# Tivo versus Dish DVR



## obrienaj (Apr 8, 2004)

I like my 510 but am still making the final decision about switching to TW cable or not (3 more days of my 30 day TW trial to go).

I do not like the TW DVR as much as the Dish 510, I particularly miss the skip forward button on the Dish system. It ocurred to me that I could possibly ditch the TW suppied DVR and buy myself a TIVO system. Does anyone know if the TIVOs have a skip forward function? It did not clearly say so on their web site.


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## Capmeister (Sep 16, 2003)

There's a code you enter into the Tivo remotes and it gives you a 30 second skip.


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## navychop (Jul 13, 2005)

No, I think Rupert and Tivo have been successful against that 30 second skip feature. They want to force people to watch commercials- Rupert produces a lot of programming in other companies he controls, and Tivo doesn't want Replay style lawsuits against it. I don't think the 30 skip works on units with the latest software updates- or maybe it's just units recently manufactured.


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## boba (May 23, 2003)

navychop said:


> No, I think Rupert and Tivo have been successful against that 30 second skip feature. They want to force people to watch commercials- Rupert produces a lot of programming in other companies he controls, and Tivo doesn't want Replay style lawsuits against it. I don't think the 30 skip works on units with the latest software updates- or maybe it's just units recently manufactured.


You are confusing TiVo and Directv DVR Plus to completely different products.:lol:


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

obrienaj said:


> I like my 510 but am still making the final decision about switching to TW cable or not (3 more days of my 30 day TW trial to go).
> 
> I do not like the TW DVR as much as the Dish 510, I particularly miss the skip forward button on the Dish system. It ocurred to me that I could possibly ditch the TW suppied DVR and buy myself a TIVO system. Does anyone know if the TIVOs have a skip forward function? It did not clearly say so on their web site.


Before you go out and buy a Tivo, find a friend who has one or go to a store and try it. My sister bought one last month and I tryed it over the past weekend over an extended period. I currently have the 508 and 721. I strongly prefer the 721 over the Tivo. The 721 doesn't have NBR, but I prefer the guide and the fact that you can actually see the viewing picture while you look at the guide. The 721 guide is also faster and I prefer the skip feature on the 721. Try it for an hour and see what you think before you go out and commit yourself to Tivo and higher monthly fees or a one time upfront cost. As to the 508 vs. the Tivo, that's more of a tossup.


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## bidger (Nov 19, 2005)

If there's one advantage that a standalone TiVo has is that it, along with Replay, can be used for cable, satellite, and antenna inputs. There are all kinds of features that the Series 2 SA TiVo offers to broadband users as well. If you're not sure about which provider you're going to stick with, it's a good backup strategy. Be advised that there's a one year service agreement for new TiVo subs, but I think there's still a 30 day return policy. Make sure to confirm that before you dive in.

However, I personally prefer my D-TiVos because there are things from the hardware aspect that SA TiVos can't do right now such as Hi Def, DD5.1 audio, and dual tuners. If you force me to choose between core features of a DVR and peripheral things, I'll choose core features. The main reason I have a standalone is that there are two networks I couldn't get waivers for. 

I don't want to dismiss other DVRs and everyone has their own preferences and I really haven't used any others. Friends of mine have a TWC DVR and there were things I thought were better than then the SA, dual tuners, PIP which you could swap between tuners, seamless recording quality, but I think that the overall reliability of the TiVo is the reason it's become the "face" of DVRs. 

There is a 30 skip feature which can be enabled on both SA and D-TiVos. Good luck with whatever you decide and be sure to research before you decide. Great thing about the internet age, you don't have to rely on salespeople.


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## FTA Michael (Jul 21, 2002)

I have both a TiVo Series 2 and a 510. The Series 2 is more versatile in serving up music and other content from a home network. It has fewer software bugs than the 510, but it will fail to change channels correctly about 1% of the time because it has to beam IR signals at my 301 receiver.

In the shadow of a monthly fee increase on the 510 (the first of how many?), another positive for the TiVo is the "Product Lifetime" subscription option. For an upfront payment of $299, that receiver gets free TiVo programming forever -- or until the receiver breaks down or TiVo breaks down. When I bought my Series 2, I lumped in the Lifetime payment so I effectively got a subscription-free box that was a bit more expensive to buy.

Two more points: The TiVo will seamlessly blend your OTA antenna with cable or DBS, letting you choose which source you want for which channels. Also, if you decide to switch from cable to Dish or DirecTV or just plain OTA, your TiVo will still be useful, as opposed to the 510 which becomes a paperweight if you leave Dish.


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## navychop (Jul 13, 2005)

Does Tivo still offer the lifetime subscription?


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## bidger (Nov 19, 2005)

Yeah, navychop, carload mentions it in the 2nd paragraph in the post before yours.


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## FTA Michael (Jul 21, 2002)

I double-checked the TiVo web site just before I mentioned it. That's also where I found the $299; I think I paid a little less than that long, long ago.


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## navychop (Jul 13, 2005)

Thanks- I'd heard they were dropping that option.


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

Select Play Select 30 Select

That is the code to enable 30 second skip. Just had DirecTV Tivos installed and it works today.


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## bidger (Nov 19, 2005)

carload said:


> I double-checked the TiVo web site just before I mentioned it. That's also where I found the $299; I think I paid a little less than that long, long ago.


It went from $199 to $249 in the Spring of 2001 to the $299 they currently charge. It remains to be seen if it will be offered with the S3 Cable Card HD-TiVo and if it is, the price.


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

THe Tivo remote being IR kills me. I always had to make sure it was pointed properly for it to respond. I really am used to the 721 and 508 remotes where you don't even need to be in the same room as the box.


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## Antknee (Oct 13, 2005)

Tivo is undoubtably easier to use than Dish DVR. I came from Tivo to Dish DVR and I am pretty unhappy with the Dish DVR.
But it is what I am used to... I think Tivo is much better at adding new features and if you are in to it, it is much easier to "modify"


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## mnassour (Apr 23, 2002)

One word.........stability. Tivo has it.


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

Antknee said:


> .. I think Tivo is much better at adding new features


Why do they still not have the basic "Feature" of telling you how much record time you have remaining?


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

LtMunst said:


> Why do they still not have the basic "Feature" of telling you how much record time you have remaining?


Yeah, that is pretty funny. I have to agree that from everything I've heard the stability and NBR is much better than Dish. I'll stick with Dish though.


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## Antknee (Oct 13, 2005)

Yeah, I forgot about that. Just read the forums here for Dish DVRs. They are riddled with issues.


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

Antknee said:


> Yeah, I forgot about that. Just read the forums here for Dish DVRs. They are riddled with issues.


The 942 is pretty darn stable now and IMHO beats the pants off Tivo on the features end also.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

LtMunst said:


> Why do they still not have the basic "Feature" of telling you how much record time you have remaining?


They don't tell you because they aren't entirely certain. With the SA version, you have your choice of "quality" modes and the compressability of the channels varies widely. With non-digital formats like VHS, you can measure what's left on the reel and divide by the tape speed. A funny thing about analog TV is that the worse the signal is, the more space it takes on a DVR.

Even in the full digital domain of DBS and OTA DTV, it is a guess. Some rates are very high while others are waaaay too low. On my 921, I've seen episodes of CBS's Numb3rs (received in awsome quality OTA) take anywhere from 67 minutes of space down to as low as 40 (recording 1+60+3 minutes).

Suffice it to say that if it runs out of space, TiVo will whack an existing recording accoring to a arguably complicated priority system. TiVo wants to you feel comfy and telling you that you're going to start whacking things is not compatible with that feeling.

What DVR is best is really a matter of what you would do with it. If you're into series, the TiVo is probably the best. If all you want to do is record movies and events, then anything with lots of capacity will be fine.

Consider that the current crop of SA TiVo can only record one program at a time through a cable/satellite receiver which may be sufferable on cable, but it is a real killer on satellite if you're into series.

I'd wait to see if you get bit by the HDTV bug or maybe if TiVo releases a cablecard receiver. Then again, there is that persistent rumor that the 5xx series machines may get NBR...


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## mnassour (Apr 23, 2002)

With no disrespect intended "pretty" stable isn't good enough, especially when you're recording something your better half wants to watch! <grin>

I'm currently running three DirecTV Tivo-based DVRs and have run the boxes for three years now. There has not been a single lost program...period. Before that I ran Dishplayers (shudder!) as well as Ultimate TV (nice, but no longer supported). I currently also run a Dish 501 and can tell you that the Tivo is MILES ahead of that basic Dish DVR as far as any features are concerned.

And while I don't have experience with more recent Dish equipment, I do keep up with the continuing story of its software upgrades. Those postings continue to assure me that I made the right move in sticking with my Tivos and not going back to Dish.


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

harsh said:


> They don't tell you because they aren't entirely certain. With the SA version, you have your choice of "quality" modes and the compressability of the channels varies widely.


Tivo could easily break down available time remaining based on quality. The 942 shows time remaining for HD and SD. Tivo could show time remaining for Best, Excellent, Good, Standard. Sure its not going to be exact due to varying channel qualities, but a reasonable estimate based on averages would be nice.


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

mnassour said:


> With no disrespect intended "pretty" stable isn't good enough, especially when you're recording something your better half wants to watch! <grin>
> 
> I'm currently running three DirecTV Tivo-based DVRs and have run the boxes for three years now. There has not been a single lost program...period. Before that I ran Dishplayers (shudder!) as well as Ultimate TV (nice, but no longer supported). I currently also run a Dish 501 and can tell you that the Tivo is MILES ahead of that basic Dish DVR as far as any features are concerned.
> 
> And while I don't have experience with more recent Dish equipment, I do keep up with the continuing story of its software upgrades. Those postings continue to assure me that I made the right move in sticking with my Tivos and not going back to Dish.


All I can say is that I have had tried both. I used Tivo for 4 years before getting the 942. Early on the 942 was a pain with missed recordings. With the latest software upgrade, missed recording DO NOT happen. As far as I can tell, the only remaining bugs complained about on the 942 are some minor audio issues (which I have not seen).

942 Advantages over Tivo:

1 Hour buffer
FAST menus/searches
Record time remaining
Video box viewable while navigating menus and doing searches
2 Room functionality
Haven't been caught testing Broadcast Flags and 30 day autodelete like Tivo

Tivo Advantages:

Easier search functions
Home networking capability

I would definately not want to go back to Tivo after using the 942. As far as Direct goes, they dumped Tivo for their R-15 :lol: Go read the posts on that one.


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## Dino (Jan 8, 2006)

Does the Dish HD dvr have a "Season Pass" like feature? I'm thinking about switching because DirecTV's HD Tivo is too expensive.


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## JohnL (Apr 1, 2002)

Dino said:


> Does the Dish HD dvr have a "Season Pass" like feature? I'm thinking about switching because DirecTV's HD Tivo is too expensive.


Dino,

All of the Dish Two Tuner receivers have a feature called Dish Pass, as well as an option to set the receiver to only record new episodes.

Dish Pass allows you input ANY Character String, Actor Name, Series Name, or Data that might appear the program description, the receiver's software will search for those strings on each and every channel.

If you only want to record one show on one channel then select the show in the Program guide and then select only new episodes, and the receiver will only record those new episodes.

The other bonus over a TIVO is that the Electronic program guide is instanteous, you can also jump through the Guide very fast. Press the "Skip Forward" button and you advance 24 hours at a time, "Skip Back" does the same thing only backwards. Lastly, say you want to see what will be on 15 hours from now, Press "1" then "5" then press the "Right Arrow" button you jump 15 hours ahead.

This is much faster than TIVO.

John


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

JohnL said:


> Dino,
> 
> All of the Dish Two Tuner receivers have a feature called Dish Pass, as well as an option to set the receiver to only record new episodes.
> ...John


Try some (I think the 522/625 and HD tuner 542) have Dish Pass.


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## navychop (Jul 13, 2005)

I love my 721 two tuner DVR, but it does not have Dish Pass. Granted, it is not HD and is discontinued. If the VIP622 does not have it when released, I'm sure it will be added soon. Anyone know for sure if that will be an initial feature?


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## JohnL (Apr 1, 2002)

tnsprin said:


> Try some (I think the 522/625 and HD tuner 542) have Dish Pass.


All of the Dish 2 tuner DVR's besides the 721 have Dish Pass namely; 522, 625, 921, 942, and the forth coming 622.

The biggest feature by far is on the forth coming 622, the ability to connect ANY USB2 Hard Drive to archive content from the 622. Although that feature will not be enabled in the 622 when first released.

The only worry would be Dish Networks track record with regard to forthcoming receivers. Unfortunately Dish has NOT delivered onall of "coming feature"s in receivers firmware.

John


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## Dino (Jan 8, 2006)

So, should I hold out on switching to dish untill the new receivers are available? if so, is there a set date for them?

also, has anyone tried comcast's hd pvr?


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## JohnL (Apr 1, 2002)

Dino said:


> So, should I hold out on switching to dish untill the new receivers are available? if so, is there a set date for them?
> 
> also, has anyone tried comcast's hd pvr?


Dino,

I would advise waiting for the new MPEG4 HD DVR (Model 622). It is slated for release on Feb 1st, but the release dates tend to slip alittle.

I really hope by not too much as the new HD channel additions are to added on Feb 1st and only in MPEG4.

John


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## navychop (Jul 13, 2005)

Dino-

The VIP622 was to be released 2/1/06- some now say sometime in March. Tomorrow night will be a Charlie Chat, and it should have a great deal of info for us, including the VIP622 release date and upgrade programs (I may be setting myself up for a fall- again). Anyway, join us here for an online Chat, which will discuss what is happening on the Charlie Chat. Since you don't have DISH equipment, this is the best way to track what is being said, more or less live. "Our" chat starts at 8:30, Charlie starts at 9. You'll see how to participate in the chat on the DBSTALK home page.


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

The 921 does not have NBR and therefore no Dish Pass.


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## stonecold (Feb 20, 2004)

Here are the primary downsides to a tivo that in a Digital Cable or Satellite setup (Excluding DirectTV Tivo models)

1. Can not record a direct stream. So you are taking a digital signal converting it over to analog just for your tivo to convert it back to digital for storage. This does degrade the picture quality of the recording. Now granted you have to have a good quality television and good eyes to see the extr distrotation of the pciture but it is there.

2. Yet another box, I am not a fan of the jack of all trade devices. I belive my cellphone should be able to only do one thing make and recieve calls. But in the concept of DVRs especially with issue of number 1 a DVR/Satellite Receiver or DVR/Digital Cable Box is the best solution. as it does the following:
A. One lest thing to break
B. Fewer cables to plug in
C. One less thing to pay a warranty fee on 
D. One less phone call to make when there is a problem
E. Saves room in entertainment cabinet.

3. As technology progresses so you box will become outdate this is true for any piece of electronics but in the mordern age of cable and satellite leasing boxes out you never have buy a new dvr as the company would exchange it out for a small fee. Where as with tivo it is another 300 dollars at least for the latest and greatest tivo.

4. Tivo most likely will not be around much longer. Most predict that they will stop producing hardware and simply licence the tivo software out to companies like comcast and echostar ( dish network) 


Now I could go on but I dont want this to be a bash fest on the tivo platform. There are plenty of great things about tivo that would make you want to have one. I am simply playing devil's advocate for a second pointing out what is seriously wrong with the tivo model


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