# Why Is SSN required ?



## dishcrazie (Jan 4, 2005)

Why would dishnetwork want our SSN? I don't see the point. 
They said they won't activate withouth a SSN. That is ridiculous. 
Anyway to avoid that?
thx


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

dishcrazie said:


> Why would dishnetwork want our SSN? I don't see the point.
> They said they won't activate withouth a SSN. That is ridiculous.
> Anyway to avoid that?
> thx


Dish Network evaluates your credit score. It's called credit worthiness verification. Basically they only want customers who respect their contracts and will pay their bills in a timely manner. The actual criteria is a secret, but they do run your credit score, Echostar is listed as a utility with Equifax. You can pay $50 and only give up the last 4 of your S.S. # if you want. No way to avoid that though.


----------



## HTguy (May 7, 2002)

It's not ridiculous from their point of view. 

DirecTV is doing the same thing.

In addition to the credit check it's also a means of identifying you. 

They've been burned too many times by people bailing out early, owing money, and then trying to set themselves up again as "new" customers.


----------



## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

DirecTv has been doing it for longer than Dish Network has. Dish Network tried a while back but quit having it as a requirement for a while but then started requiring it for each new subscriber. You can pay $200 to avoid giving them your social security number. A lot of people have made up names, addresses, and phone numbers to try to get the special promotions only available for new subscribers from time to time.


----------



## JM Anthony (Nov 16, 2003)

It will be a cold day in hell before I give out our SSN, or Gus' for that matter. I suspect they can find all the information out on my credit worthiness without it.


----------



## finniganps (Jan 23, 2004)

When I joined E* in 1999, SSN was NOT required.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Jacob S said:


> You can pay $200 to avoid giving them your social security number.


Actually, it's $50....the $200 is to get a DHA without a credit card.

Actually, E* uses the SSN so they can report you to the credit bearus if you don't pay your bill. Better get used to it, because everyone is trying to do this.


----------



## lazaruspup (Mar 18, 2005)

Working in wireless, you can get nowhere without a social security number. As for everyone who is worried about identity theft, it's more of a myth than anything. Even if you did have a social, you would need mounds more information to get anywhere with most companies when it comes to credit theft, subscriber fraud, etc. I have to laugh at customers who whisper their social to you when you ask before you run a credit check for a new subscriber. It has become the ultimate taboo to actual say it out loud it seems. I think it's all rather ridiculous. If you are that worried, buy a credit monitoring service and be careful of your mail... most thieves can do more with your mail than with your social.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

lazaruspup said:


> ...If you are that worried, buy a credit monitoring service and be careful of your mail... most thieves can do more with your mail than with your social.


I agree, most people that don't want to give their SS# to company that they know is legitimate are either paranoid or have terrible credit.


----------



## DishDude1 (Apr 13, 2002)

With someone's name and address, you can pull their credit report and on it...SSN! The SSN is simply used as an identifier to sort through all the "Smiths" and "Williams" etc.


----------



## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> Actually, it's $50....the $200 is to get a DHA without a credit card.


Beg to differ. It *IS* $200 with no SSN. And that does *NOT* count toward your programming charges. If you give them the last four digits, it is $49.99. BUT, they can still refuse you on that basis and ask for the full $200.00.

Believe me, I know. I just bought a brand new system with a Dish 500, installed it myself and called to activate. DISH refused to accept my four digits and insisted on the $200. I offered to pay the full year in advance on my credit card and they said no. I told them to go fly a kite.

I already have DirecTV and DID NOT have to give my SSN. DirecTV charged me $50 up front, but that was credited against my programming.

DISH is out to lunch.


----------



## Bill R (Dec 20, 2002)

KingLoop said:


> I agree, most people that don't want to give their SS# to company that they know is legitimate are either paranoid or have terrible credit.


Or, in the case of some people, they are in this country illegally or have some other "reason" (like hiding from the law using an "assumed" identity) for not giving out their SSN.

As mentioned, in many parts of the country, it is not possible to set up a new account with a public utility (phone, gas, electric, water), cell phone provider, cable company and many other companies if you don't provide your SSN.

The DBS companies are just doing what everyone else is doing (CYA). Nothing wrong with that. There are a lot of deadbeats out there.


----------



## lazaruspup (Mar 18, 2005)

Bill R said:


> As mentioned, in many parts of the country, it is not possible to set up a new account with a public utility (phone, gas, electric, water), cell phone provider and many other companies if you don't provide your SSN.


That's absolutely true. I have worked for two nationwide carriers in wireless and carrier #1 would give you service without your social ONLY if you faxed their credit department a copy of your birth certificate or certificate of naturalization AND a recent utility bill in your name showing your current address. Carrier #2 would not under any circumstances extend you service without a social security number. Now in California this is currently changing and I believe there are bills in progress that would outlaw the practice of refusing service based on the presence of a SS. I say, why worry, I pay my 3.00 a month or so for credit monitoring, so I know what happens with my financials when and where it happens.


----------



## Rick_R (Sep 1, 2004)

The poster that said Identity Theft is a myth is wrong. I have a friend (Ex Wife actually) who when someone got her SSN and Drivers license number that person went down to Hollywood Blvd and got a drivers licence and SS card made with the other persons picture on the drivers licence ($100 on the black market). They used this to rent an appartment and get medical care all over the place at emergency rooms. When they couldn't pay the apartment rent they declared bankrupcy in my Ex-es name. This allowed them to stay for 6 months rent free.

My ex found out later and took many 100's of hours and $1000s of dollors clearing her credit reports. She still has a bankrupcy on her record that she can not remove.

Rick R


----------



## Bill R (Dec 20, 2002)

Rick_R said:


> My ex found out later and took many 100's of hours and $1000s of dollors clearing her credit reports. She still has a bankrupcy on her record that she can not remove.
> 
> Rick R


Rick,

It is true that identity thief is becoming a big problem but giving your SSN to legitimate companies is not what is causing it. Being careless about your personal information and not properly destroying personal information usually is the cause.

And as for your statement, _"she still has a bankruptcy on her record that she can not remove"_ is not correct. Apparently, she (or her attorney) just hasn't done the proper paperwork. If you do a little research you will find that the false bankruptcy can be expunged from her credit report.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

peano said:


> Beg to differ. It *IS* $200 with no SSN. And that does *NOT* count toward your programming charges. If you give them the last four digits, it is $49.99. BUT, they can still refuse you on that basis and ask for the full $200.00.


Considering that I run claims for E* almost daily, I know for a fact that it is $49.99. Also, I have no conrol over WHAT 4 digits are given to me, and considering just how many duplicate last 4 digits there are, I can't imagine that it would matter what 4 digits you give them. I have never heard of a $200 deposit for not giving any info, but considering that there is no way to verify the last 4 digits, I can't see what it would matter if you were to just make something up. Considering that you could rip off well over $200 worth of programming before they deactivate you, or that you could keep several hundred dollars of equipment from their lease program, I don't blame them 1 bit. As for identity theft, I have extremely ****ty credit, so I don't anything to worry about. Steal my info. Big deal. When I want to buy something online, I go to my local mall and get a VISA gift card for up to $500. Costs me $1.50, and I through it away when it's empty. Nothing to lose......


----------



## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

In the olden days... you were actually instructed NOT to give out your Social Security Number. It originally was just that... your social security number... tied to that chunk of money that gets taken from your paycheck month to month for your retirement... like your access account number to that money when you retire.

Somewhere along the line... other parts of the government, other people, and companies started wanting to use that number for lots of other things... but that is not what it was originally intended for.

People prior to my generation were much more in that line of thinking, I believe, than people my age and younger... and I kinda missed when the SSN started really being used for everything under the sun.

Its kind of like if all of a sudden companies wanted to use your savings account number at your bank to identify you for other things and demanded you give it to them... Even if they can't do anything bad with it... how do they get the right to demand that?


----------



## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

larrystotler said:


> Considering that I run claims for E* almost daily, I know for a fact that it is $49.99. Also, I have no conrol over WHAT 4 digits are given to me, and considering just how many duplicate last 4 digits there are, I can't imagine that it would matter what 4 digits you give them.


Well they declined me. I offered to pay a year in advance and they said no.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

In my experiance, almost everyone, regardless of their credit background, quallifies to activate an E* system. They have the FFA (Free for All) promo where the customer buys a 1 or 2 room system, including install for $150 and $200 respectively and then receives either 15 or 20 $10 monthly credits. Also they have No Promo, also know as Cash and Carry. I haven't run into anyone yet who didn't quallify for No Promo. (Though I'll admit anything is possible with Charlie) Some people just don't quallify to lease. I'll also add that as long as you live in a house and have SBC as your phone company, you quallify for SBC/Dish, NO further info required.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

peano said:


> Well they declined me. I offered to pay a year in advance and they said no.


I'm not trying to be ignorant, but from another thread, you stated that you weren't in the US to begin with, and this is why you refused to give your social. E* has checks in place to catch this kinda activity, and since it is illegal, perhaps you should just live with it. I am aware that some people have services outside of their actual allowed footprint, and while I could care less, I am not the one in charge of the system, and as an installer, I MUST abide by the system.


----------



## the_bear (Oct 18, 2004)

lazaruspup said:


> Now in California this is currently changing and I believe there are bills in progress that would outlaw the practice of refusing service based on the presence of a SS.


Most states ban the "requirement" of a SS to get service. There are exceptions of DMV and IRS related services, such as a bank account (IRS tracking). Since there are deposits to not give a SS for other services, most people give SS out anyway.


----------



## ntexasdude (Jan 23, 2005)

When I first signed up for DirecTV in December of 2003 they asked for my SS# and I asked why they needed and if I was required to give it. They told me it wasn't required and I never gave it out. When I switched to Dish in January 2005 I don't rememeber them asking me about it (but they may have).

Back in my USAF days you HAD to use for all kinds of stuff but you also were required to read and sign a form about why they were asking for it and how it would be used.

As far as buying stuff online I have an AT&T Gold Mastercard that will issue a one time use number. You go to their site and request a one time number and after it's used it becomes invalid forever. I've never actually used it but it sounds like a great idea.


----------



## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

_


larrystotler said:



Actually, it's $50....the $200 is to get a DHA without a credit card.

Click to expand...

_They do not do DHA without a credit card now even if you are willing to pay the $200.


----------



## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

Some customers still will not be able to get service even if you want to pay the $200. It was not given as an option when an elderly lady tried to sign up for service. They said she did not have any credit to check to see if she existed. They was at first saying her SSN was not right but I was looking at her SS Card. Otherwise its $200+$150 for the 1 receiver system and $200+$200 for the 2 receiver system on FFA. No CC is not an option on DHA.


----------



## JM Anthony (Nov 16, 2003)

ntexasdude said:


> . . . As far as buying stuff online I have an AT&T Gold Mastercard that will issue a one time use number. You go to their site and request a one time number and after it's used it becomes invalid forever. I've never actually used it but it sounds like a great idea.


Now that is a good idea. Wish more financial institutions would do that.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

Jacob S said:


> ...Otherwise its $200+$150  for the 1 receiver system and $200+$200  for the 2 receiver system on FFA. No CC is not an option on DHA.


Why so much for a FFA?


----------



## kenglish (Oct 2, 2004)

For a while, the military used your SSN for everything. No telling how many old uniforms are lying around in used-clothing shops, with people's name and SSN still stencilled on them.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Jacob S said:


> They do not do DHA without a credit card now even if you are willing to pay the $200.


I just ran a claim day before yesterday, and the $200 option was still listed. When did they supposedly do this?


----------



## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

Maybe the change did not take effect yet. If it hasn't then it will probably be in effect as of April 1, 2005. It showed up in the Facts Blast for retailers. 

They are also going to start charging more for Dish Movers and some will have to pay more for the Dish Upgrades and Dish Movers - anywhere from $50-150 depending on what you qualify for, the type of dish, etc.


----------



## peano (Feb 1, 2004)

I don't see how Dish can do this and remain competitive with D*. All I had to do was pay $50 in advance with a credit card to get DirecTv. No SSN at all. Not even four digits. *And* the $50 applies against my programming charges.

The more I read about Charlie, the more I realize he is just like BEV in the north. Very poor customer service, pathetic software, and a complete disregard for both existing and potentially new customers.


----------



## DS0816 (Mar 29, 2002)

KingLoop said:


> I agree, most people that don't want to give their SS# to company that they know is legitimate are either paranoid or have terrible credit.


_Wrong_.

Most people who don't want to give out their social-security number feel it's a bad idea for two reasons: 1) There's a risk of identity fraud that would be caused by the other party; 2) Privacy reasons -- realistically, we have a lot more rights and we're not required to explain why we choose not to disclose info that's not necessarily anyone else's business.

DirecTV and Dish Network -- and any other business -- should have no rights to even ask for customers' social-security numbers. Employers have the right to know for federal and state income tax reports and audits.

This is an abuse on behalf of both DirecTV and Dish Network.

It's amazing how little people know about their rights. I signed up for DirecTV in 1998 -- no such information was requested of me. Nowadays, I'd tell them to either grant me service or I'd take my business elsewhere (and report them to any agency, like the Better Business Bureau, in the process).


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

JacobS - I haven't looked at the fast blast lately.....I'll have to pull it.

peano - As of 3/29, D* will require a credit check or you will have to pay a $150-200 deposit that will be reimbursed as a $10 credit on your bill.

DS0816 - Your SSN is now your credit. Companies can and do request your SSN anytime a credit worthiness check is required. There are ways around this, like a self employed person can use an EIN instead in some cases. However, it has become pretty much the way it is.


----------



## DS0816 (Mar 29, 2002)

larrystotler said:


> JacobS - I haven't looked at the fast blast lately.....I'll have to pull it.
> 
> peano - As of 3/29, D* will require a credit check or you will have to pay a $150-200 deposit that will be reimbursed as a $10 credit on your bill.
> 
> DS0816 - Your SSN is now your credit. Companies can and do request your SSN anytime a credit worthiness check is required. There are ways around this, like a self employed person can use an EIN instead in some cases. However, it has become pretty much the way it is.


What companies are worth dealing that would want to check your credit? Give me some examples of companies, from whom you're purchasing merchandise, or with whom you're in the midst of forming a company-and-consumer connection, that would explain your claim that "[One's own] SSN is now your credit. Companies can and do request your SSN anytime a credit worthiness check is required."

Applying for credit is one thing, but to obtain satellite programming services -- nah, unless there was some law recently passed permitting them to do so, just say _No_!

What I'm saying is this: DirecTV and Dish Network are two examples of _businesses_ that have no legal right to a consumer's social-security number.


----------



## StevenZ (Aug 15, 2003)

DS0816 said:


> What I'm saying is this: DirecTV and Dish Network are two examples of _businesses_ that have no legal right to a consumer's social-security number.


You're absolutely right. But it's also true that D* & E* can legally request your SSN and legally charge you a fee to do business if you choose not to share your SSN.

I used to think it was a violation of federal law to use an SSN other than for SS-related activity (employment, etc.), but even the SS website acknowledges how common SSN's use has become.


----------



## SimpleSimon (Jan 15, 2004)

It USED to be 100% illegal for the SS# to be used for ANY other reason.

I forget when that got changed - some rider on some unrelated bill I suppose.


----------



## Jacob S (Apr 14, 2002)

If DirecTv no longer requires a SSN and only requires a $50 deposit which is credited off your bill then that's news to me. If that is the case then its no wonder why they get more sales than Dish Network although Dish Network almost gets just as many sales as DirecTv with much higher hardware prices and with the stricter requirements to sign up if that is the case.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

Dish doesn't really use your SSN so much as a credit check but as a way to come back at you if you default on a huge bill. Face it, Cell Phones, Sat TV, Car loans, etc all require your creditworthiness because they are GIVING you something either for free, or for your promise to repay what you owe. Now, consider the case of buying equipment outright. SSN is needed to attach your credit report when your end up being a dirtball and charging $150-$500 worth of programming and not payng for it. I didn't say I agreed with it. It's just become a fact over the years..............

And, when D* does anything for you that requires a tech, they make you sign a one year commit. I'm not sure how they would do it if you did the install yourself.

Just say no, and become unable to get what you want......unfortunately, it's becoming a fact of life and business.


----------



## DS0816 (Mar 29, 2002)

larrystotler said:


> Dish doesn't really use your SSN so much as a credit check but as a way to come back at you if you default on a huge bill. Face it, Cell Phones, Sat TV, Car loans, etc all require your creditworthiness because they are GIVING you something either for free, or for your promise to repay what you owe. Now, consider the case of buying equipment outright. SSN is needed to attach your credit report when your end up being a dirtball and charging $150-$500 worth of programming and not payng for it. I didn't say I agreed with it. It's just become a fact over the years..............
> 
> And, when D* does anything for you that requires a tech, they make you sign a one year commit. I'm not sure how they would do it if you did the install yourself.
> 
> Just say no, and become unable to get what you want......unfortunately, it's becoming a fact of life and business.


I'm glad you addressed this. I'm trying to remember whether I did allow Sprint PCS, my cell-phone service provider, access to my social-security number. I'm thinking _yes_, because it was 2001 and the company has been doing credit checks on new customers.

I've been selective in singling out DirecTV and Dish Network as offenders -- and if I'm correct with recalling Sprint PCS, it would be hypcritical of me to apply two separate set of standards. I had a failure for the moment. Again, I don't think it's legit -- but obviously folks will put with more than they should. (And I'm one of them. :nono2: )


----------



## scottchez (Feb 4, 2003)

====== Here is a new SSN Credit Check question =================

What happens when you have a Credit Alert on File to prevent credit checks?


Do they do a full credit check when you sign up for the Digital Home Advantage (lease plan)? Or do they just check to verify that it is a real person with the SS# 


I ask becuase someone wants to sign up with the Club Dish card but they have a 90 credit alert placed at the credit bureaus.

Will they be able to do that? They are never home in the day time for the credit bureaus to call to verify.

Who does Dish use can the call them to OK the credit check?


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

scottchez said:


> ...Do they do a full credit check when you sign up for the Digital Home Advantage (lease plan)? Or do they just check to verify that it is a real person with the SS#...


Echostar is listed as a utility company with Equifax, when a retailer or E* CSR submits a customer's information (SS# and CC#) it is run as a credit check. If the customer has an alert placed on file then the retailer (I don't know what the CSR does at E* at that point) E-Mails credit info and they take it from there. Credit info then contacts the customer and gets verification i.e. copy of I.D. and SS card. As far as to how the credit bureaus are involved I'm not sure. The whole process can take a few days.


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

scottchez said:


> ====== Here is a new SSN Credit Check question =================
> 
> What happens when you have a Credit Alert on File to prevent credit checks?
> 
> ...


 [Finally something I really know the answer to...  So pay attention.]

You have to wait 2 full business days for the Executive Office at E* to call you back and ask you a bunch of questions to let them know that you are who you say you are. They can call in the evening. And yes they do a full credit check. But if for some reason they lose your information, SUCH AS YOU CALLING BACK AND REQUESTING A CHANGE TO YOUR PACKAGE, you have to wait again, EVEN OF THE INSTALLER IS THERE AT YOUR HOUSE. HE CAN'T ACTIVATE YOUR RECEIVERS AND HE WON'T BE ABLE TO DO ANYTHING EXCEPT RIP YOUR NOW-WET 811 OUT OF YOUR TEAR-STAINED HANDS! (Oh, and the 311 too.) This is sometimes exacerbated by the fact that the "right people" at E* don't ever get their memos to call you back and sometimes you have to WAIT THROUGH TWO MAJOR HOLIDAYS to get any satisfaction. Just make sure that when you get that first initial call from the Executive Office, you have all your programming decisions made, and MAKE SURE they NOTATE everything IN TRIPLICATE on your account and find some way to ensure it is not ERASED by the E* computers, which I believe are located somewhere in HADES!

:ramblinon


----------



## scottchez (Feb 4, 2003)

So they call you back, you dont have to send in a copy of I.D. and SS card like King Loop says or do you need to do both?

Take the call AND fax things in?


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

scottchez said:


> So they call you back, you dont have to send in a copy of I.D. and SS card like King Loop says or do you need to do both?
> 
> Take the call AND fax things in?


They just called me. I didn't have to send anything in.


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

scottchez said:


> So they call you back, you dont have to send in a copy of I.D. and SS card like King Loop says or do you need to do both?
> 
> Take the call AND fax things in?


Of course the retailer already had my ID.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

scottchez said:


> So they call you back, you dont have to send in a copy of I.D. and SS card like King Loop says or do you need to do both?
> 
> Take the call AND fax things in?


Sometimes they want photocopied proof of your information sometimes not... each case is differant, the best thing your friend could do is call in and find out, the last guy i signed up that had an alert placed on his file needed to fax copies of his info to E*. One thing your friend wants to be sure to do is keep track of who he talks to. CSR #s are important. Sometimes it's hard to activate the account even though someone gave someone else the go ahead, you know?


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

KingLoop said:


> ....One thing your friend wants to be sure to do is keep track of who he talks to. CSR #s are important....


NOW they tell me.  The guy I talked to on Installation Day (#1) seemed to be of Indian descent. All he could tell me was the "sincerely apologize" BS, which was TOTALLY not helpful. It irritated me so much that every time I talked to another CSR, I specifically requested they not talk to me in this patronizing manner before I even tried to ask my questions. I was literally beside myself :ramblinon :ramblinon, no more Mrs. Nice Guy. (I think I scared the installer!) I guess you could say "Shirley" came out that day! !devil12: :lol:

I know that E* is just trying to protect me, I have just never liked the feeling of being protected from myself!


----------



## scottchez (Feb 4, 2003)

OK they just sign up on the phone but forgot to get the CSR name or number-opps

The CSR said Dish would call in Two days. I asked why and they said the block automatically causes an Email to be sent to a department and then they research it.

I wonder why the Two Day wait, is it so the credit card will clear or so the Credit Brureaus can allow the un block from the alert by them calling the customer to get permission.

Sounds like a mystery all this credit report stuff.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

scottchez said:


> ...I wonder why the Two Day wait, is it so the credit card will clear or so the Credit Brureaus can allow the un block from the alert by them calling the customer to get permission....


Credit Info needs to do their thing. It doesn't have anything to do with the Credit Card. Tell your friend to make sure to keep track of who they talk to when they get called back, hopefully everything with go off with out a hitch but what could happen sometimes does.


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

scottchez said:


> ....I wonder why the Two Day wait....


It doesn't have anything to do with the credit card or credit report. It's all on account of the block on the SSN. Your friend might remember back to when they had their SSN blocked with the credit bureaus in the first place, they were told this would be the process for anything in the future that required the use of their SSN. They can't do anything for you right then, it always has to be a call-back situation. HTH.


----------



## scottchez (Feb 4, 2003)

When She put the block on the credit bureaus told then that for the next 90 days when ever they applied for anything or did any thing that required a SSN check or score that they would have to apply and then go home so the Credit Bureau could then call them to verify that it was OK to give out the information or score.

When she opened a checking acount 2 weeks ago, she was at the bank then ran home to get the call, but she missed the call, the bank then called her again to arrange for a time so they could ask the bereau to call again.

Once again, it is all strange, but interesting this credit stuff.


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

scottchez said:


> ....for the next 90 days....


That might make the difference then. Mine's permanent. It was definitely someone from E* that called me.


----------



## lazaruspup (Mar 18, 2005)

DS0816 said:


> Applying for credit is one thing, but to obtain satellite programming services -- nah, unless there was some law recently passed permitting them to do so, just say _No_!
> 
> What I'm saying is this: DirecTV and Dish Network are two examples of _businesses_ that have no legal right to a consumer's social-security number.


In essence when you sign up with a satellite or telephone company they have every right to check your credit in order to prove credit worthiness. In essence, the companies justify this because they are extending you a line of credit. Every month, they are giving you a 50 dollar or 100 dollar or 200 dollar line of credit that you can use until you pay your bill and start back at 0. The best way to make sure you are worth of this is by obtaining the customer's social security number. Now, all the grand conspiracies aside, I work in wireless and I have and will refuse a customer service if they refuse to provide a social security number. As a salesperson, my salary is affected by the number of customers who default and don't pay their bills. I don't want every deadbeat on earth getting service because then I have to suffer. I am glad that companies check for credit worthiness.


----------



## scottchez (Feb 4, 2003)

Update (if anyone is interested) They just called to ask about adding the Super Stations to the order.

The CSR said there was no record of the order. Is this becuase the order is not really even in the system till the CEO office calls back? Seems stranger yet.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

scottchez said:


> Update (if anyone is interested) They just called to ask about adding the Super Stations to the order.
> 
> The CSR said there was no record of the order. Is this becuase the order is not really even in the system till the CEO office calls back? Seems stranger yet.


I'm not sure about that one, this just goes back to your friend making sure she keeps track of who she talks to. If she doesn't hear back from E* by tomorrow advise her to call back and start all over, making sure to record the CSRs ID #, as I said the whole process could take a few days. Also if it was me, and I knew, as a new customer, what I know as a current customer, I would tell the first CSR that picked up the phone that I've been having trouble signing up and I want to talk to a supervisor, Then get the supervisor's ID #. If things don't go smoothly call back and ask for the Executive Dept. That's the hardest, easy way to get things done with E*.


----------



## Laverne (Feb 17, 2005)

scottchez said:


> Update (if anyone is interested) They just called to ask about adding the Super Stations to the order.
> 
> The CSR said there was no record of the order. Is this becuase the order is not really even in the system till the CEO office calls back? Seems stranger yet.


My guess would be that is the case. Someone else may know better. I do feel for your friend. I hope that by her calling, it doesn't kick her out of the system since they looked for her info. I know this doesn't sound logical, but I swear that's what happened to me. I had already had my callback, but then I changed something (through the retailer), and then on Installation Day #1 when he called to activate my receivers, EVEN THOUGH I WAS STILL IN THE RETAILER'S COMPUTER, E* had NO RECORD of my account whatsoever, and the only thing they could finally figure out was that change had erased my info.

If they don't call back when they say they will, make sure she starts doing some calling and asking to speak to someone in the Executive Office. They will question why she needs to speak to them, then let her talk to their supervisor, who will then finally connect her. That's who you have to talk to, but you can't call and talk to them directly. (In fact, when I first called back at the number the first girl gave me, they wanted to know how I got that number!  ) Don't do anything until they make that initial call-back, talk about the programming then. But IF they don't call back, MAKE SURE you call back, because it does seem that they don't get their memos around there sometimes.

Keep me posted and I'll offer all the suggestions you can stand.


----------



## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

lazaruspup said:


> In essence when you sign up with a satellite or telephone company they have every right to check your credit in order to prove credit worthiness. In essence, the companies justify this because they are extending you a line of credit. Every month, they are giving you a 50 dollar or 100 dollar or 200 dollar line of credit that you can use until you pay your bill and start back at 0. The best way to make sure you are worth of this is by obtaining the customer's social security number. Now, all the grand conspiracies aside, I work in wireless and I have and will refuse a customer service if they refuse to provide a social security number. As a salesperson, my salary is affected by the number of customers who default and don't pay their bills. I don't want every deadbeat on earth getting service because then I have to suffer. I am glad that companies check for credit worthiness.


I'd have to double-check my bill to be sure... but aren't we paying in advance for Dish service? I mean, after that first month (which a lot of times is a freebie depending on the promotion)... don't we usually pay now for the next month (30 days) of service?

If I'm correct in my memory... then they aren't really extending credit... We're paying for a month in advance of service... that we haven't used yet... so *technically* speaking there isn't an extention of credit really.

IF I don't pay my bill by the due date... they could cut my service at the end of this month for which I've already paid... and not give me service next month that I haven't paid for...


----------



## scottchez (Feb 4, 2003)

Update: They called Her did the things needed for the SSN alert verify, they had to start the whole order over again and they asked for the Credit card number again, but this time She got CSR ID Number and phone numbers. 

Looks like this one will go though. If not, she now has phone numbers and names. She said thanks.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

HDMe said:


> I'd have to double-check my bill to be sure... but aren't we paying in advance for Dish service? I mean, after that first month (which a lot of times is a freebie depending on the promotion)... don't we usually pay now for the next month (30 days) of service?
> If I'm correct in my memory... then they aren't really extending credit... We're paying for a month in advance of service... that we haven't used yet... so *technically* speaking there isn't an extention of credit really.
> IF I don't pay my bill by the due date... they could cut my service at the end of this month for which I've already paid... and not give me service next month that I haven't paid for...


May "month" starts on the 15th, but my bill isn't due until the 21st, and they usually give you at least a month late before they cut you off, so, yes they are. Plus, you don't pay for the PPVs up front either, so same thing.


----------



## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

larrystotler said:


> May "month" starts on the 15th, but my bill isn't due until the 21st, and they usually give you at least a month late before they cut you off, so, yes they are. Plus, you don't pay for the PPVs up front either, so same thing.


Ok, thanks for checking the details for me... I had actually forgotten to go look at my last bill!

That said, though... it still isn't quite the same kind of extension of credit as, say, buying a car or a house...

I can't remember giving my SSN to Dish when I signed up a few years ago... I'm not worried about a credit check either, but sometimes I do wonder if perhaps too many people are getting their fingers in the pot, so to speak, of being able to have access to certain kinds of information.


----------



## catnap1972 (May 31, 2003)

HDMe said:


> I can't remember giving my SSN to Dish when I signed up a few years ago... I'm not worried about a credit check either, but sometimes I do wonder if perhaps too many people are getting their fingers in the pot, so to speak, of being able to have access to certain kinds of information.


They don't need your SS # to do a credit check. Imagine my surprise when I pulled my Equifax report to find an account review from Dish back in December (the first time I'd EVER seen one from them and I've been a sub since Feb of 97). To my knowledge, I NEVER gave them my SS # (maybe I'm wrong), and I can't see why they're snooping on me since my equipment is LONG since paid off (I don't think they want a pair of antique 4000s back) and I've ALWAYS paid on time.

Were they looking for something or is this just standard MO with them nowadays?


----------



## splish (Nov 7, 2002)

As I recall, my SS card, issued in the early 60s, clearly states something like 'may not be used for purposes of identification.'


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

splish said:


> As I recall, my SS card, issued in the early 60s, clearly states something like 'may not be used for purposes of identification.'


I think that goes to your SS Card not being a positive piece of ID, but I may be wrong there... E* doesn't use it as an identifier per se, (while it helps them in that endeavor) it is used for a CREDIT CHECK.


----------



## Stewart Vernon (Jan 7, 2005)

splish said:


> As I recall, my SS card, issued in the early 60s, clearly states something like 'may not be used for purposes of identification.'


I think mine says that too... and I was born in 1970, so mine was obtained sometime in the 1970s...

Yet, oddly enough when I recently renewed my driver's license... I was required to furnish my original-beat-up-old social security card as a form of identification. Even stranger when you consider that with its age, it would be one of the easiest kind of documents to falsify... and of course it isn't a picture-ID.


----------



## SAEMike (May 29, 2004)

splish said:


> As I recall, my SS card, issued in the early 60s, clearly states something like 'may not be used for purposes of identification.'





> Q21: When did Social Security cards bear the legend "NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"?
> 
> A: The first Social Security cards were issued starting in 1936, they did not have this legend. Beginning with the sixth design version of the card, issued starting in 1946, SSA added a legend to the bottom of the card reading "FOR SOCIAL SECURITY PURPOSES -- NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION." This legend was removed as part of the design changes for the 18th version of the card, issued beginning in 1972. The legend has not been on any new cards issued since 1972. http://www.ssa.gov/history/hfaq.html


About 12 years ago I worked at a video store where we required a SSN to sign up for a membership. We often encountered some people who were adamant that we were not "permitted" to require or even ask for a SSN. We always informed them that we could very well ask for nearly anything we wanted to ask for, and that the customer could very well refuse and take his business elsewhere.

A private company has every right to require a SSN, Mother's maiden name, DNA swap, or anything else they feel important, the "check and balance" for that is that you can very well tell them to climb a tree, and find service somewhere else.

The SSN is very useful when sending people to collection agencies or reporting poor payment practices by the customer to the various credit bureaus, and for purposes of identification when names, cities, and even date of births are similar. Giving someone your SSN could actually protect you from being confused with a delinquent customer with the same name.

The satellite provider could be giving you credit in many different ways. Many customers lease equipment which is worth hundreds of dollars, not receiving that equipment back could be a sizable financial loss to the provider. While it is true that they charge double your first month's service charge as a buffer for a month when you may not pay, that does not take into account additions you may have made to your account since your first month of service, or if you signed a contract committing you to a year or more, it doesn't take into account the money you may owe on the contract after failing to pay your bill.

There are many legitimate reasons for the satellite or cable provider to want and require your SSN and to do a credit check before they provide you with service.


----------



## stonecold (Feb 20, 2004)

OK here are the things 

A. you could charge up 300 dollars of PPV and leave dish stranded with the cost.
b. if you are leasing recievers then they are extended credit in the form of the recievers.
c. Comcast, Timewarner , Verizon (landline), require ssn why should dish be any different


----------



## slenz (Apr 28, 2005)

if i'm not mistaken.ssn was not created for personal id for companies,or cops, or anyone else,other than the irs and your employer.and you could very well be sued if somebody wanted to take you to court for refusing service for that reason alone.


----------



## KingLoop (Mar 3, 2005)

slenz said:


> if i'm not mistaken.ssn was not created for personal id for companies,or cops, or anyone else,other than the irs and your employer.and you could very well be sued if somebody wanted to take you to court for refusing service for that reason alone.


I don't think that is true. It's not like having a particular service is a right. It's not your right to be able to be financed by a bank or a car lot. In the same respect it's not your right to expect a company to let you use their service.


----------



## the_bear (Oct 18, 2004)

KingLoop said:


> I don't think that is true.


Yes, slenz is correct for most states. This is why Dish does not "require" (as pointed out by many customers on this thread) a SS.


----------



## larrystotler (Jun 6, 2004)

E* cannot require it. But they CAN charge you more for not providing it. It's just like when someone asks you for your SSN card or a Credit Card as a form of ID. These are NOT IDs. An SSN is only used in conjuction with a stat issued DL.


----------



## SAEMike (May 29, 2004)

E* *CAN* require it. Your SSN and Social Security Card *CAN* be used and even required as ID.



> Q21: When did Social Security cards bear the legend "NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"?
> 
> A: The first Social Security cards were issued starting in 1936, they did not have this legend. Beginning with the sixth design version of the card, issued starting in 1946, SSA added a legend to the bottom of the card reading "FOR SOCIAL SECURITY PURPOSES -- NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION." This legend was removed as part of the design changes for the 18th version of the card, issued beginning in 1972. The legend has not been on any new cards issued since 1972. http://www.ssa.gov/history/hfaq.html


----------



## jeslevine (Jul 21, 2002)

dishcrazie said:


> Why would dishnetwork want our SSN? I don't see the point.
> They said they won't activate withouth a SSN. That is ridiculous.
> Anyway to avoid that?
> thx


one is for your credit score

the second is identity theif

I think I am only kidding about the second. I don't like it either, but thats the way it is


----------

