# That's it! I've had enough.



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

After 7 years of service with Directv I am planning to call tomorrow and cancel my service. 
I have a HD DVR and have the rain fade issue where one tuner does not come back. I have missed a number of recordings because of this but it cam to a head today.
I set the DVR to record the F1 Grand Prix on Speed. It was in the middle of the night. Sat down this morning to watch and black screen. 2 hours of nothing.
That's it I said. I want a new box. I proceeded to call Directv and got caught up in all the recorded technical procedures of how to reset my box. I called back and this time I said "cancel service" to get straight through to a person. I explained my situation and how I was close to cancelling. She then walked me through swapping my cables etc. When I explained that I needed a new box she told me that they couldn't swap the box without sending someone out. Of course they would charge me for this service. However they would give me the maintenance plan free for 6 months if I took it for 12 months.
Well, I'm sorry. This rain fade tuner problem is well known. All they had to do was send me a box. But no...

So after 7 years, tomorrow I call Comcast.

Sad...


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

If rain fade is the issue, it is usually resolved by a simple realignment of the Dish. A new receiver is usually not going to solve the problem.


----------



## shocky (Oct 23, 2007)

sarcasm
Too bad you called in for technical support. That's a new 2 year contract because you spoke to a live person.
/sarcasm

That's how it feels sometimes.


----------



## shocky (Oct 23, 2007)

DodgerKing said:


> If rain fade is the issue, it is usually resolved by a simple realignment of the Dish. A new receiver is usually not going to solve the problem.


I'm familiar with the issue he is having.. Bout 6 months ago I had issues with an HR21 unit 'losing' signal on a single tuner after rainfade. IE both tuners will go out but only one will come back. For me replacing my unit solved the issue so I chalk it up to the unit.

I've also seen enough posts on here for the same issue to agree with the OP.


----------



## Mertzen (Dec 8, 2006)

Over 90% of replaced IRDs are non defective. A new box won't help you out with rain fade.
Post your signal levels.


----------



## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

kinsale said:


> After 7 years of service with Directv I am planning to call tomorrow and cancel my service.
> I have a HD DVR and have the rain fade issue where one tuner does not come back. I have missed a number of recordings because of this but it cam to a head today.
> I set the DVR to record the F1 Grand Prix on Speed. It was in the middle of the night. Sat down this morning to watch and black screen. 2 hours of nothing.
> That's it I said. I want a new box. I proceeded to call Directv and got caught up in all the recorded technical procedures of how to reset my box. I called back and this time I said "cancel service" to get straight through to a person. I explained my situation and how I was close to cancelling. She then walked me through swapping my cables etc. When I explained that I needed a new box she told me that they couldn't swap the box without sending someone out. Of course they would charge me for this service. However they would give me the maintenance plan free for 6 months if I took it for 12 months.
> ...


Call again, tell the CSR that the DVR is dead, will not power on at all. You had a power outage, when the power came back on, the DVR will no longer operate and there is a "burnt" smell. They will have a new DVR in the mail to you that day.


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

shocky said:


> I'm familiar with the issue he is having.. Bout 6 months ago I had issues with an HR21 unit 'losing' signal on a single tuner after rainfade. IE both tuners will go out but only one will come back. For me replacing my unit solved the issue so I chalk it up to the unit.
> 
> I've also seen enough posts on here for the same issue to agree with the OP.


I can see them wanting to send a technician before simply giving out a new box. It cost too much money to give things away every time a sub has a problem, especially when many problems can be fixed pretty easily.

Remember that most subs are not as technically savvy as those that post here. They call up and request things for the stupidest reasons. I cannot tell you how many times my neighbor thought there was something wrong with their box because they accidentally changed the channel on their TV and could not figure out why they could no longer get a picture.


----------



## jefirdjr (Feb 20, 2006)

The OP was not complaining about the rain fade, but the fact that one tuner would not recover from the rain fade. No amount of dish alignment will fix that.


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

jefirdjr said:


> The OP was not complaining about the rain fade, but the fact that one tuner would not recover from the rain fade. No amount of dish alignment will fix that.


Maybe...Maybe not. Direct does not know what his particular problem is nor do they know how technically knowledgeable he is. They don't know if it is a wiring, a BBC, ex. The only way to find out is to send a technician to confirm before giving away a box.

It would be nice if they gave boxes away like they used to, but those old SD Hughes boxes are pennies compared to the HRs.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

DodgerKing said:



> It would be nice if they gave boxes away like they used to, but those old SD Hughes boxes are pennies compared to the HRs.


What would be nice is if they fixed an issue they caused in Jan/Feb 2008.

If you want to read more on the issue the OP is talking about (which has nothing to do with alignment) do a search on tuner and rain fade. In fact, two of the threads are on the front page of the HD DVR page right now.

ie http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

raott said:


> What would be nice is if they fixed an issue they caused in Jan/Feb 2008.
> 
> If you want to read more on the issue the OP is talking about (which has nothing to do with alignment) do a search on tuner and rain fade. In fact, two of the threads are on the front page right now.


I agree

Does sending a new box fix the issue or will a simple software update fix it? Does Direct know for sure that this is what is affecting him? As a company, they cannot simply give out inventory until they can confirm what the issue is in each case.

BTW, if he calls enough and gets the right CSRs or manager and threatens to leave, more often than not, they will give in.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

DodgerKing said:


> I agree
> 
> Does sending a new box fix the issue or will a simple software update fix it?


Don't know. All I know is that the issue cropped up after the Jan/Feb 2008 NR and does not appear to affect all units.

I (as have others) have asked a number of times if there is any feedback on this particular issue but I've yet to see anyone with contacts respond.

I agree they cannot send boxes at anyone's request, but this issue has gone on long enough one would hope it could be identified as a known issue and a box sent to get it fixed

That is what burns me, the issue happened after a NR, but if I want a new box to fix their shoddy programming, it would take a service call, a shipping fee and the risk of getting hit with a new two year contract.


----------



## Dolly (Jan 30, 2007)

Well I was having a problem with a receiver. It wasn't a rain fade issue. I had over a month's documentation of the problem. I have the Protection Plan and wanted a new receiver. All my phone calls documented the problem, however, my husband's phone call got us a new receiver  It's a man's world still


----------



## rebkell (Sep 9, 2006)

DodgerKing said:


> I agree
> 
> Does sending a new box fix the issue or will a simple software update fix it? Does Direct know for sure that this is what is affecting him? As a company, they cannot simply give out inventory until they can confirm what the issue is in each case.
> 
> BTW, if he calls enough and gets the right CSRs or manager and threatens to leave, more often than not, they will give in.


You'd think 7 years of service would get you a little better treatment, he'll have to send in the old unit and pay shipping charges, so I don't see how it costs more than a service call.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

Call and get a replacement. Say it won't power on. Let them walk you thru the motions, say it still won't power on. You'll have a new box pretty quickly. Just gotta walk the CSR down the right path on their call scripts.


----------



## Upstream (Jul 4, 2006)

kinsale said:


> So after 7 years, tomorrow I call Comcast.


If you do decide to switch to Comcast, let them know that you are switching from DirecTV. They waived the HD-DVR fee for me for 12 months because I switched from DirecTV.


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

rebkell said:


> You'd think 7 years of service would get you a little better treatment, he'll have to send in the old unit and pay shipping charges, so I don't see how it costs more than a service call.


Service call is still much less than a new receiver.

I do agree that one who has been with them for a long period of time should have some of the costs waived. They have paid enough in service to warrant some perks. Perhaps offer him a free service call (free in the sense the Direct pays the bill).


----------



## doctrsnoop (Nov 20, 2007)

I would spring for the Tivo HD's and the cable cards. They made life completely tolerable. For the year I had both Tivo HD/Comcast and DirecTV, I could see living with the Comcast. Unfortunately 12-13 bucks extra for each box though, but I found the Motorola boxes completely insufferable


----------



## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

If rain fade was a software problem then it would impact everyone. Chances are there is something else causing a signal issue. The signal might be good enough to watch TV but then it could be at the threshold where the receiver flags it for SFSS. If it gets stuck on SFSS then resetting can help. They tweak the settings of the SFSS strength constantly to find a good balance between usability and saying there's an error so someone calls rather then thinking macro blocking is normal.


As others have stated it costs more to send back a good unit and go through the refurb process and costs then it does to have a tech fix the actual problem. Telling people to lie to get a new receiver is just wasting time. If they have another problem then they've not only wasted time with a new receiver but now they have to wait longer for the SC and still have had the problem. I know this won't stop people from telling others to lie but last I checked I personally have gotten a lot farther with being truthful then by lying.


----------



## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

Actually, I'd call back and say, now its making a clanking noise! I can hear the Hard Drive.. This needs to be swapped out!


----------



## tgater (Jul 24, 2007)

I had an issue one time we thought was rain fade. After searching this site I found an article relating to grounding the dish. I called D* and had a tech come back out to ground the dish according to D*'s specs (I had to provide and put in an 8 foot ground rod) but after that the issues that seem to have come from rain fade went away. We had replaced the HR20-700 in the MBR 3 times and the one in my home office twice before the ground rod was installed vs only replace the MBR unit once after. BTW all DVR's are connected to battery back-up units.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

Shades228 said:


> If rain fade was a software problem then it would impact everyone. Chances are there is something else causing a signal issue. The signal might be good enough to watch TV but then it could be at the threshold where the receiver flags it for SFSS. If it gets stuck on SFSS then resetting can help. They tweak the settings of the SFSS strength constantly to find a good balance between usability and saying there's an error so someone calls rather then thinking macro blocking is normal.


Read the http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412 thread. It is not a signal issue, it is not an allignment issue. My signals are in the high 90's. The issue only occurs when there is a storm or hard rain strong enough to cause rain fade.

This is a very specific issue where the least little bit of rain fade causes one tuner, and one tuner only, to not come back, it is always the same tuner and a reboot always fixes. The box slows down considerably and this issue started after a Jan/Feb 08 NR.


----------



## gilviv (Sep 18, 2007)

It may be the way your D* was originally installed. Right after I had my 1st install, my original DVR started missing recording, locking up... it was just a mess. I was new to D* so I called them and I told them I wasn't happy with the service and to come pick up all thier stuff-- I going back to Comcrap!
The CSR supervisor arranged for someone to come out and CHECK the install; he in turn ended reinstalling the whole setup. No major problems with that DVR since. Later upgraded that DVR to HD and moved the original into another room and still works great!


----------



## MIKE0616 (Dec 13, 2006)

Mertzen said:


> *Over 90% of replaced IRDs are non defective.* A new box won't help you out with rain fade.
> Post your signal levels.


And you know this how? Please cite your source for such an "interesting" statement.



raott said:


> Don't know. All I know is that the issue cropped up after the Jan/Feb 2008 NR and does not appear to affect all units.
> 
> I (as have others) have asked a number of times if there is any feedback on this particular issue but I've yet to see anyone with contacts respond.
> 
> ...


That is NOT "shoddy programming", it was the new "contract extension for another 24 months" feature they added. Seriously, D* must have monkeys doing their software development and have absolutely no idea of what testing is.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

From the information the OP provided...it would appear that he suffers from a poor installation situation, leading to malfunctions and/or poor reception.

In any case, this can happen with sat or cable, so I would have recommended they have a service call to check the Dish alignment and cable connections before cancelling...but that's just me. :sure:


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

As the OP let me clarify a few points.

1. I do not suffer from poor reception. My signal levels on both tuners are in high 80s and 90s. 

2. As the more informed of you are aware this is a known problem that has not been addressed. 

3. When rain fade occurs from Heavy rain or snow only 1 tuner returns. Please explain to me how poor signal strength causes only one tuner to return?

4. When the box is reset BOTH tuners have good signal level.

5. Why after 7 years of service should I be expected to add a $6 dollar/month insurance to my account to fix a problem with THEIR DVR?? Am I not leasing it??

I have gone thorugh thick and thin with Directv. I like the service. But I'm not happy. All I wanted was a replacement box. 
BTW I appreciate that I could have misled them with tales of a box that wouldn't power on. But I just feel that I shouldn't have to.

If the box is perfect, then what do they lose in sending me a new one? They can send my one to someone else. If the shipping charges are worth more to them than a happy customer then maybe they need to look a their business model again.


----------



## Brandon428 (Mar 21, 2007)

You should give Dish a try. I had Directv for 7 years also and switched to Dish because of competitive pricing and more value. Also a much better more reliable DVR. My 712 and 622s haven't missed one recording yet. There running great new customer deals. You should definitely give Dish some thought.


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

kinsale said:


> As the OP let me clarify a few points.
> 
> 1. I do not suffer from poor reception. My signal levels on both tuners are in high 80s and 90s.
> 
> ...


It could be a bad BBC, a bad cable, or a bad installation. Have a tech check it out first and talk them into paying for the service.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> From the information the OP provided...it would appear that he suffers from a poor installation situation, leading to malfunctions and/or poor reception.
> 
> In any case, this can happen with sat or cable, so I would have recommended they have a service call to check the Dish alignment and cable connections before cancelling...but that's just me. :sure:


No. From the information provided by the OP, he specifically states he is having loss of one tuner upon rain fade issue.

Read http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Brandon428 said:


> You should give Dish a try. I had Directv for 7 years also and switched to Dish because of competitive pricing and more value. Also a much better more reliable DVR. My 712 and 622s haven't missed one recording yet. There running great new customer deals. You should definitely give Dish some thought.


Funny....my neighbor across the street did the opposite...left Dish for DirecTV after 6 years....hated their service. To each his own I guess.


raott said:


> No. From the information provided by the OP, he specifically states he is having loss of one tuner upon rain fade issue.
> 
> Read http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412


Regardless of it potentially being an LNB, Dish, cable, or other issue...in any case... a service call would be in order...which was my main point.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

Been trying to stay out this pissing match as long as I can, but, well, here I am. 

It's NOT the hardware.

It's also NOT the software.

It's a combination of both.

The OP states that he's had his setup in place for 7 or so years.

How old is that Rg 6 (hopefully not Rg59)? If it's from the original install, there is a very good chance its:

Not rated to 3ghz
Not solid copper
May have "unrated" barrels in line/wallplate.
May have poorly installed compression or crimp or god forbid twist on connectors.

Take my word if you want, but a very large number of "issues" that people state are box related, end up being something other than the box. The most recent data that I have for an issue in the first 7 days is over 96% installation/infrastructure related.

Would a new box "fix" the problem? Maybe, maybe not, just really depends on so many factors. 

For sake of arguement, say they do send a box and it doesn't fix the problem? Then what? Whine & cry that the box is a POS and didn't fix it. Send yet another box, then another, etc. At some point, the system needs a good looking at. Where does it end?

For the techies, it can be frustrating, but overall, it is the right move for them to do it the way they are doing now.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

RobertE said:


> At some point, the system needs a good looking at.


Yup....agree totally.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

RobertE said:


> Been trying to stay out this pissing match as long as I can, but, well, here I am.
> 
> It's NOT the hardware.
> 
> ...


Take the time to read the http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412

There were a number of posts that all popped up at the same time, after a NR in Jan/Feb 08. Prior to that NR, I had zero problems (same with others). Following that NR, EVERY time there is rain fade (or snow fade for that matter), Tuner One (and always only Tuner One) will not come back online and the box becomes very slow to respond.

I have no signal strength issues (high 90s), my install is in a new house built in September 2008, with RG6 wiring and never had a single issue until the exact same time period everyone else who has this issue started having it.

So if everyone who has the issue, starts having it at the same time, right after a NR, what path does that lead you down.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

raott said:


> Take the time to read the http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412
> 
> So if everyone who has the issue, starts having it at the same time, right after a NR, what path does that lead you down.


Could be....then again.....not necessarily.

That was once instance were many were effected. The OP here is isolated with their problem.

To RobertE's point, based on the age of several components (cables, Dish, etc.)....it could be several things, most of which would be detected via an onsite service call.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Could be....then again.....not necessarily.
> 
> That was once instance were many were effected. The OP here is isolated with their problem.


No, that is not one instance. It is an issue that has been going on since that time period and, to this day, is still not fixed.

When the OP says he has an issue where one tuner doesn't come back and is only fixed upon reboot, I'll take his word that he is suffering from the same "Tuner will not come back after rain fade issue" that has been going on for many of us for over a year.


----------



## DodgerKing (Apr 28, 2008)

raott said:


> No, that is not one instance. It is an issue that has been going on since that time period and, to this day, is still not fixed.
> 
> When the OP says he has an issue where one tuner doesn't come back and is only fixed upon reboot, I'll take his word that he is suffering from the same "Tuner will not come back after rain fade issue" that has been going on for many of us for over a year.


You are more likely than not, correct. I even think that this is the issue as well. But Direct is not certain and does not know the OP. It is to their benefit to first check these issues out before they give out new equipment.


----------



## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

kinsale said:


> As the OP let me clarify a few points.
> 
> 1. I do not suffer from poor reception. My signal levels on both tuners are in high 80s and 90s.
> 
> ...


OK, so this is what I did and it worked out very well for me. Once I had the tuner issue (mine was not rain-fade, but the other single tuner loss issue with the HR-20) I left the box in failure mode and placed a call to DirecTV. I let the CSR go through their required resetting procedures that they must do. As we were doing so, I informed her that I knew this would bring the tuner back but it would only be temporary. Of course, her troubleshooting led her to the conclusion that a technician visit was in order. I asked her very politely to note on the call that I was specifically requesting a replacement DVR as I knew the problem was with the DVR and I intended to call back afterwards to have the service call charges removed if I was correct. Long story short, the technician came saw that tuner 2 was at 0, tuner 1 fine. I explained the scenario to him and he decided to first check the dish alignment and LNB. He put a new LNB on and spent a half hour or so tweeking the dish, nothing. Reset the DVR and bingo tuner 2 came back. He replaced the DVR with an HR22 and went on his merry way. So when the bill came as expected with the 49.95 service fee, I called and politely explained how this charge was not mine to pay as I specifically requested a replacement DVR and that the CSR forced a service call. She pulled the previous call and apparently saw the notes from the previous CSR and without debate, said the charges would be credited.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, by letting them do what they wanted, I got a new DVR, LNB (why he didn't switch it back out, I don't know) and an alignment for free, when all I wanted was for them to ship me a new DVR for $20...


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

raott said:


> So if everyone who has the issue, starts having it at the same time, right after a NR, what path does that lead you down.


 It leads me down the path of checking all of my cables/connections, but then I've worked with cabling for a very long time and have gone through mine completely. All have snug connectors and none of them are exposed to the weather, except for those at the dish itself and I don't have this problem.

As to the NR release, it might only point to a common time that the receivers were rebooted. The same problem might have happened earlier had they been rebooted.


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

1. It is a new installation (approx 18 mons) as I previously didn't have HD. They put a new 5LNB dish up. New switch, cabling etc.

2. no one is answering why only ONE tuner returns after rain fade. Simple question, right?

3. How does a reboot FIX faulty connectors and/or cabling??

I have a directTIVO as well. No issues! None.

I like many other people do not have someone at my house during the day. A service call is very inconvenient. I tried to explain the problem to the CSR that a new box was in order. I understand the whole argument that a service call is the way to go. I do. But charging me for it is not on. I did not install the system. I did not buy the box. They are the only ones responsible for the equipment. I am LEASING the box! I understand insurance on a cell phone because you OWN the phone. I do not own this box.

Would COMCAST charge me to replace a faulty box?


----------



## rebkell (Sep 9, 2006)

kinsale said:


> 1. It is a new installation (approx 18 mons) as I previously didn't have HD. They put a new 5LNB dish up. New switch, cabling etc.
> 
> 2. no one is answering why only ONE tuner returns after rain fade. Simple question, right?
> 
> ...


No, they wouldn't. I can totally relate to your problem, it's their fault and their equipment and you get charged for it and possibly/probably have to miss work and their appointments aren't always dependable. My install for HD was for the mid time 11:00 am, and the tech didn't get there until nearly dark and didn't have the right equipment, etc....

Not to mention you've been a customer for 7 years and have probably paid them in the neighborhood of $10,000 over that period of time.


----------



## aa9vi (Sep 4, 2007)

rebkell said:


> You'd think 7 years of service would get you a little better treatment, he'll have to send in the old unit and pay shipping charges, so I don't see how it costs more than a service call.


not if they're more focused on quarterly profit than long term business from the customer. ... and why should they?... the numbers are telling them to keep up this game plan. not that I agree this is the right thing to do.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kinsale said:


> 1. It is a new installation (approx 18 mons) as I previously didn't have HD. They put a new 5LNB dish up. New switch, cabling etc.
> 
> 2. no one is answering why only ONE tuner returns after rain fade. Simple question, right?
> 
> ...


Since you have one receiver not having the problem, I'd swap it with the "problem" receiver and then see which loses a tuner. Then I'd use this "data" when I called DirecTV. If the "problem" stayed with the receiver, then this should point to it being the cause.


----------



## rebkell (Sep 9, 2006)

aa9vi said:


> not if they're more focused on quarterly profit than long term business from the customer. ... and why should they?... the numbers are telling them to keep up this game plan. not that I agree this is the right thing to do.


I hear you, now now now, it will surely implode on them one day, they had such a superior offering, but that is slipping away on a daily basis and the more ill will they build will surely cost them in the long run.


----------



## jims (Jan 5, 2008)

I found that running a grounding wire to my dish solved a lot of problems with signal strength and stopped getting these problems. The older dishes didn't seem to need it as much and the installers don't ground them.


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

OK last point.

If it is NOT the box. Why when I swap BCB/cable does the problem only happen to the SAME tuner?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kinsale said:


> OK last point.
> 
> If it is NOT the box. Why when I swap BCB/cable does the problem only happen to the SAME tuner?


 Swapping cables & BBCs and not having the tuner swap too, kind of points to the receiver.


----------



## dodge boy (Mar 31, 2006)

kinsale said:


> After 7 years of service with Directv I am planning to call tomorrow and cancel my service.
> I have a HD DVR and have the rain fade issue where one tuner does not come back. I have missed a number of recordings because of this but it cam to a head today.
> I set the DVR to record the F1 Grand Prix on Speed. It was in the middle of the night. Sat down this morning to watch and black screen. 2 hours of nothing.
> That's it I said. I want a new box. I proceeded to call Directv and got caught up in all the recorded technical procedures of how to reset my box. I called back and this time I said "cancel service" to get straight through to a person. I explained my situation and how I was close to cancelling. She then walked me through swapping my cables etc. When I explained that I needed a new box she told me that they couldn't swap the box without sending someone out. Of course they would charge me for this service. However they would give me the maintenance plan free for 6 months if I took it for 12 months.
> ...


Maybe you should see this thread:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=155741


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

kinsale said:


> I like many other people do not have someone at my house during the day. A service call is very inconvenient. I tried to explain the problem to the CSR that a new box was in order. I understand the whole argument that a service call is the way to go. I do. But charging me for it is not on. I did not install the system. I did not buy the box. They are the only ones responsible for the equipment. I am LEASING the box! I understand insurance on a cell phone because you OWN the phone. I do not own this box.
> 
> Would COMCAST charge me to replace a faulty box?


You won't be charged to replace a leased box (only shipping). If you had the protection plan then shipping would be covered as well. BUT you will be charged if you need a service call. And yes, cable will charge you all day long to perform a service call ($40 just to roll the truck, $80 per hour on top of that around here). Or you can take your box to the local office and get a new one at no charge. But if you need the cable guy to come install it for you, you better bet you'll be charged. Unless you have their protection plan that is. 

I and others have already told you what you can do. Call up and say the receiver isn't working at all now and you'd like it replaced. You don't need a service call, you'll replace it yourself and they'll send a return box to send in the broken one. That simple.


----------



## rebkell (Sep 9, 2006)

bonscott87 said:


> You won't be charged to replace a leased box (only shipping). If you had the protection plan then shipping would be covered as well. BUT you will be charged if you need a service call. And yes, cable will charge you all day long to perform a service call ($40 just to roll the truck, $80 per hour on top of that around here). Or you can take your box to the local office and get a new one at no charge. But if you need the cable guy to come install it for you, you better bet you'll be charged. Unless you have their protection plan that is.
> 
> I and others have already told you what you can do. Call up and say the receiver isn't working at all now and you'd like it replaced. You don't need a service call, you'll replace it yourself and they'll send a return box to send in the broken one. That simple.


Interesting, here, with Comcast, you will be charged if it's determined to be a problem on your end, but not if it's not. Of course you can pretty much just go swap boxes anytime you like at the local Comcast office without any problems. They check the serial # and make sure it's the same box and record the new #'s and check some ID to make sure you are you and off you go.


----------



## wallfishman (Dec 31, 2008)

you have to understand dtvs point of view. I have contracted for comcast and cable cos for 20 yrs , now dtv. Done thousands of service calls. a known fact (when you work in these fields for a living) is that 90 % of any problem is inside the customers home. Comcast will not mail you a replacement receiver if you call them and tell them you are having issues with a hd box. they will want to setup a service call to have your system looked at. They however will waive the charge if they come out and it does turn out to be defective equiptment. thats what dtv needs to do. many many many times you would hear how a box is bad or this is bad or that is bad, and 99 out of 100 it isnt. you hook up your meter and its -20 db or look at there wiring and its rg59 going thru 4 splitters. you jump it out as a test and the same box stops doing it right before their eyes. you have to give them a chance to fix the problem. They cannot start having customers that have no clue (obviously not you old school) start diagnosing their own problems and start wanting 300 dollar receivers mailed out to them at no charge because of something they read on the internet. Period. known issue or not.
with DTV i handle my own service calls for the first 90 days after my installs. I havent had one person in 6 months call with this known issue. I have however had 30-40 people call saying nothings working and its something stupid that they did, or dont know how to operate their own tv. 
My question is even if there is a known issue do you think they are going to mail out a new dvr to every person that calls up saying rain fade knocked out one tuner ? Once news of that got out this site alone would have them mailing out thousands of them for nothing. It simply doesnt matter about a known issue , or a thread on this site, a rep form DTV needs to do a service call. And to the guy that said 90% of receivers arent defective. Thats just a little inside info that you would only know from years of experience in these fields. so called bad boxes are taken back to a warehouse with known good wiring and extensively tested and 90% there is nothing wrong with them. same with comcast.
Let them try and fix it. the problem I see is that if it works fine without rain fade and its a nice day when the tech shows up your screwed. he may find something faulty or he may not see a problem at all when he gets there. If you lived near me id stop by and do a look.
Also signal readings off those receivers arent a say all end all. same with comcast. another job of mine with them was a custom installation tech where i was sent to replace wiring that needed wallfished and since their techs didnt do it they sent me. Id see it with my own eyes. decent levels but the box is tiling / pixelating. hook up to meter and signals good. line is old rg59. customers would say its NOT the wiring Its worked flawless for years. Id say well they want me to replace it its free so sit back and lets see what happens. we homerun new line from grounblock to attic then fish down wall and signal level is almost the same however problem is gone, and customer just sits there with stupid look on face. that has happened hundreds of times in my career. signal levels dont always reflect attenuation, intermittent shorts, kinks in wiring, slices in wiring, alot of things.
maybe you should try the call and if it is their equiptment then fight them for a credit or tell them at that point your cancelling. you arent even giving them a chance to fix it.
good luck. i gotta go do a 2 setter in the rain. luckily its not an HDDVR !! just kidding.


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

I compromised and suspended my service for 6 months. this gives me a chance to evaluate Comcast and decide what I want to do.

Thanks for all the discussion!


----------



## jazzyjez (Jan 2, 2006)

RobertE said:


> ...
> May have poorly installed compression or crimp or god forbid twist on connectors.
> ...


Robert - just wanted to jump on your reply for some further advice on this... when I added some additional cabling for a second receiver and an antenna I used twist-on connectors throughout. Later, when I had my system upgraded (3rd receiver) with a multiswitch and new dish, the DTV engineer used what I'd take to be compression connectors. They look much better quality and I wonder if they're also better at keeping moisture out of the cable (which caused me a bit of a problem on some runs that I hadn't terminated for a couple of years, and when I did need to use them, the last 1 ~ 2 feet of the cable had seriously corroded/oxidized as if moisture had 'wicked' in.

At this time all is more-or-less working OK (though my signal strengths on 99 are marginal). Should I consider swapping out the twist-on connectors? I also used them for all the home-made internal hook-ups from the wall plates to the receivers.

Thanks, J


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

veryoldschool said:


> As to the NR release, it might only point to a common time that the receivers were rebooted. The same problem might have happened earlier had they been rebooted.


So no one posts about this specific issue before the Jan/Feb 08 NR, the NR hits and there are a number of people that all of a sudden have the issue and you still want to believe its not software related?


----------



## eakes (Sep 22, 2007)

Run, do not walk to remove the twist-on connectors - they cause nothing but grief! Count yourself lucky that they have worked as well as they have for this period of time. I used a few of those when they first hit the market, but not for long. They caused more problems than I care to remember and they were only used inside as jumpers between pieces of equipment. Compression connectors are by far the preferred connector. As you have noted several feet of your cable near the ends is bad, black equals water damage which destroys the cable. Let it go long enough and the cable will literally fall apart - I seen such cable.

I strongly suggest new connectors and new cable!


----------



## HDTVsportsfan (Nov 29, 2005)

jazzyjez said:


> .......At this time all is more-or-less working OK (though my signal strengths on 99 are marginal). *Should I consider swapping out the twist-on connectors?* I also used them for all the home-made internal hook-ups from the wall plates to the receivers.
> 
> Thanks, J


If you have the connectors,the tool to do it, and the knowledge...I would. Even tho it goes against the logic of "If it ain't broke don't fix it". Compression fittings are so much better than twist ons IMO. My two cents.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

raott said:


> So no one posts about this specific issue before the Jan/Feb 08 NR, the NR hits and there are a number of people that all of a sudden have the issue and you still want to believe its not software related?


It's not 100% software.

It's possible that the OP has a "marginal" installation. With that last NR, some of the tuner parameters may have changed. Where before the marginal installation wasn't a problem, now it is.

Want an example? The 21/22 -100s had an attenuation issue prior to 2d7. On short cable runs, the tuners were overly sensitive to signal levels on the "hot" side. So, an additional 50-80ft of cable, or a -30db attenuator, or 4 way splitter had to be added to each line to get the box to make it through it's setup. Then, like magic, with 2d7, the problem went away?

So, is that a hardware issue? A software issue? Or a combination of both?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

raott said:


> So no one posts about this specific issue before the Jan/Feb 08 NR, the NR hits and there are a number of people that all of a sudden have the issue and you still want to believe its not software related?


 If it was "purely software", wouldn't there be more of us posting about it?


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

veryoldschool said:


> If it was "purely software", wouldn't there be more of us posting about it?


You are misquoting me. I did not say "purely software", I said software related, big difference.


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Gotta back RAOT on this one. I'm still suffering this issue. On multiple DVRs.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

raott said:


> You are misquoting me. I did not say "purely software", I said software related, big difference.


Which would mean: it would need to be a specific model or type of [marginal] system, wouldn't it?
You also haven't responded to the "simple fact" that these receivers with "this problem" may have been marginal before and the reboot to download was what brought it out.
Part of troubleshooting [anything] is to eliminate variables. If it isn't the system connected to the receiver as the cause, then it "must be" the hardware/software in the receiver. If it's software, then it should be "a model" as we're all running the same software [at some point] and would have had more complaints.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> Gotta back RAOT on this one. I'm still suffering this issue. On multiple DVRs.


You may have his same problem. With multible DVRs having the problem, would it point [more] to something [in common] from the dish to the DVRs as the cause?
Jeff don't get me wrong, if any of mine were doing this, I'd "fix it".


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Been rewired, and re-dished. RAOTT has it dead on.



veryoldschool said:


> You may have his same problem. With multible DVRs having the problem, would it point [more] to something [in common] from the dish to the DVRs as the cause?
> Jeff don't get me wrong, if any of mine were doing this, I'd "fix it".


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

JeffBowser said:


> Been rewired, and re-dished. RAOTT has it dead on.


That's kinda where I started...the Dish...LNB...cables....connectors...

Looks like one's the culprit...

An onsite service call should find the source of the problem.


----------



## smimi10 (May 22, 2006)

I had the very same issue on my HR20-700. I was convinced it was software related as it happened (or I noticed it) right around a new National Release. I messed with it for weeks, hoping to find the problem.

I eventually ended up with a box that would not only lose a tuner in rain fade, but also lose signal with most HD channels. This effect happened a little later on. 

So, I had a tech come out. The box failed while he was here, which was convenient. He replaced the LNB and both BBCs. 

I've been fine since.

I think there was a signal tolerance or something that might have been adjusted in the NR that made it more sensitive to signal levels, OR it was just an odd coincidence brought on by failing components. Or both.

If you want to get to the bottom of it, have a tech come out.


----------



## n-spring (Mar 6, 2007)

wallfishman said:


> the problem I see is that if it works fine without rain fade and its a nice day when the tech shows up your screwed.


Isn't it possible to simulate rain fade by blocking the LNBs from the dish, like sticking tin cans on them or something?

Chalk me up as another who's experienced the loss of tuner 2 during/after bad weather. I have no BBCs on my DVR as I am using a SWM8.


----------



## n-spring (Mar 6, 2007)

kinsale said:


> I compromised and suspended my service for 6 months. this gives me a chance to evaluate Comcast and decide what I want to do.


I'd like to know what you think of Comcast once you give it a try. The PQ here in Houston gives Comcast its well earned nickname: Comcrap.


----------



## xmguy (Mar 27, 2008)

wallfishman said:


> you have to understand dtvs point of view. I have contracted for comcast and cable cos for 20 yrs , now dtv. Done thousands of service calls. a known fact (when you work in these fields for a living) is that 90 % of any problem is inside the customers home. Comcast will not mail you a replacement receiver if you call them and tell them you are having issues with a hd box. they will want to setup a service call to have your system looked at. They however will waive the charge if they come out and it does turn out to be defective equiptment. thats what dtv needs to do. many many many times you would hear how a box is bad or this is bad or that is bad, and 99 out of 100 it isnt. you hook up your meter and its -20 db or look at there wiring and its rg59 going thru 4 splitters. you jump it out as a test and the same box stops doing it right before their eyes. you have to give them a chance to fix the problem. They cannot start having customers that have no clue (obviously not you old school) start diagnosing their own problems and start wanting 300 dollar receivers mailed out to them at no charge because of something they read on the internet. Period. known issue or not.
> with DTV i handle my own service calls for the first 90 days after my installs. I havent had one person in 6 months call with this known issue. I have however had 30-40 people call saying nothings working and its something stupid that they did, or dont know how to operate their own tv.
> My question is even if there is a known issue do you think they are going to mail out a new dvr to every person that calls up saying rain fade knocked out one tuner ? Once news of that got out this site alone would have them mailing out thousands of them for nothing. It simply doesnt matter about a known issue , or a thread on this site, a rep form DTV needs to do a service call. And to the guy that said 90% of receivers arent defective. Thats just a little inside info that you would only know from years of experience in these fields. so called bad boxes are taken back to a warehouse with known good wiring and extensively tested and 90% there is nothing wrong with them. same with comcast.
> Let them try and fix it. the problem I see is that if it works fine without rain fade and its a nice day when the tech shows up your screwed. he may find something faulty or he may not see a problem at all when he gets there. If you lived near me id stop by and do a look.
> ...


I agree. Cable isn't worth it. They raise their rates every time there is a chill in the air. D* won't do that (often) because they compete nationally. Cable usually is a specific region. So prices in (where I am at ) TN might be higher than say TX. Depends on how the cable CO does maintenance. I have Charter for my Internet. Have GOOD RG6 (not 59) running a straight shot from the drop box to my modem. Only one split through a high quality 1GHz splitter. and my signal levels were in the toilet. Called Charter they sent a tech out turns out a amp serving my area was bad they fixed that and my issues went away. But For "savings" alone for TV You really can't beat D* or E*.


----------



## MIKE0616 (Dec 13, 2006)

xmguy said:


> I agree. Cable isn't worth it. *They raise their rates every time there is a chill in the air. D* won't do that (often)* because they compete nationally. Cable usually is a specific region.


:lol: Thanks, but that made me choke on my coffee, was laughing so hard! Sure, cable raises their rates more often than D*'s yearly increases, time to put on the tin hat!


----------



## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Keep in mind your goals. If you like D*'s programming for the price, and generally like the equipment, then bite the bullet and get your entire system evaluated as a long term investment. It will be money well spent and eliminate a lot of unnecessary aggravation.

If I knew that fifty bucks would buy me a "tuned up and ready to go system" (new receiver if necessary), I'd pay it. Your issue seems less money related than principal related.

I wouldn't throw 7 years of good service away in a fit of pique over fifty bucks. If it hasn't been good service (up until this recent problem), or you are otherwise dissatisfied with D*'s offering, then call it quits, and caveat emptor.

A thorough inspection of my system is worth fifty bucks to me. In fact, the peace of mind knowing that all my wiring, two dishes, 3 HD DVRs and one HD receiver are covered has been worth me paying the monthly fee for quite some time. I haven't gotten a penny out of it yet, but the time is coming for a dish realignment and perhaps one other tweak. So far, I'm "in the hole" with the plan. I consider that good luck, and money well spent.


----------



## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

hasan said:


> If I knew that fifty bucks would buy me a "tuned up and ready to go system" (new receiver if necessary), I'd pay it. Your issue seems less money related than principal related.


But no one knows if spending $50 will do anything, except make his wallet a little lighter. He may have to play tech. roulette to get someone who knows what he's doing and cares enough to spend a lot of time diagnosing an intermittent problem. And still they may not find a problem.

I have determined that D* is simply unreliable, so it comes down to luck. If you have had good luck with your system, good for you. If you've had bad luck with your D* system, and have tried to fix it without success, D* may just not be for you.


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

I've had Comcast for a day or two. So far so good. Yes the DVR isn't as good but it does what I need so I'm ok with it. I got a SD Tivo for the bedroom and it is nice being able to download shows to my Mac to watch on my iPhone.
As far as picture quality it's a mixed bag. Some HD channels look a little better to me, others not as good. But again it's a bit of a wash. My son is loving the On Demand. It is the one area where DTV cannot compete in my opinion. I had the DTV set up with my broadband connection and really never used it. Comcast's version has been used quite a bit already.
Like I said before I'll give it 6 months and see how I feel. After 8 years with the same provider it was time to try something new. You don't know till you try.


----------



## MIKE0616 (Dec 13, 2006)

bobcamp1 said:


> I have determined that D* is simply unreliable, so it comes down to luck. If you have had good luck with your system, good for you. If you've had bad luck with your D* system, and have tried to fix it without success, D* may just not be for you.


AMEN! Some of the techs in this area would have to improve to be classified as incompetents, however, if you are lucky, you can get someone who is qualified. After having cable, then D* for several years, going to E* to get locals, then comcrap, and back to D*, the last guy who was here was pretty worthless, so I canceled and they sent someone who actually did a awesome job (tipped him, naturally.) Its as bad with playing "tech roulette" as it is with "CSR roulette" with D*, but then I have seen it with all the providers. Maybe the solution would be for D* to actually HIRE and train the techs, pay them well, and keep them around or is that too radical? That is how we kept up companies that I worked for, train AND pay (well.) We can hope. 



kinsale said:


> I've had Comcast for a day or two. So far so good. Yes the DVR isn't as good but it does what I need so I'm ok with it. I got a SD Tivo for the bedroom and it is nice being able to download shows to my Mac to watch on my iPhone.
> As far as picture quality it's a mixed bag. Some HD channels look a little better to me, others not as good. But again it's a bit of a wash. My son is loving the On Demand. It is the one area where DTV cannot compete in my opinion. I had the DTV set up with my broadband connection and really never used it. Comcast's version has been used quite a bit already.
> Like I said before I'll give it 6 months and see how I feel. After 8 years with the same provider it was time to try something new. You don't know till you try.


The comcrap flavor here gave me motorola boxes, which were less than reliable, but worked pretty decently. They had disabled the 30 second skip, which kind of PO'd me, but with FF, you could still skip commercials in recordings. Agree with you about VOD, D* will never stack up and for folks without a high-speed connection, it is of no benefit. Can you imagine VOD on dial-up? :lol:

Best of luck and hope things work well for you. Have heard good things about TiVo series 3 and cable-cards, you may want to look into that for a DVR, if I went back to cable, would be my only choice.


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

MIKE0616 said:


> AMEN! Some of the techs in this area would have to improve to be classified as incompetents, however, if you are lucky, you can get someone who is qualified. After having cable, then D* for several years, going to E* to get locals, then comcrap, and back to D*, the last guy who was here was pretty worthless, so I canceled and they sent someone who actually did a awesome job (tipped him, naturally.) Its as bad with playing "tech roulette" as it is with "CSR roulette" with D*, but then I have seen it with all the providers. Maybe the solution would be for D* to actually HIRE and train the techs, pay them well, and keep them around or is that too radical? That is how we kept up companies that I worked for, train AND pay (well.) We can hope.
> 
> The comcrap flavor here gave me motorola boxes, which were less than reliable, but worked pretty decently. They had disabled the 30 second skip, which kind of PO'd me, but with FF, you could still skip commercials in recordings. Agree with you about VOD, D* will never stack up and for folks without a high-speed connection, it is of no benefit. Can you imagine VOD on dial-up? :lol:
> 
> Best of luck and hope things work well for you. Have heard good things about TiVo series 3 and cable-cards, you may want to look into that for a DVR, if I went back to cable, would be my only choice.


thanks. I'm waiting to see how much we use the OnDemand. As far as I know if I go to a Series 3 Tivo with the Cable cards then i would lose OnDemand.


----------



## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

I don't use it a lot, but I really like DOD. Select a show, start watching.


----------



## kinsale (Oct 17, 2007)

what is DOD?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kinsale said:


> what is DOD?


 DirecTV On Demand, aka VOD [video on demand]

[also Department of Defense :lol: ]


----------



## perkolater (Sep 6, 2006)

Short version of today's events:

Got up this morning and turned on set. Received "check cable message" on TV. Traced it down to a failed HDMI port on my H20 receiver via trial and error, swapping cables with known good cables etc. Specifically, if I pressed down firmly on the cable (applying significant force) where it plugged into the back of the receiver a connection was made. When I let go, the signal dropped. I setup component cables as a temporary workaround and called DTV. 

After about 10-15 minutes on the phone the Tech agreed that there was a hardware failure, but since I had it working via component cables DTV was not willing to replace the receiver. I explained that with my setup, running 5 cables (RGB and Audio L/R) to the set instead of the single HDMI cable would not work for me and was told sorry they would not replace the unit. 

I asked to speak to a supervisor. I was transferred to "Doug" who was an arrogant jerk. When I explained my setup and why I needed the HDMI functional he informed me that I "Pay directv for HD services and since I was able to get that service via component cables" they had "delivered the service I paid for" and that no replacement would be coming. I tried again to explain my setup and was told that he had "already told me" there was nothing they would do. I told him to cancel the service and was transferred to Crystal in (I assume) the retention department. 

She was the exact opposite of the first two people I spoke with, friendly, helpful, understanding and polite. She agreed that it was a hardware failure and within minutes said they would send me a replacement receiver if I agreed to pay $19.95 for shipping. I'm not trying to get something for nothing so I agreed to the shipping charge. I just don't understand why it is always SO difficult to deal with DTV? They acknowledged it was a hardware equipment but decided to treat a 14 year customer with attitude and arrogance. I also wonder what I am getting in return for paying for the protection plan.

I stay with DTV because of Sunday Ticket, but I am questioning if even that is worth it. It is time to look into other options.

(OK, so it wasn't so short...  )


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

I got a refurb unit that did that straight out of the box and they tried the same trick. I lied and told them that their own 1080p dod downloads would not work over component due to encryption restrictions. that forced the issue and another refurb was sent that day.


----------



## beer_geek (Jun 14, 2007)

perkolater said:


> Short version of today's events:
> 
> Got up this morning and turned on set. Received "check cable message" on TV. Traced it down to a failed HDMI port on my H20 receiver via trial and error, swapping cables with known good cables etc. Specifically, if I pressed down firmly on the cable (applying significant force) where it plugged into the back of the receiver a connection was made. When I let go, the signal dropped. I setup component cables as a temporary workaround and called DTV.
> 
> ...


While you are looking into other options, you may want to verify the new box didn't extend your committment.


----------



## jpl (Jul 9, 2006)

kinsale said:


> thanks. I'm waiting to see how much we use the OnDemand. As far as I know if I go to a Series 3 Tivo with the Cable cards then i would lose OnDemand.


I'd probably look at the new Moxi DVR - it's pricey at $800, but that includes your service fees. You don't pay extra for your DVR service. Then there's a new Echostar DVR coming out (forget the name) which is a Tru2Way DVR (so, from what I understand, you wouldn't have to deal with cable cards, and it would give you access to on-demand service). Not sure when it's coming out, though, or how much it'll cost.


----------



## perkolater (Sep 6, 2006)

beer_geek said:


> While you are looking into other options, you may want to verify the new box didn't extend your committment.


Good point. I thought the PP provided for replacement without extending commitments?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

perkolater said:


> Good point. I thought the PP provided for replacement without extending commitments?


"It should" and also not cost you the shipping either.


----------



## beer_geek (Jun 14, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> "It should" and also not cost you the shipping either.


Exactly!


----------



## perkolater (Sep 6, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> "It should" and also not cost you the shipping either.


I forgot about that.... crap, I guess after I actually get the receiver I'll argue that charge.

UGH.


----------



## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Directv On Demand


----------



## tomkarl (Jan 6, 2009)

perkolater said:


> Good point. I thought the PP provided for replacement without extending commitments?


It does provide for replacement without extending your commitment.

However, Directv has a very, very long history of having "system problems" that extend your contract.

I believe that the trigger is when you activate the new receiver, so wait until it is activated before checking.

My advice would be to check and get something verified via e-mail or writing.


----------



## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

Replacement without the PP does not extend the commitment either. Not to say they don't try to, but it is not valid if they do, so there is no worry. The arbitrators are aware that commitments are being extended incorrectly and will make the correction if you ever find yourself disputing an ETF.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

JeffBowser said:


> Been rewired, and re-dished. RAOTT has it dead on.





hdtvfan0001 said:


> That's kinda where I started...the Dish...LNB...cables....connectors...
> 
> Looks like one's the culprit...
> 
> An onsite service call should find the source of the problem.


No, Jeff said he has rewired and redished and still has the problem.

The problem with this issue is that many here, rather than listen to the overall presentation of the problem, simply want to immediately conclude it is the setup, poor cables, poor connections, moisture etc because we know it couldn't possibly be the programming.

Let me try one more time to explain when the issue does and does not occur and what the symptoms are:

During rain fade, one tuner, and only one tuner will not come back. For me, it is always tuner One, even with swapping the cables.

It doesn't matter whether the rain fade event lasts 30 seconds (as happened last week) or 20 minutes, the problem is the same.

It doesn't matter that the rain fade event is actually caused by a thunderstorm to the south and I'm only getting light to moderate rain, if the signal is lost, the problem occurs.

It doesn't matter that it is ice and not rain causing the rain fade, if the signal is lost, I have a problem.

I can have a moderate to heavy two-day long steady rain where the equipment is getting absolutely soaked (far more soaked than the thunderstorm described above), but if it is not severe enough to cause the signal to be lost the problem doesn't occur.

The box slows down to the point I immediately know I have the issue when the problem occurs.

My signals are in a constant high 90s.

A reboot always fixes the issue, nothing else does.

This only started happening after a NR in Jan/Feb 08 the exact same time others began posting about the issue. Never happened before that and I don't see any other reports of it happening until that NR.

Why does it occur for a group of people and not others, my guess is something was changed in the programming in Jan/Feb 08 that for some reason affects a particular batch of receivers. I have no doubt a box swap would fix the issue (as has happened for others) but I would rather see it fixed by the software change that created it in the first place than pay $19.99 for a new receiver, be forced to have a service call and risk a new two year commitment.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

raott said:


> Why does it occur for a group of people and not others, my guess is something was changed in the programming in Jan/Feb 08 that for some reason affects a particular batch of receivers.


The firmware doesn't work that way. There are models (based on manufacturers) which receive updates periodically, and all receivers within a model should perform the same way.

There is no viable way only "a batch" of receivers within one of the models would act differently. That points to something else, likely environmental to specific locations, or simply a bad unit itself.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

unless the receivers affected were already on the "weak" side due to age/environment/use. 
I had 2 hr20-100 here at 1 time, 1 acted this way. 1 out of the 4 tuners, and always same 1. this went on for about a month before T1 on this unit actually fully quit.
now I did have a flaky lnb which could have led to a general demise of that unit, but I think the 2 issues were separate.
replaced hr20 with hr21 and no issues.

you know, looking back on it the hr20 were somewhat problematic for me compared to the hr21 in the 9 months I had 2 of them.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> The firmware doesn't work that way. There are models (based on manufacturers) which receive updates periodically, and all receivers within a model should perform the same way.
> 
> There is no viable way only "a batch" of receivers within one of the models would act differently. That points to something else, likely environmental to specific locations, or simply a bad unit itself.


I was speaking of a manufacturing batch of a specific piece of hardware that is having a problem.

There is obviously some interplay going on, other than just software, or else everyone would had the problem.

I simply do not believe it was a coincidence that the problem was never reported before that NR, but after the NR during March there was a number of posts about the issue. That tells me something in the software is playing a role.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

The point is that very, very often this problem is due to bad cables, LNB/dish, switch, etc. Nothing to do with the receiver.

BUT, there are some receivers with bad 2nd tuner from what I recall that can also cause this problem.

I still don't understand the big deal with all this. Just call up DirecTV, get a replacement receiver. Still got the problem? Then either you are really unlucky or it's one of the above external issues.

Problem solved.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

bonscott87 said:


> The point is that very, very often this problem is due to bad cables, LNB/dish, switch, etc. Nothing to do with the receiver.
> 
> BUT, there are some receivers with bad 2nd tuner from what I recall that can also cause this problem.
> 
> ...


No actually the entire point of the discussion is that this specific problem has absolutely nothing to do with bad cables, LNB/dish and switch and has everything to do with the receiver.

The "bad second tuner" issue is a different issue altogether.

The "big deal" with a replacement receiver is $19.99, a forced service call and a potential 2 year commitment extension.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

I don't have PP, replaced both HR20's, shipping was waived, no service call-drop shipped, and was no extension.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

raott said:


> No actually the entire point of the discussion is that this specific problem has absolutely nothing to do with bad cables, LNB/dish and switch and has everything to do with the receiver.


So have I missed something? The issue at hand is 771 errors, correct? That very often is something bad that isn't the receivers. Heck, I had that problem myself a couple years ago. The problem? Bad LNB. Replaced it and all is well with both my HR units that I had long before then. But I'm just one example.

Certainly it can be a bad receiver. But often it is not.



> The "big deal" with a replacement receiver is $19.99, a forced service call and a potential 2 year commitment extension.


Ummm, ok. A whole $20 which you can usually negotiate out of, have it drop shipped to you. 2 yr commitment you'd have to probably fight against but then it only matters if you care about it. Or if these types of things bother you then the protection plan would take care of it all for you at no charge and no commitment extension (and would fix any external issues that may be the issue, again at no charge). Up to you. Personally I don't have the PP because I'll fix it all myself, but if you can't or any of these things bother you then perhaps the PP is worth it to not worry about it.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

bonscott87 said:


> So have I missed something?


Yes, you have missed something.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

raott said:


> Yes, you have missed something.
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412


Nope, didn't miss anything. Replace the receiver and be happy. It's so simple.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

bonscott87 said:


> Nope, didn't miss anything. Replace the receiver and be happy. It's so simple.


Or D* could fix whatever they broke in Jan/Feb 08.


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I wonder why so many want to contradict raott. There was an entire thread dedicated to this in the hardware forum for a long time. I haven't been over there for awhile, so I don't know what happened to it. Tuner 1 does not recover after rain-fade until a reboot. This started after the firmware update raott references. I know a number of others have this. Since I started experiencing this, I have (for different reasons) replaced all my cabling, got an entirely new and differently designed dish, and even installed a Sonora locker. The only common thread is my two DVR's, one HR20 and one HR21.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

JeffBowser said:


> I wonder why so many want to contradict raott.


Because there is an unfortunate widespread view on this site that it is never the software causing an issue.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

raott said:


> Yes, you have missed something.
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412


So you've been "fighting this" for over a year now, right?
Once "the system" is out of the loop as the cause, then it comes down to the receiver [hardware] as the cause.
Software may do wonders, but can't over come bad hardware.
Just because others may have the same defect, doesn't mean there ever will be a "software fix".
I wouldn't have waited this long if any of my receivers did this or any other malfunction. If software didn't come quick to fix it, then my leased receiver would have been replace so "my hardware" worked with their software.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> Since I started experiencing this, I have (for different reasons) replaced all my cabling, got an entirely new and differently designed dish, and even installed a Sonora locker. The only common thread is my two DVR's, one HR20 and one HR21.


Jeff, you & I have "known each other" for a while now.
You have this problem on two DVRs?
What are your exact models?


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Well, I have a lot of respect for VOS and Bonscott, their replies surprise me.



raott said:


> Because there is an unfortunate widespread view on this site that it is never the software causing an issue.


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I'll grab this info when I get home for lunch today. I "think" I know, but since you asked specifically for the info, I will double check and get back to you.



veryoldschool said:


> Jeff, you & I have "known each other" for a while now.
> You have this problem on two DVRs?
> What are your exact models?


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

veryoldschool said:


> Jeff, you & I have "known each other" for a while now.
> You have this problem on two DVRs?
> What are your exact models?


VOS, no offense, but did you read this thread? Jeff was the starter.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412

I only ask because have the battle with this issue has been people strongly opining on the causes without fully comprehending the presentation of the issue.


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Wow, that's been over a year ago. I didn't realize I was that patient :lol:



raott said:


> VOS, no offense, but did you read this thread? Jeff was the starter.
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412
> 
> I only ask because have the battle with this issue has been people strongly opining on the causes without fully comprehending the presentation of the issue.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

raott said:


> VOS, no offense, but did you read this thread? Jeff was the starter.
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=124412
> 
> I only ask because have the battle with this issue has been people strongly opining on the causes without fully comprehending the presentation of the issue.


That thread is a year old and yes I have read it, but not lately.
I'm here trying to help.
"Tuners dropping off line" first seemed to start showing up when Pace [-700] moved the production to China. "We" didn't see this with those made in Mexico [before]. This move I'm sure was to reduce costs, and the build quality has suffered.
I don't know "what changed" in the NR a year ago. By that time I'd moved over to a SWM system, so I can't even try to duplicate it here on my system.
I have little tolerance for my equipment not working correctly. I will beat the crap out both my system and then DirecTV to "fix it".
I can't come to your house and "do my thing" to find the cause, so I can only post steps to try to narrow down the cause.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> Wow, that's been over a year ago. I didn't realize I was that patient :lol:


I'm not. 

And not to be confused with this thread: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=153567


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

HR21-100 and HR20-700. The -700 is probably 2 years old.



veryoldschool said:


> I'm not.
> 
> And not to be confused with this thread: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=153567


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> HR21-100 and HR20-700. The -700 is probably 2 years old.


Next would be to look on the back and see where they were made. "2 years ago" was about the time the -700 moved to China.
I'm at a bit of a loss about the HR21-100. I have a HR21-200 [which came out earlier].
If the 771 is coming from the lack of DC driving the dish, changing over to the SWM, would resolve this, and if you were near me, I'd lend you a SWMLNB just to see what [if anything] it would do for you.


----------



## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Any lack of DC should have been resolved by my Sonora locker, which, in fact, cured a different, random, 771 I was getting on an H22 that's at the max cable length spec. I will grab the serials for you over the weekend, appreciate your assistance. The HR20 is the box nearest the dish, cable length wise.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

raott said:


> Because there is an unfortunate widespread view on this site that it is never the software causing an issue.


I personally never said it wasn't a software issue, I have no knowledge either way.

But why so many people keep banging their head on the table hoping and praying that DirecTV will solve their software problem this week and continue to do that for months on end I'll never know.

If my receiver is broke I'm getting it replaced. Yesterday. I've got much better things to do then wait around for a software fix that may never come and then deal with the stress of the problem in the meantime.

Replace the dang thing and be done with it. That's all I'm saying. I don't care *why* it's broke. I guess I could keep the problem receiver for months on end and deal with just to *show* DirecTV they need to fix it. But I got much better things to do. Maybe you don't.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

bonscott87 said:


> Replace the dang thing and be done with it. That's all I'm saying. I don't care *why* it's broke. I guess I could keep the problem receiver for months on end and deal with just to *show* DirecTV they need to fix it. But I got much better things to do. Maybe you don't.


I can honestly do without the condescending statements and smileys. You say you have no knowledge on what is causing the issue but continue to opine and criticize throughout on the subject.

I do have better things to do than spending 30 minutes on the phone arguing with D* about sending a receiver without a service call, then arguing with them when they extend my contract by "mistake", and paying them at least $19.99 for the pleasure of doing so.

No one is attempting "to show" D* they need to fix a problem, I am simply a customer who wants an issue fixed.


----------



## joe diamond (Feb 28, 2007)

As an installer I once responded to a service call for a similar issue. After examining a really good looking installation and testing all the eq I determined defective tuner in a recent HDDVR. Then the original installer arrived and wanted to know what was wrong with his work. I showed him the HDDVR. He was not given a spare but was backcharged $100.00 because the installation had a problem within seven days.

I was paid $30.00 by the fulfillment company......they were not paid and stopped taking HSP work.

We left. The customer still did not have a serviceable unit.

Joe


----------



## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

bonscott87 said:


> I personally never said it wasn't a software issue, I have no knowledge either way.
> 
> But why so many people keep banging their head on the table hoping and praying that DirecTV will solve their software problem this week and continue to do that for months on end I'll never know.
> 
> ...


Speaking as a former "head-banger", I did not want relinquish the HR20 as we did not have our HD Locals and directv could not guarantee a replacement HR20. As a matter of fact, on one occasion, I was told that I would very likely NOT get and HR20 as it was not the current model. Based on the audio issues that the AM21 was having at the time, I did not want to trade one problem for another so I kept riding it out hoping the next NR would solve the problems. Once our HD locals came on line, I immediately got the HR20 replaced with a new HR22 and have been 771 (and concussion) free ever since.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

raott said:


> I can honestly do without the condescending statements and smileys. You say you have no knowledge on what is causing the issue but continue to opine and criticize throughout on the subject.
> 
> I do have better things to do than spending 30 minutes on the phone arguing with D* about sending a receiver without a service call, then arguing with them when they extend my contract by "mistake", and paying them at least $19.99 for the pleasure of doing so.
> 
> No one is attempting "to show" D* they need to fix a problem, I am simply a customer who wants an issue fixed.


Look. DirecTV needs to fix the problem. No doubt. But too many people wait around for weeks and months with the problem hoping for a solution when they could have gotten a replacement receiver and fixed the problem. I don't know about you but I'll spend 30 minutes on the phone if that saves me weeks/months of trouble. But that's just me.

Anyway, no need to argue with me anymore about it. I understand it's the principle of the thing with you, nothing wrong with that. But I think many people would rather just spend the 30 minutes on the phone and be done with the problem once and for all. Their choice (and yours).


----------



## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

bobcamp1 said:


> But no one knows if spending $50 will do anything, except make his wallet a little lighter. He may have to play tech. roulette to get someone who knows what he's doing and cares enough to spend a lot of time diagnosing an intermittent problem. And still they may not find a problem.
> 
> I have determined that D* is simply unreliable, so it comes down to luck. If you have had good luck with your system, good for you. If you've had bad luck with your D* system, and have tried to fix it without success, D* may just not be for you.


"No one knows" is not a solution. The $50 is charged for a service. That service is comprehensive, aimed at getting a fully functional system. That's what you pay for, that's what you will get, if persistent.

Sitting on the sidelines crabbing doesn't give one a functioning system.

Doing nothing doesn't work either.

If the service is really so unreliable that a person is paralyzed by doubt, (preventing them from scheduling a service call) then it's time to stop complaining and change providers. Speak with your pocketbook and be done with it.


----------



## Cable Lover (Jun 19, 2007)

MIKE0616 said:


> The comcrap flavor here gave me motorola boxes, which were less than reliable, but worked pretty decently. They had disabled the 30 second skip, which kind of PO'd me, but with FF, you could still skip commercials in recordings. Agree with you about VOD, D* will never stack up and for folks without a high-speed connection, it is of no benefit. Can you imagine VOD on dial-up? :lol:
> 
> Best of luck and hope things work well for you. Have heard good things about TiVo series 3 and cable-cards, you may want to look into that for a DVR, if I went back to cable, would be my only choice.


I thought you had Insight when you had cable.


----------



## MIKE0616 (Dec 13, 2006)

Cable Lover said:


> I thought you had Insight when you had cable.


As you may be aware of, Insight was a joint deal between ATT & comcrap here long ago and then ATT was bought out, leaving the name Insight. There was a leveraged buy out of part of the company a few years back by an investor group of a part of the company leaving comcrap owning half (IIRC) of the company and a couple of years ago, the last stake was traded out in another deal, so cc is now out of the loop. The equipment, DVRs, programming, etc. while I had them was Insight in name only, it was all controlled by cc.


----------



## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

hasan said:


> "No one knows" is not a solution. The $50 is charged for a service. That service is comprehensive, aimed at getting a fully functional system. That's what you pay for, that's what you will get, if persistent.
> 
> Sitting on the sidelines crabbing doesn't give one a functioning system.
> 
> ...


"If persistent" means spending a lot of your time, including time off work, for multiple tech. visits and/or multiple DVR replacements and/or multiple calls to tech. support to find one that works. They are not "paralyzed by doubt," they actually have something better to do with their lives then try and troubleshoot a system they did not install and where all the equipment is leased. Plus, why would someone throw more money at somebody who has previously given them a bad product?

I agree they should simply cancel the service and be done with it. Except of course, if they also have to pay a fee for breaking the 2-year service agreement. For a problem with D*'s system.

For what it's worth, I believe software has uncovered a dormant hardware issue. Software can fix it by covering it back up, but I wouldn't count on D* fixing it. Ever. They have had a tough time fixing simpler things than that. So play hardware roulette if you have the time and patience, or cancel the service.


----------



## skrudrvr (Jan 20, 2006)

Each Comcast system has it's own dish winback offer so definitely tell them you're coming from satellite. Also, you get thousands of programs On Demand 70% of which is free. And you can get it on any tv with a box whether it's a DVR or not. You can't get that on satellite.


----------



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

bonscott87 said:


> I personally never said it wasn't a software issue, I have no knowledge either way.
> 
> But why so many people keep banging their head on the table hoping and praying that DirecTV will solve their software problem this week and continue to do that for months on end I'll never know.
> 
> If my receiver is broke I'm getting it replaced. Yesterday. I've got much better things to do then wait around for a software fix that may never come and then deal with the stress of the problem in the meantime.


Tonight is a prime example of why I keep "banging my head on the table". I finally, after another rain fade event and loss of tuner last night, called D* to replace my HR20.

The first CSR put me told me he couldn't replace the receiver and transferred me to tech support, where, after waiting 15 minutes, I was disconnected.

Called back, next CSR doesn't want to tranfer me to tech support but instead tells me that since the problem goes away each time after I reboot the DVR, it is "normal" and refuses to replace the box, even after speaking with her supervisor. I tell her to transfer me to customer retention.

Customer retention refuses to replace the box without a service call even after being told about this site, this thread, the fact that a new box always resolves this issue.

Sum, total, almost an hour on the phone only to get nowhere, with the only option of taking a half day off work and having a tech come which would just result in a box being replaced which is all I want anyway. Totally unacceptable.


----------



## tlieberg (Apr 17, 2008)

raott said:


> Tonight is a prime example of why I keep "banging my head on the table". I finally, after another rain fade event and loss of tuner last night, called D* to replace my HR20.
> 
> The first CSR put me told me he couldn't replace the receiver and transferred me to tech support, where, after waiting 15 minutes, I was hung up on.
> 
> ...


I must say I was surprised by the level of pushback you and the OP received. I don't know how you can read that thread and not conclude a subset of HR20-700's have a problem. But that's not why I'm posting. I'd like to observe that you no longer have a technical problem, you have a negotiation problem. You know what your issue is and you know what the solution is; you simply have to get it implemented.

I'd encourage you to call D* back and when you do keep in mind a few items: you are smarter than they are - you know what's wrong and you know exactly what you need to be satisfied. You have way more flexibility and options. You can hang up, you can take your business elsewhere, you can accept their offer, you can verbally berate them, you can denounce them publicly on forums like this, your options are endless  The D* contacts on the other hand, are trapped. They are bound by rules and limits and (probably) counts on how many customers they retain or lose or units they ship, etc. All of which limits their options.

This time, simply skip all the crap and say 'cancel service' or 'customer retention' and get routed straight to them. In my limited experience (and I think it is born out by other threads on dbstalk) they have more flexibility in responding to you, so use your knowledge to get what you want and go straight to the best option for you.

When they get on the phone explain your situation and again ask for a new unit to be shipped. You might be lucky and you'll get a yes. But assuming not, appear to compromise and accept the service call. Tell them (as was suggested previously on this thread) that if everything checks out and the tech agrees you need a new unit you expect that service charge to be waived and for that to be documented in your history or case file or whatever. And then get them to schedule the tech visit on Saturday - voila! no time off from work. So what if their techs are booked for a month - you've lived with this problem for a year so what's another 4 weeks?

Keep in mind while on the phone, it is not your objective to get them to admit there is a problem with their software, get them to acknowledge dbstalk exists let alone know about the reference thread or even to definitively agree that your receiver needs to be replaced. Your objective is to get them to replace the receiver on terms you can live with. Keep in mind the person on the other end of the phone is not free to be rational. They are not empowered to discuss your situation and devise a customized and informed solution for you. They have a list of things they can do and a list of things they can't do and if they break the rules, they probably lose their job. Your mission is to find a way to get what you want using their rules.

One other crazy, unsubstantiated idea: you might want to call at the beginning of the month. It wouldn't surprise me to learn D* gives it's csr's targets for customers retained and quotas for "gifts" given to customers, etc. It could be that at the end of the month csr flexibility for intervening in your favor goes down.


----------



## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

raott said:


> Tonight is a prime example of why I keep "banging my head on the table". I finally, after another rain fade event and loss of tuner last night, called D* to replace my HR20.
> 
> The first CSR put me told me he couldn't replace the receiver and transferred me to tech support, where, after waiting 15 minutes, I was disconnected.
> 
> ...


Call back and tell them the unit will not power on. You had a power outage and after the power came back on, the box was unresponsive and there is a "burnt" smell.


----------



## jacksonm30354 (Mar 29, 2007)

And cable is so much better...

Both my neighbors on either side had cable. I call to get it installed. My address isn't in the database. So they have to do a survey to see if I am in their service area. I tell them my neighbors on either side have their service. Doesn't matter they have to do a survey and call back in 2 weeks. 2 weeks later still not in their system. Turns out the street name had changes a few years prior and they had the old street name. Once I gave the old street name all was fine.

When I got HD, the picture kept breaking up. Usually at the point in a show you didn't want it too. 4 services calls ending with shrugged shoulders, I gave up on them.

My neighbor still has them. We had a storm a couple weeks ago and his service was out for 3 days. When it came back on, the picture was not quie what it was so called them out. They show up, fool around inside and out. Before the leaves they turn on the living room tv, no picture. Next thing you know, the tech comes in with the older model Motorola box (currently th tv had a much newer model). My neighbors catches him and tells him it can't be the box as it was working prior to him getting there that day. After bit of back and forth, the tech goes back to the basement. My friend follows and the guy looks at the splitter he had been messing with and realizes he had reconnected the wrong cable. He swapped cables and the living room tv worked just fine.

I'd rather have the rain fade than be out of service for days/weeks. Usually, when it rains hard enough for the signal to go out, it's a storm you should be paying attention to anyway 

Comcast will not let you just pick up a box or have one sent either. They have to have someone come out to the house.

Just my 2 cents, I know it's a pain, but I'd go with the service call if the problem is that frustrating.


----------



## skrudrvr (Jan 20, 2006)

jacksonm30354 said:


> And cable is so much better...
> 
> Both my neighbors on either side had cable. I call to get it installed. My address isn't in the database. So they have to do a survey to see if I am in their service area. I tell them my neighbors on either side have their service. Doesn't matter they have to do a survey and call back in 2 weeks. 2 weeks later still not in their system. Turns out the street name had changes a few years prior and they had the old street name. Once I gave the old street name all was fine.
> 
> ...


Your comment about Comcast is incorrect. You can pick up as many boxes as you want at Comcast or they can order you a video self-install kit and ship them to you.


----------



## jacksonm30354 (Mar 29, 2007)

skrudrvr said:


> Your comment about Comcast is incorrect. You can pick up as many boxes as you want at Comcast or they can order you a video self-install kit and ship them to you.


Maybe you can in your area. That was not the case in Atlanta. Had to have a technician and it was $29.50 per box installation fee.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

raott said:


> Sum, total, almost an hour on the phone only to get nowhere, with the only option of taking a half day off work and having a tech come which would just result in a box being replaced which is all I want anyway. Totally unacceptable.


Sorry, but why did you waste all your time doing that? You know a CSR isn't going to replace a unit if it's still "working". Just call and tell them it won't boot up. Let them walk you thru whatever call script they have and say "yep, still won't boot up". You'll have a replacement in a couple days.


----------



## Upstream (Jul 4, 2006)

bonscott87 said:


> Sorry, but why did you waste all your time doing that? You know a CSR isn't going to replace a unit if it's still "working". Just call and tell them it won't boot up. Let them walk you thru whatever call script they have and say "yep, still won't boot up". You'll have a replacement in a couple days.


Some people feel that if you have to lie to get a company to act responsibly, then maybe you shouldn't be doing business with that company.


----------



## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

Upstream said:


> Some people feel that if you have to lie to get a company to act responsibly, then maybe you shouldn't be doing business with that company.


Then do just that, move on to something else. Either way I wouldn't put up with a bum receiver for more then a couple weeks, if that. One way or another it's getting replaced or shipped out.


----------



## Upstream (Jul 4, 2006)

I guess that's why the OP switched to Comcast. 

Perhaps Raott is more patient, and wants to give DirecTV the opportunity to fix the problem. Or maybe he is locked into a two-year commitment.


----------



## BKC (Dec 12, 2007)

BattleScott said:


> Call back and tell them the unit will not power on. You had a power outage and after the power came back on, the box was unresponsive and there is a "burnt" smell.


Exactly, and when the new box gets there give the old one a shot of 220 so no one else ever has to put up with that box again.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

BKC said:


> Exactly, and when the new box gets there give the old one a shot of 220 so no one else ever has to put up with that box again.


I can't even think of the number of ways in which doing that is just so wrong :nono2: ...

There really is no reason to destroy DIRECTV's property and it could potentially be hundreds of dollars out of your pocket to do so.


----------

