# Please Add Close Captioning to the Quick Menu



## jwd45244 (Aug 18, 2006)

The UI is getting much better. DTV has On Demand in the Quick Menu. Please add Close Captioning to it. Enabling CC should not be as hard as it is.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your sentiment, but there are a couple of factors at play here that you should consider (from DIRECTV's point of view):


DIRECTV on Demand has the potential to bring in revenue for DIRECTV
Closed Captioning for most people is either on or off (not toggled) - yes, there are folks that toggle, but I have to believe that most people have it either on or off making the need to quickly change greatly dimished


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## RoyGBiv (Jul 24, 2007)

Maybe most people have it on or off all the time, but I also want to be able to turn it on or off without going through 13 steps. I leave CC off, but for some shows, especially those with characters speaking in strong accents, I turn CC on. It is a pain, and it would seem something could be done to turn it on or off with 1 click.

SMK


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

I agree with the OP. It should be much simpler than it currently is to enable/disable CC at will, so adding it to the menu makes sense.


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## jwd45244 (Aug 18, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> Closed Captioning for most people is either on or off (not toggled) - yes, there are folks that toggle, but I have to believe that most people have it either on or off making the need to quickly change greatly diminished


DTV has Audio options on the Menu and most people never touch that.


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## Capmeister (Sep 16, 2003)

I'd like it to be easier, but FIRST I'd like closed captioning pop-on placement issues fixed (it places too far left) and I'd like MPEG4 CC fixed.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

RoyGBiv said:


> Maybe most people have it on or off all the time, but I also want to be able to turn it on or off without going through 13 steps. I leave CC off, but for some shows, especially those with characters speaking in strong accents, I turn CC on. It is a pain, and it would seem something could be done to turn it on or off with 1 click.


+1. Lots of folks with no hearing issues just want to be able to quickly toggle CC's ON/OFF to verify some dialog that may be unintelligible for a variety of reasons, but otherwise don't want to be distracted by keeping CC's on all the time.

A "quick CC toggle" is the 20th most-requested feature of the 96 items currently on the HR20 Wish List. /steve


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## DishDog (Nov 10, 2006)

I'd vote for CC in the quick menu. It would be a great enhancement.


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## Mixer (Sep 28, 2006)

I would like to have a toggle for one simple but very important reason - my mother. My wife and I need the CC on becase of our kids but my mother complains about it all the time. To be abke to turn this on or off quickly would be a huge benefit for us.

Where does this item factor on the Wish List?



Doug Brott said:


> I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your sentiment, but there are a couple of factors at play here that you should consider (from DIRECTV's point of view):
> 
> 
> DIRECTV on Demand has the potential to bring in revenue for DIRECTV
> Closed Captioning for most people is either on or off (not toggled) - yes, there are folks that toggle, but I have to believe that most people have it either on or off making the need to quickly change greatly dimished


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Mixer said:


> Where does this item factor on the Wish List?


Currently about #20 out of 96 requests. If you haven't taken the Wish List survey, you can help bump this request up higher by voting for it here. Registration is quick and painless, I promise.  /steve


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## macmantis (Aug 19, 2006)

They should just put it in the Audio Options menu. It is related to audio.

MacMantis


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

macmantis said:


> They should just put it in the Audio Options menu. It is related to audio.


Yup. Yours is just one of the many good ideas that have been batted around in numerous earlier threads on this subject. Other attractive options include a top level CC ON/OFF toggle on the QUICK MENU, or to make it one of the clicks on the YELLOW audio button.

Any one of these would be preferable to the 15-16 steps required to toggle it at present. I've got a 15-step MACRO programmed into my universal remote that works about 50% of the time, at best, due to the variable HR20 menu response lags. /steve


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

This was discussed at length months ago, let's start talking about it! It's one of the few things I would change.


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## PoitNarf (Aug 19, 2006)

Capmeister said:


> I'd like it to be easier, but FIRST I'd like closed captioning pop-on placement issues fixed (it places too far left) and I'd like MPEG4 CC fixed.


+1 and to the OP as well.

While I never use CC, I know there's a fair share of members here that do. Most of the wrinkles have been ironed out of the HR20, so now CC should be put under a microscope by D*. After all, for some members here CC is a necessity.


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## lucky13 (Nov 27, 2006)

As has been posted above, even for those of us who are fortunate enough not to need CC on all the time, it's very useful when watching certain shows, or when, despite replaying the dialogue several times, you just can't understand what was just said.

A secondary use is understating the music lyrics on Letterman and SNL. Once Pavarotti was on, and I turned on CC to see if it was translating the aria. Alas, all it said was:

[Singing in Italian]


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

Closed Captioning should be either on the first level Quick Menu or in the Audio sub-menu.

Anything is better than the current 23 steps.

The LIST button is already for My Playlist. Why steal the menu space for My Playlist again?

The ACTIVE button should be for all ACTIVE content. It should bring up four options:
Active Channel
News Mix
Sport Mix
DIRECTV on Demand 

- Craig


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## armophob (Nov 13, 2006)

Without objection, but for effect, maybe a poll?


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## joejhawk (Oct 3, 2006)

The cumbersome steps it takes to enable/disable CC is one of the few remaining gripes (DLB being another biggie) I have about the HR20. Even if it's not on the main menu why isn't the tab under the audio options?


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

I toggle this all the time. A huge PIA. My hearing is excellent. It has many other uses: I run on Mute a lot. In fact, some TV's give you the nice option of letting captions appear, if desired, whenever the audio is muted. It's also handy, like they say on CH 264, when there is English spoken in arcane local British dialects or slang. Your hearing is good, you say? Try figuring out what in the heck Bradd Pitt is saying in the movie, "Snatch."

They _should_ have put a button right on the front of the oddly-designed, upside down, two-hands-required remote (numbers on the bottom, DVR features on the top.)

And somebody needs to fix the captioning on Showtime HD.

One other problem: On the H20-600's I have (FW ver. 2038), the color white displayed for both characters and background is more like medium gray, making it very difficult to read. The HR20-700 looks fine, though.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Somebody start a POLL.....I'll call D* myself a request this option!!!!!!


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## dchoe (Jun 22, 2007)

jwd45244 said:


> The UI is getting much better. DTV has On Demand in the Quick Menu. Please add Close Captioning to it. Enabling CC should not be as hard as it is.


+1


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

HOW bad do we want this????

I think the D* engineers could fix this to were we only have to bring up the quick menu guide and select CC....im tired of having my wife screw up my macro settings on my Harmony(long story).

We should not let this thread die!!

Moderator's will you please sticky this for us?


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

How bad? Very bad, at least here in the Shadow household. I really thought we were close to it a couple months ago.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Stuart......sticky this thread PLEASE

If enough of us keep hittng D* over the head with this request then maybe they'll breakdown and do this for us!


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## ntrprize (Jun 15, 2006)

I dont use CC, but if it had a quick toggle in the menu, then I would use it from time to time. Especially when the house is asleep.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Probably more effective than a POLL would be to get this bumped up higher on the Wish List, which we know D* looks at. If you haven't already voted a THUMBS UP to: "*A quick way to toggle Closed Captions On/Off.*", please do so here.

Thanks! /steve


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

If you are not disabled, you may wish people with disabilities would just go away. I must confess that sometimes I am annoyed that the disabled parking spots seem to always be sitting open.

But the HR20 is an ADA lawsuit waiting to happen. Show how impossible CC is to a federal judge. Show how the DIRECTV manual does not even disclose the existiance of CC let alone how to find it. It would be a summary judgment. A big one.

I am not saying it was deliberate but could DIRECTV have made Closed Captioning any harder to use?

What this debate really goes to is our compassion. The fact that the hearing impaired go 23 keystrokes does not affect the 92% of us. In most cases the hearing impaired live with others who are not hearing impaired. Hence the need for the ability to toggle CC.

It is kind of like a mall saying they are ADA compliant when the wheelchair ramp is two miles away.

DIRECTV has more to lose in a CC ADA lawsuit than they can make in DoD.

Moderators, please make this a sticky.

Let's commit to this until Closed Captioning access is fixed.

We need to get DIRECTV's attention on this.

If DIRECTV won't fix CC access from a devotion to helping the less fortunate, they should from a devotion to money.

- Craig


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Milominderbinder2 said:


> If you are not disabled, you may wish people with disabilities would just go away. I must confess that sometimes I am annoyed that the disabled parking spots seem to always be sitting open.
> 
> *But the HR20 is an ADA lawsuit waiting to happen.* Show how impossible CC is to a federal judge. Show how the DIRECTV manual does not even disclose the existiance of CC let alone how to find it. It would be a summary judgment. A big one.
> 
> ...


Excellent! But it's not just the HR20. D*'s remotes have _always_ made this function way more difficult than even the most convoluted scheme of any TV manufacturer. This generation of remotes takes them _way_ farther down the wrong road. Their liability is that their current CC option is indistinguishable from what would be designed by someone who _intentionally_ wanted to make it as difficult as possible, without actually eliminating the option, although I'm sure that was not their intention.

As I said, I'm not hearing impaired, but I use this option all the time. It must be a tremendous issue for those who share a household with those who are impaired, and these are the very people who are more likely than the rest of us to have difficulty with navigating menus with a remote. * A software fix can't be that difficult.*


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Moderators Make This A Sticky........P L E A S E

EARL...TOM...DOUG......come on guys this needs to be a sticky.....Everybody is in agreement that CC would be a simple addition to the quick menu......


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## theoldone (Dec 19, 2006)

cc on the quick menu would be great. I hate going through all the steps that are now required to toggle cc.


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## Coffey77 (Nov 12, 2006)

They should just add it in to the Audio section of the Main MENU listing. It'd be quicker... Might have been mentioned but I'll mention it again then.


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## Coffey77 (Nov 12, 2006)

Milominderbinder2 said:


> Let's commit to this until Closed Captioning access is fixed.
> 
> We need to get DIRECTV's attention on this.
> - Craig


I do agree that this needs better attention and I hope with the constructive minds here @ DBSTalk that we can figure out a way to make this happen for everyone who has waited a long time, usually patiently.


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## jutley (Oct 11, 2006)

Totally agree with the OP on this one. When I am watching TV at a low volume when the kids are going to sleep it would be great to be able to quickly toggle it on and off. Right now it is such a pain to get CC turned on.


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## armophob (Nov 13, 2006)

Steve said:


> Probably more effective than a POLL would be to get this bumped up higher on the Wish List, which we know D* looks at. If you haven't already voted a THUMBS UP to: "*A quick way to toggle Closed Captions On/Off.*", please do so here.
> 
> Thanks! /steve


Hey Steve, how bought giving this its own category in the wish list. Maybe dropping competition amongst the other functions would let it stand out. Maybe a catagory like remote button assignments. Or even Special Needs to isolate it further and show the support of the whole group.


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## sunsfan (Jan 5, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your sentiment, but there are a couple of factors at play here that you should consider (from DIRECTV's point of view):
> 
> 
> DIRECTV on Demand has the potential to bring in revenue for DIRECTV
> Closed Captioning for most people is either on or off (not toggled) - yes, there are folks that toggle, but I have to believe that most people have it either on or off making the need to quickly change greatly dimished


I agree. I am amazed to hear that people use CC for reasons other then being hearing impaired. I would not be opposed to it being in a audio sub-menu, but not on the first level menu.


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## armophob (Nov 13, 2006)

sunsfan said:


> I agree. I am amazed to hear that people use CC for reasons other then being hearing impaired. I would not be opposed to it being in a audio sub-menu, but not on the first level menu.


Why would you be opposed to this being in top menu? Would you be opposed to it being a color button on the remote?


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## cmeans (Sep 2, 2007)

+1 for me (have to turn the TV down at night to not annoy the neighbors, and sometimes can't understand everything being said).

+1 for my son who sometimes gets up early in the morning, and doesn't want to wake me up (yes, there are other options, but it's the simplest).

I understand D* can't retrofit the remote (I don't use the included remote anyway). Please, please, please get it on the top level of Menu as a toggle item (you could always have it as a show/hide item in the Setup/DisplayCaptions screen so that people who don't need quick/easy access, can avoid it).


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## Coffey77 (Nov 12, 2006)

If Mrs. Coffey is listening to her favorite music, I like to turn off the volume and watch CC as well. It'd be nice to have a quick toggle so I don't miss half the show trying to turn it on.


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!

- Craig


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## tpm1999 (Sep 5, 2006)

My wife loves closed captioning, I dont. It takes WAY TOO LONG to turn it off, so I just give up and leave it on.

Directv Must make it easier to turn on or off. At this point, I am kind of sick of the excuses coming out of closed caption haters!

Get it done DirecTV!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

armophob said:


> Hey Steve, how bought giving this its own category in the wish list. Maybe dropping competition amongst the other functions would let it stand out. Maybe a catagory like remote button assignments. Or even Special Needs to isolate it further and show the support of the whole group.


As an ardent fan of this feature request, I'd love to shine a brighter light on it, but I'm having difficulty figuring out what new group to create.

The new toggle may not be a new BUTTON assignment, but a QUICK MENU item.

And as far as "special needs" go, since those with hearing difficulties will probably just keep captions on all the time, I believe this is less of an issue for the hearing-impaired then for those that just want a quick CC toggle for a variety of other valid reasons.

I think "EASE OF USE" is the proper Wish List category for it. We just need folks to vote!!!!!

/steve


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## boomer (Jan 10, 2003)

I agree....this is needed on the quick menu...


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## mdmantia (Jul 24, 2007)

RoyGBiv said:


> Maybe most people have it on or off all the time, but I also want to be able to turn it on or off without going through 13 steps. I leave CC off, but for some shows, especially those with characters speaking in strong accents, I turn CC on. It is a pain, and it would seem something could be done to turn it on or off with 1 click.
> 
> SMK


I totally agree....The Wire....The Sopranos are 2 examples


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

quickfire said:


> Moderators Make This A Sticky........P L E A S E
> 
> EARL...TOM...DOUG......come on guys this needs to be a sticky.....Everybody is in agreement that CC would be a simple addition to the quick menu......


Not that you asked me  but this will not be "stuck" in the Cutting Edge subforum. The CE sticky area is already pretty crowded.

Believe me, I want this as much as you guys. I had my HR20 30 minutes when I posted my first request for it. The best way to get DIRECTV to listen is to keep talking about it. If you keep posting, there's no need for a sticky, and I'm sure my fellow moderators would agree.


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

mdmantia said:


> I totally agree....The Wire....The Sopranos are 2 examples


And imagine the plight of the large Asian community when confronted with temporary usage of Spanglish, Ebonics, whatever, in much of today's supposedly-English scripts. There's really a _lot_ of demand for _really_ quick toggle. Not buried too deep either.


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

DirecTV,

Please simplify the CC enable/disable process.

My wife is hearing impaired. She has noted that it is a laborious process to enable to CC. 

I have gotten used to watching most TV with the CC enabled but there are times, e.g. when watching sports, when I would like to disable the CC.

Please dedicate one the colored buttons to a CC toggle and/or make a quick menu option.


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## joejhawk (Oct 3, 2006)

Would it be possible to assign tasks to the color buttons? This is not just a CC issue but you could have some options available for those buttons when a window is not open. It would be like assigning tasks on a keyboard.

I haven't seen this anywhere so maybe it's not possible or practicle.


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## lucky13 (Nov 27, 2006)

tpm1999 said:


> My wife loves closed captioning, I dont. It takes WAY TOO LONG to turn it off, so I just give up and leave it on.
> 
> Directv Must make it easier to turn on or off. At this point, I am kind of sick of the excuses coming out of closed caption haters!
> 
> Get it done DirecTV!


Once CC is enabled, there's a quick workaround:

The BACK button will return you to the CC toggle screen. You'll have to press BACK multiple times if you've looked at the guide or other service screens after setting CC. The BACK memory clears when the unit goes into Standby.

This is only a workaround; not an acceptable substitute for an easy toggle. And the first time you enable CC, you have to go through all the steps.


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Not that you asked me  but this will not be "stuck" in the Cutting Edge subforum. The CE sticky area is already pretty crowded.
> 
> Believe me, I want this as much as you guys. I had my HR20 30 minutes when I posted my first request for it. The best way to get DIRECTV to listen is to keep talking about it. If you keep posting, there's no need for a sticky, and I'm sure my fellow moderators would agree.


Stuart,

Thank you.

We need to show that the needs of the hearing impared matter to us.

I am not hearing impaired nor is anyone in my household. But I volunteer with youth with hearing and other disabilities. Unfortunately it is in our nature as people to forget the needs of others.

I ask everyone to keep this thread up as a tab in your browser and keep the candle going.

We are only asking for a menu item.

- Craig


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I completely agree. Let's keep talking about this issue, both here and in the general HR20 subforum. If it stays near the top, it won't need to be "stuck".


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> I completely agree. Let's keep talking about this issue, both here and in the general HR20 subforum. If it stays near the top, it won't need to be "stuck".


Again, this is _not_ just an HR20 issue, but wherever the most people will see and comment is the place to carry on this discussion.


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## judson_west (Jun 15, 2006)

I like adding CC ON/OFF to the MENU, but I also think there needs to be a hard button for CC on the remote and for this I would like to second the suggestion that it be on the MUTE button. This seems like a logical place and reduces the number of button presses to just 1.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

judson_west said:


> I like adding CC ON/OFF to the MENU, but I also think there needs to be a hard button for CC on the remote and for this I would like to second the suggestion that it be on the MUTE button. This seems like a logical place and reduces the number of button presses to just 1.


It's a logical idea, but unfortunately, the mute button is not a button the HR20 recognizes. It's specific to your TV or audio receiver.

And even if you could use it, many users would want both audio and captions simultaneously, and most likely, mute used this way would either have to be designated as mute or CC.

The "yellow button" suggestion above (post #50) reduces CC's to one click as well, BTW, and that's another button currently dedicated to AUDIO, like the mute button. /steve


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

sunsfan said:


> I agree. I am amazed to hear that people use CC for reasons other then being hearing impaired. I would not be opposed to it being in a audio sub-menu, but not on the first level menu.


well, I never said that I agreed with what I said. I think the biggest use of this new feature will be for non-hearing impaired persons who sometimes want CC for silence or in an attempt to understand words. This necessitates a lot of button presses, so a one-touch (or near one-touch) solution is very attractive. This is because of the frequent use.

My only statement was that most households are going to be happy with it either on or off and in these situations the length of time to make a change is negligible because you do it once (or rarely). In households where one person likes it on and another likes it off the change can be burdensome for sure.

I think it probably should go in the audio menu.


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> .....I think it probably should go in the audio menu.


That's still _at least 5_ clicks each way. Too many for toggling, particularly for the elderly and/or technophobes. What's the matter with a colored button when there are _no_ menus present on the screen (not the blue button, though!) and let the FW handle it? Future remotes produced could have "CC" printed under the button, and all subscribers could be notified of the change in either an insert with their bill or an e-mail if they are online subscribers. "Special Notice for the Hearing Impaired Regarding Closed Captioning"...."In an effort to improve the functionality of our equipment for the hearing impaired, DirecTV is pleased to announce that....."


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

K4SMX said:


> That's still _at least 5_ clicks each way. Too many for toggling, particularly for the elderly and/or technophobes. What's the matter with a colored button when there are _no_ menus present on the screen (not the blue button, though!) and let the FW handle it? Future remotes produced could have "CC" printed under the button, and all subscribers could be notified of the change in either an insert with their bill or an e-mail if they are online subscribers. "Special Notice for the Hearing Impaired Regarding Closed Captioning"...."In an effort to improve the functionality of our equipment for the hearing impaired, DirecTV is pleased to announce that....."


See post #50 for a button suggestion. I think most folks could deal with that, or with simply having CC/ON or CC/OFF on the top level of the quick MENU, depending on the current caption display status. Just my .02. /steve


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

The problem with changing the button behavior is it becomes inconsistent with other receivers. I think all receivers should act as consistently as possible. Not all receivers have CC decoders in them.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

...and congrats to my friend Steve for 2,000 helpful and inspiring posts!!!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> ...and congrats to my friend Steve for 2,000 helpful and inspiring posts!!!


Thanks, *SS*... and back atcha for 5k! /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

I don't know about you guy's but I will not let this thread die!!!!!!

Hopefully D* will see this thread and suprise us all with a 2 step CC option!!!


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## thart (Oct 11, 2006)

macmantis said:


> They should just put it in the Audio Options menu. It is related to audio.
> 
> MacMantis


Makes sense!


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> The problem with changing the button behavior is it becomes inconsistent with other receivers. I think all receivers should act as consistently as possible. Not all receivers have CC decoders in them.


Well that's certainly a valid point, but on a going forward basis they could have a colored remote button for the newer models where it's _not_ inconsistent. They are going to be replacing a lot of the older ones over the next few years in any event. Maybe it's Grandma that gets the new box. Besides, we deal with inconsistency every day. For example, on TV's, we are used to the CC function being accomplished differently on the different TV's in our homes. If I had a choice between a new HR20A or H20A with one button CC and keeping my current HR20's and H20's, I would upgrade immediately.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

My favorite suggestion comes from "Lamont Cranston " who said that they should assign a discrete code for it now, so that it could be used immediately in Harmony, Pronto, and other remotes, then put the button in future DIRECTV remotes.


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

I agree that the ideal solution would be to have a dedicated button on the remote for CC, but the problem is it would be quite an undertaking to replace all of the remotes currently in use.

So here's my suggestion, and it will work for ANY feature that a user wants to have a dedicated button for: Let the user assign ANY features (from a list) to the unused UP and DOWN arrow buttons during playback or live TV. This idea comes direct from my cell phone, where the software lets me assign the calculator, or calendar, or alarm clock, to the UP key. 

So all DIRECTV needs to do is come up with a setup screen with a list of features (DirecTV-on-Demand, CC, Prioritizer, To Do, etc.) and let users assign a feature to UP and to DOWN. 

Everyone wins: Users get dedicated keys for any two functions they want, including CC, and DIRECTV doesn't have to replace remotes.

Just do it!


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## ram4784 (Oct 17, 2006)

As most of you know I have been b******* about this for a year now. The HR20 has evolved into one great DVR, thanks to D* engineers and my fellow CE'ers. As you can see, I do not post frequently, but I do lurk.

I've gotten used to no DLB, although I do hope it is in the not too distant future. But the only other thing this DVR *NEEDS* is a quick toggle for CC. *Puhleeeeze, Mr. Bartender.*


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Your post count has nothing to do with your importance here. 5,600 posts or 56, you are all equally valued.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## terrelliott (May 7, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> My favorite suggestion comes from "Lamont Cranston " who said that they should assign a discrete code for it now, so that it could be used immediately in Harmony, Pronto, and other remotes, then put the button in future DIRECTV remotes.


BINGO!!!


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## John in Georgia (Sep 24, 2006)

tpm1999 said:


> My wife loves closed captioning, I dont. It takes WAY TOO LONG to turn it off, so I just give up and leave it on.
> 
> Directv Must make it easier to turn on or off. At this point, I am kind of sick of the excuses coming out of closed caption haters!
> 
> Get it done DirecTV!


If a toggle is too difficult, wrap-around menus would at least reduce the number of keystrokes required to turn CC on and off.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

I think it's less a question of implementation difficulty and more a question of getting it squarely on D*'s radar screen. I can recall a huge CC thread that started back in February or March. It's now 6 month's later, and there has been no movement at all.

One way to get D*'s attention would be to elevate the "CC toggle" request's ranking on the WISH LIST. If you haven't yet voted for it, please do so here. TIA. /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

We may not have our NEW HD channels as of right now........but lets not let this NORMAL/LEGIT thread die!!!

T T T


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## cuibap (Sep 14, 2006)

I agree. This shouldn't be hard to do.


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## cuibap (Sep 14, 2006)

Steve said:


> One of my suggestions from a previous thread on this topic was to assign it to the YELLOW AUDIO SAP button.
> 
> If there is no SAP:
> 
> ...


This is the best idea so far. Please do it.


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## Agrajag (Jun 22, 2004)

+1 for me too. This is silly the way it is now. It's a feature and I use it but I don't use it now unless I really have to. I often will miss a reference to something due to various reasons (like accent, noise, etc.) and this is a great way to quickly find out what I missed.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Steve said:


> One of my suggestions from a previous thread on this topic was to assign it to the YELLOW AUDIO SAP button.
> 
> If there is no SAP:
> 
> ...


A third OPTION I could add to this list would be to simply use the DOWN ARROW to toggle CC's ON/OFF, since it's currently unused during RECORDING playback or LIVE TV. If someone hits it accidentally, it's easy enough to hit it again. Just a thought. /steve


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

We can toggle the HD Only Filter in 4 clicks. There has to be a way that Closed Captioning can be viable.

23 keystrokes...

- Craig


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Yes, it's silly. It should be rectified. If you've been lurking in this thread and not posted, please make your opinion known... they are listening.


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Yes, it's silly. It should be rectified. If you've been lurking in this thread and not posted, please make your opinion known... they are listening.


well, then...I'll jump in even though I don't have much to add. D* may have originally thought that this wasn't an option that was toggled much, and therefore could be placed deep in the menu system only. However, I think this thread has shown that many people toggle it back and forth.

D* please listen. Make this easier.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Like I posted before I have my CC setup thru macro keys and my wife(bless her heart keeps messing up the sequence by pushing it to many times!!!!!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

quickfire said:


> Like I posted before I have my CC setup thru macro keys and my wife(bless her heart keeps messing up the sequence by pushing it to many times!!!!!


Ya. It's a long macro. And since you need to use an IR remote, aiming the remote properly is also important. So is macro timing. Even with pauses inserted between steps, my universal remote still sometimes gets ahead of the HR20's menu's ability to keep up. Depending on what's going on at the time, the HR20's response time to IR commands can vary. And if you just keep making the pauses between macro steps longer to compensate, then the whole process becomes interminable.

D*... please throw us a bone here! :lol: /steve


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Milominderbinder2 said:


> If you are not disabled, you may wish people with disabilities would just go away. I must confess that sometimes I am annoyed that the disabled parking spots seem to always be sitting open.
> 
> But the HR20 is an ADA lawsuit waiting to happen. Show how impossible CC is to a federal judge. Show how the DIRECTV manual does not even disclose the existiance of CC let alone how to find it. It would be a summary judgment. A big one.
> 
> ...


Now that certain parties have wrung out all the $'s from asbestos, silicon breast implants, tobacco, Merck, etc., the legal department at D* better hope none of those guys ever see this thread. Even though most of the eventual ADA CAL's alleged "victims" probably _never_ toggle, once someone with some technosavy sets it up for them, those guys wouldn't care. Big bucks. Let's hope the legal department is not now afraid to change because to do so would be an admission of previous guilt. That's how some of these guys think. If they move before something bad happens, they won't have that problem. They'd better quit spending all their time losing lawsuits against all those "theft of services" geeks and look in their own backyard instead.

Toggling CC is a big usability issue for a lot of people, as is quite obvious from what's been posted here. Keep bumping this thread!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

OH NO you dont.....TTT....keeping this thread alive until we D* customers have a quick CC selection option!!!!!!


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## killi (Jun 26, 2007)

i too would really benefit and enjoy a quick way of toggling CC on and off. My household uses CC on our main TV 50% of the time for various reasons. Thanks for listening!


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## renen (Jul 16, 2007)

I also agree that we need a simple way to toggle CC. Typically we have it turned on as I lost my hearing on one ear years ago and enhances comprehension, but if watching sport or sometimes when we have guests it can be very distracting to have the CC on the screen.

It is great to have CC, but there are times when the images speak more than the words and it is very inconvenient fumbling through menus to turn it off or on!


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

If you go back and forth much between CC or Mute with CC on and then switch to FNN or Bloomberg, you do a _lot_ of toggling, because the CC obscures the banners and numbers!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

There seems to be so much passionate support out there for this feature, I'm really suprised it's not the #1 item on the current *Wish List*!

Please cast your vote for *"A quick way to toggle Closed Captions On/Off"* here, and let D* know how important this feature is to you.

Registration will only take a second... I promise!

Thanks. /steve


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## Coffey77 (Nov 12, 2006)

That's not a bad idea... Put it with the MUTE button. First press is MUTE, Second is CC on, Third is CC off/Mute Off.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Coffey77 said:


> That's not a bad idea... Put it with the MUTE button. First press is MUTE, Second is CC on, Third is CC off/Mute Off.


Can't be done. The HR20 doesn't "listen" for the MUTE button, only the TV or Audio Receiver. /steve


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Per Steve's request, this thread has been moved so our comrades running national release software can get in on the excitement!


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

I've only had my HR20 for about 2 weeks, but this is by far the biggest issue we have with it. With a 2 year old and a 4 year old running around, the wife and I use CC a lot. We toggle it when the kids enter and leave the living room quite a bit and with some shows that have language violence, we turn the volume down pretty low and use the CC for the whole show (because the kids are upstairs in the loft area). We haven't made the HR20 our main unit yet (it's in the HT) and no easy way to toggle CC is one of the reasons why.



Steve said:


> There seems to be so much passionate support out there for this feature, I'm really suprised it's not the #1 item on the current *Wish List*!
> 
> Please cast your vote for *"A quick way to toggle Closed Captions On/Off"* here, and let D* know how important this feature is to you.
> 
> ...


OK, I took this survey last week, but have a couple of questions:

1. How do you know where items rank overall? I couldn't find that.

2. How is that ranking accurate? For example, I'd rank CC as the number 1 priority, but I can't. I can only give it a thumbs up just as I did with many other things. The survey would rank them all as equal according to me, but they're not. If CC is my number one priority, should I give a thumbs down to everything else??


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

spartanstew said:


> OK, I took this survey last week, but have a couple of questions:
> 
> 1. How do you know where items rank overall? I couldn't find that.
> 
> 2. How is that ranking accurate? For example, I'd rank CC as the number 1 priority, but I can't. I can only give it a thumbs up just as I did with many other things. The survey would rank them all as equal according to me, but they're not. If CC is my number one priority, should I give a thumbs down to everything else??


By voting, you are not ranking, but rather telling D* that if they implement a particular feature:
you _would_ use it (THUMBS UP),
_might_ use it... or don't care if it's there for others who need it (NEUTRAL),
or feel the feature would be a _step backwards_, based on the way you use your HR20 (THUMBS DOWN).
The RESULTS page rankings represent the sum of everyone's votes in aggregate, not just yours. The items which all users gave the most "THUMBS UP" will rank highest, and vice versa.

When you view the results page, by default, you'll see how each item ranks within it's category. The most popular will be on top (usually dark green), to the least popular. If you select "All categories - Combined" from the pull-down menu, you'll be able to see how each item ranks OVERALL.

The Wish List is simply an attempt on our part to send D* the clearest message possible of what new features are most- and least-desired by the entire HR20 user population, so they can prioritize the order they work on them.

/steve


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## kmkraft_1974 (Feb 13, 2006)

last night I watched a movie on dvd and was able to toggle closed captioning during times where I wanted to make sure I fully got the conversations. 

today I watched a movie I recorded to the HR20. I didn't even bother trying to go to the buried page to get the CC on. too much of a pain......

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE implement a quick CC toggle.

btw, I've filled out the wish list survey...just wanted to keep this thread moving with my experience last night and today.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Steve said:


> By voting, you are not ranking, but rather telling D* that if they implement a particular feature:
> you _would_ use it (THUMBS UP),
> _might_ use it... or don't care if it's there for others who need it (NEUTRAL),
> or feel the feature would be a _step backwards_, based on the way you use your HR20 (THUMBS DOWN).
> ...


Thank you, I figured out how to see the overall rankings.

I still, however, don't understand how they can be accurate. For example, lets look at the top 5 items and lets say 100 members voted. Maybe 99 members gave a thumbs up to #1 (Recording history should always display reason), 98 members to #2 and so on down to 95 members gave a thumbs up to the fifth place item (ability to edit all shows in prioritizer). That's how it's currently ranking them.

But, what if all 95 members that gave a thumbs up for #5 (ability to edit shows) actually consider it their #1 wish list item. Maybe out of the 99 members that gave a thumbs to #1 (Recording history), NONE of them consider it a top priority (maybe they gave 20 different things a thumbs up and if they had to rank them, this would be 20th).

It's possible that with that survey, the #1 priority could actually be something that isn't a priority to anyone and items further down the list could be the #1 priority for everyone that gave it a thumbs up.

That's why I'm not surprised CC is way down at #20. There's many members that probably don't use CC at all, so they leave it as neutral. However, most of the people that gave it a thumbs up would consider it one of their top priorities. Unfortunately, there's no way to know that with this survey.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Keeping this thread alive.......LOL

ARE you listening D*?


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Today's New York Times capsule summary of the new NBC show "Life" had this to say:

"[...] Damian Lewis, yet another Briton, stood out in the HBO series "Band of Brothers," but he has a harder time here, _*partly because his dialogue is almost impossible to hear*_. NBC, Wednesday at 10."

/steve


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## rekoil (Aug 10, 2007)

K4SMX said:


> Your hearing is good, you say? Try figuring out what in the heck Bradd Pitt is saying in the movie, "Snatch."


The point was that you _weren't supposed to_ be able to understand what he was saying - the misunderstandings between Mickey and Turkish/Tommy were part of the plotline. Even the DVD didn't subtitle his lines when you turned on CC unless you hit a different menu item to specifically enable his lines to be subtitled.

That said, I voted for quick-CC toggling too on the wishlist page. I recommend to all interested parties do the same!


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

I filled out the wishlist again, giving the thumbs up the easy toggle option for CC. This would drastically simplify things for an important feature. I hope D* is listening.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

I took the survey....if you want CC to have a quick toggle......
Then take the survey please....its been reported in this thread that D* is listening to us about wanting CC!!!


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

rekoil said:


> The point was that you _weren't supposed to_ be able to understand what he was saying - the misunderstandings between Mickey and Turkish/Tommy were part of the plotline. Even the DVD didn't subtitle his lines when you turned on CC unless you hit a different menu item to specifically enable his lines to be subtitled.
> 
> That said, I voted for quick-CC toggling too on the wishlist page. I recommend to all interested parties do the same!


I understand all that. I just thought it was a phenomenal job of acting, and I enjoyed seeing the subtitles of what he was really saying, while simultaneously watching the looks on the faces of those who didn't understand him either! Then I would have also enjoyed being able to toggle "off," when he wasn't in a scene...


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Thanks, *MikeNY* and *quickfire*, and everyone else who gave the "*quick CC toggl*e" a THUMBS UP on the Wish List!  It's making a difference. It's now ranking 5th out of 21 in the "*Ease or Use*" category, and up to 21st out of 96 overall. I believe it was down around midway, before this thread. Nice job! /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## Jerry Lundegaard (Sep 25, 2007)

I am HOH (hard of hearing) with fairly significant hearing loss and I want to say *Thank You* for bringing attention to the matter of Closed Captioning. Over the past decade I have watched TV almost exclusively with headphones and have come to rely on (and take for granted) Closed Captioning which I use approximately 20-25% of the time. I made the transition to HDTV about a month ago and was horrified to learn (the hard way) that I could no longer toggle easily to CC by selecting the mute button on my remote. I've been doing that for many years and I can't tell you how much I miss that option. I do not think there is a single HDTV or digital receiver on the market today that provides that long-standing feature. And to address a point made up-thread, I would say that most people who I know who are HOH do not want to leave CC on all the time. It is distracting when you are not using it.

I am new to DirecTV, but one of the reasons I made the switch was because my cable company used a Motorola box which was fine for my old tube TV, but with HDTV I could only activate CC by shutting the cable box off completely, pulling up the configuration menu, turning CC on, and then turnng the cable box back on. How's that user-unfriendly? When I asked the cable company about it I got the standard refrain of "just leave it on all the time" even though I told them I didn't want to do that.

While I am happy that DirecTV has the CC option from the remote, it is still way too cumbersome to toggle back and forth. My new Panasonic plasma has a CC option but it will only work with OTA. If I wanted to use CC directly from the TV menu using either a cable box or satellite receiver, it will only work with an analog connection. Why would anyone want to buy a High Def TV and then use an analog connection? Of course there is nothing in Panasonic's Owners Manual that provides even the slightest hint about this. Becasue CC is important to me I called Panny's technical service area before I made my purchase and I was told specifically that CC would work with a Component Video connection. Of course that turned out to be a big fat guess that was totally wrong. Frustrating beyond all belief.

I had just assumed that moving to the mored "advanced technology" of HDTV that I would continue to be able to use CC as I had in the past with my old tube TV. What a mistaken assumption that was! I still can't believe that we have actually gone backwards with CC with HDTV. And there is no doubt that the TV manufacturers and the cable and satellite providers view Closed Captioning as strictly an afterthought.

Where is the FCC on this? Congress mandated CC regulations many years ago and we've made wonderful progress in the interim in getting most programs available in CC and with easy to use features (e.g. activation with the mute button). It is not ADA that is at issue here; it is the already existing FCC regulations. The problem is that the FCC has given everyone a pass with 5 year exemptions on compliance with CC regs. In addition the FCC has become a stooge for industry and they really don't care about the HOH and deaf community.

I can only hope that DirecTV will act responsibly and take seriously the concerns that are being expressed about the unwieldy process for using Closed Captioning.

And once again ... *Thank You* for bringing attention to this matter. Sorry for the long post (hey ... it was cathartic for me) and thanks for reading.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

:welcome_s to the forums, *Jerry*, and thanks for providing such valuable perspective to this issue/feature request. I, for one, assumed that HOH folks left the captions on all the time. It's important feedback for D* to understand that this is not always the case. /steve


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## Smuuth (Oct 4, 2005)

Milominderbinder2 said:


> Closed Captioning should be either on the first level Quick Menu or in the Audio sub-menu.
> 
> Anything is better than the current 23 steps.
> 
> ...


I am not one who usually posts a +1, but in this case, I agree with Craig completely, so +1.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

We must keep posting in this thread....thus keeping this topic ALIVE...... TTT

Are you listening to us D*????We loyal D* customer's are asking you to create a quick CC step ......If its a one button toggle on/off..or added to the quick menu catagory......gives us either one and we'll be satisfied!!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

ttt


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## briang5000 (Aug 11, 2004)

I agree this is lacking feature.
I frequently need CC when the dogs won't shut up or if the dialogue is from an actor with a bad accent.

It's crazy that the feature is hidden so deep in the setup menu.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

briang5000 said:


> It's crazy that the feature is hidden so deep in the setup menu.


It's one area where D* copied TiVo's UI, and they shouldn't have! (IOW, I can't believe the otherwise "friendly" TiVo buried this toggle too!) /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

KEEPING IT ALIVE!!!!!

Come on People.......let D* know how we feel about this!!

`


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## YankeeFan (Jan 31, 2006)

+1

D*'s implementation of closed captions on the HR20 is just plain stupid!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

YankeeFan said:


> +1
> 
> D*'s implementation of closed captions on the HR20 is just plain stupid!


True, but in D*'s defense, the HR10 implementation was equally dumb. That being said, "_two wrongs don't make a right!_" :lol: /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## barryr (Sep 28, 2006)

I just can't believe that D* hasn't fixed this yet.

There are literally hundreds of unique individuals crying for it on this list.

There have been, based on my observations, ZERO objections to fixing it.

There is plenty of precedent for implementing fixes like this one in simple downloads.

Sooner or later the ADA folks are going to file a big lawsuit over this one.

I hope it costs D* a lot of money then.

Let's see now: exactly how many people had their viewing experience improved with the much-ballyhooed shift from light blue to dark blue?

How many people who could not use the HR-20 conveniently because of physical or environmental limitations had their lives improved with the new menu appearance?

Why doesn't D* work on what really matters?

Sigh.


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## jazzyd971fm (Sep 1, 2007)

I agree with Doug, CC should be in the audio options menu.

My suggestion would be in that menu, there would be a way to have the captions at the top or bottom of the screen due to channel content.

Let's go D* get this done !!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Had to dig this thread up .......I WILL NOT LET THIS SUBJECT DIE!!!!!!!!

UHHHHHHH.....TTT!


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

quickfire said:


> Had to dig this thread up .......I WILL NOT LET THIS SUBJECT DIE!!!!!!!!
> 
> UHHHHHHH.....TTT!


It would be indeed interesting to read D*'s written response if a deaf D* subscriber with non-hearing impaired family members would happen to write a well-worded formal letter to D*'s Customer Service Department which documented their family's difficulty cycling closed captioning on and off. It might specifically inquire whether the current system is in compliance with the Americans With Disabilities Act. I have no idea exactly what's in that Act, but I guarantee you that letter would make it to the legal department, a carefully worded reply would be crafted, and there _would_ be certain conversations with management regarding this issue.


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## GonzoF1 (Sep 19, 2007)

Yes please... I am HoH as well and am always needing to go back and check dialog. In all honesty, I never found out how to do it. I am a new owner of an HR20-700 and I went looking for it the other night. I had to give up and try the TV's CC system... It didn't work either. So I just dealt with it.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

ttt ......are you listening to your loyal customers D*??


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

ttt?



Tic Tac Toe?

Troops to Teachers?

Tinsel Town Tubes?


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

ttt?.......TO THE TOP


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

Ah. Most people usually just say "bump".


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Crossreference to Closed Captioning discussion thread in the General DirecTV Discussion forum.


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## rbean (Jan 12, 2007)

Milominderbinder2 said:


> We can toggle the HD Only Filter in 4 clicks. There has to be a way that Closed Captioning can be viable.
> 
> 23 keystrokes...
> 
> - Craig


Don't know what everyone is fussin' about it doesn't take 23 button pushes to get CC on it's only 14.:nono: THS IS RIDICULOUS for a function as important as CC


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## Ely (Sep 1, 2007)

The problem I'm experiencing with closed captioning hits me when I make the banner transparent so that the text doesnt show up against the black banner, now when I do that the text is almost unreadable regardless of which font color I pick, white is not really white, looks more like gray and other colors are just too light and hard to read too, what happened with the latest software upgrades? they have totally messed up the close captioning system.


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

rbean said:


> Don't know what everyone is fussin' about it doesn't take 23 button pushes to get CC on it's only 14.:nono: THS IS RIDICULOUS for a function as important as CC


I would just like to see some acknowledgement that DirecTV is planning on simplifying the CC process. For g-d sakes, even Caller ID is off the menu. As much as I love that feature, is that such a crucial, must see pop-up off the first tap of menu..more than CC? My cordless phone is sitting next to me.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Ely said:


> The problem I'm experiencing with closed captioning hits me when I make the banner transparent so that the text doesnt show up against the black banner, now when I do that the text is almost unreadable regardless of which font color I pick, white is not really white, looks more like gray and other colors are just too light and hard to read too, what happened with the latest software upgrades? they have totally messed up the close captioning system.


I have the same problem using a transparent background. D* doesn't do a great job smoothing the font outlines in this mode.

I found that a "translucent" black background with White, Small, "Fruitger 2" type works best for me. It actually looks quite nice, IMO. /steve


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## personman (Apr 24, 2007)

I don't think that the CC should be in the quick menu; but I do think that the red/green buttons should be used to toggle it.


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

personman said:


> I don't think that the CC should be in the quick menu; but I do think that the red/green buttons should be used to toggle it.


That would be even better!


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

personman said:


> I don't think that the CC should be in the quick menu; but I do think that the red/green buttons should be used to toggle it.





mikeny said:


> That would be even better!


Please read back through this thread, and you'll find discussion on why RED and GREEN may not be suitable as CC toggles. Primarily, they are used for interactive features on several channels.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Do you guy's think D* would respond with an actual letter thru e-mail about CC info if one of us here were to insert a link to this CC thread???


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

Drew2k said:


> Please read back through this thread, and you'll find discussion on why RED and GREEN may not be suitable as CC toggles. Primarily, they are used for interactive features on several channels.


I get it, but since you didn't say 'yellow', throw it there with the audio options.

edit: Another thought regarding the interactive features.. They're all text based. We don't need a CC toggle there. If it doesn't work on those channels that's fine. I realize it would harder to implement it with those buttons however.


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

I found another good reason to make this easier to toggle. (Not that current reasons shouldn't be enough for D* to make the change.) 

Was watching Criminal Minds the other night and several minutes of the dialog was silent. (I imagine it was problem with my local station.) I backed up the recording and turned CC on. It was annoying that it was so many button presses. So annoying that I didn't turn CC off when the sound came back, just in case the dialog disappeared again. With an easy toggle, I could turn it off and back on anytime I needed it. 

D*, time to get this one crossed off the list.


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## personman (Apr 24, 2007)

quickfire said:


> Do you guy's think D* would respond with an actual letter thru e-mail about CC info if one of us here were to insert a link to this CC thread???


No, it wouldn't.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Well I sent a nice and very friendly e-mail request to D* with this thread link....and believe it or not was emailed back within the hour from someone called Angelo B...that actually told me that he had fowarded the my email to someone that would have more knowledge with software for the HR20......that was his exact words!........I'll post back if and when D* contacts me!!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

rbean said:


> Don't know what everyone is fussin' about it doesn't take 23 button pushes to get CC on it's only 14.:nono: THS IS RIDICULOUS for a function as important as CC


15?....I takes me 23 steps to complete the sequence!!!


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## waynenm (Oct 31, 2006)

This issue has been around for WAY too long. One button to CC, please!


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## rbean (Jan 12, 2007)

quickfire said:


> 15?....I takes me 23 steps to complete the sequence!!!


I'm on vacation right now and away from my HR20 so I can't verify number but just before I left I pretty sure I counted 14 pushes but will check myself in about a week when I get home. Just turned 60 and the memory is the second thing to go.


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

quickfire said:


> Well I sent a nice and very friendly e-mail request to D* with this thread link....and believe it or not was emailed back within the hour from someone called Angelo B...that actually told me that he had fowarded the my email to someone that would have more knowledge with software for the HR20......that was his exact words!........I'll post back if and when D* contacts me!!!!


Thank you for doing that:up:


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Giddy up.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Here's the response from a tech in the escalations department......................

Subject 
CC takes 23 button commands to turn on or off!!!

Discussion Thread 
Response (AW Anna D) 10/07/2007 11:01 PM 
Dear Mr. ------aka quckfire,

Thank you for writing. I see that you have been a DIRECTV customer since February of 1997; your long time loyalty and business are appreciated. I would be glad to address your concerns about the closed captioning process on the HR20.

I know that there are several DIRECTV customer's who use this forum to talk about their satellite service. I would like to thank you for bringing this to our attention. I can forward your suggestion to the right people, however, I can not make a guarantee as to whether or not something will be changed. I know that it can be frustrating to have to go through so many menus and options in order to turn your Closed Captioning on and off.

I would encourage you to keep offering suggestions to us, and to encourage other customers who wish different features to be added or changed to also let us know. The more people that ask, the better chances of a change happening. DIRECTV likes to try and provide the best Customer Service and programming available, and will continue to make changes and add/change features to our equipment based on that.

Thanks again for writing, we appreciate your patience and understanding.

Sincerely,

Anna D.
Y4033
DIRECTV Customer Service

Make the most of DIRECTV by registering your account on directv.com. You'll learn about exclusive online promotions, new features of DIRECTV and the latest programs and packages. Visit www.directv.com/register today. 
Customer 10/07/2007 04:10 PM 
DIRECTV FEEDBACK MESSAGE

Name: .............quickfire
Status: 
[Account Number: 
[Phone Number: 
Email Address: QUICKFIREemail]
[Topic Selected: Suggestions]

quote:I have been a Happy HR20 owner but I often go to a web site called DBStalk....and stumbled upon this specific thread would you please take time and read it there are so many Loyal D customers that want this to be fixed with a simple button or quick toggle on and off.....it takes to long ....23 button commands to get to it...---- link [URL]http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=98889[/URL]


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

On a side not:: I thought I had been with D* since March 12th 1996.........I have receipts that are dated in July 1996!!!! Somethings wrong in the data system.......

Anyways back on topic.......If the people on this forum keep demanding that this be fixed...I personelly believe D* will finally take our request serious ...and to fix it!!!!!

We CANNOT let this thread fade away!!!!!!!

I will not let it happen myself......the way I look at it if D* can add a ON DEMAND button to the quick menu...then they can add a CC selection button also!!

Come on D*......do this for us PLEASE!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

rbean...just checked the sequence and its 18 steps to turn CC on or off......BUTTT it takes another 5 steps to get back to live TV......I know that you can push exit once you have selected On or Off....but if you program a universal remote ...it is indeed 23 steps!!!!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

quickfire said:


> rbean...just checked the sequence and its 18 steps to turn CC on or off......BUTTT it takes another 5 steps to get back to live TV......I know that you can push exit once you have selected On or Off....but if you program a universal remote ...it is indeed 23 steps!!!!


Actually, it can be done in 13 steps.  /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Steve said:


> Actually, it can be done in 13 steps.  /steve


Here are the steps I programmed for my remote.......

#1 push Menu
#2 navigate to help & settings
#3 push select button
#4 navigate to setup
#5 push select
#6 navigate to display---->>>>(Thats 5 steps)
#7 push select
#8 navigate to preference then to captioning---->>>(2 steps)
#9 push select
#10 select either on or off
#11 push select
#12 navigate back to help & settings menu by moving left 
#13 navigate to done----->>> (thats 4 steps)
#14 push select
#15 THEN  push exit!!!!!

23 steps for me!!!!!!Thats is TOOOOOOO many steps just to turn On CC!!!!!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

*QF*, try this if you have Music and Photos or VOD enabled:


MENU
Down (if you have Music and Photos or On Demand)
Down
Audio Options
Up
Edit Settings
Left
Down
Display
Green button
Select
Down
Select
Exit

14 steps, 13 without Music or VOD. 15 if you have both. Doing it from memory, but I think I have it right. /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Steve said:


> *QF*, try this if you have Music and Photos or VOD enabled:
> 
> 
> MENU
> ...


WOW........I will use this process from now on..........BUT D* still needs to fix it to were it's 1 or 2 button to activate CC don't you think??

But 13 steps is quicker that 23.......remember it's 23 steps IF you program a universal remote which most of us here use!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Steve said:


> *QF*, try this if you have Music and Photos or VOD enabled:
> 
> 
> MENU
> ...


WOW........I will use this process from now on..........BUT D* still needs to fix it to were it's 1 or 2 button to activate CC don't you think??

But 13 steps is quicker that 17.......remember it's 23 steps ONLY IF you program a universal remote which most of us here use!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

13 or 17 or 23.....I think we all agree its to many steps??


D* could have made this so easy on all of us.....IF they would have added a CC button on all of there remotes....thats a MAJOR flaw by not adding a CC BUTTON if you ask me!!!!

LOOK I don't want to have to use a series of commands with my remote in order to toggle CC on or off......I would like to push men--- select CC button---turn it on or off <<<<---it should be that simple!!!!!.......that is not only wanted by US here in this forum but by many average/normal D* customer's that aren't aware of this forum and don't follow all of the upgrades of software and such....don't you think???


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

Quickfire, 

So you know, I know for a fact that DIRECTV has seen this thread.

I have no information at this point if anything can or will be done beyond considerations of options.

Cheers,
Tom


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

bump


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

I think D* will fix this for us ...as to when who knows......hopefully sooner rather than later.


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## Jerry Lundegaard (Sep 25, 2007)

K4SMX said:


> It would be indeed interesting to read D*'s written response if a deaf D* subscriber with non-hearing impaired family members would happen to write a well-worded formal letter to D*'s Customer Service Department which documented their family's difficulty cycling closed captioning on and off. It might specifically inquire whether the current system is in compliance with the Americans With Disabilities Act. I have no idea exactly what's in that Act, but I guarantee you that letter would make it to the legal department, a carefully worded reply would be crafted, and there _would_ be certain conversations with management regarding this issue.


I am hearing impaired and I have to say that (in my opinion) Closed Captioning is specifically not an ADA issue. The FCC is the governmental body that promulgated the regulations pertaining to Closed Captioning for broadcasters, satellite and cable providers, and TV manufacturers. The problem is that the FCC regulations about Closed Captioning only mandate that CC has to be available. The regulations do not say that CC has to be easy or even rational for that matter. That is the problem of resorting to the "legal liability" argument. There is none in my opinion.

My request to DirecTV about CC did not reference anything about ADA, FCC or anything "legal" for that matter. As far as I can tell DirecTV is in complete compliance with all relevant FCC regulations pertaining to CC. What I did was appeal to them to "do the right thing" and make CC more user-friendly. I also mentioned that their primary competitor, Dish Network, already has a more user-friendly method for toggling back and forth from CC. It is bad business practice for DirecTV to not do something about this. I just hope enough people contact DirecTV about this and make them aware of it.


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

Jerry Lundegaard said:


> I am hearing impaired and I have to say that (in my opinion) Closed Captioning is specifically not an ADA issue. The FCC is the governmental body that promulgated the regulations pertaining to Closed Captioning for broadcasters, satellite and cable providers, and TV manufacturers. The problem is that the FCC regulations about Closed Captioning only mandate that CC has to be available. The regulations do not say that CC has to be easy or even rational for that matter. That is the problem of resorting to the "legal liability" argument. There is none in my opinion.
> 
> My request to DirecTV about CC did not reference anything about ADA, FCC or anything "legal" for that matter. As far as I can tell DirecTV is in complete compliance with all relevant FCC regulations pertaining to CC. What I did was appeal to them to "do the right thing" and make CC more user-friendly. I also mentioned that their primary competitor, Dish Network, already has a more user-friendly method for toggling back and forth from CC. It is bad business practice for DirecTV to not do something about this. I just hope enough people contact DirecTV about this and make them aware of it.


Thanks for your informed reply to this thread. We're all just groping around for some way to get someone's attention on this important matter who is in a position to actually do something about it. Certainly your observation about the competition's method of cycling CC on and off should be right up there with major reasons to change. I imagine there are various publications devoted to covering issues effecting the hearing impaired, and I should think D* would not want to be in a position of being down-rated over this issue with any group of folks, large or small. "...Do the right thing," is right. Excellent post and welcome to DBSTalk!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

I did a little googling, and according to http://www.hear-it.org, Hearing Review quoted a study in their July 2005 issue that stated that 31,000,000 Americans were hearing-impaired. Only 23.5% use hearing aids.

The study also stated that almost 15% of "baby boomers" (age 41-69), were hearing impaired.

/steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT------BUMP


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I'm glad to see this thread come back to life because it needs attention. 

If you haven't updated your wish list survey, please do! This deserves to be in the top ten in my opinion and it isn't, don't know why.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

ttt


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

Steve said:


> I did a little googling, and according to http://www.hear-it.org, Hearing Review quoted a study in their July 2005 issue that stated that 31,000,000 Americans were hearing-impaired. Only 23.5% use hearing aids.
> 
> The study also stated that almost 15% of "baby boomers" (age 41-69), were hearing impaired.
> 
> /steve


Does Closed Captioning require more keystrokes than any other feature in the HR20?

- Craig


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

I can't think of any routinely-used feature that uses more keystrokes. It's obvious the D* product design folks didn't envision viewers wanting to use this as a togglable feature, but they were wrong to assume that.

That being said, it's a mistake that's _so_ easy to rectify, however. Come on, D*! /steve


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## milesy20 (Aug 26, 2007)

Bump.

I also found it interesting and immediately recognized it as a UI/Usability design flaw when I first tried to use the CC option on my HR-20. CC should always be a toggle-able feature in the fewest steps possible. IMHO it is much more important than having a top-level Audio Options item.

When they designed the remote control to not have a dedicated CC button, they sealed the fate of the UI that a CC option would be required as a high-level menu item. 

Having to go through a dozen menu operations to get there is just frustrating.


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## theboomslang (Apr 12, 2007)

Just Add an option that CC will turn on when TV is muted. Bam ,done,end of story.

I stay up later than my wife and she doesnt want sound so CC is the best alternative.


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## lucky13 (Nov 27, 2006)

theboomslang said:


> Just Add an option that CC will turn on when TV is muted. Bam ,done,end of story.
> 
> I stay up later than my wife and she doesnt want sound so CC is the best alternative.


That would be fine as an option. But it doesn't solve the problem.

There are times when I want sound and CC, such as when I'm using CC to decipher song lyrics.

There are times I use MUTE to help me avoid a spoiler, such as when I'm recording 2 games are selecting one from the list.

We still need a convenient CC toggle, although an option MUTE = CC ON would be a good addition.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

lucky13 said:


> We still need a convenient CC toggle, although an option MUTE = CC ON would be a good addition.


The MUTE "IR CODE" varies, depending on what TV or audio receiver you are trying to mute. The HR20 has no way of sensing a "MUTE" command, since it is intended for another device. /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

BUMP........


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## personman (Apr 24, 2007)

Stop bumping.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

personman said:


> Stop bumping.


Do you want a 1 or 2 button CC option???

If so then this thread has to be keeped alive so that everybody that see's this thread has an oppurtunity to ask for this CC option..........it's already been noted that D* is aware of this thread and watch it daily!!!!!!


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

Absolutely - the more voices added to this thread to request quick access to CC, the better.


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## waynenm (Oct 31, 2006)

Drew2k said:


> Absolutely - the more voices added to this thread to request quick access to CC, the better.


I agree that "quick access" is sorely needed. A 2-button solution would be fine. The sooner, the better!


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## cuibap (Sep 14, 2006)

when are they going to do it? I need it NOW


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## spunkyvision (Oct 12, 2006)

2 Things about CC
1. Yes I want it a simple solution to turn on, one or 2 button pushes.
2. Most importantly I want it to work and I find it still does not perform as well as any other unit I have. Garbled words mostly.


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## kenmoo (Oct 3, 2006)

spunkyvision said:


> 2 Things about CC
> 1. Yes I want it a simple solution to turn on, one or 2 button pushes.
> 2. Most importantly I want it to work and I find it still does not perform as well as any other unit I have. Garbled words mostly.


Amen to #1. Amen to #2....there are several threads that have recent comments on garbled and misplaced CC. Try this. On a program that has bad garbled CC and part Spanish CC, after watching it, "keep it", go back to the beginning and then re-watch it for awhile again. In at least half to 2/3's of my re-watched MPEG4 HD programs the CC is no longer garbled or has Spanish in it? It's near perfect the 2nd time but placement is still off. Now how can that be if it's the same recording??


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## the_tango (Sep 26, 2007)

I use CC all the time - Its a one button on my TV - But that does NOT work with DTV. Make it a 1 button option!!!!


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## Pauley (Oct 16, 2007)

I agree, I would like it to be a quick option.

One thing I haven't seen mentioned is my wife's biggest complaint. The HR20 does not show the CC while fast forwarding. She would tape her soaps and get through one of them in about 15 minutes using this method on the Tivo.

Pauley


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## kmkraft_1974 (Feb 13, 2006)

add me to the list  one button CC please


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Here are three CC toggles I could live with:

*Option 1:* Assign CC's to the YELLOW AUDIO SAP button.

If there is no SAP on the current program:_ One YELLOW BUTTON click would turn CC's ON or OFF, depending on the current state of CC.
_
If there is SAP, then each click would be:_ CC/ON or OFF (depending on current state), SAP ON or OFF (depending on current state), SAP CC/ON or OFF (if applicable). The button should "time out" so that after a few seconds, clicking the YELLOW button restarts the cycle from the beginning.
_
So one click of the YELLOW BUTTON toggles CCs on or off, no matter what the SAP availability is for a particular program. It would now take one extra-click to enable SAP, however.

*Option 2: *Use the DOWN ARROW to toggle CC's ON/OFF, since it's currently unused during RECORDING playback or LIVE TV. If someone hits it accidentally, it's easy enough to hit it again.

*Option 3:* Put either "CC ON" or "CC OFF" on the first page of the QUICK menu, depending on current CC state.

/steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Steve said:


> Here are three CC toggles I could live with:
> 
> *Option 1:* Assign CC's to the YELLOW AUDIO SAP button.
> 
> ...


I'll take either one of the options!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

B U M P!!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

keeping it alive....


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## n3ntj (Dec 18, 2006)

I vote YES for Closed Captioning in Quick Menu!


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## Martian946 (Oct 13, 2007)

Hey guys


I have been lurking around here for some time but htis is the first issue I have felt the urge to get involved in. My wife is hearing impaired but I am not. However I have gotten so used to the cc that I cant watch without it. when a program is not captioned I don't watch. I didn't realize how many people around here were like me. This is important for all of us and hopefully this thread and others like it will make directv understand that a large part of there customer base wants this. I leave it on all the time but sometimes I just want to change the font or something for variety. A quick selection on the menu would be appreciated. 

Ray


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## MeSue (Oct 7, 2007)

*I'd also like to see a quicker way to turn CC on and off. * We don't keep CC on all the time but like to toggle it on for times when we miss a bit of dialog, or when we are watching something where there are heavy accents.

While we are waiting for DirecTV to get this fixed, is there any workaround that can be done with a Harmony remote? I don't have one yet, but plan to buy one this week.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

bump


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## ronrico51 (Feb 13, 2007)

MeSue said:


> *I'd also like to see a quicker way to turn CC on and off. * We don't keep CC on all the time but like to toggle it on for times when we miss a bit of dialog, or when we are watching something where there are heavy accents.
> 
> While we are waiting for DirecTV to get this fixed, is there any workaround that can be done with a Harmony remote? I don't have one yet, but plan to buy one this week.


You can do it with the harmony 880, but it's not for the faint of heart. You have to create a new activity, enter all the steps into it. I have it on mine. I followed the advice of someone else here on how to do it, I can't remember who.

Why bother with having a poll about CC, or putting it on the wishlist. How's the number 1 item on the wishlist coming along?


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Giddy up.


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## MeSue (Oct 7, 2007)

ronrico51 said:


> How's the number 1 item on the wishlist coming along?


I've voted in the wish-list, but is there somewhere we can go to see how items are ranked in the wish-list priority?


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## ChiWavDave (Jul 13, 2007)

I've lurked on this site for a long time, patiently waiting and learning and preparing for the one chance I have to bring my household into an HD world. (We have huge WAF issues here). Anywho, as I continue to build my dream configuration, I thought the need to jump in here. I had no idea that you couldnt use the cc on the TV/mute with HD DTV, like we do with analog Dtivo and our tube TV. Being hard of hearing, I mostly use a headset to watch, but there are times where the cc is critical and I use it often, the inability to be able to quickly toggle the cc on and off (who wants to watch the cc on a live show, or sports that lag behind so bad) is mandatory for me. I absolutely will not be able to make this transition until a 1 or 2 button cc toggle is activated. I never thought this would be my first post topic. thanks

dave


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

ChiWavDave said:


> I've lurked on this site for a long time, patiently waiting and learning and preparing for the one chance I have to bring my household into an HD world. (We have huge WAF issues here). Anywho, as I continue to build my dream configuration, I thought the need to jump in here. I had no idea that you couldn't use the cc on the TV/mute with HD DTV, like we do with analog Dtivo and our tube TV. Being hard of hearing, I mostly use a headset to watch, but there are times where the cc is critical and I use it often, the inability to be able to quickly toggle the cc on and off (who wants to watch the cc on a live show, or sports that lag behind so bad) is mandatory for me. I absolutely will not be able to make this transition until a 1 or 2 button cc toggle is activated. I never thought this would be my first post topic. thanks
> 
> dave


:welcome_s

I hope that the needs of people with disabilities will be a top priority.

You can voice your issues directly to the developers here:

HR20-700 0x1B4 Issues / Discussion

Maybe if you can just help them to understand what it is like to be hearing impaired?

We have been told that they think in a hearing impaired household, you would buy a DVR, turn on Closed Captioning once and never set it again. Could you help them to understand what it is like to be hearing impaired in a hearing world?

All of us must never stop echoing your voice.

- Craig


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

MeSue said:


> I've voted in the wish-list, but is there somewhere we can go to see how items are ranked in the wish-list priority?


If you choose "view results" on the Wish List, you will see how items rank within their category. Or, you can select "All Categories Combined" at the top of that page, and see the overall ranking of each request.

And of course, for those others who haven't yet taken the Wish List survey, please do and let D* know how you value each request. TIA. /steve


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

ronrico51 said:


> You can do it with the harmony 880, but it's not for the faint of heart. You have to create a new activity, enter all the steps into it. I have it on mine. ...


How do you do it?

- Craig


----------



## annenoe (Oct 11, 2006)

jwd45244 said:


> The UI is getting much better. DTV has On Demand in the Quick Menu. Please add Close Captioning to it. Enabling CC should not be as hard as it is.


Totally agree. I don't like keeping it on all the time (due to HD crap captions and stupid placement) but have hearing issues and sometimes just want to back up, turn on CC and rerun a scene. Instead, I keep it on all the time which is highly annoying due to crappy service.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Milominderbinder2 said:


> How do you do it?
> 
> - Craig


Well, I haven't done it, but I'm assuming that you set up a CC activity (like Watch TV, or Watch DVD) and that activity runs through the 15 (or whatever) steps to turn CC on and off.

It would work, but not very elegantly as it would take a bit of time for the remote to activate all those "presses" and if one didn't "catch" you might be stuck in the menus somewhere.


----------



## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

spartanstew said:


> Well, I haven't done it, but I'm assuming that you set up a CC activity (like Watch TV, or Watch DVD) and that activity runs through the 15 (or whatever) steps to turn CC on and off.
> 
> It would work, but not very elegantly as it would take a bit of time for the remote to activate all those "presses" and if one didn't "catch" you might be stuck in the menus somewhere.


Thats what happens to my wife just about every single time she tries to use the macro function with my remote......I'm tired of having to reset the TV inputs!!!!!!

And so is the WIFEEEE!!!


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

MeSue said:


> *I'd also like to see a quicker way to turn CC on and off. * We don't keep CC on all the time but like to toggle it on for times when we miss a bit of dialog, or when we are watching something where there are heavy accents.
> 
> While we are waiting for DirecTV to get this fixed, is there any workaround that can be done with a Harmony remote? I don't have one yet, but plan to buy one this week.





ronrico51 said:


> You can do it with the harmony 880, but it's not for the faint of heart. You have to create a new activity, enter all the steps into it. I have it on mine. I followed the advice of someone else here on how to do it, I can't remember who.


I hadn't thought of the Activity solution before - I like it, though, and it would work - but I have another one that does give you one button cc. You need another good remote like a Pronto to do it, in addition to the Harmony. You put mini-macros in the Pronto and then have the Harmony learn those mini-macros. They are then put in a sequence. It is cumbersome to program but it does work.

I posted my solution here.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

Doug Brott said:


> My only statement was that most households are going to be happy with it either on or off and in these situations the length of time to make a change is negligible because you do it once (or rarely). In households where one person likes it on and another likes it off the change can be burdensome for sure.
> 
> I think it probably should go in the audio menu.


My experience is the latter is much more common than the former. You have households where only one person wants or needs closed captioning. Or maybe they need it just part of the time. My experience is that outside of nursing homes and bars, closed captioning is always toggled on and off, not left on all the time.

And as to this option being voted on by a poll, that's totally bogus. Closed captioning is used mostly by the old and the infirmed, two groups not likely to fill out Internet polls. If we were relying on the outcome of Internet polls, the Health and Disabilities Act would have never been passed. It is time for DirecTV to do what's right for needy members of the community, not what is popular.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Throw us a bone D*...please!!!!


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## Pauley (Oct 16, 2007)

I like some of Steve's functions, but I think this is a good solution:

Use the Mute button.
First Press - Mute
Second Press - Mute w/Captions
Third Press - No Mute w/Captions
Fourth Press - normal

Now, there would be a time limit, so that after about 10 seconds of not hitting the mute button, it just toggles the audio. Thus, if you press it the first time, you mute. If you press after 10 seconds, then it un-mutes with no captions. Maybe too confusing for some people.


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

ggergm said:


> .....Closed captioning is used mostly by the old and the infirmed......


Dang! I'd better stock up on the Geritol. Meanwhile, I'll just be another frustrated member of the non-hearing impaired who toggle CC all the time. CC is used by a much wider group and for more reasons than your statement indicates, which is all the more reason to solve this problem for not only "the old and the infirm" who share a TV with people who are not, but also all the rest of us who regularly use it for any of the many reasons already posted in this thread.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Pauley said:


> I like some of Steve's functions, but I think this is a good solution:
> 
> Use the Mute button.
> First Press - Mute
> ...


Problem with MUTE is that, by design, it is a "device" key and not an HR20 key. The Mute IR signal varies, depending on which TV or Audio Receiver you have it programmed for, and is ignored by the HR20. /steve


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

K4SMX, you really did miss my point all together. I think DirecTV should have one button closed captioning not only for the convenience of people like you, and I did read through this thread, but because it is the socially responsible thing to do for impared members of the community.

I'm on your side of this debate. I think we have a stronger argument making it a moral one rather than a convenience one.

As for who uses closed captioning, all I can go by is my experience in setting up TVs for customers and who has requested closed captioning.


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## Kishore (Feb 11, 2007)

I am also very frustrated with the way of enabling/disabling CC. I don't have it on always, but when I cannot understand the accent in the audio or for some programs like Jeopardy I would like to enable it and it takes lot of steps to do that. This is one thing I hate most about my HR20. I wish DirecTV will fix it soon.


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

Steve said:


> Problem with MUTE is that, by design, it is a "device" key and not an HR20 key. The Mute IR signal varies, depending on which TV or Audio Receiver you have it programmed for, and is ignored by the HR20. /steve


Steve - I wonder if it wouldn't be impossible to update the firmware so that when MUTE is pressed it can detect it, much like the POWER key sends one command to the HR20 and another to the TV. Of course, if the remote itself can not send two IR signals from MUTE, well - that's a different story.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Drew2k said:


> Steve - I wonder if it wouldn't be impossible to update the firmware so that when MUTE is pressed it can detect it, much like the POWER key sends one command to the HR20 and another to the TV. Of course, if the remote itself can not send two IR signals from MUTE, well - that's a different story.


Agree, if the remote was designed to do that on day one. Sending all those remotes back to D* for a firmware upgrade at this point would not only be a huge PITA, but a very expensive proposition as well.

Assuming "mute" is the best solution for the CC toggle (and I don't think it is, personally), another option would be to move the mute function away from the TV/receiver and mute the HR20's internal audio output instead. But in that case, volume control would have to be given over to the HR20 as well, since the remote's VOL and MUTE keys are "married" in f/w. Being somewhat of an audiophile, I would not want to see that happen. I want my audio output signal path to my receiver/audio preamp to be as clean as possible. "Fixed" output from the source device usually introduces less harmonic distortion than "variable" output. You also have the added annoyance of having to adjust two volume controls, the HR20's and the TV's or receivers, whenever someone in the house changes one or the other, or when you watch a DVD or play a video game on your home theater setup.

Just my .02. /steve


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

I also don't think MUTE is the best choice for CC, but I just wanted to explore whether or not it was possible. Given your explanations, I would say even if it was possible, it's not worth it.

So ... back to YELLOW and a pop-up menu, or adding CC to the Quick Menu. 

Make it so, DIRECTV!


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

Drew2k said:


> I also don't think MUTE is the best choice for CC, but I just wanted to explore whether or not it was possible. Given your explanations, I would say even if it was possible, it's not worth it.
> 
> So ... back to YELLOW and a pop-up menu, or adding CC to the Quick Menu.
> 
> Make it so, DIRECTV!


I like that. Yellow, yellow, make it so!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Or yellow as a toggle... CC ON, SAP (if available), SAP CC (if available).

Or.... up ARROW! It's not doing anything else, ATM.  /steve


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## K4SMX (May 19, 2007)

ggergm said:


> K4SMX, you really did miss my point all together.....


No, it was very clear the first time, and you were totally correct:



ggergm said:


> ....... It is time for DirecTV to do what's right for needy members of the community, not what is popular.


----------



## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

bump


----------



## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

This is becoming something of a sit-in or a peace rally.

We should start chanting and singing.

_We shall overcome, we shall overcome,
We shall overcome some day
Oh, deep in my heart, I do believe we shall overcome some day_

Where are Peter, Paul and Mary?

- Craig


----------



## cuibap (Sep 14, 2006)

please


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT


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## jwd45244 (Aug 18, 2006)

As the original poster of this thread, it is heartening to see of all of the agreement around doing something better for Close Captioning. No name-calling or insults, just people agreeing that DTV can do better and proposing ideas on how that could be done.

I applaud the DBSTalkers who have taken up this cause. I just hope DTV does something to improve this soon.

If any of our folks with contacts con the "inside" could help pass on our agreement around this, maybe we can get some traction around a real solution.

There are a number of very good ideas in this thread. 

Please DTV, this is one case where it is not about dollars, it is about doing the right thing.


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## ram4784 (Oct 17, 2006)

I'm glad to see this thread is still active "after all these years". Any "one button" solution would be greatly appreciated. Keep on, keeping on.:hurah:


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## jwd45244 (Aug 18, 2006)

bump


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

I'm going to resend this thread to D* tomorrow!!!!


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## mikek (May 18, 2007)

I hope they fix the CC to a one button solution, but I don't think the MUTE is the right way to go.

#1, as previously stated, MUTE is for the TV or audio receivers.

#2. I don't want my audio muted while I use CC.

I normally use it to figure out a word or 2 that I didn't understand. I still want to hear the audio while I am doing that.

If my TV did CC through component or HDMI then I wouldn't even worry about this problem. I would just use the TV's CC.

-mk


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Just resent this thread to D*.....


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

I sent this and was told this thread was passed on to the higher ups at D*.................I'm not sure exacltly who looked at it but D* is aware about D* customer's that are in need of a quick CC option!!!!!


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

quickfire said:


> I sent this and was told this thread was passed on to the higher ups at D*.................I'm not sure exacltly who looked at it but D* is aware about D* customer's that are in need of a quick CC option!!!!!


Good news. I would hope they are planning on implementing an easy solution. I'm not a programmer, but it's got to be easier than DLB.:lol: The question is "Do they want to do this?" It would be great if there was some feedback. Something like "not going to happen" (g*d forbid) or "it will" and "this is the time frame".


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

One would think that if the programmers can add a On Demand button in the quick Menu....it would be just as easy to add a CC button!!!!Wouldn't it???


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## cuibap (Sep 14, 2006)

just want to keep this alive...


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## jwd45244 (Aug 18, 2006)

quickfire said:


> One would think that if the programmers can add a On Demand button in the quick Menu....it would be just as easy to add a CC button!!!!Wouldn't it???


No, putting on a Software driven menu is just that software. Putting a button on a remote is hardware and manufacturing (night and day different)


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

jwd45244 said:


> No, putting on a Software driven menu is just that software. Putting a button on a remote is hardware and manufacturing (night and day different)


I think *quickfire* meant to say _option _instead of _button _in his original post.  /steve


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Steve said:


> I think *quickfire* meant to say _option _instead of _button _in his original post.  /steve


YOU SIR are CORRECT!!!

I wish any D* insider that belongs to this site would let us know if a CC option is being considered for any CE or regular software update in the near future!!


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

TTT......

D* are you listening??


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Thought I would bring this thread back to life!!!


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## m4p (Apr 12, 2007)

I'm glad you did, Quickfire. I would love it if Directv would implement an easy access closed-captioning!


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 21, 2007)

I'd also like to see it a little easier to access (plus maybe make the remote response a little more predictable so I can use a macro reliably).


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## captdusty (Jul 13, 2006)

Adding my voice to the chorus. While she's nowhere near old and infirm, my wife's hearing is going, but mine most certainly is not...yet. PLEEEEEASE, DirecTV, give me an easier way to let her in on the dialog I'm enjoying without shredding my center speaker or my own eardrums, thus making the CC option all the more necessary, and round and round, ad infinitum. 

(Is there an emoticon for being on one's hands and knees, or perhaps one with pleading, Precious Moments, puppydog eyes?)


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

I Will Continue To Try My Best To Not Let This Thread Die!


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## Rpbertxyz (Feb 22, 2006)

quickfire said:


> I Will Continue To Try My Best To Not Let This Thread Die!


Thank You Quickfire.


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## JokerStick (Oct 22, 2006)

This needs to happen, as posted several times over the last couple of years.

Similarly, why am I paying 4.99 for a movie on 136HD tonigth (Evan Almighty) that says it has CC, and yet there is nothing? Tried all 6 digital services...zilch.


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

_We shall overcome, we shall overcome,
We shall overcome some day
Oh, deep in my heart, I do believe we shall overcome some day_

- Craig


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## w3syt (Feb 17, 2006)

Yes, it needs to be toggled easily. (age 73)


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## w3syt (Feb 17, 2006)

Yes, and it is not showing on PPVH.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Keeping it alive


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

H O L Y.....CRAPPPPPP.......DirecTv has given us a 2 button Close Captioning option!!!!!

DirecTv....is listening to us here at DBSTalk!!!

Man I'm so happy for all of those that was in need of the quick CC option......

UHHHHH.....MiloMinderBender2...now you can finish the song....LOL


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

OH by the way......I want to give a BIG THANK YOU to DirecTv manangement and to the Software Developers!!


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

Shhhhh....

What happens in CE stays in CE....


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## Milominderbinder2 (Oct 8, 2006)

Thank you.

- Craig


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

WOOHOO.


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## Rpbertxyz (Feb 22, 2006)

Thank You

Bob H.


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 21, 2007)

I am guessing this is part of a CE not yet sent down to the HR20-100s?


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

LlamaLarry said:


> I am guessing this is part of a CE not yet sent down to the HR20-100s?


HR20-700 WITH THE NEW....CE!!

This Ce should be pushed to a National release as soon as possible...theres to many GREAT things about this CE that all HR-** can use!!!!


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

Please visit the CE forum for information about participating in the CE program and the risks associated with using "test" software.


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 21, 2007)

quickfire said:


> This Ce should be pushed to a National release as soon as possible...theres to many GREAT things about this CE that all HR-** can use!!!!


Cool, I will definitely keep an eye out for when it becomes available as either a CE or NR for the -100's. I know the wife and kids will appreciate being able to easily turn them off when they watch TV without me.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Well looks like this thread can finally be layed to rest!!!!

We now have a very quick CC option for the HR20-700 with the new CE!!!!!

I would think that DirecTv would want to get this CE released nationally as soon as possible!!!

Yes this CE is that GOOD!!!


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

quickfire said:


> Well looks like this thread can finally be layed to rest!!!!
> 
> We now have a very quick CC option for the HR20-700 with the new CE!!!!!
> 
> ...


Quickfire, I know you're excited about this and want it to go to others as soon as possible, as do I, but please don't raise hopes or expectations that this will be available in a national release any time soon. The last national release for the HR20 was based on CE Cycle 9, which had 10 or 11 individual CE releases to the testers during the cycle. The current CE cycle, number 10, contains many ambitious updates and new features, and as such, will require quite a bit of testing, and we are only in the fourth CE release for this cycle. It may be awhile before this goes national.

For anyone with questions about this CC feature or the CE program in general, please continue all discussion about CE features in the Cutting Edge forum. If anyone is interested in being a CE tester, please make sure you read the Sticky at the top of the forum about what the CE program is about, including the risks associated with using test software.


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## quickfire (Nov 14, 2003)

Drew2k said:


> Quickfire, I know you're excited about this and want it to go to others as soon as possible, as do I, but please don't raise hopes or expectations that this will be available in a national release any time soon. The last national release for the HR20 was based on CE Cycle 9, which had 10 or 11 individual CE releases to the testers during the cycle. The current CE cycle, number 10, contains many ambitious updates and new features, and as such, will require quite a bit of testing, and we are only in the fourth CE release for this cycle. It may be awhile before this goes national.
> 
> For anyone with questions about this CC feature or the CE program in general, please continue all discussion about CE features in the Cutting Edge forum. If anyone is interested in being a CE tester, please make sure you read the Sticky at the top of the forum about what the CE program is about, including the risks associated with using test software.


Drew2k...you couldn't be more correct with your response..........

After posting last night...I had 2 picture FREEZE's....and 1 this morning!!

I've never had any problems up until now with any CE!!

But ......if DirecTv can work out the bug's......then this CE would make a GREAT national release....


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## Dan1 (Jul 25, 2007)

I am new to HR20, but Close Caption issue is really bothering me. It doesn't pass thru to the TV so I can't turn it on or off with the TV remote and requires several remote presses on HR20 to turn it on/off. They should either make one of the colored buttons toggle it or put it on the quick menu!


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Dan1 said:


> I am new to HR20, but Close Caption issue is really bothering me. It doesn't pass thru to the TV so I can't turn it on or off with the TV remote and requires several remote presses on HR20 to turn it on/off. They should either make one of the colored buttons toggle it or put it on the quick menu!


I'm happy to be able to report to you that the quick-access to CC issue has been virtually resolved in the latest HR20-700 beta software.

When watching LIVE TV or a recording, the Yellow button brings up a menu that allows you to quickly toggle CC's on and off.

Hopefully this s/w release will go national (with the CC toggle still in place) soon for the HR20-700, at least. My guess would be before the end of the month, but I have no way of knowing this for sure.

/steve


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## namja (Jan 8, 2007)

I was on Directv hiatus for 4 months (moving; issues with line of sight), but now I'm back. I was hoping that the CC would have been "fixed" by now, but alas, I still have to jump through hoops to turn CC on/off.

I like having CC on for sitcom/dramas/movies/news and CC off for sports. So I toggle CC on/off a lot.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

namja said:


> I was on Directv hiatus for 4 months (moving; issues with line of sight), but now I'm back. I was hoping that the CC would have been "fixed" by now, but alas, I still have to jump through hoops to turn CC on/off.
> 
> I like having CC on for sitcom/dramas/movies/news and CC off for sports. So I toggle CC on/off a lot.


If you have an HR20-700, you shouldn't have to wait too long for a pretty nice resolution to this issue.  See my post right above yours. /steve


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## namja (Jan 8, 2007)

Awesome. Looking forward to it. Thanks Steve.


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