# new contract with hd dvr even if you dont sign for it?



## suncom3 (Nov 4, 2006)

called dtv about issues I was having with a older hd dvr,they wanted to swap it out,I was out of contract at the time and didnt want to commit to anothter 2 yrs,after some time talking with csa they agreed to that. They sent a install guy out with the new hd dvr to swap,he asked me sign the new agreement when he was done,I said no,I worked that out with dtv,he said alright and left.

a month later I called them about a billing issue and they say im in a new 2 yr contract? how is that possible?

They do shady things in the way they operate...so in lieu of going to court what are the ways out of a contract,moving to a location where they wont let you have a dish or the dish wont work,the house burns down,military deployment,any others?


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

Follow the link in my signature to the tips and resources page if you look through there you'll find a link to DirecTV's website where you can send an email explaining the situation to Ellen's team who deals with issues such as this. You shouldn't of had to start a new contract it is just a simple mistake unfortunately not everybody knows how to fix these mistakes. The people at that email will be able to fix your issue with ease.


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## n3vino (Oct 2, 2011)

suncom3 said:


> called dtv about issues I was having with a older hd dvr,they wanted to swap it out,I was out of contract at the time and didnt want to commit to anothter 2 yrs,after some time talking with csa they agreed to that. They sent a install guy out with the new hd dvr to swap,he asked me sign the new agreement when he was done,I said no,I worked that out with dtv,he said alright and left.
> 
> a month later I called them about a billing issue and they say im in a new 2 yr contract? how is that possible?
> 
> They do shady things in the way they operate...so in lieu of going to court what are the ways out of a contract,moving to a location where they wont let you have a dish or the dish wont work,the house burns down,military deployment,any others?


You are not supposed to get into a contract for them exchanging out a bad box, usually with a compatible box. However, you will get into a contract if you upgrade your equipment. I believe an HR34 would be an upgrade since those are the only HR's that you can request by model. Did you upgrade any receivers such as from SD to HD or to DVR? Was anything else done in order to handle the new Box before swapping it out?


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

What older model HD DVR did you have replaced, and what was it replaced with? ANswer that question and it will pretty much determine if you should have had a 2 year extension.


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## bigmike200587 (Oct 25, 2009)

suncom3 said:


> called dtv about issues I was having with a older hd dvr,they wanted to swap it out,I was out of contract at the time and didnt want to commit to anothter 2 yrs,after some time talking with csa they agreed to that. They sent a install guy out with the new hd dvr to swap,he asked me sign the new agreement when he was done,I said no,I worked that out with dtv,he said alright and left.
> 
> a month later I called them about a billing issue and they say im in a new 2 yr contract? how is that possible?
> 
> They do shady things in the way they operate...so in lieu of going to court what are the ways out of a contract,moving to a location where they wont let you have a dish or the dish wont work,the house burns down,military deployment,any others?


You need to call and ask the following. When the order was placed for this receiver was it submitted as an ERP (Equipment Replacement Program) or was it done as an Upgrade? There are still some issues in the DTV system that shows an erp with a contract. This happens when the technician does not actually close out the erp order instead makes a shortcut and just puts that they are activating a receiver and then puts in the information so it looks like he done an upgrade while at your house. (i don't think they do this for money reasons just a shortcut to make the activation faster instead of pulling the order) I run into it several times a week. If it can be determined that it should have been an ERP instead of an upgrade the contract will always show on there but it can be documented that it is invalid and if you ever go to cancel you would just refer back to the date and it will be all good.

Mike


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

suncom3 said:


> called dtv about issues I was having with a older hd dvr,they wanted to swap it out,I was out of contract at the time and didnt want to commit to anothter 2 yrs,after some time talking with csa they agreed to that. They sent a install guy out with the new hd dvr to swap,he asked me sign the new agreement when he was done,I said no,I worked that out with dtv,he said alright and left.
> 
> a month later I called them about a billing issue and they say im in a new 2 yr contract? how is that possible?
> 
> They do shady things in the way they operate...so in lieu of going to court what are the ways out of a contract,moving to a location where they wont let you have a dish or the dish wont work,the house burns down,military deployment,any others?


Standard operating procedure. These aren't mistakes. It's done on purpose, and they hope you won't notice. Every time I swapped out a defective box for the same model, they re-upped my contract. I always had to call to get it fixed. I think it's very dishonest.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"mdavej" said:


> Standard operating procedure. These aren't mistakes. It's done on purpose, and they hope you won't notice. Every time I swapped out a defective box for the same model, they re-upped my contract. I always had to call to get it fixed. I think it's very dishonest.


If its SOP then it would happen to everyone. I've had several swap outs over the years. None changed my contract.


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## GerryC (Aug 25, 2007)

dpeters11 said:


> If its SOP then it would happen to everyone. I've had several swap outs over the years. None changed my contract.


I agree. I replaced two defective receivers in the last year and it did not change my contract.


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## iceman2a (Dec 30, 2005)

mdavej said:


> Standard operating procedure. These aren't mistakes. It's done on purpose, and they hope you won't notice. Every time I swapped out a defective box for the same model, they re-upped my contract. I always had to call to get it fixed. I think it's very dishonest.


NEVER had this happen when replacing a def. box! So it's not SOP!


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## joshjr (Aug 2, 2008)

iceman2a said:


> NEVER had this happen when replacing a def. box! So it's not SOP!


Your lucky. I have had it happen more times then i can count. Granted part of my problems are that they activate the replacement as a leased box instead of owned for owned but I call the Access Card Department as soon as they leave and have it corrected every time.


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## Barry in Conyers (Jan 14, 2008)

"Mistakes" like this don't just happen; they are either caused to happen or allowed to happen. Either way, it is a sign of sloppy management.


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

I just ordered a replacement box yesterday and as part of the closing spiel, the CSR specifically stated that since this was a replacement DVR, it would not extend my contract.


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

suncom3 said:


> ...so in lieu of going to court what are the ways out of a contract,moving to a location where they wont let you have a dish or the dish wont work,the house burns down,military deployment,any others?


I think the best and cheapest way out if a contract is to pay the ETF you agreed to in the contract. I'm not sure if any of your items would get you out of the contract.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

dpeters11 said:


> If its SOP then it would happen to everyone. I've had several swap outs over the years. None changed my contract.





GerryC said:


> I agree. I replaced two defective receivers in the last year and it did not change my contract.





iceman2a said:


> NEVER had this happen when replacing a def. box! So it's not SOP!


My guess is you guys always activate through the access card department. If you go through the normal channels like us other poor schmucks who don't know any better, then you get re-upped. I've had more than one CSR tell me that ALL receivers automatically start a new contract unless you call back to get it fixed, or unless you activate through the access card department to begin with. Not that I believe anything a CSR says, but it has proven to be true for me and many others. So I still contend it's SOP. It's happened to at least 3 people in this thread alone.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"mdavej" said:


> My guess is you guys always activate through the access card department. If you go through the normal channels like us other poor schmucks who don't know any better, then you get re-upped. I've had more than one CSR tell me that ALL receivers automatically start a new contract unless you call back to get it fixed, or unless you activate through the access card department to begin with. Not that I believe anything a CSR says, but it has proven to be true for me and many others. So I still contend it's SOP. It's happened to at least 3 people in this thread alone.


I have never talked to the access card department. I had some issue, they sent me a new box, installed and activated the new one, returned the bad one. No contract and through a regular CSR.


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## lacubs (Sep 12, 2010)

i had box replaced more then 10 times, (long story) without no new contract


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## suncom3 (Nov 4, 2006)

so to get this fixed months later you can either call and ask for the accsess dept or email ellens team?
I had a older hd dvr dont know the model,one of the original ones for hd..It was having issues,very slow,I called in and they wanted to swap it out for "up to date" hd dvr,I didnt request anything but ended up with a hr25.I was upfront with them about not wanting another contract if they were to do this,they did agree to this before hand.

while the tech was here,he said i had a older lnb,he swapped it out for the swm type and set it up to work with my wireless internet.


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## sdirv (Dec 14, 2008)

My comments here will probably make me "unpopular" (again).

I don't understand the obsession people have to being "out of contract".

I've been with D* for several years and could care less whether I'm "in contract" or "out of contract".....since I want D*'s services, have no desire in any of my wildest dreams to switch to Dish or a variety of local, available cable TV carriers, and am not interested in "cutting the cord" (I supplement my Premier Package with Netflix)......

Being "in contract" or "out" is pretty meaningless to me.....I've been in this house for 15 years. I originally had Qwest's (my phone company) cable TV offering until they discontinued it and replaced it with D*. Been happily with D* ever since.

To me, it's the same as my cell phone service. I like the service and the hardware. why would it matter if I'm in contract or out????


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## celticpride (Sep 6, 2006)

That was one of the reasons i left directv 2 years ago,I had a bad dvr exchanged ,I was mad because i only had a few months to go on my contract and they extended me another 2 years or was it one year? ,Anyway i couldnt renegotiate a new deal for that time period,so when it ended i went to verizon fios,now i want to comeback to directv. I'm waiting to see if verizon will carry all the nba league pass channels in HD,my only hurdle is my wife likes the fios but i always loved directv! stupid me i should never had left!,BUT i was upset at all the problems i was having with D*


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"mdavej" said:


> Standard operating procedure. These aren't mistakes. It's done on purpose, and they hope you won't notice. Every time I swapped out a defective box for the same model, they re-upped my contract. I always had to call to get it fixed. I think it's very dishonest.


Sorry but I have a problem with anyone saying its done on purpose. I have had and know others that have had to swap out a unit and not have this happen to them. I think it's either poor or not enough training or a csr gets paid different if there is a re up and they do it for themselves in which case they should be fired.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"mdavej" said:


> My guess is you guys always activate through the access card department. If you go through the normal channels like us other poor schmucks who don't know any better, then you get re-upped. I've had more than one CSR tell me that ALL receivers automatically start a new contract unless you call back to get it fixed, or unless you activate through the access card department to begin with. Not that I believe anything a CSR says, but it has proven to be true for me and many others. So I still contend it's SOP. It's happened to at least 3 people in this thread alone.


I have only talked to the access car department once and it had nothing to do with a swap. And the other people I know don't even know the access card department exists.


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## n3vino (Oct 2, 2011)

suncom3 said:


> so to get this fixed months later you can either call and ask for the accsess dept or email ellens team?
> I had a older hd dvr dont know the model,one of the original ones for hd..It was having issues,very slow,I called in and they wanted to swap it out for "up to date" hd dvr,I didnt request anything but ended up with a hr25.I was upfront with them about not wanting another contract if they were to do this,they did agree to this before hand.
> 
> while the tech was here,he said i had a older lnb,he swapped it out for the swm type and set it up to work with my wireless internet.


HR25? I didn't know they made an HR25. Anyhow, you might want to call them and ask what triggered the new contract since they did upgrade some of your equipment such as the LNB and SWM and wireless internet.Did he install an internet module? I think they are called CCK or CDK. How about whole home DVR? I don't know if that and the SWM are considered upgrades. Maybe some of our more knowledgable members can chime in.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"sdirv" said:


> My comments here will probably make me "unpopular" (again).
> 
> I don't understand the obsession people have to being "out of contract".
> 
> ...


I don't much care about being in contract, but I only want to be in contract when I want to be. I'm in contract now by choice.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"n3vino" said:


> HR25? I didn't know they made an HR25. Anyhow, you might want to call them and ask what triggered the new contract since they did upgrade some of your equipment such as the LNB and SWM and wireless internet.Did he install an internet module? I think they are called CCK or CDK. I don't know if that and the SWM are considered upgrades. Maybe some of our more knowledgable members can chime in.


When I went to SWM, there was no contract. This was to go supported on MRV. When I added my HR34 later, that triggered the contract.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

It's been posted many times but I'll post it here again.

Upgrade = Agreement
ERP/RMA = No agreement

If you have a technical problem you deal with the technical department and require them to send you a replacement receiver. 

The way this happens is if someone orders an upgrade instead of a replacement. This happens from bad communication or someone doing something they shouldn't do.

I know people that have left the company who love to troll here like to state that it's SOP but it's not and it doesn't matter who activates the receiver. The people who you talk to have 0 ability to choose if an agreement is added or not manually. The only way agreements get added are by systemic policies based on offers. It does happen and by people not communicating properly or by people doing the wrong thing. Sometimes it's customer driven and sometimes it's agent driven however if the proper policies are followed this shouldn't happen. When it does it's easy to verify and resolve if the account is ever disconnected.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

dpeters11 said:


> When I went to SWM, there was no contract. This was to go supported on MRV. When I added my HR34 later, that triggered the contract.


If you ordered a WHDVR upgrade but had SWM compatible equipment then nothing was swapped out which wouldn't have generated an agreement, I also believe there was a small window where the WHDVR swaps didn't generate agreements unless it was an ugprade as well, so that is more than likely what happened with you. Now if you order WHDVR and they have to swap out equipment an agreement is added approrpiately based on equipment type.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Shades228" said:


> If you ordered a WHDVR upgrade but had SWM compatible equipment then nothing was swapped out which wouldn't have generated an agreement, I also believe there was a small window where the WHDVR swaps didn't generate agreements unless it was an ugprade as well, so that is more than likely what happened with you. Now if you order WHDVR and they have to swap out equipment an agreement is added approrpiately based on equipment type.


Correct. Actually, thinking back, I was already under contract at that time, I'd gotten rid of my H20 and replaced it with an HR22 to use unsupported.


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## Brubear (Nov 14, 2008)

if it was an erp, why was a tech dispatched to install it? An erp is sent via Fed Ex. It sounds like an upgrade was ordered - probably at no cost - and you took advantage of that offer. If that is true, then it is a legitimate commitment. Unless it's a service call (or upgrade) no tech should ever roll, so I'm leaning towards the upgrade.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Brubear" said:


> if it was an erp, why was a tech dispatched to install it? An erp is sent via Fed Ex. It sounds like an upgrade was ordered - probably at no cost - and you took advantage of that offer. If that is true, then it is a legitimate commitment. Unless it's a service call (or upgrade) no tech should ever roll, so I'm leaning towards the upgrade.


Well there's still a question on what he got model-wise.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Brubear said:


> if it was an erp, why was a tech dispatched to install it? An erp is sent via Fed Ex. It sounds like an upgrade was ordered - probably at no cost - and you took advantage of that offer. If that is true, then it is a legitimate commitment. Unless it's a service call (or upgrade) no tech should ever roll, so I'm leaning towards the upgrade.


I'm not going to to go into the validity of the agreement but service calls can be seutp as well for free.



dpeters11 said:


> Well there's still a question on what he got model-wise.


Model wouldn't matter unless you're saying he got a TiVo or HMC.


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

Brubear said:


> if it was an erp, why was a tech dispatched to install it? An erp is sent via Fed Ex. It sounds like an upgrade was ordered - probably at no cost - and you took advantage of that offer. If that is true, then it is a legitimate commitment. Unless it's a service call (or upgrade) no tech should ever roll, so I'm leaning towards the upgrade.





Shades228 said:


> I'm not going to to go into the validity of the agreement but service calls can be seutp as well for free.


In late-June, I had an HR21-100 die on me (paused all the time, internal temp at 149 and an error code (that I forgot)). Called and talked with Tech support. They rolled a truck to fix the DVR ("we won't charge your Mr. H as you've been such a loyal customer since 1998."). Two guys arrived (on time) and it took them all of five seconds to say "your HD is toast, we're replacing your DVR". All they had were HR24s and 34s. I did ask for one of the 34s, but all I got was two loud laughs. And a brand new 24. 

No cost to me: no shipping, no roll-out charge and no extended contract.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

Even if an ERP or service call is processed incorrectly and generates a commitment...it's a matter of like 5 seconds to fix it. Just call DTV and ask for the Access Card Dept. it can researched and corrected...very simple fix


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## Brubear (Nov 14, 2008)

let me clarify my statement. A truck roll to a receiver replacement is rare but not unheard of. I see it commonly for an elderly or differently-abled customer. When an onsite tech activates a replacement ird as part of a service call through his handheld it should actually prevent a service commitment from being applied.
SOP now is that when a commitment -changing event (upgrade, programming offer, etc) occurs on an account, the caller is transferred to a third part agent who verifies the order/offer and th customer's understanding of what it entails, before applied.
If a tech rolled, he activated a new ird and you got a commitment, it sounds seriously like an upgrade. These things can fall hrough the cracks, but it is much more rare.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

Brubear said:


> let me clarify my statement. A truck roll to a receiver replacement is rare but not unheard of. I see it commonly for an elderly or differently-abled customer. When an onsite tech activates a replacement ird as part of a service call through his handheld it should actually prevent a service commitment from being applied.
> SOP now is that when a commitment -changing event (upgrade, programming offer, etc) occurs on an account, the caller is transferred to a third part agent who verifies the order/offer and th customer's understanding of what it entails, before applied.
> If a tech rolled, he activated a new ird and you got a commitment, it sounds seriously like an upgrade. These things can fall hrough the cracks, but it is much more rare.


For the most part correct ...but it all depends on how the activation is processed


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## iceman2a (Dec 30, 2005)

mdavej said:


> My guess is you guys always activate through the access card department. If you go through the normal channels like us other poor schmucks who don't know any better, then you get re-upped. I've had more than one CSR tell me that ALL receivers automatically start a new contract unless you call back to get it fixed, or unless you activate through the access card department to begin with. Not that I believe anything a CSR says, but it has proven to be true for me and many others. So I still contend it's SOP. It's happened to at least 3 people in this thread alone.


If it were SOP as you say then it would have happened to EVERYONE in this thread and everyone would have to call the access card dept. to get it fixed!
We all know the various levels of competance and training of CSRs, if you guide them the correct way it will not happen. Do not call in and tell them you "want to activate a "NEW" rcvr" explain to them you recieved a "replacement" rcvr and need to activate it and don't expect a contract extention. If they tell you "all activations require an extention" ask to transfered to tech support and have them do it! I found that being proactive but polite gets things done the correct way the first time, most of the time.


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

iceman2a said:


> If it were SOP as you say then it would have happened to EVERYONE in this thread and everyone would have to call the access card dept. to get it fixed!
> We all know the various levels of competance and training of CSRs, if you guide them the correct way it will not happen. Do not call in and tell them you "want to activate a "NEW" rcvr" explain to them you recieved a "replacement" rcvr and need to activate it and don't expect a contract extention. If they tell you "all activations require an extention" ask to transfered to tech support and have them do it! I found that being proactive but polite gets things done the correct way the first time, most of the time.


There was an issue a few years ago where there was a system glitch or broken system process where replacement receivers defaulted to extend a two-year contract when it should not. There were many, many threads on it and the problem went on for a very long time (ie well over a year) According to some of the D* employees that post here, the glitch was acknowledged and eventually fixed.

A quick search and you will find some of the many threads on it.


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## iceman2a (Dec 30, 2005)

raott said:


> There was an issue a few years ago where there was a system glitch or broken system process where replacement receivers defaulted to extend a two-year contract when it should not. There were many, many threads on it and the problem went on for a very long time (ie well over a year) According to some of the D* employees that post here, the glitch was acknowledged and eventually fixed.
> 
> A quick search and you will find some of the many threads on it.


I can understand that happening. That would come under the "mistake" or "error" catagory, not SOP. I can also understand it still happens today with "human error" but that avoided upfront on our (customers) side!


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

iceman2a said:


> I can understand that happening. That would come under the "mistake" or "error" catagory, not SOP. I can also understand it still happens today with "human error" but that avoided upfront on our (customers) side!


I don't disagree that what is currently happening is likely isolated errors. My point was, I wouldn't completely discount "SOP", since the issue was a widespread system problem in the past.

I say "SOP" because, at what point does a known system issue, that always innurs to Directv's benefit, move from being a simple glitch to SOP. Is it a month, is it a year? I don't know, all I know is the issue was very widespread in the past and they didn't seem to be in any hurry to fix it - if memory serves it was well over a year.


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## iceman2a (Dec 30, 2005)

raott said:


> I don't disagree that what is currently happening is likely isolated errors. My point was, I wouldn't completely discount "SOP", since the issue was a widespread system problem in the past.
> 
> I say "SOP" because, at what point does a known system issue, that always innurs to Directv's benefit, move from being a simple glitch to SOP. Is it a month, is it a year? I don't know, all I know is the issue was very widespread in the past and they didn't seem to be in any hurry to fix it - if memory serves it was well over a year.


Maybe they were not in a hurry to fix it or maybe they were incappable of fixing it in a timely manner. What I consider SOP is a directive from upper management to all CSRs that all replacement activations extend current contracts. I am not saying that they didn't ignore or act slowly to a situation that caused that error because they figured some would not notice enough to call back and have it fixed!


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## TBoneit (Jul 27, 2006)

The obsession people have to being "out of contract". comes from many sources.

1. An expected and not for the better change in income in the indefinite future.
2. Planning a move and afraid the new location will not be able to get satellite TV.
3. Barely scraping by financially now. 
4. Planning for retirement, not exactly sure when. 
5. You feel that no commitment gives you an edge when you call DirecTV for anything. 
6. Retiring soon, similar to #4 but you know when.
7. No other commitments, Including cell phone contract.
8. Everything is paid off, Including mortgage, credit card debt and you don't want obligations any longer.

Those are off of the top of my head.

I personally do not want an obligation as I see things coming that may make me want to change providers. Since I could be happy with a Hopper or a HR34 or Cable with a 4 tuner cablecard in my computer to use it as a DVR, I want to keep my options open.
That is one reason I have Basic Cable and Satellite TV as well as one backs up the other and I can DVR locals off of the cable feed.

It's nice that you are happy and nothing will ever make you change providers.



sdirv said:


> My comments here will probably make me "unpopular" (again).
> 
> I don't understand the obsession people have to being "out of contract".
> 
> ...


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

While I don't particularly care for service commitments, there are cases where you don't have a choice (assuming you want that particular service). A service commitment does not prevent you from ending service, it only puts a cost on it.

When I get a commitment, I accept the fact that if I want/need out early it will cost me a little extra. Only once have I ever actually terminated early and paid the ETF (was with an ISP, not DirecTV), and it was worth every penny to get out of that.

As to your reasons for no contract, most reflect financial limitations (barely scraping by, about to retire, possible job loss, etc.). Sorry, but if you are that close to the edge you have no business paying for TV service. Get a set of rabbit ears and save yourself a bunch of money each month. That's just my opinion though, which I recognize many won't agree with.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

Really? 3 people out of 30 million subscribers.....seems isolated to me


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## MrShowtime (Apr 8, 2009)

back to the original post with the signing after the receiver was activated.
Since the launch of "fist' you can't activate a receiver on your handheld, without first obtaining a lease agreement signature on the handheld. If you click "customer refused" it comes up with a message telling you to cancel the work order and that the box can't be activated. Obviously there are ways around this, but I'm not sure why he's trying to get you to sign the lease after. Unless it was an old paper lease?


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## csgo (Oct 15, 2006)

I had a HR-20 replaced about 2 - 3 months ago. It became so slow I couldn't stand it (it's one that I used a lot). DTV said they couldn't just replace the unit and had to send someone out. The guy came out and replaced the box (he didn't even bother to test the HR-20). He had some kind of handheld device to "close out the work order" and "activate the receiver". He then said he couldn't close the ticket until he "verified" a different receiver and gave me the last 4 digits of the access card. I looked it up on my chart (I have 11 receivers) and it was in an area I preferred he didn't see so I said, no. 

He then said he had to call in and get some kind of exemption. After about 10 minutes on the phone he asked me to talk to the lady on the other end... she asked me why I wouldn't let him verify the other receiver. I explained that I didn't want the guy in my house to start with and I'm not going to let him explore looking for another receiver. She started to say something... I hung up and told the guy to leave. 

About 2 months ago I got a call from a DTV 'field supervisor' who was "in the area" and asked if he could stop by my house and talk to me. I said no, and my driveway (1/3 mile long) is clearly marked as private and no trespassing. He said that DTV may have to discontinue service if I didn't cooperate. I said, "fine, send me the return boxes, and don't contact me again" and hung up. That's been at least 2 months ago and I've received nothing other than my usual bill. 

DTV likes to play all these games and I have no desire to play.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

csgo said:


> I had a HR-20 replaced about 2 - 3 months ago. It became so slow I couldn't stand it (it's one that I used a lot). DTV said they couldn't just replace the unit and had to send someone out. The guy came out and replaced the box (he didn't even bother to test the HR-20). He had some kind of handheld device to "close out the work order" and "activate the receiver". He then said he couldn't close the ticket until he "verified" a different receiver and gave me the last 4 digits of the access card. I looked it up on my chart (I have 11 receivers) and it was in an area I preferred he didn't see so I said, no.
> 
> He then said he had to call in and get some kind of exemption. After about 10 minutes on the phone he asked me to talk to the lady on the other end... she asked me why I wouldn't let him verify the other receiver. I explained that I didn't want the guy in my house to start with and I'm not going to let him explore looking for another receiver. She started to say something... I hung up and told the guy to leave.
> 
> ...


No games just protecting itself. You're willing to have them stop your service rather than let a tech run a test on a receiver that is stated to be at the residence. This isn't rational behavior and therefor will raise red flags.


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## rgs825 (Jul 25, 2012)

csgo said:


> . . . He then said he couldn't close the ticket until he "verified" a different receiver and gave me the last 4 digits of the access card. I looked it up on my chart (I have 11 receivers) *and it was in an area I preferred he didn't see so I said, no.
> *


That's why I never would put a receiver in my grow house. Never knew when those pesky repairmen would pop round. :lol: :rolling:

I did have one in the "50 Shades of Gray" dungeon though.


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

csgo said:


> DTV likes to play all these games and I have no desire to play.


I've got news for you, you're playing games too.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"CCarncross" said:


> I've got news for you, you're playing games too.


Yep. They need to send authorization to verify the guy is at your house, and that you have the randomly selected unit at your actual subscription address. Nothing wrong with that. I'm surprised the guy didn't ask them to verify using a different receiver if he had given them a decent reason why, like, my wifes sleeping in that room, and we are not waking her up, or something of that nature. Why anyone takes such a ridiculous hard line and is so rude when people are trying to do their jobs correctly is beyond me, especially when it does make sense what they are trying to do.


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## csgo (Oct 15, 2006)

CCarncross said:


> I've got news for you, you're playing games too.


Actually no. The repair guy could not produce a surety bond upon arrival and in hindsight I shouldn't have even let him in my house. In other words there is a very real possibility that his second job is not legitimate.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"csgo" said:


> Actually no. The repair guy could not produce a surety bond upon arrival and in hindsight I shouldn't have even let him in my house. In other words there is a very real possibility that his second job is not legitimate.


Wow. His second part was legit, it's normal procedure for all techs to randomly check when the system asks them to.


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## MrShowtime (Apr 8, 2009)

csgo said:


> I had a HR-20 replaced about 2 - 3 months ago. It became so slow I couldn't stand it (it's one that I used a lot). DTV said they couldn't just replace the unit and had to send someone out. The guy came out and replaced the box (he didn't even bother to test the HR-20). He had some kind of handheld device to "close out the work order" and "activate the receiver". He then said he couldn't close the ticket until he "verified" a different receiver and gave me the last 4 digits of the access card. I looked it up on my chart (I have 11 receivers) and it was in an area I preferred he didn't see so I said, no.
> 
> He then said he had to call in and get some kind of exemption. After about 10 minutes on the phone he asked me to talk to the lady on the other end... she asked me why I wouldn't let him verify the other receiver. I explained that I didn't want the guy in my house to start with and I'm not going to let him explore looking for another receiver. She started to say something... I hung up and told the guy to leave.
> 
> ...


DirecTV makes the tech either run and test from a random pre-selected access card and get a pass number in order to close the work order. If he doesn't get that code, he can't close the job and can't get paid for his work. An agent just verifies that you don't want him in another room and waves it so he can close the job and get paid. If you would have tried to pull that on me your replacement box would have been coming back with me.
No need to be an unreasonable person when somebody is just trying to do their job and following rules.


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## csgo (Oct 15, 2006)

MrShowtime said:


> If you would have tried to pull that on me your replacement box would have been coming back with me.
> No need to be an unreasonable person when somebody is just trying to do their job and following rules.


The worker was in my house at my discretion. He enjoys no right of any kind to be there... only at my will and desire. He is required by law to be properly licensed, bonded and insured, but this person was unable to present any evidence of being bonded. DirecTV does not have any right, implied or otherwise to inspect anything at my house.

I allowed him in my house for one reason... replace the HR-20. Once that was done he had no further business in my house, and I did not care to take part in a 10 minute conversation with some unknown person at DirecTV. I will not let him inspect anything any more than I would my gardener. Any rituals or obligations imposed upon him by DirecTV are not my concern.

I will only ask someone to leave once... after such request you are guilty of criminal trespass in my state (we also have the castle doctrine). So if he had refused my request to leave the best he could hope for is just a night in jail.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

Was the box he wanted to see connected to the Internet or a phone line?


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

All I can say is WOW...you really need to chill, and next time do your own self installs. That is appalling behavior on your part, and the sad thing is everyone will recognize it as that except you.


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## MrShowtime (Apr 8, 2009)

csgo said:


> The worker was in my house at my discretion. He enjoys no right of any kind to be there... only at my will and desire. He is required by law to be properly licensed, bonded and insured, but this person was unable to present any evidence of being bonded. DirecTV does not have any right, implied or otherwise to inspect anything at my house.
> 
> I allowed him in my house for one reason... replace the HR-20. Once that was done he had no further business in my house, and I did not care to take part in a 10 minute conversation with some unknown person at DirecTV. I will not let him inspect anything any more than I would my gardener. Any rituals or obligations imposed upon him by DirecTV are not my concern.
> 
> I will only ask someone to leave once... after such request you are guilty of criminal trespass in my state (we also have the castle doctrine). So if he had refused my request to leave the best he could hope for is just a night in jail.


Ahh, makes sense now, you are one of those people, greater than the common man. Everyone else is put on this earth to kiss your ass. Rules don't apply to you... understood. You ignore the fact that he has no id badge on because it is convenient to you, but once he's completed the only part of the job that you wanted him to, he's all used up so throw him out, right? Cuz you are king of the world... I would never refuse a request to leave (not that I have ever been asked to leave) especially from someone like you. But until that code is in, and that job is closed... that box is the techs responsibility, so it would be coming with me. Guess who owns those boxes, not you....


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## n3vino (Oct 2, 2011)

MrShowtime said:


> Ahh, makes sense now, you are one of those people, greater than the common man. Everyone else is put on this earth to kiss your ass. Rules don't apply to you... understood. You ignore the fact that he has no id badge on because it is convenient to you, but once he's completed the only part of the job that you wanted him to, he's all used up so throw him out, right? Cuz you are king of the world... I would never refuse a request to leave (not that I have ever been asked to leave) especially from someone like you. But until that code is in, and that job is closed... that box is the techs responsibility, so it would be coming with me. Guess who owns those boxes, not you....


 I assume that once the box was in, the poster did not let him take it out. He had already told him to leave. So the tech probably did the only thing he could have done under those circumstances, and that was to call in and find another way around the problem. At that point, the situation was in D*'s court.


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

MrShowtime said:


> Ahh, makes sense now, you are one of those people, greater than the common man. Everyone else is put on this earth to kiss your ass. Rules don't apply to you... understood. You ignore the fact that he has no id badge on because it is convenient to you, but once he's completed the only part of the job that you wanted him to, he's all used up so throw him out, right? Cuz you are king of the world... I would never refuse a request to leave (not that I have ever been asked to leave) especially from someone like you. But until that code is in, and that job is closed... that box is the techs responsibility, so it would be coming with me. Guess who owns those boxes, not you....


I don't know why you'd put yourself in that situation. If the box is installed and the customer tells you to leave, seems to me the best option is to leave and let Directv deal with it rather than tussle for the DVR. Directv can always close his account and make him return the equipment or be charged for it.

Though I'd be shocked if this situation comes up very much.


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## csgo (Oct 15, 2006)

CCarncross said:


> All I can say is WOW...you really need to chill, and next time do your own self installs. That is appalling behavior on your part, and the sad thing is everyone will recognize it as that except you.


All of the wiring, setup, etc. were done as "self install". I didn't personally do it but I had a cabling expert wire the entire house when I built it a few years ago. DirecTV supplied nothing... I even purchased the dish.

I didn't want the guy to come out... DirecTV wouldn't send me a replacement receiver, they said they needed to send a tech out... which I didn't want in the first place.

Someone asked if the receiver he wanted to verify was hooked up to a phone line or internet... yes on the phone line, no to internet.


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## 242424 (Mar 22, 2012)

Lots of people don't want a stranger walking around in their house, i can understand that.


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## csgo (Oct 15, 2006)

MrShowtime said:


> Ahh, makes sense now, you are one of those people, greater than the common man. Everyone else is put on this earth to kiss your ass. Rules don't apply to you... understood. You ignore the fact that he has no id badge on because it is convenient to you, but once he's completed the only part of the job that you wanted him to, he's all used up so throw him out, right? Cuz you are king of the world... I would never refuse a request to leave (not that I have ever been asked to leave) especially from someone like you. But until that code is in, and that job is closed... that box is the techs responsibility, so it would be coming with me. Guess who owns those boxes, not you....


It sounds like you're a DirecTV installer... if so you really need to have a frank discussion with your employer... you're very misinformed.

Rules do not apply to everyone, but laws do. In this case it was a matter of law, not rule. Any rules DirecTV imposes upon their employees does not apply to me and I am under no obligation to honor them.

If he had attempted to remove anything from my house without my authorizaton he would have spent the night in jail. Regardless of ownership of the receiver I legally lease it. Even if DirecTV were to recognize a technician as having authority to terminate an account (which is highly doubtful that they have any authority of any kind over an account) then there would have to be a charge order issued by a judge to the sheriff of my county giving him the authority to remove the receiver. Just as if you leased a car the lessor cannot come pick up the car at their discretion (there is an agreed upon process to follow).

So to put this as simple as possible... the only remedy DirecTV has regarding the "leased" receivers in my house is civil not criminal. If the technician removed anything from my house without my permission that would be criminal, not civil.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

dpeters11 said:


> If its SOP then it would happen to everyone. I've had several swap outs over the years. None changed my contract.


It's happened to me a couple times. I wouldn't blame the corporate entity that is D*, I'd blame the CSRs. I always got it straightened out fairly quickly.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

mdavej said:


> My guess is you guys always activate through the access card department. If you go through the normal channels like us other poor schmucks who don't know any better, then you get re-upped. I've had more than one CSR tell me that ALL receivers automatically start a new contract unless you call back to get it fixed, or unless you activate through the access card department to begin with. Not that I believe anything a CSR says, but it has proven to be true for me and many others. So I still contend it's SOP. It's happened to at least 3 people in this thread alone.


After my misadventures activating owned boxes, the only way I activate them is thru the Access Card Team. They don't seem to know much about anything else, but they do a good job with proper activations.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

inkahauts said:


> I have only talked to the access car department once and it had nothing to do with a swap. And the other people I know don't even know the access card department exists.


It exists and here's their direct phone number: 877-887-7994. I've got nothing but good things to say about the ACT.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

carl6 said:


> While I don't particularly care for service commitments, there are cases where you don't have a choice (assuming you want that particular service). A service commitment does not prevent you from ending service, it only puts a cost on it.
> 
> When I get a commitment, I accept the fact that if I want/need out early it will cost me a little extra. Only once have I ever actually terminated early and paid the ETF (was with an ISP, not DirecTV), and it was worth every penny to get out of that.
> 
> As to your reasons for no contract, most reflect financial limitations (barely scraping by, about to retire, possible job loss, etc.). *Sorry, but if you are that close to the edge you have no business paying for TV service*. Get a set of rabbit ears and save yourself a bunch of money each month. That's just my opinion though, which I recognize many won't agree with.


I'll agree with that statement. I've never understood people's priorities or how they arrive at them. We've got a couple rundown houses near us and they have dishes on the roofs and new Harley's or new cars parked outside. Meanwhile, their homes just keep getting worse.

Rich


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

There are times where something major happens that it's hard to predict. My wife found she had a tumor, but while she was employed, she didn't yet qualify for insurance. It was benign, but doesn't help all that much in terms of the bills that started coming in. At that point, even if you have a cushion, you start looking to cut back whatever you can.

Besides, some people do just consider a contract as them being in debt to someone, and they don't like that. They want to be free and clear in whatever they can be.


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## suncom3 (Nov 4, 2006)

hmm to get back to the subject,I didnt want a contract because I knew I could be transferred out of the county for my job for sometimes longer than a yr.Dtv also seems to give much better deals when your not under contract.I was hoping to renegotiate when I got back from overseas. I checked the model they gave me,it is a hr24.
They did install the swim and the wireless internet thing,the tech asked me if I had a router I said I did and he installed the dvr to work with it. He said it would not effect anything I had setup with dtv..
The comment about csgo having a grow room is hilarious,maybe that was his dvr loaded with porn in the S&M room...he sounds more like the type for that.Yesh If I ever get that uptight.......


Sending a email to ellens Team,here is a copy of what Im sending..please advise...

Hello

I was referred to Ellens team to resolve this issue by some better informed than I. They say that this is somewhat common..
I initially set up my account with a owned receiver in Fl without a contract yrs back,I knew I might be transferred out of the country with my Job.I don't believe this was ever documented properly either but it wasn't a issue at the time,I was transferred to Va and everything was fine,I moved To another house last yr in Va that was already setup with a dish,so I just brought my receivers with me and hooked them up.
I later had a problem with one of the hd dvrs I had.I called dtv and they said they would replace it,there was to be no contract for this. I talked at length with a dtv csa about this.They wanted to send a tech out to check everything else out and install the new dvr,He came and did this and found the the lnb to be old,he replaced the lnd and installed the dvr to work with my wireless internet. When he was done he gave me a paper contract to sigh.It was a 2 yr agreement,I declined and said I had handled this with dtv already,He made a phone call and then told me that would be fine,He gave me some other papers to sign that he had completed the the job and I was happy with it.
It has been a few months since then but It looks like I will be transferred now soon,I called dtv a couple days ago about some other concerns I had with equip and the csa recommended adding a feature to have have my dvrs transfer information since I apparently already had the necessary wiring. This solved my issue so I had them add it. In this conversation I also learned they did actually show me as being in a new 2 yr agreement. This information was entered wrong by the tech, can you please correct this and advise what I need to do when I am transferred and need to cancel my service.

Thank You


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## billsharpe (Jan 25, 2007)

wahooq said:


> Even if an ERP or service call is processed incorrectly and generates a commitment...it's a matter of like 5 seconds to fix it. Just call DTV and ask for the Access Card Dept. it can researched and corrected...very simple fix


I've had very good service from DirecTV, but five seconds to fix a problem?


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## suncom3 (Nov 4, 2006)

we will see about 5 seconds....


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

When you went to cancel your account they would have just removed the agreement if it was invalid.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

billsharpe said:


> I've had very good service from DirecTV, but five seconds to fix a problem?


yes literally


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## ThomasM (Jul 20, 2007)

sdirv said:


> My comments here will probably make me "unpopular" (again).
> 
> I don't understand the obsession people have to being "out of contract".
> 
> ...


Being "out of contract" isn't meaningless to me, and I've been with DirecTV for 12 years. When you have no commitment, you are free to make a change to a different service IF YOU DESIRE, and even if you decide to stay with DirecTV, they have additional incentives to offer you deals to stay.

I think what irritates most of the people is when they get stuck with a new 2 year commitment but get nothing in return. Referring to your cellphone service comment, when your 2 year agreement is up, most carriers offer you a brand-new state-of-the-art replacement phone for a fraction of it's retail cost-or maybe for free just to commit to another 2 years. When your DirecTV commitment is up you get......nothing.

When a leased receiver breaks down it should be replaced for a reasonable S & H charge of $20, but should not lock the customer in for another 2 years. When that happens, something is wrong with the system. In fact, there were court cases in which DirecTV PROMISED not to do this...but apparently they still do hoping customers don't notice. That isn't right.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

> When a leased receiver breaks down it should be replaced for a reasonable S & H charge of $20, but should not lock the customer in for another 2 years. When that happens, something is wrong with the system. In fact, there were court cases in which DirecTV PROMISED not to do this...but apparently they still do hoping customers don't notice. That isn't right.


as has been stated many times this is not the norm...erp is just 19.95 the mistake if it happens is easily rectified


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