# Your TV does not support 4K content



## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

I have Sony XBR-75-850D 4K TV connected to a C61-700 mini. In between the mini and the TV is Integra 40.6 amp and a Binary B-540 Balun. 

The amp and balun are both 4K HDCP 2.2. 

I have D*tv coming out to investigate and try to figure the problem. Any suggestions? I have my house run on Control 4.


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## ragweed10 (Jul 10, 2013)

Bulldog08 said:


> I have Sony XBR-75-850D 4K TV connected to a C61-700 mini. In between the mini and the TV is Integra 40.6 amp and a Binary B-540 Balun.
> 
> The amp and balun are both 4K HDCP 2.2.
> 
> I have D*tv coming out to investigate and try to figure the problem. Any suggestions? I have my house run on Control 4.


What is the Problem ? 
What is "Control 4" ?


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

What happens if you connect the Mini directly to your Sony 4K TV?


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

ragweed10 said:


> What is the Problem ?
> What is "Control 4" ?


Control 4 is used to integrate and control all my audio sources as well as some lighting and security.

The problem, if you read the name of the topic, I get the message "Your TV doesn't support 4K content". My TV won't show 4K content. When I go to settings on D*tv mini the 4K is not illuminated


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

litzdog911 said:


> What happens if you connect the Mini directly to your Sony 4K TV?


My mini is in a rack away from the TV. When I take the amp out and plug in the HDMI to the balun and then the balun is connected to the TV I get 4K enabled. But when I try to watch a 4K show or movie, the screen goes blank and says I don't have a signal. I then just punch in a regular HD channel and D*tv takes me to the channel.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

An update. When I connected the Genie mini directly to the TV, the screen would show the 4K channel for a second and then it would go blank and a message on the screen read something like no signal. Now I could go to other non-4K channels and it would be fine. In settings 4K is illuminated.

When I connect it with the amp and balun I can view the 4K channel, but only in 1080p. It shows on the screen - your TV doesn't support 4K


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Try this, run the C61K directly to your TV. Pull the power from the C61 and the coax line then power it back up. Once it comes back up you should see a server selection screen with a line that says if your TV does or not support 4K from DIRECTV.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

RAD said:


> Try this, run the C61K directly to your TV. Pull the power from the C61 and the coax line then power it back up. Once it comes back up you should see a server selection screen with a line that says if your TV does or not support 4K from DIRECTV.


I just tried that. Same thing. I get Ch. 104 for about a second or two with the banner and then the screen goes blank with the information about no external input...change the input. Something like that.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Bulldog08 said:


> I just tried that. Same thing. I get Ch. 104 for about a second or two with the banner and then the screen goes blank with the information about no external input...change the input. Something like that.


Strange if you pulled the coax you shouldn't have any connection to the HR54 and get the server selection screen with the test message, not any channel.

Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

RAD said:


> Try this, run the C61K directly to your TV. Pull the power from the C61 and the coax line then power it back up. Once it comes back up you should see a server selection screen with a line that says if your TV does or not support 4K from DIRECTV.


Ok this time I didn't connect the coax and I got the screen "This TV supports Directv 4K service." "Directv network connection not found. Please check cabling"


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Bulldog08 said:


> Ok this time I didn't connect the coax and I got the screen "This TV supports Directv 4K service." "Directv network connection not found. Please check cabling"


OK that just verifies that the C61K thinks the TV can meet their 4K requirements.

Sent from my iPad using DBSTalk


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

Bulldog08 said:


> I have Sony XBR-75-850D 4K TV connected to a C61-700 mini. In between the mini and the TV is Integra 40.6 amp and a Binary B-540 Balun.
> 
> The amp and balun are both 4K HDCP 2.2.
> 
> I have D*tv coming out to investigate and try to figure the problem. Any suggestions? I have my house run on Control 4.


What's important is the type of server you have. You MUST HAVE either an HR-44 or HR-54 Genie to view 4K. An HR-44 will not display live channels, though (ch. 104, 105, 106). You can record 4K on an HR-44 and view it on your 4K television. You also need a new reverse band 4K LNB on your dish for this to work properly. Eliminate all the distractions like the baluns and external amps as D* will tell you they do not support any of these. Also, make sure you have proper cabling, no breaks in the lines between the Genie server and the SWM splitter and the C61K and the SWM splitter. Also, an HDMI cable capable of supporting 18 Gbps is highly recommended for 4K. Do not use anything cabling or connection boxes that aren't HDMI 2.2 compliant. If a D* tech comes out, they will want to change all of the above so you might as well beat them to the punch.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

alex15301 said:


> What's important is the type of server you have. You MUST HAVE either an HR-44 or HR-54 Genie to view 4K. An HR-44 will not display live channels, though (ch. 104, 105, 106). You can record 4K on an HR-44 and view it on your 4K television. You also need a new reverse band 4K LNB on your dish for this to work properly. Eliminate all the distractions like the baluns and external amps as D* will tell you they do not support any of these. Also, make sure you have proper cabling, no breaks in the lines between the Genie server and the SWM splitter and the C61K and the SWM splitter. Also, an HDMI cable capable of supporting 18 Gbps is highly recommended for 4K. Do not use anything cabling or connection boxes that aren't HDMI 2.2 compliant. If a D* tech comes out, they will want to change all of the above so you might as well beat them to the punch.


Thank you for the input. I do have the HR-54 to go with the C61. When D* came out to install I am not sure they put on a new 4K LNB. I do know they removed something from the dish because I had 4 boxes for 5 TV's. With the HR-54 I now have 2 minis and 1 other box. 
I did some investigating and realized it might be the HDMI cabling that I am using at the moment is just the basic HDMI cables and I need to upgrade them to the 4K HDMI. Truly amazing that with new technology you have to spend more $$ for new cabling.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

You just need high speed cables. But for your setup you may want to look at some redmere cables from mono price. Otherwise the regular Amazon basic hdmi cables work very well for a normal 4K setup


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## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

alex15301 said:


> What's important is the type of server you have. You MUST HAVE either an HR-44 or HR-54 Genie to view 4K. An HR-44 will not display live channels, though (ch. 104, 105, 106). You can record 4K on an HR-44 and view it on your 4K television. You also need a new reverse band 4K LNB on your dish for this to work properly. Eliminate all the distractions like the baluns and external amps as D* will tell you they do not support any of these. Also, make sure you have proper cabling, no breaks in the lines between the Genie server and the SWM splitter and the C61K and the SWM splitter. Also, an HDMI cable capable of supporting 18 Gbps is highly recommended for 4K. Do not use anything cabling or connection boxes that aren't HDMI 2.2 compliant. If a D* tech comes out, they will want to change all of the above so you might as well beat them to the punch.


No, you don't need a reverse band LNB for the moment, because DirecTV is not transmitting 4K on reverse band. Maybe this will become a requirement later this year.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

I'm thinking the Binary B-540 may be the issue. My quick Google search shows that it only supports 4K30p, DirecTV requires 4K60p support.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

Beerstalker said:


> I'm thinking the Binary B-540 may be the issue. My quick Google search shows that it only supports 4K30p, DirecTV requires 4K60p support.


You are correct with your google search. My rep is telling me the balun should still work with D*tv 4k. I bought ultra high speed cables online. When they arrive I will see it that is the issue.


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## ragweed10 (Jul 10, 2013)

Bulldog08 said:


> You are correct with your google search. My rep is telling me the balun should still work with D*tv 4k. I bought ultra high speed cables online. When they arrive I will see it that is the issue.


What does the Binary B-540 do ?


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

ragweed10 said:


> What does the Binary B-540 do ?


It is a balun I believe is used to help transmit HDMI over longer distances. I think it also uses Cat 5 cable.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

Bulldog08 said:


> It is a balun I believe is used to help transmit HDMI over longer distances. I think it also uses Cat 5 cable.


How far do you have to transmit your link between the 4K TV and your C61K client? You should eliminate this or if you can't move the C61K closer to the television.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

alex15301 said:


> How far do you have to transmit your link between the 4K TV and your C61K client? You should eliminate this or if you can't move the C61K closer to the television.


It can't be removed because I need it to connect the TV into the network


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## trh (Nov 3, 2007)

What is the distance?


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

trh said:


> What is the distance?


Under 20'. Going up and down and through walls.


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

Bulldog08 said:


> You are correct with your google search. My rep is telling me the balun should still work with D*tv 4k. I bought ultra high speed cables online. When they arrive I will see it that is the issue.


SnapAV's site says it is a 4Kp30 device but in the specs tab claim it does 4Kp60 at 4:2:0 which should work with Directv. If everything works without the balun present then you have to assume that either it is the problem, or you have a problem in your cat5e/cat6a cable connecting the two B540s that is causing it to connect at less than its full rated speed.

http://www.snapav.com/p-2805-b-540-ext-330-rs-ip.aspx


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

Until you test with a HDMI cable directly that you know should work you don't know where the actual issue may lie.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

Bulldog08 said:


> It can't be removed because I need it to connect the TV into the network


What do you mean by this? You need to connect the TV into what network? We are trying to get your DirecTV working properly with your C61K mini-client and your 4K television. I don't understand what else you are trying to accomplish here. Please inform us as to what else you are doing with this.


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## ragweed10 (Jul 10, 2013)

alex15301 said:


> What do you mean by this? You need to connect the TV into what network? We are trying to get your DirecTV working properly with your C61K mini-client and your 4K television. I don't understand what else you are trying to accomplish here. Please inform us as to what else you are doing with this.


Alex has a GOOD Point !! WHAT NETWORK ? A bunch of us don't understand what you are trying to accomplish. ???
This is NOT sending Rockets to the Moon.
Connecting a HDTV to a DirecTV Mini Genie (Client) is Kids play.
Just Connect the HDTV , with a HDMI Cable to the mini-client, Plug BOTH into an AC Outlet, Connect the COAX to the mini-genie, other end of COAX to the Splitter (Hub, or what ever DirecTV supplied) DONE !! 
Don't count on watching much 4-K TV now. There is NOT much available. Maybe down the Road.
Today's HD Picture is EXCELLENT, and DirecTV has MOST Channels in HD.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

If you're trying to get a wired network connection at the TV, if you can get a coax run to the TV, get a 2 way splitter and an DECA and use the DECA's ethernet connection to the TV.


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## compnurd (Apr 23, 2007)

I am thinking his tv is very far from his box


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

He needs to bypass all that to check his system but I believe he runs everything through a matrix system and uses converters to make his HDMI signals pass via an Ethernet cable for some of the distance from the matrix to the tvs. I believe that Ethernet is isolated for just this purpose and his talk of a network is a general term for all his gear being connected to this matrix to distribute signals all around the house to different tvs.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

RAD said:


> If you're trying to get a wired network connection at the TV, if you can get a coax run to the TV, get a 2 way splitter and an DECA and use the DECA's ethernet connection to the TV.


Precisely. I believe he is making this way too complicated. If D* has to come out to examine this, I'm certain they'll do this for him.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

compnurd said:


> I am thinking his tv is very far from his box


So am I. He just needs to run the RG6 coaxial cable closer to the television and he can bypass all these other extraneous components.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

inkahauts said:


> He needs to bypass all that to check his system but I believe he runs everything through a matrix system and uses converters to make his HDMI signals pass via an Ethernet cable for some of the distance from the matrix to the tvs. I believe that Ethernet is isolated for just this purpose and his talk of a network is a general term for all his gear being connected to this matrix to distribute signals all around the house to different tvs.


This is what I'm thinking too. He doesn't need all of this. The D* equipment does all of this for him. All he needs is a coaxial cable run to each TV he wants in his "network." Each TV is then connected via coax to the network via the SWM splitter, probably either outside his house or inside where the coaxial cable line comes from the LNB. At the HR54 Genie box, get a D* 2-way splitter and a broadband DECA box (both available at Solid Signal or Amazon for cheap). Split the signal, with one line (the power) from the splitter to the HR54 and the other via coax patch cable to the DECA. Hook the DECA via ethernet to a router or network switch. He then subscribes to the whole-home option thru D* (I believe an extra $3.50/month) and ---- presto WAH LAH ----- he has his network. Eliminate any converters, baluns or other amps as D* is not going to play nicely with them.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

inkahauts said:


> He needs to bypass all that to check his system but I believe he runs everything through a matrix system and uses converters to make his HDMI signals pass via an Ethernet cable for some of the distance from the matrix to the tvs. I believe that Ethernet is isolated for just this purpose and his talk of a network is a general term for all his gear being connected to this matrix to distribute signals all around the house to different tvs.


If all of his televisions were equipped with the D* proprietary "RVU" cabability then this may work great. If they're all not, which I suppose they're not, he needs to use coaxial cable with mini-clients to each TV, and not ethernet cables run to each television.


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

compnurd said:


> I am thinking his tv is very far from his box


If he has an ethernet cable running to his television, I wouldn't think it should be all that hard to run a coaxial cable to it instead. He could use a splitter and a DECA to obtain his wired internet from there.


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## inkahauts (Nov 13, 2006)

You guys may be missing it. I believe he runs everything through the system so he can run audio gear in each room. I'd still try bypassing the system and seeing if it works directv. Worst case scenario is he moves the client to the tv, uses a HDMI splitter and runs the signal back to the main room for the audio gear. 

I don't think he's doing this because he doesn't have enough boxes for however many tvs he has, I think it's got the audio. 

We really need more info though to know for sure...


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## alex15301 (Feb 1, 2016)

If he had clients at each box, he could come out of the client HDMI to his audio system, then out of the HDMI audio to the HDMI in at the TV. I believe he is trying to accomplish too much here.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

I replaced my cables to ultra high speed HDMI that is for 4K. And still got the same results. I have D*tv coming this morning. I will report on them afterwards


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

inkahauts said:


> You guys may be missing it. I believe he runs everything through the system so he can run audio gear in each room. I'd still try bypassing the system and seeing if it works directv. Worst case scenario is he moves the client to the tv, uses a HDMI splitter and runs the signal back to the main room for the audio gear.
> 
> I don't think he's doing this because he doesn't have enough boxes for however many tvs he has, I think it's got the audio.
> 
> We really need more info though to know for sure...


You are so correct. I have capabilities to control all my equipment from my phone, ipad, remote etc.

I had D*tv and my A/V company out. They first connected the C61 directly to the TV. 4K worked. Then they tried passing it through the Integra 40.6. It didn't work. Then they tried a different HDMI input on the receiver. The one labelled 4k 2.2. After changing the setup on the receiver to accept input #3 to the TV, I was able to receive 4K content.

So it appears the receiver was the issue. The A/V company was under the assumption that all the inputs had 4K labelled and would be able to send 4K content. They were wrong. At least for D*tv content.

One other thing...the HDMI cables did not make a difference.

Looks like I am up and running. I am looking forward to more 4K content now, especially sports.

Thank you everyone for your input.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Odd. I thought that the Integras had all HDMI that were fully 4K ready.

My Onkyo has just the first 3 HDMI inputs that are 4K HDMI/HDCP ready. The others could do 4K but not the DRM that HDCP brings to the table.


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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

lparsons21 said:


> Odd. I thought that the Integras had all HDMI that were fully 4K ready.
> 
> My Onkyo has just the first 3 HDMI inputs that are 4K HDMI/HDCP ready. The others could do 4K but not the DRM that HDCP brings to the table.


It is odd. The guy that does my A/V is at a lost. He was under that assumption all the HDMI's were 4K and they are all labelled 4K. Input #3 has 2.2 above it. 
This 4K stuff is going to be a problem with installers. Especially, if you have a lot of equipment.


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## ragweed10 (Jul 10, 2013)

Bulldog08 said:


> It is odd. The guy that does my A/V is at a lost. He was under that assumption all the HDMI's were 4K and they are all labelled 4K. Input #3 has 2.2 above it.
> This 4K stuff is going to be a problem with installers. Especially, if you have a lot of equipment.


Have you actually compared "4-K" to HD ?
What is the difference.
What I hear is there is an Extremely Limited amount of 4-K available
and people that have seen it say there is NO difference. 
_Is this true ? _


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Yeah, the three that I have on my Onkyo are enough for me, but it could be different in the very near future for others.

4K sat/cable, 4K BluRay, 4K gaming console, 4K media streamer and so on. Currently I have a Hopper 3 and FireTV that do 4K, when prices come down probably will get 4K BluRay and then I'm out of ports.


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

ragweed10 said:


> Have you actually compared "4-K" to HD ?
> What is the difference.
> What I hear is there is an Extremely Limited amount of 4-K available
> and people that have seen it say there is NO difference.
> _Is this true ? _


IMO, no!

Even just upscaling to 4K is better, probably because of better panels and electronics.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## btedford (Mar 10, 2010)

ragweed10 said:


> Have you actually compared "4-K" to HD ?
> What is the difference.
> What I hear is there is an Extremely Limited amount of 4-K available
> and people that have seen it say there is NO difference.
> _Is this true ? _


There is a difference between HD and 4K and there are times when it is more noticeable than not..it depends on the source. The bigger the screen, the more of a difference you will notice. Just like when HD started, there was limited content available but it eventually grew.


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## ragweed10 (Jul 10, 2013)

lparsons21 said:


> IMO, no!
> 
> Even just upscaling to 4K is better, probably because of better panels and electronics.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


That is what I found. Bought a 4-K Sony TV. The UP-Scaling is Great. 
So good I bought another TV.
It has to be better, 1080 Pixles to 3800 has to make a difference.
What does IMO mean ?


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## DishCSR (Jan 14, 2004)

IMO= in my opinion

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## ragweed10 (Jul 10, 2013)

DishCSR said:


> IMO= in my opinion
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk


Sorry for being so Dumb. Should have known that.
Do you think 4-K "Broadcasting" will go the way of "3-D"
No one seem to be pushing it.


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## DishCSR (Jan 14, 2004)

ragweed10 said:


> Sorry for being so Dumb. Should have known that.
> Do you think 4-K "Broadcasting" will go the way of "3-D"
> No one seem to be pushing it.


Not sure yet

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## Bulldog08 (Jul 26, 2007)

ragweed10 said:


> Sorry for being so Dumb. Should have known that.
> Do you think 4-K "Broadcasting" will go the way of "3-D"
> No one seem to be pushing it.


I haven't had the chance to check out 4K fully. I'd love to see some movies, but I've seen a couple wildlife scenes and the picture is definitely better than 1080p. 
I can't imagine 4K will go the way like 3D. I certainly hope not.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

ragweed10 said:


> _*Have you actually compared "4-K" to HD ?*_
> What is the difference.
> What I hear is there is an Extremely Limited amount of 4-K available
> and people that have seen it say there is NO difference.
> _Is this true ? _


I have done it quite often. Just did it today and I don't see much difference between a 1080p upscaled picture and the 4K offerings on Amazon or NF. Amazon has 4K titles and 1080p titles some of which are duplicated and it's really easy to switch back and forth between them. For instance _Bosch _has the same titles in 4K and in 1080p. I put them in my Watchlist and just jumped back and forth. Not really much of a difference. I did end up watching the first season of _Bosch _in 4K, but if I hadn't I don't think I would have missed the 4K.

Rich


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## btedford (Mar 10, 2010)

The best source for 4K is UHD Blu-ray. The jump from 1080p to 4k is not as big as the jump from 480i to HD, however I think 4K is more about refining the image and having more detail and more colors available.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

btedford said:


> The best source for 4K is UHD Blu-ray. The jump from 1080p to 4k is not as big as the jump from 480i to HD, however I think 4K is more about refining the image and having more detail and more colors available.


I don't have a 4K disc player, but I would not be surprised if you are correct. I do get a great picture when using my upscaling BD player on normal BDs.

Rich


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

4K Blu Ray is spec'ed to allow delivering up to 128 Mbps, which is 4x what Directv uses and 8x what Netflix delivers. So it will obviously be a far better 4K source than you'd get from any broadcaster or streaming provider, just like HD Blu Ray is far better than the HD you get from any cable/satellite providers.

How noticeable that really is versus 1080p HD Blu Ray shown on your 4K TV probably depends on the size of that TV and how close you sit to it (and whether you are really looking hard to find a reason to prefer "true" 4K Blu Ray)


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## lparsons21 (Mar 4, 2006)

Rich said:


> I don't have a 4K disc player, but I would not be surprised if you are correct. I do get a great picture when using my upscaling BD player on normal BDs.
> 
> Rich


As do,I on my neon-upscaling BD player. In your case the BD is upscaling, in mine the tv is. IOW, 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

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## Skram0 (May 3, 2010)

slice1900 said:


> 4K Blu Ray is spec'ed to allow delivering up to 128 Mbps, which is 4x what Directv uses and 8x what Netflix delivers. So it will obviously be a far better 4K source than you'd get from any broadcaster or streaming provider, just like HD Blu Ray is far better than the HD you get from any cable/satellite providers.
> 
> How noticeable that really is versus 1080p HD Blu Ray shown on your 4K TV probably depends on the size of that TV and how close you sit to it (and whether you are really looking hard to find a reason to prefer "true" 4K Blu Ray)


And it will depend on the quality of the 4K screen too. Not all 4K TVs are created equal. Some skimp on the dynamic range coloring, which is why they have the new labeling for TVs now.


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## Skram0 (May 3, 2010)

ragweed10 said:


> Sorry for being so Dumb. Should have known that.
> Do you think 4-K "Broadcasting" will go the way of "3-D"
> No one seem to be pushing it.


It's all about the bandwidth. I think there was a struggle as it was to get the needed bandwidth for 1080i for over the air broadcasting. I think 4K availability will be very low for years to come. It took many years for the industry to consider 1080i/p until a wide percentage of people actually owned 1080p TVs.


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

What are you talking about? There have never been any 1080p over the air broadcasts, and it was never seriously considered, because 1080i is effectively 1080p30. Broadcasts that need higher frame rates used 720p60.


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## Skram0 (May 3, 2010)

slice1900 said:


> What are you talking about? There have never been any 1080p over the air broadcasts, and it was never seriously considered, because 1080i is effectively 1080p30. Broadcasts that need higher frame rates used 720p60.


Woops, too many beers.  Sorry, meant 1080i.


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