# Talked to DirecTV about R15



## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

I spoke with a DirecTV Expanded Services Rep (DVR/Tivo people) the person I spoke with was telling me that many of them have never even seen this DVR nor do they have barely any information in the computers about it. She stated that most of what they know if from hand written notes being passed around among themselves. What she did state is that some of the problems I called in about (Missing Recordings, Everything being recorded, Box Freezing) are being tracked and worked on. She stated that their best guess is a couple of weeks before they have a fix ready for some of these issues, but that it's just a guess as they aren't getting much feedback yet. One thing she said kind of bothered me though it did confirm what some of us have said, she stated that the box was released knowing that it was going to have issues and that they released to smaller set of distributors on purpose so that they could fish out some of the issues and have fixes ready before the box hit mass market. She said this isn't the first time they have done and won't be the last. So I guess that confirms that all of us with the R15 are somewhat Beta Testers lol.


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## LockMD (Nov 16, 2005)

yeah you'd think that with it supposely avail at BB now, a fix should be coming soon, huh?


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## ISWIZ (Nov 18, 2005)

Thanks for the update, I had emailed them earlier hoping for some feedback and suggesting they use their DTV forum to communicate. At least they are aware there are problems. Many of us signed up to Beta TIVO software so we're used to hunkering down in the trenches while the shells fly. In this case we "volunteered" unaware that we had done it.


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

Kanyon71 said:


> One thing she said kind of bothered me though it did confirm what some of us have said, she stated that the box was released knowing that it was going to have issues and that they released to smaller set of distributors on purpose so that they could fish out some of the issues and have fixes ready before the box hit mass market. She said this isn't the first time they have done and won't be the last. So I guess that confirms that all of us with the R15 are somewhat Beta Testers lol.


Wow, I'm not surprised that is the case, but I'm shocked they would say that over the phone.

In any case, don't they realize that beta testers are more effective when they are aware that they're beta testers and have access to the developers (even if through another layer)?


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

walters said:


> Wow, I'm not surprised that is the case, but I'm shocked they would say that over the phone.
> 
> In any case, don't they realize that beta testers are more effective when they are aware that they're beta testers and have access to the developers (even if through another layer)?


I completey agree if we had a way to effectively turn in these problems it would make us all more effective.

I was shocked she said it also but she kept telling me she was sorry I was having these problems. I told her since I knew I was going to be in the group of some of the first real world testers I pretty much expected it. She kept saying to please hang in there and they would get it fixed. I didn't ask for anything free like showtime (which I already have) or the fee waived. She made sure to ask me though if it was ok if someone from engineering contacted me in the future about these or other problems.


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## Malibu13 (Sep 12, 2004)

Kanyon71 said:


> What she did state is that some of the problems I called in about (Missing Recordings, Everything being recorded, Box Freezing) are being tracked and worked on. She stated that their best guess is a couple of weeks before they have a fix ready for some of these issues, but that it's just a guess as they aren't getting much feedback yet.


then they aren't following this forum and others as well either:nono2: "Ya think"

the thread started here, that's titled: "R15 Enhancements, Bugs & Fixes", should be enough feedback to get every problem with the R15 corrected


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

db54 said:


> then they aren't following this forum and others as well either:nono2: "Ya think"
> 
> the thread started here, that's titled: "R15 Enhancements, Bugs & Fixes", should be enough feedback to get every problem with the R15 corrected


I don't know who's following what, I havea feeling they arevery disconnected from the people who are actually making the R15. Especially since she stated she's never even seen one. :nono:


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

One thing I have learned in the last 10 years.... 

Regardless of what ever awards DirecTV get's... Internal communication is not one of them. In almost every single case, it seems like one hand is not talking to another, and the mouth has a third story.

And I simply can't understand why.

A company that can launch Satalites, provide Satalite service, and manage to build a billing system that is pretty darn good at taking my money every month..... You would think they would be able to build and internal FAQ system to keep everyone up to speed.

Heck... We train our help desk at least two weeks in advance of an update to the application. How hard would it before DirecTV to at least Demo the unit to all their employees... Even if it is to require them to watch a video or slide show at the minimum.



No wonder they are out of touch what people want.... If they can't communicate amongst themselves... how the heck are they going to communicate with us?


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## John Duncan Yoyo (Nov 22, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> One thing I have learned in the last 10 years....
> 
> Regardless of what ever awards DirecTV get's... Internal communication is not one of them. In almost every single case, it seems like one hand is not talking to another, and the mouth has a third story.
> 
> ...


Maybe they are waiting for someone to write a decent FAQ for them...


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

John Duncan Yoyo said:


> Maybe they are waiting for someone to write a decent FAQ for them...


I get the point... I am really trying to get it done... I just keep getting side tracked.... 
:grin:


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> I get the point... I am really trying to get it done... I just keep getting side tracked....
> :grin:


Are you letting the life thing get in the way again? :lol:


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Kanyon71 said:


> Are you letting the life thing get in the way again? :lol:


 Yep.... It is easy to post replies while at work, but to recompile the FAQ... That is a home project, and I am not getting home till around 10pm this week...

Soon... I promise... Hey I am getting to be like DirecTV... my delivery dates keep slipping....


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> Yep.... It is easy to post replies while at work, but to recompile the FAQ... That is a home project, and I am not getting home till around 10pm this week...
> 
> Soon... I promise... Hey I am getting to be like DirecTV... my delivery dates keep slipping....


I know how it is, the only reason i've been around so much lately is that i''ve been sick and made to stay home. If you need any help or anywhere to store stuff just let me know. My offer still stands.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

No problem... Thanks.


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## cheer (Nov 9, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> Regardless of what ever awards DirecTV get's... Internal communication is not one of them. In almost every single case, it seems like one hand is not talking to another, and the mouth has a third story.
> 
> And I simply can't understand why.


You must be new to large corporate organizations.  I've worked for small companies and large companies, and in every case I can state that communication in large companies blows. ("Blows" being a technical term used by people in corporate communications, of course.)


> A company that can launch Satalites, provide Satalite service, and manage to build a billing system that is pretty darn good at taking my money every month..... You would think they would be able to build and internal FAQ system to keep everyone up to speed.


Indeed. But it is generally not so.

I currently work for a very large company -- one that, in fact, just recently got a whole lot bigger. (I won't name it, but our corporate logo used to look suspiciously like a place of evil from a famous science fiction movie.) Getting a product up and running (i.e. launching satellites) and getting billing in place will always have priority over documentation and customer service, when prioritization is required.

Now why, you might ask, would prioritization be required? Scenario:

Global Telkom, a managed network provider, has decided to launch a new managed service. They are doing this because (A) their existing service is aging, (B) the new service can offer features that customers are starting to ask for, and (C) the competition is creating pricing pressures that eat into margins.

GT creates a plan, with timelines and so forth. The plan encompasses testing, training, documentation, marketing...the whole shebang. So far, so good.

After a while, the first problem occurs. Testing has uncovered issues. Development works on the problem, but the schedule now starts to slip. (Even assuming that time was built into the schedule for this, it's never enough.)

Meanwhile, GT learns that a competitor is beginning to develop a similar product. GT has six to eight months of lead time, but that could disappear with more delays. So GT now plans to do a "controlled launch" of the product, targeting specific customers with simple requirements. The full product will continue to be developed in parallel.

This costs more money. Head count elsewhere is trimmed as a result. However, now the competitor's pricing pressures on the legacy product erode revenue further. Funding has to be reduced, because the Street is getting antsy. So documentation/training is cut, because it won't prevent the launch of a product that marketing is already getting worked up about.

There are many similar situations that could explain why this happens.


> Heck... We train our help desk at least two weeks in advance of an update to the application. How hard would it before DirecTV to at least Demo the unit to all their employees... Even if it is to require them to watch a video or slide show at the minimum.


If everything is on schedule and they've had the time and money to prepare all of that...I agree. But I'm willing to bet that they're still working on that piece.


> No wonder they are out of touch what people want.... If they can't communicate amongst themselves... how the heck are they going to communicate with us?


Welcome to corporate America.

P.S. Tinley Park, eh? Hello from Gurnee! Which, of course, is a Northern suburb of Chicago in the same euphamistic way that Tinley Park is. I think we're both in different time zones...


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

I spend two years out at the Sears headquarters so I have seen the inner workings of big corporate america.

It can be done, if the effort is applied. You would think they could get a system together to make sure that their front end first level contact people have the same information.

My current client, we just completed building an online education system, to keep the 5,000+ employees up todate on certain topics. It even tracks who took it and when...


Gurnee aye? How is the weather up there? I hate that town... that mall and theme park always sucks my wallet dry ever summer.

Gurnee is just about as far north as you can get and still call it Chicago.
Tinley is just about as far south as you can get and still call it Chicago.

On a good day... 1 1/2 - 2 hour drive between the two..


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

ebonovic said:


> One thing I have learned in the last 10 years....


So you referring to your 10 years in the real world? Is that it?



ebonovic said:


> A company that can launch Satalites, provide Satalite service, and manage to build a billing system that is pretty darn good at taking my money every month..... You would think they would be able to build and internal FAQ system to keep everyone up to speed.


DTV doesn't launch the "Satalites". In fact I don't think they even use "Satalites". But they do contract out the building and launching of "satellites". They also contract out their call centers. Go figure.



ebonovic said:


> Heck... We train our help desk at least two weeks in advance of an update to the application. How hard would it before DirecTV to at least Demo the unit to all their employees... Even if it is to require them to watch a video or slide show at the minimum.


I'm guessing what you are referring to is a new rollout of an internal application by any medium/large firm that can afford a help desk. And you are correct. You're missing the fact that DTV had to get the R15 to market by early November if they wanted ANY part of the Christmas Shopping Season. The goals of an organization rolling out an internal application update are totally different than the goals of a retail oranization making sure they hit the Christmas season.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Yes... 10 years in the real world. and 10 years as a DirecTV subscriber.

Well no... they are not the ones that actually Launch them... As they contract that out, as well as contract the building of them too... you are correct. I was using it a vague reference to... "they are not a mom-pop shop dealing with cheap stuff", they are a big time company..

.... Yes internal application to 5,500 user company, spread across the country.

BUT... how hard would it have been to create a small Power Point presentation, or video showing their first line support people the unit. 

That could have been put together in less then a week... Staged on a server inside the company, and sent out an email.... I would hope that at least their first line people have an internal communication mechanism of some time. And I an not refering to the distribution of a retail product during the busiest shoping time of the year.

I am referring to them preparing their front line employees to hand the calls and questions regarding that product. Two different teams, two different "projects" for the same product. Heck they still have managed to get all their employees on the same page regardng the HR10-250 or even the TiVo models and those have been out for years... Hence the affectionate term: CSR Roulette... aka.. Keep calling to get someone with a clue.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

ebonovic said:


> BUT... how hard would it have been to create a small Power Point presentation, or video showing their first line support people the unit.
> 
> That could have been put together in less then a week... Staged on a server inside the company, and sent out an email.... I would hope that at least their first line people have an internal communication mechanism of some time. And I an not refering to the distribution of a retail product during the busiest shoping time of the year.
> 
> I am referring to them preparing their front line employees to hand the calls and questions regarding that product. Two different teams, two different "projects" for the same product. Heck they still have managed to get all their employees on the same page regardng the HR10-250 or even the TiVo models and those have been out for years... Hence the affectionate term: CSR Roulette... aka.. Keep calling to get someone with a clue.


I agree completely.

But I've been a part of a couple of organizations in which that doesn't happen. DTV seems to be one of those organizations.


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## 01ds650 (Nov 20, 2005)

Want it done right let the Asians do it!


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## DTV TiVo Dealer (Sep 27, 2003)

I totally agree with Earl that the product management should have a presentation. They could easily use their closed circuit channels they have reserved for corporate communications. 

DIRECTV CSRs have a networked resource with just about any possible scenario or question anyone could have with the company response well documented and written. Officially, it's called the DIRECTV Order Resource Information System, aka DORIS.

You will know when a CSR is referring to DORIS as they may say "hold on while I check my resources" or if they just sound like they are reading a script.

I have the same DORIS resource available to me in real time.

Better communications is vital in today rapid moving high technology world and unfortunately, effective, quality communications is lacking in most companies. I try to do my best in training our small groups of CSRs and field service technicians to delivery the highest level of service and support. I must admit we also miss our mark occasionally.

-Robert


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## ISWIZ (Nov 18, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> I am referring to them preparing their front line employees to hand the calls and questions regarding that product. Two different teams, two different "projects" for the same product. Heck they still have managed to get all their employees on the same page regardng the HR10-250 or even the TiVo models and those have been out for years... Hence the affectionate term: CSR Roulette... aka.. Keep calling to get someone with a clue.


Let's hope they don't give them the manual!:lol:


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## Joe C (Mar 3, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> Yes... 10 years in the real world. and 10 years as a DirecTV subscriber.
> 
> BUT... how hard would it have been to create a small Power Point presentation, or video showing their first line support people the unit.
> 
> ...


I agree with Earl, I work for the Federal Government and that's how we take most of our annual traing classes. So if the Feds can figure it out surely Dave could do the same thing.


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## cheer (Nov 9, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> I spend two years out at the Sears headquarters so I have seen the inner workings of big corporate america.


Yikes. Two years at Sears is like 14 normal years.


> It can be done, if the effort is applied. You would think they could get a system together to make sure that their front end first level contact people have the same information.


I don't dispute that. I'm merely pointing out the things that can exist in corporate structures that impede such an effort.

Unless there's real focus from management, at a level high enough to cross over the various divisions and departments involved, this effort can fail -- or at least, suffer significant delays.


> Gurnee aye? How is the weather up there? I hate that town... that mall and theme park always sucks my wallet dry ever summer.


We thank you for the revenue; it saves us from having to buy stickers for the cars each year. 


> Gurnee is just about as far north as you can get and still call it Chicago.
> Tinley is just about as far south as you can get and still call it Chicago.
> 
> On a good day... 1 1/2 - 2 hour drive between the two..


And as we all know, good days can be rare. Heck, last time I took in a concert at your nearby Tweeter Center I considered renting a chopper...


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## cheer (Nov 9, 2005)

ebonovic said:


> BUT... how hard would it have been to create a small Power Point presentation, or video showing their first line support people the unit.


See, that's not big-company thinking. I used to think like that too -- in fact, I often still do, though it's useless where I work.

In a large company, it would go something like this:

A conference call is set up to discuss training the operations folks
Operations asks who is going to develop the PowerPoint (or whatever)
The deployment team states they can't -- they don't have the expertise; they're just planners
Development says they were never given this training as a requirement and asks who is going to fund this training
Operations points out that they just need a quick-n-dirty presentation; nothing elaborate
Development agrees that that might be so, but still has to tie back man-hours to project codes in the system, and those project codes have fixed budgets; they'll need SVP approval to break them. Plus, as new bugs are fixed and information learned, surely Ops will want the presentation updated; development has no head count for that ongoing effort.
Operations turns to deployment, opining that this sort of thing should have been encompassed in the project itself
Deployment says that was never in its mandate and it has no funds to allocate
Operations says they certainly don't have funds and can't be expected to train themselves.
Time runs out, and parties agree that a follow-up call needs to be scheduled for next week so that this issue can be pinned down.
This isn't an exaggeration -- I've seen this exact scenario play out. More than once.

Companies need to foster a "let's pull up our sleeves and work together" mentality. The larger the company, the harder that is. At one time I worked for a big blue company, and after a few months there emailed the CEO in utter frustration at this sort of thing. Naturally, that prompted many management phone calls as they teamed together to "craft" a response to my email. It's all so silly.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

cheer said:


> See, that's not big-company thinking. I used to think like that too -- in fact, I often still do, though it's useless where I work.
> 
> In a large company, it would go something like this:
> 
> ...


No it's not. That's exactly the way it works.

"What project do I bill the 4 hours to prepare the presentation to?" Answer, don't do it.


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

BTW, (and this seems as good a thread as any to put this in) apparently _there is_ a video for installers and CSRs. It's been reported seen on channel 592 (not sure if that's available to us normal customers).


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## chewwy420 (Nov 28, 2005)

walters said:


> BTW, (and this seems as good a thread as any to put this in) apparently _there is_ a video for installers and CSRs. It's been reported seen on channel 592 (not sure if that's available to us normal customers).


No it's not availible to us!


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

Strange. The guy who reported seeing it doesn't seem to be an installer or dealer or anything. Same for the other guy who says he saw it too.

Maybe it will show up as a yellow star item on my R10


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## ISWIZ (Nov 18, 2005)

Autorecord Keyword: Inept


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## chewwy420 (Nov 28, 2005)

I checked a few weeks back when I first saw it posted somewhere and the preview is there but when it started it got blacked out...


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## Malibu13 (Sep 12, 2004)

chewwy420 said:


> No it's not availible to us!


i am no installer, dealer or csr, and i did watch it last evening on Ch #592

also, saw the short video on Ch. #1000 last evening (12-3)


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## wolf0695 (May 9, 2006)

i am a directv csr and as far as the training we get, it is usually a video but not necessarily about troubleshooting, just some of the features


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Welcome to the forums wolf0695


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## wohlfie (Dec 28, 2005)

Earl Bonovich said:


> Welcome to the forums wolf0695


I once had a class in college where there were SEVEN "Steve"s out of about 35 people.....but I think the "wolf" trend on this forum is really getting out of hand!!!:lol:


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## mikewolf13 (Jan 31, 2006)

wohlfie said:


> I once had a class in college where there were SEVEN "Steve"s out of about 35 people.....but I think the "wolf" trend on this forum is really getting out of hand!!!:lol:


Agreed:hurah:


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## ApK (Mar 6, 2006)

cheer said:


> I currently work for a very large company -- one that, in fact, just recently got a whole lot bigger. (I won't name it, but our corporate logo used to look suspiciously like a place of evil from a famous science fiction movie.)


Hey I used to work for them too. My only union job. (CWA).

Regarding DTVs internal communications, I think they are especially bad.

When I tried to sign up for DTV, there was problem with my initial order. It took 3 days and hours on the phone before I finally got one CSR manager who realized that I was going though all this hassle just because I wanted to beome a customer, and he finally said "Just stay on the phone with me. I will get this resolved no matter what it takes." And two hours later, he did. And he really had to work at it, because he kept getting the same run around and wrong answers that I had for the previous three days. I wish I could remember his name and what call center he was in. I might have to call and have them look up notes on my account so I can send a letter of commendation for him.

Back in the 80's and 90's when I worked for the same company you do (I won't name them either, but their initials are A, T and T.) there was big internal initialtive to improve internal communications...to make sure that if a custumer asked a question, the buck stopped there. Any employee must have the channels available to get the answer. It had variable success, but it was a real effort.

ApK


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