# New hd guide sd connections



## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

I have 6 tv's running from one hd receiver in living room. I have rf remote in every room to control. Now it is all worthless. Beacuse of the stupid message this tv is not connected to hd blah blah it blocks the screen. No matter where I am in the house I have to walk to living room to change channels or do anything. 

My system is 16 years old, but still works great. Is there a new distribution system that can fix this problem?

DTV answer is to put a receiver on each tv or change to sd, neither one is what I want. I want to watch, pause, ff my recordered shows.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

You're distributing the signal through SD, so why not simply change the resolution to SD/480?
there's a press and hold of the exit button that toggles HD/SD for this.


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## WestDC (Feb 9, 2008)

You add can one of these-At your source then connect the composite out to a RF modulator and feed your system as before.

http://www.amazon.com/Component-Composite-w-Down-Scaling/dp/B003FJKHBU

Going forward the additional connections will be elimited from future D* receiver (example) H25 you can get an adapter at this time but with the addition of the HR34 and RUV Tv's the need for the additional expense is driving the market change.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

Thank you for the advice. If I change the resolution will recorded shows then be recorded at that resolution, so when I do watch in living room they won't be hd? 

Will check out the new distribution info, that sounds like what I need. 

So frustrated yesterday with dtv not knowing what I needed or was talking about.

Just remembered this forum - I beta tested the first dtv hd recorder and had to use this frequently.

Thanks


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

I have the same issue. I have an RF modulator for the upstairs TV. Worked perfectly until the change.

Now, I have to hold down INFO to put the entire receiver in SD. That sucks, because before someone could be watching a show in HD in the living room and I could watch it in SD upstairs. Now, I have to shift the entire DVR into SD to get it to work.

And if someone leaves it in a menu, I get a black screen.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

In a bit of defense of the CSRs, this isn't a normal setup that they deal with that often. 

When it comes to the more unusual or advanced setups, this site is a much bigger help.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

Not sure that will solve my problem after looking. My main tv is hooked to the receiver directly and displays hd. All the other tvs are distributed by coax through an empty analog channel. They are all hd tv, so I still want the wide screen pic to come through. Easiest thing for me would be just to be able to make the message disappear.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Marwood said:


> Thank you for the advice. If I change the resolution will recorded shows then be recorded at that resolution, so when I do watch in living room they won't be hd?


This change is only for the output resolution and does nothing for the recordings.
I'll need to toggle as you move from an SD to HD TV.


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## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

Marwood said:


> Thank you for the advice. If I change the resolution will recorded shows then be recorded at that resolution, so when I do watch in living room they won't be hd?
> 
> Will check out the new distribution info, that sounds like what I need.
> 
> ...


To answer your question about recording:

The change in resolution to 480 only affects output. Recordings still record at the solution that is transmitted.

Edit: Too slow, VOS beat me to the answer.


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## jodyguercio (Aug 16, 2007)

Marwood said:


> Not sure that will solve my problem after looking. My main tv is hooked to the receiver directly and displays hd. All the other tvs are distributed by coax through an empty analog channel. *They are all hd tv, so I still want the wide screen pic to come through.* Easiest thing for me would be just to be able to make the message disappear.




Why not find a way to have everything in HD?


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

That would be great tell me how


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Marwood said:


> My main tv is hooked to the receiver directly and displays hd. All the other tvs are distributed by coax Easiest thing for me would be just to be able to make the message disappear.


I find my self in the same predicament! IMO this is a serious lack of functionality in this new GUI roll-out that existed before in the "old" software/ firmware. So now we can't view programming in HD on an HD TV in one room while watching it simultaneously on an SD TV in another room? This is UNACCEPTABLE and because of this (in my situation at least) I consider the new GUI broken and not worth it. Hopefully if enough people complain about this D* will fix this in a future update.



jodyguercio said:


> Why not find a way to have everything in HD?


Like what?! Tear out the drywall and rewire the house with HDMI cable? Our house was wired back in the day when it was built with a coax distribution system. Obsolete by today's standards I realize but it functions well for our needs, as we don't need HD in the kitchen or in the guest bedrooms. Perhaps it's time to look into a wireless HDMI system? Can anyone offer some suggestions here?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> Can anyone offer some suggestions here?


*Component (YpbPr) to Composite Converter *
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...d=1011407&p_id=7114&seq=1&format=1#largeimage


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## jodyguercio (Aug 16, 2007)

Marwood said:


> That would be great tell me how





Continental Divide said:


> Like what?! Tear out the drywall and rewire the house with HDMI cable? Our house was wired back in the day when it was built with a coax distribution system. Obsolete by today's standards I realize but it functions well for our needs, as we don't need HD in the kitchen or in the guest bedrooms. Perhaps it's time to look into a wireless HDMI system? Can anyone offer some suggestions here?


As CD points out, wireless HDMI. Not a cheap solution and nothing I have found searching is good for a very long range. Could you possibly run or have run CAT5 to the other locations? You could then buy from amazon some HDMI to CAT5 baluns and HD will be achieved.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0..._m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1F3VJFQVX9KVTCCZNDG9


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

jodyguercio said:


> Could you possibly run or have run CAT5 to the other locations?


Well that's the problem. Fishing the CAT5 would not be feasible considering the layout of the house. Wireless would be the way to go if there was a reliable system available.



veryoldschool said:


> *Component (YpbPr) to Composite Converter *


How does this help? Converting YpbPr to HDMI output is great, just how to get it to the other rooms is the problem! Or are you thinking of sending the HDMI from the converter to the HD TV? The HD TV gets it's HD signal via HDMI from my Yamaha receiver, sure don't want to change that!


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> How does this help? Converting YpbPr to HDMI output is great, just how to get it to the other rooms is the problem! Or are you thinking of sending the HDMI from the converter to the HD TV? The HD TV gets it's HD signal via HDMI from my Yamaha receiver, sure don't want to change that!


It doesn't change component to HDMI, but changes* component to composite/SVideo* so it would be used to replace the SD outputs of the receiver you're using now.
HDMI to your main HD TV, and component to your distribution system.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

You go from the component out on the DVR into that converter, then from the converter you get a composite signal that should go to your other TVs.


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## racermd (Dec 18, 2006)

Another not-so-cheap but possibly a bit more future- and past-proof (since the OP says he already has coax runs to his other TVs) is an ATSC RF modulator, like this one shown at Solid Signal. Basically, if the other TVs in the house have ATSC tuners in them (if they're less than a few years old and can get local HD OTA, they'll be ATSC), something like this will let you use your existing coax runs AND give you actual HD on your other TVs.

If running new cables isn't off the table, the HDMI or Component over Cat5 option is likely a better choice but is, again, an expensive option. However, the baluns to be connected at each end can be replaced over time to support a different type of signal as your needs change. Just remember to run twice as much cable as you think you might need of the best kind money can buy (hint: it's not always the most expensive) and run an additional pull-string should you need to run even more cables than that later.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

915 dollars are you kidding? All I need is for dtv to remove the darn message!!


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

$915 !


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

veryoldschool said:


> *Component (YpbPr) to Composite Converter *
> http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...d=1011407&p_id=7114&seq=1&format=1#largeimage





Marwood said:


> $915 !


I suggest you try the component to composite converter, nowhere near that much money.

Use the link above and it's product # 7114


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Scott Kocourek said:


> I suggest you try the component to composite converter, nowhere near that much money.
> 
> Use the link above and it's product # 7114


Since the link doesn't take you to the right item:


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)




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## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

Continental Divide said:


> So now we can't view programming in HD on an HD TV in one room while watching it simultaneously on an SD TV in another room? This is UNACCEPTABLE and because of this (in my situation at least) I consider the new GUI broken and not worth it. Hopefully if enough people complain about this D* will fix this in a future update.


I don't believe D* can fix it. My theory is that the reason the new HD GUI is a little faster, even though it's responsible for generating more pixels, is that D* is now using a previously unused function in the chipset inside the box. But that function has limitations, and this is one of them.

D* never advertised using more that one output at once. You were using the box in a unsupported configuration. There appear to be workarounds available with the new GUI, and D* even included one via holding down the exit key. Since a small percentage of people use the box like this, it's probably far down on D*'s list of things to fix (if they can fix it at all). If D* took the time to implement the exit button workaround instead of fixing the problem, that's not a good sign.

Dish *DOES* actively promote this configuration. You can always switch to them if it's a critical feature for you.

FYI, I also use the box in an unsupported configuration. I have a USB cable changing channels for my Tivo on one of the boxes. If that's taken away, I'll just have to find my Tivo IR emitters and use those instead.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Thanks veryoldschool, a picture is worth a thousand words.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I believe it was a matter of the needs of the many outweighing the needs of the few. Rendering the UI in multiple resolutions would have slowed things down and would only have benefited that small percentage who run more than one TV from a receiver. This was not a problem with the old UI since it was always rendered in 480p and then scaled as necessary.


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## paulnj (Feb 23, 2008)

Very Old Schol is 100% on the money here. Bought this yesterday and had it shipped overnight. New GUI download last night, installed convertor after UOS delivery this morning, everything back to normal.

Easy fix, HD/SD work seemlessly.


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> It doesn't change component to HDMI, but changes* component to composite/SVideo* so it would be used to replace the SD outputs of the receiver you're using now.
> HDMI to your main HD TV, and component to your distribution system.


My bad! 

I had this mixed up with the "Component (YPbPr) & S/PDIF Digital Coax/Optical Toslink Audio to HDMI Converter" which is all I saw on Monoprice's home page (where the posted link took me). Unfortunately these URL links to Monoprice's web site don't take you to the specific product.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> My bad!
> 
> Unfortunately these URL links to Monoprice's web site don't take you to the specific product.


It was "my bad" too. I had the link work here as I posted it, but it was still cached here so it worked.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

I really don't understand how any of these things will fix my situation. My tvs are using coaxial which is installed through the walls. Even if I go out to distribution through anything else it still is going to end up going through the coax to the tvs.

My remotes will work to ff and rw, and message disappears after a while. But cannot see playlist or other things. 

I am going to call DISH out after the holidays, but I also have DTV upper level person getting in touch with me.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Marwood said:


> I really don't understand how any of these things will fix my situation. My tvs are using coaxial which is installed through the walls. Even if I go out to distribution through anything else it still is going to end up going through the coax to the tvs.
> 
> My remotes will work to ff and rw, and message disappears after a while. But cannot see playlist or other things.
> 
> I am going to call DISH out after the holidays, but I also have DTV upper level person getting in touch with me.


First: How are you currently sending the signal through coax?
If you're connecting a modulator to the SD outputs of the receiver, then "simply" use this converter posted and connect it from the HD analog [component] output and then use the SD output to your modulator.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

So are you using composite (red, white, yellow) to an rf modulator?

The Monoprice solution would be this converter off the Component to the the rf modulator. You can still do it. What are you using for the RF modulator?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Stuart Sweet said:


> I believe it was a matter of the needs of the many outweighing the needs of the few.


While that's certainly true, considering D*'s subscriber base numbers in the millions, there has to be several thousand of us in the "few" category experiencing this problem, not that D* gives a damn!


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> While that's certainly true, considering D*'s subscriber base numbers in the millions, there has to be several thousand of us in the "few" category experiencing this problem, not that D* gives a damn!


So 0.1% or less?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Marwood said:


> I am going to call DISH out after the holidays, but I also have DTV upper level person getting in touch with me.


Marwood, please share with us your conversation with the "upper level person" you speak with!


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> So 0.1% or less?


Guess we'll never really know...


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Scott Kocourek said:


> So are you using composite (red, white, yellow) to an rf modulator?


This is my situation, using a Radio Shack RF modulator. Unfortunately the Radio Shack unit doesn't have an S-Video input, so if I go with the Monoprice down converter I will also need to find an RF converter that will accept an S-Video cable. PITA but doable...


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> This is my situation, using a Radio Shack RF modulator. Unfortunately the Radio Shack unit doesn't have an S-Video input, so if I go with the Monoprice down converter I will also need to find an RF converter that will accept an S-Video cable. PITA but doable...



So the yellow composite output is there for what reason?


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## Ruffread (Nov 4, 2004)

For one remote 19" HD 720P TV, I am using an RF Link transmitter plugged into the HR20-700 composite out. At the remote TV end, some 25 ft away in another room, I receive the signal and feed TV the composite video and audio. Picture OK, but have a composite to HDMI converter coming so I can feed TV with 720P up-conversion. The "Not in HD" window always goes away after 30 seconds, and picture is widescreen and very good. If I had more than one remote, I could use other receivers for each.


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

Ruffread said:


> For one remote 19" HD 720P TV, I am using an RF Link transmitter plugged into the HR20-700 composite out. At the remote TV end, some 25 ft away in another room, I receive the signal and feed TV the composite video and audio. Picture OK, but have a composite to HDMI converter coming so I can feed TV with 720P up-conversion. The "Not in HD" window always goes away after 30 seconds, and picture is widescreen and very good. If I had more than one remote, I could use other receivers for each.


Have you thought of getting a 1x2 HDMI Matrix switch? Takes one input and has 2 HDMI outputs. You can either run a 25ft HDMI cable to your 19" or try HDMI over Ethernet (Cat6 in your case).


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

The yellow is your video out and you can use the Red, White from the receiver for audio.

Yellow from converter out to rf modulator and red, white from receiver to rf modulator.

Yeah it's a bummer but it works and not that expensive.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

"veryoldschool" said:


> So the yellow composite output is there for what reason?


Will keep you informed. No time now to check everything out. But I am sure there are thousands of cust in the same boat. Anyone who built a home in the 90's has this type of install. Mine was actually done by a dtv independent tech.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Marwood said:


> Will keep you informed. No time now to check everything out. But I am sure there are thousands of cust in the same boat. Anyone who built a home in the 90's has this type of install. Mine was actually done by a dtv independent tech.


What does the Nineties have to do with running more than one tv off of one receiver?

Trust me, you are a part of a small group. That's why were here to help.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

"Marwood" said:


> Will keep you informed. No time now to check everything out. But I am sure there are thousands of cust in the same boat. Anyone who built a home in the 90's has this type of install. Mine was actually done by a dtv independent tech.


Just for clarification. My feed still works to all tvs. My problem is not being able to control features with remote (except ff and rw) because the message blocks the view. Yes it disappears but comes back with every press of a button


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## Ruffread (Nov 4, 2004)

F1 Fan: I investigated converters, and an HDMI converter would cause the lowest denominator signal, ie 720P to be the outputs. I have a a 1080P Plasma, and don't want signal downgraded to 720. 
An HDMI switch would work, but for only one TV at a time.


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> So the yellow composite output is there for what reason?





Scott Kocourek said:


> The yellow is your video out and you can use the Red, White from the receiver for audio. Yellow from converter out to rf modulator and red, white from receiver to rf modulator.


Yes, I realized that right after posting. My bad again!


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

Ruffread said:


> F1 Fan: I investigated converters, and an HDMI converter would cause the lowest denominator signal, ie 720P to be the outputs. I have a a 1080P Plasma, and don't want signal downgraded to 720.
> An HDMI switch would work, but for only one TV at a time.


Not an HDMI switch. And HDMI Matrix. Big difference. they are stated in the form AxB where A is inputs and B is outputs.

For example I am looking at a 4x4 and a 4x8 Matrix. These are independently controlled. So I can have 1 input to one output, another input to 2 outputs and then a 3rd input the a 4th output. And with a couple of presses on the remote I can have 1 input to all outputs.

The 1x2 gives you 1input from your receiver to 2 outputs. This is different to what you described.

I will look for a link for you.

Edit: The 1x2 is called a splitter, the others are called a Matrix. Here is a quick link on Amazon. http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&key...s 1x2 Splitter Switch Splitter Box&page=1


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

Do you watch the main tv in hd at the same time you watch one of the other tvs you have being feed by your distribution system?


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## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

Marwood said:


> Just for clarification. My feed still works to all tvs. My problem is not being able to control features with remote (except ff and rw) because the message blocks the view. Yes it disappears but comes back with every press of a button


Correct. This message does NOT appear on any of the HD outputs. It appears on ALL of the SD outputs if the receiver is using 720p/1080i/1080p resolution. Since the receiver has TWO HD outputs, connect the HDMI output to the HDTV and use the other HD output (component) to feed all the other SD connections.

Stop using the SD outputs on the DirecTV receiver. Use the component to composite/S-video converter mentioned in this thread to convert the receiver's HD component output signal to SD. You will end up with exactly the same SD output you had before. But the annoying message will be gone and you'll even be able to use the menus again.


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## bflora (Nov 6, 2007)

I'm in a similar situation in feeding several tv's via modulated rf and the main hdtv via component since the hdmi on my hr20-700 died. I haven't seen any of the component to composite converters that have loop thru for the component which would be what I need. Anyone have any ideas (solutions)?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

inkahauts said:


> Do you watch the main tv in hd at the same time you watch one of the other tvs you have being feed by your distribution system?


Yes, that's the problem. I'll often times be watching the HD TV in the living room while my better half will be watching the SD TV while she's cooking dinner in the kitchen.


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## F1 Fan (Aug 28, 2007)

bflora said:


> I'm in a similar situation in feeding several tv's via modulated rf and the main hdtv via component since the hdmi on my hr20-700 died. I haven't seen any of the component to composite converters that have loop thru for the component which would be what I need. Anyone have any ideas (solutions)?


http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10422&cs_id=1042205&p_id=2848&seq=1&format=2

Sorry the link isnt working. Put in product id 2848 ($3 each)


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

bflora said:


> I'm in a similar situation in feeding several tv's via modulated rf and the main hdtv via component since the hdmi on my hr20-700 died. I haven't seen any of the component to composite converters that have loop thru for the component which would be what I need. Anyone have any ideas (solutions)?


Maybe a Component Splitter Box?


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Continental Divide" said:


> Yes, that's the problem. I'll often times be watching the HD TV in the living room while my better half will be watching the SD TV while she's cooking dinner in the kitchen.


Then I still don't see this as a problem that can't be easily overcome. You control it in the room with the HDTV, so she won't need to worry about seeing the on screen controls, or press and hold exit, switch the resolution, or get the adapter for the component output. There are several ways around this issue.


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

bobcamp1 said:


> D* never advertised using more that one output at once. You were using the box in a unsupported configuration. There appear to be workarounds available with the new GUI, and D* even included one via holding down the exit key. Since a small percentage of people use the box like this, it's probably far down on D*'s list of things to fix (if they can fix it at all). If D* took the time to implement the exit button workaround instead of fixing the problem, that's not a good sign.
> 
> Dish *DOES* actively promote this configuration. You can always switch to them if it's a critical feature for you.


While your post is accurate, this isn't some 'crazy' setup I dreamed up. My DirecTV installer charged me $40 extra and provided an RF Modulator and a UHF remote and installed it for me.

It was his idea, not mine....



Marwood said:


> I really don't understand how any of these things will fix my situation. My tvs are using coaxial which is installed through the walls. Even if I go out to distribution through anything else it still is going to end up going through the coax to the tvs.


Your HD receiver doesn't have a coax output, so you have something (rf modulator) converting Svideo or Composite to coax. This box goes in between them and resolved your issue.



bobcamp1 said:


> Correct. This message does NOT appear on any of the HD outputs. It appears on ALL of the SD outputs if the receiver is using 720p/1080i/1080p resolution. Since the receiver has TWO HD outputs, connect the HDMI output to the HDTV and use the other HD output (component) to feed all the other SD connections.


It ONLY appears on live tv. If someone leaves it in the guide, a menu, the screen saver you get a black screen.



inkahauts said:


> Then I still don't see this as a problem that can't be easily overcome. You control it in the room with the HDTV, so she won't need to worry about seeing the on screen controls, or press and hold exit, switch the resolution, or get the adapter for the component output. There are several ways around this issue.


Only if you don't mind changing the main HDTV to SD. The BIG problem is that you can't watch HD in one room and SD in the other room at the same time.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"adam1115" said:


> Only if you don't mind changing the main HDTV to SD. The BIG problem is that you can't watch HD in one room and SD in the other room at the same time.


In which case the component to composite output is something to consider if you use that configuration often,which again solves this issue completely, and basically allows the system to work like it did before.


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## Vin (Mar 29, 2004)

adam1115 said:


> Only if you don't mind changing the main HDTV to SD. The BIG problem is that you can't watch HD in one room and SD in the other room at the same time.


Only graphics can't be displayed on the SD set while the DVR is set to output an HD signal so after the message on the SD TV times out, video will display without issue while the DVR is still outputting in HD.


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## DarkLogix (Oct 21, 2011)

veryoldschool said:


> So the yellow composite output is there for what reason?


to be a lower quality (slightly) than s-video


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

One more thing. In my situation I have apx 35 ft feed under house and through walls from rec to main tv. I had so many prob with hdmi at that length I switched to component. Guess I need to look into a hdmi converter to my dist system?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

inkahauts said:


> Then I still don't see this as a problem that can't be easily overcome. You control it in the room with the HDTV, so she won't need to worry about seeing the on screen controls, or press and hold exit, switch the resolution, or get the adapter for the component output. There are several ways around this issue.





Vin said:


> Only graphics can't be displayed on the SD set while the DVR is set to output an HD signal so after the message on the SD TV times out, video will display without issue while the DVR is still outputting in HD.


All true! In my case I want the ability to change channels/ access the guide etc. from the other SD TV's without putting the receiver in SD mode, so the down converter is seemingly the only "no brainer" solution. Many thanks to all for providing that solution. :goodjob:

Now all I have to do is pull my two ton solid oak entertainment system out from the wall to access the back of the receiver!


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## DarkLogix (Oct 21, 2011)

Marwood said:


> One more thing. In my situation I have apx 35 ft feed under house and through walls from rec to main tv. I had so many prob with hdmi at that length I switched to component. Guess I need to look into a hdmi converter to my dist system?


um why?

use the many times linked component to composite converter and you'll be good

I'm starting to wonder as its been mentioned and linked many times why its seems to be ignored, also when with the viglink thing stop breaking the links


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> So the yellow composite output is there for what reason?





DarkLogix said:


> to be a lower quality (slightly) than s-video


I believe VOS was being sarcastic because I didn't notice the composite video output on the converter! 

Regardless of whether the signal source to the RF Modulator is composite or S-Video once the signal is converted to RF and distributed via coax the quality is going to be about the same (not great!).


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## racermd (Dec 18, 2006)

Marwood said:


> 915 dollars are you kidding? All I need is for dtv to remove the darn message!!


I did say it was rather expensive. There are likely less expensive units out there, too. It just happened to be the first one I found to show as an example. Additionally, those units will likely get less expensive over time like everything else.

Besides, like I said before, going to an ATSC modulator offers two distinct benefits. First, it upgrades your video network to a true HD signal on those 6 HDTVs in your home (as you noted in one of your earlier posts). Second, you can use your existing cabling infrastructure in doing so with no additional cost to re-wire anything.

It appears that cost is more of a factor here that I first anticipated (what was I thinking... 6 HDTVs?). If that's true, then the component-to-composite adapter is likely your better option for now.


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## Church AV Guy (Jul 9, 2007)

Marwood said:


> Not sure that will solve my problem after looking. My main tv is hooked to the receiver directly and displays hd. All the other tvs are distributed by coax through an empty analog channel. They are all hd tv, so I still want the wide screen pic to come through. *Easiest thing for me would be just to be able to make the message disappear.*





Continental Divide said:


> *I find my self in the same predicament!* IMO this is a serious lack of functionality in this new GUI roll-out that existed before in the "old" software/ firmware. So now we can't view programming in HD on an HD TV in one room while watching it simultaneously on an SD TV in another room? *This is UNACCEPTABLE and because of this (in my situation at least) I consider the new GUI broken and not worth it. Hopefully if enough people complain about this D* will fix this in a future update.*
> .
> .
> .


I too am in a similar situation. I am currently using all of the outputs on my RH21 boxes. To abandon all three of the SD outputs using the suggested converters/adapters, I would need to split either the HDMI or component outputs, run one of them into a HDMI or component to video or S-Video converter, then run the output of that into a three way splitter, all to get the same functionality I had using just the HR21 before the new HD GUI. With the signals going through so many little boxes, I fear there would be a serious degredation of quality.

Since I am fully aware of the "situation" I would be plenty happy if they just allowed me to do away with the warning screen. I would be satisfied if it disappeared in one or two seconds, instead of the 20+ seconds it takes now. Like I said, I know what's happeneing so if I press abutton and the graphics don't show up but the picture is still there, that would work for me. I really don't think this is an unreasonable request. I'm showing some flexability here.


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## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

adam1115 said:


> While your post is accurate, this isn't some 'crazy' setup I dreamed up. My DirecTV installer charged me $40 extra and provided an RF Modulator and a UHF remote and installed it for me.
> 
> It was his idea, not mine....


Understood. The installer did something slightly outside the lines, which they often do to make people happy. Mine provided the RF modulator to my old TV free of charge during the "switch from 72.5 locals" upgrade. I'm not using it. Actually, I could plug that into the coaxial cable jack near the TV and see if the signal will get distributed throughout the house. At least until my area gets the HD GUI upgrade. 

You can try to call D* and ask them for a $40 credit (or something like it) to cover the cost of the converter box. Explain the situation. Tell them the DirecTV installer helped you solve your problem but the HD GUI update broke it.

Even if it was a DIY project, you can call D* and ask for credits or something like that. The worst thing they can do is say "no."


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## Ruffread (Nov 4, 2004)

F1: I already had the RF Link Transmitters working. I don't particularly want to run another cable up and over and down into the den, about 45-50 feet. The costs are still coming down for powered splitter/converters as well as the new RF Link WHD-5001, an HD transmitter and receiver. 
Thanks for your tip.


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## drded (Aug 23, 2006)

I hate to sound sarcastic, but wouldn't it be nice if the development and decision teams actually listened to what us folks are asking for instead of continually defending what is?

A toggle for the message would be nice. Give us the option of displaying it. Also, figure out how to make the GUI display on the video output regardless of the picture resolution.

Think of the hundreds of people that have the same problem and we just don't hear about it. Or what kind of impression is DirecTV making when someone visits your home and sees that warning message on the screen for what seems an eternity. I don't think new customers will be gained. 

Dave


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

Thank you drded. I agree 100%. When I called yesterday they basically told me to bug off. I have been a customer since 1995 - beta tested their first dvr - my bill is well over 100 a month and they treated me like crap. I know this effects LOTS of customers, most people do not have a separate receiver for every tv.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Actually most people, in fact the overwhelming majority of people, do have a separate receiver for every TV. That's what I'm told. While I'm sympathetic to your situation, you should understand that you are in a relatively small minority.


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## DarkLogix (Oct 21, 2011)

Marwood said:


> Thank you drded. I agree 100%. When I called yesterday they basically told me to bug off. I have been a customer since 1995 - beta tested their first dvr - my bill is well over 100 a month and they treated me like crap. I know this effects LOTS of customers, most people do not have a separate receiver for every tv.


I'm fairly sure most do as thats the supported/correct setup
installers may do unsupported setups and its not D*'s fault if you get one of those they may at any time cause any and all unsupported setups to not work as they're unsupported and thus all that are designing new D* software and tech will assume the unsupported setups don't exist because they aren't ment to exist


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

Wow I must have a very special group of acquaintances - not one person I know with DTV has a receiver for every tv - most have just one receiver.


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Marwood said:


> ...When I called yesterday they basically told me to bug off. I have been a customer since 1995 - beta tested their first dvr - my bill is well over 100 a month and they treated me like crap. I know this effects LOTS of customers, most people do not have a separate receiver for every tv.


X2! Signed up with D* in '94, my first remote had the USSB logo on it. D* could care less about customer loyalty. Case in point D* is currently offering their latest greatest receiver to new customers while the rest of us have to wait.



Stuart Sweet said:


> ...While I'm sympathetic to your situation, you should understand that you are in a relatively small minority.





veryoldschool said:


> So 0.1% or less?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Marwood said:


> Wow I must have a very special group of acquaintances - not one person I know with DTV has a receiver for every tv - most have just one receiver.


Not to mention why inflate an already too expensive monthly D* bill by paying the extra lease charge for each additional receiver, when one can run multiple TV's from one receiver?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> Not to mention why inflate an already too expensive monthly D* bill by paying the extra lease charge for each additional receiver, when one can run multiple TV's from one receiver?


A reason I do is for HD on all of mine.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

I can get hd on all my tvs through the antenna for live tv - but 99% of what I watch is recorded - and the dvr is what runs through the distribution system


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Continental Divide said:


> X2! Signed up with D* in '94, my first remote had the USSB logo on it. D* could care less about customer loyalty. Case in point D* is currently offering their latest greatest receiver to new customers while the rest of us have to wait.


What receiver can't you get? There are all sorts of posts here of people that wanted one of the new receivers and ordered them. To be honest if you wanted one of the HR34's bad enough you probably could have one by now, I know a number of existing customers that have ordered them online and have them up and running.

Just because you cannot get one directly from DIRECTV doesn't mean you can't get one, and just because you say it doesn't make it true.


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Continental Divide said:


> Not to mention why inflate an already too expensive monthly D* bill by paying the extra lease charge for each additional receiver, when one can run multiple TV's from one receiver?


Each DVR gives you 2 independent tuners, so with a DVR at each TV or at least two DVRs, you get 4 tuners...which eliminates a lot of conflicts that you can run into with just 2 tuners (one dvr).

In our situation, we have 3 HD DVRs and 1 HD receiver, and I do split one DVRs output to a 26" HDTV in the basement. I use an HDMI splitter (powered) from monoprice and a 30' HDMI cable (also from monoprice.com)

This combo is far superior to a 30' long component cable.


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Scott Kocourek said:


> What receiver can't you get? There are all sorts of posts here of people that wanted one of the new receivers and ordered them. To be honest if you wanted one of the HR34's bad enough you probably could have one by now, I know a number of existing customers that have ordered them online and have them up and running.
> 
> Just because you cannot get one directly from DIRECTV doesn't mean you can't get one, and just because you say it doesn't make it true.


Scott, check my post count. Although I signed up with DBStalk a while ago, I came here for the first time today because of this problem.

So please excuse my ignorance. How about a link to where I can get the new receiver?


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

One place for sure is solidsignal.com

There is another place people have been talking about around here, I think it Value.... something or other. I think the owner of the place has been here letting people know he had them. I will look for a few and PM you the links, I see no reason to advertise for them.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

Bought two hdmi 30 foot cables from monoprice, trouble with both. Two years and counting and the component is just fine. although the best hd is over the air


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Marwood said:


> although the best hd is over the air


Not if your locals cram 3 SD subchannels along with their HD signal. I find the BEST HD signal is from the C band broadcasts, NASA HD, and PBS HD. Directv is a close second on their 1080i specialty channels like HDNet, Smithsonian, etc.

Isnt 30' a little long for HDMI? I dont really know the limit, never checked.


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

My locals are excellent - we watch ota whenever we can. I actually think my cables were longer than 30, but at the time (two years or so ago) I was told my problems were due to the length - possibly they are better now. But I have no desire to go back under the house unless I have to lol


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## xmguy (Mar 27, 2008)

I too have a multi TV setup in one room. A 32" HDTV and a 13" SDTV. SD TV I use by my bed then the HD is by my computer. Use a RF Modulator. I dont like the HD on SD lockout either. _ BUT _ it was worse in the CEs for the HD UI. I had to either go deep in the menus before going from HD to SD or press the info button, press the up button, then right about 4 times to get the Format option to change and watch the receiver for the SD 480p led to appear. All without seeing anything on the SD TV screen. * THEN* dive into the setup menu and disable all the HD resolutions. Then lastly set the format to letterbox. A TOTAL PITA! I do wish it was like it used to be before the HD UI. But I'd rather press the Exit key and get SD then letterbox vs the other.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Marwood" said:


> Bought two hdmi 30 foot cables from monoprice, trouble with both. Two years and counting and the component is just fine. although the best hd is over the air


Interesting. I picked up a 100 ft hdmi cable from them a few years back for a special purpose, and it worked great. What issues did you have, and did you run it through a splitter or switch of some sort as well?


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## Marwood (Nov 18, 2006)

"inkahauts" said:


> Interesting. I picked up a 100 ft hdmi cable from them a few years back for a special purpose, and it worked great. What issues did you have, and did you run it through a splitter or switch of some sort as well?


You know I really don't remember to be honest.


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## su_A_ve (Sep 27, 2007)

Years ago when E* HDDVR had the option to watch a different program on a 2nd set (SD), the only option to replicate it under D* was using an RF modulator.

In fact, that was the only option before MRV.

Now spend $50 on the component to composite, or $6 a month for a new receiver. Or run HDMI or couple of cat6 lines and baluns.

Whatever it is, it will cost us... I ordered a box from monoprice and set a thank you to D*


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

su_A_ve said:


> Years ago when E* HDDVR had the option to watch a different program on a 2nd set (SD), the only option to replicate it under D* was using an RF modulator.
> 
> In fact, that was the only option before MRV.
> 
> ...


I bet if you were really that pissed and you called retention, they'd probably give you a free H24 and even credit you $6/mo for 24 months.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

adam1115 said:


> I bet if you were really that pissed and you called retention, they'd probably give you a free H24 and even credit you $6/mo for 24 months.


A "free" receiver will still cost you $6/Month with a 2 year agreement. The other solution is a one time fee. I don't think you need retentions to tell you that.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

su_A_ve said:


> Years ago when E* HDDVR had the option to watch a different program on a 2nd set (SD), the only option to replicate it under D* was using an RF modulator.
> 
> In fact, that was the only option before MRV.
> 
> ...


MRV doesn't allow you to watch a second show without a receiver either.

People have this setup because they don't want to spend the extra money per month. The $40 cost of the modulator is nothing compared to what you haven't paid. In fact take how long you've had your setup and multiple by 6 for 1 year and 5 for the remaining then see how much the costs are comparatively.

I can understand not wanting to spend money for whatever reason but the fact of the matter is these installations are not supported so when they change something they're not going to think about or care about them. Modernize your setup or accept that you're intentionally keeping an unsupported setup and that it's on you to fix it when there are issues.

If you had this setup installed from 94-98 I can understand why you think it's how it should be because it was. Technology changes and the setups change. I'm betting that anyone who's been around that long has been offered upgrades or is eligible for one.


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Continental Divide said:


> I find my self in the same predicament! IMO this is a serious lack of functionality in this new GUI roll-out that existed before in the "old" software/ firmware. So now we can't view programming in HD on an HD TV in one room while watching it simultaneously on an SD TV in another room? This is UNACCEPTABLE and because of this (in my situation at least) I consider the new GUI broken and not worth it. Hopefully if enough people complain about this D* will fix this in a future update.





jodyguercio said:


> Why not find a way to have everything in HD?





Continental Divide said:


> Like what?! Tear out the drywall and rewire the house with HDMI cable? Our house was wired back in the day when it was built with a coax distribution system. Obsolete by today's standards I realize but it functions well for our needs, as we don't need HD in the kitchen or in the guest bedrooms. Perhaps it's time to look into a wireless HDMI system? Can anyone offer some suggestions here?


It occurred to me it might be helpful to others who may have found themselves in this same quandary to revive this thread. After suffering for a 1/2 year from D*'s firmware "upgrade", which because of our unique situation (i.e. whole house coax distribution), rendered our viewing experience unbearable due to having to constantly deal with the "Your cables or TV are SD etc. etc." 20 second long full screen message and having to constantly change resolutions to accommodate our situation (holding the "Exit" button on the remote rarely worked). Also the component to composite converter was never an option in our situation either as the component outputs on the receiver were already in use. So we were never able to view programming in HD on our Panny Plasma TV in the living room while watching it simultaneously on our SD TV's in the other rooms.

So recently the solution arrived on the horizon: DISH's new Hopper-Joey System. We had been a D* subscriber continuously for 18 years (since 1994), but because of our situation it was finally time to say goodbye and adopt this new cutting edge technology. So now we enjoy HD in all the other rooms of our home (yes, we bought all new TV's ), and the Hopper is _fast_ and responds immediately to the remote, unlike D*'s sluggish receiver. The extra advantages of the Hopper-Joey system (like automatic skipping over commercials in Prime Time programming!) are too numerous to mention here. I urge you to do your own research.

So, if you are like us and have a home with a coax distribution system and find yourself frustrated I urge you to consider the Hopper-Joey system. You wont be sorry!


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Continental Divide" said:


> It occurred to me it might be helpful to others who may have found themselves in this same quandary to revive this thread. After suffering for a 1/2 year from D*'s firmware "upgrade", which because of our unique situation (i.e. whole house coax distribution), rendered our viewing experience unbearable due to having to constantly deal with the "Your cables or TV are SD etc. etc." 20 second long full screen message and having to constantly change resolutions to accommodate our situation (holding the "Exit" button on the remote rarely worked). Also the component to composite converter was never an option in our situation either as the component outputs on the receiver were already in use. So we were never able to view programming in HD on our Panny Plasma TV in the living room while watching it simultaneously on our SD TV's in the other rooms.
> 
> So recently the solution arrived on the horizon: DISH's new Hopper-Joey System. We had been a D* subscriber continuously for 18 years (since 1994), but because of our situation it was finally time to say goodbye and adopt this new cutting edge technology. So now we enjoy HD in all the other rooms of our home (yes, we bought all new TV's ), and the Hopper is fast and responds immediately to the remote, unlike D*'s sluggish receiver. The extra advantages of the Hopper-Joey system (like automatic skipping over commercials in Prime Time programming!) are too numerous to mention here. I urge you to do your own research.
> 
> So, if you are like us and have a home with a coax distribution system and find yourself frustrated I urge you to consider the Hopper-Joey system. You wont be sorry!


So your saying there is a coax output that is live all the time on dishes hopper? Good for you. I take this to also mean you still do not have boxes at every tv in the house correct?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

inkahauts said:


> So your saying there is a coax output that is live all the time on dishes hopper? Good for you. I take this to also mean you still do not have boxes at every tv in the house correct?


Yes to the first question, and yes, there are no boxes at every TV (there's a "Joey" receiver at every TV, very small, about 6"x5", fits behind the TV, not even visible). And with 3 tuners in the Hopper every TV can serve up a different show simultaneously.

Here's a Joey:


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Continental Divide" said:


> Yes to the first question, and yes, there are no boxes at every TV (there's a "Joey" receiver at every TV, very small, about 6"x5", fits behind the TV, not even visible). And with 3 tuners in the Hopper every TV can serve up a different show simultaneously.
> 
> Here's a Joey:


Well if you have a box at every tv you could have easily done the same with DIRECTV and had h25s which are small just like the joeys placed at all the remote tvs and been just fine. And they give you a little more flexibility too over what you have because their tuners don't take away from the DVRs like a Joey does.

In the end though, I am glad your happy, just realize you chose to use the same solution to your issue as DIRECTV offers, but with a different company.


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

inkahauts said:


> Well if you have a box at every tv you could have easily done the same with DIRECTV and had h25s which are small just like the joeys placed at all the remote tvs and been just fine.


Yes, except that would have required a different wiring scheme (new cable, holes drilled in the walls etc.) whereas the MoCA protocol makes use of the existing coax which was run within in the walls of my house when it was built for HD distribution. Absolutely no changes in my existing wiring was necessary (including the double run of RG6 from the dish to the Hopper). The entire install required nothing more than to swap out the Satellite dish, and replace the D* receiver with the Hopper, done deal. Placing the Joey's behind the TV's takes about 2 minutes.

Plus there's the benefit of the extra features the Hopper has (commercial skipping Auto Hop is amazing, no more FF or 6-8 presses of the 30 sec. skip to get through commercials) not to mention finally having a receiver that responds instantly to the commands from the remote! (1 RF remote included with the Hopper, and 1 remote included with each Joey). And as a new customer I'm saving $900 in the first year with DISH (free install and about $75 / month for the total programming package for the first year, compared to the $150 / month I was spending on D*.

I'm not being a DISH fanboy here, I'm just saying this was the logical solution for me, plus I've always been an early adopter of what's new, and after 18 years with D* it was time to try something new.

Here's a wiring diagram to show how simple the Hopper-Joey install is. Example is for a 3 room setup:


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

I hate to break it to you but that's how the DIRECTV receivers do MRV too, oh and you can have other receivers and not give all of your others just because you get the HR34.

Many have the HR34 and other HR receivers that all share programming with the regular HD receivers, not to mention the folks that have the Rvu Samsung tv's.

What additional wiring do you think is needed?


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Scott, your not telling me anything I don't already know. Why would I lease more receivers and pay D* even more $$$ on my monthly bill? Kitchen TV is located on a ceiling mount and there's no room for a receiver there anyway. The same is true for our bedrooms (all have ceiling mounts for the TV's, no place to locate a receiver under them). The Joeys take up no room at all and are neatly concealed behind the TV's.

BTW, did you know that the Hopper can record ALL primetime programming from all 4 networks (every show!) using one tuner and save them for 8 days? No need to set up Season Passes on any network primetime shows ever again, not to mention the ability to go back and watch a program that was on that you may have missed because you didn't know about it in the first place. And all this with the commercials automatically skipped without ever touching the remote. That alone is a beautiful thing! 

To each his own I guess...


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

But you talked about needing new wiring for the DirecTV system, that was our confusion. Is the Joey really that much smaller than an H25?

I can guarantee you Scott does know all the features of the Hopper. Personally, to do what I'd want, I'd need to use two Hoppers instead of one HR34. No solution is the right one for everyone.

Ok, the H25 is 2" wider, half an inch deeper, and .37" shorter. Has its own tuner, but of course cant trickplay live tv. I'm not sure it's fair to compare a 25 and Joey. A C30/C31 compared to Joey maybe.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Continental Divide said:


> Scott, your not telling me anything I don't already know. Why would I lease more receivers and pay D* even more $$$ on my monthly bill? Kitchen TV is located on a ceiling mount and there's no room for a receiver there anyway. The same is true for our bedrooms (all have ceiling mounts for the TV's, no place to locate a receiver under them). The Joeys take up no room at all and are neatly concealed behind the TV's.
> 
> BTW, did you know that the Hopper can record ALL primetime programming from all 4 networks (every show!) using one tuner and save them for 8 days? No need to set up Season Passes on any network primetime shows ever again, not to mention the ability to go back and watch a program that was on that you may have missed because you didn't know about it in the first place. And all this with the commercials automatically skipped without ever touching the remote. That alone is a beautiful thing!
> 
> To each his own I guess...


I've said it countless times, You have to get what you believe is best for you family and wallet. I have never gone to the Dish forums and tried to convince someone the DIRECTV stuff is better. 

Yes I do know how the Hopper/Joey works and by looking at the diagram that *you* provided I cannot see how DIRECTV wiring is somehow inferior because the HR series receivers (all of them) could be put into that equation and work essentially the same way. Oh yeah and I do know that you can record all that "stuff", I just record what I want to with the 11 available tuners that I currently have with my 1 HR34 and 3 HR2x receivers (that I was able to keep when I upgraded.)


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## Continental Divide (Mar 31, 2008)

Scott Kocourek said:


> ... I have never gone to the Dish forums and tried to convince someone the DIRECTV stuff is better.


And I didn't come here preaching that DISH stuff is better. I never said that. If that's what your inferring from my comments then there's not much else for me to say. DISH vs. D*? Just comparing Apples to Oranges if you ask me.



Scott Kocourek said:


> ... I cannot see how DIRECTV wiring is somehow *inferior* because the HR series receivers (all of them) could be put into that equation and work essentially the same way.


Show me where I said or even inferred that D*'s wiring is inferior. I never said that either. Granted I wasn't specific on that count, I was just thinking of the added equipment like the SWM, SWM power supply, Band Stop Filters, Deca Units & Deca power supplies etc. etc. and their associated wiring. I was just thinking that the wiring to tie all these components together was more complex compared to the simplicity of the Hopper setup. At any rate please don't read into my comments beyond what I've actually said. No reason to get overly defensive here.

My only reason for posting this was to bring awareness to others of another option for fixing the problems I and others posed earlier in this thread. That's all. I didn't expect this to devolve into a which is better, DISH vs. D* debate. Like I already said, I'm not a DISH fanboy! Perhaps I shouldn't have posted this at all considering the sarcasm and rancour in your response. C'est La Vie.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

DECAs are only needed for older equipment, they allow you to not have to get new hardware to upgrade to Whole Home. SWM is usually just a different LNB on the dish with a power inserter. Band stop filters are only needed in certain situations, and in only one very specific scenario with HD boxes.

It may not be true, but it always seems to me that Dish is still trying to increase sales of new equipment from Echostar. I know they are separate companies, but while only a few features are not possible on all DirecTV HD boxes with or without an addon (like 3D), it's much more common on Dish. But then their ones may be faster, either due to that or the nightly reboots.


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## CHDinCT (Dec 23, 2006)

Well, after reading through this whole thread, I'm not sure I should even pot this but will anyway. I just ran into this no SD second TV hooked up to an HD DRV issue. 

Here's my situation. We currently have an HR24 hooked up to our 50" plasma in the family room. In the summer, we set up an old 13" TV on our screened porch just adjacent to the FR and often have both on at the same time as we move about the main living area. I have been feeding the old 13" TV via composite out to an old VCR which then sends RF out over coax to our old cable TV wiring. This distributes the SD signal to the porch as well as living room and basement (where we would occasionally set up a TV as well, but nowhere near as often as in the porch). Set up the 13" TV this past weekend only to see the new screen message that my TV or cabling doesn't support HD resolution and to hold the exit button to downres the signal to SD. 

At least I see an explanation here as to why perhaps DTV is not able to supply the GUI data in SD (but can still downres the actual signal??). Not sure what solution I'll opt for as I don't know if spending $50 on a coverter to support a 25+ year old TV is good money. I'd definitely look into the Hopper if Dish actually provided the sports programming we need here, but they don't. Would love to get multi-room viewing but I refuse to pay the extra charge DTV wants for it and/or sign up for another two year commitment. My bill is just north of $100 for two boxes (one HD and one HD DVR) and no premium channels and that's my limit. 

I think for the three months we use the TV on the porch, I'd settle for being able to toggle the stupid message off and go with blindly running the remote. I don't see why they opted to show that message on virtually every button push for like 10-15 seconds. So in case DTV actually monitors these discussions, here's another aggravated customer.


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