# Is this for real? If so why is there no "First Look"?



## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

I did a google search of "Directv c31" and found this:
http://photobucket.com/images/directv%20c31%20rvu%20client%20device/


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

Maybe it's not public yet


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

I guess so. But according to photobucket the picture was taken a month ago.


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## Rtm (Oct 18, 2011)

Good find I say best pics I've seen of it so far.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Mfg date 12/31/11 eh? Looks like an H25 without a tuner. I still dont see why anyone would want one over an H25, since they cost the same, and would rob a tuner from the HR34...but who knows.


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

Well supposedly you get trickplay and some other dvr-like features with the c31.


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## Delroy E Walleye (Jun 9, 2012)

Davenlr said:


> Mfg date 12/31/11 eh? Looks like an H25 without a tuner. I still dont see why anyone would want one over an H25, since they cost the same, and would rob a tuner from the HR34...but who knows.


My thought's, exactly. Especially if you still have to pay an "addtitional TV" fee. But barring that, I guess I might be able to see some advantage of a simple, clean extension of the HMC system (once they get the "bugs" out).


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## Rtm (Oct 18, 2011)

Because you get the rewind and fast forward of live TV over the H25 and installers can stop installing SWiM-16 because the HR34 takes up 5 tuners.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Rtm said:


> Because you get the rewind and fast forward of live TV over the H25 and installers can stop installing SWiM-16 because the HR34 takes up 5 tuners.


You can do the same thing on the H25 by hitting RECORD,LIST,PLAY as far as trick play. So it boils down to saving DirecTv money at the subscribers expense?


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Davenlr said:


> You can do the same thing on the H25 by hitting RECORD,LIST,PLAY as far as trick play. So it boils down to saving DirecTv money at the subscribers expense?


It was always designed to be used with RVU clients however the server just came out prior to the clients so HD receivers have been used. There's nothing stopping this from happening in the future either.

So yes the whole point of this machine was to save money on equipment costs. At the customers expense I'm assuming you mean at the expense of live tuners in which case yes because that was always the design of the machine since day 1.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

Since the HR34 came out, there had been talk of not only RVU TV support, but what was referred to as the C30. Guess it was one number off.


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## dishrich (Apr 23, 2002)

Davenlr said:


> So it boils down to saving DirecTv money at the subscribers expense?


Pretty much spot on; just like the (tunerless) Joey on the DISH Hopper WHD system...


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

dishrich said:


> Pretty much spot on; just like the (tunerless) Joey on the DISH Hopper WHD system...


Never checked, but does DISH charge the same price per month for a Joey as a second full functioning receiver?


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

> Is this for real? If so why is there no "First Look"?


Probably because you weren't supposed to find those pictures yet :lol:


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Davenlr" said:


> Never checked, but does DISH charge the same price per month for a Joey as a second full functioning receiver?


Yep, $7.


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## TheRatPatrol (Oct 1, 2003)

"Davenlr" said:


> Mfg date 12/31/11 eh? Looks like an H25 without a tuner. I still dont see why anyone would want one over an H25, since they cost the same, and would rob a tuner from the HR34...but who knows.


I agree. With a SWiM 8 you can still have the HR34 plus 3 additional tuners without taking one away from the HR34. Just wait until a family is recording 3, 4, 5 things at once and the wife and kids want to watch something else in their rooms. Oh sorry, you can't, all the tuners are being used.

Unless of course they're working on an 8 tuner HMC.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Let's say the average home has 1 HD DVR and 3 non DVR's. The HMC has the exact same tuner count now but can record more shows and give trick play to all rooms. Average consumers don't have the huge setups that some people have on here. This was designed with those people in mind.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Shades228" said:


> Let's say the average home has 1 HD DVR and 3 non DVR's. The HMC has the exact same tuner count now but can record more shows and give trick play to all rooms. Average consumers don't have the huge setups that some people have on here. This was designed with those people in mind.


Right, and it's an option. It doesn't require it, like a Hopper only working with Joeys.


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## Brubear (Nov 14, 2008)

that is about it - it's not so much larger than a deck of cards, hdmi, composite and digital audio connects


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

dpeters11 said:


> Since the HR34 came out, there had been talk of not only RVU TV support, but what was referred to as the C30. *Guess it was one number off.*


No - wrong guess, it was really C30-700 by inspected spooled FW and acknowledged by DTV contacts.

Perhaps the model is just updated C30 and FW would be same as for HR21 and HR22.

I think the $50 bill placed purposely - it's hinted the box's price.


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## tampa8 (Mar 30, 2002)

Davenlr said:


> Never checked, but does DISH charge the same price per month for a Joey as a second full functioning receiver?





dpeters11 said:


> Yep, $7.


The answer is actually no Dish does not charge the same. A DVR is $10, Joey $7.
In addition a second or third three tuner Hopper is also only $7 if that was what was meant.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"tampa8" said:


> The answer is actually no Dish does not charge the same. A DVR is $10, Joey $7.
> In addition a second or third three tuner Hopper is also only $7 if that was what was meant.


How much does Dish charge for a non DVR receiver that isn't a Joey? I think that's what he was referring to, not comparing to a DVR fee.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"P Smith" said:


> No - wrong guess, it was really C30-700 by inspected spooled FW and acknowledged by DTV contacts.
> 
> Perhaps the model is just updated C30 and FW would be same as for HR21 and HR22.
> 
> I think the $50 bill placed purposely - it's hinted the box's price.


Well, It may be one off for a box in the wild. As far as I know, there are no C30s out there in use by customers, and unless they ship both, it was one off for a production model.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

hahaha "one off"


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

"it's one louder"


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## tampa8 (Mar 30, 2002)

dpeters11 said:


> How much does Dish charge for a non DVR receiver that isn't a Joey? I think that's what he was referring to, not comparing to a DVR fee.


Ahh, yes. Then his answer was correct, $7 for a joey with a hopper, or $7 for a non DVR with a VIP system. Still worth noting instead of a Joey for that same $7 you can get an additional Hopper with three tuners. (Up to three on the account)


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

Brubear said:


> that is about it - it's not so much larger than a deck of cards, hdmi, composite and digital audio connects


Actually it appears to be HDMI, "component" (through a proprietary 10 pin DIN to component AV breakout cable) and coaxial digital audio connects.


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

So now we know that the c31 is out in the wild, when is rvu capability going to come to our computers and mobile devices?


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

Here are the pics so there's not too much strain on your fingers copying and pasting.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

tampa8 said:


> Ahh, yes. Then his answer was correct, $7 for a joey with a hopper, or $7 for a non DVR with a VIP system. Still worth noting instead of a Joey for that same $7 you can get an additional Hopper with three tuners. (Up to three on the account)


For the same $6 you could get another HR34 as well but they can see eachother.

There are plenty of threads of HR34 vs Hopper so if we're going to do any comparison in this thread let's compare the joey to this.


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

Another thing I want to know is that what are the other features of this device? Is it going to have access to youtube and pandora? Is it going to have Series Manager? Can you access locals if you only have an am21 hooked up to the hr34?


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## Brubear (Nov 14, 2008)

HoTat2 said:


> Actually it appears to be HDMI, "component" (through a proprietary 10 pin DIN to component AV breakout cable) and coaxial digital audio connects.


Hdmi, 10 pin, usb, & coax digital audio. two buttons, power and reset


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

jjschind said:


> Another thing I want to know is that what are the other features of this device? Is it going to have access to youtube and pandora? Is it going to have Series Manager? Can you access locals if you only have an am21 hooked up to the hr34?


Without service you cannot use OTA so an RVU client wouldn't work either. RVU clients will access the menu's like it is the receiver.

HR34 does not have Pandora on it at the moment so the answer is no.


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## nike5580 (Jun 29, 2010)

Size wise, it looks to be between a CCK and a W-CCK.


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## NR4P (Jan 16, 2007)

If you search through the CES 2012 reports on dbstalk, you will find a post or two that the C30 was shown publicly but it was also disclosed it will never reach the market and ultimately the C31 was going to be coming out later this year.

Looks like it is arriving.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

NR4P said:


> If you search through the CES 2012 reports on dbstalk, you will find a post or two that the C30 was shown publicly but it was also disclosed it will never reach the market and ultimately the C31 was going to be coming out later this year.
> 
> *Looks like it is arriving.*


With a speed of molasses ... the last photos shows a C31 box mfged in Dec'11.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Glad to finally see one in the wild, or at least somewhere other than a trade show. I suppose this means that some people are out there testing them right now, possibly even a few here at DBSTalk, but they aren't allowed to talk about it.

I'm a bit disappointed there is no 1/8" IR input though. That would make it much nicer for hiding behind flatscreens, etc. I use Harmony remotes so having RF buit into it is worthless to me (if it even does).

I'm also suprised by the regular DirecTV remote being shown with it, I thought they were going to get the smaller remote without the color buttons?

The biggest things I'm still waiting to hear though are costs. Hopefully the $50 someone mentioned earlier is right. I also hope to hear that DirecTV will only charge $6/month for the first 3 on an account and let you have additional ones for free (since you can only use 3 at a time anyway).



P Smith said:


> With a speed of molasses ... the last photos shows a C31 box mfged in Dec'11.


You expect them to send it out without testing them for a while first? We already have all kinds of people here complaining that they shouldn't have released the HR34 when they did, or they should be testing the firmware more than they did. We've also got people reporting the Samsung RVU TVs don't work that great. Hopefully that means DirecTV is taking their time and making sure this stuff is going to work right before they release it.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Beerstalker said:


> ..
> 
> You expect them to send it out *without testing them* for a while first? We already have all kinds of people here complaining that they shouldn't have released the HR34 when they did, or they should be testing the firmware more than they did. We've also got people reporting the Samsung RVU TVs don't work that great. Hopefully that means DirecTV is taking their time and making sure this stuff is going to work right before they release it.


I expected you and others know a difference between production's device (as we see on these twelve pictures) and test device.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

P Smith said:


> I expected you and others know a difference between production's device (as we see on these twelve pictures) and test device.


Yes I know the difference between test devices and production devices. But I also know that a lot of the time you make a short run of what you think is going to be the final production design and send those out into the wild with regular customers and have them test them for a while before you go to full production runs and wide realease.

We know that there are people here who were testing the HR34 before it's initial release in test markets that weren't able to talk about it until its release to the test markets (the people who worked on the first look). Are you saying they had test units and not production units? I find that hard to believe.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I'm saying it hard to believe such small program as involving DBSTalk ppl (how many ? 10 max ?) would be mainstream pre-production company's test program. I know and been in same 'box' but it always named as "usability" test group - those ppl selected outside of the company and partners and has third level influence to real decisions.

My main beef in seen PRODUCTION unit, with real mfg date, MAC address, serial number.
If you mentally 'stick' with FW features and bugs in your mind, I'm more attached to retail box what will be installed at customer's premises. And will have bugs at initial scale of deployment.


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## Groundhog45 (Nov 10, 2005)

Wow, that looks pretty small. It's not as long as the remote. Thanks for the info. Do they all come with a $50 in the box. :lol:


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

Before the HR34-700 was born, the HMC30-700 existed internally with the C30-700.

I would assume the C31-700 would be the 2nd generation like the 34.

If people think the 34 is bad, think how awful the HMC30 had to be since it was never released.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

I was common knowledge: HMC30 is the HR34. At least as I saw by spooled FW ...


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## slacker_x (Oct 9, 2007)

Is there any reason that the H25's can't operate as RVU clients for the HMC? I only as as I have H25's and would love to be able to pause live TV on them. I have 3 TV's so even if I was watching things on the 3 tv's I'd still have 2 tuners to record things. The HMC seems wasted currently as the max I'm ever recording is 2 things and watching something else.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

slacker_x said:


> Is there any reason that the H25's can't operate as RVU clients for the HMC?


Yes, the H25's don't have any RVU capabilities. The hardware needed for RVU isn't in the H25. Units either are RVU or they have their own tuner. There are no units that have both.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Sure hope the person who posted that wasn't fired.


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## slacker_x (Oct 9, 2007)

RunnerFL said:


> Yes, the H25's don't have any RVU capabilities. The hardware needed for RVU isn't in the H25. Units either are RVU or they have their own tuner. There are no units that have both.


Thank you for explaining that its more than just software needed for RVU. I wish that they had the RVU's available when I signed up. Not that I'm complaining as the record/list/view works well enough when I want to pause the show I'm currently watching.


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

RunnerFL said:


> Yes, the H25's don't have any RVU capabilities. The hardware needed for RVU isn't in the H25. Units either are RVU or they have their own tuner. There are no units that have both.


It's not clear to me that RVU requires any specific "RVU hardware".

You may be correct, and a DirecTV RVU client may include some silicon for RVU, but it's not clear to me if it's required (for RVU specifically) or just accelerates the processing, or maybe doesn't exist at all.

My view has always been that an RVU client is "software", and just needs the proper hardware to properly run the code (performance wise).

And still holding out hope that someday we will see an RVU client for Windows and iOS.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Sixto said:


> It's not clear to me that RVU requires any specific "RVU hardware".
> 
> You may be correct, and a DirecTV RVU client may include some silicon for RVU, but it's not clear to me if it's required (for RVU specifically) or just accelerates the processing, or maybe doesn't exist at all.
> 
> ...


That is support by existence of RVU in Samsung TVs.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Sixto said:


> It's not clear to me that RVU requires any specific "RVU hardware".


I thought I had read somewhere that a chip was required, could be wrong. If there's no hardware requirement why make a client box at all then instead of just using an H25?



Sixto said:


> You may be correct, and a DirecTV RVU client may include some silicon for RVU, but it's not clear to me if it's required (for RVU specifically) or just accelerates the processing, or maybe doesn't exist at all.


If only the pics included a shot of the guts...


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

RunnerFL said:


> I thought I had read somewhere that a chip was required, could be wrong. If there's no hardware requirement why make a client box at all then instead of just using an H25?


Probably $. Tuner-less boxes may be very inexpensive.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Also probably energy savings (not having ot power the tuner). Probably less computing hardware/memory in it to since all of the GUI, guide, etc. is done on the HR34 and sent to the client.

Hopefully some day we will be able to buy Blu-ray players, TVs (other than Samsung), and boxes like Roku/Apple TV that will be certified RVU clients. Until then the C31 will fill a nice role allowing us all the functionality of having a DVR attached to any TV in a small box, not taking up uneccessary tuners, etc.

For my parents an HR34 and 7 C31s will be the perfect install assuming DirecTV only charges the $6/month for the first 3. If they want to charge for every single one then I doubt my parents will ever switch over to DirecTV unless I can put together some kind of home distribution system on my own. Just not worth paying $42/month in mirroring fees for the 7 C31s when they can only use 3 at a time, and there will be few times when more than 2 TVs are on at the same time anyway.


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Sure hope the person who posted that wasn't fired.


Looks like the photos were taken down, so certainly someone has been "informed."


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

dsw2112 said:


> Looks like the photos were taken down, so certainly someone has been "informed."


Yea...probably sitting in Mike White's office right now. I'd like to be a fly on the wall for that one. :lol:


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

dsw2112 said:


> Looks like the photos were taken down, so certainly someone has been "informed."


Close the barn door after the cows get out.


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

Davenlr said:


> Close the barn door after the "Walkers" get out.


I fixed your post....I'm an AMC fan.


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

Here are the pics once again.
.
.
.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Masked serial numbers ? hehe - we got them stored in our history folders ... on each PC


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

P Smith said:


> Masked serial numbers ? hehe - we got them stored in our history folders ... on each PC


More importantly, some of us figured out who the guy is and think its a very stupid idea to post pictures of unreleased consumer hardware if one wants to keep one's job.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

He is an adult and should knew of any outcome in such consequences.


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## Rtm (Oct 18, 2011)

Davenlr said:


> You can do the same thing on the H25 by hitting RECORD,LIST,PLAY as far as trick play. So it boils down to saving DirecTv money at the subscribers expense?


When I tune to A channel on a c30 c31 whatever RVU I will automatically be able to rewind without

Clicking record, choosing receiver, list, then choose program, then click play

It's like having a DVR At every tv


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

jjschind said:


> Here are the pics once again.
> .
> .
> .


I have a feeling that the damage was already done there. Hope nobody lost his job although...


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

That's the price what our members pay for the privilege. Other places prefer 'brown-nosing' over a risk to lost they job when rush to inform us.
Some of them hiding in Ecuador's Embassy ...


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## jacksonm30354 (Mar 29, 2007)

I'll be ordering 2 or 3 of these when they become available.


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## aaronht3 (Jan 20, 2012)

Sorry couldn't release that info.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

[email protected] said:


> Yes it is real. We just received at our warehouse last week. $50 for c-31. national rollout by September.
> Sorry couldn't release that info.


That's why $50 bill been posed with the C31-700.


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## heisman6183 (Jun 4, 2008)

Does this need to be connected to a DECA setup in order to work, or can it just connect to the splitter (from a SWM dish)? I'm guessing this can't do OnDemand either, right? Just access/serve recordings from an HR34.


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## murpbrad (Jul 7, 2012)

I'm set up to have an HR34 and three H25's installed in 2 weeks. I contemplated getting at least one HR24 instead of one of the H25's simply because I've been with Dish for so long and I really like being able to pause/rewind/resume live tv. 

Will I be able to switch to these C31's when they become available or will I be charged a ton? Should I just wait until they are released before having my system installed?


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## Jacob Braun (Oct 6, 2011)

"murpbrad" said:


> I'm set up to have an HR34 and three H25's installed in 2 weeks. I contemplated getting at least one HR24 instead of one of the H25's simply because I've been with Dish for so long and I really like being able to pause/rewind/resume live tv.
> 
> Will I be able to switch to these C31's when they become available or will I be charged a ton? Should I just wait until they are released before having my system installed?


I'm sure you'll be able to switch to them when they're available to existing customers...probably for the full lease price of them, though. So $50 per unit (if that's how much they go for) plus shipping or installation and potentially a $50 upgrade fee depending on how new your account is. Plus a renewal of a two year agreement. (This is entirely speculation on my part, but it would make sense if D* treats them like normal receivers)


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

I'm hoping it's like a Nomad. $50, no contract. Would make them quite compelling.


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## Jacob Braun (Oct 6, 2011)

"dpeters11" said:


> I'm hoping it's like a Nomad. $50, no contract. Would make them quite compelling.


Very much so! Perhaps, because after all it isn't a receiver? $50 is still a great price, though either way. Hopefully they won't be any more than that!


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

JBv said:


> Very much so! Perhaps, because after all it isn't a receiver? $50 is still a great price, though either way. Hopefully they won't be any more than that!


Just be advised though, a reasonable $50.00 purchase fee notwithstanding, there's still no real monthly price break with the C31 over having another HD-DVR.

Its still a $6.00 a month "Home Media Center" fee per C31 for at least the first three boxes.


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## Jacob Braun (Oct 6, 2011)

"HoTat2" said:


> Just be advised though, a reasonable $50.00 purchase fee notwithstanding, there's still no real monthly price break with the C31 over having another HD-DVR.
> 
> Its still a $6.00 a month "Home Media Center" fee per C31 for at least the first three boxes.


Yeah, the only advantage is trickplay IMO (and they don't use a channel on the SWiM). You still pay an HMC Additional Client fee for each additional outlet. The disadvantage being (if it's like the Samsung RVU tv) you can only play what's on the HR34 and not any HD-DVRs on the network.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

JBv said:


> Yeah, the only advantage is trickplay IMO (and they don't use a channel on the SWiM). You still pay an HMC Additional Client fee for each additional outlet. The disadvantage being (if it's like the Samsung RVU tv) you can only play what's on the HR34 and not any HD-DVRs on the network.


Another advantage is savings in power usage, no need for all those extra components like harddrives to be powered up and running 24x7.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"RAD" said:


> Another advantage is savings in power usage, no need for all those extra components like harddrives to be powered up and running 24x7.


Disadvantage, uses up an HR34 tuner. At one point I was using all 5 once a week or so. Admittedly some of it could have been recorded during a re-air.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

dpeters11 said:


> Disadvantage, uses up an HR34 tuner.


Only if the client is turned on.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"RAD" said:


> Only if the client is turned on.


Well yeah,but still can be a disadvantage. There are pluses and minuses to each.


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## murpbrad (Jul 7, 2012)

So how inconvenient is it to perform the equivalent of trick play functions on the H25? I'm so used to just hitting pause or rewinding live tv a couple of minutes if I miss something with Dish. With the H25c I know you have to record what you're watching then you can do trick play. Does it record it from the beginning of the show or just from that current point forward? If it only records from that point forward, it would be pretty useless for me. I need it to essentially perform as a live tv buffer where I can go back 30, 60, even 90 minutes if needed. If it's only able to pause and resume from that point, then it may be a deal breaker.*


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## Jacob Braun (Oct 6, 2011)

"murpbrad" said:


> So how inconvenient is it to perform the equivalent of trick play functions on the H25? I'm so used to just hitting pause or rewinding live tv a couple of minutes if I miss something with Dish. With the H25c I know you have to record what you're watching then you can do trick play. Does it record it from the beginning of the show or just from that current point forward? If it only records from that point forward, it would be pretty useless for me. I need it to essentially perform as a live tv buffer where I can go back 30, 60, even 90 minutes if needed. If it's only able to pause and resume from that point, then it may be a deal breaker.*


Yeah it wouldn't work best for you...you hit record, it starts recording on the HR34 from that point, then you have to hit list and play it back and it starts playback from the point when you hit record. You would need an RVU client to always have a buffer (or a full DVR).


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

murpbrad said:


> So how inconvenient is it to perform the equivalent of trick play functions on the H25?


With an H25, you would have to start recording, then start playback, as has been noted.

With an RVU client, you would have a buffer, but only from the time you turned the client on, or from the time you last changed channels. Of course, that is the same as if you are using a local DVR.

Best bet would be to record all shows you plan to watch. I recently got an HR34, and with 5 tuners I'm in pretty good shape to be able to have everything I want to watch recorded. So in my case it is just a matter of changing my behavior pattern from live with buffer to selecting the recording and playing it. That has actually not been hard to do.

On the other hand, if you regularly peruse the guide and pick something to watch that you did not anticipate in advance, then a local DVR or RVU client off an HR34 is certainly easier as it will start to buffer the moment you change to that channel, whereas a receiver (H25) won't.


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## murpbrad (Jul 7, 2012)

So would I be better off to use my local cable company for a few months since they wouldn't make me sign any kind of contract? Then, once the C31 is finally available, I could make the switch to DirecTV? Or, would I be better off going ahead and getting the HR34 with a few H25s or even an HR34, HR24, and an H25 (or 2) and just dealing with the trick play issue until the C31 comes out?


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

That's really up to you... But something to think about might be how many rooms are you going to want to be able to watch live tv in at the same time at any given time and at that same time how many other things would you want to be recording also? If the number is four rooms and no more than five things on at a time, watching and recording combined, or under, hr34 and clients will take care of you. If its higher than that, I think you will prefer something of a mix in the long term, maybe an hr34, an hr24, and a couple clients. But you are the one who will be using all this, so I would suggest you first decide how you want to be able to view your tv in your house..


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

So anyone heard anything new? Been over a month since the photo leaks.


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## jjschind (Sep 28, 2011)

According to some guys at another forum, we are looking at an august deployment. Some installers are saying warehouses are currently being stocked with the c31s.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Also, according to the CSR that emailed me back DirecTV is planning on charging $6/month for every single RVU client, even though you can't use more than 3 at a time. I personally feel that this is a huge ripoff, and it's probably going to keep my parents from switching to DirecTV. If they do switch they will most likely not have a client at each TV, they will either have some TVs without DirecTV service or I might have to find a way to drive more than one TV off a single client. The two TVs in the basement I can probably do with one client and a HDMI switch or splitter, but I'm not sure about some of the TVs upstairs, they are further apart and get used more often.

So the only advantages that the C31 will have over the H25 is a slightly smaller form factor, possibly less of a power draw, and trick play for live TV. And I guess if the pricing is true they will be $50 for the upfront lease instead of $100.

The only advantages of the C31 compared to an HR2x HD-DVR is the ability to set recordings on the HR34 from any C31, lower power draw, and the lower up front lease price.

I sincerely hope DirecTV rethinks this position, or the CSR that spoke to me was wrong. The $6/month fee is supposedly to mirror the programming to the other devices. When you have more than three RVU clients you can't mirror the programming to all of them, so you shouldn't have to pay that fee for all of them.


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## The Merg (Jun 24, 2007)

Beerstalker said:


> I sincerely hope DirecTV rethinks this position, or the CSR that spoke to me was wrong. The $6/month fee is supposedly to mirror the programming to the other devices. When you have more than three RVU clients you can't mirror the programming to all of them, so you shouldn't have to pay that fee for all of them.


I don't think that's exactly accurate. The programming can be mirrored to all of the RVU clients, but you cannot use more than 3 at the same time. I would think that's just a limitation in regards to the tuners available on a HR34 (5 tuners - two reserved for HR34, the other 3 available to clients). So technically, you could have 4 TV's on and watching different programming at the same time in the house.

- Merg


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I know there is a lot of miscommunication and confusion about the RVU clients. It seems like there probably is an RVU client coming "soon" but I don't think the CSRs have gotten real training on it yet.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

I would be nice if Samsung was also more forthcoming with their RVU client for the 2012 sets. Folks are wondering where the client code is and not getting any clear answers from Samsung on the status of it.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"The Merg" said:


> I don't think that's exactly accurate. The programming can be mirrored to all of the RVU clients, but you cannot use more than 3 at the same time. I would think that's just a limitation in regards to the tuners available on a HR34 (5 tuners - two reserved for HR34, the other 3 available to clients). So technically, you could have 4 TV's on and watching different programming at the same time in the house.
> 
> - Merg


I think his point is that if you have four RVU clients, you can't use more than three at once, so you should only pay three RVU fees monthly, not four.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

the HMC will only allow 3 clients at a time so its a non-issue the csr miscommunicated


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

"wahooq" said:


> the HMC will only allow 3 clients at a time so its a non-issue the csr miscommunicated


So if he has 5, but only uses three at a time, how many is he getting charged $6 for? I think that is his issue.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

3 ... 2 tuners are designated to the dvr itself...it will only support 3 remote clients


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

My parents have 7 TVs throughout the house. I was planning on getting them One HR34 and 6 C31 clients. The way it works now I would have to pay a $6/month RVU client fee for all 6 C31s, that means $36/month in RVU client fees. I feel that this is unaccaptable since even though they would have 6 C31 clients they can only use three of them at any given time, therefore I feel that they should not have to pay the full $6/month fee for all 6. I feel it would be more fair if it were $6/month for the first three and the rest were free, or maybe give us a break on RVU clients compared to regular receivers, like $6/month for regular receivers and $3/month for RVU clients.

When I posed my question to DirecTV I didn't even mention the C31. I told them I was interested in getting an HR34 and 6 Samsung RVU TVs. They said I would have to pay $6/month for each one of the Samsung TVs. I have to believe that means I would have to pay $6/month for every C31 as well once they are out. I can post my email later if others want to see it.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"wahooq" said:


> 3 ... 2 tuners are designated to the dvr itself...it will only support 3 remote clients


Will the system even allow someone to have more than 3 on their account?


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

ahhh i see what your saying .....i was confused. Yeah you have to pay for each client even though only supported streaming allows three at one time....so yeah you would pay 6. per month x 6 clients


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

i was thinking about installation


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

wahooq said:


> ahhh i see what your saying .....i was confused. Yeah you have to pay for each client even though only supported streaming allows three at one time....so yeah you would pay 6. per month x 6 clients


So that is DirecTV's official stance right now. That really sucks, they need to reconsider that. I doubt very many people at all will go for the thin clients if that is the case. Really seems to me like they should only make you pay for 3 max, and let you have as many additional ones as you want (or as many as the RVU server can handle, I think there is a limit of 8 or 10 for a server but I can't remember for sure). I mean they are already going to get $50 for the hardware, and it will probably be leased so we will have to return it to them, why charge us $6/month for each if we can't always use them all the time. Not to mention an RVU TV where DirecTV isn't providing anything, why should DirecTV charge them for each one if they have more than three.

I think if people are going to get charged for each one then they might as well get an HD receiver or HD-DVR and have the additional tuners.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Beerstalker said:


> So that is DirecTV's official stance right now. That really sucks, they need to reconsider that. I doubt very many people at all will go for the thin clients if that is the case.


IIRC sources have said that most DIRECTV customers have less then four receivers in their home. So they look at RVU as a way to keep their costs down, by having only one HD DVR in the home and then the less expensive clients that still allow the customer to have DVR functionality at each location. DIRECTV is also big on being Energy Star complient and going to the RVU model helps them by reducing energy usage for the customer.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Yeah, but how many of those homes with only four receivers would have more if they didn't have to pay $6/month for each of them? How many less people would we have on here complaining about how the HDCP handshake and HD GUI have screwed up their solutions to run multiple TVs off one receiver? I'm thinking most of those people would probably add a C31 client to each of their TVs if it wasn't going to cost them $6/month for each one, but just pay $50 to buy the C31 (or possibly buy a TV or Blu-Ray player with an RVU client built in).

Most poeple miss the days of just being able to plug a TV in and hook up a coax cable to it and then have TV wherever they want it, and have the same thing everywhere in their house. They hate having a box at each TV, paying for every single TV, having a complicated setup, etc. RVU was supposed to help us get back to that. Being able to have a RVU server somewhere in the home and then just plug in your TV and hook up a ethernet cable or coax if your TV has DECA/MOCA built in would be great. But if the costs are going to be higher I think people will not transition to it.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

Beerstalker said:


> So that is DirecTV's official stance right now. That really sucks, they need to reconsider that. I doubt very many people at all will go for the thin clients if that is the case. Really seems to me like they should only make you pay for 3 max, and let you have as many additional ones as you want (or as many as the RVU server can handle, I think there is a limit of 8 or 10 for a server but I can't remember for sure). I mean they are already going to get $50 for the hardware, and it will probably be leased so we will have to return it to them, why charge us $6/month for each if we can't always use them all the time. Not to mention an RVU TV where DirecTV isn't providing anything, why should DirecTV charge them for each one if they have more than three.
> 
> I think if people are going to get charged for each one then they might as well get an HD receiver or HD-DVR and have the additional tuners.


People can decide what works best for them. A receiver that they are not watching costs $6 and a RVU client they are not watching cost $6. If your main contention is that you could turn on a receiver and make it have a channel, even though you don't watch it at the time, justifies the cost then I would just order a standard receiver.

The real issue boils down to potential use vs actual use. As every customer's situation is different they can choose what options will be best for them.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

DTV is a business, ya know


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

wahooq said:


> DTV is a business, ya know


I realize they are a business, but it doesn't hurt to throw the customers a bone once in a while.

Switching the thin clients is going to save them money anyway. The thin clients are cheaper to produce and should have less failures than HD receivers and HD-DVRs. It is likely that they could discontinue or at least scale back production or completely get rid of HD-DVRs and HD receivers completely which will save them money. They will also be smaller/lighter which means less cost to ship them, they can fit more on an installer truck so installers don't have to return to the warehouse as often etc.

More installs with one HR34 and multiple thin clients means less installs of legacy LNBs and SWM16's which are much more expensive than simple SWM LNB installs. Think about that, my parents install with one HR34 and 6 C31s would still only be a SWM LNB since it's only 5 tuners. But if they got an HR34 and 6 H25s it would be 11 tuners which means they have to have a SWM16 install.

RVU setups could save DirecTV a lot of money, why not reflect that in letting them cost less.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

gotta pay for viacom somehow


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

wahooq said:


> gotta pay for viacom somehow


Ha Ha, how about the $5/month increase we all know is coming in February.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

that too


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## iceburg02 (Sep 20, 2006)

Beerstalker said:


> I personally feel that this is a huge ripoff, and it's probably going to keep my parents from switching to DirecTV.


I've never seen anyone so fired up about their parents' TV service. Whatever makes you happy, I suppose.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

I'm not really that worked up, just annoyed as I was really hoping to finally rid their house of Comcast. I'm the one who does all the electronic stuff for my parents. I'm sick of having to deal with Comcast at their house, it's just one problem after another, not to mention Comcasts HD-DVRs and service just sucks period. I'm also sick of seeing them watching SD channels on their nice big HDTV because it's too confusing for them to worry about trying to find the HD version of their SD channels because they are all over the place. I've tried to show them that they can just tune to the channel and then hit select if it shows the little HD Version available thing at the bottom, but they never bother to do it. Heck I can't even get my mom to use the on screen guide, she still sits there and flips through channels or looks at the guide that comes in the local paper, ha ha ha.

I just know if I switch them over to DirecTV and it costs them a bunch more money they are going to complain to me about it. In the end though I might just end up doing it anyway and writing them a check for a couple hundred dollars or so every year to make up for it.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"wahooq" said:


> 3 ... 2 tuners are designated to the dvr itself...it will only support 3 remote clients


They don't designate any tuners for anything, just to be clear. It actually has nothing to do with tuners. They have a limit of three outbound streams from the HR34. You could have three previously recorded recordings going outbound, one playing on the hr34s tv, and recording six things at the same time (five on sat tuners and one Video On Demand). That's ten possible hd streams happening simultaneously on one hard drive. I have often wondered if the Hard drive is the limit.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

"Beerstalker" said:


> I'm not really that worked up, just annoyed as I was really hoping to finally rid their house of Comcast. I'm the one who does all the electronic stuff for my parents. I'm sick of having to deal with Comcast at their house, it's just one problem after another, not to mention Comcasts HD-DVRs and service just sucks period. I'm also sick of seeing them watching SD channels on their nice big HDTV because it's too confusing for them to worry about trying to find the HD version of their SD channels because they are all over the place. I've tried to show them that they can just tune to the channel and then hit select if it shows the little HD Version available thing at the bottom, but they never bother to do it. Heck I can't even get my mom to use the on screen guide, she still sits there and flips through channels or looks at the guide that comes in the local paper, ha ha ha.
> 
> I just know if I switch them over to DirecTV and it costs them a bunch more money they are going to complain to me about it. In the end though I might just end up doing it anyway and writing them a check for a couple hundred dollars or so every year to make up for it.


So this is really about Comcast sucking... Hahah

I agree with you. They should max out RVU client charges at three per HR34.

I'd ask though, how often do they have more than three tvs away from the hr34s tv going at the same time? If never, then it doesn't matter, it's just kind of an annoying thing to think about paying for something you can't use even though you also actually never would. In your situation, you could always go hybrid. Hook up HR34 and three RVU clients in main locations, then three h25s in the remaining locations that get used the least (as they won't have access to live buffering and double play, etc). Or try all clients to start, and then if they find it to be limiting, then slowly switch out ones that need to be to h25s. I'd say you have time since nothing is actually even announced that I am aware of other than its coming from ces, and I'd have them start tracking what they are on for the forseeable future, and see if they ever have more than four tvs on at one time anyway.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

Beerstalker said:


> Heck I can't even get my mom to use the on screen guide, she still sits there and flips through channels or looks at the guide that comes in the local paper, ha ha ha.


Don't laugh, or under estimate the significance of this. It was a huge issue with my mother, as she did exactly the same thing, but the fact that many of the "cable" channels on DirecTV are east coast feeds, and I'm on the west coast, totally messed her up. The local paper listings of course referred to the local cable/west coast times for shows. Channel numbers were also an issue, as the local listings did not reflect either of the satellite providers channel numbers (but certainly did show the Comcast channel numbers).


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

true didnt think about it that way


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

There pretty much would never need to be more than 3 remote TVs on at one time. There is only 2 of them in the home most of the time, so most of the time they really only use 2 TVs at once, but they use the TVs in pretty much all 7 rooms. When my family, or my sister's family visit sometimes there could be up to 4 TVs watching different things at once. That's why I liked the idea of the thin clients as opposed to regular receivers, I thought it would save them money, and simplify the system a bit since they wouldn't need a SWM 16.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

carl6 said:


> Don't laugh, or under estimate the significance of this. It was a huge issue with my mother, as she did exactly the same thing, but the fact that many of the "cable" channels on DirecTV are east coast feeds, and I'm on the west coast, totally messed her up. The local paper listings of course referred to the local cable/west coast times for shows. Channel numbers were also an issue, as the local listings did not reflect either of the satellite providers channel numbers (but certainly did show the Comcast channel numbers).





wahooq said:


> true didnt think about it that way


Back in the 90's this was probably the largest complaint that was made is that local listings didn't match and people on the west coast hated the east coast feeds. That's one of the reason that DIRECTV Guide magazine was created. With DVR's doing time shifting it's less of a complaint than it used to be but people missing prime time due to working or having to have multiple VCR's was a huge issue and still can be for some.


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## brett_the_bomb (Oct 24, 2009)

Any one know if they are beta testing these yet?


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

brett_the_bomb said:


> Any one know if they are beta testing these yet?


If there was anyone testing it they would not be able to talk about it.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

brett_the_bomb said:


> Any one know if they are beta testing these yet?


If these really are going to be released in August or September like some people are saying then I can pretty much guarantee that some people have been testing them. Most likely even some people on here, but like Scott said they aren't allowed to talk about it. If they did I'm sure that they would have to return all the equipment, and be banned from all future testing, possibly even get banned from this site. Not to mention I'm sure the posts would get deleted pretty quick.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

I wonder about another possible use these clients. Even though the pricing model is the same as an additional receiver, since they are likely to be owned and not leased units for a one time purchase of $50.00 I understand . Can you treat them just like an owned receiver and activate or deactivate (or should I say "register' or "unregister") them at will?

If so I'd like to place one in a guest room for off and on usage when visitors come and stay over at times throughout the year if that is the case.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Are we sure they are going to be owned units? I don't remember hearing that.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Beerstalker" said:


> Are we sure they are going to be owned units? I don't remember hearing that.


That's what I'm hoping, that they would be owned. But that's just my own hopes and desires.


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## brett_the_bomb (Oct 24, 2009)

If these units are like the joey units, or rvu clients, does it mean they don't tie up a swim channel? I guess my real question is if you could have these in use and exceed the tuner count for a swim setup. For example, could a swm 8 have 3 h2x's, HMC, and say 4 or so c31's? I know the cinema kits don't use up a tuner like a receiver so im curious if these do. I would assume it would be possible since you can have up to 6 rvu clients on an hr34. I guess I don't know if a swm 16 is required for a setup like that tho.


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## The Merg (Jun 24, 2007)

brett_the_bomb said:


> If these units are like the joey units, or rvu clients, does it mean they don't tie up a swim channel? I guess my real question is if you could have these in use and exceed the tuner count for a swim setup. For example, could a swm 8 have 3 h2x's, HMC, and say 4 or so c31's? I know the cinema kits don't use up a tuner like a receiver so im curious if these do. I would assume it would be possible since you can have up to 6 rvu clients on an hr34. I guess I don't know if a swm 16 is required for a setup like that tho.


With a HR34 and 3 H2x's you would only need a SWM8. Adding on the C31's, as I understand it, would still keep you at a SWM8. The SWM8 is limited to 8 tuners. The C31's, being RVU clients, do not have tuners so they shouldn't count against the tuner limit for the SWM8.

- Merg


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

brett_the_bomb said:


> If these units are like the joey units, or rvu clients, does it mean they don't tie up a swim channel? I guess my real question is if you could have these in use and exceed the tuner count for a swim setup. For example, could a swm 8 have 3 h2x's, HMC, and say 4 or so c31's? I know the cinema kits don't use up a tuner like a receiver so im curious if these do. I would assume it would be possible since you can have up to 6 rvu clients on an hr34. I guess I don't know if a swm 16 is required for a setup like that tho.


The only things that use/tie up a SWiM channel are satellite tuners. Any device that uses DECA/MOCA such as RVU clients, which a C31 would be, does not use a SWiM channel.


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## brett_the_bomb (Oct 24, 2009)

"The Merg" said:


> With a HR34 and 3 H2x's you would only need a SWM8. Adding on the C31's, as I understand it, would still keep you at a SWM8. The SWM8 is limited to 8 tuners. The C31's, being RVU clients, do not have tuners so they shouldn't count against the tuner limit for the SWM8.
> 
> - Merg





"RAD" said:


> The only things that use/tie up a SWiM channel are satellite tuners. Any device that uses DECA/MOCA such as RVU clients, which a C31 would be, does not use a SWiM channel.


Thanks. That's what I was thinking too. Opens interesting possibilities.


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

When using a C31 would it have the same slowness and poor remote response as the HR34 that it is attached to?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

HobbyTalk said:


> When using a C31 would it have the same slowness and poor remote response as the HR34 that it is attached to?


The only people who would know that are the people who may, or may not, be testing it and they aren't going to say anything.


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## HobbyTalk (Jul 14, 2007)

RunnerFL said:


> The only people who would know that are the people who may, or may not, be testing it and they aren't going to say anything.


I would guess it would be the same as using Samsung RVU?


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

HobbyTalk said:


> When using a C31 would it have the same slowness and poor remote response as the HR34 that it is attached to?





HobbyTalk said:


> I would guess it would be the same as using Samsung RVU?


It just seems logical that the peformance of a RVU client off a HR34 would be the same or a but slower then the same function locally on the HR34. Remember the HR34 is doing all the work, all the client is just telling the TV what video/audio to display.


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## kevinwmsn (Aug 19, 2006)

I hope the C31 would be owned units for around $50. I wonder if D* would think about the next version of the HMC, maybe they could have one with 8 tuners just to top dish's current promotion of recording 6 shows at once during primetime. I would like to see some sort of trade in program, I would trade in my 2 HDDVRs for a HMC and a C31.


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## Rtm (Oct 18, 2011)

I hope they are owned for $50 as well since Apple TVs go for about $100 and aren't tied to any service. The Apple TV 2 was $60ish to build and has 8GB Flash memory buffer which the C31 won't need or will require less than 1GB.

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9189541/_Margin_challenged_Apple_TV_costs_64_to_build


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