# Installing a Dish 500 and Dish 301 Receiver



## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

Spent the last day installing a Dish 500 antenna, and Dish 301 receiver in my work shop. Made a special bracket for the fascia board on the north side of the shop for the Dish 500 pole bracket. Got all that done yesterday, plus the coax cabling into the shop. All new RG-6 coax plus new grounding block with ground cable. My 4 year old 27" TV is analog which is suitable for the work shop. The Dish 301 I've had since about 2001 has the old smart card and is deactivated, so, D/N wants $50.00 for the new card, plus $15.00 for shipping... $15.00 just to send a smart card by first class mail?????????????
Dish tells me they have no set date when they will remove the 301 from service.. Plus the fact Dish will charge me $7.00 monthly for the 301.

Did I say, it was troublesome to get the satellite antenna working. Three years ago I bought a new Dish 500 with a Dish Pro Plus Twin LNBF in the carton. I had a older Dish 500 LNBF that came with my original system back in 2001 when I first signed up with Dish Network. Who would have thought the new Dish Pro Plus Twin LNBF wouldn't work with the Dish 500 and 301 Receiver. I had to remove the Pro Plus Twin LNBF and install the older Twin LNBF that came with the older system to get 110 and 119 satellite signal. 

I called the Technical customer service about the trouble on the LNBF's being a problem. The lady didn't know anything about what I was referring to. She was more concerned about where my work shop was located. I told her it was about 6' from the the edge on the home. Thought about telling her the work shop was located 40 miles off the coast of Hawaii.

Anyway, after I installed the older LNBF, the system information tells me I have satellites 110 and 119 with signal from 78 to 81 on most transponders.

I have to decide either buy the $50.00 smart card, plus the $15.00 shipping, or go on ebay and buy a new in box 301 with the new Purple smart card.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

First off, DO NOT TEASE THE BEAR. She will rain down on you with a single scribble to the audit team.

Next, don't buy a 301. That's throwing good money after bad. You can get a brand new 311 for under $70 and be done with it. One advantage in favor of a new 311 is that it doesn't require a smart card that can be kinda touchy in surroundings that aren't climate controlled.

You may have noticed that most units on eBay are non-returnable.


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## [email protected] (Jan 19, 2011)

DISH Network should not be sending a replacement smart card for the 301 receiver as it should be exchanged for a 311. If your receiver is a purchased one then the replacement would be purchased as well. I would recommend adding the service plan to your account for $6.00 a month, you will need to keep it for 5 months or pay a one time $25.00 cancellation charge to remove earlier. This will be the cheapest method to get a working receiver for you installation. If you would like my assistance, please PM me your account info. Thank you!


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

I'm guessing that the DHPP won't cover an inactive receiver. Am I right?


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## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

Mary, My understanding from reading your reply, Dish will send me a 311 for a certain price, not a lease deal and charge me $6.00 month for a service plan. I'm probably wrong, but, I would guess the 311 would be more than $100.00. Add the $6.00 month for a $72.00 year use, plus the $7.00 month fee for the third Dish receiver I have on my account. I don't see any advantage in your program when I can buy a new 311 on ebay for about $85.00 with shipping. 

After some thought, I have also a PVR 508 with a Purple smart card that I deactivated this past June when I got a VIP211 from Dish on a lease deal. I could connect this 508 and have it reactivated and use it till Dish drops it from service.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

That would be best choice for you now.


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## [email protected] (Jan 19, 2011)

Skeeterman said:


> Mary, My understanding from reading your reply, Dish will send me a 311 for a certain price, not a lease deal and charge me $6.00 month for a service plan. I'm probably wrong, but, I would guess the 311 would be more than $100.00. Add the $6.00 month for a $72.00 year use, plus the $7.00 month fee for the third Dish receiver I have on my account. I don't see any advantage in your program when I can buy a new 311 on ebay for about $85.00 with shipping.
> 
> After some thought, I have also a PVR 508 with a Purple smart card that I deactivated this past June when I got a VIP211 from Dish on a lease deal. I could connect this 508 and have it reactivated and use it till Dish drops it from service.


508 Option would be the best and most cost efficient for you all around. The 508 receiver will be an additional $10.00 a month.

To clarify the other offer. 311 would be sent as no charge and would be purchased on your account. Service Plan would need to be on account for 5 months ($6.00x5= $30.00) You would need to pay the $7.00 a month for the additional receiver no matter where the receiver comes from, even the 301 would have had that charge.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

Am I misunderstanding something... or aren't you also trying to do something against the terms of service?

i.e. You installed another dish and receiver at a location that isn't your primary dish installation... but did not open a second account?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I feel someday new employee will be hired and we will lost another mod.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Stewart Vernon said:


> i.e. You installed another dish and receiver at a location that isn't your primary dish installation... but did not open a second account?


When the second installation is in a detached shop, it shouldn't be frowned upon. The concern is if the shop is located at a different street address.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Without your proof, he is NOT guilty ! Suggestions, insinuations are not counts, only fact is matter.


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## boba (May 23, 2003)

P Smith said:


> Without your proof, he is NOT guilty ! Suggestions, insinuations are not counts, only fact is matter.


Read post #1 he states 6' from side of house. Are you calling him a liar?


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

boba said:


> Read post #1 he states 6' from side of house. Are you calling him a liar?


I think he's probably just falsely accusing me of accusing the OP of stacking.

Language barriers often create issues that wouldn't otherwise exist.


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## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

I'll jump back in here. The work shop is located about 6'4" from the corner of the home, and it has (the 6'4" space) a roof over it that connects to the home and work shop roofs. So, it could be known as a detached building.
I know all about people trying to avoid another account when they install a Dish antenna in another located/area other than the street address the original account shows.


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## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

In my setup on the work shop TV and receiver, I've decided to use the PVR 508 that still has a Purple smart card, and was activated up to June this year. I will use this 508 receiver till Dish reports to me they will discontinue the service to it.

But, I would like to ask the experts here on a situation that I have encountered. This morning, I connected the 508 to the TV. Ran a check switch, and system check. Here's what I see on the TV screen...ERROR 004 window. "A problem as been detected with your multi-dish switch." I've never seen this error message before, so, it must be something regarding my set-up.

NOTE: This PVR 508 was connected up to June this year to a Dish 1000.2 antenna, which I had "block" the SAT 129 off (covered), as I have a Dish 500 with single LNB for SAT 129. 
Here's what I show in my System Info-One screen
DP 508
Software P409
SAT'S: 119. 110. COMM. 129
Signal: Green- Green. X X
Device: DPP1K.2
Note, the Device states that I have the 508 coaxed to a Dish 1000.2, when it is actually connected to a Dish 500.
Is this the situation why I'm getting the Window: ERROR 004 as worded above? 
If I cannot correct this myself, Dish CSR wants to send out a Service Technician. I don't need a Dish Service Person to show me what I can do.

So, what is the procedure to renove the DPP 1K.2 from the Device line in the System Info. window.?


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

Skeeterman said:


> In my setup on the work shop TV and receiver, I've decided to use the PVR 508 that still has a Purple smart card, and was activated up to June this year. I will use this 508 receiver till Dish reports to me they will discontinue the service to it.
> 
> But, I would like to ask the experts here on a situation that I have encountered. This morning, I connected the 508 to the TV. Ran a check switch, and system check. Here's what I see on the TV screen...ERROR 004 window. "A problem as been detected with your multi-dish switch." I've never seen this error message before, so, it must be something regarding my set-up.
> 
> ...


Disconnect the dish from the receiver.
DO a check switch - accept that you have fewer satellites than before
reconnect receiver to dish
do another check switch.
This time , it should find 110 and 119 and the proper LNB.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Just to check switch again, no need to disconnect the coax. Or do factory reset via menu.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Stewart Vernon said:


> Am I misunderstanding something... or aren't you also trying to do something against the terms of service?
> 
> i.e. You installed another dish and receiver at a location that isn't your primary dish installation... but did not open a second account?


I have a workshop in my backyard, it isn't a business, it is for puttering around. If I want TV there I'd have to install a second dish. I wouldn't consider it account stacking since it is on the same lot as the house. No phone line could be a problem of course. Electric fed off of the house panel.

It resembles a miniature cape cod with shingles over plywood walls, roofing tiles on the roof. Center door with symmetrical windows placement on both sides of the door. Maybe the size of one bedroom in a cape cod house. Built just like a house except for standing on blocks at the corners to avoid paying property taxes like it would cost if it were bolted down to a foundation. It has been there for many years and withstood Hurricanes and Nor'easters.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

I would see if Dish would swap your 301 for a 211 perhaps free, perhaps for $50 or so.

The 211 is a far superior receiver and can be made into a DVR with $40 one time fee and EHD.


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## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

I'll give my last dollar and best wishes to, scooper here for his great TIP on how to clear the 508 receiver of it's old system.

But, first I would like to explain that I called Dish and had a 30 minute conversation with a Dish Technical "Brain" person. This person could invent the New World.

Here's his remarks. "Sir, you cannot have a Dish 500 and a Dish 1000.2 aim at the same satellites--110-119 as they will interfere with the signals to the two antennas." DUH! such stupid remark will get you sent to the back of the room.
Can you believe this Tech?

Anyway, I did what scooper said, and all is well and the TV and receiver is working great.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

Skeeterman said:


> I'll jump back in here. The work shop is located about 6'4" from the corner of the home, and it has (the 6'4" space) a roof over it that connects to the home and work shop roofs. So, it could be known as a detached building.
> I know all about people trying to avoid another account when they install a Dish antenna in another located/area other than the street address the original account shows.


Thanks for the clarification. That's why I merely asked as opposed to just closing the thread. I was giving the benefit of the doubt, and what you describe doesn't sound like a violation. Also thanks for not taking the question personally... some over-react when asked for clarification.



TBoneit said:


> I have a workshop in my backyard, it isn't a business, it is for puttering around. If I want TV there I'd have to install a second dish. I wouldn't consider it account stacking since it is on the same lot as the house. No phone line could be a problem of course. Electric fed off of the house panel.
> 
> It resembles a miniature cape cod with shingles over plywood walls, roofing tiles on the roof. Center door with symmetrical windows placement on both sides of the door. Maybe the size of one bedroom in a cape cod house. Built just like a house except for standing on blocks at the corners to avoid paying property taxes like it would cost if it were bolted down to a foundation. It has been there for many years and withstood Hurricanes and Nor'easters.


Thing is... what you are describing here is different from what the thread starter has described. A completely separate building that is not connected to your home... even if on the same lot... is usually considered a separate structure.

Some folks rent out such structures just like a cheap apartment... so I would say your example is one that probably would get you into trouble with the audit team if they ever called.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

Skeeterman said:


> But, first I would like to explain that I called Dish and had a 30 minute conversation with a Dish Technical "Brain" person. This person could invent the New World.
> 
> Here's his remarks. "Sir, you cannot have a Dish 500 and a Dish 1000.2 aim at the same satellites--110-119 as they will interfere with the signals to the two antennas." DUH! such stupid remark will get you sent to the back of the room.
> Can you believe this Tech?


That sounds like the people who used to respond to satellite/channel outage issues by saying "too many people are watching and using up the signal"


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## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

Here are my thoughts on the matter....Dish satellite dish locations.

During my two day installation on getting the Dish 500 up and running, I spoke to at least four CRS persons and one "Brainy" Technical Service wizard.
The first CRS told me I couldn't have a Dish antenna on a separate building with one account. The added Dish 500 would require an additional account.
When I told her the building from some six feet from the main home with a "breezeway" separating the work shop and home, she said the would ask someone for clarification. She came back and said it was okay at this "point."
Meaning the work shop is within Dish Network limitations.
When I couldn't get my DDP Pro Plus LNB to work, I called a CRS again, only to be ask the same questions... where is the work shop located. After giving her the same report, she said. "Why didn't you run a coax from your Dish 1000.2 antenna to the work shop." I told her that was my first choice, but, I would have run about 75' run of coax, and I would have to use a splitter at the 1000.2 dish. Keep in mind, she suggested running a coax from the main house to the work shop without any problem of a separate location. When I had the conversation with the "brainy" Tech person, I made the comment that I could install the Dish 500 some three feet from the 1000.2 antenna and run the coax from there to the work shop. He said, that wasn't allowed..only with a separate account added.

My thought here, is Dish Network don't want any "third" dish installed near or on the same building, as this may signal that I'm sending a coax to another location.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

Skeeterman said:


> Here are my thoughts on the matter....Dish satellite dish locations.
> 
> During my two day installation on getting the Dish 500 up and running, I spoke to at least four CRS persons and one "Brainy" Technical Service wizard.
> The first CRS told me I couldn't have a Dish antenna on a separate building with one account. The added Dish 500 would require an additional account.
> ...


The problem with using the 1000.2 dish on your shed wasn't the 75 feet of coax - it's more the "splitter". You cannot use "splitters" on dish LNB cables - you have to use Dish Dishpro SWITCHES .

As I would see it - as long as you are installing it yourself - there is no issue with having multiple dishes - you could even install 1 dish per receiver if you wanted to (although who in their right mind would do that ?  ). Just make sure you install all the dishes correctly (with ground as appropriate).


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Big concern for such install - ground loop; 
if you using two ground connections, those should be 'bonded'. If not - you're could create AC (60 HZ) level to second tuner's coax input. 
I would measure the AC voltage first (before connect the cable to the box) for any remote installs.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

Stewart Vernon said:


> Thanks for the clarification. That's why I merely asked as opposed to just closing the thread. I was giving the benefit of the doubt, and what you describe doesn't sound like a violation. Also thanks for not taking the question personally... some over-react when asked for clarification.
> 
> Thing is... what you are describing here is different from what the thread starter has described. A completely separate building that is not connected to your home... even if on the same lot... is usually considered a separate structure.
> 
> Some folks rent out such structures just like a cheap apartment... so I would say your example is one that probably would get you into trouble with the audit team if they ever called.


I have to disagree with you here. As long as the lot is zoned for a single family dwelling, no matter how many structures I have on my lot or my property, I can put a dish on each building and a receiver in each one and they all still belong on the same account, legally, morally and ethically.

I remember reading of a case where one familty was using anentire duplex (zoned multi-family) and when he wanted to add multiple receivers, Dish made them get a second account because the property was zoned for multi-family, not because there were more than one structure on the property - that is irrelevant.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

Jim5506 said:


> I have to disagree with you here. As long as the lot is zoned for a single family dwelling, no matter how many structures I have on my lot or my property, I can put a dish on each building and a receiver in each one and they all still belong on the same account, legally, morally and ethically.
> 
> I remember reading of a case where one familty was using anentire duplex (zoned multi-family) and when he wanted to add multiple receivers, Dish made them get a second account because the property was zoned for multi-family, not because there were more than one structure on the property - that is irrelevant.


You are arguing law vs Dish policy, though.

The law treats buildings on the same property as the same property in some cases... but Dish policy does not have to do that.

That's the difference here, really.

Dish has a policy that is against this... and when you have a completely detached 2nd building that requires you to put up a 2nd Dish, this should be a good indicator of how you aren't in compliance with the policy.

We could argue about it... but the point is, it is Dish policy... and one poster here described something in violation while the other (thread starter) did not. One would not be in compliance, while the other would be.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Perhaps Stewart, you as a Mod, could take all the sidetrack posts to specialized thread ?
:backtotop:


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## Skeeterman (Jun 24, 2003)

Stewart Vernon said:


> You are arguing law vs Dish policy, though.
> 
> The law treats buildings on the same property as the same property in some cases... but Dish policy does not have to do that.
> 
> ...


I would like to join in here and clarify on what one might call..a misunderstanding. My 28' x 36' work shop is also a 2 car garage... 16' x 28 work shop area, and 20' x 28' 2 car garage area. In this structure I have a table saws(2), routers, drill press, lathe, welding unit, five tool cabinets, a 4' wide x 12' work bench, wall ( formerly kitchen cabinets from a home I bought and torn down)cabinets on three sides of the work shop. This building in reality is a detached building with it's own electrical box and wiring. Note: No plumbing, no A/C or heating system. The space between (approx. 6' 4") is covered (breezeway) between the two building. NOTE: The breezeway cover "doesn't" attach to the two building.

During my many conversations with the Dish CRS and Technical people, I made a "point" to them how this building is situated in terms of location/distance. Two of the three CRS express this fact... You can run a coax from your 1000.2 antenna to this building up to 200' as that would be the most I could have without losing signal. Didn't state that I could add a signal booster and go another 200' ...total 400 feet.
I mentioned to the CRS that my 1000.2 dish is at the tip (gable) on our 2 story home, and it already sending signal to two HD receivers in the home. and I don't like adding a "switch" for a third receiver. From the 1000.2 dish I would have a coax run of approx. 76' from this 1000.2 to the Dish 508 in the work shop.

This is my opinion, but I think Dish Network don't like to see a "third" antenna installed. You remember how they frown when people starting adding a 2nd antenna when HD came along, and most wanted a better signal from SAT 12.
I was one of those that blocked off the 129 LNB and when with a Dish 500 with a single LNB for 129.

So, what is the big "beef" all about installing a "separate" Dish on the structure and run coax from the antenna to the receiver, and NOTE, run a 76-100 feet of coax from a Dish on a home to a "outer" "detached" structure?


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Stewart Vernon said:


> Thanks for the clarification. That's why I merely asked as opposed to just closing the thread. I was giving the benefit of the doubt, and what you describe doesn't sound like a violation. Also thanks for not taking the question personally... some over-react when asked for clarification.
> 
> Thing is... what you are describing here is different from what the thread starter has described. A completely separate building that is not connected to your home... even if on the same lot... is usually considered a separate structure.
> 
> Some folks rent out such structures just like a cheap apartment... so I would say your example is one that probably would get you into trouble with the audit team if they ever called.


 I wouldn't have the courage to rent out a temporary structure that sits on concrete blocks at the four corners with no finished walls inside, no insulation, no water or gas. In actuality I've been thinking of asking Dish to move the dishes to it as the house needs to be re roofed. And they'd need to come out either way. As I see it that would be no different than a pole mount. The biggest problem would be getting the wires to the house.

It is heavy enough that even the Nor'easters and hurricanes have never shifted it.

I think a pole mount would be too low to the ground to get line of sight.


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## azdishguy81 (Oct 13, 2011)

Sketter take some advice, have your work profeesinally done.. you may not even have dish aimed correcty. and it took you all day and mutlple calls to dish.. just kicked the hornets nest.. i could have had that working in about an hour.. check your alignment on the 500.. the signals should be around 71 on the 110 sat on trans 14. and 62 ish on 119 on trans 14.. other transponders vary. remember there are more then those sats in the sky and the 500 will pick em up and show you signal.. not the correct sats tho.. if ur house is so close why not run rg-6 from the 1k.2 dish to shop? i understand what ur doing and the reason dish wants a separate account is that it can be moved to any house you feel like.. lets have one account and have dish for everyone you know.. nothing is free in life.. suck it up and pay the $7 a month.. thats 2 gallons of gas. or a pack of smokes.


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## azdishguy81 (Oct 13, 2011)

dish 1000.2 has three outputs
leave the work to real installers. you dont do surgery on urself do ya?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Oh, those installers ! Tell me ... Newbie are knows better at the forum.

BTW. what you wrote is out of real- _"there are more then those sats in the sky and the 500 will pick em up and show you signal.."_

FYI, the dish receivers will do LOCK to a signal only if all its parameters will be exactly as in FW/system tables. Not just somewhat modulated signal.
Freq, polarity, modulation, FEC, PIDs ## ...

[Also it's hard to read your UNpunctuated posts - would you use Capital letters, commas, new lines ? Or it would tell me about professional level as installer ]


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## azdishguy81 (Oct 13, 2011)

Yes pSmith. they will Lock on the correct sats if ur aimed at em. 
You can also hit the 119 and be out of alignment still.. Due to reflection angle and such. 
I may be a noob here, but have been installing for over 2 yrs. 
And your expecting everyone to know bout the sat Lock?


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## azdishguy81 (Oct 13, 2011)

And with out a good meter your just guessing, i have seen many a camper aim dishes incorrectly. only to be off a few degree's.. i was simply stating that sometimes its best to let a pro do what we do best, get it set up correcty so you dont spend all day messing around!


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

azdishguy81 said:


> And with out a good meter your just guessing, i have seen many a camper aim dishes incorrectly.


In the end, this isn't surgery or even a highly technical issue.

Having a special meter is helpful but it is most certainly not necessary. In the end, you can do it with some patience and no extra equipment. Even if you don't do it by the book, it is low voltage and unless you fall off of something or cut yourself on a sharp edge, you shouldn't get seriously injured.

I'm all for having things done professionally as a general rule but I still do all my own work. I think it is really petty to suggest that you're necessarily risking life and limb trying to do a little DIY.


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## scooper (Apr 22, 2002)

harsh said:


> In the end, this isn't surgery or even a highly technical issue.
> 
> Having a special meter is helpful but it is most certainly not necessary. In the end, you can do it with some patience and no extra equipment. Even if you don't do it by the book, it is low voltage and unless you fall off of something or cut yourself on a sharp edge, you shouldn't get seriously injured.
> 
> I'm all for having things done professionally as a general rule but I still do all my own work. I think it is really petty to suggest that you're necessarily risking life and limb trying to do a little DIY.


Yeah - I had to correct my Dish500 installtion done by a professional - WAY back in October 2000. When they did it - they only had 119 coming in. I got it fixed so it would get both 119 and 110.


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