# Lost HBO over HDMI



## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

As of today, I can no longer watch HBO over HDMI to my television. I get an error message that says "HDMI connection not permitted. Press SELECT for more information." (And pressing Select does nothing.)

Reportedly, HBO is behind this, and it has something to do with my television not being up to date enough to allow for security of the HDMI output.

GAAAAAAAHHHHHH!

HDCP? What the???

According to DirecTV, the major studios mandated this as of April 12, and it was implemented so quickly they didn't even have time to send out a letter. 

According to DirecTV, I have to connect my DVR with Component cables in order to be able to watch HBO.

I'm surprised that I'm the first one posting anything about this. I didn't see anything in Google about this.

I'm really annoyed.


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## samrs (May 30, 2004)

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=204075

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=129334


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

You actually have two options ....
1) Use the Component Video connection instead of HDMI
2) Get a newer TV that properly supports HDCP copy protection over HDMI


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

Just a bit of follow-up. What's confounding is that my television is, according to the manufacturer, HDCP Compliant.

I found a third solution, one referenced in the threads that *samrs* posted, namely, a powered HDMI splitter.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

bldxyz said:


> Just a bit of follow-up. What's confounding is that my television is, according to the manufacturer, HDCP Compliant.
> 
> *I found a third solution, one referenced in the threads that samrs posted, namely, a powered HDMI splitter.*


I'm still questioning whether or not this will correct the problem of having a TV that is supposedly HDCP compliant, yet is failing DIRECTV's HDCP copy protection to insert an HDCP compliant switch between the two.

Please post back how it turns out as I have the same problem on one TV here with the DIRECTV DVRs


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> I'm still questioning whether or not this will correct the problem of having a TV that is supposedly HDCP compliant, yet is failing DIRECTV's HDCP copy protection to insert an HDCP compliant switch between the two.
> 
> Please post back how it turns out as I have the same problem on one TV here with the DIRECTV DVRs


I should have said I found a third solution *that works*.

I was surprised that it worked. It was only people who had posted the solution here who thought it would. DirecTV isn't interested in saying anything other than to use Component, Toshiba suggested trying a newer, v.1.4 HDMI cable, and Monoprice, the people I bought the splitter from, didn't think the splitter would work.


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

The cable will make NO DIFFERENCE in this situation....


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

bldxyz said:


> I should have said I found a third solution *that works*.
> 
> I was surprised that it worked. It was only people who had posted the solution here who thought it would. DirecTV isn't interested in saying anything other than to use Component, Toshiba suggested trying a newer, v.1.4 HDMI cable, and Monoprice, the people I bought the splitter from, didn't think the splitter would work.


So which splitter did you ultimately get from the post in the other thread on the General DIRECTV forum? Or will either suffice since the first does not specifically mention HDCP compatibility in the specs. for it?

http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...011306&p_id=8204&seq=1&format=3#specification

http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...011306&p_id=8154&seq=1&format=3#specification


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## lacubs (Sep 12, 2010)

i got 1 more question about this, as people tv get older will people run this problem? or is this a one time deal?


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

texasbrit said:


> The cable will make NO DIFFERENCE in this situation....


I have to say that I love answers like these because they are devoid of anything that is convincing.

Person A: Asserts that X is true
Person B: Asserts that Y is true, and X is false
Person C: Asserts that Z is true and the X and Y is false
Person D: Asserts that Y is false

None of them offer any reasoning or facts that can back up their claims, so what I am supposed to believe?


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

lacubs said:


> i got 1 more question about this, as people tv get older will people run this problem? or is this a one time deal?


I think if you fix it it, it will be a one time deal, but it is going to continue to get worse. At some point, they are going to force down-rezzing over component.

Of course, I figured THAT would be the first step as you can copy content from component rather easily. But the industry is so screwed up on all this nothing surprises me anymore.


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

bldxyz said:


> I have to say that I love answers like these because they are devoid of anything that is convincing.
> 
> Person A: Asserts that X is true
> Person B: Asserts that Y is true, and X is false
> ...


Not sure how you want me to "prove" this. It's just a cable, making a series of electrical connections from one device to another. HDCP is a copy protection protocol, which is based on a series of messages sent by one device to another. The cable has no idea what messages are being sent between the devices. The HDCP "failure" occurs when the DirecTv box sends messages to the TV saying "prove to me you are HDCP compliant by sending me the correct response to these messages. ". If the TV sends back the wrong answer, HDCP is determined to have failed and so the DirecTV box shuts off the output. It's basically as simple as that. The cable is irrelevant.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

HDCP is a ring tailed beast. Someone earlier mentioned Toshiba and I had more issues with HDCP in the early days with them.

Chances are if you are having these errors now your native HDMI interface running on your monitorTV could experience similar issues with other enhancements on any HDMI connected device.

The standards exist,but he vendors choose which parts of the spec they will implement. HDMI 1.1 was pretty touch and go. By the time it hit 1.3 it was pretty stable though I still have one Toshiba that is on 1.3 and it flakes on audio on IPL situations from time to time. I blame that on Toshiba.

Most current HDMI equipped devices are being shipped with 1.3 or 1.4 the latter being the current 3D spec requirement.

Before you spend money on a solution unplug the TV (no power to the chassis) then plug back in, start the TV let it come up then start the sat box and see if the handshake works. I had a Toshiba DLP set that forced me to that on numerous occasions. I put an in line switch between it and the power center so I could just kill power instead of having to fish wit the plug itself.

I gave that set away eventually but once I learned how to ensure a proper handshake, I no longer had HDCP errors.

HDCP is the High Definition Copy Protection protocol that protects the media owners from perfect quality bootlegging. It prevents us honest folk from having a completely seamless interface while the dedicated croks can bypass or emulate it. Does more damage to the customers IMO.

No certantities about that working. But it certainly did in my specific case.

Don "Half Defined Color Picture" Bolton



lacubs said:


> i got 1 more question about this, as people tv get older will people run this problem? or is this a one time deal?


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## mccinema (Apr 25, 2012)

Does anyone know if this HDMI incompatibility issue is also hitting Dish Network and Cable outlets?


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

mccinema said:


> Does anyone know if this HDMI incompatibility issue is also hitting Dish Network and Cable outlets?


Don't know, but it will. HBO will apply the same rules to every provider, it's only a matter of time.


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

texasbrit said:


> Not sure how you want me to "prove" this. It's just a cable, making a series of electrical connections from one device to another. HDCP is a copy protection protocol, which is based on a series of messages sent by one device to another. The cable has no idea what messages are being sent between the devices. The HDCP "failure" occurs when the DirecTv box sends messages to the TV saying "prove to me you are HDCP compliant by sending me the correct response to these messages. ". If the TV sends back the wrong answer, HDCP is determined to have failed and so the DirecTV box shuts off the output. It's basically as simple as that. The cable is irrelevant.


Didn't ask for proof... just asked for more than assertion. Now you've done that and you have added more to the discussion than DirecTV, Toshiba and Monoprice did. Thank you.


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

lugnutathome said:


> HDCP is a ring tailed beast. Someone earlier mentioned Toshiba and I had more issues with HDCP in the early days with them.
> 
> Chances are if you are having these errors now your native HDMI interface running on your monitorTV could experience similar issues with other enhancements on any HDMI connected device.
> 
> ...


This is essentially what the advanced technical support people at DirecTV suggested to me (unplug the TV and plug it back in, then reset the receiver). I haven't had the chance to try this yet, but I will, even though the splitter suggestion worked. I want to be able to tell DirecTV I tried what they asked.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

bldxyz said:


> This is essentially what the advanced technical support people at DirecTV suggested to me (unplug the TV and plug it back in, then reset the receiver). I haven't had the chance to try this yet, but I will,* even though the splitter suggestion worked.* I want to be able to tell DirecTV I tried what they asked.


bldxyz, again which splitter did you get? Or will both suffice?

See the links in my original message #8 earlier.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

Resetting the box (DVR) would likely have 0 effect. It's most likely that the handshake for the HDMI/HDCP connection has to happen in a certain sequence or it may spew HDCP errors.

In my case I only needed to remove all power from the TV to get it back to possibly working next try. You may need to try having the DVR set to that channel before powering out the TV so when it does handshake with the DVR it will do so with HDCP in operation.

Don "I returned several perfectly good DVD players till I discovered it was my TV that was the problem" Bolton



bldxyz said:


> This is essentially what the advanced technical support people at DirecTV suggested to me (unplug the TV and plug it back in, then reset the receiver). I haven't had the chance to try this yet, but I will, even though the splitter suggestion worked. I want to be able to tell DirecTV I tried what they asked.


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## Fab55 (Jul 25, 2008)

lugnutathome said:


> Resetting the box (DVR) would likely have 0 effect. It's most likely that the handshake for the HDMI/HDCP connection has to happen in a certain sequence or it may spew HDCP errors.


I have to disagree, in my case, powering off the DVR has fixed the issue. I started seeing the "HDCP" message when I was watching an HBO/Max channel, then I would switch from 1 HBO/MAX channel to another, which I though was weird. Powering off/on the DVR fixed the issue, re-establishing the HDMI Handshake (I'm assuming). I would think there has to be some sort of software bug... somewhere...


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

texasbrit said:


> Don't know, but it will. HBO will apply the same rules to every provider, it's only a matter of time.





HoTat2 said:


> bldxyz, again which splitter did you get? Or will both suffice?
> 
> See the links in my original message #8 earlier.


I'll get to it. I just haven't had the chance.


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## bldxyz (Aug 18, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> bldxyz, again which splitter did you get? Or will both suffice?
> 
> See the links in my original message #8 earlier.


Okay: with no promises that this will work for anyone else, since I haven't a clue why this solution works and merely followed the advice to get a powered HDMI-Splitter (HDCP compliant), this is the one I bought, and has worked for me*.

1x2 Pigtail HDMI® Splitter

*Three notes: 

I haven't even been powering it, since it seems to be working without the power plugged into it. Perhaps that is because I'm not actually splitting the HDMI signal?
Yesterday, a few times when I turned on the TV, the color was strange (very yellow). I found that switching the input and putting the DVR into standby and back corrected the issue. This may or may not be related to item #1, the fact that I haven't plugged in the splitter's power adapter.
When first connecting the splittler, it didn't display anything on the screen when I used position 1 in the splitter, but it did for position 2.

Again, no promises that it will work for anyone else.


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## coldsteel (Mar 29, 2007)

mccinema said:


> Does anyone know if this HDMI incompatibility issue is also hitting Dish Network and Cable outlets?


Yes, it is affecting Dish Network.


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## jamer81 (Jul 7, 2012)

HBO should just be grateful that millions of cable/satellite subscribers who DON'T watch their channel are effectively 'subsidizing' or paying for HBO anyway, because of how cable/satellite are sold in bundles with several hundred channels. Isn't that effectively a form reverse piracy, HBO stealing money from people with no interest in watching HBO?


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

No. HBO is a separate premium subscription package. Only those that want to pay for it are paying for it.


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