# 921 - L211 Software Release Notes and Discussion



## Mark Lamutt

Here it comes, folks!

First, I don't have the release notes yet. These should be quite extensive, so I really don't see having them before this afternoon.

But, while I wait for the official version, here are a few highlights from my personal experience.

First, the caveats:

1. After L211 downloads, if your 921 doesn't reboot on it's own, reboot it. Preferably by pulling the power cord. At the very least by pulling the smartcard.

2. You will have to rescan all of your OTA channels. Assuming they are even still there after the download. If you skip this step, you are asking for problems.

3. After the download installs, you *MAY* only have 2 hours of guide data. The guide will populate with data overnight, but yesterday when this hit me, I was unable to get the data any sooner. So, if you fall into this group, please be patient. They were aware of this problem, but decided to send the software anyway rather than making you wait another week for release. This won't affect everyone - there were several in the beta group last night that had full guide data after about 45 minutes. Unfortunately, I wasn't one of them.

4. Depending on what resolution you are outputting, you will notice that the video preview windows don't look right depending on what channel you are tuned to. Colors will be washed out, and there may be vertical lines through the preview picture. This is a result of the video driver that I've alluded to over the past couple of weeks, and is one of the fixes that we're still waiting for. It is a very well known and documented problem, and one that you don't need to file a bug report for.

5. To guarantee that your recorded timers show up in your DVR list with the correct program name, I would suggest that you redefine your timers using the new OTA guide data, when you have it available. From that point in, your recordings will be called out by station and program name, rather than just by station.

6. If you have local channel downmapping enabled, or if you have a digital OTA channel with more than one subchannel broadcasting the same programming (or even not, in the case of Salt Lake City), when you set up a timer from the digital channel guide data, the red dot in the guide may or may not display correctly on the channel that you selected to record from. For example, in Denver, we have channel 7-1 and 7-2 as our ABC channel. Both channels show exactly the same guide data. When I set a timer from the guide on channel 7-1, the red dot appears in the boxes for both 7-1 and 7-2. If I have my local channel downmapping on, I also have a channel 7 in the guide, and the red dot may show up on that channel box as well. Or any combination of the 3. To verify that your timer is set correctly, go in and edit it to make sure it's set for the correct channel, regardless of where the red dot is shown. This will get fixed, but wasn't deemed serious enough to delay the software any more than it's already been delayed.

7. It looks like the testers (me included) let one slip through the cracks that we should have caught. Don't define a timer for an OTA digital station/program from the SEARCH screen - doing so will instead record the program off of the Dish local channel. Thanks to Jim R for pointing this one out.

8. This just in - it's very likely that the L211 install process changed your display settings to 480p, assuming that you weren't using 480p by default before the download. If your picture doesn't look as good as it used to, or if your stretch modes aren't behaving like you are used to, check your display settings (Menu-6-9).

Now, what's new?

1. OTA digital guide data. The data is mapped over from the Dish local channels, so if you are in a market that doesn't have Dish locals, you unfortunately won't have guide data. *According to Dish, you must be subscribed to your local channel package to receive the guide data for your OTA digital channels.* For those of you in markets with multiple sub-channels that broadcast different programming on the sub-channels, you will only have the guide data for the primary channel. Like the guide data on the HD-Tivo, this is a work in progress, and will continue to improve as the source of the data improves. And, for those of you who subscribe to local channels in one DMA, but pull digital OTA channels from another DMA, you will not receive guide data for the out-of-DMA channels.

2. Local channel downmapping. This is activated or deactivated in the Preferences screen, and will take your Dish local channels and remap them from the 7000 or 8000 channel range down to your standard single or double digit channel numbers in your local market. Note, you can either choose to have your Dish locals downmapped OR choose to have analog OTA channels scanned in. Not both, as the channel numbers would conflict. The default is to have local channel downmapping turned on if you have no OTA analog channels scanned.

3. The OTA system has been reworked so that most (if not all) of the PSIP generated problems should now be resolved.

4. When you're outputting 1080i, 720p source channels now display correctly in preview windows and in the transparent guide.

5. OTA locals can now be added to Favorites lists again, and this time they work!

6. Numerous timer fixes, recording fixes, aspect ratio fixes, preference fixes, etc... On and on and on. We'll see what Dish wants to release for an official fix list.

7. Teach IR feature has been added to the Diagnostics page (Menu-6-5). You can now use this feature to teach your learning remote the IR codes from the 921, without having to use another Dish remote.

8. I don't know if the Blue Line bug has been fixed or not. We've gone through several new video driver versions, and I haven't seen it in awhile, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's fixed completely.

9. Pressing STOP no longer will stop recordings in progress UNLESS you are watching the program being recorded LIVE.

10. OTA digital Signal Strength meter added to the browse banner, so that when you tune to an OTA digital channel, you will see the signal strength of that channel.

11. Audio sync and delay resuming playback from a paused state has been fixed.

More later as I think of it and remember it, and as you ask questions that I can answer. Also, release notes will be coming later.


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## Eagles

Mark Lamutt said:


> Here it comes, folks!
> 
> Now, what's new?
> 
> 1. OTA digital guide data. The data is mapped over from the Dish local channels, so if you are in a market that doesn't have Dish locals, you unfortunately won't have guide data. However, you don't have to be subscribed to Dish locals to have the OTA guide data, you just have to be in a market with the data available. For those of you in markets with multiple sub-channels that broadcast different programming on the sub-channels, you will only have the guide data for the primary channel. Like the guide data on the HD-Tivo, this is a work in progress, and will continue to improve as the sounce of the data improves.


Mark, How about people like myself who receive OTA from more than one city.
My Dish locals are DC, but I receive OTA from DC, Baltimore and Salisbury. Will anything show up in the Baltimore and Salisbury Guides? Thanks!


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## SpenceJT

Once again EXCELLENT work Mark. Thanks for all that you do. I'm looking forward to getting home for some serious "play time" with my 921!


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## Scott Greczkowski

Dang no Dish Home yet. Dan Minnick said on the Tech Chat that it would be here by the end of the year. 

Thanks Mark for the information.


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## BFG

Eagles said:


> Mark, How about people like myself who receive OTA from more than one city.
> My Dish locals are DC, but I receive OTA from DC, Baltimore and Salisbury. Will anything show up in the Baltimore and Salisbury Guides? Thanks!


The way the 811 works is if you are receving channels from a neighboring DMA and those channels are dish locals, then the dish channels for the neighboring market will become red in the guide and you'll get data for neighboring DMAs. So yes you should have Baltimore data as well.


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## Mark Lamutt

Eagles, I suspect you'll only have guide data for the OTA channels you get from your Dish Locals city. But, I don't know that for sure, so please let me know what you end up with. I really wish I had that problem in Denver!

Scott - nope, no Dish Home. Also, 720p channels closed captioning isn't fixed yet either.


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## jsanders

Mark Lamutt said:


> 1. OTA digital guide data. The data is mapped over from the Dish local channels, so if you are in a market that doesn't have Dish locals, you unfortunately won't have guide data. However, you don't have to be subscribed to Dish locals to have the OTA guide data, you just have to be in a market with the data available. For those of you in markets with multiple sub-channels that broadcast different programming on the sub-channels, you will only have the guide data for the primary channel. Like the guide data on the HD-Tivo, this is a work in progress, and will continue to improve as the sounce of the data improves.


Is this a different setup than the 811? Reading the message boards, I got the impression that they actually have subchannel data, and that they were not just re-mapping the local analog guide data to the digital channels? Could you clarify for us?


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## skassan

Mark Lamutt said:


> Here it comes, folks!
> 
> 2. You will have to rescan all of your OTA channels. Assuming they are even still there after the download. If you skip this step, you are asking for problems.


Just out of curiosity, how will people who don't read this forum know that this needs to be done. I guessing by the number of new posts here recently that the number of systems in the field has increased significantly in the last month or so. I'm sure that not everybody follows this forum.


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## Mark Lamutt

jsanders said:


> Is this a different setup than the 811? Reading the message boards, I got the impression that they actually have subchannel data, and that they were not just re-mapping the local analog guide data to the digital channels? Could you clarify for us?


I don't see separate subchannel data on my setup, but there's only one channel in Denver that broadcasts different programming on different subchannels, and on that channel, I only have guide data for the "main" subchannel. The other 2 are "No Information Available".


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## Mark Lamutt

skassan said:


> Just out of curiosity, how will people who don't read this forum know that this needs to be done. I guessing by the number of new posts here recently that the number of systems in the field has increased significantly in the last month or so. I'm sure that not everybody follows this forum.


 Because most likely, users will find that there are no OTA channels in their OTA channel list anymore. It's been 6 or so versions for me since the big OTA change happened, but if I remember right, after that download, all of my OTA channels had been wiped clean and I had to start over.


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## Todd G.

Mark,

Did we get the signal strenght meter in the info screen for the ota guide?

Todd


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## Skates

from Todd G.



> Did we get the signal strength meter in the info screen for the ota guide?


YES - and it's awesome!!!


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## boylehome

Wow! I have my local digital OTA KRCR. Using the ADD DTV/SCAN DTV didn't cause the unit to fail. So far I've gone from  to  Thank you!!!!


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## FarNorth

<<9. Pressing STOP no longer will stop recordings in progress UNLESS you are watching the program being recorded LIVE.>>

Praise Jesus! My only complaint is now answered!


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## Guest

Can I power the 921 on while the power button is flashing? Will this interrupt the SW download?

Thanks,

Gerry P


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## Eagles

Todd G. said:


> Mark,
> 
> Did we get the signal strenght meter in the info screen for the ota guide?
> 
> Todd


Could you explain or supply a screen shot? Thanks!


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## Grandude

gpflepsen said:


> Can I power the 921 on while the power button is flashing? Will this interrupt the SW download?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Gerry P


I did and it didn't have any affect. I got no output to the TV during the download. 
Eventually had to do a power button reset ( after the blinking was done) and it then went into the installing new software screen.


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## jsanders

With the previous version, I would get 17 or 18 channels when I scanned. This time it was 31 or 32! My problems with KBHK are fixed now too.

Odd thing, it scanned one analog channel, KGO, Channel 7.

BTW, Guide data doesn't work with ANALOG channels! Ah, who cares! :lol: 

Sub-channels do not work with guide data, I've got 5 subchannels for PBS, and they all say there is some program about Barney. :nono2: 

Looks good so far though.


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## Mark Lamutt

Todd G. said:


> Mark,
> 
> Did we get the signal strenght meter in the info screen for the ota guide?
> 
> Todd


 Yes, and I've updated the list in the top message accordingly. The SS meter shows in the lower right corner of the browse banner screen when you tune to an OTA channel. There are a lot of other things like this I'm sure that I've been using for weeks now that have slipped my mind... :blush:


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## Mark Lamutt

gpflepsen said:


> Can I power the 921 on while the power button is flashing? Will this interrupt the SW download?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Gerry P


 You can, but you run the risk of interrupting the download if you use the 2nd tuner for anything. It'd be better to wait until the power light stops blinking, and then give it 5 minutes more to reboot.


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## Mark Lamutt

I'm starting OTA channel specific threads for problems. Please post problems there, not in this thread. Let's keep this thread for questions, please.


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## sleepy hollow

Outstanding job, Mark. Thank you again for your persistence and professionalism in the face of some real ugly customers. 

I look forward to a new improved 921 even though the one I have is doing great already. 

I am building a HT room in my basement (framing about done, on to wiring next) and cannot wait to see the 100 inch version of HD college hoops in on my 921. Go Duke (Class of '79)!


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## TowJumper

Eagles said:


> Could you explain or supply a screen shot? Thanks!


Here is an attached screenshot, you can see the meter bar (reading 116) AND the local channel program info - very nice.

New version looks good so far.


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## Dustin_Moore

TowJumper said:


> Here is an attached screenshot, you can see the meter bar (reading 116) AND the local channel program info - very nice.
> 
> New version looks good so far.


THANKS!!


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## Mark Lamutt

I have added #5 to the caveats above, suggesting that you redefine your preset timers using the guide data on your OTA channels to guarantee that the guide data maps over to the recordings.


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## HD921

Did anything get fixed on the stretch mod in SD?


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## Mark Lamutt

All of the aspect ratios look perfect (with just a slight bit of overscan) on my Sony rear projection television. I don't know how they look on fixed panel displays.


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## kzosat

TowJumper said:


> Here is an attached screenshot, you can see the meter bar (reading 116) AND the local channel program info - very nice.
> 
> New version looks good so far.


Cmon, you just saved that for the cleavage shot.


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## sampatterson

kzosat said:


> Cmon, you just saved that for the cleavage shot.


You read my mind. Mark, thanks for picking appropriate background shots on your screencaps :hurah:


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## ayalbaram

Installing new sw right now!!! finially here!


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## Hoxxx

I did not see caller ID listed in the fix list. I have never had it work in Phoenix on my 921. Using Cox Digital phone service.

:nono2: :nono2:


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## ebaltz

I am in Phoenix too with Cox Digital telephone. Haven't yet tested the caller ID, I hope that it works on the 921, works on my 501 and 510.


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## ebaltz

What does the Hard Drive Test thing actually do? I am guessing it is some kind of checkdsk or defrag program.


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## TowJumper

sampatterson said:


> You read my mind. Mark, thanks for picking appropriate background shots on your screencaps :hurah:


Yes, I hope my wife does not see Mark's rather racy screenshot. :grin:


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## rjenkins

A couple of things that "bit" me on this update...

1) Display type of 4x3 #2 acts way differently than it used to. I loved the way it used to work. I switched to 4x3 #1 and it seems much better. They may have flip-flopped the way #1 and #2 worked, or something. The ZOOM on postage-boxed material now doesn't zoom enough for me, though. I see part of the gray side-bars on zoomed 4x3 material on CBS-HD, for example. Slightly annoying.

2) I had to go into preferences and reset the screen offset preferences. For some reason it was way high and to the right as compared to before the update.

The "trick-play" on all the OTA channels now works, though. My local CBS had troubles before.

The OTA guide data is the same for all sub-channels, no matter what, for me. (Salt Lake City locals) Not a big deal, much better than no guide data at all.


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## BFG

TowJumper said:


> Here is an attached screenshot, you can see the meter bar (reading 116) AND the local channel program info - very nice.
> 
> New version looks good so far.


Wow, 116 as an OTA Signal, I'm jealous. And the PQ on that TV is extremely good!


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## Bismarck

I wish I hadn't found out the new SW is downloading. Am I the only person stuck at work who can't get home soon enough to check it out?!


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## pbrown

It appears that the bug that made the 921 revert to 480p when turned off in SD mode may have been fixed. I'm not sure if it will survive the overnight reboot, but if I set it for 1080i, switch to SD, turn it off, turn it back on, and switch to HD, it comes back to 1080i. Any one else have this good luck? Mark, any news on if this is truly fixed?


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## Redster

Bismarck said:


> I wish I hadn't found out the new SW is downloading. Am I the only person stuck at work who can't get home soon enough to check it out?!


nah,, me too,, another 2 hours to go till I can play.


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## tahoerob

What happens to guide data if analog LIL PBS station ( & guide info) has DIFFERENT programming from HD version?

Ex. WETA HD in DC has a different HD schedule on 26-1 vs 26-2 that shows actual analog Ch 26 programs.
Ex. Another PBS shows PBS HD 24/7 (21-1) programs but analog station has differnt programming (seen on 21-2)


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## Mark Lamutt

Hey, well I'm at work as well... 

CallerID fixes - I know there was some work done with callerid along the way in beta, but I can't say one way or the other because it has always worked for me. Let us know, will you? (and hopefully not in a bug report!)

4x3 displays - I only did very limited testing on the 4x3 modes on my 16x9 television, so I don't really know how they changed.

The reverting to 480p bug if rebooted set to 480i, once again I don't know. This one was never on any of our test scripts, so it's possible, but I don't have any information about it.


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## BFG

It will show show the analog pbs guide data on the -01 channel, even though it's not on the channel, kinda dumb, but that's how it goes...


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## Mark Lamutt

tahoerob said:


> What happens to guide data if analog LIL PBS station ( & guide info) has DIFFERENT programming from HD version?
> 
> Ex. WETA HD in DC has a different HD schedule on 26-1 vs 26-2 that shows actual analog Ch 26 programs.
> Ex. Another PBS shows PBS HD 24/7 (21-1) programs but analog station has differnt programming (seen on 21-2)


 Then the PBS guide data will be wrong. It's the same issue that plagues the HDTivos as well with PBS. Apparently the FCC took away the simulcast requirement that PBS stations had to do, but a lot of them are still simulcasting their analog stations at least 12 hours a day, and PBS has NEVER been very good at providing digial guide data to any service. I suspect we're going to have problems with PBS guide data for some time to come.


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## SpenceJT

Mark Lamutt said:


> Then the PBS guide data will be wrong. It's the same issue that plagues the HDTivos as well with PBS. Apparently the FCC took away the simulcast requirement that PBS stations had to do, but a lot of them are still simulcasting their analog stations at least 12 hours a day, and PBS has NEVER been very good at providing digial guide data to any service. I suspect we're going to have problems with PBS guide data for some time to come.


Still, it's better than nothing!


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## leemathre

Bismarck said:


> I wish I hadn't found out the new SW is downloading. Am I the only person stuck at work who can't get home soon enough to check it out?!


Nope, I'm dying here at work also and can't wait to get home to check out the new software on both of my 921's.


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## PacersGuy

Mark Lamutt said:


> 7. Teach IR feature has been added to the Diagnostics page (Menu-6-5). You can now use this feature to teach your learning remote the IR codes from the 921, without having to use another Dish remote.


Rats! And I had only two days ago ordered a 6.0 remote to "train" my MX-500!

Steve


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## SpenceJT

leemathre said:


> Nope, I'm dying here at work also and can't wait to get home to check out the new software on both of my 921's.


I stand with my "at work" brethren anxiously waiting to get the HELL OUTTA HERE! :lol:


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## ebaltz

L211 downloaded perfectly for me. OTAs are all still there an in my guide with guide information (except for local UPN station). Guide is also for the full 9 days. Didn't have to unplug, restart or anything. Added OTAs to my favorites no problem, didn't need to rescan for them. Don't see any issues in my first look at stuff. Looks like the help screens need to be updated in a couple of places, but otherwise everything looking great. Love the signal strength meter for OTAs.


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## jsanders

Mark Lamutt said:


> Then the PBS guide data will be wrong. It's the same issue that plagues the HDTivos as well with PBS. Apparently the FCC took away the simulcast requirement that PBS stations had to do, but a lot of them are still simulcasting their analog stations at least 12 hours a day, and PBS has NEVER been very good at providing digial guide data to any service. I suspect we're going to have problems with PBS guide data for some time to come.


To be honest, I think they did a hack with this OTA guide data (they just re-mapped the analog). When the 811 got OTA guide data, I believe it was GaryPen that said PBS subchannels were fine, but that KRON sub-channel 2 was bogus. Based on that assumption, I believe that sub-channel guide data is being transmitted, but the 921 doesn't use it. I say it doesn't use it because the sub-channels just miror what the main channel does. They are also not indexing their database by call letters, which I think is the most efficient way to do it. An example of this is the local NBC station in San Jose, CA. 11.1, KNTV, transmits a signal that not many can receive easily. So, they also transmit on telemundo, 48.2. The call letters for 48.2 even say the station is KNTV, however, the guide data is *not* NBC, it is mirrored as the telemundo guide.


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## Mark Lamutt

jsanders - please post that in the OTA Guide Data bug thread. Like I said, this is a work in progress.

I've updated the initial post with a caveat #6 about setting timers from the guide data for OTA channels.


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## Allen Noland

Bismarck said:


> I wish I hadn't found out the new SW is downloading. Am I the only person stuck at work who can't get home soon enough to check it out?!


Your not alone. I too am stuck at work.


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## PacersGuy

SpenceJT said:


> I stand with my "at work" brethren anxiously waiting to get the HELL OUTTA HERE! :lol:


still at work as well, but fortunately have a fiance' that works from home! download has started.


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## ebaltz

Hoxxx said:


> I did not see caller ID listed in the fix list. I have never had it work in Phoenix on my 921. Using Cox Digital phone service.
> 
> :nono2: :nono2:


Working for me in Phoenix with Cox Digital telephone. Just got my first call and it showed up fine. Sweet.


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## Hoxxx

ebaltz said:


> Working for me in Phoenix with Cox Digital telephone. Just got my first call and it showed up fine. Sweet.


Well I sure hope I have the same success. I wont know for 5 more hours.


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## jsanders

Mark Lamutt said:


> jsanders - please post that in the OTA Guide Data bug thread. Like I said, this is a work in progress.


I will post that in the other thread when I get home. I had to go to work, and I want to be able to add as much detail as possible to the thread that counts.

Is there a need to do the traditional poll, "Are you still having problems with OTA reception?" My stuff looks better at a first pass, a lot better actually. I'm just curious as to how good we are doing this time around.


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## Mark Lamutt

jsanders said:


> Is there a need to do the traditional poll, "Are you still having problems with OTA reception?" My stuff looks better at a first pass, a lot better actually. I'm just curious as to how good we are doing this time around.


No poll this time around, just a thread to catch all of the reports.


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## Flasshe

I'm stuck at work too, but I feel like I'm coming down with something... *cough* *cough*... yeah, I think I need to go home and "rest"...

Thanks for all the info and everything, Mark!


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## zer0cool

how can i make my 921 fetch the download? I've had it off for an hour or so and still haven't gotten 211


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## Mark Lamutt

Original Post updated with Caveat #7 - not a good idea to set a timer for an OTA digital station from search results. We (beta) missed that one.


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## JM Anthony

Thanks, Mark. I was looking for reason to skip out of work early. Now I've got one! This looks like a landmark release. Thanks for all of your blood, sweat, and tears to help us get to this point. You provided one helluva service to all the 921 users on this forum as well as the rest of the user community. Thanks for your efforts. You must have married well.


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## Mark Lamutt

zer0cool - make sure that yours hasn't already taken the download and installed it (Menu-6-1). If not, do a power plug reboot, and then wait. This was sent to everyone in a wide rollout, unlike the other receivers which go through limited release periods.


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## Mark Lamutt

JM Anthony said:


> Thanks, Mark. I was looking for reason to skip out of work early. Now I've got one! This looks like a landmark release. Thanks for all of your blood, sweat, and tears to help us get to this point. You provided one helluva service to all the 921 users on this forum as well as the rest of the user community. Thanks for your efforts. You must have married well.


You're welcome.  This is why I do this. And yes, I married very well...  My wife is VERY understanding, not to mention she very much enjoys the benefits!


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## Mark Lamutt

ebaltz said:


> What does the Hard Drive Test thing actually do? I am guessing it is some kind of checkdsk or defrag program.


I missed replying to this one earlier...sorry about that!

Honestly, I'm not sure what this new option does. But, I am sure that it will take a VLT (VERY LONG TIME) to do the test. At one point after it showed up, I started the process. More than an hour later, it had gone through about 10 of the tests, with many, many more to go, so I just pulled the plug. There doesn't seem to be a way to cancel out of it without rebooting, so if you aren't having any problems, I'd stay away from this one personally. Unless you have a VLT to kill.


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## zer0cool

I checked and it was still 188. I rebooted and Tv is back on but my menu won't come up, and neither will the system info by the button on the receiver.


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## zer0cool

Oops, just realized I've got a timer set to fire at 3pm, but I'd happily cancel it if it'll give me 211 faster.


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## Mark Lamutt

zer0cool - you've been having some really whacked problems with your 921 since you got it. Try pressing and holding the SysInfo button on the front of the 921 for awhile to see if that will bring up the sysinfo screen. If not, then try doing the power plug reboot again (you HAVE to pull the power plug to get out of this particular loop) and see what happens.


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## Mark Lamutt

Shouldn't matter if you have a timer firing or not - the other tuner will be used to take the software download.


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## zer0cool

Ok, pulled the plug and now I can get into the menu and info. Still 188. Do I need to stop the recording in progress to get the update?


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## ebaltz

Mark Lamutt said:


> I missed replying to this one earlier...sorry about that!
> 
> Honestly, I'm not sure what this new option does. But, I am sure that it will take a VLT (VERY LONG TIME) to do the test. At one point after it showed up, I started the process. More than an hour later, it had gone through about 10 of the tests, with many, many more to go, so I just pulled the plug. There doesn't seem to be a way to cancel out of it without rebooting, so if you aren't having any problems, I'd stay away from this one personally. Unless you have a VLT to kill.


Thanks, I ran it out of curiousity, it took maybe 5-10 minutes to run through whatever it was doing and said Hard Drive is Fine or something like that. I have always thought my 501 needed a defrag routine, makes sense since this is a hard drive and they slow down and do a lot of grinding when fragmented.


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## zer0cool

Power light is flashing like crazy now! Should be up soon.


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## Redster

L211 downloaded and installed. I deleted all OTA's and did a plug reboot for 10 minutes then rescanned all OTA's. I got all I had before plus one analog. I now have trick functions on WTHR that I had lost way back when. I also have guide data and all subs show in guide. I set dvr to record OTA 013-1 live and no red dot either on OTA channel or dish local. It did actually record the OTA though. Yeaaa .....Thanks Mark for all your perserverence and hard work. Thanks to all the beta testers,, this one looks like a keeper.


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## David_Levin

Bismarck said:


> I wish I hadn't found out the new SW is downloading. Am I the only person stuck at work who can't get home soon enough to check it out?!


Damm, I'm "STUCK" here on a cruise ship with a balcony currently overlooking St. Thomas (tomorrow it's St. Maarten). Won't be home till Sunday. (Hmmm, perhaps I shouldn't be complaining).

But, serously, what am I in for when I get home? I have mostly Sat timers and a few OTA timers set. Are they likely to fire? Should I try and get my neighbor to reset the boxes (not even sure he can find all the switches to get the theatre fired up).


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## boylehome

ebaltz said:


> What does the Hard Drive Test thing actually do? I am guessing it is some kind of checkdsk or defrag program.


Did you try it? I did. It went down to 248 and that is where it stayed until I rebooted 30minutes later.


----------



## Redster

well all my locals were still there,, your ota recordings still may work.


----------



## bbomar

Local channel downmapping is a little hard to find in the preferences
menu. It is on the second page and is labeled Enable Off-Air Antenna Locals.
You must remove the check mark (i.e. disable - this means disable analog
off-antenna locals which then down maps the satellite locals).

I'm in the Nashville DMA but also receive all Huntsville,AL DMA stations.
Only Nashville is in the guide data even though Dish carries the Huntsville
stations. Must be keyed to DMA location. Not a big deal since we
generally don't rotate the antenna to Huntsville anyway.


----------



## TonyB

bbomar, Thanks for the note. I was wondering how it would have the downshifting of the SAT locals. I have an OTA antenna so have the analog channels and the digital sub channels. So I have the local analog channels such as 4 and 5. When the SAT locals are programmed down - I assume they simply replace the analog 4, 5 etc.

I also am looking forward to the signal strength meter for OTA. It will help me tune the antenna direction for best signal - at the moment channel 4 (CBS) keeps pixelating a lot. I had to give up on the HD Patriots game Sunday and settle for SD local because I kept missing plays.

Can't wait to get home and download the new code.

Thanks,


----------



## garyhesq

I just got home and played a little with 921. I seem to have a problem with info. If I am watching a show, OTA or SAT, and hit the info button, the first time it pops the info up transparently. The second hit makes it blink and it pops back on transparent again. A third hit makes it disappear as it use to. So I seem to have lost my solid info screen. I looked in my preferences and I have all transparencies turned off. Anyone else seeing this?


----------



## ebaltz

garyhesq said:


> I just got home and played a little with 921. I seem to have a problem with info. If I am watching a show, OTA or SAT, and hit the info button, the first time it pops the info up transparently. The second hit makes it blink and it pops back on transparent again. A third hit makes it disappear as it use to. So I seem to have lost my solid info screen. I looked in my preferences and I have all transparencies turned off. Anyone else seeing this?


Yeah I think I saw that as well, now that you mention it. I will have to look at again when the ambient light is darker to see what it looks like.


----------



## ebaltz

boylehome said:


> Did you try it? I did. It went down to 248 and that is where it stayed until I rebooted 30minutes later.


It worked for me. Took about 5-10 minutes and finished successfully. How many recordings do you have on your disk. I have used up maybe 20 hours right now. Maybe full drives take a lot longer.


----------



## ebaltz

Redster said:


> well all my locals were still there,, your ota recordings still may work.


Mine were still there and seems like they should work. Didn't need to reset or restart anything.


----------



## garyhesq

I rebooted and tried info again. Now the second hit just takes some of the transparency away but you can still see through it.



ebaltz said:


> Yeah I think I saw that as well, now that you mention it. I will have to look at again when the ambient light is darker to see what it looks like.


----------



## boylehome

ebaltz said:


> It worked for me. Took about 5-10 minutes and finished successfully. How many recordings do you have on your disk. I have used up maybe 20 hours right now. Maybe full drives take a lot longer.


I have about 6 hours of HD space left


----------



## ebaltz

boylehome said:


> I have about 6 hours of HD space left


Bingo.


----------



## Jason Kragt

Very nice!

It took two tries before I was able to get the local channels to "stick" in a favorites list, but they are there now. I'm debating whether or not I want to map Dish's four-digit local channels to their two-digit OTA numbers. I rarely use my locals package anymore since I can get them digitally OTA.

I needed to manually reboot by pulling the power cord. The full 8-day guide remained intact. I re-scanned for local digital signals and it found a new subchannel, WZZM 13-2. It is only a weather radar channel. I wonder if they just launched it today or if the new software was able to find something that the old couldn't.


----------



## Bismarck

Finally, it's Quitin' Time! I'm headed home. Agenda: First, power plug reboot. Second, get cold beer. Third, sink into ez chair and watch silver dish logo bounce around while waiting for reboot. Fourth, get another beer. Finally, explore L211 .... Wish me luck!


----------



## mwgiii

Bismarck, I'll drink to that!


----------



## lapplegate

Jason Kragt said:


> Very nice!
> 
> It took two tries before I was able to get the local channels to "stick" in a favorites list, but they are there now.


I have tried power cord boot and the other attempts, but still can't get the OTA digitals into the favorites. It is just as it was, OTAs in the browse banner, all channels & all subs, but not in any favorites I created.

I have even tried creating a new favorites list, no luck.
Any ideas out there?

Thanks,
Larry


----------



## boylehome

lapplegate said:


> I have tried power cord boot and the other attempts, but still can't get the OTA digitals into the favorites. It is just as it was, OTAs in the browse banner, all channels & all subs, but not in any favorites I created.
> 
> I have even tried creating a new favorites list, no luck.
> Any ideas out there?
> 
> Thanks,
> Larry


Did you first delete all of your OTA locals and do a power cord reboot and then re-add the OTA locals before trying to put the OTA's into favorites?


----------



## deweybrunner

Boylehome, I did everything you said and still no ota guide info. On another thread they said you have to subscribe to Dish's ota in order to get guide info.? Said 6.00 month. I think this is wrong. Can someone enlighten me on thisl.


----------



## ClaudeR

Excellent job (again) Mark. Thank you. I've only had the 921 four days, and have been longing for OTA favorites. 

Many Kudos.


----------



## grassvalley

Mark Lamutt said:


> zer0cool - make sure that yours hasn't already taken the download and installed it (Menu-6-1). If not, do a power plug reboot, and then wait. This was sent to everyone in a wide rollout, unlike the other receivers which go through limited release periods.


I'm stuck, I did all the above and waited 30 minutes. I know I got the downloand but I'm stuck at 188. How long should I wait for?


----------



## Grandude

Lost all recordings. 
I decided to try recording a program off the one OTA channel that I get reliably with signal strength of 85 or so on the 921 meter. It appeared to record properly, started at 3PM and ended at 4PM. It was listed properly in the DVR recorded events screen. I then tried to watch it and all I got was a black screen. It was then somewhat stuck. I was not able to fast forward or jump forward or pause or do much of anything but finally was able to get the guide screen to come up. 
I was then unable to get it to jump to any other channel. I finally had to do a power button reset and was able to get going again. BUT, DANGIT..........I lost ALL my recorded programs. Everything is gone. I guess that will teach me to try to use it as it was designed.........sheesh.................guess I'll have to stick with only Dish programming again.
Tried unplugging the 921 for a while to see if anything would come back but no luck.


----------



## flmilkfarmer

My 921 is updated to the 211 software and my locals are mapped to the lower channels and my OTA channels have guide info however I did not have to rescan for them they are all still there as far as I can tell.


----------



## tahoerob

bbomar said:


> Local channel downmapping is a little hard to find in the preferences
> menu. It is on the second page and is labeled Enable Off-Air Antenna Locals.
> You must remove the check mark (i.e. disable - this means disable analog
> off-antenna locals which then down maps the satellite locals).


YES, I had to figure that out too. 
Mark, please suggest that they CHANGE the default to UNCHECK this item. I bet that most of us will want our Dish SD LIL & not analog OTA.


----------



## Bismarck

Well, L211 is up and running. I did lose my guide data going out past a couple of hours, as Mark said. However, it appears to be re-populating, albeit slowly. Some channels (both sat and OTA) are starting to show guide data going out several hours. 

There's definitely a couple of interesting new quirks in L211. I run mine 16:9 at 720p. The preview window for 4:3 SD channels used to be stretched to fill the 16:9 preview window. Now, on OTA channels it shows black bars in the preview window, i.e. it accurately previews the image. On sat channels, however, it is still stretching. I'm still exploring this. I've set new timers, per Mark's instruction, on the OTA channels. I don't get any red dot for tonite's recordings though, on either the OTA channel listing or the regular sat local listing. The timer appears correctly on the timers page, but no red dot anywhere. Finally, sometimes when I manually enter an OTA channel number, say 002 or 011, it jumps down to a 9000s number (curiously, it always goes to the ABC affiliate channel, which is KTRK in Houston). If I enter the guide, I can then properly select the desired OTA local. What's wierd is that it is not doing this all the time. Need to explore that some more.

Otherwise, loving the new OTA guide data. Here's to hoping those timers fire properly, or there will be hell to pay in my house.

Finally, I'll join the chorus of those who've written to say thanks to Mark for his hard work and PATIENCE with us.


----------



## Eagles

Mark Lamutt said:


> Eagles, I suspect you'll only have guide data for the OTA channels you get from your Dish Locals city. But, I don't know that for sure, so please let me know what you end up with. I really wish I had that problem in Denver!


Mark, The Baltimore and Salisbury locals have "NO INFO AVAILABLE". In another response to this question BFG said the 811 somehow gives the info from other locals if that other city has Dish locals available. Any chance Dish can get the 921 to do this.


----------



## scpanel

Well, I finally got 211 to download and so far it appears to have solved my slow response and lockup issue, but only time will tell for sure. The guide is finally back to normal and the locals mapped down is great!

Mark, Thank you for all you do we all do appreciate it and I cant believe its finally here!


DVR-921,811,501 and 2-301's
921 TO Sammy 5674 and Krell HTS 7.1/TAS
BOOT: 140B
FLASH: F052
VERSION: L211HECD-N


----------



## bbomar

grassvalley said:


> I'm stuck, I did all the above and waited 30 minutes. I know I got the downloand but I'm stuck at 188. How long should I wait for?


After my 921 showed in its software update menu that the software had
downloaded, I did a power plug reset. When the 921 came back up
it showed an updating software screen for a while. After the reboot
was complete it still showed L188 and had no guide data. I powered 
the unit off again (power plug reset) and left it alone with the power
light off (power button on remote) but plugged in for 30 minutes or so, 
and when I turned it back on it showed L211 and had guide data. I
guess it wants to take its time.


----------



## boylehome

deweybrunner said:


> Boylehome, I did everything you said and still no ota guide info. On another thread they said you have to subscribe to Dish's ota in order to get guide info.? Said 6.00 month. I think this is wrong. Can someone enlighten me on thisl.


deweybrunner, I believe that is true. Having read through this thread, it does sound like the local OTA's are remapped through the lil's. Anyone knowing factually, correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## boylehome

Grandude said:


> Lost all recordings.
> I decided to try recording a program off the one OTA channel that I get reliably with signal strength of 85 or so on the 921 meter. It appeared to record properly, started at 3PM and ended at 4PM. It was listed properly in the DVR recorded events screen. I then tried to watch it and all I got was a black screen. It was then somewhat stuck. I was not able to fast forward or jump forward or pause or do much of anything but finally was able to get the guide screen to come up.
> I was then unable to get it to jump to any other channel. I finally had to do a power button reset and was able to get going again. BUT, DANGIT..........I lost ALL my recorded programs. Everything is gone. I guess that will teach me to try to use it as it was designed.........sheesh.................guess I'll have to stick with only Dish programming again.
> Tried unplugging the 921 for a while to see if anything would come back but no luck.


This is scary. I've changed some of my satellite DVR events to OTA DVR events. With L188 I experienced "0" time DVR recording when I did OTA. I did some experimenting and found that if there was no signal, it would act like it was recording when, in fact, it wasn't. I wonder if Mark L. has encountered what you have experienced?


----------



## Grandude

boylehome said:


> This is scary. I've changed some of my satellite DVR events to OTA DVR events. With L188 I experienced "0" time DVR recording when I did OTA. I did some experimenting and found that if there was no signal, it would act like it was recording when, in fact, it wasn't. I wonder if Mark L. has encountered what you have experienced?


Judging from my experience, I wouldn't try it if you have anything important already recorded that you want to watch. Needless to say I am VERY upset.
I never had a single problem recording Dish programs. 
I could understand that maybe a problem or two would occur if I tried to record a marginal OTA channel but this one was always solid for me.


----------



## JimTsillas

*also my first post - I love the 921 *

I am successfully running L211: SW Version: L211HEED-N

- can someone explain the version number; I've seen others give slightly different versions

- I deleted the OTAs, rebooted (power cord), rescanned the OTAs but.. sadly, no guide data for me   I guess I'll wait until tomorrow and see if the guid data appears

- otherwise everything seems to be working OK

Do I need to subscribe to locals for OTA guide data? Is Boston, MA a Dish locals market? I am using a legacy Dish 500 setup with a Dish 300 for foreign language.

thanks for all the hard work and great info in these forums.


----------



## zer0cool

I tried to browse to the upcoming episode of House on Fox (Dish local 4). I created a timer for it, but a window popped saying it was blacked out or not authorized. I tried to set it for the 8400- equivelant for Fox and got the same error. From channel 4 once House started up, I hit the record button and got the "record remainder of this event?" popup. I selected yes, and the record light came on, but the error window popped up again. I hit cancel, and it kept recording OK.


----------



## tnsprin

Mark Lamutt said:


> Here it comes, folks!
> ...


Previous thread titles. When will L189/L210/L211 Download.

Well my date lost. Who won by picking Pearl Harbor Day?


----------



## Hoxxx

Well my 921 took the L211 update and I still do not have caller ID.

Phoenix,AZ Cox digital phone.
:nono: :nono:


----------



## lenny

Hoxxx said:


> Well my 921 took the L211 update and I still do not have caller ID.
> 
> Phoenix,AZ Cox digital phone.
> :nono: :nono:


I know this doesn't help you right now, but they may be getting closer to fixing everyone. My caller ID never worked but now started working after L211.

Lenny - Buffalo, NY Verizon


----------



## JD Robinson

This isn't in the "bug" category exactly so I'll keep it out of that thread, but it might be a thing to fix in a future SW push.

My H211 came in sometime during the day I was thrilled to find out -- the little OTA strength meter cued me to check. I immediately pulled the power cord to do a fresh boot, but after the SD/HD logo screen the unit was locked in HD-only output (but with a black screen) and wouldn't accept *any* buttons from remote or front panel. There was no traditional "please wait; downloading info from sat" message or anything. I waited about 10 minutes, then pulled the cord again but got the same thing.

I was sure that 211 had fried my unit, but I left it on and gave the kid a bath. When I returned about 30 mins later everything was hunky-dory. I think it actually was hung on the "Retriving from satellite" status but nothing was displayed so it really freaked me out.

Just in case anyone else is frantically searching here for why their 921 seems broken: be patient!


----------



## boylehome

Grandude said:


> Judging from my experience, I wouldn't try it if you have anything important already recorded that you want to watch. Needless to say I am VERY upset.
> I never had a single problem recording Dish programs.
> I could understand that maybe a problem or two would occur if I tried to record a marginal OTA channel but this one was always solid for me.


I have, how does Charlie put it, "no compelling content." They should start firing at 8:00 PST.


----------



## FaxMan

zer0cool said:


> I tried to browse to the upcoming episode of House on Fox (Dish local 4). I created a timer for it, but a window popped saying it was blacked out or not authorized. I tried to set it for the 8400- equivelant for Fox and got the same error. From channel 4 once House started up, I hit the record button and got the "record remainder of this event?" popup. I selected yes, and the record light came on, but the error window popped up again. I hit cancel, and it kept recording OK.


I got the same thing tonight.

Had re-created a weekly timer to record NYPD Blue on a local LiL. It seemed to take. At about the time Mr. Blinky would have started, I got the same error. Tried to set timers a few more times with the same error. Started recording manually when the time came, got the error message, but it appears to have recorded.

Also noticed that the Aspect zoom seemed to change on its own as was channel/dvr surfing. I'll try to re-create the issue and report appropriately.


----------



## tnsprin

JimTsillas said:


> *also my first post - I love the 921 *
> 
> I am successfully running L211: SW Version: L211HEED-N
> 
> - can someone explain the version number; I've seen others give slightly different versions
> 
> ...


I have the same question. I have two 921's and see hecd and heed.


----------



## JM Anthony

This is a VERY nice improvement. I'm going to guess this is a "halo effect", but when I deleted my locals and rescanned, I picked up a couple of new channels and my reception seems to have improved. It's a rainy night in Seattle which normally means spotty (at best) OTA reception. Not tonight. Pretty much rock solid.

Sweet!!


----------



## dishbacker

I'm gonna add to the positive feedback for this release. Lots of great fixes. Can we start asking what's coming next? Nah, lets savior this one for a few days. Great job Dish Beta testers and of course Mark!


----------



## Mark Lamutt

deweybrunner said:


> Boylehome, I did everything you said and still no ota guide info. On another thread they said you have to subscribe to Dish's ota in order to get guide info.? Said 6.00 month. I think this is wrong. Can someone enlighten me on thisl.


From the 811 reports, you don't have to sub to the local channel package to get the OTA guide data. See if you have it in the morning. This may be a guide data issue in general.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Eagles said:


> Mark, The Baltimore and Salisbury locals have "NO INFO AVAILABLE". In another response to this question BFG said the 811 somehow gives the info from other locals if that other city has Dish locals available. Any chance Dish can get the 921 to do this.


I'm waiting to hear back about this one. I did send in the question earlier today.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

zer0cool said:


> I tried to browse to the upcoming episode of House on Fox (Dish local 4). I created a timer for it, but a window popped saying it was blacked out or not authorized. I tried to set it for the 8400- equivelant for Fox and got the same error. From channel 4 once House started up, I hit the record button and got the "record remainder of this event?" popup. I selected yes, and the record light came on, but the error window popped up again. I hit cancel, and it kept recording OK.


Please post this in the proper Bug Report format in the Bug Reports forum. This is one that I haven't seen.


----------



## wcswett

Mark Lamutt said:


> I missed replying to this one earlier...sorry about that!
> 
> Honestly, I'm not sure what this new option does. But, I am sure that it will take a VLT (VERY LONG TIME) to do the test. At one point after it showed up, I started the process. More than an hour later, it had gone through about 10 of the tests, with many, many more to go, so I just pulled the plug. There doesn't seem to be a way to cancel out of it without rebooting, so if you aren't having any problems, I'd stay away from this one personally. Unless you have a VLT to kill.


I did the HD test this evening, just for the heck of it. It was so slow that I watched two half hour recordings off another PVR, did some PVR housekeeping, then checked back and the HD test was done. All it said was "HD is ok". Guess I don't need to ever do that again. Sorry I don't know exactly how long it took but it was more than an hour and less than two.

--- WCS


----------



## Mark Lamutt

FaxMan said:


> I got the same thing tonight.
> 
> Had re-created a weekly timer to record NYPD Blue on a local LiL. It seemed to take. At about the time Mr. Blinky would have started, I got the same error. Tried to set timers a few more times with the same error. Started recording manually when the time came, got the error message, but it appears to have recorded.
> 
> Also noticed that the Aspect zoom seemed to change on its own as was channel/dvr surfing. I'll try to re-create the issue and report appropriately.


You too, Faxman - please post this in the proper format in the Bug Reports Forum.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Grandude - you're the first one (that I've heard of) that has lost recordings due to this one. None of the beta testers did, and in fact, I've only lost recordings once in the 40 or 50 test versions that I've been through. I'm sorry that you did, but I really have no idea what would have caused it.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

And finally, differences in the last 4 letters of the software versions really don't have any meaning to us, the users. They indicate which run the 921s came from, and a couple of other engineering type things to the programmers. That's about it, but that's why I ask you to include your full software version, boot version and flash version when posting bug reports.


----------



## Flasshe

Update installed fine here. I can now record and trick-play off KUSA again - yeah! Everything seems to be working, as far as I can tell, though I have experienced the "lack of red dot in the guide" problem when setting up timers for OTA channels.

Looks like this is a nice pre-Christmas present!


----------



## jsanders

Are you sure you don't need a subscription to have the guide data?

I had guide data this morning, but I don't have it anymore! What happened? 

When I went to work today, I finally cancelled my locals because I was only using them for the guide data!

What gives???? Dish better not be charging for guide data, that will be the last straw for me if it is true.

What does this menu in the preferences, "Off-Air Antenna Locals" mean btw? I thought someone said that if the box was checked, it would remap the locals to the OTA, but if it wasn't checked, it would use some digital OTA guide data. Can anyone clarify??


----------



## jsanders

Whooops! I put that post in the wrong thread.... Posting a duplicate (sorry!) in the right place....


----------



## SteveB

I arrived home without checking the latest on DBSTalk. My 921 was running slow again, so I did a power reboot for 100th time (I do it about every 2 days), so it would respond faster. Much to my surprise the screen came up with the message that it was updating the new software. THANK GOD AND FOR THE PROGRAMMERS. The response time is faster than ever, as good as my old 508 (I still use for my SDTVs).

When I a can wrestle the remote from my wife (she saw something that was worth watching), I will do some tests to see if the OTA channels have good guide info. 

Hope I don't have to ever reboot again. 

PS. This is a great forum.

Steve


----------



## guruka

JM Anthony said:


> This is a VERY nice improvement. I'm going to guess this is a "halo effect", but when I deleted my locals and rescanned, I picked up a couple of new channels and my reception seems to have improved. It's a rainy night in Seattle which normally means spotty (at best) OTA reception. Not tonight. Pretty much rock solid.
> 
> Sweet!!


Yes, I am definitely experiencing better OTA DT reception with L211. The signal strengths on the meter are the same as before, but the 921 is locking tenaciously on weaker signals that it would not lock on consistently before. Multipath is not an issue here since I'm rural and over 60 mi from the xmitters and all the local OTA's have their antennas co-located. I don't have LOS to the antennas, but my antenna position now brings in all the locals just fine. I can even receive KOB (NBC OTA local from Albuquerque) that would not lock at all before. L211 is a huge improvement in OTA functionality. All OTA recordings have fired perfectly and, aside from having no EPG data for PBS HD, everything seems hunky-dory so far. I do subscribe to sat locals, so I can't comment on the missing EPG data for folks who don't subscribe to sat locals.

.....G


----------



## mwsmith2

I agree with you on the vastly better OTA DT reception. My local PBS station was a lockup-n'-reboot generator for the 921. It also gave my 6000 fits. Now it sucks in all the channels and works great. I'm also seeing new subchannels I didn't before, even with my 6000. Signal strength meter is very helpful...now I can aim my antenna like I did with my 6000.  Last night PBS was broadcasting Chris Isaak's Christmas special in full 5.1, WOW, what a great picture and fantastic sound!

Michael


----------



## boylehome

OK Mark, I want you to know exactly how I feel about this L211 update. Here it goes. My new second 921 is in the mail. Yes, I'm retiring my 721 for another 921. Unless L211 somehow gets FUBR, I'm a happy happy man  Merry Christmas to you and all.


----------



## boylehome

Grandude said:


> Judging from my experience, I wouldn't try it if you have anything important already recorded that you want to watch. Needless to say I am VERY upset.
> I never had a single problem recording Dish programs.
> I could understand that maybe a problem or two would occur if I tried to record a marginal OTA channel but this one was always solid for me.


Everything recorded with no problems. The only negative thing is that KRCR-ABC doesn't have PSIP so there is no channel remapping and no guide data, thus the title of my recorded KRCR programs are all the same, "Local Programming."


----------



## cpufixer1

I just ordered my 921 yesterday from Dish. They now sell them direct. 

I am still confused about the local channel remap. I want my sat locals to be remapped down to 2,4,5 etc , but where would my OTA locals then go ? 

Thanks for any help in advance.


----------



## Jim_R

Mark Lamutt said:


> Then the PBS guide data will be wrong. It's the same issue that plagues the HDTivos as well with PBS. Apparently the FCC took away the simulcast requirement that PBS stations had to do, but a lot of them are still simulcasting their analog stations at least 12 hours a day, and PBS has NEVER been very good at providing digial guide data to any service. I suspect we're going to have problems with PBS guide data for some time to come.


Mark,

There do appear to be some good sources of guide data for digital channels nationally. Take a look at www.titantv.com . Allows input of address or zip code to bring up a grid of OTA channels. For my area, listings (including sub-channels) are correct - I have yet to find a discrepancy. I'm not suggesting that Dish capture guide data from Titantv, but I am suggesting that Dish inquire as to the source of Titantv's data.


----------



## mwgiii

cpufixer,

Local satellite channels (ie 8050) can be remapped to local channel # (ie 40). Local digitals from an antenna are mapped to 040-1 040-2 ect.


----------



## bbriggs

I too use titantv and have not found a discrepency even on PBS in Des Moines. I've wondered too regarding the availability of that data and use for OTA guide for 811/921.


----------



## TonyB

I got home last night, waited til wife was done watching a program then took over the drivers seat.
1. deleted all timers
2. deleted all OTA, both dig and analog
3. Rebooted.
waited...
The download was quick and after 10 or so mins I was updated.
4. Rebooted
5. Scanned OTA abain
6. Disabled the OTA remap -- as described earlier in this thread
Dish Locals dropped to their correct places from 87xx into 2,4,5 etc. (dark blue background on ID)
Digital sub channels showed up (light blue background on ID) - great, now I know which is which.
7. Added some new timers.
At this point, none have fired off. Will see later today.

Observations:
1. All appears great. The local station dig broadcast OTA provides better picture than sat of the same local. ie. No reason to watch sat local is all capability for record etc exists on OTA local dig. signal.
2. I get program info for locals - same on all sub channels as expected. Since I do currently subscribe to dish locals I don't know whether I would if I dropped the dish local package. Looking forward to hearing Mark's answer on this.
3. The signal strength on OTA appears (subjectively so far) to have improved. Since there was no meter before its hard to tell. All I know is that on Sundays when I want to watch the Patriots on NFL, if its on CBS, most of the time I cannot watch the HD feed on the HD channels because they always show the Jets (who cares about them!). I have tried to watch the local CBS - WBZ in Boston, and keep losing the signal. Last night and this morning, WBZ dig OTA has been rock solid, signal meter reading about 120 (it does move about though, from about 120 to 100). I did notice that on some locals where the station is at 90 degrees from the antenna, the signal strength was about 70 and could not lock. From checking other channels it seems like 70-75 is the min to get a lock. 85 or better is fine.
4. Usually when watching a channel (4:3) on my 16:9 set I get black bars on the sides. The exception to that (found 1 so far) is that channel 04-1, WBZ Boston gives white bars. Does anybody else get different bars (either Black or White) for diff channels? no big deal, just wondered if the color is a code for something?
5. What does "Stereo out to RF or line output" mean. Its in the preferences section? Never noticed that before.
6. My thoughts on program info:
The current solution is to use the same data for sub channels as the main channel. Do the local stations broadcast program data for the sub channels or not? If yes, then the 921 should use it, if not then perhaps simply divide the time bar into 1 hour chunks but leave the content blank. After all, we would already see the main channel content. Question: is the -1 subchannel always/mostly/sometime the same as the main channel? if its always or mostly, then ussing the same program info for that is OK, otherwise leave it blank.

All in all, the new s/w is a great christmas present.


----------



## gboot

OK, so from the beginning. Per Mark's instructions.
After 211 had downloaded, I rebooted the receiver by unplugging it. I powered the unit on via the front console buttons. My remote (Dish 921 remote) no longer operates the 921, it worked before the download. The remote will control the TV functions. I have another remote (Radio Shack all-in-one) which I previously programmed to control my 6000. This remote still works with the 921.
I tried resetting the address of the remote, no improvement.
I find it hard to believe that the 211 download could cause this, but... 
Any ideas ?


----------



## Mark Lamutt

gboot - I'd call Dish and convince them to send you a new remote. I also find it hard to believe that 211 would break your remote control functionality, but not affect the rest of us.


----------



## Grandude

boylehome said:


> Everything recorded with no problems. The only negative thing is that KRCR-ABC doesn't have PSIP so there is no channel remapping and no guide data, thus the title of my recorded KRCR programs are all the same, "Local Programming."


I'm glad to hear that all went well for you. Have you watched all the recorded programs to see if they are ok? My problem occured when I tried to watch the one OTA program I recorded.
Brian


----------



## ebaltz

Hoxxx said:


> Well my 921 took the L211 update and I still do not have caller ID.
> 
> Phoenix,AZ Cox digital phone.
> :nono: :nono:


I am guessing the issue isn't with the 921 or L211. Since I have the same setup as you and mine works. Okay for stupid troubleshooting questions now. Have you subscribed to caller ID from Cox? (Is it working on your phones?). Do you have a telephone cable connected to the 921 and a wall jack? Are you using a wireless telephone jack? (Some don't work with caller ID even though the box can call out with it). And, finally do you have the option to enable caller ID set on the 921?


----------



## ebaltz

wcswett said:


> I did the HD test this evening, just for the heck of it. It was so slow that I watched two half hour recordings off another PVR, did some PVR housekeeping, then checked back and the HD test was done. All it said was "HD is ok". Guess I don't need to ever do that again. Sorry I don't know exactly how long it took but it was more than an hour and less than two.
> 
> --- WCS


For curisoity sake, how many recordings do you have on your drive? I had very few and my HD test took just minutes. I am guessing this is a defrag routine which take a VLT on hard drives that are full of data, but goes very quickly on drives with very little data, so this would make sense and correlate to the results I have seen so far.


----------



## cleblanc

jsanders said:


> Are you sure you don't need a subscription to have the guide data?
> 
> I had guide data this morning, but I don't have it anymore! What happened?
> 
> When I went to work today, I finally cancelled my locals because I was only using them for the guide data!
> 
> What gives???? Dish better not be charging for guide data, that will be the last straw for me if it is true.
> 
> What does this menu in the preferences, "Off-Air Antenna Locals" mean btw? I thought someone said that if the box was checked, it would remap the locals to the OTA, but if it wasn't checked, it would use some digital OTA guide data. Can anyone clarify??


I am also looking to cancel my locals since I only use them for guide data.
Can anyone verify if you need to subscribe or not in order to get guide data for the digital locals.

BTW - When the Off-Air Antenna locals is checked, you will get your digital locals as normal remapped channel numbers. If the box is unchecked, you will get the satellite locals remapped and the digital locals will have -01 after them. This is how I have it right now. This way I have all my locals in one spot and can easily see which ones I have digital locals for.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Officially from Dish - you must subscribe to your locals package to receive guide data. It's not a bug.


----------



## ebaltz

Just a note for all 921 users. Those of you who are unplugging your units over and over again, I would suggest against this. Do you unplug your computers all the time? Probably not, and if you did, your computer would be screwed up. Your 921 is basically a computer. Press and hold the power button on the unit for about 5 seconds or so until it shuts down and reboots. This is much easier on the system then unplugging something while it is running. I have never had to unplug any of my Dish boxes, 501, 510, 811, 921, and have never had any issues with them that couldn't be resolved with a power button reboot. This includes the download of L211. It downloaded rebooted automatically and there were no problems with anything. Local OTA works perfectly, recordings worked perfectly, previously recorded items still there, remote still works, etc... etc... 

Just a thought. Use such measures as a last resort, not as a matter of practice.


----------



## Bismarck

ebaltz:

I'm curious what the group's reaction will be to your comment. Power plug reboots are regularly and often recommended on this site, as recently as in Mark's quasi-release notes for L211 at the start of this thread. I have not had success with power button reboots on my 921. Since it never really shuts off, my personal experience has been that it only truly reboots when the power is cut off. I suspect others are having the same experience, given the number of longtime users that regularly tout power plug reboots.


----------



## ebaltz

Bismarck said:


> ebaltz:
> 
> I'm curious what the group's reaction will be to your comment. Power plug reboots are regularly and often recommended on this site, as recently as in Mark's quasi-release notes for L211 at the start of this thread. I have not had success with power button reboots on my 921. Since it never really shuts off, my personal experience has been that it only truly reboots when the power is cut off. I suspect others are having the same experience, given the number of longtime users that regularly tout power plug reboots.


Yeah I am curious too, however it makes logical sense--in relationship to unplugging computers while they are running, and also in my personal experience. My installer even told me to unplug stuff or pull out the smartcard. But I said, wouldn't it be better just to use the built in restart by holding the power button down? He didn't even know you could do that. Does E* officially recommend in their documentation to actually crawl behind your entertainment center and pull the plug on a running piece of equipment on a regular basis?

P.S. I am in the computer business (20 years) IRL (both software and hardware). And the LAST thing I would ever tell someone to do with their computer is to unplug it while it is running.


----------



## Guest

Mark Lamutt said:


> Officially from Dish - you must subscribe to your locals package to receive guide data. It's not a bug.


Then why...

does the 811 have guide data even though locals aren't subscribed to?

do we pay a $5/month DVR fee if quide data isn't included?

I can say this is a crock of crap.


----------



## n0qcu

ebaltz said:


> Does E* officially recommend in their documentation to actually crawl behind your entertainment center and pull the plug on a running piece of equipment on a regular basis?
> 
> .


I don't know about it being in writing but they do say to try unplugging when you waiting for tech suppoet on the phone. I think they even mention it on ch 101.

The really need an almost impossible to accidentally get at menu option so you can reboot from your remote.


----------



## glenn z

Ditto your post. This pisses me off. 



gpflepsen said:


> Then why...
> 
> does the 811 have guide data even though locals aren't subscribed to?
> 
> do we pay a $5/month DVR fee if quide data isn't included?
> 
> I can say this is a crock of crap.


----------



## Guest

glenn z said:


> Ditto your post. This pisses me off.


This is one of those things that will fester with me, and then when I consider my options for TV services in the future this will play a part in my descision making. I know when I'm being nickled and dimed and I don't much care for it. I don't mind paying for what I want, but this 'carrot on a stick' bit is too much.


----------



## TonyB

What I am looking for is for the same as TIVO. eg 60 minutes show (not that I would ever watch that trash) comes on after the Sunday NFL games. The problem is that the game ends at an undefined time, and more often than not the following show starts 15-20 minutes or more late. If I had set a timer for 60 minutes show, it would fire off at the expected time, NOT the actual time. Similarly for taping the football game. A timer ends and the expected time, NOT at the actaul end of the game.
TIVO on D* correctly records a show based on the show name, NOT the show planned time. 
Is there any way to get the 921 to correctly record a program of unknown duration?


----------



## ebaltz

n0qcu said:


> I don't know about it being in writing but they do say to try unplugging when you waiting for tech suppoet on the phone. I think they even mention it on ch 101.
> 
> The really need an almost impossible to accidentally get at menu option so you can reboot from your remote.


Agreed, and an actual off/shutdown option from a menu or from the remote. It would close out (like Windows) and then shut down and power off. E* could then power it on to download the guide or update software etc... I mean isn't that kind of what happens with the other boxes. My 510 and 510 stay powered on for awhile after I turn them off, but then eventually they completely shut down and turn off. My 921 is always still on.


----------



## SpenceJT

ebaltz said:


> Agreed, and an actual off/shutdown option from a menu or from the remote. It would close out (like Windows) and then shut down and power off. E* could then power it on to download the guide or update software etc... I mean isn't that kind of what happens with the other boxes. My 510 and 510 stay powered on for awhile after I turn them off, but then eventually they completely shut down and turn off. My 921 is always still on.


Way to highjack a thread ebaltz! 

I also work in the Info Tech field and have no problem doing a power plug re-boot of my 921. I don't do this while it is "running" (i.e. active recording/playback), but rather in the suspend mode when the unit is not actively recording/playing and the drive heads are parked.

I would only cut power to the unit as a last resort. Similar to an O/S lockup where the power reset button needs to be used.

Now, can we get back on the topic about how Dish Network and the blokes at Eldon have finally come through for us?! This latest upgrade is a colossal step in the right direction!

...now if they'd only bring back the DishWire!


----------



## SpenceJT

TonyB said:


> What I am looking for is for the same as TIVO. eg 60 minutes show (not that I would ever watch that trash) comes on after the Sunday NFL games. The problem is that the game ends at an undefined time, and more often than not the following show starts 15-20 minutes or more late. If I had set a timer for 60 minutes show, it would fire off at the expected time, NOT the actual time. Similarly for taping the football game. A timer ends and the expected time, NOT at the actaul end of the game.
> TIVO on D* correctly records a show based on the show name, NOT the show planned time.
> Is there any way to get the 921 to correctly record a program of unknown duration?


*Mr. Lamutt  * may be able to shed some light on this. Months ago, I remember hearing about the possibility that _*N*ame *B*ased *R*ecording_ capabilities will be added to the 921 sometime in 2005.

So Mark, are they still on track with this or is NBR going to go the way of DishWire?


----------



## SpenceJT

SpenceJT said:


> *Mr. Lamutt  * may be able to shed some light on this. Months ago, I remember hearing about the possibility that _*N*ame *B*ased *R*ecording_ capabilities will be added to the 921 sometime in 2005.
> 
> So Mark, are they still on track with this or is NBR going to go the way of DishWire?


Great! Now I've highjacked... :eek2:

...sorry! 

Mark? Feel free to delete or relocate.

Spence


----------



## Mark Lamutt

As far as I know, nothing has changed on the NBR front. It's still coming at some point for the 921. No one that I talk to has said anything differently, anyway about it.


----------



## gboot

Mark Lamutt said:


> Officially from Dish - you must subscribe to your locals package to receive guide data. It's not a bug.


 So now it's another $5/month just to get guide data for OTA's to enable the 921 to function crrrectly. That's not right.


----------



## cnwade

Just curious: what brand/model HD OTA antenna are you using?

TIA,
Curt


jsanders said:


> With the previous version, I would get 17 or 18 channels when I scanned. This time it was 31 or 32! My problems with KBHK are fixed now too.
> 
> Odd thing, it scanned one analog channel, KGO, Channel 7.
> 
> BTW, Guide data doesn't work with ANALOG channels! Ah, who cares! :lol:
> 
> Sub-channels do not work with guide data, I've got 5 subchannels for PBS, and they all say there is some program about Barney. :nono2:
> 
> Looks good so far though.


----------



## Capmeister

Are there name based timers yet?


----------



## SpenceJT

Capmeister said:


> Are there name based timers yet?


nope, but they are being planned


Mark Lamutt said:


> As far as I know, nothing has changed on the NBR front. It's still coming at some point for the 921. No one that I talk to has said anything differently, anyway about it.


----------



## TonyB

With Dish's latest OTA guide scam, its probably an extra $5, since its something we currently don't have and would like.


----------



## cnwade

I had hoped 211 would address this, but....

1. From the guide, select a future show to DVR and you get the "Create Event Timer" screen.
2. Trying to set the "End X minutes after" with X > 29 results in an error (705).

This was an issue - since fixed way back when - on the 721. Yes, I know it can manually be changed by editing the timer on the DVR list, but that's alot of extra button pushing. This was a major pain during the baseball playoffs and World Series, and now we're heading into the winterfest of football games.

Is this fixable?

Curt...


----------



## cleblanc

gboot said:


> So now it's another $5/month just to get guide data for OTA's to enable the 921 to function crrrectly. That's not right.


I totally agree with this. Dish Network is nickel and diming us to death.
I am seriously starting to think about going back to cable even though I've been with Dish for 7-8 years. It's one thing when they didn't have local guide data but now that they have it, they want to charge $6/month for it in addition to the $5 recording fee. And this is after I spent $1000 plus tax on the receiver only to have them drop the price to $549 a few months later.

My cable company tells me they are now offering HD recording so this may be an option for me. Dish is really losing every advantage they've had.


----------



## FaxMan

Mark,

Any idea when the 'official' 211 list of fixes/features will be up?


----------



## Mark Lamutt

They'll be up just as soon as I get them from Eldon. They're a bit in scramble mode at the moment...


----------



## TonyB

This thread has already generated 75% on the responses and nearly 50% of viewings in 1 day that the last one did in about 3 weeks.

Too bad the OTA guide problem is leaving a nasty taste in peoples mouths.


----------



## TonyB

Mark Lamutt said:


> They'll be up just as soon as I get them from Eldon. They're a bit in scramble mode at the moment...


Any chance the scramble has to to with OTA guide screw up?


----------



## Mark Lamutt

TonyB said:


> Any chance the scramble has to to with OTA guide screw up?


 I hope so, but I honestly have no idea. Just got that impression in an email this morning.


----------



## Jim_R

cnwade said:


> I had hoped 211 would address this, but....
> 
> 1. From the guide, select a future show to DVR and you get the "Create Event Timer" screen.
> 2. Trying to set the "End X minutes after" with X > 29 results in an error (705).
> 
> This was an issue - since fixed way back when - on the 721. Yes, I know it can manually be changed by editing the timer on the DVR list, but that's alot of extra button pushing. This was a major pain during the baseball playoffs and World Series, and now we're heading into the winterfest of football games.
> 
> Is this fixable?
> 
> Curt...


I second the nomination for an enhancement to the end after increase!

Thanks Curt, for the info on the work-around, I was creating a second timer!


----------



## wcswett

ebaltz said:


> For curisoity sake, how many recordings do you have on your drive? I had very few and my HD test took just minutes. I am guessing this is a defrag routine which take a VLT on hard drives that are full of data, but goes very quickly on drives with very little data, so this would make sense and correlate to the results I have seen so far.


My HD is about 1/2 full.

--- WCS


----------



## Mike D-CO5

If Dish wants to address this they could do it in one of three ways. 

1) They could reverse this ota guide info so it comes out like the 811 does. 

2) They could put locals included into every package for free. Kind of like the lease deals. If you didn't have to pay anymore for locals and they were included for free regardless what package you have , imagine the big plus that Dish would have. They would be more like cable than cable. Free locals with any pack you took. This would make the ota guide problem go away right now. It would also give Dish a big advantage over Directv. Imagine that advertising blitz they would put out over the airwaves about how much cheaper they were than Directv or cable. 

3) They could add locals for free if you sub to the 921/811 receivers. This would be the least expensive way for Dish to address it if they don't want to reverse the bad decision over the dish local requirements. 

Oh well this is Dishnetwork were talking about. More than likely they will just add the same requirement on the 811 users via software update, that the 921 requires now. To bad this could be the time they give their customers something for their money.


----------



## fjerina

I will be very mad if I have to pay another $5-$7 to just get the OTA guide data since I am already paying $5 for the priviledge of having a PVR and if people owning a 811 are getting it for free? It is not fair. I agree with the nickle and diming us to death comment.


----------



## Michael P

Free locals is not the answer! See the posts from people who live in one DMA but get OTA from another and/or receive OTA from a DMA not carried on E*.

PISP guide data is the ONLY way to go (not to mention that it would also fix the subchannel guide data problems).

Hey Charlie: PISP PISP PISP PISP PISP PISP PISP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## jtallon

Got 211 downloaded today, and so far it's working well for me. One question - the 'format' button (*) seems to have stopped working after 211 was downloaded. Is there some other way to set the default aspect ratio for channels ? Some of my local channels are stretched, and I would like to switch them to 'normal'.

Great to see that local channel guide though - MUCH better now !!!


----------



## bbriggs

Respectfully disagree, free locals would help right now for most users. PSIP won't do that (now).


----------



## Guest

jtallon said:


> Got 211 downloaded today, and so far it's working well for me. One question - the 'format' button (*) seems to have stopped working after 211 was downloaded. Is there some other way to set the default aspect ratio for channels ? Some of my local channels are stretched, and I would like to switch them to 'normal'.
> 
> Great to see that local channel guide though - MUCH better now !!!


Somehow my default display was switched to 4x3 and also the wrong resolution. This kept me from switching the aspect ratio while in SD mode.


----------



## bbriggs

jtallon said:


> Got 211 downloaded today, and so far it's working well for me. One question - the 'format' button (*) seems to have stopped working after 211 was downloaded. Is there some other way to set the default aspect ratio for channels ? Some of my local channels are stretched, and I would like to switch them to 'normal'.
> QUOTE]
> My 'format' button has failed to work twice since L211. I did a powerplug pull the first time, a power button reset the second. Both fixed the problem. If this keeps up, I'll be longing for the days of L188.


----------



## boylehome

Grandude said:


> I'm glad to hear that all went well for you. Have you watched all the recorded programs to see if they are ok? My problem occured when I tried to watch the one OTA program I recorded.
> Brian


OH BABY! Yes, I watched them and they are sooo gooood. HD for ABC primetime is really nice.


----------



## yeroca

cleblanc said:


> I totally agree with this. Dish Network is nickel and diming us to death.
> I am seriously starting to think about going back to cable even though I've been with Dish for 7-8 years. It's one thing when they didn't have local guide data but now that they have it, they want to charge $6/month for it in addition to the $5 recording fee. And this is after I spent $1000 plus tax on the receiver only to have them drop the price to $549 a few months later.
> ...


This issue settles it for me. I had been waiting on L211 to see how stable it was and how many bugs had been fixed. Well, it looks like there are still a ton of bugs and instabilities, and now I find that Dish is charging for OTA guide data. I didn't know about that before.

I was really on the fence about going to DirecTV's HD recorder or Dish's 921, and this has really helped me make a decision. DirecTV it is.

Thank you to all the people using the 921 for posting your reactions to the new software and to Dish's policies in general.


----------



## jtallon

yeroca said:


> I was really on the fence about going to DirecTV's HD recorder or Dish's 921, and this has really helped me make a decision. DirecTV it is.


Drawing your conclusion based upon the first 24 hours of comments after a MAJOR release of a software update seems a bit premature. Remember too that you are getting the most technical and *****y feedback here - the average user, and the happy person, tends not to reply here.

Personally, I got 211 downloaded today. It fixed the one major complaint I had about the 921 - the fact that the OTA stations didn't have guide info. Now it works well enough that I'm happy I have it.


----------



## pesla5439

Much better, but I'm still not getting WKYC in Cleveland when I do a digital channels scan or try to enter it manually. The signal meter still hangs at 75 and won't lock on.

Any idea why? I'm sure it's not a problem with my antenna or the channel's signal strength. It is the same problem that I had before the update and that was confirmed by others in the Cleveland area.


----------



## pesla5439

The software downloaded but I still can't lock onto WKYC in Cleveland with a digital scan or by manually adding the channel. Anyone else still having a problem with this channel?

Mark - what gives? I need my hi-def ER!


----------



## sgt940

gboot said:


> So now it's another $5/month just to get guide data for OTA's to enable the 921 to function crrrectly. That's not right.


Dish has been quilty of a lot with this box but I seem to remember from the begining that they published you had to subscribe to locals to even access the OTA tunner.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

I'd help you if I could, pesla, but I don't have any ideas. I'm assuming that you've checked other sources to make sure that WKYC is on the air and that your antenna is pointed in the right direction?


----------



## mwsmith2

jtallon said:


> Personally, I got 211 downloaded today. It fixed the one major complaint I had about the 921 - the fact that the OTA stations didn't have guide info. Now it works well enough that I'm happy I have it.


That's only because you are subscribed to local channels. Many of us are not. (I for one get far more stuff off of my OTA than if I subscribed to locals) That's where the anger is coming from. A lot of us are pretty much feeling like this now....










Michael


----------



## gboot

gboot said:


> So now it's another $5/month just to get guide data for OTA's to enable the 921 to function crrrectly. That's not right.


I spent 30 minutes on the phone with Dish advanced support last night. The information they have does not require you to subscribe to the locals package to get OTA guide information. So far they are treating it as a bug. 
If you have the time, give them a call. Maybe if enough of us report this we can get this fixed.


----------



## BobinStLouis

An update from me in St. Louis! My OTA channels works - I was absolutely floored when I scanned the DTV and found all of my locals and successfully saved them all! 
I am very pleased to say the least!


----------



## JackS

jtallon said:


> Drawing your conclusion based upon the first 24 hours of comments after a MAJOR release of a software update seems a bit premature. Remember too that you are getting the most technical and *****y feedback here - the average user, and the happy person, tends not to reply here.
> 
> Personally, I got 211 downloaded today. It fixed the one major complaint I had about the 921 - the fact that the OTA stations didn't have guide info. Now it works well enough that I'm happy I have it.


I too am very happy. I now have full recording functionality with the NBC affilliate in Boston and can successfully use the program information for OTA stations. I do have the locals package to support the extra receiver in the basement that the kids use, so I get the OTA guide. I've had the 921 since January, and except for the NBC station problem and lack of OTS guide, I have been happy for a long time.

Jack
Boston


----------



## drjake

pesla5439 said:


> The software downloaded but I still can't lock onto WKYC in Cleveland with a digital scan or by manually adding the channel. Anyone else still having a problem with this channel?
> 
> Mark - what gives? I need my hi-def ER!


This sounds like you are getting a strong multipath signal. We have the same problem with WBBM in Chicago which broadcasts on Digital channel 3. Wkyc braodcasts on digital channel 2 which is very susceptible to multipath. The problem will get worse on rainy or misty days. It is very important that you use a directional antenna pointed in the right direction without overamplification. Check out Antennaweb.org to see the exact direction you need to point.


----------



## sampatterson

drjake said:


> It is very important that you use a directional antenna pointed in the right direction without overamplification.


FYI, In severe multipath areas, like mine, *any* amplification just makes it worse - meaning no picture at all because the multipath and other noise is also amplified.


----------



## awp

Getting better - Thanks:

Features I'd love to see though.

- OTA Antenna Rotor control by learning the IR remote and IR blasting the preset direction that I set for each OTA channel. With my roof top Antenna, I see 4 markets. 

- Internet access to the config screens. I'd love be able to browse to it from the internet and control it. I'm willing to buy the USB ethernet adaptor.


----------



## StevenD

I still havent received the update. Ive tried everything possible. I called Advanced tech Supoprt last night and they told me "to be patient...it could take several days."


----------



## abajaj

jtallon said:


> Got 211 downloaded today, and so far it's working well for me. One question - the 'format' button (*) seems to have stopped working after 211 was downloaded. Is there some other way to set the default aspect ratio for channels ? Some of my local channels are stretched, and I would like to switch them to 'normal'.
> 
> Great to see that local channel guide though - MUCH better now !!!


I had the same problem a few hours after 211. Both the 'format' and the 'SD/HD' button stopped working. Soft reboot fixed the problem.


----------



## jsanders

abajaj said:


> I had the same problem a few hours after 211. Both the 'format' and the 'SD/HD' button stopped working. Soft reboot fixed the problem.


That happened to me, not just after the update, but about 30 hours after the update, last night. I thought my remote was busted or something, but I have two, and neither of them worked. I did a power plug reboot, and I got formatting capability back!


----------



## jsanders

mwsmith2 said:


> That's only because you are subscribed to local channels. Many of us are not. (I for one get far more stuff off of my OTA than if I subscribed to locals) That's where the anger is coming from. A lot of us are pretty much feeling like this now....


If getting run over wasn't enough! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Is that an oppossum, or just a big rat? To get painted over after getting run over is pretty funny!

I'm sorry you feel that way.... I'm upset too! Hopefully, those dish people will get their heads out of the sand and realize that extortion like this isn't a good idea...


----------



## lionsrule

It seems to me that the big ISSUE this update brings to 921 owners is whether or not you NEED to subscribe to locals in order to get guide info. I am currently an 811 owner with an OTA. I have guide info for ota, but I also subscribe to my locals via dish for the time being (I've only had the antenna for a month or so and want to give it a few months to make sure it's reliable before dropping locals).

I have a few questions and comments....

Regarding the 811, can anyone CONFIRM that you do NOT need the locals for guide info?? A few of you have stated this to be true, but is it??

If the 811 does NOT need locals via dish for guide info, then it DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE that the 921 needs them.

This "problem" is very important in my opinion. I, for one, am about to buy a 921 now that the new software is out and it is sucessful. I've been looking forward to replacing my 811/510 combo with a 921. HOWEVER, it really makes me think hard about whether or not I want to feel beholden to dish to continue to pay (forever) for locals only to get the guide info. Like alot of households, a PVR without program descriptions is NOT AN OPTION. There is NO WAY I would expect my wife or myself to try to keep all of the recording info straight in our heads without a program description.

Discuss........


----------



## markcollins

lionsrule read the string about locals required ,they most definiely are and it is not a bug in software.


----------



## StevenD

This is getting ridiculous...I STILL dont have L2.11 yet. Ugh!


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Steven - do you have both tuners connected? Are you connected through a DPP44 switch? If so, do a check switch, and maybe reboot your switch by unplugging it and then plugging it back in.


----------



## mfrodsha

Frankly, this was pretty much my biggest complaint with the Dish 921 - that, and also prior instability.

I LOVE the fact of OTA guide data, and the fact I now have all my trick play functionality on every available channel. I also LOVE the stability.

Count me as very content right now. :hurah: 

Only complaint - digital guide data on OTA is duplicated for every station where they might have multiple channels. In other words, PBS has 3 digital channels 7-1, 7-2, and 7-3, but all have the same guide data, only one of which is accurate.

But, I can live with that for now.


----------



## grassvalley

I'm having the same problems. My 921 didn't record anything from my locals in the 7000s. I was getting the same error message. My aspect also got messed up. oh well guess its time for a reboot.



FaxMan said:


> I got the same thing tonight.
> 
> Had re-created a weekly timer to record NYPD Blue on a local LiL. It seemed to take. At about the time Mr. Blinky would have started, I got the same error. Tried to set timers a few more times with the same error. Started recording manually when the time came, got the error message, but it appears to have recorded.
> 
> Also noticed that the Aspect zoom seemed to change on its own as was channel/dvr surfing. I'll try to re-create the issue and report appropriately.


----------



## Curmudgeon

>>I still can't lock onto WKYC in Cleveland <<

Probably the station is not putting out PSIP correctly and 921 won't recognize it. Either that, or your external antenna needs to be rotated to get it to an acceptable signal level.


----------



## StevenD

Mark Lamutt said:


> Steven - do you have both tuners connected? Are you connected through a DPP44 switch? If so, do a check switch, and maybe reboot your switch by unplugging it and then plugging it back in.


Yeah, I have both connected through a DPP44. I removed the cables and did a switch matrix reset, but I didnt power off the switch itself. I'll give that a try. Dish ATS just keeps telling me to wait...it will come.


----------



## ibglowin

OK here's my $0.02 on Guide data.

I have both an 811 and 921. The guide data information does not function nor work the same way on both of these machines. The 921 has data on ALL Albuquerque locals where as the 811 is missing guide data on several locals. Since they work differently this is why you don't need to subscribe to locals on the 811. Guide data on the 811 stops functioning if you leave the receiver on the OTA tuner for any length of time. This doesn't happen with the 921.

Finally yea its a bummer to be "forced" to subscribe to SAT locals but I have had OTA local HD for 2 years now. At least here in the Albuquerque TV market any DTV station can "disappear" from the air at any given time. Sometimes for hours, sometimes for days, sometimes for weeks. Paying $6 a month for a little piece of mind to know that if any of my DTV stations go down, I have a SAT back up is worth it IMHO

This also gives me the option of recording something in OTA HD and 2 SD SAT local channels at the same time should I ever need to. Last night I recorded Survivor and CSI back to back of the OTA tuner as well as the O.C. off one of the SAT tuners at the same time. ALL 3 timers fired without a hitch.


----------



## TonyB

ibglowin said:


> OK here's my $0.02 on Guide data.
> 
> Paying $6 a month for a little piece of mind to know that if any of my DTV stations go down, I have a SAT back up is worth it IMHO


Surely, if you can get digital OTA then you can get analog OTA. Analog OTA is exactly what E* provides via satellite


----------



## Mark Lamutt

You'd think so, Tony, but I can't. Well I could if I wanted to put a 4th antenna on my roof, but I don't want to do that. Plus, I wouldn't be able to record the locals with my 508s for the remaining few SD shows that I do watch.


----------



## TonyB

Mark Lamutt said:


> You'd think so, Tony, but I can't. Well I could if I wanted to put a 4th antenna on my roof, but I don't want to do that. Plus, I wouldn't be able to record the locals with my 508s for the remaining few SD shows that I do watch.


Mark,
You must have a really complicated setup. Are you saying that you already have 3 antennas? At least in MA as long as you live 20-30 miles west of Boston every single TV transmission from "beantown" comes from the same place - for me is at 121 degrees! I just assumed that a station would beam its analog signal from the same place as its digital sub channel.

Tony


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Yes, Denver is an incredibly complicated situation. If you have about 14 days worth of free time, you could read the 3 Denver OTA threads over at AVS forums that have been going for the last 6 years or so, and now total about 15,000-20,000 posts added up. Most of our digitals are very low power from the top of a downtown 27 story building. One of them is VERY LOW power (7 kW) from the top of a downtown 6 story building. Two of them (2/3rds power) are from the same place that the analogs are broadcasting. And I live exactly between them - the broadcast locations are 178 degrees apart. And I'm feeding 3 HD receivers, but with the VERY LOW power station (that is only 2.2 miles away from me) I can only split the line once, not twice and still be able to receive it. So, I've got 3 antennas on my roof - 2 pointing downtown and one pointing towards the analog broadcast location. Plus, all three of them are UHF only because all of our digitals are UHF. And of course, all but 2 of the analogs are VHF, which would require the 4th antenna on the roof. Sounds like fun, doesn't it? All because of about 155 people that live up near the tower site that have way too much money on their hands and are able to buy politicians and judges to keep the digital broadcasts out of where they should be because they think if they are successful, eventually the broadcast towers will go away...


----------



## ibglowin

TonyB said:


> Surely, if you can get digital OTA then you can get analog OTA. Analog OTA is exactly what E* provides via satellite


I am 60 miles away from the towers. This still works fine for DTV signals but analog sucks. And I want to be able to use my PVR to record them as well. At least here in NM, the Dish locals are not compressed as much as in other places. One spot beam covers ther entire state.


----------



## jsanders

ibglowin said:


> Finally yea its a bummer to be "forced" to subscribe to SAT locals but I have had OTA local HD for 2 years now. At least here in the Albuquerque TV market any DTV station can "disappear" from the air at any given time. Sometimes for hours, sometimes for days, sometimes for weeks. Paying $6 a month for a little piece of mind to know that if any of my DTV stations go down, I have a SAT back up is worth it IMHO


Sorry to hear about that glowin, however, that is just your area. I haven't had any such problems with DTV dropouts in the last year, not one.

The choice on whether to have a guide or not should be independent of whether I want to subscribe to local channels or not.

This has to be remedied some other way. How else do you solve the problem of guide data for those who have distant locals? They subscribe, but they still don't have guide data. This whole thing is a kludge that has to be re-done like the 811 to work properly. The 811 will provide guide data outside of your DMA if you receive that station. It does the lookup by call letters. The 921 is simply downloading the channel map from your DMA and using the channel number to look up your guide. That is a very bad way to do it.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

I have updated the initial post with another caveat - that your output display resolution may have been changed to 480p from whatever it was set to before by the installation of the new software.


----------



## lenny

lenny said:


> I know this doesn't help you right now, but they may be getting closer to fixing everyone. My caller ID never worked but now started working after L211.
> 
> Lenny - Buffalo, NY Verizon


Now after a couple days I see that caller id works for awhile then stops working. I then reboot the 921 using the front panel power button and then it starts working. I called tech support and they're having engineering contact me to resolve this issue.

Just letting everyone know. I'll post here after I work with engineering,
Lenny


----------



## fjerina

I am a little confused. The meter on the screen (also showing the station info) when you switch channel is for what? Is it a signal strength meter or the degree of quality (transmission without error rate) or something else? Thanks.


----------



## SimpleSimon

sgt940 said:


> Dish has been quilty of a lot with this box but I seem to remember from the begining that they published you had to subscribe to locals to even access the OTA tunner.


Negatory. In fact, every report I've seen says that OTA works with NO active E* account - but it must see good satellite signal, probably for command & control. 

P.S. It appears they did exactly one thing right for me - I no longer have to 'Skip Back, Play' to get immediate audio when leaving paused state. Of course, this may be old news, and my pre-programmed fingers hadn't slipped until now so that I just noticed the fix.


----------



## Michael P

> Negatory. In fact, every report I've seen says that OTA works with NO active E* account - but it must see good satellite signal, probably for command & control.


 I can confirm this. WHen my new 921 arrived, I used it as an OTA only tuner for most of the weekend before calling up E* to activate. From hanging around here and other DBS sites, I knew about having a satellite signal present as being a requirement for OTA. If I could have lived without satellite service for a while, I could have seen if it would have taken the 2.11 upgrade without being authorized as well.


----------



## TonyB

Thats good news. I was wondering whether I could cancel E* contract and still get OTA. I get great OTA receptiion - all 3 networks in HD! Now I know I can cancel E*, disconnect the dishes so that they cannot change the s/w and yet still get HD!!!!

FANTASTIC!


----------



## jsanders

TonyB said:


> Thats good news. I was wondering whether I could cancel E* contract and still get OTA. I get great OTA receptiion - all 3 networks in HD! Now I know I can cancel E*, disconnect the dishes so that they cannot change the s/w and yet still get HD!!!!


I'm pretty sure they will still give you the software update w/o a subscription.


----------



## TonyB

jsanders said:


> I'm pretty sure they will still give you the software update w/o a subscription.


You mean that if I connect the 2 cox cables to the dishes, then I get s/w update, even though I had subscribed to no plans??? I was assuming that I MIGHT get OTA if I disconected the coax cables but did not know if the 921 would still be "happy"


----------



## lujan

Did we ever get the Official Release Notes from Dish? I'm sure that we have received them much earlier after prior downloads (upgrades). It will be a week now on Tuesday.


----------



## FaxMan

Almost a week already?

Sounds like it is about time to start a 212+ thread.  

In all seriousness though, Mark, are you seeing any new/fixed stuff in the beta stream? (I know you can't get specific).


----------



## SimpleSimon

TonyB said:


> You mean that if I connect the 2 cox cables to the dishes, then I get s/w update, even though I had subscribed to no plans??? I was assuming that I MIGHT get OTA if I disconected the coax cables but did not know if the 921 would still be "happy"


 What are you talking about connecting two Cox cables???

There's precisely one OTA input on the box, and it's pretty unlikely that Cox Cable is feeding ATSC OTA across their feeds.

The ONLY thing you can plug into the satellite tuners is satellite feeds - and you MUST keep them plugged in or the box will not operate (is there an echo in here?).

Also, there is NO way for you to stop the box from taking software updates - which you WILL get without an active account.


----------



## Guest

He may have meant coax. 

...and they must be connected to a sat signal to receive OTA signals. Now, what I don't know is if the sat feeds must come from two E* satellites. If the dish was turned to some other DBS sat, no E* SW could be delivered to the receiver.


----------



## TonyB

TonyB said:


> You mean that if I connect the 2 cox cables to the dishes, then I get s/w update, even though I had subscribed to no plans??? I was assuming that I MIGHT get OTA if I disconected the coax cables but did not know if the 921 would still be "happy"


My text should have read "if I connect 2 coax cables", not "cox" cables.
I was wondering if I could still receive OTA programs via my local stations if I disconnected the satellite cox cables from the 921. The idea was that it would prevent any changes in s/w, ie. any dsabling of the box by E* - which they in effect could do I I dropped all programming. Since the 921 has a tuner for local OTA stations it would then work just like any other terrestrial HD receiver.

All this is in order to understand what would happen if I call E* to protest the charge for program data for local HD sub channels.


----------



## boylehome

TonyB said:


> "cox" cables.


I thought the cables were from the cable company.


----------



## Michael P

It's my understanding that you need to keep a satellite dish connected in order for the OTA receivers to work. With the 6000 it was reported that you lost the OTA when rain fade happened. This is a dangerous situation, for the cloud that's causing the rain fade might be severe weather heading your way. Only OTA can deliver your local forcast.

Hopefully they built-in some fudge factor on the 921 that allows continuous OTA reception if the dish signal drops out. Fortunately for me, I see 3 orbital locations 119, 110, and 61.5. When I do experience rain fade, it is usually from only one or two orbital locations. 61.5 is southeast while the other two are southwest. The only other issue is snow fade. Again usually only one dish is covered to the point where reception is affected.


----------



## jsanders

Michael P said:


> It's my understanding that you need to keep a satellite dish connected in order for the OTA receivers to work. With the 6000 it was reported that you lost the OTA when rain fade happened. This is a dangerous situation, for the cloud that's causing the rain fade might be severe weather heading your way. Only OTA can deliver your local forcast.
> 
> Hopefully they built-in some fudge factor on the 921 that allows continuous OTA reception if the dish signal drops out. Fortunately for me, I see 3 orbital locations 119, 110, and 61.5. When I do experience rain fade, it is usually from only one or two orbital locations. 61.5 is southeast while the other two are southwest. The only other issue is snow fade. Again usually only one dish is covered to the point where reception is affected.


That is simply not true. I have a 6000 which I deactivated when I got my 921. I got OTA reception as long as it saw the satellite when the 6000 was powered. If it was already powered, I could unplug the satellite inputs and OTA reception still worked. The only scenario where OTA would stop working is if I cycled the power on the 6000. In that scenario, it needed to see the satellite again before I could use the OTA transmission.


----------



## Guest

jsanders said:


> That is simply not true. I have a 6000 which I deactivated when I got my 921. I got OTA reception as long as it saw the satellite when the 6000 was powered. If it was already powered, I could unplug the satellite inputs and OTA reception still worked. The only scenario where OTA would stop working is if I cycled the power on the 6000. In that scenario, it needed to see the satellite again before I could use the OTA transmission.


For Dish, that is a design bug. It shouldn't do that.


----------



## StevenD

I have no idea what to do now. I STILL do not have the L2.11 update. I did a "Factory Defaults" reset last Thursday and then left town for 4 days. Dish ATS just keeps telling me to wait. But I know of nobody else that still had L1.88.

Does Dish need to send me a new receiver?


----------



## n0qcu

StevenD said:


> I have no idea what to do now. I STILL do not have the L2.11 update. I did a "Factory Defaults" reset last Thursday and then left town for 4 days. Dish ATS just keeps telling me to wait. But I know of nobody else that still had L1.88.
> 
> Does Dish need to send me a new receiver?


With all the problems I've had since L2.11 I think you're lucky you haven't got it yet.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Steven, email me your contact info, along with a summary of everything you've tried to do, and I'll send it to the 921 support team. You definitely should have gotton it long before now.


----------



## StevenD

Well, Dish is sending me a new 921. We shall see what happens...


----------



## HD921

Mark, When are the 211 release notes going to post?


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Steven - good. I'm glad they got back to you.

HD921 - no idea if I'll even get them at this point. More important things are happening at Eldon, working on getting the next release into beta so that it can get out to you all ASAP.


----------



## Eagles

Mark Lamutt said:


> More important things are happening at Eldon, working on getting the next release into beta so that it can get out to you all ASAP.


Mark, you brought it up, so I'll ask the question
:lol: ETA on the next release? Days, Weeks, Months?


----------



## Mark Lamutt

I have no idea, Eagles. (Yes, really)


----------



## Eagles

Mark Lamutt said:


> I have no idea, Eagles. (Yes, really)


Well it's good to hear that they are working on it, and maybe with a sense of urgency.


----------



## TonyB

Mark,
I hope they know, that the disappointment and ANGER over the OTA guide this time is nothing to what will happen next time if it does not fix it next time around. Users of this site I'm sure are assuming (big time) that the next release will:
a) make OTA guide work without subscribing to Locals
b) Hopefully contain the latest video drivers for the blue line, although I haven't seen much said on this (mine was fixed with 211)

I'm sure there are other small fixes, but none that rate as high as the EPG thing. Since you are waiting for a beta, I guess they really did HEAR load and clear what we all said.

Please signal in the best way you can whether we will be  or  

Thanks,


----------



## Mark Lamutt

They heard loud and clear. That doesn't mean anything will happen with it, though. I know what direction I hope they take, but Charlie/Jim et al only know what direction they ARE going to take with it.


----------



## Ron Barry

TonyB said:


> I'm sure there are other small fixes, but none that rate as high as the EPG thing. Since you are waiting for a beta, I guess they really did HEAR load and clear what we all said.
> 
> Please signal in the best way you can whether we will be  or


I would put the Jitter problem well above the OTA EPG issue personally. This problem has caused missed programs and instability into the box. I am having to reboot a lot. I would think missed recorded shows would be well above the two issues mentioned and would be considered P1.


----------



## keitheva

WeeJavaDude said:


> I would put the Jitter problem well above the OTA EPG issue personally. This problem has caused missed programs and instability into the box. I am having to reboot a lot. I would think missed recorded shows would be well above the two issues mentioned and would be considered P1.


I vigorously second this. The video jitter problem is a serious regression.

With L188 my 921 was working more-or-less as advertised, and I was more-or-less happy with it. With L211 I now have a box where live TV is sometimes watchable, sometimes not; may or may not make watchable recordings; and requires frequent reboots. i.e. I've gone from a fairly reliable and useful piece of equipment, to a very unreliable and somewhat useless one, and I am most certainly not happy with it.

I was prepared to accept the wait and incremental improvements that we saw over the past year as each step did seem to make things better (mostly), but L211 is a giant step backwards. I'd much rather forego the OTA guide to get back to box that I can rely on to watch live and recorded HD TV, which is what I paid $1000 for in the first place. My patience is now wearing very thin.

Mark - this video jitter problem is serious and is affecting many users, do you know if Eldon is acutely aware of it? And if not, can you help make them so? Thanks for any help.

Cheers,
-Keith


----------



## awp

Mark Lamutt said:


> ............. And I live exactly between them - the broadcast locations are 178 degrees apart. And I'm feeding 3 HD receivers, but with the VERY LOW power station (that is only 2.2 miles away from me) I can only split the line once, not twice and still be able to receive it. So, I've got 3 antennas on my roof - 2 pointing downtown and one pointing towards the analog broadcast location. ...


Mark,

How do you mix the inputs from your 3 rooftop OTA UHF antennas? I'm considering doing the same thing. I would think simply mixing them would result in multipath distortion from the antennas not directly pointed to the transmitter towers. Do you use notch filters for each channel?

- Andy


----------



## Mark Lamutt

I don't - three lines out to 3 receivers basically (well, actually a couple of splitters and A-B switches in 2 of the lines).


----------



## FaxMan

I guess the 'Advanced Tech' that I got shuffled off to while trying to get the OTA guide question on the air during the Charlie Chat was mistaken about his very strong assertion that an update would go out tonight with a fix.... Imagine that.


----------



## jsanders

awp said:


> Mark,
> 
> How do you mix the inputs from your 3 rooftop OTA UHF antennas? I'm considering doing the same thing. I would think simply mixing them would result in multipath distortion from the antennas not directly pointed to the transmitter towers. Do you use notch filters for each channel?


Hi Andy,

We are getting a bit off topic here, but, I use 2 rooftop antennas. First, you want a higly directional antenna to start with, that is the best way to reduce multipath. Second, the spacing between the antennas has to be large enough to reduce interference (based on frequency of lowest frequency channel you want to receive, for me it was VHF channel 2). Third, make sure the cable lengths going from the antennas to your combiner/slitter are the same length, that also helps reduce multipath. In my case, I used a band pass filter, and a notch filter, however, this may not be necessary. It depends on your personal setup.


----------



## jsanders

Mark Lamutt said:


> They heard loud and clear. That doesn't mean anything will happen with it, though. I know what direction I hope they take, but Charlie/Jim et al only know what direction they ARE going to take with it.


:scratch: Very strange.... I only see one direction that they even can take if they intend to allow users with distant locals to see guide data. Has that been written up as a bug yet? It must have been.... :group:


----------



## boylehome

WeeJavaDude said:


> I would put the Jitter problem well above the OTA EPG issue personally. This problem has caused missed programs and instability into the box. I am having to reboot a lot. I would think missed recorded shows would be well above the two issues mentioned and would be considered P1.


I agree WeeJavaDude, the jitters are so bad I can't hold onto the remote control.


----------



## Ron Barry

boylehome said:


> I agree WeeJavaDude, the jitters are so bad I can't hold onto the remote control.


LOL.. I am not only getting jitters, but the unit seems to freeze from time to time like a thread is blocked and then eventually unfreeze itself.

Along with the jitters, I have had certain functions of the remote stop working. Mentioned this in the jitters thread since I am not sure if this is all related or seperate issues. New 921 user and I thought I had stayed away long enough for things to stable. Damn guess I was wrong.


----------



## TonyB

I always find that a good fix for that is a double shot of Jack Daniels!
:lol: 

Seriously, I too have seen some picture jump - every few seconds, with 211. It seems to go along with the SD picture being stuck in widescreen mode. The remote will NOT allow me to display the various modes.


----------



## Walt C

Mark Lamutt said:


> Here it comes, folks!
> 
> First, I don't have the release notes yet. These should be quite extensive, so I really don't see having them before this afternoon.
> 
> Model ID: DishDVR 921
> Boot Version:140B
> Flash Version: F052
> Software Version: L211HECD-ND
> Location ID 192C76AE
> Albuquerque, NM
> 
> Mark,
> Sorry, I know you are planning to start a new thread for OTA problems - but I can't find it. Can you tell me where that is?
> 
> L211 SW downloaded and everything seemed to work fine WITHOUT rebooting. Of course multiple channels (e.g. 005-01 & 005-02) showed the same listings. THEN after reading your advice I rebooted. I rescanned for digital channels and I can't get channel 004 anymore. The Guide tuner was also streaked with red lines - never saw that before. So I removed the digital channels and scanned for digital channels again - still no channel 004, but red lines are gone. My other complaint is channel 005-01 KNME which is the ONLY Albuquerque OTA that broadcasts 100% HD shows the same programming data for 005-02, the SD channel. Since the programming is entirely different, I have no clue what's on unless I download programming from thier website. Why is this? What happened to channel 004 (KOB)? Timer data seems to be intact.
> 
> Walt


----------



## ibglowin

Walt,

FWIW, I lost KOB (4-01 yesterday myself on BOTH my 921's. I get a strong signal but a blank screen. I can get 4-01 just fine however on my MyHD PC CARD so not sure if the problem is with the 921 all of the sudden or if KOB has something going on from there end that is keeping the 921 tuner from displaying the picture properly. The weird thing is if I channel up or down I see a glimpse of it for just a second. We need to call KOB and see if something is going on on their end.


----------



## Walt C

Mike,
Good idea, it could be the station.
Walt


----------



## ibglowin

I just put in a call to engineering. No one is there at the moment who works the DTV part of it. So I left my name and number.


----------



## Walt C

guruka said:


> Yes, I am definitely experiencing better OTA DT reception with L211.
> 
> Do you still have KOB. I lost it (and I live in Albuquerque) when L211 downloaded???
> Walt


----------



## lenny

Walt C said:


> Mark Lamutt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here it comes, folks!
> [...]
> Mark,
> Sorry, I know you are planning to start a new thread for OTA problems - but I can't find it. Can you tell me where that is?
> [...]
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=36025
> 
> Lenny
Click to expand...


----------



## Walt C

ibglowin said:


> I just put in a call to engineering. No one is there at the moment who works the DTV part of it. So I left my name and number.


Mike,
What's the Ch 4 frequency number so I can keep trying to add without having to scan all digital's. Do you think there's anything to this multi-path talk? I wouldn't think you'd see the same problem as me though.

Walt


----------



## Walt C

ibglowin said:


> I just put in a call to engineering. No one is there at the moment who works the DTV part of it. So I left my name and number.


Mike,
I've called twice - no luck reaching anyone who knows anything yet.  
Walt


----------



## ibglowin

Walt,

I went home at lunch at checked it again and was able to pull it in just fine this time. The UHF channel # is 26.

Maybe time for a front panel reboot.


----------



## guruka

Walt said:


> Do you still have KOB. I lost it (and I live in Albuquerque) when L211 downloaded???
> Walt


KOB is having problems. It's the station, not your 921.

.....G


----------



## knealy

Where do you set the pref to remap the 8000 series channels to their normal local numbers?


----------



## FaxMan

knealy said:


> Where do you set the pref to remap the 8000 series channels to their normal local numbers?


See the first post in this thread.... Mark's initial release notes, #2 in "What's New" section.


----------



## lenny

lenny said:


> Now after a couple days I see that caller id works for awhile then stops working. I then reboot the 921 using the front panel power button and then it starts working. I called tech support and they're having engineering contact me to resolve this issue.
> 
> Just letting everyone know. I'll post here after I work with engineering,
> Lenny


Engineering never called so since it's been a week I called back and it seems I got lost in the shuffle??? This AT person said she will make sure it gets to engineering but wouldn't promise if a eng person would call me back or not.

Also, she was pushing that I should first contact where I bought the unit from because maybe it's defective???? I asked her what would I tell the people that I bought it from? That the software may not be working? :nono:

I stated what would I say to them since the unit passes the phone tests and after a reboot caller id works? Also, it never worked before 211? Sigh. 

I'll admit when you reboot a machine it sends an "init" down the bus to reset all the cards and I'm assuming the phone card/modem on this unit may be being "reset" during a boot but that wouldn't answer why it never worked before 211.

Am I the only one having this kind of issue with caller id? That is, after a power button reboot caller id works for awhile (but never a full day). Then I have to reboot again to get it working.

Thanks for any responses from people in my situation,
Lenny


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## lenny

For those of you that are having the caller id problem like I am, I just spoke with someone from the ATS and APS groups. She confirmed that there is still a problem with caller id with some users. It seems the software just stops communicating with the modem/phone card. They are trying to resolve this issue. So at least I know that I'm not imagining this problem.

Just letting some of you lurkers know, 
Lenny


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## TonyB

Mark,
Whats the status now of L212? or whatever it will be called. Are you testing a beta yet?


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## Mark Lamutt

We're desparately trying to create the 0 second recordings bug in house (mine and theirs), as well as work a fix for the jittery video. That's the current status.


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## boylehome

Mark Lamutt said:


> We're desparately trying to create the 0 second recordings bug in house (mine and theirs), as well as work a fix for the jittery video. That's the current status.


Mark, part of the, "0" second recording may partly be caused by switching problems. I wonder if this happens to 921 owners who don't have any other receivers or switches connected to the 921? I posted some information here: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=36603


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## TonyB

Mark Lamutt said:


> We're desparately trying to create the 0 second recordings bug in house (mine and theirs), as well as work a fix for the jittery video. That's the current status.


Mark,
Thanks


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## erh1117

I am a newbie to the forum and to 921's. I got my 921 to replace a 501 and was lucky enough to buy in after all the prior software fixes, so I'm looking at a newly installed 921 with L211.

I have scanned both OTA analog and digital locals in my 921, but don't need the analogs because I subscribe to Denver locals with DISH. 

My DISH locals are in the 8000's, but I want them in the normal channel locations. I also want my local OTA digitals to show up near the corresponding DISH locals (i.e. 2, 2-1, 4, 4-1, 6, 6-1, etc.).

My questions are (I've asked DISH but they seem clueless): Does disabling "Off Air Antenna Locals" in viewing preferences only disable anaolg OTA's?; Or will I lose Digital OTA listings in my favorite lists?


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## nuts4scuba

erh1117 said:


> I am a newbie to the forum and to 921's. I got my 921 to replace a 501 and was lucky enough to buy in after all the prior software fixes, so I'm looking at a newly installed 921 with L211.
> 
> I have scanned both OTA analog and digital locals in my 921, but don't need the analogs because I subscribe to Denver locals with DISH.
> 
> My DISH locals are in the 8000's, but I want them in the normal channel locations. I also want my local OTA digitals to show up near the corresponding DISH locals (i.e. 2, 2-1, 4, 4-1, 6, 6-1, etc.).
> 
> My questions are (I've asked DISH but they seem clueless): Does disabling "Off Air Antenna Locals" in viewing preferences only disable anaolg OTA's?; Or will I lose Digital OTA listings in my favorite lists?


It will only disable the analog OTA channels and then remap your local channels back to their proper channel numbers. Digital OTA will still be there.


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## GravelChan

I had a 921 installed the first week of Jan. I'm not getting program guide info for local OTA channels. I am subscribed to locals, however the OTA stations I receive are station owned translator stations. This means that I have diffferent channel numbers than the the locals which come over the satellite (same content of course). Would this be the reason for no guide info? If so, can anything be done about it?


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## Mark Lamutt

Yes, that would be the reason, and the only thing that you can do about it leave a bug report about it in the bug reports forum. Please read the posting rules in there before doing so, though. And, please be specific, providing the specific channel information (station, normal channel, translated channel).


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