# ViP622/ViP722 - L6.15 Audio Related Issues Discussions



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

This thread is just to report audio related issues. Did L6.15 fix your audio issues or did it make them worse? Please be constructive and specific to your experiences.

When reporting back success of failure, please indicate that channels or shows you were experiencing it on and the area you are reporting from. Will help with the feedback process.


----------



## yovinman (Feb 8, 2004)

Playing the local ABC news on delay right now, so far, no audio dropouts. Waiting for the weather report with the 5-day forecast. That ususally is the killer for audio dropouts. Played the first 5 minutes of a recorded ABC show ("Dirty Sexy Money" - wife's show, not mine). No audio dropouts. Usually the first 5 minutes of this show is unwatchable due to audio dropouts. Not saying this is definitive proof, but I am encouraged so far. Receiver is a 622 with software version L6.15.


----------



## yovinman (Feb 8, 2004)

5-day forecast on screen, no audio dropouts. Still encouraged.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

yovinman said:


> 5-day forecast on screen, no audio dropouts. Still encouraged.


That's really good!


----------



## Todd Nicholson (Jan 7, 2007)

Wow. That's really good news. My receiver usually doesn't get updates for a couple of day's after the initial release, so I'll have to wait to report.


----------



## CopyChief (Jan 17, 2005)

Todd Nicholson said:


> Wow. That's really good news. My receiver usually doesn't get updates for a couple of day's after the initial release, so I'll have to wait to report.


I had the audio dropout problem with 614. Generally it was an annoyance more than a real deterrent to watching programs, it only occurred for 1-2 seconds a few times an hour at the most, usually at inopportune times.

Tonight, after noticing the 615 update, I watched a program (Chuck) recorded last week, and the dropouts were worse than ever.

I can't believe it.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

OMG

First, usually my 622 has been late on the list to get updates, but I just checked and I do have 615.

Second, I have been saving some recorded programs from August that were examples of the audio drop problem on recordings. Checking them now, THEY SEEM OK. One was a strange test pattern that I happened to capture. It had a pure audio tone and the original problem was lots of very obvious drops in the tone. Now it is almost perfect. I think I hear one slight glitch at one place, but it is hardly noticable and may not even be the same issue.

I haven't tried recording anything new that I expect would be bad yet, but I am very hopeful.

It will be very interesting to hear from others. I'm thinking especially of Moman and his old Vroom recordings. Hope they are healed.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

Ron Barry said:


> This thread is just to report audio related issues. Did L6.15 fix your audio issues or did it make them worse? Please be constructive and specific to your experiences.


Ron, what's with the date on this thread-originating post? I think it was the same on the other 6.15 thread too.

No biggie. I was just wondering when you started it, and what I saw didn't make sense.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Sorry... I copied it from the other thread Rexa. I did that because I could then copy the new posts into the thread and not have them go before the Announcement post. That is all...


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

CopyChief said:


> I had the audio dropout problem with 614. Generally it was an annoyance more than a real deterrent to watching programs, it only occurred for 1-2 seconds a few times an hour at the most, usually at inopportune times.
> 
> Tonight, after noticing the 615 update, I watched a program (Chuck) recorded last week, and the dropouts were worse than ever.
> 
> I can't believe it.


First think to try... Unplug your receiver.. Wait a few minutes and plug it back in. See if the audio issues are still there. If they are, try some other content and other situations where you saw the issue. Report back the type of content you are still seeing it with and it looks like you are in St Louis. Hopefully there is someone in your DMA that can confirm the issue is still happening in your area.


----------



## RTCDude (Feb 3, 2005)

As one of the original complainers.... I mean reporters (right behind Phrelin), of the audio drop out problem, I can say for sure that L615 DOES fix the problem (my 722s always have it so bad you couldn't understand a single word. So the difference is VERY obvious)!

Now we can celebrate! But maybe not too fast. I'm now seeing MUCH more pixelations (and I've a couple of similar reports on the other board)!?!?!

One step forward, one step back !#@!#[email protected]#


----------



## harmil2 (Nov 22, 2003)

With clear skies on the Oregon coast, I was seeing some minor pixalization tonight but still have 6.14, so this may not be related to 6.15. Let's wait and see what is reported by a larger sample of folks before we panic.


----------



## olguy (Jan 9, 2006)

harmil2 said:


> With clear skies on the Oregon coast, I was seeing some minor pixalization tonight but still have 6.14, so this may not be related to 6.15. Let's wait and see what is reported by a larger sample of folks before we panic.


I still have 6.14 and noticed some pixelization as well so I'm guessing it's something besides 6.15. I'm in Houston.


----------



## CopyChief (Jan 17, 2005)

Ron Barry said:


> First think to try... Unplug your receiver.. Wait a few minutes and plug it back in. See if the audio issues are still there. If they are, try some other content and other situations where you saw the issue. Report back the type of content you are still seeing it with and it looks like you are in St Louis. Hopefully there is someone in your DMA that can confirm the issue is still happening in your area.


Thanks -- I did try that and they were still there. On second glance I'm thinking it was a feed problem with that particular broadcast. It had been pre-empted and aired late Sunday night.

I have some other recorded content to check tonight -- and I will report back. It appears that I am in the minority here, so it's possible there's something else going on.

Thanks all.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

How are downloads managed by Dish? and when should we all expect to be updated with the new software?
Thank you,
356B


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Updates are usually managed in stages (Depends on the number of receivers deployed) and the receivers appear to be chosen randomly in most cases. The update cycle can take up to a month at times and depending on customer feedback an update can be stopped if an severe issue is found. 

There is nothing one can do to get the update earlier except wait patiently. My guess given the audio related fix contained in the issues I can see a more aggressive rollout.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Sometimes Dish using ZIP codes to limit new SW to certain geographic areas.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Does this appear to be the case this time P. Smith? 

Also guys.. when reporting your audio issues, please indicate the location and the channels/programs that were having issues that seem to be fixed or are still having audio issues. 

More detail the better...


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

The specific audio dropout problem many of us in certain DMA's were concerned about was best described by Moman19:


> My dropouts tend to be very short and may mute only a portion of a word or syllable. One time I might hear "The quick brown f__ jumped over the lazy dogs" Then when played back a second time, I might hear The quick brown _ox jumped over the lazy dogs" A third try might sound like "The quick brow_ fox jumped over the lazy dogs". etc. I find that it sometimes shifts.


 It was within all those DMA's reported as affecting Fox and ABC the most. Reportedly, it was the worst on Fox's Sunday night animated lineup, so bad that many reported it unwatchable. It reportedly did not affect OTA and SD.

I don't have L6.15 yet, but it does appear from the early reports that _*this *_audio dropout problem has been fixed. I'll certainly be interested in testing it if and when I get it. I say if because of this rather unusual weather forecast for our location:










While we have gotten snow over the last 20 years on average 2 days a year, it's almost always wet and piles up on the dish resulting in signal loss.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ron Barry said:


> Does this appear to be the case this time P. Smith?
> ...


I will check, but there is strong indicator the L6.15 is spooling by ZIP based list.


----------



## Todd Nicholson (Jan 7, 2007)

I'm north of Seattle and I usually receive the updates 2-3 days after the initial release. Hopefully I'll have it before Sunday.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Now it will depend of feedbacks, could be stopped any time and new version will come later.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

P Smith said:


> Sometimes Dish using ZIP codes to limit new SW to certain geographic areas.


So far has anyone with a 722 seen it?


----------



## yovinman (Feb 8, 2004)

Tested some more previously recorded shows last nite that have been problematic with audio dropouts before. Specifically, the Fox show "Sarah Connor Chronicles" which usually gave me a near constant stream of audio drops. Now these shows are playing fine. Still encouraged. 

Also, I must say that the folder organization of EHD shows is a huge improvement over how shows were listed in simple chronological order before.


----------



## kstuart (Apr 25, 2002)

CopyChief said:


> I had the audio dropout problem with 614. Generally it was an annoyance more than a real deterrent to watching programs, it only occurred for 1-2 seconds a few times an hour at the most, usually at inopportune times.
> 
> Tonight, after noticing the 615 update, I watched a program (Chuck) recorded last week, and the dropouts were worse than ever.


Chuck is on NBC, which is 1080i , and is therefore not the problem corrected in L615, which is delayed or recorded satellite-delivered 720p HD locals, namely FOX and ABC.

So, your problem may be a bad receiver, overheating due to lack of ventilation, bad LNB, bad coax cable (or loose connection) or a problem with the NBC station itself.

A couple of people have reported pixelation on OTA that they think is new to L615, and one person reports pixelation on the same FOX and ABC channels, but others watching the same channels don't report pixelation. I should note that I have seen reports of similar pixelation on that ABC channel for a couple of years, such as during popular programs like Lost. So, it may be the broadcast itself, rather than the receiver software.

In the case of the audio dropouts, people recorded the OTA at the same time and determined that there was no problem on the OTA, so before deciding that there is now pixelation _due to software_, someone needs to record the same shows on both satellite and OTA.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

I had more pixelation this past week than usual. And occasionally I do get an audio drop on NBC KNTV 11. Notice I said "an" as I'm not totally convinced it was the same as on Fox and ABC. What I'm hoping is that when I finally do get the new release I'll see fewer audio problems period. Video, probably not.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

P Smith said:


> California, Missouri and Washington.
> 94002-94199
> 94300-94499
> 95000-95199
> ...


Could you explain this in laymen terms please:sure: , I think I get the zips but how are they dated for release etc. 
Thank you,
356B


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Press Menu twice, read that letters and digits ... oh, one second - post a picture here, I'll help you.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

P Smith said:


> Press Menu twice, read that letters and digits ... oh, one second - post a picture here, I'll help you.


The sarcasm and arrogance is unfortunate, perhaps we'll meet some day........:eek2: no wonder you have so many post:lol: 
356B


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)




----------



## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

P Smith said:


> I will check, but there is strong indicator the L6.15 is spooling by ZIP based list.


I think that would be a first. But perhaps its because the Audio drop out problem seems to be mostly for specific HD DMA's.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

tnsprin said:


> I think that would be a first. But perhaps its because the Audio drop out problem seems to be mostly for specific HD DMA's.


See post#27 above for the ZIP ranges.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

356B said:


> Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
> California, Missouri and Washington.
> 94002-94199
> 94300-94499
> ...


Is this list accurate because I'm minutes away from apoplexy?

That list includes all of the North Bay except all of Mendocino and Lake Counties and most of Sonoma County all of which are in the 954XX zip codes and therefore it excludes _*me*_.

This post may sound selfish, but I did put some effort into sending my otherwise working perfectly 722 to them in return for one that just "feels" not quite as smooth because of observable frame loss.


----------



## TulsaOK (Feb 24, 2004)

yovinman said:


> Tested some more previously recorded shows last nite that have been problematic with audio dropouts before. Specifically, the Fox show "Sarah Connor Chronicles" which usually gave me a near constant stream of audio drops. Now these shows are playing fine. Still encouraged.
> 
> Also, I must say that the folder organization of EHD shows is a huge improvement over how shows were listed in simple chronological order before.


The order of programs on the EHD matches the order on the internal drive. Not simple chronological.


----------



## teachsac (Jun 10, 2006)

I watched the DVR'd event of "are You Smarter than a Fifth Grader" off the Fox40 Sat Feed this morning and about 1/2 way through there was 5 seconds of video breakup/blocking/pixelating. Again. Audio remained stable.

S~


----------



## mulder5000 (Jul 9, 2006)

I'm happy to report that last night's 9pm news on Fox was dropout free. Aside from the Sunday animation lineup, this has been one of the worst offenders. So far so good!


----------



## NTIMID8 (Sep 17, 2005)

All I want for Christmas is L6.15, L6.15


----------



## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

CopyChief said:


> I had the audio dropout problem with 614. Generally it was an annoyance more than a real deterrent to watching programs, it only occurred for 1-2 seconds a few times an hour at the most, usually at inopportune times.
> 
> Tonight, after noticing the 615 update, I watched a program (Chuck) recorded last week, and the dropouts were worse than ever.
> 
> I can't believe it.


Have you tried a reboot since the update?


----------



## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

I'm waiting for L6.15 with bated breath. It usually takes four or five days from the time an update is released for my 622 to get it. I live in zip code 80470 (Denver DMA). I'll be happy to report its performance here once I have it.

I own a Seagate 750 GB EHD that has exhibited all of the classic incompatibilities from day one ... so I'm especially looking forward to this update. I'm hoping 6.15 turns the sleep timer off and that I can get some folders for the EHD. My 622 never experienced the audio dropout problems so heavilly reported by DBStalk users, so in that sense I feel very fortunate. Nonetheless, I'm hoping 6.15 delivers everything they've said.

Like someone else has already, quite eloquently, expressed ..._ "All I want for Christmas is L6.15, L6.15."  _


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

phrelin said:


> Is this list accurate because I'm minutes away from apoplexy?
> 
> That list includes all of the North Bay except all of Mendocino and Lake Counties and most of Sonoma County all of which are in the 954XX zip codes and therefore it excludes _*me*_.
> 
> This post may sound selfish, but I did put some effort into sending my otherwise working perfectly 722 to them in return for one that just "feels" not quite as smooth because of observable frame loss.


Up to the moment the ZIP codes still the same. Perhaps Dish didn't know where are you living ? Send your complain to CEO @ dish.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

P Smith said:


> Up to the moment the ZIP codes still the same. Perhaps Dish didn't know where are you living ? Send your complain to CEO @ dish.


Sent my irate note to Dish Quality since they were the ones who arranged to get my 722. But cc: to the Engineering Supervisor at Echostar Engineering, Dish Tech Support, and [email protected] along with an emphasized zip code map of the North Bay. Told them I was really irked.:sure:


----------



## teachsac (Jun 10, 2006)

I watched two episodes of Cops recorded from the Fox sat feed and there were no audio or video anamolies. However, when I watched E.R. from the sat feed their were audio drops like the ones on Fox and ABC before the 6.15 update, albeit minor. Video remained fine. I then watched the OTA feed, and there were no drops.

S~


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

phrelin said:


> Sent my irate note to Dish Quality since they were the ones who arranged to get my 722. But cc: to the Engineering Supervisor at Echostar Engineering, Dish Tech Support, and [email protected] along with an emphasized zip code map of the North Bay. Told them I was really irked.:sure:


I too e-mailed <[email protected]> this morning, not that I expect much, since they have stopped responding to my weekly complaints.
I suppose my dealing with politicians and media outlets has tainted my attitude concerning such basics as, integrity, ethics and honor. No wonder big business is in trouble in America, I highly suspect Dish has much more trouble currently and coming than a software glitch...... 
safe travels
356B


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

356B said:


> I too e-mailed <[email protected]> this morning, not that I expect much, since they have stopped responding to my weekly complaints.
> I suppose my dealing with politicians and media outlets has tainted my attitude concerning such basics as, integrity, ethics and honor. No wonder big business is in trouble in America, I highly suspect Dish has much more trouble currently and coming than a software glitch......
> safe travels
> 356B


Because of video freeze problems now being reported on the other thread, I may withdraw my complaint.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

phrelin said:


> Because of video freeze problems now being reported on the other thread, I may withdraw my complaint.


I received L615 software update 12/15/08 late or 12/16/08 early in the 954XX zip code area, have not yet checked for issues.... or the lack there of, but will soon and report back.
356B


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Tonight ZIP ranges been extended.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

356B said:


> I received L615 software update 12/15/08 late or 12/16/08 early in the 954XX zip code area, have not yet checked for issues.... or the lack there of, but will soon and report back.
> 356B


I recorded ABC and Fox who were the offenders for me. I noticed no audio drops, so far so good, I will record tonight and see or hear what happens. 
356B


----------



## kstuart (Apr 25, 2002)

phrelin said:


> Because of video freeze problems now being reported on the other thread, I may withdraw my complaint.


The problems are highly location dependent:

- Significant problems in Saint Louis.
- A few problems in Sacramento
- No problems in San Francisco

Which locals do you get by satellite in Willits ?


----------



## feffer (Apr 30, 2008)

I live in the SF Bay area, and got the L615 update last night. Haven't noticed any audio dropouts on Fox or ABC this morning. I checked "paused" feeds and two pre-recorded shows. I don't want to jinx it, so I won't say "yahoo" yet, but it looks promising! 

Haven't noticed increased pixelization either, but I'd like to check that thread. Could someone give me the link?


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

I believe there was some mention of the issues here.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=146692


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

kstuart said:


> The problems are highly location dependent:
> 
> - Significant problems in Saint Louis.
> - A few problems in Sacramento
> ...


I get San Francisco. Got the download. Quality Control sent me an email indicating they did add new batch of zip codes for last night. I haven't had a chance to check anything as we're just trying to get out from under snow and ice (!!!). I'm surprised I got it, but I did work to keep the snow accumulation off the dishes.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

Well, I played back tonight using L6.15 a CBS show (CSI Miami) recorded Monday night using L6.14 and had audio dropout. I recorded and played back tonight using L6.15 two CBS Shows (NCIS and The Mentalist) and had audio dropout. I did not get any video freeze as discussed on the other thread.

I will record the local ABC and Fox stations' midday news tomorrow. This will tell me if that has been fixed as reported.


----------



## RTCDude (Feb 3, 2005)

As one of the original reporters that L615 had more pixelations, I've been monitoring this issue since I first saw it. But after pixelations for the first two days, I happy to report that any abnormal pixelations seemed to have disappeared. I haven't see one pixelation for the past four days. So now I'm beginning to think that what I first reported was just a coincidence. Crossing my fingers.


----------



## Rontero (Sep 23, 2008)

kstuart said:


> Chuck is on NBC, which is 1080i , and is therefore not the problem corrected in L615, which is delayed or recorded satellite-delivered 720p HD locals, namely FOX and ABC.


I dont know how accurate this statement is. I have the same problems on NBC, FOX, ABC and CBS. I am in St Louis and I have this audio problem. Very simply, the audio drops out of recorded shows that are recorded on local channels. It does not happen on "cable" channels (non-local). If the audio drops, I can rewind back and hear it played again.

615 did nothing to help, it may have made it worse for me. I have no idea about the "ZIP" ranges.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

phrelin said:


> Well, I played back tonight using L6.15 a CBS show (CSI Miami) recorded Monday night using L6.14 and had audio dropout. I recorded and played back tonight using L6.15 two CBS Shows (NCIS and The Mentalist) and had audio dropout. I did not get any video freeze as discussed on the other thread.
> 
> I will record the local ABC and Fox stations' midday news tomorrow. This will tell me if that has been fixed as reported.


I recorded ABC San Francisco last evening with L615 upgrade, "Eli Stone", had no drop outs when viewed this morning, so far so good. I will record on CBS San Francisco to see if drops exist there; with the L614 I don't ever recall drops on CBS though.......
356B


----------



## CopyChief (Jan 17, 2005)

Rontero said:


> I dont know how accurate this statement is. I have the same problems on NBC, FOX, ABC and CBS. I am in St Louis and I have this audio problem. Very simply, the audio drops out of recorded shows that are recorded on local channels. It does not happen on "cable" channels (non-local). If the audio drops, I can rewind back and hear it played again.
> 
> 615 did nothing to help, it may have made it worse for me. I have no idea about the "ZIP" ranges.


I can second that Dish seems to be having major issues with St. Louis locals that seem to have been exacerbated, not fixed, by 6.15. I, too, have noticed that it does not occur on non-local stations, but all of the major network affiliates are affected. This includes programs recorded both with 6.14 and 6.15, played back with 6.15.

Unlike the problems in San Fran and elsewhere, the audio drops were never confined to the 720p stations.


----------



## jwhayn (May 7, 2007)

I can confirm this for the St Louis area also for Fox (2) and CBS (4). I have not tried the others.



CopyChief said:


> I can second that Dish seems to be having major issues with St. Louis locals that seem to have been exacerbated, not fixed, by 6.15. I, too, have noticed that it does not occur on non-local stations, but all of the major network affiliates are affected. This includes programs recorded both with 6.14 and 6.15, played back with 6.15.
> 
> Unlike the problems in San Fran and elsewhere, the audio drops were never confined to the 720p stations.


722 with 6.15


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

CopyChief said:


> Unlike the problems in San Fran and elsewhere, the audio drops were never confined to the 720p stations.


Because I added a ViP612 and recorded all the Fox and ABC shows on it, I recorded only NBC and CBS shows on my ViP722.

What we ended up with ABC and Fox were dropouts through my 612 that would not turn my A/V receiver's dolby off/on as it did on the 722. This minimized the disruption from ABC and Fox dropouts.

What I experienced were (far fewer) dropouts on CBS and NBC through my 722 that were so instantaneous that they also did not affect the dolby. But we still got the occasional dropout on San Francisco CBS and NBC. Last night with L6.15 we watched 3 CBS shows with some dropout.

For the record, we also watched Monday's Terminator on the ViP612 with a few dropouts as usual near the times they switched to or from commercials.

The stations involved last night are KTVU 2 (Fox) and KPIX 5 (CBS). I'll be checking KNTV 11 (NBC) tonight when we watch "Life". Today I'll be checking recordings of the midday news on KGO 7 (ABC) and KTVU 2 (Fox) on my 722, shows which never failed to dropout switching the dolby off/on.


----------



## plasmacat (Mar 14, 2007)

With L6.15 on my 622 I recorded Fringe on Fox last night and watched the recording. No dropouts. I even watched some commercials and skipped and skipped back also - no drops, no problems.


----------



## snakeoiler (Jun 12, 2007)

I have a 622 with software version 6.15. Last night I watched DVRed recordings of Sarah Connor Chronicles and Prison Break from the local Fox affiliate. No audio dropouts! The updated software seems to have taken care of my isssues.


----------



## CopyChief (Jan 17, 2005)

This discussion started in the thread discussing 6.15, but I thought it would be useful to get a read from the DBSTalk users from St. Louis and elsewhere whose audio problems were not confined to the 720p issue.

I have experienced audio drops (my A/V receiver shows the signal completely dropping, as it does when changing channels, etc.) for at least the last two software releases. Prior to this time (I've only had HD since March) it was rock solid in both audio and video performance.

I first noticed the audio drops on 6.14 on a broadcast of Chuck, which airs on NBC. The drops are also evident on CBS and ABC programs viewed from the DVR. I don't spend a lot of time watching live TV, but the problems are absent or far less evident watching things live.

In addition, as others reported with the seemingly unrelated problems -- this does not happen at all with shows recorded on non-local channels (SciFi, Food, HGTV, MTV, etc.).

Thoughts, opinions, input, additional complaints and possible fixes certainly welcome.


----------



## Scott Spillers (Apr 15, 2006)

P Smith said:


> Tonight ZIP ranges been extended.


Any word on what the new ranges might be? I am just south of Seattle in zip code 98001 and have not yet received L6.15. I record the 11PM newscast on KOMO (Seattle ABC affiliate) and the dropouts are just awful with L6.14.


----------



## Todd Nicholson (Jan 7, 2007)

Still waiting up here North of Seattle in 98221. I turn on the TV every morning hoping to see it


----------



## vader22 (Oct 25, 2005)

I just posted in the other thread and then I saw this. I noticed the same thing with my A/V receiver as well with 6.14 and still with 6.15. I think 6.15 is worse. I watched the football game Sunday night and didn't have a single problem but recorded shows on CBS and NBC have been almost unbearable. When the kids watch TV on Nick or other non-locals there haven't been any issues but that is usually live as well. 

Have you noticed a video skip as well? I was watching recorded CBS last night and it would do like a 10sec skip every once in a while. This also happened on recorded NBC.


----------



## bort269 (Sep 29, 2008)

Todd Nicholson said:


> Still waiting up here North of Seattle in 98221. I turn on the TV every morning hoping to see it


I live in Seattle, 98105, and after reading this thread and I clicked on my menu button twice and saw that I have version L6.15.

I went back to my old crappy Simpsons episodes and they were fine!
(Except for the halloween episode that had video problems & didn't even have ANY audio, but that was obviously something bigger!)

I have to say I'm surprised that it fixed my taped episodes... makes me wish I had kept all the simpsons that I resorted to watching on Fox.com instead of deleting them (thinking that they were useless with bad audio)

I hope this fixes everyone else's audio dropouts and that it doesn't lead to another bug!


----------



## BillM (Apr 27, 2005)

Since being upgrade to 615, I haven't had a single audio drop out on FOX or ABC, on recorded or live programs, on off-air or off-satellite. I have found previously recorded programs also work without issue. This has dramatically improved the WAF (wife acceptance factor).

Yipeee!


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

phrelin said:


> Today I'll be checking recordings of the midday news on KGO 7 (ABC) and KTVU 2 (Fox) on my 722, shows which never failed to dropout switching the dolby off/on.


I recorded the mid-day news on KGO 7 (ABC) and KPIX 5 (CBS). I didn't see any big problems on either recording. No audio drops, no pixelation, no freezes.

I did see a bit of audio mis-sync, more on ABC, but that is an ongoing issue that I suspect is from the stations. I didn't have anything to compare it to, so I'm not going to say the sync has anything to do with the DVR at this point.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

The following is my first L6.15 report sent to Dish Quality, Echostar Engineering, Dish Technical Support, and cc: to [email protected]:



> Hi -
> 
> Ok. Initially it appears you are half done.
> 
> ...


Obviously this is a difficult problem. Also obvious is the fact that I, like others affected, am getting tired of the dropouts and the resulting expressive noises from my better half when the dropouts occur. I can't imagine what it's like in moman19's household with the dropout-associated freezes on St. Louis NBC and CBS.

And I'm not quite sure why the only person here who let us know about their pre-release testing experience was in the Sacramento DMA. But who am I...?


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

phrelin said:


> ..... I, like others affected, am getting tired of the dropouts and the resulting expressive noises from my better half when the dropouts occur. I can't imagine what it's like in moman19's household with the dropout-associated freezes on St. Louis NBC and CBS.


:lol::lol: My better half is not pleased at all. But hang in there. We are making progress. While I too, have seen the drops move from Fox & ABC to CBS & NBC, the issue is now only on one of my two DVRs. So I feel we are half-way there and I'll bet the final half will come much quicker.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

moman19 said:


> :lol::lol: My better half is not pleased at all. But hang in there. We are making progress. While I too, have seen the drops move from Fox & ABC to CBS & NBC, the issue is now only on one of my two DVRs. So I feel we are half-way there and I'll bet the final half will come much quicker.


Tonight on our ViP722 we watched "Without a Trace", another CBS show recorded last night which had three dropouts. We also watched a TNT show "Leverage" recorded last night that had one dropout that, to my wife's annoyance, I skipped back and found that it moved syllables!

"Life" on NBC, recorded and watched tonight, had no dropouts on my ViP722. On my ViP612 within the same show, "Life", in the first few minutes there were two almost imperceptible audio drops on the music track. They did not seem to alter the dialog audio. I am only 90% sure they weren't on the 722 recording because at that time I was listening to the dialog for content. But usually I am very aware of background music and I was listening for dropouts.

None of these dropouts caused my dolby to switch off/on. So they didn't disrupt the audio flow enough to make most viewers aware of them, except for the CBS show.

The dropout on the three CBS shows recorded last night were sufficient to create an awareness that would break the audio flow for many viewers. I haven't watched my CBS recordings from tonight, "Criminal Minds" and "CSI: NY".

When I'll be able to watch them I don't know as family is coming for Christmas tomorrow night, assuming that the predicted snow falling over the icy snow already on the roads doesn't isolate us again.

Since I'm retired I usually say I get up in the morning with nothing to do and go to bed at night with it half done. I guess fortunately for me, dealing with this problem gives me an additional interest. Otherwise, I'd be really irked.


----------



## mulder5000 (Jul 9, 2006)

CopyChief said:


> I can second that Dish seems to be having major issues with St. Louis locals that seem to have been exacerbated, not fixed, by 6.15. I, too, have noticed that it does not occur on non-local stations, but all of the major network affiliates are affected. This includes programs recorded both with 6.14 and 6.15, played back with 6.15.
> 
> Unlike the problems in San Fran and elsewhere, the audio drops were never confined to the 720p stations.


This is not my experience with the STL locals. I've only had problems with FOX and ABC, never NBC or CBS. Since 6.15, problem shows on FOX (Terminator, nightly news) have not had dropouts. As far as FOX is concerned, 6.15 fixed the problem for me, instead of making it worse.

I haven't checked NBC or CBS yet. It's very possible the problem now exists on those channels, but it was never a problem on my box before 6.15.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

mulder5000 said:


> This is not my experience with the STL locals. I've only had problems with FOX and ABC, never NBC or CBS. Since 6.15, problem shows on FOX (Terminator, nightly news) have not had dropouts. As far as FOX is concerned, 6.15 fixed the problem for me, instead of making it worse.
> 
> I haven't checked NBC or CBS yet. It's very possible the problem now exists on those channels, but it was never a problem on my box before 6.15.


I would say your chances are 50-50 that the issue migrated to NBC and CBS. I say this based upon a few recent posts as well as my own personal experience. I have two DVRs that had dropout issues on ABC and Fox. After, 6.15 was installed, one DVR is now dropout-free while the other now has severe dropouts on CBS and NBC.

This is easily evidenced when I simultaneously record the same show on the same channel at the same time. Dish is aware of this phenomenon and I am confident a 100% cure will be forthcoming.

I hope you are lucky enough to have one that is cured.


----------



## plasmacat (Mar 14, 2007)

L6.15 on 622. Watched recorded House and Leverage from Tues with no drops. Also watched buffered CSI NY last night with no drops.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

moman19 said:


> :lol::lol: My better half is not pleased at all. But hang in there. We are making progress. While I too, have seen the drops move from Fox & ABC to CBS & NBC, the issue is now only on one of my two DVRs. So I feel we are half-way there and I'll bet the final half will come much quicker.


One of your two? is there a difference between your two DVRs? Is one a 622 and one a 722? The fact you are seeing it happen in one and not the other is very significant. This to me rules out stream related and puts the issue in the box but why one and not the other.

Can you verify this Moman?


----------



## mulder5000 (Jul 9, 2006)

For any St. Louis people experiencing dropouts on NBC and CBS - are there any shows that are worse than others? I would like to try recording one of these to verify if I do or don't have the dropouts.

With the FOX/ABC dropouts, some shows seldom had dropouts while others were horrible. I would hate to "confirm" I don't have dropouts on NBC/CBS when in reality I just watched a problem free show.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Ron Barry said:


> One of your two? is there a difference between your two DVRs? Is one a 622 and one a 722? The fact you are seeing it happen in one and not the other is very significant. This to me rules out stream related and puts the issue in the box but why one and not the other.
> 
> Can you verify this Moman?


Significant it is. One is a 622, the other is a 722. Both are on L6.15 but only the 722 continues to have the dropouts on CBS & NBC. The 622 appears to now be working fine.

I have captured identical events on identical channels (sat HD) on both DVRs that will soon be on their way to E* for Engineering to disect.


----------



## jwhayn (May 7, 2007)

In St Louis, I always have dropouts with both 6.14 & 6.15 on NCIS, any CSI, Mentalist, Numbers, and Criminal Mind.

722 with 6.15


----------



## mulder5000 (Jul 9, 2006)

I have a 622. Going along with Moman's and Jwhayn's experiences, that may prove to be significant if I don't have NBC/CBS dropouts.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Clues, clues and more clues.

Keep 'em coming. This is good feedback............


----------



## emandbri (Jul 9, 2007)

mulder5000 said:


> For any St. Louis people experiencing dropouts on NBC and CBS - are there any shows that are worse than others?


Someone else already said this but we watched last week's chuck last night and it was REALLY bad, so bad that we turned on the closed captioning because we had trouble understanding the dialog.

I'm in St. Peters if that helps.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

If people could indicate what receiver you are using that would be helpful I am sure. Specially is you are in St. Louis


----------



## Dr. Cool (Jun 15, 2008)

As reported before with other high PQ national HD channels, I had the random and nonreproducible-after-rewinding dropouts today with the movie "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane?", recorded from HDNet Movies. My FW is yet 6.14, so I wonder if 6.15 will solve the *NATIONAL HD CHANNEL* dropout problem.
Again, I insist: the problem is not only happening with local channels or with OTA channels. It also happens with *HD national channels*. And it started with some of the previous FW upgrades, I didn't have the problem for more than one year until one of those upgrades.
I live in Minnesota, and I have dropouts both with Dish national channels and certain local OTA channels, such as PBS (1080i). The most obvious feature of shows that have dropouts is *high picture quality* in HD.


----------



## hokie-dk (Feb 4, 2006)

Dr. Cool said:


> I wonder if 6.15 will solve the *NATIONAL HD CHANNEL* dropout problem.
> Again, I insist: the problem is not only happening with local channels or with OTA channels. It also happens with *HD national channels*. And it started with some of the previous FW upgrades, I didn't have the problem for more than one year until one of those upgrades.


I agree. I have dropouts on numerous HD channels - especially ESPNHD and ESPN2HD - and when using the 622 OTA tuner on locals. I am still on 6.14.


----------



## SteveinDanville (Jun 26, 2002)

I paused, rewound and then played my ABC local HD feed (satellite, not OTA) last night with no more audio drops! I checked and see that I have 615 now. No pixelation, so let's see how it goes. As of this minute, I'm a happy camper. All my TV episodes on my EHD are now in folders; again, all good stuff!


----------



## emandbri (Jul 9, 2007)

Ron Barry said:


> If people could indicate what receiver you are using that would be helpful I am sure. Specially is you are in St. Louis


I didn't see a way to edit my post. I have a 722.


----------



## CopyChief (Jan 17, 2005)

jwhayn said:


> In St Louis, I always have dropouts with both 6.14 & 6.15 on NCIS, any CSI, Mentalist, Numbers, and Criminal Mind.
> 
> 722 with 6.15


Last night I noticed something that might provide a clue to the problem, although I'm not sure what that leads to yet. My son (who's 9) likes to watch Wheel of Fortune after dinner. It runs here in St. Louis on Channel 5, our NBC affiliate. It's in HD, but not in Dolby 5.1.

There were NO audio drops during the broadcast. The picture flipped out a few times, but I suspect that's something with the feed -- I've noticed that during Wheel before, actually since my 722 was first installed, and it does not affect the audio.

I have not recorded or delayed any locally-produced programming... but I am beginning to suspect that the problem only occurs with network-originated programs. I'm not sure why that would be different since Dish is just passing on their signal, but, it's an observation, anyway.


----------



## Henry (Nov 15, 2007)

My 622 at 80470 (Denver DMA) is still waiting for L6.15. Slow roll-out, no?


----------



## plasmacat (Mar 14, 2007)

Well I got my hopes up too soon for L6.15 fixing the audio drops (I have a 622). I watched or tried to watch recorded Pushing Daisies (ABC) and it had terrible picture freezes and pixelations with total sound loss - just awful - much worse than before.
So while it seems Fox is OK, ABC is much worse.
I am in Richmond in the East Bay.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

We watched Wednesday's "Criminal Minds" and "CSI: NY" last night (ViP722 L6.15 San Francisco Bay Area). No audio dropouts on the shows, but I let some commercials run on each and there was audio dropout on one commercial each of the ones I allowed.

Because I am season shifting the Wednesday ABC lineup, we haven't watched any of them. We're probably in the worst three weeks for watching network TV. We may be watching some Christmas stuff from ABC after my 5-year-old grandaughter arrives December 24.

But generally, our 722 and 612 will not be real busy either recording or playing back at least until after December 28.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

I recorded Wednesday and Thursday evening ABC, CBS and NBC all San Francisco, no audio drops I could hear in commercials or programming, nothing was of interest to me on FOX..... I'll check it later...... My receiver is the VIP622; hopefully the worst is behind us.
356B


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

CopyChief said:


> Last night I noticed something that might provide a clue to the problem, although I'm not sure what that leads to yet. My son (who's 9) likes to watch Wheel of Fortune after dinner. It runs here in St. Louis on Channel 5, our NBC affiliate. It's in HD, but not in Dolby 5.1.
> 
> There were NO audio drops during the broadcast. The picture flipped out a few times, but I suspect that's something with the feed -- I've noticed that during Wheel before, actually since my 722 was first installed, and it does not affect the audio.
> 
> I have not recorded or delayed any locally-produced programming... but I am beginning to suspect that the problem only occurs with network-originated programs. I'm not sure why that would be different since Dish is just passing on their signal, but, it's an observation, anyway.


Copy Chief, you have some interesting observations. I too, live in St. Louis. Let me share some info with you:

I've seen the picture blank out on occasion on syndicated shows on KSDK (ch.5) and I think it's a local issue not caused by E*. I've observed this on sat and OTA.

The audio drops are very real but I don't know if this is related to stereo vs. DD 5.1 or film vs. video tape. Since I never experience dropouts on video events like Leno, Today Show or NBC Nightly News, I always assumed it was a film issue. However, since many filmed shows contain DD5.1 while most video taped shows don't, it's hard to know for sure.

Any way you slice it, I am confident a real fix will soon be on its way. I just hope it fixes EVERYBODY. If you read through this way-too-long thread, you'll see all sorts of variations of the "same" issue. I hope that not too many fall outside the scope of this particular issue.


----------



## vader22 (Oct 25, 2005)

My issues are on a 722 in St. Louis.


----------



## Bill_K (Mar 29, 2006)

I've experienced audio dropouts and momentary picture freeze on dirty sexy money this week. I'm in the San Francisco area, vip622, firmware 6.15. Guess they still have some work to do on this subject.....if they're interested in customer retention.


----------



## mulder5000 (Jul 9, 2006)

I've seen the video dropouts on NBC ever since we first got the 622. It never happens on primetime programming, but it happens every few days on Jeopardy. The picture goes out and cuts to all black for a brief moment. It happens on OTA and Sat.
After I read the two descriptions, I called a friend who has a Charter HD DVR and asked if he's ever noticed this with Jeopardy. He claims he's never seen it. Could this be another bug?


----------



## Scott Spillers (Apr 15, 2006)

Scott Spillers said:


> Any word on what the new ranges might be? I am just south of Seattle in zip code 98001 and have not yet received L6.15. I record the 11PM newscast on KOMO (Seattle ABC affiliate) and the dropouts are just awful with L6.14.


Well, I finally got L6.15, but now Dish stopped carrying KOMO HD because of a contract dispute. As Charlie Brown would say, Good Grief!


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

Recorded "Dirty Sexy Money" ABC, San Francisco, viewed it and had two major audio drops and one major video freeze which lasted 30 seconds or more. The phenomenon is much different than the stuttering audio of the past using L614. In my case the audio just mutes and then returns normally, the video freeze pictured break up and black screen.
356B


----------



## CopyChief (Jan 17, 2005)

moman19 said:


> Copy Chief, you have some interesting observations. I too, live in St. Louis. Let me share some info with you:
> 
> I've seen the picture blank out on occasion on syndicated shows on KSDK (ch.5) and I think it's a local issue not caused by E*. I've observed this on sat and OTA.
> 
> ...


Interesting, I hadn't made the tape vs. film connection, although I can't imagine this would cause drops on Dish but not on OTA.

A couple of weeks ago, the NBC/KSDK(5) broadcast of Chuck, which ordinarily has 5.1 sound, did not -- and the audio drops were worse than ever. Of course, programs from the DVR ordinarily in 5.1 have exhibited terrible audio drops as well.

I'm wondering if there is something wrong with the St. Louis uplink?


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

Well this if fine kettle of fish. Tonight (Saturday night) with family visiting watched "The Bucket List" recorded tonight from HBO and had somewhere between 15 to 20 audio dropouts. Good movie thought.

Then watched last night's "Sanctuary" recorded from SciFi Channel, had about 6 to 8 dropouts.

These are the same kind of infrequent dropouts I've been getting for several months on CBS (KPIX 5) and NBC (KNTV 11) that don't cause my A/V receiver's dolby to switch off/on. But this level of frequency is annoying!

(Vip722, L6.15, and San Francisco not that location matters in this case)


----------



## hokie-dk (Feb 4, 2006)

Got 6.15 the night before last. Still have audio dropouts on ESPNHD and ESPN2HD, but they are not as frequent as on 6.14.


----------



## kstuart (Apr 25, 2002)

If you remember, L614 fixed NBC and CBS *video* problems in San Francisco (and elsewhere), and that introduced FOX and ABC *audio* problems in San Francisco.

Now, L615 fixes those problems and introduces new problems in Saint Louis.

As a software engineer, my opinion is that this is not going to be practical to fix these plaback problems *in local channels* in the receivers - instead they need to analyze how San Francisco and Saint Louis bitstreams differ, _and deal with the differences at the uplink._


----------



## kstuart (Apr 25, 2002)

phrelin said:


> Well this if fine kettle of fish. Tonight (Saturday night) with family visiting watched "The Bucket List" recorded tonight from HBO and had somewhere between 15 to 20 audio dropouts. Good movie thought.
> 
> Then watched last night's "Sanctuary" recorded from SciFi Channel, had about 6 to 8 dropouts.


IMHO, any consistent dropout problem on National channels is a defective receiver.

I've never had one dropout on HBO (or to the other guy, on ESPN-HD or ESPN2-HD) ever.


----------



## plasmacat (Mar 14, 2007)

kstuart said:


> If you remember, L614 fixed NBC and CBS *video* problems in San Francisco (and elsewhere), and that introduced FOX and ABC *audio* problems in San Francisco.
> 
> Now, L615 fixes those problems and introduces new problems in Saint Louis.
> 
> As a software engineer, my opinion is that this is not going to be practical to fix these plaback problems *in local channels* in the receivers - instead they need to analyze how San Francisco and Saint Louis bitstreams differ, _and deal with the differences at the uplink._


L6.15 did not "fix" those problems in San Francisco. It seemed to have fixed Fox, at least for me, but made ABC much worse. I never had CBS video problems. The problems were audio dropouts on Fox and ABC.


----------



## feffer (Apr 30, 2008)

356B said:


> Recorded "Dirty Sexy Money" ABC, San Francisco, viewed it and had two major audio drops and one major video freeze which lasted 30 seconds or more. The phenomenon is much different than the stuttering audio of the past using L614. In my case the audio just mutes and then returns normally, the video freeze pictured break up and black screen.
> 356B


Recorded the same show with the same results. Not as bad, imho as the more frequent audio drops that stopped and started the AV/receiver, but still no cigar.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

kstuart said:


> IMHO, any consistent dropout problem on National channels is a defective receiver.
> 
> I've never had one dropout on HBO (or to the other guy, on ESPN-HD or ESPN2-HD) ever.


I would agree except I never had a dropout...well, let's say... never had repeated numerous dropouts on any program on a national before L6.15. But I'll wait to see what happens this week as I did a hard reboot on both boxes today. Tonight "Cold Case" on CBS (KPIX 5 San Francisco) had two dropouts. Friday's new "Numbers" (also CBS) had no dropouts. Of course, I skipped the commercials. Unfortunately, we're two weeks from a regular schedule and I'm just not ready to sit down and watch stuff I don't want to watch. But I'll catch a few things and watch a few things saved for season shifting.

EDIT: I want to emphasize that generally at this point the dropouts are just a little annoying because I'm listening for them. The recording of "Bucket List" from HBO was a bit more than a little annoying because of the number of dropouts.


----------



## RTCDude (Feb 3, 2005)

phrelin said:


> Well this if fine kettle of fish. Tonight (Saturday night) with family visiting watched "The Bucket List" recorded tonight from HBO and had somewhere between 15 to 20 audio dropouts. Good movie thought.
> 
> Then watched last night's "Sanctuary" recorded from SciFi Channel, had about 6 to 8 dropouts.
> 
> ...


I recorded and watched the same "Sanctuary" from SciFi, and had zero audio drop outs. And as far as I can tell, I've had zero audio drop outs on CBS (KPIX 5) and NBC (KNTV 11). Maybe there is something up with your receiver.

Again, Vip722, L6.15, and San Francisco DMA. San Jose location.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

kstuart said:


> If you remember, L614 fixed NBC and CBS *video* problems in San Francisco (and elsewhere), and that introduced FOX and ABC *audio* problems in San Francisco.
> 
> Now, L615 fixes those problems and introduces new problems in Saint Louis.
> 
> As a software engineer, my opinion is that this is not going to be practical to fix these plaback problems *in local channels* in the receivers - instead they need to analyze how San Francisco and Saint Louis bitstreams differ, _and deal with the differences at the uplink._


That description is not as I remember. ABC (not absolutely sure about fox) had audio drop problems in the SF Bay area last summer, long before 6.14. In my opinion 6.14 didn't make audio drops better or worse.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

plasmacat said:


> L6.15 did not "fix" those problems in San Francisco. It seemed to have fixed Fox, at least for me, but made ABC much worse. I never had CBS video problems. The problems were audio dropouts on Fox and ABC.


Maybe I just haven't recorded the problematic material on ABC since the fix, but I did record the mid-day news, where I used to always see drops and I didn't have problems after 6.15. So, so far it seems to fix the audio for me here in San Jose.

It also fixed saved recordings from local stations that had lots of drops before.


----------



## Grandude (Oct 21, 2004)

So far I am quite happy with the sound now on Fox and ABC from San Francisco locals via Dish. Sure there are occasional anomalies but nothing to drive me crazy like the sound drop problems did prior to L6.15.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Everyone has their own particular experience and there are several variables at play here that make a single diagnosis difficult. But here's what I have experienced to date:

6.14 was an attempt to remedy dropouts on Fox and ABC. It did little to resolve the issued for me. 6.15 cleared up Fox and ABC on my 622 and 722 but somehow managed to migrate and exacerbate the issue to the CBS and NBC HD locals *only on my 722*. So now I have two DVRs running 6.15 where one is working fine while the other is not. Therefore, I must assume that there are other subtle differences among these otherwise similar DVRs that are getting in the way of a fix for all subscribers.

This clearly illustrates the complexity of the system and hence, a universal cure. Other variables must be at play here: firmware, hardware source vendors, cable distances, temperature, etc.

Hopefully, the next release will be more "universal" and bury this issue once and for all, regardless of the Rev level or model of your particular DVR.


----------



## bhodgins (Nov 29, 2005)

Closed captioning is now messed up on some of the premium channels, e.g. HBO with 6.15. The captioning appears briefly and then disappears. Meaning you see the sentence and then it disappears.


----------



## RedRedSuit (Nov 26, 2008)

With L6.15, it's fixed for me. Terminator: Sarah Chronicles used to drop out around commercial breaks all the time, to annoying effect, but not anymore. Sunday night cartoons on Fox dropped out constantly but no longer do.

Short/quick dropouts (always single instances, not in series) do still occur on all channels, from time to time, but that's nothing.


----------



## BillJ (May 5, 2005)

Got L6.15 on one 622 yesterday. Later in the day I had several audio drops on Chicago CBS, WBBM, Ch. 2. That's been the problem station all along. Maybe it's a station or uplink issue.


----------



## Cap'n Preshoot (Jul 16, 2006)

I have OTA connected to all 3 of my receivers (722/211k/211k) and have noticed audio dropouts in both OTA and SAT mode, making me a little suspicious this may be a technical problem with the broadcaster and not an E* problem.

Our two 211k's have had the DVR feature added ($40 bux) but I don't think it has anything to do with DVR'ing. Proof would be to connect the OTA straight in to the TV's ATSC tuner, which I may do anyway (via a splitter) just as a hedge against the IRD one day locking up.

Has anyone thought of browsing the OTA threads on AVS Forum to see what their complaints are?
.


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Cap'n Preshoot;1935638 said:


> Has anyone thought of browsing the OTA threads on AVS Forum to see what their complaints are?
> .


Always a good suggestion when having OTA issues. Also it is s good to hook directly to your TV also so you can compare.


----------



## SoonerJoe (Dec 23, 2003)

Cap'n Preshoot;1935638 said:


> I have OTA connected to all 3 of my receivers (722/211k/211k) and have noticed audio dropouts in both OTA and SAT mode, making me a little suspicious this may be a technical problem with the broadcaster and not an E* problem.
> .


I live in the Dallas/Fort Worth area. I have both a 622 and a Sony DHG-HDD250, which is a high definition OTA DVR. Both units are fed by the same attic antenna with good signal strength. I also have local channels in my Dish package, so I can record on the 622 in either OTA or SAT mode. The worst program for dropouts that I record is The Simpsons (Fox). I recently recorded the same episode of The Simpsons on both DVRs. The 622 dropped, on average, every fifth syllable, whereas the Sony had zero dropouts. I have tried recording The Simpsons on the 622 using both the OTA signal and the SAT signal, and the frequency of dropouts is the same.


----------



## Dr. Cool (Jun 15, 2008)

I've never had a problem with real-time broadcasting. The dropouts happen *only* when I watch a recorded program. Therefore, it cannot be a problem with signal or with programming. In my case, it can only be a DVR problem. I have a FW 6.14 ViP622 and an Yamaha receiver connected via TOSLINK. The Yamaha receiver never gave me trouble with any other source via TOSLINK, such as DVD player, PS2, etc. The problem is with the ViP622.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Cap'n Preshoot;1935638 said:


> I have OTA connected to all 3 of my receivers (722/211k/211k) and have noticed audio dropouts in both OTA and SAT mode, making me a little suspicious this may be a technical problem with the broadcaster and not an E* problem.
> 
> Our two 211k's have had the DVR feature added ($40 bux) but I don't think it has anything to do with DVR'ing. Proof would be to connect the OTA straight in to the TV's ATSC tuner, which I may do anyway (via a splitter) just as a hedge against the IRD one day locking up.
> 
> ...


Been there, done that. I have spent much time testing this as well as posting on the local Forum. When simultaneous recordings are made on the sat HD and OTA channels, the specific audio dropouts reported in this forum are not detected on the OTA channels. Keep in mind the dropouts can and do MOVE when skipped back. Each time you play the dropout, it may shift words, syllables or possibly disappear. It's almost never a hard dropout.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

bhodgins said:


> Closed captioning is now messed up on some of the premium channels, e.g. HBO with 6.15. The captioning appears briefly and then disappears. Meaning you see the sentence and then it disappears.


Seems this really should be in the other 6.15 thread, but I'll reply here, since I don't know how to cross-post.

I rarely use this, so don't know if it is new, but I did see it last night. It depended on the channel.

I saw a Mexican movie on the HBOLT channel, "E Tu Mama Tambien" (Sp?). It is a good movie but I don't speak Spanish, so I though I'd see if captioning had an English version. I never found one, but I saw the problem you described. The problem was only on the SD version of the channel. On HD the captions worked ok. I looked at main HBO channel and didn't see the problem.

So just wanted to say that I saw the bug last night but it was only on one SD channel and not others.

As I think, I'm not exactly sure which was bad SD or HD, but it was only one version of the HBOLT.


----------



## mikejesse (Dec 28, 2008)

Moman -

I'm in St. Louis as well and have been experiencing the same problems. I've continued to contact Dish Network however they won't acknowledge the problem. I also heard that the same problem seems to occur on Direct as well so it seems to be a local feed issue. Are you aware of any pending firmware upgrades that might help? 

As a long time HD user I'm looking forward to February so that it may be a "clear resolution".


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

mikejesse said:


> Moman -
> 
> I'm in St. Louis as well and have been experiencing the same problems. I've continued to contact Dish Network however they won't acknowledge the problem. I also heard that the same problem seems to occur on Direct as well so it seems to be a local feed issue. Are you aware of any pending firmware upgrades that might help?
> 
> As a long time HD user I'm looking forward to February so that it may be a "clear resolution".


Yes. E* Engineering is very aware of this situation. In fact, 6.15 seems to be a fairly good attempt to resolve the matter as it has apparently resolved the issue with many, but not all, DVRs. I think the issue is now limited only to the VIP 722 in select markets (like St. Louis). In my case, both my DVRs had the same issue but now the 622 is "cured".

I would assume that any similar issue with D* is purely coincidence......there's a lot of that going around.

If you're having this problem, I'll bet you have a 722.


----------



## DJ Lon (Nov 3, 2005)

bhodgins said:


> Closed captioning is now messed up on some of the premium channels, e.g. HBO with 6.15. The captioning appears briefly and then disappears. Meaning you see the sentence and then it disappears.


I wrote to Tech about this issue and got the following response:

"Dear Valued Customer,

Thank you for your email. We apologize for any inconvenience that this may have caused. Our engineering department is aware of this issue. It has been determined the issue is software related and we are actively working on a resolution.

Your business is greatly appreciated and we thank you for allowing us to be of assistance to you.

Thank you,

Shane D.

DISH Network Technical E-care"


----------



## Todd Nicholson (Jan 7, 2007)

I have yet to get 6.15 up here North of Seattle. I guess it's still not a full roll-out.


----------



## plasmacat (Mar 14, 2007)

moman19 said:


> Yes. E* Engineering is very aware of this situation. In fact, 6.15 seems to be a fairly good attempt to resolve the matter as it has apparently resolved the issue with many, but not all, DVRs. I think the issue is now limited only to the VIP 722 in select markets (like St. Louis). In my case, both my DVRs had the same issue but now the 622 is "cured".
> 
> I would assume that any similar issue with D* is purely coincidence......there's a lot of that going around.
> 
> If you're having this problem, I'll bet you have a 722.


I posted previously - I have a 622 and the problem is much worse on ABC than it was before (San Francisco). It is certainly not cured.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

plasmacat said:


> I posted previously - I have a 622 and the problem is much worse on ABC than it was before (San Francisco). It is certainly not cured.


Interesting. I guess this just proves that E* still has some work to do to create a universal fix.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

plasmacat said:


> I posted previously - I have a 622 and the problem is much worse on ABC than it was before (San Francisco). It is certainly not cured.


This presents a curious contrast to my experience so far.

During the holiday weeks when nothing is on, we have been wtaching two season shifting sets of recordings from the Fall, CBS "The Unit" and ABC "Private Practice".

As CBS shows did before L6.15 "The Unit" still has infrequent dropouts on both my 722 and 612 which don't cause the dolby to switch off/on.

As ABC shows did during the entire Fall Season, "Private Practice" does have frequent dropouts on my not-fixed 612 making the some episodes almost unwatchable even though the 612 never causes the dolby to switch off/on. _*But those dropouts are gone when the same recording is played back on my 722.*_

Although there is a dearth of new episodes of scripted shows, this week I will be recording on my 722 "Eli Stone" as well as the Dick Clark New Year's Eve thing plus the Rose Parade and Rose Bowl from ABC and a New Year's Eve thing from Fox.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

Phrelin,

I can see why the fix is so elusive when we all seem to be reporting different results. Nothing seems consistent at this point. My 622 seems cured of the issue but the problem lingers on my 722 (which I thought was identical other than the faceplate color and the drive capacity). Others are reporting no change on their 622s while some have seen improvements.

Just to compare notes: Do you ever experience audio dropouts during events that are live or on video tape? As for me, I never seem to catch a dropout on any "video" event on the problem channels. This includes The Today Show, NBC Nightly News, Leno, Football events, etc. I may catch a dropout during a commercial (which I usually zip through anyway) but never the main event itself. It's only when the program material is on film. In fact, the commercials are usually on film.

Just wondering if you experience this phenomenon as well. If I am correct, it should not interfere with your Dick Clark festivities.


----------



## bobr (Mar 23, 2002)

I had dropouts yesterday on CBS durring the football games.

622 in Single mode connected to JVC LCD.


----------



## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

bobr said:


> I had dropouts yesterday on CBS durring the football games.
> 
> 622 in Single mode connected to JVC LCD.


So much for that theory.....

I watched the entire Miami - Jets game and never heard a dropout.


----------



## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

moman19 said:


> I watched the entire Miami - Jets game and never heard a dropout.


I tried watching my cowboys play, but it seems they all dropped out.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

moman19 said:


> Phrelin,
> 
> I can see why the fix is so elusive when we all seem to be reporting different results. Nothing seems consistent at this point. My 622 seems cured of the issue but the problem lingers on my 722 (which I thought was identical other than the faceplate color and the drive capacity). Others are reporting no change on their 622s while some have seen improvements.
> 
> ...


I'll let you know about the ABC New Years and the NBC New Years stuff.

I can't recall ever having a dropout on Leno or Letterman. We do record them and watch the parts we want to watch.

I don't record any of the morning shows or nightly news shows. We do watch live sometimes, but that's no help. During the recording I sent to Echostar engineering there were local ABC and Fox news recorded with lots of dropouts.

My 722 decided to make a liar out of me by giving me a couple of dropouts in the last four recorded episodes of "Private Practice" (ABC). Nothing significant that would interfere but there they were, those moving syllable dropouts.

My "control" is my 612 which has no software fix and still has the dropouts on everything, but which are just a little annoying as for whatever reason it does not affect my dolby and are very instanteous. But they are always there. However, unlike the 722, they aren't always there when I skip back, sometimes they are in the same place, and sometimes they move syllables.

It appears they have eliminated the dropout on Fox in the Bay Area DMA with whatever they did. It appears on my 722 that it reduced the frequency of dropout on ABC. It appears that it did not alter the infrequent dropouts on CBS. I guess I'm going to have to watch my season shifting recordings of Heroes to see what's happened with NBC.

And for some reason, I'm now getting some instanteous dropouts on recordings from HBO and TNT. If I weren't so tuned in to listening for dropouts, I probably wouldn't even notice those.

I'm going to be very curious as we return to regular programming in January. I just don't see a clearly identifiable pattern other than these are audio dropouts with no simultaneous visible video effects.

What's even more curious is that so far I've seen no reports of a similar problem with the 211 DVR conversion.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

*OT -- Phrelin image*

Phrelin, seems you changed your icon picture around the time of the new forum look.

I assume the picture may really be you. Thats good but it seems a bit blurry for some reason. Seems to me a bit inappropriate since your writing is so clear. Maybe you are going for sort of an artistic Van Gogh look? My one vote would be for a clearer icon.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

rexa said:


> *OT -- Phrelin image*
> 
> Phrelin, seems you changed your icon picture around the time of the new forum look.
> 
> I assume the picture may really be you. Thats good but it seems a bit blurry for some reason. Seems to me a bit inappropriate since your writing is so clear. Maybe you are going for sort of an artistic Van Gogh look? My one vote would be for a clearer icon.


Yeah, I was trying to be arty, but at 100x100. So how's this?

It's a picture one of my kids took a couple of years ago, of me working at my computer on a Christmas pic of my wife and I.


----------



## rexa (Aug 7, 2008)

phrelin said:


> So how's this?
> 
> It's a picture one of my kids took a couple of years ago, of me working at my computer on a Christmas pic of my wife and I.


Looks better to me.


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

Well, after all the New Year's stuff, I think I can summarize my ViP722 (with L6.15) HD channel audio dropout situation as follows:

Locals seem to still have slight and infrequent dropouts which no longer turn the dolby off/on. Listed in decreasing order of frequency of dropout based upon a very limited sampling: ABC, CBS, Fox, NBC. This is from the San Francisco Bay Area locals.
Cable channels now have slight and infrequent dropouts which don't turn the dolby off/on. This also is a limited sampling of TNT and HBO. EDIT: Also on SciFi tonight (Stargate Atlantis)
The dropouts most frequently disappear when I skip back, sometimes repeat at the same point, and sometimes move syllables.
Many times, these dropouts are almost negligible requiring a really high awareness. But many times they annoy my better half.
With series shows returning over the next few weeks, I'll be curious to see if they continue to manifest in this way.


----------



## 24dB/octave (Oct 1, 2008)

Wish I could check out L6.15 on my 722...it was downloaded, then 2 days ago my receiver completely crapped out. I've got a new one on the way, but I suppose I will not have the updated firmware, and with other negative reports about L6.15, perhaps it won't be downloaded any time soon.


----------



## 356B (Oct 11, 2008)

I have to say that there has been a marked improvement with advent of the new software, at least for me. Audio drops are minor compared to what was dealt with late summer and fall. Is it perfect? no....but it's watchable / recordable, there were times this fall when my recordings had to be deleted because they were unwatchable.
Happy New year,
356B


----------



## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

356B said:


> I have to say that there has been a marked improvement with advent of the new software, at least for me. Audio drops are minor compared to what was dealt with late summer and fall. Is it perfect? no....but it's watchable / recordable, there were times this fall when my recordings had to be deleted because they were unwatchable.
> Happy New year,
> 356B


I too think we're well beyond the "unwatchable" sound dropouts of the past six months with regard to the Bay Area stations. I hope they're still plugging away in an effort to smooth things out a bit more though.


----------



## dishcustomer722 (Jan 3, 2009)

Any "breaking news" on the audio dropout issue with local channels like ABC and Fox with 622/722 receivers? Will this new L6.15 software really fix the audio dropouts on *all* the channels once and for all?

Has anyone actually received an email or talked on the phone with a Dish Network engineer about this in the past few days? Are they working hard on a fix at least? Are the engineers back from Christmas vacations to work on these issues?


----------



## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

I have created a poll to try and capture the opinion of the users that have L6.15. Hopefully this will answer your question.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=149208

My gut feeling on this one based on the reports is we might be talking about multiple issues here so I would say it is hard to answer the fixed audio dropouts on all channels once and for all. Lets see what the poll reveals, but based on my read of the L6.15 thread is that it has improved life for some, but others are still running into issues.


----------



## tantrim (Jun 18, 2010)

I have audio loss on SD channels and I go to Menu 611 when I hear sound I hit Select 000 and I have audio.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

All 622/722 running L6.27 now; why you posting in the old thread ? Is your DVR still has L6.15 ?


----------

