# GPS Help



## stillbillmd (Dec 14, 2005)

Hi all. I am probably posting this in the wrong forum, but was wondering if anyone here could help me with selecting a GPS system for my wife. A little background:

She travels in a mulit-state area - MD, DC, VA, PA for the most part. The only instructions she's given me is that she wants a color screen & a unit that "talks" to her. She said she was in a car that had a unit with vocal ability, but she couldn't understand it (I guess the tone was too mechanical or something).

I've looked around at about 37 million different units, but it's all Greek to me. It looked like there were some units that may fit the bill from Garmin & Magellan in the $600 range, but I have no idea if these are really what I'm looking for.

Can anyone give me some advice or point me to somewhere that can? Thanks for any help.


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## stillbillmd (Dec 14, 2005)

oops - sorry . Thanks, Mods. Missed this forum completely


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## Mikey (Oct 26, 2004)

This would be my choice for my next GPS:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000087BXU/102-2393157-3426535?v=glance&n=172282


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

I've only had experience with the handheld GPS units from Magellan GPS, and none from other manufacturers. (I previously had a Magellan SporTrak Color before it was stolen, and now a Magellan Platinum.) Also, the mapping algorithim tends to take the shortest route rather than the fastest route. 

What's important is the quality of map data, and even then, it's gets outdated. In Sacramento, one off-ramp was completely removed as part of a road construction project, while in Roseville, a completely redesigned off-ramp system will become available on Friday. (They spent the past two years recontructing the ramp system to handle the traffic load, and so you will be taking a tunnel to board the freeway.)

Also, address entry is a little backwards. You enter in a street name, then the address number. What makes it fun is that, in Sacramento, some streets are broken into THREE pieces. One piece starts in "Unincorporated Sacramento County", then crosses over into "Sacramento", then back to "Unincorporated Sacramento County" again. 

One issue I have is memory capacity. The Sportrak Color only has 32MB, while the Platinum uses a SD-RAM card, and can store up to 64MB pieces of map uploaded from Mapsend DirectRoute. With a 128MB card, I was able to store most of California from the northern border to the southern tip of Nevada, and also include the states of Nevada and Utah as a 64MB chunk. (The chunks also include point of interest data, including banks, gas stations and restaurants). Another 50 MB chunk covers Southern California, a good portion of Nevada, and Northern California (but excludes San Francisco and surrounding areas). With the units you are describing, the complete United States map data is part of the unit, thus part of the higher cost.

If I were choosing a GPS unit for my mom, I would select a TomTom because of it's easy to use interface and more naturally speaking voice.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

If your wife travels with a laptop take a look at this solution: http://www.delorme.com/earthmatelt20/default.asp I have been using a similar product (same software, different hardware) for about 3 years now and it has worked great. Very easy and user friendly. I simply have the laptop sitting on the passenger seat and it talks me to where I tell it to go. It's very nice having the big screen.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

The other laptop option is Microsoft's Streets and Trips. http://www.microsoft.com/streets/default.mspx
I have been using this one. The biggest limitation this program had was not having a voice. That changed with the 2006 edition. If you go this way, make sure you don't buy a leftover 2005 version. The first year you buy the program and GPS unit as a package. After that you just buy that years software. You can download current information on road construction at any time, but the actual mapping only changes with the yearly upgrae.


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## penguin44 (Oct 29, 2005)

You could also look at the GPS18 unit from garmin, they send you the map and antenna for your USB laptop. I have used it for over 5 months, its great. Got me from Toronto to Sticksville NC and back. Honestly the maps are great, the place I went to was POP 250 and all the streets were there. It's got voice, auto route, auto re-route, the works! It';s a good deal.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

stillbillmd, I don't know if we are really helping any. You have said that you have looked at a bunch of these, and are looking for advice. We have at least offered what we have, and what works for us. I think to narrow down what would work for your wife we need to know some more specifics. Here are some questions that might help, and some of the others can probably add more.

What's your budget?

Do you have a laptop, and if so is that option something you even care to consider?

Or, are you looking for a portable unit?

Or, are you interested in the aftermarket built-in option. Many car audio units now also play DVDs and include a screen for your navigation.

You have stated that she wants the voice option, which I would also recommend, but are there any other requirements as far as screen size, etc.

How technically savvy is your wife. Do you need the absolute simplest unit available, or can she handle a more complex unit that might offer more options but not be as simple to operate?

Answer any of these you can that apply.


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## RichW (Mar 29, 2002)

I use ALK CoPilot Live on my Ipaq PDA. Works fine for my purposes but requires a way to mount in in the car. I uses a suction-cup mount to the windshield behind my rear-view mirror for best look at the GPS satellites.


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

Will she want a dedicated device, or an add-on to something she may already be carrying such as a laptop or PDA?

I ended up with the Dell Axim X51v PDA (VGA screen, fast processor, and the new Windows Mobile 5) and wired GPS puck that sits on the dash (currently $582, check www.techbargains.com for coupon codes. Check back the morning after one expires and use the new one quickly). Plan to buy an SD memory card. I prop the PDA on the console in front of the shifter. Can't do that with a passenger.

It does talk, and the map is maybe a bit _too_ current. As I drove in NW AZ approaching Hoover Dam it announced I would need to turn left so many feet ahead to stay on the highway. As I reached that point it made a "bong" noise and told me to turn now. About 50' overhead was a bridge for the new alignment of the highway that will lead to a future, as in "not yet there," bridge over the river canyon downstream from the dam.

I was disappointed that it lacked a specific layer. I was hoping to be able to see where RR tracks are in order to help me eliminate motels where I wouldn't stand a chance of getting any sleep. Wasn't an issue on this trip but I may be taking a longer one in the spring to unfamiliar areas.


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

Richard King said:


> If your wife travels with a laptop take a look at this solution: http://www.delorme.com/earthmatelt20/default.asp I have been using a similar product (same software, different hardware) for about 3 years now and it has worked great. Very easy and user friendly. I simply have the laptop sitting on the passenger seat and it talks me to where I tell it to go. It's very nice having the big screen.


Richard is the only visitor I've had who, thanks to the GPS software on his laptop, has been able to navigate straight to my 'door' without calling for directions first, and a laptop screen is much easier to read over a small handheld GPS unit.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

The laptop "drove" me across country last year from Florida to Minnesota to Utah and back to Florida without a hitch.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

I did a TV show for Kenwood dealer 3 years ago on their GPS system that runs off a DVD-ROM direct using a 7" touch screen. I was so excited about what this offered I bought one and put it in my Van for traveling. But that GPS quickly spoiled me so I had to have one when renting a car. I used the delorme system on my laptop. It works but was slow to lock up to the satellites and the receiver wasn't very sensitive. A year later they resolved all the receiver issues with the USB model. BUT, I found the laptop was a real chore to use after being spoiled with the Kenwood $ystem. So, when I got my IPAQ PDA the GPS was one of the first major apps I bought for it. What it lacks in screen size it makes up for in ease of use and fast set up. Typing in the address is the only difficult task with a PDA, It's about as difficult as typing e-mail or anything else on the PDA. 

I found a really simple way to use the PDA in a rental car. I mount it to the AC vents in the center of the Dash using a rubber band that I loop through the vent. It's quick for mounting the PDA just about anywhere, including on the center of the steering wheel. The BT receiver just sits up on the dash out of the way. I keep all the maps, program, and data on a single SD 1 G card. The speaker on my PDA is not very good but I can use the voice directions with the BT head set and then when I get a call it is on that as a priority audio too.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Does anyone here have a vehicle with a built in navagation system? I read a review a few days ago, I think on CNet.com, that the writer felt the built in units were overpriced and also were generally "behind the times" on features and mapping.


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

Stands to reason, Bogy. 

I recall when a simple radio/cassette player, factory-installed as an option on a new car, would add $500-$700 to the sticker price.


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## n8dagr8 (Aug 14, 2004)

I believe those navigation systems add about $1500 to the price of the car. I have the data around here somewhere (assuming it didn't get stolen in the move) if you want me to find it. We wrote a business plan for something that utilized the on-board screen.

Don,

What did all that run you (if you don't mind me asking - you can PM me if you would like)? What all do I need? (extra memory card, receive, map software)

Also, if you had to do it all over again, what would you do? I'd really like to get some sort of GPS system for my car. LA has sooooo many roads.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

In some of the vehicles I have looked at recently the navigation system added 2 grand.

If I had only one vehicle to worry about using it in, I think I would look seriously at some of the aftermarket in dash units. Crutchfield has a great selection of all the various kinds of GPS units available.


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## RichW (Mar 29, 2002)

The other nice thing about the Ipaq (or other PDA/hand-held unit) is that when I go into the woods, it goes with me. Better than any compass... until the battery runs down.


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## n8dagr8 (Aug 14, 2004)

RichW said:


> The other nice thing about the Ipaq (or other PDA/hand-held unit) is that when I go into the woods, it goes with me. Better than any compass... until the battery runs down.


mine (and Don's) also works as a phone and for my cross-country trip it was my radio. The uhaul had a radio but I had almost 1GB of songs on a SD card and a cheap little FM transmitter. Very nice thing to have....and no yapping DJs.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

n8-

The Kenwood system is not just a GPS, it is an entire Car sound/video system. The latest version has some really nice search features such as hunt down and mark on the map all particular Brand name gas stations. This is nice when I travel looking for the next exit that has a Hess station that gives me a 10% rebate. Does the same for many travel related businesses, restaurants, theaters, hotels, airports, shopping centers, etc. Of course it has custom mapping locations you can add to the map as well. Out of all the systems I looked at, this one beat all of them out on the market. I also learned that the voice programmable ones is an exercise in frustration, but the touch screen is the way to go. Other stuff included or accessoriezed is the DVD player that works with DVD-R. The mp3 drive, CD changer, NTSC TV (suppose I'll need to get an ATSC adapter when those are required!) Am/FM, serius or XM modules and DTS / DD5.1 sound system. The hardware comes in different varieties to build your system around. I have the receiver with the retractable touch screen. You can also get a larger fixed touch screen. There is a DVD-ROM drive for the GPS system so you can buy updated maps/databases. I purchased one new DVD update since putting in the system. These retail for $450, steep but it does allow you to keep the system updated. My system has the works, except for the sat radio options and the CD changer. For MP3 I opted for a custom connection with my ipaq 6315 that connects with a cradle mount which is nice because it makes the music go silent during phone calls and puts the phone sound on the speakers, then when you hang up, returns to the music. GPS nav instructions bust over top of the music. Also, the voice on the GPS can be set for real speech with dialects and accents, not some computer generated geekspeek. The sound from the mp3 Ipaq through the Kenwood is amazing. For starters you'll spend about $3G minimum for GPS and dedicated screen remote control only ( I wouldn't do this) A Base system with full auto sound for DD5.1 and videotouch screen/DVD/GPS, figure about $5G. Depending on where you go, dealers offer huge discounts on big systems. It may be worth traveling to one but in S California you'd probably have many to pick from. I also worked a deal for my van buyout and with the deal plus money saved by doing some video, It really didn't coast me anywhere near that amount but my out of pocket was close to a low end nav system like the audiovox.
It meant I was locked into my van for life rather than trade up after 3 years like I originally planned. In that respect it pays to have a vehicle that is not so obsolete so quickly. I would not put one of these in a standard car as I don't think it would pay but when I got this Van in 1999 it was loaded with every high tech option I could put on it so it would last my tastes for a number of years. I have it owned by my business which makes it a 100% tax writeoff since I have another car for personal use that is in my name. I would do another Kenwood system in a Van again for a business expense but I would go with my IPAQ for personal car. I don't think a car for mostly local travel can justify a Kenwood like GPS system. The Van for me, becomes my Office away from home for many weeks of the year. I think the only thing missing from the Kenwood system that would seriously make me consider upgrade is if they make one with a built in EVDO broadband built in that integrates with something like Google maps, NOAA weather etc. I believe this will be out in a few years and then I would be ready to buy a new VAN and add that system, after market immediately, assuming I'm still in the business that could benefit from this. 


AS for the factory added options- Absolutely a ripoff from what I've see, People who don't research these and just buy it as an option with their new car think they're great but that's just because they don't know what else is out there. I've also seen these units in Hertz and other rental cars. Very expensive and requires a short learning curve as all of them do but if you learn a particular rental system that curve will only be for your first time. They add about $10 a day to the rental cost- PLUS the taxes. MY IPAQ GPS system has paid for itself in rental car GPS cost savings after about a year.


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## stillbillmd (Dec 14, 2005)

Bogy said:


> stillbillmd, I don't know if we are really helping any. You have said that you have looked at a bunch of these, and are looking for advice. We have at least offered what we have, and what works for us. I think to narrow down what would work for your wife we need to know some more specifics. Here are some questions that might help, and some of the others can probably add more.
> 
> What's your budget?
> 
> ...


Bogy, I'll try to answer as best I can, but keep in mind my dog probably knows more about these things than I do 

Budget: I'd like to spend under 1G if possible. She knows I'm doing this & told me to "watch it" as she knows I have a tendency to go top of the line ("go top of the line" = "stupid" many times for me) - whether I need the extras or not.

She has a laptop, but doesn't want to go that way. She wants something she'll be able to see while driving.

I think we want something that's a standalone unit that can be "soft" installed (similar to how many install portable sat radio units), as opposed to say, putting a new stereo in your car by taking the dash off....

On screen size, I'm lost. I don't think she wants anything as small as a Palm Pilot - maybe the size of a portable DVD????

She's more tech-savvy than I, but I think in this case going relatively simple (user-friendly) may be the way to go.

Thanks for all the help so far, guys. I've been away for a couple of days & am pleasantly surprised by the amount of responses - they've all helped me get a better understanding of what I'm looking for.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

stillbillmd-

There are plenty of options that meet your criteria in the stand alone systems that are portable- I use the most ( I believe) versatile in the PDA system. The stand alone systems may be better suited but these also have small screen. IMO, both the PDA and stand alone systems are easy to use. The PDA just has many more options in the combination of other apps like what PDA's do today, cell phone, camera, address and appointment log, games expense reports etc. IMO, the lap top system would be a mistake. It is a poor retrofit for GPS in the car due mostly to ergonomics. I liked having it when I had nothing better but soon grew tired of the laptop's awkward use for the car.

I think the key thing for your wife would be to check out the Garmin and others like it, plan to spend about $700 for a really good one and then once she learns it, it will allow her to travel with much less stress and fear of getting lost. That just does not happen with a GPS. My wife wants one too, really bad but she also wants a PDA with EVDO more so. After CES I will be shopping for something for her then. She likes my PDA with BT GPS since it can go from her car to a rental car easily. However she agrees that the Kenwood is much easier to use than anything else out there.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

I think Don answered well, but just a couple of additions. Putting one of the aftermarket stereo type units in a vehicle is not that big a deal. It certainly does not necesitate taking off the dash. Degree of difficulty can vary, but I have a new car ordered and when it comes I will take the aftermarket stereo/mp3 unit out of my trade in and put the factory unit back in , mostly because the dealer would rather have it that way. It will take about ten minutes. Many place will do free installs if you buy the unit there.

Opinions obviously vary, but I still like my laptop method. 15" screen, I can set the fonts VERY LARGE and zoom in on the map, and if you have the voice you aren't supposed to look at it anyway.

Anyway, I agree with Don that you will probably be most satisfied with one of the Garmin type units.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Bogy is right about the custom installs, that is by a professional installer. I was pleasantly surprised at the modern day approach to doing this. The installer had all sorts of adapters and molded fittings, the factory radio came out with a few screws and the new one fit right in the standard space with a stock bezel designed for my Van. Took only a few minutes and it looks factory as the original!


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Or, if you are like me, you buy the stuff through Crutchfield, who provides you with all the adapters etc. that you will need and you do it yourself. I would just as soon not have anyone else mess around with my car.


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## n8dagr8 (Aug 14, 2004)

so what are things you would look for in a BT GPS receiver?

man, why do we always hijack every thread? 

this looks nice and the software takes up almost no memory (that kinda scares me).

http://www.delorme.com/bluelogger/default.asp


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## Cholly (Mar 22, 2004)

Like Bogy, I have a laptop with DeLorme Earthmate GPS. I'm using Street Atlas 2004 with it. The maps, of courrse, are outdated, but even the latest maps from Microsoft, Google, Yahoo, DeLorme and MapQuest are somewhat outdated. This poses a big problem when you're looking for an address in a relatively new area. 
When you research various GPS solutions, you'll find this is a common problem. There are only a few firms that provide the map data to the various manufacturers. These companies send teams all over the country with rather sophisticated combinations of GPS and recording devices. Naturally, it takes quite a bit of time and effort to provide updated data.

All that being said, take a look at www.newegg.com for quite a large assortment of GPS units. If I were buying one today, I'd be inclined to opt for the TomTom 300 or 700. Easy to use, highly regarded. If I were buying a PDA based unit, I'd probably go for the Garmin iQue M5. My son in-law has one and recommends it highly.


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## HIPAR (May 15, 2005)

I have always found operation of a laptop in my car to be cumbersome. There are wires from the GPS getting tangled. You really need an external power connections. The laptop slides all over the place. And, the worst part, the LCD is not viewable in bright light.

--- CHAS


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

HIPAR said:


> I have always found operation of a laptop in my car to be cumbersome. There are wires from the GPS getting tangled. You really need an external power connections. The laptop slides all over the place. And, the worst part, the LCD is not viewable in bright light.
> 
> --- CHAS


I have thought about getting a bluetooth version of the GPS unit, then I wouldn't need to worry about the cord.
I have an external power connection. Because of the external power connection I have no problem having my screen bright enough to view in sunlight. Also, one of the changes for Streets & Trips 2006 is a "night" screen, with a black background and florescent green roads. Shows up nice. If there is no passenger, the seat in my car holds the laptop in place very nicely.

BTW, if you get an externoal power converter, make sure you get one with enough power. Basically, this mean DON'T get one at Wal-Mart. I picked one up there that according to the specs on the package should have done the job, but it couldn't. I still want to put my test meter on it and find out exactly how much power it is actually putting out, but it isn't what is claimed. I brought the first one back and got a replacement, but got the same results, and I have talked with others who had the same problem. I purchased my current converter at Radio Shack and had no more problems.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Cholly said:


> Like Bogy, I have a laptop with DeLorme Earthmate GPS. I'm using Street Atlas 2004 with it. The maps, of courrse, are outdated, but even the latest maps from Microsoft, Google, Yahoo, DeLorme and MapQuest are somewhat outdated. This poses a big problem when you're looking for an address in a relatively new area.
> When you research various GPS solutions, you'll find this is a common problem. There are only a few firms that provide the map data to the various manufacturers. These companies send teams all over the country with rather sophisticated combinations of GPS and recording devices. Naturally, it takes quite a bit of time and effort to provide updated data.


It isn't just in new areas. In my small community there is a bridge that has obviously been out of a number of years. When I set a route from home the program quite often wants me to use that way to the highway. I get the message each time that I am "off route" and then that I am "on route" as I drive around it.


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