# Two letters that you can steal from



## Jason Kragt (Dec 20, 2002)

I've been trying to stay positive about release 215, but the new overscan problems, lockups and missed recordings have moved me to the negative camp. I previously sent a letter to Echostar's Executive Office. That is the first letter below. I just sent the second one to my state's Attorney General. My expectations are low, but I found it helpful to vent. The two letters are pasted below in case you are interested in trying one yourself.

Key to these letters are two attachments promoting DishWire™. The first is a product brochure and the second is a press release. Both attachments are clearly false advertising. They are currently on the web in these locations:

DishPlayer-DVR 921 Product Brochure 
Investor Relations News Release (9/5/2003)

In Michigan, the Attorney General has a Consumer Protection Division office. When they receive complaints such as this, they forward it to the company and ask them if the account is true and if so, how they plan to resolve it. They rarely go much further than that, but the threat is often enough to encourage some action. They also keep the letter on file--and it is never a good thing when a company has a big file.

Again, my expectations are low here, but I found it personally helpful to collect my frustrations about the product and put them down to paper. At a minimum it opens the door to me filing a claim in Michigan Small Claims Court, which is inexpensive and has a reputation of being consumer friendly.


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## Jason Kragt (Dec 20, 2002)

Charles Ergen, CEO
Echostar Communications Corp.
9601 South Meridian Boulevard
Englewood, CO 80112


Dear Mr. Ergen,

In November of 2004, I purchased one of your products, the “DishPlayer-DVR 921” satellite receiver. The receiver has never worked according to how the product brochure and news release (attached) said it would. Specifically, the following capabilities do not work:
·	DVR (“Digital Video Recorder”) or VOD (“Video on Demand”) functionality
·	DishWire™ connection for future downloading and storage of content

The most serious problem is that the DVR/VOD functionality does not work correctly. Often the 921 will seem to record a program, but when I attempt to play the recording, it reports that the event is “0 seconds” in length and that there is nothing to play. I have been on the phone with your technical support department regarding this problem more than any other. On my most recent call, the technician (at extension 42921) recommended that if there is a program that is really important to me, I should connect up a VCR and have the VCR do the recording instead. That was the last straw for me, since the whole purpose of a DVR is to eliminate the hassle and complexity of using a VCR!

At this time, I am requesting a full refund of my $549 purchase price for these reasons:

1.	I have been on the phone with your technical support departments for too many hours. Your systems should have more accurate records of all of my calls than I do, but I estimate that I have been on the phone with your technical support departments for an average of two or three hours per month resolving issues since I purchased the product. That is not reasonable for a consumer product.

2.	Your technical support departments have not resolved the problems that I have reported. I have reported numerous problems, including the system “locking up” for no reason at all, all recordings being lost on the hard drive, timers that failed to fire, recordings that did not properly save on the hard drive (“0 second recordings”), etc. Sometimes their “solution” was to have me reboot the receiver. That solved one instance of the problem, only to have it reoccur at a later time. Other times they say that the problem will be resolved in a software update and I will need to wait. I have been waiting over six months now to no avail.

3.	Your company refuses to honor its warranty. One of the managers that I talked to, John Vith, claimed that the problems I am experiencing are not covered by your warranty because only the software is defective. The hardware is working fine. I disagree with that conclusion. Software is just as much part of the receiver as hardware is. Defects in either cause the system to fail just the same. 

4.	I have been told that some promised functionality will never work. Additionally, John Vith gave me new information that the DishWire™ features promised in the product brochure and news release (attached) will never be implemented. I purchased the product specifically because of these promises.

At this point, I have no choice other than to demand that these issues be corrected within ten days of receipt of this letter, or a full refund issued upon return of my unit.


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## Jason Kragt (Dec 20, 2002)

Mike Cox
State of Michigan Attorney General
P.O. Box 30213
Lansing, MI 48909

Mr. Cox,

I would like to file a consumer complaint against Echostar Communications Corp. (dba "Dish Network") for unfair and deceptive business practices.

In November of 2004 I purchased a DishPlayer-DVR 921 satellite receiver. The product has never worked correctly, despite great efforts on my part to assist them in making things right. Here are the issues:

1.	The defects are inherent in the product. When you complain loud enough, Dish Network might send a replacement unit under the terms of their one-year warranty. I have been through five replacements already. The problem is that all of the replacements have the exact same problems as the original. The defects are inherent in the design of the product line itself, not any single receiver. Dish Network's solution has been to discontinue the 921 receiver and replace it with a new model (942) that has an entirely different architecture. That solves the problems for new customers, but leaves us existing customers with a "lemon" that probably will only be fixed by purchasing the new model.

2.	Dish Network advertised features for this product but never delivered on them. I have included a product brochure and press release about the 921 satellite receiver. Highlighted in yellow are promises of a "DISHWire connection for future downloading and storage of content." This capability was the main reason I chose Dish Network's 921 receiver over comparable models from competitors. During a phone conversation with the product manager (John Vith), I was told that they never intend to deliver this functionality. Again, the only way to get this type of functionality is to purchase their new model 942 receiver.

3.	Neither Dish Network nor its retailers will issue a refund. Dish Network sold this satellite receiver through its network of retailers. I purchased mine from a retailer of theirs called Dish Depot. This creates a "Catch 22" situation for customers like me. Since I have been so patient in working with Dish Network through these problems, the 30-day window that Dish Depot offers for a refund has closed. However, the manufacturer also will not issue a refund because it was purchased through their retailer network. I can understand both of their arguments, but from the consumer's point of view, this arrangement is nothing more than a convenient way for both parties to absolve themselves of accountability. I am looking for someone to step up to the plate and assume responsibility for this lemon.

I am starting to think that I will need to file a claim in Small Claims Court in order to get a fair resolution. I am prepared to do so. I am sending you this note (and copying the CEO of Dish Network) for three reasons:

1.	I would like to give you the opportunity to contact Dish Network regarding the claims in the letter, if you choose to do so. Perhaps you will have better luck getting them to address the root problems than I.

2.	If I do make a claim in court, I want to be able to say that I gave Dish Network every opportunity to resolve the problems. I have been on the phone with them numerous hours, sent a certified letter to their CEO, and sent you this letter. These steps should prove that I have fulfilled my obligations as a consumer.

3.	I would like your Consumer Protection Division to retain a copy of this letter for future reference. A couple of times I have used the word "lemon" to describe this product. I do not use that term lightly. There is an Internet discussion forum (http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=73) devoted entirely to the problems of this receiver and Dish Network's inability or unwillingness to address them. Some of the current discussion threads are:

·	"I want a refund Dish, keep the software!"
·	"Just ask for your money back"
·	"921 abandoned? Anyone have a clue"
·	"This Is Beyond Ridiculous"

There is even talk of class action lawsuits. I'm sure that you must have received other complaints about this product. I would like to make sure you have my documentation as well.

Thank you for your consideration of this complaint.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Jason, hope you didn't mail the AG letter yet. there is a typo on the year second paragraph you need to correct. You meant 2004 not 2005

Good luck.


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## igleaner (Aug 22, 2002)

In your letter to the Attorney General, please correct your date of purchase to November 2004.


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## welchwarlock (Jan 5, 2005)

I too may send a letter to the Texas AG office. Dish network promised features to me, and has yet to deliver. This is Bulls***, and we don't put up with it here in the great state of Texas. No disrespect to the state of Michigan intended.

Regards,
Robert Cook
aka Welch Warlock


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## igleaner (Aug 22, 2002)

And here in the state of New Jersey, home of the Sopranos, we don't put up with it either! Don't tell us to "Fuggetaboudit".

Back in the days when I had cable, and they irritated me, I would simply hook their receiver output directly up to my roof antenna, thereby broadcasting cable TV throughout the neighborhood. This overwhelmed everyone else's OTA reception, causing a flood of complaints to Comcast and was seen as a major "signal leakage" problem by the FCC, punishable by hefty fines to the cable provider. It was fun to get even!


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## Jason Kragt (Dec 20, 2002)

igleaner said:


> Back in the days when I had cable, and they irritated me, I would simply hook their receiver output directly up to my roof antenna, thereby broadcasting cable TV throughout the neighborhood.


Does that really work? I was under the impression that receiver output has nowhere near enough power to broadcast without being amplified significantly.

It does bring back memories of when I had a computer with TV outputs. It would broadcast on either channel 2 or 3. I hooked it up to my cable line in order to broadcast a text-only channel to the neighborhood. It only took a couple of seconds before the RF module in the computer began spewing out massive amounts of smoke.


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## Michael P (Oct 27, 2004)

igleaner said:


> And here in the state of New Jersey, home of the Sopranos, we don't put up with it either! Don't tell us to "Fuggetaboudit".
> 
> Back in the days when I had cable, and they irritated me, I would simply hook their receiver output directly up to my roof antenna, thereby broadcasting cable TV throughout the neighborhood. This overwhelmed everyone else's OTA reception, causing a flood of complaints to Comcast and was seen as a major "signal leakage" problem by the FCC, punishable by hefty fines to the cable provider. It was fun to get even!


I used to lilve near high-rise apartment buildings that had their own in-house "cable" system (SMATV). One day while trying to DX out-of-town TV signals I picked up WUAB-TV over ch 4 (WUAB is a local UHF station on ch 43). It turns out that WUAB was distributed on the in-house system on ch4. This was picked up about 1/3rd of a mile away from the apartment building! (too bad they didn't put Showtime on ch 4 in that building)

On another occasion I was driving down a street on the west side of Cleveland, monitoring 87.7 FM (the lowest digital frequency on my car radio which happens to be almost the same frequency of TV ch 6 which is 87.75) Insted of hearing the audio from a Canadian ch 6 that sometimes skips in, I was getting the audio from ESPN! It turns out that at that time ESPN was carried on ch 6 on North Coast Cable. Again the leakage came from a specific apartment building.

As for someone hooking the RF output of a cable directly to a TV antenna, you would need some way to amplify the signal to get it to "transmit" to a significant distance.


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## SummitAdvantageRetailer (Feb 20, 2005)

igleaner said:


> And here in the state of New Jersey, home of the Sopranos, we don't put up with it either! Don't tell us to "Fuggetaboudit".
> 
> Back in the days when I had cable, and they irritated me, I would simply hook their receiver output directly up to my roof antenna, thereby broadcasting cable TV throughout the neighborhood. This overwhelmed everyone else's OTA reception, causing a flood of complaints to Comcast and was seen as a major "signal leakage" problem by the FCC, punishable by hefty fines to the cable provider. It was fun to get even!


Great, you just confessed to a crime. FCC prohibits you from transmitting willingly without a license.


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## igleaner (Aug 22, 2002)

To amplify the signal, all you need is a cheap Radio Shack in-line power booster. But, even without it, you can still broadcast enough signal leakage to seriously upset those nearby and the cable company. When they show up with their leakage sniffers, simply turn the thing off, and they're left out there scratching their heads. It sure was funny to watch! 

In the installation instructions for cable boxes, they specifically warn you never to hook the output up directly to an antenna, but don't offer an explanation why. But it doesn't take too long to figure out the real reason or everybody would be doing it.


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## igleaner (Aug 22, 2002)

SummitAdvantageRetailer said:


> Great, you just confessed to a crime. FCC prohibits you from transmitting willingly without a license.


The real crime was the way the cable company treated their customers. Not much differnet from the way Dish is treating us now.


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## Jason Kragt (Dec 20, 2002)

After reading this discussion, Dish must be glad that nobody makes 12 GHz transmitters that could jam their signals!


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