# DIRECTV Server Box spotted



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

I saw the next gen DIRECTV multi tuner box (more than 3) in the Entropic booth along with a client device. Both use MOCA. Sorry for poor quality of photos maybe someone can go back to south hall and take a better shot.it was showing RVU demo with epg and live video on sever and client


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Any more details? Is the tuner count including using an AM21 for two ATSC tuners or is it only DBS tuners?


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

All things considered, I prefer the exterior of the HR23...

~Alan


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

I'll check it out tomorrow....


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> I saw the next gen DIRECTV multi tuner box (more than 3) in the Entropic booth along with a client device. Both use MOCA. Sorry for poor quality of photos maybe someone can go back to south hall and take a better shot.it was showing RVU demo with epg and live video on sever and client


Thanks .. I heard there might be a demo regarding the RVU Alliance.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Is this the "Whole Home" Server?


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## jasonki32 (Jan 29, 2008)

It will be interesting in what you find out. I am intrigued.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

If it has 4 actual satellite tuners, I'll definitely consider it, as long as you can have more than one!


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## idigg (May 8, 2008)

Does it run the same crappy software of the HR2x's?


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> I'll check it out tomorrow....


See if you can get an actual model number!! Wondering if this is the phantom HR24!!


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> Is this the "Whole Home" Server?


This display is related to the RVU Alliance .. I think this might be an early look into the home media center.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

idigg said:


> Does it run the same crappy software of the HR2x's?


All of DIRECTV's receivers have very similarly functioning firmware. I can't imagine this one is any different.


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

I cannot believe I missed it, guess I'm going back tomorrow.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> See if you can get an actual model number!! Wondering if this is the phantom HR24!!


We'll see how close we can get...


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## Herdfan (Mar 18, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> I think this might be an early look into the home media center.


Didn't we already see that back in '04?

I wonder how many streams will be able to host at one time.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Herdfan said:


> Didn't we already see that back in '04?
> 
> I wonder how many streams will be able to host at one time.


Well maybe this one has a better chance at reality


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## CJTE (Sep 18, 2007)

I'll be there tomorrow at 9am. Looking forward to seeing this (amongst other things).


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## dirtyblueshirt (Dec 7, 2008)

That second one we've seen before... was it CES 2009? I'll have to look at my old posts...


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## dirtyblueshirt (Dec 7, 2008)

Ah-ha! The second box was first spotted at CEDIA 2009:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=164851

The first box may be the smaller ones seen at the CEDIA "home" setup, too.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Good correlation dirtyblueshirt .. Looking forward to what the folks find out tomorrow.


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## smiddy (Apr 5, 2006)

Whoa, I will be asking to take pictures of the back of these puppies!  I like those curved corners, nice!


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Doug Brott said:


> Good correlation dirtyblueshirt .. Looking forward to what the folks find out tomorrow.





smiddy said:


> Whoa, I will be asking to take pictures of the back of these puppies!  I like those curved corners, nice!


Smiddy and I should be there together some time mid-day....cameras in hand...will ask alot of questions too...


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## inbloom (Jan 22, 2007)

From an Entropic press release:

DEMO: DIRECTV and RVU(TM)
Entropic will demonstrate the RVU(TM) (Remote Viewing) concept
using equipment provided by DIRECTV. RVU is an industry
alliance developing a standard for enabling set-top receivers
to access, view and control content in other set-top
receivers and provides a robust platform for a uniform and
consistent user experience. Entropic will be the only vendor
on the CES exhibit floor to deliver a public demonstration
of a pixel-accurate RVU Remote User Interface (RUI)
technology.

http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=433840


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## WestDC (Feb 9, 2008)

Where is the reset button located?


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## Movieman (May 9, 2009)

It looks very nice. Is that a DECA adapter that we see in the photo as well?


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Movieman said:


> It looks very nice. Is that a DECA adapter that we see in the photo as well?


Yes, I believe it is .. But those aren't released yet ..


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## DJPellegrino (Nov 18, 2005)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Smiddy and I should be there together some time mid-day....cameras in hand...will ask alot of questions too...


Good that the 2 of you are going together. You can double team them. One to distract them the other to take pictures... :hurah:


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## Movieman (May 9, 2009)

Doug Brott said:


> Yes, I believe it is .. But those aren't released yet ..


I was just glad to see them used in their setup. Gives you a positive sense of what is to come.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Without the logos, it looks suspiciously like a high-end Samsung Blu-ray player.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

The photo says DECA but that may be a dummy box. In fact there's no guarantee that anything you see there is actually a working piece of equipment.


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## dirtyblueshirt (Dec 7, 2008)

Movieman said:


> It looks very nice. Is that a DECA adapter that we see in the photo as well?


Looks like you're right...


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

dirtyblueshirt said:


> Looks like you're right...


citation required


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## dirtyblueshirt (Dec 7, 2008)

P Smith said:


> citation required


Citation Provided:
http://www.satelliteguys.us/directv...hnology-directv-ethernet-coaxial-adapter.html


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

dirtyblueshirt said:


> Looks like you're right...





P Smith said:


> citation required


Why so suspicious all the time lately?



dirtyblueshirt said:


> Citation Provided:


And why link to another site?

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2193339#post2193339


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> The photo says DECA but that may be a dummy box. In fact there's no guarantee that anything you see there is actually a working piece of equipment.


Oh the setup at CES works, I played with it. The 2nd (smaller) box is a client box, similar to a thinnet client. It has no satellite tuning capability on it's own and gets everything from the server.

I am in the process of scanning the document I picked up from that booth and will upload it later.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

Draconis said:


> Oh the setup at CES works, I played with it. The 2nd (smaller) box is a client box, similar to a thinnet client. It has to satellite tuning capability on it's own and gets everything from the server.
> 
> I am in the process of scanning the document I picked up from that booth and will upload it later.


Great;

Thanks for all the hard work in shoe leather and camera work you guys are putting in over there.

I was just about to say before you posted in response to Stuart's skepticism about it possibly being a dummy mockup that the LED indicator lights on the DECA modules appear to be indicating actual activation and network connectivity, so how could dummy boxes produce that?


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## dirtyblueshirt (Dec 7, 2008)

LameLefty said:


> Why so suspicious all the time lately?
> 
> And why link to another site?
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2193339#post2193339


first Google result 

Can't wait for more in-depth pictures of the hidden DirecTV surprise at CES...


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

BTW; with this and the SWM32 being at Entropic's booth, and with no other mentions in other CES related threads that I'm aware of, does DirecTV have a booth there at all?


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

Ok, here is what I have. I shrunk the scans to 1/3 their original size but they are still legible.

The whole setup comes from the RVU Alliance, DIRECTV is one of the founding members of this alliance but I was surprised to see results so quickly.

If you want more information about the RVU alliance at CES I would check out this link.

The large unit is the actual HDDVR, I was not given the opportunity to physically check the unit for the model number so the model number is unknown. From here on out I am going to refer to this unit as the "server".

The 2nd unit is a "client" receiver, and has no satellite tuning ability one it's own. Everything it gets, it gets from the server. It does not even have a access card.

It utilizes something very similar to DIRECTV2PC to show the video, so there is very little hardware in the unit. Even the menu commands are rendered on the server then sent to the client.

Now this is where it gets interesting, because the client box is NOT NEEDED if the TV itself is RVU compliant. Any RVU compliant device can attach directly to the network and get the same video feed.

As for the specs on the HDDVR itself, I was not able to get much. In fact the only thing I was able to get was that is does support more than 2 tuners (exact number unknown), HDD size unknown, and WILL require a SWM in order to operate.

Guess I'm going to have to go buy a SWM and install it, because this unit looks like it's going to be a great addition. (Whenever it comes out).


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

HoTat2 said:


> BTW; with this and the SWM32 being at Entropic's booth, and with no other mentions in other CES related threads that I'm aware of, does DirecTV have a booth there at all?


Nope, no booth, but there is the person hanging out at the Panasonic booth for 3D TV and the one in Entropic's booth. They were the only reps I could find.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Draconis said:


> Ok, here is what I have. I shrunk the scans to 1/3 their original size but they are still legible.
> 
> The whole setup comes from the RVU Alliance, DIRECTV is one of the founding members of this alliance but I was surprised to see results so quickly.
> 
> ...


Nice!! Thanks!!! Did they happen to mention if the "More than 2 tuners" are sat tuners? Technically all of the HR2x receivers support more than 2 tuners (2 Sat, 2 OTA).


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

kevinturcotte said:


> Nice!! Thanks!!! Did they happen to mention if the "More than 2 tuners" are sat tuners? Technically all of the HR2x receivers support more than 2 tuners (2 Sat, 2 OTA).
> So would the clients not be watching Live Tv then? OR they'd be taking a tuner away that could be recording?


Yep, more than 2 satellite tuners, exact number unknown.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

So would the clients not be watching Live Tv then? OR they'd be taking a tuner away that could be recording? If that's the case, I can see 2 problems. First one is easy to deal with, but what if you have more clients than actual tuners? Get into the uVerse problem (Limited number of tuners)? Second, what happens if 3 or 4 programs are scheduled to record, and one or more of the clients decides to watch Live Tv?


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

kevinturcotte said:


> So would the clients not be watching Live Tv then? OR they'd be taking a tuner away that could be recording? If that's the case, I can see 2 problems. First one is easy to deal with, but what if you have more clients than actual tuners? Get into the uVerse problem (Limited number of tuners)? Second, what happens if 3 or 4 programs are scheduled to record, and one or more of the clients decides to watch Live Tv?


Clients get live TV, I changed the channel on the client unit multiple times while I was playing with the system.

Now this IS pure speculation on my part, but I'm suspecting that the unit can make full use of all 8 channels the SWM has (unless there are other stand-alone IRD's present).

I'm going to have to wait and see on that one.

--- edit ---

Seems I was premature when I speculated on 8 tuners, I was going off the number of channels a SWM can support. The Broadcom information was a interesting read.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

If it could actually make use of the 8 channels, and record 8 programs at once, while playing back programs on multiple clients, that would be PERFECT!!!!


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## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

kevinturcotte said:


> If it could actually make use of the 8 channels, and record 8 programs at once, while playing back programs on multiple clients, that would be PERFECT!!!!


If you are recording 8 things at once I would suspect it will be like today where you would have to watch what was being recorded or play something from the playlist. Still, I only have 3 units, so I doubt I would ever run into that situation.


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## Movieman (May 9, 2009)

HoTat2 said:


> Great;
> 
> Thanks for all the hard work in shoe leather and camera work you guys are putting in over there.
> 
> I was just about to say before you posted in response to Stuart's skepticism about it possibly being a dummy mockup that the LED indicator lights on the DECA modules appear to be indicating actual activation and network connectivity, so how could dummy boxes produce that?


Its not a dummy box because all the LED's are on in both pictures. Even though they could make dummy DECA's with fake LED's.  Either way its nice to see these new devices. This doesnt mean that we will see this product but its nice to see it on display for the general public to see and even ask some questions about.


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

kevinturcotte said:


> If it could actually make use of the 8 channels, and record 8 programs at once, while playing back programs on multiple clients, that would be PERFECT!!!!


The Broadcom BCM7410 and BCM7420, just announced as shipping this week, support up to six tuners. There are no other SoCs announced or shipping that support eight tuners.

According to this press release:



> Broadcom will demonstrate RUI [RVU] technology support on its BCM7420 STB SoC solution and BCM3549 DTV SoC solution at CES 2010.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Even 6 tuners would be all right, still better than what we have today! I could deal with only 6 tuners. I think the MOST I would need recording would be 4. Anything beyond that would probably be filler.
1 server, 3 clients, and a 2nd server as backup, and I could be set! I assume you can also watch directly from the server itself?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ken_F said:


> ...
> The Broadcom BCM7410 and BCM7420, just announced as shipping this week, support up to six tuners. There are no other SoCs announced or shipping that support eight tuners.
> 
> According to this press release:


u 
Draconis, 
could you please check Broadcom booth, perhaps follow their release you'll get some info about practical use those new BCM chips.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

Ken_F said:


> No record lights on the front of the unit, to the right of the DirecTV logo?
> 
> The Broadcom BCM7410 and BCM7420, just announced as shipping this week, support up to six tuners. There are no other SoCs announced or shipping that support eight tuners.
> 
> According to this press release:


Are there any "chips" out there now that would "more likely" be in these units that will support multiple tuners (over 2)?

I'm no Broadcom guru.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

What would be REALLY cool is if it allowed an external drive to mirror what's on the internal drive, and allow that external drive to be moved from server to server WITHIN the same account.
So say the hard drive in the server dies. Once I get a replacement, plug in the external drive, and everything is still right there waiting for me to watch. Even better, it copies everything right over to the new server, starting with settings, Series Links, leaving the recordings for last.


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## dirtyblueshirt (Dec 7, 2008)

Ken_F said:


> The Broadcom BCM7410 and BCM7420, just announced as shipping this week, support up to six tuners. There are no other SoCs announced or shipping that support eight tuners.
> 
> According to this press release:


No word on if those are six full HD tuners, or would it be split like UVerse and be 3 HD and 3 SD tuners?


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

Engadget has some better quality pics up, as well as a *video* and a little write up.

http://hd.engadget.com/2010/01/09/a-video-demo-of-rvu-extending-a-directv-dvr-to-another-room


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## bakerfall (Aug 23, 2006)

I'm disappointed that this next gen HW does not have an HD GUI.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

bakerfall said:


> I'm disappointed that this next gen HW does not have an HD GUI.


It's running the same software as the HR2x. Actually, if you notice, it's not. There's still a Directv Cinema Tab in the List.


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## bakerfall (Aug 23, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> It's running the same software as the HR2x. Actually, if you notice, it's not. There's still a Directv Cinema Tab in the List.


Yes, I see that. I'm saying I'm disappointed by that fact.

It will be interesting to see if it will be possible to use the client boxes with existing HR2X's, and what D* will charge for them (and if there will be an additional receiver fee).


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

bakerfall said:


> Yes, I see that. I'm saying I'm disappointed by that fact.
> 
> It will be interesting to see if it will be possible to use the client boxes with existing HR2X's, and what D* will charge for them (and if there will be an additional receiver fee).


But they may have an HD GUI by release.


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## bakerfall (Aug 23, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> But they may have an HD GUI by release.


Yea, I know it's being worked on. I'm really saying I want to see it  The HR2X are pretty solid boxes now, but the GUI looks ancient. I know that D* is stressing the idea of a standardized viewing experience, but it would be nice to see what the next GUI will look like.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

SledgeHammer said:


> Engadget has some better quality pics up, as well as a *video* and a little write up.
> 
> http://hd.engadget.com/2010/01/09/a-video-demo-of-rvu-extending-a-directv-dvr-to-another-room


Interesting and somewhat confusing;

On the video clip posted on that Engadget link the speaker mentions toward the end that the system supports up to eight clients with up to three simultaneous streams + one more making four counting the DVR server itself.

So how do we interpret those numbers?


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

HoTat2 said:


> Interesting and somewhat confusing;
> 
> On the video clip posted on that Engadget link the speaker mentions toward the end that the system supports up to eight clients with three simultaneous streams + one more making four counting the DVR server itself.
> 
> So how do we interpret those numbers?


Sounds like it will support up to 8 clients with only 3 active at once (4 if you count the server itself). Apparently the server can only handle 3 simultaneous streams.


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## MadManNBama (Jan 31, 2008)

Wow, ENGADGET.com says this is the total home DVR...Finally!

I hope DTV doesn't try to charge more than $200 for it. I wonder if The multi-room viewing will work with existing boxes because I don't look forward to upgrading both boxes and my TV as I move toward 3D this year.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

MadManNBama said:


> Wow, ENGADGET.com says this is the total home DVR...Finally!
> 
> I hope DTV doesn't try to charge more than $200 for it. I wonder if The multi-room viewing will work with existing boxes because I don't look forward to upgrading both boxes and my TV as I move toward 3D this year.


If it works with current H2x and allows them to use their own tuner, that would be PERFECT!


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## bakerfall (Aug 23, 2006)

MadManNBama said:


> Wow, ENGADGET.com says this is the total home DVR...Finally!
> 
> I hope DTV doesn't try to charge more than $200 for it. I wonder if The multi-room viewing will work with existing boxes because I don't look forward to upgrading both boxes and my TV as I move toward 3D this year.


MRV already exists (in beta) on the current boxes. The only question is will these dumb clients work with existing boxes.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

hilmar2k said:


> Sounds like it will support up to 8 clients with only 3 active at once (4 if you count the server itself). Apparently the server can only handle 3 simultaneous streams.


Looks like only three satellite tuners then ...

If correct then bummer, I can't believe people are going to be happy with that .. :nono2:


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Did it have any of the video glitches we see with MRV?


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> Looks like only three satellite tuners then ...
> 
> If correct then bummer, I can't believe people are going to be happy with that .. :nono2:


4 total if you count the server. Not great, but I could use the server all by itself without any clients.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

kevinturcotte said:


> 4 total if you count the server. Not great, but I could use the server all by itself without any clients.


OK;

But I think it means that one or more of the maximum of "four" streams is not from a live tuner but pre-recorded information from the DVR-server's HDD.


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> But they may have an HD GUI by release.





bakerfall said:


> *Yea, I know it's being worked on.* I'm really saying I want to see it


SOURCE?!?!

Though I like the idea of the whole-home DVR in practice, I don't like the idea of:

1. If the hard drive goes bad, you lose everything in the whole house.
2. If the server goes bad, you can't watch TV.
3. I don't like the idea of every client having access to every recording... though maybe DirecTV will offer something similar to TiVo's KidZone by the time of release?
4. Does this mean that you are going to have three lines being ran from the server to the clients? If so, I don't care for that...

I also have other questions (like #4) that could be reservations, but since nobody knows things like fees yet, there's no point in asking.

~Alan


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## bakerfall (Aug 23, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> SOURCE?!?!
> 
> Though I like the idea of the whole-home DVR in practice, I don't like the idea of:
> 
> ...


Only "source" that I have is that it was mentioned in a DirecTV presentation years ago, and that it's been speculated upon since. Sorry, I don't remember the specifics of that presentation.

As for the whole home DVR, it's basically the same configuration as U-Verse, which given D*'s relationship with ATT for bundles, that's probably on purpose. I prefer having seperate DVRs with MRV to provide the redundancy that this solution lacks.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

HoTat2 said:


> Looks like only three satellite tuners then ...
> 
> If correct then bummer, I can't believe people are going to be happy with that .. :nono2:





kevinturcotte said:


> 4 total if you count the server. Not great, but I could use the server all by itself without any clients.


I don't think that's necessarily true. It could have more than 4 tuners but only support three streams at once (plus the server). I think 6-8 tuners is likely.


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

dave29 said:


> Are there any "chips" out there now that would "more likely" be in these units that will support multiple tuners (over 2)?


The BCM7400 became available in volume around this time last year, so that's the SoC you would expect to see in a new DirecTV DVR released in the next month or two. The BCM7400 also supports six TS inputs, but it can only handle buffers and trickplay with four tuners at a time.

Assuming DirecTV HD bitrates, the BCM7400 could probably stream three recorded programs to different rooms while it records four DirecTV HD programs. I don't know what kind of resources RVU requires, or whether Broadcom is even supporting that feature on the BCM7400.

Broadcom did say they would show a next-generation BCM7420 setup at CES with RVU, so this _could_ be that demo. The BCM7420 just started shipping, but it became available in pre-release form more than 10 months ago. That's the only way you get multi-room with six tuners.

*Edit*

I missed the Energy Star logo. If this DirecTV DVR has 3+ tuners, Energy Star compliance, and streams to multiple clients simultaneously, then it must use the next-generation BCM7410, BCM7420, or some unannounced solution.

The BCM7400 doesn't offer much in the way of power management. DVRs with that SoC run 30-40 watts.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

dirtyblueshirt said:


> No word on if those are six full HD tuners, or would it be split like UVerse and be 3 HD and 3 SD tuners?


Uverse is limited by IP bandwidth into the home .. DIRECTV would not have that limitation using an 8 (or more) Channel SWM. If it were 3HD/3SD, it would be because DIRECTV chose to limit the tuning capability of the device. I'm not sure that would be wise as it's a limitation that could easily be worked around by putting in the right hardware to start with. The IP bandwidth limitation is a physical limitation in existing infrastructure.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

Ken_F said:


> The BCM7400 became available in volume around this time last year, so that's the SoC you would expect to see in a new DirecTV DVR released in the next month or two. The BCM7400 also supports six TS inputs, but it can only handle buffers and trickplay with four tuners at a time.
> 
> Assuming DirecTV HD bitrates, the BCM7400 could probably stream three recorded programs to different rooms while it records four DirecTV HD programs. I don't know what kind of resources RVU requires, or whether Broadcom is even supporting that feature on the BCM7400.
> 
> Broadcom did say they would be showing a next-generation BCM7420 setup at CES with RVU, so this _could_ be that demo. The BCM7420 just started shipping, but it became available pre-release form more than 10 months ago. That's the only way you get multi-room with six tuners.


Thanks for that!


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## MadManNBama (Jan 31, 2008)

Alan Gordon said:


> SOURCE?!?!
> 
> Though I like the idea of the whole-home DVR in practice, I don't like the idea of:
> 
> ...


Well Alan, considering the points you've made, I have reservations also, particularly with #1 and #4.

Will DirecTV allow us to attach an external HD to backup the recordings on the DVR? Or, will it only extend the size of the HD in the DVR?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ken_F said:


> The BCM7400 became available in volume around this time last year, so that's the SoC you would expect to see in a new DirecTV DVR released in the next month or two. The BCM7400 also supports six TS inputs, but it can only handle buffers and trickplay with four tuners at a time.
> 
> Assuming DirecTV HD bitrates, the BCM7400 could probably stream three recorded programs to different rooms while it records four DirecTV HD programs. I don't know what kind of resources RVU requires, or whether Broadcom is even supporting that feature on the BCM7400.
> 
> Broadcom did say they would show a next-generation BCM7420 setup at CES with RVU, so this _could_ be that demo. The BCM7420 just started shipping, but it became available in pre-release form more than 10 months ago. That's the only way you get multi-room with six tuners.


Look, at right side of the DVR - open PCB !
Could our members make better pictures of it ?!


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## bakerfall (Aug 23, 2006)

MadManNBama said:


> Well Alan, considering the points you've made, I have reservations also, particularly with #1 and #4.
> 
> Will DirecTV allow us to attach an external HD to backup the recordings on the DVR? Or, will it only extend the size of the HD in the DVR?


It will probably work the same way as the external HD on the HR2X series and replace the internal HD.


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## Movieman (May 9, 2009)

Alan Gordon said:


> SOURCE?!?!
> 
> Though I like the idea of the whole-home DVR in practice, I don't like the idea of:
> 
> ...


I believe that the requirement with DECA is that it will have only 1 line to each receiver as it is now. SWiM install is only one coax into the property and split to each receiver. You would have to see the First Look in the CE forum for more details.


----------



## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

Movieman said:


> I believe that the requirement with DECA is that it will have only 1 line to each receiver as it is now. SWiM install is only one coax into the property and split to each receiver. You would have to see the First Look in the CE forum for more details.


That's correct - DECA and SWiM both use the same (single) coax run to a receiver, and it can be either RG6 or old in-the-wall RG59 from legacy builds or cable installs.


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

Movieman said:


> I believe that the requirement with DECA





Movieman said:


> You would have to see the First Look in the CE forum for more details.


Hypothetically, if there were to be a First Look of the DECA, and it wasn't released to the non-CE areas of the site, it's probably for a reason, so I'm going to refrain from discussing the nuts and bolts of said rumored device until the contents of said "hypothetical" First Look was made public.

That being said, my understanding of said possible future device doesn't explain how it would do away with coax coming FROM the server TO the client, unless it was a unique line from the SWM... and my understanding of this server is that there is no signal coming from the satellite, but rather from the server?

Unless I'm missing something obvious... which wouldn't surprise me...

~Alan


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

bakerfall said:


> It will probably work the same way as the external HD on the HR2X series and replace the internal HD.


Keep in mind that the HR21/HR22/HR23 use a SoC with a single SATA connection. The hardware was physically incapable of accessing more than one drive at a time. TiVo was able to support simultaneous internal and external drives on their boxes, because they added a second SATA controller specifically for that purpose.

These limitations do not apply to Broadcom's newer SoCs, virtually all of which have two SATA connections to support both internal and external drives. The next DirecTV DVR will almost certainly have the hardware necessary to support two drives at once; that capability may not be supported in the initial software release, but it could be added with an update.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> That being said, my understanding of said possible future device doesn't explain how it would do away with coax coming FROM the server TO the client, unless it was a unique line from the SWM... and my understanding of this server is that there is no signal coming from the satellite, but rather from the server?
> 
> Unless I'm missing something obvious... which wouldn't surprise me...
> 
> ~Alan


With the use of a SWiM, it frees up below 970 MHz, for communication between receivers over the same SAT feed coax.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

kevinturcotte said:


> Is this the "Whole Home" Server?


Yes


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Movieman said:


> I believe that the requirement with DECA is that it will have only 1 line to each receiver as it is now. SWiM install is only one coax into the property and split to each receiver. You would have to see the First Look in the CE forum for more details.


all boxes running moca attach to a single wire liek SWM or cable splitter so only one wire is needed


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

bakerfall said:


> Only "source" that I have is that it was mentioned in a DirecTV presentation years ago, and that it's been speculated upon since. Sorry, I don't remember the specifics of that presentation.
> 
> As for the whole home DVR, it's basically the same configuration as U-Verse, which given D*'s relationship with ATT for bundles, that's probably on purpose. I prefer having seperate DVRs with MRV to provide the redundancy that this solution lacks.


Uverse is a multi room dgvr you cannot get DVR on live tv except in living room,you can only playtback something from the main box. This box can support at least 4 live TVs


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

kevinturcotte said:


> So would the clients not be watching Live Tv then? OR they'd be taking a tuner away that could be recording? If that's the case, I can see 2 problems. First one is easy to deal with, but what if you have more clients than actual tuners? Get into the uVerse problem (Limited number of tuners)? Second, what happens if 3 or 4 programs are scheduled to record, and one or more of the clients decides to watch Live Tv?


I assume the same conflict resolution as today depending on how many total tuners there are in the box.You can cancel a recording to view live just like today.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ken_F said:


> Keep in mind that the HR21/HR22/HR23 use a SoC with a single SATA connection. The hardware was physically incapable of accessing more than one drive at a time. TiVo was able to support simultaneous internal and external drives on their boxes, because they added a second SATA controller specifically for that purpose.
> 
> These limitations do not apply to Broadcom's newer SoCs, virtually all of which have two SATA connections to support both internal and external drives. The next DirecTV DVR will almost certainly have the hardware necessary to support two drives at once; that capability may not be supported in the initial software release, but it could be added with an update.


If you're referring to BCM7038, then it is not true. The chip has two SATA ports/channels; using them both is different point, because it is SW implementation.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

dirtyblueshirt said:


> No word on if those are six full HD tuners, or would it be split like UVerse and be 3 HD and 3 SD tuners?


AT&T is IP . They dont have tuners just a limit on bandwidth and decoders. They can play back 4 SD or 3 HD but that is due ot their 25 mbps into the home etc


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

kevinturcotte said:


> See if you can get an actual model number!! Wondering if this is the phantom HR24!!


No HR24 is same tuners as an HR21-23 with MOCA and new cpu.


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

dvrblogger said:


> I assume the same conflict resolution as today depending on how many total tuners there are in the box.You can cancel a recording to view live just like today.


It would be interesting to know if there is a limit of 50 on Series Links...

~Alan


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

P Smith said:


> If you're referring to BCM7038, then it is not true. The chip has two SATA ports/channels; using them both is different point, because it is SW implementation.


I did not mention the HR20. You're right that the HR20 used the BCM7038. I doubt DirecTV wanted to invest the resources to support internal+external storage on the discontinued HR20 when they could not do the same for the HR21/HR22/HR23 (BCM7401).


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

So the conundrum is going to be. Do they charge a mirror fee to a dummy box and if they chose not too how many people scream because they were never installed with SWM.

It will also be interesting to see the expandability of these as well in terms of how many can be present in the same home. So far this wouldn't cut it for me.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> So the conundrum is going to be. Do they charge a mirror fee to a dummy box and if they chose not too how many people scream because they were never installed with SWM.
> 
> It will also be interesting to see the expandability of these as well in terms of how many can be present in the same home. So far this wouldn't cut it for me.


Since the clients themselves don't actually have a tuner, or even a card, I wouldn't think they'd charge a mirroring fee. Course, whatever they do, they'll find SOME way to get the money anyway. Higher up front costs, or a special "Home Media Server" monthly fee, something like that.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Well folks...just to clarify a few things on this topic -
Smiddy, RichieRich,and I visited the Entropic (and many other) locations at CES yesterday.

We had some very fortunate timing in our visit - most of the personnel in that booth are not DirecTV staff, nor have any official affiliation other than as distributors or partner vendors.

In fact, in speaking with 2 of them in the beginning, we did not get the same information - come contradictions....many unknowns when it came to answers.

Bottom line so far - a significant amount of the information posted to date in this thread is simply wrong information = not all of it - but much of it.

Our good fortune came when a significant DirecTV staff member appeared in the booth, and extended dialog took place.

A few points that will perhaps sift through the "facts":

1) Like many of the vendors/manufacturers at CES, booth content is often is prototype (not the actual devices which will be eventually produced for the public). This vendor is/was not exception. Some of what was displayed/viewed was simply conceptual, beta, prototype hardware.

2) Based on #1, and after speaking with folks "in the know", speculation of verbal information conveyed at the CES was littered with misinformation, guesswork, and ambiguous data.

3) While DirecTV was not a formal exhibitor at CES, they have/had some respectable and knowledgeable staff in multiple locations with multiple hardware and new product previews presented.

Please note...in our discussions with this key person from DirecTV, we agree to honor confidentiality on some information that was conveyed. We all agreed to honor and respect those areas of specific things.

That said, some of the information in this thread is accurate, some is not. In order to properly respect what was learned, we are unable to completely disclose which is which - particularly since there are still "things in progress that are not finalized" in equipment, products, and services referenced here.

In the end --- those of us that gathered yesterday to gain some "interesting" information will share what we can - including photos - in our "At The CES" postings --- but all the answers posed here will NOT be addressed or clarified.

We're gonna share all we can, which is a great deal more information than was actually confirmed to date. There are alot of exciting things coming down the pike....but some of those are nor firmed up, and others are going to be made known by DirecTV once they wish them known - likely through the Mods here.

In the mean time, and since its very early here this morning local time....hope to have more in the


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## Sgt. Slaughter (Feb 20, 2009)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Well folks...just to clarify a few things on this topic -
> Smiddy, RichieRich,and I visited the Entropic (and many other) locations at CES yesterday.
> 
> We had some very fortunate timing in our visit - most of the personnel in that booth are not DirecTV staff, nor have any official affiliation other than as distributors or partner vendors.
> ...


What a frusterating post to read through there. lol
"I know some things but I can not tell" 
I love all the work you do but always hate that line b/c it seems pointless to post it unless you actually show/tell something at least that was posted and wrong or new information.

Hope you guys are enjoying the CES! Wish I coulda make the plane trip form the east coast to go, as most CErs im big into the "Next Thing" thats out there in tech world.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Sgt. Slaughter said:


> What a frusterating post to read through there. lol
> "I know some things but I can not tell"
> I love all the work you do but always hate that line b/c it seems pointless to post it unless you actually show/tell something at least that was posted and wrong or new information.
> 
> Hope you guys are enjoying the CES! Wish I coulda make the plane trip form the east coast to go, as most CErs im big into the "Next Thing" thats out there in tech world.


Not to worry....we just wanted to set expectations a bit.

There have been tons of rumors, guesses, speculation, etc...on many topics regarding future DirecTV plans.

We intend to share everything we can here in our reports. We simply cannot share every small detail, as a *few *of those we agreed were confidential.

That said, alot was *learned*, alot will be posted and shared here - including more photos.

The Smiddy/HDTVFAN report may take a day or two to assemble (he's on a plane today and I'm flying back tomorrow and going back into CES today again), but our brain dump (which in my case generally doesn't take long ) will share plenty of info, and also clear up some misinformation and confirm other things as well. The goal is to share things that are fact, and not fiction.

P.S...its freakin 5:30am local time here...so bear with any incoherent thoughts I post...


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## Sgt. Slaughter (Feb 20, 2009)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not to worry....we just wanted to set expectations a bit.
> 
> There have been tons of rumors, guesses, speculation, etc...on many topics regarding future DirecTV plans.
> 
> ...


with that much tech in 1 place in such a short period of time incoherent thoughts are expected at times. A lot of info to take on all at once, plus the surounding environment to the CES on the outside probably makes it even a lil more difficult. lol


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Sgt. Slaughter said:


> with that much tech in 1 place in such a short period of time incoherent thoughts are expected at times. A lot of info to take on all at once, plus the surrounding environment to the CES on the outside probably makes it even a lil more difficult. lol


Indeed....my feet are still a bit sore from walking through the huge Las Vegas multiple Convention Halls at CES yesterday - which, of course, is why I'm going to do it yet again today....:lol:

Most people don't realize how big the show is...monstrously huge....thousands of booths and over 100,000 attendees.

Several of us DBSTalkers went to a number of strategic locations with various DirecTV "synergies" along product and service ties.

More reports and photos coming....we learned alot, and intend to share alot. 

Most important, I can't believe I've been on DBSTalk for over an hour starting at 4:30am local time yet again....Oh Wait....yes,,,,I guess I can believe it. Sleep is over-rated.


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## wingrider01 (Sep 9, 2005)

dvrblogger said:


> AT&T is IP . They dont have tuners just a limit on bandwidth and decoders. They can play back 4 SD or 3 HD but that is due ot their 25 mbps into the home etc


actually I beleive it is the 32 mbps profile not the 25, the 25 has been out for a while in all locations. Sister's system just got the 32 profile last week


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## Valve1138 (Apr 26, 2008)

This certainly looks like a neat product.

If I can use my existing H2x's and HR21 as a client I'll be very pleased. Might even consider ditching my SageTV setup for TV recording if I can record 4 shows at once.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Valve1138 said:


> If I can use my existing H2x's and HR21 as a client I'll be very pleased.


We'll cover that in our joint report later...but yes...there are a number of configurations possible with this prototype unit.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Folks have noticed the DECA at the Entropic booth .. Here's an exclusive first-hand look at the new DIRECTV Ethernet over Coax (DECA) device .. This is DIRECTV's implementation of MoCa ..

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=170910


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## Valve1138 (Apr 26, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> We'll cover that in our joint report later...but yes...there are a number of configurations possible with this prototype unit.


Excellent, thanks!


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## Sgt. Slaughter (Feb 20, 2009)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> ...
> Most people don't realize how big the show is...monstrously huge....thousands of booths and over 100,000 attendees.
> ...


Indeed, I think its like 48football fields of display area or something gigantic like that. A whole lot of area to cover esp when you throw in the fact that its not all completely open and there press rooms and different places so its easy to miss stuff, or just get drained from being overwhelmed.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

HR24 = multiroom DVR server, H24 = multiroom receiver? Also RVU supported TV's will be able to link to HR24 without need for box. Presumably there is a very high likelihood Pace is manufacturing this product / won a contract to supply? It sounds like Directv will pay around $700 to Pace per box as Directv CFO suggested so on 5/1.

One of the Pace engineers working on the project was suggested as Jean-Michel-Marrot according to his linked-in profile.

Pace have been very cagey about the outlook for 2010 and very unusually omitted any mention in last week's trading statement. This high profile confidential launch for Directv must be a driver along with the significant potential for Directv to be buying Multidweller from Pace also? Both are to be launched within the next two months according to Directv's CFO on 5/1.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

PaceHD said:


> HR24 = multiroom DVR server, H24 = multiroom receiver? Also RVU supported TV's will be able to link to HR24 without need for box. Presumably there is a very high likelihood Pace is manufacturing this product / won a contract to supply? It sounds like Directv will pay around $700 to Pace per box as Directv CFO suggested so on 5/1.
> 
> One of the Pace engineers working on the project was suggested as Jean-Michel-Marrot according to his linked-in profile.
> 
> Pace have been very cagey about the outlook for 2010 and very unusually omitted any mention in last week's trading statement. This high profile confidential launch for Directv must be a driver along with the significant potential for Directv to be buying Multidweller from Pace also? Both are to be launched within the next two months according to Directv's CFO on 5/1.


No signs of this at the CES, and we DO know that the prototype at the CES was NOT a Pace unit....other than that....not much more to offer on that topic.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

I thought the unit had a /700 code? A Pace engineer certainly mentions it on Linked-in.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

PaceHD said:


> I thought the unit had a /700 code? A Pace engineer certainly mentions it on Linked-in.


Not the publically displayed unit.....perhaps elsewhere behind the scenes in another location.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

Post #39 from Draconis mentioned the /700 model number however the post has now been modified removing this!


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

PaceHD said:


> Post #39 from Draconis mentioned the /700 model number however the post has now been modified removing this!


What was speculated, assumed, or thought does not reflect what was seen.

Draconis indeed posted correctly based on the best information in his post.

Having seen clear documentation yesterday....we know the prototype in the public-open booth was NOT from Pace.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

Are you allowed to say who the prototype is by? The Pace engineer's linked-in page suggests a good chance Pace will be one of the suppliers I think.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

Pace are exhibiting at CES according to their website. I wonder if there is anything Directv related there?


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## damondlt (Feb 27, 2006)

This is a great sign, for a really Bright future for D*.
Now lets just get those national HD channels.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Having seen clear documentation yesterday....we know the prototype in the public-open booth was NOT from Pace.


The photo almost certainly pegs it as a Samsung (-200) effort.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

What leads you to believe from the photo its Samsung? I would have thought most likely to be Cisco or Pace and we are told not pace?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

PaceHD said:


> What leads you to believe from the photo its Samsung? I would have thought most likely to be Cisco or Pace and we are told not pace?


Its neither.


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

Surely not Thompson or Motorola? Is the prototype made by anyone?


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> No signs of this at the CES, and we DO know that the prototype at the CES was NOT a Pace unit....other than that....not much more to offer on that topic.


Were you able to confirm whether this was the BCM7420 RVU solution that Broadcom said they would display (link) at CES?

I have not heard of any other booths showing RVU solutions.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

PaceHD said:


> Surely not Thompson or Motorola? Is the prototype made by anyone?


There are at least 5 manufactures of MPEG-4 HD receivers that DirecTV is involved with and Motorola isn't one of them, to my knowledge.


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

PaceHD said:


> What leads you to believe from the photo its Samsung?


The picture looked remarkably like a Samsung BD-P3600. Looking at pictures from other sources (Engadget), it appears that it isn't the decidedly inward slanting design that I thought it was.

Humax and Thomson are on the RVU list as well as Motorola.

Entropic has been demonstrating various MoCA configurations with different partners since the 2005 CES.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Certainly the equipment is still in the prototype stage so it will probably be a while before we see any of this equipment for real .. But yes, it's a good sign to see something new .. WooHoo!


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## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

Directv CFO does say that multiroom and multidweller will be launched in the next two months: http://www.veracast.com/webcasts/citigroup/emt2010/44103114.cfm


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

Wish I could get a closer look at the rear connections of both the server-DVR and client. Since in this CES display setup the server and client ethernet connectivity are via DECA modules, I wonder how the DECA modules are being powered at each end? 

Through the coaxial pigtail from the DECA module to an F-connector supplying DC power to each DECA on the server and client?

Therefore each of the eight possible client station outputs on the server-DVR consist of a separate ethernet port for the data streams and a female F-connector which only supplies DC voltage for a DECA module if used? 

I can't believe it requires a cumbersome arrangement of separate power adapters for the DECAs on each side of the client-server link.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

HoTat2 said:


> Wish I could get a closer look at the rear connections of both the server-DVR and client. Since in this CES display setup the server and client ethernet connectivity are via DECA modules, I wonder how the DECA modules are being powered at each end?


The DECA units we got to test were powered by the STB's coax/sat connection, no external power supply needed. I would assume that the demo units would also be able to do that.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

RAD said:


> The DECA units we got to test were powered by the STB's coax/sat connection, no external power supply needed. I would assume that the demo units would also be able to do that.


Then it should be one pair on each client and eight pairs on the server-DVR comprising an RJ-45 ethernet port and an accompanying F connector which supplies only DC power for DECAs if used to connect a server-DVR/client combo?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> Then it should be one pair on each client and eight pairs on the server-DVR comprising an RJ-45 ethernet port and an accompanying F connector which supplies only DC power for DECAs if used to connect a server-DVR/client combo?


One on each unit.


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## jacmyoung (Sep 9, 2006)

I think this is the right place to ask. According to Engadget this HR24 is "built on DLNA", if so, can we assume the HR24 is very different than whatever the new DirecTiVo will be since TiVo is not a DLNA member?

And why is this in the "HD Receiver" forum? This server appears to be the mother of all DVRs


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I think it's fair to say that HR24 and TiVo seem to be different things.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

veryoldschool said:


> One on each unit.


Only one pair of ethernet port/F connecters on the server-DVR and client?

So only one client box can be connected to the server-DVR by DECA modules without needing individual power adapters for them?


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

jacmyoung said:


> I think this is the right place to ask. According to Engadget this HR24 is "built on DLNA", if so, can we assume the HR24 is very different than whatever the new DirecTiVo will be since TiVo is not a DLNA member?
> 
> And why is this in the "HD Receiver" forum? This server appears to be the mother of all DVRs


With the reorganization of the forums, HD DVRs and HD receivers are both in this forum.

"Built on DLNA" hopefully means we will see some Media Share improvements (trickplay, more codecs, etc.) when these come along (which hopefully can be included in the current hardware, as well).


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> Only one pair of ethernet port/F connecters on the server-DVR and client?
> 
> So only one client box can be connected to the server-DVR by DECA modules without needing individual power adapters for them?


The First Look indicates that each receiver can power its DECA, so a bunch of adapters won't be required (one is needed for the connection to the rest of your network).


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

jacmyoung said:


> I think this is the right place to ask. According to Engadget this HR24 is "built on DLNA", if so, can we assume the HR24 is very different than whatever the new DirecTiVo will be since TiVo is not a DLNA member?


I wouldn't read too much into that.



bobnielsen said:


> "Built on DLNA" hopefully means we will see some Media Share improvements (trickplay, more codecs, etc.) when these come along (which hopefully can be included in the current hardware, as well).


The current hardware is limited in the codecs it supports, and software will not change that. For example, native DIVX support is not something you will ever see on existing DirecTV hardware.

DLNA itself has little to do with support for specific codecs.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

bobnielsen said:


> The First Look indicates that each receiver can power its DECA, so a bunch of adapters won't be required (one is needed for the connection to the rest of your network).


Sure;

One pair needed on the server-DVR for connection to a router to access the rest of the home network. But don't you need an additional eight individual pairs on the server-DVR to connect up to the eight clients to it with DECA modules in a star configuration with the server-DVR at the center?


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## dsw2112 (Jun 13, 2009)

jacmyoung said:


> I think this is the right place to ask. According to Engadget this HR24 is "built on DLNA", if so, can we assume the HR24 is very different than whatever the new DirecTiVo will be since TiVo is not a DLNA member?
> 
> And why is this in the "HD Receiver" forum? This server appears to be the mother of all DVRs


Since it has been said that there's mis-information in this thread, I "think" we'll soon discover that the HR24 is not going to become the "mother of all DVR's." There are certain to be changes from previous DVR's, but don't be surprised if this actually isn't the whole home DVR with 3+ tuners, as well as a number of other features that were originally stated by the booth rep. It's certainly "possible" that the setup is just a mock-up of how the whole-home server would work with the HR24 playing that "role"...


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

HoTat2 said:


> One pair needed on the server-DVR for connection to a router to access the rest of the home network. But don't you need an additional eight individual pairs on the server-DVR to connect up to the eight clients to it with DECA modules in a star configuration with the server-DVR at the center?


The DECA is powered by the HR2x, and provides full IP capability to the attached HR2x, just as if it was hardwire connected.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> Sure;
> 
> One pair needed on the server-DVR for connection to a router to access the rest of the home network. But don't you need an additional eight individual pairs on the server-DVR to connect up to the eight clients to it with DECA modules in a star configuration with the server-DVR at the center?


Nope, DECA is a loop topology, much like the old BNC 10Base-T coax networks of yore.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

The DECA communication shares the cabling used to distribute the satellite channels from the SWM. See http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2327377#post2327377.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

LameLefty said:


> Nope, DECA is a loop topology, much like the old BNC 10Base-T coax networks of yore.


Yes, but this Whole Home DVR on display here at CES connects to it's individual client boxes in a star topology with the server-DVR at the center or hub correct?

Therefore if each individual server-client connection uses DECA modules at each end doesn't that mean eight ethernet port/F connector pairs on the server-DVR and one pair on each client then?

Not counting an additional pair (nine total now) on the server-DVR for connection to a home network router.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

PaceHD said:


> HR24 = multiroom DVR server, H24 = multiroom receiver? Also RVU supported TV's will be able to link to HR24 without need for box. Presumably there is a very high likelihood Pace is manufacturing this product / won a contract to supply? It sounds like Directv will pay around $700 to Pace per box as Directv CFO suggested so on 5/1.
> 
> One of the Pace engineers working on the project was suggested as Jean-Michel-Marrot according to his linked-in profile.
> 
> Pace have been very cagey about the outlook for 2010 and very unusually omitted any mention in last week's trading statement. This high profile confidential launch for Directv must be a driver along with the significant potential for Directv to be buying Multidweller from Pace also? Both are to be launched within the next two months according to Directv's CFO on 5/1.


HR24 is a follow on to HR23 NOT the WHole Home DVR coming very soon !!


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

HoTat2 said:


> Yes, but this Whole Home DVR on display here at CES connects to it's individual client boxes in a star topology with the server-DVR at the center or hub correct?
> 
> Therefore if each individual server-client connection uses DECA modules at each end doesn't that mean eight ethernet port/F connector pairs on the server-DVR and one pair on each client then?
> 
> Not counting an additional pair (nine total now) on the server-DVR for connection to a home network router.


DECA is used to connect to the router (one per home) and for legacy boxes. New whole home has built in MOCA as do the client as seen at the Entropic booth.


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Sixto said:


> The DECA is powered by the HR2x, and provides full IP capability to the attached HR2x, just as if it was hardwire connected.


The diagram presented is only for MRV. Whole Home have built in MOCA and do not require DECA except for connection to internet/router.


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

PaceHD said:


> Directv CFO does say that multiroom and multidweller will be launched in the next two months: http://www.veracast.com/webcasts/citigroup/emt2010/44103114.cfm


That is the software version aka MRV Multi room. The new box is commonly reffered to as a whole home DVR as it provides full DVR experience at each TV including LIve and recorded just like a standard HR21 just supporting more clients and more tuners


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

dvrblogger said:


> DECA is used to connect to the router (one per home) and for legacy boxes. New whole home has built in MOCA as do the client as seen at the Entropic booth.


OK, thats it, thanks!! 

Thats what was confusing me, as I couldn't really see from the photos if the DECA modules were connecting only the router which is understandable, or DECA module pairs for both router and thinnet client box.


----------



## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

HoTat2 said:


> Yes, but this Whole Home DVR on display here at CES connects to it's individual client boxes in a star topology with the server-DVR at the center or hub correct?
> 
> Therefore if each individual server-client connection uses DECA modules at each end doesn't that mean eight ethernet port/F connector pairs on the server-DVR and one pair on each client then?
> 
> Not counting an additional pair (nine total now) on the server-DVR for connection to a home network router.


You're getting "lost" in the picture. Don't, really. It's not that complicated. Think of the coax sat line infrastructure of a typical modern Directv installation. For ease of description imagine a SWiM LNB with one line coming into the house going to a single 4-way splitter, and four individual lines feeding receivers in four locations. DECA technology allows them all to communicate with each other through the sat lines, without the need for a central "star" like a router. However, if you want the DECA "cloud" boxes to have a connection to the external internet or the rest of your home LAN, another DECA module is used to bridge the "cloud" of coax-connected boxes to the rest of the ethernet-based network, such as to your router.

But in any event, no server will require more than a single line to connect to the rest of the DECA cloud. Each box communicates to the rest the same way.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

dvrblogger said:


> DECA is used to connect to the router (one per home) and for legacy boxes. New whole home has built in MOCA as do the client as seen at the Entropic booth.


So if the whole home DVR is located at the router, no DECA would be needed at all, correct?


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

dvrblogger said:


> The diagram presented is only for MRV. Whole Home have built in MOCA and do not require DECA except for connection to internet/router.


The diagram is for any IP/UDP communication with any device. Built-in DECA would changed nothing, other then the need for a separate external receiver DECA.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Think of the DECA modules as a fat splitter to "split" the SWM signal and the Ethernet so that you can use it a the particular receiver that it is plugged into.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

DECA and MoCA are roughly equivalent in the technology, but use different frequencies and therefore are not compatible with each other (they can interconnect via ethernet, however).


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

hilmar2k said:


> So if the whole home DVR is located at the router, no DECA would be needed at all, correct?


A DECA has been required to provide the DECA-cloud to home network bridge. Attaching hardwire Ethernet to any receiver within the DECA-cloud has been categorized as unsupported.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

What about those that don't have high speed internet? Would they even need to connect a DECA box to a router? Or just have DECA boxes at each receiver?


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Sixto said:


> A DECA has been required to provide the DECA-cloud to home network bridge. Attaching hardwire Ethernet to any receiver within the DECA-cloud has been categorized as unsupported.


Maybe I need to rephrase. It was noted that the whole home DVR has built in MOCA, and that the DECA shown in the photos from CES is to get the internet to the server. However, if the server is located at the point of internet (router), you would not need DECA at all, right? Why would I need DECA to move the internet from a router that is next to the server?


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> What about those that don't have high speed internet? Would they even need to connect a DECA box to a router? Or just have DECA boxes at each receiver?


I have a Linksys router with DD-WRT being used as a bridge hooked up to my HR23-700 in order for my DECA cloud to be connected to the internet. Like Sixto says, it's unsupported by DirecTV, but it does work. I'll eventually hook mine up to the router with the modem on it, but in the meantime, I don't want any more holes in the house at this time.

To answer your question, I recently switched wireless security settings on my main router which left my DECA cloud from the internet for a few weeks, but the DECA cloud still worked perfectly with those items on the network... so no, they would not need to connect the DECA box to a router.

~Alan


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## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

hilmar2k said:


> Maybe I need to rephrase. It was noted that the whole home DVR has built in MOCA, and that the DECA shown in the photos from CES is to get the internet to the server. However, if the server is located at the point of internet (router), you would not need DECA at all, right? Why would I need DECA to move the internet from a router that is next to the server?


The network-DECA provides connectivity from the DECA-cloud to the home network / internet.

Directly attaching Ethernet to a server could provide home network / internet connectivity to the server.

We'd need to see when/if the DECA is built-in whether a network-DECA is still required.

As mentioned earlier, for receivers with two Ethernet ports (HR21/HR22/HR23), providing home network / internet connectivity for the DECA cloud, through the 2nd Ethernet port of a DECA connected receiver has been unsupported.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

hilmar2k said:


> So if the whole home DVR is located at the router, no DECA would be needed at all, correct?


No the issue is connecting the moca coax network to the web via router requires a MOCA-Ethernet conversion . Theonly way not to need a DECA was if someone made a MOCA based Router/switch that supported MOCA and optionally ethernet to DSL/Cablemodem


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

hilmar2k said:


> Maybe I need to rephrase. It was noted that the whole home DVR has built in MOCA, and that the DECA shown in the photos from CES is to get the internet to the server. However, if the server is located at the point of internet (router), you would not need DECA at all, right? Why would I need DECA to move the internet from a router that is next to the server?


You would need DECA sp MOCA network cam access broadband unless the HRbox was used to bridge the two networks and connect to the router.


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## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

kevinturcotte said:


> What about those that don't have high speed internet? Would they even need to connect a DECA box to a router? Or just have DECA boxes at each receiver?


No


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Some of us who are still here at CES today learned a few more details about the prototype....

1) It is NOT an HR24

2) It is a prototype, and as Draconis indicated earlier....made by Pace. We got conflicting information from 3 different folks we talked to....but the best source who would really know confirmed that the onsite unit was from Pace


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

dvrblogger said:


> How would MOCA network access broadband unless the HRbox was used to bridge the two networks and connect to the router.


With a seperate DECA adapter. Have you taken a look at the First Look document on DECA, http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=170910 ?


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

dvrblogger said:


> How would MOCA network access broadband unless the HRbox was used to bridge the two networks and connect to the router.


This is not a good way to connect the two networks ..


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## jacmyoung (Sep 9, 2006)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Some of us who are still here at CES today learned a few more details about the prototype....
> 
> 1) It is NOT an HR24
> 
> 2) It is a prototype, and as Draconis indicated earlier....made by Pace. We got conflicting information from 3 different folks we talked to....but the best source who would really know confirmed that the onsite unit was from Pace


What does that mean? It will be after the HR24 roll out, and since the HR24 release date is not known, we can expect this new server to be a lot later?


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

jacmyoung said:


> What does that mean? It will be after the HR24 roll out, and since the HR24 release date is not known, we can expect this new server to be a lot later?


The HR24 is essentially an updated version of the HR23 with a faster CPU and integrated DECA. It is due later this quarter.

As far as the "HM30" server, I would not expect it before the new STBs and DVRs with integrated DECA displace the current solutions at dealers and retailers.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

That sounds like a lot of speculation to me. I'm sure your sources are good but DIRECTV hasn't announced any of that.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Stuart Sweet said:


> That sounds like a lot of speculation to me. I'm sure your sources are good but DIRECTV hasn't announced any of that.


One of the realities from being on the ground at CES, asking alot of questions, and learned alot....is that we all still have alot more to "learn"...there are still as many questions as answers that came out of the CES.....but what we learned was intriguing.


----------



## Draconis (Mar 16, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> One of the realities from being on the ground at CES, asking alot of questions, and learned alot....is that we all still have alot more to "learn"...there are still as many questions as answers that came out of the CES.....but what we learned was intriguing.


I'll definitively agree to that.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

It's like an episode of _Lost_ .. One question get's answered but two more questions are asked.


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## stephenC (Jul 18, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> It's like an episode of _Lost_ .. One question get's answered but two more questions are asked.


The Lost series is ending with this season. Do you think we'll have MRV by the time all the questions are answered on the final episode of Lost?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

stephenC said:


> The Lost series is ending with this season. Do you think we'll have MRV by the time all the questions are answered on the final episode of Lost?


What does that have to do with seeing a new Server Box at CES? 

So anyway..... 

This bodes well for the future:


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Well it lets us know that DECA will work with an obsolete router :lol:


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## ryarber (Aug 3, 2008)

So, to move away from DECA and MOCA, does this thing have gigabit ethernet to support all those streams?

I guess if all you have is wifi bridge, you might as well have the HR-2x series since you wouldn't be able to do more than one stream at a time anyway, right?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Well it lets us know that DECA will work with an obsolete router :lol:


Yup...saw that firsthand....and noticed that too right away.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

ryarber said:


> So, to move away from DECA and MOCA, does this thing have gigabit ethernet to support all those streams?
> 
> I guess if all you have is wifi bridge, you might as well have the HR-2x series since you wouldn't be able to do more than one stream at a time anyway, right?


You don't need gigabit to handle 3 streams.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Stuart Sweet said:


> That sounds like a lot of speculation to me. I'm sure your sources are good but DIRECTV hasn't announced any of that.


I think Ken knows more than most realize!!!


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Ken_F said:


> Were you able to confirm whether this was the BCM7420 RVU solution that Broadcom said they would display (link) at CES?


The Directv Person I spoke too did confirm that it had an upgraded Broadcom Chipset in it but declined to specify exactly which Model Chipset it was using. But it is fairly obvious that it must be the Broadcom BCM7420 along with the BCM3549 if you look at the specs for those chipsets along with the fact that Broadcom mentioned they were displaying it at 2010 CES, isn't it?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> The Directv Person I spoke too did confirm that it had an upgraded Broadcom Chipset in it but declined to specify exactly which Model Chipset it was using. But it is fairly obvious that it must be the Broadcom BCM7420 along with the BCM3549 if you look at the specs for those chipsets along with the fact that Broadcom mentioned they were displaying it at 2010 CES, isn't it?


I wouldn't wager my money on it. 

In fact, since it was a prototype unit, it could change again by the time its deployed. Then again, you could be right as well.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> I wouldn't wager my money on it.
> 
> In fact, since it was a prototype unit, it could change again by the time its deployed. Then again, you could be right as well.


I am not wagering any money on it as it could be improved and probably will be but I would take it the way it is right now and be Happy from what I have seen.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> I am not wagering any money on it as it could be improved and probably will be but I would take it the way it is right now and be Happy from what I have seen.


Yup - bottom line is that puppy was FAST.


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## stephenC (Jul 18, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> What does that have to do with seeing a new Server Box at CES?


Oh, I think I was confused. I guess using MRV (multi-room viewing) was wrong. MRV and new server box are mutually exclusive? Thinking about it, I guess they are. You could do MRV with a HR-2x DVR and a H2x client. This new server box would use its own client boxes for remote viewing. Interesting. Am I close to being right?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

stephenC said:


> Oh, I think I was confused. I guess using MRV (multi-room viewing) was wrong. MRV and new server box are mutually exclusive? Thinking about it, I guess they are. You could do MRV with a HR-2x DVR and a H2x client. This new server box would use its own client boxes for remote viewing. Interesting. Am I close to being right?


There certainly could be a way that the new Server Box prototype we saw at CES could support MRV...and in more than one configuration...yes.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

stephenC said:


> Oh, I think I was confused. I guess using MRV (multi-room viewing) was wrong. MRV and new server box are mutually exclusive? Thinking about it, I guess they are. You could do MRV with a HR-2x DVR and a H2x client. This new server box would use its own client boxes for remote viewing. Interesting. Am I close to being right?


Yes you are right as hdtvfan0001 stated and I think that is the direction they are going. They will be putting the Client in various manufacturer's display devices so you will not even see the Client. However, what do you do when you need to replace the Client? It will have to be a Replaceable Module, as in Plug in Play.

The Client will not have a hard drive installed inside it as it won't need one.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

The HMC30 that was on display with Entropic is a different kind of MRV .. basically the endpoints (either a STB or a specially equipped TV) are dummy view ports that are extensions of the HMC30 running at various locations in your home.

It's a different concept than having multiple "servers" that act in a peer-to-peer arrangement.

The end result of course is very similar .. You can watch shows from the same "system" in multiple rooms .. a.k.a. multi-room viewing.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Doug Brott said:


> The HMC30 that was on display with Entropic is a different kind of MRV .. basically the endpoints (either a STB or a specially equipped TV) are dummy view ports that are extensions of the HMC30 running at various locations in your home.
> 
> It's a different concept than having multiple "servers" that act in a peer-to-peer arrangement.
> 
> The end result of course is very similar .. You can watch shows from the same "system" in multiple rooms .. a.k.a. multi-room viewing.


Good Point.

How do you tell the Server what to send to each different Client. I guess you Select a Recording and then Select the Client that will view that Recording.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

richierich said:


> Good Point.
> 
> How do you tell the Server what to send to each different Client. I guess you Select a Recording and then Select the Client that will view that Recording.


The client requests it.


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Well it lets us know that DECA will work with an obsolete router :lol:





hdtvfan0001 said:


> Yup...saw that firsthand....and noticed that too right away.


Looks like an 8 port switch to me, could be wrong though.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> The client requests it.


This has to be a "duh", client says "I want", server supplies. :lol:


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> This has to be a "duh", client says "I want", server supplies. :lol:


I was trying to be nice.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

dave29 said:


> Looks like an 8 port switch to me, could be wrong though.


Nope, pretty sure that's a BEFSR81 8 port router.

http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/products/BEFSR81


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

hilmar2k said:


> Nope, pretty sure that's a BEFSR81 8 port router.
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...twork+-+Routers+/+Remote-_-Linksys-_-33124022


Looks like I just got pwned in teh face. :lol:

Sorry to Stuart and HDTVfan for second guessing. :sure:

I have an old 8 port switch that looks just like that.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> This has to be a "duh", client says "I want", server supplies. :lol:


Yes it was a Brain Fart or as my wife says "A Senior Moment". :lol:


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

dave29 said:


> Looks like an 8 port switch to me, could be wrong though.


Behind that was something more "dated". 

We have that in some other photos...

...and on the other side (with the client)....more old stuff in back...


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hilmar2k said:


> I was trying to be nice.


Thanks for being Nice!!! But I can handle it. DUH!!! Oh why didn't I think of that? Makes alot of sense doesn't it? :lol:


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> I wouldn't wager my money on it.
> 
> In fact, since it was a prototype unit, it could change again by the time its deployed. Then again, you could be right as well.


If the chip selected for prototype by the company it will stay; it's not like other part what could be replaced after additional HW/SW team work. It is essential part around which is build a lot - whole HW design and a lot of SW development. Judging by real experience in similar devices.
Other manufacturer could pickup different one.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

P Smith said:


> If the chip selected for prototype by the company it will stay; it's not like other part what could be replaced after additional HW/SW team work. It is essential part around which is build a lot - whole HW design and a lot of SW development. Judging by real experience in similar devices.
> Other manufacturer could pickup different one.


Hopefully you are correct....but there's usually a reason they are called a prototype (as in...subject to change before production).


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

P Smith said:


> If the chip selected for prototype by the company it will stay; it's not like other part what could be replaced after additional HW/SW team work. It is essential part around which is build a lot - whole HW design and a lot of SW development. Judging by real experience in similar devices.
> Other manufacturer could pickup different one.


Well, there really isn't any other chipset that they would need that is out there right now, so I wouldn't think that would change. It does exactly what they want it to do.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> Well, there really isn't any other chipset that they would need that is out there right now, so I wouldn't think that would change. It does exactly what they want it to do.


Then again....I don't care if there was actually a hamster inside running a wheel....that puppy was fast. :lol:


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## mhayes70 (Mar 21, 2006)

Yeah, this is a very cool prototype. I do hope someday we will get to see this. But, I am not getting my hopes up yet. As we have seen many receiver's displayed at CES and never make it to our Living Rooms. I am keeping my finger's crossed.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

You seem to be mixing your genera. Was it a puppy or a hamster?


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Then again....I don't care if there was actually a hamster inside running a wheel....that puppy was fast. :lol:


It may have been Two Hamsters On Steroids to make it that FAST!!! :lol:

HDTVFANBOY, you are SO FUNNY!!! :lol:


----------



## stephenC (Jul 18, 2007)

richierich said:


> Good Point.
> 
> How do you tell the Server what to send to each different Client. I guess you Select a Recording and then Select the Client that will view that Recording.


Which chipsets? DECA? MOCA? All very important techy discussion topics. What I haven't seen is how will they charge us? Will a dumb, thin client still have a mirroring charge of $4.99/month? Will a HM30 server be charged as a multiple STBs? That is going to be very interesting to discuss.


----------



## stephenC (Jul 18, 2007)

PaceHD said:


> HR24 = multiroom DVR server, H24 = multiroom receiver? Also RVU supported TV's will be able to link to HR24 without need for box. Presumably there is a very high likelihood Pace is manufacturing this product / won a contract to supply? It sounds like Directv will pay around $700 to Pace per box as Directv CFO suggested so on 5/1.
> 
> One of the Pace engineers working on the project was suggested as Jean-Michel-Marrot according to his linked-in profile.
> 
> Pace have been very cagey about the outlook for 2010 and very unusually omitted any mention in last week's trading statement. This high profile confidential launch for Directv must be a driver along with the significant potential for Directv to be buying Multidweller from Pace also? Both are to be launched within the next two months according to Directv's CFO on 5/1.


Something that the Apple fans like to do is investigate the suppliers of specialized electronics (i.e. flat panels used for iPod Touch, etc). They use the information they gather about a supplier to conjecture what Apple will announce next. Maybe something like that could be done for D* STBs? Just a thought.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Stuart Sweet said:


> You seem to be mixing your genera. Was it a puppy or a hamster?


You have a point.


stephenC said:


> Which chipsets? DECA? MOCA? All very important techy discussion topics. What I haven't seen is how will they charge us? Will a dumb, thin client still have a mirroring charge of $4.99/month? Will a HM30 server be charged as a multiple STBs? That is going to be very interesting to discuss.


There was a prototype at the CES.

Every question was not asked, nor answered, especially since what we saw may/may not reflect the final version of that Home Media Server device.

We were NOT told which chipset specifically, but could see that there were some DECA devices connected as outside units. Again....this was not necessarily what the final version will look like.

As for costs...that is something much further down the road - if this thing comes out late 2010 or early 2011 as implied....then pricing will be detemined at that timeframe as well.


----------



## DogLover (Mar 19, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> You seem to be mixing your genera. Was it a puppy or a hamster?


I think the puppy was chasing the hamster. That's why the hamster was running so fast. :lol:



stephenC said:


> Which chipsets? DECA? MOCA? All very important techy discussion topics. What I haven't seen is how will they charge us? Will a dumb, thin client still have a mirroring charge of $4.99/month? Will a HM30 server be charged as a multiple STBs? That is going to be very interesting to discuss.


That is an interesting thought. If they don't charge for each client, then you have to assume they would charge more for the server. Not as fun as speculating about what's inside of the box, however.


----------



## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

stephenC said:


> Something that the Apple fans like to do is investigate the suppliers of specialized electronics (i.e. flat panels used for iPod Touch, etc). They use the information they gather about a supplier to conjecture what Apple will announce next. Maybe something like that could be done for D* STBs? Just a thought.


The Directv code warriors have a lot of experience with Broadcom's line of multimedia processors. Needless to say, there are some smart people here who spend some time digging through the Broadcom product info out on the web to fuel their conjectures and suppositions.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

LameLefty said:


> Needless to say, there are some smart people here who spend some time digging through the Broadcom product info out on the web to fuel their conjectures and suppositions.


Yes we do and there is nothing wrong with that as you can learn alot by researching!!!


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

LameLefty said:


> The Directv code warriors have a lot of experience with Broadcom's line of multimedia processors. Needless to say, *there are some smart people here who spend some time digging through the Broadcom product info out on the web *to fuel their conjectures and suppositions.


Not to mention a few barking up the wrong tree. 

But its all good.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Nothing wrong with conjecture, hypothesizing, postulating while speculating because if you remove that from this Forum then you have lost about 50% or more of the entire content of what goes on here.

That is one of the reasons people buy Lottery Tickets so they can Dream and Speculate about what they will do it they hit the Big One!!!

We spent over one year Speculating about the HR10-250 before it came out, what would it look like, what would it contain, etc. and it was alot of fun and keep us from getting Bored!!!


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not to mention a few barking up the wrong tree.
> 
> But its all good.


Well, if We the Unwashed Masses do not know as a Grasshopper, then please Master Po Enlighten Us As We Sit At The Feet Of The Master!!!

We have a Desire For Enlightenment!!!

P.S. It is Not Important How Much You Know or Whether You Know Everything!!!

What is Important Is What You Learn After You Know It All!!! (Quotation from the Great Master Richierich who taught Confucius in a Former Life) :lol:


----------



## smiddy (Apr 5, 2006)

richierich said:


> P.S. It is Not Important How Much You Know or Whether You Know Everything!!!
> 
> What is Important Is What You Learn After You Know It All!!! (Quotation from the Great Master Richierich who taught Confucius in a Former Life) :lol:


I had no idea!? Master!


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Here's what we learned at the CES from the DirecTV rep. This much is fact.

The HMC30 prototype we saw had a Broadcom chip set in it "newer than what is in the HR2x series HD DVRs right now". 

Anything beyond that was not confirmed, and subject to guess, speculation, and all that other stuff.

Based on seeing how fast the unit performed, there was simply no doubt it was significantly faster than the current generation HD DVRs. As to what specific chip set - we won't KNOW that until likely later this year at the earliest.

Hope that clears up the ongoing guesswork.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

smiddy said:


> I had no idea!? Master!


That is because you are Not Enlightened yet but I think we can work on it in forthcoming sessions!!! :lol:


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Here's what we learned at the CES from the DirecTV rep. This much is fact.
> 
> The HMC30 prototype we saw had a Broadcom chip set in it "newer than what is in the HR2x series HD DVRs right now".


DUH!!! And no one ever said that they told us what model chipset was in that HMC30. We are Speculating and it is Fun!!!

Directv already made that mistake before of not buying the right chipset to adequately support their upcoming DVR (perhaps because of timing or money) so look at the available Broadcom Chipsets that have come out since the HR23 and see what Directv might be interested in and there you go, BINGO!!!

It ain't Rocket Science to know that they need a Faster Processor, etc. So it is evident that they are going with a much better chipset this time and it doesn't take alot to guess which one they will go with especially if you are as Savvy as LameLefty or VeryOldSchool, etc.

Bottom Line is we are getting a better, faster DVR which will better support MRV and other things in the Future which is not very far away.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Here's what we learned at the CES from the DirecTV rep. This much is fact.
> 
> The HMC30 prototype we saw had a *Broadcom chip set* in it "newer than what is in the HR2x series HD DVRs right now".
> 
> ...


It wasn't hard to guess if you did take a look at right - there was a PCB with all components visible.


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## stephenC (Jul 18, 2007)

richierich said:


> <<snipped>>
> 
> Bottom Line is we are getting a better, faster DVR which will better support MRV and other things in the Future which is not very far away.


I'm sorry, but weren't we discussing this and saying just that about two years ago? Maybe I should do a RIP van Winkle and you can wake me when I can order a STB or 8 tuner home server from the D* website. Speculation is only fun for a few months.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

P Smith said:


> It wasn't hard to guess if you did take a look at right - there was a PCB with all components visible.


Are you sure? It wouldn't be unusual for non-functional mock-ups and outdated boards be put on display on purpose. It also wouldn't be unusual for the chips to have had certain markings obscured or removed for public display.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

If I would be there, I would find a way to compare mentioned PCB and back side of that HMC30 prototype ( it wasn't mockup). Unfortunately the board spotted on a picture from other site.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

LameLefty said:


> Are you sure? It wouldn't be unusual for non-functional mock-ups and outdated boards be put on display on purpose. It also wouldn't be unusual for the chips to have had certain markings obscured or removed for public display.


That has happened before....even the car manufacturers do it with their prototypes....


P Smith said:


> If would be there I would find a way to compare mentioned PCB and back side of that HMC30 prototype ( it wasn't mockup). Unfortunately the board spotted on a picture from other site.


I wish I could understand your post to respond... :shrug:


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> That has happened before....even the car manufacturers do it with their prototypes....


They sure do. About a month ago I saw a caravan of carefully taped and "de-badged" small SUVs driving through town, a couple of which were clearly existing BMW X-series and the rest of which were . . . something else. All had SC plates though (BMW has a plant in SC).

Markings can and are removed or altered for trade shows, empty boxes are rigged up with pretty LEDs and cables with the real images coming from other sources, etc. It's all marketing and should ALL be taken with a grain of salt until a production unit can be taken with a Torx bit.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

LameLefty said:


> They sure do. About a month ago I saw a caravan of carefully taped and "de-badged" small SUVs driving through town, a couple of which were clearly existing BMW X-series and the rest of which were . . . something else. All had SC plates though (BMW has a plant in SC).
> 
> Markings can and are removed or altered for trade shows, empty boxes are rigged up with pretty LEDs and cables with the real images coming from other sources, etc. It's all marketing and should ALL be taken with a grain of salt until a production unit can be taken with a Torx bit.


Pretty much so...but it was fun to see...and the performance was amazing to witness...regardless of the "guts inside the box". Some day we'll know what the production version looks like, likely inside and out.


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## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

richierich said:


> I just learned that my Nephew died last night at the age of 38 from a supposedly heart attack and I will be away for awhile at the Funeral but you never know what Life Holds Out For You!!!


Condolences to you and your family richierich. Thanks for your observations and contributions from CES.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

carl6 said:


> Condolences to you and your family richierich. Thanks for your observations and contributions from CES.


I spoke with Rich last night - it is indeed sad to learn that news upon the return of the CES trip. It also puts things in perspective.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

Sorry to hear this Rich. Take care of yourself and your family.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ken_F said:


> The HR24 is essentially an updated version of the HR23 with a faster CPU and integrated DECA. It is due later this quarter.
> 
> ...


Sorry to disappoint you but in last FW [0395] you could read lines:


> *BCM7038 *Internal Ethernet
> BCM7038 NET : Failed to allocate softc memory.
> BCM7038 NET : Failed to allocate RxBDs memory.
> BCM7038 NET : Failed to allocate TxBD memory.
> ...


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

P Smith said:


> Sorry to disappoint you but in last FW [0395] you could read lines:


But then again....none of that has anything to do with the new DirecTV Home Media Server spotted at the CES, *which is the subject of this thread*.

A new CES Report thread, which *will* include information learned there, will be posted as soon as it is complete (soon).


----------



## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

P Smith said:


> Sorry to disappoint you but in last FW [0395] you could read lines:
> 
> ```
> [B]BCM7038 [/B]Internal Ethernet
> ...


How'd you get those messages?


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

P Smith said:


> Sorry to disappoint you but in last FW [0395] you could read lines:


What exactly are you trying to say?

That the BCM7038 Chipset is used in the H24?

The BCM7401 Chipset is used in the HR23.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Sixto said:


> How'd you get those messages?


For you it could be easy to check - record one FW PID (30...40 MB should be enough to catch whole spool) and check it by any hex editor. Check Doug's site for that.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

P Smith said:


>


Well then, how about responding to my Post #224?


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter (Feb 20, 2009)

P Smith said:


> For you it could be easy to check - record one FW PID (30...40 MB should be enough to catch whole spool) and check it by any hex editor. Check Doug's site for that.


If its easy for Sixto to do it then how'd you manage to get them yourself or better yet, how would someone without a line from their dish hooked up directly to a computer get it?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Sgt. Slaughter said:


> If its easy for Sixto to do it then how'd you manage to get them yourself or better yet, how would someone without a line from their dish hooked up directly to a computer get it?


Sorry, no way for someone without proper equipment.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

richierich said:


> Well then, how about responding to my Post #224?


It's about H24, not HMC30. You pick wrong side of the dish.


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## RAD (Aug 5, 2002)

Is it time for one of these??

:backtotop


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

So folks understand RADs post .. I deleted a LOT of football talk. Wrong thread guys.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

So if read the report right, only 2 tuners available for recording?!?!


----------



## Sgt. Slaughter (Feb 20, 2009)

kevinturcotte said:


> So if read the report right, only 2 tuners available for recording?!?!


I took it in the way that 2 for the server if your watching tv on the server box then you could use double play and if one of the other clients then you could not but that all 5 were available for recording.

Hopefully they wouldn't make it with only 2 available to record.....


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Sgt. Slaughter said:


> I took it in the way that 2 for the server if your watching tv on the server box then you could use double play and if one of the other clients then you could not but that all 5 were available for recording.


You took it right.


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## smiddy (Apr 5, 2006)

Sgt. Slaughter said:


> I took it in the way that 2 for the server if your watching tv on the server box then you could use double play and if one of the other clients then you could not but that all 5 were available for recording.
> 
> Hopefully they wouldn't make it with only 2 available to record.....





hdtvfan0001 said:


> You took it right.


But it should be caveated here and now, this is in development. Which means a lot can happen between now and when it is released to the hounds (customers). Knowing what I know about the chipset, it is poissible that they may change that a bit in favor of more tuners dedicated to the HMC30 itself. Also, the other tuners serving the clients can also likely save on the HMC30 as well, but I'm not certain how doable that is in the current state the software is in, but again it is in development. Time will ultimately tell, if and when it comes to market.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

smiddy said:


> But it should be caveated here and now, this is in development. Which means a lot can happen between now and when it is released to the hounds (customers). Knowing what I know about the chipset, it is poissible that they made change that a bit in favor of more tuners dedicated to the HMC30 itself. Also, the other tuners serving the clients can also likely save on the HMC30 as well, but I'm not certain how doable that is in the current state the software is in, but again it is in development. Time will ultimately tell, if and when it comes to market.


All very much true sir - excellent point.

They key word is all this is that the unit we previewed at CES was a *prototype*, which may indeed change somewhat prior to becoming a production unit.


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

I would be *highly* disappointed with only 5 tuners. Hopefully that changes prior to release.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

5 tuners available to record would be GREAT (Compared to 2)! Now the fun question will be if it will communicate via MRV to H2x boxes. If it will do that, I'm sold! (Yes, I want ALL 5 tuners available for recording 24/7)


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

kevinturcotte said:


> 5 tuners available to record would be GREAT (Compared to 2)! Now the fun question will be if it will communicate via MRV to H2x boxes. If it will do that, I'm sold! (Yes, I want ALL 5 tuners available for recording 24/7)


5 tuners doesn't allow me to replace all of my boxes with the clients. If I can't do that, I am not sure I would bother.


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## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> I would be *highly* disappointed with only 5 tuners. Hopefully that changes prior to release.


Really? How often do you need more than five tuners at the same time?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> Really? How often do you need more than five tuners at the same time?


4 seems to be more than enough "for me", but I can see a family wanting/needing more.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> 5 tuners doesn't allow me to replace all of my boxes with the clients. If I can't do that, I am not sure I would bother.


If it has it's own outputs though, and MRV works with the H2x receivers, I don't see the problem. Unless there's something I'm missing.


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> Really? How often do you need more than five tuners at the same time?


Once would be too often.

Maybe I need to soften my stance on that a bit, but I would still like to see more. I can think of several instances where I am recording 3 things at once. That leave only 2 tuners available for viewing. Really 6 is the number I want. Doesn't sound like a big difference, but it would be for me.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

If you really needed more than 5 tuners is there anything preventing someone from having a HR to go along with the server?

Looking forward to seeing how this all works itself out.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> Once would be too often.
> 
> Maybe I need to soften my stance on that a bit, but I would still like to see more. I can think of several instances where I am recording 3 things at once. That leave only 2 tuners available for viewing. Really 6 is the number I want. Doesn't sound like a big difference, but it would be for me.


I agree, as a "Whole House" server, 5 tuners really aren't enough, with clients leaching available tuners. However, hopefully it can be used in conjunction with the H2x receivers, so they won't be leeching the available tuners, and it can actually record 5 shows at once.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

The other thing I like about the server/client (in the photos) is the size of the client box. I think something like this would fit much better in a bedroom especially in a kids room where there is not as much space as other areas of the house.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> I agree, as a "Whole House" server, 5 tuners really aren't enough, with clients leaching available tuners. However, hopefully it can be used in conjunction with the H2x receivers, so they won't be leeching the available tuners, and it can actually record 5 shows at once.


The average customer has 3 or 4 receivers or DVRs, so it would be plenty for them.

The prototype with 5 tuners was designed to be *concurrent* tuners, not singular, so the number of household receivers/clients would not be limited to 5.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

3 or 4 DVRs would be 6 or 8 tuners right?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> 3 or 4 DVRs would be 6 or 8 tuners right?


Right....and unless 5 of those will be operating *concurrently*...its a non-issue.


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## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

Five tuners would fit my SWM5 just fine


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## ndole (Aug 26, 2009)

I could deal with 5 tuners *if* other IRD's could be used in conjunction (via MRV) with the HMC-30. I don't see why it wouldn't be able to.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

It's probably way too early to ask that question.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's probably way too early to ask that question.


Agreed.

Without any firm dates provided at the CES, we were certainly let to believe you *won't* be seeing the HMC30 for a number of months down the road...


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

Wouldn't it make more sense to put in 8 tuners. Then installers would just hook up a SWM-LNB directly into the HMC box, and put client boxes on all TVs (if the TV doesn't have them built in already).

If a customer needs more than 8 tuners you install 2 HMCs and use a standard LNB with a SWM-16.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Beerstalker said:


> Wouldn't it make more sense to put in 8 tuners. Then installers would just hook up a SWM-LNB directly into the HMC box, and put client boxes on all TVs (if the TV doesn't have them built in already).
> 
> If a customer needs more than 8 tuners you install 2 HMCs and use a standard LNB with a SWM-16.


Couldn't agree more.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Beerstalker said:


> Wouldn't it make more sense to put in 8 tuners. Then installers would just hook up a SWM-LNB directly into the HMC box, and put client boxes on all TVs (if the TV doesn't have them built in already).
> 
> If a customer needs more than 8 tuners you install 2 HMCs and use a standard LNB with a SWM-16.


Not really...most users will never use that many, and since 5 tuners can be used *concurrently* with client devices, as well as HR2x units...that would be a costly overkill.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not really...most users will never use that many, and since 5 tuners can be used *concurrently* with client devices, as well as HR2x units...that would be a costly overkill.


Sounds like the need for an HMC-31.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not really...most users will never use that many, and since 5 tuners can be used *concurrently* with client devices, as well as HR2x units...that would be a costly overkill.


It would be overkill in the beginning, but if they are planning on phasing out the H2x and HR2x boxes then it really wouldn't be. It would be cheaper in the long run if they only had to carry/support 2 items the HMC and the client.

99% of installs would be as simple as installing a new dish, SWM-LNB, PI, HMC, and a few client boxes. This would streamline the installation world tremendously.

I know I would switch my system over if 8 tuners was supported, but with only 5 tuners, and only being able to use 4 at a time for live viewing from what I read, I don't think I would want this. I'm currently using 2 HR21s and one H21 and I'm running out of tuners for recording (probably ordering another HR2x this week). That's just for me and the fiance. Once we have kids I'm definitely going to need more.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Beerstalker said:


> It would be overkill in the beginning, but if they are planning on phasing out the H2x and HR2x boxes then it really wouldn't be. It would be cheaper in the long run if they only had to carry/support 2 items the HMC and the client.
> 
> 99% of installs would be as simple as installing a new dish, SWM-LNB, PI, HMC, and a few client boxes. This would streamline the installation world tremendously.


HR2x boxes may evolve, but phasing them out is not on the radar, nor announced.

The HMC30 would be *complimentary *to HR2x units, its not planned as a replacement. For those folks without anything, and wanting to use client units with a Whole House solution, its a good fit. For those who have something in place and still want an HMC30 to add into the current mix, or even reduce the number of HRx units but keep some, its still a good fit.


hilmar2k said:


> Sounds like the need for an HMC-31.


That would seem be a solution without a problem.


----------



## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> Sounds like the need for an HMC-31.


Believe me, no matter what there's going to be a scenario where it's not enough for someone. You could have 12 active tuners and then you'd have a guy with 7 DVRs in his house complaining.

The most common setup for DIRECTV customers is one DVR and up to four receivers. This is how DIRECTV has been selling their packages for some time. So, the five tuner box doesn't seem so random then.

The better question is, is it stackable? In other words, will it take control of other DVRs and use them as accessory tuners, or at least share the playlists between boxes in a transparent fashion? Can you have, for example, an HMC30, three client boxes, an HR23, and an H21, and they all see the same playlist and behave the same?

Should be interesting.


----------



## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> HR2x boxes may evolve, but phasing them out is not on the radar, nor announced.
> 
> The HMC30 would be *complimentary *to HR2x units, its not planned as a replacement. For those folks without anything, and wanting to use client units with a Whole House solution, its a good fit. For those who have something in place and still want an HMC30 to add into the current mix, or even reduce the number of HRx units but keep some, its still a good fit.
> 
> That would seem be a solution without a problem.


But I'm saying they should be thinking about doing this. Most homes now are trying to reduce the number of boxes etc they have to deal with and tyring to put as much in a central location as possibe. Network printers, network storage devices to store all their music/movies/files on, etc.

DirecTV realizes this and is working it's way in, but why only do it partway. why keep supporting multiple boxes, installation hardware, etc when you could really streamline it down. Sure a lot of homes would never need 8 tuners. Lets say 75% would only use 5 tuners. But by putting in 8 tuners that suddenly ups the coverage to 99%. Wouldn't it make more sense to do that so you could use the same setup in 99% of installs instead of using it in 75% and then hodgepodging something together for the other 25%?

Also, by using this in all future installs you would greatly increase the quantity of units needed, which would bring down the price on them quicker. By getting rid of other devices there are less items to keep in inventory, support, supply training for, etc.



Stuart Sweet said:


> The better question is, is it stackable?


I wonder about stackability too, which is why the 5 tuners seems strange. If you could stack 2 HMCs together you suddenly have 10 tuners which is a more difficult install. At least if they only used 4 tuners you could stack 2 HMCs and still get away with a SWM-LNB without dealing with splitters, SWM-16s, etc.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Believe me, no matter what there's going to be a scenario where it's not enough for someone. You could have 12 active tuners and then you'd have a guy with 7 DVRs in his house complaining.
> 
> The most common setup for DIRECTV customers is one DVR and up to four receivers. This is how DIRECTV has been selling their packages for some time. So, the five tuner box doesn't seem so random then.
> 
> ...


Tom would need what, a 20 tuner? lol


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Beerstalker said:


> I wonder about stackability too, which is why the 5 tuners seems strange. If you could stack 2 HMCs together you suddenly have 10 tuners which is a more difficult install. At least if they only used 4 tuners you could stack 2 HMCs and still get away with a SWM-LNB without dealing with splitters, SWM-16s, etc.


Well that's today's technology, sure. Maybe in the future they'll have an answer for that, or maybe it will be acceptable to use an SWM16 for those cases.

I think we at this site tend to think that all 18 million DIRECTV subs are like us. I don't have the numbers, but I bet that far more than 75% would be perfectly well served by 5 tuners.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Beerstalker said:


> But I'm saying they should be thinking about doing this. Most homes now are trying to reduce the number of boxes etc they have to deal with and tyring to put as much in a central location as possibe. Network printers, network storage devices to store all their music/movies/files on, etc.


The number of boxes will still be at least the one HD DVR (in this case an HMC30 HD DVR server)* PLUS *a 1-for-1 install to each HDTV...the *only* thing that would change is the* type of box *at each location. It could be a client, or it could be something else. The main benefit is to simply installs, yes, but using clients that will take much less time to set up at the non-server locations.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Well that's today's technology, sure. Maybe in the future they'll have an answer for that, or maybe it will be acceptable to use an SWM16 for those cases.
> 
> I think we at this site tend to think that all 18 million DIRECTV subs are like us. I don't have the numbers, but I bet that far more than 75% would be perfectly well served by 5 tuners.


For me, IDEALLY, I'll install a SWM16 (Or a SWM16 LNB if they ever do one), 2 HMC30s (1 for backup), and 3 H2x receivers, all with DECA MRV.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Believe me, no matter what there's going to be a scenario where it's not enough for someone. You could have 12 active tuners and then you'd have a guy with 7 DVRs in his house complaining.
> 
> The most common setup for DIRECTV customers is one DVR and up to four receivers. This is how DIRECTV has been selling their packages for some time. So, the five tuner box doesn't seem so random then.
> 
> ...


If it were stackable, I would get it in a heartbeat and replace 2 of my HR2x's and my R16. That would give me 7 tuners, which is plenty for my needs. Again, if it had 6 tuners, I would likely replace all my current receivers.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

hilmar2k said:


> If it were stackable, I would get it in a heartbeat and replace 2 of my HR2x's and my R16. That would give me 7 tuners, which is plenty for my needs. Again, if it had 6 tuners, I would likely replace all my current receivers.


We'll have to see if that indeed is the plan...we learned at CES that was one over several things under consideration. Indeed, it would then solve the needs of many new* AND *existing users.


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

How many simultaneous HD streams can you have on one DECA , one 10/100 or gigabit network?


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## smiddy (Apr 5, 2006)

scottandregan said:


> How many simultaneous HD streams can you have on one DECA , one 10/100 or gigabit network?


On this unit, using DECA they said 4, I never asked about the RJ-45 connection on this one (dang it). So I don't know if it is 10/100/1000 BaseT or what?! Considering the channel frequencies and Nyquest, the DECA at best would be around 250 Mbps, not including encoding schemes or sequencing. That is unless they used a different channel frequency.


----------



## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

So assuming the clients do not have a tuner, this leads me to believe that other units may not be stackable or you may not be able to use two home server units. Clearly I have no knowledge on this other than what was available through this and other threads but if you can only stream 4 HD, how could you add more without having two seperate networks?


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## Scott Kocourek (Jun 13, 2009)

For an average family this still seems like a great idea. You should be able to have more clients than needed streams, seems many people have more tv's in their homes then people.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

All I can say is... if you're thinking about that hopefully they are too.


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## Beerstalker (Feb 9, 2009)

smiddy said:


> On this unit, using DECA they said 4, I never asked about the RJ-45 connection on this one (dang it). So I don't know if it is 10/100/1000 BaseT or what?! Considering the channel frequencies and Nyquest, the DECA at best would be around 250 Mbps, not including encoding schemes or sequencing. That is unless they used a different channel frequency.


Aah, so DECA may be what is causing the 4 client limit. That makes a little more sense. I personally hope they don't tie everyone down to DECA if that is true though. I wired my house with Cat6/gigabit network components, so I would rather take advantage of that instead of DECA.

I do see the advantage of DECA for free installs/pre-wired homes though, I just hope they don't dumb down the entire system because of it. Maybe a max of 4 streams over DECA, but allow more over Cat5/Cat6 wired homes.


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## ndole (Aug 26, 2009)

Beerstalker said:


> Aah, so DECA may be what is causing the 4 client limit. That makes a little more sense. I personally hope they don't tie everyone down to DECA if that is true though. I wired my house with Cat6/gigabit network components, so I would rather take advantage of that instead of DECA.
> 
> I do see the advantage of DECA for free installs/pre-wired homes though, I just hope they don't dumb down the entire system because of it. Maybe a max of 4 streams over DECA, but allow more over Cat5/Cat6 wired homes.


Maybe we'll start carrying around spools of cat5 instead of rg6? :lol:


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Beerstalker said:


> Aah, so *DECA may be what is causing the 4 client limit*. That makes a little more sense. I personally hope they don't tie everyone down to DECA if that is true though. I wired my house with Cat6/gigabit network components, so I would rather take advantage of that instead of DECA.
> 
> I do see the advantage of DECA for free installs/pre-wired homes though, I just hope they don't dumb down the entire system because of it. Maybe a max of 4 streams over DECA, but allow more over Cat5/Cat6 wired homes.


Of course, we don't have confirmation of any such (stream) limit yet, so it remains to be determined. By the way....the DECA units are rated at 300MBps.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Of course, we don't have confirmation of any such (stream) limit yet, so it remains to be determined. By the way....the DECA units are rated at 300MBps.


What are the chances of any technology that occupies a 100MHz frequency band being able to achieve 300MBps throughput? DECA would be remarkable indeed if it gave you 24:1 utilization of the bandwidth.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

harsh said:


> What are the chances of any technology that occupies a 100MHz frequency band being able to achieve 300MBps throughput? DECA would be remarkable indeed if it gave you 24:1 utilization of the bandwidth.



It has 50 MHz bandwidth centered at 550 MHz, so it could very easily have 300 Mb/s throughput.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> It has 50 MHz bandwidth centered at 550 MHz, so it could very easily have 300 Mb/s throughput.


If you can provide type of modulation, etc for such NARROW band to achieve 300 Mbps, then it could be something. So far it is your utopia.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

P Smith said:


> If you can provide type of modulation, etc for such NARROW band to achieve 300 Mbps, then it could be something. So far it is your utopia.


Yeah, 50 MHz is so narrow, compared to ATSC, and a CF of 550 MHz, is so limiting.


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

veryoldschool said:


> It has 50 MHz bandwidth centered at 550 MHz, so it could very easily have 300 Mb/s throughput.


Be VERY careful of the units of measure. There's a substantial difference between 300MBps and 300Mbps.

100baseT Ethernet uses two 125Mbaud channels (separate transmit and receive channels) of bandwidth to yield "up to" 100Mbps in both directions. I get this. I also get that Gigabit Ethernet uses two transmit and two receive channels (all at 125Mbaud) along with one or more modulation schemes to get where it goes. My question is how can something that changes state at 50 units/second yield 300 (or 2400) units/second of information.

I suspect that I don't get it because I'm not familiar enough with the relationship between frequency and symbol rate nor with the modulation schemes. I'm hoping that someone can explain it.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

harsh said:


> Be VERY careful of the units of measure. There's a substantial difference between 300MBps and 300Mbps.
> 
> 100baseT Ethernet uses two 125Mbaud channels (separate transmit and receive channels) of bandwidth to yield "up to" 100Mbps in both directions. I get this. I also get that Gigabit Ethernet uses two transmit and two receive channels (all at 125Mbaud) along with one or more modulation schemes to get where it goes. My question is how can something that changes state at 50 units/second yield 300 (or 2400) units/second of information.
> 
> I suspect that I don't get it because I'm not familiar enough with the relationship between frequency and symbol rate nor with the modulation schemes. I'm hoping that someone can explain it.


My "units of measure" were correctly used.


----------



## Sixto (Nov 18, 2005)

More like 175Mbps: http://www.entropic.com/products/homenetworking.htm


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

From same source:


> "Extensive field trials in real homes with typical coax installations have proven MoCA can provide a minimum of 100 Mbps of throughput to over 97 percent of all coax connections."


----------



## smiddy (Apr 5, 2006)

This all goes back to my Nyquest point. You're all in the same ball park BTW, modulation schemes etcetera play a big part in throughput. harsh, check out spread spectrum implementations on modulation schemes, this should give you more information on modulation designs and their throughput. 300 Mbps is a lofty goal with a frequency of 550 MHz, and I was going with some margin when I said 250 Mbps. Entropic's site says 175 Mbps, which is reasonable, but there is margin there too. Depending on the MPEG rate though, you can pretty easily do 4 streams. You could potentially go as high as 10 but there is a higher chance of collisions when you go above 70% on a ethernet (which this is not, it is DECA or MoCA).

PSmith have you put a scope on a DECA yet? I'd love to see the spectrum.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Not yet.


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

veryoldschool said:


> My "units of measure" were correctly used.


hdtvfan0001's units with respect to the performance of DECA were MBps so I hope you understand my caution.


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Perhaps it is hdtvfan0001 who is having some problems with units of measure.

In post 276, he indicated the spec was 300 MEGABYTES per second.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

harsh said:


> Perhaps it is hdtvfan0001 who is having some problems with units of measure.
> 
> In post 276, he indicated the spec was 300 MEGABYTES per second.


I'd guess that was just a typo.


----------



## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> I'd guess that was just a typo.


Indeed, since he didn't actually type out the word "bytes" in his post. That said, 300 mbps should be fine for several simultaneous HD feeds all hitting peaks (during trickplay, for instance) at once.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> I'd guess that was just a typo.


Correct.


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Beerstalker said:


> Aah, so DECA may be what is causing the 4 client limit. That makes a little more sense. I personally hope they don't tie everyone down to DECA if that is true though. I wired my house with Cat6/gigabit network components, so I would rather take advantage of that instead of DECA.
> 
> I do see the advantage of DECA for free installs/pre-wired homes though, I just hope they don't dumb down the entire system because of it. Maybe a max of 4 streams over DECA, but allow more over Cat5/Cat6 wired homes.


Streaming HD with trickmodes is the problem. The server is limited by the number of streams due to performance and hardware limitations. The MOCA network could probably handle 5 or 6 clients so maybe future generations will have that capability.


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

richierich said:


> What exactly are you trying to say?
> 
> That the BCM7038 Chipset was used in the HR23.
> 
> ...


Hr21-23 broadcom version uses the 7401 not the 7038.


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

scottandregan said:


> The other thing I like about the server/client (in the photos) is the size of the client box. I think something like this would fit much better in a bedroom especially in a kids room where there is not as much space as other areas of the house.


RVU's goal is to have the client embedded inside a TV as software until that happens then there will be these clients available.


----------



## dvrblogger (Jan 11, 2005)

Stuart Sweet said:


> Believe me, no matter what there's going to be a scenario where it's not enough for someone. You could have 12 active tuners and then you'd have a guy with 7 DVRs in his house complaining.
> 
> The most common setup for DIRECTV customers is one DVR and up to four receivers. This is how DIRECTV has been selling their packages for some time. So, the five tuner box doesn't seem so random then.
> 
> ...


more likely would be 2 HMC30 sharing since the HR2X have more limited performance, bandwidth constraints etc


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

dvrblogger said:


> Hr21-23 broadcom version uses the 7401 not the 7038.


Thanks as I knew that as I had posted it quite a while before, BCM7401 not BCM7038.


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

richierich said:


> Thanks as I knew that as I had posted it quite a while before, BCM7401 not BCM7038.


Hope you got what I did try to say .


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Yes, I did.


----------



## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=222400529


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

PaceHD said:


> http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=222400529


Yup.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

NO, it [April release] isn't the prototyped HMC30 shown at CES this year.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> NO, it [April release] isn't the prototyped HMC30 shown at CES this year.


Correct.

The HMC30 will not be released until some time late 2010 (or so we were told at CES)....so that article refers to something else.


----------



## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=439986


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

PaceHD said:


> http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=439986


"Very sure"
The MoCA, which in DirecTV speak is DECA, is coming out in receivers before the HMC30 is released


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

PaceHD said:


> http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=439986


Positive...based on the dates in the article.


----------



## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

What will be the additional benefit of the HMC30 vs DECA in receivers being launched in April (HR24?)? Is Pace likely to be a manufacturer of HR24s? Seems strange that Entropic issued a press release today given HR24s have been talked about for a while-could it not imply another box?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

PaceHD said:


> What will be the additional benefit of the HMC30 vs DECA in receivers being launched in April (HR24?)? Is Pace likely to be a manufacturer of HR24s? Seems strange that Entropic issued a press release today given HR24s have been talked about for a while-could it not imply another box?


DECA is the base for the MRV feature/service that is DirecTV's current push.
Simply reading this same forum, that this thread is in, will give you a much better idea of what DirecTV's current plans are.
What these plans may grow into and who may or not manufacture them is not known completely, and those that might have an idea, most likely can't say what they are until DirecTV feels it's appropriate.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

DECA is DIRECTV's implementation of MoCa


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

You sure? Certainly reads like it is (MoCa, RVU, etc). If it isn't, then what is it?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> You sure? Certainly reads like it is (MoCa, RVU, etc). If it isn't, then what is it?


You'll see in April. :lol:
BTW that would seem like right about the end of the 3 months Beta MRV wouldn't it?


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> You'll see in April. :lol:
> BTW that would seem like right about the end of the 3 months Beta MRV wouldn't it?


Of course we will.....I believe everything I read...you too I'm sure.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Of course we will.....I believe everything I read...you too I'm sure.


You did get the memo, didn't you?


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> You did get the memo, didn't you?


Yup...it was personally delivered. 

The same memo told me that HMC30 was NOT coming out in April.


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Yup...it was personally delivered.
> 
> The same memo told me that HMC30 was NOT coming out in April.


Just because the article says it is coming out in April certainly does not mean what is being referred to isn't the HMC30. What would it be? A whole home box with MoCa and RVU. Sounds suspiciously like the HMC30 to me.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Stranger things have happened, but I'd be very surprised if an RVU compliant box were out "before April"


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> Just because the article says it is coming out in April certainly does not mean what is being referred to isn't the HMC30. What would it be? A whole home box with MoCa and RVU. Sounds suspiciously like the HMC30 to me.


"Like" isn't the same as "is".


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> "Like" isn't the same as "is".


Can't get away with anything around here. :lol:


----------



## ndole (Aug 26, 2009)

Perhaps the the H24/HR24 will be the last breath of what will come to be known as the new "legacy" equipment.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

ndole_mbnd said:


> Perhaps the the H24/HR24 will be the last breath of what will come to be known as the new "legacy" equipment.


How do you know that the HR24 will not have the BCM7400 chipset in it with Deca installed?

If so it will be as Fast or Faster than the Dish VIP722K DVR. Two tuners, Faster Processor and Deca so I don't think it will be a Legacy DVR. Hopefully with a 750 Gig Hard Drive.

Is that not possible?

It should be coming out around April so I wouldn't be surprised to see it as an Upgraded DVR and not just a Legacy Box.

But I could be wrong!!!


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> How do you know that the HR24 will not have the BCM7400 chipset in it with Deca installed?
> 
> Is that not possible?
> 
> ...


We simply don't know for sure...but the article sure raises that all as a possibility.


----------



## renov (Sep 13, 2006)

For what it's worth.

http://hd.engadget.com/2010/01/26/directvs-new-hr24-dvr-to-reach-customers-this-quarter/


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Now I am confused. Apparently the HMC30 and the HR24 are one in the same? Otheriwse, what separates the two?

http://hd.engadget.com/2010/01/26/directvs-new-hr24-dvr-to-reach-customers-this-quarter/


----------



## carl6 (Nov 16, 2005)

They are not one and the same. Engaget has some incorrect information.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Folks .. I have to correct some inaccuracies in the report from Engadget ..


The HR24 has 2 tuners (not 3-8)
The HR24 does use DECA (MoCA)
The HMC30 uses RVU technology (seen @ CES)

Those are the glaring things that are simply wrong in that article.


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> Now I am confused. Apparently the HMC30 and the HR24 are one in the same? Otheriwse, what separates the two?
> 
> http://hd.engadget.com/2010/01/26/directvs-new-hr24-dvr-to-reach-customers-this-quarter/


They "got it wrong". :nono:


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> They "got it wrong". :nono:


I figured.


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

Doug Brott said:


> Folks .. I have to correct some inaccuracies in the report from Engadget ..
> 
> 
> The HR24 has 2 tuners (not 3-8)
> ...


So the H24 is not a "client" for the HR24?


----------



## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> So the H24 is not a "client" for the HR24?


No, it's just a receiver.......well, it's a client as much as the H21/H23 are clients, plus it has DECA....


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> Folks .. I have to correct some inaccuracies in the report from Engadget ..
> 
> 
> The HR24 has 2 tuners (not 3-8)
> ...


So when does the 3-8 tuner DVR get released?


----------



## Crypter (Jun 21, 2007)

I already have my whole house wired for Ethernet and I have all 5 of my HR2x boxes hooked up to a switch/Router I GAIN Nothing from DECA right? It is basically a tech for people who do not have wired Ethernet available and it does not offer any other sort of advantages right?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> So when does the 3-8 tuner DVR get released?


You know how we use "soon" here?
It doesn't even get a "soon" here. :lol:


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Crypter said:


> I already have my whole house wired for Ethernet and I have all 5 of my HR2x boxes hooked up to a switch/Router I GAIN Nothing from DECA right? It is basically a tech for people who do not have wired Ethernet available and it does not offer any other sort of advantages right?


Yes!!! It may have some thruput advantages also but we will see.

Also, Engadget first reported that the HMC30 Prototype Device at the Entropic Booth was an HR24 which proved to be inaccurate. So, they have been wrong before and they need to verify stuff before publishing it as fact!!!


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Crypter said:


> I already have my whole house wired for Ethernet and I have all 5 of my HR2x boxes hooked up to a switch/Router I GAIN Nothing from DECA right? It is basically a tech for people who do not have wired Ethernet available and it does not offer any other sort of advantages right?


Yes & no.
Your current setup may work fine.
The DECA setup keeps ALL the receiver to receiver traffic off your network and within the DECA cloud.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> You know how we use "soon" here?
> It doesn't even get a "soon" here. :lol:


So how will the HR24 differ from a HR23 with DECA module on the back?


----------



## PaceHD (Jan 10, 2010)

Is this silicon for the HMC30 rather than the HR24/H24?

http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=439986


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> So how will the HR24 differ from a HR23 with DECA module on the back?


If/when I get one, I'll let you know.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> If/when I get one, I'll let you know.


If the only difference is the built in DECA, I'll go ahead and upgrade the hard drive in my HR20 now


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> So how will the HR24 differ from a HR23 with DECA module on the back?


It will have a Faster Processor/Chipset (probably the BCM7400)!!!


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

richierich said:


> It will have a Faster Processor/Chipset!!!


Are we sure on this?


----------



## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

PaceHD said:


> Is this silicon for the HMC30 rather than the HR24/H24?
> 
> http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=439986


You may want to look here: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=171697


----------



## texasbrit (Aug 9, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> So when does the 3-8 tuner DVR get released?


If you mean the HMC30, all the reports point to late 2010....if you read the info in the various posts, it seems it's not really a 3-8 tuner DVR....in the sense that some of the tuners are dedicated to clients. And I read it as 2/5, although I might just be confused (seems to happen a lot!!)


----------



## bobnielsen (Jun 29, 2006)

PaceHD said:


> Is this silicon for the HMC30 rather than the HR24/H24?
> 
> http://ir.entropic.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=439986


It may be in both (we don't know yet). The Broadcom BCM7420 has built-in MoCA and might not require any Entropic silicon, if that is what is used.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> So when does the 3-8 tuner DVR get released?


The guys that went to CES were reporting "late 2010" .. Seems like as reasonable time as any to me.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Doug Brott said:


> The guys that went to CES were reporting "late 2010" .. Seems like as reasonable time as any to me.


Probably actually be a little over a year then.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> Probably actually be a little over a year then.


DIRECTV is actually pretty good at hitting their targets .. Where the complaints show up are when DIRECTV's targets are WAY into the future and folks wonder why it will take so long 

My suspicion is that 2010 will be accurate unless something crazy happens between now and then.


----------



## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> Probably actually be a little over a year then.


If we use the new HD Tivo as a guide it will be sometime in 2015! :lol:


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> If we use the new HD Tivo as a guide it will be sometime in 2015! :lol:


Ah, but TiVo is an entirely different story .. I don't think they've ever met a deadline.


----------



## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

kevinturcotte said:


> Are we sure on this?


Yes. I know for a fact that it's faster than the HR23, although I can only speculate beyond that.

I expect the HR24 to offer at least double the performance of the HR23 to eliminate most complaints about responsiveness. Based on DirecTV's trend of cost-conscious designs, the BCM7335 would make the most sense, but other solutions like the BCM7400 and BCM7405 would work equally as well.

I'm told many will want to upgrade, and DirecTV will undoubtedly take advantage of that to extend customer contracts.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Ken_F said:


> Yes. I know for a fact that it's faster than the HR23, although I can only speculate beyond that.
> 
> I expect the HR24 to offer at least double the performance of the HR23 to eliminate most complaints about responsiveness. Based on DirecTV's trend of cost-conscious designs, the BCM7335 would make the most sense, but other solutions like the BCM7400 and BCM7405 would work equally as well.
> 
> I'm told many will want to upgrade, and DirecTV will undoubtedly take advantage of that to extend customer contracts.


I'll sign up for 2 more years if they'll give me a free one (And can guarantee it will be an HR24).


----------



## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

kevinturcotte said:


> I'll sign up for 2 more years if they'll give me a free one (And can guarantee it will be an HR24).


Same here. I have an HR20 that's getting a little long in the tooth and acting its age.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Ken_F said:


> Yes. I know for a fact that it's faster than the HR23, although I can only speculate beyond that.
> 
> I expect the HR24 to offer at least double the performance of the HR23 to eliminate most complaints about responsiveness. Based on DirecTV's trend of cost-conscious designs, the BCM7335 would make the most sense, but other solutions like the BCM7400 and BCM7405 would work equally as well.
> 
> I'm told many will want to upgrade, and DirecTV will undoubtedly take advantage of that to extend customer contracts.


What's the current chips in the HR2x?


----------



## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

kevinturcotte said:


> What's the current chips in the HR2x?


Posted above.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

Wait. If it's going to have integrated DECA, wouldn't it have to be at least a 7410 chip?


----------



## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

kevinturcotte said:


> Wait. If it's going to have integrated DECA, wouldn't it have to be at least a 7410 chip?


No. DirecTV is using a separate solution from Entropic for MoCA/DECA, rather than a SoC like the 7410 or 7340 that integrates the functionality.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> I'll sign up for 2 more years if they'll give me a free one (And can guarantee it will be an HR24).


Well, you don't want very much!!!

Good Luck in getting that!!! :lol:

Why do so many people want something for nothing but then Raise Hell when Directv or whomever charges a small fee for something so valuable as MRV???

Amazing!!!


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

kevinturcotte said:


> So how will the HR24 differ from a HR23 with DECA module on the back?


One highly supportable theory holds that the HR24 won't have the wide-band tuner so the HR24 would actually have more in common with the HR22. After all, there's little point to using a DECA enabled device in a non-SWiM environment.


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

kevinturcotte said:


> So when does the 3-8 tuner DVR get released?


If it helps, DIRECTV made a formal announcement of the device five years ago for delivery in 2005.

http://investor.directv.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=286505


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

We're never going to get more than 2 satellite tuners that can all actually record at the same time are we?


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

harsh said:


> If it helps, DIRECTV made a formal announcement of the device five years ago for delivery in 2005.
> 
> http://investor.directv.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=286505


Yeah...like that's relevant. 

I think that was about the same time Dish announced their VIP922 for release.


----------



## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

kevinturcotte said:


> We're never going to get more than 2 satellite tuners that can all actually record at the same time are we?


I don't know what you're talking about. I have 12 tuners that can all record at once now.


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

LameLefty said:


> I don't know what you're talking about. I have 12 tuners that can all record at once now.


I want them all in one receiver though lol


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> I want them all in one receiver though lol


More than 2 tuners already was done in the HR20 - albeit it two OTA ones and 2 sat ones...

Who knows what 2010 brings....


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

kevinturcotte said:


> I want them all in one receiver though lol


And you probably want it for FREE!!! 

Yes, we will get a DVR with more than 2 Tuners!!!

I also have 12 Tuners and 300 Series Links and 2060 Hours of HD Recording Capacity!!!


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> More than 2 tuners already was done in the HR20 - albeit it two OTA ones and 2 sat ones...
> 
> Who knows what 2010 brings....


I want more than 2 SATELLITE tuners lol



richierich said:


> And you probably want it for FREE!!!
> 
> Yes, we will get more than 2 Tuners!!!
> 
> I also have 12 Tuners and 300 Series Links and 2000 Hours of HD Recording Capacity!!!


I want a 6 (8 is better) satellite tuner DVR that can actually record 6 HD channels at once! And yeah, who wouldn't want it free, lol, but I wouldn't have a problem shelling out $500 for it.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

kevinturcotte said:


> I want more than 2 SATELLITE tuners lol
> 
> I want a 6 (8 is better) satellite tuner DVR that can actually record 6 HD channels at once! And yeah, who wouldn't want it free, lol, but I wouldn't have a problem shelling out $500 for it.


We do know that the Home Media Center seen at CES has more than 2 tuners...that will likely not come out until late in the year at the soonest.

In another thread, a new HRx DVR was mentioned, but the number of tuners is an unknown at this time for that unit.


----------



## Doug Brott (Jul 12, 2006)

harsh said:


> If it helps, DIRECTV made a formal announcement of the device five years ago for delivery in 2005.
> 
> http://investor.directv.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=286505


well clearly that announcement turned out to be a swing and a miss. I'm pretty sure the HMC that was seen at CES this year is much different than the prototype presented many years ago.


----------



## kevinwmsn (Aug 19, 2006)

Will the HMC be like the HR21pro where you only get through a purchased(owned) and not a lease?


----------



## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

kevinwmsn said:


> Will the HMC be like the HR21pro where you only get through a purchased(owned) and not a lease?


If it is, I would assume there would be a regular leased version as well.
You do realize you CAN outright purchase any receiver, right?


----------



## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

Doug Brott said:


> well clearly that announcement turned out to be a swing and a miss. I'm pretty sure the HMC that was seen at CES this year is much different than the prototype presented many years ago.


To be certain, it lacks the built-in LCD display. Otherwise, the specs are surprisingly similar.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

kevinturcotte said:


> I want more than 2 SATELLITE tuners lol/


Have you contemplated getting an additional receiver? Many DIRECTV customers have more than one HR2x.


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## kevinturcotte (Dec 19, 2006)

harsh said:


> Have you contemplated getting an additional receiver? Many DIRECTV customers have more than one HR2x.


Yeah, but I want the 3-4 receivers to act like one big receiver lol


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

*THIS POST IS ABOUT THE HMC... NOT TIVO*​
I was talking with my Grandmother earlier today about how I wanted to upgrade her SD-TiVo to HD once the new TiVo comes out... and knowing there was no information about the new TiVo in some of the usual places, I still did some Google searches just to pass the time while I'm waiting on someone... and I found this on DirecTV.com... found it interesting...

Does my DIRECTV with TiVo support networking?



> However, as you may have heard, we're preparing to launch a new advanced technology system called the DIRECTV Home Media Center. Our new Home Media Center will allow you to share, *move* and view content from room to room, throughout the house. It will also have DVR functionality and the capability to support both standard-and high-definition signals.


I'm assuming... since is there no mention of the new TiVo that this is in fact an OLD answer to a FAQ?

~Alan


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

^ since I can't tell who wrote this, I can't be sure the "move" is real, and may simply be a typo or being misused.
The HMC30 previewed [prototype] at CES, was a central server with thin clients, so there was no place to "move" a recording.


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## Alan Gordon (Jun 7, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> ^ since I can't tell who wrote this, I can't be sure the "move" is real, and may simply be a typo or being misused.


I provided a link. It's on DirecTV's FAQ page... and none of their FAQ responses have listed who wrote it.

As far as it being a typo, I suspect it's in regard to the HMC that was shown at CES years ago, and they simply have not updated the FAQ...



veryoldschool said:


> The HMC30 previewed [prototype] at CES, was a central server with thin clients, so there was no place to "move" a recording.


Again, as I said, I suspect it's an old FAQ answer that needs updating... just thought it was interesting. 

~Alan


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Alan Gordon said:


> I provided a link. It's on DirecTV's FAQ page... and none of their FAQ responses have listed who wrote it.
> 
> As far as it being a typo, I suspect it's in regard to the HMC that was shown at CES years ago, and they simply have not updated the FAQ...
> 
> ...


Yes, I went to your link, then "commented" on what I saw/read.
Doubt anybody will know much until late this year when the HMC30 gets closer to the market.


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## underlord2 (Dec 1, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> Same here. I have an HR20 that's getting a little long in the tooth and acting its age.


Same here! :lol:


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

For those that missed it, here's a video demo of the Broadcom-based DirecTV "HM30" DVR (3:20 in):

[youtubehd]W1B1xDCkCA4[/youtubehd]

Video was posted by Broadcom Corp.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Where's the beef?
Only the last min has the HMC 30.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Ken_F said:


> For those that missed it, here's a video demo of the Broadcom-based DirecTV "HM30" DVR (3:20 in):


That's not the same DirecTV HMC30 unit that was shown in the Entropic booth at the CES..in fact...it may not be an HMC30 at all...but its all cool.


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## Guest (Mar 16, 2010)

Ken_F said:


> For those that missed it, here's a video demo of the Broadcom-based DirecTV "HM30" DVR (3:20 in):
> 
> [youtubehd]W1B1xDCkCA4[/youtubehd]
> 
> Video was posted by Broadcom Corp.


One unit showed a world globe icon on it when he was scrolling through the onscreen icons. Could that be a web browser?


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## dave29 (Feb 18, 2007)

That guy has awesome hair.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

dave29 said:


> That guy has awesome hair.


Obviously he's inadvertently stuck his finger in a few sockets (not the chip kind) before...


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## say-what (Dec 14, 2006)

CraigerCSM said:


> One unit showed a world globe icon on it when he was scrolling through the onscreen icons. Could that be a web browser?


That was for the cable company box, not the DirecTV box.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Watch a flayer at his right shoulder on 3:35 - you'll see "HMC30" word on top of it!


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Ken_F said:


> For those that missed it, here's a video demo of the Broadcom-based DirecTV "HM30" DVR (3:20 in):
> ...
> 
> Video was posted by Broadcom Corp.


http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2390045&postcount=1034

And could those a few guys who did reports from CES2010 tell me - how it happened you did miss the Broadcom booth ?!


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## Ken_F (Jan 13, 2003)

P Smith said:


> http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2390045&postcount=1034
> 
> And could those a few guys who did reports from CES2010 tell me - how it happened you did miss the Broadcom booth ?!


They weren't on the show floor. After Broadcom told me their silicon was behind *all* of the DirecTV RVU demos, I PM'd a few people (don't recall who) to check out their private suite. For whatever reason, no one did.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Nice. 
You added to my confidence in observing spooling SW; my posts about BCM keywords inside of H24 and HMC30 current FW got no support in couple threads.


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## LameLefty (Sep 29, 2006)

P Smith said:


> Nice.
> You added to my confidence in observing spooling SW; my posts about BCM keywords inside of H24 and HMC30 current FW got no support in couple threads.


The H/HR24 are not part of the RVU demos shown by Broadcom.


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