# Woke Up This Morning And My Distants Are Gone!!!



## pajer (Jan 9, 2004)

woke up this morning and my ny & la distants are gone! only thing on is 240 & 250 for the save my channels loop. why a month early?


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

Mine are gone also!!!!! It looks like Dish has know for a while that this was going to be the day. They have a recorded message playing on 250 urging Distant users to contact their congressman.


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## garys (Nov 4, 2005)

Gone here as well.


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## Shellback X 23 (Sep 19, 2004)

Well mine are still there, both NYC and DEN.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

Shellback X 23 said:


> Well mine are still there, both NYC and DEN.


Do you know if your receiver was pluged in last night and received last night's update?


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## emathis (Mar 19, 2003)

My only distant network is Fox (Atlanta and LA) and they are still on for me.


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## khearrean (Mar 24, 2004)

I get distants Fox & NBC out of Chicago & as of 9:00 AM CST, they are still on for me. I'm probably jinxing myself by posting this though..:nono:


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## dlp85x (Mar 19, 2004)

As I mentioned in the sticky thread at the top of the forum page, I lost mine last night before 9pm. I had NBC & FOX from LA, and FOX from the other 4 DNS markets (Chi, Den, NYC, ATL). Although its not good to see other's DNS being turned off, at least I know my stations weren't turned off early by accident or anything. 

Shellback X 23: Maybe if you don't let your receiver download the update you will keep your DNS a little bit longer. I'd doubt it, since I had mine on one of the distant nets (248-KTTV) when E* sent the kill order to my receiver, although I wasn't home to see the channel be cut off as it happened. I wasn't waiting for the EPG to download and suddenly realized the DNS stations were no longer listed.


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## alebowgm (Jun 12, 2004)

The question is, are you guys subbing to distants and are 'allowed' to sub to it, or did you guys use the loophole in Dish's system to 'accidently' allow you to sub to distants.

Maybe Dish wised up and realised they should only have people who truly are supposed to have Distants have them for another month, as a way to show congress or whomever, that they have conformed to the laws they were supposed to follow in the first place...


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

FYI: Permission to watch channels is not tied to the overnight update. E* can turn on and off channels any time 24/7 on any connected receiver.


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## dlp85x (Mar 19, 2004)

alebowgm said:


> The question is, are you guys subbing to distants and are 'allowed' to sub to it, or did you guys use the loophole in Dish's system to 'accidently' allow you to sub to distants.
> 
> Maybe Dish wised up and realised they should only have people who truly are supposed to have Distants have them for another month, as a way to show congress or whomever, that they have conformed to the laws they were supposed to follow in the first place...


I got waiver approvals from NBC & FOX, so yeah, I was allowed to get them. I had them since early 2004, so I believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that I was grandfathered under some form of the SHVERA or something of the like until the injunction came about. As I mentioned in another thread, there was one time where E*'s site allowed you to sub to all 5 markets per network allowed, and I got the remaining 3 FOX networks that I didn't have, and had all 5 until yesterday. But, they were (technically) from a waiver approval, although I should've only kept 2 of them!


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## khearrean (Mar 24, 2004)

I wonder if these 'disconnects' have anything to do with geographics? Since some of us still have them, I wonder if Dish is working by some plan to turn off certain areas each day until all are gone? Maybe they figure this way they don't lose all the distants revenue at one time. Just a thought as there has to be some pre-planned method & an explanation as to why some still have them & some don't.

Ken


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

Reportedly IF Dish carries your DMA they have now turned off your distants. If you are potentially eligible for Distants (without waivers), you are still receiving them for now.

How many are seeing something else?


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## jrbdmb (Sep 5, 2002)

Mine gone as well. In my case I should not have been receiving them, I moved from a "grandfathered" address to an area with locals available and expected DNS to be cut off but they weren't (until today).

Even if Dish works out a deal in the end I expect very few of us will qualify for distant NETs.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

DISH carries Sacto DMA but I've long subscribed to all NY networks (and KCBS for $1.50) as well as locals. I'm unclear where a white area of a carried DMA should be presently, but I've still got everything. When people first mentioned 240 & 250, I checked and did NOT get them. I do now, but have no idea when they started for me (Favorites). My bill would only go down by $3 if I drop LiLs from the grandfathered package ($12 pick 3 from distant, local, supers), but I'm curious if anybody has dropped locals so they get the free ones for two months.


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## keppra808 (Oct 29, 2006)

my distant network channels are still on for me, and for the first time i see channel 240 and 250, thats all, i should ask my brother if he can see those channels also on his receiver, then that will tell me its for everyone no matter if you have distant or dont. but what do you think will happen to me.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

keppra808 said:


> my distant network channels are still on for me, and for the first time i see channel 240 and 250, thats all, i should ask my brother if he can see those channels also on his receiver, then that will tell me its for everyone no matter if you have distant or dont. but what do you think will happen to me.


240/250 is not being shown to everyone.


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## rebkell (Sep 9, 2006)

Still on here, East and West, early grandfather status. Free locals are also still on.


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## ggw2000 (Dec 22, 2003)

tnsprin said:


> 240/250 is not being shown to everyone.


Elaborate ?? How do you know this is true? Gerry


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

ggw2000 said:


> Elaborate ?? How do you know this is true? Gerry


Simple I don't see them. I checked before posting.


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## boylehome (Jul 16, 2004)

I viewed the contents of 240/250. What can congress do now to stop the courts decision? I can see that our legislators can revise or make legislation to make changes for the future. At least IMHO it is worth while to get legislators on the right track.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

It would be a good thing to separate "SV" from distants --- or otherwise modify the section where the injunction is mandated for violating the law.


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## Chris Walker (May 19, 2004)

Maybe Dish is turning off "questionable" accounts where it's not clear if that customer should be recieving distants or not. Possibly to look better to Congress or the courts?


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## Chris Walker (May 19, 2004)

Steve H said:


> Mine are gone also!!!!! It looks like Dish has know for a while that this was going to be the day. They have a recorded message playing on 250 urging Distant users to contact their congressman.


Have you called Dish and asked for an explanation? Are you currently subscribing to your locals?


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## Shellback X 23 (Sep 19, 2004)

5:30 pm CT. Still getting LiL and DNS. Maybe I still have mine since I have a valid RV waiver. 

I beleive Ch. 240 & 250 were only turned on for thoes who qualified but didn't subscribe to LiL's. I think I got them because I was on road to new service address for the winter and had not turned them on yet since I was out of the spotbeam on Oct. 1st. I got my LiL starting yesterday when I entered the spotbeam.

Also I got a live person call from Dish yesterday telling me I would lose my DNS Dec. 1st.


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## mhowie (Sep 30, 2006)

Shellback X 23 said:


> I beleive Ch. 240 & 250 were only turned on for thoes who qualified but didn't subscribe to LiL's.


I have LiL and DSNs and both ch. 240 and 250 are turned on for me.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

Chris Walker said:


> Have you called Dish and asked for an explanation? Are you currently subscribing to your locals?


I have had waviers forever for the distants. My "locals" (350 miles from that city) are included as part of my Platinium package.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

I just called Dish and was told the EVERYBODY will loose their distant locals within a few days. For some reason the CS rep claimed that the shut off is being done by area. From what I have read I sure can't see any truth to that.

Question, what are/is LiL?


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Steve H said:


> Question, what are/is LiL?


LIL is Local Into Local, aka you receive your local stations via satellite.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

RAD said:


> LIL is Local Into Local, aka you receive your local stations via satellite.


Thank You..............that is how I receve our locals and any TV for that matter.........we do not have OTA or cable where I live.


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## LJR (Nov 2, 2005)

I just found mine gone!

There goes DVRing all my shows...I had to catch some from the West Coast when two were on at the same time.

This sucks! :soapbox:


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## cj9788 (May 14, 2003)

Sat guys has reported that the shut down is random and on going untill the last dns sub gets shut off on or befor 12/1/2006.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

Shellback X 23 said:


> I beleive Ch. 240 & 250 were only turned on for thoes who qualified but didn't subscribe to LiL's.


I thought that at the start of Oct when I didn't get 240/250, but I do subscribe to both Distant and LiL and 240/250 SEEM to be a recent appearance. They weren't there about 3 weeks ago but I see them today so that would rule out "didn't subscribe to LiL's".

I'm curious what people see in Daily Schedule for 241-248 Timers. I assume they just disappear so you don't know what would have recorded. Do you now write down the Timers to recreate them on LiL channels with similar priority? It gets even more complicated when you have "backup timers" for the same "New episodes" on a different channel. The numerical priority doesn't win - the order that the Timer is created wins and I'm not sure how to duplicate a few timers.

I get the national PBS free - it is included with distants. When 241-247 go poof, has anybody found 249 still standing?


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## dlp85x (Mar 19, 2004)

CABill said:


> I'm curious what people see in Daily Schedule for 241-248 Timers. I assume they just disappear so you don't know what would have recorded. Do you now write down the Timers to recreate them on LiL channels with similar priority? It gets even more complicated when you have "backup timers" for the same "New episodes" on a different channel. The numerical priority doesn't win - the order that the Timer is created wins and I'm not sure how to duplicate a few timers.


This isn't exactly the same thing, but I had my distant nets in a custom favorites EPG guide, one for all of the FOX stations I got, and then another with the NBCs I got (KNBC-LA, and the two carried in my LiL package, WRC & WHAG) ... and found that once the DNS was gone, only my local FOX and the two local NBCs shown in each respective guide. I'd suspect that any trace of the DNS stations would simply be removed once the order to 'kill' is sent from E*. But I don't have a fancy receiver with a DVR, HD or anything ... I simply have a 311. Things might get more complicated with the absence of the channel with the higher-up receivers.


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## colavsfaninnwia (Jan 25, 2006)

I have a valid FOX waiver, I still have my FOX DNS as well as my LiL channels.


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## dishrich (Apr 23, 2002)

CABill said:


> I thought that at the start of Oct when I didn't get 240/250, but I do subscribe to both Distant and LiL and 240/250 SEEM to be a recent appearance. They weren't there about 3 weeks ago but I see them today so that would rule out "didn't subscribe to LiL's".


I'm in the same boat as you. While everyone else was talking about getting 240/250, they NEVER made an appearance in my guide. I know that I checked this as recently as over a week ago.

Well today, after I saw all the posts about the shutoffs, I came home at lunch, so that I could set some timers on my D* & Replay DVR's, for shows that I normally DVR on NY & LA. Well, when I went to turn on my 721, it would ONLY give me a pop-up that said "aquiring sat data". I though OH CRAP, it's happening & I tried to reboot it.

After playing around with it for about 10 minutes, it FINALLY came back up & I had 240/250 in my guide, but I STILL had NY/LA distants & still have them this evening.



> I get the national PBS free - it is included with distants. When 241-247 go poof, has anybody found 249 still standing?


Most others say PBS will NOT be affected, but since E* always included it w/distant net packages at NO extra cost, I wonder if it does stay around, what they plan on charging for it? But actually, if you DO get a LIL package, we really are NOT even supposed to be getting the distant PBS feed, so I suspect we'll (at least you & me) be loosing it as well.


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## John R. Metzger (Apr 24, 2002)

Distants are gone but 249 (PBS National) remains for me.


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## Darkman (Apr 16, 2002)

cj9788 said:


> Sat guys has reported that the shut down is random and on going untill the last dns sub gets shut off on or befor 12/1/2006.


Yup .. Scott reported there that he "had the opportunity to speak one on one today to Charlie Ergen, the CEO of Echostar Communications / Dish Network"

And "when asked Charlie about the reports of some members getting their distant networks shut off as of today", Charlie "confirmed that they have begun the shutoff process, and said it is being done randomly, and the last customers will be shut off on or by the December 1st deadline."


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## dishrich (Apr 23, 2002)

John R. Metzger said:


> Distants are gone but 249 (PBS National) remains for me.


Do you have "real" locals activated on your account?


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## pinchhitter (Jul 17, 2004)

Still have my Atlanta, Denver, NY, LA and Chicago distants here as of 10:01 PM Pacific time


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## Ohioankev (Jan 19, 2006)

Well i'm sure glad that Suddenlink Cable is coming to hook me up on November 6th. It's going to be great to have HBO, Cinemax, Showtime, and Starz on Demand again with two DVR units. I still have my distant locals by the way. Also the only signal i get OTA is a Grade B NBC, which is the only distant i don't have.

Also DISH better be giving out pro-rated credit because i refuse to pay for distant local feeds $9.00 if my distant locals are gone. (for service between 10-19 - 11-19 as i'm on the AT&T billing cycle) 

It's a sad country when you have to subscribe to DISH and Cable.. i'm quite upset especially if i miss Vanished, The Simpsons, Family Guy, The War at Home, and American Dad Friday and Sunday Night.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

John R. Metzger said:


> Distants are gone but 249 (PBS National) remains for me.


PBS was never part of the distants network offerings. I believe only ABC, CBS, FOX, and NBC were.


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## jrbdmb (Sep 5, 2002)

BTW, PBS National was thrown in for free with a set of DNS, but you will be charged $1.50/month when your DNS is removed. (I cancelled the PBS National this morning, never watch it).


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

jrbdmb said:


> BTW, PBS National was thrown in for free with a set of DNS, but you will be charged $1.50/month when your DNS is removed. (I cancelled the PBS National this morning, never watch it).


When you login to My Account at the DISH website, do you see anything in Recent Activity under Manage my Bill? If so, can you post same?

The Address broker obviously no longer shows distant stuff, but PBS was always a "may be included, please phone ..." item. I THINK you always had to pay the $1.50 if you didn't qualify for all 4 of the networks or some similar condition. There were even some users that qualified for all 4 distants, but still didn't get National PBS for free (and couldne't even get it for $1.50).

Under that old program where the first package is $5.99 and $3 for each package you added, I'm curious how they adjust since they are already paid for in the current billing cycle.


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## dbconsultant (Sep 13, 2005)

CABill said:


> Under that old program where the first package is $5.99 and $3 for each package you added, I'm curious how they adjust since they are already paid for in the current billing cycle.


I still have my LA & NY as of last night. I have an RV Waiver which I guess doesn't mean much at this point. With people starting to be shut down already, I had the same question as CABill - are they going to provide a refund automatically or will we have to call? I realize that 8.99 isn't much but I'm not paying for something that I'm not getting.

Hopefully, Dish automatically credits accounts because I'm sure they don't want all of those phone calls either. It would cost them as much or more in labor costs to answer, explain and fix as it would to just simply do the credit. I checked my account on-line but don't see anything other than the statement that I just paid. If they were smart, they would have sent out notices before they started shutting the channels off informing folks that they would get a pro-rated refund.


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## jrbdmb (Sep 5, 2002)

CABill said:


> When you login to My Account at the DISH website, do you see anything in Recent Activity under Manage my Bill? If so, can you post same?


 11/01 11/01 ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, PBS 11/01 TO 11/22 -4.38 
11/01 11/01 PBS NETWORK 11/01 TO 11/22 1.09

So the DNS with PBS was replaced with PBS only. I almost never watch the National PBS, so like I said I dropped it today.


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## dbconsultant (Sep 13, 2005)

jrbdmb said:


> 11/01 11/01 ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, PBS 11/01 TO 11/22 -4.38
> 11/01 11/01 PBS NETWORK 11/01 TO 11/22 1.09
> 
> So the DNS with PBS was replaced with PBS only. I almost never watch the National PBS, so like I said I dropped it today.


Good to see they are doing the pro-rated refund automatically. I'll be watching online when mine get shut off.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

dbconsultant said:


> I realize that 8.99 isn't much but I'm not paying for something that I'm not getting.


It it would seem that your whole $8.99 would go away with NY & LA. jrbdmb got credit for 22/30ths of $5.99 (odd penny on both numbers) but I've got this bad feeling I'll get 22/30ths of $3 for canceling the same programming. The NY distants were in the package long before I replaced LA with LiL, but I bet the package doesn't decrease by $5.99 to leave LiL and Supers for the remaining $6.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

jrbdmb said:


> So the DNS with PBS was replaced with PBS only. I almost never watch the National PBS, so like I said I dropped it today.


Thanks for posting the activity! When you dropped PBS, they didn't even suggest that a downgrade $5 might apply did they?


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## minnow (Apr 26, 2002)

If E* is thinking (and I find that harder and harder to believe as each day passes), they'd be very smart to treat us disinfranchised subscribers very gently. People are going to be mighty upset when they call in to find out what happened to their distants and I imagine it would take one dipwad CSR to start talking about a five dollar downgrade fee to find out the customer cancels the entire account.


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## dbconsultant (Sep 13, 2005)

CABill said:


> It it would seem that your whole $8.99 would go away with NY & LA. jrbdmb got credit for 22/30ths of $5.99 (odd penny on both numbers) but I've got this bad feeling I'll get 22/30ths of $3 for canceling the same programming. The NY distants were in the package long before I replaced LA with LiL, but I bet the package doesn't decrease by $5.99 to leave LiL and Supers for the remaining $6.


So if I have the HD Gold Package, do you know what they will charge for just my normal locals? I don't see a separate charge for my locals right now but they may be combined with the distants since I selected LA and NY and my locals are LA. I think I may be confused!


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

dbconsultant said:


> So if I have the HD Gold Package, do you know what they will charge for just my normal locals? I don't see a separate charge for my locals right now but they may be combined with the distants since I selected LA and NY and my locals are LA. I think I may be confused!


The line item on your bill for HD Gold should tell you if it includes locals now for $5. It is $69.99 by itself and $74.99 w/ locals. May not apply to you, but someone that just had NY & LA before may now be getting locals for free for the rest of 2006.

Locals are only $5 when combined with a monthly package (DishFAMILY ... HD Plat). They are $5.99 by themselves. In the old package where you could pick 2 or three from Distants, Locals, or Supers, the 1st pick was $5.99 and the next one or two were $3 each. Last I checked, if you pay for ATxx annually, it can't include locals so you end up paying $5.99 for them. People that have Distants or Superstations that signed up after they closed that grandfathered package pay $5.99 for each. I GUESS that your $8.99 is $5.99 for East and $3 for West distants on that old package. That's why I assumed it would disappear. ASS-U-ME is never the best pick!


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## dbconsultant (Sep 13, 2005)

CABill said:


> The line item on your bill for HD Gold should tell you if it includes locals now for $5. It is $69.99 by itself and $74.99 w/ locals. May not apply to you, but someone that just had NY & LA before may now be getting locals for free for the rest of 2006.
> 
> Locals are only $5 when combined with a monthly package (DishFAMILY ... HD Plat). They are $5.99 by themselves. In the old package where you could pick 2 or three from Distants, Locals, or Supers, the 1st pick was $5.99 and the next one or two were $3 each. Last I checked, if you pay for ATxx annually, it can't include locals so you end up paying $5.99 for them. People that have Distants or Superstations that signed up after they closed that grandfathered package pay $5.99 for each. I GUESS that your $8.99 is $5.99 for East and $3 for West distants on that old package. That's why I assumed it would disappear. ASS-U-ME is never the best pick!


Thanks CABill, I checked my previous statement and it was 69.99 so I will wait and see if I end up losing all locals including lil's or if they just tack on $5 or if I end up getting lil's free for the rest of the year. At least I haven't been paying for lil's AND locals AND distants!


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## Pete K. (Apr 23, 2002)

One of my Senators (Georgia) sent a response within hours after I wrote:

Dear Mr.(last name)

Thank you for contacting me regarding distant network channels. I appreciate hearing from you.
As you may be aware, in June 2006, the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB) won a U.S. Court of Appeals ruling that would prevent EchoStar's DISH Network from transmitting distant network signals to its satellite broadcasters.

The ruling, which favored local affiliates of ABC, CBS, NBC, and FOX networks, acknowledged an earlier verdict by the 11th Circuit Court that prohibited EchoStar from carrying distant network broadcasts - typically from New York and Los Angeles - to areas without local channels by the satellite provider.

The court found that EchoStar illegally provided distant network signals to as many as 630,000 ineligible homes. EchoStar's actions were in violation of copyright protections for television stations outlined in the Satellite Home Viewer Improvement Act (SHVIA) of 1999.

I certainly understand consumers' desire to receive distant network channels. These channels not only provide news and emergency information, they are often the only channels that can be received in remote and rural locations. While there is currently no legislation pending before the U.S. Senate regarding distant network channels, you can rest assured that I will continue to monitor the situation so as to best accommodate Georgians who subscribe to satellite television.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact me. As always, I appreciate hearing from my constituents. Please do not hesitate to contact me if I can be of assistance to you in the future. In the meantime, if you would like to receive timely e-mail alerts regarding the latest congressional actions and my weekly e-newsletter, please sign up via my web site at: www.chambliss.senate.gov .

Very truly yours,
Saxby Chambliss
United States Senate


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## jimborst (Jun 13, 2006)

I get locals from Sioux City, IA, and still getting ABC, NBC and Fox DNS. I also get both 240 & 250 so it's not just those that don't have locals.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

dbconsultant said:


> At least I haven't been paying for lil's AND locals AND distants!


I don't get down south that much and I'd assumed you were in the San Diego DMA - making both NY and LA be "distants". I think the San Diego DMA has part of Riverside and LA DMA has part of Riverside. If you get LA HD locals via sat, part of your $8.99 is locals and part is NY distants - putting us in the same boat. When NY goes poof, my bet is that our bills decrease by $3. You'll be left with just locals at $5.99 and you would be better off to bail on that grandfathered combo package and save the $.99 by including locals with your HD Gold. I'll still have locals and superstations and an annual AT60 so I'd save staying with the combo package. All theory though.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

Does anyone that has lost their SD distant locals still have their HD distant locals?


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## Chris Walker (May 19, 2004)

Sent another e-mail to my local rep and called her a few minutes ago and left a message. I will call again tomorrow if I do not hear back before then. Keep the calls coming everyone!


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

Chris Walker said:


> Sent another e-mail to my local rep and called her a few minutes ago and left a message. I will call again tomorrow if I do not hear back before then. Keep the calls coming everyone!


How do you get a "local rep"? I called the regular Dish number last night and the person at the other end of the line sounded like they were in a call center in India. That is the first time I have called Dish and gotten someone that didn't speak English very well.


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## Chris Walker (May 19, 2004)

Steve H said:


> How do you get a "local rep"? I called the regular Dish number last night and the person at the other end of the line sounded like they were in a call center in India. That is the first time I have called Dish and gotten someone that didn't speak English very well.


I am referring to my local Congress rep. You can reach that person by calling 1-202-224-3121. Call and call often.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

I just found this on the Dish web site, strange that they are "advertising" distant locals still................

"LOCAL CHANNELS 
Get 100% crystal clear Local or Distant Local Network channels like ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX, and more! more> "


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## mhowie (Sep 30, 2006)

Just lost them... 8:30pm EST. Saw it happen.

Update-- just signed up for the "Dish it Up" upgrade... a 625 receiver is scheduled to be installed Saturday. If successful, I should have a chance to watch a show and tape another simultaneously... just trying to overcome the limitations related to "timeshifting" brought about by the loss of the distants.


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## SkyBluffLady (Nov 3, 2006)

Dish VP DeFranco's message says some "under very limited circumstances" will not be affected. Could he be talking about those of us with an RV waiver?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Follow the judge's ruling, no exceptions.


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## minnow (Apr 26, 2002)

SkyBluffLady said:


> Dish VP DeFranco's message says some "under very limited circumstances" will not be affected. Could he be talking about those of us with an RV waiver?


Probably meant Charlie, Jim and some other high placed executives will still keep the distants under some "testing for signal stability" program.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

SkyBluffLady said:


> Dish VP DeFranco's message says some "under very limited circumstances" will not be affected. Could he be talking about those of us with an RV waiver?


Yea, Charlie, Jim and folks with pirate cards


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## Darkman (Apr 16, 2002)

haha.. that's a good one (made me laugh)


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## keppra808 (Oct 29, 2006)

i still have my distant network channel as of 5 27 hawaii time, and i have waviers and everything.


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## Chris Walker (May 19, 2004)

mhowie said:


> Just lost them... 8:30pm EST. Saw it happen.
> 
> Update-- just signed up for the "Dish it Up" upgrade... a 625 receiver is scheduled to be installed Saturday. If successful, I should have a chance to watch a show and tape another simultaneously... just trying to overcome the limitations related to "timeshifting" brought about by the loss of the distants.


If my distants end up getting cut off, this is the route I will have to go if I stick with Dish so I can timeshift network programming with my locals. How much did the 625 upgrade run you, and is it a pretty good receiver?


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## Chris Walker (May 19, 2004)

SkyBluffLady said:


> Dish VP DeFranco's message says some "under very limited circumstances" will not be affected. Could he be talking about those of us with an RV waiver?


They are using different wording depending on where the information is coming from. We just recieved an e-mail from Dish stating "we may no longer be able to provide you with some distant network channels beginning 12/1". I like the "may" and "some" better than "can't".


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## mhowie (Sep 30, 2006)

Chris Walker said:


> If my distants end up getting cut off, this is the route I will have to go if I stick with Dish so I can timeshift network programming with my locals. How much did the 625 upgrade run you, and is it a pretty good receiver?


Your distants will be cut off shortly. I was charged $69 for the 625 "upgrade". I don't know how the receiver is from a quality or performance standpoint but it was the only partial solution I could think of to expand the opportunity to catch primetime programming with only one set of network signals from which to draw.


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## JohnH (Apr 22, 2002)

Steve H said:


> Does anyone that has lost their SD distant locals still have their HD distant locals?


I hope you are referring to CBS HD East and/or West. There are not any others.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

JohnH said:


> I hope you are referring to CBS HD East and/or West. There are not any others.


Yes that is what I'm asking about.


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## minnow (Apr 26, 2002)

From what I am reading the other forum, those with CBS HD had their DNS turned off but the HD feed remains.


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## minnow (Apr 26, 2002)

keppra808 said:


> i still have my distant network channel as of 5 27 hawaii time, and i have waviers and everything.


Your waivers now mean nothing. WIthin the the next 3 weeks, you will lose DNS just like all the rest of us.


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## jrbdmb (Sep 5, 2002)

Has anybody lost Significantly Viewed (SV) channels yet? Here and there I read very authoritative-sounding posts :gott: stating that when DNS goes, SV must go as well. However, I have not lost my SV stations (yet), and none of the press releases have specifically mentioned SV.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

jrbdmb said:


> Has anybody lost Significantly Viewed (SV) channels yet? Here and there I read very authoritative-sounding posts :gott: stating that when DNS goes, SV must go as well. However, I have not lost my SV stations (yet), and none of the press releases have specifically mentioned SV.


SV's were not ordered stopped in the Fl decision. So I see no reason to expect that, even though authorization to carry them may have come from the same bills.

Usually these are stations that people in those areas CAN pickup with the right antenna, and are not distants.


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## keppra808 (Oct 29, 2006)

I am not going to be mad when my distant goes, i am just going to enter in my old house address in california, then i can still enjoy west coast feed, screw dish


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## keppra808 (Oct 29, 2006)

thats what the internet is for...right, too do personal online business, with no interaction with any csr


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## Greg Bimson (May 5, 2003)

Dish Network will be prohibited from using the 17 USC 119 license, for retransmitting networks for ABC, CBS, FOX and NBC.

The 17 USC 119 license controls:
1) Distant networks, both analog an digital;
2) Significantly-viewed channels; and
3) superstations.


tnsprin said:


> SV's were not ordered stopped in the Fl decision. So I see no reason to expect that, even though authorization to carry them may have come from the same bills.


That is the problem. It isn't only the same bills, it is the same license. And, the way that the license is written, local-into-local is the 17 USC 122 license, while signifcantly-viewed is the 17 USC 119 license we refer to as the distant license.

The SV channels will go away with the injunction. If the agreement with CBS for their "HD" or "digital feed" is a blanket waiver for the O&O stations, then CBS in HD will also go away with the injunction.

Superstations are fine because none of the superstations are a network affiliate of the big four.


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## ggw2000 (Dec 22, 2003)

Greg Bimson said:


> Dish Network will be prohibited from using the 17 USC 119 license, for retransmitting networks for ABC, CBS, FOX and NBC.
> 
> The 17 USC 119 license controls:
> 1) Distant networks, both analog an digital;
> ...


According to the conversation that Scott (at satelliteguys) had with Charlie the other day, Charlie says that CBS-HD is not going away. Whether this is fact remains to be seen. SV seems to have not been brought up in that conversation (wish it was) so I have no idea other than as you state they are under the same license as networks. I don't remember the judge only stating the "big" 4 of the mentioned license but I believe it was the whole license which as you say includes SV channnels. Gerry

ps: Greg- thanks for all your informative posts "over there" in the past in keeping everyone up to date on this situation.


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## keppra808 (Oct 29, 2006)

i have a question, is there a way to have both hawaii local package and los angeles package


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## Greg Bimson (May 5, 2003)

keppra808 said:


> i have a question, is there a way to have both hawaii local package and los angeles package


No.


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## Steve H (May 15, 2006)

keppra808 said:


> i have a question, is there a way to have both hawaii local package and los angeles package


Yes, have two houses, one in Hawaii and one in LA........................two accounts


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## keppra808 (Oct 29, 2006)

Is dish network stoned, on crack, or ice?????

1. obeyed the law
2. i have waivers for ny and la
3. i have hawaii locals w/ distant network

And is the FCC full of **** also

1. Can I receive television broadcast channels on my satellite system?
There are different ways in which satellite subscribers can get television broadcast channels and your ability to receive a particular station primarily depends on several factors that are governed by legislation enacted in 1999 and in 2004. Both the Satellite Home Viewer Improvement Act of 1999 (“SHVIA” or “1999 statute”) and the Satellite Home Viewer Extension and Reauthorization Act of 2004 (“SHVERA” or “2004 statute”) affect the manner in which satellite television subscribers can receive television broadcast signals via satellite. SHVIA permits satellite companies to provide local broadcast TV signals to subscribers who reside in the local TV station’s market, commonly referred to as "local-into-local" service. SHVIA also permits satellite companies to provide "distant" network broadcast stations to eligible satellite subscribers. SHVERA modifies SHVIA primarily with respect to the way in which “distant” television station signals can be offered to satellite television subscribers. SHVERA also expands the programming available to subscribers by allowing satellite companies to offer certain “significantly viewed” distant signals.


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## BigFella (Jul 13, 2004)

keppra808 - I understand your frustration (I share your pain) but it looks like you may need to catch up on your reading on the subject. I suggest you start here http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=67857


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

keppra808 said:


> Is dish network stoned, on crack, or ice?????


No, but *THEY* violated the law and as of December 1st are no longer permitted to provide distants to ANYONE --- including you!


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## DBSJedi (Mar 25, 2002)

I sense I will lose my distant FOX5 and FOX11 channels shortly. I received an automated message on my cell phone today indicating the same thing that the email from Dish Netork the day before indicated - "enjoy the free locals, unfortunately distants will probably go bye bye". It was fun while it lasted. I have moved three times since my first being waivered for distant and only altered the billing address, so as to not affect programming. 

I have been a loyal Dish Network customer for 8 years now and they have never offered me an upgrade I didn't have to shell out for. The new 622 DVR sounds great, but I am not sure my current dish and multi-switches are up to the task. Will Dish front the cost for the hardware to allow me to use a 622? I know there is a 'Dish'n it up' upgrade forthe receiver, but what about dish hardware? Right now I just have a basic basic receiver and a Dishplayer 7100 with a Dish 500 system and two SW-21 switches. I would like to retain the Dishplayer and replace the basic receiver with the 622, but I don't have enough lines for dual-tuning on the 622. Will Dish make the necessary hardware upgrades 'free of charge' to allow this configuration or would I need to buy all new hardware myself? It might make more sense for me to cancel entirely and have my wife order at our new address (the billing address) in her maiden name to get all new hardware. What is the general concensus on sticking with Dish, but getting into the 21st century hardware?


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## BigFella (Jul 13, 2004)

DBSJedi - I would encourage you to call Dish. I believe they will provide you with a 622, switch, any necessary cabling and install all for $199 lease upgrade. With the proper switch and LNB, you'll only need one cable going from the switch to the new dual tuner receiver. 

DP7100 - wow! I had one of the first to come out a long time ago, and suffered through until I gave it up and traded for a 501. I now have two 622's and a 721 (one cable going to each dual tuner receiver). Try a 622... you'll kick yourself for not doing so a long time ago. 

BTW - User #60? You've been around for a while haven't you?


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## DBSJedi (Mar 25, 2002)

Yep.. been around a long time , just don't get to check in much. 

I'm still partial to my dinosaur Dishplayer 7100. I'm used to computers that randomly act weird and the 7100 was no different, so it fits right in.  The last couple years though it has run very solid. Dish finally got the software right. Of course I took it apart and modded in a removeable harddrive tray and extract the shows I record to my PCs to author DVDs. It's the original version of pocket-dish (pocket the harddrive, plug into identical harddrive tray in computer, boot-up, extract, author DVD, replace harddrive in receiver, boot up receiver, repeat every month.. it's a ritual). I do like not being subject to a $5/month DVR recording fee, but it would be really nice to record HD from premium channels to timeshift (currently I can only do that with HD tuner cards in my PCs for local over-the-air HDTV). I'm not sure I can get rid of the basic receiver because my wife uses it and it is hooked to my series 1 TiVo that has been running since fall of 2000 (won it at tivo.com and eventually paid lifetime service on it). 

I bought a house and am crafting a den area where I want to add a second HDTV, so I guess what I would like to do is add a 622 for the new TV for my den, retain the basic basic receiver for my wife and the TiVo and keep the Dishplayer doing what it is doing for timeshifting/vehicle for DVD creation and watching in the bedroom. Do you think Dish could accomodate adding the 622 with whatever hardware upgrades are necessary? I'll need 3 lines, right?.. one for Dishplayer, one for basic receiver and one for Vip622?

My thought is that they will remove the 3 distant network channels I pay $4.50/month for and there's no need for me to retain the free locals currently being shown, so if I can get a Vip622 and only add $5.50 to my bill, it'll be quite affordable and allow me to watch some non-network HD in my new den.


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## BigFella (Jul 13, 2004)

DBSJedi said:


> Do you think Dish could accomodate adding the 622 with whatever hardware upgrades are necessary? I'll need 3 lines, right?.. one for Dishplayer, one for basic receiver and one for Vip622?
> 
> My thought is that they will remove the 3 distant network channels I pay $4.50/month for and there's no need for me to retain the free locals currently being shown, so if I can get a Vip622 and only add $5.50 to my bill, it'll be quite affordable and allow me to watch some non-network HD in my new den.


Yes, one line to the 622 provided they give you Dish Pro Plus switch and LNB. If they don't want to give you the switch, they'll run the second cable to the 622 as part of the install.

The 622 lease fee is 6.00 and the DVR fee is 5.98, so your net increase will be 7.48 per month after subtracting the 4.50. You might want to rethink losing the local nets though - if you're at all like me, most of the HD you'll watch is network television (and I have the HD Gold package). I would probably also put the 622 wherever I watch the most TV. The convenience of the dual tuners can't be beat and couple that with HD, you've got a real winning combination - especially since you'll no longer be able to time-shift.


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## DBSJedi (Mar 25, 2002)

Cool if they can cover the hardware changes on the dish side of it. I wasn't planning to keep the Lil's as they only offer standard def here in Lex and I already timeshift my local network television HD OTA thanks to a MyHD MDP-120 HD card in my main PC and a Fusion 5 Lite HD tuner card in a secondary PC. They've got me covered for local HD. I even built a quiet media PC running Media Portal to act as a gateway between the two machines that can capture in my computer room and the TV downstairs. I had to wire the house with cat5 for high bandwidth transfer. The Media Portal software makes it easier for the family to point and click at the media PC to queue up any programming I capture around the house. The only HD local I can't pick up is the CW. Now that I think about it, I don't really need superstations package on Dish as I can get CW standard def from the .2 sub off my CBS station. If I lob that off my package too (Dish charges me $6/month for it) I can totally get a vip622 and my bill will stay pretty much the same and it looks like with the 622 I can set one output to the new HDTV and run the other up to the second bedroom? 

By the way thanks for your input.. helped me think through things. 
I have enjoyed FOX5 all these years. The news is MUCH better than the local news in my area (I'm from NY originally). I'll miss it unless I rig up an old PC with a cap card and a streaming app to send to my brother to serve that content from NY online (It's possible.. I have seen it done and quality isn't as bad as you may think). WPIX in NY is staying with Superstations package, right?


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## BigFella (Jul 13, 2004)

Wow, you've got quite the whole house video/media setup there. I've dabbled a little with HTPC but with out much luck because I have zero OTA - even with a CM 4228 antenna and CM 7777 amp. I have distributed TV2 from my downstairs 622 throughout the house however, so your second bedroom shouldn't be a problem. Heck if you've got decent Digital OTA in your area, hook an antenna up to your 622. You'll be able to easily DVR not only Dish stuff, but OTA as well via manual timers (no EPG data of OTA signals if you don't subscribe to Dish locals).

Re: your bro in NY, have you considered swapping Slingboxes with him? If you each have one, he can watch Lex and you can watch NY (quid pro quo). Of course, if he's not interested in Lex, maybe he'll host a Slingbox if you send it to him - there's no monthly fee BTW. I've set one up at my house so I can view Dish, analog (basic) cable and a security camera when I'm on the road or at work (break times of course ;-))

Superstations aren't going away AFAIK.


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## kstuart (Apr 25, 2002)

Please be aware that there is at least one person in this forum who actively "opposes" Dish Network and will answer any and every question in a way that is most negative to them. This could be due to one or more of:

- He owns a DirecTV system, and thus emotionally justifies his choice as "better" because he bought it. I see this constantly - Toyota vs Honda, PC vs Mac, Sony vs Panasonic, and on and on.
- He previously owned Dish Network, and had a bad experience - as statistically happens with all technology - defective product, bad customer rep, etc.
- He has a mental image of the successful and competent authority figure, that is the opposite of Charlie Ergen. This usually accounts for 90% of the opposition to EchoStar (and probably even contributed to the Judge's decision). Many people hate Ergen, because he gives the appearance of being an unsophisticated "bumpkin"and many people have a huge emotional investment in the idea that authority stems from "sophistication". The fact that Ergen is now worth several billion dollars, and that Dish Network over the years has provided a TV experience to customers that at least equals most other large providers, is even more subconsciously irritating to these people.

These are the reasons that people still persist in spending hundreds of hours of their life posting about a satellite provider that they don't subscribe to. (And, as I mentioned, about cars, computers and TV's that they don't own and so on.)


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## SteveinDanville (Jun 26, 2002)

Still have my distants, knock on wood.


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## Ohioankev (Jan 19, 2006)

SteveinDanville said:


> Still have my distants, knock on wood.


I still have my distants too, however if they go i'll slowly downgrade my dish to non-existant. It won't matter however if i lose locals tomorrow because Suddenlink is coming to hook up the cable. If Dish somehow pulls off a miracle the equivlant of Jesus turning water to wine then i'll probably cancel cable within a few months, however if not, i'll probably ride out the rest of my 9 month commitment and see if i can't downgrade to the top 60, or dish family (I only want colours for the Funimation Channel block) However i'm really going to hate the DVR from the cable company. It has less features, video/voice goes out of synch sometimes, 80 hours compared to dish networks 100 hours on the 625 but on the otherhand cables VOD is way better than what DISH can offer right now (excluding homezone). I'm just glad my distants held off till after FOX Sunday could record.

I'm one of the ones DISH hooked up NBC illegally to in 1998 by the way, so yeah they broke the law. They used to coach you how you should answer the question. (You should answer no to question 2) However, they've stopped long ago since the waivers thing came into effect. Everyone knows the only reason DirecTv got a settlement is because murdoch owns it. I'll never give that company my business, just like i'll never give TiVo my business.


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