# OTA or Dish?



## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

I'm so new to this. I got a Sony SXRD 60XBR2 last week. The Dish guy is coming today to upgrade to a 622 and HD package. Can I get my local HD channels or do I need to get another antenna for the roof? I didn't think I would but after reading some here I'm not sure. My local zip code is 32092 if that helps.


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## JohnL (Apr 1, 2002)

Calvin Carrigan said:


> I'm so new to this. I got a Sony SXRD 60XBR2 last week. The Dish guy is coming today to upgrade to a 622 and HD package. Can I get my local HD channels or do I need to get another antenna for the roof? I didn't think I would but after reading some here I'm not sure. My local zip code is 32092 if that helps.


Calvin,

Your Local Market channels are NOT available from Dish in HD. If you wish to receive them in HD then any Antenna that is capable of receiving a good signal in the particular band those stations are located in will be fine. There is NO SUCH thing as a HD antenna for OTA. Most Antennas labeled as such are UHF only antennas as MOST HD signals in the UHF band.

Go to Antennaweb.org. Input your exact Address and you will get a list of all of the stations that should be available at your location OTA. I just used your zipcode and it appears that your are about 22 miles from the transmitters. Your HD Locals use both VHF/UHF and you would need a medium range VHF/UHF directional antenna for all but your CW station. Your CW Station would require a Long Range Directional Antenna with PRE-AMP.

Good Luck.

John


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

This sucks. Here I was getting excited about watching football on locals in HD now I have to get an antenna? My wife will not like the looks of this.... Any reccomendations on an antenna?


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## whatchel1 (Jan 11, 2006)

Calvin Carrigan said:


> This sucks. Here I was getting excited about watching football on locals in HD now I have to get an antenna? My wife will not like the looks of this.... Any reccomendations on an antenna?


Winegard makes an antenna that doesn't look like an antenna. It is called the Squareshooter. It is a little gray plastic box. Should help w/ the WAF. According to antennaweb.org all your stations are in 1 direction so it should work fine.


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

Can I mount this by my dish and split the signal there or do I need to run coax to it? This will probably have to point north? My dish is mounted on a pole next to my south facing wall of the house. 

Is there an indoor antenna?

Thanks for the help.


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## DougRuss (Oct 16, 2005)

Here is the info from your Zip Code..........

Assignment
*	yellow - uhf	WTEV-DT	47.1	CBS	JACKSONVILLE	FL 357°	22.2	19
*	yellow - vhf	WTLV-DT	12.1	NBC	JACKSONVILLE	FL 359°	21.9	13
*	yellow - uhf	WJXT-DT	4.1	IND	JACKSONVILLE	FL 359°	22.0	42
*	yellow - vhf	WJXX-DT	25.1	ABC	ORANGE PARK	FL 359°	21.9	10
*	yellow - uhf	WAWS-DT	30.1	FOX	JACKSONVILLE	FL 357°	22.6	32
*	yellow - uhf	WJCT-DT	7.1	PBS	JACKSONVILLE	FL 357°	22.6	38
*	red - uhf	WCWJ-DT	17.1	CW	JACKSONVILLE	FL 358°	22.2	34
*	red - uhf	WJEB-DT	59.1	TBN	JACKSONVILLE	FL 357°	22.2	44
Note:

THe Direction of all tower Locations 357-359 degrees.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

You know... I really am lost as to why so many people (including HOA) freak out about antennas. Just 50 years ago, people were ecstatic to be able to put up an antenna and get free TV in their homes... and it was really only about 30 years ago when the quality of broadcast TV really became a regular (most of the 24 hour day) thing on multiple channels.

I'm very happy to have an antenna and get a bunch of good locals for free!


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

It doesn't bother me to have an antenna it just a PITA to get the cable run etc....


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## gjh3260 (Mar 19, 2006)

Since you are only 20 miles or so from the towers its possible that an indoor antenna would work. I have the Zenith silver sensor and it works great however I am only 5 miles from the towers. I do have friends that are about 25 miles awa an an indoor antenna works just fine for OTA.


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## MDRNHL (Jan 9, 2006)

> You know... I really am lost as to why so many people (including HOA) freak out about antennas.


IMO, because they are ugly. Last thing I want to see when I look at a nice house is an awkward hunk of metal poking out of it.

Home appearance is more important to me than TV. If I couldn't get my dish on the back of the house, on the roof out of sight of the street, I would probably be a cable subscriber. We just moved last month. Dish location, specifically whether it would be out of sight, played a role in my home purchase decisions.


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## JohnL (Apr 1, 2002)

MDRNHL said:


> IMO, because they are ugly. Last thing I want to see when I look at a nice house is an awkward hunk of metal poking out of it.
> 
> Home appearance is more important to me than TV. If I couldn't get my dish on the back of the house, on the roof out of sight of the street, I would probably be a cable subscriber. We just moved last month. Dish location, specifically whether it would be out of sight, played a role in my home purchase decisions.


MDRNHL,

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. "That Hunk of Metal on my ROOF" Screams, "I won't be held hostage by ANY Provider, My local channels are Really FREE not cable company, or satellite provider 'FREE' with a qualifying package of channels". My Dish's and OTA antenna show that I'm independent from some Hard wired service. Just last week, for example, during a bad Wind and Rain storm, my cable based internet went out for 10+ hours. That would have been 10+ hours of NO TV, right in the middle of Primetime and with no option to watch my local NHL team or other NHL Center Ice games. As Long as I have power or gas in a Generator I'll have my all my options both OTA and satellite TV to keep me and my family comfortable and entertained.

In most cases OTA HD reception and picture quality is going to be better, as nobody is modifying or downrezzing the resolution from my Antenna to my HD Television, like DBS and alot of cable systems do to save bandwidth.

John


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## whatchel1 (Jan 11, 2006)

Calvin Carrigan said:


> Can I mount this by my dish and split the signal there or do I need to run coax to it? This will probably have to point north? My dish is mounted on a pole next to my south facing wall of the house.
> 
> Is there an indoor antenna?
> 
> Thanks for the help.


Yes it N. As the list that DougRuss listed (which is from antenna.org) shows they are all pretty close to N. 0 or 360 is N. The antenna can come in on the standard diplexer.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

MDRNHL said:


> IMO, because they are ugly. Last thing I want to see when I look at a nice house is an awkward hunk of metal poking out of it.
> 
> Home appearance is more important to me than TV. If I couldn't get my dish on the back of the house, on the roof out of sight of the street, I would probably be a cable subscriber. We just moved last month. Dish location, specifically whether it would be out of sight, played a role in my home purchase decisions.


For my money... I spend most of my time inside of my house where I cannot see my antenna, or at work when I can't see my house from there either... so there is very little time (driving in the driveway, or doing yard work) that I am physically able to see any outside dish or antenna anyway.

To each their own... and I understand if you don't want it on your house... that's cool... but the HOAs that try to mandate it for the neighborhood really get on my nerves. Fortunately I get by just great with an indoor setup, but I know others around who can't get as good OTA as I do and feel boxed-in by what their neighbors deem "acceptable" for them.


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## DougRuss (Oct 16, 2005)

gjh3260 said:


> Since you are only 20 miles or so from the towers its possible that an indoor antenna would work. I have the Zenith silver sensor and it works great however I am only 5 miles from the towers. I do have friends that are about 25 miles awa an an indoor antenna works just fine for OTA.


 But he has 2 VHF Stations ( ABC, NBC) and the Silver Sensor would not work for him.


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## bflatmajor (Sep 8, 2006)

HDMe said:


> You know... I really am lost as to why so many people (including HOA) freak out about antennas.


If I could suggest, spend 10 dollars at walmart and get a pair of rabbit ears and connect it to the receiver. I've done that for 3 of my sets and it works great.


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## JM Anthony (Nov 16, 2003)

Couple of thoughts. Blonder Tongue makes a nice compact UHF antenna that might work. Check their web site for the model. You can also check out Channel Master is they make a number of good antennas. I tried the BT for a couple of years and then on a lark, got a CM 4228 and put it up in my attic. Nothing metallic up there and I now get really solid reception. Didn't have many issues with the BT because of its compact size. No issues with wife on the new antenna arrangement.

Good luck.

John


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

Thanks for all the help. I finally got all of my TV's set up last night. Had to mirror a room, add a drop etc.. finally done at 11:30 so I didn't really get to enjoy it. I'm going to have the kid come back and put up an antenna for the locals.


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## JohnL (Apr 1, 2002)

HDMe said:


> To each their own... and I understand if you don't want it on your house... that's cool... but the HOAs that try to mandate it for the neighborhood really get on my nerves. Fortunately I get by just great with an indoor setup, but I know others around who can't get as good OTA as I do and feel boxed-in by what their neighbors deem "acceptable" for them.


HDme,

Not to mention that ANY HOA restriction to OTA Antennas in general ARE ILLEGAL.

John


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## MDRNHL (Jan 9, 2006)

> To each their own... and I understand if you don't want it on your house... that's cool... but the HOAs that try to mandate it for the neighborhood really get on my nerves. Fortunately I get by just great with an indoor setup, but I know others around who can't get as good OTA as I do and feel boxed-in by what their neighbors deem "acceptable" for them.


I agree with you about the HOA's. Don't get me wrong, I'm not the type to whine and complain because the neighbor's house isn't perfect by my standards...I just don't like the appearance of one on my own. Same goes for my living room/entertainment center. My entertainment center is clean and relatively minimalist. I don't want to put an indoor antenna there either unless its very stealthy and discreet.

Thats what I need.....a stealth antenna!!


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## saltrek (Oct 22, 2005)

There actually is an outdoor antenna called the "stealthtenna" made by Channel Master. http://www.starkelectronic.com/stealth.htm


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## HIPAR (May 15, 2005)

Minimum OTA HDTV antenna requirements:

http://home.iprimus.com.au/toddemslie/Muntjewerff-TV-antennas-2.jpg

My neighborhood:

http://www.wanderingspoon.com/thy-tracker/images-7-12/tv_homes.jpg

Hi Hi :nono2:

--- CHAS


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## khearrean (Mar 24, 2004)

Calvin Carrigan said:


> It doesn't bother me to have an antenna it just a PITA to get the cable run etc....


If none of the other ideas posted here work, I can recommend a very good (for my situation anyway) outdoor un-obtrusive, cosmetically appealing antenna.:grin: 
I am approx. 15 miles from most of the local towers & I get great results from mine. It's a Winegard Sensar GS-2200. This is an amplified antenna, bi-directional, VHF/UHF outdoor. I believe this is either similar to or the same as the ones they were installing for the older Voom set-ups. According to the specs, this has a range up to approx. 50 miles. I believe that's probably stretching it however..You can do a search and see a photo & pricing.

Ken


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## DougRuss (Oct 16, 2005)

HIPAR said:


> Minimum OTA HDTV antenna requirements:
> 
> http://home.iprimus.com.au/toddemslie/Muntjewerff-TV-antennas-2.jpg
> 
> ...


Now that is Beutiful !!


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

DougRuss said:


> Now that is Beautiful !!


AMEN!! I'd love to have that telescoping tower to play with!!

If you have an attic, buy an antenna at least twice as large as recommended by antennaweb and put it in the attic.


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

Would something in my attic work being that far away? I could do something like that myself. My home adress is actually only 15.5 miles from the transmitters.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

An attic install looses you about 50% of the OTA signal, thus the need for the larger antenna. Other complications may be foil insulation or metal roofing blocks 90% of signal, plus reflections from A/C ducting, etc.

Attic install is a last resort, it is best to put it outside above the roof line, but sometimes you must compromise. Attic installs are a compromise.

You have two VHF digitals that complicate your antenna choice. The Channel Master 4228 is a UHF antenna that has 6dB gain on ch 10 and 4.5 dB gain of channel 13, but it stands 3 ft vertically with a 3 ft span, so you need a good sized attic. If you need a horizonal yagi type antenna the CM 3679 or a Winegard HD7082P should do fine. Go for at least a RED rated antenna maybe even a BLUE.

I also recommend against diplexing your OTA with the satellite cables. While it will work, it introduces more signal loss into both cable runs and you want the strongest possible signal for both. You don't want dropouts in bad weather.


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## whatchel1 (Jan 11, 2006)

khearrean said:


> If none of the other ideas posted here work, I can recommend a very good (for my situation anyway) outdoor un-obtrusive, cosmetically appealing antenna.:grin:
> I am approx. 15 miles from most of the local towers & I get great results from mine. It's a Winegard Sensar GS-2200. This is an amplified antenna, bi-directional, VHF/UHF outdoor. I believe this is either similar to or the same as the ones they were installing for the older Voom set-ups. According to the specs, this has a range up to approx. 50 miles. I believe that's probably stretching it however..You can do a search and see a photo & pricing.
> 
> Ken


The Sensar III which is the one you are showing is the one produced now. The unit that came with Voom was the Sensar II.


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## restart88 (Jun 18, 2006)

JohnL said:


> MDRNHL,
> 
> Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. "That Hunk of Metal on my ROOF" Screams, "I won't be held hostage by ANY Provider, My local channels are Really FREE not cable company, or satellite provider 'FREE' with a qualifying package of channels". My Dish's and OTA antenna show that I'm independent from some Hard wired service. Just last week, for example, during a bad Wind and Rain storm, my cable based internet went out for 10+ hours. That would have been 10+ hours of NO TV, right in the middle of Primetime and with no option to watch my local NHL team or other NHL Center Ice games. As Long as I have power or gas in a Generator I'll have my all my options both OTA and satellite TV to keep me and my family comfortable and entertained.
> 
> ...


That's my concern as well. Being in South Florida I often have periods where trying to watch ANYTHING in the late afternoon to early evening is nearly impossible without an antenna or cable. a 2nd video source is almost a must, for me anyway.

But I will say my experience with D* has been much better on the rain fade issue.


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## Michael P (Oct 27, 2004)

DougRuss said:


> Now that is Beutiful !!


By the looks of some of the antennas this house is not in North America. There are no vertically polorized OTA TV signals on this side of the planet. (that's the antennas that appear sideways).


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## Michael P (Oct 27, 2004)

DougRuss said:


> But he has 2 VHF Stations ( ABC, NBC) and the Silver Sensor would not work for him.


The 2 VHF stations are both in the VHF high band so the Silver Sensor may still work. I have one and I have 2 VHF's in my market (although one VHF is the lowest of the low band, ch 2 - the SS is no use for that station).

For best results an indoor antenna needs to be placed near a window facing the direction of the transmitters. Building materials (especially aluminum siding) screws up OTA signals big time. I'm only 1 mile or so from the towers and had a problem which was solved by the above method.


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## DougRuss (Oct 16, 2005)

Michael P said:


> By the looks of some of the antennas this house is not in North America. There are no vertically polorized OTA TV signals on this side of the planet. (that's the antennas that appear sideways).


 I do believe those are Ham/Cb Antenna's ( one looks like a 4 element Beam,the other looks like a MoonRaker)


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

I was told for my location that the Squareshooter isn't good for me due to one of the stations being west of me. Can anyone recommend a good omni directional amplified antenna?


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

This weekend I took an old set of rabbit ears with the UHF loop and hooked it up to my 622 reciever. It worked fairly well except I didn't get the one station that is away from the others. I was getting between 85-99 % on all of the other channels. If I got an amplified omni directional would this work even better? An what if I put it in the attic?


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## restart88 (Jun 18, 2006)

I just got my first HDTV set yesterday (Samsung 30 widescreen tuber) ! :jumpingja 

I have had a clip on antenna that I try using once in a while which is powered through the receiver. Sometimes it works and I get a good signal from 80% or more of the stations in my area and at least some signal from all. Unfortunately, sometimes ALL signals seem to drop out so I figure the voltage isn't making it to the antenna's electronics. 

So I hooked it up to the new TV. When it does work I get beautiful SD, Digital, and HDTV OTA. :dance01: 

Since I live in a high lightning strike area I am afraid of having a high profile traditional antenna. So I'm now tempted to try a powered indoor antenna.

As a side note, just the SD sat receiver connected to Component looks pretty darned good. So far it's actually hard to see the difference between DBS & HDTV mostly because the TV does such a darned good job.


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

Will this work for me? I'm having a hard time understanding what I should use.

http://shop.willyselectronics.com/browse.cfm/4,162.html


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## TreeFarm (Dec 4, 2006)

I had one of those (different brand, but made for them by Winegard) mounted at a height of 38', also in Florida. I got excellent analog reception of VHF high and UHF at 30 miles and UHF only at 60 miles. I was in a very rural area with no high reflecting structures. I also tried it in several urban areas during my travels, always with mixed results. 

The small physical size of the antenna limits its effectiveness on VHF low signals.

If you try to use an antenna like this in an area with close by tall buildings, water towers, hills, or other reflecting surfaces, you will get severe multipathing. While these sort of antennas are often sold as metropolitan area antennas, in reality they work best in flat rural country that is close enough to the transmitter that a gain antenna is not required. In strong signal ubran areas, one or more channels are almost always unwatchable.

I have no experience with digital signals with this kind of antenna. The distances listed above came from antennaweb.org. They are accurate.

Edit: 

Just in case the link above goes away, it shows a Wingard MS-2000 21 inch omnidirectional antenna.

Also, I forgot to mention that omnis, such as these, can easily be affected by multipathing due to low flying aicraft, trucks on a nearby freeway, and sailboats in a marina or at anchor. There is nothing like a gently waving forest of aluminum masts to spoil your TV viewing pleasure. How far are you from the airport, the freeway, and the ICW?


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

My subdivision is new so there are basically no trees around except 10 foot Magnolias they planted...  I live on a retention pond so that should be okay. I'm 15.5 miles from the transmitters. North Florida flat land....


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## mikeyinokc (Jan 11, 2006)

Michael P said:


> By the looks of some of the antennas this house is not in North America. There are no vertically polorized OTA TV signals on this side of the planet. (that's the antennas that appear sideways).


Ummmm, those appear to be Ham Radio antennas. Some are vertically polarized, and some are horizontal, some appear to be VHF, and others are UHF.


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## DoyleS (Oct 21, 2002)

They are definitely ham antennas. A number of the antennas are stacked for additional gain plus capable of being raised on the tower. All are on rotors and it looks like he is into terrestrial DXing. 

..Doyle


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## herni (Dec 17, 2003)

Perhaps this has been covered in some other forum, forgive me if it has but I am new to this. I have two questions. First, I have noticed on the DirecTV commercials with Jessica Simpson, it says DirecTV HD is broadcast in 1080i. My question is, does Dish HD broadcast in 1080i or 720p? And what happens to stations, like ESPN-HD that broadcast in 720p. Does Dish upconvert everything to 1080i? Or are 720p stations broadcast in 720p? My next question is somewhat technical and it refers to the title of this post. I have a 211 connected to a 720p LCD. When I watch the NFL on CBS, a 1080i station, using the OTA connected to the back of the 211, I notice lines, like on a person's uniform pants, that aren't still. It's as if the lines are blowing in the wind. Yet, when I watch that same game or station directly through my LCD HD built in tunner, that is eliminated. In other words, I have noticed that OTA HD looks better on my LCD tunner, than it does through my Dish tunner. Why? If anyone can help with either of these questions I would appreciate it. Thanks.


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## Mike D-CO5 (Mar 12, 2003)

When Jessica says that the show is being broadcast in 1080i she is right. From the channel provider like Showtime or HBO , it is broadcast in 1080i or 720 p. From there at both Directv and Dish they take it and compress it to the bit rate and compression scheme that fits their respective services. Which in the case of Directv is much less than Dishnetworks. Some call it Hd lite . Very few channels are in true 1080i or 720p after that by the time you see it on your tv. 

The Dish sat receiver will upconvert the picture to what ever you set it to: 480p/780/1080i. I think that Directv has native resolution that broadcast what ever is broadcast to the respective rate , after the sat provider does it compression and bit rate mumbo jumbo. Dish is supposed to be working on native resolution Software; coming SOON. 

Some hd tvs do a better job of upconverting the picture to 1080i or 720p or whatever you native rate is for you hd tv. You might try setting your receiver to 480p and allow the tv to upconvert the picture and and see if that improves your picture. You might also try adjusting the sharpness , brightness, contrast of you hd tv to improve your picture as well. 

The bottom line is that Dish has the better picture in both hd and sd by the amount of members that have posted here and other web boards. Directv has less bandwith and has to even take some hd channels down to make the way for others like NFL sunday ticket on Sundays. You are better off with Dish for now. Maybe by this time next year Directv will have more sats and more bandwith to provide the true 1080i , but I doubt that they will keep it in true 1080i if history of either sat company is any indication.


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## herni (Dec 17, 2003)

Thanks for the super fast response.
So if I am reading your right, you are saying that, in the case of my LCD, the 211 is set to 720p and anything I see through it will be in 720p. That makes sense since my LCD is a fixed-pixel display. But what about in the case of my RPTV, which is 1080i? The 211 for that TV is set to 1080i, so anything shown on it will be upconverted (if it is a 720p channel) to 1080i? That makes sense too. But here is where I am confused. Say ESPN-HD, which broadcasts in 720p, on my RPTV, it will be upconverted to 1080i, while on my LCD it won't? So I don't get then what you mean about Dish working on software to broadcast in native resolution. Isn't it doing so already if on my RPTV it upconverts to 1080i while on my LCD it downconverts to 720p? 

And also, since I am on the subject, I see that my RPTV's resolution is 1280x1080, is this HD Lite?


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## DP1 (Sep 16, 2002)

herni said:


> But here is where I am confused. Say ESPN-HD, which broadcasts in 720p, on my RPTV, it will be upconverted to 1080i, while on my LCD it won't? So I don't get then what you mean about Dish working on software to broadcast in native resolution. Isn't it doing so already if on my RPTV it upconverts to 1080i while on my LCD it downconverts to 720p?


Without native pass through it means that the receiver is converting channels from either 720p to 1080i or vice versa depending on what the receiver is set to output in conjunction with what channel is tuned. If I'm watching CBS HD and the receiver is set to 1080i, no problem. But if I switch to ESPN HD the receiver is still sending out 1080i even though it's a 720p channel. Or if it's set to 720p it's always sending that out even when you're watching a 1080i channel.

Many people would like the Dish receiver to pass those signals right on through to a persons display at 720p and 1080i respectively. The way any given channel comes in.. it goes out the same way.. without user intervention to match it up.

In other words people would rather their displays do any converting if necessary, rather than the Dish receiver. Oh sure you can have the receiver output match the channel resolution as it stands now if you're that worried about it, but every time you switch channels from a 720p one to a 1080i one you'd have to go into the setup menu and pick the appropriate output resolution.

It's not a feature I personally care about but some people do. I just leave my output set to 1080i and dont worry about it.

And yeah, that 1280x1080 resolution you mention is considered to be "HD-Lite"


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## herni (Dec 17, 2003)

Thanks so much. I think I got it now. 
Regarding my question as to why on some channel, specifically the NFL on CBS, or college football on CBS, is the reason I notice the lines of the uniform's stripes sort of coming and going, like flag's stripes blowing in the wind, the fault of my Dish receiver, especially since when I connect the OTA directly to my LCD, that gets eliminated?


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## DP1 (Sep 16, 2002)

Well yeah that sounds like it hits to what we're talking about. Your display is doing a better job of converting a 1080i signal to match it's native resolution than the Dish receiver is.

What happens if you set the Dish receiver to 1080i output (which in effect is sending the display the same thing as when you're viewing it OTA.. both 1080i)... do the 2 channels look more comparable that way?

If thats true, you can see why native pass-through would be a good option to have on the Dish receiver. It would send 720p out for the 720p channels and switch to sending out 1080i on the 1080i channels automatically.

It's also why for the time being you might actually consider leaving that box set to output 1080i. Since theres far more 1080i channels than 720p ones and you may not notice any appreciable difference on the 720p ones anyway.


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## herni (Dec 17, 2003)

Thanks DP1. For last night's Chargers game on NBC (1080i) I noticed what I was talking about in my previous posts regarding the lines of the player's uniforms. I then set my dish receiver to 1080i output and wouldn't you know it, the problem got fixed. Now I will just leave the dish output to 1080i even though I have an LCD HDTV. For the life of me I still don't get why that fixed the problem. I mean, it makes no sense to me. I understand the idea that my TV does a better job of converting an OTA signal than the dish receiver, but I don't I don't get why a changing the output from 720p tp 1080i on that same receiver fixes the problem. I mean, I am still going through the receiver. So thanks.


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## Yes616 (Sep 6, 2006)

Back to Calvin in St Augustine:
You are lucky. I am in the mountains and in the wrong place for OTA today. Signals are too weak for me being about 85 miles NW of NYC. The future plans of the Freedom Tower are to include transmitters on the top. The good towers were on top of the WTC and since 9/11 the signals to the distant areas have been bad.

But you are in a great place. To your north is Jacksonville and to your south and south west is Daytona and Orlando respectively. I would bet with a good VHF / UHF antenna high on a mast with a rotator you will get more OTA than Dish or your local cable will ever give you. SD and HD.

If I were you I would get a great OTA antenna and never have to pay anyone else again for what should be a free signal.

That is what I would do but to each his own.

Sometimes guests spot my 2 dishes on the roof. I have been asked if I am trying to contact aliens on other planets.. lol


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## DP1 (Sep 16, 2002)

herni said:


> Thanks DP1. For last night's Chargers game on NBC (1080i) I noticed what I was talking about in my previous posts regarding the lines of the player's uniforms. I then set my dish receiver to 1080i output and wouldn't you know it, the problem got fixed. Now I will just leave the dish output to 1080i even though I have an LCD HDTV. For the life of me I still don't get why that fixed the problem. I mean, it makes no sense to me. I understand the idea that my TV does a better job of converting an OTA signal than the dish receiver, but I don't I don't get why a changing the output from 720p tp 1080i on that same receiver fixes the problem. I mean, I am still going through the receiver. So thanks.


Well it has to do with the converting capability of a "box". Whether the "box" is the Dish receiver or your display. Some of them do a better job than others at converting a 1080i signal to a 720p one.

When you're viewing a 1080i OTA signal.. totally bypassing the Dish receiver, it's your tv thats converting the signal to 720p. When you go through the Dish receiver watching a 1080i channel but the output is set to 720p, *it's* doing the converting before it ever gets to your tv. But when the Dish receiver is set to 1080i it's more or less like feeding it an OTA 1080i signal.. the Dish receiver isnt messing with anything. As such it's once again your tv thats doing all the "work" to convert it.

Another example, albeit kind of extreme, is kinda like when you're watching 4x3 SD programming.. like say Survivor.. on a local HD channel. It's about as good as SD programming can look because the broadcaster is upconverting the signal to 1080i before they send it out.

Well in a way a Dish receiver does the same thing right? When you're watching one of the run of the mill SD channels on their system and your receiver is set to output 1080i, the receiver is converting that channel from 480i to 1080i. Except the channel still looks nowhere near as good as a 4x3 SD program on a local HD channel because the stations upconverter is so much better than the one in the Dish receiver.


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## restart88 (Jun 18, 2006)

Sometimes guests spot my 2 dishes on the roof. I have been asked if I am trying to contact aliens on other planets.. lol

Hey, I have 3 and one on the side, not counting a clip on OTA antenna! 

2 for Dish, 1 for Starchoice (not active) and one for Direct TV (currently not active). I'm not even sure what I'll do with 2 old never used Primestar dishes but if I ever do use one or both they're gonna be ground mounted. Being in Florida I fear they'd eventually be "gone with the wind." 

I'll always have at least 1 E* dish but the rest kinda depends on which, if any, HD stb I go with, I think. OTOH Skype is now reporting some success overseas with broadband HDTV. :eek2:


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## Virus (Sep 22, 2005)

One thing is for sure. OTA HD looks so much better than through the Dish locals in HD. My neighbor and me were outside talking this summer about TV's sat and stuff. I mentioned how the neighbor across the street just put up an OTA antenna. Neighbor said, "that's such and eyesore". I then pointed to my roof and said, "I've had mine up for 2 years and you never noticed it until I pointed it out". He said, "good point". People won't notice it on your roof. It's only an eyesore if you point it out.


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## rec9140 (Dec 22, 2006)

MDRNHL said:


> IMO, because they are ugly. Last thing I want to see when I look at a nice house is an awkward hunk of metal poking out of it.
> 
> Home appearance is more important to me than TV. If I couldn't get my dish on the back of the house, on the roof out of sight of the street, I would probably be a cable subscriber. We just moved last month. Dish location, specifically whether it would be out of sight, played a role in my home purchase decisions.


   Seriously dish viewability a concern....... :eek2:

Well beauty is in the eye of the beholder as another poster pointed out, and antennas are not ugly. The more the better! Look at it this way.... all those "pretty flowers, and trees, and plants, and sod....." that you spent $$$ on, guess what to a tech guy like me, they are as ugly as can be BUT I don't run around mandating and complaining that you not plant those ugly plants. Those plants can't been seen inside the house, and I could care less what the neighbors think. My house is clean, the grass cut etc...

If what you say above is correct then I would say that DBS is NOT for you at all. Stick with crapble..... and oh yeah... better turn in the the cell phone(s) too! You know they take antennas to work, its not magic.

I really fail to see the logic behind this anti antenna view and thankfully the FCC stepped in and controlled this, not far enough, but at least it put an end to 80% of the issue. Now to have it apply to ALL radio services amateur, land mobile, and allow for 6ft dishes as well for C band, with no anal rules about where they can be placed.

The whole gated community and HOA's just baffles me.....didn't need them before, dont need them now.


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## rec9140 (Dec 22, 2006)

HDMe said:


> For my money... I spend most of my time inside of my house where I cannot see my antenna, or at work when I can't see my house from there either... so there is very little time (driving in the driveway, or doing yard work) that I am physically able to see any outside dish or antenna anyway.
> 
> To each their own... and I understand if you don't want it on your house... that's cool... but the HOAs that try to mandate it for the neighborhood really get on my nerves. Fortunately I get by just great with an indoor setup, but I know others around who can't get as good OTA as I do and feel boxed-in by what their neighbors deem "acceptable" for them.


See:

www fcc gov /mb /facts /otard html

And specifically:

(3) An antenna that is designed to receive local television broadcast signals.

So even if you don't need it, put one up! 

Neighbors and HOA sleaze get NO say!


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

Stop and think for a minute. When was the last time you even looked at your house.

People don't notice things like that. It might be seen for the first week, but after a while you ignore it.

Besides, the presence of a TV antenna or two nowdays says I have HD OTA, and YOU DON'T!!


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## Calvin Carrigan (Dec 5, 2006)

For now I'm still running of my rabbit ears inside the house. I've watcched all of the bowl games with no problems........


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## UT_Texan (Dec 9, 2004)

I would at least try with a cheap $25-$50 indoor atenna and if that doesn't work then return it and get an outdoor antenna. I was 30 or so miles from the towers and it worked fine. I could even get signals from Houston, San Antonio and Waco which are 180 miles, 90 miles and 60 miles away from me. I had it in my attic.
I am all for doing the easiest, cheapest thing first.


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## MDRNHL (Jan 9, 2006)

> Seriously dish viewability a concern.......
> 
> Well beauty is in the eye of the beholder as another poster pointed out, and antennas are not ugly. The more the better! Look at it this way.... all those "pretty flowers, and trees, and plants, and sod....." that you spent $$$ on, guess what to a tech guy like me, they are as ugly as can be BUT I don't run around mandating and complaining that you not plant those ugly plants. Those plants can't been seen inside the house, and I could care less what the neighbors think. My house is clean, the grass cut etc...
> 
> ...


Yes, it is correct, I like a discrete or out of sight dish install. That's my personal opinion, and it has nothing to do with your ridiculous example.
Being a network engineer for a cell provider, I do have some clue how cell phone technology works 
And if you had bothered to read the rest of the thread, you would see that I don't give a crap about other peoples homes, just my own.


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## gintzj (Jan 4, 2007)

Terk maKes a nice OTA unit and also indoor one. take a look at their web page


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