# WB616 Rocks!



## wavemaster (Sep 15, 2007)

I had 12 ports available before by going through 2 WB68's.

Aside from a lack of additional ports I have been seeing "searching for sat..." a bunch of times for usually a couple seconds before the channel would light up.

With the dish aligned as good as it gets I got 90-100's on a lot of transponders but on the new 103 bird it was high 80's mid 90's.

After the WB616 install the "searching..." is gone, the channels synch up instantly and I see about a 4-6% increase on signal across the board. Earlier the receivers running off the second WB68 were always slower and weaker than the first but good in general. Now with the 616 they are all in the 90's to 100.

The extra 4 ports won't hurt either I'm sure.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

Sounds very cool! I've considered the upgrade myself (no real need except future expandability) but with the SWM coming out for general use RealSoonNow!(TM) for awhile, I've held off. One thing that concerns/interests me is the power insertion. How do you hand that? My current WB16 is in the crawlspace beneath my house where my switches have always been installed. My concern has always been whether I would need to put an AC outlet under there for the job. Of course I could always use a utility light or two under there anyway, but I'd rather not have to do any wiring if I can avoid it.


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## mjbehren (Nov 21, 2006)

LameLefty said:


> Sounds very cool! I've considered the upgrade myself (no real need except future expandability) but with the SWM coming out for general use RealSoonNow!(TM) for awhile, I've held off. One thing that concerns/interests me is the power insertion. How do you hand that? My current WB16 is in the crawlspace beneath my house where my switches have always been installed. My concern has always been whether I would need to put an AC outlet under there for the job. Of course I could always use a utility light or two under there anyway, but I'd rather not have to do any wiring if I can avoid it.


You will need AC for the SWM when it is available. It is a powered device.

Mb


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

That is the nice thing about a powered switch, the LNBs are always all fully energized, ready to send signal down the line. 

Congrats on a solid configuration!
Tom


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

mjbehren said:


> You will need AC for the SWM when it is available. It is a powered device.
> 
> Mb


The SWM is more easily powered at the receiver location than other switches. The SWM power supply passes satellite signals thru to the receiver, unlike powered switches.

Cheers,
Tom


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## ChicagoTC (Sep 14, 2007)

Isn't power for SWMs and other powered multiswitches sent via RG6. My old Eagle Aspen was that way. I just ran another RG6 cable to my MS outside and their is an AC/RG6 adapter inside my house.

http://www.solidsignal.com/images/5x8_install_help.gif


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

What I like about non-powered switches is that you don't have to get a power to the switch when the power is out with a generator.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

Tom Robertson said:


> The SWM is more easily powered at the receiver location than other switches. The SWM power supply passes satellite signals thru to the receiver, unlike powered switches.
> 
> Cheers,
> Tom


I guess that answers my question then.  I'll wait for an SWM5 and find a way to run it and my WB68 in parallel when it's available.


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

Tom Robertson said:


> That is the nice thing about a powered switch, the LNBs are always all fully energized, ready to send signal down the line.
> 
> Congrats on a solid configuration!
> Tom


Would it be possible to wire up a hack with a power supply connected to a WB68 to achieve the same as the WB616 does in keeping the LNBs energized all of the time ?


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> Would it be possible to wire up a hack with a power supply connected to a WB68 to achieve the same as the WB616 does in keeping the LNBs energized all of the time ?


There are things called signal lockers that some folks are using with great success. I think that achieves the same end as a fully-powered switch. Solid Signal sells such beasties. I don't use one but I'm sure someone who does will chime in shortly.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

wavemaster said:


> I had 12 ports available before by going through 2 WB68's.


This is where you went wrong. You're not supposed to cascade the WB68!


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## wavemaster (Sep 15, 2007)

The WB616 has power using a standard RG6 cable that (in the manual says) can be extended 100'.

I have the switch installed in the back of the media room behind the wall, it's actually like a utility room we built out from the wall before adding all the media. This way I could flush mount all the devices and still have air controlled access behind it.

I took a couple 30AMP 3000KVA UPS's from work to plug all the switches, boxes, projector, widescreen etc. The two tubes above the 57 (matched 27") are not on the UPS but they are just for the cameras or NFLST so redundancy wasn't very important.

I work from home and I built my office into the back of the media room so I can play with it all day. If I didn't work from home I could never justify what we have done and continue to do but being in there 16 hrs a day (due to work) I may as well be comfortable.

2 thumbs up for the WB816!


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

LameLefty said:


> There are things called signal lockers that some folks are using with great success. I think that achieves the same end as a fully-powered switch. Solid Signal sells such beasties. I don't use one but I'm sure someone who does will chime in shortly.


Thanks, I am on the hunt for them.


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## wavemaster (Sep 15, 2007)

harsh said:


> This is where you went wrong. You're not supposed to cascade the WB68!


Actually the installers said this was the only way to get the 12 ports with two of them (as well as the manual).

They took the 4 leads from the dish and went into the 4 inputs on one WB68. Then out of the first 4 outputs of WB68 #1 into the first 4 inputs of WB68 #2. This left 4 available ports on #1 and 8 available on #2.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> Thanks, I am on the hunt for them.


Here's a power inserter that works with the WB68. I don't have one but I've heard good things about this one.

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=HRPID1422&xzoom=Large#xview


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

RunnerFL said:


> Here's a power inserter that works with the WB68. I don't have one but I've heard good things about this one.
> 
> http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=HRPID1422&xzoom=Large#xview


That is the most popular model, lots of good success stories.

LameLefty, I like the SWM8, works very well, and simplifies the cabling so much while also being powered.

Cheers,
Tom


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## mattw (Sep 28, 2006)

Tom Robertson said:


> The SWM is more easily powered at the receiver location than other switches. The SWM power supply passes satellite signals thru to the receiver, unlike powered switches.
> 
> Cheers,
> Tom


If/When I get an SWM I figured this is what I would do. Put the PI behind the HR20 so that I can plug it into the UPS powering the HR20. All other boxes would come off the legacy or SWM 2 outputs.


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

RunnerFL said:


> Here's a power inserter that works with the WB68. I don't have one but I've heard good things about this one.
> 
> http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=HRPID1422&xzoom=Large#xview


Thanks, just ordered it from Solid Signal for $44.99 + $8 for shipping, from this URL:

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?prod=HRPID1422

Looking forward to improving channel changing lag time by having all the LNBs energized all the time and locked. Too cool.

User manual attached.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Do these actually decrease channel tuning lag times ?



bt-rtp said:


> Thanks, just ordered it from Solid Signal for $44.99 + $8 for shipping, from this URL:
> 
> http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?prod=HRPID1422
> 
> ...


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

JeffBowser said:


> Do these actually decrease channel tuning lag times ?


Yes, it locks the polarity in each LNB so no horizontal to vertical switching occurs in a LNB when a channel is changed and it also keeps each LNB energized all of the time.

Also eliminates the brief "searching for signal" message and increases the measured transponder S/N levels by 4 to 6%.


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## Crypter (Jun 21, 2007)

I just ordered one. Thanks!


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Well, my signal levels are all in the 90's, and I have never gotten a searching for signal message, so my only reason to buy this would be faster tuning, period, so that's my trigger - if it noticabley affects that, then I'm sold



bt-rtp said:


> Yes, it locks the polarity in each LNB so no horizontal to vertical switching occurs in a LNB when a channel is changed and it also keeps each LNB energized all of the time.
> 
> Also eliminates the brief "searching for signal" message and increases the measured transponder S/N levels by 4 to 6%.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

Interesting. Faster tuning is a good thing. Is there anyway to insert power (aside from the power coming from the receiver) into the WB68 multi-switch?


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

Hansen said:


> Interesting. Faster tuning is a good thing. Is there anyway to insert power (aside from the power coming from the receiver) into the WB68 multi-switch?


Read up this thread a few posts - you're looking for a signal locker.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

No, that's why we're discussing this locker.



Hansen said:


> Interesting. Faster tuning is a good thing. Is there anyway to insert power (aside from the power coming from the receiver) into the WB68 multi-switch?


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

Thanks. I took a look at the signal locker specs on Solid Signal's website and see what it is doing. Very nice. Easy/cost effecient add-on alternative if you already have the WB68. How much of an increase in tuning response time are we talking here? Significantly noticeable better tuning times or is it marginally noticeable?


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## steelr (Sep 24, 2006)

wavemaster said:


> Actually the installers said this was the only way to get the 12 ports with two of them (as well as the manual).
> 
> They took the 4 leads from the dish and went into the 4 inputs on one WB68. Then out of the first 4 outputs of WB68 #1 into the first 4 inputs of WB68 #2. This left 4 available ports on #1 and 8 available on #2.


Did you pay extra for the 16 port or did Direct tv have it installed for you? The reason I ask is that my local installers told me they would never carry this MS and if I wanted one, I would have to purchase it myself and try to get D* to re-imburse me.


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## dpfaunts (Oct 17, 2006)

Ordered one too..... my HR20-100 seems to have a channel switching lag problem from time to time.


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## alant40 (Oct 8, 2006)

wavemaster said:


> Actually the installers said this was the only way to get the 12 ports with two of them (as well as the manual).
> 
> They took the 4 leads from the dish and went into the 4 inputs on one WB68. Then out of the first 4 outputs of WB68 #1 into the first 4 inputs of WB68 #2. This left 4 available ports on #1 and 8 available on #2.


Interesting statement. I have 2 WB68 cascaded by using splitters from the dish coaxes to the respective switches. That way I have the use of all 16 ports. I have 2 open and my system has been working fine ever since I put it together. DTV installers didn't think it would work, but some in these forums have the exact same config and it does work.

Alan


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

i am assuming a WB616 would have the same effect of the the sonora since it is powered as well?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

compnurd said:


> i am assuming a WB616 would have the same effect of the the sonora since it is powered as well?


I would think so. The sonora has other things built into it like splitting but as far as locking I would think it would be the same as the powered WB616.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

compnurd said:


> i am assuming a WB616 would have the same effect of the the sonora since it is powered as well?


Yes, that seems to be what the data say. And would keep all the LNBs energized all the time.

Cheers,
Tom


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

wow, maybe I should get a kick back based on how many people have bought one after I pasted the link. :lol:


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

Hmm So basically the sonora powers the dish and the boxes power the wb68?


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

Hansen said:


> Thanks. I took a look at the signal locker specs on Solid Signal's website and see what it is doing. Very nice. Easy/cost effecient add-on alternative if you already have the WB68. How much of an increase in tuning response time are we talking here? Significantly noticeable better tuning times or is it marginally noticeable?


The words "instant channel changing" were used in other threads.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> The words "instant channel changing" were used in other threads.


Thanks!! That decides it for me. I'm getting about 2.5 seconds of black screen between channel changes and sometimes a bit more delay if I change them too fast. My hope is this might fix that issue.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

How much does that upgrade cost for the WB68 since I already have one?


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

SParker said:


> How much does that upgrade cost for the WB68 since I already have one?


Looks like the Sonora Signal locker is about $45 plus shipping ($8) at Solid Signal. http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?prod=HRPID1422

Not bad if the gain (elimination of channel change lag) is indeed as significant as suggested.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

So I would actually need multiple WB68's to make use of it? I really only need one.


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## RichH25 (Jun 17, 2007)

wavemaster said:


> I had 12 ports available before by going through 2 WB68's.
> 
> Aside from a lack of additional ports I have been seeing "searching for sat..." a bunch of times for usually a couple seconds before the channel would light up.
> 
> ...


Fully agree that the WB616 is great. I think is makes for a much cleaner install than cascading WB68's. I put a WB616 in my media panel several months ago when I finished my basement. I have been very pleased with the performance. The need for power was not an issue for me. I already had to have power to the panel as it also houses a cable modem, router, and switch.


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## Azeke (Sep 21, 2006)

I also own the WB616 for about a year. I initially had the WB68 installed in a cascade configuration, with power pass splitters, too much hardware. The WB616 made a much cleaner installation, also I requested reimbursement from Directv, and my request was granted. The WB616 performs well with minimal signal loss.

Peace and blessings,

Azeke


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

So far, I have not seen anyone point out the added benefit of not having to unplug the receivers when changing wires around etc on the WB616. With the WB68, we should unplug the receivers when changing wires around, to prevent the chance of shorting against the connectors since this switch is powered from the receiver port. To protect against this with the WB616 all we have to do is unplug the multiswitch from the electrical outlet.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

My signals on 103(b) just died again just like last night *sigh*. So the WB616 will make channel changes almost instantaneous just like the Sonora? Almost tempted to get one. This is happening to my parents HR20 to so I doubt its BBC's.. It bloody annoying!


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

SParker said:


> So I would actually need multiple WB68's to make use of it? I really only need one.


You can use the signal locker on 1, 2, or even more WB68s as needed. In your case, a single WB68 will work great on the signal locker.

Cheers,
Tom


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

Tom Robertson said:


> You can use the signal locker on 1, 2, or even more WB68s as needed. In your case, a single WB68 will work great on the signal locker.
> 
> Cheers,
> Tom


I assume it goes Dish>Signal Locker>WB68


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

compnurd said:


> I assume it goes Dish>Signal Locker>WB68


Precisely!


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Tom Robertson said:


> You can use the signal locker on 1, 2, or even more WB68s as needed. In your case, a single WB68 will work great on the signal locker.
> 
> Cheers,
> Tom


Okay Tom, so one signal locker would help me not get the intermittent signal loss on 103(b) on both of my HR20's?


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

SParker said:


> Okay Tom, so one signal locker would help me not get the intermittent signal loss on 103(b) on both of my HR20's?


If all the cables are in good shape, the LNB isn't failing, and the switch isn't at fault on its own, then yes, you should be in good shape. 

A signal locker can't hurt, it can only help.

Cheers,
Tom


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Tom Robertson said:


> If all the cables are in good shape, the LNB isn't failing, and the switch isn't at fault on its own, then yes, you should be in good shape.
> 
> A signal locker can't hurt, it can only help.
> 
> ...


As far as I know they are. So basically I would unplug all the inputs from the WB68 and plug those into the HRPID1422. Leave all the outs connected to the WB68. Then run short little coaxs to the HRPID1422 out to WB68 in?


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

SParker said:


> As far as I know they are. So basically I would unplug all the inputs from the WB68 and plug those into the HRPID1422. Leave all the outs connected to the WB68. Then run short little coaxs to the HRPID1422 out to WB68 in?


Yupper, you gots the picture.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

wavemaster said:


> Actually the installers said this was the only way to get the 12 ports with two of them (as well as the manual).


Using four power passing, high frequency splitters, you can get 16 ports out of two WB68s. You have more ports and both WB68s get all the power they need.


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## alwayscool (Sep 24, 2006)

steelr said:


> Did you pay extra for the 16 port or did Direct tv have it installed for you? The reason I ask is that my local installers told me they would never carry this MS and if I wanted one, I would have to purchase it myself and try to get D* to re-imburse me.


I just got my HR20-700S, Slimline Dish, WB616 which feeds a WB68, for a total of 20 outputs, and a free install from D* and they charged me for shipping only (about $21.00), but gave me $60.00 in credits. So the ended up paying me $39.00 to upgrade! When I placed my order I stressed that my current setup had 16 outputs (8 on each side of my house), so the installer would need a WB616 and WB68. When he arrived he didn't have the WB616, so I told him he had better go back to his shop and get one or forget the install. About 30 minutes he showed up with it! Works great and I'm enjoying all these new HD channels. I really like the Smithstonian HD channel it rocks!


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## vetrev (Sep 1, 2007)

steelr said:


> Did you pay extra for the 16 port or did Direct tv have it installed for you? The reason I ask is that my local installers told me they would never carry this MS and if I wanted one, I would have to purchase it myself and try to get D* to re-imburse me.


I got the same song and dance from my installer. In fact, he told me I'd have to pay an additional $149 to get one. I sent him away and began to call D* and kept calling. Finally, I got the right CSR in "installations" who knew about the 6x16 and wrote up a proper work order. Unfortunately, when another service tech came out a few days later, he didn't have one on the truck either! But he was a nice guy and let me talk to his service supervisor who actually brought the switch out himself the next day (a 45-minute round trip for him)! I did the install myself, which didn't trouble me.

I don't know about the rest of you, but it seemed to me that the color saturation was better with the WB616 than it had been previously. The picture appeared to my untrained eye to be sharper and more vivid.


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

Just ordered my 616. DTV said they'd credit my account for me purchasing it. Installers will be out on Monday to put in a new receiver (HR20 # 3  ) and another WB68.

I just can't bring myself to having such a cabling nightmare and the high potential for failing connectors not to mention I'm sure they won't be bringing a signal locker with them. I'm taking the "less is more" approach and I'm going to let them install what they are going to install and then I'm going to go right behind them and swap the spider web out for a WB616 and get my $141.00 credit promised by D*

Can't wait for those instant channel changes......


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Stupid forum. Once again it costs me money. I had looked at the signal lockers before, but I didn't realize it would also speed up channel changes. Mine will be here Tuesday.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> Stupid forum. Once again it costs me money. I had looked at the signal lockers before, but I didn't realize it would also speed up channel changes. Mine will be here Tuesday.


Yeh i ordered the Signal locker and a new Wb68 as well. Will be here tuesday to!!

cant wait.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

So, setting aside the price differences, which is better to go with in terms of performance: the WB616 or the Sonora signal locker?


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

That's a good question - I'd like to hear the answer to that. Surely they are not identical in all ways....



Hansen said:


> So, setting aside the price differences, which is better to go with in terms of performance: the WB616 or the Sonora signal locker?


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

Hansen said:


> So, setting aside the price differences, which is better to go with in terms of performance: the WB616 or the Sonora signal locker?


WB616. Much cleaner install. Fewer connections is usually better.

On a side note, I have had the WB616 since it was available. I have not had any of the issues that some had with the HR20 in its early days. Just a few random lockups and no more than my HR10's. I firmly believe that my lack off issues has been a direct result of having a powered switch.


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

JeffBowser said:


> That's a good question - I'd like to hear the answer to that. Surely they are not identical in all ways....


The only dfference that I see in the documentaion is that the Sonora has polarity locking for each LNB. The Zinwell WB616 manual makes no specific mention of this.

http://www.sonoradesign.com/images/Sheet_HRPID1422_11.pdf

http://www.zcwc.com/zcwc/tech_support/usermenual/multi_switch/usermanuals/wb_616/WB616manual.pdf


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

bt-rtp said:


> The only dfference that I see in the documentaion is that the Sonora has polarity locking for each LNB. The Zinwell WB616 manual makes no specific mention of this.
> 
> http://www.sonoradesign.com/images/Sheet_HRPID1422_11.pdf
> 
> http://www.zcwc.com/zcwc/tech_support/usermenual/multi_switch/usermanuals/wb_616/WB616manual.pdf


If I am reading the spec's correctly, the Sonora has signal locking at the LNB while the WB616 does not so the Sonora may provide a little faster switching.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I was talking to my Dad about the 771 problem we are having and about the Sonora and the WB616. He thinks if its not a connection problem then we should just get a WB616 to replace the WB68 since we are all maxed out with 8 hookups on the 6x8 anyways. So the channel changing would be quite a bit faster with the WB616 compared to the 6x8?


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

How about taking a look from a differ angle - what are the drawbacks to a polarity locker - why doesn't DirecTV just build one in and power all their multi-switches ? Is it cost alone ?


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> How about taking a look from a differ angle - what are the drawbacks to a polarity locker - why doesn't DirecTV just build one in and power all their multi-switches ? Is it cost alone ?


Hmm.... must be an engineer!  I would think cost.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

techrep said:


> If I am reading the spec's correctly, the Sonora has signal locking at the LNB while the WB616 does not so the Sonora may provide a little faster switching.


So, it sounds like the Sonora may provide a little bit better performance in the end. ????


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> The only dfference that I see in the documentaion is that the Sonora has polarity locking for each LNB. The Zinwell WB616 manual makes no specific mention of this.


Of course the Sonora mentions this as it has no other function. The WB616 has to do the same even if it is not specifically mentioned.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Herdfan said:


> Of course the Sonora mentions this as it has no other function. The WB616 has to do the same even if it is not specifically mentioned.


How fast are the channel changes with the 616?


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## McCoyRJ (May 21, 2007)

On the Sonora, can I run RG6 from the power input to an outlet inside my house like I did the old DTV48?


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## chrisexv6 (Sep 14, 2002)

Seems that the power connection is a standard coax. 

I did the same thing with my old 5x8 switch, extended with a good piece of RG6 and an RCA to coax connector (although teh Sonora looks to be a coax connection on each end, so you just need a coax cable with 2 female ends to extend it).

Reading the tech spec, Im unclear.....does it matter which cable goes to which input? I dont think it does, just wanted to be sure. Instant channel changing is a good thing  I might buy me one of these.

-Chris


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## McCoyRJ (May 21, 2007)

Since I'm already setup for the power supply (if it's standard coax), I guess I'll buy one. Dam*! It's expensive for me to visit this site! :lol:


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

Hansen said:


> So, setting aside the price differences, which is better to go with in terms of performance: the WB616 or the Sonora signal locker?


My opinion on it is the WB616 t is a cleaner install with fewer connections and devices. Parallel WB68s with the addition to 4 splitters etc just gives too much to troubleshoot should part of the assembly go bad. On the upside it would be cheaper to replace a component using 2 WM68s....so there's pros and cons to going both ways.

The function and performance may be similar, may be identical, but the fewer connections you have the less potential for problems with those connectors. Plus the 616 will be a much neater install and take up less space.


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

Herdfan said:


> Of course the Sonora mentions this as it has no other function. The WB616 has to do the same even if it is not specifically mentioned.


In stepping back and taking a fresh look; each multiswitch (by definition) is a signal locker. In a cascade setup, each MS in series must process the signal from the receiver to the dish (including the one in the LNB arm.) A independent signal locker (in this case the Sonora) can see the MS's in parallel so the signal would only have to pass through one of the MS's then be sent to the LNB.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

Hansen said:


> So, setting aside the price differences, which is better to go with in terms of performance: the WB616 or the Sonora signal locker?


It depends. I would say if you have more then 8 boxes or plan to have more, get a Wb616. If you have 8 or less and just want the boost, get the locker and WB68.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Those of us who have latched onto the current signal locker\WB616 hysteria this week will all have to gather together again next week and either report success, or bemoan our lack of self control when nothing really noticable happens upon installation :lol:


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> Those of us who have latched onto the current signal locker\WB616 hysteria this week will all have to gather together again next week and either report success, or bemoan our lack of self control when nothing really noticable happens upon installation :lol:


Ya, if I am through scratching my head by then.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I have a half-baked idea that perhaps the temperatures on my H20-600's, which are over 150 feet from the dish all told, drop a few degrees when they don't have to drive 18 volts quite so far. Or, at least, maybe extend their life-spans.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I had my Dad check the connections on the dish and multiswitch, he said some tightened up a little so I guess I should wait and see if the problem continues before jumping on the WB616.


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> Those of us who have latched onto the current signal locker\WB616 hysteria this week will all have to gather together again next week and either report success, or bemoan our lack of self control when nothing really noticable happens upon installation :lol:


Jeff I'll let you know for sure. I'm going to let the installers do their spider web thing then undo everything after a few days and install my WB616.......I'll report back.


----------



## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

I think I'm going with the WB616 since it does the same thing but it'll help keep the number of connections, jumpers, and possible failure points less.


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## llowrey (May 8, 2007)

I'm rather skeptical a signal locker will improve channel changing time by a noticeable amount. Theoretically, if you have a receiver on a channel on a particular transponder, changing to the other channels on that transponder with another receiver (or tuner) should occur w/o having to cause the LNB to re-lock. So, you should see the same predicted speedup. I sure didn't. Here's what I did on my HR20.

Tune to ch 312 > 279 > 277 > 312 > 279 > 277.

According to the transponder map, these are all sat 101, transponder 14.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=96144

This yielded the following states.

Tuner 1 (312) - Tuner 2 (n/a)
Tuner 1 (312) - Tuner 2 (279)
Tuner 1 (277) - Tuner 2 (279)
Tuner 1 (277) - Tuner 2 (312)
Tuner 1 (279) - Tuner 2 (312)
Tuner 1 (279) - Tuner 2 (277)

At all times, one or both tuners were putting out the signal to tune to transponder 14 so the LNB should have remained powered up and locked on the entire time. I saw no noticeable improvement in channel changing time.

I must be missing something...


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Interesting observations -



llowrey said:


> I'm rather skeptical a signal locker will improve channel changing time by a noticeable amount. Theoretically, if you have a receiver on a channel on a particular transponder, changing to the other channels on that transponder with another receiver (or tuner) should occur w/o having to cause the LNB to re-lock. So, you should see the same predicted speedup. I sure didn't. Here's what I did on my HR20.
> 
> Tune to ch 312 > 279 > 277 > 312 > 279 > 277.
> 
> ...


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## McCoyRJ (May 21, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> Those of us who have latched onto the current signal locker\WB616 hysteria this week will all have to gather together again next week and either report success, or bemoan our lack of self control when nothing really noticable happens upon installation :lol:


:lol: We who ordered should take great care to see that all packaging materials are not damaged, as well as the Sonora itself when we install. Makes for a nice and easy merchandise return.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

Hansen said:


> I think I'm going with the WB616 since it does the same thing but it'll help keep the number of connections, jumpers, and possible failure points less.


I almost did that but saved the 30 bucks and by the time i need 16 ports, i will get a SWM-8


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

llowrey said:


> I'm rather skeptical a signal locker will improve channel changing time by a noticeable amount. Theoretically, if you have a receiver on a channel on a particular transponder, changing to the other channels on that transponder with another receiver (or tuner) should occur w/o having to cause the LNB to re-lock. So, you should see the same predicted speedup. I sure didn't. Here's what I did on my HR20.
> 
> Tune to ch 312 > 279 > 277 > 312 > 279 > 277.
> 
> ...


I will let you know tuesday if my signals are higher and if i notice anything.

i needed a ew Wb68 anyway so 40 bucks for the power doesnt break the bank. If it sucks, i can always return it


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

All of this was already proven in back in 2006. Just check your threads people.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Was it ? Do you have a thread link ? I sure didn't find anything proving anything with the search terms I could think up.



bt-rtp said:


> All of this was already proven in back in 2006. Just check your threads people.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

If nothing else, folks, it will save wear and tear on your receivers since the tuners won't have to drive the switches. Internal temps will probably decrease a degree or three and you shouldn't be seeing 771 errors, even for just a moment. I get those once in a great while when four or five receivers are active at once and there is obviously some simultaneous channel changing going on in the house, especially in cold weather. Remember, the Zinwells are mechanic switches and will be affected by the environment they're in. Most of us probably don't have them in heated spaces. Mine at least is in the crawlspace of the house, so it's shielded from the worst temperature extremes, but a powered switch is almost always a good idea anyway, for a lot of reasons.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Mine is absolutely in a heated space  My S. Florida attic :lol:



LameLefty said:


> If nothing else, folks, it will save wear and tear on your receivers since the tuners won't have to drive the switches. Internal temps will probably decrease a degree or three and you shouldn't be seeing 771 errors, even for just a moment. I get those once in a great while when four or five receivers are active at once and there is obviously some simultaneous channel changing going on in the house, especially in cold weather. Remember, the Zinwells are mechanic switches and will be affected by the environment they're in. Most of us probably don't have them in heated spaces. Mine at least is in the crawlspace of the house, so it's shielded from the worst temperature extremes, but a powered switch is almost always a good idea anyway, for a lot of reasons.


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## mattw (Sep 28, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> Mine is absolutely in a heated space  My S. Florida attic :lol:


I'll vouch for that! I was in my attic in Orlando at 10PM last night replacing the pre amp on my OTA antenna. I was still sweating buckets that late.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

mattw said:


> I'll vouch for that! I was in my attic in Orlando at 10PM last night replacing the pre amp on my OTA antenna. I was still sweating buckets that late.


The trick to going up in a Florida attic is to wait until a rainy day. 

I've done that way too many times.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Or, wait for January, but even then, sometime not.



RunnerFL said:


> The trick to going up in a Florida attic is to wait until a rainy day.
> 
> I've done that way too many times.


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## mattw (Sep 28, 2006)

RunnerFL said:


> The trick to going up in a Florida attic is to wait until a rainy day.
> 
> I've done that way too many times.


But UPS delivered it yesterday...I'm not good at waiting. 

At least we moved into this house in February a few years back. Made it a lot easier. The day after we closed I cut a 16" wide hole in one room floor to ceiling to run wires. You should have seen the installers face when I showed him how we would get the wires where I wanted them. He said I've never seen anyone do that before! It took me three days to put in an extra 900' of cat 5 and 400' of RG6.


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## Directvlover (Aug 27, 2007)

SParker said:


> What I like about non-powered switches is that you don't have to get a power to the switch when the power is out with a generator.


If the power is out how are you watching TV?


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

with a generator, as he said. I've been there many times myself.



Directvlover said:


> If the power is out how are you watching TV?


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

Directvlover said:


> If the power is out how are you watching TV?


Doesn't everybody down there have at least 20 KVA generators with auto switching and starter relays?


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

techrep said:


> Doesn't everybody down there have at least 20 KVA generators with auto switching and starter relays?


if my power is out watching TV isn't on the list of things to do. Dominoes doesn't require a multiswitch. :lol:


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## say-what (Dec 14, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> Stupid forum. Once again it costs me money. I had looked at the signal lockers before, but I didn't realize it would also speed up channel changes. Mine will be here Tuesday.


:lol: same here. Stupid forums. :lol:



bigtiii said:


> if my power is out watching TV isn't on the list of things to do.


If it is, then you already have a whole house generator so it isn't a concern.


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## mattw (Sep 28, 2006)

techrep said:


> Doesn't everybody down there have at least 20 KVA generators with auto switching and starter relays?


You'd think so with the advertising around the start of hurricane season...but no not me. I got a hand me down 2kw in the garage that *might* work. I've been fortunate. We live across the street from a water treatment facility. They are near the top of the heap in the priority for the power company. That along with underground wire in our neighborhood and we do ok. I do believe in lots of UPS's though.

The folks with cable were without for a couple of weeks even when power was restored. That's when I just sit and smile with satellite.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

It is if your power is out for a week to three weeks after a hurricane has laid down all the power poles in a 3 county area.



bigtiii said:


> if my power is out watching TV isn't on the list of things to do. Dominoes doesn't require a multiswitch. :lol:


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> All of this was already proven in back in 2006. Just check your threads people.


Can you post a link to the threads you reference?

Thanks


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

by the way is there any difference between the Terk WB616 and the Zinwell WB616 or is it just the name recognition?


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

SParker said:


> by the way is there any difference between the Terk WB616 and the Zinwell WB616 or is it just the name recognition?


Just name, and you'll pay alot more for it.

Just go to solidsignal.com and get the Zinwell.....cheaper and they are a great company to buy from.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I just got another 771 event for 15 minutes or so, I think it cinches me decision. Time to retire the WB68..


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Just ordered one from SS, hope it fixes my problem!


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## Paul A (Jul 12, 2007)

I :heart: my WB616


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

Paul A said:


> I :heart: my WB616


Wow thats a lot of recievers.

I was close to getting the WB616 but by the time I go over 8 boxes, i will get SWM. I cant wait for my Sonora!!


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## wavemaster (Sep 15, 2007)

steelr said:


> Did you pay extra for the 16 port or did Direct tv have it installed for you? The reason I ask is that my local installers told me they would never carry this MS and if I wanted one, I would have to purchase it myself and try to get D* to re-imburse me.


I just purchased it.

D* has given me plenty over the years and when it comes to "I didn't need it, but I wanted it" kind of things I typically pick up the tab.


----------



## wolfman730 (Sep 10, 2006)

SParker said:


> What I like about non-powered switches is that you don't have to get a power to the switch when the power is out with a generator.


Unless your generator has a voltage regulator on it, I would not recommend using it to run Tv's and satellite boxes as voltages can reach 135.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I learn a lot from this forum so that previous statement I made was silly.  Now that I have a WB616 coming all should be well.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Those of us in S. Florida are old hands at this. Modern generators commonly sold down here do a remarkable job at supplying clean power, and UPS' between the wall and the equipment take care of the rest. Additionally. most consumer grade electronics these days are made with the international market in mind and can handle voltages up to 240.



wolfman730 said:


> Unless your generator has a voltage regulator on it, I would not recommend using it to run Tv's and satellite boxes as voltages can reach 135.


----------



## Groundhog45 (Nov 10, 2005)

I got a Sonora locker last year after someone posted a thread about "Power the Multiswitch" (Thanks). I don't know if the channel changes are all that much faster but I credit my having very few problems with my HR20s during the early months and in the first CE releases to having a strong signal from the LNBs as a result of installing the Sonora. I'm splitting the output from the Sonora to a WB68 and a SWM-5.


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

wavemaster said:


> I just purchased it.
> 
> D* has given me plenty over the years and when it comes to "I didn't need it, but I wanted it" kind of things I typically pick up the tab.


Purchased my WB616 Friday from SolidSignal........got my $141.00 credit on my bill from D* today :hurah:


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

bigtiii said:


> Purchased my WB616 Friday from SolidSignal........got my $141.00 credit on my bill from D* today :hurah:


Do you have to have more than 8 receivers/8 tuners to get them to do it?


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## techrep (Sep 15, 2007)

bigtiii said:


> Purchased my WB616 Friday from SolidSignal........got my $141.00 credit on my bill from D* today :hurah:


Hmmm...... that's good to know.


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

SParker said:


> Do you have to have more than 8 receivers/8 tuners to get them to do it?


I don't know but I sweet talked (BS'd) my way into getting them to agree by using the following points:

1. I have 6 DVRs and one HD receiver I need 2 cables on each DVR and 8 outputs was not going to cut it. 
2. have (now had) a flaky tuner that I hoped a powered multiswitch would help be less flaky and stay locked on the sats.......however the 2nd replacement receiver came in yesterday and so far has worked perfectly and has not lost lock yet.

in the end I mostly pushed the fact that I needed more than 8 outputs and didn't want to have that many outputs without power.

They obliged.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

Woohoo. UPS delivered a day early.

Hooking up the Sonora and MS now. Will report back in a little


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

compnurd said:


> Woohoo. UPS delivered a day early.
> 
> Hooking up the Sonora and MS now. Will report back in a little


All's i can say is WOW.

Signals are up anywhere from 1-3 points across the board. Channels changing is slightly faster as well.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

compnurd said:


> All's i can say is WOW.
> 
> Signals are up anywhere from 1-3 points across the board. Channels changing is slightly faster as well.


I'm guessing I will see the same with the WB616 since its powered too. I will be sure to do some before and after readings on 103(b)


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

SParker said:


> I'm guessing I will see the same with the WB616 since its powered too. I will be sure to do some before and after readings on 103(b)


That depends upon if the WB616 also does polarity locking or if it passes the signal tones to the LNBs for them to do switching. I suspect that the WS616 does not lock the polarity and passes the signal tones up to the LNBs.

The Sonora locks polarity on each LNB and blocks the signal tones thus reducing the channel changing delay and duration of the black screen that we see between channels.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> That depends upon if the WB616 also does polarity locking or if it passes the signal tones to the LNBs for them to do switching. I suspect that the WS616 does not lock the polarity and passes the signal tones up to the LNBs.
> 
> The Sonora locks polarity on each LNB and blocks the signal tones thus reducing the channel changing delay and duration of the black screen that we see between channels.


Are you sure the WB616 does not act as a polarity locker for the lnbs and signal filter/blocker for the signals coming from the receivers?


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

A question for those using the Sonora signal locker and WB68 multi-switch: what length of RG6 did you use between the Sonora and WB68? It seems like a 1 foot piece using a circle in the middle (to take up the extra) would work well but that means making up a bunch of 1 foot pigtails as I have not been able to find any that length that pre-made. The shortest seems to be 3 foot pre-made RG6 cables. ??????


Thanks


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

Hansen said:


> Are you sure the WB616 does not act as a polarity locker for the lnbs and signal filter/blocker for the signals coming from the receivers?


Powered multiswitches are polarity lockers. Otherwise there is no reason for them to have power.


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## Groundhog45 (Nov 10, 2005)

Hansen said:


> A question for those using the Sonora signal locker and WB68 multi-switch: what length of RG6 did you use between the Sonora and WB68? It seems like a 1 foot piece using a circle in the middle (to take up the extra) would work well but that means making up a bunch of 1 foot pigtails as I have not been able to find any that length that pre-made. The shortest seems to be 3 foot pre-made RG6 cables. ??????
> 
> Thanks


I had to make mine up custom. I used the RG-6 I had and compression fittings from Home Depot.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

i made custom's as well


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

Any update on performance improvements by those who ordered either the WB616 or Sonora signal locker last week?


Thanks


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

Hansen said:


> Any update on performance improvements by those who ordered either the WB616 or Sonora signal locker last week?
> 
> Thanks


Yes, my update is that I see a significant performance improvement is in channel changing duration. My HR20 runs over 10 degress cooler as well. My SN numbers for the 103(b) transponders were unchanged, all in the mid 90s.

Also, as reported above, the WS616 should provide these same benefits as a Sonora power supply / signal locker.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Hansen said:


> Any update on performance improvements by those who ordered either the WB616 or Sonora signal locker last week?
> 
> Thanks


Installing mine now (WB616), will let you know.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I slapped my Sonora in at lunch time. I got a 1-3 point increase in signal levels as reported by the H and HR boxes, but I didn't notice any real difference in channel changing. I'll know more tonight, as I sit on my butt and channel surf a little.

I did make one mistake on install - I forgot to pay attention to what cable went where. The cables between the Sonora and WB68 must be matched for voltage and tone.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Those are some short pigtails. Isn't there a minimum length a cable needs to be so that reflections don't become an issue ?
I took the easy way out. I had some ready-made 4 foot RG6 cables laying around, so I just put them in place. What's another 4 foot when my longest runs exceed 150', anyway :lol:

Oh, and is that bunch of wires actually right by a window and bleeding over into a walkway ? Or is that just pulled out from somewhere it is normally hidden in ?



Groundhog45 said:


> I had to make mine up custom. I used the RG-6 I had and compression fittings from Home Depot.


----------



## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> I slapped my Sonora in at lunch time. I got a 1-3 point increase in signal levels as reported by the H and HR boxes, but I didn't notice any real difference in channel changing. I'll know more tonight, as I sit on my butt and channel surf a little.
> 
> I did make one mistake on install - I forgot to pay attention to what cable went where. The cables between the Sonora and WB68 must be matched for voltage and tone.


how did you figure that one out?


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

When all my boxes said "searching for satellite" :lol: :lol: 

DOH ! I felt so stupid.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

bt-rtp said:


> Yes, my update is that I see a significant performance improvement is in channel changing duration. My HR20 runs over 10 degress cooler as well. My SN numbers for the 103(b) transponders were unchanged, all in the mid 90s.
> 
> Also, as reported above, the WS616 should provide these same benefits as a Sonora power supply / signal locker.


So my suggestion is a hit?

Maybe I should actually get one for myself then. :lol:


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I Just got my WB616 up and the signal strength appears to be the same as the WB68. Channel changing speed seems to be improved a little.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

SParker said:


> I Just got my WB616 up and the signal strength appears to be the same as the WB68. Channel changing speed seems to be improved a little.


Do you feel like the change in channel changing speed was worth the cost and effort? (I almost ordered last week but decided to wait and I'm still on the fence.)

Thanks


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

In my situation, I had some pretty long runs between my receivers and the dish, it made sense to me even if the channel changing isn't what I hoped for. I got 100's on 60% of the transponders on 101 after install. That's up from 4 or 5 100's, so it did positively impact my signal strengths.


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

SParker said:


> I Just got my WB616 up and the signal strength appears to be the same as the WB68. Channel changing speed seems to be improved a little.


The last CE version 0x1a3 introducted a new bug where upon changing the channel, the banner displays the current channel information and then the requested channel information. The second banner with the requested should only be displayed.

So the the bug causes additional delay that would otherwise not be there.

The Sonora or WS616 eliminates the black screen displayed between the bug caused first banner and the second banner. Once they fix the bug the lag time will be improved even more.


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## bt-rtp (Dec 30, 2005)

Hansen said:


> Do you feel like the change in channel changing speed was worth the cost and effort? (I almost ordered last week but decided to wait and I'm still on the fence.)
> 
> Thanks


Yes, it's worth the $50 bucks for the Sonora.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I got it to fix the 771 errors and bought the WB616 to simplify things since my Dad was hooking the stuff up. He would've had a cow hooking up the Sonora.


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## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

Thanks for the feedback.


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## Groundhog45 (Nov 10, 2005)

JeffBowser said:


> Those are some short pigtails. Isn't there a minimum length a cable needs to be so that reflections don't become an issue ?
> I took the easy way out. I had some ready-made 4 foot RG6 cables laying around, so I just put them in place. What's another 4 foot when my longest runs exceed 150', anyway :lol:
> 
> Oh, and is that bunch of wires actually right by a window and bleeding over into a walkway ? Or is that just pulled out from somewhere it is normally hidden in ?


I wasn't aware of any problems with short pigtails. I've seen others do the same. Almost all of my signals are in the 80s and 90s, with some 100, so I can't complain.

The mounting board is on a covered patio and usually has a couple of large potted plants to hide it. Pretty much out of the way.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Well, after an evening of channel surfing, I have to say, buying the Sonora strictly to gain channel change speed isn't the way to go. I get a black screen in-between OTA channels as well, of about the same length. However, it significantly helped my furthest (and oldest) receiver from the dish. It's an older non-mpeg4 model, and would occasionally complain about not finding the dish. Doesn't anymore.


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## Stevies3 (Jul 22, 2004)

JeffBowser said:


> Well, after an evening of channel surfing, I have to say, buying the Sonora strictly to gain channel change speed isn't the way to go. I get a black screen in-between OTA channels as well, of about the same length. However, it significantly helped my furthest (and oldest) receiver from the dish. It's an older non-mpeg4 model, and would occasionally complain about not finding the dish. Doesn't anymore.


I wouldn't expect the OTA to gain anything from the use of the Sonora


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

That wasn't my point.



Stevies3 said:


> I woulden't expect the OTA to gain anything from the use of the Sonora


----------



## Hansen (Jan 1, 2006)

Stevies3 said:


> I woulden't expect the OTA to gain anything from the use of the Sonora


I think he was comparing the OTA channel changing speed to the satellite channel changing speed and saying that with the Sonora on the satellite channels, there is no difference, which leads to the inference that it's the box or software causing the black screen delay when changing channels.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Exactly so, thank you ! 



Hansen said:


> I think he was comparing the OTA channel changing speed to the satellite channel changing speed and saying that with the Sonora on the satellite channels, there is no difference, which leads to the inference that it's the box or software causing the black screen delay when changing channels.


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## dminches (Oct 1, 2006)

I just installed a second WB68 to replace my old Aspen, and a Sonora to add power. I had some issues with the 2nd WB68 since I lost the signal on 103(b) when I had only 2 WB68s (connected via splitters) and no powered multi-switch. I knew the power was the issue because once I swapped out the new WB68 with the old Aspen I get my signal back. This doesn't seem to make sense since others have 2 WB68s without power. I then installed the Sonora in the front end with the 2 WB68s and everything worked fine.

I don't see any improvement in channel changing speed and my signal strengths were already pretty high. I guess the one positive is that I can now use 2 (unpowered) WB68s.

Anyone else have a similar issue with the WB68s?


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## Dom_P (Oct 6, 2007)

I installed the Sonora yesterday, and I don't see much channel change improvement or temp reduction on average. 

But the 771 error seems to gone! And that's what I really cared about.

Works great, I'd guess that the channel change is actually improved as the 771 error basically is a very long channel change issue (timeout). But I can't say that its drastic enough on average to merit purchasing one just to get improved channel switching speed. But if you've got 771 errors, then, at least for me it seems to have eliminated them


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

WB616 installed.....channels seem to change a tad faster....my signal strengths are all in the 90s as is so don't care if I gained a point or two....

But the biggest and best thing about it is........16 outputs!

Nice free upgrade.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Well I thought I was fixed but my channel I was watching Sci-Fi HD just started pixilating back and then got 771 on both tuners on 103(b). Going to call DTV and get someone out here to replace the LNB I guess. 

Someone is coming out Friday.


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## dmurphy (Sep 28, 2006)

Question for the experts ... Would there be any advantage for me to install a Sonora locker?

My current configuration has a Slimline dish, connections split with single-port power-passing splitters, to two switches (Zinwell WB68 and Zinwell SAM-4803). Since the SAM-4803 is a powered switch, I have it connected to the power-passing legs on the splitters.

I don't get any 771 messages, but if I can speed up channel changes, well, that's all in the pursuit of Television Greatness (tm).  I don't need more than 8 outputs which "see" the Ka-band birds; only have one HR20, and the rest are all standard-def, so I didn't see the point in replacing the SAM-4803.

(Side note - I had my dish realigned last month, and when the installers finally showed up (attempt #3), they told me that the switches were the problem and that I'd have to have 2 dishes installed - there was no way to have more than 8 outputs from a single dish. I caught them in my basement trying to remove the splitters. I then chased them outside and told them to get on the roof, realign the dish, and keep their paws OFF my splitters! Needless to say, the dish was out of whack and a quick realign fixed the problem for good.)


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## bigtiii (Sep 5, 2007)

dmurphy said:


> Question for the experts ... Would there be any advantage for me to install a Sonora locker?


My opinion......."if it ain't broke"

Faster channel changes aren't a guarantee either. If you have a stable setup I'd leave well enough alone.


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## dminches (Oct 1, 2006)

Is there any value to having a Sonora in addition to a WB616? My understanding is that the Sonora's real value is providing power to the LNBs, something that the WB616 already does.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

From what I understand, there would be no value to this. In fact, the Sonora blocks power from going to the dish from anything upstream, so I'm not sure if it would even coexist peacefully with the wb616


----------



## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Thought I would post a picture of my WB616 and the new 4 connector ground block. My father replaced as many crimp on connectors as he could but he ran out. I'm going to try getting more compression connectors as soon as I can.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I just had my sidecar swapped out with a slimline and here are my readings currently on a rainy gloomy day. Quite the difference.

89 91 83 85 86 89 87 89
82 83 88 89 85 88 NA NA
86 NA NA NA NA 87


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## Stevies3 (Jul 22, 2004)

What were your previous #'s? Could also be that the dish is better aligned.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Stevies3 said:


> What were your previous #'s? Could also be that the dish is better aligned.


This was taken on a clear day with the old dish

95 72 86 69 91 79 89 81
88 80 89 85 89 88
89 -- -- -- -- 89

Notice the 69 and 72 readings. Pretty low and odd considering the rest were pretty high. I think that LNB was flakey.


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## iceburg02 (Sep 20, 2006)

I saw this thread a couple weeks back and was having trouble with 0's on all even transponders on 103b. Finally got around to installing a WB616 this weekend, did an RBR and voila - all is well. Gotta like the powered multiswitch!


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I've been getting 771's on my HR20 for several weeks now, even after installing a Sonora. Loses tuner 1 every time, and a soft reboot always clears it until another week or two passes. Odd situation.


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## shendley (Nov 28, 2005)

I was curious for an update from those of you who bought the powered zinwell multiswitch or the sonora whether or not it appeared to either fix or improve your problem with getting the 771 message. I've got a similar intermittent problem I'm having with only mpeg2 HD stations and was considering getting one to see if it helped. 

And, by the way: is the Zinwell powered by simply plugging it into an outlet or is more complicated than that?


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## Lord Vader (Sep 20, 2004)

Just plug its adapter into the wall. Done.


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## dminches (Oct 1, 2006)

I set up my system 2 ways: 1) 2 WB68 switches with a Sonora and 2) WB616. I found the channel changing to be materially faster with the WB616.


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## Griff (Sep 24, 2006)

I installed a Sonora Signal locker a couple weeks ago hoping to improve channel change speed. Have seen no difference at all.
Gene


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

This has been my experience, too. It did however, cure random tuning problems on an older receiver almost 180 feet from the dish. And I also now have a comfort level knowing that my other boxes, all over 125' from the dish, don't have to drive 13 and 18v that far anymore. Should prolong their life.



Griff said:


> I installed a Sonora Signal locker a couple weeks ago hoping to improve channel change speed. Have seen no difference at all.
> Gene


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 21, 2007)

JeffBowser said:


> Those are some short pigtails. Isn't there a minimum length a cable needs to be so that reflections don't become an issue ?


I did not see anyone answer this question.  I also make my cables to custom lengths (RG6 and compression connectors from Home Depot) and never gave much thought to the length other than it looked tidy.

I am about to install the free WB616 Mastec dropped off to complete my Wednesday install (adding HR20 to make 7 DVRs) so if there really is a valid reason to not make them "too short" I can whip up some freshies. If only these WB switches could diplex OTA I would not have any short pigtails.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

The guy I asked that of replied back and said he had experienced no problems with the short cables, so I assume signal reflection is not an issue in this environment.


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 21, 2007)

Thanks Jeff, I guess I missed his reply.  Either way the switch install went without incident, although the HR20 has to be reset to reacquire signal. All of the other boxes were fine without a reboot.


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## jbraden (Mar 23, 2004)

Hansen said:


> A question for those using the Sonora signal locker and WB68 multi-switch: what length of RG6 did you use between the Sonora and WB68? It seems like a 1 foot piece using a circle in the middle (to take up the extra) would work well but that means making up a bunch of 1 foot pigtails as I have not been able to find any that length that pre-made. The shortest seems to be 3 foot pre-made RG6 cables. ??????
> 
> Thanks


I use 1-foot cables I bought on eBay here:

http://cgi.ebay.com/10-lot-of-1-Foot-Video-Cable-Coax-RG6-RG-6-Quad-Shield_W0QQitemZ130171890369QQihZ003QQcategoryZ73384QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I got the Sonora so that I could combine 2 dishes in different locations to work around my tree problem, and it works great. The cables this guy sells are high quality quad shield with compression fittings.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I had to reset mine, too, although I initially wired the cables wrong.



LlamaLarry said:


> Thanks Jeff, I guess I missed his reply.  Either way the switch install went without incident, although the HR20 has to be reset to reacquire signal. All of the other boxes were fine without a reboot.


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## shendley (Nov 28, 2005)

Looking for more info on the kind of 771 message problems people have seen the WB616 or the Sonora fix: were they only a function of intermittently losing complete signal strength on all odd or even transponders? Right now I'm thinking seriously of getting a WB616 but the problem I'm having is definitely not a function of losing all odds or evens. It's just that occasionally my HR20 can't lock on an mpeg2 signal on one tuner. Does that sound like the sort of problem the 616 might fix? 

Any thoughts would be much appreciated here. I've had this problem since . . . forever (at least it seems that way - actually about 6 months, I'd guess) and everything I or techs (or VOS - thanks again VOS!) have thought might have something to do (lnbs, wb68, HR20s, bbcs) with this have been replaced with the problem persisting.


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