# Ask DBSTalk: Has anyone had a problem with CBSHD breakup from 61.5 since L182?



## anderdea (Jan 13, 2004)

I am receiving CBSHD (New York) from my 61.5 dish. Up until the new version L182, the picture has locked flawlessly. Now I get pixelized breakup on and off while watching the channel. Sometimes I even loose he signal for a short time. Is anyone else seeing this happen? I have a legacy LNB looking at 110/119 and a separate Legacy LNB looking at 61.5. These all go into a SW64 switch which has been working fine to date. When I look at the siignal strength at 61.5 it is 90 +.

Don


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## Jerry G (Jul 12, 2003)

I have this problem on my 811 and 921. It's most likely a Dish or CBS problem and not related to a specific receiver.


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## bobl (Jan 17, 2004)

I had this problem with the West Coast version at 148 starting around the middle of April when it converted to 8PSK. It lasted about a month but now seems to have disappeared. During this period I would periodically get acquiring satellite messages sometimes resulting in a recording ending prematurely (probably 5 or 6 times). I called Dish technical support but as usual they were of no help. I'm also using legacy lnb's and a SW64 switch. I have no idea why it stopped. I was thinking of swapping out my lnb for 148 and the cabling but didn't since it seems to have stopped happening.

Bob


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

I can tell you that I was watching KCBS-HD off of 148 for a good part of the afternoon yesterday, and it was crystal clear with no signal problems. And my SS is about 82.


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## BobMurdoch (Apr 24, 2002)

I had a pixellation problem on the King of Queens on CBS-HD about two weeks ago (I don't know why but this channel seems to have the toughest time.... HDNet and HBO/SHO HD seem to record OK, but CBS-HD often burps when recording shows.... Since I only record King of Queens off of CBS right now it is not too much of a hardship, but I hope they add this to the list of things to repair.....


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## ctdish (Apr 9, 2004)

I think in general all the 8PSK signals are the weakest channels on their respective satellites and it probably cannot be filed in receiver software. For example on the 110 Sat I get 88 on xponder 19 which is 8PSK and 97,85 and 105 on 18,17 and 16. On the 61.5 Sat I get 88 on 20 which is CBS HD and 125,105,126 on18,16 and 14. I use a dish 500 and a Primestar dish equivalent to about 30 inchs on the 61.5 Sat. Generally you need more power at the Sat when using 8PSK to get the same signal strength as QPSK. I think Dish tried to use the Turbo codeing to make up some of this loss, but they also seem to have given up a considerable amount of the signal margin to get more effective bandwidth. John


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

I have not had CBS on 61.5 for nearly a month now. Can't recall when it disappeared. That was channel 9453? 

Now channel 9483 is WCBS on 110 and it has been pixelated and audio loses for over 10 days now. I sent a note to Bob Ross, Sr. VP of Engineering East Coast, about this. There has also been problems with local CBS affiliate when rebroadcasting the network feeds. This is a CBS east coast issue, I think, Mark. Good to hear your KCBS is OK.


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## ctdish (Apr 9, 2004)

Don,
I don't think its CBS's fault but maybe Bob can put on some usefull pressure on Dish. CBS is not on the 110 Sat. The East Coast feed is on 61.5 xponder 20. Since it went 8PSK I get an occassional drop out even with a larger dish. I wondered if others might have it worse. The 110 8PSK feeds are not much stronger but seem more steady not sure why. The 8PSK seems to be right on the signal strength edge, maybe if Dish can go to a higher FEC percentage it would get better. John


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## styxfix (Aug 7, 2002)

I've been having problems most of the day with this channel on my 811. I thought it might be weather related since some of that area are having T-storms. No problems with analog CBS-NY on DISH. The other CBS-LA HD channel is working fine.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

_"The East Coast feed is on 61.5 xponder 20."_

Uh-Oh! I didn't know that!. Hmmmmm... That is bad news for me because I am knocking down my Dish 61.5 soon for a VOOM antenna. I was told by CSR (I know, they know squat!) that WCBS will be moving to 110 mid April. I never checked and just assumed it happened when the 9453 disappeared. Didn't know they had WCBS on two 61.5 xpdrs for a month.

Anyway, that does not explain why our local CBS affil. is having the exact same problem that started about the same time. Too coincidental don't you think?


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## ggw2000 (Dec 22, 2003)

DonLandis said:


> _"The East Coast feed is on 61.5 xponder 20."_
> 
> Uh-Oh! I didn't know that!. Hmmmmm... That is bad news for me because I am knocking down my Dish 61.5 soon for a VOOM antenna. I was told by CSR (I know, they know squat!) that WCBS will be moving to 110 mid April. I never checked and just assumed it happened when the 9453 disappeared. Didn't know they had WCBS on two 61.5 xpdrs for a month.
> 
> Anyway, that does not explain why our local CBS affil. is having the exact same problem that started about the same time. Too coincidental don't you think?


Don, quick question, you said you were taking down your (300) dish and replacing it with a Voom dish? Can't Voom use the Dish dish and LNBF? I asked this because awhile back someone mentioned that they had Voom and it was running it off their 300 dish. I ask this because I have been looking at Voom in addition to Dish and really don't want to put up a seperate dish.
Thanks, Gerry


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

I have a 3rd party 28" dish for 61.5 now. Not a 300. I had planned to switch it to the Voom receiver but now, I have to rethink as I don't want to lose WCBS. I thought they were to move it to 110 but it, is still on 61.5. I may have to try some sharing ideas to put the Voom receiver on one leg of the 61.5 dish' lnb. Since there is only one channel, WCBS, I may be able to figure that one out without too much difficulty. 
Anyway, that's my current plan.


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## David_Levin (Apr 22, 2002)

I believe you can share if you have a legacy LNB (no DishPro or built-in switch).


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## TBarclay (Mar 24, 2002)

I have a 6000 and had a LOT of pixellation and drop-outs last night. It's the first time I've seen such a thing and assumed it was a weather issue--either uploading to the satellite or downloading here.


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## ggw2000 (Dec 22, 2003)

David_Levin said:


> I believe you can share if you have a legacy LNB (no DishPro or built-in switch).


I just replaced my legacy LNBFs and SW21s with DP equipment and a DP34 a month ago to get another line for my 501  . I have one extra output left on the 61.5 dish but it won't do me any good if it cannot be DP equipment.... Rats, Gerry


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## ggw2000 (Dec 22, 2003)

TBarclay said:


> I have a 6000 and had a LOT of pixellation and drop-outs last night. It's the first time I've seen such a thing and assumed it was a weather issue--either uploading to the satellite or downloading here.


Just got done watching "Yes Dear" that I taped on CBSHD last nite. There were intermittant drop outs and pixelation. And to think I still have the rest of the shows from 8:30 to 11:00 to watch yet  . Has anyone got an official response from Dish as to what's going on? I see that the problem appears to be across all HD receiver types...........


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

And here I've been thinking that a tree grew into the path of my 148 dish. Guess I'll wait a while a see what happens.


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## tnsprin (Mar 16, 2003)

ggw2000 said:


> Just got done watching "Yes Dear" that I taped on CBSHD last nite. There were intermittant drop outs and pixelation. And to think I still have the rest of the shows from 8:30 to 11:00 to watch yet  . Has anyone got an official response from Dish as to what's going on? I see that the problem appears to be across all HD receiver types...........


Its not the Dish channel 9483. I watched via 002-1 (dish 6000u) and the OTA also showed a lot more drop outs than usual.


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## anderdea (Jan 13, 2004)

I watched "NCIS" on CBSHD from the 61.5 location and it was very solid, no breakup. Maybe it was a temporary thing. I do have another question however. I checked my 61.5 signal strength on transponder 20 (CBSHD) and got 86-88 on tuner 1 and 100+ on tuner 2. I am using a SW64 switch with equal lengths (about 75') of High end Coax to the 921. Prior to watching "NCIS" last night I manually switched to tuner 2, transponder 20. I don't know if that made a difference or not. Why would I be getting different signal strenghts for tuner 1 and 2?  I am using a new dual legecy LNB on the Dish 300 at 61.5 to the SW64 switch.

Don


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

Sounds like a cable or connector problem. Less(?) likely is a difference in the switch hardware for the 2 ports.

I'd keep an eye on it to see if Tuner 1 degrades any further, but you've got enough signal margin now to run just fine.


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## DonLandis (Dec 17, 2003)

Last evening the WCBS and local CBS was solid here too. Hopefully what was causing the problem is past. One insider info claimed that it was the CBS uplink center as the root of the problem. I have not had any confirmation from a public source on that though. Good thing is that after 10 days or so it seems to be gone.


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

I just ordered the CBS HD from L.A., on the 148 satellite. I've been recording the "CBS Evening News" among other programs, and I've noticed a lot of pixelation, audio dropouts, and "acquiring signal" messages. I thought it was time to trim my tree, but the "Point Dish" menu says my signals are still rather strong. It is annoying, the frequency of this is every few minutes. I will time the interval the next time I watch the channel.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

I haven't tried lately, but my CBS-HD feed on 148 has been unusable for several weeks. Thought it was hardware. Thought it was a tree. Now I think it's not me.


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## guruka (Dec 27, 2003)

FWIW, I recorded four hours off of CBS-HD on 148 (the CBS mystery movie "Reversible Errors" with Tom Selleck on Sunday and Tuesday evenings) and all four hours are perfect. Great picture quality, no audio dropouts. Everything fine.

.....G


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## Mark Lamutt (Mar 24, 2002)

Those of you having problems, please report your signal levels on each tuner for either of the CBS channels. I'm in the process of persuing this one, but will eventually need that information. 

And for the dumb questions: Any chance of birds, planes, rain, bugs, etc. blocking your dish temporarily causing these problems? Please also provide your lnb/switch configurations, if you're using RG6 cable, what kind of connectors (crimp, etc.), whether you made the cables yourself, were professionally (by installer) done, were pre-bought, etc. 

This may very well be an 8psk problem from the lower powered birds on the wings, but let's rule out all of the other possibilities as well.


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## Slordak (Dec 17, 2003)

If it's a problem with the satellites themselves, we should be comparing our experiences with the 921 to the experiences of 811 owners. This would help us determine if it was specific to our setups, or not. In fact, in my opinion this is more important than what type of connectors are on your cable or whether you had a professional installation.

If 811 owners are having the exact same problems, then we know that it's not something specific to the 921 or to our setups. If they aren't, it remains a possibility that the 921 itself is at fault.


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## jsanders (Jan 21, 2004)

It could also be that they need to deal with more forward error correction (FEC) on the lower powered satellites. Guruka isn't having any problems, and he is further south than myself, or SimpleSimon. Being slightly closer to the equator will give him a slightly higher signal, either that or he has heat stroke from being in "Sunny New Mexico", and sees a great picture anyway! :hurah: Either way, he doesn't have the problems the rest of us do. If I recall, my signal strength bar said my 148 satellite had a strength of 85 or so, I will check tonight to verify. I'm curious what Guruka's signal level indicates. FEC can in effect increase the fade margin, right?


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

For KCBS on 148-13, I get a variable 68-78 on both Tuners. However, I get momentary dropouts to 0. Side note: 148-11 yields over 100, and the dropouts go down to 65. At least I think this means my dish is pointed OK. Only possible obstruction is the very top of a pine tree, and I don't think it's a problem. The cables may be questionable (the cobbler's kids, ya know). The rest of the configuration is in my signature.


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## anderdea (Jan 13, 2004)

Mark Lamutt said:


> Those of you having problems, please report your signal levels on each tuner for either of the CBS channels. I'm in the process of persuing this one, but will eventually need that information.
> 
> And for the dumb questions: Any chance of birds, planes, rain, bugs, etc. blocking your dish temporarily causing these problems? Please also provide your lnb/switch configurations, if you're using RG6 cable, what kind of connectors (crimp, etc.), whether you made the cables yourself, were professionally (by installer) done, were pre-bought, etc.
> 
> This may very well be an 8psk problem from the lower powered birds on the wings, but let's rule out all of the other possibilities as well.


Mark,
As you requested (I stared this thread) but am getting good CBSHD at present.
Dish 500 , 2 dual legacy LNB's (110/119)
Dish 300, 1 dual Legacy LNB. (61.5)
SW-64 switch
RG6Q coax. RG6Q all weather connectors through out. Note they are Rat Shack connectors but are quite good. The reason for using all weather connectors is that the quality is better than standard connector and the hex head tightening collar is wider. Also I have a good quality crimping tool which is very important. It is also VERY important not to have any hard 90 degree bends of the coax. This changes the relationship of the center core to the shield, changing the 75 Ohm rating of the cable at that point.

Tuner 1: 61.5 transponder 20 (CBSHD) from NY 86-87
Tuner 2: 61.5 transponder 2, 95-100

Don


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## kmcnamara (Jan 30, 2004)

Last night on my OTA CBS-HD I recorded Everybody Loves Raymond and got lots of blocking and even some acquiring signal messages. After one commercial break, CBS reverted to 480i and then changed back to HD after the last commercial break. The problem seemed to be fixed at that point so I don't know if they had to fix something which caused them to have to broadcast a digital 480 signal for a period of time.


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## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

kmcnamara said:


> Last night on my OTA CBS-HD I recorded Everybody Loves Raymond and got lots of blocking and even some acquiring signal messages. After one commercial break, CBS reverted to 480i and then changed back to HD after the last commercial break. The problem seemed to be fixed at that point so I don't know if they had to fix something which caused them to have to broadcast a digital 480 signal for a period of time.


I thought it was my imagination - I recorded CSI: Miami on a SD CBS satellite feed, and saw it change aspect ratios more than once - it was driving me nuts!


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