# 30 skip acting up



## SherSlick (Feb 1, 2011)

To start I have the 30 second skip enabled.

But the other day I noticed something, while watching a recorded show I was skipping through the ads when I landed right on top of a D* ad. I could no longer hit the skip button. Then the next ad was a "you think dish has.." ad and I could not skip it either.

Fast forward worked fine no matter where I was in the recording, and once the D* ads were done I could hit skip again..

Anyone else notice this?


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## ThomasM (Jul 20, 2007)

I wouldn't doubt it. I was wondering when the software would disable the skip function for certain commercials.

Who knows, maybe soon whenever you try to skip commercials you will be forced to watch channel 100 instead and suffer through previews of DirecTV Cinema movies!!


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## bikenski (May 25, 2010)

Ran into this problem with a recording of last's night Top Gear episode (US version) on History Channel. The ads that couldn't be 30-second skipped appeared to be the new locally inserted ads. The fast forward button worked, but the skip button did nothing.

An additional data point - the recording showed 57 minutes (partial) even though the entire hour long show was recorded.

Hopefully this is simply a "bug" with the new local ad insertion, and not a sign that skipping ads will be disabled down the road.


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## SherSlick (Feb 1, 2011)

Well a decent number of of them are un-skippable..


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## ThomasM (Jul 20, 2007)

I'd be curious what it does if you toggle the key from "skip" back to "slip" by searching for keyword "30SLIP"...

When it's set to slip, you can press it multiple times. I wonder if it would start slipping and then stop when it got to the "unskippable" commercial.


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## kaszeta (Apr 8, 2008)

Okay, so it's not just me. I noticed during Top Chef Just Desserts that 30 second skip stopped on the D* ads.


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## ThomasM (Jul 20, 2007)

kaszeta said:


> Okay, so it's not just me. I noticed during Top Chef Just Desserts that 30 second skip stopped on the D* ads.


You know, if advertisers think that by paying DirecTV to force subscribers to watch their commercials it will ensure that their product will be purchased I think they are in for a surprise. Personally, I would NEVER EVER purchase anything advertised that forces me to watch a commercial for it.

Actually, I really don't mind the 30 slip which is the only "skip" function on my R15's-and occasionally I'll see something zipping by that actually interests me and I'll go back and watch the whole commercial. But it was MY choice!!


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## Davenlr (Sep 16, 2006)

ThomasM said:


> You know, if advertisers think that by paying DirecTV to force subscribers to watch their commercials it will ensure that their product will be purchased I think they are in for a surprise.


So is Directv, if they think Im going to pay them if I cant skip commercials.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

So far everyone has said 30 skip are people seeing this also with slip or just skip?


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

It's my understanding that this is an issue that was identified after the latest national release rolled out. It's not intentional and our friends at DIRECTV are working to nail it down. 

My advice is to relax, there isn't a massive conspiracy to keep you from skipping commercials. It's just ... a boo-boo.


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## dvdmth (Jul 24, 2008)

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's my understanding that this is an issue that was identified after the latest national release rolled out. It's not intentional and our friends at DIRECTV are working to nail it down.
> 
> My advice is to relax, there isn't a massive conspiracy to keep you from skipping commercials. It's just ... a boo-boo.


Phew, I certainly hope so. I was worried they may be testing the system in advance of the upcoming election year...


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## kaszeta (Apr 8, 2008)

Shades228 said:


> So far everyone has said 30 skip are people seeing this also with slip or just skip?


I'm on 30-second skip. I may toggle it to slip to see if that affects it.


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## Diana C (Mar 30, 2007)

I wouldn't be surprised if this is a consequence of local ad insertion technology. If you think how 30 sec skip must work, it makes sense...

To jump 30 seconds forward, the software has to calculate the offset in the digital file that represents 30 seconds later. If the stream is redirected in to a different file, the offset becomes invalid and the playback drops back to the stream. This is why slip and fast forward still work, they follow the stream, not file offsets.

To fix this, they will have to look ahead on each skip and see if there is a local ad insertion coming, and recalculate offsets going in and coming back to the main file.


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## azphi (Apr 1, 2004)

I for one would not mind being forced to see certain commericals if it means less increases in programming.

I mean really, someone has to pay DirecT*; either the consumer or the advertiser.


LouPenya


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## bearcat250 (Feb 19, 2004)

This has happened to me three times so far. The 30 second skip will not work at a certain point of a recording, a commercial of course, the fast forward works and the skip back works. The time last it hapened was during Jersy Shore recording from 9/29.


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## rdbcatcher (May 27, 2009)

I've noticed this for awhile now. When the skip button is pushed, instead of skipping immediately ahead it will just fast forward though it. I complained to the CS and tech, but they said when the system installed the latest software upgrade, this was one of the perks that was removed.


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## racermd (Dec 18, 2006)

rdbcatcher said:


> I've noticed this for awhile now. When the skip button is pushed, instead of skipping immediately ahead it will just fast forward though it. I complained to the CS and tech, but they said when the system installed the latest software upgrade, this was one of the perks that was removed.


Maybe it's the cynic in me, but inferring what was said above about this new skip behavior being a mistake and now your experience suggests to me that maybe - just maybe - D* is trying this whole "can't skip ads" thing out in a very limited sense while giving themselves room to back out gracefully should there be sufficient backlash or insufficient interest by advertisers.

The facts themselves are pretty interesting all by themselves. D* certainly has motive (a new source of revenue from advertisers, plus trialling it out with their own commercials), the means (the DVR software programmers), and the weapon (the DVR hardware, which are generally leased so they still own the box), so to speak.

Are there reasons why they *wouldn't* want to do something like this? Sure, conflict of interest being one at or near the top. But one seriously needs to look at the financial gain D* might enjoy by implementing this "feature" and compare that against any of those other reasons. Besides, when we, the subscriber, turn into the product being sold to the advertiser, our voices of displeasure and discontent tend to fall on deaf ears.

Personally, I'm expecting and dreading the day unskippable ads are implemented en mass. I fear, however, that the day is much sooner than I would have hoped.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Titan25 said:


> To jump 30 seconds forward, the software has to calculate the offset in the digital file that represents 30 seconds later. If the stream is redirected in to a different file, the offset becomes invalid and the playback drops back to the stream. This is why slip and fast forward still work, they follow the stream, not file offsets.


This line of thinking is absurd. The actual file on the DVR is no different than the file on every other DVR. The commercials are inserted dynamically on playback, triggered by markers in the stream. They are not stitched in during recording. The software is deliberately causing the commercial to be played back in full and unskippable form when the marker is detected.


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

rdbcatcher said:


> I've noticed this for awhile now. When the skip button is pushed, instead of skipping immediately ahead it will just fast forward though it. I complained to the CS and tech, but they said when the system installed the latest software upgrade, this was one of the perks that was removed.


You might be able to restore the functionality by following the directions in this thread...

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=178872&highlight=30+sec+skip+keyword

Your description is quite different from what this thread is discussing.

I've seen it twice tonight for the same "Sunday Ticket" commercial. Once during "The Ed Show" on MSNBC and the second time at the end of the NY/DET game on TBS.

I really hope Stuart is correct in stating this is a fluke in software programming. I do agree though...I could see this day coming many years ago. There is no way that free OTA broadcasting can survive in a world without commercials.


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## hdprice (Jan 30, 2007)

MikeW said:


> You might be able to restore the functionality by following the directions in this thread...
> There is no way that free OTA broadcasting can survive in a world without commercials.


Free? Not trying to be an ass but my D* tops $160 before rentals... We're paying handsomely. Skipping commercials should not be an issue when customers are paying at that level. TBH it wouldn't be unreasonable to have ads removed completely a la HBO..


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

hdprice said:


> Free? Not trying to be an ass but my D* tops $160 before rentals...


I wouldn't consider DirecTV to be "free OTA broadcasting."


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## MikeW (May 16, 2002)

hdprice said:


> Free? Not trying to be an ass but my D* tops $160 before rentals... We're paying handsomely. Skipping commercials should not be an issue when customers are paying at that level. TBH it wouldn't be unreasonable to have ads removed completely a la HBO..


I was referring to local channels. Their major source of income is in ad revenue. While they do pull in retrans dollars, it's nowhere near enough for them to survive. With a broader DVR audience, those ad revenues must be shrinking. Combine that with increased cost of content and it's a wonder some of these guys are still in business.

Initially, I was a bit taken aback by this happening with Sunday Ticket commercials, but after the initial shock wore off, I could see the forest through the trees...


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## Diana C (Mar 30, 2007)

Jeremy W said:


> This line of thinking is absurd. The actual file on the DVR is no different than the file on every other DVR. The commercials are inserted dynamically on playback, triggered by markers in the stream. They are not stitched in during recording. The software is deliberately causing the commercial to be played back in full and unskippable form when the marker is detected.


I agree, they are inserted dynamically during playback...that is exactly my point. Absurd? If you say so - my thinking has been called worse. :lol:

If this were a deliberate act by DirecTVto make ads "unskippable" why wouldn't they also be "unslipable" and unable to be fast forwarded over?


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

Titan25 said:


> If this were a deliberate act by DirecTVto make ads "unskippable" why wouldn't they also be "unslipable" and unable to be fast forwarded over?


My wording was misleading. Although I did initially believe DirecTV made that decision, the moderators have told us that's not the case and I didn't mean to imply that they're lying. I was just referring to what the software is doing.


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## dvdmth (Jul 24, 2008)

OK, I have something to contribute here. First, note this older thread:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=196994&highlight=8888

A few days ago, we saw one of those odd items in our To Do List on the HR22-100. It was on channel 8888 and had a title which included "HEALTHONE" (that wasn't the full title, but it was the majority of it).

Today, we were watching a recording of the Diamondbacks/Brewers game #1 from Saturday. We ran into a pair of these unskippable ads. The first ad was for some furniture or something. The second ad was for Health One. Hmm...Where have I seen that before?

So, this is very clearly the local ad insert technology DirecTV is apparently now testing. I thought the test was supposed to begin early next year, but evidently it's underway now, at least for some of us.

Incidentally, this only happens when watching the recording on the local box. If I watch on either of our other DVR's (an HR21-100 and an HR24-500) via MRV, the local ad inserts don't happen, and I instead see a generic PSA ad (probably straight from TBS). Therefore, if you want to avoid this issue and you have MRV, you can simply watch each recording from a different room from where it's recorded and you should be OK.


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## billt1111 (Aug 16, 2006)

I have noticed this multiple times when watching the MLB playoffs on TBS and TNT the last 2 weeks. It does not happen every commercial break, but it ONLY happens during a commercial break and continues for the entire commercial break. Last night during the Ranger game it only happened during 2 breaks. I am using SKIP, not slip. As soon as the game comes back on skip starts working again. I can FF through the commercial(s) in question. I have only noticed it on my HR22 so far and I have the national release. I even hard reset my HR22 once to see if it still happens after that. I am going to try my HR24 via MRV the next time I notice it.


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## gilviv (Sep 18, 2007)

For me it has been a different problem altogether, while using the 30 SLIP on last weeks "Terra Nova""and then "House" both on FOX the bottom part of the screen would freeze while the banner would SLIP forward. No ads or anything else were visible on the screen while SLIPPING other than in the banner area. These were the only recordings this happened too. Never seen this before.


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## litzdog911 (Jun 23, 2004)

gilviv said:


> For me it has been a different problem altogether, while using the 30 SLIP on last weeks "Terra Nova""and then "House" both on FOX the bottom part of the screen would freeze while the banner would SLIP forward. No ads or anything else were visible on the screen while SLIPPING other than in the banner area. These were the only recordings this happened too. Never seen this before.


Be sure to report this in the Issues Thread at the top of this forum.


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## gilviv (Sep 18, 2007)

litzdog911 said:


> Be sure to report this in the Issues Thread at the top of this forum.





gilviv said:


> For me it has been a different problem altogether, while using the 30 SLIP on last weeks "Terra Nova""and then "House" both on FOX the bottom part of the screen would freeze while the banner would SLIP forward. No ads or anything else were visible on the screen while SLIPPING other than in the banner area. These were the only recordings this happened too. Never seen this before.


This Monday's "Terra Nova" also had the same problem with only slipping in the banner area of the screen as opposed to the main area. Missed the "House" recording due to the over-run on the baseball game, however the recording of the baseball game functioned correctly with respect the 30Slip feature.


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## Red Orc (Oct 11, 2011)

MikeW said:


> I was referring to local channels. Their major source of income is in ad revenue. While they do pull in retrans dollars, it's nowhere near enough for them to survive. With a broader DVR audience, those ad revenues must be shrinking. Combine that with increased cost of content and it's a wonder some of these guys are still in business.
> 
> Initially, I was a bit taken aback by this happening with Sunday Ticket commercials, but after the initial shock wore off, I could see the forest through the trees...


They can shove as many ads down my throat as they like but at the end of the day just because I watch a commercial for a product that doesn't mean that I am going to actually buy that product. I go out of my way *not* to buy some products because the commercials get on my nerves.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's my understanding that this is an issue that was identified after the latest national release rolled out. It's not intentional and our friends at DIRECTV are working to nail it down.
> 
> My advice is to relax, there isn't a massive conspiracy to keep you from skipping commercials. It's just ... a boo-boo.


I've now had this three times and from what I'm seeing, it looks like the coding in the commercial is the trigger. While it may not be intentional, as it isn't just the DirecTV commercials that have done it, I really doubt the receiver software is the source of the problem.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> I really doubt the receiver software is the source of the problem.


The receiver software *has* to be the source of the problem. Even though it's something in the commercial that causes it, it's the software that is preventing the skips.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> The receiver software *has* to be the source of the problem. Even though it's something in the commercial that causes it, it's the software that is preventing the skips.


Maybe this is a chicken or egg thing.
Since I have first hand experience with this, I "get a feeling" of what's going on.
When you've 30skipped a thousand times without issue and then you find a problem, it tends to suggest the source is what triggers it. Now "the fix" may be in a software change, but the cause is in the commercial feed.
What seems to be in common with this is not what version of software everyone is running, but the timing of the commercials being aired.


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> Maybe this is a chicken or egg thing.


It's the programmer in me. When an input causes a problem in software, the input is not the problem. The software should be designed to gracefully handle any input it could see.


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## gilviv (Sep 18, 2007)

What about the 30SLIP on the banner only thing? Any ideas?


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## Jeremy W (Jun 19, 2006)

gilviv said:


> What about the 30SLIP on the banner only thing? Any ideas?


Sounds like something totally different that should be discussed in a separate thread.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Jeremy W said:


> It's the programmer in me. When an input causes a problem in software, the input is not the problem. The software should be designed to gracefully handle any input it could see.


That's understandable, as we all look at this from our own experiences.
"The fix" may be in a firmware update, where "the source" seems to be in a change in what they've done breaking/adding commercials. "I'd guess" this change isn't going to be reversed as it came from a direction they want to pursue/develop. 
From the user's point of view, it's like the DVR thinks it's at the end of the live buffer, even though it's in the middle of a recording.


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## kikkenit2 (Oct 26, 2006)

Mine still have 30skip glitch occasionally. I called tech support last week and they don't even know what skip is. 
Will a fix/patch download show up in history or as a national release version or anything? I am waiting patiently as requested.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kikkenit2 said:


> Mine still have 30skip glitch occasionally. I called tech support last week and they don't even know what skip is.
> Will a fix/patch download show up in history or as a national release version or anything? I am waiting patiently as requested.


I'm sure you'll notice the next national release, but whether this bug is fixed or not, we don't know yet.
Also I'd say it's a waste of time calling DirecTV about this.


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## Rich (Feb 22, 2007)

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's my understanding that this is an issue that was identified after the latest national release rolled out. It's not intentional and our friends at DIRECTV are working to nail it down.
> 
> My advice is to relax, there isn't a massive conspiracy to keep you from skipping commercials. It's just ... a boo-boo.


It happened to me a few times during the ALDS when I was skipping from batter to batter. No commercials were on at the time. I was using a 24-500 and just figured it was a glitch. It did keep happening during the game, tho.

Now about those black helicopters with the D* logo on them that keep circling my house....:lol:

Rich


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## uteotw (Sep 30, 2006)

So, where are we at on this? Anyone? It's getting annoying...


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

uteotw said:


> So, where are we at on this? Anyone? It's getting annoying...


I had a talk about this and it will be addressed, but it may still take some time.
I was please to hear this, since 30slip is the only supported option, and 30skip isn't.
Your current options are to change back to 30slip or use FF.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

My friend veryoldschool is right. Here's the skinny:

(1) It is not a feature, it's a bug. 
(2) It affects only skips, not slips or FF.
(3) DIRECTV knows about it and is investigating fixing it. 
(4) SKIP is still an unsupported option, let's not forget that.


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## alm (Sep 12, 2009)

I am also seeing this happen on my tivo with cable card. Same deal as with my directv receiver. Skip is often blocked on the tivo but fast forward will work.


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## joshjr (Aug 2, 2008)

I have yet to experience any of these issues. Although wasnt it a year ago that there was an article floating around here that a new company joined with DirecTV for just this (commercials we could not skip on the DVR)?


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## Rtm (Oct 18, 2011)

Happened to me as well AT&T commercial MTV I used to be fat


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## bpratt (Nov 24, 2005)

This problem is a lot worse on the new 4d2 level. I do a 1 hour manual record Monday thru Thursday each week at 11:00 pm on Comedy Central to record Jon Stewart and Steven Colbert. Since the 4d2 level was sent, I get the skip problem every day on this recording at 18 minutes into the show.

I don't care if skip is supported or not. It worked perfectly until a few updates screwed it up a couple of months ago. When the programmers screw something up, they should be responsible of fixing it.


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## Jon J (Apr 22, 2002)

Stuart Sweet said:


> My friend veryoldschool is right. Here's the skinny:
> 
> (1) It is not a feature, it's a bug.
> (2) It affects only skips, not slips or FF.
> ...


I've been paying closer attention to this "bug" and it is odd that, for me, it never occurs during program content...just commercials. And, it always occurs during DirecTV commercials/promos as well as other advertisers that one might call "high end"...Tiffany comes to mind.


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## hilmar2k (Mar 18, 2007)

The skeptic in me says this is the beginning of the end of being able to skip commercials. I have been predicting for a while that skipping them is not going to be possible forever. With the continued proliferation of DVR's, advertisers simply won't be willing to pay as much for commercials that are skipped at a higher and higher rate. The lost revenue will have to be made up somewhere. I hope I'm wrong (but I doubt I am).


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

hilmar2k said:


> The skeptic in me says this is the beginning of the end of being able to skip commercials. I have been predicting for a while that skipping them is not going to be possible forever. With the continued proliferation of DVR's, advertisers simply won't be willing to pay as much for commercials that are skipped at a higher and higher rate. The lost revenue will have to be made up somewhere. I hope I'm wrong (but I doubt I am).


Change to 30slip and you won't have this problem.
The changes to commercials, where DirecTV can insert their own is causing this, and since 30skip isn't supported, it wasn't tested.
[again] I've talked to "my people" and was assured this isn't any conspiracy, but merely an omission in their testing, which is to be resolved "in time".


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## DallasFlier (Oct 24, 2011)

Red Orc said:


> They can shove as many ads down my throat as they like but at the end of the day just because I watch a commercial for a product that doesn't mean that I am going to actually buy that product. I go out of my way *not* to buy some products because the commercials get on my nerves.


So... You're saying that advertisers can't count on 100% of ad viewers buying the advertised product??? And some commercials are more effective than others???

And in other earthshaking news, the sun came up this morning...


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## Kojo62 (Aug 9, 2007)

I've noticed the same thing recently. It only happens on one specific commercial, an ad for an LGBT organization. I've seen this same commercial on multiple broadcasts, and it always acts the same. But I haven't noticed it on any other commercials so far.

I did some testing and it only affects the 30SKIP function. I can still zip past it manually with FF presses, or when I reset to 30SLIP. But on 30SKIP, it automatically locks back into standard play mode the instant it hits the beginning of the ad, and I am prevented from skipping forward until the ad ends. (Sneaky... even on FF, you're forced to watch their imagery even to determine when it's over.)

I came here just to post on if this was a designed new DVR behavior that DirecTV was selling to advertisers, so I guess this thread answers my question... sort of. But even if they claim it was not intentional, they clearly now have the capability to sell such a service if they want to.


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## bpratt (Nov 24, 2005)

I reported my problem with this skip in this thread a week or so ago:

"I do a 1 hour manual record Monday thru Thursday each week at 11:00 pm on Comedy Central to record Jon Stewart and Steven Colbert. Since the 4d2 level was sent, I get the skip problem every day on this recording at 17,18 or 19 minutes into the show."

I just wanted to report that this problem also fails every day on the 575 level of software. It fails on different commercials, but always 17 to 19 minutes into the recording.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

That's probably the time frame designated for local insertions.


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## djrobx (Jan 27, 2009)

Definitely seeing this issue with DirecTV commercials. Skip, skip, skip... stuck on a DirecTV comercial. Happened 3 times today. Glad to hear it's bug not a feature.


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## joerockt (Sep 6, 2007)

djrobx said:


> Definitely seeing this issue with DirecTV commercials. Skip, skip, skip... stuck on a DirecTV comercial. Happened 3 times today. Glad to hear it's bug not a feature.


Same here. Ridiculous this has been going on for a whole month.


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## Jon J (Apr 22, 2002)

Wonder if this bug has anything to do with the Channel 8888 and 8887 recordings I have been seeing in the To Do list?


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## levytv (May 13, 2008)

its directv's way of attempting to force us to watch their spots. fast forward still works. this 'encoding' is happening more and more.


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## bengalfreak (Sep 17, 2008)

I haven't seen this issue at all.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

levytv said:


> its directv's way of attempting to force us to watch their spots. fast forward still works. this 'encoding' is happening more and more.


Has nothing to do with it.
If it was the case 30SLIP & FF wouldn't work, but they do.

It's merely that the change wasn't tested with 30skip as 30skip isn't a supported feature. This should get "fixed", but when isn't known yet.

I ran into it a couple of times last night and FF works fine to get past it. I'd almost forgotten about this as I haven't run into it for weeks.


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## JonW (Dec 21, 2006)

Most likely they forgot to disable the feature on 30skip because it's an unsupported feature... but I wouldn't ignore the fact the capability is there, and the only question is when and where they use it.

For instance, with FIOS VOD, the programs cannot be recorded to your HD. You have to watch it as it's streaming. At best you can FF at 2x speed, but even this can be disabled. 

As much as we may hate commercials, free TV is not free. As long as the primary source of funding for shows are commercial breaks, they're going to try to figure out ways to get us to watch them.


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## TomCat (Aug 31, 2002)

Titan25 said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if this is a consequence of local ad insertion technology. If you think how 30 sec skip must work, it makes sense...
> 
> To jump 30 seconds forward, the software has to calculate the offset in the digital file that represents 30 seconds later. If the stream is redirected in to a different file, the offset becomes invalid and the playback drops back to the stream. This is why slip and fast forward still work, they follow the stream, not file offsets.
> 
> To fix this, they will have to look ahead on each skip and see if there is a local ad insertion coming, and recalculate offsets going in and coming back to the main file.


It might make more sense to think about how skip and slip _actually do _work.

The statement _"If the stream is redirected in to a different file, the offset becomes invalid and the playback drops back to the stream." _both makes no sense and sort of indicates one of two things:

1) you have no real idea how this works
2) you may have an idea, but don't have the wherewithall to explain it properly
​But that's OK, you probably do not have the "luxury" of working with this all of the time as some of us do. The files are compressed MPEG program stream files. A few times every second or so there is metadata in the packet headers of the video elemental stream (which is one of many simultaneous streams in the PS) called a Presentation Time Stamp, which is analogous to the running timecode in analog video. Since video files can be accessed non-linearly, it needs to read this PST both to know where playback is, referenced from the beginning, in the file, and to play back the frames in order, especially since they are purposely sent out of order as part of compression efficiency and robustness.

The PST is reconstituted at record, meaning whatever it is coming in is replaced with a new clock on the recording that starts at 00:00:00:00 and continues unbroken until the end of the recording. And as you say, skip and slip use this PST to calculate where to FFWD or jump to.

But there is nothing that distinguishes where a commercial begins and a program segment ends; all of that is by now invisible. Broadcasters learned long ago that if they did put some identifying metadata into the stream that clever techies would find that data and use it to create a commercial-skipping algorithm, and for that reason they will probably never do that.

There is however metadata that can defeat FFWD; anyone who has ever played a store-bought DVD knows this well, and is why we are treated to a nice long FBI warning logo each time we insert a new DVD.

Slip and skip are also not very accurate; they are only approximate because they are only GOP-accurate, not frame-accurate. Find video with a running timer including seconds, and try to skip or slip through that; press the button ten times. Will that be exactly 3 minutes? Rarely, and only by accident. It will be different each time, and different for the same video for skip compared to slip.

This is because it would take too long to decode the frames that are 30 seconds away to find the PST; it is quicker to decode just the I-frames (which decode faster) and not all of them but every Xth one of them, which helps prevent skip and slip from having decoding latency and allows decoded video frames to represent slices of the video as it goes by for slip. The tradeoff is that it isn't exactly 30 seconds, its approximately the number of GOPs that would represent "about" 30 seconds.

While DTV and others may be using technology to thwart FFWD, it is not unusual for the DVR just to simply get confused about the PST should the file get corrupted, whereupon skip and slip, both dependent upon the ability to read PST, just fail to be able to do that at a particular corrupted part of the stream. Sometimes this throws the file back to the beginning (00:00) because it no longer can determine where it is and just defaults there.


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## hhh222 (Sep 20, 2004)

This just started happening with me the last few days.


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## Sim-X (Sep 24, 2009)

Have been noticing this as of late as well. It seems that if you skip fast enough it will still work but if the video starts playing and you go to hit skip again it will lock. Very annoying. I seem to notice the non-function skip button more on ads where the feed has changed. So not necessarily a directv commercial but a commercial that is in a different format then the channel. So like if you are watching say pawn stars on History in 720P and they insert SD commercial or maybe a HD commercial that was shot in a different format it seems to stop working on those commercials more than the channels own commercials for different shows or what not. Not 100% sure just that is what I have noticed, either way it's annoying. I usually zip through the skips pretty fast so as long as your quick enough it seems to not be an issue.


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## markrogo (Sep 18, 2007)

Yeah, this is also now just happening for me too, very recently. Never happened till recently, now occurring with enough frequency I notice it.


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## Zenara25 (Jan 27, 2011)

My non tech savvy husband figured out a quick fix. When 30 second skip stops working, press the remote control button 'previous channel' 2 times. Then 30 second skip works again


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## dishrich (Apr 23, 2002)

SO glad for boards like this...finally figured out THIS was the reason why my 30 sec skip refused to work on commercials (ONLY) that DirecTV is doing during "local inserts" on Beavis & Butthead...  
I guess the only way to fix this...is to switch to DISH - who DOES (only) support 30 sec skip (& not "slip")


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

I believe that this issue will not be around much longer. Probably not worth switching to another provider.


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## Steveknj (Nov 14, 2006)

My cynical side was thinking that DirecTV was testing this technology out for more broader used. It's already been 2 months and not fixed, so you do have to wonder.

Think about this, with 30 second SKIP you don't see ANY of the commercials, while using FF or 30 second SLIP you can STILL see the commercial, even if it's just high speed. So, for advertisers, it's not worth them inserting any type of software to kill that, but for the skip where you can't see their ad at all, it makes sense. So with that thought, I am still leaning toward this not being a bug but a feature, and they are hoping that either people will not care or that eventually if there is any clamor it will die down.

Also, the "fix" I have found is to hit stop and then play on the remote, it completely skips the inserted commercial and allows you to use skip again.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

With due respect your cynical side may not really have the answer here. It's a fix that will require new software and we are in the middle of the HDUI rollout. It seems more likely that getting the HDUI right for everyone is a priority.


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## BubblePuppy (Nov 3, 2006)

"bengalfreak" said:


> I haven't seen this issue at all.


Yea, I haven't had this issue at all with 30sec skip. I rarely watch live tv. When I do its always behind so I can skip through the commercials. So far I haven't found a commercial I couldn't skip past.


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## Eddie501 (Nov 29, 2007)

JonW said:


> As much as we may hate commercials, free TV is not free. As long as the primary source of funding for shows are commercial breaks, they're going to try to figure out ways to get us to watch them.


DirecTV is free now?


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## markrogo (Sep 18, 2007)

BubblePuppy said:


> Yea, I haven't had this issue at all with 30sec skip. I rarely watch live tv. When I do its always behind so I can skip through the commercials. So far I haven't found a commercial I couldn't skip past.


The fact you're not seeing it is more about the relative rarity of these hideous local insertion ads rather than some technological difference between your DVR and someone else's. It's not a common problem, it's just a freaking irritating one when it occurs. As Stuart says, it's also likely not one we'll be dealing with terribly much longer.


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

Wow, this is such crap!

I'm watching a show, as soon as a DirecTV cinema commercial comes on, 30 second skip stops working. Next commercial, DirecTV movers commercial, still can't skip. As soon as the directv ad is over, 30 second skip works again.

I'm supposed to believe that it's not intentional that DirecTV's own ads aren't skippable by coincidence?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

adam1115 said:


> Wow, this is such crap!
> 
> I'm watching a show, as soon as a DirecTV cinema commercial comes on, 30 second skip stops working. Next commercial, DirecTV movers commercial, still can't skip. As soon as the directv ad is over, 30 second skip works again.
> 
> I'm supposed to believe that it's not intentional that DirecTV's own ads aren't skippable by coincidence?


"only if" you want to understand the underlying reason this doesn't work.
The testing for what is causing this, has to do with being able to insert local ads [since if you have DirecTV, their ads are pointless]. This same testing wasn't done with the "unsupported" 30skip function. YOU HAD TO CHANGE to 30skip. Should this bother you, until this does get fixed, change over to 30slip, "the supported" option.
If DirecTV really gave a crap about wanting you to watch their ads, they would have not let you 30slip or FF through their ads.


----------



## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

veryoldschool said:


> has to do with being able to insert local ads [since if you have DirecTV, their ads are pointless].


How are they pointless? The ads are for DirecTV cinema and their movers program. They would be pointless if you DIDN'T have directv.

What do you mean by local ads? A directv ad is 'local'....?

Saying 'Oh, your complaint is stupid because it is 'unsupported'', I find it odd that this targets a directv ad and that the 30 second skip has worked fine as long as directv has had DVRs. Taking it away (supported or not) is not acceptable to me and many other people.



veryoldschool said:


> If DirecTV really gave a crap about wanting you to watch their ads, they would have not let you 30slip or FF through their ads.


I have no doubt that's coming.... Baby steps. Like Steve said earlier, skip is the only out of the methods that skips over the commercial without you seeing it.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

adam1115 said:


> How are they pointless? The ads are for DirecTV cinema and their movers program. They would be pointless if you DIDN'T have directv.
> 
> What do you mean by local ads? A directv ad is 'local'....?
> 
> ...


It's not just DirecTV ads, though.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

adam1115 said:


> How are they pointless? The ads are for DirecTV cinema and their movers program. They would be pointless if you DIDN'T have directv.
> 
> What do you mean by local ads? A directv ad is 'local'....?
> 
> ...


First, I didn't say anything about "stupid". :nono:
The DirecTV ads are what is being replaced by local ads.
This is the root cause.
It will get fixed.

I'm sure if you're inclined to wear a tinfoil hat, none of this will change your mind.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

sigma1914 said:


> It's not just DirecTV ads, though.


But this would matter only to someone interested it what is really happening and why. Those that have already come to their own reasoning and this all is some conspiracy by DirecTV, will not care what is posted here, unless it falls inline with their ideas.


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## sigma1914 (Sep 5, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> But this would matter only to someone interested it what is really happening and why. Those that have already come to their own reasoning and this all is some conspiracy by DirecTV, will not care what is posted here, unless it falls inline with their ideas.


You're right. Sometimes I hope too much from users.


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

Why would anyone leap to the conclusion that this a bug in the software vs. a change in design, and that 'crazy notion' means they are a conspiracy theorist??

I saw the behavior and thought "Wow, that's annoying, but not a big surprise. Probably a sign of things to come..." I can't imagine someone saying "Wow, look at this interesting software glitch."

Most of the people in this thread thought it was be design...


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## bflora (Nov 6, 2007)

I am also noticing that after the "local insert" commercials that my hr20 in native mode sometimes gets "confused" ie. 720p before commercials and 1080i after. I have not noticed it happening from 1080i before to 720p afterwards, but it may also do that.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

adam1115 said:


> Why would anyone leap to the conclusion that this a bug in the software...


I didn't leap to any conclusions, but instead asked the software developers.


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## markrogo (Sep 18, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> I'm sure if you're inclined to wear a tinfoil hat, none of this will change your mind.


The little pithy remark under my username at AVS Forum says "no tinfoil hats". I think your sentiments are quite well expressed.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

markrogo said:


> The little pithy remark under my username at AVS Forum says "no tinfoil hats". I think your sentiments are quite well expressed.


I do believe I've read a post or two of yours over there too. :lol:


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

veryoldschool said:


> I didn't leap to any conclusions, but instead asked the software developers.


Ah, that's what I should've done! Why didn't I think of that!


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## silentpartner (Feb 9, 2007)

veryoldschool said:


> Has nothing to do with it.
> If it was the case 30SLIP & FF wouldn't work, but they do.
> 
> It's merely that the change wasn't tested with 30skip as 30skip isn't a supported feature. This should get "fixed", but when isn't known yet.
> ...


Thx VOS for the info on this little irritant.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

silentpartner said:


> Thx VOS for the info on this little irritant.


Should see some help in the next update "or so".


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## Richierich (Jan 10, 2008)

veryoldschool said:


> Should see some help in the next update "or so".


Can't Wait until I see the Update but I guess I will have to!!!


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## rpotato (Sep 6, 2007)

I have not received the latest update yet (w/Pandora) so I was wondering if this issue has been fixed.

Called them numerous times to report the issue. Got various responses from CSR's ranging from it is "not an issue" to "yes, we are aware, but not many customers have called to complain".

I have noticed the frequency of these local ads increasing and shifting from DirecTV spots to real local advertisers. Ironically, the one I saw the most often was for a residential condo complex-the same typical HOA organizations that put up as many restrictions as possible to discourage satellite dishes


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

rpotato said:


> I have not received the latest update yet (w/Pandora) so I was wondering if this issue has been fixed.
> 
> Called them numerous times to report the issue. Got various responses from CSR's ranging from it is "not an issue" to "yes, we are aware, but not many customers have called to complain".
> 
> I have noticed the frequency of these local ads increasing and shifting from DirecTV spots to real local advertisers. Ironically, the one I saw the most often was for a residential condo complex-the same typical HOA organizations that put up as many restrictions as possible to discourage satellite dishes


Yes, ironic! :lol:

30SKIP is not a 'supported function', so calling is a waste of time. You can FF through those, however. It's not been a factor in my viewing, though plenty of others have seen it.

And welcome to the posting side of DBSTalk!

:welcome_s


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## joerockt (Sep 6, 2007)

looks like this was fixed finally.


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## markrogo (Sep 18, 2007)

joerockt said:


> looks like this was fixed finally.


It has not happened to us watching Justified the last two weeks, which definitely had been using inserting ads. Knock on wood.


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## bobkatF (Sep 26, 2004)

Still happening.


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## levytv (May 13, 2008)

there's a new Honda commercial that u can't skip thru.


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## TomCat (Aug 31, 2002)

FWIW, here is why this problem occurs:


TomCat said:


> ...The problem is that skip works by calculating a new number relative to the running timecode and jumps there. If you press "skip" when the timecode is 01:23:13:16 it calculates 01:23:43:16, and jumps non-linearly to that point (actually to the closest I-frame, which is why it is not accurately 30 seconds).
> 
> If DTV does a insert and replaces the running time code with the time code from the insert (the cheap and dirty easy way to do it), the number skip tries to calculate from (inside the insert) is not in the same universe, time-wise, as what the rest of the program is in. It tries to calculate a number, but the number 30 seconds down the road is simply just not there, so it aborts the process.
> 
> They could fix it by simply using regenerative time code. They might have to spend a buck or two, but they won't, so it won't get fixed. That is the entire idea of not supporting certain features--you don't have to spend money down the road to keep supporting them. Promise unmade; promise technically unbroken.


This was my answer (actually a better answer than I gave earlier in this thread) from another thread.

So it is not conspiratorial; it is simply a by-product of them doing commercial inserts in a manner that is not fully professional.

30SLIP and FFWD work because they do not use an algorithm dependent on a number that does not exist in the time code. They use algorithms that instead instruct the DVR to decode and display at a faster rate than normal, whatever is in the stream.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

TomCat said:


> FWIW, here is why this problem occurs: This was my answer (actually a better answer than I gave earlier in this thread) from another thread.
> 
> So it is not conspiratorial; it is simply a by-product of them doing commercial inserts in a manner that is not fully professional.


[you know me] I'm not sure I'll sign off on that, since the 30slip still functions.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

levytv said:


> there's a new Honda commercial that u can't skip thru.


How about channel, name and time of recording and time of ad?


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## TomCat (Aug 31, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> [you know me] I'm not sure I'll sign off on that, since the 30slip still functions.


Yes, I do know you. Of course you won't sign off, because you never read nor understood the very simple and short explanation of why 30SLIP still works in this situation while 30SKIP doesn't.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

TomCat said:


> Yes, I do know you. Of course you won't sign off, because you never read nor understood the very simple and short explanation of why 30SLIP still works in this situation while 30SKIP doesn't.


"Garbage"
Since the 30slip isn't a manual function, it too needs to find where 30 sec is in the recording. It doesn't just FF for 30 seconds, you @#%#%, it has to know where 30 sec is in the recording.


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## TomCat (Aug 31, 2002)

veryoldschool said:


> "Garbage"
> Since the 30slip isn't a manual function, it too needs to find where 30 sec is in the recording. It doesn't just FF for 30 seconds, you @#%#%, it has to know where 30 sec is in the recording.


Sorry, that is just a wild-assed guess, and an incorrect one (which not all that surprisingly fits your usual pattern). If it weren't, you could explain it to us, couldn't you?

We're waiting.

How is 30SLIP not a "manual function"? It's certainly not automatic. Don't you have to manually invoke it to get it to work? This stuff is really not all that deep; even a chimp should be able to grasp the concepts.

The algorithm is a simple as "go into FFWD for x amount of seconds per button press, and then go back into play mode". It's not brain surgery. It does not have to calculate a timecode target to jump to or even decode a single packet. The critical difference here is _whether the timecode is contiguous or not does not even matter_ (but it does matter for 30SKIP). Maybe 10 lines of code. The simplest solution is usually the best one.

Touchy, touchy, VOS. It might be time to refill the prescription.

Actually, my mother was from the @#%#% family, and my father also has @#%#% heritage. We have a long tradition of @#%#% and even have a @#%#% coat of arms. But calling other forum members names is not really allowed here, and you have already been reported, my potentially questionable heritage nonwithstanding. And @#%#% is still probably better than whatever @#%#% some of the rest of us might have crawled out from under .

I also like your new tradition of starting each post with a single quoted word representing what is in your mind at the moment that you failed to understand the simple and obvious. But then I, even if I'm a @#%#%, am also a qualified expert in the field of transport stream technology by virtue of getting paid to work directly and intimately with it every day for the last decade or so, and you...

...are not.​
So out of the goodness of my heart, I'll allow you yet another mulligan.

That there is so little hope for you only makes me sad.

I'm out.


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

TomCat said:


> Sorry,
> 
> I'm out.


It's a shame you don't know as much as you think you know, and have to berated others while pontificating.

Do I need to post the list of the many times you've been wrong?
Such simple things as:


 Ohm's Law comes to mind and you not realizing P= I²R,
or your great reasoning for where the audio problems lie in the signal chain, but completely omitting the transcoding stage where most of it comes from.
What type of splitters are used with DirecTV
And then there was the time about scalers where I had to post screen shots to show you were wrong.

I'll enjoy your "I'm out", if that really is the case, but some how I doubt it.


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## Barry in Conyers (Jan 14, 2008)

Anyone have a good excuse why this "bug" is still around seven and a half months after this thread started?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

Barry in Conyers said:


> Anyone have a good excuse why this "bug" is still around seven and a half months after this thread started?


I've got no excuses. 
"The fix" was to be worked on "in their spare time", or something like that, since 30skip isn't supported.
Later versions don't seem to have it as bad, but I'm not saying it's gone [yet].


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## Mike Bertelson (Jan 24, 2007)

Keep it civil people. Don't make me get medieval on your posts. 

Mike


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## allenn (Nov 19, 2005)

Mike Bertelson said:


> Keep it civil people. Don't make me get medieval on your posts.
> 
> Mike


!rolling!rolling!rolling Civil and DBSTALK are not compatible!


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

So this appears to be happening again.


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## adam1115 (Dec 16, 2003)

Except instead of just not skipping forward, it appears to jump back and keep it in the same place.


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## wahooq (Oct 19, 2011)

@#%#%


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## Rage187 (Oct 27, 2007)

adam1115 said:


> Except instead of just not skipping forward, it appears to jump back and keep it in the same place.


That happened to me the other day. Then I realized it was happening because I had caught up with the recording.


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## Steveknj (Nov 14, 2006)

Happening here too. It was fixed for awhile, but came back after the last major update a month or 2 ago. Last time, you couldn't FF through them either, you had to stop the show, then go back in and it would skip past it. At least this time around I can FF through the commercial. Only happens on those locally inserted commercials. (which are funky btw, as the commercials I get are for NYC and LI and I live in NJ and would NEVER deal with any of those companies where I live).


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## brianp6621 (Jun 13, 2007)

This hasn't been fixed for me through multiple releases and many months. I guess we shouldn't expect too much at this point.


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## Stuart Sweet (Jun 19, 2006)

Actually for most people it has been fixed. However this is an unsupported function there is no guarantee it will work for anyone.


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

I've just noticed this happening and it seems very strange to me as it it's only on DirecTV commercials where the 30 Skip fails. 

I can bounce through 5, 6, 7 commercials, but then I'll hit a D* commercial (which is usually the last in the overall break) and it hangs on that one (and fairly close to the end of it) and will not let me skip past it. It's actually kind of a bonus as it keeps me from skipping ahead into the program, but I think there is more at work here. If they're working on adding a feature that keeps you from overshooting the commercial break, that would be wonderful. If it's something more devious, I'll guess we'll have to wait and see what we think...


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## Rockermann (Aug 9, 2007)

I still see this happening. I can't be the only one?


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## dpeters11 (May 30, 2007)

"Rockermann" said:


> I've just noticed this happening and it seems very strange to me as it it's only on DirecTV commercials where the 30 Skip fails.
> 
> I can bounce through 5, 6, 7 commercials, but then I'll hit a D* commercial (which is usually the last in the overall break) and it hangs on that one (and fairly close to the end of it) and will not let me skip past it. It's actually kind of a bonus as it keeps me from skipping ahead into the program, but I think there is more at work here. If they're working on adding a feature that keeps you from overshooting the commercial break, that would be wonderful. If it's something more devious, I'll guess we'll have to wait and see what we think...


It's not odd that its DirecTV commercials, that fits. It's a bug in an undocumented and unsupported feature, and that's all.


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## bpratt (Nov 24, 2005)

Rockermann said:


> I still see this happening. I can't be the only one?


You're not. It happens a lot on TNT but I've seen it on other channels also.


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## cherry919 (Jun 25, 2010)

Happened to me today on a Directv ad while watching last nights Royal Pains. So you are one of many....


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## brucegrr (Sep 14, 2006)

Happens to me on both hr23-700 DVR's and only with Directv commercials.


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## kikkenit2 (Oct 26, 2006)

I watch a lot of tv. I never watch live because skipping commercials is impossible. While watching tv the 30SKIP button is the most used button. By far. I find slip worthless, 3x fastforward too slow and 4x fastforward for every half time I encounter. I have been using 30skip for almost 10 years. The old tivo had it and dish has had it for a long time. Directv doesn't officially support this feature. This is unacceptable for the most common function used on their dvr. More importantly directv hides this fantastic feature from almost everybody. 

Most users and customer representatives have never heard of 30skip. Directv is being paid big $$$$ to hide this feature. Posting here has been worthless. Posting on directv's own forums is worthless. The jamming of this button just keeps coming back and is getting worse. Complaining directly to directv about this annoyance is our only hope. Let them know you expect this function to work all the time, hidden and unsupported or not. And yes 95% of the jamming of skip is on directv commercials.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kikkenit2 said:


> I watch a lot of tv. I never watch live because skipping commercials is impossible. While watching tv the 30SKIP button is the most used button. By far. I find slip worthless, 3x fastforward too slow and 4x fastforward for every half time I encounter. I have been using 30skip for almost 10 years. The old tivo had it and dish has had it for a long time. Directv doesn't officially support this feature. This is unacceptable for the most common function used on their dvr. More importantly directv hides this fantastic feature from almost everybody.
> 
> Most users and customer representatives have never heard of 30skip. Directv is being paid big $$$$ to hide this feature. Posting here has been worthless. Posting on directv's own forums is worthless. The jamming of this button just keeps coming back and is getting worse. Complaining directly to directv about this annoyance is our only hope. Let them know you expect this function to work all the time, hidden and unsupported or not. And yes 95% of the jamming of skip is on directv commercials.


If DIRECTV was paid to not have this feature they would just disable it. It would be simpler. You said that it's the most common used feature but that most users and csr's don't know it exists. Seems like a pretty big contradiction in terms. Maybe one day it will be fixed but until then you just have to learn with dealing with something else.


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## lgb0250 (Jan 24, 2010)

It happens when my wife is watching HGTV and some home security commercial comes up. The skip just won't work on it. The FF works but not the SKIP function. Have never really noticed it on D* ads.


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## kaszeta (Apr 8, 2008)

brucegrr said:


> Happens to me on both hr23-700 DVR's and only with Directv commercials.


Same here, although I've seen it with one or two non Directv commercials.


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## kikkenit2 (Oct 26, 2006)

Shades228 said:


> If DIRECTV was paid to not have this feature they would just disable it. It would be simpler. You said that it's the most common used feature but that most users and csr's don't know it exists. Seems like a pretty big contradiction in terms. Maybe one day it will be fixed but until then you just have to learn with dealing with something else.


Small clarification. Directv hides this function from most subscribers. They don't remove it. They just hide it. Can't think of any other reason than money from commercial providers etc.

Pushing the 30skip is the most common button "I" press. Most people don't even know 30skip exists. And honestly 75% of the csr's have never heard of 30skip. I bring it up every time I call. 99% of the people that I have exposed to 30skip have loved it and use it a lot just like me. I don't watch HBO movies. Everything I watch has tons of commercials. Just an annoyance. Nothing more. IMO directv would increase subscriber base if they made 30skip well known and even the default function just like Dish.


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## Laxguy (Dec 2, 2010)

Skipping a block. 

I use FF 3x to skip a block of commercials, thinking it's faster than pushing 30SKIP 5-8 times in a row. Has anyone actually timed this?


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## veryoldschool (Dec 10, 2006)

kikkenit2 said:


> Small clarification. Directv hides this function from most subscribers. They don't remove it.


"Large clarification": 
DirecTV added 30skip because of our requests on this forum, during the early days of testing the HR20.


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## kikkenit2 (Oct 26, 2006)

veryoldschool said:


> "Large clarification":
> DirecTV added 30skip because of our requests on this forum, during the early days of testing the HR20.


Without dbstalk.com I would have never heard of 30skip. That was on the HR10. And when it disappeared the show would jump to the very end. Not good. When the HR20 came out. Lot's of problems. Including no hidden 30skip. Lot's of people complained here then and directv pays attention to this site. 6 or 7 years later the HR20 is very stable.

This 30skip intermittent jamming has been going on for about a year now. It is a widespread problem in the national software. Directv isn't getting that many complaints because most subscribers have never heard of dbstalk or 30skip. I'm not afraid of directv disabling 30skip completely because a good chunk of people would switch to dish. I still prefer 30slip over regular fastforward at any speed for commercial skipping. Even ESPN is getting this now and I bet the nfl games on the 700 channels has it too. Find out in 2 days. I appreciate all the help you main guy's provide here. This is the only satellite/cable tv site I visit.


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## cherry919 (Jun 25, 2010)

Laxguy, IMHO skip is much faster. Most commercial breaks during a particular show tend to be the same length. Once you know the length after you get thru the first commercial break (ex 3 min) You tap skip 6 times for the next break and you should about perfect if not, skip back 10 seconds. The skips go just about as fast as you can press the button. And I only have an hr20-100 and hr21, not the newer, faster equipment.


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## Shades228 (Mar 18, 2008)

kikkenit2 said:



> Without dbstalk.com I would have never heard of 30skip. That was on the HR10. And when it disappeared the show would jump to the very end. Not good. When the HR20 came out. Lot's of problems. Including no hidden 30skip. Lot's of people complained here then and directv pays attention to this site. 6 or 7 years later the HR20 is very stable.
> 
> This 30skip intermittent jamming has been going on for about a year now. It is a widespread problem in the national software. Directv isn't getting that many complaints because most subscribers have never heard of dbstalk or 30skip.* I'm not afraid of directv disabling 30skip completely because a good chunk of people would switch to dish.* I still prefer 30slip over regular fastforward at any speed for commercial skipping. Even ESPN is getting this now and I bet the nfl games on the 700 channels has it too. Find out in 2 days. I appreciate all the help you main guy's provide here. This is the only satellite/cable tv site I visit.


DIRECTV has made changes immensly less popular than disabling this would be and it wasn't even a blip on the radar. You might leave but a "good chunk" doesn't even scratch the surface of people who even know about it.


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## gcisko (Sep 27, 2006)

Stuart Sweet said:


> It's my understanding that this is an issue that was identified after the latest national release rolled out. It's not intentional and our friends at DIRECTV are working to nail it down.
> 
> My advice is to relax, there isn't a massive conspiracy to keep you from skipping commercials. It's just ... a boo-boo.


I just noticed this 30 second skip problem a few months ago and mainly on Directv commercials. You claim this is an accident. What is the latest? I did go to the last page or so of this thread. Thanks in advance.


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## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

gcisko said:


> I just noticed this 30 second skip problem a few months ago and mainly on Directv commercials. You claim this is an accident. What is the latest? I did go to the last page or so of this thread. Thanks in advance.


http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=3009143#post3009143

IMO, they are in no hurry to fix it because skip is an unsupported feature and this is only a minor annoyance to a small number of users. Besides, they have bigger problems to fix.


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## bobcamp1 (Nov 8, 2007)

Shades228 said:


> DIRECTV has made changes immensly less popular than disabling this would be and it wasn't even a blip on the radar. You might leave but a "good chunk" doesn't even scratch the surface of people who even know about it.


+1

If I were D*, I'd remove 30 second skip with the hidden intention of putting it back in two months later. The number of complaints would increase at first, but later D* could tout how they listened to customers so they put it back in (unfixed). People would then thank them for putting it back in, even though it was still broken, and the number of complaints about it would be a lot less than before.

Of course, I've never done something like this myself....


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