# DTV Has No Control On Which Model Receiver Ships? Shenanigans!



## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

I was excited to buy the new HR24-700 to replace my R15. This would compliment my HR21-700 so I could begin using Whole Home for the first time! The CSR on the phone submitted my order and I was on my way... I thought.

Fast forward to today:
Fed-Ex drops my package off from U-HAUL VAN?! I open the box to find a beat-up refurbished HR21-100! The front USB access door is dangling off the front, and the back looked like it fell off a truck! There was even a nice silhouette where a sticker once lived.

I immediately called DTV and the CSR was shocked when I told her that I was "expecting" an HR24-700. She said that it's not possible to guarantee what model you get since everything ships from some warehouse where apparently they don't possess the technology to differentiate one receiver to another. Basically suggesting that I could have received anything from this model up to "possibly" the HR24, but it was luck-of-the-draw?! WHAAAT?!

I demanded to speak to Customer Retention and he confirmed everything the CSR had just said. Apparently, just because their website says "upgrade" showing you an HR24, you shouldn't expect an HR24. He did unofficially tell me that there's potentially a new DVR with TIVo (HR35) on the horizon. I asked him that "when I go to upgrade to the HR35, will I potentially end up with an HR24 instead?" He said, "no, because it's a completely different receiver technology."

Anyone else experience anything similar to this BS?


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

Pic links were broken? I attached them here.


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

There used to be a sticky post at the top of this forum about this. 

Yes, it's actually true. CSRs cannot guarantee a specific model. If you really want an HR24, you'll need to get one from a dealer like Solid Signal.


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

GovGeek said:


> I was excited to buy the new HR24-700 to replace my R15. This would compliment my HR21-700 so I could begin using Whole Home for the first time! The CSR on the phone submitted my order and I was on my way... I thought.
> 
> Fast forward to today:
> Fed-Ex drops my package off from U-HAUL VAN?! I open the box to find a beat-up refurbished HR21-100! The front USB access door is dangling off the front, and the back looked like it fell off a truck! There was even a nice silhouette where a sticker once lived.
> ...


litzdog911 is correct. The only way to guarantee getting a HR24 DVR is through a dealer like Solid Signal. Yes the picture on DirecTV's website shows a HR24 but there is fine print under the picture stating "Model HR24 pictured above. Your actual HD DVR may vary". Unfortunately cosmetics are not a high priorty with DirecTV's replacement receivers. Their attitude is if it plays, records, and performs it's other functions it's providing you service. However, sending a customer a receiver with a broken door panel is carrying a joke too far.


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## Joe C (Mar 3, 2005)

MysteryMan said:


> However, sending a customer a receiver with a broken door panel is carrying a joke too far.


And to further add insult to injury they put a reconditioned sticker on the back.!rolling


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## webby_s (Jan 11, 2008)

And if you are wanting the futuristic TIVO look no furthur then the THR22. Nothing about a HR"35" has ever been mentioned. It has been confirmed that a Tivo will be running on a HR22 branded as the THR22 from what I hear. So lets not get this phantom HR35 rumor mill started.


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## ejjames (Oct 3, 2006)

I understand sending out used gear, but IMO, that box has been abused and would be completely unacceptable to me. 

That's not normal "wear and tear".


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## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

The back panel, while beat up, imo is no big deal. Not like it's on display or anything.

However, having the USB door broke, no thats not acceptable.

Thank you for the pics as well.


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## ciurca (Apr 14, 2009)

FWIW, I started with a hr-23 in April 09. Since then I've added 2 more hr2x's via directv and both were hr-22's. Compared to the 23, both are dog slow and unresponsive. I really wish I would have purchased via solid signal but they were free upgrades. I understand the Op's complaint. You just gave to pay for guaranteed performance.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

As Webby says, the HR35 doesn't exist that anyone knows. There is a Tivo coming out, though not exactly what you want if you are wanting MRV etc.

Now, there is an HR34 (First Look posted yesterday.) That one will be one you can guarantee you'll get once it's available to current customers. At least until the next model in it's line is released.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

I've never heard of an HR35 but the HR34 is in limited release and when the TiVo comes out it will be the THR22. We already have a thread on the TiVo so you can discuss it there if you'd like. 

DIRECTV considers all the HRs as equivalent in functionality...which is true. They differ in speed but are identical in functionality. From that standpoint, it has long been DIRECTV’s policy to ship any HR to a customer without differentiating between individual models. 

This is a policy that has been at length, many times, in many threads here a DBSTalk but one that sometimes doesn’t get properly communicated to the subscriber in conversations with the CSR. DIRECTV CSRs need to handle that better so this kind of thing isn’t a surprise to the customer when the DVR arrives.

Mike


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## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

Does not matter if its policy. It is *completely unacceptable* and why you guys are trying to rationalize this is beyond me.


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

Someone actually posted pictures! I wonder what the bean counters would say if they knew this what they pay Celestica for. They should just forget the whole send the receiver back idea and give customers who are sending one back the address of the next customer if they aren't going to even try to make it look decent.

Usually they sharpie over those scuffs and stick a new faceplate on. While I don't think it should be perfect, replacement units should have some aesthetic value, some people have nice homes and expensive equipment that they want to look nice.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

peano said:


> Does not matter if its policy. It is *completely unacceptable* and why you guys are trying to rationalize this is beyond me.


I'm not rationalizing anything. I'm merely explaining the policy. Whether or not it's acceptable I'll leave to interpretation.

To me the unacceptable part is the CSRs not explaining the policy. I can understand how there can't ever be enough HR24s for everyone who wants one (replacements and installs) but the customer should know going in what they might or might not get. That's more to the point.

Mike


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

You can also buy new or slightly used HR24s from Directv Employees who no longer need their HR24 on Ebay and sometimes from a company that is going out of business and no longer needs their HR24 DVRs. 

However, make sure that the unit is Owned and not a Lease Unit!!!


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

peano said:


> Does not matter if its policy. It is *completely unacceptable* and why you guys are trying to rationalize this is beyond me.


The unit having a broken front door is unacceptable I will agree with that.

However, they treating all HR2x units the same is completely acceptable, and expected. They do make exceptions in a couple of circumstances (they try to give you HR20s if you tell them you use OTA, they give you HR21s or above if you have a 3D TV), but otherwise they are all the same. Cable companies do the same thing with their equipment. It doesn't make sense for them to give out brand new equipment every time when they have used equipment that functions exactly the same that they can give out. A little bit of difference in speed that 95% of customers aren't even aware of isn't a big enough reason to completely overhaul and make a inventory system more complex.

The new HR34 will be treated differently as it is a different machine and has a higher cost ($400 to lease instead of $200 for an HR2x).


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

peano said:


> Does not matter if its policy. It is *completely unacceptable* and why you guys are trying to rationalize this is beyond me.


Who's "rationalizing"? I was simply stating the policy. I agree, it's silly. But it is what it is. And it's been discussed here to death.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

litzdog911 said:


> Who's "rationalizing"? I was simply stating the policy. I agree, it's silly. But it is what it is. And it's been discussed here to death.


Yes, we have Beaten that Horse to Death and now it looks like Horsey Pate!!! :lol: :beatdeadhorse:


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## Rik1268 (Apr 16, 2009)

I few weeks back I called to upgrade an sddvr to a hddvr and they offered me a free one. I was thinking sweet a new HR24 for free and then a few days later a refurbed HR22 shows up. My reaction I was a little peeved since I had a whole home system and could not hook up this new receiver to it (no DECA module included). Then I thought to myself hey it was free if I had paid for this I would have sent it back and purchased one from Solid Signal. I did call about the ability of not being able to hook up to my whole home system they overnighted me a DECA unit. End result not what I had hoped for but I was happy they made it right in a timely manner.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

There's a difference between DIRECTV not differentiating between an HR20 and an HR24 and sending out a unit that looked like the one the OP received. The DIRECTV policy to send what they have is fine, sending out a unit that looks like it acually fell off the back of a truck is not.


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## paulman182 (Aug 4, 2006)

It is totally amazing to me that a customer would treat his DVR like that.

To me, as long as the little door will stay shut, I wouldn't worry about the hinge being broken. But I wonder why the housecat attacked the back panel?


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## scott2020 (Sep 13, 2004)

CCarncross said:


> Here is my response to anyone with that attitude about anything. If you don't like the way this is, go to another provider.


Policy is what it is, but there is no excuse sending that kind of garbage to a customer.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

Ok, let me be clear. Discuss the topic and NOT each other. There is no reason to be rude...no reason to tell someone to leave because of their opinion. That's just plain rude.

:backtotop

Mike


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

GovGeek said:


> Pic links were broken? I attached them here.


Actually the pictures you've posted of that 21 aren't that bad. I've gotten many HRs that were in far worse shape. That cover will probably just snap back in place.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

litzdog911 said:


> There used to be a sticky post at the top of this forum about this.
> 
> Yes, it's actually true. CSRs *cannot* guarantee a specific model. If you really want an HR24, you'll need to get one from a dealer like Solid Signal.


They certainly "can", what you mean is they "may not".


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

rich584 said:


> They certainly "can", what you mean is they "may not".


Grammar lessons aside, it's true. 

CSRs are prohibited from promising a specific receiver. 

Mike


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

paulman182 said:


> It is totally amazing to me that a customer would treat his DVR like that.
> 
> To me, as long as the little door will stay shut, I wouldn't worry about the *hinge being broken*. But I wonder why the housecat attacked the back panel?


I can't see if the part on the front panel is broken, but the part that snaps onto the doo-hickey on the front panel looks whole. Just a matter of snapping it back into place if the doo-hickey is whole.

As for the back being scratched, who cares?

Rich


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## maartena (Nov 1, 2010)

peano said:


> Does not matter if its policy. It is *completely unacceptable* and why you guys are trying to rationalize this is beyond me.


They should offer different pricing imho.

New: $199.
Used/Reconditioned: $99.

You can't tell me that the software they use to send stuff to their warehouse cannot be adjusted to make THAT distinction. And then the customer can decide for themselves: Do I just want "whatever they give me" or do I want a "brand new" one.


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## ronsanjim (Mar 19, 2008)

My 2 year "contract" was up in August. I called, transferred to retention, and told them I wanted a 24 to stay with Direct. _He guaranteed a 24._ I told him they would deliver whatever was on their truck.

I emailed Ellen's office, related my story, and they also _guaranteed me a 24._ He told me to call him back if the 24 was not delivered. The installer delivered my 24, and it works almost as good at my refurbished HR20-100.


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

rich584 said:


> They certainly "can", what you mean is they "may not".


You know what I meant. My comment stands.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

ronsanjim said:


> My 2 year "contract" was up in August. I called, transferred to retention, and told them I wanted a 24 to stay with Direct. _He guaranteed a 24._ I told him they would deliver whatever was on their truck.
> 
> I emailed Ellen's office, related my story, and they also _guaranteed me a 24._ He told me to call him back if the 24 was not delivered. The installer delivered my 24, and it works almost as good at my refurbished HR20-100.


Glad it worked out. If they sent me that HR21, I would have done the same thing. And again it proves that they can send the model you want, it just takes more effort.

For better customer satisfaction, I think they should let you request a specific model. Not enough subscribers even know about the different models. The ones that actually do, should be taken care of. Just my opinion.


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## larryah (Jul 29, 2010)

Well, I might as well throw in my two cents worth...A new customer should get brand new equipment of the newest model available. I can live with reconditioned replacements, but they should be truly reconditioned and not just recycled, and the equal of the replaced equipment. Why isnt that fair? Sending damaged equipment is absolutely unacceptable, and they will probably lose a customer if if happens to me.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

litzdog911 said:


> You know what I meant. My comment stands.


I knew what you meant, but did the TS? He should be told the truth and the truth is the CSRs are capable of telling us anything.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

larryah said:


> Well, I might as well throw in my two cents worth...A new customer should get brand new equipment of the newest model available. I can live with reconditioned replacements, but they should be truly reconditioned and not just recycled, and the equal of the replaced equipment. Why isnt that fair? Sending damaged equipment is absolutely unacceptable, and they will probably lose a customer if if happens to me.


This isn't a perfect system.
I'm not sure it ever could be.
There are currently five HD DVR models, all grouped together as the HD DVR Plus.
Sure everyone wants the newest brand new DVR.
What is to be done with those being returned, and for that matter "new customers" that get the free installs?
My HR20s are now almost 5 years old, and at the time were $299 each for the lease.
Stock varies so sometimes even the installers only get "reconditioned" receivers.

There is a way currently to get brand new receivers, it's through a retailer and the same price as the "no deal" from DirecTV.


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## quattro40v (Sep 5, 2011)

ronsanjim said:


> My 2 year "contract" was up in August. *I called, transferred to retention, and told them I wanted a 24 to stay with Direct. He guaranteed a 24*_._ I told him they would deliver whatever was on their truck.
> 
> I emailed Ellen's office, related my story, and they also _guaranteed me a 24._ He told me to call him back if the 24 was not delivered. The installer delivered my 24, and it works almost as good at my refurbished HR20-100.


I had the same experience.

No way would I accept that POS op received.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

ronsanjim said:


> My 2 year "contract" was up in August. I called, transferred to retention, and told them I wanted a 24 to stay with Direct. _He guaranteed a 24._ I told him they would deliver whatever was on their truck.
> 
> I emailed Ellen's office, related my story, and they also _guaranteed me a 24._ He told me to call him back if the 24 was not delivered. The installer delivered my 24, and it works almost as good at my refurbished HR20-100.


I got 2 HR24-500s from Ellen Filipiak's Office after I related trouble that I had from a Directv Employee so they take these matters seriously and can do things that other Departments can not do such as promise to deliver an HR24-500 and then you actually get it.

So if Ellen's Office can Guarantee me 2 HR24-500s for helping them, then the other Departments coud do it also if Directv chose to let them. They just want to keep using older supposedly refurbished DVRs rather than using the latest and greatest because it is cheaper and that would be Okay if they would indeed refurbish the DVRs.

I had one that had a bad hard drive and was DOA and there is no way that it was "Refurbished" but just "Recyclec".


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

scott2020 said:


> Policy is what it is, but there is no excuse sending that kind of garbage to a customer.


I completely agree sending out beat up equipment is unacceptable. But this thread is really about the policy of not being able to control what model you get as a replacement. If they make it a "like for like" replacement, people that have the less desirable models aren't happy, if they make it "you always get the newest model all the time", then people will be coming up with new and creative ways to make sure their current devices all "break" when a new model comes out...

What is probably agreed upon universally here is that the refurb program needs to be stepped up a little bit. Cosmetic damage on the back of a device, probably not a big deal, but the "customer" end of the case should be free of blemishes and damage, and of course all the components need to work.


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## TomK (Oct 18, 2010)

That is one funky looking receiver, must have been from a crack house. How does a receiver get in that shape? It must have been moved nightly from place to place. Funky.

And as bad as that is to get that, what kind of Directv employee would send that out? Surely someone checks the contents and condition of things before sending replacements/new orders.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

TomK said:


> That is one funky looking receiver, must have been from a crack house. How does a receiver get in that shape? It must have been moved nightly from place to place. Funky.


Probably been taken apart a few times by folks that had no idea how to do it.



> And as bad as that is to get that, what kind of Directv employee would send that out? Surely someone checks the contents and condition of things before sending replacements/new orders.


You'd think so, wouldn't you? Unfortunately it doesn't seem to happen the way you logically think it would.

Rich


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Beerstalker said:


> Cable companies do the same thing with their equipment.


However, every cable company I've dealt with allows you to go down to their local office and swap out your receiver for any model they have on hand. If you want their newest DVR with a 500GB hard drive, they'll give it to you.


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## paulman182 (Aug 4, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> However, every cable company I've dealt with allows you to go down to their local office and swap out your receiver for any model they have on hand. If you want their newest DVR with a 500GB hard drive, they'll give it to you.


I'd take the most beat-up HR ever pictured on this forum rather than suffer from my local cable.


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## ATARI (May 10, 2007)

paulman182 said:


> I'd take the most beat-up HR ever pictured on this forum rather than suffer from my local cable.


Amen!!


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

paulman182 said:


> I'd take the most beat-up HR ever pictured on this forum rather than suffer from my local cable.


I understand, just pointing out that cable actually does handle it differently. But DirecTV doesn't have any offices where people can walk in and exchange their receiver, so it's a different situation.


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> I understand, just pointing out that cable actually does handle it differently. But DirecTV doesn't have any offices where people can walk in and exchange their receiver, so it's a different situation.


It is easier to reject something when in their office but my experiences with Comcast says the end result is not much different. The local office one time claimed they only had this one box that I rejected. Take it or leave it. I stood my ground. Eventually, they "found" a box in the back that the customer who it was reserved for did not show up.

Truth is that you don't know what is on the truck nor do you know what is in the building. The local DirecTV guys can mess you up as well as the cable guys in a building.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

tonyd79 said:


> Truth is that you don't know what is on the truck nor do you know what is in the building. The local DirecTV guys can mess you up as well as the cable guys in a building.


This is true. But the one advantage cable has, regardless of what happens, is that they don't charge any upfront "lease fees" for their receivers. Psychologically, it's easier to accept a refurb when you're not shelling out any money upfront for it. But when you're paying $200 for a gamble, it can be tough when you get stuck with a refurb on the edge of acceptable.


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## bobvick1983 (Mar 21, 2007)

rich584 said:


> Actually the pictures you've posted of that 21 aren't that bad. I've gotten many HRs that were in far worse shape. That cover will probably just snap back in place.
> 
> Rich


I can understand that you might be a "passionate" DirecTV subscriber, but there is no excuse for them shipping out a replacement unit that looks like that, and there can be no excuse or rationalization for it. The OP has every right to be upset.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

bobvick1983 said:


> My god, I have heard of being a fanboi, but are you a stockholder? That piece of trash is completely unacceptable.


I'm anything but a "fanboi", and all I saw in the photos that was a real problem was the access card door. :nono:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> I'm anything but a "fanboi", and all I saw in the photos that was a real problem was the access card door. :nono:


And even that looks like it could be snapped back into place, but I'm not sure about that because the picture really doesn't show the "female" part that the door connects to. The door itself looks fine.

Rich


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

:rant: I really appreciate the information here. It's allowed me to level-set my expectations with DTV. Obviously DTV will never meet my high water mark with their current policy. Thankfully they have competitors to at least create a baseline in the market place.

I've been loyal to DTV since 1995 (PrimeStar before them) and I honestly expect to be treated very well in exchange for my money. I'm a realist too and I don't have unrealistic expectations. It's just mind boggling how they can run successfully with this business model. This is like if I went lease an Audi A8 and the dealer then gives me a worn-out A6 that "performs similarly." So do I say to myself... "It's better than walking?" Who else does this? I honestly feel hoodwinked.

The condition of the equipment is a big deal to me. I've spent 1.5 years saving and building out my Home Theater. I stress about my cabling and how my equipment is placed. I wrote schematics and documentation and put everything into a "Home Theater binder" for reference. I'm "that guy" that will show you my A/V closet and how cool all the wiring looks behind the equipment rack. So I care GREATLY about the equipment I use.

I don't expect everything to be perfect. But I need to have a sense of enjoyment when I look at my things; because to me those are small reminders or rewards for a hard day's work. I just want to feel as though my loyalty means something and I'm being treated fair. However with the equipment I received, I feel more like I'm a recipient of a government funded DTV welfare program.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

bobvick1983 said:


> I can understand that you might be a "passionate" DirecTV subscriber, but there is no excuse for them shipping out a replacement unit that looks like that, and there can be no excuse or rationalization for it. The OP has every right to be upset.


I do like D*, but "passionate" seems a bit off center. I'm certainly not positive, but I think I've had more replacement HRs than anyone on the forum. And I've had some real beauties. I've taken HRs out of the boxes in pieces several times, had some that looked like they were used for hockey pucks and had some that sounded as if they had a rattlesnake inside. Some that wouldn't even turn on, some that wouldn't boot up, some that would accept no remote commands. I could go on and on. But everybody that's been on the forum for a while has heard all this.

I can understand his frustration, but all the damage seems to be on the back panel. Why worry about that? As for the door, it looks like all it needs to do is be snapped back into place. I've received replacements with the front panels hanging off. What I'm curious about is this: Does it work? Much as it aggravates me, that's all they're required to do. Send you a working replacement.

All that said, let me repeat myself, I really don't see what the big problem is. If the front panel isn't damaged horribly and it works, D* has fulfilled its commitment, which isn't what any of us would really like to see, but it is what it is.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

GovGeek said:


> :rant: I really appreciate the information here. It's allowed me to level-set my expectations with DTV. Obviously DTV will never meet my high water mark with their current policy. Thankfully they have competitors to at least create a baseline in the market place.
> 
> I've been loyal to DTV since 1995 (PrimeStar before them) and I honestly expect to be treated very well in exchange for my money. I'm a realist too and I don't have unrealistic expectations. It's just mind boggling how they can run successfully with this business model. This is like if I went lease an Audi A8 and the dealer then gives me a worn-out A6 that "performs similarly." So do I say to myself... "It's better than walking?" Who else does this? I honestly feel hoodwinked.
> 
> ...


Thoughtful post.

Is the front panel in as bad shape as the back panel, have you tried to snap the door back in place and does the HR work?

D* doesn't seem to care as much for their customers as they should, but they are very successful and the way they do business seems to work very well. You sound very much like I did when I first started using the HRs. If I thought there was a better provider out there, I'd be using them. I haven't found one yet that compares to D* favorably or gives you a better deal for the money it costs.

I even bought six HRs on CL and eBay because I got sick of dealing with D*'s allegedly "refurbished" replacements and their "functionally equivalent" argument. Functionally equivalent is just what your Audi example means. In their minds and in the minds of people who just don't understand why anyone would doubt the drivel that they put forth.

Rich


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

"Functionally equivalent" means "We want to be able to keep passing off old refurbished receivers, even though they are slower and have less storage space than the current model. And charge the same price!"


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> "Functionally equivalent" means "We want to be able to keep passing off old refurbished receivers, even though they are slower and have less storage space than the current model. And charge the same price!"


To some degree that's true.
What would the lease fee be if every returned receiver simply went into the scrap heap?


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> To some degree that's true.
> What would the lease fee be if every returned receiver simply went into the scrap heap?


Obviously there's no reason to do that. But the fact that the same $200 will get you anything from a brand new HR24 to the OP's HR21 is not good.


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

The door isn't going to snap back on, the hinge pin is missing. As long as the connectors work on the back that doesn't matter.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Jeremy W said:


> "Functionally equivalent" means "We want to be able to keep passing off old refurbished receivers, even though they are slower and have less storage space than the current model. And charge the same price!"


I knew there would come a time when we would agree on something....:lol:

Rich


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

rich584 said:


> Thoughtful post.
> 
> Is the front panel in as bad shape as the back panel, have you tried to snap the door back in place and does the HR work?
> 
> ...


The door does snap back into place. However, if I met a girl who looked as roughed up as this receiver does, there's NO amount of persuasion that would convince me to interface with her whatsoever. If DTV is willing to overlook this much damage that we can see, Its very reasonable to assume that the internals are just as ignored. I'm not plugging this thing into my PDU, much less to the HDMI leading to my tuner.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

matt said:


> The door isn't going to snap back on, the hinge pin is missing. As long as the connectors work on the back that doesn't matter.


I couldn't see the hinge pin in that picture. I think they would have had to put a whole front panel on to resolve that issue, no?

Rich


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

rich584 said:


> I couldn't see the hinge pin in that picture. I think they would have had to put a whole front panel on to resolve that issue, no?
> 
> Rich


Q-tip sticks and super glue also work but I doubt that people here would find that acceptable either.


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## matt (Jan 12, 2010)

GovGeek said:


> However, if I met a girl who looked as roughed up as this receiver does, there's NO amount of persuasion that would convince me to interface with her whatsoever.


Don't you hate that? Your friends tell you about a nice girl and you go to meet her and one of her front flaps is busted and hanging low?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

GovGeek said:


> The door does snap back into place. However, if I met a girl who looked as roughed up and this receiver does, there's NO amount of persuasion that would convince me to interface with her whatsoever. If DTV is willing to overlook this much damage that we can see, It very reasonable to assume that the internals are just as ignored. I'm not plugging this thing into my PDU, much less to the HDMI leading to my tuner.


So, your next step should be to call back and demand a replacement for the replacement. After three calls about the same issue, you should be referred to the Case Management Group. Hopefully, they should be able to resolve your problems. If you feel that strongly, keep calling them and complaining, don't be afraid to call Retention. The more strongly you can argue (while being as polite as you possibly can), the more likely you will get your problems solved. Just don't give up.

Rich


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

GovGeek said:


> The door does snap back into place. However, if I met a girl who looked as roughed up as this receiver does, there's NO amount of persuasion that would convince me to interface with her whatsoever. If DTV is willing to overlook this much damage that we can see, Its very reasonable to assume that the internals are just as ignored. I'm not plugging this thing into my PDU, much less to the HDMI leading to my tuner.


The simplest thing at this point is to return this unit and go to a retailer for what you want.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

matt said:


> Q-tip sticks and super glue also work but I doubt that people here would find that acceptable either.


The TS said it would snap back into place. But that door isn't used for anything, so super glue would work too....:lol:

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

matt said:


> Don't you hate that? Your friends tell you about a nice girl and you go to meet her and one of her front flaps is busted and hanging low?


That's actually happened to me a few times...:nono2:

Rich


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

rich584 said:


> So, your next step should be to call back and demand a replacement for the replacement. After three calls about the same issue, you should be referred to the Case Management Group. Hopefully, they should be able to resolve your problems. If you feel that strongly, keep calling them and complaining, don't be afraid to call Retention. The more strongly you can argue (while being as polite as you possibly can), the more likely you will get your problems solved. Just don't give up.
> 
> Rich


I haven' spoken to "Case Management" yet (or at least not knowingly) but I have spoken to Customer Retention as I stated in the first post. I'm always calm, kind, but firm with these situations. I have a saying... "You can't get what you don't ask for" and I live by that belief.

I'll continue to call until my goal in achieved. Their approach would be much different if the roles were reversed and I happened to "forget" to pay them. But I also can't "turn them off" to get their attention either. :nono2:


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

I can see where the OP is coming from. I invested several thousand dollars having my Home Theater room professionally designed and built with top shelf materials and equipment. Adding a piece of equipment like he received is like spending on a tuxedo and getting a five cent hair cut to go with it.


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## SPACEMAKER (Dec 11, 2007)

What was sent to the OP is completely unacceptable. If that were sent to me I'd have no choice but to just laugh and remind myself that it's only TV and not a big deal in the grand scheme. Then I'd place a good natured call to D* and get the situation remedied along with a nice credit of some sort.


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## Justin23 (Jan 11, 2008)

Is this receiver functional, regardless of how it looks?


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> This is true. But the one advantage cable has, regardless of what happens, is that they don't charge any upfront "lease fees" for their receivers. Psychologically, it's easier to accept a refurb when you're not shelling out any money upfront for it. But when you're paying $200 for a gamble, it can be tough when you get stuck with a refurb on the edge of acceptable.


That is true. The upfront cost makes people think they are buying something rather than leasing. Occasionally cable companies charge an upgrade fee (like Fios did erratically for the newer 7000 series boxes) but that is nominal (in the range of 40-50 bucks) and is called an upgrade fee so it is clear.


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

GovGeek said:


> If DTV is willing to overlook this much damage that we can see, Its very reasonable to assume that the internals are just as ignored.


Or you can assume they focus on the innards and not the cosmetics. I actually worry more about pristine looking boxes on refurbs of any type because I wonder if they just made sure the paint looked good and sent it back out.

Or as Tommy Boy put it:

But why do they put a guarantee on the box? Because they know all they sold ya was a guaranteed piece of ****. That's all it is, isn't it? Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will. I got spare time. But for now, for your customer's sake, for your daughter's sake, ya might wanna think about buying a quality product from me.


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## larryah (Jul 29, 2010)

I would worry about damage to the rear panel because who knows what caused it. I had my Dish receiver for six years when I quit them, and there wasnt a mark on it. A receiver in that condition has been abused, and God knows what is inside. Dont get me wrong, I love DTV. Been with them over a year and have had excellent service when needed. I used a local retailer and got exactly what I wanted. I let them know it was my way or the highway. Thats how is should be folks....we are the paying good money for this service and equipment. I left Dish because they tried to screw me by charging $50 and forcing me to sign a new 18 month contract to replace a receiver they screwed up with a new software version after I had paid $5 a month for six years for equipment problems. I went to cable for three years and left them when they didnt fullfill their promise to have as many HD channels as satellite within the first year. After three years they were not even close. Some of these companies will treat you as bad as you let them. Its up to you!


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## Hey_Hey (Aug 23, 2006)

Beerstalker said:


> ...
> 
> However, they treating all HR2x units the same is completely acceptable, and expected. They do make exceptions in a couple of circumstances (they try to give you HR20s if you tell them you use OTA, *they give you HR21s or above if you have a 3D TV*), but otherwise they are all the same.
> 
> ...


Actually in the case of 3D, they end up giving you an R22. They apparently have some way to guarantee an R22 (vs an R16 or whatever) under the 3D upgrade program. I originally had an HR20 and when I bought my 3D TV I called to get the HR20 replaced and they sent an R22. Which works fine for HD and 3D as long as you have HD on your account. I about a year later the R22 failed completely so I called for a replacement and the CSR said "you know you may get an R16". I said "No that is not acceptable" and explained the whole HR20 3D thing and she said "oh they shouldn't have done that, let me talk to my supervisor". She came back and said "My mistake, we have a special 3D program that ships out R22's, let me enter that again for you." Sure enough the replacement receiver was an R22.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Mike Bertelson said:


> DIRECTV considers all the HRs as equivalent in functionality...which is true. They differ in speed but are identical in functionality. From that standpoint, it has long been DIRECTV's policy to ship any HR to a customer without differentiating between individual models.
> Mike


MIke I have to disagree speed of operation is a part of functionality. That's me of course.



Joe C said:


> And to further add insult to injury they put a reconditioned sticker on the back.!rolling


They may have just left the Reconditioned sticker on it from the last time they ahem, Reconditioned it. That sticker didn't look very cherry to me.

Moving on. I work in computer repair. I would never bring in a computer in the condition some of these are in. Some of the laptops look like they've been coughing on them for over a year. The first thing I have to do is clean them so I can even bring myself to touch them. I get them with USB doors hanging off. Dented and scratched etc.

I'm not the neatest person but My two year old Laptop looks like new. I could sell it and the buyer couldn't tell it was 2 years old. I've sold off used computers here at work and they still looked new.

Something that looked like those pictures would have to go back. It would make me crazy. The same way it would nag at me if I noticed a stuck pixel on a LCD display.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Hey_Hey" said:


> Actually in the case of 3D, they end up giving you an R22. They apparently have some way to guarantee an R22 (vs an R16 or whatever) under the 3D upgrade program. I originally had an HR20 and when I bought my 3D TV I called to get the HR20 replaced and they sent an R22. Which works fine for HD and 3D as long as you have HD on your account. I about a year later the R22 failed completely so I called for a replacement and the CSR said "you know you may get an R16". I said "No that is not acceptable" and explained the whole HR20 3D thing and she said "oh they shouldn't have done that, let me talk to my supervisor". She came back and said "My mistake, we have a special 3D program that ships out R22's, let me enter that again for you." Sure enough the replacement receiver was an R22.


An R22 to replace a HR20? To me, that would be unacceptable if someone had one DVR and used MRV. The R22 can participate in MRV, but not as the only HD receiver.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

GovGeek said:


> Pic links were broken? I attached them here.


Just return it as being unacceptable.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

rich584 said:


> I couldn't see the hinge pin in that picture. I think they would have had to put a whole front panel on to resolve that issue, no?
> 
> Rich


It looked like it was broken to me.
I'd be afraid that when I did send it back they would charge me for damaging the unit.



veryoldschool said:


> To some degree that's true.
> What would the lease fee be if every returned receiver simply went into the scrap heap?


Fair would be $300 for a new unit and $99 for a Refurbished unit. Let the buyer (leaser?) decide.
As it is the OP paid for a grade A unit and got a Grade C unit.

Functionality should not consider a New Mercedes or well maintained Mercedes and a clapped out 2 cylinder Subaru as equivalent. True they'll both get you there in the end...........


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

dpeters11 said:


> The R22 can participate in MRV, but not as the only HD receiver.


 If you only have one HD receiver, how are you using MRV in the first place?


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> If you only have one HD receiver, how are you using MRV in the first place?


I'd think that would be obvious, Several HRxx DVRs and one HD receiver. That's how it appears to me anyway. I just read that as implied by the MRV.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

TBoneit said:


> I'd think that would be obvious, Several HRxx DVRs and one HD receiver. That's how it appears to me anyway. I just read that as implied by the MRV.


He said the R22 wouldn't work "as the only HD receiver" meaning the R22 was the only HD receiver you had. Which also means that you have no other MRV-capable receivers.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

TBoneit said:


> It looked like it was broken to me.
> I'd be afraid that when I did send it back they would charge me for damaging the unit.


I thought you had like 30 days after receiving the unit to send it back Free of Charge if you deemed in Not Acceptable.

Also, I would call Ellen Filipiak's Office unless you damaged it yourself because they would make sure you got a New DVR to Replace this damaged goods that they sent you!

Ellen's Office has always treated me and others Very Professionally and definitely cares about our happiness with their product which is one of the Functions of Her Department reporting to the CEO!!!


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

Looks like I messed up my post. If someone has only 2 HD boxes, and one is an HR20 that is replaced with an R22, if this is accurate, they would lose MRV. If they had 3 HD boxes with 2 DVRs, they'd be fine as long as both DVRs weren't replaced.


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> He said the R22 wouldn't work "as the only HD receiver" meaning the R22 was the only HD receiver you had. Which also means that you have no other MRV-capable receivers.


I guess it is semantics as I consider a DVR as a DVR and not a receiver. To me a receiver is something that can not record.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

dpeters11 said:


> If someone has only 2 HD boxes, and one is an HR20 that is replaced with an R22, if this is accurate, they would lose MRV.


I don't understand why they would lose MRV. Last I knew, the R22 was perfectly capable of MRV.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Jeremy W" said:


> I don't understand why they would lose MRV. Last I knew, the R22 was perfectly capable of MRV.


It is technically speaking, but unless something has changed, it's not considered an HD receiver by DirecTVs systems. It was said that an R22 would not count toward the minimum requirement of 1 HD receiver and one HD DVR. If you do meet that requirement, the R22 will work fine. I believe if their systems don't see the requirements, MRV is removed from the account.

If that's changed, I haven't seen it.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

larryah said:


> A new customer should get brand new equipment of the newest model available.


Which do you think is more important: meeting the installation schedule or getting the latest and greatest some time after they physically become available.

Remember to think about this in the context of a new customer.

DIRECTV (along with their contractors and third party installers) can ill afford to make every installation a two-parter. They also need to make quick work of the activation lest the customer find an alternative.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

GovGeek said:


> I haven' spoken to "Case Management" yet (or at least not knowingly) but I have spoken to Customer Retention as I stated in the first post. I'm always calm, kind, but firm with these situations. I have a saying... "You can't get what you don't ask for" and I live by that belief.
> 
> I'll continue to call until my goal in achieved. Their approach would be much different if the roles were reversed and I happened to "forget" to pay them. But I also can't "turn them off" to get their attention either. :nono2:


As I said, keep calling and you'll be referred to Case Management. You'll know when this happens, you'll be asked to wait for a CM agent to call you. And they will, and the agent will give you their number and a password good for a week to contact them. The agent will work with you to resolve your problem. The won't promise you any particular model, but don't be surprised if a new 24 shows up in the hands of an installer.

Rich


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## Billzebub (Jan 2, 2007)

Jeremy W said:


> "Functionally equivalent" means "We want to be able to keep passing off old refurbished receivers, even though they are slower and have less storage space than the current model. And charge the same price!"


If one was in fact going to pay the $199 why wouldn't they jusy order an HR24 from Solid Signal?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

TBoneit said:


> It looked like it was broken to me.
> I'd be afraid that when I did send it back they would charge me for damaging the unit.
> 
> Fair would be $300 for a new unit and $99 for a Refurbished unit. Let the buyer (leaser?) decide.
> ...


Been arguing about that phrase for years. Go over to D*'s website and visit their forum and you'll see that phrase all over the place. "Equivalent functionality" apparently has absolutely nothing to do with speed and if speed isn't a function I don't know what it is.

Rich


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## Billzebub (Jan 2, 2007)

GovGeek said:


> The door does snap back into place. However, if I met a girl who looked as roughed up as this receiver does, there's NO amount of persuasion that would convince me to interface with her whatsoever. If DTV is willing to overlook this much damage that we can see, Its very reasonable to assume that the internals are just as ignored. I'm not plugging this thing into my PDU, much less to the HDMI leading to my tuner.


Come on, it's 3:00 in the morning and the bar is about to close


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## Billzebub (Jan 2, 2007)

dpeters11 said:


> It is technically speaking, but unless something has changed, it's not considered an HD receiver by DirecTVs systems. It was said that an R22 would not count toward the minimum requirement of 1 HD receiver and one HD DVR. If you do meet that requirement, the R22 will work fine. I believe if their systems don't see the requirements, MRV is removed from the account.
> 
> If that's changed, I haven't seen it.


When I first signed up for MRV the CSR couldn't get it registered with my R22, even though I also had an HR 22. He ended up listing it as an HR 22 on my account. Go figure.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

TBoneit said:


> I guess it is semantics as I consider a DVR as a DVR and not a receiver. To me a receiver is something that can not record.


That's how I think of the difference between the Hs and the HRs. In the back of my mind I know they are both "receivers" tho. Even if I only rarely use the HRs as receivers since I rarely watch live TV.

Rich


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## sdirv (Dec 14, 2008)

GovGeek said:


> I was excited to buy the new HR24-700


Buy???

:lol:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Billzebub said:


> If one was in fact going to pay the $199 why wouldn't they jusy order an HR24 from Solid Signal?


Really makes you wonder, doesn't it? I've never seen a good argument for why some folks buy them from D* for the same price as SS sells the model of your choice. Unless they just don't understand what they are doing when they make the purchase. Not everyone has access to what seems like a simple solution to us.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

sdirv said:


> Buy???
> 
> :lol:


Not only "Buy???", but is a 24-700 even out yet? If it is, I missed it. All I know about the 24s is a 100, 200 and 500. Perhaps just a typo?

Rich


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## DJ Rob (Jul 24, 2003)

It is crazy they do this to their customers. 

They should use the old model receivers as replacements for the old ones that are RMAed and send out HR24's for the people who are paying $200 of their hard earned money for a brand new receiver...

I had an HR24 go bad within a few days. They tried to replace it with an HR21-100. I had to cancel my account before they would finally replace it with an HR24.

They said they could select which model a customer got, but their policy is not to. And it took me cancelling before they would do it. 

So it sounds like the policy just needs to be changed by the higher ups?


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

TBoneit said:


> Fair would be $300 for a new unit and $99 for a Refurbished unit. Let the buyer (leaser?) decide.


Why would you pay $300 through D* when you can get a brand new unit from a retailer for sub $200?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

DJ Rob said:


> It is crazy they do this to their customers.
> 
> They should use the old model receivers as replacements for the old ones that are RMAed and send out HR24's for the people who are paying $200 of their hard earned money for a brand new receiver...
> 
> ...


Probably because not that many people actually complain. All we see on the forum are complaints, for the most part, so we tend to think a lot of folks are complaining.

For example, I'm having a terrible time with my Internet provider, Cablevision, which is caused by the system not being upgraded for years in my area. I had a cable guy out yesterday and he went up on the pole and checked my signal and two of my neighbor's signals. Mine was a good 12Db signal (don't know what that means, but the guy said that it was good). My two neighbors are getting -26Db and -27Db signals, which he said was terrible. Some people just never complain.

Sometime the line between who is responsible kinda blurs if nobody complains.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

dsw2112 said:


> Why would you pay $300 through D* when you can get a brand new unit from a retailer for sub $200?


Typo maybe? I do like the idea of tiered pricing. I think a lot of people would go for the cheaper price and put up with a used HR. I usually have an offer for a $99 HR on my account, but I wouldn't think of taking them up on that offer. I'd rather buy an owned unit on CL or eBay or this forum that I had some control over.

Rich


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## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

OP, please glue the door shut, hook that piece of junk up and thank your lucky stars that DIRECTV has even considered you as a sub. You must be more grateful!


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## evan_s (Mar 4, 2008)

Billzebub said:


> If one was in fact going to pay the $199 why wouldn't they jusy order an HR24 from Solid Signal?


I can think of a number of reasons.

1) They aren't actually paying that. If you've been a customer for a while in good standing discounted receivers aren't uncommon.

2) They need it installed and that is being included in the 199$

3) They don't know about Solid Signal or other ways to get receivers.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

evan_s said:


> I can think of a number of reasons.
> 
> 1) They aren't actually paying that. If you've been a customer for a while in good standing discounted receivers aren't uncommon.
> 
> ...


Number four--They're not us....:lol:

Rich


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

And number 5 is that if you do it that way, you invoke a new 2-year commit.


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

rich584 said:


> Typo maybe? I do like the idea of tiered pricing. I think a lot of people would go for the cheaper price and put up with a used HR. I usually have an offer for a $99 HR on my account, but I wouldn't think of taking them up on that offer. I'd rather buy an owned unit on CL or eBay or this forum that I had some control over.
> 
> Rich


I've always thought tiered pricing was a good idea. If someone wants to pay sticker for a receiver then they should get a brand new model of the receiver they specify. It was mentioned in a thread awhile back, but I believe D*'s manufacturing cost for a receiver is a bit under $150. That still leaves room for profit, albeit it not as much as they would probably like.

However, I think the above is unlikely to happen. Given that, I think any time (or additional money) invested into refurbishing receivers is a wise move on D*'s part. Maybe that line of thinking is why I'm not running a fortune 500 company :lol:


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

Please enlighten me... Who is "Ellen's Office?"


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

rich584 said:


> Not only "Buy???", but is a 24-700 even out yet? If it is, I missed it. All I know about the 24s is a 100, 200 and 500. Perhaps just a typo?
> 
> Rich


That's what I was told. I'm only beginning to peel the layers on this onion and I'm not liking it so far. Not one bit.


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

peano said:


> OP, please glue the door shut, hook that piece of junk up and thank your lucky stars that DIRECTV has even considered you as a sub. You must be more grateful!


If I'm going to glue anything, it'll be to glue the lips of these CSR's that cant get their story straight. On a side note, wouldn't gluing the door be modifying "leased" equipment? That's all I need is to be charged double for a POS I already hate. I'll be grateful when I get what I'm paying for.


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## Billzebub (Jan 2, 2007)

lparsons21 said:


> And number 5 is that if you do it that way, you invoke a new 2-year commit.


Aren't you invokeing a new 2 year committment anytime you pay $199 for a DVR. If it's a replacement, aren't you just charged shipping even without the protection plan?


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

GovGeek said:


> Please enlighten me... Who is "Ellen's Office?"


DirecTV's VP of customer service: [email protected]


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Billzebub said:


> Aren't you invokeing a new 2 year committment anytime you pay $199 for a DVR. If it's a replacement, aren't you just charged shipping even without the protection plan?


Correct. If you let them replace a bad one with whatever they want to ship, then the most you pay is the shipping.

If you want to control what you get, then you'll pay whatever the freight is at the time (currently $200 for a new HR24 from anyone other than Direct) and invoke a new 2-year commit.

Personally if/when one of my HRs shoots craps, I'll let them swap it out and depending on what they send either keep using it or buy/lease a new one.


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

trh said:


> DirecTV's VP of customer service: [email protected]


Awesome! Thank you!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Billzebub said:


> Aren't you invokeing a new 2 year committment anytime you pay $199 for a DVR. If it's a replacement, aren't you just charged shipping even without the protection plan?


Yup, you buy new from SS or D* and you get the commitment. No way around that. If it's a replacement and you have the PP you don't pay anything and "shouldn't" get a new commitment, but you should check with the Access Card Dept. to make sure after you activate it. If you don't have the PP, you can usually get the mailing charge ($19.99) waived.

Rich


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## rphillips187 (Oct 14, 2007)

Refurbished? I'd hate to see what it looked like before they "refurbished" it!

BTW, it's not completely unheard of for UPS or Fedex to use U-Haul if they run short on their own trucks or have a ridiculous amount of deliveries and use extra drivers. I'd rather my package arrive in a U-Haul on-time than in a UPS truck a day late!


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

rphillips187 said:


> Refurbished? I'd hate to see what it looked like before they "refurbished" it!
> 
> BTW, it's not completely unheard of for UPS or Fedex to use U-Haul if they run short on their own trucks or have a ridiculous amount of deliveries and use extra drivers. I'd rather my package arrive in a U-Haul on-time than in a UPS truck a day late!


If it's Fedex Home Delivery or Fedex Ground they used to be all independent agents (they bought their routes like the Thuman's guy) and, not sure if it still is the same, buy & maintain their own trucks. If one has a problem they probably would rent a U-Haul. At least that's how it was a couple years ago. They used to paid by the number of packages they deliver.

A neighbor used to have a route a number of years ago, not sure if all the above still happens but that's the way it used to be when there was only Fedex Ground. Now there is also Fedex Home Delivery (also ground) a separate company.


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## GovGeek (Dec 9, 2010)

rphillips187 said:


> Refurbished? I'd hate to see what it looked like before they "refurbished" it!
> 
> BTW, it's not completely unheard of for UPS or Fedex to use U-Haul if they run short on their own trucks or have a ridiculous amount of deliveries and use extra drivers. I'd rather my package arrive in a U-Haul on-time than in a UPS truck a day late!


I'm glad I'm not the only one. First time for everything...


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## KoRn (Oct 21, 2008)

I have never had a problem getting the box I request. But both times. It was at the signing of a new contract. This last time. I requested a new HR24 or I would not sign. The tech. called on install date and I told him. Not to be rude. But, don't waste your time if you don't have a new HR24 for me. He had 4 new ones in the truck. Directv also told me at the time. If they could not get me one right away and I waited for a few days. I would get one. So with new contracts. Seems like they are more willing to go out of the way to get you and sign. Now adding new boxes under contract is a different story. Never tried it and I imagine it would be much harder to get what you want.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

KoRn said:


> . . . . Now *adding new boxes under contract is a different story*. Never tried it and I imagine it would be much harder to get what you want.


DirecTV current policy forces their customers to go elsewhere for their desire equipment changes. Not exactly a good business practice.

There's a money angle in their somewhere for them to continue this approach of telling their customers to take it or leave it. And when this sales approach finally angers a customer to the point of leaving, it is only then that they consider the customer request of changing their equipment. But by then, it is often too late.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

And yet you have to presume that their research shows a lot of customers don't care what receiver they get, they just want to watch tv.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

I’m curious. How do any of you think DIRECTV should do this? 

You know that almost everyone who is requesting a particular receiver is looking for the very latest. Do you think it’s possible to keep enough inventory of the H/HR24 for all the new installs and for everyone who wants one for a replacement?

IMHO, it isn’t impossible to have enough of them to go around so what do you do then? Put people on waiting lists? That doesn’t help the sub with fried hard drive. He/she needs a replacement now.

It seems to me that since there’s can’t ever be enough to go around, it’s just not practical to give everyone an HR24 as a replacement. So what do you do about that?

I do agree there are problems the condition of the refurbs being sent out but that’s a different issue and not the question I’m asking.

Mike


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## larryah (Jul 29, 2010)

Stuart Sweet said:


> And yet you have to presume that their research shows a lot of customers don't care what receiver they get, they just want to watch tv.


Yes, until they learn they could have had something better....then they will be pissed!


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## larryah (Jul 29, 2010)

Mike Bertelson said:


> I'm curious. How do any of you think DIRECTV should do this?
> 
> You know that almost everyone who is requesting a particular receiver is looking for the very latest. Do you think it's possible to keep enough inventory of the H/HR24 for all the new installs and for everyone who wants one for a replacement?
> 
> ...


They can sell the refurbished units at a discounted price! How can you justify paying the same amount for old technology as someone else pays for new equipment?


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

larryah said:


> They can sell the refurbished units at a discounted price! How can you justify paying the same amount for old technology as someone else pays for new equipment?


How does that ensure everyone gets the HR24 that actually want?

Mike


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Mike Bertelson said:


> I'm curious. How do any of you think DIRECTV should do this?
> 
> ...
> 
> Mike


I've always felt that the best plan would be:

~If you want a specific new model, then pay $99 for the Hx and $199 for the HR2x.
~If you're receiving the unit for free or discounted, then you get whatever is sent.
~If your unit is being replaced because it failed, then you get the same model or higher...never down, like a HR24 to a HR21.


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

Mike Bertelson said:


> How does that ensure everyone gets the HR24 that actually want?
> 
> Mike


I'd venture to say that those who put thought into the matter don't think "everyone" should get a 24. As *Sigma *mentioned above, those who pay full price for the equipment could possibly have a choice in the matter. Those who do not pay really don't have much to complain about :lol:


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Stuart Sweet said:


> And yet you have to presume that their *research shows a lot of customers don't care what receiver they get*, they just want to watch tv.


Well then if most are satisfied, then why is DirecTV so arrogant to the few that would like to change their equipment?

And nothing gets me madder then being pre-catalogize as something I ain't.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I think the presumption of arrogance is an interesting thing. I would prefer to assert the near-certainty that they do more market research than any of our members do. Sometimes they make mistakes, but the consistent policy they've shown to those with a receiver preference — allowing them to go through a third party with no increase in price — leads me to believe that at some level they've determined that this policy works for them.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Mike Bertelson said:


> I'm curious. How do any of you think DIRECTV should do this?
> 
> You know that almost everyone who is requesting a particular receiver is looking for the very latest. Do you think it's possible to keep enough inventory of the H/HR24 for all the new installs and for everyone who wants one for a replacement?
> 
> ...


*A.* We, existing customers that want the newest equipment are few. It been well establish, here on many occasions, that we are such a small group, that our wants don't matter. So this huge inventory concern for our wants must also be extremely small.

*B.* Most here would consider a reasonable exchange fee for new equipment that also guarantees DirecTV another two-year commitment acceptable. The keyword is reasonable.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> they've determined that this policy works for them.


That doesn't make it a good policy. It's anti-customer no matter how you slice it. The fact that someone can get an HR21 when they're replacing an HR24 is ridiculous. I hope they've stopped by now, but they used to replace H21/23s with H20s! This was even after the H21/23s gained functionality that the H20 will never see, making the whole "functionally equivalent" crap even more of a joke.


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

While it may not be written in stone anywhere, the equipment model sigma1914 referred to is currently in *practice*. If you want to guarantee you get the latest model, you order it from a retailer for $199/$99 depending on DVR or receiver, if you want a discounted or free unit you take your chances with the D* inventory system. People in this thread keep saying this is what they want, and in essence this is exactly what is in place....


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

CCarncross said:


> People in this thread keep saying this is what they want, and in essence this is exactly what is in place....


Here's the problem: if you pay the $200 for an HR24, and it breaks, you shouldn't be forced to pay another $200 to guarantee you don't get downgraded. I can't think of any other service provider, regardless of industry, that does this. If my cellphone breaks, I am guaranteed to get the same model *or a better one*. Downgrades are completely unacceptable.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> Here's the problem: if you pay the $200 for an HR24, and it breaks, you shouldn't be forced to pay another $200 to guarantee you don't get downgraded. I can't think of any other service provider, regardless of industry, that does this. If my cellphone breaks, I am guaranteed to get the same model *or a better one*. Downgrades are completely unacceptable.


Agreed...that's why I think they should add my 3 parts, particularly the 3rd one. 



> ~If you want a specific new model, then pay $99 for the Hx and $199 for the HR2x.
> ~If you're receiving the unit for free or discounted, then you get whatever is sent.
> *~If your unit is being replaced because it failed, then you get the same model or higher...never down, like a HR24 to a HR21.*


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

sigma1914 said:


> *~If you want a specific new model, then pay $99 for the Hx and $199 for the HR2x.*
> ~If you're receiving the unit for free or discounted, then you get whatever is sent.
> ~If your unit is being replaced because it failed, then you get the same model or higher...never down, like a HR24 to a HR21.


I also think your first one is important. There are folks that are not tech savvy (like my parents :lol but they would like an HR24 for their $200. When purchasing through D*, a tech completes the install and ensures the Dish and cabling is correct; a big plus for them.


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## larryah (Jul 29, 2010)

You would think DTV would want their new customers to have the very latest equipment to ensure loyalty. You screw them from the start and they wont stay.


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## spartanstew (Nov 16, 2005)

larryah said:


> You would think DTV would want their new customers to have the very latest equipment to ensure loyalty. You screw them from the start and they wont stay.


99% of them have no idea what the latest equipment is or that there's a difference between the HR20 and the HR24 (or others).


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

spartanstew said:


> 99% of them have no idea what the latest equipment is or that there's a difference between the HR20 and the HR24 (or others).


Because you wont find that info at the DirecTV website nor do their CSR comment on the model you will get when you place an order.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

larryah said:


> You would think DTV would want their new customers to have the very latest equipment to ensure loyalty.


A two year commitment with the industry's highest ETF makes thoughts of canceling fleeting.


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## racermd (Dec 18, 2006)

sigma1914 said:


> Agreed...that's why I think they should add my 3 parts, particularly the 3rd one.


I wouldn't want my HR20-700 boxes replaced with HR21s despite this looking like an "upgrade". I'm not even sure I'd take a HR24s in trade. They're certainly not the speediest boxes out there, but they have OTA built-in. I certainly don't *need* that feature, but I do use it and don't want to give it up unless I have to.

All of the HR2x boxes are different in some way, and some of them are more different than others. They might be "functionally equivalent" to the unwashed masses that just want their TV. But each revision of the HR2x offers different connectivity, underlying feature-set, and, I would argue, even with appropriate connectivity, a different user experience.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

racermd said:


> I wouldn't want my HR20-700 boxes replaced with HR21s despite this looking like an "upgrade". I'm not even sure I'd take a HR24s in trade. They're certainly not the speediest boxes out there, but they have OTA built-in. I certainly don't *need* that feature, but I do use it and don't want to give it up unless I have to.
> 
> All of the HR2x boxes are different in some way, and some of them are more different than others. They might be "functionally equivalent" to the unwashed masses that just want their TV. But each revision of the HR2x offers different connectivity, underlying feature-set, and, I would argue, even with appropriate connectivity, a different user experience.


What's it matter if OTA is built in when you can add an AM21?


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

racermd said:


> I wouldn't want my HR20-700 boxes replaced with HR21s despite this looking like an "upgrade".


HR20's are already one of the exceptions where you can request a replacement with OTA capability, and receive another HR20. I would guess *Sigma* would iplement this into #3A


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

I agree with pretty much everything that has already been said. I certainly wouldnt want my HR20 replaced with an HR23 (if it were to die), but at the same time, how do you justify complaining about something you agreed to when you signed up?

We knock the people would said prior to sign up "I dont want anything but an HR24" but at least they did all of their complaining before they signed up.

Directv's policy kind of sucks in regard to sending out receivers like the OP got, but we kind of agreed to it in the beginning.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

dsw2112 said:


> HR20's are already one of the exceptions where you can request a replacement with OTA capability, and receive another HR20. I would guess *Sigma* would iplement this into #3A


Good work, dsw.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Xsabresx said:


> I agree with pretty much everything that has already been said. I certainly wouldnt want my HR20 replaced with an HR23 (if it were to die), but at the same time, how do you justify complaining about something you agreed to when you signed up?
> 
> We knock the people would said prior to sign up "I dont want anything but an HR24" but at least they did all of their complaining before they signed up.
> 
> Directv's policy kind of sucks in regard to sending out receivers like the OP got, *but we kind of agreed to it in the beginning.*


I read that policy before I signed up. But that was when UTV DVRs were the main weapon of choice. That said, I gotta really wonder how many folks actually read all the agreements that they sign.

Rich


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Xsabresx said:


> we kind of agreed to it in the beginning.


That doesn't mean we can't point out the fact that it's an extremely subscriber-hostile and dumb policy. Also, I doubt most people reading the policy would assume they'd be able to replace your DVR with a unit that is not only slower, but has 40% less storage space. The models simply are not equal enough for a policy like this to work.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Jeremy W said:


> That doesn't mean we can't point out the fact that it's an extremely subscriber-hostile and dumb policy. Also, I doubt most people reading the policy would assume they'd be able to replace your DVR with a unit that is not only slower, but has 40% less storage space. The models simply are not equal enough for a policy like this to work.


Yeah, you're right. I doubt if they'll change it unless they rethink the lease policy and make it like the TiVo policy was. They must have a fortune tied up in all those iffy, old boxes.

Rich


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

DirecTV should institute an exchange policy. 

Keep it simple. For a fee, after you commitment period, you should qualify for an equipment exchange program. Nice and simple - no disgruntled customer, no aggravated CSRs.


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

rich584 said:


> I read that policy before I signed up. But that was when UTV DVRs were the main weapon of choice. That said, I gotta really wonder how many folks actually read all the agreements that they sign.
> 
> Rich


You can probably count them on one hand.

Again, I dont disagree with anyone that the policy is crap, but what do you do?


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

Drucifer said:


> DirecTV should institute an exchange policy.
> 
> Keep it simple. For a fee, after you commitment period, you should qualify for an equipment exchange program. Nice and simple - no disgruntled customer, no aggravated CSRs.


*For replacements I'd like to see them do something like*

For Free you get the same DVR model you had (HR20 dies, you get an HR20 back). If that model is no longer available you get the next step up (HR20 dies you get an HR21, and so on)

For $99 you get whatever is the newest.

*For adding DVRs:*
$99 gets you whatever they send you
$199 gets you the lastest model

Something to that effect. Basically something that says if you want the latest and greatest you gotta pay for it. If you just want whatever they send you get a discount.


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

Xsabresx said:


> *For replacements I'd like to see them do something like*
> 
> For Free you get the same DVR model you had (HR20 dies, you get an HR20 back). If that model is no longer available you get the next step up (HR20 dies you get an HR21, and so on)
> 
> ...


I'll let their sales department figure out the cost.

All they got to do is undersell the price from third party vendors.

Your prices don't.


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## Xsabresx (Oct 8, 2007)

Well I did say "something to that effect". I dont know what the right price point is. Hell for the $2000/yr I pay them the price point should be zero but I digress. There should be some sort of price tier.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Xsabresx said:


> You can probably count them on one hand.
> 
> Again, I dont disagree with anyone that the policy is crap, but what do you do?


I bought six owned 20-700s. Just got fed up with getting replacements that didn't work. As soon as I did that, most of my HRs miraculously stabilized and it would seem as if I wasted my money. I returned one that I bought on CL and they talked me into replacing it with a 24-500. I was in the process of returning a 21-700 that was quickly going south and was promised a new 24. And I got one! So, my purchase plans for the six 20-700s hasn't really worked out as I thought it would. I had intended to use them as replacements. Just can't win....:nono2:

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Xsabresx said:


> *For replacements I'd like to see them do something like*
> 
> For Free you get the same DVR model you had (HR20 dies, you get an HR20 back). If that model is no longer available you get the next step up (HR20 dies you get an HR21, and so on)


Not a bad idea, but the 20-700 is a far superior DVR than any of the 21s and that includes the 22s and the 23. Of course, getting a 20-700 as a "working" replacement from D* seems to be a bit on the rare side. Seems like they've weeded out the 20-700s that work properly and all that's left are units that don't work properly.

Rich


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## Joe C (Mar 3, 2005)

Jeremy W said:


> Here's the problem: if you pay the $200 for an HR24, and it breaks, you shouldn't be forced to pay another $200 to guarantee you don't get downgraded.


And you would get a new 2 yr contract if you bought from a retailer to replace that broken box wich is SO WRONG :nono2:


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## adkinsjm (Mar 25, 2003)

Why don't cable companies provide the newest boxes to new customers? Shenanigoats.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Joe C said:


> And you would get a new 2 yr contract if you bought from a retailer to replace that broken box wich is SO WRONG :nono2:


You can choose to get a replacement through DIRECTV which won't have an agreement. The choice is yours to make. If getting a specific model is more important to you than a 2 year agreement then spend the cash. If you don't want a new agreement then go through DIRECTV.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

adkinsjm said:


> Why don't cable companies provide the newest boxes to new customers? Shenanigoats.


Cable companies don't charge up-front fees for their boxes, and they'll generally allow you to exchange your box for a newer one free of charge.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> You can choose to get a replacement through DIRECTV which won't have an agreement. The choice is yours to make.


But it's a choice that should never have to be made.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Jeremy W said:


> But it's a choice that should never have to be made.


I would rather have people make that choice than see increase in equipment pricing just to placate a very small percentage of customers.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> I would rather have people make that choice than see increase in equipment pricing just to placate a very small percentage of customers.


There shouldn't be an increase in equipment pricing, either. There should actually be a decrease. $200 for a refurb receiver is a scam that should be stopped.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Jeremy W said:


> Cable companies don't charge up-front fees for their boxes, and they'll generally allow you to exchange your box for a newer one free of charge.


They charge a rental fee every month so not charging up front is them not doing someone a favor. Even with agreements they don't charge a one time cost because they make too much money off of rental fees.

Cable company dvr's are also the most generic you can get compared to other DVR's out there.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> They charge a rental fee every month so not charging up front is them not doing someone a favor.


Yes, they charge a rental fee. But they generally don't charge for HD or DVR service. So until you start getting into higher receiver counts, the fees are generally a wash between DirecTV and cable.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Jeremy W said:


> There shouldn't be an increase in equipment pricing, either. There should actually be a decrease. $200 for a refurb receiver is a scam that should be stopped.


3 years ago it was $299 and before the leased model it was more expensive than that.

Would you rather pay was DISH pays now so that they can help recoup the ROI on their equipment faster?

You can't have free equipment and lower equipment fees. This system overall is cheaper than the old system people just forget what it was like to have to buy a new receiver when it broke. There is an equipment side of the business and it has to make a profit as well but overall this system is cheaper for customers in a long run situation.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

I know you're a DirecTV employee, but can you stop with the strawmen? It's getting ridiculous.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Jeremy W said:


> Here's the problem: if you pay the $200 for an HR24, and it breaks, you shouldn't be forced to pay another $200 to guarantee you don't get downgraded. I can't think of any other service provider, regardless of industry, that does this. If my cellphone breaks, I am guaranteed to get the same model *or a better one*. Downgrades are completely unacceptable.


I don't know what provider you are using but if my phone breaks I have to go out and buy a new one. I don't get one sent to me for the cost of shipping and no new service commitment.

As it is now it does seem like DirecTV is starting to do what we are asking somewhat. It seems that they are now trying to replace HR20s with HR20s (if you tell them you use OTA). It seems like they are treating the HR20 (for non OTA users) and the HR21, HR22, and HR23 as equivalents (same with H21 and H23). And now it appears that they are try to replace the HR24 with HR24, and H24/H25 with like models.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

At this point I think this has become:beatdeadhorse:
Nothing here is going to change anything.

You pay the price to play, or go somewhere else and pay their price.


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## RobertSeattle (Aug 27, 2006)

Perhaps we'd all do each other a favor and when we returns a DVR to DirecTV we make "sure" it can't be refurbished and send back out.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Beerstalker said:


> I don't know what provider you are using but if my phone breaks I have to go out and buy a new one. I don't get one sent to me for the cost of shipping and no new service commitment.


Verizon. Free 2nd day shipping, no new contract.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

RobertSeattle said:


> Perhaps we'd all do each other a favor and when we returns a DVR to DirecTV we make "sure" it can't be refurbished and send back out.


If the DVR can't be refurbished, they're probably going to charge you for it. It is leased equipment, after all.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Jeremy W said:


> I know you're a DirecTV employee, but can you stop with the strawmen? It's getting ridiculous.


So because I have an opposing view it's strawman? Please tell me what points are over simplified or distorted? The irony of your statement is comical.

I've owned every model of HD DVR there is except a 23 but I've never cared which one I used. I own stock in a company so I care about financial impacts, and I've been a customer for over 11 years. I can't see anything strawmen about that.

So let's stick to the topic.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Jeremy W said:


> Verizon. Free 2nd day shipping, no new contract.


What phone do you have that offers that, or what protection plan? I'm with Verizon too but I would have to pay $10 a month to have coverage on my iPhone and it would still cost me $200 deductable to get it replaced if it's broken, and I can only get 2 replacements within 12 months.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Beerstalker said:


> What phone do you have that offers that, or what protection plan?


Most of their phones, as far as I know. They honor the warranty.


Beerstalker said:


> I'm with Verizon too but I would have to pay $10 a month to have coverage on my iPhone and it would still cost me $200 deductable to get it replaced if it's broken, and I can only get 2 replacements within 12 months.


With the iPhone, you're much better off getting AppleCare.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

So you're just talking about the manufacturer's warranty. In that case anyone whose DVR fails after 3 months would have to pay to lease another since the warranty is only 90 days as far as I know. Not sure if that would be something I would like to see DirecTV do.

As far as my iPhone I actually have Squaretrade warranties on my wife's and mine so they are covered (AppleCare didn't cover accidents until recently).


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> At this point I think this has become:beatdeadhorse:
> Nothing here is going to change anything.
> 
> You pay the price to play, or go somewhere else and pay their price.


I agree in spirit. Let's see if there's anything left to this topic, otherwise I'll close this one as I have other threads on this topic that have gone off the rails.


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## Joe C (Mar 3, 2005)

Shades228 said:


> I own stock in a company so I care about financial impacts, and I've been a customer for over 11 years. I can't see anything strawmen about that.
> 
> So let's stick to the topic.


I dont care about the share holders. I want a DVR that performs to my satisfaction. I would and have raised Directv's costs to get 24's from them VS a retailer. Sorry but there is a big difference in speed with the 24's vs 21-23.


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

Time to put a amen to all of this. Talk about making a long story longer.


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## skatingrocker17 (Jun 24, 2010)

DirecTV's receiver situation is honestly a bit ridiculous. They don't have the technology to track what receivers they have? That really doesn't make any sense, how to they not know what they have?

Do they just separate the HD DVRs from the HD receivers into two big piles? Seems like it.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

skatingrocker17 said:


> DirecTV's receiver situation is honestly a bit ridiculous. They don't have the technology to track what receivers they have? That really doesn't make any sense, how to they not know what they have?
> 
> Do they just separate the HD DVRs from the HD receivers into two big piles? Seems like it.


That's about it. 
HD DVR has X number in stock, HD receiver has Y number in stock.
It would end up a nightmare trying to keep track of each model "and then" satisfy each customer's wishes, which might simply end up with a bunch of older models being left and the customer having to wait for the next batch to come in to receive what they asked for.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> It would end up a nightmare trying to keep track of each model "and then" satisfy each customer's wishes


I think "nightmare" is way too strong of a word. It would add a bit of complexity to their system, but not much. There is no way DirecTV doesn't already know exactly what they have on hand.


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

skatingrocker17 said:


> DirecTV's receiver situation is honestly a bit ridiculous. They don't have the technology to track what receivers they have? That really doesn't make any sense, how to they not know what they have?
> 
> Do they just separate the HD DVRs from the HD receivers into two big piles? Seems like it.


No one every said they don't have the technology to track their receivers. DIRECTV considers all the HRs as equivalent in functionality. If you disregard speed and OTA in the HR20, they are functionally equivalent. The same applies to each of the other series of receivers (e.g. H, HR, etc)

The idea is to replace a failed receiver with the same or equivalent so in this model, so there is no need to track by model individual model number, only by series. If an HR fails it's replaced with another HR...and maybe with an AM21 in necessary.

Everyone can decide for themselves what they think of this policy but to be clear it isn't about DIRECTV's ability/inability to track their hardware.

Mike


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## Drucifer (Feb 12, 2009)

skatingrocker17 said:


> DirecTV's receiver situation is honestly a bit ridiculous. They don't have the technology to track what receivers they have? That really doesn't make any sense, how to they not know what they have?
> 
> Do they just separate the HD DVRs from the HD receivers into two big piles? *Seems like it.*


I caught the DirecTV Boss on that undercover boss show and that's the impression I was left with.

They don't seem to keep a running inventory database. Think they still do that once-a-year physical count.


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## RACJ2 (Aug 2, 2008)

skatingrocker17 said:


> DirecTV's receiver situation is honestly a bit ridiculous. They don't have the technology to track what receivers they have? That really doesn't make any sense, how to they not know what they have?
> 
> Do they just separate the HD DVRs from the HD receivers into two big piles? Seems like it.


From the looks of the HR21 that the OP posted at the start of this thread, I think they pulled his from the bottom of the HD DVR Pile.


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## iceshark (May 7, 2004)

The thing I would like clarified is the OP states they were going to WHOLE HOME setup. As DTV told me if you order whole home you can only be sent a HR24 box. Is this not accurate. I just went back to DTV after my FIOS experiment of 3 years is over. (nother story) and its to be installed on Tue. If they think they are going to show up with anything but a HR 24 I will turn them away.


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## RobertE (Jun 10, 2006)

iceshark said:


> The thing I would like clarified is the OP states they were going to WHOLE HOME setup. As DTV told me if you order whole home you can only be sent a HR24 box. Is this not accurate. I just went back to DTV after my FIOS experiment of 3 years is over. (nother story) and its to be installed on Tue. If they think they are going to show up with anything but a HR 24 I will turn them away.


Whole Home does NOT guarentee a HR24. Anyone who says otherwise is missinformed.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Like RobertE said, getting Whole Home DVR does not guarantee you to get HR24s. However, it does increase your odds a bit as it is less work for the installer. So if he has them available to him he will most likely use them, especially if you ask politely. But if all he has available on his truck that day are HR21s and DECA adapters that is going to be what he uses.


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