# Discussion: P285 Technical discussion and Bug Reports



## Jason Nipp

P285 Spooling this morning. It will spool to factory code and 10,000 users in Phase 1. This will be a large update and will take longer to hit widespread target.

I have learned that with this release, that there are changes made to expand favorites list capacity. As such there is a chance you will have to rebuild your favorites lists. My recommendation is that you reset to defaults and completely blow away your favorites list and OTA map. Then remap and rebuild your favorites list.


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## Jason Nipp

_A personal word of caution._

_Selection of QAM mode is made on the Point Dish screen. My caution is that selecting QAM mode and then back to Satellite may cause loss of favorites lists or some settings. Attempting a channel scan in QAM mode but not connected to a QAM MDU source is not recommended for experimentation. In other words, playing with things may be irresistible but you need to be willing to accept the consequences if they occur. It should not be destructive but might become time consuming to recover from playing around._


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## waltinvt

Jason Nipp said:


> _A personal word of caution._
> 
> _Selection of QAM mode is made on the Point Dish screen. My caution is that selecting QAM mode and then back to Satellite may cause loss of favorites lists or some settings. Attempting a channel scan in QAM mode but not connected to a QAM MDU source is not recommended for experimentation. In other words, playing with things may be irresistible but you need to be willing to accept the consequences if they occur. It should not be destructive but might become time consuming to recover from playing around._


Pardon my ignorance but what does MDU source mean ?

Also, if I have a basic cable package would there be any benefit to hooking it up to see if I can pick up any additional channels ?


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## Jason Nipp

waltinvt said:


> Pardon my ignorance but what does MDU source mean ?
> 
> Also, if I have a basic cable package would there be any benefit to hooking it up to see if I can pick up any additional channels ?


MDU stands for Multi Dwelling Unit. This type of QAM will allow commercial headend systems, like those in an apartment building, hotel, or condo, to provide HD dish programming using the 811 in combination with the appropriate headend system. This software release makes this QAM mode functional.

As far as the "Open" architecture type of QAM that a residential cable provider might use, as I believe you are asking about?, this feature is not currently available. So no, you should not be able to receive any QAM channels delivered via a residential cable TV provider.

Hope this helps,


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## bavaria72

Thanks for all of the info Jason. Hopefully this thread will die a quick death! - Art


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## Jason Nipp

I edited the MDU response to better clarify. In case anyone misunderstood, the MDU QAM feature is function in this release. Please see clarification in post 4.


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## hraner

So the QAM is actually not the same as Comcast's QAM256 HD local broadcasts? Just a simple question, can I use P285 to tune unencrypted QAM256 HD channels from cable if I can' get OTA HD?


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## Jason Nipp

hraner said:


> So the QAM is actually not the same as Comcast's QAM256 HD local broadcasts? Just a simple question, can I use P285 to tune unencrypted QAM256 HD channels from cable if I can' get OTA HD?



Sorry, _but no, the 811 will ignore the QAM channels that don't have DISH Network™ network information tables (NIT) in their data. The reason is that currently the streams (PIDs) are acquired based on reading the NIT. If the cable operator has the off-air digital stations on their cable as 8VSB (same as the over the air modulation) then you can leave the 811 in satellite mode and can tune to those channels the same as if they were coming from an antenna. But if they are remodulated as 256QAM, the 811 will ignore them because they will have a unique set of NIT for the cable operator. _This also applies to 64QAM and 1024QAM.


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## Mikey

Anybody have feedback on P2.85 yet? Good? Bad? Same?


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## Ron Barry

I heard I am not in the first batch of receivers so I have not gotten yet.  No news is good news.


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## Jason Nipp

Mikey said:


> Anybody have feedback on P2.85 yet? Good? Bad? Same?


From what I have heard so far, the call center is not seeing an noteable increase in 811 calls in the last 24 hrs.


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## blkhouse

I just received it this morning. And it certainly has a different look. I have not checked it out much, but the search command does work. The system info is now 4 pages long and includes a signal check.

Small Update:
One small weird bug I found. I wanted to see if the favorites had really been increased and I added the back panel connectors to a list. When I tried to delete them it delete the next two numbers 00-locals in line rather than the back panel connector 00-vid numbers. Just a silly thing really, otherwise they did add more favorites I just don't know how many yet.


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## juan ellitinez

I have it to The menu's now have a new look..and i think the dolby sound thing might have been fixed


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## julesism

Ron Barry said:


> I heard I am not in the first batch of receivers so I have not gotten yet.  No news is good news.


so what determines if you are in one of the 1st batches?


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## Ron Barry

luck of the draw.... Dish decides and I am not sure what criteria they use. Could be random for all I know.  

However, the gods must be shining. I checked tonight and I have it. New menu look and the menu is now wider. However the EPG is still the same size. 

No issues so far but I did not do much. Saw the search and sys info. Yes lot more in the sysinfo for sure.


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## Jason Nipp

To expand, I have been told that the target range is chosen by the computer. It can be manually manipulated but that can only occur before it starts sending or when it has finished the selected target range. I have also been told they try to vary the starting range.


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## moman19

Call me chicken, but I'm going to try and hold off a few days until the feedback arrives. I'll be watching........


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## Laverne

moman19 said:


> Call me chicken


Ok, you're a chicken. :lol:   

Sorry, I JUST couldn't resist. Trying to kill time till I get my own P285. OK, :backtotop


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## HTguy

Same style of menu as newer receivers but 16x9.

Expanded system information section.

"TV Enhancements" option. (Turns on/off interactive functions like Mercedes spot, instant program upgrades, etc.???)

After clearing Favorite List, deleting & re-adding Local Digital finally got KCOP TV remapped to Ch 13 from Ch 66!!!!!


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## BFG

what do you mean the menus are new. Are they the new blue? Are you sure it's not the same, just stretched slightly, like the result you'd get if you put it in 480i mode.


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## HTguy

BFG said:


> what do you mean the menus are new. Are they the new blue? Are you sure it's not the same, just stretched slightly, like the result you'd get if you put it in 480i mode.


Yep, new blue button menu. Full screen w/o the appearence of stretching.


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## Ron Barry

The menu is definitely bigger but when set to 1080i and 16x9 it does not stretch the full length. Covers about 80%. My guess they wanted to make it look more fancy. Just a cosmetic change for sure. except in the case of the SysInfo from what I can see.


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## BFG

If it's as you describe. All I think it is , is that they just stretched the menus a bit. It's the same as if you go into Dish home and etc now. The menus used to stretch before, but only in 480i mode (because in this mode the 811 defaulted to 4X3


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## Ron Barry

Possible BFG, but To me it looks like the coloring has changes and the style has changed a bit. The menus are definetly darker. THe best I can describe it as is a skin change similar to what you would see with something like WinAmp. The SysInfo is definitely different. It could just be a stretching effect. But I do think it is more than that. Then again I don't have another 811 to compare.


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## BFG

Ok well I guess I'll just wait until the update is giving to me, and I guess I'll take the update.


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## Ron Barry

Just went down stairs. Definitely a skin change or my memory is failing. There is some new shadowing and the buttons have a more 3D feel to them. Not a big deal but it does look a bit more modern. 

As far as how well it is performing. I have not had any issues so far, but then again my box was pretty solid before 2.85. I have not tried to expand my favorites though. Never had a need to. 

Anyone jump into the abyss on expanding favorites?


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## julesism

goodness. i hope i get it soon. HTGuy mentioned that channels are mapping correctly, i have a problem with one here in DFW. plus, i totally forgot about the additional FAV capicity!


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## Nick

285 just hit my 811 overnight.

What a surprise -- new menu graphics and layout style. The horizontal dimension is wider, but not quite a full-width 16:9 AR, but it may be the way my set is handling the new menu. The overall effect would meet Martha's approval, I'm sure.

The EPG is still 4:3 however, and although not a biggie, is still a mild disappointment.

I don't even get OTA so I can't comment on that. :shrug:


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## Ron Barry

Not the way you set is handeling it Nick. Mine is doing the same thing. Would be great having the EPG in 4x3. 

I did a quick look at Dish home. I see a Soccer App and a College hoops app I don't recall seeing before.

I am hearing some audio choping on CBS on both my OTA CBS and my Dish feed. My guess is that it is at the source and not the 811. Need to check it with my 921 if I have the time.


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## Ron Barry

I have ran into the first bug. I tried to access the favorites option and it locks solid. I have done this twice with the same result. Looks like one might have reset to factory defaults to be able to modify the favorite list. I might have heard this as a possibility earlier, but I did not think it would lock solid. 

Anybody else seeing this?


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## BFG

How is the guide info hangining on? Is the receiver keeping the guide info in memory when you leave it on OTA for a while, or do they start to say no info available after a while, this is the current state with mine. And if I press guide with the no info available the guide goes frozen. I have to go back to a satellite channel and wait for the guide data to fill back in


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## Ron Barry

I did a quick check of the guide and it does not seem to go out any further than 2.85. However, I have had two reboots because of selecting favorites configuration from the the menu. 2nd time was to see if I could duplicate it. 

So in my case it might be due to the reboots. Time will tell and I recall it being mentioned that the EPG would be extended so you always got two full days. Maybe I am getting something confused, but that is how I remember it.


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## Nick

No problem with favorites so far.

My 811 EPG, still about 44 hrs; my 7200, about 9 days


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## Ron Barry

Ron Barry said:


> I have ran into the first bug. I tried to access the favorites option and it locks solid. I have done this twice with the same result. Looks like one might have reset to factory defaults to be able to modify the favorite list. I might have heard this as a possibility earlier, but I did not think it would lock solid.
> 
> Anybody else seeing this?


Update... A did a soft reboot and that seemed to clear the problem. Just having the box reboot itself after a crash did not. Or at least it seemed like it did not. I know have the favorites list back. I tried adding a channel to one of my list and it did seem to work.

So if you run into a situation where your 811 locks up when you select favorites off the main menu, do a soft boot by holding down the power button and count to 10.


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## Ron Barry

Nick said:


> No problem with favorites so far.
> 
> My 811 EPG, still about 44 hrs; my 7200, about 9 days


I am seeing the guide go out about 44 hours also.


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## tonyp56

Ron,

In Jason's original pre-release notes I believe that he mentioned that the EPG was going to be extended with P285. (not sure) However in the final it doesn't mention it, most likely Dish decided not to do it, or I read something wrong. P2.86 could have been were they were going to add the four hours too.


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## Ron Barry

I knew I read it somewhere that was why I was looking for it. Well it from what I can tell it is not in 2.85. I looked back and you are right Tony, it is planned for 2.86. Looks liked I bunched them together.


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## mkpolley

its been a week now,well almost.still no 285 update :nono2: :nono2:


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## Jason Nipp

mkpolley said:


> its been a week now,well almost.still no 285 update :nono2: :nono2:


Because of the size and complexity of the QAM rollout, P285 is going to be a very slow rollout. Extra precautions are being taken.


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## bavaria72

Better safe than sorry! Good move on E*'s part.


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## datwell

OK, so what happened the add a third day to the guide project?

da Doug


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## Ron Barry

It was never scheduled for 2.85. It is scheduled for the 2.86 release last i heard.


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## Jason Nipp

I learned that the extended guide feature was removed because it took longer to download/refresh the EPG data. In the future this might be revisited perhaps with the ability for the user to toggle on/off the extended info to avoid the longer guide refreshes.


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## datwell

Thanks guys!

da Doug


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## julesism

Jason, can you guesstimate how long this rollout will take?
thx


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## Jason Nipp

julesism said:


> Jason, can you guesstimate how long this rollout will take?
> thx


No sir, My apologies but I cannot. People tend to take projections as testament, as such if the projection is off it creates all kinds of ruckus.


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## Cokeswigga

I have a question about receiving the update...

Do I just have to put the receiver in standy mode at night for it to take the download. Or do I need to remove the power for 15 minutes to take the download?

My powerstrip is behind the tv (which is a pain in the butt to move), so unplugging is not ideal.

I guess I could shut the house power off for a while if I need to.


I'm still waiting for the latest version for my 811.. and I think my 510 too.. I haven't check it recently.

Is there a way I can force my 811 and 510 to take the download?


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## Ron Barry

You don't remove power Cokes. You put the receiver in standby. Press the power button or turn off the receiver from the remote. 

You can do it anytime, Since you never know when you number comes up it is good practice to just turn the box off at night using your remote. 

There is no way to force a download. 

This is a very slow download and it is trickeling out so patience is a virtue on this one.


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## blkhouse

Still seeing problems with the guide after a soft reboot.

I added back outlets 1 and 2 to the favorites and still can not get rid of them, and now when I use the flashback button I sometimes get the video 1 channel. Just weird.


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## Cokeswigga

You know what would be nice.. is a feature that you can activate to automatically go into standby mode.

For example, 
you can set it to go into standby at (user insert time here) if there has been no activity for the past (user insert hours here) hours.

if no timers are active, then it goes into standby at the specified time.

I usually go to bed before my mother in law does. However, she is very scared of the receiver and the remote. So she only turns the tv off. Which means, I don't get the download until *I * make sure the unit is off. But if it had the auto-standby feature, I wouldn't have to worry about this.


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## Ron Barry

Cokes,

I have a request in to be able to create a Standbye timer. Create a timer event that goes off daily that puts the 811 into Standbye. The 921 also needs this feature. I have the exact problem with the 921 being upstairs. The 921 wants to reboot itself nightly but my wife want to fall asleep with the TV on.


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## Ron Barry

blkhouse said:


> Still seeing problems with the guide after a soft reboot.
> 
> I added back outlets 1 and 2 to the favorites and still can not get rid of them, and now when I use the flashback button I sometimes get the video 1 channel. Just weird.


What problems are you seeing? Need to be more specific in describing them. With 2.85 the only problem I have seen is "No Info" once and it was momentary. Minor at best. Other than that 2.85 in terms of viewing the guide has been solid for me.

Are you having problems adding and removing Aux 1 and 2 from your favorites?


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## Cokeswigga

Ooh yeah!

A sleep timer, should be on all the receivers, and have it IR-blast the power to the TV too!


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## blkhouse

Ron Barry said:


> What problems are you seeing? Need to be more specific in describing them. With 2.85 the only problem I have seen is "No Info" once and it was momentary. Minor at best. Other than that 2.85 in terms of viewing the guide has been solid for me.
> 
> Are you having problems adding and removing Aux 1 and 2 from your favorites?


I used the wrong name, for the button (thinking of my tv button) - I meant the "recall" button.

It is simple I added the back panel outputs (1 and 2) as a test to one of my favorite lists. If I try to delete them it appears that I have but what it really does is delete the next two channels which are my 00-locals. I can add those locals back but I can not delete the back panel outputs.

Lately not all the time if I go to the favorites list with the back panel outputs and then select another favorites list choose a channel there, and then hit the "recall" button to goes to the first back panel output as if it couldn't find the channel I originally had (not on the list that the back panel outputs were on).

Like I said weird.

Update:
I can make this do this more frequently. I can set up a timer and then cancel out of the guide which should bring me back to the previous show I was watching. It brings me back to the first back panel output. The show I set the timer on is on the same favorites list.


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## Ron Barry

I did a little playing around with the Recall and adding Aux to your favorites. From what I can see there is a bug in Recall whan Aux is in the Favorites list. What I would recommend is move your Aux to their own favorites lists. 

Here is how to make this happen. 

1) Add Aux 1 and 2 to your favorites. 
2) Enter Channel from your current favorites list
3) Enter a Channel off your current favorites list. 
4) Press Recall. It goes to the first channel. 
5) Press Recall again and it goes to Aux 2 I believe. Not the channel off your favorites list. 

The behavior when Aux is not on your list is as expected. Toggles between both channels. If you have a favorites list free, I would try moving over there and your recall should work as expected.

My guess is that what you described might also be associated with the fact you have Aux in your favorites. Should be nothing wrong with it, but from what I could tell with the little playing around that there is a bug there. 

Let me know if moving these to their own favorite list gets ride of the issue. This would require only using the Aux favorite list when you are actually using Aux.


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## blkhouse

Wish I could but the Aux 1 and the Aux 2 can not be deleted from the favorite list they are currently listed. This also has my 00-local channels on it right above these back panel outputs and if I try to delete Aux1 and Aux2 it deletes the next two local channels.

Thanks for the help though. Still quite weird. It is only with these outputs.


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## Ron Barry

I actually tried to delete Aux 1 and Aux 2 and was able to. Not sure how elaborate your set up might be, but the next thing I would do is write my favorites down and then do a reset to factory setting and re-add them. I had heard that this might be needed in certain situations because of the expanded favorites list. 

I know that is a pain to do, but it might be worth it. If you are not feeling a lot of customer pain I would suggest waiting off to 2.86.


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## Jason Nipp

I found a trend. I was fine on EPG, no issues or "no info" until I hid Adult, then hid locked channels and locked. After I finished hiding/locking the adult channels I started having no info banners.


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## Laverne

Jason Nipp said:


> I found a trend. I was fine on EPG, no issues or "no info" until I hid Adult, then hid locked channels and locked. After I finished hiding/locking the adult channels I started having no info banners.


Thanks for the heads-up!! This will be a big problem for those of us with 12-year-old boys who don't even know these channels exist, but expect the info to be in the EPG. Is there a way around this, like maybe hiding those channels individually?


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## Ron Barry

Well before we got way to far out on this one. The "No Info" issues that i have seen recently are very sporatic and goes away by closing and reopening the EPG. I believe I have individual channel hidden and have the Adult stuff hidden as well. If not I will and see how things behave.


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## Jason Nipp

I exited the guide and went back in and the info was back. Hiding the channels was the only change I made when I saw this happen a few times. I will check with E* to see if this is a known issue.

Hehe 12 years old Laverne? Are you sure it is just becoming a concern now?  I only bring this up because the reason prompting me to hide adults was cause I caught my 7 year old son in an adult website this weekend.


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## Laverne

Jason Nipp said:


> I exited the guide and went back in and the info was back. Hiding the channels was the only change I made when I saw this happen a few times. I will check with E* to see if this is a known issue.
> 
> Hehe 12 years old Laverne? Are you sure it is just becoming a concern now?  I only bring this up because the reason prompting me to hide adults was cause I caught my 7 year old son in an adult website this weekend.


[Insert smilie with his fingers stuck in his ears here] La-la-la-la-la-la-la.... Yes, I know they know that stuff is "out there", it's just not ever available here (EVER.), and I intend to keep it that way. If that means locking the adult channels individually, then that's what I'll do, just for P285. 

I currently don't have any individual channels locked (not even the home shopping channels, don't know why), just have selected Hide Adult.

Does this "no info" phenomenon occur only when hiding adult, or only when adding adult channels to the list of locked channels, or does it occur when you hide adult and also lock other individual channels? (Sorry, I was a little confused by your initial description. Probably just me.  )


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## tonyp56

Jason Nipp said:


> I found a trend. I was fine on EPG, no issues or "no info" until I hid Adult, then hid locked channels and locked. After I finished hiding/locking the adult channels I started having no info banners.


:nono2:  
Jason and Ron,

Sorry about this (not really upset with you or Ron so please don't take this personal) but you and Ron really need to start reading other peoples posts! I have pointed this very issue out several times to both of you and neither of you paid any attention to me. This issue has been around for at least six months!! Why is it when I said it neither of you paid any attention, but all of a sudden you noticed it and it suddenly becomes a big deal! (Enough that you are asking Dish about it.) It was around way before P285! It seems like I noticed it back around P281 (I think that is right may have been before and please excuse me if there was never a 281 SW version I can't remember all of them but it has been atleast six months ago.)

I don't remember were I've posted info about this issue but it has been in threads that talked about guide data problems, and I've done it at least twice.


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## tonyp56

Laverne said:


> [Insert smilie with his fingers stuck in his ears here] La-la-la-la-la-la-la.... Yes, I know they know that stuff is "out there", it's just not ever available here (EVER.), and I intend to keep it that way. If that means locking the adult channels individually, then that's what I'll do, just for P285.
> 
> I currently don't have any individual channels locked (not even the home shopping channels, don't know why), just have selected Hide Adult.
> 
> Does this "no info" phenomenon occur only when hiding adult, or only when adding adult channels to the list of locked channels, or does it occur when you hide adult and also lock other individual channels? (Sorry, I was a little confused by your initial description. Probably just me.  )


It requires you to lock individual channels, specifically your local channels in the 7***, 8***, or the 9*** range. (though it will do it on any channel that you lock out, but it seemed to do it worse with locals on the LIL station number i.e. channel 43 when you lock out the Dish network local stations in the 7-9000 range) Locking adult channels doens't require channel locks it is a seperate menu option so I really don't know why Jason said that unless he is talking about locking stuff like HBO too. The reason why I found this bug (about SIX MONTHS AGO) is I got tired of scrolling through music, shopping, and stuff that I didn't like to look at and because I had a favorite lists that only allowed 120 channels I thought locking channels that I didn't watch or listen to would save me a little time in the EPG. Anyways I did it, then I started having No Info problems, mismapping of channels (you know Channel 101 was actually 300 in my 811 guide, if I switched to channel 300 it was something else and etc...) BSOD's and etc... So I unlocked the channels and no problems, then I came here talked about what I found, and well no one paid any attention.


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## tonyp56

Ron Barry said:


> Well before we got way to far out on this one. The "No Info" issues that i have seen recently are very sporatic and goes away by closing and reopening the EPG. I believe I have individual channel hidden and have the Adult stuff hidden as well. If not I will and see how things behave.


Not for my 811 if I have locked individual channels, especially the local channels in the *000 range(s). Every time you open the EPG it has no info and or you may have info in the guide but when you select a channel it may not have guide data or vice-versa. (data on channel but not in the guide) Adult channels are always locked and it doesn't do this, but as soon as I lock any individual channels it does this. (more so if I lock local channels (in the 8000 range), the LIL channels get messed up)


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## tonyp56

tonyp56 said:


> It requires you to lock individual channels, specifically your local channels in the 7***, 8***, or the 9*** range. (though it will do it on any channel that you lock out, but it seemed to do it worse with locals on the LIL station number i.e. channel 43 when you lock out the Dish network local stations in the 7-9000 range) Locking adult channels doens't require channel locks it is a seperate menu option so I really don't know why Jason said that unless he is talking about locking stuff like HBO too. The reason why I found this bug (about SIX MONTHS AGO) is I got tired of scrolling through music, shopping, and stuff that I didn't like to look at and because I had a favorite lists that only allowed 120 channels I thought locking channels that I didn't watch or listen to would save me a little time in the EPG. Anyways I did it, then I started having No Info problems, mismapping of channels (you know Channel 101 was actually 300 in my 811 guide, if I switched to channel 300 it was something else and etc...) BSOD's and etc... So I unlocked the channels and no problems, then I came here talked about what I found, and well no one paid any attention.


Oh yeah, I've tried this with P284 and it still did it just like before. Don't have P285 but it sounds like from Jason's post that it is still happening.


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## Ron Barry

tonyp56 said:


> :nono2:
> Jason and Ron,
> 
> Sorry about this (not really upset with you or Ron so please don't take this personal) but you and Ron really need to start reading other peoples posts! I have pointed this very issue out several times to both of you and neither of you paid any attention to me. This issue has been around for at least six months!! Why is it when I said it neither of you paid any attention, but all of a sudden you noticed it and it suddenly becomes a big deal! (Enough that you are asking Dish about it.) It was around way before P285! It seems like I noticed it back around P281 (I think that is right may have been before and please excuse me if there was never a 281 SW version I can't remember all of them but it has been atleast six months ago.)
> 
> I don't remember were I've posted info about this issue but it has been in threads that talked about guide data problems, and I've done it at least twice.


Tony.. I read all the posts that occur in this forum and I know that Jason does too. In fact I tend to read yours a couple of times because they are detailed.

I also remember the "No Info" issue being brought up but it was also brought up in context to the BSOD issues. At times there was discussions and theories to it being linked to locking/hiding channels. This made me actually go and lock and hide some channels. At one point if I recall locking channels resulted in some major pain and it was suggested people stay away from that feature.

As to finding an exact relationship of No Info to Locked channels. It sounds like you are saying that if I lock my LIL at the 8000 range I will get it ever time. I will give this a try tomorrow with 2.85 and see what I get. I will re-read your post tomorrow to make sure I am understanding it.

As to not listening, Well personally I try and also try and duplicate what other people are saying and sometimes type does not come accross the same way and it is hard to duplicate what you might be seeing. I spend 8 hours a day working with QA people that try and reproduce and describe what they are seeing. Lots of times things get lost in the translation from their experience entering a bug. This method is even harder.

You provide great feedback and as a user I much appreciate it. I can assure you that from my side of the fence, I have never taken your posts lightly. Sorry if it has appeared at times to be the case.

Night!


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## Jason Nipp

Tony, I remember you mentioning locks, but if I remember correctly it was in regards to BSOD. Your posts also detailed many locks, I only hid Adult. Either way I send bug reports to the team in relation to software releases. So having said that you were not previously ignored and if it seems like I was not paying attention maybe it is because I am working 70hr work weeks, traveling every other week for pilot builds, then coming home to work on my house. I apologize if you felt ignored by my statement, but I am crazy busy nowadays and this is a volunteer role. In general you have always given very good feedback and as such rest assured it was included in my report.

Best regards,
Jason


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## tonyp56

Ron and Jason, 

No problem it was just because the way you were talking (actually typing) Jason that I felt compelled to point out that this problem had been around for a while and I had reported it. Like I said in the beginning nothing personal. 

Yes, BSODs were the discussion, but I did talk about the "No Info" in the guide and or specific channels. With P284 I didn't notice any BSODs but the "No Info" is/was still present. 

Yes, if you lock out your local channels that are in the 7-9000 range, you will get no info for either the channel (i.e. 25) or in the guide for the LIL channel. It may take 2 or 3 days for it to start doing this. (at least my 811 does this) Note: Any channel that gets locked beyond selecting "Hide Adult" will cause this. May or may not always happen but it did happen for me. Jason, if all you did is "Hide Adult" then this is an addition to this bug with P285. However locking specific channels has caused the No Info banner for some time now. 

I thank and appreciate you both for all of the work that you do on this forum and this board in general. 

Sorry if anything was taken out of context or if I jumped the gun when I shouldn't have and I didn't mean to say that you both don't do a great job! You both do an excellent job!!!!

Thanks


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## BFG

Yes I just started using locks on my 811 and it's still on p284, it screwed my 811 way up, gotta remove them. this is not a new problem


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## Ron Barry

tonyp56 said:


> Yes, if you lock out your local channels that are in the 7-9000 range, you will get no info for either the channel (i.e. 25) or in the guide for the LIL channel. It may take 2 or 3 days for it to start doing this. (at least my 811 does this) Note: Any channel that gets locked beyond selecting "Hide Adult" will cause this. May or may not always happen but it did happen for me. Jason, if all you did is "Hide Adult" then this is an addition to this bug with P285. However locking specific channels has caused the No Info banner for some time now.


Checked tonight tony and I have had my 8000 locals locked for a long time. My guess is I locked then at the time the locks started working. I have also locked PPV and Adult. I will see what happens over the next couple of days, but my guess is their might be another piece to the triggering puzzle. Especially if you say that it happens all the time when you bring up your EPG.


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## tonyp56

Ron Barry said:


> but my guess is their might be another piece to the triggering puzzle.


Possible, but I wouldn't even know where to begin looking. The way it did me when I first noticed this bug/issue is that I locked some channels (locals in the 8000 range included, along with music only channels like the Sirius channels, and other channels that I didn't watch or listen to like religious channels) then I started getting "No Info" banners in the EPG and/or would select a channel from the EPG (or even punch in the number i.e. 025) and the channel banner would have "No Info". (sometimes the EPG would show No Info but the channel banner would have info, other times it was switched to were the channel banner didn't have data but the EPG did, and still yet other times both the EPG and the channel banner would show no info) Mostly did it on the LIL channel numbers (4,5,9 etc...) but did it on others as well. Now I could do a reset on my 811 (hold down the power button for 5-10 seconds) or do a switch test and my EPG data would come back but then in 1-3 days I would start getting "No Info" again. Sometimes every channel in my EPG would say no info, other times it would only be a few of the channels, however, no matter how many times I canceled out of the EPG and re-opened it the channels would still show no info. The EPG could do a DL to update the data and it would still show No info on the channels that didn't have data before, don't know what is different between the EPG downloading data when it gets ready to and forcing it to do it when you do a switch test but there is a difference, because when I do a switch test it fixes it for 1-3 days, if the EPG just does a DL on its own it doesn't fix it. Now back when I first noticed this I would also get BSOD and the EPG would mismap channels, i.e. channel 300 would show info for channel 501, but if you selected or tuned to channel 300 it would be HBO. With P284 I didn't see these problems (may or may not still be there:shrug: ) but I still noticed the No Info problem.

Note: I never attempted to lock channels without the locals in the 8000 range, don't know if that is the main issue or what.

Since you've had your channels locked for a while something you ought to try is unlocking them (you don't have to erase your locked channel list, just un-lock them) for a little while and see if you notice a difference in your 811's EPG. Perhaps you've just got used to this bug and you don't notice it, and from the sound of it you don't have this problem as bad as I did. Try it for 2-3 days and see if you see a difference.

Thanks


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## Ron Barry

I will give this a try tony. Still not seeing what you are seeing and I have all my locals hidden in the 8000 range. Do you have Aux hidden? 

I did notice something rather interesting. Not sure if it is releated. If I go to the EPG and then quickly cancel and do this a number of times what I see is a screen full of "No Infos" pop up right before the screen closes. If I do this a number of times, I can get the picture to eventually freeze. Changing channel unfreezes the picture. Seems there is a timing issue when closing the EPG down.


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## tonyp56

Ron Barry said:


> Do you have Aux hidden?


No, I use them so I never locked them.

How many hours do you use your 811? (approx) How often do you use the EPG? Mine is used about five hours a day (sometimes more) I use the EPG around five or six times a day. Even when I watch something I will put up the guide so that I can look around and see what is on. Do you use browse more or the guide? I use the EPG more, I hardly ever browse. How many LIL channels do you get? (from Dish) I receive 8. Do you punch in the channel number or do you select each channel from the EPG? I mostly select the channel that I want to watch from the EPG, though sometimes (rarely) I will punch in the channel number for what I am wanting to watch (without opening the guide). How many timers do you have? I have three right now (though now that it is the end of the season for Stargate I'll be removing one of them) Do you have a full guide, or do you use the one with a partial video in the corner? I use the guide with the PIP in the corner. How old is your 811? Mine was bought 2-24-04.

If you can think of anything else that could be different in the way that you use your 811 and I use mine ask me, OK. I can't, beyond those questions I wouldn't have any idea why my 811 does this but yours doesn't, so if you can think of any questions ask me.

I didn't start using locks until after I had the ability to do that (the 811 didn't allow individual locks at first), and it was a month or so after I heard that you could use locks to get rid of channels that you didn't want to scroll through that I decided to lock some channels. So perhaps you locked your channels before this bug was introduced and somehow didn't have to deal with it. I really don't know, or perhaps I use my 811 in a way that causes it to do this bug, or better yet you use your 811 in a way that it doesn't have this bug. And I believe you when you say that you haven't seen this issue, I just don't know why it is different for you than it is for me.

Thanks, and if you think of anything to ask, please do.

P.S. And this could be a dead issue with P285, Jason may have just had a hiccup with his 811, I don't know. And therefore you may not see this issue with 285, nor will I once I get it, whenever that may be.


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## Ron Barry

Good response there Tony.. Sounds like we use the 811 in a very similar way. I usually don't have any timers. however I have been seeting some one time timers just to see if that might have something to do with it. As far as LIL, I am in LA area so I have as many as they offer there. Not sure. I get a lot of what looks like UHF channels but I never watch them. 

I use PIP on my EPG. EPG is almost always used. I have about 8 or 9 OTA channels. I get a lot of Guide information in them. let me think a bit more going to try some things today if I have the time.

Oh.. I do put my 811 in standbye whenever I am not using it.


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## tonyp56

Ron,

During the time that I was using the locks, I thought that putting my 811 in standby every night and during the day when I wasn't there would help the problems I was having. So for two weeks I only had my 811 on (would simply press the power button on the front to turn it off, so it wasn't losing its power supply) when I was using it, however I still got the "No Info" issue. Now honestly when I retested this issue with P284 I didn't put my 811 into standby that much, only had the locks locked for one week and perhaps turned my 811 off twice for more than 30 min...

One thing I should also point out, it was accidental that I found out locks were causing the issues that I was experiencing. I simply turned the locks off and all of a sudden my problems were gone, so then I re-locked everything and the problems re-appeared. Then later after receiving P284 I tested it again, (still wanted to get rid of some channels in the guide) and the problems were there again.


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## Ron Barry

Tony,

From your reports and others. I do believe there is something hiding in the locks. PUN fully intended. Trick is to try and root cause it. So far I have not had any luck.

It is possible that some of the 2.85 fixes have either fixed it or made it harder to reproduce.


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## Mikey

tonyp56 said:


> :nono2:
> Jason and Ron,
> 
> Sorry about this (not really upset with you or Ron so please don't take this personal) but you and Ron really need to start reading other peoples posts! I have pointed this very issue out several times to both of you and neither of you paid any attention to me. This issue has been around for at least six months!! Why is it when I said it neither of you paid any attention, but all of a sudden you noticed it and it suddenly becomes a big deal! (Enough that you are asking Dish about it.) *It was around way before P285! It seems like I noticed it back around P281* (I think that is right may have been before and please excuse me if there was never a 281 SW version I can't remember all of them but it has been atleast six months ago.) ...


So, can we get back to topic about P2.85 bugs?


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## Foxbat

Mikey said:


> So, can we get back to topic about P2.85 bugs?


Right, like what bugs are the show-stoppers? I haven't read anything so far that makes me think that P2.85 shouldn't be rolled out to everyone.

Still waiting in Michiana,


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## Ron Barry

Roland, 

When I got my 285, I had an issue with it spontaneously rebooting when I went into my "Favorites". Took a soft reboot to clear the problem. To the average person that would try to add a channel to their favorites, this could be ugly. I seem to be the only one that reported this issue in the thread, but that issue I might consider it is show stopper. 

The fact that I am the only one that has reported this issue, I doubt Dish would hold up 2.85 out to everyone on this issue. However, point is that we don't necessarly see everything in these forums and from the reports it is clear that this is real slow roll out for sure. Might not have critical mass where we would see some issues pointed here. We are but a small sampling of the 2.5 million 811 receivers.


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## Jason Nipp

Closing. P285 has completed it's inital target. P287 to spool today.


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