# HR34 PIP - Enhancements Needed



## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

I'm really enjoying the features of the HR34 and glad to once again have PIP. It's one of the reason I decided to upgrade to it. Two of my flat screen TV's can actually do PIP w/o an HR34 and I used it quite a bit when I had cable and a cable card to feed the PIP. When I switched to DIRECTV, I didn't want to pay extra for 2 more DVR's to feed the PIP on both TV's, so I've been without it for a few years. From prior experience, I'm quite familiar with what you could do with PIP. So here are some items that would be nice enhancements to the HR34 PIP feature:

Buttons on the remote or discrete codes we can use for third party remotes - PIP On/Off, Move PIP location, PIP/POP. I've created macros on my AR remote for PIP On and Off, but it takes so long with so many right arrow commands.
PIP Sound - In between periods of an NHL game, I like to watch another live game on the large screen and listen to the commentators comments of the other game between periods. No way to listen to the sound in the PIP, so POP is the next best alternative.
PIP while viewing a remote recording - Sometimes I want to monitor a live NHL game and watch a remote recording. Found out when viewing a remote recording, PIP will not work.

Those are the main things I would like to see. Would anyone else like to see any of these features or do you have have anything to add?


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

All 3 sounds great to have but #1 is an absolute must. I am getting mine installed on Monday and I could not believe they don't have a discrete command to access PiP. I was thinking they would just use the yellow button or something like that.

I've been trying to think of a 100% reliable macro to set up but I can't because it matter whether the channel banner is visible or not. If it's not, my though of macro works great but if it's already on screen, then it fails because it will turn off the channel banner.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

I would like PIP to be able to mix LiveTV and DVR Playbacks


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## naijai (Aug 19, 2006)

"Drucifer" said:


> I would like PIP to be able to mix LiveTV and DVR Playbacks


PIP already does either 2 live shows, 2 recorded shows or mix of both


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

naijai said:


> PIP already does either 2 live shows, 2 recorded shows or mix of both


Two liveTV, I can do. The other are a solid no. I get bonked trying to setup PIP while watching a recording (PIP is grayed out) and an error message when in liveTV trying to setup a recording for in PIP.


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## Garyunc (Oct 8, 2006)

How about a swap option?


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## nsykes (Oct 10, 2011)

Totally agree. One of the main reasons I got the HR34 was for PIP but it is so clunky. 
Agree that they should just make the yellow button the on/off.
Sure am hoping that there are some sortware enhancements on the way to make this a better experience.
Its kind of embarrassing actually.
Was showing a buddy that uses PIP a ton on cable and needless to say they weren't impressed.


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## naijai (Aug 19, 2006)

"Drucifer" said:


> Two liveTV, I can do. The other are a solid no. I get bonked trying to setup PIP while watching a recording (PIP is grayed out) and an error message when in liveTV trying to setup a recording for in PIP.


Ok worked for me 2 weeks ago but seems to be gone now
I know I had 2 recordings using PIP. Oh well hope it's added back

Update:
Tested it and PIP does work on recorded shows but only shows recorded on the HR34, will not work for shows on other receivers. I would assume this would be since the receiver has to switch to the deca to stream the show and switching from the tuners/hard drives which the PIP uses.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Garyunc said:


> How about a swap option?


You can swap between the two "pictures" by pressing the down arrow.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

Hopefully they will make some of the improvements to PIP that are listed above. Having macros on my AR remote to do PIP On, PIP Off and PIP Menu helps, but it's still clunky. Currently I'm using PIP for monitoring live tv until a commercial ends, but not using it as much as I would, if it had all the features I mentioned.

In the meantime, I connected an old pc to my 19" lcd that is set up next to my 50" plasma. Since the HR34 has 5 tuners, I start recordings for games I want to monitor and use DIRECTV2PC to view them on my 19" lcd. That way I can use 2 tuners on the HR34 to do everything I need to w/o having to add a second DVR. I have audio feeds going from my HR34 and pc to my receiver, so I can listen to sound on either tv. Another option I have is to use my laptop with DIRECTV2PC to watch a third game or instead of using the pc/19".

It works, but I would prefer that I could do everything easily with the PIP on the HR34.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

Chuck W said:


> All 3 sounds great to have but #1 is an absolute must. I am getting mine installed on Monday and I could not believe they don't have a discrete command to access PiP. I was thinking they would just use the yellow button or something like that.
> 
> I've been trying to think of a 100% reliable macro to set up but I can't because it matter whether the channel banner is visible or not. If it's not, my though of macro works great but if it's already on screen, then it fails because it will turn off the channel banner.


On the macro question, you could use "Exit" as the first command, then the yellow button and a series of right arrows. Or just press exit to clear the banner and have the macro start with the yellow button.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RACJ2 said:


> On the macro question, you could use "Exit" as the first command, then the yellow button and a series of right arrows. Or just press exit to clear the banner and have the macro start with the yellow button.


Yea, forgot about the Exit command. I just wish they would either add the discrete code or just use the Yellow button. Right now, the Yellow button is just a duplicate of the Info button, so why not.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Forget the green, yellow & blue color buttons. They're being retired because the RVU standardize remote lacks them.


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## David Ortiz (Aug 21, 2006)

Drucifer said:


> Forget the green, yellow & blue color buttons. They're being retired because the RVU standardize remote lacks them.


It's entirely possible that the green, yellow, and blue buttons will be repurposed for the HMC. PIP is available only on the TV directly connected to the HMC. RVU clients can't do PIP, so they wouldn't need to have these color buttons on their remote controls. We'll just have to wait and see.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

The color buttons on the remote are used for so many things on different menus, I can't see how they could drop them. How would you skip forward and back 12hrs in the guide? Delete programs from the Playlist? Jump to a future date and time in the Guide? Delete a series links? Doesn't seem possible that they would change how all these items work, so they can eliminate buttons.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

RACJ2 said:


> The color buttons on the remote are used for so many things on different menus, I can't see how they could drop them. How would you skip forward and back 12hrs in the guide?


Left and Right buttons.



RACJ2 said:


> Delete programs from the Playlist?


Red is not going away, the new remotes have red just not green, yellow and blue.



RACJ2 said:


> Jump to a future date and time in the Guide?


That remains to be seen.



RACJ2 said:


> Delete a series links?


Red


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

RACJ2 said:


> On the macro question, you could use "Exit" as the first command, then the yellow button and a series of right arrows. Or just press exit to clear the banner and have the macro start with the yellow button.


If you are watching a recording from the playlist you wouldn't want to have EXIT as the first step in a macro - it will kick you out of playback to live TV (assuming no graphics are on screen).


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

Like I've said before, here is where the PIP buttons should have been on the remote, along with a move button.


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## Garyunc (Oct 8, 2006)

RunnerFL said:


> You can swap between the two "pictures" by pressing the down arrow.


Thanks Runner!! That helps.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> Left and Right buttons.


To skip ahead 12 hrs? Then how would you move to just the next program? Or are you saying they should o away with jumping ahead 12 hrs and just make up scroll thru each program one by one? I hope you are not saying that.

Sorry, but with all this added functionality Directv is cramming into their DVRs, tha LAST thing they should be doing is REMOVING buttons. They should be creating a more intuitive remote design and that includes more buttons, in a better design.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"Chuck W" said:


> To skip ahead 12 hrs?


It's actually the FF and RW buttons.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> To skip ahead 12 hrs? Then how would you move to just the next program? Or are you saying they should o away with jumping ahead 12 hrs and just make up scroll thru each program one by one? I hope you are not saying that.
> 
> Sorry, but with all this added functionality Directv is cramming into their DVRs, tha LAST thing they should be doing is REMOVING buttons. They should be creating a more intuitive remote design and that includes more buttons, in a better design.


As RatPatrol pointed out I was incorrect and it is FF and RW to jump ahead 12 ours or skip back 12 hours.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

TheRatPatrol said:


> Like I've said before, here is where the PIP buttons should have been on the remote, along with a move button.


I have a feeling they aren't going to create a new remote with additional buttons. It would be nice if they could at least figure out a way to use some of the existing buttons. And you do have a feature in the post in that link that I missed in my original post: PIP Channel Up and PIP Channel Down.


Drew2k said:


> If you are watching a recording from the playlist you wouldn't want to have EXIT as the first step in a macro - it will kick you out of playback to live TV (assuming no graphics are on screen).


True, that's why I didn't add it to my macro. And suggested an alternate option, to simply press exit to clear the banner, then start the macro with the yellow button.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

If they aren't going add buttons for PIP functions to the remote, I had another thought. Maybe have another DIRECTV code for HR34PIP remote. Keep the DIRECTV setup the same. Then we could set up the HR34PIP code on the remote as AV1 and use the slider to switch between them. 

HR34PIP setup would map the keys different, so the color buttons control the PIP functions we mentioned, Red=PIP ON/OFF, Green=PIP Move, Yellow=PIP/POP, Blue=PIP Sound, Left arrow=PIP Ch Down and Right Arrow=PIP Ch Up. And then let us know the discrete codes, so we can program our third party remotes with these functions.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"RACJ2" said:


> If they aren't going add buttons for PIP functions to the remote, I had another thought. Maybe have another DIRECTV code for HR34PIP remote. Keep the DIRECTV setup the same. Then we could set up the HR34PIP code on the remote as AV1 and use the slider to switch between them.
> 
> HR34PIP setup would map the keys different, so the color buttons control the PIP functions we mentioned, Red=PIP ON/OFF, Green=PIP Move, Yellow=PIP/POP, Blue=PIP Sound, Left arrow=PIP Ch Down and Right Arrow=PIP Ch Up. And then let us know the discrete codes, so we can program our third party remotes with these functions.


Yeah right like that's going to happen.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

TheRatPatrol said:


> Yeah right like that's going to happen.


It would be a less expensive alternative then producing a new remote with PIP buttons. Although, I still believe the problem is that they added PIP more for marketing purposes and didn't put a lot of effort into the functionality. So we probably won't see much development time or effort spent on it.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

The two things I would like to see added to PIP:

Ability to listen to audio from the PIP window (watch the large, listen to the small).
Ability to change the size of the PIP window. In some instances (like when watching sports), its just a bit too big, while in others, I wish it were a bit larger.

My old TV had both of these abilities and I used them quite a bit (could switch between audios without changing the video, could choose three different sizes of the PIP window)


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RACJ2 said:


> It would be a less expensive alternative then producing a new remote with PIP buttons. Although, I still believe the problem is that they added PIP more for marketing purposes and didn't put a lot of effort into the functionality. So we probably won't see much development time or effort spent on it.


While I think you may be right about it being for marketing, I do think "eventually" they will streamline the PiP stuff. When "eventually" is, is up for debate, but I have a feeling it's gonne be a while.

At this point, all I ask ASAP is a discrete code or assigned button to turn the PiP on/off.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

spartanstew said:


> The two things I would like to see added to PIP:
> 
> Ability to listen to audio from the PIP window (watch the large, listen to the small).
> Ability to change the size of the PIP window. In some instances (like when watching sports), its just a bit too big, while in others, I wish it were a bit larger.
> ...


I agree with the PIP sound and mentioned that one in my original post. The ability to change PIP size would be nice, but I thought that was pushing our luck. Every TV with PIP that I've had could do that. Even had one TV where you could use the arrow keys, to move the window wherever you wanted it. I really liked that, because when you used the smallest window, you could move it right in the corner of the screen.


Chuck W said:


> While I think you may be right about it being for marketing, I do think "eventually" they will streamline the PiP stuff. When "eventually" is, is up for debate, but I have a feeling it's gonne be a while.
> 
> At this point, all I ask ASAP is a discrete code or assigned button to turn the PiP on/off.


I agree that the PIP On/Off is a must. The macro helps, but the banner screen comes on and all the different menus block half the screen as it arrows across the info banner. Its painful.


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## tomallison24 (Dec 10, 2008)

I love PIP also but never use it because it's so clunky. As far as I'm concerned they could use the Active button, I see it as useless and it is too slow, which is part of the problem with PIP.


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## Reaper (Jul 31, 2008)

Great thread. I'm glad to know how primitive the PIP integration is on DIRECTV. Dish had all these features years ago. This makes my decision to go back to Dish after my current contract with Frontier expires this summer that much easier.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

spartanstew said:


> The two things I would like to see added to PIP:
> 
> Ability to listen to audio from the PIP window (watch the large, listen to the small).
> *Ability to change the size of the PIP window. In some instances (like when watching sports), its just a bit too big, while in others, I wish it were a bit larger.*
> ...


With sports using both bottom and top of the screen for data, I wish there was a left or right center for the PIP location additions.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

RACJ2 said:


> The color buttons on the remote are used for so many things on different menus, I can't see how they could drop them. How would you skip forward and back 12hrs in the guide?


ffwd and rewd now do it.



RACJ2 said:


> Delete programs from the Playlist?


red button does it now



RACJ2 said:


> Jump to a future date and time in the Guide?


press the dash key now



RACJ2 said:


> Delete a series links?


red button right now



RACJ2 said:


> Doesn't seem possible that they would change how all these items work, so they can eliminate buttons.


They have already duplicated everything any of the blue green and yellow keys do in any screen. Dash, and Enter have replaced almost every function, with dash now duplicating yellow, and enter now duplicating blue in every screen.

I agree though, pip needs to be easier to activate. Why not the red button? It does nothing on live tv. And when pip is up, allow the red button to toggle between off, on with small window in right bottom corner, left bottom corner, left top corner, right top corner, side by side, and then back to off. That would be better IMHO.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

Reaper said:


> Great thread. I'm glad to know how primitive the PIP integration is on DIRECTV. Dish had all these features years ago. This makes my decision to go back to Dish after my current contract with Frontier expires this summer that much easier.


Five tuners, and mrv with any and all other hd units from directv. The hr34 is far more versatile in other areas, and I can't say that the hr34 has actual "shortcomings" with PIP.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

inkahauts said:


> ffwd and rewd now do it....They have already duplicated everything any of the blue green and yellow keys do in any screen. Dash, and Enter have replaced almost every function, with dash now duplicating yellow, and enter now duplicating blue in every screen.
> 
> I agree though, pip needs to be easier to activate. Why not the red button? It does nothing on live tv. And when pip is up, allow the red button to toggle between off, on with small window in right bottom corner, left bottom corner, left top corner, right top corner, side by side, and then back to off. That would be better IMHO.


I didn't realize that a FF and REW worked for 12hr jumps and "-" for the yellow button commands. So I guess they could eliminate 3 of the color buttons, but I think its crazy. And at one time, I thought I read that they were moving towards eliminating the "-" to delete items. Instead of eliminating the color buttons, they should remap them for the PIP commands that are lacking. And keep the current model remote as the HMC remote. They are probably switching to the peanut remote to cut costs and ultimately raise profits, at the expense of customer satisfaction. Actually, I could care less about the stock remote, if they at least created discrete PIP codes we could use to program our Harmony, AR and other third party remotes.

The red button idea would be better then what we have now. Although still a bit cumbersome to have to press it several times, having it go through all those gyrations, just to turn it off. Using all the buttons the way I mentioned in a prior post would be much more desirable (including PIP Ch Up & Down, PIP sound, PIP Move).


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

Reaper said:


> Great thread. I'm glad to know how primitive the PIP integration is on DIRECTV. Dish had all these features years ago. This makes my decision to go back to Dish after my current contract with Frontier expires this summer that much easier.


Everybody chooses a provider for their own personal reasons. If PIP commands are high on your list of choosing a provider, then you are making the right decision. My #1 priority is having all my sports in HD like NFL ST, NHL CI, etc. So although PIP buttons would be nice, it is low on my list of how I chose my provider.

Not to mention that my current TV does all the PIP functions I desire. The issue is that currently I can only feed the PIP window with an OTA feed and swap it. If I wasn't so cost conscious, I could add another DIRECTV receiver to feed that window, but I don't thinks its worth $6/mo. Especially when the HR34 has PIP. And I can watch a second feed from that same HR34 on my laptop via DIRECTV2PC or an old dell PC and 19" LCD I set up. And those options are actually better then PIP right now, since I can do everything I want. Also, its nice that it doesn't block any portion of the picture on my 50" screen (but it does tie up my laptop).

Plus, you might want to follow your own philosophy:


Reaper said:


> ...*I'm constantly puzzled by those like you that piss on other options so that you can feel better about your choices*...


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RACJ2" said:


> I didn't realize that a FF and REW worked for 12hr jumps and "-" for the yellow button commands. So I guess they could eliminate 3 of the color buttons, but I think its crazy. And at one time, I thought I read that they were moving towards eliminating the "-" to delete items. Instead of eliminating the color buttons, they should remap them for the PIP commands that are lacking. And keep the current model remote as the HMC remote. They are probably switching to the peanut remote to cut costs and ultimately raise profits, at the expense of customer satisfaction. Actually, I could care less about the stock remote, if they at least created discrete PIP codes we could use to program our Harmony, AR and other third party remotes.
> 
> The red button idea would be better then what we have now. Although still a bit cumbersome to have to press it several times, having it go through all those gyrations, just to turn it off. Using all the buttons the way I mentioned in a prior post would be much more desirable (including PIP Ch Up & Down, PIP sound, PIP Move).


Don't get me started on the color buttons. I would not get rid of them. I would completely repurpose a lot of things and make most things a lot easier to get to than they are now by retaking and changing their approach on many things....


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

Was just talking to my dad on FaceTime, he got the HR34 today (I don't have one yet) and yeah from what I saw they really do need a PIP makeover, way too many button presses to turn it on and off. Crazy. But SBSPIP did look good on his 65 incher.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"TheRatPatrol" said:


> Was just talking to my dad on FaceTime, he got the HR34 today (I don't have one yet) and yeah from what I saw they really do need a PIP makeover, way too many button presses to turn it on and off. Crazy. But SBSPIP did look good on his 65 incher.


I'm at my parents house now, and yes they do need a one button PIP on off solution.

I was thinking if they don't want to use the color buttons how about using the dash button? I know its assigned to the SWiM info screen now, but I don't think that's needed, that info could be placed on the info screen.

But yeah something needs to be done to make it quicker to turn PIP on/off.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

TheRatPatrol said:


> I was thinking if they don't want to use the color buttons how about using the dash button? I know its assigned to the SWiM info screen now, but I don't think that's needed, that info could be placed on the info screen.


Any other thoughts on this, what do you guys think? Either that or move the PIP selection to the far left in the info banner to make it less button presses.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

TheRatPatrol said:


> Any other thoughts on this, what do you guys think? Either that or move the PIP selection to the far left in the info banner to make it less button presses.


My thoughts are still the same although with one additional request.

They need an ON/OFF Toggle button BUT I'd also like to see that when the PiP is turned on, it STAYS on the CURRENT tuner and just opens the other tuner in the PiP. Right now, when you do PiP, it auto swaps to the other tuner as the main screen.

I found myself using it quite a bit during the NCAAs. However, there were times where I would have loved to turn it off for a quick few seconds to see what was under the screen. However, even using the slow macro to turn it off, when I turned it back on, it would swap tuners on me and I'd have to swap back.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"TheRatPatrol" said:


> Any other thoughts on this, what do you guys think? Either that or move the PIP selection to the far left in the info banner to make it less button presses.


Red button makes the most sense to me for toggling it on and off. It's not used at all right now on full screen tv.

Then maybe use the dash key to switch between the different locations and the side by side.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

inkahauts said:


> Red button makes the most sense to me for toggling it on and off. It's not used at all right now on full screen tv.
> 
> Then maybe use the dash key to switch between the different locations and the side by side.


Red button is used on sports channels to bring up the score guide.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"TheRatPatrol" said:


> Red button is used on sports channels to bring up the score guide.


True..my ok how about select then? I know it doesn't do anything unless something else is onscreen.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"inkahauts" said:


> True..my ok how about select then? I know it doesn't do anything unless something else is onscreen.


Might work. That or dash, something needs to be done though.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Considering PIP is only showing up on the HR34 Channel Banner, why is it all the way to the RIGHT?


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"Drucifer" said:


> Considering PIP is only showing up on the HR34 Guide, why is it all the way to the RIGHT?


That's my question too. If they don't want to give us a toggle then move it to the far left of the info banner. Then it would go from seven to four button presses.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Why not just have "down" activate PIP instead of "double play". If you're activating PIP then "double play" gets activated anyways.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"TheRatPatrol" said:


> Might work. That or dash, something needs to be done though.


Dash and enter have other functions already.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> Why not just have "down" activate PIP instead of "double play". If you're activating PIP then "double play" gets activated anyways.


When you hit double play, have something come up that you scroll across to select which pip or if you want just double play? You can't eliminate regular double play...

Heck, I'd be happy with a option to turn on double play when you hit the up arrow and pull up quick tune. Make the center box the pip toggle on/off and if you select it, then have the other squares show to positions of pip or pop that you can choose...


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

inkahauts said:


> When you hit double play, have something come up that you scroll across to select which pip or if you want just double play? You can't eliminate regular double play...


You wouldn't be eliminating double play. Double play is used for PIP.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

inkahauts said:


> Dash and enter have other functions already.


Well the dash info screen could really go in the menu setup screens, I mean how many times are you going to press dash to see that info?



RunnerFL said:


> Why not just have "down" activate PIP instead of "double play". If you're activating PIP then "double play" gets activated anyways.





inkahauts said:


> When you hit double play, have something come up that you scroll across to select which pip or if you want just double play? You can't eliminate regular double play...
> 
> Heck, I'd be happy with a option to turn on double play when you hit the up arrow and pull up quick tune. Make the center box the pip toggle on/off and if you select it, then have the other squares show to positions of pip or pop that you can choose...


Actually that's a great idea. Press the down arrow once, a screen pops up asking you if you want PIP or double play. That might be the best solution.

The only issue I see is how would you exit out of PIP, the exit button?


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

I don't use PIP as much as I use full-screen Double-Play. I see the need to have a quick shortcut for PIP, but seems to me using DOWN as the shortcut key just makes it harder to toggle full-screen video in Double-Play. You would definitely need to let the user select what DOWN would do, but also would need to add this either on the PIP sub-menu in the INFO banner so users could change at whim...


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

I still think the Yellow button is the one to use to turn PiP on and off. Right now all it does is double for the Info button, when on Live TV, so it's somewhat useless as is.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"Chuck W" said:


> I still think the Yellow button is the one to use to turn PiP on and off. Right now all it does is double for the Info button, when on Live TV, so it's somewhat useless as is.


We agree, and at one time it was rumored that the yellow button was going to be a PIP toggle, but it seems like recently D* is moving away from the color buttons.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> I still think the Yellow button is the one to use to turn PiP on and off. Right now all it does is double for the Info button, when on Live TV, so it's somewhat useless as is.


<repeat>The blue, yellow and green buttons are going away.</repeat>


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> <repeat>The blue, yellow and green buttons are going away.</repeat>


They are on every single person's remote right now. They are not going away anytime soon because of that. Make use of them.

Removing buttons is the LAST thing Directv should be doing.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> They are on every single person's remote right now. They are not going away anytime soon because of that. Make use of them.
> 
> Removing buttons is the LAST thing Directv should be doing.


But they aren't on the new remotes...


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> But they aren't on the new remotes...


The remote I got with my HR34 is the same as always.

Worry about it when they actually get released.

What are they gonna do about the scoreguide on the Red button or the mini guide on the Blue... bury those in the menus too?

With all the added functionality these things have, as I said, the LAST thing they should be doing is removing buttons.


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

Let us tell them now.

*Keep the color buttons. Stop destroying functionality that you spent years building up!*

DirecTV, the voice of the customer is speaking here.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> The remote I got with my HR34 is the same as always.
> 
> Worry about it when they actually get released.


They have been released and I'm far from worried.



Chuck W said:


> What are they gonna do about the scoreguide on the Red button or the mini guide on the Blue... bury those in the menus too?


The mini guide now comes up using "enter". As for the score guide you may want to re-read my other post where I said blue, yellow and green were going away. Nowhere was red mentioned.



Chuck W said:


> With all the added functionality these things have, as I said, the LAST thing they should be doing is removing buttons.


Regardless of when you think it should happen it's happening now.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> They have been released and I'm far from worried./quote]
> 
> Can you point me to where I can even see one?
> 
> ...


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> Can you point me to where I can even see one?


There are several threads with pics and explanations of them, search around.



Chuck W said:


> If they have been released then why did I not get one with my HR34?


Do you have a Samsung TV with RVU? If not that's why you didn't get one.



Chuck W said:


> So if not the HR34, what equipment do these remotes come on?


HR34 RVU clients and hotel rooms so far, but I'd bet the "regular" remote changes soon too.



Chuck W said:


> I'm not sure who made the decision to start removing buttons and burying things into the menus but it's not a smart decision.


Someone at DirecTV did obviously...



Chuck W said:


> Now if removing the colored and REPLACING them with other more direct/informative buttons I'm all for, but reducing the amount of buttons is the wrong thing to be doing and I hope the rethink this before they get too many out there.


The functions of the colored buttons ARE being moved to different buttons.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

I have to agree though, there are 19 million plus current remotes with color buttons out there, why take those functions away? And I thought these new remotes were only for hotels and the RVU TVs? Do they really need color buttons on them?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

TheRatPatrol said:


> I have to agree though, there are 19 million plus current remotes with color buttons out there, why take those functions away?


That's the 64 Million dollar question that we'll never get a definitive answer to.



TheRatPatrol said:


> I
> And I thought these new remotes were only for hotels and the RVU TVs? Do they really need color buttons on them?


Think of all the functions that the colored buttons do... Of course they need those functions.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

From what I saw there was plenty of room on the new remotes for the color buttons between the trick play buttons and the number buttons, just slide the numbers down.

Notice how the red button didn't go away? I guess D* really does care about sports.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

TheRatPatrol said:


> From what I saw there was plenty of room on the new remotes for the color buttons between the trial play buttons and the number buttons, just slide the numbers down.
> 
> Notice how the red button didn't go away? I guess D* really does care about sports.


From what I have been reading(after finally finding the model of the remote), it looks as tho these are only for RVUs(which is a good thing). The lack of buttons would make some sense as the RVUs can't do some of the things full DVRs and the HR34 can do(PiP).

So what I could see is Directv coming out with a version of the RC70x but with all 4 colors on it, for the non-RVU receivers.

So with that said, it remains to be seen if the yellow/blue/green buttons will be removed fro full DVR type receivers.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> You wouldn't be eliminating double play. Double play is used for PIP.


I am talking about access. How do you flip between double play and pip? Are you saying change the pip options to side by side, different spots, or double play, and then the down arrow will activate which ever of those is selected in the menu? That may be a real good idea. Basically, instead of pip off,you have double play.....


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Chuck W" said:


> The remote I got with my HR34 is the same as always.
> 
> Worry about it when they actually get released.
> 
> ...


Actually, as much as I don't like them getting rid of the color buttons, I totally agree with DirecTV that if they are,they should make a solution that works with all remotes new and old at the same time right now. plan for the future today, otherwise you end up changing things too many times.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Chuck W" said:


> From what I have been reading(after finally finding the model of the remote), it looks as tho these are only for RVUs(which is a good thing). The lack of buttons would make some sense as the RVUs can't do some of the things full DVRs and the HR34 can do(PiP).
> 
> So what I could see is Directv coming out with a version of the RC70x but with all 4 colors on it, for the non-RVU receivers.
> 
> So with that said, it remains to be seen if the yellow/blue/green buttons will be removed fro full DVR type receivers.


I believe they are working on a new remote to replace all their other remotes. You wont see them just sending them out, but they will simply replace the current ones with a new one as the old ones die.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

inkahauts said:


> I am talking about access. How do you flip between double play and pip? Are you saying change the pip options to side by side, different spots, or double play, and then the down arrow will activate which ever of those is selected in the menu? That may be a real good idea. Basically, instead of pip off,you have double play.....


You don't flip between them, you use one or the other.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> So what I could see is Directv coming out with a version of the RC70x but with all 4 colors on it, for the non-RVU receivers.


You aren't seeing very clearly then...


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> You don't flip between them, you use one or the other.


How do you choose between them? Thats my point. If down arrow activates either pip or dlb, you have to have a way to choose which it will activate.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

inkahauts said:


> How do you choose between them? Thats my point. If down arrow activates either pip or dlb, you have to have a way to choose which it will activate.


Right now you don't have to choose. You select "PIP" from the channel banner for PIP and you hit down to turn on just Double Play. I think what you're not getting here is that Double Play is used to produce PIP, you can't have PIP without Double Play.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> You aren't seeing very clearly then...


If Directv isn't doing this then Directv isn't seeing clearly either. So I hold out hope they will come to their senses.



inkahauts said:


> How do you choose between them? Thats my point. If down arrow activates either pip or dlb, you have to have a way to choose which it will activate.


As Runner mentioned, you have to dig thru the channel banner to turn on PiP. Once you do, then you use the down arrow to swap tuners. What was requested as part of this thread was to assign a key to turn PiP on/off without having to dig through the menus.

The problem is Directv has come up with an ingeneous idea that we don't need more buttons, we need LESS, so it looks as tho they will be taking more things and either burying them into the menus/channel banners or making the same key to so many different things, depending on where you are, that the customer becomes even more confused.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> Right now you don't have to choose. You select "PIP" from the channel banner for PIP and you hit down to turn on just Double Play. I think what you're not getting here is that Double Play is used to produce PIP, you can't have PIP without Double Play.


I think we have a failure to communicate ! 

I now exactly how it works dlb and all right now. I was saying if you make the down arrow activate pip then how would you activate dlb? Dlb without pip that is. While pip uses dlb some people will prefer dlb without pip so you have to be able to select witch you want.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

inkahauts said:


> I was saying if you make the down arrow activate pip then how would you activate dlb? Dlb without pip that is. While pip uses dlb some people will prefer dlb without pip so you have to be able to select witch you want.


Instead of "press down again to activate Double Play" you have the pop up with a selection of "PIP" or "Double Play". Quite easy actually.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

The only issue I see is if you use the down arrow to activate PIP how would you exit out of it, the exit button, or exit button with a warning "do you want to exit PIP"?

I still think either select or dash should be made into an on/off toggle. But that will probably never happen.

I still can not believe D* would offer PIP in their new receiver but not have a button on the remote for it while their competition does.

Sorry to rant, but this is just very frustrating.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

TheRatPatrol said:


> The only issue I see is if you use the down arrow to activate PIP how would you exit out of it, the exit button, or exit button with a warning "do you want to exit PIP"?
> 
> I still think either select or dash should be made into an on/off toggle. But that will probably never happen.
> 
> ...


Good question on "exit". Also let's not forget the 5 different PIP options.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> Instead of "press down again to activate Double Play" you have the pop up with a selection of "PIP" or "Double Play". Quite easy actually.


Then how do you switch to just double play? Do you have to go into the info, over to pip, and turn it off, then go back and hit down arrow again? And what about if you have been using double play and then want to flip pip? You can't have the option for pip or dlb to pop up every time you flip dlb...

I like the idea, but I just don't think they work as well as making select turn pip on and off, and leave the dlb trigger alone. Actually, I think they should make the up arrow activate pip,and make select bring up QuickTune. I have always thought that the select key should bring up the QuickTune.

As for the five different pip placements, you can leave that alone in the banner, and when ever you turn it on it just starts with the same placement as was used the last time it was on.

Or

Using my example, make the up arrow toggle not only on and off, but actually cycle through all the placements as well

I would prefer my first suggestion.

And you can't use exit. That'd be weird. Why would exit exit pip but not dlb in that case?


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Drucifer said:


> I would like PIP to be able to mix LiveTV and DVR Playbacks





naijai said:


> PIP already does either 2 live shows, 2 recorded shows or mix of both





Drucifer said:


> Two liveTV, I can do. The other are a solid no. I get bonked trying to setup PIP while watching a recording (PIP is grayed out) and an error message when in liveTV trying to setup a recording for in PIP.





naijai said:


> Ok worked for me 2 weeks ago but seems to be gone now
> I know I had 2 recordings using PIP. Oh well hope it's added back
> 
> Update:
> Tested it and *PIP does work on recorded shows but only shows recorded on the HR34*, will not work for shows on other receivers. I would assume this would be since the receiver has to switch to the deca to stream the show and switching from the tuners/hard drives which the PIP uses.


Yep, yesterday I got it to work while watching a Recording. Tried today to repeat, but was unable to do so.

Just saw your update. I'll test the HR34 ONLY Recording & PIP during tomorrow ST







game.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

inkahauts said:


> Then how do you switch to just double play?


You turn off PIP, by whatever means that is changed to. You are really making this MUCH harder than it has to be...


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Drucifer said:


> Yep, yesterday I got it to work while watching a Recording. Tried today to repeat, but was unable to do so.
> 
> Just saw your update. I'll test the HR34 ONLY Recording & PIP during tomorrow ST
> 
> ...


I'm doing it now. Watching *Castle* recorded on the HR34 and the *Yankees* live in the PIP.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> You turn off PIP, by whatever means that is changed to. You are really making this MUCH harder than it has to be...


Actually, my point is that this makes it to hard. You are saying that the way you turn it on and how you turn it off are completely different.

And would it ask you every time you flip tuners on dlb if you wanted to activate pip instead? If not how do you activate pip while dlb is active?

I think it's best keeping different keys for dlb and pip activation.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

inkahauts said:


> Actually, my point is that this makes it to hard. You are saying that the way you turn it on and how you turn it off are completely different.
> 
> And would it ask you every time you flip tuners on dlb if you wanted to activate pip instead? If not how do you activate pip while dlb is active?


omg dude, it's this fricking simple.... You press down and see a message asking if you want PIP our Double Play. You select PIP, bam you have PIP. Want to turn off PIP? Exit by whatever means they've provided. Right now that's using the info banner. Now press down again and select Double Play. And NO it would not ask you every time you flip tuners because it knows PIP is on so it knows to just flip the tuners. Does pressing down now ask you if you want to activate Double Play when PIP is on? NO! It simply switches pictures. Why do you now have to have it ask you every time? Again, you're making it much harder than it has to be.



inkahauts said:


> I think it's best keeping different keys for dlb and pip activation.


Yeah, well it's not all about you...


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> omg dude, it's this fricking simple.... You press down and see a message asking if you want PIP our Double Play. You select PIP, bam you have PIP. Want to turn off PIP? Exit by whatever means they've provided. Right now that's using the info banner. Now press down again and select Double Play. And NO it would not ask you every time you flip tuners because it knows PIP is on so it knows to just flip the tuners. Does pressing down now ask you if you want to activate Double Play when PIP is on? NO! It simply switches pictures. Why do you now have to have it ask you every time? Again, you're making it much harder than it has to be.
> 
> Yeah, well it's not all about you...


Ok... using your method, so now I've activated and am in double play mode. So how do I activate PiP now, while in double play?

Also, having to again grind thru menus to turn PiP OFF is what people are trying to avoid.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> Ok... using your method, so now I've activated and am in double play mode. So how do I activate PiP now, while in double play?


Since there currently is no way to force an exit of Double Play you can't. They'd have to create a way.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"RunnerFL" said:


> omg dude, it's this fricking simple.... You press down and see a message asking if you want PIP our Double Play. You select PIP, bam you have PIP. Want to turn off PIP? Exit by whatever means they've provided. Right now that's using the info banner. Now press down again and select Double Play. And NO it would not ask you every time you flip tuners because it knows PIP is on so it knows to just flip the tuners. Does pressing down now ask you if you want to activate Double Play when PIP is on? NO! It simply switches pictures. Why do you now have to have it ask you every time? Again, you're making it much harder than it has to be.
> 
> Yeah, well it's not all about you...


You didn't hear my point. If double play is active because you where using it an hour ago, how do you switch to pip? This method has to many, if I am in this state, this happens, if I am in this state that happens.

That why I think it needs it's own specific trigger that will always work regardless of double play. Plus it could allow easy access to turn it off, which the down arrow would never do.


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

RunnerFL said:


> omg dude, it's this fricking simple.... You press down and see a message asking if you want PIP our Double Play. You select PIP, bam you have PIP. Want to turn off PIP? Exit by whatever means they've provided. Right now that's using the info banner. Now press down again and select Double Play. And NO it would not ask you every time you flip tuners because it knows PIP is on so it knows to just flip the tuners. Does pressing down now ask you if you want to activate Double Play when PIP is on? NO! It simply switches pictures. Why do you now have to have it ask you every time? Again, you're making it much harder than it has to be.


Thank you for posting the more detailed explanation of your proposal. I now understand it, but before I can buy into it I'd love to hear your "exit" option. The discussion started with wanting a quick way to launch PIP, but if it's at the expense of true Double-Play (full-screen dual buffer toggling) or requires new keys on a remote that has buttons being deprecated, I'm not sure we're simplifying ...


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Drew2k said:


> Thank you for posting the more detailed explanation of your proposal. I now understand it, but before I can buy into it I'd love to hear your "exit" option. The discussion started with wanting a quick way to launch PIP, but if it's at the expense of true Double-Play (full-screen dual buffer toggling) or requires new keys on a remote that has buttons being deprecated, I'm not sure we're simplifying ...


I believe someone already suggested dash to exit PIP, that works for me. We could do without dash showing us we're hooked up via SWiM or not.

As for picking which PIP option to use, there are 5, I'm not sure how that can be done. There aren't 5 of any type of button on the remote that can be used for that.


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

OK, here's a left-field proposal that uses two-keys, and requires a change to "true" DoublePlay as implemented on non-HR34 DVRs.... would this be a deal-breaker?

Use DOWN as the DoublePlay/PIP key and on the first press, display a "pictorial" image showing the keys used for DP and PIP.

If you want true DP, press DOWN again. You get full-screen video on the other tuner. To switch back to the other tuner, press DOWN-DOWN again.

If you want PIP, press any of the following keys after that initial DOWN key:
0 - Turn PIP off
1 - Display PIP window in top left corner (get it? top left of the num keys)
3 - Display PIP window in top right corner
7 - Display PIP window in bottom left corner
9 - Display PIP window in bottom right corner

5 - Display PIP in side-by-side windows, and/or toggle audio by switching between PIP window on left and PIP window on right

With this proposal it would always require two keys to toggle DoublePlay and PIP, but anyone can instantly switch display methods in just two keys...

Here's a run-through to demonstrate, starting with DoublePlay off and no PIP windows present. Tuner is on 202.

Press DOWN and see an on-screen graphic showing my DP and PIP options. If I hit EXIT, nothing happens. Instead I hit DOWN, so DP starts and I now switch to 206 on this tuner.

Press DOWN-DOWN, and I toggle back to channel 202 on the other tuner.

Now I want to see the buffers side-by-side, so I hit DOWN-5, and two windows appear, with 202 on the left and 206 on the right. 

I hit DOWN-5 again and audio jumps from the left window (202) to the right window (206).

With 206 active in the right window, now I hit DOWN-1 and the display changes from side-by-side PIP windows to full screen video of 206, with 202 in the upper left PIP window.

Hit DOWN-8 and now the window is in the bottom right.

I now hit DOWN-DOWN and go from PIP back to double play in full-screen.


So.... it sounds complicated, but gives instant 2-key access to all of the PIP and DP features, and with an on-screen graphic (with a setting to control the display of the graphic) this could be a great time-saver.

Thoughts?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Drew2k said:


> OK, here's a left-field proposal that uses two-keys, and requires a change to "true" DoublePlay as implemented on non-HR34 DVRs.... would this be a deal-breaker?
> 
> Use DOWN as the DoublePlay/PIP key and on the first press, display a "pictorial" image showing the keys used for DP and PIP.
> 
> ...


Way too complicated. I'll be honest, I quit reading about half way in because my head started spinning.


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## Drew2k (Aug 16, 2006)

RunnerFL said:


> Way too complicated. I'll be honest, I quit reading about half way in because my head started spinning.


:lol:

OK, new simple proposal... 

[Down] [Down] = Launch DoublePlay if DP is off, or swap the tuners if DP is already on

[Down] [5] = Cycle through all PIP options (from Off, to Side-by-Side, to Top-left, to Top-right, to Bottom-Right, to Bottom-left, to Off again)


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

Drew2k said:


> :lol:
> 
> OK, new simple proposal...
> 
> ...


I like your enthusiasm, but that's still too many button presses. 

My vote is still for the dash button (or select or the yellow button :sure to be a quick on/off toggle, with one down arrow being the swap.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

TheRatPatrol said:


> I like your enthusiasm, but that's still too many button presses.
> 
> My vote is still for the dash button (or select or the yellow button :sure to be a quick on/off toggle, with one down arrow being the swap.


Dash button works(if Directv really is silly enough to get rid of the rest of the color buttons). Then while in PiP use the UP arrow to cycle the positon of the window/split screen.

Boy life would be so much simpler if Directv would come to their senses a leave the color buttons alone and use say the yellow to turn PiP On/Off and say Green to cycle the position of the window instead of cramming more and more stuff onto a single button depending on what mode you are in. :nono2:


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> Dash button works(if Directv really is silly enough to get rid of the rest of the color buttons). Then while in PiP use the UP arrow to cycle the positon of the window/split screen.


Actually I like the idea of cycling through the window positions but now that you brought up the idea. They should make that happen with the left and right buttons. Up is for QuickTune.



Chuck W said:


> Boy life would be so much simpler if Directv would come to their senses a leave the color buttons alone and use say the yellow to turn PiP On/Off and say Green to cycle the position of the window instead of cramming more and more stuff onto a single button depending on what mode you are in. :nono2:


That ship has sailed...


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> That ship has sailed...


Not really. Directv can always come to their senses. Will they tho, is the question. :lol:


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## mikek (May 18, 2007)

How about a remote control that has PIP and SWAP buttons? 

Done.

Seriously, I can't believe they made a box that has PIP but no PIP button on the remote control they comes with the box. 

At least there should be some discrete codes that you could map to a universal remote. But I have faith that directv will straighten it out eventually.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> Not really. Directv can always come to their senses. Will they tho, is the question. :lol:


No, the ship has sailed and it's time for you to accept that. The remotes are already "out in the wild". I'm afraid it's a don deal.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> No, the ship has sailed and it's time for you to accept that. The remotes are already "out in the wild". I'm afraid it's a don deal.





RunnerFL said:


> HR34 RVU clients and hotel rooms so far, but I'd bet the "regular" remote changes soon too.


Currently, they are only for RVU's and Hotels. RVU's already have reduced functionality compared to pure DVR's thus less need for buttons.

When they start handing out the new remotes with the DVR's/HR34's then I'll think about reconsidering. Until then, I'll continue to hold out hope Directv will come to their senses.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> Currently, they are only for RVU's and Hotels. RVU's already have reduced functionality compared to pure DVR's thus less need for buttons.


No they do not.



Chuck W said:


> When they start handing out the new remotes with the DVR's/HR34's then I'll think about reconsidering. Until then, I'll continue to hold out hope Directv will come to their senses.


Good luck with that. While you're at it wait for $2/gal gas.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

RunnerFL said:


> No they do not.


Can RVU's do PiP(I mean to say HR34 since that is what they hook to)?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Chuck W said:


> Can RVU's do PiP(I mean to say HR34 since that is what they hook to)?


Not sure, I don't have one of the Samsung TV's that has RVU. I'm sure someone that has one can chime in or you can search for threads where that has been discussed.

The HR2X's don't have PIP so by your example they shouldn't have the colored buttons either because they "have reduced functionality compared to pure DVR's thus less need for buttons"?


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

A funny thing about the lack of controls for PIG that is part of the color button removal. Twice in 24 hours I've been stuck watching a commercial from Dish about the Hawppa that I could not slip past because I was doing things that put the program in PIG.


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