# HD Packages come Feb. 1st (?)



## tedb3rd (Feb 2, 2006)

...So what channels will we get for the $20/month HD package? (Or another way to ask: What channels will we lose if we don't get the package?)

Is the HD package basically the Voom networks or does it also add (or delete if you don't have it) the other HD channels like Discovery-HD, Natl. Geo-HD, Food-HD, HGTV-HD, HDNet, ESPNs, etc.

For example, if I subscribe to Top250 come Feb (and not the HD package) would I still get HD channels that have a SD channel equivalent included in that package--like Food Network, ESPN, ESPN2, National Geo, HGTV??? Or what about locals in HD?

I know that, with the movie channels like HBO, you get the HD version of that channel by subscribing to the SD channels of that package.

I have not been too impressed with DN's HD lineup... lots of HD channels but it's mostly crap--They could rename RUSH-HD to the "Riding Bikes or Snow Boarding 24/7 (except for when promoting other crappy channels) Channel"... And also that Fashion HD channel--can't remember the name b/c I don't even include that in the guide... The only ones, to me, that are worth it are Discovery, National Geo, HDNets, Equator (sometimes), ESPNs....

Dish should consider a $10/month HD package like DirectTV's--yeah, fewer channels, but it has the better ones.

Thanks in advance for the feedback!


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## saltrek (Oct 22, 2005)

Only the package names are changing, not the content. The current HD package costs $20, so the price for HD isn't changing either.


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## TNGTony (Mar 23, 2002)

Okay I see where the confusion comes in. If you have HD Bronze, Silver, Gold or Platinum it is EXACTLY the same as if you have AT60/100+HD Pack or AT120/200+HD Pack, AT180/250+HD Pack or AEP+HD Pack after Feb 1.

Here is the break down

If you *DO NOT* subscribe to the one and only HD pack starting Feb 1...

Number of HD channels with basic packs
AT100 = 2**
AT200 = 2**
AT250 = 2**
Aep = 2** 
DL2 = 2** 
DLMax = 2** 
DL Everything (not available to new subs) = 2** 
Great Wall = 2**

Premium Packs
HBO = 1*
Showtime = 1*
Starz = 1*
Cinemax = 0*

Local Package via Satellite*. See http://ekb.dbstalk.com/hdlocal.htm

*$6 HD Enabling Fee added per HD receiver without HD Pack
**Only Dish Demo and ONE of the other channels (NHL HD, PPV HD, Event HD, NBA HD) active at any one time plus $6 HD enabling fee per receiver without HD pack

The HD pack is $20 when added to any of the basic packages above or $29.99+6 HD enabling fee without a basic pack. As of this instant, the HD channels included in the HD pack are as follows:

TNT HD
Discovery HD Theater 
HDNet 
HDNet Movies 
ESPN-HD 
ESPN-2 HD 
NFL HD 
Universal HD 
Natl Geographic HD (With AT250 or DLMax and higher ONLY) 
HGTV HD 
Food HD 
Rave HD 
Equator HD 
Gallery HD 
World Sport HD 
Animania HD 
World Cinema HD 
Rush HD 
Treasure HD 
Ultra HD 
Kung Fu HD 
Film Fest HD 
Monsters HD 
HD News 9482 
Game Play HD 
Family Room HD

See ya
Tony


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

saltrek said:


> Only the package names are changing, not the content. The current HD package costs $20, so the price for HD isn't changing either.


Except for the Platinum package. Or have they made another announcement that continues offering it for $15 more than the AEP?


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## saltrek (Oct 22, 2005)

No - i didn't get into the AEP price change, since the OP was talking about AT 250. I was trying to keep it simple.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

tnsprin said:


> Except for the Platinum package. Or have they made another announcement that continues offering it for $15 more than the AEP?


AFAIK, they haven't made the 1st announcement yet (but I didn't go looking). I largely depend on TNGTony's info but assume it is still based on Retailer Chat leakage. Has there been something "official" that says what happens to current HD Platinum subs? With AT60, I don't pay that much attention to Platinum.  At least when I call DISH now, they are finally aware of the DishHD changes. I did ask about "DVR Advantage" that is supposed to go into effect with the Metallic changes, but no joy.


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## hildred (Aug 19, 2003)

yes what will i get with a 200 plus local hd/hbo/showtime with dish 622/dish 1000 how much will pay one hdtv/one sd tv


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## nataraj (Feb 25, 2006)

Looking interesting. I don't remember when I saw a SD channel last (excepting international) ... 

If I have two HD receivers will they charge $12 extra if I don't take a basic package ? How about international ... something extra again for getting an international channel without the basic ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

All accounts are charged $6 for not having a basic package (AT, DL or Great Wall).

In addition, there is a $6 per HD receiver fee for not having a DishHD package.
People subscribing to the $29.95 "HD Only" package are so rare that no one has reported their exact billing here.


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## restart88 (Jun 18, 2006)

So if I say have Dish Family and pay the $6 fee could I still add the HD pak for $20?

But not with the Dish It Up promotion which requires a higher tier, right?

At this stage I'm leaning towards BHN cable because there's no committment and at $60+ tax including an HD DVR and nothing to pay up front it seems a better option in the short term. I really don't want to go to $60 either way though.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

If you OWN your 622 (or 211) you MIGHT be able to buy the $29.95 HDPack, $19.95 DISHFamily, $6 fee, $5.98 DVR fee (on the 622) and $5 for locals (if you want EPG data). $66.88 plus tax.


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## restart88 (Jun 18, 2006)

James Long said:


> If you OWN your 622 (or 211) you MIGHT be able to buy the $29.95 HDPack, $19.95 DISHFamily, $6 fee, $5.98 DVR fee (on the 622) and $5 for locals (if you want EPG data). $66.88 plus tax.


That's sad!

So after shelling out $400 for the receiver I'd "get to pay" $6.88 more than cable. :nono:

But to be fair I've not done a package comparison, just the raw dollars at this point. Still, it's a shame other providers have kinda fizzled like Voom and USDTV's national rollout.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

If you can live with AT60 (soon to be AT100 with the addition of the 32 CD Music channels) and no regional sports you can get AT60 plus Dish HD for $49.95 per month (today they call that Bronze). 25 channels of HD (not counting the three HD movie channels, HD PPV and Nat Geo HD since you won't get them without extra cost). You still have to add $5 for locals and $5.98 for the DVR fee bringing you to $60.93 - but a decent selection of channels. If you want your local regional sports add $5. $65.93.


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## restart88 (Jun 18, 2006)

For me, I then have to add in a 2nd receiver fee, at least 1 movie channel, and $18 to Tivo. But even without 1 of the Tivos (kinda stuck with one for a while due to contract) and eliminating the bedroom receiver I'm still way above where I want to be at $60+++. (sigh)

Oh well.


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## nataraj (Feb 25, 2006)

James Long said:


> All accounts are charged $6 for not having a basic package (AT, DL or Great Wall).
> 
> In addition, there is a $6 per HD receiver fee for not having a DishHD package.
> People subscribing to the $29.95 "HD Only" package are so rare that no one has reported their exact billing here.


I was looking into the future pricing. If I just pick the HD pack at $20 - looks like I pay $6 for not having a basic package and 2x $6 fee for the receivers (plus the dvr fee which I pay anyway now). That is $18 extra ... and I can get AT100 for $29.

BTW, if I get dish family, is that a basic package ? Or will I be charged extra ?

Also, does dish family remove any of the dish HD channels (since they are not all "family friendly") ?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

nataraj said:


> I was looking into the future pricing. If I just pick the HD pack at $20 -


You can't. HD pack alone is $29.95 plus the $6 as noted (and will remain that way in February).


nataraj said:


> Also, does dish family remove any of the dish HD channels (since they are not all "family friendly") ?


E* removes all of them.  You cannot get the $20 HD pack with DISHFamily. In order to qualify for the $20 DishHD you need to subscribe to "AT100" or above.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

restart88 said:


> So after shelling out $400 for the receiver I'd "get to pay" $6.88 more than cable. :nono:


That's why almost everyone leases their receiver. The bright side is that you have access to a whole lot more national HD and SD content through Dish Network.


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## eatonjb (Nov 21, 2006)

TNGTony said:


> Premium Packs
> HBO = 1*
> Showtime = 1*
> Starz = 1*
> Cinemax = 1*


Cinemax ? are they finaly getting it?! anything fixed up with Max now?

e..b


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## TNGTony (Mar 23, 2002)

That was a mistake... it should be Cinemax = 0

Sorry. I corrected the original post

See ya
Tony


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## tedb3rd (Feb 2, 2006)

The reason that Dish prices are increasing is because they have to pay their guys more to figure out how to get at least $75/month out of customers no matter what they subsribe to--whether it's in programming you don't want to watch or in fees/penalties for not wanting to pay for channels you don't watch!!


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

tedb3rd said:


> The reason that Dish prices are increasing is because they have to pay their guys more to figure out how to get at least $75/month out of customers no matter what they subsribe to--whether it's in programming you don't want to watch or in fees/penalties for not wanting to pay for channels you don't watch!!


That's where DirecTV is better. They've already figured out how to wring out almost $8/month more, on average, out of their customers.


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## killzone (Dec 27, 2006)

James Long said:


> All accounts are charged $6 for not having a basic package (AT, DL or Great Wall).
> 
> In addition, there is a $6 per HD receiver fee for not having a DishHD package.
> People subscribing to the $29.95 "HD Only" package are so rare that no one has reported their exact billing here.


The HD enabling Fee is one fee per account. I have 2 Vip622's and only get charged one $6 HD enabling fee.


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## killzone (Dec 27, 2006)

restart88 said:


> That's sad!
> 
> So after shelling out $400 for the receiver I'd "get to pay" $6.88 more than cable. :nono:
> 
> But to be fair I've not done a package comparison, just the raw dollars at this point. Still, it's a shame other providers have kinda fizzled like Voom and USDTV's national rollout.


It's $6 more than cable. . . . . Still if most cable companies don't charge extra for HD channels that you already subscribe too, Dish shouldn't either. Cablevision doesn't charge for HD programming and I don't believe Verizon Fios does either.

My wife used to work for Rainbow Media which is the holding company that owns Cablevision and used to own Voom. They got rid of Voom because they couldn't get enough subscribers for it. It's only profitable for Dish because they are forcing all their 622 lease customers to subscribe to the package that includes it.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

I thought Rainbow Media still owns Voom.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

HDMe said:


> I thought Rainbow Media still owns Voom.


You thought correctly. Voom HD Networks is a division of Rainbow Media Holdings LLC.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

killzone said:


> My wife used to work for Rainbow Media which is the holding company that owns Cablevision and used to own Voom. They got rid of Voom because they couldn't get enough subscribers for it..


You've got your information all twisted up.

Voom was and continues to be a subsidiary of Rainbow Media.
Rainbow Media is a subsidiary of Cablevision Systems Corporation.

Here's a link: http://www.voom.tv/voom/about_us/index.html


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## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

So is there any advantage to upgrading an 811 to a 622 before the end of the month or should I stay with what I have and not go to bronze till I have to? 
I have AT60 +locals +HD package now.
I guess I would go to Bronze HD +locals with the $10.00 per month rebate after paying $299.00? for the 622 and get a 1000+ dish install


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## killzone (Dec 27, 2006)

harsh said:


> You've got your information all twisted up.
> 
> Voom was and continues to be a subsidiary of Rainbow Media.
> Rainbow Media is a subsidiary of Cablevision Systems Corporation.
> ...


Interesting, you are right. I thought I had read somewhere that they sold it. Cablevision doesn't even offer the Voom package.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

E* is an investor in the Voom channels but Cablevision/Rainbow Media is still the owner.

So far E* is the only provider carrying the channels.


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## Mike D-CO5 (Mar 12, 2003)

killzone said:


> The HD enabling Fee is one fee per account. I have 2 Vip622's and only get charged one $6 HD enabling fee.


 Really one hd enabeling fee? I was told each time I called about it I would be charged $6.00 PER RECEIVER by every csr I talked to including the Tech department. That would be nice to know it would only cost one time vs per receiver.


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## killzone (Dec 27, 2006)

Mike D-CO5 said:


> Really one hd enabeling fee? I was told each time I called about it I would be charged $6.00 PER RECEIVER by every csr I talked to including the Tech department. That would be nice to know it would only cost one time vs per receiver.


So far I only have 1 HD enabling Fee on my bill.

Here is the exact wording from their web site. Notice that for the DVR fee is says "for each" (various DVR models). For the HD enabling fee it just says it will be charged if "any" (various HD models) are activated.

DISH Network DVR Service Fee: a non-refundable $5.98 per month DISH Network DVR service fee will be charged to your account for each model 510, 522, 625, or ViP622 DVR receiver activated. This fee will be waived if you subscribe to either America's "Everything" Pak, DishHD Platinum, or Latino "Everything" Pak; HD Enabling Fee: A $6.00 per month HD enabling fee will be charged to your account if any model 411, ViP211, ViP222, or ViP622 DVR receiver is activated. This fee will be waived on a monthly basis if you subscribe to DishHD Bronze, DishHD Silver, DishHD Gold, DishHD Platinum, or Dish HD Package.


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

Cable may not "charge" more for HD channels, but you have to have their digital tier in order to receive any HD programming except for the free local OTA's. So, in their own way, they actually DO charge for the HD channels, and if cable is like my old cable used to be you have to call them about once a month to get them to tune up and adjust their amplifiers or half your channels disappear.

The business model for satellite and cable is different, you guys are comparing apples and oranges. Well, maybe oranges and grapefruit - you decide which is which.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

killzone said:


> So far I only have 1 HD enabling Fee on my bill.
> 
> Here is the exact wording from their web site. Notice that for the DVR fee is says "for each" (various DVR models). For the HD enabling fee it just says it will be charged if "any" (various HD models) are activated.


It may make a big difference how the 2nd 622 was aquired, or you may have gotten lucky. The "charged if any" occurs in the DHA agreement which limits you to a single 622. If one were to get a ViP receiver under the existing subscriber DIU agreement, it is clearly to be a per receiver:


HD Enabling Fee: A non-refundable $6.00 per month HD enabling fee will be charged to your account for each model ViP211 or ViP622 receiver for which the capacity to receive high definition programming (including without limitation via an off-air antenna) has been enabled.​This is NOT likely the current DIU agreement, but the only electronic version I have access to - http://www.dbstalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=5521&d=1143587313

A purchased ViP doesn't fall under DHA or DIU, and the Residential Agreement is VERY old. How did you obtain your 622s?


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

You cannot lease a 622 and not have an HD Metallic Pack - all part of the package. If you're paying the $6.00 you bought your 622(s).


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## Mike D-CO5 (Mar 12, 2003)

I OWN both of my 622s and the csrs all told me that it was $6.00 hd enabeling fee PER RECEIVER. That is one reason I still sub to the hd pack with the top 120 . I wish that their fees were PER ACCOUNT instead of per receiver on dvr fees and the hd enabeling fees too. I remember the good old days when there were NO extra fees except the additional receiver fees at 4.99 .

Today 1/18/07 is my 10 year anniversary with DISH.:blowout:


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## dalucca (Feb 5, 2005)

Thought I would post my question here as well.....

I thought I was already to proceed with the conversion of my 921 to a ViP622 and my 811 to the ViP211. Recently, I read that Dish has new offers effective February 1st and now I am really confused. And I know when in doubt, this is the best place to go for suggestions or answers.

The first question I have is Dish still giving a credit for turning in the 921? I believe they are still giving a $100 credit for subscribing to one of the Metal packs. I thought I had read earlier they were still giving a $100 credit for the 921. I also believe they are also giving a $25 credit for the 811. 

The next question is whether the current set of HD packages are better or should I wait for February 1st and sign up with the new programming they are offering? If I do wait for the new packages, will I then still get the credits for the 921 and 811? I have also read where I may be able to sell my 921 on eBay and get more than the $100 offered by Dish. My 921 has performed really well for the past couple of years and has not had any issues except for an occassional reboot.

The other receiver I have is a 508 in our bedroom which I believe I own. I recently purchased a LCD TV for the room and would like to gave HD available. My wife loves having a DVR in the room and does not want to lose that feature. Here is my last question......I know Dish's rule is no more than 4 leased tuners per household. Since I own the 921, are those two tuners concerned "leased". If not, one of my options would be to get a 622 and 811 and move the 921 to the bedroom. In that scenario, I would have 3 leased tuners and 2 which I own. 

I know this is a long post, but I would appreciate anyone or everyone's valuable input. Thanks.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=59333&p=597877 was last updated in November and shows 31-Jan-07 as the current expiration dates for both the $100 (credit to your account) for trading in a 921/942 and the New DishHD subscription $10/month for 10 month (rebate). You can roll the dice by waiting until 1-Feb or take a known deal before then. The $25 for the 811 dropped to $10 (for ANY receiver) some time back. Personally, my GUESS is that you'd be better off waiting until 1-Feb and the deal won't be any worse. The $100 for the 921 might go away, but you'd get more than $100 on eBay anyhow.

What would work best for YOU depends on many things. If you subscribe to AT60 plus the HD Pack now, you'll pay either $5 (you have Voom now) or $10 (you don't now sub to Voom) more to get the added MPEG4 channels with a subscription to the NEW 1-Feb HD Pack. You COULD just keep the 921 and upgrade to a 622. Only the 622 would get the MPEG4 HD channels and the 921 would only get what is available in MPEG2. You'd have two DVR fees (unless you are AEP). A BIG caution though. If you do want both a 622 and a 211, you really need to get both at the same time. A DIU upgrade can get you both, but there is a limit of one DIU transaction in 12 months. So if you just got the 622, you wouldn't be able to lease another receiver for a year.

I'd suggest you actually phone a CSR. They can't give out details until new offers are available, but there is a good chance you might get a CSR that would wink or hint that you might want to wait for 1-Feb. If I actually KNEW anything (I don't), I'd wink. New subscribers will be able to get a 622 with no up front cost on 1-Feb whereas they now get the $199 back over 10 months (but it doesn't start right away). It is a reasonable bet that existing subs aren't going to have to pay $200 more than a new sub on 2-Feb.


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## killzone (Dec 27, 2006)

CABill said:


> It may make a big difference how the 2nd 622 was aquired, or you may have gotten lucky.
> 
> A purchased ViP doesn't fall under DHA or DIU, and the Residential Agreement is VERY old. How did you obtain your 622s?


Both of mine were purchased. One of them replaced a receiver on my account, the other was an addition.

To be honest, when I spoke with the CSR's I got the impression that it was pretty rare that anyone paid the $6 HD fee and they really didn't know. They would put me on hold an have to ask someone. Every time I spoke to someone I would get a different answer.

One other very odd thing, when I originally signed up, I was under some sort of lease plan where I paid $5 for 1 extra receiver and $5 for the protection plan (with no charges for any house calls or receiver replacements). For whatever reason they lumped this together as a $10 charge. Now that one of my original receivers was replaced with a 622, it's a $6 charge for the extra receiver. However, they claim they have to leave the $10 charge as is and I have to keep calling every month to get a $5 credit.

I just hope it stays as one $6 charge. Based on the current wording on dish's website (which I posted above), it sounds like it's $6 per account. Otherwise they would have worded it the same as the DVR fee which clearly states is per receiver.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

killzone said:


> To be honest, when I spoke with the CSR's I got the impression that it was pretty rare that anyone paid the $6 HD fee and they really didn't know. They would put me on hold an have to ask someone. Every time I spoke to someone I would get a different answer.


I too think it is pretty rare to pay the $6 HD Enable fee for no Metallic package. Probably, people would rather pay the additional $14 for something than $6 for NOT getting those extra channels. Sat HD locals in your DMA would be a draw, but there are plenty of people that do buy and lease ViP receivers and choose to pay the $6 fee and not subscribe to DishHD - aka Metallic.

The terms you quoted for HD Enable match ttp://www.dishtv.com/terms_dha04.jsp but that agreement is for new (or returning former) subscribers. It isn't necessarily the same terms that apply to someone whose account was initially setup as a purchased receiver account, or the older Digital Home Plan (yours) lease. A good proportion of the 622 leases come from existing subscriber upgrades (DISH'n It Up), and that agreement is explicit in being per receiver. Neither agreement actually applies to your DHP plan with purchased additions.

Next time you call to get the $5 credit (that must get old quick), ask which of your receivers is the Primary receiver on the account. You don't want to disrupt only having a single HD Enable fee, but it might be possible to do something that makes you a "single receiver DHP subscriber" to avoid the extra $5. It is also quite possible that you SHOULDN'T be getting the $5/month back at all. Other people that had your DHP were NOT charged $6/month when they replace a DHP receiver with a ViP. The same $5 for each (not just additional) receiver applied to the account for all receivers originall on the account. The $5 for the 1st receiver is different from the existing DHA lease agreement or an account started with purchased receivers where the 1st receiver is included with the basic programming package. That 1st receiver $5 got you the "insurance" for no cost repairs. If you still have one of the original receivers and two 622s, you should be paying the extra $5/month to get the insurance on the 1st receiver and the other two receivers should have "Additional Rec" fees. That's $6 for a ViP receiver. If you presently pay $10 plus a single $6 "Addl Rec" fee, don't do anything except keep talking them out of $5 each month. If you only had a single DHP receiver and added two 622s, you'd pay $5 (insurance) plus $12 for two "Addl Rec" fees.


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