# A Year and still no VIP 922??



## RVRambler

Whatever happened to the VIP 922, it was announced in Jan 2009?

It is no longer on the dish web site so....???

Better late, than as flaky bad as some of the earlier Dish receivers (can you say 921, the 'future proof receiver', more flaky than those pie crust we love made by grandma!! ?)!

Thanks for any real news!


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## phrelin

I don't know what you consider "real news" but if you go to http://www.dishuser.org/ces2010.php and scroll down to ViP922 there is a report from CES 2010.


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## Stewart Vernon

RVRambler said:


> Whatever happened to the VIP 922, it was announced in Jan 2009?
> 
> It is no longer on the dish web site so....???


When was it ever on the Dish Web site?

The only official news about the 922 from Dish was at CES (either this year or last year) and on the Charlie/Tech chats. I don't ever remember seeing the 922 on the Dish Web site.


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## Sarahcat

The 2009 Winter CES in Las Vegas and the Dish VIP 922...woo hoo! :hurah:
The 2010 Winter CES in Las Vegas and the Dish VIP 922...woo hoo! :hurah:

Prediction:
The 2011 Winter CES in Las Vegas and the Dish VIP 922...the what? :nono:

...and no, it was never on the Dish Network web site as far as I know.


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## Shades228

We should start a pool. Which one comes out first is it 922 or the new HD DVR by Tivo for DirecTV.


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## Stewart Vernon

The 922 isn't vaporware, though... I suppose at this point it's fair to be taking bets as to when/if it will actually come out... but we know it exists based upon two CES show demos.

I'd call it vaporware if we never saw a working unit anywhere and just saw screen captures online. Since we've seen actual hardware at trade shows, it's not vaporware... it's just a very late product!


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## P Smith

And FW updating thru satellites often - definitely it exist somewhere now.


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## boba

Shades228 said:


> We should start a pool. Which one comes out first is it 922 or the new HD DVR by Tivo for DirecTV.


My bet is on TiVo DVR for D*


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## boba

Many years ago DISH introduced A receiver with DVD player at CES. A year later it had dissappeared at least the 922 has shown up 2 years in a row. DISH likes plenty of lead time on their products, maybe this time it will work when it finally hits marketplace.


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## tsmacro

The 922 definitely does exist, we have one where I work in one of our conference rooms, been there for at least half a year for "testing". Honestly I have no idea how good or bad it does or doesn't work since i'm usually too busy at work to go play with it!


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## 356B

I wonder if things were different with the economy the launch of he 922 might of been sooner, I've notice another company I'm familiar with "Apple" seems to be habitually late with updates, new product, etc. Or perhaps things just needed more tuning than originally anticipated.
My 622 still works for me. I'll be waiting though.....


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## phrelin

From Wikipedia:


> *Vaporware* describes a product, usually software, that has been announced by a developer during or before its development, if there is significant doubt whether the product will actually be released.


So the existence of a product does not preclude it from being "vaporware." While I think they will release the 922, the delays have created "significant doubt whether the product will actually be released" in many minds. So it's not incorrect to consider the 922 "vaporware."


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## Reaper

Shades228 said:


> We should start a pool. Which one comes out first is it 922 or the new HD DVR by Tivo for DirecTV.


LOL


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## bnborg

For $1 you can "reserve" one at Dish Depot. It's on the far bottom of the page.


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## Stewart Vernon

I guess I've always viewed Vaporware as either being a product that doesn't exist OR one that exists only to talk/market but a company has no intention of ever releasing.

However, a product that is fully intended to be released... but either has too many problems OR takes so long to develop that it is obsoleted by a follow-on product... that doesn't seem like Vaporware to me.

I've worked for companies that develop stuff... and to me, they had vaporware sometimes just for proof-of-concept to get "buzz" about them for a product they never intended to release... but did have a follow-on they wanted to sell.

In this case, I think the 922 is just taking longer to develop than they originally thought. Had they known then what they know now, I bet we wouldn't have seen the 922 in 2009 CES at all.

I just don't see this one as vaporware in the spirit of the word.


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## phrelin

bnborg said:


> For $1 you can "reserve" one at Dish Depot. It's on the far bottom of the page.


Gee, that sounds like a swell idea! Be among the first to be able to complain here about what doesn't work.


Stewart Vernon said:


> I guess I've always viewed Vaporware as either being a product that doesn't exist OR one that exists only to talk/market but a company has no intention of ever releasing.
> 
> However, a product that is fully intended to be released... but either has too many problems OR takes so long to develop that it is obsoleted by a follow-on product... that doesn't seem like Vaporware to me.
> 
> I've worked for companies that develop stuff... and to me, they had vaporware sometimes just for proof-of-concept to get "buzz" about them for a product they never intended to release... but did have a follow-on they wanted to sell.
> 
> In this case, I think the 922 is just taking longer to develop than they originally thought. Had they known then what they know now, I bet we wouldn't have seen the 922 in 2009 CES at all.
> 
> I just don't see this one as vaporware in the spirit of the word.


Over the 40 years I've been involved with computer products, I've seen or heard of many, many products that just didn't work out and couldn't be released. Personally, originally I associated vaporware with "buzz" artificially created to placate investors.

I also don't see the 922 as vaporware. But given the new products like the 700U, I'm not sure how good an investment the 922 is going to be for Echostar/Dish Network. We'll see, I guess.


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## boba

Vaporware or just slow getting to the marketplace, does it matter? You still can't go to your local Radio Shack and buy it. And with DISH's history of product releases why would you want it until it has at least 6 months of consumer history behind it?


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## Lt Disher

boba said:


> Vaporware or just slow getting to the marketplace, does it matter? You still can't go to your local Radio Shack and buy it. And with DISH's history of product releases why would you want it until it has at least 6 months of consumer history behind it?


Why? Some people like to be on the cutting edge of technology and are not bothered by a few reboots. Some others might want to have it so they can report problems and kudos on a website like this. It sounds like they may have most of the bigger bugs ironed out before release so I don't think that it should be that big a deal to be one of the first people to get one.


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## GrumpyBear

Lt Disher said:


> Why? Some people like to be on the cutting edge of technology and are not bothered by a few reboots. Some others might want to have it so they can report problems and kudos on a website like this. It sounds like they may have most of the bigger bugs ironed out before release so I don't think that it should be that big a deal to be one of the first people to get one.


Thats what Beta and Alpha testers are for.


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## Lt Disher

GrumpyBear said:


> Thats what Beta and Alpha testers are for.


And some people would love to be alpha and beta testers but never got the chance. You may wait if you want, but some of us aren't as grumpy as others and actually are very anxious to get our hands on the receiver, even with a few bugs.


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## P Smith

You are brave soldier,LT Dish !


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## TulsaOK

P Smith said:


> You are brave soldier,LT Dish !


:lol:


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## Reaper

I'd rather it be right than rushed into production.


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## shadough

I'm w/ you Lt. I can't see getting a 722k now if the 922 is just a few months away. No way in hell theyd take the 722k back an send me a 922. So I must wait for the 922 release before I can enjoy HD programming.


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## DNSFSS

I know that everyone has their doubts, but I'll tell you this:

We have a physical Vip922 DuoDVR in our office, and I've talked with other managers in the region and they all have one also. I've seen it, touched it, played with it, played with the remote, watched it in action.

There is no idea of a release date, as they're still updating software on it so that it is completely functional before it goes out in the field. So, patience is a virtue, and just like many things with E*, it will be available "soon".:lol:


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## JM Anthony

Reaper said:


> I'd rather it be right than rushed into production.


Amen to that! And E* has released h/w before that definitely wasn't ready for prime time.

John


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## loki993

DNSFSS said:


> I know that everyone has their doubts, but I'll tell you this:
> 
> We have a physical Vip922 DuoDVR in our office, and I've talked with other managers in the region and they all have one also. I've seen it, touched it, played with it, played with the remote, watched it in action.
> 
> There is no idea of a release date, as they're still updating software on it so that it is completely functional before it goes out in the field. So, patience is a virtue, and just like many things with E*, it will be available "soon".:lol:


So the question is, will it be worth the almost certain hefty price tag that will accompany it?


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## P Smith

loki993 said:


> So the question is, will it be worth the almost certain hefty price tag that will accompany it?


Have you seen official price tag ?


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## 356B

P Smith said:


> Have you seen official price tag ?


So OK I'll bite what is the official price?:sure:


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## P Smith

By dish press release, price list, its site, etc.


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## harsh

boba said:


> My bet is on TiVo DVR for D*


My bet is that the HR2x based DirecTiVo never sees the light of day. Note that I'm using the term "never" as in not ever. I have no solid evidence to back this up, but it sure seems to be the way things are going at TiVo with respect to software for other's hardware.

The ViP922 made a fairly significant and relatively late about face when they removed Dan Minnick's beloved touch pad remote functionality.


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## 356B

P Smith said:


> By dish press release, price list, its site, etc.


Is this just your game? why don't you just spit out the price? :lol:


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## GrumpyBear

356B said:


> Is this just your game? why don't you just spit out the price? :lol:


Nobody knows yet. 2009 CES, powerpoint had a price of $199 with 2yr lease. Only price anybody has ever seen in any offical Dish announcement.


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## 356B

GrumpyBear said:


> Nobody knows yet. 2009 CES, powerpoint had a price of $199 with 2yr lease. Only price anybody has ever seen in any offical Dish announcement.


This is all economy based, if the economy was strong the vip922 would be operational now, if the economy was strong PBS and others would be broadcast in HD, that satellite would already be in the night sky. People are cutting back on programming and everything else . For those who can afford it, when it comes it may be a deal, then again maybe not, the game has changed......:up_to_som


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## SDiego

Dishdepot has a msrp of $699.99 I wonder if that what the price will charged to your credit card when dishdepot ships them. Kinda steep.


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## P Smith

SDiego said:


> Dishdepot has a msrp of $699.99 I wonder if that what the price will charged to your credit card when dishdepot ships them. Kinda steep.


You don't remember when we forced to buy ( no lease at all ) PVR921 [first HD DVR] for $1000 !


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## GrumpyBear

SDiego said:


> Dishdepot has a msrp of $699.99 I wonder if that what the price will charged to your credit card when dishdepot ships them. Kinda steep.


Well Just like every other price on the site, the $699 has a line through it, so it will be lower than that. Plus thats an outright price vs a lease price. Far cheaper than the 9xxDVR's


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## TulsaOK

P Smith said:


> You don't remember when we forced to buy ( no lease at all ) PVR921 [first HD DVR] for $1000 !


Forced?


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## phrelin

P Smith said:


> You don't remember when we forced to buy ( no lease at all ) PVR921 [first HD DVR] for $1000 !


Boy I do remember buying two 508's because Texas Charlie had his six-shooter aimed at my head.:grin:


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## krazymonkeys

I know I am dredging up an old thread here but the 922 is around and my guess on why it hasn't gone into production is the new interface. It works as of now but the new interface with the touchscreen remote is extremely buggy. It resets several times a day. I have had some hands on time at the shop in the training room and it's nice but the menus are quite a bit different. Still have yet to find a typical check switch screen so I am not sure how initial setup is going to be. Considering from what I have heard that will be the new interface for all the high end receivers from here on I think they will release it but it may be a while. It seems the r&d department takes more time to iron out bugs than micro$oft. Just my $.02


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## Steve

phrelin said:


> Boy I do remember buying two 508's because Texas Charlie had his six-shooter aimed at my head.:grin:


I've mostly been an early adopter and paid the price. My first SD TiVo (30gb) cost me $800 in 1999. I switched to DirecTV in 2001. I forgot what I paid for my Sat T60's, but I'm pretty sure they were $300 or $400 each. Then I paid $1100 at Circuit City for my first HR10-250. I paid over $10k for my first HD plasma, so I thought the HR10 was a bargain at less than 1/10 the price! :lol:


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## olguy

Steve said:


> I've mostly been an early adopter and paid the price. My first SD TiVo (30gb) cost me $800 in 1999. I switched to DirecTV in 2001. I forgot what I paid for my Sat T60's, but I'm pretty sure they were $300 or $400 each. Then I paid $1100 at Circuit City for my first HR10-250. I paid over $10k for my first HD plasma, so I thought the HR10 was a bargain at less than 1/10 the price! :lol:


Looks like you did pay the price. I bought 3 little Sony Direct set top boxes, 2 Panasonic Showstoppers (Replay made by Panasonic) and 2 serial cables to allow the Showstoppers to change the Sony channels and I don't think I paid much more than $800 for the lot in 1998.


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## Michael1

I asked Dish what happened to the 922 at CES 2010. They said it was still in development, and would release "later this year" (probably mid-year). They did add some new features compared to the 922 they showed at CES 2009. It now has a keyboard for entering search words. It also has an HD multi-room extender. It seemed like they were throwing the kitchen sink at it, and it probably would give my Windows 7 Media Center Edition a run for its money, although we'll have to see how fast the processor is.

Michael


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## P Smith

Michael1 said:


> I asked Dish what happened to the 922 at CES 2010. They said it was still in development, and would release "later this year" (probably mid-year). They did add some new features compared to the 922 they showed at CES 2009. It now has a keyboard for entering search words. It also has an HD multi-room extender. It seemed like they were throwing the kitchen sink at it, and it probably would give my Windows 7 Media Center Edition a run for its money, although *we'll have to see how fast the processor is*.
> 
> Michael


You can find some tech info about the CPU [BCM7400] at Broadcom site.
"...dual threaded 350-MHz MIPS32 with FPU class CPU..."
"...Concurrent multi-threaded MIPS CPU with IEEE754 FPU and 128KB second- level cache provides 875 DMIPS capability enabling systems to support advanced applications with a fast response time, JAVA-based applications and 3D games..." here


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## am7crew

Considering dealers have it in hands for beta testing I think its safe to say it exists, when itll come out? Who knows. Last I heard was Feb 2010 but thats about to have come and gone.


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## Sarahcat

It's still Vaporware to the best of my knowledge. It's vaporware by the best definition until it's actually available. Demonstrating a product in January, 2009 and still not having a release date almost 14 months later is pretty much awful. My last 2 year contract with Dish expired in...January, 2009. We still use the VIP622 because we don't want to re-sign a contract with Dish and get stuck with and obsolete system. 

I've had Dish service for almost 12 years and I've had America's Everything programming as long as it's existed. Prior to that, I had all basic and premium programming that was available and I've had HD programming for over 3 years.

If DirecTV comes out with a better product, I'll probably go with them. All we really want is access to cable networks and premium movies. No interest in any of the sports networks, religious networks, or shopping channels. There's a lot of useless wasted bandwidth on satellite and cable systems, but we happily pay for it because we have little real choice. I really would like a better DVR and the demonstration of the VIP922 last year at CES led me to believe it was 'around the corner'. Dish really screwed up by announcing and promoting something that is this late.

Apple has a far better record with its new product releases. :nono2:


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## Stewart Vernon

I tend to agree it is a mistake for companies to make big splash announcements, especially at trade shows, and then not deliver...

But who are they really harming other than themselves?

It's not like people are paying for the 922 that hasn't been released yet... so it's not smart business, but it doesn't hurt existing customers.

Most tech products are in development cycles long before the public ever hears about them anyway... so almost anything that comes out "new" is really a couple or more years old in design... so the only real "mistake" here is Dish showing the receiver at CES in 2009 when apparently it must not have been ready for prime time since we are a year later and still no mainstream release.


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## olguy

Stewart Vernon said:


> I tend to agree it is a mistake for companies to make big splash announcements, especially at trade shows, and then not deliver...
> 
> But who are they really harming other than themselves?
> 
> It's not like people are paying for the 922 that hasn't been released yet... so it's not smart business, but it doesn't hurt existing customers.
> 
> Most tech products are in development cycles long before the public ever hears about them anyway... so almost anything that comes out "new" is really a couple or more years old in design... so the only real "mistake" here is Dish showing the receiver at CES in 2009 when apparently it must not have been ready for prime time since we are a year later and still no mainstream release.


I wonder just how many of the 13 million or so subs are even aware of the 922? I just imagine the vast majority of subs will be pleasantly surprised when it is released.


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## paja

Stewart Vernon said:


> I tend to agree it is a mistake for companies to make big splash announcements, especially at trade shows, and then not deliver...
> 
> But who are they really harming other than themselves?
> 
> It's not like people are paying for the 922 that hasn't been released yet... so it's not smart business, but it doesn't hurt existing customers.
> 
> Most tech products are in development cycles long before the public ever hears about them anyway... so almost anything that comes out "new" is really a couple or more years old in design... so the only real "mistake" here is Dish showing the receiver at CES in 2009 when apparently it must not have been ready for prime time since we are a year later and still no mainstream release.


Same thing happened with MITS and the road to Laservue (or you may call it Laserbust). It was coming, coming for years. Finally, after many people who were waiting for it moved on, it finally was released to less than spectacular reviews and a ridiculous price point(I thought the pq sucked) and was pulled from the market pending a possible next generation. These companies never learn.:nono2:


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## phrelin

Stewart Vernon said:


> It's not like people are paying for the 922 that hasn't been released yet... so it's not smart business, but it doesn't hurt existing customers.


Maybe, maybe not.

While the Dish Network receiver oriented fee structure increases could be explained with a sold business plan, that plan could include an R&D subsidy for Echostar development costs that include projects that ultimately result in failure. There is the pharmaceutical company R&D model that builds in a substantial R&D factor.

Or Charlie could be paying for all that 922 R&D out of his pocket.


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## HobbyTalk

Releasing information on a desirable product can have good or bad effects. In the case of computers it can be a bad effect as people wait to buy a new one while they wait for a new version. This is one main reason Apple tries to keep new versions secret, it can ravage current sales. On the other hand, in Dish's case, it can keep subscribers from moving on to other providers while they wait for the products release.

Maybe it's working. In the past year Dish's subscribers numbers have improved as Direc's numbers have tanked.


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## Jim5506

I'm glad Dish may SOON put out an new receiver, because it will depress prices of older receivers.

I do not covet a 922, I do not see its features as any kind of panacea.


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## Michael1

Stewart Vernon said:


> I tend to agree it is a mistake for companies to make big splash announcements, especially at trade shows, and then not deliver...


This is quite common at CES. Companies show a lot of emerging technology, that may or may not end up on store shelves. Dish may have been better though not giving the model a number during the 2009 show, and just called it some sort of prototype name.

Michael


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## Emanon

dishnetwork dot com/ tveverywhere / default dot aspx 

The VIP 922 is at the above link.


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## tampa8

Don't remember it being on the website. I believe I saw a working one (work in progress) at a party in Ct....... you may know who that would be...


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## phrelin

It's been on the web site since right around Feb 1 when they overhauled the site. It also includes the Dish version of the 700U, etc., the branded version of the stuff on the Sling Media web site.

Still vaporware as far as I'm concerned.


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## HobbyTalk

Last word is that the latest software is a big improvement. They now have the sling part slinging HD in very good quality. It could be out in April.


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## puckwithahalo

I won't say what exactly, but I am seeing signs that it may be just around the corner.


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## GrumpyBear

HobbyTalk said:


> Last word is that the latest software is a big improvement. They now have the sling part slinging HD in very good quality. It could be out in April.


I think that with all the MRV/Home DVR solutions coming out/already released from the competion. Dish will make sure that the Sling is working prior to the release of ViP922, and is most likely the reason for the hold up. Nice to hear that Sling is working, gives hope that soon is getting soon.


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## Paul Secic

SDiego said:


> Dishdepot has a msrp of $699.99 I wonder if that what the price will charged to your credit card when dishdepot ships them. Kinda steep.


WOW! I'll keep my VIP 722.


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## Paul Secic

Jim5506 said:


> I'm glad Dish may SOON put out an new receiver, because it will depress prices of older receivers.
> 
> I do not covet a 922, I do not see its features as any kind of panacea.


The 922 sounds like more like a computer. Keyboarding on a TV? I don't see it.


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## GrumpyBear

Paul Secic said:


> The 922 sounds like more like a computer. Keyboarding on a TV? I don't see it.


For an internet tuner, a keyboard has lots of uses. Not to mention it would make doing search's by name alot easier to do, when looking for a show, or setting up a dishpass. We have no idea if the internet tuner will be anything like the xbox360 live style interface with Netflix and Facebook support too.


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## Stewart Vernon

I don't really care about Internet access on my TV... but using a keyboard for searching would be easier than the virtual keyboard we have on our Dish receivers now.


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## P Smith

I'm pretty sure they're using keyboard for internal testing.


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## James Long

puckwithahalo said:


> I won't say what exactly, but I am seeing signs that it may be just around the corner.


It will be nice when that corner is one in customers homes.

Although I have become accustomed to my 622 and added my own Slingbox. The 922 seems like eye candy. I've seen a lot of improvements in the 622 that I never expected and a year ago I probably would have traded one in for a 922 in a heartbeat. But now that heartbeat is slower. I'll keep the 622 for now.

(Then again, I drive a 1999 vehicle ... so I am accustomed to older models. I'm a middle aged model myself!)


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## jkane

Stewart Vernon said:


> I don't really care about Internet access on my TV... but using a keyboard for searching would be easier than the virtual keyboard we have on our Dish receivers now.


Internet streaming (as much as I personally despise the lower quality sound and video) is the next major change in home television. Watch for it in the next 5 years.


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## GrumpyBear

jkane said:


> Internet streaming (as much as I personally despise the lower quality sound and video) is the next major change in home television. Watch for it in the next 5 years.


Internet Streaming isn't for all, but just look at all the effort, Netflix, Blockbuster, and Amazon are putting into it, for starters, to see the growing interest. Hulu thinking about charging for its service, shows an even stonger market of it. 
I personally enjoy using my xbox360 for Netflix, works great. I am not that worried about Hulu, and Youtube, being on my TV, but some will be. I hate it when the kids use the xbox360 for messaging and facebook, and use the TV for that crap, but its a growing market.

I am pretty good at abc typing using the remote instead of having to use the onscreen keyboard. I actually prefer it to the stupid layout onscreen keyboard. A real keyboard will help all those that have no wish for internet, but want to do a search or Dishpass


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## HobbyTalk

jkane said:


> Internet streaming (as much as I personally despise the lower quality sound and video) is the next major change in home television. Watch for it in the next 5 years.


The ISPs are already putting in caps that will prevent that. How much HD are you going to stream in a month with a 250G cap?


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## GrumpyBear

HobbyTalk said:


> The ISPs are already putting in caps that will prevent that. How much HD are you going to stream in a month with a 250G cap?


ISP's are putting in caps, but its just away to make more money.
Right now you pay for just a upload, download rate, and with unlimited cap on HOW much. 2 yrs out you will be seeing, Download speed, upload Speed, as a base, and option for x amount on how much you can download over a setbase.
ISP's are looking for extra revenue streams, just like everybody else, and having uncapped access for all, is a waste of a revenue stream.


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## HobbyTalk

Nope, a number of ISPs alrerady have caps. The biggest cable operator, Comcast, has a 250G cap. Go over and they will shut you down.... no overage fees.

If you have a low base and they charge for over that, how is that better then paying a cable or Sat company for TV?

A recent proposal by TW was customers will be charged $1 for each gigabyte (GB) over their plan's cap. Time Warner Cable offers four cap levels of 5, 10, 20, and 40 GB. So watching 5 or 6 HD movies will put you at the cap. Each additional 8GB movie will cost you $8.

A recent report from Sanford C. Bernstein suggests that a family on the 40 GB plan that streams 7.25 hours of online video a week (a fraction of the 60 hours Americans spend watching TV in a week) could end up spending $200 per month on broadband usage fees.


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## Guest

This free/pay streaming content is great. But it's not really fair. Broadband access is not available to everyone. I have a choice. Dialup or satellite. No dsl, no cable ever, and no cellular/wireless for probably years to come (and if it does, 5gb cap most likely). So, I pay $49.95 for "up to" 512Kbps down and 128Kbps up, a 7.5GB rolling 30 day cap, traffic shaping, and 1300ms+ pings. If I pay more money, I get more speed, and a slightly higher download cap. If I would move to the closest town, I would get "up to" 756Kbps up and down, unlimited, but still pay $49.95. I can look at ebay, update my operating system. Maybe watch a couple youtubes, it's constantly watching the limit every day.

I see people complaining all the time, and this complaining here of maybe a 250gb cap?? It seems that a lot of people are very spoiled in this country, a lot of people would do anything for a fraction of how lucky some of you are.


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## GrumpyBear

HobbyTalk said:


> Nope, a number of ISPs alrerady have caps. The biggest cable operator, Comcast, has a 250G cap. Go over and they will shut you down.... no overage fees.
> 
> If you have a low base and they charge for over that, how is that better then paying a cable or Sat company for TV?
> 
> A recent proposal by TW was customers will be charged $1 for each gigabyte (GB) over their plan's cap. Time Warner Cable offers four cap levels of 5, 10, 20, and 40 GB. So watching 5 or 6 HD movies will put you at the cap. Each additional 8GB movie will cost you $8.
> 
> A recent report from Sanford C. Bernstein suggests that a family on the 40 GB plan that streams 7.25 hours of online video a week (a fraction of the 60 hours Americans spend watching TV in a week) could end up spending $200 per month on broadband usage fees.


HUGE difference from REPLACING Cable or Sat, to augmenting. Streaming wont replace Cable, SAT, FIOS, UVERSE, streaming will augment those services. You already have devices already working with streaming solutions NOW. Most Blu-Ray players will work with Netflix, Amazon or Blockbuster online, this will continue to grow, Caps will be much higher than proposed now. We already watch more than 6 HD movies a month, sometimes do that in a WEEK. I know for a fact how many BILLIONS AT&T spent in building up its service for not only Uverse, but for DSL as well, not to mention how much they spend on support and services to ensure, a minimum of 4hr down time.
I wouldn't be looking at a Cable provider for a pricing point, as they will always gouge until competition comes out with real pricing.


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## GrumpyBear

ranch_guy said:


> This free/pay streaming content is great. But it's not really fair. Broadband access is not available to everyone. I have a choice. Dialup or satellite. No dsl, no cable ever, and no cellular/wireless for probably years to come (and if it does, 5gb cap most likely). So, I pay $49.95 for "up to" 512Kbps down and 128Kbps up, a 7.5GB rolling 30 day cap, traffic shaping, and 1300ms+ pings. If I pay more money, I get more speed, and a slightly higher download cap. If I would move to the closest town, I would get "up to" 756Kbps up and down, unlimited, but still pay $49.95. I can look at ebay, update my operating system. Maybe watch a couple youtubes, it's constantly watching the limit every day.
> 
> I see people complaining all the time, and this complaining here of maybe a 250gb cap?? It seems that a lot of people are very spoiled in this country, a lot of people would do anything for a fraction of how lucky some of you are.


What really sucks, is when you have somebody visiting, that is used to having a broadband connection, and starts streaming, and Hughes Net then slams your service to a crawl for violating the fair usage portion of your contract. I pay for my parents Hughes Net service, and forget when I go up there.


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## HobbyTalk

GrumpyBear said:


> HUGE difference from REPLACING Cable or Sat, to augmenting.


I agree, the original quote was



jkane said:


> Internet streaming (as much as I personally despise the lower quality sound and video) is the next major change in home television. Watch for it in the next 5 years.


I don't see it becoming any more then a supplemental service for many many years. All of the broadband providers (cable co., AT&T, FIOS, etc.) have too much invested to allow that to happen. While network/premium channel content may change over to IP, or even internet based, you will still pay for it. Comedy Channel pulling Colbert from Hulu is just the beginning I think.

Sure CBS, NBC, ESPN, etc. may offer some direct pay programming but the costs will be FAR more expensive then a cable, Sat., etc. package.


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## GrumpyBear

HobbyTalk said:


> I agree, the original quote was
> 
> I don't see it becoming any more then a supplemental service for many many years. All of the broadband providers (cable co., AT&T, FIOS, etc.) have too much invested to allow that to happen. While network/premium channel content may change over to IP, or even internet based, you will still pay for it. Comedy Channel pulling Colbert from Hulu is just the beginning I think.
> 
> Sure CBS, NBC, ESPN, etc. may offer some direct pay programming but the costs will be FAR more expensive then a cable, Sat., etc. package.


Yep, total agreement on all of the above. Only thing I would add is the days of FREE online streaming will be ending, and sooner than it should be ending.


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## phrelin

And if you want to stream the important parts of "The Daily Show" or "The Colbert Report" you can go to www.comedycentral.com and sit through a 30 second Verizon commercial. And shows like "The Sarah Silverman Program" are available on DVD.

Otherwise, you'd have to pay $24.99 a month for Dish America HD-only to get Comedy Central, Syfy, Discovery, etc. And getting it with a dual DVR would cost another $6 a month and if you want to save large quantities of stuff for later viewing you have to spring of a USB external hard drive.

Dealing with web sites is so much more appealing.


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## Guest

GrumpyBear said:


> What really sucks, is when you have somebody visiting, that is used to having a broadband connection, and starts streaming, and Hughes Net then slams your service to a crawl for violating the fair usage portion of your contract. I pay for my parents Hughes Net service, and forget when I go up there.


One of the reasons I chose Wildblue at the time (also it's cheaper per month), it's a 30 day rolling limit, not a daily cap like Hughesnet. You can use the whole 7.5 GB in one day, but you have to wait 30 days for that to roll off. A little room to work with if a person needs to download something big. If you go over, they slow you down, until enough usage rolls off to be at 70% (I think, maybe 80%, not looking it up now) of the 30 day cap. Going to the DSL in town, it's AMAZING how much faster that 756Kbps is. Lower pings and all, pages load much faster.

I found this thread, because I was waiting for the 922. I've had the same receiver for 10 years, figured I'd upgrade this time. But now that I've seen the thing, don't know if I want it. I don't like the controller, or using a mouse on the screen, etc. And now the deal with Tivo. Thinking I might just build a home theater pc and call it good enough. Time to throw out the VCR..., though I don't mind using the old thing. Might just go back to the old c-band dish, miss that thing, never got around to taking the thing down.


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## olguy

ranch-guy said:


> This free/pay streaming content is great. But it's not really fair. Broadband access is not available to everyone.


You want some cheese with that whine? Where is it writ that all shall be fair?


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## Guest

olguy said:


> You want some cheese with that whine? Where is it writ that all shall be fair?


OF COURSE! I LOVE CHEESE!

Threads a bit derailed anyway, so, whining not much more than those complaining of caps being imposed on their service. As well as other things (the subject of the thread is whining? I think?). Why did you call me out on my whining, why not the others?? (guess that's whining some more, more cheese please)


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## Stewart Vernon

_We should probably all go and get a snack, instead of starting to fight with each other. I think this thread has probably ran its useful course.

Let's all agree either to start a new thread when the 922 comes out OR discuss the 2nd anniversary next January if it still hasn't been released.

Closing thread for now._


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