# Over 30 different 1080p Movies now on DIRECTV - Discussion



## Doug Brott

Today, DIRECTV has released over 30 different movies via 1080p.

These movies are available now via DIRECTV On Demand.

Some of the titles available:


Changeling
Milk
Pride and Glory
Transporter 3

Enjoy.


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## Doug Brott

*Q. Why 1080p?*
_A. 1080p is the highest resolution available in today's Televisions giving you the best quality picture available DIRECTV HD DVRs (HR2x) are capable of delivering 1080p at 24 frames per second._

*Q. Why 1080p24?*
_A. 1080p24 is a 1080p formatted program being displayed at 24 frames per second. This is useful to note because Hollywood films are shot at 24 fps making the 1080p24 the optimal format for viewing these films_

*Q. Will my TV work?*
_A. While a TV that supports 1080p24 will provide the optimal display, you will be able to see these programs on any television. The program will be converted to the format supported by your television and the picture will still be better than normal._

*Q. What if my television does not support 1080p24?*
_A. If your television only supports 1080p60, it will not be able to display the DIRECTV movies in 1080p. Your television must support 1080p24. However, you will be able to view the movie in 1080i or 720p format and the picture should be improved over a non-1080p version of the movie._

*Q. What's available?*
_A. Programming can be found by going to DIRECTV On Demand

Tune to Channel 1100
Choose High-Def
Choose 1080p
_


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## Grentz

Sounds good, any freebies? 

I will have to take a peek when I get home.


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## Doug Brott

I believe everything is Pay Per View @ $5.99 looking at the menus ..


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## Clemsole

Doug Brott said:


> I believe everything is Pay Per View @ $5.99 looking at the menus ..


If they are PPV then they are not worth it. Just another reason not bother with the VOD junk.


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## spartanstew

Clemsole said:


> If they are PPV then they are not worth it. Just another reason not bother with the VOD junk.


While I agree that VOD is not worth it in general, I also believe it is worth it for some people. Adding 1080p to the options is a positive for those that utilize it and is worth it for them.


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## satgeek550

Just trying to keep up with Dish Network which launched this almost a year ago...


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## dettxw

Copied from the DirecTV Website Listings...

*1080p/24 VOD Movies*


Movie | CH | Genre | Rating | Exp | Price

Ace Ventura Jr., Pet Detective | 1100 | Top Action | PG | 168 | $3.99
Batman Forever | 1100 | Top Action | PG-13 |21 | $3.99 
Beverly Hills Chihuahua | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG |94 |$5.99 
Body of Lies | 1100 | Top Action | R |122 | $5.99 
Boy in the Striped Pajamas, The | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 |101 | $5.99 
Burn After Reading |1100 | Top Comedy | R | 45 | $5.99 
Changeling | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 107 | $5.99 
Dark Knight, The | 1100 | Top Thriller | PG-13 | 57 | $5.99 
Dead Pool | 1100 | Top Action | R | 21 | $3.99 
Dumb and Dumber | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 21 | $3.99 
Eagle Eye | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99 
Ghost Town | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99 
Hellboy II: The Golden Army | 1100 | Top Action | PG-13 | 14 | $5.99 
Kung Fu Panda | 1100 | Top Animation | PG | 14 | $5.99 
Madagascar: Escape 2 Africa | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG | 137 | $5.99 
Milk | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 137 | $5.99 
Mummy, The: Tomb of the Dragon ... | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99 
Nights in Rodanthe | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 115 | $5.99 
Pride and Glory | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 101 | $5.99 
Punisher: War Zone | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 123 | $5.99 
Saw V | 1100 | Top Horror | NR | 65 | $5.99 
Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99 
Soul Men | 1100 | Top Comedy | R | 49 | $5.99 
Transporter 3 | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | PG-13 | 116 | $5.99 
Tropic Thunder | 1100 | Top Comedy | NR | 45 | $5.99 
Twilight | 1100 | Top Romance | PG-13 | 137 | $5.99 
Tyler Perry's The Family That ... | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 58 | $5.99 
Vicky Cristina Barcelona | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 41 | $5.99 
W. | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 85 | $5.99 
Wanted | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | R | 45 | $5.99 
Women, The | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 75 | $5.99 
Yes Man | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 143 | $5.99 
Zack and Miri |1100 | Top Comedy | R | 55 | $5.99


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## qwsxz

Wish List: auto download 1080p movies to the Top Movies folder.


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## veryoldschool

Clemsole said:


> If they are PPV then they are not worth it. Just another reason not bother with the VOD junk.


 What is the value in your post, or why did you bother to post?
If this had been a poll or someone had asked a question about using it, I can see, but nobody has.
Seems like you just wanted to exercise your free speech and take a dump here.


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## LarryFlowers

It's a good move and I am pleased to see it. I am not a big PPV user but if it's something I haven't seen, I will give it a try.


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## Hutchinshouse

qwsxz said:


> Wish List: auto download 1080p movies to the Movies Now folder.


I'm sure this will happen sooner than later.

Also, the "Top Movies" tab now has a 1 minute video called "1080p on DIRECTV".

The video gives details on this new feature.


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## Sirshagg

veryoldschool said:


> What is the value in your post, or why did you bother to post?
> If this had been a poll or someone had asked a question about using it, I can see, but nobody has.
> Seems like you just wanted to exercise your free speech and take a dump here.


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## DO4ISU

When you download one of these 1080p movies are they only for 24 hours also?


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## roadrunner1782

I was wondering if D* was ever gonna really make an extended effort with 1080p movies, and it looks like they're starting too.


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## PCampbell

Two Blu rays a month for 6.00 at netflix still a better deal for me.


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## RAD

qwsxz said:


> Wish List: auto download 1080p movies to the Movies Now folder.


+1, don't know why they don't do that and let the box downconvert if the TV doesn't support 1080p/24.


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## HoTat2

veryoldschool said:


> What is the value in your post, or why did you bother to post?
> If this had been a poll or someone had asked a question about using it, I can see, but nobody has.
> Seems like you just wanted to exercise your free speech and take a dump here.


While I agree with your sentiments here VOS in that unless this is a polling thread or something similar, if someone does not have anything helpful to offer other than to just flat-dump on the feature, then why even bother to post at all?

However, I was very disappointed to read what you posted in another recent thread on this feature here http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2062939#post2062939 where you noticed through the use of the DIRECTV2PC application the bit rate for DOD 1080P content was the same as 1080i broadcast at 6-8 mps  .

I was really looking forward to this content not so much for its native 1080P format but as IIP stated in different threads many times, the promise of it having a lower compression rate to where it would come close to Blu-Ray in picture quality.


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## Mertzen

RAD said:


> +1, don't know why they don't do that and let the box downconvert if the TV doesn't support 1080p/24.


Server and bandwith costs for D*.

I rather not have 1080p download automatically. It would tie up my modem continuously and I am sure would max out slower DSL and cable connections never mind people with fair use policies might hit their limits.


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## veryoldschool

Mertzen said:


> Server and bandwith costs for D*.
> 
> I rather not have 1080p download automatically. It would tie up my modem continuously and I am sure would max out slower DSL and cable connections never mind people with fair use policies might hit their limits.


 How about using "down times" on the SAT feed to give us them?
Anything using my ISP, "MUST BE" under my control.

*HoTat2*
Those "numbers" were from the freebies last year [bucket list, and something else]. I have a couple of freebies due me so I'll try to find something new and look at there bitrates again [but it may take awhile].


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## Hutchinshouse

Mertzen said:


> Server and bandwith costs for D*.
> 
> I rather not have 1080p download automatically. It would tie up my modem continuously and I am sure would max out slower DSL and cable connections never mind people with fair use policies might hit their limits.


I've read that 1080P/24hz movies are a smaller file size than the STD HD movie. I'm sure one of the mods can confirm. Also, the "Movies Now" stuff does not download via ethernet.


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## veryoldschool

Hutchinshouse said:


> I've read that 1080P/24hz movies are a smaller file size than the STD HD movie. I'm sure one of the mods can confirm. Also, the "Movies Now" stuff does not download via ethernet.


1080p/24 bitrate = 1080i bitrate [at the last times I used both with DirecTV2PC].


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## Doug Brott

It is likely that some of these 1080p movies will make it to the reserved space on your receiver. Not everyone has DIRECTV on Demand setup on their receiver.


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## RAD

Mertzen said:


> Server and bandwith costs for D*.
> 
> I rather not have 1080p download automatically. It would tie up my modem continuously and I am sure would max out slower DSL and cable connections never mind people with fair use policies might hit their limits.


Movies in the Movies Now folder aren't downloaded via internet connection but pushed out in the off hours on one of the 9XXX channels.


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## Aztec Pilot

This is cool. I am not a big PPV user. I subscribe to all the movie channels though. Since I do not rent movies from Netflix, I will try this. I bet it will look great on my new 1080P Epson going in the new theatre room.

How does 1080P movies compare to blu-ray? I think there is more to Blu-Ray than just 1080P. Also, Can the current lineup of receivers deal with the newer HD 7.1 audio formats?


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## Mertzen

Yeah, forgot about that. I guess there is some off time overnight on the SATs to send them down.


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## tcusta00

satgeek550 said:


> Just trying to keep up with Dish Network which launched this almost a year ago...


I thought Dish just came out with 1080p offerings in September?

And of course the two major satellite providers will be trying to keep up with each other. That's called competition and is what keeps these companies cranking out new goodies for us. If there weren't competition then they'd have little incentive to one-up each other.


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## peaches

Comments withdrawn by choice. Have fun with the new options.


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## Sixto

Been a slot on D11 transponder 5 (channel 9215) labeled "1080p Test" for several weeks ...


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## RAD

Mertzen said:


> Yeah, forgot about that. I guess there is some off time overnight on the SATs to send them down.


As mentioned it was more like September last year. And IIRC there were MANY report of people not seeing the 1080p program show up on their DVR's or couldn't play it. Plus you couldn't test ahead of time if it would work, you needed to play the PPV and pay for it. At least DirecTV used the CE group to get a large sample of folks to test 1080p for them and put some free 1080p content out there, from full movies to trailers, so we had something to test with.


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## p010ne

:nono2:HR21-100 search for 1080p does not return these? :nono:


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## tcusta00

p010ne said:


> :nono2:HR21-100 search for 1080p does not return these? :nono:


May take some time to populate into the database for the search. What are your search terms?


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## HoTat2

> *HoTat2*
> Those "numbers" were from the freebies last year [bucket list, and something else]. I have a couple of freebies due me so I'll try to find something new and look at there bitrates again [but it may take awhile].


OK, no problem VOS, take your time;

It just that if there is no lower compression (or higher bit rates) for these native 1080P movies to rival Blu-Ray PQ, then outside of bypassing the need for de-interlacing and imperfect motion compensation at some point in the signal processing chain for flat panel TVs, what is the real advantage of 1080P VOD over 1080i and why the need to relegate it only to DOD if the bit rate is the same as 1080i?


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## Hutchinshouse

p010ne said:


> :nono2:HR21-100 search for 1080p does not return these? :nono:


Same issue on my HR20-700

I tried title search and keyword search. I think the problem is "1080P" is not part of a description or title.


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## veryoldschool

p010ne said:


> :nono2:HR21-100 search for 1080p does not return these? :nono:


 "the blonde in me" just pressed the menu button [on my HR21-200], then On Demand, then HD, then movies and..... they are listed


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## p010ne

veryoldschool said:


> "the blonde in me" just pressed the menu button [on my HR21-200], then On Demand, then HD, then movies and..... they are listed


:eek2:Yes, one can retrieve and scan for 1080p; however, why are they not listed on a search (triple-tap or whatever) for them? I am downloading the one about Rodanthe because I just read "Three Weeks With My Brother" by the author (and I think we still have a couple of free pay movies available on our account).:eek2:


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## Hutchinshouse

veryoldschool said:


> "the blonde in me" just pressed the menu button [on my HR21-200], then On Demand, then HD, then movies and..... they are listed


Yeah, I see the movies that way too. It seems the "search for shows" feature cannot find them.


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## veryoldschool

HoTat2 said:


> OK, no problem VOS, take your time;
> 
> It just that if there is no lower compression (or higher bit rates) for these native 1080P movies to rival Blu-Ray PQ, then outside of bypassing the need for de-interlacing and imperfect motion compensation at some point in the signal processing chain for flat panel TVs, what is the real advantage of 1080P VOD over 1080i and why the need to relegate it to DOD if the bit rate is the same as 1080i?


One is "in on the way" now. I don't have a Blu-Ray player for comparison.
The 1080p [even in 1080i as my Sony is only 1080p/60] has seemed "to pop" more than other movies. Since Blu-Ray doesn't have any bandwidth [issues], I'm sure it uses less compression. For the "ultimate" PQ [for now] it should be tops, but without a 40+ Mb/s "feed", some might enjoy/see an improved PQ with these 1080p/24 that can be downloaded.


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## Doug Brott

Folks .. The EASY way to find 1080p .. Go to channel 1100 instead of using the On Demand menu item.

Choose High-Def and then 1080p .. they're all listed there.


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## HoTat2

veryoldschool said:


> One is "in on the way" now. I don't have a Blu-Ray player for comparison.
> The 1080p [even in 1080i as my Sony is only 1080p/60] has seemed "to pop" more than other movies. Since Blu-Ray doesn't have any bandwidth [issues], I'm sure it uses less compression. For the "ultimate" PQ [for now] it should be tops, but without a 40+ Mb/s "feed", some might enjoy/see an improved PQ with these 1080p/24 that can be downloaded.


Alright, I'll start downloading for a try myself as well;

I'm listed for three "PPV credits" on my account. Does this apply to VOD HD content as well?


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## veryoldschool

HoTat2 said:


> Alright, I'll start downloading for a try myself as well;
> 
> I'm listed for three "PPV credits" on my account. Does this apply to VOD HD content as well?


"It better" or I'm screwed [same three credits as you] :lol:


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## Jasqid

Clemsole said:


> If they are PPV then they are not worth it. Just another reason not bother with the VOD junk.


1080p VOD download = BLOWN Comcast 250GB cap... :eek2: And if you're on TWC... Forgettaboutit.

You're paying by the GB... or soon will be.


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## p010ne

Weird that DirecTV doesn't even suggest searching for 1080p?:grin:


> How to Find 1080p Titles
> To get access to the most 1080p titles, connect your receiver to the Internet. Learn how. Once you're connected, tune to channel 1100, where you'll see a list containing all of the DIRECTV on DEMAND movies available in 1080p. Take your pick and enjoy.
> 
> If your receiver is not connected to the Internet, you'll still be able to enjoy some movies in 1080p. To access the titles available to you, press the List button on your remote, then press the GREEN button to see Top Movies Now.


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## veryoldschool

1080p/24 verses 1080i/60 at the same bitrate:

1080i/60 = 1080p/30
30/24 = 1.25
"Seems like" there is 25% more "digital picture data" in the stream, which should "look better".


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## veryoldschool

p010ne said:


> Weird that DirecTV doesn't even suggest searching for 1080p?:grin:


Could it have to do with this just coming out?


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## Steve615

PR from DirecTV,announcing "largest selection of 1080p movies".

http://dtv.client.shareholder.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=377425


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## tcusta00

p010ne said:


> Weird that DirecTV doesn't even suggest searching for 1080p?:grin:


Not really. 1080p is a format, not a part of a title or keyword. What happens if you search for "HD" or "SD" in the same manner?


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## veryoldschool

tcusta00 said:


> Not really. 1080p is a format, not a part of a title or keyword. What happens if you search for "HD" or "SD" in the same manner?


I use "premiere" and it works for new shows and it's buried fairly deep in the info, FWIW
SD wouldn't work since it isn't listed anywhere :lol:


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## bidger

PCampbell said:


> Two Blu rays a month for 6.00 at netflix still a better deal for me.


Given that you've already invested in a Blu-ray player, sure. For those of us who haven't...well, it's something I'll consider anyway. The only title I feel compelled to watch is "Milk" right now.


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## p010ne

tcusta00 said:


> Not really. 1080p is a format, not a part of a title or keyword. What happens if you search for "HD" or "SD" in the same manner?


:grin:I have *1080p* as a recent saved search, which had been working to retrieve all those 1080p trailers that were available!
Also noticed this post: http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2064597&postcount=78


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## tcusta00

p010ne said:


> :grin:I have *1080p* as a recent saved search, which had been working to retrieve all those 1080p trailers that were available!


Ah, ok, didn't know that worked in the past. Then it's probably just a matter of the database being fully updated since this just launched this morning.


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## BattleZone

veryoldschool said:


> 1080p/24 verses 1080i/60 at the same bitrate:
> 
> 1080i/60 = 1080p/30
> 30/24 = 1.25
> "Seems like" there is 25% more "digital picture data" in the stream, which should "look better".


You would think that, except that the encoding doesn't work the way your math assumes. The original master file is a 24p file. To make a 60i or 60p version, all that happens is that some frames are repeated. Because of the way this works, repeating frames adds very, very little data overhead, and the actual frames are only stored once in the file, not 2 or 3 times in a row.

It appears that the DirecTV 1080p movies ARE at a slightly better bitrate, and they won't have any interlacing errors (on a TV that supports 24p), and most importantly, they are pre-compressed using multi-pass compression, which does a lot better job, and loses less quality, than the real-time compression used for most TV content.

And for the person who asked about audio: DirecTV's equipment (and bandwidth limitations) are currently limited to Dolby Digital 5.1. Blu-Ray is the only current source of the HD audio formats, as it is one of a very few ways to move very high bitrates. I'm not aware of any commercially downloaded content from any service that supports better than DD5.1 at this time.


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## jaguar325

I have been searching D*'s site the threads here and cannot find the answer to this question. If this is redundant, sorry.

I am going to test 1080p programming this weekend via OD PPV download of one of the movies listed under the 1080p listings. If I want to get the download out of the way during the week, is the correct way to do this to go in under the record/buy later option? I want to avoid doing the download and have the 24 hr. clock start ticking right away. I am OK with the clock starting once I tell the DVR I am ready to buy/watch the movie.

Thanks,

Big K


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## CopyCat

Most of the current DVD and PPV releases are free at the public library here and available on DVD for 7 days. 

Can't beat that price..........


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## dreadlk

The bit rates that Directv uses are so low that I doubt 1080P is going to be all that magical or make much difference! It certainly wont be anywhere near BluRay quality. With that said it's still a good start and any PQ improvement is welcomed, but my main concern is the price, at $5.99 this is just crazy, who do they think is going to buy these movies?


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## veryoldschool

jaguar325 said:


> I have been searching D*'s site the threads here and cannot find the answer to this question. If this is redundant, sorry.
> 
> I am going to test 1080p programming this weekend via OD PPV download of one of the movies listed under the 1080p listings. If I want to get the download out of the way during the week, is the correct way to do this to go in under the record/buy later option? I want to avoid doing the download and have the 24 hr. clock start ticking right away. I am OK with the clock starting once I tell the DVR I am ready to buy/watch the movie.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Big K


When you start to watch the PPV, after a min or so there is a pop-up asking/confirming that you want to buy it. You can also decline. This "seems like" the starting of "the clock".


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## Maui

I think this is great but $6 is a little steep. I'd like to see some channel like HDNET in 1080p.


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## veryoldschool

IIP said:


> You would think that, except that the encoding doesn't work the way your math assumes. The original master file is a 24p file. To make a 60i or 60p version, all that happens is that some frames are repeated. Because of the way this works, repeating frames adds very, very little data overhead, and the actual frames are only stored once in the file, not 2 or 3 times in a row.
> 
> It appears that the DirecTV 1080p movies ARE at a slightly better bitrate, and they won't have any interlacing errors (on a TV that supports 24p), and most importantly, they are pre-compressed using multi-pass compression, which does a lot better job, and loses less quality, than the real-time compression used for most TV content.
> 
> And for the person who asked about audio: DirecTV's equipment (and bandwidth limitations) are currently limited to Dolby Digital 5.1. Blu-Ray is the only current source of the HD audio formats, as it is one of a very few ways to move very high bitrates. I'm not aware of any commercially downloaded content from any service that supports better than DD5.1 at this time.


[and why the use of "seems like" & "should"] Thanks for your input. 
"Real numbers": Body of Lies for the first 7 min, bitrates vary from as little as 2 Mb/s to as high as 16 Mb/s.
"On the average" it looks like 6-8 Mb/s from the download time, over my [tested] 5Mb/s DSL.


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## veryoldschool

Maui said:


> I think this is great but $6 is a little steep. I'd like to see some channel like HDNET in 1080p.


Broadcast would be hard. First the content must be 24 frames and then from the post above, the variations of bitrate measured would be hard to stream with other broadcasts, while downloading to disk works.


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## Carbon

dreadlk said:


> The bit rates that Directv uses are so low that I doubt 1080P is going to be all that magical or make much difference! It certainly wont be anywhere near BluRay quality. With that said it's still a good start and any PQ improvement is welcomed, but my main concern is the price, at $5.99 this is just crazy, who do they think is going to buy these movies?


One of my co-workers told me that Comcast on Demand for HD not 1080P is $6.99 so this seems fair.


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## HoTat2

veryoldschool said:


> [and why the use of "seems like" & "should"] Thanks for your input.
> "Real numbers": Body of Lies for the first 7 min, bitrates vary from as little as 2 Mb/s to as high as 16 Mb/s.
> "On the average" it looks like 6-8 Mb/s from the download time, over my [tested] 5Mb/s DSL.


Still confused here; 

If the minimum to maximum data rate for the 1080P content is "2-16 Mb/s" as in this example from the movie "Body of Lies." And if redundant frames are eliminated in the transport stream as IIP states. Then what accounts for the 25% (derived from the 30/24 frame rate ratio) increase in data rate?

And does a widely varying bit rate like this (2-16 Mb/s) somehow translate into a sharper picture as opposed to a, I suppose, "less variable" around the average 1080i broadcast signal?


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## man_rob

Aztec Pilot said:


> This is cool. I am not a big PPV user. I subscribe to all the movie channels though. Since I do not rent movies from Netflix, I will try this. I bet it will look great on my new 1080P Epson going in the new theatre room.
> 
> How does 1080P movies compare to blu-ray? I think there is more to Blu-Ray than just 1080P. Also, Can the current lineup of receivers deal with the newer HD 7.1 audio formats?


Blu-Ray doesn't look better just because it's 1080p. Unless DirecTV ups the bitrate by huge amounts, 4 or 5 times what they have now, it's not going to look anywhere near as good as Blu-Ray. It should look marginally better than 1080i. The audio will not compare either.


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## dennisj00

Doug, Can we request (or forward our request) that they re-instate the '1080P' search term?

It's possible that the program won't just be 'Top Movies'. . . .there was some Showtime releases that were 1080p/24 and not movies (although it could have been a mistake).

I generally search for '1080P' at least once a week - in fact did it this morning around 7:30. . . .although they still don't show up in search.


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## bakers12

I just searched for the movie "W." and found it's the same $5.99 whether I download the 1080P version or wait to record the "regular" HD version off of the HDPPV channel. Since I can get one today (DoD) or one tomorrow (HDPPV), I'll download it now so I can see it tonight.


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## dettxw

Just a reminder that not all TVs properly support 1080p/24.

Here's a list of those that do so.


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## spartanstew

dettxw said:


> Just a reminder that not all TVs properly support 1080p/24.
> 
> Here's a list of those that do so.


Correction: That's a list of some of the plasmas and projectors that do.


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## dettxw

spartanstew said:


> Correction: That's a list of some of the plasmas and projectors that do.


That's List 1 of 3.
Gotta look at the other two Lists.


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## jacksg35c

i lthink 1080p is great but if it letterboxed in original aspect ratio like most dvd's then the big black bars on top and bottom will make it look crappy. can or do they crop it to 1.78 to fill our screens? i would like maybe offering both 1.78 and OAR options. dvd's in OAR to me look wierd and most folks would like a 1.78 dvd. any thoughts on this.


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## loudo

Kind of useless for those of us who subscribe to Premier, to get all the movie channels, to avoid the high PPV costs. I can wait a few weeks for the movie to be appear on one of the Premier Movie channels. I would like to see 1080p but I already pay enough for Premier and the sports packages that I get. 

I am hoping they will offer some of these same movies, in 1080p via DOD, when they play on Showtime, Movie Channel or any other DOD Channel.


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## dettxw

jacksg35c said:


> i lthink 1080p is great but if it letterboxed in original aspect ratio like most dvd's then the big black bars on top and bottom will make it look crappy. can or do they crop it to 1.78 to fill our screens? i would like maybe offering both 1.78 and OAR options. dvd's in OAR to me look wierd and most folks would like a 1.78 dvd. any thoughts on this.


OK, one vote for cropped.

I guess I'll balance you out and vote for OAR.


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## dettxw

Fixed up the listings.


dettxw said:


> Copied from the DirecTV Website Listings...
> 
> *1080p/24 VOD Movies*
> 
> 
> Movie | CH | Genre | Rating | Exp | Price
> 
> Ace Ventura Jr., Pet Detective | 1100 | Top Action | PG | 168 | $3.99
> Batman Forever | 1100 | Top Action | PG-13 |21 | $3.99
> Beverly Hills Chihuahua | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG |94 |$5.99
> Body of Lies | 1100 | Top Action | R |122 | $5.99
> Boy in the Striped Pajamas, The | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 |101 | $5.99
> Burn After Reading |1100 | Top Comedy | R | 45 | $5.99
> Changeling | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 107 | $5.99
> Dark Knight, The | 1100 | Top Thriller | PG-13 | 57 | $5.99
> Dead Pool | 1100 | Top Action | R | 21 | $3.99
> Dumb and Dumber | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 21 | $3.99
> Eagle Eye | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99
> Ghost Town | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99
> Hellboy II: The Golden Army | 1100 | Top Action | PG-13 | 14 | $5.99
> Kung Fu Panda | 1100 | Top Animation | PG | 14 | $5.99
> Madagascar: Escape 2 Africa | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG | 137 | $5.99
> Milk | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 137 | $5.99
> Mummy, The: Tomb of the Dragon ... | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99
> Nights in Rodanthe | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 115 | $5.99
> Pride and Glory | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 101 | $5.99
> Punisher: War Zone | 1100 | Top Drama | R | 123 | $5.99
> Saw V | 1100 | Top Horror | NR | 65 | $5.99
> Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 45 | $5.99
> Soul Men | 1100 | Top Comedy | R | 49 | $5.99
> Transporter 3 | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | PG-13 | 116 | $5.99
> Tropic Thunder | 1100 | Top Comedy | NR | 45 | $5.99
> Twilight | 1100 | Top Romance | PG-13 | 137 | $5.99
> Tyler Perry's The Family That ... | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 58 | $5.99
> Vicky Cristina Barcelona | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 41 | $5.99
> W. | 1100 | Top Drama | PG-13 | 85 | $5.99
> Wanted | 1100 | Top Action/adventure | R | 45 | $5.99
> Women, The | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 75 | $5.99
> Yes Man | 1100 | Top Comedy | PG-13 | 143 | $5.99
> Zack and Miri |1100 | Top Comedy | R | 55 | $5.99


----------



## Doug Brott

dennisj00 said:


> Doug, Can we request (or forward our request) that they re-instate the '1080P' search term?


Easier way now .. Tune to Channel 1100, Choose High-Def, Choose 1080p ..


----------



## veryoldschool

HoTat2 said:


> Still confused here;
> 
> If the average data rate for the 1080P content is "2-16 Mb/s" as in this example from the movie "Body of Lies." And if redundant frames are eliminated in the transport stream as IIP states. Then what accounts for the 25% (derived from the 30/24 frame rate ratio) increase in data rate?


 Average is incorrect. min/max are the 2-16 Mb/s, which "averages" 6-8 Mb/s over the complete program [by download times].


> And does a widely varying bit rate like this (2-16 Mb/s) somehow translate into a sharper picture as opposed to a, I suppose, "less variable" around the average 1080i broadcast signal?


The "compression" is done "not in real time" [which most broadcast is done in], which means a couple of things. First the time to do it doesn't have to be confined to feeding "the stream". Second since this is going to storage, the bitrate can vary much more, where if coming off the SAT for live watching, needs to be much more constant. Imagine the detail in one frame taking 1 sec to stream and then the following being 1/60 sec, since not much detail changed. This would be harder to "time" for a non recorder.
Now what do you get for the 25% [which as IIP stated isn't really a true number] should be either finer detail or better color depth, which may simply be the same thing as each pixel can have a more unique value.

In Body of Lies, the overhead shots of the cities and as they zoomed in had some good detail.


----------



## dreadlk

If Comcrap charges $6.99 thats $1 more crazy than Directv's price. This stuff is madness, when all is said and done you don't even own the movie! Most I would ever pay for any of this is $3



Carbon said:


> One of my co-workers told me that Comcast on Demand for HD not 1080P is $6.99 so this seems fair.


----------



## veryoldschool

dreadlk said:


> Most I would ever pay for any of this is $3


Which is $3 more than I've ever spent on PPV in six years.


----------



## HoTat2

I wrote earlier:



> Still confused here;
> 
> If the average data rate for the 1080P content is "2-16 Mb/s" as in this example from the movie "Body of Lies." And if redundant frames are eliminated in the transport stream as IIP states. Then what accounts for the 25% (derived from the 30/24 frame rate ratio) increase in data rate?


VOS:



> Average is incorrect. min/max are the 2-16 Mb/s, which "averages" 6-8 Mb/s over the complete program [by download times].


Thanks  ;

I corrected it in my previous post. Already downloaded "The Boy in the Striped Pajamas" in 1080P. Looks great so far, though I'm not yet sure I see *too* much of a difference over 1080i, but I'll keep observing of course.


----------



## veryoldschool

HoTat2 said:


> I corrected it in my previous post. Already downloaded "The Boy in the Striped Pajamas" in 1080P. Looks great so far, though I'm not yet sure I see *too* much of a difference over 1080i, but I'll keep observing of course.


I don't think anybody here is going to say DirecTV 1080p "matches" Blu-Ray.


----------



## BattleZone

HoTat2 said:


> Still confused here;
> 
> If the minimum to maximum data rate for the 1080P content is "2-16 Mb/s" as in this example from the movie "Body of Lies." And if redundant frames are eliminated in the transport stream as IIP states. Then what accounts for the 25% (derived from the 30/24 frame rate ratio) increase in data rate?
> 
> And does a widely varying bit rate like this (2-16 Mb/s) somehow translate into a sharper picture as opposed to a, I suppose, "less variable" around the average 1080i broadcast signal?


To further VOS's reply, a big reason that you'll get better quality is because when you're watching a sat stream live, it has to be encoded in real time. The encoder has to encode the (approx) 5 channels on a single HD transponder together. Though it can monitor the stream a second or two ahead and make slight adjustments to the bitrate balance allocated to each channel, the adjustment range is small, because it has to be. One of the channels may post a static graphic for a second or two that takes very little bandwidth to keep refreshed, but the following second could jump to a scene with full-screen motion, peaking out the bandwidth needed. A real-time encoder doesn't deal with such extremes very well, so it has to average them out.

So, let's use some numbers, and I'm totally making these up, even though they're probably pretty close to reality.

There are 5 HD channels on a transponder. On a live encoder, let's say that each of the 5 channels is allocated 5-7 MB/s. We'll say that the entire throughput of the transponder is 30 MB/s, so you can see that while each channel can vary slightly, the total has to stay under 30 MB/s, meaning at any one time, if 2 of the channels are at 7 MB/s, the other 3 have to be throttled back to 5.3 MB/s or so. The encoder has a little room to work with, but not much, and no channel is likely to exceed 7 MB/s, ever. Here, the average is 6 MB/s across all 5 channels.

Now, compare that to a downloaded 1080/24p file. Across its entire run-time, it may also average 6 MB/s. But because it doesn't have to be encoded live, it can be run through a server farm of computers, with multiple passes each looking at several seconds of video at a time and compressing across that much larger window. It will mean that some parts of the movie with static shots will have a very low bitrate (down to 2 MB/s or so), while scenes with lots of action could hit peaks of 15 MB/s!

That's more than double the peak throughput of a live-streamed movie, and that's why it will look much better when you're watching a "difficult to compress" scene. A live stream simply has no choice but to "toss out" a bunch of information to keep the bitrate squeezed down to a constant 6-7 MB/s maximum, while a pre-compressed file, which may have been processed by a dozen or more computers for several days to optimize the compression, can have those much higher peaks.

Those peaks may not compare to Blu-Ray, which can peak over 40 MB/s, but it's a big improvement over a live stream, and "normal" eyes will see a difference.


----------



## dreadlk

Dont think your going to see much difference, thats because the resolution is not really as important as the Bandwidth / Data Rate. I have seen a 620i video that look as good as Directv's 1080i and thats because that 620 video had lots more data packed into each frame.



HoTat2 said:


> I wrote earlier:
> 
> I corrected it in my previous post. Already downloaded "The Boy in the Striped Pajamas" in 1080P. Looks great so far, though I'm not yet sure I see *too* much of a difference over 1080i, but I'll keep observing of course.


----------



## loudo

For 2 rentals you spend enough to pay for HBO or Starz for a month.


----------



## veryoldschool

loudo said:


> For 2 rentals you spend enough to pay for HBO or Starz for a month.


 And if you've had HBO or Starz for a month, you might not find a movie worth watching. [I'm still wonding why some times I pay for the three services] :lol:


----------



## HDTVFreak07

It's totally worthless for me. No closed captioning in 1080p PPV movies.


----------



## loudo

veryoldschool said:


> And if you've had HBO or Starz for a month, you might not find a movie worth watching. [I'm still wonding why some times I pay for the three services] :lol:


Isn't that the truth. When growing up as kids we had 2 OTA TV stations (ABC & CBS), and we were saying we couldn't find anything to watch. Today we have hundreds of channels and we are still saying the same thing. :scratch:


----------



## Steve615

Doug Brott said:


> Easier way now .. Tune to Channel 1100, Choose High-Def, Choose 1080p ..


Sounds like something I said this morning... :sure:  :grin:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2064581#post2064581

Post #77 in that thread.


----------



## betterdan

So are the movies now in 5.1 or better? During the tests they weren't and that kinda killed the excitement.


----------



## veryoldschool

betterdan said:


> So are the movies now in 5.1 or better? During the tests they weren't and that kinda killed the excitement.


 5.1


----------



## betterdan

Good to hear they are in 5.1 that makes it a little easier to swallow if you pony up the money for one.


----------



## meldar_b

$5.99 per flick

Still cheaper that going out to the movies


----------



## dennisj00

Doug Brott said:


> Easier way now .. Tune to Channel 1100, Choose High-Def, Choose 1080p ..


That's the "Top Movies" category. . . will this get ALL 1080p programming or does this indicate it will be movies only?


----------



## Chris Blount

meldar_b said:


> $5.99 per flick
> 
> Still cheaper that going out to the movies


Good point.

Let's face it guys. Having these movies available at the touch of a button is a luxury. Those willing to pay for not having to get off the couch will pony up the $5.99. Lord knows I've done it a few times with DirecTV and AppleTV.


----------



## jaguar325

I went back into the OD menu last night to order a "test" PPV 1080p movie. I hit the menu button, then OD, then got the same confusing menu OD menu as I have seen in the past (not a big fan of the navigation). I got the HD movie listings and was disappointed to see that it was all HD movies, including the standard 1080i ones. 

I decided to go back to the exact sequence I had used earlier in the day (got it from an ad on the D* web site) and realized the difference is that I keyed in channel 1100 instead of using the OD menu available under the menu button on the remote. This is the same thing Doug said to do in his first post. Once I got to 1100 finding the HD 1080p specific movie listing was easy (menu was slightly different) - looking more closely, I saw that 1100 is a PPV only channel. 

Does anybody know why they have a PPV-only channel vs. improving navigation in OD? Are there other special OD channels that I have not heard about?

FYI: Download time on a 2hr 1080p program was about 3 hours - did it in the evening so can't say whether it would have slowed me down if I was on my PC. We have pretty standard, semi-marginal cable modem service where I live so this speed would probably be on the slow side compared to most people. 

Thanks,

-Big K


----------



## Steve615

dennisj00 said:


> That's the "Top Movies" category. . . will this get ALL 1080p programming or does this indicate it will be movies only?


At this time,it appears that all 1080p programming consists of movies only.


----------



## Doug Brott

betterdan said:


> Good to hear they are in 5.1 that makes it a little easier to swallow if you pony up the money for one.





meldar_b said:


> $5.99 per flick
> 
> Still cheaper that going out to the movies


This is an Extra Service that DIRECTV has done a good job putting together. I don't believe any other Pay TV service has something like this available.


----------



## Doug Brott

dennisj00 said:


> That's the "Top Movies" category. . . will this get ALL 1080p programming or does this indicate it will be movies only?





Steve615 said:


> At this time,it appears that all 1080p programming consists of movies only.


Correct, just movies at this point. Not sure when/if that will change.


----------



## jaywdetroit

Forgive me if this is the wrong thread but for what it's worth...

I watched a bit of Kung Fu Panda with my son last night in 1080p. I had Auto Motion turned up and it was like looking through glass. Amazing picture.

EDIT: Pay no attention to the signature- rest assured, we were watching in 1080p.


----------



## CindyJ

Doug Brott said:


> It is likely that some of these 1080p movies will make it to the reserved space on your receiver. Not everyone has DIRECTV on Demand setup on their receiver.


I now have 2 1080p movies in my Top Movies section.


----------



## RAD

CindyJ said:


> I now have 2 1080p movies in my Top Movies section.


I've got Madagascar 2 on one HR21, recorded at 11:26AM CDT today.


----------



## jonesron

Unless D* updated the firmware recently, its not just many HDTVs that don't support 1080p/24. It appears the D* HD-DVRs don't correctly support it either. I have two HR22's connected via HDMI to two different 1080p HDTVs that both support 1080p/24 and work correctly with a 1080p/24 input from either my Sony S350 and PS3 . However both HR22s incorrectly report these TVs don't support 1080p resolution.


----------



## Sixto

Nice to see a 1080p movie in the Top Movies list. Very nice, very nice indeed!


----------



## hdtvfan0001

RAD said:


> I've got Madagascar 2 on one HR21, recorded at 11:26AM CDT today.


My......uh......*A *great movie.....


----------



## jlagesse

I got Yes Man in 1080P today from directv 1100 VOD, but when I try to watch it, it plays but has the big blue screen over a quarter of the screen that tells me how to order this PPV. Any ideas what the problem is?


----------



## JoeTheDragon

jlagesse said:


> I got Yes Man in 1080P today from directv 1100 VOD, but when I try to watch it, it plays but has the big blue screen over a quarter of the screen that tells me how to order this PPV. Any ideas what the problem is?


hook up a phone line and you may have to call in to have them force your system to call in.

I had to hook a up phone to get PPV to work Free VOD worked 100% and had and still e-net hooked to in.


----------



## spartanstew

jacksg35c said:


> i lthink 1080p is great but if it letterboxed in original aspect ratio like most dvd's then the big black bars on top and bottom will make it look crappy. can or do they crop it to 1.78 to fill our screens? i would like maybe offering both 1.78 and OAR options. dvd's in OAR to me look wierd and most folks would like a 1.78 dvd. any thoughts on this.




I had no idea that there were still people that would rather cut off up to 25% of the picture just to avoid black bars. I pray they don't do this, nor make it an option. I also hope they don't fully colorize Sin City just so those with new HD displays can see all the pretty colors.


----------



## directvfreak

So do you have to have a 1080p/24 compatable TV for 1080p content to work? I'm confused. 
I think DirecTV should post a sample 1080p video just for users o test if their TV is compatible.


----------



## RAD

directvfreak said:


> So do you have to have a 1080p/24 compatable TV for 1080p content to work? I'm confused.
> I think DirecTV should post a sample 1080p video just for users o test if their TV is compatible.


From all the testing I've done you don't need a 1080p/24 TV to make it work. If it does support 1080p/24 then you can watch it in that resolution, if not the STB will downconvert it to what your TV does support.

As for testing, just start to watch one of the 1080p/24 movies, you get a few minutes 'free' before it blacks out if you don't want to purchase.


----------



## Rich

Interesting article:

http://www.multichannel.com/blog/The_Satellite_Dish/12323-1080p_Comes_To_DirecTV_UPDATED_.php

And here's a list of 1080p TVs:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=5155

Rich


----------



## jlagesse

JoeTheDragon said:


> hook up a phone line and you may have to call in to have them force your system to call in.
> 
> I had to hook a up phone to get PPV to work Free VOD worked 100% and had and still e-net hooked to in.


The phone line is hooked up. I could watch the whole movie if I did not mind seeing only 3/4 of the screen. The rest is covered up by the blue screen asking if I want to purchase this PPV.


----------



## georgeorwell

directvfreak said:


> So do you have to have a 1080p/24 compatable TV for 1080p content to work? I'm confused.
> I think DirecTV should post a sample 1080p video just for users o test if their TV is compatible.


They did this with the Hulk sampler clip, however I'm not sure it's still available.


----------



## CindyJ

jlagesse said:


> The phone line is hooked up. I could watch the whole movie if I did not mind seeing only 3/4 of the screen. The rest is covered up by the blue screen asking if I want to purchase this PPV.


Just to be sure I understand correctly.... You've already clicked yes to purchase the PPV and the "do you want to buy" screen doesn't go away?


----------



## Greg Alsobrook

jlagesse said:


> The phone line is hooked up. I could watch the whole movie if I did not mind seeing only 3/4 of the screen. The rest is covered up by the blue screen asking if I want to purchase this PPV.





CindyJ said:


> Just to be sure I understand correctly.... You've already clicked yes to purchase the PPV and the "do you want to buy" screen doesn't go away?


Good point Cindy. After clicking on the movie in your Playlist, make sure to click 'Purchase/Buy' _before _pressing Play.


----------



## jlagesse

CindyJ said:


> Just to be sure I understand correctly.... You've already clicked yes to purchase the PPV and the "do you want to buy" screen doesn't go away?


All I did was go to channel 1100 and select the movie I wanted to see. Once it was complete on my DVR I tried to watch it. There was never a question asked to click 'Purchase/Buy'. Just the blue box asking me to goto directv.com/ppv to order. And a button for more info.


----------



## CindyJ

jlagesse said:


> All I did was go to channel 1100 and select the movie I wanted to see. Once it was complete on my DVR I tried to watch it. There was never a question asked to click 'Purchase/Buy'. Just the blue box asking me to goto directv.com/ppv to order. And a button for more info.


So Ethernet is hooked up/working and your phone line is also connected (either should allow you to order PPV) but it still tells you to go to the website to order PPV. Maybe your account has PPV disabled (but in that case, you would think the message would be "PPV disabled, please call D* customer service"). Perhaps a telephone call to D* is in order.


----------



## DeanS

I was a little surprised to learn that D* has now made available 1080p movies that are "pushed" down by satellite. I didn't know this until I logged on to my D* account and read about the new feature. I just purchased about 2months ago a new Sony LCD 1080p set (that has 24 fps capability) so I am anxious to try this out. 

As a rule, we don't rent many PPV movies. We mostly rely on HBO to watch new movie releases at home. But I was just about to go out and purchase a blue-ray disc player, but now I am going to hold off. If for the few times we actually rent movies to watch, it doesn't make sense to purchase a new BR player and open a netflix account. So I applaud D* for making at least some of their 1080p content available on the List tab. 

I did just order a WGA600N Linkysis Gaming Adaptor for my HR20 so I can finally use Direct on Demand - and get wider avilability to the 1080p library. In the meantime, I will watch Madagascar tonight just to see my first 1080p movie on my new set.

Quick question: Are all of these D* PPV 1080p movies shown in 24fps?

Thanks.


----------



## veryoldschool

DeanS said:


> Quick question: Are all of these D* PPV 1080p movies shown in 24fps?
> 
> Thanks.


yes


----------



## man_rob

DeanS said:


> I was a little surprised to learn that D* has now made available 1080p movies that are "pushed" down by satellite. I didn't know this until I logged on to my D* account and read about the new feature. I just purchased about 2months ago a new Sony LCD 1080p set (that has 24 fps capability) so I am anxious to try this out.
> 
> As a rule, we don't rent many PPV movies. We mostly rely on HBO to watch new movie releases at home. But I was just about to go out and purchase a blue-ray disc player, but now I am going to hold off. If for the few times we actually rent movies to watch, it doesn't make sense to purchase a new BR player and open a netflix account. So I applaud D* for making at least some of their 1080p content available on the List tab.
> 
> I did just order a WGA600N Linkysis Gaming Adaptor for my HR20 so I can finally use Direct on Demand - and get wider avilability to the 1080p library. In the meantime, I will watch Madagascar tonight just to see my first 1080p movie on my new set.
> 
> Quick question: Are all of these D* PPV 1080p movies shown in 24fps?
> 
> Thanks.


Keep in mind, although they are 1080p, the DirecTV PPVs are highly compressed compared to Blu-Ray video. Blu-Ray looks good because of high bit rates, not because it's 1080p. It's more a marketing gimmick, but some will swear that they can see the emperor's new clothes.


----------



## BattleZone

man_rob said:


> Keep in mind, although they are 1080p, the DirecTV PPVs are highly compressed compared to Blu-Ray video. Blu-Ray looks good because of high bit rates, not because it's 1080p. It's more a marketing gimmick, but some will swear that they can see the emperor's new clothes.


It's absolutely true that Blu-Ray, with bitrate peaks of 40 MB/s, can handle far more throughput than DirecTV's DoD. But... The DoD has peaks up to 16 MB/s or so, which is far greater than the peaks of around 7 MB/s that a normal live HD sat stream is capable of.

Also, since the DoD is limited to Dolby Digital 5.1 audio, and not the higher-bitrate HD audio formats used by Blu-Ray, most of that bandwidth is usable for video, so (putting aside the differences in audio quality) the difference in video is less than it appears between DoD and Blu-Ray.

No one is suggesting that you can get full Blu-Ray audio and video on any other platform today; you can't. If you need every bit of quality, then you have to spend money for Blu-Ray. But the experience of the DoD movies is noticably better than what you see on a normal live sat stream, and for many, DoD is more convenient than buying a Blu-Ray player and subscribing to Netflix or Blockbuster. My advice: use whichever services work best for you.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

BattleZone said:


> It's absolutely true that Blu-Ray, with bitrate peaks of 40 MB/s, can handle far more throughput than DirecTV's DoD. But... The DoD has peaks up to 16 MB/s or so, which is far greater than the peaks of around 7 MB/s that a normal live HD sat stream is capable of.
> 
> Also, since the DoD is limited to Dolby Digital 5.1 audio, and not the higher-bitrate HD audio formats used by Blu-Ray, most of that bandwidth is usable for video, so (putting aside the differences in audio quality) the difference in video is less than it appears between DoD and Blu-Ray.
> 
> No one is suggesting that you can get full Blu-Ray audio and video on any other platform today; you can't. If you need every bit of quality, then you have to spend money for Blu-Ray. But the experience of the DoD movies is noticably better than what you see on a normal live sat stream, and for many, DoD is more convenient than buying a Blu-Ray player and subscribing to Netflix or Blockbuster. My advice: use whichever services work best for you.


As Paul Harvey would have said.....thanks for *the rest of that story*....


----------



## Rich

BattleZone said:


> It's absolutely true that Blu-Ray, with bitrate peaks of 40 MB/s, can handle far more throughput than DirecTV's DoD. But... The DoD has peaks up to 16 MB/s or so, which is far greater than the peaks of around 7 MB/s that a normal live HD sat stream is capable of.
> 
> Also, since the DoD is limited to Dolby Digital 5.1 audio, and not the higher-bitrate HD audio formats used by Blu-Ray, most of that bandwidth is usable for video, so (putting aside the differences in audio quality) the difference in video is less than it appears between DoD and Blu-Ray.
> 
> No one is suggesting that you can get full Blu-Ray audio and video on any other platform today; you can't. If you need every bit of quality, then you have to spend money for Blu-Ray. But the experience of the DoD movies is noticably better than what you see on a normal live sat stream, and for many, DoD is more convenient than buying a Blu-Ray player and subscribing to Netflix or Blockbuster. My advice: use whichever services work best for you.


That was a good post. I've been thinking of getting a BD player and you've added to that thought. I am using a Sony DVD upscaler that upscales to "1080p" and gives a better picture than 1080i or 720p. Very noticeably better.

The upscaling process must use a lot of compression to get the picture it does, or am I wrong? If I'm right, and VOD 1080p is as good as my upscaler, it would be worth paying for, I guess.

Or would I be better off with a BD player and NetFlix? From your post, it would seem that the BD player would be the better choice. Am I correct? I don't plan to buy a lot of BD disks, maybe a series such as the "Tudors". Along those lines.

My intention, if I choose to buy a BD player is a Panasonic. Any thoughts on that?

Rich


----------



## DeanS

I find this discussion interesting. I have very limited experience viewing movies in 1080p on a BD player - basically just watching a movie scene or two on a set in a big box store connected to a BD player. Would it be incorrect to say I probably wouldn't notice that great of a difference between D*'s version of 1080p and that from a BD player? 

My audio system only supports DD 5.1 anyway, so the audio enhancements built in to a BD player wouldn't benefit me. Also, if I were to purchase a BD player, I would then have THREE DVD players (one is a recorder) in my home theatre setup. This would be "overkill" in my book. 

My current main DVD player (480p) player is connected to the new Sony 1080p set via component inputs. Unless I'm missing something, don't these new LCD 1080p sets upscale these signals to 1080p? I looked at some DVD's on my new set playing on the 480p DVD player and wasn't impressed with the picture quality at all.

Thanks.


----------



## hdtvfan0001

rich584 said:


> That was a good post. I've been thinking of getting a BD player and you've added to that thought. I am using a Sony DVD upscaler that upscales to "1080p" and gives a better picture than 1080i or 720p. Very noticeably better.
> 
> The upscaling process must use a lot of compression to get the picture it does, or am I wrong? If I'm right, and VOD 1080p is as good as my upscaler, it would be worth paying for, I guess.
> 
> Or would I be better off with a BD player and NetFlix? From your post, it would seem that the BD player would be the better choice. Am I correct? I don't plan to buy a lot of BD disks, maybe a series such as the "Tudors". Along those lines.
> 
> My intention, if I choose to buy a BD player is a Panasonic. Any thoughts on that?
> 
> Rich


The BD player will give you a more consistent quality 1080p playback. The download services are intriguing, but still new.

As for a Panny BD player - the BD60 and BD80 are rated as great units, and would also give you support for downloadable content should you choose to go that route.

IMHO, BD disks themselves provide outstanding HD viewing.


----------



## NOLANSKI

YYYYYYAAAAAAAAWWWWNNNNNN


----------



## BattleZone

jonesron said:


> Unless D* updated the firmware recently, its not just many HDTVs that don't support 1080p/24. It appears the D* HD-DVRs don't correctly support it either. I have two HR22's connected via HDMI to two different 1080p HDTVs that both support 1080p/24 and work correctly with a 1080p/24 input from either my Sony S350 and PS3 . However both HR22s incorrectly report these TVs don't support 1080p resolution.


Some TVs can correctly accept 1080/24p signals, but don't REPORT via HDMI that they can do so.

If you go to the System Info screen, it should tell you what resolutions your TV is reporting support for (a very helpful new feature).


----------



## CindyJ

rich584 said:


> My intention, if I choose to buy a BD player is a Panasonic. Any thoughts on that?
> 
> Rich


I have a Panasonic BD30 (now discontinued) and BD80. Both are great. You'll also find that Panasonic is top-notch when it comes to providing firmware updates as the need arises. They also continue to provide firmware updates for their discontinued BD players.


----------



## NR4P

veryoldschool said:


> How about using "down times" on the SAT feed to give us them?
> Anything using my ISP, "MUST BE" under my control.


Definitely agree with that.
ISP's are experimenting with charging for excessive use. Comcast sends warnings to users who use over 250GB/month.


----------



## jaywdetroit

NR4P said:


> Definitely agree with that.
> ISP's are experimenting with charging for excessive use. Comcast sends warnings to users who use over 250GB/month.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30252543/


----------



## dreadlk

The problem is that Directv is suggesting that it's BluRay Quality.
This is posted on Directv's 1080P Website section right now!

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageNR.jsp?assetId=3720002

"As the leader in HD, DIRECTV now brings you the latest in HD technology: 1080p. The same HD format as Blu-ray Discs, 1080p "

Secondly your Bit Rate Data is misleading, while you say DOD peaks out at 16MB and that may be true, the Average Bit rate is probably about half of that.
but it's the Average Bit rate that will make the picture look Great, not the Peak which only occurs during high activity scenes that need more BW to properly display all the changing elements of the picture.



BattleZone said:


> It's absolutely true that Blu-Ray, with bitrate peaks of 40 MB/s, can handle far more throughput than DirecTV's DoD. But... The DoD has peaks up to 16 MB/s or so, which is far greater than the peaks of around 7 MB/s that a normal live HD sat stream is capable of.
> -
> snip
> -
> No one is suggesting that you can get full Blu-Ray audio and video on any other platform today; you can't.
> -
> snip
> -
> My advice: use whichever services work best for you.


----------



## Rich

DeanS said:


> I find this discussion interesting. I have very limited experience viewing movies in 1080p on a BD player - basically just watching a movie scene or two on a set in a big box store connected to a BD player.


They do look great in the stores, don't they?



> Would it be incorrect to say I probably wouldn't notice that great of a difference between D*'s version of 1080p and that from a BD player?


If I'm reading everything correctly, the BD will give you better PQ. Noticeably better.



> My audio system only supports DD 5.1 anyway, so the audio enhancements built in to a BD player wouldn't benefit me.


I've got sound systems that support 7.1,6.1 and 5.1 and as long as you have good speakers, I think any of them will sound good. Don't let that be a deterrent to buying a BD player. I haven't bought one yet because of ignorance, I let the whole Blu-Ray thing pass me by. Now I (and you) gotta play catch up.



> Also, if I were to purchase a BD player, I would then have THREE DVD players (one is a recorder) in my home theatre setup. This would be "overkill" in my book.
> 
> My current main DVD player (480p) player is connected to the new Sony 1080p set via component inputs. Unless I'm missing something, don't these new LCD 1080p sets upscale these signals to 1080p? I looked at some DVD's on my new set playing on the 480p DVD player and wasn't impressed with the picture quality at all.


OK, I'm a little bit ahead of you here. I've been using "upscaling" DVD players for years (actually years, time sure flies...) and since I finally got a 1080p TV I can finally see the difference. Costco usually has Sony upscalers that work really well and only cost about $70. They upscale to 1080p. You WILL be impressed with what they do to a standard wide screen DVD. They do not upscale full screen DVDs.

But after all the research I've done, I think I'll buy a BD Panny and upgrade my NetFlix account to Blu-Ray disks.

Rich


----------



## Rich

hdtvfan0001 said:


> The BD player will give you a more consistent quality 1080p playback. The download services are intriguing, but still new.
> 
> As for a Panny BD player - the BD60 and BD80 are rated as great units, and would also give you support for downloadable content should you choose to go that route.
> 
> IMHO, BD disks themselves provide outstanding HD viewing.


What exactly are those downloads? If it's just a director babbling on, that wouldn't interest me. I've been trying to figure out this feature and I come up empty.

Rich


----------



## Rich

CindyJ said:


> I have a Panasonic BD30 (now discontinued) and BD80. Both are great. You'll also find that Panasonic is top-notch when it comes to providing firmware updates as the need arises. They also continue to provide firmware updates for their discontinued BD players.


Still haven't read one negative post about the Pannys and that remains my BD player of choice.

Rich


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> The problem is that Directv is suggesting that it's BluRay Quality.
> This is posted on Directv's 1080P Website section right now!
> 
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageNR.jsp?assetId=3720002
> 
> "As the leader in HD, DIRECTV now brings you the latest in HD technology: 1080p. The same HD format as Blu-ray Discs, 1080p "
> 
> Secondly your Bit Rate Data is misleading, while you say DOD peaks out at 16MB and that may be true, the Average Bit rate is probably about half of that.
> but it's the Average Bit rate that will make the picture look Great, not the Peak which only occurs during high activity scenes that need more BW to properly display all the changing elements of the picture.


So the BD player is gonna give you the better PQ? How about my Sony upscalers? Where do they fit into the picture? Same as D*'s 1080p?

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> What exactly are those downloads? If it's just a director babbling on, that wouldn't interest me. I've been trying to figure out this feature and I come up empty.
> 
> Rich


 "Up scaling" DVDs are still going to have more than half of "the dots" being makeup. How the upscaling is done [the scaler] can look quite good [good scaler].
with 1920 x 1080 "dots", "true" 1080p doesn't need to make up "dots".
"The same HD format as Blu-ray Disks, 1080p " is a true statement, though the PQ isn't going to be the same.
"The question is" does DirecTV 1080p programs look better than 1080i programs? This would be in the eye of the beholder, so.... only the viewer will know.

Blu-Ray over the net: You're either going to be waiting a VERY long time for the download, or it will be reduced bitrate.
You simply can't have both "full bitrate & decent download times".

DirecTV seems to have used a balance of better PQ and reasonable download times.
YMMV.


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> "Up scaling" DVDs are still going to have more than half of "the dots" being makeup. How the upscaling is done [the scaler] can look quite good [good scaler].
> with 1920 x 1080 "dots", "true" 1080p doesn't need to make up "dots".
> "The same HD format as Blu-ray Disks, 1080p " is a true statement, though the PQ isn't going to be the same.
> "The question is" does DirecTV 1080p programs look better than 1080i programs? This would be in the eye of the beholder, so.... only the viewer will know.
> 
> Blu-Ray over the net: You're either going to be waiting a VERY long time for the download, or it will be reduced bitrate.
> You simply can't have both "full bitrate & decent download times".
> 
> DirecTV seems to have used a balance of better PQ and reasonable download times.
> YMMV.


My 1080p upscaler PQ looks quite a bit better than a 1080i recording. Very much better. And only $70. But, I'm still gonna buy a BD player one of these days. Just ordered a wireless gizmo that will allow me to use VOD (I hope it will, I hope I read everything correctly) on my 1080p TV which is in a room that I'm never gonna get a hard wire Ethernet connection in.

Rich


----------



## Igor

This thread is interesting, but is missing testimonials. Here we go 

I watched one of 1080p movies that were already pushed to my box. The picture and sound were amazing. My set is a 60" pioneer and supports 1080p24 natively.

I have a blueRay player and might even use it in the future. But the choice will be based on title availability, not quality.


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> My 1080p upscaler PQ looks quite a bit better than a 1080i recording. Very much better. And only $70. But, I'm still gonna buy a BD player one of these days. Just ordered a wireless gizmo that will allow me to use VOD (I hope it will, I hope I read everything correctly) on my 1080p TV which is in a room that I'm never gonna get a hard wire Ethernet connection in.
> 
> Rich


As Fred will tell you: 
1080i is 2 half images. Your scaler will look at the two halves and patch them together. With DVDs it will decide [guess at] what each "dot" should be. Good scalers will "guess quite well" and will "patch" the two halves together well too.


----------



## Rich

Vitor said:


> This thread is interesting, but is missing testimonials. Here we go
> 
> I watched one of 1080p movies that were already pushed to my box. The picture and sound were amazing. My set is a 60" pioneer and supports 1080p24 natively.
> 
> I have a blueRay player and might even use it in the future. But the choice will be based on title availability, not quality.


Aww, just when I had my mind made up. Good post! More, more...

Rich


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> As Fred will tell you:
> 1080i is 2 half images. Your scaler will look at the two halves and patch them together. With DVDs it will decide [guess at] what each "dot" should be. Good scalers will "guess quite well" and will "patch" the two halves together well too.


Can't find any references to 1080p in the _Book of Fred._ :lol:

That post by *Vitor* was very interesting. Now I gotta wait for my wireless gizmo to arrive and see for myself.

Rich


----------



## SteveHas

watching Kung Fu Panda in 1080p with the family
OUTSTANDING!
Thanks D*
you did it again!


----------



## Sixto

just noticed last 5 movies in "top movies" are now all 1080p. outstanding!


----------



## CindyJ

Sixto said:


> just noticed last 5 movies in "top movies" are now all 1080p. outstanding!


I've got 6 of 9 in 1080p. Outstanding indeed!


----------



## Rich

SteveHas said:


> watching Kung Fu Panda in 1080p with the family
> OUTSTANDING!
> Thanks D*
> you did it again!


Have you seen it on BD? A comparison would be helpful. But "OUTSTANDING" is pretty helpful too. I'd really like to hear some comparisons. And some more opinions such as this.

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> Have you seen it on BD? A comparison would be helpful. But "OUTSTANDING" is pretty helpful too. I'd really like to hear some comparisons. And some more opinions such as this.
> 
> Rich


best: Blu-Ray
next: DirecTV 1080p
then: 1080i/720p [most likely OTA], then DirecTV 1080i/720p MPEG-4
"the numbers" [bit-rates] seem to point to this.
"How much" is in the eye of the beholder and their system.


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> best: Blu-Ray
> next: DirecTV 1080p
> then: 1080i/720p [most likely OTA], then DirecTV 1080i/720p MPEG-4
> "the numbers" [bit-rates] seem to point to this.
> "How much" is in the eye of the beholder and their system.


Do you have a BD player? I'm still not sure if spending $300 on a BD player is worth it. If the delta between BD and D* is minimal, I'll stick with the D* content. If that gizmo that is scheduled to arrive tomorrow works. I suppose I could get my 100' Ethernet cord out and just try one. Think I'll do that now.

Thanx,

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> Do you have a BD player? I'm still not sure if spending $300 on a BD player is worth it. If the delta between BD and D* is minimal, I'll stick with the D* content. If that gizmo that is scheduled to arrive tomorrow works. I suppose I could get my 100' Ethernet cord out and just try one. Think I'll do that now.
> 
> Thanx,
> 
> Rich


 "Nope", so I can only "go by the numbers" and Blu-Ray is 2x what DirecTV 1080p is. "Would Fred notice?" I don't know.
Blu-Ray - DVD is no question, Fred would.


----------



## tzphotos.com

veryoldschool said:


> best: Blu-Ray
> next: DirecTV 1080p
> then: 1080i/720p [most likely OTA], then DirecTV 1080i/720p MPEG-4
> "the numbers" [bit-rates] seem to point to this.
> "How much" is in the eye of the beholder and their system.


I would flip a couple of your options around...

best: Blu-Ray (My guess since I don't have one, but based on most the comments.)

Next: DirecTV 1080p

Then: DirecTV (MPEG-4) (National Channels)

Then: OTA

Sometimes the last two can be flipped around.

A good example of the reason I put DirecTV (MPEG-4) first is Baseball games in Chicago. They look better on CSN (MPEG-4) vs WGN (OTA). I think WGN bit starves the video!


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> "Nope", so I can only "go by the numbers" and Blu-Ray is 2x what DirecTV 1080p is. "Would Fred notice?" I don't know.
> Blu-Ray - DVD is no question, Fred would.


Fred's not happy, he had a decent winter, but he really hates spring and summer.

I think I'll go by your numbers. I'm gonna string that Ethernet cable now.

Rich


----------



## Rich

Vitor said:


> This thread is interesting, but is missing testimonials. Here we go
> 
> I watched one of 1080p movies that were already pushed to my box. The picture and sound were amazing. My set is a 60" pioneer and supports 1080p24 natively.
> 
> I have a blueRay player and might even use it in the future. But the choice will be based on title availability, not quality.


OK, what movie did you watch and had you seen it on your BD player prior to watching in on D*?

Rich


----------



## BattleZone

dreadlk said:


> The problem is that Directv is suggesting that it's BluRay Quality.
> This is posted on Directv's 1080P Website section right now!
> 
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageNR.jsp?assetId=3720002
> 
> "As the leader in HD, DIRECTV now brings you the latest in HD technology: 1080p. The same HD format as Blu-ray Discs, 1080p "


You're talking about marketing. While the statement above is absolutely true, I totally agree that it is misleading in that it suggests that DoD quality is equal to Blu-Ray. If you read my earlier posts on this thread, I've already mentioned that this is not the case.

But this is a MARKETING statement. Anyone who is looking for technical information by reading MARKETING is a fool. Virtually all marketing stretches the truth or uses carefully selected facts to suggest something more. It's done by all providers, and heck, all industries. That isn't much of an argument.



> while you say DOD peaks out at 16MB and that may be true, the Average Bit rate is probably about half of that.


Absolutely true.



> but it's the Average Bit rate that will make the picture look Great, not the Peak which only occurs during high activity scenes that need more BW to properly display all the changing elements of the picture.


And this is absolutely FALSE, and the exact opposite of how it works. When there's only small amounts of motion on the screen, the video information can be compressed to very low bitrates without any visible changes. Where compression has problems, and exposes its flaws, is during high-activity scenes. Higher peak rates means these scenes are handled with much less artifacting and color loss. This is the advantage of multi-pass compression: lower AVERAGE bitrates while retaining high PEAK bitrates where needed.

A single-pass, real-time encoder can't do that, so the peaks get chopped off to just above the average bitrate, and that's where the problems begin.


----------



## veryoldschool

tzphotos.com said:


> I would flip a couple of your options around...
> 
> best: Blu-Ray (My guess since I don't have one, but based on most the comments.)
> 
> Next: DirecTV 1080p
> 
> Then: DirecTV (MPEG-4) (National Channels)
> 
> Then: OTA
> 
> *Sometimes the last two can be flipped around. *


 Which would be my list :lol:


> A good example of the reason I put DirecTV (MPEG-4) first is Baseball games in Chicago. They look better on CSN (MPEG-4) vs WGN (OTA). I think WGN bit starves the video!


Basketball here with the same OTA and MPEG-4 channel has been "a bone of contention" for some [not me but..] as the fast moving images have had better detail with OTA that the MPEG-4. Players with "dreadlocks", running down court, seem to be most noticable.


----------



## dreadlk

The picture Quality of BluRay will be about 4 times better than DirectV 1080P.
Thats because the Bit Rate for BluRays 1080P is 4 times higher than that of Directv's 1080P.

I have almost all the satellite Systems so let me Sum up what I have seen.

1) BluRay ( Number 1 By a mile)
2) FTA National Network HD Feeds 1080i
3) C-Band 4DTV Receiver HDD-200 Decoder
4) Directv 1080P
5) Directv HD 1080i etc
6) Dishnetwork HD 1080i (Never seen the 1080P stuff)
7) DVD
8) FTA SD
9) C-Band SD
10) DirecTV SD
11) Dishnet SD
12) DOD SD



rich584 said:


> So the BD player is gonna give you the better PQ? How about my Sony upscalers? Where do they fit into the picture? Same as D*'s 1080p?
> 
> Rich


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> The picture Quality of BluRay will be about 4 times better than DirectV 1080P.
> Thats because the Bit Rate for BluRays 1080P is 4 times higher than that of Directv's 1080P.
> 
> I have almost all the satellite Systems so let me Sum up what I have seen.
> 
> 1) BluRay ( Number 1 By a mile)
> 2) FTA National Network HD Feeds 1080i
> 3) C-Band 4DTV Receiver HDD-200 Decoder
> 4) Directv 1080P
> 5) Directv HD 1080i etc
> 6) Dishnetwork HD 1080i (Never seen the 1080P stuff)
> 7) DVD
> 8) FTA SD
> 9) C-Band SD
> 10) DirecTV SD
> 11) Dishnet SD
> 12) DOD SD


Let me be the first to ask: Why so many sat systems?

Now you're making me lean towards a BD player. Suggestions? I'm inclined towards the Pannys.

If I get any more confused...

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

dreadlk said:


> The picture Quality of BluRay will be about 4 times better than DirectV 1080P.
> Thats because the Bit Rate for BluRays 1080P is 4 times higher than that of Directv's 1080P.
> 
> I have almost all the satellite Systems so let me Sum up what I have seen.
> 
> 1) BluRay ( Number 1 By a mile)
> 2) FTA National Network HD Feeds 1080i
> 3) C-Band 4DTV Receiver HDD-200 Decoder
> 4) Directv 1080P
> 5) Directv HD 1080i etc
> 6) Dishnetwork HD 1080i (Never seen the 1080P stuff)
> 7) DVD
> 8) FTA SD
> 9) C-Band SD
> 10) DirecTV SD
> 11) Dishnet SD
> 12) DOD SD


Not questioning #1, but is it really a 4:1 different of bitrate between DirecTV 1080p?
Please give numbers.


----------



## BattleZone

dreadlk said:


> The picture Quality of BluRay will be about 4 times better than DirectV 1080P.
> Thats because the Bit Rate for BluRays 1080P is 4 times higher than that of Directv's 1080P.


Hardly. That's like saying a car with 4 times the horsepower of another will be 4 times faster. There isn't a 1:1 correlation between the two.


----------



## Doug Brott

dreadlk said:


> The problem is that Directv is suggesting that it's BluRay Quality.
> This is posted on Directv's 1080P Website section right now!
> 
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageNR.jsp?assetId=3720002
> 
> "As the leader in HD, DIRECTV now brings you the latest in HD technology: 1080p. The same HD format as Blu-ray Discs, 1080p "


Actually, DIRECTV is not suggesting that it is Blu-ray quality .. I believe DISH did suggest this initially with their but they have backed off of that comment.

In this case, DIRECTV is saying that it's the same format .. which is completely true .. It's about perception.


----------



## Rich

BattleZone said:


> That's like saying a car with 4 times the horsepower of another will be 4 times faster.


That is an interesting statement. With all other things equal in two cars, wouldn't that be pretty close to a true statement? At least it used to be that way when cars were a lot simpler. Same thing with motorcycles. Just curious, not looking to argue.

Rich


----------



## hdtvfan0001

Doug Brott said:


> Actually, DIRECTV is not suggesting that it is Blu-ray quality .. I believe DISH did suggest this initially with their but they have backed off of that comment.
> 
> In this case, DIRECTV is saying that it's the same format .. which is completely true .. It's about perception.


Absolutely...and its just another "choice" or alternative" to view HD content....which is a good thing.


----------



## Artwood

Why is the 1080p bitrate the same as the 1080i bitrate?

I mean if you're going to offer 1080p/24--and the main people that will buy it are people who have nice sets that will support it--why wouldn't you at least have a slightly higher bit rate to make it worth buying?

Is there any fear that with a hgiher bit rate people would see how the lower bit rate that they currently receive from DirecTV on its other HD channels is inferior?

If DirecTV is offering 1080p/24 they need to make the signal as good as possible so they can truely compete with Netflix Blu-Ray rentrals--of course the signal could never be that good--but shouldn't it at least be better than the 1080i alternatives that DirecTV is already delivering in 1080i?


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> That is an interesting statement. With all other things equal in two cars, wouldn't that be pretty close to a true statement? At least it used to be that way when cars were a lot simpler. Same thing with motorcycles. Just curious, not looking to argue.
> 
> Rich


 The power needs to increase by the square, or to put it another way: to go twice as fast, takes four times the power.


----------



## veryoldschool

Artwood said:


> Why is the 1080p bitrate the same as the 1080i bitrate?
> 
> I mean if you're going to offer 1080p/24--and the main people that will buy it are people who have nice sets that will support it--why wouldn't you at least have a slightly higher bit rate to make it worth buying?
> 
> Is there any fear that with a hgiher bit rate people would see how the lower bit rate that they currently receive from DirecTV on its other HD channels is inferior?
> 
> If DirecTV is offering 1080p/24 they need to make the signal as good as possible so they can truely compete with Netflix Blu-Ray rentrals--of course the signal could never be that good--but shouldn't it at least be better than the 1080i alternatives that DirecTV is already delivering in 1080i?


 "It does and it is".
It does look better and has peak bit rates higher than HBO 1080i MPEG-4.


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> The power needs to increase by the square, or to put it another way: to go twice as fast, takes four times the power.


That makes more sense. I kept staring at that statement and didn't get what he was trying to say. Now I gotta go back and read that post again.

Rich


----------



## Artwood

How much does it cost to rent a Blu-Ray movie versus watching VOD DirecTV of the same movie?


----------



## dreadlk

I installed BUDS for years, I started out with C-Band, so i ended up owning all the latest stuff, then I went to FTA, later tried Directv and Dishnet, I ditched Dishnetwork but kept Directv. The Picture from FTA HD using a PC blew me away until I saw my first BluRay.

If you have the $$ you will really love the Panasonic DMP-BD55K. I personaly use a Sony PS3 but a friend of mine has a BD55K and man is the picture crisper and better.

Because I did high end Home Theater installs for years, a side benfit is knowing some good customers who are up there in age, love high end stuff and have money, so I do get to play with the good stuff when I want. Only downside is I usualy end up spending 2 hours fixing and adjusting their equipment  Im sure most of you guys have the same problem when you go to friends and relatives houses 



rich584 said:


> Let me be the first to ask: Why so many sat systems?
> 
> Now you're making me lean towards a BD player. Suggestions? I'm inclined towards the Pannys.
> 
> If I get any more confused...
> 
> Rich


----------



## V'ger

Artwood said:


> Why is the 1080p bitrate the same as the 1080i bitrate?
> 
> I mean if you're going to offer 1080p/24--and the main people that will buy it are people who have nice sets that will support it--why wouldn't you at least have a slightly higher bit rate to make it worth buying?
> 
> Is there any fear that with a hgiher bit rate people would see how the lower bit rate that they currently receive from DirecTV on its other HD channels is inferior?
> 
> If DirecTV is offering 1080p/24 they need to make the signal as good as possible so they can truely compete with Netflix Blu-Ray rentrals--of course the signal could never be that good--but shouldn't it at least be better than the 1080i alternatives that DirecTV is already delivering in 1080i?


Since we are talking about 24 fps movies, with 1080i, each of the 24 frames are split into two interlaced fields, these fields get repeated in a 3:2 ratio to get to 60 fields per second or effectively 30 frames per seconds.

The mpeg4 compression removes all duplicate frames and fields. so it boils back to 24 frames per second, or 48 fields per second. Other than a little bit of overhead, the data rate is the same because interlaced fields are half the resolution of full frames.

The DVR will repeat fields or frames as necessary to reproduce the correct data stream to the TV.


----------



## dreadlk

Now now Doug your getting into semantics  
Directv is trying to make the comparison in Quality, they are just doing it in a Legaly safe way.



Doug Brott said:


> Actually, DIRECTV is not suggesting that it is Blu-ray quality .. I believe DISH did suggest this initially with their but they have backed off of that comment.
> 
> In this case, DIRECTV is saying that it's the same format .. which is completely true .. It's about perception.


----------



## RAD

Artwood said:


> How much does it cost to rent a Blu-Ray movie versus watching VOD DirecTV of the same movie?


DirecTV is $5.99, what ou pay for a rental depends on where you get it.

The big advantage DirecTV has is that it's an impulse thing, don't need to go get something or order it online and wait for it to be mailed.


----------



## dcowboy7

i know they dont for ppvs but do they show these 1080p movies in OAR ?

do they ever do 7.1 sound ?


----------



## dreadlk

Just to Enlighten some confused people and Bore others  Hope I get this right, it's been awhile

Pixels per Frame
480p = 338,000 pixels / frame 
720p = 922,000 pixels / frame 
1080i = 1,037,000 pixels / frame 
1080p = 2,074,000 pixels / frame

So you can see 1080P has twice as many pixels per frame as 1080i ….BUT in terms of data being sent

1080i (30F) = 1,037,000 Pixels X 30 Frames = 31,110,000 Pixels Per Second

1080i (60F) = 1,037,000 Pixels X 60 Frames = 62,220,000 Pixels Per Second

1080P (24F) = 2,074,000 Pixel/Frame X 24 Frames = 49,776,000 Pixels Per Second 

So that gives you an idea of how much data is being sent in terms of Resolution but that’s only a small part of the Picture (No Pun).

(I think Interlacing VS Progressive has been explained to death so I will Skip that.)

The bigger part is how well defined each pixel is. Remember each pixel has Color and Brightness, these have to be defined in the Data stream for each Pixel, so just like a PC’s Video output, if you set it at 8 Bit Color you get a Pallet of 256 Color choices.

Color Depth
8 Bit = 256 Distinct Colors
16 Bits = 65,536 Distinct Colors
32 Bit = More than 4.2 billion Distinct Colors

So each Pixel can have its color defined in a Ratio/Mixture of ( Red : Green : Blue and Brightness) and the color depth defines how accurate the Color and Brightness will be. So you can see that an 8 bit color depth generates a huge amount of data if each pixel is defined by an 8 bit number and it gets to the utter mind boggling numbers when you go 32 bit color. 

Of course compression etc can remove redundant data and cut these numbers down by several factors but the picture quality and depth is still based on What is Fed into the compression scheme (Crap In = Crap Out)

I am not sure what kind of color depth BluRay uses but its significantly higher than what DirecTV uses. A BluRay Movie at 1080P uses about 40 Gigabytes of Data for a 2 hour movie, on the other hand I have noticed that Directv has pushed about 14 Hours of 1080P movies onto 100Gb of space on my Hard Drive so that’s roughly about 14GB for a 2 hour movie. When you compare 40GB VS 14GB you can get a good idea of how much more picture is packed into a BluRay 1080P VS Directv 1080P

Someone else who knows a bit more of the details will hopefully step in and correct any errors I made or give people a little more detail on things like the exact Color Depth etc that BluRay uses VS Directv.


----------



## BattleZone

rich584 said:


> That is an interesting statement. With all other things equal in two cars, wouldn't that be pretty close to a true statement? At least it used to be that way when cars were a lot simpler. Same thing with motorcycles. Just curious, not looking to argue.
> 
> Rich


My Honda Civic is claimed to have 125 hp when it was new. It will top out at roughly 115 MPH. Do you think if I put a 500 hp engine in my Civic, I would be able to reach 460 MPH?


----------



## BattleZone

dcowboy7 said:


> i know they dont for ppvs but do they show these 1080p movies in OAR ?
> 
> do they ever do 7.1 sound ?


Generally, the movies are cropped to 16:9 (but this could change at any time), and they will never do 7.1 or any of the new HD audio formats as Dolby Digital 5.1 is the max the chipsets in the receivers can handle.


----------



## veryoldschool

BattleZone said:


> My Honda Civic is claimed to have 125 hp when it was new. It will top out at roughly 115 MPH. Do you think if I put a 500 hp engine in my Civic, I would be able to reach 460 MPH?


 Maybe the question should be: "would you drive [want to be in] it at 230 MPH?"


----------



## BattleZone

dreadlk said:


> I am not sure what kind of color depth BluRay uses but its significantly higher than what DirecTV uses. A BluRay Movie at 1080P uses about 40 Gigabytes of Data for a 2 hour movie.


This number varies tremendously. Hundreds of Blu-Ray titles have been mastered on single-layer, 25 GB Blu-Ray discs, many using only MPEG2 compression! Others use an MPEG4 flavor (AVC or VC1) and may be 35 GB or more on a dual-layer 50 GB disc. Of course, that title may also have several lossless audio tracks plus several more lossy tracks, tons of bonus materials, etc. in addition to the movie.

DirecTV saves a lot of space by using a single DD5.1 audio track, leaving most of the bandwidth for video, so it's harder to do a 1:1 comparison to Blu-Ray.

Bottom line: DirecTV's DoD is probably the highest-quality downloadable HD content currently available (Dish's is probably its equal, or close enough, as their process is the same). It is nearly as good as Blu-Ray, and in some cases will be virtually indistinguishable unless you have the ability to handle HD audio or if the movie is cropped vs a 2.35:1 OAR.

While I don't think it replaces Blu-Ray by any means, it is certainly a nice compliment to Blu-Ray, for content that you would like to see but might not care enough to own. It may not be the "right" option for everyone, but options are always nice to have.


----------



## BattleZone

veryoldschool said:


> Maybe the question should be: "would you drive [want to be in] it at 230 MPH?"












Oh HELL NAW!


----------



## dreadlk

Agree 100% it's probably the best Downloadable HD anywhere!
But on a side by side comparison it's not really that close to a good BluRay disk, but then again nothing is really close to high end BluRay! Thats why every store uses BluRay to Demo there high end TV's.



BattleZone said:


> DirecTV saves a lot of space by using a single DD5.1 audio track, leaving most of the bandwidth for video, so it's harder to do a 1:1 comparison to Blu-Ray.
> 
> Bottom line: DirecTV's DoD is probably the highest-quality downloadable HD content currently available (Dish's is probably its equal, or close enough, as their process is the same). It is nearly as good as Blu-Ray, .
> 
> While I don't think it replaces Blu-Ray by any means, it is certainly a nice compliment to Blu-Ray, for content that you would like to see but might not care enough to own. It may not be the "right" option for everyone, but options are always nice to have.


----------



## ejhuzy

I searched this thread and didn't quite find this question answered. Are the 1080p movies shown in OAR? If so, I may actually use this now and then. I have a projector and anamorphic lens and hate it when they don't show the movie in OAR.

Thanks.


----------



## DeanS

While I appreciate all of the foregoing discussions regarding the relative merits and picture quality of D* 1080p/24 and BD 1080p/24, I was really quite pleased at how "Madagascar" looked on my new Sony LCD set last Saturday evening. It was, in my eyes, a qualitatively superior picture over other 1080i PPV movies from D* I have watched and this was the first 1080p/24 movie I have seen on my new set. I have no plans to rush out and buy a BD player now, since we don't rent movies very often at all anyway.


----------



## dcowboy7

dcowboy7 said:


> i know they dont for ppvs but do they show these 1080p movies in OAR ?





BattleZone said:


> Generally, the movies are cropped to 16:9 (but this could change at any time)





ejhuzy said:


> I searched this thread and didn't quite find this question answered. Are the 1080p movies shown in OAR? If so, I may actually use this now and then. I have a projector and anamorphic lens and hate it when they don't show the movie in OAR.


Yea i asked & they are generally* NOT in OAR* which to me is a *MAJOR* drawback. I would say its idiotic but that would be an insult to the word idiotic.


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> I installed BUDS for years, I started out with C-Band, so i ended up owning all the latest stuff, then I went to FTA, later tried Directv and Dishnet, I ditched Dishnetwork but kept Directv. The Picture from FTA HD using a PC blew me away until I saw my first BluRay.
> 
> If you have the $$ you will really love the Panasonic DMP-BD55K. I personaly use a Sony PS3 but a friend of mine has a BD55K and man is the picture crisper and better.
> 
> Because I did high end Home Theater installs for years, a side benfit is knowing some good customers who are up there in age, love high end stuff and have money, so I do get to play with the good stuff when I want. Only downside is I usualy end up spending 2 hours fixing and adjusting their equipment  Im sure most of you guys have the same problem when you go to friends and relatives houses


Money's not the problem, ignorance is. But I'm learning.

Rich


----------



## Rich

Artwood said:


> How much does it cost to rent a Blu-Ray movie versus watching VOD DirecTV of the same movie?


Not so much the cost as the 24 hour limit on the VOD. I hate to "have" to watch something. Too much like homework :lol:. At least with NetFlix, you get plenty of time to watch a movie. Hang the cost.

Rich


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> Just to Enlighten some confused people and Bore others  Hope I get this right, it's been awhile
> 
> Pixels per Frame
> 480p = 338,000 pixels / frame
> 720p = 922,000 pixels / frame
> 1080i = 1,037,000 pixels / frame
> 1080p = 2,074,000 pixels / frame
> 
> So you can see 1080P has twice as many pixels per frame as 1080i &#8230;.BUT in terms of data being sent
> 
> 1080i (30F) = 1,037,000 Pixels X 30 Frames = 31,110,000 Pixels Per Second
> 
> 1080i (60F) = 1,037,000 Pixels X 60 Frames = 62,220,000 Pixels Per Second
> 
> 1080P (24F) = 2,074,000 Pixel/Frame X 24 Frames = 49,776,000 Pixels Per Second
> 
> So that gives you an idea of how much data is being sent in terms of Resolution but that's only a small part of the Picture (No Pun).
> 
> (I think Interlacing VS Progressive has been explained to death so I will Skip that.)
> 
> The bigger part is how well defined each pixel is. Remember each pixel has Color and Brightness, these have to be defined in the Data stream for each Pixel, so just like a PC's Video output, if you set it at 8 Bit Color you get a Pallet of 256 Color choices.
> 
> Color Depth
> 8 Bit = 256 Distinct Colors
> 16 Bits = 65,536 Distinct Colors
> 32 Bit = More than 4.2 billion Distinct Colors
> 
> So each Pixel can have its color defined in a Ratio/Mixture of ( Red : Green : Blue and Brightness) and the color depth defines how accurate the Color and Brightness will be. So you can see that an 8 bit color depth generates a huge amount of data if each pixel is defined by an 8 bit number and it gets to the utter mind boggling numbers when you go 32 bit color.
> 
> Of course compression etc can remove redundant data and cut these numbers down by several factors but the picture quality and depth is still based on What is Fed into the compression scheme (Crap In = Crap Out)
> 
> I am not sure what kind of color depth BluRay uses but its significantly higher than what DirecTV uses. A BluRay Movie at 1080P uses about 40 Gigabytes of Data for a 2 hour movie, on the other hand I have noticed that Directv has pushed about 14 Hours of 1080P movies onto 100Gb of space on my Hard Drive so that's roughly about 14GB for a 2 hour movie. When you compare 40GB VS 14GB you can get a good idea of how much more picture is packed into a BluRay 1080P VS Directv 1080P
> 
> Someone else who knows a bit more of the details will hopefully step in and correct any errors I made or give people a little more detail on things like the exact Color Depth etc that BluRay uses VS Directv.


Oh yeah, I'm sure a lot of people will know more than you've posted. Seriously, that was one helluva post! The confusion begins to clear a bit.

Rich


----------



## Rich

BattleZone said:


> My Honda Civic is claimed to have 125 hp when it was new. It will top out at roughly 115 MPH. Do you think if I put a 500 hp engine in my Civic, I would be able to reach 460 MPH?


If you put wings on it. I did some more thinking about your post and got some input on it and I gotta admit, I'd like to try it. I'd also like to see if my Caddie will peg the needle on the speedometer (160mph). I did see a stock CTS hit 150 on a track on a show the other day. Maybe mine would peg out. I had a '60 T-Bird that had a speedometer that went to either 140 or 145. Thought that was a joke until I raced a Porsche one night on a deserted highway and I did peg the needle. I also got blown away by the Porsche. :lol:

Rich


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> Maybe the question should be: "would you drive [want to be in] it at 230 MPH?"


You wouldn't be able to sit in a Civic with a 500hp motor, would you? How would that possibly fit?

Rich


----------



## Rich

ejhuzy said:


> I searched this thread and didn't quite find this question answered. Are the 1080p movies shown in OAR? If so, I may actually use this now and then. I have a projector and anamorphic lens and hate it when they don't show the movie in OAR.
> 
> Thanks.


I really wish everyone would stop using acronyms. Or at least explain what they mean before using them. What the devil is an OAR? Nothing like a HENWAY, I trust.

Rich


----------



## ejhuzy

rich584 said:


> I really wish everyone would stop using acronyms. Or at least explain what they mean before using them. What the devil is an OAR? Nothing like a HENWAY, I trust.


Rich,

Sorry for the acronym. OAR equals Original Aspect Ratio. Someone already answered my question. Looks like these PPV moves are not OAR.


----------



## veryoldschool

ejhuzy said:


> Rich,
> 
> Sorry for the acronym. OAR equals Original Aspect Ratio. Someone already answered my question. Looks like these PPV moves are not OAR.


 Body of Lies was 16:9, but "I think" Bucket List was letterboxed.
Even the movies off the premium channels will vary between 16:9 & letterbox.


----------



## ejhuzy

veryoldschool said:


> Body of Lies was 16:9, but "I think" Bucket List was letterboxed.
> Even the movies off the premium channels will vary between 16:9 & letterbox.


Yeah, most HBO HD movies are 16:9 and I hate that too. I try to watch non 2.40 most off HBO and rent the rest.


----------



## idigg

Blockbuster has 24 hour $2 blu ray rentals. Man this is a rip off if you think about it. Now that some ISP's are charging or metering bandwidth, to download a 1080p VOD movie from D* is costing more than $5.99 :nono:


----------



## Daveyd

Blu Ray video is only half the equation. The audio, Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio are VASTLY superior to DD 5.1 or DTS.

Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio have 3-4x the bitrate of regular DD 5.1 and DTS

I have a Samsung Blu Ray playeer and a Sammy 58" Plasma FP-5884 as well as an Onkyo 705 that decodes TrueHD and DTS-HD Master. I can flip back and forth on the fly between regular DD 5.1 and TrueHD audio and there is no comparison. DD 5.1 sounds muffled as not nearly as crisp as TrueHD and or DTS Master.


----------



## dreadlk

True but if we go into the Audio aspect this post will just fry peoples braines. Plus Directv makes no claims about the sound, only the picture.



Daveyd said:


> Blu Ray video is only half the equation. The audio, Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio are VASTLY superior to DD 5.1 or DTS.
> 
> Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio have 3-4x the bitrate of regular DD 5.1 and DTS
> 
> I have a Samsung Blu Ray playeer and a Sammy 58" Plasma FP-5884 as well as an Onkyo 705 that decodes TrueHD and DTS-HD Master. I can flip back and forth on the fly between regular DD 5.1 and TrueHD audio and there is no comparison. DD 5.1 sounds muffled as not nearly as crisp as TrueHD and or DTS Master.


----------



## dreadlk

Thanks, I know that its a lot of info, and that post really only scratches the surface. I think AVS forum has some great info if you want to learn more about video standards.



rich584 said:


> Oh yeah, I'm sure a lot of people will know more than you've posted. Seriously, that was one helluva post! The confusion begins to clear a bit.
> 
> Rich


----------



## BattleZone

Daveyd said:


> Blu Ray video is only half the equation. The audio, Dolby TrueHD and DTS Master Audio are VASTLY superior to DD 5.1 or DTS.


This is unquestionably true, but in my experience of being in over 2500 customer homes working on their TV, 99.5+% of customers get TV audio via their built-in TV speakers. Thus, most are FAR more concerned about video quality and couldn't give a rip about audio. As a trained audio engineer myself, I know the value of a good audio system, but most folks can't be bothered, much less spend the money and dedicate the space for a surround sound system.


----------



## Rich

ejhuzy said:


> Rich,
> 
> Sorry for the acronym. OAR equals Original Aspect Ratio. Someone already answered my question. Looks like these PPV moves are not OAR.


Thank you. I had no idea at all. OK, now I got another question. The other day I saw a DVD for sale on Amazon (the complete box set of OZ). The aspect ratio was 1:1.35. If you multiply that ratio by 3 on both sides you get 3:4.05. Seems suspiciously like 4:3, doesn't it? Or am I wrong (again)? I have the complete set of Oz, but when I bought them, I wasn't considering that upscalers only upscale widescreen DVDs.

That was a real "wait a minute" moment when I saw the OAR (see, I learn).

Am I correct?

Rich


----------



## Rich

idigg said:


> Blockbuster has 24 hour $2 blu ray rentals. Man this is a rip off if you think about it. Now that some ISP's are charging or metering bandwidth, to download a 1080p VOD movie from D* is costing more than $5.99 :nono:


I don't really care how much things cost, I don't want to "rent" a PPV movie and have a time limit put on it. I have the Premium package and all the movie channels and I would imagine that very soon 1080p movies will start showing up on HBO and the rest. I hope, I do, I do. No time limit on those, I trust.

Rich


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> True but if we go into the Audio aspect this post will just fry peoples braines. Plus Directv makes no claims about the sound, only the picture.


For the love of God! I'm confused enough without you changing your avatar. I do agree about the audio content, let's not get into that.

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> I don't really care how much things cost, I don't want to "rent" a PPV movie and have a time limit put on it. I have the Premium package and all the movie channels and I would imagine that very soon 1080p movies will start showing up on HBO and the rest. I hope, I do, I do. No time limit on those, I trust.
> 
> Rich


I think you've caught on to the 4:3 "thing".

As much as I'd like to see 1080p HBO/SHO/Starz movies, currently these are only going to come over VOD or "movies now", since the bitrate excesses what will "flow" through "live watching".
[Think of voltage spikes that would need to be dampened. Recordings can do this where live can't]


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> Thanks, I know that its a lot of info, and that post really only scratches the surface. I think AVS forum has some great info if you want to learn more about video standards.


I tried AVS and I don't know who is who there. And the threads are miles long. I'm much more comfortable (confused, but comfortable) here and here I will stay, for the most part. At least here, I know somebody will swoop down and try to clear things up for me.

Rich


----------



## Rich

BattleZone said:


> This is unquestionably true, but in my experience of being in over 2500 customer homes working on their TV, 99.5+% of customers get TV audio via their built-in TV speakers.


No, can that be true? Wow! I believe you, but I'm shocked! 99.5%! Can the Great American Herd be that dumb? That is an amazing and sad fact.



> Thus, most are FAR more concerned about video quality and couldn't give a rip about audio. As a trained audio engineer myself, I know the value of a good audio system, but most folks can't be bothered, much less spend the money and dedicate the space for a surround sound system.


I've always wondered why so many people come in my home and comment on my sound systems. You've answered my questions.

Rich


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> I think you've caught on to the 4:3 "thing".
> 
> As much as I'd like to see 1080p HBO/SHO/Starz movies, currently these are only going to come over VOD or "movies now", since the bitrate excesses what will "flow" through "live watching".
> [Think of voltage spikes that would need to be dampened. Recordings can do this where live can't]


And sometimes trusted folks swoop down and deeply disappoint me. So now I can give up on any hope of HBO having 1080p? Geez.

I got that gizmo from Linksys yesterday, the wireless repeater they call a "game adapter". Would have worked, but when I put the CD in and started the setup I was asked for an administrator's password. Called them up in downtown Rangoon and asked them what to do. By that time I had put in every password we use. The guy says, "Just type in admin". That didn't work either, so I sent it back.

Good thing this accursed 1080p TV has a great picture on it. Without 1080p.

Wish I'd never seen the thing.

Rich


----------



## Rich

dreadlk said:


> Thanks, I know that its a lot of info, and that post really only scratches the surface. I think AVS forum has some great info if you want to learn more about video standards.


Does your experience with home TVs mirror *Battlezone's*? In regard to the audio systems?

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> And sometimes trusted folks swoop down and deeply disappoint me. So now I can give up on any hope of HBO having 1080p? Geez.
> 
> I got that gizmo from Linksys yesterday, the wireless repeater they call a "game adapter". Would have worked, but when I put the CD in and started the setup I was asked for an administrator's password. Called them up in downtown Rangoon and asked them what to do. By that time I had put in every password we use. The guy says, "Just type in admin". That didn't work either, so I sent it back.
> 
> Good thing this accursed 1080p TV has a great picture on it. Without 1080p.
> 
> Wish I'd never seen the thing.
> 
> Rich


 You really should have gone over to the CE forum here and read/asked for help. Would have been quicker and more helpful.


----------



## veryoldschool

Rich,
Look at "movies now" under your play list. There are some 1080p movies [PPV] there.


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> You really should have gone over to the CE forum here and read/asked for help. Would have been quicker and more helpful.


Didn't know that was allowed. Ah well, I'll buy another one and give it a try. D* is selling what looks like the same thing, but you need a gizmo for each HR. The way I was gonna do it was to put the adapter in the family room with the 1080p TV and the four 20-700s and just connect it to an Ethernet switch and run short Ethernet wires to each HR. Cheaper than the way D* wants to do it with the same adapter.

I knew that as soon as I connected a computer to the "system", I was gonna get driven crazier than usual. :lol:

Rich


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> Rich,
> Look at "movies now" under your play list. There are some 1080p movies [PPV] there.


I saw them, but none interested me. Let me look again...OK, Frost/Nixon looks interesting and I see that I would have till 9/30 to watch it. Can that be correct? Now that I can live with. I don't want to keep any movies, I just didn't want to have to watch it when I "had" to.

Rich


----------



## Rich

rich584 said:


> I tried AVS and I don't know who is who there. And the threads are miles long. I'm much more comfortable (confused, but comfortable) here and here I will stay, for the most part. At least here, I know somebody will swoop down and try to clear things up for me.
> 
> Rich


See what I mean by "trusted people swooping down to help". :lol:

Rich


----------



## veryoldschool

rich584 said:


> OK, Frost/Nixon looks interesting and I see that I would have till 9/30 to watch it. Can that be correct? Now that I can live with. I don't want to keep any movies, I just didn't want to have to watch it when I "had" to.
> 
> Rich


When you go to watch, it will ask you [confirm] to buy it. At this time, the 24 hour clock starts. Once you've exceeded 24 hours, it will ask "again" if you want to buy it.

When 9/30 comes, it will "fade away".


----------



## CindyJ

rich584 said:


> I saw them, but none interested me. Let me look again...OK, Frost/Nixon looks interesting and I see that I would have till 9/30 to watch it. Can that be correct? Now that I can live with. I don't want to keep any movies, I just didn't want to have to watch it when I "had" to.
> 
> Rich


Even though it has a 9/30 expiration, it will almost certainly be removed from your DVR by D* long before 9/30. I don't know why they bother with the way-out-in-the-future expiration dates on the content in the Top Movies folder. D* cycles movies in the Top Movies folder quite regularly. I'll be very surprised if Frost/Nixon is still on my DVR come 1 June.


----------



## pablo

Can somebody explain to me how the Movies Now or however it's called works? I don't have my receiver hooked up to the phoneline or the Internet. Yet I can go into that folder and start playing any of the movies there. I get a prompt in the corner asking me if I want to purchase this movie, all the while the movie is playing and I can watch it, ignoring the prompt. Can I watch it until it ends, or is there a certain trial period after which it shuts off if I haven't selected "purchase"? And how can I, if my receiver isn't hooked up?


----------



## RAD

pablo said:


> Can somebody explain to me how the Movies Now or however it's called works? I don't have my receiver hooked up to the phoneline or the Internet. Yet I can go into that folder and start playing any of the movies there. I get a prompt in the corner asking me if I want to purchase this movie, all the while the movie is playing and I can watch it, ignoring the prompt. Can I watch it until it ends, or is there a certain trial period after which it shuts off if I haven't selected "purchase"? And how can I, if my receiver isn't hooked up?


Because it's sent to your receivers harddrive over the satellite connection on a 'private' channel. If you scroll to the bottom of the discription it will show you what time it was recorded on your harddrive.


----------



## Rich

CindyJ said:


> Even though it has a 9/30 expiration, it will almost certainly be removed from your DVR by D* long before 9/30. I don't know why they bother with the way-out-in-the-future expiration dates on the content in the Top Movies folder. D* cycles movies in the Top Movies folder quite regularly. I'll be very surprised if Frost/Nixon is still on my DVR come 1 June.


Ahh, that's wonderful. You'd think that you could rely on info that shows up on the HRs, but we've seen before that you can't trust what the things tell you. Thanks for the tip.

Rich


----------



## BattleZone

pablo said:


> Can somebody explain to me how the Movies Now or however it's called works?


Over night, your receiver (if it has a free tuner) will tune to a hidden sat channel and download movies via satellite broadcast and store them on your harddrive, where you will find them in the Movies Now folder. This works even if your DVR has no Internet connection, though the list of Movies Now is FAR smaller than what is available for download via Internet.

It is possible to use higher bitrates for Movies Now as well, since the sat transfer doesn't have to be real-time. Since you can't watch it as it comes down, it doesn't matter if it takes 2.5-3 hours to transfer a 2-hour movie.


----------



## armophob

veryoldschool said:


> What is the value in your post, or why did you bother to post?
> If this had been a poll or someone had asked a question about using it, I can see, but nobody has.
> Seems like you just wanted to exercise your free speech and take a dump here.


I know this is an old post, but I had a similar reaction when I saw this thread pop up. When announcing 1080p content, I wish PPV could be in the title if none of it is free. I back tracked through this whole thread before coming to the part about it all being PPV. Just a little bit irritating to someone like me who will never use PPV.


----------



## pablo

BattleZone said:


> Over night, your receiver (if it has a free tuner) will tune to a hidden sat channel and download movies via satellite broadcast and store them on your harddrive, where you will find them in the Movies Now folder. This works even if your DVR has no Internet connection, though the list of Movies Now is FAR smaller than what is available for download via Internet.
> 
> It is possible to use higher bitrates for Movies Now as well, since the sat transfer doesn't have to be real-time. Since you can't watch it as it comes down, it doesn't matter if it takes 2.5-3 hours to transfer a 2-hour movie.


Thanks for the explanation. But what about being able to view the movie? Again, can't I just watch the entire movie without pressing Yes or No to purchase and just ignoring it? Or will it shut itself off and go back to the menu after like 5 minutes?


----------



## veryoldschool

pablo said:


> Thanks for the explanation. But what about being able to view the movie? Again, can't I just watch the entire movie without pressing Yes or No to purchase and just ignoring it? Or will it shut itself off and go back to the menu after like 5 minutes?


Well, couldn't you try this and get your answer?


----------



## Igor

rich584 said:


> OK, what movie did you watch and had you seen it on your BD player prior to watching in on D*?
> 
> Rich


I watched "Zack and Miri", no I did not watch same title from a BR disk.


----------



## Anaisa

I am pleased to have movies in 1080p.
This discussion implies that some of you are not. What is the downside?

It is also interesting to me to see how many of you live in the past. BlueRay disks will go to museums faster than VHS...

A bit of controversy


----------



## Rich

veryoldschool said:


> Well, couldn't you try this and get your answer?


That cracked me up! So obvious. :lol::lol:

Rich


----------



## Rich

Vitor said:


> I watched "Zack and Miri", no I did not watch same title from a BR disk.


Too bad, a comparison would have been useful.

Rich


----------



## Rich

Anaisa said:


> I am pleased to have movies in 1080p.
> This discussion implies that some of you are not. What is the downside?


The arguments are about which is better, the BD content or D*'s content.



> It is also interesting to me to see how many of you live in the past. BlueRay disks will go to museums faster than VHS...


I got twenty years out of VCRs, if the BD players can do that...

Rich


----------



## Sixto

another nice press release today: http://dtv.client.shareholder.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=379320

i wonder why they don't mention "top movies". there really is no reason for DoD for the latest 1080p. it's already on the hard-drive (from the satellite). unless that's what they mean. weird.

Quantum of Solace already sitting on the HR2x in 1080p.


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## BattleZone

The number of Top Movies is very limited in comparison to the number available via DoD (though Top Movies is a subset of the DoD offerings).


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## Sixto

BattleZone said:


> The number of Top Movies is very limited in comparison to the number available via DoD (though Top Movies is a subset of the DoD offerings).


true ... but Quantum of Solace is available on both ... would seem like a competitive advantage to mention in the press release that every HR2x receiver now has instant access to Quantum of Solace right on the hard-drive ... along with lots of other titles thru DoD ...


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## BattleZone

DirecTV can't guarentee that Top Movies are available on every receiver. If you don't have both tuners active, there's a good chance that you won't have it. If you had a weather-related interruption while it was downloading, you won't have it. Etc. I understand your point, but DirecTV is smart enough not to "promise" (read: advertise) something that it may not have been able to deliver. It's always better to "under-promise and over-deliver."


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## dcowboy7

BattleZone said:


> DirecTV is smart enough not to "promise" (read: advertise) something that it may not have been able to deliver.


like all the HBOs in HD.


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## Rich

I just hooked up a Panny BD-605, which is Costco's version of the BD-60. The only problem I've had so far is not being able to get the screen saver to act as a screen saver. It just sits there.

The upscaling is a little better than the Sony upscaler I've been using. Not $220 better, tho.

I did rent a copy of "Australia" today, BD version. Will check it tonight and compare it to D*s 1080p downloads.

This model has the VieraCast feature. Doesn't look like something I'd use, but I'll keep trying it.

Rich


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## AFH

Why are there only 1080p movies in Movies Now? Back in Jan I watched a movie from Movies Now b/c it wasn't 1080p, but if I wanted to watch a movie today from Movies Now I couldn't b/c its 1080p.


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## DogLover

AFH said:


> Why are there only 1080p movies in Movies Now? Back in Jan I watched a movie from Movies Now b/c it wasn't 1080p, but if I wanted to watch a movie today from Movies Now I couldn't b/c its 1080p.


I believe that the 1080p movies should play correctly (though not in 1080p) on boxes that do not have that resolution available.


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## Rich

DogLover said:


> I believe that the 1080p movies should play correctly (though not in 1080p) on boxes that do not have that resolution available.


Yeah, I read a post about this the other day and they play in 1080i.

Rich


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## BattleZone

The receiver can convert the "1080p" movies to whatever resolution it is set to output to. It only outputs in 1080/24p if you have the "1080p" resolution selected, which presumably means that the 1080p test of your TV was successful. Obviously, your TV must accept 1080/24p input signals in order to pass the test. "Cheating" the test by hitting the Info button when you aren't seeing a clear test message will enable the receiver to output in 1080/24p, but when you go to play a movie or other 1080/24p content, your TV won't be able to display it properly.


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## AFH

Thanks everyone for answering my question.


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## Rich

rich584 said:


> I just hooked up a Panny BD-605, which is Costco's version of the BD-60. The only problem I've had so far is not being able to get the screen saver to act as a screen saver. It just sits there.
> 
> The upscaling is a little better than the Sony upscaler I've been using. Not $220 better, tho.
> 
> I did rent a copy of "Australia" today, BD version. Will check it tonight and compare it to D*s 1080p downloads.
> 
> This model has the VieraCast feature. Doesn't look like something I'd use, but I'll keep trying it.
> 
> Rich


Well this was quite an experience. I put the Australia BD disc in the 605 and couldn't get 5.1 DTS. Could only get stereo. I did set it for 5.1 on the disc and I had been watching Sopranos DVDs upscaled and was getting 5.1 on them. Nothing I did would change the Australia to 5.1.

So I get frustrated with the manual which is written on the level of somebody who really understood geek speak (sadly, I don't, but I'm learning). That's the wrong way to write a manual. Should be clear and concise and easy to understand. The Panny manual is really hard to understand. I called Panasonic for help and they couldn't figure it out either. Wanted to escalate it to a higher power who would call me in an hour or so and continue to wreck my day. Told them I was gonna take it back and that's just what I'm gonna do tomorrow.

Whew! That really felt good. Thanx for letting me vent.

Rich


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## Rich

Well, I ended up taking the BD player back. Couldn't get the thing to put out any audio other than stereo. Called Panasonic several times and they don't understand the user's manual either. Yesterday, I got a call from Matsu****a, the parent company of Panasonic, asking me whether I still had issues with the BD player.

I asked the tech if the manual was translated directly from Japanese to English and he said yes. By engineers. No wonder I couldn't understand it. Sony manuals I have no problem with. While I was talking to him, I started reading him samples from the manual for the new 1080p TV I just bought. He couldn't understand them either. He asked me how I got them to run if I couldn't understand the manual and I told him that I was satisfied with the PQ right out of the box on each of my six Panny plasmas. Never had to use the manuals, but they are as bad as the BD manual.

Anyhow, I watched about 45 minutes of _Australia_ on the BD disc I had rented and yesterday I downloaded _Australia_ from the DOD list and watched it in 1080p.

The two viewings weren't side by side, but the PQ from D* was pretty close to the Panny BD, I think. I was very satisfied with the downloaded movie's PQ. That's a really good movie, by the way.

After I got thru watching the movie my wife came home and we watched _CSI:NY_ in 1080i. Looked pretty fuzzy after watching the movie in 1080p.

I'm gonna try the Sony BD player one of these days, but I think I'll stick with downloading D*'s 1080p offerings. Surprisingly good.

Rich


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## Hank3

I'm late jumping into the discussion. I've got a 1080P TV and want to see how the 1080P movies look since I don't have a BluRay player. It says that I need to hook up my AM21 to the Internet. I saw two kits on DirecTV's Web site or I can just use an ethernet cable from the AM21 to my router. Only thing is I don't want to run the cable as the rooms are kinda far apart and I don't want to drill holes in the walls and run it through the attic. So what are my options? Do I have to order both Internet kits from DirecTV? Or is there a cheaper solution?


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## RAD

Hank3 said:


> I'm late jumping into the discussion. I've got a 1080P TV and want to see how the 1080P movies look since I don't have a BluRay player. It says that I need to hook up my AM21 to the Internet. I saw two kits on DirecTV's Web site or I can just use an ethernet cable from the AM21 to my router. Only thing is I don't want to run the cable as the rooms are kinda far apart and I don't want to drill holes in the walls and run it through the attic. So what are my options? Do I have to order both Internet kits from DirecTV? Or is there a cheaper solution?


Hank, I think you might mean a HR21, the AM21 is only for over the air reception when connected to a receiver.


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## Rich

Hank3 said:


> I'm late jumping into the discussion. I've got a 1080P TV and want to see how the 1080P movies look since I don't have a BluRay player. It says that I need to hook up my AM21 to the Internet. I saw two kits on DirecTV's Web site or I can just use an ethernet cable from the AM21 to my router. Only thing is I don't want to run the cable as the rooms are kinda far apart and I don't want to drill holes in the walls and run it through the attic. So what are my options? Do I have to order both Internet kits from DirecTV? Or is there a cheaper solution?


Yes, you can get a Linksys "Game Adapter". Here is a _link_.

I have one of these and if you need help setting it up you can PM me. It's easy to set up and works perfectly with the HRs. My 600N feeds a Linksys Work Station Switch which feeds four 20-700s. Costs about $85 for the 600N and BB had the work station switch on sale for $20.

The only thing you really need to know is the password that the CD will ask you for when you're setting it up. That password is "admin". You don't have to change your security settings on your router, just follow the instructions to the letter.

Rich


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## Hank3

Thank for the help y'all. Yes, I did mean the HR21 - ugh.


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