# Larger Dish for 129 works!



## TechnoCat (Sep 4, 2005)

I've been fighting the Voom channels dropping out for quite a while. I live north of Seattle, surrounded by very tall trees, in the clouds-and-precip convergence zone. The dishes are mounted on a large tree stump because we simply cannot get satellite at the house, but even so, 129 is pretty low.

Normal numbers were running 30 for 129 on Kung Fu and 34 on Monster, dropping by six or so in a storm or when an asteroid sneezes. So I broke down and had the 20" replaced with a 30". Done by a professional, to save me time and because I don't have the tools or expertise. Yeah, it costs more, but an hour later the 30 was a 52 and the 34 was a 53. Well above the danger line, and above what we get for transponder 7 on 110 (i.e. TNT-HD, HD-Net.) Transponder 4 on 110 comes in at 65; not sure why the difference.

I'm glad it worked. But unclear why EchoStar doesn't simply use larger dishes out here to start with.


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## tedb3rd (Feb 2, 2006)

You answered your own question when you mentioned, "Yeah, it costs more..."
( - :


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## skull791 (Sep 14, 2007)

just a quick question. what kind a dish did you use ?


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## dclaryjr (Mar 11, 2007)

Yep, a large dish will work for 129 here as well, and I could get my RSN in HD. But I can't get Dish to do it and there's not enough content to move it up my budget priority.


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## TechnoCat (Sep 4, 2005)

skull791 said:


> just a quick question. what kind a dish did you use ?


I could go check, but it looks pretty generic. I didn't concern myself with a brand. Just a single (i.e. round, not oval) 30". I can't imagine there's much a specific model could do to improve on that.


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## levibluewa (Aug 13, 2005)

and the install was professionally done and free. After enduring a year-and-a-half of drop-outs; it's great! I also get USAHD, FXHD, SCIFIHD, SPIKEHD, SMITHSONIANHD, MGMHD, CARTOONHD, just to name a few!


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## cpdretired (Aug 25, 2003)

levibluewa said:


> and the install was professionally done and free. After enduring a year-and-a-half of drop-outs; it's great! I also get USAHD, FXHD, SCIFIHD, SPIKEHD, SMITHSONIANHD, MGMHD, CARTOONHD, just to name a few!


Dish Network HD is the topic of discussion. Since Dish does not provide these channels how do you receive them?


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## jclewter79 (Jan 8, 2008)

He is obviously a D* person just showboating.


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## clarkbaker (Sep 23, 2006)

Hi Technocat.. 

When you use a large dish.. it reflects 'more signal' into that LNB helping to overcome the issues you mentioned. (low horizon, sneezing astorioids, precipitation). As you correctly surmised it does cost more however.

I once heard a 'radio telescope' engineer who worked for UC Berkeley Radio Telescope Astronomy Dept. tell me that you can get a CB signal on the dark side of the moon if your 'dish' is big enough. Seem clear to me that is true given your description.

I think one of things Dish could do is market bigger dishes for those tougher customers.. or folks with 'treed' or challanged locations. The installers often just show up with a dish 1000.. expecting it to work out here in the Far West and then just saying 'nope' won't work.. when it can with just a 'little' specialized off the shelf equipment. 

I have a friend that installed a old school 'BIG DISH' (5ft or 6ft) with his 'BIG' Dish setup up in Oregon.. and he can pick off 61.5 at like 70!!! Keep in mind he had to make some modifications to that setup.. but it sure worked. It was the equivelent to Big Ben ringing when it hit that Sat Signal meter!

I've heard of interest setups in Alaska and Canada where the signals are very weak and often, transponders are not pointed at directily at them at all. Nothing quite like getting a bigger dish to push the limits. If there is somebody looking for this setup.. check out the dbstalk vendor links.. there are satillite dealers that sell 30" and bigger setups that are 'non-dish' equipment but can be fairly easily converted to work with any dish system for those tougher signal situations. It takes a little time and study.. but the principle is very simple.

Glad to hear the good news.

Clarkbaker


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

Bigger dishes are more expensive, and everyone wants everything for free. By not officially offering them in most markets, the people who REALLY want one will bear the costs involved, which is how it should be.

Besides, there are already enough problems with people complaining about bigger and multiple dishes. Most people don't WANT a second dish, much less a larger second dish.


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## mikep554 (Feb 14, 2007)

I had a similar issue, and I'm up north of Seattle. The channels I got from 129 would all drop out about every 30 - 45 minutes. Couldn't even record an hour-long show, much less a movie, without losing signal in the middle.

Three installers came out, replaced everything from the LNBs to the 622 receiver multiple times, including cables and connectors. No change in the problem.

The solution sounds wacky, but the supervisor that Dish eventually sent out said that NW Washington is on the edge of the 129 beam, which is aimed to cover as much of the US as possible. He pointed my HD dish over to 61.5, and I haven't had a problem since.

He said that Dish doesn't like to let this get out, as it means customers in NW Washington may need to have LOS to both the south for the SD dish and to the east for the HD dish, which would sink a lot of people. Also, the LOS to the east is very low on the horizon, so it is much more likely to encounter a blockage there as compared to looking high to the south-southeast.

I'm not sure if I believe his explaination 100%, but he fixed my issue, so I'm not complaining.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

mikep554 said:


> The solution sounds wacky, but the supervisor that Dish eventually sent out said that NW Washington is on the edge of the 129 beam, which is aimed to cover as much of the US as possible. He pointed my HD dish over to 61.5, and I haven't had a problem since.
> 
> He said that Dish doesn't like to let this get out, as it means customers in NW Washington may need to have LOS to both the south for the SD dish and to the east for the HD dish, which would sink a lot of people. Also, the LOS to the east is very low on the horizon, so it is much more likely to encounter a blockage there as compared to looking high to the south-southeast.
> 
> I'm not sure if I believe his explaination 100%, but he fixed my issue, so I'm not complaining.


He was essentially correct. The 129 sat is old, broken, and weak. The signal from it is poor for several reasons, but it is worse for folks up north. A replacement sat is due to be launched at the end of the year, so if all goes as planned, by early 2009, the 129 signal should be much improved.


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## Brad B (May 26, 2006)

Did you get the bigger dish (30") from Dish or other persons? Seems like it wouldn't be that hard to swap out, I've installed my Dish at other places I've lived.
Now if they would only get q13 in hd.


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## Jerry G (Jul 12, 2003)

levibluewa said:


> and the install was professionally done and free. After enduring a year-and-a-half of drop-outs; it's great! I also get USAHD, FXHD, SCIFIHD, SPIKEHD, SMITHSONIANHD, MGMHD, CARTOONHD, just to name a few!


Does this really make you feel better? Somehow, I doubt it.


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## Matt Beachy (Jun 15, 2006)

I live in northern IN (Millersburg, IN) and from the time of my initial install until today I've had problems with the 129 satellite. I had a Superdish for 110 & 119 and a regular 20" dish for 129. I had a Dish Network tech come out today to try and get my 129 signal up to an acceptable level. He played around with it awhile but could only make a very minimal improvement - signal strength of only 20 on 129 satellite, transponder 6 (home to TBS HD & Big Ten Network HD). Finally his supervisor recommended he take out the two dishes I had and put in a Dish 1000.2. That was the ticket. My signal strength jumped to 40+ on 129 transponder 6. 

Before he installed the Dish 1000.2 I had asked about simply installing a bigger dish for the 129 satellite. He had never done it and I don't think he would have had one to use.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

A second larger dish in Indiana would be a rarer install. I would not be surprised to see a DISH 500 pointed just for 129°. I'm not far from you and installed a Dish 1000 Plus (which is larger).


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## TechnoCat (Sep 4, 2005)

Brad B said:


> Did you get the bigger dish (30") from Dish or other persons? Seems like it wouldn't be that hard to swap out, I've installed my Dish at other places I've lived.


It should be very easy to swap out. I called the people who did the original installs and had them do it, simply because my time (or relaxation) for that effort is worth more than the cost of the install, considering my lack of aiming knowledge/skill. Simply put, I would never have made the time to do it, but it was easy enough to place a phone call and be around when they did it.


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## mikep554 (Feb 14, 2007)

Brad B said:


> Did you get the bigger dish (30") from Dish or other persons? Seems like it wouldn't be that hard to swap out, I've installed my Dish at other places I've lived.
> Now if they would only get q13 in hd.


No kidding! The no HD for 13 thing is killing me.

By the way Brad, I'm in Anaco as well.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=DS2077

The Winegard DS 2077 is a generic 30" dish designed to accept a D-channel (i.e., DishNetwork style) LNB.

There is also the Winegard DS 4061, a generic 24" dish designed to accept a D-channel LNB. In most locations, this would probably be plenty of gain.


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## TechnoCat (Sep 4, 2005)

24" _might_ be plenty, but if 20" wasn't, just go the distance. If it's worth kill, it's worth overkill!


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## retexan599 (Aug 1, 2006)

dclaryjr said:


> Yep, a large dish will work for 129 here as well, and I could get my RSN in HD. But I can't get Dish to do it and there's not enough content to move it up my budget priority.


I had just posted this on SatelliteGuys, but I think it may be worth repeating for this discussion, re 129 issues.

I had been having frequent signal loss with several HD channels on the 129 satellite. DISH made adjustments about a year ago, but signal strengths were always spotty. This week I asked them to come out again and see if there was a way to fix the problem permanently. The arrangement I had was a single dish with three LNB's: 110, 119, & 129. The DISH technician came out and this is what he did: 
· First, made adjustments on the roof and observed results on the TV signal strengths. 
· Agreed that my 129 readings were way too low.
· Said the old dish on the roof was an older model; asked me how long it had been up there, I told him since I moved here in early 2002; Referred to a more streamlined dish used nowadays. 
· He asked how often the problem happened, was it constant, I said yes. 
· He then recommended putting up a 2nd dish on the roof, was that ok with me, I said yes. He said he just happened to have a spare dish in his truck from another job. 
· The new dish is now aimed at their 61.5° satellite; this is now the source of my HD channels; no more flaky 129° signals! 
· He said it was very difficult to adjust the original single dish for optimum reception on all three satellites at once. With the new setup, the original dish is capturing 110 & 119; the new satellite is capturing the 61.5. 
· Reception has been excellent on all my HD channels since the installation with no signal losses. 
· There is no charge for the 2nd dish. He gave me his cell phone number in case I have problems within next 90 days. 
· When looking at signal strengths, he said to add '30 points' to get the real number, since DISH revised the display. All my numbers are in the region of 50+30 = 80 now. 
· A good experience, just wanted to share it.


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## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

I have a dual setup because I can't see 129 so I have a second ground mounted dish at 61.5. But my question is am I going to lose anything in the future that will be on 129 and not 61.5? I have the basic 100 plus locals and the HD package. Will channels be moved from 61.5 to 129 in the future and not mirrored on both sats? I don't care about sports channels.


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## levibluewa (Aug 13, 2005)

Glad you were able to hit the 61.5. That wasn't an option here. So I took the DISH installers advice and switched to Directv last November. Wish I had done it sooner. Put up with a year-and-a-half of drop-outs 2-4 x an hour for 3-6 minutes each depending on the transponder. The combination of a sat falling out of the sky and being at the edge of the footprint was a killer. Signal would go from 45-50down to 0. Oh, max signal on tp6 was 28.

Hopefully the new sat (in 2009, or ?) will have a bigger shoe!


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## racton1 (Nov 7, 2007)

audiomaster said:


> I have a dual setup because I can't see 129 so I have a second ground mounted dish at 61.5. But my question is am I going to lose anything in the future that will be on 129 and not 61.5? I have the basic 100 plus locals and the HD package. Will channels be moved from 61.5 to 129 in the future and not mirrored on both sats? I don't care about sports channels.


I hope that nothing else is moved to 129 because it is awful. I was hoping E would move programs off of 129 to a more stable sat.


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