# New 721 on existing 3 satellite config - fail check switch test



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Hi All,

Been reading the forums and ahve not seen anyone posting the following problem.

I have a Dish 500 with legacy twin lnb and Dish 300 (61.5) with legacy dual lnb (connected with two SW21's.

Both outputs from the SW21's were originally going to two receivers (501 and 4700). The two receivers saw all three sats fine.

I've disconnected the 501 and 4700 and connected the two inputs to a brand new 721. I attempted to do a switch check. The first time it said the matrix didn't match between inputs 1 and 2. I redid the switch check and now both show sw21 and 110/61.5. They do not show 119 in the matrix's but on the main point dish screen I have good 119 signal and menu is green. The 61/5 is good signal and green menu. 110 is read and says wrong sat -119.

Any ideas?? The 721 has the factory 054 software.

Thanks,
George


----------



## JustMe (Jul 3, 2003)

i have the smae problem my sw is L12 and it was find untill now i run a check switch couple weeks ago thats when that happen. I only can get 119 if i do a hard reset


----------



## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

I seem to remember that the 721 needs to have an exactly identical switch matrix for both satellite inputs. So, in your case, put both Dish500 outputs into input A of the SW21's, and put the output of your sideslot into input B of the SW21, then do the "Check Switch" again. 

Or, maybe as a first stop, disconnect ALL SW21's and let your 721 get caught up on software first - use the barrel connectors you can get at Radio Shack as a temp .


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Thanks for the reply. I do have the twin lnb going to port A on the sw21's and dual from 61.5 to port B. (both inputs are configured the same, 2 sw21's.) When I do a check switch it does not see all 3 sats. Most of the time it comes up with 110 and 61.5 odd/even, never 119 so it cannot update the software.

A 501 and 4700 (4900 software) on same inputs have no problem doing a check switch.

Looks like I will head up to the roof and bypass the sw21 and go direct to the twin for now. I also have a new legacy quad that is going in. I think you are right in that the 054 factory firmware cannot see the twin/sw21 config properly.

George



scooper said:


> I seem to remember that the 721 needs to have an exactly identical switch matrix for both satellite inputs. So, in your case, put both Dish500 outputs into input A of the SW21's, and put the output of your sideslot into input B of the SW21, then do the "Check Switch" again.
> 
> Or, maybe as a first stop, disconnect ALL SW21's and let your 721 get caught up on software first - use the barrel connectors you can get at Radio Shack as a temp .


----------



## Unthinkable (Sep 13, 2002)

RocketNJ said:


> Hi All,
> 
> Been reading the forums and ahve not seen anyone posting the following problem.
> 
> ...


I posted about a similar problem above in a thread by Up On The Mountain a few weeks ago where he mentioned having switch problems caused by lightning.

See this thread:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=16698&highlight=unthinkable

My first 721 viewed the 3 satellites (110/119/61.5) fine for a few weeks before it was no longer able to do it whatsoever with no changes made to the switch configuration by myself and no hardware failings when it comes to the two SW21's I have. My other receivers never once had a problem seeing all 3 satellites in the same configuration and still work flawlessly while the 721's switch check gets confused over and over again trying to do something it once did perfectly. I had to rma my first one for a number of other nasty problems it had and haven't yet tried to hook up the third satellite yet to its replacement so I'm not sure what to tell you. Something tells me the new one will have the same issues the last one had with regards to seeing 61.5 and not seeing everything on 119 if I attempt it though. I'll try and keep you posted on how it works out in the end. Dish Network advanced tech support says ditch the old legacy switches and upgrade to new lnb's and switches for 350 bucks or so to cure the problem, despite it working fine with this equipment when I first hooked it up.


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Thanks for the link.

Well my 721 sees the twin legacy lnb fine, dish switch check shows 119/110 both odd and even on both inputs.

Once I put the sw21's back in with the 61.5 dish it is back to crazyu switch check results. Shows sw21 for one and sw42 for the other input.

I'm getting frustrated.

I have a new quad legacy lnb and tried putting that in as well.

I took each input off the 721 and put it on my 501 and the 501 switch check detected all 3 sats correctly. So looks like the 721 has some software problems. (this is 112 software).

george


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Still not working with sw21's installed. 

About ready to throw the 721 out the window. It WILL NOT cascade commands to the legacy twin (or legacy quad) through the sw21 switches even though this is supposed to be a supported configuration.

Any else here actually ever have a 721 work with this configuration?

I think the 721 has a problem and Dish network will not admit it.

George


----------



## Unthinkable (Sep 13, 2002)

RocketNJ said:


> Thanks for the link.
> 
> Well my 721 sees the twin legacy lnb fine, dish switch check shows 119/110 both odd and even on both inputs.
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear about the continuing frustrations George. I spent a lot of time troubleshooting my switch configuration doing everything I could to remedy this on my original 721 to no avail. 
I have two Dish 500's with two SW21 switches along with a legacy dual lnb and a legacy single lnb on the 61.5 dish. In the end, I came to the same conclusion you did regarding it likely being a software related issue in the receiver as I can hook up two 501's to this same configuration with no issues at all and it once worked perfectly on my original 721 for a weeks before a hard reset ruined its ability to see all 3 satellites at once. Nothing changed in my configuration and no hardware has failed on me so I'm left to believe it has to be something screwy in the check switch screen currently in the 112 revision. My switch checks would identify wrong switches every time I ran them and gave me an entire multitude of differing information every time. Advanced tech support was clueless on resolving this every time I attempted to get new solutions.


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

I'm wondering if the legacy quad with the sw64 will work. More money than I wanted to spend though.

I'm trying to get Dish to own up to the problem so they would have to supply the sw64. I even offered to bring the 721 to any of their authorized dealers in the area and test on a multi dish setup there. Dish refused.

I've spent way too much time on a simple upgrade already. Took me less than an hour to run the additional line from the switches down to the 721 and install the quad. I spent over 8 hours trying to make it work.

If it turns out to definitely be a problem with the 721 not working in my particular configuration that is outlined in the manual I will go after Dish for some credit on my bill.

George


----------



## JustMe (Jul 3, 2003)

it is the current software that is the problem


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Do you have any hard proof of that? I would love to bounce it back to Dish and make them pay to straighten this out.

George



JustMe said:


> it is the current software that is the problem


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Here's an update. 10 hours of going up and down the ladder checking a bunch of different configurations. Dish admitted they have a software bug and are working on a fix. No ETA for the fix and they will not supply me with the proper hardware that will work with the current software.

Damn Dish


----------



## Unthinkable (Sep 13, 2002)

RocketNJ said:


> Here's an update. 10 hours of going up and down the ladder checking a bunch of different configurations. Dish admitted they have a software bug and are working on a fix. No ETA for the fix and they will not supply me with the proper hardware that will work with the current software.
> 
> Damn Dish


Thats probably about the same number of hours I put in trying to get things to work the way they should with the 112 revision. I never could get Dish to acknowledge any kind of software bug at all though despite numerous calls to advanced tech support and all the feedback they could ever hope to hear from a customer so at least you got that much out of them. My stock response to remedy this problem was to upgrade my lnb's and switches, but I'm hesitant to do that when the newer dishpro plus ones should be available down the road which allow for one cable to run a single dual tuner receiver.


----------



## Unthinkable (Sep 13, 2002)

RocketNJ said:


> Here's an update. 10 hours of going up and down the ladder checking a bunch of different configurations. Dish admitted they have a software bug and are working on a fix. No ETA for the fix and they will not supply me with the proper hardware that will work with the current software.
> 
> Damn Dish


Just to add a little bit more insult to injury, there were a bunch of folks who posted here that they were able to get better switches and lnb's for no additional cost at all when Dish Network sent an authorized dealer out to install the 2nd dish for receiving the additional local channels, but the official policy appeared to be certain exceptions in some cases while not others fwiw.


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

Well I am throwing in the towel. Just ordered a sw64 and should have it by Friday. Will let you know if it resolves the problem.

George


----------



## boba (May 23, 2003)

George for the price of that SW-64 you probably could have bought a DirecTivo with 2 turners and software that works. If you ebayed that 721 you probably could have upgraded the hard drive to a larger drive than the 721.


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

I appreciate your comments but DirectTV does not offer the foreign language package I am subscribed to. Also the cost to upgrade my 501 and two 301's would put the package price a lot higher. And also DTV does not offer the full locals package where I live (I get about 12 local channels and watch programming on at least 8 of them at one point or another). Last, DTV does not offer the Superstation package (extra WB and UPN channels). I like WSBK in Boston.

I understand that the 721 isn't as feature rich as other PVR options and I do not want this to turn into a flame war of Dish vs DTV.

P.S. - Got a new SW64 on it's way for $100 shipped.



boba said:


> George for the price of that SW-64 you probably could have bought a DirecTivo with 2 turners and software that works. If you ebayed that 721 you probably could have upgraded the hard drive to a larger drive than the 721.


----------



## JustMe (Jul 3, 2003)

I got to give it to you at least you got them to admit that there is a software problem. My good friend is a dealer where is live and he called for me and they hang up on him beacuse they told him he doesn't know what he is doing. I am now just waiting for the SW upgrade.


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

It's called CSR roulette. I think they knew about the problem but didn't want to admit it.

Anyone else in here ahve a 721 with two sw21's and either a legacy twin or quad for a 3 sat solution? If so is it working?
I have not heard of a single person that has the legacy twin or quad with sw21's working with the 112 software.

I'll install the sw64 when I get it. Should not take long to do.

George


----------



## Unthinkable (Sep 13, 2002)

JustMe said:


> I got to give it to you at least you got them to admit that there is a software problem. My good friend is a dealer where is live and he called for me and they hang up on him beacuse they told him he doesn't know what he is doing. I am now just waiting for the SW upgrade.


That doesn't surprise me in the slightest considering when I called to get my 721 RMA'd, not one single CSR had documented any of our calls or troubleshooting attempts with a single note over a period of several weeks. I couldn't believe it as when I used to work for their competitor, I had to document all calls whenever they had really heavy call volumes and needed more bodies to fill in and do general csr work with pretty extensive notes irregardless of what the call entailed. The guy filling out the form for the RMA brought up my last call notes on record in April or something instead of all the recent ones in July. It was akin to the three stooges poke in the eye after investing all that time and effort with so many different tech support reps in the hopes of resolving a pretty seemingly not so difficult problem.


----------



## JustMe (Jul 3, 2003)

SW64 works fine i have tried it, it works so you will be all good


----------



## RocketNJ (Jul 29, 2003)

I've finnaly fixed the problem by replacing the two SW21's with an SW64 (with my legacy quad and dual).

Now all of my receivers including the new 721 receive all 3 satellites.

This pretty much proves the 721 L112 software has a problem cascading through SW21's.


----------

