# problems with 1080i output



## auburn2 (Sep 8, 2005)

I just got my Dish 811 and my first HDTV (a Toshiba 34 inch CRT with a 1080i native display and an HDMI).

The TV will automatically accept and scale all the common TV formats, but says for the best picture set your source (in this case Dish 811) to 1080i.

So I did that on the dish receiver and I get horizontal lines and occasionally a dark bar on the screen. These 'flicker' and move up and down a bit. They look terrible. I have only noticed it on the HD channels like Rave. It is not exactly what I was hoping for with HDTV. It does this using both component cables and the DVI-HDMI, although it is noticably worse with the component. This does not happen when you pull up the dish onscreen menu.

When I set the dish output to 720p it clears up and looks a lot better, although with a noticable loss of resolution.

An idea what the problem is here? Is it the Dish 811, or the the TV. I have a Dish 942 in anoter room. I can unhook it and drag it down to the den for comparison, but have not yet had a chance.


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## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

Are you also hooked up to your TV with cable?


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## auburn2 (Sep 8, 2005)

No I don't have cable. All I have is Dish and OTA locals (through the 811 receiver).


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## khearrean (Mar 24, 2004)

I'm not sure, but seems that I recall something like this in a previous post. I believed it turned out that, since the 811 has DVI & their TV accepted HDMI, there was a DVI/HDMI adapter used which turned out to be the problem. That's about all I can recall and I can't find that post.

Ken


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## Jason Nipp (Jun 10, 2004)

Check the Toshiba's Input setup. Make sure the input your using for the 811 is set to HDTV and it might be a good idea to turn any auto picture and auto resolution settings off to see if that helps. I had to turn off the input autoselect feature on my Hitachi as well as auto contrast and smart picture.

If you disable your TV's auto settings and this still occurs I would first check your electrical grounds. Also make sure the coax is grounded properly. When I see horizontal lines or noise on a digital picture I can usually find a loose ground or noisy appliance on the same electrical circuit or ground that causes an EMI or RFI issue. I would start by checking the outlet the TV and 811 are plugged into with a outlet tester. Consider getting a heavy grade extension cord and running power from a distant room. Perhap run a temporary RG6 feed from the sat directly to the 811 making sure it at least goes though a ground block. Make sure you don't have mix and matched RG59 and RG6 coax between the dish receiver. 

If none of the above suggestions help, you should consider requesting an RMA replacement unit.

Hope this helps,


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## Jason Nipp (Jun 10, 2004)

khearrean said:


> I'm not sure, but seems that I recall something like this in a previous post. I believed it turned out that, since the 811 has DVI & their TV accepted HDMI, there was a DVI/HDMI adapter used which turned out to be the problem. That's about all I can recall and I can't find that post.
> 
> Ken


Yes I believe there was a post from a user with a adapter issue, good memory Ken. Also note that there is more than one type of DVI interface and cable type.


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## khearrean (Mar 24, 2004)

Jason Nipp said:


> Yes I believe there was a post from a user with a adapter issue, good memory Ken.


My memory usually works fairly well unless it's something my wife has either told me or asked me to do...If you don't believe me, just ask her !! :lol:

Ken


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## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

Your cable should be DVI-D/HMDI. Also check electical power supply that may be in contact with your set


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

He does mention that it is also being seen with component cables so I would tend to lean away from an adapter issue. Though I would not discount it. I would look first towards TV settings like Jason suggested to see if you can clear it up. Seeing if this happens with a 942 and component would be an intersting data point. Since you are seeing this with component also, I would start there and try and narrow down the variables. Once Component is solved move on to HDMI. 

The fact you are seeing it with two inputs would make me think it is not a cabeling issue. Then again it is possible you have two issues. 

Moving the 942 over and seeing if the issue goes away would be a good data point for sure. If it doesnt then I would suspect Bad TV or Bad Settings on the TV.


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## Jason Nipp (Jun 10, 2004)

I would also suggest putting the 811 on the TV in the den to see if the problem moves with the 811.


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## auburn2 (Sep 8, 2005)

"I would also suggest putting the 811 on the TV in the den to see if the problem moves with the 811."

The other TV I have is not HDTV, and will only take a 480i input on the component cables. Since it doesn't happen on 720p I think it won't be a problem. I did hook it up to a 9 inch "normal" TV using composite and looked fine.


"Your cable should be DVI-D/HMDI."

The DVI to HDMI cable I am using is the one that came with my 942 receiver (with the DVI attached to the 811 and the HDMI side to the TV). I assume that is a DVI-D/HDMI.


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## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

I experience what appears to be exactly the opposite, but it's a problem nevertheless. I have a Toshiba 52" DLP RPTV that is 720p native mode. The following issue is quite obvious with component cabling or HDMI:

In the "ideal" world, I would set the 811 output to 720p to match the TV. But when I do this, all 1080i programs (NBC, CBS, VOOM, etc.) are degraded and simply look bad. But the 720p programs (ABC, ESPN, Fox) look perfect.

When I switch the 811 to output to 1080i, the 1080i programs look much better but the 720p programs lose a little luster. In other words, the TV seems to be doing a much better job of scaling than the 811. 

In addition, placing the 811 in 1080i mode via the hdmi cable also produces ghosting. 720p does not exhibit ghosting but I cannot leave the 811 in 720p as noted above. My issue with all this is the fact that the 811 is forcing me to watch all hd programming where nothing can be in true native mode. I also cannot use HDMI due to the ghosting.

Some fun!


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## Jason Nipp (Jun 10, 2004)

auburn2 said:


> The DVI to HDMI cable I am using is the one that came with my 942 receiver (with the DVI attached to the 811 and the HDMI side to the TV). I assume that is a DVI-D/HDMI.


Not sure, Mark would know the anser better than I, But the 942's predecessor the 921, was a DVI-I not DVI-D.


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## auburn2 (Sep 8, 2005)

It must be in the 811, because I connected the 942 to the TV and set it to 1080i using the same outlet and the same satelite feed for one of the tuners. I did not get the horizontal lines with the 942, so I think it must be the 811.

I'll have to call dish for a replacement.


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## Jason Nipp (Jun 10, 2004)

Yes, with that info I would recommend calling for an replacement.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

auburn2 said:


> It must be in the 811, because I connected the 942 to the TV and set it to 1080i using the same outlet and the same satelite feed for one of the tuners. I did not get the horizontal lines with the 942, so I think it must be the 811.
> 
> I'll have to call dish for a replacement.


Did you do this using Component or the DVI? Hopefully you did with component to remove the DVI cabeling configuration variables.


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## auburn2 (Sep 8, 2005)

"Did you do this using Component or the DVI? Hopefully you did with component to remove the DVI cabeling configuration variables."

I did it with an HDMI to DVI adapapter to feed the DVI-HDMI cable I was already using with the 811. The cable was the same, the only difference is the adapter had to be used to attach it to the 942. 

I didn't think to use the complonent cables. However the problem is present with both component and DVI-HDMI cables on the 811. So if it is a cable issue it is a problem with multiple cables. I think that is unlikely.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

The fact it is on multiple cables made me also suspect not a cabeling issue, but a 811, TV issue, or incompatability between the two (We have seen that on rare occassion).  

It is very unlikely that you have two seperate issues, but it has happend before. The reason I mentioned component was to remove the adapter and the different DVI configurations from the equation. 


However, based on what I read above, the HDMI cable came with the 942. That might be the reason why it works with the 942 and not the 811. Know seeing the issue on the component definitely makes one thing a bad 811. If the 942 on component did not exhibit the same issue, I would say bad 811 or incompatibility between the 811 and your model of TV. Only way to determine what one it is is to get a replacement. 

Keep us informed what you find out.. I still would do the component test with the 942 to be sure before going through a hassle of a swap. But that is me.


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## auburn2 (Sep 8, 2005)

Called Dish technical support last night, they are sending another 811 out, I should get it in 2 days. They did not charge me and credited my bill $12 for lost time. Will let you know how it goes when I get it.


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## olgeezer (Dec 5, 2003)

Before you get it, you might try one thing. With DVI and component hooked up from your 811 to your tv. Turn off the tv. unplug the tv from electricity. wait 5 minutes and plug back in. See if the problem still exists.


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## glennh73 (Sep 5, 2005)

moman19 said:


> I experience what appears to be exactly the opposite, but it's a problem nevertheless. I have a Toshiba 52" DLP RPTV that is 720p native mode. The following issue is quite obvious with component cabling or HDMI:
> 
> In the "ideal" world, I would set the 811 output to 720p to match the TV. But when I do this, all 1080i programs (NBC, CBS, VOOM, etc.) are degraded and simply look bad. But the 720p programs (ABC, ESPN, Fox) look perfect.
> 
> ...


moman19 u have me a bit worried here as u seem to have the same TV i do, I have a 52hm94 DLP and have Dish coming the 24th to hook me up with the 811.

With you having to set the 811 to 1080i instead of 720p seems to be a pain since u are losing some of the HD purpose on Fox etc?

Would the 942 be better? Does this receiver still have this issue, cause i want all my HD stations to look their best, not some of them.

And using componets instead of HDMI, does that degrade any of the pq? I thought the whole purpose of HDMI was to be better than componets?


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## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Glenh73:

Got your PM. I have the 52HMX84. HDMI cabling with my DVD player is flawless. HDMI cabling with the 811 sucks. Essentially, you can see ghosting of all images with sharp edge (graphics, letters on-screen, etc.). It's especially bad when you set the 811 output to 1080i, which you must do to get the best HD picture for NBC, CBS, etc. Switch to Component cabling and the ghosts are gone. This has forced me to simply live without HDMI for the Dish connection. No great loss, really. But it bugs me that this buggy box will not allow me to my the digital cables nor let me set the box output to the native 720p mode on my TV.

I know nothing of the 942 other than I want one but cannot justify the price when MPEG 4 will be forthcoming. So the 811 is a necessary evil IMHO. I can live with the above issues, but what really drives me nuts are the 2 other known bugs: One is the frame-fropping where the image seems to freeze very briefly (all channels, HD & SD) once or twice per minute. Most noticeable during camera pans, easy to spot while watching text scrolling (CNN, Fox News). The other is the NO DATA bug where your on-screen guide will lock up on occasion followed by an 811 reboot. Almost certain to happen if you watch HD OTA via the box, which you will NOT have to do with the Toshiba HM94 set. I have doubts either will ever be fixed. The 811 has come a long way this past year, but after 3 box swaps and numerous issues, I feel like a guinea pig. The 942 cannot be worse.....can it?


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