# Installers unprepared for MRV/DECA



## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

Installers just left. They were completely unprepared for MRV. They didn't have a SWM8, DECA dongle for internet, DECA filter, DECA power supply. The only thing that was even close to DECA ready was a couple HR-24's and a H-24, which are awesome by the way.

They spent a lot of time on the phone with supervisors and came to conclusion that their local shop doesn't have any of the parts they need.

The guys were extremely nice and I kept my cool but the installers and I got screwed by Directv because they weren't prepared. They're supposed to be finding a solution and calling back tomorrow. I'll try to work with these guys because it's not their fault Directv allowed me to schedule installation of service that obviously isn't ready from primetime. If it doesn't get fixed I'll raise hell but for now I'll try to exercise patience. Not a good way to start off for Directv. :nono:

So, unless you know someone else in your area has MRV already, you should wait or do it yourself. I could do now that dish and boxes are up and running if I had parts. If they do come to install make sure they everything single item needed to complete the work or you'll end with a non-MRV setup.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

What was supposed to be installed? Like how many DVRs and DECAs were you supposed to get?


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

They shouldn't install a SWM 8 on a MRV install unless you have an international or 18" dish for locals. They should either change the LNB or install a SWM 16 based on how many tuners you have.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

only comment:
Do you know it was DirecTV that was at fault or was it the installation company that said "they could" but didn't have their act together.
Could be the installer did his best & DirecTV did theirs, but "the boss" didn't have a clue.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

The installers weren't prepared so it's ultimately their fault (or their company) but it's irritating that Directv said I could have this done but the intall contractors aren't all ready. I got 2 HR-24's and one H-24. The way I understand MRV from all the drawings is that I need a SWM-8 after the dish but maybe I don't since I got a new dish that only have 1 wire coming off it and I;m getting all my channels (HD, SD, local) through that. I got 24's I need one DECA unit to connect the DECA cloud to the internet. Shouldn't there be some kind of DECA power supply and filters too? Obviously I'm no expert but the installers should be. I understand learning and having issues with the first time but they got little or no support/training from their superiors.


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## Hdhead (Jul 30, 2007)

Welcome to the club!! Nice uh. Wonder how much money Directv loses for all this incompetence.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

kyledr04 said:


> The installers weren't prepared so it's ultimately their fault (or their company) but it's irritating that Directv said I could have this done but the intall contractors aren't all ready. I got 2 HR-24's and one H-24. The way I understand MRV from all the drawings is that I need a SWM-8after the dish and since I got 24's I need one DECA unit to connect the DECA cloud to the internet.


You don't need a SWM 8 if they used a SWM LNB. Did you at least get SWM?


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## bkmkdtx1 (Aug 19, 2006)

is this in North Texas? i am scheduled for Mon. morning and was hoping the installers had a chance to do a couple of these this weekend before my appointment.


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

kyledr04 said:


> The installers weren't prepared so it's ultimately their fault (or their company) but it's irritating that Directv said I could have this done but the intall contractors aren't all ready. I got 2 HR-24's and one H-24. The way I understand MRV from all the drawings is that I need a SWM-8after the dish and since I got 24's I need one DECA unit to connect the DECA cloud to the internet.


The only way to "know" the real fault would be to look at the workorder. If the workorder specified SWM, DECA, etc then the fault lies with the installers. Conversely, if the workorder was not correct then it would be D*'s fault...

A SWM8 is not the only route for MRV, and the likely setup is a SWMLnb. Do you know for sure that a SWMLnb wasn't installed? How many coax lines go to your receivers? If a SWM was installed (which it should have been) and since you have HX24's, MRV should work for you right now. The only addition necessary would be a DECA dongle/PI for internet access. Filters are not necessary with HX24's or for the SWMLnb if it has a green sticker.


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## texasmoose (May 25, 2007)

My installer was a sub of a sub. Directv>Mastec>li'l sub. This guy had never done an install. He came by yesterday an hour and a 1/2 late and didn't complete the order until today, but he didn't even check to see if it was working or not. Now I'm trying, with the help of some kind dbs folks to get this thing going. I'm trying to 'Wow' the wife, so far all I'm getting is 'wifey aggro' !


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kyledr04 said:


> The installers weren't prepared so it's ultimately their fault (or their company) but it's irritating that Directv said I could have this done but the intall contractors aren't all ready. I got 2 HR-24's and one H-24. The way I understand MRV from all the drawings is that I need a SWM-8 after the dish but maybe I don't since I got a new dish that only have 1 wire coming off it and I;m getting all my channels (HD, SD, local) through that. I got 24's I need one DECA unit to connect the DECA cloud to the internet. Shouldn't there be some kind of DECA power supply and filters too? Obviously I'm no expert but the installers should be. I understand learning and having issues with the first time but they got little or no support/training from their superiors.


What equipment do you have in your home? It almost sounds like they got you setup. Not to come off as a jerk but I can see people on this board using limited understanding of what they read on here to complicate the installation. Add the fact that the installers are also going through the learning process this can create a bad situation.

With the H24 and HR 24's installed they can do MRV between each other. The problem is if you have other equipment and they didn't install BS filters or DECA's they will now be susceptible to issues.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

I'm in College Station and these guys were Masstec subs. I fully acknowledge that I only have a limited understanding but they had even less. They said they'd never done MRV, the had a 2 hour MRV class, and thought when they came they didn't have all they need. Again the guys were nice and easy to work with and I was more than understanding. Just coming here to vent and get some help.

I think I got a SWBlnb. The dish is oval shaped and has 1 wire coming down to a 4-way splitter. They the lines split out to the TVs. In the living room he added a SWM power supply.

The boxes can see each other and have a shared list but won't play the recording on a different box. And the internet isn't connected. I didn't know it could work without a SWM8 because every drawing I've seen has one but I'm guessing you only need the SWM8 if you have a dish with multiple wires. But all those drawing also have a deca power supply and a bandstop filter. I don't have the power supply or filter. The absence of one or both of those is causing the recording to play in different rooms.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kyledr04 said:


> I'm in College Station and I know I only have a limited understanding but they had even less. They said they'd never done MRV, the had a 2hour MRV class, and thought when they came they didn't have all they need. Again the guys were nice and was more than understanding. Just coming here to vent and get some help.
> 
> I think I got a SWBlnb. The dish is oval shaped and has 1 wire coming down to a 4-way splitter. They the lines split out to the TVs. In the living room he added a SWM power supply.
> 
> The boxes can see each other and have a shared list but won't play the recording on a different box. And the internet isn't connected. I didn't know it could work without a SWM8 because every drawing I've seen has one but all those drawing also have a deca power supply and a bandstop filter. I don't have the power supply or filter. The absence of one or both of those is causing the recording to play in different rooms.


Please list the receivers you have in your home right now. It's possible we can get this working for you shortly.

They didn't close the work order so MRV programming was not added to your account automatically. Let's get the equipment sorted out quick and we can go from there.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

I didn't see the work order but it was a new install with whole home DVR. I don't know if that's all it said and the installers were supposed to know what it would take to setup the system or if Directv should have told them piece by piece what to bring. And, I was never asked by Directv about connecting DECA to the internet I thought that was part of the plan.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

2 Hr24s
1 H24


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

kyledr04 said:


> But all those drawing also have a deca power supply and a bandstop filter. I don't have the power supply or filter. The absence of one or both of those is causing the recording to play in different rooms.


The bandstop filters are not necessary if you only have HX24 receivers. The 2nd P/S you're speaking of is for the DECA dongle (to router) for internet and also doesn't affect MRV. Neither of these is a factor in your situation. As Shades mentioned what receivers do you have? We should be able to help you from here on out.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kyledr04 said:


> I didn't see the work order but it was a new install with whole home DVR. I don't know if that's all it said and the installers were supposed to know what it would take to setup the system or if Directv should have told them piece by piece what to bring. And, I was never asked by Directv about connecting DECA to the internet I thought that was part of the plan.


Ok so you're set for MRV. You do not need anything else. They installed the SWM and all the receivers you have include the internal DECA's. So all they need right now is the broad band deca (which at this time is a normal DECA with a PI). If you have their number you can call them and tell them that if they can bring a normal DECA and a PI they can install that and close their job out. As far as the MRV part go online and login to your account. Select MRV programming. Right now there is no reason that you should not be able to play something from a list as your equipment is correct. The only thing you cannot do is use On Demand or widgets until they install the broad band deca.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

I know everyone is anxious to get MRV/DECA installed, but the fact is that on rollouts like this, equipment is often delivered late and/or in much smaller quantities than needed, making it impossible to get everyone trained and familiarized with the new equipment (that the vast majority of installers are JUST hearing about for the first time).

Folks here have heard about DECA and MRV for a year, but the average installer is JUST finding out this stuff even exists, and many have never even seen the gear yet. Just because DirecTV sets a roll-out date doesn't mean that everyone's had the stuff for a month to play around with.

Like every other rollout, if you wait a couple of weeks, things will smooth out.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

kyledr04 said:


> 2 Hr24s
> 1 H24


Is that what you're asking. I have 2 HR24's and 1 H24. I can watch TV on all 3.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Going to a viewing now but with the help of the people on here I bet you will be watching something on MRV within the hour.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

Shades228 said:


> Going to a viewing now but with the help of the people on here I bet you will be watching something on MRV within the hour.


Thanks for the info.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Sounds like he just needs MRV enabled to use it. 

Then, to use DOD he'll need 1 more coax ran from the splitter to a DECA adapter with a PI and ethernet from his router to the DECA and he'll be set.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

So, I have an HR24 in the living room and in the bedroom plus a H24 in the office. The guys did know how to access MRV in the setup but I don't know if it's "activated". I think I remember a message saying I had it. I recorded a ESPN poker show on the living room box. Both other boxes can see this recording and note that it's recording on the living room box but when you try to play that recording it has the following message: "Playback failed. No audio/viedo data packets recieved from server."


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## WestDC (Feb 9, 2008)

kyledr04 said:


> 2 Hr24s
> 1 H24


The HX24's Have the Deca module built in- If your Swim LNB and Swim spliter have a Green lable then that's all you need for MRV, Connecting to the internet they should have installed a Deca Module /with a power supply and the cat 5 cable would connect to your ROUTER-Which you would need to connect and configure-NOT the installlers, They Should have provided the DECA unit, But Like my Shop the Whearhouse is CLOSED on Sunday's So you have to call around to other tech's or sup's to find equipment.

ThE installers Did not get your service order untill this AM and if they didn't have a part-then they should re-roll on monday.

Go to Setup,Mulitiroom and "opt in" then reboot your receivers and try again, you can only stream one show to another unit at a time.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

sigma1914 said:


> Sounds like he just needs MRV enabled to use it.
> 
> Then, to use DOD he'll need 1 more coax ran from the splitter to a DECA adapter with a PI and ethernet from his router to the DECA and he'll be set.


Can they just split the line at the end of one the lines with a two-way splitter then run one to the reciever and put the deca adapter and power supply to connect the internet or does it have to be a separate line coming from the 4 way splitter?


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

WestDC said:


> The HX24's Have the Deca module built in- If your Swim LNB and Swim spliter have a Green lable then that's all you need for MRV QUOTE]
> 
> I think this is what I have. The splitter label is green and the input says swm in.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

kyledr04 said:


> I'm in College Station and these guys were Masstec subs. I fully acknowledge that I only have a limited understanding but they had even less. They said they'd never done MRV, the had a 2 hour MRV class, and thought when they came they didn't have all they need. Again the guys were nice and easy to work with and I was more than understanding. Just coming here to vent and get some help.


At least your Mastec folks took a 2 hour class

The install tech supervisor that I talked to said they hadn't had the class yet.


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## Hdhead (Jul 30, 2007)

kyledr04 said:


> Can they just split the line at the end of one the lines with a two-way splitter then run one to the reciever and put the deca adapter and power supply to connect the internet or does it have to be a separate line coming from the 4 way splitter?


That should work fine.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

Shades228 said:


> . As far as the MRV part go online and login to your account. Select MRV programming. .


My account on Directv.com says Whole-home DVR service currently activated.


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## amorse2183 (May 25, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> What equipment do you have in your home? It almost sounds like they got you setup. Not to come off as a jerk but I can see people on this board using limited understanding of what they read on here to complicate the installation. Add the fact that the installers are also going through the learning process this can create a bad situation.
> 
> With the H24 and HR 24's installed they can do MRV between each other. The problem is if you have other equipment and they didn't install BS filters or DECA's they will now be susceptible to issues.


but isn't the whole point of this that he shouldn't have to deal with that? Now, the OP's situation seems to be fixed quite quickly once the installer comes back with the proper equipment. That's all well and good. In the end it really doesn't matter who is at fault. The only important fact is that the OP doesn't have what he paid for. MRV is still new, and there will likely be hiccups for some time to come. I don't think anyone would dispute that. Even I can understand that we as customers must be patient, and this is coming from a person that feels even 1 second of service that is not 100% perfect is unacceptable.

It's just unfortunate we have to be patient at all. I'd rather not have to pay until it's all hooked up 100% properly and working 100% properly, but we live in the real world and that isn't going to happen. But I certainly don't have to like it.


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## kyledr04 (May 15, 2010)

I works now. I double checked that MRV was selected on my account and all 3 of my recievers then I rebooted all 3 boxes and the swm power supply. 

I still could not play the original ESPN poker show we were trying to view. But I recorded part the Boston/Orlando game and can watch it on all the boxes. Must have been something corrupt with that first recording. 

So MRV works now. I'm not sure the installers knew it was supposed to work but they did it right (except the DECA adapter for internet) we just had trouble.

Thanks for all the help. You guys are great.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

IMHO, this is all DirecTV's fault. If I'm a customer, I don't care if a job is subcontracted out - it's still the contractor's (D*) responsibility to make sure their subs are doing the job correctly.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Glad you got it working.


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## CuriousG (Nov 23, 2006)

Ultimately, it is a poor communication between DirecTV and the companies in the field. My DECA install was yesterday and the techs showed up with the DECA parts, but no information on the workorder indicating I needed a SWM installation to make the DECA work. They had most of the SWM parts on the truck, but had used their last power inserter earlier that morning. Had to get another truck from more than ten miles away who was also on a schedule to bring them a power inserter.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

All of this hasn't been "right", but this is only four days old and everyone is on a steep learning curve.
This doesn't make it "right", but somewhat understandable, and what is more important [to me] would be how well each installer is trying to accommodate the customer.
As they say "crap" happens, it's how well everyone deals with it that counts.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

Very true, my friend- very true.

It's just that sometimes I wonder if D* knows how much it costs us customers to be home for the install - either zero wages or a valuable vacation day. If the install is successful, no sweat, but to require me to lose another day's wages or blow another vacation day is just not cool.


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

Glad to hear you got it working and the techs used the correct equipment (with the exception of the broadband DECA.)


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> Very true, my friend- very true.
> 
> It's just that sometimes I wonder if D* knows how much it costs us customers to be home for the install - either zero wages or a valuable vacation day. If the install is successful, no sweat, but to require me to lose another day's wages or blow another vacation day is just not cool.


I completely understand. 
"Next time" don't be the first one, [please move to the back of the bus. :lol: ]


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> Very true, my friend- very true.
> 
> It's just that sometimes I wonder if D* knows how much it costs us customers to be home for the install - either zero wages or a valuable vacation day. If the install is successful, no sweat, but to require me to lose another day's wages or blow another vacation day is just not cool.


Not to be crass but if you choose to prioritize an installation over work then they can't control that. I get that you still have to set aside time, I have 4 hours set aside tomorrow, so it's still an inconvenience if it doesn't go well or go at all. So I get the premise of wasting time but I don't think they should care about lost wages. I've taken time off of work when I order expensive items that are being shipped to me and I don't want to miss the shipment. I can't get pissed at the company for me losing money/vacation if the delivery was not there when it said it was because I chose to miss work. I can get upset that they didn't do what they said they were going to though.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> All of this hasn't been "right", but this is only four days old and everyone is on a steep learning curve.
> This doesn't make it "right", but somewhat understandable, and what is more important [to me] would be how well each installer is trying to accommodate the customer.
> As they say "crap" happens, it's how well everyone deals with it that counts.


No, this is only four days old in the national rollout. It's been in pilot for over a couple months in four metropolitan areas. That's what pilots are for, to find out all the issues/bugs that will happen when you start a deployment. These issues should not be happening now, IMHO.


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## Hdhead (Jul 30, 2007)

RAD said:


> No, this is only four days old in the national rollout. It's been in pilot for over a couple months in four metropolitan areas. That's what pilots are for, to find out all the issues/bugs that will happen when you start a deployment. These issues should not be happening now, IMHO.


I absolutely agree. A botched rollout. Time to end the excuse making. They dropped the ball big time.:nono2:


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

RAD said:


> No, this is only four days old in the national rollout. It's been in pilot for over a couple months in four metropolitan areas. That's what pilots are for, to find out all the issues/bugs that will happen when you start a deployment. These issues should not be happening now, IMHO.


I'm not going to disagree "but" isn't your issue this weekend that YOUR installer didn't have the correct stock?
This still falls in their laps and no matter how long or many test markets there were, if your guy didn't order the parts, then who's fault is it?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Hdhead said:


> I absolutely agree. A botched rollout. *Time to end the excuse making.* They dropped the ball big time.:nono2:


I'm not trying to make any excuses.
What I'm trying to do is point to who's to blame.
The install companies had the parts lists to order from some time back.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> I'm not going to disagree "but" isn't your issue this weekend that YOUR installer didn't have the correct stock?
> This still falls in their laps and no matter how long or many test markets there were, if your guy didn't order the parts, then who's fault is it?


That was only one of the problems. The install companies supervisor said that they hadn't been trained on "Connected Home", they didn't have any SWiM16's (never saw one), then wanted to put two SWiM8's in to handle 12 tuners. Looking at other posts it looks like training didn't go well (installers didn't know what they were doing) like not knowing how to connect HR20-100's or handle the broadband/internet connection. There's also a bunch of posts about arriving at customers homes without the necessary hardware to perform the install. I also saw a post that DirecTV technical support telling someone that DirecTV won't install a SWiM16 at a customer location.

Sorry, but as I said, IMHO, there are too many of these type of issues being reported. Before DirecTV decided to do a national rollout they should of at least made sure that their installation companies/contractors had a supply of parts to allows for installations. When a contractor that covers a metro area the size of Austin says they don't have any SWiM16's and have never even seen one that's a problem that should have never occured.


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## Hdhead (Jul 30, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> I'm not going to disagree "but" isn't your issue this weekend that YOUR installer didn't have the correct stock?
> This still falls in their laps and no matter how long or many test markets there were, if your guy didn't order the parts, then who's fault is it?


It is an entire systemic failure of Directv and their contracted installation partners to meet their customers expectations. From the CSR's who are clueless, to the order system that is missing key components, to the installer's supervisors who are not knowledgeable of how it works, to the installers who try there hardest but ultimately did not receive adequate if any training. Just feel like venting some tonight.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> I'm not trying to make any excuses.
> What I'm trying to do is point to who's to blame.
> The install companies had the parts lists to order from some time back.


And from some posts I've seen it looks like the companies tried to order parts by DirecTV wasn't putting them in the supply chain in large enough quanties so they have them in the field.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Hdhead said:


> It is an entire systemic failure of Directv and their contracted installation partners to meet their customers expectations. From the CSR's who are clueless, to the order system that is missing key components, to the installer's supervisors who are not knowledgeable of how it works, to the installers who try there hardest but ultimately did not receive adequate if any training. Just feel like venting some tonight.





RAD said:


> And from some posts I've seen it looks like the companies tried to order parts by DirecTV wasn't putting them in the supply chain in large enough quanties so they have them in the field.


Both of you are right, there really isn't anything to question.
RAD you know the memos as well as I do about this.
Stock is in short supply.
Marketing should have waited another month or two and kept the Beta going till then.
Anybody calling DirecTV on Sunday most likely isn't getting the first string CSRs [IMO].
I haven't counted up which have good installs and those that don't, so guessing at the ratio is pointless.
Those that got it working, even though the installer was doing this for the first time, are happier than those that haven't gotten what they wanted [DUH, even I can see this :lol:].
The $300 SWiM-16 seems to be everyone's biggest ***** and what a deal to get 300-400 dollars worth of hardware for $99.
Bet nobody knew how many of us on the forum have been lying in wait for these puppies.
Demand has FAR exceeded supply.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> Both of you are right, there really isn't anything to question.
> RAD you know the memos as well as I do about this.
> Stock is in short supply.
> *Marketing should have waited another month or two and kept the Beta going till then.*
> ...


BINGO (for what I *bolded*)! Except for someone at DirecTV licking their chops at bringing in a bunch of new revenue there was no reason to rush this out if the supply chain wasn't stocked to handle the installations.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

RAD said:


> BINGO (for what I *bolded*)! Except for someone at DirecTV licking their chops at bringing in a bunch of new revenue there was no reason to rush this out if the supply chain wasn't stocked to handle the installations.


And we both know his name.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

Aah - Marketing....


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> And we both know his name.


His name is Mud in my book.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

RAD said:


> His name is Mud in my book.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

While I agree there are certainly some issues with the MRV roll out I think for the average customer it will be ok.

So far the major issues have been unsupported flags for people without DECA, and people who need SWM 16's. Both of these situations are in the minority. Unfortunately I'm in one of these camps as well and I'm predicting the tech to show up tomorrow without a SWM 16. However I would say that more people will be happy with their MRV situation than unhappy.


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## dwcolvin (Oct 4, 2007)

Think about it, guys... D* hasn't started advertising 'Whole Home DVR' yet, hasn't even sent an email to customers talking about it. Their only public statement is on the website, and that's pretty low key. The only reason there was a feeding frenzy starting the 13th was that people _here_ knew about it and created demands far above what D* could reasonably expect.

Yes, the CSRs and Techs need better training and documentation, and the supply chain isn't what it should be. But as others have said, it's only four days in. And MRV works, _well_ (even for those of us with our own networks), and at a fair price.
:goodjob:


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

dwcolvin,
They are most certainly advertising it - It was the biggest item on the D* homepage 30 seconds ago.


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## dwcolvin (Oct 4, 2007)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> dwcolvin,
> They are most certainly advertising it - It was the biggest item on the D* homepage 30 seconds ago.


But (without arguing over the size of the ad on the website), you have to _go_ to the DirecTV website to see it. It's not in TV ads and hasn't been communicated to current subscribers (even the MRV Beta ones, AFAIK).


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## CuriousG (Nov 23, 2006)

dwcolvin said:


> And MRV works, _well_ (even for those of us with our own networks), and at a fair price.
> :goodjob:


That last part is subjective. You could say "and at a *low* price". Personally, I don't consider charging an already paying customer additional money for a no-cost item "fair".


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## dwcolvin (Oct 4, 2007)

CuriousG said:


> That last part is subjective. You could say "and at a *low* price". Personally, I don't consider charging an already paying customer additional money for a no-cost item "fair".


*No cost?* 

There is considerable cost to designing, developing, testing, supporting and enhancing the firmware that enabled MRV. Yes, it's 'only' software. *So?* Then there's the engineering cost of developing DECA, which allows MRV for non-rocket scientist customers (and installers). And then there's the costs of documentation, training and support.

$3/month is _dirt cheap,_ IMHO (just don't tell D* )


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## dhkinil (Dec 17, 2006)

CuriousG said:


> That last part is subjective. You could say "and at a *low* price". Personally, I don't consider charging an already paying customer additional money for a no-cost item "fair".


well, I have two dvr's in one room and two other tvs connected to non dvr's. I can drop a non dvr and save $2 per month. Also from what I read I can also probably get a HR24 to replace one of my non dvr's and the whole thing done for ±$150. I won't be able to make one machine record from another, but if I manage my series links correctly that is a non issue and on the odd chance it isn't I can program from my computer in about two minutes or walk upstairs. No biggie. Seems pretty cheap to me.

Also, from reading everything, I figure, no need to do this for about four or five weeks.


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## dwcolvin (Oct 4, 2007)

dhkinil said:


> well, I have two dvr's in one room and two other tvs connected to non dvr's. I can drop a non dvr and save $2 per month. Also from what I read I can also probably get a HR24 to replace one of my non dvr's and the whole thing done for ±$150. I won't be able to make one machine record from another, but if I manage my series links correctly that is a non issue and on the odd chance it isn't I can program from my computer in about two minutes or walk upstairs. No biggie. Seems pretty cheap to me.
> 
> Also, from reading everything, I figure, no need to do this for about four or five weeks.


You can schedule a recording on any HD DVR from any HD receiver. Many of us are _hoping_ this function will be added to the DVRs as well after the MRV smoke clears (are you listening, D*? )

Somehow, I think the number of multi-DVR households comes as a surprise to D* (which makes no sense, since they know every box at every account).  Otherwise, they would have understood the demand for SWiM-16s.


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## Billzebub (Jan 2, 2007)

Installer just left and DECA working great. H24 added to replace R15 at no charge. I've ordered an HR24 from Solid Signal and I'll use it to replace the H24 when it arrives. Installer initially didn’t believe that the regular DECA unit could be used to connect to my network, but after a phone call to DIRECTV he was convinced. Thanks to this site my system is up and running and the installer now knows how to connect to the network for his next customer.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

dwcolvin said:


> *No cost?*
> 
> There is considerable cost to designing, developing, testing, supporting and enhancing the firmware that enabled MRV. Yes, it's 'only' software. *So?* Then there's the engineering cost of developing DECA, which allows MRV for non-rocket scientist customers (and installers). And then there's the costs of documentation, training and support.
> 
> $3/month is _dirt cheap,_ IMHO (just don't tell D* )


While that is true, I tend to believe that is the kind of stuff the $7/month DVR fees should have been used to pay for. This is just an extension of the DVR function, which otherwise hasn't changed in years, so what is that $7/month paying for?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

This ship has sailed.
the cost is going to stay.
I don't like it either, but the "net gains" are staggering for DirecTV and they've already "done the math" to justify they can charge for it.
18 million customers
60% have HD service.
$3/month from how many before they're adding 1 million a month to their bottom line?


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## njblackberry (Dec 29, 2007)

I think the cost is dirt cheap....
$3 is about right...


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## dhkinil (Dec 17, 2006)

dwcolvin said:


> You can schedule a recording on any HD DVR from any HD receiver. Many of us are _hoping_ this function will be added to the DVRs as well after the MRV smoke clears (are you listening, D*? )
> 
> Somehow, I think the number of multi-DVR households comes as a surprise to D* (which makes no sense, since they know every box at every account).  Otherwise, they would have understood the demand for SWiM-16s.


no, when they get done will have three dvr's and nothing else.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

DirecTV has always understocked high-dollar, relatively low-demand items.

Since the beginning, SWM8 switches and SWM expanders have been in very short supply and never enough to meet the demand. SWM16s will actually be in greater demand, since there are no work-arounds for 9-16 tuners and DECA, but given their price, they'll be even harder to get ahold of.

And given their cost, HSPs wait until the last minute to order them, only to have them on allocation (i.e., you only get a fraction of what you ordered), and so you'll be a week or two into the rollout and still have techs that have never seen the item in person, much less know how to install it or troubleshoot it.

Training is expensive, and big companies hate to pay for it, because they either eat the cost or have to pass it on to their customers. Training also means taking techs out of the field, which is always hard to do.

But it's the old Catch-22. Customers "in the know" demand the product NOW, even if it's not ready, and the Marketing department is right there with them. Yet engineering, training, and admin wants more time to test and prepare. Somebody has to make a decision, and no matter which decision is made, someone isn't going to be happy.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

BattleZone said:


> But it's the old Catch-22. Customers "in the know" demand the product NOW, even if it's not ready, and the Marketing department is right there with them.


In this specific case, I would be most happy to wait awhile. Unfortunately, DirecTV has placed an arbitrary deadline of May 20th on me. I don't have a choice (and I don't want to lose MRV capability that I currently have).

What's really crappy in my case is that (1) I have Total Choice +HDDVR, so I can't even get it setup without having to change to the unbundled package for an extra $1 a month and (b) I already have DECA on all of my DVRs (but lack it on my H21). I have 9 tuners (with the H21 being on a WB68 and the others on SWM). So to get MRV activated I need an SWM16, my programming package changed (at a recurring monthly cost to me), an installation, and all this has to happen in just a couple of days. Yeah, right.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

those unhappy with $3 per *account* (and I am one) should feel lucky it did not go the original price route of per receiver.


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## Hdhead (Jul 30, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> those unhappy with $3 per *account* (and I am one) should feel lucky it did not go the *original price route *of per receiver.


Is that what they first announced then changed it? If it were per receiver they would have virtually zero takers.


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## CuriousG (Nov 23, 2006)

carl6 said:


> What's really crappy in my case is that (1) I have Total Choice +HDDVR, so I can't even get it setup without having to change to the unbundled package for an extra $1 a month....


FYI, I was able to keep my legacy package when I activated MRV this past weekend. The CSR did have to switch me over to the newer package in order to get the MRV authorized on the account, but then had a supervisor switch it back to the legacy package.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> those unhappy with $3 per *account* (and I am one) should feel lucky it did not go the original price route of per receiver.


Actually this is what I was quoted yesterday when I activated the service after the tech installed the equipment. The CSR told me it was per receiver.


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## tsbrady1 (Jan 6, 2006)

reading your previous post are you saying that the installer connected one of your DVRs to your home network? The reason I ask is that a Tech at D* told me yesterday when I was trying to order MRV that they would not connect to my home net but that it was a requirement that at least one of the DVRs must be connected.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

tsbrady1 said:


> reading your previous post are you saying that the installer connected one of your DVRs to your home network? The reason I ask is that a Tech at D* told me yesterday when I was trying to order MRV that they would not connect to my home net but that it was a requirement that at least one of the DVRs must be connected.


this is a bit 

What needs/should happen:
Each receiver gets connected to the DECA network and they install one more DECA to bridge to your home network.


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## tsbrady1 (Jan 6, 2006)

Veryoldschool, Thanks for the reply, this is what I was thinking but yet he told me that was my responsibility and they could not process the order unless I was connected to my home network, he also could not tell me whether that connection should be deca or cat 5, I guess I will do the keep calling until I get somebody who knows routine, I also sent an e-mail to solid signal to see if they can help but have nt heard back from them yet.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

tsbrady1 said:


> Veryoldschool, Thanks for the reply, this is what I was thinking but yet he told me that was my responsibility and they could not process the order unless I was connected to my home network, he also could not tell me whether that connection should be deca or cat 5, I guess I will do the keep calling until I get somebody who knows routine, I also sent an e-mail to solid signal to see if they can help but have nt heard back from them yet.


"The deal is" the installer isn't going to "mess with" your network.
The installer should/must setup a DECA at/near the router and find an open port on your router.
He should ask you to check your internet access [go to google :lol:].
He should next plug in the cable to the router and ask you to check your internet again.
If it works, he's done.
If it doesn't work, he unplugs your DECA to router cable, and then tells you to fix it. He's now done.
See how this_ might_ sound like what you were told?


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## tsbrady1 (Jan 6, 2006)

Yeryoldschool, your paitence is most appreciated but I still don't understand, my home net router is on the next floor up from my DVR, I do not have any cable of any sort run to it from the DVRs:

A) should the D* installer run this on his MRV install

B) if not and I have to run should it be a cat 5 or coax cable

D* told me that it was my responsibility to have some sort of cable from at least 1 DVR to the router yet he could not tell me what tuype of cable it should be. I understand that they won't fool with network set up but will the run a cable?

sorry for being stupid but I am Technically challenged!


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

tsbrady1 said:


> Yeryoldschool, your paitence is most appreciated but I still don't understand, my home net router is on the next floor up from my DVR, I do not have any cable of any sort run to it from the DVRs:
> 
> A) should the D* installer run this on his MRV install
> 
> ...


"Stupid" no
"Uninformed" maybe, but "smart enough" to be here and ask.

The installer "should run" a coax to where your router is, connect the DECA with a PI, then plug in the CAT5 jumper to your router. If this crashes your home network, he'll unplug it and tell you to fix it and then plug it back in.


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## dwcolvin (Oct 4, 2007)

tsbrady1 said:


> Yeryoldschool, your paitence is most appreciated but I still don't understand, my home net router is on the next floor up from my DVR, I do not have any cable of any sort run to it from the DVRs:
> 
> A) should the D* installer run this on his MRV install
> 
> ...


This is where the process is _really_ failing. It's not supposed to be traumatic for non-rocket scientists. 

My understanding (from reading materials on the Installer Forum) is that Techs are _required_ to install a SWM-connected coax to wherever your Router is located, install the DECA and power supply, and hand you the Ethernet cable to plug in.

You need to have a spare port on your Router or have installed an Ethernet Switch with a spare port, an available electrical outlet, and would have to provide your own Ethernet cable if you want one longer than the short one provided with the DECA.


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## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

dwcolvin said:


> This is where the process is _really_ failing. It's not supposed to be traumatic for non-rocket scientists.
> 
> My understanding (from reading materials on the Installer Forum) is that Techs are _required_ to install a SWM-connected coax to wherever your Router is located, install the DECA and power supply, and hand you the Ethernet cable to plug in.
> 
> You need to have a spare port on your Router or have installed an Ethernet Switch with a spare port, an available electrical outlet, and would have to provide your own Ethernet cable if you want one longer than the short one provided with the DECA.


IF it's on the work order. If not, then no.


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## dwcolvin (Oct 4, 2007)

RobertE said:


> IF it's on the work order. If not, then no.


*And whose responsibility is it to get the Work Order correct?*  It's not like customers fill it out, or even see it. The default for 'Whole Home DVR' should clearly be _assume a home network._

On the Installer Forum, Techs understood the new cable run requirement well enough to ask if they were going to get paid for it.


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## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

dwcolvin said:


> *And who's responsibility is it to get the Work Order correct?*  It's not like customers fill it out, or even see it. The default for 'Whole Home DVR' should clearly be _assume a home network._
> 
> On the Installer Forum, Techs understood the new cable run requirement well enough to ask if they were going to get paid for it.


The CSR is supposed to ask the customer if they have broadband internet and want it connected. I have a feeling that many are not doing so, nor are customers asking for it. Add in that some techs think they can plug in the existing ethernet cable to the 2nd port on some dvrs and are good to go. Stir and let simmer, recipe for a mess.


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## tsbrady1 (Jan 6, 2006)

Thanks Veryoldschool, that is exactly what I was trying to clear up in my mind, you have been a big help and I appreciate it greatly!


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## jokertrm (Feb 25, 2009)

My original post on this topic

I think the most frustrating part of this is the lack of knowledge starting with the installer and continuing through 3 tiers of Customer Support. I didn't get a straight answer on how the system is supposed to function until I spoke to my 2nd supervisor.

I know it's early, but wow DTV has some glaring training issues.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

jokertrm said:


> My original post on this topic
> 
> I think the most frustrating part of this is the lack of knowledge starting with the installer and continuing through 3 tiers of Customer Support. I didn't get a straight answer on how the system is supposed to function until I spoke to my 2nd supervisor.
> 
> I know it's early, but wow DTV has some glaring training issues.


So .. If folks here make this assumption going in, you can help mitigate problems. Better to say "no, you don't have the right gear" than to let them get halfway through the install and then realize that you either have to go back to how it was set up or you're stuck in an interim solution.

Again, I'd suggestion patience, persistence and politeness. I know many folks here are simply taking patience to the extreme and waiting a month or two to even think about ordering DECA.

Hopefully things will get worked out soon and yeah, it's clear that some of these folks are learning on the job (regardless of any training). In extreme cases, folks that have never been trained are tackling the projects, and I can with certainty that this should not happen .. But, the fact remains that it is happening.


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## jokertrm (Feb 25, 2009)

Doug Brott said:


> So .. If folks here make this assumption going in, you can help mitigate problems. Better to say "no, you don't have the right gear" than to let them get halfway through the install and then realize that you either have to go back to how it was set up or you're stuck in an interim solution.
> 
> Again, I'd suggestion patience, persistence and politeness. I know many folks here are simply taking patience to the extreme and waiting a month or two to even think about ordering DECA.
> 
> Hopefully things will get worked out soon and yeah, it's clear that some of these folks are learning on the job (regardless of any training). In extreme cases, folks that have never been trained are tackling the projects, and I can with certainty that this should not happen .. But, the fact remains that it is happening.


As of this morning I'm able to use the service as I understood it to work. I referred to this post to get networking to the rest of my DVRs using a Single DECA.

I agree patience and persistence is key, I only got agro after being on the phone for hours then speaking to an uneducated supervisor. Since it's working the way I want I'm all good now. 

The most important thing for anyone considering this install is to be familiar with your equipment and research the forums and don't be afraid to let the installer know if something isn't working right.


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## njblackberry (Dec 29, 2007)

Due to these growing pains, is there any chance that the 5/20 shut off date can be postponed? I'd hate to think of the confusion that could result if we go in, have MRV enabled (again, thanks for the instructions) and then try to order Whole House MRV...


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

njblackberry said:


> Due to these growing pains, is there any chance that the 5/20 shut off date can be postponed? I'd hate to think of the confusion that could result if we go in, have MRV enabled (again, thanks for the instructions) and then try to order Whole House MRV...


I've asked/recommended an extension, but :shrug:


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## njblackberry (Dec 29, 2007)

Thanks; would stink if the people who tested this and have it working over Ethernet were to be cut off because of a learning curve and lack of hardware...


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## Holydoc (Feb 18, 2008)

Installer came to my house yesterday to do the install. I have HR24, HR20, and he was going to install a new receiver in the guest bedroom. All would be connected via MRV and I wanted to continue to receive DoD.

This was all told to the directtv appointment scheduler when I made the appointment.

We received a confirmation call that stated the install would take 1.5 hours.

Installer arrived at 11:30am and left at 4:30pm. He arrived with 2 DECAs and the receiver. He had a guess on how to hook up the HR24 and new receiver but had no clue on how to get the HR20 to work. He also stated that the Southeast (I am in Florida) did not currently have the DECA-to_Broadband equipment so I could not get DoD.

With the help of this forum, I printed out the diagrams of how to hook up the HR20 (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=177061) and a diagram on how to hook up the DoD using another DECA (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=177308). He went back to the office and picked up two more DECAs and proceeded to follow the diagrams as posted on this website. It worked great!

I now have MRV throughout my house and can also access DoD. The only question I have is that:

How do I access my pictures and music on my PC like I use to when I did not have the DECA network? Is it not possible to play pictures and music across the network once you have your MRV connected via a DECA network?

THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL THE HELP FROM THIS FORUM!


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Holydoc said:


> How do I access my pictures and music on my PC like I use to when I did not have the DECA network? Is it not possible to play pictures and music across the network once you have your MRV connected via a DECA network?
> 
> THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL THE HELP FROM THIS FORUM!


Should be the same old way, though it might take some time and you may need to look on your PC to "unblock" the receivers again as they may look like 
"new ones" to it.


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## kymikes (Jan 16, 2008)

This seems to be the thread to ask this question (correct me if I am wrong). I have a fully working MRV system on the beta using my home network (2 HR21-700's, 1 H21-100 and 1 H21-200). My network connections are all hardwired (no wireless or powerline to the DVR/receivers). I have no SWiM or DECA installed but everything works. I have been reviewing these threads to determine whether there is any advantage to upgrading to SWiM/DECA as a part of this roll-out. At this point, it does not appear to me there is.

1. Am I missing some 'future proof' advantage to the DirecTV overall solution (while avoiding the 'training'/'equip. availability' issues)? I sure haven't seen it so far. The only possibility I seen is some *potential* network traffic management improvements.

2. If I go the non DECA/SWiM solution and just authorize the 'Whole Home' solution (w/ the $3 monthly charge), can I take advantage of the hardware side of this offer at a later point (with the $99 + $49 charges) if I find some reason in the future?

Thanks for any advise. If this is already answered somewhere, I missed it in the deluge.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

kymikes said:


> This seems to be the thread to ask this question (correct me if I am wrong). I have a fully working MRV system on the beta using my home network (2 HR21-700's, 1 H21-100 and 1 H21-200). My network connections are all hardwired (no wireless or powerline to the DVR/receivers). I have no SWiM or DECA installed but everything works. I have been reviewing these threads to determine whether there is any advantage to upgrading to SWiM/DECA as a part of this roll-out. At this point, it does not appear to me there is.
> 
> 1. Am I missing some 'future proof' advantage to the DirecTV overall solution (while avoiding the 'training'/'equip. availability' issues)? I sure haven't seen it so far. The only possibility I seen is some *potential* network traffic management improvements.
> 
> ...


I would say the biggest reason for making the switch now is that you know the pricing structure .. Pricing is always subject to change, so the old saying applies "a bird in the hand or two in the bush?" You just don't know if you'll get the two in the bush or even one of those two in the bush.

If you do go unsupported, down the line you'll probably have to get them to switch you back to 'n' or (none) before you can even order the upgrade. There are a lot of opportunities for it to be problematic in the future (though not impossible). I'd almost say that if you're thinking about it anyway, just go ahead and go for it now .. but that's just me.


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## kymikes (Jan 16, 2008)

Doug Brott said:


> I would say the biggest reason for making the switch now is that you know the pricing structure .. Pricing is always subject to change, so the old saying applies "a bird in the hand or two in the bush?" You just don't know if you'll get the two in the bush or even one of those two in the bush.
> 
> If you do go unsupported, down the line you'll probably have to get them to switch you back to 'n' or (none) before you can even order the upgrade. There are a lot of opportunities for it to be problematic in the future (though not impossible). I'd almost say that if you're thinking about it anyway, just go ahead and go for it now .. but that's just me.


Doug, Thanks for the response. Your thinking is what was driving me but the combination of "If it ain't broke, . . ." and the fact that the last two times I have had to have a service person at the house (hardware probs), I have gotten 2 great ones. I'm due for "my other brother Daryl" I'm afraid. Such a short window makes the decision a bit harder.

P.S. Does the SWiM/DECA installaton change the router configuration in my home network for IP addresses and port passthrough??


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## DaveC (Apr 6, 2006)

Holydoc said:


> I now have MRV throughout my house and can also access DoD. The only question I have is that:
> 
> How do I access my pictures and music on my PC like I use to when I did not have the DECA network? Is it not possible to play pictures and music across the network once you have your MRV connected via a DECA network?
> 
> THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL THE HELP FROM THIS FORUM!


Confirming what VOS said&#8230;.
I was running MRV (Beta) and MediaShare over my network. Yesterday I had the DECA/SWiM install done. Everything worked the same as it had before the install. The MediaShare capability worked immediately and nothing was required on the PC side.

Dave


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

kymikes said:


> P.S. Does the SWiM/DECA installaton change the router configuration in my home network for IP addresses and port passthrough??


Your network configuration does not need to change at all, only the method of connecting (DECA vs. Ethernet).


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## kymikes (Jan 16, 2008)

Doug Brott said:


> Your network configuration does not need to change at all, only the method of connecting (DECA vs. Ethernet).


Many thanks for your help.


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## Holydoc (Feb 18, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> Should be the same old way, though it might take some time and you may need to look on your PC to "unblock" the receivers again as they may look like
> "new ones" to it.


Thanks for the ideas. The installer said that the PC connection could not work with the DECA setup, so I never tried it. After these suggestions, I went home and rebooted the DVRs and unblocked the DVRs in the PC. Just as you said, I was able to clearly see my network again.

THANK YOU so much!

P.S. One should not believe every word an installer says who has to use diagrams I printed from this site so that he can complete the job. :lol:


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## Yog-Sothoth (Apr 8, 2006)

The only problem encountered (installation wise) yesterday was that the installer had trouble activating an HR23-700... it turned out he had previously activated it at another customer's home, but that customer thought it looked too "fat" in his entertainment center. :lol: That's like people who buy TVs to fit entertainment centers instead of the other way around.


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