# 211 or 222?



## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

I got the letter from DISH that I needed to upgrade my old 6000 HD receiver. The installers brought a 211. There were a lot of problems with the outcome and after tlaking with customer servie a few times, I was offered the 222 and they would waive the upgrade fee of $50. So which should I choose?

Here is my set up. I have a whole house video distribution system. One set of outputs (red, white, yellow) go to the house distribution system. One set of outputs (red, white, S video) go directly to the main TV). The HD connections go directly to the main TV also. The 6000 has two sets of red, white, yellow outputs. The 211 and the 222 only have one set.

First question - can I split the red, white, yellow outputs with those pigtail splitters to get the same effect as the two sets of outputs on the 6000?

Second question - since the 222 can run two TV's, can I watch an HD program at the main TV while someone else watches something else on another TV?

Third question - I do not have any HD packages from DISH and don't plan to get any at the moment. The only HD I watch is via the OTA input from my locals. Will I still be able to do that on the 211 and 222?

Fourth question - what else should I consdier and what recommendations do you have for my situation?

Thanks.

Len


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## puckwithahalo (Sep 3, 2007)

> First question - can I split the red, white, yellow outputs with those pigtail splitters to get the same effect as the two sets of outputs on the 6000?


yes



> Second question - since the 222 can run two TV's, can I watch an HD program at the main TV while someone else watches something else on another TV?


yes



> Third question - I do not have any HD packages from DISH and don't plan to get any at the moment. The only HD I watch is via the OTA input from my locals. Will I still be able to do that on the 211 and 222?


with 211 you do not have to subscribe to an HD package because of the promotion you're getting to replace the 6000. If you did the 222, you wouls have to subscribe to an HD package or pay the $7.00 per month HD Enabling Free. Note, the lowest HD package is $10.00 per month.

I think You are probably best just sticking with the 211 and just splitting the RCA signals.


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## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

Thanks for the quick reply. Interesting - I thought I asked if I had to get an HD package with the 222, but maybe I didn't. I know I asked about the 211 and the answer was "no" as you said. The offer to waive the $50 fee for the 222 was to appease a ticked off customer. Maybe I just assumed that no HD package or fee went with it too. 

Len


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## puckwithahalo (Sep 3, 2007)

Oh, and just for a tad more info, the 222 does have 2 sets of RCA outputs on it. One for TV1 and one for TV2, though in single mode, they will both output the same picture and enable pip functionality


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## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

Was just on the phone with DISH for about an hour and a half. There will be no HD access fee with the 211. For the 222 there will be no $50 upgrade fee, but there will be the $7 HD access fee. I'm leaning to sticking with the 211 as you suggested. They are coming tomorrow to reinstall it.

As an FYI, I have a whole house video distribution system that they screwed up trying to install the 211. That's what the loooong call was about and what the return visit tomorrow is all about. I wanted to just install the thing myself, but they didn't initially give me that option.

BTW, unless their website is wrong, it looks like the 222 only has one set of RCA jacks. See http://www.dishnetwork.com/downloads/pdf/product_brochures/ViP222_ProductSheet_HighRes.pdf

Thanks again.

Len


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

What is the point of two independent connections to the main TV???

Is your distribution system RF or line level?


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## BobaBird (Mar 31, 2002)

lsokoloff said:


> BTW, unless their website is wrong, it looks like the 222 only has one set of RCA jacks.


One set for TV1, another for TV2. See http://tech.dishnetwork.com/departmental_content/TechPortal/content/tech/receiver/rollover/222.shtml

The product sheet you linked to incorrectly shows the back of a 211.


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## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

harsh said:


> What is the point of two independent connections to the main TV???
> 
> Is your distribution system RF or line level?


I assume you are talking about the two connections from the 6000? One connection is strictly the HD connection. The other is for SD. About 99.9% of the time I just watch programs in SD for two reasons. First I don't have an HD package yet, so the only HD shows I get would be of the OTA locals. And since I hate commercials, I tape all of those shows on my 626 DVR and watch them in SD. Second, I don't see a whole lot of difference between SD and HD on my Sony TV. Also, only my main TV is HD, so I need to distribute a non-HD signal to the other TV's.

My video distribution system is the ChannelPlus system, this modulator, http://www.channelplus.com/product_detail.php?productId=41 and this cable panel, http://www.channelplus.com/product_detail.php?productId=60

Everything in the video distribution system is linked via RG6 cable.

Please if you have any suggestions, ideas or if I'm doing anything stupid, let me know.

Len


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## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

BobaBird said:


> One set for TV1, another for TV2. See http://tech.dishnetwork.com/departmental_content/TechPortal/content/tech/receiver/rollover/222.shtml
> 
> The product sheet you linked to incorrectly shows the back of a 211.


Okay, that makes more sense. Funny, when I raised that issue with a supervisor today, she agreed with me that the back of the 211 and the 222 were identical. She and their website is wrong.

Len


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## Sandman (Sep 23, 2002)

From other postings and my experience the 222 has problems

Bob


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## puckwithahalo (Sep 3, 2007)

The picture there is the back of a 211, will pass that along to whoever can fix it. The 222 is pretty much identical to the 622 minus the hard drive.


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## Cap'n Preshoot (Jul 16, 2006)

We have the 222 (we're on our 3rd one) and have found it (ours at least) to be quite problematic, with many-many-many (did I say many?) reboots required. We have had ours for 9 months and somewhere I lost track of the number of times it has locked up or gotten itself into an endless start-up loop, requiring a reboot. Most problems have been exhibited while trying to recover from simple rain fade. I would not feel comfortable recommending the 222 to anyone.


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## Cap'n Preshoot (Jul 16, 2006)

puckwithahalo said:


> The picture there is the back of a 211, will pass that along to whoever can fix it. The 222 is pretty much identical to the 622 minus the hard drive.


I mean no offense, but aside from external cosmetic & rear panel similarities, (and user guide & functional similarities) the 222 is in no other way electrically or design "similar" to the 622. Different mainboard & different firmware (entirely different code base).


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## Cap'n Preshoot (Jul 16, 2006)

lsokoloff said:


> Second question - since the 222 can run two TV's, can I watch an HD program at the main TV while someone else watches something else on another TV?


Yes, but not in HD on the 2nd set. The HD outputs are only available on HDMI and Component Video. The "2nd set" output is only available as an analog modulated RF-output signal


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## puckwithahalo (Sep 3, 2007)

> I mean no offense, but aside from external cosmetic & rear panel similarities, (and user guide & functional similarities) the 222 is in no other way electrically or design "similar" to the 622. Different mainboard & different firmware (entirely different code base).


I meant usage-wise they are identical except for those features that use the hard drive in the 622. I know the hardware is different.


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## DavidRobert (Apr 6, 2008)

Gents- I find your comments useful but I have questions.
Like you, I've had 1 1/2 hr discussions with someone in the Philippines. 

I am twisting in the wind considering a HDTV and whether to get DISH HD. THe 211 charges confuse me. If you get the $10 HD upgrade, do they still want a $7 fee? if so, why not say its $17? What does one really pay?

Right now - I have the Everything package with the Dish 500. I don't know if its worth going to the 61.5 degree wing dish or just try and buy a 1000.4 dish & a 211 from an internet approved supplier and install the stuff my self. 

I like the SD programs and the SD Movies; and have no idea how good HD is. At the stores- I look at the Sony 46 inch sets. The many models and various prices are confusing. No store runs the real world. I am afraid that I may not like the SD channel images on a HD set. Your user experience is appreciated. 
When I go into BJ's, all the images on all the sets look the same. So I wonder what is the real world with a 211 in your home?
Thank you for your help.


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## Allen Noland (Apr 23, 2002)

DavidRobert said:


> I like the SD programs and the SD Movies; and have no idea how good HD is. At the stores- I look at the Sony 46 inch sets. The many models and various prices are confusing. No store runs the real world. I am afraid that I may not like the SD channel images on a HD set. Your user experience is appreciated.
> When I go into BJ's, all the images on all the sets look the same. So I wonder what is the real world with a 211 in your home?
> Thank you for your help.


It isn't how the SD picture looks on an HD set, it is how the SD picture looks compared to the HD picture.


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## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

DavidRobert said:


> I am twisting in the wind considering a HDTV and whether to get DISH HD. THe 211 charges confuse me. If you get the $10 HD upgrade, do they still want a $7 fee? if so, why not say its $17? What does one really pay?
> 
> I like the SD programs and the SD Movies; and have no idea how good HD is. At the stores- I look at the Sony 46 inch sets. The many models and various prices are confusing. No store runs the real world. I am afraid that I may not like the SD channel images on a HD set. Your user experience is appreciated.
> When I go into BJ's, all the images on all the sets look the same. So I wonder what is the real world with a 211 in your home?
> Thank you for your help.


Here are my personal opinions. I got the 211 only as an upgrade to the soon to be obsolete 6000 receiver. I hardly ever watch programs in HD because the difference in picture quality is hardly noticeable. Maybe my SD is better than most or maybe my HD is worse than most, but I can barely tell the difference. Now my 36" tubed Sony is eight years old and maybe the technology of a 2008 set is much better. So at this point I do not have an HD package and don't plan to get one anytime soon. I can get OTA HD programs, but they don't do a whole lot for me. So for me there is no additional HD fee because there was none when I got the 6000 receiver initially. It is my understanding that you don't pay both fees totalling $17, but you pay one or the other.

Len


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## Jim5506 (Jun 7, 2004)

If you can't tell the difference with an HD picture, then I'd first check to make sure the 211 is not set on 480p.


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## BNUMM (Dec 24, 2006)

The $7.00 is only if you have a second receiver.


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## lsokoloff (Nov 15, 2006)

Jim5506 said:


> If you can't tell the difference with an HD picture, then I'd first check to make sure the 211 is not set on 480p.


Thanks for the reply Jim. My 211 was set on 480p. What settings should I use? If I'm reading my TV manual correctly, it looks like the TV can accept 1080i, 480p and 480i. Not sure which of the aspect ratios to use either. Here's what the manual says about vertical compression - *16:9 enhancement: vertical compression technology that maximizes picture resolution on "anamorphic" or "enhanced for widescreen" sources, including selected DVD's.* I'm not sure what that means. Will my correctly proportioned HD pictures always have the black bars across the top and bottom? Do I leave the settings alone for watching SD programming which I watch much more of? You may very well be right why I am not seeing a big difference in picture quality with HD. Is there a DIY guide to what all these settings mean other than what the manual states? As you can see from my questions above, I'm pretty clueless about this HD set up.

Thanks.

Len


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## puckwithahalo (Sep 3, 2007)

> I am twisting in the wind considering a HDTV and whether to get DISH HD. THe 211 charges confuse me. If you get the $10 HD upgrade, do they still want a $7 fee? if so, why not say its $17? What does one really pay?


The $7.00 HD enabling fee is only if you do not have one of the HD packages, which start at the $10.00 you mentioned. Its an either or thing.


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## MattDL (Aug 18, 2008)

$7 HD enabling fee is if you have HD hardware but do not subscribe to HD programming through DISH

Also, keep in mind you must have a phone line connected to the 222 since it is a dual-tuner receiver, or a HomePlug adapter. If you have neither of these then you will pay $5 per month for the dual-tuner. 

I must say that bearing in the mind your setup and the problematic nature of most 222's that I have seen I would recommend sticking with a 211 in this case. Although of course you will sacrifice PIP, and both TV's that you split the signal to will be watching the same thing at all times. But if that's not super important to you, stick with the 211. (Did you think about upgrading to a 612 or 722? If you're getting $50 off you might inquire about a "Dish'N It Up" upgrade option to get the newest hardware for a minimal cost. Then when you do update your TV set to one which can take advantage of the newest HD and features, you will be able to enjoy all that is offered)


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## newsman (Nov 21, 2006)

MattDL said:


> Also, keep in mind you must have a phone line connected to the 222 since it is a dual-tuner receiver, or a HomePlug adapter. If you have neither of these then you will pay $5 per month for the dual-tuner.


Is the HomePlug the ethernet connection directly to the Internet?


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

HomePlug is the connection to you LAN. If you don't have a LAN, you would need to get a router and plug your computer and the HomePlug adapter into it.


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## newsman (Nov 21, 2006)

Do we know if the 222 dials home through the Internet, or does it need to still use the phone lines? I know the 211 will not dial home, because it has DishComm.


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## Opusnbill7 (Aug 27, 2008)

newsman said:


> Do we know if the 222 dials home through the Internet, or does it need to still use the phone lines? I know the 211 will not dial home, because it has DishComm.


Yes, it can "call home" through the ethernet port if you hook it up to a network connection. You can't, however, use the on-screen customer service functions with the ethernet port connected, however (probably a bug in the software). You can get all of the info online, though, so if you've got broadband already, why mess with it?


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