# Receiver Lost in Transit



## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

I've been a DirecTV subscriber for 4 years and have paid them over $6000 in subscription fees over that time, over $120 a month not including Sunday Ticket fees, etc. I'm dealing with an issue that is making me question staying with them. Wondering if this has happened to anyone else. I recently had a problem with one of my receivers and they sent me a new one to swap it out. Somehow the old one that I sent back disappeared somewhere in transit and now I have a $250 charge on my bill.

I packed the old receiver, remote, power cord in the box that the new one was sent in and attached the return shipping label. I dropped it off at a Postnet store that handles stuff for all the major shipping companies. Long story short the package disappeared and I have a tracking number that doesn't do me any good because nobody has record of it. I was told by D* that it's a FedEx tracking # but that the USPS handles the package. Neither of them have record of this. I dropped it off 2 weeks ago so this has to have been scanned in by now.

I called DirecTV and they said there is absolutely nothing they can do with the charge until the receiver is returned but I don't have it in my possession anymore and honestly have no idea where to track it down. I feel like I followed their instructions exactly and what happens after I drop it off is outside of my control. Has anyone had this happen and have you been able to get the charge taken off?


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## jdspencer (Nov 8, 2003)

Not sure what you can do, but I think that the tracking number you have is proof that you sent it. Maybe there is insurance on the unit. If the charge shows up on your credit card then dispute the charge.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

The tracking # is not really proof that I sent it in this case because it was included on the return shipping label that they included when they sent the new receiver. All I had to do was slap the label on the box and then send it. I guess I can't rule out theft because it's pretty obvious by the box what was in there. As far as I know it's not all that common for a package of this size to flat out be lost in shipping. The charge is on my D* account so it would only show up on my credit card if that's how I chose to make my payment. I'm not really sure what other grounds I have to dispute it other than saying that I followed their return instructions.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Try tracking it with the USPS tool. IIRC, FedEx handles it in the middle but not until they receive the package from USPS.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I packed the old receiver, remote, power cord in the box that the new one was sent in and attached the return shipping label. I dropped it off at a Postnet store that handles stuff for all the major shipping companies. Long story short the package disappeared and I have a tracking number that doesn't do me any good because nobody has record of it. I was told by D* that it's a FedEx tracking # but that the USPS handles the package. Neither of them have record of this. I dropped it off 2 weeks ago so this has to have been scanned in by now.


This is the problem with dropping off your package at a shipping agent such as a Postnet type operation. There is no guarantee that package made it in the system and not in the trunk of someones car. 
Having owned a business such as this for many years, I have heard many stories of this happening. My store had several cameras which were not only there for the protection of my employees but for the protection of my customers as well. Int he 7 years I owned the store, I never had a claim for a lost package.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

I've checked both and I've even made phone calls to both FedEx and USPS. They show no record of it. I would have assumed they would scan it when they pick it up from the Postnet store.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I've checked both and I've even made phone calls to both FedEx and USPS. They show no record of it. I would have assumed they would scan it when they pick it up from the Postnet store.


As fluffybear indirectly points out, this assumes that Postnet handed the package over to the appropriate carrier in the first place.

Perhaps your beef is with Postnet.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

fluffybear said:


> This is the problem with dropping off your package at a shipping agent such as a Postnet type operation. There is no guarantee that package made it in the system and not in the trunk of someones car.
> Having owned a business such as this for many years, I have heard many stories of this happening. My store had several cameras which were not only there for the protection of my employees but for the protection of my customers as well. Int he 7 years I owned the store, I never had a claim for a lost package.


I guess lesson learned. Theft is the only thing that makes any sense. I took it there simply because it was more convenient for me than the post office. Won't be doing that again. I guess I need to suck it up, pay the $250 and have the access card deactivated so the receiver comes off my account.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

harsh said:


> As fluffybear indirectly points out, this assumes that Postnet handed the package over to the appropriate carrier in the first place.
> 
> Perhaps your beef is with Postnet.


I agree and I will be heading over there after work. Not that they will be able to do anything but I feel I am owed some type of explanation.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I guess lesson learned. Theft is the only thing that makes any sense. I took it there simply because it was more convenient for me than the post office. Won't be doing that again. I guess I need to suck it up, pay the $250 and have the access card deactivated so the receiver comes off my account.


I would think that if you notify DirecTV of the situation that they could flag the receiver ID as being stolen and assure no one ever activates it again.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Did you get a receipt when you dropped it off?

I sent something to HP recently and made sure the FedEx store gave me a receipt.

A receipt would be proof of shipment and throw the onus of where is it onto the carrier.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

I was heading in a hurry on my way out of town on vacation and in my rush didn't think to ask for a receipt. I walked in with the box and the woman there asks me if it's all set. I say yes and she has me set it on the counter with some other packages waiting for pick up. In hindsight I realize it was stupid not to get a receipt.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

Always get packages scanned upon acceptance! Always. That way they can't come back and claim they never got it. You can point to the shipping carrier.

It sounds like the shipping method D* was using, was FedEX SmartPost. It is the cheapest, and slowest method to send bulk packages on a major corporate account. FedEX handles the packages in the up to the point where the package gets to its destination hub, then FedEX hands the package off to USPS for the final delivery. Packages can take weeks to make it coast-to-coast with this method. The "hand-off" from FedEX to USPS can take a week alone. They are in no rush because there is almost no money to be made with this service level.

Here is what I would do;
1.) Plug the tracking number into both USPS.com and FedEX.com and see if you get ANY results
2.) If not, head down to the Postnet. Ask to speak with the owner or the supervisor. Tell them when you were in the store (date and time) and exactly what happened. If you remember the employee who took the package, try to describe them.
3.) If Postnet refuses to do anything or they start arguing with you, tell them that you will be filing a small claims lawsuit for the cost of the receiver, court costs, service fees and tell them that you will be issuing a subpoena to obtain their surveillance videos from the date of the theft. Also mention to them that you will be filing a police report and pursuing criminal charges against the person who stole the unit. 
4.) When faced with the threat of the lawsuit and criminal charges, either 1 of 2 things will normally happen. A.) the receiver will magically show up (i.e it was stolen and sitting in a workers trunk) or B.) they will settle with you for $250 to make you go away


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

A google search on this issue turned up another thread on this site which has since been closed. After reading the 5 pages of posts and based on mini's post I realize this could still be in transit even though it has been 18 days since I dropped it off. I'll just keep checking the tracking #'s daily in addition to visiting Postnet and filing a complaint.

With this SmartPost method at which point should the tracking # show something? Would it not be until it gets to the destination hub?


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## Upstream (Jul 4, 2006)

The tracking number should show up within 24 hours of when PostNet turned the package over to the carrier.

I think you need to talk to PostNet.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

Happened to me a LONG time ago when I returned an HR10-250. They charged me $999 for it. Thank goodness I had my FedEx receipt!

Of course, they NEVER sent me the funds. They refused and credited my account for a grand. Said their systems were incapable of issuing a check refund.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> A google search on this issue turned up another thread on this site which has since been closed. After reading the 5 pages of posts and based on mini's post I realize this could still be in transit even though it has been 18 days since I dropped it off. I'll just keep checking the tracking #'s daily in addition to visiting Postnet and filing a complaint.
> 
> With this SmartPost method at which point should the tracking # show something? Would it not be until it gets to the destination hub?


SmartPost will show up in the FedEX system within 24 hours of acceptance. Sometimes it will not show up in the USPS system until 12-24 hours after delivery. If it was actually entered into the system, it would have already shown up. I'd be willing to bet one of the employees noticed what this was and the package "happened" to fall into his/her trunk and "happened" to be sold on ebay.
I would move on this ASAP. If you need to go the legal route, you need to obtain those surveillance tapes before they get destroyed or "go missing". I'd be willing to bet the proof was caught on tape.


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

TBoneit said:


> Did you get a receipt when you dropped it off?
> 
> I sent something to HP recently and made sure the FedEx store gave me a receipt.
> 
> A receipt would be proof of shipment and throw the onus of where is it onto the carrier.


The receipt is meaningless if the package gets lost and is not insured. Sure, it says it was shipped .... then lost .... but the shipper isn't going to pay for it without it being insured even though THEY lost it.

I learned that as a seller on eBay. I shipped almost 1000 packages in a 3 month period all by Priority mail with no insurance. 8 of them never got delivered (6 of them were tracked right up to "out for delivery" but never "delivered" - I know I PROBABLY got ripped off there - the other 2 just got lost along the way). Since they were not insured it was out of my pocket even with proof they were shipped.

Edit: This is referring to a self-shipment not a "return label" like DirecTV would send since it would be up to them to request insurance.


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## pallisers (Feb 17, 2011)

Upstream said:


> The tracking number should show up within 24 hours of when PostNet turned the package over to the carrier.
> 
> I think you need to talk to PostNet.


Absolutely. If no scan from FedEx, USPS, etc it never went anywhere.


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## blaqhauq (Dec 13, 2010)

Anytime you drop off a prepaid package the dropped center will give you a receipt showing you dropped the package off at their center and it is in their possession. You may have to ask for one if they don't ask if you want one. Then that protects you against anything like this from happening. Hopefully for you it shows up somewhere, and if not I would fight with D* for not insuring it for the value of the package.


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## blaqhauq (Dec 13, 2010)

I also never ship with USPS because they NEVER scan it even when you pay for tracking. I can't remember the last time a tracking number worked with USPS. Their rates are high, shipping is slow and they never use scan packages. So if you pay for tracking and insurance and the package is lost you're screwed cause they never scan the package. I had a package sent to me overnighted through USPS (pay check that Comcast didn't give the correct amount) and it set to arrive on Easter sunday. When it was dropped off on Monday the carrier told me to file a claim cause the Sunday guy just went home without delivering any packages. I told him I didn't think they worked on Sunday. He told me they only deliver overnighted packages on Sunday, holidays are no exception. They deliver ever Sunday. I ship only fed-ex. They are the cheapest and fastest. Usually gets there a day prior to the expected day of delivery.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

blaqhauq said:


> Anytime you drop off a prepaid package the dropped center will give you a receipt showing you dropped the package off at their center and it is in their possession.


Not necessarily true! A shipping center such as this Postnet is an independent company who accept these prepaid return packages as a convenience and are not obligated under any circumstances to give you a receipt of any kind. These packages are treated no differently than if someone dropped off an envelope with their gas bill in their (postnet) outgoing mail.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

mini1 said:


> 3.) If Postnet refuses to do anything or they start arguing with you, tell them that you will be filing a small claims lawsuit for the cost of the receiver, court costs, service fees and tell them that you will be issuing a subpoena to obtain their surveillance videos from the date of the theft. Also mention to them that you will be filing a police report and pursuing criminal charges against the person who stole the unit.


This assumes the package store has 'recorded' surveillance video.

This also assumes that you can prove you dropped off that specific package at that specific store. Don't get me wrong but if you have nothing but your own word that you did, I doubt you will get far.

When I owned my package store, I can not tell you how many times someone would come in screaming about something that happened to a package (damage, lost, etc.) and threatening me only to discover that they shipped the package at a different store.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I was heading in a hurry on my way out of town on vacation and in my rush didn't think to ask for a receipt. I walked in with the box and the woman there asks me if it's all set. I say yes and she has me set it on the counter with some other packages waiting for pick up. In hindsight I realize it was stupid not to get a receipt.


The store was under ZERO obligation to give you one. They accept these packages as a courtesy and is looked at as being no different then you dropping a envelope in their outgoing mail.

As a former package store owner, I would have never given you any kind of a receipt for a 'drop off' without you opening the box (directly in front of me) and showing me everything that was in that package, repackaging it (yourself) and then signing a statement to such. My giving you a receipt means I am assuming liability and I have no proof that what you claim is in the box, really is.

Your next call really should be to DirecTV (you may need to speak with a supervisor) and explain the situation and ask them what should be done. It may be necessary to file a police report in order to get the charge off your account. I believe DirecTV should have a way t flag a receiver ID as being stolen. If the unit ever turns up, DirecTV can provide the authorities with all the necessary information in order to possibly catch a thief.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

fluffybear said:


> The store was under ZERO obligation to give you one. They accept these packages as a courtesy and is looked at as being no different then you dropping a envelope in their outgoing mail.
> 
> As a former package store owner, I would have never given you any kind of a receipt for a 'drop off' without you opening the box (directly in front of me) and showing me everything that was in that package, repackaging it (yourself) and then signing a statement to such. My giving you a receipt means I am assuming liability and I have no proof that what you claim is in the box, really is.
> 
> Your next call really should be to DirecTV (you may need to speak with a supervisor) and explain the situation and ask them what should be done. It may be necessary to file a police report in order to get the charge off your account. I believe DirecTV should have a way t flag a receiver ID as being stolen. If the unit ever turns up, DirecTV can provide the authorities with all the necessary information in order to possibly catch a thief.


I've been on the phone with several CSR's and someone that I was told is a supervisor. They didn't really tell me what should be done just that I should keep tracking the package. Thanks for nothing. They are standing firm on not crediting the $250 until the receiver is actually received in their warehouse. If it's stolen does DirecTV have any way to see if that receiver is in use? I assume everything links to the access card which I have already deactivated.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

There's also the Receiver ID.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> If it's stolen does DirecTV have any way to see if that receiver is in use? I assume everything links to the access card which I have already deactivated.


You can not just plug an access card to any ol' receiver. DirecTV has to pair the receiver ID and access card together in order to receive DirecTV so I would have to assume the answer is Yes.

I would call back and ask if filing a police report would get that charge off your account. After all, you are risking possible jail time at that point if you lied and actually did not return it.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

fluffybear said:


> You can not just plug an access card to any ol' receiver. DirecTV has to pair the receiver ID and access card together in order to receive DirecTV so I would have to assume the answer is Yes.
> 
> I would call back and ask if filing a police report would get that charge off your account. After all, you are risking possible jail time at that point if you lied and actually did not return it.


A bit dramatic aren't we?


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> A bit dramatic aren't we?


No, If you file a police report knowing very well that you had not returned the receiver and then were to try and activate it at some point down the road or even worse trying to sell it, you would be guilty of filing a false police report (& possibly more) and could possibly face jail time.

By no means am I trying to insinuate anything but rather that if filing a police report becomes necessary that you may have better luck with DirecTV getting the charge removed since at that point you are putting your own neck on the line (in a manner of speaking)


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

fluffybear said:


> This assumes the package store has 'recorded' surveillance video.
> 
> This also assumes that you can prove you dropped off that specific package at that specific store. Don't get me wrong but if you have nothing but your own word that you did, I doubt you will get far.


He will never know if the store had recorded surveillance, if he doesn't make a bold move.....like today. The more time that passes, the lower the chance of anything being recovered or proven.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

mini1 said:


> He will never know if the store had recorded surveillance, if he doesn't make a bold move.....like today. The more time that passes, the lower the chance of anything being recovered or proven.


It never hurts to go in and ask to speak with the manager or owner and question about surveillance video. It would not shock me to discover this place did not have cameras or that they are not pointed at the package area.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

Exactly why I drop receivers off at FedEx/Kinkos. I get a receipt and proof that I shipped it.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

At the end of the day I'm not going to lose sleep over $250. In the grand scheme it's not that big of a deal. It's mostly just frustrating that they use a shipping method for their returns that involves unnecessary handoffs (USPS --> Fed Ex or vice versa). The CSR I talked to said he has seen this happen on rare occasions before and weeks or months later they find that it is just sitting at a post office waiting for Fed Ex to pick it up. It doesn't sound like there is much communication between the 2 parties. I'm going to to go Postnet when I have a chance since that is the last place I know my package to have been. Because of their hours and the fact that it's not close to my work it's not easy for me to get there before they close. It will probably have to wait until the weekend. All I want is an explanation from a manager. If they have cameras they can check then great but I'm not going to make this into something bigger than it is.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> At the end of the day I'm not going to lose sleep over $250. In the grand scheme it's not that big of a deal. It's mostly just frustrating that they use a shipping method for their returns that involves unnecessary handoffs (USPS --> Fed Ex or vice versa). The CSR I talked to said he has seen this happen on rare occasions before and weeks or months later they find that it is just sitting at a post office waiting for Fed Ex to pick it up. It doesn't sound like there is much communication between the 2 parties. I'm going to to go Postnet when I have a chance since that is the last place I know my package to have been. Because of their hours and the fact that it's not close to my work it's not easy for me to get there before they close. It will probably have to wait until the weekend. All I want is an explanation from a manager. If they have cameras they can check then great but I'm not going to make this into something bigger than it is.


I guess if you are OK with letting someone get away with theft and ripping you off for $250, then you can let it slide. I sure wouldn't wait. I would have been right on top of the situation demanding that the parties' responsible pay up. Its not your problem they stole or lost the package. You should not have to pay a cent for that receiver. Why loose $250? I know that I do not pay for others mistakes, ever..... that is my policy. I have threatened and actually filed small claims suits for less money then you lost and guess what? I always win. Don't walk away from your money unless you are a multi-millionaire trust fund baby.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

OK so I walk in there, talk to the manager and accuse one of their employees of stealing my package. He asks what proof I have when in actuality I don't and it's only an accusation. You say you would be demanding that the responsible parties but there is no way for me to tell who that is. For all I know this could be sitting at the post office. Should I go to Postnet, USPS and Fed Ex and demand the $250? As fluffybear pointed out Postnet simply provides a service as a dropoff site. I work in commercial lines insurance and they really don't have any liability in this situation unless I can prove that someone stole it.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> OK so I walk in there, talk to the manager and accuse one of their employees of stealing my package. He asks what proof I have when in actuality I don't and it's only an accusation. You say you would be demanding that the responsible parties but there is no way for me to tell who that is. For all I know this could be sitting at the post office. Should I go to Postnet, USPS and Fed Ex and demand the $250? As fluffybear pointed out Postnet simply provides a service as a dropoff site. I work in commercial lines insurance and they really don't have any liability in this situation unless I can prove that someone stole it.


You don't need to prove a thing to get the ball rolling. As I said before, start off nice. Tell them what happened. See if they can do anything. Look for cameras. I don't know of many stores that don't have cameras. You can buy a recording night camera system for under $900 now.
If they don't do anything, then step it up a notch. Just the threat of a lawsuit or subpoena is normally enough to either have 1.) them magically find the package 2.) work all their contacts in FedEX/USPS to have them find the package 3.) start reviewing their own tapes to see who stole it. 
Most likely you won't have to take ANY legal action all. The receiver will turn up. No need to prove a thing. And those tapes, if they exist, would be your proof that not only were you there and dropped off a package, but it would also show who stole it or maybe that it was loaded on a FedEX truck. You WILL NOT know until you start investigating.


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## Chris Blount (Jun 22, 2001)

If you can't recover the receiver, there is one simple way to get your money back. Place your DirecTV account on hold for a few months and pocket the money. Sure, you don't get service for a few months but at least you have the satisfaction of not giving DirecTV any more money than what they should have.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

mini1 said:


> You don't need to prove a thing to get the ball rolling. As I said before, start off nice. Tell them what happened. See if they can do anything. Look for cameras. I don't know of many stores that don't have cameras. You can buy a recording night camera system for under $900 now.
> If they don't do anything, then step it up a notch. Just the threat of a lawsuit or subpoena is normally enough to either have 1.) them magically find the package 2.) work all their contacts in FedEX/USPS to have them find the package 3.) start reviewing their own tapes to see who stole it.
> Most likely you won't have to take ANY legal action all. The receiver will turn up. No need to prove a thing. And those tapes, if they exist, would be your proof that not only were you there and dropped off a package, but it would also show who stole it or maybe that it was loaded on a FedEX truck. You WILL NOT know until you start investigating.


While some places may have cameras (unlike you, I don't know of many smaller operations that do) that does not mean it is being recorded or stored for any period of time. When I had my store, we only kept 7 days worth of recordings at a time.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

Chris Blount said:


> If you can't recover the receiver, there is one simple way to get your money back. Place your DirecTV account on hold for a few months and pocket the money. Sure, you don't get service for a few months but at least you have the satisfaction of not giving DirecTV any more money than what they should have.


Haha that certainly is an interesting way to look at it. There was a part of me that out of spite wanted to switch providers but the fact is as a huge soccer fan DirecTV is the only one that has everything I need. None of the other providers have both Fox Soccer and Fox Soccer+ in HD, even if the latter is only a part time channel for the live Premier League games. That's not to mention the exclusive they have for all of the Champions League games.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

Another thing to do is make sure DIRECTV has disabled the receiver from your account. If it has been stolen and not lost in the mail, someone could possibly be using the receiver on your account.

This would also flag it should anyone else try to activate it.

Good luck,
Tom


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## JoeTheDragon (Jul 21, 2008)

IlliniOne82 said:


> OK so I walk in there, talk to the manager and accuse one of their employees of stealing my package. He asks what proof I have when in actuality I don't and it's only an accusation. You say you would be demanding that the responsible parties but there is no way for me to tell who that is. For all I know this could be sitting at the post office. Should I go to Postnet, USPS and Fed Ex and demand the $250? As fluffybear pointed out Postnet simply provides a service as a dropoff site. I work in commercial lines insurance and they really don't have any liability in this situation unless I can prove that someone stole it.


UPS and Fed Ex push to many packets though there systems so from time to time stuff can get beat up / fall off belts and get lost.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

Tom Robertson said:


> Another thing to do is make sure DIRECTV has disabled the receiver from your account. If it has been stolen and not lost in the mail, someone could possibly be using the receiver on your account.
> 
> This would also flag it should anyone else try to activate it.
> 
> ...


Already did this yesterday. They deactivated the access card and credited back the monthly fee that had been charged for the receiver.


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## WestDC (Feb 9, 2008)

I use UPS Drop off all the time as well as fed-Ex (Amazon returns) are all generated online -When I drop off my package (just like the OP) They check it in. I did this very thing this AM-I got home (Don't have a smart phone) you could check from your phone-I go to the ups web and look up the tracking number and it says "The shipment has been dropped off and is now at a UPS Retail Location". That being said when I use the post office -I get all the paper they will give me!!!


The UPS person hasn't even showed up to gather the total pick-up today. All you really need to do is wait for the person you handed the package off to to scan it and your good to go.

Since your tracking number has never showed up then your only recourse is to follow theadvice above and ...talk with the manager of the place you dropped it off.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

I just returned from Postnet where I spoke to the owner. They don't have security cameras on site. The postal service guy happened to be there picking up packages so he explained where it _should_ have gone. Here is what I found out.

1) Postnet will scan items at their store for UPS and FedEx packages but not for packages that are being picked up by USPS.

2) The USPS driver that picks it up from Postnet takes it to the local post office where it's loaded on a semi and taken to their sort facility in Bedford Park, just outside of Chicago. He said that is where the first scan should have taken place. I guess my next step is to call the sort facility and see if it's there.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I just returned from Postnet where I spoke to the owner. They don't have security cameras on site. The postal service guy happened to be there picking up packages so he explained where it _should_ have gone. Here is what I found out.
> 
> 1) Postnet will scan items at their store for UPS and FedEx packages but not for packages that are being picked up by USPS.
> 
> 2) The USPS driver that picks it up from Postnet takes it to the local post office where it's loaded on a semi and taken to their sort facility in Bedford Park, just outside of Chicago. He said that is where the first scan should have taken place. I guess my next step is to call the sort facility and see if it's there.


Did you physically look for security cameras? He could be lying to cover himself.

SmartPost is a FedEX service until the point where it reaches the delivery destination hub. Your next step is to find out why it was not scanned at PostNet, as this should have been treated as a FedEX package. Then find out where the FedEX packages go after they are picked up.


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## brett1198 (Jun 16, 2007)

Call 1-800-ASK-USPS and file a lost mail report and give them the scan #'s, description of box/receiver and serial #of the receiver in case box was damaged at the post office. USPS hands off the box to Fed-Ex, who do the final shipping, so you might have to do the same with Fed-Ex.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

mini1 said:


> Did you physically look for security cameras? He could be lying to cover himself.
> 
> SmartPost is a FedEX service until the point where it reaches the delivery destination hub. Your next step is to find out why it was not scanned at PostNet, as this should have been treated as a FedEX package. Then find out where the FedEX packages go after they are picked up.


Man I hope I never become as cynical as you. I was in there for a solid 15 minutes and I didn't see a single camera. It turns out the person that I left the package with is the store owner (woman in her late 50's/early 60's). I've been in there several times and the only other employees I've seen fit that same description. Maybe I'm being naive but I have a hard time believing that one of them stole my receiver.

It's not a FedEx package in the beginning of the process. I looked up the SmartPost info on the FedEx website and it is picked up from the point of origin by USPS.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

brett1198 said:


> Call 1-800-ASK-USPS and file a lost mail report and give them the scan #'s, description of box/receiver and serial #of the receiver in case box was damaged at the post office. USPS hands off the box to Fed-Ex, who do the final shipping, so you might have to do the same with Fed-Ex.


I called their # and I can not get to the point where I speak with a person. If I hit 0 to talk to someone it first makes me select the purpose of my call from their list. I selected track a package thinking that once I put in the tracking # and it doesn't find it, it would give me the option to speak to customer service. Nope, it just says to either hang up or begin a new search.


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## dcandmc (Sep 24, 2008)

mini1 said:


> SmartPost is a FedEX service until the point where it reaches the delivery destination hub. Your next step is to find out why it was not scanned at PostNet, as this should have been treated as a FedEX package. Then find out where the FedEX packages go after they are picked up.


The OP is correct when he says that this is not treated as a FedEx package until USPS hands it over to FedEx.

There have been multiple threads on this issue, primarily concerning the lack of tracking ability during part of the shipment process, since DirecTV began using this hybrid return process. I have personally returned at least two receivers to DirecTV using this process, dropping off both at my local post office. The first time the package was not scanned nor I was given a receipt, and I didn't think much of it. The tracking number never worked in the USPS tracking system, and it didn't show up in the FedEx system until many days later. The second time, after getting educated by reading of others experiences in this forum, I asked for a receipt from the postal clerk. I was told that no receipt was available at drop off using this shipping method. I later read of someone else reporting a similar experience, and when he demanded that the clerk scan the package, the system read the bar code and provided a receipt, apparently to the surprise of the clerk.

Bottom line: either this system puts the customer at risk when returning a receiver (as the OP has learned), or clerks/shipping agents at drop off locations are not adequately trained on how the system works and they are therefore unable or unwilling to provide the customer with a receipt showing proof of drop off.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

dcandmc said:


> The OP is correct when he says that this is not treated as a FedEx package until USPS hands it over to FedEx.
> 
> There have been multiple threads on this issue, primarily concerning the lack of tracking ability during part of the shipment process, since DirecTV began using this hybrid return process. I have personally returned at least two receivers to DirecTV using this process, dropping off both at my local post office. The first time the package was not scanned nor I was given a receipt, and I didn't think much of it. The tracking number never worked in the USPS tracking system, and it didn't show up in the FedEx system until many days later. The second time, after getting educated by reading of others experiences in this forum, I asked for a receipt from the postal clerk. I was told that no receipt was available at drop off using this shipping method. I later read of someone else reporting a similar experience, and when he demanded that the clerk scan the package, the system read the bar code and provided a receipt, apparently to the surprise of the clerk.
> 
> Bottom line: either this system puts the customer at risk when returning a receiver (as the OP has learned), or clerks/shipping agents at drop off locations are not adequately trained on how the system works and they are therefore unable or unwilling to provide the customer with a receipt showing proof of drop off.


When you say the tracking # didn't show up in the the FedEx system until many days later, are you talking a week or more? I'm now at 20 calendar days since I dropped it off. I assume yours wasn't that long?


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

dcandmc said:


> The OP is correct when he says that this is not treated as a FedEx package until USPS hands it over to FedEx.


It depends on the service level. There is "FedEX SmartPost Returns" and "FedEX SmartPost". The first is handled by USPS at the beginning, the last is handled by FedEX until it hits the destination hub. The OP needs to determine which service level this was sent by. They need to rename the service FedEX DumbPost. I have also encountered long delays with this service. They should discontinue the service of fix the hand-off delays.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

At this point I'm just tired of dealing with it. I have filed a lost package claim with USPS and Fed Ex has not been helpful at all. In fact when I e-mailed them they responded that a Smart Post delivery has a tracking # that is either 21 or 22 digits while mine only has 20. I also gave them an order # because it seems like that would feed into their system as soon as DirecTV sent out the recovery kit. They completely dismissed that part of my question and just gave me the links to track my package.

The owner at Postnet said they see the DirecTV packages on a somewhat frequent basis and they are always picked up by USPS.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> At this point I'm just tired of dealing with it. I have filed a lost package claim with USPS and Fed Ex has not been helpful at all. In fact when I e-mailed them they responded that a Smart Post delivery has a tracking # that is either 21 or 22 digits while mine only has 20. I also gave them an order # because it seems like that would feed into their system as soon as DirecTV sent out the recovery kit. They completely dismissed that part of my question and just gave me the links to track my package.
> 
> The owner at Postnet said they see the DirecTV packages on a somewhat frequent basis and they are always picked up by USPS.


Find out where the carrier for USPS takes the packages, either a Postal Annex or a sorting hub. You may find your package there. Don't expect either company to help you until you start becoming pushy and demanding and asking to speak with supervisors. Are you 100% sure that DirecTV didn't purchase insurance on this package? If it even shows up once in the tracking system, then they could claim insurance.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

mini1 said:


> Find out where the carrier for USPS takes the packages, either a Postal Annex or a sorting hub. You may find your package there. Don't expect either company to help you until you start becoming pushy and demanding and asking to speak with supervisors. Are you 100% sure that DirecTV didn't purchase insurance on this package? If it even shows up once in the tracking system, then they could claim insurance.


When I went to Postnet last night the guy from the postal service happened to be there at the same time. He said this should have gone through the sorting facility in Bedford Park, IL. I called them and didn't get anywhere.


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## mini1 (Jan 25, 2004)

IlliniOne82 said:


> When I went to Postnet last night the guy from the postal service happened to be there at the same time. He said this should have gone through the sorting facility in Bedford Park, IL. I called them and didn't get anywhere.


Show up in person. These sorting places normally have a front office. I have been to a few. When you show up in person, they actually spend the time to help you. I have tracked down packages this way.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

mini1 said:


> Show up in person. These sorting places normally have a front office. I have been to a few. When you show up in person, they actually spend the time to help you. I have tracked down packages this way.


When I put in the lost package claim they said I would be contacted within 2 business days. I'll see what response I get from that then I will think about going there in person. It's almost an hour drive each way from where I live so hopefully I can get it resolved before that.


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## t_h (Mar 7, 2008)

IlliniOne82 said:


> a tracking # that is either 21 or 22 digits while mine only has 20.


Funny because I'm having the exact same issue, although minus the Postnet component. I handed the receiver to my post office letter carrier, who happened to pull up just as I was going out to take it to the post office. That was on the 11th or 12th, and Directv says they dont have it and charged me $250 plus $18 tax.

Same thing as you from Directv, "Its our policy and we cant change it".

Called the post office, they said they dont keep packages around so its not still there being held, and that everything gets scanned when it comes in, then its put in a room for the fed-ex pickup. Apparently it either never made it from the letter carriers delivery truck into the building, it made it into the building but wasnt scanned and/or wasnt put into the fed ex system, or directv got it and put it somewhere other than where they should have. One of the directv guys said they should have put another sticker on it and given me a slip back with the new smartpost tracking number, but all I have is the same 20 digit number you got, on the 'keeper' sticker that was below the directv return label.

Pretty annoying all in all. My responsibility should end when I hand off the package. Its in their box, with their label, and I did everything the instructions said I should do, the failure happened after that.

The receiver is useless to anyone, including myself, because it cant be activated or used without Directv's help. Used 4 year old HR20's that wont boot have pretty much no value. And I can buy a brand new HR24 for $170, so where the hell is the $250+tax coming from? And why am I being charged sales tax for a policy fee where nothing was actually sold to me?

I wish I was well off enough to just suck up a $250 fee, but I'm not. And its not right.

Directv is great until you stumble over one of these customer policy land mines. I agree there should be an incentive for the customer to return broken equipment and receivers when the customer cancels.

I guess what really sticks in my craw is that I've been living with these two super slow HR20's for years now, that they replaced the broken one with a refurbished HR21 thats even slower, and for the $280 'fee' and the $200-250 I've paid for the protection plan, I could have bought two new HR24's and still had money in my pocket.

Let me know how yours turns out, and I'll let you know how mine goes. I have a call into the post office and they're 'investigating', and I wrote an email to the Directv VP of customer service who allegedly can fix some of these silly problems.


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## MadMac (Feb 18, 2008)

t_h said:


> My responsibility should end when I hand off the package. Its in their box, with their label, and I did everything the instructions said I should do, the failure happened after that.


Exactly. You've returned it via their designated shipping method. It's no longer your problem. Refuse to pay any charge, dispute it via any available means.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

t_h said:


> Funny because I'm having the exact same issue, although minus the Postnet component. I handed the receiver to my post office letter carrier, who happened to pull up just as I was going out to take it to the post office. That was on the 11th or 12th, and Directv says they dont have it and charged me $250 plus $18 tax.
> 
> Same thing as you from Directv, "Its our policy and we cant change it".
> 
> ...


I'm sorry you are having to deal with this but I guess it's some consolation to know that someone else understands my frustration. I will definitely let you know of any progress I make. What was the e-mail address that you wrote to? If you and I have this problem I'm sure there are others.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I'm sorry you are having to deal with this but I guess it's some consolation to know that someone else understands my frustration. I will definitely let you know of any progress I make. What was the e-mail address that you wrote to? If you and I have this problem I'm sure there are others.


I've probably returned more HRs than anyone on this forum. Never lost one. I have a drawer full of documentation that is gonna sit there forever.

After D* began this nonsense about handing off the package to USPS and then to FedEx and then to God knows who, I came to a conclusion: You want the HR back, send a truck out to pick it up and install the replacement. Have the installer or tech fill out his paperwork and include the RID number and access card number of the returning HR on the paperwork and keep the pink slip as proof of his taking the bad HR. Demand that this process be followed. I haven't used that USPS-FedEx-??? system for a long time and I've gotten a truck to my home every time I've requested it with no hassles.

There's a lesson to be learned from this thread: Don't trust the USPS-FedEx-??? method. Do you really think this process is customer friendly? Or is it possible that, once again, D* is taking the cheapest, least reliable path? I don't know the TS but he seems like a person who has a sense of honor. I do know and trust *t_h* and if he's having a problem, I'd go with my solution.

To the TS: That package is probably lost in USPS-FedEx-??? land and you might or might not see it go to the proper place over time. Then the question becomes, will D* notify you? I would like to think they would, but I wouldn't bet my home on it. They don't notify you when you return an HR by any means as soon as they receive it, so you're never really certain that they've got it. When they used to use FedEx all the way, I never worried about it, but with this new way of returning them, I'd rather have a D* guy pick it up.

Biting the bullet and just paying for it? Probably what I'd do too and then cancel enough of my services to make up for it. But in this economy, I really don't think many people would pay it without a fight and if you don't have the proper paperwork, you're just not gonna win.

Bottom line, make them send out a truck to pick it up.

Rich


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

Unfortunately I didn't realize how convoluted this process was until the package was out of my possession. If I knew this would happen I would have gladly paid to send it FedEx overnight where I could track it from the moment I dropped it off. As far as I was concerned I attached their return label, dropped it off, no worries. I guess at this point it wouldn't surprise me if all of a sudden this thing just shows up weeks from now.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

You don't have to pay anything extra. I drop mine off at FedEx/Kinkos and get a receipt.


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## dcandmc (Sep 24, 2008)

IlliniOne82 said:


> When you say the tracking # didn't show up in the the FedEx system until many days later, are you talking a week or more? I'm now at 20 calendar days since I dropped it off. I assume yours wasn't that long?


You're right, it wasn't 20 days before it showed up in the FedEx tracking system, probably more like a week.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

IlliniOne82 said:


> Unfortunately I didn't realize how convoluted this process was until the package was out of my possession. If I knew this would happen I would have gladly paid to send it FedEx overnight where I could track it from the moment I dropped it off. As far as I was concerned I attached their return label, dropped it off, no worries. I guess at this point it wouldn't surprise me if all of a sudden this thing just shows up weeks from now.


Yeah, bummer. I hope this works out so that it isn't too expensive a lesson for you.

Cheers,
Tom


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## dcandmc (Sep 24, 2008)

Hoosier205 said:


> You don't have to pay anything extra. I drop mine off at FedEx/Kinkos and get a receipt.


That would be great, if DirecTV provided a dropoff at FedEx/Kinkos as an option. Under this return program (which, I understand, may not be in use everywhere), here are the return options as per DirecTV's written instructions:

1. Give the package to your USPS letter carrier;

or

2. Drop off the package at any Post Office;

or

3. Request a Free Package Pickup from your Postal letter carrier at www.usps.com/pickup.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

IlliniOne82 said:


> Unfortunately I didn't realize how convoluted this process was until the package was out of my possession. If I knew this would happen I would have gladly paid to send it FedEx overnight where I could track it from the moment I dropped it off. As far as I was concerned I attached their return label, dropped it off, no worries. I guess at this point it wouldn't surprise me if all of a sudden this thing just shows up weeks from now.


It might well do that. Will you be notified? That's what I'd like to know. I've never received any notification that they've received one that I sent back by FedEx or USPS.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

dcandmc said:


> That would be great, if DirecTV provided a dropoff at FedEx/Kinkos as an option. Under this return program (which, I understand, may not be in use everywhere), here are the return options as per DirecTV's written instructions:
> 
> 1. Give the package to your USPS letter carrier;
> 
> ...


That's my understanding too. I watched my postman scan the package right after I handed it to him one of the last times I used that method.

Rich


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

dcandmc said:


> That would be great, if DirecTV provided a dropoff at FedEx/Kinkos as an option. Under this return program (which, I understand, may not be in use everywhere), here are the return options as per DirecTV's written instructions:
> 
> 1. Give the package to your USPS letter carrier;
> 
> ...


I'm not sure of the specifics, but that is where I always drop off. I get a receipt and I have nothing to worry about.


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## dcandmc (Sep 24, 2008)

Hoosier205 said:


> I'm not sure of the specifics, but that is where I always drop off. I get a receipt and I have nothing to worry about.


It sounds like DirecTV isn't using the "FedEx SmartPost Returns" program in your area, or at least they weren't when you last returned a receiver. Before they started using the program where I am, everything was done strictly through FedEx, and I did exactly what you described above. Sadly, that is no longer an option for me (and many others).


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## dcandmc (Sep 24, 2008)

rich584 said:


> That's my understanding too. I watched my postman scan the package right after I handed it to him one of the last times I used that method.
> 
> Rich


You apparently have an educated postman. Did you get a receipt?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

dcandmc said:


> You apparently have an educated postman. Did you get a receipt?


No, but it came up using the USPS tracking number right away. Well, same day. I still wouldn't use the mailing method, I'll stick with having a D* person pick up the bad one and watch me install the replacement. Then, if there's a problem it will get fixed immediately. I've been paying for the PP since day one, might as well use it.

Rich


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

MadMac said:


> Exactly. You've returned it via their designated shipping method. It's no longer your problem. Refuse to pay any charge, dispute it via any available means.


The problem with that approach is with no receipt you can't prove it was ever sent.

So it remains the senders problem unfortunately.


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## Hoosier205 (Sep 3, 2007)

dcandmc said:


> It sounds like DirecTV isn't using the "FedEx SmartPost Returns" program in your area, or at least they weren't when you last returned a receiver. Before they started using the program where I am, everything was done strictly through FedEx, and I did exactly what you described above. Sadly, that is no longer an option for me (and many others).


They are. The shipping labels I have used are SmartPost. One of the numbers on the tag, although not labeled, is a FedEx tracking number. That's how they scan it in. Anyone can get a receipt to use as proof that it was shipped. I consider it to be my responsibility to take the initiative to cover my own rear end.


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## t_h (Mar 7, 2008)

MadMac said:


> Exactly. You've returned it via their designated shipping method. It's no longer your problem. Refuse to pay any charge, dispute it via any available means.


I was advised that the 'customer agreement', which everyone implicitly agrees with unless they read it every time it changes and terminate their service if you dont, says that you are responsible for it until directv receives it and acknowledges acceptance.

Directv has several of these policies, and its likely that most customers would be happy fanboys if they never ran across one. Like a Directv employee telling you something or that you'd get something, only to find out after installation or getting new receivers that it wasnt correct. You're stuck with paying an etf or sucking it. Or this case where the USPS vaporizes a package and even though you followed all the Directv instructions and its a combination of their hokey lease program and the hokey multi-carrier return process that created the opportunity for failure...you're stuck with the bill.

If I were to refuse the charges, Directv would cancel my account anyhow.

I'm particularly stuffed because Dish network isnt an option for me, and both Comcast and Tivo's cable dvr's are too expensive on a monthly basis, which leaves me with windows media center and a $300 cablecard tuner.



IlliniOne82 said:


> What was the e-mail address that you wrote to? If you and I have this problem I'm sure there are others.


It was [email protected] who used to be the vp of customer service for directv. I didnt know she was no longer with directv when I sent the email, although I see several long time posters here still recommending to send email to her. I dont know if Directv is looking at her email still or if it went into another bit bucket.

The supervisor I spoke to yesterday gave me this address to send a snail mail to, but quickly assured me that NOBODY in the entirety of directv could remove this charge, even if they wanted to. Like the people who were mistakenly entered into a 2 year contract on a receiver replacement, the system does not allow for changes to these charges. At least so she said.

Directv Inc.

PO Box 6550
Greenwood Village CO 80155-6550

I also see this link, but dont know if it'll actually go anywhere useful. But I'm going to try it! [Edit: Interesting...when I filled this in and sent it, I got a message "Thank you for your email correspondence to Ellen Filipiak. DIRECTV's Customer Advocate team will contact you within 24 hours to resolve your concerns. Use this reference number for follow up"

More Ellen Filipiak...

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIFnorail.jsp?assetId=P4960016#h:561.437



rich584 said:


> I've probably returned more HRs than anyone on this forum. Never lost one. I have a drawer full of documentation that is gonna sit there forever.


You're a smarter, better organized guy than I am. I foolishly presume that people will just do their jobs, especially when the letter carrier has a box in his truck...and it had to go somewhere!



> You want the HR back, send a truck out to pick it up and install the replacement.


I didnt know they'd do that, and it wasnt given as an option to me. I tried that when I pulled the plug on Dish Network and they said I'd have to pay for a service call for that.



> Do you really think this process is customer friendly? Or is it possible that, once again, D* is taking the cheapest, least reliable path? I don't know the TS but he seems like a person who has a sense of honor. I do know and trust *t_h* and if he's having a problem, I'd go with my solution.


Thanks Rich. The process isnt customer friendly, but when you've got the customer by the cojones because most of them are in a contract with an ETF and probably few customers run across this sort of screwup, then you can keep marching to the beat and figure you're doing great.

Removing the customer service agents abilities to fix exceptions when they arise is the part where it got really stupid. The supervisor admitted that she believed I gave the receiver to the USPS, she just cant do anything about it.

What really ticks me off is they just gave me Sunday Ticket for $100, just before the guy told me about the $280 charge on my account.


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## dcandmc (Sep 24, 2008)

Hoosier205 said:


> Anyone can get a receipt to use as proof that it was shipped.


Anyone can _ask_ for a receipt to use as proof that it was shipped. My experience, corroborated by others on this forum, is that a postal clerk may or may not oblige your request.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

Hoosier205 said:


> They are. The shipping labels I have used are SmartPost. One of the numbers on the tag, although not labeled, is a FedEx tracking number. That's how they scan it in. Anyone can get a receipt to use as proof that it was shipped. I consider it to be my responsibility to take the initiative to cover my own rear end.


Two things on this. 1) Based on comments in this thread it seems like it's very hit or miss on whether they know that they can scan and give you a receipt with this shipping method. 2) In general it seems like there is very little communication between FedEx and USPS on how this process should work. I have spoken to multiple people on both sides and I get a different message each time.


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## t_h (Mar 7, 2008)

t_h said:


> It was [email protected] who used to be the vp of customer service for directv. I didnt know she was no longer with directv when I sent the email, although I see several long time posters here still recommending to send email to her. I dont know if Directv is looking at her email still or if it went into another bit bucket.
> 
> I also see this link, but dont know if it'll actually go anywhere useful. But I'm going to try it! [Edit: Interesting...when I filled this in and sent it, I got a message "Thank you for your email correspondence to Ellen Filipiak. DIRECTV's Customer Advocate team will contact you within 24 hours to resolve your concerns. Use this reference number for follow up"
> 
> ...


One of those worked. I just got a call from the office of the president. Very nice lady who said it looked like I'd done everything I could have, and noting that the receiver wasnt something they'd probably use anyhow. She said a credit should apply to my account within 72 hours to offset the charges.

Next time I'll try seeing if they can send a truck, if not I'll take it to the USPS directly and get a receipt.


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## fluffybear (Jun 19, 2004)

Hoosier205 said:


> Anyone can get a receipt to use as proof that it was shipped. I consider it to be my responsibility to take the initiative to cover my own rear end.


That is of course that you are dropping the package off at a location which has the ability to scan it in. In the case of the OP, he dropped his package off at a Postnet store & sadly, CMRA's do not have the capability to scan it in to the system and give you any kind of official receipt.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

t_h said:


> One of those worked. I just got a call from the office of the president. Very nice lady who said it looked like I'd done everything I could have, and noting that the receiver wasnt something they'd probably use anyhow. She said a credit should apply to my account within 72 hours to offset the charges.
> 
> Next time I'll try seeing if they can send a truck, if not I'll take it to the USPS directly and get a receipt.


I received a similar call yesterday saying that the charge was applied to my account in error and that a credit would be applied.


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## t_h (Mar 7, 2008)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I received a similar call yesterday saying that the charge was applied to my account in error and that a credit would be applied.


Great, I'm glad both of us got this resolved.

What might also have happened was that it was rattling around the USPS, Fed Ex or Directv and they finally got around to delivering it or scanning it into the system. Given that the shipping method Directv chose may take a week or more to ship, I've heard that it may take up to a week before Fed Ex even picks it up at the USPS, and I suspect it may be more than a few days before Directv opens the box and checks it in...maybe they might want to wait more than 2 weeks before charging the box cost to our accounts.

It'd also be nice if customer service could resolve this sort of exception without resorting to the customer getting upset and calling into the office of the president...this represents the 3rd time in 3 years I had to jump through hoops and contact multiple departments at directv to get a fairly simple matter resolved. :nono:

The USPS never called me back after taking all my information. They said they'd talk to the letter carrier and find out what happened. Either that takes 3 days, or they dropped the ball. Next time I'll ask for a truck roll or bring it directly to the post office and make sure they give me a receipt.


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## IlliniOne82 (Aug 30, 2008)

t_h said:


> Great, I'm glad both of us got this resolved.
> 
> What might also have happened was that it was rattling around the USPS, Fed Ex or Directv and they finally got around to delivering it or scanning it into the system. Given that the shipping method Directv chose may take a week or more to ship, I've heard that it may take up to a week before Fed Ex even picks it up at the USPS, and I suspect it may be more than a few days before Directv opens the box and checks it in...maybe they might want to wait more than 2 weeks before charging the box cost to our accounts.
> 
> ...


If I have to send one of these back again I'm going to insist that either they have a tech come out to physically pick it or up or at least give me a prepaid shipping label for FedEx overnight instead of this SmartPost. With that it would be scanned the minute I drop it off and I could see where it goes from there.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

IlliniOne82 said:


> I received a similar call yesterday saying that the charge was applied to my account in error and that a credit would be applied.


Congratulations on a battle well fought.


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## admdata (Apr 22, 2011)

I had a similar thing happen to me (as in my sig), my account was canceled on 7/7 and I get a charge on 7/8 for 2 receivers! The box wasn't shipped till 7/7 via fedex, and I sent it back via smartpost on 7/8, and yes they did reverse the charges, but good grief!!!!


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## pallisers (Feb 17, 2011)

Now, we can stop beating this dead horse.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

pallisers said:


> Now, we can stop beating this dead horse.


The mods can handle that choice or you could choose to not read the thread.


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## Robert L (Dec 13, 2005)

So, just wondering if the receivers HAS to go back using their way only. Why can't someone just ship it UPS ground (or Fedex ground) and pay the shipping. It wouldn't be very much really. The Directv label could be put in the box or still on the outside of the box, because UPS only goes by their label. It would get delivered I'm sure and have to be signed for. 

I got HR20-700 that should go back but I just never got around to it, but I hate anything that uses Smartpost. I've run into that before with incoming packages.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Robert L said:


> So, just wondering if the receivers HAS to go back using their way only. Why can't someone just ship it UPS ground (or Fedex ground) and pay the shipping. It wouldn't be very much really. The Directv label could be put in the box or still on the outside of the box, because UPS only goes by their label. It would get delivered I'm sure and have to be signed for.
> 
> I got HR20-700 that should go back but I just never got around to it, but I hate anything that uses Smartpost. I've run into that before with incoming packages.


Be at least $15 unless you live in CA. Not that much, true, but I'm beginning to see to many posts by folks hurting in this economy to spend that much just because D* chooses to use a method that I'd never even heard of.

Let them come out and pick it up. Have your dish aligned while the guy's there. They want it bad enough to threaten people over something that is not our fault, let them send someone to pick it up. And keep the pink copy with the RID number and the access card number written on it by the guy that picks it up.

Rich


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## joe diamond (Feb 28, 2007)

pallisers said:


> Now, we can stop beating this dead horse.


NOT YET,

How about all the thousands of lost boxes Directv subcontractors have been back charged for?

These boxes are in service or have been deactivated as newer eq has been installed. The boxes were lost by incompetent employees and the charges were passed on to installers.

Any installers still out there with bogus lost eq charges? One box is a walk in the park. While I am glad this one got sorted....this is an old budget balancing ploy.

Joe


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

joe diamond said:


> NOT YET,
> 
> How about all the thousands of lost boxes Directv subcontractors have been back charged for?
> 
> ...


So, this is a wide spread problem, Joe? Am I incorrect in forcing a truck to roll to my home to pick up bad HRs and check the replacement to make sure it works? I've never had a problem with a lost HR and I've kept the documents that contain the old HR's RID # and access card # along with the installer/tech employee name and number and the date it was received by the installer/tech.

Rich


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## joe diamond (Feb 28, 2007)

rich584 said:


> So, this is a wide spread problem, Joe? Am I incorrect in forcing a truck to roll to my home to pick up bad HRs and check the replacement to make sure it works? I've never had a problem with a lost HR and I've kept the documents that contain the old HR's RID # and access card # along with the installer/tech employee name and number and the date it was received by the installer/tech.
> 
> Rich


You are doing it correctly. As shown above, customers are forced to prove a negative; the the box was shipped and they did not keep it.

The Directv position is that since it is not showing in their system you are still responsible for it.

It is the middle part that causes the problems. Scanning errors, misdirected deliveries, loading dock theft and fraud all get mixed together. Since installers handle many more boxes each month it is the installers, as independent subcontractors, who get dinged for this. I can't comment on how wide spread it is.......I saw a bunch from HSP inventory problems.

Joe


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## billsharpe (Jan 25, 2007)

rich584 said:


> So, this is a wide spread problem, Joe? Am I incorrect in forcing a truck to roll to my home to pick up bad HRs and check the replacement to make sure it works? I've never had a problem with a lost HR and I've kept the documents that contain the old HR's RID # and access card # along with the installer/tech employee name and number and the date it was received by the installer/tech.
> 
> Rich


Your approach didn't work for me. Tech took my defective DVR, but apparently didn't get the unit back into the system before DirecTV charged me for a non-returned unit. It took about three months to get the bill straightened out.

DirecTV also charged me for a truck roll, but the receipt I got from the tech didn't mention any charges. I eventually got that reversed too.


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## joe diamond (Feb 28, 2007)

billsharpe said:


> Your approach didn't work for me. Tech took my defective DVR, but apparently didn't get the unit back into the system before DirecTV charged me for a non-returned unit. It took about three months to get the bill straightened out.
> 
> DirecTV also charged me for a truck roll, but the receipt I got from the tech didn't mention any charges. I eventually got that reversed too.


There you go,

The tech probably turned in the box with his paperwork at the end of the day. Or it could have ridden around in his truck for a day or two. At some point it would have been listed as defective and sent for further inspection or trashed. In the meantime other wheels are turning and your account gets hit.

Glad it got sorted.

Joe


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## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

rich584 said:


> So, this is a wide spread problem, Joe? Am I incorrect in forcing a truck to roll to my home to pick up bad HRs and check the replacement to make sure it works? I've never had a problem with a lost HR and I've kept the documents that contain the old HR's RID # and access card # along with the installer/tech employee name and number and the date it was received by the installer/tech.
> 
> Rich


If the tech does the swap, then by all means he should take the old one back. If done correctly, as soon has the transaction is complete, it gets moved from your account to his (or his warehouses) inventory.

What I don't recommend is sending any other boxes back with the tech that he did not shut off. Any boxes that you shut off, D* is expecting them to go back via the recovery kit. Granted, they end up at the same place...eventually, but there will be issues in the mean time.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

joe diamond said:


> You are doing it correctly. As shown above, customers are forced to prove a negative; the the box was shipped and they did not keep it.
> 
> The Directv position is that since it is not showing in their system you are still responsible for it.
> 
> ...


Thanx Joe, that makes me feel better.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

billsharpe said:


> Your approach didn't work for me. Tech took my defective DVR, but apparently didn't get the unit back into the system before DirecTV charged me for a non-returned unit. It took about three months to get the bill straightened out.
> 
> DirecTV also charged me for a truck roll, but the receipt I got from the tech didn't mention any charges. I eventually got that reversed too.


Bill, if you have documentation provided by a representative that states the RID number and access card number and the date he took it, along with the work order receipt, I don't see how D* could blame you for anything. If their representatives, the installers and the techs, can't be held responsible for the returned HR or any other device, how can D* allow them to renew our two year commitments when we sign the work order at the time we receive new equipment? The signed work order works one way, but not the other?

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

RobertE said:


> If the tech does the swap, then by all means he should take the old one back. If done correctly, as soon has the transaction is complete, it gets moved from your account to his (or his warehouses) inventory.
> 
> What I don't recommend is sending any other boxes back with the tech that he did not shut off. Any boxes that you shut off, D* is expecting them to go back via the recovery kit. Granted, they end up at the same place...eventually, but there will be issues in the mean time.


Every time I've done it, the tech has deactivated the old receiver before leaving my home. I've had to insist that they do that on a couple occasions and they did it right in front of me. I also have them activate the new box and then I call the access card folks, if it's an owned receiver that's being returned and make sure they have the new one listed as owned. All with the tech standing next to me.

Rich


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## t_h (Mar 7, 2008)

I had a credit show up on my account yesterday, said equipment was returned. Now I dont know if the office of the president fixed it or if the box was actually found and scanned.

Of course, the majority of this stuff could be resolved by Directv giving a little more grace time before making the charge, because I think a percentage of the time they get the box within 5-7 days of charging the customer for it. They charged me 21 days from the day when they sent me the replacement box. Smartpost could easily take at least 2 weeks to ship. Directv taking responsibility for chasing down the shipment rather than putting that burden on the customer would also be a good idea. After all, its their receiver in their box with their label shipped by their method.

I considered an option such as sending it UPS on my own dime the next time it happens. Besides costing me about $20 to send, from what the USPS told me a significant portion of their smartpost business is directv box returns. They all get picked up and dropped off together. So my UPS shipment might not go to the 'big room' where all the directv boxes are delivered and scanned. At least I'd have proof it arrived at Directv's premises. The lease agreement says I have to return it to direct, but all the customer service people I spoke with said it didnt count until it was scanned as received into their system.

Too much opportunity for goof ups, just different ones.

Sounds like the truck return method isnt foolproof either, although I'd feel better saying "I have a document that says your box was picked up by your contractor" rather than "I have a receipt from the post office that says they took the box in for shipment".

I think the best option would be for them to pretty much write off the box after the 2 year commitment is over. Send the customer a box to ship it back if its broken or the customer stops service. I'd imagine most people would rather drop it in the box and send it back and for those who dont...well, its an old box that needs refurbishing. Who cares if you dont get it back? These boxes cost around $150 to build, they get $100-200 for them up front, then $7 a month for 2-4 years. I think thats enough.

Rethink the non-return fees too. $250 is waaaaayyyy too much for an old broken box. Make it $50. Then people have a motivation to return it, but if it gets lost or they forget or some other stupid thing happens, Directv gets paid, the customer probably wont make a big stink over $50, and you're done with it. Shoot, people will take a shopping cart back to the store to get a quarter.


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