# Can't order AM21N?



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Just called Directv and they won't let me order an AM21N because they offer locals in my area. WHAT?!


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## Go Beavs (Nov 18, 2008)

Try ordering it from the website.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Go Beavs said:


> Try ordering it from the website.


Problem is, the website wants money for it now. I wanted to have it ship today and bill it to my account.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> Problem is, the website wants money for it now. I wanted to have it ship today and bill it to my account.


I don't believe they do that for "accessories".


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## Go Beavs (Nov 18, 2008)

Ahh, I see.

I guess you just have to spin the CSR roulette wheel then...


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

kevinturcotte said:


> Just called Directv and they won't let me order an AM21N because they offer locals in my area. WHAT?!


WOW. I'd call back and see if that was a one off response or that's their actual answer across the board.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Called back twice more and got the same response from both CSRs. They can't order it because they offer my locals in HD. I even tried asking about the sub channels that they don't carry, but apparently those aren't a good enough reason to let me shell out $50 for the AM21N. NOTHING was even mentioned about billing it to the account.
I'll try and order it through the website when I have some money to order it with.


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## Chuck W (Mar 26, 2002)

That or try SolidSignal.com. They have it in stock.


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## cummingsje (Mar 23, 2007)

Just ordered and received one from amazon the other day.


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## EyeRonik1 (Nov 26, 2007)

cummingsje said:


> Just ordered and received one from amazon the other day.


Me too. $65. I don't have HD locals here in Santa Cruz and they wouldn't let me buy it either.


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## am3211 (Mar 23, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> Called back twice more and got the same response from both CSRs. They can't order it because they offer my locals in HD. I even tried asking about the sub channels that they don't carry, but apparently those aren't a good enough reason to let me shell out $50 for the AM21N. NOTHING was even mentioned about billing it to the account.
> I'll try and order it through the website when I have some money to order it with.


I suggest you ask to speak to a supervisor. I have four of them (one on each DVR), all of which I received just for the asking over the past several years.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Sounds like the script needs a serious going over. DIRECTV shouldn't get to choose what TV you can record (although they seem pretty committed to it at this point).


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

harsh said:


> Sounds like the script needs a serious going over. DIRECTV shouldn't get to choose what TV you can record (although they seem pretty committed to it at this point).


Something is seriously wrong somewhere. It looks like a communication problem somewhere. The big advantage (these days), is avoiding rain fade on the HD locals, which can be quite problematic, at least in this part of the midwest, so whether we get HD-LIL or not (without considering the addition of sub-channels not carried by D*), is not relevant.

Very strange. I have two AM21s here, neither is the newer "N" model. One is on an HR21-100 and the other is on an H21-200. Both work well, and both were provided by D* (admittedly, a long time ago).

I can't imagine being refused for sale by D*. How can you refuse to sell, but make it available on their web site? I don't get it.

Like I said, some error has been made. It makes no sense.


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

This doesn't make sense. I ordered mine through a CSR and I get locals through DirecTV. And they gave it to me for free. That was last summer, but no reason to change. Maybe call retention?


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> I'll try and order it through the website when I have some money to order it with.


WOW!!! You must be tight on Money!!! :nono2:


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Even if I couldn't use the thing, I'd think they'd be willing to sell it to me! Maybe try and talk me out of it, but still let me buy it lol


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hasan said:


> I can't imagine being refused for sale by D*. How can you refuse to sell, but make it available on their web site? I don't get it.
> 
> Like I said, some error has been made. It makes no sense.


Probably stupid CSRs who haven't been taught correctly about what they are selling and are allowed to sell.

I got 2 AM21s Free when I traded in my HR20s for HR24-500s.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Richierich said:


> WOW!!! You must be tight on Money!!! :nono2:


Check comes in next week!


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

I would think the ONLY time the computer would intervene and not allow the sale is if you don't have any compatible equipment-H20, HR20, or even older receivers. I'm going to try again later. If I STILL can't get anybody to send me one, I will go through retention. I'm NOT looking for a deal or a free one, just looking to actually be able to purchase one lol


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## EyeRonik1 (Nov 26, 2007)

Again, try Amazon. I'm angling for a heavily discounted HR34 so I didn't want to waste my goodwill on a free AM21N.

By the way, I was talking to a CSR in the equipment department and she claimed there was no such thing as an AM21.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

EyeRonik1 said:


> Again, try Amazon. I'm angling for a heavily discounted HR34 so I didn't want to waste my goodwill on a free AM21N.
> 
> By the way, I was talking to a CSR in the equipment department and she claimed there was no such thing as an AM21.


Right now I'm looking to have them ship it out and just bill it to the account. Once I get my check next week, I can actually buy one wherever I want.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Try here: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=203536

3 of 'em for sale right here on our own playground.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Richierich said:


> Probably stupid CSRs who haven't been taught correctly about what they are selling and are allowed to sell


CSRs are trained to read scripts. In view of the evidence (the consistency of the answer), it appears that the scripts explicitly say no dice.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

harsh said:


> CSRs are trained to read scripts. In view of the evidence (the consistency of the answer), it appears that the scripts explicitly say no dice.


Yes, but there was discussion a couple of weeks ago that many many CSRs Ignore Scripts and don't read Info given to them and therefore they make ignorant decisions and I have run into this many many times where I had to instruct the CSR how to proceed and why he/she was wrong.

Clearly, if you have OTA you are Allowed by the FCC to have those OTA Channels and Directv therefore accomodates this request and it has Nothing to do with the fact that you also have HD Local Channels via Directv.

I have left my OTA Antenna up just to get OTA when there is a Bad Rain Storm and my Directv goes out. Very Useful in those situations.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

locals dtv provides have no bearing on am21 availability....the csr's are wrong


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

and yes you can have it billed


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

wahooq said:


> locals dtv provides have no bearing on am21 availability....the csr's are wrong


EXACTLY!!!


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Richierich said:


> WOW!!! You must be tight on Money!!! :nono2:


Not all of us are old rich guys with money to blow who brag about their 5+ DVRs with 5+ 2 TB drives every few days.


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## naijai (Aug 19, 2006)

Just one question
What model HDDVR(s) do you have on your account ?


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

naijai said:


> just one question
> what model hddvr(s) do you have on your account ?


1 hr34
1 hr24
2 h24


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

I don't think they arent letting him buy it, they just arent allowing him to charge it to his acct. Maybe he is a relatively new customer, kevin, didnt you just come back to D* a few months ago?


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

CCarncross said:


> I don't think they arent letting him buy it, they just arent allowing him to charge it to his acct. Maybe he is a relatively new customer, kevin, didnt you just come back to D* a few months ago?


Yes, last month, but we're not even getting that far on the phone. Nothing about payment, or billing it to the account, was mentioned. Just that I'd like to order an AM21N, and the blanket response that it's impossible because they offer my HD locals.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

they are confusing DNS with OTA i bet money


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

Like others have said, when you can afford it, just order it through your on-line D* account. It literally takes 5 minutes and they fedex it right out.


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

wahooq said:


> they are confusing DNS with OTA i bet money


That's the best explanation I've seen yet.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

If you want to save a few bucks, you can often find them on ebay for $40 or less shipped. I've gotten several that way over the years when DirecTV refused to sell me any.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

> That's the best explanation I've seen yet.


It's the only trhing I can figure...it is very plain that am21's are available for all receivers than support them regardless of what programming we provide...and kevin thinking fu8rther about it...is the csr's cant bill it ask for a sup because they can...sometimes that option is blocked out to certain level agents


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Update: Called a couple of times last night, and continued to get the same response. Emailed Ellen at the President's Office last night before going to bed. I tried again one more time today, and was even connected with Retention. Even THEY couldn't let me order it. A very nice woman from the President's Office just called me, and said that the computer showed a couple of times that the order was attempted, but never successful. She somehow managed to get around this by turning my local channels off, ordering the AMN21, and then turning the local channels back on. I don't know, but it worked lol She even billed it to the account, so I would imagine it will be sent out on Monday.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Congratulations!!!

Ellen Filipiak's Office has always responded very well and quickly to Resolve my Problems in the Past so Great News and Enjoy.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

This is a fail safe so that if a customer really wants one they have to do it themselves online if locals are provided in that area. It's the same thing to ship for self installation of receivers as well.


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## NR4P (Jan 16, 2007)

Shades228 said:


> This is a fail safe so that if a customer really wants one they have to do it themselves online if locals are provided in that area. It's the same thing to ship for self installation of receivers as well.


Directv needs to understand that just because they offer locals, it doesn't mean that a) they offer all the local channels and b) the AM21's provide an alternative to rain fade.

They shouldn't make it hard for customer's to enjoy TV even if they don't watch 100% of their channels 100% of the time off SAT.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

NR4P said:


> Directv needs to understand that just because they offer locals, it doesn't mean that a) they offer all the local channels and b) the AM21's provide an alternative to rain fade.
> 
> They shouldn't make it hard for customer's to enjoy TV even if they don't watch 100% of their channels 100% of the time off SAT.


DIRECTV does understand it which is why you can order one even if they have local channels available in the market.

I don't think anyone said it was hard ordering it on the website. The main contention the OP had was that he didn't want to pay immediately so therefor the website wasn't an option to him as you cannot bill to the account on the website. So he had some choices and he chose to do the one that was going to be the most frustrating to him hence this thread.


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

But why can't you buy it through a CSR? I know some people that don't have internet.


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

If you don't have the $50 to order it right now, you wait....you don't escalate it. If I had a business and someone came to me and said, I need this right now, but I want to be billed for it on my regular bill(which is probably $75-100/month), but I can't afford $50 today, I'd tell them to come back when they can afford $50.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

CCarncross said:


> If you don't have the $50 to order it right now, you wait....you don't escalate it. If I had a business and someone came to me and said, I need this right now, but I want to be billed for it on my regular bill(which is probably $75-100/month), but I can't afford $50 today, I'd tell them to come back when they can afford $50.


We would be out of business if we did that. We dont even have any cash at all. Everything is done on Net30, 60 or 90. Guess it depends what business you are in.

FWIW, when I ordered my AM21 online, it was just added to my bill, so apparently they changed something if you can no longer do that.


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## vikerex (Aug 18, 2006)

Just ordered one for my HR34, on Monday. Showed up on Wednesday, during the installation. Then today I ordered 2 more, had to have two receivers replaced today, no OTA on them. All were at no charge, the CSR asked me today how many I needed, and sent them out.


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

vikerex said:


> Just ordered one for my HR34, on Monday. Showed up on Wednesday, during the installation.


Can you scan for OTA channels not in the DirecTv database with the HR34/AM21N? If so, could you provide info on which menu the scan is located and what its called?


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

Shades228 said:


> This is a fail safe so that if a customer really wants one they have to do it themselves online if locals are provided in that area. It's the same thing to ship for self installation of receivers as well.


That's ridiculous. Not everyone has access to order online. What is the "fail safe" for? The AM21 isn't a bomb... How many people even know what an AM21 is? If someone is asking for one by name it's quite likely that they know what it's for.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

Davenlr said:


> Can you scan for OTA channels not in the DirecTv database with the HR34/AM21N? If so, could you provide info on which menu the scan is located and what its called?


There is no option just to force a scan. The scan takes place when you run the Antenna Setup.


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## vikerex (Aug 18, 2006)

Davenlr said:


> Can you scan for OTA channels not in the DirecTv database with the HR34/AM21N? If so, could you provide info on which menu the scan is located and what its called?


It's in the SAT&Antenna setup. Just like the others: Input zip code, searches for your primary TV market, then scans the airwaves for channels. I do not believe some of these are in the database, if so the AM21 would not be needed.


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## BuffaloDenny (Mar 19, 2007)

My installer never heard of the AM21. DirecTV CSR couldn't get around system limitations to allow me to order one and install it myself. So they gave me a $50 account credit and I ordered mine from Amazon with free 2 day delivery. Is that what they want us to do?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

BuffaloDenny said:


> My installer never heard of the AM21. DirecTV CSR couldn't get around system limitations to allow me to order one and install it myself. So they gave me a $50 account credit and I ordered mine from Amazon with free 2 day delivery. Is that what they want us to do?


You can order on directv.com as well.


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## unixguru (Jul 9, 2007)

When the HR34 software gets more stable and equal to others I'll be getting one to replace my HR20. I use OTA on it. They will definitely be providing an OTA tuner. If they don't, my state attorney general is going to hear about it. Absolutely insane that they won't sell you something.

It would be very interesting to know what the average bit-rate is for OTA vs satellite. My admittedly unscientific observation is that the picture is slightly better OTA (Minneapolis area).


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

unixguru said:


> When the HR34 software gets more stable and equal to others I'll be getting one to replace my HR20. I use OTA on it. They will definitely be providing an OTA tuner. If they don't, my state attorney general is going to hear about it. Absolutely insane that they won't sell you something.
> 
> It would be very interesting to know what the average bit-rate is for OTA vs satellite. My admittedly unscientific observation is that the picture is slightly better OTA (Minneapolis area).


To me (a long time OTA advocate with D*), the more important issue is the ability to sustain picture and audio in the presence of heavy, wet snow or strong thunderstorms to the south of the dish at elevation. Especially now with HD frequencies, we have issues in the central USA when heavy t-boomers are present to the south (at altitude).

OTA improves reliability dramatically in this part of the country. Basically we have 100% network reliability with OTA (or very, very near so). With D*, it is this simple: expect HD outages of a few minutes nearly every time there are heavy storms to the south (at elevation). This happens at least once per week in the summer storm season.

It isn't a dish aiming issue. Signals are in the low to mid nineties.....until the storms arise in the right direction.

I will agree the picture quality is ever so slightly better OTA than on HD-LIL, but the difference is quite small. I don't think very many people in a random sample could pass a double-blind experiment on which is better.

We also shouldn't jump to too many conclusions based on one person's experience. I was not refused an AM21 when we had HD-LIL. The method of payment may have been the issue in this case, along with confused CSRs (which would not surprise anyone who has been around these forums very long)

BTW, you can complain to your State Attorney General all you like. D* cannot be forced to sell you anything, if they do not wish to do so. We are lucky D* has supported OTA compatibility as much as they have, given it is a direct competitor to their main product.

I wish all their boxes would scan instead of being held prisoner to a marginal database for OTA. I find it heartening that at least one box will currently scan (HR-34). While I don't expect this same feature to make its way into the HR2 series boxes, it would be really nice if the HR-34 kept this capability, instead of telling us in a few months: we want all the boxes to be driven by the database, so we're taking it out of the HR-34.

I hope to acquire an HR-34 and AM21N in the near future.

BTW does anyone know if the AM21 with the HR-34 will scan for stations, or does it have to be one of thte new AM21N units?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

hasan said:


> BTW does anyone know if the AM21 with the HR-34 will scan for stations, or does it have to be one of thte new AM21N units?


I'm pretty sure I saw someone say in a post here that the AM21 also scans, not just the AM21N. Mine is an AM21N so I can't say for sure.


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

RunnerFL said:


> I'm pretty sure I saw someone say in a post here that the AM21 also scans, not just the AM21N. Mine is an AM21N so I can't say for sure.


Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for any further info. When I decide to make the move, I'm going to replace the HR20-700 with the HR-34 and move the AM21 from my HR21-100 to the HR-34 (if it will scan).

Since I already have both SWiM and DECA, as well as the old style ICK, (hardwired), it should be an absolute breeze to upgrade from the HR20-700 to the HR-34, don't you think?


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

hasan said:


> Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for any further info. When I decide to make the move, I'm going to replace the HR20-700 with the HR-34 and move the AM21 from my HR21-100 to the HR-34 (if it will scan).
> 
> Since I already have both SWiM and DECA, as well as the old style ICK, (hardwired), it should be an absolute breeze to upgrade from the HR20-700 to the HR-34, don't you think?


Looks like you'd need a legacy LNB, and SWM16, but not a difficult proposition


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

hasan said:


> Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for any further info. When I decide to make the move, I'm going to replace the HR20-700 with the HR-34 and move the AM21 from my HR21-100 to the HR-34 (if it will scan).
> 
> Since I already have both SWiM and DECA, as well as the old style ICK, (hardwired), it should be an absolute breeze to upgrade from the HR20-700 to the HR-34, don't you think?


Should be pretty simple.


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

BuffaloDenny said:


> My installer never heard of the AM21. DirecTV CSR couldn't get around system limitations to allow me to order one and install it myself. So they gave me a $50 account credit and I ordered mine from Amazon with free 2 day delivery. Is that what they want us to do?


Unless you have another D* receiver on your acct that isnt listed in your sig, you can't order one, because you can't use one with your current equipment. They only work with H/HR21's and higher models. All the 20's have OTA built-in. YOu do have to have an eligible piece of gear active on your acct to order one through D*'s channels. I'm sure a 3rd party source will let you buy whatever you want.


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

Richierich said:


> WOW!!! You must be tight on Money!!! :nono2:


Evidently he's not richieRICH. Are you sure you're not really Mitt incognito? :lol:


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

CCarncross said:


> If you don't have the $50 to order it right now, you wait....you don't escalate it. If I had a business and someone came to me and said, I need this right now, but I want to be billed for it on my regular bill(which is probably $75-100/month), but I can't afford $50 today, I'd tell them to come back when they can afford $50.


And I thought I was grumpy! :lol:


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

TBlazer07 said:


> And I thought I was grumpy! :lol:


Not at all, I hate to see Ellen's office being used when not necessary. It should only be used for real problems, someone tight on money isnt a reason to contact Ellen's office.


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## TBlazer07 (Feb 5, 2009)

CCarncross said:


> Not at all, I hate to see Ellen's office being used when not necessary. It should only be used for real problems, someone tight on money isnt a reason to contact Ellen's office.


 I agree 100% in theory, but actually it isn't "Ellen's Office" it's just an "advanced customer service team" of, I'm sure, MANY people. That's what they get paid to do. It's not like you have "Ellen" and a secretary fielding all the calls and "Ellen" collapsing from all the extra work. :lol:

He called them because he wasn't able to make the purchase AT ALL (billed or paid up front wasn't his main problem at that moment, just that they wouldn't sell it to him at all). He never got to the "bill me" issue but only to the "sell me" part.


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## unixguru (Jul 9, 2007)

hasan said:


> OTA improves reliability dramatically in this part of the country. Basically we have 100% network reliability with OTA (or very, very near so). With D*, it is this simple: expect HD outages of a few minutes nearly every time there are heavy storms to the south (at elevation). This happens at least once per week in the summer storm season.
> 
> It isn't a dish aiming issue. Signals are in the low to mid nineties.....until the storms arise in the right direction.


A larger dish would probably help a lot. Another thing D* could offer to demanding users like us.

At least half the programs I record are network and I record OTA so they don't get interrupted during most storms.



hasan said:


> We are lucky D* has supported OTA compatibility as much as they have, given it is a direct competitor to their main product.


How is that? Maybe I'm just not up to speed on their current programming offerings but aren't locals in all packages?

If so, since we are paying for them anyway, why do they care if it's sat or OTA?

Maybe something to do with leverage in negotiating with local stations? Or they just want to totally eliminate OTA hardware???

Either way, it's reducing program availability for many of us. Losing an hour of prime-time could be several hours of recorded programming lost. If I lose 20% of the programming I pay for in a week then I should get a refund of 20% of my service charges for that week.

The same goes for DVRs that die. If they absolutely refuse to provide a solution (movable external storage), why do I have to pay for lost programming? Likewise, if they refuse to provide a solution to HDD failure (RAID1) why do I have to pay for lost programming?

If they remain on this path then I will eventually move to internet TV service (when it gets to 1080i/p and preloading of programs) [where my hardware can go up in smoke and I can still get all previous programs with new hardware].


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

I was under the impression he never even tried to order it through his directv online acct. The AM21/21N is quite a niche product outside of many of us here that many CSR's dont even know what it is. Its best to order it thru 3rd party or order it yourself through your online acct., provided you have an active qualifying receiver.(H/HR21 or higher) It really only takes 5 minutes to order.


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## Lije Baley (Dec 7, 2003)

CCarncross said:


> I was under the impression he never even tried to order it through his directv online acct. The AM21/21N is quite a niche product outside of many of us here that many CSR's dont even know what it is. Its best to order it thru 3rd party or order it yourself through your online acct., provided you have an active qualifying receiver.(H/HR21 or higher) It really only takes 5 minutes to order.


While it may not apply to the OP, many of us have received our AM21/21N for no charge when contacting CSRs by phone. That is a significant benefit over the ease of online ordering.


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## steve0617 (Nov 14, 2008)

Got my new HR34 with my new install. Didn't even try to order from D*. I'm in Denver so I get locals from D* too.

Ordered the AM21N straight from Amazon - http://goo.gl/K3F41

$45 delivered. Works perfectly, although if I am able to scan (rather than input the zip code for D* provided channel numbers in the guide), I haven't found it.

The OTA picture for me is just _slightly _better/sharper than the D* delivered ones. You really have to look.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

steve0617 said:


> Works perfectly, although if I am able to scan (rather than input the zip code for D* provided channel numbers in the guide), I haven't found it.


As was posted earlier there is no separate menu option to scan. The scanning takes place when you go through the antenna setup.


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## billsharpe (Jan 25, 2007)

I would think there would have been a lot of people this past weekend wanting OTA reception for the missing Tribune channels.


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

dsw2112 said:


> Looks like you'd need a legacy LNB, and SWM16, but not a difficult proposition


No, I don't think I'll need any of that. The SWiM dish already supports 8 tuners. The HR34 will use 5, HR21-100 will use 2, the H21-100 upstairs will use 1. Looks like 8 to me.

The HR20-100 is on a different dish, non-SWiM, non-DECA, but connected to my network via wireless N. So it works for MRV.


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

unixguru said:


> A larger dish would probably help a lot. Another thing D* could offer to demanding users like us.
> 
> At least half the programs I record are network and I record OTA so they don't get interrupted during most storms.
> 
> .


Not really. The most one could expect in terms of increased gain for a 1 meter dish is on the order of 6 to 8 dB. That would give a couple minutes more of viewing time, but is nothing compared to the 30 to 40 dB of attenuation we get here with thunderstorms.

We record a LOT of network TV, as you do, and that's why OTA is important, especially in the summer.

You should have been around here 4 years ago, when the debate began about dropping OTA from the boxes. It was very close to happening. Then they came up with the AM21 and made a whole bunch of us very, very happy. So from an historical perspective, we are fortunate OTA is there at all from D*. They are a satellite company and have no obligation (and very little interest, I might add) to address our OTA interests.

They don't make squat on the AM21. They had to engineer and develop it. They don't charge enough, nor is there anywhere near sufficient demand for them ever to recover their investment. They almost didn't do the AM21 at all. That's why I say we are lucky.


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

hasan said:


> No, I don't think I'll need any of that. The SWiM dish already supports 8 tuners. The HR34 will use 5, HR21-100 will use 2, the H21-100 upstairs will use 1. Looks like 8 to me.
> 
> The HR20-100 is on a different dish, non-SWiM, non-DECA, but connected to my network via wireless N. So it works for MRV.


Gotcha. That wasn't clear from your sig.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

hasan said:


> Not really. The most one could expect in terms of increased gain for a 1 meter dish is on the order of 6 to 8 dB. That would give a couple minutes more of viewing time, but is nothing compared to the 30 to 40 dB of attenuation we get here with thunderstorms.
> 
> We record a LOT of network TV, as you do, and that's why OTA is important, especially in the summer.
> 
> ...


Wondering why they even bothered with the updated AM21N then?


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> Wondering why they even bothered with the updated AM21N then?


Ran out of stock from the original AM21 orders.

DIRECTV stocks the AM21 for people in markets they don't provide local channels for. There was never a plan to not support OTA in some capacity for these markets.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> Ran out of stock from the original AM21 orders.
> 
> DIRECTV stocks the AM21 for people in markets they don't provide local channels for. There was never a plan to not support OTA in some capacity for these markets.


So why not manufacture more AM21s? Why pay for the upgrade?


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> So why not manufacture more AM21s? Why pay for the upgrade?


What upgrade was that?


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> What upgrade was that?


I thought the AM21N was an upgrade?


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> I thought the AM21N was an upgrade?


Not really. Probably a lower manufacturing cost than the original AM21, so more profit for DirecTV.

By the way, Solid Signal has them on sale for the same price as DirecTV .... $50.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

I thought it was a newer generation tuner or something?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> I thought it was a newer generation tuner or something?


Nope...

Only difference I can tell is the AM21 is gloss black and the AM21N is matte black.


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## MartyS (Dec 29, 2006)

wahooq said:


> and yes you can have it billed


It will be charged to the credit card that you have on file immediately. At least, both of my AM21's were charged right away. They were never added to a bill.

And, when I ordered them (a few years back) I had no issues getting them at all. I just had to pay for them right away.


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

MartyS said:


> It will be charged to the credit card that you have on file immediately. At least, both of my AM21's were charged right away. They were never added to a bill.
> 
> And, when I ordered them (a few years back) I had no issues getting them at all. I just had to pay for them right away.


My experiences also...and I've bought 2 of them this way...


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

> It will be charged to the credit card that you have on file immediately. At least, both of my AM21's were charged right away. They were never added to a bill.


the op was specifically wanting it billed...just letting him know that it is an option


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Mine was added to my bill. I asked the woman and she said yes. I checked my account the next day, and it had gone from $0 due to $50 due.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

sweet ...gonna order one myself


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## jscott70 (Feb 14, 2009)

I was told they are free with the HR34 (HMC) as long as you request OTA functionality. We'll see when I get my DTV installed tomorrow. Coming from Dish I'm not impressed by the lack of knowledge and dumbassity of their CSR's. I just want the free Sunday Ticket and 3d channels. Hopefully the HR34 is a faster receiver than the HR21, which I had a few years ago. The VIP722k I currently have with Dish runs circles around that boat anchor.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Chances are that the installer will not bring it. When I ordered mine I had to wait until the install was done and then call. They shipped it directly to me after that.


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## smitbret (Mar 27, 2011)

wahooq said:


> locals dtv provides have no bearing on am21 availability....the csr's are wrong


You sir are incorrect. The ordering system used by CSRs will often determine customer eligibility for certain devices. Usually, the option to order the AM21 will not even appear for the CSR.


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## smitbret (Mar 27, 2011)

jscott70 said:


> I was told they are free with the HR34 (HMC) as long as you request OTA functionality. We'll see when I get my DTV installed tomorrow. Coming from Dish I'm not impressed by the lack of knowledge and dumbassity of their CSR's. I just want the free Sunday Ticket and 3d channels. Hopefully the HR34 is a faster receiver than the HR21, which I had a few years ago. The VIP722k I currently have with Dish runs circles around that boat anchor.


Agreed, Dish CSRs seem to be a little better trained and a little more free to make decisions than DTV CSRs.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

> You sir are incorrect. The ordering system used by CSRs will often determine customer eligibility for certain devices. Usually, the option to order the AM21 will not even appear for the CSR.


not for am21 and other accessories


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

My understanding is if you have an active H21/HR21 or higher on your account, you can order an AM21, that should be the only qualifying criteria. Its under accessories on the website if you are signed in, but I cant verify what a CSR sees...I have never tried to order one through a CSR because its never been necessary for me...The on-line method is preferred and typically much quicker.


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## jscott70 (Feb 14, 2009)

smitbret said:


> Agreed, Dish CSRs seem to be a little better trained and a little more free to make decisions than DTV CSRs.


They're also not dumber than a bag of hammers which is how I would describe almost every DTV CSR to this point. Funny, DTV customer service has gotten this way it seems over the last few years. Even as recently as 2008 they didn't seem this consistently and thoroughly incompetent. The widespread idiocy among DTV CSR's is jaw dropping.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

> Its under accessories on the website if you are signed in, but I cant verify what a CSR sees...


shows up the same way...that person is thinking about DNS


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

> They're also not dumber than a bag of hammers which is how I would describe almost every DTV CSR to this point. Funny, DTV customer service has gotten this way it seems over the last few years. Even as recently as 2008 they didn't seem this consistently and thoroughly incompetent. The widespread idiocy among DTV CSR's is jaw dropping.


pretty sure thats offensive


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## Kevin F (May 9, 2010)

"pogo" said:


> YO, dude. If you don't have $50 (Seriously, $50) to order this, then how you gonna pay the bill when it comes. If $50 truly strains your finances then maybe you need to rethink your spending priorities. This ain't a necessity.


I think his point was that they aren't letting him order one. Not that the price was too high.

Kevin


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## pogo (Oct 31, 2007)

Kevin F said:


> I think his point was that they aren't letting him order one. Not that the price was too high.
> 
> Kevin


Sorry to everyone -- I didn't realize that this was a basically kind of old thread. When I saw that I assumed that my response was by now irrelevant and I deleted my post. I didn't think that would be allowed if it had responses. (Apparently wrong) Be that as it may, Kevin has accurately quoted what I posted. However he didn't quote the post I responded to in which the OP was complaining specifically that they wouldn't charge it to his account, and ended by saying that he guessed he would have to wait till he had $50 to order it on the website. OP: "NOTHING was even mentioned about billing it to the account. I'll try and order it through the website when I have some money to order it with." Seriously. That's what it was about -- nothing to do with whether a CSR would let him order. I did quote him so Kevin should have been aware of the context.
Oh well -- ain't the internets fun?


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