# C71KW Review (AT&T TV device)



## techguy88

So I managed to get my hands on a C71KW aka Osprey device with the newer remote AT&T is distributing with the device for AT&T TV customers. I've been interested to see how this device works first hand for a while now.

To give it a proper test I reactivated my AT&T TV Now account for 1 month with the Max base package. I figure this base package would be best for a review since it has a decent mix of locals, entertainment, premiums and sports channels. I still have my D* account which I will be using for channels not available on AT&T TV Now such as AMC, Discovery and other locals not available on AT&T TV Now (like PBS, digi-subnets I watch via the LCC/AM21). For other channels (like FX, HBO) I'm gonna watch them on the C71KW.

*First Impressions*
*The device is designed to boot straight away into the AT&T TV app there is no way of exiting out of the AT&T TV app unless you go to another app (like Netflix).
*Channels are organized numerically by default emulating a traditional pay-TV setup (in this case D*'s channel numbers when available.) You can go into settings and switch the guide to organize channels alphabetically for a more OTT experience.
*Channel switching is very smooth approximatly 4-6 seconds to change channels. (Way better than D*'s C41W clients.)
*Cheddar is a live channel not an app so you can record programs from Cheddar (if desired, a very small plus over D* in this area.)
*Supports most major apps (full list coming soon). So far the two major omissions I noticed were Hulu and Amazon Video are not currently supported. (The person who had this unit before managed to get Hulu before it was removed so it works but has the old layout.)
*Supports CBS All Access, Disney+, Movies Anywhere and Netflix apps plus WarnerMedia-owned apps like Bleacher Report, DC Universe, Crunchyroll, VRV and Boomerang.
*Once setup is complete the unit runs decently only had an issue with setting up CBS All Access where it crashed once. (Similar to my experiences with a Roku Streaming Stick and Amazon Fire TV Stick.)
*If you have bought games with your Google account for other Android devices (smartphones, tablets, other Android TV devices, etc.) they will play here as well.


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## Rich

techguy88 said:


> So I managed to get my hands on a C71KW aka Osprey device with the newer remote AT&T is distributing with the device for AT&T TV customers. I've been interested to see how this device works first hand for a while now.
> 
> To give it a proper test I reactivated my AT&T TV Now account for 1 month with the Max base package. I figure this base package would be best for a review since it has a decent mix of locals, entertainment, premiums and sports channels. I still have my D* account which I will be using for channels not available on AT&T TV Now such as AMC, Discovery and other locals not available on AT&T TV Now (like PBS, digi-subnets I watch via the LCC/AM21). For other channels (like FX, HBO) I'm gonna watch them on the C71KW.
> 
> *First Impressions*
> *The device is designed to boot straight away into the AT&T TV app there is no way of exiting out of the AT&T TV app unless you go to another app (like Netflix).
> *Channels are organized numerically by default emulating a traditional pay-TV setup (in this case D*'s channel numbers when available.) You can go into settings and switch the guide to organize channels alphabetically for a more OTT experience.
> *Channel switching is very smooth approximatly 4-6 seconds to change channels. (Way better than D*'s C41W clients.)
> *Cheddar is a live channel not an app so you can record programs from Cheddar (if desired, a very small plus over D* in this area.)
> *Supports most major apps (full list coming soon). So far the two major omissions I noticed were Hulu and Amazon Video are not currently supported. (The person who had this unit before managed to get Hulu before it was removed so it works but has the old layout.)
> *Supports CBS All Access, Disney+, Movies Anywhere and Netflix apps plus WarnerMedia-owned apps like Bleacher Report, DC Universe, Crunchyroll, VRV and Boomerang.
> *Once setup is complete the unit runs decently only had an issue with setting up CBS All Access where it crashed once. (Similar to my experiences with a Roku Streaming Stick and Amazon Fire TV Stick.)
> *If you have bought games with your Google account for other Android devices (smartphones, tablets, other Android TV devices, etc.) they will play here as well.


Thanks!

Rich


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## NashGuy

Nice! Thanks for the review. And yes, I have questions. Please answer/update once you've spent enough time with it to know the following:

1. Please comment on the trick play experience with live TV (pause, rewind, FF). How well does it work?
2. How easy/difficult is to accurately FF/rewind during playback of cloud DVR recordings?
3. How does the HD picture quality compare between cloud DVR recordings and that same channel when viewed live? (The cloud DVR PQ was noticeably inferior a couple years ago when I was a beta tester. I haven't gotten any definitive answer whether that's changed.)
4. How would you compare PQ overall for AT&T TV Now from this device versus DirecTV via the C41W?
5. What sort of bugs/reliability issues, if any, are you noticing with the C71KW and/or AT&T TV Now?
6. What's your impression of the Google Assistant on this device, accessed via the voice remote? Is it responsive or clunky? How well does it integrate with AT&T TV for tasks like finding content, setting up recordings, etc?


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## WestDC

More info here:

https://www.att.com/ecms/dam/att/co...s/pdf/ATT-TV-Device-Remote-Control-Manual.pdf


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## B. Shoe

Great information. Will look forward to further insight from you on this!


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## Rich

WestDC said:


> More info here:
> 
> https://www.att.com/ecms/dam/att/co...s/pdf/ATT-TV-Device-Remote-Control-Manual.pdf


Do not see the 30 Second click forward button or the backward click button.

Rich


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## compnurd

Rich said:


> Do not see the 30 Second click forward button or the backward click button.
> 
> Rich


Good pickup


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## Rich

compnurd said:


> Good pickup


Deal killer.

Rich


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## mjwagner

Thanks for that review. Good info. Hopefully they will work on the channel change time. 4-6 seconds is long IMO. In my experience YTTV is 2-3 seconds max using the live guide or the live channel tile row. Also, I think they will need all the major apps not just some. Not having Amazon Prime Video would be a big miss. Also, what about support for 4k HDR/DV and ATMOS using the various apps like NetFlix, Disney+, etc. Again, without that it can’t be THE streaming device for many people, it would have to be yet another streaming device to be added.


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## CraigerM

Rich said:


> Deal killer.
> 
> Rich


What about this that is in that guide?

FAST-FORWARD
FAST-FORWARD at increasing speeds-press up to four times. Also used in pairing the remote

That looks the same as this:

REWIND
REWIND at increasing speeds-press up to four times. Also used in remote pairing


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## compnurd

CraigerM said:


> What about this that is in that guide?
> 
> FAST-FORWARD
> FAST-FORWARD at increasing speeds-press up to four times. Also used in pairing the remote
> 
> That looks the same as this:
> 
> REWIND
> REWIND at increasing speeds-press up to four times. Also used in remote pairing


That doesn't answer anything at all that he mentioned


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## TheRatPatrol

Does it do PIP of any sort?


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## CraigerM

TheRatPatrol said:


> Does it do PIP of any sort?


On page 4 in the manual it says PIP but doesn't says how it will work.


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## techguy88

Rich said:


> Do not see the 30 Second click forward button or the backward click button.
> 
> Rich


While watching a program the left directional arrow and right directional arrow are used for quick skips. One click either way is 15 seconds at a time.



mjwagner said:


> Thanks for that review. Good info. Hopefully they will work on the channel change time. 4-6 seconds is long IMO. In my experience YTTV is 2-3 seconds max using the live guide or the live channel tile row. Also, I think they will need all the major apps not just some. Not having Amazon Prime Video would be a big miss. Also, what about support for 4k HDR/DV and ATMOS using the various apps like NetFlix, Disney+, etc. Again, without that it can't be THE streaming device for many people, it would have to be yet another streaming device to be added.


The 4-6 seconds was due to the device updating. The previous owners never did a factory reset and since it already had an older version of the Hulu app that is fully functional so I didn't want to factory reset it and go through the setup process brand new (in fear of losing the Hulu app). When setting up the device brand new or via a factory reset it will download and install the update first as part of the setup process. After the device was fully updated AT&T TV Now went back to switching between channels about 2.5 seconds similar to YTTV.

The device supports 4K HDR output for apps that support the feature, however my TVs are 1080p non-HDR sets. The device outputs to the highest resolution possible when connected to a non 4K set. I just watched the last two episodes of _The Mandalorian_ on both my Xbox One X and the AT&T TV device and the PQ and sound was exactly the same.

Since it has Disney+ and ESPN+ (through the ESPN app) I'm not sure why it doesn't have Hulu or Amazon Video. I'm still exploring the apps to see about any other inconsistencies however I would expect AT&T to get Hulu and Amazon Video at some point for AT&T TV device.



NashGuy said:


> Nice! Thanks for the review. And yes, I have questions. Please answer/update once you've spent enough time with it to know the following:
> 
> 1. Please comment on the trick play experience with live TV (pause, rewind, FF). How well does it work?
> 2. How easy/difficult is to accurately FF/rewind during playback of cloud DVR recordings?
> 3. How does the HD picture quality compare between cloud DVR recordings and that same channel when viewed live? (The cloud DVR PQ was noticeably inferior a couple years ago when I was a beta tester. I haven't gotten any definitive answer whether that's changed.)
> 4. How would you compare PQ overall for AT&T TV Now from this device versus DirecTV via the C41W?
> 5. What sort of bugs/reliability issues, if any, are you noticing with the C71KW and/or AT&T TV Now?
> 6. What's your impression of the Google Assistant on this device, accessed via the voice remote? Is it responsive or clunky? How well does it integrate with AT&T TV for tasks like finding content, setting up recordings, etc?


*Trick Play/Cloud DVR*
Combining the first two into one here. Pausing, rewind and fast-forward works the same on both live TV and the cloud DVR recordings. During Live TV if you pause then hit the down arrow you can restart the program from the beginning (for channels/shows that support it). This is also where you can quickly enable/disable CC and jump to Live TV. Rewind and Fast Forward during Live TV and recordings work similar to YTTV where a thumbnail/box appears and you can see how far back you are rewinding or how far you are FF.

When you press play its almost instant and very accurate on the 1x and 2x speeds. Those speeds are actually faster than on D*'s hardware-based DVR where you need 2x or 3x to get the same effect on hardware-based DVR. Similarly when you go to 4x and then it play it may skip ahead by 5 seconds (just like how D*'s hardware-based DVR skips slightly ahead at that speed after you hit play.)

*Picture Quality*
Actually it seems AT&T has improved the service since its launch from 2016. Live TV and Cloud DVR recordings both have the same level of PQ now. If you tune into a program late and begin recording it the Cloud DVR mimics a hardware-based DVR and starts recording at the point you told it to record. I actually watched a couple of episodes of _Reba_ on CMT and recorded them at the same time. After the Live TV airings ended I went back and watched them via the Cloud DVR and the PQ was the same. I also had the same episodes recording on my Genie and then watched the first 15 minutes of the satellite hardware-based recording and it was the same quality as the Cloud DVR. 

During Live TV the PQ between AT&T TV Now via the C71KW and DirecTV via a C41W was the same on most channels. I did notice 315 - QVC2 on both services were not the same quality. On D* QVC2 is broadcasting in SD while on AT&T TV Now its broadcasting in Full HD. Looking at the channel lineup for AT&T TV service QVC2 is listed as an HD only channel. 

I also noticed 272 - Logo is listed as being in SD and HD on AT&T TV's channel lineup as well despite being in SD only on DirecTV. Since I don't have AT&T TV Now's Xtra package I can't verify its actual format as it isn't included in the Max base package. So if anyone happens to have Go Big or Gotta Have It All at the grandfathered prices best to have them check Logo to see what format it is streaming in. 

The PQ on tonight's NHL Hockey game between the Detroit Red Wings vs Columbus Blue Jackets looks the same to me on AT&T TV Now as D* in HD. Only obvious thing is AT&T TV Now is 20 seconds behind D*. Again why they don't show FS Ohio as a full time HD channel on D* is beyond me. 

*Bugs/Reliability *

This is something that is inherited with the Android platform in general but since this is a mid-range device it is affected by it. If you try to open and switch between a bunch of apps one right after the other this will cause the device to temporarily slow down. I noticed this when I was going from one app to another to activate them. When this happens you just need to give the device a bit of time or highlight the previous app you opened and click the "..." button to close the app completely. I don't blame this on the device itself because I have noticed this same thing happening to Amazon Fire TV Sticks (non-4K model) and the regular Roku Streaming Stick.

While rare I have noticed the AT&T TV app will crash when pressing the "Home" button to switch back to AT&T TV/AT&T TV Now and it has to reload. This happened once so far. Similarly the CBS All Access crashed once (which also happened on my Amazon Fire TV Stick before.) Occasionally the device is a bit slow when opening an app especially if you haven't used it in a while. While pressing the "Home" button while in another app is quicker to get back to AT&T TV I find its better to press the "Exit" button as it completely closes the app but this takes a few extra seconds.

*Google Assistant
*
This will be a friend when using the device however it is important to hold the remote in the manner they show in the ads . When asking Google Assistant to tune to a channel using its channel number it is best to say the full number (i.e. when saying "Tune to channel 206" its best to say "Tune to channel two-hundred and six") If you try to say "Tune to two-zero-six" or "Tune to channel two-O-six" sometimes the assistant will mistake the command as "Tune to channel 6."  For my RSNs (FS Ohio, FS Cincinnati and SportsTime Ohio) the assistant can't find the channel by name so I have to ask it to tune to the specific channel number.

If your TV is too loud or the remote is to far away it may misunderstand a command and think you want something else. Like I had the TV volume high and then asked it to tune to Boomerang and it misunderstood the command that I wanted to see videos from the Minecraft YouTuber DanTDM and proceed to open up his YouTube channel for my viewing pleasure. 

The assistant can be used cross-apps so if your watching something on Netflix but then realize its game time on a sport channel you can ask the assistant to tune to the channel the game is on and it will quickly load up AT&T TV and tune to the channel. I actually used this when I almost forgot about the hockey game on FS Ohio since it is the only time AT&T TV Now and D* are showing the same program on that channel in HD.

Overall Google Assistant is responsive and quick most of the time, however there have been a few times where it was a little slow at first. In most cases it is easier asking the Assistant to do things especially if you know the name of show or channel. They have integrated the assistant well I must say.

I did have one instance where it wasn't registering my voice commands so I had to remove the batteries out of the remote for 10 seconds and put them back in which fixed the issue.

Overall at this point it seems AT&T has worked a lot of bugs out of it to improve stability which at this point what remains is small. The only negative I have right now sometimes it can be a little slow switching from AT&T TV app to another app but its not a deal-breaker. The other negative is the current omission of Hulu and Amazon Video. I should have a list tomorrow for the apps.


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## techguy88

CraigerM said:


> On page 4 in the manual it says PIP but doesn't says how it will work.


I haven't seen an option of PIP yet and I've been pushing this box to its limits and combing through the entire menu with a fine tooth comb.


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## techguy88

Also with the remote this unit had both the original remote and the revised remote they are now distributing with the units. The updated remote is by far the best version the additional buttons and modified layout really is an improvement. The center pad with the directional buttons are easier to press than the original remote. Although I'm not sure what the dash button is used for I tried it on various menus and apps and it does nothing so far lol. The diamond button is like a quick button to the apps.

The volume up/down and channel up/down are just like the D* Genie remotes but the audible click is not as loud.

Edit: I just noticed this remote is back-lit as well


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## CraigerM

So does pausing, rewinding and fast-forwarding live TV work just like DTV?


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## techguy88

CraigerM said:


> So does pausing, rewinding and fast-forwarding live TV work just like DTV?


If I had to compare it to something I would say RW/FF works similar to YTTV with the thumbnail/box but it has 4 speeds like D* does.


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## mjwagner

techguy88 said:


> If I had to compare it to something I would say RW/FF works similar to YTTV with the thumbnail/box but it has 4 speeds like D* does.


If trick play works similarly to YTTV as far as being quick, fluid and accurate (frankly as good or better than any in home DVR I have ever used or have seen) then I would consider that a huge win for AT&T. IMO the performance of YTTVs cloud DVR is currently the gold standard for cloud based DVRs.


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## techguy88

mjwagner said:


> If trick play works similarly to YTTV as far as being quick, fluid and accurate (frankly as good or better than any in home DVR I have ever used or have seen) then I would consider that a huge win for AT&T. IMO the performance of YTTVs cloud DVR is currently the gold standard for cloud based DVRs.


They have drastically improved the service it seems since I last tried it out. If I remember correctly when AT&T TV Now first launched (as D* Now) there was no preview you had to pretty much hit and miss in the beginning. Now that you have the thumbnail/box to see where your going in the program its a huge difference. Only issue I've noticed is at 4x speeds is if you hit play say around 17:15 it will skip ahead 20 seconds to 17:35 but D*'s hardware-based DVRs also do this at that speed.


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## mjwagner

techguy88 said:


> They have drastically improved the service it seems since I last tried it out. If I remember correctly when AT&T TV Now first launched (as D* Now) there was no preview you had to pretty much hit and miss in the beginning. Now that you have the thumbnail/box to see where your going in the program its a huge difference. Only issue I've noticed is at 4x speeds is if you hit play say around 17:15 it will skip ahead 20 seconds to 17:35 but D*'s hardware-based DVRs also do this at that speed.


That is good news. I'm really hoping they are successful with this offering. The more good alternatives their are in this space the better it will be for consumers. Competition is good!


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> They have drastically improved the service it seems since I last tried it out. If I remember correctly when AT&T TV Now first launched (as D* Now) there was no preview you had to pretty much hit and miss in the beginning. Now that you have the thumbnail/box to see where your going in the program its a huge difference. Only issue I've noticed is at 4x speeds is if you hit play say around 17:15 it will skip ahead 20 seconds to 17:35 but D*'s hardware-based DVRs also do this at that speed.


Yep, your recollection is correct. When I beta tested the cloud DVR in early 2018, there was no thumbnail preview box during FF/rew of recordings. I don't think that feature got added until the last few months (and I'm not even sure if it's in the AT&T TV app for other devices yet or if it's just on this box for now).

Thanks for taking the time to check out and type up all this info. This sounds really promising as a solution for my parents to switch to from DISH (with a separate Roku for apps).


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> The only negative I have right now sometimes it can be a little slow switching from AT&T TV app to another app but its not a deal-breaker. The other negative is the current omission of Hulu and Amazon Video. I should have a list tomorrow for the apps.


The Hulu app is a sensitive one given that Hulu offers their own live cable TV service inside the app. I think that's been one of the hold-ups on a Hulu app coming to Comcast's X1 boxes (despite the fact that Comcast is a 30% owner of Hulu). They've announced that a Hulu app is coming to X1, though, and I think it's going to be a version of the current-UI app but without the ability to add live TV. Perhaps the same thing will come to the AT&T TV device. Understandably, MVPDs don't want directly competing MVPD services on their own hardware.

As for the Prime Video app, Amazon basically uses it as a negotiating tool with other companies. I would imagine that the presence of their app on the AT&T TV device will be part of the larger discussions between AT&T and Amazon involving distribution of HBO/HBO Max. I expect it'll happen, though. Amazon already has a full 4K HDR version of their app running on other Android TV devices, and they've already got their app on board X1, and it's supposedly being tested now for DISH Hopper.

For that matter, the same is probably true with regard to Comcast's upcoming Peacock app. Part of the deal to get HBO Max distributed by Comcast may involve AT&T putting the Peacock app on the AT&T TV device, and possibly even including a subscription to Peacock Premium ($5/mo as a standalone) in with one or more AT&T TV channel packages. Same could hold true for the Apple TV app.

Even now, I'd say that the AT&T TV box is ahead of Comcast's X1 when it comes to apps. Both offer Netflix, YouTube, Tubi, Pluto TV, and Pandora. X1 also has Amazon Prime Video and Amazon Music, which AT&T TV lacks for now. But AT&T TV has Disney+, CBS All Access, PBS, Spotify, DC Universe, Crunchyroll, ESPN and more; none of those are on X1 yet (although Comcast announced that CBS AA will come to X1 later this year).


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Although I'm not sure what the dash button is used for I tried it on various menus and apps and it does nothing so far lol. The diamond button is like a quick button to the apps.


The user manual says that the dash button is used in unpairing the remote. I'd guess that it would also be used when entering OTA channel numbers (e.g. 4-2) should this device work with an AT&T-supplied OTA tuner in the future (as I've speculated it might).

As for the diamond button, it looks like they smartly changed its label to simply "APPS" on the final version of the remote as pictured in the user manual.



techguy88 said:


> Edit: I just noticed this remote is back-lit as well


Very nice. Love back-lighting.


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## CraigerM

I think DTV has improved their PQ again. If AT&T TV can have the same or better PQ and sound quality as DTV same with the cloud DVR, that would be cool. Imagine that quality if they expanded the AT&T TV APP to all the popular smart TV’s and it looked exactly like the APP on their box. The only thing it wouldn’t do is boot into live TV but that would be cool to use your TV remote to change channel numbers.


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## Rich

CraigerM said:


> What about this that is in that guide?
> 
> FAST-FORWARD
> FAST-FORWARD at increasing speeds-press up to four times. Also used in pairing the remote
> 
> That looks the same as this:
> 
> REWIND
> REWIND at increasing speeds-press up to four times. Also used in remote pairing


Not the same. The 30 Second Click forward is invaluable when watching sports. Yeah, you can do it with FF but it's not the same. Without the 30 Second Click it would be settling for an inferior service, I think.

Rich


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## Rich

techguy88 said:


> While watching a program the left directional arrow and right directional arrow are used for quick skips. One click either way is 15 seconds at a time.


Thanks. I could make that work. Be kinda like what I have to do when using an ATV. Still settling, but doable.

Rich


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## TheRatPatrol

Rich said:


> Not the same. The 30 Second Click forward is invaluable when watching sports. Yeah, you can do it with FF but it's not the same. Without the 30 Second Click it would be settling for an inferior service, I think.
> 
> Rich


Rich, have you ever tried 30 second slip to watch sports, so you could see whats going on while slipping?


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> While watching a program the left directional arrow and right directional arrow are used for quick skips. One click either way is 15 seconds at a time.


Would be nice if you could go into Settings and change the jump back/forward increment from 15 seconds to something else, like 30 seconds. The Channels app on my Apple TV allows that. (Actually, it even allows you to set different increments for sports viewing vs. everything else.) I have mine set to jump back 10 sec and jump forward 30 sec.


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## b4pjoe

NashGuy said:


> Would be nice if you could go into Settings and change the jump back/forward increment from 15 seconds to something else, like 30 seconds. The Channels app on my Apple TV allows that. (Actually, it even allows you to set different increments for sports viewing vs. everything else.) I have mine set to jump back 10 sec and jump forward 30 sec.


What is "The Channels app"?


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## techguy88

b4pjoe said:


> What is "The Channels app"?


Apple TV Channels is an aggregate service that puts all your subscriptions into one hub so you don't have to keep switching between apps. It works similar to Amazon Channels.


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## NashGuy

b4pjoe said:


> What is "The Channels app"?


It's an app that works with HDHomeRun tuners (both OTA and CableCARD). Very nice UI for watching live TV, with trick play. You can optionally subscribe to their Channels Plus service with DVR capabilities if you have the necessary hardware.

Channels - Live TV, everywhere


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Apple TV Channels is an aggregate service that puts all your subscriptions into one hub so you don't have to keep switching between apps. It works similar to Amazon Channels.


Yes, but you're talking about something different than I was referencing.


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## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> Yes, but you're talking about something different than I was referencing.


Ah okay I had no clue about that actually I feel silly now lol.


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## techguy88

So it seems the improved trick play is only on the C71KW when using the AT&T TV Now app on my Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV Stick. When RW/FF on Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV Stick there is no thumbnail/box that shows you where you are. Its a hit or miss situation. Other than that the improved PQ, improved On Demand (which is now better and more reliable than D* On Demand now) and improved Cloud DVR are all present on these two devices.

On a side note they improved the app to the point it runs buttery smooth on other devices. It actually works well with the Amazon Fire TV Stick and is very snappy. With other apps in general and the UI I notice slowdown on the Amazon Fire TV Stick.


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## b4pjoe

NashGuy said:


> It's an app that works with HDHomeRun tuners (both OTA and CableCARD). Very nice UI for watching live TV, with trick play. You can optionally subscribe to their Channels Plus service with DVR capabilities if you have the necessary hardware.
> 
> Channels - Live TV, everywhere


OK. No can do OTA in my location.


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## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> So it seems the improved trick play is only on the C71KW when using the AT&T TV Now app on my Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV Stick. When RW/FF on Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV Stick there is no thumbnail/box that shows you where you are. Its a hit or miss situation. Other than that the improved PQ, improved On Demand (which is now better and more reliable than D* On Demand now) and improved Cloud DVR are all present on these two devices.
> 
> On a side note they improved the app to the point it runs buttery smooth on other devices. It actually works well with the Amazon Fire TV Stick and is very snappy. With other apps in general and the UI I notice slowdown on the Amazon Fire TV Stick.


Yeah, I posted above that the thumbnail preview during seek may not be in the apps, just on the C71KW. Given that it's still this way so close to the official launch of AT&T TV, you have to wonder if maybe the apps will stay that way. Could be a subtle way of them encouraging folks to use their own box. (And, of course, not having the preview box makes it more difficult to skip through ads and that's something that AT&T would rather you not do anyway.)


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## mjwagner

techguy88 said:


> So it seems the improved trick play is only on the C71KW when using the AT&T TV Now app on my Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV Stick. When RW/FF on Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV Stick there is no thumbnail/box that shows you where you are. Its a hit or miss situation. Other than that the improved PQ, improved On Demand (which is now better and more reliable than D* On Demand now) and improved Cloud DVR are all present on these two devices.
> 
> On a side note they improved the app to the point it runs buttery smooth on other devices. It actually works well with the Amazon Fire TV Stick and is very snappy. With other apps in general and the UI I notice slowdown on the Amazon Fire TV Stick.


That is not a good sign. If they (AT&T) really want to compete in this space the preview pane needs to be there on the major streaming devices. Like it or not the bar is being set by services such as YTTV.


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## NashGuy

mjwagner said:


> That is not a good sign. If they (AT&T) really want to compete in this space the preview pane needs to be there on the major streaming devices. Like it or not the bar is being set by services such as YTTV.


Hopefully they'll bring the app up to par. That said, as I've said before, I doubt that AT&T sees YTTV as their main competitor for AT&T TV. It's probably Xfinity TV. And the situation there is that their app is far less slick and user-friendly than the AT&T TV app, plus it only works on Roku and select Samsung smart TVs. It sounds like the AT&T TV app is almost as good as using their own device; that's definitely not the case with the Xfinity Stream app vs. their own X1 boxes.


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## mjwagner

NashGuy said:


> Hopefully they'll bring the app up to par. That said, as I've said before, I doubt that AT&T sees YTTV as their main competitor for AT&T TV. It's probably Xfinity TV. And the situation there is that their app is far less slick and user-friendly than the AT&T TV app, plus it only works on Roku and select Samsung smart TVs. It sounds like the AT&T TV app is almost as good as using their own device; that's definitely not the case with the Xfinity Stream app vs. their own X1 boxes.


If they don't view YTTV as one of their competitors then the execs running that ship really are as out of touch as I think they are.


----------



## techguy88

techguy88 said:


> While watching a program the left directional arrow and right directional arrow are used for quick skips. One click either way is 15 seconds at a time.





Rich said:


> Thanks. I could make that work. Be kinda like what I have to do when using an ATV. Still settling, but doable.
> 
> Rich


That 15 second skip applies during on demand/cloud recorded programs. Pressing either the left or right directional arrows twice in a row turns the 15 second skip into a 30 second skip.

During live programs like sports if you press the left directional arrow once you get a 10 second skip. If you press it twice in a row its a 20 second skip, 3 times in a row 30 second skip. Pressing the right directional arrow button once is a full 30 second skip. I found this out while watching NHL Hockey last night.



mjwagner said:


> That is not a good sign. If they (AT&T) really want to compete in this space the preview pane needs to be there on the major streaming devices. Like it or not the bar is being set by services such as YTTV.





NashGuy said:


> Hopefully they'll bring the app up to par. That said, as I've said before, I doubt that AT&T sees YTTV as their main competitor for AT&T TV. It's probably Xfinity TV. And the situation there is that their app is far less slick and user-friendly than the AT&T TV app, plus it only works on Roku and select Samsung smart TVs. It sounds like the AT&T TV app is almost as good as using their own device; that's definitely not the case with the Xfinity Stream app vs. their own X1 boxes.





mjwagner said:


> If they don't view YTTV as one of their competitors then the execs running that ship really are as out of touch as I think they are.


Yeah I would consider the preview pane a basic need for any TV service. Its not good trying to RW/FF during a program and can't see where your going. There are other ways they can optimize AT&T TV / AT&T TV Now for the C71KW than not including a preview pane on non-AT&T home devices.


----------



## Rich

TheRatPatrol said:


> Rich, have you ever tried 30 second slip to watch sports, so you could see whats going on while slipping?


Yup, not what I want. I really like and use the 30 Second Skip. I could live with a 15 second skip. If I had to.

Rich


----------



## Rich

techguy88 said:


> That 15 second skip applies during on demand/cloud recorded programs. Pressing either the left or right directional arrows twice in a row turns the 15 second skip into a 30 second skip.
> 
> During live programs like sports if you press the left directional arrow once you get a 10 second skip. If you press it twice in a row its a 20 second skip, 3 times in a row 30 second skip. Pressing the right directional arrow button once is a full 30 second skip. I found this out while watching NHL Hockey last night.


All I care about is how the skips work with recorded content. I rarely watch anything live. I guess I'd have to try this myself just to see it could be a possible substitute for D* as we know it.

Rich


----------



## mjwagner

techguy88 said:


> That 15 second skip applies during on demand/cloud recorded programs. Pressing either the left or right directional arrows twice in a row turns the 15 second skip into a 30 second skip.
> 
> During live programs like sports if you press the left directional arrow once you get a 10 second skip. If you press it twice in a row its a 20 second skip, 3 times in a row 30 second skip. Pressing the right directional arrow button once is a full 30 second skip. I found this out while watching NHL Hockey last night.
> 
> Yeah I would consider the preview pane a basic need for any TV service. Its not good trying to RW/FF during a program and can't see where your going. There are other ways they can optimize AT&T TV / AT&T TV Now for the C71KW than not including a preview pane on non-AT&T home devices.


Hopefully they aren't going to try to differentiate their box by crippling their sw running on other boxes. I think they are going to have to try to differentiate it based on what it can do. Frankly based on what I know about this box I think that is going to be difficult. Unfortunately the pricing of it (even though the first one is "free" with some commitment to the service) puts it in the category of the higher end streaming devices, think ATV 4k and Nvidia Shield not FireTV, and in that category I think their box is going to struggle particular with the "streaming literate" crowd. Although, as I have said before, that is seemingly not their target demo although that demo, "streaming illiterate" or "streaming newbies" , while currently large is rapidly shrinking. Personally I still think the folks at the top driving this train are out of touch with where and how fast things are moving in this space. Time will tell.


----------



## techguy88

Rich said:


> All I care about is how the skips work with recorded content. I rarely watch anything live. I guess I'd have to try this myself just to see it could be a possible substitute for D* as we know it.
> 
> Rich


With recorded and select on demand content its 15 seconds either way if you click once, double click turns it into a 30 second skip then.


----------



## techguy88

I plan on writing up a full review after a week but Day 3 and the Osprey is working well. The interface is as smooth as the YouTube videos posted so far. So far Google Assistant works well and if it can't find certain content on AT&T TV Now it will search all my other apps I have activated. If I am watching something on Disney+ and want to watch TNT it will tune to TNT when I ask.

Here is what everyone is probably wondering... the apps! For comparison sake I have included Comcast's X1 platform as a comparison point (not their Xfinity Flex). Comcast has the ability to block apps it doesn't want since its OS is a proprietary OS. AT&T doesn't have this ability since it runs the Android TV OS (currently Android TV 8 to be specific.)

As part of the Android TV standard the device operator (in this case AT&T) can't block apps from its device even if it is a competitor (like YouTube TV). However the app developer (using Netflix as an example) can restrict which devices its app is available on until they reach an agreement with the device operator (in this case AT&T.) So this chart I am providing provides an interesting section at the end. 

Aside from the absents of Hulu and Amazon Prime Video, currently HBO GO, HBO Now and Max GO are absent as well. I personally don't think AT&T is leaving their three premium apps out on purpose so there must be some technical issue going on behind the scenes as to why they are not available. So far every-time I have used my ATV to search for random programs on HBO GO and HBO On Demand via AT&T TV Now the program is there.

So it seems the work-a-round for the time being on AT&T TV / AT&T TV Now is to use HBO On Demand and Cinemax On Demand on the Osprey. I will say using the On Demand service in general on the Osprey is very reliable so far way better than when I last had the service in 2017. It takes about 2-4 seconds for an On Demand program to load on AT&T TV Now which is way quicker than DirecTV for the same program! Not to mention TBS' original series Miracle Workers Season 1, Episode 4 is messed up on D* On Demand (and the TBS app) but works flawlessly on AT&T TV Now On Demand. 

There is way more apps available but these are probably the big ones. If there is any specific app you want me to check post here.


----------



## NashGuy

mjwagner said:


> If they don't view YTTV as one of their competitors then the execs running that ship really are as out of touch as I think they are.


Comcast ended 2019 with 21.25 million cable TV subscribers.
AT&T (between its various services) ended the year with 20.4 million subs.
YouTube TV -- after nearly three years in existence, run by one of the largest corporations on earth -- ended 2019 with 2 million subs.

I'm not making a substantive argument about the quality of YTTV, I'm just saying that I don't think AT&T is quaking in their boots over it. And given that AT&T TV will largely serve to pair with and bolster AT&T's own broadband service (just as Xfinity TV does for Comcast's broadband service), I don't think AT&T execs are out of touch at all to be more concerned about making AT&T TV a strong competitor to Xfinity TV than to YTTV (which, at best, is probably only barely profitable and may still be losing money).


----------



## compnurd

NashGuy said:


> Comcast ended 2019 with 21.25 million cable TV subscribers.
> AT&T (between its various services) ended the year with 20.4 million subs.
> YouTube TV -- after nearly three years in existence, run by one of the largest corporations on earth -- ended 2019 with 2 million subs.
> 
> I'm not making a substantive argument about the quality of YTTV, I'm just saying that I don't think AT&T is quaking in their boots over it. And given that AT&T TV will largely serve to pair with and bolster AT&T's own broadband service (just as Xfinity TV does for Comcast's broadband service), I don't think AT&T execs are out of touch at all to be more concerned about making AT&T TV a strong competitor to Xfinity TV than to YTTV (which, at best, is probably only barely profitable and may still be losing money).


Yes but you are not comparing them properly.

YTTV is "cord cutters" mostly. Not Mom and Pop who have Comcast and hit the power button to flip TV. To a lot of average joes ATT TV is going to require a lot of education that it isn't a cord cutting product. Comcast comes over there cable lines. Directv comes over there Sat. But ATT TV comes over there internet?? Why would I want to pay for a separate TV service when X1 is bundled nicely

Quite frankly I don't think Comcast is quaking in there boots at all over this


----------



## mjwagner

NashGuy said:


> Comcast ended 2019 with 21.25 million cable TV subscribers.
> AT&T (between its various services) ended the year with 20.4 million subs.
> YouTube TV -- after nearly three years in existence, run by one of the largest corporations on earth -- ended 2019 with 2 million subs.
> 
> I'm not making a substantive argument about the quality of YTTV, I'm just saying that I don't think AT&T is quaking in their boots over it. And given that AT&T TV will largely serve to pair with and bolster AT&T's own broadband service (just as Xfinity TV does for Comcast's broadband service), I don't think AT&T execs are out of touch at all to be more concerned about making AT&T TV a strong competitor to Xfinity TV than to YTTV (which, at best, is probably only barely profitable and may still be losing money).


Like I said, it's one of their competitors, certainly not their largest, and certainly not their only, but it is clearly one of their competitors in this space, and IMO, one that they ignore at their peril. Just like in sports, you don't run to where the ball is, you you run to where the ball is going to be. Unfortunately I see AT&T not just running to where the ball is now but running to where it used to be...


----------



## mjwagner

compnurd said:


> Yes but you are not comparing them properly.
> 
> YTTV is "cord cutters" mostly. Not Mom and Pop who have Comcast and hit the power button to flip TV. To a lot of average joes ATT TV is going to require a lot of education that it isn't a cord cutting product. Comcast comes over there cable lines. Directv comes over there Sat. But ATT TV comes over there internet?? Why would I want to pay for a separate TV service when X1 is bundled nicely
> 
> Quite frankly I don't think Comcast is quaking in there boots at all over this


This really is about the market they are targeting. I think you have described it pretty well as "Mom and Pop who have Comcast and hit the power button to flip TV." but I would also include D, Dish, and traditional cable cos ...and hit the power button to flip tv. The problem is while that is a large segment currently it is shrinking. The question is how fast.


----------



## compnurd

mjwagner said:


> This really is about the market they are targeting. I think you have described it pretty well as "Mom and Pop who have Comcast and hit the power button to flip TV." but I would also include D, Dish, and traditional cable cos ...and hit the power button to flip tv. The problem is while that is a large segment currently it is shrinking. The question is how fast.


I am in my Mid Thirties. Live in a upper income area Out of all of my family and friends I have 1 who has Hulu Live. Everyone else still has cable or sat service. Why... because they know they can flip it on and it works. Because they know they get the channels they would want without having to poke around to see if the package lines up. Because it just works and don't have to deal with the tech aspect. Because there family regardless of how much there kids stream. Still turn the TV on to watch TV. Just as stated above. Just Comcast and Directv have 40 million customers. There may be a shift towards on demand/streaming. But it is a long long way away from really making a dent. And it most cases with people who have disposable income. They are going to subscribe to all of it


----------



## mjwagner

compnurd said:


> I am in my Mid Thirties. Live in a upper income area Out of all of my family and friends I have 1 who has Hulu Live. Everyone else still has cable or sat service. Why... because they know they can flip it on and it works. Because they know they get the channels they would want without having to poke around to see if the package lines up. Because it just works and don't have to deal with the tech aspect. Because there family regardless of how much there kids stream. Still turn the TV on to watch TV. Just as stated above. Just Comcast and Directv have 40 million customers. There may be a shift towards on demand/streaming. But it is a long long way away from really making a dent. And it most cases with people who have disposable income. They are going to subscribe to all of it


I suppose we all could play dueling anecdotal evidence all day. I have posted also here before that out of my circle of family, friends, and neighbors, all upper middle class, large single family home, suburban/rural type of folks with lots of disposable income, 3 years ago 90% had some sort of traditional linear service from either D, Dish, or a local cable co. That number is now down to below 10%. Maybe it's just my area or my circle of family and friends, who knows but it is what it is and the subscriber losses that keep accelerating for the traditional services sure indicates a change. And again as I have said before, I agree that the population of folks who still want or need traditional service is still a very large number. But it is indisputably shrinking. The only question is how fast. BTW, not that it matters but I turned 60 last year, have been retired for 5 years and my wife and I can afford anything we want...we are lucky for sure.


----------



## NashGuy

compnurd said:


> Yes but you are not comparing them properly.
> 
> YTTV is "cord cutters" mostly. Not Mom and Pop who have Comcast and hit the power button to flip TV. To a lot of average joes ATT TV is going to require a lot of education that it isn't a cord cutting product. Comcast comes over there cable lines. Directv comes over there Sat. But ATT TV comes over there internet?? Why would I want to pay for a separate TV service when X1 is bundled nicely
> 
> Quite frankly I don't think Comcast is quaking in there boots at all over this


AT&T TV will be paired with AT&T Fiber (and AT&T Internet) just as Xfinity TV is paired with Xfinity Internet. There will be some folks outside of AT&T's broadband footprint who, for whatever reasons, opt to get AT&T TV over another company's broadband, just as there are some folks who get YTTV over whatever broadband they have. But I don't expect that there will be a ton of those customers for AT&T (just as there aren't a ton for YTTV).


----------



## NashGuy

mjwagner said:


> Like I said, it's one of their competitors, certainly not their largest, and certainly not their only, but it is clearly one of their competitors in this space, and IMO, one that they ignore at their peril. Just like in sports, you don't run to where the ball is, you you run to where the ball is going to be. Unfortunately I see AT&T not just running to where the ball is now but running to where it used to be...


Where the ball is going isn't YTTV or *any* service focused on the old model of a bundle of cable channels. It's direct-to-consumer services that are mainly on-demand. Services like Netflix and Hulu. And AT&T's competitor in that arena is HBO Max.


----------



## SledgeHammer

compnurd said:


> I am in my Mid Thirties. Live in a upper income area Out of all of my family and friends I have 1 who has Hulu Live. Everyone else still has cable or sat service. Why... because they know they can flip it on and it works. Because they know they get the channels they would want without having to poke around to see if the package lines up. Because it just works and don't have to deal with the tech aspect. Because there family regardless of how much there kids stream. Still turn the TV on to watch TV. Just as stated above. Just Comcast and Directv have 40 million customers. There may be a shift towards on demand/streaming. But it is a long long way away from really making a dent. And it most cases with people who have disposable income. They are going to subscribe to all of it


If you listen to a few of the vocal posters, they make it sound like all traditional companies will be filing for bankruptcy and shutting down within a year. Not the case at ALL! I'd say the majority of older folks aren't going to be tech savvy to use OTT and the younger crowd (teen - 25ish) doesn't watch live TV in the sense that we used to... they're going to do Netflix and AP, or even more likely TPB or similar. There aren't any water cooler shows on right now on ANY service, so it works for folks to just binge down the road.

None of my family members use streaming either. Plenty of co-workers and family friends use services like Netflix, etc. At best I know maybe 2 or 3 cord cutters who just use Pluto. Probably know 3x - 5x that amount on TPB. Don't think I know anyone on a paid LiveTV service.


----------



## MysteryMan

compnurd said:


> I am in my Mid Thirties. Live in a upper income area Out of all of my family and friends I have 1 who has Hulu Live. Everyone else still has cable or sat service. Why... because they know they can flip it on and it works. Because they know they get the channels they would want without having to poke around to see if the package lines up. Because it just works and don't have to deal with the tech aspect. Because there family regardless of how much there kids stream. Still turn the TV on to watch TV. Just as stated above. Just Comcast and Directv have 40 million customers. There may be a shift towards on demand/streaming. But it is a long long way away from really making a dent. And it most cases with people who have disposable income. They are going to subscribe to all of it


As I have stated before everyone doesn't have "reliable" internet service. SPECTRUM is my internet service provider. On Saturday they suffered a multi area cable, internet and phone service outage. It lasted most of the day. On the other hand my DIRECTV service was up and running even with over a inch of snow covering the dish!


----------



## compnurd

NashGuy said:


> AT&T TV will be paired with AT&T Fiber (and AT&T Internet) just as Xfinity TV is paired with Xfinity Internet. There will be some folks outside of AT&T's broadband footprint who, for whatever reasons, opt to get AT&T TV over another company's broadband, just as there are some folks who get YTTV over whatever broadband they have. But I don't expect that there will be a ton of those customers for AT&T (just as there aren't a ton for YTTV).


ATT Fiber doesn't have a large footprint


----------



## mjwagner

NashGuy said:


> AT&T TV will be paired with AT&T Fiber (and AT&T Internet) just as Xfinity TV is paired with Xfinity Internet. There will be some folks outside of AT&T's broadband footprint who, for whatever reasons, opt to get AT&T TV over another company's broadband, just as there are some folks who get YTTV over whatever broadband they have. But I don't expect that there will be a ton of those customers for AT&T (just as there aren't a ton for YTTV).


I have seen no evidence that suggests that a majority, or even a large number, of YTTV subscribers get their broadband from Google. In fact I would bet that the majority of YTTV subscribers get their broadband from someone other than Google.


----------



## b4pjoe

compnurd said:


> ATT Fiber doesn't have a large footprint


Indeed. As of last April they only had 3 million subscribers for ATT Fiber and AT&T claims that will rise to 7 million by 2022 which still isn't a large footprint. AT&T can keep boasting about how much you can save by combining AT&T TV and AT&T Fiber but the reality is that it isn't even a possibility for most of the nation.


----------



## Rich

b4pjoe said:


> Indeed. As of last April they only had 3 million subscribers for ATT Fiber and AT&T claims that will rise to 7 million by 2022 which still isn't a large footprint. AT&T can keep boasting about how much you can save by combining AT&T TV and AT&T Fiber but the reality is that it isn't even a possibility for most of the nation.


We were supposed to get ATT fiber, Verizon FIOS, Altice/Optimum fiber. Nothing has happened. Altice was running fiber cable in town, but I haven't seen them doing that for quite a while. I have no idea what's going on.

Rich


----------



## b4pjoe

A small local telco has been saying fiber is coming in our town. They started saying that in 2014. They used to have a place on their website to give your email address so you could be contacted when fiber becomes available. That is no longer on their website. Not a good sign for the soon to be fiber here.


----------



## SledgeHammer

b4pjoe said:


> Indeed. As of last April they only had 3 million subscribers for ATT Fiber and AT&T claims that will rise to 7 million by 2022 which still isn't a large footprint. AT&T can keep boasting about how much you can save by combining AT&T TV and AT&T Fiber but the reality is that it isn't even a possibility for most of the nation.


I'd say FTTH is dead except in new construction and even that is pretty limited. It's just too expensive (for the installation) -- monthly bill wise, T & GF charge a lot less then Cox does for 1Gbps. Besides, there are limited to no legal (and/or that don't violate TOS) applications for symmetric internet in the home.


----------



## NashGuy

mjwagner said:


> I have seen no evidence that suggests that a majority, or even a large number, of YTTV subscribers get their broadband from Google. In fact I would bet that the majority of YTTV subscribers get their broadband from someone other than Google.


You completely misunderstood my post. I agree, the vast majority of YTTV subscribers are getting their broadband and their TV from two different companies (e.g. Comcast for internet + Google for YTTV). But again, YTTV has only 2 million subs. I don't think that there's ever going to be a majority of Americans getting broadband and cable TV from two different companies. It's just not a natural thing for most consumers to do.

That's why I say that AT&T TV will *mainly* be purchased by folks who get their broadband from AT&T. Now, that said, AT&T does have a situation where they have millions of DirecTV customers who get their broadband from a company other than AT&T (largely because AT&T isn't a broadband option where those folks live). Some of those folks will probably be persuaded to switch over to AT&T TV given that they already have a relationship in place with AT&T through which they can become aware of this new service. "Oh, I can get the same channels and picture quality I have now on DirecTV but also have better receivers with built-in apps and Google Assistant? And it costs a little less too? OK, sign me up." These folks are already used to maintaining two separate billing relationships for TV and broadband.

As I've said before, I don't expect AT&T TV to be wildly successful. I think it will help the company slow down the rate of decline in its overall cable TV subscriber base and it will also help them improve uptake of AT&T Fiber in those areas where it's available. And I think that's all AT&T really expects/hopes for AT&T TV to do.

Well, I think it will also do a third thing: help drive penetration of HBO Max, since they'll be packaging it with AT&T TV.


----------



## mjwagner

NashGuy said:


> You completely misunderstood my post. I agree, the vast majority of YTTV subscribers are getting their broadband and their TV from two different companies (e.g. Comcast for internet + Google for YTTV). But again, YTTV has only 2 million subs. I don't think that there's ever going to be a majority of Americans getting broadband and cable TV from two different companies. It's just not a natural thing for most consumers to do.
> 
> That's why I say that AT&T TV will *mainly* be purchased by folks who get their broadband from AT&T. Now, that said, AT&T does have a situation where they have millions of DirecTV customers who get their broadband from a company other than AT&T (largely because AT&T isn't a broadband option where those folks live). Some of those folks will probably be persuaded to switch over to AT&T TV given that they already have a relationship in place with AT&T through which they can become aware of this new service. "Oh, I can get the same channels and picture quality I have now on DirecTV but also have better receivers with built-in apps and Google Assistant? And it costs a little less too? OK, sign me up." These folks are already used to maintaining two separate billing relationships for TV and broadband.
> 
> As I've said before, I don't expect AT&T TV to be wildly successful. I think it will help the company slow down the rate of decline in its overall cable TV subscriber base and it will also help them improve uptake of AT&T Fiber in those areas where it's available. And I think that's all AT&T really expects/hopes for AT&T TV to do.
> 
> Well, I think it will also do a third thing: help drive penetration of HBO Max, since they'll be packaging it with AT&T TV.


No worries. Clearly I misunderstood what you were trying to say in those last couple of sentences of that post.

Time will tell on this point but I think more and more people are starting to view their ISP, whether it is their local cable co or some other company, as just the internet pipe into their house. I know that's how I and most of my family/friends/neighbors view it. Particularly when their live tv service is just an app on their streaming device that can be changed at will, with no more than a 1 month commitment, with just a few clicks.


----------



## compnurd

Rich said:


> We were supposed to get ATT fiber, Verizon FIOS, Altice/Optimum fiber. Nothing has happened. Altice was running fiber cable in town, but I haven't seen them doing that for quite a while. I have no idea what's going on.
> 
> Rich


Rich

My parents live in Altice territory and last I heard they are still full bore to wire everyone with FTTH It is going to be awhile


----------



## Rich

mjwagner said:


> No worries. Clearly I misunderstood what you were trying to say in those last couple of sentences of that post.
> 
> Time will tell on this point but I think more and more people are starting to view their ISP, whether it is their local cable co or some other company, as just the internet pipe into their house. I know that's how I and most of my family/friends/neighbors view it. Particularly when their live tv service is just an app on their streaming device that can be changed at will, with no more than a 1 month commitment, with just a few clicks.


That's the way I've always thought of my ISP. Just a pipeline into the home. We don't have much choice about ISPs here. I would happily switch to another ISP if I could.

Rich


----------



## Rich

compnurd said:


> Rich
> 
> My parents live in Altice territory and last I heard they are still full bore to wire everyone with FTTH It is going to be awhile


I dunno. They started in 2015 I think. And I haven't seen any sign of the trucks that do the cable laying in months. It was supposed to take about a year and that's obviously not happening. I hope you're right but I'd rather see Verizon FIOS in my area. We were supposed to get it and then that stopped too.

Rich


----------



## compnurd

Rich said:


> I dunno. They started in 2015 I think. And I haven't seen any sign of the trucks that do the cable laying in months. It was supposed to take about a year and that's obviously not happening. I hope you're right but I'd rather see Verizon FIOS in my area. We were supposed to get it and then that stopped too.
> 
> Rich


It is going to take YEARS Rich. Below is the current Jersey Status

*Basking Ridge*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Bergenfield*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Bridgewater*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Clifton*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Closter*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Cresskill*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Demarest*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Dunellen*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Edison*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Fair Lawn*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Highland Park*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Jefferson*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Green Brook*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Metuchen*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Middlesex boro*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Milltown*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Montvale*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*New Brunswick*: Fiber [*Active*]
*North Brunswick*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Oak Ridge*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Paramus*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Paterson*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Piscataway*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Sayreville*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Tenafly*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Warren*: Fiber [*Active*]
*Washington*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
*Watchung*: Fiber [*Active*]
*West Milford*: Fiber [*Deploying*]


----------



## Rich

compnurd said:


> It is going to take YEARS Rich. Below is the current Jersey Status
> 
> *Basking Ridge*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Bergenfield*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Bridgewater*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Clifton*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Closter*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Cresskill*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Demarest*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Dunellen*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Edison*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Fair Lawn*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Highland Park*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Jefferson*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Green Brook*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Metuchen*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Middlesex boro*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Milltown*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Montvale*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *New Brunswick*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *North Brunswick*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Oak Ridge*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Paramus*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Paterson*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Piscataway: Fiber [Active]
> Sayreville*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Tenafly*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Warren*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *Washington*: Fiber [*Deploying*]
> *Watchung*: Fiber [*Active*]
> *West Milford*: Fiber [*Deploying*]


Says: "Active" for my town, Piscataway. I have no idea what that means.

Rich


----------



## compnurd

Rich said:


> Says: "Active" for my town, Piscataway. I have no idea what that means.
> 
> Rich


Go Here

Altice Fiber Network with Up to 1 Gig Internet and Smart WiFi | Optimum

Legend:
*Deploying:* there are fiber taps on the poles
*Active:* there are some users who can sign up now
*Complete:* All Optimum served residents in a town can sign up for Fiber.


----------



## Rich

compnurd said:


> Go Here
> 
> Altice Fiber Network with Up to 1 Gig Internet and Smart WiFi | Optimum
> 
> Legend:
> *Deploying:* there are fiber taps on the poles
> *Active:* there are some users who can sign up now
> *Complete:* All Optimum served residents in a town can sign up for Fiber.


Thanks. I'm gonna have to call them, all I see on that link is bundles.

Rich


----------



## Steveknj

MysteryMan said:


> As I have stated before everyone doesn't have "reliable" internet service. SPECTRUM is my internet service provider. On Saturday they suffered a multi area cable, internet and phone service outage. It lasted most of the day. On the other hand my DIRECTV service was up and running even with over a inch of snow covering the dish!


On the other hand, I've had my dish covered in snow, and gotten no signal during heavy wet snow, while my internet was humming along. I've had that happen more often than my internet go out for that long.


----------



## Rich

Steveknj said:


> On the other hand, I've had my dish covered in snow, and gotten no signal during heavy wet snow, while my internet was humming along. I've had that happen more often than my internet go out for that long.


Folks in rural areas don't get the kind of Net service we do. Like you, I rarely lose the connection.

Rich


----------



## MysteryMan

Rich said:


> Folks in rural areas don't get the kind of Net service we do.


Exactly. I live in a very rural area serviced by SPECTRUM. Packages and service available in cities are not available in our area.


----------



## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Overall at this point it seems AT&T has worked a lot of bugs out of it to improve stability which at this point what remains is small. The only negative I have right now sometimes it can be a little slow switching from AT&T TV app to another app but its not a deal-breaker. The other negative is the current omission of Hulu and Amazon Video.


Any updates to your review or further thoughts on your experience using this device over the past week? Assuming that you could get your current package of DirecTV channels via AT&T TV on this device for the same price, would you switch? Why or why not?


----------



## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> Any updates to your review or further thoughts on your experience using this device over the past week? Assuming that you could get your current package of DirecTV channels via AT&T TV on this device for the same price, would you switch? Why or why not?


Meant to post this earlier but I was a bit busy Friday. Overall I was actually impressed that AT&T managed to produce a decent TV device. Overall I've been quite pleased and surprised with Osprey in its current form sure it has some drawbacks (what doesn't) but it is an impressive piece of kit.

If I was paying regular price for D* Select (currently $62.99), ARS ($15) and 3 TVs ($21) which would be $98.99/mo I would defiantly make the jump to AT&T TV and get Entertainment which is $93/mo (also the new customer perks for the first year would push me there too.) However as long as I have my $25 VLC on D* which makes the regular price of Select, ARS, 3 TVs $73.99/mo for me I will stay put. If I did switch to AT&T TV I would just subscribe to Epix Now because of Epix Drive-In and since Osprey supports Epix Now. I would get Movies Extra Pack with AT&T TV because I enjoy it on D*. HBO is included with my wireless plan regardless of provider so no worries there.

To be completely honest if AT&T TV Now had A&E, AMC, Discovery, Food Network, History and ID in the Max package and I wasn't getting HBO as part of my wireless plan with AT&T I would gladly keep the Max package at $80/mo as those are the only channels I need that it was missing.

*Full Detailed Review
0. Introduction (this may recap my first impression post)*
For the purpose of review of the AT&T TV device (aka C71KW / Osprey) I had to subscribe to AT&T TV Now to use the box. Currently AT&T has the box on lock so you need either an active AT&T TV or AT&T TV Now account to use the AT&T TV device. For the purpose of review I chose the *Max* base package at $80/mo because it had a good mix of entertainment, sports and premiums for me to try out.

I also got a free month of Epix to try out after going to the "Account Details" section of my AT&T TV Now account and selecting "View promotions and offers". So if you still have AT&T TV Now I recommend clicking on that button and paying attention to any blue notification bars that appear at the top could land you some goodies. 

I have 2 TVs that are 1080p Full HD SDR sets and 1 720p HD SDR set so I couldn't test out the 4K HDR capabilities of the AT&T TV device (here-on referred to as Osprey.) My Internet speed is 300 Mbps download / 20 Mbps upload which is more than enough for the service.

AT&T recommends 8 Mbps download for each stream (3 max) so any plan that is lower than 25 Mbps could result in lower quality video and performance. If you have a household of at least 3 members that would make full use of the 3 concurrent streams plus any other streaming services (like Netflix) or gaming (PC or console) I would personally recommend 75-100 Mbps depending on activity for optimal streaming.

Going forward I'm going to refer to the AT&T TV device as Osprey.

*1. Technical Specifications*
Information provided from the official manual at AT&T and Android TV Guide. The beta version of Osprey I received has 6.3GB available to the user for additional apps (I found this under App Storage.) I didn't see anywhere else in the system menus about storage. This could mean the version AT&T is releasing has more storage available to the consumer or 9.7GB is reserved for the operating system, AT&T TV app and future updates. See Android TV Guide's page for a link to some Geekbench scores from April/May 2019.

*Model:* C71KW-XXX (200 for Samsung produced models, 400 for WNC produced models)
*Android TV version:* 8.0 (Oreo)
*Operator Tier:* Yes
*System on a Chip:* Broadcom BCM7271
*CPU:* Quad-core 1.6 GHz (ARM Cortex-A53)
*GPU*: Broadcom VideoCore V HW (V3D-520)
*RAM:* 2GB DDR memory / 64 bit DDR3/DDR4 interface
*Storage:* 16GB eMMC
*Video and Audio*: MPEG2, Dolby Audio, MPEG-4 AVC single or dual display up to 1080i60/1080p30 or UHD/4K, HEVC / VP9 display, HDR10 SMPTE ST 2084, ST 2086 Blu-ray
standard and HLG support
*TV Compatibility*: Compatible with HD and 4K TVs with HDMI 2.0 & 1.4, HDCP 2.2, 60 Hz and capable of 4K, 1080p and 3D
*Remote Control Support*: IR Remote Control Interface, RF Remote Control Interface
*2. Basic Information*
The primary interface is the AT&T TV app so this will be familiar to existing AT&T TV Now subscribers who use the service on non-AT&T devices such as Apple TV (4th/5th generations), Amazon Fire TV devices and Roku devices (for those who currently have the AT&T TV app installed prior to the removal.) On non-AT&T devices the Gear icon (aka Settings) is minimal only providing basic account info, marketing preferences (i.e. Nielson ratings) and the option to sign-out. Osprey adds an "Apps" tab beside the "Discovery" tab for easy access to your apps, pre-installed apps like Netflix, Bleacher Report Live, Boomerang, DC Universe, YouTube, etc. It also provides easy access to the Google Play Store, Google Play Games, Google Play Movies & TV and Google Play Music. For an overview of common apps that are compatible with Osprey see this list.

As per the current AT&T TV device User Manual (link above) Osprey *does not support Picture-In-Picture*. Currently AT&T TV/AT&T TV Now does not support PPV of any kind.

If you would like to purchase/rent movies this can be done through Google Play Movies & TV, Vudu, Redbox, etc. Because Google Play Movies & TV, FandangoNow, YouTube and Vudu are participating Movies Anywhere retailers any movie purchased from them from studios like Walt Disney studios, Universal Pictures studios, Sony Pictures studios and Warner Bros. studios can be linked to a Movies Anywhere account and streamed through those apps or the Movies Anywhere app.

If you purchased movies from Amazon Video, iTunes or any other Movies Anywhere retailer that is not supported by Osprey if you link those accounts to your Movies Anywhere account you can view those purchases on Osprey via supported MA retailers or the Movies Anywhere app. ESPN+ is supported on Osprey so any sports related PPV events ESPN+ has can be purchased through them. Osprey also supports DAZN.

*3. The Remote*
I wish AT&T would make a similar remote for D* because I honestly love the revised remote they are now distributing with Osprey. The form factor is like the love-child between the D*'s Universal Remote and the Genie Remote. The Vol +/- and Ch +/- buttons are very similar to the Genie Remote but without the loud audible clicking noises but the tactile feeling when pressing the buttons are still there. The remote has a light black-light (can't be turned off) which is nice and comes in handy when using it in the dark.

*4. Google Assistant*
Osprey supports Google Assistant which comes in handy when searching for programs or tuning to a specific channel. You can also use Google Assistant to tell you the weather, check your Google calendar, search for news, etc. Depending on the apps installed Goggle Assistant can search for titles within installed apps that support the feature. You can even tell Goggle Assistant to go to a live channel (like ESPN) while watching Netflix and it will take you there. You can also ask it to open any installed app and it works very quickly I love being able to ask Google Assistant to open Spotify for example. 

One point you need to be very clear when using channel names sometimes it may confuse Epix with FX. 

The only issue I have with Google Assistant is occasionally it will take it a few seconds to close an app and return to AT&T TV/Now. I have ran into a few instances where it may glitch and the AT&T TV/Now app may need to reload. The quickest way I've found to exit an app is by pressing the "Home" button and it will close the app and take you back to AT&T TV/Now quickly. Outside of this Google Assistant works very well and I'm sure with future updates/optimizations AT&T could fix this small issue.

So far I'm very surprised by the integration of Google Assistant and prefer it over the Alexa skill for DirecTV HR44+. If I want to go to a channel directly I just tell Google Assistant this will be something I will miss when I go back to using D* exclusively. 

*5. Bulit-in Google Chromecast*
Since this is powered by Android TV it has built-in Chromecast which is nice. I casted a few things from my Google Chrome browser and had no issues. I also tried casting something from a few apps like Disney+ from my iPhone XR and it worked as well. Although if I had an Android powered device like a smartphone or tablet I could have experimented more but my iPhone only tends to play well with the Apple TV. Although I would recommend playing YouTube videos directly from the app instead of casting them as the YouTube app has a higher quality video than just casting.

*6. Osprey with AT&T TV/Now*
So the AT&T TV/Now service works very well on Osprey! It is quick, fluid and responsive just like in some of the YouTube videos we have seen so far. Pretty much the beta Osprey device with AT&T TV Now worked just like how it did in this video. AT&T TV Now has channel numbers just like AT&T TV when using Osprey the guide just doesn't show channels you are not paying for (which is 100% accurate versus D*'s Channels I Get ).

I love how quickly I can scroll through the Guide on AT&T TV Now via Osprey its like when I use my HR44 just buttery smooth. My C41Ws are beyond the pale when compared to Osprey in that the C41Ws are laggy as hell then want to pause and play catch-up with the button presses. 

So people on D* with older clients (or older receivers like HR34 that run slow) will love this. U-Verse TV subscribers who make the jump to AT&T TV will love this as well.

*7. Cloud DVR vs Hardware DVR*
Pro here is you can record as many shows with AT&T TV/Now as you want at the same time with no conflicts. Hardware DVR you have to employ tuner management which is a bummer if you want to record 6 shows but only have an HR44/54. U-Verse TV subscribers are limited both on hardware and internet speed so if they have Internet 25 they can't have too many simultaneous recordings. The pro for the Hardware DVRs is the recordings stay until you delete them (or you run out of room if you have that feature enabled.)

Setting a show to record via the AT&T TV app is easier and quicker than the D* app. Since the D* receivers have to be connected to get the command from the app there can be issues in the event there is a problem with the internet (or power) at home and you are trying to schedule a recording via the D* app.  The AT&T TV app does not have this drawback since everything is in the cloud.  You can also stream your recordings out of home on AT&T TV/Now whereas on D* you need to download them to your device.

*8. On Demand/72 Hour Rewind/Restart*
AT&T TV/Now has a leg up on its big brother D* with On Demand. Previously in 2016 this didn't work very well but in 2020 it is a different story. I dare say AT&T TV/Now is 100% better than D* On Demand. All episodes work on AT&T TV/Now whereas D* has some issues (i.e. TBS shows are often brought up with D*). Some shows have complete seasons on AT&T TV/Now but missing episodes on D*. (Although for some shows both AT&T TV/Now and D* have the same episodes so that is a hit and miss with AT&T TV/Now.) AT&T TV/Now On Demand loads way quicker than D* On Demand in general. It only took me 5 seconds to load the most recent episode of Miracle Workers: Dark Ages whereas D* took about 30 seconds (and that box is hardwired to my router!) 

Restarting a show/film in progress is also quicker on AT&T TV/Now versus D* so I'm at a loss here for this.  Instead of D*'s "Missed It? Watch It Now" category for the 72 Hour Rewind programs AT&T TV/Now just lists the latest episode with its respective show.

*9. Trickplay*
This is where D* can shine with its full screen display as you rewind or fast-forward shows up to 4x speed either way. AT&T TV/Now via Osprey provides a preview pane similar to YTTV (however this feature is not available on Apple TV or Amazon Fire devices.) 

The 1x and 2x speeds on Osprey are quicker than their equivalent on D* Genie hardware. Both D* and AT&T TV/Now via Osprey share a common thing when at 4x speed when you hit "Play" the progress bar will actually advance about ~20 seconds ahead so this could cause you to RW at 1x speed if you overshot the end of a commercial break. In my testing 2x speed for Osprey was very quick and accurate whereas on D* I tend to use 3x more often.

AT&T TV/Now supports quick skip so on non-AT&T devices this works in 15 second increments. (A single backpress is 15 seconds double backpress is 30 seconds, etc.) On Osprey this works a bit differently:

Live TV: Pressing the left directional arrow once will go back 15 seconds, press twice for 30 seconds, etc. Pressing the right directional arrow once will advance 30 seconds at a time or until it has caught up with live TV.
Recorded/On Demand: Each press either way is 15 seconds, double press for 30 seconds, etc. I was able to go as high as 5 presses will get you 75 seconds (I quit after 5 presses.)
72 Hour/Restart: You can go backwards but can't skip forwards as fast-forwarding is disabled on those programs just like on D*.
*10. Picture Quality*
Again this also has improved since the ill-fated launch of late 2016  I temporarily moved my 2nd TV into my living room to do a side-by-side comparison of the two services. I was able to compare FS Ohio HD during a hockey game since D* gave me FS Ohio as a complimentary service a few weeks after downgrading my package.

*Fox Sports Ohio*: AT&T TV/Now has this channel as a full time 720p HD channel whereas D* only shows first run events in HD rest in SD. So I watched a full NHL Hockey game on both AT&T TV Now w/Osprey and on D* w/HR44. I didn't notice any different between the two services the picture quality looked exactly the same to me when watching both TVs side by side at a normal viewing distance. Even getting up close I didn't notice a difference.
*Syfy*: Next test was watching SyFy for about 30 minutes (they had an ep of Futurama on.) Syfy was picked as it is a 1080i Full HD channel. Again I didn't notice any difference when watching the two side by side.
*Boomerang*: Picked as it was one of the few SD channels I had access to on both services. This wasn't a fair comparison since the channel was window-boxed on AT&T TV/Now and I had to use my TV's native zooming feature to get rid of the extra black bars. However still looked better than D*.
*CNBC World*: This was the other SD channel I had access to and it was in widescreen SD on AT&T TV/Now so I could watch both side-by-side with no black bars. AT&T TV/Now does have better PQ on SD channels than D* does. (My original 2nd option was QVC2 however AT&T TV/Now has this in Full HD while D* has this in SD so I had to scrap that idea. The other shopping channel just looked awful on both services.)
*Miracle Workers*: (Season 2, Episode 2) - This was picked as the Cloud vs Hardwire DVR test. Again no noticeable difference here both looked the same to me.
*Miracle Workers*: (Season 1, Episode 1) - Chosen as the On Demand test here I was able to notice a small, subtle difference. It wasn't bad or degraded the actual video but I was able to tell the Osprey was upscaling to 1080i. When I pulled up Osprey's System Info screen my suspicion was confirmed as AT&T TV Now's On Demand version was 720p despite TBS' linear feed being in 1080i. Since the Genies can't do native anymore I couldn't use that to see if D* On Demand was the same. I plan on reconnecting my HR24 later this week, putting it on native and re-watching this episode to see if the version of this episode on D* On Demand is just like its AT&T TV Now On Demand counterpart.
*11. Channels, Packages and Price*
So this is where AT&T TV and AT&T TV Now vary. The strong suite for both services is that in certain areas these services are the OTT leaders in regional sports especially in Chicago where AT&T has both NBC Sports Chicago and Marquee Sports Network.

AT&T TV will have the most robust lineup of channels but at a cost.

AT&T TV Now is missing some key channels from key groups in its base Plus and Max packages however there is no single OTT provider targeting cord-cutters/cord-nervers that has the full suite of top channels. So it really depends on what you want and mixing & matching to get the full suite.

As of 2/15/20 the regular price for AT&T TV is the 2019 D* prices so AT&T TV currently has some automatic savings built in there after the 12-month introductory offer ends. AT&T TV also has customers purchase equipment not lease it so there is no ongoing equipment charges either. Based on non-promo rates an existing D*/U-Verse TV can save $18-$20 per month. (Except those on U-450 they will pay $0.50/mo based on regular rates.)

(Both DirecTV and U-Verse TV are using their "All-Included" pricing structure which includes the base package of channels, HD, DVR, WH-DVR and the first TV.)
**AT&T TV Now sells the same packages as AT&T TV without any promotions, contracts or hardware included under the "Other Packages" tab. However the AT&T TV Now versions do not charge a monthly RSN fee.










On a side note the AT&T TV app w/Osprey has a "channel 192" which serves as an in-guide launch pad to the Netflix app. 

*12. Conclusion*
AT&T TV Now (formally DirecTV Now) has done a lot of growing in 3 years and can be considered a worthy alternative to its big brother DirecTV if the Plus or Max packages happen to suit your needs or if you were planning on getting HBO and Philo alongside another streaming service.

Since AT&T TV and AT&T TV Now are sharing the same app and infrastructure AT&T TV will be good for those wanting a traditional MVPD experience but with modern features. Those who move and loved D* but can't get it due to things like No Line of Sight will be happy with AT&T TV and Osprey as an alternative (if they have good Internet.)

Using AT&T TV Now w/Osprey for a full week I did notice a small spike in my data usage but it wasn't nothing to be concerned about. Binge watching a season of a show via D* On Demand actually uses more data than a full 8 hour day of watching AT&T TV Now via Osprey.

If I couldn't have my D* I would defiantly go with AT&T TV over any traditional MVPD. AT&T just needs to keep on their toes about updating Osprey, improving switching from apps back to AT&T TV and working with Google on refining and optimizing Google Assistant.

Hate to say it but for U-Verse TV at least it looks like curtains when this goes national I just don't see them continuing to sell U-Verse TV once AT&T TV goes nationwide.

*AT&T TV device (C71KW/Osprey)* I give it 3.5 out of 5 stars: Get Hulu and Amazon Prime Video and fix the minor issues above and this would be a 4.5 out of 5 stars.

*AT&T TV Now* I give it 4 out of 5 stars which is dramatic improvement over its past. I can't ding it too much on the channels issue as we currently don't have an vMVPD that as a robust lineup of channels from all major groups. If it adds the major channels from A+E Networks, AMC Networks, Discovery, and some pro-sports without a major price increase I would rate it a 4.5 out of 5 stars.

[Last edited 2/18/20 mistake in table AT&T U-Verse TV's max broadcast fee is $7.99]


----------



## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> Meant to post this earlier but I was a bit busy Friday. Overall I was actually impressed that AT&T managed to produce a decent TV device. Overall I've been quite pleased and surprised with Osprey in its current form sure it has some drawbacks (what doesn't) but it is an impressive piece of kit.
> 
> If I was paying regular price for D* Select (currently $62.99), ARS ($15) and 3 TVs ($21) which would be $98.99/mo I would defiantly make the jump to AT&T TV and get Entertainment which is $93/mo (also the new customer perks for the first year would push me there too.) However as long as I have my $25 VLC on D* which makes the regular price of Select, ARS, 3 TVs $73.99/mo for me I will stay put. If I did switch to AT&T TV I would just subscribe to Epix Now because of Epix Drive-In and since Osprey supports Epix Now. I would get Movies Extra Pack with AT&T TV because I enjoy it on D*. HBO is included with my wireless plan regardless of provider so no worries there.
> 
> To be completely honest if AT&T TV Now had A&E, AMC, Discovery, Food Network, History and ID in the Max package and I wasn't getting HBO as part of my wireless plan with AT&T I would gladly keep the Max package at $80/mo as those are the only channels I need that it was missing.


Wow, very thorough review! Thanks for taking the time to evaluate and write this up!

As for my earlier question, what I meant was this: If you disregard prices and channel availability (i.e. assume that they would be exactly the same between AT&T TV and DirecTV), which service would you choose? When you factor in everything else -- hardware, UIs, feature sets, etc. -- which do you like better, AT&T TV or DirecTV?


----------



## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> Wow, very thorough review! Thanks for taking the time to evaluate and write this up!
> 
> As for my earlier question, what I meant was this: If you disregard prices and channel availability (i.e. assume that they would be exactly the same between AT&T TV and DirecTV), which service would you choose? When you factor in everything else -- hardware, UIs, feature sets, etc. -- which do you like better, AT&T TV or DirecTV?


Your welcome it was actually very fun tbh  I would ultimately chose AT&T TV over any traditional MVPD in all honestly. Through all my testing any feature I wanted to use in or out of home with the AT&T TV app just worked without any extra actions needed and that's what I like. (One of the reasons I stay with iPhone, iPad and Apple TV lol) I dread having to use the D* app sometimes because I know at a some point it will kick back with an error or two just to upset me.

I had no problems with the UI and in all honestly its actually better than D*'s. I loved having the channel logos in the guide and AT&T TV's logos seem to be constantly up to date unlike D*'s. Also AT&T TV has proper logos for Epix 2 and Epix Hits unlike D*'s channel banner which just has a generic typeface right now.

It was also nice having those traditional pay-TV features like dedicated channel numbers and channel surfing available alongside the modern features like streaming apps, Spotify, etc. Not having to constantly change inputs when I wanted to stream something was a huge bonus. I haven't watched a lot of Hulu and Amazon Prime Video since the launch of Disney+ and right now I have a free month of CBS All Access so I've been using those apps for the most part and having them on Osprey was so cool since I didn't have to switch inputs.

For me the only downside is the lack of hardware DVR. I will always prefer a hardware DVR but I the new Cloud DVR they rolled out is very good so I wouldn't mind sacrificing the hardware DVR in favor of the Cloud DVR for all the other features the service provides.


----------



## NashGuy

techguy88 said:


> AT&T just needs to keep on their toes about updating Osprey, improving switching from apps back to AT&T TV and working with Google on refining and optimizing Google Assistant.


I'm not necessarily expecting it but it's possible that AT&T will at some point upgrade the Osprey from Android TV 8 to either 9 or 10 (which were released by Google in 2018 and 2019, respectively). The focus of those two recent updates to Android TV has mainly been optimization to work better on lower-powered devices, such as smart TVs, as opposed to new user-facing features or UI changes. Not that the Osprey is a low-powered device; Geekbench scores indicate that it's about as powerful as the current-gen Fire TV Stick 4K, IIRC. But running a newer, better optimized version of the OS might make it perform a bit smoother with regard to app-switching, accessing Google Assistant, etc.


----------



## techguy88

NashGuy said:


> I'm not necessarily expecting it but it's possible that AT&T will at some point upgrade the Osprey from Android TV 8 to either 9 or 10 (which were released by Google in 2018 and 2019, respectively). The focus of those two recent updates to Android TV has mainly been optimization to work better on lower-powered devices, such as smart TVs, as opposed to new user-facing features or UI changes. Not that the Osprey is a low-powered device; Geekbench scores indicate that it's about as powerful as the current-gen Fire TV Stick 4K, IIRC. But running a newer, better optimized version of the OS might make it perform a bit smoother with regard to app-switching, accessing Google Assistant, etc.


If they are committed to the long term viability for the platform they will eventually have to update to a newer version of Android TV. The fact they launched with 8.0 (Oreo) is very good considering at the time of Pie's release in 2018 most Android TV devices and TV sets were still running 7.x (Nougat). Oreo will ensure the device keeps getting updates for the long term. I wouldn't be surprised if it gets updated to 9.0 (Pie) now if AT&T would skip Pie and go straight to 10 for the next major update that would shock me.

Looking at Android TV Guide's listing of NA Pay-TV operators Android TV devices it looks like the upcoming WOW! tv+box will use similar specs and the Operator Tier will release with Pie which is good. This means AT&T should be able to update Osprey to Pie without issue. Most European devices using the Operator Tier are also on Pie which is good. So far I haven't seen any device on Android TV Guide for the US/EU market on 10. Although Nvidia Shield TV seems to be the best one at keeping up with Android TV updates as it started with 5.1 Lollipop and currently runs 9.0 Pie.


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## b4pjoe

Will the remote that comes with the AT&T TV box work with the AT&T TV app on a TV where the AT&T TV box is not at? Or does the remote only work with the AT&T TV box?


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## techguy88

b4pjoe said:


> Will the remote that comes with the AT&T TV box work with the AT&T TV app on a TV where the AT&T TV box is not at? Or does the remote only work with the AT&T TV box?


The remote that comes with the AT&T TV device only works with AT&T TV devices.


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## LTYRS

techguy88 said:


> The remote that comes with the AT&T TV device only works with AT&T TV devices.


Is the remote IR or RF?


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## LTYRS

LTYRS said:


> Is the remote IR or RF?


Never mind I found out it's both.


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## techguy88

LTYRS said:


> Never mind I found out it's both.


Sorry I missed your question I was away for a few days and I've been trying to catch up. IR for controlling the TV / RF for controlling the AT&T TV device. Although they made pairing the remote easier with the AT&T TV device by pressing and holding down the RW/FF buttons during the setup process. I never did like the D* Genie remote method of the Mute + Enter buttons as they were too far apart.


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## LTYRS

Nothing to be sorry about, you are doing a fantastic job reviewing this box, thank you!


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## techguy88

LTYRS said:


> Nothing to be sorry about, you are doing a fantastic job reviewing this box, thank you!


 Your welcome and thank you for the kind words 



techguy88 said:


> Tennis Channel is now part of AT&T TV Now's Max package. Marquee Sports has been added for those who are in territory. (The C71KW has a bug where you can ask Google Assistant to take you to a channel number of an RSN the AT&T TV/TV Now supports however you will get a blackout message.)
> 
> No other channels were added to AT&T TV Now's Max package.


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## rey_1178

techguy88 said:


> Sorry I missed your question I was away for a few days and I've been trying to catch up. IR for controlling the TV / RF for controlling the AT&T TV device. Although they made pairing the remote easier with the AT&T TV device by pressing and holding down the RW/FF buttons during the setup process. I never did like the D* Genie remote method of the Mute + Enter buttons as they were too far apart.


So sounds like you can't use the Harmony Elite remote with this device?


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## techguy88

rey_1178 said:


> So sounds like you can't use the Harmony Elite remote with this device?


I don't have a Harmony Elite remote so I can't comment on that. I just know you can't use the included remote with non-AT&T TV devices. The AT&T device accepts IR and RF signals and the included remote with the AT&T TV device communicates via RF just like D*'s Genie remotes with compatible D* Genie receivers & clients. So it is possible to use a third party remote with the AT&T TV device I just haven't tested it since I don't have third party remotes.


----------



## techguy88

techguy88 said:


> View attachment 30364


So I will be updating this chart but in further testing with the built-in Chromecast function I can confirm you can cast anything from Hulu and Amazon Prime Video to the AT&T TV device since both of those apps support Google Chromecast. So for anyone wandering "how will AT&T TV succeed without Hulu and Amazon Prime Video" until native app support is enabled treat the device as a Google Chromecast.


----------



## techguy88

If there is any apps you would like me to try with the Chromecast feature that is not supported for the AT&T TV device natively let me know before March 8, 2020 and I will try them. HBO GO/Max GO will not cast to the AT&T TV device however the majority of their content is included via AT&T TV/TV Now On Demand. My next app to try is Xumo.

Apple TV+ does not support Chromecast only Apple's proprietary AirPlay service. So there is no support for Apple TV+/iTunes at all for AT&T TV device/Chromecast.


----------



## Steveknj

techguy88 said:


> So I will be updating this chart but in further testing with the built-in Chromecast function I can confirm you can cast anything from Hulu and Amazon Prime Video to the AT&T TV device since both of those apps support Google Chromecast. So for anyone wandering "how will AT&T TV succeed without Hulu and Amazon Prime Video" until native app support is enabled treat the device as a Google Chromecast.


Maybe you covered this already, but, since this is an Android box, couldn't you just download the AP and Hulu apps from the Play Store? Or is there some restriction to doing that? I don't have an Android based TV or streaming box so I was curious as those apps exist in other Android platforms like phones and tablets.


----------



## gio12

mjwagner said:


> I have seen no evidence that suggests that a majority, or even a large number, of YTTV subscribers get their broadband from Google. In fact I would bet that the majority of YTTV subscribers get their broadband from someone other than Google.


Yep, COMCAST


----------



## techguy88

Steveknj said:


> Maybe you covered this already, but, since this is an Android box, couldn't you just download the AP and Hulu apps from the Play Store? Or is there some restriction to doing that? I don't have an Android based TV or streaming box so I was curious as those apps exist in other Android platforms like phones and tablets.


The Google Play Store restricts you from downloading apps that are flagged as not compatible. However if the app supports Google Chromecast you CAN cast the app to the AT&T TV device as if it was a Google Chromecast


----------



## techguy88

****Supported App List Update****​
So I forgot to test out the built-in Google Chromecast feature the first time around when I made the first app list. So if an app isn't compatible with the AT&T TV device (or Android TV in general) but supports Google Chromecast then you CAN cast the app's content to the AT&T TV device since it has a built-in Chromecast! 

I tried this with Amazon Prime Video, Hulu, Britbox and Xumo and they all worked flawlessly! If you subscribe to Amazon Prime Channels you can cast them through the Amazon Prime Video app to the AT&T TV device as well and there is no restrictions. 

Only apps like *Stirr* which doesn't support the AT&T TV device and doesn't support Google Chromecast can't be used with the AT&T TV device at all. 

*Note*: HBO Go, HBO Now and Max Go currently can't be used at all with the AT&T TV device (these are the only exception.)  I reached out to my friends that work at AT&T O&O stores and call center about this and here is what they said. As per their internal guidance there are some technical issues with these three apps in regards to the AT&T TV device. For the time being the apps show as "not compatible" in the Google Play store while the technical issues are worked out and casting will not work. As soon as the issues are fixed users can download the apps to the AT&T TV device currently there is no ETA. 

*Workaround:* However like I said in my earlier review the On Demand content for both HBO and Cinemax available through AT&T TV / AT&T TV Now is very robust and most of what is available on HBO Go, HBO Now and Max Go is available on HBO On Demand and Cinemax On Demand. It's very rare you will need to use another device to access HBO Go and/or Max Go to watch something on those apps not available on HBO On Demand or Cinemax On Demand. 

*TL;DR: *Use the built-in Google Chromecast feature for Hulu, Amazon Prime Video, Britbox and Xumo.  Use HBO On Demand and Cinemax On Demand until technical issues are resolved with HBO Go and Max Go.


----------



## rey_1178

Received the C71KW box yesterday. Got the harmony remote to work with it in 5 minutes. Aside from the brutal price spike in the 2nd year of the contract, I feel ATT is going to miss out on something that could've been great. I say this because this device is under-powered. Either that or something is inefficient about the software. @techguy88 does it improve as the days go by? At this point I hope it can at least run ATT TV at a good pace and forget about running any of the apps. Too much lag and a couple of times the box rebooted on it's own when trying out the apps. The device gets you close to the experience of having a real DVR at home and a major improvement over the app on the apple tv 4k. I would've gladly paid for a device with similar horsepower as a Nvidia Shield.

The other thing has to do with recording a series. I set it to record only new episodes and it records everything and from every channel showing the series. I'm not sure if the guide is listing these shows as all new. I'll have to look at that again. Is the guide info from Gracenote?


----------



## techguy88

rey_1178 said:


> Received the C71KW box yesterday. Got the harmony remote to work with it in 5 minutes. Aside from the brutal price spike in the 2nd year of the contract, I feel ATT is going to miss out on something that could've been great. I say this because this device is under-powered. Either that or something is inefficient about the software. @techguy88 does it improve as the days go by? At this point I hope it can at least run ATT TV at a good pace and forget about running any of the apps. Too much lag and a couple of times the box rebooted on it's own when trying out the apps. The device gets you close to the experience of having a real DVR at home and a major improvement over the app on the apple tv 4k. I would've gladly paid for a device with similar horsepower as a Nvidia Shield.
> 
> The other thing has to do with recording a series. I set it to record only new episodes and it records everything and from every channel showing the series. I'm not sure if the guide is listing these shows as all new. I'll have to look at that again. Is the guide info from Gracenote?



Glad the Harmony Remote is compatible! I've been looking at getting a Harmony Remote and trying it out tbh.
From what I can tell it records all episodes once past and present there isn't a way to set for new episodes only. I've tried but pressing the red button once records 1 episode pressing it twice records all episodes it finds.
After first boot it will be a little slow for a while especially if it is downloading and installing updates in the background. Once it is fully updated the AT&T TV/TV Now service runs buttery smooth (at least with the device I bought and the one that was given to me this week.) It will improve within a day.
In all honestly the TV I've been using the AT&T TV device w/AT&T TV Now on I will be sad at the end of the week when I go back because the C41W is way more under-powered and lags no matter what.

If you switch between apps in rapid succession it will bog down the device (similar to other Android TV devices that have similar specks, Rokus and Amazon Fire TV Sticks) causing it to lag for a while and cause the AT&T TV app to eventually reboot itself (I believe I mentioned that one in my review).
I have no idea where the guide data comes from lol


----------



## B. Shoe

Enjoying all of the review and conversation. Keep it up, guys.


----------



## Rich

techguy88 said:


> From what I can tell it records all episodes once past and present there isn't a way to set for new episodes only. I've tried but pressing the red button once records 1 episode pressing it twice records all episodes it finds.


There is nothing on any menu that lets you pick between "new" and "repeats"? What you describe above is the same thing that happens when you program a normal DVR but the menu items allow you a choice.

Rich


----------



## Rich

B. Shoe said:


> Enjoying all of the review and conversation. Keep it up, guys.


Yes, this is a better thread than we could have hoped for.

Rich


----------



## rey_1178

Rich said:


> There is nothing on any menu that lets you pick between "new" and "repeats"? What you describe above is the same thing that happens when you program a normal DVR but the menu items allow you a choice.
> 
> Rich


Yes there is. I'll post a pic in the morning. I'll say after 24 hours the box is working much better.


----------



## techguy88

Rich said:


> There is nothing on any menu that lets you pick between "new" and "repeats"? What you describe above is the same thing that happens when you program a normal DVR but the menu items allow you a choice.
> 
> Rich


It organizes them by season and episode numbers with the oldest at the bottom of the list and the most recent at the top similar to D*'s Genie. I tested that out by having it record all episodes of _Chicago Med_ and _Futurama_.


----------



## swyman18

Just curious, has anyone ordered the service and device online or did you get the it from a retail store? I ordered the service on Monday but haven’t received a shipping confirmation yet for the device. 

My account was activated fine with the package selected and I’ve been using it via the app on my Apple TV. So far, it’s been working fairly well.


----------



## rey_1178

swyman18 said:


> Just curious, has anyone ordered the service and device online or did you get the it from a retail store? I ordered the service on Monday but haven't received a shipping confirmation yet for the device.
> 
> My account was activated fine with the package selected and I've been using it via the app on my Apple TV. So far, it's been working fairly well.


I ordered it online. Good reward cards for doing so. It should've shipped by now so contact them today.


----------



## rey_1178

rey_1178 said:


> Yes there is. I'll post a pic in the morning. I'll say after 24 hours the box is working much better.


Here's the pic showing an option to record new episodes only but it's not working properly. This would be great when it's fixed.


----------



## swyman18

rey_1178 said:


> I ordered it online. Good reward cards for doing so. It should've shipped by now so contact them today.


Yeah, I contacted them and they have no clue. They couldn't find any indication of whether it has shipped or not.

They already charged me for the first month of service, so looks like the 14 day "grace period" clock has already started. I'll give it another few days and then if no device ships, then I'll tell them to cancel the account and I'll start over by signing up at a retail store. I probably should have just done that originally.


----------



## Rich

swyman18 said:


> Yeah, I contacted them and they have no clue. They couldn't find any indication of whether it has shipped or not.
> 
> They already charged me for the first month of service, so looks like the 14 day "grace period" clock has already started. I'll give it another few days and then if no device ships, then I'll tell them to cancel the account and I'll start over by signing up at a retail store. I probably should have just done that originally.


I saw something like that in a post the other day and wondered how they could do that. I would think if you to to a store and sign up you'd get the box right away. Or could they screw that up too? ATT never seems to have it's **** together no matter what they try to do. You/we should get the box at the time we sign up.

Rich


----------



## rey_1178

Could it be that many folks singed up, more than they anticipated? I find that hard to believe but maybe there are others with similar plans like mine to get out the 2nd year, unless ATT renegotiates and I also love the service.


----------



## Rich

rey_1178 said:


> Could it be that many folks singed up, more than they anticipated?


Sure. Think these nitwits actually have a plan? Certainly sounds like, once again, ATT throwing something against the wall, seeing if it sticks. Spit-balling in real life.

Rich


----------



## swyman18

rey_1178 said:


> Could it be that many folks singed up, more than they anticipated? I find that hard to believe but maybe there are others with similar plans like mine to get out the 2nd year, unless ATT renegotiates and I also love the service.


I stopped into my local store yesterday and they said they have not sold one yet, lol.

I mentioned to them that I haven't received my shipment confirmation yet and they said if I wanted I could call to cancel that account, and they could sign me up in store and they have the devices there. But yeah, sounds like I would be the guinea pig for them, since I would be their first.

I know I'm taking a gamble with this service, I just want to be able to get out before the ETF kicks in if it all goes haywire and it takes them forever to get me a device.


----------



## techguy88

rey_1178 said:


> Here's the pic showing an option to record new episodes only but it's not working properly. This would be great when it's fixed.
> View attachment 30414


I feel like an idiot now rofl all this time I've been pressing the red button twice to record series which by default records all episodes.  I didn't think to press the "..." button then Record to get to that option ROFL


----------



## Rich

techguy88 said:


> I feel like an idiot now rofl all this time I've been pressing the red button twice to record series which by default records all episodes.  I didn't think to press the "..." button then Record to get to that option ROFL


You can change the way the programs are recorded when you do the double click on the Record button in the menu. You can opt for All or First run.

Rich


----------



## swyman18

One thing I don't like is there seems to be no way to view a list of your current series recordings. If you want to cancel a series recording, then you have to search for the show specifically and then select Cancel Series. But you would have to specifically search for that show. It would be nice to see a list of current series recordings that are setup so you can then manage them accordingly.


----------



## rey_1178

techguy88 said:


> I feel like an idiot now rofl all this time I've been pressing the red button twice to record series which by default records all episodes.  I didn't think to press the "..." button then Record to get to that option ROFL


But to be fair it's still recording all episodes. I don't see where in the guide it would show info on if the episodes are showing new status or not. I can't tell. Bottom line is it doesn't work but hopefully it will soon.


----------



## rey_1178

swyman18 said:


> One thing I don't like is there seems to be no way to view a list of your current series recordings. If you want to cancel a series recording, then you have to search for the show specifically and then select Cancel Series. But you would have to specifically search for that show. It would be nice to see a list of current series recordings that are setup so you can then manage them accordingly.


Also the ability to extend time on recordings for live events.


----------



## rey_1178

In case anyone wants an additional box for a room, this is a decent price on ebay AT&T C71KW-400 DirectTV NOW Streaming Player Black 607376634251 | eBay


----------



## swyman18

Thanks for the eBay link, I may actually order one considering ATT can’t seem to figure out how to ship one to me.


----------



## Rich

swyman18 said:


> One thing I don't like is there seems to be no way to view a list of your current series recordings. If you want to cancel a series recording, then you have to search for the show specifically and then select Cancel Series. But you would have to specifically search for that show. It would be nice to see a list of current series recordings that are setup so you can then manage them accordingly.


That would be annoying but every time a new app or service comes online there are glitches like this. Gotta give them time to fix all the little things.

Rich


----------



## Rich

rey_1178 said:


> Also the ability to extend time on recordings for live events.


You can't pad a recording? That would really be a problem.

Rich


----------



## Rich

rey_1178 said:


> In case anyone wants an additional box for a room, this is a decent price on ebay AT&T C71KW-400 DirectTV NOW Streaming Player Black 607376634251 | eBay


How much is ATT selling them for?

Rich


----------



## rey_1178

Rich said:


> That would be annoying but every time a new app or service comes online there are glitches like this. Gotta give them time to fix all the little things.
> 
> Rich


I hope they do because so far I'm leaning towards staying with the service at least the first year.


----------



## lparsons21

Rich said:


> How much is ATT selling them for?
> 
> Rich


$120


----------



## lparsons21

Rich said:


> You can't pad a recording? That would really be a problem.
> 
> Rich


I thought I read somewhere that you could pad a recording. Can't remember where though.


----------



## rey_1178

Rich said:


> You can't pad a recording? That would really be a problem.
> 
> Rich


 To me it's ok on most recordings but gotta have it for live events like sports etc.



Rich said:


> How much is ATT selling them for?
> 
> Rich


 ATT is selling them for $120 plus tax.


----------



## b4pjoe

Rich said:


> You can't pad a recording? That would really be a problem.
> 
> Rich





lparsons21 said:


> I thought I read somewhere that you could pad a recording. Can't remember where though.


I think it was said somewhere that it automatically ads to the recording for live events that exceeds its expected stop time.


----------



## swyman18

Regarding the “New Episodes” series selection. I think I read somewhere that new episodes won’t show up under Upcoming Recordings until 2 days prior to airing. That bugs me a little bit, but I guess I can live with it. 

But it does seem strange how it handles the New flag in the guide. For example, on Monday I recorded episode 3 of Better Call Saul and watched it and deleted it on Tuesday. But the guide had a rerun of that episode on Thursday still flagged as New so it recorded it again. Episode 4 on Monday still doesn’t have the New flag in the guide. I assume it will by tomorrow. 

Not sure if these little things will ever change, because I assume this is the same behavior that has existed with DirectTV Now/ATT Now over the past few years.

I was hoping the series recording options would be a little smarter, along with not flagging reruns as New in the guide.


----------



## Rich

rey_1178 said:


> To me it's ok on most recordings but gotta have it for live events like sports etc.


That's what bothers me. I always stick an extra 3 hours on every sports event. Just in case. I'm having a hard time imagining life without my DVRs.

Rich


----------



## Rich

b4pjoe said:


> I think it was said somewhere that it automatically ads to the recording for live events that exceeds its expected stop time.


Right, forgot that. Wonder how well that would work?

Rich


----------



## rey_1178

Rich said:


> Right, forgot that. Wonder how well that would work?
> 
> Rich


I'm going to test it tonight with some basketball games.


----------



## Rich

rey_1178 said:


> I'm going to test it tonight with some basketball games.


Anticipating the answer, I am.

Rich


----------



## swyman18

I have another question for those that have used the device, apologies if I missed it. 

Does the remote have system on/off capabilities? Meaning being able to toggle power for the TV and AVR in addition to the device?


----------



## rey_1178

swyman18 said:


> I have another question for those that have used the device, apologies if I missed it.
> 
> Does the remote have system on/off capabilities? Meaning being able to toggle power for the TV and AVR in addition to the device?


When I press the off button it also turns off my AVR.


----------



## swyman18

rey_1178 said:


> When I press the off button it also turns off my AVR.


Cool, thanks.


----------



## rey_1178

Let me add that while the box works really well with ATT TV, it has issues running apps. I get crashes, reboots etc. Unfortunately this is not a replacement for your streaming device. It could've been but the software is inefficient. The hardware seems to have enough horsepower.


----------



## rey_1178

Does it bother anyone the ethernet port is only 10/100?


----------



## lparsons21

rey_1178 said:


> Does it bother anyone the ethernet port is only 10/100?


It shouldn't since you'd never exceed those speeds streaming video.


----------



## swyman18

Looks like my Roku Ultra has 10/100. My Apple TV and Nvidia Shield appear to be gigabit. 

Haven’t really given it much thought, although I would prefer 10/100 wired over wireless if possible.


----------



## rey_1178

swyman18 said:


> Looks like my Roku Ultra has 10/100. My Apple TV and Nvidia Shield appear to be gigabit.
> 
> Haven't really given it much thought, although I would prefer 10/100 wired over wireless if possible.


Yes for sure. I have all these devices hardwired.


----------



## swyman18

Finally got my ATT TV device today. After putting it through the paces tonight, there is one thing related to the audio that bugs me:

There are 2 settings for audio, Stereo Only and Surround Sound, as expected. I have it set to Surround Sound since I use an AVR. 

I noticed that for any content that is 2.0 stereo, the device appears to still be outputting it to my AVR as 5.1. So my AVR doesn’t know it is a 2.0 stream and it funnels the sound to only the L+R speakers, nothing at all on the center channel. That makes it sound kind of crappy. The app on my Apple TV (and the way pretty much every other app and device works) will automatically recognize it is a 2.0 stream and output it as such so my AVR can do its Pro Logic mix or whatever else is needed to simulate the surround sound. 

Anybody else seen this? It seems like a fundamental defect of sorts for it to behave this way. If I change the setting to Stereo Only, then it behaves as it should for 2.0 content. But then of course I don’t get any DD5.1 on channels that have it. But I would almost rather leave it on Stereo Only and live with the fake surround for all content then have to keep changing the setting back and forth.


----------



## techguy88

rey_1178 said:


> Let me add that while the box works really well with ATT TV, it has issues running apps. I get crashes, reboots etc. Unfortunately this is not a replacement for your streaming device. It could've been but the software is inefficient. The hardware seems to have enough horsepower.


I didn't have any issues with the apps themselves they worked just fine for me. The switching from the app back to AT&T TV Now was my main criticism. I didn't like the load time going back from the app to AT&T TV Now. (Apple TV is my main streaming device.) I did experience some crashes and reboots but they were infrequent and random during my testing. I usually had crashes and reboots when registering apps where I was opening too many within a short amount of time.

It could be something to do with Android 8.0 in general as Android 9.0 was more optimized across the board (for mobile devices 9.0 optimized battery consumption for example). There are devices with the same specifications as the AT&T TV device running Android TV 9.0 so I'm thinking once AT&T upgrades the device to 9.0 it should help with a lot of issues.

I do know my Amazon Fire TV Stick that I got on sale from Best Buy however is very slow, sometimes unresponsive and crashes frequently. According to Amazon's own specifications its running a modified version of Android 5.1 with 1 GB of RAM.



rey_1178 said:


> Does it bother anyone the ethernet port is only 10/100?


Never thought to check considering on my 1080p TV sets the AT&T TV device and Apple TV (4th Gen) had the same PQ hardwired.


----------



## techguy88

swyman18 said:


> Finally got my ATT TV device today. After putting it through the paces tonight, there is one thing related to the audio that bugs me:
> 
> There are 2 settings for audio, Stereo Only and Surround Sound, as expected. I have it set to Surround Sound since I use an AVR.
> 
> I noticed that for any content that is 2.0 stereo, the device appears to still be outputting it to my AVR as 5.1. So my AVR doesn't know it is a 2.0 stream and it funnels the sound to only the L+R speakers, nothing at all on the center channel. That makes it sound kind of crappy. The app on my Apple TV (and the way pretty much every other app and device works) will automatically recognize it is a 2.0 stream and output it as such so my AVR can do its Pro Logic mix or whatever else is needed to simulate the surround sound.
> 
> Anybody else seen this? It seems like a fundamental defect of sorts for it to behave this way. If I change the setting to Stereo Only, then it behaves as it should for 2.0 content. But then of course I don't get any DD5.1 on channels that have it. But I would almost rather leave it on Stereo Only and live with the fake surround for all content then have to keep changing the setting back and forth.


I don't have an AVR so I couldn't test that function.


----------



## rey_1178

Rich said:


> Anticipating the answer, I am.
> 
> Rich


Well, the first game I checked is missing the last 4 minutes. I thought yesterday how what was mentioned above would work. The guide info will not change to know the game has passed its window so unless it automatically adds time to live events this won't work. Bad news there. For now I'll just record the event scheduled to follow a game until they add this feature. Hopefully they'll add it.


----------



## I WANT MORE

For those that actually have the box.
Are you able to receive out of market RSNs or just the ones specific to your market?
Is there a "sports pack" where you can get all of the RSNs?


----------



## swyman18

I WANT MORE said:


> For those that actually have the box.
> Are you able to receive out of market RSNs or just the ones specific to your market?
> Is there a "sports pack" where you can get all of the RSNs?


Only RSN's in my market. I wish there was a sports pack similar to DirecTV.


----------



## I WANT MORE

Three things are holding me back.

The uncertainty of the product.
No Sports Pack.
No integration of "off air" antenna.


----------



## techguy88

I WANT MORE said:


> For those that actually have the box.
> Are you able to receive out of market RSNs or just the ones specific to your market?
> Is there a "sports pack" where you can get all of the RSNs?


My one month of AT&T TV Now has ended and I can no longer access the box without a subscription. With AT&T TV & AT&T TV Now there is no sports pack you get the RSNs based on your billing address zip code. The RSNs available match what you would get on D* when available.

Currently there is no sports pack like on D*.


----------



## techguy88

I got a Jetstream Android TV device from Walmart to replace my slow *** Amazon Fire TV stick for my bedroom TV (testing the damn Osprey got me hooked on a few Android TV features.)

Anyway the remotes that come with the AT&T TV device can be paired with other Android TV devices and function properly. However some buttons (like Guide, List, ... , Ch +/-, dash) won't work (this may vary on device) the diamond button which is used for the apps menu on the AT&T TV device has other functions in other apps (i.e. in the Sling TV app it will bring up the top info bar and the bottom bar to pause the program during live TV)


----------



## rey_1178

I WANT MORE said:


> Three things are holding me back.
> 
> The uncertainty of the product.
> No Sports Pack.
> No integration of "off air" antenna.


If ATT TV gets more support for TVE, the channels DVR app would be a great solution. Won't fix #2 but I have to imagine these things are coming to the service as it's suppose to replace Uverse and Directv.


----------



## rey_1178

Rich said:


> Anticipating the answer, I am.
> 
> Rich


This member says it worked for him. Not sure why it didn't work for me. AT&T TV - Extended Recording for Sports


----------



## rey_1178

All of a sudden some of my scheduled series recordings have stopped recording everything on every channel showing the series and are only recording new episodes on said channel.


----------



## Ken776

How long do you have to return the device & stop service if you're not happy?


----------



## rey_1178

Ken776 said:


> How long do you have to return the device & stop service if you're not happy?


14 days


----------



## rey_1178

I don't remeber if it was here where someone asks how long a buffer when pausing live tv. I confirmed yesterday it is an hour.


----------



## I WANT MORE

Has anyone that actually has the box taken it to a different market?
If so, what locals did you receive?
Has anyone tried to use a VPN?


----------



## bill buckner

Anyone else experiencing slow speeds while connected by ethernet? When i'm connected with an ethernet cord my speeds are around 20 Mbps, and when connected by wifi it's around 150 Mbps. I switched cords with my apple tv which pulls down my normal speed of around 215 Mbps and that still didn't make a difference on the C71KW box.


----------



## rey_1178

bill buckner said:


> Anyone else experiencing slow speeds while connected by ethernet? When i'm connected with an ethernet cord my speeds are around 20 Mbps, and when connected by wifi it's around 150 Mbps. I switched cords with my apple tv which pulls down my normal speed of around 215 Mbps and that still didn't make a difference on the C71KW box.


No sorry, I'm actually pulling the max in for the 10/100 port on this thing.


----------



## LTYRS

I WANT MORE said:


> Has anyone that actually has the box taken it to a different market?
> If so, what locals did you receive?
> Has anyone tried to use a VPN?


Good questions, if I had the box would like using a VPN around NFL season.


----------



## B. Shoe

Just curious how the box/AT&T TV service is still going for those that are subscribing? Any new details or changes that can be shared would be great!


----------



## rey_1178

After a month of use one of the things I am noticing is that there's a limit of amount of recordings per series. The limit is 31 episodes. Maybe this was mentioned before and I missed it but don't like that limitation.


----------



## KoRn

Does anyone know how to factory reset the remote clearing the codes out for tv/sound bar? I can’t find a way to clear the codes out of the remote. Also. How to use the remote in RF mode?


----------



## Rich

KoRn said:


> Does anyone know how to factory reset the remote clearing the codes out for tv/sound bar? I can't find a way to clear the codes out of the remote. Also. How to use the remote in RF mode?


IIRC, and I'm gonna do this from memory, hold the Select button and the Mute button down until you see two flashes on the remote and then put 981 in on the keyboard of the remote. That should totally reset the remote...IIRC.

Rich


----------



## KoRn

Rich said:


> IIRC, and I'm gonna do this from memory, hold the Select button and the Mute button down until you see two flashes on the remote and then put 981 in on the keyboard of the remote. That should totally reset the remote...IIRC.
> 
> Rich


I don't see a select button? You mean the OK button? I have the RC28V remote which I guess is the latest remote. I just signed up for service a couple weeks ago and received the new equipment directly from AT&T TV.

***EDIT***

I tried using the OK button. Nothing happening....


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## Rich

KoRn said:


> I don't see a select button? You mean the OK button? I have the RC28V remote which I guess is the latest remote. I just signed up for service a couple weeks ago and received the new equipment directly from AT&T TV.
> 
> ***EDIT***
> 
> I tried using the OK button. Nothing happening....


I was talking about D* remotes. What remote are you wanting info about?

Rich


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## KoRn

I am talking about the remote that comes with the AT&T TV internet streaming box.


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## techguy88

rey_1178 said:


> After a month of use one of the things I am noticing is that there's a limit of amount of recordings per series. The limit is 31 episodes. Maybe this was mentioned before and I missed it but don't like that limitation.


I did not notice that limitation and I had it recording all episodes of Futurama during the month I had AT&T TV Now + Opsrey. 



KoRn said:


> Does anyone know how to factory reset the remote clearing the codes out for tv/sound bar? I can't find a way to clear the codes out of the remote. Also. How to use the remote in RF mode?





Rich said:


> IIRC, and I'm gonna do this from memory, hold the Select button and the Mute button down until you see two flashes on the remote and then put 981 in on the keyboard of the remote. That should totally reset the remote...IIRC.
> 
> Rich





KoRn said:


> I don't see a select button? You mean the OK button? I have the RC28V remote which I guess is the latest remote. I just signed up for service a couple weeks ago and received the new equipment directly from AT&T TV.
> 
> ***EDIT***
> 
> I tried using the OK button. Nothing happening....





Rich said:


> I was talking about D* remotes. What remote are you wanting info about?
> 
> Rich


@Rich he is referring to the remote that comes with the AT&T TV device/Osprey. However the steps to initially pair the AT&T TV remote to the device is similar to pairing a Genie remote to a Genie (44+) Receiver and Client but the button combination is different.

To pair an AT&T TV remote with the device you press and hold the RW and FW buttons. The blue light at the top will illuminate indicating it is in pairing mode.

To change TV / soundbar codes & settings after initial setup is done through the settings menu. This procedure applies to any device running Android TV OS (i.e. Nvidia Shield TV) however devices using the Operator Tier (i.e. AT&T TV device) follow their own steps to get to this setting.

(Bear with me here keep in mind I was only conducting a month long trial so after my 1 month subscription to AT&T TV Now was over I cancelled the service and I have my devices boxed up. So this next part I'm doing from memory.)

To change your TV / soundbar setup press the Home button to bring up the AT&T TV menu.
Press > button to navigate to the Gear icon then press the OK button. Give it a few seconds the settings screen should load.
Scroll down to (I can't remember which one exactly) either "Preferences" or "General" then you should see the "Remotes & devices" option 
Once in the Remotes & devices sub-menu you will see your TV and the Soundbar. This is where you can change settings (i.e. Volume to control the TV instead of Soundbar), remove the Soundbar / TV or change the Soundbar / TV.


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## KoRn

techguy88 said:


> I did not notice that limitation and I had it recording all episodes of Futurama during the month I had AT&T TV Now + Opsrey.
> 
> @Rich he is referring to the remote that comes with the AT&T TV device/Osprey. However the steps to initially pair the AT&T TV remote to the device is similar to pairing a Genie remote to a Genie (44+) Receiver and Client but the button combination is different.
> 
> To pair an AT&T TV remote with the device you press and hold the RW and FW buttons. The blue light at the top will illuminate indicating it is in pairing mode.
> 
> To change TV / soundbar codes & settings after initial setup is done through the settings menu. This procedure applies to any device running Android TV OS (i.e. Nvidia Shield TV) however devices using the Operator Tier (i.e. AT&T TV device) follow their own steps to get to this setting.
> 
> (Bear with me here keep in mind I was only conducting a month long trial so after my 1 month subscription to AT&T TV Now was over I cancelled the service and I have my devices boxed up. So this next part I'm doing from memory.)
> 
> To change your TV / soundbar setup press the Home button to bring up the AT&T TV menu.
> Press > button to navigate to the Gear icon then press the OK button. Give it a few seconds the settings screen should load.
> Scroll down to (I can't remember which one exactly) either "Preferences" or "General" then you should see the "Remotes & devices" option
> Once in the Remotes & devices sub-menu you will see your TV and the Soundbar. This is where you can change settings (i.e. Volume to control the TV instead of Soundbar), remove the Soundbar / TV or change the Soundbar / TV.


How do I remove the sound bar?


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## techguy88

KoRn said:


> How do I remove the sound bar?


I can't remember how to exactly (I no longer have the service) but you go into the settings and the option should be under the remote sub-menu. It should give you the option there IIRC.


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## KoRn

I see no option to remove it. Picture attached.


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## Rich

KoRn said:


> I am talking about the remote that comes with the AT&T TV internet streaming box.


Yeah, that dawned on me in the middle of the night. Sorry for the confusion.

Rich


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## techguy88

KoRn said:


> I see no option to remove it. Picture attached.


Ok I was able to workaround the login screen and get to the settings menu without having to reactivate my AT&T TV Now account. (I hate how they have these devices locked to where you need an AT&T TV or AT&T TV Now account to use them )

So once a soundbar is programmed there is no way to clear it completely unless you want to perform a factory reset of the AT&T TV device. (I'll explain a bit more on that below.) You can however disable certain settings so the AT&T TV remote control won't control the soundbar.

*Disable TV/soundbar (without factory reset of AT&T TV device)*

Go to Settings then "Remote & Devices"
Select "Program Your Remote"
Scroll to "Advance Remote Programming"
Select "Switch Volume Control" to "None" (if you don't want the remote to control any volume from TV and Soundbar) or "TV" (if you want the remote to control TV volume)
Check "HDMI-CEC Volume Control" if that is on switch to "Off" (especially if the soundbar is the only device programmed to remote.)
Check "Power Off Devices" if that is on then switch to "Off"
Now the remote will only control the AT&T TV device and not your TV/soundbar.

*(This bit below applies to Android TV devices in general so this is not AT&T's fault)*

If you are dead set on removing the TV/soundbar completely you will have to perform a factory reset of the entire AT&T TV device / Android TV device as the codes for TV and soundbars seem to be stored on the Android TV device themselves and sent to the paired remote when needed. (Don't ask me how or why I have no clue.)

I found this out by accident when I unplugged my Nvidia Shield TV while cleaning. The Shield TV was unplugged for 12 hours and when I went to watch a movie I tried turning on the Shield TV and my TV with the Shield remote (like I normally do) but nothing happened.

My TV didn't turn on at all. After I figured out the Shield TV was unplugged I plugged it back in and turned my TV on manually and waited for it to reboot. After the Android TV home screen loaded I tested the remote out by pressing the power button to turn both the Shield TV and my TV off and it worked.

I can also confirm the AT&T TV device and remotes work in a similar manner. I never took the batteries out of my AT&T TV remote (which I should have now that I think about it) but where my AT&T TV device has been unplugged for over a week the AT&T TV remote didn't want to control anything. It didn't want to mute my TV, change volume, etc. The blue light kept staying on with each button press (I'm guessing it was searching for the AT&T TV device.)

After I plugged in the AT&T TV device and it got to the login screen to input my credentials I could turn the AT&T TV device and my TV on & off with the AT&T TV remote. Change volume, mute my TV and change inputs with my AT&T TV remote again.

AT&T TV remotes can be paired with other Android TV devices. (They work well with Nvidia Shield TV devices  )


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## KoRn

techguy88,

Awesome post! Thank you all for helping. I finally got the problem resolved. Btw. Even a factory reset could not resolve it. AT&T employee posted the fix on their forums. No way would I or anyone else could have figured it out imo. I could be wrong. Any ways here you go.


When the remote control is programmed with the TV or Speaker System, you may toggle ON/Off, the ability to use the TV keys:

Volume
Input


Turn ON/Off the TV or Speaker System, with the AT&T TV device
Enabled by default.


To disable toggle Off the setting.When disabled the you need to use the TV or Speaker System remote control to: Change the volume.
Change the Input on the TV. 


Turn On/Off their programmed device. 


When toggled Off the programming is removed for the TV/Speaker System to the remote control.



After this, you should be able use another remote with the device. Let us know if this helps.

Sound bar is now gone and code cleared. Whew!


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## b4pjoe

techguy88 said:


> Ok I was able to workaround the login screen and get to the settings menu without having to reactivate my AT&T TV Now account. (*I hate how they have these devices locked to where you need an AT&T TV or AT&T TV Now account to use them* )


So does that mean if you get AT&T TV and cancel after one year the AT&T box becomes a brick where you can't use it as just a stand alone streaming box to watch content on other streaming services that you have installed on the box?


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## techguy88

b4pjoe said:


> So does that mean if you get AT&T TV and cancel after one year the AT&T box becomes a brick where you can't use it as just a stand alone streaming box to watch content on other streaming services that you have installed on the box?


Pretty much yus. Until AT&T decides to unlock them they become a glorified Chromecast in the event you cancel AT&T TV. The remotes however have other useful purposes on other Android TV based devices.


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## rey_1178

rey_1178 said:


> After a month of use one of the things I am noticing is that there's a limit of amount of recordings per series. The limit is 31 episodes. Maybe this was mentioned before and I missed it but don't like that limitation.


Last thing I'll add to this thread. I need to correct this post. One of my series went past the 31 episode mark so it seems this isn't an issue.


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## dhkinil

I have set the box up on my Samsung tv's with one minor issue, it thinks it is D* box and when I turn off the TV the samsung remote turns off the box, but will not turn it on. I might be able to fix this if I knew who makes the box.


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## Tork

I have an Osprey box that is stuck in Beta mode. Never updates to the new software...I have factory reset it to no avail several times.
It seems to update to the last beta software and works but some things are incomplete.
Netflix not in the guide and you also cant download it, DVR in older beta mode....shows Beta in upper left corner when you go to home button.
Any ideas???
Thanks


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## techguy88

Tork said:


> I have an Osprey box that is stuck in Beta mode. Never updates to the new software...I have factory reset it to no avail several times.
> It seems to update to the last beta software and works but some things are incomplete.
> Netflix not in the guide and you also cant download it, DVR in older beta mode....shows Beta in upper left corner when you go to home button.
> Any ideas???
> Thanks


Honestly I won't have any idea the beta Osprey boxes I received off of eBay were already updated and had Nexflix in the guide and even updated themselves to add HBO Max at launch without me needing to do anything. Tbh the folks over at the AT&T TV Now sub-reddit might be of more assistance with this kind of issue.


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## Tork

techguy88 said:


> Honestly I won't have any idea the beta Osprey boxes I received off of eBay were already updated and had Nexflix in the guide and even updated themselves to add HBO Max at launch without me needing to do anything. Tbh the folks over at the AT&T TV Now sub-reddit might be of more assistance with this kind of issue.


Thanks for the response.
It's kinda weird ...I have another Osprey box which updated fine.


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## Tork

Tork said:


> Thanks for the response.
> It's kinda weird ...I have another Osprey box which updated fine.


Success....the worlds most stubborn AT&T Osprey Beta Box has updated to AT&TVNow with full functionality,

I will summarize the methodology below hopefully to help some others unravel this mystery of the absurd. But first some shout-outs to a couple of posters that helped, I had to combine their suggestions to get this to go.

Many thanks!

What didn't work (at least on it's own): Resets, restarts, 10 restarts, 5 restarts, 15 restarts, WiFi, Hard-wired Lan, even tethered to my AT&T phone 5GE and a normal router and a mesh network at my house. Probably some other things didn't work also.

The methods:

1. Different location/Different network (went to my daughters house, even though she has the same router as me) Hard-wired.

2. Reset /restart still no go. Reboot method - hold red button until globe appears....with no words (NO "resetting your device", No "Powered by Android", No Nothing just the globe. Mine happened after 8X red button restarts and never happened before...so the the number is random depending on your beta box or the weather. Just gotta catch it.

3. Got message "Connecting to the Network" with a update bar that started moving (got excited) and then stopped dead at 20%. for 20 minutes. What did I have to lose...hit red button 1X....she came up and said "downloading updates". (This could be important)

4. Finished downloading updates (about 10 minutes) and immediately went to installing updates. Completed and rebooted itself!

5. The Beta Box then happily updated itself, paired my remote, signed me in...then updated the box to match my account and my other normally updating and functional Beta Box.

Trust me... I tried everything 15 times with no joy....the above sequence worked on the first try.

Hope this helps some of you with the same issue!


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## techguy88

Tork said:


> Success....the worlds most stubborn AT&T Osprey Beta Box has updated to AT&TVNow with full functionality,
> 
> I will summarize the methodology below hopefully to help some others unravel this mystery of the absurd. But first some shout-outs to a couple of posters that helped, I had to combine their suggestions to get this to go.
> 
> Many thanks!
> 
> What didn't work (at least on it's own): Resets, restarts, 10 restarts, 5 restarts, 15 restarts, WiFi, Hard-wired Lan, even tethered to my AT&T phone 5GE and a normal router and a mesh network at my house. Probably some other things didn't work also.
> 
> The methods:
> 
> 1. Different location/Different network (went to my daughters house, even though she has the same router as me) Hard-wired.
> 
> 2. Reset /restart still no go. Reboot method - hold red button until globe appears....with no words (NO "resetting your device", No "Powered by Android", No Nothing just the globe. Mine happened after 8X red button restarts and never happened before...so the the number is random depending on your beta box or the weather. Just gotta catch it.
> 
> 3. Got message "Connecting to the Network" with a update bar that started moving (got excited) and then stopped dead at 20%. for 20 minutes. What did I have to lose...hit red button 1X....she came up and said "downloading updates". (This could be important)
> 
> 4. Finished downloading updates (about 10 minutes) and immediately went to installing updates. Completed and rebooted itself!
> 
> 5. The Beta Box then happily updated itself, paired my remote, signed me in...then updated the box to match my account and my other normally updating and functional Beta Box.
> 
> Trust me... I tried everything 15 times with no joy....the above sequence worked on the first try.
> 
> Hope this helps some of you with the same issue!


Wow! Thanks for the info can't believe that damn box was suborn to update. I will save this info in the event I decide to migrate to AT&T TV or AT&T TV Now since I still have 2 beta boxes I got off eBay lol.


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## Tork

dhkinil said:


> I have set the box up on my Samsung tv's with one minor issue, it thinks it is D* box and when I turn off the TV the samsung remote turns off the box, but will not turn it on. I might be able to fix this if I knew who makes the box.


Just noticed this post.
It's a made by Samsung box most likely.....although I have heard there is another mfg.

Actually, if you go into remote settings of the Osprey box you can setup your TV and speaker system/receiver to turn on/off as well as volume control even if it does not setup automatically, it will show you all the mfgs.

I just did it recently....might be a new feature that rolled with an update.

I don't remember seeing all those options in the past.

I have an old Samsung Plasma, a Mitsubishi rear Projection TV and a 21 year old Kenwood Surround Receiver all working perfectly with the Osprey remote!

One remote one button on and off and sound control.

One note: The sound on the Samsung Plasma TV did not initially work with the osprey remote.....it did turn on and off after I set it up manually and the box seemed to find the code....had to toggle the CEC setting on and off.....and then the sound control worked magically!
Another AT&T mystery feature.


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## mjwagner

Tork said:


> Just noticed this post.
> It's a made by Samsung box most likely.....although I have heard there is another mfg.
> 
> Actually, if you go into remote settings of the Osprey box you can setup your TV and speaker system/receiver to turn on/off as well as volume control even if it does not setup automatically, it will show you all the mfgs.
> 
> I just did it recently....might be a new feature that rolled with an update.
> 
> I don't remember seeing all those options in the past.
> 
> I have an old Samsung Plasma, a Mitsubishi rear Projection TV and a 21 year old Kenwood Surround Receiver all working perfectly with the Osprey remote!
> 
> One remote one button on and off and sound control.
> 
> One note: The sound on the Samsung Plasma TV did not initially work with the osprey remote.....it did turn on and off after I set it up manually and the box seemed to find the code....had to toggle the CEC setting on and off.....and then the sound control worked magically!
> Another AT&T mystery feature.


I would hope their boxes remote would be able to do that. It's sort of "jacks or better to open" functionality for streaming boxes.


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## Steven Kornreich

Is there anyway to turn off HDR/DeepColor on the Osprey box? I just started using it with my LG TV set and the Color looks really bad, color temp is off, etc. It seems to be because of “deep color” / HDR
Any advice?


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## compnurd

Steven Kornreich said:


> Is there anyway to turn off HDR/DeepColor on the Osprey box? I just started using it with my LG TV set and the Color looks really bad, color temp is off, etc. It seems to be because of "deep color" / HDR
> Any advice?


No. It is a bug with Android TV. Google needs to fix it


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## Steven Kornreich

compnurd said:


> No. It is a bug with Android TV. Google needs to fix it


It's weird, all the whites in my picture have a very warm cast. Bummer.


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## compnurd

Steven Kornreich said:


> It's weird, all the whites in my picture have a very warm cast. Bummer.


You should be able to adjust your LG to tone it down


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## swyman18

I find that as long as the box triggers the HDR flag on my Sony TV, then it looks fine. But sometimes I will notice the colors are off and the picture is washed out like others have reported. In those instances, I notice the HDR flag didn’t trigger on my TV. I have to either reboot the box, or turn off/on my AVR to get it to look normal again. 

I read somewhere that it might be possible to use an HDMI splitter with a scaler switch to force the box to think my TV is only 1080p. Kind of cumbersome, but I may give it a try. I don’t use the box for any of the apps, so I don’t care about trying to get 4K/HDR on this thing.


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## harperhometheater

Steven Kornreich said:


> It's weird, all the whites in my picture have a very warm cast. Bummer.


We had a similar issue with the HDFury Dolby Vision LLDV mod. It had a red push (warm) issue initially. We were able to alleviate it by making sure the TV was in its BT2020 color gamut mode instead of DCI-P3. You may want to check that on your display. Your Osprey may be sending BT2020 with its SDR to HDR conversion and processing but your TV could be in P3 mode.


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## Steven Kornreich

As I continue to evaluate ATT TV Now I have noticed many of times where my picture quality varies between and episodes I assume i may start off at 1080 then it throttles to 720 then bumps back up. Very frustrating as I have a 100mb fiber internet connection and i have the Osprey box direct connect via Ethernet and not WiFi. Is what I am experiencing Norma?


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## rey_1178

Anyone here experiencing video breakups on many channels? Haven't seen this crap since being on xfinity and it's been happening for a week now. Internet has been fine.


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## compnurd

rey_1178 said:


> Anyone here experiencing video breakups on many channels? Haven't seen this crap since being on xfinity and it's been happening for a week now. Internet has been fine.


nope


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## techguy88

rey_1178 said:


> Anyone here experiencing video breakups on many channels? Haven't seen this crap since being on xfinity and it's been happening for a week now. Internet has been fine.





compnurd said:


> nope


I no longer have AT&T TV Now so I can't answer this. However I've been making use of the box for streaming apps on my 4th TV since they enabled former customers to use the apps only and they are working fine.


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## lparsons21

rey_1178 said:


> Anyone here experiencing video breakups on many channels? Haven't seen this crap since being on xfinity and it's been happening for a week now. Internet has been fine.


I'm seeing it on the ads only but not the actual shows.


----------

