# HR-44 with the AM21 Off Air Tuner



## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

I was going to get the Genie installed but DTV tells me me the AM21 off air tuner won't work with it. Then I look online and see that people have gotten it to work. I call DTV again and he tells me that it will not work in South Florida. What's the deal with this? Will it work on won't it? Anyone in South FL have this set up? If so how? Is the new power cord plugged in separately? TIA


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

It'll work fine if you're able to receive OTA.


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## gov (Jan 11, 2013)

My goodness!

A D* CSR with misinformation ?!?!?!?!


{swoon}

{faint}



:eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2:


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## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

Will it work in South FL without issues? This DTV morons are really starting to piss me off. All I want is for the OTA channels to show up in the guide.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

The major ones will, but some others might be hit or miss.


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## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

Thanks for the info. In order to get this going would I just need to get another power cord?


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## jdspencer (Nov 8, 2003)

I see no reason why the AM21 wouldn't work in your location. 
The only problem is that it will be limited to what DirecTV has in the database for OTA.

The AM21 uses the power cord from the DVR and it has a short cord that then plugs into the DVR.


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## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

The spot on the back of the Genie when the cord goes into from the genie is different. Just wondering who else out there has successfully gotten the AM21 & HR44 to work together and how they did it.


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

Yes, you just need another power cord for the AM21. With the AM21 and HR44 both unplugged from AC power, connect the USB cable between the AM21 and the HR44's USB jacks. Connect your off air antenna cable to the AM21's ANT IN jack. Then power up the AM21. Then power up your HR44. Follow the Off Air setup steps in the Satellite & Antenna Setup Menu.


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## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

I'm familiar with the set up process. There was a serviceman out here this morning that said it AM21 would not work with Genie. He left and I went online and found out that it did. He also said there was no "Satellite & Antenna" set up option with the Genie. What kind of new power cord would I need for the AM21?


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## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

Well the technician just left and everything is set up just fine. There were zero issues getting the AM21 to work with the new Genie receiver. The guy this morning was a complete moron. Even had a local manager call me and he's the one who tried to tell me it would not work in Florida. Freakin dumbasses. Both of them!!! Thanks to all who gave me some input.


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

FuSchnickens said:


> Will it work in South FL without issues? This DTV morons are really starting to piss me off. All I want is for the OTA channels to show up in the guide.


I'm in Palm Beach County. The HR44/AM21 combo works just fine. They are full of you know what. I can even pickup the Miami and Ft. Lauderdale locals with the AM21 on my HR44.


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## NR4P (Jan 16, 2007)

I'm in Palm Beach County. The HR44/AM21 combo works just fine. They are full of you know what. I can even pickup the Miami and Ft. Lauderdale locals with the AM21 on my HR44.


I agree works fine in PB county with same out of market results. However that will depend on your antenna and location. 


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## FuSchnickens (Nov 9, 2013)

I'm in South Broward. So you guys pick up CBS4, NBC 4 ABC 10 & Fox 7? Are you using Miami area as the secondary market when u set up the antenna? I've never tried to set up an secondary market on mine. Wonder if I can get West Palm channels?


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## RunnerFL (Jan 5, 2006)

FuSchnickens said:


> I'm in South Broward. So you guys pick up CBS4, NBC 4 ABC 10 & Fox 7? Are you using Miami area as the secondary market when u set up the antenna? I've never tried to set up an secondary market on mine. Wonder if I can get West Palm channels?


Yes, I get 2, 4, 6, 7, 10, 17, etc... I use my old Miami zip code (2 years living in Hell) as my secondary zip.


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## boogie (Jun 7, 2009)

I'm surprised when any DTV employee even knows the AM21 exists. I've had DTV technicians at my house on a few occasions and not a single one of them knew what it was! I've had one for years (currently connected to a HR44) and have demonstrated the device for DTV technicians, much to their amazement. All of the technicians were very nice, and, after showing off my setup (including how I network my connected devices over swm) they've always helped me out by throwing a few splitters or other misc. parts my way.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

I had my AM21 for a year and it worked perfectly with an HR44 until my 4TB external hard drive failed. I removed the external hard drive which also removed my season passes and custom guides. I cannot get the AM21 to re-add the local channels to my guide. It always hangs at 50% during antenna setup. I suspect that the HR44 received a software update that breaks the integration with the AM21. DirecTV has not been very helpful. Not sure if buying a new AM21 or HR44 would help. Very disappointed as I watch a lot of shows OTA.


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## coconut13 (Apr 14, 2013)

drumdude said:


> I had my AM21 for a year and it worked perfectly with an HR44 until my 4TB external hard drive failed. I removed the external hard drive which also removed my season passes and custom guides. I cannot get the AM21 to re-add the local channels to my guide. It always hangs at 50% during antenna setup. I suspect that the HR44 received a software update that breaks the integration with the AM21. DirecTV has not been very helpful. Not sure if buying a new AM21 or HR44 would help. Very disappointed as I watch a lot of shows OTA.


I would try a "CLEARMYBOX" on the HR44 and then wait 48 hrs for the HR44 to totally rebuild its own guide and everything else. Then try the initial setup with the AM21. This should let the HR44 rebuild itself so everything is current (software updates, etc.) and be like starting over after changing the external hd.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

Thanks for the feedback *coconut13*.
The DirecTV installer just visited. He tried CLEARMYBOX. Unfortunately that did now help. Then he tried forcing a software update. That didn't work either. So he called DirecTV headquarters and talked to an AT&T technician there. Get this! That technician says that since the AT&T acquisition, the AM21 device is no longer supported. Recent AT&T software updates have broken the functionality that adds OTA channels to the guide. He says the AM21 OTA Box will not work with HR44 new software releases. I asked if I could revert back to the previous DirecTV (not AT&T) software, but he says no. The only option would be to purchase a HR22 box which would not receive AT&T software updates because it's no longer supported. What this means is if you have the HR34 or HR44, the AM21 will work until you have to rerun the Antenna Setup. If you move to another city or if your external hard drive fails (in my case), you will not be able to re-run Antenna Setup. Your AM21 will now be useless.
If anyone has a workaround I am interested. Please update this thread. :bang


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## coconut13 (Apr 14, 2013)

Try a double reboot by unplugging the DVR/AM21 and letting it reboot, and then unplug it again. Hence a double reboot. This is the only way to truly clear an AM21. Make sure the AM21 is hooked up to the HR44. That's how it has always been for me. I have my AM21 hooked to an HR24 (and that maybe matters) and haven't had any issues after a software update. I've had 2 recent software updates on 6-2-2016 and 7-29-2016. I really think the HR44/AM21 will still work, you just haven't found the right procedure to make it so. The CLEARMYBOX and RBR reboots sometimes work to clear the AM21 and sometimes not. I 've never figured out why it is that way, but a double unplugging reboot has always been successful in clearing the AM21 in my case. I really believe their are a lot of people with HR 34,44, and 54's hooked to AM21's and their's are still working after software updates. I would think a lot of people would be complaining if that were the case.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

Thanks for the suggestion *coconut13*. I just tried the double reboot and the Antenna Setup still hangs at 50%. I'm still willing to try a few more things before I throw this AM21 in the lake.


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## ejbvt (Aug 14, 2011)

drumdude said:


> Thanks for the feedback *coconut13*.
> The DirecTV installer just visited. He tried CLEARMYBOX. Unfortunately that did now help. Then he tried forcing a software update. That didn't work either. So he called DirecTV headquarters and talked to an AT&T technician there. Get this! That technician says that since the AT&T acquisition, the AM21 device is no longer supported. Recent AT&T software updates have broken the functionality that adds OTA channels to the guide. He says the AM21 OTA Box will not work with HR44 new software releases. I asked if I could revert back to the previous DirecTV (not AT&T) software, but he says no. The only option would be to purchase a HR22 box which would not receive AT&T software updates because it's no longer supported. What this means is if you have the HR34 or HR44, the AM21 will work until you have to rerun the Antenna Setup. If you move to another city or if your external hard drive fails (in my case), you will not be able to re-run Antenna Setup. Your AM21 will now be useless.
> If anyone has a workaround I am interested. Please update this thread. :bang


Lies. Well, uninformed. I have the LATEST software (iamanedgecutter.com for more) and my AM21 and HR44 work just fine. It is true that Directv isn't making them anymore but the AM21 will still play nice with the HR44. If memory serves, others in southern Florida posted YEARS ago about a similar situation. It could be here or the other site. Unless I am thinking of this thread from YEARS ago!


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

ejbvt said:


> Lies. Well, uninformed. I have the LATEST software (iamanedgecutter.com for more) and my AM21 and HR44 work just fine. It is true that Directv isn't making them anymore but the AM21 will still play nice with the HR44. If memory serves, others in southern Florida posted YEARS ago about a similar situation. It could be here or the other site. Unless I am thinking of this thread from YEARS ago!


The difference is that if it happened a few years ago Directv would try to help you fix the problem. Now that they no longer support the AM21 it is up to the end user to figure out the issue.

I think it is safe to assume Directv is phasing out the AM21 because they don't plan to support it on the new generation of hardware that is coming. The question is whether there will be some other solution for OTA in that new generation of hardware, or if it will be abandoned entirely. Considering Directv stated just three years ago they were looking at integrating OTA in future receivers like they had in the past (due to all the retransmission fights) I still hold out hope that it might be built in. Since the ATSC patents have all expired, it would be very cheap to add. Time will tell.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

Thanks *AllStar*.
I found another thread from a few years ago. I have exhausted all those recommended solutions. I would expect that the support team the DirecTV installer called (not the one I had access to) would give out the correct information. He seemed very knowledgeable about the AM21 and emphatic it would not work with the latest software releases. He said it will work only until you have to run the Antenna Setup. That is the process that will not run. And without that you can't add the channels to your guide or record them.


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## coconut13 (Apr 14, 2013)

drumdude said:


> Thanks for the suggestion *coconut13*. I just tried the double reboot and the Antenna Setup still hangs at 50%. I'm still willing to try a few more things before I throw this AM21 in the lake.


It's probably the AM21 itself. If you had any kind of power surge (lightning, power spike, etc.) the AM21 is pretty sensitive to that. I would reboot the DVR by itself and let it rebuild the guide, etc. for 48 hrs. Then try to re-initialize the AM21 after that. If that doesn't work, I would try a different AM21 (if you can) and check results.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

Thanks for the reply *coconut13*.
I will try Antenna Setup again in a few days but I don't think I want to spend $150 for another AM21 when AT&T says it's not going to work. Especially when I already spent $150 for this one less than a year ago. I've already wasted $150 so not eager to flush another $150.


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

I've had about 3 AM21's die on me in the last two years after several years of service. I have 6 new ones as backups in addition to the three I replaced that recently went bad. No problems here on my HR44 Genie with the AM21. And it was not a surge that toasted the others, or all 10 of my other AM21's would have likely been toast.


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

drumdude said:


> Thanks *AllStar*.
> I found another thread from a few years ago. I have exhausted all those recommended solutions. I would expect that the support team the DirecTV installer called (not the one I had access to) would give out the correct information. He seemed very knowledgeable about the AM21 and emphatic it would not work with the latest software releases. He said it will work only until you have to run the Antenna Setup. That is the process that will not run. And without that you can't add the channels to your guide or record them.


Where are you located? There are a couple of locations where the AM21 has issues completing the scan, I know Chicago and Raleigh Durham are in that category. And the techs who tell you the AM21 won't work with the Genie are completely wrong...yes, even with the latest software releases.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

TexasBrit, I am in Charlotte NC.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

texasbrit said:


> Where are you located? There are a couple of locations where the AM21 has issues completing the scan, I know Chicago and Raleigh Durham are in that category. And the techs who tell you the AM21 won't work with the Genie are completely wrong...yes, even with the latest software releases.


Yeah ...

And wasn't there found to be an issue with the signal the PBS stations in those markets are putting out as the source of the hang ups duing AM21 setup IIRC?

I think the key to the solution was, at least for some of the subs with this problem, was that they had antenna pre-amplifiers working during the setup and had to temporarily disable them?

Or perhaps insert attenuators if no pre-amps were used?

Anyway, something was needed to temporarily reduce the signal strength of the PBS station during the setup was needed to get around the hang up and complete the setup. Then restore the original signal levels.

Again, if IIRC on this ...

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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

At HoTat2. I am in Charlotte NC which is near Raleigh/Durham. I am using an indoor antenna which is the AmazonBasics version of the Mohu Leaf. It is unpowered. I also tried running Antenna Setup with it disconnected and with a 5 ft coax instead of the antenna. No success.


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

Yes I reading reading other threads where people had the AM21 hang during a scan, which would happen for more than one person in the same area. If there's some PSIP data a few stations are sending out which causes the AM21 to hang, and it isn't possible to fix in software, that may have something to do with Directv discontinuing the sale/support of the AM21.


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

Yes, it's something about the local PBS station that is causing the problem in NC. If DirecTV were still suporting the AM21 they would probably find out what it was and get the station to fix it.

See also https://forums.att.com/t5/DVR-Receivers/HR44-with-AM21-OTA-scan-fail-at-66/td-p/4751981/page/3 and others. Scanning works OK until it hits the PBS station then it locks up.


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

texasbrit said:


> If DirecTV were still suporting the AM21 they would probably find out what it was and get the station to fix it.


That assumes the station is doing something wrong. If it is a bug in the AM21 hardware (i.e. the ATSC chip it includes) there isn't much to be done about it.

Drumdude - have you tried disconnecting the antenna from the AM21 for a few seconds then reconnecting it when it hangs? You might have to try a few times to figure out how long it needs to be disconnected for the scan to 'skip' that station and move on to the next. Of course that may leave you with a setup that leaves out that channel (and maybe a couple others depending on how long you disconnect it)

Another thing you could try is figuring out where in the process it hangs, and disconnecting it right before that, and reconnecting it once you're past that point. Again, it would require some experimenting. I have no idea if either of these things will work, but if the problem is that the AM21 is seeing some sort of 'bad' data when it is scanning that causes problems, having the antenna disconnected so it can't see that station would at least let others stations be scanned and you'd have a (mostly) working AM21.


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

Yes, if you see the links I posted some people had partial success with those techniques.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

I tried about 10 more times tonight. The only way I could get Antenna Setup to complete was by disconnecting the antenna. However I got 0 channels. I tried plugging and then unplugging the antenna before it got to 50% (where it freezes). It completed but again no channels.
One more thing to note. When I restart the HR44, I am not prompted to do the Antenna Setup. I have to manually run it. When I bought the AM21 and first hooked it up I was prompted. Also I notice that when I power on or off my system the AM21 stays on. When working properly, the AM21 used to power on or off with the HR44. It seems like the link between the two is not working.


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

The Hr44 does not prompt for antenna setup, I don't think it ever did. HR54 the same. You have to go into settings. And the AM21 always stays powered on, remember you are powering it separately not through the Hr44.
If you read the other posts you'll see the people who had success unplugged the antenna just before it reached 50%, and then plugged it back in once the scan got beyond 50%.


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## Motleyfan (Sep 13, 2007)

Mine hung up at around 50% on the Antenna set up but I let it sit for about 4-5 minutes without doing anything and it finished the setup. All my channels were there.
That's connected to a HR44. No other issues with OTA.


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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

Thanks to everyone who contributed on this thread. I have found a solution although not by fixing my AM21 to HR44 integration. I called DirecTV and demanded a refund on the AM21 OTA box since they sold it but will not support it. They offered a monthly discount on my bill instead which was more than I paid for the AM21. I am using that money to buy a TiVo Roamie OTA DVR. I used to have DirecTV TiVo DVR and like the TiVo OS better anyway! This TiVo Roamie box is independent of any cable or satellite provider. It just plugs into a different HDMI input on your TV. You pay TiVo a monthly service fee for the guide. They sell the Roamie with lifetime plan for about $399. And it's only $359 on Amazon. No monthly fee with the lifetime plan. And no more worry about whether the AM21 will work with newer Genies! Over and out! 

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## fudpucker (Jul 23, 2007)

What kind of OTA antenna will you be using with the Roamie? My problem with OTA is my indoor antenna has to be oriented differently for a couple of the stations, I can't just set the indoor antenna up and forget it. I.e if I wanted to reorder NBC and Fox at the same time I could not because the antenna has to be oriented differently for each channel.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

drumdude said:


> Thanks to everyone who contributed on this thread. I have found a solution although not by fixing my AM21 to HR44 integration. I called DirecTV and demanded a refund on the AM21 OTA box since they sold it but will not support it. They offered a monthly discount on my bill instead which was more than I paid for the AM21. I am using that money to buy a TiVo Roamie OTA DVR. I used to have DirecTV TiVo DVR and like the TiVo OS better anyway! This TiVo Roamie box is independent of any cable or satellite provider. It just plugs into a different HDMI input on your TV. You pay TiVo a monthly service fee for the guide. They sell the Roamie with lifetime plan for about $399. And it's only $359 on Amazon. No monthly fee with the lifetime plan. And no more worry about whether the AM21 will work with newer Genies! Over and out!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yep, same here ....

Gave up on the AM21 (or should I say "(sh)AM21") used on what was then an HR34 Genie (which made things doubly bad) over a year and a half ago for an OTA TIVO Roamio to which I managed to get DIRECTV to more than reimburse me for with a one time credit of $150.00 after I complained bitterly as well over the AM21's failure.

No problems with OTA since though I do miss the integrated guide and the TIVO recently suffered a noisy fan problem that cost me ~$40.00 from Weaknees.com for a replacement.

Note: Be forewarned the TIVO Roamio Basic and OTA models use a small but powerful cooling fan which is hard to locate outside of Weaknees if it goes bad on you.

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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

fudpucker said:


> What kind of OTA antenna will you be using with the Roamie? My problem with OTA is my indoor antenna has to be oriented differently for a couple of the stations, I can't just set the indoor antenna up and forget it. I.e if I wanted to reorder NBC and Fox at the same time I could not because the antenna has to be oriented differently for each channel.


 I use the AmazonBasics version of the Mohu Leaf Antenna. Works perfect and is inexpensive.

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## drumdude (Oct 25, 2011)

HoTat2 said:


> Yep, same here ....
> 
> Gave up on the AM21 (or should I say "(sh)AM21") used on what was then an HR34 Genie (which made things doubly bad) over a year and a half ago for an OTA TIVO Roamio to which I managed to get DIRECTV to more than reimburse me for with a one time credit of $150.00 after I complained bitterly as well over the AM21's failure.
> 
> ...


 I am hoping they fixed the fan problem in the new 1TB version of TiVo Roamio. I just ordered mine and it's on the way!  Love TiVo's!

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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

drumdude said:


> I am hoping they fixed the fan problem in the new 1TB version of TiVo Roamio. I just ordered mine and it's on the way!  Love TiVo's!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It really may have been my fault though. ...

I was lucky enough to get my troublesome HR34 swapped out for an HR54 not too long after I got the TIVO and stupidly placed the TIVO atop the HR54 as I did with the HR34. Not realizing the top of the HR54 is much hotter while in operation than the 34.

This may have caused the TIVO to have to run it's cooling fan at much higher average speeds throughout the day than normal resulting in it's premature failure.

Needless to say I've had the two separated ever since.

But unfortunately ~$40.00 lighter in the wallet as a painful reminder. 

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## TXD16 (Oct 30, 2008)

Motleyfan said:


> Mine hung up at around 50% on the Antenna set up but I let it sit for about 4-5 minutes without doing anything and it finished the setup. All my channels were there.
> That's connected to a HR44. No other issues with OTA.


This is the key---just let it finish when it appears to "hang." I have lots of other issues with the AM21, but I am still able to at least get it to tune the channels I want, albeit with much effort.


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## fudpucker (Jul 23, 2007)

BTW - as I'm moving to Dish (99% sure) I have an AM 21 new and never taken out of the box. I'm surprised to see an active auction on eBay for one in the box, with 12 bids that are currently up to $90. Are they hard to find? That seems a bit high.


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## peds48 (Jan 11, 2008)

Yes, as DIRECTV stopped selling them supply is running dry and demand is growing high. 


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## fudpucker (Jul 23, 2007)

peds48 said:


> Yes, as DIRECTV stopped selling them supply is running dry and demand is growing high.
> 
> Sent from my iPad Pro using Tapatalk


Guess I'll need to see what I can get for mine then. Does me no good sitting unopened in the box.


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