# Problems in setting up networking and MRV



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Skip ahead, if you don't need/want to know the history leading up to my questions.... One month ago I had an old R10 DVR and a ten year old 36" Sony TV that weighed more than an elephant. I wanted to upgrade, but didn't know how to get started. I first bought a 22" Samsung HDTV TV/Monitor on open box sale at Tiger Direct, but it didn't work right, and went off to Samsung for regrooving... nice that it came with a 3-year warranty I didn't even know I had. It's now fixed. Next purchase was a very small Toshiba HDTV for my kitchen, mostly simply to replace a huge ancient blurry TV with something nicer. This was followed by an order from SonyStyle for a refurb XBR7, which arrived a short time before my DirecTV installation was supposed to be started. 

After numerous discussions, the technician arrived and upgraded my dish to something newer (slimline oval multi-LMB I think), and installed an HR24-500. The new DVR worked great. Unfortunately, my old R10 didn't recognize the new dish, and would no longer pick up all the stations I was supposed to receive. After a long discussion, it was decided that I needed to get a new device, in my case a receiver and MRV. They sent me an H24 (not sure if it made a difference or not, but that's what I asked for). Living room was now all set with HR24, and bedroom with H24. Still no MRV yet.

We had a long talk, and someone at DirecTV who was on top of all this, told me that the best option was to replace the new dish system with a SWM, which would provide the ability to have MRV in many rooms. At this point I was thinking I'd be using my old R10 in the kitchen.

The technician arrived yesterday, but needed more parts, so he came back to do all the work today. The dish setup is now SWM. There is an HR24 in the living room, an H24 in the bedroom, and (unexpectedly) a new R16 in the kitchen. MRV seems to work fine with the HR24 and H24. The R16 works fine by itself, but not with the MRV. Apparently DirecTV gave me the R16 in "exchange" for my R10 because they knew my old R10 wouldn't work with the SWM. I'm not sure what "exchange" means, as the R10 is mine, not leased. That's another issue I'm not even thinking about yet.



I've got two questions, one simple, and one a bit more complicated.

Easy question - Why would DirecTV send me a brand new R16? I'm guessing it's because I was getting the SWM, but if they wanted to make sure things were compatible, they should have sent me at least an R22 so it would all be compatible with MRV. I don't know if I should be happy, or frustrated, or ?? If I can get them to approve it, maybe I can get another H24, but I don't want to spend $100 for it when most people seem to get them as a free upgrade.


Next, my main question. For MRV to work, along with "On-Demand", networking needs to be working. The technician seemed to get things set up so the HR24 and H24 are working with each other as they're supposed to, so I think that's OK (but I need to learn more about it). I'm guessing that this means networking is working, but only between the HR24 and H24.

Half an hour after the technician left, i got an error message on the screen telling me there was a problem with the internet connection. 

Is there a good way to do some kind of a test to see how well my internet connection is functioning? Something like a "speed test", and maybe something to verify that download is functioning the way it should?


I should add that when i spoke to a DirecTV support person after this, she told me to wait 24 hours before doing anything else. She also said that if I don't have a download speed of at least 700 mbps, the system won't work. I don't think this was the problem, as my download speed is 4888 kb/s and my upload speed is 411 kb/s.

Any advice? Is there a utility that can tell me all about my internet connection?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

The R-16 is the replacement for the non SWiM receiver/DVR.
The R-22 isn't around anymore, except for old stock. You can request one.
Did they add a DECA to bridge to your home network? You need this for internet access.
To get MRV at all locations, or your "missing" location, that would be an upgrade and additional cost.


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Easy question - Why would DirecTV send me a brand new R16? I'm guessing it's because I was getting the SWM, but if they wanted to make sure things were compatible, they should have sent me at least an R22 so it would all be compatible with MRV. I don't know if I should be happy, or frustrated, or ?? If I can get them to approve it, maybe I can get another H24, but I don't want to spend $100 for it when most people seem to get them as a free upgrade.
> 
> Next, my main question. For MRV to work, along with "On-Demand", networking needs to be working. The technician seemed to get things set up so the HR24 and H24 are working with each other as they're supposed to, so I think that's OK (but I need to learn more about it). I'm guessing that this means networking is working, but only between the HR24 and H24.
> 
> ...


Part of the MRV install is swapping of any equipment that is not SWiM compatible. But it is a like for like free swap. R16 for R10. If you want MRV everywhere, you need to pay to upgrade the R10 to either an H or HR box.


----------



## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

They gave you the R16 because your R10 is not SWM compatable. It is also not MRV capable. You can call and ask for it to be swapped with an R22, but good luck.  I called in when the gave me an R16 and told them I couldn't find the on demand movies like their website showed for SD DVR, and they send me and R22. YMMV.

The R16 is probably a lease. I called into the access card dept to ask about receivers that get replaced when you order MRV and they told me that owned receivers would be replaced with leases in this situation. Did they let you keep the R10?

Did he give you an internet connection for your MRV? For some reason I can't understand, they are making you ask for it and not including it by default. Somewhere near your router you will find a little white box with an ethernet going into the router to describe it simply.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

matt1124 said:


> They gave you the R16 because your R10 is not SWM compatable. It is also not MRV capable. You can call and ask for it to be swapped with an R22, but good luck.  I called in when the gave me an R16 and told them I couldn't find the on demand movies like their website showed for SD DVR, and they send me and R22. YMMV.
> 
> The R16 is probably a lease. I called into the access card dept to ask about receivers that get replaced when you order MRV and they told me that owned receivers would be replaced with leases in this situation. Did they let you keep the R10?
> 
> Did he give you an internet connection for your MRV? For some reason I can't understand, they are making you ask for it and not including it by default. Somewhere near your router you will find a little white box with an ethernet going into the router to describe it simply.


Thanks for the explanation - at least some parts of this now make more sense to me now.

As to internet, they told me that one connection to either the H24 or the HR24 is all I should need, but when the technician left, there were cables from my in-home network plugged into both of them. The technician said one needs to stay plugged in, and the other I can remove.

Yes, the R16 is "leased" as I understand it. My old R10 is "mine". If they were going to send me something to replace the R10, it would have made more sense (to me) to send something that works with MRV, but I guess they're not required to do that. I certainly have no intention to send back something that I own, in exchange for something that is leased.... but the installer didn't say anything about keeping my old R10 anyway.

Where did you find the information you're referring to here: " I called in when the gave me an R16 and told them I couldn't find the on demand movies like their website showed for SD DVR, and they send me and R22. YMMV."?


----------



## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

Yeah, you can't use the H24 or HR24 as an internet bridge when also using the DECA for MRV. That is why it isn't working. That seems to be a common problem with the installers it looks like, and the info he gave you about an ethernet connection like that is wrong, that port is disabled.

You need to call D* and tell them that they did not give you a DECA adapter for your internet connection but they connected a cat5 from your router to the ethernet port of your H/HR24 along with using the DECA functionality at the same time. They should know that you can't do that and send you what you need or send a tech back out.

As for the info about calling and asking where the on demand menu is on the R16 I got that info from real life experience . I didn't know the differences between the models and I was given a R16 at the start. A few days later I remembered seeing the on demand ad on the website and couldn't find how to use it. I called in and they told me I had the wrong model for that and sent me an R22 that showed up like the next day.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

I've never seen a DECA in person, but I just found one to look at on a different website. Does the ethernet cable plug into the DECA? Does it add the internet access to the signal going into the DVR or receiver?

If so, I think I understand what you're telling me - I will call them back tomorrow.



One other thing - I went to my computer and tried to view my network components. Maybe it's just a coincidence, but my TV screen went all white... very strange - and now, I haven't repeated this, in case it's maybe going to damage something. Maybe the screen went white for some other reason.... I don't know that these things are related, but I'm thinking they might be.


----------



## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

Your Hx24 receivers are on what is called a DECA cloud. Hooking up the DECA adapter to the coax that runs back to the dish (again, keeping it simple), powering it with a power inserter, and hooking ethernet up to it from your router will bridge the internet into your cloud. Through the cloud is how your receivers will connect to the internet.

By using the built in DECA in the Hx24, the ethernet port on the receiver gets turned off. It sounds like the tech is trying to use the receiver as its intended use and as the bridge described about at the same time, which can't be done.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Matt, I think you're saying the DECA is a box that will be inserted in the co-ax line going from my DirecTV system and the dish antenna with SWM. I will then take an ethernet cable from my router (actually, my switch) and connect it to the DECA. The DECA will "combine" all this information and send the appropriate things to the appropriate parts of my DVR and receiver. Is this correct?


Second, you're saying that the HR24 has a built-in DECA, but that is not used when the system is set up with a SWM system. True?

I assume that the only time one would plug the ethernet cable into a DVR or receiver, is if one did not have the SWM configuration. 

Apparently I was confused, as was the installer, and the people I recently spoke to at DirecTV were equally confused. 




It's too bad DirecTV doesn't provide any kind of cabling schematic, which might be much more obvious to follow.


----------



## 66stang351 (Aug 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Matt, I think you're saying the DECA is a box that will be inserted in the co-ax line going from my DirecTV system and the dish antenna with SWM. I will then take an ethernet cable from my router (actually, my switch) and connect it to the DECA. The DECA will "combine" all this information and send the appropriate things to the appropriate parts of my DVR and receiver. Is this correct?


No, for any H/HR pre 24 the DECA converts the Coax network to Ethernet. The ethernet out goes to the port on your receiver. You can also add a separate DECA that connects to your router to get internet to your receivers.



mikemyers said:


> Second, you're saying that the HR24 has a built-in DECA, but that is not used when the system is set up with a SWM system. True?


No, the DECA is only used on a SWM system. If you didn't have SWM you would use the ethernet port only instead of a DECA then the ethernet port. The benefit of the HR24 is that you don't need to have an external DECA converting to ethernet then being plugged into the receivers ethernet port.



mikemyers said:


> I assume that the only time one would plug the ethernet cable into a DVR or receiver, is if one did not have the SWM configuration.


All receivers except the H/HR24 will have an ethernet cable plugged in to their ethernet port for any MRV configuration.



mikemyers said:


> Apparently I was confused, as was the installer, and the people I recently spoke to at DirecTV were equally confused.
> 
> It's too bad DirecTV doesn't provide any kind of cabling schematic, which might be much more obvious to follow.


There are diagrams and pictures in the First Look here on DBSTalk. Look at this thread for pics... http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=177308


----------



## wallfishman (Dec 31, 2008)

what the technician was talking about was that one box hooked up like that will make all your boxes respond to directv when pinged therefore he dont have to worry about phone lines. as for internet you should be able to get it on the one its hooked up to. probably DECA Broadband wasnt on your work order so he wasnt getting paid for it so he didnt do it ,,, just a guess


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

wallfishman said:


> what the technician was talking about was that one box hooked up like that will make all your boxes respond to directv when pinged therefore he dont have to worry about phone lines. as for internet you should be able to get it on the one its hooked up to. probably DECA Broadband wasnt on your work order so he wasnt getting paid for it so he didnt do it ,,, just a guess


The technician had recently taken the class on how to do all this. He started on one day, but didn't have something he needed, so came back and spent many hours doing everything the following day. He went far beyond what he was required to do, and even helped me reconfigure the cables for my over-the-air antenna. I've got nothing but praise for the work he did - but he seemed lost on how to get the internet connection going. He left it with a cable from my network plugged into both the H24 and HR24, plugged directly into the network connection in addition to the co-ax from the SWiM system which I think was hooked up correctly. He seemed much more familiar with the SWiM components. I recall he said something about DECA, but I don't see anything here that might be a DECA - but then again, I've never seen one, so I don't know what to look for.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

66stang351 said:


> No, for any H/HR pre 24 the DECA converts the Coax network to Ethernet. The ethernet out goes to the port on your receiver. You can also add a separate DECA that connects to your router to get internet to your receivers.
> 
> No, the DECA is only used on a SWM system. If you didn't have SWM you would use the ethernet port only instead of a DECA then the ethernet port. The benefit of the HR24 is that you don't need to have an external DECA converting to ethernet then being plugged into the receivers ethernet port.
> 
> ...


I have an H24 and HR24, with the SWiM. As far as I can tell, there is no DECA, unless it's built into the component that I would call a "splitter". That has something that plugs into the AC outlet, to power it.

Until this morning, there were internet cables plugged into both the H24 and the HR24, coming from my network connections in each room. From what you guys are telling me, that is not correct, so I disconnected everything. I called the technician, who is going to figure out what I need, then maybe come back. In the meantime, I think you guys are telling me I need a DECA, and then to connect it to my switch/router.

I'll check out those pictures, as hopefully they'll make things clearer for me. Thanks for the answers, but in my case, they apply for things that I don't have.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Aha!!!! Thanks for the link to the pictures. It's nothing like I was imagining, but it's all so simple.

DECA has one co-ax lead that goes to the splitter.
DECA has a power adapter that gets plugged into the AC.
DECA has a connection to use an ethernet cable to my switch/router.

It's all so simple now!!!

(Now I also know what I need to ask DirecTV to send me.)

THANKS!


----------



## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

wallfishman said:


> what the technician was talking about was that one box hooked up like that will make all your boxes respond to directv when pinged therefore he dont have to worry about phone lines. as for internet you should be able to get it on the one its hooked up to. probably DECA Broadband wasnt on your work order so he wasnt getting paid for it so he didnt do it ,,, just a guess


The only thing correct above that the internet bridge wasn't included on the order so it wasn't done.... even the box that is connected with ethernet wont have internet, since the ethernet port is disabled since you are using internal DECA.

anyway, when the tech comes back he should get you straightened out.


----------



## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

mikemyers said:


> Aha!!!! Thanks for the link to the pictures. It's nothing like I was imagining, but it's all so simple.
> 
> DECA has one co-ax lead that goes to the splitter.
> DECA has a power adapter that gets plugged into the AC.
> ...


You got it!


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

The DECA gets delivered tomorrow afternoon. I offered to install it myself, but they said a technician will bring it over.

To make sure everything is working properly, I think I need to do the following:
a) Test out VOD on the HR24.
b) Make sure the H24 sees the playlist on the HR24.


Is there anything else I should test tomorrow, to be sure things are as they should be?

I assume all this work will be "invisible" the R16 in my kitchen - therefore nothing to check out from there.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

The technician came by an hour ago, and installed the DECA. 

"cLINK" is flashing yellow.
"NETWK" is off
"Power" is solid green.

It's been almost an hour, and neither my HR24 nor my H24 can see each other yet.


How long does it take for these things to set themselves up?

Are there any tests we should be trying, if it shouldn't take this long?


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> The technician came by an hour ago, and installed the DECA.
> 
> "cLINK" is flashing yellow.
> "NETWK" is off
> ...


The lights on the DECA should all be green and it shouldn't take more than a couple of minutes. I would check the coax on the DECA. It should be connected to the SWiM.

The HR24 and H24 probably need the network settings reset. Because they were connected to ethernet first, they aren't using their internal DECA parts. The receivers need to be power cycled with the ethernet cables disconnected and possibly a Restore Defaults performed in Network Setup.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

David Ortiz said:


> I would check the coax on the DECA. It should be connected to the SWiM.


Wow...

I'm looking at http://www.dbstalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=20873&d=1263157334

My system looked different. On my systerm there was no "SWM Filter" between the 4-way splitter and the SWM. The SWM Power Inserter was placed between the 4-way splitter and the Living Room HR24. There was one "stop band filter" placed just outside my R16.

The technician said none of this mattered. Since I had a LNB with a green label, I didn't need the "SWM Filter", and the SWM Power Inserter could be located right where it was.

After a while, it was obvious that the DECA just wasn't going to connect - the yellow light just kept on flashing. So, I convinced the technician to put the Power Inserter between the SWM and the 4-way splitter. I figured we had nothing to lose. It didn't change things though, and the DECA still refused to connect. Both the HR24 *and* the R24 immediately did a software download then, "03E0" (whatever that means). Still no connection.

We "simplified" the cabling, bypassing one switch, and disconnected the kitchen R16. Still no-go.

At this point, the technician thought my internet network had a problem, even though we put a computer next to the DECA, connected it to the same switch as the DECA, and found that it worked fine. My thoughts were to go back to what I had last week - at least "VOD" worked then. So, we hooked up Ethernet cables to both the HR24 and to the R24, and left the DECA wired in as well. I know this is wrong, but we wanted to see if things started working again.

The HR24 and R24 both seemed to like this system much better. For the HR24, the "VOD" listings came back again, and the setup menus worked the way I think they were supposed to. The H24 still couldn't "see" the HR24 though, nor did it see the listings from the HR24.

That's how far we've gotten. As it was well past 6pm, we stopped for today. The technician thinks that "something" is defective, and the most likely culprit is the 4-way splitter. He'll bring another one back tomorrow.

As for myself, I feel like someone looking out an airplane window through lots of clouds, and trying to figure out what the ground below looks like. I keep thinking I've got an idea, but as often as not I find out later how wrong I was. Calling DirecTV is not going to help, as so few people there understand this new system. You guys are light-years ahead of anyone else I've spoken to.

Any suggestions, or advice? Anything I can test? The DECA is still connected to the system, and only the green "power" light is on. The "NETWK" light is still off, and the "c.LINK" light is flashing yellow. Is there any way to hook up the DECA to *only* the network, and see if the NETWK light comes on, with everything else disconnected?


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Wow...
> 
> I'm looking at http://www.dbstalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=20873&d=1263157334
> 
> ...


The DECA (white rectangular box) has three ports. Where do the three cables connected to them go?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

David Ortiz said:


> The DECA (white rectangular box) has three ports. Where do the three cables connected to them go?


There is a white co-ax cable going from "towards LMB", going to one of the four output connections on the splitter.

There is another (short) white co-ax cable going from "Sat recvr/power", going to the AC power device that is plugged into a wall socket.

There is a short blue Ethernet cable going from "Ethernet", going to a network switch.


----------



## bratboy (Apr 5, 2008)

I was warned about making sure my upgrade order specifically said needs the bridge. When I called DTV back to check she said oops no it didn't and fixed the order so the parts are sent.


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> There is a white co-ax cable going from "towards LMB", going to one of the four output connections on the splitter.
> 
> There is another (short) white co-ax cable going from "Sat recvr/power", going to the AC power device that is plugged into a wall socket.
> 
> There is a short blue Ethernet cable going from "Ethernet", going to a network switch.


The DECA is connected correctly. You should have all green lights. I would try connecting the first white coax cable you mention to your H24 instead. Power it up and see if you get Live TV. If you do, it's possible your DECA is defective.

You could also try connecting the DECA to the coax that is currently feeding your H24 (if the ethernet cable will still reach your switch.) See if you get green lights there.

I am assuming that you have a DHCP pool on a router connected to your switch as there is no way to assign an IP for the DECA. I am also assuming that if you press the dash button, the H24 and HR24 are telling you on screen that they are SWiM connected.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

I'm not qualified to even begin to suggest what to do, but in my very incomplete view of what's going on, there are two issues, and I'd try to solve them by simplifying things.

================================================
Issue #1 is that when hooked up properly, the internet connection does not work (meaning VOD doesn't work). I would only leave the HR24 connected, with everything else disconnected, and see if I could get that working. 

(It seems to be working now, with the Ethernet plugged into the HR24. I go to channel 1265, and find VOD - A&E. I click "All", pick a show, then click on "Add to Queue". It gets added. It's downloading as I am watching, which I think means my internet connection is working. So, "something" is preventing the HR24 from accessing my internet connection from the regular connection Internet > DECA > 4-way-splitter > co-ax > HR24.)
================================================

Issue #2 is that my R24 doesn't "see" the program listing of the HR24. Again, if left to my own devices, I'd simplify, and disconnect the DECA as well as the line to the kitchen R16. I'd then try to use either the DECA or the two Ethernet cables hooked up to the HR24 and H24. 

================================================

Unless someone here suggests something I am capable of doing on my own, I'll probably just leave everything untouched until tomorrow when the tech returns. He's already tried replacing the DECA with a second one (no change) and his next plan is to replace the 4-way splitter with another one. That sounds very unlikely to me, but I guess we need to try....

I wish there was some kind of diagnostic utility that would explain what is going on....


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

The 24's can be a bit quirky in trying to get it to switch from ethernet networking back to deca networking. It may take several resets of the receiver and network settings WITHOUT anything connected to the ethernet port.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

David Ortiz said:


> The DECA is connected correctly. You should have all green lights. I would try connecting the first white coax cable you mention to your H24 instead. Power it up and see if you get Live TV. If you do, it's possible your DECA is defective.


I don't understand - you mean to disconnect the co-ax coming from the H24 and instead hook that cable up to the white co-ax that now goes to the 4-way splitter and then to the SWM? I've got to be missing something, as how would the DirecTV signal reach the H24 if I do that? Or, do you mean just to see if my Ethernet signal is now going through the DECA and on to the H24, and for me to see if I get the green light coming on for "Network"?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

David Ortiz said:


> I am assuming that you have a DHCP pool on a router connected to your switch as there is no way to assign an IP for the DECA. I am also assuming that if you press the dash button, the H24 and HR24 are telling you on screen that they are SWiM connected.


I have an Ethernet cable coming into my room, and going to several switches. When I hook up a PC, I set the network settings to automatically set the right settings.

I didn't know anything about the "dash" button until you said that, but yes, both the HR24 and the H24 say "SWiM Connected" after I press the "dash" button.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

What the DECA unit lights indicate.

The DECA has three LED’s on the front of the device, as shown in the figure below. The C.LINK LED indicates that the device has formed or joined a network of DECA’s, and the quality, or available bandwidth, of the link to this device from all other nodes. The NTWK LED lights when the DECA network is
established, and blinks when network traffic is being sent across the network. The Power LED indicates the device is booted up and powered.

Once connected to the receiver, the DECA should respond with the “Power” LED flashing, to indicate it is booting up.

The C.LINK LED will then flash orange while it searches the house for a network, or until it finds other DECA’s. 

The search in a DECA-only network is designed to take upwards of 3 minutes to complete to ensure all receivers on the network have time to boot up and take control of the network, if necessary. 

This is because the first DECA to be powered up will take 3-minutes before it times out of the "listen only" search phase and will start broadcasting offers to start a network. The second DECA will then "hear" the offer while in its "listen only" mode and break out to respond. 

Once the 3-minute search is completed, all three LED’s should be lit (C.LINK, NTWK and Power). A good connection will have all three LED’s in a green state.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> The 24's can be a bit quirky in trying to get it to switch from ethernet networking back to deca networking. It may take several resets of the receiver and network settings WITHOUT anything connected to the ethernet port.


Nothing has been connected to the Ethernet ports on either the H24 or the HR24 for several days. For the first few hours the technician was here, he did quite a few resets of both devices, but there was never any sign of life from the network connection.

It was only as he was finishing up for today, that I suggested we plug in the internet the way it used to be (plugged into the HR24 and H24), just to prove that the internet was working properly. Since the system successfully downloaded a show using VOD, I think I can cross the internet off my troubleshooting list.

Robert - are there any "settings" that I can view, which will tell me if the resets have accomplished what they need to change? How many resets do you mean by "several"?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> What the DECA unit lights indicate.
> 
> The DECA has three LED's on the front of the device, as shown in the figure below. The C.LINK LED indicates that the device has formed or joined a network of DECA's, and the quality, or available bandwidth, of the link to this device from all other nodes. The NTWK LED lights when the DECA network is
> established, and blinks when network traffic is being sent across the network. The Power LED indicates the device is booted up and powered.
> ...


Thanks for the explanation - things like that help me understand what I'm trying to do.

Does it matter that I only have one DECA? This is the white box that you've described. (I think I remember reading that the HR24 and H24 each have a built-in DECA???).

.....if I were to disconnect everything from the DECA, then connect only the power lead and the Ethernet connection, should those two lights come on and go solid green? Or will they not do anything unless the third line is also connected?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

RobertE said:


> The 24's can be a bit quirky in trying to get it to switch from ethernet networking back to deca networking. It may take several resets of the receiver and network settings WITHOUT anything connected to the ethernet port.


I had a dose of this yesterday with my HR24. It lost the coax network and I tried a few things and had nada.
What did work was to go into the advanced networking setup. The IP and other settings were good [still had the DECA to router active] and after >> through this screen I did the "connect" and it brought the coax network back on line.


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I don't understand - you mean to disconnect the co-ax coming from the H24 and instead hook that cable up to the white co-ax that now goes to the 4-way splitter and then to the SWM? I've got to be missing something, as how would the DirecTV signal reach the H24 if I do that? Or, do you mean just to see if my Ethernet signal is now going through the DECA and on to the H24, and for me to see if I get the green light coming on for "Network"?


The H24 and the DECA are each connected to the 4-way splitter. The H24 works, the DECA doesn't. I'm suggesting that you swap the two for testing purposes. See if the H24 works using the other cable from the splitter and (vice versa) see what lights you get on the DECA when you use the cable from the splitter that you know works for the H24.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Thanks for the explanation - things like that help me understand what I'm trying to do.
> 
> Does it matter that I only have one DECA? This is the white box that you've described. (I think I remember reading that the HR24 and H24 each have a built-in DECA???).
> 
> .....if I were to disconnect everything from the DECA, then connect only the power lead and the Ethernet connection, should those two lights come on and go solid green? Or will they not do anything unless the third line is also connected?


It would help if you had two DECAs to monitor. Since the one you have doesn't have the green cLink LED, it hasn't completely recognized the DECA network.
I would start with the DECA router power & connected to your router.
I'd go to one of your 24s and reset network setting to default. This should clear any settings it has stored and during a reboot should pick up the DECA to router and then pull your network settings from this with the DHCP from your router.
The cLink can take a few mins before it turns green. There is some dialog [polling] between other DECAs that takes time.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

Your setup should look similar to this:










The placement of the power inserter can be anywhere, doesn't have to be on the R16.

STOP connecting the ethernet cable to the receiver.

A reset everything will probably get things going. Do it on the H24. Run through the sat setup, it should automaticly select the proper dish. Once thats done, go in and run the network setup. Now you should be able to to the Info & Test page, under more info, if you scroll down, you should see for Network, it says Coax Connected.

If it all works, then repeat the process on the HR24. Keep in mind a reset everything will wipe out your records and series links.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> It would help if you had two DECAs to monitor. Since the one you have doesn't have the green cLink LED, it hasn't completely recognized the DECA network.
> I would start with the DECA router power & connected to your router.
> I'd go to one of your 24s and reset network setting to default. This should clear any settings it has stored and during a reboot should pick up the DECA to router and then pull your network settings from this with the DHCP from your router.
> The cLink can take a few mins before it turns green. There is some dialog [polling] between other DECAs that takes time.


Actually, I do have an extra DECA that the technician left until tomorrow. He thought my DECA might be defective, but both act the same way. Where in my system should I connect the second DECA? I can always disconnect the cable that goes to the R16 in the kitchen, and add another DECA there, plugged into a different switch. Is this what you're suggesting I do, or did you have something else in mind?

I can do the test you suggested, but won't things get even more confused if I have two DECAs, each plugged into the same network?


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Actually, I do have an extra DECA that the technician left until tomorrow. He thought my DECA might be defective, but both act the same way. Where in my system should I connect the second DECA? I can always disconnect the cable that goes to the R16 in the kitchen, and add another DECA there, plugged into a different switch. Is this what you're suggesting I do, or did you have something else in mind?
> 
> I can do the test you suggested, but won't things get even more confused if I have two DECAs, each plugged into the same network?


The stand alone DECA needs to be connected with RG6 from the SPLITTER, not a switch. There also needs to be a power supply connected to the DECA as well. Lastly there needs to be an ethernet cable going from the DECA to your router/switch/hub/internet connection.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> A reset everything will probably get things going. Do it on the H24. Run through the sat setup, it should automaticly select the proper dish. Once thats done, go in and run the network setup. Now you should be able to to the Info & Test page, under more info, if you scroll down, you should see for Network, it says Coax Connected.
> 
> If it all works, then repeat the process on the HR24. Keep in mind a reset everything will wipe out your records and series links.


The above sounds great, but we've been doing it all afternoon - it seems like nothing is going to work until we get the DECA working.... all I've got is a green power light, nothing for network, and a blinking yellow light for cLINK.

(The "switching" idea did give me an idea - maybe I can switch the connections for the DECA and the R16 on the 4-way switch, and maybe the DECA will start working, and the R16 will stop? Worth a try.)


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> The stand alone DECA needs to be connected with RG6 from the SPLITTER, not a switch. There also needs to be a power supply connected to the DECA as well. Lastly there needs to be an ethernet cable going from the DECA to your router/switch/hub/internet connection.


Robert, maybe I wasn't clear. What you describe is what I've got. My DECA has the Ethernet cable going to my Linksys network switch. The other cables go as you describe, one to the 4-way splitter, and one to the power supply.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Actually, I do have an extra DECA that the technician left until tomorrow. He thought my DECA might be defective, but both act the same way. Where in my system should I connect the second DECA? I can always disconnect the cable that goes to the R16 in the kitchen, and add another DECA there, plugged into a different switch. Is this what you're suggesting I do, or did you have something else in mind?
> 
> I can do the test you suggested, but won't things get even more confused if I have two DECAs, each plugged into the same network?





RobertE said:


> The stand alone DECA needs to be connected with RG6 from the SPLITTER, not a switch. There also needs to be a power supply connected to the DECA as well. Lastly there needs to be an ethernet cable going from the DECA to your router/switch/hub/internet connection.


Robert I'm winging it here so I'll ask what you think, could the R-16 take this extra DECA? We know it doesn't have a network jack, but if it can power the DECA then it may work to help with the cLink LED.
Thoughts?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

There's so much going on, my head is spinning.

I decided to simplify. I removed the R16 and the H24 - they're no longer plugged into the 4-way splitter.

I would like to go back to the simplest situation, as if I was just starting out. I will do a reset of the HR24, and unplug-replug the DECA.

Which comes first? Do I get the DECA going, then do a reset of the HR24 (doesn't sound right to me because of the three-minute timer), or do I do I first reset the HR24, then when it's all ready, add the DECA?



With most computer gear, you get "everything else" going first, and then turn on the computer. That implies getting the DECA plugged in first, then doing the reset of the HR24.... 

(My plan is to get VOD running, for which I don't need an extra receiver or anything else - it's the simplest configuration I can think of, with the gear that I've got to work with.)

(I do have two DECAs, but only one power connector for the DECA, so I can't do the double DECA test until the tech returns tomorrow...)


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

I would start with the DECA -router, then the 24.
Doing it the other way means the 24 comes up without any other DECA to talk to, which could mean it doesn't.

What I was kind of thinking was:
Use your two DECAs to first establish the DECA networking. Each needs power [green LED] and only one needs a real network connection [the router]. I was wondering if the R16 would power the extra DECA by connecting it to the SAT input. This is how the DECAs are powered with the H/HR20/21/23s, but I don't know if the R16 works this way. Another thing might be to use a 24 as it might power the DECA, though again I don't think anybody has tried this. The SWiM 21 volt PI could be used, but then you'll lose all your SAT signals while you do this.
If these two will establish the DECA network to each other, then the cLink LED will turn green.
This verifies the DECA network is active.
Next would be to work with a 24 to get it to join this DECA network.
Then if you can get this to work, move on to the other 24.
Once[if] you get these to work, you remove the "extra" DECA and you've got everything set.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> What I was kind of thinking was:
> Use your two DECAs to first establish the DECA networking. Each needs power [green LED] and only one needs a real network connection [the router]. I was wondering if the R16 would power the extra DECA by connecting it to the SAT input. This is how the DECAs are powered with the H/HR20/21/23s, but I don't know if the R16 works this way.
> 
> If these two will establish the DECA network to each other, then the cLink LED will turn green.
> This verifies the DECA network is active.


I left one DECA hooked up correctly, and connected the other DECA to one of the Satellite-in ports on the R16 as you suggested.

Both now look the same - each has a flashing yellow cLINK light, and a solid green power light. Neither has a network light.

I haven't reset the R16.
I've now reset the HR24 four times.

No network connections....


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I left one DECA hooked up correctly, and connected the other DECA to one of the Satellite-in ports on the R16 as you suggested.
> 
> Both now look the same - each has a flashing yellow cLINK light, and a solid green power light. Neither has a network light.
> 
> ...


With the power LED lit, they "should be" working. Because the cLink is flashing yellow, shows it/they are still searching for each other.
Sounds like this may be what is/has been your problem all along.
It doesn't sound/look like the cabling is wired correctly.
"For grins" connect the DECA to router where one of your 24s is and use that coax. See it the two will "sync" and have the cLink change to green.
"All of your problems" may come down to a bad coax drop to the DECA to router.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> With the power LED lit, they "should be" working. Because the cLink is flashing yellow, shows it/they are still searching for each other.
> Sounds like this may be what is/has been your problem all along.
> It doesn't sound/look like the cabling is wired correctly.
> "For grins" connect the DECA to router where one of your 24s is and use that coax. See it the two will "sync" and have the cLink change to green.
> "All of your problems" may come down to a bad coax drop to the DECA to router.


Sorry, I'm getting sleepy I guess - not sure what you mean. First, I don't have a router, only switches, and I've got four switches spread around my place. I've got lots of long CAT5 cable, so i can connect the DECA no matter where I place it.

I assume you want me to connect my second DECA to the unused sat-in connector of my HR24? Easy enough. The cable lengths then will be very short. If that's not what you meant, please advise.

.....nope. When I connect the DECA to the unused sat-in connector on the HR24 nothing happens - no lights on the DECA.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

OK, what I'm trying to get you to do is:
Connect each DECA to a place that you know has a good SAT feed.
Use the r16 to power one and then use the PI for the other one.
Let's start with the Hr24 and disconnect the coax to it and use the DECA & PI here.
Now you should have the two DECAs with green power LEDs and since the coax all go to the splitter, they should sync with a green cLink within a few mins.
If they don't then your tech may have install bandstop filters where he shouldn't have. these are small "square blocks" with a coax on one end. Your system should only have one over by the R-16, which you should remove for the DECA temp install there. 

Being as late as it is, maybe you want to take a break and PM me tomorrow. or come back and post here & we'll continue.


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

David Ortiz said:


> The H24 and the DECA are each connected to the 4-way splitter. The H24 works, the DECA doesn't. I'm suggesting that you swap the two for testing purposes. See if the H24 works using the other cable from the splitter and (vice versa) see what lights you get on the DECA when you use the cable from the splitter that you know works for the H24.





veryoldschool said:


> OK, what I'm trying to get you to do is:
> *Connect each DECA to a place that you know has a good SAT feed.*
> Use the r16 to power one and then use the PI for the other one.
> Let's start with the Hr24 and disconnect the coax to it and use the DECA & PI here.
> ...


I am positive that I have powered my SWiM and then my DECA (to router/switch) and have gotten green lights without any other receiver or DECA powered up.

I agree, the coax that goes to the DECA from the 4-way splitter might be bad. I think swapping the H24 and the DECA like I suggested earlier might give us some answers.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

I'm getting way too sleepy - will continue tomorrow. Thanks for all the advice.

I did try using a different piece of co-ax to the DECA. Didn't make any difference.

I tried two DECAs, one after the other - both worked the same, no network.

I tried on on the R16, but the band stop filter was still on the incoming line - should I have removed it? (That's the only band stop filter I have.)



I can't find any way to get the network light to go on.

David's comment seems very relevant - if I read it correctly, if I disconnect *everything* from the 4-way splitter except the DECA, and plug my network cable into it, should the green network light on the DECA come on???? I would then have the following:
a) DISH with SWM
b) Power Inserter
c) DECA (with power inserter and ethenet connected)
Should the green network light come up solid green?

David - I can't swap the cables for H24 (around 30 feet run) and the DECA (one foot), because of the distance. 



I've got two issues, and maybe they're related. First, the network light never comes on, on the DECA, and second, the H24 doesn't "see" the HR24 when they're both hooked up. (Right now, only the HR24 is connected, as I was hoping to somehow get the DECA to come on..... there's probably a simple explanation here, that I'm just overlooking. Maybe the technician will come by later today with a good answer, but I don't think that's going to answer unless he brings a more experienced technician with him.)


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I'm getting way too sleepy - will continue tomorrow. Thanks for all the advice.
> 
> I did try using a different piece of co-ax to the DECA. Didn't make any difference.
> 
> ...


Good morning!

The piece of info that means the most is that when you pressed the dash button on the remote the boxes (H24 and HR24) responded that they were SWM connected. This means that all of the wiring (including splitters and/or power inserters) is correct in these two locations.

If we assume that at least one of your DECAs is good, then some part of the wiring at its location must be bad.

So if you were to take your two DECAs and the AC adapter to the location of either the H24 or the HR24, then remove the H24 or HR24 and its power cord, and then attach the coax that you just disconnected to one of the DECAs, you can test the DECA in this new location.

Just try one DECA first. There are existing ethernet cables near the H24 and the HR24, right? Plug that existing line into the DECA ethernet port.

Now power the DECA. The guess so far is that the DECA doesn't ever get SWiM connected. But by pressing that dash button, we know the H24 and the HR24 see the SWiM. So we are using wiring that we know is good to see if the DECA is good.


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

You are correct. There are two issues. The H24 not seeing the HR24 is separate from trying to get the DECA to work.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Do any additional ports need to be opened up in the router? I wouldn't think so, but....


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Do any additional ports need to be opened up in the router? I wouldn't think so, but....


I just hope your router has DHCP active.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

What is DHCP Active, how do I know if I've got it, and what does this mean?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> What is DHCP Active, how do I know if I've got it, and what does this mean?


This is a setting in the router that assigns the IP addresses and all the other network settings for each device connected.
If your receivers were getting these over the ethernet cable, then it is active.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

This is all very strange. The equipment is all supposedly good, and we've tried other identical parts in the case of the 4-port splitter and DECA The functions just don't work.

After the technician was her for several hours, and lots of reboots, nothing worked. No MRV. No networking. Therefore, no VOD.

Around 3pm we gave up, and the plan is/was for a supervisor and the technician to come back here together and figure things out.

----------------------------------

With nothing to lose, I figured I could play around with the gear, and see if I could figure anything out. 
The IP address for the HR24 was 192.168.1.89 (which is typical of my computers in my apartment.

The IP address for the H24 was 169.254.3.100 which is nothing like my computers - which made me think that's a number generated by DirecTV. That seemed like a better number for use with the DECA setup.

So, I did yet another reset of the HR24 and the IP now said 169.254.8.88 which "sounded" like something that would work with the H24....

.....but nothing worked.

----------------------------------

Since the system had once worked with my internet, I hooked everything up the wrong way. I plugged the ethernet cable into the HR24 and did the network setup, and everything looked good. No more errors. I then did the same to the H24, plugging in a network cable to that box as well, and after a reset and a bit of network setup, it was happy too.


Now everything works. I can see the HR24 programming from the H24, as well as the internet. I'm back to where I was a week ago. I will do another download for VOD, and see if I eventually get an error message, as happened a week ago.

----------------------------------

I'm thoroughly puzzled. Why does all my stuff NOT work when hooked up properly, but seem to work when I plug the network cables into the H24 and HR24 which I know is wrong?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

(After reading and re-reading this document http://forums.directv.com/pe/RepositoryFileDownloadServlet/10690708/TB%20Issue%209%202010-051210.pdf I'm wondering about the line that says "Don't install an Ethernet cable in the back of a 24-series IRD or you will disable the buil-in DECA and MRV will not work."

Is it possible that the built-in DECA on my HR24 and R24 have been "turned off" and I just need to find a way to turn them back on?)


----------



## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> (After reading and re-reading this document http://forums.directv.com/pe/RepositoryFileDownloadServlet/10690708/TB%20Issue%209%202010-051210.pdf I'm wondering about the line that says "Don't install an Ethernet cable in the back of a 24-series IRD or you will disable the buil-in DECA and MRV will not work."
> 
> Is it possible that the built-in DECA on my HR24 and R24 have been "turned off" and I just need to find a way to turn them back on?)


Have you restored Network defaults? Since you keep going back to ethernet, your 24s keep getting "confused."


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

:bang



> The IP address for the HR24 was 192.168.1.89 (which is typical of my computers in my apartment.
> 
> The IP address for the H24 was 169.254.3.100


You have yet to have the DECA to router come into the DECA network.
Without this the 169.xxx.xxx.xxx IP is being generated by the receiver because there is no connection to your DHCP router.

Connecting the ethernet cable to the 24s overrides their internal DECA.
Getting the 24 to go back and use the DECA is hard.
Rebooting, resetting network defaults, resetting everything, unplugging the power for 10 mins, etc. need to be done and not having the ethernet cable connected are the only ways to get this to shift back to coax networking.

"Pick one" and use another location with both a SAT cable that works on a receiver AND a working ethernet cable to your router for where to connect your DECA to router. Then go back to the first location with a 24 and reset everything you can until this one shows it has networking.
The DECA router should end up with all green LEDs and the 24 should show it is networked and has internet connectivity in the info screen.
Once you can verify that you have the DECA to router active and one 24 connected, then you can move the DECA to router location back and see if it still works at that location.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Sorry, but could you please clarify a few silly things for me?

First, what do people mean by "DECA to router"? I don't have a router - all I have is an ethernet cable coming in to my apartment, and it goes to several switches, also in my apartment. When you type "DECA to router", why even mention the router? (Are we talking about a device such as a Linksys Router that some people use to connect to their modem?)

Next, what is the DECA network that we want the DECA needs to come into? As far as I can tell right now, the only "network" that is running in my apartment is the Ethernet. There "should" be a network going between my HR24 and H24, but I don't think that is running.

You say "Pick one", and I assume you're referring to one of my co-ax cables going to a receiver - OK, I pick the co-ax cable going from the 4-way splitter to the HR24. The HR24 now has an Ethernet cable going to my switch. Please pretend you're talking to a kid, and try to tell me specifically what I should disconnect/connect.... or if you email me your phone number, to "mikem @ rc-racing.com" maybe I can call you. I just don't "get it".

-----------------------

Apparently, all this started because the technician hooked up my system "wrong", but it worked. He told me this is how he's been doing it for others, and they have had no problems. Maybe I'm lucky that I did have a problem, or it would have remained set up "wrong" all this time, and I'd be unaware of it.

(Just curious - what's the difference between leaving things as they are now, or correcting it? Is the problem that it's generating more traffic on my Ethernet network, and doing this on the co-ax would be more efficient?)


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Most setups have a router connected to the DSL or cable modem.
You seem to have just the ethernet cable and a switch [or switches].
For every "DECA to router" figure this is "a DECA connected to your ethernet switch".
On the coax side: Do you have your own dish, or [again] do you simply have a coax coming into the apt and then connect a splitter to it? Do you have more than one coax?

The idea of going with the DECA networking is to not have to use the ethernet other than for access [at one point in the DECA network] to the internet.

Let's first realize what you have from the questions above and then maybe everyone here can understand a few things better.

Does your 4-way look like this:


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

:bang
:imwith:
:beatdeadhorse:
:new_popco!pepsi!


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

1 - yes, I just have the Ethernet cable as you describe, and I have to total of 4 switches in various places. I can easily connect to any of them from just about anywhere in my apartment.

2 - Co-ax... I have my own dish, with SWM. There is a single cable coming into my apartment from the dish.

3 - The co-ax cable comes into my apartment, goes to the power inserter, and then to the splitter.

4 - Yes, I have the 4-way splitter as shown in your picture.

5 - Currently there are three cables coming from the splitter:
One cable goes to HR24 (living room),
One cable goes to H24 (bedroom), and
One cable goes to R16 (kitchen)


At the time this is being written, I still have the DECA, but it's not connected to anything.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> :bang
> :imwith:
> :beatdeadhorse:
> :new_popco!pepsi!


Sorry Robert, but I've got a lot to learn. One week ago I had no idea what a DECA was or did. Gradually, this stuff is starting to make sense. I'm also learning that many of the people at DirecTV know less than I do, which is pretty sad considering how little I know. They're all learning, and maybe in a few months all this will seem quite obvious to everyone.... In the meantime, I've had two technicians spending around ten hours all together, and one of them thinks what I've got now is correct (which you guys know is not correct) and the other guy seemed to know how he should do things, but it didn't work...... It's "working" now, but not the proper way.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

its not so much you as , I think, many installers not knowing the info thats been out there for some time. gives a bad name to other installers including those who come home and hop on forums to help out.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

OK let's go from here:









But over on the right the DECA to router is really a DECA to switch.
The PI is before the splitter.

I'd start be making sure the ethernet cables are removed from your 24s.
reboot each of them and then press and hold the info button until you get to the info screen, then select more system info.
Do this on each 24 and post the network status.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

David MacLeod said:


> its not so much you as , I think, many installers not knowing the info thats been out there for some time. gives a bad name to other installers including those who come home and hop on forums to help out.


David, I'm pretty sure that the installer who has been helping me "knows" that he is doing things correctly. He did a fantastic job of fixing up my wiring, so it's organized, neat, and looks quite professional. Apparently he's installed several 24 series devices before, doing what seems quite obvious - using the built in network connection on the H24 and HR24. He did that when he installed my equipment, and at the time he left me, everything was working properly. He (and I) both thought everything was done properly.

If I hadn't gotten an error message an hour after he left, I'd be happily using the system just the way he left it, having no idea that anything was "wrong".

Knowing what I know now, it's a really crazy situation. His way (using the internet connections on the '24 devices) works fine. The "correct way" as all of you and the DirecTV Technical Bulletin I posted the link for earlier, does NOT work (yet). When one method works, and the other doesn't, which of the two would people think is correct??????

Durn, I'm rather frustrated about all of this. My system is now "working" the way it's supposed to. MRV works fine, and I can download using VOD. I'm going to sound rather foolish if I call back DirecTV tomorrow, and tell them that the method that I'm now using is "wrong", and the method that people in a forum and in the Technical Bulletin is the right way to do things, when they (and we) haven't had any luck at all in getting it to work????

I think you're suggesting that the technician who has been working on my system is giving installers a bad name, because he's doing something "wrong". I would disagree - he's probably doing things the way he thinks he's supposed to be doing them, and his way seems to "work" better than the "correct" way.

I feel very dumb in even posting this now. My gut feeling is that you guys are right, and the technician is doing things incorrectly, BUT his way worked effortlessly, and the "correct" way still wasn't working, after endless hours of trying stuff, replacing gear, and rebooting many, many times. I think I'll sound very irrational if I make another phone call to DirecTV and tell them the way that is now working is "wrong" and the way that nobody could get working is really "right". I think they'll laugh at me, and tell me to just leave things as they are.

-------------------------------------------------------

I think "veryoldschool" is trying to tell me that my H24 and HR24 have incorrect settings, and it's going to be very difficult to clear out those incorrect settings, so the correct settings can be configured.

I'd feel better about this if I could somehow make the DECA that is still here connect to the internet and display the green light telling me that it's connected.

Maybe DirecTV is still going to send out a supervisor along with the technician, and we can get this sorted out properly. I'll find that out tomorrow. Until I know what they're going to do, I don't want to take things apart and start following the suggestions from "veryoldschool" even though I think he (and the rest of you) are right. Right now, whether or not it's correct, what I have is "working". I need to take a break from this, and learn a bit more.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> I'd start be making sure the ethernet cables are removed from your 24s.
> reboot each of them and then press and hold the info button until you get to the info screen, then select more system info.
> Do this on each 24 and post the network status.


Before I do anything that will disturb what is now working, is there any way that I can use the empty post on the 4-way splitter, and connect it to the DECA box, then connect an internet cable, and get the "NETWK" light to turn green? I've got a good piece of the co-ax cable that I know works, as well as the DECA. If I understand what you've posted so far correctly, even if my HR24 and H24 are using the "wrong" network configuration, the DECA should still recognize that it's connected to a network cable?

It seems to me that trying to do things the "correct" way is doomed to failure, unless I can get the DECA to recognize my network. Does this make sense?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Before I do anything that will disturb what is now working, is there any way that I can use the empty post on the 4-way splitter, and connect it to the DECA box, then connect an internet cable, and get the "NETWK" light to turn green? I've got a good piece of the co-ax cable that I know works, as well as the DECA. If I understand what you've posted so far correctly, even if my HR24 and H24 are using the "wrong" network configuration, the DECA should still recognize that it's connected to a network cable?
> 
> It seems to me that trying to do things the "correct" way is doomed to failure, unless I can get the DECA to recognize my network. Does this make sense?



If you have:
1 R16
1 HR24
1 H24
the only "empty post" would HAVE TO GO to the DECA/switch/for internet. 
How can this be connected and still have "an empty post" on the 4-way splitter???????


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> If you have:
> 1 R16
> 1 HR24
> 1 H24
> ...


Naw, you're the one making sense - it's me that's quite confusabobbled by all this.

Yes, there is an empty post right now, because the DECA isn't connected. 
Yes, if I want to connect the DECA, it will have to go to that currently unused post.

My question is if I connect it, with the Ethernet cable plugged in, should the network light on the DECA turn green, even if none of my receivers are paying attention to it? Right now, they're all using the Ethernet connections on the back of the HR24 and H24.

If you tell me the light "should" turn green, and I already know it won't, that might mean my problem all along might have been the "power injector".

Or, if the light won't turn green until after the c.LINK light indicates that I've got a connection, there's no point in doing this test.

I know I've got a lot of other things to sort out, but I'm wondering now about the network light. (If I plug a connector into the back of my switch, I get the lights all lit up regardless of whether anything is actually using the connection or not, so I'm thinking maybe the NTWK light might work the same way.....)


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Naw, you're the one making sense - it's me that's quite confusabobbled by all this.
> 
> Yes, there is an empty post right now, because the DECA isn't connected.
> Yes, if I want to connect the DECA, it will have to go to that currently unused post.
> ...


Some of this I've answered in your other thread.

"What we need to do is":
Get your H/HR24s to go back to being on the coax network, even if there isn't any internet.
Next with these outputting the DECA signals, we then work on the DECA/switch/internet and get this to have a green cLink.
Then we/you can runs some tests on the receivers to get them both networked & internet.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

I agree completely. That's what I tried to do this morning - I disconnected the Ethernet cables from the two 24 boxes, and did a few reboots. It didn't work then, but I understand from what you're saying that it might be difficult to get the H24 and HR24 back to their original settings.

You wrote:
"I'd start be making sure the ethernet cables are removed from your 24s.
reboot each of them and then press and hold the info button until you get to the info screen, then select more system info.
Do this on each 24 and post the network status."



I'll leave everything as it is for now, in case the supervisor from DirecTV is actually going to come see me tomorrow (along with the technician). If that does not happen, I'll do the following:
a) go to the info screen and document what's there now.
b) remove both Ethernet cables
c) reboot both the H24 and the HR24 simultaneously
d) go to the info screen and document what's there, and document all the network settings

I'll repeat "c" and "d" until either something changes as we hope it will, or if after seven or eight attempts, nothing changes. 

Do you think I need to un-plug the AC power cords for 30 seconds or so, after a reset, then do a second reset immediately, in case something is still being retained in some kind of system memory, even through the reset?

One other thought - the network setup is on "automatic". If I could find out the appropriate values for using the co-ax network, do you think I could enter those manually and "force" the H24 and HR24 to use the appropriate values?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I agree completely. That's what I tried to do this morning - I disconnected the Ethernet cables from the two 24 boxes, and did a few reboots. It didn't work then, but I understand from what you're saying that it might be difficult to get the H24 and HR24 back to their original settings.
> 
> You wrote:
> "I'd start be making sure the ethernet cables are removed from your 24s.
> ...


30 secs without AC power wouldn't be long enough. 5-10 mins normally is better.
If reboots don't do it, then reset network defaults. If you can get them on the 69.xxx.xxx.xxx IP, then that is a good sign [without the DECA bridge to network]. Below this in the info screen you want to see "networked", and below that "coax network". This last is the major point as it shows the DECA is active. Once this is shown, then you can go over to the DECA to switch/internet and reboot it and hopefully it will sync with a green cLink LED. Next would be to reboot the 24 and it will pick up the apartment IP and internet.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> 30 secs without AC power wouldn't be long enough. 5-10 mins normally is better.
> If reboots don't do it, then reset network defaults. If you can get them on the 69.xxx.xxx.xxx IP, then that is a good sign [without the DECA bridge to network]. Below this in the info screen you want to see "networked", and below that "coax network". This last is the major point as it shows the DECA is active. Once this is shown, then you can go over to the DECA to switch/internet and reboot it and hopefully it will sync with a green cLink LED. Next would be to reboot the 24 and it will pick up the apartment IP and internet.


I thought the best plan would be to talk to D* before changing everything once again. While discussing things with the support person on the phone, I suggested that there ought to be a way to do a full reset. We discussed how to do this, and I did it on the H24 (with network cable disconnected).

As documented in the D* Bulletin, plugging an Ethernet cable into the back of any 24 series unit will DISABLE the built-in DECA --- I apparently need to REENABLE the built-in DECA, and a full reset of everything ought to accomplish that.)

After a full reset, I found that the IP address had reset itself from the previous 192.168.... IP address to 169.254.3.100, so perhaps that cleared out ALL the incorrect settings from my H24.

If you agree, maybe you can help me do the following, to prove this is going in the right direction. It seems to me that as a customer, I could have ordered an H24 and what the technician called an "internet kit" (DECA and power inserter). So even if my HR24 isn't talking to anything because I haven't yet reset it, my H24 should be all ready to communicate with my DECA.

Using only the H24 and "internet kit" I'd like to get the DECA to go "all green", and the "DECA cloud" can then consist of only the H24 and the DECA. If I get a connection, I can plug the Ethernet cable into the DECA, and that part of my system should be all set, with the DECA lights "all green".

(If I get this far, all I would need to do is clear out the incorrect settings on the HR24, unplug the Ethernet cable, and reconnect it to my system so it can join the DECA cloud using its built-in DECA. A full reset should do this, but I would rather not lose my recorded programs, so maybe I can follow your suggestions, leaving the HR24 disconnected from everything and turned off overnight to clear out the old settings.)


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

OK this is sounding hopeful.
Go into your H24 and check the network to see if "coax" is below the IP information.
If so, then this has activated the DECA.
Next would be to connect the ethernet cable to your DECA to switch and then pull the AC to this DECA for a min and power it back up. This should get the cLink to sync and show green.
Next after/if this happens would be to reboot your H24 and see if it changes IP to the 192.xxxxxxx and has internet.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> Go into your H24 and check the network to see if "coax" is below the IP information.
> If so, then this has activated the DECA.


OK, I go to the H24 and get into the NETWORK page.

I have four choices:
Connect Now
Advanced Setup
Network Services
Restore Defaults

If I click on Network Services, it tells me:
IP address: 169.254.3.100
configuration type: automatic
STB services port: N/A
Audio Services Port: N/A

At the bottom right the choices are:
Connect Now
Cancel

If I click on Connect Now, I get "Starting Network Services", and eventually "Unable to start Network Services (<301>)

So, I go back in the menus and click on Advanced Setup. This eventually displays the following data:
IP address (yes)
Subnet mask (yes)
Default Gateway (everything is blank)
DNS (everything is blank)

there is nothing yet about co-ax....


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> OK, I go to the H24 and get into the NETWORK page.
> 
> I have four choices:
> Connect Now
> ...


You're looking at the wrong screen.
Press and hold the info button on the remote.
You will finally see the blue screen and system info & test.
at the bottom select more system info.
scroll down on the next screen until you see the network status.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

to continue, I can go back to the original NETWORK menu page, and select "Connect Now".

This generates a message "We were not able to connect to the internet. Would you like to get connected?"

I select "Get Connected".

I am then asked "Please choose the method you will use to connect."

Choices are:
Wired
Powerline
Wireless


None of the above three choices is what I need - all show cables going into the Ethernet connector on the back of the receiver.


I think this may be the key to getting things working -how do I get the H24 to select the method we're now trying to use? Is my software out of date, and do I need to update the software so it "knows" I have an H24??


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> You're looking at the wrong screen.
> Press and hold the info button on the remote.
> You will finally see the blue screen and system info & test.
> at the bottom select more system info.
> scroll down on the next screen until you see the network status.


Doing this now...


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Network:
IP Address: 169.254.3.100
Subnet Mask: 255.255.0.0
Default Gateway: -
STB Services Port: N/A(301)
Status: -
Audio Services Port -
Network: Ethernet not connected (9)
Internet: Not connected (9)


You wrote: "Go into your H24 and check the network to see if "coax" is below the IP information.
If so, then this has activated the DECA." Apparently the internal DECA is not yet activated. Is there a way to activate it? (I was hoping the full reset would have done that...)


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Network:
> IP Address: 169.254.3.100
> Subnet Mask: 255.255.0.0
> Default Gateway: -
> ...


This was what Robert was posting. Getting these back to DECA can be tough, once they've switched to ethernet.
I've posted the steps to try before:
Reset everything, pull the power cord for 10 mins.
repeat.
This is where your techs screwed you from the start.
Keep the ethernet cable completely away from these from now on.
The "reset everything" has worked for most.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> This was what Robert was posting. Getting these back to DECA can be tough, once they've switched to ethernet.
> I've posted the steps to try before:
> Reset everything, pull the power cord for 10 mins.
> repeat.
> ...


I guess I'm somewhat slow, but this time I followed you step by step, and I think we're on the same page.

It's 2:20. I've disconnected both the AC power and the co-ax. I'll reconnect both at 2:30. If that doesn't work, I'll try it again. I'm tempted to do the full system reset again as well.

(I assume that it won't cause any problems if the HR24 is in the other room, still connected to the internet via the connection on the back of the HR24? My H24 shouldn't even see the HR24 until when/if the DECA in the H24 is re-activated, and even then it shouldn't, because the DECA in the HR24 is still deactivated.)

Wow, this seems to me to be a potential nightmare for DirecTV. I think I'll suggest that they put a red notice on the back of the 24 units, saying DO NOT CONNECT TO INTERNET!! If not, a lot of people are likely to make the same error as my technician, and then go through this huge mess to try to get the internal DECA reactivated.

I can't really blame my technician - he did what he thought (and still thinks) was right, and it seemed to work, not only for me, but for many previous customers for whom he installed this system. I think they're likely to be complaining to DirecTV about an issue that could have been prevented with a warning label.


----------



## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> (I assume that it won't cause any problems if the HR24 is in the other room, still connected to the internet via the connection on the back of the HR24? My H24 shouldn't even see the HR24 until when/if the DECA in the H24 is re-activated, and even then it shouldn't, because the DECA in the HR24 is still deactivated.)


Nooooo. Unplug the ethernet on all 24s...it's not right! :nono2:


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

sigma1914 said:


> Nooooo. Unplug the ethernet on all 24s...it's not right! :nono2:


I know it's not "right", and will soon be removing it. My question was whether or not a cable plugged into my HR24 would have any effect on what's going on with my H24 as I continue with this process.


----------



## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I know it's not "right", and will soon be removing it. My question was whether or not a cable plugged into my HR24 would have any effect on what's going on with my H24 as I continue with this process.


Unplug it now. I'd power everything down, remove all wrong connections, wait 10-20 mins, replug everything PROPERLY starting with SWM PI then receivers.

You can't keep half a$$ing the set up.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

sigma1914 said:


> I'd power everything down, remove all wrong connections, wait 10-20 mins, replug everything PROPERLY starting with SWM PI then receivers.


No reason not to...
OK, the H24 (which didn't yet fix itself) is unplugged. I will disconnect everything from the system, including power adapter.

In half an hour, I will *only* connect the SWM Power Inserter, and the H24. Nothing else. The 4-way splitter will only have those two lines attached.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> No reason not to...
> OK, the H24 (which didn't yet fix itself) is unplugged. I will disconnect everything from the system, including power adapter.
> 
> In half an hour, I will *only* connect the SWM Power Inserter, and the H24. Nothing else. The 4-way splitter will only have those two lines attached.


You may need to move over to the HR24 since this is based on the Whole Home DVR.
Rebooting the SWiM [for this] is just a wild goose chase, as it has nothing to do with any of this.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I can't really blame my technician - he did what he thought (and still thinks) was right, and it seemed to work, not only for me, but for many previous customers for whom he installed this system. I think they're likely to be complaining to DirecTV about an issue that could have been prevented with a warning label.


Maybe "you can't", but I sure as hell can [and will]. He either didn't pay any attention to his training, or simply is trying to do this work without any training and doesn't have a clue what he's doing.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> You may need to move over to the HR24 since this is based on the Whole Home DVR.
> Rebooting the SWiM [for this] is just a wild goose chase, as it has nothing to do with any of this.


I agree, but I don't want to lose some shows I have recorded before I can copy them from the DVR. The H24 still has the wrong setting for internet, so I should be able to get it back to the default setting eventually.

If I do a full reset of the HR24, it will format the drive. There should be some way to clear out the incorrect settings without having to do that.

In the meantime, shouldn't I be able to "force" the H24 into going back to co-ax? I can plug in the DECA so it will have something connected to the 4-way splitter that is also using DECA if you think that would help....


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I agree, but I don't want to lose some shows I have recorded before I can copy them from the DVR. The H24 still has the wrong setting for internet, so I should be able to get it back to the default setting eventually.
> 
> If I do a full reset of the HR24, it will format the drive. There should be some way to clear out the incorrect settings without having to do that.
> 
> In the meantime, shouldn't I be able to "force" the H24 into going back to co-ax? I can plug in the DECA so it will have something connected to the 4-way splitter that is also using DECA if you think that would help....


A "reset everything" will lose all the recordings on the HR24.

If you haven't yet connected the DECA [to switch], "WHY NOT"?
If the receiver has no other DECA to talk to or recognize, how the hell can it become active? 

[sorry] I seem to be posting steps that you're not following. This makes this "just a bit hard" to straighten out your tech's screw ups.

If you want to focus on the H24 for right now, fine since this has no recordings to lose. Get this one to see the other DECA and then we can try some other things on the HR24 before "killing it completely" and starting over.

We either have too many cooks or nobody following the recipe.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Sorry, I thought we were trying to just get the H24 back to its default settings. I will plug in the DECA before I turn the H24 back on again in five minutes. I'm trying to follow everything, but I guess I didn't see where the DECA had to be "on" before turning on the H24.

(I incorrectly assumed that the H24 would go back to some kind of default condition, that I would then plug in the DECA, and the two would then start communicating, with the H24 then being set to co-ax......)

I've just done another full reset of the H24.
I am now plugging in the DECA.
I will then plug in the H24.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Good baseline to start from.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

Good god, this is like watching a train wreck happening.

I'm not trying to be a prick here, but...Why are you asking for help, then doing EVERYTHING but the steps given?

I've told you to stop plugging in the ethernet, yet you keep doing so.
I've told you to do a reset everything on the H24, yet you haven't done so.

Sorry this is frustrating as hell trying to help someone that is ignoring all advice.

The only ethernet cable that should be attached to anything, will be the independant DECA that will connect to a powersupply and RG6 from the splitter.

Hook that up first.
Disconnect any and all ethernet cables from your H24 & HR24.
Do a reset everything on the H24.
Do it twice just for the hell of it.
Go through the sat setup.
Run through the network setup.
At this point, it should connect to the DECA bridgeing the deca cloud to your internet. If not, something else is either not reset, not connected right or your not doing something right.
If it does work, then you can move on to the HR24. You could try resetting the defaults to try and save your recordings, it may take several attempts with reboots in between resets.

Good luck.


----------



## GirkMonster (Mar 20, 2007)

This is why MRV using home networks can never be supported by DTV. 

I hope you get this worked out. This is a great service and I worry that this experience will turn you to the dark side...hang in there, be patient and stick to the advice you are getting.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> Good god, this is like watching a train wreck happening.
> 
> I'm not trying to be a prick here, but...Why are you asking for help, then doing EVERYTHING but the steps given?
> 
> ...


Sorry for my not following instructions. I'm trying to do what you guys tell me, and then the DirecTV technician calls me back and tells me to plug the internet cables into the receivers, even though I've told and shown him that this is incorrect. Train wreck is a good description. My knowing so little about this stuff can't help any. You guys were telling me one thing, and everyone at DirecTV seemed to think this was completely wrong.

At last, I've got some supervisor from the support area at DirecTV who called me back, and who (FINALLY) the same thing that you guys are saying. He also told me he'd make sure the installers are correctly informed on what to do in the future. I will *not* plug any internet devices into either receiver, no matter what the technician(s) tell me to do.

Robert, I have been doing what you guys suggested for the past three hours. Here's where things stand now:

The only ethernet cable that should be attached to anything, will be the independant DECA that will connect to a powersupply and RG6 from the splitter. DONE. (DOES IT MATTER WHICH PLUG ON THE 4-WAY SPLITTER THE DECA IS PLUGGED INTO? #1 HAS "DC POWER PASS.)

Hook that up first. DONE
Disconnect any and all ethernet cables from your H24 & HR24. DONE
Do a reset everything on the H24. DONE (FULL RESET FROM THE RESET MENU)
Do it twice just for the hell of it. DONE THREE TIMES NOW
Go through the sat setup. THE RECEIVER GOES THROUGH THE SAT SETUP
Run through the network setup.

I HAVE NOT YET FOUND ANY NETWORK SETUP WHERE I CAN SELECT BETWEEN ETHERNET AND CO-AX. PLEASE ADVISE...

At this point, it should connect to the DECA bridgeing the deca cloud to your internet. If not, something else is either not reset, not connected right or your not doing something right.
If it does work, then you can move on to the HR24. You could try resetting the defaults to try and save your recordings, it may take several attempts with reboots in between resets.

NOT DONE YET

=============================================

Sorry for how silly this must sound to you guys... It's taken me a while to realize that the people on this forum know more about this stuff than the people being paid to do the actual work. When the person from DirecTV at the other end of the phone is telling me to do something, it's very difficult for me to just say "no", and tell them that they are wrong.......

It doesn't help any that I've now been trying to follow the above instructions, but my H24 so far refuses to remove the network setting from Ethernet.

The supervisor agreed that he would come see me in person if I can't get this thing working by following instructions (and it was this supervisor who told me to disconnect and reconnect the power to the SWM, doing that before I reconnected the receivers. All of you and the supervisor seem to agree that my H24 should "see" the DECA, but until I can get the H24 to change from "Ethernet" I don't think anything is going to work. I will continue to repeat this process over and over - from what I'm reading here, eventually the H24 should fix itself..................


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

GirkMonster said:


> This is why MRV using home networks can never be supported by DTV.
> 
> I hope you get this worked out. This is a great service and I worry that this experience will turn you to the dark side...hang in there, be patient and stick to the advice you are getting.


While I now completely agree with what you've said, most people would tell me I'm nuts, and why am I beating my head against a brick wall trying to get things to work properly, while the unsupported method works instantly with minimal setup just by plugging in two network cables? If the D* Technician Bulletin 5.12.10 didn't say the same thing many people are trying to help me with here, I'd be tempted to believe the "company representative" rather than an "internet forum". 

Oh well, I'll keep rebooting and resetting my H24 for the rest of the night, until either it finally kicks the Ethernet setting, or I get too frustrated. Even if the technician comes by tomorrow morning, what I will *not* do is plug in the internet cables incorrectly again.


----------



## samrs (May 30, 2004)

I don't suppose you know if your OTA antenna was ever, or is currently diplexed into your setup. Just a thought reading your original post.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> The only ethernet cable that should be attached to anything, will be the independant DECA that will connect to a powersupply and RG6 from the splitter. DONE. (DOES IT MATTER WHICH PLUG ON THE 4-WAY SPLITTER THE DECA IS PLUGGED INTO? #1 HAS "DC POWER PASS.)
> 
> It can go on any of the outputs. Personally, I'd put it on any of the 3 white ports.
> 
> ...


See above items in blue.

Here's what I fear may end up happening. When they come out, they will fiddle with it, get frustrated and will end up swapping out the boxes.


----------



## Tisby (Jun 4, 2010)

In my experience a Reset Defaults works. I haven't had to Reset Everything to get any customer's equipment back to DECA from ethernet.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Since the H24 is being such a ......

Here's a wildcard: 
You have another DECA adapter still, right?
Take this and connect it to the H24 and connect the short ethernet to the H24. 
Reboot the H24.
Can you now get the DECAs to sync?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

I do have an OTA antenna, but it is not connected to the D* system. I select one or the other from my TV.

I've done every type of reset I can find, numerous times. The H24 is doing a full reset right now, for maybe the fifth time...



RobertE said:


> See above items in blue.
> 
> Here's what I fear may end up happening. When they come out, they will fiddle with it, get frustrated and will end up swapping out the boxes.


I could have agreed that they would come out tomorrow, as the supervisor suggested. I told him I've got him and a lot of good people helping me, and I'd rather try to do it myself - as I see it, they'd run out of patience far sooner than I will, and the gear would be replaced without figuring out what is wrong.

"There is no place to select ethernet or coax. You can see which way it's connected (if it is) by pressing and holding the INFO button on the remote. The System Info & Test screen will come up. Select More Info. Scroll down. You will come accross the Network settings. There should be an IP, subnet, gateway and DNS adresses. May or may not have STB/Audio services porsts. Then the important part. Network should say Coax Connected. Internet should say Connected."

Yes, that is what "veryoldschool" told me (until then I didn't know to do this) and I've been doing it constantly since then.

I can get to the "Network Settings" page, and only the two first lines are ever filled in, IP and subnet. Gateway and DNS are blank - apparently I'm supposed to enter the values??

Network and Internet always say "Ethernet", and "not connected".


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> Since the H24 is being such a ......
> 
> Here's a wildcard:
> You have another DECA adapter still, right?
> ...


May get the external decas to sync, but will continue to delay getting the x24s to switch back to internal decas.

Have other thoughts, but "can't go there".


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

RobertE said:


> May get the external decas to sync, but will continue to delay getting the x24s to switch back to internal decas.
> 
> Have other thoughts, but "can't go there".


"My thinking" get the DECA up and then move over to the HR24.
With a DECA signal present, it "might" shift over to DECA/coax networking easier.
With the HR24 now DECA, go back to the H24 and remove the external DECA and beat the crap out of it to get it on internal DECA.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

may have missed it, but was software updated and if not COULD it cause issues?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> Since the H24 is being such a ......
> 
> Here's a wildcard:
> You have another DECA adapter still, right?
> ...


Yes, I have another DECA (but only the one power injector).

I will connect "Sat Rcvr / Power" to the H24 satellite in, 
I will connect "towards LNB" to the co-ax cable coming to my H24
Then reboot H24.

Interesting - will try now.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> may have missed it, but was software updated and if not COULD it cause issues?


not this, but that would be next :lol: [for MRV]


----------



## houskamp (Sep 14, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> not this, but that would be next :lol: [for MRV]


 actualy the original versions were much worse to get to switch..
hope he has at least updated to currrent national release..


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Fascinating...

c.link went solid green.
ntwk went to a "flickering" green (almost always on)
power was solid green.
(This is for both DECAs)

Meanwhile the H24 is still booting and going through the tests.

A few minutes later...
Lights on the second DECA all go off.
Lights on original DECA are back to the way they used to be.

When the H24 finally finishes booting, it seems to be working properly.

If I go to the menu from hitting "INFO" I see that the H24 still insists it's using Ethernet.

I'm not sure what all that means - I'm guessing that it shows the DECA devices are working, but the H24 is messing things up by insisting on using Ethernet... Oh well, I'll leave the DECA connected, and do yet another "reset everything".


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

houskamp said:


> actualy the original versions were much worse to get to switch..
> hope he has at least updated to currrent national release..


The installer might have done that (I know he tried to) but I don't know if this is done for sure. I remember I have to press 2 4 6 8 as the H24 is first coming on - right? Should I do that next? Are you saying that if I have "old" software, that might be the reason I can't get the H24 to realize it is no longer on Ethernet???

(Time out for dinner.... I will get back to this in about an hour.)


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> The installer might have done that (I know he tried to) but I don't know if this is done for sure. I remember I have to press 2 4 6 8 as the H24 is first coming on - right? Should I do that next? Are you saying that if I have "old" software, that might be the reason I can't get the H24 to realize it is no longer on Ethernet???
> 
> (Time out for dinner.... I will get back to this in about an hour.)


No the reason it keeps sticking with ethernet is because you keep plugging the ethernet back in.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Of course it won't show it''s coax networked, since you're using the external DECA and an ethernet connection.
So when all this is done booting, what does the info screen show for network & internet?

If this looks good, then it's time to move over to the HR24 and see if you can get it to now come on to the internal DECA.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> Of course it won't show it''s coax networked, since you're using the external DECA and an ethernet connection.
> So when all this is done booting, what does the info screen show for network & internet?
> 
> If this looks good, then it's time to move over to the HR24 and see if you can get it to now come on to the internal DECA.


INFO screen still shows Ethernet for both. No change.
I'm doing another full reset.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> INFO screen still shows Ethernet for both. No change.
> I'm doing another full reset.


yes "I KNOW", but does it show the 192.xxxxxx IP and say it has internet? [On the H24]


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> yes "I KNOW", but does it show the 192.xxxxxx IP and say it has internet? [On the H24]


It has:
IP 169.254.3.100
Subnet: 255.255.0.0
Gateway -
DNS

Network: Ethernet not connected (9)
Internet: Not connected (9)


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> go back to the H24 and remove the external DECA and beat the crap out of it to get it on internal DECA.


If I had an electronic baseball bat, about now would be the right time to do this. It just refuses to change.

Time out for dinner I guess, and to stop thinking about this for a bit.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> It has:
> IP 169.254.3.100
> Subnet: 255.255.0.0
> Gateway -
> ...


Come to the chatroom here: http://www.dbstalk.com/addonchat.php


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

RobertE said:


> No the reason it keeps sticking with ethernet is because you keep plugging the ethernet back in.


I haven't done that since yesterday afternoon, when the installer told me to do it. You're right - I'm part of the problem, but I was trying to tell the guy that everyone here, and the DTV Technician Bulletin said NOT to do so.

Since last night, I'm trying to do only what you guys suggest, but sometimes I'm slow because I don't understand enough yet.


----------



## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

When you get back from dinner how about posting some pictures
Specificly, the deca thats attached to your internet.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

mikemyers said:


> I could have agreed that they would come out tomorrow, as the supervisor suggested. I told him I've got him and a lot of good people helping me, and I'd rather try to do it myself - as I see it, they'd run out of patience far sooner than I will, and the gear would be replaced without figuring out what is wrong.


should have not canceled that


----------



## bratboy (Apr 5, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> You're looking at the wrong screen.
> Press and hold the info button on the remote.
> You will finally see the blue screen and system info & test.
> at the bottom select more system info.
> scroll down on the next screen until you see the network status.


Okay, I was just wanting to check for myself on my boxes. This isn't the same as going to menu setup and then to system info and test from there?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Veryoldschool and barryb2 talked me through a way to create a DECA cloud between my DECA that's connected to the 4-way splitter, and another DECA attached to the R16.

HR24 is off and not connected.
H24 has had software updated, but still wants Ethernet.

After a couple of hours of trying things, we're closer but so far have not found a way to get the H24 to connect properly.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

David MacLeod said:


> should have not canceled that


David, if I did that, I'd probably have two brand new boxes, both working fine, and we'd have no idea of what the problem was, or how to fix it (for others, who will surely have the same problem, if they or their installer ever connects an internet cable to the back of the receiver).

David Ortiz suggested "what about plugging the H24 DECA ethernet into a laptop to see if the laptop gets an address". I'm not sure what he meant, let alone how to do this, but maybe that might be a backdoor into the system, which would allow us to change the incorrect settings. There's a USB port on the H24 - there should be some way to get into it as a support technician might, and fix any corrupted settings.

I think it's time to move to the kitchen and make dinner. I think I should also tie a cinder block to the ceiling right over the H24, and maybe that would scare it into cooperating, especially if I use very small string to hold up the cinder block!


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

bratboy said:


> Okay, I was just wanting to check for myself on my boxes. This isn't the same as going to menu setup and then to system info and test from there?


It's the same but a shortcut to the menu


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> David, if I did that, I'd probably have two brand new boxes, both working fine, and we'd have no idea of what the problem was, or how to fix it (for others, who will surely have the same problem, if they or their installer ever connects an internet cable to the back of the receiver).
> 
> David Ortiz suggested "what about plugging the H24 DECA ethernet into a laptop to see if the laptop gets an address". I'm not sure what he meant, let alone how to do this, but maybe that might be a backdoor into the system, which would allow us to change the incorrect settings. There's a USB port on the H24 - there should be some way to get into it as a support technician might, and fix any corrupted settings.
> 
> I think it's time to move to the kitchen and make dinner. I think I should also tie a cinder block to the ceiling right over the H24, and maybe that would scare it into cooperating, especially if I use very small string to hold up the cinder block!


The only thing this could be good for it to use the laptop to pull the settings and then unplug the laptop and manually enter them into the advanced networking screen but this still doesn't get the receiver to shift over to the DECA


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> The only thing this could be good for it to use the laptop to pull the settings and then unplug the laptop and manually enter them into the advanced networking screen but this still doesn't get the receiver to shift over to the DECA


we could confirm that the DECAs are passing internet traffic. By plugging the laptop in, we could confirm DHCP is working with the DECAs.

In the end, we only need the one DECA, but the laptop allows us some more control for testing networking.


----------



## azarby (Dec 15, 2006)

Mike M, VOS,

I had a problem similar to this early on in our testing. My solution was sort of convoluted. The thing that I found that worked was to set up the ethernet as normal. Once you do this go to advanced networking and set up a (static) fixed IP outside the range of the DHCP. Use your computer to get your setup paramters. Once you have established a good connection to the network, you need to power off the receiver (5 minutes). Remove the network cable and bring it back up on DECA. Check network parameters to see if they stuck through the power off process and removal of the network cable. Hopefully it will have switched to coax. If things work, leave it as is. 

If it did not switch to coax, you will need to reset all (reset netwok defaults didn't always work properly (thought they fixed that with SW, but the problem may have been reitroduced some how). Once booted, immedialtely go to advanced networking and set the static IP again and try connecting. 


If this doesn't work have DTV swap out the boxes.

No guarantees, sort of convoluted process, but you never know what happens with these boxes. To this day , I run staic IPs on all 4 of my boxes.

Bob


----------



## Tisby (Jun 4, 2010)

To get the 24s to disable the ethernet and switch back to the internal DECA:

1) Unplug ethernet (I think you've done this)
2) Select Restore Defaults (NOT RESET EVERYTHING)
3) Repeat Sat Setup
4) It works...


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Tisby said:


> To get the 24s to disable the ethernet and switch back to the internal DECA:
> 
> 1) Unplug ethernet (I think you've done this) "Check"
> 2) Select Restore Defaults (NOT RESET EVERYTHING) "this is *not* the network defaults"
> ...


*mikemyers* 
This may be about the only thing you haven't tried and is well worth trying.


----------



## azarby (Dec 15, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> *mikemyers*
> This may be about the only thing you haven't tried and is well worth trying.


VOS,
I went back to my original issue and checked my entries and "Reset Everything" was the only thing to fully reset the network. Reset defaults did not work on my system.

Bob


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

azarby said:


> VOS,
> I went back to my original issue and checked my entries and "Reset Everything" was the only thing to fully reset the network. Reset defaults did not work on my system.
> 
> Bob


Yes, but we have done that a few times without any luck.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Actually, I've done both. I did "reset defaults" several times, and then (when it didn't work) did the "reset everything".

I wonder if DTV has an office in Miami that I can bring my H24 to, and let them do it there? They've got to have a way to access the software so they can fix things.....

Is there any way to use one of the ports to get "into" the box? If so, it's probably protected though.......

Yikes, it just doesn't sound like there's any way to get "in". If nothing else, I guess I leave it unplugged overnight.
(and then I've got to do all this again, with the HR24???????)


----------



## azarby (Dec 15, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> Yes, but we have done that a few times without any luck.


I only know what I reported in the issue threads. Reset Everything was the only thing that worked for me.


----------



## azarby (Dec 15, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Actually, I've done both. I did "reset defaults" several times, and then (when it didn't work) did the "reset everything".
> 
> I wonder if DTV has an office in Miami that I can bring my H24 to, and let them do it there? They've got to have a way to access the software so they can fix things.....
> 
> ...


Have you tried setting up a staic IP?


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

azarby said:


> Have you tried setting up a staic IP?


No, that's something I haven't tried. I'm not sure how it might help, but if you think it might help, why not....

My network screen displays IP and Subnet. I think it wants me to fill in the next two lines, "DNS" and "default gateway" before it will allow me to "connect". Not sure, as I haven't done this. If I were to put in wrong numbers, might it reject everything and give us a chance to start over?

I used to be able to get to a screen asking what kind of network setup I have, wired, wireless and powerline. Is there maybe a way of forcing it to go to the correct way, co-ax? Maybe some prototype software release might have this option?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> No, that's something I haven't tried. I'm not sure how it might help, but if you think it might help, why not....
> 
> My network screen displays IP and Subnet. I think it wants me to fill in the next two lines, "DNS" and "default gateway" before it will allow me to "connect". Not sure, as I haven't done this. If I were to put in wrong numbers, might it reject everything and give us a chance to start over?
> 
> I used to be able to get to a screen asking what kind of network setup I have, wired, wireless and powerline. Is there maybe a way of forcing it to go to the correct way, co-ax? Maybe some prototype software release might have this option?


Sorry to say, but I think all of this is going down a dead end.
The connect now doesn't have the coax/DECA option.
Everything in advanced isn't going to get you on the DECA.
Your network has DHCP, as we know from the ethernet connection, so advanced is useless right now.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

As you suggested before, I will leave the DECA cloud up.

Tomorrow I will try to get the HR24 to work, doing the same things you've already suggested for the H24. Maybe it will be more cooperative.

Monday I will call the supervisor at DTV and ask him to come out, and to bring a replacement H24 along just in case.



It's possible that the H24 is just defective. It's unlikely that I've got two defective boxes, so the odds are that the HR24 will respond as you expected. 

Perhaps you could pass along to the right people, the message that this kind of thing shouldn't happen from a "simple mistake" like plugging in the ethernet to the ethernet connection on the back of the receiver. At the least, there should be a big warning label telling people not to do so, but the real solution is to add another choice to the list of network selections, one that includes co-ax.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

I really wonder if forcing an update after a reset everything might work. the initial versions had trouble switching deca/ethernet.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

mikemyers said:


> David, if I did that, I'd probably have two brand new boxes, both working fine, and we'd have no idea of what the problem was, or how to fix it (for others, who will surely have the same problem, if they or their installer ever connects an internet cable to the back of the receiver).


what if the problem is the boxes?


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

shot in the dark here, but I had seen some say redoing sat setup to make sure dish is set correctly made a difference.
not sure if worth a try or not, roberte or vos would know better.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> I really wonder if forcing an update after a reset everything might work. the initial versions had trouble switching deca/ethernet.


Did that last night... no help 



David MacLeod said:


> shot in the dark here, but I had seen some say redoing sat setup to make sure dish is set correctly made a difference.
> not sure if worth a try or not, roberte or vos would know better.


As I posted above, this is about the only combo that hasn't been done/tried and is worth a shot, be it in the dark, twilight, or full sun.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> Did that last night... no help
> 
> As I posted above, this is about the only combo that hasn't been done/tried and is worth a shot, be it in the dark, twilight, or full sun.


I did numerous resets last night, and then finally left the box unplugged for several hours. Nothing seems to have any effect.

What is the procedure to force the box to do this full satellite re-setup? I was under the assumption that "reset everything" takes the box back to the very beginning, but since that's not the case, I'd like to try that this morning. If all else fails, I will call the supervisor at DTV and see if he still has time to visit me today, but if I were him, I'd probably replace the box (meaning we wouldn't know what finally fixed it, if anything).


----------



## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> What is the procedure to force the box to do this full satellite re-setup?


Menu/Setup/Setup/Satellite/Repeat Satellite Setup.

You might have success if you switch it to 18" round, let it reboot, and then go back to the correct dish after you get an error which could take several minutes of it trying to find the 18" dish.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I did numerous resets last night, and then finally left the box unplugged for several hours. Nothing seems to have any effect.
> 
> What is the procedure to force the box to do this full satellite re-setup? I was under the assumption that "reset everything" takes the box back to the very beginning, but since that's not the case, I'd like to try that this morning. If all else fails, I will call the supervisor at DTV and see if he still has time to visit me today, but if I were him, I'd probably replace the box (meaning we wouldn't know what finally fixed it, if anything).


You will find it in the setup menu, reset, then the option between "restart receiver" and "reset everything".

If you can get the sup out, have him bring a new H24 & HR24 with him.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Davenlr said:


> You might have success if you switch it to 18" round, let it reboot, and then go back to the correct dish after you get an error which could take several minutes of it trying to find the 18" dish.


 While I've read/seen strange [stranger?] things,


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

BRILLIANT IDEA!!!!!!!!
SATELLITE RESET DID THE TRICK

CO-AX CONNECTED!!!!!!



Thankyou!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Davenlr said:


> Menu/Setup/Setup/Satellite/Repeat Satellite Setup.
> 
> You might have success if you switch it to 18" round, let it reboot, and then go back to the correct dish after you get an error which could take several minutes of it trying to find the 18" dish.


I started the test and clicked on "default values" before writing down what the settings used to be. Not knowing what to do, I did CANCEL, let it finish, and then started all over again, this time writing down the current settings for Dish Type (17:slimline-3s(SWM) and Switch Type: 01:SWM. Instead of clicking on "reset values" again, I figured I would try "continue". The process completed, and I went to the "menu" screen - I'll post the information I saw in a minute - need to copy it all down. I'll run another "system test" in a bit, and see what that says, but the major obstacle seems to be fixed!!


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

OK, here's the settings:
IP 192.168.1.88
subnet: 255.255.255.0
gateway: 192.168.1.254
dns: 192.168.1.254

network: coax connected
internet: connected



Next step is to do this for the HR24, which I also left unplugged last night.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

And the winner is:


> Originally Posted by *Tisby*
> _To get the 24s to disable the ethernet and switch back to the internal DECA:
> 
> 1) Unplug ethernet (I think you've done this)
> ...


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> And the winner is:
> [/I]


I just did this on the HR24 - it's now also on "coax connected".

It's strange - when I went to sat setup, there was a third option under Dish Type and Switch Type - there was also Tuner which was set to "dual". I wonder why that didn't show up for the H24.....

This may or may not have worked earlier - in my case, you already had me set up the DECA cloud with one DECA connected to the internet, and the one you had me add to the R16.

Until we find out that isn't needed, it's still part of how we fixed things.

Now I've got to make some phone calls to the supervisor, installer, and another tech person at DTV who've been involved.

(I certainly learned more in the past few days from you guys, than I ever expected to learn about this new technology!!)


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> I just did this on the HR24 - it's now also on "coax connected".
> 
> *It's strange - when I went to sat setup, there was a third option under Dish Type and Switch Type - there was also Tuner which was set to "dual". I wonder why that didn't show up for the H24.....*
> 
> ...


You think this might be because the H24 only has a single tuner and the DVR has two? :lol:
Time to go remove the DECA from the R16 and put the filter back.

"I would guess", this would have worked from the beginning, had we known this. With the DECA to router/switch connected, when either of your 24s booted to the DECA networking, each would have simply come online.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

veryoldschool said:


> You think this might be because the H24 only has a single tuner and the DVR has two? :lol:
> Time to go remove the DECA from the R16 and put the filter back.
> 
> "I would guess", this would have worked from the beginning, had we known this. With the DECA to router/switch connected, when either of your 24s booted to the DECA networking, each would have simply come online.


Sometimes I get my mords wixed up, or let my fingers get ahead of my brain. What I meant to say was I wonder why the field "Tuners" didn't show up, which would have had a value of "single", not "dual". It's just the way I do things, i guess.

Yes, in an hour or so I'll set the R16 back to how it used to be. I think I want to take a photo of the back of it first, so if anyone ever asks, there will be no doubt as to how you had me connect it. That may have been part of how we finally got the system to recognize coax. Anyway, for now, it's first a long shower, and then breakfast!


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> Did that last night... no help
> 
> As I posted above, this is about the only combo that hasn't been done/tried and is worth a shot, be it in the dark, twilight, or full sun.


yup I missed that post somehow.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

mikemyers said:


> Yes, in an hour or so I'll set the R16 back to how it used to be. I think I want to take a photo of the back of it first, so if anyone ever asks, there will be no doubt as to how you had me connect it. That may have been part of how we finally got the system to recognize coax. Anyway, for now, it's first a long shower, and then breakfast!


"In the end" the R-16/DECA was only done to prove you had the other DECA able to function.
Knowing now, how to force the 24s back on DECA, this [the R-16/DECA] doesn't need to be repeated.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

wonder if this should be mentioned as a possible bug, system should detect deca\ethernet easier then that. this isn't happening often but neither is it an isolated incident.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> wonder if this should be mentioned as a possible bug, system should detect deca\ethernet easier then that. this isn't happening often but neither is it an isolated incident.


I think you'll see this added to our FAQ thread above.
The "possible bug", seems not understanding how to, in simple steps.


----------



## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> I think you'll see this added to our FAQ thread above.
> The "possible bug", seems not understanding how to, in simple steps.


Is step 2 in the solution: Menu/Setup/System Setup/Reset/Reset Defaults?

I ask because there is a separate Restore Defaults at Menu/Setup/System Setup/Network/Restore Defaults


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David Ortiz said:


> Is step 2 in the solution: Menu/Setup/System Setup/Reset/Reset Defaults? *YES*
> 
> I ask because there is a separate Restore Defaults at Menu/Setup/System Setup/Network/Restore Defaults


This does seem a bit "odd", but it does seem that there is logic here that the SAT setup overrides or needs to be set/cleared for the type of dish [SWiM] to allow the DECA to be active. If [as in this case] the chip/logic isn't correct, any settings "downstream" are merely network and doesn't "flip" the DECA active.
I was on DECA and lost the connection. Going through the advanced networking screen brought it back, but this receiver had never been ethernet, so the networking issue could be "reset" at a lower level than the DECA on/off.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

Unless I'm missing something, wouldn't the entire issue be solved just by adding an additional screen to the network setup choices? Right now it's "wired", "powerline", and "wireless". Just add "co-ax", with an image, let it configure the necessary changes, and the problem is solved. It's not only the "logical" place, but also "obvious".

(...but to be complete, unless I'm missing something you guys are saying, running the satellite setup shouldn't be making changes to the network settings. For someone who wants to use the internet connection on an H24 box for who-knows-what-reason, it would be a nasty surprise if he went through satellite setup and found his internet connection broken.)



As to "bugs", if someone gets an H24 or HR24 and doesn't order any of the other features at that time, an open (and working) internet port shouldn't be there, like a piece of candy, tempting people to use it. ....and if they stick a cable in it anyway, the 24 series boxes probably shouldn't change anything automatically - a smarter way would be to display on the screen a message saying "Do you want to disable co-ax internet and the internal DECA?" Most people would at least hesitate at that screen - the word "disable" is going to be seen as a huge red warning flag!


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

All good ideas, but [there always needs to be one] currently the 24s are going to DECA/MRV installs and installed by "trained & certified" techs, which if this was really 100% true, negates these changes for the time being.


----------



## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

that option might cause issues on the 24's also since they can only be one and forgetting to unplug the unneeded cable might cause more confusion.


----------



## mikemyers (May 19, 2010)

This has nothing to do with DTV, but you guys have really confused the way that I have been seeing the "electronic world" for many years.

I've been doing computer conferencing since the early 1980's - If you check this link, http://greatgreenroom.org/cgi-bin/bt/backtalk/wasabi/begin?item=19 and scroll down to "M-Net", that's the "Mike Myers" that is me. Conferencing used to be a wonderful way to get information.

Over the years, as bazillions of people jumped into all the new "forums", it's gotten to where advice on a forum needs to be taken with a pound of salt... it's often worthless.

From what I've seen here, this place is more like the original M-Net than any of the hundreds (thousands?) of worthless forum systems, where people just talk for the sake of talking, and everyone is an "expert" even if they're a beginner who only thinks they know stuff. As to me, I absolutely *know* that I don't know a lot of stuff, and I found this place bewildering, with lots of brainy people talking about stuff that might as well have been written in Greek for all the sense it made to me. ....two weeks ago I had never heard of a "deca", and my idea of a satellite reset was to unplug the box, count to ten, and plug it back in.

It's not an easy choice when it comes to believing/trusting a group of well meaning people in a forum, or the factory representative/technician who comes to my home to do an installation.

This place is light-years different from most of the forums that I pretty much ignore lately. It's also pretty special that I don't know many places where the users would go to so much effort to help a stranger with a problem, especially when that stranger didn't know diddly, and wasn't very good at following directions....

I'm not sure if I'll be saying much here for a long time, but I think this is a really cool place to hang out and learn things.


----------



## john18 (Nov 21, 2006)

This has been a special place for quite awhile an there are quite a few people who way past the point of above and beyond in order to help people and get them good information. I know that I have been able to learn from them.

Even if you just skim forum topics and threads you can learn a lot of information and know that if you have a problem you can do a keyword search and probably find the information you need right there. If that fails, as you have seen, just make a post and know that an answer will probably be coming in short order.


----------

