# Intermittent tuner failure



## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

This is a follow-up post to this recent thread:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=186970

In brief, had HR21 with intermittent 771 errors, wildly fluctuating transponder readings, culminating in zero transponder readings across the board. eventually had zeros all the time (but originally would start, weirdly, at night at about the same time, 10 PM). Bought hr24, and alll was well for three weeks.

Last night, remarkably at 10 PM, got the 771 errors, zeros on the transponders, etc...and could not past the 771 errors on two resets. Exhausted I turned the tv off and this am, signals are rock solid.

When everything was going to hell, I checked my other two dvrs and they were just fine.

I even had a tech out here two days ago to inspect my dish and connections, so I doubt a hardware failure at the dish/swm.

any insights? weird about the timing no? there are other posts re: intermittent tuner failure (from '08) solved by returning for replacement, but am unclear still about possible cause.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

This happened before around here just about the same time of year too.
It turned out to be related to the Christmas lights turning on. The member had three sets on a timer and two wouldn't cause it, but the third did.
After much  and then some more , the power company did something that made it go away.


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## davring (Jan 13, 2007)

LNB's can become erratic with temperature fluctuations,'cold evenings can make them fail and recover in the morning sun. Although you have other receivers that don't seem to be affected, I wouldn't discount that possibility.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

davring said:


> LNB's can become erratic with temperature fluctuations,'cold evenings can make them fail and recover in the morning sun. Although you have other receivers that don't seem to be affected, I wouldn't discount that possibility.


davring,

FWIW, the problems did start once evening temperatures dipped toward freezing, although 10 pm here in Southern AZ is a little bit early in the evening any time of year to get near 32 degrees F.

I guess I could replace the LNB unit, although I have no idea how to it...although I presume it might require repointing the dish after install.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

peters4n6 said:


> davring,
> 
> FWIW, the problems did start once evening temperatures dipped toward freezing, although 10 pm here in Southern AZ is a little bit early in the evening any time of year to get near 32 degrees F.
> 
> I guess I could replace the LNB unit, although I have no idea how to it...*although I presume it might require repointing the dish after install*.


Maybe, not always. Swapping out the LNB is really easy as long as the dish is easy to get to. Should take less than 10 mimutes.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

shame i just spent $89 on a service call a couple of days ago if I might need to get 'em back here again.


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## armchair (Jul 27, 2009)

peters4n6 said:


> shame i just spent $89 on a service call a couple of days ago if I might need to get 'em back here again.


If it's the same issue, no charge for a return service call. Most likely, the LNB will be replaced and dish re-pointed if you insist on that.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

It could also be a damaged cable run. More than once, we've done service calls on homes where the outer jacket of the cable was cut/damaged and allowed water to get inside. The moisture will travel down the cable, so even if you cut out the damaged portion, the "good" part may still be full of water. You have to replace the entire run to fix the problem.

You can also have problems where cold temps cause the center conductor to contract enough that it will lose contact at one of the connection points.

One of the problems is the very robustness of the system; you can "get away" with doing lots of things wrong, and the system will still work MOST of the time. But if you want the system to be *very* reliable, you must do everything right everytime, or something will catch you.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

BattleZone said:


> It could also be a damaged cable run. More than once, we've done service calls on homes where the outer jacket of the cable was cut/damaged and allowed water to get inside. The moisture will travel down the cable, so even if you cut out the damaged portion, the "good" part may still be full of water. You have to replace the entire run to fix the problem.
> 
> You can also have problems where cold temps cause the center conductor to contract enough that it will lose contact at one of the connection points.
> 
> One of the problems is the very robustness of the system; you can "get away" with doing lots of things wrong, and the system will still work MOST of the time. But if you want the system to be *very* reliable, you must do everything right everytime, or something will catch you.


Thanks for that insight. One thing I have not done that piggybacks on your theory is I'm going to switch the cable run from my central closet to the "other" run. That is to say that originally when I built this home, I had two runs of RG-6 going from the central closet (where the main line from the SWM comes into the house) to each room. Now with SWM technology I have an extra run to each room just sitting there idle. Maybe there's some sort of damage (water, other) to that run. Why I seem to have the problems at ~10 PM is another story, but damage to this run of cable might very adequately explain why the other two receivers in my house have never had a problem.

In the end I think the 10 o'clock thing will likely end up being a coincidence as that is the most frequent time of the day I'd be watching TV.

One last question/comments about your concern about the cold and contraction of the central conductor. If that were true, wouldn't the problem be rampant in colder climates?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

peters4n6 said:


> Thanks for that insight. One thing I have not done that piggybacks on your theory is I'm going to switch the cable run from my central closet to the "other" run. That is to say that originally when I built this home, I had two runs of RG-6 going from the central closet (where the main line from the SWM comes into the house) to each room. Now with SWM technology I have an extra run to each room just sitting there idle. Maybe there's some sort of damage (water, other) to that run. Why I seem to have the problems at ~10 PM is another story, but damage to this run of cable might very adequately explain why the other two receivers in my house have never had a problem.
> 
> In the end I think the 10 o'clock thing will likely end up being a coincidence as that is the most frequent time of the day I'd be watching TV.
> 
> One last question/comments about your concern about the cold and contraction of the central conductor. If that were true, wouldn't the problem be rampant in colder climates?


Been really cold in NJ lately and I've not had any problems.

I'd stick one of your other receivers on the cable you're having problems with and see if that has the same issues. If it doesn't, you might have a problem with the original receiver.

Rich


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Been about ten days without a problem and whamo! zeros across the board (although a quick signal check while the signal was 0 on the 101 showed 80s on the 103 (?) and then zeros there too. my other two receivers were without problem at the same time.

Anyway after multiple rb-resets with cable switching, diplexer replacement, and even a new run of cable to my central closet, the only thing that got me back a signal was removing the AM-21 from the setup (although once i got my signal back i hooked the am-21 back in and everything remained ok). i took the am-21 out of the loop and will watch for any further changes. opinions as always appreciated.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Been about ten days without a problem and whamo! zeros across the board (although a quick signal check while the signal was 0 on the 101 showed 80s on the 103 (?) and then zeros there too. my other two receivers were without problem at the same time.
> 
> Anyway after multiple rb-resets with cable switching, *diplexer *replacement, and even a new run of cable to my central closet, the only thing that got me back a signal was removing the AM-21 from the setup (although once i got my signal back i hooked the am-21 back in and everything remained ok). i took the am-21 out of the loop and will watch for any further changes. opinions as always appreciated.


Not sure if this was mentioned before "but" this diplexer may not be passing the 2.3 MHz FSK comm signal that well to the SWiM.
You might want to try this without any diplexing the next time and see if it goes away. Sounds like this diplexer [or the combination of two if used] might be marginal for the FSK signal.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Not sure if this was mentioned before "but" this diplexer may not be passing the 2.3 MHz FSK comm signal that well to the SWiM.
> You might want to try this without any diplexing the next time and see if it goes away. Sounds like this diplexer [or the combination of two if used] might be marginal for the FSK signal.


What is the 2.3 MHz FSK comm signal? It seems that it has something to do with communicating with the SWM. If that is the case why would the other two units work? And if it is the problem, how can one use an AM21 in one's setup? FWIW, the diplexers I'm using (see below) have been in my setup for three years.

FWIW, I am using Channel Master 4001IFD VHF/UHF Satellite Diplexer/Separator (CM4001IFD) at all three units with an AM21. the other two units are HR21 boxes which have never had a problem.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

can confirm hr21 (I have 3) will work fine while a hr24 (I have 1) WILL have issues with this that match this scenario. I also have channel masters.
works fine...all of a sudden all zeros.
remove diplex, all fine on all units.
edit: see I need to update my signature too


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> What is the 2.3 MHz FSK comm signal? It seems that it has something to do with communicating with the SWM... And if it is the problem, how can one use an AM21 in one's setup? FWIW, the diplexers I'm using (see below) have been in my setup for three years.


Yes, it's what the receivers & SWiM use for control.
Diplexing has been unsupported for a long time. For the FSK signal to pass through a diplexer, it must pass through the DC circuit which has a large coke filtering out "almost" everything but DC, as the high pass side has a blocking cap, which is what feeds the SWiM.
So to answer "how can one use an AM21?", it would be to use a separate coax.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

fwiw after this started to happen last month or so ago I did try different combiners and diplexers, no help.
remove diplex and ran ota line to each tv, split there to go to each am21 and tv tuner.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Whether this is true or still available, I don't know:


> The NAS STD-9501 satellite diplexer is design specifically to work with the Directv SWiM (*S*ingle *W*ire *M*ultiswitch) technology. The special diplexer does not block the lower frequency bands that the SWiM technology uses to operate the system.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> can confirm hr21 (I have 3) will work fine while a hr24 (I have 1) WILL have issues with this that match this scenario. I also have channel masters.
> works fine...all of a sudden all zeros.
> remove diplex, all fine on all units.
> edit: see I need to update my signature too


That's actually very heartening to hear of a similar problem. Interestingly, what brought me down this path was what I thought was a dying HR-21 tuner, one that I took from room to room and saw that it was all zeroes at my two other receiver locations. While moving other functioning HR21 units to location of the "bad" one would find them to work just fine. So I replaced it with a hr24-500 which was fine for about 3 weeks before having the above-stated problems. I've since returned the "bad" HR21 to D*; I wonder now if it was ever bad...



veryoldschool said:


> Yes, it's what the receivers & SWiM use for control.
> Diplexing has been unsupported for a long time. For the FSK signal to pass through a diplexer, it must pass through the DC circuit which has a large coke filtering out "almost" everything but DC, as the high pass side has a blocking cap, which is what feeds the SWiM.
> So to answer "how can one use an AM21?", it would be to use a separate coax.


Well I might have to bite the bullet and go without OTA as my locals are covered by D* although you never now when a station might get dropped. I do have one unused run of coax going to each receiver location all going back to my central closet. I'm a bit loathe to split up my signal more than I have to---I assume it would probably be ok. Any comments you have on signal loss would be appreciated.

What do you mean by "control" in reference to the FSK signal. IOW, might that cause the transponder readings to zero out...I assume so otherwise you probably would not have mentioned it...

A couple of final "by the ways":

The receiver location that has been having the greatest problem is the furthest from the central closet. A rough estimation of the RG-6 run from the dish to the problem receiver is 75 feet; to the other rooms it is no more than 40-50 max.

When doing RBR and even unplug restarts I've found the status bar that creeps up from 0-100% will often abort way below 100% when the picture finally comes back. In the past, I think I recall the status bar going to 100% every time. Don't know if I have a mis-remembering of something there or might it be an important detail. :whatdidid


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

wonder why the tech even looked at it with it being diplexed.
I run from ant to distribution amp, 2 lines out of that to 2 rooms with a splitter feeding 2 am21 and tv at each.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> wonder why the tech even looked at it with it being diplexed.
> I run from ant to distribution amp, 2 lines out of that to 2 rooms with a splitter feeding 2 am21 and tv at each.


tech never looked at it. he just checked out my signal strengths at the dish one day. (BTW, when I click on the link to your setup I get an error that I don't have any privileges to see it...this happens on other's links...what gives...PM me if you know answer, thanks!)


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Since the SWiM needs to first do a course "tune" to select the transponder for the receiver to then fine tune for a channel, the 2.3 MHz FSK is what is used to communicate these commands.
What I think you're seeing is a marginal signal. The 24 may have a higher/lower [depending on which end] threshold and the longer coax added to the lossy path through the diplexer(s) are all summing up to be giving you this problem.
I haven't used the NAS diplexer so :shrug: , but if they have tweaked the DC path to pass the 2.3 MHz, it may work for you.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Since I have two runs of coax to each receiver location I am planning on running the OTA signal directly to each of my AM21 units to retain their functionality, but I need some splitters. Can I still use the green splitters even if I have MRV via ethernet? IOW, I know the green splitters are optimized for use with DECA; are there any contraindications for using them without DECA? Also, stupid question...can I run the new cable run directly to the AM-21, or must I use my old diplexer to "feed it what it needs" The former, no?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Since I have two runs of coax to each receiver location I am planning on running the OTA signal directly to each of my AM21 units to retain their functionality, but I need some splitters. Can I still use the green splitters even if I have MRV via ethernet? IOW, I know the green splitters are optimized for use with DECA; are there any contraindications for using them without DECA? Also, stupid question...can I run the new cable run directly to the AM-21, or must I use my old diplexer to "feed it what it needs" The former, no?


The green splitters will also work fine without DECA.
If you're using a coax for your OTA and not anything else, why waste diplexers to do nothing for you?


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> why waste diplexers to do nothing for you?


That's what I thought. For some reason, in my head, I thought I needed to "isolate" the OTA signal from the SAT signal that is on that same line.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> That's what I thought. For some reason, in my head, I thought I needed to "isolate" the OTA signal from *the SAT signal *that is on that same line.


but, but ,but... there isn't going to be one, right? This is the unused coax right?


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> The green splitters will also work fine without DECA.
> If you're using a coax for your OTA and not anything else, why waste diplexers to do nothing for you?


Wait a minute, to clarify, my OTA antenna is plugged into the OTA port on my SWM-8. It is not a direct run straight from the OTA antenna. That single wire comes directly to a central closet. From there the "unused coax run" (from the closet to the location of the AM21) will only be used for OTA.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Wait a minute, to clarify, my OTA antenna is plugged into the OTA port on my SWM-8. It is not a direct run straight from the OTA antenna. That single wire comes directly to a central closet. From there the "unused coax run" (from the closet to the location of the AM21) will only be used for OTA.


OK, then things are a bit different.
Either don't use the SWM8 OTA input, or use "the other coax" to feed your OTA tuner, but you'll need to diplex out and terminate the SAT port on the diplexer.
This should still help your original problems as you've removed the diplexer from the SAT input to SWiM.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> OK, then things are a bit different.
> Either don't use the SWM8 OTA input, or use "the other coax" to feed your OTA tuner, but you'll need to diplex out and terminate the SAT port on the diplexer.
> This should still help your original problems as you've removed the diplexer from the SAT input to SWiM.


Agreed. And thank you.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Since the SWiM needs to first do a course "tune" to select the transponder for the receiver to then fine tune for a channel, the 2.3 MHz FSK is what is used to communicate these commands.
> What I think you're seeing is a marginal signal. The 24 may have a higher/lower [depending on which end] threshold and the longer coax added to the lossy path through the diplexer(s) are all summing up to be giving you this problem.
> I haven't used the NAS diplexer so :shrug: , but if they have tweaked the DC path to pass the 2.3 MHz, it may work for you.


Well it seems like the diplexer is not the problem. Again this evening got all zeros(cold?...never during the day...my daughter was home sick in my bed today watching tv all day) Rapidly checked all other boxes in the house...all fine. Checked signal strength bars and they are varying wildly...after five minutes picture back------> off to type this post :computer:

>>>>>insert wife screaming from the other room, "It's doing it again"<<<<<<<

Go back to TV and note the following:

1-For a short period of time I have normal transponder readings for the SWM (and 100% on the strength meters) while zeros everywhere else.

2-For a period of a couple of *minutes* I have zero signal strength on one tuner for the SWM and 100% on the other---then the first tuner kicks back in to 100%

The only thing I haven't done (which I'm embarrassed to point out) is replace the coax line from the wall to the HR24. Just did that now :shrug: Strengths ok for now...

:icon_dumm

I don't know if i'm reading this wrong, but is this smelling like a flaky tuner again?

My big concern about calling out a D* tech right now is that this only happens at night.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

With two tuners varying and having a single coax feeding them, "the coax" shouldn't be the cause.
Doing a quick review of this thread, you've had two DVRs to this at this location, right?
If you have doubts about the receiver, can you swap it with another and run each at these locations to see if it's location or receiver that has this in common?
Weirdness prevails, so you may need to start going way out for the cause.
If location is it, then it might be AC related.
The SWM8 could be an issue, but it shouldn't be in one location.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Doing a quick review of this thread, you've had two DVRs to this at this location, right?
> If you have doubts about the receiver, can you swap it with another and run each at these locations to see if it's location or receiver that has this in common?
> Weirdness prevails, so you may need to start going way out for the cause.
> If location is it, then it might be AC related.
> The SWM8 could be an issue, but it shouldn't be in one location.


Yes, two DVRs at this location, a 3-year-old HR21 that had exactly the same problem that I swapped to a different location and duplicated the problem. My conclusion was that it was tuner failure. Tuner failure on that box started out symptomatically like my current box, but eventually I got zeros permanently after a couple of weeks.

Box and TV are plugged into a power strip, I could plug the box into a different hole I guess...TV never has flaked out. Could it be something with the external HD enclosure's controller communicating something weird to the main box? I assume whatever is going wrong, if it is in the box, is hardware based and not some sort of firmware or esata issue.

The obvious irony is that if it is tuner failure, I replaced a bad box with another bad box to the same location--sending me on this goose chase.

Like I said earlier, I would call a tech out, but I have yet to have a problem other than between ~9-10 PM. I'm not an engineer (obviously), but I wonder if there's something a tech could do to "interrogate" the wiring to see if there are any problems(voltage issues, etc) even if it is not manifesting in a signal dropout at the time of the visit.

Thanks again for your learned input.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Could two receivers have the same malfunction? It's not unheard of.
With it happening more or less at a certain time of day/night, I can't completely rule out issues/problems coming from the AC power, as these have also been the source of similar problems.
It would seem very strange for the external drive to have any affect, since it isn't "doing anything" during the SAT levels tests/checks.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

may have missed you removing all traces of ota, if so sorry.
unplug ota from swm8. this is how I had it and had exact issues you do. you gotta remove ota and diplexers from the lines.

mine worked for 2 years then suddenly stopped, and I also DID have hr21-100 units doing it too.
so now I am swm8 to pi to splitter to dvrs.
no ota, no diplexers, no issues.
I DID have to run swm to pi too, using swm2 port for PI gave flaky signals. SEE EDIT

edit: even having ota plugged into swm8 even if not used at dvr end caused issues. HAD to unplug ota from swm8 units.

EDIT: clarify- had pi to swm1 and dvrs all off swm 2


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> may have missed you removing all traces of ota, if so sorry.
> unplug ota from swm8. this is how I had it and had exact issues you do. you gotta remove ota and diplexers from the lines.


Can try that. Thanks. WIth my fear of heights that could be fun. Not. :grrr:



David MacLeod said:


> I DID have to run swm to pi too, using swm2 port for PI gave flaky signals.


Not sure what you mean by that. Isn't one supposed to avoid the SWM2 port for the PI?


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> With it happening more or less at a certain time of day/night, I can't completely rule out issues/problems coming from the AC power, as these have also been the source of similar problems.


VOS,

Humor me because I am not knowledgeable in these matters, and after having read many of your previous posts here and elsewhere, you clearly have great experience and scientific knowledge in these matters.

Why would some sort of AC power issue possibly adequately explain why I would have, as I mentioned earlier, 100% signal strength on one tuner to the SWiM and zero on the other, but a bad run of coax from the wall to the box would not?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Isn't one supposed to avoid the SWM2 port for the PI?


YES!


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

I misstated it, had tried pi to swm1 and then run everything off swm2.
point was (for mine) had to be swm to pi to dvr with NO ota at all.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> I misstated it, had tried pi to swm1 and then run everything off swm2.
> point was (for mine) had to be swm to pi to dvr with NO ota at all.


The MDUs used the third legacy port to power them too.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

I had seen that and considered trying it but at that point it was working well so.... :lol: left it


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> I had seen that and considered trying it but at that point it was working well so.... :lol: left it


It's one way to not have 15' of coax coiled up when you have the PI next to/near the SWM8.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

due to mobile home my swm's are mounted on drop down in crawl space and the pi's are inside on UPS. I make up the 15 for each by running swm8 to pi inside then back to splitters.

thats also something OP should check, 15 foot stuff.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

I've easily got 15' between SWM and PI.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> due to mobile home my swm's are mounted on drop down in crawl space and the pi's are inside on UPS. I make up the 15 for each by running swm8 to pi inside then back to splitters.
> 
> thats also something OP should check, 15 foot stuff.





peters4n6 said:


> I've easily got 15' between SWM and PI.


and 15' between SWiM and a single 1x2 splitter


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

I'm sure you all are tiring from my saga, but once again at 9:30 PM my signal flaked out. Zeros across the board except for the signal strengths of the SWM...99% on one tuner and "not acquired" on the other (see attached photo #1). Gave the RG-6 cable at the back of the box a wiggle and both tuners went to "not acquired" Gave it another wiggle, and was back to one tuner at 99%. To be clear, the compression fitting was attached tightly (to itself) and to the HR24. Drum roll please.....unscrewed the cable and reinserted cable and voila! (see picture #2)....with strong signals across the board. I tightened it only a couple of turns after reacquiring signal---not till I could turn anymore.

Can Rg-6 be *too* tight? Could I be just screwing these things on *too far*? With 99% signal on one tuner to the SWM, why is there no picture?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> I'm sure you all are tiring from my saga...


Not yet, but :shrug:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

If VOS is shrugging, the chances of a random tech coming out here and figuring this out are, what, 0.001% ?


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

slightly confused at this point, have you unplugged ota from the swm8 and removed all diplexers?


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> slightly confused at this point, have you unplugged ota from the swm8 and removed all diplexers?


Diplexers all gone. OTA not removed from swm8.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Diplexers all gone. OTA not removed from swm8.


Since David has had some of this problem and removing the OTA from the SWM8 seemed to resolve it, Please try that next.

Some of my :shrug: is simply because I'm not there "to get a feel for" what is happening. There is just so much one can do through the internet. :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Since David has had some of this problem and removing the OTA from the SWM8 seemed to resolve it, Please try that next.
> 
> Some of my :shrug: is simply because I'm not there "to get a feel for" what is happening. There is just so much one can do through the internet. :lol:


I understand. As I may have noted earlier I have a bad fear of heights which is "heightened" if I have to scale a ladder, so one can imagine going up to the dish would be a last resort. Maybe I'll bite the bullet and see how that pans out.

Thought the wiggling of the port on the HR24 might be simply indicative of, well, a crappy connector. Additionally, I have always screwed on the connectors until I can't tighten them anymore and thought that might be doing something. Seemed like backing off a couple of screws might be the logical next step. FWIW, I want to know what is wrong as much as I want my problem to go away, thus, I am only willing to apply one "fix" at a time, otherwise I'd never know which fix did the trick.

As, all your patience and help, has been appreciated.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Please stay away form anything but "a snug" coax connection.
Hand tight until you can't any more or a "slight touch" with a wrench.
Change coax if you have any doubts about one, but "snug it".
If you try any other "tricks" you'll simply be allowing more squirrels into the mix.
I understand your "issue" with the OTA input, but frankly I think this is the most important step to take at this point in time.

Got any neighborhood kids? :lol:


----------



## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> I understand your "issue" with the OTA input, but frankly I think this is the most important step to take at this point in time.
> 
> Got any neighborhood kids? :lol:


I'll do it myself. :down: It literally took me 60 minutes to build up some courage to get back on the ladder to get down last time!

I think i'll need to buy a pack of terminators first so I can cap the ota port once i unhook. I don't think i have any laying around. Do home depot or lowes carry those things or am i going to need to order something from solidsignal?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> I'll do it myself. :down: It literally took me 60 minutes to build up some courage to get back on the ladder to get down last time!
> 
> I think i'll need to buy a pack of terminators first so I can cap the ota port once i unhook. I don't think i have any laying around. Do home depot or lowes carry those things or am i going to need to order something from solidsignal?


Since it's an "input" I wouldn't worry one bit if it wasn't terminated [doubt I would terminated it anyway].


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

ok, thanks.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> ok, thanks.


"If anything" I'd use a weather cap [keeping water out].


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

without the ota being completely removed from the equation all of this is just wasting your time.
you can mess with connections and they will appear to work but I am telling you I had the same issues.
using different port on splitters worked a day or so, etc.
has to be removed, even if no diplexers the ota signal is still in the lne.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> I am telling you I had the same issues.


So who ever listens to a mainiack? :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> without the ota being completely removed from the equation all of this is just wasting your time.
> you can mess with connections and they will appear to work but I am telling you I had the same issues.
> using different port on splitters worked a day or so, etc.
> has to be removed, even if no diplexers the ota signal is still in the lne.


I hope by the end of this weekend to post a pic of me on the roof next to my dish...!


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> I hope by the end of this weekend to post a pic of me on the roof next to my dish...!


Please don't post the CSI photos instead. :lol:


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> So who ever listens to a mainiack? :lol:


other crazy fools with vise grips


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Please don't post the CSI photos instead. :lol:


Considering I investigate sudden, unexpected, and unnatural deaths as my line of work...your comment is more than ironic.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

could carry smartphone up there and we could shout words of encouragement to you 
I do want to know the end result.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> could carry smartphone up there and we could shout words of encouragement to you
> I do want to know the end result.


actually, that's what my wife does..while not calling me wussy and other NSFW putdowns.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

any updates?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> any updates?


waiting for the CSI photos.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> waiting for the CSI photos.


Will not have an update for a while. Moments after my last post above I was alerted to a local disaster unfolding. Considering the line of work I'm in as I mentioned as well, I'm sure you can imagine what I am talking about. Thanks for your continued interest :up:


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

be safe and be accurate


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Interestingly, right before crashing to bed last night I turned on my DVR-ed evening news. For some reason it wasn't recorded on the "bad" box in my bedroom, but I recorded it the living room. Lo and behold the recording was pixellated out and "771". This morning I checked signal strengths out there and they are normal everywhere _*except*_ the 101 satellite...instead of mid and high 90s across the board I had many 80s and even a 70s or two. So it is good news and bad news. I have the problem in another room *and* it is a room that is fed directly from the PI (not the same line as the other box)

So, yes, it looks like I need to pull the OTA line at the SWM...will get to that if I ever get home when it is light outside, but I wonder if this might be a symptom of a borked SWM. I have seen, I believe, V.O.S. and others suggest powering everything down including the PI, reconnecting the PI, and then one-by-one letting each receiver boot up fully. I wonder if this might make a difference in the case?; I'm sure it couldn't hurt. Do you think this sounds more SWM-ish or more LNB-ish?

Thanks!


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Power cycling the SWiM doesn't sound like it would address this problem. It normally is used when a receiver simply can't communicate with the SWiM.
Before anyone can know if a SWiM or LNB is causing this, you need to remove a known source of the problem.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

fwiw AFTER removing ota I did need to do this too, not sure I mentioned that.
also not sure why I needed too but....don't care


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Well, I got home before dark, tackled my fears and unhooked the OTA. Pic attached as proof. 

I think I almost borked two of my receivers when I returned to the house. I forgot how to unplug them the proper way (did a menu reset and then unplugged when power light went out). After unplugging and then replugging in the PI, I plugged in the first of my three receivers and got a "14" error (14-164 to be exact)..for those not in the know, this is pretty much what you see on-screen:

On Screen Text: “Internal Storage Error Detected. A problem was detected reading your internal storage device. Please call Customer Service at 1-800-DIRECTV and report the diagnostic code displayed below. Diagnostic Code: 14”

I literally rebooted 10 times with the same error. So I went to my second receiver and plugged it in and it refused to power up. The power light came on and then it went off after 5-10 seconds. This happened 4-5 times. So I'm cursing up a storm right now :new_cussi:, wondering if did something wrong until I go to my 3rd receiver, the hR24 and plug it in and it boots up just fine! Then I hear my son in the living room say, " Dad the tv is booting up in here." He's right, the second receiver is now booting up properly. Finally I go back to the first receiver and do 2-3 more RBR after getting the same error message above (error 14) and it boots up properly. Let's see how everything goes....

Can't anything---just---work?


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

5 hrs without OTA in the line and at 10:05 my signal went out on my HR24. Zeros across the board...but 100% signal strength on one tuner to the SWM and 0% on the other. Other receivers in the house fine during this dropout. RBR and back to normal..

So diplexers out and OTA out. What do you think? Replace SWM? As I said earlier, am hesitant to call out D* tech as the problem only happens in the evening.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

had one that was problematic after removing ota and diplexers, think I had to do the reboot swm procedure (mentioned above) and then rerun sat setup on that one unit.
if thats not it I would look towards lnb and not swm as its dependent on time.
if its the au9s 5lnb I got a spare on ebay for $20 shipped.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> if thats not it I would look towards lnb and not swm as its dependent on time.


Just curious, if it's happening only at night why you think the LNB is a more likely culprit (it certainly is a less expensive fix)?


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

moisture incursion, condensation forming internally.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

David MacLeod said:


> moisture incursion, condensation forming internally.


that's a good thought. But how would one account for two other receivers with rock-solid signals at the same time?


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

does not always affect all units, remember the lnb itself it a 4 tuner switch.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

David MacLeod said:


> does not always affect all units, remember *the lnb itself it a 4 tuner switch*.


This isn't how I would describe it.
With it feeding a SWM8, the LNBs are all locked onto each SAT and both polarizations. "Basically fixed outputs"
Any variation at the receivers would need to come from the SWM8 down, and not before the SWM8, as this is constant.

*peters4n6*
What you might try is a SWiMLNB, while I don't thing the LNB is the cause [as posted ^], these tend to be cheaper than SWM8s.
Next would seem to be swapping receivers.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> What you might try is a SWiMLNB, while I don't thing the LNB is the cause [as posted ^], these tend to be cheaper than SWM8s.
> Next would seem to be swapping receivers.


I think I'm going to replace the SWM-8 as a first try, as it should be easy enough to do on my own, even though the hardware costs are slightly higher. It is my understanding that your suggestion of trying a SWimLNB would require a new dish alignment, no? That is something that I cannot do on my own and would add to the cost anyway if I have to have a D* service call.

Thanks for the input guys. Any comments on why my whole reboot process was as it was?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> I think I'm going to replace the SWM-8 as a first try, as it should be easy enough to do on my own, even though the hardware costs are slightly higher. It is my understanding that your suggestion of trying a SWimLNB would require a new dish alignment, no? That is something that I cannot do on my own and would add to the cost anyway if I have to have a D* service call.
> 
> Thanks for the input guys. Any comments on why my whole reboot process was as it was?


You can change an LNB "carefully" without changing the dish alignment. There are two screws holding the LNB to the arm. Googling SWM LNB [shopping] shows the 3 LNB starting at about $24.
This doesn't receive the 110 & 119 SATs, but there isn't anything on 110, and 119 doesn't have HD, as it has local SD & some music channels along with international language programing.
You can still use the PI you have for the SWM8 with the LNB too.
It would seem like the cheapest item to try and you'll either resolve the problem, or have to move on to replacing receivers "would be my guess".

http://shop.globalsaw.com/DirecTv-S...src=froogle&utm_medium=CSE&utm_source=froogle

and

http://salestores.com/directvsl3sl.html

There are more so these are just to give you an idea of what they are/look like.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Any comments on why my whole reboot process was as it was?


Hard to guess from here, "but" they seemed to have been writing to the drive at the time and for whatever reason, came back with a glitch [or two] that took a while to sort through.
The power light/lack of response isn't that uncommon, while the error 14 was.
One thing that may help when this happens is to pull the power cord for 10 mins. "Cold booting" seems to help at times when menu & red button resets don't.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> You can change an LNB "carefully" without changing the dish alignment. There are two screws holding the LNB to the arm. Googling SWM LNB [shopping] shows the 3 LNB starting at about $24.
> This doesn't receive the 110 & 119 SATs, but there isn't anything on 110, and 119 doesn't have HD, as it has local SD & some music channels along with international language programing.
> You can still use the PI you have for the SWM8 with the LNB too.
> It would seem like the cheapest item to try and you'll either resolve the problem, or have to move on to replacing receivers "would be my guess".
> ...


Didn't realize they were so cheap. And just one wire from the PI and that's it? Wow, that should be really easy, although I hope I have enough slack to get it to the LNB otherwise I'm gonna need some sort of barrel connector/extender.

As far as the 110 and 119 are concerned. I didn't realize there was nothing (_nothing?_) on the 110. Losing local SD, however, may be problematic, although off the top of my head, I'm not sure what we watch in SD anymore. It might only be one of the evening or morning news programs that haven't switched over to HD yet. PBS still has a lot of stuff not in HD, too. Grrrr.

Nevertheless, $30 shipped would be an economical way to troubleshoot the problem. I could always just pony up $89 and just get the SL5-SWiM LNB and just be done with it and not have to listen to gripes about missing local programming. Worst case scenario (which will likely happen) is it will not fix the problem, but I'll have newer gear on the roof.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> One thing that may help when this happens is to pull the power cord for 10 mins. "Cold booting" seems to help at times when menu & red button resets don't.


Will keep that in mind. Thanks.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

In fact, if the 10 minute unplug doesn't work, try again for up to a day. It's weird but sometimes it works.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Didn't realize they were so cheap. And just one wire from the PI and that's it? Wow, that should be really easy, although I hope I have enough slack to get it to the LNB otherwise I'm gonna need some sort of barrel connector/extender.
> 
> As far as the 110 and 119 are concerned. I didn't realize there was nothing (_nothing?_) on the 110. Losing local SD, however, may be problematic, although off the top of my head, I'm not sure what we watch in SD anymore. It might only be one of the evening or morning news programs that haven't switched over to HD yet. PBS still has a lot of stuff not in HD, too. Grrrr.
> 
> Nevertheless, $30 shipped would be an economical way to troubleshoot the problem. I could always just pony up $89 and just get the SL5-SWiM LNB and just be done with it and not have to listen to gripes about missing local programming. Worst case scenario (which will likely happen) is it will not fix the problem, but I'll have newer gear on the roof.


Do you know that your SD locals come off 119? They also come off 101.
This depends on your market as to which one carries them.
If in doubt, cover your 119 LNB [cat food or tuna can works] and see, if you can't find them here: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=188487.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Do you know that your SD locals come off 119? They also come off 101.
> This depends on your market as to which one carries them.
> If in doubt, cover your 119 LNB [cat food or tuna can works] and see, if you can't find them here: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=188487.


I'd assume Tucson locals are on the 119. I think we're like the 66th largest DMA. There must be a chart where I could find this out. I assume only the largest markets are on the 101.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> I'd assume Tucson locals are on the 119. I think we're like the 66th largest DMA. *There must be a chart where I could find this out. *I assume only the largest markets are on the 101.


"The link"


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

http://www.lyngsat.com/packages/directvusa119.html

I think this chart indicate they are on the 119


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Just saw that. Doh!!


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> "The link"


Yep, 119


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Yep, 119


"Well" you could try the SL3S, and then pay shipping to send it to me and me to send you my spare SL5. My SD locals are on 101. :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> "Well" you could try the SL3S, and then pay shipping to send it to me and me to send you my spare SL5. My SD locals are on 101. :lol:


Or we could just switch houses. :lol:


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Or we could just switch houses. :lol:


I didn't see any trees [just shrubs] in your photos. :nono: :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> I didn't see any trees [just shrubs] in your photos. :nono: :lol:


Hey! Those are trees. I'm like 25 feet off the ground.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Hey! Those are trees. I'm like 25 feet off the ground.


"Shrubs" compared to "trees" here, midway up the Sierras.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

http://cgi.ebay.com/DirecTv-SlimLin...930?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cb2b9b5e2
28 shipped.
if it fails to fix issue you have spare.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

ordered a bunch of stuff from Solid Signal including an SL5-SWiM LNB. Will report back after install.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

peters4n6 said:


> ordered a bunch of stuff from Solid Signal including an SL5-SWiM LNB. Will report back after install.


Will I need to run any part of the satellite setup again after swapping out my SL5 lnb for the same LNB with the SWiM built in?

Also, need I power down the PI while doing the swapout?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> Will I need to run any part of the satellite setup again after swapping out my SL5 lnb for the same LNB with the SWiM built in?
> 
> Also, need I power down the PI while doing the swapout?


Power down YES. Change setup, no.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Power down YES. Change setup, no.


VOS-

Just read your sticky on splitters and am looking for some hand-holding here when I get my parts.

OLD SETUP-

dish---->SWiM8---[coax 1]--thru roof--->PI---->HR24
....................|
....................|
.....................----[coax 2]--thru roof--->2-way splitter--->HR21
.........................................................................|
.........................................................................|
..........................................................................----->HR21

NEW SETUP (proposal 1)-

dish/SWM combo--->2-way splitter--[coax 1]---thru roof----PI----HR24 
............................................|
............................................|
.............................................--[coax 2]----thru roof-----2-way splitter--->HR21
...................................................................................|
...................................................................................|
....................................................................................-------->HR21

(proposal 2)

dish/SWM combo--->-[coax 1]---thru roof----PI----4-way splitter---HR24 
..........................................................................|
..........................................................................|
...........................................................................------>HR21
..........................................................................|
..........................................................................|
...........................................................................------>HR21

Is either proposal better than the other? Perhaps #2 because it would have 1 fewer splitter exposed to the environment? Perhaps #1 because it would allow the HR24 (which is the furthest away from the PI), to have 1 fewer splitter upstream?

Thanks


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> VOS-
> 
> Just read your sticky on splitters and am looking for some hand-holding here when I get my parts.
> 
> ...


The goal/idea of this is to balance [maximize] the power at the end of each coax, while working within the coax structure in place.
The only real difference I see between #1 & #2, would be "if" the HR24 has a 50' longer coax than the HR21s. If this is the case then #1 would balance better. If all the runs are about the same, then there really isn't any advantage, as #2 would work and the "imbalance" with #1 would simply mean the HR24 would get slightly higher signal.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Thanks for that.

In fact, the HR24 is probably 50 ft or so further away than the other two units, so I will stick the first 2-way splitter on the roof (proposal # 1)

Still waiting for my parts which should be here tomorrow. I've recorded a bunch of things between 11 PM and 7 AM and found that I get 771 errors on these as well, so I'm thinking there might be something cold-related. All the problems seemed to start when our evening temps dipped below 40 and were worst when below freezing. It will be interesting to see if things are solved by the replacement SL5-SWiM. If I have the same problems after, one will probably be able to hear my F-bombs from many miles away!


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Well new SL5-SWiM installed without much fanfare, but I'm afraid I wiggled the dish a little too much and will probably need to have dish signal peaked again.

Before:

101 ----- 95-96%
110------95%
119------85%
99c------86%
99s------not acquired
103s-----not acquired
103ca---81%
103cb---89%
swm-----99%

After:

101 ----- 95-96%
110------95%
119------80%
99c------82%
99s------not acquired
103s-----not acquired
103ca---73%
103cb---85%
swm-----99%

Most concerning is the 103ca and 119. I hope I don't lose any local HD. Everything seems ok right now.

Will keep an eye on my old zero-ing out problem on the transponders. Hopefully, replacing both my old LNBs and SWM-8 will solve things.

Will update status as necessary.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

What's the deal with D*? I call them and tell them I've swapped out the LNBs and have lower signal strengths (as posted above) They tell me that they are perfectly adequate and won't schedule someone to come out and peak the dish. Instead they want to troubleshoot me over the phone. I just hung up because the service rep had to put me on hold (for over 5 minutes when I hung up) because I had the temerity to say that I would gladly pay for a service call. My local guy came out once for $89. I figured going through D* this time would be slightly lower or even free. Did I break some sort of service agreement by swapping out the LNB unit on my own?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

And you still wonder why DBSTalk is here, alive and well? :lol:
I think there is a 70% cutoff, where above they won't and below they run your through a bunch of hoops before they will.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> And you still wonder why DBSTalk is here, alive and well? :lol:
> I think there is a 70% cutoff, where above they won't and below they run your through a bunch of hoops before they will.


In other words, my 74% should be 69%


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> In other words, my 74% should be 69%


you could always throw a wet blanket/towel over your LNB and give them those readings. :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> you could always throw a wet blanket/towel over your LNB and give them those readings. :lol:


It has to be asked:

Are there any good youtube or other tutorials out there that would let me do this by myself, maybe with the wife watching the signal strengths on the tv while i'm on the roof? (i.e., no BirdDog or anything else) Or just too much hassle to learn?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> It has to be asked:
> 
> Are there any good youtube or other tutorials out there that would let me do this by myself, maybe with the wife watching the signal strengths on the tv while i'm on the roof? (i.e., no BirdDog or anything else) Or just too much hassle to learn?


First question would be "how well do you communicate with your wife & she you?" :lol:

Really, tweaking the dish isn't that hard. 
I find it easier to setup a receiver & display that I can see from the dish.
With the SWiMLNB, your need to "detune" to one side to "a number", then move the fine adjuster the other way, counting the turns, until you find "the same number". Then divide the number of turns by 2 and turn it back this amount. This has now split the distance/angle between the two equal "detuned" points. Do this for AZ & EL.
You need to loosen the locking bolts/nuts for both the AZ & EL, and then use the fine tuning screws that should have dials on them. 
"And then" remember to lock things back down.

For me these adjustments are so much easier than the part of yelling to find out what the screen is showing and trying to get a response [and why I setup a receiver & monitor].

YMMV :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Sounds easy enough...but I know myself and I WILL screw it up. It'll be money well spent to have someone come out. I think this time I'll watch the tech do it (even if he's using a birddog, or whatever) and in the future i'll be more comfortable trying it myself


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## jmikestock (Oct 9, 2008)

Not trying to hyjack this thread, but I have scanned through 5 pages looking for the final solution.

I too, am looking to solve a similar problem. After about a year of use, my SWM 3 with 8 way splitter has started intermittently loosing connection with receivers. So far, I have seen it at different times on 3 DVR's and 1 receiver.
I am using three DVR's and 3 receivers with one of the DVR's set up as a single line so as not to exceed the 8 ports.

I have, so far replaced the splitter without improvement. 

I have a spare SWM 3 in my RV and after reading all the posts my next move is to go get the other LNB and bring it home to swap. I'll post results.

Thanks for all the info above.

As far as swapping the LNB, the Slimline 3 aligns exactly the same as the 5. I don't think you will need to worry about changing the dish setup unless you trip over it. It's not that sensitive and if it were it would have already been moved by wind.


----------



## B Newt (Aug 12, 2007)

I was having a loss of tuner problem on my HR20. I found the problem to be the center contact on the coax female connector on the receiver wasn't making good contact with the copper wire in the cable.


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## jmikestock (Oct 9, 2008)

Well, I changed out the SWM LNB. No better. Found a corroded connector exiting the PI to the LNB. Changed. No better. Next step is to go get the PI from the RV and swap. The mate to the connector I changed could be bad.


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

Jmikestock

Sorry you're having so many troubles. All I can say (As I have relied heavy, if not exclusively, on the expertise of others) is that you are in good hands here at DBSTALK forums. Hope things work out for you. It looks like you're going through possibilities pretty systematically.


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## jmikestock (Oct 9, 2008)

Well I guess I finally got to the bottom of my problem. After swapping the 8 way splitter, the LNB and the PI without success I finally got to the last possibility, the incoming line. 

BINGO!


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

So far I have not had any problems with sat signals since replacing the SWiM-LNB combo. No dropouts. No "cold" related issues, etc... It looks like tht may have been the problem. I'll give it a couple of more weeks before I put that problem to rest.

When I hooked everything back up on the roof, I took the cable from the roof jack (which had quite a bit of slack) and just threaded it up to the output at the SWiM-LNB. If get a tech out here to peak my dish, did I not leave the tech with nowhere to plug into my satellite up on the roof? I think I'll need to rewire to have some "point of entry" to the system without have to remove the LNB unit.

Additionally, I have fresh lines going to each of my AM-21 boxes to maintain OTA. Two of my three boxes now also have great working OTA. The third (one closet to the signal) only picks up the local PBS (and rather weakly) The other two boxes pick up everything very well (I have 10 mile line of sght to antennas. So when I get home I need to troubleshoot that bad boy (It never ends, does it?)


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

A week now without any problems. Did have some pixellation for a 3-5 second spell during the wife's viewing of American Idol last night, but other than that things have been good.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

peters4n6 said:


> A week now without any problems. Did have some pixellation for a 3-5 second spell during the wife's viewing of American Idol last night, but other than that things have been good.


Time to update your sig... :lol:


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## peters4n6 (Jun 19, 2007)

thanks for reminder!


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