# Router Recommendations



## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

I have an old Linksys WRT54G Version 8. Lately I've noticed a significant degradation in performance, ie high ping times (that fluctuate dramatically) and much slower speeds than I should be getting. I have 20 down service and am getting anywhere from 3-13.

The issues are the same whether the computer is connected wirelessly or via ethernet. Going direct from computer via ethernet to the cable modem cures all issues (speeds go from the low described above to 20+), so seems like a definite router issue.

We have a ton of devices connected. A PS3, desktop, printer and the DECA are all hardwired to the router. We also have a ton of wireless devices, (2 iPhones, 1 iPod, 2 iPads, 1 Wii, 1 Macbook Pro, 1 Windows laptop) among others.

Does anyone disagree this is a router issue.

Can anyone recommend a solid router that can handle that load that won't burst the budget. I thought about the Apple Time Capsule but they are extremely expensive and I already have an external drive I'm backing up the Macbook Pro to.

Thanks


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

Netgear with DD-WRT software on it. Fast, robust, and hasnt dropped once in over a year.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

Agreed. Stay far away from another Linksys. They have been the worst on the vulnerability that unfortunately affects all current routers by default. On other ones, you can disable the feature that's affected, that doesn't work on most Linksys units unless they have dd-wrt or a similar third party firmware.

I'd look at the wndr4500.


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

"dpeters11" said:


> Agreed. Stay far away from another Linksys. They have been the worst on the vulnerability that unfortunately affects all current routers by default. On other ones, you can disable the feature that's affected, that doesn't work on most Linksys units unless they have dd-wrt or a similar third party firmware.
> 
> I'd look at the wndr4500.


This one looks like a winner. Going to pick one up tomorrow. Even works with Time Machine.


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## dennisj00 (Sep 27, 2007)

I'm not sure of the beef with Linksys. I'm very pleased with the dozen or so dual band units I have around family, friends and small business. The first thing I do is put dd-wrt on them.


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## RasputinAXP (Jan 23, 2008)

I have a 3x3 Asus RTN16. love it.


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## phrelin (Jan 18, 2007)

dennisj00 said:


> I'm not sure of the beef with Linksys. I'm very pleased with the dozen or so dual band units I have around family, friends and small business. The first thing I do is put dd-wrt on them.


I am happy with my E4200. I don't see the problem either. It's no big thing to install dd-wrt and I'm not sure I'd worry much about a home installation such as mine without it.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"dennisj00" said:


> I'm not sure of the beef with Linksys. I'm very pleased with the dozen or so dual band units I have around family, friends and small business. The first thing I do is put dd-wrt on them.


Installing dd-wrt on them negates my issue with them. The problem with Linksys was that Wireless Protected Setup PIN mode is insecure. It may be an 8 digit pin, but in reality, it's a 4 digit number that is denied or confirmed, then a three digit number (the 8th will always be right). This is much easier to crack than one 8 digit number. The number also is generally static (many are on a sticker on the bottom). Now, almost all wireless routers current have this vulnerability (except Apple Airport, which uses a dynamic pin, some buffaloes etc.) The real problem is, turning off WPS on Linksys units didn't actually work. It stayed on, even though it said it was off in the GUI. Linksys has fixed this in some models, but not enough.

http://www6.nohold.net/Cisco2/ukp.aspx?vw=1&articleid=25154
Admittedly, the E4200 is one Linksys fixed, but how many people update their firmware?

With DDWRT it's a moot point as that firmware doesn't do WPS, they don't have Wifi alliance certification. WPS must be usable and on by default to use the wifi logo on packaging.

I also don't like that Cisco updated some models of routers without the user knowing it, moving them to their cloud interface. One thing I don't want is my router being accessible from the Internet, particularly without knowing about it, not to mention the fact that one day it couldn't be done, then the next day it could without my knowing about it.

To be clear, the WPS issue is irregardless of the network security. It doesn't matter if its a randomly generated long WPA2 passcode.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

I have a couple of recent Netgear routers--WNDR4000 and WNR3500L (sam knows version)--and neither will do port forwarding (I can set it up on the browser interface but it doesn't work). I put dd-wrt on the 4000 but that didn't help. Otherwise, both appear to be excellent routers but no port forwarding is a deal-breaker for me. I also tried a D-Link which won't port forward either.

I'm still using my Linksys WRT160N, but I need to reboot it every few days because DHCP stops working. It seems that I have dumped a lot of bucks into useless hardware.


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"bobnielsen" said:


> I have a couple of recent Netgear routers--WNDR4000 and WNR3500L (sam knows version)--and neither will do port forwarding (I can set it up on the browser interface but it doesn't work). I put dd-wrt on the 4000 but that didn't help. Otherwise, both appear to be excellent routers but no port forwarding is a deal-breaker for me. I also tried a D-Link which won't port forward either.
> 
> I'm still using my Linksys WRT160N, but I need to reboot it every few days because DHCP stops working. It seems that I have dumped a lot of bucks into useless hardware.


Seems odd to me. I'd think port forwarding would be software, not part of the WNDR4000 hardware.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

Seriously - I'd get the cheapest 802.11N router you can find. I really doubt you'd see much a difference between the base model and the fancy one.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> Seriously - I'd get the cheapest 802.11N router you can find. I really doubt you'd see much a difference between the base model and the fancy one.


You can depending on the issues.

The only real choice you need to make is do you want a dual channel or single channel. If you have G rated devices and N rated devices then segmenting it can cause you to gain significant perofmrance on your N devices as they will not be capped at G speeds.

Price does not dictate good qualities in routers but generally speaking higher price routers do have better processors and memory which can translate to better performance.


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## lugnutathome (Apr 13, 2009)

http://usa.asus.com/Networks/Wireless_Routers/RTN66U/

One of my network admins swears this is the best and recently obtained one for himself. Not cheap but consider if you make a proper investment it is likely a technogly shift down the road will drive its replacement and not its failure.

We all have our way we percieve things.

Don"this would be my pick" Bolton


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## The Merg (Jun 24, 2007)

I have 2 WRT160N routers with DD-WRT firmware on them and they work fine. You can usually find them refurbished on Amazon for about $30.

- Merg


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## swyman18 (Jan 12, 2009)

Another vote here for the Asus RT-N16. 

I love the old Linksys WRT54G's, but the newer versions can be problematic. If you want to play around with dd-wrt or tomato, you can still buy a WRT54GL brand new. They were built specifically as a "hobby" router with the Linux based firmware. But the hardware on those is getting rather outdated, especially for use with today's faster connections. I doubt the WAN port could handle throughput much higher than 20Mbps or so.


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## Cholly (Mar 22, 2004)

I have a Netgear WNDR3700 router that I swear by. I'm sure there are later incantations of this router, but at the time I bought it, it was the most highly recommended dual band wireless-N router on the market. Certainly, the Asus router mentioned above and Buffalo routers also rate very highly. Cisco/Linksys routers don't come as highly recommended.


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## mobandit (Sep 4, 2007)

Linksys E4200 (with updated firmware) has been a great buy. I once swore off Linksys, but like their newest models.


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

I went with the Netgear WNDR4500, probably overkill but it does have (with the latest firmware) Time Capsule compatibility, which was a plus. Plus, I'm considering moving to the 30Meg down tier from the 20 I am at now as we are doing alot more streaming lately from Vudu, Amazon, Netflix and D* VOD and wanted something pretty robust.

Does anyone know whether it still holds true that if I put a "G" device and an "N" device (on the same 2.4ghz band), whether that particular router will slow down all devices to the "G" speed. I know that used to hold true but am not sure if it still does with some of the newer routers, and not that it makes much of a difference, more out of curiosity. Some of my devices are "N" but only operatee at 2.4 rather than 5 (ie my Roku 2 XD), so it will be sharing the 2.4 channel with my daughters Ipod Touch which is only a "G".


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

raott said:


> I went with the Netgear WNDR4500, probably overkill but it does have (with the latest firmware) Time Capsule compatibility, which was a plus. Plus, I'm considering moving to the 30Meg down tier from the 20 I am at now as we are doing alot more streaming lately from Vudu, Amazon, Netflix and D* VOD and wanted something pretty robust.
> 
> Does anyone know whether it still holds true that if I put a "G" device and an "N" device (on the same 2.4ghz band), whether that particular router will slow down all devices to the "G" speed. I know that used to hold true but am not sure if it still does with some of the newer routers, and not that it makes much of a difference, more out of curiosity. Some of my devices are "N" but only operatee at 2.4 rather than 5 (ie my Roku 2 XD), so it will be sharing the 2.4 channel with my daughters Ipod Touch which is only a "G".


I've never seen a consumer class router not do this. You would have to look at the specifications but the chances are very slim it won't. There are routers out there that will but they're not consumer, or even entry business, level that will do this because it's costly.


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## brett_the_bomb (Oct 24, 2009)

"Shades228" said:


> I've never seen a consumer class router not do this. You would have to look at the specifications but the chances are very slim it won't. There are routers out there that will but they're not consumer, or even entry business, level that will do this because it's costly.


Maybe this isn't a good idea, but buying a second router(cheaper one) to host your G devices. That way you get the N speeds out of your nicer router? Is there something im missing?


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## Cholly (Mar 22, 2004)

brett_the_bomb said:


> Maybe this isn't a good idea, but buying a second router(cheaper one) to host your G devices. That way you get the N speeds out of your nicer router? Is there something im missing?


If the router has dual radios (2 and 5 GHz), then it's easy to put the G devices on the 2 GHz radio and the N devices o the 5 GHz. That's the way my Netgear is set up.


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## raott (Nov 23, 2005)

Cholly said:


> If the router has dual radios (2 and 5 GHz), then it's easy to put the G devices on the 2 GHz radio and the N devices o the 5 GHz. That's the way my Netgear is set up.


Problem is there are some N devices that only work at 2.4 (ie the Roku 2XD), then you become forced to mix G and N devices on 2.4.

I've moved all my N devices that can do 5 to that channel.

With that said, I haven't run into problems yet streaming with G and N mixed on the same channel.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

brett_the_bomb said:


> Maybe this isn't a good idea, but buying a second router(cheaper one) to host your G devices. That way you get the N speeds out of your nicer router? Is there something im missing?


You could do that but then you start segmenting your network as you would have to have a different subnet setup which will segment your network.



raott said:


> Problem is there are some N devices that only work at 2.4 (ie the Roku 2XD), then you become forced to mix G and N devices on 2.4.
> 
> I've moved all my N devices that can do 5 to that channel.
> 
> With that said, I haven't run into problems yet streaming with G and N mixed on the same channel.


You shouldn't have "issues" but if you have enough devices going you'll notice that your throughput speeds will drop and that could impact things like streaming. It seems odd that Roku went backwards and removed 5ghz support like they used to have.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

mobandit said:


> Linksys E4200 (with updated firmware) has been a great buy. I once swore off Linksys, but like their newest models.


I just ordered a refurb E4200 from http://homestore.cisco.com, $79.99. Hopefully it won't have the DHCP issues my WRT160N has, nor the port forwarding issues of my Netgear WNR3500 or WNDR4000.


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## Phil T (Mar 25, 2002)

I bought the Costco version of the Netgear WNDR4500 yesterday. It is a R4500. So far I am very impressed with the speed of my local network and features of the router. I bought the latest Centurylink modem/router Actiontec C1000A and was very disappointed and took it back. The Actiontec dropped out the first day of a trip I was on last week and left me with no Slingbox access. So far this plays very well with all my devices. I have a Zyxel Q100 basic modem for Centurylink in bridge mode and have never seen my network and internet speed fly like it is doing now.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

I'm an Apple kind of guy, so I tend to most things from Apple. And I think the Apple Extreme is one of the very best routers out there. Simple and clean design, one of the simplest to configure from Windows or OSX, dual-band and covers all the right wireless 802.xxxx stuff.

Yeah, they aren't the cheapest out there, but you can save a few bucks by buying them from the online Apple Store in their 'special deals' section. Refurbs and open box, but with full warranty just like the new ones.

I have a long bi-level house, and my tech room where the telco line is, is located at one end of the house, and I need to get it to the 2nd floor over the garage at the other end. And I wanted a new TimeCapsule to replace my 1st Gen one whose HD is getting hinky.

So now I have a 2TB Time Capsule at the tech room, one Extreme on my A/V rack with wired connections to it from the A/V gear that doesn't have wireless, and the old Time Capsule in a room at the furthest point from the tech room on the lower floor mounted up very high.

I'm using a mixed 2.4/5.0Ghz network of mostly 'n', but some older stuff doesn't do 'n' and the blasted W7 Acer laptop does 'n' but not at 5Ghz.

The setup is rock solid. And a pleasant surprise was when after 'virginizing' the Extreme to reset it to 'extend the network', when it came back up, the Airport Utility ran automagically and said it thought I wanted to extend the network and a single click and it was done! That's just sweet.


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## Phil T (Mar 25, 2002)

I was in Best Buy Sunday and saw a open box return of the latest Apple Extreme router for less than I had paid for the Netgear R4500. I brought it home and hooked it up. I did have to do a reset because someone had already set up and named the networks. There is not a mark on it and it was very easy to set up. I have had it up and running a few days and really can not tell much of a difference in performance between the Extreme and the Netgear. I have a all Apple set up and my IPad, IPhone and Macs are all enjoying it. The DirecTV HR34, HR24 and HR21 all are playing nicely and my Slingbox did not require Port Forwarding or did it itself. On the Netgear I had to set it up manually. A funny thing is that the Netgear Genie still works on my Macs and shows me the network map and status of all my devices. My HP wireless printer did not like the Netgear and would not do Airplay even though it was supposed to. The Netgear went back to Costco this morning.


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## Phil T (Mar 25, 2002)

Something I forgot to add. I have an early Time Capsule that I upgraded to 2 GB that was running my network. I would get a lot of dropouts when streaming video over the net and from my Apple devices. The Extreme and the Netgear R4500 both solved this issue and now I can also stream video stored on the Time Capsule that I could not do before. I have the Time Capsule in bridge mode and access it through the Extreme.


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