# 721 guide problems ... check yours and post



## Guest (Aug 23, 2004)

All of a sudden today around 2pm MDT the guide on my 721 refuses to come up. Push the "guide" button and it just stays on the channel you're watching. Push "menu" and then "guide" buttons same thing, just stays on what you're watching.

Did the "power button reset" and then the "smart card reset" but no guide. Finally, pulled the AC plug, let it sit for about 15 minutes and then plugged it in. Rebooted and stil no guide.

Called Dish and, of course it's news to them ... never seen that!

Do me a favor and check the guide on your 721 and post results so I know if it's my box or Dish.

Thanks all.


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## ERSanders (Apr 24, 2002)

I tied it on both of mine...no hay problemas! :jumpingja


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## Big Bob (May 13, 2002)

used mine a few hours ago. all was fine


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## kzosat (Aug 22, 2004)

mine works fine


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## Guest (Aug 24, 2004)

Went to dinner and turned off the 721 (as usual when we're not watching TV). We were gone about 2 hours and when we returned the 721 was functioning perfectly.

Either a coincidence OR Charlie sent a spike down the sat to my 721 for starting the "opinions on Dish warranty thread" http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=31779

I'll never post again ... Honest Charlie, I'll be good! Can I polish up those J.D. Power awards for ya?


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## kzosat (Aug 22, 2004)

Ya know, I re read your post and I had something similar happen (my guide would ONLY comue up if took out the video inlay) Ended up for me anyways that my 721 was FREAKING HOT when I touched it. Did realize my wife had put a stuffed animal behind it to hide it from the baby. I turned it off for a bit and let it cool off then everything worked fine.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Wife+technology=disaster, eh?


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Goldang wimmins. Never shouldn't oughta have given 'em the vote. Then, they up and got them there jobs. Ruined the sanctimony of the institute of marriage it did. Next thing ya know, them thar homersensuals'll be hitchin' up.


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## kzosat (Aug 22, 2004)

Yeah, my wife loves the DVR, but when I told her she was like "how can it overheat? Oh it has a hard drive? Will it crash?" and a bunch of other questions. But the good thing is she likes technology so that lets me buy stuff!


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## Bob Haller (Mar 24, 2002)

Mine did that exact same thing, then appeared ok for about a week before the dreaded hard drive failure message appeared.

I suggest you archive anything of interest just in case


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## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

I had a problem with the guide at 1 point since the L172, but a power off reset took care of it.


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## Big Bob (May 13, 2002)

Bob Haller said:


> Mine did that exact same thing, then appeared ok for about a week before the dreaded hard drive failure message appeared.
> 
> I suggest you archive anything of interest just in case


But can't you say that about most any event?

"The sun came up. Everything appeared ok for about a week before the dreaded hard drive failure message appeared."

(just a bit of kiddin Bob )


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## Guest (Aug 24, 2004)

Bob Haller said:


> Mine did that exact same thing, then appeared ok for about a week before the dreaded hard drive failure message appeared.
> 
> I suggest you archive anything of interest just in case


Damn, the "Haller" curse ... now I'm screwed

(Sorry Bob, couldn't resist)


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## Guest (Aug 24, 2004)

kzosat said:


> Ya know, I re read your post and I had something similar happen (my guide would ONLY comue up if took out the video inlay) Ended up for me anyways that my 721 was FREAKING HOT when I touched it. Did realize my wife had put a stuffed animal behind it to hide it from the baby. I turned it off for a bit and let it cool off then everything worked fine.


In my case not a heat problem. From the first day my first 721 arrived I monitored the chassis temp and was concerned. Of particular interest to me were the ultra low profile bottom feet of the 721. Since heat rises, so little room under the box made for BAD ventilation.

I placed the 721 on it's own shelf with mucho roomo on the sides and top and inserted 2" spacers under the bottom feet. Monitoring the chassis temp my 721 is always only slightly warm to the touch even when it's been on for a long time. Now, that doesn't mean that the internals are running cool.

I strongly recommend that every 721 be spaced up to increase free air room under the box and it needs adequate room on top also. The 721 is NOT a "stackable" unit if you want it to last.


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## Bill R (Dec 20, 2002)

SteveS said:


> I strongly recommend that every 721 be spaced up to increase free air room under the box and it needs adequate room on top also. The 721 is NOT a "stackable" unit if you want it to last.


I think that is a good idea with all DVRs. I noticed that my DirecTV is built the same way (low profile bottom feet). On both my 721 and my DirecTV TiVo I put half inch spacers under the feet and it does provide for better air flow (and there is nothing below them that produces heat and nothing is stacked on top of them).

I wonder how many problems are caused by overheated receivers? I have seen some that are in enclosed cabinets (those glass fronted ones) and when you open the unit you can feel the heat. That can't be good for ANY of the equipment stored in them.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

I, too, was shocked at how hot my 721 got. So, I removed the cover. That certainly improved ventilation. The groovy part is that it's not noticable, the way it sits in the cabinet. It looks like stock from the front.


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## Bob Haller (Mar 24, 2002)

Big Bob said:


> But can't you say that about most any event?
> 
> "The sun came up. Everything appeared ok for about a week before the dreaded hard drive failure message appeared."
> 
> (just a bit of kiddin Bob )


Only trying to prevent my 721 lost the recordings including the one in a lifetime show my wife had stored there.

hope I havent cursed anyones box...


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

My 721 has also would only do certain functionality like go to guide or press info or something like what some of the others described but it wouldnt let me do anything else. Had to reboot the receiver everytime it happened and eventually it quit doing it.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Bill R said:


> I think that is a good idea with all DVRs. I noticed that my DirecTV is built the same way (low profile bottom feet). On both my 721 and my DirecTV TiVo I put half inch spacers under the feet and it does provide for better air flow (and there is nothing below them that produces heat and nothing is stacked on top of them).
> 
> I wonder how many problems are caused by overheated receivers? I have seen some that are in enclosed cabinets (those glass fronted ones) and when you open the unit you can feel the heat. That can't be good for ANY of the equipment stored in them.


I actually have a dual sensor thermoeter from RadioShack located in my Cabinet. One sensor is located at the top of the cabinet and another one is right next to the receiver (Biggest heat source). I have an enclosed cabinet with two fans on the top pulling air out, one pushing air into the receiver, and one on the bottom air in. I have always be concerned, due to the A/V receiver, that it would get too hot in the cabinet. The highest I have seen has been 95 degrees F. I am sure that there are people that don't release the heat situation and as a result bake a few components.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

WJD: 95 sounds pretty hot to me - you might want to work on that.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

SimpleSimon said:


> WJD: 95 sounds pretty hot to me - you might want to work on that.


Really? I ran this across the avsforums HT forum a while back and the response was that it was actually pretty good. Most of the time it is below 90. Actually this is better than what I had before when when it was in the low hundreds. Old setup. No fan. If I recall, this was within the operation temp of the components that I could find a spec on. Does the 721 have a operating temp range?

Do you have a cabinet? What does your tempeture range from. Mine ranged from the upper 70s to the low 90s. I have never seen it above 90. It seems to peak at 91ish and then spikes up when I turn the HT off and the fans shot off 30 seconds later. Maybe I should install another fan.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

I have a small cabinet. 921 on top (where the turntable used to be), VCR below, Sony receiver below that sitting on top of a Sony 5-disc DVD player. No fans. No thermometer, but air temp is only a bit warmer than room air - maybe 80 or so. The glass doors tend to be open much of the time, and aren't airtight anyway.


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## Guest (Aug 25, 2004)

WeeJavaDude said:


> Really? I ran this across the avsforums HT forum a while back and the response was that it was actually pretty good. Most of the time it is below 90. Actually this is better than what I had before when when it was in the low hundreds. Old setup. No fan. If I recall, this was within the operation temp of the components that I could find a spec on. Does the 721 have a operating temp range?
> 
> Do you have a cabinet? What does your tempeture range from. Mine ranged from the upper 70s to the low 90s. I have never seen it above 90. It seems to peak at 91ish and then spikes up when I turn the HT off and the fans shot off 30 seconds later. Maybe I should install another fan.


WJD,

If memory serves back in the day when the 721 had a temp in the setup mine used to read 100-105F and that was WAY too hot (chassis was HOT to the touch). Using thermocouples I measured temps around 125F in the chassis (without disassembly). I believe that's why Dish removed that feature from the software. You know, lots of calls to Dish "my 721 is running too hot".

Then I raised my 721 on spacers and put it on it's own shelf and dropped the external temp to around 80F (not even warm to the touch).

REMEMBER, there's a hard drive in there that generates substantial heat and it's spinning if the 721 is on (and often even when it's off :lol: ).

This ain't rocket science. If you look around at new CPUs you'll usually find 2 case fans, a CPU chip fan WITH heatsink, and often a hard drive fan. Dish could properly cool the 721 and 921 but not with $.03 each noisy Chinese fans.

HEAT kills!


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## phantompr (Aug 2, 2004)

My 721 did the same thing last week. I put it on channel 101 for 30 minutes and the guide came back. I only have the 119 feed, so my unit will update the guide every night at 3:00 am.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

SimpleSimon said:


> I have a small cabinet. 921 on top (where the turntable used to be), VCR below, Sony receiver below that sitting on top of a Sony 5-disc DVD player. No fans. No thermometer, but air temp is only a bit warmer than room air - maybe 80 or so. The glass doors tend to be open much of the time, and aren't airtight anyway.


Simon, Here is my cabinet as you can see the temperature. It is right next to the biggest heat generator the A/V receiver. I usually always have the cabinet closed. I can turn up the fans but then I find them too noisy. You got me thinking so I am going to circle back and make sure I am not doing a little cooking.

http://www.dbstalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1404

I also should mention that the cabinet in the picture is not where the 721 is and is where I have my 811. I was commenting on heat issues so I wanted to make that clear. My 721 is locate upstairs and I have found it to not be that hot externally.. I need to measure the temp of this cabinet, but it is in a cabinet with glass, but does have plenty of room around it. My 721 is warm to the touch, but not real hot.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Damn nice piece of furniture. 

I'll get around to taking pics of my setup sometime soon.


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

SimpleSimon said:


> Damn nice piece of furniture.
> 
> I'll get around to taking pics of my setup sometime soon.


Thank you.. But the question is did I create an component oven?


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## Guest (Aug 26, 2004)

WeeJavaDude said:


> Thank you.. But the question is did I create an component oven?


Measure your oven by the "classic yardsticks" ...

How long to cook a sweet roll?
How long to toast a bagel?
How many 721s have you RMAed?


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## Randy_B (Apr 23, 2002)

The guide would not come up on our 721 last night either. A power button reboot resolved the issue.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

WeeJavaDude said:


> Thank you.. But the question is did I create an component oven?


No way for me to know from here. The front door looks fairly airtight, but if it's got good airflow from slots in the back, that doesn't matter.

My rule of thumb is if a case is too hot for me to keep my hand on it "forever", it's too hot. I'll call that 85 degrees if I have to put a number on it.


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

I'm the next victim of the missing guide. No response from the guide button, no response when trying to access the guide from Menu 1, 4, however, I can do a search, and a theme search, so I know the data is in there. It also picked up on the David Letterman recording at 11:30. The unit is not hot to the touch right now and is well ventilated. 

This doesn't bode well for Dish in my house! My mother in law, from Mexico, is in town for a month. Had to sub to the Dish Latino Max package and teach her how to use the 721. She's used it for two weeks and now has to be re-trained. Did the card reset, power reset, pulled power cord, and now I'm ready for bed. Hope there's a guide tomorrow....

I'm beginning to feel alot like Mr. Haller...Sporadic 721 issues, a failed HD in my 508 and a general level of "babysitting" my recievers. Even my 11 year old daughter is trained on how to do the power reset on her 508.


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

Got the fix from advanced tech. She was very friendly and persistant and it took about 15 minutes, but here it is....

Go into the favorites menu and check "All Channels"
Perform the power reset
May need to do a check switch (I didn't have to)

All fixed...well...kinda.....


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## Bob Haller (Mar 24, 2002)

Wonder what all these calls to CSRs cost E? Whatrever it must be less than provding stable software.. Or they would fix it.

mike welcome to the "club"

As I tell anyone who wil listen at E

You shouldnt have to be a tech to watch tv


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## bmciver (Feb 20, 2003)

I had the same "no guide problem" tonight that you have been describing. Dish had no solution besides that they were aware of it and were working on a fix. My question was how long? You can imagine what they had to say. Anyway, any luck getting it back?

Brian


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## Guest (Aug 28, 2004)

bmciver said:


> I had the same "no guide problem" tonight that you have been describing. Dish had no solution besides that they were aware of it and were working on a fix. My question was how long? You can imagine what they had to say. Anyway, any luck getting it back?


Brian,

As I said earlier in this thread ... after trying all the obvious fixes I just pulled the plug on the 721 and went to dinner. Came back about 2 hours later, plugged in the 721. It booted up and has been perfect ever since.

Give that a try and let us know.


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

bmciver said:


> I had the same "no guide problem" tonight that you have been describing. Dish had no solution besides that they were aware of it and were working on a fix. My question was how long? You can imagine what they had to say. Anyway, any luck getting it back?
> 
> Brian


Did you try the process I described above? Nothing worked until I switched the guide preference to "All Channels".

By the way, tonight, the damned thing would bring up the guide, but wouldn't let me change channels. I couldn't type channel numbers nor could I scroll through the guide. A power reset "fixed" it..

Had I spent the original retail price, I'd have been pissed! I can't see myself paying a grand for the 921 and running against these bugs.


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## Bob Haller (Mar 24, 2002)

I wonder if this bug is a reative of the same sort of one that occured on 1 of my 508s recently. It was very irritating and E offered to RMA the thing. I hung in there a few days longer and it left as mysteriously as it came. My 508 would hang on acquiring guide, stuck on the guide transponder. Which showed awesome strength. Power boots and switch tests would fix it eventually.

I am begining to wonder if the base operating system E uses, or the associated encryption system is somehow less robust than the one D uses?

If thats the root cause of the troubles it might never be resolved

Oh well where before people trashed me for my negative attitude, yesterday someone called me Mr Haller. I am begining to get some understanding and respect. Sadly that poster had troubles with their 721 aand 508

I would prefer E somehow miracliously fix this for EVERYONE!


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