# It's me reddice. Finally upgrading to a HDTV but have questions?



## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

I am getting a 32" 1080P Toshiba HDTV and I want to upgrade my Dish 510 to a HD receiver. Right now I have a Dish 500 and a second dish pointing at 61.5. I have Dish Network currently hooked up to 4 510 receivers. I want to upgrade my receiver to a 612VIP for one TV. I currently have one line coming into my room. I can't have any more holes drilled since recently we had all new windows put in. I am wondering can they make that one line into two tuners. I head that they can do that with the DP44 switch.

What are the HD channels NYC locals and regular HD channels on. I heard that they are on 129 and 61.5. When I called them up they said that they would upgrade me to a Dish 1000 and a VIP receiver for $75 with 2 year agreement. That sounds good but what hardware is needed. Does the 44 switch need power because it can be plugged into the back windows that were not replaced yet.

Also how reliable is the 612VIP? I am only using it on one TV. 200 hours of SD content or 30 hours of HD content is plenty. Should I opted out for a 722. Does the 612 have a Ethernet cable. I am just all new to this?


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## space86 (May 4, 2007)

Vip 722 and a Dish 1000.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

So what you are saying is that the 612VIP is not okay. I have plenty of hours of recording time with it and I am only using it for one TV.

Also would I only need a Dish 1000. I have one line coming in that has to be split into two and have 3 standard 510 receivers that have to be hooked up.


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## IDRick (Feb 16, 2007)

reddice said:


> So what you are saying is that the 612VIP is not okay. I have plenty of hours of recording time with it and I am only using it for one TV.
> 
> Also would I only need a Dish 1000. I have one line coming in that has to be split into two and have 3 standard 510 receivers that have to be hooked up.


The 722 is a bit more mature technology than the 612. Theoretically, it should be more stable than the 612 but from what I read here, the 612 seems to perform pretty well. The 722 allows dual buffering, pip, and ability to feed a second signal to a SDtv. You could lower costs by dropping one of the 510 receivers plus have DVR functionality for the HDTV and a SDTV. The dual buffering and pip options are not something that I would use. However, if you're a super sports fanatic, pip and dual buffering allow you to watch two games at one time.


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## garys (Nov 4, 2005)

I would go with a 722 and replace two receivers as it will work two tv's independently. You will save an additional receiver fee and maybe a dvr fee. Also, NY HD locals are on 61.5 as well as SNY (I am in NY dma so I do know). You have no need for a Dish 1000 as your two dish setup is fine (and parts of NY have problems even viewing 129). If you hook the 722 to output one, the receiver should power the DPP44 switch and you can make use of the DPP Separator to feed both tuners. The 722 does have eithernet, not sure of the 612.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

I'm with garys on this one. You have a D500 and 61.5 then you are good to go. I'm in Central NJ and have the D500 pointed at 110, & 119, and a Second dish pointed at 61.5 and get all the NYC locals Plus HD. I have the VIP622 and a VIP612. I specifically got the 612 for that TV set as I got tired of being called for how do I get rid of that box in the corner of the screen (PIP). 

For myself the PIP is handy and a VIP722 will store more video than the 612 or the 622. However the 612 was cheaper. 

The DPP44 will let them use one line to the 612 or 722 with a separator, the trick is getting them to use it as they cost a lot more than running a second line. When you order specify a DPP44 as a part of the upgrade. The local DNSC tech was saying they aren't allowed to carry them anymore unless needed due to the cost and because to many techs were doing installs with them to save time running more lines.

Good Luck


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## zedug (Oct 23, 2006)

612 does have ethernet


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

I suspect that all the future DVR boxes will have ethernet and homeplug in them. Incremental cost and the theoretical benefit of PPV over the internet. My VIP622 setup very easy. Plugged in the ethernet cable from the wired router and done. a minute later I was looking at the DishOnline offerings. Too cheap to pay for them of course but nice to know they are there for future need.

Operationally the 622 and the 612 are more similar than different. Some things are moved in the menus.

If money isn't tight then go for the VIP722 otherwise go for the VIP612. Neither one will let you down. The least tech savvy person in the house had no problem learning the 612 after a 721 (not 722) and has learned how to set a timer choosing from all the options. 

There will be a slight learning curve after the 510 but not to bad.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

I opted for the 612 receiver because the lady said that she could not lease a 722 for just one TV. I wanted the 612 anyway. When I called I was on the phone for about a half hour. I could barely understand the woman but she said that the HD channels on 129. My local stations are on 61.5. Maybe they will come and install both. 61.5 is still there but maybe they will swap my Dish 500 for a Dish 1000. Worst case is that they leave it the way it is and just connect my main line to the 612. Can the 612 run with one tuner and the over the air tuner. I know you won't have duel tuning but does it work or not.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

And you believed her?

The number of TV's you have is none of DishNetworks business. You can lease any DVR you are willing to pay the lease fee for.

I know of persons who put a 622 or 722 on an SD TV set, just because they hadn't bought the HDTV yet.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

I been wanted to get a HDTV for a while. I could always afford despite my gripes here it it is just that my Grandmother which is the owner of the house would not let me get one. My old crappy analog TV 27" monstrosity which I still don't know how I am going to take out of my small room with its only RF connector is starting to go so now I can get one. Can't wait to watch all of the primetime network shows in HD. I never viewed HD except for demos at the electronics store.


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## Nick (Apr 23, 2002)

I recently ordered a 722 for just one tv, but then I already have a wireless a/v distribution network.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Jim5506 said:


> And you believed her?
> 
> The number of TV's you have is none of DishNetworks business. You can lease any DVR you are willing to pay the lease fee for.
> 
> I know of persons who put a 622 or 722 on an SD TV set, just because they hadn't bought the HDTV yet.


Count me into that group. I got the 622 first and enjoyed the better quality of the HD feeds as well as the HD only channels. Then I got the HDTV. The 612 is still hooked up to to a 27" (29"?) Sony SDTV. One thing at a time. I sort of justified the 1st HDTV as I use it for TV and the computer monitor. Wireless KB & Mouse to complete the computer setup. KB has encryption of course as it is wireless.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

reddice said:


> I been wanted to get a HDTV for a while. I could always afford despite my gripes here it it is just that my Grandmother which is the owner of the house would not let me get one. My old crappy analog TV 27" monstrosity which I still don't know how I am going to take out of my small room with its only RF connector is starting to go so now I can get one. Can't wait to watch all of the primetime network shows in HD. I never viewed HD except for demos at the electronics store.


One thought.
If you have basic cable get a QAM capable HDTV. I can tune my locals on my HDTV off of basic cable that I keep along with the cable internet. That would be WCBS, WNBC, Fox, WABC, WWOR, CW11, WNET, WLIW and a few others. Plus that gets me the subchannels such as the 24hour weather and so on.

The other thing to look at when buying is a VGA port for computer input. That makes it real easy to hook up to your computer. That lets me Browse teh internet, Play all types of video as well as DVDs full screen.

And as has been said you shouldn't need 129 dish.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

I am getting my LCD TV tomorrow and I hope they install my 612VIP receiver. Just have a quick question. For the east coasters. Is all the non-local HD channels on 61.5 and 129 or is their some only on 129?

Also can the 612VIP receiver run with one satellite tuner and a over the air tuner? Does it need both satellite tuners to run?


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## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

FYI - you can review it all from the The EKB on DBSTalk link at the top of every page.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

Thanks. I could not find the channel chart.

About my other question. Will it work with one tuner. It is only temporary because I know when they come to install the 612VIP they are not going to have a DP44 switch and they are going to let me order one and then they will come back to install it. It has not been the first time that has happened.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

I see the HD channels on 129 are also duplicated on 61.5 so then I really don't need a superdish and a wing dish. I just need a wing dish and a Dish 500 which I already have. They would conflict as I see them on the same channel numbers for both satellites. Also why are the HD channels duplicated so many times in the 4000's, 9000's etc.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

What other receivers do you have? A DPP Twin can serve up two tuners on two receivers without the rather expensive DPP44.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

The problem I have is that I have 3 other single tuner receivers. I only need one for two tuners. Never understood why the switches only have 4 outputs and now it is even worse with the new ones only having 3 outputs. What if you want to hook up 4 TV's. It's a big mess.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

reddice said:


> What if you want to hook up 4 TV's.


If you want to hook up 4 TVs, the solution is to use dual tuner receivers. In your situation, they would set you up with a ViP622 and a 625.


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## kal915 (May 7, 2008)

phrelin said:


> FYI - you can review it all from the The EKB on DBSTalk link at the top of every page.


too bad it's almost a month out of date


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

That does me no good because the idea of a duel tuner receiver is so I can watch a program and record another. Can't do that if the other tuner is hooked up to my grandmothers television. She watches her own programs.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

I see that my second post was combined with my first one. Sorry about that. Anyway can you please answer my other question. Will the 612VIP work with one satellite tuner connected? Like I said this is only temporary if they don't come with the right switches needed.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

Deleted - duplication.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

reddice said:


> I see that my second post was combined with my first one. Sorry about that. Anyway can you please answer my other question. Will the 612VIP work with one satellite tuner connected? Like I said this is only temporary if they don't come with the right switches needed.


No it won't work with only one tuner, You need DPP technology so that one cable can feed both tuners.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

Well I got a call saying that they are coming tomorrow afternoon however I had some horrible news today. After which my new TV came. I hooked it up and it was damaged. The screen was cracked internally and half the screen was a rainbow and cracks. I am furious. When I got the TV everything was in the back but the book and remote were in the front. That is how it probably got damaged. After talking to the vendor Crutchfield they and sending a replacement today. It has shipped and I will be getting it tomorrow the same day I am getting the VIP receiver. I am not a happy camper right now. If it comes damaged again I will demand my money back and never buy a TV from them again.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

When Dish called me they said that they would be installing a second dish and 2 DP34 switches. I already have the second dish and a DP34 switch. Will you please answer this question. How reliable is 2 DP34 switches cascaded. 1 has 4 outputs connected and the second one has 1. I hope it would not cause any problems with my other receivers.


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## digital223 (Dec 19, 2002)

reddice said:


> When Dish called me they said that they would be installing a second dish and 2 DP34 switches. I already have the second dish and a DP34 switch. Will you please answer this question. How reliable is 2 DP34 switches cascaded. 1 has 4 outputs connected and the second one has 1. I hope it would not cause any problems with my other receivers.


riddice,

sorry you are having a rough time with the damaged tv.....but:.

1-should have been at least a 37".
and 
2-the b---s--- that the DN csr gave you, re dish 1000 and 129.
3-get a vip722 .

harsh is correct. the dishes you have are good to go all you need is a dishpro plus lnb pointed at 100 and 119. [129 is not good for nyc I know I also live in Brooklyn].
and a second dish pointed at 61.5............no switches the DPP has the necessary switch built in. 1 downlead and a separator at the receiver.
Stop wasting time and get a 722 you,ll love it.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

reddice said:


> When Dish called me they said that they would be installing a second dish and 2 DP34 switches. I already have the second dish and a DP34 switch. Will you please answer this question. How reliable is 2 DP34 switches cascaded.


The DP34s won't really be cascaded. The have special outputs for successive switches so you'll still have eight outputs. It would probably be better to hook two receivers to each DP34 to make sure each gets good operating power.

The problem with doing it with DP34s is that they will have to run a second cable to the ViP612 and that's going to represent some work.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

To reddice, why are you furious? the Vendor is making it right quickly. It sounds like you bought something that had to be shipped, shipped things can get damaged. I bought mine at a B & M store, It could have still been damaged when I got it home and I'd have had to take it back. If you had a delivery from a local store than it is their job to bring it in and open it up to be sure no damage. BTW you can spot a cracked screen without needing to turn it on. The manufacturers are very careful how they pack things to prevent damage. 

You have now seen first hand the drawback of the modern HDTVs. The screen is easy to crack. Kids running, one careless whack with the broom or vacuum cleaner in the screen. Easier to knock over too. If I had kids I'd have never bought a LCD HDTV for example.

Moving on:
From what I understand two Dp34s and the extra wiring is still cheaper for E* than the DPP44. 

I have four wires into the house and feed two dual tuner receivers, a 721, a 622 and a 612 as well as a 7100. The DPP44 can feed them all with the four wire runs I have. The Installer didn't have a legacy adapter for the 7100 or I'd have probably ended up with cascaded dp34s when the HD upgrade was done.

For those that might be saying, why is he running the 7100? It isn't covered in the Tivo lawsuit, it was my first integrated with E* DVR, it is solid and I like the interface. I'll probably be running it until the mpeg2 SD goes away. Plus It can take a 120Gb hard drive and hold more than a 510 does. It also has two unique features that the newer ones do not have. You can pause it and it will stay paused until it runs out of room on the drive. So if it had a 120Gb empty drive it would stay paused 120 hours +/-. It has a wireless keyboard for easy searches and the remote is easier on the hand than the 501 through 721 remotes are.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

Update. Yesterday the tech guy came and installed my VIP622. He did a great job. He cascaded two DP34 switches. I already had the second dish so all of my HD will come off the more reliable 61.5 satellite. I told him that I could not run a line through the window so he was able to drill a hole in the bottom near my bed and run the cable right to the roof through the open stairway to get to the roof. He knew what he was doing. I am very pleased by his work.

The TV did not come that day because the replacement was delayed because of lighting storms. It however came this morning and the screen is fine. The last one was damaged because whoever packaged it put the remote and batteries in the front of the screen. There is suppose to be nothing in the front. SD looks great but HD looks really good. What about calibrating colors. I hear you have to do that with a HD set.

However I am not pleased with trying to pull in over the air reception with a good antenna that I bought. I was only able to get channels 4 and 7 and if I moved the antenna slightly I lost a signal. Don't see how in Feb 17 it is going to work. People are going to have trouble pulling in digital signals. I live in Brooklyn near the downtown area so I should be able to pull in the stations from Manhattan but I was only able to get two local channels. I get most of my HD locals on Dish except channel 9 and 13.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

reddice said:


> However I am not pleased with trying to pull in over the air reception with a good antenna that I bought.


Make and model of the "good" antenna? Mounted where?


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

Terk HDTVi antenna. I read the reviews and most were positive. Outside antenna is definitely out of the question.

Also HDTV is awesome. I was watching the tennis channel in HD and could not keep my eyes off it it and I hate tennis.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

I thought as much. Terk antennas are mostly high-fashion junk. They look high-tech/interesting, but they don't work very well. A $10 outdoor antenna would blow it out of the water.


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## reddice (Feb 18, 2003)

Then I will be returning it. All of this HD stuff is new to me so I though that antenna was good.


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