# HR-24 Slowness Freezing b/c of eSata?



## heelsmj (Mar 31, 2009)

I have read many threads about people with similar issues to mine with the HR-24. It will freeze for 10-15 seconds and any keys pressed during that freeze are "saved" and then executed consecutively when it comes back. Another issue is long delays from pressing play on an item in my play list and the item actually playing. My final issue is audio cut outs. This happens on recorded items as well as live items. There will be a slight hiccup for a fraction of a second where the audio drops and then it comes back. I have had this receiver for around 4 months. There were no issues until a few weeks ago. I have it running a 2 TB WD Green drive in an Antec MX-1 enclosure with a Trip-Lite eSata cable. I was thinking that the slowness might be related to the drive filling up (38% Free) and it just can't handle the sheer size of the playlist. However now that I am reading all the other issues im not so sure. How many people out there with issues with their HR-24 are using an eSata enclosure? Feedback, thoughts? Can this be causing the issue or is there just a problem with the design of the receiver?


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

heelsmj said:


> I have read many threads about people with similar issues to mine with the HR-24. It will freeze for 10-15 seconds and any keys pressed during that freeze are "saved" and then executed consecutively when it comes back. Another issue is long delays from pressing play on an item in my play list and the item actually playing. My final issue is audio cut outs. This happens on recorded items as well as live items. There will be a slight hiccup for a fraction of a second where the audio drops and then it comes back. I have had this receiver for around 4 months. *There were no issues until a few weeks ago. I have it running a 2 TB WD Green drive in an Antec MX-1 enclosure with a Trip-Lite eSata cable.* *I was thinking that the slowness might be related to the drive filling up (38% Free) and it just can't handle the sheer size of the playlist*. However now that I am reading all the other issues im not so sure. How many people out there with issues with their HR-24 are using an eSata enclosure? Feedback, thoughts? *Can this be causing the issue or is there just a problem with the design of the receiver*?


1) That drive and enclosure should not cuase you problems
2) No - not even close - I know folks with 95% full that don't see those symptoms on the HR24
3) No - but it could be firmware that needs some corrections - they work on those kind of "fixes" all the time, and push out firmware updates to correct them. Perhaps you'll see something soon.


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## heelsmj (Mar 31, 2009)

Thanks, Is there any way to manually force a firmware update or I just have to wait for the push?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

heelsmj said:


> Thanks, Is there any way to manually force a firmware update or I just have to wait for the push?


What model WD HDD are you using? Some of the Green Caviars aren't compatible with the HRs.

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

heelsmj said:


> Thanks, Is there any way to manually force a firmware update or I just have to wait for the push?


Updates are generally pushed out by DirecTV.

What version (and specific model HR24) do you have?


rich584 said:


> What model WD HDD are you using? Some of the Green Caviars aren't compatible with the HRs.
> 
> Rich


Good point - need the drive model number too...


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Updates are generally pushed out by DirecTV.
> 
> What version (and specific model HR24) do you have?
> 
> Good point - need the drive model number too...


There ought to be some way for us to get the word out that without the proper model numbers of HRs, HDDs, enclosures, etc., we just can't answer the questions asked. He might be using an EARS for all we know. That's a Green Caviar HDD too. And they are very problematic with the HRs.

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> There ought to be some way for us to get the word out that without the proper model numbers of HRs, HDDs, enclosures, etc., we just can't answer the questions asked. He might be using an EARS for all we know. That's a Green Caviar HDD too. And they are very problematic with the HRs.
> 
> Rich


True.

It would also be interesting to know if the external unit was unplugged and the unit was rebooted...do the symptoms continue...that would seem to point to something in the external unit somehow.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

Your troubles sound the same as mine. I doubt your external drive is the cause – my troubles started at about the same time. 

There are some models of drives that have issues – I’m sure Rich can help you there.

As for the firmware – you can’t force it… They haven’t even released a fix yet – hopefully soon – in the mean time a restart fixes it for some number of days (except for the audio trouble).

Let’s hope they don’t just ignore the troubles – I’m still waiting for the fix to make the HR22s work properly and that is going on 3 years now!


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> Your troubles sound the same as mine. I doubt your external drive is the cause - my troubles started at about the same time.


So without knowing the drive model (for known potential incompatibility) and if this happens with the internal drive (to see if it is isolated to the external setup), this can be diagnosed? Hardly.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> True.
> 
> It would also be interesting to know if the external unit was unplugged and the unit was rebooted...do the symptoms continue...that would seem to point to something in the external unit somehow.


Problem is that the restart will likely fix the problems - at least for a few days (or more) but the problem will return.....


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> So without knowing the drive model (for known potential incompatibility) and if this happens with the internal drive (to see if it is isolated to the external setup), this can be diagnosed? Hardly.


I guess you missed this:

"There are some models of drives that have issues - I'm sure Rich can help you there."


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> Problem is that the restart will likely *fix the problems* - at least for a few days (or more) but the problem will return.....


Fix or temporarily delay?

The bottom line is we don't have all the facts, do determining a root cause, or even educated speculation is impossible at this point.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> True.
> 
> It would also be interesting to know if the external unit was unplugged and the unit was rebooted...do the symptoms continue...that would seem to point to something in the external unit somehow.


Would seem to point that way, but not always. Usually, but not always. But the more info we get the less typing we have to do. My fingers are getting worn down to nubs. :lol:

Rich


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Fix or temporarily delay?
> 
> The bottom line is we don't have all the facts, do determining a root cause, or even educated speculation is impossible at this point.


Ok! - We get it&#8230;.

Call it what you want but I have 3 HR24-500s that started having these troubles about the same time. You have decided that I am the problem&#8230; I'm good with that.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Your troubles sound the same as mine. I doubt your external drive is the cause - my troubles started at about the same time.
> 
> There are some models of drives that have issues - I'm sure Rich can help you there.
> 
> ...


Ever the optimist, Mike! I doubt if D* is even concerned with the 22s now.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Problem is that the restart will likely fix the problems - at least for a few days (or more) but the problem will return.....


And the problem with that is that the problem might get worse. Gotta have patience.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Ok! - We get it&#8230;.
> 
> Call it what you want but I have 3 HR24-500s that started having these troubles about the same time. You have decided that I am the problem&#8230; I'm good with that.


I don't think he meant you were the problem. I'm having the same problem with mine and I'm sure we are not alone.

Rich


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

rich584 said:


> Ever the optimist, Mike! I doubt if D* is even concerned with the 22s now.
> 
> Rich


Bingo!:lol:

Yeah - the HR22s are likely as good as they'll ever be. That's why I forced them on the kids!

I'm sure sooner or later my remaining HR22s will die and get replaced - hopefully by then my luck will change and the HR24s will be tweaked and by some miracle they'll send me HR24s to replace them! How's that for optimistic!?

My suggestion to heelsmj (Please ignore this Mr. HDTVFAN) would be to verify that the model of drive is OK and then restart the box once a week until DirecTV figures it out - hopefully sooner rather than later.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

rich584 said:


> And the problem with that is that the problem might get worse. Gotta have patience.
> 
> Rich


Working on the patience! Just a real slap in the face after paying $600 for 3 of these to get away from the trouble only to have it return after a few months of bliss. I'll think happy thoughts for now - hopefully this is just a temporary set back.



rich584 said:


> I don't think he meant you were the problem. I'm having the same problem with mine and I'm sure we are not alone.
> 
> Rich


I think he knows there is something up - but because he loves me so much he has to poke at me!:lol: Can't blame him I guess!

As more and more people post we'll get more details but no doubt something is up with the firmware changes they made.


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## heelsmj (Mar 31, 2009)

The drive is a AV-GP WD20EVDS 2TB. As far as the type of HR-24 I believe its a 500. But I will have to confirm that and what version firmware I am running when I get home. I am at work now. A reboot does not seem to make any difference I tried that.

Thank you all for the help.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

heelsmj said:


> The drive is a AV-GP WD20EVDS 2TB. As far as the type of HR-24 I believe its a 500. But I will have to confirm that and what version firmware I am running when I get home. I am at work now. A reboot does not seem to make any difference I tried that.
> 
> Thank you all for the help.


That stinks... Did you reboot twice to clear the guide cache as suggested in other threads?

I rebooted two of mine twice to clear the guide and things did speed up - I'm not sure if they needed two reboots or not. The pauses came back after a while. I'll check the one I didn't reboot twice and and I'll try rebooting once this time to see if speeds things up with a single restart.

Rich - did you double-boot yours or just restart once?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Bingo!:lol:
> 
> Yeah - the HR22s are likely as good as they'll ever be. That's why I forced them on the kids!
> 
> ...


All we're looking for is more complete info regarding HRs and external HDDs and their enclosures. Kinda hard to figure out what's going with someone's setup without knowing what that setup entails.

Have you noticed any 22-100s being given to folks as replacements? I don't remember seeing any, but then I don't remember what I did a day ago, usually. Perhaps D* has given up on them too?

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

heelsmj said:


> The drive is a AV-GP WD20EVDS 2TB. As far as the type of HR-24 I believe its a 500. But I will have to confirm that and what version firmware I am running when I get home. I am at work now. A reboot does not seem to make any difference I tried that.
> 
> Thank you all for the help.


Good news and bad news. Good news first. You've got the best available HDD and the MX-1 is a good enclosure. Bad news: A couple suggestions I have might help. I have gotten MX-1s that were faulty. Antec is great about replacing defective enclosures. You might try to get a replacement and rule out the possibility of a bad enclosure. The other thing is it might just be normal to have the issues you're seeing at this time. The 24s are new and it took a long, long time to get the 20-700s stabilized. Patience might well be your best bet. If we get a new NR soon, and we always do, the whole thing might clear right up.

Another thing to think about is that the 24s are a lot more sensitive to reboots with external drives hooked up to them. The proper method for rebooting a 24 with an external device is to pull the power cords for the external device and the 24. Wait a minute or so and plug in the external device. Wait a bit and plug in the 24. That should be the ONLY way you should reboot. You should also do this after an NR or a random reboot. Don't use the Menu Restart with your external device hooked up. It won't turn off the external device and you'll definitely have problems.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> That stinks... Did you reboot twice to clear the guide cache as suggested in other threads?
> 
> I rebooted two of mine twice to clear the guide and things did speed up - I'm not sure if they needed two reboots or not. The pauses came back after a while. I'll check the one I didn't reboot twice and and I'll try rebooting once this time to see if speeds things up with a single restart.
> 
> Rich - did you double-boot yours or just restart once?


I tried the double reboot and it didn't help much and went right back rather quickly to where it was.

Rich


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## heelsmj (Mar 31, 2009)

rich584 said:


> Good news and bad news. Good news first. You've got the best available HDD and the MX-1 is a good enclosure. Bad news: A couple suggestions I have might help. I have gotten MX-1s that were faulty. Antec is great about replacing defective enclosures. You might try to get a replacement and rule out the possibility of a bad enclosure. The other thing is it might just be normal to have the issues you're seeing at this time. The 24s are new and it took a long, long time to get the 20-700s stabilized. Patience might well be your best bet. If we get a new NR soon, and we always do, the whole thing might clear right up.
> 
> Another thing to think about is that the 24s are a lot more sensitive to reboots with external drives hooked up to them. The proper method for rebooting a 24 with an external device is to pull the power cords for the external device and the 24. Wait a minute or so and plug in the external device. Wait a bit and plug in the 24. That should be the ONLY way you should reboot. You should also do this after an NR or a random reboot. Don't use the Menu Restart with your external device hooked up. It won't turn off the external device and you'll definitely have problems.
> 
> Rich


Thanks for the help. I knew I bought the right equipment as I am a Computer Engineer and did a lot of research on this forum before purchasing it. I agree with your assessment as far as patience and this might just be normal new product glitches. The only thing that makes me suspect something else might be going on is that everything worked perfectly for several months. It is just the last few weeks I am seeing these issues. With that being said what makes me think it is an overall issue with the HR-24 is other people on the forum having the same exact issues without using an external device or while using a different one. As far as the reboot again thanks to this forum I was aware of the proper reboot procedure with an external device and have always done it the way you described.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

heelsmj said:


> Thanks for the help. I knew I bought the right equipment as I am a Computer Engineer and did a lot of research on this forum before purchasing it. I agree with your assessment as far as patience and this might just be normal new product glitches. The only thing that makes me suspect something else might be going on is that everything worked perfectly for several months. It is just the last few weeks I am seeing these issues. With that being said what makes me think it is an overall issue with the HR-24 is other people on the forum having the same exact issues without using an external device or while using a different one. As far as the reboot again thanks to this forum I was aware of the proper reboot procedure with an external device and have always done it the way you described.


My 24-500 (the first one) worked really well until the first download of an NR, then there was another NR and my 24s started slowing up. I'm getting the same symptoms on my 24-200, now. Took a while for the 200 to start acting as the 500 does. Sometimes the effects of an NR are felt immediately and sometimes it takes a while for the symptoms to appear. I have no idea why this happens.

Rich


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

how many SL's do you have on the problem machines. 
wondering if high/close to limit causing database bogging.


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## heelsmj (Mar 31, 2009)

Not sure what SL's mean I am assuming it is a Season recording I have all 50 filled. Speaking of which why the hell am I limited to 50 with two TB of storage its crazy!


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## elixir26 (Mar 9, 2007)

I'm in the same boat. I have a Hr24 500 with a WD 2TB EADS in a Azio enclosure that is skippin' and hoppin' along. I rebooted from shutdown last night. This morning my hard drive is being scanned for errors. We are at 44% complete 64 errors found and 64 errors corrected. This set has been working flawlessly since May 5th until a couple weeks ago. I'm hoping the scan will fix what ails it.


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## David MacLeod (Jan 29, 2008)

heelsmj said:


> Not sure what SL's mean I am assuming it is a Season recording I have all 50 filled. Speaking of which why the hell am I limited to 50 with two TB of storage its crazy!


database limits to 50 due to performance issues...so...


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> Working on the patience! Just a real slap in the face after paying $600 for 3 of these to get away from the trouble only to have it return after a few months of bliss. I'll think happy thoughts for now - hopefully this is just a temporary set back.
> 
> As more and more people post we'll get more details but no doubt something is up with the firmware changes they made.


We have gone through these "new model" issues with every new model that substantially differed from previous models. When the 24 series hit the scene, many were downright giddy with the speed increases. They were dismissive of previous models. They advised turning installers away who didn't bring a 24 series unit.

Did anyone really expect the 24s to be different in the early stages than all the others, when they were introduced? Yes, they are faster, but just as certainly they are vulnerable to the same startup issues that all the other models have experienced. Spending 600 bucks and thinking this was going to avoid the very predictable early adopter problems that have surfaced every time on other units is the height of optimism.

So the only thing left (and that has largely worked in the past) is patience.

If anyone buys a new D* (perhaps any company's) DVR, the problems early on are virtually certain. The best predictor of future performance is past performance. $600 didn't buy you anything more than potential. Potentially, the 24 series could become downright outstanding. For now, they are nothing more than faster (most of the time), early product cycle boxes.

No one should have expected anything different, no matter what they paid.

(I'm not talking about what people think they have a right to expect, rather, what to expect based on what experience should have taught them.)

Two of my friends got 24 series boxes about three months ago (at my recommendation, but with the caveat that there would be "new model" issues that could run six months to a year). I see them weekly. Not a week goes by that I don't ask them how satisfied they are with the boxes. Both of them are very, very pleased...but they don't do anything fancy...I mean nothing, no home theater, nothing. All they do is record programs and play them back. They are completely oblivious to the issues discussed here.

They expected very little, and got very much. Most of us, on the other hand, expect a lot and can easily become frustrated with the myriad of startup issues that are legendary with all new models. Go figure.

The good news is, most of the obvious major issues do get fixed. It's all a matter of expectations and patience.


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

The ONLY Problem that I am having with my HR24-500 is the fact that it Switches from Digital to Analog and back and forth and the Volume usually is Louder when it is in the Analog Mode and it is not just when the station takes a commercial break.

I Love the Speed just Wish they would Fix the Audio Problem.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hasan-

I don’t expect perfection – especially right out the gate. I didn’t just jump in and buy three of these. I bought one with ‘hope’. After that one proved to be light years ahead of my HR22s for a couple of months I bought two more. That’s not to say they were perfect – I knew of the audio trouble and caller ID trouble but still much much better than my HR22s. A couple of months after that (first week in October) DirecTV took a step back and all three start having freezes and reboots.

I think it’s perfectly fair to ***** to and about DirecTV when they screw things up. I didn’t have a choice or any input on the firmware update that caused the grief. That is 100% on DirecTV.

Let’s hope the sudden update that has appeared today corrects the trouble and I’ll go back to just watching TV.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> The ONLY Problem that I am having with my HR24-500 is the fact that it Switches from Digital to Analog and back and forth and the Volume usually is Louder when it is in the Analog Mode and it is not just when the station takes a commercial break.
> 
> I Love the Speed just Wish they would Fix the Audio Problem.


I'm watching the _Yes Network_ and I have not had one audio dropout so far. Yesterday's show at this time (_The Mike Francesa Show_) was unwatchable on the 500 because of the audio dropouts. So far, so good. Not a good enough sample to be assured that my issues have cleared up, but right now it is definitely better.

I got the update on both the 24-500 and the 24-200.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

heelsmj said:


> Not sure what SL's mean I am assuming it is a Season recording I have all 50 filled. Speaking of which why the hell am I limited to 50 with two TB of storage its crazy!


This is where people do the wrong thing unintentionally. It's not just about the amount of storage you have in your home. You also need tuners to use that capacity and get the most out of it. You would have been better off with two HRs and two 1TB externals. That way you would have gotten the 2TBs of capacity and four tuners. And 100 Series Links to use. That 50 SL limit is plenty on a stock HR with a stock HDD. You're not the first to discover this, most of us that use externals did the same thing. If you're going to record a lot of content you need a lot of tuners to go along with large capacity HDDs.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> The ONLY Problem that I am having with my HR24-500 is the fact that it Switches from Digital to Analog and back and forth and the Volume usually is Louder when it is in the Analog Mode and it is not just when the station takes a commercial break.
> 
> I Love the Speed just Wish they would Fix the Audio Problem.


Just tried the Playlist on the 24-200 and it does seem to be better. Last night I was using the Playlist and it kept stalling and stacking remote commands. It still does that, but not nearly as bad as last night.

Of course, having eleven HRs on the Playlist is probably always gonna be a problem when it comes to finding something. Wish they'd come up with a Search function for the Playlist. I realize that with the Yellow button you can change the options on the Playlist, but a Search function would be a bigger help for those of us with multiple HRs.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> The ONLY Problem that I am having with my HR24-500 is the fact that it Switches from Digital to Analog and back and forth and the Volume usually is Louder when it is in the Analog Mode and it is not just when the station takes a commercial break.
> 
> I Love the Speed just Wish they would Fix the Audio Problem.


Been watching on the 500 for a half hour and not one audio dropout. Haven't tried any other channels.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> Wish they'd come up with a Search function for the Playlist. I realize that with the Yellow button you can change the options on the Playlist, but a Search function would be a bigger help for those of us with multiple HRs.
> Rich


AMEN!!! With my 7 DVRs and 13 TB of Storage Capacity I am getting Pages and Pages of Recordins and it would be Nice to be able to Select Which DVRs make up the UPL and to have a Search Feature included would be Very Nice.


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## heelsmj (Mar 31, 2009)

I have an HR-24 500 and I got a new firmware version last night at 3:25 version 0x416 anyone else get the push? I haven't seen any release about this anyone have any info? I hope this helps our issues. As far as expectations I have to say even with the issues the HR-24 is far and away better then the HR-22 I would never trade back.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> AMEN!!! With my 7 DVRs and 13 TB of Storage Capacity I am getting Pages and Pages of Recordins and it would be Nice to be able to Select Which DVRs make up the UPL and to have a Search Feature included would be Very Nice.


Great minds (and those with a lot of HRs)... :lol:

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

heelsmj said:


> I have an HR-24 500 and I got a new firmware version last night at 3:25 version 0x416 anyone else get the push? I haven't seen any release about this anyone have any info? I hope this helps our issues. As far as expectations I have to say even with the issues the HR-24 is far and away better then the HR-22 I would never trade back.


Patience, this will all unfold in the next few days. We'll get the discussion thread and the problems will be posted. I can see a change (for the better) in my 24-200 already.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

heelsmj said:


> I have an HR-24 500 and I got a new firmware version last night at 3:25 version 0x416 anyone else get the push? I haven't seen any release about this anyone have any info? I hope this helps our issues. As far as expectations I have to say even with the issues the HR-24 is far and away better then the HR-22 I would never trade back.


Yes, there is a Thread on it here already. Look around and you will see it.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> Yes, there is a Thread on it here already. Look around and you will see it.


...and a number of folks report no further audio issues with this update. If you still have them...maybe its time to replace all that expensive audio component hardware with something less costly that actually works.... !rolling


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> hasan-
> 
> I don't expect perfection - especially right out the gate. I didn't just jump in and buy three of these. I bought one with 'hope'. After that one proved to be light years ahead of my HR22s for a couple of months I bought two more. That's not to say they were perfect - I knew of the audio trouble and caller ID trouble but still much much better than my HR22s. A couple of months after that (first week in October) DirecTV took a step back and all three start having freezes and reboots.
> 
> ...


I wasn't disputing any of your points, just noting how perfectly parallel your experience has been to what we all went through with every model (that was substantially different) in the past.

I don't think they took a step back. I think they took the exact same steps they have taken with all previous new models. That was my only point. I wish there were a better way to describe it, but I sure don't see anything in the 24 series process that differs from every previous model.

I certainly wouldn't try to take away from your right to complain. My only point is that in similar circumstances (and I've been there several times, just not with the 24 series), I learned that this is how it goes with these boxes. It always has gone this way, and I don't expect it to be any different in the future.

It doesn't make it right. It doesn't make it fair, it doesn't make it fun (except for a few of us, who enjoy the intrigue). The process has been utterly consistent from day one. No one should be surprised, and as a *caveat for the next "I just gotta have it, and all the other boxes are junk" mentality, no one in full possession of their faculties should (realistically) expect this to change in the future.*

There ain't no free lunch. We actually have to pay for as much indigestion as we tolerate, or ....get over it and enjoy what we can out of what we have. It really is that simple.

We keep reporting, we keep demanding, we keep helping as we can. That is all good. All the rest is up to us, as far as how much we stew in our own juices, knowing full well *precisely* what to expect.

I'm *very* sympathetic with what the 24 series users are going through. I've been there myself. Some would say I'm jaded. Others would say, realistic. In any case, warts and all, I'm thoroughly enjoying the units I have. I would like to see them improved, but I'm not going to wager my sense of well being or mood against it.

Hasn't anyone read "The Myth of Sisyphus" ? Substitute the DVR for the rock, and it's a perfect fit.


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## Barry in Conyers (Jan 14, 2008)

hasan,

No disagreement with what you said, *but it does not have to be that way.*

A DirecTV DVR is basically a Linux computer with a couple of digital tuners.

My smartphone is a Linux computer with a dual band digital cellular transmitter and receiver, a Wifi transmitter and receiver, a Bluetooth transmitter and receiver, a GPS receiver, a FM receiver, a flux gate compass and a high resolution touch screen crammed into a tiny package and running all sorts of applications on a minuscule power source. Despite being much more complex than a DirecTV DVR, it has never locked up, never pixelated, never brrrp'ed, never required restarting, never done anything but work as intended and advertised.

New products do not have to be bug infested. That is a symptom of failing to identify and / or correct problems before releasing the product. DirecTV can do better if they want to.

Just my opinion, YMMV.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Barry in Conyers said:


> *A DirecTV DVR is basically a Linux computer with a couple of digital tuners.*


True. Then again...it has to manage exponential data and data relationships well beyond anything a smartphone could ever wish to handle...


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Barry in Conyers said:


> hasan,
> 
> No disagreement with what you said, *but it does not have to be that way.*
> 
> ...


A lot of us have made that same point, but D* does what it does and is very successful with the way they do it. Think of a major league baseball team that depends on putting fannies in the seats to exist financially. (I'm thinking of the Mets.) They don't get the seats filled up, they panic and go out and get good ballplayers to make their team competitive. But, let those seats be filled, season after season, with one bad team after another, and nothing will change (this actually happened). Right now D* is on the top of the heap. Why change the way they do business now? Let a few million subs opt out each quarter for a year or two and you'd probably see better HRs or the same HRs we have now running perfectly. But D* keeps gaining subs and their is no incentive to change things.

Rich


----------



## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hasan-

I don’t necessarily disagree but I do hope they do a better job with the HR24s than earlier models. My HR22s still have problems. Please don’t suggest that it will be OK for the HR24 problems of today to still be here 3 years from now. Please!:eek2:

The sad thing is that it looks like at least some of the trouble introduced to my HR24s with the update earlier this month is still present. I scrolled through the playlist a few times this morning and it looks like the pauses are starting to come back….


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

Mike Greer said:


> hasan-
> 
> I don't necessarily disagree but I do hope they do a better job with the HR24s than earlier models. My HR22s still have problems. Please don't suggest that it will be OK for the HR24 problems of today to still be here 3 years from now. Please!:eek2:
> 
> *The sad thing is that it looks like at least some of the trouble introduced to my HR24s *with the update earlier this month is still present. I scrolled through the playlist a few times this morning and it looks like the pauses are starting to come back&#8230;.


The HR24-500's have been reported by posters to have 90% of any of the issues - the -100 and -200 brethren have *almost* no such problems.

The fact that the -500 is the only device with a different (non-Broadcom) processor in it is more than coincidence. They're working hard on correcting the -500 issues....rest assured, especially when its easier to isolate the potential focus.


----------



## dsm (Jul 11, 2004)

heelsmj said:


> I have read many threads about people with similar issues to mine with the HR-24. It will freeze for 10-15 seconds and any keys pressed during that freeze are "saved" and then executed consecutively when it comes back. Another issue is long delays from pressing play on an item in my play list and the item actually playing. My final issue is audio cut outs. This happens on recorded items as well as live items. There will be a slight hiccup for a fraction of a second where the audio drops and then it comes back. I have had this receiver for around 4 months. There were no issues until a few weeks ago. I have it running a 2 TB WD Green drive in an Antec MX-1 enclosure with a Trip-Lite eSata cable. I was thinking that the slowness might be related to the drive filling up (38% Free) and it just can't handle the sheer size of the playlist. However now that I am reading all the other issues im not so sure. How many people out there with issues with their HR-24 are using an eSata enclosure? Feedback, thoughts? Can this be causing the issue or is there just a problem with the design of the receiver?


My HR23 (no esata) got into this same freeze issue a few days ago. Very annoying and my patience is short so I rebooted. I've got other hangs after a long pause of live tv happening on an HR20-700. I really think the latest software release introduced several new bugs.


----------



## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> hasan-
> 
> I don't necessarily disagree but I do hope they do a better job with the HR24s than earlier models. My HR22s still have problems. Please don't suggest that it will be OK for the HR24 problems of today to still be here 3 years from now. Please!:eek2:
> 
> The sad thing is that it looks like at least some of the trouble introduced to my HR24s with the update earlier this month is still present. I scrolled through the playlist a few times this morning and it looks like the pauses are starting to come back&#8230;.


I would never suggest it's "OK"...it isn't. All I do is try to deal with reality and not set myself up for any more frustration than absolutely necessary.


----------



## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Barry in Conyers said:


> hasan,
> 
> No disagreement with what you said, *but it does not have to be that way.*
> Just my opinion, YMMV.


I don't disagree. It's not that it has to be this way, it is certain, however, that this is the way it is now, this is the way it has been from the beginning, and my bet is that it will remain so in the future.

The rest is all about our coping mechanisms.


----------



## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

I am having the exact same issue as the original poster, and am also using a Western Digital AV-GP WD20EVDS 2TB. The description said it was made specifically for streaming video devices such as cable DVR's.

I hope there's a fix soon. We have recorded a lot of stuff since we got our HR-24 and I'd hate to lose it all just to get a new drive.


----------



## WheezerTheGeezer (Sep 23, 2010)

I gave up on my HR24 after several firmware downloads that never corrected the freezing problem (among others).
DirecTV tech came out and swapped it with an HR23. No problems at all with this back-level box.


----------



## bondheli (Dec 31, 2009)

I am also having this issue on both my hr24's with WD20EVDS external drives. Worked fine for months and then just a few weeks ago it started with the 10-15 second lag/delays.

I decided to do a little investigating. I reset my dvr2 and removed the external hard drive. I played around with it for 10 minutes and could not get it to stutter/lag (it is possible that the reset alone cleared the problem temporally but that may be moot). *I then proceeded to play shows from my dvr1 on my dvr2 and got no stuttering or lag issues at all.* If it was strictly an issue of working with an external hard drive then dvr1 should not have been able to stream to dvr2 without the same issue occurring.

After that test I restarted dvr2 and plugged the external hard drive back in. I immediately had the same stuttering so the restart did not temporarily fix the issue.

Also, another thing to point out is that I experience the the lag/delays while browsing the guide or list and the video playback of a prerecorded show continues to play without a hitch in the video playback window.

With those bits of knowledge I am forced to conclude that the external hard drives and/or the streaming capability aren't at least directly responsible the stuttering/delays. I think they probably pushed out a bad update a few weeks back without testing it on receivers with external hard drives first.


----------



## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

Exactly the issue I'm having, yes. The video continues to play fine. But this 10-15 second freeze doesn't only happen on the menus -- sometimes I'll hit fast-forward and then realize I can't stop. So I'm fast-forwarding half way into the show, and then finally the HR-24 starts responding again and only then can I rewind.

I'm about ready to try another hard drive and just lose all my recordings, unless someone knows that this is being worked on? Any way we can find out if this is being worked on?


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

bondheli said:


> I am also having this issue on both my hr24's with WD20EVDS external drives. Worked fine for months and then just a few weeks ago it started with the 10-15 second lag/delays.


There have been lots of Post about Problems with EVDS Drives particularly when it comes to using it as an External Drive.


----------



## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

richierich said:


> There have been lots of Post about Problems with EVDS Drives particularly when it comes to using it as an External Drive.


Mostly with 24 series and that may be firmware related. The other sat boxes seem to do very well with the EVDS drives. My HR20-700 is using a 2 TB EVDS drive recommended by rich584 (with the Thermaltake Dock), and it works perfectly. No issues whatsoever, no overheating, no noise, just plays away.

Of course eSATA is not supported, so we're kinda shooting in the dark now, aren't we?


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

hasan said:


> *Mostly with 24 series and that may be firmware related.* The other sat boxes seem to do very well with the EVDS drives. My HR20-700 is using a 2 TB EVDS drive recommended by rich584 (with the Thermaltake Dock), and it works perfectly. No issues whatsoever, no overheating, no noise, just plays away.
> 
> Of course eSATA is not supported, so we're kinda shooting in the dark now, aren't we?


Yup...or processor-related...or controller-related...but the HR24's are indeed the ones not caring for the EDVS.

I seem to recall a number of folks having *no* problems with HR20 and HR21 units with those drives.


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hasan said:


> Mostly with 24 series and that may be firmware related. The other sat boxes seem to do very well with the EVDS drives. My HR20-700 is using a 2 TB EVDS drive recommended by rich584 (with the Thermaltake Dock), and it works perfectly. No issues whatsoever, no overheating, no noise, just plays away.


Agree, I do. I think the 24s are much more sensitive than the 20-700s. I know that I treated my first 24-500 as if it were a 20-700, and I ended up having to have it replaced. I kinda think the problems are more related to the 24's sensitivity than the EVDS drives being bad. I say that based only on my experience with that one 500.

For instance, with a 20-700, you can get away with using the Menu Restart with an MX-1 or a TT on it with an EVDS drive, but if you do that with a 24 you risk losing the 24. Same thing with an RBR. Since I lost the first 24, I've been very careful how I reboot the 24s, each having a TT with an EVDS drive on it.



> Of course eSATA is not supported, so we're kinda shooting in the dark now, aren't we?


Well, I still think we've got a better grasp of how and what externals work than D* does. And I hope it stays that way. I'd rather continue on my way using the best HDDs and enclosures that I know of, than to be told what to use. So, in a way, we are the external and internal drives' support system.

Both my 200 and 500 seem to be very comfortable with their external EVDS HDDs now that I know what I did wrong with the first 500. And the 20-700s just keep on truckin' along.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Yup...or processor-related...or controller-related...but the HR24's are indeed the ones not caring for the EDVS.
> 
> I seem to recall a number of folks having *no* problems with HR20 and HR21 units with those drives.


I think once everyone understands how the increased sensitivity of the 24s needs to be taken into consideration when using an external drive, we'll see the "problems" with the EVDS drives go away. While I caused the first 500 to fail the second one is working very well with the SAME EVDS external drive. Sometimes you have to admit "operator failure" is the cause of the problems.

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> I think once everyone understands how the increased sensitivity of the 24s needs to be taken into consideration when using an external drive, we'll see the "problems" with the EVDS drives go away. While I caused the first 500 to fail the second one is working very well with the SAME EVDS external drive. *Sometimes you have to admit "operator failure" is the cause of the problems.*
> Rich


True.

Think that'll ever happen?


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> True.
> 
> Think that'll ever happen?


People do hate to admit that they cause problems. I worked with an EE once who told me to just stay off to the side and keep my mouth shut while he programmed a chiller. After two or three days of keeping quiet and watching him struggle, I finally asked him why the Start button wasn't illuminated. We hit the Start button, the chiller started right up and he finished the programming in about an hour. I've got a lot of stories like that. People just don't want to take responsibility for their actions. The EE did have the grace to apologize to me and we never had a problem working together again.

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> People do hate to admit that they cause problems. I worked with an EE once who told me to just stay off to the side and keep my mouth shut while he programmed a chiller. After two or three days of keeping quiet and watching him struggle, I finally asked him why the Start button wasn't illuminated. We hit the Start button, the chiller started right up and he finished the programming in about an hour. I've got a lot of stories like that. People just don't want to take responsibility for their actions. The EE did have the grace to apologize to me and we never had a problem working together again.
> 
> Rich


For sure.

If I had a nickel for every time a problem was caused by a cable not plugged in or connected properly, or else plugged in to the wrong place...I'd be rich.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> For sure.
> 
> If I had a nickel for every time a problem was caused by a cable not plugged in or connected properly, or else plugged in to the wrong place...I'd be rich.


My union president brought his hedge trimmer and extension cord to work one day and asked me to fix his trimmer. I took the trimmer off the extension cord and plugged it into a wall socket and turned it on and it worked perfectly. He couldn't understand how that was possible until I picked up his extension cord and found the spot where he ran the trimmer thru it. He was quite chagrined. And this is a really smart guy. Happens. If I had a nickel for every time it happened I'd be...

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> My union president brought his hedge trimmer and extension cord to work one day and asked me to fix his trimmer. I took the trimmer off the extension cord and plugged it into a wall socket and turned it on and it worked perfectly. He couldn't understand how that was possible until I picked up his extension cord and found the spot where he ran the trimmer thru it. He was quite chagrined. And this is a really smart guy. Happens. If I had a nickel for every time it happened I'd be...
> 
> Rich


!rolling


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## adamson (Nov 9, 2007)

Thought I would report how my new external drive works with the HR24-500. I purchased a Western Digital My Book AV DVR Expander, model #WDBABT0010HBK. Absolutely no issues, HR24 is as zippy as day one without the external drive. No studder, freeze whatsoever.

Did I not read somewhere anything over 1TB is not supported? Just wondering, Im no expert as some here.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

upmichigan said:


> Thought I would report how my new external drive works with the HR24-500. I purchased a Western Digital My Book AV DVR Expander, model #WDBABT0010HBK. Absolutely no issues, HR24 is as zippy as day one without the external drive. No studder, freeze whatsoever.
> 
> Did I not read somewhere anything over 1TB is not supported? Just wondering, Im no expert as some here.


I've haven't tried using a 1.5 or 2TB with several models, but I can assure you that the 20-700s, 21-700s, 24-200s and 24-500s will work very well with 2TB externals. Never tried a 21-200, but I can't imagine it not working with the large internals either. And if they'll support an external that big, they'll easily take an internal drive that large.

The rest I've never tried or wouldn't waste my money on.

Rich


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## bondheli (Dec 31, 2009)

richierich said:


> There have been lots of Post about Problems with EVDS Drives particularly when it comes to using it as an External Drive.


That doesn't explain why my two hr24's I've owned stutter free since June both decided to start doing this at the exact same time.



rich584 said:


> I think once everyone understands how the increased sensitivity of the 24s needs to be taken into consideration when using an external drive, we'll see the "problems" with the EVDS drives go away. While I caused the first 500 to fail the second one is working very well with the SAME EVDS external drive. Sometimes you have to admit "operator failure" is the cause of the problems.


Well that's rich . But as I said above it does not explain why heelsmj, Mike Greer, elixir26, dsm, SPG900NY, and I all had no problems for months then all got the same symptoms around the same time period. What does explain it though is a bad or malicious firmware update.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

bondheli said:


> That doesn't explain why my two hr24's I've owned stutter free since June both decided to start doing this at the exact same time.


The NRs we have gotten since June are the explanation. Most NRs cause problems with some HRs.



> Well that's rich . But as I said above it does not explain why heelsmj, Mike Greer, elixir26, dsm, SPG900NY, and I all had no problems for months then all got the same symptoms around the same time period. What does explain it though is a bad or malicious firmware update.


First, *Mike Greer* is cursed by the Gods of D*.  (Sorry Mike, I just couldn't resist.)

Aside from that, how do you handle rebooting the 24s and which model 24s are you having the problems with? Both my 500 and 200 are running smoothly and I haven't had a problem since I wrecked that first 500. That doesn't explain away your problems, but some more info might help. Bear in mind that NRs are usually not without problems. My first 500 was working very well until the first NR and it was a downhill trip from that point on. And what I did certainly didn't help it get better.

Rich


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## bondheli (Dec 31, 2009)

I don't know what NRs are but just an update, the lagging seems to be getting worse by the day. I hope dtv fixes this soon, the dvr's are becoming almost unusable.


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

Let me know when it improves. I was about to swap my HR20-700 with D* approved eSATA, but I'll hold off now.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

bondheli said:


> I don't know what NRs are but just an update, the lagging seems to be getting worse by the day. I hope dtv fixes this soon, the dvr's are becoming almost unusable.


An NR is a National Release of firmware. Don't honestly know what the difference is between firmware and software.

Do you have and use MRV?

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> Let me know when it improves. I was about to swap my HR20-700 with D* approved eSATA, but I'll hold off now.


What is a "D* approved eSATA"? Unless something's changed, D* only "suggested" two eSATAs and certainly doesn't support them. And one of them doesn't seem to work with every model of the HRs.

If there's nothing wrong with that 20-700, you already have the most reliable HR (at the moment). And it's almost as fast as the 24s. While I don't have any problems with my two 24s, one a 500 and the other a 200, I see that many others do and you might want to wait until D* gets all the 24s as stable as the 20-700s. Time and patience.

Rich


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

rich - The family was interested in 3D, something the HR20-700 can't do.


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> rich - The family was interested in 3D, something the HR20-700 can't do.


Yup....an important point.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> rich - The family was interested in 3D, something the HR20-700 can't do.


I think it can if it is used with MRV thru a 24. That sounds confusing. Here's another way to look at it: You record the 3D show on your 20-700 and access that program with a 24 or any of the other models that support 3D thru MRV and the program plays in 3D. I think that will work. Shame to just chuck a good 20-700. (I'm kinda biased towards the 20-700s.)

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> I think it can if it is used with MRV thru a 24. That sounds confusing. Here's another way to look at it: You record the 3D show on your 20-700 and access that program with a 24 or any of the other models that support 3D thru MRV and the program plays in 3D. I think that will work. Shame to just chuck a good 20-700. (I'm kinda biased towards the 20-700s.)
> 
> Rich


Not to worry....I loved my 2 HR20-700's until they both got replaced with newer stuff. Sometimes we have to say goodbye to the kids when they grow up...


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not to worry....I loved my 2 HR20-700's until they both got replaced with newer stuff. Sometimes we have to say goodbye to the kids when they grow up...


Can't do it, hanging on to my good ole 20-700s for as long as they work. I've got eight of them and they are still the best of the bunch, I think. Can't comment on the 24s yet. Too new. New NRs coming to them, Doug says.

Was I right about playing the 3D programs thru MRV on the 24s?

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> Can't do it, hanging on to my good ole 20-700s for as long as they work. I've got eight of them and they are still the best of the bunch, I think. Can't comment on the 24s yet. Too new. New NRs coming to them, Doug says.
> 
> Was I right about playing the 3D programs thru MRV on the 24s?
> 
> Rich


They can record, but not play locally...MRV is the cure.

Let thy children go... :lol:


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> They can record, but not play locally...MRV is the cure.


I actually find it to be a bit of a curse. That UPL is horrible. When May rolls around, I can't even begin to imagine how long mine will be. I've actually stopped using it. 

Rich


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## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> I actually find it to be a bit of a curse. That UPL is horrible. When May rolls around, I can't even begin to imagine how long mine will be. I've actually stopped using it.
> 
> Rich


Not yet here....I find it manageable.

Having seen a few folks setups in person where they have 4,5,6, 7, even 8 HD DVRS on WHDS/MRV...it does get to be quite a list. The reality is some of us with all those units are the exception and not the rule - most folks have 1 or 2 HD DVRS...not like us recording fanatics. :lol:


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Not yet here....I find it manageable.
> 
> Having seen a few folks setups in person where they have 4,5,6, 7, even 8 HD DVRS on WHDS/MRV...it does get to be quite a list. The reality is some of us with all those units are the exception and not the rule - most folks have 1 or 2 HD DVRS...not like us recording fanatics. :lol:


I've got eleven HRs activated and on MRV and the list, as I type this, is unmanageable. Even for housekeeping. When I try to go thru it to clean up shows we've watched I delete all the programs and then it takes me back up to the top of the Playlist again. It's actually easier to clean up the HRs one by one.

Rich


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## wilbur_the_goose (Aug 16, 2006)

I have 2 HR20-700's and 1 H24, and MRV works great.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

rich584 said:


> I've got eleven HRs activated and on MRV and the list, as I type this, is unmanageable. Even for housekeeping. When I try to go thru it to clean up shows we've watched I delete all the programs and then it takes me back up to the top of the Playlist again. It's actually easier to clean up the HRs one by one.
> 
> Rich


I can understand that...but of course...your setup represents perhaps 1/100th of 1% of the general population using MRV.

For the mainstream folks...its just fine.

That's probably what drives where it sits on the priority list in terms of "important changes"....I'm just sayin'


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I actually find it to be a bit of a curse. That UPL is horrible. When May rolls around, I can't even begin to imagine how long mine will be. I've actually stopped using it.
> 
> Rich


That is why I asked for a Selectable (by DVR) UPL so we could keep the UPL more manageable. And I hate deleting a program in my UPL and then it takes me to the top of the UPL. I want it to leave me where I was at so I can continue my Maintenance.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> That is why I asked for a Selectable (by DVR) UPL so we could keep the UPL more manageable. And I hate deleting a program in my UPL and then it takes me to the top of the UPL. I want it to leave me where I was at so I can continue my Maintenance.


Of course you would be the other 1/100th of 1% of the user base.... :lol:


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> Of course you would be the other 1/100th of 1% of the user base.... :lol:


Hey, I am One of Directv's Best Customer if you look at my Directv Bill so give me my Selectable UPL. We had it at one time so it is easy to put the code back in.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> Hey, I am One of Directv's Best Customer if you look at my Directv Bill so give me my Selectable UPL. We had it at one time so it is easy to put the code back in.


I'll let Mike White know when we go out to dinner this weekend...


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> I'll let Mike White know when we go out to dinner this weekend...


Hey can you introduce Mike to me when we get to Vegas.


----------



## hdtvfan0001 (Jul 28, 2004)

richierich said:


> Hey can you introduce Mike to me when we get to Vegas.


!rolling

I'm going as an Undercover Customer.


----------



## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

OK, so if it's operator error, and the EVDS drives have an issue with the 24-500's, is there a known good 2TB drive that we know works flawlessly with this model? At this point, it has gotten unmanageable enough that I'm willing to ditch hundreds of hours of saved shows just to be done with these issues.

There's nothing like watching a sporting event on time-delay and hit the FF button to go through a commercial, and suddenly it's FF-ing through the next 30 minutes because the unit has stopped responding for 10-15 seconds. 

I'm tempted to download the "cutting edge" release tomorrow night to see if they addressed this at all. I did report it in the issues section.


----------



## bondheli (Dec 31, 2009)

SPG900NY said:


> the EVDS drives have an issue with the 24-500's, is there a known good 2TB drive that we know works flawlessly with this model?


I would be curious about this too, but seeing as how this problem didn't show up for me until 5 months after ownership, I doubt anyone can say for sure.



SPG900NY said:


> There's nothing like watching a sporting event on time-delay and hit the FF button to go through a commercial, and suddenly it's FF-ing through the next 30 minutes because the unit has stopped responding for 10-15 seconds.


Just in case you don't know, there is a 30 second slip or skip function that allows you to skip all the commercials with just a few button presses instead of fast forwarding. It is the button with an arrow pointing to a vertical line just above and to the right of the play button on the remote.


----------



## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

SPG900NY said:


> OK, so if it's Operator Error, and the EVDS drives have an issue with the 24-500's, is there a known good 2TB drive that we know works flawlessly with this model?


I have several 2 TB WD20EADS Models and they Work Flawlessly but of course they are Installed Internally on my Owned HR2Xs.


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hdtvfan0001 said:


> I can understand that...but of course...your setup represents perhaps 1/100th of 1% of the general population using MRV.
> 
> For the mainstream folks...its just fine.
> 
> That's probably what drives where it sits on the priority list in terms of "important changes"....I'm just sayin'


I know. I can cope. Kinda wish they'd take those of us that have multiple HRs into consideration before they come out with something new. Maybe start with a system that would satisfy the most demanding customers and work down instead of feeding the Great American Herd and working up.

All that work, and I don't use it. 

Rich


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

wilbur_the_goose said:


> I have 2 HR20-700's and 1 H24, and MRV works great.


So you could get 3D from your 20-700s thru your H24, couldn't you?

Rich


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> That is why I asked for a Selectable (by DVR) UPL so we could keep the UPL more manageable. And I hate deleting a program in my UPL and then it takes me to the top of the UPL. I want it to leave me where I was at so I can continue my Maintenance.


I'm not even using my MRV anymore, even for housekeeping. I knew the UPL was gonna be a problem going in, but I just had to have it. Gotta be careful what you wish for!!!

Rich


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> Hey, I am One of Directv's Best Customer if you look at my Directv Bill so give me my Selectable UPL. We had it at one time so it is easy to put the code back in.


I knew that. Don't understand why D* did what they did. Puzzling and disappointing.

Rich


----------



## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

SPG900NY said:


> OK, so if it's operator error, and the EVDS drives have an issue with the 24-500's, is there a known good 2TB drive that we know works flawlessly with this model? At this point, it has gotten unmanageable enough that I'm willing to ditch hundreds of hours of saved shows just to be done with these issues.
> 
> There's nothing like watching a sporting event on time-delay and hit the FF button to go through a commercial, and suddenly it's FF-ing through the next 30 minutes because the unit has stopped responding for 10-15 seconds.
> 
> I'm tempted to download the "cutting edge" release tomorrow night to see if they addressed this at all. I did report it in the issues section.


I've never had that problem with either my 500 or my 200 and both have 2TB EVDS HDDs. But, remember, I did have all sorts of problems with my first 500 because I didn't treat it properly and it had nothing to do with the EVDS drive. That same EVDS 2TB is still working well with the replacement 500. I'm sure the problems I had weren't caused by the HDD. When I reverted to the internal drive, I still saw the same wacky things happen. I really think I corrupted the flash drive in some manner. And your issues sound like they have nothing to do with any HDD. Just an opinion based on my experiences. I think the best cure you can hope for is to trade the 24 in for another one. I just can't see an HDD, any HDD causing the problems you report.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I'm not even using my MRV anymore, even for housekeeping. I knew the UPL was gonna be a problem going in, but I just had to have it. Gotta be careful what you wish for!!!
> 
> Rich


I don't know why you just don't take a couple of DVRs out of your Mix by not allowing them to Share Their Recordings so they don't show up in your UPL.

I don't have to have every one of my DVRs in My UPL so I Elect to exclude a couple of them to Keep the UPL Manageable and then I go to those rooms and Manually do the Housekeeping on them.

Later I may decide to bring them back into the Fold so to speak but for now I just leave the ones that I Want To See in the UPL. I Still Would Love To Have A Selectable UPL so I could change it from time to time as I perform Maintenance Procedures or whether I am using it for Viewing a Recording!!!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> I don't know why you just don't take a couple of DVRs out of your Mix by not allowing them to Share Their Recordings so they don't show up in your UPL.


I've been told that the best way to do that was to pull the Ethernet cable from the MRV dongle on the HR you want to exclude. I've been considering it, but I've been busy solving my Roku problem the last few days. Finally got that fixed and will now consider pulling the cord on several HRs to make the UPL a bit more usable. If that's even possible.



> I Still Would Love To Have A Selectable UPL so I could change it from time to time as I perform Maintenance Procedures or whether I am using it for Viewing a Recording!!!


That's what I want to see. Don't see why folks with +$200 a month bills should have these problems, you'd think D* would do everything they could to keep us happy. But...

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I've been told that the best way to do that was to pull the Ethernet cable from the MRV dongle on the HR you want to exclude.
> 
> That's what I want to see. Don't see why folks with +$200 a month bills should have these problems, you'd think D* would do everything they could to keep us happy. But...
> 
> Rich


All you have to do is Select Menu, then Parental, Favs & Setup, then System Setup, then Whole-Home, then Select "Share Playlist" and then Select "NO" to tell it Not To Share It's Recordings with the other DVRs/Receivers. It's Simple.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> All you have to do is Select Menu, then Parental, Favs & Setup, then System Setup, then Whole-Home, then Select "Share Playlist" and then Select "NO" to tell it Not To Share It's Recordings with the other DVRs/Receivers. It's Simple.


Yup, I know how to do that, but the advice I got was from someone who's advice I usually follow to the letter. Not that I don't follow your advice. And appreciate it.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> Yup, I know how to do that, but the advice I got was from someone who's advice I usually follow to the letter. Not that I don't follow your advice. And appreciate it.
> 
> Rich


Just an Easy Way to do it and then later on be able to easily go back and turn it back on if you decide you want to.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> Just an Easy Way to do it and then later on be able to easily go back and turn it back on if you decide you want to.


I'm just so disgusted with the UPL...

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> I'm just so disgusted with the UPL...
> 
> Rich


And what makes me Mad is that it would be so Easy to put back the code in place to give us a Selectable Unified Playlist which would make everyone Happy.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> And what makes me Mad is that it would be so Easy to put back the code in place to give us a Selectable Unified Playlist which would make everyone Happy.


Get the impression that nobody at D* cares? And I know the blame for this monstrosity is fully on the shoulders of the folks at D*.

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

I even spoke to a Senior Engineer Manager who job is was to be responsible for the Development of DVRs/Receivers and 2010 CES last year and explained my need to him and he agreed and still nothing has happened.

If I see him again this year at 2011 CES I am going to grill him on this issue and why they don't address it.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> I even spoke to a Senior Engineer Manager who job is was to be responsible for the Development of DVRs/Receivers and 2010 CES last year and explained my need to him and he agreed and still nothing has happened.
> 
> If I see him again this year at 2011 CES I am going to grill him on this issue and why they don't address it.


Go get him!!!

Ricn


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

Could you ask him to get my HR24-500s back to working at least as well as they did before the ‘updates’ the first week of October? I can’t believe I blew $600 to get away from the HR22s only to have a few months of HR24 bliss and then slapped back to DirecTV reality.

I don’t think the ‘freezes’ being talked about here are only connected to external drives. I don’t have external drives and I have 3 HR24-500s that will just stop responding for 5-15 seconds.

This sucks.


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## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

Mike, you're saying you have the SAME problem we're having, but with NO external drives? Say, you're scrolling through the playlist and the unit just freezes for 5-15 seconds and then when it starts responding again it clicks through all the commands you pressed in the meantime?


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## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

rich584 said:


> I've never had that problem with either my 500 or my 200 and both have 2TB EVDS HDDs. But, remember, I did have all sorts of problems with my first 500 because I didn't treat it properly and it had nothing to do with the EVDS drive.


How did you "not treat it properly?



> That same EVDS 2TB is still working well with the replacement 500. I'm sure the problems I had weren't caused by the HDD. When I reverted to the internal drive, I still saw the same wacky things happen. I really think I corrupted the flash drive in some manner. And your issues sound like they have nothing to do with any HDD. Just an opinion based on my experiences. I think the best cure you can hope for is to trade the 24 in for another one. I just can't see an HDD, any HDD causing the problems you report.


Ugh. So what would I tell DirecTV? I assume I will lose all my recordings anyway because they're locked to the receiver?


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## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

Hmm... There are different manufacturers for the HR-24's, right? I wonder if all of us who are having problems are using one from the same manufacturer? Any way to tell who made mine?


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> Could you ask him to get my HR24-500s back to working at least as well as they did before the 'updates' the first week of October? I can't believe I blew $600 to get away from the HR22s only to have a few months of HR24 bliss and then slapped back to DirecTV reality.
> 
> I don't think the 'freezes' being talked about here are only connected to external drives. I don't have external drives and I have 3 HR24-500s that will just stop responding for 5-15 seconds.
> 
> This sucks.


...and was entirely predictable. So, while the "HR24 is god" bandwagon was raging a few weeks ago (don't let them give you that old junk, they should give us all HR24 series, don't accept it, cancel your order, tell the truck to go home....ad nauseum), many of us were waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Sure enough, it did.

Curiously, my HR20-700 continues to perk right along without stopping 15 seconds to figure out where it is. Same for the HR21-100 and HR20-100. Guess this old junk that I should have upgraded from isn't quite as "junkie" as the "I gotta have the latest and everything else is junk" crowd thought. It ain't perfect, but the stuff works pretty darn well and allows me to enjoy recorded programming, when the holes in the audio aren't happening.

All the snarkiness aside, the big picture of HR series boxes has not changed. One step forward (speed), two steps back (halting/OTA issues with some/eSATA issues with others), etc.

This is how it has always been with these boxes, and being that the best predictor of future performance is past performance, it is just as likely to stay this way. Small steps, incremental improvement in some areas, problems in others...this has been the characteristic of the HR boxes. It is "normal" development. I'm not saying like it, I'm not saying "take it", I'm not saying be satisfied. I am saying *don't be surprised by it*.

....and next time, don't bow down to the false god of "latest is greatest". The HR24s are going to become very, very good. They are far from that at the moment. Anyone who uncritically jumped on the 24 series bandwagon is now paying the price that a longer term view would have warned them about.

You said it perfectly in your post, "slapped back to DirecTV reality".

As an example: how long ago was it that we traded brrrrrpy audio for holes in the audio? How many posts? How many denials (early on)? In the beginning the audio was fine. New developments were undertaken that resulted in brrrrppps. Band aid: replace brrrrrp with "silence". The problem is a nasty one to fix. It's still there in all its glory. (and most likely cannot be fixed by firmware updates, at least one facet of the problem is not box related.)

New customers have an excuse. People who have been on these forums should have known better. If everyone can get past their disappointments and completely unrealistic expectations, and wait it out, they will most likely be rewarded with a really nice sat box. In the mean time, it's either patience or grind the teeth time.

...along with the requisite reporting/testing/complaining/calling/writing about the problem

I'm not anti-D*. I'm not a fanboy or excuse maker. I am a realist. I remain hopeful, but there is little point in denying the obvious. Everything else is more about our coping skills and mechanisms while we wait for our particularly grating problems (fill in blank here) to get addressed and the overall development of the boxes continues.

It's not a pretty picture, but it *is* the picture.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

hasan...Stop being so realistic & logical!


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

!!


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

SPG900NY said:


> Mike, you're saying you have the SAME problem we're having, but with NO external drives? Say, you're scrolling through the playlist and the unit just freezes for 5-15 seconds and then when it starts responding again it clicks through all the commands you pressed in the meantime?


Yep - that's exactly what it does!


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

Hasan, 

Sorry to say that I think you’re right.

I should have expected DirecTV to completely screw it up from day 1.  That’s what they have done and will likely continue to do.

What I don’t really understand is how DirecTV engineers can do such a poor job. Does anyone have any pride in their work anymore?

My new official answer when people ask me for advice is – ‘All the providers suck – if you can do without pay TV that’s your best option’.

Hopefully in the not so distant future we’ll be able to just use the Internet for delivery completely doing away with DirecTV and Dish Network. Hard to believe how much I pay for a few Discovery Channel, Showtime and NFL programs. Would love to cut out the middleman entirely and just pay the content providers rather than DirecTV.

I’d be happy if DirecTV would just put the HR24-500s back to the firmware they had on them in September. Not perfect but a whole hell of a lot better than the 2 or 3 they shoved down our thoughts since then.


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

sigma1914 said:


> hasan...Stop being so realistic & logical!


I guess this is as close to being critical of DirecTV you can get.

Are you suggesting that expecting DirecTV to continue to screw things up is realistic and logical?

If so I think we finally agree on something!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

SPG900NY said:


> Mike, you're saying you have the SAME problem we're having, but with NO external drives? Say, you're scrolling through the playlist and the unit just freezes for 5-15 seconds and then when it starts responding again it clicks through all the commands you pressed in the meantime?


I have seven 20-700s, one 21-200, one 21-700 and two 24s and they all do it. With or without externals, mostly without. It's just not the kind of issue that an HDD normally exhibits. It's a software problem and the OS resides on the flashdrive not the HDD.

If you said you were experiencing freeze ups, which can be quickly corrected or lockups, which require a reboot, I'd say thats a bad HDD. Maybe. Always maybe.

If you said you were experiencing constant 771s, I'd suggest a bad dish alignment or a bad LNB. Maybe. Always maybe.

I have had a lot of HRs, far too many, and I've seen them do things that defied quick diagnosis, but I've rarely had HDD problems and they were, usually, noise related.

Since I'm experiencing the same problems on eleven HRs of varying models, can you actually think I've got eleven HDD problems? You'll find some nitwits that will try to say that I've got eleven "marginal" HDDs, but that's just not the answer. Most of my HDDs are high quality WD EADS or EVDS HDDs and I just can't believe that anyone could call them "marginal". Hasn't stopped at least one person from doing it.

If the HDDs you have were the problem, you'd surely see other symptoms.

Rich


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> I guess this is as close to being critical of DirecTV you can get.
> 
> Are you suggesting that expecting DirecTV to continue to screw things up is realistic and logical?
> 
> If so I think we finally agree on something!


I'm suggesting that I agree with hasan. 

I can be very critical of DirecTV, I just don't see a point in getting worked up over a TV provider. I'd be happy to tell you negatives if you want to be bored. :lol:


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## hasan (Sep 22, 2006)

Mike Greer said:


> I guess this is as close to being critical of DirecTV you can get.
> 
> Are you suggesting that expecting DirecTV to continue to screw things up is realistic and logical?
> 
> If so I think we finally agree on something!


Yes, if you are asking will things pretty much continue along the lines I summarized in my last post. It is both reasonable and logical to expect the issues that have characterized every new box they have ever released.

...that's where the coping skills come in.

...oops...forgive me, I thought you were asking me, sorry. I was surprised that you thought we never agreed on anything, now I realize you weren't speaking to me. Duh!


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

Mike Greer said:


> Could you ask him to get my HR24-500s back to working at least as well as they did before the 'updates' the first week of October?


I am going to ask him why they spend so much time on New Projects when they haven't completed or finalized the Current Projects and yes I realize that Directv has a lot of resources and multiple teams as was evident when I was in IT but there are a lot of problems that aren't being addressed or addressed fast enough such as the Dolby Digital Audio Dropout Problem where the DD Signal loses sync with the Video and drops altogether probably associated with FF or Skipping FF or backwards.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

SPG900NY said:


> How did you "not treat it properly?


I actually started a thread about it where I admitted to driving the 24-500 berserk. They are computers and you can drive a computer nuts without even trying too hard. I used to teach computer classes for adults and, without fail, each class would produce a computer that went nuts. Just from the people answering dialog box questions that they didn't know the answer to. All Dell computers.

What I think I did to mine was treat it as I would a 20-700, a model that has been stabilized to the point where you can do just about anything to them and they will still work properly. The 24s are new and suffer from growing pains. Give D* some time and it will all be fixed, I hope.

If you have an external drive on a 24, don't use the Menu Restart, pull the plug on the external device and pull the plug on the 24. Then plug in the external device and wait a bit for it to spin up. Then plug in the 24. If you get an NR, reboot both the external device and the 24 in the manner I have written above as soon as you see that you have received the NR. Since I had the problems with the first 500, I have treated my replacement 500 and my 200 in this manner and both work very well.



> Ugh. So what would I tell DirecTV? I assume I will lose all my recordings anyway because they're locked to the receiver?


Tell them the truth. I do. And I make sure I can support my arguments. Yes, if you get a replacement, all the programming will be useless. And if you get a replacement, it's a crap shoot as to whether you get a properly functioning HR or a piece of junk. Believe me, the chances of getting a piece of junk far outweigh the chances of getting a properly working HR. That's why I carefully bought six 20-700s from MDU dwellers who seem to take care of their equipment. And are only one owner units.

I really doubt that the cause of your problems is the external HDDs. It sounds like a processor problem. Kinda like we had when the first PCs came out and you could type a long sentence and sit back and watch it slowly appear on your monitor.

Rich


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

SPG900NY said:


> Hmm... There are different manufacturers for the HR-24's, right? I wonder if all of us who are having problems are using one from the same manufacturer? Any way to tell who made mine?


The 500s are made by Humax, the 200s by Samsung, the 100s? I dunno. Who's the maker of the week for 100s? Anyone?

Rich


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

rich584 said:


> Since I'm experiencing the same problems on eleven HRs of varying models, can you actually think I've got eleven HDD problems? Rich


Yes! Oh wait, No! I'd like to be able to be one of those posters that says 'Mine works fine, there must be something in your setup' but, damn it, mine don't work either!:lol:


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

hasan said:


> Yes, if you are asking will things pretty much continue along the lines I summarized in my last post. It is both reasonable and logical to expect the issues that have characterized every new box they have ever released.
> 
> ...that's where the coping skills come in.
> 
> ...oops...forgive me, I thought you were asking me, sorry. I was surprised that you thought we never agreed on anything, now I realize you weren't speaking to me. Duh!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

hasan said:


> ...and was entirely predictable. So, while the "HR24 is god" bandwagon was raging a few weeks ago (don't let them give you that old junk, they should give us all HR24 series, don't accept it, cancel your order, tell the truck to go home....ad nauseum), many of us were waiting for the other shoe to drop.
> Sure enough, it did.
> 
> Curiously, my HR20-700 continues to perk right along without stopping 15 seconds to figure out where it is. Same for the HR21-100 and HR20-100. Guess this old junk that I should have upgraded from isn't quite as "junkie" as the "I gotta have the latest and everything else is junk" crowd thought. It ain't perfect, but the stuff works pretty darn well and allows me to enjoy recorded programming, when the holes in the audio aren't happening.
> ...


Well said, Hasan. While I have two 24s, if I would have had to pay one cent for them, I wouldn't have them. I wrecked one, I know you disagree but let me go on this, my bad. The replacement 500 and the 200 both work better than I could have hoped for.

Rich


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

sigma1914 said:


> I'm suggesting that I agree with hasan.
> 
> I can be very critical of DirecTV, I just don't see a point in getting worked up over a TV provider. I'd be happy to tell you negatives if you want to be bored. :lol:


Well, if you agree with hasan then you agree with me!:lol:

No need to go through the negatives - I've got years of DirecTV negatives!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> Well, if you agree with hasan then you agree with me!:lol:
> 
> No need to go through the negatives - I've got years of DirecTV negatives!


And one whopper of a D* curse!!! :lol:

Rich


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

rich584 said:


> And one whopper of a D* curse!!! :lol:
> 
> Rich


You've got that right!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Mike Greer said:


> You've got that right!


And you know you've got my sympathy. 

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> And you know you've got my sympathy.
> 
> Rich


My, This Seems Like A NEGATIVE LOVE FEST!!! :lol:


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

rich584 said:


> And you know you've got my sympathy.
> 
> Rich


Thanks!



richierich said:


> My, This Seems Like A NEGATIVE LOVE FEST!!! :lol:


Yep - something like that!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> My, This Seems Like A NEGATIVE LOVE FEST!!! :lol:


Can't help but feel sorry for him and you gotta admit he puts up with a lot. I admire his persistence!!!

Rich


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

rich584 said:


> Can't help but feel sorry for him and you gotta admit he puts up with a lot. I admire his persistence!!!
> 
> Rich


Yes, and so have you!!!


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

richierich said:


> Yes, and so have you!!!


Huh, never thought of that. Yup, you're right!!!

Rich


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## SPG900NY (Aug 13, 2010)

Mike -- it seems our issue might be firmware-related. We're not supposed to talk about "Cutting Edge" in the forums, so I'll only go so far as to say that the latest firmware, probably due to be released shortly to the wild (0x0448), fixed the issue I was having. Just thought in case anyone else had any similar issue when surfing this topic, a fix is probably out soon. Hang in there.


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## bondheli (Dec 31, 2009)

Just got software update 0419 and it did not solve the issue. The delays do seem slightly shorter but are still very much present.:nono:


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## Mike Greer (Jan 20, 2004)

Same here – just got 0419 and same crap…. How many updates since they first screwed this up in October? Pretty pathetic….


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