# Which Switch for a Dish 1000? 34 or 44?



## robertkoor (Jan 22, 2007)

I have a Dish 1000 and want to add a switch to add additional receivers. My neighbor has a Model DP34 switch that he will give me that he used with his Dish 500, but I thought I heard somewhere that only the Model DP44's will work with Dish 1000's. I have a Vip 622, a 211, and want to add another 622. Can I do this with the DP34, or do I have to buy a DP44? Will it work to connect the 2 cables coming from the dish 1000 to the DP34 switch and then run a single line from each switch output (using diplexers) to each of the receivers? What are the advantages of either? Thanks in advance!


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

The DP34 will work with a Dish1000 BUT you want the DPP44 because of the receivers you are looking at.

The DPP44 allows one cable to each receiver, the DP34 requires two satellite cables to each 622 (or other two tuner receiver). You cannot diplex two satellite signals together. You can diplex satellite and OTA but the only way of putting two satellite tuners on the same cable is with DPP equipment.

Another thing to look at is what you have now. If you have no switch and are just running one cable from your dish to each receiver you likely have a DPPTwin LNB. Adding a DPP44 switch will require some rewiring. All three feeds, two from the DPPTwin and one from the third LNB head, need to go to the DPP44 inputs. With only a 622 and a 211 it is highly likely that you were set up with a DPPTwin.


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## robertkoor (Jan 22, 2007)

James Long said:


> The DP34 will work with a Dish1000 BUT you want the DPP44 because of the receivers you are looking at.
> 
> The DPP44 allows one cable to each receiver, the DP34 requires two satellite cables to each 622 (or other two tuner receiver). You cannot diplex two satellite signals together. You can diplex satellite and OTA but the only way of putting two satellite tuners on the same cable is with DPP equipment.
> 
> Another thing to look at is what you have now. If you have no switch and are just running one cable from your dish to each receiver you likely have a DPPTwin LNB. Adding a DPP44 switch will require some rewiring. All three feeds, two from the DPPTwin and one from the third LNB head, need to go to the DPP44 inputs. With only a 622 and a 211 it is highly likely that you were set up with a DPPTwin.


Yes, I have a DPPTwin, with just a single line going to each receiver. What type of rewiring would I need to do? thanks


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Disconnect the "jumper cable" between the third LNB and the DPP Twin.
Run a new cable from the third LNB and the two existing cables directly to your switch (preferably a DPP44).
Run the first output to one of your receivers. Place the power inserter in this line somewhere inside your House to power the DPP44.
Run the second output to another receiver. The third and fourth outputs can be run to other receivers (one receiver per feed).

This is glossing over all the important stuff about drip loops and grounding.


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## jarvantgroup (Mar 24, 2006)

robertkoor said:


> Yes, I have a DPPTwin, with just a single line going to each receiver. What type of rewiring would I need to do? thanks


Your money would be well spent on the DPP44 switch. Using you neighbor's DP34 switch would require that 2nd line to each of your dual-tuner rcvrs. Probably a big pain. :icon_cool


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## Bradtothebone (Aug 11, 2003)

If running two lines to each receiver is NOT an issue, you can cascade two DP-34's for less money than a DPP-44 - especially since you already have one. You would have to replace the DPP twin on your 1000 with a DP twin or two DP duals, but it would still be less. You could sell your DPP twin, or keep it for the "future." Just another idea.

Brad


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## SWTESTER (Apr 7, 2004)

Bradtothebone said:


> If running two lines to each receiver is NOT an issue, you can cascade two DP-34's for less money than a DPP-44 - especially since you already have one. You would have to replace the DPP twin on your 1000 with a DP twin or two DP duals, but it would still be less. You could sell your DPP twin, or keep it for the "future." Just another idea.
> 
> Brad


I have a maxed out DP-34 with 3 receivers, one of which a 622.
Is there a way to use a DPP diplexor with a DP-34 single cable run if I wanted to replace a 301 tuner with a 622?
My 301 [or 311?] SD box is just soooo slow.


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## 585960 (Feb 4, 2007)

SWTESTER said:


> I have a maxed out DP-34 with 3 receivers, one of which a 622.
> Is there a way to use a DPP diplexor with a DP-34 single cable run if I wanted to replace a 301 tuner with a 622?
> My 301 [or 311?] SD box is just soooo slow.


If you use a DP 34, you cannot have a single run to a dual tuners input. DPP technology can, as in DPP Twin lnb, DPP44, and the new DPP 1000.2 lnb. What do you mean your 301 runs slow?


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

SWTESTER, you can add a 2nd DP34 as shown in the diagram on the face of the switch. Run a new line to the 2nd 622, with both feeds coming from the same switch.

A few more options, all of which will allow you to use the DPP Separator:
- replace the DP34 with a DPP44, or wait for the DPP33
- replace the dish and DP34 with a Dish 1000.2

If the 2nd 622 can also replace your other single-tuner receiver, you can eliminate the DP34 and have just a DPP Twin feeding both 622s.


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## tasp (Mar 2, 2007)

The biggest problem I have had is that when an installation requires a DP-44 switch, Dish is not forthcoming with one.

I had an install (I am an independent home theater installer) last fall, and called Dish twice, prior to their coming to the house to 'Dish it up' from 2 receivers to 4, in the presence of the customer (I had a premonition), and explained in excruciating detail that we had an existing home, with limited in wall wiring and that stringing additional coax was not an option. Dish assured us everything was fine, everything would work, no problem.

Well, the Dish installer arrived and he didn't even have a 44 switch in the truck. He spent 2 hours on the phone with Dish trying to get authorization for a 44, I was on the phone with Dish too, and when the customer came home from work, so was he.

It was a 2 hour screaming match, and Dish never did pony up a 44 switch.


I went through the exact same experience with another customer 2 weeks ago, and I kept refering to the prior bad experience and how I had done everything possible to make sure this 'high end' customer did not go through the same thing.


Well, it turned into another 3 cell phone, 2 hour screaming match with Dish. The customer finally relented and paid the Dish installer (IIRC) $150 for a 44 switch.

I called Dish the next day, and just kept explaining the situation and asking to be 'kicked up' to the next level at Dish till I could get to someone who could fix the problem.

2 hours later (what is it with Dish and 2 hour phone calls?) I got customer #2 a $150 REFUND! and customer #1 an appointment for an installation of a free 44 switch. 


Alls well that ends well I guess, but crikey, what a freaking ordeal.

I can't keep putting my high end home theater customers through this nightmare. I'm probably heading towards dropping all my Dish customers and/or charging them 50% more per hour for the hassle.

I can see Dish giving customers who don't pay their bills a hard time, but these high end customers wanting to do upgrades don't deserve the aggravation Dish puts them through.


{the Dish installers I have encountered tell me they go through this every week!}


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## tasp (Mar 2, 2007)

Customer #1 had his appointment today to have his 44 switch installed. I was on site from noon to 5 (at no charge to the customer, when will I learn?) At 5 I started calling Dish to find out when their guy would be there. After being on the phone for an hour (was hung up on once, which seems to be par for the Dish system), the tech pulled in the driveway. He gets out of the truck and the work order does not show a 44 switch and he does not have one on the truck.

So we both are on our respective phones, him to the 'hub' and me to Dish.

Hour later, tech leaves, wishing me luck in my quest for a 44 switch. And the representative at Dish is at a loss to explain what happened.


How do I fix this?


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## fredinva (May 10, 2006)

A much easier solution:

Get a Dish 1000.2 which will handle 3 twin tuners - cheaper than a switch.
Or, once when I installed four twin tuners at one large lake house, I just put up two dishes.

fred


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

tasp said:


> How do I fix this?


Install your own equipment?

My trusted local dealer has his own install team (the other guys in town have their own installers as well). Sure there are guys who run everything through Dish for their installers/contractors to install but my dealer is trusted because he or someone he can fire is doing the work and bringing the parts and tools needed to get the job done.


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## tasp (Mar 2, 2007)

More on the 44 switch saga:

The installer who stopped by (without the 44 switch) gave me his boss's phone number, so I called him to see what is going on.

He explained that there is no code that Dish can put on a work order that will cause him to send a 44 switch to my job site. They are HIS switches, and Dish has no right to be giving his stuff away and I am not getting one. 



So, it looks like he told me.


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## tasp (Mar 2, 2007)

{An aside:

I am aware I can get a 44 switch on E-Bay, for a lot less hassle, but my position in this matter is from the very first call to Dish to set up the appointment I have apprised Dish of the precise requirements of the installation, they quote a price, and we schedule the work. 

A deal is a deal. Having the installer show up and say "oh, by the way, this is all $150 more than we told you" is totally unacceptable to my customers and myself. 

In the case of my first customer, the original install (I was not a party to this) resulted in the Dish dish being installed on the front roof of a very nice house, I have no idea why this was done, it looks awful. The lot has no trees to the south/southwest, and the dish could have been anywhere else. The customer does not want an even bigger dish in this location.

That Dish has some internal structural disconnect between the marketing/order department (who apparently will say/promise anything to make a sale) and that the installation department apparently is broken up into little fiefdoms ruled by petty tyrants with nothing better to do than harrass high end customers.

I find the entire imbroglio to be compellingly in need of intervention by the 'higher ups' at Dish, and resolved promptly}


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## tasp (Mar 2, 2007)

Well, I can wrap this up finally.

Dish Executive Response Team (think I got that right) called the local installer and was unable to induce him to provide the need DP-44 switch, so at that point I suggested Dish Network management bypass the local problem point and just mail me the switch from their end.

They agreed, and the switch arrived a few days ago.

I installed it in the utility cupboard and then connected all three receivers. The dual tuner unit utilized diplexers (in conjunction with the seperator) to send back both tuners signals on channels 4 and 44 to the cupboard, and then back down to the master bedroom unit, and from that location, mom and dad can watch their own satellite box, and also utilize the dual tuner PVR and keep an eye on what the kids are watching.

Slick system on an existing home with very little existing wiring and no way to add more.

Glad it's done finally, I can get paid now.

But one little nagging question:

What's up with the local installer organization? I have been told that when an installation requires a 44 switch, you're supposed to get one, I was also told that Dish reimburses the local installers for these units. Doesn't seem to happen around here. My experience in this matter has certainly been awful, and I am grateful the customers persevered through all the gyrations we went through to get their system working.

If customers can't get 44 switches in this area, what is the local installer organization doing with them?


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## jarvantgroup (Mar 24, 2006)

tasp said:


> Well, I can wrap this up finally.
> 
> Dish Executive Response Team (think I got that right) called the local installer and was unable to induce him to provide the need DP-44 switch, so at that point I suggested Dish Network management bypass the local problem point and just mail me the switch from their end.
> 
> ...


It all boils down to Dish making a commitment to the local installer to reimburse them for equipment used. They have to pay for rcvrs, dishes, LNB's and switches up-front. When Dish issues work orders to them, Dish enters the equipment needed for that install or upgrade on the work order. If the installer uses additional equipment that is not on the work order, he just ate the cost for it. So no matter what a Dish CSR promises you, if he/she doesn't make the change on the local installer's work order, you're out of luck. Dish already tries to make the local installer eat the cost of installing poles, concrete, custom mounting brackets/poles, conduit, trenching, splitting TV signals to 5th, 6th, 7th TVs. So to ask a local installer to just 'eat' more cost won't get you too far. Being a technician myself, its like trying to pull teeth with Dish to get a DPP44 with any installation requiring less than four satellite orbital locations. :icon_cool


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## tasp (Mar 2, 2007)

I was really surprised the executive at Dish that I talked too, who called the local installer manager, could not get the local installer to send a 44 switch to my job site and wound up mailing me one from the home office. It would seem to me that Dish would have some kind of contract with the local installers outlining jurisdiction over these matters. Having a system that is guaranteed to snag home theater installers like me into some annoying intramural squabble within the Dish organization seems stupid to me. I am actively discouraging new customers from even considering a Dish install (unless they have wiring issues, but I know all too well what that leads to) and am encouraging existing customers to switch to D*. When D* perfects their new single wire technology, I can swap my Dish customers with limited wiring to them and get away from this problem entirely.

I spent a 1/2 hour on the phone with Dish after I was able to complete my second 44 switch customer. I was begging for a way in the future to get 44 switches without going through our local installer organization. I suggested setting up all my future jobs (that are headed that way) with the ERT instead of the initial CSR level. Dish has no enthusiasm for that idea. I can e-bay 44 switches (I still wonder if my local installer manger isn't scamming Dish somehow and selling 44 switches this way) but I already stock all kinds of stuff (quite a bit of which I am likely to never use on a job) and besides, if I outline to Dish from the very start of a job that I have limited wiring and dual tuner Dish receivers, and they agree to send all the goodies I need to get the job working, why in the blue blazes should I be inconvenienced in any way because Dish has some bizarre internal business practice snafu? Why should my customers get snagged for an additional $150 charge on top of the already agreed to price to 'Dish it up'? I have called the matter to their attention twice now, at the executive level, they have frustrated installers who go through this every week, and they have installation managers with nothing better to do than to PO my high-end customers, the ball is in THEIR court to fix THEIR problem.


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## jarvantgroup (Mar 24, 2006)

tasp said:


> I was really surprised the executive at Dish that I talked too, who called the local installer manager, could not get the local installer to send a 44 switch to my job site and wound up mailing me one from the home office. It would seem to me that Dish would have some kind of contract with the local installers outlining jurisdiction over these matters. Having a system that is guaranteed to snag home theater installers like me into some annoying intramural squabble within the Dish organization seems stupid to me. I am actively discouraging new customers from even considering a Dish install (unless they have wiring issues, but I know all too well what that leads to) and am encouraging existing customers to switch to D*. When D* perfects their new single wire technology, I can swap my Dish customers with limited wiring to them and get away from this problem entirely.
> 
> I spent a 1/2 hour on the phone with Dish after I was able to complete my second 44 switch customer. I was begging for a way in the future to get 44 switches without going through our local installer organization. I suggested setting up all my future jobs (that are headed that way) with the ERT instead of the initial CSR level. Dish has no enthusiasm for that idea. I can e-bay 44 switches (I still wonder if my local installer manger isn't scamming Dish somehow and selling 44 switches this way) but I already stock all kinds of stuff (quite a bit of which I am likely to never use on a job) and besides, if I outline to Dish from the very start of a job that I have limited wiring and dual tuner Dish receivers, and they agree to send all the goodies I need to get the job working, why in the blue blazes should I be inconvenienced in any way because Dish has some bizarre internal business practice snafu? Why should my customers get snagged for an additional $150 charge on top of the already agreed to price to 'Dish it up'? I have called the matter to their attention twice now, at the executive level, they have frustrated installers who go through this every week, and they have installation managers with nothing better to do than to PO my high-end customers, the ball is in THEIR court to fix THEIR problem.


I totally agree with your POV. As an installer, I loathe giving customers the choice between paying a couple hundred bucks for a DPP44 switch or installing 2nd RG-6 lines to the dual-tuner rcvrs from the outside of the house. Or charging custom fees for wall fishes. Inevitably, customers look confused when I'm on the phone debating with Dish about switches. They're under the impression that all installers and Dish are under the same umbrella. It would be nice for Dish to provide an inexpensive, dependable piece of equipment to cover the majority of installs in order to avoid all the squabbling about this and that piece of equipment. :icon_cool


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