# View A Different Channel While Recording



## edw (Mar 8, 2007)

This may be a very basic question but...I'm not able to view any other DISH channels while I'm recording. I keep getting a message re: cancelling the recording that is presently in process if I want to change the channel.

I am able to change the channel to one on OTA. But, when I try to go back to a DISH channel, other than the one I'm recording, I get that message.

What am I doing wrong?

Thanks, in advance.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Hit the pip button on the remote.. if it does not come up then you are in dual mode and you need to be in single mode, unless you have a dual mode configuration.


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## edw (Mar 8, 2007)

Ron Barry said:


> Hit the pip button on the remote.. if it does not come up then you are in dual mode and you need to be in single mode, unless you have a dual mode configuration.


Ron,

Thanks. I'll try it.


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## TNGTony (Mar 23, 2002)

Just an FYI for those that may not know:

A 622 can run in a single mode where it is a dual tuner receiver for one TV (or many TVs all showing the same channel output/s) 
You can do any of the following:
Watch one satellite channel and record a second satellite channel or over the air HD channel at the same time
Watch an over the air HD channel and record one or two statellite channels at the same time
Watch a DVR recording while recording 1 or two satellite channels AND over the Air HD channel. (watch 1 while recording 3)

Or the 622 can be in dual mode. In this mode the unit acts like two separate receivers with independent controls. One user does not control both tuners. It is like having two separate boxes.

In the dual mode TV1 which uses a UHF remote can:
Watch an Over the Air HD channel while recording a satellite channel or vice-versa
Watch a DVR recording while recording a satellite channel AND over the air HD channel
In the dual mode TV2 which uses an RF remote can:
Watch a satellite channel *OR* record a satellite channel
Watch a DVR recording while recording a satellite channel.

There is also a "share" mode which can get a little confusing if you have two separate users that allows one to select which tuner records what show when. This mode is the one most responsible for people posting complaints that times pop up unexpetedly interrupting their viewing. When used properly this mode it great, but it requires planning!

See ya
Tony


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

TNGTony said:


> >...
> In the dual mode TV1 which uses a UHF remote can: > ...


That would be IR Remote out of the box.

Thjere are only *two* 622 Modes - *Single* and *Dual.* Both of these Modes are described in the manual.


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## edw (Mar 8, 2007)

Well, I'm having no luck in trying to record.

I have the dual mode 622 set-up. When I try to record on TV1, I cannot change the channel without the message requesting me to cancel/not cancel the recording. When I instruct TV1 to record on TV2, I can change the channel on TV1 but not on TV2 without getting that message on TV2.

I am simply trying to record a program on TV1 while watching another program on TV1 (in dual mode setup). Is this possible!?

Thanks, again, in advance.


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

Do you have an OTA antenna connected? The 622 has three tuners. In Dual mode you have access to one sat tuner and one OTA tuner, if you have OTA. If you have a program recording on the TV2 tuner, you can watch a sat channel or an OTA channel on TV1. You can not watch another channel on TV2 because its tuner is busy with the recording and it can not use the OTA tuner.

If you have a recording going on the TV1 sat tuner you can watch a channel on the OTA tuner, if you have it. Without OTA you can not watch another channel on TV1 if the tuner is recording.

At any time from either TV output you can watch a pre-recorded program because that does not require a tuner.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

apparently, what you are trying to do is not possible.

I do think it's kind of a silly limitation but that's the scoop. If you're recording channel A on TV1, you can only watch channel A on TV1. If you record channel B on TV2, you can only watch channel B on TV2. The only exception is OTA channels on TV1, which adds a second tuner (so you can record SAT on TV1 and watch OTA or vice versa).

For what you want to do, you need to switch to single mode.


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## edw (Mar 8, 2007)

For all the years that VHS/Beta machine have been in existance, I believe, you could record one program while watching another.

This is just rediculous...all these tuners in the 622...but, something basic as recording one show while watching another (in dual mode and on TV1 while someone else is watching TV2...for example) is not possible.

O.K....well, thank you all for your input...(I think I'll lie down now)...


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

I never had a tape machine that did anything but record one channel. Sure you could record one channel on the tape machine and use a different antenna connection to your TV to watch another channel, but both devices had only a single tuner.

With the 622 you can record using the TV2 tuner and still have two tuners to watch (with OTA). I take it you do not have OTA. That would give you what you wanted to do. Watch something on TV2, record something on TV1 tuner while watching an OTA channel. You can actually get five streams going at once with the 622. Record on three tuners while watching two recorded programs. And, you want more?


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

The only way you could record a channel and watch another with a VHS recorder was the VCR had its own tuner and your TV had another. That's 2 tuners.

The ViP622 has 3 tuners. 2 satellite and 1 OTA tuner.

As described in the manual and above in this thread... there are two modes, single and dual.

Dual mode drives 2 TVs in different locations to allow independent viewing. Single mode is for 1 TV to share all the tuners.

You have to choose one mode or the other, you can't have both.

Single mode you can view any of the 3 tuners (or use PIP and see 2 of them at a time). Dual mode you only have the 2nd tuner on TV2, while TV1 can see either tuner 1 or the OTA tuner.

If you want to record one live satellite channel and watch a different one at the same time on the same TV... then you should be using single mode instead of dual mode. These mode operations are mutually exclusive.


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## edw (Mar 8, 2007)

O.K., folks...it's finally sinking in (yes, I do have (OTA connected).

Thanks.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Do you have a 2nd TV requirement? Is a second TV hooked up to your 622 that is used all the time. If you use one or the other, then I suggest putting it into Single mode. The 2nd remote still will work and it will work just like you expect it to. 

There is some good content above explaining Dual mode and what it means... Sorry if does not meet your expectations, but it all comes down to your particular use case and some technical trade offs. 

There was a post a while back along the same lines and turns out that it was the case of using one or the other TV. If this is the case, Single mode is what you should use and just access the TV1 channel on your home distribution connection.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

a slick(er) way to implement this would be for the thing to ask you if you would like to switch to single mode when you try and change the channel while recording in dual mode.

A notch or two down on the slick scale, but still usable would be to enable you to change from single to dual mode with the [either of] the remote.

unfortunately, as it is, you have to access the front panel of the unit to change it, which is kludge at least.


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## jacobm69 (Mar 21, 2007)

why not just set it up to record to TV 2 that way you can watch what you want on TV 1. Of course, whoever is watching TV 2 at the time of the recording will be forced to watch the show being recorded.


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

I believe most people decide when the receiver is first installed if they want to use single or dual mode. They set the mode to their needs and never change it. I don't think many people switch the modes on a whim as you suggest would be the slick way to do it.

You just need to understand how the receiver works and then you know what you can do and what you can't without shooting yourself in the foot. Mine stays in Dual mode 100% of the time. Performing on the fly mode changes would confuse more people than are confused now.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Mr.72 said:


> a slick(er) way to implement this would be for the thing to ask you if you would like to switch to single mode when you try and change the channel while recording in dual mode.
> 
> A notch or two down on the slick scale, but still usable would be to enable you to change from single to dual mode with the [either of] the remote.
> 
> unfortunately, as it is, you have to access the front panel of the unit to change it, which is kludge at least.




I disagree... This has been discussed a number of times. In my opinion, the addition of the mode button was not a kludge but an obvious design decision given its purpose. In my opinion and I think it is backed up when you read the Record Plus sheet on the sticky in this forum, the purpose is not to toggle between single and dual mode on a whim. It intention was something more delibert and something whose intention was to minimize toggling. Placing it on the remote or as a option on a dialog goes against the intention of the mode button.

Yes it would be more convinent, however, i think it was intentionally made inconvient to avoid this type of behavior so the average person would not toggle back and forth accidently.


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## TulsaOK (Feb 24, 2004)

edw said:


> O.K., folks...it's finally sinking in (yes, I do have (OTA connected).
> 
> Thanks.


It takes a while to get used to the 622. It's a powerful unit and it has many features that require a little experience to become proficient. Once things start falling in place, I think you'll be very happy with the unit. Hang out here and you'll get plenty of help just by reading some of the posts.
Good luck.


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## edw (Mar 8, 2007)

TulsaOK,

Thanks to you and the others offering advice.


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## koralis (Aug 10, 2005)

> A 622 can run in a single mode where it is a dual tuner receiver for one TV (or many TVs all showing the same channel output/s)


What would be nice is a Boss mode, where TV1 can do whatever it wants and TV2 shows/controls the tuner that TV1/DVR isn't using (If TV1 has all of the tuners tied up, then TV2 can simply switch between tuners that are tuned, but not control.)

I'm in the scenario where MOST of the time I'll be just viewing TV1, so having more tuners available will be less annoying. Occasionally though I'll head to the basement and want a TV on if a tuner doesn't happen to be busy.

Yeah yeah, I can switch modes every timeI want to go to the basement.... seems annoying. I don't even have a 622 yet (being installed today) but I can already tell that I'm going to be pissed off at the deliberate inflexibility.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

koralis that's what I think as well.

90% of the time we just use one TV at a time. During the day the kids watch TV2 downstairs. In the evenings we watch TV1 upstairs as a family. Rarely we will watch both with different channels. So we need only single mode like 90% of the time but when we need dual mode, we usually are downstairs, away from the 622 and it's a pain to have to go change it so we just leave it in dual mode and put up with the restriction on changing channels.

What's dumb is to have three tuners in the thing but be unable to change the channel while it's recording, even though there's two totally unused tuners.


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

koralis said:


> ... I don't even have a 622 yet (being installed today) but I can already tell that I'm going to be pissed off at the deliberate inflexibility.


I love self fulfilling prophecies, don't you?


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

Mr.72 said:


> ...
> 
> What's dumb is to have three tuners in the thing but be unable to change the channel while it's recording, even though there's two totally unused tuners.


What's also dumb is expect the 622 to "know" if the other tuner that is providing a signal to TV-2 is being viewed.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

koralis said:


> What would be nice is a Boss mode, where TV1 can do whatever it wants and TV2 shows/controls the tuner that TV1/DVR isn't using (If TV1 has all of the tuners tied up, then TV2 can simply switch between tuners that are tuned, but not control.)
> 
> I'm in the scenario where MOST of the time I'll be just viewing TV1, so having more tuners available will be less annoying. Occasionally though I'll head to the basement and want a TV on if a tuner doesn't happen to be busy.
> 
> Yeah yeah, I can switch modes every timeI want to go to the basement.... seems annoying. I don't even have a 622 yet (being installed today) but I can already tell that I'm going to be pissed off at the deliberate inflexibility.


Or if you are using one or the other. Just keep it in single mode. TV2 tuner will work with TV1. You also can distribute TV1s channel so it basically allows you to access TV1 from another TV. This is exactly the configuration I use. If you then have the scenario where you want to view two programs independently then switch to dual. I also do that. I don't see this as inconvenient and personally I consider flexiable enough for my needs.


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## dclaryjr (Mar 11, 2007)

I'm a little confused because I watch one satellite channel while another watching another satellite channel every day--and I'm in dual mode. I don't remember selecting anything to it but the TV that is restricted while I'm recording is the second TV (SD) in my office. On the big screen in the living room, my wife is watching whatever she wants while PTI and SportsCenter are being recorded. Isn't that what the other poster is asking to do??


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

No. The original poster wanted to record something off a Dish channel while watching a sat channel on TV2 and watching a different sat channel on TV1.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

SaltiDawg said:


> What's also dumb is expect the 622 to "know" if the other tuner that is providing a signal to TV-2 is being viewed.


wow. maybe I could suggest putting _a button on the remote!!!_

or did I already suggest that? I could have sworn I did.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

Ron Barry said:


> Or if you are using one or the other. Just keep it in single mode. TV2 tuner will work with TV1. You also can distribute TV1s channel so it basically allows you to access TV1 from another TV. This is exactly the configuration I use. If you then have the scenario where you want to view two programs independently then switch to dual. I also do that. I don't see this as inconvenient and personally I consider flexiable enough for my needs.


yes Ron, that is exactly what would work, if there were a convenient way to switch it from the remote TV (TV2). But that requires a trip up stairs to switch it, and that's enough inconvenience to make it a moot point. We leave it in dual mode.

I still think there's a way to do it with clever allocation of prompts when you try and change the channel under certain circumstances so the thing will switch between single and dual mode based on use and interactive user choice. Maybe it's a third mode. Either single mode ONLY, dual mode ONLY, or switch-on-the-fly mode.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Mr.72 said:


> yes Ron, that is exactly what would work, if there were a convenient way to switch it from the remote TV (TV2). But that requires a trip up stairs to switch it, and that's enough inconvenience to make it a moot point. We leave it in dual mode.
> 
> I still think there's a way to do it with clever allocation of prompts when you try and change the channel under certain circumstances so the thing will switch between single and dual mode based on use and interactive user choice. Maybe it's a third mode. Either single mode ONLY, dual mode ONLY, or switch-on-the-fly mode.


Works for me... and I don't have the button on TV2.. 

Here is a use case why I feel having a button on TV2 is a bad idea.

1) User presses dual mode toggle on TV2. 
2) TV1 is currently using Tuner 1 (Viewing it) and has Tuner 2 paused (Sticky pause) on another program they are toggling between.

Under this use case... What is the correct behavior.. Tell the #2 user he is out of luck? Ask him if he wants to overide TV1 and allow him? Should he be able to do this? Tell user #2 to negotiate with user #1. Having the functionality to toggle this mode aware from the actually receiver is a bad idea in my opinion.

Like I said in a previous post.... The feature is not something intended to be toggled on the fly from a remote .. In my opinion, If this feature does not meet your needs and you feel you really need to be able to toggle on the fly, then there is a strong indication that there is a need for a second DVR for the other TV. That is my opinion.

Providing toggling on the remote opens up a lot of use cases that i see as being ugly any way you slice it.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

This whole button-on-the-remote thing reminds me of other things you can't just configure on a whim.

You can't, for instance, change the RF output of a VCR from the remote. There is a toggle on the back for channels 3 or 4 usually, so if you wanted to change that you have to get up and go change it. The design is that you shouldn't need to change configurations often (or ever beyond initial config).

There are all kinds, and probably better, of examples of things that you have to go up to a receiver to do. These things are usually limited on purpose. It would probably be easy to allow all functions accessible from the remote... but some features are deemed so rarely used OR so important not to be accidentally pressed, that they intentionally keep them off the remote.

As noted in another post above mine... how should the receiver handle mode selection conflicts from the remote? Should only remote 1 be able to force changes? Or should both remotes be able to effect a mode change? How do you handle those conflicts when people are at both TVs with cross-purposes? Does remote 1 override and lockout remote 2 on a simultaneous request?

There's a lot more reasons why NOT to have the mode button on remote than there is to have it there.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

Dish wouldn't set me up with 2 DVRs in this location. I tried, believe me. Sharing content is a kicker. It's not like I have TV2 located ten miles away and being viewed by some strangers. I can't really see any reason why not even having the OPTION of toggling this from the remote makes any sense.

FWIW the VCR channel 3/4 modulator thing required (for cost sake) a mechanical switch, not some electronic switch. That's hard to do by remote. There was no reasonable point in putting it on as a remote control function but despite the apparent attitude that all of you think I am totally nuts for thinking I should be able to switch this mode on the fly, it is not unreasonable to want to switch from single mode to dual mode on the fly.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Mr.72 said:


> Dish wouldn't set me up with 2 DVRs in this location. I tried, believe me. Sharing content is a kicker. It's not like I have TV2 located ten miles away and being viewed by some strangers. I can't really see any reason why not even having the OPTION of toggling this from the remote makes any sense.


Well I think you would change your tune if you had this option and the person on TV2 hanked the tuner out from under you while you were watching the season finally of your favorite show. 

Don't get me wrong. there is ways to accomplish what you are wanting. Example would be perhaps prompting the TV1 before taking away the resource, but that still does not have its usability issues.

As for the 2nd DVR, not sure about your situation but there are people here with more than one 622. It can be done in most cases from my understanding.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

in my case, it could not be done without a much higher cost. the additional cost did not justify it, especially considering you cannot share content between the two locations.


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

My suggestion is simple. There's already a mode button on the box to switch between two modes. I suggest adding a third mode. Single, Dual, and Both.

Single and Dual operate just as before.

"Both" utilizes one of the buttons on the remote to toggle, such as the "Swap" button or some other button whose function would just be remapped when in "Both" mode.


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## koralis (Aug 10, 2005)

SaltiDawg said:


> What's also dumb is expect the 622 to "know" if the other tuner that is providing a signal to TV-2 is being viewed.


Uh, doesn't TV2 have a Standby/Off? If not in standby, assume someone is watching. If TV2 is in standby, then no one is watching. If TV1 is in standby then no one is watching TV1, etc.

Seems pretty simple to me.


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## koralis (Aug 10, 2005)

Ron Barry said:


> Having the functionality to toggle this mode aware from the actually receiver is a bad idea in my opinion.
> 
> Like I said in a previous post.... The feature is not something intended to be toggled on the fly from a remote .. In my opinion, If this feature does not meet your needs and you feel you really need to be able to toggle on the fly, then there is a strong indication that there is a need for a second DVR for the other TV.


Or a third mode that operates differently from the other two that you don't ever need to change. That was my suggestion. If you don't like that mode, you just don't use it. It would be handy for many though.


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

Mr.72 said:


> wow. maybe I could suggest putting _a button on the remote!!!_
> 
> or did I already suggest that? I could have sworn I did.


Doh. Misplaced sarcasm based on lack of knowledge. The point is that the 622 has no way of knowing if a Tuner that is "awake" and available at an output is in fact being viewed. You have a nice day, ya hear?


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

you know the user of the 622 _might_ be able to figure out whether the other tuner is in use. just maybe. I know it's a stretch, but have some faith in humanity.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

koralis said:


> Or a third mode that operates differently from the other two that you don't ever need to change. That was my suggestion. If you don't like that mode, you just don't use it. It would be handy for many though.


Just because a feature is handy does not mean the feature should be implemented.  One must also consider the ramifications of adding such a feature and weigh it against the beneifit. I am sure if there was such a fetcher it would be liked by the requester until the time where the feature resulted in an unexpected result because it does not have enough information to properly manage the feature. I think this is the case with the feature we are discussing. Just put a toggle does not take this fact away.

One example comes to mind. ActiveX. Nice feature to add to the browser. Useful in providing an enhanced browser experience. Problem is that it also can be used for evil. No amount of warning dialogs take away from the fact that in the wrong hands or miss-understood can result in bad things happening. I am sure a lot of people also were asking for such a feature because it was cool and allowed them to do what they wanted but the ramifications were not taken into account (Especially when this functionality was initially released).

There are numerous other examples, but I think this one drives my position the best. I know we are not talking about security issues here, but it still illustrates my point. Handiness of a feature is one thing to consider, but one must also consider the ramifications of the feature and in this case I think the ramifications trump the handiness.

My guess is that either side is not going to convince the other... I have stated my side read the other side position and I am sticking to my opinion why I would like not seeing this feature added. I am sure I have not convinced others, but that is what is great about opinions...


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## liferules (Aug 14, 2005)

I personally rarely if ever have problems in dual mode, mainly because I always time-shift my viewing... these problems only occur when trying to watch live TV while recording another. IMO, I would rather wait for a show or sport game to finish, or at least get half-way recorded, so I can skip through the commercials...


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## koralis (Aug 10, 2005)

Ron Barry said:


> Handiness of a feature is one thing to consider, but one must also consider the ramifications of the feature and in this case I think the ramifications trump the handyness.


The only ramification is that perhaps someone downstairs that wants to watch TV2 can't because of TV1. But that would be the case in Single Mode or Dual Mode w/ Remote Plus (when recording to TV2) anyway. The fact that TV2 might not have access to the tuner didn't stop them from adding the other modes.

The mode I proposed is EXACTLY like Single Mode, except that TV2 can use any tuner that TV1 hasn't dedicated to a task. Determining whether TV1 is using a tuner is pretty simple. 1) Is TV1 "on"? Then the tuner assigned to TV1 is busy. 2) Is a recording happening on any tuner? Then that tuner is busy. if all Tuners are busy, only Swap and DVR-play functions are available to TV2. If a Tuner is available, then TV2 can swap to that tuner and use it until such time as TV1 wants it back. (This is a problem? The TV1 user could do it in Dual-mode by hitting the button. If you want to be nice, you could ask whether they really want that tuner since TV2 is using it, but I wouldn't personally.)

I think you're putting far too much faith in the "if Dish didn't add it, it must be for a good reason" addage. Perhaps the good reason is that they didn't consider it, or didn't feel like spending the time because no one would use it. I'm hereby suggesting it, so if it was merely not having the idea, or not fleshed out enough to differentiate it and define it, that's now gone. If they don't feel like spending the time on it, then the more users that say it'd be useful, the more likely they'll feel that it's a feature worth adding. If it's a feature that they think Joe Sixpack won't understand and it'll cause problems (more than Remote Plus??) then they could require an advanced enabling code from TV1 to make the mode available. Only people that look for it, would find it.

I'm a programmer and an INTJ personality. I hate to see functionality "left on the table" when this seems pretty straightforward to impliment. I could write the C in an afternoon (barring learning Dish function names  )


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## Mr.72 (Feb 2, 2007)

koralis, you nailed it. this is not a hard feature to implement. My suspicion is leaving it out has a lot more to do with sales and revenue than it does with cost of implementing the feature. Like, the suggestion that I need another 622, or another receiver, etc...


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

koralis said:


> I'm a programmer and an INTJ personality. I hate to see functionality "left on the table" when this seems pretty straightforward to implement. I could write the C in an afternoon (barring learning Dish function names  )


:lol: through my 20+ years of development I have heard statements just like the one above and not one has never actually been proven true. Lots have been proven false. If I only had a nickle for each one.  Not dogging on your abilities, just that Engineers (and I am one) from my experience tend to over simplify things only to later find the problem is not as simple as first anticipated. Based on my past experience of under estimating a lot of tasks in my career, I personally don't estimate the difficulty of a task unless I am at least familiar with both the environment, tools architecture and code base.

Of course you have the right to believe that adding this type of feature in a user friendly way is simple. I disagree and I think there is more to it (Mainly in terms of how to provide a good user experience).

Since you dont' have the cpode to imlement and I don't have the time to write up some use cases to test against the added functionality we will have to agree to disagree.

This sounds like a feature to add to the Wish list.. See how important people think this is..


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## Mawingo (Mar 27, 2007)

I'm having trouble locating the manual for the 622.. how do you switch between modes?
It's in dual mode right now and would rather have it in single mode, as I don't have a TV yet in the other (TV2) room. 

:icon_cof:


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

Just press the Mode button on the front panel.

You can find the 622 User Guide here:

http://www.dishnetwork.com/content/our_products/user_guides_and_manuals/receivers/vip622/index.shtml


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