# Why only non-USB powered external hard drives?



## festivus (Nov 10, 2008)

Can't seem to find the answer to this.

I have a spare external hard drive but it's powered via the usb connection. Why can't the 622's and 722's power the hard drive this way? I have a small usb fan running off my 622 in my basement so it can power that.

With the activation fee and the cost of a non-usb powered drive I don't really want to take the plunge.


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## tampa8 (Mar 30, 2002)

Since you tried a fan and it works, have you tried the drive you have? 

As to why, could simply be more engineering than Dish wanted to do, or, they felt a powered unit would work better.

As to "taking the plunge", an excellent WB 1TB is currently only $70 at places like Amazon. Additionally, the $40 fee you are talking about is history in a few days, it will be free for everyone.


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## [email protected] Network (Jan 5, 2011)

festivus said:


> Why can't the 622's and 722's power the hard drive this way?


The USB port on the rcvr is not generating enough power to power the EHD so we require it to have it's own power source.


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## BattleZone (Nov 13, 2007)

A hard drive requires a lot more power, especially at start-up, and that's more than the motherboard is designed to provide. Assuming it worked at all, you risk burning up the drive controller or the USB controller.


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## festivus (Nov 10, 2008)

Thanks. For some reason I always have to know why. Makes sense now.


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

festivus said:


> With the activation fee and the cost of a non-usb powered drive I don't really want to take the plunge.


You could wait for 1-Feb when there won't be an activation fee.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

You can also chalk it up to a loophole in the USB specifications.

While it can supply power to some connected devices... there is a limit to the amount of connected devices on any given port AND I do not believe there is any specific power requirement required to meet USB specs.

The voltage is specified... but current is not... thus power is not... so there is no guarantee really that any USB port will power anything... though some devices are intended to power USB-connected devices and usually will say so up front.


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## festivus (Nov 10, 2008)

CABill said:


> You could wait for 1-Feb when there won't be an activation fee.


Wow! I didn't know about that! Thanks!

Edit: Looks like the $40 fee still applies, according to this page:
http://www.dishnetwork.com/SupportSection/setup-ehd


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

festivus said:


> ...
> Edit: Looks like the $40 fee still applies, according to this page:
> http://www.dishnetwork.com/SupportSection/setup-ehd


With all due respect, do you think that the page has not yet been updated *or* do you think the $40 fee still applies?


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## festivus (Nov 10, 2008)

SaltiDawg said:


> With all due respect, do you think that the page has not yet been updated *or* do you think the $40 fee still applies?


With all due respect, the dish page says that the fee still applies (actually on several different pages) and I wasn't directed to any other official announcement about the fee being zero now. So my assumption is that the $40 fee still applies. Or should I assume something else for which I have zero evidence? :nono:


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## CABill (Mar 20, 2005)

If you have an EHD that you don't care if it gets formatted, just connect it to the USB port. There is some minimum size, so you can't just use a 32GB flash as an EHD. Previously, the receiver would say it needed to be activated, please call 800 ...
I've paid the fee and can't try, but I'm led to believe that it will now just format the drive and use it. You'd have to tell me if that is or isn't accurate!


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

festivus said:


> ... So my assumption is that the $40 fee still applies. Or should I assume something else for which I have zero evidence?


No. I'm sure you're right. Stupid ol' other posters. :lol:

EDIT: Oh, "The elimination of the EHD fee was annoaunced here http://www.satelliteguys.us/satellit...drive-fee.html some time ago. The web page is not updated. The $40.00 fee to add an EHD to a 211 still applies."

Who'd a figured that festivus would have been mistaken and attacked somone?


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## tampa8 (Mar 30, 2002)

festivus said:


> With all due respect, the dish page says that the fee still applies (actually on several different pages) and I wasn't directed to any other official announcement about the fee being zero now. So my assumption is that the $40 fee still applies. Or should I assume something else for which I have zero evidence? :nono:


:nono2: How about actually asking Dish online or on the phone? I know it just can't be that the Dish site has not been updated......that has never happened.


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## thomasjk (Jan 10, 2006)

The elimination of the EHD fee was annoaunced here http://www.satelliteguys.us/satelli...240182-dish-drop-external-hard-drive-fee.html some time ago. The web page is not updated. The $40.00 fee to add an EHD to a 211 still applies.


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## Mike109 (Jun 28, 2010)

I saw this on the Dish website yesterday (2-2-11)
http://www.dishnetwork.com/redirects/promotion/dvrstorage/default.aspx


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## festivus (Nov 10, 2008)

SaltiDawg said:


> No. I'm sure you're right. Stupid ol' other posters. :lol:
> 
> EDIT: Oh, "The elimination of the EHD fee was annoaunced here http://www.satelliteguys.us/satellit...drive-fee.html some time ago. The web page is not updated. The $40.00 fee to add an EHD to a 211 still applies."
> 
> Who'd a figured that festivus would have been mistaken and attacked somone?


Don't want this to turn into an argument between us, but who attacked who first with the rolling of the eyes? I was only asking for evidence since no link was provided. And shame on me for assuming that Dish could have its website updated in 2 business days. Looks like it's updated today though, on some pages since someone finally provided a link. Still not updated here though. So I was wrong for reading exactly what was on Dish's site? I know who to ignore now...

http://www.dishnetwork.com/SupportSection/setup-ehd


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## tymekeeper (Jan 11, 2008)

[email protected] Network said:


> The USB port on the rcvr is not generating enough power to power the EHD so we require it to have it's own power source.


Hi Tommy, You were so good at answering the Starz for one year thing, I figured I would ask you about the maximum size EHD. Some have said 2 TB with v6.74 on a VIP 722. Dis site says 1TB.

Also are the 722's active now or do I have to call to have it activated.

Think of getting a Western Digital WDBAAU0015HBK-NESN. Do you just plug it in

Any other info would be appreciated.

Your the man!


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

tymekeeper said:


> Hi Tommy, You were so good at answering the Starz for one year thing, I figured I would ask you about the maximum size EHD. *Some have said 2 TB with v6.74 on a VIP 722*. Dis site says 1TB.
> 
> Also are the 722's active now or do I have to call to have it activated.
> 
> ...


Some did tests for 1, 1.5 and 2 TB drive as EHD and posted RESULTs for you. Why it's need to be questioned ?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Stewart Vernon said:


> You can also chalk it up to a loophole in the USB specifications.
> 
> While it can supply power to some connected devices... there is a limit to the amount of connected devices on any given port AND I do not believe there is any specific power requirement required to meet USB specs.
> 
> The voltage is specified... but current is not... thus power is not... so there is no guarantee really that any USB port will power anything... though some devices are intended to power USB-connected devices and usually will say so up front.


Current is specified - 500 mA Max per port for powered ports and 100 mA for all.


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## Texas-Justice (Dec 28, 2010)

tymekeeper said:


> Hi Tommy, You were so good at answering the Starz for one year thing, I figured I would ask you about the maximum size EHD. Some have said 2 TB with v6.74 on a VIP 722. Dis site says 1TB.
> 
> Also are the 722's active now or do I have to call to have it activated.
> 
> ...


I can't answer about that specific model since I haven't tested it, but I know that the WDBACW0020HBK-NESN works fine. It is a WD My Book Essential 2 TB drive with USB 3.0 connection. Of course, that will work on the USB 2.0 ports on the 722k at USB 2.0 speeds, but it does give me some leeway in the future if a new receiver comes out with USB 3.0 ports.

Also, this unit had $15 off as well when I bought it and there were no USB 2.0 2 TB drives in stock at the store I was at, and the USB 2.0 drive price tags showed them at the same price as the new 3.0 drive but without the $15 discount. Easy decision to go ahead and get the 3.0 version of the drive.

It took somewhere between 5 and 15 minutes to format, but I wasn't timing it so I can't say for certain how long. It automatically activated after the format without needing to use chat or call a CSR to activate it.

After seeing reports from others about various drives, I would suspect that the one you list would work as well since it is a powered drive.

I know that the limit for the 211k is 1 TB, so that may be why the main site still lists that as the maximum size. Also, the fee still applies for the 211k as well.

Hope this info helps.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

P Smith said:


> Current is specified - 500 mA Max per port for powered ports and 100 mA for all.


Specifying a maximum in my mind doesn't make it a spec standard.

This means 100mA is ok... and 500mA is ok... which means not all USB ports will power all USB-powered devices... which is why I said what I did.

IF all USB ports were required to have the same voltage and current... then all developers would be working on a level playing field.

The fact that a USB can provide far less than another USB port and still be compliant with the standard is how we end up with a thread like this where we have a device with a USB port that can't power an external hard drive that your desktop computer could power.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Yes, it depend of manufacturer - seen on one desktop: some USB ports provisioned 500 mA, some not. 
During enumeration an OS and USB device could settle with that max current what the port can handle.
But spec is written for two type of ports.


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

P Smith said:


> Yes, it depend of manufacturer - seen on one desktop: some USB ports provisioned 500 mA, some not.
> During enumeration an OS and USB device could settle with that max current what the port can handle.
> But spec is written for two type of ports.


Yeah... and that's what I wish had never happened.

Heck.. when I worked at a computer company... there were debates from the service dept vs the engineering dept... because the engineering dept kept wanting to just have USB ports tested to support keyboard + mouse... and the support dept always wanted support for things like thumb drives for diagnostic tools... and the engineering dept often didn't want to develop or test for those additional devices.

I always scratched my head and wondered why they didn't just develop USB the same all the time (at least all USB the same, all USB 2.0 the same, etc.) for consistency.


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## tymekeeper (Jan 11, 2008)

Texas-Justice said:


> I can't answer about that specific model since I haven't tested it, but I know that the WDBACW0020HBK-NESN works fine. It is a WD My Book Essential 2 TB drive with USB 3.0 connection. Of course, that will work on the USB 2.0 ports on the 722k at USB 2.0 speeds, but it does give me some leeway in the future if a new receiver comes out with USB 3.0 ports.
> 
> Also, this unit had $15 off as well when I bought it and there were no USB 2.0 2 TB drives in stock at the store I was at, and the USB 2.0 drive price tags showed them at the same price as the new 3.0 drive but without the $15 discount. Easy decision to go ahead and get the 3.0 version of the drive.
> 
> ...


I ordered the 1.5 TB I mentioned last night from Amazon. Your info convinced me and I feel a lot better doing it now. I was a bit hesitant as you, as a fellow Texan, could see in my posts. You didn't have to do any changing on a computer to the drive as some have mentioned? Just plug and play!? Thanks again.


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## Texas-Justice (Dec 28, 2010)

Nope. Just plug and play. As I said, it takes a bit for it to format it once you connect it to the 722k and OK the dialog box, but no need for connecting to the computer at all.


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## tymekeeper (Jan 11, 2008)

Texas-Justice said:


> Nope. Just plug and play. As I said, it takes a bit for it to format it once you connect it to the 722k and OK the dialog box, but no need for connecting to the computer at all.


Got my 1.5 TB today and did like you said and it formatted just fine. Took 8 minutes to format and 5 minutes to restart for a total of 13 minutes. Transferred some programs and all seems to work OK. The only thing I don't like is the "deleting" of transferred items from the main VIP 722. Thanks again for your help.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Stewart Vernon said:


> Yeah... and that's what I wish had never happened.
> 
> Heck.. when I worked at a computer company... there were debates from the service dept vs the engineering dept... because the engineering dept kept wanting to just have USB ports tested to support keyboard + mouse... and the support dept always wanted support for things like thumb drives for diagnostic tools... and the engineering dept often didn't want to develop or test for those additional devices.
> 
> *I always scratched my head and wondered why they didn't just develop USB the same all the time (at least all USB the same, all USB 2.0 the same, etc.) for consistency*.


Been in that HW development as EE I could tell you but it would take a few pages of letter size.


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