# Are you experiencing signal strength drops on Satellite 129?



## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

Just wanted to start a poll to see how many people with a Dish1000 or a Dish500/300 pointed at 129 are seeing signal drops for apparently no reason? 

This may or may not result in you losing lock. A lot of people, myself included are seeing signal drops up to 30 points every 45 minutes or so. 

In my case, my normal strength is not enough to retain lock so I loose the signal when this happens. Other people seem to have enough signal that when the drop happens it doesn't cause signal loss. If you have a dish pointing at 129 and have the time, please go the point dish screen and watch it for a while and see if you see a signal drop. and report.

Please post your configuration and location if possible as well. Trying to figure out how big this problem is.

Thank you


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## grover45 (Feb 8, 2006)

I have been having dropouts on transponder 30 on satellite 129. I have emailed dishnetwork twice with this question about this problem, with no replies. I'm in the Seattle area and just assumed that transponder 30 is at the edge of the spotbeam.


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## Charles Oliva (Apr 22, 2002)

From the 129 in Alaska thread:


> Here's an update. I just got off the phone with Microcom. He confirmed that 129 is not stable for us here. Apparently, it will lock on for 45 minutes or so, then lose the lock. Their engineers have been talking to Dish about this, so Dish is aware of it but does not have a date as to when the problem will be solved.


http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=528955&postcount=5


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

For people answering the poll, if you could also post your location so we can get a better idea where the problem is and where it isn't. I'd really appreciate it.


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## Marriner (Jan 23, 2006)

Getting an 85 signal on 129 West Transponder 5 here in Houston. 129 is captured by a dish 300 with 110 and 119 on a dish 500.


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## sbuko (Jan 10, 2006)

89 on 129 transponder 5 in ATL. Dish 300 / 942


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## pinkey2u (Jan 21, 2006)

Rob, Back on Feb 20th I received a call from a Dish recommended shop from Marysville, WA and ask if it was OK if he could send out a tech to my house to evaluate my situation and run some tests. The tech arrived at 1:00 pm in the afternoon as setup between us and discussed the problems I was having with the 129 Satellite reception. He then tried various tests to check signal readings which he admitted were low but about equal to others in the Puget Sound Area. He then called his boss and they agreed to use a dedicated Dish 500 with the 300 mounting hardware to properly mount the 129 LNB to the dedicated dish for the 129 Satellite. I agreed to having a separate dish mounted for picking up the 129 sat so he proceeded in the change over from removing the 129 LNB from the Dish 1000...setting the Dish 1000 skew adj back for only the 110 & 119 LNB's along with fine point adj to the 119 Satellite. The tech then setup the dedicated 129 sat Dish with much improved readings. He had finished the conversion in about 1.5 hours. I took readings of the 129 Satellite on the various channels and transponders between 6:45 pm and 7:05 pm Monday, Feb 20th as follows: 
ESPN2 HD...TP19...73%__UNIHD 9426...TP19...80%__UNIHD 9427...TP19...80%__Rave...TP30...69%__Equator HD...TP23...69%__Gallery HD...TP3...71%__Treasure HD...TP11...67%__Animania HD...TP23...76%__World Cinema HD...TP11...69%__Rush HD...TP3...73%__World Sport HD...TP11...69%__Ultra HD...TP31...82%__Kung Fu...TP30...75%__Film Fest HD...TP3...75%__Monster HD...TP23...78%__HD News...TP30...75%__Game Play HD...TP31...83%__Family HD...TP31...83%__D1000...TP17...78%.
As you can see the transponder readings have increased but you can also see the variations of readings from certain transponders taken during the 20 minutes. The dedicated 129 Satellite dish did help somewhat but it does not stop signals dropping from the high 70's and low 80's to fall within 30 minutes to the mid 30's then unlock the signal and have a drop out!!!
two Dish 411's originally through a Dish 1000 Satellite with 129...119...110 LNB's.


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

I get an average of 48-77 with my setup. However, I am in the northernmost part of VA, and I am using a D* Phase I dish with an SW64 switch, and have not had time to try to retune the dish for a better signal. Also, keep in mind that E* 5 was never designed to be at the 129, so this can cause issues with signal strength due to the changed look angle. Further keep in mind that E* has had issues with E* 5 and I would hope that they move a sat to the 129 as a backup from either the 110 or 119 when E*10 goes live.


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

pinkey2u said:


> ... The dedicated 129 Satellite dish did help somewhat but it does not stop signals dropping from the high 70's and low 80's to fall within 30 minutes to the mid 30's then unlock the signal and have a drop out!!!
> two Dish 411's originally through a Dish 1000 Satellite with 129...119...110 LNB's.


Thank you for the detailed post.


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## paychekkk (Jan 15, 2006)

I am in north western New Mexico and ater getting a HD upgrade the initial installers had 90 signal strengths on 110 and 119, but only 50 on 129. I called dish and they sent another dish tech and he told me that around 60 was the best he could get for me. I have dropouts, pixelated pictures, pictures freezing on the 129 satt channels. I have the vip 411 with the dish 1000 in my system. 
I ordered the Mosley - Vargas hbo PPV fight this last Saturday night and had freeze frames every couple of minutes. Had it not been mirrored on a mpeg 2 channel which was flawless(110 or 119) I would have been unable to view the fight at all. I have another dish tech coming out this week and I will try again. I understand that 129 has a weak signal, can't dish increase the signal strength level coming from the satt.
This is starting to get real annoying. Hope a fix is on the way.
Mikey


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## zer0cool (Nov 24, 2004)

I'm in Arlington Texas, and I've been losing lock on several of the Voom channels. I've got a Dish 1000 hooked up to a 921receiver (which will be replaced by a 622 tomorrow).


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

paychekkk said:


> I ordered the Mosley - Vargas hbo PPV fight this last Saturday night and had freeze frames every couple of minutes. Had it not been mirrored on a mpeg 2 channel which was flawless(110 or 119) I would have been unable to view the fight at all. I have another dish tech coming out this week and I will try again. I understand that 129 has a weak signal, can't dish increase the signal strength level coming from the satt.


Actually, all the "new" "MPEG4" channels are currently being sent as MPEG2. They are having problems on the sending end with the new stuff at MPEG4. As for the 129, they really should have put another bird there, like the one they moved to the 77, but oh well.


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## talk000 (Jul 5, 2003)

Upstate SC. Dish 1000. 508 reciever. Upper 60s on transponder 21 (for some locals) in good weather. If it rains will drop to mid 50s with complete loss of signal on 129. 
110 and 119 still will come in fine..
Some breakup (not a complete loss of signal) ocassionally on 129 in fair weather but not often


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## Cokeswigga (Jan 25, 2005)

I haven't watched enough of the HD channels to experience a total drop, but I have seen pixelization some of it severe. 
(very similar to what happened on superbowl for those who remeber when dish offered superbowl in HD for the day)


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## Paradox-sj (Dec 15, 2004)

I am in San Jose, Calif. and my D1000 reception is spotty at best. Can't even lock on to the TP's 17 You have a Dish 1000 channel....

On a good moment cos we have yet to have a good day, signal strength for the TPS that do lock is betwear 40-45.


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## Greg Mueller (Feb 28, 2006)

Is there a chart of the foot print of 129?
I live by Seattle and I'm trying to figure out what kind of signal strength I can possibly get.

I'm getting a little concerned (after reading these posts) that all the HD subscribers have been sold "a bill of goods". If Dish Network's HD programming is not going to work then what is it they think they have a right to sell? I really don't consider programming with continuous freeze ups (etc) a sellable product.


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## cebbigh (Feb 27, 2005)

Although I am seeing variations on the 129, it shouldn't be enough to loose signal now that I'm using two 500's.


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## Paradox-sj (Dec 15, 2004)

I get better reception from 61.5 than I do from 129 and I am in Calif...129 is supposed to solve the one dish local issue...I suppose it does as they have them linked there even if you can recieve them


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## cebbigh (Feb 27, 2005)

Paradox-sj said:


> I get better reception from 61.5 than I do from 129 and I am in Calif...129 is supposed to solve the one dish local issue...I suppose it does as they have them linked there even if you can recieve them


Sadly, I was getting more reliable signal off the 61.5 too here in the Seattle area. The numbers did not peak as high but the signal was more steady, enough so that I only had drops during major thunder and lighting storms off to the east (Cascades). But most people just don't have the line of sight out here for 61.5 and those of us who look forward to local HD from dish will most likely need 129. According to the techs I've talked to, they are aware of the 129 issues and there are people looking into getting things fixed. It seems to me that the signal off 129 used to be better. My problems started around the end of January. Anyone else have the same experience?


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## Mike123abc (Jul 19, 2002)

There is a possiblity of the signal improving in a couple months when E10 goes into 110. If the get to move all the LIL HD off of 129 and put them on 110, it is possible that they will be able to swich E5 back into high power mode. E5 can do 16 TPs in high power and 32 in regular power. It is hard to say what Dish will end up doing. Some have speculated that a satellite from 110 may move there when E10 gets to 110.


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

I happened to be looking at the signal on transponder 30 tonight in the "point dish" screen when it dropped and recovered. Was quite interesting to watch. First the strength is 71, then it fluctuates down into the upper 60's, then all of a sudden drops down to 36 and loses lock. The, a few seconds later it starts going back up, 1 - 2 points every couple of seconds like clockwork, slowly back up to 71. It never regains "lock", but as soon as I change transponders and go back to transponder 30 it's locked again, I'm guessing the screen just didn't update that it had locked back on.

How could this possibly be a problem with the installation????


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## Paradox-sj (Dec 15, 2004)

Rob Glasser said:


> I happened to be looking at the signal on transponder 30 tonight in the "point dish" screen when it dropped and recovered. Was quite interesting to watch. First the strength is 71, then it fluctuates down into the upper 60's, then all of a sudden drops down to 36 and loses lock. The, a few seconds later it starts going back up, 1 - 2 points every couple of seconds like clockwork, slowly back up to 71. It never regains "lock", but as soon as I change transponders and go back to transponder 30 it's locked again, I'm guessing the screen just didn't update that it had locked back on.
> 
> How could this possibly be a problem with the installation????


Tp30 on 129 for me is DOA...nothing, zero not even a peap of anykind, completely asleep.


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## Mikey (Oct 26, 2004)

I looked at 129/TP30 last night, about 7pm, signal was ~68 and steady here in central Oklahoma. I watched the Monsters (129/TP23) movie "The Black Scorpion" from 6-7:30, no dropouts or pixellation.


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## cebbigh (Feb 27, 2005)

Rob Glasser said:


> I happened to be looking at the signal on transponder 30 tonight in the "point dish" screen when it dropped and recovered. Was quite interesting to watch. First the strength is 71, then it fluctuates down into the upper 60's, then all of a sudden drops down to 36 and loses lock. The, a few seconds later it starts going back up, 1 - 2 points every couple of seconds like clockwork, slowly back up to 71. It never regains "lock", but as soon as I change transponders and go back to transponder 30 it's locked again, I'm guessing the screen just didn't update that it had locked back on.
> 
> How could this possibly be a problem with the installation????


I think something similar happens on 23 although I haven't stuck with it long enough to get that clear a pattern. But I have seen 23 drop to the 30's on the 1000 dish. The stronger transponders also drop periodically but hold signal because they start at a higher level to begin with. I do think it is across the board.


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

cebbigh said:


> I think something similar happens on 23 although I haven't stuck with it long enough to get that clear a pattern. But I have seen 23 drop to the 30's on the 1000 dish. The stronger transponders also drop periodically but hold signal because they start at a higher level to begin with. I do think it is across the board.


I would tend to agree. I checked out a bunch of the transponders during a transponder 30 dropout and the higher numbered transponders, namely those in the 20 - 30 range had a lower signal strength than the lower numbered ones.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Paradox-sj said:


> Tp30 on 129 for me is DOA...nothing, zero not even a peap of anykind, completely asleep.


Do you have a HD receiver?


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## Cokeswigga (Jan 25, 2005)

James Long said:


> Do you have a HD receiver?


You need to look at signal strength with an receiver.

BTW... I never saw Transponder 30 dancing around.

I took the 311 outside to install a 2nd dish to have 129 on it's own dish and 110/119 on another, and to my dismay, the 311 wouldn't show signal strength on 129. So I had to grab my mod output from the 622 and hook it up to the little tv.

By the way.. here are my sig strengths on D1000 setup for 110/119/129 and then I added a d500 for 110/119 and used the D1000 and swung it for 129 only

Xponder-D1000/110/119/129-D1000/129
1-63-71
2-64-75
3-66-74
4-62-70
5-63-71
6-78-87
7-70-79
8-60-66
9-76-82
10-78-86
11-66-74
12-77-82
13-64-70
14-67-76
15-71-79
16-63-71
17-62-68
18-63-74
19-64-72
20-63-70
21-62-69
22-N/A
23-67-74
24-60-68
25-N/A
26-N/A
27-65-74
28-N/A
29-N/A
30-65-75
31-64-78

On average by having 129 on it's own Dish peaked for 129, I gained about 8 points of signal strength. On 110 I gained over 16 points, and 119 gained about 4.

Before this instlall, when it was raining, it was seeing signals drop to the 50's and it was having pixelation. I will have to wait for more rain to update my numbers with the new dish.

I would highly recommend keeping your current dish at 110/119 and adding a 2nd for 129.

Before anyone asks... I'm too lazy to point the a D500 at 129 and try this again, so you will have to live with my numbers from the D1000.


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## grover45 (Feb 8, 2006)

I am in the Seattle area and also noticed the problem occuring mid January. Transponder 30 on Satellite 129 is having dropouts (RAVE and KUNGFU). I won't upgrade to the new receivers till this problem is fixed. In fact, I have gotten so upset with Dish that I dropped all the premium channels and am probably goint to drop the HD channels. The only was I believe Dish will take care of this problem is if they loose customers.[

QUOTE=cebbigh]Sadly, I was getting more reliable signal off the 61.5 too here in the Seattle area. The numbers did not peak as high but the signal was more steady, enough so that I only had drops during major thunder and lighting storms off to the east (Cascades). But most people just don't have the line of sight out here for 61.5 and those of us who look forward to local HD from dish will most likely need 129. According to the techs I've talked to, they are aware of the 129 issues and there are people looking into getting things fixed. It seems to me that the signal off 129 used to be better. My problems started around the end of January. Anyone else have the same experience?[/QUOTE]


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## cebbigh (Feb 27, 2005)

grover45 said:


> I am in the Seattle area and also noticed the problem occuring mid January. Transponder 30 on Satellite 129 is having dropouts (RAVE and KUNGFU). I won't upgrade to the new receivers till this problem is fixed. In fact, I have gotten so upset with Dish that I dropped all the premium channels and am probably goint to drop the HD channels. The only was I believe Dish will take care of this problem is if they loose customers.
> 
> 
> > Mid January might be right. I wasn't watching Voom that much at the time and may have just not noticed the problem till later on. On 2/21, I went from the 1000 to two 500's. Since that time I have not experienced any picture breakup on my 942, although I continue to see signal variations off 129. It might be possible to zero in the 1000 to make it work in the Pacific NW with a high enough signal that it doesn't drop out when the signal drops, but I couldn't do it.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Cokeswigga said:


> You need to look at signal strength with an receiver.


That's the point. My 301 and 501 can't see a 8PSK transponder to give signal strength - so it's always zero. One must use an 8PSK receiver - most of those are HD.

Odd that your 311 didn't give a signal strength. I was under the impression that it could see 8PSK transponders. Probably more to the process than we understand.


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## gspandel (Jan 9, 2006)

My signal strength range on 129-30 will go from 45 to 82 and I had several instances yesterday where the signal became Zero while trying to watch RAVE. I don't know if the problem is with the satellite or VOOM's broadcasting and transmitting ability of some of its channels.


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## absmith (Oct 22, 2005)

Yes. I am in SW Idaho and I have reception problems with 129 on my superdish. My mother, friend, and brother do too. The install techs always said that the 60% reception range was the best they could do.

Maybe dish needs to release a single higher gain dish (20"-24") that can be used to really focus and boost reception to 105, 121, etc etc.. Something standard that could be considered a "fix-all" for all us trouble cases. Personally, I wouldn't mind having 2-3 dishes on my roof vs a single super dish (they are so huge). 

Also I'm curious why there is superdish for 110,119,129 and a dish for 105, 110, 119. I haven't found what I am missing from 105. I really hope they start dedicating some serious channel space for the mpeg4 HDTV content.


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## jmm4600 (Jan 30, 2006)

My location is in the Metro Detroit area, northern burbs, and I have not experienced any drop outs on 129. I had it installed back on February 10th and so far no problems, only time will tell!


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## BB1 (Mar 8, 2006)

I am located about 100 miles north of Seattle and experiencing severe problems with the Voom channels on 129. The problem happens on all transponders, with transponder 30 being the worst. Sometime in January the problem got so bad that nearly all my Voom channels are now unwatchable, even after carefully re-aiming the D1000.

About every 15 minutes, my already weak signal levels of 50 to 65 will start slowly diving downwards. When this happens, a 20 point loss in signal strength is the norm for most transponders. It will then linger at a 20 to 30 signal level for several minutes or more. Then it starts slowly creeping up again, eventually making it back up to the low 50's. This whole cycle can often take 2 to 5 minutes to complete!

Lately it has been getting even worse. For example, as one other person here near Seattle mentioned, transponder 30 (Rave) has started to occationally drop all the way to zero before slowly regaining normal strength. I have also seen transponder 23 (Equator) do the same thing, but not nearly as often.

The problem is further componded by the buggy software in the 811, which does not gracefully handle weak or unexpected signal loss. For example, once the signal levels on a transponder drop off, the screen freezes and often won't return unless you change to a different channel. That's if you're lucky! Often the whole receiver just starts acting wierd and you're best off to force a reboot. In my opinion, E* does not sufficently test their software for the handling of unusual or rare states. 

Judging from all the posts on this subject, there is clearly something wrong with the satellite at 129. Since these problems already existed (but to a lesser extent) back when E* launched the D1000, it is my opinon E* knew about these issues but for some reason choose to charge ahead with the D1000 roll-out anyway. If I had to speculate, I would say they wanted something to counter D*'s "re-think TV" ad campaign and their claims of a "1000 HD channels" that seemed to be providing D* with so much mindshare at the time. They took a risk with a known marginal sat, and now the problem has become unexpectedly worse.

Whatever their motivation, I am pissed off and would like to see E* come clean by explaining to us what is going on with 129 and when it will be fixed. As it is now, I am paying for Voom channels that are nearly unwatchabale. While I could simply cancel Voom, I am afraid they will force me into a more expensive metalic pak if I ever want Voom back again.

So I sit here waiting, hoping a fix is in the works. I read here that their recent FCC filings state they plan to move E10 to 110 and keep one of the existing sats there as a spare. I sure hope that's not accurate. I was hoping they would move the free'd up sat to 129 and fix this problem.


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## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Not seeing drops but unable to pick up 3 VOOM channels on Transponder 30. So I swung my dish back to 61.5.


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## Greg Mueller (Feb 28, 2006)

BB1
I live by The Hood Canal on The Kitsap Peninsula. I had the same problem with the 129 bird. Here's what I finally did

http://www.muellersatomics.com/VSA.htm


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

Greg Mueller said:


> BB1
> I live by The Hood Canal on The Kitsap Peninsula. I had the same problem with the 129 bird. Here's what I finally did
> 
> http://www.muellersatomics.com/VSA.htm


Somehow I think my wife would shoot me if I put something like that on my roof 

Still hoping that Dish will get this fixed before too long.


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## Greg Mueller (Feb 28, 2006)

All the folks at Dish are in denial about the 129 bird. I've been through 4 techs and they are all "surprised" that we have weak signal on the west coast, even though I've told them each about the problem and had the installers back out. (They were supposed to send the manager, but he didn't show and didn't call)

Some people in western Washington are having luck using their old Dish 500 dish and moving their 129 LNB over to it using this "I Adapter"
http://www.dishstore.net/product_info.php?cPath=65&products_id=146

I've heard reports of a 20 point signal gain over the Dish 1000 setup. Not sure what it does for stabilizing the "Yo Yo signal" we're getting here. One guy is going to use his old Voom dish (with LNB mounting mods).

I think if you wait for them, it might take a while


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

I've heard of about 10 point increases with what I'm currently getting on my Dish1000, but even that is not completely eliminating the dropouts for a lot of people. Until there are channels that I watch a lot being affected I'm not going to deal with a second Dish on my roof again. Trying to keep my install clean.

Dish has to be aware of the problem, various people have reported that their techs have been in contact with Dish about it. There is no way it's not a problem with the Bird or the location. There is no way that almost 50 DBSTalk members and who knows how many other Dish customers would all have their Dish1000's pointed incorrectly. Especially since so many have had installers out multiple times to make sure things are right. Whether or not it's fixed quickly or not, who knows. I'm definetly waiting for Echostar 10 to get up and running and see what happens from there.


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## dale2345 (Mar 19, 2005)

Greg Mueller said:


> All the folks at Dish are in denial about the 129 bird. I've been through 4 techs and they are all "surprised" that we have weak signal on the west coast, even though I've told them each about the problem and had the installers back out. (They were supposed to send the manager, but he didn't show and didn't call)
> 
> Some people in western Washington are having luck using their old Dish 500 dish and moving their 129 LNB over to it using this "I Adapter"
> http://www.dishstore.net/product_info.php?cPath=65&products_id=146
> ...


I am one of the people in Western Washington (Lake Forest Park) who paid a local installer to reinstall my Dish 500 and take the 129 LNBF from my Dish 1000. It added about 10-15 points to all transponder readings, but I still get the 30+ point yo yo signal. Earlier this morning I recorded 4 consecutive Rave programs on my 942, (I'm still awaiting my 622 36 days after ordering) and all 4 could not be viewed all the way through when I watched them later. As soon as my 942 comes to a spot in the recording where the signal dropped drastically the recording "jumps" to the end showing the choices for viewing a program.

I have ordered a 31" dish and will try installing it when it gets here. I agree its a problem with the 129 satellite and I believe Dish knows of this!


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## dale2345 (Mar 19, 2005)

Rob Glasser said:


> I've heard of about 10 point increases with what I'm currently getting on my Dish1000, but even that is not completely eliminating the dropouts for a lot of people. Until there are channels that I watch a lot being affected I'm not going to deal with a second Dish on my roof again. Trying to keep my install clean.
> 
> Dish has to be aware of the problem, various people have reported that their techs have been in contact with Dish about it. There is no way it's not a problem with the Bird or the location. There is no way that almost 50 DBSTalk members and who knows how many other Dish customers would all have their Dish1000's pointed incorrectly. Especially since so many have had installers out multiple times to make sure things are right. Whether or not it's fixed quickly or not, who knows. I'm definetly waiting for Echostar 10 to get up and running and see what happens from there.


I have been encountering similar problems with frequent signal decreases. First I had a Dish 500 installed and that raised the transponder signals on 129 about 10-15 points but I still have the frequent, regular signal losses. I now have ordered a 31" Fortec dish and will get it next week. Now I'm wondering if I need an adapter to install one of my DishPro dual LNBs to it. This LNB is currently installed on the Dish 500 with an "I" adapter. Does anyone know if this setup will work with the larger 31" dish?


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## dougmcbride (Apr 17, 2005)

dale2345 said:


> I have been encountering similar problems with frequent signal decreases. First I had a Dish 500 installed and that raised the transponder signals on 129 about 10-15 points but I still have the frequent, regular signal losses. I now have ordered a 31" Fortec dish and will get it next week. Now I'm wondering if I need an adapter to install one of my DishPro dual LNBs to it. This LNB is currently installed on the Dish 500 with an "I" adapter. Does anyone know if this setup will work with the larger 31" dish?


See http://www.daveswebshop.com/76dss_dish.shtml


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## cebbigh (Feb 27, 2005)

Has anyone noticed picture breakup on Universal HD that doesn't seem related to the observable signal drops off 129? I've seen momentary picture breakup (not enough to cause a freeze/black screen) and done an immediate check switch expecting to see a low number off the 129 but the numbers looked fine. I think there might be something more going on besides the observable signal fades.

later observation: Just saw something similar on HDNET so I guess it's not limited to 129 and probably not related to the whole issue of signal drops that this thread is about. It isn't a major problem, just momentary picture breakup usually on the bottom of the screen. Enough to be a minor annoyance. Since I moved off the single dish 1000 to two 500's I still see the signal drops on 129 but I don't think I've seen complete picture loss or any interrupted recordings. I wonder if it has anything to do with mpeg4 vs mpeg2? I think what I'm seeing has less to do with signal loss and more to do with signal translation.


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## digiblur (Jun 11, 2005)

What does expierencing mean?

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q= expierencing


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## David_Levin (Apr 22, 2002)

Wow, with my 622/Dish1000 now on the way I've started reading more here.

Currently have both wings.

With drops from the 70's to the 30's you gotta figure that satellite positioning is fried (which has been reported). They've probably lost gyros and are running on thrusters only (do Torque Rods work at 22,000 miles?).

I'd like 129 for the Denver locals, but if it's not stable, I'll never watch it. Was thinking to repoint the 61.5 wing to 129, but it sounds like this isn't enough.

What happens if I bring in both 61.5 and 129? Do both copies of the common channels show up in the guide (like HBO on 110 and 148)? Then, I have to tell the name-based-recording which channel to record?

Dish will have to (eventually) move another bird to 129 (if they are on thrusters, they'll probably run out of fuel before the new Canadian bird can get there). Maybe (after the guy leaves), I'll just reconnect both wings and skip the Denver locals (for awhile). I get them OTA as well.


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## deweybrunner (Feb 8, 2004)

At times signal strength is in low 40's, other times picture completely black. Other times signal is in mid seventies with good picture. 1000 antenna tweaked out to strong signals on 119 and 110, which means 129 should come in good, since anchored to same dish. Have this loss on both 942 and 622. One thread said e is aware and will fix in the future? Dewey in Tampa


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

I'm on the central Oregon coast and just added Dish to my new KDS-R60XBR1 so I could get HD programming.

My local Dish dealer cautioned me that some of the HD channels were dropping out every 30 minutes or so here but I went ahead and got it anyway.

They put up a D 1000 dish and I got what he said I would....drop out of the 129 sat signals every 30 minutes.

I too have contacted Dish and the phone jockey that I talked to claimed that they've never heard there was a problem with 129 out here until I called. From what I've read here and elsewhere, Dish has been contacted plenty of times and is stonewalling the issue until they can fix it. I received no response from Dish in emails asking for a credit on my bill until the problem was fixed.

If Dish had customer satisfaction as a priority, they would offer relief to those affected and post progress towards a solution on their website. They would certainly not try to plead ignorance to the problem. However, to keep the money rolling in, they just keep their mouths shut so they don't have to issue credits.

Sad...


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## Greg Mueller (Feb 28, 2006)

Started with a Dish 1000 and VIP211. HD was total unusable. My best signal was 70 with swings into the low 30s.

Obtained a Channel Master 1.2M and moved 129 LNB to it. Now the signal never leaves the 90s.

The Dish techs lie when they say they don't know. I have written several times to [email protected] blah...... and called several times. I'm counting the months till I can bale from DN

They know


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## wimcolgate (Mar 29, 2004)

When I had my 622 installed this past week, the tech put in a dedicated Dish 500 to point to the 129 satelite and then feed it into an LNB that feeds the house. I live in the Seattle area and the install tech said they were having problems with the 1000's.

Wim


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

We live in southern Utah about 30 miles north of St. George. I had a 622 and a Dish 1000 put in about a month ago. My local HD's come out of Salt Lake City on 129 t 24. We have had very bad signal dropout problems with those locals from day one. We went from the Dish 1000 to 3 dishes, 1000 pointed to 110 & 119; a 500 pointed to 148 & a 500 pointed to 129. The signal on 129-24 goes from low 50's to the upper 60's. We have had the 622 exchanged with no help. This weekend we started to experience a total loss of picture for up to 1/2 hour on different local HD feeds ( the NASCAR race on Fox was a green "pixilated" screen). The tech advisors at Dish (I call them almost every day) claim that they are NOT aware of any problems on 129!!!!! I'm about ready to use the whole system for targets!!!! Has anyone gotten any help from Dish????


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

As a side note to my post above. Dish Network has told me on several calls that 129 does have problems in 4 areas; the Northwest, the Northeast, south Florida and Baja.


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

That's more than I got from Dish. I don't suppose they told you what they're going to do about it....


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

Avedis said:


> That's more than I got from Dish. I don't suppose they told you what they're going to do about it....


Last week they were going to send a FSM out (Field Service Mananger) but a contract installer showed up instead!!!! He claimed that the dish 1000 should be removed and a 500 put up in its place - to look at 110 & 119. I told him that the problem with 129 would not be helped with doing that............why do they send out idiots????? Dish was going to send out a FSM this week but I have to cancel (I have to be away and don't want them working on the system if I'm not here). I'll reshcedule for when I get bakc in a couple of weeks and see what happens.

Some of the tech service reps at dish did claim that the problems with 129 are "JUST A RUMOR" and don't exist. BUT I did get a call last week from Dish "engineering dept." asking about my signal strength on 129. The "enigneer" admitted that there is a problem on 129.


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## mraroid (Jun 11, 2006)

Greg Mueller said:


> BB1
> I live by The Hood Canal on The Kitsap Peninsula. I had the same problem with the 129 bird. Here's what I finally did
> 
> http://www.muellersatomics.com/VSA.htm


Which dish has more gain the Primestar 1.2 meter dish you have used, or the 500?

I would like to try your solution, but I can not custome make a LNBF holder as you have. If I can find a solution with off the shelf items, that would work better for me.

What do you (or anyone) think about this Wave Frontier T55 dish used just for just 129.0W?

http://www.criscros.net/ToroidT55.htm

Thanks for sharing your information.

Mr. Aroid


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## mraroid (Jun 11, 2006)

dale2345 said:


> I have ordered a 31" dish and will try installing it when it gets here. I agree its a problem with the 129 satellite and I believe Dish knows of this!


So, I take it the 31" dish is larger than the Dish 500?

Mr. Aroid


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## mraroid (Jun 11, 2006)

Here is a Fortec 1.2 meter, 48" dish on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=9706397668

I take it Channel Master makes a 48" dish? Can someone post a URL?

This 48" baby looks like it might be a good solution for a single LNBF for 129.0W. How about mating it up with a high end LNBF? Do vendors (other than the Dish Network) make LNBF's that maybe have higher gain than the stock LNBF we see in the D1000?

Here is a link to Invacom. Can someone smarter than me look over the LNBF's they sell and see if they have a better one than the stock LNBF we see Dish Network handing out?

http://www.invacom.com/

What other LNBF vendors do we have to choose from? Let's put our heads together and find a solution to the 129.0W problem in the PNW and other places.

Thanks in advance.

Mr. Aroid


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## LG811User (Jan 12, 2005)

Paradox-sj said:


> Tp30 on 129 for me is DOA...nothing, zero not even a peap of anykind, completely asleep.


Ditto. I am in the Los Gatos mountains near San Jose. I use a dish 300 for 129.
Tp30 is dead. All other Tps work well.

I started a thread on this earlier:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=58666

Dirves me crazy!

I'm switching back to 61.5 this weekend.


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## dewey brunner (May 1, 2006)

I am here in Tampa, Fl. and experience great fluxuations. This morning the signals are from low 60's to mid 80's . Later I could get low readings and begin to get a loss or break up, expecially in the higer transponders.. I even put an in line amplifier which was no help. I have a 622 and 942 with no switches along with the 1000. I would go back to 61.5, however, we now have some hd channels on 129. I have read about every thread on this subject and have seen very little that will help.


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## steveschauer (Jun 17, 2006)

I just had a site survey done for my pending install and learned a few things I can pass on.

The installer said they will no longer shoot for 129 here in the northwest - they will install two Dish 500s, with one for 110 and 119 and the other for 61.5. Only problem was my neighbors' fir trees block 61.5. 

He said the dropoffs have to do with an orbital problem at the satellite, compounded by the fact that we are at the very edge of the footprint.

After calling and talking to the manager I found out that they expect a new larger Dish 1000 to be used in the future to help fix the problem. I also decided to go ahead and do the install at 129 and wait for the fix, which he said would be at their expense.

Considering the alternative (DirecTV's measly HD selection and no DVR) what else could I do?


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## levibluewa (Aug 13, 2005)

Hey Steve in Port Townsend...trees here too  , so 61.5 is not an option.

Upgraded to the 211 last week to receive the long awaited National Geographic HD channel. They installed a separate dish for the 129, but as the installer forewarned me the signal drops off and the signal is lost if not frozen for several minutes at a time. I too called DISH to voice my dis-pleasure and was told no problem exists that they are aware. He asked me to check the signal strength...129 transponder 22...signal was about 55 with clear skies...no drizzle!
They're sending someone out this Friday. Any words of wisdom from anyone?

Thanks...
Bruce in Bellingham (100 mi N of Seattle)


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

levibluewa said:


> the signal strength...129 transponder 22...signal was about 55 with clear skies...no drizzle!
> They're sending someone out this Friday. Any words of wisdom from anyone?


Get a bigger dish. You might be able to get into the low 70's if the Dish500 they installed is tuned perfectly but you'll still probably have periodic dropouts when the signal drops 30 - 40 points every 30 - 45 minutes.

Other than that there isn't much we can do at the moment.


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## ebaltz (Nov 23, 2004)

In Phoenix I have occassional dropouts on 129, signal strength on all Xponders is usually in low 60s or lower.


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## jjjrace (Jun 27, 2006)

See a lot of posts about problems, problems, problems. I upgraded to Dish Network High Definition package. I have a new Vip 622 receiver hooked to a Dish 1000 which brings in Satellite 110,119, and 129 . I have strong signal on all Satellites. Signal on 129 is about 88 which is excellent . I live just north of Atlanta,GA. The high def programming is awesome. I have a new 50" Maxent Plasma from Best Buy. Outstanding picture coupled with the Dish Network ViP 622. HDNet is a really cool channel with very diverse programming with breathtaking picture quality. Love it. Gotta go!


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## walendvay (Oct 8, 2003)

absmith said:


> Yes. I am in SW Idaho and I have reception problems with 129 on my superdish. My mother, friend, and brother do too. The install techs always said that the 60% reception range was the best they could do.
> 
> Maybe dish needs to release a single higher gain dish (20"-24") that can be used to really focus and boost reception to 105, 121, etc etc.. Something standard that could be considered a "fix-all" for all us trouble cases. Personally, I wouldn't mind having 2-3 dishes on my roof vs a single super dish (they are so huge).
> 
> Also I'm curious why there is superdish for 110,119,129 and a dish for 105, 110, 119. I haven't found what I am missing from 105. I really hope they start dedicating some serious channel space for the mpeg4 HDTV content.


What outfit did your install? Are you still seeing signal issues? I am looking to switch from D* to E*, however, this 129 problem has me worried. Especially since ESPN2 is on 129! :-(


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## Don M (Jul 1, 2006)

I live in the Texas Panhandle. I had a Vip211 installed last Fri. I was unable to get any signals on 129. I called Dish and they ran all the diagnostics and said it was either a hardware problem or the dish needed to be realigned. I had the installer come out Thursday, and he checked the dish, the switch, and everything else. Finally as a last resort, he unplugged the 211 and plugged it back in. Since then I can get 129 ok, but the signal strength is usually in the 50s. I haven't noticed any problems yet, but I will monitor it over the weekend and post any problems I encounter.


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## Mike D-CO5 (Mar 12, 2003)

Just add a side sat dish for 61.5 and don't use the 129 sat anymore. Unless you have hd local locals at 129 I wouldn't use the 129 sat. I did the same in southeast Texas 90 miles from Houston , and I now have no problems with hd channels. I get consistent signal strengths in the 90s and 100s on 61.5 .


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## cyclone27 (Feb 1, 2006)

I'm in Des Moines, Iowa & I am also having problems on 129 with constant outages on ESPN2, NFL, Starz. 
My locals are on 110 but I don't think 61.5 is an option for me. Is there a map I can refer to see if it's possible to use 61.5?
Is anyone else in this area having these problems?
Thanks.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

I'm in Lubbock, Texas, especially in the afternoon my signal drops below 45 and I loose lock, sometimes it reboots my 622 or completely locks it up so I have to do a power button reboot.

I got tired of it so I bought a DP500 dish and aimed it at 61.5. Now my signal is in the 70's for tp22 and some tp's are over 100.


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## jjkrueg (Jul 26, 2006)

cyclone27 said:


> I'm in Des Moines, Iowa & I am also having problems on 129 with constant outages on ESPN2, NFL, Starz.
> My locals are on 110 but I don't think 61.5 is an option for me. Is there a map I can refer to see if it's possible to use 61.5?
> Is anyone else in this area having these problems?
> Thanks.


I'm in southwest Iowa and having the same problems on the same channels. I've had Dish out to replace the LNB's, receiver, line, everything. Still same issues. Work for 30 minutes, off for another 30. I don't buy locals. Does anyone know if I can get a 500 dish and tune it to 129 and get a better signal? Are the channel options the same on 61.5 as they are on 129?


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## MarkoC (Apr 5, 2004)

I live in Minneapolis and I got a Dish 1000 installed on Monday. I am experiencing dropouts on some of the channels on the 129 as well. I have problems with StarzHD, HGHD, NTGHD, ESPN2HD and Rave. These occur somewhat frequently and it is quite annoying. I called Dish technical support and they are sending someone out Saturday to take a look. The woman on the phone said that it is possible I live in an area where I won't be able to recieve the 129. That doesn't make any sense to me, why would they put the Minneapolis locals on the 129 if people who live in Minneapolis can't recieve them?


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## HD-Jene (Jul 30, 2006)

I live in southern New Mexico. Dish installed my VIP622 and a Dish 1000 on July 10.
After 3 service visits the best signal level was 60 on TP3 and 22.
I put up my 500 Dish and aimed at Sat 129 got about78 on these channels.
Better but not good in rainey wheather.
I reaimed the 500 Dish at 61.5 and get 100 to 115 on the HD channels.


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## Mike D-CO5 (Mar 12, 2003)

Yes a two satellite install works best especially if the second dish is set for 61.5. The dish 1000 is a good idea but unfortunately Dish put up a crappy dieing satellite up there at 129 which makes the dish 1000 useless.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

Steve H said:


> As a side note to my post above. Dish Network has told me on several calls that 129 does have problems in 4 areas; the Northwest, the Northeast, south Florida and Baja.


??

Two of hese areas are not suppose to be using 129 (also part of texas). So that just leaves NW and Baja.


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## George Jetson (Mar 9, 2006)

Another datapoint for those who are interested. Moderators feel free to move this if it should be somewhere else.
I originally had a dish1000 installed and 129 was always problematic. My signal strengths after the initial install ranged from 49-70 (average 57). I tweaked the dish to favor 129 and got readings up to 57-74 (average 62). I then put up my old dish 300, aimed it at 129, and got 56-76 (average 64). Up to this point I was still seeing dropouts - it would lose lock on 129 every 20 minutes like clockwork. 
Then I managed to get a hold of an old 30" dish from my employer (not sure of the brand, they used to use it for a wireless datalink between buildings). I figured out a way to mount my lnb to it and set it up to see 129. My signal strengths are now 70-86 (average 76). I've only had it set up for a couple of days , but so far I haven't seen a dropout. I saw some minor pixellation once for a few seconds, but other than that its been flawless.
This is the first time I've ever attempted to mess with my setup myself. Many thanks to all of the contributors here that gave me the knowledge and courage to give it a shot.


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## ebaltz (Nov 23, 2004)

George Jetson said:


> Another datapoint for those who are interested. Moderators feel free to move this if it should be somewhere else.
> I originally had a dish1000 installed and 129 was always problematic. My signal strengths after the initial install ranged from 49-70 (average 57). I tweaked the dish to favor 129 and got readings up to 57-74 (average 62). I then put up my old dish 300, aimed it at 129, and got 56-76 (average 64). Up to this point I was still seeing dropouts - it would lose lock on 129 every 20 minutes like clockwork.
> Then I managed to get a hold of an old 30" dish from my employer (not sure of the brand, they used to use it for a wireless datalink between buildings). I figured out a way to mount my lnb to it and set it up to see 129. My signal strengths are now 70-86 (average 76). I've only had it set up for a couple of days , but so far I haven't seen a dropout. I saw some minor pixellation once for a few seconds, but other than that its been flawless.
> This is the first time I've ever attempted to mess with my setup myself. Many thanks to all of the contributors here that gave me the knowledge and courage to give it a shot.


What's the short and sweet way to peak for 129?


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

ebaltz said:


> What's the short and sweet way to peak for 129?


Go into the Installation menu of your receiver and then the Point Dish screen. Change the Sat to 129 and then tweak your DISH, slightly adjusting skew, elevation, and direction to find the highest signal strength for that Sat. Is this what you were looking for?


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## ebaltz (Nov 23, 2004)

Rob Glasser said:


> Go into the Installation menu of your receiver and then the Point Dish screen. Change the Sat to 129 and then tweak your DISH, slightly adjusting skew, elevation, and direction to find the highest signal strength for that Sat. Is this what you were looking for?


Yeah I know the first part of that, but have never phsyically adjusted the dish itself. How subtle do the adjustments need to be?


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

ebaltz said:


> Yeah I know the first part of that, but have never phsyically adjusted the dish itself. How subtle do the adjustments need to be?


Pretty subtle. If you can either have someone watching the signal strength meter giving you updates or what I've done is either use the intercom feature of a couple cordless phones if you have that or use your land line to call you cell phone and leave one by the TV/AVR speaker and listen for the increase in signal. When you move it give it a coupe seconds to update the strength then continue until you find your sweat spot.


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## George Jetson (Mar 9, 2006)

What I did was took an old portable (10", I think) monitor and a long piece of coax connected to the RF output of the receiver. I took this up to the roof by the dish so I could watch the signal strength as I moved the dish. I was cautious at first - before I loosened any bolts I gently torqued the dish left/right/up/down to get an idea of which way I needed to go.
When I started aiming the new dish, I got a ballpark estimate from one of the dish angle calculators (sorry, don't have a link), and then methodically started scanning that general area. I would lock the dish at a particular elevation, then slowly rotate left/right (or east/west) around where the sat should be. If I couldn't find the signal, I would raise the elevation a degree or two and try it again. It took me close to an hour to find it the first time (being a newb), I think I skipped right over it a couple of times before I finally found it. Hope this helps.


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## ebaltz (Nov 23, 2004)

George Jetson said:


> What I did was took an old portable (10", I think) monitor and a long piece of coax connected to the RF output of the receiver. I took this up to the roof by the dish so I could watch the signal strength as I moved the dish. I was cautious at first - before I loosened any bolts I gently torqued the dish left/right/up/down to get an idea of which way I needed to go.
> When I started aiming the new dish, I got a ballpark estimate from one of the dish angle calculators (sorry, don't have a link), and then methodically started scanning that general area. I would lock the dish at a particular elevation, then slowly rotate left/right (or east/west) around where the sat should be. If I couldn't find the signal, I would raise the elevation a degree or two and try it again. It took me close to an hour to find it the first time (being a newb), I think I skipped right over it a couple of times before I finally found it. Hope this helps.


Yeah that sounds pretty subtle. I might give it a try. Of course it would be great if Dish would just fix the 129 problem.


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## George Jetson (Mar 9, 2006)

ebaltz said:


> Yeah that sounds pretty subtle. I might give it a try. Of course it would be great if Dish would just fix the 129 problem.


Agreed. Although it was a fun little project for someone who is so inclined.


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## MarkoC (Apr 5, 2004)

MarkoC said:


> I live in Minneapolis and I got a Dish 1000 installed on Monday. I am experiencing dropouts on some of the channels on the 129 as well. I have problems with StarzHD, HGHD, NTGHD, ESPN2HD and Rave. These occur somewhat frequently and it is quite annoying. I called Dish technical support and they are sending someone out Saturday to take a look. The woman on the phone said that it is possible I live in an area where I won't be able to recieve the 129. That doesn't make any sense to me, why would they put the Minneapolis locals on the 129 if people who live in Minneapolis can't recieve them?


Well it took two visits from the Dish technicians but I am now getting pretty good signal strength from the 129 and am not having problems with any of the HD channels.


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## beachside (Dec 8, 2004)

On the 8/14/06 Technical Chat the guys were answering a question from someone in the north-west (Washington state I beleive) and they said there was a problem in the west with signal strength. 

They also stated that Wednesday (today) they were set to increase the strength on certain transponders that were on 129 to ensure better reliability.

HTH


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

beachside said:


> On the 8/14/06 Technical Chat the guys were answering a question from someone in the north-west (Washington state I beleive) and they said there was a problem in the west with signal strength.
> 
> They also stated that Wednesday (today) they were set to increase the strength on certain transponders that were on 129 to ensure better reliability.
> 
> HTH


Yep they did mention that it is a problem, especially in the northwest, and Wednesday (Tomorrow) they are planning on putting some channels into 'boot mode', but in the Northwest they are still recommending a seperate Dish. You can read about this in the recap: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=62004


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## BigGeek (Aug 6, 2006)

Hello all. This is my first post on this site. I want to first say a big "Thank You" to everyone here for providing some terrific information. I spent quite a while here reading before I made my decision to upgrade to the ViP622.

Now to the point...

I'm located in Oklahoma. My ViP622 was installed last Friday (August 11) and since the day installed, have noticed dropped signal/pixelation on HD channels (129 at @40 signal w/yo-yo drop-off).

I hoped this would subside shortly after the first few days, but it continues still. I also have contacted E* regarding the problem a few times and have received the same lack of acknowledgement that anything is problematic with their satellite(s). They are currently shipping me a replacement receiver, but I suspect I'll be contacting them again once that one's installed and the problem still exists.

I certainly hope this issue is resolved soon, as it was a pretty big jump in my monthly service $$ and my wife will certainly not be happy if we cannot even view the HD service we are paying for.

That all being said, I absolutely LOVE the PQ when it's all working properly. I can put it on RAVE and watch/listen for hours, if there was no sig-loss.

I hope I don't have to consider one of the alternative dish ideas, but if that's what it takes to get a more stable signal, then I'll probably give it a try. I'll try to post back once I've been through a few rounds with E* techs and let everyone know how things are here.

Thanks again,
Chris


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

I've been having a problem with 129 since I subscribed in April. Still do. I am on the Oregon coast. You want to get their attention? Hit them in the pocket book. I did. I demanded a reduction in fees until the problem is resolved and I would not back down. They credited my account in June for the problem and told me in order to maximize the compensation, to space the claims out about 2 months apart. So at the end of August, I will call Dish and demand compensation again...and every two months until they resolve the problem.

They will compensate you only if you call and demand it!


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

Avedis said:


> I've been having a problem with 129 since I subscribed in April. Still do. I am on the Oregon coast. You want to get their attention? Hit them in the pocket book. I did. I demanded a reduction in fees until the problem is resolved and I would not back down. They credited my account in June for the problem and told me in order to maximize the compensation, to space the claims out about 2 months apart. So at the end of August, I will call Dish and demand compensation again...and every two months until they resolve the problem.
> 
> They will compensate you only if you call and demand it!


Ask them for the new larger dish they mentioned on the last tech forum.


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

tech forum or Charlie Chat? When was it broadcasted?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Tech Forum last Monday (August 14th).


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## JohnGfun (Jan 16, 2004)

I'm having drops in Vincennes, IN 47591.


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## elbyj (Jan 9, 2003)

We were experiencing a lot of drops on Sunday night (20 Aug) -- so bad we had to switch off of HD to SD.


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## cebbigh (Feb 27, 2005)

ebaltz said:


> Yeah I know the first part of that, but have never phsyically adjusted the dish itself. How subtle do the adjustments need to be?


It can be extremely sensitive. While tweaking my 500 dish pointed at 129 changes of less than 1/8 of an inch made a difference. I actually noticed change while tightening the bolts. Like Rob said, you really need to have someone watching the signal (and it helps if they pay close attention).


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

You are fortunate that you can do that. I'm on the Oregon coast and their solution of a separate dish does not work here. The local Dish installation technician tried a 4 foot diameter dish pointed at 129. He could get a signal strength of 98 while the satellite was aligned to this area. When it wobbled like it does every 40 minutes, the signal strength still went to zero.

The 129 satellite is fubar for fringe areas and until they put up a new bird or move another one, if you can't get it, complain and get a credit on your bill.


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

As an update to this thread, I have talked to Dish Network again (8/28) regarding crediting my account for their failure to provide uninterrupted HD service from the 129 satellite.

After talking to some woman with an Indian accent who couldn't help me, she transferred me to technical services. The technical services guy insisted that they could not give me another credit on my account. I asked him why not because the HD service was still being interrupted and he said simply "We can't". I told him it wasn't a matter of whether Dish could issue a credit, it was an issue of whether Dish WOULD issue a credit. 

After a rather heated debate with a technical services guy who got fed up with me and transferred me to the account termination people, I talked to a guy in that department that said they had some latitude about the issue of credits. He finally offered me a credit of $10 per month for four months. He said at the end of the four months if it was still a problem, to contact them again. He gave me an ID number to identify the issue so I could bypass the morons that answer the phones and not rehash this again.

The moral of the story is: Insist on a credit if you are having this problem with the 129 satellite and do not take no for an answer.


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## Robinwill (Sep 14, 2006)

Dish 1000 in North Bend, Oregon, HDF worthless owing to continual loss of lock on 129. Dish TS denies problem wirth 129. How do we get to them. Count me in.


Rob Glasser said:


> Just wanted to start a poll to see how many people with a Dish1000 or a Dish500/300 pointed at 129 are seeing signal drops for apparently no reason?
> 
> This may or may not result in you losing lock. A lot of people, myself included are seeing signal drops up to 30 points every 45 minutes or so.
> 
> ...


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## Robinwill (Sep 14, 2006)

I just found this site. My experience is identical. Dish tech support denies problem. Local installers say no solution. Big problem! I am in North Bend on the Oregon coast. 129 signal on my dish 1000 varies from 55 tops and drops to 0 regularly. Can you tell a neophyte what is Channel Master and how do I get it? I am at my wits end dealing with these idiots


Greg Mueller said:


> Started with a Dish 1000 and VIP211. HD was total unusable. My best signal was 70 with swings into the low 30s.
> 
> Obtained a Channel Master 1.2M and moved 129 LNB to it. Now the signal never leaves the 90s.
> 
> ...


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## Robinwill (Sep 14, 2006)

I am in North Bend, Oregon, Same problem. How can Dish offer HD programming in our area without the ability to deliver. There must be legal remedies to stop this deceitful practice which is ripping off consumers. Yes you can call Dish and ***** and they will put credits on your account because they obviously know about the problem although they vehemently deny it exists whille giving you the credit. They appear to have a defective system that cannot provide the service being sold. This would seem to be a real case for a class action law suit. Any interest?


Avedis said:


> You are fortunate that you can do that. I'm on the Oregon coast and their solution of a separate dish does not work here. The local Dish installation technician tried a 4 foot diameter dish pointed at 129. He could get a signal strength of 98 while the satellite was aligned to this area. When it wobbled like it does every 40 minutes, the signal strength still went to zero.
> 
> The 129 satellite is fubar for fringe areas and until they put up a new bird or move another one, if you can't get it, complain and get a credit on your bill.


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## Robinwill (Sep 14, 2006)

You need to be more assertive with Dish folks. They will give you big credits if you ***** and threaten them. They deny any problem but it is widespread. They are advertising a non-existent product. Consumers are entiltled to compensation and Dish knows it. Get on their case, they will cave. I did but I still do not have HD that I can watch without drop outs which makes it worthless.


Avedis said:


> I'm on the central Oregon coast and just added Dish to my new KDS-R60XBR1 so I could get HD programming.
> 
> My local Dish dealer cautioned me that some of the HD channels were dropping out every 30 minutes or so here but I went ahead and got it anyway.
> 
> ...


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

Huh?

I said I did get credits from Dish. They originally gave me about $50 in a lump sum credit. I call them 2 months later and complained again. I have it set up now where they give me a $12 credit every month. I told them I'd check back every 4 months and make sure they continue to issue the credit until the problem is solved. I had the rep put that in my file so the next person will not give me crap and just continue to issue the credit.

That's about all one can do in the fringe areas. They will ultimately have to reposition existing satellites, reallocate the HD channels to the 110 and 119 satellites or shoot up another bird that has a decent CONUS footprint. 

In the meantime....I deal with the dropouts.


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## leif (Apr 19, 2006)

I am just north of san fran and have been getting choppy audio on starz HD. I also get a frozen picture when trying to fast forward. Is this a low signal symptom? My sat 129 signal is mid- low 60's.


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

leif said:


> I am just north of san fran and have been getting choppy audio on starz HD. I also get a frozen picture when trying to fast forward. Is this a low signal symptom? My sat 129 signal is mid- low 60's.


If I had to guess, I'd say yes.


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

As an update to this thread and my experience regarding this problem, The local Dish Network dealer called me up and wanted to put a 24" dish next to my Dish 1000 and peak it on the 129 satellite. 

I said go ahead and since then, I have had no dropouts of 129 satellite channels. Dish has boosted some of the transponder signals on 129 (looks like tp 19, 30 and 31) and combined with the addition of the 24" dish focused on 129, it has solved my problem. At least during clear weather. We shall see how it works during the monsoon season on the Oregon coast.

No cost to me BTW....call your dealer and ask for an additional 24" dish for 129. It just might solve your dropout problem.


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## shodobe (Sep 16, 2006)

I haven't had any real problems since I had a tech come out a few weeks ago and re-point my dish. Before that I had nothing but trouble and that was from a diferent tech not tweaking correctly. I am in the Sierras east of Stockton and Sac.


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## gravity764 (Nov 13, 2006)

I live in northeast indiana and have problems with signal loss on 129.It has never been over 50 signal strength.I have dish 1000,It was installed 2 days ago.Ihave contacted dish network about this .They will be sending someone out this weekend to correct this(or so they say)As of this posting I can only get about half of the hd chanels that I am paying for.Iwill keep you posted.


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

For those of you still having problems with 129, but want to have a single dish install, I have, for the most part, alleviated my issues by installing a Dish1000+ instead of a Dish1000. 

This let me get a higher signal strength on all locations. On average my signal strength on 129 went up slightly more than 10 points. For 110 and 119 it was between 12 - 15 points. All in all I am really happy with the results as I did not want to go the route of 2 different dishes on the roof. I still get an occasional dropout in bad weather but it seems stable otherwise. No where near the frequency I was getting them with my Dish1000.

Anyways, wanted to throw this out there for those of you still having problems.

Average Signal Strength of 129 Transponder w/Dish1000: 65.3
Average Signal Strength of 129 Transponder w/Dish1000+: 75.8
Location: Seattle, WA Area


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

gravity764 said:


> I live in northeast indiana and have problems with signal loss on 129.It has never been over 50 signal strength.I have dish 1000,It was installed 2 days ago.Ihave contacted dish network about this .They will be sending someone out this weekend to correct this(or so they say)As of this posting I can only get about half of the hd chanels that I am paying for.Iwill keep you posted.


Hopefully your next installer will be better. My worst transponder on 129° is at 76 and I'm not that far away from you.


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## cornflakes (Sep 30, 2005)

James Long said:


> Hopefully your next installer will be better. My worst transponder on 129° is at 76 and I'm not that far away from you.


What is the minimum signal required for the receiver to maintain a lock?


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

Additional update regarding 129 reception solutions. After Dish installed a separate 24" dish for 129 a couple months ago, it has resolved most but not all of my 129 signal dropouts. Heavy rains on the Oregon coast will still cause momentary 129 dropouts but they are fairly infrequent.

The 24" dish has boosted my 129 signals significantly and while the signal still oscillates every 20-30 minutes, it rarely drops below 40-45 where signal lock is lost.

The problem has not been solved but for me at least it has been improved to a tolerable level. A 24" dish has about twice the surface area of the 1000 dish and peaked on 129 may solve your problem. Having two dishes on my roof doesn't present a asthetics problem as they can not be seen by anyone.

Dish needs additional satellites to cover the US properly for HD. This will take time. As I've said before in this thread, don't be afraid to insist on credits if Dish can not solve this problem for you. They will install the second dish on their nickel but it may not help everyone.


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## sharklover (Oct 1, 2006)

What channels other then pay per view is 129 used for?


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## Avedis (May 1, 2006)

Transponder 6 - Gallery, Rush, Ultra

Transponder 11 - Treasure, World Cinema, World Sports

Transponder 19(boosted) - ESPN2, Universal

Transponder 22 - Kung Fu, HD News, Game Play

Transponder 23 - Equator, Monsters, Family Room

Transponder 27 - Food NetworkHD

Transponder 30(boosted) - HGTV, NFLHD

Transponder 31(boosted) - Film Fest, Animania, Rave


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## Rob Glasser (Feb 22, 2005)

sharklover said:


> What channels other then pay per view is 129 used for?


Most new HD is going to show up on 129 and 61.5, so you'll need to have a Dish pointed at one of these locations to get all the HD programming. For those of us on the west coast 61.5 can be difficult if not impossible to get leaving us with 129, which currently appears to have technical problems causing the signal to drop dramatically every 30 - 45 minutes, for a few minutes, before recovering.

So, that being said, if you are on the fringe area of 129 coverage, like we are up here in the Northwest, signal strength is already marginal. Therefore when these dropouts happen we quickly lose our lock on the various transponders. To counteract this installers are now using a 24" Dish just for the 129 location and then leaving a separate dish for 110/119. This is boosting the signal enough to keep lock during these dropouts ... most of the time.

Another solution, if you want only one dish, is to buy a Dish1000+. This is what I did since my dish has to be visible from the front of my house and I didn't want multiple dishes on the roof. This brought my 129 signal very close to what those with separate dishes are getting. Not quite there but close.


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## gravity764 (Nov 13, 2006)

Dish installer was out today...moved dish to a higher location .I am now getting about 75 on 129.guess that's as good as it gets


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

My installation is a 2-dish one. I have a Dish500 for 110/119, and a Dish300 for 129 installed and re-peaked this afternoon in Raleigh, NC.

Here are my 129 numbers (I just went through them):

01 -> 85
02 -> 84
03 -> N/A
04 -> 93
05 -> 86
06 -> 79
07 -> 84
08 -> 89
09 -> 92
10 -> 92
11 -> 82
12 -> 93
13 -> 94
14 -> N/A
15 -> N/A
16 -> 85
17 -> 85
18 -> 79
19 -> 94
20 -> N/A
21 -> 82
22 -> 83
23 -> 84
24 -> N/A
25 -> N/A
26 -> N/A
27 -> 85
28 -> N/A
29 -> N/A
30 -> 94
31 -> 98
32 -> 82

My installer today was pretty meticulous so I figure these are good numbers for my area. I forget what I used to have on 61.5, but these don't seem much lower than what I remember so I was pleased. With the horror stories, I had feared the worst!

I am guessing the "N/A" transponders are ok, since I just got my 129 today I am not sure which ones are unused. Basically those were all skipped as I cycled through the list of available when writing down signal levels.

It's a pretty clear day, so we'll have to see how these hold up under storm activity... but thus far I think I'm in good shape.


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## DanoP (Sep 29, 2006)

Ha! Well I see I'm not alone. Watching HDNews tonite and my screen got pixelated and then froze.....turned it on the Gameplay channel and the same thing happened. I've been a customer for about six weeks and never experienced this problem. So I go to the dish pointing menu and notice my signal fluctuating in the 50s and 60s. I get on the horn to Dish tech support and nearly the same moment I get connected the signal jumps back up to the high 70s and low 80s. She said something about the receiver needing to reset its signal acquisition or somesuch and by going to the dish pointing menu it did that. Hmmmmmm....... I suppose I haven't seen the last of this. 

What is so frustrating about this is that it is intermittent so the chances are near 100% that if I call a tech over there will be no problem and of course they'll deny any issues with their birds/signal acquisition on 129. BTW, I've got the Dish 1000 and 622 receiver.


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## dave1234 (Oct 9, 2005)

DanoP said:


> Ha! Well I see I'm not alone. Watching HDNews tonite and my screen got pixelated and then froze.....turned it on the Gameplay channel and the same thing happened. I've been a customer for about six weeks and never experienced this problem. So I go to the dish pointing menu and notice my signal fluctuating in the 50s and 60s. I get on the horn to Dish tech support and nearly the same moment I get connected the signal jumps back up to the high 70s and low 80s. She said something about the receiver needing to reset its signal acquisition or somesuch and by going to the dish pointing menu it did that. Hmmmmmm....... I suppose I haven't seen the last of this.
> 
> What is so frustrating about this is that it is intermittent so the chances are near 100% that if I call a tech over there will be no problem and of course they'll deny any issues with their birds/signal acquisition on 129. BTW, I've got the Dish 1000 and 622 receiver.


My understanding is 129 is wobbling in orbit. That causes the fringe areas signal strength to vary widely.


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## SMosher (Jan 16, 2006)

Rob Glasser said:


> For those of you still having problems with 129, but want to have a single dish install, I have, for the most part, alleviated my issues by installing a Dish1000+ instead of a Dish1000.
> 
> This let me get a higher signal strength on all locations. On average my signal strength on 129 went up slightly more than 10 points. For 110 and 119 it was between 12 - 15 points. All in all I am really happy with the results as I did not want to go the route of 2 different dishes on the roof. I still get an occasional dropout in bad weather but it seems stable otherwise. No where near the frequency I was getting them with my Dish1000.
> 
> ...


This is enuff for me to dump the 1000 and get a 1000+.

I as well keep dropping off now and then.


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## SMosher (Jan 16, 2006)

Rob Glasser said:


> Most new HD is going to show up on 129 and 61.5, so you'll need to have a Dish pointed at one of these locations to get all the HD programming. For those of us on the west coast 61.5 can be difficult if not impossible to get leaving us with 129, which currently appears to have technical problems causing the signal to drop dramatically every 30 - 45 minutes, for a few minutes, before recovering.
> 
> So, that being said, if you are on the fringe area of 129 coverage, like we are up here in the Northwest, signal strength is already marginal. Therefore when these dropouts happen we quickly lose our lock on the various transponders. To counteract this installers are now using a 24" Dish just for the 129 location and then leaving a separate dish for 110/119. This is boosting the signal enough to keep lock during these dropouts ... most of the time.
> 
> Another solution, if you want only one dish, is to buy a Dish1000+. This is what I did since my dish has to be visible from the front of my house and I didn't want multiple dishes on the roof. This brought my 129 signal very close to what those with separate dishes are getting. Not quite there but close.


Why not pack up 148? I get 125 off that sat all day long. Current 61.5 for me is from 88 to 105. Thats damn good for Central Cali.


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## 7thton (Mar 16, 2005)

Rob Glasser said:


> Another solution, if you want only one dish, is to buy a Dish1000+. This is what I did since my dish has to be visible from the front of my house and I didn't want multiple dishes on the roof. This brought my 129 signal very close to what those with separate dishes are getting. Not quite there but close.


Just curious, is it because the 1000+ is larger?


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## cdub998 (Aug 16, 2006)

7thton said:


> Just curious, is it because the 1000+ is larger?


I think so. It helped me out a lot. I am getting over 100 on a lot of the transponders now.


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## SAinCA (May 22, 2007)

Signal drops in Yorba Linda, CA (Orange County) VERY frequent - at least 2/day while watching HD up to 8/day so far and getting worse. Signal was at 70% when installed 2 months ago, now hovering around 50% with mid-50 if we're lucky. DISH-guy not very helpful (at the home) - language barrier, too... Told him to access the page that shows dopped signal statistics - wasn't interested because he's getting 56% - BIG DEAL!!!

This is MAY 2007 - a year since the last post to this thread... And Dish hasn't responded in a satisfactory manner??? Is this what we, as consumers, are expected to put up with - and PAY FOR???

We have "the latest" tri-whatever dish and are at L405 software on the (not so) nifty HD DVR.

Any suggestions on how to coerce DISH into providing the service I've paid for???


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

SAinCa. I am in your area and I am not seeing issues with 129 like you are describing. As for signal drop count that increased with L4.01, I have not been able to correlate those counts with end user experience. 

like others I also get about 20 to 30 a day (assuming it resets), but I have not seen anything that has allowed me to correlate the numbers with actually viewing experience... For all we know, the algorithm to increment this count could have changed resulting in more occurances than previous version and really does not mean L4.X made things worse in this area. 

If you like... We could compare 129 numbers since we are close.


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## SAinCA (May 22, 2007)

Hi Ron,

Can you shed more light on the nubers to compare, please? Is there a transponder that serves LA's local HD channels besides 27? I'd be happy to give you numbers...

The outages we get result in a hard-boot (5-sec power-off on the DVR) on every occasion - we've yet to enjoy a short-outage (i.e., loss-regain without going through the entire "Acquiring..." five-step recovery...).

We're also enduring the DVR-doesn't-like-HDMI-connection problem - no ETA on a software fix for that either... Sadly the panel I have, although having what I consider to be a very good HD picture, only has one HDMI and one Composite input (DVD player gets that), so we stick with HDMI and reboot often for that, too...


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Well based on EKB, LA locals are on TP 10. You can get signal strengths by using your Point Dish Screen (Menu 6-1-1). How many times are you locking up a day? Is there anything particular you watch that cause the lock up? I can set up my two 622s and record it and see if I get the same behaivor. PM me with info if you want to run that test. 

What I was suggesting is go through your 129 transponder strengths and right them down. I can do the same for comparison.


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## eckertman (May 20, 2005)

I think that it might be switch problems. But that could have just been a localized problem with my dish 1000. I have a 322 reciever, if that is of any use.


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## SAinCA (May 22, 2007)

Ron Barry said:


> Well based on EKB, LA locals are on TP 10....


Will go through 129 transponders and PM you, Ron. Yesterday's count was at least three with one "caught in the act" - my son found that if the black-screen occurs on channel change (not via program guide), you can sometimes swiftly pull up the Guide, swap a channel, then do it again and the DVR catches itself mid-hiccup and gives signal. It may be that the signal lock momentarily drops below 50, giving a red-line on 6-1-1, but is short enough in duration that the DVR can pick up without going through the entire 5-step acquiring procedure... Who knows!

The Dish guy left having been through the 6-1-1 menu so many times my wife lost count. He did nothing besides take a look to see if the dish was bolted securely, then left, giving us a phone number to the local Dish Retailer, where option 4, for exisitng customers, tells you to hang up and call Dish's 800# - a complete waste of our time and a true display of incompetence!

I can only hope that todays UEFA Champions League Final recording on 9425 will take...


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