# Ethernet - do I need it connected or not?



## Steve Rhodes (Oct 4, 2006)

I have 1 HR34 and 4 HR24s. Two of the HR24s have hardwired Ethernet attached while 2 of the HR24s and the HR34 do not. I am having connectivity issues with the Whole Home.

Do I need the Ethernet connected or not?


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

The only unit you can connect directly to Ethernet in this system is your HR34. You can not connect your hr24s directly to Ethernet. Unplug them and reboot them. If you cannot connect your HR34 directly, then you must get a DIRECTV Wired Broadband Internet Connection Kit to connect the system to the Internet. 

All this does assume you are using a single dish and a swim16 to connect all your system as well,which is what you should be using.

Oh and you don't need Internet to use Whole Home Service, but you do for all the on demand and other he extra stuff that's available on the all the DVRs.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

inkahauts said:



> The only unit you can connect directly to Ethernet in this system is your HR34. You can not connect your hr24s directly to Ethernet.


These are both false statements. You can, as an alternative to the built-in DECA, choose to connect via CAT5.

If it was the TS's intention to use DECA, your disconnect and reboot advice is required to switch to DECA.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

I'm right, his system as implemented needs to have Ethernet disconnected form two units. Then rebooted those dvrs. I did not feel the need to explain in dire detail why that is so, it's not what he asked. He asked a simple question, I gave him a simple answer that will satisfy what he needs to do. Find someone in the dish threads to confuse.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

OK. As was initially replied undoing the Ethernet connection from the two that have it and rebooting will rest these to use DECA like the other units already are.

If there are some considerations where these units need be on the switched Ethernet fabric this is possible but complex and not supported.

I run dual SWM16s and have one running a DECA cloud and the other provides service to systems on a switched Ethernet fabric. These two network fabrics bridge transparently through the wireless internet connection kit (running wired only) into a centralized backbone switch. This is not an official configuration and the two fabrics must be completely isolated from one another (with respect to the DECA band frequencies) so they bridge at the single point.

If you have reasons why the two 24s cannot be on the DECA fabric (amplified leg due to excessive length as an example) I can help you privately. But unless you have truly mitigating circumstances, putting them all on the DECA fabric REALLY is your best option!

Don "simplicity is best" Bolton


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

harsh said:


> These are both false statements. You can, as an alternative to the built-in DECA, choose to connect via CAT5.
> 
> If it was the TS's intention to use DECA, your disconnect and reboot advice is required to switch to DECA.


False statements? Perhaps on Dish Network world. I let the TS decide if he wants to "listen" to a person who has never have DirecTV® or to one that had had the DirecTV® service for many years.........


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Steve Rhodes said:


> I have 1 HR34 and 4 HR24s. *Two of the HR24s have hardwired Ethernet attached while 2 of the HR24s and the HR34 do not*. I am having connectivity issues with the Whole Home.
> 
> Do I need the Ethernet connected or not?


You can't mix & match whole home - it's either all Ethernet or all Coax

Plug the Ethernet into the HR34 as Genies are the only HR that have an internal bridge. Or you need to get a DECA/CCK to connect to your home LAN.


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## dennisj00 (Sep 27, 2007)

Drucifer said:


> You can't mix & match whole home - it's either all Ethernet or all Coax


Our friend Lugnut would disagree with you . . . you can have boxes on Ethernet or the DECA cloud easily. You just have to know what you're doing.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

But getting it work faultlessly with DirecTV flaky software is the big Q.

You want faultlessly - follow the KISS principle.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

It is actually transparent Drew. In order for the "legacy" equipment to work with adapters it has to be the same packets. Smart TVs and the RVU push pretty much ensure that standard will be adhered to going forward.

The interconnection issues arise as most service techs let alone home subscribers do not fully understand what they need to know to make the hybrid beast work. I was brain dead in that matter when I started. switched Ethernet was just fine thank you. Why go back to networking's stone age on coax?  Actually a complete end to end infrastructure they control and manage is great logic! OMG. My internal dash light came on. 

People here edumacated me as did my network engineers at work and as such I have a unique understanding of the rules for doing what I have had to do to make my Hacienda del Toro abode work as I want. I'm still no expert on the technical how it works but I get the logical and that is enough.

I am with your thinking for everyone's home deployment though. Unless they have a "Winchester house" like mine. Use what is supported. And if someone has a deployment like mine well I am glad to share what all of you have shared with me.

Don "so even though it can work bridged, i'll back your play. A simple as possible and fully supported ROCKS" Bolton


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

harsh said:


> These are both false statements. You can, as an alternative to the built-in DECA, choose to connect via CAT5.
> 
> If it was the TS's intention to use DECA, your disconnect and reboot advice is required to switch to DECA.


Most likely this installation involves a SWM-16 due to the number of tuners in the system. A proper installation would also add a DECA for connection to the Internet. The use of CAT-5 in this situation, while noble, would require one to (1) know what they are doing and (2) go against prescribed installation requirements.

Since the pain point is MRV (whole home), the proper answer is to disconnect all Ethernet connections and restart all receveivers. Whole Home should start working right away (assuming no other oddities in the coax connectivity). To also enable Internet features, a DECA connection would be added.

As stated many times in the past, while CAT5 may work .. it's really not the right way to go for these installations. Bringing it up time and time again only distracts from best practices.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

Drucifer said:


> You can't mix & match whole home - it's either all Ethernet or all Coax





dennisj00 said:


> Our friend Lugnut would disagree with you . . . you can have boxes on Ethernet or the DECA cloud easily.


Depends, connect two Genies on ethernet and you have yourself a network loop


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

Would that be true if there was no secondary DECA connection involved? Seems to me both Genies would function normally on a switched network as long as they weren't also towing DECA networking as well.

Again, I think it could work but it is so far out of standard and for absolutely everyone rather dumb to try

Don "I certainly ain't tryin it thats for sure" Bolton



peds48 said:


> Depends, connect two Genies on ethernet and you have yourself a network loop


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

lugnutathome said:


> Would that be true if there was no secondary DECA connection involved? Seems to me both Genies would function normally on a switched network as long as they weren't also towing DECA networking as well.
> 
> Again, I think it could work but it is so far out of standard and for absolutely everyone rather dumb to try
> 
> Don "I certainly ain't tryin it thats for sure" Bolton


Keep in mind that there is no way to disable the DECA on the Genies, is always ON. It happened to my two HR44s. Granted, I did not seem to see any errors on my network, but they reported "network loop" under the "more system info" screen with an exclamation point


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

BS filter isolate one Genie to just Ethernet and let the other manage DECA.

Don " Not that I am recommending this" Bolton



peds48 said:


> Keep in mind that there is no way to disable the DECA on the Genies, is always ON. It happened to my two HR44s. Granted, I did not seem to see any errors on my network, but they reported "network loop" under the "more system info" screen with an exclamation point


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

lugnutathome said:


> BS filter isolate one Genie to just Ethernet and let the other manage DECA.
> 
> Don " Not that I am recommending this" Bolton


Right, but that would mean going to the van to grab one of these bad boys, I just did the easiest thing, unplug ethernet from one of the Genies. I was just trying to "illustrate" a point.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

Gotchya!

(My spare parts shelves down by the wall-o-SWMs is likely like the stash in one's service truck. As I run a non supportable commercial scale installation on a residential account I have amassed a complete set of replacements fron the slope equalizer down through the SWMs themselves) I wish that on nobody 

Don "band stops, diplexers, and jumper coax OH MY  " Bolton



peds48 said:


> Right, but that would mean going to the van to grab one of these bad boys, I just did the easiest thing, unplug ethernet from one of the Genies. I was just trying to "illustrate" a point.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

Hybrid can be done but it's complex and not at all recommend becasue there's virtually no advantage unless you have a massive system.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

inkahauts said:


> Hybrid can be done but it's complex and not at all recommend becasue there's virtually no advantage unless you have a massive system.


This ^ we can agree on...


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

YUP!


peds48 said:


> This ^ we can agree on...


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

I don't how we got to two Genies, when DirecTV current policy is not allow two. But when they do, it will probably be setup by DirecTV field techs. The Q is just how many of them wont know how to do a dual setup correctly.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

If it's a swim16 it will be no different than what they do today. It will be simple.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

inkahauts said:


> I'm right, his system as implemented needs to have Ethernet disconnected form two units.


Does your monthly bill tell you how the TS's system was initially set up or is it communicated telepathically, subliminally or via e-mail to interested DIRECTV subscribers?

You claimed that only a Genie could be connected to the router via Ethernet or WHDS would not work. That claim is false. As peds pointed out, the caveat is that there should only be one DECA bridge in the system to avoid error messages.

You also claimed that HR24s could not be connected to the LAN via Ethernet and that claim, taken at face value, is also false.

In both cases, as you later admitted, hybrid systems may indeed work just fine. Whether or not the system works is largely independent of what is supported or recommended as the MRV testing phase proved.


> He asked a simple question, I gave him a simple answer that will satisfy what he needs to do.


Regrettably you offered reasoning that was technically untrue. Policy, recommendations or common practice should not be construed as being immutable laws of Physics.

The simple answer is that it should have worked the way it was set up and maybe the system just needed a reboot. Converting to DECA may or may not ultimately fix the issues but it would be another, albeit somewhat more involved, troubleshooting step to try.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

harsh said:


> Does your monthly bill tell you how the TS's system was initially set up or is it communicated telepathically, subliminally or via e-mail to interested DIRECTV subscribers?
> 
> You claimed that only a Genie could be connected to the router via Ethernet or WHDS would not work. That claim is false. As peds pointed out, the caveat is that there should only be one DECA bridge in the system to avoid error messages.
> 
> ...


Again, everything i said was right. YOU need to stop. He wanted a simple solution, I gave it to him. You are trying to say I am wrong simply because you can try to, not because you should or that I am wrong. The fact that it can be hooked up in a hybrid way was also discussed and I even chimed in on that. Everyone but you knows I was right about what the OP should do, regardless of your incessant rattling of trying to say otherwise.

He would have to do a lot more work to make a hybrid system work, including likely buying additional equipment, to bypass the way the system is made to work that would work right by simply unplugging his two hr2xs. But from a dish customer, its not surprising you would tell him you can and should maybe do it the hard way.

And if you opened your eyes and read this line that I had in the post, it ruins your taken at face value nonsense... "All this does assume you are using a single dish and a swim16 to connect all your system as well,which is what you should be using." you would realize I made it specific to those conditions."

All my reasoning was absolutely technically true and perfectly accurate.

And what the heck are you rambling about physics and such?

You really need to leave this directv forum because you are either wrong or telling peopel to do things the hard way, or far more complex way, and passing misinformation to way to many people when you say things like that. And its just sad that you are trying to do this to people who deserve good help.


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## JimAtTheRez (May 9, 2008)

So, the bottom line is that should only have ethernet hooked to my Genie, and let the DECA part handle the rest on the whole home setup? If so, that would explain why I can't see two of my HR24's on my whole home setup. Thanks in advance.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

JimAtTheRez said:


> So, the bottom line is that should only have ethernet hooked to my Genie, and let the DECA part handle the rest on the whole home setup?


That is correct!


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## JimAtTheRez (May 9, 2008)

peds48 said:


> That is correct!


Thanks peds48. That's what I get for trying to improve things as an amateur, ha!


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## Steve Rhodes (Oct 4, 2006)

I am confused. I am having trouble keeping all of DVRs connected with Whole Home. Is the Ethernet connection part of the problem or not?


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## jimmie57 (Jun 26, 2010)

Steve Rhodes said:


> I am confused. I am having trouble keeping all of DVRs connected with Whole Home. Is the Ethernet connection part of the problem or not?


Yes, Ethernet is part of or all of the problem.* See post # 2. *
Ethernet should be connected to the Genie only and no other receivers. The internet will then be on the coax giving all the receivers access.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

Steve Rhodes said:


> I am confused. I am having trouble keeping all of DVRs connected with Whole Home. Is the Ethernet connection part of the problem or not?


How about you tell us exactly about your set up and what is going on so that we may be able to help


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

When my HR34 was setup the Tech use a CKK even though I have a GB switch for my PS3 and the HR20 it replaced. Is it better to have the HR34 connect by ethernet or the CCK where the modem is at?


Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

machavez00 said:


> When my HR34 was setup the Tech use a CKK even though I have a GB switch for my PS3 and the HR20 it replaced. Is it better to have the HR34 connect by ethernet or the CCK where the modem is at?
> 
> Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk


As long as the CCK is the wired kind, there is no difference. You can have either way, but NEVER both


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

If you have other recoevers that can do on demand you could make an argument that you are better off with the outboard cck only because when a genie reboots if it's the cck you do lose Internet on all receivers while it's rebooting. 

I personally prefer to save the electricity and use the genie to bridge the network.


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## Steve Rhodes (Oct 4, 2006)

peds48 said:


> How about you tell us exactly about your set up and what is going on so that we may be able to help


As I said before, I have 4 HR24s and 1 HR34. I had them for a little over a year connected with Whole Home and, of the 5, I had only 2 of the HR24s hard wired into the Ethernet. It worked most of the time but sometimes one of more units would drop off Whole Home, causing me to have to reboot them so all units could see each other. In the past week. it started happening much more so I got advice on the forum.

The top suggestion seemed to be that I unhook all from the Ethernet and then put Ethernet cable on the H34, which I did. I then rebooted the my router and the HR34 at the same time. Once it was up, I rebooted the 4 HR24s.

For a day this worked, but now I am having intolerable pauses in audio and in audio and video whenever the program is being piped over Whole Home either from or to the HR34. I can play programs fine across various HR24s without this problem.

I am at a bit of a loss as to what to try next? Should I hook everything up to the Ethernet? I've got a gigabit router and high speed fiber to the house.

Suggestions? Thoughts? Possible explanations?


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

peds48 said:


> As long as the CCK is the wired kind, *there is no difference*. You can have either way, but NEVER both


Except for one rare event -- if the Genie Ethernet is being used and the Genie bites the bullet, so does your VoD and any other Internet for the rest of your boxes. So keep the CCK.


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## Steve Rhodes (Oct 4, 2006)

Steve Rhodes said:


> As I said before, I have 4 HR24s and 1 HR34. I had them for a little over a year connected with Whole Home and, of the 5, I had only 2 of the HR24s hard wired into the Ethernet. It worked most of the time but sometimes one of more units would drop off Whole Home, causing me to have to reboot them so all units could see each other. In the past week. it started happening much more so I got advice on the forum.
> 
> The top suggestion seemed to be that I unhook all from the Ethernet and then put Ethernet cable on the H34, which I did. I then rebooted the my router and the HR34 at the same time. Once it was up, I rebooted the 4 HR24s.
> 
> ...


Does anyone have a suggestion on what to try next? These 2-5 second freezes are trying us crazy?


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

Steve Rhodes said:


> Does anyone have a suggestion on what to try next? These 2-5 second freezes are trying us crazy?


remove the Ethernet connection then do a reset. Post back with the results...


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## Steve Rhodes (Oct 4, 2006)

peds48 said:


> remove the Ethernet connection then do a reset. Post back with the results...


Let me make sure I understand what you are proposing.

I should remove the Ethernet from the HR34 and leave it off and then reset the HR34s but do nothing to the HR24s?


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

You can try that Steve: but you may need to rest the whole stack.

The problem sounds like you have an internet connection kit somewhere in your set up and it is creating conflicting pathways at the router since the Genie is also attempting to act as a gateway. There can be only one.

You might avoid reboots on the HR24s as long as they currently do not have a Cat5/6 cable connected to its LAN port by using the network settings option off their setup menus. That is faster. . . >check network settings or simple reset network settings should do the trick. There is an option where you can manually add bits you don't want that one  (at least till we've ruled out all other factors)

Don "sorry this is all so confusing and that we've spun it into more than just your question" Bolton


Steve Rhodes said:


> Let me make sure I understand what you are proposing.
> 
> I should remove the Ethernet from the HR34 and leave it off and then reset the HR34s but do nothing to the HR24s?


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Steve Rhodes said:


> Does anyone have a suggestion on what to try next? These 2-5 second freezes are trying us crazy?


I occasionally get these too playing back remote recordings on the HR34 - so you're not do anything wrong. It's the HR34 SW.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

I get the impression that Steve is getting these frequently. And I've yet to have such issues with the HR34 I have in service (early release model) at least specifically.

There are some occasions where streaming seems to hang at a point for a second or two. But as it repeats at the same point in time on either a local or remote stream and on different model DVRs I cannot blame the 34. As far as I can see the HR34 is fairly solid just a tad slower than the 44.

Best to set it to run on DECA only and verify operation and then validate if VOD works at that stage.

Don "break it down to the simplest form and evaluate" Bolton


Drucifer said:


> I occasionally get these too playing back remote recordings on the HR34 - so you're not do anything wrong. It's the HR34 SW.


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## dennisj00 (Sep 27, 2007)

No issues like that here either.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

The other option would be to go back to Ethernet since that was apparently less problematic for you.


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## machavez00 (Nov 2, 2006)

I removed the CCK from my router and connected my HR34 to the Gigabit switch I have at the AV rack where my PS3 and AppleTV are connected. I noticed that My CenturyLink loads much faster now. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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