# need quick answer before I call Dish



## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

I noticed awhile back my 222k would sometimes change channels by itself.

[ I should clarify, only happens on tv tuner #2]

It didn't happen often so I ignored it, figuring someone in the neighborhood was on the same channel set-up.

Well, today it has gone completely bat ****. Keeps going to 222 [ Home shopping channel, which is NOT on my fav list, so that's a NO. then it toggled a few times to 024, which is my local abc, So, still thinking Someone just had Dish installed and used the same channel set up as I've got, [ Oh yeah, I first did a soft re-set, didn't work] I re-set my modulator set up to a different channel. Then I did a hard re-boot.

If this was a modulator issue, that should have fixed it, I believe.

Well in about 90 seconds, it went back to same "222" HSN. It keeps filling in "222" while in the guide, as if someone was just pressing "222" over and over. Prior to the modulator reset, it would also scroll very fast through all the channels while in the guide.

Weird, huh?

Any suggestions before that painfull call to Dish?


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

You need to change your RF remote channel. Someone nearby (who apparently lives for HSN) is sharing their affliction with you.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Harsh, If you notice in my post I said I changed the "modulator" set up which is the "RF" channel.

I thought the same thing before I changed it.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

satcrazy said:


> Harsh, If you notice in my post I said I changed the "modulator" set up which is the "RF" channel.


The RF modulator has nothing to do with the RF remote code. Rather than assuming I had ignored what lengths you had gone to to address the issue, you should have taken my recommendation literally as something new to try.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

harsh said:


> The RF modulator has nothing to do with the RF remote code. Rather than assuming I had ignored what lengths you had gone to to address the issue, you should have taken my recommendation literally as something new to try.


OK, My bad. :blackeye:

I thought it was the same.

So, how do I change the remote code? I'm not sure of that procedure.

Appreciate your help, by the way.


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## Blueflash (Jan 16, 2009)

Look here http://www.mydish.com/support/change-remote-address


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Blueflash said:


> Look here http://www.mydish.com/support/change-remote-address


Thanks Blue, that was easy.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

satcrazy said:


> I thought it was the same.


The RF modulators determine what analog TV channels TV1 and TV2 are _transmitted_ on.

Remote commands are _received_ on a single radio frequency and identified by the remote ID code. If everybody in the neighborhood ran the remote same code, each remote can conceivably control them all.

Please let us know if our advice ultimately solves the problem as others (and www search engines) will refer people with the same problem to this thread.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

Right now it appears to be working properly.



thanks



Your first sentence is a bit confusing to me.

If your TV is digital, and the receiver is digital, where does the analog come in?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

It came from sending RF signals by your 222 modulator over coax to your other TV. Read Wiki about NTSC and 8VSB signals


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

P Smith has it right - The early dual tuner receivers had NTSC (AKA analog) modulators for sending the signal to remote TVs. Now - it's more a cost/ licensing of the technology issue - which is one reason the Hopper/Joey and the DTV Genie system came out. Hopper/Joey is basically using IPTV for communications. I'd imagine the same thing is true for the Genie.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

OK, to simplify [ for me] , the modulator [ tuner#2] is analog.

But what do you mean about the" cost/licensing of the technology" issue?


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

If you're wondering why Dish isn't using ATSC or Clear QAM for the modulators - it's probably MUCH cheaper to be using the analog (NTSC)


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

To be informed, dish made ATSC modulator (a cartridge ) for SD IRD 5000 many years ago.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

P Smith said:


> To be infirmed, dish made ATSC modulator (a cartridge ) for SD IRD 5000 many years ago.


Infirmed=ill

I thought the ATSC modulator was for the 6000 (that didn't feature a modulator), not the 5000. There would be little point to using an ATSC modulator with an SD receiver that already had an analog modulator.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

satcrazy said:


> But what do you mean about the" cost/licensing of the technology" issue?


The technologies involved in ATSC modulating are patented and the licenses to incorporate the technology is very expensive.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

harsh said:


> The technologies involved in ATSC modulating are patented and the licenses to incorporate the technology is very expensive.


BINGO !


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

P Smith said:


> To be informed, dish made ATSC modulator (a cartridge ) for SD IRD 5000 many years ago.





harsh said:


> Infirmed=ill
> 
> I thought the ATSC modulator was for the 6000 (that didn't feature a modulator), not the 5000. There would be little point to using an ATSC modulator with an SD receiver that already had an analog modulator.


grammar corrected
6000 had 8VSB and 8PSK cartridges


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## shadough (Dec 31, 2006)

To be even more accurate, its not TUNER-2 that's analog, its the TV-2 Coax output modulator that's analog. Not to mention also the RCA outputs are analog also. The dish SAT Tuners (1 & 2) are digital inputs. The only digital outputs are the HDMI and Fiber optic audio. (I miss any?). The TV-2 Coax output, aka 'the modulator', or NTSC modulator, whatever you want to call it, is sending SAT Tuner-2 to your distant TV (assuming your in dual mode). Now your distant TV may be a digital TV, but the signal coming from Dish's TV-2 output is still analog, thus eminent by the 'not as clear' picture quality as you get via the HDMI output on the local TV. And if your distant TV is digital, it must also have an analog tuner built into it in order to receive the signal from said TV-2 output.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

shadough said:


> To be even more accurate, its not TUNER-2 that's analog, its the TV-2 Coax output modulator that's analog. Not to mention also the RCA outputs are analog also. The dish SAT Tuners (1 & 2) are digital inputs. The only digital outputs are the HDMI and Fiber optic audio. (I miss any?). The TV-2 Coax output, aka 'the modulator', or NTSC modulator, whatever you want to call it, is sending * one channel from digital mux of SAT Tuner-2 * to your distant TV (assuming your in dual mode). Now your distant TV may be a digital TV, but the signal coming from Dish's TV-2 output is still analog, thus eminent by the 'not as clear' picture quality as you get via the HDMI output on the local TV. And if your distant TV is digital, it must also have an analog tuner built into it in order to receive the signal from said TV-2 output.


technically updated


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

shadough said:


> To be even more accurate, its not TUNER-2 that's analog, its the TV-2 Coax output modulator that's analog. Not to mention also the RCA outputs are analog also. The dish SAT Tuners (1 & 2) are digital inputs. The only digital outputs are the HDMI and Fiber optic audio. (I miss any?). The TV-2 Coax output, aka 'the modulator', or NTSC modulator, whatever you want to call it, is sending SAT Tuner-2 to your distant TV (assuming your in dual mode). Now your distant TV may be a digital TV, but the signal coming from Dish's TV-2 output is still analog, thus eminent by the 'not as clear' picture quality as you get via the HDMI output on the local TV. And if your distant TV is digital, it must also have an analog tuner built into it in order to receive the signal from said TV-2 output.


OK, so if the output modulator from tv2 was hdmi instead of coax, it would be digital, right?

Too bad the 222k tv2 modulator didn't have a component output, it would have a decent picture while by- passing the HDMI handshake issue.


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## shadough (Dec 31, 2006)

That's kind of why they came out w/ the Hopper/Joey: To get HD signal at multiple locations independently from just 1 rcvr. The VIP recvrs can only do HD at 1 location, SD at the other, for independent viewing. You can however do 'shared' HD viewing at multiple locations: 1 way would be w/ an HDMI splitter. Another (they way I did it), connect the "local" TV via Component video w/ audio, an connect the distant TV w/ HDMI. In my case I used a 50ft HDMI but you can also use cat5/cat6/coax and HD Baluns. But that would only be a 'shared view' of TV-1 at both locations.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

You could also do it with a component splitter, and that would probably have less DRM issues.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Modulators produce tunable TV channels. They don't provide line level analog or digital outputs.

Analog modulators expect to see analog inputs while ATSC modulators need to see digital video and audio streams. The problem with doing this in a consumer DVR is that digital rights management precludes sending out digital without some sort of copy protection.

I also want to remind everyone that the distribution output sends out both TV1 and TV2 in SD form, not just TV2.


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

harsh said:


> Modulators produce tunable TV channels. They don't provide line level analog or digital outputs.
> 
> Analog modulators expect to see analog inputs while ATSC modulators need to see digital video and audio streams. The problem with doing this in a consumer DVR is that digital rights management precludes sending out digital without some sort of copy protection.
> 
> I also want to remind everyone that the distribution output sends out both TV1 and TV2 in SD form, not just TV2.


Well, if TV 1 has multiple outputs, [ HDMI, and component] it must be a dual modulator then.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

No it doesn't. You have a digital HD signal, that is fed to both circuits at the same time ( the composite Video signal as well as the modulator input in addition to the HD outputs). The HDMI output keeps in the digital domain until the display device circuits do their thing, while the component outputs convert to analog audio and video, then to the display device.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

satcrazy said:


> Well, if TV 1 has multiple outputs, [ HDMI, and component] it must be a dual modulator then.


You need to completely disassociate video outputs with modulators. They are two different things.

Modulators send out encoded radio frequency signals, not video signals. If you feel the need to use a cool sounding term, use "rendering subsystem". The rendering subsystem decompresses and rasterizes the video stream and overlays still graphics and text on top.

Modulators aren't even available in DIRECTV's current receivers yet you can still get a picture on an appropriately connected TV (which sometimes takes a rather unique adapter cable).


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## satcrazy (Mar 16, 2011)

OK, I learned something.

When I was looking for a work around for tv 2 [ the rear RCA input on analog tv was faulty causing a bad picture] I started doing some reading and came up with a VCR as a pass through converter [ RCA in, composite out to TV] and it worked great. "Modulator" came up many times, but instead of researching that term I "assumed" [ yeah, I know] it let me pass audio/video signal, making it a [ audio/video] bridge.

After a quick search I see there are all kinds of modulators, IF, UHF, Digital , etc...

Thanks.


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