# ASK DBSTalk: 921 with cable TV



## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

I cannot get the 921 to scan and set up all cable channels. It can get a few but not all. The instruction book says either an antenna or cable feed can be used with the antenna input. I have Adelphia (mainly for the modem service but I also have security cameras modulated on the in house cable distribution feed. They are on channels above the cable channels. I'd like to be able to see whos at the door on my screen, or using PIP

It seems there needs to be a "antenna/cable" setup option to get the frequencies right for each.

Is this a bug? Is it something that can be fixed in a future software download? Is it something that is being worked on? Thanks


----------



## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

I assume you're doing a "Scan ATV". It's highly unlikely that the incoming cable is using ATSC (DTV) modulation. Note that the on-screen help says that it will only go up to channel 69, and I'll bet that's OTA frequencies, not the "oddball" frequencies that some cable systems use. In other words, I don't think there's a cable/TV setting like there is with EVERY OTHER TUNER OUT THERE.


----------



## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

SimpleSimon said:


> I assume you're doing a "Scan ATV". It's highly unlikely that the incoming cable is using ATSC (DTV) modulation. Note that the on-screen help says that it will only go up to channel 69, and I'll bet that's OTA frequencies, not the "oddball" frequencies that some cable systems use. In other words, I don't think there's a cable/TV setting like there is with EVERY OTHER TUNER OUT THERE.


Yes thats what I think too. Maybe Mark or someone from Dish can tell us if there is a "fix" in the works for this? 
I wonder if Dish realizes that this unit is going to be largely purchased by folks who have sophisticated setups in large homes, and many will have both cable and Sat receivers, infrared repeaters, modulators, and other stuff that a lot of the folks that buy the lower end receivers don't have (or need) 
This unit should be able to accommodate all these things easily. If this is to be the "top end" receiver, It should be able to receive cable, have an infrared input jack, be able to output a program on both RF ch 4 and HDTV resolutions at the same time etc.

I just got a new Sony 34XBR960 HDTV. Very good Digital tuner and super easy setup and integration of analog and digital station lists. Wish the 921 was this easy!


----------



## boylehome (Jul 16, 2004)

It should be software fixable. It does seem like a conflict of interest for a satellite company to have provisions for cable companies channels. :lol:


----------



## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Here's the scoop for "cable" channels-

Cable and NTSC TV (aka analog broadcast TV) uses the same channel frequencies from 2-13. (VHF) However the Cable company uses a different band of cable analog channels for 14-125. UHF NTSC is 14-69 but on a different band. This is why your TV set has to have a switch to select whether you have a UHF antenna connected or CATV connected for channel scan. 

Satellite STB's operate under different regulations and are not required to have a Cable TV tuner like TV sets and VHS VCR's The fact that you can receive a cable channel when tuning a satellite tuner with the cable from adelphia connected is just a coincidence that CATV and broadcast TV uses the same frequencies. None of the cable's QAM digital channels will work with the set top box nor will it work with the ATSC tuner input. You need a cable TV digital tuner to work. 

Before the 921 was released, I had posed the question to a developer from E*:
With my tongue firmly planted in my cheek I asked- Since the 921 has provisions for 3 additional tuner slots, any chance E* will make available a QAM tuner for Digital cable? Well that brought a big roar of laughter! So, to answer your concern about conflict of interest, No there is no FCC requirement that DBS must provide cable tuners and there is no conflict here. Just a coincidence that the 921 can tune cable analog channels 2-13 in the "ADD ATV" menu.


----------



## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

audiomaster, please read the posting rules of the 921 forums. Your title does not comply.

And in reply to your post, "What Don Said"...I seriously doubt that it will happen.


----------



## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> audiomaster, please read the posting rules of the 921 forums. Your title does not comply.>>
> Sorry about that. I see you fixed it, will try to be more careful infuture.
> 
> And in reply to your post, "What Don Said"...I seriously doubt that it will happen.


What a shame. This means that every home theater designer that wants to use a 921 must include a VCR in the rack to use as a cable tuner! More rack space and more complication for the owner. Do any Dish receivers receive cable? Or is it just the ones that record that don't?

And I think I got a hint in the Tech chat that an IR emitter fix is in a future software update. This nust mean that what I suspected is correct. The 921 does contain an IR emitter, it just is not activated!


----------



## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

The 921 will be able to send out IR commands so that you can teach learning remotes the codes, very much like the 811 can now. 

And, I don't know if any of the other Dish receivers can take a cable signal. I doubt it, but can't say one way or the other, as I've never tried it with any of my receivers.


----------



## n0qcu (Mar 23, 2002)

The 6000 & 811 and even the 5000 can all tune cable channels 2-99 so they really need to fix the 921 to do the same. (other things first, but it should be done)


----------



## Slordak (Dec 17, 2003)

audiomaster said:


> What a shame. This means that every home theater designer that wants to use a 921 must include a VCR in the rack to use as a cable tuner! More rack space and more complication for the owner. (...)


Why is this? While not all HDTVs contain an ATSC tuner (yet), they certainly should all contain a standard NTSC tuner and are "cable ready", so they can directly tune analog cable channels 2 - 99. There shouldn't be any need for a VCR just for this purpose.


----------



## audiomaster (Jun 24, 2004)

Slordak said:


> Why is this? While not all HDTVs contain an ATSC tuner (yet), they certainly should all contain a standard NTSC tuner and are "cable ready", so they can directly tune analog cable channels 2 - 99. There shouldn't be any need for a VCR just for this purpose.


If you're using a HDTV TV receiver like my Sony 34XBR960 yes, but I have an InFocus 7205 front projector in the theater and there is no VCR. The 921 IS the system tuner. I don't expect the 921 to get cable digital channels, but I think it ought to tune the regular analogs and include them in the menu and favorites lists.


----------



## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

The original law only applied to TV sets with built in tuners and VCR's with built in tuners. It does not apply to all electronic devices, specifically, monitors, and VCR's without any tuners or set top boxes. I also believe certain portable TV's were exempt when small such as a Sony Watchman or a TV set designed for mobile installation. 

OK, I disagree with you and have the logic to back it up. I don't think all STB's should be required to tune cable channels. Reason: Cable already enjoys all sorts of special favors in the laws offering advantages over DBS. There is no reason to force the DBS makers to add cable tuners to their boxes any more than it should be a law to require all Cable tuners to tune all satellite DBS companies. I have no problem with this if a company wishes to build a modular tuner a consumer can custom fit as he wishes. I just don't think it should be required with a favor for cable.


----------



## boylehome (Jul 16, 2004)

DonLandis said:


> The original law only applied to TV sets with built in tuners and VCR's with built in tuners. It does not apply to all electronic devices, specifically, monitors, and VCR's without any tuners or set top boxes. I also believe certain portable TV's were exempt when small such as a Sony Watchman or a TV set designed for mobile installation.
> 
> OK, I disagree with you and have the logic to back it up. I don't think all STB's should be required to tune cable channels. Reason: Cable already enjoys all sorts of special favors in the laws offering advantages over DBS. There is no reason to force the DBS makers to add cable tuners to their boxes any more than it should be a law to require all Cable tuners to tune all satellite DBS companies. I have no problem with this if a company wishes to build a modular tuner a consumer can custom fit as he wishes. I just don't think it should be required with a favor for cable.


Hope your weather calms! I agree, As Dish says, "Stop feeding the Pig."


----------



## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

boylehome said:


> ... As Dish says, "Stop feeding the Pig."


Yeah, but until we've got HD LiL, and many people can't get local HD OTA, sometimes, for some people the only option is cable.

I think the "correct" solution there is a separate cable DVR setup.


----------



## boylehome (Jul 16, 2004)

SimpleSimon said:


> Yeah, but until we've got HD LiL, and many people can't get local HD OTA, sometimes, for some people the only option is cable.
> 
> I think the "correct" solution there is a separate cable DVR setup.


Good point. Too bad that the law is so anti satellite local network.


----------



## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

While that's true (IMO), that's not the problem. HD requires at least 6 times the bandwidth of SD - there just isn't enough bandwidth to carry LiL HD feeds. Not even if D* E* and V* all shared their feeds.


----------

