# OFFICIAL PVR-721 REVIEW THREAD



## Scott Greczkowski

Ok folks I am happy to report that the Exclusive DBStalk.COM PVR 721 Review is ONLINE!

CLICK HERE FOR THE REVIEW!

I still have a few things to add but for the most part everything's there!

Feel free to ask your 721 questions here and I will do my best to answer them for you!

_(Please note I will be away from my computer most of the day on Sunday)_

I wish to thank Mark from DishDepot.COM for helping me obtain the 721 unit. If you do order a 721 from Dish Depot please tell them you saw the review here on DBStalk.COM!

I would also like to thank the folks from Echostar, who called me a few times checking if I had any questions about the 721 that they could answer!

Enjoy the review, I look forward to any questions or comments you may have.

Scott


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## John Corn

Thanks a bunch for the review Scott !! :righton:

Are you pleased with the 721 up to this point?
During all this and up till now, did the 721 ever lock up or hang?

Great job on the video portion of the review as well!!!!!!


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## Mark Holtz

Here's what I've noticed:

Clicking on the next page link opens up a new window. Oops.

At http://www.dbstalk.com/review/menus.htm , clicking on the bottom link "Click here for 721 games", gets a 404 error at http://www.dbstalk.com/review/games.htm . You could have put in a placeholder page saying "Coming soon".

Also, how about some close-up shots of both the front and back panels as well as the remote?


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## Scott Greczkowski

> Are you pleased with the 721 up to this point?
> During all this and up till now, did the 721 ever lock up or hang?


Am I pleased? Check the overview for my feelings on it.  Yes the 721 did hand before the fix was put into place. But now its solid like a rock!



> Also, how about some close-up shots of both the front and back panels as well as the remote?


I am working on the games one now. 
I have tried a few times taking a pic of the remote but it keeps coming out all out of focus.

Scott


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## John Corn

Sorry about that.....I didn't go back and look what you added to review, I see your overall thoughts now.

It was great to hear up to this point there were no major bugs. :righton:

I'm very excited to get mine now.


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## Kevin

Good review, Scott. Thanks!


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## LarryH

Scott,

Thanks for the great review. I hope my 721 ships soon! Do you know of any 501 features that didn't make it into the 721? (one feature that I didn't hear you talk about was commercial skip)

Thanks,
Larry


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## Scott Greczkowski

Commercial Skip is there (But I don't use it because some idiot from AOL/Time Warner says I am stealing by skipping commercials) 

The Games page is up now.


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## Karl Foster

Great review, Scott.

I'm glad to see E* put out a solid (at least for now) PVR for their subs. You guys deserve it after putting up with the DP and 501. BTW, the guide looks almost exactly like the UTV guide.


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## Guest

Thanks for the review Scott, sounds like it maybe a good product after all.

One would hope they will make it easier in a future upgrade to switch between tuners and folders would be nice on it too. I wish my DTIVO had folders as have 120gig in it and it gets quite cluttered.


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## Dmitriy

Thanks Scott!!! Great Review!! :goodjob:


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## Chaos

Does it have support for the 129 satellite for Philly locals?


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## Scott Greczkowski

It does not appear that it supports 129 as of yet, on the Point Dish screen there is only listings for 61.5, 110, 119 and 148.


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## SParker

wow nice review! It almost makes me want to buy one. But I have other priorities right now. I think I will wait and see what the 921 brings to the table. Because by then I might want to go HDTV.


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## kelliot

I'd be really interested in seeing if there was anyway of fooling the tuner until I can support extra LNBs. Otherwise, I'll have to wait until the 921 is available.


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## STXJim

Scott,
I'm amazed!
That is an excellent presentation that you put together. 
Very professional. 
I'm glad to hear you talk so favorable of the 721.
I hate to say this; but I had nothing but praise for my DP7200 when it was new. It was sometime before the bugs started biting me.
I sure hope that E* got their act together for this one. 
I really would like to own one.
Thanks for being 'my' beta-tester. 
Jim


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## Mark Holtz

On the games screen, that's not Tux the Linux Pengiun, but D.Mon the FreeBSD Daemon.


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## marshalk

Thanks Scott, keep the info flowing. I sure hope your longer term impressions match up with the first blush which sounds great. The ability to switch between tuners, a'la channel recall would be a great feature if they can just add it via software. 

Have you tried a learning ir remote with it, such as a pronto or similar?

thanks again...marshal


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## Scott Greczkowski

Marshal,

My 3900 remote (which is IR) works great with the 721. So I think its safe to say that any learning remote will work fine with the 721.


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## Guest

Great review, Scott. I have a couple questions... How much does it cost and when will it be available?


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## Scott Greczkowski

The cost is $549 (cough too high... Cough too high)

And they are available now, dealers should be receiving better quanaties in the next week or two.

While I think the cost IS high, I am still very happy that I have one.


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## Bill D

Brian, the 721 costs $550 and dealers (like dish depot have begun shipping them now), if you were to order today it may be few weeks.


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## Rick P

Scott...

could you try an experiement??

1 - find 3 short programs in a row on the same channel
2 - set each one to record as a seperate event
3 - set each one to start 1 minute early and 3 minutes long
4 - see how each program looks when played back
(ie. each program should be COMPLETE with 1 and 3 minute
segments duplicated on each program)

Reason - to see if it's smart enought to switch tuners for serial recordings on the same channel.

Objective - Program Marathon recordings without having to set
"x"hour long events manually to not lose the program segments
when the events 'switch'.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Rick, I will try that tonight.

I have a feeling it will work as I did it last night with battlebots. Both shows recorded and bth stared 1 min early, and ran 3 min late.


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## Guest

This may seem stupid but I really hate the fact that it is silver. I can only hope that maybe an option in black will appear in the future.


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## John Corn

I thought the samething Swamp, I'm actually starting to like it now.  The 721 will actually match my TV, my Sony Wega is silver.


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## LarryH

Scott,

Another question: Did the 721 ship with the USB-to-Ethernet adapter that will be required when they add Internet support to the 721? Any mention of the IR keyboard (availability/price)?

Thanks,
Larry Hufty


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## Swampthing

Um... who's Swamp??


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## Rick P

> _Originally posted by swamp _
> *This may seem stupid but I really hate the fact that it is silver. I can only hope that maybe an option in black will appear in the future. *


A one words solution to that... "Krylon"


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## Guest

Since Starband and Dish have gone there separate ways will the 721 still be able to use starband when it becomes internt ready


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## The Old Wizard

Great review Scott. I have posted a link to your review in Dishplayer X.

My only problem with the 721, is the way you have to change tuners. I hope they change that in a future upgrade. Maybe something more like how the DirecTivo does with just pushing one button. 

Does it come with a keyboard? They made a big deal at CES about that NEW keyboard. If not, is there any mention to cost, & where to get it?


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## markh

Didn't I see that the first batch of 721s were intended for dealer showrooms and not customers? Since they already gave it an update it sounded to me like they wanted dealers to work out the initial problems. Have fun with your 721, Scott. It really is good to hear that it's working OK.


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## Nick

Just wondering if the DP keyboard would work on the 721???


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## UpOnTheMountain

Great Review Scott,

One of the main things I was looking for ...
was ...

How do they implement the Timers Screen?

The 501 is quite frustrating on this topic.

Anyway you can snapshot the timers screen for us?


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## Scott Greczkowski

Rick I tried recording 3 programs from the sae channel last night all in a row and all 3 recordings came out fine. It automaticly switched between tuners with NO PROBLEM.

Huftyl, No the 721 does not come with the USB ethernet adapter.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Wizard, 

The platinum keyboard will be avilable for sale once Internet connectivity is available. 

I almost got brave and was going to try pluging in my Microsoft USB keyboard to it, but then chicekned out. 

UpOnTheMountain.
I will try to take a picture of the timer screen, it will be sometime tommorow before I can do it. 

(It's my first anniversary today and I got to keep wifey happy so I can have a second anniversary.)


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## Steve Mehs

Scott, this is more a personal question, was there anything that you expected the 721 to do or not do that is does or does not do? (did I say that right  )


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## Corey140

Scott, is anyway we can download the video to watch? Its pretty hard to watch the video because frames are dropping ( i have cable modem) and the voice over and video just isn't matching up. It would be greatly apprecaited if I could just download it...
thanks


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## marshalk

Scott, happy anniversary. tv/dbs/av/etc is fun but...


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## Scott Greczkowski

Hi again,

I have placed the videos online for Download.

The 56k Video is 1.5 MB and you can download it by CLICKING HERE

The broadband version is also available for download this size of this file is close to 7 MB in size (The video is much clearer then the 56k version) You can download it by Clicking Here

Enjoy!


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## Scott Greczkowski

Steve, It does everything I expected of it, and it does everything that is mentioned in the manual. All features work as advertised!

I wasn't expecting the games so that was a suprise. Although I am surprised that the 721 does not have OpenTV, I kind of expected that it would be on the unit.

Back to the picnic.  (BTW everyone likes my DBStalk shirt and hat.)


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## Guest

Scott, Great review! Can you lock shows recorded on the PVR? Thanks


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## Corey140

Thanks, Scott


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## Randy_B

Great info. Very helpful! Big question for me, issue that makes me nuts with the 501, does the 721 sort the timers by day, frequency or channel AND have some of the program info included? The DP timer screen is very nice, easy to read and figure out what you have. The 501 gets very jumbled and difficult at times to find a timer.

Thanks again for the report.


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## Guest

Scott, Very Nice Review. I was very impressed.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Whitecoats, Yes you can lock shows from being deleted. Also it asks you are you sure you want to delete a program beofre you delete it. (My wife is gonna love that feature! She is always accidently deleting shows from the dishplayer. 

Randy the timer screens DO need some work, they are jumbled here as well. I would like to see a seperate timer screen and recorded shows screen that would help eliminate a lot of the confusion.


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## kyoo

What does the 721 do when you have a weekly recording scheduled, and you want to record a show one time that conflicts with it? Does it make you delete the weekly timer and re-add it after the one-time program is over? (Like the 501)


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## Scott Greczkowski

Kyoo it uses the other tuner.  This way no conflict.


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## Guest

BUT, what if you want to watch live satellite too?


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## Scott Greczkowski

Then your out of luck.  And its time to invest in a 3 tuner system. But then you will probably want to record 3 shows and watch live tv as well, so maybe you will need a 4 tuner system...

Hmm if you think about it you will probably need 100 tuner system to be on the safe side. 

(I think I just heard every Echostar tech scream at the idea of a 100 tuner system)


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## Guest

Scott, what I ment to say was if you are watching live satellite what will happen as asked by kyoo ?


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## Scott Greczkowski

A blinking clock (nice color clock too) will appear on the screen 5 minutes before the recording will start, if you press the info button it will tell you whats going to happen and why, it give you options to record as scheduled or keep watching live tv.

I found this Info Button help by mistake last night when I was looking for info on the show I was watching while the clock was blinking on the bottom left of the screen. 

And BTW if you do hit the info on the clock and select and option the blinking clock will then go away.

Its nice.


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## Chris Blount

Scott,

If it's anything like the 501, if you hit cancel the blinking clock will stop.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Yup pressing Cancel works fine too. 

I just found a problem that I did not see earlier.

I just hooked the 721 up to my TV in my bedroom (up untill then the only thing the 721 was hooked up to was my computers TV tuner card.

On the TV tuner card I could see the top of all the 721 screens, however on my TV the graphics are cut off on the top. Yet however the TV programs are not cut off. 

Kind of annoying, there should be a position screens option like the Dishplayer and my 6000 have.


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## Guest

are you using the rf out or are you going line out to a modulator ? plus, have you checked the 2 line level outs to see if they have the same output. on the 5000 one of them will not show caller ID.


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## Scott Greczkowski

I am using line output directly to the television. I have not checked both outputs to see if this problem is on both outputs.

Again this problem is only on the Graphics that the 721 generates the TV programs themselves are not cut off.

I will take a picture of the TV in the morning with my Digital camera to show you better what I mean.


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## kyoo

anyone know of people beginning to hack the PVR721's Linux capabilities? 

What happens when you slap the PVR's harddrive into another linux box and try to mount the filesystem?

Any PCI slots on the main board in the PVR721?

Scott, care to grab some digital photos of the inside for us?

Someone will probably set up a PVR721 hacking website.. or is there one already?


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## Scott Greczkowski

Sorry Kyoo, while I would like to tinker with the 721 I don't want a $549 paperweight


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## STXJim

Scott,
Can you search the EPG for a program by typing in a name or title like the DP?


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## Scott Greczkowski

Yes Jim, search is just like the Dishplayer but faster


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## Karl Foster

They need to give you a keyboard now. It makes searching sooo much easier, especially if you are searching for a long title. It also makes a good secondary remote if you lose the main one like I do about once a week. Have you tried hooking up a USB keyboard yet?


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## DDRio

The 501 accepts titles of only 15 characters long. No need for keyboard! But I don't know how many characters you can enter on the 721 before is full.


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## Scott Greczkowski

I have not tried hooking a USB keyboard up to it yet, I am sure I will try it over the next few days to see what it does.


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## Scott Greczkowski

*ODDITY ALERT*

I won't call it a bug (yet) but last night I had a show set to record at Midnight, I had another show set to record at 1am and another at 2:30 am.

When I woke up this morning, I went to my PVR list to find none of my shows recorded from last night except the show at Midnight which it says was still recording (it was only a half hour show) I selected the start over button on the PVR screen then pressed stop, when I went back to the PVR screen all my shows from last night were now there (phew) and the Midnight show was its correct length.

I am begining to not like the 3 min default that is added to the time of the show, I am starting to think that feature should be defaulted to OFF instead of on. I was recording 2 shows at the same time yesterday and wanted to record a third show when one was over but could not because of the 3 min extended recording time.

Annother Oddity that I have found is that when the clock starts blinking and you press the Info Button it says something to the effect of "The Scheduled Recording of "Batman" is about to start"
The problem here is that Batman is the show which is currently airing and "I love lucy" is the show I want to record, because the recordings start 1 min early, this info screen shows the name of the show which is currently airing instead of the one you want to record.

Both of these are very minor glitches in my book and in no way has effected the actual performance of the 721.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Here let's kill two bird with one stone. 

Here is a shot of the Timer Screen from the 721, this photo it taken off of my Bedroom 27 Inch RCA Television. Notice that the top of the screen is cut off. However when watching a live TV show the screen does not appear to be cut off.


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## cnsf

Excellent review Scott!!!!

If only they'd update the 501s/508s with the single tuner aspects of the interface....


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## cnsf

Is there a screen position adjustment?


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## Scott Greczkowski

I have been through the menus and see no screen position adjustment.


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## cnsf

Maybe you should try it on another TV and see what happens.


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## Guest

Is there a slow mo? Are all the menu's fast? Does it record by show, or is there a season pass type option so it won't miss time changes (a must have IMO)


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## Scott Greczkowski

There is no slo mo or frame by frame advance on the 721, that I have found.

The menus are really fast.

No season pass feature it seems like the 721 is the same as the 501 in this regards, where it is Time Based Recording instead of Program based recording.


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## Kagato

I wouldn't be suprised if the program based recording violates Tivo's or Replay's patents. Although Dish does have a history of beating down various patent suits, i.e. Gemstar.

The linux is a nice touch. The fact that they included lbreakout means they installed SDL in the package. SDL is a set of UI/GFX libs for Linux (as well as other ported systems including windows). You can use several programming languages to create GFX, including C, Perl, TCL, etc. 

It's an interesting way of doing things. Where as with Tivo there was a lot custom programing for the UI. Assuming you mount the HD and add programs (which is a really big IF), the use of SDL means easy access to the on screen GUI. Something that was never possible with Tivo because the myworld program was totally closed. 

I'd like to see what's under the hood here. x86, PowerPC, MIPS, etc.

Still, my feeling is that Dish most likely had to change some GPL component in order to release this box. So their is a lingering GPL complience issue that they will have to face at some point. Of course Tivo had a similar problem in the begining, although they were quick to release effected sources when confronted with the problem.


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## STXJim

Scott,
Here in the VI we have to use two 1.8CM dish to receive AT150.
One dish for each sat. Therefore I only aim at 119 for AT100.
My question:
Which sat does the EPG come from? If the 9 day guide comes from 110 would I be able to get a (any) guide from 119 and if so how long would it be.
If you don't know the answer to this question is there any way you could experiment one night and find out for me.
It would cost me at least $500 to install a second dish just to be able to receive the EPG. 
Many thanks if you can help me on this one.
Jim


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## Scott Greczkowski

Welcome Kagato :hi:

I really would love to rip the cover of this baby and play around but again, I don't want to $549 paperweight. 

I am starting to think that the price is high just to keep people from trying to hack at it, the boot screens look so basic that it looks extremely possible to play around in it. But again I won't take that gamble. 

I just notice that the review has been slashdotted!

http://slashdot.org/articles/02/06/29/2139250.shtml?tid=129


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## Scott Greczkowski

Jim the 501 and 721 use the same guide data, do you know anyone there who has a 501? That might better give you an answer. 

If anyone watching from Echostar knows the answer to this please email me and I will pass the info on.


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## Scott Greczkowski

I notice some reviews are starting to go online at CNET.

http://electronics.cnet.com/electronics/0-6342371-1318-8365569.html?tag=uo-thanks

Scott


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## Nick

_"Here in the VI we have to use two 1.8CM dish to receive AT150."_

1.8 cm? Jim, that is a very small disc,
especially for the VI.

Did you possibly mean 1.8m?

Nickster


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## kcwh

Kagato, the processor is a Geode from National Semiconductor. See the following link for more info:

http://www.national.com/news/item/0,1735,720,00.html

Bill


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## Scott Greczkowski

I understand that the processor is running at 300 Mhz. (Don't remember where I read that though)

It gets the job done!


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## Randy_B

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Here is a shot of the Timer Screen from the 721, this photo it taken off of my Bedroom 27 Inch RCA Television. Notice that the top of the screen is cut off. However when watching a live TV show the screen does not appear to be cut off. *


You're right. The list does order like the 501. A jumble a times, I have played around with it trying to figure out how it orders them and couldn't. It appears to have no logic in it. Not even order of entry. Hopefully this is in works to fix now, for both 501 and 721.

Thanks for your patience as well. Reading this thread, we are all like a bunch of kids with a million questions.:lol:


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## Scott Greczkowski

No problem Randy,

I am here to answer all questions. As soon as a question is posted my pager goes off and I come and answer the questions as soon as I can (of course there are sometimes when the page gets shut off) 

Scott


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## SteveinDanville

Scott-great job with the information! Can you give a screen shot or anecdotally share with us what the list of recorded events looks like? Is it by name, and if it is by name, if it was a recording that started 1 minute early, will it have the wrong name for the event?


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## Scott Greczkowski

The recorded event look like the Programmed timer screen (infact it is the same screen) The shows recorded are listed on the top while the programmed timers are in the bottom.

The correct name is shown for the program recorded. It does not show the name of the show for the 1 min early recording.

Scott


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## SteveinDanville

Does it show a date of recording, as if you had six weekly events of "E.R." all recorded, for example, would you know the sequence?


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## Scott Greczkowski

Heres a funny one to share with you guys.

I was just going through my Digital Camera and noticed this show from when I first got my 721 on Friday.

I noticed that the 721 had a small piece of blue tape covering up some words on the front of the box, so I removed the tape.

Heres is what a found.










Who knows Internet access on the 721 may be available sooner then we thought  (Or it could be longer then we thought as well)


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## Scott Greczkowski

Steve I will take a picture of it tonight for ya and will put it online for you to see. 

Thanks for visiting DBStalk.COM!


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## STXJim

> _Originally posted by Nick _
> *"Here in the VI we have to use two 1.8CM dish to receive AT150."
> 
> 1.8 cm? Jim, that is a very small disc,
> especially for the VI.
> 
> Did you possibly mean 1.8m?
> 
> *


Nick, 
You are right it is a 1.8m dish.
It should have been 1.8m CM dish. 
CM = Channel Master.


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## SParker

would Dish Depot let me trade in a 3700 and a 2700? I doubt I will though I really don't have any money except plastic and I should wait for the 921.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Call them and ask Sparker! Worse they can say is no. And don't forget to mention DBStalk.COM when you call.


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## Randy_B

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *The recorded event look like the Programmed timer screen (infact it is the same screen) The shows recorded are listed on the top while the programmed timers are in the bottom.
> 
> The correct name is shown for the program recorded. It does not show the name of the show for the 1 min early recording.
> 
> Scott *


Sounds like the DP rather the 501. personally, I like the way the DP has it all on screen and then scrolling down (when you get to the bottom if you left key over, it jumps the cursor up to the PIP screen to go back to live). I will have to double check this, but I believe that (sometimes!!) the 501 picks up the name of the program at the end of the record to label th event. So if you go 3 minutes pastthe program on the 501, it will have the name of the show that was on during the 3 minute overlap.

My wife has a 2 hr timer set up everyday to record All My Children and One Life to Live. 3-4 days of the week, the event is labled as One Life to Live. The other day it is called All My Children. Occassionally it will have 3 or more days with the AMC label. Spurious at best, nop idea why it does this.


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## MarkA

I just saw this thread. I think DISH will be sued for violating GPL (not releasing their modifications to GPL licensed source including Linux). I also would like to know how it reacts to a USB keyboard and mouse (it does have USB, right?)


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## Scott Greczkowski

It does have USB (2 ports)

the GPL issue is being Discussed on Slashdot.

It should be interesting to see how this issue develops.


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## Kagato

Although I like slashdot, most of the posts there are people talking out their a**. Dish isn't going to get sued. Someone talked to some level 1 helpdesk goonie and now they take it as cannon that Dish is going to withhold GPL stuff. *Rolls Eyes*

In looking a little closer Dish might not have to do anything with GPL code. Depending on how much leg work they took from National Semiconduction they may find that all the mods for the Geode have already been released. Besides, Tivo had the exact same problem, they put source online, and have treated the mod community well. No one will give this a thought after a while.

Two Questions:

One) If you put the 721 on a music channel and play lBreakout does it attempt to write the song title stuff? Or does it leave the background black?

Two) If I put my order in at DishDepot on 5/31, how much longer will I have to wait to get my grumbie hands on this thing!


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## Scott Greczkowski

Hmm havent tried that Kagato, I like that the screen saver does not kick in on the music channels as the song title graphics "float" around the screen.

Mark said last week that it would be about 3 weeks to fill them all.


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## Kagato

I'm just trying to get a sense of how far back I am in line. A few days, a week, or two, etc.

Three things could happen with the Lbreakout and the musak:

1) The Title stuff doesn't kick in and you can play with out a distracting background.

2) The Title stuff does kick in causing somewhat of a distraction.

3) The Title stuff does kick in causing the box to crash.

Obviously number 1 is best...


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## kstuart

Scott - do you own a 501 or have you used one since the P153 upgrade ? Other than the cosmetics of the Interface, it seems very much like 2 501s in a box with a PIP feature. The ONLY two things that are missing on the 501 is the "End ___ minutes late" feature, and the program information for timers.

Also, any indication of OpenTV (ie do you have either channel 100 or channel 9500)?

PS To Randy_B - the 501 uses the program information from the longest program in the recording. So, if you go 1 minute early and 3 minutes late, it still gets the program information of the one hour program you were recording.


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## DDRio

STXJim:

you will get the standard 46 hours EPG data if you only have one dish pointed @ 119W.

The data for the 9-day EPG is at 110W.


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## Dmitriy

Scott, can you take some pictures of the box it self? Front, back, top, and bottom. I just want to look at the design. I hope this is not too much too ask, sorry for any inconvenience.

Thanks
Dmitriy


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## Guest

can you take/do you have any shots of the back of the actual unit? some front shots as well would be nice.

At a decent resolution too heh.


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## Guest

I have a 6x4 switch installed to receive programming from 110, 119, 61.5. I've heard about new "pro" switches for the 301, 501, and 721, are they neccesary for the 721 function or can I use my existing switch?


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## Scott Greczkowski

No Kstuart, I do not have a 501, I have played around with them a lot though. 

No there is no open TV on the 721.

I will try taking some pics of the unit tommorow, my wife is already sleeping and the 721 is all hooked up (the 721 is in my bedroom)

Justdaved you can use your existing switch.


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## Guest

You can use legacy LNB's. The 721 will use both.


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## HTguy

> _Originally posted by justdaved _
> *I have a 6x4 switch installed to receive programming from 110, 119, 61.5. I've heard about new "pro" switches for the 301, 501, and 721, are they neccesary for the 721 function or can I use my existing switch? *


DishPro receivers, like the PVR721, are "backwards compatible" with regular hardware so you will have no problem w/a SW-64.


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## Guest

kagato,
I would have to agree with you about the GPL(and slashdot). Checking on the Geode processor it looks to be an x86 compliant architecture. So it will probably run with a standard linux kernel out of the box(no GPL violations needed). The rest of the software tools used to make the 721 are just that tools. Just b/c you compile something with GCC doesn't mean it has the gcc licence. I will be curious how long it is before someone does the leg work (e.g. feeling lucky on google).
http://www.national.com/news/item/0,1735,660,00.html

--Robert


----------



## STXJim

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *
> the 721 is all hooked up (the 721 is in my bedroom)
> *


Scott,
I hope that this isn't a personal question, but...
Why isn't your 721 hooked up in your viewing room???
I hate to say it but if it was bedtime...I'd kiss my wife good night and keep on playing with it for a little while longer. 
Hey; I got a new 721!
Uh-oh...I almost forgot....You guys are still on your honeymoon.
Happy Anniversary! 
Jim


----------



## Randy_B

kstuart, her timer was built off of AMC and just modified, extending the time 1 hr (starts noon ends at 2pm). Equal time for both shows. It always says recording AMC, on the PVR screen, while the event is going on and 75% of the time when it completes, it immediately chages the name of the recording, but not every time. Works fine, just kinda strange on this.


----------



## MrPete

I don't seem to recall if anybody asked this, but how quiet is the unit?

Also, go ahead and take a picture of the 721 in the bedroom. Don't forget to get the wife in the shot too!!


----------



## BobaBird

nexex,

Back panel photo (dishretailer.com)


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

MrPete,

The unit is REALLY quiet! The only time I heard the hard drive on the 721 is when I first plugged it in.

Thanks for the picture link BobaBird, it means I don't have to take my 721 all appart to do it. 

Speaking of pictures I took picture of the PVR listings screens last night as requested however I forgot my camera at home (and my Digital film reader is here in my office)

I found a neat feature last night by mistake. If you are watching a show that you really like and you want to know when its being reaired, press the # button on the remote which automaticly searches for the show you are watching! (COOL!)

I also got to test Dolby Digital recording last night and I am happy to say the Dolby Digital works well. I like the special retractible cap on the SPDIF input in the 721, There is no removable dust cap to remove, just push your SPDIF Optical cable and the doors open up letting you plug in the SPDIF port.

Scott


----------



## MarkA

Have you tried a USB HID mouse and keyboard?!?!?!? You really have to


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Nope have not tried that yet, I do plan to though, it will be handy when doing searches then using the on screen keyboard. 

It will also make LBreakout a lot easier to play as the response time playing with the remote is not to great.

I actually downloaded Lbreakout (there is a Windows port of it) and it runs well on my PC and is actually a really cool game!


----------



## BobLafleur

I wouldn't worry about trying to hook up USB devices... Don't think you can hurt anything by doing so. USB is just a serial interface, so really nothing to "blow".

Maybe someday it will be possible to add HD recording space via USB drives!

So if you record two consecutive shows on the same channel and use the "start early" and "end late" options, both tuners are used? So if you want to records TWO sets of consecutive shows on the same channel and use the start/end options, you can't? How about if you DON'T use the start/end options, then can you?

- Bob


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> While watching Live TV, how do you switch from one tuner to the other? Do you have to go to PIP in order to swap tuners? DirecTivo uses the "down arrow" and UTV has a dedicated button, as far as I know.


Welcome Bob, it's good to see you here! :hi:

You need to go into PIP mode then you can switch to the second tuner, then you can turn pip off.

If you record two consecutive shows then it will used both tuners if you have the start early and start late options turned on (which are tuned on by default)



> So if you want to records TWO sets of consecutive shows on the same channel and use the start/end options, you can't?


 You can unless your second tuner is recording something else, if this is the case you will get a conflict screen.



> How about if you DON'T use the start/end options, then can you?


Yes then it works fine. It all depends on what you are doing with the other tuner. 

Sounds confusing but it really isn't they just need to give a options to turn to show padding options OFF by default.


----------



## SteveinDanville

Scott-
"Steve I will take a picture of it tonight for ya and will put it online for you to see. " Referring to the list of recorded events. Can't wait to see what it looks like...
Steve


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I took a picture of it last night for ya Steve, I just forgot to bring my Digital camera with me to the office today (my Digital film reader is here)

Sorry about that.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Just to let everyone know who have not seen it, I have placed my In Depth review of the 721 online.

Enjoy!

Any questions ask them here!

Thanks for Visiting DBStalk.COM!


----------



## SParker

probably a dumb question but can you record on the fly without timers? I mean just hit the record button? Also if you are recording 2 programs at once can you watch one of the programs that you are recording?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Sparker

Yes hit the record button and it will give you the option to end recording at the end of the show or end recording when you press the stop button.


----------



## John Corn

More Info..... 

Thanks Scott, the added info will be helpful when I get mine and first set it up.


----------



## SParker

oh one more thing do you know what the dimensions of the unit are?


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## Scott Greczkowski

I have a DVD player and a VCR and the 721 is the same size as they are. I don't have exact demensions.

Scott


----------



## LarryH

> _Originally posted by SParker _
> *oh one more thing do you know what the dimensions of the unit are? *


The 721 PDF that was floating around listed the dimensions as:

Size: W: 16" D: 13-1/4" H: 3-1/2"


----------



## SParker

That sounds about right as the 501 is supposidly 3.1"H. Wow this is very tempting. I called DISH Depot and they would take 2 trade-in's for the 721. So in essense it would be $489. I could take the 301 I just bought and move it to the living room or my dad's room. Hrmmm decision's decision's!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Can someone answer a question for me, on an Ultimate TV or DirectTivo unit how do you go about switching between tuners on them?

On the 721 you need to go into PIP first before you can switch tuners.

How is it on the DirecTivo? And do you loose your buffer when you switch between switching tuners?


----------



## Swampthing

Hmmmm... taking that thought a bit further, if the USB ports allow you to add an additional portable USB hard drive for additional recording space, I wonder if you could transfer all your recorded programs to the portable USB hard drive and bring them to your computer. It would be a nice way to pull the programs record them to CD or DVD for archival purposes, depending of course, if the format is hackable or not.


----------



## MarkA

Like Bob said, you almost certainly can't destroy your 721 hooking up a USB HID keyboard and mouse, and unless the 721 puts out more voltage than USB says, it's almost impossible to damage them either. It's quite likely DISH (intentionally) didn't put HID device support in the kernel, so it won't work.


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Can someone answer a question for me, on an Ultimate TV or DirectTivo unit how do you go about switching between tuners on them?
> 
> On the 721 you need to go into PIP first before you can switch tuners.
> 
> How is it on the DirecTivo? And do you loose your buffer when you switch between switching tuners? *


You have several choices with the Directivo when switching tuners. Easiest is just to hit the "down" arrow - that will toggle between them so long as a menu item is not up.

Otherwise, when you call up a program description, there is a toggle icon you can select to jump between tuners.

And yes, the Directivo continues to buffer BOTH tuners when selecting between them.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks Eric! I was wondering how that was done.


----------



## MrPete

On the 501, while watching a live show, you can press pause and rewind to the beginning of the show (or some other point) and press REC to record from that point on. 
Can you do that on the 721? 
Will it also display an option to record from the new (rewound) point to the end of the show?


----------



## Craig Fogus

On that same note, what I'd really like to know is can you set it to shut off after recording the current show after rewinding it? That's one of the things that I'd like to see with my 501. I can go into the guide and hit record, but you cannot rewind it to the beginning and record it so that it will shut off afterwards.


----------



## MrPete

Hmmm, just thought of another thing.
When archiving to tape  can you tell the 721 to play a series of shows back to back?
That way, you can start recording before you go to sleep and it will be done by the time you wake up.


----------



## Jacob S

I remember Dish talking about using the unit in the past for use with Starband as well or maybe a unit in the future. Maybe they delayed the product to take that feature out of it due to the fact that they did go their seperate ways.


----------



## Tony S

> _Originally posted by Craig Fogus _
> *On that same note, what I'd really like to know is can you set it to shut off after recording the current show after rewinding it? That's one of the things that I'd like to see with my 501. I can go into the guide and hit record, but you cannot rewind it to the beginning and record it so that it will shut off afterwards. *


Yes Craig you can do that with the 501. Here's how:

Rewind to the point where you want to start.
Press Pause.
Press the Browser button (the Right arrow).
Then press the Record button.

This will make the 501 stop at the end of the show!

BTW Scott, thanks for the great review and all the information!!! :hi:


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Yes Mr Pete,

It does all of those things. Check out the PVR pictures and you will some of this stuff in action. Its also featured on the video. 

Scott


----------



## Craig Fogus

> _Originally posted by Tony S _
> *
> 
> Yes Craig you can do that with the 501. Here's how:
> 
> Rewind to the point where you want to start.
> Press Pause.
> Press the Browser button (the Right arrow).
> Then press the Record button.
> 
> This will make the 501 stop at the end of the show!
> 
> BTW Scott, thanks for the great review and all the information!!! :hi: *


Sweet! How do you guys know all this cool stuff!! Thanks a lot!
:goodjob:


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

That's what were here for Craig!

We help our members get the most from their satellite systems.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Well folks I just tried hooking up my Microsoft USB keyboard up to my 721.

And it appears that USB support is not enabled as of yet. (It woulf not even light up the keyboard lights)

I also tried using my old Dishplayer keyboard with the 721, no response from the 721 no matter which key was pressed.


----------



## Jacob S

Is there a way one can write software to the receiver to allow it to do that and other things?


----------



## waxdonuts

Scott,

Have you tried recording a PPV Movie yet? What I am specifically interested in is:

- Does it record the Dolby Digital sound track?
- Will it record Dolby Digital 5.1 or just Dolby Digital 2.0?
- Is Dolby Digital 5.1 even available on Dish Network? (I'm not a subscriber yet.)
- Can you record a PPV, protect it, and watch it multiple times?

Thanks!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Waxdonuts,

I have recorded Dolby Digital 5.1 off of HBO with no problems.  (My Dishplayer always choked on this)

Yes Dolby Digital is available on a handfull of Dish Network channels.

Yes you can record a PPV and watch it as much as you want.


----------



## Randy_B

> _Originally posted by Eric _
> *And yes, the Directivo continues to buffer BOTH tuners when selecting between them. *


NOW that is really sweet! Hopefully 721 will do that.

So Scott, the 721 lets you select multiple events for simultaneous playback? That awesome as well.

My new question. One of the things that is really handy soemtimes on the DP is the ability to "jump back" into the program at the end of the play, once you get the finished text screen. On the 501, once you get text, you have to restart and FF all the way to end. EVry once in a while something in th ecredits catches my eye and by the time I try to skip back it has fully finished.

Can the 721 skip back from the end of play text screen? Small detail, but as I said, very handy on occassion.


----------



## STXJim

Scott,
Two questions.
Did you experiense any Dolby Digital audio drop outs. Also please pay attention to drop outs for a follow up question about them.
Second; lets say that HBO has been on since before the beginning of a movie and 30 min into it, it looks like it would be worth recording. If you start recording (after the movie started) do you get the entire movie or only from where you started recording?


----------



## 10056753

scott,

great review and video. i have read the whole post and the review, but still am not clear on a couple things. 

1) if you are watching two shows using the PIP feature, can you still use the pause features and rewind on each tuner? for instance, if you pause the main picture and then switch pictures, does the window remain paused? 

2) can you use rewind and pause etc on the small picture or does it have to be the main picture to operate the pvr functions?

3) do you have to pay for a second receiver fee (5.00 per month) with the 721 for the two tuners?

thanks again for all the great info. my wife watched your video and wants me to order one immediately!

chi


----------



## Karl Foster

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Can someone answer a question for me, on an Ultimate TV or DirectTivo unit how do you go about switching between tuners on them?
> 
> On the 721 you need to go into PIP first before you can switch tuners.
> 
> How is it on the DirecTivo? And do you loose your buffer when you switch between switching tuners? *


Ultimatetv doesn't buffer both stations unless PIP is in use. As far as switching between tuners, you can use the PIP button and switch between the two. If you are recording a program and change the channel, it will automatically switch tuners without intervention, and use the RECENT button on the remote to change back. The easiest way to see what is on another station is to use the PIP. Truly, the use of dual tuners is so seamless that switching between tuners for me isn't even something I think about. It just happens.


----------



## Karl Foster

> _Originally posted by 10056753 _
> *scott,
> 
> 3) do you have to pay for a second receiver fee (5.00 per month) with the 721 for the two tuners?
> 
> chi *


The $5.00 is a per receiver fee, not a per tuner fee.


----------



## BobaBird

> _Originally posted by Craig Fogus _
> *Sweet! How do you guys know all this cool stuff!! Thanks a lot!*


Here's some more cool stuff you may not know about your 501: DishPVR 501 User Guide Supplement


> _Originally posted by waxdonuts _
> *- Is Dolby Digital 5.1 even available on Dish Network? (I'm not a subscriber yet.)*


Sure is, see Dolby Digital at the EKB. The 721 and 508 aren't listed there but will be soon.


----------



## Chris Blount

> _Originally posted by STXJim _
> *Scott,
> Second; lets say that HBO has been on since before the beginning of a movie and 30 min into it, it looks like it would be worth recording. If you start recording (after the movie started) do you get the entire movie or only from where you started recording? *


Just like the 501, if you are 30 minutes into a program you rewind the show back to the begining and press the record button. This records the movie from the start.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> 1) if you are watching two shows using the PIP feature, can you still use the pause features and rewind on each tuner? for instance, if you pause the main picture and then switch pictures, does the window remain paused?


I have only done this once so I may be wrong, but from what I remember it did work. 



> 2) can you use rewind and pause etc on the small picture or does it have to be the main picture to operate the pvr functions?


No the finctions only work in the main Window. I think it would be confusing to be able to FF, Rewind pause etc in the small PIP window.  Again you can pause and switch to the second tuner, then you can switch back and unpause with no problem.



> 3) do you have to pay for a second receiver fee (5.00 per month) with the 721 for the two tuners?


While you do have to pay a $5 extra receiver fee you do not have to pay an additional $5 a month for the second tuner.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> Ultimatetv doesn't buffer both stations unless PIP is in use.


This is the way the 721 works as well. In fact it sometimes when you press the PIP button it takes about 2 seconds for it to come up, it seems as though the unused tuner shuts itself off when not in use.


----------



## MarkA

So have you tried a USB HID mouse and keyboard yet?!?!?!?! I really am excited to know how that turns out. (I'm imagining DISH wasn't QUITE dumb enough to have HID support in their kernel)


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Yes Mark, read above I tried it and it did NOTHING, not even power to the keyboard to run on and off the scroll lock, num lock or caps locks leds.


----------



## SParker

Hey guys I am really tempted to order one of these but I am still on the fence. Do you guys think it would be best to wait a couple months and see how the system pans out for others or do you think it will be okay? Also do you think the price will drop much in a few months?


----------



## MarkA

WOW! Now that is freaky. I expected it to have POWER. This means the USB ports don't even work. Maybe they turn them on remotely when you get an expansion? Sure sounds like they don't want people doing ANYTHING with this box. Oh well, destroying the open intentions and nature of Linux. BAD CHARLIE!


----------



## Chris Blount

> _Originally posted by SParker _
> * Also do you think the price will drop much in a few months? *


I was told by Charlie's office that later this year Dish will be offering incentives for the 721. Details unknown at this time so you may be able to get it cheaper if you wait.


----------



## Kagato

Well, most likely if you were to order it today you wouldn't see it for about a month. So you'd have plenty of time to back out. 

I wouldn't count on much for price breaks as long as it stays popular. Although at some point I guess the falling prices of computer hardware (specifically on the Hard Drive and RAM) will kick in. I wouldn't count on anything until sometime in 2003.


----------



## SParker

Thanks Chris! That way it'll give the 721 more shake out time and plus I will be able to pay down on my CC! Maybe a 721 for $399 direct from Dish for commiting to 150 and CC autopay. I could handle that!



> _Originally posted by Chris Blount _
> *I was told by Charlie's office that later this year Dish will be offering incentives for the 721. Details unknown at this time so you may be able to get it cheaper if you wait. *


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> WOW! Now that is freaky. I expected it to have POWER. This means the USB ports don't even work.


Not true at all Mark, Plug in your USB keyboard into your computer and boot into dos you will find the same thing that the USB does not work. 

USB needs drivers to work and it appears that so far the 721 does not have keyboard drivers installed, or at least drivers for my USB keyboard installed.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

The price $549 actually is not that bad (and will be a nice value once Internet access is working) if you look at a DirecTivo or Ultimate TV. $9.95 a month for PVR service gets expensive after awhile, and for the Tivo folks $249 for lifetime service bundeled with the cost of the DirecTivo itself is almost as much as the 721.


----------



## Rick_EE

removed by author.


----------



## dlsnyder

Please forgive the basic question but I have never seen or used a PVR before. How would you select a program for recording on the 721 as opposed to the 501? Can you just find a show in the guide and "click" on it or do you have to set a timer like you would on a VCR? Anything that would make it easier for my wife to record her shows would be a big help. Currently all we have is a VCR connected to our 3900. Not very user friendly.


----------



## Dmitriy

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *The price $549 actually is not that bad (and will be a nice value once Internet access is working) if you look at a DirecTivo or Ultimate TV. $9.95 a month for PVR service gets expensive after awhile, and for the Tivo folks $249 for lifetime service bundeled with the cost of the DirecTivo itself is almost as much as the 721. *


I agree. You forgot to add 120gig HD. It looks very tempting.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> Can you just find a show in the guide and "click" on it


Yup that's how you do it! (It's that simple!)

Check out the review for the Video, it shows you how to setup timers.


----------



## Randy_B

Scott, if you pause a channel or have it recording and then channel up/down are you "automatically" switched over to the other tuner? Or do you still have to do the PIP thing to switch tuners.

I know there are a lot questions so this one got lost in the volume, but have you tried the skip back into a recording after it has finished and you are the end of playback/erase text screen. On the DP you can skip back into video, on the 501 you have to start all over again and FF all the way through it again. Thanks.

Oh yeah, does the 721 allow you to select multiple shows for simultaneous palyback (the dump to tape while you sleep question raised earlier)?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Randy you still have to do the PIP thing to switch tuners.

Echostar is working on a fix for this. And when I say fix I don't mean that the current way of switching tuners is a bug, as it's the way they designed it. They are listening to all feedback on the 721 carefully.

As far as your second question, I think the 721 is like the 501 where as soon as the recording is done it dumps you out. I thought I may have done something wrong but maybe not. 

No there is no multiple playback that I see. You must select the shows one by one which you want to playback.


----------



## pdennard

:goodjob:

Scott,

Excellent review!!! Thanks for taking the time and effort to do this for all us waiting with baited breath to get our hands on something that works out of the box.

I am a DishPVR 501 user and I love it. I've had a few bugs but there are some things the 701 has (so, I think).

One feature I don't see talked about is the ability to record a particular show. I watch TV for a particular show/event not for a particular time. Therefore, is there a way for the PVR to follow the show no matter what time/day it is broadcast?

Thanks!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

No the 721 does not track and program by name (like the Dishplayer and Tivo do) it is all time based.

In this regard the 721 is much like the 501.


----------



## belsokar

If you look at how Dish Network currently handles pricing of equipment, you'll see the PVR-501 is about the same price it has always been, so I wouldn't count on a cheaper 721 anytime soon. Hopefully they'll follow in their own footsteps and offer some upgrade-promotions to existing 501 owners, other owners as well. It can come with a 1 year contract or whatever, I don't plan on leaving dish network anytime soon, so it makes no difference to me. But that price has to definitely come down a bit somehow to make the upgrade.


----------



## SParker

heheh I just talked to my dad about it (even though I am an adult I do seek his advice), he thinks I should wait since I just bought a 301. He figures since its new that the price might go down but he said to get it if I wanted to. Err decisions decisions.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I think once the Internet access is working in the 721 the price factor will make the 721 a far better deal then any other PVR.

Again remember that there are no fees to use the PVR. 

Not trying to sell 721's just want to make sure I compare apples to apples.


----------



## dlsnyder

> _Originally posted by pdennard _
> *:One feature I don't see talked about is the ability to record a particular show. I watch TV for a particular show/event not for a particular time. Therefore, is there a way for the PVR to follow the show no matter what time/day it is broadcast?
> 
> *


Wouldn't you be able to accomplish this (albeit manually) with the search function? Does the search return all showings of the program that are stored in the 9 day guide? I realise that this is not quite as advanced as what the Tivo does but for many of us (OK, for ME) this would be good enough 99% of the time.


----------



## Guest

Dumb question here -- I have a 500, but would like to upgrade to this 721. I have no problem replacing what's in my living room, but I'm less inclinded to go on my roof to add another dish. Do I need to do that?

Thanks


----------



## EvanS

> _Originally posted by KSG _
> *Dumb question here -- I have a 500, but would like to upgrade to this 721. I have no problem replacing what's in my living room, but I'm less inclinded to go on my roof to add another dish. Do I need to do that?
> 
> Thanks *


if you have Dish 500 dish then you are ok there
BVut you will likely need to change the LNB on the dish arm as well as run another cable to the 721 for the 2nd tuner.
The cable run will depend on where you put the additional multiswitch of course

These are the basics, but I am not expert enough to totally identify all the requirements

good luck!!


----------



## DarrellP

Scott, have you used a DVD test pattern grid to check your TV for overscan to ensure it is indeed the 721's graphics and not the TV? It's hard to tell if a TV show is cut off or not.

Viewing my 6000 on my 27" NTSC TV I get the HD Discovery logo cut off on the right hand side (as well as the Fox logo on widescreen shows), but on my computer monitor, I get the full picture.


----------



## Hoosier

Has anyone tried transfering a recorded show to a DVD-recorder or any other device? Does it maintain its digital integrity?


----------



## SParker

Well guys I just went and did it, I just ordered one from Dish Depot! I sure hope I am not dissapointed, I don't think I will. 

P.S. I resisted the Dishplayer and the 501 but this time resistance WAS futile!


----------



## Jay Byron

SParker,
Did Dish Depot let you know a delivery date? I'm still waiting for my email from them.


----------



## John Corn

me too....

I sent you a PM SParker.


----------



## SParker

Nope it was just a automated order confirmation, they are closed until Moday for the 4th of July.



> _Originally posted by Jay Byron _
> *SParker,
> Did Dish Depot let you know a delivery date? I'm still waiting for my email from them. *


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I almost forgot...

I promised a few pictures to folks. 

Here ya go!

Below is the recorded show listings from the PVR.










The next one is what you see when you select a show you want to watch. Notice the only way to get the show to play is select "Start Over" even though you never actually watched it yet.










And finally for tonight, here is the best picture of the remote I could take.










Hope these were ok.


----------



## Randy_B

What the heck is the "Clean up" button on the PVR home for? I could use a remote control maid service. 


Hmmm, What are the three blue buttons just above the number pads? Other than those (and the i button and moving Dish Home to the side), it looks like the Platinum remote that ships with the 501.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Clean up is a way to select shows you want to delete and delete the marked shows all at once.

The Three Blue Buttons on the remote are "SWAP" "PIP" "POSITION"


----------



## STXJim

Wow,
I really like the "approximate recording time left" display.
I can get rid of my calculator that I keep with all of my remotes.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hey you just gave me an Idea of something I havent tried Jim. 

I am gonna try recording one of the music channels and see how much space it takes up. 

I am guessing I can record 8 hours of music and only take up and hour of Drive space.


----------



## STXJim

I didn't know that the 721 could record the music channels.
If a song starts and you want to record it can you rewind to the beginning of the song, hit record and record the entire song?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Yup you can 

Works nicely too!


----------



## Jacob S

> _Originally posted by MrPete _
> *On the 501, while watching a live show, you can press pause and rewind to the beginning of the show (or some other point) and press REC to record from that point on.
> Can you do that on the 721?
> Will it also display an option to record from the new (rewound) point to the end of the show? *


Yes but I dont think the unit will turn off by itself as it would if someone had already had the unit turned off and then turn on by itself to record an event then turn back off again. Even if it had already turned on by itself if you press any button it will prevent it from turning off by itself.

Is it technically possible for them to upgrade the 721 to allow a person to do the pvr functions in the small window as well and at the same time as the big one?


----------



## MediaMills

I ordered my 721 from DishDepot...got a late-night reply that it could be 2-3 weeks. I said, "No problem. I waited 6 months, 2-3 weeks isn't going to matter because there is no *new* TV on anyway!


----------



## SParker

Scott, when a recording timer is done will the system power itself off or can you set it to? I'm kinda curious because when this thing ships to me in a couple weeks it would be nice if I can have it power down automatically when it is done recording and not sheduled to do anything else.


----------



## gsusser

> _Originally posted by EvanS _
> *
> 
> if you have Dish 500 dish then you are ok there
> BVut you will likely need to change the LNB on the dish arm as well as run another cable to the 721 for the 2nd tuner.
> The cable run will depend on where you put the additional multiswitch of course
> 
> These are the basics, but I am not expert enough to totally identify all the requirements
> 
> good luck!! *


Hi, 1st post from a techno idiot (that's me!) First, I've read through all the posts on this thread as well as Scott's great review, thanks loads! However, I'm a little confused by the cable/hardware requirements for the 721. When you say Dish 500, is that the same as a 501?, which is what I currently have in addition to another receiver/tv hookup. I have a SW21 switch and it's my understanding that I'll need to have installed a different switch. Yes?? If so, can I rely on the dealers on dish's site to do the job right and, if not, who/what is recommended for the northern nj area? [i had a dish authorized company do the initial install 4 years ago and they completely botched it up, but maybe things are different.] Many thanks, and grateful to have found this place.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

You can actually turn it off while its recording and it still records.


----------



## SParker

OOOOH nice!!!!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Last night I recorded 4 hours or Muisc from one of Dish Networks Muzak channels.

The amount of space (in time) it took to record 4 hours of stereo music.... 50 minutes. 

Is my math correct when I figure that the 721 can record 432 hours of stereo music?


----------



## Craig Fogus

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *You can actually turn it off while its recording and it still records.  *


Now that is nice indeed!!!

While watching a recorded show, can you see how much time is left? On the 501, you can't unless you stop then restart it. Hitting the view button (which works when watching live TV) stops the show and shows you live TV. I really hate that! :bang


----------



## MrPete

Craig,
Just hit the 'CANCEL' button while watching a recorded show and you will see the 'time left'


----------



## Craig Fogus

Won't that stop the show? I'm not at home, but I'll try that when I am. Thanks!


----------



## Jacob S

Is it the 501 or the 721 that can be powered off and it still will record? If the 721 can do this then how come can the 501 cannot do this? How can it power off yet still be 'on' in a sense to record? In other words how can the unit be off if it is recording, that would be on in a sense wouldn't it?


----------



## kcwh

JACOB S,

most tv's, vcr's etc now don't actually power off when you turn them off. they go into a mode kind of like sleep mode on a pc. otherwise they wouldn't be able to respond to your remote control or to automatically turn on and record things for you.



SCOTT G,

the 721's ability to continue recording even though it's been "turned off" is very nice because it will prevent me from stopping recording unintentionally. but this made me think of another issue.... i've lived in places before where the power goes out unpredictably for short periods of time, which probably wouldn't be helpful for recording shows, and it could corrupt the data on the 721/501 hard drive. 

i'm wondering if an PC uninterruptible power supply would be a good thing to connect it to so that temporary power outages don't screw things up?

Bill


----------



## Dmitriy

This question is for Scott only:
How's 721 working right now? Did you find any bugs? Are you enjoying it? Is worth $550?


----------



## MediaMills

> _Originally posted by kcwh _
> *i'm wondering if an PC uninterruptible power supply would be a good thing to connect it to so that temporary power outages don't screw things up?
> 
> Bill *


In preparation for this, I bought an old Compaq UPS from a buddy of mine. It doesn't have a model number but from the back panel it appears to be the equivalent of a 1400VA Model. Yesterday me and my wife (with her smaller arms) unplugged all the A/V equipment and added the UPS to our living room setup. I have not tried killing the power but according to the front panel of the UPS, the equipment is approximately a 20-25% load on the unit. Here is a listing of the equipment running on this load:

Sony Wega 36" Flat-Screen
Sony Surround A/V Receiver (100w/channel, blah blah blah)
RadioShack 10w amp (for surround speakers)
Dish Model 5000 Receiver
Electronic equalizer
Cassette Deck (stand-by mode)
VCR
DVD
OTA Antenna amplifier

I was impressed! If during a storm I shutdown all but the TV and the Satellite receiver I am guessing that I would get an hour of use before the battery died...good for getting weather updates during Tornadoes.


----------



## DRJDAN

> _Originally posted by Hoosier _
> *Has anyone tried transfering a recorded show to a DVD-recorder or any other device? Does it maintain its digital integrity? *


I have an ATI All In Wonder Radeon. I use the A/V out on a 301 to the A/V in on the video card. Then all you do is schedule the recording session on the ATI software and be sure the 301 is on the correct channel at the correct time.

As to quality, the feed is the same as is comming to your TV. In the recording software, you select the quality you want. DVD MPEG-2 is one of the choices. Then once you have it stored on the hard drive. You can create a DVD if you have the DVD-R burner. You can select to record in MPEG-1 and create a VCD on a CD-R burner. A VCD will play on a lot but not all DVD players. The MPEG-1 is VCR quality at best.

www.vcdhelper.com is a good web site on VCD and DVD recording.


----------



## Randy_B

> _Originally posted by gsusser _
> *
> 
> Hi, 1st post from a techno idiot (that's me!) First, I've read through all the posts on this thread as well as Scott's great review, thanks loads! However, I'm a little confused by the cable/hardware requirements for the 721. When you say Dish 500, is that the same as a 501?, which is what I currently have in addition to another receiver/tv hookup. I have a SW21 switch and it's my understanding that I'll need to have installed a different switch. Yes?? If so, can I rely on the dealers on dish's site to do the job right and, if not, who/what is recommended for the northern nj area? [i had a dish authorized company do the initial install 4 years ago and they completely botched it up, but maybe things are different.] Many thanks, and grateful to have found this place. *


Welcome. The DIsh 500 is a satellite dish that is capable of reveiving the signal from 2 satellites (110 and 119 degrees), it has two specialLNBs on board. The 501 is a model of receiver, this particular one is the 2nd generation E* PVR receiver. If your Dish 500 is fully set up (2 SW21 switches) you could hook up JUST the 721 with both feeds from the dish (1 from each SW21). If you want to have more than just the 721, you will need to have either a SW44 or SW64 switch installed to feed more than just the 721. I will have to pass on recommending a dealer (I'm in IL). Perhaps someone else can pick that one up. You could do it yourself, it is not especially hard, if you can safely get to the dish and are comfortable hooking up cables that is about all would take. Dishdepot.com has reasonable proices for the switch you would need.


----------



## Jacob S

How about using solar panels for backup during a storm? And better yet not just a storm but might as well use it all the time if you have them, just for the electronics, to make sure that they dont go out, if you are worried about that. It may be too expensive though. Be good if you had a house out in the country where there was no electricity, or a generator would work alright I suppose.


----------



## Danny R

_I won't call it a bug (yet) but last night I had a show set to record at Midnight, I had another show set to record at 1am and another at 2:30 am.

When I woke up this morning, I went to my PVR list to find none of my shows recorded from last night except the show at Midnight which it says was still recording (it was only a half hour show) I selected the start over button on the PVR screen then pressed stop, when I went back to the PVR screen all my shows from last night were now there (phew) and the Midnight show was its correct length._

I've seen this bug several times with the 501. Since it looks like they ported over the code from the 501 in most part, I would bet some of the timer problems the 501 has are also present in the 721.

If you can, try playing around with midnight timers for a bit, setting up shows that straddle, then a show the next evening for the same time.

Likewise, set up a repeating once a week timer for a show with a 1 minute start early, and then go a week out and set up a one time timer for a show in the same timeslot. I've had my 501 mess that up a lot as well, where it won't register the conflict or sets the recording for the show just before what I wanted.

---

One nice thing I like is that the 721 search feature has a complete character set. The 501 only has a-z and space. This is a much needed improvement. For example, searching for Dr. Who on the 501 is impossible. Searching for Dr. or Who gives way too many responses.

---

How about some screen shots of the front and back?


----------



## SParker

I can't wait to get my 721!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I will answer all your questions later today. Been busy.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Ok after having a very nice Foruth of July and drinking too much of my Friends home made Fruit Punch , I am back on the mend.

Let's get back into things by answering questions! I will try my best to answer them all (now that the room is done spinning!) 

First up let's answer Bill's question.



> i'm wondering if an PC uninterruptible power supply would be a good thing to connect it to so that temporary power outages don't screw things up?


A UPS is always a good item to have hooked up to any big dollar electronics.  I will let you know of something that happened the other day, I started recording a movie and the power went out for about 10 minutes when it came back on the 721 automaticly started recording again and recorded the rest of the movie! In my PVR listings I had 2 parts to my show, 1 before the power went off and the second from after the power came back on. Very nice!

Next up we answer the following questions from Dmitriy



> This question is for Scott only:
> How's 721 working right now? Did you find any bugs? Are you enjoying it? Is worth $550?


My 721 is workinging very well, other then the few quirks I mentioned earlier in this thread things have been running great!

No bugs found, I have seen some things (again as I reported here) that I did not like and have reported them to Echostar who have been very responsive to my suggestions.

Is it worth $550? I would say that once the Internet access is available on the 721 that $550 will be a bargin. If you look at other non Dish PVR's and figure in the costs of monthly PVR service the price is the 721 is not bad (It would be much more Palatible at $499)

Next on to a comment from DrJDan


> I have an ATI All In Wonder Radeon. I use the A/V out on a 301 to the A/V in on the video card.


Hey thats the way I captured the video and origional screen captures. I love my ATI All In Wonder Radeon 7500!

Next up we go to a question by new member Danny R! (Welcome Danny! :wave:



> How about some screen shots of the front and back?


Look earlier in this thread there are some links to pictures of the front and back of the 721. Again welcome!

I think I answered all of them for now. Thanks for everyones patience and thanks for visiting us here at DBStalk.COM!


----------



## Donna Williams

Does anyone know if the 721 allows you to delete a scheduled recording while on the program guide rather than having to go to the timer list? That is one thing that bugs me about the 501.

Also does the list of future timed shows provide the name of the program rather than just the date, time and channel like the 501 does?

One more question, is there a screen saver. The 501 has burned the pause indicator on our new rear projection wide screen TV. 

Donna Williams


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hi Donna,

Welcome to DBStalk.COM! :hi: I just saw your posting in the newsgroups (which someone suggested you come here which got some guy mad, but you made it here) 

To answer your questions

1) I see no way to delete timers from the guide, you need to go through the timer list.

2) Yes the name is there, although to see the full description you need to press the info button.

3) Yes a screen saver kicks in after a few minutes if you leave any 721 graphic on the screen. A nice thing is if your listening to a music channel the screen saver does NOT kick in so that you can see the artist and title information (which is almost a screensave itself as the info floats around the screen)

Again welcome!

Scott


----------



## Jacob S

That darn thing about not deleting a timer from the Program Guide is so darn annoying to me as well. I wonder why the 501 has no screen saver when the dishplayer and 721 does? I added that to the long list of features people want on the unit.


----------



## Jacob S

I have some questions, can you do the following:

> Uncheck channels you do not want to change to instead of checking the ones that you want (Dishplayer has this)

> Browse ahead more than just the next show 

> Browse more than one channel at once (DirecTV RCA receivers do this)

> Make program guide transparent so you can watch a show while viewing entire program guide

> View and/or perform program guide or other menu functions while information is downloading from satellite (just like you can watch a show while info ins downloading from satellite)

> Do away with flashing clock timer reminder

> List timers in order of time to be shown 

> Have a scrolling text reminder just like the one that appears on the Dishplayer before a show is recorded or asks if you want to change channels for a reminder instead of a blinking clock

> A selection asking the days of the week you would like that show recorded instead of having just the options M-F, daily, weekly, once

> setup timer based on name of show instead of time of show (season pass)

> only allow one selection to be checked at a time (so when u r editing it will not say that two are checkmarked at the same time) in the timer screen

> Over ride a normal timer for a one time show without having to delete the normal timer to do so. 

> View all events on channel 1 (just like dishplayer)

> Have ability to check the events that you want to delete to delete more than one at a time instead of having to delete one at a time (the only way it allows you to do this is if you run out of space on the hard drive when it asks you to select the events you want deletes - on the 501)

> Make defragmenting the hard drive optional

> Add on external Hard Drive/CD-RW/DVD drives 

> Color scheme change 

> Indicate whether a show is NEW or REPEAT on the show information screen

> jump to listing by day/time capability just like you can that of the Dishplayer (it looks like a calendar and you select the day on the calendar) 

> in SEARCH history make it to where you can clear just one or more word(s) instead of all of them (just as you would select and deselect favorite channels in the favorite list)

> limit the amount of characters you can type in during a search

> If one searches for a certain channel show just what is airing on that channel each day of the week for that timeslot just as the dishplayer does 

> After search is complete select which shows to record from that screen

> Search multiple items at once 

> Allow the search to be stopped midstream with the results already found

> Edit words in SEARCH history

> Allow short rings (short, short - etc.) to be detected

> to be able to pause a show without having to select ok or cancel

> Automatically enable caller id feature 

Having had a dishplayer in the past and now having a 501 I want to see the differences between all of these three receivers.

Thanks a bunch!


----------



## Danny R

_Look earlier in this thread there are some links to pictures of the front and back of the 721. Again welcome!_

Thanks. I missed them on my first readthrough.

It was driving me crazy because you kept refering to your review in another forum, but I could never find it till someone mentioned this site. Glad to find it and to be here!


----------



## John Corn

Welcome Danny, Ya this thread in now 8 pages long, if your like me, I start reading through it pretty fast, and then when I do finish, I forgot about half the stuff I read........:shrug:


----------



## STXJim

Jacob S,
Geeze...
Give Scott a break. He has been doing a great job reviewing and answering questions, but....
You just bombarded him with a truck load of questions. 29 to be exact.
Present them one or two at a time and I bet you will have better results getting them answered. IMHO
I appreciate your labor of love Scott.
Jim


----------



## Jacob S

Yeah, I know it was a lot of questions all of a sudden but I figure that it would be nice to have all the answers all in once place in which could be edited to add more answers. He dont have to answer all of them at the same time, but it gets people wondering. I got the questions from my website so I can update it and so that me and others can know about this unit. I figured someone would say something about having that many questions, thats to be expected. Scott is a great guy and had dedication in this satellite technology like I do, thats why I figured he would answer them for me and all the others on this board.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Jacob I will answer as many of those as I can later tonight while I am sitting in front of my TV and my 721. 

Anyone else have any questions.


----------



## SParker

The 721 is going to get opentv and the instant weather in a future right? At least I would imagine it would

Thanks,

Shawn



> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Jacob I will answer as many of those as I can later tonight while I am sitting in front of my TV and my 721.
> 
> Anyone else have any questions.  *


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Yes the 721 will be getting OpenTV (ala Dish Home) in a few months (note the guide will not change to the OpenTV guide)

There is actually alot you can do with the 721 with OpenTV activated.


----------



## SParker

2 more weeks and I'll maybe have my hands on one of these units W00T!!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Sparker I hope you unit works as well as mine. I have heard from quite a few people who have received them and things are working fine, I only had one person write me and let me know his unit arrived DOA. 

Let's just hope his was a victim of a disgruntled UPS guy instead of a bad unit from the factory.


----------



## SParker

hopefully Dish Depot ships the box inside a brown box otherwise the UPS guy might take my 721 home with him!


----------



## Jacob S

I have seen UPS truck drivers throw the receivers around and seen dents on the sides of my boxes and that did not make me very happy when I got shipments in like that. If a receiver goes bad and Dish makes me pay for shipping is UPS responsible for throwing the boxes around, in which I could say it was damage during shipment?

What can you do with the 721 with OpenTv that you cant do with the other receivers (3900, 4900, 301, 501) ?

Is there going to be any games on the 721 like there was on the dishplayer like doom, etc. or are there any now?


----------



## SParker

Yeah even when they aren't powered I don't think its good for the hard drives to be jared.


----------



## Mark Holtz

No, jarring a hard drive isn't good. However, if you've been to a retail store, you see the size of the box in comparison to the hard drive. That's how much padding is in the box.


----------



## gsusser

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Yes the 721 will be getting OpenTV (ala Dish Home) in a few months (note the guide will not change to the OpenTV guide)
> 
> There is actually alot you can do with the 721 with OpenTV activated.  *


Mine is on order based on all the favorable comments here, yipee! Excuse the stoopidity, but what is OpenTV?


----------



## John Corn

Hi Glenn, Welcome to DBSTalk. 

Open TV is all the interactive stuff on Dish Network, your electronic programming guide, Dish's weather channel and the new Dish Home.

Click here to see Dish Networks Open TV application's

Here is the link to the Open TV website


----------



## thomasmaly

I currently have an echostar model 3700 hooked up to my WEBTV plus unit and a VCR. I have ordered a dish model 721. Will I be able to hook up the 721 in the same manner as my current setup? I am totally non technical. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Tom


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Ok sorry for the delay, here we go. (I am not at home when I type this, the unknowns will be answered later) 

> Uncheck channels you do not want to change to instead of checking the ones that you want (Dishplayer has this)

I believe that the 721 has a favorites list feature.

> Browse ahead more than just the next show 

Yup

> Browse more than one channel at once (DirecTV RCA receivers do this)

Not sure what you mean on this

> Make program guide transparent so you can watch a show while viewing entire program guide

This is coming (the option is greyed out) You can however make all the other menus transparent.

> View and/or perform program guide or other menu functions while information is downloading from satellite (just like you can watch a show while info ins downloading from satellite)

Yup this is a great feature of the 721. (You even get software updates while you watch TV, your 721 does not need to be powered off to obtain the updates.

> Do away with flashing clock timer reminder

Yup push cancel or info to get rid of them

> List timers in order of time to be shown

Not sure I think the timers are in the order you added them in. 

> Have a scrolling text reminder just like the one that appears on the Dishplayer before a show is recorded or asks if you want to change channels for a reminder instead of a blinking clock

No just a blinking clock (this one is a nice color clock) 

> A selection asking the days of the week you would like that show recorded instead of having just the options M-F, daily, weekly, once

Not quite sure I think it only has the options you show above.

> setup timer based on name of show instead of time of show (season pass)

No all timers are based on the time and not the show name

> only allow one selection to be checked at a time (so when u r editing it will not say that two are checkmarked at the same time) in the timer screen

Not sure what you mean by this one

> Over ride a normal timer for a one time show without having to delete the normal timer to do so. 

You can go an edit timers at any time

> View all events on channel 1 (just like dishplayer)
Yes press the PTV button just like on the Dishplayer (there is no channel 1 on the 721 though)

> Have ability to check the events that you want to delete to delete more than one at a time instead of having to delete one at a time (the only way it allows you to do this is if you run out of space on the hard drive when it asks you to select the events you want deletes - on the 501)

Yes the 721 has a nice "clean up" feature

> Make defragmenting the hard drive optional

Why would you want to do that?

> Add on external Hard Drive/CD-RW/DVD drives 

The ability is there but the USB is not enabled yet in the software.

> Color scheme change 

No although I would not be suprised to see that in a future software release

> Indicate whether a show is NEW or REPEAT on the show information screen

The guide data is the same data which the 501 uses its up the the people who make a guide to put this info in, its not a 721 function

> jump to listing by day/time capability just like you can that of the Dishplayer (it looks like a calendar and you select the day on the calendar) 

No calander that I can see, but like all other Dish receivers you can type 24 and press the right arrow to jump 24 hours into the guide.

> in SEARCH history make it to where you can clear just one or more word(s) instead of all of them (just as you would select and deselect favorite channels in the favorite list)

I havent checked this out.

> limit the amount of characters you can type in during a search

Why would you want to do that?

> If one searches for a certain channel show just what is airing on that channel each day of the week for that timeslot just as the dishplayer does 

Not sure what you mean by this one.

> After search is complete select which shows to record from that screen

Yup it can do that.

> Search multiple items at once 

Never tried it, but I doubt it, as it would complicate matters.

> Allow the search to be stopped midstream with the results already found

Dont believe it does this (the search is REALLY quick)

> Edit words in SEARCH history

Not sure

> Allow short rings (short, short - etc.) to be detected

Dont have this type of phone service, but the call ID works well.

> to be able to pause a show without having to select ok or cancel

You press the pause button and it pauses. 

> Automatically enable caller id feature 

Caller ID popup is set to off by default.

There you go. 

Anyone else?


----------



## SParker

perhaps the E* software automatically defrags the HD? maybe it isn't necessary since it's not really a OS that needs constant tending too. Plus seeing that it's Linux and not Winblows  That might be the case hehe.


----------



## Kagato

Defrag is a very DOS/Windows centric concept. Since it's linux there are several options for file systems they could use. Most of which wouldn't gain much from a "defrag".


----------



## Thinker

Does the 721 have outputs to support two TVs for viewing at one time? Can you watch two TVs each on a seperate channel at once.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hi Thinker, Welcome to DBStalk.COM!

No you can not watch two TV's on seperate channels with the 721.

Dish is working on a receiver with these features though.


----------



## Danny R

*> Do away with flashing clock timer reminder*
_Yup push cancel or info to get rid of them_

I think he means is there a way to toggle the reciever so that the reminder doesn't appear at all. When downloading shows to tape, the clock can appear and ruin the recording.

*> Over ride a normal timer for a one time show without having to delete the normal timer to do so. *
_You can go an edit timers at any time_

Again, I think you missed the point of the question. Lets say you have a weekly timer starting every monday. However next monday you know the show is a rerun, so you want to tape something else. Does the conflict manager allow you to do a one time program overriding the existing timer, WITHOUT ERASING THE PREVIOUS TIMER. With the 501, you have to delete the existing timer, and set it up again after the show having the conflict has passed.


----------



## psecic

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Yes Jim, search is just like the Dishplayer but faster *


Anything is faster than a Dishplayer. :lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Jacob S

- On asking if you can uncheck the channels you do not want to go through, what I meant to ask is if it had it to where on the All Channels Favorite list where you dont check the channels that you want but uncheck the ones you dont want to go through when you go through the All Channels Favorite list. You can do this on the dishplayer.

- How many shows ahead can you browse ahead in the browse feature?

- When saying doing away with the clock feature I meant if they did not use the clock but something else instead to tell us when a timer was about to activate. What color are they using for the clock?

- When I asked about only allowing one event to be checked at a time in the timer screen, what I meant to ask was to ask is if you would check two events in the timer screen and then tried to edit or delete if it would say to only check one - the 501 does this.

- When I say browse more than one channel at a time I mean while you are watching one show it will come up like a partial program guide like two or three lines of the program guide on the side or bottom which is either transparent or not transparent

- When I asked about over riding a timer without deleting the original one what I meant to ask was if someone had a timer already set for a particular time and you go and try to set another show for that time that it will tell you to delete or edit one of the timers because it is a timer conflict. (I figure since there are two tuners that this may only occur if there are THREE timers set for the same time period due to the fact it can record two things at the same time) If someone wanted to record a show just one time only and had a timer set for that same time for everyday or M-F that person would have to delete that timer that activates everyday then after the show is over with go back and add it again which is a huge hassle.

- Someone had mentioned before about defragging a hard drive because it will corrupt and have to be reset and then it would end up erasing all recordings and it was suggested by another member of this forum or on dbsforums.

- Didnt they ever have it on the info screen NEW or REPEAT to indicate whether the show was a repeat or not? Isnt there others like FIRST AIRING or something like that as well?

- I made an error and meant to ask if it did limit the characters you can type in the search box while doing a search

- When asking a question about searching shows that are on one particular channel, what I meant was if you would type in the channel as it appears in the program guide if it would list just the shows on that channel instead of searching for the shows with that in the info or in the show title. dishplayer does this.

Thanks for the answers, I will mention you on my website.

How can I get a list of all features that are currently available on the 501 and 721 to add to my website?


----------



## Guest

Can the PVR721 output two programs at once, say one on the svideo output and the other on composite or rf, so it can feed two TVs?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

No Rpoole. 

Read above I answered this one today. 

Scott


----------



## UpOnTheMountain

I'm still concerned about the timers, and searching.

1. Please clarify if you can use the info button in the timers screen to see the program name of what is going to be recorded.

2. If it does indeed show the program name, does it use the name of the program in the future time slot that consumes the greatest amount of time to be recorded.

3. And finally , did I understand that when in the pvr screen you can press the # key, and this will bring up an automatic search results screen for the program name selected in the pvr screen ???

if so waaayyy cool !!!!  

This would help get around the "not-programming-by-name-and-my-show-could-be-at-a-diffferent-time-slot" problem !!!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> 1. Please clearify if you can use the info button in the timers screen to see the progam name of wha going to be recorded.


Yes you can, pressing the Info button on the Timers Screen gives you all the details of the program



> 2. If it does indeed show the program name, doe it use the name of the program in the future time slot that consumes the greatest amount of time to be recorded.


Yes it does, the correct program name is shown, the place where it screws up is when your watching TV and the clock atarts blinking and you press info the info screen tells you that your PVR is about to start recording the current show that on instead of the name of the show you actually want to record.



> 3. And finally , did I understand that when in the pvr screen you can press the # key, and this will bring up an automatic search results screen for the program name selected in the pvr screen ???


No thats not it, let's say you come home and turn to HBO and there is a movie on you really like but it is halfway done, you want to know if the movie is on again, so what you do it press the # key on the remote, which will automaticly search for the show your watching. This way you can record the show the next time it is on!

Nice feature.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Wow Jacob. Well NOW I am sitting in front of my 721. (BTW on your site you have us listed as DBS Dish instead of DBStalk.COM please correct ASAP. (DBSDish was John Hodgson's brain child and was the Birthplace of what we know today as DBSforums)

Ok here we go...



> - On asking if you can uncheck the channels you do not want to go through, what I meant to ask is if it had it to where on the All Channels Favorite list where you dont check the channels that you want but uncheck the ones you dont want to go through when you go through the All Channels Favorite list. You can do this on the dishplayer.


It is setup like most Dish favorites lists. You start off with the channels you want in your list. You can create 4 seperate lists.



> - How many shows ahead can you browse ahead in the browse feature?


You can open the browse bar and see the show you are watching and the show that is coming up.



> - When saying doing away with the clock feature I meant if they did not use the clock but something else instead to tell us when a timer was about to activate. What color are they using for the clock?


The clock is yellow on the outside, grey on the inside and black hands and tick marks.



> - When I asked about only allowing one event to be checked at a time in the timer screen, what I meant to ask was to ask is if you would check two events in the timer screen and then tried to edit or delete if it would say to only check one - the 501 does this.


You can delete as many checked events in one time as you want, but you can only edit one show at a time.



> - When I say browse more than one channel at a time I mean while you are watching one show it will come up like a partial program guide like two or three lines of the program guide on the side or bottom which is either transparent or not transparent


This is like the browse bar bring it up and press the up and down arrows and you can go through the guide for whats on without actually changing the channel or going to the main guide.



> - When I asked about over riding a timer without deleting the original one what I meant to ask was if someone had a timer already set for a particular time and you go and try to set another show for that time that it will tell you to delete or edit one of the timers because it is a timer conflict. (I figure since there are two tuners that this may only occur if there are THREE timers set for the same time period due to the fact it can record two things at the same time) If someone wanted to record a show just one time only and had a timer set for that same time for everyday or M-F that person would have to delete that timer that activates everyday then after the show is over with go back and add it again which is a huge hassle.


It will ack you which timer you want to delete it does not automaticly as you which one you want to record like the Dishplayer does (which leaves the regular program set to not record yet recording will resume on it next air date) This is something that the Dishplayer is MUCH better at.



> - Someone had mentioned before about defragging a hard drive because it will corrupt and have to be reset and then it would end up erasing all recordings and it was suggested by another member of this forum or on dbsforums.


Since its a Linux system I am not sure if there is a need to defragment, as the file system is different then a normal Fat or Fat32 file system that most windows users are use to.



> - Didnt they ever have it on the info screen NEW or REPEAT to indicate whether the show was a repeat or not? Isnt there others like FIRST AIRING or something like that as well?


I dont honestly remember this being done at any time. Again this would be a function of the EPG provider, and nothing to do with the hardware.



> - I made an error and meant to ask if it did limit the characters you can type in the search box while doing a search


I went in and put over 50 characters in and I could have put in a lot more  I don't think there is a limit here. Although no show I know has a title that long.



> - When asking a question about searching shows that are on one particular channel, what I meant was if you would type in the channel as it appears in the program guide if it would list just the shows on that channel instead of searching for the shows with that in the info or in the show title. dishplayer does this.


Nope it does not do this.

Phew. Got through those.


----------



## Craig Fogus

Scott, I just wanted to say thanks for all of your hard work! I'm sure that I speak for all of us when I say that we really appreciate it. 

BTW, if all of this testing starts to get too much for you, I'll be more than happy to finish the rest of the testing for ya. Just send it my way! hahahahahaha


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Craig the only way you will get this 721 out of my hands is to pry the remote from my dead hands. 

Thanks for the comments!!


----------



## SParker

Scott I asked you this earlier but I don't think you understood my question (I didn't either after re-reading it!  ). Can you watch one of the shows that you are recording and if you are recording two at once can you do the PIP functions while they are recording without messing up the recordings?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Sparker yes I have done this and it does work. 

It looks wierd when you have both the main and the pip window displayed with both showing the PAUSED icon.


----------



## SParker

I figured it did but it had to be asked  I can't wait!


----------



## Guest

Scott,

Could you please tell me if you had to buy an add-on to the Dish 500 to enable the 2nd tuner function of the 721 to work or did your existing Dish 500 already have the adaptor on it (Ex: Dual LNB or Quad LNB)? In other words does the kit, that Dish Network is selling for $599 which includes a new Dish 500, include the correct LNB or do you have to buy one separately?

Thanks,
Jason


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Jason,

I hooked mine up to my SW-64. If you but the complete kit with Dish it contains one of the new Dish Pro dishes, which means your dish will only work with your 301, 501 and 721 receviers. 

If you have older recievers (notlisted about) it is better for you to get a switch then move over to the Dishpro line.


----------



## Jacob S

> Does it only allow a 4 digit pay per view/ratings lock code or unlimited characters of numbers and letters like the dishplayer does?

> Does it have 2 hours of buffer on each show that you are watching even if you have PIP on?

> Anybody gonna try to shoot for a hard drive upgrade in this big bad boy of a machine? Is there a bigger hard drive than 120 GB (and I dont mean MB hehe, you had to be on the text chat to know what I am talking about guys)

> Why was 'Hard Drive' grayed out on the 501 menu? What was that going to be used for? Its not there anymore but was.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> Does it only allow a 4 digit pay per view/ratings lock code or unlimited characters of numbers and letters like the dishplayer does?


The 721 REQUIRES 5 digets to lock it not 4 like other receivers.



> Does it have 2 hours of buffer on each show that you are watching even if you have PIP on?


The second tuner is turned OFF when not in use however when the PIP window is in use it buffers just like the main window.



> > Anybody gonna try to shoot for a hard drive upgrade in this big bad boy of a machine? Is there a bigger hard drive than 120 GB (and I dont mean MB hehe, you had to be on the text chat to know what I am talking about guys)


I wouldn't try this, one of the first thing the 721 does at bootup is is validates the hard drive. I don't think a larger drive will work.


----------



## Jacob S

Does it have an option for the previous 6 or 8 channels you were viewing like you would go to this screen on the dishplayer and then u could see like a picture in each box with the channel number and name on the box and there be like 6 or 8 boxes on the same screen, does the 721 do this? wouldnt it be neat to put this together with the second tuner to form some kind of better functionality with a feature such as this? what are the possibilities with this?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Nope it dont do this.


----------



## DRJDAN

I have a SW44 with four receivers connected now. What would I have to do to replace one of my 301's with a 721 from a switch stand point?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

im no expert in switches, so someone who knows switches help DRJDAN out


----------



## Jacob S

> Is the wireless keyboard going to be UHF or just IR ?

> Does it download a video into PVR events showing a demonstration for the 721? This would be great for the dealers for the PVR products.

> Does it have 2 hours of buffer in the PIP and main window or just two hours of buffer total? I guess this question would be irrelevant since you cannot pause the PIP screen. 

> If you would pause the main picture though and then swap it to the pip picture would it remain paused? If so then could you pause the main window and then have both paused at the same time?


----------



## Richard King

> I have a SW44 with four receivers connected now. What would I have to do to replace one of my 301's with a 721 from a switch stand point?


It depends. The SW44 will work fine with a 721 if you have 3 or fewer receivers. Having 4 receivers creates a dilemma. Your best bet would be to switch over to DishPro if you want to continue to use 4 receivers (or up to 12 receivers). The SW44 is a 4 in 4 out switch, meaning it will receive from 2 dual lnb's and distribute to up to 4 tuners. If you have a 721, it eats up 2 of the 4 outputs, leaving 2 outputs for other tuners. The best thing to do now is think in terms of tuners, not receivers. If you want to have 4 receivers with one being the 721 you have 5 tuners that need to be fed with a signal. You will need a DishPro LNB replacing your current LNB and 2 DishPro 34 switches to feed your 5 tuners. Drop one single tuner receiver from the mix and you can keep the SW44.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

> > Is the wireless keyboard going to be UHF or just IR ?


 I believe it is just IR. (I could be wrong the keyboard has not been released as of yet)



> > Does it download a video into PVR events showing a demonstration for the 721? This would be great for the dealers for the PVR products.


 By my estimates, there is over 20 hours of recording time on the 721 reserved for use by Echostar.

Training videos or Video on Demand movies could be downloaded to the 721 at any time.



> > Does it have 2 hours of buffer in the PIP and main window or just two hours of buffer total? I guess this question would be irrelevant since you cannot pause the PIP screen.


It appears that the 2 hour buffer is per window. You can pause the PIP window but first you must make the pip window you want to pause full screen pause it then make it your pip window again (it will not be paused)



> > If you would pause the main picture though and then swap it to the pip picture would it remain paused? If so then could you pause the main window and then have both paused at the same time?


Yes and Yes


----------



## Mark Lamutt

> _Originally posted by DRJDAN _
> *I have a SW44 with four receivers connected now. What would I have to do to replace one of my 301's with a 721 from a switch stand point? *


I think that you could also cascade 2 SW44s together to get the additional outputs. I know that I've seen pictures of cascading 2 SW64s together, so I would assume that you could do it with the SW44s as well. If I remember right, there are a couple of other parts that you have to install on the lines as well to make this work. If you want, I could do some research and see if I can dig up the setup for you.

I agree with Rking - going to the dishpro switches would probably be easier (but not cheaper most likely).


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

The only problem with DishPro switches is that your old receivers will not work with them. 

There will be adapters available soon however the price of these "Legacy" adaptors will be around $60 each (and one will be needed on each old stile receiver.


----------



## Danny R

*one of the first thing the 721 does at bootup is is validates the hard drive. *

Seems to me then that the best bet would be to upgrade the hard drive before bootup. However you'd have to have a method of properly cloning the old one to the new first.

Do you have enough of a view to see if their room in the 721 to add a second drive?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Danny I don't know if you can add a new drive, there is a possibility that there is some software on the drive loaded from the Factory which helps the 721 first boot.


----------



## Danny R

Yeah, I'm sure there is. It would have to be hacked. But is there even room to do so is my question.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

No room that I see through the vents.


----------



## Richard King

> The only problem with DishPro switches is that your old receivers will not work with them.


You are correct, but since he referred to "one of his 301's" I assumed he has four 301's, which will work with DishPro.


----------



## Randy_B

> _Originally posted by Rking401 _
> *
> The best thing to do now is think in terms of tuners, not receivers. *


Great point! This new point of view will become more important as technology advances. A lot of "tricks" can be done inside the equipment, but for the foreseeable future it will continue to take one feed for one tuner, regardless of the eventual output.


----------



## SParker

If 90 hours isn't enough recording time for you guys you watch too much TV!


----------



## EvanS

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Craig the only way you will get this 721 out of my hands is to pry the remote from my dead hands.  *


*

Scott,
I dunno about Craig but I am in NO WAY above coming over there and taking possession!!! :eek2: 
But you have another few months I guess, cuz I will save the trip until the leaves turn back there!! *


----------



## Jacob S

QUOTE: It appears that the 2 hour buffer is per window. You can pause the PIP window but first you must make the pip window you want to pause full screen pause it then make it your pip window again (it will not be paused)

I am curious how you can pause both the PIP and the main window by switching them if it will not be paused if you put the PIP to the main window, Pause it, then put it back to the PIP window not pausing the show that was in the main window in the first place?

If there is not enough room in the 721 for the hard drive then one could have a hard drive outside of the receiver and disconnect it from the receiver whlie u r out on the road putting it in a very cushioned box which would be a lot easier than cushioning the whole receiver. 

- Do they even make a bigger hard drive than what's in the 721?

- Has anybody ever tried putting a hard drive to a 301 or even a legacy receiver? Is this possible? 

- Isnt a 501 just a 301 with a hard drive? Can someone make their own PVR receiver? One where you would not have anything to do with the receiver.

- If they can make two tuners play off of one smart card then could someone connect two receivers in a home together and do the same thing with that as they do with a 721 to make both play off of one smart card? 

- Do they have to activate both tuners or do they activate the receiver as one with only one receiver number and one smart card number?

- Will the 921 have two smart cards or just one for both tuners?

One could make it record off air, on air, vcr tapes even, anything played over the tv set. That would be a new way of copying vcr tapes too by recording it to PVR unit's hard drive then playing it back recording that back to a blank tape in a vcr to record it.


----------



## SParker

anyone that has a 721 and has their LIL package does the 721 have local channel mapping yet or is that later?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Sparker,

No locals in Connecticut yet, but I would be that local channel mapping will come later once OpenTV is available on the 721.

Jacob,

Don't do drugs.


----------



## Guest

Scott - thanks for providing this outlet - it is the best source of info I have found on the 721.

Okay - excuse the question if somewhat redundant (and ignorant), but I have looked through the thread and have yet to see this exact situation. I have a dish 500 with one of the LNB's going to my gameroom dishplayer upstairs and the other going to the living room PVR501 downstairs. I want to ditch the dishplayer, move the 501 upstairs and put the 721 downstairs (bear in mind I have only one cable coming out of the wall downstairs). Can I get the two tuner support by "splitting" this cable or do I need another entire cable run? If possible I would like to avoid this run. 

Also - how is the future "free" internet scenario supposed to work? Will I still need an ISP? 

Thank you in advance for your patience and response.

Mark S.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Mark, you will need to run another cable. You can't split the cable.

No idea on the Internet as of yet. You will need an ISP, you will have to supply the broadband and Dish supplies the web browser.


----------



## formerxtian

Scott, Many thanks for your exhaustive review of the PVR-721! (Your wife must be a very patient woman)
You've got a lot of folks trying to come up with the funds for this new set-top. Keep exploring!!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks formerxtian and welcome to DBStalk.COM! :wave:

Hope you enjoy yourself here and visit us often.


----------



## BobaBird

> _Originally posted by Mark Lamutt _
> *
> I think that you could also cascade 2 SW44s together to get the additional outputs. I know that I've seen pictures of cascading 2 SW64s together, so I would assume that you could do it with the SW44s as well. If I remember right, there are a couple of other parts that you have to install on the lines as well to make this work. *


Both parallel switch solutions require adding a satellite grade splitter to each LNBF output, with load isolators needed for the SW64s.

Dual SW64 diagram and photo
http://www.dishnetwork.com/downloads/pdf/technology/installation/install-5.pdf
http://www.dishretailer.com/ts2000/tradeshow/00000315.JPG
http://www.dishretailer.com/ts2000/charles/P0000727.jpg (Large photo with Twin and Quad on the right side)

The SW44 hookup is the same minus the load isolators and of course the inputs from the 3rd satellite.


> *I agree with Rking - going to the dishpro switches would probably be easier (but not cheaper most likely). *


DishPro DP34
Switch: http://www.dishretailer.com/ts2002/Disk3/MVC-019S.JPG
Diagram: http://www.dishretailer.com/ts2002/Disk3/MVC-021S.JPG
24-tuner diagram (limit 6 receivers - 12 tuners if all are 721s - per account): http://www.dishretailer.com/ts2002/Disk3/MVC-020S.JPG


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Thanks for providing those links, Bobabird. Saved me the time of looking them up!


----------



## thomasmaly

> _Originally posted by thomasmaly _
> *I currently have an echostar model 3700 hooked up to my WEBTV plus unit and a VCR. I have ordered a dish model 721. Will I be able to hook up the 721 in the same manner as my current setup? I am totally non technical. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
> Thanks,
> Tom *


I have not seen any replies to my post, but it appears the 721
may be way to heavy technically for me to use. Any comments?
Thanks,
Tom


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Tom,

You will need another line run from your Dish (or switch) to your 721, as it needs two feeds.

Once you have that done, the 721 is a breeze to operate.


----------



## Guest

Scott, 

Thanks for the response. I feared the answer was such!

Keep up the good work - you are doing everyone a great service.

Mark S.


----------



## thomasmaly

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Tom,
> 
> You will need another line run from your Dish (or switch) to your 721, as it needs two feeds.
> 
> Once you have that done, the 721 is a breeze to operate. *


Scott, can I just use a splitter from my existing dish line to generate the 2nd feed?
Thanks for your patience.
Tom


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

No you can NOT use a splitter. It must be a direct line from the LNB or from your switch.


----------



## Jacob S

When you are using the browse feature can you search more than the next show ahead like two or three shows ahead and if you can how far ahead can you browse?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Just to the next show ahead


----------



## Hoosier

Sorry I am confused about hooking the PVR 721 up to SW64 switch? I presently have four recievers hook up to this switch...If I take off one reciever and add the 721 will that switch still work..because with this switch I have two open inputs left even with the present 4 recievers? I have Dish 500 with the standard dual LNB...Can anyone help sort this out for me?? Thanks in advance...


----------



## Guest

The SW64 will only feed 4 receivers, if you want to hook up a 721 (it has 2 receivers)  then you only have room for 2 additional standard receivers (1 input each).


----------



## Kagato

You can support up to 8. BUT, you'll need more hardware. Six DC Blocked Spliters, a second SW-64, and three feed through loads.

Here's the installation Diagram from Dish: http://www.dishnetwork.com/downloads/pdf/technology/installation/install-5.pdf


----------



## Greg Haynes

WooHoo!!!!!!!!! I just received this email from DishDepot about the status of the 721s. I got the email at 9:42pm so I'm sure others will be getting this email.

*Can everyone post your preorder date? Mine is 06-27-02. Just trying to get a feel on when I should be getting mine.*

721s Steady and 508s available

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Dish Depot Members,

We will begin shipping a large amount of 721s beginning Friday and continue through next week with hopes of having all Preorders and current orders filled within 2 weeks. We are contacting individuals via email to verify orders, which in some cases have moved individuals up in queue due to cancellations. Thanks for your patience.

A non-preorder item, The Model 508 (Same as the 501 but with the 80GB Hard Drive = 70hrs of record time) will be available for shipping Monday from The Dish Depot Store. Limited Time Sale Price of $299 with Free Shipping!

DISHPro Twin LNBFs are also in stock and will make for easy multiple receiver installations once the DISHPro 34 Switches begin to ship in a couple weeks.

508s ONLY $299!

Fast, Friendly Sales and Service Since 1997.


----------



## SParker

I ordered mine 7-3


----------



## Craig Fogus

I ordered mine on 6/16/02. No email as of yet.


----------



## Thinker

The diagram for the two SW64 installation above shows Feed-Through Loads. What are Feed-Through Loads and what do they do?


----------



## Kagato

I assume the feed through loads trick the SW64 into thinking it's directly hooked up to the LNB. Although according to the news release the Dish Pro stuff will allow up to 8 without all the extra junk you need for the dual SW64 rig. Although it might cost just as much. 

I ordered the 721 on 5/31 for DD. Haven't heard a Peep.


----------



## toddjb

Scott, 

In your updated review you comment that there is a FIVE SECOND lag between channel changes. You also comment that this is something PVR owners should accept. Please elaborate.

First off, ANY pause between channel changes has always been a big pet peeve of mine when shopping for TVs, VCRs & cable boxes. I would always try them out first. I found that my RCA tuners would change fast, any Toshiba TVs would always be annoyingly slow. Basically, its nice to have the video appear the INSTANT you hit the button...a feature all sporting channel surfers appreciate. 

So, back to PVRs. I see no reason for the delay. The hardware should be able to switch over to the channel immediately and then begin buffering the live program. If they do it in any other order, they're not putting channel surfing in a high enough priority.

(I know....the browse feature is quick, but that's just a band-aid fix since you don't get the video with it.)

Thanks again for the detailed & unbiased review,
-Todd


----------



## Neil Derryberry

My UTV does the same thing. My guess is that the box closes the file that it was using to buffer, deletes it, and starts another.... 

My channel change delay is about 3.8 seconds. I live with it.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Todd the delay is like that on ALL PVR's, remember that the satellite signal is saved to the hard drive and then played from the Hard Drive, this is how you can pause live TV.

It needs the buffer in order to have the PVR features.


----------



## formerxtian

OK, so DishDepot will be able to ship the units, and it looks like a great box. But no one has come up with a good hair-brain, Homer-esque scheme which will PAY for this thing! Any ideas are welcome. (I want one BADDDD!) :grin:


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Regarding the delay between changing channels - I experience almost no delay (less than a second) changing channels on my 501. Changing channels on my 501 is faster than on my 4900, and a bunch faster than on my 6000. Maybe mine's a fluke, but that's my experience.


----------



## formerxtian

Mark: Ditto, regarding my 501. I count about 2 seconds between pressing "CHAN UP" and seeing a picture on the new channel. (It's 1 - 1.5 seconds on my 5000, but then again, there's no hard drive to buffer to)


----------



## EvanS

> _Originally posted by Mark Lamutt _
> *Regarding the delay between changing channels - I experience almost no delay (less than a second) changing channels on my 501. Changing channels on my 501 is faster than on my 4900, and a bunch faster than on my 6000. Maybe mine's a fluke, but that's my experience. *


yeah, my 501 is not THAT fast, but 2 seconds max...no complaints here


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

When I say 5 seconds that is a general time. If I change to a channel which is on the same satellite the speed is much faster, but if the 721 must change the switch to switch to another satellite then it takes a little longer.


----------



## formerxtian

Scott: Yeah, that explains why I was getting longer and shorter times, depending on channels.


----------



## Bill D

Scott, just got my 721 yesterday, here is one thing that bothers me(minor thing). If you pause a channel, call up the PIP, and do a swap, the only way to keep that first channel paused is to keep the PIP up, if you close PIP and later go back, it stopped buffering the pause and is back to live. If you set up a record on the first channel, then bury it, it does let you obviously go back and pick up where you left off (rewinding to that spot)
I think it should keep that pause going, should be no reason why it can't???
Besides the problems I described under the 721 Glitch thread, it is very cool, and extremely fast, especially after waiting 30 seconds for the video in the guide to pop up on a 4900.
Also love the 9 day guide. 
Bill


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I I think that when you shut the PIP off it also shuts off the second tuner completely. The seond tuner is only on when recording or is in PIP mode. (Which is why I think it takes a few seconds for the PIP to appear when you turn it on)


----------



## Bill D

I was thinking about the getting to the 2nd tuner thing.. Scott when I read your original review about how you said it would be great if they could make a way to get to the other tuner with 1 button (like recall works)
Maybe Dish could make it so swap when the PIP isn't on switches to the other tuner, this would be a little faster, although the PIP wasy isn't terrible, just a little slow, like changing channels, as the hardrive starts buffering...


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Bill, I have heard from Dish Network and they are working on the changing between tuners.

They ARE listening 

This is what will make the 721 a GREAT product!


----------



## Guest

Bill D,

Where did you buy your 721 from? Did you get it in the kit? If so, what switch comes with the kit and what type of LNB does the dish have?

Thanks,
Jason


----------



## DRJDAN

Scott what do you know about the 721 keyboard? I saw the attached on Satellite One web site,


----------



## waxdonuts

Scott,

Can you confirm for me that the 721 supports simultanious output on all the output connections? I.E. S-video and RCA at the same time, both Audio connections at the same time as the DD output.

I want to connect the 721 to drive more than one TV at the same time.

Thanks!


----------



## Bill D

> _Originally posted by makurof _
> *Bill D,
> 
> Where did you buy your 721 from? Did you get it in the kit? If so, what switch comes with the kit and what type of LNB does the dish have?
> 
> Thanks,
> Jason *


Makurof, I pre-ordered it last Sept from Dish Depot, and got mine July 3rd (just hooked it up since I was on vacation)
All I got was the receiver. I made my Dish 500 upgrade back in March and then soon after I got my Free 61.5 Dish for locals. I was trying to get a SW64 free from it but they wanted to give me a twin since I only had two receivers but the installer cut me a deal and I paid him $50 to get the SW 64, and he put it down as a Twin for Dish's reimbursement to him. I know the box did have a dish in it that was taken out I assume by Dish Depot, not sure what it would be (dish pro maybe)


----------



## Bill D

> _Originally posted by waxdonuts _
> *Scott,
> 
> Can you confirm for me that the 721 supports simultanious output on all the output connections? I.E. S-video and RCA at the same time, both Audio connections at the same time as the DD output.
> 
> I want to connect the 721 to drive more than one TV at the same time.
> 
> Thanks! *


I'll give Scott a break on this one..
Just like the 4700 (which has the same set of AV outs, everything is active at all times.
I just checked it out today when I watched the 721 upstairs for a little while. I feed the composite video and analog audio to my marantz receiver which has a multi room output that I modulate to RF and send back into my bedroom receiver's cable/antenna in. 
So more info then you asked but Yes everything is always active. Now if we just would have gotten some component outputs that would have been gold..
Bill


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## Craig Fogus

I am excited! I have not received an email from Dish Depot yet, but I just checked my credit card online, and I have a charge on there for the amount of the 721! It wasn't on there yesterday! I'm thinking that they are going to ship mine tomorrow!


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## Bill D

If they charged it then yes I think they are shipping it, did you get a tracking # via email..
Good luck, I love it after 1 day..despite the few problems I had


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## Jacob S

Is the Tivo faster or slower at changing channels than the 501?

How come can Dish not make their receivers change channels fast like the DirecTv receivers do on the non pvr products?


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## Swampthing

I currently have a Quad 500 with four receivers installed. If I only want to take two of those receivers, and turn them into outlets for a 721, could this be done with additional switches on the lines drawn from the Quad 500? It was mentioned here earlier that the Quad 500 has the capability of handling five or more receivers with the right combination of switches, so I apologize if I sound confused! If this is the case, what combination of switches would make it work right?


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## Scott Greczkowski

DRJDAN, The keyboard will be avilable once Internet access is ready. I would kind of hope that they package the keyboard and USB ethernet adapter together when they decide to sell it.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Swampthing you would be better off asking that question in our tech area. I am a dummy when it comes to switches.


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## SParker

this is probably a LOL question but will E* give us 721 owners a free keyboard and USB stuff? Okay LOL


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## Scott Greczkowski

I have heard that indeed that Keyboard and USB Ethernet Adapter will be free... _when pigs fly!_ :rolling:


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## Craig Fogus

If you sign up for CC autopay. <vbeg>  I couldn't resist.


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## marshalk

With apprpriate genetic engieering we very well could make a pig fly...well before we get free usb keyboards and ethernet adapters.


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## DRJDAN

Scott,

I thought the 721 had an Ethernet Adapter. If so, why would a USB Ethernet Adapter be needed with the keyboard? Is the keyboard USB?


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## RonPrx

I understand that the 721 is "time based" not exactly sure what that means, but I am new to the PVR game and had a question. I hear great things about TiVo and how you can search for shows under various conditions, actors, genre, etc. I also understand that you can select certain shows for the system to search out and record automatically for you, as well as setting season passes, and such.

Does the 721 have any of these features, and if so are they comparable? If the 721 does not have these features, is this something that will be added, or in your collective opinions not necessary?

Thanks

Ron


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## Nick

The KB should be IR, like the DP.


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## Greg Haynes

This thread is going to get awful long next week once everybody starts receiving their 721's


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## Danny R

_I understand that the 721 is "time based" not exactly sure what that means_

Time based means that you tell it to record a show, and it records from the start time to the finish time according to the guide. If the show changes its schedule and the guide is updated, the 721 isn't smart enough to adjust in the same manner as a Tivo. (Note that no PVRs are smart enough to adjust to time changes that are not reflected in the guide.)

_TiVo and how you can search for shows under various conditions, actors, genre, etc._

The 721 has a search feature that will search for what you want within the 9 day guide. Do a search for an actor, and it will find shows the that guide says have that actor in them. However you can't make it automatically record all shows that feature that actor as the Tivo does.

_I also understand that you can select certain shows for the system to search out and record automatically for you, as well as setting season passes, and such._

The 721 doesn't have this feature. You can look up a show and tell it to always record that same timeslot. However if the show changes time, you might end up with an episode of Baywatch instead.

_If the 721 does not have these features, is this something that will be added, or in your collective opinions not necessary?_

I would guess that they would NOT be added. The season pass is a pretty advanced feature of the Tivo, and given the skills of Echostar programmers I hope they never attempt this, or we are in for a long few years of constant crashes and updates.


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## Nick

_"...given the skills of Echostar programmers I hope they never attempt this, or we are in for a long few years of constant crashes and updates."_

Ouch!


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## Craig Fogus

Hmmmm....I'm thinking that this probably wasn't a good way to encourage the Echostar programmers to listen to us.


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## John Corn

I agree with Greg Hayne's post regarding this thread, it's starting to get hard to look through. There will be several of us getting 721's with the next couple of weeks and we maybe should start another thread regarding " Tip's and Features".....something like that anyways. Any suggestions?


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## Bill D

John sounds good to me, we already have the 721 glitch thread, which thankfully is very short and hasn't been touched for a while.


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## RonPrx

Thank you for the feedback on the 721 features. I'm thinking that the best way to go is with a seperate TiVo and Sat box. ANy suggestions?


Ron


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## Jacob S

Now you know why I started up a website based on just the PVR and the features people want especially with all of the possibilities of the 721. Maybe they will make a module with more memory to add to the unit and more advanced features if that module would be bought. I also want to have a place on my site that lists all of the bugs. Mary D. said that she would like to see the contents of the site and give that info to the tech people. I want to find out what can and cannot be done and what is being considered and being worked on. I want to have my ideas rated so that they know which ones are in the most demand to be added.


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## Danny R

_I'm thinking that this probably wasn't a good way to encourage the Echostar programmers to listen to us._

Sorry, just being realistic. It seems overly optimistic to expect such an advanced feature to be added on to a product that doesn't support it out the door. The 501 has enough timer troubles as it is, which I'm betting the 721 also has hidden away. If you start playing around with changing timers and suggestions, etc, then you are bound to introduce bugs.

Now don't get me wrong, I'd love for the 721 to gain the features of a Tivo. But I've also had my 501 since month 1 and have suffered numerous program losses with various upgrades. And I've not got an axe to grind against Echostar. I love my 501. It finally has emerged as a relatively stable platform. However it took a year to get it that way.

While I like Tivo's features, I don't own one. I like Echostar's programming much better (Superstations, more movie stations, more HDTV, ability to PVR music channels, etc). Tivo's main advantage is that they have been doing this much longer. Early adopters of it also suffered through numerous upgrade headaches.


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## jasonf

> _Originally posted by Jacob S _
> *Is the Tivo faster or slower at changing channels than the 501?
> 
> How come can Dish not make their receivers change channels fast like the DirecTv receivers do on the non pvr products? *


I've heard people here say that "all PVR's" take along time to change channels, this is untrue. The UTV and DTivo change channels consistantly around 2 seconds, (just as fast as my regular non PVR D* receiver) and I have channel surfed 20+ channels many times without a glitch.


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## Jacob S

Why not have a forum dedicated to just additional features people would like to see on pvr units?

Am I the only one that has come up with a website that lists features that people would like to see on PVR's or had any others created such a site as well?


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## Guest

Just got my 721 today! I haven't noticed this bug mentioned here, but there are a lot of posts to wade thru, so I might have missed it... anyway, my locals are in the 8000s, and when using the 721's search function, it doesn't seem to look thru the "thousands" channels. Has anyone else experienced this? Is it a known bug? TIA!

Frank


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## Dmitriy

Jacob, I have a new idea for your website. It's for both, 501 and 721. I don't know if it's possible or not, but it would be a great feature. How about getting PIP for recorded and live shows? I mean something like 721's PIP but to watch recorded show and live show at the same time. What do you people think? Is it possible? Is this a good idea?


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## gsusser

The tech came to install my 721 yesterday, yippee. Unfortunately though, he had no idea that the receiver requires 2 lines. [i already have 2 receivers and the 721 is going to replace 1.] Armed with my knowledge from this forum, when I ordered the receiver I made it clear that I needed a SW-64. This is a small outfit I was dealing with and it seemed the owner had no idea what I was talking about, but that's another story. So when the tech came, he was going to install a second dish when he realized another line was needed (and he only came to this realization after I made him call DISH tech support). I refused to have the 2nd dish installed fearing the structure the dish is on cannot support another dish, plus it seems overkill.

MY QUESTION [finally] - he wants to charge me an additional $169 for the switch. I thought you could buy the receiver and switch as a package, no? So in essence, it would cost (for the eqpt.) $599 for the receiver and $169 for the switch. Is this justified. [they've already charged my card $775 which I haven't figured out - $599 + $100 (labor) + tax (6%) does not equal $775.

I wish I had half a brain so I could do this myself. The cabling is a little complicated though. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks.


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## Guest

What does the epg look like on the 501 and on the 721?


Is the epg just like the guide from the 4900 receivers or is it different?


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## Ronster

Scott, How many software upgrades have you recieved since getting the PVR721 and what version is it up to now??
Bye the way great job Scott, I am waiting for an e-mail from Dish Depot about my order. I ordered on 7/5. Hope they are getting more soon.


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## John Corn

Glen, This is what I did, I have a 4900 and a 501.
The 721 will replace the 4900.
I would suggest getting a Quad LNB, the switch is built into the LNB which will allow you to run the lines directly, just screw them in and run the line directly to your receiver.

The Quad LNB just screws right on to your dish, 2 screws.Take the old LNB off and screw the Quad on. No realigning of your Dish, nothing, just screw it on and your ready to connect it directly to a receiver.Of course you will have 2 running to the 721 and 1 to your existing receiver. Cost is $149.99 at Dish Depot.
Dish Depot was offering a trade in on the old LNB of $50.00, although it appears there not now, I would email Mark at DD or call him and ask about the trade in the the old LNB.
Final cost for the Quad would be $100.00
Here's a picture.
Quad LNB

Dish Depot has a Quad package with the 721 for $649.00
for both.
Quad and 721 packaged together

The $549.00 standalone receiver does not come packaged with a switch.

Another alternative would be if your installer could get the new DishPro switches.

DishPro Twin LNB

DishPro 34 Switch


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## Scott Greczkowski

> _Originally posted by FrankD1 _
> *Just got my 721 today! I haven't noticed this bug mentioned here, but there are a lot of posts to wade thru, so I might have missed it... anyway, my locals are in the 8000s, and when using the 721's search function, it doesn't seem to look thru the "thousands" channels. Has anyone else experienced this? Is it a known bug? TIA!
> 
> Frank *


I don't have local's so this is the reason I have not seen this one.  (come on Dish add Hartford locals PLEASE?)


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## Scott Greczkowski

To everyone else, I will answer your questions when I get back home.


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## John Corn

jz, the 501 and 4900 epg look alike. The 501 is a 9 day guide the 4900 is something like a 2 day guide.

The 721 looks slightly different in color
721 EPG, Click Here


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## Guest

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *
> 
> I don't have local's so this is the reason I have not seen this one.  (come on Dish add Hartford locals PLEASE?) *


Never mind... I left the receiver off overnight, and this morning it seems to be including the "thousands" channels in the search. Maybe it took awhile to index all the EPG data for searching? Anyway, my note SEEMS to be a false alarm. I'll speak up if it rears its head again.


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## gsusser

> _Originally posted by John Corn _
> *Glen, This is what I did, I have a 4900 and a 501.
> The 721 will replace the 4900.
> I would suggest getting a Quad LNB, the switch is built into the LNB which will allow you to run the lines directly, just screw them in and run the line directly to your receiver. *


John, thanks so much for the info. I was originally going to go through dish depot but I thought I'd get better service if I did everything locally. Lesson learned. I printed out your message and the links you provided and am going to pass this on to the local dealer. Thanks again.


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## FrankD1

I forgot to mention this minor bug... (I don't think this is a false alarm). When in menu->setup->telephone, I attempted to put *70 in as a dialing prefix to disable call waiting (not that I ever buy PPV). Anyway, I can't seem to put the asterisk in... whenever I hit the asterisk key on the remote, the asterisk appears briefly in the onscreen field, but then disappears immediately after releasing the key. Has this been mentioned alrerady?


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## Craig Fogus

FWIW, I have call waiting, and I do not disable it using *70, on my 501. I haven't had any problems even with my other receivers.


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## formerxtian

"I have call waiting, and I do not disable it using *70, on my 501"
----------------------------------------------------

My D-VHS used to try to make a daily call, even though I never purchase PPV. It doesn't call anymore, AFAIK. 
So, if it gets interrupted by Call Waiting while making a call-out, I don't think it will cause any problems. (I'm assuming that if it needs to upload purchases from your SmartCard, it will try until successful)


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## Scott Greczkowski

Your Pay Per View calls are less the 45 seconds long, you should not need to disable call waiting.

And if its interupted it will try again at another time.

I don't really consider this bug a bug.


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## Scott Greczkowski

The current 721 software version is (As of Today July 14th)

Boot Version: 10GB
Flash Version: 10GL
Software Version: L100HABD-N


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## Greg Haynes

Do I need to have a telephone line plugged into the 721 for updates, or are the updates done by satellite?

I never have ran a telephone line to any of my receivers before since I never buy any PPV movies.

*[Message Edited by Scott Greczkowski]*
Edited this one to answer the question here since I am closing this topic, but I want this question to have and answer.

The updates are made via satellite. You do not need a phone line plugged into the 721 in order to operate it.


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## Scott Greczkowski

Well folks with close to 13,000 views and almost 350 messages in this thread I am now going to close this thread, and ask that if anyone has any 721 talk to post individual messages.

With the amount of folk who are now getting there 721s we can better help by answering questions as they are posted, this will make it easier for new 721 owners to find the answers to their questions.

If they 721 generates a lot of messages then perhaps we can launch a Dish PVR message area. 

All new 721 owners are welcomed to post their reviews and are also more then welcome to answer 721 questions. 

We thank everyone for choosing DBStalk.COM as your source for 721 information, we look forwarded to providing you with the most in depth 721 coverage on the Internet.


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