# HR24 - Buy or Lease?



## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

Folks,

If I end up having to replace my failing HR20, should I buy or lease? I'm really wanting a HR24, so if I buy, I'd be sure that's what I get. As I understand it, D* cannot guarantee I'll get a HR24 if I'm sent a replacement.

I read the following on Amazon's site: 
_...and most important, THIS IS A LEASE. You are not actually buying this DVR, and you do not own this DVR. The Amazon price (or anyone else's "retail" price) is actually a LEASE FEE. Once the unit has been activated with DirecTV, you cannot return it or resell it later. Legally it is the property of DirecTV. If you ever terminate service, you will have to ship it back to DirecTV. (This is why you basically never want to "buy" one of these from swap meets or private parties.) _

Is all that true? If so, then I guess the only question is whether to pay up front or the $5 a month.

I'm a 10 year plus customer at D*. Don't know if that will help my case, but if you had a failing HR20 that's currently 'leased', wanted a new HR24, how would you go about it?


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

Rockermann said:


> Folks,
> 
> If I end up having to replace my failing HR20, should I buy or lease? I'm really wanting a HR24, so if I buy, I'd be sure that's what I get. As I understand it, D* cannot guarantee I'll get a HR24 if I'm sent a replacement.
> 
> ...


Yes that is all true.

There are those here who have obtained owned HR24s. It can be done. However, if someone is trying to sell you an owned HR24, get the RID and verify that it's actually owned and a lease.

Mike


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

A leased receiver will get replaced with another leased receiver of the same type. So, an HD-DVR will get replaced with an HD-DVR. You don't get to pick the exact model number, and DirecTV's system is not set up to fulfill anything by model number. You could get anything from an HR20 to an HR24. That's how the lease model works.

If you want to buy an HR24, you have two options: purchase directly from DirecTV, or try to find one of the relatively few owned units for sale on this site or on eBay. They are rare, but they do exist.

You can also lease an HR24 directly from a retailer that has one. Note, though, that like any leased receiver, if it were to die a day later, it could be replaced with any HD-DVR model.

The whole point of the lease model is that the receiver isn't yours; it's DirecTV's. By setting up this system, where they can give you any model in that receiver family, they save lots of money, and can afford to lease you the equipment at a much lower price than the old days, when you had to buy your receivers (the HR10-250 was $1000!). But the trade-off is that there is no guarentee of any specific model.


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

Excellent summation, BattleZone. Thanks for the info. I guess I have to decide if leasing a HR24 from a third party is worth the gamble. It'd be my luck, it'd go belly up after a week. But, I sure don't want to play DVR Russian Roulette and end up with a HR21/22/23 and be disappointed with performance. 

What a conundrum.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

From what my Installer told me Directv is trying to get rid of the HR20 DBRs so he replaced mine with an HR24-500 for Free!!! Yes it is a Leased unit but I would try to have it Replaced as my installer only had HR24s on his truck.


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

That's a good point. I read that elsewhere, that it would be good to have an installer replace the DVR as they were likely to have the HR24s on their truck. I'll have to consider that.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

Some people have reported getting a credit from Directv after leasing a HR24 from a dealer. It never hurts to ask. This may cover most or all of the up-front lease fee. You will still pay $5/month when adding a receiver no matter if it is leased or owned.


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## drpjr (Nov 23, 2007)

Rockermann said:


> Excellent summation, BattleZone. Thanks for the info. I guess I have to decide if leasing a HR24 from a third party is worth the gamble. It'd be my luck, it'd go belly up after a week. But, I sure don't want to play DVR Russian Roulette and end up with a HR21/22/23 and be disappointed with performance.
> 
> What a conundrum.


Have you looked at your account online? As a long time customer you might be entitled to a free upgrade. If so that could go in your favor when asking for a credit to "purchase" the model you want from a retailer. (since they were going to give you a free one anyway). You could get a credit just for asking. As BattleZone says they can replace an HR24 with any other model if it breaks. However if I "bought' an HR24 and it died I would not accept and would send back everything but another HR24.


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

bobnielsen said:


> Some people have reported getting a credit from Directv after leasing a HR24 from a dealer. It never hurts to ask. This may cover most or all of the up-front lease fee. You will still pay $5/month when adding a receiver no matter if it is leased or owned.


Thanks... I'll keep that in mind. I see I'm eligible for a $99 HD DVR replacement from DirecTV right now. Hopefully, I could get that same discount at least.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Rockermann said:


> Excellent summation, BattleZone. Thanks for the info. I guess I have to decide if leasing a HR24 from a third party is worth the gamble. It'd be my luck, it'd go belly up after a week. But, I sure don't want to play DVR Russian Roulette and end up with a HR21/22/23 and be disappointed with performance.
> 
> What a conundrum.


I'm not sure you understand what is going on here. No matter where you get the HR24 from you will actually be leasing it from DirecTV. The "seller" is just the distributor, you don't lease from them. So if you were to lease one from a place like Solid Signal, and they went out of business it wouldn't be a problem because your lease is actually with DirecTV and they will take care of you if the receiver dies.

Also, just so you know, even if you find an owned receiver to buy you will still have to pay $5 per month for them to mirror your programming to the receiver (unless it is your only receiver then the cost is included in your package cost).


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

So, BeerStalker, I guess it doesn't really make a difference about buying or leasing. Though it does seem leasing is the better option as I still have to pay the $5 no matter what. I just need to get the DVR from a third party to make sure I'm getting the one I want. Is that about it?


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## drpjr (Nov 23, 2007)

Rockermann said:


> So, BeerStalker, I guess it doesn't really make a difference about buying or leasing. Though it does seem leasing is the better option as I still have to pay the $5 no matter what. I just need to get the DVR from a third party to make sure I'm getting the one I want. Is that about it?


The biggest difference is money. Buying to own will set you back $400-500 from D. (no discounts). Purchasing a leased box will cost anywhere from $0 to $199 depending on the retailer and the credits you can get from D. Also if you buy to own you will probably want to get the Protection Plan ($5.99mo) to protect your ownership. Without it if you have to replace the box it will become leased. EDIT: Oh, and nice setup by the way.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

BattleZone said:


> A leased receiver will get replaced with another leased receiver of the same type. So, an HD-DVR will get replaced with an HD-DVR. You don't get to pick the exact model number, and DirecTV's system is not set up to fulfill anything by model number. You could get anything from an HR20 to an HR24. That's how the lease model works.
> 
> If you want to buy an HR24, you have two options: purchase directly from DirecTV, or try to find one of the relatively few owned units for sale on this site or on eBay. They are rare, but they do exist.
> 
> ...


And yet, I always get the specific model I want. There are ways...

Rich


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

rich584 said:


> And yet, I always get the specific model I want. There are ways...


Would you care to share?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Rockermann said:


> Would you care to share?


I have shared that knowledge many times. I hate reading threads to find info too, but it's what I do when I get stuck. The answers are there in the threads for anyone to read. By the way, I rarely have to pay any costs for the "new" receivers. How to do that is in the threads too.

Rich


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## joshjr (Aug 2, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I have shared that knowledge many times. I hate reading threads to find info too, but it's what I do when I get stuck. The answers are there in the threads for anyone to read. By the way, I rarely have to pay any costs for the "new" receiver. How to that is in the threads too.
> 
> Rich


Well dang I want to know to. Any certain thread name I should look for? But you are subject to a new 2 year agreement right?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

joshjr said:


> Well dang I want to know to. Any certain thread name I should look for? But you are subject to a new 2 year agreement right?


I could have gotten around that, too, but I think I pushed it far enough. I sounded kinda snotty on that post and I apologize for that. That kind of info only goes out on PMs now. Basically, if you catch a CSR in a "power position" and are polite, you never know what you are gonna get. The folks at D* in certain positions have been pretty good about treating me well, especially those that realize what I went thru a couple years ago. Loyalty does seem to appreciated.

Rich


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## gryphoncub (May 7, 2010)

I purchased a lease HR24 after getting confirmation that D* would credit my account. II made sure he noted the account as such. I received the HR24 today and will probably hook it up/activate it tomorrow. If D* refuses to issue the credit I will return the receiver to the merchant. I hope it goes ok.


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## mcbeevee (Sep 18, 2006)

BattleZone said:


> You can also lease an HR24 directly from a retailer that has one. Note, though, that like any leased receiver, if it were to die a day later, it could be replaced with any HD-DVR model.


That would really be bad to spend $199 on a new HR24, then it dies after a few weeks and is replaced by something like an HR21!! :eek2:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

mcbeevee said:


> That would really be bad to spend $199 on a new HR24, then it dies after a few weeks and is replaced by something like an HR21!! :eek2:


Happens all the time. That's when you have to push back. Politely and persistently. Sooner or later you'll get what you want.

Rich


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## I WANT MORE (Oct 3, 2006)

gryphoncub said:


> I purchased a lease HR24 after getting confirmation that D* would credit my account. II made sure he noted the account as such. I received the HR24 today and will probably hook it up/activate it tomorrow. If D* refuses to issue the credit I will return the receiver to the merchant. I hope it goes ok.


Don't think you can return it after it has been activated. CBW


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## gryphoncub (May 7, 2010)

I WANT MORE said:


> Don't think you can return it after it has been activated. CBW


I will confirm that they will issue the credit before I let them activate it.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I have been told by Directv that if you Lease an HR24-500 and it goes bad they will Guarantee that the Replacement will be another HR24-500.

They will not do that for other models but they will do it for the HR24-500.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

richierich said:


> I have been told by Directv that if you Lease an HR24-500 and it goes bad they will Guarantee that the Replacement will be another HR24-500.


Do you mean "a DirecTV CSR told you" or do you mean "DirecTV issued an official statement"? Because CSRs say things that aren't true 10,000 or more times every day.

I'm not saying you're wrong; I hope you're right. I'm just saying you have to be REAL careful what you believe unless it is an official, sanctioned communication.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

gryphoncub said:


> I purchased a lease HR24 after getting confirmation that D* would credit my account. II made sure he noted the account as such. I received the HR24 today and will probably hook it up/activate it tomorrow. If D* refuses to issue the credit I will return the receiver to the merchant. I hope it goes ok.


You can't return the receiver to the merchant after it has been activated.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

RunnerFL said:


> You can't return the receiver to the merchant after it has been activated.


You can as long as it's deactivated and off the "leased receivers" list. I've done this a couple times when it was easier to return it to the merchant than get a replacement. Thing is, you gotta do it quickly. Can't wait a month and then try to return it.


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## H8tank (May 26, 2010)

I canceled two installs the past few weeks cause they had no HR24's, today the kid comes with HR15's and HR20's!!!!

I don't want to spend $200 on a *leased* unit, and I don't want a refurb HR20.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

If you cancel many more, they'll ban you from future installs.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

H8tank said:


> I canceled two installs the past few weeks cause they had no HR24's, today the kid comes with HR15's and HR20's!!!!
> 
> I don't want to spend $200 on a *leased* unit, and I don't want a refurb HR20.





spartanstew said:


> If you cancel many more, they'll ban you from future installs.


That would be hilarious! It does seem like a waste of company time and money.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

sigma1914 said:


> That would be hilarious! It does seem like a waste of company time and money.


I remember a thread a year or so ago where it happened to someone. They canceled three installs (IIRC) and when they tried to set up another, was told that D* didn't want their business.


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## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

If you want a specific model number like the HR24 just get it from an online dealer who can guarantee it. Simple as that.


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## modeboy (Apr 13, 2010)

I called DirecTV tonight, and I've been a loyal customer for 7.5 years... I was told I was eligible for a receiver upgrade, but when I asked for the HR24-500, I was told they couldn't guarantee that's what I would get. Then I asked if they would credit my account if I purchased one from one of the online authorized resellers, and they told me no.

Jason


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Ask for retention, and ask the question again. They have done this twice for me.


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## MISpat (Apr 22, 2009)

If your HR20 is failing, they will replace it for you for free (well, for $20 shipping). Still no guarantee of the HR24 of course, but chances are much better if you have an installer replace the receiver rather than having D* ship one to you.

If you're thinking of doing the MRV upgrade at some point anyway, set it up as one appt. This way you can ask the installer to give you an HR24 if he has one. (it's likely he does if he's doing an MRV upgrade!)


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

spartanstew said:


> If you cancel many more, they'll ban you from future installs.


This is a good thing. I've been seeing way too many posts from people saying they canceled an install because the installer didn't have the gear they want these days. It's getting out of hand.


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## rahlquist (Jul 24, 2007)

RunnerFL said:


> This is a good thing. I've been seeing way too many posts from people saying they canceled an install because the installer didn't have the gear they want these days. It's getting out of hand.


Amen.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

What I don't get about cancelling an install is why people want to turn this into a confrontation? As has been said, there are ways to massage the system to take your odds up to 100% that you will get what you want. Why not do that instead? 

The best definition I ever heard of selling is that it is the process of reaching an agreement. Throw in a confrontation and there's no agreement.


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## Matt_Stevens (Jun 21, 2010)

Carl, then specify that in your reply. Specify what you think they can do. Don't assume someone has read all of your posts. 

I'll be installed the end of next month and am biting my fingernails over it because I really have no idea if I am going to get what I want. No HR-24 = no install. I'll send them away. I know the CSR put "Customer requests HR24" in the notes, but so what? 

I just have to hope the installer calls me before they roll that truck out.


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## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

Matt_Stevens said:


> Carl, then specify that in your reply. Specify what you think they can do. Don't assume someone has read all of your posts.
> 
> I'll be installed the end of next month and am biting my fingernails over it because I really have no idea if I am going to get what I want. No HR-24 = no install. I'll send them away. I know the CSR put "Customer requests HR24" in the notes, but so what?
> 
> I just have to hope the installer calls me before they roll that truck out.


I believe if you get a Whole Home DVR install they will have to install you a DECA network and H/HR24's is a requirement. So request that and I'd think that should just about guarantee a 24.

Or get them online at your favorite dealer and install them yourself or have DirecTV do it.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

Matt_Stevens said:


> Carl, then specify that in your reply. Specify what you think they can do. Don't assume someone has read all of your posts.


Here's an open and active thread on this topic.

How to get an HR24


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## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

bonscott87 said:


> I believe if you get a Whole Home DVR install they will have to install you a DECA network and H/HR24's is a requirement. So request that and I'd think that should just about guarantee a 24.
> 
> Or get them online at your favorite dealer and install them yourself or have DirecTV do it.


Whole Home installs/upgrades does not mean getting 24s.


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## Matt_Stevens (Jun 21, 2010)

bonscott87 said:


> I believe if you get a Whole Home DVR install they will have to install you a DECA network and H/HR24's is a requirement. So request that and I'd think that should just about guarantee a 24.


We only have one TV, so that't work for us, I'm afraid. 

As for getting it online, well, now you are paying $200 for something you don't even own. I'll just take mychances and if I cannot get the HR24, hello Comcast.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Matt_Stevens said:


> We only have one TV, so that't work for us, I'm afraid.
> 
> As for getting it online, well, now you are paying $200 for something you don't even own. I'll just take mychances and if I cannot get the HR24, *hello Comcast.*


Their DVRs are so great!


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## Matt_Stevens (Jun 21, 2010)

Of course they are not great, but I am not going to sign a two year contract if I cannot get the HR24. It's just that simple. Hopefully everything will work out fine.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

Maybe it's time for DirecTV to fix the problem of lumping the HR24s with the HR20/21/22/23s. They are not the same and shouldn't be lumped together.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Maybe it's time for DirecTV to fix the problem of lumping the HR24s with the HR20/21/22/23s. They are not the same and shouldn't be lumped together.


Nor should the 20-700s be lumped together with the rest of the HRs. The HR24 should have been the next HR after the 20-700.

Consider the statements above before replying to this post, please. It seems logical to me. Think of all the complaints and problems that could have been avoided.

I think today marks my third week with the 24 and if it makes it until tomorrow, that will be longer than my brand new 22 and my brand new 23 lasted. That's a pretty sad comment.

Think it was evolution? I don't. I think we got hosed. D* comes out with the 20-700s and then for almost four years we have to put up with inferior HRs? Then the 24 appears and suddenly we see what can be done. And what should have been done.

Rich


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

Agreed.



rich584 said:


> Nor should the 20-700s be lumped together with the rest of the HRs. The HR24 should have been the next HR after the 20-700.
> 
> Consider the statements above before replying to this post, please. It seems logical to me. Think of all the complaints and problems that could have been avoided.
> 
> ...


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Agreed.


Huh. Thought I'd get flamed for that last post. :lol:

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> D* comes out with the 20-700s and then for almost four years we have to put up with inferior HRs? Then the 24 appears and suddenly we see what can be done. And what should have been done.
> Rich


AMEN BROTHER BEN!!! I mean Rich. They went the cheap route and finally woke up and realized that Dish was killing them talking about how bad their DVRs are and how SLOW they are so Directv finally got a Faster CPU and More RAM and the problem has been solved.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> AMEN BROTHER BEN!!! I mean Rich. They went the cheap route and finally woke up and realized that *Dish was killing them talking about how bad their DVRs *are and how SLOW they are so Directv finally got a Faster CPU and More RAM and the problem has been solved.


That's a little bit funny....Dish's claim to have anything "advanced or superior" in technology happens to be the brunt of the humor in the current DirecTV ads.

The only thing they seemed to have gotten right ended up in the courts for years as patent challenges.

As for the topic here....buy or lease...there are pros and cons to both. I'd rather own, given the choice.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I'd rather OWN too and also if it is an HR24-500 because it is what Directv should have had 4 years ago that would have solved alot of problems and eliminated alot of *****ing and moaning here at DBSTALK.COM and for all of Directv's customers who have experienced a Slow, almost unresponsive DVR.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> That's a little bit funny....Dish's claim to have anything "advanced or superior" in technology happens to be the brunt of the humor in the current DirecTV ads.
> 
> The only thing they seemed to have gotten right ended up in the courts for years as patent challenges.
> 
> As for the topic here....buy or lease...there are pros and cons to both. I'd rather own, given the choice.


You know what kills me about Dish? No Yes Network. That's like a local deli not carrying the NY Daily News. Delis that I visit once.

Rich


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## wingrider01 (Sep 9, 2005)

spartanstew said:


> If you cancel many more, they'll ban you from future installs.


:hurah: would be hillarious to see the posts if this happened, after all it is costing the installer money when they get someone like this on a install and the cancel because the installer does not have what the end user wants. After the seond time of canceling a non-refundable deposit of 50.00 needs to be charged, so at least the installer is covering their gas/wear and tear and a party of their payment


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

rich584 said:


> Huh. Thought I'd get flamed for that last post. :lol:
> 
> Rich


Nope - not from me!


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> That's a little bit funny....Dish's claim to have anything "advanced or superior" in technology happens to be the brunt of the humor in the current DirecTV ads.
> 
> The only thing they seemed to have gotten right ended up in the courts for years as patent challenges.
> 
> As for the topic here....buy or lease...there are pros and cons to both. I'd rather own, given the choice.


Spoken like a true believer&#8230;. Kinda sad really. I just don't understand the defend DirecTV at all costs logic. Same goes for the people that defend Dish Network at all costs. Why not just call it the way it is? All providers have issues of some kind. DirecTV is not infallible and Dish Network doesn't do everything wrong.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Matt_Stevens said:


> Carl, then specify that in your reply. Specify what you think they can do. Don't assume someone has read all of your posts.
> 
> I'll be installed the end of next month and am biting my fingernails over it because I really have no idea if I am going to get what I want. No HR-24 = no install. I'll send them away. I know the CSR put "Customer requests HR24" in the notes, but so what?
> 
> I just have to hope the installer calls me before they roll that truck out.


The way I have gotten what I want is to have the Installer call me before coming out and then I tell them what I need and want and see if they have it. If they do they will normally bring it and I have always got what I asked for but you have to communicate it with them ahead of time so they can put it on the truck.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> That's a little bit funny....Dish's claim to have anything "advanced or superior" in technology happens to be the brunt of the humor in the current DirecTV ads.
> 
> The only thing they seemed to have gotten right ended up in the courts for years as patent challenges.
> 
> As for the topic here....buy or lease...there are pros and cons to both. I'd rather own, given the choice.


Dish's VIP722K was much Faster than anything Directv had so they bit the bullet and got a Faster CPU with more RAM as they had learned from experience that it was causing them alot of headaches so they finally decided to spend the money to fix the problem and eliminate the Issues!!!

Some posters will go to extraordinary lengths to Wave the Directv Banner and it is Very Interesting why they do it!!! :lol:

Maybe they are Earl Wannabees!!!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> Dish's VIP722K was much Faster than anything Directv had so they bit the bullet and got a Faster CPU with more RAM as they had learned from experience that it was causing them alot of headaches so they finally decided to spend the money to fix the problem and eliminate the Issues!!!
> 
> Some posters will go to extraordinary lengths to Wave the Directv Banner and it is Very Interesting why they do it!!! :lol:
> 
> Maybe they are Earl Wannabees!!!


Ah, you're in fine form today!!! 

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> The way I have gotten what I want is to have the Installer call me before coming out and then I tell them what I need and want and see if they have it. If they do they will normally bring it and I have always got what I asked for but you have to communicate it with them ahead of time so they can put it on the truck.


That's what I have learned to do. And it's the only method that ensures you get the proper equipment. By the way, I canceled the DECA install more than three times and nothing happened. Way more than three times. Retention stepped in and got me what I needed at a very reasonable cost. $0.00.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> Ah, you're in fine form today!!!
> 
> Rich


Yeah, just having a little Fun with my Buddy!!! :lol:


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> Spoken like a true believer&#8230;. Kinda sad really. *I just don't understand the defend DirecTV at all costs logic*. Same goes for the people that defend Dish Network at all costs. Why not just call it the way it is? All providers have issues of some kind. DirecTV is not infallible and Dish Network doesn't do everything wrong.


I don't understand the DirecTV bashing at all cost either...but hey...it happens. 

Yup - you're correct - it happens both places.

Then again...I can see reality. :lol:

As for the original question (hint hint back to topic) it would seem that buy/lease only has a very short list of differences to most users.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> As for the original question (hint hint back to topic) it would seem that buy/lease only has a very short list of differences to most users.


YUP!!! :lol:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

wingrider01 said:


> :hurah: would be hillarious to see the posts if this happened, after all it is costing the installer money when they get someone like this on a install and the cancel because the installer does not have what the end user wants. After the seond time of canceling a non-refundable deposit of 50.00 needs to be charged, so at least the installer is covering their gas/wear and tear and a party of their payment


Oh, that's a great idea. Did you think that thru completely? Suppose a truck comes to your home to install a new dish and doesn't have it on the truck and the next day another truck shows up to do the same job and doesn't have the proper dish on the truck. Now you want to be charged $50 for someone else's mistake? Do you think the third truck to come to your home will have the correct dish?

This might seem far fetched, but I've had this happen to me a couple times and, while it's not usually the installer's fault, the fault certainly doesn't lie with the customer. D* has to find a way to communicate with the installer's companies to ensure that they are given a list of the proper equipment needed to do the job.

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> Oh, that's a great idea. Did you think that thru completely? Suppose a truck comes to your home to install a new dish and doesn't have it on the truck and the next day another truck shows up to do the same job and doesn't have the proper dish on the truck. Now you want to be charged $50 for someone else's mistake? Do you think the third truck to come to your home will have the correct dish?
> 
> This might seem far fetched, but I've had this happen to me a couple times and, while it's not usually the installer's fault, the fault certainly doesn't lie with the customer. *D* has to find a way to communicate with the installer's companies to ensure that they are given a list of the proper equipment needed to do the job. *
> 
> Rich


That's the ultimate solution.

Personally, in seeing multiple installs (5) done the past year alone (not mine), I've never once saw this reported issue happen once.

It seems to be more prevalent these days, and I'm willing to bet that 50% or more are due to canceling based on the the desire for the HR24 specifically. That's just wrong too.


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> As for the original question (hint hint back to topic) it would seem that buy/lease only has a very short list of differences to most users.


I see only one: I want to drop a different HDD in every HR without worrying about the agreement. And that's a critical difference for me. Aside from that, I could care less whether I own it or not.

I'm willing to pay the cost if I damage any HR by dropping a larger HDD in it and wreck the HR.

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> I see only one: I want to drop a different HDD in every HR without worrying about the agreement. And that's a critical difference for me. Aside from that, I could care less whether I own it or not.
> 
> I'm willing to pay the cost if I damage any HR by dropping a larger HDD in it and wreck the HR.
> 
> Rich


That's the one I'm most familar with...and use as my own "excuse" for owning. :lol:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> That's the ultimate solution.
> 
> Personally, in seeing multiple installs (5) done the past year alone (not mine), I've never once saw this reported issue happen once.
> 
> It seems to be more prevalent these days, and I'm willing to bet that 50% or more are due to canceling based on the the desire for the HR24 specifically. That's just wrong too.


Look at the time I wanted two Zinwell 6x16s paralleled. At least four trucks rolled up to my house without the proper splitters to do the job. And each of those trucks had an installer sitting in it that did not know how to parallel the switches. That job never got done. Ended up with an additional dish on my roof to meet my requirements. None of the trucks that showed up had a work order that specified exactly what had to be done. That's not the installer's fault. And it's not my fault. Let's see, that leaves...

This post was written by a person that only hopes that D* gets it's act together so that things like I've experienced never (well, you know ) happen. I like D* or I wouldn't be paying them more than I've paid for some mortgages I've had. (Houses in Florida, years ago, but, still...).

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> This post was written by a person that only hopes that D* gets it's act together so that things like I've experienced never (well, you know ) happen. I like D* or I wouldn't be paying them more than I've paid for some mortgages I've had. (Houses in Florida, years ago, but, still...).
> 
> Rich


Not disagreeing really...but I've seen more posts about folks *expecting* an HR24 for their WHDS install...and we know there are no guarantees (although it seems most get one anyway).

Yes...the inventory needs to match the work order before the trucks hit the road.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> I don't understand the DirecTV bashing at all cost either...but hey...it happens.
> 
> Yup - you're correct - it happens both places.
> 
> ...


Have you ever said anything critical of DirecTV? Just curious!

There are many things posted here and so much of it is so far from reality it's funny.

As for back to the topic... I personally don't care all that much about the lease/buy question. I wouldn't pay the crazy money that DirecTV wants for a 'purchase'. About the only options to 'buy' is to get a used one and finding one that is not a lease is getting harder all the time! If I could buy a new DVR from DirecTV for an extra $100 I probably would but I'm not sure they will sell you an HR24 for any price....


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## wingrider01 (Sep 9, 2005)

rich584 said:


> Oh, that's a great idea. Did you think that thru completely? Suppose a truck comes to your home to install a new dish and doesn't have it on the truck and the next day another truck shows up to do the same job and doesn't have the proper dish on the truck. Now you want to be charged $50 for someone else's mistake? Do you think the third truck to come to your home will have the correct dish?
> 
> This might seem far fetched, but I've had this happen to me a couple times and, while it's not usually the installer's fault, the fault certainly doesn't lie with the customer. D* has to find a way to communicate with the installer's companies to ensure that they are given a list of the proper equipment needed to do the job.
> 
> Rich


As a matter of fact I did - did you read the thread to see what prompted the comment?

Not referencing that at all - it has been stated - "I asked the installer if they had HR24's on the truck, they answer was no so I canceled" This is the type that should be hit with the 50.00 charge, just becasue the person does not get what they want they cancel teh order.

Besides I really doubt that a truck would roll for an install without the needed equiment on board - in that case either the people that load the truck or the installer need to look into their habits. As you put it seems kind of far fetched.

key statement in your arguement "D* has to find a way to communicate with the installer's companies to ensure that they are given a list of the proper equipment needed to do the job." this is 100 percent correct, and I suspect that they already have it, the charge should be leveed on those that cancel becasue they don;t get the equipment that they demand so they cancel the installation and send the install packing because of their whims.

here we go found the comment



H8tank said:


> *I canceled two installs the past few weeks cause they had no HR24's, today the kid comes with HR15's and HR20's!!!!
> 
> I don't want to spend $200 on a leased unit, and I don't want a refurb HR20*.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I had a Bad LNB and called Directv and told them what the problem was and she stated it in the notes and the guy arrived without an LNB and didn't want to go on my roof which is where Directv installed my Dish without asking me.

I was so mad I had him leave and had it fixed myself. He wanted to mount another Dish in my Garden so he wouldn't have to climb up on the roof. Amazing and this is where the Directv installer had installed it originally but he was blaming me for putting it there and I had Zero, Nothing, NADA to do with the Placement of the Dish.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> Have you ever said anything critical of DirecTV? Just curious!
> 
> There are many things posted here and so much of it is so far from reality it's funny.
> 
> As for back to the topic... *I personally don't care all that much about the lease/buy question. *I wouldn't pay the crazy money that DirecTV wants for a 'purchase'. About the only options to 'buy' is to get a used one and finding one that is not a lease is getting harder all the time! If I could buy a new DVR from DirecTV for an extra $100 I probably would but I'm not sure they will sell you an HR24 for any price....


Which prompts the question - *then why post here in this thread*?

The answer is obvious in your first 2 "agenda" sentences.

Please feel free to move your personal insults to a PM, as opposed to disrupting the topic-based contributions from many posters here in this thread.

:backtotop


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Which prompts the question - *then why post here in this thread*?
> 
> The answer is obvious in your first 2 "agenda" sentences.
> 
> ...


Sorry - didn't mean to hit a nerve. Just being a smartass:lol:

No need for personal insults - this is DirecTV and most of us can take it or leave it.

I gave my opinion on lease/own. I realize it doesn't carry any weight here but what I posted is the way I feel about it.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> Sorry - didn't mean to hit a nerve. Just being a smartass:lol:
> 
> No need for personal insults - this is DirecTV and most of us can take it or leave it.
> 
> I gave my opinion on lease/own. I realize it doesn't carry any weight here but what I posted is the way I feel about it.


Thank you sir. No nerves were damaged in the posting of a response. :lol::lol:

Just as an aside....I was plenty vocal on the $3 MRV fee and other topics in the past...you must have missed those. The colleciton on DVD will be out for $19.95 in the fall.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not disagreeing really...but I've seen more posts about folks *expecting* an HR24 for their WHDS install...and we know there are no guarantees (although it seems most get one anyway).
> 
> Yes...the inventory needs to match the work order before the trucks hit the road.


That's one of the things that make the installers look so bad. And if that happens to anyone reading this post, I urge you to ask to see the work order. If what you want done isn't on the work order, you can't blame the installer.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

wingrider01 said:


> As a matter of fact I did - did you read the thread to see what prompted the comment?


Yes



> Not referencing that at all - it has been stated - "I asked the installer if they had HR24's on the truck, they answer was no so I canceled" This is the type that should be hit with the 50.00 charge, just becasue the person does not get what they want they cancel teh order.


If the customers are promised something, it should be on the work order, then it will be on the truck. I was promised an HR24 and an H24. Absolutely promised by a Retention CSR who also noted that in his notes. And I got the HR24 and didn't want the H24. All the CSRs have to do is put it in the notes and then that info can be referenced by the installer when calling D* to see what went wrong.

In the case of the paralleled multi-switches, it was put into the notes by a CSR in the CMG, but never made it to the work orders. Those pass thru splitters were not a normal item that was carried on the trucks. All we could do at the time was call the CMG and ascertain that it was in the notes. That prompted a cancellation of the install. Happened again and again. Each time the dispatcher for the installers called me and I told them what had to be done and they sent the installers out knowing that the proper equipment wasn't on the trucks. For that I should be charged $50?



> Besides I really doubt that a truck would roll for an install without the needed equiment on board - in that case either the people that load the truck or the installer need to look into their habits. As you put it seems kind of far fetched.


No, this is normal. There is nothing strange about an installer showing up without the equipment to do the job. You can doubt it all you want, but it happens all the time. Again, it's not the installer's fault.



> key statement in your arguement "D* has to find a way to communicate with the installer's companies to ensure that they are given a list of the proper equipment needed to do the job." this is 100 percent correct, and I suspect that they already have it


You're obviously basing your assumption on experiences that you imagine rather than what you've experienced. You "suspect" that they have the info they need to do the job correctly, but they don't put the proper equipment on the truck? Why would they do that?

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Thank you sir. No nerves were damaged in the posting of a response. :lol::lol:
> 
> Just as an aside....I was plenty vocal on the $3 MRV fee and other topics in the past...you must have missed those. The colleciton on DVD will be out for $19.95 in the fall.


I didn't miss those responses so you have made responses that said Directv may not be doing the Right Thing even though in the end they did the Right Thing so Way To Go Directv in getting the MRV FEE RIGHT!!!


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## wingrider01 (Sep 9, 2005)

richierich said:


> I had a Bad LNB and called Directv and told them what the problem was and she stated it in the notes and the guy arrived without an LNB and didn't want to go on my roof which is where Directv installed my Dish without asking me.
> 
> I was so mad I had him leave and had it fixed myself. He wanted to mount another Dish in my Garden so he wouldn't have to climb up on the roof. Amazing and this is where the Directv installer had installed it originally but he was blaming me for putting it there and I had Zero, Nothing, NADA to do with the Placement of the Dish.


Be curious to have seen what the actual work order indicated was needed


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## keithw1975 (Oct 1, 2006)

So if I go out and buy a Directv DVR for $199 at some local store, like I have in the past, and take it home and throw it up on eBay selling it for whatever they are worth then how can they say it is a lease? They have no control over what I do with it and when I bought mine I didn't sign anything. I just went to Best Buy and paid them with cash. They didn't get my name or have me sign a contract.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

You can do anything you want, but the seller is going to give you awfully bad reviews when DirecTv tells your buyer he doesnt own the DVR, and has to agree to a two year contract to activate it. Its not like it isnt written all over the box.


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## keithw1975 (Oct 1, 2006)

So in other words you do actually own it until you register it. If you buy it for $199 throw it in the closet and never activate it then you basically own it.


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

keithw1975 said:


> So in other words you do actually own it until you register it. If you buy it for $199 throw it in the closet and never activate it then you basically own it.


I have run across these on ebay. When you call about the RID they say that basically it doesn't exist in the system and it will be activated as a leased box. So, in a way, I guess that statement is correct, they don't know it exists for them to lease it to anyone!


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

keithw1975 said:


> So if I go out and buy a Directv DVR for $199 at some local store, like I have in the past, and take it home and throw it up on eBay selling it for whatever they are worth then how can they say it is a lease? They have no control over what I do with it and when I bought mine I didn't sign anything. I just went to Best Buy and paid them with cash. They didn't get my name or have me sign a contract.


It's a lease because you're supposed to sign the lease agreement at the time of purchase. Unless you goal is to cheat the buyer by tellin them you won the receiver, they're not going to pay you more then they get the dang thing at BestBuy or Amazon so you're out the listing and purchase price fees at Ebay and you lost money.

BTW, discussion of selling leased equipment not a good idea. Not to mention your argument doesn't make that much sense to me.

The following is from the DirecTV Lease Addendum that comes with the receiver.

_Within 30 days of provision of DIRECTV equipment to you, or on the date that the professional installer has installed or is prepared to install your DIRECTV equipment, whichever is sooner, you agree to activate each and every DIRECTV Receiver ordered by you or provided to you&#8230;_​
Lease Addendum Link

You can't just stick it on a shelf some where and pretend it's owned.

Mike


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

keithw1975 said:


> So if I go out and buy a Directv DVR for $199 at some local store, like I have in the past, and take it home and throw it up on eBay selling it for whatever they are worth then how can they say it is a lease? They have no control over what I do with it and when I bought mine I didn't sign anything. I just went to Best Buy and paid them with cash. They didn't get my name or have me sign a contract.


That HR WILL be able to be activated, but as a leased receiver, not an owned one. And, yes, you can sell it. I think if someone bought it, they'd have to pay $20 for a new access card. Not sure about that.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

keithw1975 said:


> So in other words you do actually own it until you register it. If you buy it for $199 throw it in the closet and never activate it then you basically own it.


True statement. Kinda of an expensive way to make a point, tho. 

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> It's a lease because you're supposed to sign the lease agreement at the time of purchase. Unless you goal is to cheat the buyer by tellin them you won the receiver, they're not going to pay you more then they get the dang thing at BestBuy or Amazon so you're out the listing and purchase price fees at Ebay and you lost money.
> 
> BTW, discussion of selling leased equipment not a good idea. Not to mention your argument doesn't make that much sense to me.
> 
> ...


I know BB used to have that on the receipt when you purchased it. But, Costco never did. Of course Costco could track your purchase by your membership number, so perhaps you would get a notice that you had to activate it sometime up the road.

But I think you could buy one at Costco and stick it on a shelf and pretend it's owned. Kinda draconian way to satisfy yourself, never mind the expense. :lol:

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

matt1124 said:


> I have run across these on ebay. When you call about the RID they say that basically it doesn't exist in the system and it will be activated as a leased box. So, in a way, I guess that statement is correct, they don't know it exists for them to lease it to anyone!


I've run across a lot of them on eBay too. At least they can be activated, so the buyer isn't totally screwed as he/she would be if they bought a leased receiver. Gets kinda confusing, doesn't it, Matt? I mean, what are we doing when we put our money out initially? Purchasing it or leasing it on the spot? No wonder so many folks get confused.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Davenlr said:


> You can do anything you want, but the seller is going to give you awfully bad reviews when DirecTv tells your buyer he doesnt own the DVR, and has to agree to a two year contract to activate it. Its not like it isnt written all over the box.


If the buyer doesn't have the sense to check with D* and see if it is truly owned or has never been activated or is leased and cannot be activated, well, that's where caveat emptor kicks in. Notice how many offerings on eBay say that they will not accept returns?

Rich


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## keithw1975 (Oct 1, 2006)

rich584 said:


> True statement. Kinda of an expensive way to make a point, tho.
> 
> Rich


Yeah I know. Just saying that without any way to know who buys them at the subsidized price they can't really have any control over them until you use them on their system.

I had toyed with the idea of buying a DVR off e-bay to get the one I wanted but ended up going to BB. After reading this I am glad that I did.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

keithw1975 said:


> Yeah I know. Just saying that without any way to know who buys them at the subsidized price they can't really have any control over them until you use them on their system.
> 
> I had toyed with the idea of buying a DVR off e-bay to get the one I wanted but ended up going to BB. After reading this I am glad that I did.


I got six off eBay and Craigslist. Glad I got them when I did. The owned HRs on eBay don't last long. Someone makes the seller an offer he can't refuse and he pulls the plug on the offering.

Rich


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

rich584 said:


> Someone makes the seller an offer he can't refuse and he pulls the plug on the offering.
> 
> Rich


They don't for me, but I usually only offer about $50 :lol:


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## mikegold (May 14, 2002)

Beerstalker said:


> I'm not sure you understand what is going on here. No matter where you get the HR24 from you will actually be leasing it from DirecTV. The "seller" is just the distributor, you don't lease from them. So if you were to lease one from a place like Solid Signal, and they went out of business it wouldn't be a problem because your lease is actually with DirecTV and they will take care of you if the receiver dies.
> 
> Also, just so you know, even if you find an owned receiver to buy you will still have to pay $5 per month for them to mirror your programming to the receiver (unless it is your only receiver then the cost is included in your package cost).


Additionally, as happened to me, I owned three out of my four DVR's. When one of the owned DVR's had to be replaced under my equipment coverage it automatically converted from owned to leased in my account information online. Despite all of my protestations to DirecTV I still have not been able to get them to change it back.


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## mikegold (May 14, 2002)

richierich said:


> I have been told by Directv that if you Lease an HR24-500 and it goes bad they will Guarantee that the Replacement will be another HR24-500.
> 
> They will not do that for other models but they will do it for the HR24-500.


All of the receivers/dvr's I've had to have replaced over the years have ALWAYS been replaced with the same or better/newer equipment.


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## mikegold (May 14, 2002)

The whole "lease" thing is ridiculous. If it's a lease and we don't own the equipment, why are we paying anything to just get the box into the house? If DirecTV wants to retain ownership of the equipment that's fine but, don't ask me to first purchase the equipment and then pay you a monthly lease fee and then have to return the box to you when I no longer want it.

If I sign up with Cablevision and get their DVR/receiver I'm leasing the equipment from them and paying them monthly for the leased equipment. There's no upfront 'purchase' price.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

If you owned the equipment, you would still pay $5/month, although it would be called an "additional receiver fee" instead of a "leased receiver fee". I look at the $199 fee as a prepaid lease and the $5 as a charge for being able to get separate programming on two TVs.


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

gryphoncub said:


> I purchased a lease HR24 after getting confirmation that D* would credit my account. II made sure he noted the account as such. I received the HR24 today and will probably hook it up/activate it tomorrow. If D* refuses to issue the credit I will return the receiver to the merchant. I hope it goes ok.


 Once you activate it no dealer is going to take it back. If they do take it back in error after it has been activated DirecTV is going to hit you for a big $$$$ fee when you eventually need to return it to THEM. I would check with DirecTV just BEFORE you actually activate it.


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## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

mikegold said:


> The whole "lease" thing is ridiculous. If it's a lease and we don't own the equipment, why are we paying anything to just get the box into the house? If DirecTV wants to retain ownership of the equipment that's fine but, don't ask me to first purchase the equipment and then pay you a monthly lease fee and then have to return the box to you when I no longer want it.
> 
> If I sign up with Cablevision and get their DVR/receiver I'm leasing the equipment from them and paying them monthly for the leased equipment. There's no upfront 'purchase' price.


Do the math though.

DirecTV - $199 (down to free) up front, no monthly if it's your only receiver, $5 if it's additional
Cable - Typically $0 up front, but anywhere from $13-$20 a month fee.

Sure doesn't take long for cable to get up to that $199 mark and with cable you keep on paying forever. So you pay more with cable even though it's $0 up front.

So once you do the math you'll see that even though you pay an up front fee to DirecTV it's actually cheaper if you stay more then a year (in most cases).

Always good to do the math.


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## wingrider01 (Sep 9, 2005)

mikegold said:


> Additionally, as happened to me, I owned three out of my four DVR's. When one of the owned DVR's had to be replaced under my equipment coverage it automatically converted from owned to leased in my account information online. Despite all of my protestations to DirecTV I still have not been able to get them to change it back.


6 units, all owned, all have been replaced by the PP at one time or the other, all 6 are still flagged as owned. If they where replaced under the Protection Plan then call and ask for the access card department, they should be able to resolve the issue. If they where replaced without the Protection Plan nothing you can do, they are leased


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

mikegold said:


> Additionally, as happened to me, I owned three out of my four DVR's. When one of the owned DVR's had to be replaced under my equipment coverage it automatically converted from owned to leased in my account information online. Despite all of my protestations to DirecTV I still have not been able to get them to change it back.


Do you have the Protection Plan?

Rich


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## mikegold (May 14, 2002)

rich584 said:


> Do you have the Protection Plan?
> 
> Rich


Since day one.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

mikegold said:


> Since day one.


Huh. They're usually pretty good about keeping things straight. You might try calling the access card team and tell them what's happening.

Rich


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## Mark L (Oct 23, 2006)

rich584 said:


> Nor should the 20-700s be lumped together with the rest of the HRs. The HR24 should have been the next HR after the 20-700.
> 
> Consider the statements above before replying to this post, please. It seems logical to me. Think of all the complaints and problems that could have been avoided.
> 
> ...


Best post I've read in some time :righton:

You took the words right out of my mouth.

DirecTV went the cheap route and gave us knowingly inferior hardware for many years, all in favor of securing contracts through its subscribers............. thus creating more profitability and driving up their stock price.

Corporate greed strikes yet again.

Thank God I still have my HR20-700, cause the other HR2*'s absolutely blow!

I'll be purchasing an "owned" HR20-700 from a member on here vs. leasing and paying a $200 fee for a "Russian roulette HR2*". I'm honestly not confident I'll be with DirecTV for 24 more months (after 8 years of service), so it's better to go this route.

As more bandwidth becomes available in the U.S., I have a strong feeling we'll see cable and satellite companies lose millions of subs, due to massively cheaper options for streaming television online.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

Mark L said:


> Best post I've read in some time :righton:
> 
> You took the words right out of my mouth.
> 
> ...


To be fair, at the time the HR21 was released everyone was using the BCM7401 in their STBs; including TiVo HD, Dish Network DVRs, and Motorola to name a few.

I don't really it's fair to say they "knowingly" put out an inferior DVR. They didn't say "hey, lets put out some crap so we can get lambasted by our subs and the forums...yeah, let's do that." 

Let's not create some phantom conspiracy on DirecTV's part to put out an inferior product for the sake of profits.

I think it's far more likely that Broadcom had a single chip solution the replace the BCM7411/7038; after all Broadcom's boasts the same 300MHz CPU and similar specs for the BCM7401. The DVR manufactures (all the major players and not just DirecTV) decided to go with it. So would that be a bad decision on DVR manufactures part or good marketing on Broadcom's part. :grin:

I'll concede that the BCM7401 never performed as well as expected and that the 24 series is far quicker than any previous HR2x. However, having had an HR20, 21, 23, 24, IMHO the HR20 was quicker than 21/23 but no where near the HR24. AAMOF, it's closer in speed to the 21/23 than it is to the 24.

I really don't like the inability to deliver a particular DVR to a customer. I think that model was based on having all the same features and expecting the same performance. They shot themselves in the foot with that one. 

Hopefully they'll stick with hardware that can handle the ever expanding feature sets and not lose performance. But, it's certainly not a fair characterization to say they knew the performance would suck and did it anyway. The BCM7401 didn't meet the expectations; no conspiracy to found. 

Mike


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

MicroBeta said:


> To be fair, at the time the HR21 was released everyone was using the BCM7401 in their STBs; including TiVo HD, Dish Network DVRs, and Motorola to name a few.
> 
> I don't really it's fair to say they "knowingly" put out an inferior DVR. They didn't say "hey, lets put out some crap so we can get lambasted by our subs and the forums...yeah, let's do that."


No, they said "Hey, Motorola makes the best STBs, hands down, so let's do what they did!" :lol:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mark L said:


> Best post I've read in some time :righton:
> 
> You took the words right out of my mouth.
> 
> ...


I'm not too sure how long we'll have to wait for the streaming content to catch up with the PQ of the HRs when used on 1080p TV sets. I do think that the PQ of the Rokus is better than the HRs, but they only stream 720p and probably will continue to unless NetFlix starts streaming content at 1080i or higher. Their new boxes will do that and the older boxes will be getting an update soon that will allow, at least, the formerly top of the line XRs to get 1080p, but from where? I'm not interested in Amazon's streaming content, which is still in the 720p mode, or any other PPV movies. I haven't seen any mention of NetFlix upgrading to 1080 anything.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> To be fair, at the time the HR21 was released everyone was using the BCM7401 in their STBs; including TiVo HD, Dish Network DVRs, and Motorola to name a few.
> 
> I don't really it's fair to say they "knowingly" put out an inferior DVR. They didn't say "hey, lets put out some crap so we can get lambasted by our subs and the forums...yeah, let's do that."
> 
> ...


I've been using a 24-500 and a 24-200 along with my nine 20-700s and I really don't notice much speed difference. My wife's 21-700 is noticeably slower than the first three I mentioned.

Did they release an inferior HR21-xxx (plus the 23 and the two 22s) knowing that the performance would be worse than the 20-700s? I think they went for cheaper STBs and let the chips fall where they did. They certainly knew the 21 series would be cheaper.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

matt1124 said:


> No, they said "Hey, Motorola makes the best STBs, hands down, so let's do what they did!" :lol:


I used to test Motorola cell phones. Got $125 each time. Took less than an hour each time and was near my home. Never got one to test that I liked or would have bought. They finally got exasperated and asked me what I wanted in a cell phone. I took out my LG and showed them. Been a long time since they called me and they moved, so...

Man, they had crappy phones.

Rich


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## hidef2010 (Jul 28, 2010)

Hey guys, I am leasing an HR22-100 & H24-100 (2 year contract/ I am 2 months in), I was told that, if I wanted to buy/lease another receiver, say a new HR24-100 that my 2 year contract would start again from that point. Is this true?
Also, I already ran all the wires from my swim splitter to the other room of my potential new receiver, does D* have to send someone out to install it? *I don't want to pay *for a truck roll for something as simple as a hook up! I do home theatre set-up/calibration on the side, I am perfectly capable of doing this myself!

Any comments welcome!!
Thanks

Hidef2010


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

I made the mistake of buying a Motorola cell phone *once*. Now when it comes to business radios... they are the stuff baby.


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

hidef2010 said:


> Hey guys, I am leasing an HR22-100 & H24-100 (2 year contract/ I am 2 months in), I was told that, if I wanted to buy/lease another receiver, say a new HR24-100 that my 2 year contract would start again from that point. Is this true?
> Also, I already ran all the wires from my swim splitter to the other room of my potential new receiver, does D* have to send someone out to install it? *I don't want to pay *for a truck roll for something as simple as a hook up! I do home theatre set-up/calibration on the side, I am perfectly capable of doing this myself!
> 
> Any comments welcome!!
> ...


If you leased one it would start your contract over again for 2 years. They would not have to come out and install it for you. Just a quick note (since I sell them all the time) that adding an owned receiver to your account doesn't extend your commitment, but since you are only 2 months in, I wouldn't consider that a deal breaker to add 2 months back on.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

rich584 said:


> I've been using a 24-500 and a 24-200 along with my nine 20-700s and I really don't notice much speed difference. My wife's 21-700 is noticeably slower than the first three I mentioned.
> 
> Did they release an inferior HR21-xxx (plus the 23 and the two 22s) knowing that the performance would be worse than the 20-700s? I think they went for cheaper STBs and let the chips fall where they did. They certainly knew the 21 series would be cheaper.
> 
> Rich


They, and a most other manufactures, went with the BMC7401 because it was a cheaper overall option than the two chip configuration (BCM7411/BCM7038). That in no way means they intended to sacrifice performance for price. Of course it's only speculation on our part either way. Personally, I think it was a way to reduce the cost and it backfired by not holding up to the increases in functionality.

IMHO, my HR21-100 is slower then when I first got it. I ran it side by side with my HR20-700 and there was no where near the speed difference that I notice today. This seems to indicate that the functionality has outgrown the system which is based on 2006 capabilities. The all in one option doesn't seem to have handled the increased load very gracefully. Of course this is just a guess and I have no idea what they were thinking.

I'm sure that's why the 24 Series is based on having more horse power. They saw this coming and stepped up to deal with it. I have no idea how long the HR24 has been in testing but I'll bet it goes back a ways. They took the bull by the horns and came up with a new platform that will to handle the ever added functionality.

It is what it is. If we assume DirecTV intended to sacrifice performance (which I don't believe) then that would have to extend to that to all the other manufacturers who went with the 7401. :shrug:

Mike


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

matt1124 said:


> I made the mistake of buying a Motorola cell phone *once*. Now when it comes to business radios... they are the stuff baby.


Agreed, but they've had a kind of monopoly on them for a long time. The cell phones were terrible, but they were prototypes. I don't mean to give the impression that all Motorola phones are crap, just the prototypes that I tested.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> They, and a most other manufactures, went with the BMC7401 because it was a cheaper overall option than the two chip configuration (BCM7411/BCM7038). That in no way means they intended to sacrifice performance for price. Of course it's only speculation on our part either way. Personally, I think it was a way to reduce the cost and it backfired by not holding up to the increases in functionality.
> 
> IMHO, my HR21-100 is slower then when I first got it. I ran it side by side with my HR20-700 and there was no where near the speed difference that I notice today. This seems to indicate that the functionality has outgrown the system which is based on 2006 capabilities. The all in one option doesn't seem to have handled the increased load very gracefully. Of course this is just a guess and I have no idea what they were thinking.
> 
> ...


One of the problems you have with devices such as the DVRs is the time it takes for them to go down in performance. But the 20-700 never did. And it was more expensive than the 21 series. I don't think they took the time to test them properly and they went the cheaper way. I'm not sure it was a bad business decision, they sure sold a lot of the 21s and if the people who bought them were satisfied, as I'm sure most were, the decision to supplant the 20-700s with a string of inferior HRs was definitely a good decision from D*s point of view. In the end, the DVRs were safe and nobody got hurt. It's not like what Toyota did, that was dangerous.

A lot of people have criticized the lease program. That was a great business decision according to several people that I've spoken to.

They are a business, and they do seem to make strange decisions on some things, but when you examine them from their point of view, they've done well.

Rich


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

rich584 said:


> One of the problems you have with devices such as the DVRs is the time it takes for them to go down in performance. But the 20-700 never did. And it was more expensive than the 21 series. I don't think they took the time to test them properly and they went the cheaper way. I'm not sure it was a bad business decision, they sure sold a lot of the 21s and if the people who bought them were satisfied, as I'm sure most were, the decision to supplant the 20-700s with a string of inferior HRs was definitely a good decision from D*s point of view. In the end, the DVRs were safe and nobody got hurt. It's not like what Toyota did, that was dangerous.
> 
> A lot of people have criticized the lease program. That was a great business decision according to several people that I've spoken to.
> 
> ...


I have no problem with the lease program. I pay the same either way. I doesn't matter what the name on the fee is, it still costs the same.

Mike


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## hidef2010 (Jul 28, 2010)

matt1124 said:


> If you leased one it would start your contract over again for 2 years. They would not have to come out and install it for you. Just a quick note (since I sell them all the time) that adding an owned receiver to your account doesn't extend your commitment, but since you are only 2 months in, I wouldn't consider that a deal breaker to add 2 months back on.


Thanks Matt for your response.
So, are you saying if I purchase a new receiver from say you or solid signal all I have to do is call D* to activate it? Is there an activation charge?
OR 
If I order a new receiver from D* (lease obviously) they would just ship it to me and I can install it myself and just call in to activate it? Is this correct?

Thanks again

Hidef2010


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

hidef2010 said:


> Thanks Matt for your response.
> So, are you saying if I purchase a new receiver from say you or solid signal all I have to do is call D* to activate it? Is there an activation charge?
> OR
> If I order a new receiver from D* (lease obviously) they would just ship it to me and I can install it myself and just call in to activate it? Is this correct?
> ...


Either way you can call in and activate and there isn't an activation fee. Unless the receiver you are getting is already owned it will go down as a lease but, owned or leased, it will start a new two year commitment.

Mike


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## hidef2010 (Jul 28, 2010)

MicroBeta said:


> Either way you can call in and activate and there isn't an activation fee. Unless the receiver you are getting is already owned it will go down as a lease but, owned or leased, it will start a new two year commitment.
> 
> Mike


Thanks Mike I now understand....... I guess I will just buy a new HR24-100 and activate it like you said. 
Oh $*T, I just remembered.....how will my existing h24 know which recordings to access? My h24 is now linked MRV with my HR22-100, when I add the HR24-100 what will happen?:eek2:

Thanks
Hidef2010


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

hidef2010 said:


> Thanks Mike I now understand....... I guess I will just buy a new HR24-100 and activate it like you said.
> Oh $*T, I just remembered.....how will my existing h24 know which recordings to access? My h24 is now linked MRV with my HR22-100, when I add the HR24-100 what will happen?:eek2:
> 
> Thanks
> Hidef2010


All your receivers should see each other. If you add a new HR2x to the mix then you will see those recordings as a combined play list. Unfortunately it's all or nothing. You can view the playlist on the local receiver (assuming it's a DVR) or all the playlists. You cannot filter the play list by DVR.

As long as the new HR24 is connected to the same network (DECA or Ethernet) to the rest of the receivers it won't be a problem. It will just work.

Mike


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> I have no problem with the lease program. I pay the same either way. I doesn't matter what the name on the fee is, it still costs the same.
> 
> Mike


My point was that the leased HRs still were owned by D* and they would be able to use that fact to their financial benefit. Maybe they get to depreciate them? Stuff like that. My wife explained it to me when the leasing program went into effect. Don't remember much of it. She thought it was a good decision, for D*.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> Either way you can call in and activate and there isn't an activation fee. Unless the receiver you are getting is already owned it will go down as a lease but, owned or leased, it will start a new two year commitment.
> 
> Mike


New owned receivers don't trigger an extension of the commitment. Only leased.

Rich


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

rich584 said:


> New owned receivers don't trigger an extension of the commitment. Only leased.
> 
> Rich


Yes, you are correct. Sorry about that.

Mike


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

Yep. Just remember solid signal would send you a leased receiver. Some people care, others don't, and I am sure my feelings on it are well known by now.


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## Mark L (Oct 23, 2006)

I have a question that I've never seen asked before:


What if one were to purchase 2 DirecTV receivers, say a couple HR20-700s (RIDs owned), then go to DirecTV and ask to activate them under a new account? Is this allowed?

It would essentially be a 'month to month' commitment....... no?

I would much prefer this route, since the ball would be in the consumers court for once.


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

Mark L said:


> I have a question that I've never seen asked before:
> 
> What if one were to purchase 2 DirecTV receivers, say a couple HR20-700s (RIDs owned), then go to DirecTV and ask to activate them under a new account? Is this allowed?
> 
> ...


I have never done it, but I have heard that it is possible, but a PITA. I also heard that you will need all the info about the previous account it was on to go along with it. That could be BS, but that's what I was told by a friend that had someone in Canada trying to buy a receiver and open an account like that.


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