# PAC 12 Network Added (was For fans of the PAC12, plz request PAC12 Network)



## pmjones

DirecTV deal in the works for next week.

DISH now the only one who has not signed up for the PAC12 Network. College football is right around the corner and for us fans in the western USA, this is a must-have.

I am indifferent to the whole AMC fight, but DISH not getting this network would be hard to ignore, IMHO. I realize sports is not a big part of the DISH business model, but for a Colorado-based company, I would think this is something they would want to pursue. . . .

Please chat up a CSR or call DISH to request! They won't make changes without us speaking up.


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## Willh

depends on how much the Pac-12 is trying to charge Dish to carry it and whether or not Pac-12 is co-owning this channel with Disney and the ESPN networks.


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## maartena

This just in from Twitter:

@espn700bill
Update per @wilnerhotline who just joins us on @espn700 Deal with @pac12 Network & DirecTV could come as soon as next week, DISH not likely

--
Doesn't seem that Dish is going to get PAC12 Network.


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## RasputinAXP

Another over priced network.


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## Stewart Vernon

Dish should have seen this coming, though, when they signed on for the Big10 Network. It is really going to stand out if they have Big Ten, and don't pick up Pac12...

IF Dish never picked up Big Ten, they would at least be consistent... but having one and not another seems like a recipe for losing a lot of customers who are on the West Coast.


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## CeeWoo

Stewart Vernon said:


> Dish should have seen this coming, though, when they signed on for the Big10 Network. It is really going to stand out if they have Big Ten, and don't pick up Pac12...
> 
> IF Dish never picked up Big Ten, they would at least be consistent... but having one and not another seems like a recipe for losing a lot of customers who are on the West Coast.


I know for me, it could be a deal breaker when my commitment ends. Depends on pricing with that other satellite provider. And heck, I'll even consider (dare I say it) cable

Consistency isn't a factor to me-I just happen to have attended a PAC school (I don't want to date myself, but back then it was PAC-8 LOL) Go Cougs!


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## kick4fun

pmjones said:


> DirecTV deal in the works for next week.
> 
> DISH now the only one who has not signed up for the PAC12 Network. College football is right around the corner and for us fans in the western USA, this is a must-have.
> 
> I am indifferent to the whole AMC fight, but DISH not getting this network would be hard to ignore, IMHO. I realize sports is not a big part of the DISH business model, but for a Colorado-based company, I would think this is something they would want to pursue. . . .
> 
> Please chat up a CSR or call DISH to request! They won't make changes without us speaking up.


Are you sure about the Directv thing being done and available next week?


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## kick4fun

CeeWoo said:


> I know for me, it could be a deal breaker when my commitment ends. Depends on pricing with that other satellite provider. And heck, I'll even consider (dare I say it) cable
> 
> Consistency isn't a factor to me-I just happen to have attended a PAC school (I don't want to date myself, but back then it was PAC-8 LOL) Go Cougs!


Whoa Pac 8........ Hey, once a Coug, Always a Coug! :icon_bb::icon_bb::icon_bb:


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## CeeWoo

kick4fun said:


> Whoa Pac 8........ Hey, once a Coug, Always a Coug! :icon_bb::icon_bb::icon_bb:


LOL-we are a loyal breed. BTW-huck the fuskies


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## pmjones

kick4fun said:


> Are you sure about the Directv thing being done and available next week?


Wilner out of NorCal, generally pretty reliable, tweeting next week for DTV.

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/collegesports/

Nothing on his web site yet, but the tweets have been up today.


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## sum_random_dork

"pmjones" said:


> Wilner out of NorCal, generally pretty reliable, tweeting next week for DTV.
> 
> http://blogs.mercurynews.com/collegesports/
> 
> Nothing on his web site yet, but the tweets have been up today.


He has the inside info in regards to the Pac12. With the offices in Walnut Creek and the TV studios in SF the Bay Area Newsgroup (SJ Merc, CoCo Times, and Oakland Tribune) is in their backyard.


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## maartena

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/colleg...t-neuheisels-debut-and-the-objectivity-issue/

Looks like DirecTV *may* be close to a deal.
Also looks like Dish is not.


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## Paul Secic

maartena said:


> This just in from Twitter:
> 
> @espn700bill
> Update per @wilnerhotline who just joins us on @espn700 Deal with @pac12 Network & DirecTV could come as soon as next week, DISH not likely
> 
> --
> Doesn't seem that Dish is going to get PAC12 Network.


Sorry but I don't care about football.


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## phrelin

I was a fan of the Pac-8 from 1964 to 1978 (and before, but that's another story), which included colleges from states that had a Pacific coastline. The competition between Washington, Oregon, and California schools was fun. The geographic area covered was the size of the entire East Coast and seemed to feel right.

When in 1978 they added Arizona and Arizona State, to create the Pac-10, my enthusiasm started to wane a bit. When they added the University of Colorado and the University of Utah in 2010 I felt they should rename it the Big Money Conference.

But I do like to watch some of the games.

According to Wikipedia the networks are the first owned fully by a conference without support from outside groups like Fox, CBS, or Comcast. However, their offices share the same building as Comcast SportsNet Bay Area.

I'd rather it be available as a separate package so everyone in the region doesn't have to pay for it.


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## pmjones

Paul Secic said:


> Sorry but I don't care about football.


Thanks for replying.


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## 4bama

The SEC network was formed by the SEC signing agreements with individual stations in most of the markets and did not rely on Dish or DTV to carry the "SEC Network"...

Each market that's under contract with the SEC can carry any game being televised..

This is a different marketing strategy and does not require Dish to set aside a group of channels to specifically carry SEC games..

Market demand for SEC games or Pac12 games?? Regional sports channels, local stations and the ESPN game plan satisfies most folks..

The BTN chose to market their games differently...which model is the most successful in the long run remains to be seen..


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## dstout

"The SEC Network" of right now is not the SEC Network that is coming. The current SEC Network is really nothing more than a syndication package to mostly OTA stations in the South. I think it is on some RSNs up north.

The SEC will have a cable/DBS/teleco channel in the future, probably the near future.


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## maartena

Paul Secic said:


> Sorry but I don't care about football.


Me neither. I actually want to watch Field Hockey, Soccer, and Track and Field.

Football is overrated. Besides, it should be called Handegg.


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## aaronbud

pmjones said:


> DirecTV deal in the works for next week.
> 
> DISH now the only one who has not signed up for the PAC12 Network. College football is right around the corner and for us fans in the western USA, this is a must-have.
> 
> I am indifferent to the whole AMC fight, but DISH not getting this network would be hard to ignore, IMHO. I realize sports is not a big part of the DISH business model, but for a Colorado-based company, I would think this is something they would want to pursue. . . .
> 
> Please chat up a CSR or call DISH to request! They won't make changes without us speaking up.


I tweeted them last week. I was told they would "put a request in" for me. Dish needs to get this and add it to the sports pack!


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## ehilbert1

maartena said:


> Me neither. I actually want to watch Field Hockey, Soccer, and Track and Field.
> 
> Football is overrated. Besides, it should be called Handegg.


It may be overrated (not for me) but it brings in $$$$$ and ratings like no other sport. Plus College football is huge. I don't see many sports getting 105,000 people at every game like they do at Ohio State and in the south.

For people that don't like it there is a simple method. Turn the channel.


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## inazsully

Stewart Vernon said:


> Dish should have seen this coming, though, when they signed on for the Big10 Network. It is really going to stand out if they have Big Ten, and don't pick up Pac12...
> 
> IF Dish never picked up Big Ten, they would at least be consistent... but having one and not another seems like a recipe for losing a lot of customers who are on the West Coast.


I've put up with part time RSN,s and the AMC fiasco and the Disney dispute and no 3D broadcast. It's always the same excuse from Dish. It's always somebody else's fault and it's ALWAYS about the money. Everybody wants to rip off poor Dish Network. Well this is the last excuse I'm going to swallow. No Pac 12 and I'll jump ship like I probably should have a couple of years ago. Shame on me for thinking Dish would finally see the light. Apparently light can't get through blinders. I'm sure we will have the resident geniuses chiming in to tell me to not let the door hit me on my way out but you know what, that's exactly the kind of attitude Dish has towards it's customers that have stuck with them for years and has brought on board many new subs.


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## inazsully

I just got off the phone with Dish and was told that the PAC 12 Network will be carried on ESPN U. Hmmm. We'll see.


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## dstout

inazsully,

You got a CSR that doesn't know what they are talking about. ESPNU may have PAC 12 games, but they aren't carrying the network on that channel.


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## kick4fun

dstout said:


> inazsully,
> 
> You got a CSR that doesn't know what they are talking about. ESPNU may have PAC 12 games, but they aren't carrying the network on that channel.


Exactly.. Haha.. A week or two ago, was told at a DIRECTV booth to get the "F.." out of the booth because I challenged him on the launch of the Pac 12 networks. Of course he said he's been watching Pac 12 networks for "2" years". Funny stuff. Oh, and he threw a wadded piece of paper at my 6 year old daughter because I provided proof that Pac 12 Networks hadn't launched yet.. A nice email to the CEO Mike White yielded a response.. Crazy times, just want my PAC 12 Networks!!!


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## dstout

kick4fun,

You showed great restraint not hitting that guy.


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## kick4fun

dstout said:


> kick4fun,
> 
> You showed great restraint not hitting that guy.


Unbelievable restraint.. I had this Angel of a person that grabbed me and said, "Sir, you have your daughter". OMG, it was one of the hardest lessons learned considering how I felt. Anyway, Long story short and a great cup of coffee the next morning with my wife, I reasoned that A letter to the CEO was good satisfaction. No reason for a night in jail.  One last note... I'm not named "kick4fun" without reason.. haha


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## WazzuCougs

Great to see so many Wazzu fans here!

Dish really does need to get with the program. Hopefully when DirecTV gets on board, Dish will follow. DirecTV has always seemed to take sports more seriously.

Fortunately I will be able to go to all of the football and basketball games in Pullman--and a few of the games will be on the ESPN networks--but I really want the Pac-12 Network. I've sent in a couple of the requests through the Pac-12 site.

Go Cougs!


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## kick4fun

WazzuCougs said:


> Great to see so many Wazzu fans here!
> 
> Dish really does need to get with the program. Hopefully when DirecTV gets on board, Dish will follow. DirecTV has always seemed to take sports more seriously.
> 
> Fortunately I will be able to go to all of the football and basketball games in Pullman--and a few of the games will be on the ESPN networks--but I really want the Pac-12 Network. I've sent in a couple of the requests through the Pac-12 site.
> 
> Go Cougs!


Go Cougs!!! Both Bill Moos and Mike Leach are so good for Wazzu.. So pumped... Not so sure about Dish, but if you still live at WSU, and Directv picks it up, you can watch at a number of places like the Coug, Valhalla (I worked there when it first opened), Sports Page or even My Office.. Good Luck and Go COUGS!


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## WazzuCougs

kick4fun said:


> Go Cougs!!! Both Bill Moos and Mike Leach are so good for Wazzu.. So pumped... Not so sure about Dish, but if you still live at WSU, and Directv picks it up, you can watch at a number of places like the Coug, Valhalla (I worked there when it first opened), Sports Page or even My Office.. Good Luck and Go COUGS!


There's definitely a renewed excitement for football. Just eight more days!

I don't live in Pullman, having graduated some time ago, but we live not far away. I guess I'd better be finding out which of my friends have DirecTV, assuming it signs on and Dish doesn't. Or maybe get the most basic DirecTV package possible that would include the Pac-12 Network?


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## inazsully

Nice reunion but is anybody else calling "E" and complaining? I'm surprised at the lack of pissed-off-edness here. New word but I like it.


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## Gloria_Chavez

So, look for a price hike of at least 80 cents in Pac-10 footprint, and, my guess, 35 cents everywhere else.

*******************************************
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-et-ct-pac12-20120814,0,1511937.story

Sports Business Journal has reported that the Pac-12 is seeking more than 80 cents per subscriber to carry its channels. That's more than CNN, USA and FX and about the same as Disney Channel, according to SNL Kagan, an industry consulting firm.
......
In the fall, Time Warner Cable launches its two sports channels -- one in English and one in Spanish. Time Warner Cable secured the rights to the Lakers and the Galaxy and is hoping to snag the Dodgers as well. The price tag is just under $4 per subscriber and Time Warner Cable wants the channels distributed to everyone as opposed to putting them in a package for sports fans.
*******************************************

And it's all because of ESPN.

That said, Beat Cal!!!!!!!
The only game I religiously watch is Big Game.


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## pmjones

So why not make the sports pack $ 10/month (as opposed to $9) and include PAC12 in the package? Thay way, you get Big 10/Pac 12 in the same bundle and only those who want it have to pay for it. It gets a little more complicated with the regional tiers, but no more complex than Dish has already done with the regional Fox Sports channels.

I'm not sure why this is so hard to work out. HD bandwidth maybe?



Gloria_Chavez said:


> So, look for a price hike of at least 80 cents in Pac-10 footprint, and, my guess, 35 cents everywhere else.
> 
> *******************************************
> http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-et-ct-pac12-20120814,0,1511937.story


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## inazsully

Great news though. Even though we won't get the PAC-12 Channel, at least the Little League World Series on right now is in 3D. Oh, wait. Never mind.


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## WazzuCougs

inazsully said:


> Nice reunion but is anybody else calling "E" and complaining? I'm surprised at the lack of pissed-off-edness here. New word but I like it.


Right now I'm trying to be a little patient as I _hope_ the sat providers try to work a deal.

I've contacted Dish several times now, and there are people commenting on Dish's latest post on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151164834290851&set=a.198772670850.166608.45347040850&type=1&relevant_count=1

Shouldn't we be contacting the Pac-12 as well? Seems like they are more than happy to have us do their dirty work for them. I think they deserve a little pressure too.


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## rcadss

WazzuCougs said:


> Right now I'm trying to be a little patient as I _hope_ the sat providers try to work a deal.
> 
> I've contacted Dish several times now, and there are people commenting on Dish's latest post on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151164834290851&set=a.198772670850.166608.45347040850&type=1&relevant_count=1
> 
> Shouldn't we be contacting the Pac-12 as well? Seems like they are more than happy to have us do their dirty work for them. I think they deserve a little pressure too.


Don't worry. You will be able to watch your cougars first loss on ESPN in full HD one week from today at the hands of the real COUGARS of BYU!! :hurah:

I do hope Dish picks up the Pac but it doesn't look good. Hell I would love it if they even picked up the ESPNU HD feed, oh and AMC, oh and ahhhh nevermind.


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## WazzuCougs

rcadss said:


> Don't worry. You will be able to watch your cougars first loss on ESPN in full HD one week from today at the hands of the real COUGARS of BYU!! :hurah:
> 
> I do hope Dish picks up the Pac but it doesn't look good. Hell I would love it if they even picked up the ESPNU HD feed, oh and AMC, oh and ahhhh nevermind.


Ha! :nono2:

No, it doesn't look good. Especially when I hear DirecTV is in discussions and that there will be an announcement soon. So far, nothing from Dish. I can only hope that Dish is waiting for DirecTV to get signed up and try for a similar deal. Wishful thinking, I suppose.


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## Stewart Vernon

I would have to hop back in time to see how the Big Ten came to be on Dish... I'm pretty sure I remember Dish having it at its launch... but I don't remember that there was a lot of talk before the date it went live...

Sometimes Dish does things quietly and something just shows up.

The PAC-12 should easily have as many fans that want it as does the Big Ten... so unless there is a bandwidth issue, or the price is through the roof, I would like to think Dish would get it.

Should be a similar deal too... part of your RSN package for PAC-12 DMAs as long as you are in AT120+ or higher... and in multi-sport for everyone else.


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## CeeWoo

rcadss said:


> Don't worry. You will be able to watch your cougars first loss on ESPN in full HD one week from today at the hands of the real COUGARS of BYU!! :hurah:


Could be---ya see, this is a building year. Of course, we've had a whole lot of building years in the last decade or so. 

But the Wazzu spirit is undaunted


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## maartena

A sports commentator and radio host from Utah that apparently has been talking to PAC12 tweeted the following two things:

From: https://twitter.com/espn700bill

@espn700bill
Based on conversations I've had today, I'm expecting the #Pac12 Network and #DirecTV deal to roll out Monday barring a snag.

@espn700bill
@mikey_t19 I've been told that Dish and #Pac12 Network aren't talking.

So it looks like Dish customers are going to be screwed re: PAC12 and will need to make a call to DirecTV really, really fast in hopes for an install date before football starts on Thursday.


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## rcadss

CeeWoo said:


> Could be---ya see, this is a building year. Of course, we've had a whole lot of building years in the last decade or so.
> 
> But the Wazzu spirit is undaunted


Good hire in Leech(BYU alum and all) . I can see why WSU fans are getting excited. If they pull out a win in Provo that would be HUGE. It's not going to happen but it would be a good win.


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## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> Dish should have seen this coming, though, when they signed on for the Big10 Network. It is really going to stand out if they have Big Ten, and don't pick up Pac12...


Big Ten is a midwestern network ... and I suspect they made a good offer to DISH (especially as they are the only 24/7 HD RSN, plus alternate HD feeds).

To expect the same out of all the conference networks is expecting too much. But if PAC 12 makes a good offer DISH could carry them as well. It is the networks that think too highly of themselves that will find themselves not on DISH.


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## fudpucker

"James Long" said:


> Big Ten is a midwestern network ... and I suspect they made a good offer to DISH (especially as they are the only 24/7 HD RSN, plus alternate HD feeds).
> 
> To expect the same out of all the conference networks is expecting too much. But if PAC 12 makes a good offer DISH could carry them as well. It is the networks that think too highly of themselves that will find themselves not on DISH.


Except that the word is from several sources that Dish isn't even talking with them. Ugh.


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## James Long

DISH is not in negotiations with a lot of channels. If those channels want carriage they can make an offer. There is no reason for a stream of meetings if the offer isn't close to what the other side wants.


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## Willh

James Long said:


> DISH is not in negotiations with a lot of channels. If those channels want carriage they can make an offer. There is no reason for a stream of meetings if the offer isn't close to what the other side wants.


i bet the Pac-12 channel is co-owned by ESPN, hence why they aren't negotiating right now, and it's all due to the Disney lawsuit as Disney owns ESPN. it's the same reason the The Longhorn Network isn't on Dish.


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## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> Big Ten is a midwestern network ... and I suspect they made a good offer to DISH (especially as they are the only 24/7 HD RSN, plus alternate HD feeds).
> 
> To expect the same out of all the conference networks is expecting too much. But if PAC 12 makes a good offer DISH could carry them as well. It is the networks that think too highly of themselves that will find themselves not on DISH.


I hear you... it's just that Dish had to see the writing on the wall... that other conferences would want their own channel too... so jumping on with the Big Ten and then not getting the next conference will be a slap in the face to customers in those parts of the country.

I defend Dish on the price negotiations... but this is like the RSNs... if you get yours but your friend in the next state doesn't get his, he is going to complain... At least when other channels drop (national ones) they drop for everyone.

I don't want name-your-price by these sports networks by any means... but when Dish used to say "we don't have sports" that kind of worked and people went to DirecTV for sports... but you pick up the Big Ten, and then people in other parts of the country figure you'll pick their network up too... and when you don't, you risk setting off a firestorm from an entire cluster of states and not just a few local markets like when LiLs are negotiated.


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## James Long

So ... Midwesterners should not get Big 10 because someone else _might_ not get their network? We might as well have DISH pull all the RSNs since YES and MSG are not carried.

DISH will carry the channels they can get a fair contract to carry. Perhaps when the contract was written with Big 10 DISH expected other RSNs to follow suit. There have been recent improvements in the number of HD RSN feeds available (24 channels for HD RSNs) which is close to the number needed to carry all core RSNs in HD 24x7 (additional channels would be needed for the alternates). But I suspect there is an issue with the RSNs wanting more $$$ for their 24/7 HD feed than DISH is paying for game only HD (and selected game HD) carriage.

RSNs always seem to want more $$$ ... even when their content is not improving.


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## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> So ... Midwesterners should not get Big 10 because someone else _might_ not get their network? We might as well have DISH pull all the RSNs since YES and MSG are not carried.


Not what I'm saying at all.... but that is why the NY customers are mad at Dish for carrying most other RSNs but not theirs. IF Dish carried no RSNs, then NY wouldn't complain as much.

Similarly... Dish had to know that signing on for Big Ten was a signal to Pac-12, SEC, ACC, and whomever else that there was a market for their schools to have their own sports channel..

Obviously they have to negotiate a fair price... but Dish can't bury their head in the sand and pretend they didn't see this coming OR the complaints from Pac-12 fans who want to know why they can see Big Ten games but not Pac-12 games.


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## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> Obviously they have to negotiate a fair price... but Dish can't bury their head in the sand and pretend they didn't see this coming OR the complaints from Pac-12 fans who want to know why they can see Big Ten games but not Pac-12 games.


You make it sound like it is all DISH's fault! If AMC owned PAC-12 rights would you cut DISH a break? 

Big Ten Network was added September 9th, 2007. Did you really expect DISH to know that PAC-12 would start their own network five years later?

I expect that there have been discussions over the past year with PAC-12. A seven channel network isn't the easiest to add ... especially when DISH already has obligations to carry other sports content.


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## fudpucker

I will say this about Dish and sports: they are more generous than most providers in our area when it comes to regional coverage. We are in the middle of nowhere, and we get Foxmw, which gives us KC and St. Louis coverage, Fox North, which gives us Minn coverage, and CSNCH, which give us Chicago coverage. Since we have fans of teams from all of those areas it's great. I'm a huge White Sox fan, so to live 8 hours away and still get them here is pretty awesome. By contrast, the local cable only gives you Fox North, and I'd have to check DirectTV but I doubt they are so generous.


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## zippyfrog

Looks like there is a chance that we won't be with the Pac12 or the Big 10 Network...

http://thegazette.com/2012/08/26/btn-dish-network-at-impasse-deal-ends-aug-31/


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## tampa8

I would say there is no way in H*ll Dish will pay those kind of prices for the Pac 10, Pac 12, or Pac anything..... Just how many expensive channels can carriers keep carrying and still keep prices down? Let Direct TV carry them, and keep their cost higher. That gives a choice to us all. I don't want to pay what my friends do for Direct because I can live without alot of the expensive sports channels. On the other side, they are willing to pay more to get them. So there is the choice.


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## dstout

Are the only channels we are sure won't lose the infomercial channels?


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## Willh

well when it comes to the Big Ten network pending dispute, just let you know, it's co-owned by Fox and the Big Ten Conference, so that means we are in for yet another blackout dispute, and after the one we went thought in 2010 with Fox, which co-owns this network, we clearly will lose the Big Ten Network. if the Pac-12 network isn't co-owned by Disney, it might be co-owned by Fox, which would be their way to bundle Pac-12 Network with the Big Ten Network. meanwhile Disney/ESPN co-owns the The Longhorn Network with the University of Texas in Austin, which is pretty much the closest the Big XII has to it's own 24/7 RSN channel. 

one story short, it's gonna be a long college football season for fans of the Texas Longhorns, a Big Ten or Pac-12 school or anyone who wants to see any game on ESPN-U in HD.


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## sigma1914

tampa8 said:


> I would say there is no way in H*ll Dish will pay those kind of prices for the Pac 10, Pac 12, or Pac anything..... Just how many expensive channels can carriers keep carrying and still keep prices down? Let Direct TV carry them, and keep their cost higher. That gives a choice to us all. I don't want to pay what my friends do for Direct because I can live without alot of the expensive sports channels. On the other side, they are willing to pay more to get them. So there is the choice.


You're really overly exaggerating the cost difference between DirecTV & Dish. When you're not receiving new sub discounts, the prices are very similar for similar packages and fees...off by a couple dollars.


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## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:
 

> You make it sound like it is all DISH's fault! If AMC owned PAC-12 rights would you cut DISH a break?
> 
> Big Ten Network was added September 9th, 2007. Did you really expect DISH to know that PAC-12 would start their own network five years later?


There's no "fault" here... but Dish can't be surprised that Big Ten starts a network, and the other conferences see that and think "I want mine"... so whether they predicted the date or not, they have to have seen this coming.

Per the other thread, it looks like Dish might be considering the option of dropping Big Ten rather than picking up Pac-12!

It would at least be consistent.


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## sum_random_dork

"Willh" said:


> well when it comes to the Big Ten network pending dispute, just let you know, it's co-owned by Fox and the Big Ten Conference, so that means we are in for yet another blackout dispute, and after the one we went thought in 2010 with Fox, which co-owns this network, we clearly will lose the Big Ten Network. if the Pac-12 network isn't co-owned by Disney, it might be co-owned by Fox, which would be their way to bundle Pac-12 Network with the Big Ten Network. meanwhile Disney/ESPN co-owns the The Longhorn Network with the University of Texas in Austin, which is pretty much the closest the Big XII has to it's own 24/7 RSN channel.
> 
> one story short, it's gonna be a long college football season for fans of the Texas Longhorns, a Big Ten or Pac-12 school or anyone who wants to see any game on ESPN-U in HD.


FYI, The PAC 12 owns 100% of the channel, Disney, FOX, TWC, Comcast have no ownership stake.


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## dstout

sigma1914 said:


> You're really overly exaggerating the cost difference between DirecTV & Dish. When you're not receiving new sub discounts, the prices are very similar for similar packages and fees...off by a couple dollars.


You are correct. I think what it means is DISH puts more in THEIR pocket.


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## inazsully

I think we'll see both the BTN and the Pac-10 Network on both "D" and "E. Why? Because if "E" doesn't have them both you will see a sub exodus that will dwarf anything they've experienced from all of their other channel screw ups combined.


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## dstout

inazsully said:


> I think we'll see both the BTN and the Pac-10 Network on both "D" and "E. Why? Because if "E" doesn't have them both you will see a sub exodus that will dwarf anything they've experienced from all of their other channel screw ups combined.


It hasn't stopped Dish in New York. I know they don't have the Yankees or Mets there, not sure about MSG.


----------



## James Long

dstout said:


> You are correct. I think what it means is DISH puts more in THEIR pocket.


If he did he would be incorrect ...

DirecTV charged an average $94.40 per customer per month 2Q12 vs $78.11 for DISH.
DirecTV made $20.35 per customer per month 2Q12 vs $5.35 for DISH.
(Note: Single quarter results. Over the past six years, DISH has averaged $6.04 and DirecTV has averaged $12.90 profit per month per customer.)

Nothing wrong with being profitable, but when one company is now making $15 more per customer than the other and currently charges $16.29 more per average customer it is fair to say that the customer's wallet is the source of the profit.


----------



## inazsully

Part of that "D" average is because of the NFL package. Without it the two companies are much closer in cost per sub. Taking that adjusted rate per month I'd rather pay more for the "D" content but from Dish instead.


----------



## dstout

James,

I am talking about Dish dropping channels "to keep the customers cost low". I just don't believe it.

Dish and DirecTV's regular packages look close in price to me. What am I missing?


----------



## James Long

dstout said:


> I am talking about Dish dropping channels "to keep the customers cost low". I just don't believe it.
> 
> Dish and DirecTV's regular packages look close in price to me. What am I missing?


First of all, you're missing your own point when you use phrases like "DISH puts more in THEIR pocket". As shown, their profits are relatively low - and when providers ask for "a few pennies per day" that adds up. They have managed to keep their prices lower. Sometimes that means not having the higher priced channels as part of their packages.

What you may be missing are built in price increases ... contracts that specify a higher price be paid for the channel each year for the length of a long contract. DISH must adjust their prices to cover those automatic increases. Dropping a channel doesn't mean DISH's cost for other other channels doesn't keep going up.

And you may be missing replacement content ... in some cases DISH has replaced a dropped channel with another channel and has to pay the second channel. Any savings would be diminished (except for customers who subscribe to "everything" ... but those customers also get all the new channels and rate increases are often not as sharp).

It is a complicated situation.


----------



## satcrazy

I see FX had a running banner tonight about Dish dropping the big ten, so, what's FX's interest?

Ok, nevermind, I see Fox has 51% interest in btn.


----------



## dstout

I just switched to Dish back in July. I really kind of wish I hadn't. I like the Hopper and Sirius/XM, but I don't care for their games of chicken they seem to be playing. I knew they did it, and I guess I should have thought it through more.

I may be wrong, but I really get the feeling that Dish gets a pass for a lot of the crap they do under the "they are looking at for the consumer banner". I really don't they get ripped in this forum like they should, but it is your house, I am just visiting.


----------



## fudpucker

I had DirectTV for about 15 years. Just switched to Dish a couple of years ago. I compared pricing on similar packages every year, and for the same general packages pricing was very similar. I only switched, very reluctantly because I was very happy with DirectTV, when we moved to an area where DirectTV did not have the locals in HD and Dish did. (DirectTV has since picked them up.) The average price per sub and profit is almost entirely due to some of DirectTVs high end sports packages. 

The trend I seem to be seeing with Dish is dropping channels and putting the savings in their pockets. First AMC and now potentially the big 10 network. Ugh.


----------



## inazsully

Jim, the bottom line is, it doesn't matter if Fudpucker is correct or not. His position is the perception that many subs have. And perception is everything.


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## ggust

No Pac 12 = No Dish


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## tampa8

fudpucker said:


> I compared pricing on similar packages every year, and for the same general packages pricing was very similar.


Must not have checked _this_ year.....


----------



## fudpucker

I didn't but I will. The tricky part is making sure its apples to apples.


----------



## dishrich

fudpucker said:


> I will say this about Dish and sports: they are more generous than most providers in our area when it comes to regional coverage. We are in the middle of nowhere, and we get Foxmw, which gives us KC and St. Louis coverage, Fox North, which gives us Minn coverage, and CSNCH, which give us Chicago coverage. Since we have fans of teams from all of those areas it's great. I'm a huge White Sox fan, so to live 8 hours away and still get them here is pretty awesome. By contrast, the local cable only gives you Fox North, *and I'd have to check DirectTV but I doubt they are so generous.*


I can pretty much assure you they ARE - you can check it here yourself:

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIF.jsp?assetId=3450006


----------



## tampa8

fudpucker said:


> I didn't but I will. The tricky part is making sure its apples to apples.


Yes, agreed.....


----------



## James Long

dishrich said:


> I can pretty much assure you they ARE - you can check it here yourself:
> 
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIF.jsp?assetId=3450006


That site gives me one channel (CSN Chicago) in Choice ($63.99 regular) unless I subscribe specifically to the Sports Pack or Premier. DISH also includes FSN Midwest in AT120+ ($49.99 regular). 

BTW: The closest "apples to apples" is DISH AT200 for $59.99 vs DirecTV Choice for $63.99.
AT250 for $69.99 vs Choice Xtra for $68.99 or Choice Ultimate for $74.99 would also be good for "channels for $$$" comparisons.

The low end AT120 $44.99 vs Entertainment $54.99 and high end AEP $104.99 vs Premier $114.99 have a larger price difference.


----------



## dstout

So the package prices, DirecTV is between $4 per month to $10 per on the high end package.

Do you view that as a huge difference or more or less the same?

Do we consider DBS a luxury item?


----------



## shadough

With BTN being dropped at the end of the week, I seriously doubt the Pac 12 Network will popup on E* anytime soon. Course I could be wrong and pigs might start flying soon.

When I 1st heard about Pac12 network, I knew I wouldnt be seeing it on E*. But there's always hope.........The ole Fox Sports net slogan/promo, "You gotta have hope.."


----------



## Stewart Vernon

I would say that IF Big Ten gets dropped (i.e. not renewed) at the end of the week, don't hold your breath for Pac-12.

But, if Big Ten and Dish come to an agreement, I would take that as a potential positive sign for Pac-12 at some point, though perhaps not in time for the start of the season.


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## Jim5506

Most people don't give a rats rear end about college football. What few who do can go elsewhere and Dish will be fine. You overestimate your influence.


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## ggust

Next to the NFL, there is no bigger sports business than college football or for that matter NCAA basketball. There are 8 major market cites in the Pac 12 and tens of thousands of dish subscribers who have ties to their alma mater, add the Big 10 cities to that and you have critical mass. I've been a happy DN subscriber for 14 years, but....no Pac 12 = no dish for me. Eventually if this issue does not get resolved, this will make the AMC snafu look insignificant with yet even more subscriber loss for Charlie. I have no problem paying extra for the entire Pac 12 lineup ala-carte or just throw the main channel on the sports pack. Bandwidth doesn't seem to be an issue lately as i have not seen a "JIP" game on Root in over 3 months. Once a DN fan cannot see -1- of their home team's road games, It will immediately become personal way beyond losing a simple series like Mad Men (which I enjoy).


----------



## dishrich

James Long said:


> That site gives me one channel (CSN Chicago) in Choice ($63.99 regular) unless I subscribe specifically to the Sports Pack or Premier. DISH also includes FSN Midwest in AT120+ ($49.99 regular).


Well w/out you (or fudpucker) giving me the specific zip code(s) you're using, I can't tell what you're talking about.  

I CAN tell you about MY zip code of 62704...BOTH DISH & DirecTV give us CSN Chicago AND FS Midwest St.Louis - with NO blackouts - & without needing to purchase the extra cost (RSN) "sportpaks". And except for a couple (very small) cable co around us, all the cable co. provide the same, duplicate RSN coverage in our area.


----------



## pmjones

Jim5506 said:


> Most people don't give a rats rear end about college football. What few who do can go elsewhere and Dish will be fine. You overestimate your influence.


This could not be more wrong. CFB is a big deal, especially for fans out west who have (essentially) one league and thus one network to ensure complete coverage. SLC, Denver, LA, SF, Portland, Seattle. These are big markets.


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## fleckrj

Jim5506 said:


> Most people don't give a rats rear end about college football. What few who do can go elsewhere and Dish will be fine. You overestimate your influence.


I think you will be run out of Texas for your first statement.

I do agree with your second statement, though. Anyone who really cares about sports left Dish (or never started with Dish) long ago and is now with DirecTV. PAC 12 fans, though are out of luck with either satellite providers. The PAC 12 network was designed for cable and does not translate well to satellite. Dedicating 7 CONUS transponders to one mediocre conference is not going to happen. It is not like the PAC 12 is the SEC (or even the Big 12 or Big 10).


----------



## inazsully

Lump all of the sports channels into a ad-on Sports Package. Think ESPN would let that fly? UH, NO, But it's a tempting solution to this problem.


----------



## Gloria_Chavez

fleckrj said:


> Dedicating 7 CONUS transponders to one mediocre conference is not going to happen. It is not like the PAC 12 is the SEC (or even the Big 12 or Big 10).


The PAC-10 is by FAR, the most elite sports conference in the US. And Stanford, BY FAR, has the most successful sports program in the country. No school comes close. 18 straight years.

***********************
Stanford Wins 2011-12 Division I Learfield Sports Directors' Cup Standings; Pac-12 Places Four Institutions in Top 10

June 14, 2012

http://www.nacda.com/sports/directorscup/spec-rel/061412aaa.html

CLEVELAND - With the final standings set to be released after the baseball College World Series, the winner of the 2011-12 Division I Learfield Sports Directors' Cup Standings has been determined, with Stanford capturing its 18th straight title with 1384.25 total points. The Cardinal placed sixth place in women's track & field, ninth in women's rowing, 17th in softball, 18th in men's track & field and 19th in men's golf. Stanford scored in 25 sports, with the lowest-scoring five women's sports omitted due to the maximum of 10 allowed. 
***********************

That said, I do believe that many overrate the importance of college sports, and I'm with Dish and DTV on this one.

When does it end? Pac-10 gets 80 cents, then ESPN comes back and asks for 7.50 a month. Soon, History Channel, which has already publicly compared itself with ESPN, will demand 2 dollars.

And the average monthly bill goes to 140???!!!!

I ask all of you, how much has ESPN's monthly rate gone up over the last 12 years? How does that compare to the median income over the same time period?


----------



## fleckrj

Gloria_Chavez said:


> The PAC-10 is by FAR, the most elite sports conference in the US. And Stanford, BY FAR, has the most successful sports program in the country. No school comes close. 18 straight years.


But the only sports that draw enough viewers to support a television network are football and basketball. Since 1998, when the BCS began, 8 of the football champions have been from the SEC, 2 from the Big 12, and one each from the ACC, Big East (although Miami has since moved to the ACC), and Big 10. The lone PAC 12 champion (USC in 2004) was forced to vacate its championship.

During the same time period, 5 of the mens basketball champions have come from the ACC, 4 each from the SEC and Big East, and 1 each from the Big 10 and Big 12. For the women's basketball, 7 of the champions have come from the Big East, 3 each from the SEC and Big 12 (although one of those - Texas A&M - has since joined the SEC), and 1 each from the Big 10 and ACC.

The other sports are nice to have, but they do not pay the bills.


----------



## kick4fun

Jim5506 said:


> Most people don't give a rats rear end about college football. What few who do can go elsewhere and Dish will be fine. You overestimate your influence.


You are really naive... All Pac12 teams receive $30 Million a year through tv contracts by ESPN and FX. You don't think people give a rats behind? Seriously, what a dumb thing to say. They don't pay that kind of money unless people are showing a demand.


----------



## Jim5506

Don't get me wrong. I enjoy college and pro football, but honestly, the percentage of the 300,000,000 people in the USA who would pay extra to see all of a specific teams games is less than 1% probably in the 0.1% of the whole population, maybe lower.

I think sports are getting oversaturated and overpriced, we have a bread and circuses situation here.

DirecTV is sucking some air on its contract with the NFL because they over estimated how many rabid fans would fork over hundreds of dollars to watch any and all NFL games. Now they are giving it away to new subs in a hope that a few will get hooked on it and pony up the cash.

Sure, Sunday Ticket is cheaper than actually buying season tickets, but it is just not worth the overall price, in the same way all these conferences and schools instituting their own networks are just trying to milk the cash cow - and guess who the cow is.

There is plenty of football broadcast "free" over the networks for 99% of the population, plus the pay TV like ESPN and the RSNs throw in more football - maybe not "MY GAME" but the most "important" games get carried on the "free" networks and who really wants to see every Big 10 or PAC 12 game, some of those schools just suck at football and they don't "deserve" to be broadcast.

Not to belittle anyone, but who would rush home early to watch Arizona play Iowa? I'm sure their fans are loyal - let a local TV station broadcast the game if there is enough sponsor support and the school can stream the game for those oout of the area, we do not need a national network for this kind of circus.

Support your local high school football team, you get a more honest game there, anyway.


----------



## RasputinAXP

And somehow these teams think they can make big money by forcing people to watch networks exclusively by and about them.

Ask Texas how that's going with LHN-ESPN.


----------



## fleckrj

Jim5506 said:


> Not to belittle anyone, but who would rush home early to watch Arizona play Iowa? I'm sure their fans are loyal - let a local TV station broadcast the game if there is enough sponsor support and the school can stream the game for those oout of the area, we do not need a national network for this kind of circus.


The one thing the PAC 12 has going for it is that most of the country does not have to rush home early to watch the games  On the other hand, being able to stay up until the game ends, and then having to get up to go to work on the East Coast might be a problem.


----------



## sigma1914

RasputinAXP said:


> And somehow these teams think they can make big money by forcing people to watch networks exclusively by and about them.
> 
> Ask Texas how that's going with LHN-ESPN.


It's going great for Texas, because ESPN is guaranteed to pay them big money. I don't have the numbers right now, but UT is still getting like $50 million.


----------



## James Long

dishrich said:


> Well w/out you (or fudpucker) giving me the specific zip code(s) you're using, I can't tell what you're talking about.


Try 60601 ... a little city called Chicago. 

Yes, there are blackouts when you are out of the sports team's home area. That is probably why DirecTV does not include Fox Sports Midwest in their Choice package for Chicago area viewers (the teams moved to CSN Chicago). But there is other content on FS channels - and I'm surprised that the channel is missing.


----------



## inazsully

I don't know it we'll have the Pac-12 Channel on "E" but I do know the college football season starts in earnest this Saturday. I also know that here in Arizona every game being broadcast by FSN Arizona will be carried on Dish Network, in glorious standard definition. What a sick sad joke.


----------



## RasputinAXP

sigma1914 said:


> It's going great for Texas, because ESPN is guaranteed to pay them big money. I don't have the numbers right now, but UT is still getting like $50 million.


But in terms of carriage, I mean. Neither D* nor E* have picked them up.


----------



## fudpucker

"James Long" said:


> Try 60601 ... a little city called Chicago.
> 
> Yes, there are blackouts when you are out of the sports team's home area. That is probably why DirecTV does not include Fox Sports Midwest in their Choice package for Chicago area viewers (the teams moved to CSN Chicago). But there is other content on FS channels - and I'm surprised that the channel is missing.


For me it is nw Iowa - 51041


----------



## CeeWoo

Jim5506 said:


> Don't get me wrong. I enjoy college and pro football, but honestly, the percentage of the 300,000,000 people in the USA who would pay extra to see all of a specific teams games is less than 1% probably in the 0.1% of the whole population, maybe lower..


If we're gonna make up stats, 87.945% of us think you're wrong


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## zippyfrog

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_21428382/source-pac-12-networks-directv-deal-wont-get

I found the last sentence interesting: "The conference is also in discussions with Dish Network and AT&T U-verse and could make carriage deals before the first kickoff."

I don't know how accurate the statement is, but it is interesting they report that Dish Network is in discussions.


----------



## dishrich

James Long said:


> Try 60601 ... a little city called Chicago.


YOU had better try it again...because I can *200% guarantee* you that DISH, in fact - not only does NOT offer ANY FSN affiliate in the Chicago proper market in their base packages, they do not, nor can they even offer ANY pro-sports on those said FSN (Midwest) affiliates in that same zip code.

When I put in 60601, this is exactly what comes back on their own website:

http://www.dish.com/entertainment/channels/local/



> Regional and Collegiate Sports Networks are available with America's Top 120 Plus or higher.
> Station
> Big Ten
> CSN Chicago


FYI, FSN Midwest is NOT offered on any cable systems that are generally considered part of the Chicago DMA, since NONE of their pro-sports teams are considered a "local" team in that area.

If you only look at this RSN map on DISH's own website, you can plainly see that FSN Midwest is NOT offered in any of DISH's base packages in the Chicago area - which BTW, matches what DirecTV offers:

http://www.mydish.com/support/rsn-maps



> That is probably why DirecTV does not include Fox Sports Midwest in their Choice package for Chicago area viewers (the teams moved to CSN Chicago).


You are mixing up FSN Midwest with FSN *Chicago*, which NO longer even exists! When the (newly formed) CSN Chicago swallowed ALL the Chicago pro-sports teams, FSN Chicago went out of business, which was in 2006. CSN Chicago *replaced* FSN Chicago on ALL cable/satellite systems. FSN Chicago & Midwest were always completely separate RSN's - & none of the Chicago sports teams were EVER on FSN Midwest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FSN_Chicago



fudpucker said:


> For me it is nw Iowa - 51041


OK fud, so this is what DISH's website shows you get as part of your base pkg:

http://www.dish.com/entertainment/channels/local/



> Regional and Collegiate Sports Networks are available with America's Top 120 Plus or higher.
> Station
> Fox Sports Midwest
> Fox Sports North
> CSN Chicago
> Big Ten


OK, so now let's try it on DirecTV's RSN lookup:

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPageIF.jsp?assetId=3450006



> With any *DIRECTV base package* (CHOICE or above, or MÁS ULTRA or above):
> 
> Comcast SportsNet Chicago HD (Ch. 665) - HD Available
> Chicago Blackhawks (HD Available)
> Chicago Bulls (HD Available)
> Cubs (HD Available)
> White Sox (HD Available)
> 
> FS North HD (Ch. 668) - HD Available
> Brewers (HD Available)
> Minnesota Timberwolves (HD Available)
> Twins (HD Available)
> 
> FS Midwest HD (Ch. 671) - HD Available
> Cardinals (HD Available)
> Royals (HD Available)
> St. Louis Blues (HD Available)


(note that while DirecTV does NOT specifically mention B10 in this lookup, since they do not treat it as an RSN per se...you WOULD get the same coverage of it in your base DTV pkg, as you would in DISH's)

Hmm, looks to me like you are getting *exactly* the SAME (if not more) RSN coverage in DirecTV's base pkg - as you are with DISH. (actually, you ARE getting more on DirecTV, since ALL their RSN's are HD 24/7) :lol:
Sorry to burst your's (& James's) bubbles - but as I said & stand by with earlier - with few exceptions, as long as you are comparing like for like RSN's...you are going to get the SAME RSN/pro-sports coverages between BOTH DBS providers in their base pkgs that include local RSN(s). (except obviously for any RSN's that a given provider does offer at all!)


----------



## James Long

dishrich said:


> YOU had better try it again...because I can *200% guarantee* you that DISH, in fact - not only does NOT offer ANY FSN affiliate in the Chicago proper market in their base packages, they do not, nor can they even offer ANY pro-sports on those said FSN (Midwest) affiliates in that same zip code.


Wow ... so much anger. Sorry ... I misread a map.



> FYI, FSN Midwest is NOT offered on any cable systems that are generally considered part of the Chicago DMA, since NONE of their pro-sports teams are considered a "local" team in that area.


Try 46320, Hammond Indiana. Unless you're going to claim that being a foot over the state line doesn't count as "Chicago proper" it is firmly in the Chicago television market. 
I don't know what teams would be seen in Hammond on Fox Sports MW ... but I do know that they would be seen on DISH packages starting at $49.99 (full price) and not in DirecTV's "Choice" package. And all the non-blacked out programming would be seen as well.


----------



## dstout

Hammond might be in the Pacer's territory? Their games are on FS Indiana that is a subfeed of FS Midwest.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

zippyfrog said:


> http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_21428382/source-pac-12-networks-directv-deal-wont-get
> 
> I found the last sentence interesting: "The conference is also in discussions with Dish Network and AT&T U-verse and could make carriage deals before the first kickoff."
> 
> I don't know how accurate the statement is, but it is interesting they report that Dish Network is in discussions.


That's very interesting indeed.

With one single sentence we went from Dish isn't talking to PAC-12 at all and DirecTV will have it at launch to instead, DirecTV definitely will not have it in time for launch and Dish might.

Dish might very well be playing PAC-12 and Big Ten against each other... PAC-12 wants to be picked up, and Big Ten wants more money... Dish might be trying to get both at the same rate... which means we could be all or none this weekend.

Not holding my breath, but Dish has done Friday and even Saturday channel uplink/launches before, even though it is rare.


----------



## dishrich

James Long said:


> Try 46320, Hammond Indiana. Unless you're going to claim that being a foot over the state line doesn't count as "Chicago proper" it is firmly in the Chicago television market.


Well, yea...Chicago proper would NOT be in Hammond IN, would it; it would be Hammond IN proper.
So yea, I am saying it's NOT "Chicago" proper, which is why I used that terminology.
The boundary line for everything, (like RSN broadcast boundaries) has to stop somewhere; what WOULD be so unusual that it would be the state line?  
And, RSN boundary lines do NOT always line up with TV DMA boundary lines - & they even vary by individual sport teams WITHIN the same RSN(s).

Hence, that is why I qualified what I said with *generally* - meaning there ARE always a few exceptions, as I stated (again) here:



dishrich said:


> *with few exceptions,* as long as you are comparing like for like RSN's...you are going to get the SAME RSN/pro-sports coverages between BOTH DBS providers in their base pkgs that include local RSN(s).


My main point was - when I was trying to tell fud that (most likely) he was NOT getting any more RSN(s) w/DISH than DirecTV, you then gave me a (Chicago) zip to try to prove otherwise.
Neither that zip nor fud's zip gets you more RSNs on DISH over DTV - which was all I was trying to say. (in case fud wants other options... 



> I don't know what teams would be seen in Hammond on Fox Sports MW ... but I do know that they would be seen on DISH packages starting at $49.99 (full price) and not in DirecTV's "Choice" package.


And since neither of us knows exactly which sports/teams DISH shows w/out blackouts, it's basically meaningless. Assuming DISH's zip lookup in this case is correct, it's most likely the FSN Indiana sub-feed f/the Indiana Pacers, as dstout suggested. (it sure as hell is NOT the "primary" Midwest/St.Louis feed w/the Cards, etc.) Problem is, I can't find any kind of NBA team coverage maps &/or zip code lookup, so it's hard to tell what exactly (pro-sports) a DISH sub is actually getting on that FSN feed. It also might be because the NBA season has NOT started yet, the RSN lookup table(s) might NOT be updated properly for the new NBA season.



> And all the non-blacked out programming would be seen as well.


Which is also pretty meaningless as well...since it's basically a carbon copy of the same programming on CSN Chicago. (we have both here, so it's easy to tell this...  )

So I did try some adjacent zips in IN - this one is interesting:
46947; Logansport, IN

DISH is listed the same as your zip code 46320

DTV has the following:


> With any DIRECTV base package (CHOICE or above, or MÁS ULTRA or above):
> 
> Comcast SportsNet Chicago HD (Ch. 665) - HD Available
> Chicago Blackhawks (HD Available)
> Cubs (HD Available)
> White Sox (HD Available)
> 
> FS Midwest HD (Ch. 671) - HD Available (example of varying teams within an RSN)
> Indiana Pacers (HD Available)
> St. Louis Blues (HD Available)
> 
> With the PREMIER or LO MAXIMO package or any DIRECTV base package plus SPORTS Pack, you also get:
> 
> FS Cincinnati HD (Ch. 661) - HD Available
> Reds (HD Available)


(DISH has no mention whatsoever of FS Cincy)


----------



## James Long

dishrich said:


> Well, yea...Chicago proper would NOT be in Hammond IN, would it; it would be Hammond IN proper.
> So yea, I am saying it's NOT "Chicago" proper, which is why I used that terminology.


You also said Chicago DMA ... which most certainly includes Hammond, IN. I figured you'd try to redefine and squirm out of it.

The point is, there are places where DISH's $49.99 package includes RSNs that DirecTV does not include. Perhaps not your place ... but your claim made earlier in the thread is false and I thank you for acknowledging that in your post.



> Assuming DISH's zip lookup in this case is correct, it's most likely the FSN Indiana sub-feed f/the Indiana Pacers, as dstout suggested. (it sure as hell is NOT the "primary" Midwest/St.Louis feed w/the Cards, etc.)


Perhaps you should learn more about DISH carriage before coming into a DISH forum and spouting off about it? Channel 418 on DISH (channel 412-08 on the Hopper) is FOXMW ... the main FSMidwest feed.

When there is content on FSIndiana (such as a Pacers game) it appears on one of the Alternate channels. DISH does not have permanent separate channels set aside for the subdivisions of the regional FS feeds.



> (DISH has no mention whatsoever of FS Cincy)


On DISH, one would find that content on the FSMidwest channel or an Alternate channel (most likely on an alternate channel).


----------



## dishrich

James Long said:


> Perhaps you should learn more about DISH carriage before coming into a DISH forum and spouting off about it?
> 
> Channel 418 on DISH (channel 412-08 on the Hopper) is FOXMW ... the main FSMidwest feed.


Well as a current DISH sub for quite some time...thank you for pointing out something I was well aware of. 



> When there is content on FSIndiana (such as a Pacers game) it appears on one of the Alternate channels. DISH does not have permanent separate channels set aside for the subdivisions of the regional FS feeds.


AND as part of that process, if the primary feed on 418 would be showing prog blacked out in a given area - *such as a Cardinal game that would NOT be shown in your Hammond, IN zip code 46320*, it WOULD be blacked out - per MLB blackout rules. (unless you're planning on telling me that DISH doesn't have to abide by those rules  )

Just in case, here's an MLB blackout map; it's VERY clear that Hammond, IN is NOT in the home broadcast area for any FSN Midwest MLB teams:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MLB_Blackout_Areas.png

The point is, when DISH's website says you qualify for FSN Midwest - they do NOT qualify that with which specific "programs" (ie: sports teams) you will see on that said "primary channel". Obviously, it WILL be blacked out in some instances - but you already know (all) this, right? 

And (again) in this case of zip 46320...for all we know, other than (possibly) the IN Pacers, there's probably NOT much, if any, pro content these particular FSN Midwest subs will actually get from DISH. We'll have to agree to disagree on this one...



> On DISH, one would find that content on the FSMidwest channel or an Alternate channel (most likely on an alternate channel).


Since there are actually 2 FSN *Ohio* feeds, it would not be on the FSN Midwest feed whatsoever.


----------



## James Long

dishrich said:


> Well as a current DISH sub for quite some time...thank you for pointing out something I was well aware of.


Based on your inaccurate portrayal of the facts it was not obvious. :eek2:
I thought you had left DISH and just had an unfortunate handle from the past. :grin:



> Since there are actually 2 FSN *Ohio* feeds, it would not be on the FSN Midwest feed whatsoever.


As I said:
_On DISH, one would find that content on the FSMidwest channel or an Alternate channel (most likely on an alternate channel). _

Even without an explicit FS Cincy channel on DISH the content is still available to subscribers via the alternate channels.


----------



## Brubear

http://espn.go.com/blog/pac12/post/_/id/43662/direct-tv-rejects-pac-12-network


----------



## RasputinAXP

Full letter on the PAC 12 site: http://pac-12.com/portals/0/content/enterprises/dearfan/index.html


----------



## inazsully

Dish has an opportunity to look mighty good here. Don't blow it "E".


----------



## sigma1914

inazsully said:


> Dish has an opportunity to look mighty good here. Don't blow it "E".


If DirecTV won't add it, you really think Dish would? No chance.


----------



## James Long

sigma1914 said:


> If DirecTV won't add it, you really think Dish would? No chance.


It all depends on the deal. Personally I believe it is the alternate channels that are squashing the deal.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> It all depends on the deal. Personally I believe it is the alternate channels that are squashing the deal.


That's what it sounds like to me... Big Ten has one channel + part-time alternates for game only... sounds like PAC-12 wanted a bunch of full-time channels and that ultimately killed the DirecTV deal.

As I said in another thread... the days of DirecTV just giving in are over... they are fighting back now too, and it will be good for everyone!


----------



## nmetro

Our local Comcast system picked up the main Big 12 Channel and PAC 12 Rocky Mountain.

PAC 12, unlike BTN, has a national channel. However, they also have a channel for Washington, Oregon, Northern California, Southern California, Arizona and Colorado/Utah. This means, a national carrier like DISH or DirecTV needs to carry all seven PAC 12 channels. They are all 24x7 channels, which means one will fill up most of one HD transponder just with PAC 12 networks. And if they offer SD, that is 14 channels. This is very expensive for satellite space. Either the provider DirecTV or DISH has to make room by dropping channels or they have to add capacity.

BTN, as pointed out above, only has one full time channel, and borrows from the HD "pool" for alternate games. But, it is truly one 24x7 channel; two if you count SD.

PAC 12, I think, created an impossible model for national satellite carriers. Yes, they could use spot beams for the regional channels, but I suspect PAC 12 wants to use satellite to cover all 50 states regardless of where PAC 12 fans live.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Yeah, the more I read, the more insane it is... I don't know what the PAC-12 was thinking that they were going to get Dish and DirecTV to dedicate 1 or even 2 transponders just to them... even at "the right price" that wouldn't make sense, and I gather that's what ultimately made it a non-starter with DirecTV... it doesn't sound like they really drilled to price negotiations since they couldn't get past the number of dedicated full-time channels that the PAC-12 wanted.

And people think ESPN is bad!

Hopefully the PAC-12 will re-think this and offer Dish and DirecTV something like the Big Ten offers with 1 national full-time channel + alternate feeds for game-only overlap.


----------



## WazzuCougs

I've been trying to keep up with the status of the Pac-12 Network on Facebook a little bit. The agreement--albeit a short-term one--with the Big Ten is a good sign. I felt if Dish completely abandoned the Big Ten there would be no way it would be adding the Pac-12. Although keeping the Big Ten also does not guarantee an addition of the Pac-12, it's still a positive sign. 

Anyway, this is one of the posts from a CSR I read on Dish's Facebook page today. It's a much different tone than what the CSRs had been posting:

"We understand the importance of college football and see the value in the games the Pac-12 will provide DISH customers. Which is why we are working hard to come to an agreement and finalize a deal with the Pac-12." -Tommy F

I like the sounds of that!!!!


----------



## James Long

The "multiple channel" thing with PAC-12 needs to be sorted out. DISH currently has 24 slots for RSNs in HD. BTN takes up an additional slot with their 24/7 channel. Allowing BTN to consume up to four more slots occasionally when there is conflicting content is a burden, but those up to four channels are available for other channels during the rest of the week.

Asking for multiple 24/7 channels is a greater burden. Perhaps PAC-12 will be able to pick one as the 24/7 feed and open up the others only when games are airing. It would still cut into the 24 HD RSNs available but it would not cost DISH a complete transponder for a single network.

Channels need to look at it from DISH's perspective. Not only is it costing DISH the fee the content owner wants for carriage, it is costing DISH space on the satellites. Think of it as a 25-30k per month investment in each channel they carry in HD. Roughly a quarter of a cent per subscriber for a channel at AT200 available nationwide, but for a regional channel the "per subscriber" shoots up (and for multiple channels the "per subscriber" multiplies by "per channel"). Plus the use of limited space for PAC-12 channels makes it harder to add other HD channels.


----------



## fudpucker

dishrich said:


> Hmm, looks to me like you are getting *exactly* the SAME (if not more) RSN coverage in DirecTV's base pkg - as you are with DISH. (actually, you ARE getting more on DirecTV, since ALL their RSN's are HD 24/7) :lol:
> Sorry to burst your's (& James's) bubbles - but as I said & stand by with earlier - with few exceptions, as long as you are comparing like for like RSN's...you are going to get the SAME RSN/pro-sports coverages between BOTH DBS providers in their base pkgs that include local RSN(s). (except obviously for any RSN's that a given provider does offer at all!)


Um - there's no bursting of bubbles. When I moved here 3 years ago, with DirectTV (which I'd had since 1995) Dish offered more regional sports packages than DirectTV. DirectTV at the time also did not offer the local networks at all. So I switched to Dish. When I commented on how happy I was with Dish's regional coverage and that it was better than what I'd gotten on DirectTV, it was just a comment that Dish does well here, in the same thread in which I'd criticized Dish, not meant to be a "DirectTV SUX!!!! Dish RULEZ!!!" DirectTV now offers the same regional sports in my area that Dish does? Cool.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> The "multiple channel" thing with PAC-12 needs to be sorted out. DISH currently has 24 slots for RSNs in HD. BTN takes up an additional slot with their 24/7 channel. Allowing BTN to consume up to four more slots occasionally when there is conflicting content is a burden, but those up to four channels are available for other channels during the rest of the week.
> 
> Asking for multiple 24/7 channels is a greater burden. Perhaps PAC-12 will be able to pick one as the 24/7 feed and open up the others only when games are airing. It would still cut into the 24 HD RSNs available but it would not cost DISH a complete transponder for a single network.
> 
> Channels need to look at it from DISH's perspective. Not only is it costing DISH the fee the content owner wants for carriage, it is costing DISH space on the satellites. Think of it as a 25-30k per month investment in each channel they carry in HD. Roughly a quarter of a cent per subscriber for a channel at AT200 available nationwide, but for a regional channel the "per subscriber" shoots up (and for multiple channels the "per subscriber" multiplies by "per channel"). Plus the use of limited space for PAC-12 channels makes it harder to add other HD channels.


Yeah... PAC-12 trying to have 7 full time channels and claiming they only want what the Big-Ten has is borderline insane! It is one thing if this stuff grew over time... but to come right out of the gate wanting so many full time channels...

Hopefully DirecTV kicking them to the curb will force them to re-think and re-structure so that 1 full-time + alternates will be acceptable.


----------



## Gloria_Chavez

Does anyone know if the Big-10 asked for multiple channels when it began the BTN? 

You would think it would have asked for them, as there's little downside. At worst, the PayTv carrier would have responded it that it does not offer multiple channels to NCAA sports leagues. At best, the carrier would have responded affirmatively.


----------



## Jim5506

I believe one fulltime channel per conference is more than fair, they do not have that much to offer on a fulltime basis that is interesting to anyone other than the rabid.


----------



## WazzuCougs

Basketball season will be here before we know it. It would be hard to get the games from all 12 teams on one channel.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

WazzuCougs said:


> Basketball season will be here before we know it. It would be hard to get the games from all 12 teams on one channel.


You missed the point. Alternate game-only feeds are sometimes necessary and would be wanted. But those feeds wouldn't need to be full-time channels to cover the games.


----------



## WazzuCougs

Stewart Vernon said:


> You missed the point. Alternate game-only feeds are sometimes necessary and would be wanted. But those feeds wouldn't need to be full-time channels to cover the games.


Oh, o.k. I see what you mean now. Too bad the Pac-12 didn't use your foresight. I understand what it was attempting to do, but I think it created more problems for itself.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

WazzuCougs said:


> Oh, o.k. I see what you mean now. Too bad the Pac-12 didn't use your foresight. I understand what it was attempting to do, but I think it created more problems for itself.


Exactly... The Big Ten has one 24/7 channel, and at least on Dish there are 4 alternate channels. I can't say I remember all channels with an active game but there must have been a time 5 games were simultaneous or there wouldn't be so many alternate channels 

The PAC-12 appeared to be trying to have 7 24/7 channels that they wanted DirecTV to take (and I assume Dish as well)... and frankly that's a lot to ask basically a whole transponder be dedicated full time to just the PAC-12. That would put them in the same class as ESPN that covers all the conferences + pro games... and that doesn't seem likely to me.

I bet if PAC-12 had launched with one 24/7 main channel and even 5+ alternates, they probably would be on DirecTV already and be nearing a deal with Dish... instead of in limbo.

I could be wrong... but I think the local cable markets don't carry all 7 of their 24/7 channels.. but rather just the one for that market OR maybe that 1 + the main channel perhaps.

They wanted national coverage for all their teams... so wanted DirecTV and Dish to have all the full-time channels... and that appears to have been the deal-breaker.


----------



## kick4fun

lets get this Pac12 thing worked out.. I'm getting impatient


----------



## bschulte

WazzuCougs said:


> Basketball season will be here before we know it. It would be hard to get the games from all 12 teams on one channel.


Just so you guys know, the BTN does NOT carry basketball games on alternate channels, only football games. As an alum of the University of Illinois and a rabid college hoops fan I've learned this the hard way. For the early season games where everyone is playing "Directional U", the less attractive games are internet pay per view only. I've had to subscribe to the Big Ten Digital Media service (forget the exact name) the last few years to get some early season Illini games against patsies.

PS As a current DISH subscriber, DISH could not care one iota less about sports programming. They don't carry the two main New York RSNs, why would they have a problem not carrying the Pac 12 Network? Just saying. Once my two young sons get old enough to watch sports, I'll be moving over to DirecTV. Like I said, as a rabid college basketball fan, I would LOVE to have all 7 of these channels, and I can almost guarantee you DirecTV will have them before DISH ever does.


----------



## inazsully

bschulte said:


> Just so you guys know, the BTN does NOT carry basketball games on alternate channels, only football games. As an alum of the University of Illinois and a rabid college hoops fan I've learned this the hard way. For the early season games where everyone is playing "Directional U", the less attractive games are internet pay per view only. I've had to subscribe to the Big Ten Digital Media service (forget the exact name) the last few years to get some early season Illini games against patsies.
> 
> PS As a current DISH subscriber, DISH could not care one iota less about sports programming. They don't carry the two main New York RSNs, why would they have a problem not carrying the Pac 12 Network? Just saying. Once my two young sons get old enough to watch sports, I'll be moving over to DirecTV. Like I said, as a rabid college basketball fan, I would LOVE to have all 7 of these channels, and I can almost guarantee you DirecTV will have them before DISH ever does.


With the incentives "D" is offering, why wait?


----------



## James Long

A channel called "PAC12" is testing on channel 413.

In SD, not available to subscribers. Channels tested do no always become active.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

That's progress of a sort... they have to start somewhere. It at least indicates they are talking and have some kind of link to test delivery of a feed.

IF that works and they make a contract... then I would hope to see an HD feed followed quickly by some alternates.


----------



## pmjones

I posted this over at the Dish support foum, but may as well post it here, too ~

I'm curious if the SD testing actually has any meaning w/respect to the final product. Would not make a lot of sense to go through all the trouble of negotiation and adding just to carry in standard definition, IMO. I don't even bother with ESPNU (may as well not have it), given it is non-HD. I'm hoping an HD feed (even if it is just the national one) is the plan.

Of course, we would want regional channels, too (like what they do with Root/Fox regionals), but I guess one step at a time.


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## James Long

Currently all RSNs DISH carries are in SD. BTN is also carried in HD 24/7, but it is the only one. Every other RSN channel is only carried in HD when there is a game (and only selected games).

It would be nice to see a placemarker for a HD channel but they are easy to put up if a deal is reached.


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## superdeluxe

Sa this earlier at wilner hotline page. Apparently it is no longer up:

https://mobile.twitter.com/#!/mrbducks/status/243813284191547397?photo=1


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## WazzuCougs

Letter from Pac-12 to Dish customers:

http://pac-12.com/portals/0/content/enterprises/dearfan/index.html
--------
I called Dish and requested the Pac-12 Network. The CSR put me on hold, then returned to say that Dish has a contract with Pac-12 Network, but that the games wouldn't be on this weekend. Next week we would have more details.

This is great news! But how accurate is the CSR's info?


----------



## WebTraveler

WazzuCougs said:


> Letter from Pac-12 to Dish customers:
> 
> http://pac-12.com/portals/0/content/enterprises/dearfan/index.html


wholly crap, this is getting ridiculous. All these providers come to the table and then walk.


----------



## James Long

I get tired of multi-million (billion) dollar companies making emotional pleas using their potential subscribers as leverage.

Work the deal ... add the channel or don't add the channel ... agree to be carried or don't agree to be carried. But STOP using viewers as pawns.

We shouldn't be hearing "leaks" out of the negotiations.


----------



## WazzuCougs

I edited my post above because I called Dish and requested the network, then added what I was told by the CSR. What do you make of what I was told as far as it being accurate?


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## James Long

If a deal were 100% done Pac-12 wouldn't be posting that it wasn't, would they (unless the facts changed after their web guy went home).

I really doubt a CSR has that information at this point. We've seen channels test and be added before our resident "DIRT" members admit that there is a deal. And DIRT knows more than most.


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## inazsully

Heck, when I called the CSR was absolutely positive that the Pac-12 Network would be shown on ESPNU.


----------



## pmjones

James Long said:


> If a deal were 100% done Pac-12 wouldn't be posting that it wasn't, would they (unless the facts changed after their web guy went home).
> 
> I really doubt a CSR has that information at this point. We've seen channels test and be added before our resident "DIRT" members admit that there is a deal. And DIRT knows more than most.


I doubt a DIRT member would touch this thread with a 10-meter cattle prod. Too hot, too in flux, too hush hush.

Bet we find out something in the PM on Friday.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> I get tired of multi-million (billion) dollar companies making emotional pleas using their potential subscribers as leverage.
> 
> Work the deal ... add the channel or don't add the channel ... agree to be carried or don't agree to be carried. But STOP using viewers as pawns.
> 
> We shouldn't be hearing "leaks" out of the negotiations.


100% agreement here. BOTH sides use the subscribers/viewers as leverage and it has gotten old. I too blame both sides for talking about negotiations in public while they are ongoing.

It's bad enough after negotiations fall through when the mudslinging starts... but while negotiating they really should both be quiet.

In this particular case, I could be wrong, but I think the only noise is coming from PAC-12... I haven't see Dish saying anything... but DirecTV and PAC-12 have been going at each other over it. That stuff just makes both sides look bad.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

I forgot to post this link yesterday...

http://www.pacifictakes.com/2012/9/6/3296215/pac-12-network-dish

It contains a nice shout-out link to DBSTalk's Uplink thread for spying the uplink of the SD PAC-12 channel the other day.


----------



## inazsully

SD? Not for this guy. I spend a couple grand for a HD TV, lease a HD DVR, and now I'm going to watch a football game in SD? I won't watch anything in SD. Haven't for years and won't start now. Let's see. We have 7" and 10" tablets in HD from $199. We have Smart phones that can download just about anything and watch TV shows and movies. We can stream just about anything from the internet direct to our TV's. And we're going to be fed a SD signal for college football games? Is this 1992 or 2012? HD technology has been around for years now (to the point that Dish advertises HD "Free for Life"). Giving me SD only for anything is like offering me a new car with a carb instead of fuel injection, or a new release DVD in full screen only, or dial up internet. Hey, I'm 65 years old and well remember the good old days, and I'm not anxious to go back to those days. SD in 2012? Thanks but no thanks.


----------



## fudpucker

Stewart Vernon said:


> 100% agreement here. BOTH sides use the subscribers/viewers as leverage and it has gotten old. I too blame both sides for talking about negotiations in public while they are ongoing.
> 
> It's bad enough after negotiations fall through when the mudslinging starts... but while negotiating they really should both be quiet.


Stewart, we have gone after each other in posts on here, but we are on the same page here.

When the guy who owned a lot of networks affiliates in our area threatened to pull our CBS and Fox channels (in NFL season) he ran the standard banners on the channels. "Dish is threatening to black out your channels" blah blah blah. To be fair, Dish then started running their own banners and ads with a website link for their side of things, so it was both sides doing the mudslinging. I did a LOT of homework and was a little torn on who was "right" and who was "wrong" - BUT the affiliate owner made it easy for me. He posted phone #s to call, and I discovered at least one of these was the cell phone of a Dish rep. I had talked to her about this, and found out she had to disconnect her phone because of this.

At this point, I took a pad of paper and spent time watching the local Fox and CBS channels and made note of every local advertiser. I then wrote both paper mails and emails to the affiliate owner and copied the advertisers (and did the homework to figure out who to copy at the advertisers, e.g. the owner of the car dealership advertising, the owner of the vet clinic, etc.) and expressed my disgust at the affiliate owner holding me, as a viewer, hostage in his attempt to get more money from Dish and his way of doing that including posting cell phone numbers that were not "official" Dish company phone numbers. I stated that our family, as a result, had already changed our viewing of the local news shows from the CBS affiliate that we watched at 6 and 10 to the ABC affiliate, etc. etc.

I actually got emails back from about 2/3rds of the advertisers telling me they were not aware of his tactics and that they shared my feelings. When I saw that, I put together a small campaign in our area to mail the owner and the advertisers. Several of the advertisers told me they were pulling some of their ads, and even more dropped their advertising on the affiliates news programs (I assume it is an easier decision to drop your advertising on those than it is to pull your ads from Glee or the weekly NFL game.)

FWIW.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

That's actually the right place to go to make a difference anyway, at least with commercial TV channels... the channel and the carrier (in this case PAC-12 and Dish) will each point you at the other one and you get nowhere...

But if you get the attention of the advertisers, that's where differences can be made.


----------



## Heisenberg

Yippee! Pac-12 announced a deal just after midnight pacific time:

http://blog.pac-12.com/dish-networks-and-pac-12-reach-deal/


----------



## James Long

The Press Release:

*DISH fans score with Pac-12 Networks*

Updated September 8, 2012

ENGLEWOOD, Colo. and SAN FRANCISCO, Calif. - DISH and Pac-12 Networks announced today that they have entered into a multi-year agreement making DISH the only satellite provider to offer the sports programming that includes conference football and basketball games. DISH customers will have access to Pac-12 football games starting this weekend.

The agreement allows DISH subscribers to enjoy the hundreds of live sporting events, including 35 football games, more than 140 men's basketball games, and hundreds of national championship caliber Olympic sporting events this season on Pac-12 Networks. Included in the lineup of football games will be multiple appearances by No. 2 USC, No. 4 Oregon and No. 25 Stanford.

The new agreement also provides DISH with exclusive category sponsorship for Pac-12 athletic programs. The sponsorship includes stadium signage and logo rights with each of the member schools including:

• University of Arizona
• Arizona State University
• University of California, Berkeley
• University of Colorado, Boulder
• University of Oregon
• Oregon State University
• Stanford University
• University of California, Los Angeles
• University of Southern California
• University of Utah
• University of Washington
• Washington State University

"DISH is delighted to offer our customers more than 800 sporting events available on Pac-12 Networks each year, while giving them a great value," said Dave Shull, DISH senior vice president of programming. "This is a great partnership with the Pac-12 that goes beyond the TV screen to the campuses in the form of an exclusive sponsorship to support the programs and the students."

DISH is offering Pac-12 Networks as a free preview for a limited time to all DISH customers. Games are available starting this weekend, including the following:

• Sacramento State at Colorado, 12:00 p.m. PT, Ch. 445
• Eastern Washington at Washington State, 12:00 p.m. PT, Ch. 446
• Southern Utah at California, 12:00 p.m. PT, Ch. 413
• Fresno State at No. 4 Oregon, 3:30 p.m. PT, Ch. 413
• No. 18 Oklahoma State at Arizona, 7:30 p.m. PT, Ch. 413
• Duke at No. 25 Stanford, 7:30 p.m. PT, Ch. 445

"DISH wanted to deliver Pac-12 Networks to its customers and our fans will benefit," said Gary Stevenson, President of Pac-12 Enterprises. "DISH's line-up and ability to offer Pac-12 fans nationwide access to an unprecedented number of live quality sporting events make this a huge day for DISH customers and Pac-12 fans."

DISH customers will have login access to stream all Pac-12 Networks content and additional sporting events through Pac-12 Now in the coming weeks.

"As a leader in TV Everywhere technology and providing customers the ability to watch live programming on the go, DISH is a great partner for Pac-12 Networks as we build out our digital and TV Everywhere capabilities that ensure fans can access our content when and wherever they choose," concluded Stevenson.

Pac-12 Networks is available to all DISH customers as a free preview for a limited time. It is included in America's Top 120+ package and above for customers in Pac-12 territory (which includes the six states with Pac-12 schools) and available nationwide in the Multi-Sport Pack for $9 per month.

About DISH
DISH Network Corporation (NASDAQ: DISH), through its subsidiary DISH Network L.L.C., provides approximately 14.061 million satellite TV customers, as of June 30, 2012, with the highest quality programming and technology with the most choices at the best value, including HD Free for Life. Subscribers enjoy the largest high definition line-up with more than 200 national HD channels, the most international channels, and award-winning HD and DVR technology. DISH Network Corporation's subsidiary, Blockbuster L.L.C., delivers family entertainment to millions of customers around the world. DISH Network Corporation is a Fortune 200 company. Visit www.dish.com.

About Pac-12 Enterprises
Pac-12 Enterprises is the new content and multiplatform media company for the Pac-12 Conference, a leader in collegiate athletics that includes 12 of the most prestigious universities in the world and a nation-leading 451 NCAA titles across 27 sports. Headquartered in San Francisco, Pac-12 Enterprises was created in 2011 to develop and launch the Pac-12 Networks and Pac-12 Digital, and to control the distribution of the Pac-12 intellectual property rights in sports and other Conference initiatives. The Pac-12 Networks are full-time native HD linear networks, available to video programming operators, dedicated solely to the Pac-12. They consist of a national network and six regional feeds that will televise hundreds of live sporting events annually and provide 24/7 access to Pac-12 teams and universities. Pac-12 Digital encompasses the digital network, mobile, the university websites, social media and innovative digital initiatives across the company. Visit www.pac-12.com.

Source


----------



## Eksynyt

Unfortunately I still can't login to Pac 12 online and channel 413 hasn't been put up yet. So I'm not sure we're going to get this in time for the games today.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Methinks there will be an uplink coming soon to add the new channels (413, 445, 446).

Curious that the press release didn't mention HD... so we still have to cross our fingers on that one.

But, wow that was quick... I literally just got the email, checked my TV to see if the channels were up yet... then came here and James had already posted the press release and news headline.


----------



## James Long

The first game is in eight hours ... Uplink Activity will be posted as it occurs.
(See My website for immediate updates.)


----------



## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> Methinks there will be an uplink coming soon to add the new channels (413, 445, 446).


413 remains in test mode ... 445 and 446 are available. They are regular Sports Alternative channels (mapped to 412-33 and 412-34 on the Hopper/Joey).
The EPG is not updated for the games but it appears that the contract has barely been signed - so give DISH time. At least the channel is known to be coming.


----------



## Eksynyt

So will there be any way for us to watch the Sacramento State-Colorado, Eastern Washington-Washington State, and Duke-Stanford games on Dish tomorrow?


----------



## James Long

Eksynyt said:


> So will there be any way for us to watch the Sacramento State-Colorado, Eastern Washington-Washington State, and Duke-Stanford games on Dish tomorrow?


See the press release ... and be patient. 

BTW: DISH now has the release on their site: http://investor.echostar.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=705725


----------



## Eksynyt

What a huge win for Dish Network over DirecTV. Great job!!!


----------



## speedy4022

"Eksynyt" said:


> What a huge win for Dish Network over DirecTV. Great job!!!


I would not call it a huge win over directv but congrats on the new addition.


----------



## APB101

DirecTV subscriber here.

I get the feeling, with Dish Network having arrived first, that DirecTV will now become more favorable to making a deal to carry Pac-12 Network. 

Congratulations to Dish Network … and, of course, likewise its subscribers!


----------



## oldengineer

Eksynyt said:


> What a huge win for Dish Network over DirecTV. Great job!!!


So far it looks like the PAC 12's gain is the BTN's loss,


----------



## Stewart Vernon

This article (if accurate) might answer some questions, while raising others...

http://www.pacifictakes.com/2012/9/...standard-definition-channel-413-online-stream

"_Only the Pac-12 National Network will be carried, with the remainder of the content available on overflow channels._"

"_The regional channels will be available online via Pac-12 Now at a later date after the Pac-12 and Dish get everything installed in an orderly fashion._"

"_There could be one piece of bad news: If the original uplink was true, channel 413 was meant for standard definition ... However, it seems like the hope in the Pac-12 offices is that high-definition will be available soon, if not today._"

So... it would seem like the national channel full-time, plus some part-time feeds for overflow games (presumably for football and maybe even basketball unlike the Big Ten deal).

Eventually support for the PAC-12 app and online access to the other regional feeds via streaming, but I gather Dish and PAC-12 need to get some stuff in place to make that happen so that might lag the rest of the deal by a couple of weeks I would guess.

Everybody is nebulous on HD... but clearly the PAC-12 intends Dish to pick-up their feeds in HD... so unless Dish has a bandwidth issue OR they have trouble actually getting the feed from the PAC-12 for some technical reason... my guess is they intend us to have HD today if possible, but if not then VERY soon.

All-around, this sounds like a pretty good deal... and from the press release that James posted, it sounds like Dish got some marketing considerations that help pay for these channels... so again, having them in HD would benefit everyone involved.

Now just waiting to see what lights up, when, and when the EPG gets an update for the games!


----------



## tommiet

With about 30+ sports channels now, did we really need another 12? Just like drugs... Some cannot get enough. 

I'm not against sports... just don't want to end up paying more for programming that I don't watch and in many cases, don't have a choice. As long as your willing to pay, I'm happy.


----------



## rtd2

APB101 said:


> DirecTV subscriber here.
> 
> I get the feeling, with Dish Network having arrived first, that DirecTV will now become more favorable to making a deal to carry Pac-12 Network.
> 
> Congratulations to Dish Network &#8230; and, of course, likewise its subscribers!


Agree BUT Since Dish has landed the PAC12's stock just went up as they are now on a national provider so expect for Direct to have to pay more $$ and no word if Dish got Exclusive adversting on tv and stadiums,ect


----------



## ChileDuck

A couple of phrases in the Pac-12 announcement are noteworthy. Apparently the Pac-12 sweetened the deal for Dish by granting some exclusive rights. 


> The new agreement also provides DISH with exclusive category sponsorship for Pac-12 athletic programs. The sponsorship includes stadium signage and logo rights with each of the member schools


and.... 


> DISH and Pac-12 Networks announced today that they have entered into a multi-year agreement making DISH the only satellite provider to offer the sports programming ...


Does anyone else read that last quote to mean that for multiple years... Dish will be the only satellite provider? Did Larry Scott totally sell out to the highest bidder between Dish and Directv?


----------



## yosoyellobo

It seem that Directv should have no trouble matching Dish one National channel plus a few part-time.


----------



## rtd2

ChileDuck said:


> A couple of phrases in the Pac-12 announcement are noteworthy. Apparently the Pac-12 sweetened the deal for Dish by granting some exclusive rights.
> 
> and....
> 
> Does anyone else read that last quote to mean that for multiple years... Dish will be the only satellite provider? Did Larry Scott totally sell out to the highest bidder between Dish and Directv?


Thanks for that info!


----------



## pmjones

Awesome awesome news.

Hey, we won! I'm the original thread starter. Do I get some sort of fruit basket?


----------



## rtd2

pmjones said:


> Awesome awesome news.
> 
> Hey, we won! I'm the original thread starter. Do I get some sort of fruit basket?


no fruit.... just get to hang out with us nuts here...


----------



## WebTraveler

ChileDuck said:


> A couple of phrases in the Pac-12 announcement are noteworthy. Apparently the Pac-12 sweetened the deal for Dish by granting some exclusive rights.
> 
> and....
> 
> Does anyone else read that last quote to mean that for multiple years... Dish will be the only satellite provider? Did Larry Scott totally sell out to the highest bidder between Dish and Directv?


I read this to be a multi-year agreement if Multichannel's news reporting is correct.

I also read this now means that Dish is now the exclusive satellite sponsor of the Pac 12. I don't read it that the content cannot be shown elsewhere. But I do think it's not what Directv wants its customers to see - advertising for Dish and their lower rates all over Directv should they come to a deal.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/489249-Pac_12_Networks_Adds_Dish_to_Distribution_Lineup.php

"Dish's multiyear agreement will place the Pac-12 Networks on the distributor's America's Top 120+ and packages above that level of service for customers within the conference's six-state footprint"

"The new agreement also provides Dish with exclusive category sponsorship for Pac-12 athletic programs. The sponsorship includes stadium signage and logo rights with each of the member schools, a roster that includes No. 2 USC and crosstown rival UCLA."


----------



## Stewart Vernon

tommiet said:


> With about 30+ sports channels now, did we really need another 12? Just like drugs... Some cannot get enough.


Dish has way more than 30 sports channels if you count the part-time feeds...

But they didn't just add 12 more channels.

For the moment it looks like they really only added 1 new channel... and the 2 overflow feeds are going to use existing part-time channel blocks...


----------



## ehren

I still hate exclusive deals even if my provider has the channels. Me I am hoping the Iphone app gets launched soon cause my laptop has to stream with the sucky Adobe flash video. I wanna stream thru my Apple HDMI av adapter in 720p.

Launching the channel only in SD as well? That's terrible! WTF--ing F?


----------



## monoparadox

I'm sitting here watching BTN and hear there is an announcement coming at 10 am CDT. Suppose Charlie closed the deal with PAC-12 and then used it as leverage with the BTN?

The fox?


----------



## cjrleimer

Congrads to Dish subscribers. Now I am wanting to know is it exclusively the only provider you can get games on, as the press release stated it is the only satellite provider to have them, or is this just temporary as its the only provider so far to have them.


----------



## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> Now just waiting to see what lights up, when, and when the EPG gets an update for the games!


413 lit at 8:11am ET ... the alt channels EPG is showing games (at 3pm ET and 10:30pm ET).

As far as the press release ... at 3am DISH was the only satellite carrier with a deal for Pac-12. The item in the press release noted as exclusive is the stadium advertising and other promotion of DISH by the member schools. I don't see it as precluding DirecTV from ever getting the channel(s) --- but viewers will be seeing DISH ads.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> 413 lit at 8:11am ET ... the alt channels EPG is showing games (at 3pm ET and 10:30pm ET).


Those ALT channels (445 and 446) are showing "No Info" for me at 3pm... which is a change... but no game-specific info for me yet.


----------



## cjrleimer

Per Jon Wilner: The exclusiveity is for advertising and sponsorship only.


----------



## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> Those ALT channels (445 and 446) are showing "No Info" for me at 3pm... which is a change... but no game-specific info for me yet.


Your EPG may be out of date - Check again after noon ET when the games are the "next" event on each channel.

At 3pm I see:
413 College Football - Souther Utah at California
445 (412-33) CFB: Scramento St vs Colorado
446 (412-34) CFB: Washington at Washington St (Programming subject to blackouts)

BTW: The Hopper channel numbering is annoying me.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Yeah... it is way easier to find 445 and 446 than it would be to find 412-33 and -34 in a collapsed list...

I may have to reset my receiver anyway, I think all these uplinks are confusing it because it just became very sluggish... so maybe that will help the EPG update too.


----------



## pmjones

cjrleimer said:


> Per Jon Wilner: The exclusiveity is for advertising and sponsorship only.


Wilner is the same guy who weeks ago claimed the DirecTV deal was imminent. He also said those with Dish should "seek other options". And just two days ago said the possibility of Dish picking up the games for this weekend was "highly unllikely."

I don't know what kind of reporter he is for NorCal sports, but for the Network carriage deals, he has been completely useless.


----------



## ehren

Good god can the main channel 413 look any worse? The alt channel games look fine. Main channel is washed out and blurry!!!


----------



## Stewart Vernon

I'm guessing that they didn't want to risk trying to uplink the HD channels on a weekend without testing them, as the alternate feed games seem to only be SD as well.

Fingers crossed that HD shows up next weekend.


----------



## Jim5506

For SD it really does not look all that bad.


----------



## phrelin

pmjones said:


> Awesome awesome news.
> 
> Hey, we won! I'm the original thread starter. Do I get some sort of fruit basket?


Sure. Here you go: :grin:


----------



## Stewart Vernon

That's a pretty good looking fruit basket... now I'm hungry!


----------



## insimbi

Sorry if it's been posted already, but will 413 and the other channels be in HD soon?


----------



## JoeTheDragon

Stewart Vernon said:


> This article (if accurate) might answer some questions, while raising others...
> 
> http://www.pacifictakes.com/2012/9/...standard-definition-channel-413-online-stream
> 
> "_Only the Pac-12 National Network will be carried, with the remainder of the content available on overflow channels._"
> 
> "_The regional channels will be available online via Pac-12 Now at a later date after the Pac-12 and Dish get everything installed in an orderly fashion._"
> 
> "_There could be one piece of bad news: If the original uplink was true, channel 413 was meant for standard definition ... However, it seems like the hope in the Pac-12 offices is that high-definition will be available soon, if not today._"
> 
> So... it would seem like the national channel full-time, plus some part-time feeds for overflow games (presumably for football and maybe even basketball unlike the Big Ten deal).


Big never used the overflow for basketball and never planed for it (at network launch cable systems did not have the bandwidth for the alt basketball feeds so they never planed to have them)


----------



## Art7220

No I don't think they will be HD. And only one Fresno State game? Big Fail, don't expect this to last.

No FTA, we'll be paying for it though.


----------



## sigma1914

Art7220 said:


> No I don't think they will be HD. And only one Fresno State game? Big Fail, don't expect this to last.
> 
> No FTA, we'll be paying for it though.


Fresno State isn't in the Pac12. Bigger fail.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Art7220 said:


> No I don't think they will be HD. And only one Fresno State game? Big Fail, don't expect this to last.
> 
> No FTA, we'll be paying for it though.


If you've been researching... you would also see that the PAC-12 stated on their site (can't remember if it was Facebook or their main Web site) that Dish wanted to get the SD feeds up in time for Saturday's games because that's all they could get up in the ~12 hours they had once the deal was signed.

HD feeds are coming.. perhaps in time for next weekend.

As they say, Rome wasn't built in a day.

Given that Dish is the only national provider to sign for PAC-12 (all the other contracts are with cable companies for various local regional distribution) they had to work all the infrastructure and the PAC-12 may not have even been able to provide an HD feed directly to Dish on that short of notice.


----------



## pmjones

Art7220 said:


> No I don't think they will be HD. And only one Fresno State game? Big Fail, don't expect this to last.
> 
> No FTA, we'll be paying for it though.


Per Larry Scott,

"My understanding is that the games will be in HD but they couldn't get it done today."

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...sioner-scott-on-new-pac12-networkdish-tv-deal

Hopefully, by next weeked, this will be resolved.

I'm not sure what Fresno State has to do with the PAC12.


----------



## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> Given that Dish is the only national provider to sign for PAC-12 (all the other contracts are with cable companies for various local regional distribution) they had to work all the infrastructure and the PAC-12 may not have even been able to provide an HD feed directly to Dish on that short of notice.


The SD Pac-12 feed was only put up by DISH for testing on Wednesday. This has been one of the quicker channel adds, from an uplink point of view.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

James Long said:


> The SD Pac-12 feed was only put up by DISH for testing on Wednesday. This has been one of the quicker channel adds, from an uplink point of view.


That's what I was thinking... usually we see channels in testing for a week or more before they launch them.

The only real exception I can remember was Voom... but that was a cheat since Dish bought the satellite that Voom had been using, so technically it was just a little re-routing and pushing authorization for the channels out to Dish receivers... they already knew the channels were uplinking properly from the Voom side.

Also, to be fair... we don't know how long they tested and tweaked that prior to when the channels launched. From a customer perspective we all kind of found out about it the weekend and they launched late Saturday night I believe... so it seemed like a 24 hour turnaround, but they might have been playing with things prior to that to see what they needed to do.

I still think it's funny, and not taking a jab at DirecTV because I 100% get why they didn't want the original PAC-12 deal offered to them. Dish probably benefited from DirecTV backing out and PAC-12 being desperate to go national...

But... I remember seeing the article that read "Dish is the only major provider without PAC-12"... how that worm turned!


----------



## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> The only real exception I can remember was Voom... but that was a cheat since Dish bought the satellite that Voom had been using, so technically it was just a little re-routing and pushing authorization for the channels out to Dish receivers... they already knew the channels were uplinking properly from the Voom side.
> 
> Also, to be fair... we don't know how long they tested and tweaked that prior to when the channels launched. From a customer perspective we all kind of found out about it the weekend and they launched late Saturday night I believe... so it seemed like a 24 hour turnaround, but they might have been playing with things prior to that to see what they needed to do.


JohnH first saw the uplink on 4-29-05 ... the same day the press release came out. The channels became active on 5-1-05. The Voom satellite service went dark the same day (5-1-05) at 3am ET.

DISH can uplink to a transponder without putting the channels in the master table that we look at for Uplink Activity - and they can place channels in Uplink Activity that do not exist. So there is no easy way of telling when the channels were testing. I don't have "Uplink Activity" reports for the Voom system to know if they were the same transponders or if Voom's uplink went dark and DISH's uplink lit up or what went on. But there was some advance notice (behind the scenes) knowing that the deal was pending ... and DISH did not have to figure out where to put the channels.

I would not say that there has never been an immediate uplink (added and available the same day or the same moment). I see that often in the Uplink Activity ... but it usually relates to new mirrors of old channels (such as taking a national HD channel and adding it to the Puerto Rico HD service).

Rushing a channel to air isn't a good thing. Get 'r done right!


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Exactly... for as much as I wanted HD... If that meant screwed-up HD, they would have fielded a lot of complaints.

To be honest, I think the only ball-dropped here was what you have already mentioned... all the Hopper folks not being told what channel those alternates were on their receivers. Otherwise, I thought it was a pretty smooth launch for the SD feeds and they have at least a week here to get things right for HD by Saturday.

The only game I actually wanted to see was Duke vs Stanford, but it was a blowout so I was ok not having it in HD since I tuned out.


----------



## Bobmu

Kudo's to DISH for providing the PAC-12 network! Got to watch the Az Wildcats big win over #18 Oklahoma St. When will the games be available in HD?


----------



## pmjones

Bobmu said:


> Kudo's to DISH for providing the PAC-12 network! Got to watch the Az Wildcats big win over #18 Oklahoma St. When will the games be available in HD?


http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=3092484#post3092484


----------



## shadough

I thought it was kinda ironic when I was watching some game on saturday and the "ESPN" bus/RV was in the parking lot of the stadium (at least I think it was the ESPN RV), and it had a big sign on it for Directv, "The only place to watch All of college football"...........heh except pac-12 of course  Now if we could only get Dish to launch a part-time Fox College Sports channel (FCS), like D* has.

One epic fail from saturday WERE the alternate games on the ALT channels, the 3pm games all started w/ the Cal Bears game instead of the games they were soppose to be. At some point, the correct feeds were uplinked but I'm sure for some subs, that was annoying.


----------



## WebTraveler

Is the streaming option running? That's what I am waiting for before changing providers. HD turned on now?


----------



## pmjones

WebTraveler said:


> Is the streaming option running? That's what I am waiting for before changing providers. HD turned on now?


Streaming not turned on yet, but soon . . . Here is a response RE: HD -

PAC-12 Network will be in HD as early as this week. We are working as fast as possible to make HD available.In the interest of getting content to customers as quickly as possible this past weekend after an agreement was reached on Friday, we launched in SD because the technology was not in place to deliver HD that quickly.

*
John Hall*| Corporate Communications | DISH


----------



## Stewart Vernon

If I'm guessing... My gut says we will see the HD feeds before we see the streaming. PAC-12 might even have to update their mobile app before allowing that... whereas the HD feed uplink is more of a business as-usual thing that they can probably do quicker.


----------



## pmjones

Stewart Vernon said:


> If I'm guessing... My gut says we will see the HD feeds before we see the streaming. PAC-12 might even have to update their mobile app before allowing that... whereas the HD feed uplink is more of a business as-usual thing that they can probably do quicker.


Dish testing their HD feeds today. Hopfully, 'on' by this weekend.

http://uplink.jameslong.name/updates/


----------



## James Long

They were activated as you made that post ... although the HD content is not there at this time.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

I would hope that the main channel (413) gets "promoted" to full-time status rather than being part-time... otherwise the PAC-12 didn't get the same deal that the Big Ten did with a full-time HD feed.

I'm fine with the ALT channels... and 4 of them, so that seems the same as the Big Ten...

Wondering if those ALT channels will ultimately get grouped with 413 for Hopper customers like they did for the Big Ten grouping.


----------



## James Long

Stewart Vernon said:


> I would hope that the main channel (413) gets "promoted" to full-time status rather than being part-time... otherwise the PAC-12 didn't get the same deal that the Big Ten did with a full-time HD feed.


BIG10 HD is also encoded as "part time" ... what that does is place the HD channel next to the SD channel in the guide instead of replacing the SD with HD. The setup is the same for BIG10 and PAC12.

The full EPG is a positive sign ... but the negative sign is that the PAC12 HD channel is currently on transponders that only have part time HD channels. I would feel better about it being 24x7 HD if it were on a regular transponder.

Time will tell. Either the EPG will be fixed or the channel will light up 24x7.



> Wondering if those ALT channels will ultimately get grouped with 413 for Hopper customers like they did for the Big Ten grouping.


Unfortunately DISH cannot do that. A channel number can only be used for a real channel (such as 439 BIG10) or an expandable EPG (such as 438 BIG10). 412 could become the grouped channel if all the other RSNs are taken off 412-xx (please) or moved to a different grouped channel location.


----------



## ehren

So is the blurry washed out SD channel on 413 a PAC-12 issue or a Dish issue? The alt games looked fine.


----------



## donm

I sure wish Dish carried AMC (Walking Dead). I would have switched over to Dish before cable. I had dish for years until moving 4-5 years ago to Directv.


----------



## rasheed

Wow, I really did not expect Dish to be a satellite sports leader in any market (maybe parity with DirecTV). Clearly, the Dish advertising deal at the schools justified the Pac-12 fee they requested. From the Pac-12 perspective, they had to get a national satellite carrier (and no one expected Dish to pull ahead of DirecTV on sports which is what the false rumors had to be around). We know both DirecTV and Dish play hardball with negotations (as they should).

In So Cal, the timing is vastly interesting because we still have the Lakers networks in negotiations. I cannot think Dish will go for only Pac-12 and not make a deal for Lakers. However, I am concerned that this Pac-12 deal will cause DirecTV to go for the Lakers network to avoid the sports shift over to Dish. There is definitely no mutual deal for Dish because Time Warner is not going to give that anything except of course from local Dish ad time (which they already get from most cable networks anyway).

Oh and the cost next year for the 120+, I would be very afraid personally. However, any customer who must have their Pac-12 is likely willing to pay for it anyway, so this is likely the type of customer Dish wanted. Oh, and if they like any international programming, even more fabulous, that average revenue per customer will do very well.

Rasheed


----------



## tundracat

I am not currently subscribed to the multi-sports pak. Does anyone know when the SD free preview ends on channel 413? I currently live in Alaska. Also, the overflow channel 445 was not mapped on my guide. Is this channel on the 110 degree sat? This would explain a lot since I can not see that bird due to tree issues. Finally do you need to subscribe to the multi sport pak to view the games on the sport alt channels. Last weekend I tried to tune in to one of those games that wasn't blacked out and I got a message involving my smart card not being able to access that game. (Can't remember exactly what the message said.)


----------



## James Long

The alts are on 129 for HD and 110 for SD.


----------



## plasmacat

129 is Bravo.


----------



## Ray [email protected] Network

The Big Ten Network and PAC-12 network are available with the Multi-sports package. The AT 120 + or above packages are required for the Multi-sports package.

Your channels in Alaska are mapped mostly to the 5000 range channels. PAC-12 doesn't have a channel in this range at this time. Thanks.



tundracat said:


> I am not currently subscribed to the multi-sports pak. Does anyone know when the SD free preview ends on channel 413? I currently live in Alaska. Also, the overflow channel 445 was not mapped on my guide. Is this channel on the 110 degree sat? This would explain a lot since I can not see that bird due to tree issues. Finally do you need to subscribe to the multi sport pak to view the games on the sport alt channels. Last weekend I tried to tune in to one of those games that wasn't blacked out and I got a message involving my smart card not being able to access that game. (Can't remember exactly what the message said.)


----------



## Stewart Vernon

plasmacat said:


> 129 is Bravo.


He asked what satellite they were on... he knows the channel numbers. James was telling him which satellite locations carried the channels.



Ray [email protected] Network said:


> The Big Ten Network and PAC-12 network are available with the Multi-sports package. The AT 120 + or above packages are required for the Multi-sports package.
> 
> Your channels in Alaska are mapped mostly to the 5000 range channels. PAC-12 doesn't have a channel in this range at this time. Thanks.


This isn't entirely true...

Big Ten is available to anyone with AT120+ or above who is in the designated Big Ten DMAs... Multi-sport is only required for those of us outside the Big Ten markets if we want Big Ten Network.

Similarly... PAC-12 will be available to anyone with AT120+ or above in the PAC-12 designated DMAs... and to everyone else with the purchase of Multi-Sport.

BUT... for the first few weeks, Dish has PAC-12 in a free preview for everyone... so even IF he wouldn't get these channels later without multisport, he should get them now as part of the free preview.

The channel numbers (5000 range) is not nearly as important as the satellite carrying the channel. As I understand it, the 5000 range is more of a convenience thing to have the Alaska/Hawaii channels grouped together... but they get lots of other channels not in the 5000 range.


----------



## inazsully

So does this mean we're going to have to buy the multi-sports Pack in order to get the Pac-12 channels?


----------



## donm

inazsully said:


> So does this mean we're going to have to buy the multi-sports Pack in order to get the Pac-12 channels?


Only if you live outside the Pac 12 regions. Basically any state that doesn't have a Pac 12 team.


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Looks like the last uplink converted the channel to a real part-time HD feed as the EPG info now just says "PAC12HD" and has the description of "part-time HD feed for some games"...

I really hope this is just while they are testing things... I hope they aren't making the main PAC-12 channel a part-time game-only HD channel. I don't see how PAC-12 would have agreed to that when Big Ten has a full time HD channel on Dish.


----------



## tundracat

Thanks for answering my question guys, particularly James and Stewart!


----------



## Stewart Vernon

FYI, now I see some games tomorrow in HD on the PAC-12HD feed... but only games... and, the last game of the day does NOT have an HD listing, which seems curious.


----------



## Eksynyt

What channel is the SCSt at Arizona game tonight?


----------



## James Long

Eksynyt said:


> What channel is the SCSt at Arizona game tonight?


It is on channel 5453 at 6:30pm PT. HD coverage on 5454 is listed at 7:30pm PT. There is also a replay at midnight PT on 413 (SD only).


----------



## James Long

You are invited!

If you would like to discuss Pac-12 sports feel free to join the conversation over in the Sports and Programming forum in the following thread:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=208874

This thread remains open for the discussion of DISH Network's carriage of the Pac-12 Networks and content available to DISH subscribers.


----------



## WebTraveler

When is Dish Network going to have Pac 12 streaming available?

http://video.pac-12.com/

Lists several providers and ones coming soon, but Dish is not listed......does this mean Dish will not have streaming access?


----------



## kick4fun

WebTraveler said:


> When is Dish Network going to have Pac 12 streaming available?
> 
> http://video.pac-12.com/
> 
> Lists several providers and ones coming soon, but Dish is not listed......does this mean Dish will not have streaming access?


haha Webtraveler.. You too? Thinking of swiching?? Good for you.. I think I read it was being worked out to be on Dishonline.com
not yet, but real soon...


----------



## Stewart Vernon

FYI...

There was an update to the PAC-12 app (iphone/ipad) today... and the update said that there would no longer be required app updates to add new providers.

IF you update to the new app, you now see a selection for "Dish (soon)" and if you click that, it displays a popup that says they expect Dish Network streaming to be enabled by 10/19/2012.

So... "soon" now appears to have a date attached to it.


----------



## WebTraveler

Stewart Vernon said:


> FYI...
> 
> There was an update to the PAC-12 app (iphone/ipad) today... and the update said that there would no longer be required app updates to add new providers.
> 
> IF you update to the new app, you now see a selection for "Dish (soon)" and if you click that, it displays a popup that says they expect Dish Network streaming to be enabled by 10/19/2012.
> 
> So... "soon" now appears to have a date attached to it.


Saw that...a very good thing, no more being vague! Hopefully sooner rather than later!


----------



## kick4fun

WebTraveler said:


> Saw that...a very good thing, no more being vague! Hopefully sooner rather than later!


LIKE!


----------



## Paul Secic

pmjones said:


> DirecTV deal in the works for next week.
> 
> DISH now the only one who has not signed up for the PAC12 Network. College football is right around the corner and for us fans in the western USA, this is a must-have.
> 
> I am indifferent to the whole AMC fight, but DISH not getting this network would be hard to ignore, IMHO. I realize sports is not a big part of the DISH business model, but for a Colorado-based company, I would think this is something they would want to pursue. . . .
> 
> Please chat up a CSR or call DISH to request! They won't make changes without us speaking up.


I don't like any kind of football. To many billionaires in college and pro football. Sorry.


----------



## Ray_Schwarz

Paul Secic said:


> I don't like any kind of football. To many billionaires in college and pro football. Sorry.


Did you mean millionaires ?


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Paul Secic said:


> I don't like any kind of football. To many billionaires in college and pro football. Sorry.


While I feel what you are saying... the same can be said of actors and actresses... so between sports, movies, and TV, that rules out a large chunk of TV viewing if you only watch people that aren't millionaires...


----------



## fudpucker

Stewart Vernon said:


> While I feel what you are saying... the same can be said of actors and actresses... so between sports, movies, and TV, that rules out a large chunk of TV viewing if you only watch people that aren't millionaires...


Yeah, when some actors are getting $500,000 per episode, if you're gonna avoid rich people then you'd better not watch TV!


----------



## kick4fun

YEAH, it's here..

http://pac-12.com/Sports/Pac-12News.../Pac-12-Now-available-for-DISH-Customers.aspx


----------



## WebTraveler

kick4fun said:


> YEAH, it's here..
> 
> http://pac-12.com/Sports/Pac-12News.../Pac-12-Now-available-for-DISH-Customers.aspx


You beat me to it! I was thinking it would show up early!


----------



## 4bama

Considering UW's next two games are on the Pac-12 Networks, here's good news for Husky fans who have the iPhone and iPod Touch, as the conference just announce that Apple customers can now access live content from the Pac-12 Now App.

Here's the official release from the conference, with details:

http://seattletimes.com/html/huskyfootballblog/2019467931__pac-12_networks_now_available.html


----------



## Stewart Vernon

Of course, the games themselves should be in HD on Dish proper anyway...

but the app enabling means the live feed of all their networks, including the other sport coverage and other programming, is now available.


----------



## Hunter844

Guess this got taken away, I'm top 250


----------



## beavis

Hunter844 said:


> Guess this got taken away, I'm top 250


It was in free preview, since you don't live in PAC-12 country you'll need the Multi-Sports Pack.


----------



## gdowns63

I live in Washington and have AT200, but no Pac12 after the preview ended. My understanding was that you would get it with the MultiSport Pack OR if you had AT120 or higher and lived in a Pac12 state. I just got done chatting with Dish and was told that the requirement is AND, not OR. I'm not paying an extra $10 a month so my daughter can watch a few women's soccer and basketball games a year.


----------



## donm

gdowns63 said:


> I live in Washington and have AT200, but no Pac12 after the preview ended. My understanding was that you would get it with the MultiSport Pack OR if you had AT120 or higher and lived in a Pac12 state. I just got done chatting with Dish and was told that the requirement is AND, not OR. I'm not paying an extra $10 a month so my daughter can watch a few women's soccer and basketball games a year.


I would call back and complain. If you live in any of the states of the Pac 12 (have AT120 or higher)with of coarse Was being one you get the Pac 12 network.


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## WazzuCougs

This link at Dish says you _should_ be getting the Pac-12 Network with 120+ and above:
http://www.dish.com/entertainment/packages/americas-top-120-plus/

There seems to be a problem with people losing the network where they shouldn't.


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## James Long

gdowns63 said:


> I just got done chatting with Dish and was told that the requirement is AND, not OR.


That particular person at DISH is wrong. I'm in the midwest and get PAC-12 because I have Multi-Sport. No "and" about that.

If you live in the official Pac-12 region you should get the networks as part of AT120+ or any higher package. If you live outside that region you need Multi-Sport. If you live near the edge of the region there may be an error as to whether you are in the region or not.


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## CeeWoo

WazzuCougs said:


> This link at Dish says you _should_ be getting the Pac-12 Network with 120+ and above:
> http://www.dish.com/entertainment/packages/americas-top-120-plus/
> 
> There seems to be a problem with people losing the network where they shouldn't.


On Friday, my 722k continued to get PAC12, my 211k didn't. I did a full reboot (as the Programming Not Authorized message said). Still nothing-so I did a 'chat' with customer service and after they walked me thru everything I had already done, they sent a rehit to authorize that receiver and all was good.

funny thing was, in the chat I had already explained everything I had done and that they would need to reauthorize the programming. Guess they didn't believe me LOL.

(oh-btw-I sub to AT120+ but I don't get the sports pkg. After watching the game Saturday, I sort of wish I had waited a couple days to have PAC12 reauthorized on even that 1 receiver LOL)


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## Singe0255

I can't believe that DirecTV hasn't gotten this channel yet. Considering the E* switch.


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## ChileDuck

Is the pac12 network in HD for people out of the pac12 footprint? I just decided to switch from DTV and now looking at the DISH program guide it lists the Oregon-Oregon State game without the X for HD. 

Please reassure me the Pac-12 is in HD for multi-sports pac/ out of footprint locations. My installation is scheduled for Friday.


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## RasputinAXP

I'm in Jersey. It is for me.


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## kick4fun

ChileDuck said:


> Is the pac12 network in HD for people out of the pac12 footprint? I just decided to switch from DTV and now looking at the DISH program guide it lists the Oregon-Oregon State game without the X for HD.
> 
> Please reassure me the Pac-12 is in HD for multi-sports pac/ out of footprint locations. My installation is scheduled for Friday.


There are usually slow to show it, but it will be in the guide in a day or so.. I switched from Directv as well.. I show it on Channel 413 in HD on Saturday.. Make sure you have both the HD and SD showing..


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## Ray [email protected] Network

Most games are broadcast in HD channel 413. There are alternate channels on 5453-5460. You can find information about the games at Game Finder. Please let me know if I can assist you further. Thanks.



ChileDuck said:


> Is the pac12 network in HD for people out of the pac12 footprint? I just decided to switch from DTV and now looking at the DISH program guide it lists the Oregon-Oregon State game without the X for HD.
> 
> Please reassure me the Pac-12 is in HD for multi-sports pac/ out of footprint locations. My installation is scheduled for Friday.


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## ChileDuck

Ray [email protected] Network said:


> Most games are broadcast in HD channel 413. There are alternate channels on 5453-5460. You can find information about the games at Game Finder. Please let me know if I can assist you further. Thanks.


Ok ... thanks. It was the Game Finder, however, that caused my alarm. (see screen grab). It doesn't show an 'X' in the HD column.

I'll take it on faith that I'll see the game in HD....


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## zippyfrog

I just checked with the on-screen guide and it is listed to be in HD on Saturday.



ChileDuck said:


> Ok ... thanks. It was the Game Finder, however, that caused my alarm. (see screen grab). It doesn't show an 'X' in the HD column.
> 
> I'll take it on faith that I'll see the game in HD....


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