# Does the 921 incur the $4.99 DVR Fee?



## crodgers79 (Jul 18, 2004)

I just bought two 921s (no lectures please!) - I got my first bill and Dish charged me $4.99/921 for "DVR Service Fee." I thought that the 921s were like the 721 (owned equipment, not leased) and therefore did not incur the DVR fee. I spoke to two CSRs (I played 'CSR Roulette' and both times got Dish Billing working out of the Phillipines).. anyway, both CSRs insisted that the 921s do incur the fee.. 

Let me know if I need to work this issue through Dish or just suck it up and pay the $4.99 per DVR921 that I bought.

Thank you!

Chris R.


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## langlin (Apr 8, 2005)

the short answer is yes, there was at one time an offer that you get it waived with the America's everything package, don't know it that's still the case,


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

Owning vs leasing has no bearing on the DVR fee. The only receivers exempt from the fee are the 501, 508 and 721. Every DVR introduced since then has the fee. The fee is waived for those who subscribe to AEP.


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## welchwarlock (Jan 5, 2005)

The fee is waived for the top tier customers who by the Everything Package...The rest of us have to pay when using the 921.
<Rant On>
You stepped into a landmind here. Fundamentally I believe that this fee is illegal. You purchased the equipment, there is no mention of the DVR fee in the contract that is printed in the manual (Not in the ones I have). So Dish charges you to use the hard disk that you purchased. If you leased it, I would understand.. HDDs are guaranteed to fail, they need to recoup the cost of replacement.

A good analogy is that it would be like the telephone company charging you an answering machine fee for the answering machine that you bought with your money. It doesn't cost the phone company a dime more or a dime less whether or not you have an answering machine...they're just being greedy...It is, unfortunately, the American way.

Heck, if I choose NOT to have long distance, my phone company (Verizon), actually charges me a "No Long Distance Carrier Service Fee", which is higher than having a long distance carrier and paying the "Long Distance Carrier Fee". That should be illegal too. Have it or don't they charge me a fee. That old "Touch Tone" fee is a scam to. It actually costs them more to provide pulse dial, yet they charge you for the convieience of "Touch Tone"

I have a DVR on my PC for over the air channels...why don't the networks charge me a DVR fee for that? Because they have no control over that DVR. Dish basically blackmails you...don't want to pay the DVR fee, we will turn off your receiver...they have no way to disable just the HDD. Direct TV does the same thing...It is now "Customary to charge users for posession of a DVR, even if they choose to not use it".

I don't know why they don't charge you a "Remote Control Fee" or "Guide Data Fee" (Separate Rant available) or a "Over The Air Local Channel convienience Fee". or perhaps a "TV Guide Logo Usage Fee", why not a "DVI Output Enable Fee".....

<Rant Off>
WW


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## madbrain (Dec 10, 2004)

welchwarlock said:


> I have a DVR on my PC for over the air channels...why don't the networks charge me a DVR fee for that? Because they have no control over that DVR. Dish basically blackmails you...don't want to pay the DVR fee, we will turn off your receiver...they have no way to disable just the HDD.
> 
> <Rant Off>
> WW


Actually, I canceled my Dish service last week altogether, and I can still use the DVR for OTA digital SD/HD channels, although I have no EPG . Since I canceled my service, I don't expect to still be paying any DVR fee for the 921 anymore.

However unfortunately the 921 still needs to have a satellite hookup to get its time source :-( It won't operate without the dish hookup. This means it continues to get software updates from dish, and they could potentially break it in the future, without me having any say in it.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

WW- If you understood how business works you wouldn't have posted all that nonsense. There is nothing illegal about what Dish or any of these companies you mentioned are charging. Dish can charge you these unregulated charges because you all agree to pay them and it is not blackmale. You can go to the competition. The no long distance carrier fee is a regulated charge, but still this is not blackmale because you do not have to buy your phone service from the land line phone company.

FYI- The FCC is revisiting the idea of getting the DBS and cable companies to allow for a la carte billing. Everyone has asked for this but how much you want to bet this will be very bad for the consumer overall. We will lose the less popular channels that some people actually do want because bundling will go dead in the business or be priced too high forcing people to just buy the channels they can afford. CNN may be cheaper than Oxygen due to volume. Say you now pay $70 a month for 100 channels of which you only watch 15 on a regular basis. If those 15 channels are priced a la carte at $5 a channel you will be paying more for less. Then the less popular channels that had rare appeal, will be out of business. Bundling isn't all bad. I would also suspect that when a la carte does pass, the base bundles we now have will increase substantially as many subscribers think they will save money and drop the bundle for a la carte reducing total revenues for the company's base overhead. When there is a realignment forced on the business model for these companies, there will be losers and winners. I suspect that once again if the government forces the DBS and cable providers to realign their revenue stream through forced a la carte, the big losers will be the consumer. It happened with the break up of ATT and history will repeat itself. The American way is to let competition rule the market place, not the government control. Let Government oversee stuff like colusion and price fixing among competitors.


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## welchwarlock (Jan 5, 2005)

DonLandis said:


> WW- If you understood how business works you wouldn't have posted all that nonsense. There is nothing illegal about what Dish or any of these companies you mentioned are charging. Dish can charge you these unregulated charges because you all agree to pay them and it is not blackmale. You can go to the competition. The no long distance carrier fee is a regulated charge, but still this is not blackmale because you do not have to buy your phone service from the land line phone company.


I am sorry you missunderstood what I said. I said it SHOULD be illegal, I know that it is not. We could argue that it is unethical, unreasonable, or greedy but that would simply be for the fun of arguing.

Yup, I can go to the competition...which charges the same fee... now if they actually conspired to charge the same fee... THAT would be illegal.


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## welchwarlock (Jan 5, 2005)

DonLandis said:


> FYI- The FCC is revisiting the idea of getting the DBS and cable companies to allow for a la carte billing. Everyone has asked for this but how much you want to bet this will be very bad for the consumer overall. We will lose the less popular channels that some people actually do want because bundling will go dead in the business or be priced too high forcing people to just buy the channels they can afford. CNN may be cheaper than Oxygen due to volume. Say you now pay $70 a month for 100 channels of which you only watch 15 on a regular basis. If those 15 channels are priced a la carte at $5 a channel you will be paying more for less. Then the less popular channels that had rare appeal, will be out of business. Bundling isn't all bad. I would also suspect that when a la carte does pass, the base bundles we now have will increase substantially as many subscribers think they will save money and drop the bundle for a la carte reducing total revenues for the company's base overhead. When there is a realignment forced on the business model for these companies, there will be losers and winners. I suspect that once again if the government forces the DBS and cable providers to realign their revenue stream through forced a la carte, the big losers will be the consumer. It happened with the break up of ATT and history will repeat itself. The American way is to let competition rule the market place, not the government control. Let Government oversee stuff like colusion and price fixing among competitors.


Actually I enjoyed my C-Band system...everything could be purchased a la carte. Sci-Fi was 0.45, MTV was $1.50, VH1 was 0.55, and HBO was 7.95. So for about $13 I got all the channels I wanted. I don't need or even want 500 channels. I did not have to pay for CourtTV, Disney, ESPN, etc. etc. Now I pay $27 per month (+DVR Fee + Local Guide Data Fee) and don't even get HBO....what a crock.

If a less popular channel goes out of business, so what. Let the marketplace decide and increase the bandwidth and picture quality on the channels people really watch!

As you stated "The American way is to let competition rule the market place..." But when all the providers sign deals with Disney to make it a must carry, then we all pay a tithe to Disney even if we don't watch the channel.

WW


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

_"I am sorry you missunderstood what I said. I said it SHOULD be illegal,"_

Actually, I thought I read you as: _"Fundamentally I believe that this fee is illegal."_ Must be a Clintonism- Depends on what your definition of the word " is "is.  Oh you crack me up. Anyway, I do respect your opinion of what should be although I have mixed feelings enough not to be convincingly committed either way. My reason is while I do agree that the market should dictate what channels remain I also feel that reviewing my own habits of watching programming, I find myself broadening my horizons too often into those channels, unpopular, yet interesting on rare occasions. jonstad introduced me to a Discovery Times channel I previously never watched. Now I check it out to see what's on and sometimes end up watching a new and interesting program. Had bundling not be the game plan, the channel would no longer exist. If one has strict "tunnel vision" with their entertainment, I can see no interest in expanding their cultural interests through TV. e.g. many teens won't watch anything except VH1 and MTV. My daughter was like that for about 2 years.


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## horseshoe (Dec 23, 2005)

Has anyone who has had the 921 with the top 120 package just recently had the monthly PVR charge added to there bill?
Chris R. said he got the charge on his first bill.
I have had my 921 with the AT 120 package for a year now and this is the first month that there has been a PVR charge.


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## langlin (Apr 8, 2005)

I have the 120 package and have always paid the DVR charge since feburary 2005


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## Ken Green (Oct 6, 2005)

I have a 921, a 811, and 3 301's.
I do not have a phone line connected to any receivers.
I've never been charged a DVR service fee, but that may because of the AEP  
My bill reads as follows:

DISHNET LOCAL PACKAGE - $8.99 
AMERICA'S EVERYTHING PAK-AT180 + 4 PREMIUM MOVIE PKGS - $81.99 
DISH NETWORK DVR SERVICEFEE - $00.0 (for the 921)
LEASED RECEIVER FEE - $5.00 (for the 811)
ADDL RECEIVER ACCESS FEE - $4.99 (for the 2nd 301)
ADDL RECEIVER ACCESS FEE - $4.99 (for the 3rd 301)
DISH NETWORK HD PACKAGE - $9.99 
VOOM ORIGINAL - $5.00 
HD PROMOTION - ADJUSTMENT - -$5.00cr (was supposed to expire 2mo ago-still receiving credit)


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## Alpaca Bill (Jun 17, 2005)

welchwarlock said:


> Yup, I can go to the competition...which charges the same fee...


Actually D* charges either (I can't remember which one) $4.99 or $5.99/mo PER ACCOUNT not per DVR. So you can have as many DVRs as you want on your account and you would only pay one fee whereas E* charges it per DVR. D* also waives the fee if subscribed to their TC Premier.


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