# R15 Problems



## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

First of all, thanks for all the great info on this board.

I've been using a couple of old UTV's up until a week ago. I love them, but I'm down to one tuner on each, so I thought I would upgrade. WHAT A MISTAKE! These R15's are crap.

I could probably get used to the 30 second _slip_, but I've already lost 3 programs do to lockup/reboots. Now I read that they are rolling back the latest update to get back to the version that I have. Well the version I have sucks!

Anyway, I'm shipping the UTV's off in the morning to be repaired. Anyone know if Best Buy will take these R15's back? I've had them less then a week and I have all of the boxes/packing material.

I would love to be convinced that I'm being hasty and the R15's are worth the hastle. Anyone want to give it a try? :lol:


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## KY Mike (May 3, 2006)

I can’t convince you. Only you can do that. All I can do is relate my experiences. 

I have 3 TIVO based DVRs and one R-15. I love the TIVO DVRs but I’m also growing quite fond of the R-15. The features that can only be accessed with the R-15 are a big selling point to me, especially during football games. The only time I reset is after a software upgrade. My problems have been few and far between. 

I rarely post on this board although I read it daily. The reason being I rarely have problems. Others will relay different experiences. Your mileage will vary.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

I don't think BB will simply take them back. But give it a try.

I agree, R15/HR20 isn't there yet. DTivos are and from what I've heard, so are the UTVs. If you can get them fixed, good for you. If not, look to purchase a DTivo or two. Bottom line is that if you want to depend on your DVR to record what you tell it and be able to play what it records, you need to stay away from the R15 and HR20.


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## laxcoach (Dec 7, 2005)

As a UTV (2 retired) fan who owns 2 R-15s, 2 HR-20s, a HR10-250 and one of the SD DTivos.... Don't get a DTivo. You probably dislike the workflow. The R-15 is much closer to the feel of a UTV.

I didn't even know you could get a UTV fixed.


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## KY Mike (May 3, 2006)

Wolffpack said:


> I don't think BB will simply take them back. But give it a try.
> 
> I agree, R15/HR20 isn't there yet. DTivos are and from what I've heard, so are the UTVs. If you can get them fixed, good for you. If not, look to purchase a DTivo or two. Bottom line is that if you want to depend on your DVR to record what you tell it and be able to play what it records, you need to stay away from the R15 and HR20.


And so my point is proven.

My R-15 records what I want when I want and I never have problems playing back the recordings. I dump many programs to my DVD burner and they come out fine.

Wolfpacks experiences are obviously different.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

KY Mike said:


> And so my point is proven.
> 
> My R-15 records what I want when I want and I never have problems playing back the recordings. I dump many programs to my DVD burner and they come out fine.
> 
> Wolfpacks experiences are obviously different.


That's the point. Both the R15 and HR20 are the greatest DVRs since sliced bread for some folks and the worst POSes for others. That equals unreliability. My R15 works fine, but then again I do a reset every weekend to keep it on it's toes. There's no way that users of these DVRs should be seeing this wide a range of dependability.


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## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

Wolffpack said:


> Bottom line is that if you want to depend on your DVR to record what you tell it and be able to play what it records, you need to stay away from the R15 and HR20.


Wow, that's a very strong statement. Unfortunately, it does summarize my short experience with the R15.


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## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

laxcoach said:


> As a UTV (2 retired) fan who owns 2 R-15s, 2 HR-20s, a HR10-250 and one of the SD DTivos.... Don't get a DTivo. You probably dislike the workflow. The R-15 is much closer to the feel of a UTV.
> 
> I didn't even know you could get a UTV fixed.


You're absolutely right. I didn't have any dependability issues with my dtivo, but I hated the interface. The R15 seems very intuitive.

I'm not sure if you're aloud to post links here, but a quick search for "ultimatetv repair" brings you to a place that I'm told is very reliable. It's $130 to have both tuners replaced (hence the R15 decision), but I'm starting to think that it's worth it.


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

laxcoach said:


> I didn't even know you could get a UTV fixed.


Yeah, there are some places online that will do it. I would think that it would be cheaper to get a used one of of ebay.


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## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

KY Mike said:


> The features that can only be accessed with the R-15 are a big selling point to me, especially during football games. The only time I reset is after a software upgrade. My problems have been few and far between.
> 
> I rarely post on this board although I read it daily. The reason being I rarely have problems. Others will relay different experiences. Your mileage will vary.


What features are available on the R15 that aren't on dtivo or utv?

The final straw was last night when my wife and I were watching a recording of the Eagles game. About half way through, we stopped it to eat dinner. When we tried to restart the playback, we just got a black screen. I tried everything, including trying to play it from the history screen. Nothing worked. I did a reset, and when it came back up, the game, along with several other recorded items, was gone.

Have you experienced anything like this?


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## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

cabanaboy1977 said:


> Yeah, there are some places online that will do it. I would think that it would be cheaper to get a used one of of ebay.


Yeah, but I have three of them from Ebay laying here right now, all with 1 bad tuner. I finally gave up.


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

DustyTrail said:


> What features are available on the R15 that aren't on dtivo or utv?
> 
> The final straw was last night when my wife and I were watching a recording of the Eagles game. About half way through, we stopped it to eat dinner. When we tried to restart the playback, we just got a black screen. I tried everything, including trying to play it from the history screen. Nothing worked. I did a reset, and when it came back up, the game, along with several other recorded items, was gone.
> 
> Have you experienced anything like this?


Did you try changing the channel? There is an issue sometimes where if you don't change the change before you reboot that the program will be gone. Also if the program is still recording it will delete the first half of what you recorded (unlike the UTV that would break it up into two partials).



DustyTrail said:


> Yeah, but I have three of them from Ebay laying here right now, all with 1 bad tuner. I finally gave up.


Yeah it's always a gamble with ebay. Just wondering, how much are they charging you to fix the tuners?


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

DustyTrail said:


> I would love to be convinced that I'm being hasty and the R15's are worth the hastle. Anyone want to give it a try? :lol:


All I will say is you locked yourself into a new two year commitment already so you might as well keep them.


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

DustyTrail said:


> Have you experienced anything like this?


Most of us have. All you do is press stop and then press the previous button or at least that works for me.


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

Wolffpack said:


> That's the point. Both the R15 and HR20 are the greatest DVRs since sliced bread for some folks and the worst POSes for others. That equals unreliability. My R15 works fine, but then again I do a reset every weekend to keep it on it's toes. There's no way that users of these DVRs should be seeing this wide a range of dependability.


I had both extremes. My R15 300 was nothing but trouble, lockups, black screens, unresponsive, caller id non-functional (would display unknown caller several times a day when the phone hadn't rang), similar issues to others. Reboots, reformats did not help.

My replacement, an R15 100, with the exact same series links, exact same cables, exact same hookup, has not been reset at all and the caller id is functional.

The variation in performance is just bizarre.

Now, if they would just up the limits and add dual buffers, I would be totally happy.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Bobman said:


> All I will say is you locked yourself into a new two year commitment already so you might as well keep them.


Two year committment is for service. Not equipment. Get your own equipment and go from there.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

raott said:


> I had both extremes. My R15 300 was nothing but trouble, lockups, black screens, unresponsive, caller id non-functional (would display unknown caller several times a day when the phone hadn't rang), similar issues to others. Reboots, reformats did not help.
> 
> My replacement, an R15 100, with the exact same series links, exact same cables, exact same hookup, has not been reset at all and the caller id is functional.
> 
> ...


Kinda makes one wonder if the newest kid on the block (-100) has different hardware specs. Possibly all -300s and -500s need to be replaced with -100s. Anyone with a -100 having problems?


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## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

cabanaboy1977 said:


> Did you try changing the channel? There is an issue sometimes where if you don't change the change before you reboot that the program will be gone. Also if the program is still recording it will delete the first half of what you recorded (unlike the UTV that would break it up into two partials).
> 
> Yeah it's always a gamble with ebay. Just wondering, how much are they charging you to fix the tuners?


$130. They do both tuners, regardless if one is working.


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## qwerty (Feb 19, 2006)

Wolffpack said:


> I don't think BB will simply take them back. But give it a try.





Bobman said:


> All I will say is you locked yourself into a new two year commitment already so you might as well keep them.


I was in BB last week. There was a sign by the R15's saying something bout a 30 day satisfaction guarantee (I didn't read the details because I'm not considering another unit).

I think there's a shot they might take them back.


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## tommybrownell (Nov 14, 2006)

Wolffpack said:


> Kinda makes one wonder if the newest kid on the block (-100) has different hardware specs. Possibly all -300s and -500s need to be replaced with -100s. Anyone with a -100 having problems?


I joined these boards and was about to post, for precisely this reason.

I switched from D*Network after some crappy customer service issues, but no real hardware issues that they didn't take care of right away.

I've had the r15-100 for about a month and a half...and have already had issues like crazy.

It started with dropping timers for Heroes, and is now dropping timers everywhere. This morning it dropped an Outer Limits timer for me, and tonight it is currently failing to record Tales from the Darkside.

Basically, unless I'm babysitting my DVR, I am apt to miss shows...and that defeats the purpose of a DVR.

I haven't done a reformat yet, because I have shows saved I haven't watched (like Heroes, for instance, since I'm waiting until I can watch the episode that this DVR dropped entirely).

I was going to force a software update, but from what I gather, 0x1022 is the most up to date software, so it seems like I'm SOL there.

To say nothing of smaller issues like the DVR refusing to recognize a "push-button" record, or ignoring the rewind or fast forward buttons.

Soooo...yeah, I'm having problems with a -100.

Tommy


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

qwerty said:


> saying something bout a 30 day satisfaction guarantee


That is only to return the R-15 and you can. The "catch" is and I am 100% positive that once you activate the R-15, even if you return it the next day, your locked into a new two year commitment.

You must have missed the thread a couple months ago I posted trying to help a friend get satisfaction as he didn't like the R-15 and tried to sent it back right away?


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## DustyTrail (Nov 13, 2006)

Bobman said:


> That is only to return the R-15 and you can. The "catch" is and I am 100% positive that once you activate the R-15, even if you return it the next day, your locked into a new two year commitment.
> 
> You must have missed the thread a couple months ago I posted trying to help a friend get satisfaction as he didn't like the R-15 and tried to sent it back right away?


I'm actually fine with that. I've had Directv for over 10 years. It's just the R15 that I don't like.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Personally, I believe that's one area that should be challenged in court. DTV's current "MO" is to impose a 2 year commitment to service when a customer gets any "advanced technology" equipment. If, within 30 days a customer returns that "advanced technology" equipment, then the 2 year commitment needs to be removed.

John Q Public want's a new R15 or HR20 and he's told he has 30 days to return it if he doesn't like it. What he's not told is that if he returns it he's still extended his commitment to DTV for 2 years. So after 30 days John cancels and also cancels his DTV service because he wants to try Dish or cable. He then faces a cancellation fee to get out of the commitment that should never have been there.

Plus, I don't even want to get into the fact that DTV needs to drop the "advanced technology" term and just say a HD receiver or a DVR. I say this simply because I don't consider anything DTV is offering right now as "advanced technology". If it new to DTV sure, does it perform advanced functions....nope.


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

Wolffpack said:


> Personally, I believe that's one area that should be challenged in court. DTV's current "MO" is to impose a 2 year commitment to service when a customer gets any "advanced technology" equipment. If, within 30 days a customer returns that "advanced technology" equipment, then the 2 year commitment needs to be removed.
> 
> John Q Public want's a new R15 or HR20 and he's told he has 30 days to return it if he doesn't like it. What he's not told is that if he returns it he's still extended his commitment to DTV for 2 years. So after 30 days John cancels and also cancels his DTV service because he wants to try Dish or cable. He then faces a cancellation fee to get out of the commitment that should never have been there.
> 
> Plus, I don't even want to get into the fact that DTV needs to drop the "advanced technology" term and just say a HD receiver or a DVR. I say this simply because I don't consider anything DTV is offering right now as "advanced technology". If it new to DTV sure, does it perform advanced functions....nope.


It's all in how you want to determine what the phrase means. It does things normal receivers don't do so it's advanced. Nothing more then a marketing term. Tivo doesn't do some things UTV did, R15 does some things Tivo and UTV didn't do, Tivo does some things none of them do.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Clint Lamor said:


> It's all in how you want to determine what the phrase means. It does things normal receivers don't do so it's advanced. Nothing more then a marketing term. Tivo doesn't do some things UTV did, R15 does some things Tivo and UTV didn't do, Tivo does some things none of them do.


That's 100% correct. And given the current state of DVRs and the units you just mentioned, I don't consider any of those being "advanced". All of those units pretty much do what the other do. Some to a better degree than others. But none really any further advanced than the other.

It's all in the definition. To me, if someone wants to label their product as possessing "advanced technology" then I expect it to do things most others don't, to perform functions most others cannot perform and even to provide one or two functions never before seem by mortal man.  But again, all in the definition.

Now, with Tivo's announcement that their users will soon be able to play YouTube.com videos (or other internet content) on their TV via their Tivo, that I do consider "advanced".


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## bearymore (Sep 1, 2006)

I got 2 R-15's to replace some Series 1 DTivos. I went back to the Tivos not because I had problems with the R-15's, but because they did work as specified and I didn't like the specifications. My issues:

FF and RW were unpredictable. It was impossible to FF through a commercial because where it stopped seemed random. RW would do anything from be approximately right to jump to the beginning of the program, so it was useless for correcting a bad FF. Some on this forum said this is a function of the file system and is essentially uncorrectable.

Searches include channels you don't receive and you can save only 25 of them. So if I search for some show on CBS, it may record LA Channel 2 which I receive or CBSE which I don't. Most of the time it seemed to want to record CBSE because that channel airs shows before the LA channel due to the time difference.

You can only make an SL for a show once on one channel. I am a huge fan of PBS' Mystery! I have 3 season passes for it on my Tivo for channels 24, 28, and 50 in LA (they all run different episodes). On the R-15 I had to settle for only channel 28.

You can only have a total of 50 SLs and autorecord searches combined. I have lots more than that. I like to set up autorecords for obscure movies that only come around once in a blue moon. With a limit of 50, I can't do this and set up SLs for the programs I do watch regularly. Furthermore, I don't have the freedom to leave SLs for shows that air in spurts. On my Tivo I have a season pass for first-run Sopranos. When HBO gets around to airing the next season, I'll get it. I don't have to keep track of when it will start being aired. With only 50 SL slots, I'd probably have deleted the SL when last season was over and would have had to remember to reinstate it when the Sopranos started appearing in the quide again.

The DTivo is hackable. I've expanded mine to 176 hours.

If you unplug the R-15 it loses its guide data. The Tivo doesn't. If you have a power outage, your R-15 won't get all the data it needs to work properly for 2 days. The Tivo comes up where it was when the power went off. 

There are features I like in the R-15 like the PIG and the on screen menus are easy to use once you get used to them. There just were too many issues. The straw that broke the camel's back, though, was the FF and RW problem. This seemed like such a basic function and was so repeatedly annoying, I started to hate using the R-15. At that point I switched back to D-Tivo.


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

Wolffpack said:


> That's 100% correct. And given the current state of DVRs and the units you just mentioned, I don't consider any of those being "advanced". All of those units pretty much do what the other do. Some to a better degree than others. But none really any further advanced than the other.
> 
> It's all in the definition. To me, if someone wants to label their product as possessing "advanced technology" then I expect it to do things most others don't, to perform functions most others cannot perform and even to provide one or two functions never before seem by mortal man.  But again, all in the definition.
> 
> Now, with Tivo's announcement that their users will soon be able to play YouTube.com videos (or other internet content) on their TV via their Tivo, that I do consider "advanced".


I agree I don't consider any of them advanced, honestly not even with the YouTube.com integration. Is that feature actually out or is it another Tivo/Netflix thing?

Can't wait to see what happens when somone comes out with the next killer piece kind of like when Replay and Tivo came out. That was a huge shift in how I watched TV, Slingbox did somewhat of the same thing but nowhere near what the DVR gave me.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Clint Lamor said:


> I agree I don't consider any of them advanced, honestly not even with the YouTube.com integration. Is that feature actually out or is it another Tivo/Netflix thing?


Watch it Clint. Don't start accusing a company that can actually produce a DVR that performs the functions of a DVR as peddling vaporware. No, internet access is not out, it was just announced. http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/14/technology/14tivo.html

Kinda like DTV announced their new DVRs....what about two years ago...and still have yet to produce a unit that can be depended on as a DVR.

Like I said, let's not get into a slamfest here. But I do consider Tivo's recently announced internet capability something more advanced that what we see from everyone.


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

Wolffpack said:


> Watch it Clint. Don't start accusing a company that can actually produce a DVR that performs the functions of a DVR as peddling vaporware. No, internet access is not out, it was just announced. http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/14/technology/14tivo.html
> 
> Kinda like DTV announced their new DVRs....what about two years ago...and still have yet to produce a unit that can be depended on as a DVR.
> 
> Like I said, let's not get into a slamfest here. But I do consider Tivo's recently announced internet capability something more advanced that what we see from everyone.


Wasn't meant as a slam at all. I was wondering if it was actually out or if it was going to turn out like the NetFlix deal.

Every company Tivo included has many Vaporware releases I was just haven't been keeping up with them since I can't use the S3 so I didn't know it they released this feature or not. I have no reason to slam them they still get money from me every month for my Standalone S2s. 

Edit:

Actually I just read that link and YouTube is one it won't be able to do it looks like. I don't like the part that I have to pay them $24.95 then download to my computer and then stream it to Tivo. I was one of those who actually paid for HME option then they made it free. Made me a little upset with them. I really wish I could use my SA Tivos with DTV in a more integrated manner because I like some of the add on stuff HME has but never liked that I only had one tuner and it wasn't pure digital. Then with the DTivo I didn't like the fact that I didn't have all the features that my SAs have. :lol: guess it's a no win


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Clint Lamor said:


> Wasn't meant as a slam at all. I was wondering if it was actually out or if it was going to turn out like the NetFlix deal.
> 
> Every company Tivo included has many Vaporware releases I was just haven't been keeping up with them since I can't use the S3 so I didn't know it they released this feature or not. I have no reason to slam them they still get money from me every month for my Standalone S2s.
> 
> ...


Legitimate complaint!

In the consumer electronics world we generally have two types or organizations. Those that innovate, and those that imitate. The degrees of success at each of those can withstand years of debate. But in the end, IMO, those two categories describe all. I won't assign labels, I'll leave that to the readers of this forum.


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## pentium101 (Nov 19, 2005)

Wolffpack said:


> John Q Public want's a new R15 or HR20 and he's told he has 30 days to return it if he doesn't like it. What he's not told is that if he returns it he's still extended his commitment to DTV for 2 years. So after 30 days John cancels and also cancels his DTV service because he wants to try Dish or cable. He then faces a cancellation fee to get out of the commitment that should never have been there.


Do you know this from an actual experience or are you just speculating?

When I had owned and then returned my R15 back in November of last year, I had never seen any 2 year commitment added to my account. 

I had only owned the unit for 3 weeks and when I checked my account before and after cancelling there never was any kind of commitment added.


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## sheridan1952 (Mar 16, 2006)

I can tell you that the 2 year commitment was my experience. And it is stated in their website.

That you escaped the commitment was a fluke. You were lucky.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

pentium101 said:


> Do you know this from an actual experience or are you just speculating?
> 
> When I had owned and then returned my R15 back in November of last year, I had never seen any 2 year commitment added to my account.
> 
> I had only owned the unit for 3 weeks and when I checked my account before and after cancelling there never was any kind of commitment added.


From other posts on this site.


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## pentium101 (Nov 19, 2005)

Thanks Wolffpack.

I must have missed those. :bang


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## zortapa (Nov 16, 2005)

Bobman said:


> Most of us have. All you do is press stop and then press the previous button or at least that works for me.


I just press PAUSE and then PAUSE again. This has worked about 49 out of the 50 times that I have encountered the "frozen playback problem".


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## TheMoose (Jan 20, 2006)

The programs are showing up on my to do list but they are not recording.
It still can't tell the diffrence between a new show & a rerun.
I tried to do a forced update but it didn't work.


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## chiefgeek (Nov 19, 2006)

I decided to dump my 3 UltimateTV boxes with R15.

So far so good, 1 thing I haven't mastered is skipping throug the buffer or a recorded program. UTV hit FF/RR multiple times and it increases in speed up to 300x, Tivo hit 30-second skip while in FF/RW mode and it jumps 15 minutes and R15 ???????

The 30 second slip (I guess thats the term) sucks because it takes 2.5 sec to complete. I would much rather see it just jump 30 seconds like all the other PVRs do.

If anyone knows a good outlet for me to get rid of the 3 UTV boxes, please let me know. I know some of you are looking for spares in case yours dies. All 3 of them work fine, have remotes, are de-activated with no balance, ...


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## tae111 (Dec 1, 2006)

I am new to Direct TV and have the R15. I also have problems with recording shows. I have programed it to record General Hospital for my wife and many times it does not record. If I go to history it is there but says not recorded. I have contacted Direct TV and re set the system numerious times but it still is unreliable. My wife is driving me nuts about this. I have heard that the TIVO system is much better.I can get the TIVO series 2 (TVD649080) for $69.99 after rebate. I am going to call DIRECT TV and find out if it is compatable with there system.


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

tae111 said:


> I have programed it to record General Hospital for my wife and many times it does not record.


Set up a manual recording just to be safe. Keep your SL but add a manual recording and then you have two chances to record it.


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