# Three genies in one room



## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

I am planning a media room that will have three TV's in it so I'll need three Genie minis in the room. Is there a way to have three Minis in one room so that they can all be independently controlled by remote control?


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Run the remotes in RF mode, no problem at all doing that way.


Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

If all the TVs are the same brand each time you change the volume on one of them it will probably change all 3 of them.


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

jimmie57 said:


> If all the TVs are the same brand each time you change the volume on one of them it will probably change all 3 of them.


I'm not going to have the audio on for all three TV's at the same time, so this isn't going to be an issue.



RAD said:


> Run the remotes in RF mode, no problem at all doing that way.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk


Then I assume I can use a programmable RF remote to control all three with one?

Any problem with extending this further, putting all 8 Minis in a closet and controlling them individually with RF remotes in different rooms? I've never needed to use an RF remote before, what's the range?


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

You can only have three Genie clients (minis) active at one time....


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

texasbrit said:


> You can only have three Genie clients (minis) active at one time....


I know. But you can have 8 clients connected at the same time. So my question is a valid one.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

If running RF then you must use the DIRECTV remote at this time if it's a C41/C41W mini client, it uses a different RF standard then the C31's.

And while you can have up to 8 clients authorized on a Genie it's still only three clients can be powered up and being used at one time, or three streams to other STB's like H2X's or HR2X's that are whole home DVR authorized.


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

RAD said:


> If running RF then you must use the DIRECTV remote at this time if it's a C41/C41W mini client, it uses a different RF standard then the C31's.
> 
> And while you can have up to 8 clients authorized on a Genie it's still only three clients can be powered up and being used at one time, or three streams to other STB's like H2X's or HR2X's that are whole home DVR authorized.


Say what? So if I have three mini clients in one room then I will have to use three separate DTV remotes? And if I have a universal RF remote I can't program it to control the mini's? If this is the only way it will work then this is crap.

What is the range of the RF remote?


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## damondlt (Feb 27, 2006)

uscpsycho said:


> Say what? So if I have three mini clients in one room then I will have to use three separate DTV remotes? And if I have a universal RF remote I can't program it to control the mini's? If this is the only way it will work then this is crap.
> 
> What is the range of the RF remote?


I'm almost positive a you can operate 3 seperate receivers with one remote.

I think you just program the other 2 in AV1 and AV2.
But like rad stated I believe they have to be c31s because they use the older remotes.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

uscpsycho said:


> So if I have three mini clients in one room then I will have to use three separate DTV remotes?


If your plan is to control them with DIRECTV remotes via RF, then yes, you'll need three remotes. If you're willing to install and configure a third party universal remote that communicates RF with IR emitters, you can control all three with that remote with the minis operated via IR mode.


> And if I have a universal RF remote I can't program it to control the mini's?


AFAIK, universal remotes that can do the RC71 RF protocol (RF4CE) are not yet available.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

You might also consider using H25 receivers rather than Genie minis. They will work fine both for showing live TV as well as streaming recordings from the Genie. The only thing they don't have is a live buffer on live TV. Another option would be to use HR2x DVRs, each of which can also stream recordings from each other or the Genie, as well as have their own tuners and buffers for live TV.

This approach will also let you go beyond the 3 client limitation.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

damondlt said:


> I'm almost positive a you can operate 3 seperate receivers with one remote.
> 
> I think you just program the other 2 in AV1 and AV2.
> But like rad stated I believe they have to be c31s because they use the older remotes.
> ...


You can use the older remotes with the C41/C41W, but only in IR mode, not RF.

If you went the AV1/AV2 route then you would need to use the older remotes since the new RC71 doesn't have a switch for that.


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

This is a bit frustrating. Definitely one of those times where I wish people who aren't 100 PERCENT sure would refrain from chiming in because I'm getting conflicting answers that are all over the map.

Here is the situation. I'm going to have a Genie plus 8 mini clients all in a closet. None of the minis will be in the same room as the TV. In one room there will be three different TV's connected to three different minis so from that room I need to be able to independently control three minis with ONE remote (preferably a universal remote so I can operate all three with one remote).

Since the Genie & minis are in a closet I'm obviously going to have to communicate with them using an RF remote.

Can someone who is 100 PERCENT sure they know what they are talking about tell me what my options are? Based on the thread so far it sounds like these are my only options.
1) I muse have 8 DirecTV Genie remotes -- including three in one room -- because no third party universal remote can communicate with a Genie or Mini via RF.
2) From the room with three TV's I can use a universal RF remote in combination with an IR blaster in the closet which will let me independently control all three minis. And then in the other rooms I can either use a DirecTV RF remote or I can use a universal remote with IR blasters.

In case #2 is there a practical limit on how many minis I can put in one closet before IR signals from the blaster overlap?



carl6 said:


> You might also consider using H25 receivers rather than Genie minis. They will work fine both for showing live TV as well as streaming recordings from the Genie. The only thing they don't have is a live buffer on live TV. Another option would be to use HR2x DVRs, each of which can also stream recordings from each other or the Genie, as well as have their own tuners and buffers for live TV.
> 
> This approach will also let you go beyond the 3 client limitation.


Now this advice is very interesting.

The H25 solution would be ideal if it had buffers for live TV; I want that so I think the HR2x option is a better solution. This is going to go a little off topic but I'd love some more information about this option. For starters, is the additional monthly fee for additional HR2x DVR's $6 as it is with the mini?

Some other questions I'd love to get answers to. I understand that this eliminates the 3 mini limit, but I assume that if I'm streaming from the Genie itself I'm still limited to three simultaneous streams. Is that right? Does this route still limit me to 8 HR2x DVR's in addition to the Genie or can I have more than 8?

And what about the other DVR's, what is their streaming capacity? If I have a HR2x can I watch something directly from it while another DVR streams something else from it? And if so, how many DVRs can stream from a HR2x at one time?

Can the Genie stream FROM a HR2x?

I already have an HR20 and HR24 which came out way before Genie existed. Are you saying that these can play recordings from each other and play recordings from a Genie? And if so, will this work without a Genie in the mix? Can I play recordings on my HR20 using my HR24 today without a Genie? HOW?

Thanks guys, lots of questions here but very helpful to me and I'm sure this will be helpful to others who have these same questions in the future.


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## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

> The H25 solution would be ideal if it had buffers for live TV; I want that so I think the HR2x option is a better solution. This is going to go a little off topic but I'd love some more information about this option. For starters, is the additional monthly fee for additional HR2x DVR's $6 as it is with the mini?


Yes. The additional fee is $6 regardless of receiver type.



> Some other questions I'd love to get answers to. I understand that this eliminates the 3 mini limit, but I assume that if I'm streaming from the Genie itself I'm still limited to three simultaneous streams. Is that right?


Yes.



> Does this route still limit me to 8 HR2x DVR's in addition to the Genie or can I have more than 8?


A standard Genie install includes a dish with a SWiM LNB. This install has an 8 tuner limit. If you order DVRs instead of mini clients, your tuner count increases quickly, which necessitates using a different LNB capable of feeding one or more SWiM-16s. Each SWiM-16 supports 16 tuners. So as the tuner count grows, the installation becomes more complicated. But there are some users here with very complicated installations. I don't know of a DVR limit per account.



> And what about the other DVR's, what is their streaming capacity? If I have a HR2x can I watch something directly from it while another DVR streams something else from it? And if so, how many DVRs can stream from a HR2x at one time?


HR2x DVRs can only do one outgoing stream at a time. Anything else in the playlist from that DVR is unavailable remotely, but is available directly.



> Can the Genie stream FROM a HR2x?


Yes.



> I already have an HR20 and HR24 which came out way before Genie existed. Are you saying that these can play recordings from each other and play recordings from a Genie? And if so, will this work without a Genie in the mix? Can I play recordings on my HR20 using my HR24 today without a Genie? HOW?


Yes. Yes. Yes. You need Whole-Home DVR added to your account and at the very least your DVRs need to be networked.


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## dennisj00 (Sep 27, 2007)

All HR2xes can stream 1 recorded program while you watch something else. This requires Whole Home and a Deca converter on each HR2x except the 24 where Deca is built in. The monthly fees are the same whether it's a DVR, tuner, genie or mini.

Genies and clients can watch streams from HR2xes on the same DECA cloud.

Your challenge in putting 8 minis in one closet (or 8 dvrs for that matter) is you will only be able to use IR and IR blasters. The RF of the 44 Genie and C4x minis are a new RFCE standard and so far, there's no multi-device or universal RF remote.


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

David Ortiz said:


> Yes. Yes. Yes. You need Whole-Home DVR added to your account and at the very least your DVRs need to be networked.


When you say the DVR's need to be networked, you just mean connected to my LAN, the same way I connect the DVR to my network to use DIRECTV2PC or to remotely program the DVR from my phone. There is nothing special, correct?

Another question is remote recording. I understand that if I set something to record using a Mini it will always be recorded to the Genie. But if I am using DVR #4 to watch something from DVR #2, can I also schedule something to record on DVR #2 from DVR #4? Or can I only schedule recordings on the "local" DVR?



dennisj00 said:


> All HR2xes can stream 1 recorded program while you watch something else. This requires Whole Home and a Deca converter on each HR2x except the 24 where Deca is built in. The monthly fees are the same whether it's a DVR, tuner, genie or mini.
> 
> Genies and clients can watch streams from HR2xes on the same DECA cloud.
> 
> Your challenge in putting 8 minis in one closet (or 8 dvrs for that matter) is you will only be able to use IR and IR blasters. The RF of the 44 Genie and C4x minis are a new RFCE standard and so far, there's no multi-device or universal RF remote.


Can you explain what you mean by the same DECA cloud? Is there a limit to how many minis and/or DVRs I can put on the same DECA cloud?

I may end up with more than 8 minis or receivers in the closet. Why is this a challenge? Is there going to be IR overlap? Ultimately I think I'm going to have a mix of using DirecTV RF remotes in some rooms and universal remotes in other rooms.

This brings up a different question. With a Genie + Minis I am limited to 8 total clients. If I use DVR's instead of Minis then I can have more than 8 clients. The added benefit of having a DVR at every TV is that I'm not limited to 8 and I have a lot more recording capacity. And the cost of a DVR and Mini is the same. So is there a downside to using all these DVRs instead of minis? Since everything is going into a closet space is not a consideration.


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## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

> When you say the DVR's need to be networked, you just mean connected to my LAN, the same way I connect the DVR to my network to use DIRECTV2PC or to remotely program the DVR from my phone. There is nothing special, correct?


If the HR20 and HR24 are both connected to your LAN, then you would just need Whole-Home DVR activated on your account to start watching the recordings from one on the other. But, this is not the "supported" setup and it may be difficult to get Whole-Home DVR activated. More info: http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/168053-enabling-mrv-using-your-home-networking/



> Another question is remote recording. I understand that if I set something to record using a Mini it will always be recorded to the Genie. But if I am using DVR #4 to watch something from DVR #2, can I also schedule something to record on DVR #2 from DVR #4? Or can I only schedule recordings on the "local" DVR?


A DVR can only schedule recordings for itself. An HD receiver can schedule (but not review, cancel or otherwise manage) recordings for connected DVRs.


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## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

> Can you explain what you mean by the same DECA cloud? Is there a limit to how many minis and/or DVRs I can put on the same DECA cloud?


DECA is the name for DIRECTV's coax networking. It requires some type of SWiM (Single Wire Multiswitch) install and allows the hardware to communicate over coax instead of Ethernet. The DECA cloud would include all of the devices connected to the same coax network. There can be 16 devices or nodes in one cloud.


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

David Ortiz said:


> DECA is the name for DIRECTV's coax networking. It requires some type of SWiM (Single Wire Multiswitch) install and allows the hardware to communicate over coax instead of Ethernet. The DECA cloud would include all of the devices connected to the same coax network. There can be 16 devices or nodes in one cloud.


16 devices, not 16 tuners, correct?

So with 16 devices you're likely to have a boatload of tuners, but it's still possible using the proper LNB.


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## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

> 16 devices, not 16 tuners, correct?
> 
> So with 16 devices you're likely to have a boatload of tuners, but it's still possible using the proper LNB.


Yes and yes, the key word being possible. Having much of the hardware in one location helps, considering that there are limitations on coax length.


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## uscpsycho (Oct 23, 2008)

David Ortiz said:


> If the HR20 and HR24 are both connected to your LAN, then you would just need Whole-Home DVR activated on your account to start watching the recordings from one on the other. But, this is not the "supported" setup and it may be difficult to get Whole-Home DVR activated. More info: http://www.dbstalk.com/topic/168053-enabling-mrv-using-your-home-networking/


What makes my setup unsupported? The lack of a Genie or the lack of using DECAs?


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## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

> What makes my setup unsupported? The lack of a Genie or the lack of using DECAs?


Neither really, although the lack of using DECAs is part of it. A supported install would only have a single connection to your LAN, not Ethernet connections to each DVR/receiver. Approved hardware is required, including SWiM and splitters, as well as external DECAs for pre 24 series boxes.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

There are two ways to network DirecTV equipment. The "specified" / primary / supported method is via coax. This is where the DECA devices come into play. This puts all of the network infrastructure within DirecTVs equipment and support. The "unsupported" method is by connecting individual receivers/DVRs directly to your LAN individually. When you do that, networking between devices is now dependent upon your LAN infrastructure, which DirecTV has no control over. Therefore, they won't support it.

With a DECA/supported network (over coax), there will be one (and only one) connection, someplace (doesn't matter where really) to your LAN/WAN for internet access.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

uscpsycho said:


> 2) From the room with three TV's I can use a universal RF remote in combination with an IR blaster in the closet which will let me independently control all three minis. And then in the other rooms I can either use a DirecTV RF remote or I can use a universal remote with IR blasters.


This is your only option for the three-source room if you want to use a single remote. There's no guarantee you're going to like it; the exercise of switching receivers may be cumbersome and require considerable discipline on the part of the operator.

You tape the blasters in front of the IR sensors on the receivers/streamers in such a way that outside light cannot exit (or enter). In that way, you insure that the light from the emitters doesn't control another receiver (all-important).

I'm not sure why you think you're getting conflicting information. I think the real problem is that you've presented a number of different (and substantially unrelated) issues and people are picking one of them and running with it. I chose the remote issue because it seems like it could be a show-stopper.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

carl6 said:


> When you do that, networking between devices is now dependent upon your LAN infrastructure, which DirecTV has no control over. Therefore, they won't support it.


How much more DIRECTV support does a self-installed DECA setup get than a non-DECA setup?


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## jagrim (Aug 26, 2006)

harsh said:


> I'm not sure why you think you're getting conflicting information. I think the real problem is that you've presented a number of different (and substantially unrelated) issues and people are picking one of them and running with it.


So true. I couldn't have said it better myself.


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