# BUG Report: Transparent Blue vertical lines visible



## smooth28la

I am getting 4 giant blue vertical lines that are visible against dark backgrounds, It happens while viewing the guide/using the menu AND on any SD/HD channels.
It does not happen when using analog outputs on SVHS (I don't have DVI) 

I didn't have such problem when the same TV input/cable are used with the 6000 receiver.

I'm not sure if it's a software or hardware problem but they are NOT visible during the initial silver Dish/HD logo... due to the fact that the DISH logo is grey and lacking in color.

The first pic is via SVHS ouput.
Second pic is the same image using component.. the blue lines are very visible during dark scenes.
The 3rd pic shows less visible blue lines but still annoying during brighter scenes
The 4th pic is that famous distorted picture from the movie The Ring!!! (kinda of ironic with that extra distortion huh?


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## strykerakamack

smooth28la said:


> I am getting 4 giant blue vertical lines that are visible against dark backgrounds. It happens while viewing the guide/using the menu AND on any SD/HD channels.
> 
> I'm not sure if it's a software or hardware problem but they are NOT visible during the initial silver Dish/HD logo.


 What type of connection and Quality of cable are you using ?
Usually problem is video cable is picking up interference on way to TV .Reroute cable or upgrade cables .I just upgraded to a HDTV and when I first turned on the set I got vertical bands .no matter what I did . When I upgraded to High Quality video cables the bands went away.


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## smooth28la

strykerakamack said:


> What type of connection and Quality of cable are you using ?
> Usually problem is video cable is picking up interference on way to TV .Reroute cable or upgrade cables .I just upgraded to a HDTV and when I first turned on the set I got vertical bands .no matter what I did . When I upgraded to High Quality video cables the bands went away.


I'm using the DISH-provided cable.

The thing is, when the silver DISH HDTV logo came up, the blue vertical lines aren't there.

They are only visible when watching TV and nagivating within menu's


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## Mark Lamutt

Can you describe the lines in a little more detail? Are they fat or thin, do they move or are they static? Where on the screen are they? And have you made sure that your component cable is firmly plugged in on both the 921 and your tv/receiver/whatever?


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## kls

I can see the same blue lines, I never noticed them until I was actually looking for them. They are the most visable with 480P for me but they are there with 720P and 1080i as well. They aren't there with my 6000... I only see it with the component inputs. I don't see it with composite or svid. In 480P I can see 10+ blue lines, all verticle.
For the record I'm using a Toshiba 51H83 tv

Same software/flash versions as everyone else - L142


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## strykerakamack

Sounds like interference .Time for a cable upgrade http://www.partsexpress.com
Is a good place to pickup some quality cables at a reasonable price .


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## Mark Lamutt

Or at the very least, run down to your local Best Buy and pick up a set of Acoustic Research component cables for $25 and try those. If they don't solve the problem, just take them back.


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## kls

I understand cables can make a large difference but I've tried 3 different sets of cables(the ones included with the 6000, the ones included with the 921 and another good quality set of component cables) and again I see no such lines with my 6000 using the same cables.


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## Mark Lamutt

Are your cables connected directly to the television, or are they running through a switch or receiver? There's something going on here certainly, but I've been working with my 921 for the last 8 hours straight doing testing, and have not been able to see any vertical blue lines, no matter what I've done.


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## kls

The cables are connected directly from the 921 to the TV, I've also tried various power sources - with and without my UPS. I'll have a DVI cable to try next week. Seriously though turn the output of your 921 to 480P and then pop up the search screen(or any other screen with the usual green background) and then go sit a foot from your TV and look for the lines.(and no I don't sit a foot from my TV, I just moved that close to look for them)


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## Mark Lamutt

I just gave that a shot, and either the lines are there and my eyes can't see them, or they're not present on mine.


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## Mr5150

I mentioned the same thing in the DVR thread with little response. Running direct to TV with gold plated AR cables. NOT a prob w/ my 6000...


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## howdydoody

I have hooked up two of my three 921's so far and have noticed this blue line issue on both using a variety of cables and direct hookup to the displays (two different displays Panasonic plasma and Sony direct view 910). This is not a cable problem. It is a bug.


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## Mark Lamutt

Do one of you have a digital camera that could take a picture of what you're seeing? If so, please size it to about 640x480 and post in this thread.


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## smooth28la

Mark Lamutt said:


> Do one of you have a digital camera that could take a picture of what you're seeing? If so, please size it to about 640x480 and post in this thread.


So we have 3 people experiencing the same situation!

It's definitely a HARDWARE problem since only 3 of us have the same problem.


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## kls

Mark,

I have a digital camera but I don't think it will pickup the blue lines, they move somewhat and aren't as bright as the rest of the picture for me. I did do somemore testing and found they only occur on the component outputs. I received my DVI cable today and the difference between DVI and component is night&day. I also don't see the blue lines using composite or svid. Its also most pronounced using 480P.
The picture difference between DVI and component is so huge I almost wonder if the component outs on my 921 are defective, or somehow just don't play "nice" with my Toshiba TV. I did talk to a salesguy at a local place and they told me to bring the 921 in and compare the picture on various TVS. If I do that I'll report back.


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## tgerrish

I have had my 921 for a few days now, and I am seeing the "4 giant blue vertical lines that are visible against dark backgrounds" as well. 

921 info:
Boot Version: 120B
Flash Version: F051
SW Version: L142HECD-N

I have tried a few different component video cables (some short, some long, all pretty good quality) and I see these lines with all cables. I am also using a Sony 65" XBR2 HDTV. I really doubt that this is cable-related.


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## Mr5150

kls said:


> Mark,
> 
> I Its also most pronounced using 480P.


That's interesting...Mine shows mostly at 1080i. Using a 55" RP Mitsubishi.

It also shows more with color and contrast up higher.


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## Ronald K

I am using the YPrPb outputs and also have 4 vertical blue lines when the screen goes black when going from a commercial back to programming.

There is another unusual thing happening since the 921 has been installed: I have a Key Digital 8x3 flash matrix switcher sending my HD/DVD signals to other HDTVs. The inputs are changing on their own without my influence. If by example the 921 is on input #1 and I am watching the 921 on all three TVs via input #1, about every half hour one or more of the outputs mysteriously are switched to a different input.

This has never happened before.


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## jled5087

smooth28la said:


> I am getting 4 giant blue vertical lines that are visible against dark backgrounds, It happens while viewing the guide/using the menu AND on any SD/HD channels.
> It does not happen when using analog outputs on SVHS (I don't have DVI)
> 
> I'm not sure if it's a software or hardware problem but they are NOT visible during the initial silver Dish/HD logo... due to the fact that the DISH logo is grey and lacking in color.


Same issue here. Not a problem with my 6000 and I'm using the same cables I was using w/ the 6000. Also tried switching to the cables that came with the 921 - lines are still there. I've had my 6000 for over 2 years and never had a problem. I've had the 921 for 3 days and I just noticed it tonight. I think the reason is for the first couple of days I was mostly testing with discovery HD and a local OTA loop most of which were bright outdoor scenes. As smooth pointed out the lines are more noticeable in dark scenes with some bright contrast. First noticed it while watching "Ghost Ship" from an HBO HD recording. I have about five pairs of transparent blue lines running vertically through the entire screen. Some scenes they aren't even noticeable, other scenes (the darker ones, which in this case was much of the movie) were quite noticeable and very distracting. I don't have the problem in the menus (as far as I can tell) or the Dish boot logo and I haven't noticed it on any live HD. Although I just finshed the movie and went straight to this forum, it was that bad. I'll be watching a little closer now. The strange part about the Ghost Ship recording is that as soon as the credits started to roll (black screen with white letters) the lines were gone. This was not what I was expecting as througout the movie the darker the screen, the more visible the verticle blue lines. Strange!

I can live with the OTA issues for the moment, but for $1000 I can't live with lines running through all my HD movies - particularly since this seems like more of a hardware issue.

If anyone discovers a solution, please post. I'm going to try more cables first and then, as much as it pains me, I'll have to return the 921 to the dealer.

For compartive purposes I'm running the Dish supplied component cables out to a Mits 65" RPTV @ 1080i. I don't have any SD outputs attached and rarely watch anything other than HD or DVD on this setup.

Jeff


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## jled5087

Forgot to mention that I am connected direct to the TV; I would agree this seems like a hardware problem.


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## smooth28la

jled5087 said:


> The strange part about the Ghost Ship recording is that as soon as the credits started to roll (black screen with white letters) the lines were gone. This was not what I was expecting as througout the movie the darker the screen, the more visible the verticle blue lines. Strange!
> 
> Jeff


It's not strange at all. The credits and the dish logo's have no color in them.. that's why there's no color smearing or the blue lines.


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## Mark Lamutt

I'm really beginning to think there's a problem with your component blue outputs on your 921s. I sympathize, even though I don't see the problem on mine. But the developers are watching, and I'll see if they have anything to say about it tomorrow morning.


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## smooth28la

More pic's from the movie The Crow !


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## smooth28la

For testing, I disconnected the blue input (the middle input) and only leaving 2 of the component cables connected, the blue lines disappeared!

Of course the pic wouldn't be the right color with just two cable connections.

Definitely something wrong with the blue component output of the 921 !


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## kls

My blue lines aren't that bad, I don't think I can see them during a movie, just when the guide is running or any of the other greenish screens like the search screen. There is certainly something wrong with the component outs on the 921 though - perhaps there are a collection of defective ones. I'm thinking more likely its a design issue though and it varies IRD to IRD and some TVs are more sensitive to it then others. Atleast I have a super clean picture using the DVI cable I just got. With the DVI cable I can honestly say the picture is better then my 6000 has ever provided.


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## jled5087

kls said:


> My blue lines aren't that bad, I don't think I can see them during a movie, just when the guide is running or any of the other greenish screens like the search screen. There is certainly something wrong with the component outs on the 921 though - perhaps there are a collection of defective ones. I'm thinking more likely its a design issue though and it varies IRD to IRD and some TVs are more sensitive to it then others. Atleast I have a super clean picture using the DVI cable I just got. With the DVI cable I can honestly say the picture is better then my 6000 has ever provided.


Hmm, I'd like to try the DVI output, but I only have component in on the TV. I do have an 19" LCD w/ DVI in for my computer. Maybe a dumb question but shouldn't I be able to use this as the display for testing purposes?

After a very long wait for the 921 this is very frustrating. I was happy with the unit for all of 3 days before this issue reared it's head.

Thanks for the input.

Mark, I''d really be interestes to see what, if anything, the developers have to say. It doesn't seem like this would be a hard issue to duplicate judging by the number of people that seem to be noticing it.


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## DonLandis

Two things to try I haven't seen posted yet-

1. Simplify your setup-
Disconnect all connections except the component to your monitor and the 2 sat cables to the 921. Have the only connection to your monitor be the 921. This means everything, including the cable to antenna or your cable TV. AND, make sure your monitor and 921 are plugged into the same AC receptacle for common ground point. Do this for the test at least, even if you have to run an extension cord.

Did the problem go away? Look for ground loops and hot or AC floating on the shields of the component cables. Solution- common grounding for both the 921 and the monitor.

2. Test the RGBHV if you can. You will need a DVI-I breakout cable on the 921 and possibly a computer monitor (VGA input). In a chain of signal processing the video is first D/A to RGBHV and then encoded to the composite, Y/C and Y, Pr, Pb signals on the analog side. If the RGBHV looks good then it is most likely something malfunctioning in your Y, R-Y, B-Y encoder. 

You might also look to see if your monitor has settings for Href adjustment Fast / Slow sync but I doubt that is it. I'm betting this is a failure of the color difference encoder in the 921 or some AC floating on the shields of the component cables due to long path grounds.


The reason why some may experience this while others will not is some monitors do not use good AC isolation in the grounding of their chassis. Don't know why this never showed up on the 6000 though if you have ACfloating on your cable shields.


One more thought but this is highly unlikely. Sometimes having two monitors, especially those with high voltage sections near each other will interfere and cause this symptom. Even a small TV set sitting on top of the big one can do this. WE run into this all the time in edit suites when non-engineers get creative and sit a TV set radiating all sorts of RF from the horizontal oscillator next to the edit monitor and then complain about those vertical bars in the picture. 

OK, that's all my thoughts on this for now!


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## Mr5150

Definitely the same lines I get, but mine are barely noticeable when color and contrast are set properly. It does seem like a ground prob to me as well. No prob with the 6000. The lines also seem to "modulate" in pairs becoming closer and further apart for any given pair (7 pairs, like yours) ....crazy stuff. Thanks for the pix...great job.

UPDATE: I just tried plugging both into same source, no change. I'll try removing everything else (OTA) tomorrow. It is MUCH worse w/ contrast and color up. Almost invisible when set correctly for my TV.


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## jled5087

Thanks Don, I'll try that tomorrow. 

5150 - mine are in pairs as well. As far as color/contrast my set has been professionally calibrated so it's not noticeable for the majority of my viewing, but in those certain dark scenes / dark movies it's maddening! Again in over two years in two houses I never had a single problem with the 6000 (other than the 747 engine they called the 8VSB fan)


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## Mark Lamutt

Great pics! That definitely lets me see what you guys are talking about.

I have a little news for you this morning. The developers are working on isolating the problem. They need to know exactly what model televisions everyone with this problem has. Even if you have already posted it in this thread, please post it again in a new message that just lists the tv model, nothing else.


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## smooth28la

DonLandis said:


> Two things to try I haven't seen posted yet-
> 
> 2. Test the RGBHV if you can. You will need a DVI-I breakout cable on the 921 and possibly a computer monitor (VGA input). In a chain of signal processing the video is first D/A to RGBHV and then encoded to the composite, Y/C and Y, Pr, Pb signals on the analog side. If the RGBHV looks good then it is most likely something malfunctioning in your Y, R-Y, B-Y encoder.


I can't try this but as I stated earlier, the problem isn't there if I use an analog S-video out... and the problem goes away if I unplug the blue component cable (leaving the 2 other attached).

Conclusion: Faulty blue component out !

My TV is Mitsubishi 55" Widescreen Rear-Projection HDTV Monitor with 2-Tuner Picture-In-Picture - Gray

Model: WS-55313

Bought a year ago at Bestbuy


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## Mark Lamutt

One more question from me: Are any of you in the Denver area that are having this problem?


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## Mr5150

Mitsu 55" WS 55411 
Updated to reflect accurate mode #


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## tgerrish

Mark Lamutt said:


> One more question from me: Are any of you in the Denver area that are having this problem?


I am in Massachusetts.

Also, Don's prior suggestion to check for a ground problem was a good idea, but all of my devices (monitor, 921, power inserter for SW64, etc.) are plugged into the same line conditioner.

I have also run 2 new RG-6 lines from my SW64 to the 921, using the shortest lengths possible, but I still see these blue lines.

I am still thinking about what else I might try at my end, but this is really looking like a 921 hardware issue...


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## smooth28la

tgerrish said:


> I am in Massachusetts.
> 
> Also, Don's prior suggestion to check for a ground problem was a good idea, but all of my devices (monitor, 921, power inserter for SW64, etc.) are plugged into the same line conditioner.
> 
> I have also run 2 new RG-6 lines from my SW64 to the 921, using the shortest lengths possible, but I still see these blue lines.
> 
> I am still thinking about what else I might try at my end, but this is really looking like a 921 hardware issue...


Another thing we can try is to disconnect EVERYTHING except the 3 component cables... I'm sure the problem is still there when playing back the recorded content without the satellite connected.


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## tgerrish

smooth28la said:


> Another thing we can try is to disconnect EVERYTHING except the 3 component cables... I'm sure the problem is still there when playing back the recorded content without the satellite connected.


One thing that I just thought of trying was changing the setting on the Transparent Guide in the viewer preference screen. Currently I have the "Transparency" set to "Medium", but I wonder if setting this to either "Off" or "High" makes any difference?

(I'm at work now but plan to try this tonight...)


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## Ronald K

Mits 73711

I haven't check the Fuji p50 yet. I will do that tonight.


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## smooth28la

That's 3 Mitsubishi TV's so far!

Hm... it CAN'T be the TV's fault... The 6000 or my DVHS VCR didn't have such problem now or before!

I have a RCA HDTV 38" Directview TV and a Sony overhead front projector as well.. I'll unhook my 921 tonite and connect to it to see what happens tonight.


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## Mark Lamutt

I certainly think it's a 921 hardware problem at this point, but the developers have asked me to compile the television data.


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## kls

Toshiba 51H83


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## tgerrish

Mark Lamutt said:


> I certainly think it's a 921 hardware problem at this point, but the developers have asked me to compile the television data.


Sony KDP-65XBR2

(All other component video devices OK including Sony DVP-CX777ES & DVP-NS700P DVD players).


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## peterd

Pioneer PDP-502 Plasma fed via Vigatec Dune scaler. High quality cables, and the Panasonic DST-50 previously hooked to this input shows no such problems.


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## smooth28la

Another question is... I got my 921 just last week.. and today marks the one-month availability of the 921.

How is that no one else has the problem until I posted this message last Friday?

Could it be that the latest batch has such problem or is everyone else using the DVI connection?


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## Mr5150

smooth28la said:


> Another question is... I got my 921 just last week.. and today marks the one-month availability of the 921.
> 
> How is that no one else has the problem until I posted this message last Friday?
> 
> Could it be that the latest batch has such problem or is everyone else using the DVI connection?


Look at similar threads below...I posted 1-8-04. Wrong spot I guess. I got my 921 on 12-30-03.


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## frozenpenguin

Maybe people need to post if their TV's absolutely do NOT have this problem as well?


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## Ronald K

I just checked the Mits 73711, Fujitsu P50 and a Samsung 1775w LCD for the blue lines.

Using the KD switcher, I froze a dark image and simultaneously compared the three TVs. The Mits was by far the worst it had about 11 obvious vertical blue lines. The Fuji did not have the blue lines but had what I would describe as smeared vertical pixelation with the pixels being blue, but no where with the same intensity as the Mits. There was only a very slight pixelation on the Samsung which I had to really look closely to see.

Interestingly, the Fuji also had in the extreme upper left hand corner a 3x3 grouping of white pixels that appear as a 1/8 inch dia. white dot that varies in brightness. The dot is not on the Mits or the Samsung. The Dot disappears when the guide is put on the screen and returns for both sat and OTA channels. 

I also notice faint hum bars which means that the 921 has introduced a ground loop into my system. I do not have an extra 3 prong to 2 prong adapter to put on the 921. I will pick up one tomorrow to see what kind of impact it has on the bars and the blue lines.


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## jled5087

smooth28la said:


> That's 3 Mitsubishi TV's so far!
> 
> Hm... it CAN'T be the TV's fault... The 6000 or my DVHS VCR didn't have such problem now or before!


Add another Mits to the mix: 65" RPTV model 65819, again over two years with the 6000 and never had any image problems.


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## Matt Stevens

I saw the blue lines on a 73 inch Mitsubishi last night. I do not own this setup. It belongs to a friend. He's not a member here so I asked him to sign up. No idea if he will. Hehas called E* support.

Yikes. Looks like the 921 may have a serious compatibility problem with many types of Component inputs. Hope there is an easy fix.


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## smooth28la

I got my second 921 yesterday. In the few hours I've played with it, I've also noticed the problem.. though less pronounced than my first one.

Maybe it's pointless to exchange the receiver at this point.


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## BarryO

frozenpenguin said:


> Maybe people need to post if their TV's absolutely do NOT have this problem as well?


Yes, is there anyone definitely NOT seeing this on the component outputs?

I'm bummed; I have a 921 sitting at home waiting for me to hook it up, and now it sounds like there is a hardware problem that wrecks the PQ. 

I suppose a workaround would be to use the RGB signals on the DVI-I output into something like an Audio Authority 9A60, but I'd rather not spend the >$100 (this assumes the RGB doesn't have this problem).


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## Mark Lamutt

I am definitely not seeing this problem via component out. But, mine came from a batch before yours did.


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## MattG

I'm definitely not seeing it on my sony 36" wega xbr component in. I played with the brightness, contrast, 480p/i 1080i, and I didn't see a trace of blue vertical lines.


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## kls

Mark,

Has Dish had anything to say regarding the blue lines yet? It can't be that tough for them to recreate the issue at this point. Should we also be comparing to see how close the IRD #'s are of the "blue light special" units.


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## smooth28la

kls said:


> Mark,
> 
> Has Dish had anything to say regarding the blue lines yet? It can't be that tough for them to recreate the issue at this point. Should we also be comparing to see how close the IRD #'s are of the "blue light special" units.


Both of my 921's have the blue line problem. Their IRD serial number's have the following in common:

R0059416xxx
R0059494xxx

I haven't gone through a good one yet.. so I don't know what's a good serial number.


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## Allen Noland

I have a Mitsu WS 65809 and it has the problem. Woudn't have even know it was a problem except for this thread. But now that I know, I see them every now and then.


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## Mr5150

After messing some more, brightness and contrast seem to have much less to do with it than the color setting. I had the color up higher than usual to compensate for a poor non HD Dish feed when I noticed it for the first time. At normal settings, I rarely notice it on the Mitsubishi 55". I'm definitely going to wait awhile before I think about returning it. Aren't these covered under warranty as long as you're are a Dish customer or is someone steering me down a garden path? 5150


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## peterd

smooth28la said:


> I got my second 921 yesterday.


I was wondering who would be the first to own two!


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## Ronald K

I also have moving horizontal blue lines on my screen.

I thought that they were hum bars from a ground loop but last night I put a 3 prong to 2 prong adapter on the 921 and it had no effect.


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## smooth28la

Ronald K said:


> I also have moving horizontal blue lines on my screen.
> 
> I thought that they were hum bars from a ground loop but last night I put a 3 prong to 2 prong adapter on the 921 and it had no effect.


Do you mean vertical.. not horizontal?


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## Ronald K

I also have the vertical lines everyone is talking about but these lines are horizontal that move vertically.


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## BarryO

No blue lines on mine so far. I didn't get a chance to call Dish last night to activate it, so this is only based on the channels you can see for free, and the guide pages.

I'm using the Dish-supplied component cables (which look pretty good), connected to one input of an Inday RGB4X-R switcher, going to a Philips 64PH9905 TV.

BTW I popped the cover off the unit (engineers can't resist doing this with new toys  ). FWIW the component jacks sit very close to the input filter magnetics of the power supply, although why this should affect only the Pb output, and only in some installations, I haven't a clue...


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## Scott Greczkowski

I just got a note from my 921 contacts, who request you to email them ASAP if you are having this problem. Please email 921 [email protected]

(Please only email that address for this specific problem, thanks!)


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## Mark Lamutt

And an added note - please include your name and contact information in your email - someone from Dish will likely be contacting you about it.


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## MattG

Originally I didn't think my 921 had the blue line problem but I actually saw it today and I took a picture of it. For me they're not too noticable but I see them in very dark pictures or pictures with a solid blue background (see attachments). I have a Sony 36" Wega XBR and the lines aren't nearly as noticable as some of the pictures that have been posted to this thread. The blue lines are tolerable for me but this appears to be a problem not just for Mitsubishi TVs. Hopefully this can be fixed in software otherwise E* is going have their hands full exchanging 921s.


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## Mark Lamutt

Matt - it won't be fixed in software. It's not a software problem. Please contact Dish through the above email address. They will contact you about swapping out your 921 for a new one that doesn't have this problem.


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## MattG

Mark Lamutt said:


> Matt - it won't be fixed in software. It's not a software problem. Please contact Dish through the above email address. They will contact you about swapping out your 921 for a new one that doesn't have this problem.


Thanks Mark,

I sent an email last night to productelevation so hopefully I'll hear from them today. Too bad it's a hardware problem.

Matt


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## BarryO

I spent several hours last night watching the 921 in a totally dark room; I can't see any blue lines (whew!), so it must just be some units.

This is my first DVR, and may be the unhealthiest thing I ever bought -- I can now get up from the couch and get a beer anytime I want!


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## conner65

I have the same problem. This is my second 921 and it looks just like the pictures posted. I have a Sony G90CRT.


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## jled5087

Mark Lamutt said:


> Matt - it won't be fixed in software. It's not a software problem. Please contact Dish through the above email address. They will contact you about swapping out your 921 for a new one that doesn't have this problem.


Mark,

I hope you're right. I sent them an email three days ago and have yet to receive a response. I resent a duplicate tonight, but for $1000 and what seems to be an acknowledged issue, I'm a little antsy that I haven't heard from anyone yet.

Jeff


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## Big D

I just received a phone call from Dish on this, I had sent them an email Saturday. They are requesting that I ship my 921 to them, at their cost, and they will repair/replace/fix it and return it within 2 or 3 days. The person I was talking to did not have any information as to what what was causing the issue, or at least he did not want to say. The only question he asked of me is if my TV had DVI, which it does not.

One kind of odd thing though, he gave me a shipping address that is a UPS store in Greenwood Village, CO. Seems odd that it is not being shipped to a Dish facility. Also no RMA number is needed, he said they are tracking each unit with the issue separately.


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## MattG

They contacted me with the same deal so I'm shipping mine out today. Hopefully I'll get it back before the superbowl.



Big D said:


> I just received a phone call from Dish on this, I had sent them an email Saturday. They are requesting that I ship my 921 to them, at their cost, and they will repair/replace/fix it and return it within 2 or 3 days. The person I was talking to did not have any information as to what what was causing the issue, or at least he did not want to say. The only question he asked of me is if my TV had DVI, which it does not.
> 
> One kind of odd thing though, he gave me a shipping address that is a UPS store in Greenwood Village, CO. Seems odd that it is not being shipped to a Dish facility. Also no RMA number is needed, he said they are tracking each unit with the issue separately.


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## howdydoody

I hooked my third 921 to my G90 front projector. It has the same blue line issue as my other two 921's and it has what I would describe as a shimmer to the entire picture. Given that all three of my 921's have the problem on three different types of displays I am very concerned. I will say that if I hadn't noticed it initially on one display watching a very dark blue scene, I wouldn't have readily noticed it. It is faily subtle on most material. Incidentally, the problem is not just on the component output, it is also on the RGBHV output. It is not present on DVI-D.


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## Ronald K

Today is Tuesday, the Superbowl is Sunday.

Good luck.


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## Slordak

I have never tried the component outputs on my 921, having only used the DVI output to this point. This thread makes me considerably concerned, though, with regards to the unit possibly having defective component outputs which will require later replacement of the unit.

Are all the 921s defective in this regard, or some more than others (some have it a little bit, some more), or is it just certain units?


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## jled5087

Big D said:


> I just received a phone call from Dish on this, I had sent them an email Saturday. They are requesting that I ship my 921 to them, at their cost, and they will repair/replace/fix it and return it within 2 or 3 days. The person I was talking to did not have any information as to what what was causing the issue, or at least he did not want to say. The only question he asked of me is if my TV had DVI, which it does not.
> 
> One kind of odd thing though, he gave me a shipping address that is a UPS store in Greenwood Village, CO. Seems odd that it is not being shipped to a Dish facility. Also no RMA number is needed, he said they are tracking each unit with the issue separately.


Same thing here they called this morning and the first thing the guy asked was if I could use the DVI output. I told him no and then said I could return it on their FedEx account to the UPS store referenced above. I questioned him about that and he replied it was a way for them to separate these shipments from the normal returns. Still makes me a little nervous.

I asked about the possibility of a straight trade and according to the tech there are two reasons they're not doing that right now. 1) supply is supposedly very limited 2) they don't know exact units that have the problem and could potentially ship another defective unit if taken from existing stock. He said the only way to guarantee this would not happen is to send the unit in for a fix. When I asked him what problem and the fix was, he didn't know (not his department). I think he sensed I was hesitant about sending it to a UPS store with no RMA # and told me that if I wanted to wait a couple of weeks to check on replacement availability I could call back.

Jeff


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## MattG

Thanks,

I'll be impressed if they can fix it and turn it around that fast.



Ronald K said:


> Today is Tuesday, the Superbowl is Sunday.
> 
> Good luck.


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## tgerrish

MattG said:


> Originally I didn't think my 921 had the blue line problem but I actually saw it today and I took a picture of it. For me they're not too noticable but I see them in very dark pictures or pictures with a solid blue background...
> 
> Well said, this is exactly my situation also. I am using a 65" Sony XBR2 HDTV, and the blue lines are not very noticeable unless there are dark/blue backgrounds. My set was recently calibrated and I have tried different component video cables with the same result. I am waiting to hear how others make out with this before I take further action...


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## the_tx_dude

Activated 921 yesterday and noticed blue lines when watching a dark scene in dark room. Have it hooked up with component to Mitsu 65-411. Sent an email to address Mark posted and waiting for response. The lines are pretty subtle and I think I will wait until after the Super Bowl to take any action with it.


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## the_tx_dude

the_tx_dude said:


> Activated 921 yesterday and noticed blue lines when watching a dark scene in dark room. Have it hooked up with component to Mitsu 65-411. Sent an email to address Mark posted and waiting for response. The lines are pretty subtle and I think I will wait until after the Super Bowl to take any action with it.


Well that was fast. Dish rep. just called. Said to send unit in via FedEx at their expense and they would get fixed unit back to me within 3 days. Told him I wanted to wait until after the SuperBowl and he said to call him Monday to make sure they are still doing the same thing to fix this problem. Said it was mainly a problem with component input and they are currently screening all 921s before shipping to make sure they do not have problem.


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## Mark Lamutt

Slordak said:


> I have never tried the component outputs on my 921, having only used the DVI output to this point. This thread makes me considerably concerned, though, with regards to the unit possibly having defective component outputs which will require later replacement of the unit.
> 
> Are all the 921s defective in this regard, or some more than others (some have it a little bit, some more), or is it just certain units?


No, not all 921s have this defect. Mine doesn't (thankfully).


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## conner65

What is amazing to me is that the "advanced" tech says the is no reported issue with this problem. I called to make sure I was sending my 921 to a correct person and my account would not have a thousand dollar credit against it. They confirmed that the person I had talked to in CO was a Dish engineer and I would not be charged. It still amazes me how poor the communication is within the dish tech support.


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## BarryO

#[email protected]??*&!!

I hadn't watched much HD, until I was watching "Ghost Ship" on HBO-HD last night. Guess what! The blue lines were readily viewable on many scenes.

I paused one and took a picture (attached), although it doesn't show them very well and they were much more apparent "in person". But they look like the same lines everyone else is seeing. They even effect the blue in the Pause Banner (not just the "live" video).

The weird thing is that when you pause the picture, the blue lines pause too; i.e., it doesn't move around as you would expect interference or noise to do.

There also just seems to be quite a bit of video noise in the picture; a rapid waviness or "shimmer" like someone else noticed.

None of this is apparent on my 6000, which produces outstanding HD pictures.


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## smooth28la

As the originator of this post, I'm here to report that I have received my first 921 back from DISH today. DISH engineers have completely eliminated the blue line problem. In addition, the picture quality is about 200% better than the original one I just sent in yesterday. The picture is much sharper and less grainy. The edges are clear, not noisey as before.

DISH just received my second 921 today. Less than 5 hours later, it was ready to be shipped back. DISH said that it missed the Fedex deadline today so it would be shipped back to me on Friday with Saturday delivery (I'm not a Superbowl fan.. so whether I get it back on Saturday is not that important).

WOW... ! That's fast turn-around!

I'm sure that this problem has cost DISH a lot of money in labor and shipping. The fast and open acknowledge from DISH about this problem is a positive sign that DISH is commited in making the 921 as bug free as possible.... eventually!

So send your units in for repair. Don't worry about the UPS store address. It is completely legit.

P.S. It still has the bug of not able to pause and record certain OTA channels with multi-casting. DISH has promised to look into it.


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## DonLandis

No blue streaks here! 

Tonight I tested my component outputs on the 921. Looked clean on all channels, 720P channels, 1080i channels and 480i or SD channels. I guess I got lucky! Or, maybe this is only present in certain 921 - Monitor combos. The Dwin TV-3 is streak free.

The real difference was the overall quality of the HD channels. I have been using DVI since I first fired up the 921 and my eyes have gotten used to it. Switching back to Component was a noticeable difference, like switching from Component to Y/C! In large solid color blocks on the screen, I would see a bit of video noise while the DVI looks pristine and clean solid color. On SD channels there was a bit of buzz around graphics. I wanted to be sure it was the Component so I switched to the 6000 and it looked the same. Switched to my DTC-100 using RGB and the image looked slightly improved over component, mostly in the buzz around the graphics but still noise in the solids. 
I would highly recommend those using Component HDTV connections consider switching to DVI. There is a significant improvement. I'm thinking I should consider getting a new DVD player now with DVI. 
Funny, how easy it is to get used to higher quality and not realize it until you go back to what once was the hi quality of your system. I'm a real DVI believer now.


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## MattG

When I got to the office this morning my repaired 921 was already waiting for me! I honestly didn't think I'd get it back until next week but I'm very impressed on how Echostar's product elevation group is handling this problem.



Ronald K said:


> Today is Tuesday, the Superbowl is Sunday.
> 
> Good luck.


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## MattG

Plugged in my repaired 921 this evening and the blue lines are definitely gone.


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## Mark Lamutt

I'm happy to hear this is working out.


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## kmcnamara

Someone mentioned above that the problem exists on the RGB output as well. Has anyone else noticed this? I can't really see it but I may not have my brightness/contrast set to really show the problem. I'd like to know if my unit has the problem, but I have no way to really test this as my display device does not have component input (it's a 7 year-old CRT front projector).


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## conner65

I have a sony G90CRT and I originally hooked it up with RGB and I had the problem right out of the box. I then switched to component and the problem was just as presistent.


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## TVBob

My DVR-921 does not seem to have the "blue line" problem, but it has a similar problem with the composite video (yellow connector) output:

480p, 720p, 1080i Component Video Output all look great.
480i S-Video output looks very good. 
_But_, 480i *composite video* output looks really bad, as if the contrast is set too high. The colors are all washed out. There is also a wide transparent vertical bar in the middle of the display.
TV: Sony KD-34XBR2 direct view HDTV

Has anyone else compared 921 S-Video output to composite? They should look almost the same, but on my TV they look very different. I'll try different cables, but I think my 921 has hardware problem. I'd like to know if anyone else is seeing the same thing.

Why use composite video at all? To save recordings to a VCR.


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## kmcnamara

Bob, your post might be better served in another thread. Sounds like an unrelated problem and it might get missed if you just post it here.

Anyway, I just confirmed that I have the blue streak problem on my 921 using the RGB outputs.  I think I'll wait a week or so to send it in so I can really make sure there aren't other problems with it. I'm glad that this thread got started because I would've just assumed that the problem was caused by my cabling or something.


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## conner65

Got unit back and blue lines are gone. I am glad that dish has been so responsive however, I hope that there is some type of communication between the engineers and tech support because this still is not a "known problem." If it was not for this forum I would have gotten my money back and waited for the Direct TV HDTivo. I am glad I didn't because I prefer dish to direct.


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## Mr5150

How did all of you send in your PVR's? FedEx Express, Overnight or ground? Thanks...


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## Mark Lamutt

Dish is having you send it back Fedex overnight at their expense.
Then, when it's fixed, they send it back to you also via fedex overnight.


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## Mr5150

Got my 921 back today...seems ok now. In the box there was a return UPS label and a notice saying to return defective unit within 10 days or I'll be charged for the new receiver. It seems it's being treated as if I got an exchange unit. I definitely got my original unit repaired/returned... is this typical? Did you all get this label and notice to return the defective unit? Should I call Dish, or just forget about it? Thanks.


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## the_tx_dude

I received the same box and UPS labels. In my case, however, it looks like I will need them as the fix did not work. I still have the same thin transparent blue lines that are visible in dark scenes. I am sending email today to see what they can do about it. Happens with component cable hookup to Mits. WS 65-411 monitor.

Dish called within a few hours of my email. They asked whether I wanted them to try to screen a new 921 unit for one that does not have problem or return this one for another try at fixing. I asked which was faster and which they would recommend. They are checking into it. With all of the other bugs and problems I am tempted to tell them to keep the 921 if they cannot fix and I can get refund.


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## Allen Noland

I received mine back on Friday. It too is not completely fixed. It does seem to be a little better.


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## the_tx_dude

Maybe instead of returning the 921 for $1000 I should just replace the 1 year old 65 inch Mitsubishi tv with a large plasma with DVI connect...have to tell the wife to wait on replacing her 6 year old car though


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## BarryO

Got mine back, and hooked it up today. 'very sure that the blue lines are gone: I still had "Ghost Ship" on the hard drive, and on the scenes where the lines were very apparent, I can't see them. And this is in a completely dark room, sitting 1 foot from the screen, and going frame-by-frame through the picture. I figure if I can't see them under those conditions, they're simply not visible.

Before i sent the unit in, I'd gotten pretty good as spotting them even on SD channels, at fade-in and fade-out when the brightness level was just right. 'can't see them anymore.


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## Steven Miller

Hi,

I have the following "blue-line" like problem with Component video output in 3 out of 4 stretch modes including the zoom mode that I use most. I can't remember off the top of my head which stretch mode doesn't have it.

It occurs in about 10% of the content and doesn't occur with S-video output. It appears as a series of blue and/or red dots on both recorded and live material. It's always one vertical line exactly in the center (horizontally speaking) of the screen and appears as a series of closely spaced dots.

Is this the blue-line bug?

Check out the attached pictures

Regards,

Steven


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## Mark Lamutt

Steven, your pictures look different from the other ones that have displayed the problem, but if it's happening only with the component video, it's definitely possible. I'd recommend sending your pictures to the email address posted at the top of the forum and asking them the question.


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## Steven Miller

I sent this information into dish and they offered to repair it.

I'm going to make sure to have content on the system with the blue line bug and instruct them how to locate and replicate the issue so they can verify that it's there and that it's gone when they make the fix. I'll report back after I get the unit back.

- Steven



Mark Lamutt said:


> Steven, your pictures look different from the other ones that have displayed the problem, but if it's happening only with the component video, it's definitely possible. I'd recommend sending your pictures to the email address posted at the top of the forum and asking them the question.


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## Jim Kosinsky

Steven-
Looking at your pictures I now realize my old 921 also had this problem, along with the blue-lines...at the time I thought it was a source problem. Dish did fix my blue line issue, but found other problems and sent me a new 921. I received it yesterday and so far all is well.


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## the_tx_dude

My first 921 and first 921 returned for the fix had both blue line problems mentioned in this thread. My recently received second 921 that was purportedly screened for the blue line problem appears to be ok but I have done only limited viewing so far. Dish was very anxious for me to send the first "fixed" 921 back so that they could do further testing to determine why the fix did not work. Hopefully they are figuring out this problem with the component outputs.


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## srrobinson2

Steven Miller said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have the following "blue-line" like problem with Component video output in 3 out of 4 stretch modes including the zoom mode that I use most. I can't remember off the top of my head which stretch mode doesn't have it.
> 
> It occurs in about 10% of the content and doesn't occur with S-video output. It appears as a series of blue and/or red dots on both recorded and live material. It's always one vertical line exactly in the center (horizontally speaking) of the screen and appears as a series of closely spaced dots.
> 
> Is this the blue-line bug?
> 
> Check out the attached pictures
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Steven


It's very close! I had the blue line problem and got it repaired, and now I have the green/red line problem that you seem to have. I will take pics and add to my post this evening.
(Update: Pics are uploaded. Red line is harder to see in my picture, but it is definately there. The green line is pretty easy to spot)


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## thevoice

Steven Miller said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have the following "blue-line" like problem with Component video output in 3 out of 4 stretch modes including the zoom mode that I use most. I can't remember off the top of my head which stretch mode doesn't have it.
> 
> Steven


Steven, I have seen something similar but it only happens as a fluke and happens when my box is set to SD and it is trying to pipe out data through the Y/Pr/Pb, even though SD is the only light on. Once I change it to HD only - it corrects this problem. Does this seem like the problem you are having?


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## srrobinson2

thevoice said:


> Steven, I have seen something similar but it only happens as a fluke and happens when my box is set to SD and it is trying to pipe out data through the Y/Pr/Pb, even though SD is the only light on. Once I change it to HD only - it corrects this problem. Does this seem like the problem you are having?


No--I always run mine in HD mode with component cables (good ones)attached.


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## dreamer

Steven Miller,

I have the exact same line issue, on my 921, that you are having with your 921. I am using the component out to view SD.


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## Steven Miller

thevoice said:


> Steven, I have seen something similar but it only happens as a fluke and happens when my box is set to SD and it is trying to pipe out data through the Y/Pr/Pb, even though SD is the only light on. Once I change it to HD only - it corrects this problem. Does this seem like the problem you are having?


I haven't been able to repeat the problem, even with the original program material that I saved that originally showed it. I tried for over an hour with various recorded SD (and some HD) through the HD outpouts, various stretch modes, etc...

I wonder if it was a particular mode or setting combination similar to what you mentioned above that I haven't successfully replicated. Or maybe a combination of events put the hardware in a state I can't repeat.

I'm not going to send my unit in right now because it seems to be working fine after about 10 hours of viewing SD content over a component connection. This "fluke" has only happened on that one day and never since. I don't want to send something in for a fix if I can't even verify the fix (the risk of shipment, etc.. may be higher than the benefit of getting a fix if the unit doesn't need it... plus I don't want to live without my HD DVR!).

- Steven


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## DVDDAD

Steven Miller said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have the following "blue-line" like problem with Component video output in 3 out of 4 stretch modes including the zoom mode that I use most. I can't remember off the top of my head which stretch mode doesn't have it.
> 
> It occurs in about 10% of the content and doesn't occur with S-video output. It appears as a series of blue and/or red dots on both recorded and live material. It's always one vertical line exactly in the center (horizontally speaking) of the screen and appears as a series of closely spaced dots.
> 
> Is this the blue-line bug?
> 
> Check out the attached pictures
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Steven


I just noticed this problem on my 921 and the pictues you posted are exactly what I am seeing. I've had my 921 for about a month now, but am just noticing the single blue streak tonight for the first time. Did you notice it from when you first received your 921 or did this happen after a period of time? Was your unit retuned fixed?


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## dishguy

I also have the blue line down the middle. Sent in the first box for a replacement. My replacement is also now showing this problem as well(supposed to have been screened for blue line problem). The first box didn't seem to have the problem for the first month I had the receiver, then it became pretty apparent. I tried to record some material with the problem line. Was able to capture it, playback showed it last night. This morning checked the playback and the line was gone again. Either my switching between SD/HD cured it for now, or it has something to do with the receiver having been on(Video output) for some time period. Suspecting this may be a thermal problem with one of the chips in the system. Problem only occurs in certain scenes with darker backgrounds and bright faces in the middle of the screen. Going to monitor to see if this box continues to do this before sending back again.


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## tgerrish

My 921 was sent in for it's "blue lines repair" and I've had it back for well over a week now. I can honestly say that I have not seen the multiple blue lines visible against a dark blue background as before.

Unfortunately, I can create the single blue line in the middle of the screen. To do this, simply switch between SD & HD modes and you should be able to see this clearly. While I'm not sure that this affects DVI output, it does appear with component video and is not present with SVideo.

For now I am using HD (1080i) for everything, despite the fact the my Sony 65 XBR2 scaler is better than the 921 scaler. It's not worth slightly better PQ with SD to have a blue line down the middle in HD mode later IMHO.


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## BarryO

This sounds alot like a software problem.

I leave mine in HD mode all the time (or used to, before a corrupted download killed it), so I haven't seen this problem.


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## MattG

tgerrish said:


> My 921 was sent in for it's "blue lines repair" and I've had it back for well over a week now. I can honestly say that I have not seen the multiple blue lines visible against a dark blue background as before.
> 
> Unfortunately, I can create the single blue line in the middle of the screen. To do this, simply switch between SD & HD modes and you should be able to see this clearly. While I'm not sure that this affects DVI output, it does appear with component video and is not present with SVideo.
> 
> For now I am using HD (1080i) for everything, despite the fact the my Sony 65 XBR2 scaler is better than the 921 scaler. It's not worth slightly better PQ with SD to have a blue line down the middle in HD mode later IMHO.


I see the same thing if I hit the HD/SD button and the line down the middle appears to be a software problem, not hardware. Usually I run 1080i through component out and if I want to see 480p then I dive into the menus to set it to 480p, not hit the hd/sd button. It would be nice if hitting the hd/sd button worked correctly.


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## Mark Lamutt

Um, 480p isn't SD though. SD by definition is 480i, which is what the HD/SD button changes to.


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## bobl

Everything except 1080i and 720p is considered to be SD.

Bob


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## Mark Lamutt

Bob, my understanding is that 480p is considered "Extended Definition", not standard definition.


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## srrobinson2

srrobinson2 said:


> It's very close! I had the blue line problem and got it repaired, and now I have the green/red line problem that you seem to have. I will take pics and add to my post this evening.
> (Update: Pics are uploaded. Red line is harder to see in my picture, but it is definately there. The green line is pretty easy to spot)


Dish is still looking at my "green line" and "red line" problem. The dealt with my blue line problem so fast, I assumed this would be dealt with in a like manner, but I am in "wait and see" mode now.


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## bobl

Mark,

I think the ED term has been applied to the capabilities of some non-HD televisions to supposedly show that they are better than standard SD televisions but I don't believe I've ever heard the term applied to programming. For example a DVD played through a progressive DVD player provides 480p resolution but I believe this is still referred to as SD material.

Bob


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## Mark Lamutt

Fox OTA 480p is referred to both as "high resolution" and extended definition.


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## kmcnamara

Actually Mark is right. EDTV is broadcast 480p but it's called Enhanced Definition TV.

http://skyvision.com/pages/information_center/hdtv_lingo.html


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