# Why I'm about to switch to Dish



## dkerr64 (Oct 10, 2011)

I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..

- The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
- The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.
- No Slingbox or equivalent. Everyone else has a solution (at least for in house which is all I need) for iPad/iPhone streaming.
- Nomad... an extra box, you kidding? And it doesn't even stream live. And you want me to pay for it when everyone else has it supported directly from the box (ViP922) or with free adapter (ViP722/622) or directly from cable company servers. 
- DirecTV2PC. Have been waiting YEARS for them to make this work on Apple Mac. Doesn't even work in BootCamp on iMacs, nor Windows in VMware. Come on DTV.
- BBC America -- Where is the HD feed? Huh?

DirecTV claims lots of extra HD channels, but not the mainstream ones. If you exclude sports networks, then Dish top 200/250 packages have more, way more.

Tell me I'm wrong. Tell me that these problems are all going to get fixed in the next month or two. Else I think I'm off to Dish.

DAK


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

You may want to only suspend your DirecTV account until you're sure the grass is greener on the other side. Good luck.


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## BosFan (Sep 28, 2009)

Okay, you're wrong! 
Seriously, you're the only person that can determine what is important to you. Other than the small hard drive comment none of the other items are important enough for me to make such a move. I have two DVRs and each has plenty of space for me, but they are newer. None of those things will be fixed soon enough for you so it's simply a matter of choice. Good luck and if you do switch let us know how it all goes fo anyone else who may consider switching either way.


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

trh said:


> You may want to only suspend your DirecTV account until you're sure the grass is greener on the other side. Good luck.


+1


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## TwoPhases (Jul 20, 2010)

I'd move to Dish asap if I were you. It seems they have all that you need.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

The slow HR20 issue will be resolved shortly.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

hilmar2k said:


> The slow HR20 issue will be resolved shortly.


Seems like we've been hearing that for just over five years and to date, the trend has been towards slower.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

dkerr64 said:


> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.


Anyone who argues otherwise is a fool.


> - The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.


You can fix this with an external hard drive. Not a pretty nor economical solution, but it works if you get the right parts.


> - No Slingbox or equivalent. Everyone else has a solution (at least for in house which is all I need) for iPad/iPhone streaming.


Get a Slingbox (or whatever Monsoon is offering these days). It should work just fine with an HR20.


> - Nomad... an extra box, you kidding? And it doesn't even stream live.


nomad is about having the content loaded. Many claimed that it was a streaming solution but they were fantasizing that it would be much more than DIRECTV2Go.


> - DirecTV2PC. Have been waiting YEARS for them to make this work on Apple Mac. Doesn't even work in BootCamp on iMacs, nor Windows in VMware. Come on DTV.


This is a significant omission but DISH doesn't do this any better.


> - BBC America -- Where is the HD feed? Huh?


An even more significant omission. Anyone who argues otherwise is a fool.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

harsh said:


> Seems like we've been hearing that for just over five years and to date, the trend has been towards slower.


Fortunately, actual customers with actual firsthand knowledge and use of the HR20 with a certain feature have proven this. Keep stirring the pot.


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

I guess "sluggish" is a relative term. I have an HR20 and I dont find it sluggish at all. Is it slower than the HR24? Probably, but not to the extent that I would call it sluggish.
EDIT: but apparently I am a fool


I am curious though, and this might be my own ignorance because I dont know a thing about Dish, but cant you add a 2TB drive to the HR20 and add a slingbox cheaper than the startup costs of Dish?


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Xsabresx said:


> I guess "sluggish" is a relative term. I have an HR20 and I dont find it sluggish at all. Is it slower than the HR24? Probably, but not to the extent that I would call it sluggish.
> EDIT: but apparently I am a fool
> 
> I am curious though, and this might be my own ignorance because I dont know a thing about Dish, but cant you add a 2TB drive to the HR20 and add a *slingbox* cheaper than the startup costs of Dish?


Or a Vulkano for even less.


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## msimanyi (Jun 17, 2007)

Speed can be helped a bit. I followed instructions from one of the threads on here, cleared the NVRAM and turned off scrolling effects, and that has certainly helped.

Here's a link to one thread discussing the NVRAM: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=192729&highlight=nvram

Scrolling effects can be turned off from the Display Preferences menu.

Hopefully the anticipated new HD GUI has a more pronounced effect.

As for capacity, your box should have an eSata port. Plug in an external eSata hard drive, restart your box, and you'll have all the capacity of that drive. You won't have access to your recordings on the internal drive, and you'll have to reset your Series Manager selections, but it's incredibly nice to have a ton of storage so easily.

I like the Western Digital external drives. I just picked up a 2TB unit from a local computer store for right around $200. It's not the cheapest way to go, but the case is nice and I trust WD to put together a box with a reliable power supply.

Good luck with your choices.

Mike


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## scorpion43 (Mar 16, 2011)

dkerr64 said:


> I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..
> 
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
> - The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.
> ...


just switch to dish and get it over with


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## Ira Lacher (Apr 24, 2002)

I notice HD picture quality was not on your list . . . 

Now before the flames begin . . .

I used to pooh-pooh this argument until I walked into my installer's store last week, intending to sign up for DISH, because I was tired of how DirecTV new customers get everything on a silver platter and long-time subscribers are expected to pay full price for everything or beg for discounts. 

The store was showing an ESPN NFL preview program from DISH and DirecTV, side by side on the exact same size and model TVs (new 50" Sony Bravias, calibrated exactly the same way. I verified this.). 

The DirecTV picture was far sharper and clearer. 

On DirecTV, NFL game-action video was sharp and unpixilated; the DISH video was soft and blurry. On DirecTV the lines on the studio personalities' faces showed up as clear as if you were standing next to them; they were very, VERY much softer on DISH, almost like looking thru an old pair of glasses. 

I never believed the argument about HD picture quality being so different. I believe it now.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

Though, and I have no reason to doubt this, I've heard from multiple sources that SD looks much better on Dish.


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## scorpion43 (Mar 16, 2011)

Ira Lacher said:


> I notice HD picture quality was not on your list . . .
> 
> Now before the flames begin . . .
> 
> ...


u don't happen to be a directv customer ?
now that explains why directv's picture looks better


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## Ira Lacher (Apr 24, 2002)

As I mentioned, I am a DirecTV customer who was walking into my installer to set up an imminent DISH install. I was doing this because I am mightily displeased with the company's "caviar for the new customer, gruel for the masses" way of doing business.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

dkerr64 said:


> ...
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
> ...
> - No Slingbox or equivalent. Everyone else has a solution (at least for in house which is all I need) for iPad/iPhone streaming.
> ...


Having had both services, I'll address what hasn't been addressed so far.

- I had HR20's for years, so I can tell you from first hand experience they are significantly slower than my Dish 722k. But, as others have said, a speed increase is coming soon, really and truly.

- Sling works fine and is free, unlike a stand-alone slingbox you could buy today for your HR20. Unlike Dish, slinging your HR20 takes over the whole DVR, so those watching locally have to watch what you're watching. And if you intend to use it a lot outside your home, make sure your ISP has a fast upload speed or you'll be disappointed.

- BBCA HD looks fantastic on Dish as do all the other HD channels. DirecTV HD PQ is indeed superior, but the visible difference is not significant to most people.

The system definitely favors new customers. With Dish you'll get new equipment, new customer deals, free unlimited blockbuster rentals and all the HD you desire. Two years from now DirecTV may have caught up, and you can switch back and get their new customer deals and the newest equipment. So you really have nothing to lose.


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## jssp8s (Sep 11, 2007)

I find SD to be clearer on Directv. I just switched over from Dish. Dish is good, but I switched because of sports.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

scorpion43 said:


> u don't happen to be a directv customer ?
> now that explains why directv's picture looks better


Not everyone is a fanboy, anymore than all Dish subscribers are.

If you feel the Dish picture is better, that's fine. Personally, even if it was better, there are other reasons I stay where I am. I don't think DirecTV has had outages like Dish has had this year for one.


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## larryah (Jul 29, 2010)

I had Dish for six years and I can tell you DTVs customer service is far superior. Everytime I would call Dish CS I would get someone who could barely speak english, and knew less than I did. And thats after waiting ten to twenty minutes to get through. When I have called DTV I have yet to have to wait to get through. They have all spoken english, and were very knowledgeable. I finally left Dish because they did a software update that caused my DVR to act up, and then wanted to charge me $50 and a new 18 month contract to send me an updated one. And I had paid for the service contract for six years! I told them to take a hike. I have no problem with Dishs picture or equipment, but their CS is horrible. Just want you know what you are in for if you change.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

The world is most certainly not a one-size-fits-all world. That is why there is competition and multiple service providers. If you have done your research and determined that Dish Network meets your needs better than DirecTV, then by all means make the change. As to whether or not you suspend or terminate your DirecTV service, that may depend at least in part whether or not you will have a service commitment with Dish. If you will, then it is not likely you would do an early termination to return to DirecTV. But that is also your choice entirely.

Whatever you decide, I hope you enjoy it. Give us an update in a month or so.


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## oldengineer (May 25, 2008)

I actually signed up for Dish on Sept 23, for much the same reasons as the OP. 3 hours after I signed up and paid $169.59 for first month service and a second HDDVR E* announced the Blockbuster Movie Pass and said it would be free to new subs after Oct 1. My deal was for 3 months free Platinum Pack and Blockbuster which became the Movie Pass so I was shorted out of 9 months or $90. I called E* back figuring they would give me the 1 year deal or a credit but no, they said I wasn't eligible. I cancelled.

I still may switch but now I'm gonna give D* a few weeks to implement the new GUI and hopefully add TCM and BBCA to the HD lineup.


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## n3vino (Oct 2, 2011)

I guess it is kind of crappy the way D* treats it's older loyal customers. I've read this argument several times. 

I'm a new customer, but I would not have made the switch had there not been a lower monthly premium for the first year, free installation, free upgrades to equipment, and no startup costs. I never paid TW, other than their monthly lease fee for boxes. If one broke, I took it in and just got a new one, so there is no way I would have paid anyone all kinds of money for their boxes, plus the monthly lease fees. I was not disatisfied with TW, and even if I was, there is no way I would have switched if it was going to cost me an arm and a leg to sign on. I was a TW customer for many years. 

The free premium channels, which I will cancel, the free Sunday Ticket for this year, and whole home DVR were just icing on the cake. But now they've got me and I do like it so far. I might not like it as much when all the freebies go away, and my premium goes up next year. 

Uverse and Dish also offer incentives to switch. TW is also offering incentives to switch some services and bundle with them. So it's a marketing tool to get new customers. But once they've got you, they've got you. Just thought you might be interested to hear from the other side of the fence.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

n3vino said:


> I guess it is kind of crappy the way D* treats it's older loyal customers. I've read this argument several times.


Yeah, and there have been stories of Dish customers and how they have been treated. Along with a lot of other service providers. It's not exactly unique.

OldEngineer was in a position where he could still cancel with no ETF, they lost a whole customer over it. When the Eastern Arc satellite went out, a friend lost at least local HD for several days and they wouldn't install the dish current customers got that would get around the issue. He had to stay with a double dish setup.


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## adkinsjm (Mar 25, 2003)

Just leave. Announcing your decision on here makes you seem like a whiner.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

adkinsjm said:


> Just leave. Announcing your decision on here makes you seem like a whiner.


How do you figure? He stated a list of concerns he had, and asked if there was anything in the works to remedy his concerns. Seemed like a logical post to me. Your comment on the other hand, has absolutely no added value to his questions. Perhaps you could address some of his concerns?


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## adkinsjm (Mar 25, 2003)

"Davenlr" said:


> How do you figure? He stated a list of concerns he had, and asked if there was anything in the works to remedy his concerns. Seemed like a logical post to me. Your comment on the other hand, has absolutely no added value to his questions. Perhaps you could address some of his concerns?


The OP could email the CEO.


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## MattScahum (Oct 27, 2010)

adkinsjm said:


> The OP could email the CEO.


Honestly, what would emailing the CEO accomplish..The OP isn't having a giant billing dispute, no complaints about installers, etc..They are just upset that the needs that they personally have aren't being met and another provider is offering solutions for them. I posted the entire post below and will elaborate....
I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..

- The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface. *This will be addressed very soon..the update will automatically download when it is released.*
- The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them. *As other users have suggested, you could try adding an ESata drive and that will definately increase the capacity, up to 2TB* 
- No Slingbox or equivalent. Everyone else has a solution (at least for in house which is all I need) for iPad/iPhone streaming. *You are able to use the slingbox with Directv, which admittedly does have limitations but it will work for what you are looking for*
- Nomad... an extra box, you kidding? And it doesn't even stream live. And you want me to pay for it when everyone else has it supported directly from the box (ViP922) or with free adapter (ViP722/622) or directly from cable company servers. *all the Nomad has EVER been is a means to access your recorded programming from a remote location. Any info to the contrary could easily be removed by following posts from the people that have been reporting on it up until the 1st look the other day, not just rumors that random posters had guessed on*
- DirecTV2PC. Have been waiting YEARS for them to make this work on Apple Mac. Doesn't even work in BootCamp on iMacs, nor Windows in VMware. Come on DTV. *nothing to say here as I do feel it should work with all platforms, but I can't say I'm shocked since it isn't a primary focus for Directv, more like a side project they do to add functionality for some customers*
- BBC America -- Where is the HD feed? Huh? *They will only add certain HD channels when they are either available or when negotiated for. Since that is one of their most requested channels and they honestly do monitor the polls they put out on these sites for things like that. I would say it is in the works but no timetable is out there yet*

DirecTV claims lots of extra HD channels, but not the mainstream ones. If you exclude sports networks, then Dish top 200/250 packages have more, way more. *I will definately have to disagree that Directv doesn't carry alot of mainstream HD channels. Off the top of my head I will say that TCM/E!/HLN/BBC/DIY are the only channels that I would consider to be mainstream. Others like Style/Wetv/LMN and other channels would be more niche' channels. Also, Directv models themselves a sports and premium subsciriber centric company. Dish markets towards the "average joe" type customer. There is a reason that Dish's marketing focuses on their lowest price package and Directv tends to market towards their sports packages/movie offerings/new equipment rollouts. When was the last time you saw a Dish network commercial mentioning the 922 with built in sling?*

Tell me I'm wrong. Tell me that these problems are all going to get fixed in the next month or two. Else I think I'm off to Dish. *In a month or two, yes, some of the issues you are mentioning can or will be fixed(mainly the HD GUI and storage cuz you could add ESata) but other than that I would say no and honestly you will probably be much happier with Dish. Just make sure you do all the research and make sure your upfront cost you will have and what you lose vs what you gain. Also make sure it is worth it to you because you will be there for 2 yrs so just keep that in mind.*

DAK


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

scorpion43 said:


> u don't happen to be a directv customer ?
> now that explains why directv's picture looks better


That's just scraping the barrel for low down insults.

I believe Ira's report regardless of which provider he uses.


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## Malibu13 (Sep 12, 2004)

BE NICE! 

Personal insults will not continue to be tolerated. The topic can be discussed without it getting personal.


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## Shaqdan (Jan 24, 2009)

BBC America is not a "mainstream" HD channel. Have fun with an inferior service.


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## Jon J (Apr 22, 2002)

Shaqdan said:


> BBC America is not a "mainstream" HD channel. Have fun with an inferior service.


Please expand. What is your definition of "mainstream" and whose service is inferior...BBCA, DirecTV, your cableco?


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

I believe he means only a few fringe lunatics watch BBCA or any other HD channel DirecTV doesn't have, and that everyone except DirecTV is an inferior service.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Come now... you were asked to be nice. If this thread can't continue politely it will be closed and infractions issued.


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## BosFan (Sep 28, 2009)

Seems the one things missed here is this is the OPs first post and no one, including me, has welcomed him/her...

Welcome to DBSTALK! :welcome_s


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

To the OP. Some of the issues you bring up are very valid, and should be addressed at some point in time, by Direct with additional HD channels and such. But who knows in what time frame? 

If you are an avid sports fan, you will miss some of that with a switch to Dish. Their emphasis is not on sports. But they do have some basic HD that you have indicated is important. So from a programming point of view, you have to decide which is more important.

As to your aging HR20, well as long as D* makes the assumption that one HR is the same as the next, despite all the differences, you're pretty much stuck unless you want to add an eSATA HD to your HR20 or pony up around $200 for a brand spanking new HR24 which you can buy from a number of places, but you can't buy it from Direct since they count one HR the same as the next. Oh and if you decide to get a new HR, you invoke a 2-year commit again.

But if you switch to Dish, you get a 2 year commit there too, so I guess it is a wash from that standpoint.

Both services are fine, but each has their own unique approach to satellite TV service. I know, I've had both and just switched from Dish to Direct in the last couple months. I find I like lots of things about both services, and have an equal list of things I don't like about each service. One is not inferior, they are each different.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

dkerr64 said:


> I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..
> 
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
> - The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.
> ...


Well you can add a 2Tb external eSATA drive and expand your storage which will replace the internal drive. This means that you have to unplug the eSATA the right way and reboot to use the internal drive and watch anything there.

The Dishnetwork approach is different. Everything records to the internal drive and can be moved and viewed from a USB 2 External drive . You can use more than one of these external drives to organize by category. Examples would be one for TV Shows, One for Holiday shows, One for Movies etc.

One other thought if you are recording more than you can watch and they get deleted no matter how much storage you have eventually it will fill up and you will be in the same boat. I call that the closet law. No matter how big the closet it will eventually end up overfilled.

I guess you can always buy a Slingbox for your HR20.



Xsabresx said:


> I guess "sluggish" is a relative term. I have an HR20 and I dont find it sluggish at all. Is it slower than the HR24? Probably, but not to the extent that I would call it sluggish.
> EDIT: but apparently I am a fool
> 
> I am curious though, and this might be my own ignorance because I dont know a thing about Dish, but cant you add a 2TB drive to the HR20 and add a slingbox cheaper than the startup costs of Dish?


Well I don't know about cost? As for the difference between Dishnetwork and DirecTV as regards externals see my above reply.

Once can give you a big fast drive for everything and the other can give you unlimited except for cost external storage that can be easily changed and categorized by type of content.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

trh said:


> You may want to only suspend your DirecTV account until you're sure the grass is greener on the other side. Good luck.


If they sign up with Dish they are in a 2 year commitment so suspending will do no good. Research first makes better sense IMO.



mdavej said:


> The system definitely favors new customers. With Dish you'll get new equipment, new customer deals, free unlimited blockbuster rentals and all the HD you desire. Two years from now DirecTV may have caught up, and you can switch back and get their new customer deals and the newest equipment. So you really have nothing to lose.


That Blockbuster deal is a nice bonus for new customers. No doubt about it.



larryah said:


> I had Dish for six years and I can tell you DTVs customer service is far superior. Everytime I would call Dish CS I would get someone who could barely speak english, and knew less than I did. And thats after waiting ten to twenty minutes to get through.


I'm not sure who you were calling however....
I just dealt with Dish today for my parents house. They need a realignment.

I did the chat since parents will not use internet and I get to phone or chat for them. I did chat since I'm at work.

The English was clear and concise. I believe in all the times I have used the phone when I was sitting there only one time did I get a person with a accent.

OT Mon loved the Dishplayer. It allowed her to pause a channel for hours and when she came back it would still be buffering.


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## bobvick1983 (Mar 21, 2007)

You will certanly have to be the one that makes the decsion about what is best for you, you are the only one that can decide that. I can tell you as a former Dish Network subscriber my opinion. DirecTV has far better customer service than Dish Network. At Dish most of the time you will know more than the CSR does, most of the time they ended up making things worse than better. DirecTV in my opinion has better service, any time I have called them the person has been very knowledgeable and has been more than happy to help me and they have resolved the issue that I called about. As far as the performance of your HR-20, you will be pleasntly surprised when the new HD GUI is released. Add an external HDD and you will have all of the recording capacity that you need. I can also tell you that DirecTV does an AMAZING job with their HD feeds. I have a FTA C-Band system. Occasionally the master feed of certain cable networks are in the clear. I have compared these master feeds to what DirecTV distributes from the same source, they look nearly as good on DirecTV as on the master feed. I can not tell very much difference at all. On Dish Network, you can tell quite a bit of difference. Not that the Dish feed is by any means unwatchable, but DirecTV definitely does better. For the slingbox issue, that is something that you will have to decide. I had a Dish 922 receiver that had sling built in, I used it some with my iPhone, but unless you have a very robust internet connection, it is not going to perform very well. That is the problem I had with it, but 1.5/256K is all I can get where I live so I am sure that that had an impact on my experience with it.


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## rphillips187 (Oct 14, 2007)

I just recently switched from Dish to DirecTV a few months ago and it is the best decision I could have made. My HR24-500 beats the pants off my VIP722 in functionality, ease of use and stability. Dish doesn't give you MRV (sorry, a two-room DVR that only delivers HD to one TV doesn't count). I've also noticed a huge improvement in my signal during inclement weather. Just my take...

Oh, and E* is no less guilty of giving their new customers all the goodies than D*. They all play that game.


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

TBoneit said:


> Well I don't know about cost? As for the difference between Dishnetwork and DirecTV as regards externals see my above reply.
> 
> Once can give you a big fast drive for everything and the other can give you unlimited except for cost external storage that can be easily changed and categorized by type of content.


I knew the externals could be added as I have a 1TB connected to me HR20 and a 2TB connected to my HR23. I was just curious if the cost to add those things (eSATA and Sling) would be cheaper than starting over from scratch with DISH.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

You get the same from Dish for free (VIP922 with 1TB and integrated Sling). So it's a good deal for those getting only one or two receivers. But in your case (according to your signature), Dish will be much more expensive due to the number of boxes you have.


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## gsocal2011 (Oct 23, 2011)

I'm with Time Warner right now, just signed up for Dish Network install for next week, but now thinking maybe DirectTV or waiting for Dish for the XIP 813...any idea when this comes out ? On Dish right now I'd only receive HD on one TV and it's not true whole house DVR...any thoughts?


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## gsocal2011 (Oct 23, 2011)

I chatted with "Loyalty" rep through dishnetwork.com site, apparently that's the retention for new orders. Very dissapointed by response to my questions regarding whole house DVR, etc. was offered 3 Pay Per View coupons if I agreed not to cancel...LOL, if that's what they call a "retention" offer, maybe I better start considering DirectTV


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

gsocal2011 said:


> I'm with Time Warner right now, just signed up for Dish Network install for next week, but now thinking maybe DirectTV or waiting for Dish for the XIP 813...any idea when this comes out ? On Dish right now I'd only receive HD on one TV and it's not true whole house DVR...any thoughts?


Well, DIRECTV's current deal for new customers is one HD DVR and 3 HD receivers as part of the basic install. If you went with DIRECTV I'd recommend getting at least two HD DVR's if you can afford it. Sorry, can't answer the XIP question, all I've seen is a rumor that Echostar is supposed to send the first boxes to Dish next month and then late winter/early spring 2011 for when customers could get them.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

I'm a Dish sub anxiously awaiting the XIP, hopefully early next year according to the rumor mill. I dropped DirecTV for Dish because Dish had a lot more basic HD content (got to have my Top Gear in HD). If that's not a factor for you, then DirecTV is definitely the best bang for the buck these days. MRV is great, and so is free ST, $30/month for year 1 and $15/month off for year 2. Dish is only $15/month off for a year. But they do have sling and a blockbuster by mail add-on with limited streaming fairly cheap.


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

We should have an automated "I'm leaving DirecTV" thread that gets posted fresh daily with copies of the same replies that get posted each time.


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## Yankee (Oct 24, 2011)

I made the swith from Directv last to Dish Network last week and let me tell ya i like dish better good service good custermer service i have there vip 722 dvr and two vip211k whats good bout Dishes boxes you can external hard drives to there boxes even the non dvr's you can and it will turn it into a dvr but anyways i feel dish is better because there boxes are heck of alot faster better service and better picture and im paying bout 18 dollars cheaper a month for basically the same package i had with Directv just took a while getting use it it with the guide but Dish is alot better


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Please: Use punctuation, capitalization and short-to-medium sentences.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

Dish (or DirecTV) isn't absolutely better than another, you can't state it like a fact. It's subjective, it is better for certain people.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"dpeters11" said:


> Dish (or DirecTV) isn't absolutely better than another, you can't state it like a fact. It's subjective, it is better for certain people.


Hey! How dare you use logic and truth in this discussion! 

That really is as true as it can be. Some people have to have bbca in hd, so they run to another provider. I have all the channels I want in hd, so that's not an issue for me, but I have so many dvrs that it's impossible to ever get the same amount of equipment for anywhere near the same fees at any other provider, especially my local cable company.

Personally, I would always start a search for a provider based on what channels are available in hd, knowing that 90% of them need to be in hs for me to consider a provider. Then I start looking at everything else.


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## dkerr64 (Oct 10, 2011)

Okay, I'm back (the OP). I thought I owed everyone an update and my thanks for all the comments posted here. So...

1) I'm still with DirectTV. Maybe I'm procrastinating, maybe I just have faith that my concerns will get addressed sooner rather than later. Certainly I'm loyal.

2) I have a 1.5TB internal HD lying around unused. I've bought an eSATA enclosure and am waiting for the cable to arrive (Why sell an eSATA enclosure with only a USB cable in the box?)

3) I look forward to the new GUI (probably the main reason I am still with DTV because if performance in improved as claimed it will help my satisfaction a lot).

4) I have a Vulkano. Have had it for a while. It is NOT the same as built-in support for streaming to another device on your home network. Nor is an external Slingbox. The "right" solution is for it to be built into the DVR or have support from central servers, like cable providers do. It baffles me why DTV is dragging their feet on this when they "beta tested" DirecTV2PC for years (and admittedly didn't get it right) but they were leaders in this area for a long time.

5) I spoke to DirecTV customer service and established that I am not bound to any contract so could leave any time. They did offer me a $20 month loyalty credit for 6 months, no strings attached (i.e., I can still leave if I choose).


Thanks again for everyone's comments.

DAK


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

dkerr64 said:


> 4) I have a Vulkano. Have had it for a while. It is NOT the same as built-in support for streaming to another device on your home network. Nor is an external Slingbox. The "right" solution is for it to be built into the DVR or have support from central servers, like cable providers do. It baffles me why DTV is dragging their feet on this when they "beta tested" DirecTV2PC for years (and admittedly didn't get it right) but they were leaders in this area for a long time.


They are working on this they are just doing it a bit differently. They have Nomad for allowing you to take your recordings with you wherever you want and you don't have to rely on access to high speed internet. They are also signing deals with the content providers to get us access to stuff like HBO Go, Max Go, TBS, TNT, Cartoon Network, Adult Swim, CNN etc. so we can stream them to our phones/tablets/computers when we do have access to high speed internet. I'm hoping they eventually come out with one DirecTV app that will be able to work with all of the different providers streams so we don't have to have seperate apps for each channel.

I don't think that we will ever see anything like Slingbox being built into DirecTV equipment though.


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## E91 (Oct 7, 2008)

dpeters11 said:


> Dish (or DirecTV) isn't absolutely better than another, you can't state it like a fact. It's subjective, it is better for certain people.


Having had both in recent years, I can state with some degree of objectivity that neither is really better. DISH was a great company to deal with (at least for me) and I liked a lot of things about their service. I thought the price was great too, and I'd probably still be with them if they had all the HD sports content I wanted. D* is a bit more overpriced, but the product feels more polished to me, and I get my hockey games in HD.

Honestly, I couldn't recommend one over the other. Its all about what you want in terms of programming, and perhaps which equipment line you like better.


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## bobvick1983 (Mar 21, 2007)

Yankee said:


> I made the swith from Directv last to Dish Network last week and let me tell ya i like dish better good service good custermer service i have there vip 722 dvr and two vip211k whats good bout Dishes boxes you can external hard drives to there boxes even the non dvr's you can and it will turn it into a dvr but anyways i feel dish is better because there boxes are heck of alot faster better service and better picture and im paying bout 18 dollars cheaper a month for basically the same package i had with Directv just took a while getting use it it with the guide but Dish is alot better


I hope that you continue to have good customer service from Dish Network. I was with them for two years, and I could not stand their customer service department. Most of the CSRs were completely incompetent, and had a very bad attitude. I have had to call DirecTV on several occasions for various issues since I have been back with them and I have been very pleased with their service all of the CSRs I have spoken with have been very knowledgeable and polite, and make you feel appreciated as a customer. As far as Dish equipment vs. DirecTV, I think that both have very good equipment. I always liked the 722 DVR, but I have become quite fond of the HR24. I also really like the MRV from DirecTV. Before I had to have a HDMI extender and swap inputs on my TV to watch recordings from the additional 722 that I had. I like MRV much better as it reduces the wiring requirement and I don't have to switch inputs. I am also very pleased with the HD quality from DirecTV, which is, in my opinion superior to that of Dish Network. In any case, I hope that Dish continues to serve you well.


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## jtravisdavid (Oct 27, 2003)

I switched from Dish to Directv about 6 weeks ago. I was always happy with Dish, but the reason I switched was Directv offers locals in HD in my area (Amarillo, TX), whereas Dish still does not. I got tired of watching the locals in SD as OTA for HD locals was not working well for me and football season was about to start. 

Here is my two cents:

I always had a good experience with Dish's customer service. Rarely had to sit on hold and can never remember getting frustrated with who I got on the line. I have not had any experience with Directv's customer service yet.

Dish's price is a little lower IF you only need their one two tuner receiver (I had the 722). But then your second TV is not in HD.

I have whole home DVR with 2 HR24s. I am pretty happy with my setup. I get HD on all my TVs whereas in the past I only had it on the main tv. I do wish the two DVR's were a bit more intelligently linked together. I wish I could tell the system to record a show on the other room's DVR via the recording menu. Right now I have to use the smartphone app in order to select the receiver to record a program on. But maybe there's a better way I'm just not yet aware of...

The Dish tv guide is better than Directv's. It shows more timeslots at once and is just as easy to read as Directv's. 

HD picture quality MAY be a SMIDGE better on Directv. Or it could just be my imagination or subconscious confirmation bias.

Directv definately has a sports bias. Whether or not that's something you're interested in is another question. I do miss BBC America in HD.

All in all, I don't really feel one service is substantially different for the average consumer.

Best of luck!


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## jswinner (Dec 21, 2007)

jtravisdavid said:


> I switched from Dish to Directv about 6 weeks ago. I was always happy with Dish, but the reason I switched was Directv offers locals in HD in my area (Amarillo, TX), whereas Dish still does not. I got tired of watching the locals in SD as OTA for HD locals was not working well for me and football season was about to start.
> 
> Here is my two cents:
> 
> ...


Called DTV to deactivate my SD receiver. We talked discounts, they gave me $5/m off. The only issue I have is that even with that, I can save over $500 in the next 2 years switching to DN for my single TV setup. I did not demand anything or threaten to cancel. I was with Dish before DTV. With Dish, I can drop my netflix, as we have a brick and mortar blockbuster still open nearby. Being a loyal customer these days only means a lot $ out your pocket going to TV, cell and Internet providers.


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## wolfjc (Oct 4, 2006)

dpeters11 said:


> Yeah, and there have been stories of Dish customers and how they have been treated. Along with a lot of other service providers. It's not exactly unique.
> 
> OldEngineer was in a position where he could still cancel with no ETF, they lost a whole customer over it. When the Eastern Arc satellite went out, a friend lost at least local HD for several days and they wouldn't install the dish current customers got that would get around the issue. He had to stay with a double dish setup.


I am with Dish and two years ago Dish came out a installed a new 1004 western arch dish which replaced my two dish setup.
This cost me a two year agreement which was no big deal as I was not leaving Dish I did not have to pay any $$.
So I don't know what you are talking about unless in the two years since Dish took care of me they changed how they do updates.


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## ThomasM (Jul 20, 2007)

dpeters11 said:


> Though, and I have no reason to doubt this, I've heard from multiple sources that SD looks much better on Dish.


Oh, I don't know. I think SD on DirecTV is pretty darn good since that's all I have!!


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## fourhokiefans (Jul 27, 2009)

I've been with both. First with Directv in 1994 To Dish in 1995 for the next 8 years or so, then back to Directv with which I remain. I changed based upon my needs and my assessment as to the providers' ability to meet them. You're a big boy, make up your mind and change. Your query is argumentative - typical of many posts here.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"ThomasM" said:


> Oh, I don't know. I think SD on DirecTV is pretty darn good since that's all I have!!


I think I was mainly thinking SD on an HDTV. If you have SD receivers on SD TVs, I think it looks different than SD on a widescreen HDTV. I have heard Dish SD looks better on an HDTV than DirecTV.


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## Jodean (Jul 17, 2010)

Ira Lacher said:


> I notice HD picture quality was not on your list . . .
> 
> Now before the flames begin . . .
> 
> ...


I have never seen a blurry picture on EITHER provider on ESPN. I have seen Dish equipment set to 480 instead of 720 or 1080, its way deep in the menu unlike with directv.

With that said, I have seen horrible picture on HBO on direct where dish is crystal clear, Not to mention you get another 15+ movie channels in HD with dish.

Anyhow, your experience at the store may be true, but it sounds like they were playing you even though you thought you checked all the settings.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

ThomasM said:


> Oh, I don't know. I think SD on DirecTV is pretty darn good since that's all I have!!


I think it depends on what size TV you are watching the SD programming on. On my old 27" analog set that I occasionally watch, SD looks decent. On my 50" flat screen, SD channels are hard to watch, especially stretched to 16 x 9. Its very rare I watch SD programming, but on occasion there is something I want to watch that is only in SD.


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## mreposter (Jul 29, 2006)

Jodean said:


> I...Not to mention you get another 15+ movie channels in HD with dish...


With Directv's HD additions several months ago, I believe they now offer far more premium movie channels in HD. For instance, Directv has 8 Cinemax in HD while Dish only has 4 and Directv has 8 Showtime channels in HD to Dish's 4.

Dish does offer the PLEX and EPIX channels not currently on Directv.


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## ChicagoBlue (Apr 29, 2011)

dkerr64 said:


> I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..
> 
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
> - The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.
> ...


They could use you. Lost another 110K customers announced today. 6th quarter of 7 they have been losing customers.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

RACJ2 said:


> I think it depends on what size TV you are watching the SD programming on. On my old 27" analog set that I occasionally watch, SD looks decent. On my 50" flat screen, SD channels are hard to watch, especially stretched to 16 x 9. Its very rare I watch SD programming, but on occasion there is something I want to watch that is only in SD.


SD should be viewed in as small an area as practical; therefor, no stretching. Praise the black bars, for they help prevent those poor little pixels from being spread out too thin. YMMV.....


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

Laxguy said:


> SD should be viewed in as small an area as practical; therefor, no stretching. Praise the black bars, for they help prevent those poor little pixels from being spread out too thin. YMMV.....


I agree with you on no stretching of SD. I just feel like I'm being cheated, if I don't use all the real estate on my screen. So I usually stretch it and end up changing it right back to 4:3.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

RACJ2 said:


> I agree with you on no stretching of SD. I just feel like I'm being cheated, if I don't use all the real estate on my screen. So I usually stretch it and end up changing it right back to 4:3.


Hah! PIP, when I use it, gets its most use out of shrinking down a pixel-starved feed. But most days, I am able to get by without dipping into SD at all. :sure:


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Laxguy said:


> Hah! PIP, when I use it, gets its most use out of shrinking down a pixel-starved feed. But most days, I am able to get by without dipping into SD at all. :sure:


What Is SD???


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

richierich said:


> What Is SD???


20th C technology! Way better than 19th C! Now, I am waiting for The Next Big Thing! 20,000,000 pixels, yeah, Baby!


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I heard the other day that the Japanese will be helping us get High Definition in the very near Future!!!

Can you believe that???

I saw 480I the other day and almost threw up!!! :lol:


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

ChicagoBlue said:


> They could use you. Lost another 110K customers announced today. 6th quarter of 7 they have been losing customers.


If you're comparing the lost customers numbers (and ignoring the percentages), DIRECTV lost 186,000 more (953,000) existing customers than DISH did. Of course DIRECTV has almost 7 million (43%) more customers to lose.

What financial information has to do with a consumer's choice of TV providers is something that few can appreciate because there is so little relation.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

harsh said:


> What financial information has to do with a consumer's choice of TV providers is something that few can appreciate because there is so little relation.


Those who are comfortable in thought about only the short term financial results will see no relationship.

Long term, financial results have everything to do with a consumer's choice.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Laxguy said:


> Those who are comfortable in thought about only the short term financial results will see no relationship.
> 
> Long term, financial results have everything to do with a consumer's choice.


Really? I was in sales and marketing for a lot of years, and have been a consumer of goods and services longer than that, and I can tell you that only those that have way too much time on their hands care about the 'long term financial results' other than if long term means in the 2 years of the contract with D* or E* for instance. Or if they are investing in the stock.

As a consumer of satellite/cable services, I'm interested in :
#1 - what channels do you have in HD?
#2 - what channels do you have overall?
#3 - what are your prices like?
#4 - what's your equipment like?
#5 - what special features do you offer?

And I'd bet my list is more accurate for more consumers of sat/cable service than your 'long term financial...'! And honestly, I doubt as a salesperson for these goods and service that most of those questions even get asked in the sales process...


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Laxguy said:


> Long term, financial results have everything to do with a consumer's choice.


Churn is not a good indicator of financial health in the long or short term. Some of DIRECTV's most difficult quarters were ones where the net additions were the highest (and Q3 was no exception).

Using DIRECTV's historically high gross adds quarter is misleading when trying to show a trend.

Given that you're committing to no more than 24 months with anyone you choose, it probably isn't going to hurt if you save some money for a while and when you have the choice again, it is always good being a born again virgin.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Gents-

Without good long term financial results, the consumer will have fewer choices in providers. 

Changes effected in Quarter One will show de minimus results if any in Q1. Results get spread out over many quarters, perhaps even many years if the change is significant enough.


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## cypherx (Aug 27, 2010)

To the OP,

It may be worth your while to give Dish a go... but remember it's another 2 year contract. I'm not sure if they have any grace period like some cell phone companies (14 days to 30 days) where you can cancel without penalty, but you would want to look into it.

Do you have any friends or family with Dish Network? I would encourage you to play with it before jumping ship.

Yes, they do have a different selection of HD channels which is really nice.

I prefer DirecTV's equipment and GUI over Dish Network.

I hope that those missing HD channels come to DirecTV someday, but I don't think many more will come until 2014 when the new D14 is launched into orbit and tested.

To each his own.... every provider has it's pro's and cons. I for one wish they would merge. Then finally we can get the missing HD, Dish can get the missing sports and MR-DVR, plus a better user interface, and possibly better HD picture quality. Imagine what we could do if we had that ENTIRE FLEET of satellites out there. BANDWIDTH GALORE.

I know it's Swanni so take it with a grain of salt, but today he brings up some comments about "Could Dish and DirecTV merge?"
http://www.tvpredictions.com/ergen110811.htm


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

cypherx said:


> I hope that those missing HD channels come to DirecTV someday, but I don't think many more will come until 2014 when the new D14 is launched into orbit and tested.
> 
> To each his own.... every provider has it's pro's and cons. I for one wish they would merge. Then finally we can get the missing HD, Dish can get the missing sports and MR-DVR, plus a better user interface, and possibly better HD picture quality. Imagine what we could do if we had that ENTIRE FLEET of satellites out there. BANDWIDTH GALORE.


Oh, Lord, NOOOOOOO! While the benefits you mention are possible, maybe even probable in the short term- a few years- soon the dreaded monopoly effect would likely take ahold. Then you'd really hear some squealing.


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## jahgreen (Dec 15, 2006)

cypherx said:


> To the OP,
> I for one wish they would merge. Then finally we can get the missing HD, Dish can get the missing sports and MR-DVR, plus a better user interface, and possibly better HD picture quality. Imagine what we could do if we had that ENTIRE FLEET of satellites out there. BANDWIDTH GALORE.
> 
> I know it's Swanni so take it with a grain of salt, but today he brings up some comments about "Could Dish and DirecTV merge?"
> http://www.tvpredictions.com/ergen110811.htm


Reducing competition is seldom a benefit to the consumer.


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## cypherx (Aug 27, 2010)

jahgreen said:


> Reducing competition is seldom a benefit to the consumer.


I sometimes forget that cable is not available to everyone, especially those in real rural or "the sticks".

I've always had "competition" available. Right now Service Electric Cablevision competes with DirecTV and Dish Network in my area. About a mile over it's Comcast. 30 miles north to Allentown, it's RCN, Service Electric and in some lucky parts, FIOS.

Sorry about that!


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Yep, you city dwellers forget about us out in the toolies!! 

Here we have Mediacom cable and in some of the other small towns here there are various other cable providers, but never more than one per area. Our largest town is maybe 20K when the students are in town for the University.

Mediacom isn't even worth mentioning here...


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## scsa1000 (Feb 11, 2011)

Why I don't get dish at all there choices for ppv movies I dont get they show the inventor movie but they won't have cars 2 at all wth. They have small movies on ppv not the big sellers lol ok.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

True. But you can get the big ones from Dish on disc via blockbuster, which is much cheaper per title than ppv and better quality ($10 unlimited blu-ray vs. $6 for a single movie). Not as convenient as ppv, I know, but I've never thought that convenience was worth 4 times the price of say a redbox rental. Of course I understand the need for ppv if you can't/don't get out much.


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## Rasterburn (Nov 2, 2009)

MattScahum said:


> Honestly, what would emailing the CEO accomplish..The OP isn't having a giant billing dispute, no complaints about installers, etc..They are just upset that the needs that they personally have aren't being met and another provider is offering solutions for them. I posted the entire post below and will elaborate....
> I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..
> 
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface. *This will be addressed very soon..the update will automatically download when it is released.*
> ...


Dak, MattScahum is correct in most cases. Here is some other things you might like to know about dish (according to their own agreement on their website). First you are comparing a piece of equipment you have had for probably 4 yrs now to brand new equipment you will get with dish upfront. You are comparing dish's new customer offer with directv regular prices after the new customer offer is done. what you should do is compare dish after discounts to directv you have now without discounts. On november 8 2011 directv launches the new interface update which will speed up the slowness.

Secondly, the harddisk is small, compared to new dish equipment, but if you upgrade to a hr24 then you will have more space then dish. Also a little know fact, you can hook up a external hard-drive on your hddvr with dtv for free while if you hook one up with Dish you have an External Hard Drive Activation Fee of $39.99 a one time charge if you have a ViP receiver and you choose to connect an external hard drive to that receiver.

Third, tehcnically a Nomad is a slingbox since the purpose of a slingbox is to allow you to to watch your cable TV when we're away from home. And it allows you to do that even if its recordings and not live tv. Also some customers with Dish can pay or have paid upto $200 one time fee to activate the sling system.

Fourth, Direct2PC is actually being blocked because of Mactv and apple trying to go to that for the las 4yrs, plus most people dont use macs, so of course Windows was first it makes more business sense, but guess what Dish doesnt have anything like this either so what was your point in the first place.

Lastly, lets really talk HD. Dish has BBC America HD, Cooking Channel HD, E! Entertainment Television HD, Lifetime Movie Network HD, Nat Geo HD, TLC HD, and G4 HD to name a few that Directv doesnt have right now. On Dish, Big Ten Network HD * = Available in: Ohio, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Illinois, Nebraska and sections of Pennsylvania and Indiana, no where else. But Dish is also missing the following that Directv has @MAX HD, ESPNU HD, SHOWTIME Beyond HD, SHOWTIME Extreme HD, ABC Family HD Fuel TV HD, SHOWTIME Next HD, Audience Network (prev. 101 Network), HD GolTV HD, SHOWTIME Women HD, Mega TV HD, Smithsonian Channel HD, MoreMAX HD, Starz Cinema HD, Disney Channel HD, Starz InBlack HD, Disney XD HD, ThrillerMAX HD, ESPNews HD, and WMAX (WomensMAX) HD. The problem is not with Directv or Dish, the problem is who owns the chs and what deals do they have with each company.

Also, call the retention department for Directv if you are still with them and see what upgrades you can get. Most time they will help you if you are a good customer. And what I mean by "good customer" is do you pay on time? do you currently not have lots of credits given to you. every company takes this into effect and looks at this.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

Rasterburn said:


> ...Third, tehcnically a Nomad is a slingbox since the purpose of a slingbox is to allow you to to watch your cable TV when we're away from home. And it allows you to do that even if its recordings and not live tv. Also some customers with Dish can pay or have paid upto $200 one time fee to activate the sling system.
> 
> Fourth, Direct2PC is actually being blocked because of Mactv and apple trying to go to that for the las 4yrs, plus most people dont use macs, so of course Windows was first it makes more business sense, but guess what Dish doesnt have anything like this either so what was your point in the first place...


Good points. No doubt D* has Dish beaten on sports and premiums, just as Dish has D* beaten on basics. But the sling info isn't quite right.

Last time I checked, the sling adapter and service was free and didn't require you to pull your recordings off ahead of time. So while Nomad is cool and quite useful, it's no sling.

Sling is also Dish's answer to Direct2PC, which works fine on Mac and always has. There are a lot of Mac users that would love to have something like Direct2PC. But then they'd have to rename it Direct2Mac


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## dishrich (Apr 23, 2002)

Rasterburn said:


> Secondly, the harddisk is small, compared to new dish equipment, but if you upgrade to a hr24 then you will have more space then dish. Also a little know fact, you can hook up a external hard-drive on your hddvr with dtv for free


Yea, but adding an external hd to the DirecTV DVR's *replaces* the internal one - while on DISH, you can quickly archive things from the internal drive to the external one. And in order to swap drives on DirecTV, you have to reboot the DVR each time to do this, so it's NOT really a practical way to get more space.
Also, any external drives you use on DirecTV will ONLY work on that specific DVR, while any hd's you use on DISH can be moved amongst any other DVR's on your account. (you can also move them to any 211's on your account, as long as you have paid the $40 hard drive enabling fee)



> Also a little know fact, you can hook up a external hard-drive on your hddvr with dtv for free *while if you hook one up with Dish you have an External Hard Drive Activation Fee of $39.99 a one time charge if you have a ViP receiver and you choose to connect an external hard drive to that receiver. *


This is ONLY if you turn a 211 into a DVR; there is NO longer a charge to add EHD's to any of the ViP DVR's



> Also some customers with Dish can pay or have paid upto $200 one time fee to activate the sling system.


DISH also has a deal for a FREE Sling w/the 722 DVR


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Rasterburn said:


> <<snipped a bit>>
> if you hook one up with Dish you have an External Hard Drive Activation Fee of $39.99 a one time charge if you have a ViP receiver and you choose to connect an external hard drive to that receiver.
> 
> Also some customers with Dish can pay or have paid upto $200 one time fee to activate the sling system.
> ...


I snipped and seperated, here's some clarification to this rather long bunch of misinformation...

Dish hasn't had a fee for adding a hard disk to the Vip series for quite some time now. The only fee like it is the one-time/per account of $39.99 to add a hard drive to a Vip211, which is a receiver but which then becomes a DVR. All the other Vip HDDVRs can use the freely connectable external HD as a sneaker net if they want, AND that hard drive data is good even with a HDDVR swap out since it is tied to the account, not the receiver itself. Big plus for Dish on this method.

And yes, I'm sure some customers in the past paid up to $200 for a Sling for their Dish equipment. But the majority that actually paid, only paid $99 and now it is free with rebate.

And no, Apple is not blocking Direct from making Direct2PC work on the Mac. That is solely Direct's decision not to support the Mac. BTW, Dish does have an app that does the exact things that Direct2PC does, but does it on an iPad.

Glad I could clear that up!


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## fleckrj (Sep 4, 2009)

cypherx said:


> To each his own.... every provider has it's pro's and cons. I for one wish they would merge. Then finally we can get the missing HD, Dish can get the missing sports and MR-DVR, plus a better user interface, and possibly better HD picture quality. Imagine what we could do if we had that ENTIRE FLEET of satellites out there. BANDWIDTH GALORE.


I strongly disagree. If there was only one satellite provider, that would be bad for everyone. We could no longer threaten to drop DirecTV and go to Dish (or vice versa). I for one like the fact that DirecTV puts more emphasis on sports and Dish puts more emphasis on channels that I never watch. That way, I have a choice. I rarely watch movies or any of the "basic" channels that DirecTV does not have in HD. The only channel I really want in HD that I do not have (and no one else has, yet, either) is Universal Sports (although DIY and Cooking would be nice, but I can wait for those); therefore, I am very satisfied with DirecTV. If I really cared about BBCA, or any of the other "basic" channels that DirecTV does not have in HD, I would go to Dish, but I do not miss those channels, so I am not about to switch.

I live in a fairly large metro area, but my only other option is TWC, and I left them for DirecTV more than 15 years ago. Because of franchicing deals that the city and county made, we do not have a choice of cable companies, and we do not get UVerse or Fios, so it is DirecTV, Dish, or TWC. If DirecTV and Dish were to merge, my choice decreases by a third. Reduced choice is never a good situation.


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## wchaffin (Nov 22, 2011)

the hr20 is a slow box ....but many things will make it sluggish your satelite signal strengths lots of installers didnt dither the ka/ku dish and if its not set right the box will crawl also check the hd setting set the native to off this will speed up channel changing. If your signal strengths are low maybe call in and have your dish serviced.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

wchaffin said:


> the hr20 is a slow box ....but many things will make it sluggish your satelite signal strengths lots of installers didnt dither the ka/ku dish and if its not set right the box will crawl also check the hd setting set the native to off this will speed up channel changing.


Unless you're on the ragged edge of alignment where signal drops out fairly frequently, this probably isn't the issue.

More likely the issues are these:

1. Most HR2x receivers change channels relatively slowly
2. Native is enabled


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## tulanejosh (May 23, 2008)

dkerr64 said:


> I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..
> 
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
> - The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.
> ...


Brother - all this is fixable...

- Slow Interface: get a new dvr (i got one for free last month as a thank you gift for renewing my contract); Also - HD GUI has enormous performance upgrades baked in.
- Small HD: See comment above
- Sling: Go buy a sling box. I did. It works fine on computer and my iphones.
- Nomad: If you have a ling - you don't need Nomad. and Sling streams live.
- Directv2PC works on my Mac. Has for years. You just need to download eyeconnect. But again - if you have a SLING BOX, you don't need Directv2PC.
- BBC America - you got me there. They dont have it.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"tulanejosh" said:


> - Nomad: If you have a ling - you don't need Nomad. and Sling streams live.
> .


Does Sling do offline? That's where Nomad is at its best, it doesn't eat into data limits, works where there is no Internet available, or is more expensive than you want to pay, or too slow.


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## xmguy (Mar 27, 2008)

"RACJ2" said:


> I agree with you on no stretching of SD. I just feel like I'm being cheated, if I don't use all the real estate on my screen. So I usually stretch it and end up changing it right back to 4:3.


Me too. If its in 4:3 then I have my HDTV set to same. I HATE seeing the image stretched out.


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## dkerr64 (Oct 10, 2011)

Well, 6 months has passed since I originally seriously considered switching from DirecTV to Dish. This weekend I did it. They had given me a $20 monthly credit after I first called, and it expired. When I called back they quickly reinstated the discount, but could not address the lack of BBCA in HD nor the lack of an equivalent to Sling (Nomad is not the same, and I bought a Monsoon Vulkano, but it is not the same as an integrated solution)

So I have moved to Dish, one of their new Hopper DVR boxes with Sling adapter. From my POV a far superior DVR box than anything DTV have. But seriously that is secondary to the lack of BBCA in HD. It has been almost 2 years since HD was available on BBCA and every other provider (for me) now has it... Comcast, AT&T, Dish. I really don't understand why DTV is dragging their feet on this one, had the BBCA in HD I would not have cancelled service.

DAK


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## Blankman2k5 (Oct 21, 2010)

dkerr64 said:


> Well, 6 months has passed since I originally seriously considered switching from DirecTV to Dish. This weekend I did it. They had given me a $20 monthly credit after I first called, and it expired. When I called back they quickly reinstated the discount, but could not address the lack of BBCA in HD nor the lack of an equivalent to Sling (Nomad is not the same, and I bought a Monsoon Vulkano, but it is not the same as an integrated solution)
> 
> So I have moved to Dish, one of their new Hopper DVR boxes with Sling adapter. From my POV a far superior DVR box than anything DTV have. But seriously that is secondary to the lack of BBCA in HD. It has been almost 2 years since HD was available on BBCA and every other provider (for me) now has it... Comcast, AT&T, Dish. I really don't understand why DTV is dragging their feet on this one, had the BBCA in HD I would not have cancelled service.
> 
> DAK


I hope you enjoy Dish Network, good luck with your new service and I sincerely hope it works out for you.


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## inf0z (Oct 16, 2011)

Can I have your stuff when you quit?


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## fleckrj (Sep 4, 2009)

Good luck with your choice. Personally, BBCA in HD means nothing to me, nor does the ability to record all of the major networks' prime time offerings. There were five shows on the major networks that we watch, but two of them have been cancelled as of the end of the season, so that leaves only three. For me, recording all of the prime time network programs would be a complete waste of disk space. I am still waiting for Universal Sports in HD, but no one has that yet.


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## Marlin Guy (Apr 8, 2009)

fleckrj said:


> For me, recording all of the prime time network programs would be a complete waste of disk space.


PTAT is easily turned off. No big deal.


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## underlord2 (Dec 1, 2006)

dkerr64 said:


> Well, 6 months has passed since I originally seriously considered switching from DirecTV to Dish. This weekend I did it. They had given me a $20 monthly credit after I first called, and it expired. When I called back they quickly reinstated the discount, but could not address the lack of BBCA in HD nor the lack of an equivalent to Sling (Nomad is not the same, and I bought a Monsoon Vulkano, but it is not the same as an integrated solution)
> 
> So I have moved to Dish, one of their new Hopper DVR boxes with Sling adapter. From my POV a far superior DVR box than anything DTV have. But seriously that is secondary to the lack of BBCA in HD. It has been almost 2 years since HD was available on BBCA and every other provider (for me) now has it... Comcast, AT&T, Dish. I really don't understand why DTV is dragging their feet on this one, had the BBCA in HD I would not have cancelled service.
> 
> DAK


It's nice you're happy with dish! How the boxes treating you speed wise?


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

dkerr64 said:


> Well, 6 months has passed since I originally seriously considered switching from DirecTV to Dish. This weekend I did it. They had given me a $20 monthly credit after I first called, and it expired. When I called back they quickly reinstated the discount, but could not address the lack of BBCA in HD nor the lack of an equivalent to Sling (Nomad is not the same, and I bought a Monsoon Vulkano, but it is not the same as an integrated solution)
> 
> So I have moved to Dish, one of their new Hopper DVR boxes with Sling adapter. From my POV a far superior DVR box than anything DTV have. But seriously that is secondary to the lack of BBCA in HD. It has been almost 2 years since HD was available on BBCA and every other provider (for me) now has it... Comcast, AT&T, Dish. I really don't understand why DTV is dragging their feet on this one, had the BBCA in HD I would not have cancelled service.
> 
> DAK


This just shows how diverse people's viewing habits are. Some would be more upset at losing the disney channels in HD, AMC and sports channels. You seem to not care about those and want BBCA. As with most providers now they have the main ones and it's the smaller channels that are now being picked over but aren't enough to usually justify a cost unless it's just right.


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## Weller (Apr 23, 2002)

The last time I looked AT&T uVerse did not have BBCA in HD, I realise Dish has though.


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## domingos35 (Jan 12, 2006)

my sling adapter was free 
didn't have to pay anything to connect an external hard drive to my hoppers either.
LOVE THIS SYSTEM


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## sregener (Apr 17, 2012)

"Marlin Guy" said:


> PTAT is easily turned off. No big deal.


True, but the 500GB of drive space is reserved for PTAT whether it is on or not. A mere 1TB is available for user-selected programming.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

I thought it was 500GB. 500 for the user space, 500 for PTAT and 1TB reserved for Dish.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

That was changed with one of the firmware updates.
Now 1TB user space.


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## BaronHarkonnen (May 23, 2012)

dkerr64 said:


> I've been a DirecTV customer since 1997, if not longer. Lately I am getting increasingly impatient with DirecTV and am tempted to move to Dish. Specifically..
> 
> - The HR-20 DVR (the only device I have) has a really sluggish user interface.
> - The hard disk is way too small, lots of (HD) programs deleted before we get round to watching them.
> ...


If you're having problems with your DVR, they usually do offer you "free upgrades", but the catch is that you have to send the old one in and the new one causes your committtment period to reset to 24 months.

An agent tried getting me to agree to this about a month before my committment expired so I'd be stuck with them for another two years. I politely declined.

If your committment period is already up and you can cancel without any punitive fees, you can bring up cancelation as a serious bargaining chip that their customer retention people might take seriously. You might qualify for some bill credits and new boxes for the agreement of another 24 month committment. Rushing to take the new boxes without trying to negotiate a substantial discount in return for giving them another 24 months of guaranteed business might not be such a great idea.

It might not hurt to mention that Dish Network would consider you a new customer and give you a new customer deal, so if DirecTV wants to retain you they should match it.

When you're in the middle of a "committment" period, you have little or no negotiating power. THe ball is in their court because they know that charging hundreds of dollars just to make them go away is more unappealing to many customers than just continuing to pay full price until it's over.

I wouldn't let them keep you if they aren't willing to make some serious concessions in exchange for another committment. The ball is rarely in your court with DirecTV, and when it is you should make the most of it.


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## patmurphey (Dec 21, 2006)

sregener said:


> True, but the 500GB of drive space is reserved for PTAT whether it is on or not. A mere 1TB is available for user-selected programming.


"Mere 1 TB"? How much does DTV offer? 2 Hoppers equals 2TB plus unlimited 2TB at time External Drives, easily playable from Hoppers and Joeys, useable on any receiver in the account. I hope the "mere" was only sarcastic.


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

Dish seems to have a lot of functions going for it that I would love to have but it seems like every time you turn around they are losing content. I certainly wouldnt mind better/faster equipment but not at the expense of my content.

Oh, and I dont watch BBCA so that isnt an issue.


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## Ira Lacher (Apr 24, 2002)

Xsabresx said:


> Dish seems to have a lot of functions going for it that I would love to have but it seems like every time you turn around they are losing content.


I would switch today if that weren't an issue. DirecTV has its contract squabbles too (remember Versus?). But they don't seem to have them to the extent DISH does.


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## sregener (Apr 17, 2012)

"patmurphey" said:


> "Mere 1 TB"? How much does DTV offer? 2 Hoppers equals 2TB plus unlimited 2TB at time External Drives, easily playable from Hoppers and Joeys, useable on any receiver in the account. I hope the "mere" was only sarcastic.


The complaint was about wasting disk space with PTAT. My point was that there is plenty of space to waste. And with a USB hub, I have heard of 4 2TB drives attached and active at one time, which would give you an expensive 9TB of user space. But you could also swap out those drives, so in theory, space is limited only by your wallet.

Since the 500GB is reserved for PTAT recordings anyway, if you record any network shows, it's worth activating - unless you need 3 active tuners at one time for non-network programming, which would be the only reason I see to disable it.

I switched from DirecTV in April and have been very happy. There are more channels that I am likely to watch in AT250 than there was in the similarly-priced package from DirecTV. And yes, Dish does seem to have some serious contract negotiating issues, as seen with their impending drop of AMC. Dish is run by an eccentric, DirecTV by professional bean-counters. Having been on the wrong end of a DVR from the professionals at DirecTV, I'm okay with the eccentric.

Many ask what a Dish customer is doing reading a DirecTV forum, and for me, it's a matter of curiosity. I liked DirecTV a lot. I wish them well. I wish their DVR had been better, as I would never have left otherwise. If they someday get their act together, I may come back. The channel selection on Dish is better for me, especially HD channels, but not enough to justify switching by itself. In the end, it's just entertainment and isn't worth the angst it generates here.


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## Phil17108 (Apr 10, 2010)

Hay Directv has been more than good to me and I'm an older customer. Last time I paid for a dvr was when I went to the HR20 from the old Tivo hd one, for $100, after that there were still 2 Tivo unites on the account and about 6 months later they called me and ask if they could replace them with what was just coming out hr21, free. I have 4 HR's a 22 two 23 and a 24 at this time. Works for me. I looked in on the dish side of DBStalk and found they are not jumping for joy, so good luck with that.


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## dkerr64 (Oct 10, 2011)

sregener said:


> True, but the 500GB of drive space is reserved for PTAT whether it is on or not. A mere 1TB is available for user-selected programming.


A mere 1TB ? I don't think any DTV box comes with a system disk this large. My DTV box had probably a quarter of this space available to me and was always full.

DAK


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## dkerr64 (Oct 10, 2011)

underlord2 said:


> It's nice you're happy with dish! How the boxes treating you speed wise?


So far the Hopper box is fast and responsive. But I would expect it to be the case as it is new. My old DTV box was extremely sluggish -- a contributing factor to me deciding to switch, but not the main reason.


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## dkerr64 (Oct 10, 2011)

BaronHarkonnen said:


> If you're having problems with your DVR, they usually do offer you "free upgrades", but the catch is that you have to send the old one in and the new one causes your committtment period to reset to 24 months.
> 
> An agent tried getting me to agree to this about a month before my committment expired so I'd be stuck with them for another two years. I politely declined.
> 
> ...


I was well out of any commitment period. DTV quickly offered me a $20 credit and 6 months ago this is what kept me around. But 6 months ago they wanted to charge me for an equipment upgrade and/or nomad. Last week DTV reinstated the $20 and said I was eligible for equipment upgrade offers, with a 24 months commitment. I didn't bother to find out what the offers were as frankly that was only half the problem and I didn't want to commit to 24 months of as service that was missing programming/features I desire.

Moving to Dish cost me nothing, actually negative $20 as google found a coupon code that gave me a instant $50 credit. The Hopper was free, the Slingbox $30, so negative $20. First year of service has $25 monthly credit. Yes I am committed to 24 months now so if DTV want me back before that expires they need a very attractive incentive.

There are only about a dozen, maybe 20 channels that I even care about. I resent having to pay for 200-250 channels most of which are junk just to get the few I want. So it is important to me that the few I do want are available in HD. Bring on a-la-carte pricing.

DAK


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## patmurphey (Dec 21, 2006)

sregener said:


> ...Many ask what a Dish customer is doing reading a DirecTV forum, and for me, it's a matter of curiosity...


I share the curiosity angle, but also have discovered that there are often misstatements here about Dish products - especially the Hopper/Joey - that need correcting. It is especially important for new customers and those considering change that comparisons between D* and E* be accurate. There are plenty of D* users keeping track of the opposite over on the E* side.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Phil17108 said:


> I looked in on the dish side of DBStalk and found they are not jumping for joy, so good luck with that.


While I don't doubt you looked there, it appears that you forgot to really look at the D* side too. There are no more or less complaints on average between the two services.

Although D* does tend to get two continuing issues that get fixed for short periods of time, remote response and sluggish HRs. That doesn't seem to be the case with E*.


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## mreposter (Jul 29, 2006)

lparsons21 said:


> Although D* does tend to get two continuing issues that get fixed for short periods of time, remote response and sluggish HRs. That doesn't seem to be the case with E*.


There's also the Directv "channels I get" and other guide issues that have been around for years and years.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

mreposter said:


> There's also the Directv "channels I get" and other guide issues that have been around for years and years.


Yea, that has dragged on for ages. But IMHO not a big deal since I have favorites lists set up for the channels I watch, don't need to see that I subscribe to all the shopping/PI channels out there anyway.

But one thing that DIRECTV does do that Dish tends not to is to keep adding new features to existing hardware where Dish makes you go out and get new hardware. If you wanted WHDVR you could add that on any HD DVR, Dish makes you go upgrade to Hopper/Joey for example.


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## Ira Lacher (Apr 24, 2002)

D* complaints seem to focus on slow hardware, high prices for upgraded hardware, fairness of giveaways to new customers vs. existing customers, and the lack of HD channels. 

DISH complaints seem to focus on buggy hardware, lack of full-time RSNs, and here-today-gone-tomorrow channels.


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## domingos35 (Jan 12, 2006)

Phil17108 said:


> Hay Directv has been more than good to me and I'm an older customer. Last time I paid for a dvr was when I went to the HR20 from the old Tivo hd one, for $100, after that there were still 2 Tivo unites on the account and about 6 months later they called me and ask if they could replace them with what was just coming out hr21, free. I have 4 HR's a 22 two 23 and a 24 at this time. Works for me. I looked in on the dish side of DBStalk and found they are not jumping for joy, so good luck with that.


not jumping for joy?right


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Ira Lacher said:


> D* complaints seem to focus on slow hardware, high prices for upgraded hardware, fairness of giveaways to new customers vs. existing customers, and the lack of HD channels.
> 
> DISH complaints seem to focus on buggy hardware, lack of full-time RSNs, and here-today-gone-tomorrow channels.


Add remote response issues with the HRs and you've got a pretty good description of D*'s complaints.

E*'s complaints are as you say, but it should be noted that the hardware issues are sporadic and in general not something consistent which makes fixing things with them a bit erratic too. In general, if a problem with hardware comes along with E*, they get it fixed fairly soon. Some exceptions of course.


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## domingos35 (Jan 12, 2006)

Ira Lacher said:


> D* complaints seem to focus on slow hardware, high prices for upgraded hardware, fairness of giveaways to new customers vs. existing customers, and the lack of HD channels.
> 
> DISH complaints seem to focus on buggy hardware, lack of full-time RSNs, and here-today-gone-tomorrow channels.


buggy hardware thats only couple months old so no surprise there


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

domingos35 said:


> buggy hardware thats only couple months old so no surprise there


Ignoring the 922?


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> Ignoring the 922?


Since the 922 was a pretty limited edition box, you don't have to ignore it, but most do. It was as close to a one-off box as E* ever came up with. The bad was that it never came up to the potential it should have had, the good is that E* learned a lot with it, incorporating many of the things the 922 had in a box that does work fine overall, the Hopper.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

lparsons21 said:


> Since the 922 was a pretty limited edition box, you don't have to ignore it, but most do. It was as close to a one-off box as E* ever came up with. The bad was that it never came up to the potential it should have had, the good is that E* learned a lot with it, incorporating many of the things the 922 had in a box that does work fine overall, the Hopper.


Since you mentioned the 922, brings up a point, Dish has a habit of announcing some new hardware feature that will be coming, customer pays for the box and then Dish changes their mind and doesn't implement the feature, or does it many months or not years later then they said they would.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

RAD said:


> Since you mentioned the 922, brings up a point, Dish has a habit of announcing some new hardware feature that will be coming, customer pays for the box and then Dish changes their mind and doesn't implement the feature, or does it many months or not years later then they said they would.


How many times has that happened? I mean that they actually shipped a box with some promised functionality that never happens. I don't remember many, and certainly not more than 1 for many years now.

So I find it hard to call it a 'habit'...


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## PK6301 (May 16, 2012)

Here is a thought..Dish just released their new thing-a-magig that skips annoying commercials.. Does that mean it skips even Dishes own annoying commercials ?? 

Just a thought :lol:


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

"lparsons21" said:


> How many times has that happened? I mean that they actually shipped a box with some promised functionality that never happens. I don't remember many, and certainly not more than 1 for many years now.
> 
> So I find it hard to call it a 'habit'...


The ones that come to mind to me are:

- OpenTV on the 6000. The STB even had the logo on the back of the hardware but they never implemented that software.
- Name based recording on the 501/508/510, it took a couple years from when they said they'd have it before they implemented it.
- D-VHS copying of HD programming from the 921 to JVC D-VHS VCR's. They even had a FireWire port (Dish called it DishWire) but never implemented it.
- of course the recent SlingCatcher that was to work with the 922, never came out.
- wasn't there supposed to be a USB keyboard demo'ed for use on the HD DVR's?

Those are the examples I recall, but to me that shows a bad track record of delivering on what they tell customers will be coming.


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## Marlin Guy (Apr 8, 2009)

lparsons21 said:


> While I don't doubt you looked there, it appears that you forgot to really look at the D* side too. There are no more or less complaints on average between the two services.


From what I've seen the threads get locked on the D* side and they work their way off the first page pretty quickly.

"We already have xxx threads on how slow the UI is. So let's not start another one!" :lol:


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

PK6301 said:


> Here is a thought..Dish just released their new thing-a-magig that skips annoying commercials.. Does that mean it skips even Dishes own annoying commercials ??
> 
> Just a thought :lol:


Technically no, because the networks won't even sell Dish ad space anymore and have already sued them (LINK). :lol:

While I love the hopper and love the auto commercial skip feature, I think Dish is really biting the hand that feeds them. Without ad revenue, everybody will have to pay more for content in the long run. Now that cost is hidden in the cost of the products/services in the ads.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Well, to be honest, since Dish is required to pay retrans fees, I dont think the networks have a leg to stand on in court, if the DVR is simply skipping the commercials, and leaving them in tact on the drive. Now a network that DOESNT charge retrans fees might stand a better chance of winning. Surly the networks thought of that before double dipping


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Marlin Guy said:


> From what I've seen the threads get locked on the D* side and they work their way off the first page pretty quickly.
> 
> "We already have xxx threads on how slow the UI is. So let's not start another one!" :lol:


Hmmmm. It's more often a case of trolling, including those fond of big game fish.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

RAD said:


> The ones that come to mind to me are:
> 
> - OpenTV on the 6000. The STB even had the logo on the back of the hardware but they never implemented that software.
> - Name based recording on the 501/508/510, it took a couple years from when they said they'd have it before they implemented it.
> ...


Most of that is pretty old. The only current thing is the 922 SlingCatcher, all the rest is quite old.

As to the keyboard, I don't remember a USB keyboard on the HDDVRS, but I think there was one demo'ed for the 922. And now there is a remote 'concept' with a keyboard on it.

But let's just assume that all you arguments are correct and it indicates a bad track record of delivering what they say. How is that more/less of an issue than every HR ever made that is :
A. Slow as molasses, with the exception of the HR24. Took a couple sw 'updates' to slow them down. About 6 years worth of slow here.
B. Remote response issues nearly as old.
C. Has an HDGUI that is basically the old one in a new wrapper, nothing real great about it at all. And until the last update, slower when it was advertised as faster, and remote response was the pits. Now with the latest update we have bad video/audio glitches.

From purely an operational standpoint between Dish and Direct, Dish wins hands down for hardware/software, imo.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

lparsons21 said:


> Most of that is pretty old. The only current thing is the 922 SlingCatcher, all the rest is quite old.
> 
> As to the keyboard, I don't remember a USB keyboard on the HDDVRS, but I think there was one demo'ed for the 922. And now there is a remote 'concept' with a keyboard on it.
> 
> ...


Speed issues are not universal sorry. With that said there are improvements still to be made for sure.

Bottom line is both companies have done good and bad things with equipment at some point but saying that one has always done better is wrong on both sides.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Shades228 said:


> Speed issues are not universal sorry. With that said there are improvements still to be made for sure.
> 
> Bottom line is both companies have done good and bad things with equipment at some point but saying that one has always done better is wrong on both sides.


+1.

There seem to be a few dozen folks who have a very bolshy DVR, and one or two guys who have bad DVRs across the board. A few claim to never have problems of any sort. I experienced some real slowdowns that were temporary, but annoying at the time.

The new GUI is faster and easier to read than its predecessor.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> Speed issues are not universal sorry. With that said there are improvements still to be made for sure.
> 
> Bottom line is both companies have done good and bad things with equipment at some point but saying that one has always done better is wrong on both sides.


Good thing I didn't say one always has done better, I did say 'in general' though and I'll stand behind that.

And while not everyone has speed issues with HRs, it is enough of a problem to be mentioned much more often than any other, and not just by those that don't like D*. But here's the catch in all this. I was with D*, had an HR21, it sucked, I left D* solely over that DVR and the fact that D* had nothing that was any better to offer at the time.

Now I'm back to D*. Got the latest and greatest HR24-500, or at least it was when I got it. It was great when I got it, had that old SDGUI that didn't look all that good, but it was fast with no issues whatsoever. Liked it. Then the HDGUI came out, back to slow and poor remote response.

So how the hell do I go away for 2 years and see the same problems I left for re-occur? And yet, others keep telling me the issues aren't universal.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

lparsons21 said:


> Most of that is pretty old. The only current thing is the 922 SlingCatcher, all the rest is quite old.
> 
> As to the keyboard, I don't remember a USB keyboard on the HDDVRS, but I think there was one demo'ed for the 922. And now there is a remote 'concept' with a keyboard on it.
> 
> ...


Yes, some of those examples are old, most were from when I had Dish, don't keep track of all of what they're doing or not doing now. But it does show that Dish does have a history of not delivering on features they say they'll come out with. This is different then what you're responding with now which are bugs/issues with released hardware.


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## domingos35 (Jan 12, 2006)

PK6301 said:


> Here is a thought..Dish just released their new thing-a-magig that skips annoying commercials.. Does that mean it skips even Dishes own annoying commercials ??
> 
> Just a thought :lol:


just directv's:hurah::hurah::hurah:


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## domingos35 (Jan 12, 2006)

lparsons21 said:


> Good thing I didn't say one always has done better, I did say 'in general' though and I'll stand behind that.
> 
> And while not everyone has speed issues with HRs, it is enough of a problem to be mentioned much more often than any other, and not just by those that don't like D*. But here's the catch in all this. I was with D*, had an HR21, it sucked, I left D* solely over that DVR and the fact that D* had nothing that was any better to offer at the time.
> 
> ...


directv is going back in time :lol::lol:


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## PK6301 (May 16, 2012)

domingos35 said:


> just directv's:hurah::hurah::hurah:


The funny thing about skipping commercials..As I sit and watch TV at night I see at least 3 Dish Network commercials every night, Plus print ads every week in my Sunday Paper, plus ads in the mail, and my e-mail..(I Think they are Desperate :hurah::hurah::hurah So I hope the original Poster of this thread is happy with his reasons to leave, I wish him the best of luck.


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## Marlin Guy (Apr 8, 2009)

PK6301 said:


> The funny thing about skipping commercials..As I sit and watch TV at night I see at least 3 Dish Network commercials every night,


Dish will be glad to know that those ads are reaching their target audience.
If you had a Hopper you wouldn't see them.... and they wouldn't care.


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## PK6301 (May 16, 2012)

Marlin Guy said:


> Dish will be glad to know that those ads are reaching their target audience.
> If you had a Hopper you wouldn't see them.... and they wouldn't care.


But what is good for the Goose is good for the Gander (If Direct enginered the same type of system Dish would be PO'd that their ad efforts were being thworted )


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## Marlin Guy (Apr 8, 2009)

PK6301 said:


> (If Direct enginered the same type of system...


They would if they could. :lol:


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Marlin Guy said:


> They would if they could. :lol:


You mean a system that has a maximum amount of tuners that are less than I have on one TV?

So once again it's go with what is best for you because I couldn't use DISH if I tried without having to have at least 3 independent systems setup and that would be 6-9 dish's last I checked.


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## domingos35 (Jan 12, 2006)

PK6301 said:


> The funny thing about skipping commercials..As I sit and watch TV at night I see at least 3 Dish Network commercials every night, Plus print ads every week in my Sunday Paper, plus ads in the mail, and my e-mail..(I Think they are Desperate :hurah::hurah::hurah So I hope the original Poster of this thread is happy with his reasons to leave, I wish him the best of luck.


Desperate?hardly:nono:
u wish.only in your dreams


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## Carolina (Jan 20, 2012)

I just don't think it is worth the trouble to switch. It sort of reminds me of my husband and insurance companies. If he didn't like the price with one company he would change, but then the company he changed to would raise their price so he would change again and it kept going on this way until finally he didn't think all the switching was worth it so we finally stuck with an insurance company. I can't remember how long we have been with our insurance company now, but I do know we have been with D* since 1995. So we aren't changing our TV service.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Switching or not is a personal decision, some do it often, some less so, some never. In the case of switching between sat providers, the savings can sometimes be just a little, sometimes much more. Depends on what you do when you switch.

With insurance companies it is dead simple imo. The way they all structure rates is to get you at a cheaper rate and then push the rates up every single year with varying methods. I've found that switching insurance on my home and car every 3 years saves me bunches of money. Generally about 40-50% difference in rates. And since it isn't even hard to do, why not save some money?

The last time I switched insurance, the new company gave me a rate that covered both the house and the car for slightly less than the old company was insuring either one. Savings of more than 50%.

If I switched from D* to E* right now and was out of contract, I would save about $480 in the first year.

Both of those are not insignificant savings, and are especially welcome now that my income is fairly flat.


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## bluemoon737 (Feb 21, 2007)

Davenlr said:


> Well, to be honest, since Dish is required to pay retrans fees, I dont think the networks have a leg to stand on in court, if the DVR is simply skipping the commercials, and leaving them in tact on the drive. Now a network that DOESNT charge retrans fees might stand a better chance of winning. Surly the networks thought of that before double dipping


Never realized Dish was a wholly owned subsidiary of Hadden Industries...they have now perfected "ad-nix"...(read Contact by Carl Sagan). :lol:


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Shades228 said:


> ...last I checked.


This is often what the companies bank on; that you won't check very often.

Brand E offers a single dish solution for domestic and international programming. DIRECTV does not. Everybody's needs are different.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

lparsons21 said:


> Switching or not is a personal decision, some do it often, some less so, some never. In the case of switching between sat providers, the savings can sometimes be just a little, sometimes much more. Depends on what you do when you switch.
> 
> With insurance companies it is dead simple imo. The way they all structure rates is to get you at a cheaper rate and then push the rates up every single year with varying methods. I've found that switching insurance on my home and car every 3 years saves me bunches of money. Generally about 40-50% difference in rates. And since it isn't even hard to do, why not save some money?
> 
> ...


Agreed. When renewal time came around My insurance agent said why not switch and save money on the car insurance. Wow was I being ripped. I'm paying less than 50% of the old rate for the same coverage that I had with the old company for years.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

harsh said:


> This is often what the companies bank on; that you won't check very often.
> 
> Brand E offers a single dish solution for domestic and international programming. DIRECTV does not. Everybody's needs are different.


I have less need to check than others here though. I did have DISH system for a few months for awhile just to see some things but installation methods could have changed since then. However you need a minimum of 1 dish per 2 Hoppers and I would need at least 5.



TBoneit said:


> Agreed. When renewal time came around My insurance agent said why not switch and save money on the car insurance. Wow was I being ripped. I'm paying less than 50% of the old rate for the same coverage that I had with the old company for years.


Usually insurance goes down due to what you own is has less monetary value and insurance companies don't automatically devalue what you are insuring so what you insure is based on the value you setup at.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> I have less need to check than others here though. I did have DISH system for a few months for awhile just to see some things but installation methods could have changed since then. However you need a minimum of 1 dish per 2 Hoppers and I would need at least 5.
> 
> Usually insurance goes down due to what you own is has less monetary value and insurance companies don't automatically devalue what you are insuring so what you insure is based on the value you setup at.


Wow! You would need 15 tuners? That's a lot of TV!  You can get 3 hoppers on one Dish, it isn't a standard installation and takes a phone call or email DIRT member for help in getting that set up, but it is doable.

As to insurance, well they are loaded with 'because they can' rules when it comes to your money. With a car, what you say is true, the value of the car is less now than it was when you first insure it. With a house, it is just the opposite. It costs more to rebuild/repair it than when it was new in general. And for a house, that is what causes your homeowners to increase. Unfortunately for us, they are quite liberal in what they think a house would cost to rebuild.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

lparsons21 said:


> Wow! You would need 15 tuners? That's a lot of TV!  You can get 3 hoppers on one Dish, it isn't a standard installation and takes a phone call or email DIRT member for help in getting that set up, but it is doable...


I'm guessing that someone that works for DIRECTV, probably isn't going to do that.


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