# PVR721 ... are you kidding me?



## gowilk (Jul 3, 2002)

:shrug: I went out and looked to find out what i needed to do to upgrade myself as a 3 year dish customer.... I currently have a dish pvr501 (without the problems that others have had) and a 2800 receiver but my wife recently figured out what "PVR" meant so i need a second PVR preferably with a dual tuner (like Direct TV users have had for 18 months or so). 

I researched the prices and they look something like this:

$549 + shipping for a 721
$149 + shipping for a quad lnbf
$125 for someone to come out and install this mess ( I know i could myself but I don't do ladders--- fear of heights).
$900 approximately 

This all sounded really crappy to me so i went over to the competition to see what they had to offer:

$39 - 35 hour pvr system
$200 - 70 hour pvr
$60 - multiswitch
$200 installation and a 3rd receiver
$500 approximately

Yes I know that my monthly costs will go up about 4 dollars a month after my 9.95 monthly contribution to the Bill Gates Enrichment fund but it will take me 8 years to break even on that not counting the value of my equipment on Ebay (501's still have value there).

BTW since it seems likely that the merger will go through I would not be surprised if my receivers didn't wind up going to a 721 after the merger anyway if they adopt the DISH receivers as their standard.

I use this forum for information on the satellite industry and I would really appreciate it if someone could tell me what i'm missing here. Thanks 

A sad soon to be ex-dish customer(at least till after the merger).


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## HTguy (May 7, 2002)

Your not missing anything but maybe a reasonable & much more economical solution would be just to replace your 2800 w/another PVR 501 for $299. If you wait a few weeks you can get the new PVR508 w/the 80G HD (twice as big as the 501 for double the recording time) for about $50 more.

You could also call DISH & see if they'll do a 501 upgrade deal for your 2800 for $199. I wouldn't count on it since you already have one but they may not even pick up on that. Of course if you got your 501 that way in the 1st place don't bother to try this.


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## gowilk (Jul 3, 2002)

Thanks for the suggestion but already did the $199 upgrade which actually helps make my point and my total cost is about $300 since i'll probably get around $200 bucks after fees from selling my equipment on ebay. Maybe economics is why Charlie never wants to discuss the 721.

I know this opens a can of worms but is picture quality, consistency of service similar to dish on directtv?

Don't flame the topic, please


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## HTguy (May 7, 2002)

> _Originally posted by gowilk _
> *
> I know this opens a can of worms but is picture quality, consistency of service similar to dish on directtv?
> *


Overall, pretty similar.

Here's another idea. When your commitment is up & if you do call to cancel service they will ask why. You tell them you're switching to get a 2-tuner PVR for less.

Very likely you will be contacted by DISH's "Win Back" team. Quite possibly you could negotiate another PVR UPG deal (w/another 12mo agreement, of course) to stay on as a cust.


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## Scott Greczkowski (Mar 21, 2002)

gowilk, I can't really argue with those numbers. 

Sometimes you need to do what makes best sense to your wallet. 

No fault in that!


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## Mark Holtz (Mar 23, 2002)

Heres what I did....

Since I already have three receivers. my switch was a SW44. However, I elected to get a second dish at 148 to get KUVS-19 (for Spanish class, natch). They replaced the SW44 with a SW64. So, if I elect to get a 721 (which is still unlikely), I can run new cable for the second line.


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## palisade (Jul 4, 2002)

Hi there. I was in a similar situation you were a little while ago. Thinking about maybe getting a 721, but not really being able to justify the $550 cost (that's nuts), but still wanting an integrated PVR solution. 

Then I found a DirecTV UTV deal (no longer available) where I got 2 (yes, two) Sony 35 hour (easily upgradable to over 100 hours) UTV boxes, the multi-switch, and the dish for free after rebate. Compare that to around $1300 it would have cost to get a similar Dish setup. UTV blows the 501 and 721 away (in my opinion). Previously I was using a ReplayTV with my Dish box, and I like UTV just as much. Sure, UTV costs $10 a month, but DirecTV service is actually much cheaper than Dish (despite what Charlie would lead you to believe) -- $40 for all regular channels plus locals versus $47 for the same with Dish. You pay for it with Dish one way or another. 

It was a little difficult for me to switch, but once I did I haven't looked back. I love DirecTV so far. I feel the picture quality is actually better -- sharper and clearer. And no pixelization. And no dropouts like I consistenly got with my Dish boxes. Unless you have a compelling reason to stick with Dish, of which there aren't many (one more HD channel maybe?, more international channels, superstations), I wouldn't think twice about switching if I were you.


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## Chris Blount (Jun 22, 2001)

Hi palisade and welcome to DBSTalk! :hi: 

Like you, many switched over to a UTV or DirecTivo. They are definitely great units. I would have switched over myself many months ago except I can't do without the superstations. 

If I'm still with Dish in the future, I will probably get a 721 but I agree with you. The price tag is nuts. Dish is supposed to offer some incentives in the future to bring the price down so I guess we'll see.


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## HTguy (May 7, 2002)

> _Originally posted by palisade _
> *...but DirecTV service is actually much cheaper than Dish (despite what Charlie would lead you to believe) -- $40 for all regular channels plus locals versus $47 for the same with Dish. *


Sounds like you're comparing apples & oranges here with regard to E* vs. D* packages.

E* T100 w/LILs = $37.98/mo
D* TC w/ LILs = 37.99/mo

D* TC+ w/LILs = 39.99/mo

E* T150 w/LILs = 47.98/mo (this is a bigger package than TC+)

E* AEP w/LILs = 83.97/mo (w/RSNs)
D* TCP w/LILs = 85.99mo

D* has a cheaper "middle" package w/TC+ but it's not comperable to E* T150.

If it's all you want or need that's OK but it's not fair to say that overall D* is "much cheaper" than E*.

Then, if you prefer UTV to PVR that's fine, too, but you are paying an additional $10/mo for that, right? So which service costs more per month?


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## palisade (Jul 4, 2002)

> _Originally posted by HTguy _
> *
> 
> D* TC+ w/LILs = 39.99/mo
> ...


You're right, in all circumstances they may not be cheaper -- I'm comparing TC+ to T150 and luckily in my case they are. You say it's not comparable, but after having both, I certainly see it to be. T150 gives you a few more total channels I guess, but all the extra ones are (in my opinion) crummy channels that I (and I would guess most people) would never watch or care about anyway (or at least not want to pay extra for if they had a choice), like the university channels and a couple more home shopping channels. If there are bigger differences than those, please let me know, as when I did my research I didn't find any.

Otherwise, I find the two packages to be quite comparable, and $40 is certainly much cheaper than $47. So that leaves $3 a month more I'm paying now after the $10 UTV charge, but since I didn't have to pay $550 for a 721 (and $0 for my hardware), it will take over 15 years before it would have been worth it to buy a 721.

Chris, thanks for the welcome -- I hope you're right and they start offering deals for the 721 for you guys. If they had released the 721 sooner and maybe offered some deals by now, I might not have switched. I had the superstations, too, when I had Dish, and while I miss them, I'll get by.


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## Karl Foster (Mar 23, 2002)

Here is how I compare apples to apples (sort of):

Purchase price of UltimateTV unit: $39.99 from Orbitsat in February 2002 - they may or may not offer this again.

120GB HD, $123.00

So the UTV cost me $162.99

With the UTV fee of $10 per month, it will take 38 months to equal the price of a 721. 

While TC+ falls in the middle of AT100 and AT150, it is more than adequate for my family. 

So while the programming package may be a different (not necessarily better or worse) price, my price for my dual-tuner PVR (and anyone who gets a smokin' deal for a UTV) is well below that of a 721. I suspect in 38 months, there will be something new that I will want to buy that will make my UTV obsolete. YMMV. Have a good holiday weekend.


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2002)

This is why I switched to D*

I got 2 Dtivo's plus switch + install $99.00, then got a UTV for $79 and can't be happier. 

Like you I compared the TC+ with the TOP150, I also get PBSKids which was a must in my house, saving me $7 a month. I saw the differences as the addition "Mono" music channels. However I enjoy D* music channels much better. I still miss Dish's channel line up, can't stand how D* arranges their channels. 

The number one thing is Dual tuners and Season passes! My wife is so happy now, she hated always missing a recording cause the DP recorded by Date/Time and not shows.

You can't go wrong with the UTV - in 5 months not one problem! No missed recordings....nothing. Its a Turbo driven DP that works


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## Neil Derryberry (Mar 23, 2002)

I too switched to D* via the orbitsat deal on 2 sony w60's... I love that box! I hated to switch, though, because I really liked E*'s overall solution. Maybe in a few years those W60's will be 721's due to the merger.... who knows...


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## Karl Foster (Mar 23, 2002)

I was just on Orbitsat's website and they currently have a RCA UTV w/dish for 0.00 after rebate. 

The 721 does seem like a good box. The only thing they need to change (IMHO) is the date/time recording and move to a program recording with an auto-record or season pass setup.


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## markh (Mar 24, 2002)

Since AT150 and TC+ got mentioned, the biggest bonus for ME for 150 over TC+ is the premiums that get thrown in with 150. TMC-W, TMCX-W, Encore-W, and the Encore Theme Pack make 150 my choice. Of course YMMV.

I hope the 721 works so great that they have to give 508s away. I'll take one if that happens.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

hey guys which premiums channels on DISH have DD? By the way I am really excited to get my 721.


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## gowilk (Jul 3, 2002)

UPDATE --- decision made ...

3 sony w-60's installed w/multiswitch - $520
... a guy down the street has a dish system already and wanted to upgrade to PVR so I sold him my clean 501 for $200 so current total out of pocket cost is $320 and i now have 3 pvr's and i'll upgrade one of em to 120 gb hd (a la the 721) for about $100 bucks (i'm in the computer business) and i have still have 2 dish's, and a receiver to sell on ebay.

$300 bucks is better than $700 bucks ... think about that comment Charlie.


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## Scott Greczkowski (Mar 21, 2002)

Thats cool, I was thinking of Switching to DirecTV a few months ago, if I did I would have made about $300 in the deal. But my wife hates change and told me not to cancel my 721 order.

The rest they say is History.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

I bet your glad you listened to the little lady now aren't you 



> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Thats cool, I was thinking of Switching to DirecTV a few months ago, if I did I would have made about $300 in the deal. But my wife hates change and told me not to cancel my 721 order.
> 
> The rest they say is History.  *


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## Karl Foster (Mar 23, 2002)

...except Scott still can't PVR his locals...


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