# Multi-Room Viewing: How much would you pay for installation?



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Was thinking this morning .. I think there will be a charge for upgrading most folks systems to be MRV ready. While I don't know whether DECA/SWM installation will be necessary or not, let's assume for a moment that it will be.

So, in this scenario, if you don't accept the installation charge, you will be without MRV (this is a hypothetical at the moment).

We also don't know what the monthly MRV charge is going to be, but there will be one. Again, another assumption .. Whatever the MRV fee is, you will find it acceptable (even if zero is your "acceptable" level).

All I'm really looking at is how much folks might be willing to pay for installation of new equipment to bring your entire system up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM and, when applicable, upgraded receivers. This would be a one size fits all fee.


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## gpg (Aug 19, 2006)

I pay for the protection plan every month so I think installation charges should be waived for protection plan customers.

MRV is working flawlessly on my home network, so I am unwilling to pay a one-time fee for the privilege of paying a monthly fee for a feature that should be free in the first place!


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## Starchy77 (Jul 18, 2008)

MRV is currently working at my house, so if DTV decides to change something that would require me to install new equipment, etc. I think they should pay for it.


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## irlspotter (Dec 14, 2006)

If my network is already installed and everything is working great, why should I have to pay more to get MRV compliant??? I ran the cables and I already paid for my switches and routers. It is working flawlessly. Why should it be a requirement to get MRV. If I do not use DECA, then it should be free for MRV!!! DIsh and UVerse do not charge to view in any room, why should D*????


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

$0.00 - Never answer the question when the salesman asks "how much do you think you can handle per month?..."


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> $0.00 - Never answer the question when the salesman asks "how much do you think you can handle per month?..."


I'm not selling anything .. I'm just curious. No one at DIRECTV asked me to create this poll either. Just thought it might be a good time to brainstorm.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

I voted abstain. I really don't know at this point in time. I like MRV, I want MRV, but I do not know how much I am willing to pay. I'll decide that when DirecTV tells me what the cost will be. Until then, my choice is zero.


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## Lee L (Aug 15, 2002)

irlspotter said:


> If my network is already installed and everything is working great, why should I have to pay more to get MRV compliant??? I ran the cables and I already paid for my switches and routers. It is working flawlessly. Why should it be a requirement to get MRV. If I do not use DECA, then it should be free for MRV!!! DIsh and UVerse do not charge to view in any room, why should D*????


This is more or less how I feel. I don't love the idea of a fee for MRV, but I will accept it, but requiring me to pay to install more equipment that takes the place of equipment and infrastructure I already have working 100% fine is a non-starter.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> I'm not selling anything .. I'm just curious. No one at DIRECTV asked me to create this poll either. Just thought it might be a good time to brainstorm.


I was not accusing, although reading it back I can see how you might take it that way. Appologies on that. I was merely stating that it doesn't seem prudent (as with the How much for MRV? Poll) to offer this information voluntarily, especially in a place where the "salesman" is known to hang out from time to time...

But seriously, my answer is still $0.00. I have a network already, but it would require signing a new commitment in order to upgrade the SD DVR in the bedroom and it's just not that desirable a feature. Even if I had capable hardware, I would still not pay to play in MRV if forced to take and pay for an inferior DECA solution.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Doug Brott said:


> I'm not selling anything .. I'm just curious. No one at DIRECTV asked me to create this poll either. Just thought it might be a good time to brainstorm.


Nothing wrong with that.

Its good to get a pulse on this, despite the fact that DirecTV will do what they decide to do.

There are various possibilities, but it is still a good idea to understand the sentiment - in the past - this kind of information was passed back to contacts there, and likely the Moderators can do the same here.

I hope for existing networks to be sufficient, but then, I see some added value in the SWM/DECA infrastructure as well (for other purposes down the road, not just MRV).


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

Doug Brott said:


> All I'm really looking at is how much folks might be willing to pay for installation of new equipment to bring your entire system up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM and, when applicable, upgraded receivers. This would be a one size fits all fee.


Doug,

I've been quite vocal about my opposition of the MRV fee elsewhere, and this is obviously not the thread for that. I've also been quite vocal about defending any possible install fee from DirecTV... but if I was in charge of making decisions, I'd have two different install fee structures:

*$49 (One Year Commitment)* - Equipment/Install Fee - Covers the installation of SWM/DECA equipment. No monthly fee.

*$99 (Two Year Commitment)* - Receiver/Equipment/Install Fee - Covers the installation of SWM/DECA equipment, and replaces any receiver not capable of MRV. No monthly fee.

If DirecTV charges a -$2 fee, I'd stick with the same fee structures. If DirecTV charges $2+, I'd either get rid of the $99 structure, or offer it free with an MRV commitment depending on the monthly fee cost.

*NOTE #1:* Though my top two choices state no monthly fee, I'd actually offer the ability to break the installation fee into 12 monthly payments.

*NOTE #2:* Due to not knowing which way the wind is blowing, I chose not to vote in the poll. I did however want to comment on the question.

~Alan


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> I would still not pay to play in MRV if forced to take and pay for an inferior DECA solution.


All things aside [I agree with all but], I have DECA and it is not "inferior" in any way to my wired network.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> All things aside [I agree with all but], I have DECA and it is not "inferior" in any way to my wired network.


Can you run other ethernet devices on it? I was under the impression that the DECA adapters would only operate with D* receivers...


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> Can you run other ethernet devices on it? I was under the impression that the DECA adapters would only operate with D* receivers...


Why would that make it inferior?


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

I voted $0. I already have a SWM setup, so all I would need are the DECA adapters. I am perfectly capable of installing them myself. I would pay a reasonable price for the adapters themselves, but would prefer to install them myself.

While I might take the day to wait for installer to bring the adapters and install them, I most certainly would not pay $49 for that. I'm assuming that your poll is for the installation call only. Since some people would need SWM and some wouldn't, you couldn't possibly have the same price for both scenarios. Again, I would be willing to pay for a charge for the actual DECA adapters.


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## shuye (Oct 20, 2008)

Given your assumptions, I voted $99 for a fee for the typical customer who might need to upgrade receivers, SWiM, and have DECA installed. (customers should have the option of splitting the fee over several months if needed).

Now for customers who already have SWiM, and the hardware needed along with ethernet connections as suggested by DirecTV for On Demand features, then there should be no upfront fee or a reduced fee just for the DECA which could be offered as a self install.

Given this, I think that that the actual MRV feature should be included in the DVR fee that is charged each month and not a separate cost on the bill. If they have to, raise the DVR fee $1 and sell it as additional features with a DVR.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> Can you run other ethernet devices on it? I was under the impression that the DECA adapters would only operate with D* receivers...


Your impression isn't correct.
While I have DECAs on all my receivers, I also have one bridging to my home network and a switch. There isn't any reason I couldn't use one on my receiver and connect it also to a switch and cluster the devices there.
As with any network, you can go overboard with the number of devices connected though.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I'll accept your what-ifs for the sake of answering the question:
Shouldn't that amount be highly dependent on what you have already? Someone with H21 and up and SWM already shouldn't be on the hook for as much as someone who has a houseful of old RCA and Tivo units and a single LNB 18" dish.....


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> I'll accept your what-ifs for the sake of answering the question:
> Shouldn't that amount be highly dependent on what you have already? Someone with H21 and up and SWM already shouldn't be on the hook for as much as someone who has a houseful of old RCA and Tivo units and a single LNB 18" dish.....


I would think, you'd need to have H/HR2x to even be part of this upgrade.
SD & Tivos would have additional costs to be replaced.


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> I would think, you'd need to have H/HR2x to even be part of this upgrade.
> SD & Tivos would have additional costs to be replaced.


Re-read Doug's original post. 



Doug Brott said:


> All I'm really looking at is how much folks might be willing to pay for installation of new equipment to bring your entire system up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM *and, when applicable, upgraded receivers.* This would be a one size fits all fee.


~Alan


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> Re-read Doug's original post.
> 
> ~Alan


I have and still think the same.
Since there is no networking of older receivers, upgrading these would be in addition to "this" upgrade.
You may think otherwise, but the $99 charge was floated by DirecTV earlier and there was nothing about upgrading all receivers to HD.
Replacing receivers was more directed at the H20s that have no networking, yet are MPEG-4 capable.
Even after you edit, it's still the same: "when applicable".


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> I have and still think the same.
> Since there is no networking of older receivers, upgrading these would be in addition to "this" upgrade.
> You may think otherwise, but the $99 charge was floated by DirecTV earlier and there was nothing about upgrading all receivers to HD.
> Replacing receivers was more directed at the H20s that have no networking, yet are MPEG-4 capable.
> Even after you edit, it's still the same: "when applicable".


So... apparently *I* misunderstood Doug's post.

I read it to say "how much would you pay to bring your *entire system* up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM and, when applicable, upgraded receivers."

I was not aware that the receiver replacement was directed toward the H20.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. 

~Alan


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## BudShark (Aug 11, 2003)

I voted $49, but echo the sentiments that its highly dependent on what is included and size/etc. In my case I have DECA, SWM already. So if you're talking about adapters for my non-DECA connected receivers so they play nice and to clean up some of my wiring - sure, $49 is fair.

If however, DirecTV has a larger "vision" and this includes replacing my SWM-8 with a SWMLine dish, and upgrading my non-DECA built in receivers to newer models with built0in DECA when those come out... well I just might be willing to go over $99 for that luxury. :grin:


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

Let's go with that, then. Say I have a household full of H20-700's complete with cheap, hot, and prone to failure power supplies (had to get that dig in). I have an old dish, a WB68, and an old HR20-700 (or is it 600? the one that can't stand voltage below 118....). Now, should the guy who has all HR and H21 and up series, SWM already in place, who only needs a handful of DECA modules pay the same upgrade price? That's a substantially different cost basis.....



veryoldschool said:


> I have and still think the same.
> Since there is no networking of older receivers, upgrading these would be in addition to "this" upgrade.
> You may think otherwise, but the $99 charge was floated by DirecTV earlier and there was nothing about upgrading all receivers to HD.
> Replacing receivers was more directed at the H20s that have no networking, yet are MPEG-4 capable.
> Even after you edit, it's still the same: "when applicable".


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## BudShark (Aug 11, 2003)

Alan Gordon said:


> So... apparently *I* misunderstood Doug's post.
> 
> I read it to say "how much would you pay to bring your *entire system* up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM and, when applicable, upgraded receivers."
> 
> ...


 I don't think anyone knows. However, reading this thread, I can't possibly imagine a $99 upgrade if it was to bring all receivers to current standards. I don't know who WOULDN'T take that deal... :grin:


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> So... apparently *I* misunderstood Doug's post.
> 
> I read it to say "how much would you pay to bring your *entire system* up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM and, when applicable, upgraded receivers."
> 
> ...


Hey "that's my take".
Since MPEG-4 is needed for HD, it seems upgrading MPEG-2 only receivers would be "over the top" & the $99 charge sure wouldn't cover them.
SWiM/DECA was the focus, and H20s not having a network jack would need to be replaced.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> Let's go with that, then. Say I have a household full of H20-700's complete with cheap, hot, and prone to failure power supplies (had to get that dig in). I have an old dish, a WB68, and an old HR20-700 (or is it 600? the one that can't stand voltage below 118....). Now, should the guy who has all HR and H21 and up series, SWM already in place, who only needs a handful of DECA modules pay the same upgrade price? That's a substantially different cost basis.....


"Hey this isn't my idea" :lol:
What's the cost of a service call?
What's the cost of each DECA?
The service call we can guess, though maybe not the length/time.
I can only guess the $99 fee would need to be averaged over all customers for it to come anywhere near "even".


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## houskamp (Sep 14, 2006)

It already works.. $0.00..

so will they come out and run all the new cable to keep my OTA working too? :grin:


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

They'd have to cost average, and that would be fair. I can argue against myself, too, and say those that are set such that they need very little to finish it out have already put a lot of time and money into their own systems (I'm thinking of me), and that was their decision, can't fault DirecTV for that one.



veryoldschool said:


> "Hey this isn't my idea" :lol:
> What's the cost of a service call?
> What's the cost of each DECA?
> The service call we can guess, though maybe not the length/time.
> I can only guess the $99 fee would need to be averaged over all customers for it to come anywhere near "even".


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## chevyguy559 (Sep 19, 2008)

I voted $0.00 since I have MRV working already on my network. I would, however, be open to paying a $49 or $99 fee if my H20's are swapped and I incur no commitment extension.


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## JeffBowser (Dec 21, 2006)

I forgot about that. This probably results in yet another commitment extension, especially if replacement STB's are involved, to defray the costs.



chevyguy559 said:


> I voted $0.00 since I have MRV working already on my network. I would, however, be open to paying a $49 or $99 fee if my H20's are swapped and I incur no commitment extension.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

JeffBowser said:


> I forgot about that. This probably results in yet another commitment extension, especially if replacement STB's are involved, to defray the costs.


I'd have to also figure there was some commitment for this too.

What has NEVER been mentioned [anywhere] is a DIY for DECAs. :nono:


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

BudShark said:


> I don't think anyone knows. However, reading this thread, I can't possibly imagine a $99 upgrade if it was to bring all receivers to current standards. I don't know who WOULDN'T take that deal... :grin:


Honestly... if given a choice between my old Sony B65 SD receiver, or one of DirecTV's current D1x receivers, I'd choose it. If given a choice between an HD version of the B65 or an H2x, I'd choose the B65. Obviously there are also older receivers which I find inferior to the D1x or H2x receivers, BUT I can think of reasons why one might not want to get rid of older receivers.

The ability to use MRV (throughout the house) is a good reason to upgrade though.

However, let's say that a DirecTV customer with an HR20-700, and two older legacy SD receivers wants MRV. They'd need to pay a (rumored $99 according to VoS) upgrade fee... then you'd need to tack on the costs of two new receivers... and then you'd add on a monthly fee to that. That's quite a bit of cash to put out to use a feature.

~Alan


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> However, let's say that a DirecTV customer with an HR20-700, and two older legacy SD receivers wants MRV. They'd need to pay a (rumored $99 according to VoS) upgrade fee... then you'd need to tack on the costs of two new receivers... and then you'd add on a monthly fee to that. That's quite a bit of cash to put out to use a feature.
> 
> ~Alan


First off without another H2x, MRV isn't an option.
It only works between H2x & HR2x, so not having them means an upgrade of receivers anyway.
This "upgrade" is directed at those that have had the new HD receivers and:


Don't have SWiM
Haven't been networked
or are using wireless or powerline adapters for DOD.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

I said $0 because I won't need anything unless they make it DECA only.

However my guess is it will be identicle to the OTA order where it's $99 for installation and $50 per swap out.


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## webby_s (Jan 11, 2008)

Have SWMLine (self installed)
Have DECA (self installed)
Have all tv locations with Network cabability (self installed)
Love DECA
Love SWM
Worked hard at getting it all installed myself.
Abstain from voting!

BUT I think to upgrade to DECA (which I would highly recommend!) and possibly upgrading the "outdated recievers" all with a truck roll out to the house should cost something probably between the $49-$99 mark.


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> First off without another H2x, MRV isn't an option.


EXACTLY! 



veryoldschool said:


> It only works between H2x & HR2x, so not having them means an upgrade of receivers anyway.


EXACTLY! 



veryoldschool said:


> This "upgrade" is directed at those that have had the new HD receivers and:
> 
> 
> Don't have SWiM
> ...


*"How much would you pay for installation to become MRV compliant?"*​
~Alan


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## woj027 (Sep 3, 2007)

I didn't vote (or abstain) I'm still thinking. But I have other follow up questions.

What if I build my own home, or re-wire my current house?

Is there a thread somewhere that compares and contrasts DECA vs Networked (Cat 5e, Cat 6e, etc).

Right now I'm looking at moving, and if I build I'd like to know if I should be running 2 cables to the outlets, or one cable and 1 network.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> EXACTLY!
> 
> EXACTLY!
> *
> ...


Vote the way you feel.
"Realistically" added upgrades most likely will cost more.


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

I would be willing to pay, but there is no way any D* tech is going to touch my stuff. They can drop it off and leave, but they are not touching my equipment. If this is just a money grab by D*, I will pay since I can't go back to not having MRV, but their techs aren't coming though the door.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

woj027 said:


> Right now I'm looking at moving, and if I build I'd like to know if I should be running 2 cables to the outlets, or one cable and 1 network.


The short answer is one cable would work for everything with SWiM & DECA.


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## woj027 (Sep 3, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> The short answer is one cable would work for everything with SWiM & DECA.


Thanks, I'm going to have to read up on DECA more.


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## webby_s (Jan 11, 2008)

woj027 said:


> I didn't vote (or abstain)Is there a thread somewhere that compares and contrasts DECA vs Networked (Cat 5e, Cat 6e, etc).


Not that I know of


> Right now I'm looking at moving, and if I build I'd like to know if I should be running 2 cables to the outlets, or one cable and 1 network.


I recently moved and I have 3 cable runs and 3 network runs. Off of one of those cable runs I then have the DECA!!

Here is my reasonings: I wanna get one of those TV's with internet ready apps and stuff... But I have heard bad reviews Oh well
I have an XBOX 360, so there is two networks right there then who knows what you MAY need for the third.

With the cable runs I have 2 RG6 runs for Dirctv expansion even though I have SWM and the last cable run is RG59 for OTA.

So there are my 6 Keystone plate filled up.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

I abstained.

I’ve wondered about this very thing.

I already have SWiM, so let’s say I have an H24, it’s connected to my home Ethernet, and MRV currently works via Ethernet.

Now, if it’s decided that to run MRV you must use DECA via SWiM, (I have no problem with this BTW) then do I have to pay for an installer to come and put three DECA adapters on my HR20, HR21, and HR23? 

Or, would the paid install only be for the full blown DECA/SWiM and I could self-install the adapters on an existing SWiM? 

Would a SWiM install be required to even get the H24? In which case, the non-SWiM customer would be locked out of having MRV (which I don’t see happening)?

This is a quagmire with a myriad of install configurations so who would get charged an install fee, and at what point would the sub be able to do a self-install...or will it be required to have an installer verify the system setup prior to DirecTV turning on MRV? 

Now my head hurts. :grin:

Mike


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

The only reason for DirecTV to ever visit my location is to install/tweak the Dish.

And every receiver location already has a hardwired Ethernet port, all homerun cabled to a 16-port (soon 24-port) Switch.

No need for any other 3rd-party installation activity, so $0. 

Will gladly pay the MRV fee, if required to get awesome MRV.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

MicroBeta said:


> ..... Now my head hurts. :grin:
> 
> Mike


Does anybody still wonder why this is in "Beta"? :lol:


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

woj027 said:


> I didn't vote (or abstain) I'm still thinking. But I have other follow up questions.
> 
> What if I build my own home, or re-wire my current house?
> 
> ...


From what I've read/experienced, there doesn't seem to be any MRV perfromance differences between DECA and Ethernet.

I think the point is that SWiM/DECA is a single solution that is easier for DirecTV to troubleshoot. Otherwise they have to try to figure out the many different network setups and that would be tough, if not impossible.

Mike


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## webby_s (Jan 11, 2008)

MicroBeta said:


> if not impossible.
> 
> Mike


I go with, it would be darn near impossible.
:sure:


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

Here's another head-scratcher. Say that I have two SWiM-8's in parallel, with MRV-compatible receivers off each one. Does that get replaced with an as-yet-unreleased SWiM-16 so that all the now-DECA-connected boxes can "see" each other? After all, the DECA cloud has to be off a single SWiM leg to work. 

Yep, this is fundamentally a mess. :nono:

(I voted $79, by the way, in the interests of full disclosure and knowing full well I already have SOME but not all of the bits necessary to go all-DECA.)


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

webby_s said:


> I go with, it would be darn near impossible.
> :sure:


I agree, it definitely would be "darn near impossible".

How many routers are there, how many different switches, how many different wireless adapters, which firmware versions, how the heck can you get the general subscriber to figure out to upgrade their firmware, Cat5, Cat5e, Cat6, wireless, etc...

I'm gonna to get an aspirin. 

Mike


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## MartyS (Dec 29, 2006)

I abstained for right now. 

I would prefer not to bother with any of it, and run it off of my network, the way it's working now. It's flawless and doesn't need to be fixed.

In my case, I'd need the SWM, I'd probably need a new dish (I have the AT-9) and adaptors for my 4 units. A significant investment on D*'s part, for something that is working currently.

$99 would be reasonable, I assume, but only without a contract extension. It's not something I need to use the feature, it's not something I want to have to do, and it's in essence providing no additional benefit.

I the tech folks at D* want to have their consistency for support, then by all means go ahead, but don't force me to extend my commitment for 2 years just so that they can have consistency.

Since they're most likely targeting new users, those of us that are completely networked are a very small percentage of the market out there. They could easily allow us to keep our current commitment dates and provide the installation at a nominal cost. They still own the boxes, and they own the DECAs, so if i decide to leave they'll get all their "stuff" back and be able to pass it on to another customer.


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

LameLefty said:


> Here's another head-scratcher. Say that I have two SWiM-8's in parallel, with MRV-compatible receivers off each one. Does that get replaced with an as-yet-unreleased SWiM-16 so that all the now-DECA-connected boxes can "see" each other? After all, the DECA cloud has to be off a single SWiM leg to work.
> 
> Yep, this is fundamentally a mess. :nono:


Ahha, you raise a great point. Exact same scenario here.

Two SWM-8's (and all 7 receiver locations have hardwire Ethernet connectivity).


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

LameLefty said:


> Here's another head-scratcher. Say that I have two SWiM-8's in parallel, with MRV-compatible receivers off each one. Does that get replaced with an as-yet-unreleased SWiM-16 so that all the now-DECA-connected boxes can "see" each other? After all, the DECA cloud has to be off a single SWiM leg to work.
> 
> Yep, this is fundamentally a mess. :nono:





Sixto said:


> Ahha, you raise a great point. Exact same scenario here.
> 
> Two SWM-8's (and all 7 receiver locations have hardwire Ethernet connectivity).


Similar situation here with 2 parallel SWM's.

This will be interesting to see how things unfold.


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## woj027 (Sep 3, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> The short answer is one cable would work for everything with SWiM & DECA.


Ok so how does OnDemand (via wired internet) work within the SWiM/DECA, or does it? or does it?

Would I need a network cable running to each of my boxes then? Essentially giving me two networks, one using DECA that only contains (supports) my Receivers? and one that is part of my "home" network that supports my computers?

Is this the correct forum to ask these questions?


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

MartyS said:


> ...
> They still own the boxes, and they own the DECAs, so if i decide to leave they'll get all their "stuff" back and be able to pass it on to another customer.


Will they own the DECA's? I assumed that those would be "accessories" that we would own, not lease. I wouldn't think they'd want to keep up with them.


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

woj027 said:


> Ok so how does OnDemand (via wired internet) work within the SWiM/DECA, or does it? or does it?
> 
> Would I need a network cable running to each of my boxes then? Essentially giving me two networks, one using DECA that only contains (supports) my Receivers? and one that is part of my "home" network that supports my computers?
> 
> Is this the correct forum to ask these questions?


No, you don't need a duplicate ethernet network. There would be one DECA adapter that would connect to your network (to the router or a switch) that would provide the "bridge" to your home network to get out to the internet.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

woj027 said:


> Ok so how does OnDemand (via wired internet) work within the SWiM/DECA, or does it? or does it?


A DECA module is connected as a bridge to your router by ethernet. The boxes "see" each other over the coax connection, isolating them from your home LAN, but the "bridge" to your router lets them all connect to the LAN for things like Media Share and On Demand content.


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## longrider (Apr 21, 2007)

Herdfan said:


> I would be willing to pay, but there is no way any D* tech is going to touch my stuff. They can drop it off and leave, but they are not touching my equipment. If this is just a money grab by D*, I will pay since I can't go back to not having MRV, but their techs aren't coming though the door.


I feel the same way. I will not be happy but I will change out the network if I have to (MRV is working fine on my current network) and I will pay for it to keep MRV, but I will NOT have anything 'installed'. I have skipped a Mover's Connection and a free HD dish upgrade both for this reason, I just bought the dishes myself.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

woj027 said:


> Ok so how does OnDemand (via wired internet) work within the SWiM/DECA, or does it? or does it?
> 
> Would I need a network cable running to each of my boxes then? Essentially giving me two networks, one using DECA that only contains (supports) my Receivers? and one that is part of my "home" network that supports my computers?
> 
> Is this the correct forum to ask these questions?


While this may not be the right thread, "DECA is cool" and everything will work with the addition of one more DECA that bridges to your home network.
This can be done by either having a coax run to your router, having a Cat5 cable to where you have coax, or using a wireless/powerline "hop" from the DECA network to your home network.


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## netraa (Mar 28, 2007)

I don't see a possiblity of any one size fits all for an upgrade fee.

Your going to have people with networked rcvrs and swim that (might) only need Deca

your going to have people that have all swim compatible equipment, and networked ird's but a legacy install and only need deca and a swm LNB

your going to have people with older non-swim compatible ird's that are going to either need a swim 8-16, or upgrade to d12's or R16's, deca, and that's it.

then your going to have people with old legacy stuff, no networking, and are going to need a full rebuild.

I don't see how you can possibly do a one size fits all fee for that without loosing the farm on the top hanging fruit, and or blowing the lowest hanging fruit out of the market.


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## iamqnow (Dec 26, 2007)

I could only answer this question if I could see it in action. So far I see nothing. I have 1 HD/DVR with the update, but none of my non DVR/HD receivers have the software. Everything is hard wire networked. Tired of waiting impatiently in NJ.


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## YCT (Mar 16, 2008)

I went with $0.00. I really could care less about MRV. Let those who want it pay.


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## Bill Broderick (Aug 25, 2006)

Given that MRV is working solidly on my current network, I'm going to have a real problem with DirecTV if we have to get a new dish and DECA to continue to use it after the Beta test is complete.

It's not even as if DECA could replace my current network as there are a combination of Blu-ray players, HD DVD players and PC's at the same locations as my DVR's. So, I would need both my current gibabit network and the DECA network.

Paying DirecTV to provide unnecessary equipment that won't do anything to improve the quality of MRV is something that I have a significant objection to.

If they want to require DECA and charge us for it, in lieu of a monthly fee, then I'd be OK with that (I don't have significant objections to a monthly fee). But if they charge for installation and have a monthly fee, after it has worked well on my existing network is BS.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

I'd pay $99 for 2-SWM16's and a full DECA outfit....


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

dave29 said:


> I'd pay $99 for 2-SWM16's and a full DECA outfit....


That's only because you know what they cost. :lol:


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## HDJulie (Aug 10, 2008)

I voted for $99. I would gladly pay that for them to install SWM & get me DECA. I have a DVR in a guestroom that has only one cable so I need SWM to get both tuners to work without having to run another cable. And, we can't easily network that room & don't want to use wireless. My husband has an H20 in the man cave that is separate from our house & it also can't be easily networked. The DECA would be the perfect way to get MRV everywhere. Obviously we'll have to replace the H20 & will wait for the H24 to do so. I'd pay up to $300 if I could also replace all of the HR boxes with the HR24's (we have 3 HR boxes). And I'd sign another 2 year contract. It's not like I have a lot of choices -- there's no cable out here & none will be coming any time soon so my only other option is E* & we're never going to switch to them. However, if I were already hardwired everywhere & didn't want or need SWM, then I would not want to pay anything. That's just not the case for me.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> Why would that make it inferior?


Flexibility. If I could only use it with d* receivers (which is apparently not the case) then it would be far less useful than, or inferior to, the existing ethernet run.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> Your impression isn't correct.
> While I have DECAs on all my receivers, I also have one bridging to my home network and a switch. There isn't any reason I couldn't use one on my receiver and connect it also to a switch and cluster the devices there.
> As with any network, you can go overboard with the number of devices connected though.


From what I have read, the ehternet over coax implimentations saturate faster than 100MB and way faster than 1G backbones.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> That's only because you know what they cost. :lol:


 $99 would be a good deal. :lol:


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> From what I have read, the ehternet over coax implimentations saturate faster than 100MB and way faster than 1G backbones.


Where are you reading that?
It won't match a 1G network, but it's for the receivers and gets them off the rest of your network.


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## Hutchinshouse (Sep 28, 2006)

Existing customers = $49 install, zero fee per month if all receivers are DVR.
Existing customers = $49 install, small fee per month if one or more receiver is non-DVR.

New customers = Free install, zero fee per month if all receivers are DVR.
New customers = Free install, small fee per month if one or more receiver is non-DVR

*If customer installs, maintains and supports their own network = No charges/fees of any kind.


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## slimoli (Jan 28, 2005)

I live in a condo with a MDU MFH2 system. I wonder who's gonna install the DECA in this case. The MDU company here is the same that installs OTA antennas and I bet they never heard about DECA before. I am not allowed to access the communications closet, where my initial feed probably is. Is the filter really mandatory ?


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

I voted abstain.

My reason, if DirecTv wants to install a SWM/Deca at my home I would like to wait to get a new HR24. If I assume the HR24 will cost $199.00 and have a 2 year commitment and possibly a free install, then they can convert me. I do not need the wiring or the Deca for that matter but I would let them install install it at that time. The SWM for me would actually make it easier to feed additional tv's off a single DVR or add OTA because I already have multiple coax runs to each. SWM and Deca on one run and Ota on the other. I will pay for it because I like it, I don't need it because it already works great.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> From what I have read, the ehternet over coax implimentations saturate faster than 100MB and way faster than 1G backbones.


The way I am setup to test, I can have three streams flowing through a single DECA dongle bridge to my router. One out from a single DVR, two in to that DVR and an H24. Even with trickplay, I have no issues with all HD streams.


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## mikeny (Aug 21, 2006)

I want to pay $0. Everything is fine the way it is with our 2 wired HR20s and 1 H21. MRV is awesome.

If they _make_ me 'upgrade' to DECA for their solution, it should be free.

Now I have creating a whole scale for fun for other people who request it. 

I think the following would be a fair install charge: $35 for either DECA only or $49 for DECA + SWiM. $19.99 upgrade from H20 to H21/H23. $49 upgrade from an R15 to an H21. $75 upgrade from an R15 to an HR.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

I can’t see DirecTV requiring DECA...at least not for a long while. How many subs do not have SWiM? 

What would it cost to upgrade everyone to SWiM? How long would it take to upgrade everyone? 

I’m guessing but I can’t see DirecTV holding up potential revenue (MRV fee) by telling someone they have to wait for an upgrade.

IMO, DirecTV will allow MRV on Ethernet home networks just as it works now.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

Mike


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> Where are you reading that?


Here's one of the best links I've read. It's a review/test of the netgear MoCA adapter (Entropic chip). I've seen a few others for a DLink if I recall, but they were not near as thorough as this one.

 ...ethernet-from-your-tv-outlet-netgear... 



veryoldschool said:


> It won't match a 1G network, but it's for the receivers and gets them off the rest of your network.


If you need or want to remove them from your ethernet network, great, it's a viable solution. But you shouldn't have to if you don't need to or want to.


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## hdtvluvr (Mar 2, 2008)

I voted $0. I have MRV working using Cat5e and a gigabit switch. I also self installed a SWM switch so I'm down to 1 wire per DVR. I don't need a tech to come out.

MRV should be a value added product and be free every month.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

LameLefty said:


> The way I am setup to test, I can have three streams flowing through a single DECA dongle bridge to my router. One out from a single DVR, two in to that DVR and an H24. Even with trickplay, I have no issues with all HD streams.


MoCA specs are approximately 20MBits/Sec. per HD Stream. I can't imagine DECA is any different, so three shouldn't pose a big problem, especially without any other traffic. 4 or 5 might be pushing it though.


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## 4120 woodrow ct (Oct 12, 2009)

I would pay for the hardware if the service is free....


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> Here's one of the best links I've read. It's a review/test of the netgear MoCA adapter (Entropic chip). I've seen a few others for a DLink if I recall, but they were not near as thorough as this one.


Thanks for the link.
I'm not sure this is truly "apples to apples", but at the same time, I haven't been able to max out my DECA cloud to see where it limits.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Is the Deca cloud I hear about that much different than a setup like I have with all home runs to a 10/100 switch that has all of my receivers on the same switch and one port running to my gateway? All are connected together through one switch and at a single point connected to the internet.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> MoCA specs are approximately 20MBits/Sec. per HD Stream. I can't imagine DECA is any different, so three shouldn't pose a big problem, especially without any other traffic. 4 or 5 might be pushing it though.


So far seven streams of HD haven't been a problem.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

scottandregan said:


> Is the Deca cloud I hear about that much different than a setup like I have with all home runs to a 10/100 switch that has all of my receivers on the same switch and one port running to my gateway? All are connected together through one switch and at a single point connected to the internet.


You probably wouldn't see any difference.


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## dettxw (Nov 21, 2007)

I voted abstain since I'm already set up with compatible equipment, SWM, DECA, and backup wired ethernet & wireless. Also I'm an engineer so do my own installation/connection work. 

Now if MRV was DECA-only and I needed that, or had old equipment that had to be upgraded, or it was required for a technician to come out then a fee would be appropriate.

So I guess I'm really voting against a "One size fits all fee" as some may need everything, and some may not need anything except the ability to use their own ethernet network.


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## dettxw (Nov 21, 2007)

scottandregan said:


> Is the Deca cloud I hear about that much different than a setup like I have with all home runs to a 10/100 switch that has all of my receivers on the same switch and one port running to my gateway? All are connected together through one switch and at a single point connected to the internet.


As I understand it the DECA cloud is a subnet that keeps MRV traffic between the receivers/receivers without involving the router.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

I will pay nothing. The fact that D* is even considering charging for any sort of MRV is making me count the days till my contract is up


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

$0 - I would prefer to install it myself (as I have alrady done).


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## Lee L (Aug 15, 2002)

OK, here is something I just hought of. If they restrict MRV to DECA only, how will they know? The only way I can think of is to require the service call, so it is all in the system. How will those who have some DECA equipment already working feel if they still have to wait for a service call to replace and or verify their setup in order for MRV to be activated?


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## captainjrl (Jun 26, 2007)

4120 woodrow ct said:


> I would pay for the hardware if the service is free....


I voted abstain, but the above feelings are similar to mine.

I think its about time for DTV to stop playing games and tell us what they intend to charge.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

Lee L said:


> OK, here is something I just hought of. If they restrict MRV to DECA only, how will they know? The only way I can think of is to require the service call, so it is all in the system. How will those who have some DECA equipment already working feel if they still have to wait for a service call to replace and or verify their setup in order for MRV to be activated?


The receivers will send a request over the ethernet port asking for the DECA converter to identify itself. If there is no response, no MRV functionality will be enabled.


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## chevyguy559 (Sep 19, 2008)

BattleScott said:


> The receivers will send a request over the ethernet port asking for the DECA converter to identify itself. If there is no response, no MRV functionality will be enabled.


Using this same idea, why couldn't they use this to flag the account as "Non-DECA - No Support" and still allow us to use our hardwired network for MRV??

So if I want MRV I have to pay $$ to have them come install little boxes near my recievers even though MRV works GREAT with my setup now?? :nono2:

Its like NFL RedZone and NFL Sunday Ticket RZC, I can get NFL RedZone on Comcast for $10 a month or RZC on DirecTV for $400 :lol:


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## amorse2183 (May 25, 2006)

if they were going to replace all the receivers in the house with mrv compliant models (preferably with deca) i wouldn't mind paying $49 for that, provided there was no fee for the service. if they were charging a monthly fee, then i wouldn't be willing to pay anything. its obvious there will be a monthly fee, so my idea is more of a pipedream, but that's what i think.


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## puckhead (Sep 22, 2007)

compnurd said:


> I will pay nothing. The fact that D* is even considering charging for any sort of MRV is making me count the days till my contract is up


I don't have a problem with your choice, but where will you find MRV service for free?


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## GrumpyBear (Feb 1, 2006)

puckhead said:


> I don't have a problem with your choice, but where will you find MRV service for free?


+1 on that one. People keep yelling about Uverse, and seem to forget the $4 fee that Uverse builds into there way of doing MRV.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

puckhead said:


> I don't have a problem with your choice, but where will you find MRV service for free?


Umm... just about everywhere except D*? Last time I checked E* had a 2-room receiver and so did U-verse. That's why it's kind of puzzling how D* thinks they can charge for something the competition gives away.

What exactly are the fees for the competition for a 2-room setup? I must be missing something.


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

If the upgrade included DECA and SWiM and no monthly fee I feel the $149 would be reasonable as a 1-time charge. If there was a monthly fee AND SWiM and DECA were included then $49 install would be reasonable.

Too many possible scenarios so I didn't vote.


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

mdavej said:


> Umm... just about everywhere except D*? Last time I checked E* had a 2-room receiver and so did U-verse. That's why it's kind of puzzling how D* thinks they can charge for something the competition gives away.
> 
> What exactly are the fees for the competition for a 2-room setup? I must be missing something.


Didn't someone post in another thread that Dish's 2-room DVR was $17 a month, rather than DirecTV's $5. Even if you assume that you need 2 with DirecTV (an assuming neither is your primary free one), still seems like Dish is charging $7 more.

Again, this is based on something I read in another thread, so take that for what it's worth.


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

mdavej said:


> Last time I checked E* had a 2-room receiver and so did U-verse. That's why it's kind of puzzling how D* thinks they can charge for something the competition gives away.
> 
> I must be missing something.


Just that they are not anywhere near the same service. U-Verse is the closest, but you still can have only 1 HD DVR. So 2 tuners of HD content is not going to cut it at my house.

And with E*, the second room is SD, so that is out as well.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

mdavej said:


> Umm... just about everywhere except D*? Last time I checked E* had a 2-room receiver and so did U-verse. That's why it's kind of puzzling how D* thinks they can charge for something the competition gives away.
> 
> What exactly are the fees for the competition for a 2-room setup? I must be missing something.


I have 6 DVRs and a standalone HD receiver. Tell me again how UVerse would handle that (even assuming it was available in my area, which it's not). And Dish's "2-room receiver" really isn't the same thing as Directv's MRV at all.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

chevyguy559 said:


> Using this same idea, why couldn't they use this to flag the account as "Non-DECA - No Support" and still allow us to use our hardwired network for MRV??


There is no reason they "couldn't", but the jury is still out on how they wil actually handle it. There has only been speculation to this point about what will and will not be allowed and/or supported.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

mdavej said:


> Umm... just about everywhere except D*? Last time I checked E* had a 2-room receiver and so did U-verse. That's why it's kind of puzzling how D* thinks they can charge for something the competition gives away.
> 
> What exactly are the fees for the competition for a 2-room setup? I must be missing something.


U-verse's charges $7/mo for each addition receiver and $15/mo for the Total Home DVR.

IIRC, Dish charges a DVR fee for each DVR and a higher fee for each receiver.

Verizon charges $19.95/mo for the Home Media DVR that supplies upto four TVs, and each addition HD receiver is $9.99. However, it will only record 20 hours of HD. :eek2:

If DirecTV's fee is $5/mo and I have 2 additional TVs, then in each of these cases the cost for multi-room viewing is more than what I pay for the same hardware...I'm just sayin' :grin:

Can any of those stream to you laptop without you buying something else?

Mike


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## BudShark (Aug 11, 2003)

FIOS and U-verse are not available to me.

That leaves Comcast (they already charge more for DVRs and DON'T have a multiroom as yet) and Dish (they charge PER DVR and their two room is not an option if you have multiple HD boxes).

So at the end of the day, No, Dish does not have MRV nor does Comcast. U-verse is severely limited and FIOS is expensive. I'll pay my $3/mo and go on happily.


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## paragon (Nov 15, 2007)

I voted $0 since I have all SWM-compatible equipment and an SWM8 already, and I don't think I should have to pay for DECA adpaters when I will be paying a monthly fee for MRV and people with newer (HR24) receivers will have DECA built in.

However, if DIRECTV is willing to replace my receivers (two HR21s) with two HR24s or a HMC30 and a client, I would pay $100.


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## beer_geek (Jun 14, 2007)

BattleScott said:


> There is no reason they "couldn't", but the jury is still out on how they wil actually handle it. There has only been speculation to this point about what will and will not be allowed and/or supported.


How do you define "No Support"?

I could see them blaming any problem you have on "your network".


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## leww37334 (Sep 19, 2005)

Any fee seems quite excessive for plugging in two ethernet connectors, screwing on two coax and replacing a switch, what am I missing here? Is Directv going to require a service call ( I got MRV working fine without an installer the first time).

Is this an attempt to recover hardware/design costs? I thought that was what the monthly fee was for? I would truly like clarification on what Directv plans. But we know what the chances of Directv actually providing any information are.

It is really hard to vote on any poll unless you know what the complete plan is.


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## Grentz (Jan 10, 2007)

For myself $0, but overall I think around $50-$75 would be fair though a bit on the cheap side for feasibility if equipment/etc. has to be provided for free.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

leww37334 said:


> Any fee seems quite excessive for plugging in two ethernet connectors, screwing on two coax and replacing a switch, what am I missing here? Is Directv going to require a service call ( I got MRV working fine without an installer the first time).
> 
> Is this an attempt to recover hardware/design costs? I thought that was what the monthly fee was for? I would truly like clarification on what Directv plans. But we know what the chances of Directv actually providing any information are.
> 
> It is really hard to vote on any poll unless you know what the complete plan is.


I can't say what the complete plan is but:
Service call,
replacing & align SWiM dish,
rewire coax as needed,
add splitters as needed,
run new drop for the DECA bridge to router,
add DECAs as needed to all receivers,
swap out receivers that aren't compatible with SWiM,
swap out HD receivers lacking networking.

clearly not everyone would require everything from this list.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> U-verse's charges $7/mo for each addition receiver and $15/mo for the Total Home DVR.
> 
> IIRC, Dish charges a DVR fee for each DVR and a higher fee for each receiver.
> 
> ...


Thanks.

But to clarify, for just a 2 room setup with dish (1 receiver total), no extra monthly fee, right?

A 2 room setup for Uverse would be $15 + $7 = $21 versus $6 + $5 + $MRV = $11 + ???. So I agree Uverse is way out of whack, and FIOS is even higher.

If D* would do 2-room MRV for free like E* and charged a small monthly fee for more rooms, that would be reasonable IMO and make them the value leader.


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## GrumpyBear (Feb 1, 2006)

mdavej said:


> Thanks.
> 
> But to clarify, for just a 2 room setup with dish (1 receiver total), no extra monthly fee, right?
> 
> ...


NO external fee from Dish. Dish has embedded the fee into thier Duo recievers. Dish also doesn't give anybody a break for using a Duo in Single mode for a just a single TV either. Dish treats all Duo's as a dual output no matter how the user uses the the Duo Reciever. As a user that has a 622 a 722 and a 612 from Dish, I see the embedded pricing.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

mdavej said:


> Thanks.
> 
> But to clarify, for just a 2 room setup with dish (1 receiver total), no extra monthly fee, right?
> 
> ...


I just checked what it would cost me to replicate the channels/hardware I have now with Dish. It came out to about 5 dollars more a month plus a $100 one time "Upgrade Charge" (what the heck is up with that BTW :eek2. It would seem that over the 2 year commitment it would cost me more with Dish then with DirecTV and an MRV fee (assuming $5/mo). You could skip the commitment with Dish but the website wanted to charge me an addition $99 for that. Either way it would never come out cheaper then keeping DirecTV and paying the MRV fee.

Don't get me wrong. If there is a fee I won't be having MRV. However, it's just plain un-true that MRV is "free" with the other providers. They just charge you more up front, or in the case of FiOS which has an additional charge, to have MRV.

Of course the two posts where I have actual dollar amounts are based on the service providers website and in my area. I don't know if the basic fees are that much different anywhere else but I would figure if it is then it's probably across all the providers.

Seriously, what the heck is the Upgrade Charge all about? :scratchin

Mike


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

MicroBeta said:


> U-verse's charges $7/mo for each addition receiver and $15/mo for the Total Home DVR.
> 
> IIRC, Dish charges a DVR fee for each DVR and a higher fee for each receiver.
> 
> ...





mdavej said:


> Thanks.
> 
> But to clarify, for just a 2 room setup with dish (1 receiver total), no extra monthly fee, right?
> 
> ...


I'm confused on the rates you guys are quoting for UVerse. My in-laws have UVerse 200 + HD with an HD DVR (included with plan) and 2nd room HD rcvr. The only thing they get, that is different from standard pricing here is she got a credit for the 2nd HD receiver free by calling asking if there was a way to lower their bill. Here is the line item list of their bill (guess who is the account admin)



AT&T U-verse TV U200|64.00| 
AT&T Yahoo! Broadband Express|25.00| 
AT&T U-verse Voice Unlimited |33.00| 
AT&T U-verse Voice||5.00-CR 
HD Technology Fee|10.00| 
Receiver Fee|7.00| 
Receiver Fee (Promo Offer)||7.00-CR 
With this they get full HD DVR service plus the multi-room functionality on the 2nd receiver. Even without the $7.00 credit on the 2nd receiver, it is still cheaper than the DirecTV setup per month, and they paid no upfront lease fees for the hardware.


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## billsharpe (Jan 25, 2007)

I voted "abstain," which might be a contradiction in terms.

I have two HD TV's, but one is just connected to an OTA antenna, so there's no real need for MRV at my house.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

BattleScott said:


> I'm confused on the rates you guys are quoting for UVerse. My in-laws have UVerse 200 + HD with an HD DVR (included with plan) and 2nd room HD rcvr. The only thing they get, that is different from standard pricing here is she got a credit for the 2nd HD receiver free by calling asking if there was a way to lower their bill. Here is the line item list of their bill (guess who is the account admin)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's included with the U200 package. With a couple of the lower packages the Total Home DVR is $15.00/mo. I went to AT&T, entered my info and built a package to match what I've got now and this is how it came out. At least it is in my zip code anyway. :shrug:

However, even if I have one of the packages with the price built in, it still works out to $8/mo more then I'm currently paying with DirecTV. Add to that the $29 activation fee (might be able to haggle that one away) and the cost is more then I'd pay even if I added the MRV fee.

In summary, and only as it applies to my area, I would pay more with U-verse for the same capabilities and channels no matter which package I pick. The Total Home DVR fee is either built in or added on and the outlay over the commitment is higher then it would be with DirecTV. I already bundle internet, phone, and wireless with AT&T now so adding U-verse gets me no additional discount. I don't get it but that's the way it worked our last year when it became available and they called me.

In my case U-verse is $132/mo, and I currently pay $124/mo. I wouldn't pay it but as long as the MRV fee is less then eight dollars then I would make out.

Not only that, but the $132/mo with U-verse is for only one HD DVR with a 65 hour HD capacity and three HD receivers. I currently have three HD DVRs with combined 250 hour capacity and one HD receiver. How much more would that cost with U-verse?

Mike


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## leww37334 (Sep 19, 2005)

veryoldschool said:


> I can't say what the complete plan is but:
> Service call,
> replacing & align SWiM dish,
> rewire coax as needed,
> ...


I was under the impression, in fact it was stated elsewhere that no new dish would be required for deca/swm, that a new switch would suffice, is this incorrect?

If you have two working DVR's you are going from two existing wires down to one wire, what has to be rewired? What new drops, what rewiring?

Which receivers in the HR-2x line aren't compatible, the new receiver required for MRV is certainly a new wrinkle I wasn't aware of.

This laundry list sounds like what the auto mechanic told me the last time I went for an oil change. :lol::lol::lol:

but really, seriously, I do need to know if I will have to replace my AU-9 dish also.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

au9-s works with swm 8 just fine.
I suspect they would just drop a swm lnb into existing dish though.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> au9-s works with swm 8 just fine.
> I suspect they would just drop a swm lnb into existing dish though.


That exactly what I did. I unscrewed the old LNB, and screwed on the new one. No messing with the dish is necessary. 

Mike


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

leww37334 said:


> Which receivers in the HR-2x line aren't compatible, the new receiver required for MRV is certainly a new wrinkle I wasn't aware of.


The HR's aren't the problem, the H20 & legacy SD boxes are. The H20 doesn't have an ethernet port, and legacy SD boxes will need to be upgraded to SWM capable units. The latter has nothing to do with MRV, the legacy boxes will simply not run on SWM...


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

dsw2112 said:


> The HR's aren't the problem, the H20 & legacy SD boxes are. The H20 doesn't have an ethernet port, and legacy SD boxes will need to be upgraded to SWM capable units. The latter has nothing to do with MRV, the legacy boxes will simply not run on SWM...


Don't forget that if DirecTV starts installing SWiM8's there's three legacy ports on it so they might use those vs. replacing STB's that aren't SWiM compatible.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

RAD said:


> Don't forget that if DirecTV starts installing SWiM8's there's three legacy ports on it so they might use those vs. replacing STB's that aren't SWiM compatible.


I bet the SWiM8's are the likely upgrade path for existing customers.

Mike


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

RAD said:


> Don't forget that if DirecTV starts installing SWiM8's there's three legacy ports on it so they might use those vs. replacing STB's that aren't SWiM compatible.


Good point. We'll have to see how they handle these scenarios. Installing a SWM8 would make sense to someone with an R15; with a box swap they would lose their recordings... Unfortunetely other factors, like supply, will likely also come into play...


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

leww37334 said:


> I was under the impression, in fact it was stated elsewhere that no new dish would be required for deca/swm, that a new switch would suffice, is this incorrect?
> 
> If you have two working DVR's you are going from two existing wires down to one wire, what has to be rewired? What new drops, what rewiring?
> 
> ...


What part of


> clearly not everyone would require everything from this list.


Did you not understand?
They could use SWiMLNBs or SWM8s.
If you needed the DECA bridge to be close to your router, it might take a new drop.


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## ehilbert1 (Jan 23, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> It's included with the U200 package. With a couple of the lower packages the Total Home DVR is $15.00/mo. I went to AT&T, entered my info and built a package to match what I've got now and this is how it came out. At least it is in my zip code anyway. :shrug:
> 
> However, even if I have one of the packages with the price built in, it still works out to $8/mo more then I'm currently paying with DirecTV. Add to that the $29 activation fee (might be able to haggle that one away) and the cost is more then I'd pay even if I added the MRV fee.
> 
> ...


I see where your coming from. In my house we have to HD DVR'S and Choice Plus. If we went with Uverse and got the U200 with one extra reciever it would be cheaper for us. My wife and I use our DVR mostly to skip commercials and watch what we want when we want. We don't stock up and store programming so the capacity would not effect us. When I went online to look and I came close to switching there was no activation fee. Set up, MRV,DRV and were included in the U200 package. So if your just a regular joe that doesn't have a need for a bunch of extra DVR's and capacity Uverse is a good deal. I guess I'm just loyal to Directv.

I just don't understand why Directv would want to charge for this option. Yea I know to make money, but come on guys don't we pay enough already? I would not mind paying a little to have it installed, but I don't want to pay a monthy fee for MRV. My bill just went up a little and I don't mind that as long as we get updated features. This would fit the bill fine. I'm not instrested in a bunch of new HD channels that I would not watch anyway. Speaking of HD Uverse has a lot of channels too. Just my 2 cents.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

ehilbert1 said:


> I see where your coming from. In my house we have to HD DVR'S and Choice Plus. If we went with Uverse and got the U200 with one extra reciever it would be cheaper for us. My wife and I use our DVR mostly to skip commercials and watch what we want when we want. We don't stock up and store programming so the capacity would not effect us. When I went online to look and I came close to switching there was no activation fee. Set up, MRV,DRV and were included in the U200 package. So if your just a regular joe that doesn't have a need for a bunch of extra DVR's and capacity Uverse is a good deal. I guess I'm just loyal to Directv.
> 
> I just don't understand why Directv would want to charge for this option. Yea I know to make money, but come on guys don't we pay enough already? I would not mind paying a little to have it installed, but I don't want to pay a monthy fee for MRV. My bill just went up a little and I don't mind that as long as we get updated features. This would fit the bill fine. I'm not instrested in a bunch of new HD channels that I would not watch anyway. Speaking of HD Uverse has a lot of channels too. Just my 2 cents.


The other service providers are charging for it. Some, like Verizon and U-verse, charge up front and others have it built in. :shrug:

Like I've said I won't get MRV if there's a fee but I'm not under the illusion that the other providers don't charge for it. :grin:

Mike


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

MicroBeta said:


> I bet the SWiM8's are the likely upgrade path for existing customers.
> 
> Mike


Then they will be on lots of tech trucks!


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

matt1124 said:


> Then they will be on lots of tech trucks!


Probably...it's easier the climbing on the roof for SWiM. 

Mike


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

beer_geek said:


> How do you define "No Support"?
> 
> I could see them blaming any problem you have on "your network".


"No support" means that using your network is allowed but there will be no tech support available.

"Not allowed" means it will not work unless DECA is installed.

My gut is telling me that neither one of these is going to be relavent. I suspect that MRV will never be "supported" on the current stand alone receivers.

This disclaimer on the MRV page:



> _Please do not purchase any additional receivers to participate in this beta trial. If your existing receivers are not currently networked please do not network them to participate in the beta testing phase. Once the service launches nationally there will be a special offer available to take advantage of the service. _


makes me think it will only be made a standard, supported feature on the new home server box with the H24s as clients.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

I abstained because realistically, the cost would probably be determined by #1: Does the customer need to be upgraded to SWM, #2: How many customers receivers need to be replaced, #3, How many Deca adapters will they need.

I would think DirecTv would charge based on the actual equipment required, rather than a flat "one fee fits all" format, if they offer upgrades at all. I can see them doing the same thing they did with the AM21. Put the Deca Adapters on their website, and let you buy as many as needed, and offer a Flat Rate install price to upgrade from non-SWM to SWM if needed. Otherwise, I think they will have to recover all those upgrade losses through MRV subscription fees, which will ding those using ethernet of their own, into paying for Aunt Maybelle's upgrade.

The only way MRV will be free, or cheap enough for the masses on a monthly basis, is if they pass on the actual upgrade costs to the customer needing the upgrade.


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## ehilbert1 (Jan 23, 2007)

MicroBeta said:


> The other service providers are charging for it. Some, like Verizon and U-verse, charge up front and others have it built in. :shrug:
> 
> Like I've said I won't get MRV if there's a fee but I'm not under the illusion that the other providers don't charge for it. :grin:
> 
> Mike


I don't see where there is an upfront fee with Uverse. Like I said their U200 package is only $67 and that includes the DVR with MRV. PLus you don't have to pay $200 or $99(depending on if you get a deal) upfront for the actual DVR. That package has a lot of great channels in it and a lot of HD. All I'm saying is when I compare it to what I have now it is cheaper. I would love to have MRV with Directv, but I'm not willing to pay an extra $5 for that when Uverse already has it included in their U200 package. I also wouldn't have to pay for a protection plan. Thats another $6 I'm giving to Directv also.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

ehilbert1 said:


> I don't see where there is an upfront fee with Uverse. Like I said their U200 package is only $67 and that includes the DVR with MRV. PLus you don't have to pay $200 or $99(depending on if you get a deal) upfront for the actual DVR. That package has a lot of great channels in it and a lot of HD. All I'm saying is when I compare it to what I have now it is cheaper. I would love to have MRV with Directv, but I'm not willing to pay an extra $5 for that when Uverse already has it included in their U200 package. I also wouldn't have to pay for a protection plan. Thats another $6 I'm giving to Directv also.


I saw at least two packages that add a $15 charge for it (can't get there right now or I would post the link).

It stands to reason, to me at least, that if the other packages include that cost then they are higher by some amount because of it.

I posted the costs for me to get U-verse earlier in this thread and it was about $8 more for a similar configuration. That didn't replicate my hardware correctly so it was actually less then what I have now. To recap, I pay about $124 with DirecTV and for the not quite the same-ish stuff from U-verse would be about $132 (see my previous post for why it's not quite the same-ish). The difference with one of the packages that don't have the Total Home DVR built into it would have been closer to what I would have with DirecTV. This indicates to me that at least part of the extra $5/mo for the Total Home DVR is built into the U-verse pricing structure. All I'm saying is when I compare it to what I have now it's more expensive then what I have now by $8...of course I don't have the PP like you do.

Mike


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## Thaedron (Jun 29, 2007)

Alan Gordon said:


> So... apparently *I* misunderstood Doug's post.
> 
> I read it to say "how much would you pay to bring your *entire system* up to full MRV compliance with DECA, SWiM and, when applicable, upgraded receivers."
> 
> ...


Hmmm, yeah... If I'm being asked to pay BOTH a monthly recurring fee for MRV and an installation fee in order to utilize it, my expectation is that I come out the other side with every receiver in my home fully MRV capable.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Thaedron said:


> Hmmm, yeah... If I'm being asked to pay BOTH a monthly recurring fee for MRV and an installation fee in order to utilize it, my expectation is that I come out the other side with every receiver in my home fully MRV capable.


How many SD receivers do you have?

Changing to a SWiM to get the DECA networking, would require all receivers to be SWiM compatible.
At $50-$199 per receiver/DVR for an HD upgrade, why would customers feel entitled to free HD upgrades? :shrug:


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> Changing to a SWiM to get the DECA networking, would require all receivers to be SWiM compatible.


Unless they went with a SWiM8 and used the three legacy ports on it.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

RAD said:


> Unless they went with a SWiM8 and used the three legacy ports on it.


We can do the "what ifs" all day, ie: the customers has more than 3 SD tuners.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> We can do the "what ifs" all day, ie: the customers has more than 3 SD tuners.


SWiM8 and splitters to a WB68.

Just saying that all legacy receivers might not need to be replaced to get someont to DECA/SWiM.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

RAD said:


> SWiM8 and splitters to a WB68.
> 
> Just saying that all legacy receivers might not need to be replaced to get someont to DECA/SWiM.


I do think DirecTV's "plan" is to change all receivers to SWiM, but also a like for like exchange.


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## HDJulie (Aug 10, 2008)

BattleScott said:


> This disclaimer on the MRV page:
> 
> 
> > Please do not purchase any additional receivers to participate in this beta trial. If your existing receivers are not currently networked please do not network them to participate in the beta testing phase. Once the service launches nationally there will be a special offer available to take advantage of the service.
> ...


We haven't even seen specs yet for the home server box, right? Are you thinking that MRV won't even be out of Beta until this server box comes out? And will they charge for the non-standard, non-supported version of MRV, give it away for free, or just disable it.

I'm thinking the quote means what many others have guessed -- that the only supported option will be DECA but I can't imagine the nightmare in customer service they will have if they do allow non-DECA usage & particularly if they still charge for the MRV service whether supported or not.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

HDJulie said:


> We haven't even seen specs yet for the home server box, right? Are you thinking that MRV won't even be out of Beta until this server box comes out? And will they charge for the non-standard, non-supported version of MRV, give it away for free, or just disable it.
> 
> I'm thinking the quote means what many others have guessed -- that the only supported option will be DECA but I can't imagine the nightmare in customer service they will have if they do allow non-DECA usage & particularly if they still charge for the MRV service whether supported or not.


I thought the same thing as well, but then I got to reading it again and the first line says not to buy any additional receivers. Current receivers would still be OK even if DECA was mandated, so the request to not purchase any receivers is kind of strange to me. Perhaps the Server Box may not be what is required, but I am thinking the only supported clients will be the H24s. Perhaps they will follow up with an HR24 as the only supported "whole home DVR". 
Furthermore, the last line says that a "Special Offer" will be made available to take advantage of the service... That to me sounds like there is going to need to be some big changes in our setups to have an MRV setup.

My suspicion is that the "offer" will be something like this:
- Upgrade to SWiM (LNB Only. If more drops are needed, that would be extra charges beyond the Upgrade offer price)
- Upgrade primary Receiver to WH-Server or HR24-WHDvr
- Upgrade exisiting receivers to H24 clients (so much per)

This will be the required setup to utilize a fully functional and suppported MRV system.

What will happen the the current BETA stuff, I don't really know what to think. Maybe limited, "unsupported" functionality?


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

HDJulie said:


> We haven't even seen specs yet for the home server box, right? Are you thinking that MRV won't even be out of Beta until this server box comes out? And will they charge for the non-standard, non-supported version of MRV, give it away for free, or just disable it.
> 
> I'm thinking the quote means what many others have guessed -- that the only supported option will be DECA but I can't imagine the nightmare in customer service they will have if they do allow non-DECA usage & particularly if they still charge for the MRV service whether supported or not.


I took that quote to mean they didn't want anyone spending money to test MRV only to later complain about paying the fee after spending extra money for MRV to work....but maybe that's just me. :grin:

Mike


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

The way I see this that no matter what the ultimate goal configuration will be, all that’s currently supported will be supported when MRV starts. Otherwise they limit their revenue stream to those that currently meet the hardware requirements...and pretty much that’s it.

Or, they could wait until they have enough people upgraded to SWiM and the latest receivers/DVR’s until they can officially roll it out and charge the fee.

IMHO, they’ll make it official as soon as possible and then work on getting people upgraded. In the mean time, it has to work with the existing receivers, e.g. HR20-23 & H21/23/24. I can’t see it working any other way.

They will probably work towards everything being SWiM/DECA but until then the subscriber base that doesn’t meet those specs (and that's a really huge percentage of potential MRV users) will still have MRV available. That means the vast majority of MRV households will be without DECA, without SWiM, and running on Ethernet.

Mike


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

I guess everyone can have their own idea of what is meant.
"My take" was no one should buy the currently offered [DirecTV website] wireless & powerline adapters, as these don't work for everyone with MRV.
I'm fairly sure no one will need to buy/get any 24s to have MRV.
If someone had a H20 and was going to upgrade it to the current H21/23, then I'd wait as a H24 might be part of their upgrade package.
Whether MRV will only be allowed to be added to an account with DECA networking has yet to be determined. :shrug:


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> I guess everyone can have their own idea of what is meant.
> "My take" was no one should buy the currently offered [DirecTV website] wireless & powerline adapters, as these don't work for everyone with MRV.
> I'm fairly sure no one will need to buy/get any 24s to have MRV.
> If someone had a H20 and was going to upgrade it to the current H21/23, then I'd wait as a H24 might be part of their upgrade package.
> Whether MRV will only be allowed to be added to an account with DECA networking has yet to be determined. :shrug:


If it ONLY asked that we please not buy any *networking hardware *to participate in the BETA test, then I would probably agree with you 100%, except to say that they are trying to discourage ANY networking, not just PL or Wireless options. However, the fact that they specifically ask that we not buy any *additional receivers* and that there will be a *special offer* when it becomes available, really makes me think that there will be more to it than just a potential DECA mandate.

I guess we just have to wait and see...


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

BattleScott said:


> I guess we just have to wait and see...


I'd say this is the best thing to do right now.

I'm not sure how much we can read into their disclaimer, since I'm not sure how much thought they put into it, "other than" not wanting customers to invest into hardware during the Beta time frame, as DirecTV is working on a plan that they know will work for MRV.


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## Sharkie_Fan (Sep 26, 2006)

Starchy77 said:


> MRV is currently working at my house, so if DTV decides to change something that would require me to install new equipment, etc. I think they should pay for it.


Same here. I've got a hardwired network that's working just fine. If they choose to make changes which render MRV over my network inoperable, I'd hope they would comp the equipment - ESPECIALLY since they're charging a monthly fee! If there were no monthly fee, I'd be more likely to agree to a one time fee... but not both.


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## Getteau (Dec 20, 2007)

Since all my DVR's currently support MRV over Ethernet, I vote 0.

Question for those of you testing DECA.
If you connect something to the 2nd network port on the HR's, can that device go through the DECA to the Internet? For example, MY DVR is connected to a 10/100 switch which is connected to the Internet. If I was to plug a Blu-Ray player into the second port on that HR, I could use the internal switch in the HR to get the Blu-Ray player connected to the Internet.
Can I accomplish this same task with the DECA adapters? Or would I still need to run an Ethernet cable to the Blu-Ray player or TV or Netflix box....


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Getteau said:


> Since all my DVR's currently support MRV over Ethernet, I vote 0.
> 
> Question for those of you testing DECA.
> If you connect something to the 2nd network port on the HR's, can that device go through the DECA to the Internet? For example, MY DVR is connected to a 10/100 switch which is connected to the Internet. If I was to plug a Blu-Ray player into the second port on that HR, I could use the internal switch in the HR to get the Blu-Ray player connected to the Internet.
> Can I accomplish this same task with the DECA adapters? Or would I still need to run an Ethernet cable to the Blu-Ray player or TV or Netflix box....


You "can do it", but the second port isn't exactly a switched port. It uses the DVR processor to do the routing, and this might cause some problems [slowdowns] with the DVR, so this method isn't recommended/supported.
You can use a DECA adapter to a "real switch" and then feed more than the receiver, but again you don't want to overload this either, as the DECA is only 100 Mb/s.


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## jclarke9999 (Feb 10, 2007)

Sharkie_Fan said:


> If there were no monthly fee, I'd be more likely to agree to a one time fee... but not both.


This sums up my feelings exactly. Especially if it's a "one size fits all" fee when different users need differernt levels of upgrade.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

My DVR's are on my LAN and MRV is working fine. Wouldn't be interested in paying any install charge for something that is working. If they force us to use DECA, I could install the adapters myself, since I already have SWiM.

On a side note, now that I have MRV I am more willing to pay a small monthly. Although I would like them to fix some small issues, like slow response when skipping forward and the occasional picture breakup.


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## chevyguy559 (Sep 19, 2008)

RACJ2 said:


> On a side note, now that I have MRV I am more willing to pay a small monthly.


I agree, I wasn't too hot on the idea before I tried it out, but now that I have it up and running in 3 rooms, I love it and am willing to pay a monthly fee. However, I better not have to pay anything to get DECA if they require it, since I already have it running flawlessly on my wired network....and I better not have my commitment extended


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## Billzebub (Jan 2, 2007)

I would prefer everything for free, just like everyone else. That being said, if the DECA setup works as well as wired networking I'd pay the $150 bucks for the setup. It's tough to pull wire in my old house.


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## MemphisBrian (Mar 6, 2010)

If I can hook it up to Ethernet myself now, $0. On a new install - $0. Upgrades... Hmmm... Since these HD DVRs all show up on the bill as 'leased'- in theory the lease should eventually expire. Then if you ask for new hardware they will want a year contract... So I'm gonna say $0 there too.

That said, this is one of the best of the HD DVR 'advanced features' yet - I turned it on for the first time today and watched a show, it worked flawlessly and fast.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

MemphisBrian said:


> Since these HD DVRs all show up on the bill as 'leased'- in theory the lease should eventually expire.


Yeah, when you close your account, it expires and you need to return them.


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

Just listened to the Credit Suisse presentation from Monday.

On the topic of DECA ... mentioned "we're going to start out charging a modest fee, maybe 25 bucks or so, just to see what the take rates are ... so they can get DoD instantly through the broadband connection".

31:40 into presentation.


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

Sixto said:


> Just listened to the Credit Suisse presentation from Monday.
> 
> On the topic of DECA ... mentioned "we're going to start out charging a modest fee, maybe 25 bucks or so, just to see what the take rates are ... so they can get DoD instantly through the broadband connection".
> 
> 31:40 into presentation.


Hmm. DECA for DoD would require and adapter for the DVR and one for the network, along with power inserter. I suppose $25 isn't bad for that. (How much are the wireless adapters that they sell?)

Though, if you had more than 1 DVR, I'd hope they'd also sell the adapters separately for less.


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## Lee L (Aug 15, 2002)

Surely, $25 can't include a truck roll can it? I guess it is good that they would allow the customer to hook this up themselves.


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## joed32 (Jul 27, 2006)

DogLover said:


> Hmm. DECA for DoD would require and adapter for the DVR and one for the network, along with power inserter. I suppose $25 isn't bad for that. (How much are the wireless adapters that they sell?)
> 
> Though, if you had more than 1 DVR, I'd hope they'd also sell the adapters separately for less.


It would also require a SWM install for most people.


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## Kapeman (Dec 22, 2003)

veryoldschool said:


> Your impression isn't correct.
> While I have DECAs on all my receivers, I also have one bridging to my home network and a switch. There isn't any reason I couldn't use one on my receiver and connect it also to a switch and cluster the devices there.
> As with any network, you can go overboard with the number of devices connected though.


That is VERY interesting information and made MRV more valuable to me.

How much, I'm not willing to say at this point.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

Sixto said:


> Just listened to the Credit Suisse presentation from Monday.
> 
> On the topic of DECA ... mentioned "we're going to start out charging a modest fee, maybe 25 bucks or so, just to see what the take rates are ... so they can get DoD instantly through the broadband connection".
> 
> 31:40 into presentation.


So now the DECA equipped HR24 is announced, and the DECA adapters are referred to as a way to get DoD via broadband connection. hmmm...


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

What's different between today's DoD and what D* discussed at the Credit Suisse presentation?


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## thekochs (Oct 7, 2006)

gpg said:


> I pay for the protection plan every month so I think installation charges should be waived for protection plan customers.
> 
> MRV is working flawlessly on my home network, so I am unwilling to pay a one-time fee for the privilege of paying a monthly fee for a feature that should be free in the first place!


Amen. I'm so tired of these companies trying to nickel-and-dime me. I mean a fee for HD access.....come-on now....once upon a time yeah...but now...be real. While I have MRV up and running it is not* that *compelling of a feature to pay for....or per this thread the hardware upgrade to support it.


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## Bigg (Feb 27, 2010)

It's perfectly reasonable to charge a monthly fee and a $99 install fee for people who want to use DECA and/or have support, but if people want to run their own CAT-5 and not have access to support, it should remain free. DECA has zero functionality that isn't already available via hardwired ethernet.

They're not going to want to support people's home networks, so requiring DECA for a supported version makes sense, but they should allow people to keep a free/unsupported version (what's there now) if they want to use their network. It's not like anyone who knows half of anything would ever need support anyways...


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## jdspencer (Nov 8, 2003)

As long as my network works for MRV I don't need an installation.


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## gio12 (Jul 31, 2006)

I have the necessary receivers and SWM.

I Need 2 DECA switches and I would pay $75 for both installed or not to get MRV.


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## BattleScott (Aug 29, 2006)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> What's different between today's DoD and what D* discussed at the Credit Suisse presentation?


Nothing is different about the DoD. What appears will be different is how it will be accessed from an "MRV Cloud"...


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

And they want me to pay to install for what I've already done myself?


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> And they want me to pay to install for what I've already done myself?


No one's saying that. It's merely a question. Is there a charge you'd consider to be reasonable to upgrade to a DECA/SWiM setup? Nothing more then that. 

Mike


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## Bigg (Feb 27, 2010)

MicroBeta said:


> No one's saying that. It's merely a question. Is there a charge you'd consider to be reasonable to upgrade to a DECA/SWiM setup? Nothing more then that.
> 
> Mike


If you're already on 100mbit Ethernet, that would be a downgrade.  Of course, if you can't figure out how to drop Cat-5e to your locations, then it would be an upgrade.


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