# No OTA when SAT blocked by weather?



## ewingr (May 18, 2005)

I thought that we should be able to get OTA when the satellite was blocked by weather. But I had a lot of storms this weekend, and at one point, all I could get on my 942 was a message about trying to acquire a signal.

I couldn't enter a channel number for the locals or anything.

Is this normal?


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## pmsmith66 (Feb 13, 2003)

Someone step in here if I'm mis-remembering but this HAS been reported before and most have agreed it should be corrected. I'm pretty certain Mark is aware of this situation and that he has taken whatever actions are needed to get it in front of the "right" people.


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## Bichon (Jun 5, 2003)

Yes, it's normal. You need to be able to see at least one satellite in order to tune local channels. Dish does this because they subsidize their hardware, and they don't want people buying their boxes to use as a cheap OTA receiver. People have been asking for a "grace period" so that they'll be able to tune OTA channels during bad storms.


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## normang (Nov 14, 2002)

I have noted that if you are on a local channel, and rain fade occurs, you don't lose the channel unless you enter the guide or try and change channels, then the aquiring screen appears. However it would be better if you could access a local OTA channel for at least few hours after you lose signal to rain fade.


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## smokejoe (May 12, 2005)

Blocking a person's access to their local stations during servere weather i.e. tornado warnings will likely liability action against E* when the individual's life and/or home is lost (it will happen) due to D* black out of broadcast of public safety alerts and warnings. 
E* has continued this potentially fatal action in spite of numerous notices and awareness of the more responsible practice of 'black out delay' used by DTV.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

This is an issue that's been there since the 6000/8VSB module. If they haven't changed their minds now I wouldn't bet on them changing it in the future (unless a court tells them to).


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## ewingr (May 18, 2005)

I do recall seeing a post about not being able to use the 942 if no satellite. But...that should be if you don't subscribe...not if rain blocks it out. There MUST be a way for the system to know if you are subscribed or not.

The tornado thing is EXACTLY what I was trying to do...get to weather info. We had a very fierce rainstorm hit in very short order this weekend. I had family at my house, and I was very embarrased, let alone worried, about not being able to bring up weather info. They were all running around fretting, and I couldn't bring up Sh#t.

I live in Kansas where a lot of tornados hit. 

I will be forced to do something to work around this thing. This is really very very annoying! I had been an E* customer a few years ago, and left in frustration. I don't even remember why. But this type of crap would certainly contribute to a decision like that.

I too think that E* could be liable...but who knows. Some day they may find out.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Frankly, I'd get a NOAA weather radio for sever weather warnings, that has a battery backup, so if power is lost you still have weather alerts.


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## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

smokejoe said:


> Blocking a person's access to their local stations during servere weather i.e. tornado warnings will likely liability action against E* when the individual's life and/or home is lost (it will happen) due to D* black out of broadcast of public safety alerts and warnings.
> E* has continued this potentially fatal action in spite of numerous notices and awareness of the more responsible practice of 'black out delay' used by DTV.





ewingr said:


> I will be forced to do something to work around this thing. This is really very very annoying! I had been an E* customer a few years ago, and left in frustration. I don't even remember why. But this type of crap would certainly contribute to a decision like that.
> 
> I too think that E* could be liable...but who knows. Some day they may find out.


Or, you guys can do what I did and by a TV with an OTA tuner...

You choose to subscribe to Dish Network knowing that it doesn't support OTA during satellite outages, it is incumbent on *you* to get a TV that supports OTA only.

Now, I realize that it would be nice to watch your TV when there is a signal outage but E* isn't *liable * for you not buying the right equipment for TV.


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## ewingr (May 18, 2005)

The weather radio is a good idea...for the severe thing of the moment. I think I actually have one of those radios stuck somewhere.

That doesn't change my feelings about having TV weather available. As much bad weather as we do get, we like to watch what's going on ahead of time, and heading our way.

I think I'll set my antenna to run over the same wire as TV2 so I can get locals on that TV at least. I presume I can do that.


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## ewingr (May 18, 2005)

```
You choose to subscribe to Dish Network knowing that it doesn't support OTA during satellite outages, it is incumbent on you to get a TV that supports OTA only.
```
I didn't 'choose' to subscribe based on that. It makes common senses to me to block it based on not subscribing. Not based on no read of the satellite.

I will admit that I didn't do due diligence and find that out before subscribing. However, I don't think Dish Network makes that information readally available.


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## Mike Johnson (Jan 16, 2005)

If you lose your satellite signal, you _should_ be able to get to your OTA channels, but it isn't nearly as easy as it should be. I got to experiment about a week ago when we got some heavy weather here in South Dakota.

If the "aquiring signal" screen comes up, it is true that you cannot directly tune to an OTA channel. Usually the GUIDE button won't work either. But if you press MENU, it should bring up the main menu and from there you can navigate to the program guide and scroll to your OTA channel and select it. I've tried this on both my 942 and 811 and have been able to tune to my OTAs without a satellite signal present.


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## smokejoe (May 12, 2005)

> You choose to subscribe to Dish Network knowing that it doesn't support OTA during satellite outages, it is incumbent on you to get a TV that supports OTA only.


OTA weather warning blocks, apparent block of PBS HD program info, and required fees for useless duplicate NON HD locals to view OTA are a few reasons why my (leased)942 and $1,000 yearly E* fees will soon be replaced by OTA DVR - just as 
the above quoted member suggests.


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## waltinvt (Feb 9, 2004)

Not sure why many of you expect any different. I can recall no instance where Dish has ever put intregity ahead of $$ but I do recall the reverse.

The point is that part of Dish's marketing is the ability to receive your local digital stations OTA with their receiver and an antenna. They DO NOT make it clear that you will loose those OTA signals if your satellite signal fails. They DO NOT make if very clear that you won't get epg info for your ota stations unless you subscribe to their locals package.

Dish tries to have it both ways: gain market share by advertising reception of OTA digital locals but then make it frustrating enough so you'll buy their locals package.
It would even be reasonable if the receiver only had OTA ability when there was a valid subscribition for some Dish programming present and if you cancelled Dish, you lost OTA.

When they design a unit to shut off OTA when the sat signal is lost (through no fault of the customer), I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to see what their motivation is.


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## ewingr (May 18, 2005)

```
I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to see what their motivation is.
```
Who said we don't see what their motivation is. I didn't.


```
Not sure why many of you expect any different. I can recall no instance where Dish has ever put intregity ahead of $$ but I do recall the reverse.
```
I'm just a customer that foolishly gave them more credit than they deserve. Now I see how they are, but I have no difficulty understanding their motivation.

Although, all of this being said, Mike Johnson's post indicates we can get to the OTA channels. Maybe it's not a Dish problem, but an interface design issue on the unit(...and these complaints are misguided?).

This gripe behind me, I like the unit pretty well, even with all of it's bugs. Only complaint is that probably by the time the bugs are fixed and it is a really solid unit, MPEG 4 will be out and negate the value of the unit.

Shucks...it seems I'm becoming a pessimist.


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## Bichon (Jun 5, 2003)

C'mon folks, let's not piss off Mark. His posting rules for the 942 support forum clearly state "no Dish bashing" - let's just document the reasons why shutting off OTA during a storm are ill-advised, put correction of the issue on our "wish list", and save the rants for the general Dish forums.


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## smokejoe (May 12, 2005)

Bashing? If I ran E*, I'd welcome and value feedback from subscribers on issues that affect company profits; potential multi-million dollar lawsuits and customers I may lose (or never get) - especially now that STB dependent 'HD monitors' are phased out and OTA HD is increasingly abundant -(primetime networks, nearly 24 hr PBS)
I'd pay for this feedback - not avoid it.


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## TVBob (Dec 19, 2003)

mike_johnson said:


> If the "aquiring signal" screen comes up, it is true that you cannot directly tune to an OTA channel. Usually the GUIDE button won't work either. But if you press MENU, it should bring up the main menu and from there you can navigate to the program guide and scroll to your OTA channel and select it.


Excellent tip Mike -- thanks!


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

smokejoe said:


> OTA weather warning blocks, apparent block of PBS HD program info, and required fees for useless duplicate NON HD locals to view OTA are a few reasons why my (leased)942 and $1,000 yearly E* fees will soon be replaced by OTA DVR - just as
> the above quoted member suggests.


If you'd done your research before ponying up the $250, you'd have known all of these things. Enjoy your OTA DVR.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

This thread's done now.

I have already contacted the correct people at Dish about allowing the OTA channels to remain available for at least a 24 hour period after your lose your satellite signal due to a weather event (or any other reason). That should cover just about all weather related events, allowing you to keep OTA available (assuming you have power, and assuming that your OTA station keeps broadcasting through the event). This is what the Directivo does, and it should be what the Dish receivers do as well.


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