# American Idol (Top 9)



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

It's time again ... Hopefully your favorite will sing well tonight.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

It's a 2 man race now....Danny and Adam.


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## joshjr (Aug 2, 2008)

Can someone post the call and test info for Matt please?


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

Adam, Allison, Kris, and Danny were head and shoulders above the rest. Megan goes home.


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## waynebtx (Dec 24, 2006)

Have to agree Megan goes home.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

Adam, Danny, and Kris at the top of the heap this week.

Allison was good, but a step behind those three, IMO.

Next grouping for me was Matt Giraud and Scott. I like both of them, they were alright, but not great.

Anoop was a total train wreck - I couldn't even watch him. Thank God for FF!

Megan is in trouble. I like her, but her song choice is poor. She's yet to pick a song that shows anything. She's got a cool sound - I really like her sound, her quirky style. But she hasn't "brought it", and I won't be surprised to see her go.

Surprise of the night, for me... Lil would be in my bottom 3. I don't think there's any real danger of her going home tomorrow, BUT, if she doesn't step it up soon, she's going to meet an early demise. Another mediocre performance. And for the love of pete, PLEASE, fire whoever is giving you styling tips. She looks so cute & fun in her intro videos, and then she comes out looking like a circus clown. I think she's looked ridiculous every week, and she's going to be in trouble soon if she doesn't kick it up a notch, Emeril style. BAM!


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## dettxw (Nov 21, 2007)

I like to be concise, boil the choice down to its essence.

Whose records would I spend my money on?

Right now that would be Kris.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Kris - very good
Adam - very good
Danny - very good
Allison - good
Lil - good
Scott - good
Matt - OK
Megan - bad
Anoop - bad


Anoop might have saved Megan.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

My favorites tonight were Adam, Kris, Danny and Scott (in that order) ...

Allison, sorry I don't like it and I know why I don't like it now, too. Finish the words. Every other word is only about half as long as it should be.

As for the bottom three .. Megan, Matt and Lil but it doesn't really matter as Megan was downright bad tonight. Everyone else was at least respectable and some were downright great!


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

I liked Anoop .. Now, the dancing and "the look" were bad, but singing I thought he was spot on. Interesting that folks think he is completely bad.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Really Doug? I think Simon hit it right on the head. He looked like a wannabe.. Sorry but that guy does not have attitude and to try to act like he does just looks silly. As for his singing.... Sorry.. Not my cup of tea.

Top 4 for me is Kris, Adam, Danny and Lil. I think Allison took a step down. Found the transition from slow to fast awkward and I think she was off on the fast part. Great start.. but weak ending. In terms of voices.. Top two in my books.. Adam and Kris by a comfortable margin and they both showed it tonight.

I think they were a bit harsh on Lil and Matt this week as I thought both put out solid performances. Not at the level of Kris, Adam, and Danny.

Scott.. Sorry.. Just don't like his voice and to me it just sounded like bad Billy Joel impression.

Megan was unique week one.. Now it just sounds the same.. 

Personally I don't care if it is Megan, Anoop or Scott. The rest I want to see more of.

Oh.. I wanted to vomit when they get showing those three girls when danny was singing.. UGH!!!


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

So, nobody else found the "genius" Adam's performance to be (to borrow a Simonism) "indulgent"? 
I don't see the range that he supposedly posesses, all I see is a stage actor playing a part and screeching the notes he can't sing like the hair-band frontmen from the 80s.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

I agree that Anoop or Megan are going home. I really can't stand listening to Megan. Her voice has a quality that is like fingernails on a blackboard to me. Her vibrato is totally uncontrolled and when it kicks in she is all over the place pitch wise. She always sounds like she's using an auto tuner even though she probably isn't. Horrendous.

The music mix for Anoop tonight was also horrendous. It seemed like nothing but drums in the mix, with everything else (including Anoop) burried deep behind the drums. I still didn't like his performance and think he is in the bottom two. If I had to pick though, Megan would be gone, but she would have been gone weeks ago. She's not bad to look at, other than that big mess on her arm, but she really can't sing.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Megan is very likely to get a record deal because of her voice .. That being said, she is untrained and she will need some voice lessons to go to the next level. She's not there yet and if she's not the one going home tonight I'll be shocked.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> So, nobody else found the "genius" Adam's performance to be (to borrow a Simonism) "indulgent"?
> I don't see the range that he supposedly posesses, all I see is a stage actor playing a part and screeching the notes he can't sing like the hair-band frontmen from the 80s.


I'm not sure of the actual octave range, but last night he went from pretty low really, really high in the same song. I don't think he was as good last night as he has been in the past. His Ring of Fire (whether you liked it or not) had the most control I think I've ever heard from an Idol contestant. The dude can cover a lot of notes with his voice.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> So, nobody else found the "genius" Adam's performance to be (to borrow a Simonism) "indulgent"?
> I don't see the range that he supposedly posesses, all I see is a stage actor playing a part and screeching the notes he can't sing like the hair-band frontmen from the 80s.


I see the range, and I like (for the most part) his take on the songs he does.

In today's cookie cutter pop culture, he's unique. Something different.

That said, yes, I think to some extent his performances are somewhat 'self indulgent'. He's walking a fine line between unique/interesting and over the top/scary.

With the exception of Ring of Fire, I think he's stayed on the right side of that line. I think he's got to be careful though, because he could easily cross that line and turn off alot of the voting public.


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## waynebtx (Dec 24, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> I'm not sure of the actual octave range, but last night he went from pretty low really, really high in the same song. I don't think he was as good last night as he has been in the past. His Ring of Fire (whether you liked it or not) had the most control I think I've ever heard from an Idol contestant. The dude can cover a lot of notes with his voice.


I liked his Ring of Fire.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

I think Scott saved himself for another week, and it's possible that Anoop and Lil may join Megan to make up the bottom 3 as a result. VFTW will probably continue to stave off elimination for Megan, but in my mind she should go next.

I wasn't surprised that Danny improved over last week. Nor was I surprised that 16 year old Alison couldn't match her performance from last week. Given her lack of experience relative to Danny and Adam, I think uneven performances from her are to be expected.

I didn't think Matt's song choice was as bad as the judges thought, or that Kris was as good as the judges thought. That said, I continue to like them both.

Like his style or not, Adam has talent. I think he was the most entertaining performer of the night.

Just my .02. /steve


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Totally agree with Steve and Sharkie's comments.. I could not help but smile after Adams song and From what I could tell so could Simon. He is the only one so far that I would have to say commands the stage and the most controlled voice of any idol I have seen over such a wide range. 

Kris I really liked.. He voice is really polished and nice to listen too. Both those guys took old songs and really but their marks on it. Personally I would give Kris the nod this week with Adam second and Danny third. 

Be interesting to see where Matt falls. I liked his song and his vocals but the judges did not at all.


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## dmspen (Dec 1, 2006)

Megan will stay. I voted 3 million times for her last night. I have a new computer system that can spoof the telephone lines on idol.

What day is today?


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

dmspen said:


> Megan will stay. I voted 3 million times for her last night. I have a new computer system that can spoof the telephone lines on idol.
> 
> What day is today?


 I'm shocked 

:lol:

That being said .. even if this were possible, it would take a minimum of 1000 phone lines (and associated autodialing equipment) to actually do this.

I know this is a joke


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## Bluto17 (Jan 31, 2007)

BattleScott said:


> So, nobody else found the "genius" Adam's performance to be (to borrow a Simonism) "indulgent"?
> I don't see the range that he supposedly posesses, all I see is a stage actor playing a part and screeching the notes he can't sing like the hair-band frontmen from the 80s.


Indulgent and way over the top. I thought it sucked. Not quite 'Ring of Fire' on the Suck Scale, but up there.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> So, nobody else found the "genius" Adam's performance to be (to borrow a Simonism) "indulgent"?
> I don't see the range that he supposedly posesses, all I see is a stage actor playing a part and screeching the notes he can't sing like the hair-band frontmen from the 80s.


All of his performances are indulgent, IMO, and seem so theatrical. He annoys me as much as Scott "Awww He's Overcome So Much" MacIntyre and Megan "How'd She Make The Finals" Joy.


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

Dial idol bottom three

Anoop 12.523

Allison 10.66  (Judges save used this week?)

Megan:8.937


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

sigma1914 said:


> All of his performances are indulgent, IMO, and seem so theatrical. He annoys me as much as Scott "Awww He's Overcome So Much" MacIntyre and Megan "How'd She Make The Finals" Joy.


The same way Carmen "Goat Girl" Rasmussen made the Finals, Simon's wild card pick.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> I'm not sure of the actual octave range, but last night he went from pretty low really, really high in the same song. I don't think he was as good last night as he has been in the past. His Ring of Fire (whether you liked it or not) had the most control I think I've ever heard from an Idol contestant. The dude can cover a lot of notes with his voice.


He has a good falsetto, but he really never attempts to enter the lower registers. This is why i dispute the usage of the "range" comparisons. If you listen to his "Ring of Fire" and "Play that Funky Music" below, in all the places that are traditionally sung in a lower register, he avoids them by "changing it up". 
Pay close attention at around the 1:08 mark in the "funky" clip where he does attempt to lower his register on the "till you die" lyric. The lower range just isn't there.

Not disputing that he is clearly the best stage performer of the group and, from a Pop Music standpoint probably the most talented, just "keepin' it real dog...".

IMO, Allison is the only one that has the heart and the talent to be a real musical presence post AI.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> Pay close attention at around the 1:08 mark in the "funky" clip where he does attempt to lower his register on the "till you die" lyric. The lower range just isn't there.


Very low .. definitely missing so he's wise to stay away from that area.

Kinda low .. I think that's there.


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

Can someone name just one male contestant that comes close to Adam's "range"?

American Heritage Dictionary offers this for the word "Range": _The gamut of tones that a voice or an instrument is capable of producing._

It doesn't say that "range" must contain certain (low, high or middle) notes.


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## jodyguercio (Aug 16, 2007)

HDG said:


> Can someone name just one male contestant that comes close to Adam's "range"?
> 
> American Heritage Dictionary offers this for the word "Range": _The gamut of tones that a voice or an instrument is capable of producing._
> 
> It doesn't say that "range" must contain certain (low, high or middle) notes.


No it doesn't. But if I remember my music lessons from band (this one time, at band camp....... ), a range of notes would generally be considered from low to high or vice versa. Notes within the same register i.e the high register can have a different key, either flat or sharp.

As far as the guys in this years show, Matt can do very well in the high and middle register.


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

jodyguercio said:


> No it doesn't. But if I remember my music lessons from band (this one time, at band camp....... ), a range of notes would generally be considered from low to high or vice versa. Notes within the same register i.e the high register can have a different key, either flat or sharp.
> 
> As far as the guys in this years show, Matt can do very well in the high and middle register.


Band camp? !rolling

I would argue, Jody, that Adam's "range" exceeds that of any other contestant this season, Matt included. But that's just me arguing... :sure:


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## jodyguercio (Aug 16, 2007)

HDG said:


> Band camp? !rolling
> 
> I would argue, Jody, that Adam's "range" exceeds that of any other contestant this season, Matt included. But that's just me arguing... :sure:


Adam is vocally the best male in the competition no question and one of the top three overall, with Allison and Lil Rounds being the other two. We haven't watched last nights yet as we do a back to back with the performance show and then the results right after.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

jodyguercio said:


> Adam is vocally the best male in the competition no question and one of the top three overall, with Allison and Lil Rounds being the other two. We haven't watched last nights yet as we do a back to back with the performance show and then the results right after.


Lil Shouts, Allison can't enunciate. Adam beats each of these two.

However, Danny's gonna win.


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## jodyguercio (Aug 16, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> Lil Shouts, Allison can't enunciate. Adam beats each of these two.
> 
> However, Danny's gonna win.


I forgot about Danny and I hope he does win but given Adams popularity coupled with the talent he has, he's the winner. I also think he would be the only one the judges would use the save on.

As to Lil and Allison, if they both work with the right voice coaches I think their problems would be over come and everyone would see them both shine.


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

jodyguercio said:


> Adam is vocally the best male in the competition no question and one of the top three overall, with Allison and Lil Rounds being the other two. We haven't watched last nights yet as we do a back to back with the performance show and then the results right after.


Gotta take my leave on Lil ... who can be easilly replaced by Kris. Lil's a bit overrated for me. I've read comparisons to Fantasia and Melinda and I can't believe we're all seeing the same program.


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> However, Danny's gonna win.


I might have thought that way during auditions, but since then Danny's been a disappointment. His delivery has become predictable and boring, IMO.

It remains to be seen who the judges honor with the Save. The list seems to be a moving target.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

HDG said:


> Gotta take my leave on Lil ... who can be easilly replaced by Kris. Lil's a bit overrated for me. I've read comparisons to Fantasia and Melinda and I can't believe we're all seeing the same program.


Normally we're having these types of discussions @ 5 or 6 people left. The fact that we're doing so @ 9 (and even 10, really) indicates that this group as a whole is better than some previous seasons (as a whole).


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> Normally we're having these types of discussions @ 5 or 6 people left. The fact that we're doing so @ 9 (and even 10, really) indicates that *this group as a whole is better than some previous seasons *(as a whole).


+1 No argument there! We started watching AI sometime into Season 2 and can never recall a better, more talented season start than this one.


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## heathramos (Dec 19, 2005)

my top 3: Danny, Kris and Allison (although I really didn't like Allison that much this week)

bottom 3: Scott, Anoop and Megan (although I didn't like Adam either)


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

heathramos said:


> my top 3: Danny, Kris and Allison (although *I really didn't like Allison that much this week*)
> 
> bottom 3: Scott, Anoop and Megan (*although I didn't like Adam either*)


It's all subjective anyway.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

HDG said:


> It's all subjective anyway.


...except for Simon, of course....


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

HDG said:


> Can someone name just one male contestant that comes close to Adam's "range"?
> 
> American Heritage Dictionary offers this for the word "Range": _The gamut of tones that a voice or an instrument is capable of producing._
> 
> It doesn't say that "range" must contain certain (low, high or middle) notes.





jodyguercio said:


> No it doesn't. But if I remember my music lessons from band (this one time, at band camp....... ), a range of notes would generally be considered from low to high or vice versa. Notes within the same register i.e the high register can have a different key, either flat or sharp.
> 
> As far as the guys in this years show, Matt can do very well in the high and middle register.


Yes it does. The key word in that definition is gamut.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Well, Anoops butchery wasn't enough to save Megan. I like her, but will admit she was pretty brutal the past couple of weeks.

I'll add that I like Simon. I respect his opinion more than anyone elses on the show. People say he's rude, but I've never really thought so. Just that he's honest. Tonight, however, I thought he was extremely rude to Megan when he was asked if they might use a save for her. It seemed that he was being rude just because she had remarked earlier that she didn't care what Simon said in his critique of her performance. There's lots of ways to tell someone they're going home. When you've made it into the top 9, you deserve to be dismissed with a bit more class, IMO.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

jodyguercio said:


> I forgot about Danny and I hope he does win but given Adams popularity coupled with the talent he has, he's the winner. I also think he would be the only one the judges would use the save on.
> 
> *As to Lil and Allison, if they both work with the right voice coaches I think their problems would be over come and everyone would see them both shine*.


Without a doubt, you hit the nail on the head here, jody.

There was a reference earlier in the thread to Carmen "goat girl" Rasmussen, who was downright awful during her season, I thought. She's clearly had a pretty good voice coach, coupled with the natural maturing of her voice in the last few years, and the couple of songs of hers that I've heard are actually pretty good.

The same is true of Bucky Covington. I'd have rather heard a cat in heat wailing outside my window than listen to Bucky sing. And yet, here he is a couple years later with a decent career going on in the country music industry.

Allison and Lil have, IMO, loads more natural talent than Carmen or Bucky ever had. Give them a little bit of good, solid coaching, and they'll have respectable careers in the music industry.


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

spartanstew said:


> Well, Anoops butchery wasn't enough to save Megan. I like her, but will admit she was pretty brutal the past couple of weeks.


 Well, people complain that they don't want professional singers on the show. Megan obviously has little or no vocal training. She has a unique style and sound to her voice. Unfortunately that only goes so far when she's pushed into the harsh spotlight under tremendous pressure, competing against seasoned musicians and professionals (like Adam). 


> Tonight, however, I thought he was extremely rude to Megan when he was asked if they might use a save for her. It seemed that he was being rude just because she had remarked earlier that she didn't care what Simon said in his critique of her performance.


 Exactly. He can dish it out but he can't take it. Surprisingly thin skin for how much abuse he dishes out to others.


> There's lots of ways to tell someone they're going home. When you've made it into the top 9, you deserve to be dismissed with a bit more class, IMO.


 Not if they talk back to Simon apparently. "Little" Lil got the same treatment a couple of weeks ago for standing her ground against something he was saying Tonight Simon was not only rude, but cruel. I don't think it's unusual at all from him but mine is a minority opinion on Simon


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

Anoop's imitation of Kris was hilarious! There's this nice, mellow, melodic song, and then... a primal yell at the end. :lol: Kris did well last night though. Probably the best except for Adam. Adam is a pro and delivers every time. 
Danny did well too though I didn't find his performance as fabulous as Paula, for example, did. 

Usually I hate the judges' comments on how a contestant looks, especially from Simon who wears a fricking T-Shirt all the time. But I have to admit that Allison's outfit did distract me from her song. She looked like Pebbles or Bam Bam from the Flintstones.  OTOH, was Ga Ga Girl (or whatever her stage name is/was) any less ridiculous? No. 10X worse. That pink bubble-filled piano and all the rest was like Liberace meets Cyndi Lauper meets MC Hammer. Yuck!


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

I think Adam was clearly the best on a kind of off night for a lot of the contestants. Then Kris not too far behind.

Not sure where Lil's support is coming from anymore? Three or four subpar performances in a row would get most people in the bottom three at least, if not eliminated. I've tried to give her every benefit of the doubt... 

I didn't care for Matt's song but I thought he did a decent job with it if one likes that kind of thing. Nice to see that he wasn't dumped into the bottom 3 again. 

Scott at least did something different with a unique interpretation of the Billy Joel song. I didn't care for his interpretation but he wasn't the worst. 

I wasn't familiar with Allison's song. Thought she did ok, not great compared to what she is capable of doing. 

Anoop needs to avoid Michael Jackson, Usher, Eminem; Basically anything that involves aggressively strutting around the stage. I think the problem is that it looks more karaoke than sounds it. Well, maybe both... 

Megan. I said it once and I'll say it again: Childrens' Music  That, or enter and win America's Next Top Model. Keep on Smiling!


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

HDG said:


> Can someone name just one male contestant that comes close to Adam's "range"?


 If we're talking low to high note range, then yes. Ricky Braddy. Too bad he wasn't colorful enough to move through to the finals.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

spartanstew said:


> Well, Anoops butchery wasn't enough to save Megan. I like her, but will admit she was pretty brutal the past couple of weeks.
> 
> I'll add that I like Simon. I respect his opinion more than anyone elses on the show. People say he's rude, but I've never really thought so. Just that he's honest. Tonight, however, I thought he was extremely rude to Megan when he was asked if they might use a save for her. It seemed that he was being rude just because she had remarked earlier that she didn't care what Simon said in his critique of her performance. There's lots of ways to tell someone they're going home. When you've made it into the top 9, you deserve to be dismissed with a bit more class, IMO.


I think it was a combination of her being rude and also her refusing to follow their advice about song choice. Every week they told her (not just Simon) that she was picking completely wrong songs and she blew them off so I have no problem with the way they booted her.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

> OTOH, was Ga Ga Girl (or whatever her stage name is/was) any less ridiculous?


Whoever that person was appears to me to be trying to become the next Amy Winehouse. Once Amy does herself in Ms. Ga Ga will take her place. The majority of her act is Winehouse light right down to the black dancers.

As for AI, the right person went home, but I don't see how in the world Allison could be in the bottom three..


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Richard King said:


> Whoever that person was appears to me to be trying to become the next Amy Winehouse. Once Amy does herself in Ms. Ga Ga will take her place. The majority of her act is Winehouse light right down to the black dancers.
> 
> As for AI, the right person went home, but I don't see how in the world Allison could be in the bottom three..


Uh, that person was the holder of the #1 song this week, which we heard her perform on stage. I saw her on SYTYCD last year and really didn't care for her, but really thought last night she's a good musician, singer and dancer .. Now as for the outfit .. not so much :lol:


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

peak_reception said:


> I wasn't familiar with Allison's song. Thought she did ok, not great compared to what she is capable of doing.


Sounds like someone needs to hit itunes  .. No Doubt 






Allison's got a ways to go to be as good as Gwen Stefani in my mind.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> Allison's got a ways to go to be as good as Gwen Stefani in my mind.


+1. I liken her to a diamond in the rough. She needs to (a) get help with hair and wardrobe and (b) get some professional elocution coaching. She has a magnificent vocal instrument, IMHO, but needs to work on articulation. And of course, she needs to mature, but nature should take care of that.  /steve


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## jodyguercio (Aug 16, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> Sounds like someone needs to hit itunes  .. No Doubt
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That was her biggest problem this week I think. She was trying to sound too much like Gwen and not herself.



Steve said:


> +1. I liken her to a diamond in the rough. She needs to (a) get help with hair and wardrobe and (b) get some professional elocution coaching. She has a magnificent vocal instrument, IMHO, but needs to work on articulation. And of course, she needs to mature, but nature should take care of that.  /steve


I wonder if the braces on her bottom teeth have anything to do with her articulation?


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

jodyguercio said:


> I wonder if the braces on her bottom teeth have anything to do with her articulation?


Possible, but honestly, I believe this is due to other factors. Her parents (and likely her as well) probably speak a different language at home and Allison just never really learned it properly. Jorge from earlier is another example of someone that had a similar situation. Jorge had a very pronounced accent as well which Allison doesn't have so much. Yet, by the same token, he was able to enunciate all of the words. If she does that this season then she really could jump to the top of the list.

I suspect the simple fact is that she is just too young right now. The voice itself might be great, but there are other things that need improvement.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

Ya. She can do it if she tries. If you listen to the first half of "Papa was a rolling stone", she pronounced the words more clearly than I ever heard any singer who did that song. It was like hearing it for the first time, at least for me. Then in the second half of the song, the pace quickened a little, and she was harder to understand. /steve


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

Steve said:


> Ya. She can do it if she tries. If you listen to the first half of "Papa was a rolling stone", she pronounced the words more clearly than I ever heard any singer who did that song. It was like hearing it for the first time, at least for me. Then in the second half of the song, the pace quickened a little, and she was harder to understand. /steve


Here is the studio version. Allision sings with the original Motown master recording, Temptations and all.

On a side side, I found an earlier performance of Adam's ring of fire arrangement. It was on Tommy Lee's Super Nova show


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

Adam Lambert and the Miracles


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

BattleScott said:


> I think it was a combination of her being rude and also her refusing to follow their advice about song choice. Every week they told her (not just Simon) that she was picking completely wrong songs and she blew them off so I have no problem with the way they booted her.


I agree BattleScott. She got weirded out over the last couple of weeks (Final 10) and from what I could tell she was basically throwing away here chance. I started to wonder if being away from her kid was really effecting her and at the top 10 she decided to not throw it but to make her self less appealing.

She really started to do some wierd stuff in front of the camera. I now she was a little wild but something definitely changed for her two weeks back... Seemed here heart was no longer in it...

As for Simon's comments. Well given her attitude I personally felt it was warrented. Sorry, I felt she was showing the opportunity disrespect and deserved the boot.

I thought she was unique.. But given the talent this season no chance to win...

Hopefully Anoop is next on the list. Going to be a good final 5 or 6.


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## Steve (Aug 22, 2006)

machavez00 said:


> Here is the studio version. Allision sings with the original Motown master recording, Temptations and all.


Enjoyed that. Thx!  /steve


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

machavez00 said:


> Here is the studio version. Allision sings with the original Motown master recording, Temptations and all.


Excellent. Thanks for the link.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

machavez00 said:


> Adam Lambert and the Miracles


That is such an incredible song and has always been up there as one of my favorite Motown hits. Smokey is a tremendous genius of a writer. His handling of lyrics are among the best in the rock era. Who would have thunk of the term "Tracks of my tears"? Very expressive.


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

Ron Barry said:


> I agree BattleScott. She got weirded out over the last couple of weeks (Final 10) and from what I could tell she was basically throwing away here chance. I started to wonder if being away from her kid was really effecting her and at the top 10 she decided to not throw it but to make her self less appealing.
> 
> She really started to do some wierd stuff in front of the camera. I now she was a little wild but something definitely changed for her two weeks back... Seemed here heart was no longer in it...
> 
> ...


Agree with you and BattleScott, to a point. Everything you guys point out about Megan and her attitude/state-of-mind is right on.

I only take exception with your rationale for Simon's crude behavior. For one thing, he's dealing with a contestant who like it or not returned to him in kind. Him!, not the judges.

And for another, he appeared to arbitrarilly decide for the other judges that they would strip her of a last opportunity to get saved in accordance with the new rule ... an opportunity she was summarilly denied, by Simon.

I agree with the outcome, it's just the mechanics of it that I mind. She should have had the same opportunity to sing for her life, just like the previous contestants were afforded. Afterwards, Simon could have gotten his jollies by telling her she would not be saved because of what she said.

If Simon polled the other judges before telling Megan she would not be saved, then shame on all of them for denying her what had been clearly stated was the process.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Good points HDG... From what I saw I do think it was a decision all the judges made and Simon just delivers it as he did in the past show. Personally I don't like the sing for you life thing anyway.. I think it is a joke and just for drama sake. I think the polling Simon prior to the final song was also done for drama sake and given we are talking about it.. Mission accomplished.

Could they have done it nicer.. Most definitely.. But in end it is a show and they do these type of mean spirited things to create drama.. Personally I see what Simon did not different than what Ryan S. does during the who is in the bottom three at times. 

Even if Simon did do it all on his own because he did not like the attitude she presented, which I don't think is the case, I can see why he would. Over the past years the show has tried to keep it somewhat professional and entertaining while at the same time you have certain contestents not respecting it and I think to some extent the producers also have a lot to blame here. Sanjia comes to mind and there are others along the way. 

I could totally see someone getting a bit tired of this type of crap.. Bottom line is like others have said.... She was given advice over and over again in which she obviously did not use and was disrespectful of the advice as I see it. I know two wrongs don't make a write.. But personally I see it has part of the show and take it as that. 

In the end.. I like Megan.. Unique voice and definitely brought something different to the show. I hope she can use this to build on...


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

The following is not an attack on Ron or B.S. or anyone else. I'm just addressing the topic at hand and will probably be done with it after this unless someone else wants to respond which they probably don't. Fine. :soapbox: 


Ron Barry said:


> I agree BattleScott. She got weirded out over the last couple of weeks (Final 10) and from what I could tell she was basically throwing away here chance.


 Hard to understand why some 21 year old girl/single mom from Sandy Utah who probably has never even been out-of-state would get weirded out over the last few weeks! <mild sarc off>

This competition is a cauldron for a lot of these kids and some of them get burned badly by it before they're done and tossed onto a heap of garbage like Megan was last night. In front of tens of millions of people no less which only intensifies the humiliation. Yes they're in the competition by their own choice and all the rest, but the humiliation is just not necessary. Maybe it makes for "good TV" for those who like to see others humiliated [NOT directed at Ron or anyone else here]. Plus the whole "elimination ceremony" is designed to play manipulative mind games with the contestants. Megan wasn't playing along but instead was feigning mock suspense and anxiety over the drawn out melodrama. Hard to blame her for that.



> She really started to do some wierd stuff in front of the camera.


 And Simon doesn't?



> I now she was a little wild but something definitely changed for her two weeks back... Seemed here heart was no longer in it...


 She probably realized like the rest of us that she didn't have a chance in hell of winning and decided to just do what she felt inside (musically) instead of trying to please the judges. I can't blame her for that either.

Then there's the fact that she'd already become the laughingstock of the show, promoted by Vote-For-The-Worst, and having scorn heaped on her by complete strangers who only see her as the contestant who really sucks. Yeah, all that probably had an effect on her.



> As for Simon's comments. Well given her attitude I personally felt it was warrented. Sorry, I felt she was showing the opportunity disrespect and deserved the boot.


 Ok, let's agree that she was being disrespectful. Most reasonable people would agree that Simon was being disrespectful (or worse) too. Which one is the 21 year old from Sandy Utah and which one is the powerful, fully developed 49 year old Mega-Millionaire in complete and total control of his life?? Not a fair fight no matter how you slice it. He could have easily taken any or all of this into account and let her mild rebellion pass into the night. She was gone anyway. But no, he had to humiliate her in front of the whole country in revenge for her saying she didn't care about being criticized by him any more. p.s. of course she cared about the criticisms. They hurt.



> I thought she was unique.. But given the talent this season no chance to win...


 At least we agree about that.


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

Doug Brott said:


> Sounds like someone needs to hit itunes  .. No Doubt


 You're right about that. I am not up-to-date on the latest pop musical scene, for sure.  I'll go have a listen to the link you provided.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I didn't see Simons comments as all that disrespectful.

Everybody in the building, and everybody watching on TV knew that there was no way in heck that they were going to use the save on Megan. We all knew it going into the show. Then, she tells Ryan that she doesn't care what Simon has to say about her performance.

Why pretend that she's actually singing for her life when she clearly ISN'T?

IMO, Megan basically told the judges "I had to stay true to myself, and I don't give a damn what you think".

They basically responded by saying "If you don't care, and you don't want to be here, we'll oblige you by not using the save, and lets not pretend that we _might_"

I loved Megan going into this competition. Her CD was probably going to make it into my CD player. After last night, it probably won't.

And, one response to peak.... She didn't have to be the laughingstock of the show. She became the laughingstock because she chose crappy songs and performed them even crappier - especially this week. She refused to listen to the advice of the judges, because she had to "walk her own plank". She brought it on herself. She wasn't going to win, but, if she had taken the opportunity seriously, she probably could have stuck around another few weeks - staying past Anoop & Scott, and depending on performances, *maybe* Allison (who doesn't seem to have much fan support) or Lil (who has talent to spare but can't seem to pick a song that fits her). Top 5 or 6 is nothing to sneeze at.

Clearly though, at least in my opinion, she lost interest in the process completely, which I think played into her lack of fan support.


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

machavez00 said:


> More great links from machavez
> 
> 
> > On a side side, I found an earlier performance of Adam's ring of fire arrangement. It was on Tommy Lee's Super Nova show
> ...


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

Ron Barry said:


> *Personally I don't like the sing for you life thing anyway*.


I don't either, but I'd like to see it applied evenly.



Ron Barry said:


> *Could they have done it nicer[?]*..


Not interested in nicer ... just fairly will do.



Ron Barry said:


> *Sanjia comes to mind...*


I'd rather he didn't. 



Ron Barry said:


> * I know two wrongs don't make a ​​*.​




If that's as close to an agreement as you want to go, I'll take it.



Ron Barry said:


> *I hope she can use this to build on...*


Or look back at it as the most humiliating embarrassment of her life.​


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

Sharkie_Fan said:


> Maybe I'm in the minority, but I didn't see Simons comments as all that disrespectful.
> 
> Everybody in the building, and everybody watching on TV knew that there was no way in heck that they were going to use the save on Megan. We all knew it going into the show. Then, she tells Ryan that she doesn't care what Simon has to say about her performance.
> 
> ...


No, you're not a minority ... and Simon will be Simon ... and Megan burnt her only bridge.

My point is one of fairness, that's all. The judges have ample time to diss her disrespectful statements without resorting to unfair and dramatic knee-jerk reactions.


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

machavez00 said:


> Adam Lambert and the Miracles


 Man, another great link! What's so impressive about these two takes, side by side, is that Adam listened carefully during his session with Smokey R. and obviously took his description of what was behind the song directly to heart. He then put that pain to music in a beautifully set vocal + guitar and made art from it. I very much liked the studio version too but the Idol arrangement and delivery was truly memorable. That performance, Ring of Fire, and Allison's "Alone" are the three performances this season which have really stayed with me.

That might be a fun thread. What three A.I. performances this season have you found to stand above all others? And what three have you found most awful? Subjectively of course  I could post it but then no one would reply  :lol:


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

HDG said:


> And for another, he appeared to arbitrarilly decide for the other judges that they would strip her of a last opportunity to get saved in accordance with the new rule ... an opportunity she was summarilly denied, by Simon.


 It's his show, he can do what he wants.


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

peak_reception said:


> It's his show, he can do what he wants.


Simon Fuller might disagree.


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

HDG said:


> Simon Fuller might disagree.


 Oops, my bad. Too many Simons :lol: In that case, he should be fired! 

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_22/b3935425.htm


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29961865/


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## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

peak_reception said:


> Oops, my bad. Too many Simons :lol: In that case, he should be fired!
> 
> http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_22/b3935425.htm


I assumed you were speaking symbolically ... in which case you're right. In his mind, he must feel like he owns the show.

If I recall correctly though, it was mentioned during the audition shows that Simon C had been designated head judge with tie-breaking powers. Who knows, maybe that spills over to the main show and includes making arbitrary calls like Megan's?

Thanks for the MSNBC article link. It pretty much describes it.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

On the "fairness" topic":
I'm not certain, but I don't recall an official declaration that each contestant would be given the chance to "sing for their life". As I understand it, the judges simply have the power to not eliminate the contestant receiving the lowest number of votes and bring them back the next week. They can only do this once prior to the final 5. The first girl they asked to sing again because they were trying to make up their minds whether they were going to save her or not and I think that this has led to the false assumption that each contestant will be in this same scenario.

On the "harshness topic":
If I had given someone the biggest opportunity they will likely ever get in life and they decided to throw it away and then tell me they don't particularly care about my opinion on it, my reaction would have been far worse than what Simon delivered. :box:


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

BattleScott said:


> and then tell me they don't particularly care about my opinion on it, my reaction would have been far worse than what Simon delivered. :box:


Many, many contestants over the years when asked what they thought of Simon's criticism the previous week have said basically the same thing (I think he's wrong, I disagree, I don't care, doesn't bother me, etc., etc.).
I don't think Megan did anything numerous others haven't and don't think she did anything wrong by saying it. Seemed to me she was just stating that she wasn't going to let his criticism get to her.

But when he dismissed her, he threw that line back in her face. Something to the effect of "If you don't care, then we don't care about you. We'll not be saving you." IMO, he didn't need to do that. I don't think he had to say anything about how they might consider saving her (if they had no plans to), but to verbally slam her (which is what I think he did) after she just found out she was getting voted off, wasn't necessary.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

spartanstew said:


> Many, many contestants over the years when asked what they thought of Simon's criticism the previous week have said basically the same thing (I think he's wrong, I disagree, I don't care, doesn't bother me, etc., etc.).
> *I don't think Megan did anything numerous others haven't and don't think she did anything wrong by saying it. Seemed to me she was just stating that she wasn't going to let his criticism get to her. *
> 
> But when he dismissed her, he threw that line back in her face. Something to the effect of "If you don't care, then we don't care about you. We'll not be saving you." IMO, he didn't need to do that. I don't think he had to say anything about how they might consider saving her (if they had no plans to), but to verbally slam her (which is what I think he did) after she just found out she was getting voted off, wasn't necessary.


I don't know if it's an accurate thought or not, but.... when I was watching the show last night, I actually felt like she HAD done something that others haven't done.

As you said, every week SOMEBODY disagrees with the judges. Numerous contestants over the years have said "Simon, I disagree with you". In every instance that comes to mind, though, when Ryan questions them further, the response is something along the lines of "I respect the judges opinions, but I felt I had to make this decision". In other words, I understand the judges are doing their job, I'm standing up here doing my "job", and we can agree to disagree on whether I made the right choice with my song/performance this week.

Megan, I thought, basically acted the spoiled brat last night, saying, in essence, "I'm bored with this. I don't care what any of you think, I'm just doing my thing." It went beyond "I disagree with you", to "I flat out don't care anymore". It was like the 'virtual' flip of the bird to the judging panel.

I've only watched the exchange once, last night as it happened. I didn't rewind, and I haven't studied all the previous interactions to see if my initial thoughts are correct.... but that was my initial reaction - that she'd crossed the line from disagreeing with the judges to, in essence, flipping the bird to all the judges.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

machavez00 said:


> Here is the studio version. Allision sings with the original Motown master recording, Temptations and all.
> 
> On a side side, I found an earlier performance of Adam's ring of fire arrangement. It was on Tommy Lee's Super Nova show


THAT's where I remember it from ..


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

At this moment in time, its a clear 2 horse race...

...unless, of course....someone screws up next week.

But for now...it looks like this year's winner will not be a female contestant.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

Sharkie_Fan said:


> I don't know if it's an accurate thought or not, but.... when I was watching the show last night, I actually felt like she HAD done something that others haven't done.
> 
> As you said, every week SOMEBODY disagrees with the judges. Numerous contestants over the years have said "Simon, I disagree with you". In every instance that comes to mind, though, when Ryan questions them further, the response is something along the lines of "I respect the judges opinions, but I felt I had to make this decision". In other words, I understand the judges are doing their job, I'm standing up here doing my "job", and we can agree to disagree on whether I made the right choice with my song/performance this week.
> 
> ...


You very well could be right and I'm probably jumping to conclusions. I watch the elimination show in about 5 minutes usually just fast forwarding through most of it. I caught the part where she said "I don't care", but probably FF'd through the rest of what she said.


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## waynebtx (Dec 24, 2006)

HDG said:


> I assumed you were speaking symbolically ... in which case you're right. In his mind, he must feel like he owns the show.
> 
> If I recall correctly though, it was mentioned during the audition shows that Simon C had been designated head judge with tie-breaking powers. Who knows, maybe that spills over to the main show and includes making arbitrary calls like Megan's?
> 
> Thanks for the MSNBC article link. It pretty much describes it.


Simon created the show.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

spartanstew said:


> You very well could be right and I'm probably jumping to conclusions. I watch the elimination show in about 5 minutes usually just fast forwarding through most of it. I caught the part where she said "I don't care", but probably FF'd through the rest of what she said.


I don't watch it quite so fast - but I do FF through most of the show, but generally, once they've revealed the bottom 3, I'll watch to see who gets the reprieve and then who gets sent home. I usually take 15 minutes or so to see what I need/want to see.

I watched this elimination a little more closely than I normally would because I really liked Megan from her first audition and on through to this point of the show.

When I get a chance, I'll rewatch the elimination and see if it's as bad as I initially thought it was.


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

Not to beat a dead horse :beatdeadhorse: but just to be sure of how I felt it went down at least, I went back to the exchange in question and had a closer look.

The bottom three were singled out and standing there waiting for the axe to fall. Ryan approaches and repeats Simon's critique from the previous night, that he found her performance "...boring, indulgent, and monotonous." Nothing too horrible there except that that's all she's been hearing lately. But then Ryan adds the kicker and asks Megan "How did you *feel* after what Simon said last night?" Remember, as misguided as it may have been, she loved that song and put all she could into it. She had a couple of seconds to reply about how she *felt* and said with a smile, "I love you Simon but I didn't really care." Simon didn't hear the reply so Paula translated for him that she (Megan) said she loved him but that she didn't care. Simon replied "That's not true... that's not true." He was right. He knew she did care and was probably hurt by his words.

Megan was put on the spot about how she felt and had seconds to reply. She blurted out some mild defiance. Simon on the other hand had about 10 minutes to formulate how or if he would respond. A bigger man would've just let it go, understanding how young Megan is and all the pressure and criticism etc. Not Simon. Instead he works up his vengeful scenario that she can sing but in view of her attitude of not caring (even though he knew she did care by his own words) the judges would not even consider "saving" her, saying "they" (read "he") didn't care about her anymore either.

I found it even smaller, more vengeful, and more _unnecessary_ on rewind than i did the first time around.

That being said, it's water under the bridge now and I'm certainly not going to lose any sleep over it. I do look forward to more songs by the remaining finalists next week. This year's group is very talented and a few of them are *outstanding!*


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## peak_reception (Feb 10, 2008)

Bowing out, here's something softer and more beautiful from Idol past:


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Guess we all see it a bit different.. I do remember the line and how it was delivered. Both me and my wife felt the same way. To me it was in the same vane as... I don't mean to be rude.. but you were horriable but it was I love you Simon, but I don't really care. And the care as I saw it was in terms of their advice. 

Like you said peak. Water under the bridge... If I have time I will have to give it a second look if I did not delete it already.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

The elimination is posted on Youtube:






After looking at it again I'm even more in agreement with what Simon said. If you listen to what he says, he is simply stating that her "not caring" is precisely the reason why "they don't care" to save her, meaning that her lack of regard for what they had been trying to get her to do to be successful was the reason they were not interested in having her return. If you look closely at the other judges while he is saying that, it's obviously a unanimous opinion or Paula would have freaked out.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> The elimination is posted on Youtube:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I thought the comment was a bit rude .. but it wasn't wrong. Even Ryan was taken aback by the delivery as much as many of the folks here. Bottom line, Simon will move on, Megan will move on and everyone will be just fine. It's not like Megan was gonna win this thing anyway.

If anything, Simon could have been less rude so as not to anger the public .. but then again, controversy @ AI .. nah, that never happens :lol:


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

It looks like this has all the studio versions.
http://www.youtube.com/user/formerlyrusselites

Take a listen to Allison's tracks. If she can sing like that on the show, she has a real shot at winning.


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## SParker (Apr 27, 2002)

Simon is pretty brutal with his delivery. However Megan annoyed me a lot the other night. My favorite was Alexis Grace but she is gone so I'm just watching now out of boredom. If I had to pick someone now it would be Danny.


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