# DirecTV update - DirecTv and Viiv PC



## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

Over in the DirecTV General Discussion jeffjorgy posted this:

DirecTV update - DirecTv and Viiv PC 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From the DirecTv Forum homepage:

Connect your DIRECTV Plus HD DVR (HR20) with your Intel Viiv based PC for Photos and Music 
Participate in DIRECTV's public trial for the new DIRECTV Music and Photos service. Connect your HR20 to your Intel Viiv based PC and listen to your favorite music and share your best photos on your TV! 

IMPORTANT: The DIRECTV Music and Photos service is currently available to customers that opt in to participate in DIRECTV’s public trial. By doing so, participants commit to receiving peer to peer customer support for the service via this online technical forum. All DIRECTV Music and Photos service features are production ready.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

More should be available soon.

Earl


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## dconfer (Nov 18, 2005)

This is one of the feature I am waiting for.

I have tried to get the detail instruction for this and it keeps giving me page not found. Can anyone else get this page to work.


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

Anyone know if Vista is going to be currently supported, or am I SOL with RC2?

Direct link to the page with this info:

http://forums.directv.com/pe/index.jsp


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## tfederov (Nov 18, 2005)

So let me get this straight... Viiv is hardware and the PC I bought less than a month ago is no good? Or will it work and be unsupported?


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Things are getting "setup" for ViiV...
You are catching all the pages, in mid-update.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

tfederov said:


> So let me get this straight... Viiv is hardware and the PC I bought less than a month ago is no good? Or will it work and be unsupported?


If you don't have the ViiV logo on it... then yes, it is not a ViiV PC.
As far as I know, the ViiV software components, will not run on a non-ViiV system.


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## hancox (Jun 23, 2004)

blech - if it doesn't add anything over my xbox 360 AND introduces craptastic Intel DRM, this is DOA.


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## dconfer (Nov 18, 2005)

Earl,
Are you going to have more info on this soon?
I want to opt in for this program.


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## tfederov (Nov 18, 2005)

Earl Bonovich said:


> If you don't have the ViiV logo on it... then yes, it is not a ViiV PC.
> As far as I know, the ViiV software components, will not run on a non-ViiV system.


Okay, dbstalk forum party at my house!! I want there to be witnesses around when my wife kills me for asking to buy another computer! :grin: :lol: :grin:


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

dconfer said:


> Earl,
> Are you going to have more info on this soon?
> I want to opt in for this program.


Yes, but it probably won't be until later tonight at the earliest


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## Dusty (Sep 21, 2006)

tfederov said:


> Okay, dbstalk forum party at my house!! I want there to be witnesses around when my wife kills me for asking to buy another computer! :grin: :lol: :grin:


YOu should try my trick. Every computer I buy is for my wife. I never buy any computer for myself. She is just kind enough to allow me to use her computer from time to time.


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

hancox said:


> blech - if it doesn't add anything over my xbox 360 AND introduces craptastic Intel DRM, this is DOA.


Hey, you can put an SD card into the Wii too and see your photos. It's not a bad presentation either.


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## tfederov (Nov 18, 2005)

Dusty said:


> YOu should try my trick. Every computer I buy is for my wife. I never buy any computer for myself. She is just kind enough to allow me to use her computer from time to time.


I dunno... sounds alot like Homer buying Marge a bowling ball with his name on it!


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> Anyone know if Vista is going to be currently supported, or am I SOL with RC2?
> 
> Direct link to the page with this info:
> 
> http://forums.directv.com/pe/index.jsp


Assuming you have the ViiV components running under Vista, I would guess that the HR20 wouldn't care. It's talking over the wire to your PC so as long as it supports the appropriate communications you should be fine. Vista simply adds to the capabilities of the existing IP stack (things like full IPv6 support, etc.) so there really should be no difference.

I have the released version of Vista running on my PC, but it's an AMD unit so ViiV is not something I have been looking at with Vista.


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## packfan909 (Oct 6, 2006)

Not sure if this was on a prior thread...

Will the USB port allow for a Wireless Adapter or will one need to acquire a Wireless Bridge if there is no hard wired lan cable going to their HR20?

Thanks!


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

packfan909 said:


> Not sure if this was on a prior thread...
> 
> Will the USB port allow for a Wireless Adapter or will one need to acquire a Wireless Bridge if there is no hard wired lan cable going to their HR20?
> 
> Thanks!


Wireless bridge.

Right now, there is no time frame for if/when they may introduce a wireless option via the USB.


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## premio (Sep 26, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> If you don't have the ViiV logo on it... then yes, it is not a ViiV PC.
> As far as I know, the ViiV software components, will not run on a non-ViiV system.


ViiV's technical details are horrible, I think on purpose to force you to buy an expensive box. You can buy a ViiV motherboard/CPU combo in a build your own scenerio. It is essentially the same thing as when AMD branded 3dNow and Intel MMX to boost performance. There is a hardware component that is needed for the software to make the appropriate calls.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

premio said:


> ViiV's technical details are horrible, I think on purpose to force you to buy an expensive box. You can buy a ViiV motherboard/CPU combo in a build your own scenerio. It is essentially the same thing as when AMD branded 3dNow and Intel MMX to boost performance. There is a hardware component that is needed for the software to make the appropriate calls.


I am not the biggest fan of Gateway, but...
http://www.gateway.com/products/gconfig/prodhmseries.asp?seg=hm&gcseries=dx420&clv=Btn1&clv=Btn1

But for as little as $599, get's you into a ViiV Dual Core 2 system...

So, I guess it depends on your definition of expensive.


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## Meklos (Nov 7, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Wireless bridge.
> 
> Right now, there is no time frame for if/when they may introduce a wireless option via the USB.


Just as an FYI to everyone out there... look around before you go out and drop $250 on a wireless bridging solution, or even $100 on the "game adapters".

I picked up two Airlink AP411Ws for $20 each at Frys in Houston when they were on sale (there have been new APs to come out since I did it). They can do point-to-point and point-to-multipoint bridging. Also you can get several different types of AP hardware and increase their functionality by running OpenWRT software on it. It takes a little doing, but you can take cheap hardware, change the firmware, and enable features of units costing much more.


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

Here's an interesting interview from this past March with an MS executive on lots of stuff including some info on Vista and DirecTV...

http://www.engadget.com/2006/03/02/the-clicker-a-sitdown-with-microsofts-joe-belfiore-part-i/

The information on CableCard is a little distressing to those of us that like our very custom home-grown systems, but we'll have to see what D* comes up with. The most worrisome is that the CableCard discussion states that their technology will only support a single stream per device so you would have to have a card for each stream... ugly stuff that I can only hope D* won't do to the PC community.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Meklos said:


> Just as an FYI to everyone out there... look around before you go out and drop $250 on a wireless bridging solution, or even $100 on the "game adapters".
> 
> I picked up two Airlink AP411Ws for $20 each at Frys in Houston when they were on sale (there have been new APs to come out since I did it). They can do point-to-point and point-to-multipoint bridging. Also you can get several different types of AP hardware and increase their functionality by running OpenWRT software on it. It takes a little doing, but you can take cheap hardware, change the firmware, and enable features of units costing much more.


FYI:
At Buy.COM

Linksys WET54G (Wireless Bridge) is $93
SMC's is $68

Still not as cheep as the phone line networking, but...


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## Marty B (Sep 21, 2006)

premio said:


> ViiV's technical details are horrible, I think on purpose to force you to buy an expensive box. You can buy a ViiV motherboard/CPU combo in a build your own scenerio. It is essentially the same thing as when AMD branded 3dNow and Intel MMX to boost performance. There is a hardware component that is needed for the software to make the appropriate calls.


Yeah theres always a catch. Why not just make it work with any computer that has the horse power?


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## ajwillys (Jun 14, 2006)

So .....


Am I the only one googling to figure out how I can "fake" my HR20 into believing my PC is "Viiv Certified" and send my music over the network? Can't be hard.


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Yes, but it probably won't be until later tonight at the earliest


Hi Earl ... the HR10 is slowly catching up to the Series3 ... there might be an HR20 next to my Series3 to begin testing/comparing soon ...


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## Marty B (Sep 21, 2006)

ajwillys said:


> So .....
> 
> Am I the only one googling to figure out how I can "fake" my HR20 into believing my PC is "Viiv Certified" and send my music over the network? Can't be hard.


If you find anything, do tell


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## tfederov (Nov 18, 2005)

Marty B said:


> If you find anything, do tell


I second that!


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## ajwillys (Jun 14, 2006)

Marty B said:


> If you find anything, do tell


I don't know if this topic is off limits or not so I won't post any links but it looks like my early searches have yielded a Linux Media Center with "Full integration and compliance with Intel's ViiV devices" called "Elisa Media Center".

It's still in very early beta but I think it will pick up quickly if/when Viiv starts getting popular. Personally, my machine will be tri-boot adding this by the end of the week 

Moderators, if this is off limits, feel free to delete and I won't mention anymore.

Edit: Looks like it runs on top of any Linux/Unix/Windows machine so no need to install new OS


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## VideoVeteran (Dec 12, 2006)

ajwillys said:


> So .....
> 
> Am I the only one googling to figure out how I can "fake" my HR20 into believing my PC is "Viiv Certified" and send my music over the network? Can't be hard.


I think the main barrier will be support of DTCP-IP (Intel's copy protection system). AFAIK only ViiV computers support that. Try a google of DTCP-IP.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

VideoVeteran said:


> I think the main barrier will be support of DTCP-IP (Intel's copy protection system). AFAIK only ViiV computers support that. Try a google of DTCP-IP.


While I agree it will be a huge barrier, it does appear that DTCP-IP is a consortium license of five companies: Hitachi, Ltd., Intel Corporation, Matsu****a Electric Industrial Co., Ltd., Sony Corporation, and Toshiba Corporation. What I don't know is how opensource projects handle the licensing fees (upwards of $50k for mass distributions.)

Cheers,
Tom


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## RobertSeattle (Aug 27, 2006)

Sounds almost like a product Rokulabs had out several years ago. It's been discontinued - just wasn't enough demand back then.

www.Rokulabs.com


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

tibber said:


> While I agree it will be a huge barrier, it does appear that DTCP-IP is a consortium license of five companies: Hitachi, Ltd., Intel Corporation, Matsu****a Electric Industrial Co., Ltd., Sony Corporation, and Toshiba Corporation. What I don't know is how opensource projects handle the licensing fees (upwards of $50k for mass distributions.)
> 
> Cheers,
> Tom


The problem is that this will be a huge hurdle for Intel and anyone else to overcome. Given that companies like Microsoft are putting a lot of effort into similar technologies that are not tied to the brand of chip (things like Output Content Protection in Vista) I would be curious as to what would motivate anyone to support something like DTCP-IP?? Probably the same number as flocked to MicroChannel Architecture of the PS2....


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## Meklos (Nov 7, 2006)

Marty B said:


> Yeah theres always a catch. Why not just make it work with any computer that has the horse power?


Because the content providers are *super worried* (with good reason) that someone might be able to construct a digital copy of the content you are viewing. From just perusing the VIIV architecture, it looks like the requirement is that the data be encrypted not just across the ethernet, not just between two programs, but all the way from one particular chip to another particular chip on the motherboard.

Basically it's an attempt to make it to where even if you wrote a player program to look just like the legit player, your program couldn't fork off a copy of the decompressed data to another part of memory and buffer it to a file on the hard drive.

That's why it's only on particular hardware. It's only the VIIV-certified hardware that has this crypto capability in hardware. And if it's not in hardware, they're not going to trust it.


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

so once again the Mac addicts are frozen out


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

machavez00 said:


> so once again the Mac addicts are frozen out


So when are you all going to learn your lesson....  
(Just Kidding)


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## bret4 (Nov 22, 2006)

I don't get it. Why would I want to do this on my TV when I can already download music and photos on the internet? Never heard of VIIV before this thread. Can you do more with it than just photos and music? 

I wish they would just spend more time fixing bugs.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

bret4 said:


> I don't get it. Why would I want to do this on my TV when I can already download music and photos on the internet? Never heard of VIIV before this thread. Can you do more with it than just photos and music?
> 
> I wish they would just spend more time fixing bugs.


Part of the ViiV features, is to allow your HR20 to connect to YOUR PC, and display those pictures you downloaded (from where ever), on your TV.

As well as music files.


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## bret4 (Nov 22, 2006)

Just checked out Intel's site and saw that you can do games and video with VIIV. That would be cool if you could use it to download video like VOD. Maybe play some games on the TV. Something to do when there is nothing on the 200+ channels I have now.:lol:


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## raidersiowa (Dec 12, 2006)

Sixto said:


> Hi Earl ... the HR10 is slowly catching up to the Series3 ... there might be an HR20 next to my Series3 to begin testing/comparing soon ...


I just built a Athlon Duo Core 64 bit system with Vista Ultimate final release. I am going to be very upset with Directv if I have to buy more equipment to make this work.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

raidersiowa said:


> I just built a Athlon Duo Core 64 bit system with Vista Ultimate final release. I am going to be very upset with Directv if I have to buy more equipment to make this work.


Welcome to the forums! :welcome_s

I expect there will be "something" that will solve the customer pressure, but I don't know what yet.

Cheers,
Tom


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

Wonder how many homes actually have a Viiv PC. Weird to require Viiv.


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## Canis Lupus (Oct 16, 2006)

Don't worry machavez. We can already do all of this with our iPods.  We're not frozen out - all the windoze users are frozen in! And there's no escape! Hahahahaha :goodjob:

Man I need my OTA - I'm losin it.....



machavez00 said:


> so once again the Mac addicts are frozen out


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

VideoVeteran said:


> I think the main barrier will be support of DTCP-IP (Intel's copy protection system). AFAIK only ViiV computers support that. Try a google of DTCP-IP.


No, that doesn't make any sense. As of now, the only capabilities they're offering is the ability to view music and photos stored on your computer using the HR20. That doesn't require any form of copy protection.


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## jayvista (Oct 19, 2006)

hancox said:


> blech - if it doesn't add anything over my xbox 360 AND introduces craptastic Intel DRM, this is DOA.


Actually DirecTV will add the same "features" as they have with the HR20 .... instability, feature-lacking, and promises that it will work in the future. I imagine we will see photos that have the bottom half cropped ... or pixelated so you cant see the photos ... or music that stutters ... or ... . And they will probably spread their "technology" to your PC making it crash and reboot at the same frequency as the HR20.

After so many companies (more competent than DTV at product development) have tried and failed to deliver a good product for streaming photos, music, and video from a PC ... what makes anyone think DTV can do it? The expression "learn to walk before you run" comes to mind. DTV ... FIX your HR20 BEFORE you unleash more half-attempts at products!


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

jayvista said:


> DTV ... FIX your HR20 BEFORE you unleash more half-attempts at products!


Do you have to crap on every thread about new features with your dumb little rants? If you have an HR20, you should get rid of it. It's clearly having a negative effect on your mental health. If you don't have an HR20, then you shouldn't be as angry as you are.


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

This is of interest:

Intel's Viiv Page

System Requirements for Viiv Software

Based on that, it looks like I'm SOL. I imagine many others here don't have computers that match these specs.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> Based on that, it looks like I'm SOL. I imagine many others here don't have computers that match these specs.


Probably the vast majority of people will be SOL. DirecTV is just putting their greed ahead of customer satisfaction. It's not like music and photo sharing requires a Core 2 Duo processor. Intel just slipped DirecTV a few bucks to lock things down to Viiv.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

Since I can already do this with my Xbox360 (including 1080p, which the HR20 can't do) and my PCs throughout the house, why do I need to go buy an Intel Viiv-based computer?


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

Also looks like it requires Windows Media Center Edition (MCE). Geez.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Sixto said:


> Also looks like it requires Windows Media Center Edition (MCE). Geez.


MCE is required by Viiv.


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

I bethca I can fool it by running vitrtual pc and Vista on my Mac
:bonk1:


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## houskamp (Sep 14, 2006)

bet some kid hacks it in less than a month...


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

machavez00 said:


> I bethca I can fool it by running vitrtual pc and Vista on my Mac
> :bonk1:


Currently, no. The installer for Viiv 1.5 (latest version) will not install under Vista. I just tried it with my Vista RC2 machine. It complains about the OS first thing. I'm tempted to tear open the MSI that gets extracted from the EXE installer and tweaking the required OS and other such things to make it install on my machine. From what I've seen, Viiv 1.6 will support Vista fully.


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

Jeremy W said:


> MCE is required by Viiv.


So to be able to show photos on TV thru the HR20, you're going to need a Windows Media Center Edition (MCE) PC with Viiv? Wow ... big bucks.

With the TiVo Series3, you download TiVo Desktop 2.3a for free. You then tell it the directory(s) where your photos and mp3s are and you're done. Takes 5-10 minutes and it's free.

Was assuming that the HR20 would be as simple.

Just when I was starting to lean back to the HR20  Ah well ...


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## houskamp (Sep 14, 2006)

nice to know they are so worried about protecting the privacy of my family photos in my house on my network, wouldn't want my cat or dog stealing them... :nono2:


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Sixto said:


> So to be able to show photos on TV thru the HR20, you're going to need a Windows Media Center Edition (MCE) PC with Viiv? Wow ... big bucks.


Define "Big Bucks".....

Gateway has a ViiV Dual Core, MCE XP system for $599
http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=749640&postcount=19

Not that I am saying that you should "have" to purchase a new system, but we are not talking $3,000 or something here...


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

LameLefty said:


> Since I can already do this with my Xbox360 (including 1080p, which the HR20 can't do) and my PCs throughout the house, why do I need to go buy an Intel Viiv-based computer?


This is the thing for D* to look at. I can do this as well today.

I have a two tuner OTA card running under Vista Ultimate that can record HDTV content and stream it at full resolution to my XBox360. MS built all of this into their new network stack to appease the content gods... Very cool stuff that is all from the *software* not a particular hardware vendor.


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## bret4 (Nov 22, 2006)

Maybe this feature will go away if no one uses it. I'd rather see something TV related in a TV product. The HR20 has a hard enough time doing what it is asked to do now. Asking it to do more things at once is most likely not going to work that great. The more I read about this the more I think they should just dump the idea and get back to adding TV related features. Clean up the software to make it run more stable before you go and add something that most people do not have the hardware to use.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

lguvenoz said:


> This is the thing for D* to look at. I can do this as well today.
> 
> I have a two tuner OTA card running under Vista Ultimate that can record HDTV content and stream it at full resolution to my XBox360. MS built all of this into their new network stack to appease the content gods... Very cool stuff that is all from the *software* not a particular hardware vendor.


and where are you going to get 1080p content from ? One day it will exist but not over the air either HD DVD/Bluray or maybe cable and satellite. ATSC doesn't support 1080p .
Not to mention I amsure that cost you 1500$ total or more the HR20 is 1/3 of the price or less and Vista doesn't support MPEG 4 yet maybe one day so the only content you could play would be 1080i MPEG2 or WMV-HD .


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

bret4 said:


> Maybe this feature will go away if no one uses it. I'd rather see something TV related in a TV product. The HR20 has a hard enough time doing what it is asked to do now. Asking it to do more things at once is most likely not going to work that great. The more I read about this the more I think they should just dump the idea and get back to adding TV related features. Clean up the software to make it run more stable before you go and add something that most people do not have the hardware to use.


Other than stability and missed recording many of the features added are only for groups of different users. Some (mostly sports fans) want OTA, some want photos some music some want dual buffers. I bet 80-90% of the total HR20 users don't care about dual buffers or even know what it is.Personally I would prefer soft padding of programs and some other features like storing the guide and other parameters on the disk or the web.
In most software teams there are different groups working on different parts of the system and if some are working on VIIV it doesn't mean others are not busy trying to fix or add other "tv" features.


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> and where are you going to get 1080p content from ? One day it will exist but not over the air either HD DVD/Bluray or maybe cable and satellite. ATSC doesn't support 1080p .


In all fairness, he said "full resolution" which is rather vague. He never specifically said 1080p.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

PoitNarf said:


> In all fairness, he said "full resolution" which is rather vague. He never specifically said 1080p.


the quote was:
Originally Posted by LameLefty 
Since I can already do this with my Xbox360 (including 1080p, which the HR20 can't do) and my PCs throughout the house, why do I need to go buy an Intel Viiv-based computer?


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> the quote was:
> Originally Posted by LameLefty
> Since I can already do this with my Xbox360 (including 1080p, which the HR20 can't do) and my PCs throughout the house, why do I need to go buy an Intel Viiv-based computer?


Ah, but your post in which you said that quoted lguvenoz, not LameLefty. Technicalities


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## Canis Lupus (Oct 16, 2006)

iTunes and iPhoto - free with Mac OSX

USB cable connecting from a Mac to a Sammy 50" DLP using Wiselink - $3

Ability to push photos and mp3 through that connection - free

Watching Viiv PC Media Center Gateway MS-DOS Microsoft Ethernet to the HR-20 Dell Windows XP Compaq HP users worried about trying to achieve the same thing? - Priceless :lol:


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Canis Lupus said:


> iTunes and iPhoto - free with Mac OSX
> 
> USB cable connecting from a Mac to a Sammy 50" DLP using Wiselink - $3
> 
> ...


one little thing missing from the Mac called HD Video (other than OTA) although probably coming in January (ITV) but that cost as much as an HR20 and has no hard drive.
Also most people do not have a PC or Mac near their living room TV so a networked solution will be better if it works. Also VIIV aggregates content from Windows Media 11 and any other DLNA servers so if you have multiple machines networked you can see photos/music from all. If a VIIV PC can see other servers maybe the HR20 will.


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## Barmat (Aug 27, 2006)

Everybody in the room that has a Viiv computer please raise your hands. Thanks, the two of you can go and connect your HR20 now. What might I ask are the rest of us supposed to do?

I think I might go buy a 360 w/ a HD-DVD.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Barmat said:


> Everybody in the room that has a Viiv computer please raise your hands. Thanks, the two of you can go and connect your HR20 now. What might I ask are the rest of us supposed to do?
> 
> I think I might go buy a 360 w/ a HD-DVD.


Be patient and see what happens we haven't even seen it yet !!


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## Barmat (Aug 27, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> Be patient and see what happens we haven't even seen it yet !!


No way, I want my cutting edge technology uber geek toy now!!!!!


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## Canis Lupus (Oct 16, 2006)

That was kind of my point (was only kidding about the Mac OS thing [apologies to dvrblogger]  ). All discussions about the integration of the PC and the TV have been going on for ages, and none from a general consumer standpoint has been the solution. It'll be interesting to see what happens, but I for one [seriously now] would just as soon watch a movie, TV show, listen to music or look at photos on my iPod. This Hr-20 is an engaging idea, but aside from the Slingbox (which I find really impressive even though I don't even have one), I don't see much here that has merit at all unless you're willing to invest dollars only to give more dollars to D* for VOD. Just my 02. 



Barmat said:


> Everybody in the room that has a Viiv computer please raise your hands. Thanks, the two of you can go and connect your HR20 now. What might I ask are the rest of us supposed to do?
> 
> I think I might go buy a 360 w/ a HD-DVD.


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

I have my old G4 (hidden in entertainment center) hooked up to the SVGA connect on the back of my Sammy, linked to my dual 1.25 via Gigbit router :icon_bb:


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Define "Big Bucks"...


Hi Earl, Yep you're right, big bucks is usually in the thousands which is what I always thought a Windows MCE cost. At least the MCE's I always looked at!

It is concerning that just to see simple photos and play MP3s on the HR20, you'd need an MCE. As you know from some of my previous posts, I love the photo and mp3 app on the Series3.

As for those that think that this isn't a big deal, it's actually very cool, and could be simple to use, and very productive. I now have the complete family history (hundreds of photos) a few clicks away, and working on burning every CD so they're also a couple of clicks away. So simple on the Series3. You just tell it what directory for photos and mp3s and you're done.

Trying to reduce the reasons to not get a HR20. The HR20 is getting closer!

Add this and dual buffers ... and two more Satellites ... and bingo!


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## Jomanscool2 (Aug 28, 2006)

machavez00 said:


> so once again the Mac addicts are frozen out


pssh just wait till macworld and we get out iTV. a box the size of two CD cases that streams anything from out macs to our TV. And from what I read, its mac only!!!

Yay for us!

And its the size of 2 cd cases.

Now, to make this post on topic...

Pssh, who needs to stream media to their HR20? I want to stream media FROM my HR20.


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## Jomanscool2 (Aug 28, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> This is of interest:
> 
> Intel's Viiv Page
> 
> ...


*opens second link*
*notices how they are all intel chipsets*
*curses a dozen times*

So basically this is a cross market alliance with intel to kill AMD. Hmm, fun!

Too bad I hate intel and their 183571374192 core processors.

I mean, they are working on quad core processors already!

But yes, why is directv complying with intel's begging for assistance from every company out there? Even going a la microsoft and them making their own media jukebox so everyone has to buy new music and reload their photo's again would be better than this. (imho) (ZUNE!)


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

Jomanscool2 said:


> Too bad I hate intel and their 183571374192 core processors.
> 
> I mean, they are working on quad core processors already!


Yeah! Damn them for making more powerful processors!


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## Canis Lupus (Oct 16, 2006)

and what's coming from the HR-20 is H.264, which potentially gives Mac users a leg up in the streaming of MPEG-4 anyway. Don't be surprised if the next generation iTV does exactly what you're looking for - can u say Quicktime HD from the HR-20 thru iTV? (all DRM aside of course) 



Jomanscool2 said:


> pssh just wait till macworld and we get out iTV. a box the size of two CD cases that streams anything from out macs to our TV. And from what I read, its mac only!!!
> 
> Yay for us!
> 
> ...


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Jomanscool2 said:


> *opens second link*
> *notices how they are all intel chipsets*
> *curses a dozen times*
> 
> ...


AKA show me the money, Intel usually funds advertising so I assume if AMD would pony up they would cross promote. I doubt DIRECTV would ignore AMD computers as they represent 50% of the consumer market !!


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

CES is only 3 weeks away let's see what DISH, DIRECTV and others have in store for 2007 ? Wireless Portable Video players, PC receivers, external hard drives,networked DVRs ?


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## Jomanscool2 (Aug 28, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> Yeah! Damn them for making more powerful processors!


Well, I could have gone deeper, but I decided not to as this is a HR20 forum, but you have made me!

There are many studies that VERY few programs actually benefit from more than two core (final cut studio is one of them...). Having more powerful dual core 64bit processors have proved to be more advantageous for gaming. (Only worthwhile thing to do on computer besides browse forums/blogs and other... sites)

Even with the new multicore support for the souce engine by valve, the additional cores don't prove to be that powerful.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Streaming video (To/from a PC) is one app that is vastly improved with dual core as long as the video player application can take advantage of it.


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## grooves12 (Oct 27, 2005)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Define "Big Bucks".....
> 
> Gateway has a ViiV Dual Core, MCE XP system for $599
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=749640&postcount=19
> ...


$600 IS big bucks JUST to view photos, when the same functionality could be had for free if implemented properly.


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## houskamp (Sep 14, 2006)

I just want to play my music collection (already on my home server) on my sound system....
Think they should have a secure path out only...


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## Canis Lupus (Oct 16, 2006)

Airport Express. Done.



houskamp said:


> I just want to play my music collection (already on my home server) on my sound system....
> Think they should have a secure path out only...


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

grooves12 said:


> $600 IS big bucks JUST to view photos, when the same functionality could be had for free if implemented properly.


Yes, it would "high cost" for little return in your scenerio.
But say for someone like my mother, that hasn't purchase a new PC in 3 years. Fair price for a new system.

Everyone's situation is different.


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Yes, it would "high cost" for little return in your scenerio.
> But say for someone like my mother, that hasn't purchase a new PC in 3 years. Fair price for a new system.
> 
> Everyone's situation is different.


Oh well, I was planning on getting a new machine for the Vista release anyways :lol:


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> and where are you going to get 1080p content from ? One day it will exist but not over the air either HD DVD/Bluray or maybe cable and satellite. ATSC doesn't support 1080p .
> Not to mention I amsure that cost you 1500$ total or more the HR20 is 1/3 of the price or less and Vista doesn't support MPEG 4 yet maybe one day so the only content you could play would be 1080i MPEG2 or WMV-HD .


Vista does support MPEG4 depending upon the capture card (some existing cards support H.264). It also supports disk encryption, bus encryption and network encryption and trusting. All of the software pieces you would ever need to support distribution over your home network with the necessary protections to appease the content distributors.

Add to that hardware support for up to 4 parallel tuners, and you have a tremendous opportunity to build a true HTPC that distributes throughout your house. The biggest drawback to the whole setup is the bandwidth requirements for HDTV streaming. None of us should be surprised, but it's huge (your standard 802.11g wireless ain't gonna cut it). Mine can handle it, but it's over 100Mbps switched networking today, and I plan to upgrade to gigabit.

The networking piece is kind of interesting from ViiV. I've noticed that most, if not all, of the support hardware from Intel is all supporting gigabit networking. I also have noticed a lot of noise about the lack of wireless networking support being mandated. Realities of networking will hit home as people start doing more with streaming HD quality video, but that is where the real fun begins...


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> Oh well, I was planning on getting a new machine for the Vista release anyways :lol:


I'm enjoying it today, but I half expect to need to do another round of upgrades once the hardware pieces I want (can you see D* tuner card) become available. I'm just postponing any significant upgrades until we all find out what hoops we will be forced to jump through. I just hope they're nowhere near as bad as the stuff being discussed around CableCards.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Again, to all of the "other" setups out there.

Great... you have a solution that you are happy with.
No one is saying you have to use this method... use what makes sense for your setup, your systems, your configurations, ect...

No one is going to "force" you to purchase a ViiV system... no one is going to "force" you to use this feature of the HR20. 

But if in your setup... if this fits... then it is a feature to you.
Just like any other feature (OTA, "Dual Buffers", Active, ect...) may matter to you, may not... doesn't make it any less valuable to the next guy.

I have an XBOX360, that can connect to my Media Servers... however, my XBOX360 isn't on all the time... and I do have a ViiV PC... so having access to my MP3's via my wired network in my house, is one step closer to what I want...

So bottom line...
If you are not happy that you will need a ViiV complaint system...
Then add that to the column of reasons why YOU don't like the HR20.

But, doesn't change the fact that it (soon to be) is a feature of the HR20.
And just like any other feature, there are requirements for it...


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Again, to all of the "other" setups out there.
> 
> Great... you have a solution that you are happy with.
> No one is saying you have to use this method... use what makes sense for your setup, your systems, your configurations, ect...
> ...


Well said.


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Again, to all of the "other" setups out there.
> 
> Great... you have a solution that you are happy with.
> No one is saying you have to use this method... use what makes sense for your setup, your systems, your configurations, ect...
> ...


Great point Earl. I think it's awesome that they're reaching out to the computer community. I'll be interested to see how much activity they drum up around this. Even more so I'll be curious to see what sort of UI D* comes up with for the HR20 for things like browsing and listening to your music library.

It would be nice if they had maybe exercised their rekindled relationship with MS to do things using the standard MCE capabilities at the software level instead of hardware, but hey it is better than nothing and things are definitely advancing.


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## heaphus (Oct 30, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> CES is only 3 weeks away let's see what DISH, DIRECTV and others have in store for 2007 ? Wireless Portable Video players, PC receivers, external hard drives,networked DVRs ?


That's what I'm waiting for. Strictly going by what the MS rep said in the previously linked engadget interview, this recent development and, my daydreams, I'm guessing an external receiver that connects via usb or firewire and is controlled by MCE, which could then be shared across the network to HR20s, all of which would make the MCE/ViiV requirement make some sense.

Well, I can dream, can't I?:lol:


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## lguvenoz (Aug 23, 2006)

heaphus said:


> That's what I'm waiting for. Strictly going by what the MS rep said in the previously linked engadget interview, this recent development and, my daydreams, I'm guessing an external receiver that connects via usb or firewire and is controlled by MCE, which could then be shared across the network to HR20s, all of which would make the MCE/ViiV requirement make some sense.
> 
> Well, I can dream, can't I?:lol:


I do hope that CES sheds some light. My honest hope is that from D* perspective they remove ViiV from the tuner card discussion. They should leverage the components of Vista and develop a PCI-Express internal solution. Vista can then guarantee the integrity and security of data all the way from the tuner card to the disk and over the network to distribution points. None of these elements in Vista mandate ViiV so it would be the most friendly to the user community.

How's that for a dream... Companies thinking of users first :lol:


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## heaphus (Oct 30, 2006)

lguvenoz said:


> I do hope that CES sheds some light. My honest hope is that from D* perspective they remove ViiV from the tuner card discussion. They should leverage the components of Vista and develop a PCI-Express internal solution. Vista can then guarantee the integrity and security of data all the way from the tuner card to the disk and over the network to distribution points. None of these elements in Vista mandate ViiV so it would be the most friendly to the user community.
> 
> How's that for a dream... Companies thinking of users first :lol:


I have no problem with that. However, the agreement with Intel, and this resulting development, tell me that ViiV will remain in the loop. But, look on the potential brightside, we may get lucky and not have to buy a pre-built, certified box like the CableCard folk. We could still roll or own, albeit on the ViiV platform. And, internal or external won't hurt my feelings either way. ATI has both already built for OCUR.


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## dwenn (Oct 26, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> CES is only 3 weeks away let's see what DISH, DIRECTV and others have in store for 2007 ? Wireless Portable Video players, PC receivers, external hard drives,networked DVRs ?


I think we saw what DirecTV has in store for 2007 at last year's CES!

By the way this USB port on the front of the HR20 - couldn't I just put my 4GB thumb drive on it which has hours of music and 100s of photos in to display on my Sammy. Wow that would be cool - Go HR20!


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## ouijal (Aug 22, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> CES is only 3 weeks away let's see what DISH, DIRECTV and others have in store for 2007 ? Wireless Portable Video players, PC receivers, external hard drives,networked DVRs ?


A stable HD DVR?


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

ouijal said:


> A stable HD DVR?


Lets hope that Directv doesn't have to choose between the R15 and HR20. Perhaps we can have both stable! 

Cheers,
Tom


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## skierbri10 (Sep 18, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> This is of interest:
> 
> Intel's Viiv Page
> 
> ...


I have all of that except I have XP pro instead of media center. No way I am downgrading to Media Center, another DTV mess up in my opinion.


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## skierbri10 (Sep 18, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Again, to all of the "other" setups out there.
> 
> Great... you have a solution that you are happy with.
> No one is saying you have to use this method... use what makes sense for your setup, your systems, your configurations, ect...
> ...


Great point Earl, but it is just another reason I can't wait for Fios to come to Colorado. :grin:


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Earl Bonovich said:


> just like any other feature, there are requirements for it...


I would have no problem with the requirements if they weren't arbitrary BS imposed on us strictly because Intel gave DirecTV a few bucks.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

Jeremy W said:


> I would have no problem with the requirements if they weren't arbitrary BS imposed on us strictly because Intel gave DirecTV a few bucks.


Clearly Viiv horsepower isn't technically required just to serve my photos or MP3s. Hopefully some serious future features will better test the computing horsepower of the Viiv specs.

Cheers,
Tom


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## darrin1471 (Aug 18, 2006)

Could ViiV be used to distribute HD TV from the PC to the TV now or in the future?
Could DirecTV set up a Pay per view option online and distribute it through the PC?


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

lguvenoz said:


> Vista does support MPEG4 depending upon the capture card (some existing cards support H.264). It also supports disk encryption, bus encryption and network encryption and trusting. All of the software pieces you would ever need to support distribution over your home network with the necessary protections to appease the content distributors.
> 
> Add to that hardware support for up to 4 parallel tuners, and you have a tremendous opportunity to build a true HTPC that distributes throughout your house. The biggest drawback to the whole setup is the bandwidth requirements for HDTV streaming. None of us should be surprised, but it's huge (your standard 802.11g wireless ain't gonna cut it). Mine can handle it, but it's over 100Mbps switched networking today, and I plan to upgrade to gigabit.
> 
> The networking piece is kind of interesting from ViiV. I've noticed that most, if not all, of the support hardware from Intel is all supporting gigabit networking. I also have noticed a lot of noise about the lack of wireless networking support being mandated. Realities of networking will hit home as people start doing more with streaming HD quality video, but that is where the real fun begins...


I should have said MSFT doesn't support MPEG4 yet in Vista and there is no secure driver /OS support from MSFT for anything other than MPEG2 and WMV. This means any solution for now would need to be a complet 3 rd party solution and not a plugin to Media Center's PVR.


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## Marty B (Sep 21, 2006)

houskamp said:


> nice to know they are so worried about protecting the privacy of my family photos in my house on my network, wouldn't want my cat or dog stealing them... :nono2:


I agree completely. So this feature allows a secure connection from my PC to my HR20 so I can display pictures that I took and play music that I downloaded from limewire. I dont get it. I could ALMOST understand it if it went the other direction, meaning it woud allow you to play recorded shows on your. Why do I want this "feature" again? PC.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Marty B said:


> So this feature allows a secure connection from my PC to my HR20 so I can display pictures that I took and play music that I downloaded from limewire.


No, security has nothing to do with it.


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## Marty B (Sep 21, 2006)

Jomanscool2 said:


> Well, I could have gone deeper, but I decided not to as this is a HR20 forum, but you have made me!
> 
> There are many studies that VERY few programs actually benefit from more than two core (final cut studio is one of them...). Having more powerful dual core 64bit processors have proved to be more advantageous for gaming. (Only worthwhile thing to do on computer besides browse forums/blogs and other... sites)
> 
> Even with the new multicore support for the souce engine by valve, the additional cores don't prove to be that powerful.


I remember people saying "A megabyte of memory? No one will every need that much."


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Marty B said:


> I remember people saying "A megabyte of memory? No one will every need that much."


Absolutely. I don't see how anyone could be angry about the fact that Intel is working on pushing the limits of technology. We don't need quad cores on the desktop today, sure, but the day will come.


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## monkeydrum (Aug 28, 2006)

PoitNarf said:


> Currently, no. The installer for Viiv 1.5 (latest version) will not install under Vista. I just tried it with my Vista RC2 machine. It complains about the OS first thing. I'm tempted to tear open the MSI that gets extracted from the EXE installer and tweaking the required OS and other such things to make it install on my machine. From what I've seen, Viiv 1.6 will support Vista fully.


Does anyone have the Viiv 1.50(??) installer available for download? Currently have 1.0(something) and only can find 1.52 on the intel site. Downloaded and tried to install but received message that 1.50 has to be installed first.

Thanks in advance guys...


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

monkeydrum said:


> Does anyone have the Viiv 1.50(??) installer available for download? Currently have 1.0(something) and only can find 1.52 on the intel site. Downloaded and tried to install but received message that 1.50 has to be installed first.
> 
> Thanks in advance guys...


I am still working on getting the link for the 1.5 download.


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## mridan (Nov 15, 2006)

ajwillys said:


> So .....
> 
> Am I the only one googling to figure out how I can "fake" my HR20 into believing my PC is "Viiv Certified" and send my music over the network? Can't be hard.


my pc isnt "viiv certified" ,and I can listen to music while watching pic. slideshow. hardwired hr20 to 2wire router,and installed wmp 11.had to reboot hr20 after wmp11 install,and works fine


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