360... has much much much better support for recorded DVD's and CD's.


----------



## Alan Gordon

Earl Bonovich said:


> On a slide note...
> 
> The HD-DVD add-on to the XBOX360... has much much much better support for recorded DVD's and CD's.


Than what?

~Alan


----------



## Alan Gordon

Snoofie said:


> From what I have seen from Sony though, they have no intention of dropping prices so it might be a long wait.


Sony has announced two upcoming 2.0 players. One with a few additional bells and whistles for the same MSRP as their current Blu-ray player, and a second player priced $100 lower than their current Blu-ray player. The cheaper one will be out this Summer, and the second one will be out this Fall. Though I LOVE my PS3, I'll probably add a stand-alone later this year and get the one released in the Fall.

From your comments above, it appears that you would prefer a Sony over other brands, but other companies will be releasing additional models as well. Some should be lower than the Sony players...

~Alan


----------



## keith_benedict

Alan Gordon said:


> Sony has announced two upcoming 2.0 players. One with a few additional bells and whistles for the same MSRP as their current Blu-ray player, and a second player priced $100 lower than their current Blu-ray player. The cheaper one will be out this Summer, and the second one will be out this Fall. Though I LOVE my PS3, I'll probably add a stand-alone later this year and get the one released in the Fall.
> 
> From your comments above, it appears that you would prefer a Sony over other brands, but other companies will be releasing additional models as well. Some should be lower than the Sony players...
> 
> ~Alan


It looks like the less expensive model doesn't have analog audio out, which kills this player for me. I'd rather have the analog audio out than the 1.1 or 2.0 features.


----------



## flexoffset

That's cool bidger.
The intent of my post was to give my opinion that I'd love downloadable movies in 1080p.
Problem is the full-length HD feature films we can download don't compare to Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.
They are compressed and even sized down in some cases.

I concur. It's easier to download online content if top quality viewing is not a concern.


----------



## Alan Gordon

keith_benedict said:


> It looks like the less expensive model doesn't have analog audio out, which kills this player for me. I'd rather have the analog audio out than the 1.1 or 2.0 features.


The less expensive player has 5.1 analog outs and will decode Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD, and will output PCM and DTS-HD. It will only bitstream DTS-HD MA though as there is no DTS-HD MA.

The more expensive player has 7.1 analog outs and will decode all of the above as well as DTS-HD MA.

Expect the S350 to sell for $199 by this Christmas and the S550 to sell for $299 by this Christmas.

~Alan


----------



## ShawnL25

I purchased my blu-ray players nearly a year ago; at the time I looked at the two choices and deemed blu-ray the more viable option in the long term. Feels good to be right, but I just as easily could have been wrong. I just felt that if Blu-ray got the advantage that HD-DVD had less reason to stay and fight, where as had it been the other way, there still would be PS3’s and I felt it would be a long time before Sony or Disney would release on HD-DVD format. I made my educated guess and it has worked out. I have continually fought with the idea of going format neutral especially after the Paramount decision, but I never could bring myself to do it. I understand the argument of the picture not being that much better than D* HD or upconverted SD and in many cases this is true. I question why I would need Sleeping Beauty in HD or many traditional non-special effects fair. But if you have a higher end a/v setup then you can immediately recognize the difference is in the audio. I have yet to watch an HD broadcast on any channel from any provider that sounds as good as a DTS 5.1 dvd track. And I’ll guarantee even the biggest non-audiophiles can hear the difference between a dvd and blu-ray uncompressed audio. It has only after hearing the rumble of the 20th century Fox entrance music that I became a believer in the viability of a next gen optical format. 

I know that there are alot of you who seem stuck on all the different profiles, well know that you will be able to enjoy the movie experience on all players. The bump to 1.1 or 1.5 adds the ability to watch PIP commentaries, and bolsters some of the BD-Java features that is it. The jump to 2.0 adds more memory and online interconnectivity, this has been applied to such practices as group viewing sessions? And access to the movie store to buy merchandise on your movie box… the key behind adding Ethernet is the ease of updating to box. As for 2.5 it is rumored to add even more memory and wi-fi. The point is that none of the profile enhancements impair your ability to watch the movie. Also if you are worried about it the PS3 is good to go on all profiles. 

This brings me to the idea that downloadable content is some how the death nail in blu-ray coffin. Both the audio and video suffer greatly in all current modes of digital distribution, there are no special features, and you can’t take it with you. That for my is the killer I can’t lend it to a friend or sell it on ebay if I don’t like it. Heck I can’t even light it on fire in some sort of symbolic gesture to the studio’s to make better films. I just have it and when I’m done with it it goes away. This benefits the studio’s but not me. There is no bargain bin to rummage through for USED digital downloads. 

So I ask you now that HD DVD is DEAD what will it take to get you of the Blu-ray bandwagon. I personally think they should go after dvd the way it did vhs with day and date releases ahead of the tradition time frame. Historically most films where made available for rent 6-8 months after initial release, 6-12 weeks later the would be available for purchase. With DVD all film are available to rent or own the same day usually 4-6 months after initial theatrical release. What I propose Blu-ray should do is bump up there release date to own to 6-8 weeks after initial theatrical release I think this would go along way in justifying the higher prices and increase market penetration. Would this sway anyone, is there anything other than price that would?

I’m just asking - Shawn


----------



## Earl Bonovich

ShawnL25 said:


> So I ask you now that HD DVD is DEAD what will it take to get you of the Blu-ray bandwagon.


-) Movie prices to be sub $20 on release day.
-) An option for premium Hybrid Disks or an option to download the SD-DVD ISO's, so I and have that version for my other players in the house
-) PS3, that supports PS2/PS1 to be sub $300
-) A recordable option that is affordable, so I an dump my HD camcorder material to optical disk.

The future alternatives, to be so over priced... that it doesn't make sense.

I see in my future a PS3 as my Blu-Ray player.
But there is no doubt that I will be using DirecTV for HD movies (as a lot of movies I will probably only watch once)... and I REALLLLLYYYY like the looks of xStreamHD

For xStreamHD it is all going to be about the price point for the movies. (at least to me).


----------



## ShawnL25

To be clear I watch most of my movies in HD on HBO & Starz, but when something comes out that I am excited about I usually buy it on blu-ray.


----------



## Tom Robertson

Earl Bonovich said:


> -) Movie prices to be sub $20 on release day.
> -) An option for premium Hybrid Disks or an option to download the SD-DVD ISO's, so I and have that version for my other players in the house
> -) PS3, that supports PS2/PS1 to be sub $300
> -) A recordable option that is affordable, so I an dump my HD camcorder material to optical disk.
> 
> The future alternatives, to be so over priced... that it doesn't make sense.
> 
> I see in my future a PS3 as my Blu-Ray player.
> But there is no doubt that I will be using DirecTV for HD movies (as a lot of movies I will probably only watch once)... and I REALLLLLYYYY like the looks of xStreamHD
> 
> For xStreamHD it is all going to be about the price point for the movies. (at least to me).


Hey, didn't I see you in Vegas recently? Hobnobbing with Michael Douglas...  (Michael Douglass opened the XStreamHD press conference, for those who weren't aware. He also is a significant investor.)

We both agree XStreamHD has a great sounding concept and potential. Price points will be so very critical. Flexibility in the model will be important too. If they get this right, it will make a real niche that can grow into a real industry.

My guess is that at this point in my financial life, I can easily see Blu-Ray, XStreamHD, and DIRECTV all as important aspects in my HD viewing and "acquisition".

And I'm very thankful that I'm able to be in such a position. 

Cheers,
Tom


----------



## Stuart Sweet

Earl Bonovich said:


> -) Movie prices to be sub $20 on release day.
> -) An option for premium Hybrid Disks or an option to download the SD-DVD ISO's, so I and have that version for my other players in the house
> -) PS3, that supports PS2/PS1 to be sub $300
> -) A recordable option that is affordable, so I an dump my HD camcorder material to optical disk.
> 
> The future alternatives, to be so over priced... that it doesn't make sense.
> 
> I see in my future a PS3 as my Blu-Ray player.
> But there is no doubt that I will be using DirecTV for HD movies (as a lot of movies I will probably only watch once)... and I REALLLLLYYYY like the looks of xStreamHD
> 
> For xStreamHD it is all going to be about the price point for the movies. (at least to me).


I completely agree with Earl here. I am going to stay with PPV-HD until the price point is about where it is now for SD-DVD.

I really thought the idea of the HD/SD combo disc was a great one and I will say that I think people will miss this option until BD players are cheap enough to be everywhere. I do like the idea of a downloadable ISO for the SD content but I don't think the studios would embrace it, DRM and all.


----------



## keith_benedict

Earl Bonovich said:


> -) Movie prices to be sub $20 on release day.
> -) An option for premium Hybrid Disks or an option to download the SD-DVD ISO's, so I and have that version for my other players in the house
> -) PS3, that supports PS2/PS1 to be sub $300
> -) A recordable option that is affordable, so I an dump my HD camcorder material to optical disk.
> 
> The future alternatives, to be so over priced... that it doesn't make sense.
> 
> I see in my future a PS3 as my Blu-Ray player.
> But there is no doubt that I will be using DirecTV for HD movies (as a lot of movies I will probably only watch once)... and I REALLLLLYYYY like the looks of xStreamHD
> 
> For xStreamHD it is all going to be about the price point for the movies. (at least to me).


xStreamHD seems somewhat attractive, but I can't imagine having another dish and more wires run into my house. I also prefer to have physical media. I regularly share my discs with family members and expect them to do the same in return.


----------



## Tom Robertson

Keith, this is where I agree with both you and Earl. XStreamHD only is interesting to me if the pricing is spot on. Too high, and I would want to buy and own the physical media for portability and sharing with family instead.

Too low and the studios will say no or XStreamHD won't make any money.

This may boil down to I'll have several classes of movies:
1) one's I'll buy physically the moment I can, (and put into my own library) 
2) one's I'll "buy" in an XStreamHD library
3) one's I'll PPV and/or rent from any provider like DIRECTV, RedBox, or XStreamHD
4) one's that I'll wait for the Premium Channels on DIRECTV
5) never likely to watch in any form.

I no longer watch movies on broadcast or normal cable, btw. Too many commercials and too late after being in the theatres.  (I realize that is just me.)

Cheers,
Tom


----------



## Alan Gordon

Stuart Sweet said:


> I do like the idea of a downloadable ISO for the SD content but I don't think the studios would embrace it, DRM and all.


Some upcoming FOX Blu-ray releases come with a digital copy ("Hitman", "AvP:R" and "Juno") that you can copy to assorted devices. Sony has also stated that they have considered working on some digital copies for their Blu-ray discs that you can watch on your PSP, etc...

I do agree with one point, back when I was an HD DVD supporter, I did like the HD DVD Combo idea as it allowed me to loan my movies out to some family members that didn't have an HD DVD player. I didn't like that (at the time) Warner's HD DVD Combos were more expensive than their Blu-ray counterparts, but they later changed that. Either way, I don't really mind anymore as the family members who I lend my films to are planning on upgrading to Blu-ray later this year after seeing what Blu-ray looked like on their new HDTV...

~Alan


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## hdtvfan0001

ShawnL25 said:


> So I ask you now that HD DVD is DEAD what will it take to get you of the Blu-ray bandwagon. I'm just asking - Shawn


- Sub $20 new releases.
- Sub $250 dedicated players.
- Support for Javacode v2.0 and full Ethernet.
- Continued evidence that Blu Ray will survive by reaching 15% or more of the total movie disk market (they are at 2% now) - the studios are keeping their eyes on this one too.

In other words, its not going to happen for sure in 2008.


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## Tom Robertson

hdtvfan0001 said:


> - Sub $20 new releases.
> - Sub $250 dedicated players.
> - Support for Javacode v2.0 and full Ethernet.
> - Continued evidence that Blu Ray will survive by reaching 15% or more of the total movie disk market (they are at 2% now) - the studios are keeping their eyes on this one too.
> 
> In other words, its not going to happen for sure in 2008.


The first 3 might happen just in time for Christmas 2008. (Boosting the other up pretty close, if not there.)

Cheers,
Tom


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## pez2002

im watting for prices to drop then i will go blu


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## 408SJC

shocky said:


> BlockBuster Online movie rentals for me.  I'm grandfathered in for $14 a month for 2 DVDs out at a time with unlimited rentals & unlimited in-store exchange. (I switched from NetFlix to BlockBuster during the BlockBuster online beta before it was public) Within 48 hours of exchanging a movie at my local BlockBuster I already have a new one.
> 
> I realize this now costs $30+ for new customers but there are a TON of grandfathered customers and it's a great source for HD DVD & Blu-Ray titles (online has both stores have Blu-Ray only mostly).


I like netflix myself. Must be lucky that I live in San Jose. On Friday or Saturday I send my movies back and they get them on Monday and then send me the new releases on Monday afternoon and get them on Tuesday (the day they are released) One day turn for me. If I want more I can get a total of nine in a week. (for 20 bucks a month thats over 30 movies a month if i wanted) not bad if you ask me. But I might be moving to another state and was wondering how long it would take for them to get them to me. Sounds like it would not be as fast.

I also like optical media over downloads or sat because I can take it anywhere, not needing a internet connection or anything but the player. One room or a home media server or slingbox (which I have but not a great upload speed) wouldn't work for me.


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## SkersR1

408SJC said:


> I like netflix myself. Must be lucky that I live in San Jose. On Friday or Saturday I send my movies back and they get them on Monday and then send me the new releases on Monday afternoon and get them on Tuesday (the day they are released) One day turn for me. If I want more I can get a total of nine in a week. (for 20 bucks a month thats over 30 movies a month if i wanted) not bad if you ask me. But I might be moving to another state and was wondering how long it would take for them to get them to me. Sounds like it would not be as fast.


There are Netflix distribution points all over the country. I am in Nebraska and am 40 miles from the one in Omaha and get movies back in 1 day.


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## Pinion413

Earl Bonovich said:


> On a slide note...
> 
> The HD-DVD add-on to the XBOX360... has much much much better support for recorded DVD's and CD's.


...and can be had for around $50 now. :grin:


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## hdtvfan0001

Tom Robertson said:


> The first 3 might happen just in time for Christmas 2008. (Boosting the other up pretty close, if not there.)
> 
> Cheers,
> Tom


I suspect you are right, Tibbs...but as we both know....alot can happen between now and then......

In any case....it is really "wait and see" time as the dust settles and the next gen boxes are released.


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## jims

I know you can do it with a PC but PS3 has allowed me to watch YOUTUBE on my HDTV, quality wasn't great because the upload wasn't but the capability is there.

I beleive the focus is changing to how to make these boxes multi-functional, so that it is not just a DBS receiver or not just a gamebox. The real work will come in getting them to better recognise one another and getting better content and quality streamed over the net.


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## Earl Bonovich

jims;1482767......... getting better content and quality streamed over the net.[/QUOTE said:


> That is pretty much the #1 key factor to all of this.
> 
> With ISPs over stretched... and over allocated in a lot of places...
> Putting "hidden" bandwith caps on a lot of things....
> 
> The "net" connection piece may become a major factor in what eventually becomes common place.
> 
> Distribution model basically because the key factor then....
> As why I don't go BluRay today... as the cost for the disk (it's distribution method).
> 
> I don't even consier B&M rental stores anymore, unless it is an emergency or I have absolutely no other choice.
> 
> And NetFlix... just doesn't cut it for me, as we don't have that much time to watch enough movies to make the rental fees worth it.
> 
> I am so for 1 off's and even it requires a day earlier planning to get the download or something.... I see that as more my option.


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## jims

We got the PS3 for xmas and signed up at Blockbuster to rent through the mail. Have been steadily getting Bluerays but that might change. Any disk price is expensive if you are only going to watch it once or twice and to be honest if I keep a disk, I still tend to rewatch it more when it comes over the air (DBS). A lot of times a 60's era movie that I want to find is neither on the upcoming air, available in DVD, or on anything like Vongo. So once a really good repository is created it will make a big difference for me.


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## bjacot

My plan is to forget blu-ray. I have the xbox 360 hd-dvd add on, and several hd-dvd movies. 
The household watches movies in several rooms in the house and also in the family truckster on the way to grandma's. I liked the hd-dvd combo discs that I could watch in high-def in "my" room and still play it in the other rooms in SD and also in the mini-van.
What would I do with blu-ray? If I wanted to watch ratatouille I could buy a new blu-ray player for every room in the house, but then what would I do about the mini-van?
Why does it seem that in these format wars, common sense loses?
I'm not planning on buying any hd format discs anytime soon. 
I'm all for moving towards an all-digital format. I want movies to work like my music. I can network devices in all the rooms of the house to play my mp3s and I can stick them on my portable music player and play them in my car on the way to work. Too much to ask?


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## shocky

408SJC said:


> I like netflix myself. Must be lucky that I live in San Jose. On Friday or Saturday I send my movies back and they get them on Monday and then send me the new releases on Monday afternoon and get them on Tuesday (the day they are released) One day turn for me. If I want more I can get a total of nine in a week. (for 20 bucks a month thats over 30 movies a month if i wanted) not bad if you ask me. But I might be moving to another state and was wondering how long it would take for them to get them to me. Sounds like it would not be as fast.
> 
> I also like optical media over downloads or sat because I can take it anywhere, not needing a internet connection or anything but the player. One room or a home media server or slingbox (which I have but not a great upload speed) wouldn't work for me.


I've had pretty good luck with blockbuster too. But with blockbusters new pricing model I'de switch to netflix if I didn't have my free in-store rentals.


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## bobukcat

bjacot said:


> I'm all for moving towards an all-digital format. I want movies to work like my music. I can network devices in all the rooms of the house to play my mp3s and I can stick them on my portable music player and play them in my car on the way to work. Too much to ask?


If you want this in HD or near HD quality the studios' response will be "yes, it is too much to ask!"


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