# Quick help needed! Power Center died



## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

My Monster Power Center 3600 mkII died a sudden death this morning. Since spending $$$ on that unit I have retired and cannot afford a comparable replacement.

I am considering just a good surge protector such as this Belkin from Home Depot - http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical...splay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051

What is your opinion/recommendation?

We have frequent lighting here in North Texas.

EQUIPMENT
Sony HDTV
Denon AVR
Pansonic Blu-Ray Player
DirecTV HR24
DirecTV AM21N 
Toshiba HD-DVD Player
Powered Subwoofer


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Get a UPS.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

sigma1914 said:


> Get a UPS.


Please help me better understand your recommendation. Why a UPS? Does it provide the necessary surge protection in addition to contined power? Our powe failures are basically short. What UPS do you recommend?

Thanks.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

1953 said:


> Please help me better understand your recommendation. Why a UPS? Does it provide the necessary surge protection in addition to contined power? Our powe failures are basically short. What UPS do you recommend?
> 
> Thanks.


They do both. I have some CyberPower units I like, and APC also comes highly recommended. Here's mine: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000QZ3UG0/ref=wms_ohs_product

I'm near Dallas and we had lighting hit our backyard a few months ago that fried one outlet my UPC was on. Everything was saved except my BluRays network connection.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

Thanks for the data. We live in Desoto on top of a hill, one of the highest points in Dallas county.


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

The UPS will supply power to keep your DVR recording if you loose power during a show. It will also supply power for your disc players and other network devices if they are doing a firmware update (which shouldn't be interputed). The latter only does you any good if the internet modem is on a UPS as well.

Besides that however, most UPS do not have very good surge protection (unless you're spending some big bucks on a higher end model). There is maintenance involved (replacing batteries every 3-5 years), etc...

Based on your needs you stated, I would NOT recommend a UPS.

The surge protector you linked to at Home Depot is marginal at best. The question becomes how well do you want to protect your equipment? You already stated you get a lot of lighting where you are.
I would recommend one of the following brands for a point of use protector: Panamax, Furman, APC (thier higher line), SurgeX, Ditek, Zero Surge, Tripplite (higher ISO line), and 1-2 other brands I can't think of right now.
Notice I did not have Monster listed in there. Sorry but Monster just is NOT a good value in protectors. There highend models ($1K+) are good protectors, just not for the price.

Also, consider looking at getting a whole house protector. This is a good 1st line of defense for your home and help protect everything in it (Appliances, large motor devices like HVAC, etc...). This is not a replacement for a point of use protector on sensitive electronic equipment however - don't be confused by the 2.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

John Williams said:


> Besides that however, most UPS do not have very good surge protection (unless you're spending some big bucks on a higher end model).


The only reason not to get a UPS is if you live where hydroelectric or nuclear power are the main sources of power.

UPSes that cost at least as much as comparable surge suppressors sink the spikes just fine and better ones offer voltage regulation that no surge suppressor can.


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

harsh said:


> The only reason not to get a UPS is if you live where hydroelectric or nuclear power are the main sources of power.
> 
> UPSes that cost at least as much as comparable surge suppressors sink the spikes just fine and better ones offer voltage regulation that no surge suppressor can.


I can tell you from experience that is just not true. 
A UPS is an electronic device just like a lot of equipment. As such, it can be damaged from spikes just like equipment if not protected well. Most inexpensive UPS units do not have good protection. Guess what happens when they take a strike. Maybe your equipment survived, maybe the UPS even survived. *The point is, you're paying money for a battery backup 1st.* If it's a cheap unit, it rarely has a good protection circuit (much like that Belkin unit linked to above).
A UPS at the same price as a straight surge protector will *NOT* have the same protection. It can't! Is the manufacture giving away the surge circuit for free? I don't think so.

Only people living in certain parts of the country are ever going to run into this or experience this for themsleves. People living in Fl or here near FL. And a few other select locations around the country that experience high volume of lighting strikes a year. Everyone else is living in blessful ignorance until 1 day they get an actual lighting strike (which may even never happen to them, bless their souls).

Oh. Yes there are straight surge protectors that do voltage regulation. Actually, a lot of highend ones do. But that seems to be outside the original poster's budget. Also, what's important is the protector's ability to disconnect power to the equipment when power is above or below what it should. And not reconnect until voltage is stable again for a preset amount of time. Again, not something a cheap surge protector does.


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## Cholly (Mar 22, 2004)

I agree with John. I have a Panamax surge protector on my family room HT system and an APC on the HT system in my bedroom.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

Thanks to everyone for your advice and comments.

After considering all options I have a Panamax M4300-PM 9 Outlet Rack Mountable Power Conditioner/Surge Protector*on order.


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

1953 said:


> After considering all options I have a Panamax M4300-PM 9 Outlet Rack Mountable Power Conditioner/Surge Protector*on order.


One thing you might want to look at on that brand, is if there is a local dealer near you. Under warranty, Panamax will send the dealer a brand new unit for the old one they send in. So when I have a customer take a hit that knocks one out, I go out and swap it for them; knowing I'll get a new one in return from the manufacture. That doesn't mean every dealer will do that for thier customer but you can ask.
Also, make absolutely sure you buy from an authorized dealer. Panamax has it listed right on the front page of the website:
"WARRANTY NOTICE! Panamax products purchased online do not carry a valid product warranty unless purchased from an Authorized Panamax Internet Dealer."
If the place isn't authorized you will have NO warranty.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

John Williams said:


> One thing you might want to look at on that brand, is if there is a local dealer near you. Under warranty, Panamax will send the dealer a brand new unit for the old one they send in. So when I have a customer take a hit that knocks one out, I go out and swap it for them; knowing I'll get a new one in return from the manufacture. That doesn't mean every dealer will do that for thier customer but you can ask.
> Also, make absolutely sure you buy from an authorized dealer. Panamax has it listed right on the front page of the website:
> "WARRANTY NOTICE! Panamax products purchased online do not carry a valid product warranty unless purchased from an Authorized Panamax Internet Dealer."
> If the place isn't authorized you will have NO warranty.


Thanks for the info. I ordered my Panamax from Best Buy.


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## kc1ih (May 22, 2004)

harsh said:


> The only reason not to get a UPS is if you live where hydroelectric or nuclear power are the main sources of power.


Why would that make a difference? I think it makes a difference is if your power comes from overhead lines or underground lines.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

Our power comes from underground lines.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

1953 said:


> Thanks to everyone for your advice and comments.
> 
> After considering all options I have a Panamax M4300-PM 9 Outlet Rack Mountable Power Conditioner/Surge Protector*on order.


OK, what the h*** did you pay for that "monster" set up? $234.oo is not exactly a cheap date, LOL.

So, I am exposed to brownouts, which are pretty serious for electronic equipment. Right now I'm using a new cyberpower "smartstrip" which is realy cool, shuts everthing down behind the master plug like it should, got it from our local electricity provider as a promo. But I know somewhere in my head, it just a standard surge suppressor.

So, 2 questions to John, [who I am guessing is in the business:] AND anyone out there with more knowledge than I.[ that would be alot,lol]

1. I kinda like tripplite, their CSR's are quick to reply any questions you have, Web site very easy to navigate. But if you had to pick a surge supressor, which [ inexpensive one] is the best for the $ ? I'm on a tight budget as well. 
2. If you shut off a suppressor at the switch, does that cut power to anything plugged into it? Meaning, no power, no power spikes? I've had this conversation before, and the general idea is throwing the switch reduces problems with brownouts. True or false?


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

satcrazy said:


> 1. I kinda like tripplite, their CSR's are quick to reply any questions you have, Web site very easy to navigate. But if you had to pick a surge supressor, which [ inexpensive one] is the best for the $ ? I'm on a tight budget as well.
> 2. If you shut off a suppressor at the switch, does that cut power to anything plugged into it? Meaning, no power, no power spikes? I've had this conversation before, and the general idea is throwing the switch reduces problems with brownouts. True or false?


1) I have used many Tripplite products and most seem to be good. The ISO series is what you want to be looking at for surge protection (it's a real protector). 
I can't recommend thier UPS however. The 3 different models that I tried all had issues. Within 2-3 years the batteries went bad, when I pulled them out they were swollen ready to explode (thou none did). Upon closer inspection, I noticed the design has the main power supply transformer right up against the batteries - it gets real hot. This most certainly caused the problem with the batteries (piss poor design). 
I have always used APC for cheap to expensive UPS setups. I have had a few fail on me in the last few years however, seems no one can make a quality UPS anymore. Have installed 3-4 Cyberpower units (customer purchased), 2 went bad within 2 years. Seen a lot of stuff get damged on cheap products over the years.
Always been happy with all the Panamax, Furman, and Ditek units I've sold over the years. They have UPS units as well but pricey.

2) This depends on the design of the product. A lot of surge equipment that has switches, have banks of outlets. Some banks are always hot, some switched, some switched with delay.
Brownouts are a special case that you really need to look closely at the surge protector you buy. ANY cheap surge device is going to have problems with brownouts. A good surge device will cut power when voltage goes below a certain point (usually around 95VAC). 
If you have a lot of brownouts due to the power company, then a UPS is certainly a recommend.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

John Williams said:


> 1) I have used many Tripplite products and most seem to be good. The ISO series is what you want to be looking at for surge protection (it's a real protector).
> I can't recommend thier UPS however. The 3 different models that I tried all had issues. Within 2-3 years the batteries went bad, when I pulled them out they were swollen ready to explode (thou none did). Upon closer inspection, I noticed the design has the main power supply transformer right up against the batteries - it gets real hot. This most certainly caused the problem with the batteries (piss poor design).
> 
> Sorry to hear that. Did you address that problem with the company?
> ...


OK, but I thought a UPS is used more for computers? So you don't lose data, etc..
I'm guessing a good surge suppressor would be what I need for my new tv and audio video equipment, correct?
I could also use a good SS on my computer as well? I'm realy more concerned about the electronics getting fried more than anything.

OK, I found a ditek 8 outlet surge strip for 20$ If there is something better, I need a link, as they make alot of stuff! [ that I'm not familiar with]

thanks john

One more thing, does ISO for tripplite stand for Isobar? Because that's what I found at the provantage web site.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

harsh said:


> The only reason not to get a UPS is if you live where hydroelectric or nuclear power are the main sources of power.
> 
> UPSes that cost at least as much as comparable surge suppressors sink the spikes just fine and better ones offer voltage regulation that no surge suppressor can.


what is your recommendation?


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

satcrazy said:


> OK, but I thought a UPS is used more for computers? So you don't lose data, etc..
> I'm guessing a good surge suppressor would be what I need for my new tv and audio video equipment, correct?
> I could also use a good SS on my computer as well? I'm realy more concerned about the electronics getting fried more than anything.
> 
> ...


On Tripplite, it would be the Isobar.

For $20, you're not going to get good A/C protection. I guess I should have pointed out that Ditek has some "power strips" that say surge protection, but don't really do much. As a rule, if the device you're looking at doesn't retail for more than $50, then you probably are not getting much of a protector. 
Even Panamax has some protectors that retail for less than $35, I won't use them. If you notice those protectors also don't have thier "protect or disconnect" feature. Which is what will disconnect power in case of a brownout situation.

UPS = Like I mentioned earlier in the thread, a UPS is good for DVR's to keep them recording so you don't lose your show. It's good for keeping power to a device that may be installing firmware - in the off chance that happens, corrupted firmware can brick a device. It's also good for projection devices (LCoS, DLP, etc...) that loose power when they are on - the cooling fan needs to run for at least a minute or two after the lamp turns off; if not, this can shorten the life of the lamp considerably. It's good for computers so a power failure doesn't cause you to lose data or corrupt the OS system. And lastly: if you have very bad power in your area, a UPS can keep your equipment from continually being rebooted all day. Which could get very annoying.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Thank you.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

Well here I am, a new owner of a Panamax M4300-PM. Honestly, I cannot begin to join in your technical discussions due to my lack of knowledge so I'll speak from a plain Joe's point of view

All I can say is that during the years we used a Monster HT3600 MKII this device protected our AV equipment during many, many voltage spikes, surges, lighting strike and power outages. With the HT3600's demise I researched the devices on the market along with opinions from three forums. After feeling my head was about to explode I came to the conclusion that about 50% of those who offered advice preferred not to use power centers. Many surprised me by supporting UPS's with the minority liking power centers.

I was ready to go the high quality surge surpressor route until my wife reminded me how well the power center performed and (now don't throw rocks at me) to some degree improved both the audio and video. There is no way I can support my position other than tell you visitors to our home were and still are astounded by the our systems performance.

The new Panamax M4300-PM is installed, coax, telephone line included. I was surprised by the strict warranty conditions but that will be presented in a new thread. Please accept my sincere appreciation for your help.

Louis


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Anybody have any advise about APC H15? [ good or bad]

Amazon.com APC H15BLK AV 1.5kVA H Type Power Conditioner Electronics


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Personally, if I was going to spend that kind of money, I would get an APC with a battery backup, so you dont lose your recording programs during brief power outages, but that is just me.

I have been running a 1500VA APC UPS on my home entertainment center for several years. Runs for 15 minutes during a power outage, more than enough time to go out and fire up the generator if it doesnt come back on pretty quick.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

1953 said:


> Well here I am, a new owner of a Panamax M4300-PM. Honestly, I cannot begin to join in your technical discussions due to my lack of knowledge so I'll speak from a plain Joe's point of view
> 
> All I can say is that during the years we used a Monster HT3600 MKII this device protected our AV equipment during many, many voltage spikes, surges, lighting strike and power outages. With the HT3600's demise I researched the devices on the market along with opinions from three forums. After feeling my head was about to explode I came to the conclusion that about 50% of those who offered advice preferred not to use power centers. Many surprised me by supporting UPS's with the minority liking power centers.
> 
> ...


Hi louis,

After reading amazon reviews, One poster stated there were no "always on" outlets, like his previous panamax had.
So, my question is two fold, what would I do about my sat reciever which needs to be on for second tv viewing/ and /or daily guide updates?

Does the 4300 have sequential power up and power down ability? Meaning if you shut off one component do all the rest follow?

Does the Panamax turn off your components if the voltage stays too low [ brownouts]


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Davenlr said:


> Personally, if I was going to spend that kind of money, I would get an APC with a battery backup, so you dont lose your recording programs during brief power outages, but that is just me.
> 
> I have been running a 1500VA APC UPS on my home entertainment center for several years. Runs for 15 minutes during a power outage, more than enough time to go out and fire up the generator if it doesnt come back on pretty quick.


Well. I don't have a DVR, so I would only need that for a computer I guess, although J Williams recommended a UPS for brownouts, I'm not sure why unless he also thought I had a DVR.

I'm mostly concerned about fluctuations, and low power/ then surge when the power co. here is playing with their grid. Like I mentioned in another post, I was leaning towards a tripplite, but it never cuts the supply of electricity to your stuff if the power goes too low and hangs there. I would think that would be the first thing it should do.


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

See your other thread.


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

satcrazy said:


> After reading amazon reviews, One poster stated there were no "always on" outlets, like his previous panamax had.
> So, my question is two fold, what would I do about my sat reciever which needs to be on for second tv viewing/ and /or daily guide updates?
> 
> Does the 4300 have sequential power up and power down ability? Meaning if you shut off one component do all the rest follow?
> ...


Well if you don't ever switch the unit off, then all the outlets are always-on. The master power switch on the front turns the unit on/off, there are no 12v triggers etc... on that unit. There is also no sequential outlets on the unit.
A couple of notes: The only reason you would need sequential outlets, would be if: 1) You were running a separate preamp/ audio amp. Even then, most modern quality amps have their own start up delay built in. So again, not needed. 2) You have several large loads that demand a lot of start up power when first applied (usually large motor loads, high current amps, etc...). Again, if you don't have this, then there's no need.

In comparison to the APC 15 unit you were looking at. It also has no 12v triggers, etc... to turn it on/off either. The on/off has to be done by the front switch as well. The only time I could think you would use that, is if you have a lot of transformers (wall warts) plugged in. This would stop the vampire drain. Otherwise not much need to cut power to everything (unless you are a serious power control advocate). Then depending on the amount of equipment, you might save 10-50 watts killing power to everything vs. equipment just off and in standby.

The Panamax has protection for coax, telephone, and LAN. But you can add those things onto the APC with external modules (just like the gentleman did with the Panamax).

Feature wise they are similar (both have over & under voltage protection).

I wouldn't want to say one was better than the other without actually having both to take apart and study the circuits involved. Specs mean very little in this market.


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

satcrazy said:


> Well. I don't have a DVR, so I would only need that for a computer I guess, although J Williams recommended a UPS for brownouts, I'm not sure why unless he also thought I had a DVR.


A DVR doesn't have anything to do with needing a UPS or not.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

SayWhat? said:


> A DVR doesn't have anything to do with needing a UPS or not.


What would be gained with A/V equipment then, having a ups? If there is something funky going on with the power, I don't need to watch tv that bad. I figure ups is for saving stuff, like recordings or computer data before it shuts down.

What do you mean?


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## SayWhat? (Jun 7, 2009)

A momentary outage that suddenly restores can be devastating to any electronics. They like to be turned off completely, then turned back on after a short waiting period.

A UPS either makes those momentary glitches invisible to the devices or ensures that you have time to turn the devices off and let them fully shut down before turning them back on.


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

satcrazy said:


> Hi louis,
> 
> After reading amazon reviews, One poster stated there were no "always on" outlets, like his previous panamax had.
> So, my question is two fold, what would I do about my sat reciever which needs to be on for second tv viewing/ and /or daily guide updates?
> ...


Here is a link to the 4300's manual- http://www.panamax.com/PDF/Manuals/INS00818B_m4300pm.pdf

I suggest you call Panamax to ensure the 4300 will meet your specific needs. It works perfectly with my DTV HR24 HDDVR, AM21N and all of my other AV gear.

Panamax is to Furman as Ford is to Lincoln. Furman is far to costly for my needs.


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

SayWhat? said:


> A momentary outage that suddenly restores can be devastating to any electronics. They like to be turned off completely, then turned back on after a short waiting period.
> 
> A UPS either makes those momentary glitches invisible to the devices or ensures that you have time to turn the devices off and let them fully shut down before turning them back on.


Well I'll slightly disagree with you here - someone's got to disagree somewhere  
Electronic equipment generally isn't bothered by power being lost to it for a split second. Even if it is interuppted again when it's booting back up, usually isn't a deal killer. It is generally just annoying to the user.
I recommended a UPS to him because of his description of power at his location. It sounds like brownouts are a daily occurance for him. In such a case, a UPS would save your sanity from your equipment rebooting all the time while trying to use it. 
Sometimes when an electronic device gets cycled this way, it might lock up on you. It just means you have to pull power again to reset it and it will boot right back up. If you have electronics that lockup 'every time' there is a power glitch, or is damaged by a split second power loss - I recommend you get better electronics :lol:

See other post for reasons to have a UPS on certain kinds of devices, irrelevant of power conditions.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Thanks for dealing with the dual posts, I just wasn't getting the answers I needed.

No, I don't realy deal with brownouts everyday, but it seems like whenever a storm sweeps through, I am at the alter of "cross your fingers" or on my knees pulling the surge suppressor plugs for the AV center and the computer [ not a cheap one] [ this plug is buried] from the wall outlets, because they are 25$ surge strips, and I'm paranoid. Problem is, these storms can pop up while I'm sleeping or away from the house.

Do line conditioners [ voltage regulators] realy "clean" the power so there is better performance, or is that just hype? I saw "sine" mentioned more than once, does that go hand in hand with "clean power"? I know, this is a crash course, but the more I glean, the better the informed choice, I think. Who buys the first thing they see? [ Well, I made that mistake as a kid, but not now, unless it's under a hundred,LOL]

I guess calling them [ the companies] with questions is ok, but even though the guy from tripplite was very pleasant, I would have been screaming if after setting up the tripplite product I found out it "hums" -that's a dealbraker, as I don't listen to the tv with the volume cranked [ well, most of the time] That's why I prefer casting a wider net, and I'm gratefull for everyone who replys, and a special thanks to John for his detailed explanation


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

satcrazy said:


> Thanks for dealing with the dual posts, I just wasn't getting the answers I needed.
> 
> No, I don't realy deal with brownouts everyday, but it seems like whenever a storm sweeps through, I am at the alter of "cross your fingers" or on my knees pulling the surge suppressor plugs for the AV center and the computer [ not a cheap one] [ this plug is buried] from the wall outlets, because they are 25$ surge strips, and I'm paranoid. Problem is, these storms can pop up while I'm sleeping or away from the house.
> 
> ...


Man am I confused! All of my statements, regardless of thread, pertained only to AV.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

1953

Audio/ video.

Yes, that is the main idea here. I don't understand why you are confused.

Your input also helped!

After looking at the panamax manual, The first page indicates it has the disconnect/protect feature. If the APC does not have this I will be looking real hard at this model. You did say there was some tight restrictions on the warranty. I know it has to be bought from an authorized dealer, but any other red flag?

You also indicate it had none of the problems that the Tripplite had, like audible "hum" and clicking. [ a dealbraker for me]. So that also helped


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## 1953 (Feb 7, 2006)

satcrazy said:


> 1953
> 
> Audio/ video.
> 
> ...


Sorry friend. Hard night.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

No problem.


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

Now you are getting me confused on which products you are trying to compare. Let me see if I can run thru some of this briefly again, in different terms.

1) When hum was being discussed, we were talking about voltage regulators (a separate circiut from surge protectors and UPS) - the example you linked to was a Tripplite unit. Although cheap UPS can have hum to them as well - but that's for a different reason and not generally audible from a distance. I don't know if that particular Tripplite unit has audible hum or not, I have never used it. It is a very rare thing you see voltage regulators being used in residential installs. The customer would have to have some REALLY crappy power problems and even then I think a call to the power utility company would be more in order, as there is probably something wrong at the pole.
Again - Voltage regulators are generally only used in special cases. Where there is a real power problem.

2) 'That' Panamax does not have voltage regulation, nor does the APC, nor do most surge protectors. Most of the time, it simply isn't needed in the design. You want good power to pass thru and if the power isn't good, you want the protector to stop it. Simple.

3) 'Protect or Disconnect' is a feature Panamax calls its under & over voltage protection. The APC unit does the exact same thing, as do many quality protectors. I have actually mentioned this 3 times now :lol:

4) Sine wave. The A/C power that comes from your wall is in the form of a Sine Wave: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sine_wave
If you have ever bought a power inverter for your auto
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverter_(electrical)
you will notice a warning that comes with it. The output from these things are almost square waved and WILL cause damage to A/C motors, sensitive electronic equipment, etc...
A typical UPS (battery backup) for the home is a modified sine wave. It's better than the output from a cheap auto inverter (almost square) but still not the same as a sine wave. Some equipment doesn't like being ran from this "dirty" power and might lockup. Also, audible noise might be picked up thru audio compnents, lines or hum in video, etc... None of that really matters as the whole point of battery backup is to have power during an outage to safely shut everything down (or for your DVR to keep recording its show).
Pure Sine wave UPS deliver the same quality sine wave as the utility company does. This prevents any noise problems when running on battery and/or lockups of sensitive electronic equipment (rare in A/V).

5) Clean power. Now you are getting into snake oil. 
Generally the power coming from your wall is clean enough to not worry about. If there is enough noise coming in on the A/C power to cause audible noise in your audio system or picture problems in your video system; then I suggest you search down the problem with the power more so than buying a device that is advertising to "clean" up your power.
Note: Most system noise or interference is almost always related to a ground loop problem.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

The tripplite LC1800 is advertised on tripplite's site as a "automatic voltage regulator", so I thought that's what it does. If it "trims" higher input, and boosts lower input, isn't that a regulator? I guess I misunderstood. When I was reading the reviews for this, more than a few people complained about "hum" and clicking noise. This unit was recommended by a tripplite CSR, after I told him what I was looking for.

The panamax and APC I was looking at also advertises the same function as the LC1800, no compaints about hum or clicking though. Again, I must have misunderstood the function of adjusting the incomming power up or down as "regulating".

Thanks for#4 and 5 
Got it.

One other question, how important is it to run a sat or cable coax through one of these "protectors" if [ in my case, Sat] the installer already grounded the incomming cable at a switch box [ in the basement] ?


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## John Williams (Oct 5, 2011)

satcrazy said:


> The tripplite LC1800 is advertised on tripplite's site as a "automatic voltage regulator", so I thought that's what it does. If it "trims" higher input, and boosts lower input, isn't that a regulator? I guess I misunderstood. When I was reading the reviews for this, more than a few people complained about "hum" and clicking noise. This unit was recommended by a tripplite CSR, after I told him what I was looking for.
> 
> The panamax and APC I was looking at also advertises the same function as the LC1800, no compaints about hum or clicking though. Again, I must have misunderstood the function of adjusting the incomming power up or down as "regulating".
> 
> One other question, how important is it to run a sat or cable coax through one of these "protectors" if [ in my case, Sat] the installer already grounded the incomming cable at a switch box [ in the basement] ?


That's one thing I hate about typing. What sounds good in my head and what I think is clear on what I'm typing, may not be for someone else reading.

Yes, yes. The Tripplite LC1800 'is' a voltage regulator and not much else. As such, everything that has been discussed about 'voltage regulators' stand true for this product. Which is it can have clicking and hum noise from the autoformer inside (I'm never tested that unit so I don't know how loud it would be). And that such devices are rarely used in residential settings because they are only used for certain types of power problems - specifically when you have voltages that swing around a lot and can be extreme.

No, No. The Panamx 4300 and APC 15 do 'not' have voltage regulators in them, nor does any literature imply this. I do understand that it can get confusing reading some of these marketing materials. But those units do not 'adjust' the voltage coming out of them in anyway. That would require a large heavy autoformer or a battery/inverter assisted system.

Have you ever seen what happens to a cable that's struck by lighting? If it's a good strike, it can vaporize the metal inside. Leaving slag and a burning jacket. If your wiring isn't grounded (to divert the critical voltage to ground), then that could happen in your walls (bye bye house). NEC requires everything coming into the home to be grounded, this is for saftey reasons. So you don't get shocked and so if you take a lighting strike, your house doesn't burn to the ground.
If you do not have surge protection on your coax or data lines: the rather large surge that WILL still be on the line after the ground point, is more than enough to knock out your equipment. Without the NEC ground point outside, you could see you equipment explode and burn on the inside.

As far as grounding the satellite coax coming in. CATV, telephone, A/C power are the most likely ways a strike can come into your home. A satellite dish would have to take a strike or near strike to come into the home (much less likely, unless it's on a pole out in the yard or at the highest point on the roof). But if it does happen and you're not protected.... And god help you if that happens and you're not even grounded.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Well, it is a pole mount, but like I said, the installer did some grounding work in the basement where the coax comes in.

So, whatever I buy for AC protection should have a coax in. Should keep the reciever from getting fried.

[ I'm guessing at that point I'd need a new piece of protection equipment, lol]

Thanks again.


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