# Should I upgrade my 508 to a 721? Why not?



## Guest (Jul 14, 2004)

Hi,

Im toying with the idea of switching to the 721 from my existing 508... i guess there is an upgrade promo for $249?

Anyways- are there any major issues with the 721 I should be aware of before thinking about this? Bugs, usability, etc? It seems like the UI is pretty slick compared to the 508.

Thanks!


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## Ron Barry (Dec 10, 2002)

Well Lava Man this has been discussed a few times before. I suggest you do a search and you will find a number of threads discussing this question. I upgraded from a 508 to a 721 and I am very happy. Yes there are some difference.. 

1) Font size is smaller. If you love the large 508 font you will dislike the 721. 
2) Some clipping on screen with older TVs. I have seen this with mine.
3) Slow Motion jumps 3 seconds whe you start. Not as smooth as the 508 in some cases. This can be annoying if you need high level of granularity.
4) Box for me has been stable. I did notice something strange last night having to do with skipping 30 seconds and seeing a freeze. Maybe it was because I stated yesterday my box was stable and the BobH gremlins rushed over to my house. 
5) Two tuners rock. Very transparent.

I am sure there is more, but this should cover the top ones. Like I said. do a search and you will get all the info you should need to make the decision.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

I had a 510 (same as a 508, but larger hdd). Got a 721. No comparison. The 721 is way better. 
Better looking interface.
Easier to use menu.
Program info is displayed at the top of the guide, so no need to hit "info".
More rows at one time in the guide.
Two tuners is very nice. (Record two shows simultaneously. Record one, watch another. You can "pad" the start and end times of concurrent shows.) 
Much easier to setup a recording from the guide.
PiP.


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## Bob Haller (Mar 24, 2002)

Ahh my gremlins have been busy?

Well theres the $5 a month DVR fee unless you have the everything pack.

The 721 is great when it works but as everyone knows its not stable for ME


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## goughl (Jul 18, 2003)

I have the 501 and 721, love them both but ,do like the 721 better.


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

I bought a 508 in Jan. 04 and a 721 in April 04. I've been a subscriber since 1999. I use the 721 ALOT more than the 508 and am very happy with it. I agree with garypens comments above. I think the only downside I've seen that makes the 508 better is the reboot time. It takes several minutes to reboot the 721. This can happen if you have a power outage. If I lived in an area prone to this I would just buy a UPS so that I didn't lose the power, than you could manually shut it down until the power came back on. The larger HD is also nice. I think that $249 is a great price and who knows how long it will last. If you sell your 508, you can cut that cost down $100-$200.


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## DVDDAD (Dec 21, 2002)

If you do go for the 721, make sure you have Dish's extended service plan. I've had two 721's that have had Hard Drive Failure after a few months of service. Remember you'll need two coax runs to your 721 from your switch and also that 721's don't have fully functioning "Dish Home" feature yet. Other than that the 721 is much better than the 508 I have. And it functions similar to my $1000 921.


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

721 through E* usually comes with a 1 year warranty (double check). Than you can add the warranty if you want.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Bob Haller said:


> Well theres the $5 a month DVR fee unless you have the everything pack.


Wow! Dish charges you a $5 DVR fee for your 721? You finally have a legitimate 721 complaint!


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## Pepper (Mar 9, 2004)

garypen said:


> Wow! Dish charges you a $5 DVR fee for your 721? You finally have a legitimate 721 complaint!


maybe he meant that you get rid of the fee by switching from a 5xx to a 721, which is in fact the case.

The value of having two tuners, thus the ability to record 2 while watching a previously recorded item, or record one and watch something live, or use PIP, cannot be discounted. But there's also the need to run a 2nd feed from the downlink hardware which may be easy or difficult depending on how your wires are run now.


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

Pepper said:


> maybe he meant that you get rid of the fee by switching from a 5xx to a 721, which is in fact the case.


There was no monthly fee for either the 501, 508 or 721. 510 has one.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

You do not get the one year warranty on refurbished receivers, but only three months warranty on those instead. The one year warranty only applies to the new receivers.


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

Jacob S said:


> You do not get the one year warranty on refurbished receivers, but only three months warranty on those instead. The one year warranty only applies to the new receivers.


The current 721 promo is for new receivers, so he should be covered.


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## kmcnamara (Jan 30, 2004)

I upgraded to a 721 from a 501. No comparison. The 721 wins hands down. The only problem I've had is that on a handful of occasions, the 721 has stopped responding to a lot of the remote commands. I know a number of people have had this problem. A power button reboot fixed it each time. I like the interface better than the 501 and having the 2nd tuner is great. No more having to decide whether to cancel a recording or just watch as it records. One of the better $249 purchases I've made.


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## veith (Jul 31, 2003)

LavaMan said:


> Hi,
> 
> Im toying with the idea of switching to the 721 from my existing 508... i guess there is an upgrade promo for $249?
> 
> ...


When I first came in to Dish Network I really wanted a 721 for the obvious reason, dual tuners. One look at the price and I went for a 508 instead. I've been quite happy with the 508, but when the chance came to get a 721 installed for $249 I jumped at the chance.

Unlike most of the responders here, I'm actually ever so slightly disappointed. I think it is a highly individual decision revolving around your use pattern, among other things. For instance, having been initiated into the glories of pvr use, I found myself hardly ever watching live tv, so two tuners became less of an issue. Timer conflicts arose occasionally but for me personally it was no big deal. Also, frankly, I don't even watch tv that much at the moment so I am a light user.

Here are some points which for me personally, the 508 might actually be better. Keep in mind this is a situation where your mileage will most certainly vary a great deal.

1. The hard drive spins continuously. It never shuts down. Doing some searching it appears this is sop with the 721. Especially for a light user I think it's better to spin up only when in use or updating. There have been endless dialogs arguing whether it is better for hard drive longevity to keep it spinning or not. Apparently Echostar sides on spinning down since the 50X series do this.

2. The 721 runs much warmer than my 508 did. Presumably because the drive is always spinning? Also there are ventilation slots on one side of the case only. I really wish there were ventilation slots on top. Perhaps it is part of an overall controlled airflow design. The fan picks up air from the bottom, pushes over the internals, and out the other side. But the fan has never activated during normal use, only during reboots. This is probably actually a good thing, indicating temperature is within normal operating range, but it just runs too hot in my judgment.

3. I have two tv's. One is a 6 month old Sanyo fed by Supervideo. The bedroom tv is a 14 years old and fed with the channel 3 modulator. The 508 produced good pictures on either one. The 721 overscans a little with the new tv. The old one is really bad. Not only is there overscanning but a curious blooming when coming out of a menu or info screen. Also, Frasier looks great on the downsized pip, but after swapping he looks to have put on a LOT of weight. The picture becomes stretched sideways, rather like looking at a standard aspect ratio screen stretched to fill out a 16:9. The worst of these problems appear only on the old tv, but it still seems odd to me the 508 did not exhibit this behavior.

4. The 721 software appears to me to be considerably buggier than the 508. The 508 was far from perfect but was reasonable enough for me. On the other hand my 721 has experienced most of the numerous recently reported bugs. In fairness my 721 has been online for only a few days and I understand some of the bug and stability issues settle down after a period of time and a few reboots (some spontaneous, others not).

Oddly enough, after all that being said, I can see why most users give rave reviews. Especially for sports enthusiasts because of the pip, for heavy users, for those with a lot of hard to decide timer conflicts, and for those who might still actually want to watch live tv while something else is recording.

I don't fall into any of those categories but I suppose I'm rare in that regard. What could get me really enthused is if Echostar followed through on their original hype about being lan/internet ready. But I'm not holding my breath, even though the menu teases us with a nonfunctional internet subset.

Best regards,
Charles


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

veith said:


> 3. I have two tv's. One is a 6 month old Sanyo fed by Supervideo. The bedroom tv is a 14 years old and fed with the channel 3 modulator. The 508 produced good pictures on either one. The 721 overscans a little with the new tv. The old one is really bad. Not only is there overscanning but a curious blooming when coming out of a menu or info screen. Also, Frasier looks great on the downsized pip, but after swapping he looks to have put on a LOT of weight. The picture becomes stretched sideways, rather like looking at a standard aspect ratio screen stretched to fill out a 16:9. The worst of these problems appear only on the old tv, but it still seems odd to me the 508 did not exhibit this behavior.
> 
> 4. The 721 software appears to me to be considerably buggier than the 508. The 508 was far from perfect but was reasonable enough for me. On the other hand my 721 has experienced most of the numerous recently reported bugs. In fairness my 721 has been online for only a few days and I understand some of the bug and stability issues settle down after a period of time and a few reboots (some spontaneous, others not).


RE: 3 above) I have a 15 year old Sony 27" TV hooked to the 721. I have NOT experienced the problems discussed in 3 above. On the first two days I did have an issue with the left hand side of the EPG getting cut a bit, but I could clearly read it. For whatever reason, that is no longer a problem. I rarely use the PIP two watch two things at once, so PIP is really just a novelty. I like the 721 because of the ability to tape one thing and watch another or two tape two things at once at the same location PLUS be able to watch a previously recorded item at the same time.

RE: 4 above) I have experienced minimal bugs on the 721 - limited to the commonly reported remote problem (reboot required) and to a couple of timers NOT firing. These problems are infrequent and the features of the 721 over the 508 far outweigh the problems for me.

On a personal note I'm not sure why you (Charles) were interested in the 721 if you aren't interested in multiple tuners and don't watch much TV. In that case the 508 is definately sufficient for your needs.


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## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

The additional tuners really helps me to be able to schedule programs two at a time to avoid conflicts. This makes my scheduling of events so much more flexible and also allows me to watch live tv as another show is recording or have PIP functionality.


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## veith (Jul 31, 2003)

finniganps said:


> RE: 3 above) I have a 15 year old Sony 27" TV hooked to the 721. I have NOT experienced the problems discussed in 3 above. On the first two days I did have an issue with the left hand side of the EPG getting cut a bit, but I could clearly read it. For whatever reason, that is no longer a problem. I rarely use the PIP two watch two things at once, so PIP is really just a novelty. I like the 721 because of the ability to tape one thing and watch another or two tape two things at once at the same location PLUS be able to watch a previously recorded item at the same time.
> 
> RE: 4 above) I have experienced minimal bugs on the 721 - limited to the commonly reported remote problem (reboot required) and to a couple of timers NOT firing. These problems are infrequent and the features of the 721 over the 508 far outweigh the problems for me.
> 
> On a personal note I'm not sure why you (Charles) were interested in the 721 if you aren't interested in multiple tuners and don't watch much TV. In that case the 508 is definately sufficient for your needs.


I'm glad you had better luck with your old tv than I did, and that you didn't have as many initial bug problems as I have.

Yes, I'm asking myself at the moment why I wanted the 721 given my use patterns also. To be fair I don't think I would be asking myself this at all had everything gone swimmingly with the 721. I simply would have written another rave review. Mind you, I AM happy with my 721, just not quite as happy as I thought I would be, and tried to answer the original poster's question as honestly as possible.

I think I was so excited to get one because it is such a good deal, is what I originally wanted, and read a lot of rave reviews. I also watched more tv a year ago than now but didn't really stop long enough to think about how reduced it's been lately. And certainly I liked the idea of having a spare pvr with no guide fees as a backup.

I apologize if the tone of the post was negative, it really wasn't intended that way. I suspect in time I'll become even more enamored of my 721 than my 508.

Best regards,
Charles


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## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

veith said:


> I think I was so excited to get one because it is such a good deal, is what I originally wanted, and read a lot of rave reviews. I also watched more tv a year ago than now but didn't really stop long enough to think about how reduced it's been lately. And certainly I liked the idea of having a spare pvr with no guide fees as a backup.
> 
> I apologize if the tone of the post was negative, it really wasn't intended that way. I suspect in time I'll become even more enamored of my 721 than my 508.


For me the 721 is really about convenience. The two tuners are very convenient if you watch a fair amount of television. Yes there are other differences from the 508 (EPG, PIP, recording defaults, larger HD, etc.), but the 721's biggest advantage over the 508 is the dual tuners IMO.

I didn't take offense to your remarks and hopefully you didn't take offense to mine. I think we're both offering opinions on the 721 for a user who is contemplating buying a 721. Sharing opinions/experiences is what most of us are trying to do here. I just wanted to add my comments to give a more balanced evaluation - I think most of us come here to get a balanced opinion and I wanted the user to be more fully informed before he decided.

I like the 721, but I don't think everyone needs one - it depends on what you want in your TV experience.


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## veith (Jul 31, 2003)

finniganps said:


> For me the 721 is really about convenience. The two tuners are very convenient if you watch a fair amount of television. Yes there are other differences from the 508 (EPG, PIP, recording defaults, larger HD, etc.), but the 721's biggest advantage over the 508 is the dual tuners IMO.
> 
> I didn't take offense to your remarks and hopefully you didn't take offense to mine. I think we're both offering opinions on the 721 for a user who is contemplating buying a 721. Sharing opinions/experiences is what most of us are trying to do here. I just wanted to add my comments to give a more balanced evaluation - I think most of us come here to get a balanced opinion and I wanted the user to be more fully informed before he decided.
> 
> I like the 721, but I don't think everyone needs one - it depends on what you want in your TV experience.


Agreed.

And true to form, the most annoying problems (overscanning and picture blooming on my older tv, remote nonresponse, etc.) have fixed themselves over the first few days. It's truly strange. I read about this before but it's still weird. Just like magic.

The trivial problems remain (such as delayed sound after pause, 3 second skip on slo-mo, etc.) but are quite tolerable in view of the advantages of two tuners, which to my surprise, is turning out to be extremely desirable (more on the lines of what I originally envisioned a year ago).

I have seen the light! Count me as another convert!

Happy viewing,
Charles


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## DBSJedi (Mar 25, 2002)

Does the 721 incur an additional $5/month in addition to the $5/month DVR fee? I guess I am wondering if this receiver is considered like 2 receivers since it can record two separate channels simultaneously. I just have a Dish 500 with two dual LNBs and two switches.. one SW21 going to my old 2700 receiver (with SA S1 TiVo) and the other SW21 going to my Dishplayer 7100. Would I need an SW64 to add more than 2 receivers to my Dish? If I added a 721 to my plan the additional two connectors on the SW64 would be occupied entirely by the 721, so that would max me out again, right?


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## garypen (Feb 1, 2004)

No DVR fee.
Also, if you get it from Dish at the promo price, it'll include whatever switches and LNB's you need. Sounds like a simple DP Quad is what you'll need. No more switches.


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