# Terrestrial radio's decsent



## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

http://dai.investor.reuters.com/Article.aspx?docid=9818&target=companyoftheday&src=DAI


> As more listeners tune in to satellite radio and sign up to the Apple iPod revolution, terrestrial radio providers are finding themselves losing ground to the likes of Sirius Satellite Radio Inc. (SIRI) and XM Satellite Radio Holdings Inc. (XMSR). Contrarians may be tempted by lower stock valuations, but a job-cut announcement at CBS Radio, a unit of CBS Corp (CBS), suggests expectations, and earnings estimates, have more room to fall.


More....


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

Excellent!

And some thought people would never pay for radio :lol: 8 Track, Audio Cassette, VCRs, Dial Up Modems, Floppy Drives, Terrestrial Radio. Terrestrial broadcasters are running scared, because they know they have a terrible service and they suck, but now they have competition. I have no use for AM/FM Radio anymore and haven’t listened to it in years.


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

> I have no use for AM/FM Radio anymore and haven't listened to it in years.


I use AM radio to wake me up every morning. I also have it on snooze every night, but that's it. I never have it on in the car unless there is an event that I need info on (a hurricane or a shuttle launch that I am going to). Local AM/FM does have a use, but no where near what it did a few short years ago. I REALLY can't STAND the poor quality of the signal (both AM and FM). AM here is full of static, FM is so over compressed they kill ANY dynamic range in the music in favor of "reaching out further".

When this http://www.savinglots.com/lotprod.asp?item=XR100 finally arrives at my supplier I will be rid of the garbage clock radio that I use for wakeup and snooze purposes.


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

While I have both my XM and Sirius receivers hardwired to my home theater receiver, I have the FM modulators enabled so I can listen to satellite radio on my alarm clock. Sirius on 106.9, XM on 107.9. I fall asleep to satellite radio almost every night, but I sure do miss the John & Jeff Third Shift show on XM. Either that or tune into Music Choice and set my cable box to go off in 2 hours.


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## coolbreeze (Dec 19, 2005)

Steve,

I do the same. I wake up to my Sportster Replay playing Stern over my FM mod. My alarm clock picks it up. It's just like having Stern on regular radio. Nothing like waking up laughing my ass off. Starts the day off on the right foot.

Sirius is amazing. I don't see how I managed with regular old fashioned radio. I literally have not tuned into regular AM/FM in over 2 years. Not even once!


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## agreer (Apr 7, 2006)

Steve Mehs said:


> Excellent!
> 
> And some thought people would never pay for radio :lol: 8 Track, Audio Cassette, VCRs, Dial Up Modems, Floppy Drives, Terrestrial Radio. Terrestrial broadcasters are running scared, because they know they have a terrible service and they suck, but now they have competition. I have no use for AM/FM Radio anymore and haven't listened to it in years.


AM is great for news, if something happens in Chicago I can turn on the CNN or Fox snoozw sat feeds and listen to NY-ers who havnt a clue about Chicago. or I can listen to WLS, WGN, WBBM...and get on-sight info from folks who know what is going on and know the turf...terrestrial news/talk wont be dead untill I can get WLS, WABC, KOGO, KFI, WMAL, WIBC and so on - all on satalite...and I do not see that happening.

I will put up with a little static for good info, if it were a huge emergency, wouldnt you?


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

Nope. It's only XM and Sirius for me. Traveling around, I wouldn't be able to pick up AM radio even if I for some reason wanted to. I disconnected the terrestrial radio antenna from my Ford factory head unit, then removed the antenna altogether and it went out in the trash a while back. At home the AM loop antenna and FM antennas for my home theater system were also thrown out and my clock radio doesn’t pick up AM radio that well.

I have Fox News, I don’t need Buffalo’s ‘News Leader, News Radio 930’. 

*do-do-do- You’re listening to WBEN NewsRadio 930, News Time is 9:02, expect extremely hazardous, blizzard-like conditions today, driving ban is in effect for all of Western NY. Zero visibility. In other news expect another ¼ of an inch of powder. WBEN, News Time 9:03, after the brief commercial break we’ll be back with tips on how to keep an eye on your elderly neighbors and tips on the proper way to shovel your driveway. Winter is the #1 season for fatal back injuries. Beware! do-do-do- You’re listening to WBEN NewsRadio 930 The Station Here When You Need Us Most*

Yeah, I don’t need this crap, if the sun explodes I can hear about it on Fox News on XM 121 or Sirius 131. I honestly couldn’t give a rats behind about local news, same crap different day. Shooting on the Westside, Legislator Corruption, Bills Suck, Erie Canal Dried Up, I really don’t care. Besides practically the entire AM dial here is owned by Entercomm one of the most vocal crap radio companies when it comes to anti satellite radio ads.


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## agreer (Apr 7, 2006)

Steve Mehs said:


> Nope. It's only XM and Sirius for me. Traveling around, I wouldn't be able to pick up AM radio even if I for some reason wanted to. I disconnected the terrestrial radio antenna from my Ford factory head unit, then removed the antenna altogether and it went out in the trash a while back. At home the AM loop antenna and FM antennas for my home theater system were also thrown out and my clock radio doesn't pick up AM radio that well.
> 
> I have Fox News, I don't need Buffalo's 'News Leader, News Radio 930'.
> 
> ...


Very valid point; I jsut enjoy Chicago because there is always a new scandal involving the Mayor and / or governor...the former governer sold CDLs to anyone for a $1500 donation, Daily hiered friends' trucking COs to do nothing, just basicly sit and idle on the sholder and create cone zones, Gov Blogo. is up to his ears in scandle too, it is like nixon*3 over there all the time...great radio, I live in IN so it is just a circus to me!


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

Oddly enough one of the things I miss from satellite TV and I hope Time Warner picks up is WGN. I used to love watching the WGN News at 9. Local news to me is much more interesting when it’s not your local news.


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## music_beans (Mar 21, 2003)

Steve Mehs said:


> Nope. It's only XM and Sirius for me.


Why bash FM/AM radio so much? Its not that bad. I have listened to stations that play really great music, even though they have commercials.

What about this? Severe Weather or Tornado. You don't hear LOCAL weather warnings on Sirius or XM do you?


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

> Why bash FM/AM radio so much? Its not that bad.


Yes it is.

20 minutes of commercials an hour
Same songs over and over and over
A Country station, 4 AC/Lite Pop stations, a Rap Station, an alt channel and JACK
FCC Control, meaning I can't hear music how it was meant to be heard
No smooth jazz, no death metal, no later classic rock, no southern gospel, no dance hits, no alternative country, no classic hard rock
Stupid DJ's that serve no purpose other then to be an annoyance
Stupid Callers
Low usage of RDS
20 minutes of commercials an hour

There is nothing local about radio other then the car dealers that scream at you every few songs. It's all about advertising dollars for Clear Channel, CBS Radio, Entercomm, Citadel, Cox Radio and the rest. Local weather I can do without. I can look out the window and see what it's doing or if I gave a hoot I have the internet and The Weather Channel. We don't get hurricanes, tornadoes, flash floods, wind storms, dust storms, mud slides, wildfires, just a few feet of snow every year that the local media brags up.

Check out some of the satellite radio message boards and you'll see plenty of others that have no use for free radio. Free radio, you get what you pay for. Me I'd rather pay to have 135 channels of commercial free, uncensored music that play songs that FM radio would never play and relatively interruption free. Plus another few dozen unique talk channels.

I just don't see the point of nine commercial ridden, censored FM Radio stations with playlists more shallow then a week old mud puddle and DJs that do nothing but blab when I have XM at home and in my SUV, Sirius at home and in my SUV, Music Choice at home on Digital Cable, a 30GB iPod wherever I go and a bunch of internet radio streams where ever I have a broadband connection. And obviously from the article others are starting to feel the same way. About 11.5 million people have rejected crap radio, and more do every day.

Terrestrial Radio = Tits on a Bull


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## Richard King (Mar 25, 2002)

music_beans said:


> Why bash FM/AM radio so much? Its not that bad. I have listened to stations that play really great music, even though they have commercials.
> 
> What about this? Severe Weather or Tornado. You don't hear LOCAL weather warnings on Sirius or XM do you?


Being in hurricane central I agree with you on the weather situation, BUT, for anything else satellite is the only way to go. As I mentioned above, I can't STAND the quality, or rather the lack of quality, of the sound of AM or FM stations. I have Sirius for the sound quality on all channels and for the lack of commercials on the music channels.


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## music_beans (Mar 21, 2003)

Steve Mehs said:


> There is nothing local about radio other then the car dealers that scream at you every few songs.
> 
> Terrestrial Radio = Tits on a Bull


Well, look here: www.kwyr.com, www.kjamradio.com

These are several stations in SD that have actual local stuff on them. Don't think that no radio station has local content. Many small town stations have it.

And BTW, back down on the sexual innuendo. It offends me.


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## music_beans (Mar 21, 2003)

A few more things. No, I don't work for KWYR or KJAM.

And don't go around saying "small town stations are crap" or any of that junk. I don't need it, and neither do other people. Offending a true local station is like offending an entire small town.


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

Even if there’s local content, what’s the big deal, I listen to the radio for music, and neither of the stations you linked to seem to play smooth jazz, death metal, later classic rock, southern gospel, dance hits, alternative country, or classic hard rock. I see one of them does a Classic Rock hour every day during lunch, woopie, I have about 10 dedicated 24/7 classic rock channels I can chose from ranging from the early years to the later years, classic metal, hair bands and deep cuts terrestrial radio is afraid to play. I’m guessing those stations don’t play The Bottle Rockets, Greater Vision, Napalm Death or United Nations. If they played let’s say something from Meatloaf it would be either ‘I’d Do Anything For Love’, ‘Paradise’ or ‘Bat out of Hell’ no ‘Rock & Roll Dreams Come Through’ or ‘Objects In The Rear View Mirror May Appear Closer Than They Are’. And I’m willing to bet my favorite verse from ‘Just One of Those Days’ by Limp Bizkit would be nothing but beeps and the ending from Disturbed’s ‘Down With The Sickness’ would never be heard. That’s why local radio sucks. If I wanted to hear 20 minutes of commercials an hour and a whole 5 songs in a row, with a playlist of 500 songs where all the music is cut up, then yes terrestrial radio would rock. But until then I’ll pay my $39.88 for two subscription of each, and not deal with commercials and other terrestrial stupidness.

Satellite radio goes to great depths and opens your eyes to music you never imagined you listen to before. Three years ago I got XM for heavy metal and hard rock, now I’m listening to Southern Gospel, something completely opposite and dance music, which I never used to consider music.

And BTW, ‘Useless as Tits On A bull’ is not a sexual innuendo, it’s a expression that’s been around for years, that even my grandfather used, that translates into worthless. It’s a simile no different then ‘Sharp as a marble’.


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## music_beans (Mar 21, 2003)

On a lighter note, I did find a Southern Gospel station, but on AM: http://www.kcgs.com/

They are plentiful toward the south, but virtually non existant in the north.

BTW, Im sure you changed your avatar just for this discussion and, to further offend me.


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## Geronimo (Mar 23, 2002)

Richard King said:


> I use AM radio to wake me up every morning. I also have it on snooze every night, but that's it. I never have it on in the car unless there is an event that I need info on (a hurricane or a shuttle launch that I am going to). Local AM/FM does have a use, but no where near what it did a few short years ago. I REALLY can't STAND the poor quality of the signal (both AM and FM). AM here is full of static, FM is so over compressed they kill ANY dynamic range in the music in favor of "reaching out further".
> 
> When this http://www.savinglots.com/lotprod.asp?item=XR100 finally arrives at my supplier I will be rid of the garbage clock radio that I use for wakeup and snooze purposes.


I have to agree. Right now I listen to terrestrial radio sparingly but occasionally I am not near my sat radio receiver or I want 
something local---for news or emergency purposes.

Besides other people have other tastes. I can listen to satellite and let others listen to what they want. I am glad we have choices. But the discussion has gone pretty far downhill.


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

> They are plentiful toward the south, but virtually non existant in the north.


And living in Buffalo, NY, I don't see how an AM southern gospel station from the bible belt will do anything for me. We have 9 actual FM stations, plus 2 religious ones and an NPR affiliate in the FM dial, I find AM radio unlistenable, and like I said most of it's owned by Entercomm, a company that I hate.



> BTW, Im sure you changed your avatar just for this discussion and, to further offend me.


Yes and no. Frankly if you're offended by radio station arguments, there's a problem here. I've been meaning to change my avatar to that for a while now, but this thread reminded me of it. If I had a better copy, I'd print it off on adhesive paper in high rez and place it in the center of my rear windshield in between my XM and Sirius decals. I boycott free radio, simple as that, the content or lack there of does nothing for me. Unless something takes a dramatic turn for the worse, I will never willingly listen to terrestrial radio again as in my and plenty of others opinions it sucks. If people didn't think that, why would terrestrial radio air anti SDARS clips, why would there be JACK stations, why would XM and Sirius even be around and why would there be articles written like the one linked to?


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## music_beans (Mar 21, 2003)

Maybe I did go a little far, but I was sure steamed last night. Shouldn't have been.

I guess we are just two different people who like two different things. Thats how it is, and thats how it always will be.


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## CivilizedAnarchy (Nov 22, 2003)

Well I work for a station in Davenport, IA WXLP 97 Rock
And I think the most commercials we play per hour is 8 minutes worth. Not 20. THANK GOD!

No one is ever content with the depth of your playlist, no matter what
station you're talking about on regular radio.
In fact, no matter you do, someone ain't gonna like it.
Doesn't matter if you're talking about radio or even your own personal life.

The whole radio "industry" has really only existed for 10 years.
Before that, there was really no order and was very splintered.

Now what is happening is radio is being forced to compete and upgrade.
Competition is good for listeners and for the business as a whole.
HD Radio is on the very near horizon. And with further expansion into HD with
sub-streams, there is going to be the capacity to handle multiple genres of
music with deeper playlists. And just because satellite plays different stuff,
it doesn't make it better by default.

I've listened to Hard Attack on Sirius multiple times and I'm a metalhead through 
and through. But damn, they play alot of ****ty metal!
So whoever is in charge of that channel, needs to get a clue and pick
good music. Not just anything claiming to be "heavy".

Aside from that, there is always going to be a debate.
All we can do is our best to have compelling programming
to satisfy our local listeners.
And to also NOT be annoying douches on air.
hahaha

Lata, C.J. (the D.J.)
http://www.myspace.com/iamcjthedj


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## agreer (Apr 7, 2006)

CivilizedAnarchy said:


> Well I work for a station in Davenport, IA WXLP 97 Rock
> And I think the most commercials we play per hour is 8 minutes worth. Not 20. THANK GOD!
> 
> No one is ever content with the depth of your playlist, no matter what
> ...


If it is good for listeners, then why have the rock stations here all gone to a ~25 song playlist (oddly enough, the only "requests" that get play are in that list) and, at least in the Lafayette/Indianapolis IN markets, playing like 20 Min/HR of ads...and oh yea, did I mention that they are all owned by one of 4 companies?


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

When I listened to dinosaur radio, some times I'd tune into the Rochester rock station, if it wasn't Disturbed, Linkin Park, Metallica, System Of A Down or Korn it never got played. While I like all of those bands (well don't care much for SOAD due to political reasons, but they have a song or 2 I like) it was the same songs over and over. I own the DVD-As of Linkin Parks Hybrid Theory and Disturbed's Believe, each is loaded full of great songs that terrestrial radio plays maybe 5 of combined.

I love Hard Attack on Sirius, but prefer Liquid Metal on XM. The Nu Metal stylings of Korn and Slipknot, I think not. Vampire Moose anyone? Now that's metal. One thing I never understood, as a hard rocker or metal head, why would you even want to consider listening to this stuff on FM, I respect the artists and bands that put this out and like to hear my rock and metal as it was intended to be heard, uncensored.



> And just because satellite plays different stuff,
> it doesn't make it better by default.


Why not? Sure it does. If I want the same few dozen songs over and over I could have them loop over and over on my iPod and not have commercials, but if I want to, you know, discover something different, well, on FM radio, I'm screwed.

Being born in 1985, I missed what most people now call classic rock. Near the end of my dinosaur radio days I listened to our 97 Rock in Buffalo (don't ya love the creative monikers FM radio uses). Beatles, Stones, Floyd, Zeppelin, the top 5 AC/DC hits, a few songs by Genesis and Journey's Anyway You Want It, that's pretty much all I heard. Now thanks to Sirius' Classic Rewind, and mostly XM's Big Tracks the Classic Rock section of my iPod has grown by upwards of over 250 songs by artists I never new existed before and by artists I liked but never new they had more then one song (Twisted Sister, Cheap Trick).


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## oldave (Dec 22, 2003)

CivilizedAnarchy said:


> Well I work for a station in Davenport, IA WXLP 97 Rock


Oh, good, a Cumulus station... not as bad as Clear Channel... but still... 


CivilizedAnarchy said:


> The whole radio "industry" has really only existed for 10 years.Before that, there was really no order and was very splintered.


Two things...

First, there's a whole raft of us older broadcasters who'd vehemently disagree that the "industry" is only 10 years old..

Second, where is it written that "order" via corporate masters far removed from the local market is a good thing?

Satellite isn't a replacement for local radio - or it wouldn't be, if local radio actually existed anymore.

We used to play album cuts, and when the phone rang, we answered it, the listener told us what they wanted to hear, and we played it, generally within 15 minutes. Of course there was no order... no tightly structured hours... we played what folks called and asked for. A lotta people made very good livings doing that before this whole "order and structure" crap came along...

In many markets, even "emergency" information is just the duck farts followed by the NWS station's feed, followed by more duck farts then back to the satellite delievered music.

I just don't see how terrestrial radio actually serves the public interest, convenience and necessity anymore.

At least with Sirius and XM, there's actually music played that doesn't "test well" in focus groups... my "focus groups" were always the actual listeners that called in.

Yeah, we know, corporate groups like Cumulus, Clear Channel, Entercomm and the rest are the saviors of terrestrial radio.. which just proves that they've managed to brainwash the desired demos.


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## jacag04 (Jul 12, 2006)

Steve Mehs said:


> Nope. It's only XM and Sirius for me. Traveling around, I wouldn't be able to pick up AM radio even if I for some reason wanted to. I disconnected the terrestrial radio antenna from my Ford factory head unit, then removed the antenna altogether and it went out in the trash a while back. At home the AM loop antenna and FM antennas for my home theater system were also thrown out and my clock radio doesn't pick up AM radio that well.
> 
> I have Fox News, I don't need Buffalo's 'News Leader, News Radio 930'.
> 
> ...


ha ha ha ha ha


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## zman977 (Nov 9, 2003)

CivilizedAnarchy said:


> Well I work for a station in Davenport, IA WXLP 97 Rock
> And I think the most commercials we play per hour is 8 minutes worth. Not 20. THANK GOD!
> 
> 
> ...


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## deraz (Sep 25, 2004)

zman977 said:


> CivilizedAnarchy said:
> 
> 
> > Well I work for a station in Davenport, IA WXLP 97 Rock
> ...


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## zman977 (Nov 9, 2003)

deraz said:


> zman977 said:
> 
> 
> > CivilizedAnarchy said:
> ...


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## GeorgeLV (Jan 1, 2006)

zman977 said:


> I also dj for a classic rock station in Peru Illinois WBZG FM 100.9, I do the overnights and that is about the same for us. In fact during my overnight show I just play a couple of spots at the top of the hour and the rest is music. I'm thinking the people who say their stations play twenty minutes of commercails may be exadurating a little Commercail breaks can be long but people forget it takes MONEY to run a station and *the more stations you own, our company has seven, the more MONEY it takes to run them so the more commercials you have to play,*


So...terrestrial radio has negative economies of scale!?


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## Steve Mehs (Mar 21, 2002)

> keep in mind people have been predicting radios downfall for decades. First it was movies would kill radio, then TV would be the end of radio, then Walkmen would be the death of radio and so on and so on. Radio has survived many advancements in techknowlogy and will survive this one.


No terrestrial radio will not die, as much as I say it will and would like it to, it won't, the best I can do is not listen to it and spread the good word of SDARS. It's a stone age medium of audio entertainment. Like I said before, terrestrial radio is like dial up internet or VCRs, old out dated, better stuff available, but will never die. However it will take a major chunk out of listening audience of terrestrial radio. Somewhere on the net there's a chart floating around on consumer adoption rate of new technology. The Satellite Delivered Audio Radio Service industry has a faster consumer adaptation rate then cell phones, cable TV and even the internet. And the terrestrial radio industry knows this and they are scared.



> I'm thinking the people who say their stations play twenty minutes of commercails may be exadurating a little Commercail breaks can be long but people forget it takes MONEY to run a station and the more stations you own, our company has seven, the more MONEY it takes to run them so the more commercials you have to play,


Not exaggerating, 20 minutes, WNVE-FM a Clear Channel station, WBZA an Entercomm Station. Use to listen to them all the time when I could get them in, the music was just filler for the commercials. Four to five commercial breaks an hour approximately four to five minutes in length each. But even 8 minutes of commercials an hours is still too much, hell 1minute is too much. It also takes money to run XM and Sirius and they have 135 channels of commercial free music (not to mention the talk and entertainment content, both in house and outsourced) and I don't hear commercials, that's why I pay $40 a month for them. Free radio is worth of penny I pay per month for it.



> Again true. and the people who make thease complaints are those who want music that if most people heard it they'd change the channel


Which goes to prove one of my points, terrestrial radio is just an advertising gimmick, if it doesn't have a pretty face it's not worthy to be heard, it's all about demographics for the advertising dollar, it has nothing to do with what listeners actually want to hear.



> Again true. and the people who make thease complaints are those who want music that if most people heard it they'd change the channle. Compaining that your local classic rock station dosn't play death mettlal is silly.


It not even about that. My dinosaur classic rock station plays mostly the early stuff. I absolutely hate The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Pink Floyd and The Doors. If it wasn't for satellite radio I would have never heard of The Hooters, Huey Lewis, Rush, Loverboy, Foreigner and a whole host of others. As far as I'm concerned, Big Tracks on XM is the standard for classic rock radio stations, a standard that dinosaur radio can't come close to. And don't dis death metal. Last year XM axed Liquid Metal, and it was brought back this past spring. Obviously it does have a strong following, but not strong enough for the suites in the FM world to realize. They're loss.

This is no scientific study but where I work, last year this time I was one of three people to have satellite radio, now I'm one out of 22, considering we only have about 40-50 employees altogether I think that's pretty good. Most have Sirius for Stern, I think six or seven have XM, but I'm the only one with both. The most common thing that comes up in discussions about satellite radio is, 'I'm never listening to FM again' or 'I have listened to FM since I got XM/Sirius.' It's great!


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## kenglish (Oct 2, 2004)

"Yeah, I don’t need this crap, if the sun explodes I can hear about it on Fox News on XM 121 or Sirius 131. I honestly couldn’t give a rats behind about local news, same crap different day."

Of course, Fox News will tell you that the Democrats blew up the sun  .


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## skidog (Dec 2, 2004)

Of course, Fox News will tell you that the Democrats blew up the sun  .[/QUOTE]

Typical Democrats!!


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## zman977 (Nov 9, 2003)

Steve Mehs said:


> No terrestrial radio will not die, as
> 
> The problem is many are not scared. There are many broadcasters some of whom I work with who don't take satellite radio seriously, pardon the pun. I still hear quite a bit of, "people won't want to pay for radio." Well they said that about cable tv too and people were willing to pay.
> 
> ...


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## obrienaj (Apr 8, 2004)

One "danger" of Satellite Radio's multitude of music streams is the marginalizing of music. Corporate radio killed most of the innovative free-form stations in the 1980's (and college radio has also capitulated and become slaves of the record compaines that send them CDs). Satellite radio does have 2-3 channels per system (XM and Sirius) that take risks via the playing of innovative artists. However , in the old days a progressive station with a large audience coule "break" an innovative new artists. With satellite radio, the few channels that take risks (CBC Radio 3 for example) have such a small audience that they'll never "break" anyone.

Contrast this to BBC Radio One (Sirius 11) , they are perhaps the most listened to music related radio network in Europe via plain old VHF/FM signals. While they play mostly "pop" and "dance" music they "break" new artists frequently. The massive audience hears a new artist and a portion buy (download) the new music. That portion is enough to make a difference , but in satellite radio it is unlikely to be large enough to make any difference.
The Arctic Monkeys are a good example, BBC broke them in Europe last year. They are now on Left of Center's play list but I bet hardly anyone in the USA knows this.


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