# DirecTV starting to shut down SD



## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

Didn't see any threads on this yet, sorry if there are, but I noticed the SD shutdown has begun. If you look in the guide, there are some channels (i.e. ION @ 305 that say they are now exclusively HD). Didn't count them lol, but also TV1 and a few other obscure channels.


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

SledgeHammer said:


> Didn't see any threads on this yet, sorry if there are, but I noticed the SD shutdown has begun. If you look in the guide, there are some channels (i.e. ION @ 305 that say they are now exclusively HD). Didn't count them lol, but also TV1 and a few other obscure channels.











Channel 103: Equipment Upgrade


Channel 103 shows as “Upcoming Equipment Upgrade.” Wonder what this is about. Had an upgrade done just a few months ago with a new LNB and 4k minis installed. Any ideas?




www.dbstalk.com


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Who could accept words from notes, when we've seen it was wrong many times for years?! 
while we have factual info about H.262/H.264/H.265 SD/HD/UHD/etc. updating each week on imanimagecutter site


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## kkl (Feb 11, 2007)

So can I get rid of my $10/mo "Advanced Receiver Service - HD" fee?


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

kkl said:


> So can I get rid of my $10/mo "Advanced Receiver Service - HD" fee?


Yea that fee is getting a little old. I got that fee waived for 4 straight years starting back in 2010, but once ATT was knocking at the door that deal was gone.

How about being the guinea pig with Loyalty Dept on getting that fee down to $0, and post your results if it happens. 👍


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## CraigerM (Apr 15, 2014)

You probably will still have that Advanced Receiver Service Fee and they would just drop the HD part of it.


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

It is handled differently based on the age of the account.


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

I don't suppose they'll turn down the compression with all that extra bandwidth, eh?


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## Rob37 (Jul 11, 2013)

If they are shutting Standard Def down, there are still a few channels that are still being shown in Standard Def only and to me I STILL cannot figure out WHY in 2022 we STILL have some channels that haven’t been converted over to HD yet. Two of those channels that immediately come to mind are CSpan & CSpan 2. Both those channels are still in Standard Def not High Def on DIRECTV. This is 2022 & there shouldn’t be ANY channels left being shown in Standard Def. I hope this is really happening because it’s 2022 & no channels should be in blurry Standard Definition now!


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## Rob37 (Jul 11, 2013)

It's 2022 now & there are still a bunch of channels on DIRECTV that aren’t in HD. Who else is with me that it’s about time DIRECTV starts converting all remaining channels still being shown in Standard Definition to High Definition? It’s LONG past due! There shouldn’t be anymore Standard Definition Channels left. Come on DIRECTV & convert the remaining channels left in SD to HD!


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

How many left are available in SD? We have a long running thread on HD conversion which has basically gone dead since most of the channels that could be converted have been converted.

As noted, removal of the SD duplicates has begun. That means people who have not upgraded their equipment will be losing channels. I suppose "so sad, too bad" would be the response of people who have all HD compatible equipment but not so good for those customers.


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## codespy (Mar 30, 2006)

Rob37 said:


> If they are shutting Standard Def down, there are still a few channels that are still being shown in Standard Def only and to me I STILL cannot figure out WHY in 2022 we STILL have some channels that haven’t been converted over to HD yet. Two of those channels that immediately come to mind are CSpan & CSpan 2. Both those channels are still in Standard Def not High Def on DIRECTV. This is 2022 & there shouldn’t be ANY channels left being shown in Standard Def. I hope this is really happening because it’s 2022 & no channels should be in blurry Standard Definition now!


Especially NASA with all of their cutting edge research and technology developed over the years.


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## CraigerM (Apr 15, 2014)

They won't have that switch SD option during bad weather anymore when all SD shuts down.


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

Rob37 said:


> If they are shutting Standard Def down, there are still a few channels that are still being shown in Standard Def only and to me I STILL cannot figure out WHY in 2022 we STILL have some channels that haven’t been converted over to HD yet. Two of those channels that immediately come to mind are CSpan & CSpan 2. Both those channels are still in Standard Def not High Def on DIRECTV. This is 2022 & there shouldn’t be ANY channels left being shown in Standard Def. I hope this is really happening because it’s 2022 & no channels should be in blurry Standard Definition now!


Is anyone really losing sleep because CSpan is SD? Does anyone even watch CSpan? .

Some of the channels that mostly show classic content, is there a point in HD? Personally, if I'm watching a 4:3 show, I'd prefer to watch it in 4:3 rather than having it scaled inappropriately. I've seen some channels take a 4:3 show with pillar boxing, then letter box the whole thing and then pillar box it again where you have a small picture in the middle taking up 25% of the screen.

Seinfeld is a 4:3 show that's being shown in HD. I'm not one of those do analysis on every screen to see what got cut off when its shown in 16:9, but I assume we're losing stuff. Unless Seinfeld had 16:9 or better masters and it was simply re-mastered or whatever you want to call it.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

SledgeHammer said:


> Unless Seinfeld had 16:9 or better masters and it was simply re-mastered or whatever you want to call it.


Seinfeld was shot on film in 4:3. Aspect ratio conversion is certainly possible but not trivial.

People need to get over the idea that 4:3 is necessarily a bad thing.


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## CraigerM (Apr 15, 2014)

harsh said:


> Seinfeld was shot on film in 4:3. Aspect ratio conversion is certainly possible but not trivial.
> 
> People need to get over the idea that 4:3 is necessarily a bad thing.


Imagine what TNG and DS9 would look like if it was filmed in 16x9.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

CraigerM said:


> Imagine what TNG and DS9 would look like if it was filmed in 16x9.


Where are the OAR wonks when you need them?

If the production was composed for 4:3, attempts to change that usually end in a diminished product. The "Rule of Thirds" doesn't turn out well when you lop off the top and bottom. There have been some attempts at widescreening both and those were arguably disasters.


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## CraigerM (Apr 15, 2014)

harsh said:


> Where are the OAR wonks when you need them?
> 
> If the production was composed for 4:3, attempts to change that usually end in a diminished product. The "Rule of Thirds" doesn't turn out well when you lop off the top and bottom. There have been some attempts at widescreening both and those were arguably disasters.


I wasn't saying change it. I was saying if they filmed it originally in 16x9. I know it was filmed for 4:3. I saw what TNG would look like if they remastered in 16x9. You would see the stuff on the set on the left and right like the spotlights ect.


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

SledgeHammer said:


> Is anyone really losing sleep because CSpan is SD? Does anyone even watch CSpan? .


Isn't CSPAN what you watch when are losing sleep and don't want to take pills?


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

slice1900 said:


> Isn't CSPAN what you watch when are losing sleep and don't want to take pills?


Nope .


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

CSPAN is special because it is a PI (public interest) channel. It is carried under special rules that control how much DIRECTV can charge for carriage and who must receive the channel. As long as there are SD only subscribers the channels must be in SD and available to all subscribers to channels on that orbital position.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

CraigerM said:


> I was saying if they filmed it originally in 16x9.


Unless you've got the Borg Queen in your back pocket, there's not much use fantasizing about changing history. This, like Babylon 5 wouldn't be all that happy since much of the green screened stuff was relatively low resolution.


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## skinnyJM (Nov 19, 2005)

James Long said:


> How many left are available in SD? We have a long running thread on HD conversion which has basically gone dead since most of the channels that could be converted have been converted.
> 
> As noted, removal of the SD duplicates has begun. That means people who have not upgraded their equipment will be losing channels. I suppose "so sad, too bad" would be the response of people who have all HD compatible equipment but not so good for those customers.


 The channels my household has wanted the HD version for quite awhile but Directv only carries in SD version is Nicktoons and TeenNick.


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## JodeanSS (11 mo ago)

what about all the encore channels, shouldnt those have been in HD for the last 10 years already??


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## cableview (10 mo ago)

I believe it is the channels themselves migrating to being fully HD, rather than DirecTV removing SD channels.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

cableview said:


> I believe it is the channels themselves migrating to being fully HD, rather than DirecTV removing SD channels.


I'm pretty sure all of the Encore channels have been HD for a while now. That DIRECTV was offering some in SD was their doing.


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## JodeanSS (11 mo ago)

harsh said:


> I'm pretty sure all of the Encore channels have been HD for a while now. That DIRECTV was offering some in SD was their doing.


What?? only one of the ten or so Encore channels are in HD......


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

JodeanSS said:


> What?? only one of the ten or so Encore channels are in HD......


At the distribution level, at least eight of the Encore channels are available in HD. Encore Classics may be the lone exception.

If DIRECTV chooses to offer SD renditions, that's DIRECTV's choice.


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## skinnyJM (Nov 19, 2005)

And it looks like they have updated to HEVC compression too

Galaxy 13/Horizons 1: 4040 V - LyngSat


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

skinnyJM said:


> And it looks like they have updated to HEVC compression too
> 
> Galaxy 13/Horizons 1: 4040 V - LyngSat


Gonna see a lot of that, with the C band sale for 5G leaving less C band spectrum.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

harsh said:


> Seinfeld was shot on film in 4:3. Aspect ratio conversion is certainly possible but not trivial.
> 
> People need to get over the idea that 4:3 is necessarily a bad thing.


I once was at a theater for the 50th anniversary of Gone With the Wind. There were people that booed when they realized it was a 4:3 movie.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> I once was at a theater for the 50th anniversary of Gone With the Wind. There were people that booed when they realized it was a 4:3 movie.


"People" are often subject to stupidity, ignorance and ill-conceived notions.

_Gone With the Wind_ was released in 1939 yet standardized widescreen formats wouldn't appear until the early to mid 1950s. If the movie had been released in one of the predecessor widescreen formats, most theaters wouldn't have been able to play it and it likely wouldn't have been commercially successful.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

CraigerM said:


> I wasn't saying change it. I was saying if they filmed it originally in 16x9.


So you're suggesting that letterboxing would have been graciously accepted?

You can't have it both ways without doing serious injury to one or possibly both formats.


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## Steveknj (Nov 14, 2006)

harsh said:


> So you're suggesting that letterboxing would have been graciously accepted?
> 
> You can't have it both ways without doing serious injury to one or possibly both formats.


I think most people have gotten so used to letterboxing 16:9 format (of old 4:3 content) that people assume that's the way it's "supposed to be". So when you watch something that's 4:3, it looks strange and old and out of whack. Seinfeld is an exmaple of a show that used to be 4:3 but is now showed in 16:9 on TV, and when I pull out my old DVDs and it's 4:3 it looks a bit strange, even though that's how it's meant to be.


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

Steveknj said:


> I think most people have gotten so used to letterboxing 16:9 format (of old 4:3 content) that people assume that's the way it's "supposed to be". So when you watch something that's 4:3, it looks strange and old and out of whack. Seinfeld is an exmaple of a show that used to be 4:3 but is now showed in 16:9 on TV, and when I pull out my old DVDs and it's 4:3 it looks a bit strange, even though that's how it's meant to be.


letterbox is for > 16:9 on 16:9 (bars top & bottom), pillar box is for 4:3 on a 16:9 (bars on the side). I love when the ghetto local channels take 16:9 content, stick on the 4:3 channel with letterbox and then pillar that whole mess and you get window box aspect ratio (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windowbox_(filmmaking)).


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## trainman (Jan 9, 2008)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> I once was at a theater for the 50th anniversary of Gone With the Wind. There were people that booed when they realized it was a 4:3 movie.


Are you sure you're thinking of the *50th* anniversary? That was 1989, when letterboxing was far from the mainstream -- movies being released on VHS with letterboxing was almost unheard of, and Turner Classic Movies was five years away from going on the air as the first channel that regularly aired films in their original aspect ratio, including letterboxing if necessary.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

He did say "theater" ... widescreen was prevalent in the theaters with the movies cropped or pan and scan when they hit TV / video. Perhaps the theater goers thought they were missing some of the picture since most "modern" films in 1989 were wide screen.


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

harsh said:


> "People" are often subject to stupidity, ignorance and ill-conceived notions.
> 
> _Gone With the Wind_ was released in 1939 yet standardized widescreen formats wouldn't appear until the early to mid 1950s. If the movie had been released in one of the predecessor widescreen formats, most theaters wouldn't have been able to play it and it likely wouldn't have been commercially successful.


For the record "The Big Trail" staring John Wayne was released in 1930 in two aspect ratios (2.10:1 Grandeur Widescreen and 1.2:1 Academy 4.3).


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

MysteryMan said:


> For the record "The Big Trail" staring John Wayne was released in 1930 in two aspect ratios (2.10:1 Grandeur Widescreen and 1.2:1 Academy 4.3).
> View attachment 32102
> View attachment 32103


Personally, I'd prefer 4:3 shows in 4:3. You lose intended stuff when they crop it to 16:9. But there really isn't a lot of 4:3 shows I can still watch. I've seen every episode of all my favorite shows to the point of remembering the whole plot from a few sentences in the guide.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

MysteryMan said:


> For the record "The Big Trail" staring John Wayne was released in 1930 in two aspect ratios (2.10:1 Grandeur Widescreen and 1.2:1 Academy 4.3).


How many academy awards did that movie win? Composition is not just a suggestion -- it is what makes a film something more than a newsreel (something else that was occasionally released in widescreen formats).

As I said, there were earlier widescreen films but they typically weren't commercially successful as they required a special projector. Not as bad as Cinemascope that required three projectors but you hopefully get the point.


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

harsh said:


> How many academy awards did that movie win? Composition is not just a suggestion -- it is what makes a film something more than a newsreel (something else that was occasionally released in widescreen formats).
> 
> As I said, there were earlier widescreen films but they typically weren't commercially successful as they required a special projector. Not as bad as Cinemascope that required three projectors but you hopefully get the point.


In post #32 you "Incorrectly " stated "widescreen formats wouldn't appear until the early to mid 1950s". I corrected your error in post #38. Academy awards have nothing to do with it.. Just another example of you posting incorrect information!


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

MysteryMan said:


> In post #32 you "Incorrectly " stated "widescreen formats wouldn't appear until the early to mid 1950s". I corrected your error in post #38. Academy awards have nothing to do with it.. Just another example of you posting incorrect information!


You've very carefully sound-bited what I said through a carefully executed misquote. I specifically said "standard widescreen formats". Giving a format a name doesn't make it "standard". A "standard" in this case is a projection format that is shared by most theaters.

Just another example of falsely accusing me of posting incorrect information.


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

harsh said:


> You've very carefully sound-bited what I said through a carefully executed misquote. I specifically said "standard widescreen formats". Giving a format a name doesn't make it "standard". A "standard" in this case is a projection format that is shared by most theaters.
> 
> Just another example of falsely accusing me of posting incorrect information.


As I stated "The Big Trail", released in 1930 was shot in both 2.00:1 Grandeur Widescreen and 1.2:1 Academy 4.3. At that time both formats were the "standard" used by studios.


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Should we stop the madness bickering off-topic ?


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## makaiguy (Sep 24, 2007)

harsh said:


> ... Not as bad as *Cinemascope* that required three projectors but you hopefully get the point.


 Umm.... Cinerama?


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## MysteryMan (May 17, 2010)

harsh said:


> Not as bad as Cinemascope that required three projectors but you hopefully get the point.


And again you post incorrect information. Cinemascope is an anamorphic lens used for shooting widescreen films. Cinerama is a widescreen process that projects simultaneously from three 35mm projectors onto a hugh, deeply curved screen.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

MysteryMan said:


> And again you post incorrect information. Cinemascope is an anamorphic lens used for shooting widescreen films.


My bust. I confused the two. My point was to illustrate that there were lots of formats and that special projection requirements were a thing.

Fox's Grandeur format was available in very few theaters (it was a 70mm format) and was home to only a handful of movies (if that). Wikipedia lists the musicals _Happy Days_ and _Song o' My Heart_ and the aforementioned_ The Big Trail._

There were many widescreen formats and more than a few of them used odd film formats. RKO's NaturalVision used 65mm film and is not to be confused with the earlier Natural Vision 63.5mm format.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Widescreen



It wasn't until the 1950s when the format war had mostly settled out to a point where the majority of theaters could handle widescreen formats that I refer to as standard.


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

Thank you for your opinion ... Now let's get back to the topic of this thread, DIRECTV removing SD channels.


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## harsh (Jun 15, 2003)

James Long said:


> Thank you for your opinion ...


Leave it to you to declare supporting data as "opinion".


James Long said:


> Now let's get back to the topic of this thread, DIRECTV removing SD channels.


The channel mentioned in the OP was on the list for jettison as part of a migration of HD channels to Ku announced nearly 11 months ago (May 13, 2021). What is remarkable is that it has taken this long. The announcement stated that the channels were to disappear starting July 13th, 2021.

For reference, the channels mentioned in May 2021 were:

MAV TV - 214
GSN - 233
ION East - 305
TV ONE - 328
Fuse - 339
RFD TV - 345
AccuWeather - 361
Trinity Broadcast Network - 372


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## James Long (Apr 17, 2003)

harsh said:


> Leave it to you to declare supporting data as "opinion".


It is your opinion that the widescreen formats used before the 1950s were not "standard".

This thread remains open for on topic discussion.


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## boukengreen (Sep 22, 2009)

CraigerM said:


> They won't have that switch SD option during bad weather anymore when all SD shuts down.


Yep I had bad weather in North Alabama yesterday and it didn’t give me a swap to SD option it was only watch on demand or watch from my playlist.


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## Troch2002 (May 8, 2016)

I know this is kinda off topic but what is Directv Satellite long term plan ? I know they are getting close to some satellite lifespan. 

But I know a few people that have Starlink and switched to Directv stream and its been working quite good. 
Is that the Direction Directv is headed?


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## P Smith (Jul 25, 2002)

Troch2002 said:


> Is that the Direction Directv is headed?


It's a matter your OWN thread - go ahead, open it !


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## Carolina (Jan 20, 2012)

boukengreen said:


> Yep I had bad weather in North Alabama yesterday and it didn’t give me a swap to SD option it was only watch on demand or watch from my playlist.


I'm going to miss having that because we have had a lot of bad weather this summer and I did use the SD option.


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## west99999 (May 12, 2007)

boukengreen said:


> Yep I had bad weather in North Alabama yesterday and it didn’t give me a swap to SD option it was only watch on demand or watch from my playlist.


It’s still an option now so if you didn’t get it that means your 101 was below threshold also. They are about to swap a bunch of HD channels over to the 101 to help with rain fade.


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## HoTat2 (Nov 16, 2005)

west99999 said:


> ... They are about to swap a bunch of HD channels over to the 101 to help with rain fade.


Yeah ...

To note they've only moved 5 HD channels off Ka and down to 101 Ku so far (to tp. 24).

CNN HD, HGTV HD, Hallmark HD, MSNBC HD, and FNC HD.

But exactly how they'll create more available CONUS tps. on 101 Ku though to move many more HD channels is a matter of debate since it took virtually all the available bandwidth on Ku just to open up the one tp. 24.

For a while, in light of a number of recent A3 SD duplications of LiL channels on Ka band spotbeam tps. of DSS SD LiL channels on Ku. Seem to suggest DIRECTV is planning to convert some or all the six local spotbeam tp. channels on 101 Ku to CONUS beam ones.

However, that idea now appears to be problematic as well as demonstrated by kyl416's excellent post on the Edgecutter forum here ....






Domestic Transponder Map ~ Data 1/11/2023 - Edgecutter Cutting Edge Forums


Domestic TPN Map Presents all Domestic Directv Channels: National (50-States or wide/NAT+PR beams) Local (Local-Into-Local or narrow/Spot beams) Additional tabs also provide: OTA the (Over-The-Air) Database On_Demand Listings Offline Records Engr Records Net Decoder a graphic...



www.iamanedgecutter.com












Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

HoTat2 said:


> Yeah ...
> 
> To note they've only moved 5 HD channels off Ka and down to 101 Ku so far (to tp. 24).
> 
> ...



If they were going to do more, presumably they'd do it like they did these - move some rarely watched MPEG2 SD only or MPEG2 SD duplicate channels to MPEG4, and free up another transponder. Alternatively, they could turn up the compression on MPEG2 SD to cram more channels per transponder.

I'm not sure they'll bother, that would be a lot of work for five more HD channels.


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## Carolina (Jan 20, 2012)

I can no longer do an SD swap.


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## slice1900 (Feb 14, 2013)

Carolina said:


> I can no longer do an SD swap.



Do you have only SD receivers, or a mix of SD and HD?

I think they stopped letting people with mixed accounts replace SD receivers years ago, but if they are not replacing SD receivers even on SD only accounts that's something new. But not unexpected as they may not want to deal with taking them back and refurbishing them anymore.


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## krel (Mar 20, 2013)

Troch2002 said:


> I know this is kinda off topic but what is Directv Satellite long term plan ? I know they are getting close to some satellite lifespan.
> 
> But I know a few people that have Starlink and switched to Directv stream and its been working quite good.
> Is that the Direction Directv is headed?


Dtv wants everyone streaming its cheaper for em. No truck rolls no sat boxes need to be made ect ect


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## SledgeHammer (Dec 28, 2007)

krel said:


> Dtv wants everyone streaming its cheaper for em. No truck rolls no sat boxes need to be made ect ect


Not cheaper for me .


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