# Emergency Power- Getting ready for the Hurricane Season



## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Yes, I live in Florida and last year during Hurricane season was too close for me so I decided to install a Generator to get prepared. I have just completed the project with final run testing done last Sunday.

I started out with the idea I could put in a small generator to keep the Ref running and a light or two on. The project kept growing the more people I talked to for advice. I ended up with a Nice Electric start Honda with inverter and a 10 circuit switch panel beside my main load center. 

The reason why I chose to go this route is because I run my business from home and if I should be down for 5 days as was typical around here in some neighborhoods, I could lose nearly half the cost of the system during that week in lost income. It just made sense as an alternative to some form of insurance to cover a loss. 

In my testing I was able to start and run the Central air, and refrigerator and some lights and the home theater; or, run a small 8000 btu AC in the main edit suite plus all the video editing equipment; Or, run the hot water heater and Refrigerator plus some lights. In all cases, I was able to also add a few house lights as well.

The trick was balancing the load on the generator in various emergency run scenarios. I still have one change to make in the Generator switch panel which will balance the load for my daily business operation. I installed a nice switch panel that comes with two wattmeters to aid in the load balance. On the domestic side, we felt that the bathroom lights, bedroom lights and Kitchen lights plus the microwave (which is on it's own circuit) was appropriate. For sleeping at night we will run the house central air and an hour before shower time in the morning switch the central air off and turn on the hot water heater. The size generator we put in is a compromise and will not run the entire house at the same time but I have about 80% of the house wired now for operation on the generator in 3 different emergency scenarios. Items that have been left off the hard wire were The Kitchen stove and oven and The washing machine and Electric dryer. The Generator does have local outlets that can be used to feed via extension cords to the dryer and washing machine. I have that cord set ready if needed. The Kitchen Stove and Central heat exceeds the capacity of the generator by themselves so I have no hookup for them.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Well, I went with the cheap & simple approach.

First, even a manual transfer switch is WAY overpriced. So, I went searching and found that Square-D had this simple little stamped metal breaker interlock gizmo. It prevents the main and the top-right double-pole breaker from both being on at the same time. 

Got a 6000 watt continuous (8000 surge) generator - that's 50 amps, which is plenty for a single guy - even with all my electronics. If the furnace is on, and I'm using the washer, I'd probably have to shut down the main home entertainment center if I want to fire up all four PCs and monitors.  Clothes dryer is out of the question, though.

The generator is in a doghouse-sized shed under the breakfast nook window which is where the main breaker panel is. There's only 3 CBs in it, not counting supply (main & generator) - house, garage, and well. Some might say that putting the generator under the window is bad - but with the window cracked open "just enough" noise comes in so that you can easily tell if you're overloading it. 

Oh - stove & hot water are propane, no A/C needed.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

It's amazing that hurricane season is "just around the corner" and my insurance company JUST paid for the roof on my house from last year's storms last week and the insurance company on my commercial building STILL hasn't paid enough to even START the rebuild process. Needless to say, my opinion of insurance companies is about as low as can be, occupying about the same area as class action lawyers.


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## cdru (Dec 4, 2003)

SimpleSimon said:


> The generator is in a doghouse-sized shed under the breakfast nook window which is where the main breaker panel is. There's only 3 CBs in it, not counting supply (main & generator) - house, garage, and well. Some might say that putting the generator under the window is bad - but with the window cracked open "just enough" noise comes in so that you can easily tell if you're overloading it.


I'm suprised that code allowed you to put a gas generator underneith a window. I thought the exhaust fumes would exclude this location.


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## dfergie (Feb 28, 2003)

When we have power outage's, I just use my 2 generators I use for camping... one is a 2,000 watt(will run the Ac)-the other a 3,000 watt that will handle most everything else... Or in the event of short outage, I just move to the Camper and use inverter and or Generator power.


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

Natural Gas. Get a permanent NG installation and professional hookup for your natural gas generator. 

With gasoline, when you run out, chances are the pumps down at the corner will be out & you are up the creek without a paddle. Natural gas is underground, less vulnerable to natural disasters, theft, accidental fires, explosions and so on. Unlike retail pumped gasoline, there are no "storage" problems with natural gas.

Get a permanent, professionally-installed NG gen and connection to your side of the meter.

Natural Gas. The only way to go.


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## Neil Derryberry (Mar 23, 2002)

and the nice thing about NG is that the byproduct of burning it is mostly water!


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Nick said:


> Natural Gas. Get a permanent NG installation and professional hookup for your natural gas generator.
> 
> With gasoline, when you run out, chances are the pumps down at the corner will be out & you up the creek without a paddle. Natural gas is underground, less vulnerable to natural disasters, theft, accidental fires, explosions and so on. Unlike retail pumped gasoline, there are no "storage" problems with natural gas.
> 
> ...


In the early 1990s they piped the town where I was living for natural gas. My secretary worked part time for the church and part time for the guy who delivered propane. She tried to convince people, including me, that switching to NG would be a big mistake, because in times of shortage the company could just "shut you off." The argument might have worked with others, but I had actually been served by NG companies in a number of communities. I HAD run out of propane when I forgot to check the gage and call them to deliver more. I had NEVER run out of NG.


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

Our city has an ordinance about putting LP tanks in your yard. Generally, you can't mount an LP tank if you are served by the local natural gas supplier. I suppose it's for aesthetic reasons but I don't really know.

I think it's pretty simple to convert an LP appliance to NG. You just have to change out the metering orifice that feeds the burner. 

I've got no backup at all, I'm at the mercy of the gods. Of course, the natural calamity in my area is tornadoes. If one of those hits the house I probably won't be too worried about backup power.

I remember Granny's house back in the 60's and 70's. They used butane and the house always stunk. I think most LP users have shifted away from butane in favor of te safer propane.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

In 1993, the year of some of the worst flooding in the midwest ever, it was not uncommon to see an LP tank caught in a tree or on a bridge, now 40 or 50 feet above the river. Those tanks float real good.


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## dfergie (Feb 28, 2003)

Bogy said:


> In 1993, the year of some of the worst flooding in the midwest ever, it was not uncommon to see an LP tank caught in a tree or on a bridge, now 40 or 50 feet above the river. Those tanks float real good.


 I guess I better tie my propane tank down...  I would love to convert my gen sets to propane...


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Simple Simon-

Be real careful of using a simple generator with surge load devices on one side and electronics on the other. When I was shopping for a generator we did some field tests on this and the simple generators without inverters caused voltage swings of 90-160 volts as the generator's rpm's shifted during surges. Now if you feed all your electronics with UPS and feed the UPS with the generator, My guess is you will be OK.

The transfer switch is actually required by local code here. But, the cost is what you questioned. I feel that by shopping around the cost is not so bad. I actually paid $300 for all my wiring and a 10 ct. switch. The 10 circuit breakers, 10 SPDT switches, and 2 meters with full cable harness isn't such a bad price. The switch also came with a 25 ft 14-4 rubber cord to connect to the generator. 

AS for fuel, I have 15 gallons of gas plus what's in the tank and according to the manual I should be good to go for a few days. 

I agree, Nick, that afull house, Natural gas system is the Rolls Royce of emergency power centers. I actually looked into it for here eventhough I knew it was way overkill for the history in this area. I don't have NG here but it is at the street. In order to have it installed the city required I install a hot water heater minimum to qualify and then I could also hook to the generator. They would not connect the NG on the basis of a generator-emergency power center alone. Propane was also an option with this system but the tank installation was also expensive and alternative rental per month was equally undesirable. I do know a bit about NG generators as when I was a plant mgr and CE in NY I installed a 50KW Winco NG power center that ran off NG. I set it up with an auto switch and wired it to our critical chemical processes plus our office. It worked great! The cost was around $75,000 and the first power outage we suffered saved a $140,000 batch of Laundry detergent from spoiling. PLUS- the local power company had made an arrangement with me to back feed emergency power to the hospital next door when they requested. They gave us a special deal on our electric for doing that in certain emergencies. Like you, Bogy, we never suffered outages on NG all through the 70's and 80's when I worked for the company. 

If we had a history of repeated power outages here I would have strongly considered the whole house-NG-auto switch system at about $12,000 cost estimate but I think what I put in at $3200 budget (with several discounts) will do the trick. If I didn't need the quality of power, I would have gone the Briggs & Stratton system at half the price. And, if it wouldn't have been for the business in the home, I would have just used a portable with extension cord to the needed appliance. A friend who does real estate appraisals also told me that when he sees a load center with generator transfer system, it adds considerably to the value of the house so the cost of adding it is not lost when you sell. It's an added value that does not depreciate, like a swimming pool.


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## JohnGfun (Jan 16, 2004)

I've been seeing all of those Propane Commercials...I would like to switch over to propane. Anyone here done that? Does it REALLY Save that much $$$$?


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

My eldest son and his wife built a 3800 sf home on a hillside east of Albuquerque. After a power outage the first winter, he had a NG gen installed on a concrete pad outside at the service entrance. I believe it is about 30kw, and the cost was like $6-7k, IIRC.


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## Neil Derryberry (Mar 23, 2002)

www.americasgenerators.com


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

Here's a gen guaranteed to stay put during the strongest blow.

www.americasgenerators.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=1560


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

I need two. :lol:


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

...and it's less than $165,000.00


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

dfergie said:


> I guess I better tie my propane tank down...  I would love to convert my gen sets to propane...


I remember in '93 seeing footage of whole "herds" of propane tanks floating around a fenced in propane storage yard. Kind of scary.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Nick- The KW rating on any simple generator is somewhat confusing to the non-engineer. There are actually two numbers one needs to consider depending on the typical loads. Start current load and sustained running loads. Most simple generators have a start load maximum that is about double the sustained running load. In an inverter design or any load regulated design, the load is regulated and the power filtered and voltage regulated, Therefore the surge current is not as high as near double the running current. But then the voltage doesn't vary wildly either. The biggest offenders of surge loads would be central airconditioners, second Refrigerators and freezers. Third would be washing machines. 

It is hard to say what kind of NG generator your son installed at "30KW" for only "6-7K" dollars. The cheapest price I have seen is an $11,000 Generac that is actually located here in Jacksonville, for $7600. They have this one left, open box, as a return from last year's Hurricane season. Around here people were desperate to buy anything, they used it for a few weeks and then returned it to the Home Depot where they bought it for full refund. That's Home Depot policy. Now it sits in the store at a third off special. It will work as an auto transfer 200 amp service. 

Another thing, while I am quite capable of wiring in a sub panel like a transfer switch, I stop short of working on any main feed line between the meter and the main load center. This requires a permit and a licensed electrician under the code while what I do is legal to be done by the home owner as long as the home owner installs according to the code. I once held a Master Electrician's license in NY so doing this with knowledge of the code is within my ability. my old NY license is not good here in Jacksonville. 

An estimate to install a 200 amp transfer switch for the Generac is about $600 by a licensed electrician. Figure about $300 for NG plumbing and all permits etc and you add about a grand to the cost of your generator for install of service. This would put the whole home unit at about $8500 with the Home Depot discounts for the returned unit or about $12k for a new one at MSRP. I believe the new unit comes with the 200 amp auto transfer switch although the one here in Jax didn't. It was missing!


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

One of the Air Force bases I was stationed at had dozens and dozens of gigantic underground diesel storage tanks and big generators for every critical building. The base susposedley had enough stored diesel to operate for months without commercial power. They test ran each generator once a month to check for problems.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

I'm all set for the next hurricane. My solution is I have thousands of D cells I have taped together. In an emergency all I have to do is plug the wires taped to the posts on the end batteries into a wall socket and all that power will flow through the house circuits, powering all my needs.


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

Bogy said:


> I'm all set for the next hurricane. My solution is I have thousands of D cells I have taped together. In an emergency all I have to do is plug the wires taped to the posts on the end batteries into a wall socket and all that power will flow through the house circuits, powering all my needs.


One small problem - that would be DC not AC.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Dang, I knew I was forgetting something. Good thing I have lots of time to work that out before the next hurricane hits Nebraska.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Bogy- You can try prayer, or an inverter. Don't you get severe T-Stormes in Nebraska, along with Tornados?

FYI- It's not necessarily the Hurricanes that worries me here in Jacksonville since the last one to hit here was several decades ago, it's the Tornados that takes down trees, taking out powerlines that wipes out your electricity until the power company can rebuild. Last Fall a small tornado set down across the street and took out several trees as well as all the power lines. From two houses down for the next several blocks, the power was out for 5 days. Here, it went out for 5 hours until the power company came by, isolated the real damage and reset our end of the street. We were lucky but the neighbors weren't. 
What I'm doing is not meant to help in a major disaster but all the little ones that hit during severe thunderstorms that take out your power for a lengthy period of time. 
Example is Richard's place. A generator doesn't help much when the roof and a few walls are blown away. The real issue is that here in Florida, the worst time to install a generator is hurricane season because the prices are high and the availability is nil. That's why I did it now.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

DonLandis said:


> Bogy- You can try prayer, or an inverter. Don't you get severe T-Stormes in Nebraska, along with Tornados?


Prayer is good, humor is also good. 
We do obviously get storms in this area, but the storms I most worry about are the winter storms. In the summer the worst thing is that if the power stays off for to long we lose everything in the refrigerator and freezer, but survival is not a problem. Its just a matter of comfort. If a major ice storm/blizzard hits and knocks out power it is no longer a matter of comfort, but survival. The food aspect then becomes easy, you just put it outside in the natural freezer. Heat is another matter, and the most important priority. I have a NG furnace. Except of course that the furnace will not ignite without electricity. However, I also have two NG fireplaces. Those two fireplaces, one upstairs and one down will keep the house warm enough to keep us from freezing, as well as the pipes. That is my solution to meet my potential needs. I know of very few people in this area who go to the lengths you guys do to ensure power. We do not experience power outages on a regular enough basis to warrant that kind of expense. I have not lost power for a full 24 hours in the past 10 years.


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## cdru (Dec 4, 2003)

Nick said:


> ...and it's less than $165,000.00


But there are "low lease rates available". I guess it comes down to how they define "low".


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

> FYI- It's not necessarily the Hurricanes that worries me here in Jacksonville since the last one to hit here was several decades ago,


Gee, that's what I thought when I moved to Vero Beach. It had been over 100 years since there was widespread damage from a hurricane landing near Vero when I moved here. 



> The real issue is that here in Florida, the worst time to install a generator is hurricane season because the prices are high and the availability is nil.


Excellent point. I guess it's time for me to go shopping.

By the way, as I sit here in my house typing away, the roofers are madly stripping the old roof off of my house. The hurricane that did the damage was on Sept 5th. of last year. This is how long it has taken to get enough money out of the insurance company to get the job done.  I still have to get some bucks for redoing the screened in porch, a porch that is about 25' long and 8' high for which the insurance company alloted $175. to replace. Nice folks.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

That large generator looks like the ones that are used as power backup by Echostar at the Wyoming uplink center. They have several of them (four or five?) and they were quite impressive to see when I toured the place many years ago.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

Here's what happened last summer when Vero Beach was being rewired after Jeanne.
http://www.pbase.com/rking401/image/40903741 There were power trucks from nearly every state in the country here. These guys were about a mile north of my house and, small world, were from Minnesnowta. THere were nearly 40 trucks lined up along the street rewiring the neighborhood. Multiply this by the number of neighborhoods all across Florida that had the same problems and you get some idea of the magitude of the problems we had after these hurricanes. The last of the two storms came through on Sept. 25 and this picture was shot on Oct. 2. They do respond quickly. I still had no power when this was shot.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Richard King said:


> Gee, that's what I thought when I moved to Vero Beach. It had been over 100 years since there was widespread damage from a hurricane landing near Vero when I moved here.
> 
> Excellent point. I guess it's time for me to go shopping.
> 
> By the way, as I sit here in my house typing away, the roofers are madly stripping the old roof off of my house. The hurricane that did the damage was on Sept 5th. of last year. This is how long it has taken to get enough money out of the insurance company to get the job done.  I still have to get some bucks for redoing the screened in porch, a porch that is about 25' long and 8' high for which the insurance company alloted $175. to replace. Nice folks.


I wonder how long people in Canada have to wait for their insurance companies to pay up after hurricanes. Probably they are put on a waiting list for repairs. :lol:

Don't take it the wrong way Richard, sometimes things are so frustrating the only thing you can do is laugh, through your teeth if need be. I do have you, and a lot of others, in my prayers.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

It's to the point that all I can do is laugh at these people lately. Even the public adjuster that I hired to deal with the insurance company on my commercial building is proving to be pretty much worthless. He came up with a $$$ figure (large) to file with the insurance company, but won't communicate with me as to what is going on between him and the insurance company. So, all I can do on that place is sit and wait and watch the building rot away. The insurance company still hasn't released enough to even get started on the roof yet. For some reason I figure I should do the roof before starting to replace the interior walls. :lol: But then, what do I know?


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

OK on the NG heaters. I had one to heat the whole house when I lived in NY and I think I could have rigged a small battery operated ignighter to do the job if needed but I still needed some form of continuous 240 volts to supply the fan motor as it was gas hot air HV system. No AC in upstate NY, didn't need it. Now I can't imaging using one of those small space heaters ion NG for the winter. Of course my house up there was so poorly insulated. When the outside was 10 below, the highest I could get the house was 55 degrees. 
Now living in Florida, I have to agree with you that priority on a generator is in part comfort but for me anyway, it is also keeping my business running. If I didn't value comfort, I would have stayed living in NY.


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

DonLandis said:


> OK on the NG heaters. I had one to heat the whole house when I lived in NY and I think I could have rigged a small battery operated ignighter to do the job if needed but I still needed some form of continuous 240 volts to supply the fan motor as it was gas hot air HV system.


You could light the burner with a match - if you could get gas out of the gas valve. New gas appliances, including home furnaces, don't use standing pilot lights anymore. They use the safer piezo-electric ignitors. However, the new gas valves used on electric ignition appliances are electrically operated and wont open and release gas unless there is power. :nono2:

Most home gas furnaces only need 110 VAC and not 240. The blower motors don't use too much juice, something like 2-1/2 or 3 amps.

I couldn't imagine living in North Texas without an AC. In the summer 110° days are not uncommon. Arizona and Hell are the only places that get hotter.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

ntexasdude said:


> You could light the burner with a match - if you could get gas out of the gas valve. New gas appliances, including home furnaces, don't use standing pilot lights anymore. They use the safer piezo-electric ignitors. However, the new gas valves used on electric ignition appliances are electrically operated and wont open and release gas unless there is power. :nono2:
> 
> Most home gas furnaces only need 110 VAC and not 240. The blower motors don't use too much juice, something like 2-1/2 or 3 amps.
> 
> I couldn't imagine living in North Texas without an AC. In the summer 110° days are not uncommon. Arizona and Hell are the only places that get hotter.


Right, newer furnaces do not have a pilate light. They also will not operate, as in igniting the burner, unless they know there is power to run the blower to keep the transfer plates from cracking. Smart little buggers aren't they. I have considered buying a small generator just to run the blower on the furnace. It wouldn't have to be much. At this point I will wait and see where we land next.


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

ntexasdude said:


> ...In the summer 110° days are not uncommon. Arizona and Hell are the only places that get hotter.


...but it's a _dry_ heat!


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Yeah, and when it gets to 40 below in South Dakota its a _dry_ cold.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

> Yeah, and when it gets to 40 below in South Dakota


Gee, I thought it only did that in Minnesnowta.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

cdru said:


> I'm suprised that code allowed you to put a gas generator underneith a window. I thought the exhaust fumes would exclude this location.


Code, code? We don't need no stinkin' code! 

Actually, that's a good thought. If the wind blew in exactly the wrong direction at exactly the wrong speed while the window was open enough for some exhaust to come in, I might smell it.

Of course, this IS Colorado, where the weather changes by the minute, so I'm not worried.


DonLandis said:


> Be real careful of using a simple generator with surge load devices on one side and electronics on the other. When I was shopping for a generator we did some field tests on this and the simple generators without inverters caused voltage swings of 90-160 volts as the generator's rpm's shifted during surges. Now if you feed all your electronics with UPS and feed the UPS with the generator, My guess is you will be OK.


And you nailed it, of course - all my important gear is on UPS. 


DonLandis said:


> The transfer switch is actually required by local code here. But, the cost is what you questioned. I feel that by shopping around the cost is not so bad. I actually paid $300 for all my wiring and a 10 ct. switch. The 10 circuit breakers, 10 SPDT switches, and 2 meters with full cable harness isn't such a bad price. The switch also came with a 25 ft 14-4 rubber cord to connect to the generator.


$300 isn't bad for what you got - if you think you need it. The little Square-D interlock gizmo was like $40, and is UL & NEC approved for this purpose - in effect it IS a transfer switch (obviously). The surprising part is that the NEC cranial-rectal inversion crowd got the clue.


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

Cranial-rectal inversion??? :eek2:

Is that the same as a rectal-cranial insertion? :shrug:


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

Nick said:


> ...but it's a _dry_ heat!


Hot is hot and cold is cold. When it gets above 105° I don't think the humidity matters. A frog in a pan of boiling water at 212° is going to be a little uncomfortable as is a frog on a cookie sheet in an oven at 212° 

I remember reading an article in either Popular Science or Popular Mechanics a few years about a nuclear reactor for homes. It was about the same size as an outdoor air conditioning condensing unit and could supply a ordinary home with limitless electricity. The article pointed though it probably would never be feasible because of terrorist threats and natural disasters. :eek2:


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

Nick said:


> Cranial-rectal inversion??? :eek2:
> 
> Is that the same as a rectal-cranial insertion? :shrug:


 !rolling !rolling

Can you say Richard Cranium?


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

_"$300 isn't bad for what you got - if you think you need it. The little Square-D interlock gizmo was like $40, and is UL & NEC approved for this purpose - in effect it IS a transfer switch (obviously). The surprising part is that the NEC cranial-rectal inversion crowd got the clue."_

$40 if your main load center is already set up for that "little gizmo" installation.

The transfer switch is not just "what I needed" to meet code requirements, it also is what I wanted to be able to conveniently switch my desired circuits depending on what I wanted to power. The alternative was to use extension cords, or a whole home emergency power center with main auto switch. This is a middle of the road system than is installed the way the local codes require.


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## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

ntexasdude said:


> Hot is hot and cold is cold.


Sorry, NTDude, but I have to agree with Nick. I moved to MO from ETX to get away from the humididity(  )! Every August when I go to pick up _my_ boys, I just about suffocate. It's like a damn sauna. It's less humid in NTX, so you really don't know unless you've lived somewhere really humid. (Have you? (Not trying to be sarcastic.  ))


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## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

I have pretty much lived in North Texas, Wichita Falls to be exact, all my life but I have traveled all over this great country for business reasons. I used to be a field service engineer for a major equipment manufacturer. Spent lots of time away from home in almost every major city and almost every state. Florida and Houston were pretty miserable places as I recall. But still, if it's 115° outside you ain't gonna be too happy regardless of the humidity. It will cook your brain and cause dementia. Generally, I've found that the Southeast US has more miserable summers than the rest of the US.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Take a look at the heat index. Humidity makes a big difference in how bad it feels.


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## Bogy (Mar 23, 2002)

Humidity can also make a difference in how cold it feels, but to figure out how cold it feels wind is the determining factor, not humidity. My own experience is that by the time you hit 30 below there is not humidity in the air. It all froze out. In fact, when it gets to 30 or 40 below you don't even have to worry about ice on the roads, because it freezes off. Contraction rates between water and pavement evidently vary enough that the ice breaks off. Thats the good news.


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## Neil Derryberry (Mar 23, 2002)

SimpleSimon said:


> Code, code? We don't need no stinkin' code!
> 
> Actually, that's a good thought. If the wind blew in exactly the wrong direction at exactly the wrong speed while the window was open enough for some exhaust to come in, I might smell it.
> 
> ...


Manual or not, you absolutely have to have a transfer switch... the transfer switch is designed not only to switch your load from primary to secondary - it also keeps you from energizing the circuit that feeds your house, preventing you from killing power company linemen that might be working somewhere on your street.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Neil- What Simon is referring to is, in effect a transfer switch as it converts a main breaker and an inbound feed breaker to a 4 pole double throw switch by ganging the two at the lever. Does this meet code? I can find no reference to it meeting code. It certainly does not qualify under the UL1800 (I'm guessing from memory on that spec.) but there is a spec un UL to define the minimum standards for transfer switch for generators back feeding a main load center.

Do you absolutely have to have a transfer switch? Technically, no. But it places you at a huge risk of being brought up on manslaughter charges in the event of an accident. There is a process whereby many a handyman has back fed his 30 amp 240v generator plug into the main breaker via the electric dryer plug using an adapter cord and unplugging the generator. Then one must open the main and all the circuit breakers, Once the generator is up and running the each circuit is activated with the main panel breaker. This works, but in the event of an accident, your handyman backfeed that does not meet code will place you under arrest as a suspect in the wrongful death if that happens. Frankly, what's the big deal? The proper transfer switch is not only convenient, it keeps you safe in within the law and it assures your generator is properly balanced if you watch the meters. Also, it is not expensive either, but it does cost considerably more than the extension cords which is also "legal"

Here is a cute video showing how the transfer switch is installed:

http://www.connecticut-electric.com/online/Emergen.html


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