# "Searching for signal on the off-air tuner ....(771)"....What??



## r34220 (Jan 6, 2007)

Today I tuned to an HD off-air channel and get the Searching for signal... message when the signal is there. Anyone seen this?


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## Teronzhul (Sep 21, 2006)

Yes, the exact same thing started happening to me last night while I was watching Lost on ABC. The program was playing fine but 3 or 4 times during it the 771 popped up for about 15 seconds and then went away.


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## r34220 (Jan 6, 2007)

I have seen that on occasion but the 771 does not go away. It happends on only one channel on both my HR20's with different OTA antennas.


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

Try resetting your DVR.


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## r34220 (Jan 6, 2007)

tryed to reboot.. no joy.


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## jcrandall (Jun 18, 2004)

could be the second tuner is on a channel that is weak or not coming in.

try recording the channel you were watching and changing the other tuner to a different ota channel. only thing i can think of.


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## 4DThinker (Dec 17, 2006)

My local CBS station simply was off the air for a few days this week. I couldn't find the station even with my TVs auto-channel search.

Signal came back today.

771 simply means it's having trouble finding or keeping hold on the signal your antenna is getting. Check your antenna. Check your cables. Check all the connections. At one time while in my attic I accidently bumped the antenna I have in there. It took me two days to realize that small movement had reduced the signal I could get by about 20% from most stations. Once figured out and re-aimed all stations came in strong again.


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## John4924 (Mar 19, 2007)

4DThinker said:


> My local CBS station simply was off the air for a few days this week. I couldn't find the station even with my TVs auto-channel search.
> 
> Signal came back today.
> 
> 771 simply means it's having trouble finding or keeping hold on the signal your antenna is getting. Check your antenna. Check your cables. Check all the connections. At one time while in my attic I accidently bumped the antenna I have in there. It took me two days to realize that small movement had reduced the signal I could get by about 20% from most stations. Once figured out and re-aimed all stations came in strong again.


Agree with 4D..a small movement of the antenna can make a big difference. What I have done is aim my antenna (in my attic) at the weakest signal. In addition, I installed a CM7777 amp in my attic right at the antenna that feeds a distribution system in my home. Now, ALL of my OTA signals are at 100%, and no more dreaded "771" for me! 

Cheers,
John


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## miggo (Feb 28, 2007)

I do see that. My local 33-1 works fine through my TV tuner but the hr20 just "search for signal". I am going to re-setup my off air antenna as soon as I am not recording something to see if it helps.

Oh, my HR20 antenna is a HD antenna on the roof - my TV is hooked up to a 20 year old set of rabbit ears on floor behind the TV!


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

r34220 said:


> Today I tuned to an HD off-air channel and get the Searching for signal... message when the signal is there. Anyone seen this?
> View attachment 7855


It is possible that that D* introduced an error in the OTA data stream that tells it what frequency the HR20 tuner is supposed to tune to. I have one channel that has been like this for months. The channel shows 80% signal strength in the Signal Meter screen, but when you change to the channel "live", it gives the 771 error.

So if nothing else works, I'm betting they "updated" the stream and got your channel freq wrong.


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## ahrjmr (Nov 17, 2004)

If anyone uses "Rabbit Ears" to get local HD feeds and the antenna is positioned on a table or shelf in the room and someone walks by I get that message until the person clears the area where the signal is coming from.

This could by the problem.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

ahrjmr said:


> If anyone uses "Rabbit Ears" to get local HD feeds and the antenna is positioned on a table or shelf in the room and someone walks by I get that message until the person clears the area where the signal is coming from.
> This could by the problem.


excuse me for: DUH...
You need something better than your rabbit ears as the signal is blocked when the human body is between the "ears" and the tower.


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## ahrjmr (Nov 17, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> excuse me for: DUH...
> You need something better than your rabbit ears as the signal is blocked when the human body is between the "ears" and the tower.


I know that, but maybe some others don't.


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## Radio Enginerd (Oct 5, 2006)

r34220 said:


> Today I tuned to an HD off-air channel and get the Searching for signal... message when the signal is there. Anyone seen this?
> View attachment 7855


Yes, I saw this with my local PBS affiliate at one point. I have 90% signal but got that message when I went to tune it.

I contacted my PBS affiliate and it was a transmitter issue on their end. Probably not your issue though...


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

ahrjmr said:


> I know that, but maybe some others don't.


Good point....


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## ahrjmr (Nov 17, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> Good point....


Thanks.


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## bonscott87 (Jan 21, 2003)

Definately make sure your OTA station isn't actually down.

Few weeks ago I'm watching CBS via MPEG4 off the sat. Signal goes out, blank screen. What the.....
I check another MPEG4 and it's coming in so I haven't lost the sat.

So I switch over to my old HD receiver with OTA and what do ya know, OTA down as well. I check analog and it's fine. So the digital tower was out. It was down for 2 days.

Checking AVS for your local thread may help you as well determine this.

I'm not saying that's the problem here, but it is the most common issue with OTA.


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## jorossian (Jan 21, 2007)

Radio Enginerd said:


> Yes, I saw this with my local PBS affiliate at one point. I have 90% signal but got that message when I went to tune it.
> 
> I contacted my PBS affiliate and it was a transmitter issue on their end. Probably not your issue though...


Same issue on my end right now. The problem is the PBS signal and not the receiver (and my PBS signal is a literal blowtorch for me in terms of strength.... solid 100% signal all the time). I just switch the TV input from the HR20 to my TV's OTA tuner and see if I still get the channel there. If I don't I know the signal's gone, If I do I know the HR20 is the problem. So far it's always been the signal being temporarily down. Rare, but it happens.


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## purpledave (Oct 23, 2006)

For the past 5 downloads including 0x145, I get the 771 message on my CBS HD channel 11.1. In an earlier post in the 0x145 discussion and issues thread, I got a response that the problem was with the Tribune Co. who administers the Guide Data.

My question is, why can't I get any signal strength on my HR20-700, when I get a signal in the 70's on my HR10-250 [TIVO], and get good reception on my MITS TV tuner, and the guide data does show up for 11.1 on the TIVO... and the HR20-700...?

I can watch the Masters Golf but can't record it on the HR20.

I have done several RBR's to try to solve this problem.


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## Keeska (Feb 10, 2007)

hasan said:


> The channel shows 80% signal strength in the Signal Meter screen, but when you change to the channel "live", it gives the 771 error.


Unfortunately the signal strength it shows you is only part of the equation. Multipath (reflection of the signal off of objects in the path between you and the transmitter) is a big problem with ATSC signals. The RF signal level is high but due to multipath the digital data (bits) cannot be decoded without error. On NTSC signals you just see ghosting. Newer ATSC tuners use better multipath rejection algorithms. The HR20 does not appear to be very good in this area though. One of my other ATSC tuners is worse then the HR20 and two are significantly better.


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## White94Cobra (Jun 18, 2007)

I have one channel (ATSC 5.1 my local NBC) that shows 771 24/7 now. It tunes fine on my HD TiVo and on my 4 SageTV ATSC tuners. 5.2 also tunes fine on the HR20-100, it's just 5.1 that shows 771. This started with the last software update. I'm going to try swapping back to my internal drive (with an older sw version) to see if that fixes it.


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## dgordo (Aug 29, 2004)

I have heard of other reports of this. Im starting to think it is related to the other 771 issue going around. Bottom line, the HR20,21 series are fubar.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

White94Cobra said:


> This started with the last software update. I'm going to try swapping back to my internal drive (with an older sw version) to see if that fixes it.


This would be a complete waste of time. The software is on the chips, not the drive.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

dgordo said:


> I have heard of other reports of this. Im starting to think it is related to the other 771 issue going around. Bottom line, the HR20,21 series are fubar.


Since the HR21 has NO OTA tuner, you can't think it's "fubar" for this topic.
The OTA tuners in all but the H20-600 are the third gen chips that simply aren't as good as the 5th gen chips are.


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## White94Cobra (Jun 18, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> This would be a complete waste of time. The software is on the chips, not the drive.


As I completely and wastefully discovered a few minutes ago.


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## dgordo (Aug 29, 2004)

veryoldschool said:


> Since the HR21 has NO OTA tuner, you can't think it's "fubar" for this topic.


Nope, just fubar in the other 771 issue.


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## White94Cobra (Jun 18, 2007)

FWIW - I've talked with two other local people that have the HR20. Both are getting the 771 error on our local ATSC NBC HD feed. It does tune fine on 4 other devices however.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

White94Cobra said:


> FWIW - I've talked with two other local people that have the HR20. Both are getting the 771 error on our local ATSC NBC HD feed. It does tune fine on 4 other devices however.


Maybe try resetting up OTA via the menu?


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## smptc73 (Jul 11, 2007)

I too get the 771 on OTA channels.

I posted the following in another thread:

So a couple of nights ago I finally got fed up with the 771 issue occuring on my HR20-700 and decided to call DirecTV about it.

To recap: I get the 771 error on OTA channel 9-1 in Minneapolis. For some reason, the box randomly replaces the 9-1 channel in Minneapolis with a 9-1 broadcast in Wisconsin in the Guide. When I change the system to change the guide back to 9-1 Minneapolis, I get the 771 error which can be remedied by resetting the OTA channels or resetting the box.

I explain this situation to the tech service rep; here are his responses:

1. You need to be using a wideband multiswitch to distribute your signal. I indicated to him that this was an OTA issue, not one with the satellite signal. The multiswitch is irrelevant, but the one I do use was provided by DirecTV.

2. He indicated to me that they are currently working on a solution called "SWM" that may resolve this issue. I kindly reminded him again that this was an OTA issue, and realized it was going to be a long call.

3. He indicated that my OTA antenna needed to be grounded in order to function properly. I commented to him that it seemed odd that all of the other OTA channels (including 9-2) worked just fine without it being grounded, and that all of the signal strengths were outstanding. [OT - anyone else notice that the highest OTA signal strength you can get from the HR 20 is 77%? On the same feed, I get over 90 (out of 100) on my internal TV tuner.]

4. He indicated that my coax cable from the antenna was split, and therefore, not compatible with the OTA tuner in the HR20. "Really?" I replied. DirecTV released a component that is incompatible with the splitting of coax cable? Who in the engineering group signed off on that requirement? Again, there doesn't seem to be a signal strength issue on any of the other channels or the other "legacy technology" boxes from DirecTV that I own.

At this point, I'm pretty unhappy and request that a new box be sent. I am told that since DirecTV isn't responsible for OTA programming that sending me a new box is out of the question.

My response is that the only thing mentioned here that I haven't confirmed is the grounding of my antenna (which is IN my attic, not on my roof). If I ground it, and this still happens, will DirecTV then be convinced that this is not a signal issue and will I be sent a new box in that eventuality? I am told no.

I exhibit my extreme displeasure with this product and these responses and suggest that something is wrong with the HR20, not the signal going to it. I am put on hold, and after am told that the Supervisor has recommended forwarding my issue to the Broadcast and Engineering teams at DirecTV for further analysis. My issue will be forwarded for consideration in future software updates.

However, it's not guaranteed that the issue will be fixed, and no one will contact me to let me know if it's even been considered (or forwarded.) I asked that someone contact me, and it is requested in the note, but not guaranteed.

I follow up with the fact that I will be following up in 1 week if not contacted.

What a joke.

For starters, I signed on for a 2-year committment to activate this unit. The committment is a two way street - they provide a box subisdy, the box, and the programming, I pay the fee. They are in breach of the committment when the box they provide doesn't work. PERIOD.

This is a $1500 (minimum) piece of equipment (lease plus 24 month committment of a bare bones programming.)

I don't own any other $1500 electronics items in my A/V set up. Given that, it should be the best piece of equipment I own.

Instead, this one randomly changes the guide by itself, resulting in blank recordings for that channel.

Perhaps I should randomly decide to send what I want for monthly programming fees.

I'll give an update to the saga next week, lest the group have any recommendations I haven't thought of (besides resetting the box and checking the connections, which have already been done.)


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## ncshawng (Oct 4, 2007)

Ok, I noticed the same issue with the 771 on an OTA channel.

First of all, I flipped the switch on my antenna switch to connect the OTA antenna to the ANT input on my Toshiba Regza HDTV. The missing signal showed up immediately on that set (along with a few others that I had never seen before due to wonderful reception conditions last night -- probably due to an inversion.)

I switched back and noted the same problem -- 771 on one particular OTA channel.

I'm only three miles from that particular tower. The signal for that channel has always been 100%. Heck, I can hold a coat hanger wire next to the antenna connector and pick up the signal from that station! I ciould see the tower from my house (2000 ft tower) if not for the trees in the neighborhood. It's not my antenna, and it used to work until a week or so ago. A software change has occurred which changed the tuning for this station.

In my case, this is channel 58 (58-1 through 58-5), one of the stations of the University of NC educational TV network, located in Concord, NC, and a PBS member.

In reading this thread, I do note that a variety of channels have been affected in the other notes here. Perhaps a pattern ciould be seen. My OTA at 2-1 still works fine (Greensboro, NC)

And, no, my problem is not quite the same as the first note in the thread. I have lost a previously-received OTA channel altogether.


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## Anonuser (Jan 15, 2007)

smptc73 said:


> I too get the 771 on OTA channels.
> 
> To recap: I get the 771 error on OTA channel 9-1 in Minneapolis. For some reason, the box randomly replaces the 9-1 channel in Minneapolis with a 9-1 broadcast in Wisconsin in the Guide. When I change the system to change the guide back to 9-1 Minneapolis, I get the 771 error which can be remedied by resetting the OTA channels or resetting the box.


I live in the Twin Cities and have had the phantom 9-1 problem on both my HR20 and H20 for months. KMSP is replaced with KAWEDT (Bemidji).

btw - I have an ungrounded antenna in my attic.

If/when you figure it out, please post the solution.

Thanks


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## smptc73 (Jul 11, 2007)

Anonuser said:


> I live in the Twin Cities and have had the phantom 9-1 problem on both my HR20 and H20 for months. KMSP is replaced with KAWEDT (Bemidji).
> 
> btw - I have an ungrounded antenna in my attic.
> 
> ...


Good to hear I'm not the only one with this issue.

Magically, a new (probably reconditioned) HR 20-700 showed up at my door Friday. I have yet to set it up, but I guess someone listened to the tape of my call and decided that rather than deal with me again they'll just send a different box.

I plan on setting it up tonight and will let you know how it goes in the next couple of days.


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## too hip (Aug 8, 2007)

smptc73 said:


> Good to hear I'm not the only one with this issue.
> 
> Magically, a new (probably reconditioned) HR 20-700 showed up at my door Friday. I have yet to set it up, but I guess someone listened to the tape of my call and decided that rather than deal with me again they'll just send a different box.
> 
> I plan on setting it up tonight and will let you know how it goes in the next couple of days.


I have the same issue. Here is a temporary fix.

1. Run the Initial Antenna Setup in the Ant/Sat menu.

2. After you run the initial setup then go to edit off air channels, uncheck the 9.1 KAWEDT (Bemidji), and check KTSP 9.1 Minneapolis. After you do this 9.1 should be working fine.

The only problem with this fix is that if you install new software on your receiver or it reboots you will have to do this all over again.


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## Steve Robertson (Jun 7, 2005)

I have this problem here in Boston but not sure to what extent I need to check it out more tonight. I just thought it was just one of those days when OTA was not working right.


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## smptc73 (Jul 11, 2007)

So Too Hip - 

Just to confirm, you also get this EXACT issue with channel 9-1?

Thanks for the workaround, I have performed that before in the past, but frankly, it takes as long as a roboot. But it certainly works until the system screws it up again.

That having been said, now that I've seen multiple people with the exact same issue in the Minneapolis area, I'm thinking about calling and testing the new receiver without sending my initial receiver back. It's kind of a pain to reset up everything if this isn't going to work, or even worse, have additional problems.


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## allenn (Nov 19, 2005)

I have an HR21-700 and see 771's on occasion. I just tuned to a different channel.


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## Carl Spock (Sep 3, 2004)

You folks in Minneapolis - one of you should PM Earl and find out how to report this bug officially to DirecTV through the board. It does sound like a software bug somewhere in the system.

You guys didn't get the special HR20s that run on Vista, did you? :grin: 

smptc73, I'll bet you dollars to donuts the new receiver will work just like the old one.


And yes, I've seen 771 but it was either in the middle of a storm or I knew the station was off the air.


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## smptc73 (Jul 11, 2007)

ggergm said:


> You folks in Minneapolis - one of you should PM Earl and find out how to report this bug officially to DirecTV through the board. It does sound like a software bug somewhere in the system.
> 
> You guys didn't get the special HR20s that run on Vista, did you? :grin:
> 
> ...


Unfortunately, I'll bet you're right too, which is why I'm shy about giving the receiver they sent me a try.


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## tonyd79 (Jul 24, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> excuse me for: DUH...
> You need something better than your rabbit ears as the signal is blocked when the human body is between the "ears" and the tower.


Disagree.

I have that problem with one of my stations with an UHF loop. If i put something bigger (indoors), I get multipath errors.

Bigger is not always better.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

tonyd79 said:


> Disagree.
> 
> I have that problem with one of my stations with an UHF loop. If i put something bigger (indoors), I get multipath errors.
> 
> Bigger is not always better.


I'm guessing the "bigger" was in the part you didn't post?
"Normally" with "bigger", you get more directional too [thus reducing multi-path].


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## too hip (Aug 8, 2007)

smptc73 said:


> So Too Hip -
> 
> Just to confirm, you also get this EXACT issue with channel 9-1?.


Yes.

9.1 works fine on my OTA input on the TV and HR10 so I know it's not a signal issue. I'm guessing it is just a database error that is pulling the wrong info for our area? Maybe we can find a southern Minnesota zip code that might not include Bemidji as a local?

I do have an additional receiver coming on Saturday (not a replacement) so I will see how that one works? I'll probably get an HR21, i hope not.


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## DSOUND (Nov 18, 2006)

I have the same 771 problem. Not only on OTA but any HD station. I noticed that the stations were working fine earlier. I did notice that I was recording in the backgroung when this happened. Sure enough, when the recording stopped, everything was fine. Hope this helps.


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## smptc73 (Jul 11, 2007)

DSOUND said:


> I have the same 771 problem. Not only on OTA but any HD station. I noticed that the stations were working fine earlier. I did notice that I was recording in the backgroung when this happened. Sure enough, when the recording stopped, everything was fine. Hope this helps.


Thanks for the input DSOUND.

I haven't cleared the OTA error on 9-1 via reset since the last time it showed up.

Regardless of whether something is recording or not, I always get the 771 error for that channel.

The remainder of the channels are rock solid.

I've been time strapped the last couple of days, hopefully I get the chance to swap receivers tonight and see if this error is repeatable.


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## flyt100 (Jun 27, 2007)

I have the same issue on 9-1 in minneapolis.


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## smptc73 (Jul 11, 2007)

So, I sent a message to Earl with no response - perhaps he doesn't like me....or is more likely buried with other requests.

As for the replacement box, everything worked honky dory until last night, when this issue reared its ugly head again.

Whatever they may have done, the issue is not resolved, and appears to occur across hardware. Still smells like a software issue to me.


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## ddingle (Aug 19, 2006)

smptc73 said:


> So, I sent a message to Earl with no response - perhaps he doesn't like me....or is more likely buried with other requests.
> 
> As for the replacement box, everything worked honky dory until last night, when this issue reared its ugly head again.
> 
> Whatever they may have done, the issue is not resolved, and appears to occur across hardware. Still smells like a software issue to me.


I have had the same problem several times over the last year? I am sure Earl has known about it for that long as well. It must be a database problem that is not controlled by Directv? It is their responsibility to resolve the problem however.
I would bet that the new AM21 outboard tuner would exhibit the same problem when available. 
It is about time this is fixed. Or I should get some money back for programming lost.?


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## Rabushka (Dec 21, 2007)

Is there any way to check OTA signal strength on an HR20 700 other than seeing if the station comes in or not?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Rabushka said:


> Is there any way to check OTA signal strength on an HR20 700 other than seeing if the station comes in or not?


Yes if you go into the setup menu for OTA [it may be under "edit"].


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## DJ)V (Feb 15, 2008)

I have the same problem as several others: channel 9-1 in Minneapolis with an HR20.

I've tried every suggestion on this thread except re-doing the off-air setup sequence. Will try that next.

smptc73, how's it going? Does the new box still have the problem?


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## carsonius (Jan 1, 2008)

So, last night I tried to watch "The Simpsons" that I recorded OTA here in Pittsburgh, (WPGH 53-1), and the progress bar zooms to the end and locks up the HR20. I try to tune to the local PBS station, WQED 13-1, to check what I'm recording there and the HR20 locks up again.

After about 30 minutes of patiently waiting for the DVR to respond to my remote clicks, and manual button presses on the HR20, I regain control and am able to do a reset. I deleted all the attempted OTA recordings from yesterday and, thankfully, it didn't toast all the recordings on my 750gb external drive.

I just did the initial antenna setup, again, and I've lost WPGH, and WTAE. I'm not happy.

It was a Herculean task for me to get an HR20 when I started my service in January and it will be tragi-funny if it was all for naught because I can't receive my locals OTA.

This can't be a database issue with my particular problem because the database knows that I should be receiving these stations. Software? Seems pretty unlikely that someone would go through the trouble of programming something that goes like this:

1) Correctly identify local broadcast stations.
2) Randomly not tune some of them.

Too much cat hair in the DVR? Sunspots? Divine retribution because I like "Family Guy" in HD? A Republican plot agains PBS?


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## DJ)V (Feb 15, 2008)

DJ)V said:


> I've tried every suggestion on this thread except re-doing the off-air setup sequence. Will try that next.


Well, that fixed it. We'll see how long it lasts. At least I found a solution.


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## aaront22 (Mar 23, 2008)

I am setting up the AM 21 with my HR 21 and I have everything installed but the ATSC off air attena cable. Can anyone suggest a good indoor attena. 

Thanks


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## ddingle (Aug 19, 2006)

ddingle said:


> I have had the same problem several times over the last year? I am sure Earl has known about it for that long as well. It must be a database problem that is not controlled by Directv? It is their responsibility to resolve the problem however.
> I would bet that the new AM21 outboard tuner would exhibit the same problem when available.
> It is about time this is fixed. Or I should get some money back for programming lost.?


This issue continues for me and several of my clients! I am getting tired of resetting the antenna settings everytime a new firmware is downloaded. Someone at Directv should be able to fix the database or make a recommendation?


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## randyk47 (Aug 21, 2006)

OK. Now I'm bugged. I have two HR20's and one H20. Up until a week or so ago I had no problems with any of my locals OTA. Now, all of a sudden, I've got one station that shows up in the guide but every time I try to go to it I get the 771 message. I've reset every receiver and still the same. I tried the OTA through the TV's and they pick up the missing channel without a problem. So then I go and do signal strength on the DirecTV receivers and the missing channel strength is actually stronger than some of the ones I'm getting. What in the world is going on?


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## ddingle (Aug 19, 2006)

randyk47 said:


> OK. Now I'm bugged. I have two HR20's and one H20. Up until a week or so ago I had no problems with any of my locals OTA. Now, all of a sudden, I've got one station that shows up in the guide but every time I try to go to it I get the 771 message. I've reset every receiver and still the same. I tried the OTA through the TV's and they pick up the missing channel without a problem. So then I go and do signal strength on the DirecTV receivers and the missing channel strength is actually stronger than some of the ones I'm getting. What in the world is going on?


On my end, you have to reset the antenna settings and then do a new antenna setup. The missing OTA channel (9-1 here in Minneapolis) will become available after this procedure.
I have done it 50 times on several different receivers. I am getting the impression that Directv is not capable of fixing this issue. I may have missed something,but there hasn't been any response from them on this problem. 
If it is out of their control or extremely difficult to remedy,why not just let us know that is the case.? 
It is costing me money as I am repeatedly resetting clients receivers only to find the problems again shortly there after.


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