# D* not taking HR21 back anymore?



## riprecked (Oct 11, 2009)

I took a pair of HR21-100s out of service around six months ago. At the same time A few weeks earlier I took a HR22 out of service.

A return kit arrived for the HR22, but I never received anything for the HR21s (and D* hasn't contacted me about them).

Is D* no longer asking for HR21-100s to be returned?


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

AFAIK if it's a leased recever they still want them back. Guess you could call them, give them the RID number and ask them to verify if it's an owned or leased receiver.


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## HarryD (Mar 24, 2002)

RAD said:


> AFAIK if it's a leased recever they still want them back. Guess you could call them, give them the RID number and ask them to verify if it's an owned or leased receiver.


I would call and check with them.. I hear if you don't return it, you'll get billed for it...

:sure:


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

If you haven't been billed for 7 months doubt you will be now but I still wouldn't junk them just yet. .


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

TBlazer07 said:


> If you haven't been billed for 7 months doubt you will be now but I still wouldn't junk them just yet. .


Problem is, they still won't list them as owned. I'd still keep them and keep pestering them for a return kit. As long as it's listed as leased, it still belongs to D*.

I have this vision of someone at D* sitting in a cubicle waiting to push a button that will bill everyone for all the receivers that haven't been returned. :lol:

Rich


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## jdspencer (Nov 8, 2003)

I just returned my dead HR20-100 last week.

I would guess the HR21 fell through the crack, but watch your online account for a non return charge.


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## Santi360HD (Oct 6, 2008)

rich584 said:


> Problem is, they still won't list them as owned. I'd still keep them and keep pestering them for a return kit. As long as it's listed as leased, it still belongs to D*.
> 
> I have this vision of someone at D* sitting in a cubicle waiting to push a button that will bill everyone for all the receivers that haven't been returned. :lol:
> 
> Rich


D* tried that $h**** on me twice with a couple of old SD recievers a while back...1st time I called them they saw the oversight...removed it...another time it was back on my bill again...I call them and I blasted them..."think I'm some old guy who doesnt read his bill and just pays it??" I said...and I cursed out at the CSR I didnt censor myself...after being hung up on legitimately...I called back and they knew what I was talking about before I even uttered a few words of happy happy joy joy politeness..and credited me on the spot...

sneaky bastards!


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## djrobx (Jan 27, 2009)

I have a couple HR22-100s that DirecTV didn't send kits for. It's been about 6 months now. No surprises on my bill ... yet.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

It's best to force the issue and make them send you a return kit anyway. I got dinged big time when I cancelled D* over some receivers that had been sitting in my closet for years. They swore they were owned at the time and insisted I keep them. Then they had the gall to charge me years later, plus bogus ETF fees on top of that.

I personally think that kind of thing is criminal, but I'm sure they get away with it sometimes, so it's their standard operating procedure to try to cheat you and hope you won't notice.


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## Santi360HD (Oct 6, 2008)

mdavej said:


> It's best to force the issue and make them send you a return kit anyway. I got dinged big time when I cancelled D* over some receivers that had been sitting in my closet for years. They swore they were owned at the time and insisted I keep them. Then they had the gall to charge me years later, plus bogus ETF fees on top of that.
> 
> I personally think that kind of thing is criminal, but I'm sure they get away with it sometimes, so it's their standard operating procedure to try to cheat you and hope you won't notice.


thing is I got a return box from D* and I wondered what the f* it was...It came out of the blue..I'm like these old SD recievers?? *NOW YOU want em back???* Do I even know where they are? then I saw them on my bill when I called in and questioned the empty box they sent. :nono2:


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## jdspencer (Nov 8, 2003)

Santi360HD said:


> thing is I got a return box from D* and I wondered what the f* it was...It came out of the blue..I'm like these old SD recievers?? *NOW YOU want em back???* Do I even know where they are? then I saw them on my bill when I called in and questioned the empty box they sent. :nono2:


And what was their answer to that question?


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## Santi360HD (Oct 6, 2008)

jdspencer said:


> And what was their answer to that question?


scroll up Post#7...a few cuss words and being hung up on...then playing nicely on my callback...the ends justify the means...


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## riprecked (Oct 11, 2009)

I contacted D* today and they said it was an oversight that I didn't receive a box for the receivers. They said I would get one in 3-4 days.

We'll see, I'm stunned that they don't track them better.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I had to call them back twice on one of my HR20 units and on another HR20 unit I had to call again so they aren't very diligent about sending out the Return Kits.


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## azarby (Dec 15, 2006)

riprecked said:


> I took a pair of HR21-100s out of service around six months ago. At the same time A few weeks earlier I took a HR22 out of service.
> 
> A return kit arrived for the HR22, but I never received anything for the HR21s (and D* hasn't contacted me about them).
> 
> Is D* no longer asking for HR21-100s to be returned?


My HR21-700 was replaced last week. It was an owned receiver. DTV sent a shipping label kit so I could return it in the same box as the HR22-100 that replace it. 0$ cost to me.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

I called to deactivate a HR20-700 a few months ago. The CSR said it was listed on my account as owned and I didn't need to return it.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

I still have an HR20-700 that I deactivated almost a year ago. I've called 3 times asking if they want it back and the first 2 they said they'd send a return kit and the 3rd they said no.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

riprecked said:


> I contacted D* today and they said it was an oversight that I didn't receive a box for the receivers. They said I would get one in 3-4 days.
> 
> We'll see, *I'm stunned that they don't track them better.*


Well which would you rather have - an old box back or the money?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

riprecked said:


> I contacted D* today and they said it was an oversight that I didn't receive a box for the receivers. They said I would get one in 3-4 days.
> 
> We'll see, I'm stunned that they don't track them better.


How many "oversights" could there possibly be? You just got pacified and, since you had the good sense to call, you'll probably get the return box now. If you hadn't called...

Nothing that D* does really "stuns" me anymore.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> How many "oversights" could there possibly be? You just got pacified and, since you had the good sense to call, you'll probably get the return box now. If you hadn't called...
> 
> Nothing that D* does really "stuns" me anymore.
> 
> Rich


They are a Large Corporation and only as good as their employees and yes they do drop the ball a lot it seems as I had to call several times for 2 DVRs but I finally got them returned.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> They are a Large Corporation and only as good as their employees and yes they do drop the ball a lot it seems as I had to call several times for 2 DVRs but I finally got them returned.


I had to call Retention to get one of my HRs returned. They always seem to help when I get frustrated enough to call them.

Rich


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## Lee L (Aug 15, 2002)

Had the same issue with a HR10-200 that I kept for a while after I got an HR24, so I could watch the stuff on it. Once I cancelled and they did not send me a box after 10 days, I called them up and they said it was never even noted in the system to send me one (even though they did take it off as I could see on account management online). Somehow, they have a glitch in the system or some CSRs are just not doing all the steps correctly.


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## tkrandall (Oct 3, 2003)

DirecTV really does need to get their act together with how the manage this whole leased receiver side of the business. It is really sloppy.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

tkrandall said:


> DirecTV really does need to get their act together with how the manage this whole leased receiver side of the business. It is really sloppy.


I gotta feeling that D* would rather just see the HRs after the 20-700s and before the 24s just go away.

Rich


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

richierich said:


> I had to call them back twice on one of my HR20 units and on another HR20 unit I had to call again so they aren't very diligent about sending out the Return Kits.


If it is any consolation, they seem to be better about billing for non-return than they are about sending the return kits.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

richierich said:


> They are a Large Corporation and only as good as their employees and yes they do drop the ball a lot it seems as I had to call several times for 2 DVRs but I finally got them returned.


They are only as good as their procedures.

The sending of boxes probably shouldn't be a CSR function. It should be hardwired to the countdown timer that ends in getting billed for late return.


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## CliffV (Jan 24, 2006)

bobnielsen said:


> I called to deactivate a HR20-700 a few months ago. The CSR said it was listed on my account as owned and I didn't need to return it.


Same thing happened to me when I deactivated an R10. It was definitely a leased receiver. But when I asked about not getting a return box, they said their records indicated it was owned and I didn't need to return it. I assume they simply didn't want such an old receiver back.

However, I did this whole inquiry *via e-mail *so that I have a written record in case it ever becomes an issue.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Probably when they deem the model usefulness is over, and it is now cheaper for them to convert a lease to an own and let you dispose of it.

I don't think the HR21 has fallen to that level, but it could have.


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## ndole (Aug 26, 2009)

Drucifer said:


> Probably when they deem the model usefulness is over, and it is now cheaper for them to convert a lease to an own and let you dispose of it.
> 
> I don't think the HR21 has fallen to that level, but it could have.


Not just yet I think.. But we'll see. It could be the case *Soon*.


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## tkrandall (Oct 3, 2003)

harsh said:


> They are only as good as their procedures.


Bingo. That and perhaps the execution of whatever plan they do have. It just seems one can conclude it is logistically ill conceived given the seemingly haphazard nature the leased inventory is desseminated, life-cycled, "refurbished", and otherwise managed and accounted for. :nono2: I can't imagine the nightmare of a mess it must be from the inside view of it all. We only see the consumer end of it.


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## tkrandall (Oct 3, 2003)

Well, based on this job description, they would seem to have the capability of knowing what specific sub model types are when and where, and how many, and just as importantly, how to get specific sub models where they need to be. Now, if they would only turn that capability into something that would allow the customer to have better control with their equipment acquisition experience.....

https://directv.taleo.net/careersection/2/jobdetail.ftl?lang=en&job=1001809

Job Description 
Sr. Inventory Control Planner, SCM Fulfillment.-1001809

Description

This position will be located at our Englewood, CO office.

The Inventory Control Planner, Sr., will manage the demand planning for a designated portion of the Owned & Operated installation network. This Sr. Inventory Control Planner will become a super-user of various applications (SAP, Inventory Management Systems, Siebel, and other on-line tools) and must have expert knowledge of Excel. _This position takes information from these various applications and consolidate it into a meaningful weekly replenishment plan by location. _ Once transitioned, the Sr. Inventory Control Planner _will make SKU specific replenishment decisions based on individual geographic product needs._ This is an hourly position. Duties include but aren't limited to:

* Monitors historical consumption and pending work orders by ship to location.
* _Product specific order fulfillment decisions and subsequent entry into SAP
* Run on-hand, in-transit inventory and tech count level reports and monitor in relation to Days On Hand_
* Becomes a super-user of Siebel, HS Inventory system, and 3PL transportation systems
* Works with sites on their SKU specific product consumption and behavioral adjustments needed to be in compliance
* Identifies product categories in jeopardy of going on backorder and also, communicate out backorders to the field with ATP (available to promise) dates.
* Interacts with the Regional Director of Operations in the planning function.
* Plans and deploys limited inventory allocation decisions for their designated sites.
* Makes recommendations for reports and future data intelligence enhancements.
* Other duties as assigned.

Qualifications

* Bachelor's Degree preferred and 4-6 years of related experience in Inventory Management or other related analytical roles
* Requires at least 3 years experience in a Customer Service/Interfacing Role
* Significant data analysis skills required. 
* Must be proficient in the use of MS Excel and have a strong working knowledge of MS Access
* Must have strong working knowledge of ERP (preferably SAP) and Inventory Management Systems. 
* Must have well-polished oral and written communication skills as this position is a primary external customer facing role
* Ability to work in a fast pace and rapidly changing environment
* Ability to prioritize and adhere to critical deadlines
* Previous management experience preferred
* May require up to 5% travel and the ability to expense travel costs prior to reimbursement
* Must be able to work extended hours and participate in weekend on call support rotation.

Job
Operations
Primary Location
CO-Englewood
Schedule
Full-time​


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## tuff bob (Mar 5, 2007)

I wonder if you should start billing DirecTV for looking after their property that you no longer want and that they're not taking back :sure:


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## riprecked (Oct 11, 2009)

Box arrived today to return the receivers. I wonder if they have aged like a fine wine sitting on the shelf for so long.

Thanks for the help all, I almost tossed them.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Drucifer said:


> Probably when they deem the model usefulness is over, and it is now cheaper for them to convert a lease to an own and let you dispose of it.
> 
> I don't think the HR21 has fallen to that level, but it could have.


Problem is, I'm not sure they actually ever convert them to "owned".

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

I'm gonna make a serious statement about that job description. My wife could do that job in her spare time. I showed her the description and she just laughed. Add to that the fact that they couldn't afford her. I'm really serious about that. Any decent accountant could do that job. But, how many decent accountants are gonna take an "hourly job"?

Rich



tkrandall said:


> Well, based on this job description, they would seem to have the capability of knowing what specific sub model types are when and where, and how many, and just as importantly, how to get specific sub models where they need to be. Now, if they would only turn that capability into something that would allow the customer to have better control with their equipment acquisition experience.....
> 
> https://directv.taleo.net/careersection/2/jobdetail.ftl?lang=en&job=1001809
> 
> ...


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## tkrandall (Oct 3, 2003)

I never said that job looked difficult. :^)


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

tkrandall said:


> I never said that job looked difficult. :^)


Didn't say you did. I've seen a lot of job descriptions for applicants that look just as the one you posted looks and then when an applicant sits down and actually talks to a person doing the hiring, they quickly find out that the employer is not really looking for all that, just covering their butts so that they can reject applicants they don't approve of. I did find your post interesting and thank you for that. I meant no offense.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

So where is this thread going???


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## tkrandall (Oct 3, 2003)

I would like it to go back to clarifying if DirecTV is 

1) dropping the ball lately on sending out return kits for its receivers, and has this become a problem, and
2) if so is this going to set some people up for nasty unreturned equipment fees down the line.

If they are starting to not want certain older equipment back, then they should send a written release to the account holder for the specific box(es) so released.

Moral of the story I guess is be very proactive on ensuring you get return kits sent, and then track and record those waybill histories when you do ship something.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Directv has dropped the ball on this problem for a number of years as I guess it is not directly tied to a Revenue Stream but I Requested that someone at the Dock at Directv sign off on my Returned Kit so I had proof that I had returned it.

Then I called Directv to ensure that they had listed it as Returned. I have done this on several occasions as I have bought "Owned" DVRs thru Ebay.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Inventory management at this level of volume has to be a nightmare anyway. 

Trying to sift through hundreds of thousands of new and used units each month and matching them up to installation supplies can't be alot of fun.

They seem to budget for a 20% attrition rate each year, so before you know it...the old HR20, HR21 series units will be a thing of the past as far as replacement units.


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## tkrandall (Oct 3, 2003)

I sometimes wonder how much of this logistical headache and costs were captured in the business case many years ago to adopt the leasing model exclusively.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

tkrandall said:


> I sometimes wonder how much of this logistical headache and costs were captured in the business case many years ago to adopt the leasing model exclusively.


I bet its safe to assume it was all part of that model.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

tkrandall said:


> I sometimes wonder how much of this logistical headache and costs were captured in the business case many years ago to adopt the leasing model exclusively.


Maybe they never even considered it. Wouldn't surprise me. The leasing of the HRs was a great business decision, I think. My wife explained the benefits of it, but I don't remember too much of what she said. She did say that she didn't see a downside for D* since the leasing allows them to actually own all the leased HRs and there are tax benefits of some sort in owning all those units.

Rich


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## mike91163 (Nov 22, 2010)

What a nightmare I have endured with these nitwits...I'll share my tale below, but in the interest of brevity, here's the bottom line:

1---If you OWN-as in paid the FULL CASH PRICE-for ANY DirecTV receiver, find your receipt; put in in an envelope, seal it, and tape it to the receiver...so you have PROOF of ownership.

2---Any OWNED receivers must have their access cards returned; call/annoy/pester/file a lawsuit to have DirecTV send you the "card return" envelope.

3---Before sending ANYTHING back to DirecTV, write down every conceivable ID#, serial#, part#, access card#, date of manufacture, the works.

4---If possible, get a receipt at the post office for any returns via "SmartPost". Make CERTAIN you retain the "receipt strip" at the bottom of the supplied return label.

5---Email DirecTV at [email protected] -in the email, list everything in #3 above, also include ALL the info from the receipt strip, AND list the date, time, and post office location you dropped off the box to. Be VERY CLEAR that you want a reply via email, confirming receipt of the email.

6---Follow up frequently, until you receive confirmation that DirecTV has indeed received your return.

7---Keep all documents, print out all emails, and retain all these records indefinitely.

8---Say a few prayers that some knucklehead at DirecTV doesn't screw up and send you a bill for a receiver you returned a decade ago!

That said...

Mon. 11/22: Come home to find one of my leased HR21s with a BSOD indicating hard drive failure...cannot even access diagnostics, despite many resets/power cycles. Call DTV, arrange for replacement, specify, AND am willing to pay for, overnight shipping...as Thanksgiving is 3 days away, have family staying over...assured by CSR that it will ship overnight Tues for Wed delivery.
Wed. 11/24: No receiver delivered: Call DTV, CSR says it shipped Fedex Ground Home Delivery, says other rep screwed up, no overnight deliveries, package to be delivered Friday...problem is, my work-which is where I had it shipped to-is CLOSED Friday! So, I'm SOL...the wife asks me later about moving to FiOS TV, as we have had phone/Internet through FiOS for past year and a half. Turns out, switching to IDENTICAL channel package will save us a stunning $85/month...even with purchasing 2 new TiVo Premiere DVRs, they will pay for themselves in 12 months. Make arrangements for switch, FiOS TV install scheduled for 12/6.
Mon. 11/29: Replacement HR21 finally arrives; activate new one (refurb, of course!), dead unit had already been deactivated. Pack dead unit in box, seal it, drop at local post office Tues 11/30.
Wed. 12/9: After 2+ days of FiOS, we're thrilled...HD channels MUCH better PQ (signal is NOT re-compressed, getting straight MPEG-2 as broadcast by providers)...and TiVo Premiere incredibly fast compared to HR21 (I was furious with 5-6 seconds of gray screen during channel changes)...so I call DTV to cancel service, as my contract ended in Jan 2010. After 40 minutes of soft and hard sell from Retention, CSR gives up...arrangements for return are made.
Mon. 12/20: DTV hits my bank account for $250 non-return fee...CSR says I didn't return defective unit. I provide tracking #, shows no record on usps.com. Of course, we go round and round...apparently they cannot grasp the concept that maybe, just maybe, USPS or Fedex lost it, or that their return warehouse screwed up and didn't enter the return into their system.

But wait, it gets better...later that day, they hit my bank account for the usual monthly billing of $140.28! I am beside myself now, being out close to 400 bucks...and get told by these morons that it can take UP TO 30-THAT'S THREE-ZERO-DAYS to "cancel" auto bill-pay! I ask the CSR to answer a question: "OK, 30 days...let me ask you-if I upgrade services, or buy a new receiver, when do YOU bill me? Isn't it a matter of SECONDS or MINUTES?" Silence on the other end...and then get transferred to a "supervisor"...and get disconnected.

Fortunately, when I called back, I lucked into reaching their call center in New Mexico...and spoke with an INTELLIGENT, ENGLISH-SPEAKING AMERICAN! This young woman actually took the time to investigate the whole mess...and found out that DTV never sent the recovery kit...and after working on my problem for almost a half-hour, got everything straightened out...charges reversed (although I have to wait 1-2 weeks, better than a month), new kit request generated (and given the ID number), "clock" on this return reset...and defective unit flagged as lost.

My Dad, who's been a long-time (15+ years) subscriber, had told me a while ago that if I call DTV, and get someone clueless, hang up, and call back in as many times as needed until you get someone on the phone who has a brain and can THINK, instead of reading a script. Given the mess I endured, isn't that really sad? I realize that these CSRs likely get a lot of abuse, but let's face it, if they actually used a handful of brain cells, the customer will not get abusive!

Funniest part of this mess? VERY late in the Retention rep's speech was this tidbit: "If I could get you a pair of brand-new HR24 units, would you stay with DirecTV?" (Mind you, this was AFTER she had already TWICE denied my requests for the HR24...) Even though my mind was made up, I figured I'd play with them a little...I asked "Well, that depends, what's the catch?" I get put on hold...and she returns with "My supervisor said we could give you $10/month credit for 24 months...and we can reduce the price from $499 to $199 per unit." I reply "So, let me see: I pay-TODAY-$400, and over the next 2 years, I get $240 credit...umm, even a 3rd grader would know that I would be getting SCREWED out of $160, right?" The rep's reply? "One moment while I speak to my supervisor..." Now, the supervisor gets on the phone...after sucking up to me, she asks "Sir, would you be willing to accept a 2-year commitment in exchange for 2 HR24 units?" I say "Well ma'am, let me tell you: In my conversation with your rep, I twice asked for this, nevermind the numerous times in the past year that I have requested this exchange...and then *your* FIRST offer would have cost ME money! Maybe you are able to confuse other customers into accepting this losing deal, but I caught it...and now that I have turned the tables, all of a sudden we can make my request happen? SORRY-even if I had any meager thoughts of staying, you have surely, and without a doubt, buried them for good. No thank you for your "deal"...now please put me in touch with someone who can make the necessary cancellation and return arrangements."

BE VERY CAREFUL!


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

mike91163 said:


> What a nightmare I have endured with these nitwits...I'll share my tale below, but in the interest of brevity, here's the bottom line:


 << Snipped bits out >>

Sayonara. Glad you didn't post the long version.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I have had to send back several units and I always send it back requiring a Signature and I keep all of my Emails and of course my RID Numbers, etc.

Just common sense and you have to CYA!!!


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

richierich said:


> I have had to send back several units and I always send it back requiring a Signature ...


How did you do that? With a couple recent returns, using the DirecTV supplied return Smart Post lables, I was no able to add delivery verification even if I wanted to pay for it. The two post offices I used say they aren't allowed to put any additional services on SmartPost returns.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Mine were Fedex Labels and I told the Fedex Guy I wanted Fedex to Guarantee it with a Signature so he included that and at the Directv Dock they had to Sign for it and when I talked to Directv later who said they hadn't received it I sent them the Email of the Signature and they later found it and sent me an Email confirming that they had indeed received my Unit.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

RAD said:


> How did you do that? With a couple recent returns, using the DirecTV supplied return Smart Post lables, I was no able to add delivery verification even if I wanted to pay for it. The two post offices I used say they aren't allowed to put any additional services on SmartPost returns.


You get a tracking label from the USPS, use that until FedEx gets it and then track it from their site. Save all your docs.

Rich


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## dmurphy (Sep 28, 2006)

richierich said:


> I have had to send back several units and I always send it back requiring a Signature and I keep all of my Emails and of course my RID Numbers, etc.
> 
> Just common sense and you have to CYA!!!


I've had to send back a few units over the years, and all I did was hold onto the tracking # for a few weeks...

I don't worry about getting billed for a non-return fee. If I do, I'll just call in and they'll fix it.

Believe me, they'll fix it.

DirecTV has always treated me wonderfully over the years. They've made mistakes now and again, but who doesn't? The important part is being able to correct the mistakes, and that has never, ever been an issue.

I'm sure being a >10 year customer with a healthy spend helps .....


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## toneman (Oct 23, 2007)

mike91163's experiences w/ having funds deducted from his bank account due to Auto Bill Pay is exactly why I try to avoid subscribing to such automatic billing deduction services as much as possible.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

dmurphy said:


> I've had to send back a few units over the years, and all I did was hold onto the tracking # for a few weeks...
> 
> I don't worry about getting billed for a non-return fee. If I do, I'll just call in and they'll fix it.
> 
> ...


I'd be willing to bet that no ordinary sub on this forum has sent back as many HRs and TiVos as I have. And not one has been lost. I do keep the tracking records for a while, but so far, not a single loss. And, like you, I'm very well treated by D*. Extraordinarily well.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

toneman said:


> mike91163's experiences w/ having funds deducted from his bank account due to Auto Bill Pay is exactly why I try to avoid subscribing to such automatic billing deduction services as much as possible.


I wouldn't let any company have access to my bank accounts. My credit cards are protected, but allowing a company to siphon money out of your accounts is just asking for trouble.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I wouldn't let any company have access to my bank accounts. My credit cards are protected, but allowing a company to siphon money out of your accounts is just asking for trouble.
> 
> Rich


BINGO!!! I Agree 100%!!!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> BINGO!!! I Agree 100%!!!


Too risky for me!!!

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Ain't Nobody Going To Have Access To My Account other than my Wife who Owns the Account she just lets me use it from time to time!!!


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## DonDeAgo (Jun 3, 2008)

Drucifer said:


> Probably when they deem the model usefulness is over, and it is now cheaper for them to convert a lease to an own and let you dispose of it.
> 
> I don't think the HR21 has fallen to that level, but it could have.


No, it hasn't. I'm waiting for a replacement now for my HR 21-700 that has a hard drive going out. They charged me $20 shipping and said they were sending me a return kit and I would be billed if I didn't return the old unit. I wonder which receiver I would be most likely to receive.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

DonDeAgo said:


> No, it hasn't. I'm waiting for a replacement now for my HR 21-700 that has a hard drive going out. They charged me $20 shipping and said they were sending me a return kit and I would be billed if I didn't return the old unit. I wonder which receiver I would be most likely to receive.


They normally Replace the Unit with a model that is the same one so you should get an HR21-700 unless they don't have them in stock in the Refurb Area.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

DonDeAgo said:


> No, it hasn't. I'm waiting for a replacement now for my HR 21-700 that has a hard drive going out. They charged me $20 shipping and said they were sending me a return kit and I would be billed if I didn't return the old unit. I wonder which receiver I would be most likely to receive.


I'd be more concerned with what kind of shape the replacement is gonna be in. They don't really refurbish anything to any great extent. They just wipe the HDD clean and send it out. Furbish originally meant "to shine" or "to polish". They do that and little else.

How do you know your HDD is bad? Did you try an external HDD on your HR? Or did you take the word of a CSR?

Rich


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## DonDeAgo (Jun 3, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I'd be more concerned with what kind of shape the replacement is gonna be in. They don't really refurbish anything to any great extent. They just wipe the HDD clean and send it out. Furbish originally meant "to shine" or "to polish". They do that and little else.
> 
> How do you know your HDD is bad? Did you try an external HDD on your HR? Or did you take the word of a CSR?
> 
> Rich


I know it's bad because it was sticking and skipping when I tried to play back a program I had recorded. I rebooted to try and correct this and got the old blue screen of death. When I called tech support and read them the error code the tech said it was a hard drive failure. He didn't think I could get the receiver going again but after I tried rebooting it a couple of more times it booted up. Now it's not working right but at least I can watch it until the new unit arrives. I do have an external hard drive I unhooked from my computer that I can use if the receiver's drive completely dies but I should have the replacement tomorrow according to DTV.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

DonDeAgo said:


> I know it's bad because it was sticking and skipping when I tried to play back a program I had recorded. I rebooted to try and correct this and got the old blue screen of death. When I called tech support and read them the error code the tech said it was a hard drive failure. He didn't think I could get the receiver going again but after I tried rebooting it a couple of more times it booted up. Now it's not working right but at least I can watch it until the new unit arrives. I do have an external hard drive I unhooked from my computer that I can use if the receiver's drive completely dies but I should have the replacement tomorrow according to DTV.


The simplest way to determine an HDD is shot is to hook up an external HDD to the HR. If it doesn't have any issues, the internal HDD is bad. If it shows the same issues the problem is in the HR itself.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

DonDeAgo said:


> I know it's bad because it was sticking and skipping when I tried to play back a program I had recorded. I rebooted to try and correct this and got the old blue screen of death. When I called tech support and read them the error code the tech said it was a hard drive failure. He didn't think I could get the receiver going again but after I tried rebooting it a couple of more times it booted up. Now it's not working right but at least I can watch it until the new unit arrives. I do have an external hard drive I unhooked from my computer that I can use if the receiver's drive completely dies but I should have the replacement tomorrow according to DTV.


A Failing or Marginal Power Supply unit can Mimic a Bad or Failing Hard Drive because it is not getting the proper amount of voltage to allow it to Spin Up to the Optimal Spin Rate therefore it looks like the drive is failing but that is not the case.

It also could be the drive so doing what Rich says by hooking up an external drive can tell you that it is probably a bad drive or a bad Power Supply or something else.

Also, normally Power Supply Units start failing before hard drives do as a General Rule. They normally only last 4 to 5 years and that is about where the HR21 units are in terms of age.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

rich584 said:


> The simplest way to determine an HDD is shot is to hook up an external HDD to the HR. If it doesn't have any issues, *the internal HDD is bad*. If it shows the same issues *the problem is in the HR itself*.
> 
> Rich


And in both examples what happens? Yep, the receiver is sent back.

So why go thru the trouble of pinpointing the exact problem?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Drucifer said:


> And in both examples what happens? Yep, the receiver is sent back.
> 
> So why go thru the trouble of pinpointing the exact problem?


It's not sent back if he decides to just stick with the external drive.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Drucifer said:


> And in both examples what happens? Yep, the receiver is sent back.
> 
> So why go thru the trouble of pinpointing the exact problem?


He can stay with the External Drive or I would check the Power Supply unit to see if it is outputting the correct amount of amperage. If not I would replace it for a cost of about $20 if you do it yourself or maybe $50 if you pay someone to do it for you. Then you don't lose your Recordings and Profile Settings.

An awful lot of DVRs are sent back thinking it is a hard drive when it is not and I hate losing recordings so I had a company Replace my Power Supply unit on two of my DVRs on two different occasions and Never Lost Any of My Recordings or Settings.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Drucifer said:


> And in both examples what happens? Yep, the receiver is sent back.
> 
> So why go thru the trouble of pinpointing the exact problem?


Actually, I don't remember ever having an internal HDD go bad. But if it did, and an external HDD worked on the HR, I'd probably keep it and not go thru the agony of replacement roulette.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I've had two hard drives go bad and two Power Supply units.


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## bpratt (Nov 24, 2005)

richierich said:


> I've had two hard drives go bad and two Power Supply units.


I would suspect you have a problem with heat.

Many years ago, I was responsible for a server farm that had about 60 servers and 350 hard disks. We use to have one or two disks fail per year. One day we had the computer room air conditioner fail. The temperature after about 4 hours got up to 92 degrees before the ac unit could be fixed and re-started. None of the servers crashed but over the next 6 months, we had 26 disk failures and 4 power supply failures.

My two HR21-700s are nearly 3 years old. They are mounted on a wall in a vented closet with the fans pointing up for maximum air flow. I also have a HR10-250 and two ReplayTV units in that same closet. The ReplayTVs are nearly 10 years old and the HR10-250 was one of the first ever built. I have never had a disk or power supply fail on anything because I keep it cool.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

rich584 said:


> Actually, I don't remember ever having an internal HDD go bad. But if it did, and an external HDD worked on the HR, I'd probably keep it and not go thru *the agony of replacement roulette*.
> 
> Rich


Agony? It is challenging sometimes, but most often it is a simple swap.

And when we know more about _Nomad_, maybe we will no longer have to worry about losing stored content.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Drucifer said:


> And when we know more about _Nomad_, maybe we will no longer have to worry about using stored content.


Never Thought About Using NOMAD as an Archival Method!!!

Good Idea!!!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Drucifer said:


> Agony? It is challenging sometimes, but most often it is a simple swap.


Considering how many replacements I had before buying six HRs, it was agony.



> And when we know more about _Nomad_, maybe we will no longer have to worry about losing stored content.


I don't really worry about it now. With eleven HRs, I can record the same episodes many times over. I've lost HRs and external devices every year and I had to do something drastic to keep from losing valued content.

Nomad I know nothing about, but I'll learn when it becomes available. Any input would be appreciated. Don't feel like reading thru that long thread.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

NOMAD from what I have learned initially will be a Directv Hardware Device coupled with Software that will Allow you to Download your Recordings to a Smart Phone such as a Droid or IPAD or IPHONE or a PC so you can Play the Recordings back without WIFI as they will be on the Mobile Device's flash drive or hard drive.

Later it may have Netstreaming Capabilities but that is just Speculation at this point.

If this information is correct that will be a Big Plus for Directv giving us a way to take Directv with us when we travel.

This is just Speculation Gleaned from the Nomad Thread so take it as such with a little grain of salt.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> NOMAD from what I have learned initially will be a Directv Hardware Device coupled with Software that will Allow you to Download your Recordings to a Smart Phone such as a Droid or IPAD or IPHONE or a PC so you can Play the Recordings back without WIFI as they will be on the Mobile Device's flash drive or hard drive.
> 
> Later it may have Netstreaming Capabilities but that is just Speculation at this point.
> 
> ...


So, where does the archiving come in?

I just read an article about (and remember I predicted this) D* coming out with a DVR that will stream Net content and, possibly, be wireless. When you get to Vegas, please be sure to check this out. I'm sure the _FAN_ is reading this, and I hope he'll do some research into this too.

Rich


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## DonDeAgo (Jun 3, 2008)

richierich said:


> They normally Replace the Unit with a model that is the same one so you should get an HR21-700 unless they don't have them in stock in the Refurb Area.


I got my replacement receiver Tuesday afternoon and shipped my HR 21-700 back to DTV. Everything seems to be OK except my caller ID still does not work. I received an HR 21-100 as a replacement. What is the difference between a 100 and a 700?
PS.
I notice my internal temperature is running in the mid to high 90's. This is about 15 to 20 degrees less than my old unit. Does this sound about right?


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## jmonica (Nov 16, 2008)

hehehe Good one!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

DonDeAgo said:


> I got my replacement receiver Tuesday afternoon and shipped my HR 21-700 back to DTV. Everything seems to be OK except my caller ID still does not work. I received an HR 21-100 as a replacement. What is the difference between a 100 and a 700?


Yup, the 21-700 is probably the best of the 21 series. The 21-100 is...not.



> PS.
> I notice my internal temperature is running in the mid to high 90's. This is about 15 to 20 degrees less than my old unit. Does this sound about right?


They should both have about the same temps. Perhaps that's the reason the 700 failed.

Rich


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