# Best way to stream in house



## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

I'd like to be able to stream to other devices in home, specifically two surface rt tablets and two windows laptops. What is the best way to do this? Apparently there's no way to use a geniego with with the surfaces, and a sling box will only stream one thing at a time, and it will occupy one of our boxes, which defeats the point, or we'd have to get an extra box to dedicate to the slingbox. Are there other options I'm missing? Again, I just want to stream within the house, I don't need to stream over the net.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

While not all channels are available, using the DIRECTV® website is your only option….


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

I can't watch any of my recordings via the website. I don't watch anything live.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

What DVR have you? 
How many viewers in the house? 
Can you split off an HDMI to feed another device?


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

dbronstein said:


> I can't watch any of my recordings via the website. I don't watch anything live.





dbronstein said:


> I'd like to be able to stream to other devices in home, \


Then you should have clarified&#8230;. :eek2:


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

dbronstein said:


> I can't watch any of my recordings via the website. I don't watch anything live.


The only option to stream without tying up a tuner is the GenieGO, all other options will need to use the receiver as if you were watching TV


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

I have a Genie 44



peds48 said:


> Then you should have clarified&#8230;. :eek2:


I thought it was clear, obviously it wasn't.

I have a Genie 44 with one mini. My goal is to be able to watch on additional devices while both TVs are in use. Directv2pc would cover the laptops if it hadn't stopped working (see my other thread on that issue). And Geniego doesn't work with the surfaces apparently.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

I repeat, The only option to stream without tying up a tuner is the GenieGO, all other options will need to use the receiver as if you were watching TV


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

What are the other options besides a slingbox?


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Can you respond to post 4?


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

dbronstein said:


> What are the other options besides a slingbox?


I use elgato eyetv HD, but I must admit that the Slingbox is more elegant


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

Laxguy said:


> Can you respond to post 4?


I did in post 7. I didn't explicity mention splitting HDMI because I don't see the point in it - it would tie up a receiver and you would be tied to a specific location.


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## zebra (Nov 26, 2014)

I think the issue is even deeper. Although I appreciate the practical kludge discussion about how to use stuff we already paid for by paying more for more boxes and fixes, the overpopulation of variety of boxes and fixes and by passes to accomplish simple watching is troublesome.
The issue is that DirecTV locked down their system in my opinion in an illegal way and everyone accepted it. The devil is in the detail.
The Constitution sets-up the Copyright right law, from that law we have the right to make and use recordings. DirecTV and HDMI and HDCP infringe on those rights via anti-decryption law. In other countries (e.g. Sweden) no court will enforce anti-decryption laws if the encryption code is available to the public. The onus is on the one who wants to rely on the encryption to change it if it got into public domain. The people who rely on encryption are sufficiently lazy and/or are not willing to put money into new encryption (I am talking mostly about DVD producers) - so why the courts should work for them. In the USA the argument has not been impressed on courts yet and they enforce the law even though the horse is out. DirecTV and Dishnetwork did it right by replacing the encryption, but DirecTV is abusing us and the law.
The abuse comes in several flavors: (1) we cannot copy the recording we paid for onto anything else - although the Kludge does exist; (2) if the receiver is turned of for longer than about 2 weeks we cannot watch our recordings; (3) if the receiver fails the recording we paid for are lost; (4) if we discontinue the subsription for new programming we are prevented from watching the programming we already paid for and recorded; (5) with all WiFI/LTE/Internet wonderful technology we cannot watch/stream our recording inside nor outside our homes. Time to change it.
This calls for action, and the easiest first thing to do is to write Library of Congress which has the power to tell DirecTV to change this. The more involved and lengthy way would be to start a class action. So please write to the Library of Congress. Enough is enough.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

You need to start with what is available for your various devices and go from there. The Surfaces are likely going to prove to be the least common denominator.

In general, if you convinced yourself that streaming was an ingenious way around a monthly TV fee, you were wrong. The GenieGo can offer one session and only one GenieGo is allowed per account.

How many streaming sessions do you need to have going at any one time?


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

I'm not looking to get around a monthly fee. We have two TVs and occasionally it would be nice to be able to watch something other than what the kids are watching, or if my son is playing xbox. I might use it once a week if it was available to me.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

zebra said:


> (1) we cannot copy the recording we paid for onto anything else - although the Kludge does exist; (2) if the receiver is turned of for longer than about 2 weeks we cannot watch our recordings; (3) if the receiver fails the recording we paid for are lost; (4) if we discontinue the subsription for new programming we are prevented from watching the programming we already paid for and recorded; (5) with all WiFI/LTE/Internet wonderful technology we cannot watch/stream our recording inside nor outside our homes. Time to change it.
> This calls for action, and the easiest first thing to do is to write Library of Congress which has the power to tell DirecTV to change this. The more involved and lengthy way would be to start a class action. So please write to the Library of Congress. Enough is enough.


To keep it short, the content you "paid for" is not actually yours, the content is actually rented.

About the only thing can make better that you motioned is to "locked" the continent to the account instead of the DVR, so that when a DVR fails, you can actually watch it on the replacement DVR, this is of course only possible if you are using an external drive.


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## dennisj00 (Sep 27, 2007)

dbronstein said:


> I'm not looking to get around a monthly fee. We have two TVs and occasionally it would be nice to be able to watch something other than what the kids are watching, or if my son is playing xbox. I might use it once a week if it was available to me.


Check out GenieGo, you can stream or download one program at a time from either the streaming channels or programs on your DVR.

Up to 5 clients can be authorized for streaming or downloads. PC, MAC, IOS iPhone/ iPad or android.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

peds48 said:


> To keep it short, the content you "paid for" is not actually yours, the content is actually rented.
> 
> About the only thing can make better that you motioned is to "locked" the continent to the account instead of the DVR, so that when a DVR fails, you can actually watch it on the replacement DVR, this is of course only possible if you are using an external drive.


What he said; you have a license to use, and very much under restrictions.

It's long been sought after to effect this second paragraph, but to try to force a provider into anything like that is a non-starter.


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## zebra (Nov 26, 2014)

peds48 said:


> To keep it short, the content you "paid for" is not actually yours, the content is actually rented.
> 
> About the only thing can make better that you motioned is to "locked" the continent to the account instead of the DVR, so that when a DVR fails, you can actually watch it on the replacement DVR, this is of course only possible if you are using an external drive.


If you knew the Copyright law, case law and facts - you would not make such a wrong statement.

Actually you own the copy of the recorded programming and the Copyright and case law applying Copyright law clearly gives you certain rights - such as having the ownership of the copy and watching it when you want as many times as you want and making a back-up copy. It also give you rights to republish fragments for scholar and research purposes. This apples to recordings. There are things you may not be able to do with that copy so your ownership is somewhat limited. Think about the book - you own it, you can do whatever you with it, you can even sell it. About only thing you cannot do is to publish it again.

But if you download a ready made movie like using On Demand service - that is akin to rental and you do not own that copy. But you do own and have rights to the recording you made.


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## stvcmty (Oct 24, 2014)

zebra said:


> If you knew the Copyright law, case law and facts - you would not make such a wrong statement.
> 
> Actually you own the copy of the recorded programming and the Copyright and case law applying Copyright law clearly gives you certain rights - such as having the ownership of the copy and watching it when you want as many times as you want and making a back-up copy. It also give you rights to republish fragments for scholar and research purposes. This apples to recordings. There are things you may not be able to do with that copy so your ownership is somewhat limited. Think about the book - you own it, you can do whatever you with it, you can even sell it. About only thing you cannot do is to publish it again.
> 
> But if you download a ready made movie like using On Demand service - that is akin to rental and you do not own that copy. But you do own and have rights to the recording you made.


A subscriber to any service (or a user of FTA/OTA TV) is free to make any recordings they want for time shifting, but as far as I know, not law says it has to be easy.

DirecTV owns the DVR's which it then leases to end users (with the limited exception of some end user owned equipment). Since they own it, they can impose whatever constraints they want. Anything stored on a DirecTV DVR should be viewed as part of the leased equipment since DirecTV owns the hard drive.

DirecTV does not keep an end user from creating encryption free time shifting recordings, even the newest receiver the H25 supports scheduled viewings where the receiver will tune to a specific channel at a specific time. Then a digital recorder, DVD-recorder or a VCR could record the content if the recorder was scheduled to record when the receiver came on. That is cumbersome but it is a good example of how you can make recordings on media you own.

HDMI is locked down with HDCP, deal with it. Component is HD, and most HD recorders offer component in because HDMI is locked down. To my knowledge HDCP is not going anywhere; if it were illegal and violating the constitution l I would think the Supreme Court would have said so some time in the last 14 years.

So back to the OP's question:
If a DirecTV box is on a TV tied up by kids video game systems and you want to avoid paying for yet another box every month, you need to make it so the DirecTV box on the video game TV can be accessed either on another TV (HDMI splitter and long cables or a streaming device for example). DirecTV wants you to pay for as many boxes a month as they can get you to, so they are not going to make it easy to use one box for multiple devices.

In general, if there are two people in a house and 4 TV's, reasonably there should only need to be two boxes for both people to watch what they want when they want, but some way is needed to get signals from those boxes to whatever TV each person is using. A HDMI matrix could allow the boxes to be shared between all TV's, but when the cost of HDMI matrixing with long cables is looked at, it starts to look appealing to just rent 4 boxes a month. Same with a whole house QAM modulator setup.


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## zebra (Nov 26, 2014)

stvcmty said:


> A subscriber to any service (or a user of FTA/OTA TV) is free to make any recordings they want for time shifting, but as far as I know, not law says it has to be easy. RIGHT on this includes DirecTV.
> 
> DirecTV owns the DVR's which it then leases to end users (with the limited exception of some end user owned equipment). Since they own it, they can impose whatever constraints they want. Anything stored on a DirecTV DVR should be viewed as part of the leased equipment since DirecTV owns the hard drive. WRONG and WRONG. A lease has certain characteristics which these pseudo-leases based on DTV say-so do not have. Besides even if it was a real lease your assertion about who owns the recordings is WRONG. Here is why: I own a leased car - does my ass and the luggage in the trunk belong to its lessor? What complicates issues even more DirecTV does not have neither direct nor derivative copyrights to some of the content that can be and is recorded on the receiver. My receivers record OTA and my own production to which I have Copyrights -- and with your sweeping statement all this belongs to DTV? Really you think so?
> 
> ...


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

zebra said:


> > I *own* a leased car - does my ass and the luggage in the trunk belong to its lessor?
> >
> > You DO NOT own a leased car, any modifications you make to the car will belong to the lessor unless you modify back.  Your analogy is flawed.
> >
> > ...


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

dbronstein said:


> I'm not looking to get around a monthly fee. We have two TVs and occasionally it would be nice to be able to watch something other than what the kids are watching, or if my son is playing xbox. I might use it once a week if it was available to me.


If you don't go over the GenieGo limit of one session, it is an option. It has some odd limitations that you need to be aware of. The Slingbox will help on the Xbox TV (as long as it isn't an Xbox One) as you can still use the receiver even if the TV is tied up.


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## zebra (Nov 26, 2014)

peds48 said:


> > I *own* a leased car - does my ass and the luggage in the trunk belong to its lessor?
> >
> > You DO NOT own a leased car, any modifications you make to the car will belong to the lessor unless you modify back.  Your analogy is flawed.
> > Wrong again - recording is not a modification, recording is the luggage in the trunk.
> > ...


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

zebra said:


> > I *own* a leased car - does my ass and the luggage in the trunk belong to its lessor?
> >
> > You DO NOT own a leased car, any modifications you make to the car will belong to the lessor unless you modify back.  Your analogy is flawed.
> > Wrong again - recording is not a modification, recording is the luggage in the trunk.
> > ...


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## zebra (Nov 26, 2014)

peds48 said:


> > I *own* a leased car - does my ass and the luggage in the trunk belong to its lessor?
> >
> > You DO NOT own a leased car, any modifications you make to the car will belong to the lessor unless you modify back.  Your analogy is flawed.
> > Wrong again - recording is not a modification, recording is the luggage in the trunk.
> > ...


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

zebra said:


> > I *own* a leased car - does my ass and the luggage in the trunk belong to its lessor?
> >
> > You DO NOT own a leased car, any modifications you make to the car will belong to the lessor unless you modify back.  Your analogy is flawed.
> > Wrong again - recording is not a modification, recording is the luggage in the trunk.
> > ...


Very funny stuff... !rolling !rolling !rolling

I am done here&#8230;.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

peds48 said:


> Very funny stuff... !rolling !rolling !rolling
> 
> I am done here&#8230;.


So are we!

:rolling:


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## prushing (Feb 14, 2007)

There are plenty of ways to record from the DVR to a video. I used to do it all the time for offline viewing before the GG2. I even have it setup where I can download remotely. Just schedule a recording on the device and then hit play on the recorded show.


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## jzoomer (Sep 22, 2006)

Besides working on a constitutional amendment or litigating this, what is the best way to stream to a PC in the house? I would love to have a small window on one of my screens to watch things as I work.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

The Colossus for PC, or ElGato EyeTv for Mac seems to be great options


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## jzoomer (Sep 22, 2006)

I picked up a geniego2 off ebay and it does what I want. Not too bad.


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

prushing said:


> There are plenty of ways to record from the DVR to a video. I used to do it all the time for offline viewing before the GG2. I even have it setup where I can download remotely. Just schedule a recording on the device and then hit play on the recorded show.


What are some of these ways?


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

dbronstein said:


> What are some of these ways?


To VCR, DVD, PC or Mac video capture card.


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## prushing (Feb 14, 2007)

dbronstein said:


> What are some of these ways?


I have a Vulkano, but they are now no longer sold in the US because SlingBox sued them and won. Unless you can get your hands on one, you will have to use a capture card like peds mentioned. You can then setup remote options and transfer the files, but it takes a lot more setup and hardware than the Vulkano does.


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## dbronstein (Oct 21, 2002)

So nothing that's user-friendly.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

the GG is pretty much user frinedly


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## Sgtsbabygirl1 (Dec 15, 2014)

zebra said:


> I think the issue is even deeper. Although I appreciate the practical kludge discussion about how to use stuff we already paid for by paying more for more boxes and fixes, the overpopulation of variety of boxes and fixes and by passes to accomplish simple watching is troublesome.
> The issue is that DirecTV locked down their system in my opinion in an illegal way and everyone accepted it. The devil is in the detail.
> The Constitution sets-up the Copyright right law, from that law we have the right to make and use recordings. DirecTV and HDMI and HDCP infringe on those rights via anti-decryption law. In other countries (e.g. Sweden) no court will enforce anti-decryption laws if the encryption code is available to the public. The onus is on the one who wants to rely on the encryption to change it if it got into public domain. The people who rely on encryption are sufficiently lazy and/or are not willing to put money into new encryption (I am talking mostly about DVD producers) - so why the courts should work for them. In the USA the argument has not been impressed on courts yet and they enforce the law even though the horse is out. DirecTV and Dishnetwork did it right by replacing the encryption, but DirecTV is abusing us and the law.
> The abuse comes in several flavors: (1) we cannot copy the recording we paid for onto anything else - although the Kludge does exist; (2) *if the receiver is turned of for longer than about 2 weeks we cannot watch our recordings*; (3) if the receiver fails the recording we paid for are lost; (4) if we discontinue the subsription for new programming we are prevented from watching the programming we already paid for and recorded; (5) with all WiFI/LTE/Internet wonderful technology we cannot watch/stream our recording inside nor outside our homes. Time to change it.
> This calls for action, and the easiest first thing to do is to write Library of Congress which has the power to tell DirecTV to change this. The more involved and lengthy way would be to start a class action. So please write to the Library of Congress. Enough is enough.


Do you mean turned off , just the power? Or deactivated/not connected to the dish? This may have been an anomoly, but we were at my MILs house for about 6 months while building a house. My kids watched recordings on my HR24-500 for the full 6 months, and we never connected it with a dish until after we fully moved.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

It used to be about a day before it wouldn't work anymore. Now it seems random and longer as have found out...


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

I had missed some of the longer posts in this discussion but after breezing over a few of them I find some of it funny for two reasons. First DVRs aren't really recorders in the sense that dvd recorders and even vcrs ever where.. They are meant for time shifting. Very different things. Goes with the fact that other than DVDs I have never seen a device meant for long term storage without failure (100 years is long term to me). tapes didn't even last very long.

And locking down. Anyone who thinks that's coming from anyone other than Hollywood doesn't pay enough attention to what Hollywood wants and does to make money. You can make copies, but at a lower resolution than what is broadcast most of the time. What other devices haven't done the exact same thing? tapes where lower res... Heck beta for all intents and purposes wasn't as good as original broadcast either. Not after a couple viewings for sure. The only dvd recorders that ever where where the ones with built in tv tuners and that was only sd. Really the only device that ever really came close was the digital hd VCR from JVC that last about ten minutes and only worked with certain tv's and never for any cable sources....

So really sitting there and saying dtv is doing something against the law or even different than anything that's ever already been done in the past seems a bit over the top. Add in that there is no other provider I have ever heard about that. Is doing anything different...

And same goes for charging per box. Show me a cable company that doesn't charge you something for every box in your home. I have yet to actually see one... That's just how they do business and to compare this business to any other, even leasing cars, there has to be an understanding that some of the business decisions of the mvp providers will be fundamentally different form any other model from a different business because they are , well, in fact different kinds of business.


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## aces99 (Feb 15, 2011)

I don't know know if the Copyright law applies equally to a DVD recording and a cable or satellite provider recording. With a DVD recording you own a hard copy of the DVD and own the content of it which you can watching on any TV you want. But with a satellite or cable provider recording DirecTV or whoever it is owns the equipment and leases or rents it to you, you don't own the content like a DVD. But I agree you should be able to watch the recording on any receiver or the account not just the receiver it was recorded on. The problem is getting DirecTV or whoever to agree to it.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Can you be specific as to what you're trying to do? 

And I bet you dollars to donuts you —or anyone— do not own the content on your purchased DVDs, BRDs and so forth. Yeah, you own the plastic, but the bits and bytes can be used only in limited ways. If the RIAA had its way, the discs would disintegrate after one playing....
It's not DIRECTV's content, either...they don't set the rules, but have to abide by what the content providers say, subject to a small amount of negotiating.


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## WestDC (Feb 9, 2008)

That's a FACT JACK :rotfl:


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

aces99 said:


> With a DVD recording you own a hard copy of the DVD and own the content of it which you can watching on any TV you want.


Your license in both cases (DVD and DIRECTV subscription content) is very specifically limited. In both cases, you cannot "perform" the program publicly or for a paying audience.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

harsh said:


> Your license in both cases (DVD and DIRECTV subscription content) is very specifically limited. In both cases, you cannot "perform" the program publicly or for a paying audience.


This seems to provide less information than stated above. There are many things you cannot do with a recording legally.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

aces99 said:


> But I agree you should be able to watch the recording on any receiver or the account not just the receiver it was recorded on.


That how it works currently. You can record on your Genie and watch on any HD or HDDVR that i son the same network


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Laxguy said:


> This seems to provide less information than stated above. There are many things you cannot do with a recording legally.


I was addressing a single claim (being able to watch the content on any chosen TV); not the scope of the limitations.


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