# Recording to a DVD-Recorder



## kslates (Sep 21, 2007)

I just got a DVD recorder yesterday. I have a HR20-700. How do I record what I have saved onto a DVD?

The DVD-R is a Philips DVDR3505


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Connect with RCA cables to analog outputs and feed into input of DVD recorder. You should also run the audio cable across (out-to-in) as well.

My Toshiba DVD recorder has been working very well with this setup.

One last suggestion....record in the highest possible "mode" on the DVD recorder, and you'll get a pretty good image quality stored on the DVD.


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## kslates (Sep 21, 2007)

But where on the DTV menu do I actually send it to the DVDR? Or do I just record what is actually showing on the tv? That is the part that confuses me


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## Michael D'Angelo (Oct 21, 2006)

kslates said:


> But where on the DTV menu do I actually send it to the DVDR? Or do I just record what is actually showing on the tv? That is the part that confuses me


You just record what is playing (what you see on your TV).


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## dduitsman (Dec 8, 2007)

Also - if your DVDR has an S-Video input, using an S-Video cable instead of the (yellow) composite video cable will give you a better picture. Just to be totally clear - I'm recommending an S-Video cable for the video, plus the dual rca cable (red and white) for the stereo audio.

Composite (EDIT: make that *Component*) video (3 rca jacks) is best of course - as long as you can get it to output 480i. Perhaps you might list whats already connected to your HR20. If your HD TV is using your component outputs, then my answer applies for sure.

Good Luck,
dd


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## CMO (Apr 7, 2008)

Also make sure you select 480 as your resolution on the HR20 or else you will record a black screen.


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## Michael D'Angelo (Oct 21, 2006)

CMO said:


> Also make sure you select 480 as your resolution on the HR20 or else you will record a black screen.


When using RCA's out or S-Video out on the HR20/21 it down-converts the resolution to 480i and it does not matter what the actually resolution the program is.


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## grizbear (Aug 9, 2007)

and make sure "CC"-captions and Caller ID are off or any captions/messages will be recorded on your DVD recorder.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

BMoreRavens said:


> When using RCA's out or S-Video out on the HR20/21 it down-converts the resolution to 480i and it does not matter what the actually resolution the program is.


Yes....you are correct sir!


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## CMO (Apr 7, 2008)

Thanks for the correction. I know I had to do this on my HR10-250 so I thought it was the same procedure on the HR20.


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## Michael D'Angelo (Oct 21, 2006)

CMO said:


> Thanks for the correction. I know I had to do this on my HR10-250 so I thought it was the same procedure on the HR20.


Nope, that is one of the very nice things about the HR20/21 vs. the HD TiVo and it works great for Slingbox.


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## lwilli201 (Dec 22, 2006)

grizbear said:


> and make sure "CC"-captions and Caller ID are off or any captions/messages will be recorded on your DVD recorder.


Also the network cable. You can record those network log off messages. I have two HD DVR's in the living room, so when I am recording to DVD I disconnect the phone line and network cable from that DVR and watch TV on the other. I usually record anything I want to record to a DVD. If you make a mistake, you can start over.


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## dduitsman (Dec 8, 2007)

lwilli201 said:


> Also the network cable. You can record those network log off messages.


Good tip - I've never seen that message pop up though (2 HR21's both with wired network connection).

What causes the DVR to display that message? I ask because, in my setup, it's hard to reach the ethernet cable.

dd


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## Michael D'Angelo (Oct 21, 2006)

dduitsman said:


> Good tip - I've never seen that message pop up though (2 HR21's both with wired network connection).
> 
> What causes the DVR to display that message? I ask because, in my setup, it's hard to reach the ethernet cable.
> 
> dd


If you have you HD DVR's set up for "Media Share" and you log off/turn off your PC you will get the log off message.


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## dduitsman (Dec 8, 2007)

ahhh 

Thanks Mike and Iwilli. I'll file this message away for when I setup media share - It would have gotten me for sure.

dd


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## lwilli201 (Dec 22, 2006)

BMoreRavens said:


> If you have you HD DVR's set up for "Media Share" and you log off/turn off your PC you will get the log off message.


Yes, that is it. I have 5 networked computers with other family members using them. I never know when some one is going to log off.


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## davring (Jan 13, 2007)

Depending on the content you are recording to DVD ensure you set the DVR(HR20/21)to the format you wish to record. Your DVD recorder should copy either 16X9 or 4X3 so set your output depending on the type of DVD you wish to have, widescreen or full screen.


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## dduitsman (Dec 8, 2007)

FYI: *Regarding Network Logoff messages...*

I am not a Cutting Edge member, but I was Lurking over there and I see they have a Poll going as to whether these messages should be capable of being disabled - just like caller ID.

Hopefully this will be adopted soon.

dd


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## ChiTown Gal (Apr 17, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Connect with RCA cables to analog outputs and feed into input of DVD recorder. You should also run the audio cable across (out-to-in) as well.
> 
> My Toshiba DVD recorder has been working very well with this setup.
> 
> One last suggestion....record in the highest possible "mode" on the DVD recorder, and you'll get a pretty good image quality stored on the DVD.


I have a toshiba hdd/dvd recorder (RD-XS54SU) and can't get the direct tv DS12-300 satellite receiver to sync so that I can use the TV Guide feature of the dvr. Any ideas? From a previous thread, it appears that the DS12-300 is made by Phillips but my DVR is not accepting the codes for phillips.


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

davring said:


> Depending on the content you are recording to DVD ensure you set the DVR(HR20/21)to the format you wish to record. Your DVD recorder should copy either 16X9 or 4X3 so set your output depending on the type of DVD you wish to have, widescreen or full screen.


Composite or S-video cables 480i connections can only handle 4:3 images, so that's what the DVD-R will record. If the program you are recording is 16:9, and the HR2x is configured to use a 16:9 display, the image the HR20 outputs on the composite/S-video will be "squeezed" horizontally (i.e. it will look tall and skinny). This won't be a problem when you play the DVD as long as it's on a 16:9 screen and the DVD player is set to use a 16:9 display - it will stretch the image back to its proper aspect.


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## 420benz (Dec 20, 2006)

Can i assume that in order to record a recorded movie,i must play the movie and watch it.


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## 420benz (Dec 20, 2006)

Also:What does DMR mean?


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

420benz said:


> Can i assume that in order to record a recorded movie,i must play the movie and watch it.


You have to play it, but you don't necessarily have to watch it. You could turn off the TV and read a book, or leave the room&#8230;but seriously, no, you can't watch anything else on that HR20; it has to playback the program while the DVD-R records it in real-time.

Maybe someday in the future we will be able to select different "streams" on the different outputs, for example, tuner 1 on HDMI, tuner 2 on component, and playback of a saved show on composite (or any combination of the above). This would be great for people (like me!) who have more than one TV connected to the same receiver. Of course I have no idea if the hardware could actually do that. If it could, D* might never implement it for fear that it would adversely affect sales (excuse me, "leases fees") of receivers and the monthly mirror/lease fees since some households could get by with fewer units.



420benz said:


> Also:What does DMR mean?


DMR? I have no clue. Are you referring to the model number of the DVD recorder you are using? Maybe it stands for "Digital Media Recorder"?


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## 420benz (Dec 20, 2006)

rudeney said:


> You have to play it, but you don't necessarily have to watch it. You could turn off the TV and read a book, or leave the room&#8230;but seriously, no, you can't watch anything else on that HR20; it has to playback the program while the DVD-R records it in real-time.
> 
> Maybe someday in the future we will be able to select different "streams" on the different outputs, for example, tuner 1 on HDMI, tuner 2 on component, and playback of a saved show on composite (or any combination of the above). This would be great for people (like me!) who have more than one TV connected to the same receiver. Of course I have no idea if the hardware could actually do that. If it could, D* might never implement it for fear that it would adversely affect sales (excuse me, "leases fees") of receivers and the monthly mirror/lease fees since some households could get by with fewer units.
> 
> DMR? I have no clue. Are you referring to the model number of the DVD recorder you are using? Maybe it stands for "Digital Media Recorder"?


I have a Panasonic DMR-ES 35v combo.I thought it was a recorder.


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

hello everyone. i am having a problem. i am trying to dub some things from my hr20-100 to my father in law's dvd/vcr burner (magnavox mrv700vr). i hooked an s-video cable going from the out on the hd-dvr to the in on the dvd recorder as well as the rca audio plugs. however, having done all of that, i can't get any sort of noticable sign that the units are talking to each other. can anyone give me any advice as to what i can do?


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## The Merg (Jun 24, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> hello everyone. i am having a problem. i am trying to dub some things from my hr20-100 to my father in law's dvd/vcr burner (magnavox mrv700vr). i hooked an s-video cable going from the out on the hd-dvr to the in on the dvd recorder as well as the rca audio plugs. however, having done all of that, i can't get any sort of noticable sign that the units are talking to each other. can anyone give me any advice as to what i can do?


Hook up the DVD-burner via the output of your TV and not directly from the HD-DVR. Most TV's have at least a composite output that you would use RCA cables with.

Also make sure that you are connecting the cables to the input on the DVD-burner.

- Merg


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## dduitsman (Dec 8, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> hello everyone. i am having a problem. i am trying to dub some things from my hr20-100 to my father in law's dvd/vcr burner (magnavox mrv700vr). i hooked an s-video cable going from the out on the hd-dvr to the in on the dvd recorder as well as the rca audio plugs. however, having done all of that, i can't get any sort of noticable sign that the units are talking to each other. can anyone give me any advice as to what i can do?


Kevin,

On your mrv700vr, did you connect to the S-Video on the front panel or on the back?

dd


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## joed32 (Jul 27, 2006)

kevin75 said:


> hello everyone. i am having a problem. i am trying to dub some things from my hr20-100 to my father in law's dvd/vcr burner (magnavox mrv700vr). i hooked an s-video cable going from the out on the hd-dvr to the in on the dvd recorder as well as the rca audio plugs. however, having done all of that, i can't get any sort of noticable sign that the units are talking to each other. can anyone give me any advice as to what i can do?


Make sure that you have the correct input or source selected on the DVR and the same thing with the TV. When you can see the picture on the TV you should be good.


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## rajeshh (Sep 11, 2007)

kslates said:


> I just got a DVD recorder yesterday. I have a HR20-700. How do I record what I have saved onto a DVD?
> 
> The DVD-R is a Philips DVDR3505


Hello, I am getting the same Philips recorder. I was looking at the posts in avsforum and found this post about DirecTV HR20s not allowing to record to this DVDR. Are you experiencing this?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13648781&postcount=176

Btw, OT, any feedback on this DVDR? Do you like it?


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## Church AV Guy (Jul 9, 2007)

rudeney said:


> You have to play it, but you don't necessarily have to watch it. You could turn off the TV and read a book, or leave the room&#8230;but seriously, no, you can't watch anything else on that HR20; it has to playback the program while the DVD-R records it in real-time.
> 
> Maybe someday in the future we will be able to select different "streams" on the different outputs, for example, tuner 1 on HDMI, tuner 2 on component, and playback of a saved show on composite (or any combination of the above). This would be great for people (like me!) who have more than one TV connected to the same receiver. Of course I have no idea if the hardware could actually do that. If it could, D* might never implement it for fear that it would adversely affect sales (excuse me, "leases fees") of receivers and the monthly mirror/lease fees since some households could get by with fewer units.
> .
> ...


Multiple output streams are indeed possible, but it would require a second set of decode chips, and at least for now, they are expensive. As you point out, there is little incentive to make a machine with multiple output streams. My sister has a DISH DVR with dual output streams, but it is strictly MPEG2. I don't expect to see a DVR with dual output streams any time soon.



rajeshh said:


> Hello, I am getting the same Philips recorder. I was looking at the posts in avsforum and found this post about DirecTV HR20s not allowing to record to this DVDR. Are you experiencing this?
> 
> http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=13648781&postcount=176
> 
> Btw, OT, any feedback on this DVDR? Do you like it?


What this post is referring to has little or nothing to do with DirecTV, the HR20s, or in fact the Philips recorder. All DVD recorders sold in the US must conform to the content protection mechanisms. Some are more sensitive to these mechanisms than others, Sony being notorious, but they all must comply. Recently, some content providers (HBO for one) have started putting content protection on some of their programming. What programs specifically, and when, seem to be vague, but if a provider like HBO adds content protection to a show or movie, then the DVD recorder has no choice but to refuse to record that program. This is independent of who is sending the program (cable, DISH, DirecTV) or what manufacturer of the recorder. With the exception that some machines are more sensitive than others, they all must be compliant. Certain products are reported to filter the video signals and in the process of cleaning up the signal, the copy mechanisms are removed. Discussions of such things is usually to be avoided, I am just commenting that they exist.


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## mdavej (Jan 31, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> hello everyone. i am having a problem. i am trying to dub some things from my hr20-100 to my father in law's dvd/vcr burner (magnavox mrv700vr). i hooked an s-video cable going from the out on the hd-dvr to the in on the dvd recorder as well as the rca audio plugs. however, having done all of that, i can't get any sort of noticable sign that the units are talking to each other. can anyone give me any advice as to what i can do?


I believe you just change channels until you get to EXT2. And make sure the s-video is on the IN port of the magnavox.


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## sean_mba (Jul 27, 2006)

BMoreRavens said:


> When using RCA's out or S-Video out on the HR20/21 it down-converts the resolution to 480i and it does not matter what the actually resolution the program is.


Just so that I'm clear on this - If I have a S-Video cable attached to my HR20-700, will it down convert the signal at the S-Video output and ONLY the S-Video output (while leaving the HDMI at 1080)? Or does it down convert the signal for all of the outputs? In other words, can I watch something at 1080 on TV via HDMI while it is simultaneously sending a 480 signal to my recorder?


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## Michael D'Angelo (Oct 21, 2006)

sean_mba said:


> Just so that I'm clear on this - If I have a S-Video cable attached to my HR20-700, will it down convert the signal at the S-Video output and ONLY the S-Video output (while leaving the HDMI at 1080)? Or does it down convert the signal for all of the outputs? In other words, can I watch something at 1080 on TV via HDMI while it is simultaneously sending a 480 signal to my recorder?


Welcome to DBSTalk

It will only down-convert the picture on the S-Video and composite video outputs. It will still be the correct resolution on the HDMI and component video outputs.

So if you are watching an HD program on one TV using HDMI or component it will still be 1080i or 720p even if you are using S-Video or composite to another TV.


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

thanks for the help so far everyone, but i have a couple more questions. i don't have a normal tv, instead i have a projector, to which the satellite signal is passing through my onkyo reciever to the projector via component. after looking again at the projector's connections, it doesn't look like it has any outputs only hdmi/component/s-video in. with that being the case, and having everything run through the receiver, am i screwed or is there another way that i can hook up the dvd recorder?

thanks.


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## rbpeirce (Feb 24, 2006)

grizbear said:


> and make sure "CC"-captions and Caller ID are off or any captions/messages will be recorded on your DVD recorder.


I actually taped a note to my remote to turn off caller ID. I still forget to do it sometimes!


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## joed32 (Jul 27, 2006)

kevin75 said:


> thanks for the help so far everyone, but i have a couple more questions. i don't have a normal tv, instead i have a projector, to which the satellite signal is passing through my onkyo reciever to the projector via component. after looking again at the projector's connections, it doesn't look like it has any outputs only hdmi/component/s-video in. with that being the case, and having everything run through the receiver, am i screwed or is there another way that i can hook up the dvd recorder?
> 
> thanks.


Satellite box to DVD recorder. TV is not needed except to monitor your recording so it doesn't need any "outs".


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

kevin75 said:


> thanks for the help so far everyone, but i have a couple more questions. i don't have a normal tv, instead i have a projector, to which the satellite signal is passing through my onkyo reciever to the projector via component. after looking again at the projector's connections, it doesn't look like it has any outputs only hdmi/component/s-video in. with that being the case, and having everything run through the receiver, am i screwed or is there another way that i can hook up the dvd recorder?
> 
> thanks.


You'll be OK....the outputs from the HD DVR are "hot" concurrently, meaning...you get output through multiple forms of output at the same time. I currently have outputs from HDMI and S-Video running to my Projector and DVD Recorder respectively at the same time, and can use either...


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## Bowtaz3 (Sep 8, 2007)

CMO said:


> Also make sure you select 480 as your resolution on the HR20 or else you will record a black screen.


So make sure the playback of what I have saved on my DVR is playing back in 480i? Or is it 480p? Even if it was originally shown in HD? I kept getting black recordings. But I could hear sound. So I wonder if this "might" be my problem. Thanks for any help. *Edit*, I just tried putting it on 480i and it still shows a black screen. But with sound. I tried every input possible too.


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## Tom Robertson (Nov 15, 2005)

Bowtaz3 said:


> So make sure the playback of what I have saved on my DVR is playing back in 480i? Or is it 480p? Even if it was originally shown in HD? I kept getting black recordings. But I could hear sound. So I wonder if this "might" be my problem. Thanks for any help. *Edit*, I just tried putting it on 480i and it still shows a black screen. But with sound. I tried every input possible too.


Sounds like a cabling problem OR macrovision on a premium channel. The S-Video or composite (yellow, red, white) outputs are always 480i, no matter what the HD outputs are set too. My recorder will let me watch what it is "recording" and if it can't record because of macrovision protection, it will still display the picture but not record. And with a warning that it can't be recorded.

You might try channel 201 or some other basic cable channel just as a test.

Cheers,
Tom


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## Bowtaz3 (Sep 8, 2007)

Tom Robertson said:


> Sounds like a cabling problem OR macrovision on a premium channel. The S-Video or composite (yellow, red, white) outputs are always 480i, no matter what the HD outputs are set too. My recorder will let me watch what it is "recording" and if it can't record because of macrovision protection, it will still display the picture but not record. And with a warning that it can't be recorded.
> 
> You might try channel 201 or some other basic cable channel just as a test.
> 
> ...


Thanks I'm beginning to think it must be a bad s-video, because it didn't give a message or anything that I couldn't record it


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## 1995hoo (May 14, 2004)

dduitsman said:


> Also - if your DVDR has an S-Video input, using an S-Video cable instead of the (yellow) composite video cable will give you a better picture. Just to be totally clear - I'm recommending an S-Video cable for the video, plus the dual rca cable (red and white) for the stereo audio.
> 
> Composite video (3 rca jacks) is best of course - as long as you can get it to output 480i. Perhaps you might list whats already connected to your HR20. If your HD TV is using your component outputs, then my answer applies for sure.
> 
> ...


I believe you meant to say "component video (3 rca jacks)...." Composite video is the single cable that usually has yellow ends, as you note in your first paragraph.

Just wanted to be sure nobody misunderstood what you meant!


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

1995hoo said:


> I believe you meant to say "component video (3 rca jacks)...." Composite video is the single cable that usually has yellow ends, as you note in your first paragraph.
> 
> Just wanted to be sure nobody misunderstood what you meant!


Agreed.

It would have to be an S-Video (better imagery and preferred) or composite connection from the DVR to the DVD recorder, as almost no DVD Recorders support component inputs (HD copyright protect enforcement).


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

i finally got this to work! except for one thing. the program that i was trying to dub was in HD and therefore widescreen. i changed the setting on the dvd recorder to 16:9 and as far as i can tell, the setting on my ps3 is the same, however, when i put in the recorded dvd, it only shows up in 4:3. is there a way to fix this back to widescreen?


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> i finally got this to work! except for one thing. the program that i was trying to dub was in HD and therefore widescreen. i changed the setting on the dvd recorder to 16:9 and as far as i can tell, the setting on my ps3 is the same, however, when i put in the recorded dvd, it only shows up in 4:3. is there a way to fix this back to widescreen?


Because your DVD recorder only accepts a 480i signal via composite or S-video cables, it will only record a 4:3 ratio image. There are two options for recording 16:9 material this way: letterbox or anamorphic. With letterbox, you will actually record the black bars above and below the 16:9 image on the disc. This actually "wastes" pixels of resolution. With anamorphic, the 16:9 image will be horizontally "squeezed" to fit within the 4:3 ratio, and thus no pixels are wasted with black bars.

What determines whether you record letterbox or anamorphic has nothing to do with the setting on the DVD recorder. In fact, those setting only affect the playback, not the recording (and I'll mention more on that in a moment). What determines the format is actually the display setting on the HR2x. If you set it to be connected to a 16:9 screen, it will produce an anamorphic image. If you set it to be connected to a 4:3 screen, it will letterbox any 16:9 content.

So, which should you use? My advice is to always go with anamorphic. This gives you the most pixel content by not wasting any on black bars. If your DVD player is connected to a 16:9 screen, setting it as such should cause it to stretch any 4:3 content (and that's all it does). If not, your widescreen TV will likely have the ability to do so. Since the image was squeezed horizontally during recording, having it stretched during playback will actually return it to its "native" undistorted 16:9 ratio. If you playback on a 4:3 screen, the image will look "tall", but many people find that less annoying to watch than a 4:3 image that is stretched wide to fill a 16:9 screen (YMMV).


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

rudeney said:


> Because your DVD recorder only accepts a 480i signal via composite or S-video cables, it will only record a 4:3 ratio image. There are two options for recording 16:9 material this way: letterbox or anamorphic. With letterbox, you will actually record the black bars above and below the 16:9 image on the disc. This actually "wastes" pixels of resolution. With anamorphic, the 16:9 image will be horizontally "squeezed" to fit within the 4:3 ratio, and thus no pixels are wasted with black bars.
> 
> What determines whether you record letterbox or anamorphic has nothing to do with the setting on the DVD recorder. In fact, those setting only affect the playback, not the recording (and I'll mention more on that in a moment). What determines the format is actually the display setting on the HR2x. If you set it to be connected to a 16:9 screen, it will produce an anamorphic image. If you set it to be connected to a 4:3 screen, it will letterbox any 16:9 content.
> 
> So, which should you use? My advice is to always go with anamorphic. This gives you the most pixel content by not wasting any on black bars. If your DVD player is connected to a 16:9 screen, setting it as such should cause it to stretch any 4:3 content (and that's all it does). If not, your widescreen TV will likely have the ability to do so. Since the image was squeezed horizontally during recording, having it stretched during playback will actually return it to its "native" undistorted 16:9 ratio. If you playback on a 4:3 screen, the image will look "tall", but many people find that less annoying to watch than a 4:3 image that is stretched wide to fill a 16:9 screen (YMMV).


thanks for the info. i put the disc back into the ps3, double checked the settings on that and pushed play. again, it came up as 4:3 and so i tried pushed the aspect ratio button on my projector, but with no luck. it stayed 4:3. seeing as how i have a widescreen for my projector, i know that my directv box is outputting for a 16:9 screen and therefore, i think that the program should've recorded 'anamorphically'. the burned dvd does indeed look good even though it's 4:3, i just cant figure out why it won't stretch.


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## dduitsman (Dec 8, 2007)

1995hoo said:


> I believe you meant to say "component video (3 rca jacks)...." Composite video is the single cable that usually has yellow ends, as you note in your first paragraph.
> 
> Just wanted to be sure nobody misunderstood what you meant!


You are correct of course, thanks.

dd


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> thanks for the info. i put the disc back into the ps3, double checked the settings on that and pushed play. again, it came up as 4:3 and so i tried pushed the aspect ratio button on my projector, but with no luck. it stayed 4:3. seeing as how i have a widescreen for my projector, i know that my directv box is outputting for a 16:9 screen and therefore, i think that the program should've recorded 'anamorphically'. the burned dvd does indeed look good even though it's 4:3, i just cant figure out why it won't stretch.


So, if I understand you correctly, you recorded a 16:9 HD program and when you play it back, it is showing all of the image, but it is 4:3 anamorphic (i.e. squeezed horizontally)? And even though your player is set for a 16:9 display, it is not re-stretching the image, correct?

Here are some thoughts:

1. Maybe there are more setting in your player that tell it to stretch a 4:3 image. It may "pillar box" its output by default when the source disk is 4:3. Poke around and see if you can find anything. Sometimes DVD players have settings like "pillar box" or "pan & scan". Try what you can to see if it makes a difference.

2. You say your projector won't even allow you to stretch the image? How is the DVD player connected? Via HDMI or component video? Is the player doing a 1080i/p upconversion? The reason I ask is that my older Panasonic plasma TV will not stretch content that it receives in resolutions above 480p because it is "assumed" to already be 16:9. I wonder if this is the case with your projector? If so, try setting the player to no upconvert the signal.

3. Try outputting to the TV via a non-HD connection (composite or S-video) to see if it looks any different. Maybe it's the DVD player that's doing the "wrong" thing here.

4. To make sure the HR2x is outputting the proper anamorphic signal to the DVD player, connect a non-HD output from it to the projector. To see what it looks like.


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## Church AV Guy (Jul 9, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> thanks for the info. i put the disc back into the ps3, double checked the settings on that and pushed play. again, it came up as 4:3 and so i tried pushed the aspect ratio button on my projector, but with no luck. it stayed 4:3. seeing as how i have a widescreen for my projector, i know that my directv box is outputting for a 16:9 screen and therefore, i think that the program should've recorded 'anamorphically'. the burned dvd does indeed look good even though it's 4:3, i just cant figure out why it won't stretch.


Another possibility: Many of the high def channels, when they are showing non hi def content will pillarbox the video. If it came that way from the source, the DVD recorder and the projector have no way of knowing that it isn't actual contnet, because in face it IS actual content the way it was recorded. Under those circomstances, there is no way to make it full screen. SOme of these channels, SciFi for one, will even go as far as "postge-stamping" the image. This is a real waste of pixels and bandwidth. If your program shows full screen when watching it not throught the DVD recorder, then this does not apply.


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

Church AV Guy said:


> Another possibility: Many of the high def channels, when they are showing non hi def content will pillarbox the video. If it came that way from the source, the DVD recorder and the projector have no way of knowing that it isn't actual contnet, because in face it IS actual content the way it was recorded. Under those circomstances, there is no way to make it full screen. SOme of these channels, SciFi for one, will even go as far as "postge-stamping" the image. This is a real waste of pixels and bandwidth. If your program shows full screen when watching it not throught the DVD recorder, then this does not apply.


i had wondered about that. the program(s) that i am trying to dub are disney shows from the travel channel. this particular one was taped in 2004 so i am not sure that they are even native HD but they were shown on discovery HD. on DHD, it filled the entire screen, but i am not sure if it's HD or just upconverted. whenever i watch it normally via the dvr, it does take the whole screen.


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

rudeney said:


> So, if I understand you correctly, you recorded a 16:9 HD program and when you play it back, it is showing all of the image, but it is 4:3 anamorphic (i.e. squeezed horizontally)? And even though your player is set for a 16:9 display, it is not re-stretching the image, correct?


yes. as i said above in another reply, i'm not positive that what i transferred was native HD or just upconverted, if that makes a difference. it does show the entire picture, but it is squeezed horizontally. when i am watching tv normally through the dvr/satellite if i try to change the aspect ratio it WILL change things around to the proper aspect ratio.



> Here are some thoughts:
> 
> 1. Maybe there are more setting in your player that tell it to stretch a 4:3 image. It may "pillar box" its output by default when the source disk is 4:3. Poke around and see if you can find anything. Sometimes DVD players have settings like "pillar box" or "pan & scan". Try what you can to see if it makes a difference.
> 
> ...


thanks for the suggestions. here is what i could find:

1. i played around with the settings on the ps3. i put it back into pan and scan mode and the picture shrank with the same 4:3 ratio.

2. i did try to turn off the upconverting with no luck. let me say that i am using dvd+r's because that is the type of disc that the recorder uses. the reason that i am using the ps3 is because that is the only player i have that will play dvd+r's. i have the dvd player connected to the projector through a receiver via HDMI. i haven't had an opportunity to check via a different connection though.

3. i don't know if you are talking about just the dvd player, but the dvr is connected via component to the projector and it looks fine.

4. are you talking about the dvd player that i am trying to play it on, or the dvd recorder that the signal was going through? in looking at the signal that is going through the dvd recorder, i am trying a few different HD channels and they are the same as the dvd i burned (horizontally squished).

again, thanks for all of the help. after all of this, i hope that i haven't done or not done something that was ridiculously easy to solve the problem.


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## cartrivision (Jul 25, 2007)

rudeney said:


> So, if I understand you correctly, you recorded a 16:9 HD program and when you play it back, it is showing all of the image, but it is 4:3 anamorphic (i.e. squeezed horizontally)? And even though your player is set for a 16:9 display, it is not re-stretching the image, correct?
> 
> Here are some thoughts:
> 
> 1. Maybe there are more setting in your player that tell it to stretch a 4:3 image. It may "pillar box" its output by default when the source disk is 4:3. Poke around and see if you can find anything. Sometimes DVD players have settings like "pillar box" or "pan & scan". Try what you can to see if it makes a difference.


When you record a 16:9 program anamorphicly on a DVD, most or all DVD players will not be able to play it back correctly on a 4:3 TV (with letterbox bars on top and bottom), but to view it correctly on a 16:9 TV, the setting that has to be changed is not on the DVD player but on the TV. You have to set the TV to stretch 4:3 content to 16:9. That will horizontally stretch the anamorphicly recorded picture on the DVD to the correct looking aspect ratio and fill the entire 16:9 TV frame.


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

I don’t think this has anything to do with using DVD+R discs. The discs are just recording “data” which happens to be MPG video. My suggestions #3 and #4 were to connect the HR2x to your projector via a non-HD cable, such as composite or S-video to see how the output appears, to verify it is anamorphically compressed and not adding the pillar bars, and also to do the same with the PS3 that you are using for playback. Also have you tried to play the discs on the DVR recorder to see how it shows them?


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

cartrivision said:


> When you record a 16:9 program anamorphicly on a DVD, most or all DVD players will not be able to play it back correctly on a 4:3 TV (with letterbox bars on top and bottom), but to view it correctly on a 16:9 TV, the setting that has to be changed is not on the DVD player but on the TV. You have to set the TV to stretch 4:3 content to 16:9. That will horizontally stretch the anamorphicly recorded picture on the DVD to the correct looking aspect ratio and fill the entire 16:9 TV frame.


I have a very old Sony DVD player (not even progressive capable) connected to my 42" Panasonic plasma via component, and I have my Philips DVD recorder connected to my 50" Panasonic plasma via HDMI. Both are set for a 16:9 display, and both correctly stretch an anamorphic 4:3 image without changing any settings on the TV. If I connect them via composite or S-video, then I do have to set the TV to stretch the image.


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## kevin75 (Apr 29, 2008)

rudeney said:


> I don't think this has anything to do with using DVD+R discs. The discs are just recording "data" which happens to be MPG video. My suggestions #3 and #4 were to connect the HR2x to your projector via a non-HD cable, such as composite or S-video to see how the output appears, to verify it is anamorphically compressed and not adding the pillar bars, and also to do the same with the PS3 that you are using for playback. Also have you tried to play the discs on the DVR recorder to see how it shows them?


i connected the hr20 to the projector via s-video and it was fine. the picture stretched correctly. i tried to connect the ps3 to the projector via some other way than HDMI, but it doesn't have an s-video output. it has hdmi and/or a specific output for ps3 that can split into different types. the cable that came with it went from the specific ps3 connector to red/yellow/white rca jacks. i could go into the receiver that way and then go to the projector via hdmi, but i would think that would pose the same problem. otherwise i would have to spend who knows how much to get a cable that would work specifically with the ps3.

i just tried to reburn it on the dvd recorder. when i tried to adjust the picture settings, it WOULD let me stretch the signal that was coming through the dvd recorder and it looked good through that machine. not hd but good. when i played the disc through the dvd recorder, it showed up fine. stretched out and everything. when i tried to play it via the ps3, no luck.


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## rudeney (May 28, 2007)

kevin75 said:


> i connected the hr20 to the projector via s-video and it was fine. the picture stretched correctly. i tried to connect the ps3 to the projector via some other way than HDMI, but it doesn't have an s-video output. it has hdmi and/or a specific output for ps3 that can split into different types. the cable that came with it went from the specific ps3 connector to red/yellow/white rca jacks. i could go into the receiver that way and then go to the projector via hdmi, but i would think that would pose the same problem. otherwise i would have to spend who knows how much to get a cable that would work specifically with the ps3.
> 
> i just tried to reburn it on the dvd recorder. when i tried to adjust the picture settings, it WOULD let me stretch the signal that was coming through the dvd recorder and it looked good through that machine. not hd but good. when i played the disc through the dvd recorder, it showed up fine. stretched out and everything. when i tried to play it via the ps3, no luck.


That set of red, white and yellow jacks from the PS3's proprietary output are composite audio and video. S-video and composite video are essentially the same in that they both carry only 480i SDTV signals. S-video offers no better resolution over composite - just better signal quality. You could try connecting the yellow composite video to the projector (assuming it has a composite video input) and see if the PS3's ratio setting affect that output. My guess is that your PS3 is not allowing any video reformatting on its HDMI output, but may on the analog output.

By the way, speaking of all this recording and screen aspect stuff, I had downloaded all the Dexter episodes via DOD. Although they were in 480i, they were widescreen. In native, so they would have appeared in "postage stamp" mode on my HDTV, so I have the HR20 set to "crop" any SDTV broadcasts. This made the images fill the screen, although quality was just "tolerable". Anyhow, I recorded that onto DVD's and when I play it back on the 16:9 TV, I get the same screen-filling zoomed/cropped image I do from the HR20. I loaned the discs to a friend and on his 4:3 SDTV, they appear in letterbox, as they should.


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## cartrivision (Jul 25, 2007)

rudeney said:


> I have a very old Sony DVD player (not even progressive capable) connected to my 42" Panasonic plasma via component, and I have my Philips DVD recorder connected to my 50" Panasonic plasma via HDMI. Both are set for a 16:9 display, and both correctly stretch an anamorphic 4:3 image without changing any settings on the TV. If I connect them via composite or S-video, then I do have to set the TV to stretch the image.


There is nothing that *any* DVR ever does to stretch an anamorphic video source. It already fills the entire video frame. The only thing left to do in order to view it correctly is for the TV to stretch the full video frame horizontally to fill the TV's 16:9 display instead of adding pillar box bars on the sides and displaying the video frame in 4:3 aspect ratio.

What a DVR sometimes does to an anamorphic video source is to compress it vertically and add letterbox bars at the top and bottom if the DVR is set to output for a 4:3 display, but a DVR doesn't stretch it when it's in 16:9 mode.


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## cstelter (Sep 20, 2007)

cartrivision said:


> There is nothing that *any* DVR ever does to stretch an anamorphic video source. It already fills the entire video frame. The only thing left to do in order to view it correctly is for the TV to stretch the full video frame horizontally to fill the TV's 16:9 display instead of adding pillar box bars on the sides and displaying the video frame in 4:3 aspect ratio.
> 
> What a DVR sometimes does to an anamorphic video source is to compress it vertically and add letterbox bars at the top and bottom if the DVR is set to output for a 4:3 display, but a DVR doesn't stretch it when it's in 16:9 mode.


My experience with 2 upconverting DVD players is that if you output in 1080i, it will automatically stretch the recording to 16:9 to conform to the 1080i standard. My Zenith gave you no option to add piller boxes if the original source was actually 4:3, but I haven't had my new one long enough to know what it can do.


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## Ramsrule (Sep 23, 2007)

to fix the issue of 16x9 content not being "stretched" automatically, you'll need to do the following -

(Note: This is how I've done it with both the HR10-250 and the HR20-100 to a first generation Panny DMR-HS2)

- Record widescreen content to your DVD recorder (Duh!).
- Finalize the DVD
- Copy the entire DVD to a PC
-Download "IFO Edit", which is a program that allows you to edit the flags in the DVD's IFO files. The issue is that your DVD recorder is setting the flag in the IFO's to 4x3.
- Edit each IFO (you'll have one per menu chapter)... setting your IFO's to both 16x9 and Pan & Scan. Pan & Scan will allow the widescreen content to be shown correctly on DVD players set to 4x3 by chopping off the right and left hand sides of the content. If you dont want this, then set the IFO's to "Letterbox" and then your friends with 4x3 TV's will get black bars on the top and botton of the screen:grin: 
- Once you've finished with the IFO editing, burn the entire set of files back to DVD.
- Enjoy you're corrected DVD's!  

I hope this helps.


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## cartrivision (Jul 25, 2007)

cstelter said:


> My experience with 2 upconverting DVD players is that if you output in 1080i, it will automatically stretch the recording to 16:9 to conform to the 1080i standard. My Zenith gave you no option to add piller boxes if the original source was actually 4:3, but I haven't had my new one long enough to know what it can do.


Again, the DVD player isn't stretching anything. With anamorphic widescreen video, the image already fills the entire video frame. If it was stretched by the DVD player, the sides of the image would have to be cropped (cut off and lost) since each edge of the image is already at each edge of the video frame. What has to happen with anamorphic video coming from a DVD player is that it has to be displayed from left edge to right edge of the video frame and top edge to bottom edge of the video frame, exactly filling the TV's 16:9 display with each edge of the video signal at each edge of the display.

Most HD TVs have separate stretch/zoom/crop settings for each input type (1080i/720p/480p/480i), and 1080i & 720p is normally set to display edge to edge of the video frame as 16:9, while 480i/p is usually set to display edge to edge of the video frame as 4:3 with the TV adding pillar bars on the sides to fill out the 16:9 frame. That's why if you set your DVD player to upconvert to 1080i, the TV displays an anamorphic disc correctly.... because you have the TV set to display 1080i signals as a 16:9 frame. If you set the player output to 480i, you would probably have to change the TV setting to stretch the 480i video to fill the 16:9 TV screen instead of adding pillarbox bars to it.


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## cartrivision (Jul 25, 2007)

Ramsrule said:


> to fix the issue of 16x9 content not being "stretched" automatically, you'll need to do the following -
> 
> (Note: This is how I've done it with both the HR10-250 and the HR20-100 to a first generation Panny DMR-HS2)
> 
> ...


Isn't it easier to just set the TV to stretch 4:3 content to 16:9? All HD TVs seem to have that setting available.


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## Ramsrule (Sep 23, 2007)

cartrivision said:


> Isn't it easier to just set the TV to stretch 4:3 content to 16:9? All HD TVs seem to have that setting available.


Sure, if everyone that's going to watch the disk has a widescreen TV.

With me, that's not the case. If you leave the DVD incorrectly flagged as 4x3, when someone watches it on a 4x3 set, everything's scrunched into the 4x3 screen.

Doing what I've outlined eliminates this issue. YMMV.


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## cartrivision (Jul 25, 2007)

Ramsrule said:


> Sure, if everyone that's going to watch the disk has a widescreen TV.
> 
> With me, that's not the case. If you leave the DVD incorrectly flagged as 4x3, when someone watches it on a 4x3 set, everything's scrunched into the 4x3 screen.
> 
> Doing what I've outlined eliminates this issue. YMMV.


OK, so you do it so that the DVD player knows to compress the video vertically and add letterbox bars when connected to and playing it on a 4:3 TV. I'm fine with the limitation of having to watch the recording on a 16:9 display to get the correct aspect ratio.


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## Ramsrule (Sep 23, 2007)

cartrivision said:


> Again, the DVD player isn't stretching anything.


Not necessarily the case if he's talking about the Zenith DVB-318. It indeed stretched all 4:3 content to 16:9

It's a great upconverter over component when using the proper firmware.... the stretching of 4:3 content was it's only real drawback. I gave mine away to my brother when he bought my Sony 57" CRT a couple of months back since the two worked so well together.

I'm now running a PS3 via HDMI to a Samsung 6187SAX LED DLP which also seems to be a very good combination.


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## Ramsrule (Sep 23, 2007)

cartrivision said:


> OK, so you do it so that the DVD player knows to compress the video vertically and add letterbox bars when connected to and playing it on a 4:3 TV. I'm fine with the limitation of having to watch the recording on a 16:9 display to get the correct aspect ratio.


Yeah, other than 4:3 sets and some PC software not wanting to stretch the improperly flagged material, there's no real benifit to someone that's always going to stretch the content with their sets.


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## highheater (Aug 30, 2006)

Ramsrule said:


> Sure, if everyone that's going to watch the disk has a widescreen TV.
> 
> With me, that's not the case. If you leave the DVD incorrectly flagged as 4x3, when someone watches it on a 4x3 set, everything's scrunched into the 4x3 screen.
> 
> Doing what I've outlined eliminates this issue. YMMV.


Isn't this all about what I heard refered to as 'setting and passing the anamorphic flag'?

Some DVD recorders (mostly Sonys) can set the anamorpic flag during recording such that material played back on either a 16:9 or 4:3 will display the material properly.

Most recorders (tragically the 'best in breed' Panasonics w/o DVR and Philips with DVR) do not set the flag during recording (or set it improperly requiring the procedure outlined by Ramsrule to be reset correctly).

But even before the DVD recorders can set the flag correctly or incorrectly, it needs to be told what the setting should be. Thats where differences in the sources become a problem.

I can record video on my camcorder as either widescreen or 4:3 and pass both of those to the DVD recorder over a digital output like firewire.

Likewise I've read at AVS Forums that Motorola STBs cannot pass widescreen content out the analog S-Video port. It seems reading here, that is not the problem with the Direct TV HR 21 as widscreen content can be sent out out the S-Video port.

It seems this problem could be solved if all DVD recorders set the anamorphic flag correctly. Unfortunatly this is not the case and we are left with an endless and confusing set of permutations based on STB receiver, DVD recorder and even DVD-RAM and other media.

Thanks to all above for their observations.


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