# Bug Report L215 - Missing OTA Guide Data



## cleblanc (Dec 18, 2003)

I'm happy for the people who are now getting guide data but i am NOT. I did up until the 215 download. I subscribe to the Hartford CT locals. Now all I get on every channel is 'Local Programming' for the current time slot and 'No Information Available' after that.
I am extremely frustrated with this since I've now lost the ability to record OTA programming. I was hoping that by waiting til this morning, my guide data would be back but it's not.
I'm not sure what changes Dish made to give some people guide data but they've apparently taken it away from everyone else.


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## lujan (Feb 10, 2004)

I am still missing the OTA guide data for my local PBS station and my local ABC station, just as before the L215 download.


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## lapplegate (Jan 17, 2003)

I lost OTA guide data, for some Local OTAs, when 213 dowloaded. I now have 215 and stiil have no guide data on the same channels. 215 did nothing to fix this.


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## jergenf (Mar 31, 2005)

I always received and still receiving 'Local Programming' or 'No Information Available' in the OTA section but I excepted that because never subscribed to dish locals. What I'm now getting (with L215) is guide info in the 7634-7637 range when in All-Chan mode. They show up red of course because I don't subscribe but at least it better than before.


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## JPC (Feb 8, 2005)

Jergenf - Does that EPG info also show up on the HD locals [8-1, 10-1, 13-1, 21-1 and 31-1] or just the SD versions? As of last night, all of my local HD channels showed "local programming" and "no info". I do subscribe to locals, but I'm still trying to find out if I can dump them and retain the EPG info.


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## michaelL (Nov 30, 2004)

Ditto with the above. I lost the OTA guide (even though I subscribe to local channels) for ABC, FOX and PBS with the 213 (or was it 212).

215 did not fix the problem.


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## revenson (Feb 1, 2003)

JPC said:


> Jergenf - Does that EPG info also show up on the HD locals [8-1, 10-1, 13-1, 21-1 and 31-1] or just the SD versions? As of last night, all of my local HD channels showed "local programming" and "no info". I do subscribe to locals, but I'm still trying to find out if I can dump them and retain the EPG info.


Same for me...most channels get ota guide except for fox-hd at 13-2 and nbc hd at 05-2. This was not fixed with 215 but before 213 I had this guide info!


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## JPC (Feb 8, 2005)

I should mention that until L215, I _did _ have EPG info for local SD and HD channels and I still subscribe to the locals package.


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## HailScroob (Aug 3, 2004)

I have the same issue - the guide now says "Local Programming" on all 19 of the OTA channels, where previously 7 of those channels had guide data.


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## gunawo (Aug 17, 2004)

I only receive NBC and CBS OTA. I do subscribe to locals from E. I do have guide data on locals from E but it is not remapping to OTA channels. Always have before 215
Not a big deal as I can read the guide info from the subscribed locals if I need to
but it would be more convenient if they would remap to OTA.
All else works fine with L215


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## socceteer (Apr 22, 2005)

I was never able to receive guide data on Fox, NBC or PBS, since I downloaded L215, I am able to get Fox and NBC, but I seam to get data from PBS from time to time. I am assuming it is a PBS issue

I am so happy that they fixed this problem, no more manual recordiing


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## jgarrard (Jan 16, 2005)

I subscribe to locals, had OTA guide data for most with 211, lost all but NBC (5.01) with 212. Do not have ANY local guide data for OTA with 215. I agree that someone knows how the software is supposed to work and could explain what is happening.


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## HailScroob (Aug 3, 2004)

I followed Mark's suggestions and deleted and rescanned my locals: no OTA guide data on any channel. 

Now I've waited 24 hours since then: still no OTA guide data on any channel.

And yes, I subscribe to Dish locals (forced into it after they took away my NY Distants).


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## Martyf (Apr 8, 2004)

Before L215 my OTA subs showed the same guide information as my subscription locals. Now none of the OTA subs has any guide information other than the "Local Programming" and "No Information" defaults.

From what has been posted since L215 came out, I think Dish is now populating the guide data on a station by station basis for the OTA subs. They just don't seem to be providing information for all channels yet. This way some markets have some of the OTA channels with info, and some without. Lucky me, I live in the Quad Cities, and they seem to have no information for guide data for any of our channels.

I would suggest that rather than defaulting to "No Information" they provide the information for the subscribed channels as they used to do. Now setting up recording for OTA channels becomes an exercise in creating the timer on the subscribed channel, and then editing the timer to be on the OTA sub.

If Mark or Allen or anyone else for that matter have any information on this, please respond.


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## Guest (Jun 30, 2005)

HailScroob said:


> I followed Mark's suggestions and deleted and rescanned my locals: no OTA guide data on any channel.
> 
> Now I've waited 24 hours since then: still no OTA guide data on any channel.
> 
> And yes, I subscribe to Dish locals (forced into it after they took away my NY Distants).


I'm in the exact same condition.

It'd be nice if someone would "officially recognize" that there's a problem here!


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## cleblanc (Dec 18, 2003)

I'm glad to see another post where someone says they aren't getting any of the local stations in the guide anymore. I talked to tech product support for the 921 last night who BTW read all these posts and he thought that people were having similar problems but that I was the only one who lost all local station guide info with the 215 upgrade. We tried everything last night to get the guide data back but nothing worked. He will call me back tomorrow night to see if waiting a couple days makes a difference.
I told him it has to be either a hardware problem, the 215 software or my location (Hartford CT). What else could it be? Since other people are experiencing the same problem since 215, I'm going to rule out a hardware issue.
He also told me that he is baffled as to why people are now getting guide info when they don't subscribe to the Dish locals. He didn't think they removed that requirement. So I hope that fix is not temporary.
I am wondering why though we still haven't seen any formal release notes or a description as to this change should be working for the local EPG info.

Mark - do you have any answers?


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## TonyB (Jul 5, 2004)

Yesterday morning I called and cancelled my subscription to dish locals. As of this morning this is the status. I live near Boston MA
Under setup I enabled local station mapping.

1. under sys setup did switch check - passed OK (have 2 dishes and use SW21's)
2. Rescanned OTA analog and digital channels. (have antenna on roof)
3. OTA guide now shows "local programming" for analog stations and I cannot record anything on them
4. OTA guide now shows what seems to be correct info for digital sub channels (where does it get that from?) If it has correct program data for say 005-1 then why not analog 005?
5. I now also see the digital station showing up at its normal number and a simple "cryptic" id, - I cannot remember the exact number but lets say that 005 (WCVB) is actually in digital form on channel 23. What I now see is 005-1 and also 023.
The digital sub channels not only get EPG data but it also correctly identified the station, wheras the analog does not. eg. 004 analog has to manually be named WBZ, whereas 004-1 correctly shows up as WBZ - very odd.

What is the source of the digital station EPG?

Tonight (if nothing has changed) I will perform a full power down reboot and see if that changes anything.

There needs to be a documented process that we should ALL perform - only then will we really see s/w errors. What we need is for E* to force everybody back to a default code level - maybe have us all clean off all timers, set everything to default, then power down for 5 minutes etc etc.

Mark, could sombody that knows the box and how it works create such a set of steps? Then and only then should be be able to post bug reporst?


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## JPC (Feb 8, 2005)

Well, it's not a hardware or location issue, because I'm having a similar problem in Rochester, NY. Dish CSRs are notoriously uninformed, so unless you're able to speak with someone in Advanced Tech Support, don't even bother. Sooner or later the real scoop will be posted here, but until then.....

Anyway, here's my deal:

I _do _ subscribe to locals.
I _do _ have EPG info for the satellite SD local channels.
I do _NOT _ have EPG guide info for the OTA HD channels.

There's obviously a problem here and it would be great if Mark could shed some official light on this issue.

It would also be helpful to know if I no longer have to subscribe to the locals package to receive EPG info.


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## JPC (Feb 8, 2005)

TonyB said:


> There needs to be a documented process that we should ALL perform - only then will we really see s/w errors......Mark, could sombody that knows the box and how it works create such a set of steps? Then and only then should be be able to post bug reporst?


Great idea :righton:


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## Rory (Dec 14, 2004)

New Orleans DMA. 

I have LILs. Had EPG on OTA channels before L215, except for PBS-HD and religious channels. WIth L215, no EPG for OTA. 

Saw that another NOLA area subscriber (with 942?) was not getting OTA EPG either. Could it be that E* does not have the OTA EPG data going out the data stream?


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## dweber (Jan 11, 2005)

I am located in Plain City, Ohio and can receive both Columbus and Dayton Ohio OTA-Digital channels. I subscribed to Locals, which I receive from the 105 Satellite, so that I would receive the Guide for the Columbus OTA-Digital channels. I received the software version 2.15 download on Tuesday June 27th. With version 2.13 I received the Guide for the Columbus OTA-Digital Channels. Of course, the Guide was missing for all of the Dayton OTA-Digital channels and did not work for any of the PBS subchannels. This was expected since they would populate the OTA-Digital Guide with the same info present on the Columbus locals from satellite 105.

With version 2.15, the Guide says "Local Programming" for all of the OTA-Digital channels. I still have the correct Guide information for my Columbus Locals from the satellite.

I have done the following:
1) Deleted all of the OTA-Digital Channels and Rescanned them in.
2) Waited 24 hours.
3) Did a power cord reboot and waited 12 hours.
4) Checked the signal strength for the OTA channels (weakest is 70 Most are 100-120)

Tonight, I called Dish Technical Support. The technician claimed that version 2.15 was only a partial download and had not been activated yet. He also claimed that it is impossible to get Guide data from other DMA's and you must be subscribed to Locals to get the Guide.

My info screen shows the following:
Card Revision: DNASP103Rev302
Boot Version: 150B
Flash Version: F053
SW Version: L215HEED-N

Is it possible that DISH downloaded version 2.15 to all 921 receivers but only activated the new software on selected receivers for testing.

Or, am I listening to a DISH technician who is misinformed.

Is anyone in the Columbus, Ohio area receiving the OTA-Digital Guide?

Thank you for your service. I know I will get the correct information through you.


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## jergenf (Mar 31, 2005)

JPC said:


> Jergenf - Does that EPG info also show up on the HD locals [8-1, 10-1, 13-1, 21-1 and 31-1] or just the SD versions? As of last night, all of my local HD channels showed "local programming" and "no info". I do subscribe to locals, but I'm still trying to find out if I can dump them and retain the EPG info.


No they are NOT mapped to the local digital channel slots so I can't use the guide to schedule any events. I can obtain guide info by going to the 763X range in All-Chan mode or use the Browse feature and enter in the 763X number followed by the info button but that method only provides info for the present or next event. 
Also I believe you need to have superdish 121 (which I have) to see 763X info but I would like confirmation on that.


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## jergenf (Mar 31, 2005)

JPC said:


> Well, it's not a hardware or location issue, because I'm having a similar problem in Rochester, NY.
> 
> Anyway, here's my deal:
> 
> ...


I do NOT subscribe to Rochester, NY locals but I do receive guide data for ABC, NBC, CBS and FOX. Note: No PBS or UPN and also don't know how long this feature be remain in effect. They now show up (after L215 download) in the 7634-7637 portion of the guide as red. They are NOT mapped to the OTA section so I can't use the guide to setup any events. I believe you need 121 superdish (which I have) to obtain this info. This info is being provided by dishnetwork and not the PSIP data from the actual digital stations.

FYI: If you received a free superdish because you subscribed to locals make sure that your obligation period is over to avoid any penalty. I have 121 superdish because of German TV and pay on an annual basis.


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## JPC (Feb 8, 2005)

Jergenf - It looks likes we're in the same boat, except that I'm still paying for the locals. We're both seeing info for the SD satellite stations but it's not getting remapped to our HD OTA channels. 

I've deleted, re-scanned and re-booted....don't know what else to do.


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## bbomar (Oct 18, 2004)

dweber said:


> Is it possible that DISH downloaded version 2.15 to all 921 receivers but only activated the new software on selected receivers for testing.


I don't think that is possible. Go to your menu and select the system
information screen. If is shows L215 as the software version then that
is what you are running.

Lots of folks seem to have lost the ability to have the satellite LIL
data mapped over to the OTA channels with this software release.


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## jergenf (Mar 31, 2005)

dweber said:


> SW Version: L215HEED-N
> 
> Is it possible that DISH downloaded version 2.15 to all 921 receivers but only activated the new software on selected receivers for testing.


I agree with bbomar either you got it or you don't and your menu is showing the latest. Another test is to bring up the gray bars if there's no black borders then is doing something new. Also the overscan is worse than before which you can measure using the HDNet test pattern.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

For all who are paying Dish for your OTA guide data and after L215 are not getting it any more. I suggest you contact E* immediately and report it through their CSR route rather than just report it here. It is possible that the adv tech support may be able to re-trigger your 921 to receive the purchased guide info at their end. 
Anytime you pay for something and they do something to prevent you from receiving it as they have done to some of you, you need to call them and get it on record for your account. Don't JUST report it here. In most cases you will receive some sort of compensation is they can't correct it for you. In my experience, it always "pays" to call them and report it to your account.


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## jergenf (Mar 31, 2005)

JPC said:


> Jergenf - It looks likes we're in the same boat, except that I'm still paying for the locals. We're both seeing info for the SD satellite stations but it's not getting remapped to our HD OTA channels.
> 
> I've deleted, re-scanned and re-booted....don't know what else to do.


New update: PBS (WXXI) now shows up as 7640 in the guide. I saw this July 4th after rebooting my box. Dish is not supplying the info for the subchannels just the main analog feed (21-4). Again none of these are remapped to the OTA section so you can only see it as red in the 76XX region of the guide.
Also it appears that all five channels are transmitting at (or near) full power because I'm getting higher signal levels and less dropouts than before.


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## JPC (Feb 8, 2005)

Actually, I think what you're seeing is better behavior from the 921's OTA tuner. Channels 8-1, 10-1 and 13-1 do appear be be a little stronger, but I spoke with FOX's engineer 2 weeks ago and as of then, 31 and 21 were the only two full power stations in our area. 

I think that the 921 still has a problem with hot signals because I have frequent loss of signal from 31 and can't lock on 21 at all. I did get 21 right after the 215 download, but then I did a hard boot to try and fix the EPG re-mapping and now it's gone again.


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## jergenf (Mar 31, 2005)

JPC said:


> Actually, I think what you're seeing is better behavior from the 921's OTA tuner. Channels 8-1, 10-1 and 13-1 do appear be be a little stronger, but I spoke with FOX's engineer 2 weeks ago and as of then, 31 and 21 were the only two full power stations in our area.
> 
> I think that the 921 still has a problem with hot signals because I have frequent loss of signal from 31 and can't lock on 21 at all. I did get 21 right after the 215 download, but then I did a hard boot to try and fix the EPG re-mapping and now it's gone again.


Actually 31 and 21 are my best digital channels with a signal strength of 125 and 120. For analog it's the opposite both those channels are extremely ghosty so I removed them from the lineup once I got the 921. Channel 10 (digital) is good 95% of the time with signal ranging from 70 - 100. Channel 13 (digital) is real iffy maybe 50% reliable but it was much better in the winter and in the last few weeks. I wasn't able to even get channel 8 (digital) until a few weeks ago but it seem to be getting stronger.

On analog I have 8, 10 and 13 for backup purposes. Also I get 36, 40, 42 and 51 however 40 and 51 need to have the antenna moved to a different position if I want perfect reception.

I have a deep finge log periodic antenna with preamp but presently the antenna is too low (I'm in a valley). Planning on raising the system 20 feet with a new antenna so that I can add Buffalo and some Canadian stations to my OTA.


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Please see this thread for an update: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=43695


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