# Is DBSForums down?



## Chris Freeland

Is DBSForums down? I have bean trying for a couple hours to get their without succes.


----------



## John Corn

Must be.....I've tried to Chris.


----------



## Chris Blount

Yep, it's down. Dan must be working on something.


----------



## Mike

Wow! 50 looks in 2 hours for this question. That's pretty good. I basically hang out in the sports forum at the other site. The other forums are way too heavily moderated. Last night, I troll around the other forums and I read the posts in the admin forum. It seems there was some type of an argument between some posters this past week and one of the mods made reference to it in the general forum. If yadda yadda happens then the site will be closed down. Why not close it down? It's way too heavily moderated anyway. Certain mods get upset if they are contradicted by a poster, some posters don't like people "doing" "monthly updates" if the original person can't do it each month and just stupid childish stuff. Maybe the mods decided to close up shop? The site certainly won't be missed by those that are tired of the childish stuff mostly caused by the moderators.


----------



## Guest

Mike, you are perfect proof, you cant please everyone all of the time. We still have alot of loyal followers, just as this great place does. One less poster, wont bring the site to its knees. Jeff M


----------



## Peter Wilson

Why do the Moderators from "the other site" refuse to register here. It's as if this site were beneath them?


----------



## John Corn

Hi Peter, Welcome to DBSTalk.......Welcome to the DARKSIDE.....j/k...  

John Hodgson stops buy and visits us.


----------



## TNGTony

John registered recently. He even has a pretty cool avatar IIRC

See ya
Tony


----------



## JBKing

There's quite a few mods from the other place who are registered here.


----------



## John Corn

LOL......:lol: Thats right Tony, John has that wild looking golf cart, or is it a 4 wheeler......Thats funny I almost forgot.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I hope DBSforums does not close down. I for one feel that while things do sometimes get out of hand there they are a good place to visit. 

Both John and Dan are good folks, if there is anything I can do to help get them back online they have my phone number.

Having only one forum (while we would love all the new members) would not be a good thing for the hobby I hope they are back online soon.


----------



## Bob Haller

I will go have a look, have been too busy to stop by there. Interesting that when I left their problems continued. With their efforts to ban me I thought all there problems were caused by me.

I havent posted there in any form since the banning.... Whatever their problems I have NOTHING to do with it.


----------



## Geronimo

I too hope that DBS Forusm is back soon. Yes they occasionally blame problems on an individual or the use of "handles" but there is solid info there and for that reason alone I hope it returns soon.

As for those other things well maybe recent developments will make it clear to all that civility is indeed important but it is not related to certain factors.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I have sent John and email trying to find out what was wrong and asked him if he needed help we are here.

No reply as of yet, but if I hear anything before they come back online I will post it here.

Again we hope they come back online soon.


----------



## J Rath

While I agree that DBSForums has some great info, things over there have seem to have been getting just downright ugly lately. Is it me or does it seem that the bashing has gotten worse there since the merger announcement? :shrug: 

Anyways, I find this site much more relaxed and a more positve atmosphere to have productive discussions.


----------



## Mike

JRath - Exactly! 

John -No! Not the 'DARKSIDE". It's the bright side. The smiley side of the scoreboard. Think positive! 

Scott - Having one forum (for now anyway) is not that bad of a thing if it's done right. So far this is done right, IMO. 

If some of the moderators (former moderators - whatever they are now on the other site) from the other forum post here then that could lead to some serious ramifications if they act the same way over here. They will have to be watched closely with their views and so forth, IMO.  Some people left that site/don't visit certain areas for reasons. The same thing could happen here too.


----------



## Guest

At first I thought it was a techinal issue.
Now I think it might be personal.
I hate to say it......But I hope so!
It really sucks when a couple of assholes f*ck everything up for everybody!
I hate wading through a bunch of bullsh*t just to find out a post has taken a wrong turn and gone nowhere.
I hope this is just a temporary thing. Next time for real!!
I've crossed the line a couple of times at DBSForums and I was asked not to do it again. I respect that and try to oblige.
Don't piss in my house and I won't piss in yours.
Sign me...STXJim

*[Admin Note- Edited for language]
-Steve*


----------



## Guest

PS............
Did my language bother you????
I hope not.
I try not to use it in the 'other forum'.
Why?
Because it's in the Code of Conduct. 
That's not too much to ask. Is it?
Respect your brother.


----------



## Guest

> While I agree that DBSForums has some great info, things over there have seem to have been getting just downright ugly lately.


Truth be told, there really wasn't much of any flaming over there until the merger announcement. Since then, a core group of E* hating D* subscribers have been vehemently bashing Dish Network and especially demonizing Charlie Ergen every single chance they got. I'd like to say the moderators were handling it but Dan C. would just close threads left and right (which changed nothing) and Jim M. would actually join in on the E* bashing!

If they took it down then, what can I say? It was headed that way since the merger announcement anyway.

-Lyle J.P.


----------



## TNGTony

Let's not get into the bashing mode ourselves here. Until we find differently, DBSForums is down due to technical issues and nothing more. This board took quite some time to get over the "DBSForums bashing site" image. It never was intended as an US vs THEM board. This is just an alternative. Nothing more. So let's see if we can keep the rhetoric under control. As Scott said, let's hope they get their problems resolved and come back on line soon.

See ya
Tony


----------



## Steve Mehs

Hi Jim welcome to DBSTalk :hi:

I had to edit your post for language. this is a family site, next time plese use astricks, thanks.


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Peter Wilson _
> *Why do the Moderators from "the other site" refuse to register here. It's as if this site were beneath them? *


I suspect that it more likely reflects a lack of interest that many DBS aficionados show in this site that comes from the fact that it really hasn't found a "niche" beyond being a refuge for a few disgruntled former DBSForums members who either were deemed or who deemed themselves to be out of place in the "how dare you rip the little tag off your mattress" environs of DBSForums.

The other factor is that most of the moderators at DBSForums are not active posters themselves. As such, there isn't much reason for them to register here or anywhere else. The lack of topic participation by most of the moderators over there may not bode well for the long term health of that Forum. I suspect that the lack of personal involvement by the moderators there may have contributed to the short fuses that a some of them have exhibited over the last few months.

Nevertheless, it might be useful for the Administration here to somehow authenticate the registrations or screen names of the DBSForums moderators that do post here. In the past, I have been skeptical of the validity of some of the comments ascribed to screen names here that match or correspond closely to the screen names of some DBSForums moderators.

I probably have posted about a couple of dozen times over here, versus maybe 500 or more times over there. It isn't so much because of "snobbery" (I'm an anti-snob by nature: I'm inclined snub snobs, myself) but rather because, on most general subjects, initiating or commenting here would be like starting a redundant thread over there: it would just dilute the focus of the discussion. I recognize the screen names of about a dozen frequent posters here who have participated in threads in which I was a respondent over there, so I have no reason to doubt that if I am involved in a discussion on a DBS matter in that Forum which is of interest to those posters, and about which I would be interested in reading their opinions, then they will participate in that thread and similarly posting over here would be redundant.

There are certainly related topic areas that might be of interest and that might ultimately find a non-DBSForums home. Satellite radio may ultimately become one, but I just scanned through this site's Satellite Radio topics list and see zero responses for most of them. AVS Forums already does a good job with HDTV, so I'm not rooting for that topic to pick up anywhere else, and I believe that there are TIVO forums adequate to meet the needs of those users, though I am not one myself and maybe not the best one to judge their adequacy.

I also seems likely to me that someday, a Satellite Internet Forum audience will reach the critical mass needed to sustain an audience, but again, I am not a computer guy, so I may not be a very good evaluator of whether such users have a recurring or developing needs that are met by forums.

I have not found a DBS or satellite forum that discusses technical matters at the level of sophistication that my business interests in DBS requires. The exchanges of technical information that took place in the short-lived Commercial Installer forum experiment here could have been carried on over two tin cans and a string running from my house to that of another member named Floyd. I have found a similar lack of interest in technical posts of that nature at both DBSForums and the Delphi 4DTV general satellite forums as well. Basically, those of us who have to send DBS signals down 1000 feet of coax for a living must be introverts. Or everyone except Floyd and me who does so already has all of the answers they need.

Anyway, here's hoping that the outage over there is just due to a temporary technical problem. I doubt that a "work stoppage" has been deliberately staged to try to moderate the behavior of maybe four members who blew up last week, since there are obviously more effective ways to squelch that behavior. And while I fear that this will fall on deaf ears, so to speak, I will add myself to the list of those who have noticed and been annoyed by the E-bashing by the moderators that unwittingly contributed to last week's flame wars.

-AntAltMike


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Unregistered _
> *
> 
> Truth be told, there really wasn't much of any flaming over there until the merger announcement. Since then, a core group of E* hating D* subscribers have been vehemently bashing Dish Network and especially demonizing Charlie Ergen every
> single chance they got. I'd like to say the moderators were handling it but Dan C. would just close threads left and right (which changed nothing) and Jim M. would actually join in on the E* bashing!
> 
> If they took it down then, what can I say? It was headed that way since the merger announcement anyway.
> 
> -Lyle J.P. *


Wow, a core group of E* hating D* subscribers??? 
I never got that impression, although both camps have a couple of real winners though.

I see many at critisizms as what they are, critisizms. But occasionally very verifiable and known issues are presented, and someone dcides to deny it to the point of being totally rediculous. This has been the biggest problem IMHO. Sometimes it's hard for moderators not to take a side, they are DBS customers too and are experiences with most o the issues talked about. They know BS when it's posted in any camp.

And lets face it, with DirecTIVO, UTV, lots on new channels, locals, PQ, D* "IS" enjoy some peaking popularity.

I find it strange that the moderators are knocked. A couple of posters are still "not banned" which I find as an amazing feat of patiences by the moderation team, especailly when these few posters have caused a few very good threads to deteriorate.


----------



## Guest

I was trying to tell Steve the moderator that the supreme court has protected swearing as a free speech right and that censorship of posts for language is actually against the first admendment right to free speech. Public or private no one cvan legally take that right away from anyone else. Family site or not this site amoung many others must stay true to the american right to free speech, including typing or speaking of swear words.
please stop your censorship of all on this board.
thank you

(Mod Note. Deleted Blank Mistake post and deleted appology for blank post since he has nothing to appoligize for anymore)


----------



## TNGTony

Figures  There always has to be one out there.

See ya
Tony


----------



## Guest

Steve,
I didn't mean to disrespect this forum.
What I had read in the past about DBSTalk (a long time ago) is that I thought our Freedom of Speach was uncensored here.
That won't happen again.
Sorry,
Jim


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Sorry folks we are not a "free speech" board over here.

We have rules like all other forums and expect them to be followed, but in saying that we are more open to different topics of discussion. (If you dont believe this check out our Potpourri forum) 

You will find that we are very lightly moderated infact most of the moderation is done here is to clean up the language. 

Still no word from John about the status of DBSforums. I do hope that it comes back online soon. Remember folks we are all members of DBSforums, and while we do not agree with some of the things that go on over there we all do visit regularly and consider it a valuable asset to the DBS community. My rule of thumb is if you don't like the way a place is run then dont visit again, same goes for resturants.


----------



## Guest

Then Steve you should expect to get a possible lawsuit from some zealot out there.
Just cause you are running a forum whether on your own equipment or a public system you can not in any way censor anything anyone sends to be posted, legally that is.
Just cause everyone else used to make blacks sit in the back of the bus in the 1950s doesn't mean we can do it today.
The policy that these forums use for censoring swears, which are legally protected first admendment speech, is wrong and illegal. Dan on dbsforums was facing a lawsuit on libel or slander or some such. More forums could face lawsuits for impinging on a constitutional right to free speech.
the ACLU eats these things up.
Just trying to show you that you are WRONG legally with your policies.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hey Unregistereds,

Not to get in spitting matches (thats not what we are about)  But I think both of you guys would love out Potpourri forum.

Check it out.


----------



## Chris Blount

You might want to read the terms of use especially section i, k and L.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23

As long as you use these forums, you are bound by these rules. Our house, our rules. You should feel lucky that we allow any profanities at all.


----------



## Guest

Chris-
Your RULES are good rules don't get me wrong. But no one can OVERIDE the constitution of the United States. NO ONE! Not even Uncle Sam. Your house could be shut down if you get sued from the ACLU for having RULES that go against the US Consitution.

Why are these forums all controlled by power hungry, nazi like people?

So what if someone swears read it throw it out of your minds and get on with life. Any way just trying to show that in a legal manner this forum and others are taking away a right guarenteed to all in the USA.

Sorry to be thinking so patriotically.


----------



## Chris Blount

I have no problem with your thinking. I respect your opinion. The beauty of this whole thing is that you also have the freedom to go elsewhere if you feel you are beeing violated here. 

No reason to argue about it. Since we have both aired our opinions, I hope we can now move on. 

Thanks for joining us!


----------



## Geronimo

I am sure that DBS Forums is either down for tech reasons or for a cooling off period. Either way I am certain that it will be back. I certainly hope it will. 

I do not always agree with management over there but they are not Nazis. They simply have a restrictive view of what should be allowed on THEIR forum. Butt ehere are other forums to express other points of view.


----------



## John Hodgson

Since my e-mail is down, I have no idea as to the status of DBSForums. As soon as I can get my e-mail bak up, I'll post the status for those who may be interested.

An editorial note:

I would submit that IF DBSForums went down for good, you'd all see the same type of crap happening here in within six weeks. It is the nature of the internet - plain and simple. To some extent, the guys here at DBSTalk have already had to 'moderate' to an extent that they were not chartered to do. To wit, - the deleting of posts, editing of posts to mention just two, and rightfully so IMHO!.

You can make all the rules and registration agreements you want , but guess what, some few people figure that' what the hell, that doesn't apply to me' or ' I'll be damned if I'm going to follow that BS', 'who in hell do those people think they are'?

Anyone think it won't hppen here? Keep dreaming ....

One thing AltaMike (SP) is totally correct on is the lack of posting my the moderators. I, for one, totally agree - after doing this since 1994 - what's left to say? Not to mention getting very tired of getting flamed on a weekly basis and second guessed at the drop of a hat. Be it the truth come out, I've completly lost interest in the subject of direct broadcast satellite - I couldn't care less anymore. Nuff said in this rant .....


----------



## Fish Man

> _Originally posted by Unregistered _
> *Then Steve you should expect to get a possible lawsuit from some zealot out there.
> Just cause you are running a forum whether on your own equipment or a public system you can not in any way censor anything anyone sends to be posted, legally that is.
> Just cause everyone else used to make blacks sit in the back of the bus in the 1950s doesn't mean we can do it today.
> The policy that these forums use for censoring swears, which are legally protected first admendment speech, is wrong and illegal. Dan on dbsforums was facing a lawsuit on libel or slander or some such. More forums could face lawsuits for impinging on a constitutional right to free speech.
> the ACLU eats these things up.
> Just trying to show you that you are WRONG legally with your policies. *


Are you saying that any sort of moderated forum is illegal?

I think the courts would beg to differ.

There are countless instances in which sensorship is tollerated. Moderated discussion groups are one of them.

By your logic, TV networks would be forced to permit the "F"-word in children's programming. Elementary school libraries would be forced to have kiddie porn on the shelves, etc.

Newspapers are free to print, or not print what they please (within certian broad restrictions, for example, they can't slander anyone). By your logic, if I sent a letter to the editor of my local newspaper, and they chose not to print it, I could sue them to force them to print it or pay me damages. *This is not the case, I have no such right!* Just as a newspaper is free to print or not print a letter to the editor (and they are also free to print it with their own edits to it) the moderators of forums such as this one (and dbsforums.com) are free to edit, delete, and enforce rules of conduct as they see fit.

*Now, as to the lawsuit against dbsforums.com:*

They *were not being sued over removing something from the forums* as you suggest. Rather, they are being sued (or was it just a threat to sue at this point?, I don't remember for sure...) for *failing* to remove a post _quickly enough_ that the person bringing the lawsuit (or threat of a lawsuit) considered to be slanderous to himself.

Essentially, someone got flamed (quite probably in an aggregeous violation of the board's rules), the flamee sued the board (or thretened a suit) for slander on the basis that the flame was not removed quickly enough. The moderators' argument is (correctly) that they are not bloody well on line 24/7, they removed the offensive post as soon as it was brought to their attention.

The maintanence of the server and the internet bandwidth for dbsforums.com is payed for entirely by Dan and John (and, perhaps, a handfull of others), essentially as their "hobby". Those costs are partially, but not fully defrayed via the occasional "raffle" or merchandise sale (like dbsforums coffee mugs). If their expenses now have to include legal fees to defend themselves against assinine frivolous lawsuits, I can see why they might choose to just shut the board down.

I hope this is not the case, but I'm afraid it might be.

Edit: Based on John's post just above this one (posted as I was typing this) I guess it's not a deliberate shut down. That's good news!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

John,

Thanks for the update. I hope to see DBSforums back online ASAP. Again if theres anything we can do to help please let us know.

We know some very good inexpensive hosting sites where you could be back up and running in the matter of a few hours. This way if Dan had server issues you could be back online while Dan irons out the bugs.

I have emailed you (to your az mail address) with my phone numbers where I can be reached. Let us know if we can help in any way.


----------



## Chris Freeland

I agree with you Geronimo on all your points above, however I suspect a cooling off period is whty it is down. If it were for technical reasonsI think Dan would have had it up by now and we are now into day 2 of them being down, I too hope it will be back soon. I like this site too by the way. I do wish somone from the other site would let us know what is going on.


----------



## John Hodgson

If I knew what was happening, I'd be more than willing to share.

How in hell can you 'suspect' a cooling off period without knowing what's up Chris? Do you not think Dan or myself would make it known as we HAVE DONE in the past when the Forums have been shut down for what ever reason?

But let us continue to speculate as to what's going on without anyone, myself included, knowing what the hell is going on.

ARGH!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I agree with John, let's not speculate on whats going on, people are probably making more out of this then what is really going on.

Let's just hope we see the server back online soon.

Thanks John for your updates.


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Unregistered _
> *Then Steve you should expect to get a possible lawsuit from some zealot out there.
> Just cause you are running a forum whether on your own equipment or a public system you can not in any way censor anything anyone sends to be posted, legally that is.
> Just cause everyone else used to make blacks sit in the back of the bus in the 1950s doesn't mean we can do it today.
> The policy that these forums use for censoring swears, which are legally protected first admendment speech, is wrong and illegal. Dan on dbsforums was facing a lawsuit on libel or slander or some such. More forums could face lawsuits for impinging on a constitutional right to free speech.
> the ACLU eats these things up.
> Just trying to show you that you are WRONG legally with your policies. *


I can't believe I am feeding the troll&#8230;

Sport, cite the LAW that you believe protects your right to post whatever you feel on a privately owned system.

You see, just like the newspaper, these guys can edit or remove any post at any time. It is their sandbox. Do you really believe that the "Letters to the Editor" are not edited, and that they print all they receive?

Here is an idea, take a summer course on Constitutional Law from your nearest college. Then come back here and defend your position, if you can&#8230;

Geeze&#8230;.


----------



## Guest

As for why some moderators dont register here,,, isnt that suppose to be the beauty of this place. If I want to I can, if I dont, so be it. John is right about losing the interest in DBS, I to hardly post anymore, I still help keep an eye out, but I really think DBS has soured to some degree. As for why the site is down? I just hope nothing has happened that Dan couldnt tell any of the guys. Posted by Jeff M Shoe size 10.5 hair brown, and greying quickly.


----------



## Guest

Thanks John, 

I was sure that if this was any "real" outage other than unplanned we would have had notice. As I remermber Dan is out of town and if the server crashed, well, there may be nothing that can be done about it till he gets back. 

Jim M


----------



## Guest

One further item, unregistered…

If you do not like the way forums are managed, you are most able to set up your own…

Go and have fun in your own sandbox…


----------



## Guest

as to registering......... well, I have only a small amount of time and I tend to lend it to the forums. I do read here though. Just don't post. Is that a sin? I could register but would that change anything? 


- jim m


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Registering makes it easier to find the messages which are new since your last visit.

And you can have you own avatar for when you do decide to post. 

<--- Me in the ugly guy on the left


----------



## John Hodgson

As has been mentioned, Dan is out of town this week and if I remember correctly, won't be available until Wed. afternoon.

I had forgotten the above until I read Jim's post. I could remotely access the site using PCAnywhere but I'm at work so it ain't gonna happen .... unless Dan accesses the server from where ever he is.


----------



## Guest

the website name www.dbsforums.com will be auctioned off on EBay starting April 25.

Bid high & bid often


----------



## Jim M

Aaaahhhh..... this is more like it.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Yeah right, an auction. I expect pigs to fly out of my butt before that happens. 

BTW Thanks for the update John!


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Crashes really suck, but that's pretty funny...


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Welcome Jim! :wave:

Thats the first coming soon avatar I have seen


----------



## RandyAB

If this is true I am happy for them. Because I do not understand why they would want to continue putting up with all of the *****ing that they get for decisions they make. I guess a little extra money they will be able to spend on things that they actually enjoy too. For some reason though I doubt this is true!


----------



## John Hodgson

Yep, about as funny as a wet fart Mark. 

trolling, trolling, trolling ....


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Dan as opinionated as he can be, is a genius. He knows the technical side of DBS like the back of his hand.

And while he has been opinionated about his move to DirecTV (which is his right) I always look forward to Dan's posts as I always learn something from each one of them.


----------



## Jim M

Click here to visit the official announcement regarding the forums


----------



## Jim M

.............. maybe coming later than sooner though. 

BTW --- it was a joke! Lighten up


----------



## Geronimo

Thanks for the laugh Jim. I needed that.


----------



## Guest

Does anyone think that Dish will be adding Trio or Goodlife?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thats why I have a wireless internet connection at my house.... So I can go outside and browse the forums and get fresh air at the same time. 

Thanks for th laugh Jim


----------



## Guest

Not that I post much at dbsforums (more administrator than posting member, I'm afraid) - I thought I'd chime in as well.

Sorry to say it's no news - but at least it's good news, in that if John and I are 'in the dark' (so to speak), it's most likely a simple technical problem.

If I hear anything, I'll let you guys know.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks for checking in Chris, that is reassuring news!


----------



## Ray_Clum

Jim, I just about spit out a glass of water on my computer at work. That was GREAT!


----------



## Guest

Come on, folks -- this business about the mods not being able to moderate profane language is ridiculous, and wrong, to boot.

The fact is that the Constitutional protections of free speech relate *solely* to governmental restrictions on free speech. And even those aren't absolute. Kiddie porn is illegal. Certain states won't let DirecTV broadcast regular old porn to their citizens. 

The mods and owners of this forum are under NO legal obligation whatsoever to allow you to post gutter language here, any more than your local newspaper is mandated to publish your letter to the editor, just because you send them one. TV networks are free to take off the air any content they deem unworthy, regardless of what you or anyone else thinks. And they should have this right. After all, they own the transmission equipment and they pay the money to broadcast the information. 

No private person or company has a legal obligation to give you a platform from which to say anything at all, profane or not. The owners here could throw you out simply because they don't like the looks of you, or because they don't like what you have to say or the way in which you say it. You have no free speech rights here or in any other private forum. You exist here solely as a guest of the site owner -- you have no rights as a tenant. Nor should you.

Avenger / sanderson


----------



## Guest

If Chris or John or anybody else from DBSForums can email me I think I know what happened.

[email protected]


----------



## John Corn

This is GREAT having everyone here......Welcome to all of you.


----------



## Chris Freeland

> _Originally posted by John Hodgson _
> *If I knew what was happening, I'd be more than willing to share.
> 
> How in hell can you 'suspect' a cooling off period without knowing what's up Chris? Do you not think Dan or myself would make it known as we HAVE DONE in the past when the Forums have been shut down for what ever reason?
> 
> But let us continue to speculate as to what's going on without anyone, myself included, knowing what the hell is going on.
> 
> ARGH! *


Chill out John, your post was not up when I made that coment, are messages must of crossed, I did not mean to affend you .


----------



## Sherlock

By doing a tracert, it appears the Speakeasy ISP is down.

John Hodgson, I can definitely identify with your comments. DBS is not that big of a deal to me anymore, either. I find I'm spending more of my time discussing computers, something where I do have some control over the outcome.

Bob, don't flatter yourself. Only you thought that someone might think it was you.
(I'm glad to hear you and the wife are doing better healthwise.)


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Sherlock _
> *By doing a tracert, it appears the Speakeasy ISP is down.
> 
> John Hodgson, I can definitely identify with your comments. DBS is not that big of a deal to me anymore, either. I find I'm spending more of my time discussing computers, something where I do have some control over the outcome. *


I am in agreement as well - this is at least part of the reason I just don't post much anymore. John, Dan and I have discussed this before - the 'golden age' of DBS has passed.


----------



## Sherlock

Let's come up with a new forum to discuss something most of us have in common that's really exciting!

Electric, Water, and Sewer service!


----------



## Guest

We'd probably have someone claim that their sh_t don't stink and then that would cause a flame war. Cause we all know it does.


----------



## BearsFan

Just registered...was a dbsforums.com semi-regular (MSadowski there)...

I like this forum...and the wide variety of boards.

--MfS


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks BearsFan, and welcome to you and everyone else who joined us today! :hi:


----------



## scooper

> _Originally posted by Sherlock _
> *Let's come up with a new forum to discuss something most of us have in common that's really exciting!
> 
> Electric, Water, and Sewer service!
> *


Well - not having them would certainly make life "interesting " !!


----------



## John Hodgson

I don't know Chris S - IMHO the Golden Age of DBS passed by when LIL became a reality. I can't remember the last time I had anything relevent or exciting to discuss regarding DBS.


----------



## Sherlock

Maybe when PQ and options become too good for us to handle?

DBS has become 'cable in the sky' where it no longer seems to excel in spectacular ways.

Besides, who wants to talk about cable?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Oh come on John! You wern't excited when they added the Lifetime Movie Network?


----------



## John Hodgson

yawn ...


----------



## Guest

Speakeasy Network System Status >> 04/22/2002 02:31 PM PST
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4/2/02 07:56:43 AM Firmware Issue

Region : All
E.T.A. : N/A
Services Affected : (none)

We are currently having intermitent outages through our network. Customers will be seeing packet loss and their dsl modems will be rebooting. If you are one of these customers, please call into tech support and notify them.


----------



## Sherlock

Region: All
Services Affected : (none)

Huh?
"The wind is out of the North at 0 miles per hour."
Direction, but no movement?

This has network upgrade FUBAR written all over it.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hmm this does not jive with the tracerts I am seeing. My tracerts get stuck at Internap border28.ge3-1-bbnet1.nyc.pnap.net

It does not even make it to Speakeasy.

If it were a DSL modem rebooting the tracert should still make it to the DSLAM of the ISP.

Also look at the Date of that trouble report. Its April 2nd. Today is the 22nd. That report is from 20 days ago.


----------



## bobr

My tracert mahe it to spk-1-nyc.dsl-isp.net

BobR


----------



## Guest

ok i am registered, did charlie.


----------



## Guest

Chris, let me know what you find out, the main thing is Dan. God, you even let Jim register here, maybe I should re-think this.
John what did it for me was the increases in price,that took all the specialty of dbs out of it.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Jeff can I borrow your secrect decoder ring? Im trying to figure out what your messages say. 

Good to see you here.

I am sure (and hope) Dan is ok, hopefully it is a question of Dan resetting the server or his DSL modem to get things back online.


----------



## Jeff McClellan

Oops now I am registered. Sorry Scott, just making fun of Jim M. I know Dans ok, loyality is the only good vice I still have. You guys really are to be comended for what you have here.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks Jeff we try hard here to make everyone feel welcomed. You guys have it tough over there sometimes. 

Some users forget that we only do this for fun, we dont get paid, we dont get free satellite, we get nothing. Infact that we pay for the costs out of our pockets (well we get donations now) this should mean something to the visitors.

I do hope things get straightened out with your board soon, it has been a valuable resource to everyone interested in satellite television.

Thanks for registering and enjoy your stay here at DBStalk.COM :wave:


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Hmm this does not jive with the tracerts I am seeing. My tracerts get stuck at Internap border28.ge3-1-bbnet1.nyc.pnap.net
> 
> It does not even make it to Speakeasy.
> 
> If it were a DSL modem rebooting the tracert should still make it to the DSLAM of the ISP.
> 
> Also look at the Date of that trouble report. Its April 2nd. Today is the 22nd. That report is from 20 days ago. *


I timed out at spk-1-nyc.dsl-isp.net [209.191.132.33] and didn't make it to dbsforums.com [216.27.142.172].

The issues started 4/2 and is still unresolved...

Speakeasy System Status


----------



## Ray H

> _Originally posted by Unregistered _
> *Then Steve you should expect to get a possible lawsuit from some zealot out there.
> Just cause you are running a forum whether on your own equipment or a public system you can not in any way censor anything anyone sends to be posted, legally that is. *


Super! Does this mean I can walk into a crowded theater lobby and yell, "FIRE!"? Does this mean my grandkids can now publically ask the Blessing in their school cafeteria before eating, or request a Blessing prior to taking a test in their classroom? When somene's in MY house, they follow MY rules regardless of *your* personal interpretation of a Supreme Court 1st Ammendment related decision. You may be right, though, that Steve's hands are tied, since this board does not require registration to participate. I offer no advice to Steve, but I suspect the gears are turning. It does seem a shame that some people are so lacking in the ability to build a withering argument based on sweet logic to make their point that they have to rely on potty-mouthed intimidation language to express themselves. (-_sigh_-) Oh, well . . .


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Yeah but DBSforums has not been down since April 2nd (although it seems like it) so I dont think this is the problem.

Another guess of mine would be that somehow Dans DSL router got assigned a new IP address and this way dbsforums.com is not pointed correctly anymore. Ive seen that happen before, especially when a router goes down.


----------



## Steve Mehs

Thanks Ray! Its apperciated! 

And a big welcome to all of our new members, including Jeff M and Jim M.


----------



## Guest

last time this happened, Dan was also out of town. last time I think it was his housekeeper who brought down the server accidently.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hmmm does that mean that Dans house keeper "dosen't do Windows?" :lol: (DBSforums is run on WindowsNT for those that dont get it)


----------



## Jim M

Thanks. Thismust be some place when even *I* am welcomed


----------



## Sandy

Well, here I am, too. I was starting to get lonely. 

Sandy


----------



## Nancy Galliano

Not that anyone at DBF Forum should care, but I found it so uncomfortable that I stopped even logging in. It just seemed that any opinion was slammed by someone and it was less painful to stay away. Maybe it wasn't the moderator's fault (although some of them didn't have much tact)....but in any case, I'm outta there. Having to use one's real name (or modification of it) was uncomfortable, too) -- IMHO. (there will now be a pause while people say "so what?") Oh well.


----------



## Sherlock

Nancy, you don't know what you're talking about.

Do you feel at home now?


----------



## Steve Mehs

Welcome Sandy and Nancy, :hi:

I hope you gals enjoy your stay and thanks for registering and stopping by.


----------



## Guest

Whatever its faults DBSForums as long as they're around are number 1. 

This site is letter A.

Glad for the opportunity to have the choices. 

Often you don't realize what you have until it's gone!


----------



## Steve Mehs

> Often you don't realize what you have until it's gone!


You said it man, I couldnt agree more


----------



## Jacob S

(1) I have a local newspaper that had to close shop after someone had put in the editorials on the second page about burning the american flag, that was their last print run. It may have been the competition that had that put in there then turned in since they were not in business for that long and suffered because of them.

(2) If DBSForums.com is in fact down then could we get the archives and have it put on this site so we could have that information and kind of start off from where we left off at?

(3) Didn't this happen before where DBSDish.com got sold to someone else? If this is true that they are getting auctioned off then it seems like there is a pattern. I was a member of DBSDish.com when that was around before DBSForums.com came about and remember them closing it down then the new forum came about and I think I found out about it because I was emailed the new address to the new forums site.

(4) If DBSForums closed down for good could we get all of those email addresses to email them all the link to this site so that they know of another place to go to have everyone meet? the have done this before.


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Jim M _
> *Thanks. Thismust be some place when even *I* am welcomed  *


Don't push it, man!


----------



## JBKing

oops! Forgot I lost (deleted) my cookies


----------



## Jacob S

To the older subscribers the freshness of satellite is gone and reminds them more of just cable in the sky but to the newer subscribers its more than that, its still fresh to them. 

Its just like a new car, you like it for a while then you get tired of it after a while or at least the thrill is gone than what you had at first. Those that do upgrade to like the pvr systems or upgrade in programing have a renewed thrill but not as long lived bc they get used to all of that just like they did the satellite system. 

In other words people get SPOILED, and this is what happens with some of my customers.


----------



## Mike

> _Originally posted by John Hodgson _
> *I would submit that IF DBSForums went down for good, you'd all see the same type of crap happening here in within six weeks. It is the nature of the internet - plain and simple. To some extent, the guys here at DBSTalk have already had to 'moderate' to an extent that they were not chartered to do. To wit, - the deleting of posts, editing of posts to mention just two, and rightfully so IMHO!.*


If the same crap does happen here as is happening at DBSForums then it's a crying shame. Same at DBSForums. Only safe forum there is the sports forum. I went to the admin forum there the other day and there was about 10 locked threads of people yelling at each other. Why? Reason # 1 - # 200 why I just hang out in the sports forum. It's pretty much civilized there. If people start yelling here like at that site then I suspect people won't like all of the crap and will move on. I'm hoping it doesn't happen here and it stops there. Programming forum is okay there too I guess. General forum and admin forums have way too many childish arguments between posters and then even mods and then the posters get upset and yell at the mods. It's pretty stupid. I just hope it doesn't happen here. I've had satellite stuff since 1988. I'll never get tired of it and the related topics. If I knew as much as Dan then I'd post more. I just get tired of the arguments and banning people and just stupid childish stuff.


----------



## Brian Rector

When I tried to access DBSForums, I thought maybe it was Netscape 6 that was causing my not being able to connect to the site. DBSForums will be back sometime soon.


----------



## Guest

I am registered at dbsforums and have nothing against E/D merging,can't wait in fact.I don't have anything against Dish subscribers either we have quite a few things in common after all is said and done we are all proud americans are we not?


----------



## Edward E Suleski

Chris what do you think of the united states constitution and namely the bill of rights?


----------



## Guest

Will Dish Network ever add Trio and/or Goodlife? I hope so. Lots and lots of good programming on both channels.


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Jacob S _
> *To the older subscribers the freshness of satellite is gone and reminds them more of just cable in the sky but to the newer subscribers its more than that, its still fresh to them.
> 
> Its just like a new car, you like it for a while then you get tired of it after a while or at least the thrill is gone than what you had at first. Those that do upgrade to like the pvr systems or upgrade in programing have a renewed thrill but not as long lived bc they get used to all of that just like they did the satellite system.
> 
> In other words people get SPOILED, and this is what happens with some of my customers. *


I'm curious, what would you do if the problem was yours???

As of late, I see Dan being amazingly patient. He gives many many warnings in an attempt not to ban, yet a couple (and I repeat) only a couple of people get out of hand. 
(Admins forums should go...just provide an admin email address)

Right now I know of one bigtime flamer, who kind of makes up DBS history as fact and promotes his adjusted facts, while another repeatedly choices to take the bait and argues with him seemingly endlessly. Banning my not be a nice thing but in some cases it is indicated.

Arrogant moderators??? Maybe? Maybe not?

Ya gotta remember, these guys are our peers. They're into this stuff too. When you get a strangely confident poster promoting BS, sometimes bluntness sends a stronger message than an emotionless cover-note. Most of the moderators are aware of most of the happenings in DBS and respond confident of their knowledge.

I think Arizona John misses the "nitch" aspect of the industry. He started out as a C-Band guy on a less-frequent traveled interrnet. It was a much more purely tech enviornment in those days(93-94). Now we have every Tom, Dick, and Harry surfing the net. Tech talk is strongly drown under product loyalty.

I think DBSForums is aggressively trying to strive for that original flavor. Perhaps an "anything goes" forum is needed to let folks decompress??? 
Hey, isn't that why DBSTalk sprang up?

I want to add that there is still LOTS to talk about. Both DBS providers now have large fleets of satellites. How they deals with locals has been interesting. After years I have found my "comfort zone" with DirecTIVO...and new receivers are still trickling out.

Perhaps the merger has put people on edge, but naturally so. Some has chosen move out to the land where beta testing is NOT a dream. Folks have to be a little open minded...DirecTV subs are justified by the premise of don't fix what ain't broken. DirecTV is happening right now. This is not a knock at E*, it just pointing out the result of good competition. Yeah, cable is the bad guy, but consumers absolutely DO benefit from the existence of ~2~ providers. The merger may end up being the best thing to happen to cableTV in years if the involved parties aren't careful.


----------



## Guest

Only 2 more days to the start of the big satellite URL auction on EBay - starting April 25


----------



## Neil Derryberry

I guess I live under a rock.... what are you talking about?


----------



## Geronimo

All internet forums have problems. I was a moderator in another forum for awhile and the smallest things can be hotly contested. 

DBS Forums actually tries to tone town the controversy. Sometimes those efforts backfire (like the real name rule which has encouraged far more flaming than it discouraged) but it it is still a good source of info. I am glad there are two sources of info there.

But is it true that DBSTalk is trying to buy DBSForums and devote a forum to every local station in the country?


Just kidding.


----------



## stephen_M

Hey, I had DBS withdrawals. How's everyone???!!

Friendly neighborhood DBS Forums mod,
Stephen_M


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

:thats: Good one Geronimo.

We all (Dbstalk and Dbsforums) try our best. Sometimes our ideas are not the best and they do backfire. But hey we are human and we do screw up from time to time. (And if you include my spelling / typing that is most of the time)


----------



## Bob Haller

Well I KNOW that at least when I was there some of the problems were caused by moderators INTENTIONALLY working to tick off posters. Dan is well aware of this and was in on it. I dont know if it was still occuring, since I rarely visit there. On a interesting note, me lifetrime banned am a moderator for a HUGH websute/ Funny ?

Oh well this too shall pass....


----------



## John Hodgson

Boy do I wish I could let sleeping dogs lie ....

Is this the type of unfounded, slanderous, libel, and downright dastardly remarks the Admin and Mods allow at this site? 

An no, it's not funny that you're a moderator at a HUGE website.
Is it perhaps that at this website topics are being discussed that you happen to know something about for a change? 

You see, I'm a moderator at a HUGE website as well, but since I don't know anything about the subject being discussed anymore , I don't post.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hey I think the word dastardly is a cool word. 

And I am sorry for being slanderous when I say I like DBSforums :grin: 

Keep us informed John


----------



## stephen_M

> _Originally posted by Bob Haller _
> *Well I KNOW that at least when I was there some of the problems were caused by moderators INTENTIONALLY working to tick off posters. *


Hello, Bob. Stephen_M from the other place lurking here while repairs are being done....and your quote above is an absolute falsehood!

Have a nice day!


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Ok, everyone...take a deep breath...  dastardly - I like that!

John, I assume that you were unsuccessful rebooting the server last night remotely?


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Bob (and Stephen_M and John) and everyone else who remembers this anceient history.

:soapbox: (Admin Hat off)

No need to stir the pot of things that happened in the past, from where I sit mistakes were made on all sides. I feel it is time to let it go, what happened happened, it's time to move on from these unfortunate happenings.

I like Bob hes a good guy with a good heart, I like John he got a certain wit that most folks dont understand, but if most folks took the time to understand him you would find that he is one good funny sob. I like Dan, I consider him a DBS technology genious.

I am not trying to offend anyone with my statements, just my point of view from where I sit. We all have the share some of the same interests, let bygones be bygones and let move ahead together.


----------



## John Hodgson

Correct - no luck in remotely rebooting the server. It's gotta wait until the 'man' gets back home.

[crybaby bed wetter mode on]
Wah! Bob brought it up!!!! (again) Wah!
[crybaby bed wetter mode off]

I'll do my best to grow up and act like the adult I'm supposed to be. Seriously Admins and Mods, I'll tone it down.


----------



## Jeff McClellan

Its starting to feel alot like home here. One cracked egg, spoils the whole carton.


----------



## Chris Blount

Jeff,

I like your signature. Excellent for stirring up trouble. 


John,

Why do I get the feeling that you were the "DBS Pundit" in a previous life.


----------



## Jeff McClellan

Dont worry, I wont here. I will behave. I wouldnt want to get banned on my second day of being registered.


----------



## Steve Mehs

Welcome to DBSTalk, Stephen :hi:

Jeff, I just noticed theres a typo in your sig, just to let you know. We would ban you on your second day


----------



## Guest

I have started a 1 area no moving topics DBS discussion forum. Hope to see you all there. Post on any topic DBS related, including TV, radio (satellite and/or am/fm), BUD satellite.

NO REGISTERING REQUIRED TO POST!

Site Name:
DBS zone
web address is:
http://pub34.ezboard.com/fdbszonefr1


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Unregistered.

First off Ezboard (ugg) Good luck over there. (We use to be on there too many problems)

Second please don't spam our board with your ads. If you had registered first it would be a little better, but just coming here to spam is not cool.

However with that being said, We wish you the best of luck with your board.


----------



## Mark Lamutt

Mr. UnR.,

If you are for real, then you need to fix your link, and I also wish you luck with your board. If not, and you are lampooning us for starting this site 9 months ago, then :lol: See, we're pretty good-natured around here, and can laugh along with you.


----------



## Frapp

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Unregistered.
> 
> First off Ezboard (ugg) Good luck over there. (We use to be on there too many problems)
> 
> Second please don't spam our board with your ads. If you had registered first it would be a little better, but just coming here to spam is not cool.
> 
> However with that being said, We wish you the best of luck with your board. *


Very well put ..............

Scott,

It would appear that you guys have formulated the best DBS board ( and the nicest looking ) on the net !

Congrats,
Frapp


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks Frapp, Welcome! :hi:


----------



## Mike

> _Originally posted by JEFF M _
> *Dont worry, I wont here. I will behave. I wouldnt want to get banned on my second day of being registered. *


Yes,. please get banned. We don't want your psychological behavior at this site!


----------



## Jeff McClellan

Thanks Steve. Oh hey Mike. Good to hear from you. Sorry I couldnt make it to your barbecue last weekend, I was having another treatment.


----------



## John Hodgson

Strange you guys don't seem to remember dbszone ... guess there aren't that many 'ole timers' reading this thread.

Mike sez:
" Yes,. please get banned. We don't want your psychological behavior at this site!" Not a smilie face in sight so I guess this
is a flame directed towards Jeff_M. Sigh, I guess my six week prediction should have been one week.

Chris, Scott, et all, ban me now please as I realize I can not
conduct myself in a positive manner and am becomming something of a troublemaker. Guys, realize it or not, the worst is yet to come.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I was on a lot of satellite boards back in the old days. I was a C/KU Band user so while I visited DBS boards I did not follow everything they did. 

No John we will not ban you sorry, but we can suggest that you go with Jeff M for a treatment 

Thanks to all the DBSforums staff for hanging out here while you wait for Dan to hit that reboot switch.


----------



## Guest

> _Originally posted by Unregistered _
> *Chris-
> Your RULES are good rules don't get me wrong. But no one can OVERIDE the constitution of the United States. NO ONE! Not even Uncle Sam. Your house could be shut down if you get sued from the ACLU for having RULES that go against the US Consitution.
> 
> Why are these forums all controlled by power hungry, nazi like people?
> 
> So what if someone swears read it throw it out of your minds and get on with life. Any way just trying to show that in a legal manner this forum and others are taking away a right guarenteed to all in the USA.
> 
> Sorry to be thinking so patriotically. *


And if it is illegal then why hasn't the ACLU that you are waving at everybody gone after the Networks for their censorship of talk shows language... TV & Radio both... radio censors callers, and the TV shows are edited for content including movies.

Bye


----------



## Pete K.

I was growing old, gray and bald waiting for
DBS Forums to retu...Wait! I'm growing old,
gray and bald anyway.
Funny thing, the hard drive on my PVR 501 
died the same day the Forums went down.
Coincidence? I think not!


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Hmm was your hard drive hosting DBSforums? :lol:

Just kidding.

The plot thickens.

Welcome Pete! :hi:


----------



## Neil Derryberry

That's great, unregistered... I'm sure Dan is glad you made sure to post his name, address and phone number.


----------



## EvanS

what IS up with that?
tell me it's a joke with phony info


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Folks no more posting peoples personal information. I am now deleting post which contain the someone personal info.

I am sure you folks posting this stuff would want your info posted.

Again, yes we know the info is available on the Internet and is easily obtainable, we just don't want that stuff posted here.

Thanks


----------



## Geronimo

I agree. this was WAY over the line. I do not even want my NAME on the net (and yes I know you can get it) but this is over the edge. If Mr. Collins wanted this posted he would post it himself. It is not up to others to do it.


----------



## Mike

> _Originally posted by John Hodgson _
> *Strange you guys don't seem to remember dbszone ... guess there aren't that many 'ole timers' reading this thread.
> 
> Mike sez:
> " Yes,. please get banned. We don't want your psychological behavior at this site!" Not a smilie face in sight so I guess this
> is a flame directed towards Jeff_M. Sigh, I guess my six week prediction should have been one week.
> 
> Chris, Scott, et all, ban me now please as I realize I can not
> conduct myself in a positive manner and am becomming something of a troublemaker. Guys, realize it or not, the worst is yet to come. *


 HOW'S THAT! A smiley face wasn't intended. The dude is whacked out of his mind. This was a great site until the mods/former mods and anyone else in mod land over there came over here. .


----------



## Mike

You see what I mean. You mods here are relying on info from the mods there now to function. Just as predicted yesterday. Don't let this happen! It's a great site. You shouldn't need people in Glendale telling the folks here how to run the site. Jeff needs help! We know that. Bob is right. The mods do intentinally start fights. It's a proven fact. If the site had any backlog info then I'd show you.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Mike,

Things should _hopefully_ get back to normal once DBSforums is back online.

Honestly there not trying to start trouble, doing this for so long you get a warped sense of humor.


----------



## Mike

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *Mike,
> 
> Things should hopefully get back to normal once DBSforums is back online.
> 
> Honestly there not trying to start trouble, doing this for so long you get a warped sense of humor.  *


I like John. He seems like a nice guy. Saw him once on Dish Network, but the mods from there are turning the ship. I can see it. All of the unregstered posts have me questioning the validity of the site especially since those posts are kind of strange. I'm getting worried about the site. Sports forum may be the only safe hangout again.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

I agree some are strange.

Hang in there Mike


----------



## James_F

> _Originally posted by Geronimo _
> *I agree. this was WAY over the line. I do not even want my NAME on the net (and yes I know you can get it) but this is over the edge. If Mr. Collins wanted this posted he would post it himself. It is not up to others to do it. *


Guys calm down. All that was posted what a "whois" search. Go to http://www.netsol.com/cgi-bin/whois/whois . I know its easy to find out info on the web, but why not? Its an open system... But I get off of the topic...

BTW... Scott, Great site....


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks James we are trying Hard.

As far as Dan's personal info being posted here, agreed the info is easily available, but I dont feel we need to smeer it all over the place. Dan is not here to defend himself on anything so its better just to remove the stuff.

Welcome to DBStalk.COM James :hi:


----------



## James_F

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *As far as Dan's personal info being posted here, agreed the info is easily available, but I dont feel we need to smeer it all over the place. *


Agreed, but people have to realize how easy it is to get info about this stuff. You guys log every IP address and can do a reverse lookup to see where the post was written. Thats all I want to say on that subject.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

We already did and found it "quite" interesting 

I feel like a cop after an accident which has been cleaned up.
Move on folks theres nothing to look at.


----------



## James_F

> _Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski _
> *We already did and found it "quite" interesting *


I thought you might :blush:


----------



## Win Joy Jr

> _Originally posted by Edward E Suleski _
> *Chris what do you think of the united states constitution and namely the bill of rights? *


Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Chris -

And what does it have to do with DBSTalk?


----------



## jegrant

Why can't more people develop a mental spam filter?

If someone does or says something you find irritating, the best response is to avoid them and avoid reading their posts. Preferably, do so without publicly indicating it. If the person is truly undesirable, everyone will eventually ignore them and there is no reason to waste more bandwidth trying to convince people.

If this person does something that is legally or morally questionable, or appears to violate a forum's terms of service (at ANY forum), contact the administrators and/or moderators. Unless you *are* an administrator or moderator, don't take it upon yourself to enforce such rules. The only time it would be acceptable to do so is if there is a direct immediate genuine threat to life or property, and then you still shouldn't attempt to handle it yourself - it should be passed on to the appropriate law enforcement agency.

Something else to keep in mind is that although most forum operators certainly aren't opposed to a reasonable exercise of free speech - most forums are private property, at least on the internet. This means free speech is a privilege you have, to the extent that the owners and maintainers of the property allow it. On the other hand, if there is a forum somewhere that was hosted on a government server (www.whinewhinewhine.gov)  - THEN you would be accorded the right to free speech, as guaranteed by our laws and heritage.

In any case, even in the world of private forums, there is absolutely nothing stopping anyone from having their own forum, that they own and control, to say whatever they like. It is completely possible to buy your own domain name and web hosting account and install forum software, or simply start an EZBoard or something similar.


----------



## JBKing

Well, at least posts have picked up around here! (somewhat sarcastically)


----------



## TNGTony

What did you say? I can't hear you over the static! 

See ya
Tony


----------



## Sherlock

Scott, from a previous post where you got on your soap box, you forgot to step down from the box and put your moderator hat back on.

Jeff M, another treatment? Should we start calling you sparky?

John, I understand. Some folks just seem to endlessly ask for it. The worst is yet to come? Are you speaking of my anticipation of the worst to come from DBS, or are you speaking from a more personal perspective?


----------



## Jacob S

I remember pom poms, hehe. Anyways I look at it this way, what good is the arguing doing? None at all, it dont solve any problems but just causes them. I am sure there are better things to do than to argue. If there was a forum where anything when then people would get spoiled on that thought and being so used to anything goes it would happen here as well. 

It is good to have forums that are moderated to where you can have some decent discussions without the topic getting off topic and keeping things on track and things being put where they belong. Thats what makes the forums what they are and the moderates help a lot in bringing that about. We the people as a whole make up the forums, just as the people in the church make up the church, not the building itself.


----------



## Jeff McClellan

Hey John, keep on posting here, Chris and Scott have done pretty good. People like Mike are ok to. The ironic thing is he is a tad bit out of touch. The reality is that in the last 6 months, I have only posted 3 toimes in open forums at dbsforums. So the guy is living in the past. Now for some good news..... Mike, Darren called me and asked if I would take over moderating the sports forum, isnt that great. (fake smile). 
Scott, no more posts from me as you guys welcomed me, and I dont need any battles right now,,,,hmmmmmm, but I do think I need to be more active when Dan gets the site back up,


----------



## Mike

> _Originally posted by JEFF M _
> *Mike, Darren called me and asked if I would take over moderating the sports forum, isnt that great. (fake smile).
> Scott, no more posts from me as you guys welcomed me, and I dont need any battles right now,,,,hmmmmmm, but I do think I need to be more active when Dan gets the site back up, *


:crying: :blush:


----------



## Sandy

> _Originally posted by JEFF M _
> * I do think I need to be more active when Dan gets the site back up, *


I think that is a great idea!:righton: 
:goodjob:

Sandy


----------



## Marcus S

Dan is home, don't everyone rush out the door at the same time, fire codes and such.. However, I will be back here frequently now that I know about dbstalk.


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks Gang.

I am glad to see DBSforums back online.


----------



## Edward E Suleski

> _Originally posted by Win Joy Jr _
> *
> 
> Amendment I
> Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
> 
> Chris -
> 
> And what does it have to do with DBSTalk? *


It could be that no one has the legal right to interfere or stop us, we the citizens of this great country from expressing our viewpoint no matter how controversial, I am not endorsing the prolific use of profanity but if anyone starts telling us what we can type or what we can't ,my question to you is where will it stop?But I agree not to be to political in my correspondence on these forums,I don't want to get people needlessly upset.


----------



## Win Joy Jr

Edward – 

READ the First Amendment. Scott and the others OWN this forum. They can set whatever rules they wish covering what can and cannot be posted. If you do not like them, you are free to seek out a forum that shares your views, or even create on of your own. Like it or not, this is private property. If the owners do not like what I am posting, it is well within their right to edit it or delete it. The can even revoke my posting privlidges, if they should so choose. 

Do you believe that if someone invites you into their home, and you start topics of conversation that the owners are uncomfortable with, that they cannot ask you to end the conversation, or leave their property? Would you threaten them with a lawsuit? Would you have any standing to do so?

Do you not believe your employer can limit what you can and cannot say in the workplace?

Newspapers edit letters to the editors all the time, and choose not to print letters all the time. Are they infringing on the First Amendment? How is DBSTalk different than a newspaper?

You have the freedom of speech. You do NOT have a right to be heard by those who choose not to listen to you. No have no right to force a third party to publish your messages.

Threats made upthread by unregistered parties about ACLU lawsuits are laughable, and show that the poster has no clue about the law or the constitution...


----------



## Scott Greczkowski

Thanks Win Joy, I dont own DBStalk, Chris does, I am just a volunteer here 

I agree with everything you said above.

No reason to really debate this any further, and DBSforums is back online so I wll close this thread as there is no point to it anymore.

That being said however our members are welcome to discuss the free speach debate in our Potpourri area if they want.

Thanks


----------

