# Problem with 622 displaying correctly on TV2 Single User mode. Help?



## OinkinOregon (Feb 19, 2006)

I have an HD capable Samsung 32 inch TV for my TV2. I understand that the HD is downconverted through the coax on the Home Distro output. What does not work for me is using the 622 in single user mode. While in single user my TV2 picture is squished into a square. Is there any way to correct this to format the screen correctly the way Dual user mode does? Thanks!


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## Rogueone (Jan 29, 2004)

in single mode, aren't you suppose to be viewing TV1's output on the coax? I don't have a 622/942 yet, but that is what I thought it did in single mode


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## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

I could be going off on a tangent... but if you are wanting to connect the ViP622 to two different TVs, wouldn't you need/want to be in dual-user mode? Single-user mode is intended for when you are going to connect to just one TV, right?

Or am I misreading something?


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

In single mode TV2 mirrors whatever TV1's SD output would be (unless you disable shared view).

At the moment TV1's SD output is best described as an 'anamorphic' version of what is on the HD outputs. Is the second set a 4:3?


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## OinkinOregon (Feb 19, 2006)

HDMe said:


> I could be going off on a tangent... but if you are wanting to connect the ViP622 to two different TVs, wouldn't you need/want to be in dual-user mode? Single-user mode is intended for when you are going to connect to just one TV, right?
> 
> Or am I misreading something?


Single user mode enables the use of PIP. That is all I am going for. I was hoping that it could format correctly to both screens but I guess not, if TV1 is showing wide screen then TV2 will do the same but the TV2 is not a widescreen HD TV, thus the picture gets squished. Oh well.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Perhaps there will be a software update to fix that.

The ViP-211 had that "squished" problem on the SD outputs when it first came out - it now forces 4:3 on the SD outputs.


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## OinkinOregon (Feb 19, 2006)

James Long said:


> In single mode TV2 mirrors whatever TV1's SD output would be (unless you disable shared view).
> 
> At the moment TV1's SD output is best described as an 'anamorphic' version of what is on the HD outputs. Is the second set a 4:3?


Yes it is a 4:3 HDTV, so when I adjust the TV to format to the receivers input my screen goes from a 32 inch to about a 23 inch.


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## OinkinOregon (Feb 19, 2006)

James Long said:


> Perhaps there will be a software update to fix that.
> 
> The ViP-211 had that "squished" problem on the SD outputs when it first came out - it now forces 4:3 on the SD outputs.


Thanks! I will try again in about 6 months 25 updates from now..:lol:


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

It is a blessing and a curse. On the ViP-211 the SD outputs (AV/RF) are always 4:3 and 16:9 is either letterboxed or zoom. E* needs to add a "stretch" mode to keep people with 16:9 2nd TVs happy. (Or at least as happy as they can be without adding a 2nd HD output.  )


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

OinkinOregon said:


> I have an HD capable Samsung 32 inch TV for my TV2. I understand that the HD is downconverted through the coax on the Home Distro output. What does not work for me is using the 622 in single user mode. While in single user my TV2 picture is squished into a square. Is there any way to correct this to format the screen correctly the way Dual user mode does? Thanks!


This has been complained about for some time on the 942. Looks like it has yet to be addressed. In Single mode, there is no way to get widescreen programs to letterbox on TV2 unless you go into the menu and change the HDTV settings to 4x3 #2. This fixes TV2 but would then mess up TV1.


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

LtMunst said:


> This has been complained about for some time on the 942. Looks like it has yet to be addressed. In Single mode, there is no way to get widescreen programs to letterbox on TV2 unless you go into the menu and change the HDTV settings to 4x3 #2. This fixes TV2 but would then mess up TV1.


My wife operates her 942 in Dual Mode - with TV2 being an old 13" 4:3 set. It works just fine.

If we were to replace that TV2 with a 16:9 LCD TV, would we see 16:9 programming filling the TV2 screen and 4:3 with side bars on TV2?


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## LtMunst (Aug 24, 2005)

SaltiDawg said:


> My wife operates her 942 in Dual Mode - with TV2 being an old 13" 4:3 set. It works just fine.
> 
> If we were to replace that TV2 with a 16:9 LCD TV, would we see 16:9 programming filling the TV2 screen and 4:3 with side bars on TV2?


Good question. Not sure how a 16x9 would handle the TV2 output. I'd bet that you would not be able to get a true 16x9 widescreen picture.


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

If TV1 is a 16x9 set, attach the Home Distribution output to your external antenna input on TV1 and when you switch to display that input put it on channel 60 (or proper channel if you changed the default) and you should see the TV2 output. So, you should be able to check it your self.


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## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

James Long said:


> It is a blessing and a curse. On the ViP-211 the SD outputs (AV/RF) are always 4:3 and 16:9 is either letterboxed or zoom. E* needs to add a "stretch" mode to keep people with 16:9 2nd TVs happy. (Or at least as happy as they can be without adding a 2nd HD output.  )


EXACTLY!


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## moman19 (Oct 22, 2004)

ChuckA said:


> If TV1 is a 16x9 set, attach the Home Distribution output to your external antenna input on TV1 and when you switch to display that input put it on channel 60 (or proper channel if you changed the default) and you should see the TV2 output. So, you should be able to check it your self.


But the problem is: Unless you set up the 16x9 TV1 to a stretched screen (something you wouldn't want to normally do with HD content) The remote TV on channel 60 will look Squished with vertically elongated people & objetcs.


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## ChuckA (Feb 7, 2006)

I was simply suggesting a method for Saltidawg to be able to actually see for himself what a 16x9 TV2 output would look like so he could decide if he wants to invest in upgrading TV2. I have not tried it so I can't comment on the outcome.


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

ChuckA said:


> If TV1 is a 16x9 set, attach the Home Distribution output to your external antenna input on TV1 and when you switch to display that input put it on channel 60 (or proper channel if you changed the default) and you should see the TV2 output. So, you should be able to check it your self.


Thanks,

Looked at an HD program as outputted via TV2 Composite signal to another input on my HD TV1. The image appears in a 4:3 format with Gray bars on the side. The TV2 Remote permits toggling the Format from "Normal" to Letterbox. If I do Toggle to Letterbox the 4:3 image on TV2 now has black bars top and bottom and the gray bars remain on the side. (On my little 13" 4:3 TV2 down stairs the gray side bars are of course not present.)

With the 16:9 set using the TV2 input I could of course stretch/zoom the 4:3 input and eliminate the gray bars and also the black upper and lower bars if I have the 942 TV2 set to Letterbox Format. These abilities would be slightly different depending on the Zoom/Stretch characteristics of you set.

I am going to go ahead and look at 20" or so HD set to replace the old 13" 4:3 Set. I guess if that set is going to spend its whole life as a TV2 is SD that I could see if an ED set would be a wiser choice.

Thanks for your suggestion, ChuckA.


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

moman19 said:


> But the problem is: Unless you set up the 16x9 TV1 to a stretched screen (something you wouldn't want to normally do with HD content) The remote TV on channel 60 will look Squished with vertically elongated people & objetcs.


I think that there is a misunderstanding here. I used my wife's Panasonic TH-37PX50U as the Guinea Pig. As I am sure you realize the Television's Stretch/Zoom mode is *only* utilized when the programming is 4:3. The TV will "distort" the 4:3 image to fill up the 16:9 screen using the method you choose. My wife generally chooses "Just" as the "distortion" of choice. *Again, this method is applied ONLY to 4:3 programming.*

When I ran my mini-test per ChuckA's suggestion I used the TV2 Composite Video signal as my input to the Panny now acting as TV2. The *only* output of the 942's TV2 is 4:3 "Normal" or 4:3 "Letterbox." (Edit: And these are only effective on HD Programming.) In that our second set is and will be a smaller screen unit - say 20" or 22" 16:9 we will leave the 942 to "Normal." On a larger screen 16:9 TV2 some other choice might be superior.

So, whether TV2 is tuned to an HD *or* an SD program, _it will always put out a SD 4:3 image to TV2!_ The picture I see on my 16:9 TV2 will *always* be that 4:3 image "distorted" in my chosen "Just" manner to fill up the entire screen. _I do not care what stretch mode is on TV1._

The remote image onTV2 with no stretching seems to be without any distortion at all on either my 13" 4:3 set or my 37" 16:9 set and again seems without distortion when viewed with black bars on the side. When viewed with our preferred "Just" distortion the picture seems to be distorted very little, and again on a smaller screen I suspect that it will be less noticeable.

The notion that, "E* needs to add a "stretch" mode to keep people with 16:9 2nd TVs happy." does not make sense to me. No disrespect intended, but it's doing everything I could want - except provide an HD signal to TV2.


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## s8ist (Aug 21, 2006)

I know what James is talking about here. The display on my 2nd TV is actually stretched out the wrong way, and a part of the picture is cropped. SD content seems fine, but shows that are recorded in HD still have the black bars on the top and bottom and cropping on the sides. More options need to exist under the "Format" button.


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## Guitar1969 (Oct 19, 2006)

OinkinOregon said:


> Yes it is a 4:3 HDTV, so when I adjust the TV to format to the receivers input my screen goes from a 32 inch to about a 23 inch.


My TV2 which is a 4:3 non HD does the same thing in single user mode, and even worse, the middle of the screen(Thinking vertically) is distorted so it is not even a square - I had to set it in strech mode to correct it, but obviously that is not the true image proportions. I want single user mode because of PIP, but I still watch shows on my second TV. What's dumb is why why Dish did not put a single user/dual user button on the remotes to change, instead its only on the reciever front panel).

I think Dish nbeeds to look into this problem with TV2 output


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## SaltiDawg (Aug 30, 2004)

Guitar1969 said:


> ... What's dumb is why why Dish did not put a single user/dual user button on the remotes to change, instead its only on the reciever front panel). ...


What's dumb is not what Dish is doing. 

As you (likely) know, in Single mode both *TV1* and *TV2* must watch the same *tuner.* The specific tuner being viewed must be set at some format, and it is the one selected by the viewer of *TV1.* It follows that in Dual mode the format for the *tuner *being viewed at each TV should be determined by the respective TV viewer. :grin:


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

The ViP211 handles the problem by handling the HD and SD outputs separately. You can watch a 16x9 program in widescreen on the HD connected set while watching the same program in 4:3 (cropped or letterboxed) on the SD outputs. Not that many would do it with a 211 (which comes with an IR remote control) but the TV3/TV4 output can be distributed (as I have done) and this separate HD from SD works nice in the "other room". (The downside is that there is no anamorphic widescreen "stretch" mode - so if you are using the SD outputs to feed a DVD recorder or other device you only get crop or letterbox and can't make "widescreen" DVDs.)

I expected E* to do the same on the ViP622 DVR ... but while TV2 is stuck in the letterbox or crop only mode, TV1 via SD is a simple downrez of the HD picture. This can be annoying when one is watching a 4:3 program on the 16:9 main set and also feeding (via home distribution) the TV1 signal to another room. One must either stretch on the 16:9 set (and use options on the set to get back to the right aspect) or put up with a squeezed pillarbox on the home distribution output.

Seems odd that a ViP-211 would have SD outputs more suited to a ViP-622 and vice versa.


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

Indeed. The 622 needs a "TV2 Setup" screen with HD down-convert options for
Widescreen/anamorphic
4:3 letterbox
4:3 full-screen/cropped


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