# Hate to admit it but the PQ is great on the R15



## tall1 (Aug 9, 2005)

The PQ on the R15 is excellent, much better than on my R10 DTivo; there I said it.

I really hate the R15 in it's current state so it is difficult for me to mention anything positive about the R15. But I was using the R15 on my Sammy 50" DLP and was really impressed with the PQ until I just couldn't stand the horses*** transport functions anymore and swapped it with the R10 in the bedroom which has a Sharp Aquos LCD 32". The R15 PQ looks awesome on that display as well.

I may never be able to truly embrace the R15 because I have little to no confidence that it will have the overshoot autocorrection and/or the 30 sec skip but the PQ is a step up at least.


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## DesignDawg (Jan 8, 2006)

I have to say it's a little sharper than my UlitmateTV as well. In my case, it was actually a little "too much better", as it was much sharper, and I actually had to turn the sharpness all the way down on my TV to hide the compression artifacts. They all have the exact same artifacts, but they have differing outputs. The R15 is no doubt the sharpest output of all the receivers I have (a UTV, a DTiVo, and the R15). But, like you, I can't stand the flakiness right now. When it improves, it'll be a heck of a unit.

Ricky


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

Have you noticed that in general Scifi's PQ has gone down and it seems a little blurry. Don't think it's my dish because it only seems to be on scifi. But besides that I do agree that the picture seems a little better.


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

SciFi's has gone through the CRAPPER....

I have noticed that VERY much this past week, watching some of the repeats of Stargate SG1

That is accross all types of recievers (not just the R15)


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

I swear some nights the bandwidth allocated to SCI-FI is less than zero.....


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## 430970 (Nov 21, 2005)

You might add that the $$$ allocated to SciFi's original pictures is less than zero (judging by the quality).

I remember getting Sci-Fi on my cable line-up back in 94 (if memory serves) and being really excited. It's a lot less exciting these days.


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

I'm glad it's not just me with Scifi. I watched the rerun of the Triangle and the picture was just horrible not to mention the blurriness of what I watch Sci-fi for on Friday SG1, SGA, and BSG. So is this just a D* thing? or is it Sci-fi in general?


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

Anyone care to do some screen caps so we can see this (the R15 versus R10 issue, not the Sci-Fi issue)? Is it just in comparison to the R10 (which a lot of people have had a problem with), or is it all DTiVo models? My R10 is on a 19" in the bedroom, so the weakest link in that is definitely the TV. I'm overall happy with the HDVR2 in the living room, but it's just a SD 32" tube, so I'd be only marginally more demanding there than in the other room.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

I don't have an R10 operational but I do have HDVR2's. I've never seen any bad PQ from a DTivo but then again I've never seen the PQ from an R15.

I can post screen caps from a HDVR2 for comparison but if we're going to compare these we should set a standard for the cap software/quality and methods. I've got MS Media Center and an HP receiver for Media Center. I don't think MC can capture but I could be wrong there.

walters: Would you like to define the parms?

Here's one example. This was the display via Media Center, not full screen, captured on the clipboard via CTL/ALT/PRT SCRN then pasted into Photo Impact and saved as .jpg. I'm guessing alot of the Q portion can get lost depending on the capture method and resolution.










Does anyone have an R15 connected to a "HP Dual TV Tuner/Digital Video Recorder" unit with MS Media Center? If so, could you follow the same process I did and post your results?


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Just to note to others:

That screen image is from a "tweaked" HDVR2

(The DVR:MasterBedrom and DVR:FamilyRoom) line items are not available to STOCK DTivos


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

ebonovic said:


> Just to note to others:
> 
> That screen image is from a "tweaked" HDVR2
> 
> (The DVR:MasterBedrom and DVR:FamilyRoom) line items are not available to STOCK DTivos


Correct. Also the folders. I neglected mentioning that. Sorry.


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

Off Topic, but....

:rant: 

As Earl pointed out the screen cap I posted kinda missed the point of PQ and highlighted the point that DTV crippled the DTivos from the beginning.

The DTivos have the code to do MRV, Folders, many of the things regular Tivos can do but DTV, for some reason said no.

Keep in mind that MRV, folders and HMO play not part in anything that could be viewed as violating "content" or "copyrights".

My RANT here is that if DTV disabled software already working in Tivos, So easy to enable that even simpletons like myself can do it, what can we really expect DTV to deliver with their own DVRs?

Don't tell me that customers don't want MRV, don't tell me that customers don't want folders, don't tell me that customers don't want HMO. With the DTivo units DTV turned those features, already available in the Tivo software, off.

Now DTV is trying to re-invent the DVR wheel. So far, kinda a square wheel, but a start at reinventing something that already exists.

The way DTV has handled their current and past DVR products is just plain sad.

:backtotop


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## DesignDawg (Jan 8, 2006)

DirecTiVos have folders by default.

Ricky


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

DesignDawg said:


> DirecTiVos have folders by default.
> 
> Ricky


Only those that have been upgraded to 6.x

To Wolfe: I wasn't picking on the screen shot... I just didn't want future generations to come across your post (via google), and go... hey ... Mine doesn't look like that.

:balloons:


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## Wolffpack (Jul 29, 2003)

I agree completely Earl. No problem.

So how 'bout one of those...there....new fangled R15 screen shots that are so much better? Anyone?

EDIT: I took care of that problem. Now it's just DTV Central.


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## DesignDawg (Jan 8, 2006)

To really compare, I think we need to see the exact same picture, captured with the exact same cables into the exact same capturing device. Too many variable otherwise, even with compression of the stills for the web. Anecdotal evidence should be enough here. There's a lot of talk about the R10 being fuzzier than other DTiVos. It's most certainly much cheaper, flimsier, etc. But even then, as I said, I had my DVR39 hooked up to my living room TV for awhile while my UTV was at work, and the PQ seemed about the same. The PQ is much sharper with the R15, to the point of the edges almost "singing", and the compression artifacts are much more noticeable.

Ricky


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

I can't say the picture is any better then other models.. (R15 vs R10 specifically).

But as always PQ... Is in the eyes of the viewer...

PS: I should sneak in a screen shot from the H20 (since it's menus look VERY similar).... !devil12:


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## Malibu13 (Sep 12, 2004)

The OP was only stating his belief that the PQ on his R15 was better (in his opinion) than that of his R10. Let's not take this thread into a discussion on ways to dispute his belief with comparison "screenshots".


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## Earl Bonovich (Nov 15, 2005)

Donnie Byrd said:


> The OP was only stating his belief that the PQ on his R15 was better (in his opinion) than that of his R10. Let's not take this thread into a discussion on ways to dispute his belief with comparison "screenshots".


Please let me sneak an H20 screen shot in... Please......
:angel:

PS: I love some of the other Emoticons....


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## Malibu13 (Sep 12, 2004)

:nono: Earl, put it in the "HD Forum" and we'll all come look at it.


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## walters (Nov 18, 2005)

Donnie Byrd said:


> The OP was only stating his belief that the PQ on his R15 was better (in his opinion) than that of his R10. Let's not take this thread into a discussion on ways to dispute his belief with comparison "screenshots".


I'm not looking to dispute his belief. I just want to see what he's talking about. Just trying to discuss the topic, you know, because that's what you do on a discussion forum.

If anyone is still interested as I am, I was thinking ideally it would be the same frame from actual program material. Menus are mostly useless since it depends on the font , color scheme, etc (incidentally, menus are where the R10 gets the most complaints versus the earlier DirecTiVo models). It would be nice if the test were "blind" (put any identifiers in spoiler tags that one can look at once they decide which one is "better").


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

walters said:


> It would be nice if the test were "blind" (put any identifiers in spoiler tags that one can look at once they decide which one is "better").


Or better yet post the pictures and wait a day or too for people to post on which one they think looks better and then post spoiler tags 1-2 days later.


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## Rondo1 (Jan 4, 2003)

cabanaboy1977 said:


> I'm glad it's not just me with Scifi. I watched the rerun of the Triangle and the picture was just horrible not to mention the blurriness of what I watch Sci-fi for on Friday SG1, SGA, and BSG. So is this just a D* thing? or is it Sci-fi in general?


I have Dish Network and Sci-Fi is by far the worst PQ of any other channel. Naturally this sucks because I'm am glued to my Friday Night SciFi.


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

Rondo1 said:


> I have Dish Network and Sci-Fi is by far the worst PQ of any other channel. Naturally this sucks because I'm am glued to my Friday Night SciFi.


Yeah i'm there with you, can't wait for Fridays either. What's worst is that i record it to dvd for my parents and It looks even worse. I'm thing about just waiting and downloading them from the torrent sites and burning from those instead.


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## kay (Nov 27, 2005)

I must say the quality on my R15's is absolutely stunning compared to my D11's


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## ajseagles3 (Feb 17, 2006)

It's hard to appreciate the picture quality when none of your shows record as scheduled.


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## Rondo1 (Jan 4, 2003)

cabanaboy1977 said:


> Yeah i'm there with you, can't wait for Fridays either. What's worst is that i record it to dvd for my parents and It looks even worse. I'm thing about just waiting and downloading them from the torrent sites and burning from those instead.


Well here's something for you. It seems that the UNIVERSAL HD channel shows Battlestar Galactica in HD!!!!!! WOW! :eek2: Did anyone else know this? Looks like Dish Network carries this channel in their new HD lineup. Couldn't find it on DirecTV. Very - very - interesting find......


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## khajath (Feb 18, 2006)

Pic looks awesome, especially when using S-Video cable.


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

Rondo1 said:


> Well here's something for you. It seems that the UNIVERSAL HD channel shows Battlestar Galactica in HD!!!!!! WOW! :eek2: Did anyone else know this? Looks like Dish Network carries this channel in their new HD lineup. Couldn't find it on DirecTV. Very - very - interesting find......


Now that would be cool. I couldn't see paying 10.99 for the 5 HD channels that D offers but I "might" thinking about it for that.


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

Rondo1 said:


> Well here's something for you. It seems that the UNIVERSAL HD channel shows Battlestar Galactica in HD!!!!!! WOW! :eek2: Did anyone else know this? Looks like Dish Network carries this channel in their new HD lineup. Couldn't find it on DirecTV. Very - very - interesting find......


Its on Sunday evening every week....Channel 74 Its been carried by D* for quite awhile....the BG episodes are about a season or so behind....but it does look fabulous in HD...and the HD package price goes down to $9.99 starting Mar 1.


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## cabanaboy1977 (Nov 16, 2005)

CCarncross said:


> Its on Sunday evening every week....Channel 74 Its been carried by D* for quite awhile....the BG episodes are about a season or so behind....but it does look fabulous in HD...and the HD package price goes down to $9.99 starting Mar 1.


It's nice that it went down but I still can't see paying that for 5 channels and they are going to have to give them to us at some point. Because all stations will be putting out HD sometime, right?


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## CCarncross (Jul 19, 2005)

cabanaboy1977 said:


> It's nice that it went down but I still can't see paying that for 5 channels and they are going to have to give them to us at some point. Because all stations will be putting out HD sometime, right?


All stations wont be HD for years...They dont even have to be digital until 2009, which is still completetly different than being in HD.....The list of National HD channels is still pretty small, there is no FX HD, USA HD, SCI-FI HD, you name it, they dont even exist yet.....if it wasnt for VOOM, there wouldnt be anywhere near as many HD channels out there to even potentially get.....

I think D* has 7 HD's for that $9.99 currently, and if you subscribe to Showtime and HBO, you get 2 more.....it'll ge there slowly but surely....

D* seems to be pushing to get all their LiL HDs up and running....


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## mkmhr (Jan 25, 2006)

I would like to point out the number 1 reason for shows not recording.

There is a close relationship between the prioritizor and the typre of recording scenario you are setting up. If you choose the option to record "all epsiodes", depending on the program, there could be as much as 99 of them available in this guides 2 week info capability. The higher priority you have it set on will now take into consideration the disk space that will then be available thus actually canceling certain recordings scheduled during that same time. Best advice, watch the prioritizor, and if you set up any series links make sure it's not a show that plays 30 times a day. (very popular and common with the ladies shows that air 10000000000000000000000000 times a day  anyway hope that helps out somebody.


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## zortapa (Nov 16, 2005)

Regarding PQ, I, too, have been very impressed with the PQ on the R15. I just purchased an H20 for my parents. Before installing it for them, I hooked it up to my SD Toshiba. With the H20 resolution set at 480i and using component cables, the H20 PQ is pretty poor compared to my R15 using an S-video cable. I had expected them to be about the same......


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## morgantown (Nov 16, 2005)

I see no PQ difference between my DirecTiVos and R15. Heck, the PQ on my original (non-DVR) reciever from the 90's is the same as the R15 too. It is all the same feed. 

How on earth could the R15 make the DTV feed any "better?"


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

morgantown said:


> How on earth could the R15 make the DTV feed any "better?"


Its the PARTS inside the units that differ.


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## zortapa (Nov 16, 2005)

... and the way they are connected to the TV (e.g., composite, component, S-video, HDMI/DVI).
... and, perhaps, whether or not the signals are passed through/upconverted by an AV receiver.


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## morgantown (Nov 16, 2005)

Bobman said:


> Its the PARTS inside the units that differ.


Perception is reality, I would not dispute that. But the PQ of either in the same circumstance :nono: .


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## Bobman (Jan 3, 2006)

morgantown said:


> But the PQ of either in the same circumstance.


Its how people see it. If people remember when the R-10 was first released some swore the screens appeared fuzzier than other models of DirecTiVos and others said there was no difference.


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## morgantown (Nov 16, 2005)

Bobman said:


> Its how people see it. If people remember when the R-10 was first released some swore the screens appeared fuzzier than other models of DirecTiVos and others said there was no difference.


Very true.


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## Clint Lamor (Nov 15, 2005)

morgantown said:


> Perception is reality, I would not dispute that. But the PQ of either in the same circumstance :nono: .


Actually the quality of the components can change the output quite drastic.


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